# Trem Picking Stamina/Speed



## noUser01 (Jan 13, 2014)

We recently wrote a part for my band that has some pretty insane trem picking and to be honest I don't even know if it's humanly possible.  I need some good tips for practicing my tremolo picking speed and endurance. Right now I'm just playing the part we wrote at a moderate speed, trying to focus on staying relaxed and making small movements but after a few days I'm not making a lot of progress. Just wanna make sure I have it nailed before we go into the studio but also don't want to overexert myself and cause any injury.

As a side note, for fun, post the fastest trem picking you've ever heard in a song!


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## Svava (Jan 13, 2014)

Whatever technique you are working on, try doing it on a nylon-string classical.

Whenever I do this I just get massively better on my electrics. Especially when it requires some complex muscular stuff like sweep picking or big chords or trem picking/speed picking.

Try it xD


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## ghost_of_karelia (Jan 14, 2014)

My suggestion would be to learn anything by Amon Amarth, those guys are nuts when it comes to picking, and they use it a hell of a lot in even their most basic songs. Give it a go man, see if it helps


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## Maniacal (Jan 14, 2014)

I'm currently learning this, 264bpm 16ths:



This is probably the fastest, clean alternate picking I have heard. It's fake, but still sounds awesome.

The part at 3.08 is insanely hard.


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## lemniscate (Jan 14, 2014)

There's a few things I've noticed about speed picking, from studying Morbid Angel. One thing is, you're gonna need to find a good pick. Jazz III XL, the small fat Stubby picks, V-Pick Screamer, and Dunlop Sharps work best for me. You need one that pushes through the strings, instead of a super light pick, that flexes more than the strings. 

The concept of completely relaxing becomes completely impossible, at certain speed. When I try to play a song like the "Lions Den" by MA, I can relax while trem picking the pedal notes, but when a chord comes up, I have use the "digging in" motion. 

The length of your guitar strap makes a huge difference.


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## ghost_of_karelia (Jan 14, 2014)

Really looking forward to seeing feedback from this thread, I'm really curious as well to know whether people have any tips for tremolo picking and fast picking in general. I use standard Jazz III picks exclusively because I believe they build strength in my picking hand, and I find it very hard to maintain a consistent speed, good musicality and general pick attack consistency during high-speed sections.


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## Adam Of Angels (Jan 14, 2014)

Maybe not THE fastest, but this is pretty obnoxious - starting at 0:26


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## vilk (Jan 15, 2014)

^What's most impressive about that is that it's freaking palm muted!


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## Mega-Mads (Jan 15, 2014)

I have played in black metal bands since i was 15. If you want to trempick single notes or power chords, then find a place to anchor your wrist.

If you want to see a decent trem picking technique, then watch Michael Paget from Bullet for my valentine. I really like the way he uses his finger joints!


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## The Reverend (Jan 15, 2014)

I think at a certain point you have to abandon classical good technique. Some people are just genetically gifted, and make whatever it is they do look effortless, while still having good technique. I personally have to just get the f--k in there when the tempo is really insane.


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## chopeth (Jan 15, 2014)

Get Ihsahn Scattered ashes tab book and let the fun start


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## Rizzo (Jan 15, 2014)

^is that you?
Holy shit!
And that Schec! :O


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## noUser01 (Jan 16, 2014)

Thanks guys, gonna try this stuff out and spend some time working on trem picking in a few different ways (medium speed for a longer time for endurance, fast speed for short bursts, etc.) and see if tackling the technique from several angles helps.


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## Maniacal (Jan 16, 2014)

Mix things up. Some days do long sets at a slow tempo, other days work on pushing your maximum tempo in short bursts (with a controlled technique)

Keep track of your progress too.


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## SeditiousDissent (Jan 16, 2014)

I think if you're looking to build up stamina, you should start with some not-as-extreme trem picked passages. I always liked to play along to Metallica's "Disposable Heroes" or "Fight Fire With Fire." They both have some killer alternate picking/galloping sections and you get a break during the chorus. 

IMO, Metallica has some of best rhythm guitar practice anyone could ask for. It's not terribly difficult, primarily riff based, fun to play with and Hetfield is simply a rhythm guitar master.


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## chopeth (Jan 17, 2014)

Rizzo said:


> ^is that you?
> Holy shit!
> And that Schec! :O



Yeah, finally sold it and bought another SLS, with passives!


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## Rizzo (Jan 17, 2014)

chopeth said:


> Yeah, finally sold it and bought another SLS, with passives!


Nice choice to me!
Awesome technique you got in the video up there though


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## chopeth (Jan 17, 2014)

Rizzo said:


> Nice choice to me!
> Awesome technique you got in the video up there though



Black metal made it, I'm humbly trying some Belphegor now and not easy though, also recommendable to develop tremolo stamina, actually hundreds of bands. But Emperor made the start for me,


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## MetalElitist (Jan 17, 2014)

one time i did 16th notes at 315 bpm


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## noUser01 (Jan 19, 2014)

chopeth said:


> Black metal made it, I'm humbly trying some Belphegor now and not easy though, also recommendable to develop tremolo stamina, actually hundreds of bands. But Emperor made the start for me,



I started learning Transylvanian Hunger and that was a great workout, but I want to start learning some Emperor since it's got a lot more of the stuff I like to use in my own playing with single note trem picking.


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## chopeth (Jan 20, 2014)

ConnorGilks said:


> I started learning Transylvanian Hunger and that was a great workout, but I want to start learning some Emperor since it's got a lot more of the stuff I like to use in my own playing with single note trem picking.



Get Ihsahn's book, he transcribed it himself, so no flaw in it. Very cheap for a lot of good songs there. Easy ones like "the majesty of the nightsky", "I am the black wizards" or "Ye entranceperium" a couple for 7 strings and some harder as "the tongue of fire" or "the loss and curse.."


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## noUser01 (Jan 27, 2014)

chopeth said:


> Get Ihsahn's book, he transcribed it himself, so no flaw in it. Very cheap for a lot of good songs there. Easy ones like "the majesty of the nightsky", "I am the black wizards" or "Ye entranceperium" a couple for 7 strings and some harder as "the tongue of fire" or "the loss and curse.."



Thanks man I will, seems like a solid investment.


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## Repner (Jan 27, 2014)

I find this song really tiring to play. Fast galloping, but so controlled.


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## noelcnguyen (Jan 29, 2014)

Repner said:


> I find this song really tiring to play. Fast galloping, but so controlled.




I wanted to be a lead player (still do!), but I definitely started playing all Metallica songs and Iced earth songs. That built my rhythm playing like no other.


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## Berserker (Jan 30, 2014)

I find this is pretty good for trem picking stamina. It's not that fast but you don't get a chance to breathe


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## TylerEstes (Feb 1, 2014)

Maaneskyggens Slave cover - YouTube

Here's a shitty video of me badly playing a cover of Maaneskyggens Slave by Gorgoroth when I was a teenager. The camera was so shitty that my room was pretty bright in spite of not being able to see most of the video. BUT IT WAS SO KVLT, MANE. 

My trick is I use a Jim Dunlop Jazz III (the tiny one) and be really efficient with your picking. Don't move your pick any farther than you need to in order to hit your notes. Don't move your arm at all; it's all in the wrist.


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## noUser01 (Feb 2, 2014)

TylerEstes said:


> Maaneskyggens Slave cover - YouTube
> 
> Here's a shitty video of me badly playing a cover of Maaneskyggens Slave by Gorgoroth when I was a teenager. The camera was so shitty that my room was pretty bright in spite of not being able to see most of the video. BUT IT WAS SO KVLT, MANE.
> 
> My trick is I use a Jim Dunlop Jazz III (the tiny one) and be really efficient with your picking. Don't move your pick any farther than you need to in order to hit your notes. Don't move your arm at all; it's all in the wrist.



I use Jazz II's and already do all those things, it's just a matter of practicing now. I also found picking harder and accenting the note groupings more than I usually do helps me out a ton when playing at high speeds.


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## DarksomeOrigin (Feb 4, 2014)

In my experience, tremelo picking is just something you have to just do a lot without worrying too much about accuracy at the higher speeds. Once the twitch muscles get used to moving that fast, you'll get more control and be able to clean things up. Don't even worry about note subdivision, just go nuts. I'd have a hard time believing any of the classic extreme death and black metal bands developed it any differently than that. A bunch of drunk 17 year olds in Scandinavia don't give me the impression that they were very methodical with their technique development.  I'm sure if you isolated the rhythm guitars on an old Dismember or Mayhem record, the individual performances would be a mess by today's super squeaky clean and accurate digital standards.


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## tedtan (Feb 4, 2014)

ConnorGilks said:


> I also found picking harder and accenting the note groupings more than I usually do helps me out a ton when playing at high speeds.



You're on the right track. This is a big help at higher tempos, otherwise it's easy to get lost. Petrucci mentions something about this in his Rock Discipline video.


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## Eptaceros (Feb 4, 2014)




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## redstone (Feb 6, 2014)

^that dude is wrong, Mclaughlin isn't a pronosupinator picker he's mainly based on the radial deviation, like Shawn Lane. People shouldn't give guitar lessons when they don't even know how their arms work. Pronosupination isn't some wrist motion, it's the elbow. This guy basically criticize what he actually does : playing from the elbow.


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## noUser01 (Feb 6, 2014)

redstone said:


> ^that dude is wrong, Mclaughlin isn't a pronosupinator picker he's mainly based on the radial deviation, like Shawn Lane. People shouldn't give guitar lessons when they don't even know how their arms work. Pronosupination isn't some wrist motion, it's the elbow. This guy basically criticize what he actually does : playing from the elbow.



I just disagree with that technique in general. It's not precise to me. Plus I use the same technique for speed picking (normal alternate picking runs) as tremolo picking. Using the same technique for both allows me to just work on one kind of picking technique and not have to develop two separately. I'm having no issues developing speed with my trem picking (thanks to a combination of posts in this thread and just some practice) so I don't see any need to try his rather odd technique.


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