George Floyd...

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by BlackSG91, May 28, 2020.

  1. USMarine75

    USMarine75 The man who is tired of the anus is tired of life Contributor

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  2. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    Lot's of guitar porn there!
     
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  3. spudmunkey

    spudmunkey SS.org Regular

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    The best communities/forums I've been a part of over the years have all been havilly moderated. The discourse on relevant topics was so much more pleasant when nobody knew who were racists homophobes, etc.
     
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  4. GoldDragon

    GoldDragon SS.org Regular

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    Here is what I was going to say last night before I feel asleep.

    First off, I have a 4.96 rating driving majority black people and thousands of rides under my belt.

    I have never kicked out black passengers, but I have kicked out white passengers. This is because of rudeness, breaking rules, hostile conversation, hiding drinks, or not listening to me. Or saying racist things.

    Out of several thousand rides, I only had one "racist" group I had to kick out. They thought they were being clever and saying "veiled" racist things. They probably thought it was okay because I'm white, but they were also saying "veiled" things about people in general and they were entitled assholes, so I kicked them out. Three entitled rich girls and one guy. Law students.

    So I've learned driving that there are generally three classes of people: white collar/executive, working class, and not-working.

    Both whites and blacks have people in all the categories, but there are many fewer white collar blacks, and many more non-working blacks. (People that live in section 8, single moms who receive assistance to take care of their kids, etc.) I'm not casting judgement on these people.

    The people in the "not working" category, usually have drug problems (more whites than blacks) or mental health issues, or both. Sometimes section 8, sometimes homeless. There are quite a few whites I have taken to methadone clinics or halfway houses. I have also driven a couple black drug dealers (I actually put them in the "working" category, they are operating at a higher level of intelligence and motivation, and usually just keep to themselves. Same thing is true of working girls.)

    That said, my *least* favorite people come from the executive/white collar group of people, more specifically the women. (Wives of rich men, or who they think are rich, maybe had a secondary career or rich parents.) We are calling these women "Karens" now.

    They absolutely have no filters, say disparaging things about people they know (while thinking they are veiled enough and they are clever enough that you can't tell), and just carry a negative vibe. 10/10 entitlement. The conversations are grating, self serving, braggy, etc and I don't like listening to them. Their husbands always pretend to be a big shot. Sometimes the men will call up a coworker to practice their B-talk, but you can tell its always a waste of bandwidth call; the person on the other end is usually a subordinate. The call was made so that I know they are a "manager".

    When they are going out as a couple, they pretend to be the "lord and lady of the manor". Appear to have zero personality or connection with each other. Unlike black couples who always seem to have rapport and vibe.

    The thing is that as a driver, the most important thing is your bottom line and you will do anything to get tips which is a large part of your earnings. What I've noticed is that with the white collar people, they have a belief that they are better than you. (They don't realize that I have a white collar career, work with people exactly like them.)

    I try not to talk about my career because it brings too many questions and they know that their illusion of superiority is broken. You can't break that illusion, if you want any chance of a tip. They have to believe that you are "just a driver". You have to "bow and scrape" and not push back at their fake air of superiority.

    IOW, these white people are douchebags and assholes.

    That said, I can imagine if black people met these white professionals and were treated the same way they treat me, they would think they were racist. They may actually be racist, but they treat white people "beneath their level" poorly as well. So I think there would be a tendency for black people to label them as racist when they are actually classist. Honestly, these people work 60+ hours a week, don't have much social grace, and don't have the time to be anything but grubby materialists.

    Wealthy people seem to live in a bubble of self deception, to somehow justify their good fortune, or perhaps they are engaged in a constant struggle to keep up with their peers and maintain the air of superiority (Dunning Kreuger effect.)

    This phenomenon is both conservative and liberal groups. I have gotten this vibe from every ivy league professional I've driven, even ones who are flagrantly liberal. (Its interesting when someone is Harvard or Yale that they always have to insert that into the conversation.) They may be liberal and "for" black people, but they also believe they are "above" black people.

    Anyway, now to the poor people. Again, as a driver its all about the bottom line. I have had a couple black people who didn't get their way claim I'm racist, but its all about the bottom line.

    As an example, one trip in particular happened back in March before the shutdown. I had a hotel pickup queued up (usually lucrative trips to airport), but then another pickup came in on Lyft that was close by. I had just enough time to stack a low profit trip with the hotel pickup, so I accepted. According to the app, it was just a 3 min trip.

    I arrive at the strip mall and there is a black woman at the dollar store with TWO full shopping carts of merchandise. Based on the location and length of the trip, I knew she was going in the wrong direction to section 8 area. So I keep rolling and I cancel the trip. Loading up and unloading a car adds alot of time, and it means I'd probably lose the hotel pickup.

    Additionally, it is known in rideshare that black people never tip. I realize its because they don't have much money, but they expect extras like loading/unloading. NFW is 20 minutes of my time worth 3.50. Anyway...

    Then she starts texting me, calling me a "racist mf" along with alot of other bad things. This is business so I just ignore and move on. What she doesn't know is that I ditch unprofitable trips from white people all the time, when something better comes on the other app. Not racist, just unable to take a trip that would screw my earnings. We are ICs and don't have to take any trip we don't want.

    So I think there is evidence that there are shitty white people who think they are better than other people. And there are situations that black people might misinterpret as racism.


    Hands down, the best passengers are working class people, just trying to get to a job, or maybe youngish people (mostly black) who dont have a car and are going shopping or to the doctor.

    This may sound crazy, but having driven thousands of people, I would say that the happiest people seem to be black people. They laugh, joke, make banter, or at the very least will just keep to themselves. White people always seem to be chewing on something in the back of their mind and try to exert their superiority.

    The absolute unhappiest people I have driven are police officers. I have had two lengthy trips with cops that ended up feeling like counselling sessions. One cop was having marital difficulties and it was obvious that the stress of his job and his tough guy persona that he needed for his job, was taking a toll on his family.

    The other cop had a knee injury and couldn't pass physical and was being rolled out of the force before his expected retirement. (He was looking for a security job in the meantime before he could pull his pension.) He had a partner killed several years back and it seemed like he was on the edge of tears at one point just having another person listen to him and empathize. Then it dawned on me that MOST police officers have had someone they personally know killed in the line of duty. Tough job. Tough life.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
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  5. SnowfaLL

    SnowfaLL SS.org Regular

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    Wow..
     
  6. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    Hey, It worked for the book of Revelation and would make a good movie too.
     
  7. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I get that this might make me sound a bit like an asshole when put up against what I'm sure you intended to be a very sincere point, but that's a whoooooooooole lot of generalizing. For all the comments about "they don't mean to be racist, they just don't understand", I hate to say that your examples sort of fit that description. I don't think you're racist, in the sense that you hold any malice towards anyone. But you really do generalize a lot, which is sort of..... adjacent to prejudice? It very well may be that in your slice of the world, in your profession, in your own experience, things tend to line up that way, but there's soooooooo much more going on outside of that slice.

    Like take the story about the lady with the two shopping carts - if you knew the route ahead of time, and only cancelled after you saw the person, it's suuuuuuuuuper easy to read that as prejudice. Nobody can know your real intent, but with the information available to them, I imagine you can see why it looks bad. You made a visual assessment, a generalization, a lot of assumption, and acted on that instead of just following through with what you had agreed to do. Honestly, if they expected you, and even saw you, and you bailed after the fact, even putting the race thing aside, that's kind of a dick move.

    I understand your thought process, and I'm not faulting you specifically for that, but remember that the people around you can only see what you do, not the thought process that led to it. It's the whole "actions speak louder" thing. And being willing to bend a little bit to help someone out at your own expense isn't the worst thing in the world.
     
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  8. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Realistically, normally things do get moderated around here pretty well, from what I've seen. Lots of threads get shut down when things get out of hand. Recent months have been kind of an exception to the norm - but that's kinda the case with everything right now.
     
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  9. GoldDragon

    GoldDragon SS.org Regular

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    You didn't read my post.

    I never said anywhere that someone "didn't mean to be racist".

    If that is the premise of your whole response,, I didn't read it. (And I didn't).

    I relayed a personal experience dealing with large numbers of people of all races in a fairly intimate setting, experience you probably dont have. And as a result I'm told "I probably don't mean to be racist."

    Go fuck yourself.

    This forum is filled with liberals looking for a boogeyman. Not worth my time anymore.
     
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  10. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    - That makes a lot of sense.
    - What the internet needs is a bicker filter.
    - Being a mod would be a hassel. If I was a mod nobody would ever get banned. I'm ok with people talking about literally everything. I think I'm really calloused and it's all just blase' to me at this point. I understand and sometimes forget this is new to some people still. I can't expect people to be able to seperate themselves into an omniscient or 3rd person thought process.

    - I think the mods do a good job around here too. Three cheers for the sso mods! :mike:
     
  11. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    Don't let the door hit you in the ass.
     
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  12. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    So Minneapolis says is going to dismantle the police department. Wonder what they'll do.
     
  13. jaxadam

    jaxadam SS.org Regular

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  14. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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  15. narad

    narad Progressive metal and politics

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    A hero, really.
     
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  16. zappatton2

    zappatton2 SS.org Regular

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    Last Week Tonight had a really great episode on this Sunday, I'd recommend checking it out. The premise isn't to make police non-existent; it's to dramatically divert funds from an overburdened and ineffective public service to far more effective ones when it comes to evidence-based crime reduction, and trim and train what remains to only respond to situations it needs to deal with, in a professional manner, within the scope of the public interest (all the public, not just the white ones).
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
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  17. Strobe

    Strobe SS.org Regular

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    Yep. TLDR version is, police deal with a lot of stuff. Mental health issues. Drug issues. Homelessness. Lots of things in addition to actual crimes that would be more effectively dealt with by a different kind of professional. You could divert money away from policing and more effectively (not to mention cost effectively) deal with a lot of these problems by addressing root causes, or with people trained in mental health, social workers, etc. From there, you could build a police department up - it would have less non-crime things to deal with (and likely less crime too). When you built it up, it would be smaller, and hopefully better designed with better accountability.

    I live right next door and I am in the city a lot (or was until pandemic). I wish St. Paul would consider a similar strategy. This is one of those things that sounds crazy at first, but when you go just a little bit deeper, it sounds crazy not to do it.
     
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  18. Randy

    Randy Full on Friendship!™ Super Moderator

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    Mods on this forum no longer have the ability to ban unless it's spam or a flagged IP. We can do other editing type stuff but banning has to be sent to the administrator based on reports filed by members, and he gets to them when he gets to them, and he's not active on here either, so he goes off of what's in the report and past history.

    That might sound great but it's been worse for this place and worse for membership and discussion. Things stayed more on topic because a mod could do, say, a month or a week or even a one day ban if someone was totally off the rails, and they'd have the chance to come back and rethink their decorum without necessarily having to change their positions.

    NOW, most bans are permanent because he admin doesn't have time to come in and police threads day by day or hour by hour, so it's all or nothing. Likewise, you get trouble members who have no interest in discussion and just literally fire bombing threads, and it devolves into days and days of name calling instead of discussion. That's what your type of "free discussion" yields, and it sucks.
     
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  19. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I certainly did.

    I didn't say that you did. That phrasing has been used in this thread. I didn't mean to specifically attribute it to you. That's my bad.

    It was not. You should have read my whole post. I didn't call you racist. I said that optics matter, and I can understand why someone might call you racist even if what motivates your actions aren't racially driven.

    Likewise, I guess? Maybe I'm being a bit harsh/critical, but sometimes the truth is harsh. People generalize. It happens. I do it too. There's value in introspection and being able to take criticism. I'm sure I've also done things that came across as racist, despite the fact that I wouldn't call myself a racist (most people wouldn't call themselves racist if you asked them). That's sort of what my point is - there's danger is generalizing, and most people care more about actions than intentions in the moment. A lot of what gets called racism after-the-fact is absolutely not intended in the moment, but our generalizations allow it to happen. That's how something becomes "systemic" or just "part of the culture". It's rare that someone sat down and went "you know what, I don't like black people, so I'm going to be a dick to them". But we do little things subconsciously. If I do it too (and I'm sure I do occasionally), you have every right to call me on it.

    Trust me, I'm not as liberal as you think I am.
     
  20. c7spheres

    c7spheres GuitArtist

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    Oh yeah, I forgot about that show. I'll check it out. Sounds good.

    These ideas sound alot better. To have the proper professional for the job. I always thought it would be better to not lock up people for non violent drug crimes and do treatment and stuff like that more. Sounds like stuff might actually be on the way for better policing. Maybe they'll come up with a model that works well and othes can adjust accordingly too. Good news.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020

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