# Chords...



## Brett89 (Jan 21, 2007)

I had my secound lesson with my guitarteacher, and we started learning about chords...

Well for example, here is a C Major chord...

-------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------
-----0----------------------------------
-----2----------------------------------
-----3---------------------------------
-------------------------------------

So the root is C, and there is an E and G note... and my teacher said that we can change the chord, like we put the C note up one octave, soo it would look like this...

---------------------------------------------
-------1--------------------------------------
-------0--------------------------------
-------2------------------------
------------------------------------
--------------------------------



SOOOOOOO my main quastion is that is this true, or I misunderstud something???  

Sorry for the english and thanks in advance


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 21, 2007)

Yeah, that's correct.


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## playstopause (Jan 21, 2007)

Of course it's true.
There's many, many, many (have i said many?) ways to do each chords across the fretboard.
To do a major one (say C), you basicelly need the root, the third (E) and the fifth (G)

The root doesn't always have to be the note "on top", while i suggest you first learn it this way when beginning. It's easier to figure things out on the fretboard and where to plays your chords: you get a reference.

The one you were shown is an "open chord". Later, you will learn the several variants of that same chord fooling around with all its degrees (as a simple example, a minor chord as a flat third). Etc.


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## Brett89 (Jan 21, 2007)

Thank you very much!  

Well he showed me that some chords (I dont know the right word for that) can be moved on the fingerboard, like the E major chord, if I remember right  

Well he gived me a lot of homework... I most learn the basic major and minor chords, plus the intervals, plus a C major scale figure....

BUT I'M SOO FUCKING HAPPY THAT I CAN LEARN PLAYING THE GUITAR!!! (sorry for the F word but I'm realy happy)

It's fun for me, I like it, well he teaches a but fast, he thinks I understand everything at the first time, but he's a great player, he's a bluesy, jazzy guy...

So thanks again


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 21, 2007)

Sounds like he's showing you all the right fundementals. Stick with it and you should progress pretty quickly.


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## Brett89 (Jan 21, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Sounds like he's showing you all the right fundementals. Stick with it and you should progress pretty quickly.



Well yes, I will stick to it, I love it... I think it's great learning by a teacher. And I think it's hunderd times better learning blues, rock, jazz, and such stuff then always learn from fucking incorrect tabs from your favorite band...

And I think this is the only way that I can learn how to play my OWN music, my own style... I'm very a beginer, but when I'm getting better I would like to play some kind of instrumental metal think.... it's sad that I can't fing a nother guitar/bass/drumplayer with a similar taste


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## playstopause (Jan 21, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Well he showed me that some chords (I dont know the right word for that) can be moved on the fingerboard, like the E major chord, if I remember right



_Any chords_ can be moved across the fretboard.

Glad you enjoy learning the instrument. It's really great discovering something you like.


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## Mastodon (Jan 21, 2007)

Yup, it's called an inversion. Here's a tutorial on the concept. http://www.musictheory.net/legacy/html/id42.html

It's cool to see how excited you are about learning guitar. That's one of the things that makes me really want to become a guitar teacher.


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 21, 2007)

Mastodon said:


> Yup, it's called an inversion. Here's a tutorial on the concept. http://www.musictheory.net/legacy/html/id42.html
> 
> It's cool to see how excited you are about learning guitar. That's one of the things that makes me really want to become a guitar teacher.



When you get a student who really wants to learn, it rocks. Actually, this gives me an idea for a new thread...


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## Naren (Jan 21, 2007)

playstopause said:


> _Any chords_ can be moved across the fretboard.
> 
> Glad you enjoy learning the instrument. It's really great discovering something you like.



Yep. Some of them can be kind of awkward, though (Well, at least, it's awkward at first. Once you get used to it, it's not so awkward). Such as moving the G major open chord form up the neck like this:

e-7---9--
b-5---7--
g-5---7--
D-5---7--
A-6---8--
E-7---9--

At least, I think that's how it goes. I'm going by memory only. I don't have a guitar in front of me to try on...


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## metalfiend666 (Jan 22, 2007)

As others have said, what he's shown you is an inversion of the chord. As long as the chord contains the notes C, E and G it will always be a C Major chord, but placing the notes in different orders can have drastic differences in how the chord sounds. It can be very cool. If you've got access to a piano or keyboard try playing a C, an E and a G anywhere on the keyboard. You could have a very low G, a mid area E and a very high C and it would still be C Major, it would just sound very different. Try chaging the positions of them and see the affects it has.


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## Brett89 (Jan 23, 2007)

...well my teacher didn't wrote down the minor B chord in my book... it's a mistake or there isn't any minor B chord?


Other thing... my teacher wrote down the major B chord something like this....

E----1------------------------
B----2-------------------------
G----2---------------------------
D----2-------------------------
A----1------------------------
E----------------------------

... but there's no B note in this chord... or am I stupid? 

Please help!


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## Drew (Jan 23, 2007)

Close - that's a Bb major chord, it's a half step below a B major chord. 

b = flat, a half step below the indicated note.
# = sharp, a half step above the indicated note.

There's a Bm chord, he just hasn't shown it to you.


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## Naren (Jan 23, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> ...well my teacher didn't wrote down the minor B chord in my book... it's a mistake or there isn't any minor B chord?
> 
> 
> Other thing... my teacher wrote down the major B chord something like this....
> ...



Like Drew said, that's Bb (but not a Bb major chord). A Bb major chord would be:

E----1------------------------
B----3-------------------------
G----3---------------------------
D----3-------------------------
A----1------------------------
E----------------------------

This would be Bb minor:

E----1------------------------
B----2-------------------------
G----3---------------------------
D----3-------------------------
A----1------------------------
E----------------------------

There are major and minor chords for ever note.



Drew said:


> Close - that's a Bb major chord, it's a half step below a B major chord.



I don't think that's what his teacher wrote, because that wouldn't be a Bb major chord. I don't know what it'd be. Something pretty dischordant.


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## Brett89 (Jan 23, 2007)

Naren said:


> Like Drew said, that's Bb (but not a Bb major chord). A Bb major chord would be:
> 
> E----1------------------------
> B----3-------------------------
> ...



So a B major chord would be this?

----2-------------------------
----4-------------------------
----4--------------------------
----4--------------------------
----2--------------------------
-------------------------------

...and a B minor looks like this?

------2------------------------
------3----------------------
------4-----------------------
------4----------------------
------2----------------------
------------------------


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## playstopause (Jan 23, 2007)

Exactly.

Like i said in a previous post, if you wanna get a minor chord, just take the "third" and bring it down a half step.

B major ROOT = B / THIRD = D sharp / FIFTH = F sharp
B minor ROOT = B / THIRD = D  / FIFTH = F sharp


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## Naren (Jan 23, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> So a B major chord would be this?
> 
> ----2-------------------------
> ----4-------------------------
> ...



Yep. 

Although I usually play my B major chords like this:

------------------------------
----4-------------------------
----4--------------------------
----4--------------------------
----2--------------------------
-------------------------------


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## IbanezFan (Jan 23, 2007)

Awesome forum.. so helpful


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## cvinos (Jan 25, 2007)

For an overview of standard triads, that is chords with three tones constructed by stacks of thirds, you may also read the thread "Voicings" http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/showthread.php?t=19984 I started in the Lessons and Technique section. The thread is meant to also cover more chords with more tones and stuff, but it starts with the standard triads.


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## Brett89 (Jan 31, 2007)

Please kill me!!! 

Oh man, I'm idiot I know, but I practice the chords, pratice the scales and I don't know... it feels shit, I mean I'm not comfortable with the thing, it sound shit, and sometimes I feel it's better if I put down a guitar... I feel frustrated... 


I think that it doesn't matter how many scales and chords I know, even If I pick a single note it sound terrible... 

What's the problem, what sould I practice? Or my approach of guitarplaying isn't good?


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

Stick with it. You'll have to be really patient as you get the fundementals down. Just set manageable goals, and you'll find your skills improve over time. For instance, rather than sitting down and saying, 'I've got to learn all these chords', say 'Today I'm just going to practice changing between A minor and E minor chords', and work until you nail that. Do that each day, and eventually it'll all become second nature.

Don't get disheartened; developing skills on the guitar takes time. I guarantee you all accomplished players felt the way you do when they first started. If you need help with anything, there's plenty of people here who are willing to offer advice.


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## Brett89 (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Stick with it. You'll have to be really patient as you get the fundementals down. Just set manageable goals, and you'll find your skills improve over time. For instance, rather than sitting down and saying, 'I've got to learn all these chords', say 'Today I'm just going to practice changing between A minor and E minor chords', and work until you nail that. Do that each day, and eventually it'll all become second nature.
> 
> Don't get disheartened; developing skills on the guitar takes time. I guarantee you all accomplished players felt the way you do when they first started. If you need help with anything, there's plenty of people here who are willing to offer advice.



Thank you


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## Mastodon (Jan 31, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Please kill me!!!
> 
> Oh man, I'm idiot I know, but I practice the chords, pratice the scales and I don't know... it feels shit, I mean I'm not comfortable with the thing, it sound shit, and sometimes I feel it's better if I put down a guitar... I feel frustrated...
> 
> ...



Meh, probably just having a few off days. Everyone gets em *cough Yngwie video* They blow major ass.

I usually just avoid playing and go do something else until I get that druggie sensation where you crave the feel of the guitar in your arms. I find that when I do that I feel alot more relaxed and have alot more fun, and then I suddenly realize that I'm making progress on the things that were frustrating me previously.


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## Naren (Jan 31, 2007)

While that's true, Mastadon. Brett is a beginner and, at the beginning, everything is uncomfortable. Sometimes it's hard to fret a simple note. I've taught the E minor open chord to several people before (possibly the easiest open chord) and not one person I taught it to could fret it without buzzing or complaining that their fingers hurt. To fix the buzzing, I just told them to put their fingers as close to the fret as possible without being on it and then I told them push down hard. That reduced the buzzing, but didn't completely get rid of it. I remember that it took a while before I could comfortably switch between open chords, but I just kept practicing. When my fingers started to hurt, I would push my fingers even harder against the frets until they were a reddish-purple. That helped me develop callouses faster. I remember how awkward scales were at first. I made mistake after mistake after mistake. If you practice and keep on trying hard, you'll get used to it.

Keep trying, Brett!


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## Kotex (Jan 31, 2007)

^ That happened to me too.

It's just practice. The more you try, the better you get. Stick with it man. You'll be glad you did later.


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## Brett89 (Feb 1, 2007)

Thanl you for the help! 

Two more quastion...

If I do big bends I touch other strings in the direction where I bend the string, and it makes unwanted noises... what do I do wrong?

Other... when I play scales the string the I dont play are ringing, so If I start the scale from the E string, and step to the A string, the E string rings out after that... I hope you get what I mean  So how sould I mute it?

Thanks in advance!


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## Mastodon (Feb 1, 2007)

Naren said:


> While that's true, Mastadon. Brett is a beginner and, at the beginning, everything is uncomfortable. Sometimes it's hard to fret a simple note. I've taught the E minor open chord to several people before (possibly the easiest open chord) and not one person I taught it to could fret it without buzzing or complaining that their fingers hurt. To fix the buzzing, I just told them to put their fingers as close to the fret as possible without being on it and then I told them push down hard. That reduced the buzzing, but didn't completely get rid of it. I remember that it took a while before I could comfortably switch between open chords, but I just kept practicing. When my fingers started to hurt, I would push my fingers even harder against the frets until they were a reddish-purple. That helped me develop callouses faster. I remember how awkward scales were at first. I made mistake after mistake after mistake. If you practice and keep on trying hard, you'll get used to it.
> 
> Keep trying, Brett!



Ah , right that completely slipped my mind.



Bret89 said:


> Thanl you for the help!
> 
> Two more quastion...
> 
> ...



I'm trying to figure out a reason why the other strings would wring while bending but I couldn't make it happen.

I think I can answer your second question though.

When you lift the last finger left on the low e string it has the same effect as doing a pulloff.

So for example, if you're playing an A minor scale starting at the 5th fret of the low E.

D|-------------------5
A|----------5--7--9--
E|--5--7--9----------

The pattern would be index, middle, pinkey, index, middle, pinkey, index.

As you lay your middle finger down be sure to leave your index finger on the 3rd, and as you lay your pinkey down be sure to leave your middle and index in place.

As you place your pinkey on the 7th fret begin moving your index finger to the next string. When you put your index down on the a string make sure the very tip of it is making light contact with the e string.

That way the e string will be muted when you lift your pinkey from it.


I hope I made sense.


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## Brett89 (Feb 1, 2007)

Thank you for the help!

Wel I try to explane my problem, I try my best 

So, I do a bend on the A string, a big bend, and I pull it in to the direction of the D string. And sometimes, my finger, which bends the A string touches the D string, and it makes unwanted noise, or I bend the D string a little, but I don't want...that's all...

Sorry for my english


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## Mastodon (Feb 1, 2007)

There's absolutely no need to apologize for your english. If anything it's admirable.

I just realized that I made a few errors in what I said earlier. 
The example I wrote is actually Major, not minor.

I also should have written this:



mastodon said:


> As you lay your middle finger down be sure to leave your index finger on the *5th*, and as you lay your pinkey down be sure to leave your middle and index in place.
> 
> As you place your pinkey on the *9th* fret begin moving your index finger to the next string. When you put your index down on the a string make sure the very tip of it is making light contact with the e string.


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 1, 2007)

Mastodon said:


> There's absolutely no need to apologize for your english. If anything it's admirable.



He's right. Seriously Brett, your written communication is ten times better than a lot of native English speakers.


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## Durero (Feb 2, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Thanl you for the help!
> 
> Two more quastion...
> 
> ...


Sounds like a damping problem.
I hold the tip of the pic very very close to the side of my thumb - so that the side of my thumb damps any string that is lower-pitched that the one I'm picking.
I also use the side of a fretting finger (usually the index finger) to damp strings that are higher-pitched than the one I'm playing - similar to what Mastodon described.

This works very well for scales & riffs, and can also help for the bending situation you described. But if you watch most blues players (a style where bending is especially important) you'll probably see them bending with their 2nd & 3rd fingers together while damping the strings they bend into with their index finger. Also a good way to go


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## Naren (Feb 2, 2007)

I also always dampen strings I'm not using so they don't ring out.


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## Brett89 (Feb 4, 2007)

Is it Ok or I wrote something wrong?

G minor

E----------------------
B----------------------
G----------------------
D-----0----------------
A-----1----------------
E-----3----------------

... notes are G, B, and D...

did I change the G and D note right? Is still a G minor chord?

E-------------------------------------------
B------------------------------------3------
G----13------------------------------3------
D-----x------------------------------0------
A----14-------------------------------------
E----10--------------------------------------
or an easyer way.... is it OK??????????

... and the other thing

I picked this G minor, and if a put a B and a D in it, it would look like this...

E------------------------
B-------3----------------
G-------3----------------
D-------0----------------
A-------1----------------
E-------3----------------

So it has a G,B,D,B and a D note.... is it correct? Is it a realy chord?

Thanks in advance!!!


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 4, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> I picked this G minor, and if a put a B and a D in it, it would look like this...
> 
> E------------------------
> B-------3----------------
> ...



That's a G Minor, but I'd recommend you avoid doubling the third in your chord voicings. This would be a better version of that voicing for instance...

-----3------
-----3----
-----0----
-----0------
-----1----
-----3-----


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## Durero (Feb 4, 2007)

A correction for you Brett:



Brett89 said:


> did I change the G and D note right? Is still a G minor chord?
> 
> E-------------------------------------------
> B------------------------------------3------
> ...



hope that helps


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## All_¥our_Bass (Feb 6, 2007)

In a G minor chord the third is 'Bb' (B-flat) not 'B'. but your tab is right for that chord.


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## Durero (Feb 6, 2007)

Brett do you use 'B' for Bflat and 'H' for B in your language?

I know that's the way it works in German, but I'm not sure about Hungarian. If you do use music terminology this way that could be causing some misunderstanding in this post.


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## Brett89 (Feb 6, 2007)

Durero said:


> Brett do you use 'B' for Bflat and 'H' for B in your language?
> 
> I know that's the way it works in German, but I'm not sure about Hungarian. If you do use music terminology this way that could be causing some misunderstanding in this post.



Well yeah I head a lot of misunderstanding, becouse in Hungary well call B note H, band Bflat B... so it looks like this... or not 

A B H C Cb D Db E F Fb G Gb


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## Naren (Feb 6, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Well yeah I head a lot of misunderstanding, becouse in Hungary well call B note H, band Bflat B... so it looks like this... or not
> 
> A B H C Cb D Db E F Fb G Gb



Uh, could you tell me "why"? 

I mean, first of all, that order seems weird.
A A# H Bb C C# 

Does the Hungarian alphabet go A H C D E F G B I J K etc.?

And seeing as B isn't flatted, why would it be called...? 

That's just really confusing.

PS: Your alphabet is wrong. The note that would come after A would be A# (A sharp). When counting up, it'd all be sharps. If you were counting down, it'd be flats. Like this:

G Gb F E Eb D Db C B Bb A Ab


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## Brett89 (Feb 6, 2007)

Naren said:


> Uh, could you tell me "why"?
> 
> I mean, first of all, that order seems weird.
> A A# H Bb C C#
> ...



Ohhh, sorry, but I don't know how to say it... and I'm realy a beginer, but the main thing is that the 7th string (lowest) on a guitar, or the 5th (lowest) string on a 5 string bass is H in hungary and in a few other countrys...


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## Durero (Feb 6, 2007)

Naren said:


> Uh, could you tell me "why"?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Note

Look at the section: "History of Note Names"


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## All_¥our_Bass (Feb 7, 2007)

Durero said:


> Brett do you use 'B' for Bflat and 'H' for B in your language?
> 
> I know that's the way it works in German, but I'm not sure about Hungarian. If you do use music terminology this way that could be causing some misunderstanding in this post.


 


Brett89 said:


> Well yeah I head a lot of misunderstanding, becouse in Hungary well call B note H, band Bflat B... so it looks like this... or not
> 
> A B H C Cb D Db E F Fb G Gb


 
 D'OH!! I should have thought a tad bit more before making my comment. I am an idiot.


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## Naren (Feb 7, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Ohhh, sorry, but I don't know how to say it... and I'm realy a beginer, but the main thing is that the 7th string (lowest) on a guitar, or the 5th (lowest) string on a 5 string bass is H in hungary and in a few other countrys...



No, that's cool. We all make mistakes, especially in the beginning - and especially with theory. Just remember that every note inbetween naturals can be referred to as a flat or a sharp (for example: Bb is also known as A#), but when going up, you always use sharps and, when going down, you always use flats. 

You seem to be doing pretty well for a beginner.



Durero said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Note
> 
> Look at the section: "History of Note Names"



I read it, but it didn't really say why... So I'm guessing that they don't know why. Maybe it's a "that's just the way it is" kind of thing.


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## Mastodon (Feb 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> No, that's cool. We all make mistakes, especially in the beginning - and especially with theory. Just remember that every note inbetween naturals can be referred to as a flat or a sharp (for example: Bb is also known as A#), but when going up, you always use sharps and, when going down, you always use flats.
> 
> You seem to be doing pretty well for a beginner.
> 
> ...



I think they did.



Wiki said:


> The remaining five notes of the chromatic scale (the black keys on a piano keyboard) were added gradually; the first being B which was flattened in certain modes to avoid the dissonant augmented fourth interval. This change was not always shown in notation, but when written, B&#9837; (B flat) was written as a Latin, round "b", and B&#9838; (B natural) a Gothic b. These evolved into the modern flat and natural symbols respectively. The sharp symbol arose from a barred b, called the "cancelled b".
> 
> In parts of Europe, including Germany, the natural symbol transformed into the letter H: in German music notation, H is B&#9838; (B natural) and B is B&#9837; (B flat).



Because the letter B with a natural symbol looked alot like the German letter H.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Feb 8, 2007)

Another reason for the H note is so that Bach could spell his name in notes. Other compserers that elude my mind at the moment have also done this.


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## Brett89 (Feb 18, 2007)

Well it' not about chords, but I gone tell you, I had my 4th or 5th guitar lesson and I LOVE IT!!!  All I have to do is practice... till DEATH  

My teacher dimensioned a song from the band Cream - Sunshine of your love... is not hard read music though 

So I learned the song and played for the teacher, after that, he suddenly said "OK Ákos now improvise a solo on it" . . . and I looked like WTF??? I never EVER played a solo, a never looked on a solo's tab, Soo a tried play something shity simple thing on it... but the main thing is that improviseing is not a soo difficult thing... just one thing, practive!


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 18, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Well it' not about chords, but I gone tell you, I had my 4th or 5th guitar lesson and I LOVE IT!!!  All I have to do is practice... till DEATH
> 
> My teacher dimensioned a song from the band Cream - Sunshine of your love... is not hard read music though
> 
> So I learned the song and played for the teacher, after that, he suddenly said "OK Ákos now improvise a solo on it" . . . and I looked like WTF??? I never EVER played a solo, a never looked on a solo's tab, Soo a tried play something shity simple thing on it... but the main thing is that improviseing is not a soo difficult thing... just one thing, practive!



God, SSOYL was the first song I ever learnt! Glad you're enjoying it dude!


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## Drew (Feb 20, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Soo a tried play something shity simple thing on it... but the main thing is that improviseing is not a soo difficult thing... just one thing, practive!



Well, it's both the easiest thing in the world, and the hardest. 

Once you get the hang of it, it's actually not very hard to do. However, you'll spend the rest of your life trying to get better, and if you're like me, you'll never be as good at it as you want to.


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## Brett89 (Feb 23, 2007)

What does polyrhytm mean?


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## playstopause (Feb 23, 2007)

^

I guess it's when there is several time signatures inside a single song or piece of music. Progressive + jazz music have a lot of rhythm changes to mark sections and/or change "color" within a (long or not) song.

As a simple example, a song could start with a basic 4/4 tempo.
Then, at some point, it could switch to 12/8 and so on...
I could be wrong though


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## Chris (Feb 23, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Thank you very much!
> 
> Well he showed me that some chords (I dont know the right word for that) can be moved on the fingerboard, like the E major chord, if I remember right
> 
> ...



We fucking love the fuckin' F-word around here man.


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## The Dark Wolf (Feb 23, 2007)

Chris said:


> We fucking love the fuckin' F-word around here man.



This can't be stated enough. 

I don't drop the f-bomb in RL a 10th as much as I do on here.


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## Chris (Feb 23, 2007)

The Dark Wolf said:


> This can't be stated enough.
> 
> I don't drop the f-bomb in RL a 10th as much as I do on here.



I do.  I tried giving up swearing for lent. I made it 10 minutes. I was actually in my car, by myself, on the way to work and some dude cut me off. I said out loud "Fuckin' dick", and immediately realized that I'd have to give up something else.


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## The Dark Wolf (Feb 23, 2007)

Chris said:


> I do.





I bet hanging around with you is like a real-life 'Good Will Hunting'. Smart, educated, and yet amazingly vulgar. All topped with a Boston-Irish accent. 





Get me drunk and I'm a damn sailor. (And no! Not in THAT Way! )


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## Chris (Feb 23, 2007)

Shit, I wonder if I like, have to ban myself for derailing my own forum's threads.


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## NegaTiveXero (Feb 23, 2007)

I think I curse in real life more than I do here.

I curse A LOT, but then again, I don't really consider it cursing, it's in the english language, fucking use it.



Chris said:


> Shit, I wonder if I like, have to ban myself for derailing my own forum's threads.





777th Fucking Post


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## Naren (Feb 23, 2007)

playstopause said:


> ^
> 
> I guess it's when there is several time signatures inside a single song or piece of music. Progressive + jazz music have a lot of rhythm changes to mark sections and/or change "color" within a (long or not) song.
> 
> ...



You are wrong, snagglepuss!! ... 

Actually polyrhythms are when there are two (or more) different rhythms going on at the same time. Meshuggah is the main example given on this forum (but, in world music, African music would be a good place to look). For example, they might have the drums playing in 4/4 and the guitars in 6/4. Or, they might have the guitars in 4/4 and the drums switching between 3/4, 6/4, 2/4, and 6/8 (and altogether, the drums all add up to the same amount of measures as the guitars). Or they might have one instrument in 4/4 and another in 3/4 but slower than the one in 4/4 so they match up.

Poly = many
So, I can see how you might think that it would mean time signatures changing throughout a piece of music.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyrhythm



wikipedia article said:


> Polyrhythm is the simultaneous sounding of two or more independent rhythms. Polyrhythms can be distinguished from irrational rhythms, which can occur within the context of a single part; polyrhythms require at least two rhythms to be played concurrently.
> 
> A simple example of a polyrhythm is 3 evenly-spaced notes against 2, with the 3-beat pattern being faster than the 2-beat pattern, so that they both take the same amount of time. Other simple polyrhythms are 3:4, 5:4, 7:4, etc. Where one of the parts involves an irrational rhythm, the resulting rhythm could be said to be an "irrational polyrhythm"
> 
> Another form of polyrhythm, which might also be termed polymeter, would be phrasing to suggest a different meter than the one being played by the rest of the ensemble. A common example of this in jazz would be phrasing quarter notes in groupings of 3 to suggest 3/4 time while the ensemble plays in 4/4. Compare with hemiola (not a polyrhythm).


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 23, 2007)

Naren said:


> You are wrong, snagglepuss!! ...
> 
> Actually polyrhythms are when there are two (or more) different rhythms going on at the same time. Meshuggah is the main example given on this forum (but, in world music, African music would be a good place to look). For example, they might have the drums playing in 4/4 and the guitars in 6/4. Or, they might have the guitars in 4/4 and the drums switching between 3/4, 6/4, 2/4, and 6/8 (and altogether, the drums all add up to the same amount of measures as the guitars). Or they might have one instrument in 4/4 and another in 3/4 but slower than the one in 4/4 so they match up.
> 
> ...



'Kashmir' is another classic polyrhythmic example. IIRC the guitar part is in 3/4, but the drums keep playing a 4/4 rhythm.


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## Naren (Feb 23, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> 'Kashmir' is another classic polyrhythmic example. IIRC the guitar part is in 3/4, but the drums keep playing a 4/4 rhythm.



 I didn't know I was regularly playing a polyrhythmic song. I've always thought polyrhythms would be hard and never bothered trying to try doing it before, but I used to cover Kashmir/mess around with it in 2 different bands I was in (TDW and I made a really heavy version of it, which we arranged in a very very cool way, but we never got to record it or anything. ).


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## The Dark Wolf (Feb 23, 2007)

Naren said:


> I didn't know I was regularly playing a polyrhythmic song. I've always thought polyrhythms would be hard and never bothered trying to try doing it before, but I used to cover Kashmir/mess around with it in 2 different bands I was in (TDW and I made a really heavy version of it, which we arranged in a very very cool way, but we never got to record it or anything. ).



 Man o man, it was the bomb diggity. It was penultiumate heavy.


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## Brett89 (Feb 23, 2007)

And how would you descripe tremolo picking?

It's just fast picking, when the notes blur together?


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 23, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> And how would you descripe tremolo picking?
> 
> It's just fast picking, when the notes blur together?



No, tremolo picking just means picking the same note over and over again as fast and smoothly as possible. It comes from mandolin technique, where the player has to pick in that way to create the illusion of sustain, as a mandolin possesses virtually none.


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## Naren (Feb 23, 2007)

The Dark Wolf said:


> Man o man, it was the bomb diggity. It was penultiumate heavy.



I loved how we arranged it for 2 guitars with me playing the higher parts with distortion, flanger, delay, and chorus and you playing the lower parts with just crazy heavy distortion. Indeed, it was penultimate heavy.


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## The Dark Wolf (Feb 23, 2007)

Naren said:


> I loved how we arranged it for 2 guitars with me playing the higher parts with distortion, flanger, delay, and chorus and you playing the lower parts with just crazy heavy distortion. Indeed, it was penultimate heavy.



Oh yeah, i can hear that already. *shiver* That rocked.



 We shoudl have done that when you were in town! Man, we gosta hang out a bit longer when next you blow into town, dude.


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## Brett89 (Feb 23, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> No, tremolo picking just means picking the same note over and over again as fast and smoothly as possible. It comes from mandolin technique, where the player has to pick in that way to create the illusion of sustain, as a mandolin possesses virtually none.



So... It means that, REALY fast and smooth and possibly? So it doesn't matter how much time I pluck the string, just the lenght of time I do it, or...? I can find the right words


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## Naren (Feb 24, 2007)

The Dark Wolf said:


> Oh yeah, i can hear that already. *shiver* That rocked.
> 
> 
> 
> We shoudl have done that when you were in town! Man, we gosta hang out a bit longer when next you blow into town, dude.



Definitely. The night you, me, and Nate hung out was the coolest time during my 2 week stay. We shoulda hung out more.

Besides, I still remember how to play about 70% of Kashmir.


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## playstopause (Feb 24, 2007)

Naren said:


> You are wrong, snagglepuss!!



Just what i thought.


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## Brett89 (Mar 4, 2007)

Two question...

If I tab down a song by hear, how can I check out that each note is correct? I tried that a played the song on my PC and played something like that on my guitar but I don't heard anything that sounded wrong... you know, there are the drum's and vocals too... so how sould I do it?

The other thing... there is a simple metal riff, how sould I find out the key of the riff? Hope you understand... 

Thanks un advance!!!


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## Metal Ken (Mar 4, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> The other thing... there is a simple metal riff, how sould I find out the key of the riff? Hope you understand...



This one, you just kinda analyze the notes and see what sharps and flats there are. Also, if you had a certain chord in mind with it, you could go by that too.


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## Brett89 (Mar 4, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> This one, you just kinda analyze the notes and see what sharps and flats there are. Also, if you had a certain chord in mind with it, you could go by that too.



 ... sorry but I don't understand this... here's an example..., the riff contains these notes: E,G,C, and A#... in which key is it in?


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## Metal Ken (Mar 4, 2007)

F Major/D Minor.


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## Brett89 (Mar 4, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> F Major/D Minor.



Now it's clear! Thanks!


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## Metal Ken (Mar 4, 2007)

no prob


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## Brett89 (Mar 7, 2007)

What does "groove" mean? How would you descripe it?


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## distressed_romeo (Mar 7, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> What does "groove" mean? How would you descripe it?



Think of it as being the 'pulse' of a rhythm...it's heartbeat, if that makes sense.

It's one of those things that's actually a bitch to define.


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## Brett89 (Mar 8, 2007)

Well I sould rename this thread to "quastions from Brett"... but I don't want to open a new one for this... so...

Is it fully legal to play other bands songs on a concert? I mean, you know I would play some songs from my band and some from other, bigger bands (Morbid Angel offcores


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## distressed_romeo (Mar 8, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Well I sould rename this thread to "quastions from Brett"... but I don't want to open a new one for this... so...
> 
> Is it fully legal to play other bands songs on a concert? I mean, you know I would play some songs from my band and some from other, bigger bands (Morbid Angel offcores



IIRC it's fine provided you don't record and release it.


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## Brett89 (Mar 12, 2007)

It's so disturbing that when I've got the right mod for guitarplaying, I turn on my combo, and turn the overdrive on (becouse I think I hear my mistakes better) I get a headache from it!  And it happens very often, but why? Is my tone so bad or what?  Sould I change something or it's not a big deal? You never had any problem like this?

Thanks in advance!


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## Durero (Mar 12, 2007)

Do you have too much 'Presence' or 'Treble' on your amp? Do you play extremely loud without using ear protection (musician's ear plugs?)
I can't think of any other reasons you might be getting a headache from playing.


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## Brett89 (Mar 12, 2007)

My amp hasn't got a Presemce, in the EQ, everything is in the middle, I tried that I cut the highs but It didn't help. Well, I have a 15W amp and I don't turn the volume more then 5... so I don't know  

My dumb brother taunt: ) and his band practice soo loud that after a song, I don't hear 100%-ly... they say it's not a problem for them...


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## distressed_romeo (Mar 12, 2007)

Incidentally, Brett, you might get more responses if you post new questions in their own threads.


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## Brett89 (Mar 12, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Incidentally, Brett, you might get more responses if you post new questions in their own threads.



Sorry for that... but I don't want to open a new thread for a quastion like this.


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## distressed_romeo (Mar 12, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Sorry for that... but I don't want to open a new thread for a quastion like this.



I wouldn't worry about it. There's no limit on the amount of threads you're allowed to start. A question's a question, even if it seems like a simple one. That's the whole point of the beginners' section.


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## Brett89 (Mar 31, 2007)

I have a quastion:

What notes can I add to the three main notes of a chord? For example I have a G major triad, it has a G, B and D note. I can only use these 3 notes + octaves or I can add other ones?


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## All_¥our_Bass (Mar 31, 2007)

Yes you can add other notes. And technically you can add any other note. But for now you might want to try adding the minor 7 (F), or the major 7 (F#). You could also try adding a major ninth (A), or a major thirteenth (E). I listed notes you can add to the chord that will tend to 'agree' with the chord well. There are many other notes you add to any but some of them can be quite dissonant, and require special care when used.

Gmajor = G B D
Gmajor, minor7 (usually abrev. 'G7') = G B D F
Gmajor, major7 (usually abrev. 'Gmaj7') = G B D F#
Gmajor, add9 (usually abrev. 'Gadd9') = G B D A
Gmajor, add6 (usually abrev. 'Gadd6') = G B D E

And here's a picture so you can play these chords.
(For six string so that people with out sevens can use them too)


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## Brett89 (Apr 4, 2007)

Could you tell me what does it mean "chord progression"? I only know that it means something like changing a few chords that contains the same notes... is it wrong? Or is it mainly about playing chords that are in the same key?

Thanks in advance!


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## All_¥our_Bass (Apr 14, 2007)

Chord progression don't have to have all chords in the same key (but that tends to be easier to work with). It just means playing chords in a predefined order.


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## Sebastian (Apr 14, 2007)

Just realised i play the guitar like... 1 year... (I suck)
At the beginning i learned some chords.. but now.. nothing i remember 

I just play - Suck at playing but still play...


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## Aghorasilat (Apr 15, 2007)

an easy way to learn how to "Comp" chords is to play the Root, 7th, & 3rd of each chord togther in that order....

so for example...

group 

an a - 7

A , G , C
G_5___________
D_5__________
A___________
E_5__________
B___________


d - 7

D, C, F
G_10____________
D_10___________
A____________
E_10___________
B____________
A dominant 7th

A G C#
G_6___________
D_5___________
A____________
E_5___________
B____________

etc 


keep it simple 3 note chords at first when learning 7th chords.

in the beginning before adding inversions and extentions. 

Once you get that you can learn what is called "drop 2 chords"
where you are inverting all the intervals..


"Drop2" chords 

B_5_8_12_13___________
G_4_5_ 9__12___________
D_5_9_10_14___________
A_3_7_10_14____________
Another cool approach is the Holdsworth "way"

Stack intervals...

stack Root, 4th, 5th, 7th

so a min = A D E G
E_3________________________
B_____5______________________
G__________7________________
D_____________7______________
A
E
B

I use these A LOT!

Peace 

Santiago Dobles
www.aghora.org
www.myspace.com/aghora


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## Durero (Apr 15, 2007)

^ Good post. Thanks Santiago.


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## Aghorasilat (Apr 15, 2007)

Durero said:


> ^ Good post. Thanks Santiago.



thanks dude.

I learned that stuff from mark white.


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## distressed_romeo (Apr 15, 2007)

Agreed. Good info. 

The 'stacked interval' approach is especially fun, especially if you use lots of fourths and fifths.

Quartal voicings (stacked fourths) are extremely versatile for everything from funk rhythms to jazz comping.

E----6-----
B----6-----
G----5-----
D----5-----
A----------
E----------
B----------

Try moving that around over a static root note, and see how it sounds...

Fifths are fun too...there's the 'prog rock power chord'...

D---9----
A---7----
E---5----

...which is basically stacked fifths, or a powerchord with an added 9. Kind of a trademark voicing for John Petrucci and Andy Summers.

If you want it to be specifically major or minor, you can add a third on top...

Minor add9

G---5----
D---9----
A---7----
E---5----

Major add9

G---6----
D---9----
A---7----
E---5----

Finally, here's one of my favourite chords of all time, courtesy of the mighty Holdsworth! It's based mainly on stacked fifths.

E----12----
B----12----
G----18--
D----16--
A----14------
E----12-----
B----------

Another strategy is some thing I call 'Lifeson chords'. The idea here is to take your regular voicings, and add open strings on top. You don't need to understand what they're called for now...just try this with all your regular triads and barre chords...

For example...

A regular A major barre chord...

E----5----
B----5----
G----6--
D----7--
A----7------
E----5----
B----------

The 'Lifeson' version...

E----0----
B----0----
G----6--
D----7--
A----7------
E----5----
B----------

By adding the top two open strings, the plain barre chord voicing becomes a nice ringy A Major add9!

It sounds like a lazy approach, but you can come up with some really nice sounds this way. Alex Lifeson is the undisputed master of this sort of thing (obviously!), as is John Petrucci (check out the strummy acoustic part in 'Voices' for a good example of this...if you're not sure of the part I mean, he plays it in his 'Rock Discipline' video when he's demonstrating his live acoustic sound).

Santiago, have you checked out Scott Henderson's 'Jazz Chord System' book? If you're into the Holdsworth style of chording, it's got some amazing voicings...


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## Aghorasilat (Apr 15, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Agreed. Good info.
> 
> 
> 
> Santiago, have you checked out Scott Henderson's 'Jazz Chord System' book? If you're into the Holdsworth style of chording, it's got some amazing voicings...



No I will pick it up. I actually know Scott though. Great guy & Player!
Huge influence on me!


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## distressed_romeo (Apr 15, 2007)

Aghorasilat said:


> No I will pick it up. I actually know Scott though. Great guy & Player!
> Huge influence on me!





It's well worth picking up, as it's not particularly expensive either.


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## Brett89 (Apr 22, 2007)

Hi there!

Today a wrote something, it sounds nice to me. It contains these "chords":

---------------------------------
----------------------------------
----------------------------------
---9------7-----7-----7----------
---7------5-----5-----6----------
---8------6-----5-----5----------

B A A A 
E D D D#
C A# A A 

First one: These are not real chords? They sound nice to me...

Secound: What can I solo on this? I don't find any scale that contains A-A#-B-C-D-D#-E . . . so, any idea what can I play? Or sould I use these notes?

Thanks in advance


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## DDDorian (Apr 22, 2007)

The first chord is Cmaj7 with no 5th, the second chord is A#maj7 with no 5th, the third chord is an inverted D powerchord with an octave A note on top and the fourth chord is an A "tritone" chord with the root note, flat 5th and octave. To solo over a riff like that, you can pretty much just take the Kerry King approach and hit random notes with lots of whammy bar action, that's what I'd do, heh.


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## Aghorasilat (Apr 22, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> What does polyrhytm mean?



Poly rhythm is when you super impose 2 or more seperate rhythms that have different tempos and or timing on top of a common pulse. So you would play for example a 4/4 and on top of that you are counting either a 3 against the 4 or a 2 against the 4 or a 5 or a 6 or a 7, etc...

Polymeter is when you superimpose a different time signature but with same tempo over a common pulse for example you play in 120 bpms 4/4 and another instrument is playing 7/8.



poly meter tends to give you more "over the bar line" stuff. Both are essential to know for good music  

I had to edit out my examples cause for somereason it wouldn't post as I had meant it o be expressed,


Peace

Santiago Dobles


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## DelfinoPie (Apr 22, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> BUT I'M SOO FUCKING HAPPY THAT I CAN LEARN PLAYING THE GUITAR!!!



I don't think I've come across this thread before but straight away thats the right attitude to have man. Its awesome you're loving your tuition  

I've recently started working on my chord construction and refreshing some of my theory knowledge so that when the time comes for my to record I can do some experiments 

Best of luck to you! Keep up the good work.


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## Brett89 (May 9, 2007)

At sweep-picking do they pick random notes from the scale or they pick chords?


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## Durero (May 9, 2007)

Sweep picking is a way to get from one string to the next with only one stroke (picking movement.)

So sweeping can be applied to anything that uses more than one string - scales, chords (arpeggios), random notes, anything.


Frank Gambale has many excellent instructional books & videos on sweeping.


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## Korbain (May 9, 2007)

ohh i'm terrible with chords. I can play alot of different ones, but i don't have a clue what they are lol. Sad considering i been playing guitar since i was 10 haha. I've always been a fuck the theory side of it person and just going hands on. Music is one thing i really shouldn't be like that with, timing is the only thing i know...This thread has inspired me to get my game on with learning more music/guitar theory


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## Naren (May 9, 2007)

Korbain said:


> ohh i'm terrible with chords. I can play alot of different ones, but i don't have a clue what they are lol. Sad considering i been playing guitar since i was 10 haha. I've always been a fuck the theory side of it person and just going hands on. Music is one thing i really shouldn't be like that with, timing is the only thing i know...This thread has inspired me to get my game on with learning more music/guitar theory



Even a little understanding of theory can go a long way. I'm not a master of theory, but I've studied theory through 2-3 different books, 2 music theory college classes, and a jazz teacher I had for about 2 months a long time ago. Even though I've forgotten a lot of it (I can barely remember how to read music), the knowledge I gained through it has made me a lot more comfortable with my instrument and a better song writer and improviser. Before I studied music theory, when I looked at the guitar's fretboard, I didn't see the relationships between the notes. Afterwards, I became able to see everything in how they related to each other and the way that anything can be moved anywhere on the fretboard.

Although I haven't studied theory in a while, I still recommend at least getting a basic understanding of chord structure, scale structure, interval relationships, and such other basic stuff that will really help you out.


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## distressed_romeo (May 9, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> At sweep-picking do they pick random notes from the scale or they pick chords?



What Durero said. It tends to be used to play arpeggios, i.e. notes from within chords, but it can be used for pretty much anything.

Brett, I think I said before, but you'd get more responses to questions like this if you just open a new thread for them.


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## Brett89 (May 9, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> What Durero said. It tends to be used to play arpeggios, i.e. notes from within chords, but it can be used for pretty much anything.
> 
> Brett, I think I said before, but you'd get more responses to questions like this if you just open a new thread for them.



Yes, I know I know sir , it's just a bad habbit... if I open a new thread in hungarien forums they kill me for it .


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## Naren (May 9, 2007)

Brett89 said:


> Yes, I know I know sir , it's just a bad habit... if I open a new thread in hungarien forums they kill me for it .



It's a bad habbit, indeed.  You'll have to break that one.


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