US Political Discussion: Biden/Harris Edition (Rules in OP)

narad

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Yes, you absolutely can. That's why the 2018 midterms will most likely see a mass exodus of GOP from their offices, most likely because of Trumpcare. The town halls that dare be held are vicious.

Well yea, I mean, that's the established process. This guy's referring to just magically ousting the guy right now rather than "wait and see". Not to mention the rest of the world outside of the US essentially lives in the liberal microcosm too -- last month Trump still had pretty good approval numbers. Not sure where we're at now though..it's been a busy week :lol:
 

MFB

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last month Trump still had pretty good approval numbers. Not sure where we're at now though..it's been a busy week :lol:

Where did you see that?

His approval rating as a whole is still at 39%, only a point or so lower than he was throughout the majority of April, and I'd wager 3/4 of that are the people who voted for him originally and won't be swayed at all.
 

narad

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Where did you see that?

His approval rating as a whole is still at 39%, only a point or so lower than he was throughout the majority of April, and I'd wager 3/4 of that are the people who voted for him originally and won't be swayed at all.

Well I guess we have to go about 7 weeks back for 44% approval. My point is that approval ratings like that are not too uncommon - they're right in line with just about any Obama second term measure, and yet this guy is saying Trump needs to be dealt with now. It's not like the whole country agrees that Trump is making tons of bad decisions. You have to wait for him to do something that's clearly beyond the bounds of the power of the office.

But yea, I mean, I agree a huge amount of the people who originally voted won't be swayed -- not that that's different from any presidency! :)
 

AngstRiddenDreams

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So he literally admits that he fired Comey to stop the Russian investigations that "aren't happening" and we're just supposed to okay with this? What the actual fuck is happening?
 

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At this point it's just a waiting game to see how many times he can commit an impeachable offense before the GOP is forced to act.
 

bostjan

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Trump's all time high approval rating was at inauguration, and that was 45%. Obama wasn't a particularly popular president, and his all time low was around 40%, about even with Trump's average approval so far (keep in mind that a president's first 100 days in office, historically, have been his most popular).

But, to me, at least, popularity is not congruent, necessarily, with good leadership.

So, what are the characteristics that define a good leader?!

  • Honesty/Integrity/Respect
  • Focus/Passion/Confidence
  • Persuasiveness
  • Transparency/Clarity
  • Patience/Care
  • Innovation/Inspiration

1. Honesty/Integrity/Respect: Can we trust Trump? No. Of course not. He lies constantly, he's involved in tons of scandal and political shenanigans, and he has flip-flopped on almost all of his campaign promises. Is that not just like all other politicians? Void argument, since his platform was that he was not a politician and therefore, he would not behave at all like a politician once he was elected.

What is this garbage with Russia? At first, I was quick to write it off as nitpicking, but now that he's gone way out of his way to try to obfuscate his relationship with Putin and with Russia, it only goes to show that there's something worth hiding from the public.

2. Focus/Passion/Confidence: I wish I could give him this one, but he's been really flip-floppy, which Obama could do too, but again, his selling point was that he wouldn't do that.

3. Persuasiveness: Again, one of his biggest selling points during the election. "I can make a deal..." well, now that he's in the Oval Office, he should be moving and shaking...but he's run into problems and he's running into more problems. Most optimistic thing to say is that this is still up in the air. Maybe it'll remain in the air until he's out of office...

4. Transparency/Clarity: He doesn't speak clearly, his mission statements are vague and devoid of substance, and, as far as transparency, refer to the rest of this thread: :noway: Hiding stuff by firing the people responsible for investigating it, withholding documents that have historically always been presented to the public, and refusing to comment on stuff that is too controversial is just not good leadership.

5. Patience/Care: No room for argument here - he's a hothead. If you think that a hothead makes a good leader, then take it up with the people who make lists of good leadership traits.

6. Innovation/Inspiration: I'll give him that. He's branded himself as "outside of the box," which, so far he has been unlike other presidents in many ways....I just don't think it's been the ways that we really needed. Oh well, maybe one out of six isn't that bad. ...., who the hell am I kidding, one out of six is horrible. It's not as bad as zero, but, really, a random garden slug could probably hit three of the traits on this list. That makes Trump three times worse than a random garden slug. :(

EDIT: I'm not saying that bad approval is a good thing. I guess I'm trying to say that whilst it indicates potential trouble with a leader, it's not a definitive measure of effectiveness. Just look at the list I posted. Somebody like Dwight D Eisenhauer does a pretty good job matching the description. Somebody like Obama matches a couple of descriptors and might be able to fudge his way through a few more. Trump just falls flat. I think that now that we are past the honeymoon period, we are going to see his approval dip into the low thirties, maybe even high twenties, as his former supporters start to either run out of patience with what they hoped to see or just give up caring. This is going to be a historic period for the office, as we had the worst two candidates in US history. You can't not blame the political parties for this mess.
 

Stealth7

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*tips tin foil fedora*
 

narad

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That settles it. He definitely murdered that guy.
 

vilk

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He's admitting that it's a conspiracy theory. Just because something is a conspiracy theory doesn't mean that it can't be true.
 

flint757

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Seth Rich's murder was absolutely sketchy as hell, especially the timing of it all. Wikileaks has never been caught in a lie and insists that it was a leak, not a hack. That isn't exactly a guarantee that it was Seth, but there's plenty of smoke that points towards that having at least some validity.
 

narad

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He's admitting that it's a conspiracy theory. Just because something is a conspiracy theory doesn't mean that it can't be true.

Right, it doesn't mean it can't be true. Which bins in it with alien abductions, big foot, skervesens being good guitars, 9/11 as an inside job, scientology, and other such things that are difficult to definitively disprove.

However, what is the point of bringing it up?
 

flint757

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Right, it doesn't mean it can't be true. Which bins in it with alien abductions, big foot, skervesens being good guitars, 9/11 as an inside job, scientology, and other such things that are difficult to definitively disprove.

However, what is the point of bringing it up?

Those are deliberately disingenuous comparisons.

Our country has been responsible for the death of leaders all over the world and have started wars that have killed millions of people. Lets not pretend they believe in the sanctity of life. It's not beyond reality that someone within our government could be responsible for something such as this. There's certainly plenty of motive if he was the leak.

The timing of events, Wikileaks offering a reward, and Wikileaks piggybacking off of any new info that gets dropped does lend the story 'some' credibility that at the very least he was likely the leak.

Now, that doesn't mean they had him killed, but it being labeled a robbery when his fancy watch, his gold chain, his wallet full of money and his smartphone weren't taken, and he was shot from the back in a low crime neighborhood does make his death, and the immediate dismissal of it, suspect.
 

narad

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Those are deliberately disingenuous comparisons.

Our country has been responsible for the death of leaders all over the world and have started wars that have killed millions of people. Lets not pretend they believe in the sanctity of life. It's not beyond reality that someone within our government could be responsible for something such as this. There's certainly plenty of motive if he was the leak.

The timing of events, Wikileaks offering a reward, and Wikileaks piggybacking off of any new info that gets dropped does lend the story 'some' credibility that at the very least he was likely the leak.

Now, that doesn't mean they had him killed, but it being labeled a robbery when his fancy watch, his gold chain, his wallet full of money and his smartphone weren't taken, and he was shot from the back in a low crime neighborhood does make his death, and the immediate dismissal of it, suspect.

And yet, I would give alien abduction more credence than the Seth Rich conspiracy stuff -- at least that caters more to our ignorance of the universe.

I'll admit his death has some suspicious details and timing, but any thought of conspiracy seems ridiculous given the dull details of the leaks -- or is there something supposedly more scandalous out there? And what would be the point of murdering someone after they leak the documents? I feel like you should have a really good motive before hopping to a conspiracy with extremely thin bits of circumstantial happenstance.

btw, you're talking about DC at 4am. Not the kind of place you'd catch me walking around alone.
 


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