What Bands Have Been Able to Grow Their Style Without "Selling Out"

Discussion in 'General Music Discussion' started by tedtan, Jun 19, 2019.

  1. coreysMonster

    coreysMonster So long, Germany!

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    But that's exactly the point, they already were selling multi-plat records every time. You say they were in a position to dictate the direction of their next album, but after writing four of the most famous thrash albums in history, where else should they have gone? Do exactly the same thing again? Go heavier, like Slayer? James Hetfield death growls? Why is the only valid artistic decision to go heavier and weirder? Black Album is to this day one of the metal albums with one of the biggest mainstream appeal. Everybody and their mother knows Enter Sandman and Nothing Else Matters, that's a colossal achievement. There is absolutely artistic merit in taking something (relatively) underground and packaging it for the radio-listening masses, without becoming a parody of itself.
     
  2. Seybsnilksz

    Seybsnilksz SS.org Regular

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    Porcupine Tree.
     
  3. akinari

    akinari SS.org Regular

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    Kayo Dot.
     
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  4. USMarine75

    USMarine75 Plays Authentic ® Contributor

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    I think for people to understand why this was "selling out", they had to view this through the lens of contemporarily listening to metal between 1988 and 1991. I remember how polarizing the release of the "Black" album was - HATED by purists/old-school listeners and liked by a whole new generation that didn't listen to SF Bay Area thrash. Keep in mind their wasn't the proliferation of bands that there are today, so this was a big deal. My old bassist and I stopped being friends because he only like their older stuff, Danzig, Motorhead, and Exodus. He thought I was a poser because I liked the Black album lol. At least now (e.g. with In Flames), there's a million other bands to listen to instead, so the vitriol is diluted.

    Also, keep in mind we're talking about a band that didn't get radio play and only released only one video by 1989 which was "One". And even that was controversial because the standard format of the day was 3 minutes, but no more than 4. Yet Metallica made a 7:45 long cinematic piece.
     
  5. coreysMonster

    coreysMonster So long, Germany!

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    I'm not old enough to remember that, but I can absolutely understand how at the time it was a big deal. When I was younger I had all sorts of strong feelings about bands selling out and not being true to their art and what-not. But to still harp on that 30 years later, as grown-ass adults (as I assume most of us are), is just silly. We might as well be calling out Van Halen for selling out with their synth shit in 1984 when they were sellouts from the get-go.
     
  6. MerlinTKD

    MerlinTKD EIght.Fold.Path / Hinge Theory Contributor

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    Oh yeah, that was a thing too. The butthurt was real, and strong:lol:
     
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  7. SamSam

    SamSam GAS problems

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    Architects.

    But they've done it well. I like most of their stuff bar one album which I forget the name of.

    Have they been mentioned?
     
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  8. mpexus

    mpexus SS.org Regular

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    When people say that Metallic Sold Out on the Black Album I laugh... if you want to say they Sold Out then dont pick The Black Album but the next two...

    One of the reasons given at the time by James to having changed for simpler riffs was because all the complex stuff they did on AJFA, they wanted something easier to play Live which is totally understandable and apart from the more weak Enter Sandman (yes to me its the weakest song on the Album) the rest is cool AF.

    I dont think they were expecting to Sold as many records and explode to the World as they did with the Black Album. Other bands after it tried to do the same and didn't achieve half the success...like Megadeth for example.
     
  9. duffbeer33

    duffbeer33 working on my mix Contributor

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    This is a tricky question because of how subjective it is. I'd be more interested to hear what bands people think have sold out. That would give an interesting baseline. I'm guessing if a metal band shifts to music that is radio-ready, that would be a sell-out. So bands like Bring me the Horizon would be the archetype of sell outs who changed their style? Other candidates....Disturbed? Five Finger Death Punch?

    I'd say Deftones is one band that has drastically changed their style over the years, but it never seemed like they were selling out. They were pretty popular around the White Pony era, and if they wanted to sell out that would have been a good time to do it, but instead they released S/T and Saturday Night Wrist in the following years, both of which were heavy and different. I don't like their latest record, but it is definitely way outside the realm of what I'd consider mainstream.
     
  10. mpexus

    mpexus SS.org Regular

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    Helloween after Keys had a total piece of shit Album that was a total sell out IMO...so much I cant stand and totally lost track of them.

    I could say Kreator with Renewal... it was awfull and totally made me loose interest on them after that.
     
  11. DLG

    DLG not guthrie govan

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    You should try the Master of Rings - The Dark Ride era. It's very good.
     
  12. tedtan

    tedtan SS.org Regular

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    I never claimed that Metallica should or shouldn't gave gone in any given direction at that point in their career. And I never claimed that selling out is a bad thing in and of itself. Also, I actually like the black album, it just didn't sound like a Metallica album at that point in time (aside from James' vocals). Everything else about that album, from the songwriting, to the solos, to the drumming, to the bass, to the production, sounds like a different band.

    The only reason I even mentioned this was to try to separate the bands that have been able to develop a sound over the course of their career, growing and changing in small amounts each album, from those that have either 1) stagnated in the same old sound without growing, or 2) made a drastic shift in their sound. I used Metallica as an example of a band going for the money and Opeth as an example of a band making a drastic shift in their sound just for the hell of it, and in both of those cases, I say they should have changed the band's name since the new sound was so different, though I understand the business reasons for not doing so.

    As far as harping on the topic, that would not be me. :lol: I only mentioned it as an example of what I did not want to discuss in this thread, as I was trying to zero in on bands who made more steady, organic changes to their sound.
     
  13. FancyFish

    FancyFish SS.org Regular

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    I don't know if they would count, but this thread reminded me of them: The Devil Wears Prada. I was never into them as they were getting big but it's just interesting to see there transition from this High School, swoopy hair metalcore to becoming a legitimate act and probably one of the better metalcore bands to come from that era.

    They still do the typical chuggy metalcore thing, but they've now infused this ambient, sludgy thing into their sound, which surprisingly has gotten pretty dark.
     
  14. BusinessMan

    BusinessMan SS.org Regular

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    CARNIFEX
     
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  15. Emperor Guillotine

    Emperor Guillotine The Almighty Ruler

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    Code Orange. They've changed quite a bit. And I like that Shade is kind of turning them into the modern hardcore version of Nine Inch Nails now.

    Vein also comes to mind. They've definitely grown their own chaotic Botch/Converge/Dillinger meets modern hardcore sound and let it evolve without selling out. Looks like the grind finally paid off for them when Errorzone got so much acclaim upon its release last year.

    Has anyone mentioned Meshuggah yet on this thread? Is it even possible for Meshuggah to "sell out"? I mean, no one does the Meshuggah sound like Meshuggah. Ya know what I mean? :lol:
     
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  16. HeHasTheJazzHands

    HeHasTheJazzHands greg rulz ok

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    Meshuggah did the opposite. Their music became less and less accessible. And they pretty much made their own genre of music. :lol:
     
  17. Emperor Guillotine

    Emperor Guillotine The Almighty Ruler

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    Yeah, you're right. :lol: I like this response.
     
  18. HeHasTheJazzHands

    HeHasTheJazzHands greg rulz ok

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    Listening to the first Meshuggah album, you woulda swore they would have become some ungodly AJFA Metallica/RiP Megadeth amalgamation.

    But then the next album is... not. :lol:

    And then the next album is even MORE intense.

    And then their album after that pretty much created a new sound entirely.
     
  19. Veldar

    Veldar Is Post-Thrash?

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    Not that I'm a huge fan of anything post P2, but if Periphery wanted they could of keep making scarlets every album and using it to crossover, even Ash of Sumarian wanted them to.

    But they were like "nah fam".
     
  20. manu80

    manu80 Jackson for life !

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    What's selling out? just selling millions of album? having a natural evolution without doing the same album every 2 yrs but the public doesn't understand it ?
    Basically every band who want to succeed in this industry and get bigshould be considered as "selling out". You will have to do compromises every time...for the company, the public, your bandmates etc....
    Releasing a Load after a black album is more than a big risk to being selling out to me...
    Sure Slayer never change their style, neither Krisiun. it's a strength...or a weakness...maybe....
    So i wouldn't put metallica in selling out box.
    Sugar Ray yes;)
     
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