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Discussion in 'Standard Guitars' started by diagrammatiks, Oct 3, 2019.
And the "original" was just embellished top Ibanez RG cut body, cut-down ESP headstock neck anyway.
Nothing wrong with copies IMO but you've gotta do something unique with it. These look exactly like a Blackmachine to me, with the mild difference of the deeper chamfer carve that looks like a Kiesel copy (which was already BM influenced).
At least with the Ormsby line, he did the fruity colors and weird lumber combos, along with changing it up with the single cut. At this point, most outlines are going to be derivative, so at least try to do SOMETHING different with it.
But it was THIIIN
No problem here then? Not a copy, move along folks
Why stop at BM when you could have Majones clones, Legator clones, etc... haha i kid i kid. Courtesy of that new Ebay custom shop...
You guys are kidding yourselves with the "just an RG". The most inventive design ever? No. But it brought together a bunch of design cues into an brand aesthetic. You think we'd ever be saying "hypemachine-style" or whatever-this-thing-is-style. Ebony top, ivoroid binding, that headstock, that style of runner, that style of hs join, that bolt joint/heel, that control cover that sticks out stupidly from the back, that logo plate, that bevel style, that way of doing bevels with binding. In the metal genre here we know those things purely because of blackmachine.
It doesn't take a massive amount of honesty to accept that Doug didn't just take an RG and repackage it as quickly as possible, which is more than I can say for the countless number of people attempting to follow in his footsteps.
Why doesn't Black Machine still make guitars?
Doug never really stops, more takes long breaks. He built a bunch of B2s a few years ago and started building a lot more recently when he brought out a headless model. You can see the new model on the BM site. Most guys don't upload pics of their new BMs but you can find them every know and then being flipped on reverb.
So I guess he just takes minimal orders as he can handle them and such. Obviously there's more demand than he can handle. It looks like all his stuff his really high quality and hard to get specific pieces of wood. I can understand that and also understand not wanting to get into a cheaper or less quality model to meet numbers too. It's basically inevitable that clones will pop up with a similar design because the market is there for it. It's ultimately up to the manufacturer or right holder to uphold their ideas and defend them in court, which is unfortunate because that is a full time job and a huge expense. I think ultimately everyone knows there's a big difference in the guitars and that reflects in the quality and price etc. What eventually happens though it just like Fender and Gibson, eventually there will be clones of much higher quality than the original at a better overall price too. This is the free market and how the current state of affairs is though. It's good for the consumer in that regard, but ultimately a little immoral/unethincal regarding certain things regarding certain aspects of the design.
The thing is, IMO from a novice woodworker perspective, the design itself of the blackmachine guitars lend themself to easy replication. I would say next to a telecaster, the blackmachine seems like the next easiest guitar body to replicate.
I don't think the raw body shape is the appeal.
It's the small touches like the binding, the metal plate, that headstock, the one piece bodies/tops.
Again, it's far from complex in the same way something like a true hollowbody, but it's definitely something with its own vibe.
Some current planned design specs:
Flamed maple top
Bolt-on Maple / Wenge Neck
24 SS Frets
You'd think so but the Sabre and Skervesen(early build) BM clones I owned were some of the worst built guitars I've ever come across. For a relatively easy design most guys who jumped on the demand for clones couldn't build them and went out of business as a result.
Yeah he's never wanted to take more than a few orders and even then he gets overwhelmed. He's always been hesitant to take more than a few orders and ends up canceling some or people get fed up and get a refund. He was all set to go the CnC route and turn BM into a much bigger operation but for a bunch of reasons he didn't go through with it.
The demand a few years ago was enormous so it's no wonder people got in on it. So many small builders have Doug to thank for making customs so popular. He really doesn't get enough praise for that in the guitar world but at least the builders themselves know and are super grateful. Since people couldn't get the real thing they just pursued other options like Siggery, Mercer, Ormsby, Blackwater, Sabre, Skervesen etc. For most it was the look and not the "unicorn dust" factor.
I've no real problem with clones or variations(I've owned a bunch and even my Ibanez is BM inspired) as long as the builder doesn't claim its their design which quite a few have tried to do or mass market it. Once Ormsby took the hypemachine to production all rules were off. Its no wonder Aliexpress has Mayones, Strandberg, BM and even the Tosin model for sale.
Yeah, Doug started with a Soloist.
I guess I lack the context of some others here, because I am still not understanding at all what makes these BlackMachine guitars so very different from the nine thousand and one other super strat designs out there. And I definitely don't understand in what way GA is somehow intruding on something that isn't theirs.
Well technically didn't he start from a telecaster? But yes, we're all glad he eventually decided the soloist was a better point of departure.
and jesus wept because a blackmachine x wirebird would have been the greatest thing in history.
Combining the two shops with the lowest output...
Clearly they wouldn't build them.
just the first one. for other people to copy.
Who's making Wirebird copies. Gimme one