Anyone got any Mind Blowing Questions?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by joelozzy, Jul 13, 2010.

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  1. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    In an 'ideal' pendulum (no friction between the rope and the frame to which it is attached, and so on) the pendulum simply swings back and forth on its own and the planet rotates under it. The swinging is of course due to gravity, and a simple calculus exercise shows that for all the pendulum cares the Earth's gravitational pull is the same as that which would occur if the Earth were replaced by a point mass located at the center of the planet's gravitational field and with the same mass as the Earth (up to some small error since the planet isn't perfectly round, which is utterly insignificant as far as we - and the pendula - are concerned), so the pendulum essentially ignores the Earth's rotation. Gravitational pull from everything else is too small to bother caring about. Why would you jump to the conclusion that it's following something?

    Jeff
     
  2. silentrage

    silentrage The DeRailer

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    Because it's meaningless to say what a motion is without providing a frame of reference. The earth is orbiting the sun, the sun orbits the milky way, the milky way moves toward its neighbour galaxy, presumably on an elliptical or otherwise curved trajectory, but if the pendulum is ignoring all this multitudes of curved trajectories and always swings back and forth in the same fashion, it still is swing back and forth in reference to something, what is it swing in reference to?

    The closer an object you compare to the pendulum's motion, the larger the deviation will be between the two object's motion because that local object would be tied to the earth's rotation, or the solar system's.
    The amount of deviation starts to diminish the farther you go, a star at the opposite end of the galaxy would drift less from its initial relative position to the pendulum at the time we observe it, another galaxy far away would seem almost stationary compared to the pendulum, it would still drift from this initial relative position very slowly.

    If we take the farthest possible objects in the observable universe, a galaxy on the edge of the universe, it should always(almost) remain in a fixed relationship to the pendulum's motion.

    So it would seem, at least on the surface, that somehow the pendulum's motion is fixed relative to the farthest possible object from it. And why is that?

    Hope you get what I'm saying.
     
  3. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    That has nothing to do with links to distant masses. I see where the confusion is now, and it's not where you think it is.

    Jeff
     
  4. silentrage

    silentrage The DeRailer

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    I am, I'm just wondering what's the reference for its swinging motion then, it'd have to be something apart from the motion of the earth, the sun, and the galaxy. Is it fixed in some kind of absolute sense?
     
  5. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    I think we may have already touched on the problems with absolute reference frames. Where have you been reading about the Foucault pendulum?

    Jeff
     
  6. Encephalon5

    Encephalon5 Six String Bass Fish

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    Dogs have vocal cords. And brains that haven't evolved enough to have the mental capacity to learn a language as complex as any of the human languages.

    It isn't.

    Also, a person born deaf wouldn't have any internal voice as they would have no knowledge of spoken language. they would most likely think in pictures. or just the words themselves.
     
  7. vampiregenocide

    vampiregenocide SS.org Regular

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    Okay vocal chords advanced enough to speak words. And parrots can learn hundreds of words and phrases, dogs are just as intelligent theres no reason they couldn't at least learn some words. Might not be able to have a proper conversation but fuck it I want a talking dog.

    Not in the literal sense of going in a straight line forever and ever, but theres no 'edge' to space that has been discussed from anywhere I've seen. Its supposed to fold in over itself, or create some kind of looping form whereby you can never reach any edge.
     
  8. budda

    budda Do not criticize as this Contributor

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    How the fuck did someone create the numerical system, and how come people can use imaginary numbers in math?
     
  9. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    Many people contributed little bits to what we now see as the numerical system... that's something best taken to Wikipedia.

    As far as 'how come ... ?', I don't see what the objection is. How do we know that complex numbers give a sensible idea of 'things we can treat as numbers'? How do we define them? How do they gain real-world interpretations or simplify seemingly concrete, 'real' problems? The big issue will probably wind up being the name 'imaginary' itself - this name is unfortunate and a little bit nonsensical (anything more complicated than five is clearly the work of man, and I'm not so sure about two, three, or four), but it turns out that complex numbers are the 'right' numbers for things as concrete as mechanics and signal processing, as abstract as geometry, and as ridiculously overpowered as modern analysis.

    Jeff
     
  10. Rick

    Rick ALL HAIL DJOD Forum MVP

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    STOP FEEDING JEFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    :lol:
     
  11. ittoa666

    ittoa666 /)'3'(\

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    Can you dig it?
     
  12. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    Your grave? Three steps ahead of you.

    Jeff
     
  13. vampiregenocide

    vampiregenocide SS.org Regular

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    This. :rofl:
     
  14. Cadavuh

    Cadavuh Bounce The ....

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    Pierre grows up in France, and learns about a city called "Londres" (the same city which we call "London"). Pierre comes to believe that London is pretty, and would sincerely assent to the sentence, "Londres est jolie."

    Pierre then moves to an unattractive part of London, and learns English by picking it up from native speakers, without the help of translation. He does not know that the city he now lives in is the same city he calls "Londres". He comes to believe that the city he lives in, which he calls "London", is not pretty.

    If a normal speaker of English, upon reflection, sincerely assents to 'p', then he believes that p.

    If a sentence expresses a truth in one language, then a correct translation of it into any other language also expresses a truth (in that other language).

    "London is pretty" is a correct translation of "Londres est jolie."

    From these very plausible principles it seems to follow that Pierre both believes that London is pretty and believes that London is not pretty. This is a very counterintuitive result, though, since Pierre is not an irrational fellow, and no matter what his logical abilities he will not be able to figure out (as things now stand) that he holds contradictory beliefs.

    How can we make sense of this situation?
     
  15. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    The initial statement "Londres est jolie" is clearly in error if he finds a part of London that isn't pretty. This has nothing to do with translation and everything to do with poor generalizations.

    Jeff
     
  16. Cadavuh

    Cadavuh Bounce The ....

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    Well of course its erroneous on his part, the puzzle is about belief though.
     
  17. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    If by that you mean 'belief in generalizations taken so far that they become wrong', then yes. However, it has nothing whatsoever to do with a French boy, England, beauty, translation, or anything else but improper generalizations.

    Jeff
     
  18. pink freud

    pink freud SS.org Regular

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    To me, the puzzle is about ignorance. He does not simultaneously believe that London is and is not pretty. He believes London is pretty, and the city which he is in, which he believes to be not-London, is not pretty.

    You scenario has differing characteristics in the juxtaposition that makes the two beliefs not equal in comparison.
     
  19. Tomo009

    Tomo009 SS.org Regular

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    This is still the ask/state something and be made to look stupid by Jeff thread?
     
  20. JBroll

    JBroll Hard-On For Freedom™ Contributor

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    If you ask something stupid, it can be.

    Jeff
     

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