# Windows 8 Pro



## CrushingAnvil (Oct 26, 2012)

I'm tempted to grab it for the 49 NZD they're offering it for  

My brother just got it a couple of hours ago but he just left without letting me having a hoon (turn  ) on it. 

Anyone have any hands on experience with the official release?


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## Daemoniac (Oct 26, 2012)

Yes, it's great.

Takes getting used to on a traditional desktop (ie: no touchscreen), but once you are, it's great to use. I think the main menu really needs a touch pad/multi-touch mouse at the very least, but yeah - not the abysmal trainwreck I was expecting. At all.

Like I said on Facebook, I'm really very impressed so far. It feels like a more complete, more consistently themed Windows 7.


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## Daemoniac (Oct 26, 2012)

Also; this is an absolute fucking BLAST to use, and fits W8 _perfectly_. When used on something like that, with the touch screen and everything, it's honestly some of the most fun I've had with an OS release in years.


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## Fat-Elf (Oct 26, 2012)

As far as Google pics tell, the visual design is way too blocky for my taste. I like how round and smooth everything looks in W7.


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## CrushingAnvil (Oct 26, 2012)

Fat-Elf said:


> As far as Google pics tell, the visual design is way too blocky for my taste. I like how round and smooth everything looks in W7.



I like the way it looks, but I'll wait until I navigate my brother's computer with the same thing on it.


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## troyguitar (Oct 26, 2012)

I've had the consumer preview on my spare laptop for months and still hate it. I'll be sticking with 7 unless I buy a tablet that comes with 8.


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## Sofos (Oct 26, 2012)

I'm a gamer, so I absolutely refuse to get Windows 8. 
Gamasutra - News - Windows 8 arrives amid serious concerns from PC game devs


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## Ishan (Oct 26, 2012)

I work in IT and for me and many pros it's an half assed attempt at something new and useful. MS is trying to shove that crap to everyones throats but metro on a server? really?
I'm predicting a big tank of that monstrosity for any serious work but it'll do fine for the average man I think (think email, web, chat type of people) everyone else including gamers will hate it as MS will force more and more the use of their own store (bye bye Steam).
That's what I think but I'm pretty sure I'll be proven wrong


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## Lagtastic (Oct 26, 2012)

I work for a MS Gold Partner, have had Win8 on a laptop for 6 months now. I see absolutely no reason to move from Win7 to Win8. I'm so glad I'm transitioning out of server support into straight networking. Have fun with that crap. 

Also agreed on the above comments about the new Windows store, its making game development companies uneasy, and for good reason. 

There is one caveat to the $49 deal, you can't "downgrade" your license and install Win7, it's for Win8 only. They want your cash from the store, plain and simple. I guess MS will be transitioning more and more into the Apple way of marketing and billing, considering how successful it has been. That's the last thing we need, 2 competing forms of generic commercials blasting us everywhere we look. I bet they even go the way of CAPCOM DLC content, charging you a fee to "unlock" additional features already installed in the OS. Fun times are ahead.


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## Mexi (Oct 26, 2012)

the interface is so counter intuitive for a desktop feeling really clunky and annoying.

I can certainly see that it could have some value on a tablet/phone though


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## Ishan (Oct 26, 2012)

I think the most annoying thing is those damn active corners,reaching them with a mouse on a 24" screen is just a pain...
And no more than 2 apps on screen in metro (or Windows UI as they call it now ) ? all apps defaulting to full screen? really? That's an insane waste of screen...


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## JPhoenix19 (Oct 26, 2012)

I might give it a shot- I read in an article that Windows 8 tested better in just about every way over Windows 7 for recording. Stand by while I find the reference on that.

EDIT: Here it is. 
Music Developer on Windows 8: A Leap Forward for Desktops; A Leap Backward for Metro, WinRT?

Reading that, I'm disappointed that Windows didn't try to make their mobile versions more audio-friendly. I was imagining Windows answers to things like Ampkit for the iPad.


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## axxessdenied (Oct 27, 2012)

JPhoenix19 said:


> I might give it a shot- I read in an article that Windows 8 tested better in just about every way over Windows 7 for recording. Stand by while I find the reference on that.
> 
> EDIT: Here it is.
> Music Developer on Windows 8: A Leap Forward for Desktops; A Leap Backward for Metro, WinRT?
> ...


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## FireInside (Oct 27, 2012)

Well, if it is actually better than Windows 7 for recording then I will definitely pick up a copy. I still prefer XP for recording for now.


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## Ben.Last (Oct 27, 2012)

I'm really not too keen on the rumblings I've been hearing about MS moving it in a direction away from the open architecture that Windows usually has. I haven't actually looked into it all too much though. I won't be upgrading, regardless.


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## DMONSTER (Oct 27, 2012)

Downloading it now, got it for 15 bucks so i said fuck it why not


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## JPhoenix19 (Oct 27, 2012)

DMONSTER said:


> Downloading it now, got it for 15 bucks so i said fuck it why not



Whaaaat? How'd you work that one?


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## CrushingAnvil (Oct 27, 2012)

DMONSTER said:


> Downloading it now, got it for 15 bucks so i said fuck it why not



I've tried installing 8Pro twice and the screen turns grey after 2-3 restarts for the system configuration. 

I'm at a complete loss for why it's not installing. I paid 50 bucks for this shit!


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## DMONSTER (Oct 27, 2012)

https://www.windowsupgradeoffer.com/en-US/Registration

Go through this, as long as you put in that your purchase date was after June 6th or so, you get an email for a promo code to put in before you download that bumps it down to 15 bucks


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## Alex6534 (Oct 27, 2012)

my college got a link to give it's students to get it for free, even then I'm not downloading it.


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## CrushingAnvil (Oct 27, 2012)

I'm rocking it and I like it. Bear in mind I don't use my notebook for gaming or anything intensive, I use it for uni and leisurely activity - I really like it


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## GuitaristOfHell (Oct 28, 2012)

Alex6534 said:


> my college got a link to give it's students to get it for free, even then I'm not downloading it.


LINK . 
My concern is can I still use Microsoft office 2010 on it because I'm a college student as well.


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## flint757 (Oct 28, 2012)

office is a microsoft product I see no logical reason why it wouldn't work.


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## Bekanor (Oct 28, 2012)

Lagtastic said:


> I work for a MS Gold Partner, have had Win8 on a laptop for 6 months now. I see absolutely no reason to move from Win7 to Win8. I'm so glad I'm transitioning out of server support into straight networking. Have fun with that crap.
> 
> Also agreed on the above comments about the new Windows store, its making game development companies uneasy, and for good reason.
> 
> There is one caveat to the $49 deal, you can't "downgrade" your license and install Win7, it's for Win8 only. They want your cash from the store, plain and simple. I guess MS will be transitioning more and more into the Apple way of marketing and billing, considering how successful it has been. That's the last thing we need, 2 competing forms of generic commercials blasting us everywhere we look. I bet they even go the way of CAPCOM DLC content, charging you a fee to "unlock" additional features already installed in the OS. Fun times are ahead.



They already are, windows media centre has been stripped out and there is no DVD playback in windows media player unless you purchase the pro edition or the stand alone media centre package.


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## flint757 (Oct 28, 2012)

That being true I find it an odd direction for them to take. Funny enough I don't think people would have a problem embracing the new design if it wasn't for the behind the scene BS they seem to be initiating. I mean it isn't like they aren't a profitable company.


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## Mordacain (Oct 29, 2012)

Bekanor said:


> They already are, windows media centre has been stripped out and there is no DVD playback in windows media player unless you purchase the pro edition or the stand alone media centre package.



They actually are offering Media Center for free until the new year (basically for early adopters). That being said, if you miss it, it's a $5 option.

I just installed it on my laptop this morning and once I got past Metro and installed Classic Shell (to add normal Start menu functionality) I actually really like it.

I wish I could revert to original Aero windows, but I'm not hating metro as much as I thought I would. The install process was utterly seamless (I just upgraded, carrying over my files and settings from 7) and all I did was reinstall updated video drivers.

For $15 bucks, it's well worth it (particularly for those that aren't exactly running a legitimate copy of Windows already).

/EDIT if you want basic DVD playback, just install VLC. No self-respecting PC user should not already have it installed since it plays pretty much every file on the planet.


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## flint757 (Oct 29, 2012)

VLC has always been buggy for me, but I agree. So is the $15 version the exact same as the $40 one on their website? In both cases can I download it to a disk or is the disk option only available if I buy the physical copy?

I'm contemplating upgrading my current setup and then re-installing windows 7 again for dual boot purposes as I'm running SLI on a non-SLI board and apparently the drivers aren't ready yet on 8. 

For an outright copy of 8 pro it is $40 and physical copy is $60. I don't think a disk is worth $20 is why I ask FYI (definitely not worth $45 if I get the 'OEM upgraded' version ).

[EDIT]

Also very interesting article which confirmed my thoughts on the whole valve situation.

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2012/10/let-off-some-steam-is-window-8-really-that-bad-for-game-developers/


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## Ben.Last (Oct 30, 2012)

flint757 said:


> That being true I find it an odd direction for them to take. Funny enough I don't think people would have a problem embracing the new design if it wasn't for the behind the scene BS they seem to be initiating. I mean it isn't like they aren't a profitable company.



I don't know if I'd call it odd. The way of thinking they're heading toward has been working for Apple for years now.


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## flint757 (Oct 30, 2012)

Yeah, but many people also avoid apple for these same reasons. In any case the more I think about it the more likely I'm going to buy it. Probably dual boot for now though.

I had read somewhere that they took media center out because they wanted to get rid of it straight up and only added it back because people were complaining. Currently it is free, probably until the end of January. I imagine when they found out people wanted it back and are also willing to purchase the OS that they decided they could profit from it which isn't irrational or odd (but arguably shitty). In a way it makes sense I guess as I wouldn't expect Corel to be free and WM player doesn't play Blu Rays as is anyhow. If I paid for it I'd definitely expect Blu Ray support. If that is the case paying for it is fine for me as it seems that there are very expensive licensing agreements associated with them.


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## Ben.Last (Oct 30, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Yeah, but many people also avoid apple for these same reasons. In any case the more I think about it the more likely I'm going to buy it. Probably dual boot for now though.



Yeah. I didn't mean that in a positive way. I think it's utterly stupid that MS is jumping on the closed system train along with Apple.


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## Mordacain (Oct 30, 2012)

flint757 said:


> VLC has always been buggy for me, but I agree. So is the $15 version the exact same as the $40 one on their website? In both cases can I download it to a disk or is the disk option only available if I buy the physical copy?
> 
> I'm contemplating upgrading my current setup and then re-installing windows 7 again for dual boot purposes as I'm running SLI on a non-SLI board and apparently the drivers aren't ready yet on 8.
> 
> ...



Yea, the $25 discount is what someone linked earlier in the thread and is the same. I went ahead and put it one all 3 of my PCs. It is the same Pro version, just gets a $25 discount applied at checkout when you use the promo code.

As far as the Steam situation is concerned I will be following it intently, but I loaded up Dragon Age:Origins (one of my Steam titles) immediately and haven't had any issues.

My main desktop I haven't been able to test all of the games I had installed but so far I haven't run into any issues, the only things reported as non-compatible were one of my Asus board utilities and Daemon's Tools. On my desktop, I did have to disable my SSD cache drive (Intel Smart Response) to get Windows 8 to install properly and have not re-enabled it yet, but I'm sure it will be fine.

On my nettop install, all I had some weird wireless throughput issues, but that seems resolved by reinstalling the Windows 7 driver again ppost Windows 8 install.

I must say, I'm really quite impressed with how well the upgrade works. I've always been a format / reinstall fresh kind of guy but I've not noticed any problems this go-round with any loss of settings. The user account sync function is pretty nifty as well and the Homegroup setup seems to work better (I used to have issues with some of the PCs in my house not connecting properly).


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## flint757 (Oct 30, 2012)

Yeah, I imagine once it has been out for awhile drivers and software patches will be made to work with 8 if it doesn't currently.

So do you only need one license to install on several machines? I was going to buy another, but if I don't have to, cool.


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## Aevolve (Oct 30, 2012)

For anyone that's interested in Windows 8 interface and style but doesn't want any of the issues involved, you could always install rainmeter and the Omnimo 5 theme. Pretty awesome and I'm using it right now. 

It's free! The only downside I've seen is that it takes a little while to start up once you boot your computer.


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## Mordacain (Oct 30, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Yeah, I imagine once it has been out for awhile drivers and software patches will be made to work with 8 if it doesn't currently.
> 
> So do you only need one license to install on several machines? I was going to buy another, but if I don't have to, cool.



I think you'd probably need multiple licenses. I went ahead and got 3.

I should mention that Media Center has not been released yet (for free or otherwise) that being said, I'll do a test with my nettop tonight when I get home and see if the media center remote works with the standard start screen, and if so, how well. I wager it will and probably will be just fine for watching videos and listening to music (which is all I need).


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## flint757 (Oct 30, 2012)

They email you a code for media center can you not download it yet?

Did you get 3 at $15, it's an awesome deal.


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## Kryss (Oct 31, 2012)

i ran win8 release preview/candidate for bout 2 months. at first it ran good for a few weeks. did some windows updates and got the nice new bsod happy face randomly often after that. something hosed with the way usb worked on my mb probably. bsod'd randomly with usb_driver fatal error. also the ntfs partition after a few weeks wrecked itself. and would not boot. funny thing was i could access the partition with no issues when booted into mint linux. the win8 boot/partition repair was full of fail and could not repair. so i gave up and reinstalled win7. depending on your hardware it may run great but on my rig i had issues. so i will not ever be buying. i'll stick to win7 mint linux and osx on my laptop for logic pro.


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## axxessdenied (Oct 31, 2012)

The Steam issue is more about the Windows Store cutting into Valve's profits than actual issues with being able to run them on Windows 8. You can run steam and have your games no problem. Everyone that has something bad to say about Windows 8 generally hasn't had any experience with it and is just regurgitating internet bullshit.

The performance gains for music production alone have me sold on upgrading my system to Windows 8. Start menu is gone? Big deal, after a month of being on Windows 8 I'll have totally forgotten about it. 

I'm excited to get a Surface Pro when it comes out end of January!


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## Ben.Last (Oct 31, 2012)

axxessdenied said:


> Everyone that has something bad to say about Windows 8 generally hasn't had any experience with it and is just regurgitating internet bullshit.



Speaking of generalizing about things you have no actual facts to back up your opinion on... 

So, you're saying that MS hasn't maneuvered the OS more toward a closed system? Cool story. That... what... everyone needs to actually be subjected to it before they can say anything about it? Nice to know that that little thing called research magically disappeared at some point recently.


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## axxessdenied (Oct 31, 2012)

axxessdenied said:


> The Steam issue is more about the Windows Store cutting into Valve's profits than actual issues with being able to run them on Windows 8. You can run steam and have your games no problem. Everyone that has something bad to say about Windows 8 generally hasn't had any experience with it and is just regurgitating internet bullshit.


Talk to anyone that has upgraded to Windows 8. They are enjoying Steam and their games no problem. All my friends that have upgraded so far have been enjoying the experience and aren't looking back to Windows 7. The Microsoft Store doesn't allow games that have adult content, violence, etc so that means there is no reason for Steam to go anywhere.



axxessdenied said:


> The performance gains for music production alone have me sold on upgrading my system to Windows 8. Start menu is gone? Big deal, after a month of being on Windows 8 I'll have totally forgotten about it.



The Cakewalk Blog » Blog Archive » Windows 8 &#8211; A benchmark for music production applications



axxessdenied said:


> I'm excited to get a Surface Pro when it comes out end of January!


Shall I post a pic of my mug to show you the excitement? 

A lot of stuff that is new in Windows 8 is geared towards Tablets and Phones. If you are skeptical, just wait and see what happens 6 months down the road. People jump to the worst conclusions always. This is a pretty huge leap forward for Windows, so of course it is going to be met with a lot of disdain. Aside from that, Windows 8 itself is showing to be a solid operating system.



Lern2swim said:


> Speaking of generalizing about things you have no actual facts to back up your opinion on...
> 
> So, you're saying that MS hasn't maneuvered the OS more toward a closed system? Cool story. That... what... everyone needs to actually be subjected to it before they can say anything about it? Nice to know that that little thing called research magically disappeared at some point recently.


I am not worried that Microsoft is moving towards a more closed system approach. They are looking to increase their revenue from Windows. I can totally understand from a business model. Also, Windows 8 is now not just geared towards COMPUTERS. But a more wide variety of devices. Microsoft hasn't alienated Windows functionality as a operating system for PCs. The way I see it is that people that use Windows RT devices will be the most restricted with what they can do with their devices, which is where a majority of Microsofts new policies are probably geared towards. People running PCs will be running Windows 8 Pro which is a much more open operating system. This is how I see things from my experience being a Windows user for the majority of my life. Time will tell. If the Microsoft Store is very popular digital distrubtion platforms like Steam will suffer, not because of the policies Microsoft has in place, but because people will be spending their money elsewhere. So, Steam has a lot to gain from W8 not being popular, hence the very harsh words from Newell. Remember, he's a business man. He didn't get to where he is just by knowing how to make good games.


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## Mordacain (Oct 31, 2012)

flint757 said:


> They email you a code for media center can you not download it yet?
> 
> Did you get 3 at $15, it's an awesome deal.



I'm not sure about the media center. I did very little research about it when I couldn't find it in the app store and it looked like it wasn't released yet. 

I did 3 at $15 each, still an awesome deal.



axxessdenied said:


> The Steam issue is more about the Windows Store cutting into Valve's profits than actual issues with being able to run them on Windows 8. You can run steam and have your games no problem. Everyone that has something bad to say about Windows 8 generally hasn't had any experience with it and is just regurgitating internet bullshit.
> 
> The performance gains for music production alone have me sold on upgrading my system to Windows 8. Start menu is gone? Big deal, after a month of being on Windows 8 I'll have totally forgotten about it.
> 
> I'm excited to get a Surface Pro when it comes out end of January!



Couldn't agree more. I've really had very few issues (no more than when I migrated to 7 from XP at any rate). Actually, I ran a tri-boot setup for a long time with XP, 7 and Ubuntu but I just don't feel the need to anymore.

For anyone that does want a start menu, you can install Classic Shell. It's free, has tons of customization options and works great. That being said, I'm finding the since Windows 8 is so hotkey friendly (which I've always been an avid hotkey user), I'm really finding I need the start menu less and less. Windows key + Q is pretty much your best friend and the search function is instant and incredibly usable.


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## troyguitar (Oct 31, 2012)

Windows 8 is noticeably slower than 7 on my laptop but it's not representative of the average PC, old Fujitsu T2010 tablet with 1.2GHz U7600 ULV processor and Intel GMA X3100 graphics. A decent amount of apps won't even run because the screen resolution is too low at 1280x800, which I found odd for an OS that is supposed to be geared toward tablets and phones...


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## flint757 (Oct 31, 2012)

For your benefit Windows 8 Media Center Pack is free for a couple months, just email them and they send you a code.

Add features - Microsoft Windows

The valve thing was a huge joke and it smelled fishy from the first words out of his mouth especially since he was the ONLY one ever saying it. It was all rumors that he conveyed as facts and his followers took as fact.


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## Mordacain (Oct 31, 2012)

flint757 said:


> For your benefit Windows 8 Media Center Pack is free for a couple months, just email them and they send you a code.
> 
> Add features - Microsoft Windows
> 
> The valve thing was a huge joke and it smelled fishy from the first words out of his mouth especially since he was the ONLY one ever saying it. It was all rumors that he conveyed as facts and his followers took as fact.



Actually just found this article and came back here to post it, but you beat me to it :

How to add Windows Media Center to Windows 8 free of charge | PCWorld


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## Ben.Last (Nov 1, 2012)

axxessdenied said:


> If the Microsoft Store is very popular digital distrubtion platforms like Steam will suffer, not because of the policies Microsoft has in place, but because people will be spending their money elsewhere. So, Steam has a lot to gain from W8 not being popular, hence the very harsh words from Newell. Remember, he's a business man. He didn't get to where he is just by knowing how to make good games.



Except, if there's one lesson to learn from the way that Apple has gone about things, it's that THIS^ is not how these things shake out. What we get instead is lackluster apps from Apple and other companies releasing higher quality apps that don't receive full functionality because, again, a closed system for anyone that's not at the most basic level of computer literacy is retarded. I'm sorry, MS is not going to offer an experience above what Steam provides. It's just not going to happen. UNLESS... oh, yeah, that's right... unless MS cripples them by limiting what they're capable of doing by turning toward a closed system. Which is exactly what they seem to be doing hence the very harsh words from Newell.


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## flint757 (Nov 1, 2012)

Except that isn't what they are doing. Steam will work fine and continue to work fine. He isn't worried about not being able to sell on pc's, he is worried about another company cutting in on his profits. Steam really isn't that great; gamestop and ea have better stores, apps and prices imo. If they were doing what he said he'd have something to complain about but they aren't. The only 'closed' thing they did was disable some things people could alter and they are only doing that so traditionalist will adjust themselves to what their future design is inevitably going to be.


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## Ben.Last (Nov 1, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Except that isn't what they are doing. Steam will work fine and continue to work fine. He isn't worried about not being able to sell on pc's, he is worried about another company cutting in on his profits. Steam really isn't that great; gamestop and ea have better stores, apps and prices imo. If they were doing what he said he'd have something to complain about but they aren't. The only 'closed' thing they did was disable some things people could alter and they are only doing that so traditionalist will adjust themselves to what their future design is inevitably going to be.




Except that IS what they're angling to do. I'm not saying it's there now, but they are laying the groundwork.

They're boiling the frog nice and slow.


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## flint757 (Nov 2, 2012)

Perhaps, but for now you are only conveying rumors just as Newell was and for that you are both wrong for standing there saying you are absolutely right (especially for Windows 8, later, to me, would be a few OS's down the road). I honestly think people are getting overly paranoid. Windows is only allowing basically family friendly content to their store which means the majority of Steam games will still be bought at Steam. Other than a few things directly correlated to the OS design (and that is it) it is still open source or as open source as it always was (it has never been absolutely open source).

Hey if you are right I honestly wouldn't fret as something else will take over most likely. Maybe Linux will grow substantially at that point, maybe Google will step up or maybe everyone needs to chill and realize that only in the mobile market are they concerned with locking things down (as has every other mobile phone/tablet maker). Rumors are still just rumors even if in the end they turn out to be true. Microsoft has not said they were doing this and there is no evidence that they are going to go that way (strong evidence that is, intuition doesn't count).


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## Ben.Last (Nov 2, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Perhaps, but for now you are only conveying rumors just as Newell was and for that you are both wrong for standing there saying you are absolutely right (especially for Windows 8, later, to me, would be a few OS's down the road).



Except it's not just rumor. It's in the verbage and guidelines of the system they've started with Windows 8. Have they enacted a lot of the things they have explicitly stated in there that they're "allowed" to? Not yet. But the groundwork is incredibly clear. Newell isn't the only one pointing this stuff out. There's numerous other people (who have poured through the Windows 8 related literature more than I care to) that point to the same thing. 

Regardless, you're right, something will fill the void if they do continue down that road. I'm not worried about it. I'll stick with Windows 7 and, if I need to change for some reason, figure out what works for me. That doesn't change the fact that I think it's stupid.


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## flint757 (Nov 2, 2012)

Yeah time will tell. Who knows what will happen in the next decade at this point.

The majority of coputer users are via tablets, smartphones and the like and increasing daily. These devices have always been fairly locked up. They made 3 versions of Windows 8 and one is only for tablets and that one is definitely locked, but the Pro and standard aren't. Microsoft does like to 'guide' its users which could be perceived as control, but all that shit can be disabled in some form or fashion. I imagine as time goes on it will still be 'open', but continue to become more of a pain in the ass to make it completely so.

His beef was with game development and 3rd part installations though and specifically with windows 8, neither of which is a problem. He has been saying all of this before the demo was even released (before he could even look at it practically). At the time I searched around and he was the only one saying it and the others who were saying it got the info secondary from him. I honestly feel like it is a little bit of the telephone game going on. He has something to lose financially and that should be accounted for in his thought process.

There'd be too much backlash that once they did it they'd have to undo it or face a loss of a bunch of users (what makes their product look good in the first place is how many people use Windows).

Posted this earlier and this is more logical pertaining to the situation than Windows going fully closed in the coming years:

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2012/10/let-off-some-steam-is-window-8-really-that-bad-for-game-developers/


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## axxessdenied (Nov 2, 2012)

Lern2swim said:


> Speaking of generalizing about things you have no actual facts to back up your opinion on...


...just saying.... some facts to back up what you're saying would be helpful 

All you are posting is scepticism and not actual facts.


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## axxessdenied (Nov 2, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Yeah time will tell. Who knows what will happen in the next decade at this point.
> 
> The majority of coputer users are via tablets, smartphones and the like and increasing daily. These devices have always been fairly locked up. They made 3 versions of Windows 8 and one is only for tablets and that one is definitely locked, but the Pro and standard aren't. Microsoft does like to 'guide' its users which could be perceived as control, but all that shit can be disabled in some form or fashion. I imagine as time goes on it will still be 'open', but continue to become more of a pain in the ass to make it completely so.
> 
> ...


Exactly. People need to get it through their heads that Windows 8 is now a cross-platform operating system and a lot of new policies had to be put in place because of that. Windows RT users are going to be the ones that are going to be most affected by these policies. The Pro variant of Windows 8 is a lot more open and gives you a true PC experience.


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## Ben.Last (Nov 2, 2012)

axxessdenied said:


> ...just saying.... some facts to back up what you're saying would be helpful
> 
> All you are posting is scepticism and not actual facts.



I didn't bookmark the links with the intent of having to parenthetically cite them for someone on a guitar forum. 

If you really need proof, I can try to backtrack to what I was reading.


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## flint757 (Nov 2, 2012)

Well as for verbiage itunes, as an example, has a "software cannot be used in missiles" clause which no one intends to do I don't think. Sometimes things are written with no intent of actually being utilized and more for "just in case shit rolls down hill".

I don't deny that they may have the domino's lined up, but I find it sincerely unlikely that they will actually knock them down. 7 asks me every time I want to do something and it is much harder than XP to get certain things to appear without a quick google search, but it can be done. I have a feeling that is all that is going to happen. Certain things will be more difficult, but not impossible.

They will never eliminate 3rd party applications. Since it didn't start out that way many companies (too many) write software for Windows. Microsoft would have to waste a lot of money to verify everything and more than likely they'd end up in court for an attempt at monopolizing the marketplace. They have been in the business of taking out competing 3rd party applications, but never completely eliminating them as an option and doubt that is the road they will take (potential legal trouble, loss of customers and expensive to initiate). As long as you can install things outside of 'Metro' the rules don't matter. Yeah people will be given a quicker easier option, but they don't have to buy it there if they don't want too. Same goes with the certifications on their new boot security (can't remember what it is called). It can all be bypassed or ignored. The people who will benefit the most from what Microsoft is doing are the people, as an IT professional, I'd recommend buying a MAC so it makes little difference to me as they will get the similar sense of safety and I can just avoid it.


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## axxessdenied (Nov 2, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Well as for verbiage itunes, as an example, has a "software cannot be used in missiles" clause which no one intends to do I don't think. Sometimes things are written with no intent of actually being utilized and more for "just in case shit rolls down hill".
> 
> I don't deny that they may have the domino's lined up, but I find it sincerely unlikely that they will actually knock them down. 7 asks me every time I want to do something and it is much harder than XP to get certain things to appear without a quick google search, but it can be done. I have a feeling that is all that is going to happen. Certain things will be more difficult, but not impossible.
> 
> They will never eliminate 3rd party applications. Since it didn't start out that way many companies (too many) write software for Windows. Microsoft would have to waste a lot of money to verify everything and more than likely they'd end up in court for an attempt at monopolizing the marketplace. They have been in the business of taking out competing 3rd party applications, but never completely eliminating them as an option and doubt that is the road they will take (potential legal trouble, loss of customers and expensive to initiate). As long as you can install things outside of 'Metro' the rules don't matter. Yeah people will be given a quicker easier option, but they don't have to buy it there if they don't want too. Same goes with the certifications on their new boot security (can't remember what it is called). It can all be bypassed or ignored. The people who will benefit the most from what Microsoft is doing are the people, as an IT professional, I'd recommend buying a MAC so it makes little difference to me as they will get the similar sense of safety and I can just avoid it.


Exactly. There are two different version of windows now. One for Intel-based PCs and the other for ARM-based PCs. Windows RT which is for ARM-based deviced only comes pre-installed on devices. It has no desktop mode, only the Modern UI. So, it makes sense that microsoft will employ some sort of verification process for applications that are made for sale so they work smoothly on these devices. Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro have the Desktop mode which provides all the functionality that you have on your Windows 7 PC. Lots of these new policies will only affect you when you are stuck to only the Modern UI. But, for actual PC users that have Windows 8, this is not an issue. 


If you're going to complain about people generalizing and not posting sources and then not do it yourself... why bother?


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## Ryan-ZenGtr- (Nov 3, 2012)

@*axxessdenied*

Nice post!

From the paranoia inducing rumours regarding the closed shop model, similar to another well known app store, open source OS's may receive a big boost to their popularity.

The only way to find out is to wait and see.


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## Jordan Djenital Warts (Nov 3, 2012)

Lagtastic said:


> There is one caveat to the $49 deal, you can't "downgrade" your license and install Win7, it's for Win8 only. They want your cash from the store, plain and simple..


 
Why would you want to downgrade an upgrade? That doesn't make sense...


At the moment, for consumers, only Windows 8 Pro Upgrade is for sale at the stated promotion prices - in the UK:

£14.99 for an ESD (electronic software download) copy should you have bought a windows 7 computer between 2nd June 2012 and 31st Jan 2013.
£24.99 for an ESD copy of Windows 8 Pro Upgrade
£49.99 for a DVD copy of Windows 8 Pro Upgrade
All offers require an underlining OS (XP or above) and are limited to 5 upgrade license purchases per customer.

You can buy a COEM version (for naked PCs) behind the counter of local computer stores, but they'll have to sell it with hardware; as it is an OEM license...

Either way it is a steal at this promo price. If you don't want to install it now, you can just buy the ESD upgrade, burn it to a DVD and come back to it when you want / more refined. It's your license. That's what I'm doing (except, I dont have to pay for it )


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## flint757 (Nov 3, 2012)

That and if you have a windows 7 disk who says you can't go back. It may not let you go back and keep everything installed like the upgrade is capable of, but I see no reason why you can't do a fresh re-install of windows 7 or XP.


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## flint757 (Nov 14, 2012)

Just installed it and so far I'm very impressed. Tons more shortcuts than there ever was, I can install whatever I want, it is actually easier to get around than XP or 7, but there is a learning curve. Having the live tiles is rather useful for my desktop (might be a problem battery wise on a laptop, don't know) and you have full control of what sort of settings are in place like always. At first glance it is a tad more intrusive, but you can keep it in offline mode and turn off all the extra protection things they always add with the new releases if you want too.

So far I'm personally impressed. The Start screen is surprisingly customizable. I also like all the new things they added to essentially replace the start button. Getting to disk management, control panel and whatnot has never been easier IMO.


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## axxessdenied (Nov 19, 2012)

Upgraded last night. Got all my hardware working fine! Got Studio One installed and my plugins! Love it! It's not really that much different from Windows 7


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## maliciousteve (Nov 19, 2012)

I just bought a new desktop PC due to my laptop with Win7 being on the brink of dying on me. It came with Windows 8 already installed and I really like it. Takes some getting used to but it's great.

The one thing I don't like is having both the traditional desktop look and the tiles together. Windows should of gone with one or the other. But ah well.


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## 7slinger (Dec 6, 2012)

didn't see another windows 8 thread so I'll just plop this here:

picked up a new laptop with windows 8, and haven't used anything but XP, so as you can imagine win8 takes some getting used to.

my wife is on the verge of turning into a homicidal lunatic if the desktop screen switches back to the start screen again when she swipes her finger on the touch pad, so for starters, does anybody know how to disable this?


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## flint757 (Dec 6, 2012)

Right corner and drag down, settings, change pc settings, general, app switching. Turn off swipe from left opening most recent app. If all you have gone to is desktop and start menu then in desktop start is the most recent app.

Switching from 7 to 8 is significantly smoother.


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## Lagtastic (Dec 6, 2012)

Learning some keyboard shortcuts will make your life much easier with Win8, or any version of Windows for that matter. Here are a few examples you should know and master, there's a ton more if you get interested:

Alt+F4
Alt+Tab
Windows+Tab
Windows by itself
Windows+D
Windows+L
Windows+R
Windows+E
Windows+Arrow keys (snap feature) 
Windows+number keys (opens programs from your taskbar in order)
Shift+Home,End,PgUp,PgDn,arrow keys
Ctrl+Home,End,PgUp,PgDn,arrow keys

Run command tricks, again there's a ton more but these are the useful ones for normal PC users. These also work for quickly changing paths in normal windows (up at the top of the window).
Windows+R, \ , Enter (opens C drive)
Windows+R, %userprofile%, Enter (opens user profile of currently logged in user)




Also there are some free easy tools to get rid of the damned Metro crap interface and get a normal Start Bar back in your life.

How to get the Start menu back in Windows 8 | Windows 8 - CNET Reviews


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## flint757 (Dec 6, 2012)

windows + I opens up charm window

In the start menu or 'metro' you can initiate a search for whatever just by typing too.


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## axxessdenied (Dec 7, 2012)

Loving windows 8 
Don't miss the start menu at all!

I think the new all-in-one touch pcs with windows 8 on them will appeal to a lot of people. My mom could never get the hang of Windows (she's on OSX). But, she played around with the new windows 8 touch pcs and actually wants one!

Don't have to disable WiFi anymore like in Windows 7 to record with my firewire interface either! 
Actually I found Windows 8 to be really great for low-latency audio recording right out of the box without any tweaks. Nice improvement over W7 for sure!


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## 7slinger (Dec 7, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Right corner and drag down, settings, change pc settings, general, app switching. Turn off swipe from left opening most recent app. If all you have gone to is desktop and start menu then in desktop start is the most recent app.
> 
> Switching from 7 to 8 is significantly smoother.



thanks a lot

I'm going to order parts to put together a new desktop this coming week for recording, and I can't decide whether to do win 7 or 8. I've read 7 is much more like xp which is what I'm used to, but I've also read that 8 utilizes some things better, like core use for example. It will be a powerful but simple system, and if 8 will help me get the most out of my cpu etc. then perhaps I should do it

maybe not the best thread for this debate, but any thoughts anybody?


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## Mordacain (Dec 7, 2012)

7slinger said:


> thanks a lot
> 
> I'm going to order parts to put together a new desktop this coming week for recording, and I can't decide whether to do win 7 or 8. I've read 7 is much more like xp which is what I'm used to, but I've also read that 8 utilizes some things better, like core use for example. It will be a powerful but simple system, and if 8 will help me get the most out of my cpu etc. then perhaps I should do it
> 
> maybe not the best thread for this debate, but any thoughts anybody?



I've been running 8 for awhile and I haven't really had any problems save with a few older applications (games mostly). I run a few systems and I really like the account linking aspect. I'm also a big fan of the hotkey integration. The gesturing support is pretty nifty as well.

If you want windows 8 to work like previous versions of Windows, just install classic shell to get back the old start menu interface.


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## Ben.Last (Dec 7, 2012)

axxessdenied said:


> Don't have to disable WiFi anymore like in Windows 7 to record with my firewire interface either!



Care to elaborate on this?


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## flint757 (Dec 7, 2012)

7slinger said:


> thanks a lot
> 
> I'm going to order parts to put together a new desktop this coming week for recording, and I can't decide whether to do win 7 or 8. I've read 7 is much more like xp which is what I'm used to, but I've also read that 8 utilizes some things better, like core use for example. It will be a powerful but simple system, and if 8 will help me get the most out of my cpu etc. then perhaps I should do it
> 
> maybe not the best thread for this debate, but any thoughts anybody?



Yeah windows 8 runs better overall especially for audio recording, so I'm told. It handles start up, ram, core processes, etc. just better than 7 did. The only major difference, visually, between 7 and 8 is metro so if you install classic shell you can pretty much avoid it if you wish. I haven't had too much issue with it, but I could see why it may annoy some people. It will at least help with the transition and then over time you could switch to the default 8 setup if you wish. 8 is currently cheaper to buy I think.


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## axxessdenied (Dec 7, 2012)

Lern2swim said:


> Care to elaborate on this?



Well, network drivers in general have been pretty inefficient on Windows machines.
The issue with Windows 7 is that the system will sometimes wait for the WiFi driver to respond which causes latency on your machine which in turn causes random clicks and pops on your interface.
This, becomes a big problem when you are using a firewire device. Because, for some reason the developers decided that the wifi drivers have precedence over the firewire drivers which causes some pretty hectic behavior. I struggled getting my hardware to be stable in Windows 7 until I learned what the issues were. If you run latencymon on a windows 7 machine with WiFi drivers it will usually tell you that you should disable WiFi in order for the machine to run smoothly for low-latency applications. I tried this on every one of my Windows 7 machines and they all failed to pass latencymon with wifi on.


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## Ben.Last (Dec 7, 2012)

Ahh. That's good to know. I've been getting weird popping issues with my firewire interface lately and I was working under the assumption that it was an IRQ issue. But I did just install a wifi card.


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## axxessdenied (Dec 7, 2012)

Lern2swim said:


> Ahh. That's good to know. I've been getting weird popping issues with my firewire interface lately and I was working under the assumption that it was an IRQ issue. But I did just install a wifi card.



Guaranteed if you run with WiFi drivers disabled your problem with clicks and pops should disappear!

A neat little workaround to having wireless internet while still keeping wifi drivers off is to get your hands an old wrt54gs router and install dd-wrt firmware on it so that you can run it as a wireless bridge. You plug into it via cable and it handles connecting to your wireless network. 
That is what I did to get around the annoying wifi issue. But, so far I've been testing running with my wifi card again and no random clicks and pops yet!


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## 7slinger (Dec 8, 2012)

flint757 said:


> Yeah windows 8 runs better overall especially for audio recording, so I'm told. It handles start up, ram, core processes, etc. just better than 7 did. The only major difference, visually, between 7 and 8 is metro so if you install classic shell you can pretty much avoid it if you wish. I haven't had too much issue with it, but I could see why it may annoy some people. It will at least help with the transition and then over time you could switch to the default 8 setup if you wish. 8 is currently cheaper to buy I think.



I did some quick googling yesterday on classic shell and such, because what you describe sounds like what I want...but what I was finding was talking about deleting registry items and such and I don't think I want to get down in a hole I can't climb out of. 

is the classic shell you're talking about just a setting vs. something more involved like a reg edit?

edit: nm, don't know what the hell I was looking at yesterday, this is probably what you're talking about - freeware right?

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/


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## flint757 (Dec 8, 2012)

Haven't tried it, but that looks about right. From what I had read on it in the past it was just install and done.


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## CrushingAnvil (Dec 15, 2012)

7slinger said:


> didn't see another windows 8 thread so I'll just plop this here:
> 
> picked up a new laptop with windows 8, and haven't used anything but XP, so as you can imagine win8 takes some getting used to.
> 
> my wife is on the verge of turning into a homicidal lunatic if the desktop screen switches back to the start screen again when she swipes her finger on the touch pad, so for starters, does anybody know how to disable this?



Teach your wife not to be so clumsy - I fail to see how it's easy to accidentally select the start screen. 

Use the windows key and tell her to also.

Windows key + tab also.


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## MrMcSick (Dec 16, 2012)

I bought a new pc with win8 already on it. Im still pissed that I have to pay $70 to upgrade my oem version of win8 to the Win8 pro pack to get media center!!!!!!!!!!!! I miss using my xbox as an extender so much. I can't justify spending $70 just to have it though. Not sure what I want to do.


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## Ben.Last (Dec 16, 2012)

MrMcSick said:


> I bought a new pc with win8 already on it. Im still pissed that I have to pay $70 to upgrade my oem version of win8 to the Win8 pro pack to get media center!!!!!!!!!!!! I miss using my xbox as an extender so much. I can't justify spending $70 just to have it though. Not sure what I want to do.




Go get the discount to get it for $15


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## xFallen (Dec 16, 2012)

All I have to say is I'm sticking to windows 7 xD


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## flint757 (Dec 16, 2012)

MrMcSick said:


> I bought a new pc with win8 already on it. Im still pissed that I have to pay $70 to upgrade my oem version of win8 to the Win8 pro pack to get media center!!!!!!!!!!!! I miss using my xbox as an extender so much. I can't justify spending $70 just to have it though. Not sure what I want to do.



Windows Upgrade Offer - Landing Page

And you can download the code for media center for free. If not you could purchase it for $5.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/feature-packs


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## Ben.Last (Dec 16, 2012)

xFallen said:


> All I have to say is I'm sticking to windows 7 xD



For the time being, despite my reservations, I'm rolling with 8. It just simply works better than 7, and, for now, there's plenty of ways to make it act like 7. Until they roll out 9 and really close things, I'll make it work.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Dec 16, 2012)

Mexi said:


> the interface is so counter intuitive for a desktop feeling really clunky and annoying.
> 
> I can certainly see that it could have some value on a tablet/phone though


And there's *NO DESKTOP OPTION* without installing extra (3rd party) stuff.
Current laptop is win7 and I love it.
If this BS keeps up, next computer is dual booting w/ linux.


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## MrMcSick (Dec 17, 2012)

Lern2swim said:


> Go get the discount to get it for $15


 


flint757 said:


> Windows Upgrade Offer - Landing Page
> 
> And you can download the code for media center for free. If not you could purchase it for $5.
> 
> Add features - Microsoft Windows


 

The windows that came on my pc is non pro win 8. The $15 upgrade is if you have a pc that recently came with win7. I already tried the media center download code and it didn't work. Media center is only available for window8 PRO hence why I have to upgrade my basic windows that was installed from the factory to the window 8 pro and then get the media center upgrade. The link in this page states this on the top half.


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## flint757 (Dec 17, 2012)

For anyone who has more than one monitor, can you force the start menu and all the related apps to only open to a specific monitor. Currently working with only one monitor and the way start menu apps open doesn't make for a smooth experience. It feels quite jarring.


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## Ben.Last (Dec 17, 2012)

All_¥our_Bass;3317692 said:


> And there's *NO DESKTOP OPTION* without installing extra (3rd party) stuff.
> Current laptop is win7 and I love it.
> If this BS keeps up, next computer is dual booting w/ linux.



It's working fine on my desktop. I just don't use metro for much of anything (basically the same way I used the old start menu)


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## crg123 (Oct 22, 2013)

Ok. So I know this is a necrobump but I figure with the addition of Windows 8.1 and all the fixes that have occurred with third party apps this should be reopened anyway.

So. I have a 2012 Macbook pro that I received from my computer for grad school. For some reason they installed windows 7 Pro *32-bit* on it when it has a 2.3Hz quad core i7 with 8 gigs of RAM on it for the bootcamp partition instead of 64-it

I use windows 7 all the time for most of my Autodesk software (I'm an architect). It dives me CRAZY how slow the windows side is because it can't take advantage of the full processor/RAM so I was thinking about upgrading to windows 8.1 or I'd rather, if there was a cheap or free way, of just upgrading it to Windows 7 64 bit. Does anyone know if there is any way to do this (Legally of course).

I'm upgrading to Mavericks today since my computer is still running snow-leopard for some reason as well haha. Please PM me or respond here if you think you can help. Thanks guys.


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## ferret (Oct 22, 2013)

You can't upgrade from 32-bit to 64-bit (Or the reverse, for that matter). You'll have to do a clean install.

There's not really a cheap way anymore, the initial $15 upgrade promotion is long past. The upgrade price is currently $200 for Pro. You probably don't really need Pro though, so the $120 for the regular ol' edition is a better bet. Those are the current Windows 8.1 retail prices

You might be able to find some Windows 8 disks on the internet though, from various retailers who still have them. I've seen those as low as $85, but it was months ago and don't know if you can still find them at that price. If you get Windows 8, the upgrade from there to Windows 8.1 is free.


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