Official Daemoness Guitars Thread

jco5055

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Thanks for the clarification on Carillion! I know he makes great stuff, but just seeing how he does charge what he does even at the base price, I wasn't sure if he was doing something extremely unique a la Rick Toone and similar luthiers that charge crazy amounts for R&D etc...I don't have any issue as I do believe all luthiers should charge enough to make a decent living, so seems like really we should count our lucky stars Cariliion is more unique than the standard at this point.
 

oracles

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I would say a substantial price increase probably is in order.
While this logically makes sense, I can't see a justification as a consumer to pay even more money to a luthier who's production output is this low, and takes this long to build the product. From the outside looking in, it already looks like Dylan is on the ropes, placing new orders seems like a massive risk I couldn't see many people being willing to take.
 

Flappydoodle

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You can hear Dylan saying repeatedly in old interviews establishing the brand as metal guitars for metal players, so the idea of charging a huge sum kind of defeats the idea of getting them into the hands of players. But then again, I suppose it could be argued that most of his orders are not that sort anyway. Maybe it would be a better compromise to have orders from more financially secure metal fans buying fancy guitars and subsidizing guitars to like Vitriol or Crypt Sermon.
Yes, definitely. And it's an awesome aim to have. But the reality is that unless he is willing to work for almost nothing, that wasn't going to work with his current way of doing things. Maybe if he was putting out basic natural finishes or plain colours of the same guitar that could have worked. But offering highly custom everything along with the time-consuming artwork can't be cheap unless you place zero value on your time.

And obviously it hasn't worked because the business and the owner got to a point where it couldn't afford to even to cover costs like rent.

Anyway, I do really hope Dylan pulls through. And once he does start offering basic stock builds, I'll be first in line for one.
 

SamSam

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While this logically makes sense, I can't see a justification as a consumer to pay even more money to a luthier who's production output is this low, and takes this long to build the product. From the outside looking in, it already looks like Dylan is on the ropes, placing new orders seems like a massive risk I couldn't see many people being willing to take.
I think the biggest issue is that he has taken on too many deposits based on the expectation of paying whatever the price was when the deposit was made (which in most cases seems to be over 5 years now). He may well be in a position now where he has to implement a global price increase but may not be able to afford to pay back everyone that wishes to withdraw from the queue. But the positive may be that those who are willing to pay a higher rate / risk it will receive a guitar sooner than as things currently stand.

I think that Carillion guitars have done it right and set the price at a level where demand is effectively gatekept by the price which to an extent will keep the deposits placed to a reasonable level.

On a side note don't let short wait list / limited slot releases lead you to believe that it will ensure consistency. I placed a deposit on another well known/regarded builder as part of a five instrument slot and appear to have been left high and dry. In fact I haven't found any negative comments about this builder so perhaps I am the anomaly in this case.
 

Lorcan Ward

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I recall Dylan having a large price increase 4-5 years ago. He mentioned the problem of having to honour original prices so it would take a while before orders would catch up to the newer prices. In an ideal scenario he finishes his build list and then goes the Padalka route of limited builds of his own choosing, the Blackmachine way of in-stock builds or Carillion with annual guitar runs.

Thanks for the clarification on Carillion! I know he makes great stuff, but just seeing how he does charge what he does even at the base price, I wasn't sure if he was doing something extremely unique a la Rick Toone and similar luthiers that charge crazy amounts for R&D etc...I don't have any issue as I do believe all luthiers should charge enough to make a decent living, so seems like really we should count our lucky stars Cariliion is more unique than the standard at this point.

When you buy a guitar from Chris you are paying not only for his skill but a clear build time and completion date. I see he's moved mostly towards limited spec runs which is the ideal way to run a small shop. Not everyone could raise their prices if they aren't supplying a high level of quality and strict build times. The demand for his instruments means he's choose a suitable price.

A lot of luthiers make less than minimum wage for the hours they put in when a build gets delayed. It really is a labour of love and most of those guys could get into much better paying jobs with their skill. I think it's great to see builders charging what they should. We are spoilt in the guitar world with how low prices are, even with big price increases in recent years. Many of the custom shops that have gone out of business priced their guitars so there was no decent profit margin after build cost, rent, electricity etc was accounted for. Not ideal to work a job where you aren't bringing enough money home to pay your own cost of living.
 

Jonathan20022

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I went in expecting a 5 - 6k cost + Fees (Shipping/Import), if he raises prices much more than that I'd have a rough time justifying it. And there's no way I waited all this time to not get some of his art on the guitar, I wouldn't want to just get a superstrat with a figured top if that's the case.
 

narad

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I'm just going based off the ones I've seen for sale recently. Figured they're going for that at least

Ken's been very reasonable with his pricing and even fairly recently, around the start of covid, prices weren't anywhere near that. Of course the inlays can add $1500-2500 easy, but my guess is a blank board KL is still less than $9k if not less than $8k. Sellers are going to ask whatever and say whatever though.
 

Hollowway

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On a side note don't let short wait list / limited slot releases lead you to believe that it will ensure consistency. I placed a deposit on another well known/regarded builder as part of a five instrument slot and appear to have been left high and dry. In fact I haven't found any negative comments about this builder so perhaps I am the anomaly in this case.

Often, there are a number of people who get left high and dry, because everyone is afraid to say something, so more customers are drawn into the fold. For that reason, I think it's at least worth mentioning the name of the person somewhere on SSO.
 

SamSam

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Often, there are a number of people who get left high and dry, because everyone is afraid to say something, so more customers are drawn into the fold. For that reason, I think it's at least worth mentioning the name of the person somewhere on SSO.


A very popular London based tele builder who is no longer active. I obtained some new contact details a few days ago and will see what he has to say. With Covid and all thay happening literally a month after I placed the deposit I want to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Not that an email would have killed the guy.
 

narad

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A very popular London based tele builder who is no longer active. I obtained some new contact details a few days ago and will see what he has to say. With Covid and all thay happening literally a month after I placed the deposit I want to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Not that an email would have killed the guy.

Again, I don't know why one wouldn't just say it, rather than someone else fall victim to it for failure to google "london based tele builder scam".
 

M3CHK1LLA

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A very popular London based tele builder who is no longer active. I obtained some new contact details a few days ago and will see what he has to say. With Covid and all thay happening literally a month after I placed the deposit I want to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Not that an email would have killed the guy.

sorry to here that...hopefully you can get things sorted.

there is a thread of dead custom guitar builders on sso. you may want to see if they are on the list and what happened.
 

StevenC

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A very popular London based tele builder who is no longer active. I obtained some new contact details a few days ago and will see what he has to say. With Covid and all thay happening literally a month after I placed the deposit I want to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Not that an email would have killed the guy.
Wirebird is gone?!
 

narad

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sorry to here that...hopefully you can get things sorted.

there is a thread of dead custom guitar builders on sso. you may want to see if they are on the list and what happened.

I'm not sure it will be of any use. Each entry in the thread reads as:

- Crackhead son of famous builder took my deposit on a special (American) holiday run

- Eastern block luthier who built a guitar in a week but hasn't built mine in 5 years

- Canadian scientist who made a 10 year anniversary run after building 2 guitars took my money

- Tosin Abasi
 


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