Abasi Concepts/Larada Megathread

Discussion in 'Extended Range Guitars' started by HeHasTheJazzHands, Nov 7, 2015.

  1. pfizer

    pfizer SS.org Regular

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    Shame you couldn't try the 6 string model; I'm curious to know how the neck on that feels. Although since Tosin was an Ibanez player, I'm thinking it's probably pretty close to that.

    Excited to see their headless models, although I imagine that the price is going to be pretty steep.
     
  2. jephjacques

    jephjacques BUTTS LOL

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    The neck on the 6 I played felt a lot like a Jackson Soloist. Thin but not Ibanez thin, slightly U shaped but nothing extreme. All in all very comfortable.
     
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  3. Takk

    Takk SS.org Regular

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  4. Takk

    Takk SS.org Regular

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  5. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

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    The guitars are perfect, that's merely swamp gas from a weather balloon that was trapped in a thermal pocket and reflected the light from Venus. :cool:
     
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  6. Avedas

    Avedas SS.org Regular

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  7. Fred the Shred

    Fred the Shred Shrederick

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    That last pic in particular hurts. What happened there? o_O
     
  8. Avedas

    Avedas SS.org Regular

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    Seems like something is happening with the glue or whatever after it leaves Frank's shop. I wonder if this shipment is not adjusting perfectly to the climate here or something related to that.
     
  9. JSanta

    JSanta SS.org Regular

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    Oof, that is not good. The last pic Takk posted looks almost like the glue isn't able to hold the neck in place. All around, it looks like it's not well built and/or a lack of attention to detail on such an expensive build.
     
  10. cwhitey2

    cwhitey2 BlackendCrust Metal™

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    Those flaws are completely unacceptable for a guitar in price range, hell my $1300 Ibanez was FLAWLESS. I would hate to see what these would look like if the price tag was cut in half :erk:
     
  11. Andrew Lloyd Webber

    Andrew Lloyd Webber Super Duper Moduraturr

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    Looks ready for NAMM.
     
  12. StevenC

    StevenC SS.org Regular

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    Headless tuners detailed in the latest email. Just generic bridge pieces similar to the Strandberg type.
     
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  13. Randy

    Randy Full on Friendship!™ Super Moderator

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    Not that anybody's waiting around for my take but here it is anyway :lol:

    Pics in the first post, some of them are 'nothing' some of them are 'something'. Yes, an immaculate guitar that looks like it was just birthed as a finished instrument would be nice but sans the damage in the last pic and maybe the first (unless it's a 'thumb grab' gap), none of what I'm seeing is especially unusual for a handbuilt, low build volume, one man shop. When the arrangement was original announced, what I'm seeing there is fairly inline with what I would've expected and personally, I wouldn't be greatly disappointed by a guitar if it showed up like that, within reason.

    Second pic is a different story and it kinda explains itself. It'd be foolish to try to make a structural claim about what's going on there (I already see some rumblings) but put simply, it's an ugly joint.

    The duality of the situation boils down to the fact the scrutiny of SSO essentially spares nobody and the fact Frank over sold the notion ALL previously pictured flaws were explainable and "how dare anybody question his abilities and QC".

    I've said before, the SSO pile-on brigade can be outrageous, climbing over eachother to scan pixels for fatal flaws in guitars and I've known luthiers that are well regarded around here that would say the same. Likewise, I cut Claas a lot of slack in his thread, despite similar or worse concerns over his fit and finish. But all that's in the context of having a bit of humility.

    In a perfect world, the first guitar would get spit out of the assembly line flawless 100% of the time or barring that, the builder can make 1000 prototypes that they can bandsaw for every imperfection until the first 'finished' one reaches anyone's hands. In the real world that doesn't happen and that's fine too. There's a lot of builders (KxK is one that comes to mind) that were still fine tuning the machining process and the builds themselves in the early days while they figured out what 'worked' and they still sold those builds as they went, but that's typically accompanied by either an early adopter discount or deliberately super-low volume output, to make sure the customers are understanding of the process and willing to go along. Eventually you figure out things like what woods are prone to chipping during what part of the milling process, or shaving a little off here or there from the g-code to get a better fit on the neck, etc etc. but it's a process.

    I'd personally give these the benefit of all that were it not for the amount of order/pre-orders they've been taking, in the context of already existing scrutiny about the models they were selling still being early in the beta testing/design phase. There's nothing wrong with confidence and the pile-on here can be unreasonable, excessive and sometimes unfounded but Frank came in here and made BIG promises and beat his chest when the first couple, even less severe, questions of QC came up. That post about all the 'low build numbers' being spoken for already, like they deserve a premium instead of a discount or sign of appreciation for being guinea pigs, that was a complete and total absence of any humility whatsoever.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2018
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  14. cardinal

    cardinal F# Dive Bomber

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    I’m sad now.
     
  15. Avedas

    Avedas SS.org Regular

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    The guitar I played was seriously incredible. I'm sure with a microscope and a couple hours I could find more flaws, but the only thing that jumped out at me was the neck joint. I really would buy one if the import price tag weren't so insane. 600k JPY for a model I can't even customize myself. I can only imagine what a proper custom would cost me to get one to my door. Unfortunately that's just the nature of the game.
     
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  16. JSanta

    JSanta SS.org Regular

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    Small flaws are one thing - the only thing that truly bothers me is that horrendous neck join. No excuse for that.
     
  17. Jonathan20022

    Jonathan20022 Engineer

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    Yikes that sucks, hope it gets sorted. I still want to order one eventually.

    EDIT: Looking more into it, I know from just browsing Digimart over the years that the Japanese are actually incredibly attentive to issues and match up to the amount of microscope detective work SSO is known for. So they'll display any and all problems as clearly as possible for any potential customer to know what they're getting.

    But also something to note, that the other 9 guitars don't seem to have any defects photographed by them.

    https://www.digimart.net/search?category12Id=359&keywordAnd=abasi&x=0&y=0

    Not saying 1/10 having imperfections is a thing to celebrate over, but maybe not as tragic as a lot of people are making it out to be. The neck joint with the glue is a concern for sure, same with the clear missing around the backplate photo. But the rest are dings that could have been part of mishandling during shipping, hard to say without being the person to ship and the receiver.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2018
  18. frank falbo

    frank falbo SS.org Regular

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    Yes. The first few guitars that went to Japan were the initial batch, and toward the end when it came to paint it was a little rushed, but the guitars themselves (wood, glue, basically the entire build prior to paint) are full quality instruments. Nothing about that was rushed.

    There’s no “excuse” here but I will say the Japan market was first to jump in and buy a lot of guitars, and they were also very interested in getting the guitars as quickly as possible. So for a guitar with finish damage like that photo, the decision was made to sell it, because apparently for the Japan market there will be someone who would rather have THAT instrument right now, instead of another one in 2 months.

    So I need everyone in this thread to please filter this through this lens: Let the Japan market decide if these are worth the Yen, and if so, then that guitar, as-is, will make someone happy because they have one of the first samples, even if with finish damage. It’s “new” as far as warranty is concerned.

    The Japan market is being run by a distributor there, so these decisions are strictly for the Japan market and being made by them, for what they think is best for their market.

    We have already told them that we’ll happily take these few back for total repaints. It’s just finish related. So that may still happen. Until then, I’m sure these photos will haunt me for the rest of my life.

    As for the guitars themselves, I’ll try to break it down to the key points:

    Neck pocket area: This is a transition from painted guitar to unfinished (oil). Any time you do that, it’s a long, labor intensive process to shape and razor cut the transition. What you see there is a split line between paint and no paint. What it is not: glue. Everyone speculating about the glue situation, no it has nothing to do with glue. It’s not glue you’re seeing.

    The white powder is the combination of wetsanding dust and buffing compound. It does clean off. We clean it here and oil the fingerboard edge and it disappears. I think eventually the oil dries and you can see white again. But please understand this: It can be cleaned away, and in the future I will be personally cleaning it away to the point where it is gone and doesn’t reappear. However, it’s a transition from paint to unpainted. So dust can collect in there and would have to be cleaned in the future. We think that to have the neck unfinished is important. We also think the end of the fingerboard should be unfinished too. Other manufacturers will roll the paint up and over the fingerboard edge on the body. I’m not doing that. If I did do that, then there wouldn’t be that hard line that needs to be taped and then cleaned. You can second guess me on that I suppose. But I think it’s the right way to handle that transition.

    Finish damage: From today forward, for worldwide distribution AND all future orders for Japan, there will be absolutely ZERO finish issues allowed/accepted. They simply will not ever occur from here forward. With Burl Maple we will be adding one more coat of pore filler, and an additional coat of topcoat. Thin finishes are great and resonant, but I won’t be shipping any Burl tops out without a slightly thicker coat of paint. Unless someone chooses a satin finish that purposely has the feel of all the nooks and crannies of the Burl (like they want it to feel raw)

    tl:dr Yes we know about this stuff; first batch expedited for very enthusiastic Japan market; it will never come up again, neither in Japan nor worldwide, and we are gladly accepting returns if they prefer.

    Heck even if someone buys it so they have the earliest serial number and they want to send it back to me for a refinish in a YEAR from now, I’ll do that too!
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2018
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  19. Avedas

    Avedas SS.org Regular

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    They will openly acknowledge and display flaws, but you won't get any sort of discount, especially from the big stores, unless the guitar is seriously damaged. I was looking at a 178k used Strandberg last year from Ishibashi and they wouldn't budge on the price at all. They maybe considered throwing in a few picks or a strap had I bought it on the spot.

    All that said, they will definitely sell out. There are so many stupidly high prices guitars here and they all eventually get cycled through, even if it takes a few years.

    @frank falbo thanks for the insight. Big fan of the guitar.
     
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  20. frank falbo

    frank falbo SS.org Regular

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    The most significant alteration is the ball bearings between the tuner and the bridge. That’s the most common complaint; that most headless are (or become) difficult to turn for fine adjustments. These bearings, combined with the fine thread pitch are (in our opinion) improvements.
     

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