I need help to be more tolerant of other people's taste in music.

Discussion in 'General Music Discussion' started by Xaios, Jul 6, 2018.

  1. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I'm a bit late to this party, I think - but really? Think about this for a moment. In this thread (and presumably at any party, or in any conversation you've had with "normy" non-metal listeners), we're constantly ostracizing:

    - Pop music
    - Anything that can be called Top 40
    - Anything that gets radio play or publicity (out of jealousy maybe?)
    - Rap
    - Hip-hop
    - Country
    - Electronic music
    - People's desire to dance or have fun (because this is different from our desire to BE BRUTAL FOR SOME REASON AAAAARGH SOMETHING SOMETHING MACHO)
    - Anything we can deride for being "not complicated/sophisticated enough" for our elite tastes
    - Anything that we've decided has somehow violated some unwritten rules about the integrity of music and artists (not real instruments? Auto-tune?)

    Has anyone made fun of classical music yet? Or is that up to our high standards of musical sophistication?

    At the end of the day everyone thinks everyone else listens to terrible music, but for some reason the metalheads in the room insist on being elitist d*cks about it.

    I think it's important to notice that if you keep getting into confrontations over music taste that you might be the common denominator.
     
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  2. PunkBillCarson

    PunkBillCarson SS.org Regular

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    You do realize that much of this site is inhabited by people who love metal and as such is a very small part of the music listening population all over the world, right? As such there is a very small amount of people who listen to metal compared to those that listen to all of the above that you listed.

    Anywho, it is what it is. I just know that I like hearing metal and it has nothing to do with anti-social behavior or pushing an agenda or chugging cheap beer as ol' Mr. I think I'm a God That Lives Under The Ocean would have anyone believe. I've made my points, obviously none of you except for maybe a couple understand and instead try to blatantly ignore points that I've made. There's nothing more for me to say here.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2018
  3. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Yup, and that fits perfectly well with what I said.

    You claimed that metal is unique in that it gets ostracized. That's not even close to true. Almost every genre gets torn to shreds by the people who don't like it or don't understand it. I do it too.
     
  4. bhakan

    bhakan SS.org Regular

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    Yea metal is not at all unique to being ostracized or unacceptable at parties. Country, jazz, classical, emo, etc. are all likely to go over poorly. Also, hip hop and electronic may be the go to "party" music but only certain examples of the genre work for the environment. I don't think clipping or Aphex Twin would go over much better than metal.
     
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  5. KnightBrolaire

    KnightBrolaire only the dead have seen the end of GAS

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    I love metal, but I'm not going to play Stabwound by Necrophagist at a wine tasting (maybe at the tail end of a 3 kegger to clear people out of the house).
    Everyone knows that Richard Cheese's cover of Hammer Smashed Face would be perfect for a wine tasting though :p
    I have been to parties where jazz/classical were played, though they were parties hosted by people in their mid 30s sipping wine, not 18 year olds trying to get shitfaced on PBR.
    You have to know your audience/demographics before playing a lot of music.
     
  6. BIG ND SWEATY

    BIG ND SWEATY Edgy

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    Some of you guys need to lighten up about other peoples taste in music and what gets played at a party. "Errrr why dont they play some metal here?" probably because metal isn't exactly the most fun music to try groove to while you're hammered at a party. I would never expect to go to a party with people my age and hear anything even resembling a metal song, I don't need someone to throw on some metal just so I don't have to "suffer" through the other music that gets played, give me some hood ass rap or some EDM/top 40 to groove to and I'll have a great time, along with everyone else. Metal fans are the whiniest bunch of people I've ever talked to when it comes to other genres of music, can't you fucks just not like a song without being insufferably annoying about it?
     
  7. Sogradde

    Sogradde SS.org Regular

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    I find the "metal is being ostracized" argument really funny because historically, heavy metal (much like punk) was a counter culture. The entire point of metal is to be ostracized and noncomformist.

    I still enjoy Taylor Swift though.
     
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  8. GuitarBizarre

    GuitarBizarre Listen to physics.

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    Your issue is that you found a musical genre you liked and then you've actually never looked beyond that.

    Instead of having it demonstrated to you just how wide and vastly different the world of music can be, you've burrowed down and down and down into progressively less and less different music, absorbing the most minute differences with the same kind of importance placed on them, as most people would place on the difference between Chuck Berry and Jimi Hendrix.

    The fact you want to attack hip-hop so much just speaks, so very much to this mindset. Sure, people at parties who don't know any better will put on Iggy Azalea or Nicki Minaj.

    But you know what? Those same people will gladly listen to Wu-Tang Clan, Eminem, Nujabes, J Dilla, the Roots, Kool and the Gang, etc. Hell, they'll listen to Twista, they'll listen to Busta Rhymes, they'll listen to any number of really technically sound and solid hip-hop artists. They'll sit and nod along to One Be Lo, Run The Jewels, etc.

    The issue here is that YOU won't listen to those solid examples of Hip-Hop either. You clearly believe the genre is entirely bankrupt when nothing could be further from the truth.

    Break apart hip hop and you have a list of characteristics that are just as hard to combine as anything in rock and metal. Sure, Yngwie has put all the time and effort into being as good as he is. But so has Dan Bull, so did Black Thought, so did Canibus, Eminem, KRS-One, etc.

    What they're doing is *HARD* to do and deserves more respect and more credit than you're willing to give it, and that's your issue - You don't respect it despite the fact you know nothing about it and you're using your own preferences and knowledge about metal as a cudgel, slamming it down on other styles of music because you'd rather proclaim that Metal is the "best" rather than expose yourself to a musical style with depth you don't understand and appreciate.
     
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  9. FILTHnFEAR

    FILTHnFEAR Dread it, run from it....

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    I wouldn't go to a party of non metal people and even try putting on most of the stuff I listen to. I've gone to plenty of parties with coworkers and had to just deal with the obnoxious poppy hip hop r&b garbage that was played. It's just how it is. But who cares? I knew it going in. And honestly I'd rather hear some horrid "yo diggity dawg" hip hop or dance hall crap that's gonna make girls wanna drink and shake their asses than annoy them with Insomnium. Lol And I still had a great time at the parties.

    The music has to be fitting to the environment, as others have said. I can go to my cousin's parties where yea, there will be pop and hip hop played, as well as Staind and Distubed type rock, definitely some country, and I know I can throw in something like Mastadon or Russian Circles and people will dig it and it'll be fine. But I'm not gonna throw on anything with screaming or pig squeals because it would just serve to annoy people. I'm not gonna be that guy at the party.

    Idk, I'm 40 yrs old and accepted the fact, long ago, that the vast majority of society will hear what most of us here listen to on this site and say "wtf is this, this isn't even music?" And that's fine, it doesn't hurt my feelings or stop me from loving it.
     
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  10. lurè

    lurè Fake Shredder

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    Simply go to a party with the expectations of going to a party and not to a metal concert.
    Having fun and socializing should be your n°1 priority, music is just a contour.
     
  11. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Not directed at you in particular, I just really enjoy the way we talk about this kind of music in the same thread that we complain about how people don't understand the stuff we like either. :lol: For every "Yo Diggity Dawg", there's an equal and opposite "is this some kind of Screamo?" comment going the opposite direction.
     
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  12. Seabeast2000

    Seabeast2000 Tropospheric Holocenian Contributor

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    Uh uh yeah uh uhn uhh yeah [sample/rendition] . Best played with 1500 watts at stop light. Tolerated.
     
  13. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    No genre of music is complete shit, but there certainly are plenty of songs that are utter garbage. There are plenty of top 40 songs that have some value, usually by relate-able lyrics. Metal has plenty of garbage songs. I think you could argue that some artists' entire repertoires are worthless, but you never know, that same artist could come out with something actually good tomorrow...

    If you don't like a particular genre, I think it's totally fair to say so, but, at the same time, maybe you haven't found the right song to make an exception, and that song may well exist.

    But, that all said, anyone who ever said they liked a pop song "because it had a good beat" is being willfully ignorant. "Bump chump bump chump bump chump bump chump..." is a good beat, yes, but, 99.999...% chance that, in the song in question, it was not originally developed for that song, so if that makes it a good song, then my polaroid photo of a Salividor Dali painting should be worth a million bucks to someone.
     
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  14. FILTHnFEAR

    FILTHnFEAR Dread it, run from it....

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    :lol:The "yo diggity dawg" thing is just how I used to describe the most simplistic main stream hip hop stuff to my friends and co-workers, that were into it. The kind that's not really good for much other than making girls dance. Not a general diss(pun intended) on hip hop/rap in general.

    I'm a huge old school 80's - 90's gangster rap fanboy. I grew up to Eightball and MJG, Geto Boys, NWA, KRS One, E-40, Tupac, Spice 1. Guys with crazy mic skills and great beats and bass lines that destroy whatever's going on today in those genres.
     
  15. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I'm with you, but with the added caveat that said exception might not exist. And if it does exist, it doesn't negate my view of the rest of the genre. And there's no requirement that I search for that exception. It drives me nuts when someone insists that there's some requirement that I try harder to like what they like and just "haven't found the right examples yet". There is zero requirement. I have no motivation or desire to seek out examples that I like in genres I don't otherwise like.

    Edit: I sort of see it as a fair trade - don't ask me to dig for things to like in your music, and I won't push what I like or be elitist about the things I don't like in your music. (The general "your", not you in particular.)
     
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  16. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I suppose the trick is that it's always difficult to pick out that context or intent conversationally. Someone might say "all that screaming stuff" as a simplification when speaking to someone who they know doesn't listen to metal, but someone overhearing it is going to hear two people "talking sh*t about a type of music they don't know anything about".
     
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  17. GuitarBizarre

    GuitarBizarre Listen to physics.

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    It all starts with being able to say to yourself "I don't like this. Someone else does like it. Why do they like it? WHAT ARE THEY HEARING THAT I AM NOT HEARING"

    You might still dislike it (Hello, most black metal), but you'll probably be able to pull something out of it that you do like (Hello, Varg Vikernes being such a caricature of evil and malice that he's practically a cartoon).

    If you can't do that with hip hop, of all things, then it's really very simple - You're not fucking looking hard enough.

    Check out Black Thought freestyle on Flex - 10 minutes of uninterrupted, unrehearsed impromptu rhythm and poetry, with punchlines, references, comedy, politics and personal exposition. You can't do that. Yngwie can't do that. None of your favourite bands can do that.

    What about written verses? Well let's break one down - Eminem in "Remember Me?"

    Code:
    Sick sick dreams of picnic scenes, two kids, sixteen
    With M-16's with ten clips each
    And them shits reach through six kids each
    And Slim gets blamed in Bill Clint's speech to fix these streets?
    Break that down by rhyme scheme. He's literally carrying three independent half-rhymes through multiple lines at the same time, while simultaneously playing off of his "Slim Shady" persona *and* making an extended and multi-level columbine reference. - Two kids, six kids each, Clinton made reference to "violent influences" on children in his speech. 12 students died at columbine - Total death toll was 13 plus Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold but the 13th fatality was a faculty member, so the "Two Kids" are Harris and Klebold, the "six kids each" is the student bodycount.

    All that in 35 words. His entire verse is 226 words long and is only 1/3rd of the song.

    What about sheer wordplay?

    Well here - this is Dan Bull's final segment in a Rap Roast he did of KSI on youtube. It's 34 anagrams of "The Nightmare" delivered in rhyme.

     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
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  18. GuitarBizarre

    GuitarBizarre Listen to physics.

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    What I'm getting at here is that there's a whole lot of elitist "Well rappers just say whore and bitch and drop n bombs hurrr" bullshit in this thread coming from people who have absolutely no idea exactly how deep rap lyricism can be.

    Sure, they don't have Yngwie. They don't *need* Yngwie, they have their own standards by which to measure skill and ability. And they do. Constantly. You wanna hear a hip hop Yngwie? Go listen to Twista and Busta Rhymes, two of the most famous speed rappers in Hip-Hop.

     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
  19. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I think there can be a sort of balance between admitting that, yes, we're not looking hard enough - but it's because we really don't want to, and that's ok. I can appreciate that someone who enjoys something I'm not might be hearing something that I don't hear - but I also expect that they're going in with different expectations and searching for something that I don't search for when I listen to a piece.

    In particular, I find that I'm going to be partial to instrumental technique (in part because I'm a musician), but I also look for things like the build and release of tension, dynamics in volume, speed, etc., stuff that matter to some listeners and not to others. I don't really care what the lyrics to a song are most of the time (depending on the song). I recognize that someone who doesn't like what I like is probably judging music by a different set of requirements/values. If they prioritize lyrical prowess and relatable/dance-able rhythms over dynamic melodies, then of course they're going to like something different than I do. What they value as predictable and a great platform to deliver clever lines, I would find repetitive and flat. What I would find to be dynamic and technically impressive, they might find convoluted, wanky, maybe lacking in restraint for some of the heavier stuff.

    The world gets a lot easier to navigate when you allow for the fact that people's valuation systems are different and that there's nothing wrong with that.
     
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  20. GuitarBizarre

    GuitarBizarre Listen to physics.

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    It's OK as long as you're not going to use your ignorance as a platform from which to assert things that are simply idiotic. If you want to go into a cave and ignore the world of hip hop entirely and not bother me or anyone else with that, then sure, that's fine.

    But the moment you or anyone else reduces hip-hop to this:
    Code:
    Uh uh yeah uh uhn uhh yeah [sample/rendition] . 
    Best played with 1500 watts at stop light. Tolerated. 
    That's the point at which ignorance is being used as a weapon, and that's not defensible. Sure, it's their opinion, but it's an ill-researched, weakly-made, idiotic opinion and simply does not have the same credibility as the opinion of someone who is actually informed about hip-hop culture.
     

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