Having lots of trouble deciding between two very different amps for recording purpose

Discussion in 'Gear & Equipment' started by XeoFLCL, Apr 10, 2019.

  1. XeoFLCL

    XeoFLCL SS.org Regular

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    So I've had this real first world problem that I can't come to a conclusion on and figured maybe I could get some good input from multiple viewpoints here. I'll start with explaining what I'm doing here.

    I'm looking for a good amp for home recording, having a good DI out is basically mandatory as is the ability to get unique but good tones that will compliment all the way down to E on 8's. Initially I was considering holding out for the invective MH, but after thinking on it more heavily I realized I don't think it'd fit my goal and preferences, that being more or less a meater tone more akin to a Mark V. The issue being I don't really want to spend Mark V money, not until I move next year and can justify having one. I should mention that currently I run a Hughes and Kettner Tubemeister 18 and I'm very happy with it in terms of live tone, but the speaker emulation on the DI out is.. not quite up to snuff with what I want in terms of a DI out, creating this kind of issue. It's not bad but it's not exactly great. So with the invective MH kind of ruled out I went looking again and I've landed on two amps that I feel would fit my needs, but the distances are so night and day that I'm really having a hard time actually coming to a decision on.

    The two amps in question that I've landed between are the Laney Ironheart Studio and Boss Katana Head. I was originally just going to get the Ironheart Studio but our other guitarist has a katana 2x12 that has seriously piqued my interest in terms of using them for actual gigs and more importantly recording. I don't think I'd be THIS indecisive if I also didn't see the price; 350 dollars is really hard to say no to. The Laney on the other hand, I've read many good things about but I cannot for the life of me find one to try out locally. It seems like it's really good for extended range tunings, but I've only seen a handful of videos of people actually using it for 7s, and I think a single video of it being used for an 8, which has me unsure whether I'll really enjoy it or if I'll end up returning it in a week for some reason. Though I think my biggest concern with the Katana is how dynamic it can be tonally, I did own one for a very short minute but I never really tweaked it enough to give it justice as it was just a temporary bedroom amp until I got my H&K. I'm a little worried about it being a one trick pony on the high gain channels, but maybe I'm an idiot that's too concerned with being a unicorn or something rather than actually getting a good tone hence why I'm posting lol

    EDIT: I didn't even mention the style of music. On my own I'm more of a Nevermore and Whitechapel kind of guy, but the band I play for is more of an alternative metal act with two good influence examples being later Deftones and Chevelle.
    EDIT#2: Also if I could get some really good recordings that show exactly how diverse the Katana is so I can actually pick with my ears and not my eyes, that might lean me towards the more soft-on-my-wallet choice!


    So the TLDR; suck it up and take the 700 dollar hit and get a Laney Ironheart Studio and trust the few examples I've heard on youtube for non extended range guitars, or get a Boss Katana Head, know what I'm getting and that it CAN do what I want and pay literally half, but pass up the chance to get the Ironheart Studio and possibly a very unique tone.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
  2. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    I don’t think the laney is good unless you are going to use all the features.

    The di out is garbage without additional post processing.

    In your situation I’d keep your amp and grab a helix stomp.
     
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  3. XeoFLCL

    XeoFLCL SS.org Regular

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    That's an interesting option I've never actually considered since I've actively stayed away from line 6 for quite a while BUT it might be a very good one since I can use it in more than just a home situation. I did at one point own a POD300 and while it did it's job I don't think I was ever 100% satisfied with what I was getting out of it, but I know the Helix is in a whole different league. Pricewise it seems like a good inbetween, I'll look into it definitely. In the meantime do you by chance have any good examples of what to expect from it?
     
  4. Sogradde

    Sogradde SS.org Regular

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    You don't need an amp with a DI out, you need something like a Torpedo Captor.
     
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  5. XeoFLCL

    XeoFLCL SS.org Regular

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    That's something I've also thought about since I'm very happy with how my H&K sounds, it's just the emulated out that lands in a strange place tonally that I'm not very satisfied with. I should add that I do love the idea of having a multieffects processor which is another thing that was leaning me at the katana, I have an M5 but the one effect at a time limitation can be a bit frustrating.

    EDIT: Also I'll just be mic'ing the H&K once I move in about a year, lol.
     
  6. ATRguitar91

    ATRguitar91 SS.org Regular

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    I've never heard a DI out on an amp that sounds good. If recording is the main goal and you only need a temporary solution (ie. you don't want to grab something like the captor), I'd just use VST amps. I'd wager one of the popular VSTs with a good IR will sound as good as the DI out from the H&K. That'd be a solid stopgap until you can mic your amp in the future.

    If you already have an interface, you could try this setup for completely free as well before buying anything. Just download the Ignite Emissary, the NADir or LeCab 2 for IR loading, and grab some free impulse responses. The free Mesa pack from OwnHammer is a great place to start.
     
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  7. Bearitone

    Bearitone SS.org Regular

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    Wait, if the invective really is just a “tweaked 6505 with a good clean channel” then i can’t imagine it NOT being meaty. 6505s are meaty AF. Maybe not Rectifier meaty but, definitely on par with a markV or markIV
     
  8. Thaeon

    Thaeon Cosmic Question Asker

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    Save money and get a Reactive Load. Access to the tone you're used to dialing in on the projects you work on. And flexibility with Cabs/I.R.s.
     
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  9. XeoFLCL

    XeoFLCL SS.org Regular

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    I have played around with VSTs in the past, I think amprig and the original bias fx but I had a hard time really getting a sound that felt "right" if that makes sense. I think it's the physical act of using hardware that makes it click since I didn't have much of an issue with my pod HD300 once upon a time. eitherway I think I'm just going to invest in a captor since thinking on it and the input here it really seems like the logical choice for what I'm after and longterm it'll be the best investment regardless of temporary or longterm
    it's just personal preference and my way of putting it is probably WILDLY inaccurate, I don't exactly dislike the 6505 GRANTED I have never owned one myself. I'd probably change my tune if I found a crazy stupid deal on one since I'd get to spend time to really find a tone I like. generally though, I tend to lean more towards EL34 amps (and some EL84 in the case of my H&K and and a carvin V3m I owned but kept having severe electrical issues) so I think that has alot to do with it. For example, I previously owned a Laney AOR50 series 2 that I am kicking myself for selling now..

    Anyways that kind of sums up what I'll be doing, the more I sit and think about it the more logical it seems to get a torpedo captor and I'm not sure why I didn't put thought into that beyond a passing thought. It seems like the logical conclusion since I'm already really happy with my H&K and anything other seems like it'd be settling for less. Thanks for the input, definitely saved me (and a retailer lol) from a potential headache of being unsatisfied and dealing with a return process. I'm probably just gonna invest the rest of the amount I had put aside into a few key pedals since I'm always fighting on very specific effects on my M5 that I'd like to run two of. :yesway:
     
  10. Descent

    Descent SS.org Regular

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    If it is just for recording, why not invest in a IR loader and some good impulses on the PC?
    You can also save yourself a lot of grief if you just mic a cab. If you can't do it all the time, you can reamp.
    That's what I do, save all my DI rhythm recording for a day when I blast few amps that I record with 2 mic setup. Sounds great IMO. Only downside is that I have to record with amp sim, but for rhythm it doesn't bother me.
     
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  11. op1e

    op1e Spirit Taker

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    I have a lot of decent hardware to choose from (MTS, Diavlo, 6505mh, Ultra 120) and 2 great v30 cabs, good interface. But after hearing our "producer" recording his band with the Tongeforge Ben Bruce plugin, I just wanna go back and retrack stuff. It just sounds great and already produced and thick. We used the 6505mh into WoS as well as micing my Mesa OS cab and its hard to get that produced, full bottom end if you're DiY like most of us. A good plugin first, Torpedo captor as you're second option. You have a good amp.
     
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  12. LiveOVErdrive

    LiveOVErdrive CNC hack

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    Do you have a recording interface? If so, try muting your speaker and running the effects send into your interface and then putting an IR loader on it. Should sound pretty good. You won't include the power amp but it'll still work well.
     
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  13. XeoFLCL

    XeoFLCL SS.org Regular

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    Yep this is basically what I'm doing now, ordering the torpedo captor. it's the smarter choice for what I'm specifically after lol.
    Yeah I think the captor is gonna be my solution, I will be dipping into a few different VSTs now though since the conversations here really piqued my interest in what's out now.
    I sure do! I might try giving this a shot while I wait on my torpedo captor to arrive and see how it turns out. Definitely not something I thought of trying, thanks for the suggestion!
     
  14. laxu

    laxu SS.org Regular

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    If you want a cheap solution and your amp can output from its line-out without any speaker emulation, then try running that into Ignite Amps TSA-1 poweramp plugin and Nadir for impulse response cab sims. Pretty much free to try this setup out to see if it works for you. I've tried this with my Bogner and gotten very usable results that were better than just running the preamp into cab sim.
     
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  15. sakeido

    sakeido Contributor

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    I run a Torpedo Captor into a Mooer Radar IR pedal here. Very happy with the combination. The Captor's built in cab sim is totally usable but not my favorite tone, so I got the Radar to get more control over that aspect of the sound.

    The Radar is quite the pedal. It has power amp simulation built into it as well so I've been using it with a Blackstar preamp pedal because it sounds way, way better than the built-in speaker simulated out. You could run it with the built-in power amp simulation from an effects loop send too.

    Only drawback with the Radar... it probably shouldn't be a half sized pedal. It runs crazy hot and I have doubts about its longterm durability. The boot process is also very slow so if power ever gets interrupted you have a solid 15 second wait to get back to making noise
     
  16. Descent

    Descent SS.org Regular

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    I just wouldn't spend all this money on a loadbox with IRs, considering that you can probably just do an IR capture of your power amp with a mic and use the fx return to the interface. Well...unless you're doing a lot of late night recording.

    I just reamp my stuff, it is much cheaper and get to use my amp miking skills :)
     
  17. op1e

    op1e Spirit Taker

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    That's a good idea. I don't even remember if we were using power amp emulation when we recorded with the 6505mh into the interface. I messed with it in Two Notes WoS but there were so many options with that and the cabs it was a bit daunting. The six choices that come with Nad IR are pretty good and just work.
     
  18. Salt513

    Salt513 SS.org Regular

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    Can you please tell me how you’re connecting those two? I want to do the same but i’m not sure how since the captor’s lineout is a balanced TRS and the mooer’s input is not.
     
  19. whatupitsjoe

    whatupitsjoe SS.org Regular

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    I'm going to add to the chorus of people saying to get a Captor and run you H&K.
     
  20. sakeido

    sakeido Contributor

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    I just connect them with an unbalanced patch cable. It cancels out the balanced TRS out so you could get some noise over a long run. My run is only 20 feet and I do get a little bit of hiss but it's a tube amp without a noise gate in the loop so I can't say if the noise is from the amp or unbalanced cable run.

    I'm not sure if there is a balanced cab sim option out there without going to a full pedalboard like a Line 6 Helix or the like
     

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