good ole pickups don't do it for me in a new guitar - is it really the wood? or, what else can be done

[Tuned]

Wait, so what part of the pickup swap does the not-electronics guy do?!



If you need help/advice, I think this site is a great resource, but maybe first, we'd have to identify the question or problem in terms that can be addressed as directly as possible.

If you want just more brightness in your tone, there is a list of possible mods. But maybe the JP pickups are part of the reason you can't get there... If the issue is that you want guitar A to sound identical to guitar B, then I think it might be a bottomless errand, especially if you have any nostalgia for the EBMM. In that case, just get the EBMM back (or get another one) and hope that it sounds the same as you remember.

To make your tone brighter: set the tone knob to 10, pick closer to the bridge, use newer strings, adjust the highs and/or presence on your amp/sim upward. If that doesn't get you where you need to be, bypass your tone knob, replace your saddles with brighter-sounding ones, try a different pick, use thinner gauges or brighter branded strings, use a brighter amp/sim. If that still isn't enough, replace your pickups with Dimarzio EVO7's, replace your bridge with something brighter, try the Cool Picks Carbon Fiber Resin pick, get some GHS Boomer 0.008" strings, add an EQ, and deck your guitar out with stainless steel. If that still doesn't work, throw the guitar away, get a piece of slate chalkboard and some steel fingerpicks and just rake them across the surface of the slate. If that's still not bright enough, what I'd suggest next isn't going to be safe and involves staring directly into the sun.

No, the non-electronics guy doesn't do electronics at all. He just refuses to, I don't even know why , maybe just because of what kind of person he is. You know, the boring meticulous type who only does what he does really well. Other than that, he is great. Builds cool guitars (attached see a few of his), does the servicing and repairs (wood and other... mechanical (?) stuff), so I always think of him as the guitar tech rather than the other guy, the soldering dude.
As a matter of fact I've been thinking to buy my old EBMM JP7 back. The main reason I sold it was the EBMM Modern Trem that I couldn't get along with. I eventually decided not to mod it for an OFR and to sell it as is and seek for another guitar, and later regretted that decision, especially after the prices for the EBMM JP have doubled since. The JP16 is not an option for a few reasons.
Thank you for your input, it was very helpful. I will definitely try some and think about others that I always considered as no-go for me.
I think I'll start form staring into the sun

 

[cindarkness]

I read the whole thing and still don't know what this thread is about

Agreed.
I've acquired more than a couple of handfuls of guitars. Different sizes, shapes and features and I've come to a conclusion:

Yes, they all sound different, some differences in sound stand out more than others.
No, I really do not know why, I can only assume though - but I might be wrong.

In conclusion, I believe that guitars are some mystical creatures that I will never fully understand. And that's why the ideal amount of guitars for me is always N+1.

 

[Tuned]

after 30+ guitars and basses , my understanding at this point is that the guitar sound is a result of interaction of all its parts and cord until the first buffer. However , there are parts that contribute niticeably more than some others.

 

[odibrom]

after 30+ guitars and basses , my understanding at this point is that the guitar sound is a result of interaction of all its parts and cord until the first buffer. However , there are parts that contribute niticeably more than some others.

... like the player's hands?

 

[Tuned]

not in the sense of your plugging your hands into an amp, but...

 

[InfernalVortex]

I have a guitar that just has a sort of lazy string attack to it. It otherwise sounds great, but it just doesn’t seem react as quickly as some of my others. It’s one of the only guitars I have that I didn’t really like the EMG 81 in. It still has that sort of lazy bloom to it, but it took all the thiccness out of the tone which is what it did well. But you can hear this acoustically unplugged too. The guitar just had that sound.

Anyway it’s got a Jim Root Daemonum set in it now. It’s a good fit. Has a really a big sound now but with the EMG attack I like so much.

 

[Neon_Knight_]

Only skimmed some of the posts, so I may have missed something. However, it seems the OP was expecting two guitars to sound the same simply because they have the same pickups. That's simply not going to be the case. Others have suggested potential solutions. If I lived in the US, my default approach would have been to make use of the DiMarzio return policy to swap the relatively dark (IMO) JP pickup set for something brighter (e.g. Evos or D Activators).

 

[Tuned]

I have a guitar that just has a sort of lazy string attack to it. It otherwise sounds great, but it just doesn’t seem react as quickly as some of my others. It’s one of the only guitars I have that I didn’t really like the EMG 81 in. It still has that sort of lazy bloom to it, but it took all the thiccness out of the tone which is what it did well. But you can hear this acoustically unplugged too. The guitar just had that sound.

Anyway it’s got a Jim Root Daemonum set in it now. It’s a good fit. Has a really a big sound now but with the EMG attack I like so much.

sounds pretty much like my case, so I was thinking what I could change internally to manage that to some extent

 

[Tuned]

Only skimmed some of the posts, so I may have missed something. However, it seems the OP was expecting two guitars to sound the same simply because they have the same pickups. That's simply not going to be the case. Others have suggested potential solutions. If I lived in the US, my default approach would have been to make use of the DiMarzio return policy to swap the relatively dark (IMO) JP pickup set for something brighter (e.g. Evos or D Activators).

Not expecting the two to sound exactly the same, I am still bewildered by how large the extent or their difference is, same guitar construction and neck joint, same scale,same strings model and gauge (and while not quite the same lately, still almost the same ) , floating trems and sustain blocks made of the same materials, yes of different designs but I've never experienced this to cause that mush of a difference.

 

[Flappydoodle]

Yeah man, guitars sound different. End of that day, you can't stick a single coil in a Les Paul and make it sound like a Strat.

There are tons of variables. Some big ones including the distance from bridge string saddle to the bridge pickup. Some guitars have a smaller distance (brighter sound). Others are a little further (darker sound).

And sure, the neck construction, type of bridge, woods etc make some difference too.

End of the day, you need to find a pickup that works well in THAT guitar.

 

[ekulggats]

I *think I know what you're asking.

Yes the guitar itself and the way it resonates affects your end sound. Some just don't resonate well and/or have a limited frequency range. Rap on the guitar with your middle knuckle, if it gives you a relatively loud 'crack' that's a well resonating body, if it doesn't really move that's a bad one. Do that with guitars you know you like for reference.

If it's excessively warm, put a brighter pickup in it. If it's too midsy warm, put a duncan custom in it. If it's somehow too bassy, you could try an Omega. As others have said, make sure your strings are new, and make sure your action isn't excessively high because the added difficulty of fretting can give the illusion of it being unresponsive or dark sounding

I'm a luthier and have had the experience of buying 2-3 of the exact same model to get one I like the sound of, it's not unheard of but usually guitars are at least ok enough sounding

 

[Kosthrash]

Just for fun reference...

 

[KnightBrolaire]

Some pickups just don't work in some guitars dude. I've swapped a ton of pickups in the last couple of years, and just because they work in one guitar doesn't guarantee they'll work in another one. Case in point, I had a basswood RG and tried Dactivators, Titans and Evo2s in it. None of them worked in that particular guitar. Then I swapped a guitarfetish crunchyrail that I cannibalized from another guitar into it, and the guitar came to life. I moved the Titans into my other basswood guitar and it sounded way better too.
I had a Carvin dc600 made out of limba that sounded awful with the stock lithiums. I swapped in painkillers and immediately ripped them out for being painfully bright. I swapped the painkillers into a darker sounding PRS and they worked perfectly for that guitar. I swapped the PRS' holy diver bridge into the dc600 and it just suited that guitar so much better. It was dull in the PRS but felt balanced in the dc600.

I've played multiple versions of the PRS Holcomb SEs and they varied wildly in sound even with identical specs. Some were darker sounding, some were brighter, and some sat in the middle.

Wood is a highly variable material and it's damn near impossible to get the exact same results with pickup swaps. All you can do is figure out what you dislike about the current set, and then offset that with the eq/voicing of the new set.

The Dsonic is pretty much a leaner, brighter crunchlab. That might be a good option for you. Otherwise check out the illuminators.

 

[bigcupholder]

Sounds like someone realized that the wood and construction actually matters

 

[elkoki]

My question to you is does your trem have a brass block ? If it does , replace it for a regular block , and or try titanium inserts for your Floyd . Mostly people with no experience on this will say it’s bull shit , but it makes a difference. At one point on my main guitar I had a ton of brass on it , big brass fr block , brass claw , brass trem stopper and it sounded so bassy , almost lifeless. Removing the brass block removes some of the bass from the signal , and the titanium insert blocks honestly made the sound brighter. Don’t knock it till you tried it !

With certain guitars you reach a point where pickup swaps just don’t get you the results you want , sometimes it’s because the guitar sounds too thin or others times to lifeless , bassy , dull , I’ve been there with some guitars . In those cases it’s not a bad idea to try something to change the mass on the guitar like adding a brass block , or trying different saddles made of different materials for a hard tail . Those things do make a difference .

 

[Grindspine]

It would be halarious if with all this, he swapped his cable somewhere along the way and that was the change in high end response... (Did you change your cable to a longer or higher capacity cable?)

But yeah, all things being the same, two different guitars of similar build may sound similar, but depending on specific pieces of wood and construction, they will not necessarily sound like you expect. That is the great thing about Dimarzio, Duncan, EMG, Bareknuckle, Lace, Fender, Gibson, and all of the other pickup brands out there. You can swap pickups til you find one that works better in that specific guitar.

 

[Tuned]

Some pickups just don't work in some guitars dude. I've swapped a ton of pickups in the last couple of years, and just because they work in one guitar doesn't guarantee they'll work in another one. Case in point, I had a basswood RG and tried Dactivators, Titans and Evo2s in it. None of them worked in that particular guitar. Then I swapped a guitarfetish crunchyrail that I cannibalized from another guitar into it, and the guitar came to life. I moved the Titans into my other basswood guitar and it sounded way better too.
I had a Carvin dc600 made out of limba that sounded awful with the stock lithiums. I swapped in painkillers and immediately ripped them out for being painfully bright. I swapped the painkillers into a darker sounding PRS and they worked perfectly for that guitar. I swapped the PRS' holy diver bridge into the dc600 and it just suited that guitar so much better. It was dull in the PRS but felt balanced in the dc600.

I've played multiple versions of the PRS Holcomb SEs and they varied wildly in sound even with identical specs. Some were darker sounding, some were brighter, and some sat in the middle.

Wood is a highly variable material and it's damn near impossible to get the exact same results with pickup swaps. All you can do is figure out what you dislike about the current set, and then offset that with the eq/voicing of the new set.

The Dsonic is pretty much a leaner, brighter crunchlab. That might be a good option for you. Otherwise check out the illuminators.

yeah I'm leaning to 'they just don't work in this guitar' more and more, whatever the exact reason may be, it is something in the equasion that doesn't lead to the answer I'd like.

 

[Tuned]

Sounds like someone realized that the wood and construction actually matters

well, after I've checked all possible boxes there's not much left to point at, really

 

[Tuned]

My question to you is does your trem have a brass block ? If it does , replace it for a regular block , and or try titanium inserts for your Floyd . Mostly people with no experience on this will say it’s bull shit , but it makes a difference. At one point on my main guitar I had a ton of brass on it , big brass fr block , brass claw , brass trem stopper and it sounded so bassy , almost lifeless. Removing the brass block removes some of the bass from the signal , and the titanium insert blocks honestly made the sound brighter. Don’t knock it till you tried it !

With certain guitars you reach a point where pickup swaps just don’t get you the results you want , sometimes it’s because the guitar sounds too thin or others times to lifeless , bassy , dull , I’ve been there with some guitars . In those cases it’s not a bad idea to try something to change the mass on the guitar like adding a brass block , or trying different saddles made of different materials for a hard tail . Those things do make a difference .

yes, as a matter of fact mine has a brass block . Titanium is out of the question for me at this point, but I'll try a regular block, thank you

 

[elkoki]

yes, as a matter of fact mine has a brass block . Titanium is out of the question for me at this point, but I'll try a regular block, thank you

There are titanium insert blocks for the strings , like these https://reverb.com/item/51722936-fl...are&utm_campaign=listing&utm_content=51722936

In my experience they brighten up your sound a little bit