Kiesel --- Never Again!

Discussion in 'Standard Guitars' started by MetalHead40, Mar 7, 2017.

  1. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    A promotion is easier to end (and can be more under the radar) than it is to have to actually change prices.
     
  2. Albake21

    Albake21 "Just get a used Ibanez Prestige."

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    That's exactly what's going on. It's not a real promotion like many think. It was the same thing as when I worked in retail. The "sale" prices were the normal every day prices while the "door busters" were actual sale prices. On black friday it was even worse. They raised the prices of products to the "normal" price and made the black friday prices just the "door busters" price. In other words, nothing changed and the prices were the same on week days and on weekends when "door busters" were a thing. It's just marketing.
     
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  3. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    Hopefully not to derail the entire conversation, but i find it to bizarre that some stores have "black friday in July" sales, "black friday week" sales, and even all-weekend-long, all-day "door busters".
     
  4. nosferum

    nosferum SS.org Regular

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    Well I was all ready to order me a Kiesel DC600 and it would be my first Kiesel but some of these posts now have me a bit nervous. My budget is no more than $2400 and I specced out what I think would be a great guitar but I have never played a Kiesel so I don't know how well they are made or play. What other brands could they be compared to? Im looking for a guitar to play Metal. I've been considering Solar, ESP E-II line and Ibanez but the Kiesels seemed like a great deal compared to some of those other brands I'm looking at. A lot of bang for the buck it seems. SS frets and a custom build are big pluses in going the Kiesel direction. I'll do some more research before I make my final decision.
     
  5. MSS

    MSS SS.org Regular

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    You can get a Mayones Duvell 7 standard for under $2400 usd. They are harder to find but around.
     
  6. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    I personally haven't owned guitars that felt similar (all of the guitars I've owned have felt different, i think), but the three I see mentioned most often are some USA Jason necks, some of the more slim Schecter necks, and PRS Pattern Regular necks. Note that Kiesel offers a couple neck thickness options and also fretboard radius and fret size options, which can all impact feel. For example, All of the fretboards will be the same thickness in the middle, so if you get a smaller 10" radius, the fretboard will be thinner at the edges than if it were a 20" radius. Take a 20" radius and throw on Jumbo frets and a multi-coat/layer paint job, and the same "neck" can feel quite different to a tung-oiled 10" radius with "regular" or "vintage" frets even if you stuck with the same neck thickness option.

    What I would say is that their standard neck is meant to be a middle-of-the-road neck, sort of one-size-fits most, that's comfortable the the largest audience. Not thick, not too thin. If you know that you want the thinnest they can offer, then get their thin option...it only shaves off .03" though, so it's still not "Wizard" thin. If you want a thicker neck, that would add .03" (so again, not a huge difference) and I believe it's an option that voids the 10-day trial. They might be able to "stack" two of those thick options, too, for an additional .06" over the standard, but I'm not 100% sure on that.

    Two options that they DON'T have: nut width/string spacing options, or compound radius.

    Your best bet would be to stick to options that retain the 10-day trial period, for at least your first. Note: Just because it's not on the builder online, that doesn't mean something is non-returnable (and vise versa, in some cases). Definitely recommend calling (because there are some things the builder lets you do that are conflicting or add cost unnecessarily, or they may suggest something you haven't thought of), and then getting your build sent to you for review before placing the order (once it's placed: no changes).
     
  7. crankyrayhanky

    crankyrayhanky SS.org Regular

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    That's a good choice but apples and oranges (new vs used). You could likely get a decent used Kiesel for closer to 1k .

    Yes, this is a bummer. I would love compound radius and an asymmetrical neck. I may order another Aries soon anyway.
     
  8. Jonathan20022

    Jonathan20022 Engineer

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    Yep Black Friday is a complete joke, sometimes you can find good deals online. But literally any extension that monitors price history will tell you if what you're buying is truly a deal or not :lol:

    Reddit has been more reliable for me to find something on sale throughout the years, I just follow subs that have deals for products I'm interested in and the people there will do all the work for me.
     
  9. budda

    budda Do not criticize as this Contributor

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    What extensions are these?
     
  10. nosferum

    nosferum SS.org Regular

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    Thanks for the great info. I also wanted to ask, Is there going to be a Kiesel price increase coming soon? If so when does it go in effect? I better make my mind up soon! The pressure is on. Ive been watching a lot of youtube clips of Kiesel guitars and they look and sound great to me. I'm guessing that they are pretty great guitars and I would be very happy with one.
     
  11. DudeManBrother

    DudeManBrother Hey...how did everybody get in my room?

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    This thread should be a reminder as to why you order something that maintains the 10 day return policy. Of the 15 or so I’ve had in my hands, I have yet to play a bad Carvin/Kiesel. A few have needed setups, but that’s typical of instruments in every price range. Some didn’t do it for me aesthetically, but all of them have been great playing instruments. My Aries shipped with bridge saddles in the wrong spot, like it was for a lefty; and the neck pickup installed upside down, but that was easy to remedy. It’s one of my favorite playing guitars. The chances of you receiving a great guitar are much higher than receiving a lemon. Just make sure you have your 10 day in case...
     
  12. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    Yes, July 1st. They have small ones every 6mo or so. In the past, they have been about $50 to $100. Sometimes specific options also go up a little. I don't believe there's been more concrete data yet. There likely won't be until it happens, unless Jeff just decides to go off the cuff and starts listing them in one of his live Q&A videos.

    People shit on their "frequent" price increases...but for reference, last March, Music Man raised prices on many models by $300-600 depending on the model,and there was about 10-12% in 2013. So kiesel does them more often, but are normally smaller...and up until the last couple, they came with upgrades. One $50 increase brought standard luminlay side dots. One $50 brought standard stainless frets. They started rolling in the carbon fiber neck reinforcement rods between price changes. They haven't added any standard upgrades the last couple price changes, though.

    While I'm a fan of their guitars (I have 3, and planning on at least 2 more), and keeping up with them is a little hobby of mine...this is a "never again" thread, so you know that there have been some people with issues. Some with quality, some with customer service. They do make 4,000+ guitars in a year though, so even if 99.9% of customers are happy, that's still 4 pissed off folks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
  13. narad

    narad Progressive metal and politics

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    Kiesel: makes 4,000 guitars a year.

    Also Kiesel:
    ~Aww man guys, Jeff here (Kiesel Guitars, Carvin Guitars, 1-800-KieselGuitars), feeling really bummed. Our warehouse was totally robbed last night...had a dozen guitars stolen... Maaan, you know...if you've been thinking about putting in an order... it would really help us out right now....that number again is 1-800-KieselGuitars....super bummed right now...
     
  14. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    It was 16, and international order credit card fraud. ;)
     
  15. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

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    That extra tenth of one percent net really matters. :lol:
     
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  16. narad

    narad Progressive metal and politics

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    The fact that it was international order credit card fraud and was generally presented as some sort of direct theft is also part of the point I'm making.
     
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  17. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    I think the price increase is a minor thing. Still shoulda bought a vader before I left the states.

    Although, it's funny to think that it's more annoying the way they do a little bit at a time.

    Suhr, Anderson, and PRS have all had massive price increases in the last few years. People complain but then it dies down. I know andersons are like almost 1000 dollars more for the same specs to what I first got.
     
  18. budda

    budda Do not criticize as this Contributor

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    Everyone has price increases, it's called inflation. Some brands probably increase more than others.

    As you were.
     
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  19. jephjacques

    jephjacques BUTTS LOL

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    Man I get that Jeff is a dink but I'd try to spin that into getting some more orders too if I were in his position. My merch company spends a ridiculous amount of time and effort fighting scammers like this, it fuckin sucks.
     
  20. Hollowway

    Hollowway Extended Ranger

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    I can't remember if it's a California thing, or US thing, but I think it's illegal to advertise something as being on sale if it never was the original price.

    EDIT: I act like I'm not literally on the internet. So, I looked it up, and it is, in fact, a federal law against false advertising. For a sale to not be false advertising, the original price must be in force for a substantial amount of time, and relatively recently (most saying within 3 months) for the sale price to be considered legitimate, and not false advertising. Furthermore, the actual price cannot be an inflated price, only to allow for a reasonable sale price to be created. AND the business has to be able to show that a decent number of people were buying the product at the non-sale price before the sale was instituted.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2019

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