EBMM Abasi Kaizen

The Blue Ghost

Direct Mount Pickup Enjoyer
Joined
Dec 17, 2020
Messages
82
Reaction score
117
Seen some RG7620s going for close to 1500-2000 recently. Reverb is a cesspool
It's insane to me that reverb is like this now since I've gotten two of my forever guitars by scouring through that damn site for weeks years ago and then striking a good deal when I found them. Now you only either see music shops selling at full retail value or people claiming "X-factor of this totally not used instrument isn't for me so I'll list it for market price or more expensive since I'm just not playing it enough nowadays". Reverb is becoming the Airbnb of music gear sites.
 

Thaeon

Probably diddling an Oni
Joined
Aug 17, 2008
Messages
2,678
Reaction score
2,081
Location
San Antonio, TX
If I remember my materials science courses correctly in university, different crystalline structures of stainless steel have different magnetic properties. These crystalline structures can be modified by changing the temperature of the steel and quenching (annealing and tempering), and depending on the composition of the steel alloy used (Carbon percentage, as well as Nickel, Cobalt, Vanadium, etc.) the temperatures needed to achieve these changes are different. Changes in magnetic properties tend to be side effects of these processes; usually what they're trying to do is to modify the mechanical properties of the metal.

That's just the general info I remember off the top of my head. I'd need to dive back into the phase diagrams for different steel alloys.

Fascinating. I would think that consistency would be difficult to attain with heating and cooling. Which I guess is where they build in mfg tolerance. I’d also be interested in how much of a difference it actually makes since pickups themselves really don’t make much over a difference beyond output level, compression, and a range of clarity between types of pickup. The differences between one pickup and the next outside of that are mostly negligible anyway. I guess I just don’t see much of a point.

Played a Kaizen a few weeks ago. It was a nice guitar for sure.

Of course it is. It’s an EBMM. It’s rare that anything leaves that factory that isn’t good.
 

neurosis

SS.org Regular
Joined
Nov 23, 2010
Messages
1,540
Reaction score
383
Location
Virginia
It's insane to me that reverb is like this now since I've gotten two of my forever guitars by scouring through that damn site for weeks years ago and then striking a good deal when I found them. Now you only either see music shops selling at full retail value or people claiming "X-factor of this totally not used instrument isn't for me so I'll list it for market price or more expensive since I'm just not playing it enough nowadays". Reverb is becoming the Airbnb of music gear sites.
I have had really snarky buyers later last year and am just about fed up with the inpouring offers from shops on "new stuff" whenever I wishlist a similar thing "used". I can't say it's the same experience it used to be.
 

SalsaWood

I like metal.
Contributor
Joined
May 15, 2017
Messages
394
Reaction score
677
Location
NoVA
Not to push this further into the weeds, but the crazy thing to me is that with instruments sold "as is" Reverb offers literally no buyer protection (or at least they used to not, dunno now). I got really, really, really burned by sellers in the past and they basically told me tough shit. The last time I asked them why I would even use their service since most used guitars are sold "as is" with no buyer protection and they couldn't answer, so I disputed it through PayPal and thankfully reversed a sale that way. Haven't been back to do anything but check prices since, and it's not even good for that anymore. Ebay/FB marketplace/CL/Forums have more than enough guitars I want to buy anyways.
 
Last edited:

Hollowway

Extended Ranger
Joined
Dec 28, 2008
Messages
17,063
Reaction score
13,228
Location
California
Not to push this further into the weeds, but the crazy thing to me is that with instruments sold "as is" Reverb offers literally no buyer protection (or at least they used to not, dunno now). I got really, really, really burned by sellers in the past and they basically told me tough shit. The last time I asked them why I would even use their service since most used guitars are sold "as is" with no buyer protection and they couldn't answer, so I disputed it through PayPal and thankfully reversed a sale that way. Haven't been back to do anything but check prices since, and it's not even good for that anymore. Ebay/FB marketplace/CL/Forums have more than enough guitars I want to buy anyways.
Holy crap, I had no idea that was the case. I’ve started seeing those “as is” descriptions, and I was like, “duh, I know it’s not new.” But now I understand why people have that there. The problem is there are people who try to scam buyers, and people who try to scam sellers. I haven’t sold anything on reverb yet, because I’m scared. I HAVE had to do 2 disputes as a buyer, though. And, oddly, the best deals these days seem to be from actual stores selling used stuff, so that may be the way to go. Individual sellers of teen expect way too much for their gear, and then may be shady.
 

SalsaWood

I like metal.
Contributor
Joined
May 15, 2017
Messages
394
Reaction score
677
Location
NoVA
And, oddly, the best deals these days seem to be from actual stores selling used stuff, so that may be the way to go.

Yea, I forgot about this. GC and Sweetwater have an online used section akin to Reverb and there are some solid deals there pretty frequently. They'll just take it back if you're not happy with it, too- at least GC will and I'm assuming SW also will.
 

MetalDestroyer

Heaven's Football Bat
Joined
Sep 1, 2012
Messages
1,582
Reaction score
1,933
Location
San Diego
“As is” is supposed to mean “as described” not whatever condition no matter what. I’ve had to deal with reverb buyers trying to get partial refunds for dings/scratches with both dedicated pictures and a mention in the description. Most recently I sold a factory relic’ guitar and the buyer complained that it felt used. It truly is a shitshow out there
 

MaxOfMetal

Likes trem wankery.
Super Moderator
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
42,300
Reaction score
42,616
Location
Racine, WI
“As is” is supposed to mean “as described” not whatever condition no matter what. I’ve had to deal with reverb buyers trying to get partial refunds for dings/scratches with both dedicated pictures and a mention in the description. Most recently I sold a factory relic’ guitar and the buyer complained that it felt used. It truly is a shitshow out there

And folks wonder why people give up and just go to GC or MGR and take a hit.

I'd literally pay to not have to deal with some folks on 'Verb and CL. :lol:
 

Kyle Jordan

Ace of Knaves
Joined
May 25, 2008
Messages
1,643
Reaction score
2,099
Location
Karakura Town
And folks wonder why people give up and just go to GC or MGR and take a hit.

I'd literally pay to not have to deal with some folks on 'Verb and CL. :lol:

That’s exactly what I’m doing as I look at selling my Soloists. Rather get $1000-$1300 for them than deal with all of that bullshit.
 

narad

Progressive metal and politics
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Messages
14,221
Reaction score
24,837
Location
Tokyo
And folks wonder why people give up and just go to GC or MGR and take a hit.

I'd literally pay to not have to deal with some folks on 'Verb and CL. :lol:

You should see some of the messages my friend gets on Reverb. I have to paraphrase, but this guy basically bought a charvel from him in Japan, which is in pretty good shape but is an 80s guitar. Somewhere in shipping the tiniest of dings occurred around the trem cavity. The guy gets it and sends a photo and a message -- I'll try to recreate the tone if possible as that's really the key here:

So guitar arrived. Thank you again for the excellent packing. But somewhere along the line, this ding here happened. I don't know what to tell you, but it's kind of ruining the whole idea of the guitar for me, so I guess there are three options:

(1) I can ask Reverb to issue a refund. I know that can hurt seller's reputations and sometimes put holds on their funds, so for your sake I don't want to have to go down that road.

(2) You can compensate me for the damages. I don't know if I even really want to keep it at this point, but let me know a number I'll consider it.

(3) I do a chargeback with the credit card company. I've done it before and it's quick and easy on my end, but again, I don't want to hurt your business.

Let me know what works for you, thanks!


Man, I just about transformed into pure energy and sent myself through the internet just to kick this guy's ass. And this is international delivery to the US, so it's a tough spot for the seller.

But the funny thing is is that this guy later wanted to buy my Vandenberg, and heckled me from various accounts for weeks. I had no idea, I just was wondering why everyone messaging me had 0 feedback and would be unmessagable by the time I went to message back. So I wound up selling it over Facebook, and when I updated the listing to sold, the guy went ape shit threatening to ban my Reverb account for selling outside Reverb, and that there was still time to "do the right thing", and he was now ready to add another $500 back to my original asking price, etc. But I assumed he was going to try the same thing with me -- get the guitar, point out (or create) some tiny ding and then basically leverage several hundred dollars in hassle to get several hundred in refund.

Anyway, this was like weeks of drama in the close-knit JP guitar selling community previously. But yea, if I could pay not to deal with such people I would. I haven't found that option yet though :D
 

somethingsomething

SS.org Regular
Joined
Sep 23, 2021
Messages
292
Reaction score
542
“As is” is supposed to mean “as described” not whatever condition no matter what. I’ve had to deal with reverb buyers trying to get partial refunds for dings/scratches with both dedicated pictures and a mention in the description. Most recently I sold a factory relic’ guitar and the buyer complained that it felt used. It truly is a shitshow out there

Yeah, just to piggyback on this, there is no "as is" on Reverb. There's "as described in the listing." And there IS buyer protection if the guitar isn't as described. I list all my guitars this way because I'm not a music store. I'm a guy selling gear on the side and then buying more gear. Why would I have something ridiculous like a 30 day return policy?

Try returning a guitar you bought through Craigslist. Ask one of those dudes you meet in a parking lot what their return policy is.

Anything beyond "as described" on Reverb is the seller going above and beyond.
 

Sermo Lupi

SS.org Regular
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
1,044
Reaction score
936
Location
UK
You should see some of the messages my friend gets on Reverb. ... But yea, if I could pay not to deal with such people I would. I haven't found that option yet though :D

In both cases I feel it boils down to people having no shame anymore when it comes to trading gear. Yeah, there's always been flippers asking too much and buyers willing to do anything to save a buck, but it's gotten a lot more blatant than it used to be.

I wish folks would see the bigger picture that fair prices are good for everyone. Price inflation for the sake of it just boils down to having more money tied up in fewer things.
 

narad

Progressive metal and politics
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Messages
14,221
Reaction score
24,837
Location
Tokyo
In both cases I feel it boils down to people having no shame anymore when it comes to trading gear. Yeah, there's always been flippers asking too much and buyers willing to do anything to save a buck, but it's gotten a lot more blatant than it used to be.

I wish folks would see the bigger picture that fair prices are good for everyone. Price inflation for the sake of it just boils down to having more money tied up in fewer things.

Maybe there's something to say about that, but here it's really just buyers trying to scam the sellers using Reverb's protections and knowing the cost of "rolling back" the transaction for an international deal is huge.
 

unusual

EBMM Slave
Joined
Mar 20, 2023
Messages
17
Reaction score
28
Location
USA
I like the idea of the Kaizen, but I just don't understand the execution. It's an extreme departure from Abasi's line of guitars, everything he's used in the past, and the sound too. It's a great, ergonomic guitar with a lot of interesting design concepts, but at the end of the day, I compare it to a Majesty. It costs more, it has less features, and feel-wise, it's comparable, but not groundbreaking in any better way.

I might check it out in a 6-string, but from what I can see on how it sells, it's not selling well and if there is still a 6, they're not going to pump out in volume with these. Last I checked about a month ago, there were 48/75 Spectraflares still available. Now they don't even show how many are left, they just say how many are available, and that quantity hasn't changed in a while either. The first run of Majesty 8 sold out in what, like 6 hours?
 

somethingsomething

SS.org Regular
Joined
Sep 23, 2021
Messages
292
Reaction score
542
I like the idea of the Kaizen, but I just don't understand the execution. It's an extreme departure from Abasi's line of guitars, everything he's used in the past, and the sound too. It's a great, ergonomic guitar with a lot of interesting design concepts, but at the end of the day, I compare it to a Majesty. It costs more, it has less features, and feel-wise, it's comparable, but not groundbreaking in any better way.

I might check it out in a 6-string, but from what I can see on how it sells, it's not selling well and if there is still a 6, they're not going to pump out in volume with these. Last I checked about a month ago, there were 48/75 Spectraflares still available. Now they don't even show how many are left, they just say how many are available, and that quantity hasn't changed in a while either. The first run of Majesty 8 sold out in what, like 6 hours?

The Kaizen is a big ask. A weird looking 7-string with all sorts of proprietary hardware/electronics and a boring finish for $4000. It's cool that it exists, but the audience for this guitar has to be tiny. And Petrucci has way more reach than Tosin and his "this isn't a signature guitar" guitar.
 

unusual

EBMM Slave
Joined
Mar 20, 2023
Messages
17
Reaction score
28
Location
USA
The Kaizen is a big ask. A weird looking 7-string with all sorts of proprietary hardware/electronics and a boring finish for $4000. It's cool that it exists, but the audience for this guitar has to be tiny. And Petrucci has way more reach than Tosin and his "this isn't a signature guitar" guitar.
Right. The price is the biggest barrier and if you can have all the features of a Majesty for less money, why not do that instead? It's just a poor sales execution.

Tosin himself said that this exists in the spirit of abundance and creativity... at a time when abundance (or lack thereof) doesn't facilitate a $4000 guitar purchase. I just don't understand it. My EBMM dealer offered 20% off and I still couldn't justify it.
 

Sermo Lupi

SS.org Regular
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
1,044
Reaction score
936
Location
UK
Maybe there's something to say about that, but here it's really just buyers trying to scam the sellers using Reverb's protections and knowing the cost of "rolling back" the transaction for an international deal is huge.

That's what I mean, though. If you ever did that to someone, wouldn't you be embarrassed? I couldn't show my face again in a community like this one if I treated another member in the way you described. Stories like this on reverb are fairly common, however.

The practice of scamming is as old as time. The cultural acceptance of it being okay in certain contexts has changed a lot over recent years, though, in my opinion.
 

Musiscience

SS.org Regular
Joined
Jan 29, 2013
Messages
2,044
Reaction score
2,288
Location
Montreal, QC
And folks wonder why people give up and just go to GC or MGR and take a hit.

I'd literally pay to not have to deal with some folks on 'Verb and CL. :lol:
This, so much! And the lower the value of the item, the worse it gets.

I have removed my lower priced items from classified ads last week after two bad experiences and making a donation to charity instead. That way someone in need is going to be really happy and I don't have to suffer through BS. Win win.
 
Top