ugh my continued disappointment with the mesa rectifier

Discussion in 'Gear & Equipment' started by oniduder, Oct 3, 2019.

  1. oniduder

    oniduder HONKEY DONKEY

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    it's been stated that these particular amps are sometimes hard to dial in

    i'm beginning to think that selling my single rectifier is better for my mental health then continuing the mental gymnastics and fighting through general cognitive dissonance that the amp is good and a classic while never getting a tone i enjoy

    i tend to dial it as follows,

    treble-NONE, no treble at all
    middle-idk 1 to 3 o clock as they may say
    bass-noon or a bit higher,
    presence sometimes none sometimes about noon or bit higher
    gain idk what to do with this thing gain wise, i tend to like the vintage mode more, but sometimes the "modern" sounds better i guess? either way in vintage mode it's almost maxed and in modern mode it's anywhere from 1 o clock to maxed, either way not my flavour so far

    blablabla on everything else

    the amp seems to have too much dynamics for a true brootz amp, picking lightly can be enjoyably light on gain, but i don't want that in this type of amp, save that shit for idk the rhythm channel

    if i do use the treble it's a fizzy disaster and there's a volume swing i guess? idk how to describe it

    tl;dr

    just let me know what if anything you think/feel about these amps

    i'm having trouble justifying owning the rectifier

    this isn't a feeler but a true call to anyone who has decided screw owning these amps

    or others that feel they're completely necessary to their tone/sound and why and how they get dat tone

    i boost with a tc pre (clone) and yeah

    ciao
     
  2. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    Why you have so much bass and no treble.
     
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  3. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    I have heard people make them sound really good, but they usually have pre and post EQs, and various drives/boosts to get there. I've never been able to just plug into one and get a sound that I like or would use live.
     
  4. Cynicanal

    Cynicanal SS.org Regular

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    No treble is your issue. That's going to make your midrange focused ridiculously, unusably low.

    Try this, on modern, with a Tube Screamer style boost:
    Bass: 11 'o clock
    Mids: 10 'o clock
    Treble: 1 'o clock
    Presence: 8:30
    Gain: 1 'o clock to 2 'o clock
     
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  5. oniduder

    oniduder HONKEY DONKEY

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    yeah i hear your critique of the none use of treble, i find the middle creates a more usable treble in conjunction with the presence

    i was trying to say that i go back and forth between using treble and not while dialing in the amp,

    when using treble instead of getting a more rounded sound it's a fizz box mess

    also my boost is all treble, the bass is cut so having high bass through the amp is like an older pultec type eq thingy

    like killing mids in the eq of a mark series but having a ton of mids in the eq

    agree it's totally not very plug and play,

    thanks more opinions are very cool by me
     
  6. Merrekof

    Merrekof SS.org Regular

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    I knew a guy who was hyped to get a triple rec. He got it and after a good while he litteraly plugged his line6 bean pod in the fx return bc he didn't like the sound he got out of it. Don't know if he still has the triple rec..

    Get rid of it and buy something else..
     
  7. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    Ya the rec is a classic amp. Lots of people like them.
    The only one I like is there tremoverb and only for mid gain applications.
    But the op should be able to get some usable sounds.


    The other thing is...how old are the tubes? And when were the power tubes last biased?
     
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  8. protest

    protest SS.org Regular

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    Where's the volume set?
     
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  9. sevenfoxes

    sevenfoxes SS.org Regular

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    I owned a series 2 single rec a couple of times. Easily my least favorite of the recto series. Generally, it's VERY fizzy, no matter what you do (well, unless you crank it to the point that your house trembles). I ended up getting rid of them. That info doesn't help you, but here are some tips that might help.

    1. Keep the master volume at least at 11:00. The higher the MV, the more the fizz goes away.

    2. Put all the eq dials at noon, and adjust accordingly from there.

    3. Depending on your pickups, and what mode you are on, you generally don't want the gain passed 1:00. These amps respond very well to your picking dynamics. The harder you dig in, the fuller your sound will be. Obviously, In vintage mode you will need more gain. In Modern mode, you need less. The same goes for the Presence and Bass dials.

    4. Try a tungsol or Ruby in V1. This usually helps remove some fizz, especially at lower volumes. JJ's are terrible for rectos.

    5. Try all of these tips without a boost at first. A boost will only complicate things if you don't know how to dial in the amp first. You have to develop an understanding how the eq works, which can take a while with rectos.

    6. Read the manual. Mesa manuals are usually quite informative.

    7. Sell your Single, and buy a MW, or Roadster. Seriously, that's exactly what i had to do to prevent a mental breakdown. My Roadster is a walk in the park compared to the single i had, and hated.

    Finally, rectos aren't for everybody, even though they are generally loved and respected in the highest regard, some people just don't jive with them. And if tweaking ain't your thang, then you will probably never be happy with one, because all rectos require just that.

    If you want a no nonsense, set and forget type of amp, then look into the 5150/6505. Easiest amps in the world to dial in, and also just one of the best amps ever made.

    Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
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  10. mnemonic

    mnemonic Custom User Title

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    It might just be that you don’t like rectos. They’re a distinctive sound and feel and I get why they’re not everyone’s cup of tea (they’re my favourite tone of all time, however).

    What model do you have? You say single rectifier, is it series 1 or series 2?

    The eq isn’t nearly as straightforward as a Marshall or something, I would start with everything at noon. Leave it in bold power, diode rectifier (if it has those, only dual and triple do), hard-bypass the effects loop on the back. This minimises the amount of stuff to mess with.

    Use a boost if you can, tubescreamer with the usual settings (drive: 0, volume: 10, tone: 5-10), or something tighter if you can. I like my tc integrated preamp in front of my Recto.

    Start with the eq and gain all at noon. The closer you can stick to noon, the better. Put the master volume as high as you can get it. Bare in mind they don’t sound great at low volumes, and the master volume taper is not bedroom-friendly.

    Rectos, especially in Modern mode (my preference), are very sensitive to the cab used. One cab might sound screechy and fizzy where another is thick and pummelling. I think a darker/smoother cab works better with rectos.

    The gain knob I wouldn’t run higher than 2:00, it loses definition when you go too high. If you need more gain, try a louder boost or picking harder. They’re pretty dynamic amps in my opinion, and they’ll punish you for a light picking hand.

    Treble knob controls attack and stiffness/fizziness, the higher you turn it, the more attack it has, the more high-end focus, and more fizz you get. Low settings are rounder, chunkier, less aggressive. Use presence to balance the fizz/brightness level. As you turn treble up, bass and middle have less effect so you may want to turn them both up as treble goes up. But you can overdo it on treble easily. Honestly I think the sweet spot is between 10:00 and 2:00, I don’t think I really go higher than like 1:00.

    Treble is the most important control so don’t ‘set and forget’.

    Presence control, this will depend on the version you have. On my 3-channel dual rectifier (non-multiwatt) the presence controls for channel 2 and channel 3 are very different. The pot value, among some other changes in the circuit, make me not like channel 3 so much, since it goes from dark-sounding when set at 0 to fizzy sounding when set at like 9:00 or higher. With a weird zone of dark-yet-still-fizzy in between.

    Channel 2, however, is much more usable across the whole range of the knob, and honestly only has a minor effect on the sound.

    Either way, don’t be afraid to bring presence right to 0 if it sounds fizzy, and slowly move up from there. Presence is like the only control that doesn’t need to stick close to noon, in my opinion.
     
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  11. sharedEQ

    sharedEQ SS.org Regular

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    Peavey XXX is the amp for people who don't like Rectos.
     
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  12. sleewell

    sleewell SS.org Regular

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    sell it and get a 5153.
     
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  13. sevenfoxes

    sevenfoxes SS.org Regular

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    Probably. It's everything a recto isnt.
     
  14. Gmork

    Gmork SS.org Regular

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    I was beyond excited when i got my dual rec but just didnt gel with it. Sometimes i liked it and ither times i didnt. Soent more time fiddling with knobs rather than playing. Happily sold it off
     
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  15. wakjob

    wakjob SS.org Regular

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    Recto's are like Les Paul's for me...

    From just a listening standpoint, I LOVE them.
    Put it in my hands, and I can't really gel with them.

    They are like the king of hit & miss amps.
    Sometimes they sound godly. Other times like poo.

    Anyone ever try theirs with a speaker with less highs?
    Thinking SwampThangs or the like.
     
  16. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    Lot's of good advise here on Recto's. Not sure what type of sound you are trying to get though. Rectos are great for everything from blues to metal. Very versatile.

    The pickups you use can affect things too. The Boogie manuals explain how the controls affect the other controls and the amp etc. You must turn up the treble and presense to open up the amp. What you described you're doing will sound honky. It could be the tubes or a tube is killing something too.
    - Honestly, something might be wrong with the amp or going wrong with it like a capacitor or somthing. If you can't get a great metal tone from a properly working Recto then something else (pickups, pedals etc, your ears : ) is the problem. Maybe give your ears a reset and come back to it after a few days. It really can help sometimes and give new perspective.
    What your explaining with the mids and fizz thing, since you like the mids for treble more can be achieved by turning up the treble and presence to open the amp up and then turning the mid's up too. The fizz will go away as you turn up the mids, but while still having the amp opened up. These settings can vary greatly because of all the other stuff involved like pickup type etc, but keep in mind that these are sensitive amps. Picture the knob like it's divided into a hundred divisions, it's very sensitive, and drastic moves can unbalance things. Make small adjustments and learn the amp and how the controls affect each other. When you adjust one thing another rebalances it etc. The Boogie manual explains it a bit too and is very helpful in regards to this. It also has sample settings.

    Maybe try something like this:

    - First, unplug everything. Just plug guitar straight into amp to eliminate any other issues. Add other stuff later and one piece at a time, after you dial in the core tone. Actually unplug it though, don't just bypass it.
    - The Mesa manual says the gain and presence are the most powerful controls. I'd agree. Higher presence allows lower treble without muffling things up and also allows reducing the fizz, plus you can regain and smooth out the treble to taste with the mids control.
    - Put it on diode recitfier ,modern mode, bypass effect loop.
    - I'd start with the gain on around 2 o'clock and master around 9-10 o'clock. The bass around 10 o'clock, the mids around 9 o'clock, the treble around 2 o'clock and the presence around 3 o'clock.
    - Leave the gain and master where they're at for now and just each EQ control in order left to right and top to bottom once. Listen to it and then adjust the gain knob back and forth a millimeter to see how much the tone is affected. Turn the gain counter clock wise a millimiter and it cleans up and pops with clarity noticably. Turn it to clockwise a millimiter and it smoothes out a bit. Depending on what you do you can now fine tune either one conrol or all EQ controls just a little but each time like that, but always be mindful to try to rebalance things using that gain control too. Make those little adjustments and go back and forth and learn the amp. You'll notice things like instead of decreasing the treble to get rid of fizz you might slightly boost the presence and the gain. It gets weird but there is a learnign cure to really get the feel for this amp. You gotta give it time and really zone in on the micro adjustments and what's really happening with what your doing. This is how people get so many great tones with it. It ain't a one trick pony that's for sure.
    - If all else fails there are other things like mentioned above for different tubes in the v1 position and that sor t of thing. That can make a big difference too. I agree with above that JJ's suck in a recto, but in reality they still sound good and it's just my personal taste.
    - Give it time and check it out some more. It's worth it once you get that tone and know how to dial it in for what you want.
    - Another suggestion I might say is to try to paly through another Recto also to hear how that one is sounding. try it with your guitar and different guitar too etc. That can go a long way too.
     
  17. Thaeon

    Thaeon Cosmic Question Asker

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    Here's how I dialed mine.

    I set the over all volume I wanted with everything at noon.
    Then set the gain.
    Then I'd sweep the presence all the way to zero and then back up until it was where I wanted it.
    Then I'd do the same with the mids.
    Then I'd do the treble.
    Finally I'd sweep the bass to zero and then back up until there's just enough body in the tone.

    The treble control is centered on a higher frequency than most amps. So is the Mid control.
     
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  18. Darchetype

    Darchetype SS.org Regular

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    Get a 6505, literally plug and play
     
  19. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    I wouldn't be entirely surprised if the recto didn't get along with your Oni pickups, they might be kind of doubling up in a particular frequency range. I remember trying some of the early prototypes with a dual recto (I think) and finding them unusually harsh even though they were ok with other amps. The magnet layout on your pickups is different to those, but still a little peaky with some amps. The latest magnet layout smooths out the treble a little more again, so if you like I could swap the magnets, but it means sending the pickups over to me so it's a moderate pain the twat for you.

    If you're looking at alternative amps I really dig the MI Audio Megalith range. The Beta is what I mostly use now, though the Gamma would do the job just as well. They're probably unbelievably cheap in US dollars right now too.
     
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  20. cardinal

    cardinal F# Dive Bomber

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    Just sell it and move on. No point in fighting with it.

    IME they sound great if you just embrace the fizz and assume it'll get buried in the cymbals. But they are fuzzy IMHO. Dialing them in to avoid that butchers the amp in the process.
     
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