Solar Guitars by Ola Englund

[John]

Is the thinking that the sweet spot is where it would be on a 22 fret guitar, or is the idea that the less frets the better?

To the ones who prefer this on a guitar, like a Gibson or some PRS builds- the idea is the neck pickup is in a 'sweet spot' the extra couple of frets would've occupied.

 

[Shask]

Not sure if I got you right, but this has got to be one of the pettiest issues of the guitar world. Dime, Het, Malmsteen etc did just fine with 22-frets.

I play without issues with both 22 and 24. If I'd have to choose I guess 22 feels SLIGHTLY better to play in many cases, but this will never make or break a guitar. Nothing to do with pickup or sound. It's only two notes difference afterall.

Of course you do you. Your guitar, your choice.

I have been noticing how 24 fret guitars have the bridge moved closer to the neck, which throws off the symmetry with the forearm contours on many guitars. The neck also sticks out further on 24 fret guitars. Because of these reasons I have been preferring 22 fret guitars lately.

 

[Hollowway]

I don't know about other guitars, but on Strats, the neck pickup is in the same place, either way. The 22nd fret is just on a sort of "diving board" extension over the pickguard at the end, and still fits behind the neck pickup.
View attachment 122358

Ah cool, thanks for that! I had no idea.

 

[spudmunkey]

I have been noticing how 24 fret guitars have the bridge moved closer to the neck, which throws off the symmetry with the forearm contours on many guitars. The neck also sticks out further on 24 fret guitars. Because of these reasons I have been preferring 22 fret guitars lately.

Sort of. Only some guitars.

So, no matter if it's 21, 22 or 24 frets, if the scale is 25.5", then the distance between the nut and the bridge is the same on all of them. How they execute this is different from model to model.

Some guitars, to make sure for both the 22 and 24 fret versions that you can reach each of their highest fret with the same ease, the highest fret is set at the same location in relation to the body. Then, because the fretboard on the 24-fret model would be sticking into the body ~1" further, they pull the bridge in closer to push the neck out to keep that 25.5" scale length. This is how PRS does it, and how Kiesel does it on their CT6/CT624 line.

Some guitars, though, they keep everything in the same place in relation to the body, but they give the 24-fret version a deeper fret access cutaway. This makes it so that they will feel and hang identically, but you can just go up a bit higher on one, and you get the warmer neck pickup tone on the other. This is how Kiesel does it on their Delos model:


Then you get the Gibson/Epiphone SG, where it doesn't matter if you get 22 or 24, you don't get a deeper cutaway AND you also don't get a warmer neck pickup location.

 

[Hollowway]

Love these superimpositions, @spudmunkey!

 

[groverj3]

Not sure if I got you right, but this has got to be one of the pettiest issues of the guitar world. Dime, Het, Malmsteen etc did just fine with 22-frets.

I play without issues with both 22 and 24. If I'd have to choose I guess 22 feels SLIGHTLY better to play in many cases, but this will never make or break a guitar. Nothing to do with pickup or sound. It's only two notes difference afterall.

Of course you do you. Your guitar, your choice.

I just think it's dumb to have almost, but not quite, two full octaves of fretboard.

 

[profwoot]

Is the thinking that the sweet spot is where it would be on a 22 fret guitar, or is the idea that the less frets the better? Like, do people feel a 21 fret guitar sound better on a neck pickup than a 22 fret guitar? I have 21, 22, and 24 fret guitars. I like 24 frets because there are enough songs that use the 23rd and 24th fret that I want that option. But I've never bothered to try to deduce a tone difference.

I'm currently having trouble bonding with a strandberg strat and I think it's due to the 24 frets. The pickups on my real strat are about 2 3/8" apart, and the ones on my berg strat are about 1 7/8" apart, which adds up to a neck pickup about an inch closer to the bridge, making it sound quite a bit like a middle pickup. Since the neck pickup tone is the only reason I like strats, that's a problem for me.

 

[Emperoff]

This thread is getting into hard TGP territory with recent derails with topics discussed ad nauseum... 22 vs 24 fret necks, OFR vs FR-1000...

Plenty of people get obsessed with neck pickup placement while overlooking the bridge one, which probably varies a lot more between guitars. I barely play above 22th fret, but calling that a dealbreaker would be insane for me (In fact most of my guitars are 24 frets).

Same as the bridge, which I've seen people go pretty agressive on defending their empty claims. I have both and there ARE differences between the OFR and the 1K. The finish is nicer, the arm holder is way better and the fine tuners are better on the OFR as well. The 1k has beveled sadles which are more comfortable, though.

Worth a 400$ upgrade for the "real thing"? No fucking way. Just spend 20$ for a push-in arm (which you also should with an OFR anyway). I would happily just get Gotohs (they look the best and apparently function the best as well) if they were a 100% compatible drop-in replacement, which they're not.

 

[lewis]

screw this supposed "tone neck pickup" nonsense for 22 fretters.
Literally 98% of the type of riffs I play use tapping sections that utilise 24th Fret.
And for harmony purposes etc. Not having it is a nonsense.
I didnt think about this too long ago before I bought my 30inch baritone, and when I strung it up and started jamming there was sections in about 5 of my own tracks I couldnt play properly because its a 22 fretter haha. Its annoying. No idea about some weird neck pickup tone argument.

 

[RevDrucifer]

The 22+ frets/pickup placement thing has never even entered my head as an issue. I’ve got four 21-fret Strats, three 24.75” 22 fretters and four 24-fret Ibanez’….they all sound like neck pickups to me.

My biggest issue in that area is upper fret access. There’s shit I wrote on my Ibanez guitars that is taking me a little effort to translate to a Les Paul because getting up there without moving my hand out of the way of the neck joint is a bitch.

 

[lewis]

who here could do a blind test on a bunch of neck pickup tests and be easily able to not only notice tonal differences between a 22er and a 24er, but be able to boldly and accurately declare which is which?
Laughable

 

[JimF]

I don't have an opinion either way, but surely that's no harder to discern than the difference between a middle pickup and a neck pickup?

 

[Emperoff]

I don't have an opinion either way, but surely that's no harder to discern than the difference between a middle pickup and a neck pickup?

The difference between middle and neck pickup is way bigger (around 4 frets). If we consider than most 21-22 fret guitars don't have the neck pickup flush with the fretboard end (which 24 fretters do), the difference is even more irrelevant.

 

[JimF]

Ah ok, I stand corrected 👍

 

[Xaeldaren]

It could also be seen as an advantage if you don't particularly like overly-round, warm neck pickup sounds.

 

[Shask]

Sort of. Only some guitars.

So, no matter if it's 21, 22 or 24 frets, if the scale is 25.5", then the distance between the nut and the bridge is the same on all of them. How they execute this is different from model to model.

Some guitars, to make sure for both the 22 and 24 fret versions that you can reach each of their highest fret with the same ease, the highest fret is set at the same location in relation to the body. Then, because the fretboard on the 24-fret model would be sticking into the body ~1" further, they pull the bridge in closer to push the neck out to keep that 25.5" scale length. This is how PRS does it, and how Kiesel does it on their CT6/CT624 line.

Some guitars, though, they keep everything in the same place in relation to the body, but they give the 24-fret version a deeper fret access cutaway. This makes it so that they will feel and hang identically, but you can just go up a bit higher on one, and you get the warmer neck pickup tone on the other. This is how Kiesel does it on their Delos model:
View attachment 122359

Then you get the Gibson/Epiphone SG, where it doesn't matter if you get 22 or 24, you don't get a deeper cutaway AND you also don't get a warmer neck pickup location.

Yeah, there are various ways for it to be done. I dont really care about the bridge being moved an inch as much, but what bugs me is they move the bridge, but then dont change the forearm contours to match. This is common on Strat and Superstrat types. The way I hold my guitars, it is very common that on a 22 fret guitar my forearm is right where the contour is, but on a 24 fret guitar my arm lays against the flat edge right next to the contour. They need to contour over an extra inch also.

 

[Noisy Humbucker]

Split the difference with 23 frets and you still technically have two octaves.

 

[Hollowway]

Split the difference with 23 frets and you still technically have two octaves.

How do you figure?

 

[spudmunkey]

How do you figure?

0-11 is one octave, 12-23 is the 2nd. The 24th fret would be the same note repated for a 3rd time, so technically 23 frets gives you every note in 2 octaves.

 

[Hollowway]

0-11 is one octave, 12-23 is the 2nd. The 24th fret would be the same note repated for a 3rd time, so technically 23 frets gives you every note in 2 octaves.

Well played, @Quiet Coil, well played.

Thanks for explaining, spud. It's like when someone turns 30 and you tell them they just entered their 4th decade.