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Discussion in 'General Music Discussion' started by anomynous, Feb 21, 2013.
This whole incident feels overly.... DRUMATIC
sorry for that
This is how I look at it too. KK has always been the biggest douche bag in metal. Which is saying a lot since, you know, Dave Mustaine. I could totally see him knowing the score and getting a bit more out of it and keeping the rest of the guys out of the loop.
And also, Slayer isn't Slayer without Dave. It just isn't the same at all. I mean, I listen to Grip Inc because Lombardo played drums for them, there is no other drummer out there that that I listen to albums to because they played on it.
90% of touring income goes towards expenses and management fees?!
Even the mighty Slayer has to succumb to the Money Machine.
Although I appreciate his candidness, I am a bit surprised that Dave is airing out the laundry so publicly.
Sounds like Dave is making trouble and gets the boot. Sounds like he deserved it.
Seriously he comes in with a 'new business model'? I'd love to have been a fly on the wall for that.
Nirvana used to make something like 6% on tour. Dunno why anyone thinks 10% is shocking or anything. Its not.
Where the money goes.....
^Very informative, thank you for that.
I am def not saying that bands don't deserve a MUCH MUCH Larger share of tour and record sale profits BUT this sums up the current state of play for probably all but the biggest grossing acts like The Stones or Madonna and so you have to say any touring musician who is left wondering where the money went needs to just sit back and have a think. Nothing comes for free.
Before I found that article I read one on the RIAA details of Major Label accounting practices..... Holy sh1t..... Fact that acts like 30 seconds to mars can sell 2 million albums and still be "in debt" to the record company?!!?
Edit: Add Link to RIAA Accounting article
Who knows what the situation really is, but Lombardo complains that their professional fees paid to management were being expensed. Professional fees are expenses, subtracted from income to arrive at whatever would be either gross profit or net income, depending on how you want to define profit/income. How else would you recognize professional fees from an accounting perspective?
Just coz I am bored worked it out that based on the RIAA model and assuming the band didn't owe the record company any advance money back........ you would have to shift over 40 MILLION records for you to become a millionaire based on your 2.34% of the money made on your record sales as a band member..... Yes... that really is in excess of 40 million world wide record sales to earn you $1,000,000...... before taxes.... And yet people take the p1ss that Prince and Trent Reznor have gone it alone.... 70% of 500,000 record sales is a lot more money that 13% of 10,000,000 sales
Bands that move that many units are not making their cash through record sales alone. Likely, they are also selling $40 tee, $60 hoodies, $100 hockey shirts, etc. Then there are the endorsements and song writing credits that come down the pike. If you sell 40 million units, you are more than just a millionaire...
Back In Black sold 22 million copies... you don't think the boys in Acca Dacca weren't set for more than life around that time?
I don't think Lombardo offered totally ridiculous "new business model", to be honest. I'm on Lombardo side for now, though I don't know all the things. This sounds quite weird for the men being in the band together even in '83 - to say things like "if you don't like something you're out". I personally really don't think that taking Lombardo out is good idea.
Granted and I know I am taking one set of figures to apply to all or most circumstances when every act will be different I am sure so I take you rpoint on the merch sales, but as the Rock n Roll blog stated and other bits I have read this afternoon, deals on the tour tickets, merchandise, share of the bar bill, venue etc etc all need to be done and I wouldn't imagine that every band out there is lucky enough to be even getting to keep 50% of the $40 t-shirt sale...? Obviously there are multi millionaire artists who have been set for life by one album but I guess my point was you do need to be shifting tens of millions of records or one the highest grossing tours of the year to be set for life if your a major label artist
Sorry to double post but just to sum up my opinion on this:
1) Musicians HAVE to be financially savy now or be prepared to pay out for a great accountant
2) Major Label deals aren't the holy grail any more, they are or can be for most acts a poison chalice..... And tbh you don't need major labels any more anyway not now if you are smart enough to use the Web for all its worth
You gotta remember that Kerry King has a lot of endorsement deals. As far as I know, he's on the payroll with/and has signature equipment with B.C. Rich, Marshall, Dunlop, EMG, and Kahler. He "may" be getting paychecks from those companies for using their equipment. Thus, not having money problems like Dave.
Also, Dave did not play for Slayer for 9 years (1992-2001). I'm sure he made good money with the bands he played with but probably not as much as he would if he was in Slayer.
Many people may not know this but Kerry did not want Dave back in the band when they needed someone to replace Paul Bostaph. Also, this is the third time Dave has been out of Slayer and the second time that involved money issues. Knowing this, it probably wasn't too difficult for Kerry to make his decision about Dave being out of Slayer.
My thoughts exactly.
My question is: as fans AND as musicians, why are we ok with this? Slayer is one of the biggest metal bands IN THE WORLD, if they can only make 10% for live gigs, what are other smaller bands getting? Also, I understand that the live shows may be advertisement for merch and endorsed equipment sales, but this isn't "unknown industry knowledge" anymore, as fans and musicians I ask again, why are we supporting this?
I'd quit my day job right now for 2.5% of "millions" of dollars. Even at just two million that's still $50k. That's not too bad for what they do.
Not saying they don't deserve more of the pie, but I doubt anyone is having trouble paying their cellphone bill in the Slayer camp.
He's actually in Anthrax currently filling in for Charlie Benatte during the Soundwave Australia shows... which incidentally enough also has Slayer on the bill.
Exaaaaaaaaaaaaactly. BUT the industry is getting wise, so are bands.
Kickstarter. Indiego. Spotify. Youtube. Bands are ditching archaic distribution models and becoming much more DIY.
The latest Protest The Hero kickstarter is a brilliant example of this.
Also let's be completely rational about this; imagine trying to introduce a new business model to a large business, one week before a 'project' (tour) That's madness. Lawyers, management, employees, family, 3rd party companies/contractors (transport companies, stage crew etc) there would be SO many people effected. It's no wonder the band probably had a 'it's not broken, don't fit it' attitude. Again, you don't get to their size without a keen business sense. Unless of course you're not involved in the difficult decisions from the ground up (which is sounds like Dave wasn't)
I dunno, I never take things like this at face value. They would not be haemorrhaging money as badly as Dave is making it out.