# Picking - butt or nose - pinky hook or fist?



## Oogadee Boogadee (Mar 9, 2006)

In regards to picking motion (from the picking poll thread), I'm mostly a fingers/wrist combo. depends on what i'm playing, obviously.

It makes more sense to start a new thread for this question:

Who does the pinky hook on the high E? I do it a lot, but recently tried to stop. I felt a lot more relaxed. A little less control, b/c I'm just not used to it - but control can be learned, so I'm thinking of making the conscious effort to curl all my fingers in. With that open pinky, you have to have your middle and ring fingers open as well and I realized I had to use extra muscles to hold them high enough to avoid inadvertant contact with the treble strings. once i brought my pinky in, allowing me to tuck the rest in and make a nice relaxed fist, i felt my whole forearm relax and I felt like i was attacking the strings with more power and getting a more robust and even tone on 16th note alternate picking chugga chuggas (like the holy wars instrumental rhythm). 

Also, with the tension of holding the fingers up, i also felt like (when i was hooking during alternate rhythm picking) the down stroke was fine, but the upstroke was weaker since, with the hook, the fingers were slowing the hand down since they were literally being stretched apart. 

Noodles watched my play the HW riff a few months ago, saw my arm tension, felt my shoulder, told me it was rock hard (and big) and that I had to relax (i agreed). Since then, I'd try to relax from the top down (shoulder down to hand) and had little success. I actually had more results by just focusing on deep breathing. Anyway, now I'm thinking about totally converting to a closed picking fist and relaxing from the bottom up (hand to shoulder), since the relaxation I felt in my whole hand and finger extensors (in the forearm) was so immediate - and cool.

anybody else feel this way?

Oh, this is all in the context of rhthym playing. if you prefer different techniques for lead v rhythm, please explain.

i'll make it a poll, for fun...


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## distressed_romeo (Mar 9, 2006)

Interesting...I've always anchored my pinky, but on the guitar body rather than the high E. I literally can't play any other way, as it's the only way my hand stays relaxed. If I play with a floating hand I find myself tensing up. I also curl my remaining fingers in, but it's not quite the fist posture you describe. The guy I've seen with the closest pick hand posture would be John Petrucci, although I evolved this style on my own rather than emulating him.
I know it sounds wierd, but this is the position I've found (after going through a few different phases over the years) that allows me to stay relaxed, and keep control over the pick.


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## eaeolian (Mar 9, 2006)

Noodles does it all. He's a slut. 

I don't actually do either - if you watch, my fingers splay out, except for the middle one, since it's holding the pick - sort of like the "devil sign" with the ring finger extended. I use my pinky and the edge of my hand to mute.

I don't recommend anyone else try this. 

Staying relaxed is key, though - I never tense either hand or arm when playing, which is surprising considering how hard I whack the strings. Everything's much smoother and controlled when you're relaxed...


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## Oogadee Boogadee (Mar 9, 2006)

crap. i don't know. i wrote my post from work. i should've waited till i got home so i could hold a guitar.. maybe even snap a photo. my other fingers that are out *might* be on the strings, muting them, or they might be semi-curled. I play guitar so infrequently that I can't even remember how i pick!  I do know that I'm a thumb/index finger dude. Mike, i don't even know how you pick with your middle and thumb. That feels totally weird.


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## Drew (Mar 9, 2006)

"I'm a hooker who fists occasionally." 

Because, frankly, how could you not click that?


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## Leon (Mar 9, 2006)

_I met a boy wearing Vans, 501s, and a dope beastie-tee, nipple rings, and new tattoos that claimed that he was OGT, from '92, the first EP. and in between sips of coke he told me that he thought we were sellin' out, layin' down, suckin' up to the man. Well now I've got some advice for you, little buddy. Before you point the finger you should know that I'm the man, and if I'm the man, then you're the man, and he's the man as well so you can point that fuckin' finger up your ass._

i'm a hooker... with a penis 

i hold the pick with my thumb and first finger, then my second and third finger kinda float, and my pinky is somewhat an extension of my palm, for muting.


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## D-EJ915 (Mar 9, 2006)

I don't understand how people can hold the pick and then have all their other fingers out all over the place...it's just not comfortable, lol. Anyway, I keep my hand in a fist and because of that I get some nasty scrapes and cuts on my knuckles, lol.


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## bostjan (Mar 9, 2006)

I dunno. This is me, typically.
















this one was a little awkward holding the camera while picking


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## Regor (Mar 10, 2006)

Most of the time I'm anchored with my pinky on the guitar's body. Definately not the E string. Palm muting with my right hand, involving no pinky whatsoever. But sometimes my pinky will come off the guitar's body, and i'm still able to play. It doesn't feel awkward or anything, but I don't necessarily adhere to 'have to do it this way' or anything. But I do feel more control while picking when my pinky is anchored.


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## Drew (Mar 10, 2006)

What guitar is that, Bostjan? looks like a 7620 by the pickups and hardware, but it's way too red for a VK...


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## forelander (Mar 11, 2006)

my pinky is lightly touching something usually, with half my palm muting the higher strings. sometimes it hooks under without my noticing but generally its somewhere on the body, not anchored as such, but i play with an open hand. I find playing with a fist makes me much more tense.


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## maskofduality (Mar 11, 2006)

i'm a hooker. <-- isnt their a more dignified way of saying this without feeling like a common street whore? how am i supposed to explain myself to my extremely feminist friends? 

that said i used to be a fister but after learning to do it my teacher's way (hooking on the guitar body and resting palm just barely behind the bridge) i've found that i've had stronger pick strokes and less muting problems. not to mention i can trem pick without hurting my entire arm.


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## Kotex (Mar 16, 2006)

I pick mostly with all my finger spread out not touching anything. Sometimes my pinky will rest of the body though. But not very often.


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## bostjan (Mar 24, 2006)

Drew said:


> What guitar is that, Bostjan? looks like a 7620 by the pickups and hardware, but it's way too red for a VK...




It's a 7620. At the store, they told me it was red. When I took it home, I got ragged on for it being purple. I honestly have no idea what color it is, but It says VK in the serial number.

Sorry I took like a month to respond to that, but I just now saw it.

I'm searching to see if there was a similar question polled yet about the left hand thumb....


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## God Hand Apostle (Mar 25, 2006)

I was just going to start a thread about this, but here you go...

I started out as a hooker resting on the pinky: 

Then I found Yngwie and tried to copy his style to a T, so I began hooking with resting on the ring finger with the pinky hovering over the volume palming right where strings come off of the bridge: 

Then I got into fusion...Mostly Gambale and Holdsworth...But as far as picking is concerned, I spent the last 2 years trying to copy Marshall Harrisons picking hand (Fister, picking over or close to the neck pickup pretty much Gambales style). Hence the other polls where I admit to being a strict economy picker with hybrid picking.

Tuesday of this week I downloaded a concert of Disgorge in Melborne, and instantly wanted to PLAY death metal again (Remember, Ive been practicing Jazz/Fusion for 2 years). So my fist style was not cutting the aggressive picking/ palm muting required, so I started to do the Yngwie again.

It sucks because I DO NOT want to have 2 differnet picking styles. I want one that does all, but they sound different. If you wach Rusty Cooley, he has 2 or 3 differnt picking styles that he uses (most evident when he does 2 or 3 string arps, but when he BURNS he fists).

Im kinda making this face when playing out of frustration today.


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## Mastodon (Mar 26, 2006)

My hand seems to float alot but when I do anchor my fingers I usually hook them into the lower cut away for some reason. It's usually when Im playing clean stuff like jazz, it keeps me picking right above the neck or neck pickup.


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## Hexer (Apr 7, 2006)

hm, I'm mostly a hooker I'd say, but I dont anchor my pinky on the high E-string, I usually have it on the bottom of the bridge-humbucker. when doing palm-muted rythm stuff I don't hook and my hand is completely "free" when playing single chords or stuff like that (where you dont need the controll)


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## Roland777 (Apr 7, 2006)

I tend to hook my ring-finger on the high B whenever I can. Gives me a good pivotal point on all the lower strings, except for the low B. Then I usually anchor around the G-string. For any shredding on the high B and E, I shape a fist.


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## abyssalservant (Apr 12, 2006)

eaeolian said:


> Noodles does it all. He's a slut.
> 
> I don't actually do either - if you watch, my fingers splay out, except for the middle one, since it's holding the pick - sort of like the "devil sign" with the ring finger extended. I use my pinky and the edge of my hand to mute.
> 
> ...



Amazing. I do the exact same thing. Except for the pick grip, which is more normal.


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## nitelightboy (Apr 12, 2006)

For leads or more technical precise rythm work, I like to keep my pinky mounted to the guitar, usually between the bridge and volume pot. For heavy riffing that isn't uber technical or difficult, I tend to fist, unless I have to do a ridiculous amount of muting, then I kind of do both....explanation....My thumb and index on the pick (DUH) my middle and ring fingers curled in tight and my pinky extended and loosely hanging onto the body.

For acoustics though, it's all about fisting, good and hard.


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## Michael (Apr 13, 2006)

My pinky kind of floats with my ring finger, sometimes they will hook a little bit but not too much. It kinda looks like Francesco Fareri's picking hand a bit. Except my fingers aren't as straight as his.


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## Bregaladar (Jun 2, 2006)

Sometimes I anchor my pinky on the body, sometimes it floats with my middle and ring fingers. Fisting feels silly.


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## JPMDan (Jun 16, 2006)

I usually play with my hand open so I guess I'm a hooker but sometimes I play with my hands closed, other fingers never fucked up on other strings though.


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## Buzz762 (Jul 10, 2006)

I hook my pinky onto the bridge.


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## Luvuvibanez (Jul 28, 2006)

I hold the pick with my thumb, index, and middle and bend it slightly with my pinky and ring fingers extended away from the guitar think holding a tea cup or whatever), I have no idea why.


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## rummy (Sep 25, 2006)

I recently converted to a fister. It seems like I can relax my right shoulder better that way. It's still awkward, but I am getting used to it.


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## includao (Sep 29, 2006)

depends on the technique/situation. 

you can play fast tensing your fist a little bit


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## JoryGriffin (Oct 4, 2006)

Definitely a Hooker... People have criticised me since i started but i see its not just me


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## Trespass (Mar 9, 2008)

I used to fist, but I played my electrics unamplified for about a year, so I had no muting skills at all. So I naturally progressed into a Steve Morse/Yngwie type thing, but with fist. Then I eventually said fuck it, and now have a makeshift Jennifer Batten thing I throw on for lead, and I play the acoustic style which has no muting at all. (Al Di Meola, palm is behind bridge)

For rythmn, my hand is all over the place. When playing flamenco rhythmns, my hand will be palm muting the 12th fret at times


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## Zepp88 (Mar 9, 2008)

Two years later 


Noodles still does it all.


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## sanchezero (Mar 9, 2008)

nice, undead thread. 

i don't anchor, no hooking here. i'm pure as the driven snow.

i do however fist for stuff like sweeping and any single note stuff, especially on the skinny strings. when i need to palm mute or for most strummy shite i use my pimp hand. every one needs a good slap now and then.


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## stubhead (Mar 9, 2008)

I'm moving more and more towards a floating fist, but I also use my middle and ring fingers to pluck notes with the pick at speed, so I'll "anchor" any which way. The two guitarists who influenced me the most were John McLaughlin - total fist; and Steve Morse - rock solid pinky anchor. They're both fast as hell and can play just about anything, so figure out what _that_ means.... 

If you're going to fist, it's really helpful to have your forearm anchored or at least brushing the guitar body, I specifically prefer guitars _without_ the Stratty forearm contour. That closed fist position first came up with jazzers playing fat archtops sitting down, it's sure not going to work playing your guitar down at your knees like Jimmy Page. A large percentage of the problems guitarists have seem to come from practicing stuff up in one position, then trying to play it in a very different position with a band or onstage. Unless you're planning on bringing your favorite chair to your gigs, you have to practice standing up at least some of the time.


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## HotRodded7321 (Mar 9, 2008)

Drew said:


> "I'm a hooker who fists occasionally."
> 
> Because, frankly, how could you not click that?



I'm with Drew on this one.


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## oompa (Mar 9, 2008)

where is the kirk hammet judo chop alternative??  

during my introduction to guitar i was into metallica so like kirk i kinda kept the rest of my fingers rigid, chopping air, mosquitos or knobs or whatever i hit. after a while i realized that i almost cramped up with tension so i started relaxing and now im a a hooker who says no to fisting.


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