# What's wrong with Soldano for modern metal?



## Promit (May 19, 2013)

I've read a lot of people saying that the JetCity/Soldano amps are more of an 80s metal type sound and that they don't have the modern sound that you'd get from a 6505, Dual Recto, EVH, ENGL, etc. 

Can someone explain to me why? What's the voicing difference?


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## Randyrhoads123 (May 19, 2013)

Doesn't seem to have a problem with metal to me. I like it the best in this video.


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## Rook (May 19, 2013)

Very airy mids, lots of gain, not tight so much as fizzy.

I actually think they could work fine for modern metal, just needs some tweaking or maybe a boost.


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## kylendm (May 19, 2013)

Yeah I agree with all of that^

The SLO i played was pretty fizzy and we were cranking it. I'm sure it took a lot of work getting that SLO to sound like that in the clip.


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## Mordacain (May 19, 2013)

kylendm said:


> Yeah I agree with all of that^
> 
> The SLO i played was pretty fizzy and we were cranking it. I'm sure it took a lot of work getting that SLO to sound like that in the clip honestly.



The guy who made the videos' comments clearly state that we was using the same settings as on the other amps, just adjusted 1 up due to the Soldano's knobs going to 11.

Every SLO 100 I've played has been characterized by a lack of high-end fizz. They have ridiculously smooth and detailed midrange characteristics and if anything a relaxed high end.

Were you sure you were playing on the Lead channel and not the Crunch? The Crunch channel has a much crisper high-end, and throatier midrange and overall, much less gain.


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## erotophonophilia (May 19, 2013)

They're just not made for anything heavier than 80s glam/hair rock (I hate when people call it hair metal. And for $3,250, you shouldn't need to use a boost or OD, to get a decent tone. For that amount I'd go with an Ubershall.


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## Promit (May 19, 2013)

erotophonophilia said:


> They're just not made for anything heavier than 80s glam/hair rock (I hate when people call it hair metal. And for $3,250, you shouldn't need to use a boost or OD, to get a decent tone. For that amount I'd go with an Ubershall.


I said JetCity/Soldano, which includes the JCA22h that can be had for well under 400.

In any case, this type of statement is exactly what is getting me confused. "They're just not made for anything heavier [...]". Fine, but what does that actually _mean_? What makes the Uberschall or anything else better? I legitimately don't understand what the difference is that makes amp A suitable and amp B not, since it doesn't seem to be just the amount of gain available.


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## Rook (May 19, 2013)

Mordacain said:


> The guy who made the videos' comments clearly state that we was using the same settings as on the other amps, just adjusted 1 up due to the Soldano's knobs going to 11.
> 
> Every SLO 100 I've played has been characterized by a lack of high-end fizz. They have ridiculously smooth and detailed midrange characteristics and if anything a relaxed high end.
> 
> Were you sure you were playing on the Lead channel and not the Crunch? The Crunch channel has a much crisper high-end, and throatier midrange and overall, much less gain.



The SLO I tried sounded like it'd be good for getting Vai's DLR era tone, it had that wispy, hot-rodded marshall type tone. We could all just be using different words to describe our differing perceptions of the same thing.


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## SSK0909 (May 19, 2013)

Theyre super dynamic. 

No modern metal player wants that,, its all about DA TAITNEZZ now a days where every tone must be squished with boosts and gates ;-)


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## Seanthesheep (May 19, 2013)

Pierce the veil use some kind of soldano and they sound pretty modern. But also obviously not very metal


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## TemjinStrife (May 19, 2013)

2 problems:

-Price (they are very pricey compared to some of the modern purpose-built high-gainers)
-They're long out of style. They will do modern metal just fine, but in conjunction with their price and rarity means that you just won't see them on many touring stages when a cheaper 5150 or Recto (which are both SLO derivatives) will do just fine.


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## VBCheeseGrater (May 19, 2013)

erotophonophilia said:


> And for $3,250, you shouldn't need to use a boost or OD, to get a decent tone.



Perhaps i have not played enough high gain amps, but this seems like a bit of a catch 22. Boosts are typically solid state pedals, and the minute you put one in an amp people freak out. Yet i've never heard a tube amp get that same level of tightness without a boost in front. Every amp i've owned (a few Mesas, 5150, 6505+, Jet City..) has benefited from a boost for chug type tones. 

At this point i prefer to use a boost, as it ensures i have two tones at my feet on and given single amp channel. Less aggressive with boost off, boost on to get heavier.


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## Chickenhawk (May 19, 2013)

> What's wrong with using a Soldano for modern metal?



Nothing.


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## Choop (May 19, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> 2 problems:
> 
> -Price (they are very pricey compared to some of the modern purpose-built high-gainers)
> -They're long out of style. They will do modern metal just fine, but in conjunction with their price and rarity means that you just won't see them on many touring stages when a cheaper 5150 or Recto (which are both SLO derivatives) will do just fine.



Pretty much came here to say this. They sound really great and could do modern metal easily...but there are too many great sounding and cheaper options to make the brand attractive for most metal players probably. Not that I wouldn't want to have one myself...


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## SSK0909 (May 19, 2013)

And they have limited use for most people.

No bedroom rocker or small stage band will ever get to play it at the volume level it needs to truly shine. 
And it really needs volume. Those old Marshalls and Hot rod marshall type amps change tone and character as the volume goes up that id say the master knob affects tone more than the eq knobs


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## TemjinStrife (May 19, 2013)

Volume? Fizz? On an SLO? How much time have you spent with one? 

The SLO isn't a Marshall, and it really isn't a hot-rodded Marshall so much either. It's the daddy of all the modern high gain amps where the "gain" and tone comes from the preamp section. It does sound better loud, but I've played SLOs, Hot Rods, and the like at reasonable home volumes and they sound *fantastic.*


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## 155 (May 19, 2013)

In my experience the slo has no fizz and is plenty tight..perfect for metal..


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## Dawn of the Shred (May 19, 2013)

The slo is one of my fav amps. I have had two and iv loved both of them. No problems getting the sound i wanted out of the Slo.


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## TemjinStrife (May 19, 2013)

Now, if you're thinking of the small Jet City amp heads, the original JCA20H was very much of an '80s metal sound, as it was the crunch (not lead) channel of an SLO into two EL84s. Great for crunchy rock, less so for modern metal. 

The JCA22H has more gain but is still relatively low-headroom, but the JCA50H and JCA100H are pretty beastly budget amps. They skimp on the transformers so they're not quite as nice as the real thing, but they're perfectly serviceable.


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## kylendm (May 19, 2013)

Idk, I was literally playing one in front of me playing through my Mesa 4x12 and that's just what I heard. It wasn't as tight and was fuzzier than say my Baron K88 and a VHT UL that were also in the room.


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## Curt (May 19, 2013)

Seanthesheep said:


> Pierce the veil use some kind of soldano and they sound pretty modern. But also obviously not very metal


 Not metal at all. But yeah, still pretty good tone... And their music is pretty catchy.


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## wakjob (May 19, 2013)

Good Lord. How tight does it have to be?

Seem like everyone wants a HPF set at about 330Hz before the first gain stage.
And a gate threshold so high, you have to hit the strings with a hammer.

Whatever. To each is own. 

I like a little give in the bottom to make it 'scrunchy' and playful. You can still have tight palm mutes and some chewiness working at the same time.


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## Curt (May 19, 2013)

wakjob said:


> Good Lord. How tight does it have to be?
> 
> Seem like everyone wants a HPF set at about 330Hz before the first gain stage.
> And a gate threshold so high, you have to hit the strings with a hammer.
> ...


 
I second this. 
I love beefy low end with just enough tightness that things don't get flubby.


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## erotophonophilia (May 19, 2013)

VBCheeseGrater said:


> Perhaps i have not played enough high gain amps, but this seems like a bit of a catch 22. Boosts are typically solid state pedals, and the minute you put one in an amp people freak out. Yet i've never heard a tube amp get that same level of tightness without a boost in front. Every amp i've owned (a few Mesas, 5150, 6505+, Jet City..) has benefited from a boost for chug type tones.
> 
> At this point i prefer to use a boost, as it ensures i have two tones at my feet on and given single amp channel. Less aggressive with boost off, boost on to get heavier.



Try a modern high gain amp that uses EL34's, because an electric guitar is supposed to sound like a chainsaw.


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## cardinal (May 19, 2013)

SLO can do modern metal just fine, but it won't ever sound like a Diezel or an Engl, if either of those is your gold standard.

SLO also is odd to dial in. The knobs are very predictable and easy to work with once you figure out what's going on, but it's VERY easy to make the amp super-crazy-unbelievably bright and fizzy if you point the knobs in the right direction. The SLO can be very smooth and even dark (which is how I have mine dialed in).


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## Promit (May 19, 2013)

The reason I asked is because I have a Jet City 100, it's my first high gain amp, and I'm extremely fond of it. (Especially for the price paid.) But I don't know how it compares to other common "monsters of high gain" and when I went looking, I kept reading that the sound wasn't 'modern'. I just don't know what that means.

For me personally, I love the Dual Rectifier sound I hear on albums, as cliche as that is. I know it has some heritage in the SLO. I'm just trying to get a handle on what sets high gain amplifiers apart.


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## TemjinStrife (May 19, 2013)

The JCA 100 is a pretty awesome high gain amp. It's less raw than a block letter 5150. It cuts better and has more presence and less compression than, say, an ENGL Powerball or original Fireball (I haven't played one of the new Fireballs). It won't be as tight or dry as a VHT, and the Rectifier has a different sort of dry growl but a similar tonality. I haven't tried any Diezels so I can't compare to that.

But really, it's just a different flavor of high gain. People have different tastes, and the JCA100 is a pretty solid SLO clone with mediocre transformers and lower-spec components.


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## bulb (May 19, 2013)

The SLO-100 and Avenger are incredible amps for modern metal.


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## yingmin (May 19, 2013)

bulb said:


> The SLO-100 and Avenger are incredible amps for modern metal.



The Avenger has probably the best high gain tone I've ever heard.


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## Toshiro (May 19, 2013)

I have a JCA22H, and it does metal just fine with a boost in front. I feel like it's too warm/smooth without it though.


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## Legion (May 20, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> 5150 or Recto (which are both SLO derivatives)



What?! Really? I had NO idea...

They sound ENTIRELY different to my ears, and the Dual Rec with a boost is the only one among them that I get along nicely with


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## yingmin (May 20, 2013)

Legion said:


> What?! Really? I had NO idea...
> 
> They sound ENTIRELY different to my ears, and the Dual Rec with a boost is the only one among them that I get along nicely with



Yeah, I've heard that mentioned several times, and I'm not trying to argue that it's not true, but to me they are such different amps that it's almost beside the point.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 20, 2013)

I believe it is true. When Eddie Van Halen was designing the 5150, he based it on the SLO since that's what he used before his Peavey deal.


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## Jakke (May 20, 2013)

Love my JCA HDM 100 (even more when I'm putting in a better OT), and I love Soldanos in general. What seems to be the problem with Soldanos and modern metal players (should be a added that Artusato played one for quite a while) is that they are really beefy, and perhaps not insanely tight. 

They can of course do modern metal just fine.


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## 4Eyes (May 20, 2013)

erotophonophilia said:


> And for $3,250, you shouldn't need to use a boost or OD, to get a decent tone.



I don't get what's wrong on using sort of TS pedal in front of crunchy amp. second biggest invention ever, after wheel.


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## troyguitar (May 20, 2013)

My JCA100 head is beastly at band volumes but sounds kind of mediocre at home volumes. It's modded though and I have not played a stock one. The actual Soldano Hot Rods and SLO I have played sound like perfection at all volumes - most "modern metal" kids are basing their opinions on playing one JCA20 combo at Guitar Center for a few minutes I think. That amp sounds nothing like the 50 and 100 watt Soldano/Jet City stuff. Nothing at all.

JCA20 = Soldano Atomic/Astroverb = instant 80's rock/metal tone, too much high mids and not enough low mids for "modern metal"

JCA50/100 = Soldano Hot Rod 50/100 = different animal, much bigger and smoother sounding, way more bass and low mids

Sent from someone who has actually owned and played some of these things


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## Mordacain (May 20, 2013)

4Eyes said:


> I don't get what's wrong on using sort of TS pedal in front of crunchy amp. second biggest invention ever, after wheel.



Nothing wrong with running a boost in front of any amp, no matter it's price.

I will add that the SLO is not a crunchy amp, at least not on the Lead channel. The Crunchy channel is sure, but when run at high volumes, it too becomes smooth as well. Think Mark Knopfler's live "Brothers in Arms" tone which is the Crunch channel, run at pretty ridiculous volume.

I think people see the price of something and equate it with what it should do on it's own. 

From this thread, I'm kind of expecting that folks expect the SLO to also chop their vegetables and give them blow jobs while they play...


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## 4Eyes (May 20, 2013)

Mordacain said:


> I will add that the SLO is not a crunchy amp,


my bad, I meant TS pedal in front of amp set for crunch sound, even on lead channel of hi gain beasts


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## jordanky (May 20, 2013)

My old Hot Rod 100+ was pretty ....ing beastly with an OD in front of it, as well as other SLO and Avengers I've had the chance to play with. Mine didn't have gobs of saturation like a 5150, but it could do modern metal no doubt, you just have to turn knobs!


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## guitar_player4_2_0 (May 20, 2013)

I have both a JCA50h and a Mesa Solo 50 series II. Personally, I prefer the Jet City. It's got a really impressive tone for the price range, and from what I've read they are really similar to the actual Soldanos. I've been wanting to swap the tubes, but stock out of the box with a TS up front and an equalizer in the effects loop, it does modern metal just fine.


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## Andromalia (May 20, 2013)

Legion said:


> What?! Really? I had NO idea...
> 
> They sound ENTIRELY different to my ears, and the Dual Rec with a boost is the only one among them that I get along nicely with



Amps can be made to sound various ways, I don't think EVH planned his amp to be played for the brootalz and viking invasion tuned to B when designing it.
Also note that although he used Soldano SLOs (among others) before, EVH being EVH I highly doubt they were stock.

Sadly, my only experience with SLOs have been the axe FX blocks.


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## chopeth85 (May 21, 2013)

it depends on what soldano are you talking. ive got soldano sp 77 preamp and it isnt the best choice for metal but a friend has x88r and it screams like hell. Soldano is more "shreddy" kind of sound but its really great for metal or modern metal.


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## HUGH JAYNUS (May 21, 2013)

i have a suspicion that they will sound fine. so long as you know how to get a good tone. 

ive never played one. but i have made even a cheap Crate sound like a monster.

with a good EQ tweak, good speakers, hot ass uck pups (no less than EMG BKP or Dimarzios), and some Ruby tubes and you wouldnt even need a boost.


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## great_kthulu (May 21, 2013)

this was soldano's.


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## RustInPeace (May 21, 2013)

I tried a Soldano Hot Rod 100 plus for a good hour or so about a week ago.

The tone controls were very responsive. You could really shape the tone to be as bright or dark as you needed it to be. Not as raw and punchy as a 5150, but it still had as much gain. It felt like it REALLY needed a boost out front, just to compress it a little and tighten the bottom end, which can get HUGE!

I think this one was on sale at L&M here for $2100...?


I liked the orange rockerverb mkII a bit more for this price..but that may have been due to the orange cab it was plugged into


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## KAMI (May 21, 2013)

The price tag...


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## Hemorrhage (May 22, 2013)

Even tho I don't personally have experience of Soldano's (only heard good about them), I've been lately reading a lot of different amps around the mighty internet and I came to the not-so-shocking conclusion that people speak with so different terms of the same thing that you can hardly get any help out of it. Of course when talking about physical qualities such as durability or construction you can easily point out which is suitable for what but when you talk about nuances like this... I feel this goes to the same category of when you feel sick and you Google it. Sooner or later you will find out that you have a disease in terminal stage.

I'd like to remind that the combination of rest of the gear, recording method, recording device, youtube and your speakers pervert the sound of those samples and you would most likely not perceive it the same way IRL. Even tho they do give some guidelines of what it could possibly sound like.

I like the good spirit on the answers on this post.


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## Jakke (May 22, 2013)

KAMI said:


> The price tag...



There are modern metal bands that play more expensive, or equally expensive amps.


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## Hemorrhage (May 22, 2013)

Do you feel that you need something more or different soundwise or are you happy with the stuff you have? 

There can ofc be room for improvement but if you are satisfied with what you have, there is no reason why other peoples categorization should make you doubt what you hear and feel. If you have the chance around where you live, go to a store and play some of these hi-gain amps and you will know which you like the most. In the long run its irrelevant what other people like or think is good if it doesn't feel good specially for you. Unfortunately the tips on the internet only send you out for the journey but trying the particular item yourself gets you to the end.




Promit said:


> The reason I asked is because I have a Jet City 100, it's my first high gain amp, and I'm extremely fond of it. (Especially for the price paid.) But I don't know how it compares to other common "monsters of high gain" and when I went looking, I kept reading that the sound wasn't 'modern'. I just don't know what that means.
> 
> For me personally, I love the Dual Rectifier sound I hear on albums, as cliche as that is. I know it has some heritage in the SLO. I'm just trying to get a handle on what sets high gain amplifiers apart.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 22, 2013)

Jakke said:


> There are modern metal bands that play more expensive, or equally expensive amps.



Like Engl.


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## RustInPeace (May 22, 2013)

Engls are pretty rare around here. Only one dealer within 200kms and they are priced to sit on the shelf.


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## Jakke (May 22, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Like Engl.



Not here, but Mesa Boogies are well within the Soldano price range here.


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## SSK0909 (May 23, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Like Engl.



Thats only in the states because of shipping.

In Europe we get two Engl Invaders for the price of one SLO, and I'm not kidding.

Engl Invader: 1770 Euros.

Soldano SLO: 3800 Euros.


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## Seanthesheep (May 23, 2013)

RustInPeace said:


> Engls are pretty rare around here. Only one dealer within 200kms and they are priced to sit on the shelf.



I think in ontario theres only one dealer in the entire province and they are way out of the way from anything too


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## RustInPeace (May 23, 2013)

$4000 for an Engl Savage can blow me.


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