The Carvin / Kiesel thread

Mboogie7

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I get the fact that Kiesel has to make money, has to price out certain things certain ways to make things worth their time but also not so good of a deal they get swamped, etc, but there's no way in HELL that they have a hard time selling Floyd equipped 7 strings. There's just no way. Thats the one option I just don't understand them nixing.
Yeah, I’m scratching my head still at that decision. The only logical explanation I can come up with is maybe Kiesel and Hipshot worked out an agreement/contract that makes much more sense from a pricing standpoint? Then again, they offer Floyd’s with sixes, so who knows.
 

NoodleFace

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How much cash? I'd probably entertain a straight trade if I really don't want the trem, but that's a pretty basic build to be throwing much cash in for.

Not to mention Kiesel doesn't do Floyds on 7s, because they're assholes, so your piece can't be replaced, which has to count for something.
$500. That's true. My green kiesel is a much nicer playing guitar but it has the thinnest neck option whereas the carvin has a bit of a thicker neck (regular neck option I guess).

I might just keep it and fix up the few small issues instead.

I kind of wanted a fixed bridge 7 since I have 3 Floyd equipped 7s but it's not so bad.

On the topic of them not selling 7 strings with Floyd's I don't understand either. I once commented they should bring them back and Jeff Kiesel liked my post haha.
 

Sir_Shreddington

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Curious about what everyone thinks about the resale value of this brand when the kiesel pickups have been swapped out?

I recently had a Kiesel listed on Reverb that I ended up pulling because it wasn't getting the offers I was really looking for. I wondered if it had to do with the pickups? I got rid of the kiesel pickups because I wasn't a fan, so I replaced with bare knuckles. The guitar plays and resonates great but I wonder if I had it priced too high because of the BK I had in there. I bought a Duncan JB and 59 to replace the BK, hoping that I can price it a little lower and hopefully see more action on the listing.

I originally just wanted to try one out, so I bought it from the guitars in stock page on the website. The guitar is built well, and I'm not sure why I see so much hate for them, but it sounds like there might be consistency issues with them.

Anyway, just curious of everyone's thoughts.
 

John

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Curious about what everyone thinks about the resale value of this brand when the kiesel pickups have been swapped out?

I originally just wanted to try one out, so I bought it from the guitars in stock page on the website. The guitar is built well, and I'm not sure why I see so much hate for them, but it sounds like there might be consistency issues with them.

Anyway, just curious of everyone's thoughts.

Resale value for Kiesels and Carvins isn't really a thing anyway, whether you changed the pickups or not. It's just how it goes for semi-custom instruments in general (fwiw, even similar competitors like Balaguer have the same kind of thing when people tried getting rid of theirs).

And that's disregarding some of the DIY DI-why mods that some folks have done to really trash whatever resale value may have been salvageable whilst flipping or trading for other things.


277561871_10227190486330920_2933210862263734682_n.jpg


As for the 'hate' question you're throwing out there, there's been multiple cases from the company's side of things (ie- QC gaffes, customer service or cavernous lack thereof) to foster such sentiments, for starters.
 
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Sir_Shreddington

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Resale value for Kiesels and Carvins aren't really a thing anyway, whether you changed the pickups or not. It's just how it goes for semi-custom instruments in general (fwiw, even similar competitors like Balaguer have the same kind of thing when people tried getting rid of theirs).

And that's disregarding some of the DIY DI-why mods that some folks have done to really trash whatever resale value may have been salvageable whilst flipping or trading for other things.

277561871_10227190486330920_2933210862263734682_n.jpg


As for the 'hate' question you're throwing out there, there's been multiple cases from the company's side of things (ie- QC gaffes, customer service or cavernous lack thereof) to foster such sentiments, for starters.
:spock: Yikes! What did he do to that guitar?! :lol:

Oh right, I did see those two threads before I bought from Kiesel. I also figured that buying an axe that was already made might be a quick solution to the issues. I also tried to get a spec that was pretty generalized and might appeal to more people upon resale. Ultimately I knew I was rolling the dice by 1) buying an axe before actually playing it and 2) resale may be a bit tougher because of brand recognition. Oh well, I'm sure I'll eventually get it moved.
 

John

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:spock: Yikes! What did he do to that guitar?! :lol:

The owner of that guitar hacked off the upper horn, the part near the logo.
Then, if memory serves, proceeded to try selling it on Reverb near the cost of a new one. It didn't flip at the cost he was asking for, either way. In the event it finally did and it wasn't just a backpedaled ad, he would've gotten rid of it at a sizeable loss.
 

Benzene

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Curious about what everyone thinks about the resale value of this brand when the kiesel pickups have been swapped out?

I recently had a Kiesel listed on Reverb that I ended up pulling because it wasn't getting the offers I was really looking for. I wondered if it had to do with the pickups? I got rid of the kiesel pickups because I wasn't a fan, so I replaced with bare knuckles. The guitar plays and resonates great but I wonder if I had it priced too high because of the BK I had in there. I bought a Duncan JB and 59 to replace the BK, hoping that I can price it a little lower and hopefully see more action on the listing.

I originally just wanted to try one out, so I bought it from the guitars in stock page on the website. The guitar is built well, and I'm not sure why I see so much hate for them, but it sounds like there might be consistency issues with them.

Anyway, just curious of everyone's thoughts.
My Kiesel D7 is the best guitar I've ever played. The re-sale value seems to be for people who can disassociate Jeff Kiesel from the Kiesel guitar in their hands. If they want to pay more for a guitar with worse fret-work and worse paint job, that's on them.
 

Sir_Shreddington

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My Kiesel D7 is the best guitar I've ever played. The re-sale value seems to be for people who can disassociate Jeff Kiesel from the Kiesel guitar in their hands. If they want to pay more for a guitar with worse fret-work and worse paint job, that's on them.
Yeah dude. This guitar has one of the raw finishes and it looks and feels sick, I love it. Fretwork is solid too. I think I'm just finally ready to admit that I'm not that into stainless steel frets, especially on a maple board. Nine out of ten times I'll choose nickel. It also has the trem that they offer with a bar but isn't a Floyd. It stays in tune better than I thought it would. Not a bad axe by any means!
 
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Sir_Shreddington

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The owner of that guitar hacked off the upper horn, the part near the logo.
Then, if memory serves, proceeded to try selling it on Reverb near the cost of a new one. It didn't flip at the cost he was asking for, either way. In the event it finally did and it wasn't just a backpedaled ad, he would've gotten rid of it at a sizeable loss.
Dude should have just trashed it and turned it into a punk guitar. Carve stuff into it. Really give it a go.
 

Hollowway

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Curious about what everyone thinks about the resale value of this brand when the kiesel pickups have been swapped out?

I recently had a Kiesel listed on Reverb that I ended up pulling because it wasn't getting the offers I was really looking for. I wondered if it had to do with the pickups? I got rid of the kiesel pickups because I wasn't a fan, so I replaced with bare knuckles. The guitar plays and resonates great but I wonder if I had it priced too high because of the BK I had in there. I bought a Duncan JB and 59 to replace the BK, hoping that I can price it a little lower and hopefully see more action on the listing.

I originally just wanted to try one out, so I bought it from the guitars in stock page on the website. The guitar is built well, and I'm not sure why I see so much hate for them, but it sounds like there might be consistency issues with them.

Anyway, just curious of everyone's thoughts.
Were you factoring in the price of the BKPs? Generally speaking, people will not pay extra for upgrades, unless you happen to find someone who was literally going to do that exact upgrade anyway. If you still have the stock pups (I can't tell if by "got rid of" you mean sold, or just took them out), I'd put those back in, price it lower, and then sell the BKPs separately. I don't think most people are a particular fan of Kiesel pickups, but it's more that they don't want to pay added cost, no matter what the aftermarket upgrade is. The same goes with tuners, trem blocks, knobs, control plate covers, etc.

Also, did you post it FS here?
 

Sir_Shreddington

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Were you factoring in the price of the BKPs? Generally speaking, people will not pay extra for upgrades, unless you happen to find someone who was literally going to do that exact upgrade anyway. If you still have the stock pups (I can't tell if by "got rid of" you mean sold, or just took them out), I'd put those back in, price it lower, and then sell the BKPs separately. I don't think most people are a particular fan of Kiesel pickups, but it's more that they don't want to pay added cost, no matter what the aftermarket upgrade is. The same goes with tuners, trem blocks, knobs, control plate covers, etc.

Also, did you post it FS here?
I was factoring that in the price and you're right. I finally realized that. Which is why I ended up getting the JB and 59 to replace the BK so I could sell those separately. I sold the original pickups that came with that guitar, and I figured the JB and 59 are universal enough and will sound pretty kick ass in that guitar.

I haven't listed it here because I don't really meet the requirements to post in there yet. It's okay though I think there is still a big enough market for when I actually do list it again, it will sell.
 

mastapimp

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:spock: Yikes! What did he do to that guitar?! :lol:

Oh right, I did see those two threads before I bought from Kiesel. I also figured that buying an axe that was already made might be a quick solution to the issues. I also tried to get a spec that was pretty generalized and might appeal to more people upon resale. Ultimately I knew I was rolling the dice by 1) buying an axe before actually playing it and 2) resale may be a bit tougher because of brand recognition. Oh well, I'm sure I'll eventually get it moved.
that guitar is explained here: https://www.sevenstring.org/threads/some-guitars-are-too-funny-not-to-post.298929/post-5390661
 

Themistocles

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The thing with custom guitars that arent inherently luxury brands as well (Kiesel is about performance not rarity) is that their value is in the options for the initial client. At a certain point someone can just spec their owne build that has what they want so resale is never with that added premium uless it is a special build and now unobtainable for some reason that others will paya premium for. All that said Im very happy with my 2. The recent Vader 7 is a dream and the best guitar Ive ever played... it performs in the studio like a boss and is always ready. The thing with custom guitars is most dont really know what they need or require and the companies have a hard time living up to expectations. It seems like Kiesel's shop is running at a high level these days.
 

Hollowway

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Well, I finally swapped out the OEM FR on the used 2014 DC700 I bought last year. Thanks @spudmunkey snd @MaxOfMetal for the tips on what to get. I ordered an OFR 7 baseplate during the Black Friday sale, and swapped all the saddles, etc onto the new plate. (Somehow the previous owner completely jacked the knife edges - looked like he took a serrated knife to it, so it was clunking all around when using the trem.)

Anyway, it worked like a charm EXCEPT the screw spacing for the trem block, the block plate, and the tensioner are all different between the OEM “series 1000 original” version and the OFR. I drilled out the tensioner for the correct hole spacing, and then grabbed a trem block and plate from an OFR sixxer I’ve got for a Warmoth build. The OEM block was 34mm, and the one I had laying around is 37mm, so I can’t get the back cover on. I just ordered a new 34mm OFR block for it, so hopefully this weekend I can put it on.

Anyway, the string spacing is exactly the same. According to FR, the only difference is the hole spacing for the block.

Anyway, if anyone is wondering, it’s a direct swap.
 

Jeff

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Jesus, their prices have skyrocketed. W(hy)TF is a satin finish neck a $300 upcharge? That's three times as much as another company would charge for the neck finish, period.
 

spudmunkey

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Jesus, their prices have skyrocketed. W(hy)TF is a satin finish neck a $300 upcharge? That's three times as much as another company would charge for the neck finish, period.
It slows them down, so they don't want to do it. They don't even offer it anymore on bolt-ons at all for the same reason.

As is the case with many of their decisions, their model depends on volume.
 

ShredmasterD

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i miss the days full sized carvin catalogs would come in the mail and i could obsess and price things out for days. i was a teen so i couldn't really afford anything though. still...
 

Themistocles

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It slows them down, so they don't want to do it. They don't even offer it anymore on bolt-ons at all for the same reason.

As is the case with many of their decisions, their model depends on volume.
and the quality these days really is so much better than it was. My Vasder 7 simply outclasses my DC747 for playability , options and refinement. To me the volume means they have to standardize a lot of things and frankly I prefer tung oil necks, most do. Let me reiterate the fact that they do have so many more options now than in the past and the finishes are way better too. Ill have my DC747 refinished someday I suspect. That daid it gets only 5% of the playing time at most. The other 95% is the vader. Very happy with the approach they are taking now... and they seem to have things running well.
 
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