Ibanez RG to Lundgren

[l1ll1]

Hey you all,

before I go and bring it to a trusted tech, I'm gonna try it here:

Wanted to replace the Fusion Edges in my new (used) RG2027XL with Lundgren Black Heavens. I know my way around a soldering iron, but for the love of god the wiring schemes and color codes I find on the internet make no sense.

The "DiMarzios" have white, red, green, black conductors, but the schemes I seem to find don't make sense – everyone says red is hot, but bridge/white is wired to position 1 on the 5way switch.

The Lundgrens have red, green, yellow/white, blue conductors and I found three different schemes on what is hot etc. It sucks.

If anybody has a solution to this fun (*facepalm*) little riddle, I'm happy to listen. Otherwise it's off to the tech who currently has a 4week waiting period.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Matt08642]

This is the color code for DiMarzio wiring:



I can't find a labeled Lundgren diagram like this, so what I would do is just email Lundgren and ask them which color is North start, North finish, South start, and South finish on their pickups, then just do a 1 to 1 swap of each wire according to color.

Also I wouldn't worry about the Ibanez/DiMarzio wiring not making sense, they have special switches that offer weird combos like Bridge, bridge and neck split inners, both pickups, neck parallel, neck series.

 

[l1ll1]

Thx for the tip, mailed Johan already, he has been super helpful so far.

 

[PK317]

Guitar Humbucker Wire Color Codes | Guitar Wirirng Diagrams

Anderson, Bare Knuckle, Bartolini, Benedetto, Bill Lawrence, Caparison, Carvin, DiMarzio, Dunca Designed, EMG-HZ, Fender, Fralin, GFS, Gibson, Golden Age, Gotoh, Ibanez, Iron Gear, Joe Barden, Jackson, Kent Armstrong, Lace, Lollar, Lundgren, Nordstrand, Paul Reed Smith, Peavey, Railhammer, Rio...

guitarelectronics.com

 

[l1ll1]

Guitar Humbucker Wire Color Codes | Guitar Wirirng Diagrams

Anderson, Bare Knuckle, Bartolini, Benedetto, Bill Lawrence, Caparison, Carvin, DiMarzio, Dunca Designed, EMG-HZ, Fender, Fralin, GFS, Gibson, Golden Age, Gotoh, Ibanez, Iron Gear, Joe Barden, Jackson, Kent Armstrong, Lace, Lollar, Lundgren, Nordstrand, Paul Reed Smith, Peavey, Railhammer, Rio...

guitarelectronics.com

Yeah thanks, I had stumbled on that chart already, but I tried to go from the switch and missmatching Ibanez/DiMarzio info. But as Matt08642 pointed out, it's probably not the switch I'm used to, so it might be the cause of my confusion...

 

[l1ll1]

So for anyone dealing with Lundgrens, here is the actual info from Johan as of 2023:

PUs with GREY wire:
"Yellow and red together as a split funktion if you need that. Blue is hot Green and shield is ground."

PUs with BLACK wire:
"white and red together as a split "link" (if you need that. Black is hot and green is ground."


So this diagram is outdated:

Guitar Humbucker Wire Color Codes | Guitar Wirirng Diagrams

Anderson, Bare Knuckle, Bartolini, Benedetto, Bill Lawrence, Caparison, Carvin, DiMarzio, Dunca Designed, EMG-HZ, Fender, Fralin, GFS, Gibson, Golden Age, Gotoh, Ibanez, Iron Gear, Joe Barden, Jackson, Kent Armstrong, Lace, Lollar, Lundgren, Nordstrand, Paul Reed Smith, Peavey, Railhammer, Rio...

guitarelectronics.com

 

[Manurack]

I'd take a multimeter to each wire to find the "hot" wire with the Lundgrens.

 

[odibrom]

Regarding the DiMarzio (and any other brand), each color is related to a specific coil and "function". You should read about how pickups are build to understand it a bit more, but I'll leave you a short resume for understanding.

A humbucker can be wired in series in 4 different ways and deliver the exact same tone (when alone). For DiMarzio you can have:
1 - Red goes HOT, Black and white together, Green goes GROUND
2 - White goes HOT, Green and Red together and Black goes GROUND
3 - Black goes HOT, Green and Red together and white goes GROUND
4 - Green goes HOT, White and Black together and Red goes GROUND

These 4 different wiring configurations deliver the EXACT same tone when the pickup is isolated, however 1 and 2 are in reverse phase to 3 and 4.

Depending on the other pickups in the guitar and on the switching configurations and possibilities, it's common to see the bridge pickup wired as listed on number 2 to to get access to a specific coil on other switch positions (for coil spliting and combos with other pickups).

Options 3 and 4 may sometimes be useful when mixing pickup brands as some are build in reverse phase to DiMarzio and Duncans, for example or when Out of phase (same as reverse phase) sounds are needed.

The "Start" and the "Finish" as seen on the previously shown DiMarzio color code refers to the bobbins' winding, the North and South refers to its magnetic polarity.

Regarding Lundgreen, I'm not familiar with their lead wires' color code, but it should be similar, probably shown in their website.

In order to solve your puzzle, it helps to know how do you want your guitar to be wired in the other switch positions and what switch you're working with. If it's just a pickup swap (meaning keeping all the configurations and combos of the 2, 3 and 4 switch positions), carefully trace the present one regarding Neck and Bridge pickups' leads and get a conversion for DiMarzio's color code to Lundgreen's.

 

[l1ll1]

The "Start" and the "Finish" as seen on the previously shown DiMarzio color code refers to the bobbins' winding, the North and South refers to its magnetic polarity.

Regarding Lundgreen, I'm not familiar with their lead wires' color code, but it should be similar, probably shown in their website.

In order to solve your puzzle, it helps to know how do you want your guitar to be wired in the other switch positions and what switch you're working with. If it's just a pickup swap (meaning keeping all the configurations and combos of the 2, 3 and 4 switch positions), carefully trace the present one regarding Neck and Bridge pickups' leads and get a conversion for DiMarzio's color code to Lundgreen's.

Thats exactly what I did. I want to keep the exact same switching, but the info on the Fusion Edges is very weird, different colour codes etc. As is the info on the switch. As was the info on the Lundgrens (even on their website the info differs from Johans response on the actual 2023 color code). I don't have any crocodile clamps to measure the pickups myself without a big hazzle but will do it anyway on wendesday. Thx anyway for your long answer.

 

[odibrom]

Thats exactly what I did. I want to keep the exact same switching, but the info on the Fusion Edges is very weird, different colour codes etc. As is the info on the switch. As was the info on the Lundgrens (even on their website the info differs from Johans response on the actual 2023 color code). I don't have any crocodile clamps to measure the pickups myself without a big hazzle but will do it anyway on wendesday. Thx anyway for your long answer.

http://www.hoshinogakki.co.jp/pdf/ibanez/products/EG/rg2027xl_00_01.pdf

So, this is your guitar, right?


It should be wired something like this if the guitar has the VLX91/Otax superswitch:

or like this if the guitar has an "import type" switch:

Either way, you must relate DiMarzio's color code to Lundgreen's and follow these exact schematics.

DiMarzio's web site has lots of wiring schematics, look at those found under the folders Ibanez / Specific Models / RG and my suggestion is under the folder RG1527.

Regarding this chart:

Lundgren compares to DiMarzio like this:
- DiMarzio RED = Lundgren BLUE
- DiMarzio BLACK = Lundgren RED
- DiMarzio WHITE = Lundgren YELLOW
- DiMarzio GREEN = Lundgren GREEN.

Remember, all bare wires go to ground.

 

[l1ll1]

http://www.hoshinogakki.co.jp/pdf/ibanez/products/EG/rg2027xl_00_01.pdf

So, this is your guitar, right?


It should be wired something like this if the guitar has the VLX91/Otax superswitch:

or like this if the guitar has an "import type" switch:

Either way, you must relate DiMarzio's color code to Lundgreen's and follow these exact schematics.

DiMarzio's web site has lots of wiring schematics, look at those found under the folders Ibanez / Specific Models / RG and my suggestion is under the folder RG1527.

Regarding this chart:

Lundgren compares to DiMarzio like this:
- DiMarzio RED = Lundgren BLUE
- DiMarzio BLACK = Lundgren RED
- DiMarzio WHITE = Lundgren YELLOW
- DiMarzio GREEN = Lundgren GREEN.

Remember, all bare wires go to ground.

Hey, thx again for the post!
Yes, that is my guitar.
I got the export variant with the 5way even though my wiring is a bit different from the one you posted and the ones I found on DiMarzio. I did a longer search myself... I'm familiar how that type of 5-way-switch is usually wired, at least the full humbucking positions. BUT and thats what I've been saying:
The wiring in my RG does not make sense if I use the already disproven color code pic. In your scheme for my RG (import 5 way), my DiMarzios have their "hot" wire in the color code white – which should be red, according to the color code pic that is also wrong on the Lundgrens, so I'm not trusting that one.
Anyway, I'm gonna wait for an answer from Ibanez and check polaritys of the Fusion Edges with clamps on wednesday and match that with the ones on the Lundgrens. Meh. Why isn't this stuff standardized anyway.

 

[odibrom]

Hey, thx again for the post!
Yes, that is my guitar.
I got the export variant with the 5way even though my wiring is a bit different from the one you posted and the ones I found on DiMarzio. I did a longer search myself... I'm familiar how that type of 5-way-switch is usually wired, at least the full humbucking positions. BUT and thats what I've been saying:
The wiring in my RG does not make sense if I use the already disproven color code pic. In your scheme for my RG (import 5 way), my DiMarzios have their "hot" wire in the color code white – which should be red, according to the color code pic that is also wrong on the Lundgrens, so I'm not trusting that one.
Anyway, I'm gonna wait for an answer from Ibanez and check polaritys of the Fusion Edges with clamps on wednesday and match that with the ones on the Lundgrens. Meh. Why isn't this stuff standardized anyway.

In position two of your guitar, what coils are working? Tap them with something metal with the guitar plugged in to the amp/whatever gear you have.

As you said the guitar was bought used, it's possible someone rewired it... right?

 

[l1ll1]

In position two of your guitar, what coils are working? Tap them with something metal with the guitar plugged in to the amp/whatever gear you have.

As you said the guitar was bought used, it's possible someone rewired it... right?

Gonna check that on wednesday, as far as I heard it was the splits of both humbuckers, as it should be. If someone rewired it, they did a VERY good job. It looks totaly stock and clean.

 

[ezboarderz]

I stumbled upon this thread when wiring up the Lundgren 7 string Black Heaven set with my newly acquired Ibanez Prestige RG2027XL.This thread doesnt have it right when it comes to the wiring for Lundgren with a black hot wire and not blue. What worked for me was:

Dimarzio red = Lundgren black
Dimarzio green = Lundgren green
DImarzio black = Lundgren white
Dimarzio white = Lundgren red

Johan was quite nice to chat with and helped bring this dimarzio:Lundgren wire color translation. I can also confirm that if you email Lundgren before ordering, they can make a custom order with the flat baseplate with triangle ears to perfectly fit this guitar.

Really nice pickups for this guitar as well. Much better than the stock pickups that come with the guitar.

 

[SalsaWood]

@odibrom Sorry for being kinda OT, but can Dimarzio (for example) neck and bridge pickups change each other's sound based on the wiring even when one is not selected?

If I had an Ionizer in the neck and a D'Activator in the bridge would they respectively sound different even on bridge/neck only positions compared to "matched" model set, or other mismatches in regard to the same respective position settings? Would using an Evolution in the neck make the D'Activator bridge sound different on the bridge only setting, and is this dependent on certain wiring configurations?

 

[ezboarderz]

@odibrom Sorry for being kinda OT, but can Dimarzio (for example) neck and bridge pickups change each other's sound based on the wiring even when one is not selected?

If I had an Ionizer in the neck and a D'Activator in the bridge would they respectively sound different even on bridge/neck only positions compared to "matched" model set, or other mismatches in regard to the same respective position settings? Would using an Evolution in the neck make the D'Activator bridge sound different on the bridge only setting, and is this dependent on certain wiring configurations?

no it shouldnt. The point of a matched set is to match a neck pickup with a particular bridge pickup for leads/cleans, but it wont impact your bridge pickup by swapping neck pickups, unless your pickup switch/blade is actively on both pickups.

I have a black winter neck pickup with a Sh5 that sounds exactly the same with it as it did with the black winter bridge, when only selecting the neck pickup with the switch.

 

[lewis]

This is why I just use the EMG quick connect kits for either Passive or Active.

So much simpler to wire any pickups up to a quick connect setup.

 

[Lemonbaby]

Sorry for being kinda OT, but can Dimarzio (for example) neck and bridge pickups change each other's sound based on the wiring even when one is not selected?

When it's not selected, it's not connected.

 

[odibrom]

@odibrom Sorry for being kinda OT, but can Dimarzio (for example) neck and bridge pickups change each other's sound based on the wiring even when one is not selected?

If I had an Ionizer in the neck and a D'Activator in the bridge would they respectively sound different even on bridge/neck only positions compared to "matched" model set, or other mismatches in regard to the same respective position settings? Would using an Evolution in the neck make the D'Activator bridge sound different on the bridge only setting, and is this dependent on certain wiring configurations?

Like @ezboarderz said, a neck pickup does not affect the bridge pickup tone nor vice versa. However, let's not forget that String Pull is a thing and all pickups do this at some level. Hotter pickups generally have bigger string pull than less hot ones. The string pull affects how the string vibrates dampening it magnetically. So, in a way, a neck pickup does interfere with the way a bridge pickup sounds. Comparing 2 exactly equal guitars, one being HH and the other Bridge hum only, same setup, same bridge hum, same hardware... it's probable to have the bridge humbucker sounding different from one guitar to the other. Now within the same guitar with 2 pickups, the different string pull different neck pickups have will be negligible if the neck pickups are somehow similar. In most cases, no one will notice any difference, but in some particular configuration, there might be some influence. If it's noticeable or not...

The "matching set" most brands sell has the purpose of delivering similar/compensated outputs and tone, but it's not mandatory for the user to get a set. I've tested neck pickups in the bridge position and they work just fine. The rule of thumb is to have the bridge pickup with more output than the neck's, other than that, one's free to do whatever suits him better, even combining passives with actives.

The reason why most classic guitars (Les Pauls, for example) have dedicated volumes is because when they were built, the pickups used were "all the same" and the method to balance their outputs was to add a dedicated volume control.

This is why I just use the EMG quick connect kits for either Passive or Active.

So much simpler to wire any pickups up to a quick connect setup.

I've been using some PCB mini connectors to allow me quick pickup swaps without soldering. Later I started using the same approach to separate some circuit parts, so I can replace whatever inside the guitar without soldering inside of it... and these also allow me to trouble shoot possible problems.

 

[Rob Joyner]

This thread is exactly what I was looking for. I wanted to swap a Fusion for a Lundgren M7.
Can you tell me if everything went ok or update us when it finally works?