Oh crap..BUGERA is trying to get in on the TRIPLE RECTO and MARK market

Discussion in 'Gear & Equipment' started by DrakkarTyrannis, Mar 23, 2010.

  1. Mop

    Mop SS.org Regular

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    Moro, I agree with some of what you said but not all of it.
    Yes many companies (including some mesa amps) mount sockets to the board, which can be fine if done properly, I was more trying to show the difference in labour costs of doing it chassis mount and wiring to the sockets (longer lasting imo, but we can agree to disagree there).

    The pots on the dsl are mounted right up against the chassis which is better than what the bugera has done, but still not good imo. Surely you agree that using decent chassis mounted pots is a far better (albeit much more expensive) option?

    I think you'd find most techs would have a much easier job finding and fixing the fault in the bassman or badcat actually, again we can agree to disagree if you like.

    The pics were just ones I picked at random from a google search, I can't even remember which mesa and which bugera they are. The sole purpose was to compare construction on the two to illustrate why one is more expensive than the other and why one will undoubtedly last longer than the other. The pots on the bugera alone are enough for me to avoid that amp, it's clearly built on the cheap as most people know and as the pics illustrate.

    I'm not going to go into this any further here, IMO bugera = :poop: YMMV
     
  2. Moro

    Moro Big damn hero

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    I understand what you said. I actually MADE my own amp from scratch, a Soldano SLO clone, and I mounted everything on the chassis, because I think it's more reliable. And I also lack the resources to make everything PCB munted. But I do think that if done properly, both methods can work.
     
  3. El Caco

    El Caco Djavli te ponesli Contributor

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    I'm confused, as you have made your own amp you are no doubt aware that the examples you questioned are point to point contruction vs the cheap printed board of the Bugera. Point to point is absolutely easier to repair (unless you are talking early Sansui tube amp :lol:), and the reports I have seen said the tracks on the Bugera printed circuit boards are so thin they are next to impossible to repair. There is nothing questionable about point to point construction, it just doesn't always look pretty.
     
  4. Moro

    Moro Big damn hero

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    Sorry, I did not express myself correctly there. Keep in mind, english is not my native language...

    When I worked in my SLO, I mounted all the HW in the chassis, i.e. the pots and the tube sockets. The rest went in a PCB. I did not want to mount those in the PCB because of the risk of someone bumping into a pot and damaging the PCB.

    I didn't do a point to point amp because I hate point to point, TBH. If you construct point to point, you start running cables everywhere and the chances of getting hum increase, and since it's easily avoidable with a good PCB, I just did that. Also, the original Soldano is made with a PCB, so I made it exactly like that. There's nothing wrong with using a PCB, in fact, I think it's much, much better. But only if it is a quality PCB. I've never come across a Bugera's guts, so I wouldn't know about the quality of their PCBs.

    When I said the thing about the questionable construction, I was refering to the bassman and the bad cat, not the Marshall. Although the pots of the DSL are crap.
     
  5. El Caco

    El Caco Djavli te ponesli Contributor

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    I'm just arguing that the point to point wiring of those amps is not questionable construction. You might prefer a quality circuit board and one has to recognize the advantages of using one but it is important to keep in mind that there is nothing questionable about point to point construction and that some of the greatest amps built use point to point and some of these look like a rats nest. You can easily avoid hum when using wires in point to point construction by using quality shielded wires. The bad cat pic especially is an example of a high quality modern point to point design.

    Although almost never seen today the rats nest approach to point to point construction was considered by some to be superior as it attempts to offer the most efficient signal path. The problems are realised when one needs to replace a resistor that is buried in the circuit.

    The main advantage printed circuit boards have over point to point construction is machines can build them.
     
  6. Ben.Last

    Ben.Last Formerly Lern2Swim

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    Going to a store and trying them out. Maybe even renting one. Sure, everyone looks to the internet now but let's be honest, you can find evidence for and against every single product in existence out there. I would never depend solely on internet stories was what I meant.
     
  7. iff

    iff SS.org Regular

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    +

    =

    Reason.

    Renting one, okay, you can put it through some tests. But trying one at a store? That's not really going to prove anything about reliability (unless, on the off chance, it breaks down right in front of you).
     
  8. Vegetta

    Vegetta Change Everything

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    My guy said he could get me one of these for $560 US

    I tried out the V55 combo and a 333xl combo for a little bit and both were pretty damn good,
    I'm going to try one of these when he gets one in and will probably end up buying one if i like it,
     
  9. Mordacain

    Mordacain 1-watt brigadier

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    I'm saving up now for a Magician. Even if I could afford a Mark V I would want one of these as well just for the Variable Output power. Assuming its the same circuit as the TriRec, it advertises 1Watt to 100Watt (or 85 in case of Magician).

    The Mark V by comparison offers 10w, 45w and 90w options. If the tone gets even 80% close to a Mark I'd be happy. This also has a Pentode / Triode switch so it is doing some things different circuit wise so its obviously not a straight clone. Figure in $80 for a Warehouse Speaker Veteran 30 and you've probably got a fantastic sounding recording rig.
     
  10. cow 7 sig

    cow 7 sig AU director / RHLC ©

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    IMO its closer than 80% its very very close in tone.
     
  11. splinter8451

    splinter8451 SS.org Regular

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    So are their clips of these things yet? Any news on when they will be in stores?
     
  12. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

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    Apparently they're still waiting on FCC approval.

    :agreed:

    If it's anything like the Peavey clones that Bugera makes, it's going to be more like 95% with a tube swap.
     
  13. splinter8451

    splinter8451 SS.org Regular

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    Well if the Magician comes out even close to the Mark V I have played then I'll be getting one :yesway:

    World Music Supply has them for order at $699.99. I guess that'll stay the street price then.
     
  14. CFB

    CFB SS.org Regular

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    I doubt that. A Mark V is $2000 in the US and here in Sweden the same amp goes for about $4100. The price is affected by import taxes, but it will never double the price.
     
  15. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

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    Which is where the distributor comes in. :)
     
  16. Mordacain

    Mordacain 1-watt brigadier

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    Hi all,
    I thought I'd share this email:


    Amps should be released October\November according to that response :hbang:
     
  17. ittoa666

    ittoa666 /)'3'(\

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    Can't wait to see how fast these ones break.
     
  18. Customisbetter

    Customisbetter WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot Contributor

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    the inside of that mesa looks EXACTLY like the insides on my markIII built 25 years ago. :lol:
     
  19. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

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    Don't hate bro. :yesway:

    When is the last time you heard a legit story of a new, recent Bugera amp dying?
     
  20. Cheesebuiscut

    Cheesebuiscut Loves his Q-tuners

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    Mooo0000OOOOO
     

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