Necrophagist Recorded Epitaph Note for Note

Discussion in 'Recording Studio' started by @zwen, Oct 16, 2019.

  1. Pat

    Pat SS.org Regular

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    To be clear, it makes no difference to me at all and frankly I don't care either way - I would just like to know from someone with some actual knowledge of the recording process
     
  2. Lorcan Ward

    Lorcan Ward 7slinger

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    I mean this in the nicest way but that’s on you if you can’t hear the difference. You need to work on your ears cause it’s night and day. Like the difference between a one shot snare sample and a live recording or regular vs autotune vocals. The biggest give away is when Yngwie/Gilbert/Looimis play one note bleeds into the next while if you listen to Necrophagist or Within the Ruins there is none, every note has a stop start sound like a keyboard triggering a sample. Thats always the biggest give away and what gives you that super clear surgically tight sounding guitars.

    I've explained it so many times already. Posted links to other bands and producers who do similar things. The only thing left is for you to really listen to this and other modern albums. Drag them into your DAW, slow them down, EQ them, try various recording methods to hear the difference in sound. If you still don't want to believe it then thats fine but this has been common knowledge for a long time.
     
  3. allheavymusic

    allheavymusic Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't the lore that it took an extremely long time to record Epitaph? That'd make sense if they were doing it this way.

    Recording note by note works great for stuff that needs to be absurdly tight. Since someone mentioned Joey Sturgis, I'm thinking of all the breakdown-heavy bands he's recorded. It's not like chugging 0s is a huge test of skill, but if you get the rhythm guitars perfectly on grid and with perfect pick attack, they'll sound much tighter. So why wouldn't you record that note for note? That being said, comping lots of takes is probably more common. There's producers like Dave Otero who don't like to edit guitars much. And Dave produces for Cattle Decap and Archspire. Archspire!

    I'm fascinated by the topic. Since I started listening to a lot of electronic music years ago, I don't have the knee-jerk negative reaction that I did when I was younger. I'm more interested in albums that sound awesome to me than that fulfill some arbitrary constraints of production. Fortunately, we're in an era where you can listen to bands all along the spectrum from old-school to ultra-modern recording techniques. So anyone who feels bad about this should just find bands whose sound you prefer. I tend to naturally lean towards the more modern sound.

    Just remember: If you get the sound you want, there's no objectively wrong way to record an album. There is an objectively correct way, though, and it's anything Adam D does.
     
  4. ikarus

    ikarus SS.org Regular

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    Can anybody explain to me what a "punch in" is?
     
  5. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    except wear a cape and cutoffs onstage and suck all the enjoyment out of the live show by acting like an attention-starved 8 year old.

    cant tell if serious
     
  6. ikarus

    ikarus SS.org Regular

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    Serious.
     
  7. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    A punch in is when you're recording and you get a really good take, minus a note or two, so you play back over that part have have your engineer (or you automate it) "punch in" at the spot where you made a mistake or weren't playing cleanly to get a better take of that small section of music versus redoing a whole track/song to try and fix a small error in an otherwise excellent performance.
     
  8. DudeManBrother

    DudeManBrother Hey...how did everybody get in my room?

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    Redoing a portion of an otherwise good take.
     
  9. ikarus

    ikarus SS.org Regular

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    Ok and then you cut out the not so good note and crossfade the perfectly played note in?
     
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  10. InCasinoOut

    InCasinoOut syncopAZN

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    You don't even have to crossfade it. If your timing is close enough, you'd be able to slice the section at whatever quarter/eighth/sixteenth note you need to paste the punch in into, and if you did it right, the two parts will have no discernable difference.
     
  11. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    pretty much

    unless you're strip-silencing ahead of the note, crossfading is never a bad idea.
     
  12. ikarus

    ikarus SS.org Regular

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    Ok thanks guys for clearing that up for me. ;)
     
  13. axxessdenied

    axxessdenied Arium Addict

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    leave your ego at the door when entering the studio
     
  14. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    This. So Much.
    The ONLY thing I don't like about doing self-recording for my bands is 1) coaxing additional takes or doing things piece by piece and 2) the mix notes. I have to keep reminding the vocalist and the drummer that doubling parts/recording individual kit pieces isn't cheating and they're not the show and that turning them up isn't making anything better, it's just making them louder.
     
  15. j3ps3

    j3ps3 SS.org Regular

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    While mixing, we had a rule with my band that you can't comment about the levels of your own instrument. Before that it was just a constant loudness war between everybody in the band
     
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  16. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    That's a good rule. I'm still doing everything but mastering for one project, but the other one I told the guys we're pitching and paying someone else to do it, because they're not gonna give them 40 mix revisions.
     
  17. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    I'm an advocate of holding onto your ego while tracking and drive yourself to record the best possible takes you can and track as if you can't change a goddamn thing in post-processing.... But, when the raw tracks are done, when you take off your "musician" hat and put on your "engineer" hat, check your ego and do whatever you need to do.

    For my own music, since I'm playing instrumental guitar, the performance is definitely a fairly important part of the recording, so while I did a decent amount of punching (I improvised every solo on my first album, so often I'd do a take, love the first half, not like the second, and keep the first half and then do a couple takes on just the second, or vice versa), the amount of actual "editing" of the lead guitars was pretty minimal - I think I tempo-aligned one sustained note on one solo, because it was a little behind the beat and didn't bother me while tracking but while working on the mix it became increasingly jarring to me. I did a bit more work to the rhythm guitars, and basically threw the book at the bass guitar, but I'm a shit bassist anyway.

    And, man, thinking back to the time I spent working on that project is making me REALLY want to get going on a follow-up. :lol:
     
  18. @zwen

    @zwen Well-Known Member

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    Don’t get me wrong, I think the results sound excellent, and that’s all that matters, I just was astounded that Necro utilized this method.
     

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