# Return of the Ibanez RGA Prestige



## Ludgate (Aug 25, 2017)

Also part of the Uppercut series, that means Lo Pro Edge, Bareknuckle Aftermaths, Ebony fretboard and SS frets. 

Ghost Fleet Blue burst






Red Viking Flat





But at just under 3000 USD retail, I would probably wait till Rich or Ikebe blow these out in a year. What do you guys think?


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## marcwormjim (Aug 25, 2017)

That price makes me GAS for a different brand.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 25, 2017)

Finally. 
But like 3000 usd really? Are they going to be 1800 better then the rgaixu. Hmmm


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## Jake (Aug 25, 2017)

Well it's a start 

If we get a hardtail- which would most likely not be in the uppercut series I'm on it.


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## cwhitey2 (Aug 25, 2017)

Jake said:


> Well it's a start
> 
> If we get a hardtail- which would most likely not be in the uppercut series I'm on it.




I agree...What made the RGA awesome was the fact it was hardtail 

I think I'll pass on these...too much $$$$


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## Shoeless_jose (Aug 25, 2017)

For that much $$ crazy high in Canadian I could do way way better


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## knet370 (Aug 25, 2017)

ill just buy a rga420z instead if it comes along..


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## GraemeH (Aug 25, 2017)

Fretboard binding does a _lot_ for guitars with ebony planks IMO, and is hardly too much to expect at that price-point.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Aug 25, 2017)

GraemeH said:


> Fretboard binding does a _lot_ for guitars with ebony planks IMO, and is hardly too much to expect at that price-point.



I always preferred a lack of binding, to be honest. 
But yeah, for these prices I'd be hard pressed to not just make the extra stretch into custom territory.


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## GXPO (Aug 25, 2017)

It's hard to believe that the day Ibanez release an Ebony board, stainless steal fret, Prestige RGA with the best trem they've ever produced people would bitch about it. 

I remember every time someone complained a guy like Max would say, if they did it you wouldn't but it. Well, they did it.


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## bnzboy (Aug 25, 2017)

That's a cool guitar but the price is a turn off for me. 

Reissue RGA121 (MIJ), add locking tuners/ebony fretboard, price it reasonably and put something other than Aftermaths=Profits and happy customers!


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## Webmaestro (Aug 25, 2017)

Now that I'm starting to see the Lo Pro coming back to more models, I feel like Ibanez is turing a bit more back in the direction of what I like in an Ibby. But, I'll agree... the price tag on those Uppercuts is a little crazy.


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## Metropolis (Aug 25, 2017)

bnzboy said:


> That's a cool guitar but the price is a turn off for me.
> 
> Reissue RGA121 (MIJ), add locking tuners/ebony fretboard, price it reasonably and put something other than Aftermaths=Profits and happy customers!



And Gibraltar Standard II or Tight-End R bridge  I bet it will be bit over 2k, 3000 is just a list price for these.


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## Sephiroth952 (Aug 25, 2017)

Metropolis said:


> And Gibraltar Standard II or Tight-End R bridge  I bet it will be bit over 2k, 3000 is just a list price for these.


According to the site the msrp is 4k. The sales price is 3k.


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## Metropolis (Aug 25, 2017)

Sephiroth952 said:


> According to the site the msrp is 4k. The sales price is 3k.



Okay, damn those are expensive.


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## couverdure (Aug 25, 2017)

>Ibanez brings back the RGA to the Prestige line after disappearing for a few years
>and to top it off it's a super high-end Uppercut model
>has pretty much the most possible perfect specs for an Ibanez guitar
>people would rather buy another brand for the same price or want an entirely guitar instead

Like clockwork. I bet it won't be soon until it's pulled out of the line again and I wouldn't be surprised if they also complained about it.


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## Rawkmann (Aug 25, 2017)

I don't have any experience with the 'Uppercut' series and ya this guitar looks awesome with great specs but at 3K I'm buying a new Vigier Excalibur or a USA ESP. I think a 2K Prestige model with those specs would have been better received.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Aug 25, 2017)

Is it wrong that I wan't one in black?


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## Metropolis (Aug 25, 2017)

You can't please everyone. If it had hardtail bridge, and fret markers on fretbeoard it would be perfect. Also they should bring back little bit thicker and round neck profiles for lower end Prestiges, which are 18mm from 1st fret. 17mm is just too thin for some players.


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## Adam Of Angels (Aug 25, 2017)

Price aside, these are fucking amazing. You guys are crazy.


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## Lemonbaby (Aug 25, 2017)

Really nice, finally Ibanez found out how to do a fretboard without markers. No idea why it's a lot more expensive than the RG6UCS though. And the colour is debatable...


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## Lemonbaby (Aug 25, 2017)

Really nice, finally Ibanez found out how to do a fretboard without markers. No idea why it's a lot more expensive than the RG6UCS though. And the colour is debatable...


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## Boojakki (Aug 25, 2017)

Metropolis said:


> ...they should bring back little bit thicker and round neck profiles for lower end Prestiges, which are 18mm from 1st fret. 17mm is just too thin for some players.



I totally agree.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Aug 25, 2017)

Adam Of Angels said:


> Price aside, these are fucking amazing. You guys are crazy.



Oh dude all the way. If it was in my budget I'd be all over it, and I don't even like trem guitars.
....which is a bit of a curse to have, as an Ibanez fanboi.


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## GXPO (Aug 25, 2017)

Lemonbaby said:


> Really nice, finally Ibanez found out how to do a fretboard without markers. No idea why it's a lot more expensive than the RG6UCS though. And the colour is debatable...



Colour/stain, Flame maple and producing an arch top over the price of a flat top. I mean, the fact that they have to glue two pieces of wood together in alignment and sand round multiple corners must already add a fair amount of time to the manufacturing process.


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## cwhitey2 (Aug 25, 2017)

I would take an uppercut FR over this all day.


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## possumkiller (Aug 25, 2017)

And the proper horn shapes as well. The old RGA models had weird fat horns and only the LACS models had proper thin RG horns.


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## possumkiller (Aug 25, 2017)

Is there going to be a 7?


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## dmlinger (Aug 25, 2017)

Like most in this thread...really dig the guitar but the price is prohibitive for an ibby.


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## Jake (Aug 25, 2017)

Adam Of Angels said:


> Price aside, these are fucking amazing. You guys are crazy.


No denying they're amazing here, just not a trem guy (and I'm in the minority for that )

I've got a trem on my JEM and ESP so I can't deal with another right now 

Maybe once they start popping up used, would block. Still havent pulled the trigger on an RGD UC either.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 25, 2017)

GXPO said:


> It's hard to believe that the day Ibanez release an Ebony board, stainless steal fret, Prestige RGA with the best trem they've ever produced people would bitch about it.
> 
> I remember every time someone complained a guy like Max would say, if they did it you wouldn't but it. Well, they did it.



Well let's not get hasty. We don't know the final retail price yet. It could be really good. 

However the specs on these aren't that much different then the iron labels. 

I think most people complaining think that 3k is a bad price for these.


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## Ludgate (Aug 25, 2017)

diagrammatiks said:


> Well let's not get hasty. We don't know the final retail price yet. It could be really good.
> 
> However the specs on these aren't that much different then the iron labels.
> 
> I think most people complaining think that 3k is a bad price for these.



You can buy them already. Ikebe has a batch arriving on the 31st, and it is 3K.


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## AkiraSpectrum (Aug 25, 2017)

Dang those are gorgeous, especially the blue.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 25, 2017)

Ludgate said:


> You can buy them already. Ikebe has a batch arriving on the 31st, and it is 3K.



jeez really 3k.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 25, 2017)

Give that blue one full binding and it would be perfection. Absolute perfection.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 25, 2017)

interesting tidbit from phil mcknight on the future of the prestige plant. dunno how trustworthy his information is


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## Jarmake (Aug 26, 2017)

Wow, these look really great! But then again, 3k pricetag, thanks but no thanks!


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## KnightBrolaire (Aug 26, 2017)

i hate trems and aftermaths but otherwise it seems like really great specs. Not 3k great though. At that price I'll just get more custom 8 strings


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## gujukal (Aug 26, 2017)

What made the RGA121 great was the hardtail and price imo. Hope their will be a fixed version that's a bit cheaper.


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## possumkiller (Aug 26, 2017)

Are people seriously comparing this to an Iron Label??? What are we living in the ass backward days of people defending to the death $1k garbage Indo guitars and saying a high quality Japanese guitar at $3k is too expensive because it's the same shape? Really?


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## lewis (Aug 26, 2017)

1. The RGA/RGD are Ibanez's best ever shapes imo
2. that price is a joke haha > next company


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 26, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Are people seriously comparing this to an Iron Label??? What are we living in the ass backward days of people defending to the death $1k garbage Indo guitars and saying a high quality Japanese guitar at $3k is too expensive because it's the same shape? Really?



the iron label is really good tho if you find a good one.
there's a lot of competition at 3k. that's all we're saying. It's pretty much the most expensive upper cut and more then the jbm100.

plus both the premium 1027 and the rgaixu are like 700 for me in Hong Kong. That's impulse buy territory. 3k...not so much.


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## HighGain510 (Aug 26, 2017)

Same boat as everyone else it seems. Specs are fantastic, but $3K for a prestige is lunacy. I'm not sure how they think tossing an ebony board and a $350 pickup set onto the guitar justifies that price tag, but I wish them luck selling them at that price.


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## Petar Bogdanov (Aug 26, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Are people seriously comparing this to an Iron Label??? What are we living in the ass backward days of people defending to the death $1k garbage Indo guitars and saying a high quality Japanese guitar at $3k is too expensive because it's the same shape? Really?



Ibanez is trying to charge a huge premium for some fairly affordable features. There is nothing particularly labor-intensive on the Uppercuts AFAIK. And before you say "stainless frets", they used to cost nearly the same without them.


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## Jake (Aug 26, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Are people seriously comparing this to an Iron Label??? What are we living in the ass backward days of people defending to the death $1k garbage Indo guitars and saying a high quality Japanese guitar at $3k is too expensive because it's the same shape? Really?


Probably because a blank board, locking tuners, BKP aftermaths and the RGA shape are all features on the iron label version and this one costs twice as much?




Also the price is insane, it's $1k more than the RG and RGD UC models which are also high end guitars with incredibly similar features.


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## TheGuitarPit (Aug 26, 2017)

lewis said:


> 1. The RGA/RGD are Ibanez's best ever shapes imo
> 2. that price is a joke haha > next company



Yeah, this pretty much says it all. What on earth.

I'm sure it's higher quality than an Iron Label but even at $2k it'd be a stretch, but more palatable. I guess that's an issue when you have $1500 Indonesian guitars in your lineup...


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## lewis (Aug 26, 2017)

whats stopping anyone buying the Iron label RGA. And fitting Bareknuckles themselves?. I mean I bet play ability and sound is not even that much different between that and this prestige line. If at all.
Replace the Gibraltar bridge with the Hipshot replacement just "because", and you have an easily comparable instrument that will likely play and sound the same for thousands less?.


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## Metropolis (Aug 26, 2017)

lewis said:


> whats stopping anyone buying the Iron label RGA. And fitting Bareknuckles themselves?. I mean I bet play ability and sound is not even that much different between that and this prestige line. If at all.
> Replace the Gibraltar bridge with the Hipshot replacement just "because", and you have an easily comparable instrument that will likely play and sound the same for thousands less?.



Mine had fret ends popping out, and fretboard cracked between 15-17th fret when winter came. Conditions were even not that extreme. Just says something about quality of indonesian made Ibanez's. But I don't mean they're all bad guitars.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 26, 2017)

lewis said:


> whats stopping anyone buying the Iron label RGA. And fitting Bareknuckles themselves?. I mean I bet play ability and sound is not even that much different between that and this prestige line. If at all.
> Replace the Gibraltar bridge with the Hipshot replacement just "because", and you have an easily comparable instrument that will likely play and sound the same for thousands less?.




They already make the iron label in an uppercut. 

But I think 2k would be fine.


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## Shoeless_jose (Aug 26, 2017)

at 2k I would buy this all day, at 3k its a beautiful guitar and Im envious of anyone who has one, but if I had 3k to spend somebody somewhere would be making me a custom explorer.


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## lewis (Aug 26, 2017)

Metropolis said:


> Mine had fret ends popping out, and fretboard cracked between 15-17th fret when winter came. Conditions were even not that extreme. Just says something about quality of indonesian made Ibanez's. But I don't mean they're all bad guitars.


blimey man  thats dreadful.
I know someone that tours with and has no problems. Shame you got a lemon


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## Glades (Aug 26, 2017)

This guitar is missing a string.


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## possumkiller (Aug 26, 2017)

lewis said:


> whats stopping anyone buying the Iron label RGA. And fitting Bareknuckles themselves?. I mean I bet play ability and sound is not even that much different between that and this prestige line. If at all.
> Replace the Gibraltar bridge with the Hipshot replacement just "because", and you have an easily comparable instrument that will likely play and sound the same for thousands less?.



That's exactly what those Iron Labels are aimed at. If you really think you can slap some name brand pickups and hardware on a garbage ass Indo guitar and have a Japanese quality instrument then those guitars were made just for you. Is $3k high for the top tier prestige? Probably. Is it unfair for what you get? No. If people will pay MiK prices for Indo guitars why wouldn't they pay more for the new top of the line Japanese prestige?

I really don't get the hype around the premium and iron label models. I tried a few and even bought one online. I've never once touched one that was any better than a standard Indo RG7321. I've come to the conclusion that people who love them probably haven't played anything better and those people who claim their iron label or premium is just as good as their prestige are probably just trying to hype it up so they can sell it.


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## lewis (Aug 26, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> That's exactly what those Iron Labels are aimed at. If you really think you can slap some name brand pickups and hardware on a garbage ass Indo guitar and have a Japanese quality instrument then those guitars were made just for you. Is $3k high for the top tier prestige? Probably. Is it unfair for what you get? No. If people will pay MiK prices for Indo guitars why wouldn't they pay more for the new top of the line Japanese prestige?
> 
> I really don't get the hype around the premium and iron label models. I tried a few and even bought one online. I've never once touched one that was any better than a standard Indo RG7321. I've come to the conclusion that people who love them probably haven't played anything better and those people who claim their iron label or premium is just as good as their prestige are probably just trying to hype it up so they can sell it.


end of the day though, if you are a great guitarist, you can play and sound great on even "indo" guitars?
Do you think if we handed Andy James that RGA Iron Label he would play terrible and complain and whine about the difference between this and the Prestige's?


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## Ordacleaphobia (Aug 26, 2017)

No, but I'm sure he'd at least have a fleeting thought of "Man, I wish I had my signature ESP right now."

Someone else hit the nail on the head touching on this being the result of having $1500 Indo builds in the lineup.


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## lewis (Aug 26, 2017)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> No, but I'm sure he'd at least have a fleeting thought of "Man, I wish I had my signature ESP right now."
> 
> Someone else hit the nail on the head touching on this being the result of having $1500 Indo builds in the lineup.


yeah thats fair on both points!.


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## purpledc (Aug 26, 2017)

Love the guitar. Hate the pickups and the absolutely shitastic price just because it has them. Imho the uppercut series really is a headscratcher. Now i love they made the rga with an edge trem. Hell im probably the only one. But if this was just a prestige with dimarzios or emg this thing would be a grand less.


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## purpledc (Aug 26, 2017)

couverdure said:


> >Ibanez brings back the RGA to the Prestige line after disappearing for a few years
> >and to top it off it's a super high-end Uppercut model
> >has pretty much the most possible perfect specs for an Ibanez guitar
> >people would rather buy another brand for the same price or want an entirely guitar instead
> ...




Its simple. All they have to do is get it right. I dont know maybe some options? I remember the days when guitars came in three bridge options and more colors than a box of crayolas. And if they could spare me the dick in my ass price it would really go a long way to making it a success. Imho when a brand doesnt want to focus on a certain model anymore they do exactly this. They make a guitar that is close to perfect yet they inflate the price point to a level that no rational person can justify. That way in six months when they pull the guitar they can lean on the excuse that it didnt sell. Rip out the aftercraps give me duncans or dimarzios and make msrp $3000 and give it to me for $1999 and im in. Hell even $2299 selling price and id bite. But im not paying a grand premium because they just discovered flavor of four years ago pickups.


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## possumkiller (Aug 26, 2017)

If it were a 7 I would go for it. It's really close to what I would custom order from Ibanez if that were an option. 7 string hardtail flat black like the RGD and priced similarly I wouldn't think twice. I never played BKPs but they can't be that bad. They seem to be the pickups to hate at the moment I guess the EMG hate has subsided?


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## possumkiller (Aug 26, 2017)

lewis said:


> end of the day though, if you are a great guitarist, you can play and sound great on even "indo" guitars?
> Do you think if we handed Andy James that RGA Iron Label he would play terrible and complain and whine about the difference between this and the Prestige's?


How many great guitarists (that aren't flogging Indo sig models) do you see voluntarily touring (really touring not just playing one at a show and then tossing it into the crowd) and recording with a low end Indo guitar? Keith Merrow did it right with Schecter. It's a guitar that's got the quality to match the price. Ibanez and Jackson are trying to slap some trendy brand name parts (Jackson doesn't even do that just a trendy name) on a sometimes barely decent crafted cheapo Indo guitar and and want MiK money for it.


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## A-Branger (Aug 26, 2017)

must say, they are beautiful OMFGBBQ!!

would have loved a fretboard binding, or at the very least an un-masked binding on the body since they are actually using a proper top.

I prob might not like the back of the guitar as I suppose its the same blue, but thats jsut me that at this moment I rather have a 2 tone color for it. Thats my flavour of the month

and ofcourse to be hardtail. But having said that ^, I would gladly own one of these babies any time


But yeah 3K seems to be pushing the top end of the Prestiges, but, thats because everyone here is thinking about the SSO mantra of "get an used RG prestige" since those go for pennies. I donno what made those so cheap? do they were that cheap brand new?

and yeah it doesnt jsutify the high price mark blah blah...... but also remmeber the IRon labels are recently priced as premiums. The premiums are recently priced as prestiges. So it takes no brain to see a new prestige would be priced higher. But yeh they might be pushing it. But hey, at least now you cant complain on the prices of the premium line


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## knet370 (Aug 26, 2017)

its hard to justify the cost when a jbm100 which is essentially a rga minus the ss frets etc etc cost significantly less. and i thought the jbm100 was already overpriced.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

I bought a brand new RG7620 for 599USD and a brand new prestige RGR1570 for 699USD so they all seem overpriced to me these days.


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## Andromalia (Aug 27, 2017)

Cool guitar, price is stupid.


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## _MonSTeR_ (Aug 27, 2017)

I'm surprised they've used such colourful finished in the "uppercut" range previously haven't they all been rather more sombre?

Pricing seems interesting and might be more sensible in Japanese terms compared to US imports. They might be very carefully priced for the domestic market!


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## 1b4n3z (Aug 27, 2017)

Ooh very nice. If it said j.custom on the headstock people would fall over themselves to grab one or two. Well, if they don't sell, easy fix 

Apropos, where do you get a similar quality level custom, for the same price with a good probability of actually receiving a guitar?


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 27, 2017)

1b4n3z said:


> Ooh very nice. If it said j.custom on the headstock people would fall over themselves to grab one or two. Well, if they don't sell, easy fix
> 
> Apropos, where do you get a similar quality level custom, for the same price with a good probability of actually receiving a guitar?



if it was a jucstom that'd be a great price.

mayones is about 3k now with the recent price changes.

3k also puts you in aristides 060 territory.

also suhr and anderson....


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> That's exactly what those Iron Labels are aimed at. If you really think you can slap some name brand pickups and hardware on a garbage ass Indo guitar and have a Japanese quality instrument then those guitars were made just for you. Is $3k high for the top tier prestige? Probably. Is it unfair for what you get? No. If people will pay MiK prices for Indo guitars why wouldn't they pay more for the new top of the line Japanese prestige?
> 
> I really don't get the hype around the premium and iron label models. I tried a few and even bought one online. I've never once touched one that was any better than a standard Indo RG7321. I've come to the conclusion that people who love them probably haven't played anything better and those people who claim their iron label or premium is just as good as their prestige are probably just trying to hype it up so they can sell it.







possumkiller said:


> How many great guitarists (that aren't flogging Indo sig models) do you see voluntarily touring (really touring not just playing one at a show and then tossing it into the crowd) and recording with a low end Indo guitar? Keith Merrow did it right with Schecter. It's a guitar that's got the quality to match the price. Ibanez and Jackson are trying to slap some trendy brand name parts (Jackson doesn't even do that just a trendy name) on a sometimes barely decent crafted cheapo Indo guitar and and want MiK money for it.




You really cant be serious? Ok, if you are a touring musician with an endorsement no you probably aren't going out and playing the indo guitars on a regular basis. But many of the endorsed Ibanez guitarists are playing LACS guitars and not even Japanese prestige or J. Customs. Why? Because they don't have to. But that by no means translates into the indo guitars not being instruments that can be taken seriously. I honestly don't know what happened in recent years but guitarists seem to focus WAYYYY too much on what gear they have, where it was made and to what level of refinement.

A good marksman can pick up a stock gun and shoot well with it. He doesn't NEED a custom firearm with titanium internals to hit the bullseye. Guitarists are the same way. A good guitarist can pick up any guitar with a decent set up and level frets and make good music with it. Any guitarist who picks up a premium and says he cant make good music on it because the CNC machine that cut the wood was in Indonesia and not korea or japan is just making excuses for their own shortcomings. The best tell of a poor musician is when he sits and blames his gear for not being able to play. Especially when the differences in the quality are usually in the refinement of the finish and other finer details that don't actually have an effect on ones ability to play.

I honestly don't know why you would even expect the indo guitars to be as good. That was never the point. The point was to bring options you normally wouldn't see unless spending $5000 and putting it in a guitar in the $1300 price range. In that situation something has to give. Now if you are expecting prestige or J. custom level of refinement in a guitar costing $1300 with the options it has yeah you probably will be disappointed. But if you are willing to compromise a bit on perfectionism and realize nothing stays perfect forever these guitars offer insane value. And before you go saying I have never owned anything better I can assure you that is not the case. I have owned numerous high end guitars over the last 25 years and while many of them have been technically superior in terms of flawless finish quality, none of them were so much better that it justified the increased cost. Especially since many of them only had good looks. In fact the reason I have a premium RG is because of the way it plays, feels and sounds. 

Some of your statements read like there is some magical secret sauce if you have a guitar made in one part of the world over another. Bad guitars and good guitars can be made anywhere. And 10 years ago people were saying about Korean guitars what you are now saying about indo guitars. But yes slapping fancy parts on a cheaper guitar raises the price. That's called economics. Not sure why you are knocking it.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

What the hell does being a good guitarist have to do with buying a good guitar? I'm not talking about musical skill or talent I'm talking about getting what you pay for. Yeah they are all made on a CNC machine but in Japan they actually do some more fit and finish work when it comes out of the machine. A good marksman can shoot anything well but I seriously doubt you'll see a good marksman buy a poorly put together Mosin Nagant for the same money he would pay for a Winchester 70 just because someone slapped a Leupold scope and a synthetic stock on it...

But like I said if someone can pay that much for it and be happy then that's exactly for whom they were made... for. I would personally rather pay a few hundred less for an Indo standard upgrade it myself and still come out cheaper. But it's still sad a lot of people have convinced themselves the quality and workmanship is just as good as a prestige. You are definitely correct in saying it doesn't matter where it's made. It just matters how much work they put into crafting it. I've had two friends that each had a bronze series BC Rich warlock and both of them were put together far better than any Indo Ibanez I've played.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 27, 2017)

I don't think anyone in the history of the world was ever convinced that the iron labels are as good as the prestige. 

All of us are wondering if the prestige is 3 times as good.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> What the hell does being a good guitarist have to do with buying a good guitar? I'm not talking about musical skill or talent I'm talking about getting what you pay for. Yeah they are all made on a CNC machine but in Japan they actually do some more fit and finish work when it comes out of the machine. A good marksman can shoot anything well but I seriously doubt you'll see a good marksman buy a poorly put together Mosin Nagant for the same money he would pay for a Winchester 70 just because someone slapped a Leupold scope and a synthetic stock on it...
> 
> But like I said if someone can pay that much for it and be happy then that's exactly for whom they were made... for. I would personally rather pay a few hundred less for an Indo standard upgrade it myself and still come out cheaper. But it's still sad a lot of people have convinced themselves the quality and workmanship is just as good as a prestige. You are definitely correct in saying it doesn't matter where it's made. It just matters how much work they put into crafting it. I've had two friends that each had a bronze series BC Rich warlock and both of them were put together far better than any Indo Ibanez I've played.



You are the one who brought up the whole "how many great guitarists do you see playing them" thing. So YOU are the one who brought in the good musician thing as a metric in which to measure an instruments merits. As if most "great" guitarists were even playing the japan ibbys to begin with. So by your thinking even the prestige line shouldn't live up to the standards of "greats". 

And yes the japan factory does more fit and finish work and has more attention to detail. That is why if you had an 11 piece laminated neck with wenge bubinga and purpleheart you would likely pay $5000 for that guitar. But does that lack of attention to detail actually make a indo Ibby a bad playing or sounding instrument? Not even remotely. Unless the only way you judge what a good instrument is, is by how well it shines. I just don't see a lack of refinement as a bad thing if refinement isn't the motivation for why a guitar was created. And I surely don't see a guitar as a "bad guitar" because its not as refined as a prestige.

And I'm sorry. But the whole bronze series comment has me questioning how you evaluate an instrument and what you consider "better". And it completely ignores the fact of those guitars having materials that are much easier to work. IDK maybe you have just had incredibly bad luck when looking into the indo Ibanez guitars. And I'm sorry but you cant take a regular Indo Ibby and turn it into a premium and have money to spare. Its impossible spec for spec. But again you seem to think the only thing they did with the higher end indos are pickups and hardware. And I don't really see anyone who has convinced themselves that the premiums are on the level of a prestige. I for sure as hell know they aren't as refined. But I care about the things that actually effect my playing, the tone and the feel.

It really comes down to this. If you want high level of refinement with basic specs prestige is your best bet. But if you want the most options you can get for the least amount of money and are wiling to sacrifice a bit of polish to get more for your money then the indos are a great choice. But to call them crap guitars IMHO is a huge leap of snobbery. And the differences between a prestige and a premium are not the difference between good or bad. They simply offer a different way of doing things for the people who prioritize different things.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

lewis said:


> end of the day though, if you are a great guitarist, you can play and sound great on even "indo" guitars?
> Do you think if we handed Andy James that RGA Iron Label he would play terrible and complain and whine about the difference between this and the Prestige's?



This is clearly the message I was replying to. I did not bring it up. Maybe bother to read a bit first. You also introduced the same argument using firearms which I replied to as well. The fact still remains that Ibanez puts an ebony fretboard, DiMarzios and Gotoh tuners on a low end Indo guitar and sells it in the same price range as MiK LTD and Schecter guitars that still have name brand pickups, hardware and ebony fretboard btw one even has stainless frets. They're slapping some rims and decals on a Fiesta and trying to sell it like it was a Mustang.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> This is clearly the message I was replying to. I did not bring it up. Maybe bother to read a bit first. You also introduced the same argument using firearms which I replied to as well. The fact still remains that Ibanez puts an ebony fretboard, DiMarzios and Gotoh tuners on a low end Indo guitar and sells it in the same price range as MiK LTD and Schecter guitars that still have name brand pickups, hardware and ebony fretboard btw one even has stainless frets. They're slapping some rims and decals on a Fiesta and trying to sell it like it was a Mustang.




I did read. I was addressing you. Not anyone else. I don't care who brought it up. I cared about your personal take on the subject, hence why I am addressing you and you alone. That previous person seemed to not agree with you and noted that a good guitarist can make due with an indo guitar just fine regardless of if they play them regularly or not. You made it seem that because these players don't regularly use the Indo ibbies that it verifies your assumption they are crap which I think is ludicrous. 

And I completely disagree with you that the indo guitars are low end. It seems to me that you think Indonesia is a guarantee of inferiority. I have played plenty of shit quality schecters and Korean LTD's. And if you want to throw specs out as the new metric my RG has those schecters beat just by the use of solid woods vs veneers alone. And the parts are IMHO better quality on many indo ibbys. And my RG has stainless frets as well.

So with that said if my guitar has even better specs in some areas and is completely equal in others what is the only difference that makes my guitar crap and your idea of a good guitar better? And no they aren't slapping rims and decals on a fiesta and calling it a mustang. Because the features on many of those indo ibbies are not bolt on add ons and are in the construction and choice of materials which cant be changed. Its more like they are trying to give you Ferrari specs at a mustang price and finish quality.


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## Andromalia (Aug 27, 2017)

diagrammatiks said:


> I don't think anyone in the history of the world was ever convinced that the iron labels are as good as the prestige.
> 
> All of us are wondering if the prestige is 3 times as good.



The difference between a Prestige and a Premium is mostly QC, meaning if you can dress frets and setup a guitar yourself, as long as you get a guitar with a sound neck and body, getting the cheaper one is often the smart move.
The other difference is, neck profiles on IL aren't the wizard necks so if you want that a prestige is the way to go.
A friend of mine got an Iron Label RGA, after a bit of work on the frets and double checking the electrics and soldering wwich were a little shoddy, it's a pretty good guitar


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

Say whatever you want man. If you love your Indo Ibanez great that's why they sold it to you. I've played too many other higher quality guitars in the same price range and cheaper to justify paying the huge upcharge for a premium or iron label. I played two premiums from my local shop in Florida before and wasn't impressed. I played an iron label at the local GC and it was shoddy. I actually listened to guys like you singing the praises of how much better they are and maybe they just had some QC issues in the beginning and ordered an iron label just to find out that they are still shoddy. I've owned a few Indo Ibanez guitars in the past and they are great guitars for 300-400 when you can't afford better but they are by no means a pro level instrument.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

Andromalia said:


> The difference between a Prestige and a Premium is mostly QC, meaning if you can dress frets and setup a guitar yourself, as long as you get a guitar with a sound neck and body, getting the cheaper one is often the smart move.
> The other difference is, neck profiles on IL aren't the wizard necks so if you want that a prestige is the way to go.
> A friend of mine got an Iron Label RGA, after a bit of work on the frets and double checking the electrics and soldering wwich were a little shoddy, it's a pretty good guitar


Yes if you're a good tech you can put in the man hours Ibanez didn't pay for and make them a decent guitar. You can do the same with most cheap guitars. The iron label I bought had good fretwork. Unfortunately it had binding separating before glue dried in some places with paint over it. The rough plastic nut was held in place by the strings. The worst was there was absolutely nothing to support the neck apart from the screws. There was a 3-4mm gap between neck heel and neck pocket on all sides.


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## Andromalia (Aug 27, 2017)

Well, you got a lemon, my own 7 string Iron Label just needed a bit of fretwork and the electronics were fine. (Hard to mess up EMG quick connect, that said)


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

If that's the case there are far more lemons coming out of there than I would be willing to gamble my money on.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Say whatever you want man. If you love your Indo Ibanez great that's why they sold it to you. I've played too many other higher quality guitars in the same price range and cheaper to justify paying the huge upcharge for a premium or iron label. I played two premiums from my local shop in Florida before and wasn't impressed. I played an iron label at the local GC and it was shoddy. I actually listened to guys like you singing the praises of how much better they are and maybe they just had some QC issues in the beginning and ordered an iron label just to find out that they are still shoddy. I've owned a few Indo Ibanez guitars in the past and they are great guitars for 300-400 when you can't afford better but they are by no means a pro level instrument.




Well sorry if i dont just bend to your opinion and wanted some insight as to what you were talking about. Which you never really gave any insight. You can have any opinion you want but you never actually articulated what was wrong with the indo ibbys you saw. But at this point its probably best we just agree to disagree. I dont really need to change anyones mind to be content with my purchase. I was simply trying to get an. understanding of why you feel the way you do but i dont think we will ever get past labels and goal post moving. Have a good one.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> If that's the case there are far more lemons coming out of there than I would be willing to gamble my money on.




Your experience if im counting correctly is 4 am i correct? The one you ordered and the three demo floor models that may have had something happen to them on said sales floor? Thats not exactly conclusive as anyone who has experienced a strictly seven or carvin can attest to.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

Yeah I think you kind of miss my entire point. From the experience I've had with Indo Ibanez guitars in general and for the little actual name brand hardware added (the rga7 I had came with Ibanez bridge, special Ibanez DiMarzios and Gotoh tuners so not exactly a ton of extra money) the huge leap in price over the standard series is hard to swallow given the same attention to detail in craftsmanship. In the same price range can be had MiK LTD and Schecter guitars that still have name brand pickups and hardware and a higher level of attention to detail in craftsmanship. 

But I can also get the notion of having beefed up low end guitars similar to stripped down high end guitars. I would personally take the stripped down high end guitar and add upgrades as I could afford it. I still think they are overpriced for what they are but then they seem to be wanting to hike up prestige prices now as well.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

Yeah I think you kind of miss my entire point. From the experience I've had with Indo Ibanez guitars in general and for the little actual name brand hardware added (the rga7 I had came with Ibanez bridge, special Ibanez DiMarzios and Gotoh tuners so not exactly a ton of extra money) the huge leap in price over the standard series is hard to swallow given the same attention to detail in craftsmanship. In the same price range can be had MiK LTD and Schecter guitars that still have name brand pickups and hardware and a higher level of attention to detail in craftsmanship. 

But I can also get the notion of having beefed up low end guitars similar to stripped down high end guitars. I would personally take the stripped down high end guitar and add upgrades as I could afford it. I still think they are overpriced for what they are but then they seem to be wanting to hike up prestige prices now as well.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Yeah I think you kind of miss my entire point. From the experience I've had with Indo Ibanez guitars in general and for the little actual name brand hardware added (the rga7 I had came with Ibanez bridge, special Ibanez DiMarzios and Gotoh tuners so not exactly a ton of extra money) the huge leap in price over the standard series is hard to swallow given the same attention to detail in craftsmanship. In the same price range can be had MiK LTD and Schecter guitars that still have name brand pickups and hardware and a higher level of attention to detail in craftsmanship.
> 
> But I can also get the notion of having beefed up low end guitars similar to stripped down high end guitars. I would personally take the stripped down high end guitar and add upgrades as I could afford it. I still think they are overpriced for what they are but then they seem to be wanting to hike up prestige prices now as well.



Apologies for the wall of text. But I promise I change my tone and lose my attitude. I get what you are saying. My needs have changed over the years. You see I was once a perfectionist. I honestly cant remember a single guitar I have owned that was perfect. And to be honest even when I spend what I thought was stupid money on a guitar ($3200 on a Warrior custom namm show fully armed soldier) I was incredibly let down by that guitar. They actually routied the neck pickup 1/4" off center. They just moved the pickup ring over and ground most of the pickup tab off to cover it up. The fret ends also cracked through the finish on every single fret. I was actually pretty shocked at how thick they were stacking the poly on the side of the neck.

That incident and many many others when spending in excess of $1500 and above have forced me to be a budget minded consumer. So I started looking for the absolute most that I could get for the money and what I wanted feature wise. I was willing to overlook some fit and finish issues. Especially if they are things I can correct myself. I also got a discount on the guitar after I did find a few minor cosmetic flaws. 

So for me, it would seem I get jacked up guitars no matter how much money I spend so I let my ears and fingers decide this time. So to be fair to you, I may have just be lucky for once. I honestly have played a lot of Ibanez indo guitars. And my experience has been pretty different from yours. Either way, sorry if I gave you a hard time. Might just be a little, defensiveness since I just got mine and love it. This is actually my first Ibanez since 1992. I got my first new guitar (always had used) for Christmas which was an ex370fm in amber violin burst. I was going to get a prestige RG but couldn't pass this guitar up when I saw the top it had. 

But had it not played and sounded better than I ever imagined I wouldn't have kept it. In fact the whole guitar goes against what I usually go for in a guitar. But it just has a really lively feel and a super stable neck. And after I removed that ZPS3 stabilizer thing the guitar has that bouncy feel that Floyd type trems have when you play em hard unblocked. I guess it just spoke to me. Sorry if I got defensive.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

No I get where you're coming from as well. I've had about 65ish guitars in the last 20 years. I've always had low end guitars. Some were garbage, some were good for the money and some were just plain great. Sometimes you can take an okay guitar and make it great. I've had a few high end guitars as well. I've never been disappointed with a Japanese Ibanez. I was never blown away but never disappointed. I had Edwards and ESP standards with the same result. Gibson USA I've had good and bad. Fender never disappoints either. I've actually just got a CS 69 Stratocaster that I'm pretty impressed with. I got it used though I wouldn't pay new full price for one. I've had BRJ, custom Russian made Shamray beautiful PRS clone and was disappointed. I was disappointed with USA Jacksons. I can still say the one and only guitar that ever seriously blew me away was my ESP custom shop KH4. It's nothing fancy just a plain black super strat. However every little microscopic detail was executed to exact perfection. I mean everything. Every corner and edge was smooth rounded over. Every paint line was perfect. Every single fret was perfectly round smooth and mirror polished. Even the ebony fretboard was smooth and polished. There were absolutely no sign of any tool marks anywhere. Even the transition line between the gloss black neck heel and natural satin neck was undetectable by feel. That guitar set the bar for me. Everything since then has either been a disappointment or just ehh it's pretty good. I got it for like 1900 and never should've let it go. I want another ESP custom but I haven't really been able to justify 5k for a guitar the last few years. I don't think I would ever spend ESP custom kind of money on anything other than an ESP custom again. It's just usually a disappointment and I wind up taking a loss.


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## purpledc (Aug 27, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> No I get where you're coming from as well. I've had about 65ish guitars in the last 20 years. I've always had low end guitars. Some were garbage, some were good for the money and some were just plain great. Sometimes you can take an okay guitar and make it great. I've had a few high end guitars as well. I've never been disappointed with a Japanese Ibanez. I was never blown away but never disappointed. I had Edwards and ESP standards with the same result. Gibson USA I've had good and bad. Fender never disappoints either. I've actually just got a CS 69 Stratocaster that I'm pretty impressed with. I got it used though I wouldn't pay new full price for one. I've had BRJ, custom Russian made Shamray beautiful PRS clone and was disappointed. I was disappointed with USA Jacksons. I can still say the one and only guitar that ever seriously blew me away was my ESP custom shop KH4. It's nothing fancy just a plain black super strat. However every little microscopic detail was executed to exact perfection. I mean everything. Every corner and edge was smooth rounded over. Every paint line was perfect. Every single fret was perfectly round smooth and mirror polished. Even the ebony fretboard was smooth and polished. There were absolutely no sign of any tool marks anywhere. Even the transition line between the gloss black neck heel and natural satin neck was undetectable by feel. That guitar set the bar for me. Everything since then has either been a disappointment or just ehh it's pretty good. I got it for like 1900 and never should've let it go. I want another ESP custom but I haven't really been able to justify 5k for a guitar the last few years. I don't think I would ever spend ESP custom kind of money on anything other than an ESP custom again. It's just usually a disappointment and I wind up taking a loss.



I really like esp. I have two Edwards LP guitars that I really like and have owned a number of ESP's. I guess I would say I have almost a dislike for perfect guitars because of my own issues. When I say I was a perfectionist I mean to an unhealthy level. For instance if that custom KH4 I would not want to play it for fear of damaging that perfection. I have actually had instances where I get a guitar and love the look and feel and the paint was just perfect and then when it got its first ding I obsessed over it so much that I couldn't enjoy the guitar again and would sell it. So my only solution was to make a conscious effort to prioritize what I can hear and feel because my eyes will always disappoint me.


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## possumkiller (Aug 27, 2017)

I was the opposite. I never try to damage guitars but I also do not hold back playing. At first I bought it because it looked just like the modded KH2 Richard Z was playing. After I started playing it my playing just took off to a whole new crazy high level. After that I could give a rat's ass what it looked like as long as it still made me play so well. I was a strictly rhythm player for like the first ten years and this guitar not only made my rhythm playing better but I became a sweeping, tapping and trem wanking shredder in like a freaking month. I've never touched a guitar so magical ever again


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## couverdure (Aug 27, 2017)

Two whole pages of arguing with someone who made a separate thread about having quality issues with his own Ibanez. Can we please just have people who are willing to buy the new RGA here instead?


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 28, 2017)

couverdure said:


> Two whole pages of arguing with someone who made a separate thread about having quality issues with his own Ibanez. Can we please just have people who are willing to buy the new RGA here instead?



Magically no one ever posts in this thread ever again.


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## possumkiller (Aug 28, 2017)

The 7 string version I would buy. Is there any other news on these? Will there be a 7? The only nitpick I have is the beat up pickup covers but those are easy enough to remove.


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## kevdes93 (Aug 28, 2017)

I saw someone say on facebook that theres only 6 of these for the japan market, 3 of each color. If thats true hopefully we'll get a US release next year and maybe theyll drop the price a bit


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 28, 2017)

kevdes93 said:


> I saw someone say on facebook that theres only 6 of these for the japan market, 3 of each color. If thats true hopefully we'll get a US release next year and maybe theyll drop the price a bit



if that's true then the price is justified. There's only 6. time to buy 3.


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## DarthV (Aug 28, 2017)

couverdure said:


> Two whole pages of arguing with someone who made a separate thread about having quality issues with his own Ibanez. Can we please just have people who are willing to buy the new RGA here instead?



With a $3k street price, you think many people are going to line up an buy them? The new models look awesome, but I couldn't see myself shelling out more than an EBMM BFR on one!


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## couverdure (Aug 28, 2017)

DarthV said:


> With a $3k street price, you think many people are going to line up an buy them? The new models look awesome, but I couldn't see myself shelling out more than an EBMM BFR on one!


I'll take that people who who have enough money to buy them don't like Ibanez too much, and the ones that do only seem to buy JEMs.


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 28, 2017)

I still feel like i'd buy a jbm100 before I bought this


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## DarthV (Aug 28, 2017)

couverdure said:


> I'll take that people who who have enough money to buy them don't like Ibanez too much, and the ones that do only seem to buy JEMs.



Well since that's very close to the price of a J-Custom and more than just about any Ibanez sig, limited potential buyers would be an understatement! One of the reasons the original RGAs were so popular was their bang for the buck. Then again, Ibanez prices have risen quite a bit since they were in production. Probably pretty good guitars @ $1600US or so.


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## Jake (Aug 28, 2017)

couverdure said:


> I'll take that people who who have enough money to buy them don't like Ibanez too much, and the ones that do only seem to buy JEMs.


 Although my 88' JEM 77FP in almost mint condition cost less than this RGA 



diagrammatiks said:


> I still feel like i'd buy a jbm100 before I bought this


This. So much this. I'll end up with one eventually and just block the trem on it, but it's gonna happen.


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## 7 Strings of Hate (Aug 28, 2017)

couverdure said:


> Two whole pages of arguing with someone who made a separate thread about having quality issues with his own Ibanez. Can we please just have people who are willing to buy the new RGA here instead?


Last I checked this was a discussion forum. I saw a couple pages of guys discussing stuff pretty peacefully. On a discussion forum. Its almost like this forum exists to discuss things. Go figure.


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## Ludgate (Aug 31, 2017)

Well, there is one of each already in stock at Ikebe. My gripe with the price is the quality of the top you get on one of these. They definitely look better than those in the product pictures, but are still far from what you would expect to see in this price range.


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## possumkiller (Aug 31, 2017)

Flat black 7 hardtail would get my $3k


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## Glades (Aug 31, 2017)

It's an Ikebe guitar, not a production guitar. $3k sounds reasonable


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## diagrammatiks (Aug 31, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Flat black 7 hardtail would get my $3k



now riddle me this...a man whose dream guitar is a 25.5 hardtail bolton seven string what makes this more compelling then a suhr modern 7 or a mayones duvell


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## possumkiller (Aug 31, 2017)

The fact that neither is an RGA? I wouldn't mind a Duvell but it's more of a blackmachine style. 

Matte silver would look cool on an RGA7 also...


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## trem licking (Sep 1, 2017)

these things are absolutely awesome... that's all i got. I'd try a few different models before spending this kind of money on a guitar but if you love the feel and look of an ibanez this is going to absolutely hang with any of the other top tier makers


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## robski92 (Sep 1, 2017)

I think that blue one looks fantastic!


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## Elwood (Sep 4, 2017)

Would love to see a comparison between the RGA iron lable, the old RGA 321f and the new ones.


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## Nitrobattery (Sep 8, 2017)

Not trying to spam, and not listing anything, but what seems to be the going rate for an old Prestige RGA321F? I've been toying with letting my trans-black one go.


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## Jake (Sep 8, 2017)

Nitrobattery said:


> Not trying to spam, and not listing anything, but what seems to be the going rate for an old Prestige RGA321F? I've been toying with letting my trans-black one go.


$750-900 depending on condition. I'd possibly be interested


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## Spicypickles (Sep 9, 2017)

But your thing says you're done buying guitars.


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## Jake (Sep 9, 2017)

Spicypickles said:


> But your thing says you're done buying guitars.


 We're never really done


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## exo (Sep 10, 2017)

That blue one pretty much looks like a Misha sig Jackson with a trem.

Pretty much the same price, too......

A $3k guitar will be forever beyond my reach no matter the maker, unless I win the lottery.....


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## Power2theMetal (Sep 11, 2017)

3k for a high quality Japanese guitar isn't outrageous...

*Looks at Caparison models*


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## possumkiller (Sep 15, 2017)

People are just used to paying less for an Ibanez. The last prestige I bought new cost me $699USD hard currency from Musicians Friend with a case. This was in 2007. Ibanez is probably trying to get inline with ESP in the price hiking trend.


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## Nitrobattery (Sep 15, 2017)

Jake said:


> $750-900 depending on condition. I'd possibly be interested



I may just hold onto it. It's a killer guitar, and even though I don't play it much, it would take more than it's worth for me to part with it. If I ever change my mind though, I'll let you know!


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## Jake (Sep 15, 2017)

Nitrobattery said:


> I may just hold onto it. It's a killer guitar, and even though I don't play it much, it would take more than it's worth for me to part with it. If I ever change my mind though, I'll let you know!


Makes sense to me! They're fantastic guitars and I've yet to find a black one to compliment my blue one. Although there is one on Ebay right now...hmm


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## diagrammatiks (Sep 15, 2017)

Power2theMetal said:


> 3k for a high quality Japanese guitar isn't outrageous...
> 
> *Looks at Caparison models*



Caps are almost entirely made by hand


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## Shoeless_jose (Sep 15, 2017)

exo said:


> That blue one pretty much looks like a Misha sig Jackson with a trem.
> 
> Pretty much the same price, too......
> 
> A $3k guitar will be forever beyond my reach no matter the maker, unless I win the lottery.....



so just different headstock and different style of bridge?? lol


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## narad (Sep 17, 2017)

diagrammatiks said:


> Caps are almost entirely made by hand



I don't assign much weight to that -- my j-custom always outdid my caparisons.


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## possumkiller (Sep 17, 2017)

Dineley said:


> so just different headstock and different style of bridge?? lol



Yep. Otherwise it's the exact same guitar. May as well save a couple grand and get a misha pro sig. Or save even more and get an agile septor it's literally the exact same thing for like 2400$ cheaper. I bet I could get one of those Chinese "custom" builders to make the exact same guitar for even cheaper.


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## Pikka Bird (Sep 17, 2017)

Best part: Lo Pro on a sixer. I think the tops make them look like Premiums or Iron Labels though. Nowhere near as classy as the first or second generation RGA Prestiges.


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## possumkiller (Sep 17, 2017)

Yeah looking at the inner part of the horns these tops are veneers. I'd prefer a solid color or a plain wood. The lo pro edge is wonderful. Still if they made this as a 7 even with a veneer I would be on it. I've been waiting years for Ibanez to make something like this. The only other thing that would turn my attention would be a prestige RGT 7.


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## diagrammatiks (Sep 17, 2017)

narad said:


> I don't assign much weight to that -- my j-custom always outdid my caparisons.



I don't think they are very worth it either. But it's one of the reasons they charge so much. I wasn't very impressed by any of the ones I played.


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## trem licking (Sep 17, 2017)

possumkiller said:


> Yeah looking at the inner part of the horns these tops are veneers. I'd prefer a solid color or a plain wood. The lo pro edge is wonderful. Still if they made this as a 7 even with a veneer I would be on it. I've been waiting years for Ibanez to make something like this. The only other thing that would turn my attention would be a prestige RGT 7.


not veneers, they are thin tops. looks like there is a thin layer of wood between the top and body as well


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## possumkiller (Sep 18, 2017)

Ok so how thin is a "top" before you call it a veneer? That top definitely doesn't look 5mm thick. It looks like a slightly thicker veneer than used on the Indo RGAs. They were able to bend it to fit the contour of the main body top but not the horns.


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## diagrammatiks (Sep 18, 2017)

Shouldn't these be between 5 and 7? That's a top.


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## marcwormjim (Sep 18, 2017)

trem licking said:


> not veneers, they are thin tops.



A perfect claim for illustrating the veneer of success.


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## narad (Sep 18, 2017)

trem licking said:


> not veneers, they are thin tops.



"not veneers, they are <definition of veneer>."

But yea, that does look thick enough to get some nice multi-dimensional figure going on, it's just not high grade maple. Shouldn't be surprising though when their mega-expensive limited j-customs look like this:







Not that they're all bad -- just no consistency, even among > $5k guitars.


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## Ludgate (Sep 18, 2017)

Pretty sure it's thick enough to be considered a top, the new bevels on the horns that resemble those on the Indo Iron Label RGAs make it seem like a veneer.





Definitely a step down from what we're used to seeing though.


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## Ludgate (Sep 18, 2017)

Now this one is slightly better.


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## possumkiller (Sep 18, 2017)

narad said:


> "not veneers, they are <definition of veneer>."
> 
> But yea, that does look thick enough to get some nice multi-dimensional figure going on, it's just not high grade maple. Shouldn't be surprising though when their mega-expensive limited j-customs look like this:
> 
> ...



If I were specifically out to get a figured top I'd be unhappy about that. On it's own though it looks kind of cool like a watercolor painting or something. It actually kind of works with the vine inlay instead of against it.

The old RGA had a proper top. I can even go with a 1/4" drop top on an RG. But the new RGA definitely looks like a 3mm thick veneer. Look at where it meets the neck pocket. Im not bashing it or saying I wouldn't buy one. I'm just not going to call it something it isn't.


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## eightsixboy (Sep 18, 2017)

They are a thick veneer, probably a few mm.

Look at the J Custom JCRGA1601-SSK in comparison. Its only like 6k but at least you get a thick top lol.

Body Top Material: Exotic Maple 14mm
Body Material: African Mahogany 30mm


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## trem licking (Sep 18, 2017)

narad said:


> "not veneers, they are <definition of veneer>."
> 
> But yea, that does look thick enough to get some nice multi-dimensional figure going on, it's just not high grade maple. Shouldn't be surprising though when their mega-expensive limited j-customs look like this:
> 
> ...



veneer is like 1/16th" thick. as in very thin. these are tops. thin tops


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## narad (Sep 18, 2017)

trem licking said:


> veneer is like 1/16th" thick. as in very thin. these are tops. thin tops



I think you might be missing the point in that there isn't a certain thickness where something transforms from 100% "thin top" to 100% "veneer". If you're replacing what was once a single thick piece of maple with a laminate (consisting of a thin piece of figured maple glued to a larger chunk of plain maple) then you're doing it to stretch how many guitars you can turn out from a fixed amount of figured billets. That's the veneer strategy, regardless of exactly how thin they slice it (something we don't even know).


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## eightsixboy (Sep 18, 2017)

narad said:


> I think you might be missing the point in that there isn't a certain thickness where something transforms from 100% "thin top" to 100% "veneer". If you're replacing what was once a single thick piece of maple with a laminate (consisting of a thin piece of figured maple glued to a larger chunk of plain maple) then you're doing it to stretch how many guitars you can turn out from a fixed amount of figured billets. That's the veneer strategy, regardless of exactly how thin they slice it (something we don't even know).



Well yea. What is defined as a top and what is defined as a veneer?

These RGA's kind of seem in the middle of what people would call a top vs what people would call a veneer.

Either way imo these are pretty expensive, I'd rather get a RG7570Z for a lot less cash, still get a "top" with an ebony board, just don't have the stainless frets. 

http://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/366954


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## purpledc (Sep 18, 2017)

Well regardless of what most people define as a Top or a Veneer I think its some pretty weak figuring for a top that thin.


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## trem licking (Sep 18, 2017)

ok I'm not going to split hairs here with what a veneer is or isn't but in my opinion anything over a couple millimeters thick where you can clearly see a binding of wood going over the sides/horns with figuring on it, as well as a thin laminate of a darker accent wood underneath, is a top ha. I think these look great, subtle figuring in these particular models is really classy looking.


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## marcwormjim (Sep 19, 2017)

A veneer of class.


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## possumkiller (Sep 19, 2017)

The thin laminate underneath it doesn't count at all toward being part of a "top". It's just another even thinner veneer. What most people call a top is something thick enough to have an effect on sound. Something thin added purely for aesthetics is a veneer.


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## narad (Sep 19, 2017)

I think that argument is pretty flakey -- pretty much all drop tops probably have negligible effect on the sound of the instrument.


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## Nlelith (Sep 19, 2017)

An optimist sees a top. A pessimist sees a veneer.


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## Lemonbaby (Sep 19, 2017)

Although the thin top might have just been an economic decision, I like that the horns look deeper due to the darker paint where the top/veneer ends. It's basically an RG outline, but the trick works...


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## knet370 (Sep 19, 2017)

I don't mind the "thinner" top on these new rga's as long as they have a really nice figuring. Thinner means cheaper in materials right? So they have this headroom to choose atleast a good figuring on wood.


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## knet370 (Sep 19, 2017)

I don't mind the "thinner" top on these new rga's as long as they have a really nice figuring. Thinner means cheaper in materials right? So they have this headroom to choose atleast a good figuring on wood.


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## trem licking (Sep 19, 2017)

This debate is giving me veneerial disease...


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## narad (Sep 19, 2017)

trem licking said:


> This debate is giving me veneerial disease...



There we go! That's the level of "veneer" pun I was looking for!


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## trem licking (Sep 19, 2017)

Yeah but how much wood would a tonewood tone if a tonewood could tone wood? For real this guitar is sweet though, i don't want to veneer off topic here.


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