# How to start shredding



## JosephAOI (Mar 8, 2012)

Hey guys, I need some advice on where I should start as far as shred. I've always thought of myself as more of an intermediate player but recently I feel like I've been progressing a lot more and I need to set some higher goals for myself. Currently, my 'long-term goal' (Time span of next 1 to 3 years) is to get about as good as Jason Richardson (Ya know, the guy who used to be in BOO). The only thing is I don't know exactly what to practice (Maybe even how to practice 'correctly'). The way I've worked up my technical skills thus far has been from simply learning other people's songs as well as my own. Should I keep continuing this way and should simply be asking for what songs I should learn next? Should I get lessons? If so, from who? (Lol Jason himself) Should I be working through dvd's like Rock Discipline? Any help would be be appreciated!

TL;DR: Tell me how to be a shredder.


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## Pooluke41 (Mar 8, 2012)

I'm no shredder by any means, but I'd get a metronome and practice some strict alternate picking stuff to begin with, eg: Dream theater, Paul Gilbert, ect. Of course don't try and play the most hardest songs from these guys straight away, but songs like; Caught in a Web and Overture 1928 are really good to practice for Alternate picking IMO,

For sweep picking I'd just use a metronome to try and learn Scar Symmetry's Holographic universe.

EDIT: Start Really slowly.


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## Solodini (Mar 8, 2012)

Make sure you don't neglect your brain and ears while training your hands. Learn to think and hear fast, as well as just play fast. That's likely to be something you'll need to take slowly and work very deliberately at.

An important part of scalable technique at anything is to perfect the basic technique. Make sure when you're playing slowly that you're being economical with motion and that you're playing cleanly, muting unused strings, lifting fretting fingers cleanly so as not to pluck the string and make more noise. Don't overlook musicality on your quest for speed. While it's well and good to take a melody and speed it up, most people's ears won't appreciate that. A good method for writing shred solos is to write them like a musical acrostic poem, in that there's the main noticeable melody at normal melody speed and add depths of faster melody in between. That way, non musicians will appreciate it at the same time as musicians do.


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## Maniacal (Mar 8, 2012)

I have 2 books out that are aimed at teaching how to practice properly in the ways of shred.
News | ShredTraining.com


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## noUser01 (Mar 8, 2012)

Just small tidbit since I'm too lazy to cover a million topics in shredding... as an economy picker for 8 years I'm telling you, if you want to be a picker, learn to alternate pick. I've just started and I have to say for about 75% of what I play alternate picking is better.


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## niffnoff (Mar 8, 2012)

Metronome + Slow first + Scale patterns/Scales/Mode + Phrasing that is consistant = good shredder

Fast random chromatic what the fuckery = bad shredder


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## pitbulltodd (Mar 8, 2012)

ConnorGilks said:


> Just small tidbit since I'm too lazy to cover a million topics in shredding... as an economy picker for 8 years I'm telling you, if you want to be a picker, learn to alternate pick. I've just started and I have to say for about 75% of what I play alternate picking is better.



everyone is different but i couldn't get my speed up using alternate picking. it wasn't until i saw a frank gambale instructional on economy picking that i really started to have success.


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## Grimbold (Mar 10, 2012)

well first off
learn the natural minor and natural harmonic minor

then your shredocalypse shall BEGIN!!!!


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## ronjhoser (Mar 10, 2012)

Alternate picking vs. economy picking is really about more than speed. I find that when I sweep or economy pick (mini sweeps), it is very smooth and legato sounding. Alternate picking (especially as executed by Paul GIlbert or the like) is much more percussive, staccato, what have you. If you just wanna go fast... sweep. If you want more colors on your palate, learn many techniques. I think putting time in with the metronome is going to pay off no matter which direction you are picking...


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## StratoJazz (Mar 10, 2012)

As far as places to start, it's really hard to screw up. Any of the REH videos, guitar magazines, websites, or whatever else on shred are really easy to find. It's more a matter of practicing the shred material in a methodical and intelligent way.

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*Sweep Picking*

For example, instead of starting with 6(or 7) string sweeps, start with 3 string sweeps using this shape:

Picking directions(note by note) D H D D U P U U D Etc.

E------------------5---8---5-------------
B--------------6--------------6-----------
G-----5---7----------------------7---5--- Rinse and
D----------------------------------------- Repeat
A-----------------------------------------
E-----------------------------------------

D is down pick, U is Up pick, and H and P are Hammer, Pull off respectively. Try experimenting with different rhythms/Speeds whatever. Just go slow at first making sure you pick glides through the strings. Keep in mind that finger and pick synchronization is extremely important!!! 

I'd also advocate you practice with a metronome or some beat keeping device like band and a box.

When you get through that try this one:

Picking Directions D H D D D U P U U U D

E-------------------2---5---2----------------
B---------------3---------------3------------
G-----------4-----------------------4-------- Rinse and
D---2---5-------------------------------5---2 Repeat
A---------------------------------------------
E---------------------------------------------

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*Picking: Alternate Vs. Economic*



ronjhoser said:


> Alternate picking vs. economy picking is really about more than speed. I find that when I sweep or economy pick (mini sweeps), it is very smooth and legato sounding. Alternate picking (especially as executed by Paul GIlbert or the like) is much more percussive, staccato, what have you.



This is is really sound advice on this. The only thing i'd add as far as picking individual notes is that:
Strict Alternate picking tends to come more from the arm while Economic Picking comes more from the wrist.

Also if you got the alternate route, practice playing lines starting down and up. That way your picking hand isn't confined to one particular direction. That way you just "throw" your hand at the guitar and shred comes out. 

I've got an old post on this forum that deals with the basics of Economic picking if you want to check that out.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/mu...ues/148765-introduction-economic-picking.html

There is not really any wrong way to do it, it just depends on the sound your going for. I personally find economic picking is really great for playing angular jazz sax licks on guitar.

You may even find that you'll want to get in to hybrid picking so you can pick really large intervals easily.

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*Other Advice*

Solodini also points out being able to make sure that you can hear all of the fast lines you're playing. This is good advice, and i would like to add that:

_"The pursuit of technique should only allow you play the ideas that you are hearing in your head."_ 

Here is a real quote by the Jazz guitarist Pat Martino

_"The music has generated all the techniques I use. When I sit down to learn to play something . . . it is not because I want to master a technique. It is because I want to hear what an idea sounds like."_

The point is, that you shouldn't pursue more technique than you need to play the music that you want to play. So make sure that you learning how to shred reflects your interest in new ways to play music and not because some dude on the internet told you that you need to shred.


Hope this was insightful and helpful to you.
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## Aspiringmaestro (Mar 10, 2012)

Kudos on having a long term goal and a time frame that is long enough for you to make some serious headway toward it. 

The best thing that you can do is the one thing that none of us can do for you, and that's analyze your weaknesses. Can you sweep pick? Can you alternate pick at the tempo you want to? How's your timing? When you play songs do you have enough understanding of the music to explain the theory behind the music to someone else? All these questions and more should be asked and answered, and then the answers should be analyzed in order to form a game plan which will allow you to reach your goals. 

All of the above advice is good, but only you know what you need to work on most. 

If after reading these posts you still don't have any idea where to begin, then it's time to look into lessons.


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## noUser01 (Mar 10, 2012)

pitbulltodd said:


> everyone is different but i couldn't get my speed up using alternate picking. it wasn't until i saw a frank gambale instructional on economy picking that i really started to have success.



Oh no don't get me wrong I'm a much better economy picker, it's so much easier, but as far as what covers the most ground I feel alternate picking makes it much easier to play a lot of the "typical shred patterns". Also makes shredding two note per string patterns like pentatonic scales much easier.


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## Echo Field (Mar 11, 2012)

Sorry I didn't read the comments, but I don't think you need to take lessons, learn songs, songs with quick parts to them, slow them down then try to play them up to speed, try out some new techniques sloooowly, like economy picking, sweep picking, tapping, if you're familiar with the basic techniques in guitar then all you need is your own dedication to go through these exercises. Also practice a lot alternate picking, it won't be fun shredding if you're gonna attempt to downpick everything!


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## AndyLunt (Apr 9, 2012)

I have the same goal! Been obsessing over J.R's playing for the past year now and decided to start practicing furiously! My advice would be the usual, like everyone hear might've already said, starting slow with a metronome, but also try playing all your alternate picking exercises starting with an UP pick and going from there as well as starting with a down pick. It's a lot harder than you may think! (At least for me!)


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## Grimbold (Apr 9, 2012)

another thing
make sure a pick pattern seems logical to you
i often have had pick patterns forced upon that i didn't like so i changed them and went much faster


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## Solodini (Apr 9, 2012)

It's good to work at the less natural approaches, as well, in case you need to play something into it it out of it which requires a picking pattern or fingering which is not optimal preparation for what is to follow. Good to be prepared for difficult eventualities.


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## Konfyouzd (Apr 9, 2012)

Metronomes and scale/arpeggio etudes. Learn or make up some etudes/runs and practice like your next sexual encounter depends on it. 

Also, some techniques are easier to play faster than others. For instance I sweep and legato faster than I can pick. I feel like they're just a bit easier when moving quickly bc w sweeping you don't change directions til you reach the end and legato requires minimal picking to being with.

Alternate picking took some work. I had to start VERY slowly to get it clean. Also I've found that standing my fingers up similar to how I would if playing a piano makes positiin changes easier than if I allow them to lean/lay down like they might when riffing. I can usually achieve this by pushing my wrist forward a tad (learned this when reaching for the 8th string in runs.)


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## PortalNathrakh (Apr 9, 2012)

niffnoff said:


> Metronome + Slow first + Scale patterns/Scales/Mode + Phrasing that is consistant = good shredder
> 
> Fast random chromatic what the fuckery = bad shredder



Sup, I'm a bad shredder. It's more fun that way, even if it's easier and sounds worse. I've got good articulation, at least!


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## starslight (Apr 10, 2012)

Solodini said:


> A good method for writing shred solos is to write them like a musical acrostic poem, in that there's the main noticeable melody at normal melody speed and add depths of faster melody in between. That way, non musicians will appreciate it at the same time as musicians do.



To hear this approach in action, I recommend listening to lots of Steve Morse. He's so rhythmically tight that he can throw in uber-fast runs seemingly at will in between melodic fragments. He's doing it all over the new Flying Colors album--a relatively poppy project where "shred" would seem inappropriate. But because he has command of every possible rhythmic grouping at any tempo, he's always complimenting what the rhythm section is doing, always adding urgency to the music.

A younger guy who does this well is A.J. Minette. Listen to "Antebellum" and tell me those arpeggios don't add at least 25% more headbangability.

Paul Gilbert uses the term "fast guitar" instead of shred, and guys like him and Morse know how to be musical at all times, even when they're making guitar nerds crap themselves.


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## mr_rainmaker (Apr 10, 2012)

wanna learn to shred?
two words.


Joe Stump


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## Enselmis (Apr 15, 2012)

Grimbold said:


> another thing
> make sure a pick pattern seems logical to you
> i often have had pick patterns forced upon that i didn't like so i changed them and went much faster



This seems like it wouldn't really help you at all. The reason that you didn't like them is probably because you couldn't play them comfortably right off the bat because it was something unfamiliar. The whole point of practicing is to work on things that are unfamiliar and not stuff you can already do.

OP: Even if a pattern doesn't immediately make sense it could expand how you look at other facets of your technique by getting comfortable with it. I'm not saying learn a bunch of goofy nonsensical outside picking runs but definitely work on things you don't quite understand immediately and play what's on the page. If you wanna alter it, do it after you can play it the original way.


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## ImaDjentleman (Apr 15, 2012)

i think the answer is too simple to read all these supa long comments: picking, sweeping, string skipping, start slow and progress


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## Ryan-ZenGtr- (Apr 15, 2012)

As has been said, to play fast you must first learn to play slow.

For a long while I could play pretty fast, but lacked tone when playing slow. So I worked on vibrato, glissando and legato techniques to improve it. Once you can play "slow" so sweetly butterflies land on your headstock then you can start with the speed. In my opinion, for lead, speed is just to add excitement to your melodic statement, as Solodino described.

All that being obvious, best way is to find a selection of songs that are too hard to play. Work out the oder of them from least to most difficult and start learning them. Power tab and guitar pro are great for this.

Combine learning from others with scales, theory and ear training, focusing on timing, rythmn, melody and good music.

Check out some Shawn Lane while your at it!


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## JazzandMetal (Apr 16, 2012)

Metronome. Youtube. Dedication and multiple practice sessions a day. Learning songs. 

Keeping your inspiration and motivation up by listening and watching music and musicians frequently. Forcing yourself to practice when you don't want to. Learn your scales inside and out. 

That is what has worked for me.


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## mindwalker (Apr 18, 2012)

I also have problems shredding. Focusing mostly on alternate picking at the moment but I just can't seem to have a steady rythm, with all the right accents, without hitting the wrong strings, and properly jumping from one string to another..

It's been years... 2 or so that I just can't seem to evolve. Some say that if you just keep at it, eventually it cleans up but I think not... I also believe that if there is progress to be made, one has to go back to basics and start slowly.. and analyse himself properly, to see exactly what is going wrong. Is it the right hand ? The left hand ? The pick angle ? Hand position... etc etc.

But it takes time and motivation... if you just get home from work to play the same old stuff you don't evolve.. sometimes you have to play entirely new things or do seemingly boring exercises that should help achieve the master goal!

Just hitting the right strings is not everything... the accents have to be right too!


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## Grimbold (Apr 18, 2012)

you're on point
try buying a guide to shred
that might help you go places!


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## VBCheeseGrater (Apr 18, 2012)

Pooluke41 said:


> I'm no shredder by any means, but I'd get a metronome and practice some strict alternate picking stuff to begin with
> EDIT: Start Really slowly.



Yup, you always hear about the metronome but is's so true. For the longest time (like 10 years) i would get by on legato alone, my double picking stunk, and i ignored the metronome suggestions. Last year or so i've really tried to get up to speed with it, and the metronome helps a ton.

Once you bust out the metronome, you really realize where your weaknesses are, where you're sloppy, etc. its makes it easy to see your progress too, which is great. 

If you like to pick up the guitar and noodle instead of practicing like me, the metronome will give you a nice kick in the ass


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## MrPepperoniNipples (Apr 18, 2012)

like others said, the metronome is a big part

like i KNOW at some time or another you're gonna think "i don't need a metronome for this"
but you should get your lazy ass up and spend at the VERY LEAST 5-10 minutes with it

also, just because you're starting to shred doesn't mean that's all you can or should do
when you're not super-metronoming, i think your main focus should still be non-shred oriented licks

i've seen guitarists "solo" and all they do is play up and down as fast as they can up and down and it's boring and annoying as fuck


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## Stealthdjentstic (Apr 18, 2012)

I'm no shredder but I find just learning solos by whoever you dig works well and lets you incorporate some of their ideas into your playing.

For the longest time I dug the shit out of Muhammed from Necrophagist's solos so I learned a few of their licks and now all I can play is harmonic minor shit 

Some Cynic solos the one from Evolutionary Sleeper are similar to BoO's and a little easier/more interesting at the same time, check that out as a starting point. The BoO stuff isn't really really crazy unimaginably difficult like some of the stuff out there, just work at it and I think you'll surprise yourself.


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## Addison90 (Apr 19, 2012)

1. Learn basics by watching Paul Gilbert (Terrifying Guitar Trip), Richie Kotzen (Rock Chops), Michael Angelo Batio (Speed Kills), Michael Romeo, Frank Gambale, Andy Timmons & John Petrucci (Rock Disicpline) videos. These guys teach you how to do Alternate Pickings, Sweep Pickings, Economic Pickings, incorporating Scales, etc. 
(Paul Gilbert & Michael Angelo Batio videos are very useful.)

2. Pick your favorite shredder/guitarist.

3. Learn how to play like your favorite guitarist (by learning his songs or his style).

Tool for practicing : metronome.

don't forget 3P (Practice, Patience, & oPen minded).

*and anyway, Jason Richardson (BoO) is a huge fan of John Petrucci & Dream Theater


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## Davey (Apr 19, 2012)

ConnorGilks said:


> Oh no don't get me wrong I'm a much better economy picker, it's so much easier, but as far as what covers the most ground I feel alternate picking makes it much easier to play a lot of the "typical shred patterns". Also makes shredding two note per string patterns like pentatonic scales much easier.


Typically though you can't play the common pentatonic shapes economy picking. Two notes per string = Down, Up, Down, Up etc. consistently.

As for my take on economony vs alternate. Just go for whatever one comes naturally. Ever since I first started picking down and up I've always done economy picking but didn't realise it for years. I've tried playing strictly alternate picking but there's a lot of wated movement for my liking. However I don't think either way is better and I don't think switching from one to the other will magically make you play faster or better in any way. So just do what you do naturally.


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## mindwalker (Apr 19, 2012)

do you guys rest your picking hand forearm on the body of the guitar ? I find that sometimes when doing that and having to go from the lower to the higher strings, I need to push my hand down and with the forearm against the body it kinda sticks there and makes it hard to do the movement...

on the other hand I'm so used to rest the forearm on the body that I can hardly play any other way


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## Davey (Apr 19, 2012)

mindwalker said:


> do you guys rest your picking hand forearm on the body of the guitar ? I find that sometimes when doing that and having to go from the lower to the higher strings, I need to push my hand down and with the forearm against the body it kinda sticks there and makes it hard to do the movement...
> 
> on the other hand I'm so used to rest the forearm on the body that I can hardly play any other way


Yeah I rest my forearm on it too


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## Solodini (Apr 19, 2012)

I generally rest my forearm. Playing fingerstyle helps to decrease your reliance on that position, I find, as you rely less on being anchored for a back and forth motion.


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