# Gibson heading towards default



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------



## Dredg (Aug 25, 2017)

https://www.thestreet.com/story/142...ault-if-company-can-t-refinance-its-debt.html

This gives me so many warm fuzzies inside.


----------



## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

ESP EXP 2018. I'm so down.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Let Epiphone rise from the ashes. Much better company releasing much cooler stuff. 

And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.


----------



## feraledge (Aug 25, 2017)

Clearly this has been a long time coming, but the fact that this announcement comes less than a month after this happened is pretty damn hilarious to me:





Any residual Gibson GAS was immediately killed. But throw ESP on those headstocks and I'm 100% back in the game.


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

Hopefully they'll fix the headstock angle before rebranding them.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Why would this make anyone happy?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

fuck gibson, they make shit guitars. I played a ton at guitar center over the years and the quality is so hit or miss. I think I'd find one really good one out of every 5 or 6 that I played. The CEO really tanked them with all of his stupid gimmicky ideas like robotic tuners/putting a distortion pedal in an explorer instead of focusing on building good guitars. 
meh between my 2 destroyers and my exploder 8 I'm pretty set on explorers. Firebirds are a completely different story. Esp needs to bring back their version of it since I can't afford a sully raven right now ;_;


----------



## Dredg (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Probably because Gibsons are massively overpriced, sub-par instruments with numerous design flaws and have been for quite a while. Their arrogance is only surpassed by the mind-boggling refusal to make any sort of forward movement that doesn't amount to a ludicrous marketing gimmick clearly thought up in a boardroom instead of the drafting board. Gibson has become nothing more than a cancer to the industry, caring to do nothing more strenuous than rest on their laurels and propagate the "magic" qualities of outdated and flawed designs. At this point, Epiphone genuinely makes better instruments than Gibson, and that's saying a lot.


----------



## Unleash The Fury (Aug 26, 2017)

Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA". I thought this word only existed at the company i work for! I really lol'd when i saw that word in the article.

Jokes aside. I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics. Stop half assing lackluster ideas.


----------



## crankyrayhanky (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> I dont want to see Gibson go under completley, i want them to reapproach the way they care for their guitars, customers, get with the times and/or just stick to the classics.


This makes more sense


----------



## Rawkmann (Aug 26, 2017)

I love my Gibsons tho...


----------



## USMarine75 (Aug 26, 2017)

Love mine! Then again, I think an LP had a one night stand with a PRS one night, and this came knocking on the door 18 years later, but we don't talk much 'bout that...


----------



## Zado (Aug 26, 2017)

marcwormjim said:


> If they go under, who's going to make Kiesel look good?


Devries Guitars?



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> And what Feraledge said. If this means a return of the ESP EXP and lawsuit V, then fuck it. Sacrifices must be made.



+ the Eclipse I shape 





And maybe a 100% simmetrical Schecter V-1?






Let's face it, there so much to celebrate if the thing happens


----------



## prlgmnr (Aug 26, 2017)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Forget everything else in the article, i want to focus on the acronym "EBITDA".



I was thinking it must be some sort of alternate tuning.


----------



## blacai (Aug 26, 2017)

Well, that's what happen when you don't know how to rule a business in a living field.


----------



## JohnIce (Aug 26, 2017)

crankyrayhanky said:


> Why would this make anyone happy?



Can't speak for everybody, but personally when I see a company as cartoonishly capitalistic as Gibson that puts profit that far above employees, customers and product quality, not to mention suing their competitors left and right for decades, I'm glad when it bites them in the ass. Not necessarily because they're a guitar brand, I just don't like companies like that in general and I think any warning examples of why running a company like that doesn't pay off is a good thing for the world at large.


----------



## Velokki (Aug 26, 2017)

I used to work for a UK Gibson retailer in 2013.
Once we had a shipment of 4 Gibson guitars come in, that all looked really nice on the surface. 2 of them sold very fast, 2 of them were left in the shop. Both of the sold guitars were returned for issues (one had the nut cracked in a really weird way which essentially killed the tone and screwed up the intonation; the other's electronics didn't work properly). Upon close inspection, the two unsold guitars were faulty, too. We ended up returning the whole shipment to Gibson, but here is where it gets interesting. Our manager found out that these guitars had been shipped before to a shop in Netherlands. They had received the guitars, but rejected them, claiming they're not in condition to be sold. Gibson saw it to be proper to try to scam another retailer, and send broken guitars to us. Very professional!

Also, I remember once a customer wanted to try the proper Gibson ES-335. I think it even was a special, really expensive model, costing way over 3000£. Might've been VOS. Anyway, I couldn't tune the instrument properly. Turns out one of the tuners was broken out of the box, and on top of that, tuning was almost impossible since the string slots in the nut were way too tight. You couldn't even properly fit a 9-42 in it. Our tech said that the nut would need to be filed/changed, and a tuner to be replaced. Needless to say, we had to return it and apologise the customer for waiting 20 minutes for nothing.

Also, my friend who used to play in a vintage rock band, thought it was a good idea to buy an authentic Gibson Les Paul. It most definitely looked great, but nothing but problems surfaced, the tuning was inconsistent all the time and frets were sticking out real bad. I tried the guitar and it was just plain bad.

I'm not trying to bash them completely for the sake of bashing, since I've tried some Gibson guitars that felt really good. But as a company, they're completely worthless in regards to customer support, corporate policy and quality control. It's astounding how they've managed to stay in the game this long with this kind of attitude. I'm gonna quote Mark Baum from "The Big Short": _"Hey... excuse me! Let me ask you this: What company treats its customers *that* shittily... and succeeds!?"_


----------



## Esp Griffyn (Aug 26, 2017)

We will never be rid of the curse that is Gibson, new investors will buy the brand and the designs.


----------



## Blytheryn (Aug 26, 2017)

Can they speed it up?


----------

