Kemper profiler, new model?

SkullCrusher

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Hi Guys

been a while... Been wanting a new amp for some time and my EVH 5150 somehow has packed up, so until its mended now seems like a great time to treat myself.

I've always liked the idea of the kemper, my only issue is they have seemed to been out for ages. any idea if they will replace them with a new model soon. Or should i bite the bullet?

Cheers !
 

katsumura78

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Why the Kemper would be my question? And I’m not asking because I’m a fractal fan but after playing a kemper I felt very limited. There’s a ton of great options out there so what’s the “tone goal” lol. I’m gassing for synergy stuff and I don’t need any of it so I understand wanting to try something new.
 

lewis

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my attitude these days is the "Jack of all trades" setups i.e Kemper, are used to record/Profile album tones.

For most shows however, a small analog Pedalboard is more desirable. Its why I picked up the Amp1 Iridium edition. 180watt tube amp that weighs less than the 2lbs and is pedal board mountable. Perfect tiny and light setup to tour/travel with

EDIT: Being able to also run into any House Cabs whilst going direct at the same time is do able like this too so covers even more bases. You can get the sound guy to blend both the stage Cab sound with the Direct tone.
 

Lorcan Ward

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It will be another 2 years minimum before we see a Kemper II and even then that’s doubtful, they still don’t have an official editor yet? The Neural Cortex is going to have a type of profiling and STL released a plugin that loads their Kemper patches which shows other brands are moving on the market Kemper have left open.
 

Chebax

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they still don’t have an official editor yet?
Yes, actually they released an editor recently. It’s quite good imho, but they’re admittedly late to the editor party.

I’ve had my Kemper toaster since 2012 and I couldn’t be happier with it. Actually I could, I just wish I had the powered version instead, it just didn’t exist then.

The Kemper Stage pedalboard seems to be based on a different more modern HW (they have published OS updates that were specific for it) so it might be the first product of their new architecture. Does that mean they’re going to launch the Kemper 2 soon? Maybe.

They will certainly not announce it in advance, since the day they do people will automatically stop buying the current model.

If the Kemper Stage fits your needs, that’s probably the safest bet. It was released recently so chances it gets replaced are close to zero.
 

GunpointMetal

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A decade with no hardware innovation is (no, the floor is not an innovation, its just a different format for the same stuff) is almost unheard of in this market. If people are still buying them at a steady rate I don't know why they would replace it, but they'd be foolish to think that product line's development is completely mature and has nowhere to go. I'd rather have a full-on modeler personally. I had a way easier time dialing in amp models from scratch for my sound than I did hunting down a profile that had the right EQ and gain profile. I also didn't like the way the Kemper EQ controls function. They're closer to the EQ on a home stereo than an amp EQ.
 

USMarine75

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What tones are you looking for? Axe FX is as good or better for high gain. KPA is far better for low/med gain and dynamics IMO.
How important are FX? The KPA effects are good but very limited. The FX on AxeFX are much superior IMO.
The powered toaster is also super portable and great for practice, gigging, and recording.

The biggest detractor was the lack of an editor, but now they have one. It's not fantastic, but it's decent and getting better.

I don't care that it hasn't been innovated... it does everything I want. I'd rather they wait until they have a revolutionary change and not just minimal.

I have a KPA and love it.
 

sleewell

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the kpa is awesome. they came out with the stage recently. i would still buy either the toaster or stage. they can do firmware updates without having to release an entire new piece of hardware.
 

Chebax

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A decade with no hardware innovation is (no, the floor is not an innovation, its just a different format for the same stuff) is almost unheard of in this market. If people are still buying them at a steady rate I don't know why they would replace it, but they'd be foolish to think that product line's development is completely mature and has nowhere to go.
That's a fair point. The Kemper is basically a decade old computer. And it wasn't specially powerful when it was released.

But at the same time, as a user it's refreshing to see that such an old device still gets frequent OS updates and hasn't been a victim of planned obsolescence.
Love it when a company is not pushing constant HW updates every second year just for the sake of it. I wish Apple, Samsung and friends were a bit more like that.
 

lewis

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This is why having newer axe fxs every few years seems pointless to me. We have already reached basically perfect tonal and feeling clones of every popular amp that exists.

its why Kemper's model unto now has worked. The Kemper already provides a basically perfect tonal copy of any sound, how would we have improved on that with a Kemper II or III by now?

The Axe Fx II XL was THE pinnacle for Fractal imo. Im not surprised to see and hear many people hold off on buying the III. If you have the II its pointless grabbing a III. Ive checked out tonal differences and its so marginal it isn't justified. The III just sounds like its got a more refined bottom end and more top end sparkle - things you could change on the IIs versions of the same amp model by utilising some EQ blocks or something.

The unit itself looks lovely but these are amps/efx units and its all about tone. The Kemper looks like some weird shit out of TRON in the 80s. Don't really matter how it looks.
companies are going to start running around in circles thinking of ways to repackage the same product but market it differently to get the sale. - seeing as they basically sound the same now. How perfectly can you clone a sound when you already have basically perfectly cloned it already?
Where do we stop? Axe FX XII VII ?
 

MaxOfMetal

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This is why having newer axe fxs every few years seems pointless to me. We have already reached basically perfect tonal and feeling clones of every popular amp that exists.

its why Kemper's model unto now has worked. The Kemper already provides a basically perfect tonal copy of any sound, how would we have improved on that with a Kemper II or III by now?

The Axe Fx II XL was THE pinnacle for Fractal imo. Im not surprised to see and hear many people hold off on buying the III. If you have the II its pointless grabbing a III. Ive checked out tonal differences and its so marginal it isn't justified. The III just sounds like its got a more refined bottom end and more top end sparkle - things you could change on the IIs versions of the same amp model by utilising some EQ blocks or something.

The unit itself looks lovely but these are amps/efx units and its all about tone. The Kemper looks like some weird shit out of TRON in the 80s. Don't really matter how it looks.
companies are going to start running around in circles thinking of ways to repackage the same product but market it differently to get the sale. - seeing as they basically sound the same now. How perfectly can you clone a sound when you already have basically perfectly cloned it already?
Where do we stop? Axe FX XII VII ?

They come out with a new flagship AxeFx about every few years and then extend the newest firmware till they max out the memory.

You're buying two separate products, the hardware and the software within. If you want the newest updates you'll buy the newer hardware.

The Kemper is it's own thing. Folks lump them in with Fractal gear because it uses software and isn't cheap, but the similarities pretty much end there. It's a completely different user experience and work flow.
 

lewis

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They come out with a new flagship AxeFx about every few years and then extend the newest firmware till they max out the memory.

You're buying two separate products, the hardware and the software within. If you want the newest updates you'll buy the newer hardware.

The Kemper is it's own thing. Folks lump them in with Fractal gear because it uses software and isn't cheap, but the similarities pretty much end there. It's a completely different user experience and work flow.
Im aware of their differences. Until recently I owned an AX8 alongside my Kemper.

End of the day though all the bells and whistles are kind of pointless. Its about the end tonal result and how close it is to the real amp. The Kemper and II (regardless of their differences) already get unbelievably close. In a live, and recorded mix, the differences are either negligible or non existent.

Maxing out newer and newer firmware to me is irrelevant to imo because of my thoughts on how close we already are. There isn't enough of a gap left between the digital sound vs the Tube amp counterpart, to justify thousands and thousands of $$$ on a newer generation of Axe FX regardless of the on paper differences between it and the previous one.
 

GunpointMetal

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Kemper and AFX are barely the same kind of devices. Other than replicating analog amp sounds, the Kemper can't do 1/4 of the stuff you can do on an AFX in regards to spatial FX, routing, etc. I don't personally like "profiling" as I'd rather start from scratch. But as noted, amp modeling has been "there" for a long time, especially if you're the type to use a normal cab on stage, so its a matter of rig integration. You'd need an entirely separate FX board or MFX unit to get the Kemper to do what AFX III does beyond just the amp sounds.
 

Lorcan Ward

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The requests for a Kemper 2 was more for ease of use and additional features like dual rigs, less destructive EQ, more CPU, more effect slots etc rather than tonal improvements. Apart from the impulse response being shortened so much there aren’t many complaints about the accuracy of the profiling.
 

MaxOfMetal

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Im aware of their differences. Until recently I owned an AX8 alongside my Kemper.

End of the day though all the bells and whistles are kind of pointless. Its about the end tonal result and how close it is to the real amp. The Kemper and II (regardless of their differences) already get unbelievably close. In a live, and recorded mix, the differences are either negligible or non existent.

Maxing out newer and newer firmware to me is irrelevant to imo because of my thoughts on how close we already are. There isn't enough of a gap left between the digital sound vs the Tube amp counterpart, to justify thousands and thousands of $$$ on a newer generation of Axe FX regardless of the on paper differences between it and the previous one.

It's not really about amp accuracy, but about how much "stuff" you can run at a given time.

They've also done much better as far as the HMI goes. I know they still get knocked on for that, but it's worlds better now than before.

I don't think ~$2k every three or four years is too bad. If you plan it right selling the older hardware will pay for about 50% of the new device.

Compared to shopping around real amps, it's a pittance.

Kemper and AFX are barely the same kind of devices. Other than replicating analog amp sounds, the Kemper can't do 1/4 of the stuff you can do on an AFX in regards to spatial FX, routing, etc. I don't personally like "profiling" as I'd rather start from scratch. But as noted, amp modeling has been "there" for a long time, especially if you're the type to use a normal cab on stage, so its a matter of rig integration. You'd need an entirely separate FX board or MFX unit to get the Kemper to do what AFX III does beyond just the amp sounds.

Eh, the Kemper's effects and routing satisfy most users. So unless you're a heavy FX user or routing multiple units to multiple sources there shouldn't be that big of a gap.

Though, I'm sort of in a glass house here as I'm running a Kemper with an Axe2. :lol:
 

GunpointMetal

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IEh, the Kemper's effects and routing satisfy most users. So unless you're a heavy FX user or routing multiple units to multiple sources there shouldn't be that big of a gap.

Though, I'm sort of in a glass house here as I'm running a Kemper with an Axe2. :lol:
Best of both worlds, ay? My live patches are pretty much maxed on DSP on my Helix, but the FX are what drove me to modeling/multifx anyways. I have two types of tones - dry, or soaked. I wanna hit one button and get three subtle delays, a reverb, a trem and a filter all at the same time, then turn them all off at the same time.
 

budda

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Fractal clean and mid gain are lacking? Cant say that's been my experience :lol:. Garageband has good cleans, thinking latest gen modellers dont is asinine.
 

KnightBrolaire

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The Kemper already provides a basically perfect tonal copy of any sound
Hard disagree on that. It's excellent and damn near spot on PROVIDED you don't tweak any of your eq settings EVER. That's when the profiling falls apart. If they ever manage to implement more of a modeling approach that better represents amp EQs (or a more involved profiling that involves showing how the EQ/knobs affect the sound) I'd buy it in a heartbeat. Until there's some massive leap forward like that, I'm going to stick with real amps. The kemper was great if you don't like tweaking (like at all) but otherwise I'm glad I dumped mine.
 

technomancer

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It's not really about amp accuracy, but about how much "stuff" you can run at a given time.

They've also done much better as far as the HMI goes. I know they still get knocked on for that, but it's worlds better now than before.

I don't think ~$2k every three or four years is too bad. If you plan it right selling the older hardware will pay for about 50% of the new device.

Compared to shopping around real amps, it's a pittance.

And the Axe III was basically developed because the processor in the II was EOL'd. Basically they had two choices: stop selling product or design new hardware. Seems like everybody overlooks that :lol:
 

Celtic Frosted Flakes

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I love my Kemper, except for the toaster design. Featurewise it suits all my needs - I only download the amp profiles and I am not to fond of tweaking. The only thing I miss about the Kemper is maybe a graphic EQ.
 


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