# Jeff Hanneman’s wife selling TONS of his gear.



## Blytheryn (Nov 5, 2019)

https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/?s=Hanneman

I’d love one of those heads and a Flecktarn M-II...


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 5, 2019)

ooh lawd that blue crackle BC Rich is hawt


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## Blytheryn (Nov 5, 2019)

KnightBrolaire said:


> ooh lawd that blue crackle BC Rich is hawt



They haven’t listed the prices, so I’m terrified to even think what they’re asking for anything hahahaha!


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## possumkiller (Nov 5, 2019)

Didn't he sell a bunch of gear years ago? I seem to remember some of his ESPs on eBay.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 5, 2019)

possumkiller said:


> Didn't he sell a bunch of gear years ago? I seem to remember some of his ESPs on eBay.



He unloaded a lot of stuff to help pay for his treatment.


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## possumkiller (Nov 5, 2019)

He didn't have health insurance?


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 5, 2019)

possumkiller said:


> He didn't have health insurance?



With the kind of care he required he was likely still paying out of pocket significantly, even if insured. 

Even if he had "amazing" insurance, if they declined procedures he'd have to pay for them himself.


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## Andromalia (Nov 5, 2019)

> With the kind of care he required he was likely still paying out of pocket significantly, even if insured.
> 
> Even if he had "amazing" insurance, if they declined procedures he'd have to pay for them himself.



If I ever hint at ever emigrating to the US, please remind me of this post.

The guitars are going to go for outrageous prices so hard pass for me.


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## Louis Cypher (Nov 5, 2019)

I would love to have the money to be able to afford either of his Raiders guitars, even tho a big part of me feels very awkward when it comes to the thought of owning or buying a famous musicians gear when its being sold because the musican or their family need the money. I am completely guessing the reason for her selling and apologise if thats incorrect


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## Spicypickles (Nov 5, 2019)

Regardless of the imagery, I would love those flecktarn camo fiddles.


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## Airhead (Nov 5, 2019)

i ask the price for two of them:
https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-hanneman/ - 40k USD
https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-grey-camo/ - 75k USD


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## electriceye (Nov 5, 2019)

Airhead said:


> i ask the price for two of them:
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-hanneman/ - 40k USD
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-grey-camo/ - 75k USD



That's hilarious - and obscene.

BTW, I'm a HUGE crackle fan, but that BCR is hideous. I'd kill for the maple 10-string Bich, though.


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## JustinRhoads1980 (Nov 5, 2019)

Airhead said:


> i ask the price for two of them:
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-hanneman/ - 40k USD
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-grey-camo/ - 75k USD




That fuckin much.....


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## Blytheryn (Nov 5, 2019)

JustinRhoads1980 said:


> That fuckin much.....



Here I was thinking 10K tops...


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## Kaura (Nov 5, 2019)

Blytheryn said:


> Here I was thinking 10K tops...



I was thinking exactly 10k as well. It's crazy that LACS Ibbies can be found for less than 1k (apparently, that was as shocking to me as these prices, tbh) and I don't really see these being that much more special when it comes to the actual guitar.


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## Blytheryn (Nov 5, 2019)

Kaura said:


> I was thinking exactly 10k as well. It's crazy that LACS Ibbies can be found for less than 1k (apparently, that was as shocking to me as these prices, tbh) and I don't really see these being that much more special when it comes to the actual guitar.



I mean I get that they’re Hanneman’s used ESP Customs, with and that he’s passed... But who can afford a 75,000 dollar guitar?!?


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 5, 2019)

Those prices are asking prices, there's plenty of room to haggle. This isn't a gas station, it's a professional musical memorabilia reseller.


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## Viginez (Nov 5, 2019)

Airhead said:


> i ask the price for two of them:
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-hanneman/ - 40k USD
> https://www.rockstarsguitars.com/products/slayer/jeff-hanneman/jeff-hannemans-esp-grey-camo/ - 75k USD


dayum, i wonder how much the heineken sold for then. 100k?


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## Andromalia (Nov 5, 2019)

Blytheryn said:


> I mean I get that they’re Hanneman’s used ESP Customs, with and that he’s passed... But who can afford a 75,000 dollar guitar?!?



Lots of people. It's one fifth of a modern Rolls Royce.


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## ArtDecade (Nov 5, 2019)

Andromalia said:


> Lots of people. It's one fifth of a modern Rolls Royce.



Yeah, but I have never seen a single Rolls Royce in the parking lot of a Slayer concert.


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 5, 2019)

Andromalia said:


> Lots of people. It's one fifth of a modern Rolls Royce.


the real question is, do people with that level of disposable income actually like Slayer enough to pay it..


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## Frostbite (Nov 5, 2019)

That Camo ESP was something I wanted so bad back in the day


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## Trainwreck (Nov 5, 2019)

Ugh, I want one of the Marshall heads but for what they're asking for the guitars I'll pass.


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## Andromalia (Nov 6, 2019)

ArtDecade said:


> Yeah, but I have never seen a single Rolls Royce in the parking lot of a Slayer concert.


You just don't have access to the VIP parking.  I've seen a few luxury cars in the VIP parking at Wacken. Lambos etc.


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## ArtDecade (Nov 6, 2019)

Andromalia said:


> Wacken.



The Coachella of Metal - a place to be seen more than heard.


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## ikarus (Nov 6, 2019)

Some of the guitars would be confiscated by customs in my country immediatly...


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## xzacx (Nov 6, 2019)

ikarus said:


> Some of the guitars would be confiscated by customs in my country immediatly...



Confiscated and destroyed hopefully like the trash it is. I never understood why he always got a pass on that stuff—ruined the whole band for me. Didn't matter since I didn't think the music was very good anyway.


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## Vyn (Nov 6, 2019)

KnightBrolaire said:


> the real question is, do people with that level of disposable income actually like Slayer enough to pay it..



The answer to that question unfortunately is yes because those people believe highly in status symbols.


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## mlp187 (Nov 6, 2019)

I just read everything I could on the internet about Jeff, the SS inlays, and his WWII Nazi interest. I can find no redeeming reason for those inlays. Really poor taste in my opinion.
I don't think he heald any of Nazi Germany's ruling party's values in his heart. I just think he made a really myopic, shitty design decision. WTF man. 

If someone has more insight, I am all ears. But for me right now, fuck that guitar.


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## Spicypickles (Nov 6, 2019)

This subject has been picked apart a million times and the man that asked for them is dead. You won’t be buying them, money reasons or otherwise, move on.


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## Trainwreck (Nov 6, 2019)

Slayer always has been about shock value so why are the symbols such a surprise? Keep in mind it was a different world back in the 80's and 90's. If Jeff stated that he wasn't a Nazi then that was that. This day and age everyone is offended by anything they don't agree with which is downright scary.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 6, 2019)

Trainwreck said:


> Slayer always has been about shock value so why are the symbols such a surprise? Keep in mind it was a different world back in the 80's and 90's. If Jeff stated that he wasn't a Nazi then that was that. This day and age everyone is offended by anything they don't agree with which is downright scary.



Eh, it was more than "shock value" given how super into Nazi memorabilia and history Jeff was.

I don't think he agreed with the ideology, which is to say I don't think he wanted to be a Nazi. It was more of a morbid curiosity, much in the way people are obsessed with serial killers and death in general.

Honestly, I think the "I'll let you know what you're allowed to be offended about" police are just as bad as the "everything is offensive" sect. Which is to say, I think there are genuine reasons someone could be offended by the co-opting of Nazi imagery for kicks. There's just something trashy about it in an internet edgelord way. It just hasn't aged well.


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## xzacx (Nov 6, 2019)

Trainwreck said:


> Slayer always has been about shock value so why are the symbols such a surprise? Keep in mind it was a different world back in the 80's and 90's. If Jeff stated that he wasn't a Nazi then that was that. This day and age everyone is offended by anything they don't agree with which is downright scary.



It may have been a different world in the '80s and '90s, but that imagery was never acceptable—it's not like there's ever been any fuzzy middle ground with it. I haven't seen anyone say they were offended by it either, it's just about calling bullshit what it is. Jeff could say he's not a Nazi all he wants, but he was certainly OK with being mistaken for one—if you think those two things can be mutually exclusive, then we can agree to disagree.


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## mlp187 (Nov 6, 2019)

Spicypickles said:


> This subject has been picked apart a million times and the man that asked for them is dead. You won’t be buying them, money reasons or otherwise, move on.


No.


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## c7spheres (Nov 6, 2019)

You gotta really be a huge fan to want this stuff that's for sure.


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## oppgulp (Nov 7, 2019)

His father fought against the nazis during the second world war and Jeff started collecting nazi memorabilia after receiving it from him.


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## Andromalia (Nov 7, 2019)

I never got why Hanneman was such a controversial topic when some others weren't, most notably that little known guy


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 7, 2019)

Andromalia said:


> I never got why Hanneman was such a controversial topic when some others weren't, most notably that little known guy
> View attachment 74337



It's usually brought up at some point, like you just did.

Lemmy was smart enough to stay away from the more widely associated symbols of Nazism.

He kept it mostly to iron crosses and oak leaves. The main exception being the "Motorhead-orized" Reichsadler on the hat in your picture.

Like Jeff he was super into collecting Nazi stuff. Still pretty tacky in my opinion.


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 7, 2019)

xzacx said:


> Confiscated and destroyed hopefully like the trash it is. I never understood why he always got a pass on that stuff—ruined the whole band for me. Didn't matter since I didn't think the music was very good anyway.


yeah fetishization of the totenkopf symbol/einsatzgruppen is gross. It was just edgelord bullshit like george lynch's kamikaze guitars


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## efiltsohg (Nov 7, 2019)

xzacx said:


> Confiscated and destroyed hopefully like the trash it is. I never understood why he always got a pass on that stuff—ruined the whole band for me. Didn't matter since I didn't think the music was very good anyway.



because it gets reactions like this, literally the only reason


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## PunkBillCarson (Nov 7, 2019)

efiltsohg said:


> because it gets reactions like this, literally the only reason




Yep. Likely, Jeff would have laughed his ass off at seeing someone so pissed.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 7, 2019)

PunkBillCarson said:


> Yep. Likely, Jeff would have laughed his ass off at seeing someone so pissed.



That says worse about his character than the one offended by the co-opting of symbols used by Nazis.

People still use these symbols to intimidated and show hate towards actual human beings.

Using them as a stage prop is trashy and tacky in and of itself. 

Laughing at those made uncomfortable by those symbols, or more likely the reduction of them to a real life edgy meme.


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## JustinRhoads1980 (Nov 7, 2019)

To be honest i could care less about the whole nazi thing.


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## PunkBillCarson (Nov 7, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> That says worse about his character than the one offended by the co-opting of symbols used by Nazis.
> 
> People still use these symbols to intimidated and show hate towards actual human beings.
> 
> ...




I'm not telling him/her they can't be offended. I'm saying that that's the exact reaction he would have wanted and thus... even though he's in the grave is somehow living up to the Slayer name and apparently what he wanted out of life.


I will say that what's funny about this situation is the fact that Slayer is essentially one bad terrible taste joke around 40 years old and they are STILL garnering responses like that, and like I said before in this case, even from beyond the grave.


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## Thaeon (Nov 7, 2019)

KnightBrolaire said:


> yeah fetishization of the totenkopf symbol/einsatzgruppen is gross. It was just edgelord bullshit like george lynch's kamikaze guitars



Does anyone else find it ironic that Lynch's sigs were built in a Japanese factory?

Collecting it and having a fascination with it is one thing. Turning it into imagery you currently identify yourself with is something different altogether. I can understand Jeff's interest in it given the family history. Makes plenty of sense. Putting an SS on your signature guitar is not just historical interest. Marilyn Manson has used some of that to parody culture and make people think. Which I still find questionable. There are better ways of challenging people than making light of one of the greatest atrocities humans have openly committed to themselves.


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## JustinRhoads1980 (Nov 7, 2019)

Thaeon said:


> Does anyone else find it ironic that Lynch's sigs were built in a Japanese factory?
> 
> Collecting it and having a fascination with it is one thing. Turning it into imagery you currently identify yourself with is something different altogether. I can understand Jeff's interest in it given the family history. Makes plenty of sense. Putting an SS on your signature guitar is not just historical interest. Marilyn Manson has used some of that to parody culture and make people think. Which I still find questionable. There are better ways of challenging people than making light of one of the greatest atrocities humans have openly committed to themselves.




I am surprised the whole George Lynch kamikaze thing doesnt get people offended like the ss or totenkopf from hanneman.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 7, 2019)

JustinRhoads1980 said:


> I am surprised the whole George Lynch kamikaze thing doesnt get people offended like the ss or totenkopf from hanneman.



There have been threads about it in the past, Lynch just isn't as popular here, or specifically in Slayer threads. 

The fact that all folks do is chuck other examples of edgelord guitarists into the mix is fairly telling, as if you can't defend their actions default to the whataboutism fallacy.



PunkBillCarson said:


> I'm not telling him/her they can't be offended. I'm saying that that's the exact reaction he would have wanted and thus... even though he's in the grave is somehow living up to the Slayer name and apparently what he wanted out of life.
> 
> 
> I will say that what's funny about this situation is the fact that Slayer is essentially one bad terrible taste joke around 40 years old and they are STILL garnering responses like that, and like I said before in this case, even from beyond the grave.



Again, the joke was tacky in the 80's, trashy in the 90's, shitty in the 00's, and genuinely awful in the 10's. 

It's fine that it doesn't bother you. That's cool. But shrugging it off is just as insensitive as it's use to begin with. 

You can call something out for being wrong. Jeff was shitty for this. Was he a monster? I don't think so. Do I hate him or his band over this? Not really.


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## mpexus (Nov 7, 2019)

Maybe some Nazi supportes Groups can make a collect and buy them to display on their Meetings room.


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## NeglectedField (Nov 7, 2019)

It'd be disingenuous to say that going as far as to put Totenkopf/SS inlays in your guitar isn't playing with fire, even in the context of shock value. Hell, even people who genuinely lean that far politically are wary of what symbolism they use, even if only to avoid immediate public censure. Personally I'm not _viscerally_ offended but I would be like "careful now, might be more trouble than it's worth."


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## PunkBillCarson (Nov 7, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> There have been threads about it in the past, Lynch just isn't as popular here, or specifically in Slayer threads.
> 
> The fact that all folks do is chuck other examples of edgelord guitarists into the mix is fairly telling, as if you can't defend their actions default to the whataboutism fallacy.
> 
> ...





It doesn't bother me because I know the intent behind it. It's meant to get a reaction. It's trolling. That said, I also understand why people would be offended by it. I'm not saying one way or another that people should be offended or not, I'm simply pointing out that Hanneman is getting the response he wants/wanted. Do I personally agree with it? No. Do I hate him over it? No, I'm more indifferent than anything. Fact is though, Slayer is and always was a troll band. They made a living out of pissing people off. I will say it wasn't a particularly clever form of trolling. Anyone can sport Nazi shit just to piss someone off and I don't think it was particularly thought provoking either. Even if I had the money, I wouldn't own one of those guitars. One of those Marshall Heads, though?


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 7, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> There have been threads about it in the past, Lynch just isn't as popular here, or specifically in Slayer threads.
> 
> The fact that all folks do is chuck other examples of edgelord guitarists into the mix is fairly telling, as if you can't defend their actions default to the whataboutism fallacy.
> 
> ...


I mean, I used Lynch as an example because the Kamikaze guitar is equally in poor taste. It's basically glorifying suicide bombing if you want to be reductive. I find that equally as disgusting as glorifying Einsatzgruppen since they were mass murderers.


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## Alex79 (Nov 8, 2019)

Of course Jeff was a Nazi. 
How do I know?
He openly displayed Nazi symbols. 
Case closed.

Something the obvious is obvious for a reason. There's no need for all this "oh he was only collecting this for research" bullshit. 

If you play one of those guitars in public, you're basically asking for someone to throw something at you... or worse.


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## JustinRhoads1980 (Nov 8, 2019)

Alex79 said:


> Of course Jeff was a Nazi.
> How do I know?
> He openly displayed Nazi symbols.
> Case closed.
> ...




jEfF iS a nAzI


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## Thaeon (Nov 8, 2019)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I mean, I used Lynch as an example because the Kamikaze guitar is equally in poor taste. It's basically glorifying suicide bombing if you want to be reductive. I find that equally as disgusting as glorifying Einsatzgruppen since they were mass murderers.



Anything that glorifies the death of anyone is disgusting.


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## Humbuck (Nov 8, 2019)

I guess Lemmy was a nazi too.


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## Blytheryn (Nov 8, 2019)

Thaeon said:


> Anything that glorifies the death of anyone is disgusting.



Must be a HUGE death metal fan.


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 8, 2019)

Blytheryn said:


> Must be a HUGE death metal fan.


there's a difference between exploiting real events for pure shock value and glorifying death as a consistent artistic theme though. I say that as a big DM/TDM fan.


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## Humbuck (Nov 8, 2019)

I wonder if Rick Rubin knew Jeff was a nazi?


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## Blytheryn (Nov 8, 2019)

Humbuck said:


> I wonder if Rick Rubin knew Jeff was a nazi?


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## efiltsohg (Nov 8, 2019)

damn guys remember that time Jeff Hanneman put all those jews into ovens?


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## JustinRhoads1980 (Nov 8, 2019)

KnightBrolaire said:


> there's a difference between exploiting real events for pure shock value and glorifying death as a consistent artistic theme though. I say that as a big DM/TDM fan.




Mmmm i dunno. That kind of tends to walk a fine line since some bands do exactly that and get no angry mob at them


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## MASS DEFECT (Nov 8, 2019)

I look up to Jeff. Wrote some really nice riffs/songs and can write awesome lyrics. But I also despise him for using Nazi imagery. He probably wasn't really that emphatic and most likely didnt care about people's reactions with SS inlays and all the Nazi Insignia. He just liked it. And probably wasn't smart enough to know the difference between shock value and being racially offensive.

Just like Dime and his "rebel flag" guitars. Really talented guitarists but not really "that" kind of smart or thoughtful.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 8, 2019)

JustinRhoads1980 said:


> jEfF iS a nAzI





Humbuck said:


> I guess Lemmy was a nazi too.





Humbuck said:


> I wonder if Rick Rubin knew Jeff was a nazi?



Can you guys honestly say you knew them well enough to know what their beliefs were?

As for Rick Rubin, I wasn’t aware he was the head Jew.



efiltsohg said:


> damn guys remember that time Jeff Hanneman put all those jews into ovens?



If actually throwing a Jew into an oven is the gold standard for determining if one is sympathetic to Nazi views, then there are actual Nazis that don't fit that mold. 



MASS DEFECT said:


> I look up to Jeff. Wrote some really nice riffs/songs and can write awesome lyrics. But I also despise him for using Nazi imagery. He probably wasn't really that emphatic and most likely didnt care about people's reactions with SS inlays and all the Nazi Insignia. He just liked it. And probably wasn't smart enough to know the difference between shock value and being racially offensive.
> 
> Just like Dime and his "rebel flag" guitars. Really talented guitarists but not really "that" kind of smart or thoughtful.



While I don't doubt that Jeff wasn't the brightest star in the sky, he researched Nazism heavily and bought stupid amounts of extremely expensive Nazi trinkets. I think he knew a thing or two.

Dime was a dumb white dude who grew up in Texas when Dukes of Hazard was on the TV. Enough said.


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## Rosal76 (Nov 8, 2019)

Not 100% sure if Jeff Hanneman was racist or not but he had been photographed wearing a Los Angeles Raiders jersey with the number 34. That is Bo Jackson's number when he played with the Raiders from 1987 to 1990. That jersey number was also the number for Raiders running back, Chris Warren. Both Jackson and Warren are black. Warren did not have the accolades that Jackson had so more than likely, Hanneman's 34 Jersey is for Bo Jackson. And also, Warren started his NFL career way after Hanneman passed away in 2013.

I can't imagine Hanneman being racist and also wearing a NFL jersey whose number belonged to a black running back. But like Max said, "Jeff wasn't the brightest star in the sky" so who knows what Hanneman was thinking or if he even was thinking.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 8, 2019)

Rosal76 said:


> Not 100% sure if Jeff Hanneman was racist or not but he had been photographed wearing a Los Angeles Raiders jersey with the number 34. That is Bo Jackson's number when he played with the Raiders from 1987 to 1990. That jersey number is also the number for running back, Chris Warren. Both Jackson and Warren are black. Warren did not have the accolades that Jackson had so more than likely, Hanneman's 34 Jersey is for Bo Jackson. And also, Warren started his NFL career way after Hanneman passed away in 2013.
> 
> I can't imagine Hanneman being racist and also wearing a NFL jersey whose number belonged to a black running back. But like Max said, "Jeff wasn't the brightest star in the sky" so who knows what Hanneman was thinking or if he even was thinking.



Believe it or not, while the Nazis believed blacks to be "inferior" they were treated better than the jews, slavs, Romani, gays, and communists, as they were not marked for extermination, just deported with assets seized. 

The fact of the matter was there weren't very many people of African descent living in Germany at the time so they weren't a useful target for the Reich.


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## MASS DEFECT (Nov 8, 2019)

^I know white supremacists who always say they are close and have long friendships to black and asians. I particularly know of this neo nazi who wears NBA jerseys of Curry or Wade. When asked why he does that when he is openly a neo nazi, he retorted: "Our slaves play for our amusement."

Again, not proof that Jeff is racist. I just don't think the reason above is a sign that one isn't racist.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 8, 2019)

MASS DEFECT said:


> ^I know white supremacists who always say they are close and have long friendships to black and asians. I particularly know of this neo nazi who wears NBA jerseys of Curry or Wade. When asked why he does that when he is openly a neo nazi, he retorted: "Our slaves play for our amusement."
> 
> Again, not proof that Jeff is racist. I just don't think the reason above is a sign that one isn't racist.



Racism in itself is stupid. Don't expect logic from those who hold these views.

Also, you know what's racist? Being fucking racist. All these "rules" are manufactured to somehow absolve folks while really not proving anything. 

"He can't be racist because he had a black friend."

"He can't be racist because he didn't throw someone into an oven."

"He can't be racist because he enjoys professional sports."

It's all bullshit.


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## Meeotch (Nov 8, 2019)

As a Slayer fan who literally had no idea about Jeff's Nazi obsession prior to this thread, I'm not sure what to think at this point. Granted I have little interest post Seasons, but their early work always impressed me as being heavy AF, fast AF, and the lyrics put it into this evil category that was mostly gross but strangely enticing at the same time. 

I mean, Angel of Death is a giveaway but otherwise I just thought they were mostly into either Satan or murder/suicide/war. However, I do think there's a difference between writing songs about the Holocaust and putting Nazi emblems on your guitar. The former is hyper revealing art, and the latter is bordering on identity and support. So yeah it saddens me, but at the same time...it's metal. Fringy and at times totally inappropriate.


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## PunkBillCarson (Nov 9, 2019)

If it's any consolation to any of you, I'm a big H.P. Lovecraft fan.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 9, 2019)

PunkBillCarson said:


> If it's any consolation to any of you, I'm a big H.P. Lovecraft fan.



And I daily drive a Ford. 

The important thing is that we know these people were flawed. We don't hide from it or excuse it or try to revise history. We can say it's bad to have those beliefs and it's a black mark on their legacies, and that we should all strive to be better than they were. 

That's kind of the point of all this.


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## Alex79 (Nov 10, 2019)

Humbuck said:


> I wonder if Rick Rubin knew Jeff was a nazi?



I think it's best to separate the artist from whole band, at least to some degree.

Phil Anselmo/Jeff Hanneman/David Vincent have all said/done things that put them in the "Nazi" or "Idiot" camp, depending on how you want to see it; yet that doesn't mean I have to stop liking my Pantera/Slayer/Morbid Angel records. Plus, people can change over time - for better or worse. I tend to hope for the better!


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## PunkBillCarson (Nov 10, 2019)

Alex79 said:


> I think it's best to separate the artist from whole band, at least to some degree.
> 
> Phil Anselmo/Jeff Hanneman/David Vincent have all said/done things that put them in the "Nazi" or "Idiot" camp, depending on how you want to see it; yet that doesn't mean I have to stop liking my Pantera/Slayer/Morbid Angel records. Plus, people can change over time - for better or worse. I tend to hope for the better!




Of course the thing with that is even if a person can change, everyone treats them as if they never did. Take Liam Neeson for example. He himself stated how stupid he was in doing what he did way back when when his friend was raped by a black person and he grabbed a club and went out looking to beat the shit out of any black guy. He admits today that that was idiotic of him and that he's a changed man, but that doesn't matter. For some reason, there's this stance that we're only allowed to be better than someone before us or someone else, but not better than WE were before. If you're a racist once, apparently you're a piece of shit for the rest of all time, regardless of what you may have done to try and change for the better. Myself, I think that stance is complete bullshit.


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## Evil Chuck (Nov 10, 2019)

I bet Jeff would have been just gutted to know that some nerds on sevenstring.org didn't approve of his fretboard inlays or interest in WWII / NAZI paraphernalia. It's too bad we can't splay those people's lives out for all the world to judge them and their mistakes, isn't it? If you manage to make it through life without ever fucking up, please let the rest of humanity know your secret to being perfect.


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## BornToLooze (Nov 11, 2019)

Personally, I agree with what Lemmy said. The bad guys always have the cool looking shit.


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## mpexus (Nov 11, 2019)

BornToLooze said:


> Personally, I agree with what Lemmy said. The bad guys always have the cool looking shit.



There are several reason for it, one is:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Boss_(fashion_designer)


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## Wolfhorsky (Nov 11, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Dime was a dumb white dude who grew up in Texas when Dukes of Hazard was on the TV. Enough said.


It must be just trolling. It must be. If it is a legitimate opinion of this forum’s mod, it is very very sad. Did we, as the small group of hobbysts, stoop so low? I’m disgusted by this.


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## Chokey Chicken (Nov 11, 2019)

The point made is just that dime, for all intents and purposes, was just an everyday white dude from the southern US. That's why he rocked the Confederate flag. Hanneman actively sought out evil imagery for the sake of being edgy and giving off a sinister/evil vibe. 

I like Dime, I dislike hanneman.


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## Fred the Shred (Nov 11, 2019)

Honestly, it's super easy to understand why Jeff's choices of inlays and whatnot are shocking and offensive to some people. They are basically littered with nazi symbols with a particular emphasis on what is likely to be the most infamous division of the most infamous nazi unit, with countless heinous acts to their name. Isolated, the Totenkopf is just like the Iron Cross - it vastly predates nazi Germany as a military insignia, and has no specific ties to any historial atrocities -, but when you shove the SS monicker in there, then it is super clear you DO want to evoke the SS-Totenkofverbände, and there is no ambiguity left in there for the sake of controversy, just a very objective reference to the worst kind of people, responsible for the torture and death of many, many thousands of people.

I always found it was in real poor taste, and it's really taking things to a pretty pointless extreme for the sake of controversy. People who have known me for a while know that I'm a complete WWII warbird nut, and I have guitars painted with various schemes from planes I love, including a Messerchmitt Bf109. There isn't a swastika in sight on said guitar, for obvious reasons, and that way I can have a reference to a plane I love without any kind of "NAZIS ARE COOL MMMKAY?" association (they're fucking not), unless you want to really try to tell me the plane has political leanings, which could even be the case but none of the ones I've been close to were very talkative.  I typed this and now I remember how the Hellcat version of that guitar eluded my grasp. Damn.

Anyway, stuff like the Kamikaze guitar, or seeing random military references like the Iron Cross, which are pretty party / regime agnostic by themselves, is super harmless if controversial to some, but let us not kid ourselves when it comes to really crossing the line with the sort of stuff Jeff decided to use - he knew and embraced just how much of a shitstorm and discomfort that would cause.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 11, 2019)

Evil Chuck said:


> I bet Jeff would have been just gutted to know that some nerds on sevenstring.org didn't approve of his fretboard inlays or interest in WWII / NAZI paraphernalia. It's too bad we can't splay those people's lives out for all the world to judge them and their mistakes, isn't it? If you manage to make it through life without ever fucking up, please let the rest of humanity know your secret to being perfect.



So it was a "mistake" and "fuck(ed) up"?

Progress!



Wolfhorsky said:


> It must be just trolling. It must be. If it is a legitimate opinion of this forum’s mod, it is very very sad. Did we, as the small group of hobbysts, stoop so low? I’m disgusted by this.



You have neither a working understanding or context to what I said.


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