The Carvin / Kiesel thread

RickF

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Sorry if this isn't the right thread to ask. But has anyone got a Kiesel Vader 8 string with the hipshot trem? Curious to know how well it performs.

Eyeing an 8 string guitar and debating if to go with Kiesel, either Vader or Aries. 27" vs multiscale. Too many options
 

CanserDYI

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I dig your theory here, if I HAVE to have the markers to ensure I don't play like rubbish, a good chunk of blank board would certainly help ease the pain
I got NIN on my profile pic guitar, and its lovely, but yeah, after like 12th fret, I'm gonna probably put one or two custom inlays in, as it just turns into 40 frets lol
 

spudmunkey

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Here's mine with offset (not staggered) dots:

The effect is exaggerated by the strip of sapwood though, camouflageing the abalone:
UTQ4hCX.jpeg
 

Hollowway

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Sorry if this isn't the right thread to ask. But has anyone got a Kiesel Vader 8 string with the hipshot trem? Curious to know how well it performs.

Eyeing an 8 string guitar and debating if to go with Kiesel, either Vader or Aries. 27" vs multiscale. Too many options
I have an Osiris with one. It’s nice, but it doesn’t have the range of a Floyd. Way the hell better than a Kahler, though.
 

mbardu

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Sorry if this isn't the right thread to ask. But has anyone got a Kiesel Vader 8 string with the hipshot trem? Curious to know how well it performs.

Eyeing an 8 string guitar and debating if to go with Kiesel, either Vader or Aries. 27" vs multiscale. Too many options

I can only comment on the 7 version, but couple of things to be aware of:
  • It is extremely high quality in terms of materials an machining. Seriously solid.
  • Stays in tune like some of the best systems around, and the knife-less design makes me think it's going to be very durable
  • Sustains well thanks to a T H I C C stock block
With some "downsides":
  • Aforementioned block makes the bridge HEAVY
  • The arm assembly is not the best, and can benefit from a simple swap
  • As @Hollowway said, not as much range as a Floyd
 

spudmunkey

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Do either of you with them find that your body movements translate into trem movement, specifically leaning forward, any more than other terms? With the weight of the block, plus the weight of the tuners, it seems like it could be more susceptible to inertia-based tuning fluxuations.
 

Hollowway

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Do either of you with them find that your body movements translate into trem movement, specifically leaning forward, any more than other terms? With the weight of the block, plus the weight of the tuners, it seems like it could be more susceptible to inertia-based tuning fluxuations.
I’ll have to try that to see. I’ve never really thought about that, because I haven’t gigged in forever, and am usually sitting while I play.
 

MaxOfMetal

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Do either of you with them find that your body movements translate into trem movement, specifically leaning forward, any more than other terms? With the weight of the block, plus the weight of the tuners, it seems like it could be more susceptible to inertia-based tuning fluxuations.

I never found a particularly noticeable difference. All floating bridges do it to some degree, and there's even somewhat significant variation from one setup to another even with the same model bridge. Which is why I don't setup guitars flat, but mounted in playing position.

The Hipshot/Kiesel unit is pretty stiff, and that helps keep it in place, and while big, they're not particularly heavy, less than a pound and a half, vs. the heavier Floyd style units which can be up to two pounds.
 

mbardu

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Do either of you with them find that your body movements translate into trem movement, specifically leaning forward, any more than other terms? With the weight of the block, plus the weight of the tuners, it seems like it could be more susceptible to inertia-based tuning fluxuations.

It can fluctuate a bit, but not particularly notable / different from my other tremmed guitars.
 

RevelGTR

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Now that my brain has ordered a medium low option Kiesel that will likely fit my needs perfectly, my heart is telling me to sell off some unused gear and order a djentastic blinged out monstrosity just like the ones I shake my head at when I see them on Instagram.
 

spudmunkey

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You know what I wish the builder had? A random spec generator.

I've been playing with it a LOT, and I find I've settled into a slump where I keep building out the same couple of spec combinations. I would like to start with random collections of specs that I could tweak for my preferred frets, string count. etc. It would likely come up with wood/finish combinations I hadn't thought of.

Sometimes I've taken a build-out for their semi-hollow carved top single cut SH550, and just randomly switched it to a Vanquish, and though. "Oooh...that's nice." Or tried building a Delos, then switching it to a Lightspeed, and thinking, "not a spec I would have come up with for a Lightspeed...but I like it!"
 

olejason

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Why does adding the best headstock they offer (pointed angle) make so many options unavailable? Two weirdest ones I've found:
1. You can't get a roasted maple neck with the pointed angle headstock
2. You can't get a matching koa overlay on the pointed angle headstock
 

spudmunkey

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Why does adding the best headstock they offer (pointed angle) make so many options unavailable? Two weirdest ones I've found:
1. You can't get a roasted maple neck with the pointed angle headstock
2. You can't get a matching koa overlay on the pointed angle headstock

I suspect it's a bug. I don't know about the koa overlay, but the pointed angle headstock is so much wider than their neck blanks, they have to actually add a small piece of wood to the tip (for all woods, but just the roasted maple). Perhaps...if it's not a bug...only thing I could think of is that they don't offer 3 , 5 or 7 piece necks with roasted maple, so...maybe...glueing the roasted maple to the side of the neck blank makes it two pieces...somehow...*sigh* Nevermind, I got nothin. It's probably a bug. I actually send in errors I find because I'm a dork like that (I also like to find/point out restaurant menu misspellings), so I'll add it to my next submission.

Some other fun bugs:
No logos on left-handed headless (or tung oil headless)
upload_2021-10-15_13-25-54.png

Deleting the Hyperdrive's body bevel actually also takes the burst color along with it:
upload_2021-10-15_13-26-36.png

The battery compartment location is in the wrong place for the Osiris and Zeus (but amusingly it's in the right place for the model that's a combination of both, the Lee McKinney LMX model):
upload_2021-10-15_13-27-17.png

3PB shouldn't be visible on an all-painted guitar:
upload_2021-10-15_13-27-41.png

You can't stain Koa, but it won't let you add a koa body to a maple top even if you have Rear Natural Clear option.

The routes for the side tabs on the 7-string pickups are wrong:
upload_2021-10-15_13-29-42.png

Black crackle on natural wood is technically possible (likely not meant to be offered on the builderthough), but there's a way to trick the builder into showing it, and when it does, the orientation doesn't make sense, because the wood pattern isn't what's meant to break apart to show black underneath. The white crackle is the correct way, though, strangely:
upload_2021-10-15_13-31-21.png

you can trick it into showing you a Delos without a pickguard...but the screws are still there.
upload_2021-10-15_13-31-54.png

headless, too:
upload_2021-10-15_13-32-15.png

The tops on the V220 are too thin in the rendering, if you can see the 5-piece neck on that chamfered edge behind the bridge. The top could only be veneer-thin if this were visible, and it's not.
upload_2021-10-15_13-33-9.png

This headstock is fun:
upload_2021-10-15_13-33-29.png

And that's not even a 1/4 of the list of bugs I've found. The post window just said I couldn't add any more images. :lol:
 
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spudmunkey

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2. You can't get a matching koa overlay on the pointed angle headstock

Actually...this one seems to work for me.

Plain koa body, plain koa top
upload_2021-10-15_13-44-24.png

Plain koa body, flamed koa top
upload_2021-10-15_13-43-59.png


Unless you're talking about a plain koa body with NO top. On the builder, they don't offer headstock overlays where there's just a body wood and not a top wood. The overlays come with the tops. You can get a headstock overlay to match a non-topped body, but it's a call-in option, though.
 
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Jeffrey Bain

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Actually...this one seems to work for me.

Plain koa body, plain koa top
View attachment 98881

Plain koa body, flamed koa top
View attachment 98880


Unless you're talking about a plain koa body with NO top. On the builder, they don't offer headstock overlays where there's just a body wood and not a top wood. The overlays come with the tops. It's a call-in option, though.
En-kiesel-opedia over here lol. Endless knowledge from the man himself.
 

laxu

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That's why builder software is not so straightforward to make when there are lots of constraints it needs to validate for different options. They start from simple "if 7 string then filter out this and that option" type stuff and snowballs into validating specific combinations of specs.
 

CanserDYI

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En-kiesel-opedia over here lol. Endless knowledge from the man himself.
He's a god damn 8th wonder of the world, Spud. I know he was doing some email work answering questions for them, but @spudmunkey if you joined the Kiesel sales team, I would personally buy all my guitars from you, cheers.
 

spudmunkey

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That's why builder software is not so straightforward to make when there are lots of constraints it needs to validate for different options. They start from simple "if 7 string then filter out this and that option" type stuff and snowballs into validating specific combinations of specs.

I haven't designed a web page since having to work out of a physical "Intranet Design" book, but I knew enough about Kiesel's offering to laugh whenever people were like, "I don't get why it's so hard, or why it would cost so much money. I could put together something in a week."

I'm genuinely curious if the virtual builder update came with any back-of-house system updates. I seems like not, as phoned/emailed in orders are still getting their order confirmations in the same old formats, based on screenshots people in the FB shared of their newly-placed order build sheets.

But besides the visual aspect, the best thing this builder does, from a customer's standpoint, is separates the body wood from the neck wood. That was the silliest aspect of the old builder. On one screen you had to pick a *combination* of neck and body woods, and each combination had a unique option code, and then on another screen, you could pick your multi-layered 3, 5 or 7-pieces necks. Or 1 piece flamed or roasted necks. :confused:. So you could have a build sheet that says "mahogany body/maple neck" on one line, and then "3-piece walnut and purpleheart neck" for a single-neck guitar.
 

wheresthefbomb

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You know what I wish the builder had? A random spec generator.

I've been playing with it a LOT, and I find I've settled into a slump where I keep building out the same couple of spec combinations. I would like to start with random collections of specs that I could tweak for my preferred frets, string count. etc. It would likely come up with wood/finish combinations I hadn't thought of.

Sometimes I've taken a build-out for their semi-hollow carved top single cut SH550, and just randomly switched it to a Vanquish, and though. "Oooh...that's nice." Or tried building a Delos, then switching it to a Lightspeed, and thinking, "not a spec I would have come up with for a Lightspeed...but I like it!"

Great, now just imagine if it were like Oblivion and you could keep picking "random" to make it uglier every time.
 


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