Gibson Les Pauls

Discussion in 'Standard Guitars' started by tehgriffmeister, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. Ryan-ZenGtr-

    Ryan-ZenGtr- SS.org Regular

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    Didn't Les Paul (himself) have this same problem?

    I seem to recall from an interview that when he first discovered a neighbour had a guitar, he and his friends sneaked in so they could take a look.
    When the owner discovered the kids had been messing with his guitar, he burnt it in the hearth so "...Those pesky kids can't steal my chords anymore!." Essentially destroying the only guitar in the neighbourhood.
    Go look it up though, my memory of this story is hazy at best.

    More guitar bigotry. :noplease:
     
  2. MatthewK

    MatthewK SS.org Regular

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    Fine, more Les Pauls for me! Don't let some snobby assholes ruin a classic guitar for you.
     
  3. Nile

    Nile Giver of the Likes

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    Am I weird for liking the roughed up, reliable, ak47 look I get from a BFG?
     
  4. -42-

    -42- Nothing to see here

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    Ignore this, doppelpost.
     
  5. -42-

    -42- Nothing to see here

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    Well, he was comparing American Standard Strats to Les Paul Standards. The Paul has a quilt/flame maple carve top, which costs a bit more in labor and materials, the set neck is also generally more time consuming to mount than a bolt on. A pickguard allows for the body to be front routed, as well as reduces the tolerances and finishing required for routing.

    I agree that the Les Paul Studios and American Standard Strats are comparable instruments, but that wasn't the point I was originally trying to make.
     
  6. jephjacques

    jephjacques BUTTS LOL

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    You don't know what you're talking about.

    Set necks are more expensive because they are vastly more difficult and time consuming to build than bolt-ons. Even with modern CNC machinery there still needs to be a ton of hand-fitting to make sure the guitar is put together properly. Gibson still does a lot of stuff the old fashioned way in this regard.

    Using a pickguard makes for a cheaper guitar because the routing work to install the pickups and electronics is much, much simpler when done under a pickguard. It's quite a bit more time consuming to do "rear routed" electronics like on a LP.

    The reason LP Studios are so much cheaper than Standards is, indeed, related to cosmetic issues. The binding, fretboard inlays, fancy maple tops, fancy finishes, and different pickups all combine to make a LP Standard much more time consuming (therefore expensive) to produce than a Studio. Do standards command a premium over and beyond their actual value? I'm sure they do. But a Studio and a Standard are not "the same guitar."

    The simple fact is Fender guitars are much simpler to mass-produce than Les Pauls, which is why they tend to be less expensive. Both guitars do what they were designed to do very well, and neither is intrinsically "better" than the other.
     
  7. budda

    budda Do not criticize as this Contributor

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    Please show me using statistical data that set necks are more expensive to build then bolt-ons. Thanks. Also, most les pauls ship with pickguards ;)
     
  8. Grand Moff Tim

    Grand Moff Tim Some call me... Tim

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    A pickguard that after being removed still leaves a fully functioning guitar with no big weird routes all over the place. Their point about the pickguard on the strat was that the routing doesn't need to be as precise since the pickguard is just going to cover it up anyway, whereas the pickguard on an LP is mostly cosmetic.

    Having said that, LPs do use pickup rings, which can cover up non-snug routes just as well as a pickguard does. They're all CNCd anyways, and I kinda doubt it's any more time consuming or expensive to have a CNC route for an HH rear-route LP rather than an SSS top-route strat.
     
  9. rty13ibz98

    rty13ibz98 SS.org Regular

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    i have an edwards LP, john sykes model that i swapped the duncan distortions to 59/jb and it is spectacular. i bought it just for studio work and i never play it live. the meatiness of the guitar is legendary. i find that most of the more recent usa gibsons have quality inconsistencies and the "weight relieved" pauls lack the low end and girth of the notes with more snarly high mids than the traditional LP sound. i have had the pleasure of playing some early 70s-mid 80s LP and those were awesome sounding guitars, not the best for playing all night, but the notes were like sledgehammers and those are the type that i get out of the edwards. i also have an ltd ec-400 that has the ewards distortions and it has way more mids and less of the bottom. it sounds like the more modern pauls at way less than a gibson.
    for me, it comes down to value: if i can't justify the $2000+ price, i will try to hunt down an excellent alternative.

    rich
     
  10. jam3v

    jam3v wat

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    Source?

    Source?

    I'd wager that the manufacturing process is so efficient at this point that routing wires through a rear-routed guitar literally takes seconds. In fact, I can think right of a way right off the top of my head that makes it really quick and simple, so i'm assuming it's relatively trivial for the experienced manufacturer. I'd also bet that all the additional hardware that goes into a pickguard setup is more expensive than the few seconds of manual labor it will take to wire a rear-routed guitar.

    I don't think you or anyone has proven which one was is cheaper to produce.
     
  11. jam3v

    jam3v wat

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    My point in comparing the Fender and Studio was to disprove your assertions that neck-joint, lack of pickguard, and mahogany made the guitar "fundamentally [more expensive] to produce" since those qualities are universal to Les Pauls.

    Now you're making different assertions.
     
  12. cajunboy2k

    cajunboy2k SS.org Regular

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    I think guitars are highly personable. What works well for one personnel, ay not work for another. I've owned 2 les Paul's, and could not bond with either. I like the body shape, but not the weight. I couldn't get a tone I liked out of them either. I finally bit the bullet and ordered a Carvin CS6. For me, I haven't played a better guitar than it. So, tell your friend to take off his blinders. As for companies who make copies of other guitars, more power to them. The world needs competing brands at all price points.
     
  13. xxx128

    xxx128 -108 point(s) total

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    I love gibson's for their tone. My best sounding guitar is...tada, a gibson. Hands down. They are decent players too.

    i HATE them for the horrid quality. Some recent gibsons cant even compare to a 200$ Made in China guitar in terms of craftsmanship. And its a bit sad because gibson has been building guitars for the past 3 million years!
    So yeah they fucking suck but they are awesome, lol.
     
  14. goldsteinat0r

    goldsteinat0r Zib Zob Zabbity

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    I have a Les Paul Studio (my particular model happens to be the least expensive USA model Gibson offers - $799 new with a gig bag) and the QC on it was pretty flawless. It sounds fantastic and plays beautifully. Nothing like it.

    I have 5 guitars and its consistently my #1. Its very recent too, I think a 2011. The fretwork, the nut slots, everything was great right off the shelf, especially for the price. Also it takes quite the beating for shows and such (as long as it doesn't fall over :lol:).

    Not saying that its OMG THE BEST GUITAR IN TEH WORLD but I don't really understand why a lot of modern heavy musicians dislike LPs so much. They have one of the meatiest, most distinctive tones available and they're very durable from a "normal use" standpoint.
     
  15. Murmel

    Murmel SS.org Regular

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    Recently got a higher end Epi Les Paul for like $280 from a friend. Hadn't it said Epiphone on the headstock I would never had thought it was one.

    And it sounds so fucking massive, gotta love that LP tone. Nothing quite like ripping away on Welcome to the Jungle and pretending you're Slash :lol:
     
  16. Andromalia

    Andromalia Pardon my french

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    Well, looks and finish are one important part of the cost of a guitar. The only gibson I own is a goldtop studio with a maple cap and 498T pickup. I paid 800€ for it. Would I pay 1K5€ more to get an ebony board (or whatever they use since the protected wood debacle) and binding ? No. On the other hand I have paid more than 1K€ above the price of a guitar just for cosmetics, design and paint.

    In my opinion, CNC is better than human work, if only for consistency. CNCing a Studio body isn't more expensive than CNCing a LPC's body.
    The value of the artist's hand comes where it is original work, imho, or small series that make CNC too expensive as the machine won't pay for itself with too few orders. Nobfody spits on CNCed PRSes that I know of.

    In the end it's all about what you value, I wouldn't pay for a LPC that is, to me, too expensive for what it offers, while other people would scoff at me paying for some custom paint job.

    Also note that out of Les Pauls, explorers and Vs are some serious guitar for the money.
     
  17. jam3v

    jam3v wat

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    I'd agree that a lot of Les Pauls are overpriced, but you can get a nice Studio that looks, plays and sounds great for like $1,200 brand new. That's a pretty good price for an American made guitar with good pickups.

    Your comparison against your LTD, Agile, and Schecter is strange to me. They're all totally different guitars. What are your metrics for comparison?
     
  18. HeHasTheJazzHands

    HeHasTheJazzHands greg rulz ok

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    They're trying to appeal to Les Paul players?
     
  19. zappatton2

    zappatton2 SS.org Regular

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    I've got a studio LP that is not only one of the best guitars I've ever owned, but also one of the best I've ever played. That said, I've also owned a couple of Gibsons that were so flawed in the QC department that it really soured my opinion of Gibson, despite my LP. Always best to sit with a Gibson in the store, play it a while and take full note of everything, because it really is luck of the draw, could be the greatest guitar you ever owned, or a total dud.
     
  20. Ryan-ZenGtr-

    Ryan-ZenGtr- SS.org Regular

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    Lately I've been striving against the use of generalisations. Possibly, I could claim that the Les Paul over there on the stand is "teh bestest Les'er eva!", but to say all Les Paul's are better than other designs would be a clear display of bigotry which might take years of personal character development to surpass.

    @OP
    Has your friend recovered from his unconventional beliefs yet? :D
     

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