Help with editing guitars

Discussion in 'Recording Studio' started by bautista, Oct 8, 2015.

  1. bautista

    bautista hi :)

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    Hey guys, I wrote a math/progressive rock/metal EP (16 minute long aprox) but guitars need to be quantized and I have no idea how to do it. Is anybody down to do it for free? Or at least explaining me step by step (real noob). Thanks.
     
  2. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    ...practice until you can pull it off without quantization?

    Even if you ultimately want that robotic tight feel (and I can't WAIT until that's out of fashion again), it's a LOT easier to get it to work if the performance is already most of the way there and there's only one or two notes slightly off. And even then you're better punching in than quantizing, IMO.
     
  3. bautista

    bautista hi :)

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    Yeah, it sounds tight but no "studio" tight, I mean sounds more than decent but in some little parts you can notice the differences, as you say, there's one or two notes slightly off and I tried with audio warp in Cubase but sounds awfully stretched even if it's not much. I'll search for Reaper's audio warp to see if it's easier. Thanks for the advice Drew
     
  4. Lokasenna

    Lokasenna SS.org Regular

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    What DAW are you using? There are a few different ways to quantize your guitars, and some DAWs are better for one method versus another.

    However, the most common method is known as "slip editing", because you slice up your guitar tracks and then "slip" the audio in each segment back and forth to get it on-time.

    Go on YouTube and search for "slip editing guitars" - there are a lot of tutorials, for various DAWs.

    Edit: nm about the DAW, I just saw you're using Reaper - in that case, I think the general consensus is that Reaper is better at slip editing than it is for stretching/warping. However, either will work, and often a combination of both does the job really well.
     
  5. bautista

    bautista hi :)

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    I'm actually using my friend's Cubase 5 haha but I mentioned Reaper because of its free demo which is very useful and I can easily download. I didn't know about Slip editing, I'll do some research now. By the way, I have a LE of some Ableton Live (don't remember which one) and Sonar LE too that came when I bought a mic and an interface, do you think any of these is better than Reaper for slip editing? Sorry for my bad english
     
  6. Lokasenna

    Lokasenna SS.org Regular

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    I've only used Reaper, so I can't say. I heard Pro Tools is (or at least, was) bad for slip editing because of how it handles crossfading between items, but as far as I know Ableton and Sonar should be alright, and plenty of people do slip editing in Cubase so it must be decent.
     
  7. noUser01

    noUser01 Still can't play.

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    I can't wait until people learn to play in time. You can be nearly as tight as a robotic, highly edited record, but people don't bother practicing that. Not as much as they should.

    Depends what you want, you could do punch-ins but that might not be the sound you want, tracking and editing don't cover ALL the same ground.

    Look up a tutorial on "slip editing", it's the most common form of editing and you should really get to know it well since you'll be using it on all kinds of instruments. Quantization tools like Beat Detective or stretch tools like Flex Time have their place, but most of the time you'll probably be doing slip editing.
     
  8. Lokasenna

    Lokasenna SS.org Regular

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    Mildly off-topic, but a great tip for being able to play in time: DON'T monitor the previous guitar takes when you're tracking*. They make it harder to stay on the beat. Recording with just the click and/or drums will often yield much better results.

    *unless it's for a harmony part where you really need the other part to play off of.
     
  9. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    Reaper is awesome, and worth checking out anyway. :yesway:

    Reaper also has a ton of configuration options, and you can control the way it behaves by default for virtually everything, including crossfading at cut points. You don't even need to change this, though, because while you can change the default, it also by default has a visible volume curve on each media item, so if you have a problem with the way something is fading in/out or crossfading you can simply adjust the envelope.

    I generally do little to no editing on my guitars (other than punching in if I flub an otherwise good take) - I write instrumental guitar music, and I feel like if I can't pull off the part, I shouldn't be doing it. But, I DO have to confess that I'll do some editing on my bass playing. I'm a pretty average bassist, have never cared enough about the instrument to get really good at it, and something about the much thicker strings tends to occasionally screw with my timing a little. Also, getting the bass absolutely in sync with the drums is (IMO) really critical for having a clear low end in the mix. I don't try to quantize bass - I tried it once in Reaper using their auto cut/snap to grid feature, and it sounded like absolute garbage - but after I finish tracking and do everything I can to get as good a raw bass track as possible, I will go through and listen with the bass and drums solo'd, and selectively slip-edit individual notes if I find one that isn't completely in the pocket. I'm not proud of it, and I too think the answer here is more practice (or, you know, find a proper bassist to record with :lol:) but for me the focus is really on getting the guitars right, and I'm way more comfortable leaving them sounding a lot more "human" than I am the bass and (Superior Drummer) drums. Pick your battles, I guess. Anyway, in reaper you want to disable "Snap to Grid," listen until you find the note that's off, zoom WAY in both vertically and horizontally so you can clearly see each individual note, and snip just before and just after the note (selecting the item and hitting either S or Ctl-S, I forget, will split your media item), and then carefully click and drag the note until it falls in line. Definitely scruitinize a few similar "good" notes as well to see where they're falling - if the groove of the song is such that most of the similar notes are falling just before or just after the downbeat on the grid, perfectly aligning the note with the grid isn't going to sound right. Then, just stretch out the beginning and/or end of the item and parts around it to extend the sustain from the prior note and the sustain of the note you moved to bridge the gap, and listen back to make sure it's seamless. That's the major advantage of slip-editing over quantizing; well, two, I guess, first that it's kind of a pain in the balls to do right so you tend to make fewer adjustments than you might otherwise, and "human" = good, and two, that you can do a better job preserving the natural groove of a performance.
     
  10. bautista

    bautista hi :)

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    Thanks a lot guys! I'm getting used to Cubase's slip editing very fast actually haha
     
  11. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    Just, like anything, don't overdo it. :lol: Music should sound human.
     
  12. GunpointMetal

    GunpointMetal SS.org Regular

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    Hopefully you're using dry guitar stems for re-amping, makes the visual aspect of slip-editing way easier.

    But I agree with the statement that if you're not happy with your tightness, more practice is the best option. I personally like to hear the guitarist playing the instrument and not what the Guitar Pro file run through shreddage would sound like...
     
  13. bautista

    bautista hi :)

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    But I want to be known as Lucas Mann's son :( lol jk. Of course :)
     

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