# I got my Strictly 7 Boden and....



## leonardo7 (May 24, 2013)

It plays well, sounds great, and has worm holes! Yay!

First of all, I love the endurneck. I really love the way it plays. I didn't expect worm holes though. Theres a few other funny things about the guitar such as the 21st fret popping out a little and a few other weird things but overall the design, tone and playability is great! Like I said, I love the design, and the endurneck is pure genius! Nothing but love for Ola Strandberg, Paul De Maio and their entire team. Moving production from Strictly 7 to Washburn was the right decision without question. Im sure some of these turned out perfect, but the Washburn Bodens moving forward are going to be absolutely incredible! Overall the guitar is great, it really is. It does play amazingly good and I cant complain about the general fretwork.

So, maybe I can share a little review of my experience. Jim from Strictly 7 is ignoring my emails. Payments, updates, quality control, and shipping has all been addressed to and overseen by Jim at Strictly 7 Guitars. I paid my deposit back in like November I think. He asked me for final upfront payment to help him out way back in January. He then asked again last month saying it would ship in 5 days. I paid and waited 10 days then sent a simple and kind email. No update or as much as a response to my simple and easy email request for peace of mind as to whats going on. Then I see a video up on you tube stating that there are two guys who have paid in full, but oops the tops magically and conveniently have cracked, and now we need more time, since final payment has now been made that is. That right there was a big "screw you" directed straight towards me and the other guy who paid in full. But not to worry, we have two tops and are going to glue them, its just going to take a little while. I email again asking how much longer is it going to really take and get no response. Less than a week later I receive this supposed newly topped Boden 7. Thing is the top is totally dry, and it has worm holes in the swamp ash. I dont think they glued on a new top, I think they sent me a worm holed B Stock because they assumed I would prefer that over waiting, or I wouldn't notice or care. It has also been stated in the video that they are aware of the worm hole issue, that its slowing things down alot because they dont plan to use them, just paint over the worm hole ones. 

I've sent two emails with pics in the past week and gotten no response at all. I called and spoke with Curran who said Jim is too busy to respond to emails, even though my email was titled "Boden 7 Worm Hole Pics" and Im a paying customer. He also tried slick things out of every chapter in the "how to convince this guy to just keep the guitar" book. He told me that the worm holes give it character. He said they wouldn't ship out a guitar that they didn't like and these things just happen. Meanwhile theres been facebook updates with pics of newly finished boden bodies that look great!

So, Strictly 7 has officially told me that these worm holes are totally acceptable and normal and OK on a custom build. This is totally unacceptable on a nearly $3000 guitar made by a custom shop. I cant help but feel as though its a scam and a ripoff what has happened here. They seem like crooks and like a broke and desperate company.


Full shot. OK cool its a Boden




Neck has flamed maple on the middle and right piece but no flame whatsoever at all on the left piece. Odd looking but no biggie. I mean, they could have made all three pieces flamed maple, or just the middle piece the one with no flame for a balanced look but whatever.




Kind of a dry top with some discoloration on the corner. OK, no biggie I guess.




Whats this on back upper horn




What the hell is this now










I also should mention that there was a hardware issue that was ignored by Jim as well. I had to resort to Ola himself to get it straightened out. For two weeks I had no high E string. Apparently Strictly 7 knew about it but sent me the guitar with no high E string anyways.

If you did Jim a favor by paying early and he ignored you after, would you feel offended? You guys would be upset if you received a guitar with worm holes right?


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## MrYakob (May 24, 2013)

Wow, that sucks major man.... I can see why everyone seems to be dropping S7 like a hot potato. I was going to jump in on the boden 7 a few months back but I'm really glad I waited, these Washburns model look pretty solid. Hope it all gets worked out for you though.

How much of an adjustment period is there for getting used to the endurneck? I want one real bad but I obviously have no way of trying it first.


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## trianglebutt (May 24, 2013)

Wormhole on the body is ridiculous, I would be furious if I received that after all that crap.


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## decoy205 (May 24, 2013)

I'd be really upset too man. Definitely sounds fishy. The finish looks strange to me too. Is there some sort of pore filler? The worm hole shouldn't be there. uncool.


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## JosephAOI (May 24, 2013)

I'm just gonna throw this out here but the worm holes look cool to me  If they are okay structurally, I don't think it's a big deal. The dry top and stupidly uneven flame on the neck however is unacceptable on a custom handbuilt guitar. My RG7321 has the same thing but I always think, "it's a production guitar, they're not really paying attention to flame on the neck", but this is different.

In all honesty, if you have a big problem with everything that's wrong with it, I would ask for your money back and spend it elsewhere or try to get in on a Washburn Boden or talk to Ola about giving you a higher spot in his wait list for your troubles.


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## HighGain510 (May 24, 2013)

Wow....  That sucks dude, I'm glad to hear the design itself is cool but yeah totally looks like S7 is basically giving you the shaft job and pretending that stuff should be acceptable (almost looks like they tried to epoxy fill and sand that big ass hole in the body... fail ). That being said, it does give me hope that since folks seem to really love the design that the Washburn-built Boden stuff might be killer since they actually know how to build guitars and don't give people lame-ass excuses for shitty build quality or using sub-par materials!


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## zuzek (May 24, 2013)

You are being way too nice to S7G here. Shocking work/service for a US$3000 custom.


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## ramses (May 24, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> You guys would be upset if you received a guitar with worm holes right?



I can certainly see someone liking the wood like that, it is not an ugly knot; but assuming that all customers would enjoy it is simply wrong. Like you, I would be very upset if they didn't ask beforehand.

[Edit: my mistake, when production started the specs for the neck were indeed curly (flame) maple.]


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## darren (May 24, 2013)

That looks like more than just a worm hole to me. It looks like a full-blown knot (note how the rest of the grain flows around it).

Black Limba often has a lot of worm holes in it, especially the pieces with the black and red streaks... that's where a lot of the colour in limba comes from. I always do my best to avoid worm holes (although they don't bother me personally), but in Black Limba, there's often nothing you can do if the customer wants really crazy streaking. 

That said, i would never build (or ship) a guitar with worm holes without addressing the issue with the customer first.


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## MetalBuddah (May 24, 2013)

What a bunch of scrubs....


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## technomancer (May 24, 2013)

That is totally unacceptable... if he's ignoring your emails I've got to say I'd be filing a dispute for a refund 

If he thinks that's acceptable and adds character then he shouldn't be in the guitar business


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

And people wonder why these guys have a bad reputation around here.


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## Captain Shoggoth (May 24, 2013)

what the .... man?

I've been attempting to (mentally) give S7 the benefit of the doubt thus far but the email business and that knot are just ridiculous.  unacceptable

she's a beaut otherwise though


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## Vinchester (May 24, 2013)

That wormhole is ugly yes but I wouldn't mind it myself.. Barely anyone would get to see it in that position. About the dry top.. can you apply some lemon oil yourself? I'm sure it'd look better. The 1plain-2flamed-maple neck is ridiculous though!

Despite all that It's still a kick ass guitar, man.

EDIT : On second thought, I would MIND that wormhole  such a way to ruin a perfect design!


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## L1ght (May 24, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


>




No words can describe how absolutely ridiculous, disgusting, pitiful, and absolutely saddening this picture right here is. Oh well.. I guess there are a few words...

I can NOT for the life of me understand how or why this GIANT knot would be acceptable on ANY guitar, custom or not. This is, just god awful work right here. PICK A DIFFERENT BOTTOM PIECE YOU ASSHOLES, NO ONE WOULD WANT THIS SHIT. SORRY, THIS DOES NOT ADD CHARACTER.


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## mphsc (May 24, 2013)

That sucks all the way around. Hope you get money back or a new one.


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## davidadd9 (May 24, 2013)

It also kinda looks like they messed up the endurneck. It seems like it's sloppily rounded over when it should be more of a corner. Idk if this would affect the functionality but here's what it should look like.


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## Santuzzo (May 24, 2013)

Apart from the issues the guitar looks great.

I can't say whether the worm hole is acceptable or not, but the lack of communication/S7 not getting back to your e-mails is definitely not acceptable in my book.

You are a paying customer and making excuses such as 'too busy to be answering e-mails' is so lame.

I hope you can get this settled to your satisfaction. Be it you send the guitar back and get a full refund or you decide to keep it and they give you a discount. 

What I don't get is: don't they understand that a satisfied and happy customer is the best advertizing a company can get and it is in their own best interest to make the customer happy? They are obviously headed the opposite direction thus ruining their own business.


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## WillDfx (May 24, 2013)

Sorry Alain, but that thing looks absolutely disgusting hah

I feel bad you've been dealt that hand.


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## TIBrent (May 24, 2013)

Absolutely lame dude...


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

> *He told me that the worm holes give it character*. He said they wouldn't ship out a guitar that they didn't like and these things just happen.



That's the part that pisses me off. What a ....ing spin job.


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## RickyCigs (May 24, 2013)

I don't k ow if any of you guys saw, but Ola Englund posted that he wasn't renewing his contract on his signature model with S7. I'm starting to understand why. 

What's strange is that he obviously had better luck than Keith Merrow did as Ola has probably 6 or more S7 guitars, where as Keith couldn't even get one decent one. 

All I really have to say is that shit like this as well as having your only signature guitarist drop your sorry asses is pretty much leading to Strictly 7 going out of business. They seriously get more bad reviews than good. When's the last time you saw someone on here talk about how good their S7 guitar was? 

I guess that's a tough question though since no one has gotten a completed guitar in months.....



I should also point out that Egan Custom Guitars is making these now as well. If you get your money back, give Joe a shout. I'm sure he can make something FAR more acceptable for you for most likely a lot less money.


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## MetalDaze (May 24, 2013)

It's like these guys forget about the Internet and how easy it is to post pictures so EVERYONE can see it. In the "old days", maybe only your circle of friends would know you got screwed. Now, there's a public record of it.

No better way to tank your business.


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## -42- (May 24, 2013)

Let's hear it for the Washburn Custom Shop, eh?


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## Rev2010 (May 24, 2013)

In my personal opinion no new guitar, custom or production, should ever have any open cracks or holes in the neck or body wood. The only way you should have an open hole is if it was intentionally drilled or you accidentally banged the guitar against something to cause it.

Trying to get you to accept it with fluff talk is an insult on your intelligence! The proper response should have been something more like:

"We sincerely apologize you are not pleased with the instrument. How would you like to proceed? We could refund you if you return the instrument or give you a discount refunded if you'd prefer to keep it with the blemishes".

At this point I wouldn't be surprised to hear, "Ah just fill it with wood glue and draw in some wood grain lines, no one will know!" I kid I kid 


Rev.


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## MetalThrasher (May 24, 2013)

That sucks. I would be pissed too. For a $3,000 custom that is ridiculous! I hope you can get your issues worked out. Good luck!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

-42- said:


> Let's hear it for the Washburn Custom Shop, eh?



Hear hear!


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## dcoughlin1 (May 24, 2013)

I'm sorry this happened to you man. Didn't they have a video about some of the wood having worm holes and they weren't going to use them?

Edit: Found the video its around the 14 minute mark
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cevyad-fAI4&feature=youtu.be


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## Konfyouzd (May 24, 2013)

Rev2010 said:


> Trying to get you to accept it with fluff talk is an insult on your intelligence!


 
QFT


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## Rusti (May 24, 2013)

Maybe that knot (when the shape of the body was not cutted from the blank yet), being cutted along its lenght, didn't show the crack\middle of the knot and looked just like a darker grain, and then the crack apparead only when its been cutted the body shape.. maybe.
Anyway it could even look cool to someone.. but as a customer i'd want a flawless wood..


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## Minoin (May 24, 2013)

Simply unacceptable. You don't see this crap on a natural stained Squier, so a 3000 dollar guitar...
I don't get it, they are completely screwing themselves over by letting these lemons out. Worse publicity than Ola leaving IMO.
Get a refund, period.


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## DavidLopezJr (May 24, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> He also tried slick things out of every chapter in the "how to convince this guy to just keep the guitar" book. He told me that the worm holes give it character. *He said they wouldn't ship out a guitar that they didn't like and these things just happen. *Meanwhile theres been facebook updates with pics of newly finished boden bodies that look great!
> 
> If you did Jim a favor by paying early and he ignored you after, would you feel offended? You guys would be upset if you received a guitar with worm holes right?


Dude so sorry to hear this  But they fact that they think this is fine and the fact that Jim is ignoring you after you helped him out is unacceptable. So many things to  about all of this.


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## RagtimeDandy (May 24, 2013)

Just looks like a shitty, embarrassing attempt at Ola's masterpieces. I can see why he jumped ship to Washburn, I wouldn't want my name tied to that shoddy level of workmanship


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## technomancer (May 24, 2013)

Rusti said:


> Maybe that knot (when the shape of the body was not cutted from the blank yet), being cutted along its lenght, didn't show the crack\middle of the knot and looked just like a darker grain, and then the crack apparead only when its been cutted the body shape.. maybe.
> Anyway it could even look cool to someone.. but as a customer i'd want a flawless wood..



And at that point any reputable builder would discard it and make a new body, not figure oh what they hell lets ship it anyways


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## Steinmetzify (May 24, 2013)

This is completely unacceptable. I would flip shit if I paid 3k for a custom guitar and that's what showed. Their customer service AFTER you paid is inexcusable. I can't STAND companies like that. Personally, if someone doesn't have the business sense to have enough capital on hand to RUN THEIR OWN BUSINESS (i.e. asking you for money cause he's in a tight spot) I'd run like hell.....demand a refund and GTFO as fast as possible.

To the OP; sorry about your guitar, dude. New custom guitar day is supposed to be one of our BEST NGDs ever....not showing up like this and missing a high E string. Ridiculous.

On another note, I'm glad for this site and the honest reviews posted here....it's a lot easier to avoid getting screwed by guys like this when people can post their experiences and have 50,000 people read it. I'm thinking S7 will be out of business by the end of the year, and good riddance.


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## FrancescoFiligoi (May 24, 2013)

That top is as dry as the Sahara :/


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## Rusti (May 24, 2013)

technomancer said:


> And at that point any reputable builder would discard it and make a new body, not figure oh what they hell lets ship it anyways



Yup, also to a company like them it wouldnt be a huge loss to discard it. They sure lost more shipping it anyway and having it posted here.


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## JPMike (May 24, 2013)

Close down that company of .... ups!!!


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## simonXsludge (May 24, 2013)

No bueno.


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## DakiEnt (May 24, 2013)

PM Sent--I owned an S7 Boden for a short while...

Some woods commonly have worm holes, in fact I've seen a "real" *strandberg with a (filled) worm hole in black limba. I don't know if this makes you feel any better.

As for the rest of the issues, especially the communication, good grief. Having a guitar come out below standard is maybe understandable (once in a while), but it is really not that hard to provide good customer service.


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## Andromalia (May 24, 2013)

Ther worm holes in my family buffet sure don't look like that. Looks ike a cracked knot indeed.
If I ware belligerent, I'd say don't wait until a refund or dispute isn't possible anymore.


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## gunshow86de (May 24, 2013)

This makes me sad. I used to try and defend Jim and the company, but it just keeps getting worse for them. It's their own fault of course. Even if they aren't the most skilled luthiers out there, they could at least do right by their customers.


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## Floppystrings (May 24, 2013)

DakiEnt said:


> PM Sent--I owned an S7 Boden for a short while...
> 
> Some woods commonly have worm holes, in fact I've seen a "real" *strandberg with a (filled) worm hole in black limba. I don't know if this makes you feel any better.



Worm hole mod: $250+ (AAA grade worm holes $500)


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## TemjinStrife (May 24, 2013)

gunshow86de said:


> This makes me sad. I used to try and defend Jim and the company, but it just keeps getting worse for them. It's their own fault of course. Even if they aren't the most skilled luthiers out there, they could at least do right by their customers.



If they're not the most skilled of luthiers, why are they charging $3k for instruments? I mean, I understand that making guitars is expensive, but the idea is that you get what you pay for, not that they get free reign to improve themselves on the customer's dime.

Now, the real trick is in marketing. If this were a Toone build, that knot (it's a knot, not a worm hole) would be a "feature."


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## cardinal (May 24, 2013)

Agree that it looks like a knot rather than a worm hole. Wood is naturally inconsistent and some defects are hard to avoid, particularly in figured wood. 

That said, that's a major blemish in the wood and IMHO is completely unacceptable on a $3,000 guitar unless they cleared it with you by offering a discount that you agreed to. Shit happens and maybe they didn't realize how bad it was until shaping the body, but that's on the builder, not the buyer. 

I would not pay for that guitar. I'd send it back and try to get a charge back or refund.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> *driftwood guitar*



Nope. Nope nope nope.


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## Captain Butterscotch (May 24, 2013)

From .strandbergs FB page. Seemed relevant. 

"Hello everyone. 

We are aware of several customers who have had issues with recently shipped .strandberg* Boden guitars from Strictly 7 (S7). Although we are very disappointed with these recent issues and the ensuing experiences our customers have had as a result, we want to assure everyone that we are doing all we can in assisting that these customers are taken care of. Many great guitars have left the S7 shop as well.

.strandberg* production is moved to Washburn's Custom Shop in Chicago and is under way already. We also want to assure everyone that very strict quality controls are in place for everything going forward.

Strandberg Guitarworks very much values our reputation and we sincerely appreciate everyone's support as we work through these issues. We look forward to demonstrating our commitment to excellence and quality as we move forward with this next phase of .strandberg* production operations."


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## TemjinStrife (May 24, 2013)

Also, the top looks like they used light-colored grainfill on walnut instead of dark-colored grainfill.


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## Lorcan Ward (May 24, 2013)

Unacceptable.

I've always defended Strictly 7. I don't know why I've given them the benefit of the doubt but this is just pathetic. They handled the Keith Merrow incident great but they obviously didn't learn from it. 

A company with a questionable reputation sends out a guitar with such glaring flaws hoping the customer wouldn't notice or post about it on a worldwide forum is just asking for trouble. Not to mention the sent it out to somebody who has some of the top hand-made electric guitars in the world.


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## Splinterhead (May 24, 2013)

I just got my Boden 8 a couple of weeks ago. Mine is pretty much flawless. I have a bit of worm tracking on the back but I like weird stuff like that. I definitely don't have any knots, holes or structural anomalies and its the best playing instrument I've ever laid my hands on. I am very bummed for you and quite amazed that they would let this out of the shop. I would certainly like to hear the rationale behind this.


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## ola_strandberg (May 24, 2013)

Hey,
you were quicker than me - I was just about to post the statement from above here as well.

It is devastating to watch some of these guitars surfacing and hearing the stories. 

We are doing everything in our power to help set things right.

Thanks for everyone's support!

/Ola Strandberg


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## Señor Voorhees (May 24, 2013)

Holes and shit like that is totally up to personal preference. As it stands though, the popular opinion is that they're not appealing, so somebody would do best to check with the person paying and if THEY like it. 

It's pretty shitty how it all went down, but at least the guitar plays/sounds well. Being the introvert that I am, I wouldn't bother throwing a fuss over some cosmetic issues, especially when it really does actually look pretty nice for the most part. Not that I think you shouldn't tell your story. It's certainly NOT okay how it was handled, and the fact that it even happened to begin with. The more I hear about S7, the more they seem like a company that just needs to go away. Which is a damn shame for me to say, as I try to be optimistic and overly friendly towards businesses that mess things up.


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## ramses (May 24, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> Hey,
> you were quicker than me - I was just about to post the statement from above here as well.
> 
> It is devastating to watch some of these guitars surfacing and hearing the stories.
> ...



Thanks for replying, Ola. I'm also a Boden 7 customer, and I'm still waiting for mine to be done. News like this are very worrying when you are waiting for an expensive instrument.


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## Daf57 (May 24, 2013)

That sure does look like a knot to me - and if requested or at least forewarned might be a cool feature, its got like a rustic cool to it - but I totally agree that the whole deal, with the lack of communication and the shady QC is uncalled for! I hope this works out for you - good luck with what ever course you decide on.


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## Rick (May 24, 2013)

That is just beyond unacceptable.


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## MF_Kitten (May 24, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> Hey,
> you were quicker than me - I was just about to post the statement from above here as well.
> 
> It is devastating to watch some of these guitars surfacing and hearing the stories.
> ...



I know someone who is waiting for a Boden 7, who has been waiting for a long long long time, after being told conflicting information about how far along it was several times. It looks like you guys have a lot of stuff to get to with S7G at the moment. Thanks for reaching out to the community and setting things right!


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## Randy (May 24, 2013)

Santuzzo said:


> I can't say whether the worm hole is acceptable or not



Who are you and what did you do with Santuzzo?


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## MaxOfMetal (May 24, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> Now, the real trick is in marketing. If this were a Toone build, that knot (it's a knot, not a worm hole) would be a "feature."



To be fair, Rick Toone states plainly that he uses recovered/reclaimed and downright "imperfect" wood, and shows the client the pieces in advance, there's no surprise. He will also use a visually flawless piece when a customer doesn't want something so........."unique".  

Rick does also do relic'ing on a lot of his stuff. He likes the rustic thing apparently. 

If folks order a Toone, and it has knots and other defects, it's because they wanted them.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

Randy said:


> Who are you and what did you do with Santuzzo?


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## TemjinStrife (May 24, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> To be fair, Rick Toone states plainly that he uses recovered/reclaimed and downright "imperfect" wood, and shows the client the pieces in advance, there's no surprise. He will also use a visually flawless piece when a customer doesn't want something so........."unique".
> 
> Rick does also do relic'ing on a lot of his stuff. He likes the rustic thing apparently.
> 
> If folks order a Toone, and it has knots and other defects, it's because they wanted them.



I know. It was meant to be a lighthearted aside.


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## Santuzzo (May 24, 2013)

Randy said:


> Who are you and what did you do with Santuzzo?



 I saw this coming


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## Seanthesheep (May 24, 2013)

That totally looks like a cracked knot to me. I saw the S7 video mentioned in the OP and the worm holes they showed on the guitars were literal holes in the wood. 

THAT BEING SAID..... Its still absurd that this ever even got finished as a guitar. Such a glaring visual flaw is unacceptable ESPECIALLY on a natural oil finish. A friend of mine got an off the peg S7 that seemed defect free but after seeing this I know I will NEVER order anything S7. I hope Leonardo gets everything worked out between him Ola and S7. I know this isn't necessarily Olas fault but at this point the damage has been done. 

The thing that sucks is now Im a little leary of ordering a washburn boden. If all goes well I should be able to order one by the fall but I will for sure be waiting untill a bunch of them are shipped and reviewed. I wasnt an S7 basher from the start but now that they have proven themselves unable, I will wait untill washburn proves themselves. It sucks but like I said the damage has been done at this point


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

As far as I can tell, Wasburn USA >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> S7G.


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## RickyCigs (May 24, 2013)

Did anyone notice in the pics that S7 of their new bass that the batteries are TAPED down in the control cavity?


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## Rook (May 24, 2013)

Really sucks to see this Alain.

Also, props to Ola for posting here, plenty of other builders we know wouldn't make the effort to reach out like that.


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## baryton (May 24, 2013)

Leonardo you're not the first one, i had the same kind of issue with my Boden, I did not want to speak about it here but after all with the response i had from Jim i don't see why i would not do that....

here some pics about my issues and you can see also a wormhole on the 6th pics down to the red circle...
https://plus.google.com/photos/100934562882086147165/albums/5869653545128168673?banner=pwa

Jim told me that this is a "natural character" of the wood...

I did not mention that i have a little worm hole too on the walnut top just up of the bridge

When i bought it at Guitar Candy i asked for a 1 step down tuning, Bart putted a 11/49 set + 0.59 ( Finally I putted a 0.62) 
After days of playing i begun to hear some weird sound, some buzz from the Bridge, Jim yelled at me in a video that's my fault because the nut was built with specific string gauge and not the new one i putted one... 
I have also on the bridge a blocked screw (low action) for the high B string (for me a A)

Paul and Allan were very professionnal and give the answers i needed about my buzz issue, I had also a very nice video from Curran Murphy who explains how to fixe it... 

But Jim's answer... i made a mail to apologize about my possible overeaction and never has a reply... I really felt like yelling at me


despite all this shit this guitar stills awesome to play, I really fall in love with headless, the ergonomy of the body and this Endureneck is just awesome and pleasant to play...


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## geofreesun (May 24, 2013)

^ wow i totally did not expect to see this coming! so many worm holes and now i am really worried about mine. give me a few more days and i will post pix when mine arrives.


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## Xaios (May 24, 2013)

When I read that your guitar had worm holes, I assumed you meant this:







I was disappointed.


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## capoeiraesp (May 24, 2013)

That's totally unacceptable. I'm sorry that you've been so badly bent over. Where is the accountability?


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## Bigfan (May 24, 2013)

MF_Kitten said:


> I know someone who is waiting for a Boden 7, who has been waiting for a long long long time, after being told conflicting information about how far along it was several times. It looks like you guys have a lot of stuff to get to with S7G at the moment. Thanks for reaching out to the community and setting things right!



Jim told me this on the 27th of March: "Just wanted to let you know your Boden will be finishing up in the next 1-3 weeks".

He then told me later that neither the body nor the neck was done yet. I know the BFR guys have waited longer on customs, but I still don't feel great about a custom I've paid in full for being delayed for 4 months.

I'm honestly thinking about cutting my losses and selling the spot.


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## JSanta (May 24, 2013)

I did end up selling my Boden 8, but not because it wasn't a nice guitar, just playing archtops now. What you've experienced is unacceptable. I saw the post on facebook earlier and wondered what it was about, and obviously this is it. Really sorry that something like this happened, I would have been devastated if mine had come out like that. Let us know what the resolution is.


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## Erockomania (May 24, 2013)

I give this company a year or two, tops.

You don't treat customers like crap and get away with it these days.

They were on the plate for me but I went Skervesen instead because of all the crap I hear about S7G. (and because Skervesen just kills on them on looks, wood selection, communication, etc...)

They had lots of promise but you can't run a company like this and be successful. ESPECIALLY a custom guitar company. The customers are pretty darn discerning and there is plenty of competition around. Competition with great communication, faster build times and better guitars. 

Shape up or ship out, S7G. I'm glad the Olas (Strandberg and Englund) have moved on. Maybe the decrease in orders will turn this ship around.


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## Erockomania (May 24, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> [/URL]



Why the hell wouldn't they treat this in some way? Fill.. SOMETHING! I can't believe they'd send a guitar out with a cracked knot! 

Could that propagate?


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## Jedi_Ekim (May 24, 2013)

I'm weird. I really like odd pieces of wood.

But I sure as heck wouldn't expect anything like that without plenty of warning beforehand, as well as lots pics of the unfinished body before they started working on it. My only concern would be structural but on a horn... I'd probably say "go for it" regardless.

This sure doesn't look good for this company, especially for the price paid. The sad thing is what custom folks out there do good work? It sure seems like every time a small custom shop opens up they get backed up to a ridiculous degree and then crank out crap or go MIA.


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## Zado (May 24, 2013)

mmmm oooook, let's keep buying under 1000 non-custom guitars.You know,I prefer instruments with less....character


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## Jonathan20022 (May 24, 2013)

Christ looking at the bodens on their Facebook is horrendous, I can't imagine why they don't do Natural finishes more often. The treatment of these woods is ridiculous.






That small black spot looks worrying, and definitely unexpected. 






Aesthetic, but what the hell is up with that stuff on the binding?

Honestly, I found it beyond suspicious when Acle jumped ship before he even got his custom. Ola joining and playing the Solars was encouraging, but everyone's been jumping ship. Josh Travis also silently left, which was pretty surprising, even more so that they held up on the road from his playing and abuse haha.



> mmmm oooook, let's keep buying under 1000&#8364; non-custom guitars.You know,I prefer instruments with less....character



Couldn't agree more, I'm sticking to production instruments. At least when a flaw is evident the company has to provide support and can't just ignore your calls. They're supposed to be held by their word.


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## Rhoadkiller (May 24, 2013)

WOW strictly 7 more like strictly garbage .... these guys are really out of control .. lol that is super unacceptable!


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## mniel8195 (May 24, 2013)

im confused how ola decided to start this relationship in the first place??? if anything i think it devalues his brand just as much as strictly 7.


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## -42- (May 24, 2013)

mniel8195 said:


> im confused how ola decided to start this relationship in the first place??? if anything i think it devalues his brand just as much as strictly 7.



To be fair SSG had seemingly stepped up their game when Strandberg signed on with them, I just don't think they can handle QC in any sort of volume. Jim has gotten as far as he has on charisma and price point, not consistentsy.


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## Zerox8610 (May 24, 2013)

That's completely unacceptable on even a $200 guitar. How the hell are these guys even still in business?

In the video posted, they complain about how humidity is affecting their guitars and causing problems.... My first thought was "THEN ....ING MOVE!!" Your business is dealing with wood and creating guitars worth multiple thousands of dollars, not putting strings on driftwood.


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## engage757 (May 24, 2013)

technomancer said:


> And at that point any reputable builder would discard it and make a new body, not figure oh what they hell lets ship it anyways



This. Many builders would cut the body up. Let us not forget, most shops would never even CUT a shape with that in it to begin with. We posted this on Guitar Porn. Tired of people getting ripped off by this sub-par company. You wouldn't believe some of the emails and comments we have had. One guy had his rebuilt THREE TIMES and it still isn't right. We had a statement from Paul De Maio and Ola though, so no worries with them.

Hope they will fix this for you Alain my brotha. It's such a shame to see this happen and it is totally unacceptable.


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## engage757 (May 24, 2013)

Seanthesheep said:


> The thing that sucks is now Im a little leary of ordering a washburn boden. If all goes well I should be able to order one by the fall but I will for sure be waiting untill a bunch of them are shipped and reviewed. I wasnt an S7 basher from the start but now that they have proven themselves unable, I will wait untill washburn proves themselves. It sucks but like I said the damage has been done at this point



I have had several Washburn USA Customs, and Custom Parkers, built by the same guys. Don't be leery. As much as I am NOT a Washburn fan, the Custom Shop boys are top notch and the brand is EXTREMELY well-established. I wouldn't hesitate in the slightest.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2013)

engage757 said:


> the Custom Shop boys are top notch and the brand is EXTREMELY well-established.





140 years under their belt vs someone with... ...., I don't even know. Less than a decade? 

Shit, the first time I heard of them was back during Winter NAMM 2010.


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## DoomMantia (May 24, 2013)

Unacceptable


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## poopyalligator (May 24, 2013)

Man, I saw that and my jaw just dropped in disbelief thinking about how a luthier would send out a guitar like that and be okay with that. That is just disgusting. I don't care how well it played, the fact that they used that piece of wood and didn't address that problem in the beginning is just beyond my belief. Anybody with integrity and commitment to quality would know that is wrong. Especially on a 3,000 dollar instrument.


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## s_k_mullins (May 24, 2013)

engage757 said:


> I have had several Washburn USA Customs, and Custom Parkers, built by the same guys. Don't be leery. As much as I am NOT a Washburn fan, the Custom Shop boys are top notch and the brand is EXTREMELY well-established. I wouldn't hesitate in the slightest.



Definitely agree with this. I used to have a Washburn P3 from the Chicago custom shop. And it was a very well built guitar!


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## Seanthesheep (May 25, 2013)

engage757 said:


> I have had several Washburn USA Customs, and Custom Parkers, built by the same guys. Don't be leery. As much as I am NOT a Washburn fan, the Custom Shop boys are top notch and the brand is EXTREMELY well-established. I wouldn't hesitate in the slightest.



Not trying to start shit or any flame wars or that Im even saying I wont touch anything thats not a "real" strandberg. Ill just wait until a bunch of these new bodens start coming out and getting reviewed. As big as a company washburn is, it is still possible for them to put a bad product out. Also Ive never seen any washburns in person before that weren't cheap off shore made guitars. Maybe its because Im too young or for whatever other reason but I just dont have that faith in them you have


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## DavidLopezJr (May 25, 2013)

Seanthesheep said:


> Also Ive never seen any washburns in person before that weren't cheap off shore made guitars. Maybe its because Im too young or for whatever other reason but I just dont have that faith in them you have


He's talking about their Custom Shop stuff. They pretty much always have gotten great reviews.


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## engage757 (May 25, 2013)

Seanthesheep said:


> Not trying to start shit or any flame wars or that Im even saying I wont touch anything thats not a "real" strandberg. Ill just wait until a bunch of these new bodens start coming out and getting reviewed. As big as a company washburn is, it is still possible for them to put a bad product out. Also Ive never seen any washburns in person before that weren't cheap off shore made guitars. Maybe its because Im too young or for whatever other reason but I just dont have that faith in them you have



Well, depending on your age, you may have grandchildren before you get the chance to touch a "real" Strandberg. 

Washburn USA Custom Shop stuff is top-notch, and involves most of the Parker Custom Shop boys as well. As much as I (again) dislike Washburn guitars, I would literally be shocked into a near-COMA if they didn't put out at the very LEAST a flawless, well-built, instrument with great and consistent quality control.


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## L1ght (May 25, 2013)

engage757 said:


> Well, depending on your age, you may have grandchildren before you get the chance to touch a "real" Strandberg.



I don't know, I wouldn't go that far to be quite honest because everyone has a price. What it comes down to in the end is what the guitar is actually worth to both the buyer and the seller. I mean just a two months ago someone here in NJ was selling their strandberg, and it wasn't even that expensive, as far as strandbergs go. Are they rare? Absolutely. But they aren't bigfoot rare.


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## engage757 (May 25, 2013)

L1ght said:


> I don't know, I wouldn't go that far to be quite honest because everyone has a price. What it comes down to in the end is what the guitar is actually worth to both the buyer and the seller. I mean just a two months ago someone here in NJ was selling their strandberg, and it wasn't even that expensive, as far as strandbergs go. Are they rare? Absolutely. But they aren't bigfoot rare.



Tell that to my #372 build slot.


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## Seanthesheep (May 25, 2013)

engage757 said:


> Tell that to my #372 build slot.



#329


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## DavidLopezJr (May 25, 2013)

engage757 said:


> Tell that to my #372 build slot.


Holy crap. Surpised people haven't started selling their spots at a profit yet.


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## Danukenator (May 25, 2013)

Man, this is unbelievable. I hope S7 sorts your shit out for you. Hopefully Ola has some pull with them.


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## rcsierra13 (May 25, 2013)

I can only think of one artist left with them and that's Chimp Spanner. 

He got his signature recently (head over to the ERG section to check it out) and said it was great, though there were a few complications and it still doesn't have the pickguard on it.


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## Alberto7 (May 25, 2013)

rcsierra13 said:


> I can only think of one artist left with them and that's Chimp Spanner.
> 
> He got his signature recently (head over to the ERG section to check it out) and said it was great, though there were a few complications and it still doesn't have the pickguard on it.



Wait, seriously? They couldn't even get that one right? Jesus Christ . Can't they just produce a guitar WITHOUT any hassle? Like, you know, $200 Ibanez Gio's and the like. Cheap guitars for sure, but no silly defects like that. Much less a gigantic knot on it, which, by the way, is just gross. Wood with knots looks, to me, like decaying matter.

And here I was thinking that endorsees were favored over regular customers.

It's a shame, too, because a lot of S7 guitars that I've seen actually look great.


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## toiletstand (May 25, 2013)

rcsierra13 said:


> I can only think of one artist left with them and that's Chimp Spanner.
> 
> He got his signature recently (head over to the ERG section to check it out) and said it was great, though there were a few complications and it still doesn't have the pickguard on it.


i thought that was one of the lighting(something else?) techs for chimp spanner?


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## MF_Kitten (May 25, 2013)

I think the obvious thing they could have done if they gave a damn at all, is to use that body blank on a different guitar that has a finish over it. Gibson-style.


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## Larrikin666 (May 25, 2013)

Wow man. I started to read through this yesterday and got so upset that I had to stop. This is a huge bummer. I've been skeptical of these guys from the start. I knew another one of their artists who never used his guitar. I was an absolute mess. I hope you get everything resolved.


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## JP Universe (May 25, 2013)

seriously, Is anyone surprised about the result? We called out Chris about a month ago on s7 and despite all the fan boys that backed him here we are.... Im so glad ive never bought a s7 guitar and i have sso to thank for it!, And this is coming from a guy that hasn't even touched s7 stuff  - guys that are interested in getting into guitar luthiery... Ensure you have customer service sorted out before you begin, please!!!!! FFS I can't believe this!! In saying this I do say that my money for a Washburn custom cl sig is on the cards  and my 2 spots just gained some more mojo  Ola Strandberg is the real deal


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## DarkWolfXV (May 25, 2013)

What actually bothers me, is that you are saying "OK, no biggie"
Why the .... are you conforming to mediocrity? You paid for that guitar, it better not be less than perfect, especially if its a custom.


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## SamSam (May 25, 2013)

I'm really sorry about your build man, I hope you can sort something out there.

To the Washburn doubter, dude Washburn have put out more epic guitars than Ola will ever make himself, they have a vast amount of experience and I doubt they will mess these up. Ola won't risk another venture like this unless he's certain it will work. Just look at the Parkers Washburn are making.

Hell, I'd say you will definitely get a great instrument from their custom shop, quite posibly better Strandberg than you will from Ola!

And to the guys sat around the 300 mark on the list, I'm speccing out mine with Ola now


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## Basti (May 25, 2013)

S7 posted something on facebook addressing this case in particular and apologising if I'm not mistaken, I just wondering if they have actually got back to you/got round to sorting things out?


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## Lorcan Ward (May 25, 2013)

> Curran here guys, I spoke with that guy for about 35-45 minutes on the phone and gave him two options for his complaint.
> The option he wanted to pursue BEFORE he posted this, was that we build him a new body, send him pix, and let him chose from about 12 different bodies. I know everyone hates that knot/wormhole in the wood, and I get it, you all hate the knot/wormhole in the wood. This guy tells me it is the greatest guitar he has ever played and he loves it but for this cosmetic issue. I must be weird, but I DIG how that looks, I love those kinds of things, Jim and I must be bored with plain grain wood or something. We are going to build this guy a new body if he still wants one. So you can all hate Jim, and me, and everything that gets built by S7 if you want, BUT I know that we work really hard to build the best guitars we can. We apologize that you ALL think this is unacceptable and lame, and going forward we have some ideas to try and not have this happen for people that buy S7 Guitars. I also know there is an endless issue with people not getting responses from Jim through emails when they want. It is the same old discussion, if Jim answers every email he gets right away, he would literally spend 16 hours a day on the computer and NOTHING else. With only two other guys working in the shop full time and one on site painter, and one new trainee, this would cut down our production by more than 1/3 or more. Jim tries his hardest to get to these emails as often as he can, and I have been trying through the facebook to help as well. Things are always improving and we are all working our hardest on every level for this company. I hope this address' the concerns and lets you all know that Jim and S7 have not left this guy out in the cold over the cosmetic flaw of his guitar.



Taken from their facebook page.


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## Datura (May 25, 2013)

Has a passive aggressive feel to it.


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## zuzek (May 25, 2013)

Mr Curran Dude said:


> I know everyone hates that knot/wormhole in the wood, and I get it, you all hate the knot/wormhole in the wood ... I must be weird, but I DIG how that looks, I love those kinds of things, Jim and I must be bored with plain grain wood or something.



Fool. What part of 'customer is king' do you not understand when running a professional custom build business? If your paying customer wants a mahogany body soaked in buffalo mucus, it should be in your best interest to try and achieve that. You literally say that you already know everyone but yourself hates knots or wormholes in wood. Then why are you using bodies for US$3000 custom builds that have this?! Your personal opinion and taste is of zero value and should never be superimposed on a customer. There is zero moral ground for any defense here. Own up to the fact that you screwed up.



Mr Curran Dude said:


> I also know there is an endless issue with people not getting responses from Jim through emails when they want. It is the same old discussion, if Jim answers every email he gets right away, he would literally spend 16 hours a day on the computer and NOTHING else.



'Right away?' Customers wait for several weeks, if not for all eternity, until a reply can be found in their inbox. When Mayones, where I've bought my guitar, is able to answer any and all queries within 24 hours, you should be able to do the same, if not beat it. They are your direct competition for crying out loud. Want to know a secret about doing good customs business? If you get this one right, you've won half the battle... Can't guess it? Service.

I don't buy their defensiveness and excuses. If you realize that you are unable to attend to customer queries, you simply hire an extra person to do it. There is no excuse about extra financial cost. The improvement in reputation and service quality will pay itself back multiple times over...

...provided you get the quality of your product right though.


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## technomancer (May 25, 2013)

Got to love the passive-aggressive attitude, especially since they're only correcting the issue because this went public.



Seanthesheep said:


> Not trying to start shit or any flame wars or that Im even saying I wont touch anything thats not a "real" strandberg. Ill just wait until a bunch of these new bodens start coming out and getting reviewed. As big as a company washburn is, it is still possible for them to put a bad product out. Also Ive never seen any washburns in person before that weren't cheap off shore made guitars. Maybe its because Im too young or for whatever other reason but I just dont have that faith in them you have



Washburn's cheap imports are a far cry from their USA stuff, the USA shop builds amazing instruments. These new Bodens should be fantastic guitars.


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## Rev2010 (May 25, 2013)

technomancer said:


> Got to love the passive-aggressive attitude, especially since they're only correcting the issue because this went public.



Yeah that response was worse than keeping silent. They still don't get how to handle customer service. You never mention the customer complaining, you simply apologize and offer to fix it. That whole bit about Jim would be on the computer for 16 hours a day answering emails is laughable. S7 is nowhere near as popular as other custom shops, there's no way he gets such an incredibly high flood of emails as to take that much time. And even if he did have a lot of emails I can't see why he'd have to interrupt his woodshop work, answer them after hours!

I feel bad for them in a sense, I'd spoken with Jim in the past and he was a very nice guy, and in the time they've been around he's improved substantially from his earlier work. All that doesn't matter though if they don't have the savvy for proper customer service.


Rev.


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## engage757 (May 25, 2013)

Where is that on their Facebook page? I am not seeing it at all.


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## Datura (May 25, 2013)

Maybe he's so out of touch with computers it takes him 16 hours to find his emails?


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## TVasquez96 (May 25, 2013)

LEMON GRAB UNACCEPTABLE - YouTube


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## Black Mamba (May 25, 2013)

Curran said:


> I know everyone hates that knot/wormhole in the wood, and I get it, you all hate the knot/wormhole in the wood. I must be weird, but I DIG how that looks, I love those kinds of things, Jim and I must be bored with plain grain wood or something.


 
Curran that's great. When YOU'RE spending 3 grand on a custom guitar, by all means request as many wormholes as YOU like, since YOU love it so much. The thing YOU'RE forgetting is that the recipient of the guitar did not request wormholes.


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## MF_Kitten (May 25, 2013)

zuzek said:


> When Mayones, where I've bought my guitar, is able to answer any and all queries within 24 hours, you should be able to do the same, if not beat it. They are your direct competition for crying out loud. Want to know a secret about doing good customs business? If you get this one right, you've won half the battle... Can't guess it? Service.



Hell, I've had emails answered by Schecter... F'ING SCHECTER! They could simply not have any form of customer service and still do fine, yet I got an email back about it! 

All builders I have emailed, even when it wasn't to ask about pricing or whatever, have replied to me quickly.


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## JP7 (May 25, 2013)

I can't believe that they would charge that and somehow justify it to themselves. They shouldn't be able to sell that guitar. The attention to detail is astonishingly low the neck being partly flamed? Nigh high E? Endurneck not perfect? WORMHOLES? Im sorry to hear this happened to you man. I saw your post on Guitar Porn on facebook I like that your getting the word out there so more people don't get there money taken for a bad product


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## cardinal (May 25, 2013)

Talk about digging a deeper hole. Appropriate response would simply have been a sentence to the effect of "we're aware that customer is dissatisfied and are working to make it right." Not passive aggressive attempt to justify an obvious issue.


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## AscendingMatt (May 25, 2013)

definitely passive agressive. They dont care they just want money imo


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## jsl2h90 (May 25, 2013)

WTF so glad I waited for the washberg run. That sucks man I would be pissed and expect nothing less than perfectiom at that price. S7 will get none of my money. For what its worth, HNGD man.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 25, 2013)

> I must be weird, but I DIG how that looks



It's not your guitar, you ....waffle.


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## Erockomania (May 25, 2013)

16 hours? BS. That means if he waits ONE day, then he has 32 hours of emails to answer. I get 200+ emails daily and I don't spend more than a couple hours tops. If he has 1000+ emails per day, he NEEDS TO HIRE SOMEBODY to help him in order to GIVE GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE! 

I'm sorry, if you are putting out several $3000 guitars per week and plan on keeping your business, having some employees to take care of the customer service aspect is worth far more than the salary of the person you will hire. Customer service is king. It's that simple. A company putting out mediocre guitars can get away with a higher price tag if they have GREAT customer service. Alternatively, a company that builds great guitars will not stick around if their customer service is shit even if the price is reasonable for what you get. When you bring these questionable business practices into the equation, you have a company that will fail. Bad customer service and poor QC will spell disaster for ANY company. There have been too many of these stories about S7G to think they stand a chance unless they turn this crap around quickly.

If they don't see this, they don't deserve to be in business because they simply don't understand the basics.


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## leonardo7 (May 25, 2013)

Wow thanks for the support and concern guys! People need to know which companies to stay away from. 

Its interesting how many people have PM'd me on here or Facebook telling me about their issues that they have not came out publicly with. I am definitely not even close to being the only one. By the way, the Nuno Bettencourt Washburn I played at NAMM '12 was actually in the top two nicest playing 7 strings at NAMM '12 from what I remember. I was totally impressed with it. Anyone who is skeptical of the Washburn CS is just being paranoid and has no clue. They do good work, dont trip. 

I could easily respond to everyone but just randomly chose a few.



ramses said:


> By the way, there seems to be another issue with your guitar. The neck was supposed to be Birdseye Maple, not regular maple with some flame. Both the neck and the fretboard must be birdseye maple.



Birsdeye or flame, all I know is that I got one of the three pieces with absolutely no figuring at all 



darren said:


> That looks like more than just a worm hole to me. It looks like a full-blown knot (note how the rest of the grain flows around it).
> 
> Black Limba often has a lot of worm holes in it, especially the pieces with the black and red streaks... that's where a lot of the colour in limba comes from. I always do my best to avoid worm holes (although they don't bother me personally), but in Black Limba, there's often nothing you can do if the customer wants really crazy streaking.
> 
> That said, i would never build (or ship) a guitar with worm holes without addressing the issue with the customer first.



Thats all it takes, discuss it with the customer beforehand, decide on whether your going to use it or not and there shouldn't be any issues. I think these guys bought the cheapest priced swamp ash they could find. It was probably priced well because it was marked down due to to knots and holes.



HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> That's the part that pisses me off. What a ....ing spin job.



You nailed it. That might be the most annoying part of it all, right up there with the issues having existed to begin with. He was talking to me like Im a n00b. I had to listen to him for 15 minutes trying to convince me that I should prefer the guitar the way it is, because after all, thats how they wanted it. 



Erockomania said:


> I give this company a year or two, tops



The guys at S7G appear to be broke given all of the evidence. I dont see them surviving in the guitar making world for too long. I suppose I could send the guitar back and they would have to refund me but he's saying it will take 3 months for a refund! 3 months!? Ive paid nearly 3k here, half of which I paid over 6 months ago, and now Im going to wait 3 more months with no guitar and no cash? And with a company that could file for bankruptcy in that timeframe? 



ola_strandberg said:


> Hey,
> you were quicker than me - I was just about to post the statement from above here as well.
> 
> It is devastating to watch some of these guitars surfacing and hearing the stories.
> ...



I support you Ola! Your designs and guitars are fantastic to say the least! You gave Strictly 7 a shot, they had the world ahead of them, and they failed. 



> Curran here guys, I spoke with that guy for about 35-45 minutes on the phone and gave him two options for his complaint.
> The option he wanted to pursue BEFORE he posted this, was that we build him a new body, send him pix, and let him chose from about 12 different bodies. I know everyone hates that knot/wormhole in the wood, and I get it, you all hate the knot/wormhole in the wood. This guy tells me it is the greatest guitar he has ever played and he loves it but for this cosmetic issue. I must be weird, but I DIG how that looks, I love those kinds of things, Jim and I must be bored with plain grain wood or something. We are going to build this guy a new body if he still wants one. So you can all hate Jim, and me, and everything that gets built by S7 if you want, BUT I know that we work really hard to build the best guitars we can. We apologize that you ALL think this is unacceptable and lame, and going forward we have some ideas to try and not have this happen for people that buy S7 Guitars. I also know there is an endless issue with people not getting responses from Jim through emails when they want. It is the same old discussion, if Jim answers every email he gets right away, he would literally spend 16 hours a day on the computer and NOTHING else. With only two other guys working in the shop full time and one on site painter, and one new trainee, this would cut down our production by more than 1/3 or more. Jim tries his hardest to get to these emails as often as he can, and I have been trying through the facebook to help as well. Things are always improving and we are all working our hardest on every level for this company. I hope this address' the concerns and lets you all know that Jim and S7 have not left this guy out in the cold over the cosmetic flaw of his guitar.



I thank him for going public and stating that it will be resolved. That is appreciated. Im not going to pick apart the lies, or misinterpretations of this statement as I feel I have done that enough. 

I dont care about how many emails he gets and about how much time is wasted on emails etc. I care about my email and I care about my situation. Lets not forget why we even have a situation to begin with. By the way, Jim sure does have the time to email us when he needs money. 

Finally, its not about getting the issue resolved, its about asking me to pay in full several months in advance, then asking again saying its ready to ship in a few days, then lying and saying it has a cracked top right after I do pay in full, then sending me a B stock and in the condition it was in, then being ignored, then being treated like an idiot. If he wants to build me a new body then I will believe it when I see it. If I get a new body built then yes I will be happy with the guitar, but it wont change the BS I had to go through to get it. I dont think people want to deal with a company that has these risks.


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## Mr-Jemhead93 (May 25, 2013)

What a joke, if I were you I would've complained and asked for a replacement ATLEAST. Like everyone else has already stated 3k is way to much money just to settle and accept what lame ass excuse those dudes over at that "company" gave you. S7 is seriously just digging their own grave now


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## ramses (May 25, 2013)

Paul made me realize that I was looking at an old spec sheet. The neck was not supposed to be birdseye maple anymore, but curly maple, which you did receive, mostly.


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## Erockomania (May 25, 2013)

He doesn't have time to respond to emails but he can talk shi** on the phone for a half an hour? 

These guys are a joke. Man am I glad I went the Skervesen route. 

I met Curran (I think) at NAMM... seemed like a nice enough guy. Before NAMM I was very interested in the S7G guitars... went to the booth at NAMM and noticed various cosmetic issues with the display guitars. Fretboards not joining well with necks, chips in the wood, sharp frets, etc... It was at that point I decided not to spend my money with them and that was BEFORE all these customer service issues started appearing. 

You're probably right about them not lasting even a year. These seemingly innocuous issues (to them) are HUGE issues to a community such as this. We are spoiled and we know what to look for in a quality instrument. IMHO, they would be better off offering "off-the-shelf" instruments at a far cheaper price. Nothing custom. Make Schecter Diamond series competition.


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## Forkface (May 25, 2013)

I remember about a year ago I was seriously considering these guys for a 7 string. I'm kinda glad i waited, even if my guitar came out good, I would hate to be related to a company that eventually became this.

I genuinely hope you can figure out a way to solve this Leo


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## leonardo7 (May 25, 2013)

Im sure those of you who follow the guitar porn page saw this already. Check out this guys story! 

https://www.facebook.com/pornguitar/posts/175447149288064

Its a really long read, but here is his story. I can relate. Sounds very familiar in nature.



> I ....ing love guitar. I love amps, gear, guitars, recording, making music. I'm not in a band. I don't record videos of myself playing covers and post them on YouTube. I'm not a regular fixture on guitar forums. Its all just recreational and therapeutic for me. But I'm very passionate about it.
> 
> I've been collecting guitars for a few years now. My tastes lean more toward the new and innovative rather than vintage and rare (although I appreciate the classics). I've been playing Ibanez for decades but recently I've acquired Mayones, Parker, PRS, ESP, etc&#8230;
> 
> ...


----------



## L1ght (May 25, 2013)

That was an excellent read, and a really well-written message. I hope more people who have flaws like these and yours will come forth, no matter the degree of flaw. It's messages/posts like these that will put this shit company in to the ground. 

It doesn't matter HOW much you spend on an item, a customer should never be lied to, put down, and treated like they are some kind of idiot. The fact that this is happening with ridiculously expensive guitars only makes the situation that much more worse.


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## RagtimeDandy (May 25, 2013)

L1ght said:


> It doesn't matter HOW much you spend on an item, a customer should never be lied to, put down, and treated like they are some kind of idiot. The fact that this is happening with ridiculously expensive guitars only makes the situation that much more worse.



Bingo. There's no excuse to be acting like an immature asshat because a customer is unsatisfied with a blatantly careless product. Pathetic attitude


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## Nicki (May 25, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> I thank him for going public and stating that it will be resolved. That is appreciated. Im not going to pick apart the lies, or misinterpretations of this statement as I feel I have done that enough.



I figured bringing this thread to their facebook page might get you some better results. Glad to know I could help in some small way


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## Rick (May 25, 2013)

rcsierra13 said:


> I can only think of one artist left with them and that's Chimp Spanner.
> 
> He got his signature recently (head over to the ERG section to check it out) and said it was great, though there were a few complications and it still doesn't have the pickguard on it.



Jim from Chimp Spanner, not Paul. Just clarifying.


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## engage757 (May 25, 2013)

We have been getting tons of emails at guitar porn and comments. One guy had a S7 rebuilt 3 times! It STILL wasn't right! Definitely not an isolated incident, and when you get off of the forums you truly realize how many issues these guitars have. Just the amount of issues for a small community like this is unacceptable, let alone when you see the volume of people that have never even HEARD of this forum or don't frequent forums at all that have no outlet for help or to express their problems with the guitar.

I am of the opinion, seeing it from both sides, that the only reason this is being resolved is because of the 20k plus views at GP for the thread and this thread here. I only wonder how many people have no way of expressing their frustration and thus are being left out in the cold by the "company". Wondering basically if Strictly 7 is ONLY dealing with it because of the negative publicity it is getting. One might think so from Curran's little remark. Definitely Passive aggressive in nature.


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## GreatWhiteYeti (May 25, 2013)

yeah if I was the customer I'd probably lose it over having my issue posted on Facebook. They need to hire a publicist or something. That's F'd up


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 25, 2013)

After Keith's rant a few months ago, all the endorsers leaving, ESPECIALLY Ola Englund, Ola Stranberg switching to Washburn, and these cluster....s of quality control and customer support, I'd be more than surprised if these guys keep getting orders and stay afloat


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## MF_Kitten (May 25, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> After Keith's rant a few months ago, all the endorsers leaving, ESPECIALLY Ola Englund, Ola Stranberg switching to Washburn, and these cluster....s of quality control and customer support, I'd be more than surprised if these guys keep getting orders and stay afloat



There are a few more BIG names that have been approached by them and received crappy instruments. Trust me, they've embarrassed themselves more than what has been made public!


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## Edika (May 26, 2013)

I was planning to make a similar joke as Xaios about wormholes and interstellar travel as well as providing the actual worms with the wormholes but I got so bumped out by reading this thread that I can only offer my sincerest sympathies to the OP and the rest of the people that received these sub par instruments and hope you will be able to resolve the situation.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 26, 2013)

The more I read through older S7 threads, the greater feeling of mine, and others', vindication. 

Remember, if you see the following on here from a company, fu_c_king run:

- Too good to be true pricing.
- Rampant endorsing.
- Guitars being sold in a very short span of time.
- Guitars being sold over and over. 
- Builders going "production". 
- Majority of NGDs and support posted by super new users/blatant shills. 

If you see at least two of those circumstances, run. Really. There's not a single builder that has used those tactics that didn't turn out to be a fu_c_king loser.


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## engage757 (May 26, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The more I read through older S7 threads, the greater feeling of mine, and others', vindication.
> 
> Remember, if you see the following on here from a company, fu_c_king run:
> 
> ...





These are the reasons I stayed away from them. EVERYONE should take note of this when dealing with custom guitar builders!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 26, 2013)

It's like when the Ibanez M8M came out and people were complaining about the price, saying you can get a custom built to similar specs.

Wanna know why people want the M8M instead of a custom? That's fu*c*king why.


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## trianglebutt (May 26, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> *- Rampant endorsing.*



This was really what turned me off to S7. If your product is truly quality, you don't need a bunch of endorsements to back you up.


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## Fred the Shred (May 26, 2013)

I can't complain about the S7G's I had, yet that is irrelevant pertaining the explosive mix of what is in essence a rather dodgy axe (yes, wormholes aren't a structural issue, no you shouldn't leave the things there because YOU find it cool without discussing it with the customer, not to mention the 2/3 figured maple neck for no apparent reason) and communication issues having a terrible effect on customer support.

The stuff I've seen depicted before has some truth to it (it isn't uncommon for frets to stick out on a very fresh guitar as it is exposed to more drastic climate changes), but there is also the "glue sticking out is normal" thing, which, let's face it, it really isn't as you always make sure you get rid of any excess prior to claiming a guitar is ready to ship. The condescending, borderline passive aggressive thing is uncalled for, as there are many ways to solve an issue or tranquilize the customer pertaining something he wasn't expecting.

What I have seen, over time, is something I've been fearful of for a while, namely the whole issue with a company selling customs too cheap, thus getting flooded with orders due to high profile endorsees, thus not having enough money to fund the expansion to meet the demand, and it quickly becomes a vicious cycle. A shame, really, as they are nice folks, and I see little chance of them turning things around.



trianglebutt said:


> This was really what turned me off to S7. If your product is truly quality, you don't need a bunch of endorsements to back you up.



Endorsements are a rather targetted and effective way of publicizing what you do. The bad size is, of course, that you need to be able to cope with the customer orders while maintaining the endorsees going without compromising either - it's a delicate balance, and in this case you have quite a few examples of shit hitting the fan on both fronts. Again, a shame, and the kind of mistake that WILL cost the company.


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## Xaios (May 26, 2013)

Indeed. I remember BRJ got a whole string of endorsements right before shit hit the fan as well.


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## HighGain510 (May 26, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The more I read through older S7 threads, the greater feeling of mine, and others', vindication.
> 
> Remember, if you see the following on here from a company, fu_c_king run:
> 
> ...




Yep, I posted my feelings about several S7G guitars that hit the board based solely on what I could EASILY tell from pics as well as the specific issues noted by the folks who had the guitars in their hands and received blowback from several guys on here (many of which still had their S7's in their possession, and strangely enough had ended up listed said guitars within the next few weeks/months... rather bizarre, and *completely* unrelated, turn of events, eh?!  )... I feel much better about saying what I had said back when I said it. Often times pricing that is too good to be true usually is, and when you're paying $2500-3K to a builder who at the time has less than 1-2 dozen builds under their belts, you're likely making a huge mistake.  Live and learn I guess, but sometimes folks are pointing this stuff out to help YOU out so you don't get burned months down the road. 

Also keep in mind what I posted above is not directed at you Leonardo, I sincerely hope either you get a refund or they send you a non-flawed body if you're okay keeping the neck they sent you.  Hopefully the other guys waiting on S7-build Boden's don't get the "SURPRISE, ARTSY WORMHOLES!!!" attempt from Curran on their guitars when they first open the box!


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## Fred the Shred (May 26, 2013)

I'm hardly as dramatic, but I'm not one to find that my own positive experience is a rule or has me ignoring the obvious inconsistencies in their stuff. Some of the duds I've seen coming from them always make me wonder what sort of rather weird phenomenon could be the source of the monster discrepancies found there, as I can't for the life of me conceive a company that implies you getting lucky with which employee handles the guitar or something!

If I had received the "artsy wormhole guitar" or something like Keith's disastrous guitar, I'd have gone mental and addressed the thing mercilessly. I would be so infuriated that I'd even bum HighGain510 dry. Again.


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## welsh_7stinger (May 26, 2013)

This whole thing seems really shitty. I personally like abnormalities in the wood, but if i was paying for a CUSTOM guitar and I did NOT want any abnormalities then I SHOULD have no surprises. I hope you get all this sorted.


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## TheWarAgainstTime (May 26, 2013)

When I first heard about S7 guitars, I was turned off of them simply because I didn't like the way their neck joints looked  Having a random outburst of internet-famous endorsees seemed a little fishy as well. I'm sorry to hear about the OP's wormhole'd guitar, and hope everything gets cleared up with it, as the problems you've faced are completely inexcusable from a shop when you've already payed in full.


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## Gilbertsgotbrootz (May 26, 2013)

Damn I guess I just got really lucky on the solar I had ... I have had quite a few high end guitars from private stock prs to mayones , fender masterbuilt etc . The solar I had was a solid guitar and the only reason I sold it was the 27.5 scale factor . I owned it like 7 months no problems with anything on it at all . However ..... I was one of the first people to actually get a solar if not the first in the us . So I could see how they started pumping them out and stuff started becoming flawed .
I have defended them in the past because everyone makes mistakes but alain's guitar is straight ....ed ..... Thats not a mistake like wood shrinking or a mess up in binding . The body had to have been through numerous peoples hands before shipping . Its just pure laziness of them not wanting to remake it .


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## Exit Existence (May 26, 2013)

Am I the only person who seemed skeptical of S7G from the get go?
Like I seriously expected this kind of shit as soon as the brand got semi popular. 

When I FIRST saw their guitars a few years ago and saw this shit, I just had a hunch that they would not be capable of producing first class custom shop guitars.













From the company name, the logo, the headstock shape, the horrific square neck joint, boring solid finish guitars with no artistic details that would make a guitar unique and custom like inlays binding ect.

They just never screamed "quality" to me.


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## Curt (May 27, 2013)

toiletstand said:


> i thought that was one of the lighting(something else?) techs for chimp spanner?


 
 That was a joke. He is the other guitarist.



RagtimeDandy said:


> Bingo. There's no excuse to be acting like an immature asshat because a customer is unsatisfied with a blatantly careless product. Pathetic attitude


This. 

Also, reading that story on page 5 only made me want to give my money to AES for one of those Washbergs even more.


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## ShadowFactoryX (May 27, 2013)

Idk, but following the downhill mess from the top, it seems like every time something stupid comes up and Jim gets on FB, he comes across very arrogant and ignorant of his problems.
Overall the guy just seems to be a huge douche.

And ill compare this to my same sentiments regarding custom drum companies, and the craft beer world.
The custom drum world has kinda died down, but for the longest time, everyone was getting into it, making their own companies, and being "innovative", but in reality everyone was using keller shells, and when they werent, they had someone else do their stave or segmented stuff, of if they did do their own, it was sloppy work. But regardless these people would charge upwards of 4k for a 4 piece kit, but you'd figure out who was robbing who after a while.
In the craft beer world there's been an explosion of breweries in the past few years, and it seems like about once a week im finding out of a new brewery in just PA alone. But there's an overwhelming amount of stuff out there and most of it is bad.

How does this all tie in?

I like all these things, custom guitars, custom drums, custom craft beers. But just because you like it, and you know how to do a few things regarding creating those things DOES NOT make you an expert, NOR does it automatically qualify you to start your own company.
Companies like S7G, Invictus, BRJ have such misguided ambitions, while under the preface of a great idea or "innovation", have done nothing but pissed customers off, and ensured a failure for their investment.

Its hard to keep criticism from the internet these days, and when it comes to stuff like this, I cant help but feel pissed, because if I were in a situation like this, I'd be so livid.
This is the age of the customer being always right, and in no way is it acceptable to take a defect and project it as "artistic" and force that view to a paying customer.


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## nothingleft09 (May 27, 2013)

Leo, that sucks. I hope they fix it for you. I was also hoping they would get their shit together but it just isn't going to happen. I love the S7 I own and have no intention of selling it, but they need to just give up if these are the kinds of things they are just sloppily and just plain not giving a .... about putting out to the customer. I'll either go with AES or Blackwater for a custom build next year.


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## Hankey (May 27, 2013)

Exit Existence said:


> From the company name, the logo, the headstock shape, the horrific square neck joint, boring solid finish guitars with no artistic details that would make a guitar unique and custom like inlays binding ect.
> 
> They just never screamed "quality" to me.



Don't forget the gigantic control cavities. Looks like they couldn't be bothered to load up more than one CNC program, even when all the guitar has is a single volume knob...


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## SavM (May 27, 2013)

Crikey, $3k is a lot of money for a dud and that bad customer service/ interaction will always leave a bad taste in your mouth. I've always admired your guitars from a far, hopefully you'll have plenty of other great beasts to come in. These guys have destroyed their own business, I can't imagine anyone will feel inclined to give these guys any business...



Hankey said:


> Don't forget the gigantic control cavities. Looks like they couldn't be bothered to load up more than one CNC program, even when all the guitar has is a single volume knob...



That control cavity is huge!! What the hell are they hiding in there???


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## Nahkaparoni (May 27, 2013)

Awwww man, I'm sorry for you. Those flaws are unacceptable for a $3000 guitar. Hell, they would be for a $200 guitar. I love those Bodens but it sucks hearing so many people complaining about the build quality. Or the lack of it. I'd try to get a refund but that's just me. Hope you get things sorted out!


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## MaxOfMetal (May 27, 2013)

Exit Existence said:


> Am I the only person who seemed skeptical of S7G from the get go?
> Like I seriously expected this kind of shit as soon as the brand got semi popular.
> 
> When I FIRST saw their guitars a few years ago and saw this shit, I just had a hunch that they would not be capable of producing first class custom shop guitars.
> ...



To be fair, they [S7 guitars] were very cheap/affordable back then. I don't take much issue with guitars that are a good value, if everyone understands why they are cheaper, which was because they were basic instruments that lacked polish. 

I remember getting a couple quotes from S7 back when they first popped up. Around then you could get a totally decked out bolt-on, RG-clone with a cool finish, OFR7, DiMarzios, etc. for under $1500, and have a pretty speedy turnaround on it. 

In about a year and a half that pricing nearly doubled, and the quality just didn't seem to double with it.


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## Erockomania (May 27, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> To be fair, they [S7 guitars] were very cheap/affordable back then. I don't take much issue with guitars that are a good value, if everyone understands why they are cheaper, which was because they were basic instruments that lacked polish.
> 
> I remember getting a couple quotes from S7 back when they first popped up. Around then you could get a totally decked out bolt-on, RG-clone with a cool finish, OFR7, DiMarzios, etc. for under $1500, and have a pretty speedy turnaround on it.
> 
> In about a year and a half that pricing nearly doubled, and the quality just didn't seem to double with it.


Yup, as I stated earlier, they should have stuck with that business model.

I am curious as to what Ola saw in them, considering his rep. This debacle most definitely effects the way people view him. He must have been given the full BS treatment.


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## nothingleft09 (May 27, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> Yup, as I stated earlier, they should have stuck with that business model.
> 
> I am curious as to what Ola saw in them, considering his rep. This debacle most definitely effects the way people view him. He must have been given the full BS treatment.


 
As Someone who owns an S7, I can say when they get shit right they are amazing guitars. Ola has some great ones built by them as well. Unfortunately they are self destructing now and doing everything BUT getting it right. On to better things. Recently Ola has gotten some spectacular Siggi Braun's and Blackat's. You only stay on a sinking ship if you don't mind getting wet in the process.


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## Erazoender (May 27, 2013)

Ola.... Strandberg?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 27, 2013)

Erazoender said:


> Ola.... Strandberg?



It's extremely confusing when you have two Ola's that worked with S7G.


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## Erockomania (May 27, 2013)

Erazoender said:


> Ola.... Strandberg?



yes, Strandberg 

oops


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## nothingleft09 (May 27, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> It's extremely confusing when you have two Ola's that worked with S7G.


 
I meant Englund. Haha. It is confusing. But I don't blame either one of them for bailing honestly. Which is bad cuz I love my guitar... but the company is run by jackasses.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 27, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> I am curious as to what Ola saw in them



Around the time Ola Strandberg and S7 started doing business S7 still had a HUGE endorsee/signature roster full of popular modern guitarists. Given the information he had, S7 seemed like a great choice, and it's not like other builders were stepping up to the plate, at the time. 

Perhaps if the artists at the time who were having issues had the cock and balls to be honest about the treatment and instruments they were given folks would have been privy to S7s decline much earlier. Instead, they all (with the exception of Keith Merrow, after the fact of course) kinda faded away silently and switched to other builders/brands. 

I understand being professional, but there's a difference between publicly airing grievances in the hope that A) the company at hand will get a push to be more transparent and start improving, and/or B) that folks can make a more informed choice before plunking down a nice chunk or cash, and just giving a public "fu_c_k you" with no aimed resolution. 

If you guys ever wonder why I'm so hard on endorsees who come here to shill the brand-of-the-week they happen to be using, that's why. They usually could give two shits about you, me, and our hard earned cash, it's all about the publicity and cash, and the next endorsement to jump to. I'm not falling for that, jack. Neither should you.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 27, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> with the exception of Keith Merrow, after the fact of course.



The thing that upset me about this is that people were criticizing Keith about it, saying he was trying to bad-mouth the company. I even saw a well-known guitar builder jab at Keith for it.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 27, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> The thing that upset me about this is that people were criticizing Keith about it, saying he was trying to bad-mouth the company. I even saw a well-known guitar builder jab at Keith for it.



Well, considering how long it went on for, him getting shitty guitars, it probably would have been nice having known these issues sooner, so I can see the criticism there. 

Honestly, between BRJ and S7, Keith is the typhoid Mary of endrosees. I won't touch anything he does.  

There will always be folks that have differing opinions, and luckily, differing opinions don't cause cancer, so it's fine. I'm not surprised if other builders lashed out, being scrutinized isn't fun. Out of curiosity, I'm not into FB drama, but who was this "well-known" guitar builder?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 27, 2013)

EDIT: I found it. Read below.


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## capoeiraesp (May 27, 2013)

I dunno, Max. I've met some pretty nutty conspiracy theorists that is asked will probably link opposing opinions to cancer somehow via some online 'expert'.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 27, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I don't remember who exactly



You sure? In the PM you sent me you seemed pretty sure about it being Tom, the guy who specs out the BlacKat guitars that Skervesen builds. 

Sorry if I'm throwing you under the proverbial bus here, but it would be quite hypocritical of me if I wasn't willing to be truthful here, while criticizing others for not doing so.


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## nothingleft09 (May 27, 2013)

Correct on your thinking, Max. I remember from the thread. But at the same time he had a good point. Why wait so long to say something? But, in all fairness I think Keith was trying to give them the chance to make it right and when he got fed up he said something. But to also be fair, when you are ticked isn't the best time to say something either, even if it does need to be said.


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## ramses (May 27, 2013)

Regarding endorsements ...

Two months ago I did not know who the hell Keith Merrow or Ola Englund were, and I also did not know they were related to S7G. Moreover, I just went to S7G's website and I do not recognize any of their current artists.

The reason I paid the deposit for a Boden 7 back in December, was that Ola Strandberg was explicitly endorsing S7G by the mere act of picking them as the manufacturers of the Boden line.

Who to F am I to say that Ola Strandberg is wrong when he says that a particular shop will do a great job of building his guitars?? Who the hell am I to doubt his experience of multiple decades as a guitar builder?? Who are any of you guys to say that Ola Strandberg is wrong when he says that a particular shop will do a good job??

Obviously he must have seen something good in them. Obviously something must have changed between the time they signed the deal and today. What changed? I have no idea.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 27, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> You sure? In the PM you sent me you seemed pretty sure about it being Tom, the guy who specs out the BlacKat guitars that Skervesen builds.
> 
> Sorry if I'm throwing you under the proverbial bus here, but it would be quite hypocritical of me if I wasn't willing to be truthful here, while criticizing others for not doing so.



I forgot to edit that post when I sent the PM. My mistake. Was going through another forum while trying to find it and I lost track. 

But yeah, it was the guy from BlacKat. I apologize if I made it look like I was hiding something.

EDIT: Also, I re-read that thread where all this took place, and it seems they cleared things up between each other.


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## leonardo7 (May 27, 2013)

Skervesen builds BlacKat guitars?


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## technomancer (May 27, 2013)

ramses said:


> Who to F am I to say that Ola Strandberg is wrong when he says that a particular shop will do a great job of building his guitars?? Who the hell am I to doubt his experience of multiple decades as a guitar builder?? Who are any of you guys to say that Ola Strandberg is wrong when he says that a particular shop will do a good job??



Just to be realistic, Ola built a handful of guitars over those decades before designing his current headless system and starting to build them. That has exploded for him in a relatively short period of time. He has not been involved with guitar building on any large scale until recently and while what he has done is incredible I can completely see how he could have mistakenly chosen S7. Also note that that's not a knock on Ola at all, I'm sure S7 put on a hell of a dog and pony show and made a lot of promises they obviously couldn't follow through on.

Personally the number of S7 guitars posted with issues on here were MORE than enough for me to have stayed clear of them from the beginning  Then again if you didn't see those guitars and just saw them at NAMM and tracked them on social media they looked like a great new up-and-comer in the industry.



leonardo7 said:


> Skervesen builds BlacKat guitars?



Yes Skervesen builds BlacKat's guitars


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## leonardo7 (May 27, 2013)

Geez, whats next? We find out Mayones owns Skervesen?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 27, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> Geez, whats next? We find out Mayones owns Skervesen?



I think I may see what you did there.


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## Splinterhead (May 27, 2013)

I've never paid attention to who plays what guitar. To be honest I don't really care if artist X is endorsing company Y's guitar. I become interested in a guitar if I feel it suits my purposes functionally and aesthetically. I'm actually more of a function over form guy. Anyways I've dealt with S7 and managed to get a Boden 8 which turned out absolutely tits. I don't know if I'm lucky or if the fact that I maintained contact with Curran throughout the build made any difference. I've had nothing but positive experiences with those guys. That said I am not justifying what happened regarding that Boden that Leonardo got. That shit looks way rough and in no way should have left the shop without contacting him regarding those flaws. 

It seems that the inherent properties of wood has become somewhat subjective. I think a smart thing for S7 to do is to check in with the customer if the wood has some natural flaws that some may deem unacceptable. Maybe sourcing better wood is the answer, I really don't know. It seems that they are a very small outfit that is highly overstressed. This obviously has led to some bad shit happening and now it may become detrimental to their business which is a shame. They honestly do love doing what they do. 

To be honest I don't feel that they are on the level of BRJ by any stretch. They have offered to make it right regarding Leonardo's Boden by offering a choice of 12 different bodies. (at least that's what i think I read in Curran's post) I don't see BRJ doing much of anything yet. I do hope he does though. There should be more communication between S7 and their customers. Maybe they should hire someone to answer the emails and do the updates so the other guys are free to build and run the business. I'm hoping one day to post a NGD with my Boden 8 without having to have to wear an asbestos suit and hardhat as I feel that its an amazing instrument and I consider myself lucky to have it.

I would like to hear the outcome of Leonardo's situation and see if thing's are made right.


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## ramses (May 27, 2013)

Splinterhead said:


> I'm hoping one day to post a NGD with my Boden 8 without having to have to wear an asbestos suit and hardhat as I feel that its an amazing instrument and I consider myself lucky to have it.



Please, don't be silly  Help me feel better while I continue to wait for my Boden 7. Do the NGD!


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## Fred the Shred (May 28, 2013)

Splinterhead said:


> It seems that the inherent properties of wood has become somewhat subjective. I think a smart thing for S7 to do is to check in with the customer if the wood has some natural flaws that some may deem unacceptable. Maybe sourcing better wood is the answer, I really don't know. It seems that they are a very small outfit that is highly overstressed. This obviously has led to some bad shit happening and now it may become detrimental to their business which is a shame. They honestly do love doing what they do.



Yes, they do - thing is that maintaining sustained growth is a key factor for any company, which implies understanding what the possible workload for a given period is, how much the production capacity can be increased within reasonable price and time points, and where to fit orders timewise. All of these are impossible to maintain if the work team is forced to permanently work at the very limit of its capacity, whilst accumulating QC functions and, in Jim's case, all the management aspects as well. This leaves zero margin for error at the same time it introduces more mistakes along the course of each production run.

This company is undermining itself at this rate, and it is incredibly hard to pick oneself up when the view of the buying public is that of displicent time estimation estimates leading to large delays, faulty QC making your guitar a game of roulette and apparent customer support inaccessibility making everything harder to solve from the get go. I most certainly would NOT like to be in those shoes.



Splinterhead said:


> I'm hoping one day to post a NGD with my Boden 8 without having to have to wear an asbestos suit and hardhat as I feel that its an amazing instrument and I consider myself lucky to have it.
> 
> I would like to hear the outcome of Leonardo's situation and see if thing's are made right.



Online, the key word for many a response is "extreme". Many people polarize around the negatives and will look upon a positive example as if it is almost a product of witchcraft. What I believe is often misunderstood is that a company that only makes crap (which isn't the case here) is far, FAR less dangerous than one that manages to spit out unacceptable messes as well as proper instruments, as this dilutes both feedbacks and makes people who only see the good ones not consider anything risky as there is no dud they know of. Prior to the onslaught of BRJ's with "innovative features", a lot of people would swear by them blindly, for example.


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## loktide (May 28, 2013)

i'm not really surprised to read this after having the chance to be at the Boden booth at Musikmesse this year. 

I really love the concept behind these, but after seeing them in person i realized that they should have been more carefully when upscaling production.


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## leonardo7 (May 28, 2013)

So I was told last week that in three weeks there will be 12 bodies for me to chose from. Lets see if and when that actually happens.


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## ramses (May 28, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> So I was told last week that in three weeks there will be 12 bodies for me to chose from. Lets see if and when that actually happens.



How did you do that? I'm only waiting for one and do not have an ETA yet!


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## MetalDaze (May 28, 2013)

FWIW, I always thought Strictly 7 was an odd name for a company that built 6, 7, and 8's


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## MaxOfMetal (May 28, 2013)

ramses said:


> How did you do that?


 
Airing your grievances publicly has that effect.


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## thrsher (May 28, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Airing your grievances publicly has that effect.



Festivus for the rest of us


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## stratjacket (May 28, 2013)

Hopefully they will get you a good one Alain, this was unreal for a $3k guitar. S7 just seems to be on a self inflicted rampage. Seems like they would have had shit in order before releasing these B7's, but guess not.


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## capoeiraesp (May 28, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> So I was told last week that in three weeks there will be 12 bodies for me to chose from. Lets see if and when that actually happens.



Dude, that's like going to some 3rd world whore house. Sure you're getting 12 bodies to choose from but if they're all f#$$ed up, what's the point? You're not gonna wanna put your cash or your man-meat anywhere near any of it. Thus, a refund would be sought.


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## asher (May 28, 2013)

capoeiraesp said:


> Dude, that's liking going to some 3rd world whore house. Sure you're getting 12 bodies to choose from but if they're all f#$$ed up, what's the point? You're not gonna wanna put your cash or your man-meat anywhere near any of it. Thus, a refund would be sought.


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## Forkface (May 28, 2013)

capoeiraesp said:


> Dude, that's liking going to some 3rd world whore house. Sure you're getting 12 bodies to choose from but if they're all f#$$ed up, what's the point? You're not gonna wanna put your cash or your man-meat anywhere near any of it. Thus, a refund would be sought.



I lol'd pretty hard because I live in a 3rd world country, and this is SPOT ON


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## Jonathan20022 (May 28, 2013)

Forkface said:


> I lol'd pretty hard because I live in a 3rd world country, and this is SPOT ON



I know El Paso's right on the border, but it's nowhere near as bad as Mexico can be lol.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 28, 2013)

Forkface said:


> I lol'd pretty hard because I live in a 3rd world country, and this is SPOT ON



[OT]

Someone living in the US, using the internet to discuss a luxury, referring to the US as a third world country. 

God bless America. 

[/OT]


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## toiletstand (May 28, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> [OT]
> 
> Someone living in the US, using the internet to discuss a luxury, referring to the US as a third world country.
> 
> ...


too funny haha


I hope you can get a refund dude!


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## MetalDaze (May 28, 2013)

Are you going to send it back to them or just have them ship you the body?


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## AllanMarcus (May 29, 2013)

I am both incredibly sad, and sorry that this has happened to you. Wish there were something more I could do to help you.


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## BlacKat Guitars (May 29, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> There will always be folks that have differing opinions, and luckily, differing opinions don't cause cancer, so it's fine. I'm not surprised if other builders lashed out, being scrutinized isn't fun. Out of curiosity, I'm not into FB drama, but who was this "well-known" guitar builder?



At the time I didn't like how Keith posted pictures of issues (also I did not notice some issues, like dots on wrong frets) without any comment on the background of the story - if it was rough proto build that was needed fast for some recording session, what S7G offered to do with this guitar etc. I mean - he was in professional involvement with the company. I did not defend S7G for what they delivered. I just didn't feel it right to say "they are good friends, but let's expose their shoddy work" - didn't feel that friendly.

However I got in touch with Keith and he explained the situation further than on FB posts and I'm on Keith's side of the force now. 

This situation taught me to stop commenting in other builder's threads.


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## underthecurve (May 29, 2013)

Okay, story time,

I was in the first build lot for the Boden8s. I first received the guitar early in November. Initially, I noticed some small cosmetic imperfections, and the finish felt tacky and uneven. There were parts you could see finish lines from multiple coats. In the horn area, and in the tuner recess the finish was built up and runny. 

As far as structural defects, when I first was handling the guitar, and on playing low notes, I noticed a rattle. Upon investigation I noticed the black washer for one of the neck bolts was spinning around. I tried to tighten the bolt, but it is either bound or bottomed out and will not compress the washer. If I had to venture a guess about the issue, the bolt holes aren't drilled properly, a similar problem that another boden8 owner and SSO member had.

I notified Jim & Ola of the issues. Within the day I had a response from Ola, Jim and Paul, apologizing and offering a rebuild. Sweet.

Fast forward 3 months, the middle of March, I asked how the rebuild was coming, and was told the end of the month. Sweet!

The end of the following month, April, I ask Jim how's the rebuild. No answer. Coincidentally, Paul emails me to see if I've received my rebuild. I fill him in and he apologizes, and says he'll see what's what. After a few back and forth between Paul, and a month later, last Friday, I finally hear back from Jim.

He assures me everything is moving along, and when the time comes to send my guitar to him to put a new body onto, or, he could ship the body to me and I could transfer everything over. First off, one of my complaints about the guitar was a cosmetic defect on the neck. This defect doesn't warrant rebuild, but I want them to address it. I also wanted some assurance that the neck bolt alignment issue lies in just the body and not the neck as well. No responses so far....

I originally didn't post a NGD because I wanted to give Ola and s7 a chance to rectify any issues in the original build. For a little while I felt I didn't need to resort to publicly shaming a company to get good service, but apparently I was wrong.

My greatest fear is that S7 doesn't have the capability to properly execute Ola's designs, and that anyone waiting for rebuilds will still receive junk. My guitar was in the first run, while OP's guitar came out of the most recent batch. It seem their learning curve is a flat line.

At what point does Ola step in and start taking a more active role in dealing with these issues? I know the guitar was built by s7, but I feel like the quality of these guitars ultimately lies with Ola. S7 isn't some random luthier that just licensed the design, Ola went to Ohio to transfer the process. Ola is on record saying that these guitars are %100 to specs and the reduced cost over an original strandberg is realized through economies of scale and not decreased quality. With production moving to Washburn, Ola seems to feel that s7 can't build a Strandberg, so why does he feel like they can do these rebuilds?

I know every product release has it's teething problems, and before buying I reserved some patients for issues like this to arrive, but this is all kind of too much.


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## DarkWolfXV (May 29, 2013)

capoeiraesp said:


> Dude, that's liking going to some 3rd world whore house. Sure you're getting 12 bodies to choose from but if they're all f#$$ed up, what's the point? You're not gonna wanna put your cash or your man-meat anywhere near any of it. Thus, a refund would be sought.



F*u*ck i died 
Sigged.


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## ola_strandberg (May 29, 2013)

underthecurve said:


> Okay, story time,
> At what point does Ola step in and start taking a more active role in dealing with these issues? I know the guitar was built by s7, but I feel like the quality of these guitars ultimately lies with Ola. S7 isn't some random luthier that just licensed the design, Ola went to Ohio to transfer the process. Ola is on record saying that these guitars are %100 to specs and the reduced cost over an original strandberg is realized through economies of scale and not decreased quality. With production moving to Washburn, Ola seems to feel that s7 can't build a Strandberg, so why does he feel like they can do these rebuilds?
> 
> I know every product release has it's teething problems, and before buying I reserved some patients for issues like this to arrive, but this is all kind of too much.



Well, I wish there was a simple explanation. For now, I for one am grateful for everyone's patience and understanding while I and the AES team around me work with the people involved to try and resolve the situation. There are legal and financial concerns, and at the end of the day, the big picture has to work out.


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## Xaios (May 29, 2013)

Transferring rebuilds to Washburn probably isn't an option. While they have a relationship now, Washburn really has no responsibility for anything that tranpired prior to them taking over builds from S7G. Sure, Ola could try and force S7G to relinquish the payment they've received and give it to Washburn instead to cover the cost of rebuilds, but it sounds like trying to get anything out of S7G is like bleeding the proverbial turnip. Not exactly a viable solution.


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## MetalDaze (May 29, 2013)

^ I think that's where the "legal and financial" concerns factor in.


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## fc3603 (May 29, 2013)

I assume it's only a matter of time for s7 go bankrupcy? And obviously not everyone can get their money back. First come always first serve. You know what to do.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)




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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

Just started watching these. No idea what the content is, but I gotta hand it to the guy, taking 1 1/2 hours (or more, before editing) out of your day to directly address issues/hearsay/opinions/concerns is extremely refreshing for a custom luthier. I havent seen that level of frank openness from other builders discussed on here.

*edit* bearing in mind I haven't actually watched these yet, haha so hopefully I'm not speaking too soon.


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## The Spanish Inquisition (May 30, 2013)

I'm watching these videos. They are really good, though he is totally mad bro. But good videos.


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

Why would one assume S7G is going bankrupt without more concrete data? Again, it's very easy to jump to conclusions, and the one thing we know is that we have inconsistencies deriving from excessive orders, communication issues and wood hiccups that are a consequence of multiple factors.

At the same time I'm not keen on elevating companies to supreme divinity, I also don't tend to claim they are so bad that whomever listens to me thinks they are the cause of hurricanes, wars, and famine in Africa, or at least without factual evidence to support that. I have played some very good guitars from them, as well as seen some unacceptable QC issues, but when skimming across the whole Boden debate sparked by the better known couple of duds, some peeps are really pointing out things they don't like about the parts themselves, or attributing finish properties to wood flaws and crap, or claiming that wood fluctuations are impossible in guitars (I truly hope you never get a snakewood fingerboard...) and diluting the actual problems in there out of paranoia.

Not my business, so not my problem, but this kind of phenomenon dilutes the useful information tremendously.


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

10min into the hour long video, seems like he is so far repeating a lot of "I don't have time to do things other than build guitars". Why is this video so long winded then! I'll stick to it though, interested in what he has to say


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## isispelican (May 30, 2013)

well someone is angry


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

34 min mark. Ouch.


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## Suho (May 30, 2013)

Any ballpark figures as to how many S7/Ola guitars (including rebuilds) remain to be completed?


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

Oh my.... 

www.youtube.com/watch?v=DretNN-JmYw#t=33m


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## fps (May 30, 2013)

I'm really saddened by the stories in this thread. These amounts of money, and frankly the amount of importance these guitars have to their prospective owners, are so enormous that for people to come away feeling let down, with a negative experience where they wanted such a positive one, is incredibly sad, and I really feel for you. 

It seems there are a lot of new luthiers these days. The amount of money that can be charged for working in small batches with small numbers of people working on the instruments is high, so it seems like a very good small business idea, though hard work. The internet means you can make a good-looking guitar, indeed a few genuinely terrific guitars, get a good endorsement, and the orders will roll in. However, it is the QUALITY of those people working on the guitar that we, prospective customers, are meant to be paying for, and if those people are not of the highest quality, then that shop must sort its problems out quickly, reduce its prices enormously, or die. That's not a go at S7, it's just the nature of the high-end guitar business. 

It is times like these I'm struck by how remarkable the best of the mass production guitar industry is, how few true duds there are among all the LTDs, SEs and Ibanezes I've played in my local guitar shop, and how sometimes you can find a gem in these Korean-made guitars that has the mojo and heft of a guitar three times its price. An acoustic sure, but my Yamaha AC3R, every Yamaha AC3R, is checked TWICE for quality and set-up before it leaves the factory, and I have a fantastic one that rolls with guitars twice its price, as a result. 

I guess the harsh truth here is hand-made doesn't always mean better, if those hands are inconsistent in their craft. Seems there are some FANTASTIC guitars from S7, and some very, very happy owners out there with brilliant instruments. But they have to be able to do it day-in, day-out to have the right to charge these kinds of prices, when an instrument of the highest level is meant to be nothing less than extension of your entire being.


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## decoy205 (May 30, 2013)

The builder I work with has a philosophy that when he doesn't want to sell the guitar and it's hard for him to let it go that's when it's ready to go to the client. Until then it's not good enough.


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## Basti (May 30, 2013)

xCaptainx said:


> 34 min mark. Ouch.



Indeed, OUCH. 

This isn't a way of dealing with a problem, whatever his intentions may be he's putting customers in the spotlight and expecting the general public's support to shut them up once and for all. If the customers _were_ wrong (for the sake of argument) it's the seller's responsibility to be professional in dealing with the issue, not call them out and let the world know how much they piss him off.


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## ola_strandberg (May 30, 2013)

Suho said:


> Any ballpark figures as to how many S7/Ola guitars (including rebuilds) remain to be completed?



I have now offered to assume the responsibility for delivering the outstanding orders as well as the currently agreed replacements from S7.

The customers involved will be given the option of staying on with S7 to receive their original order, or having it fulfilled by Strandberg Guitars in Sweden.


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## DoomMantia (May 30, 2013)

Haha. Wow pretty brutal videos. Entertaining watch though.


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

It is a true shame that it had to come to that Ola, but it's a testament to your character that you are extending such an offer. I hope your venture with Washburn proves more fruitful, someday I would love to see a strandberg over here in Australia


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## SDMFVan (May 30, 2013)

That video is insane. The fact that he thought that was a good idea tells you everything you need to know about S7.


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## fps (May 30, 2013)

Pretty long video, I think 24 minutes to 27 minutes is interesting stuff re Strandberg. Pretty worrying that one of his guys took a Strandberg home and worked out how to assemble it himself because he didn't receive training in putting the guitar together. Also about the neck, a 3mm side dot on a 4mm space, and how it's hard. Well, to be honest, that's why you're the luthier. 

The tone of this video is aggressive, and passive-aggressive, in a way which I feel is unhelpful for the image of the company. Poor guy is clearly near the end of his tether re all this. His point at 30 minutes is a good one re unrealistic expectations based on pretty internet pictures. 

The wormhole is addressed around 32 minutes 20 seconds. This is jaw-dropping stuff. I have sympathy on both sides. Still, jaw dropping.

39 minutes- you don't hang up on a customer. Customer service 101.

43 minutes- Lol! He is pretty annoyed about the levels of misinformation out there.

47-49 minutes- Harsh, in the extreme, on him. $23,000.

56 minutes- *you will* LOL!!

56 1/2 minutes- info for people with outstanding Boden orders, I think?


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## Pyrocario (May 30, 2013)

RickSchneider said:


> someday I would love to see a strandberg over here in Australia



+1 for Australia. I so badly want one but the import :x


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## foreright (May 30, 2013)

Wow, slagging off your ex employees... classy!

Actually, his points about people picking up the phone are fair enough... it amuses me no end how people are so reliant on email these days. He has some other good points too but specifically calling out customers and ex-employees is not cool and makes him look like a whiny kid... "pleeeeease sir... it wasn't my fault!"


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## technomancer (May 30, 2013)

Let's be honest here, if he hadn't shipped product that should have never gone out the door and then tried to tell the customer it was fine deal with it none of this would have happened. He can try to blame it on whoever he wants, it's his company and his customers and S7 should be taking responsibility for the situation. Bottom line is they've been shipping guitars with issues of varying degree for a LONG time and are finally getting backlash on it. They are also NOT handling it gracefully. Which would be more effective: fixing the customer issues and posting an apology along with what was done to resolve the situation (ie pics of replacement guitars / parts etc) and a promise not to let it happen again, or what they are doing 

Also since Strandberg is no longer associated with S7 beyond wrapping up orders I pulled this into its own thread


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## Danukenator (May 30, 2013)

What a ....ing scumbag. I assume at the 34 minute mark he is talking about Leonardo. If so, the he should take up the offer and just send the money to Washburn.


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

Thanks for breaking this off, I'd rather see strandberg move past this as soon as possible. After spending an hour and a half watching all of that footage, I've got to say he had some valid point, but his demeanor and aggression seemed to work against him.

I've got to see his reasons for being frustrated, but I think to make such extensive videos to clear your name and your company you should at least try to go about in a calm manner. Do not claim to respect your clients based on your own goodwill, but curse out other clients because they were unsatisfied with what he mostly acknowledged was subpar.

"I trust my employees to send out perfect instruments so I did not check the strandberg shipments" Did he not say there was a 3% return rate on S7 guitars? For a decent figure like that you think you would want to go over an ACKNOWLEDGED foreign product with a fine toothed comb before just shipping them out.

I hope all parties can move beyond this, S7 included. They aren't an awful company from what I have seen overall, but they have really dropped the ball a few times recently. Nobody wants people to lose jobs, and for those on the waiting list or those with S7 guitars, I hope the best for what they've spent their hard earned money on


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## Danukenator (May 30, 2013)

I'm going to double post just because this is a HUGE pet peeve of mine. I hate when people claim they are being trolled for being criticized. DDOSing, Racism and general hatred to incite anger is trolling. Criticism is NOT trolling, it's pointing out errors and failings in a company. 

I hate how people claim they're being trolled when, in reality, they are simply being confronted for having shoddy products. "Trolling" is a shield used to simply erase all of their accusers.


EDIT: I will note, to be fair, he does make several valid points. People should just pick up the phone every now and then. I couldn't reach Black Water on email, so I called and got through.


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## The Spanish Inquisition (May 30, 2013)

*flameshield on*

I must pick sides with Jim. I know receiving an instrument with a small thing wrong isn't exactly what you'd like on such an expensive guitar. But when you contact him calling him an idiot and not only mocking his builds but also insulting him and his company of which he is proud, I can totally understand he is pissed and has had it with these kind of things.

Don't get me wrong, I feel sorry for everyone who had a faulty instrument, and he shouldn't have put the blame on others. He also has to take a bit of the blame, because it's his company. But he's not the only one in the company. And people seem to forget that he's a busy man, running 2 lines. The Boden and his own S7G line. He ain't got no time fo' that. The main thing in this story, I think, is the patience. But apparently no one has patience anymore.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

yeah I feel for the guy. Difficult situation for all involved no doubt, and sure he could have represented himself a bit better and refrained from a few things he said. He's obviously frustrated however. 

Sitting on the fence on this cause quite frankly, I'm not a customer or involved with either company. Again, refreshing that he even bothered putting up such a detailed insight into his company. I bet the BRJ customers are dying for something like this, regardless of content.


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## The Spanish Inquisition (May 30, 2013)

xCaptainx said:


> yeah I feel for the guy. Difficult situation for all involved no doubt, and sure he could have represented himself a bit better and refrained from a few things he said. He's obviously frustrated however.
> 
> Sitting on the fence on this cause quite frankly, I'm not a customer or involved with either company. Again, refreshing that he even bothered putting up such a detailed insight into his company. I bet the BRJ customers are dying for something like this, regardless of content.



He's just a man desperately trying to justify the acts of his company.


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

Well to play devils advocate, it's hard to feel empathy for a man who apparently doesn't have time to fulfill the excess load that the Boden brand added to his work, yet still took it under his care and tried to deliver.

Call it overambitious, say he lacked foresight and is just trying to right wrongs, either way - mistakes were made on his part and he is now paying for them. He's getting more flak than he deserves? Perhaps. But in his own words, if someone is unhappy, the internet will hear about it. For some this isn't a problem, as good companies avoid such extensive bad rep, but S7G has gotten a fair bit lately


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## Captain Butterscotch (May 30, 2013)

Ok, you don't EVER call out a customer, by name, on a video that now thousands of people will see. You take care of shit. Get it done. Don't make an angry video to make yourself feel better. You also don't bash people you've worked with or other people who aren't even in the picture anymore. It's unprofessional. No, screw that, it's immature. 

He kept talking about "inane" issues with flaws, finish, and wood choices. When people are spending 2-3k on a guitar, then an "inane" finish flaw is a big issue. For that much money, I expect a perfect guitar. That's a whole lot of money for people that aren't Justin Bieber that make 2-3 million every time he blows a pound of glitter out of his ass. 

I see his side of the story and I understand it, but Jim is going about this with the finesse of of a drunk elephant. To be clear, I feel for the guy and his situation. But he needs a PR guy or something because that vid annoyed me to death.


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## technomancer (May 30, 2013)

I'm watching this now. All I can say is if you watch this video and want to do business with somebody with that attitude you deserve what you get.

I'll also address the brilliant excuse for using low quality wood and tops: it's bullshit. Saying cheap wood is more interesting is a great ploy if you have a market dumb enough to buy it. PRS doesn't buy all the good tops, there are plenty of suppliers that can deliver 4A and 5A tops in quantity IF the builder is willing to pay for it. So to translate the marketing speak: "It's more interesting and PRS buys all the nice tops" = "It's cheaper and easier to source and puts more money in my pocket". If a customer ORDERS a guitar with large knot holes and a lower grade / wildwood top that is an entirely different matter, but sending somebody that on something like a Strandberg is assinine.

And so much for Jim's argument about Ola doing nothing to make it right:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/3576937-post203.html

sometimes customer service goes beyond the letter of the contract


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## RickSchneider (May 30, 2013)

I thought that myself. Seems like he tried to put himself at a point of higher public standing, and Ola just threw him wayyyy down


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## watson503 (May 30, 2013)

Wow... He's about gone over the edge with all of this:


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## will_shred (May 30, 2013)

I kinda feel bad for him. I mean i'm sure he actually is a nice dude. Just the stress of owning a company that's going down the shitter is obviously huge.

The one place I don't feel bad is the guitars. Building guitars is really, really hard. If you're just going in blind (more or less), your going to have a bad time. If you are going to start a guitar company without having formal luthier training, you're going to have a bad time. If you then get one artist under your belt, then proceed to take way more orders than you can fill. you're going to have a REALLY bad time.


If you they think they're going to start a successful guitar company without formal luthier training I don't know what they expected when real guitar snobs got their hands on them. So, i'm kind of in the middle. I kind of feel bad for jim and I kind of don't at the same time, because well... I don't know what he was thinking.

Also, I guess he didn't realize that an imperfection making something better doesn't really appily in guitar building as much as it does in music


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## Yimmj (May 30, 2013)

Alright seriously, adress all of the customer you complaints you want, but being a dickhead to the customers then calling them out in facebook is just straightup the worst idea ive heard, i cant believe he names people out and where they live and that he calls them idiots for having complaints, you run a ....in business, thats your job is to make the customer happy


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## technomancer (May 30, 2013)

SDMFVan said:


> That video is insane. The fact that he thought that was a good idea tells you everything you need to know about S7.



Yep I'll say here what I said in the thread about the videos, if you watch those videos and want to do business with somebody with that attitude you deserve what you get.

leonardo7: I hope you paid by credit card and/or have a lawyer as the demands of the immediate return of the guitar and refund in 3-4 months are complete bullshit



ola_strandberg said:


> I have now offered to assume the responsibility for delivering the outstanding orders as well as the currently agreed replacements from S7.
> 
> The customers involved will be given the option of staying on with S7 to receive their original order, or having it fulfilled by Strandberg Guitars in Sweden.



Also this is incredibly classy, and shows that at least Ola understands that sometimes customer service and making things right goes beyond the letter of the contract


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## Suho (May 30, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> I have now offered to assume the responsibility for delivering the outstanding orders as well as the currently agreed replacements from S7.
> 
> The customers involved will be given the option of staying on with S7 to receive their original order, or having it fulfilled by Strandberg Guitars in Sweden.



Mr. Strandberg, I don't have any guitars on order with S7, but it is this kind of exceptional response that makes it almost certain you will have a custom order from me in the (hopefully not too distant) future! Kudos!


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## Nonservium (May 30, 2013)

I feel him. Whatever dipshit is claiming its dry should probably just stfu. As gung-ho and carried away as some of the over-entitled twats I see around the interwebs go, I don't honestly blame Jim. Some folks lack sense and straight deserve to get called out, it may not be the most professional move but sometimes cold hard reality is what some folks need. Every once in a while, I'll have to get in someone's ass in much the same way from my job which is also exacting work with little room for error. People that don't work with the finer points of something are often ignorant to the realities of it which tends to lead them into having unrealistic expectations.

He's wasting his time however, these kids have mostly been raised to believe they can do no wrong in most cases and would rather die than face the reality that they are wrong.


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## SDMFVan (May 30, 2013)

Was I the only person unaware that they had the CNC work done on the bodies by an outside company?


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## Tom 1.0 (May 30, 2013)

Man...After reading what Ola just said I wished I had been messed around by S7.

I hope everybody comes out of this in one piece.


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## crg123 (May 30, 2013)

RickSchneider said:


> I thought that myself. Seems like he tried to put himself at a point of higher public standing, and Ola just threw him wayyyy down





ola_strandberg said:


> I have now offered to assume the responsibility for delivering the outstanding orders as well as the currently agreed replacements from S7.
> 
> The customers involved will be given the option of staying on with S7 to receive their original order, or having it fulfilled by Strandberg Guitars in Sweden.



Wow, thats ridiculous he's that fed up that he'd take the blow. Those outstanding orders are some lucky SOB's. They expected S7 Boden's but they end up with REAL Strandbergs... if I'm understanding him correctly.


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## Deadnightshade (May 30, 2013)

I believe Ola and/or Jim should have informed the public about the stuff that would cause differences from the picture beforehand (like the different oil),as well as the way the tuning mechanism works.


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## Captain Butterscotch (May 30, 2013)

Ola earned a customer from me today.


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## Winspear (May 30, 2013)

I watched the long video and to be honest I can't take issue with anything he has said...Though the anger is understandable but doesn't come across well at all


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## JaeSwift (May 30, 2013)

EDIT: Nevermind, stating the obvious wont get us anywhere.
I just hope this will work out for everyone, somehow.


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## Rev2010 (May 30, 2013)

RickSchneider said:


> Oh my....
> 
> www.youtube.com/watch?v=DretNN-JmYw#t=33m



Still watching this now. Guess they haven't learned a thing. Jim takes to Youtube to talk nastily in response to his customers and making fun of them with terms like, "Self proclaimed expert" and talking about being thin skinned with emotional issues. Jesus, the ship is going to sink even faster now. K, he just called someone a "wind bag troll" 

And here I was going to respond to the guy talking about them going bankrupt and tell him why does it seem like people are *anxious* to see this company go down, and to give them a break and let's see how they handle people's issues with their guitars. Guess I see how that is going now.

Why doesn't anyone learn that this is the absolute worse way to address the issue? Getting mad and venting on your customers is just plain business suicide.


Rev.


----------



## baryton (May 30, 2013)

Damn!
The "asshole-like" Jim speaks about in last second of the video about a string gauge issue it's ME!
Except that i did not buy my Boden7 directly from S7 but through Guitar Candy (the only stock Bart had), I Asked for a A tuning with neck adjustment the day I ordered it,
PROOF
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=510931755630521&set=a.160866367303730.34830.149762801747420&type=1&theater 

Obviously It wasn't done, the guitar stills buzzing (I told it to Bart, never had a reply from him, i was thinking buying a Masvidalien... Too bad i'll see it with MusicStore or directly from AES), apparently i have to adjust the nut's cut (I'm scarred to do it alone  ), I admitted I overreacted with this strings issue's story ... JIM knows that, I explained it to him, we had a private mail exchange, I wrote anything here or in another forum about it (it was a month ago) If now he wants to say bullshit i have to say the true, especially as i apologize to putted him and S7 in a difficult situation with Strandberg and Paul (thx man btw you're awesome) and never get a reply! 

Plus he yelled at me in a private video about this strings issue and body issues he called a "natural character of the wood"
I let you judge by yourselve





































...

To finish Jim doesn't understand why i say that it's the most awesome guitar i've ever had with all my complains
I used to play on 8 and had many injuries with my left hand, since i play on the Boden it's just magic
I said that because it's light, extremely well balanced, ergonomic as hell and the Endureneck is a revolution to me, I don't feel any pain since i play with.
So besides this issue YES it stills an awesome axe...

But for 2600&#8364; (2 months salary) I excepted to have a better finish from S7 and Guitar Candy that's all!


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## firegarden (May 30, 2013)

Now I am not sure which way to go stick with S7 or go Washburn...


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## Jonathan20022 (May 30, 2013)

Just wait until the 34 Minute Mark where he addresses Leonardo, he literally verbally breaks his contract towards a customer, because of the actions that someone else did not something that Leonardo did.

It's not gonna be too hard to get your money back man, you have it on video that he has no intention of following his contract with you so you should bring that to your Credit Card company and work with them on a chargeback.

Sorry Jim, I know the industry is stressful, but you have no right to do that to Leo. Good luck to you both, but Jim lost this one.


----------



## Rev2010 (May 30, 2013)

Question, is it just me or does he keep calling his company "Circly Seven"? I've heard it several times now.


Rev.


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## Slaeyer (May 30, 2013)

To a certain extend I can understand that Jim is really pissed and angry at certain people. Still from a marketing kind of view, he handles the situation wrong. 
Instead of insulting customers and Ola, he should try to calm everyone down, say sorry and try to fix the situation. 

I kind of understand the problem with the oil though. If your used to a high gloss finish oil sometimes feels and looks way different depending on the oil.

edit:
am just watching the video.....
The comment about the gap in the neck pocket is ridiculous. I know a lot of people building guitars in their freetime, as I do it myself....
Usually a neck should fit its neck pocket in a way there is no gap, not even for a single piece of paper.


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## Rook (May 30, 2013)

Wow, that's crazy.

I wish I'd ordered an S7 Boden now, a strandberg for half the price and barely any of the wait. Crazy!


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## Jake (May 30, 2013)

What a *f*ucking dick, I would never order a guitar from this guy. Who calls their customers idiots, assholes, morons, and thinks they don't know what they are talking about. He's completely lost it, oh so you had your research published in college and that makes you god or something and everyone is out to get you? I am just shocked and saddened by all of this, and Alain I wish you the best with this situation and hope it all works out.


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## hk_golgatha (May 30, 2013)

Massive cheers to Ola. He's made a future customer in me today.
I've been researching .strandberg for a project in school and I'm beyond impressed with his character and dedication to the customer.


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## Daf57 (May 30, 2013)

Wow - 7 string reality tv!


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## decoy205 (May 30, 2013)

A neck pocket on any guitar including bolt-ons should be tight. An envelope should not fit.


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## Jonathan20022 (May 30, 2013)

Rook said:


> Wow, that's crazy.
> 
> I wish I'd ordered an S7 Boden now, a strandberg for half the price and barely any of the wait. Crazy!



Don't think it's worth all this stress, and Ola hasn't revealed any info besides his message. So let's not assume haha, price wise they're getting a sweet deal on an actual Strandberg, but I doubt they're going to get placed higher on Strandberg's list than the people who are currently on it. That wouldn't seem fair, if he means AES then that's still awesome of him to do.


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## Black Mamba (May 30, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> I have now offered to assume the responsibility for delivering the outstanding orders as well as the currently agreed replacements from S7.
> 
> The customers involved will be given the option of staying on with S7 to receive their original order, or having it fulfilled by Strandberg Guitars in Sweden.


 
What class!


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

baryton said:


> But for 2600 (2 months salary) I excepted to have a better finish from S7 and Guitar Candy that's all!



How is Guitar Candy related to a guitar's finish, considering they simply operate as the retailer, mate? If anything, you could ask for warranty coverage, which is down to GC to mediate for you, but it's not like one can blame whatever reseller for cosmetic issues with a particular instrument unless it is storage / demo damage or so!


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## MaxOfMetal (May 30, 2013)

Fred the Shred said:


> How is Guitar Candy related to a guitar's finish, considering they simply operate as the retailer, mate? If anything, you could ask for warranty coverage, which is down to GC to mediate for you, but it's not like one can blame whatever reseller for cosmetic issues with a particular instrument unless it is storage / demo damage or so!



Read his full post, man. 

Apparently Guitar Candy did not setup the guitar as requested, there is a buzzing issue, and GC has since ignored him. 

Honestly, looking at these pictures, I don't see how any retailer, especially one who focuses on high end/boutique gear, could let that guitar go to a customer without being considered B-stock. These aren't $500 Indo Ibanez guitars, these are $$$$ first world, custom shop guitars, finish and grain flaws should not be tolerated. 

Are the defects Guitar Candy's fault? Of course not, it's the manufacturer from the looks of it. Though, part of being a dealer/retailer is inspecting guitars and making sure the lemons don't make it to the paying customers.


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

YJGB said:


> *flameshield on*
> 
> I must pick sides with Jim. I know receiving an instrument with a small thing wrong isn't exactly what you'd like on such an expensive guitar. But when you contact him calling him an idiot and not only mocking his builds but also insulting him and his company of which he is proud, I can totally understand he is pissed and has had it with these kind of things.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I feel sorry for everyone who had a faulty instrument, and he shouldn't have put the blame on others. He also has to take a bit of the blame, because it's his company. But he's not the only one in the company. And people seem to forget that he's a busy man, running 2 lines. The Boden and his own S7G line. He ain't got no time fo' that. The main thing in this story, I think, is the patience. But apparently no one has patience anymore.



This is my position on this.

We're all capable of being upset, we're all human. Customers can get upset and so can Jim. He scares me when he looks straight into the camera and says "I'll take care of it." 

If you're upset with your guitar, call the office. Be polite. Be patient. They'll fix it. Only go public if they pull an Adam Orth and tell you to "Deal with it." Blatantly telling you they don't care that you have an issue and will do nothing to solve it. If you're calm and polite, you'll be fine.

Whiny message boards and Facebook posts help nothing. Especially when people that are upset tend to leave out information, whether intentionally or unintentionally. It's easy to flip a situation to appear to be in your favor by leaving out some details. You are a customer and you should be treated as one, but you're still dealing with people. Often people that spend countless hours doing their job and insulting them over some imperfections will not get anything fixed. If anything, it makes the situation worse and it makes everyone look bad. Handle it like a decent human being and you can expect the same treatment in return.

To the people that got guitars that were truly faulty, I'm sorry to hear it. It happens.

The lesson I'm taking out of this: Nothing in this world will ever be perfect. Even a $3,000 guitar.

It will give me a positive outlook when I order guitars from these companies in the future. I expect there to be some little flaws in it somewhere. As long as there isn't a chunk or wood missing, a cracked fretboard, a section of the guitar is unpainted or unfinished, or hasn't arrived to my doorstep ON FIRE for whatever insane reason from hell... I think I'll be happy. I just want it to look great, play great, and have no issues such as tuning, intonation, frets. Things that would make it impossible to play properly. I wouldn't say my standards are low, I just don't expect a golden guitar that never has a blemish and is unaffected by human error, builder or player. I'd be just fine knowing I can contact someone and have it sorted out if there is a real issue.

And on a lighter note, lets all gather around and have some Invictus Guitar Cake.






I love that picture. 

In one of his other videos, there are two Bodens sitting on a tablet next to his laptop. One has a small knot or other blemish in the walnut top and the other has a brown spot on the birdseye maple fretboard. I gotta be honest, even with those flaws, I'd ....ing love to have those...


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## HighPotency (May 30, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Read his full post, man.
> 
> Apparently Guitar Candy did not setup the guitar as requested, there is a buzzing issue, and GC has since ignored him.
> 
> ...



In defense of Guitar Candy, when dealing with such a high-value product that's essentially custom made, I think it's fair to assume that the product they receive from a (supposedly) reputable manufacturer is what was ok by their standards.


Ola, don't stop making guitars. It might take me 10 years but I'll be contacting you for one when I get the money.


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

He does have the right to make a warranty claim, and in the EU you can be refunded within two months of purchase upon returning the goods. There is a very strong customer protection legal structure in place in these parts. 

Also, he's in France, Guitar Candy is in Belgium - the neck will shift a bit along the way, all things considered, and unless we're discussing uneven frets or them simply deciding to pop out, it's usually a simple truss rod tweak as you know.  Maybe it's the way the post is structured misleading my comprehension of what happened, I suppose.

PS - Max, you NEVER gave me beer, therefore your post would always be invalid. That is all.


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## baryton (May 30, 2013)

Fred the Shred said:


> How is Guitar Candy related to a guitar's finish, considering they simply operate as the retailer, mate? If anything, you could ask for warranty coverage, which is down to GC to mediate for you, but it's not like one can blame whatever reseller for cosmetic issues with a particular instrument unless it is storage / demo damage or so!



Fred I don't Blame GC for the Guitar Finish, I asked for a A Tuning with a new string gauge set and a things i didn't know (Allan and Curran explained it to me) is the nut is cutted for specific gauge for a B Tuning, as a result it make a buzz with the zero fret which irradiate, resonate to the bridge.

When Bart received this guitar, (it was a stock one) I asked for a A tuning and neck adjustment, apparently he just changed the string and shipped it. If he doesn't how to adjust a guitar, it's not a problem, i would prefer to know it before. 

I had some exchange with Paul, Allan, Jim, Curran and Bart get copy for each Email i did about this bridge's buzz problem, I never had a reply but when i asked for Masvidalien price i get response in hour!


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

Ah, now I get what you're saying - upon reading your post I was mislead by the whole finish thing and got a bit lost!


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## baryton (May 30, 2013)

Fred the Shred said:


> Ah, now I get what you're saying - upon reading your post I was mislead by the whole finish thing and got a bit lost!



Im not surprised, it's written in a bible that French people sucks to speak/write another langages 

(nb: It's a weird circonstances to tell it but I'm a huge fan of your music, Atonement is often played in my Ipod )


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

Why thank you, man!


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## Seanthesheep (May 30, 2013)

Oh god. That 58 minutes from S7 is rediculous. I honestly cant sit through the entire thing its too rediculous. 

On the other hand its good to hear Olas stepping in and making sure the orders get fufilled either by washburn or ola himself in sweden.


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## Nonservium (May 30, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> In one of his other videos, there are two Bodens sitting on a tablet next to his laptop. One has a small knot or other blemish in the walnut top and the other has a brown spot on the birdseye maple fretboard. I gotta be honest, even with those flaws, I'd ....ing love to have those...



I had the same thoughts, I'd love to have the one he demo'd the oil on. I was on the fence about ordering one of these but it had nothing to do with S7G and everything to do with the fact that my wife wanted a kid. I chose the wife over guitar in a rare moment of insanity 

I'm sure the buyer's remorse he points out is more than likely what's happened to several of these. Damn shame all the way around.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 30, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> It will give me a positive outlook when I order guitars from these companies in the future. I expect there to be some little flaws in it somewhere. As long as there isn't a chunk or wood missing, a cracked fretboard, a section of the guitar is unpainted or unfinished, or hasn't arrived to my doorstep ON FIRE for whatever insane reason from hell... I think I'll be happy. I just want it to look great, play great, and have no issues such as tuning, intonation, frets. Things that would make it impossible to play properly. I wouldn't say my standards are low, I just don't expect a golden guitar that never has a blemish and is unaffected by human error, builder or player. I'd be just fine knowing I can contact someone and have it sorted out if there is a real issue.



After five years you guys still manage to leave me awestruck. Really.

For $3k a guitar _should_ be perfect. Heck, if I can get an off the shelf $1000 guitar with zero flaws, even little ones, then a $3k guitar, especially one touted as "custom" or "handmade" should be of the same standard. 

There are too many builders that consistently put out amazing guitars for this to be acceptable on any level. The fact that these guitars left the factory is a testament to how little the builder genuinely cares. 

Falling back on "builders are human" is a cop out if I've ever heard one. 

Mistakes do happen, *but* that doesn't mean it should be accepted, especially given the price range we're talking about. Holding builders to a high standard is why we pay the prices we do. You're paying not for materials when you plunk down the cash for a custom order, you're paying for the builder's care and attention to detail.


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## elq (May 30, 2013)

wow. trying to find the words to describe the first video... and I can only come up with batshit insane.


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## MetalBuddah (May 30, 2013)

I could barely make it past the "nicities" or whatever the hell he called them when he rambled about American and the military (nothing against the military at all)

I don't like judging people but Jim is seriously batshit and this passive aggressive attitude is a major turn-off


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## RustInPeace (May 30, 2013)

I really was liking this company but man.. this doesnt help at all. What does S7 offer to me for a product compared to RAN guitars?


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## jonajon91 (May 30, 2013)

Watching the second video. Lots of biging himself up talking about his research in collage getting published and acting cocky.


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## MetalDaze (May 30, 2013)

I've made it through about half that video. I don't know the cast of characters or everything he discusses, but it was enough for me to know not to order anything from him because "that's what I do."


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## mphsc (May 30, 2013)

wish I had that 1:20 back in my life. On another note, so glad I backed out of ordering from them and hire a damn assistant by all means.


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## asher (May 30, 2013)

RustInPeace said:


> I really was liking this company but man.. this doesnt help at all. What does S7 offer to me for a product compared to RAN guitars?



Worm holes and split knots. Builds character!


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## eaeolian (May 30, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> After five years you guys still manage to leave me awestruck. Really.
> 
> For $3k a guitar _should_ be perfect. Heck, if I can get an off the shelf $1000 guitar with zero flaws, even little ones, then a $3k guitar, especially one touted as "custom" or "handmade" should be of the same standard.
> 
> There are too many builders that consistently put out amazing guitars for this to be acceptable on any level. The fact that these guitars left the factory is a testament to how little the builder genuinely cares.





The standards are so low for "custom" guitars these days that I cannot believe people are still paying for this crap. Seriously.


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## Sudzmorphus (May 30, 2013)

Honestly, after all of this I wont be using either company.


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## Fred the Shred (May 30, 2013)

Considering my own .strandberg* axes, your loss, to be honest.


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## birch (May 30, 2013)

Can any strandberg owners confirm what Jim says at the end of the 2nd video (3/64th inches action is not possible with this bridge)? Ive got a CL7 on order from the Washburn shop and whilst i have faith that they will produce a quality instrument, im concerned that the bridge design wont let me get the action i want without a shim.


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## elq (May 30, 2013)

^ sounds like a bullshit rationalization to me


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## MaxOfMetal (May 30, 2013)

birch said:


> Can any strandberg owners confirm what Jim says at the end of the 2nd video (3/64th inches action is not possible with this bridge)? Ive got a CL7 on order from the Washburn shop and whilst i have faith that they will produce a quality instrument, im concerned that the bridge design wont let me get the action i want without a shim.



Even if the bridge itself can't be lowered to a certain point, this can easily be compensated for in construction of the instrument, without the need of a shim, by adjusting the height of the fretboard relative to the top of the guitar. That's something that needs to be considered on all builds, not just those utilizing specific hardware. 

It sounds like Jim just doesn't know how to compensate for components in his build. 



elq said:


> ^ sounds like a bullshit rationalization to me



Eric with the  win.


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## SavM (May 30, 2013)

Wow! just saw that video, anger management springs to mind. They need to slow things *right *down and go over their builds with a fine tooth comb. I'm sure their customers wouldn't mind if it meant getting a better guitar in the long run, I know I wouldn't.
They're charging premium prices, and for that money the customer could have gone anywhere else. They should be grateful they were chosen and should have done everything in their power to make things right. This is a business after all.
Who knows they could turn things around, but unless they change their attitude they will run themselves into the ground, if they haven't already.


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## JaeSwift (May 30, 2013)

My tip sheet for them would look something like this:

1. Don't have an e-mail account if you aren't answering your mails. Don't blame customers for not knowing how to contact you when you've said a hundred times that they need to call you; clearly it did not reach some of them. Also, your audience is worldwide, not just the USA, inter-continental phone calls are expensive and tedious due to timezone differences. 

2. Don't have unqualified people (Sorry, but Curran posted some pretty weird messages on FB) handle your Facebook; if you don't have the time for it, don't make a profile.

3. Your customers are your livelihood, just imagine what someone will be thinking when they hear you calling them out by name, surname and place of residence on the interwebs. 

4. 70% of communication is non-verbal, if you make a video like this you come across as a bomb waiting to explode.

5. Trash-talking others actually makes yourself look a whole lot worse.

6. Stop bringing up the marines and the US military, it is subject to such different opinions worldwide that it's just plain stupid to bring it up. This is the second time Jim brings it up, it's like your inviting termites in to your house.

7. Adressing the issues is great until' you don't adress the real issue, i.e Leonardo being told that Wormholes were ''Ok'' and ''add character''. 

8. Whatever internal company problems you've had with past employees should stay internal, don't ever bring it up, EVER.

9. Indirectly stating that the Strandberg Boden bridge design is flawed and too hard to handle means you aren't backing up your own product.

10. Showing a contract with Strandberg...really?

Gonna watch through the second video now if my stomache can handle it.


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## wespaul (May 30, 2013)

This dude reminds me of restaurant owners on Kitchen Nightmares who drive their business into the ground and are angry with everybody but themselves over it.


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## dcoughlin1 (May 30, 2013)

wespaul said:


> This dude reminds me of restaurant owners on Kitchen Nightmares who drive their business into the ground and are angry with everybody but themselves over it.



Are you talking about these crazy people?


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## wespaul (May 30, 2013)

I was totally going to make an Amy's Baking Company reference but wasn't sure if anybody would get it, haha


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## Mr-Jemhead93 (May 30, 2013)

I can understand he is under a lot of stress but this definitely could've been handled a lot better. This guy needs some sort of PR person because obviously he doesn't know how to talk to the public. This whole insulting ex employees, his current (or is it ex now?) business partners, and customers is ridiculous and a major boner kill for me atleast when it comes to this guitar company. He was just being criticized by customers who weren't satisfied with what they purchased (and they had every right to be), and a bunch of us guitar nerds, hell plenty of guitar companies get flack for releasing sub-par instruments and I've never seen them make videos of them "defending their name". This just seemed really silly and immature of him to go and do this because people had negative things to say about his company.


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## Jzbass25 (May 30, 2013)

These videos are sad, it seems like they can see their company slamming into a brick wall. I think they need to call chef ramsay to fix their company, this is near Amy's Bakery social media breakdown level =P

I'm not on any side at all but this is not how you do it. I like how this guy touts his published graduate work and says "I'm not an idiot" as he consistently proves that he doesn't know how to manage a company. I'm a smart guy that works with smart people and something a lot of smart people need to realize is that they can't be good at everything, especially running a company haha. I give him credit for refunding some people (only example I have is the guitar he showed in video 2) and I understand the difficulty with email sometimes but not being able to respond to emails have buried companies, you have to keep up with the times whether you like to email or not. He likes to talk about today's "internet world" or he mentioned something about instant gratification society, yeah I understand where he's coming from but adapting to the times is what you do as a company, or generally you have some issues or a lot of issues lol. 

I can't talk about the quality of their products but you do not call out costumers, you do not let emotions influence you like this or do the talking for you and if you're competing in the price range you're going to have some issues if you ever put out a guitar that isn't immaculate or if you have this kind of attitude with your customer service. I do understand the problem with customers not understanding how to work strandbergs and then getting mad at s7 but damn videos like these are just a horrible idea. 

Edit: I will say I always had this weird vibe coming from S7, I'm sort of glad I never ordered a Boden from them. I would like to wish them the best but after these videos I just can't. It seems like the case of another company/owner that wasn't ready to take on the market (and the demand for strandbergs) and the way it runs.


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## Jzbass25 (May 30, 2013)

I'll quote myself from the other thread that's about the S7 videos (with amy's bakery reference =P)



Jzbass25 said:


> These videos are sad, it seems like they can see their company slamming into a brick wall. I think they need to call chef ramsay to fix their company, this is near Amy's Bakery social media breakdown level =P
> 
> I'm not on any side at all but this is not how you do it. I like how this guy touts his published graduate work and says "I'm not an idiot" as he consistently proves that he doesn't know how to manage a company. I'm a smart guy that works with smart people and something a lot of smart people need to realize is that they can't be good at everything, especially running a company haha. I give him credit for refunding some people (only example I have is the guitar he showed in video 2) and I understand the difficulty with email sometimes but not being able to respond to emails have buried companies, you have to keep up with the times whether you like to email or not. He likes to talk about today's "internet world" or he mentioned something about instant gratification society, yeah I understand where he's coming from but adapting to the times is what you do as a company, or generally you have some issues or a lot of issues lol.
> 
> ...


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## Rev2010 (May 30, 2013)

wespaul said:


> I was totally going to make an Amy's Baking Company reference but wasn't sure if anybody would get it, haha



I think half the country knows about those loons by now 

*EDIT - oh crap... now I gotta worry they're gonna come after me for calling them loons on the internet... being the evil cyber bully I am 


Rev.


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## wannabguitarist (May 30, 2013)

After watching that video (while Jim's tone is not helping his cause) I have to agree with Jim about how ridiculous the tuning pegs and "dry finish" issues are.

Out of curiosity; is what he's saying about the claro walnut true? I know you're supposed to fill the holes with epoxy which you can't really do with oil right?

Not trying to defend Jim but it sounds like he's gotten some silly complaints on top his own mistakes as well


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## Captain Butterscotch (May 30, 2013)

Aaaaaaand now the video is private.


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## Jzbass25 (May 30, 2013)

wannabguitarist said:


> After watching that video (while Jim's tone is not helping his cause) I have to agree with Jim about how ridiculous the tuning pegs and "dry finish" issues are.
> 
> Out of curiosity; is what he's saying about the claro walnut true? I know you're supposed to fill the holes with epoxy which you can't really do with oil right?
> 
> Not trying to defend Jim but it sounds like he's gotten some silly complaints on top his own mistakes as well



You're always going to get silly complaints, you just don't handle it with that kind of attitude. 

I think a major problem, I only slightly touched on, is selling a guitar around the 3k range as a production guitar when the guitar is known for being a custom guitar.(if that makes sense) He brings it up slightly too, if you're going to be making a production guitar you can't really hand pick each piece like a custom shop, now it could come down to his wood supplier also being an issue as well though; however, I would always contact the customer before putting out a guitar that might come back like the walnut top guitar in the video. 
It might not look like the picture but most people are going to expect an immaculate instrument especially at that price point, hell I can get a production mayones for a couple hundred more.


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## Captain Butterscotch (May 30, 2013)

Jzbass25 said:


> *It might not look like the picture but most people are going to expect an immaculate instrument especially at that price point*




This is essentially why I think that Jim isn't doing it right as far as mindset goes. At that price point, I want a high quality piece of functional art. Not a neat little stringed thing that they spat out in a couple weeks complete with little "inane" and "artsy" flaws.


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## TIBrent (May 30, 2013)

WOW!


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## HighPotency (May 30, 2013)

It's hard to make a fair assessment of the situation since I don't know what happened other than what's been said, but there's no doubt that Jim is handling this very unprofessionally.


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## ElRay (May 30, 2013)

Captain Butterscotch said:


> Aaaaaaand now the video is private.


Only the hour long one is. The other one is still open, and the number one recommended video one of the Crazy Amy from Amy's Baking Company videos. 

Ray


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## wannabguitarist (May 30, 2013)

Captain Butterscotch said:


> This is essentially why I think that Jim isn't doing it right as far as mindset goes. At that price point, I want a high quality piece of functional art. Not a neat little stringed thing that they spat out in a couple weeks complete with little "inane" and "artsy" flaws.



But those "artsy" flaws in the walnut top aren't really flaws at all if that's actually how the wood is. If you can't fill the top with epoxy with an oil finish then some of those little black holes (not talking about the worm holes in the ash) is something you just have to deal with. The only Claro tops I've seen have been under lots of poly so I dunno how the process works with oil


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## Rev2010 (May 30, 2013)

Captain Butterscotch said:


> Aaaaaaand now the video is private.



Maybe he thought he was being too subtle and plans to release an angrier version. 

Seriously, I don't know why people don't watch something after they film it before posting... or often times even with posting people get mad and don't read what they just wrote and hit Reply and then later regret it. I've been making the effort for a while now to look over my posts and emails before sending, and sure enough there have been many times I reworded stuff just so it wouldn't be read in a bad way or cause any kind of drama. Making the video private at this point does nothing, the cat is out of the bag. Poor Jim, I wish he could've handled it better... he's does seem quite a nice guy at heart if you've ever communicated with him.


Rev.


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## AwDeOh (May 30, 2013)

Seeing public shit-flinging matches like this between company and customer might be entertaining drama for the discerning popcorn lover, but custom guitar builders are business owners no different to any other. You can't do business like this, and expect to keep doing business.

On the other hand, they are providing heaps of "what not to do" examples for those of us who want to start building for others. Thanks, Jim.


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## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

wannabguitarist said:


> But those "artsy" flaws in the walnut top aren't really flaws at all if that's actually how the wood is. If you can't fill the top with epoxy with an oil finish then some of those little black holes (not talking about the worm holes in the ash) is something you just have to deal with. The only Claro tops I've seen have been under lots of poly so I dunno how the process works with oil



From what I gathered, whether the holes were there or not was not the problem. It was the amount of holes and their size and prominence that was causing issues with the customers. Having one or two TINY holes that you can barely see at all may not be an issue, but at any point in time when you can see said natural flaws of the wood itself without even having to second glance, the wood SHOULD NOT be used. It should be tossed, and another piece with less imperfection should be selected.

Using an imperfect piece of wood on a +$3k instrument is unacceptable. It is not art, it does not add character, and if the customer does not want it, then it shouldn't be there. In this situation it literally IS that cut and dry, no exceptions. Toss the wood, use a different ....ing piece.


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## wannabguitarist (May 30, 2013)

I'm pretty sure there aren't any "perfect" pieces of Claro walnut by your definition


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## ElRay (May 30, 2013)

Jzbass25 said:


> I like how this guy touts his published graduate work and says "I'm not an idiot" as he consistently proves that he doesn't know how to manage a company.



And you definitely don't spew bad physics (the first time I remember reading that ice-skate press does NOT melt the ice was 15 -20 years ago.) and you definitely don't use a statement that actually disproves your point. On that note, TiteBond III is not a good glue for neck laminations because it does creep when under pressure. Furniture builders don't use it for bent laminations. They use epoxy, polyurethane or original TiteBond.

Ray


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## lurgar (May 30, 2013)

Jim keeps talking about how he has so little time yet he spent an HOUR bitching about people on the internet, high standards, trolls, and customers. 

I can understand being mad at the internet and trolls, but people are putting up $3k for a guitar man, you've gotta understand that people will want what they paid for. Acting passive-aggressive when somebody calls you out for a defect like you can't do anything wrong is a huge turn off for a potential customer. I mean, I was considering putting my money on an S7 very recently, but this attitude has put me off. I honestly feel like if I encountered problems with a build that I would be met with this same kind of attitude.


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## Jzbass25 (May 30, 2013)

wannabguitarist said:


> But those "artsy" flaws in the walnut top aren't really flaws at all if that's actually how the wood is. If you can't fill the top with epoxy with an oil finish then some of those little black holes (not talking about the worm holes in the ash) is something you just have to deal with. The only Claro tops I've seen have been under lots of poly so I dunno how the process works with oil




Here are some examples of nice oiled claro walnut tops that I found in a 2 second search and I don't see any holes. 

Mayones Djentlemen Series - Regius 6 MM CW Claro Walnut Top

Crap pic on this one

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/935270_464700800266716_763620943_n.jpg

Carvin.com BBS :: View topic - NGD-JB200 FIGURED CLARO WALNUT HEAVEN.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...27-claro-walnut-swamp-ash-birdseye-maple.html

#19 &#8211; Joe DeLano | .strandberg* Guitars


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## wannabguitarist (May 30, 2013)

^I stand corrected then


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## leonardo7 (May 30, 2013)

Danukenator said:


> What a ....ing scumbag. I assume at the 34 minute mark he is talking about Leonardo. If so, the he should take up the offer and just send the money to Washburn.



Correct, but on the issue of sending back the guitar, take up the offer of sending him back the guitar Ive already paid for? Then wait 4+ months for the money to be sent to Washburn? Then wait another 4+ months for the guitar to be made? That's a terrible idea. I said it before Jim admitted it in the video today, Strictly 7 is broke!! Thats the reality and I knew it when he asked me for upfront payment back in January. Since then there has been nothing but evidence stacking up to prove that they are on their way out the door. The evidence would not be as present to someone other than myself. The position I have been in and dealing with what I have dealt with is what has made it obvious to me that they are broke and today he has admitted to it in the video. 

Unless he works it out somehow, or gets financial backing, I do not feel as though I would ever get my money back, therefore will not be sending him my guitar. He wants me to send him the guitar so he can paint it and sell it asap! Meanwhile, that money wont be going to me or Washburn for many months if at all, and in the meantime the money from the resell will be used to cover his expenses and debt! Sending him back the guitar is a much better deal for him than making me a new body. While its the best option for him, its the worst option for me. Funny how these things pan out.


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## leonardo7 (May 30, 2013)

I am soooo glad I watched that video before heading to work this morning and before it was made private. The guy is one stressed out pathetic dude! I took notes and will reply in response when I get home tonight. I will start by posting a snapshot from my cell phone proving that the phone call I had with Curran last Thursday was under 21 minutes, not the 45 minutes they both claim it to be. 

For now:

He's decided to NOT make me another body as a replacement but is kind enough to be offering I send him back the guitar Ive already paid for? And hes kind enough to give me less a week to do so? Then wait 4+ months for the money to be sent to Washburn? Then wait another 4+ months for the guitar to be made? I said it before Jim admitted it in the video today, Strictly 7 is broke!! Thats the reality and I knew it when he asked me for upfront payment back in January. Since then there has been nothing but evidence stacking up to prove that they are on their way out the door. The evidence would not be so present to someone who has no dealings with the company. The position I have been in and dealing with what I have dealt with is what has made it obvious to me that they are broke and today he has admitted to it in the video. 

Unless he works it out somehow, or gets financial backing, I do not feel as though I would ever get my money back, therefore will not be sending him my guitar. He wants me to send him the guitar so he can paint it and sell it asap! Meanwhile, that money wont be going to me or Washburn for many months if at all, and in the meantime the money from the resell will be used to cover his expenses and debt! Sending him back the guitar is a much better deal for him than making me a new body. While its the best option for him, its the worst option for me. Funny how these things pan out.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

yeah that's one thing that didn't sit well with me. Unfortunately a lot of these 'hey I'm a good guy' retorts and ideas of resolution are not customer centric at all. Like you said, your customer journey throughout either of the ultimatums leaves you with full payment on a guitar you won't see for probably half a year, at best.


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## mphsc (May 30, 2013)

^ dude, you're famous.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

my memory escapes me now, but is sending it back for a new body still on the table? or did he state 'keep it or send it back for a full refund and you can go to washburn'? I can't remember.


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## Sean Ashe (May 30, 2013)

I don't usually chime in on situations like this, but..

Although I have never had interest in getting a guitar from Strictly 7 (just based on what I dig in a guitar) I can confidently say i would NEVER purchase a guitar from that company. I watched the video's of Jim, and it's just extremely unprofessional in my opinion. To see a builder/owner acting having a hissy fit on camera about being criticized for his flawed work... Just ridiculousness

I played several of the Boden's at NAMM, actually both of the ones he brought up in the video (the one that they didn't have on display and the one they did) and honestly I didn't think they resonated that well nor played that well, in comparison to Ola's work. But those are just my opinions. 

Sad to see all these problems people are having with their guitars, hope it all gets resolved!


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## technomancer (May 30, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> I am soooo glad I watched that video before heading to work this morning and before it was made private. The guy is one stressed out pathetic dude! I took notes and will reply in response when I get home tonight. I will start by posting a snapshot from my cell phone proving that the phone call I had with Curran last Thursday was under 21 minutes, not the 45 minutes they both claim it to be.
> 
> For now:
> 
> ...



Call either your bank or credit card company (whichever one you paid with), explain the situation, and ask them what your options are. You may have grounds to send the guitar back and get a charge back which gets that chunk of stump wood out of your possession and your money back in your hands in a reasonable time frame


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

xCaptainx said:


> my memory escapes me now, but is sending it back for a new body still on the table? or did he state 'keep it or send it back for a full refund and you can go to washburn'? I can't remember.



I can't really put names to message board aliases, but he said _send it back in 7 days for a refund or you're out of luck_. He was very clear, and mean about it.

Was it leonardo he was talking about? If so, he seemed very clear that he was just plain done with him and wanted to get the refund out of the way and move on.


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## leonardo7 (May 30, 2013)

mphsc said:


> ^ dude, you're famous.





technomancer said:


> Call either your bank or credit card company (whichever one you paid with), explain the situation, and ask them what your options for. You may have grounds to send the guitar back and get a charge back which gets that chunk of stump wood out of your possession and your money back in your hands in a reasonable time frame



Maybe I should keep this infamous Boden 

Ive already started a charge back claim as of Monday for the just under $1400 final payment that was sent on April 5th.



Insinfier said:


> I can't really put names to message board aliases, but he said _send it back in 7 days for a refund or you're out of luck_. He was very clear, and mean about it.
> 
> Was it leonardo he was talking about? If so, he seemed very clear that he was just plain done with him and wanted to get the refund out of the way and move on.



Actually what he really meant was Im broke, I cant afford to make you a new body so just send me the guitar so I can paint it and sell it in a few weeks to pay off my debt, then make you wait 4+ months in which time I file for bankruptcy and never pay you your refund, or I just string you along and stretch it out for as long as I can, hopefully a year or longer, Thanks


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

That's not what I heard in the video. 

But I do agree that having him send your money to Washburn is an awful idea. While I don't doubt that the successful builds Strictly 7 has completed are ....ing awesome guitars, they seem to be having management and other kinds of issues. He lacks a secretary to run the basic day stuff like PR and e-mail and he kept mentioning ex-employees that ....ed up somehow and are "no longer with the company." And after watching the Update Part 2 video and hearing how he has over $100,000 tied up and his bank repossessed his good vehicle...

Well, there's a lot more, but I fear for your money simply because it will get lost due to awful management on the business side of things. I don't fear for it being stolen... Just plain lost because someone can't even manage what they have right now.


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## Overtone (May 30, 2013)

Leo7 be careful with your comments... he might post another Youtube rant and then we ALL have to suffer!


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## technomancer (May 30, 2013)

Aaaaand the hour long rant video is now private


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## MF_Kitten (May 30, 2013)

These videos are a TRAINWRECK. He is disrespecting his customers, some of them by name, and he is disrespecting Ola Strandberg. He is addressing minor complaints, and avoiding the major ones, and he is trying to save face by getting angry and shifting the attention. This is what people do when they are caught.

Also, I was told by a high-end trained tech that luthiers shun Titebond 3 because it's rubbery, and shifts around, and is horrible for instruments, which is why luthiers mostly use Titebond 1.


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## Exit Existence (May 30, 2013)

God damnit the videos are all private now! I wanted some good entertainment!


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

Both videos are private.

What's the point... Everyone already saw it and YOU KNOW someone saved it...right? Someone please reupload it.

Someone else had said it before me, but: The cat is out of the bag. Maybe you regret how you handled yourself in the video, but what's done is done. :/


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

Exit Existence said:


> God damnit the videos are all private now! I wanted some good entertainment!



1. My family is a bunch of soldiers and marines.
2. Money, paint, unique snowflake wood tops, I am angry, dust in the guitar paint, knots in wood, guitar action, blah blah blah, some other stuff I didn't fully understand.
3. People don't understand how the Strandberg hardware works. Maybe we should release a proper how-to guide. Nah, screw that. Let's just make an improper "instructional" video.
4. Titebond glue and ice skating. No, really.
5. The bank is repossessing my property. <- This one was actually in a different video released today. Still up, pretty sure.

That's 'bout it.

I like the Strandberg bridge. Just saying.


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## elq (May 30, 2013)

Exit Existence said:


> I wanted some good entertainment!



Seriously, they were cringe inducing. Not entertaining at all.


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## AscendingMatt (May 30, 2013)

NOO i missed the video! lame... sounds like jim is embarrassed tho from all the reads.


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## Loganator259 (May 30, 2013)

>Says he has no time.
>Makes hour long rant video at work, and then makes it private in a few shorts hours.

I think this stress is getting to him...


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

Loganator259 said:


> >Says he has no time.
> >Makes hour long rant video at work, and then makes it private in a few shorts hours.
> 
> I think this stress is getting to him...



Someone else from/near Tulsa appears!





This was supposed to be an update for people that have outstanding orders with Strictly 7, but it nosedives into a rant about his financial troubles.


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## Danukenator (May 30, 2013)

I feel like a dick for not DL'ing these. I KNEW they were going to go private...

Could someone fill me in on what happened with the rouge employee that borderline committed "sabotage?"


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## Scattered Messiah (May 30, 2013)

As I woke up this morning, I took in a good 30mins of the first video, and then went to a movieshooting, where I am in charge of the choreography.
Now back home again, from a long and in it's own way pretty draining day, I wanted to round up my day with some more real life soap opera - but I find out the videos are private ... 

I try to sse both sides of the fence, really hard.
Most of us will be able to understand, emotionally and rationally, that if someone is attached to something (in this case Jim to his own company) and feels this "investment" is in danger and threatened in some aspects, we will automatically engage a defensive and potentially aggressive mode, that's only natural
...
natural but NOT professional!
I understand a person's decision, to prefer direct communication methods like phonecalls to a more indirect approach as emails etc. However when you are running a business, you should adjust to your customers, or at least make clear in a polite and precautionary fashion, that in case of emergency one of those methods is to be preffered.
again, understandable but not professional.
even more so, as your customers might be from different time zones, and have their own duties ("Boss, I can't really attend to the meeting - gotta ring up a guy for personal matters and was not able to get a hold of him up to now...") - the reason why emails are so handy is that emotion is partially camouflaged, and it is not requrired for both persons to have time at the same moment.
Frustration about seemingly unresolved or not nicely resolved issues concerning former employees or their behaviour is also totally comprehensible - but airing this as a part of an open debate, in a personal manner, is (again, see?) not professional. no matter how much it set you back, you are the head of your company, and as such you are responsible for your company's ....ups at the end of the day.
Airing your frustration about details in the building process (like the Oil thing, the sidedots, the hardware) is also unprofessional as hell. If it really would have been such a problem, then why not explain this to the customers in question (leading to a constructive discussion with maybe Ola invoved) ... like this it comes off more as an excuse that just fit in well with the scheme.

A prof I admire for his broad knowledge once said to me, that big part of an independen business and good customer service is to be able to apologize for every little """issue""" a customer brings up, while SILENTLY thinking "you dumb SOAB", and then trying to do everything so the customer has it the way HE wants ... not the way it necessarily was meant to be or wanted. because - that's actually how a good deal of product development/optimization happens...

So I believe, that a huge part of the unintelligent reaction on Jim's side is due to stress (Ola's contract not prolonged, backlog, woodsourcing problems, personal problems withing your staff, ...).

But, for christs sake, this does not excuse the (unbacked) use of materials that are commonly regarded as flawed, shoddy work, personal insults, badmouthing, etc...
this does not excuse fanning the flames of this flamewar into every direction possible...


Plus I think with todays speed of information, the standarts for "high end" products are higher than ever, as the - maybe - few bad products you produce might really start an avalanche.


tl, dr:
If I claim to take pride in my products and pretend to be a professional, instead of "self proclaimed", then why do I let things like this happen?


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## Loganator259 (May 30, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> Someone else from/near Tulsa appears!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Don't see many people from/near Tulsa on here! 
And yep, watching that right now. Feel bad for the guy because of his financial issues, I'm sure that can't be fun, but this just seems like a very poor way of handling it, imo.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

I have no sympathy for the email thing. Have someone doing it!

I administrate one full time and one part time employee handling 350+ emails a week with no concerns at all. AND talking phone calls.


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## capoeiraesp (May 30, 2013)

Can someone please make sure these videos are being downloaded in case they're removed? I don't mean this in a malicious manner rather if someone has to use his response in a legal situation they may be useful for evidence.


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## RagtimeDandy (May 30, 2013)

Lol, I don't even care to try to see his side of the story anymore. That guy is a financial dipshit, clearly has no idea how to run a business, got way in over his head, and doesn't have the maturity to figure it out

BOOOOHHOOOOHOOOO 34 EMAILS PER DAAAAAY! My ....ing dad gets ~75 per day, answers all of them, and has no issues whatsoever


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## MaxOfMetal (May 30, 2013)

Don't worry guys, the videos are safe and sound.


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Don't worry guys, the videos are safe and sound.



This is what I hope you did.







I shouldn't be getting my hopes up though.


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## leonardo7 (May 30, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> Someone else from/near Tulsa appears!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




35 emails a day is no biggie! 35 phone calls is going to take up way more time. Typing for 30 seconds x35 takes up way less time than talking for 2 minutes or more x35. Anyways, so now he says he's going back to his day job? Now he has the perfect excuse for taking EVEN longer to finish guitars


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## capoeiraesp (May 30, 2013)

So his day job isn't building guitars? Damn...

Not being able to spend an hour a day firing off 30+ emails is a pretty weak excuse. It's like studying at uni whilst also living your life, working on the side and enjoying life in general. If you let the work pile up you're going to drowning in it before long and everything else in you're life becomes difficult.

"if you pizza when you french fries, you're gonna have a bad time."


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## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

wannabguitarist said:


> I'm pretty sure there aren't any "perfect" pieces of Claro walnut by your definition



No, apparently there are not, because said imperfections are a natural occurrence on that specific type of wood and it's nearly impossible to find one without some degree of the flaw. However, just like there are different grades of maple tops in regards to the strength of their figure, there are also pieces of Claro Walnut that have less imperfections than what is typical. THOSE are the pieces that need to be carefully selected and applied to a +$3k musical instrument. You can't just "settle" on a piece of wood for an instrument of this caliber, and it's irresponsible to buy cheap shit wood in batches in order to save money. It just doesn't translate. This is where S7 went wrong in my opinion. And the proof makes it painfully obvious; a few customers got fantastic tops and cuts of wood for the bodies, and many others got garbage. A prime example of what you find when you buy cheap batch wood and you get a couple really nice pieces and the rest are sub-par, and then you just settle for whatever you get. 

Forget the aftermath of this whole situation... that's just a reaction to the problem and a completely different story.


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## HighGain510 (May 30, 2013)

Behind on payroll - check
Bank repo'd his car (i.e. MULTIPLE missed payments) - check
Four months behind on mortgage - DOUBLE-CHECK.

Yeah, dude has spent money he doesn't have, and ....ed up dozens of guitars (how many times did he say "finish issues" in that last video? that shouldn't even be plural...) and shipped them anyway because he can't afford to eat the cost of scrapping a junk build at this point.  I'm just shocked that he said "those guys who ordered in the last 2 weeks...." in the video... who in their right mind is still sending this guy money?!  

Leonardo, if you're smart, I hope you stick to the plan of working with your card to get your cash back and you don't mail this dude back a thing until you're fully-compensated in advance. Anyone with the above financial problems is running a sinking ship and it's a matter of time before he folds and regardless of the fact that he doesn't consider himself to be dishonest, he has no money to back up his claims that he's not out to screw anyone when he literally can't afford to cover the cost of scrapping a shit build and re-building someone a decent replacement.  Desperate people do desperate things, fact of life unfortunately. 

I do love how passive-agressive he is in this video talking about the people that would be bitching and sending him complaints if he sent out the flawed guitars he has sitting in the shop... yet the recent guitars he's sent out have had flaws?  The video(s) have done nothing but made him look even worse, I'm not sure why he thought ranting and badmouthing customers like this would be a good idea...?  Don't email me, but call me... because phone calls take less time? He shouldn't be building a guitar while he's on the phone, so that means he's NOT focusing on building while he'd be sitting around chit-chatting on the phone all day if he was fielding 35 calls instead of 35 emails per day. Dude is struggling financially and seems REALLY angry, and that's not someone I personally would ever do business with, I sincerely hope folks got to see the videos before they all disappear so they get an idea of who they're sending their money to before they cut that check and mail it his way.


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## TIBrent (May 30, 2013)

I don't think Jim is a bad guy nor is S7G a bad company. I think they are the perfect example of a company that grew too fast beyond their own means. Too much happening too quickly means quality control often suffers & attention to detail is lost. Clearly they are not business managers nor do they have business degrees, but they are trying to make things right in their eyes. I can appreciate that. But what you see is guys who are trying to pour water out of a sinking boat. We can pretty much already see what is going to occur in the end. I feel for the guy, he doesn't know how to properly handle the situation of bad past business deals, customers who makes things personal/not professional & the other 98% who want to jump on in & get their voices heard (mostly against the man & the company)...I feel for him, I mean we have ALL said things out of spite & anger in the past especially when our boats are taking on water & we are doing everything we can to keep it afloat, but it didn't make it right then, & this doesn't make this right now. Sinking down to the depths of despair the masses have for you will only make you are more easily reachable target in the future.
I hope the best for S7G & their customers.


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## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

HighGain510 said:


> I'm just shocked that he said "those guys who ordered in the last 2 weeks...." in the video... who in their right mind is still sending this guy money?!



Now this question piques my interest quite a bit. Other then our website here, what other kinds of advertising about these guitars is out there? I mean of course I know there are other guitar forums out there, but these are ERG instruments and I could be talking out of my ass here but... aren't we like the biggest ERG community? Don't the people here make up the majority of these ERG sales they get? 

Seriously I'm curious to know who else out there is buying these guitars that isn't already a member of this forum, and watching all this douchewankery go down?


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## engage757 (May 30, 2013)

Alain, you should post under your avatar, "Stupid, uninformed, and ignorant."

CAN't believe he said that at you.


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> Now this question piques my interest quite a bit. Other then our website here, what other kinds of advertising about these guitars is out there? I mean of course I know there are other guitar forums out there, but these are ERG instruments and I could be talking out of my ass here but... aren't we like the biggest ERG community? Don't the people here make up the majority of these ERG sales they get?
> 
> Seriously I'm curious to know who else out there is buying these guitars that isn't already a member of this forum, and watching all this douchewankery go down?



I had GAS for a Solar 8 in the online shop. I still want one, but I'm not comfortable with a $2200 gamble. I'm not picky. I can let cosmetic issues slide, the guitar will get a little beat up from myself anyways, but in the event that the guitar has some nigh-catastrophic flaw...

Well, I won't go into details on my feelings and how much of a pansy I am. I certainly won't be happy...

So I guess I'm looking elsewhere for a good 8 string. I've been watching Jackson's affordable DKA8. Still not out...


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## Electric Wizard (May 30, 2013)

Whoever posted the Kitchen Nightmares clip is spot on, S7G seems to be in the same spot as any of the restaurants you'd see on there. Jim's too invested to do anything but hang onto S7G. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like he's up for the situation he put himself in. 

That last video is really something. I couldn't believe the part where he criticized customers for wanting instant gratification. I think it really says something about his current situation when he resents customers for wanting their guitars, rather than being able to see that they are just excited about the product he's offering.


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## Pezshreds (May 30, 2013)

I can appreciate why he's getting angry, but man that's no way to handle business. His videos would have been a lot more effective if he had taken out the aggression and name calling and name shaming out, because he actually had a couple of valid points.


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## engage757 (May 30, 2013)

*mod edit: nice subtle promotion of the deal you proposed in comments to Jim's videos. One more post promoting your "network" or anything else you're up to and you will be gone permanently.*


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## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

I answer 30 emails before my morning coffee. That was pure silliness.

I hate to keep piling on, but damn was that shop disorganized! Your work is as clean as your work area. If you look at all the badass custom guitar manufacturers out there you will see very clean workbenches (with little exception). There is a reason for that.

If that were my shop, I'd hire a $15hr guy to research progress, answer emails and organize the shop as much as possible. Those few things WILL bring in more business because customers that are happy tell people how badass their new guitar is. Conversely, one unsatisfied customer will post on forums with detailed pictures and recalled conversations until EVERYONE knows just how bad the company is. A $15 per hour guys will pay himself off after only a few guitars are sold. You WILL sell more guitars when you have great customer service. Fact.

Damage control could be as easy as some standard organization and prompt correspondence. This is not a new theory. This is textbook.


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## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

engage757 said:


> You know, in all honesty, it seems like Jim is a nice guy who is stressed and over his head. He feels let down by Strandberg, and he is getting a ton of negative publicity, he rushed guitars and made mistakes because of this. That's why I said what I did. Maybe letting some other guys check one out and see what they think. Maybe S7g still has hope, I don't know. It isn't unheard of for guitar companies to make a comeback. He honestly seems like a good guy pushed to his limit to me.
> 
> Either way, mistakes were made and must be rectified. Let's face it, he isn't in a BRJ hole. yet.



I agree. Seems like a nice guy in way over his head. 

I think S7Gs future is in $1000 stock builds. They can't cater to this crowd.


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## TIBrent (May 30, 2013)

engage757 said:


> You know, in all honesty, it seems like Jim is a nice guy who is stressed and over his head. He feels let down by Strandberg, and he is getting a ton of negative publicity, he rushed guitars and made mistakes because of this. That's why I said what I did. He honestly seems like a good guy pushed to his limit to me.


+1 This, perfectly said.


----------



## jonajon91 (May 30, 2013)

JaeSwift said:


> 5. Trash-talking others actually makes yourself look a whole lot worse.



This .... seriously



Jzbass25 said:


> These videos are sad, it seems like they can see their company slamming into a brick wall. I think they need to call chef ramsay to fix their company, this is near Amy's Bakery social media breakdown level =P



Exactly what I was thinking when I was watching these.


I wonder when we will get the big paragraph apology on facebook. I wonder if he was a mental condition? HaveNotHeardThatOneBefore


----------



## fc3603 (May 30, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> I am soooo glad I watched that video before heading to work this morning and before it was made private. The guy is one stressed out pathetic dude! I took notes and will reply in response when I get home tonight. I will start by posting a snapshot from my cell phone proving that the phone call I had with Curran last Thursday was under 21 minutes, not the 45 minutes they both claim it to be.
> 
> For now:
> 
> ...



Ivr told you people he's going broke in my last comment but guys won't believe. It's not that hard to figure it out


----------



## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> I answer 30 emails before my morning coffee. That was pure silliness.
> 
> I hate to keep piling on, but damn was that shop disorganized! Your work is as clean as your work area. If you look at all the badass custom guitar manufacturers out there you will see very clean workbenches (with little exception). There is a reason for that.
> 
> ...



Okay, so I'm going to go out on a limb here and give Jim a little break on my part since I've been bashing S7 myself mostly because of the lack of care going in to such expensive instruments, but I just can't let this post slide without saying something. 

Jim himself, the "organization" of his shop, the amount of employees he has on payroll and how he chooses said employees, along with a NUMBER of other things said here, are COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to the situation at hand. This is NOT a witch hunt, nor should it be, and who are we to criticize and judge another person and the way he completes his work? There is only ONE thing to be judged here in this entire situation, and that is the quality and consistency of expensive guitars and literally NOTHING else. You simply can not bash on the state of his workshop or his tools, etc..., because beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder, alright? I am sure there are PLENTY of other luthiers and various workshops out there that are pretty unorganized, yet still have the ability to churn out fantastic instruments, and in the end that is all that matters. 

Let's all try and keep this about the guitars, his attitude towards his customers, and his overall accountability of aforementioned details. Nothing else should be discussed here. You want to talk about how you think his shop is shitty and disorganized? You want to talk about how you think he should run his own company? Go start a thread in OT or General.


Now, with that being said, I'm not sure if anyone else touched on this yet, but for those of you who saw the video, did anyone else notice the really gross rag he was using to put on the finishing oil on that untouched body? And how the black stain that was on that rag came off with the oil and in to the body of the guitar? There's no way that stain is coming out either since he himself said that body was dry as a bone and would suck up the oil instantly. I wonder who is going to get that body, who will wind up complaining about a weird black stain mixed in with the oil finish... 


/contradictorypostiscontradictory


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## Mklane (May 30, 2013)

I got this for $1500, pretty nice oiled claro walnut.


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## Insinfier (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> Now, with that being said, I'm not sure if anyone else touched on this yet, but for those of you who saw the video, did anyone else notice the really gross rag he was using to put on the finishing oil on that untouched body? And how the black stain that was on that rag came off with the oil and in to the body of the guitar? There's no way that stain is coming out either since he himself said that body was dry as a bone and would suck up the oil instantly. I wonder who is going to get that body, who will wind up complaining about a weird black stain mixed in with the oil finish...
> 
> 
> /contradictorypostiscontradictory



Yeaaaaaa, he was like "no big deal" and I'm dying a little inside. You gotta be ....ing kidding me. You just put oil on the guitar and you have some black dye on the rag. 

I think that moment sums up all the quality control issues.



I'm actually curious how the entire back of the guitar would look with a little bit of that black rubbed in with the oil... 

Not curious enough to ruin a $2500 guitar...


----------



## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> Okay, so I'm going to go out on a limb here and give Jim a little break on my part since I've been bashing S7 myself mostly because of the lack of care going in to such expensive instruments, but I just can't let this post slide without saying something.
> 
> Jim himself, the "organization" of his shop, the amount of employees he has on payroll and how he chooses said employees, along with a NUMBER of other things said here, are COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to the situation at hand. This is NOT a witch hunt, nor should it be, and who are we to criticize and judge another person and the way he completes his work? There is only ONE thing to be judged here in this entire situation, and that is the quality and consistency of expensive guitars and literally NOTHING else. You simply can not bash on the state of his workshop or his tools, etc..., because beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder, alright? I am sure there are PLENTY of other luthiers and various workshops out there that are pretty unorganized, yet still have the ability to churn out fantastic instruments, and in the end that is all that matters.
> 
> ...



I said what I said because I think it IS relevant to the work he is putting out as well as the manner in which he conducts business. Customer service is king. In order to provide great customer service, you must have a great foundation on which to work. This includes organization.


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## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> I said what I said because I think it IS relevant to the work he is putting out as well as the manner in which he conducts business. Customer service is king. In order to provide great customer service, you must have a great foundation on which to work. This includes organization.



I understand what you are trying to convey, I honestly do, but what you are saying is completely backwards. Quality merchandise and quality customer service should be achieved at any cost, regardless of the organization skills of the company or how they run their workshop. Just because you find the S7 workshop to be messy and unorganized by YOUR standards, does not mean that everyone else will have those same standards. Each individual will thrive under their own preferred setup and surroundings.

I don't think the state of the S7 workshop has anything to do with the current situation taking place right now and to be perfectly honest, it is irrelevant. You are just using the state of the S7 workshop as another excuse to justify and to be angry about the end-result quality of the guitars. It doesn't work like that.


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## theoctopus (May 30, 2013)

I'll never understand people who sink huge amounts of their own personal cash into a business. It's never a good idea. Find investors or get a loan, and if you can't, that's probably a good indication that you shouldn't be starting the business in the first place...


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## capoeiraesp (May 30, 2013)

If you can execute it well there's no problem with doing such a thing. My favourite luthier did that 10 years ago and he's doing quite well for himself and his brand.


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## underthecurve (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> I don't think the state of the S7 workshop has anything to do with the current situation taking place right now and to be perfectly honest, it is irrelevant. You are just using the state of the S7 workshop as another excuse to justify and to be angry about the end-result quality of the guitars. It doesn't work like that.



Actually it works exactly like that. Look up 5S. It's a quality control system that increases throughput and reduces defects through organization.


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## theoctopus (May 30, 2013)

capoeiraesp said:


> If you can execute it well there's no problem with doing such a thing. My favourite luthier did that 10 years ago and he's doing quite well for himself and his brand.



It's one thing to provide a (relatively) small amount of start-up cash, and then reinvest as the business grows, and another to drop $100k of your personal coin to keep a business afloat. It's a major business faux paus that even big-timers like Michael Ovitz have made (and regretted, to the tune of many millions).


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## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

underthecurve said:


> Actually it works exactly like that.



That is one seriously bold statement there, friend. 

Sure, there are plenty of processes and functions out there to increase productivity and overall quality as well, but everyone and every company have their own best practices and due diligence that either works for them, or doesn't. You can't simply place all or most of the blame of a companies misfortune on how they run their factories and/or workshops, as there are MANY variables to why things may go wrong. And you certainly can't place blame on something you know very little or next to nothing about, the S7 workshop being in question here. Just because you saw a video or two at best that made you think their workshop was unorganized doesn't mean you can go and place the blame on that. You have no background information. You have no other evidence to support your claim other than your own standards of what you consider to be organized and effective, and therefore any rational person will consider it to be invalid. 

Not to mention that these videos were made post-internet ordeal, and so in the past few weeks or so when shit started piling up and getting hectic for the workshop, it *may* have caused the shop to gain a little more "clutter". Anyone who has not been at that workshop before and personally experienced it for themselves can not present accurate speculation. You just can't. It won't mean anything lol. And to top that off, do you think initially Ola would have chosen S7 to reproduce his art and his instruments if he thought the place was a shitshack? That only further proves my point.


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## underthecurve (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> That is one seriously bold statement there, friend.



Okay, maybe not exactly, but quality doesn't just fly out of peoples asses. I'll concede that when it comes to small artisan shops, shops geared towards one off production, organization is less critical to quality. But you can't tell me that big shops like fender, gibson, prs, or even their overseas facilities aren't set up with organization and cleanliness in mind?

And I don't think workshop organization is their only problem, luthiery is a tough thing to make economical especially at this scale. Margins are super tight, and your yield would have to be really good. 

I'm sorry you misinterpreted me, I wasn't trying to make a bold paradigm shifting statement. S7 has been shown to make some good guitars, some not so much. People are going to point out the obvious, and they wouldn't necessarily be wrong.


----------



## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> That is one seriously bold statement there, friend.
> 
> Sure, there are plenty of processes and functions out there to increase productivity and overall quality as well, but everyone and every company have their own best practices and due diligence that either works for them, or doesn't. You can't simply place all or most of the blame of a companies misfortune on how they run their factories and/or workshops, as there are MANY variables to why things may go wrong. And you certainly can't place blame on something you know very little or next to nothing about, the S7 workshop being in question here. Just because you saw a video or two at best that made you think their workshop was unorganized doesn't mean you can go and place the blame on that. You have no background information. You have no other evidence to support your claim other than your own standards of what you consider to be organized and effective, and therefore any rational person will consider it to be invalid.
> 
> Not to mention that these videos were made post-internet ordeal, and so in the past few weeks or so when shit started piling up and getting hectic for the workshop, it *may* have caused the shop to gain a little more "clutter". Anyone who has not been at that workshop before and personally experienced it for themselves can not present accurate speculation. You just can't. It won't mean anything lol. And to top that off, do you think initially Ola would have chosen S7 to reproduce his art and his instruments if he thought the place was a shitshack? That only further proves my point.



Nobody said all the issues can be blamed on the organization. A clean line can and will enhance your workflow for the better. I know this from experience. I own two businesses and have implemented lean manufacturing successfully. It has increased quality, consistency and efficiency. It's measurable. 

It's something they obviously need because they could use any help they can get. Something so minor as proper workflow, in process kanbans (staging areas) and clean workspace can DRASTICALLY increase throughput and it can also improve quality and consistency.... all of which they could benefit from. 

I respectfully disagree with your comment as all these things go hand in hand.


----------



## L1ght (May 30, 2013)

underthecurve said:


> Okay, maybe not exactly, but quality doesn't just fly out of peoples asses. I'll concede that when it comes to small artisan shops, shops geared towards one off production, organization is less critical to quality. But you can't tell me that big shops like fender, gibson, prs, or even their overseas facilities aren't set up with organization and cleanliness in mind?



No. I can not tell you, because if I did, I would be lying. Can you? Do you know how the everyday works of Fender/Gibson/etc.. operate? I literally have no idea what their production facilities look like, here OR overseas, but I can bet they probably aren't always like what you may see in the pictures, on the Internet... haha. Once the cameras and film crews disappear, who honestly really knows how the facilities operate on a typical day other than the actual employees. 

And that's what I am trying to make some of you understand here. You can't judge the quality of their(S7) instruments just based on the appearance of their workshop. Especially in this situation, when most of the finishing work on these guitars is done by hand... Whatever negligence you see here that leads up the overall sub-par quality of the guitar in question is pretty much based solely on the individual that applied the finish, and ultimately made the decision to use sub-par woods.



Erockomania said:


> Nobody said all the issues can be blamed on the organization. A clean line can and will enhance your workflow for the better. I know this from experience. I own two businesses and have implemented lean manufacturing successfully. It has increased quality, consistency and efficiency. It's measurable.
> 
> It's something they obviously need because they could use any help they can get. Something so minor as proper workflow, in process kanbans (staging areas) and clean workspace can DRASTICALLY increase throughput and it can also improve quality and consistency.... all of which they could benefit from.
> 
> I respectfully disagree with your comment as all these things go hand in hand.



I am not discrediting whatever you are saying, I have already made that clear. Read my post above.


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## Splinterhead (May 30, 2013)

I really don't like getting involved in shit storms like this but I've dealt with Jim and talked a bit with him and Curran. I hate to be the guy on the other side of the tracks but laying all the blame on Jim just doesn't seem right to me. I really believe that there is a witch hunt here, burning torches and all. I think if people have an issue with a guitar, or any product for that matter, instead of napalming the internet I think getting in touch via phone with the company would be a more productive route. Being rational, intelligent and thoughtful goes a long way. If I were to have a problem with my car (which cost quite a bit more than my Boden) I wouldn't go ballistic on the web putting up pics and getting all negative. I'd contact, in my case, my Toyota dealer and get the issue fixed. 

With that said could Jim have handled it better? Yeah, he could have. I think he's reached a point where he had to vent. I cannot believe for the life of me that he would _voluntarily_ and with malice ship out a sub par guitar. He knows that the shit would hit the fan, like it did, and there would be more headaches abound. I just don't think he would want the aggravation. Would you? It just doesn't seem logical.

I think there is a lot more than we are seeing that has led up to this point. I don't know the behind the scenes goings on over at S7. Its not my business. To me it seems like the whole Strandberg* deal shit the bed quite a while ago and that's a shame. I'm not justifying I'm just trying to maybe give perspective. We don't know all the details. Now should that be reflected in the output of S7, of course not but unfortunately it is coming out in the videos. 

I really feel Jim is an honest guy. There have been other companies that have managed to abscond with a lot of people's money. To me Jim doesn't seem to be the type of person to do this. I haven't seen other companies put out videos to stay in contact with all their customers and keeping them up to date. Again I'm an not condoning the vitriol but to be honest I'd rather be told straight up what's going on with my instrument and what my choices are going forward than hearing nothing for months...or even years.


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## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> No. I can not tell you, because if I did, I would be lying. Can you? Do you know how the everyday works of Fender/Gibson/etc.. operate? I literally have no idea what their production facilities look like, here OR overseas, but I can bet they probably aren't always like what you may see in the pictures, on the Internet... haha. Once the cameras and film crews disappear, who honestly really knows how the facilities operate on a typical day other than the actual employees.
> 
> And that's what I am trying to make some of you understand here. You can't judge the quality of their(S7) instruments just based on the appearance of their workshop. Especially in this situation, when most of the finishing work on these guitars is done by hand... Whatever negligence you see here that leads up the overall sub-par quality of the guitar in question is pretty much based solely on the individual that applied the finish, and ultimately made the decision to use sub-par woods.
> 
> ...



I've read your post and it is clear you don't understand what I'M saying 

Disorganization DOES matter in the final instrument. (hypothetically) Imagine having to complete a guitar and you can't find something you need or you can't find the body/neck/parts/ etc... imagine it was an hour wasted... an hour that could be spent on finishing said guitar. Imagine (the boss) is going to be pissed that he can't collect his cash on the completed guitar. Imagine the employee now cuts a corner just to make sure the spotlight wasn't on him at that moment. Some guitars will likely make it out under these circumstances or others like it and it could have been completely avoided with a clean line with great organization. This is common and very avoidable. I must concede that the FINAL inspection is up the to man at the end of the line and he is ultimately responsible for sending it out, but pressure and super thorough inspection can be reduced is you know your line is running smoothly and properly. Pressure and time management issues WILL cause things to be overlooked.

Disorganization, whether you see it or not, is a huge problem most companies try their whole lifespan to remedy. They do that because they get better throughput, better product and ...more money! 

As I said, I know this from experience... do you? 

Of course, there are always exceptions to the rule, but I'm not talking about the exceptions here.

*typed with no hostility


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## tacotiklah (May 30, 2013)

A friend sent me one of those videos and I'm actually on the fence with the issue. Yeah Jim is atrocious with customer service in regards to the fact that you NEVER make a video calling out customers and putting them down. He may feel better or "vindicated" in that moment, but to any and all potential customers that sends the message that it could easily be them and publicly shaming your customers is never the way to go.

That said, it looks like the guy is going the way of a lot of builders; when free of stress and time constraints, they can build the .... out of a guitar. But they never bother with hiring a PR person (or two) to run the phones/emails/customer service thinking that it will save them money, but in the long run it bites both them and the customers in the ass. 

I'm sorry leonardo that you went through that, and I hope that things will work out for you in the long run.

On a lighter note:
And am I the only one here that wishes there were a Gordon Ramsey-type figure that would go into these failing businesses and put foot to ass to up their QC and see them turn things around? Maybe Ola Strandberg would be up for the task?


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## 3074326 (May 30, 2013)

L1ght said:


> No. I can not tell you, because if I did, I would be lying. Can you? Do you know how the everyday works of Fender/Gibson/etc.. operate? I literally have no idea what their production facilities look like, here OR overseas, but I can bet they probably aren't always like what you may see in the pictures, on the Internet... haha. Once the cameras and film crews disappear, who honestly really knows how the facilities operate on a typical day other than the actual employees.



Based on my experiences, they pretty much are what you see in the pictures.. maybe with more sawdust.


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

3074326 said:


> Based on my experiences, they pretty much are what you see in the pictures.. maybe with more sawdust.



You guys can go through my old posts and check out the Schecter and B.C Rich custom shops if you want. I swung by both on a visit last month, the schecter one being completely unannounced. Both were impeccable.


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## AscendingMatt (May 30, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Don't worry guys, the videos are safe and sound.



for those of us who missed out.. whats up?


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## engage757 (May 30, 2013)

fc3603 said:


> Ivr told you people he's going broke in my last comment but guys won't believe. It's not that hard to figure it out



well, he did admit that he was.


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## AscendingMatt (May 30, 2013)

S7 Guitars updates PT I - YouTube

@630 WOW way unprofessional this is just redic. im speechless. Since allan and paul have left, shit just went downhill!


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## Erockomania (May 30, 2013)

AscendingMatt said:


> S7 Guitars updates PT I - YouTube
> 
> @630 WOW way unprofessional this is just redic. im speechless. Since allan and paul have left, shit just went downhill!



saw that... woah. That crap is embarrassingly unprofessional. Rips Acle (Tesseract) at the end. Sheesh.


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## AscendingMatt (May 30, 2013)

^ these vids are basically rundowns of flaws and bad stuff happening to all the guitars. AND hes being a dick. think im gonna order one soon!


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## xCaptainx (May 30, 2013)

oh man, why air specific customer laundry like that/!?! I'd be mortified and beyond pissed if a company was putting up a public video that was addressing me directly like that! 

Also essentially saying 'f*ck it then, you can't have it, btw I'm going to take as long as legally possible to give you your money back' is a HUGE f*ck you to a customer. 

Man


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## crg123 (May 31, 2013)

Well they're asking for it. I agree its ridiculously unprofessional to bitch about customers on a video tons of people are going to see. What is he accomplishing from it? No one cares about the customer only how you as a company treat your customers. People understand issues occur but he makes it seem like when it happens that the customer's "impatience" inconvenient for them! It's not the customers fault their shop has so many errors occurring.

It really seems like immature complaining. I like the idea of a chop walk through showing the guitars but a lot of the commentary really takes away from that.


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## xCaptainx (May 31, 2013)

Yeah the walkthrough is great, but all that other stuff....geez. 

See this is why I never bought into the alure of endorsement chasing with these smaller, more approachable companies. When push comes to shove, what's the REAL benefit of entry/mid level endorsements, if this is how support/warranty/replacement requests are handled?!?

Makes me so incredibly, incredibly grateful for the associations and support I have received from my companies along the way. .


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## Exit Existence (May 31, 2013)

AscendingMatt said:


> S7 Guitars updates PT I - YouTube


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## xCaptainx (May 31, 2013)

*edit* can't be bothered haha.


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## Loganator259 (May 31, 2013)

A few of the things that really put me off were one: Whether or not a customer is a "Self proclaimed expert" or not, their words goes. If the guitar is total garbage but they love it you did your job, on the contrary if the guitar is a fantastic work of art that plays like a dream but they hate it, you haven't done your job.
Another is the public display of emotions, yes you are frustrated, yes you are pissed off. Don't display it publicly! if you are trying to run a business.
And 35 emails a day? tough shit, my dad probably gets 100+ on most days (many of which need long, detailed and immediate responses)
In my short 17 years on this planet I know not to do these things.
I feel bad for the guy, but lets face it, its not fun to purchase a guitar that has issues, much less a high end US custom that has them, and no one wants to deal with the issues, I am certain that if the customers did not feel that their complaints, refunds and rebuilds were unwarranted they would have not wanted to go through the trouble.
Granted I've never ran a business, this is just my 2cents.


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## jephjacques (May 31, 2013)

Speaking as a dude who has been self-employed thanks to the internet for almost a decade I can say with confidence that whining about 35 whole emails a day is ....ing babyassed bullshit.


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## leonardo7 (May 31, 2013)

These guys keep saying that we spent 45 mins on the phone last Thursday. It doesn't really matter much to be honest, but I just thought it was interesting that he recalls it as being a 45 minute call.


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## RevDrucifer (May 31, 2013)

I've got no claim in anything S7, never even played one.

I gotta say that I feel bad for the guy. I didn't get to see the vids that were taken down, so I don't know about the content on there but from the Update vids, he seems quite sincere.

What really struck me was that as he was walking around showing the pieces was he knew a lot of the customer's names without looking at a spec sheet or anything. I'd expect him to know the endorsee's names, but regular customers, off the top of his head, shows me he cares about what he's doing on a personal level. 

I can see the guy getting stressed to hell and back and just not knowing what else to do but lay it all out there for everyone to see and hopefully gain some empathy for his situation. 

I hope in the end it works out alright for everyone involved and he pulls himself out of debt. It's a bummer when someone tries to start their own business doing something they love only to have it turn into a nightmare.


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## Loganator259 (May 31, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> These guys keep saying that we spent 45 mins on the phone last Thursday. It doesn't really matter much to be honest, but I just thought it was interesting that he recalls it as being a 45 minute call.


And the plot ....in' thickens...


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## codycarter (May 31, 2013)

I kind of like the worm hole..it gives it character in my opinion.
Regardless though, sucks you had to deal with that


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## capoeiraesp (May 31, 2013)

Liking wormholes is like being keen on a hot exotic woman who just happens to have a nice chunk of herpes growing on her lip.

Note: sorry to the guy who thought my comment was "an completely asinine comparison ". Good English you have.


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## Curt (May 31, 2013)

capoeiraesp said:


> Liking wormholes is like being keen on a hot exotic woman who just happens to have a nice chunk of herpes growing on her lip.


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## fps (May 31, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> Someone else from/near Tulsa appears!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I have a lot of sympathy for Jim, because the stress must be horrendous, and people can indeed be annoying, but around 4 minutes it sounds like he feels he's doing people a favour doing their guitars. I hope he sorts out his financial problems with his therapy job, good luck to him, and let's hope everyone's guitars get finished to the highest quality.


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## fps (May 31, 2013)

AscendingMatt said:


> S7 Guitars updates PT I - YouTube
> 
> @630 WOW way unprofessional this is just redic. im speechless. Since allan and paul have left, shit just went downhill!



While that bit at 630 was indeed jawdropping (not the most jawdropping thing so far though!) the rest of this video was reeeeally cool! And I feel I'm getting more of an idea of the guys, their shop, and how Jim really is, he's clearly crazy about guitars. Stress does bad things to a guy, but I really don't think he's a bad guy at all. Sensible to show everything in process so customers don't freak out re the company's future and where their guitars are. 

Guess we'll see after 6 months when the dust has settled whether the company's going to make it, this is some fall-out, hopefully he'll learn from this, because he's clearly produced some great work, as well as some with issues, and maybe when the money's there Jim can employ an email guy.


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## Bekanor (May 31, 2013)

I feel bad for Jim, even though he's handling this in the worst possible way.

But I did laugh pretty hard when he said (and I'm paraphrasing as I watch that video) "Look at any guitar up close and you're gunna notice defects, pull a PRS off the wall and you'll see them".

My 513 is immaculate, top to bottom, and I bought it second hand.


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## decoy205 (May 31, 2013)

He should be doing everything he can to make positives out of negatives. Do not name names and air dirty laundry publicly. Focus on what your shop does well and highlight that! All this crap does was deepen a giant hole that they can sink into!


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## JaeSwift (May 31, 2013)

ghstofperdition said:


> A friend sent me one of those videos and I'm actually on the fence with the issue. Yeah Jim is atrocious with customer service in regards to the fact that you NEVER make a video calling out customers and putting them down. He may feel better or "vindicated" in that moment, but to any and all potential customers that sends the message that it could easily be them and publicly shaming your customers is never the way to go.
> 
> That said, it looks like the guy is going the way of a lot of builders; when free of stress and time constraints, they can build the .... out of a guitar. But they never bother with hiring a PR person (or two) to run the phones/emails/customer service thinking that it will save them money, but in the long run it bites both them and the customers in the ass.
> 
> ...



Pay my ticket and my living expenses and I'de do it. 

Also, what they need isn't a P.R person; P.R is mostly there for handling the media as stakeholders; they need a full Communications Manager to take care of the Facebook, e-mail, YouTube and owned media outlets that are full of negative stuff right now. They don't need someone to just answer e-mails for them, they need someone to figure out what their values are, how they want to represent those, what their desired identity is and why their image (or perceived identity) does not match that (i.e gap analysis).

I've had interactions with Jim in the past and I really like the guy, it also makes me sad to see him in a state like this, but as someone who has a lot of passion for his profession in Communications it just makes me cringe whenever I see stuff like this.


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## RagtimeDandy (May 31, 2013)

Bekanor said:


> But I did laugh pretty hard when he said (and I'm paraphrasing as I watch that video) "Look at any guitar up close and you're gunna notice defects, pull a PRS off the wall and you'll see them".
> 
> My 513 is immaculate, top to bottom, and I bought it second hand.



You too? My PRS was 4 years old and a floor model at G.C., and there was only 1 small ding on the top coat. Not a single flaw in the wood either. My Carvin was absolutely immaculate upon arrival


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## Ketzer (May 31, 2013)

Small-time Custom guitar shop gets overburdened by orders from sevenstring.org, quality takes a nosedive. STOP THE PRESSES.


This happens enough that it should surprise no one here.


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## decoy205 (May 31, 2013)

What I'm trying to figure out is that if these were production guitars or custom guitars. You can't have it both ways. Seems like they are now called production guitars cuz they used inferior lumber flaws etc., but when they were priced and sold they were supposed to be custom shop? 

Confusing.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 31, 2013)

decoy205 said:


> What I'm trying to figure out is that if these were production guitars or custom guitars. You can't have it both ways. Seems like they are now called production guitars cuz they used inferior lumber flaws etc., but when they were priced and sold they were supposed to be custom shop?
> 
> Confusing.



Well, the plan was to build them consistently, regardless of orders being placed by end users, which would technically qualify them as production. 

Though, it's looking like the term "semi-custom" works better here. While the specs were pretty much fixed, like a production instrument, some options like the finish were left open. 

What these were considered is irrelevant, as the issues present don't belong on an instrument of this price.


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## decoy205 (May 31, 2013)

I agree I was just trying to wrap my head around it.


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## Matt_D_ (May 31, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> What these were considered is irrelevant, as the issues present don't belong on an instrument of this price.



ive been thinking about this. what's the error rates for production instruments at around the 3k mark? how many jcustoms, or prs's, or esp's do they throw out for shrinking fretboards? or wormholes in the wood? or general bad workmanship? everyone makes mistakes, but how many make it all the way to final QC inspection after finishing and assembly before being rejected? 

why does it seem that some smaller custom shops have such high error rates that require rebuilds, or post build rectification after final assembly? the cost of the "failure demand" these things incur has to be downright staggering compared to the cost of just rejecting the build at the point some of these issues are spotted. imagine the labour cost saved if the boden body in question was thrown out as soon as the hole was spotted? (or the purchaser asked if he wanted it). not to mention that the time spent getting the instrument up to shippable spec could have been spent on something that had a net positive effect on the companies cashflow. 

oh well. a shitty situation for everyone. here's hoping we get some sort of positive resolution for all parties.


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## UnderTheSign (May 31, 2013)

decoy205 said:


> What I'm trying to figure out is that if these were production guitars or custom guitars. You can't have it both ways. Seems like they are now called production guitars cuz they used inferior lumber flaws etc., but when they were priced and sold they were supposed to be custom shop?
> 
> Confusing.


A guitar being custom doesn't mean you suddenly get superior wood just like how production guitars =/= inferior wood.


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## Curt (May 31, 2013)

I have played guitars that retail for less than $150 that had tight neck pockets, and were wormhole free. Though I can't say for sure there aren't some sub $1k solid color guits that have some wood defects, I can say the number is likely so low that at nearly $3k it shouldn't even have been allowed to be sold at the very least.


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## zakattak192 (May 31, 2013)

My thoughts on the matter:


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## jacksonplayer (May 31, 2013)

Matt_D_ said:


> ive been thinking about this. what's the error rates for production instruments at around the 3k mark? how many jcustoms, or prs's, or esp's do they throw out for shrinking fretboards? or wormholes in the wood? or general bad workmanship? everyone makes mistakes, but how many make it all the way to final QC inspection after finishing and assembly before being rejected?



I don't know about those companies, but I do know that Gibson takes a band saw to plenty of high-end Les Pauls that never make it out of the shop. And that's from a company with a recent reputation for letting plenty of cosmetic flaws out the door. 

I'm sure PRS, Ibanez and ESP do the same thing. They're obviously working at a much greater volume than S7G, though.

Oh, and leonardo, it is completely unacceptable what Jim is asking you to do. If he doesn't want to build you a new body, he should have you hold onto the guitar until he can put the refund money in escrow (NOT send it to Washburn), and have the money released to you once he gets the guitar back in good condition. Under no circumstances should he be in possession of both the guitar and your money at the same time.


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## decoy205 (May 31, 2013)

UnderTheSign said:


> A guitar being custom doesn't mean you suddenly get superior wood just like how production guitars =/= inferior wood.



I wouldn't order something as classy as a Strandberg to get inferior wood at a $3k price range though.


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## Curt (May 31, 2013)

decoy205 said:


> I wouldn't order something as classy as a Strandberg to get inferior wood at a $3k price range though.


Not a single person in their right mind would.

And that is why this thread, and the blowback of this "silliness" as Jim has called it exist to begin with.


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## Xaios (May 31, 2013)

UnderTheSign said:


> A guitar being custom doesn't mean you suddenly get superior wood just like how production guitars =/= inferior wood.



It bloody well should, because the builder should be choosing optimum pieces of timber. Choosing quality wood is no different from choosing the rest of the components for a guitar. I wouldn't pay $3k for a guitar knowing that it was going to have a Chinese knockoff Floyd and No-Name pickups. What then makes low-quality wood anymore acceptable?


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## wookie606 (May 31, 2013)

Wow, I was pretty close at one point to pulling the trigger on an S7 boden.
Kinda glad I didn't now.
Then I went with Mercer...

:/


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## jacksonplayer (May 31, 2013)

Xaios said:


> It bloody well should, because the builder should be choosing optimum pieces of timber. Choosing quality wood is no different from choosing the rest of the components for a guitar. I wouldn't pay $3k for a guitar knowing that it was going to have a Chinese knockoff Floyd and No-Name pickups. What then makes low-quality wood acceptable at the same price range?



Production vs. custom is simply the difference in how the guitar is ordered from the manufacturer. It has nothing to do with the quality level. There are plenty of expensive production guitars out there that have immaculate quality. They are built just as carefully as any custom. Some might have even better quality, since a standard model can have a more "regularized" production process.

The high purchase price on ANY expensive guitar should be put towards things like buying better cuts of lumber, being pickier in choosing individual pieces of lumber from the pile, and obviously in putting in more individual time in the fit and finish process.

It's worth noting that the Bodens are far more expensive than most of the guitars S7G makes, and perhaps that was the problem. S7G isn't really geared up to compete in the ultra-expensive end of the market, where people expect flawless cosmetics (perhaps too much so).


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## Fred the Shred (May 31, 2013)

There is no inherent distinction between custom and production guitars when it comes to the quality of the materials employed. You can have MiC customs for ridiculous prices and the "custom" nature of the guitar won't magically heighten the mats to pinnacles of quality, whereas some production companies are renowned for consistency and very high grade materials.

Even in the case of companies like PRS, there are duds. I've seen and played them, and they exist. In the grand scheme of things, we are talking about a very small percentage. NO builder, be it the super-reputable builder or the mega high-tech corporation that has all the posh woods and 0.00000001% tolerances, is immune to problems in the instruments, and I insist there is a massive confusion between the real issue here, namely consistency, and plainly affirming every guitar they put out is shit, especially since most people haven't really played or seen one in the flesh.

I'm not acting like the white knight that jumps into the fray to rescue the defenceless princess, mind you - there are serious issues at stake here, that require actual clarification due to their implications, and some unexplainable QC "ooopsies". Again, I had 2 S7G's. They were great. Ola's S7G's? Great as well. Played a few Bodens, of which one had a cosmetic issue and was nicely tucked away, but since it played well they handed it to me to judge sound and feel. Compare this with the suicide guitars Keith got, and the messed up stuff that's appeared online at times - it's this lack of consistency that needs addressing (as well as customer relations, evidently), almost as much as the mighty internet hate needs a bit of chilling and perspective. No benevolence, no sob stories, no burning the witch in the town square: simple facts pertaining the current situation and the prospective resolution for the customers that were affected by this.


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## JaeSwift (May 31, 2013)

Fred the Shred said:


> There is no inherent distinction between custom and production guitars when it comes to the quality of the materials employed. You can have MiC customs for ridiculous prices and the "custom" nature of the guitar won't magically heighten the mats to pinnacles of quality, whereas some production companies are renowned for consistency and very high grade materials.
> 
> Even in the case of companies like PRS, there are duds. I've seen and played them, and they exist. In the grand scheme of things, we are talking about a very small percentage. NO builder, be it the super-reputable builder or the mega high-tech corporation that has all the posh woods and 0.00000001% tolerances, is immune to problems in the instruments, and I insist there is a massive confusion between the real issue here, namely consistency, and plainly affirming every guitar they put out is shit, especially since most people haven't really played or seen one in the flesh.
> 
> I'm not acting like the white knight that jumps into the fray to rescue the defenceless princess, mind you - there are serious issues at stake here, that require actual clarification due to their implications, and some unexplainable QC "ooopsies". Again, I had 2 S7G's. They were great. Ola's S7G's? Great as well. Played a few Bodens, of which one had a cosmetic issue and was nicely tucked away, but since it played well they handed it to me to judge sound and feel. Compare this with the suicide guitars Keith got, and the messed up stuff that's appeared online at times - it's this lack of consistency that needs addressing (as well as customer relations, evidently), almost as much as the mighty internet hate needs a bit of chilling and perspective. No benevolence, no sob stories, no burning the witch in the town square: simple facts pertaining the current situation and the prospective resolution for the customers that were affected by this.



Very much agreed, unfortunately these video rants are making things even worse for them. If they hadn't brought up their own financial problems for example, Leonardo would probably have sent them his guitar to replace the body. 

Hell, it's the best way to directly avoid getting any orders for a while; tell everyone you're bordering on bankruptcy so no one is confident enough to pay a deposit since the chances of seeing a full fledged guitar have dramatically decreased. It's ''little'' things like this that will kill them together with the QC issues, or rather, their way of blowing up those issues by adressing them in detail in the videos.


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## Blitzie (May 31, 2013)

UnderTheSign said:


> A guitar being custom doesn't mean you suddenly get superior wood





WAT


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## Randy (May 31, 2013)

JaeSwift said:


> Very much agreed, unfortunately these video rants are making things even worse for them. If they hadn't brought up their own financial problems for example, Leonardo would probably have sent them his guitar to replace the body.
> 
> Hell, it's the best way to directly avoid getting any orders for a while; tell everyone you're bordering on bankruptcy so no one is confident enough to pay a deposit since the chances of seeing a full fledged guitar have dramatically decreased. It's ''little'' things like this that will kill them together with the QC issues.



This has been my interpretation the entire time, as well. The original defect barely factor into the issue now, at this point. The videos and the vitriol, along with the name calling, calling people out by name (including the low blows to Ola) way way WAY supersede the conversation of QC issues.


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## Jzbass25 (May 31, 2013)

Protip that I've learned from being on the forums for a few years, if you're a small time builder and you're having issues getting guitars out the door, stop taking orders or slow down orders until you catch up.


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## Xaios (May 31, 2013)

Jzbass25 said:


> Protip that I've learned from being on the forums for a few years, if you're a small time builder and you're having issues getting guitars out the door, stop taking orders or slow down orders until you catch up.



As sensible as this sounds on paper, it's sometimes simply not an option if a luthier needs to raise capital because he's only taken partial deposits and not full up-front payments. Granted, that means the luthier is probably running on an unsustainable business model to begin with, but when it reaches that point, not taking in anymore orders (and the money that comes along with them) simply isn't in the cards sometimes.


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## penguin_316 (May 31, 2013)

I understand you would be upset that they didn't mention the knot and shipped it to you. What I don't understand is the incredible focus of your displeasure in a "cosmetic" flaw on the back of the instrument (if you can even call it that...the nature of wood and all).

Having said that, the "flaw" is clearly visible from the early stages of a build in that location and they should have told you or scrapped it. I"m guessing the bad customer service is more the issue than the actual knot. Right?


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## Draceius (May 31, 2013)

penguin_316 said:


> Having said that, the "flaw" is clearly visible from the early stages of a build in that location and they should have told you or scrapped it. I"m guessing the *bad customer service is more the issue* than the actual knot. Right?



Bingo, this entire situation could've easily been avoid (or at least the situation leonardo is in), with a phone call in the early stages when they noticed it, or just not using the wood at all, and of course this thread is like the butterfly effect, where the displeasure and grievance of one person has multiplied through and grown exponentially larger and become a mass of unsatisfied or annoyed people. Leonardo's situation cause more horror stories to come out so again, more annoyance with S7.


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## Erockomania (May 31, 2013)

Fred the Shred said:


> There is no inherent distinction between custom and production guitars when it comes to the quality of the materials employed. You can have MiC customs for ridiculous prices and the "custom" nature of the guitar won't magically heighten the mats to pinnacles of quality, whereas some production companies are renowned for consistency and very high grade materials.
> 
> Even in the case of companies like PRS, there are duds. I've seen and played them, and they exist. In the grand scheme of things, we are talking about a very small percentage. NO builder, be it the super-reputable builder or the mega high-tech corporation that has all the posh woods and 0.00000001% tolerances, is immune to problems in the instruments, and I insist there is a massive confusion between the real issue here, namely consistency, and plainly affirming every guitar they put out is shit, especially since most people haven't really played or seen one in the flesh.
> 
> I'm not acting like the white knight that jumps into the fray to rescue the defenceless princess, mind you - there are serious issues at stake here, that require actual clarification due to their implications, and some unexplainable QC "ooopsies". Again, I had 2 S7G's. They were great. Ola's S7G's? Great as well. Played a few Bodens, of which one had a cosmetic issue and was nicely tucked away, but since it played well they handed it to me to judge sound and feel. Compare this with the suicide guitars Keith got, and the messed up stuff that's appeared online at times - it's this lack of consistency that needs addressing (as well as customer relations, evidently), almost as much as the mighty internet hate needs a bit of chilling and perspective. No benevolence, no sob stories, no burning the witch in the town square: simple facts pertaining the current situation and the prospective resolution for the customers that were affected by this.



Fred, you must have noticed that like 30% of his tour was apologizing for mistakes/bad wood/blemishes, etc...

That only worsens the perception.

I can't imagine most builders would be apologizing thru a large part of the "in process guitar tour". S7G has issues. I'd venture to guess it's because they are in over their heads and didn't have the infrastructure, scalability and expertise in place to handle the growth.


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## Nicki (May 31, 2013)

Xaios said:


> As sensible as this sounds on paper, it's sometimes simply not an option if a luthier needs to raise capital because he's only taken partial deposits and not full up-front payments. Granted, that means the luthier is probably running on an unsustainable business model to begin with, but when it reaches that point, not taking in anymore orders (and the money that comes along with them) simply isn't in the cards sometimes.



Well his point about slowing production down is still valid. They would just need to set the customer's expectation of a longer turnaround. If they get enough orders to sustain their bottom line for say, 6 months, then they can stop taking orders for a short time to catch up on the orders they received. Once they feel they've reached a point to where they can open orders up again while maintaining the expected turnaround, they should do so. It's not a perfect business model, but it could work for a small shop like S7.

My two cents is that yes, Jim seems stressed, but his stress shouldn't be affecting the final product.


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## Vairish (May 31, 2013)

penguin_316 said:


> I"m guessing the bad customer service is more the issue than the actual knot. Right?



Pretty much.

In his latest update video he discusses how a guitar he sent to a customer in the UAE didn't seem to clear customs and was shipped back to Strictly 7. 

The first ever 7 string I bought was from Chris Guitars. It was a MIJ RG7420 which 2 months after ordering turned back up on Chris's doorstep. I don't know why it was returned back to the States, but Chris apologized for the delay and ended up re-shipping it express on his own dime. That's great customer service and I ended up buying a few more guitars from him.

In Strictly 7's case they:


Blamed the damage the guitar sustained on it's journey on the buyer for wanting a white guitar.

Refused to re-ship the guitar back to the buyer because he gets the feeling that the buyer will be impossible to please (which to me really speaks volumes about how he rates the guitars that come out of his workshop.).

Are going to refund the buyer within the next 3 months MINUS his deposit.

So in a situation where more than likely the buyer did nothing wrong, he is now out of pocket. That's disgraceful.


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## Overtone (May 31, 2013)

I didn't watch that whole part but that was a shocker when he said that since he ASSUMES the guy won't be happy he loses his deposit. I totally didn't get what the guitar color had to do with anything. But the part I missed was that that guy never even laid hands on the guitar? That is nuts!


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## Jzbass25 (May 31, 2013)

Xaios said:


> As sensible as this sounds on paper, it's sometimes simply not an option if a luthier needs to raise capital because he's only taken partial deposits and not full up-front payments. Granted, that means the luthier is probably running on an unsustainable business model to begin with, but when it reaches that point, not taking in anymore orders (and the money that comes along with them) simply isn't in the cards sometimes.



At this moment yeah they might not be able to afford it, which means they might be past the point of no return. That's why slowing it down, as in taking less orders at a time, is a viable option but it might not be helpful to this case. I won't go into great detail but basically figure out what he could viably handle before anything happens, known the break even/operating costs (fixed and variable), and shut down orders or slow them down if you overestimated yourself. If you need to work in the red then hopefully you're doing it above shutdown or you should possibly shutdown (depending on certain factors like length of time in the red and price vs min average cost or you could say revenue vs total cost). 

Also it seems like everyone is mad because they expected a certain lead time and haven't received it in that time, maybe the mistakes are to blame like the matte white finish being a problem but maybe they should have set longer lead times and just got the guitars out earlier if they were done earlier, then slowly adjusted the lead time to the actual time that it was going to take them. If they get back on their feet I highly recommend they set longer lead times and if the guitar is out faster then good, happier customers!

Preplanning is always key to success imo, but yeah it isn't so black and white in every situation so I understand where you're coming from. Businesses though need good management and good accounting or this will probably happen. (Also good lawyers are a very good idea). Edit: Oh and good customer service...


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## Larrikin666 (May 31, 2013)

So let's sum up a few of the things that look especially bad for these guys right now:

1. Jim plans on refunding 3 (or 4) builds within the next 90-120 days. 
2. He has $23,000 in wood sitting around that he can't use.
3. His paint guy is no longer doing any work until Jim catches up on payments.
4. Despite the one or two lunatics who recently put in orders, I can't imagine these guys are going to get much in the way of business in the next few months unless something miraculous happens.
5. He mentioned needing rebuilds on a few guitars that he didn't have the wood for.


.....what a terrible situation to be in.


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## jacksonplayer (May 31, 2013)

penguin_316 said:


> I understand you would be upset that they didn't mention the knot and shipped it to you. What I don't understand is the incredible focus of your displeasure in a "cosmetic" flaw on the back of the instrument (if you can even call it that...the nature of wood and all).



Knots in wood don't normally bother me that much, but this one would, since it's actually a hole in the guitar that looks like it could split over time. If it was in the middle of the guitar and wasn't open, no biggie, although I'd probably be way more bothered about that on a $3,000 guitar than I would on a Schecter.



Vairish said:


> So in a situation where more than likely the buyer did nothing wrong, he is now out of pocket. That's disgraceful.



That bothered me, too. However, it does appear that the buyer had the guitar sent to the wrong address in the UAE.

I don't think Jim should be out the entire cost of FedEx-ing it back to the UAE, if that's the case, but perhaps he could split the cost. We don't know both sides of what went on there, though, so that does veer into speculation.


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## Randy (May 31, 2013)

On anything other than a Toone, if that hole was deliberate it would've been epoxied.


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## Vairish (May 31, 2013)

jacksonplayer said:


> That bothered me, too. However, it does appear that the buyer had the guitar sent to the wrong address in the UAE.



If that is the case then I would have no issues with S7 asking the buyer to repay the shipping costs. Still no reason not to refund the deposit though.


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## UnderTheSign (May 31, 2013)

Xaios said:


> It bloody well should, because the builder should be choosing optimum pieces of timber. Choosing quality wood is no different from choosing the rest of the components for a guitar. I wouldn't pay $3k for a guitar knowing that it was going to have a Chinese knockoff Floyd and No-Name pickups. What then makes low-quality wood anymore acceptable?


And the situation with S7G here shows that isn't always the case. 
I never said "low quality" wood was acceptable and I don't think the defects shown here are acceptable either - I merely pointed out that production guitars don't mean you're getting low quality wood. 
As for choosing optimum pieces of timer, sometimes you THINK you have a good piece only to later find out it wasn't properly dried, has defects, bullets, whatever in it. And while I think they're a bunch of idiots for doing so, I can understand S7G buying what seemed like a good batch of wood but turned out to not be as good as they thought - and being in the financial troubles and all that they're in, I can imaginee them saying "oh what the hell, we'll just use this".


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## elq (May 31, 2013)

UnderTheSign said:


> ...I can imagine them saying "oh what the hell, we'll just use this".



I can imagine this too. If true, it suggests a future spiral of events that will not end well for S7.


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## leonardo7 (May 31, 2013)

I feel like a broken record to an extent and have pretty much said all that I need to say. I probably dont need to say anything more really, but I just wanted to clarify a few things to those who havent read this entire thread or to those following it, or to those asking me what bothers me more, the issue to begin with, or how it has been handled.

First off, I love how everything Jim said in the vid about me is stuff he has heard third party through Curran. Thats always fun!

The sad part is that all this "after the fact" stuff could have been avoided by not giving me the so called "fluff talk" or "spin job" for the first 15 minutes of the 20 minute phone call that I had with Curran. It was the manner in which he tried to convince me that the guitar is better the way it is as a B stock. That threw me into the territory of wanting to post the pics on here. I was already considering it given the B stock to begin with and not having the issue addressed through email. I understand that they are broke and its in their best interest to try and convince me that I should keep the guitar. I wasnt saying I shouldnt keep it, I was politely wanting to bring it to their attention that there are issues and that a new body would be appreciated. The response I received was the opposite of "Im so sorry, lets get this sorted out". 

I dont think Curran had told Jim that I had mentioned over the phone that I was going to post pics onto the internet. His response was very close to "people can call us idiots, they can say we suck, we dont care. If you want to post pics then post pics. We ignore the internet stuff and will continue to build guitars. We dont care. If you want to do it then go ahead". 

I also find it funny that apparently I told him that this was the best guitar I have ever played? Does he know that I have a Vik and KxK and used to own a Suhr and Jackson CS, or that I played an Ola built Strandberg at NAMM? I said that it played well and was awesome in playability. That was mostly referring to the endurneck and the design. Also, the fret dress is good, so it plays well. 

I like the way Jim speaks, he is very thorough and easy to understand. He's very good with speech and seems to have excellent communication skills in the videos only. The supposed truths he talks about with what goes on with wood issues is appreciated. Most luthiers are not upfront and dont put onto the table the details of their setbacks like he does. But I also feel as though he uses it as a veil to what really goes on. We assume hes telling the truth because he is refreshingly so honest and upfront about his personal setbacks. I appreciate his attempts, but the third party insults and especially going back on his word of rebuilding me a guitar, then giving me 2 business days to overnight the guitar to him for a $150 cost and a 4 month time frame to refund me is really disappointing to hear. He should have continued with the notion of a body rebuild. Granted, Im not distraught over keeping this infamous Boden given thats my only option. But my dispute has been escalated as of today, so thats good.

I have no reason to not believe that he has lied about things. 
-Upon final payment I am told it ships next week. That was a lie. 
-Not before my final payment, but conveniently and well timed just following my final payment in April I am told in a You Tube video that my top has cracked and the guitar needs to be redone. I believe it to be a lie. 
-Lets also note that according to Jim in the video, his wood isnt dry. Why did it crack then? IT DIDNT! 
-I am then sent a B stock a week later. I am told that they prefer the guitar with the knot/holes. I believe that to be a lie. 
-Jim says he never got my emails. Thats a lie. 
-Jim says he hasn't looked at his emails in a week. I believe thats a lie. 
-I was told I would get a rebuild, that was a lie. 
-I am being told that I will be refunded in 4 months if I send the guitar back. I believe that is another lie. I believe he will string me along until I give up, or he is no longer legally bound.

I don't wish him any negativity, I hate to see someone fail like he has, but the lying and third party manner in which he has conducted himself is just insane! Most of all, sending me a guitar this way to begin with is really bad. No excuse whatsoever and totally unacceptable! Dont ask me for money when you know damn well that the guitar isnt ready. Dont send me a B stock.


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## Bigfan (May 31, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> -Upon final payment I am told it ships next week. That was a lie.
> -Not before my final payment, but conveniently and well timed just following my final payment in April I am told in a You Tube video that my top has cracked and the guitar needs to be redone. I believe it to be a lie.



That's eerily close to what and how I was told. I was told 1 to 3 weeks in march when told to pay the final deposit.


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## leonardo7 (May 31, 2013)

This whole thing with video follow ups really is rather comical in nature. 



Bigfan said:


> That's eerily close to what and how I was told. I was told 1 to 3 weeks in march when told to pay the final deposit.



Did you get it yet? Are you the other guy who paid in full then had a "cracked top"?


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## jleader (May 31, 2013)

Actually, I had been paid in full since like February on mine... Well ahead of my guitar's completion. I was told it would ship "next week" on March 27. It actually shipped April 29, so I figured I was one of those guys that had been paid in full with a cracked top because of the progress videos.

By the way, I'm on board with the idea that these guitars play great. The EndurNeck is awesome, and Ola's design just flat out works for me, the execution of those ideas is somewhat lacking... I'd be remiss if I didn't say there were workmanship/quality issues that I'm not entirely pleased with on mine, too. I think one is within reason to expect a certain amount of attention to detail at this price point. Am I going to push it any further than the brief exchange I had on Facebook with them? No... And after seeing those videos, there's no reason to push the issue, because it's obvious nothing good will come of it.


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## Erockomania (May 31, 2013)

Ya, regarding not reading his emails for over a week... then how did he know the precise amount of emails in his inbox? He said I have 3500 emails... there were 3501.


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## technomancer (May 31, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> Ya, regarding not reading his emails for over a week... then how did he know the precise amount of emails in his inbox? He said I have 3500 emails... there were 3501.



In the hour long rant that he pulled he logged into his email and looked at the numbers  Not defending Jim in any way, but I did see him do that before he mentioned any numbers.


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## Bigfan (May 31, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> This whole thing with video follow ups really is rather comical in nature.
> 
> 
> 
> Did you get it yet? Are you the other guy who paid in full then had a "cracked top"?



i'm probably the other guy, yeah. Can't help but wonder if ours were the two sent to Guitar Candy... 

Ola seems to be taking care of business though. I've exchanged some emails with him and Paul and things are looking up.


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## Erockomania (May 31, 2013)

technomancer said:


> In the hour long rant that he pulled he logged into his email and looked at the numbers  Not defending Jim in any way, but I did see him do that before he mentioned any numbers.




ah! Then why did he say " I haven't logged into my email in so long I forgot the password"? 

lol


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## wespaul (May 31, 2013)

Did somebody save those videos? I watched 20 minutes of one at work and planned to watch the rest when I got home. I love meltdowns like this.


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## Adrian-XI (May 31, 2013)

I paid in full on the 24th of April with the promise of that it would ship "next week" as well. The quilted maple topped Boden 7 body in one of their update vids is the one I paid for, so I assumed that yeah, it would only take a week. Feeling pretty stupid right now...


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## ovation22 (May 31, 2013)

So, is there a school or an online course where these guys learn the "will ship next week" line? Seems to be a common line.


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## leonardo7 (May 31, 2013)

Erockomania said:


> Ya, regarding not reading his emails for over a week... then how did he know the precise amount of emails in his inbox? He said I have 3500 emails... there were 3501.





technomancer said:


> In the hour long rant that he pulled he logged into his email and looked at the numbers  Not defending Jim in any way, but I did see him do that before he mentioned any numbers.





Erockomania said:


> ah! Then why did he say " I haven't logged into my email in so long I forgot the password"?
> 
> lol



I think hes lying. I think the forgot password thing was all show. He could have everything forwarded to another email. He very well could have also clicked on "return to inbox" before he made the vid. When you do that they go back as unread emails in your inbox. There are many ways around that one. Also, how many of those emails were repeated emails from the same customers? Theres no way he got 3,500 emails from 3,500 different people 

Also, did we see the dates? Those could be emails "sent to inbox" from the past three years 



ovation22 said:


> So, is there a school or an online course where these guys learn the "will ship next week" line? Seems to be a common line.



They do it on purpose. Main reason is they are broke and need money now. Also, paypal does not allow disputes after 45 days from paying. If he takes 30+ days to ship then 30+ days of the 45 have just been wasted in his favor. File a dispute if he doesn't ship after the one week and do not send payment unless the guitar is done and in box ready to go.


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## Mayhew (May 31, 2013)

This kind of crap just breaks my heart you guys. I really feel for anyone who's been scumbagged on a custom guitar build. When you make the jump to a custom build (especially something as unique and special as Ola's design) you're hoping for everything you could dream of and not something you can just buy off the shelf. To see people that don't treat that responsibility with the respect and attention to detail it deserves is awful. 

Music and guitars are either your life or your livelihood and to completely snowjob people like that is pretty low. Ola put his trust and reputation in S7 and they basically threw it under the bus.  Screwing everyone who puts faith and money into your business is just unimagineable to me. If you are willing to take someone's hard earned money or reputation you should be willing to stand behind your work. I hope it all works out for everyone involved here and wish nothing but the best for Ola and AES.


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## Blitzie (May 31, 2013)

Condolences to anyone who got shafted with a custom build.

People like us, on these forums, guitars and music are our lives. We live and breathe gear and music. If someone who you've given 2 or 3 months salary to has said "we will have your guitar done in 12-15 weeks" and on the 15th week tells you that it's going to be another 8-10 weeks for your guitar to be done, that is absolutely gutting. Then for them to simply stop answering emails, giving updates, picking up the phone...it's just criminal. Literally.

I understand that sometimes these things are just "estimates" but taking twice the time to get something done isn't acceptable. Neither is the amount of mistakes being made despite the doubled waiting time.

If I buy a pedal from someone on here and he ships it on a Wednesday from Idaho to where I live (Connecticut), I realize I won't have it until the next week and I'm immediately impatient and bummed out. I can't imagine building a guitar to my own specs, having my very own CUSTOM guitar built for ONLY ME, and having to wait twice as long to get it OR NOT EVER GET IT AT ALL. Even thinking about it depresses me, honestly.

It's heartbreaking. If I were the OP or anyone who is expecting a guitar, a rebuild, a 2nd rebuild, a 3rd rebuild, I would have this dude it court so fast his head would spin. That goes for S7 or BRJ.

/rant


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## ramses (Jun 1, 2013)

... sigh ...


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## RagtimeDandy (Jun 1, 2013)

The part of the video that actually made me the angriest was when he was talking about the guy who wanted a .172 or something close on his bass and Jim in all his divine knowledge of guitars said nope, you get a .142~. At that point I literally wanted to reach into the video and slap him saying "YOU STUPID SON OF A BITCH, THIS IS WHY EVERYTHING IS FALLING APART!" He puts his own desires or interests over that of the people PAYING HIM to make what they presumed they will get. Instead they get "artsy wormholes" and total disregard of special requests that were agreed upon. It's like going into a restaurant, ordering a steak medium-rare, having it all agreed upon, then the chef decides nahhhh, you get well-done. He then tells a random third party to relay the message to you (Youtube), and you may not even find out about it! And THEN, to boot the chef gets angry when you send it back wondering why in the hell you got a well-done steak. How absolutely incompetent can you be in regards to customer service and satisfaction?! 

"I made an executive decision..." Go .... yourself. If I was that guy I would be angry just out of the sheer principle of it. You don't make promises to people and then decide on your own personal preference to override the preference of the paying customer.

This is why Strictly Seven will fail.


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## firegarden (Jun 1, 2013)

Oh no...I really don't know what to do now. I am one of the 2 who paid in full and looking at all that has come to pass these last few days, I am really worried. There has been no formal message stating what my choices are now, and the video which he gave us the choice to make the decision to send it to Washburn/Ola has been made private. 

I was really hoping to get the Boden 7 by June as I am moving to another country for 3 months. Can we get an official word from S7G or Ola on what the next course of action is and the new ETA after the decision has been made?  so dissappointing...


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## Erockomania (Jun 1, 2013)

RagtimeDandy said:


> The part of the video that actually made me the angriest was when he was talking about the guy who wanted a .172 or something close on his bass and Jim in all his divine knowledge of guitars said nope, you get a .142~. At that point I literally wanted to reach into the video and slap him saying "YOU STUPID SON OF A BITCH, THIS IS WHY EVERYTHING IS FALLING APART!" He puts his own desires or interests over that of the people PAYING HIM to make what they presumed they will get. Instead they get "artsy wormholes" and total disregard of special requests that were agreed upon. It's like going into a restaurant, ordering a steak medium-rare, having it all agreed upon, then the chef decides nahhhh, you get well-done. He then tells a random third party to relay the message to you (Youtube), and you may not even find out about it! And THEN, to boot the chef gets angry when you send it back wondering why in the hell you got a well-done steak. How absolutely incompetent can you be in regards to customer service and satisfaction?!
> 
> "I made an executive decision..." Go .... yourself. If I was that guy I would be angry just out of the sheer principle of it. You don't make promises to people and then decide on your own personal preference to override the preference of the paying customer.
> 
> This is why Strictly Seven will fail.



Pretty sure it's because he didn't have a 172 on hand and didn't feel like ordering it, so in all his narcissistic glory, he thought he could just say "I know what's best for you" and get away with it.


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## leonardo7 (Jun 1, 2013)

I need to stop. I think the point has been made 



firegarden said:


> Oh no...I really don't know what to do now. I am one of the 2 who paid in full and looking at all that has come to pass these last few days, I am really worried. There has been no formal message stating what my choices are now, and the video which he gave us the choice to make the decision to send it to Washburn/Ola has been made private.
> 
> I was really hoping to get the Boden 7 by June as I am moving to another country for 3 months. Can we get an official word from S7G or Ola on what the next course of action is and the new ETA after the decision has been made?  so dissappointing...



OK, so there were officially more than 2 people who paid in full when he made the video and lied about there only being two who paid in full? Looks like he didn't want to come clean about how many have actually paid in full. I think theres 3 or 4 of us just today who have admitted to have paid in full.

Nothing is going to Washburn from what I understand. What I do understand is that if you decide to drop off then he says that he will send over your money to Washburn in 120 days. At that point they can start on your build and you can wait another 4 months for it to be made. Not to mention that the Washburn Boden 7 is slightly more expensive so you will have to pay the bit of difference. Pure speculation tells me that he wouldn't mind that people take that option, cause then he can put up your guitar for sale and sell it as in stock next week, use the money for himself, then take the 120 days to send your money to Washburn, which could very well end up not happening.


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## ola_strandberg (Jun 1, 2013)

firegarden said:


> Oh no...I really don't know what to do now. I am one of the 2 who paid in full and looking at all that has come to pass these last few days, I am really worried. There has been no formal message stating what my choices are now, and the video which he gave us the choice to make the decision to send it to Washburn/Ola has been made private.
> 
> I was really hoping to get the Boden 7 by June as I am moving to another country for 3 months. Can we get an official word from S7G or Ola on what the next course of action is and the new ETA after the decision has been made?  so dissappointing...



I will message you privately.


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## Erockomania (Jun 1, 2013)

This whole situation is so sad. I feel the worst for Ola Strandberg.


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## fps (Jun 1, 2013)

Mayhew said:


> Music and guitars are either your life or your livelihood and to completely snowjob people like that is pretty low. Ola put his trust and reputation in S7 and they basically threw it under the bus.



We really don't know enough about this situation to make such generalisations.


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## SamSam (Jun 1, 2013)

I'm so ....ing glad I didn't change my order


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## SDMFVan (Jun 1, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> I need to stop. I think the point has been made
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Jim said on Facebook on Thursday that he had two Boden 7's available for purchase right now...


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## Bigfan (Jun 1, 2013)

SDMFVan said:


> Jim said on Facebook on Thursday that he had two Boden 7's available for purchase right now...



No words.


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## Syriel (Jun 1, 2013)

I can't believe I just read this whole thread through. I'm glad I didn't decide to go with the S7 Boden. I'm sorry for you guys that have to go through all this. :/

@Leonardo7 : Check your inbox dude. "Might" cheer you up a bit.


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## leonardo7 (Jun 1, 2013)

Syriel said:


> I can't believe I just read this whole thread through. I'm glad I didn't decide to go with the S7 Boden. I'm sorry for you guys that have to go through all this. :/
> 
> @Leonardo7 : Check your inbox dude. "Might" cheer you up a bit.



Theres nothing in my inbox


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## oneblackened (Jun 1, 2013)

After reading most of this thread, I just want to say this:

Ola, you run a company like it should be run. You're doing it right.


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## jacksonplayer (Jun 1, 2013)

Leonardo7, look on the bright side. You now have easily the most famous guitar ever made by S7G. It's almost a celebrity in its own right.


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## Syriel (Jun 1, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> Theres nothing in my inbox



Wut. Lemme just resend it.

edit: now?


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## Mayhew (Jun 1, 2013)

fps said:


> We really don't know enough about this situation to make such generalisations.



There are people like this in every type of trade you can imagine. There are the types who go above and beyond all expectations and aren't happy until you get perfection. They treat what they do with their hands like art and want flawless form and function because they wouldn't settle for less and are an open book for the whole process. I have many family members in the trades and they are all perfectionists. Everything should look and function the way it was meant to and if it doesn't, you keep re doing it until you'd be happy to have your name associated with it. That's reputable.

Then there are those who will easily settle for less and have no problem justifying a half assed job because they don't have the altruistic passion and work ethic to demand the best of themselves. It's laziness and a ready willingness to cut corners and move on to the next job. They will lie to you and glaze over or downright cover up any mistakes or flaws in their work. They don't stand behind their work and unwavering quality is not their end goal. Their goal is to squeek by enough to get people's money and move on to the next job. It is simply conning your way through business. That's not reputable.


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## studmiester7 (Jun 2, 2013)

L1ght said:


> No words can describe how absolutely ridiculous, disgusting, pitiful, and absolutely saddening this picture right here is. Oh well.. I guess there are a few words...
> 
> I can NOT for the life of me understand how or why this GIANT knot would be acceptable on ANY guitar, custom or not. This is, just god awful work right here. PICK A DIFFERENT BOTTOM PIECE YOU ASSHOLES, NO ONE WOULD WANT THIS SHIT. SORRY, THIS DOES NOT ADD CHARACTER.



Hahahahaha!!!! A-F***ING-MEN! LMAO


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## fps (Jun 2, 2013)

Mayhew said:


> There are people like this in every type of trade you can imagine. There are the types who go above and beyond all expectations and aren't happy until you get perfection. They treat what they do with their hands like art and want flawless form and function because they wouldn't settle for less and are an open book for the whole process. I have many family members in the trades and they are all perfectionists. Everything should look and function the way it was meant to and if it doesn't, you keep re doing it until you'd be happy to have your name associated with it. That's reputable.
> 
> Then there are those who will easily settle for less and have no problem justifying a half assed job because they don't have the altruistic passion and work ethic to demand the best of themselves. It's laziness and a ready willingness to cut corners and move on to the next job. They will lie to you and glaze over or downright cover up any mistakes or flaws in their work. They don't stand behind their work and unwavering quality is not their end goal. Their goal is to squeek by enough to get people's money and move on to the next job. It is simply conning your way through business. That's not reputable.



There are also the issues of experience and of ability. Even a couple of the first Daemoness Guitars on other forums were shown to have flaws and the quality gets better over time the more you do and the more you learn. 

I'm not defending some of Jim's words and actions here, just saying let's keep it down to the things we definitely know. He seems very passionate about guitars, he's given himself too much work, he's making mistakes due to stress, mistakes in customer service and mistakes on some of the guitars. Give him a clear schedule to make a guitar for someone in good time he'd probably do a great job. I don't think any of this is down to laziness. It's down to owning a company in severe financial trouble with too many jobs on and not enough money to junk in-process builds.

Sorry it's just not my nature to think the worst of people. I hope everything works out for the customers as they are the most important part of all this.


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## JPMike (Jun 2, 2013)

So should I get one?? Someone is offering me one, but not sure what should I do... It has some flaws, small ones but don't really seem to matter to me. 

And I didn't read the whole thread. lol.


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## fps (Jun 2, 2013)

The whole thing has an air of unreality, perhaps because I look at Jim and see Paul Giamatti playing him in a film.


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## Daf57 (Jun 2, 2013)

^ Ha ha - I thought about that, too!


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 2, 2013)

JPMike said:


> So should I get one?? Someone is offering me one, but not sure what should I do... It has some flaws, small ones but don't really seem to matter to me.
> 
> And I didn't read the whole thread. lol.



Mike, for the love of Dio, walk away on this one. You've been bent over the barrel by BRJ already, to fall for S7 too.


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## JPMike (Jun 2, 2013)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Mike, for the love of Dio, walk away on this one. You've been bent over the barrel by BRJ already, to fall for S7 too.



Haha, ok I won't!! Just wanted to try one out! Btw, I would get one used.


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## Matt_D_ (Jun 2, 2013)

JPMike said:


> Haha, ok I won't!! Just wanted to try one out! Btw, I would get one used.



order a new one from washburn you crazy guy you


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## JPMike (Jun 2, 2013)

Matt_D_ said:


> order a new one from washburn you crazy guy you



I might do so!!  haha!!


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## ElRay (Jun 2, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> Also, paypal does not allow disputes after 45 days from paying. If he takes 30+ days to ship then 30+ days of the 45 have just been wasted in his favor. *File a dispute if he doesn't ship after the one week and do not send payment unless the guitar is done and in box ready to go.*



QFT

Ray


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## Mayhew (Jun 2, 2013)

fps said:


> There are also the issues of experience and of ability. Even a couple of the first Daemoness Guitars on other forums were shown to have flaws and the quality gets better over time the more you do and the more you learn.
> 
> I'm not defending some of Jim's words and actions here, just saying let's keep it down to the things we definitely know. He seems very passionate about guitars, he's given himself too much work, he's making mistakes due to stress, mistakes in customer service and mistakes on some of the guitars. Give him a clear schedule to make a guitar for someone in good time he'd probably do a great job. I don't think any of this is down to laziness. It's down to owning a company in severe financial trouble with too many jobs on and not enough money to junk in-process builds.
> 
> Sorry it's just not my nature to think the worst of people. I hope everything works out for the customers as they are the most important part of all this.



Things we do know: Endorsee's left due to repeat quality concerns. Ola took his business somewhere else. S7 has blatantly lied to it's customers to cover up flaws in it's products and refused to take ownership of the situation. "No that's not a knot it's a speed-hole, it makes the guitar go faster and I prefer it like that so it's not a flaw OKAY. Noobs". They only take action when forced publicly. Fail badly at their version of "making things right" and think it's okay to disrespect customers concerns in a "youtube rebuttal" because they've already paid in full. It's always someone else's fault and excuses are acceptable answers to questions.

No amount of stress would allow these mistakes to be acceptable or understandable. It sure as hell isn't carte blanche to lie. If they were honest about the situation they were in people would be a lot more understanding. If the guitar won't be ready for more than a month than don't say it'll ship next week when you know it's BS. My buddies and I went to a new pub and ordered two burger platters and a poutine. After over an hour we asked the waitress where our food was as we could see every customer who came after us had been served already. She went over to the kitchen and we could tell by the look on her face that they forgot our food but she walks up and says they're just plating it now. Twenty minutes later we get two dried up burnt burgers which they tried cooking at double time. We were honest and told the waitress you lied to us, the food was terrible, no tip for you and we won't come back. We would've preferred the truth and they had the chance to step up and try and make it right but thought covering it up was a better route. Sh!t is going to happen so it's all in how you deal with it.


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## Jeppery (Jun 3, 2013)

Mayhew said:


> Things we do know: Endorsee's left due to repeat quality concerns. Ola took his business somewhere else. S7 has blatantly lied to it's customers to cover up flaws in it's products and refused to take ownership of the situation. "No that's not a knot it's a speed-hole, it makes the guitar go faster and I prefer it like that so it's not a flaw OKAY. Noobs". They only take action when forced publicly. Fail badly at their version of "making things right" and think it's okay to disrespect customers concerns in a "youtube rebuttal" because they've already paid in full. It's always someone else's fault and excuses are acceptable answers to questions.
> 
> No amount of stress would allow these mistakes to be acceptable or understandable. It sure as hell isn't carte blanche to lie. If they were honest about the situation they were in people would be a lot more understanding. If the guitar won't be ready for more than a month than don't say it'll ship next week when you know it's BS. My buddies and I went to a new pub and ordered two burger platters and a poutine. After over an hour we asked the waitress where our food was as we could see every customer who came after us had been served already. She went over to the kitchen and we could tell by the look on her face that they forgot our food but she walks up and says they're just plating it now. Twenty minutes later we get two dried up burnt burgers which they tried cooking at double time. We were honest and told the waitress you lied to us, the food was terrible, no tip for you and we won't come back. We would've preferred the truth and they had the chance to step up and try and make it right but thought covering it up was a better route. Sh!t is going to happen so it's all in how you deal with it.



Talking about lies, you speak of Ola leaving S7G because of quality concerns, that's not and has never been the case for Ola leaving S7G.
He's stated publicly and in private conversations I've had with him that he's very proud of the Solar model and that his prototype Solar is his favourite guitar. I don't know where you came up with this kind of nonsense but it certainly isn't facts .

I won't defend Jim's behaviour in the video, nor the knot in the guitar but every company has flaws (For example my 2 Mayones guitars that both had sharp frets after 1 swedish winter) and it's just a matter of who gets it, either someone who's gonna bitch about it on forums or someone who will just deal with it privately.

S7G Makes good guitars in it's entirety but it's a young company with little experience, therefore they make mistakes, builds become more costly because they have to fix these mistakes.

However, I'm not going to rant about this anymore.

TL;DR: Everyone makes mistakes, including more reputable builders.
S7G makes good guitars in its entirety, Jim behaved badly in their youtube vids.


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## walrusaur (Jun 3, 2013)

I'm currently one of the outstanding customers who have also paid in full for a Boden 7...not 100% sure what's going to happen now. What's certain is looks like no guitar for me for awhile. However, Paul and Ola have been in contact with me so huge props to them. Still wishing all the best for Jim and his company as well.


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## Majkel (Jun 3, 2013)

Jeppery said:


> Talking about lies, you speak of Ola leaving S7G because of quality concerns, that's not and has never been the case for Ola leaving S7G.



I think he meant Ola Strandberg, buddy.


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## ara_ (Jun 3, 2013)

Bigfan said:


> i'm probably the other guy, yeah. Can't help but wonder if ours were the two sent to Guitar Candy...
> 
> Ola seems to be taking care of business though. I've exchanged some emails with him and Paul and things are looking up.



No, the first two Boden 7s that arrived at Guitar Candy were sold to me and baryton

Edit:
My NGD: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/233285-ngd-boden-7-a.html
baryton's NGD: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/234002-ngd-strandberg-boden7.html

My opinion on the situation: I feel bad for Strictly 7, but really made their situation worse with that whole thing.

I'm happy with my guitar though. I assume that my next Washberg Boden (or maybe a true strandberg!) will be even better, but my S7Boden feels great right now.
My condolescences to the guys that are having problems with S7, I really hope you'll get everything resolved soon.


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## eaeolian (Jun 3, 2013)

Since a couple of my fellow mods are weighing in on this thread, I'll leave it open.

That said, some of you really need to think before you type, and now that I have to watch this shit storm, *I* won't be as lenient. Got it?


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## Xaios (Jun 3, 2013)

Jeppery said:


> Talking about lies, you speak of Ola leaving S7G because of quality concerns, that's not and has never been the case for Ola leaving S7G.



A) As has already been said, he's probably referring to Ola Strandberg, not Ola Englund.

B) Over the past several years, this forum has seen _several_ players with endorsement deals gush over the products of their endorsed companies, only for us to find out that they had issues with the products that they only talked about after said endorsements were no longer in place. Eaeolian is probably the only endorsed player here who's opinion I would trust at first glance at this point, having been publicly critical of some of Jackson's products even while being endorsed by them.


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## Mayhew (Jun 3, 2013)

I did mean that Ola Stranberg took his design to Washburn. 

S7 doesn't have to go down like this. Pull a Papa John's campaign of acknowledging the faults and complaints truthfully and show everyone that you can and will do better. People love seeing someone turn it around because everyone can respect that. It shows strength in character. Nobody builds guitars with bad intentions and there's enough people with S7's and Bodens who are either really happy with them or really like the playability but need a little more attention to detail. That shows they can do it, they just need to do better.

I'm a glass half full kind of guy but facing my own mortality on five occasions also made me realize life is too short to pussyfoot around too. Honesty is everything.


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## Gilbertsgotbrootz (Jun 3, 2013)

Damn I wanted to see those videos I need a good laugh haha . They are private now


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## jsl2h90 (Jun 4, 2013)

Would anyone mind enlightening me on what he said about marines? I am one and i totally almost ordered one of these, that's why I ask haha. Regardless of whatever Jim said, wtf does the military have to do with their build quality? Wish I coulda caught these vids before they went private


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## ExtendedRange (Jun 4, 2013)

Wahwahwah


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## Insinfier (Jun 4, 2013)

jsl2h90 said:


> Would anyone mind enlightening me on what he said about marines? I am one and i totally almost ordered one of these, that's why I ask haha. Regardless of whatever Jim said, wtf does the military have to do with their build quality? Wish I coulda caught these vids before they went private



He said something about being away during Memorial Day and explained the absence because everyone in his family was in the Marines or Army.

Or something like that.


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## Daxten (Jun 4, 2013)

Jim said in his video that he told Ola he doesn't want to build the guitars anymore (in March). He didnt get any new orders for them since decembre because Paul redirected all orders to washburn (even though they still had the contract with Paul and never told him that they want to cancel it)

Not my opinion, not what I said, just what Jim said in the video since there are a lot of guys here throwing around facts even though they don't have sources for them


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## technomancer (Jun 4, 2013)

Which video? I don't remember hearing that in either of the initial videos that were later pulled, so if it was in one of those I'd like a time reference, or alternately a link to the video it is in.


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## geofreesun (Jun 4, 2013)

I heard what Daxten said. It's the hour-long video, Jim talking and talking and talking, about strandberg/boden issues.


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## Jonathan20022 (Jun 4, 2013)

Yeah he mentioned wanting out on Strandberg around March in that hour long video, no way of confirming that of course but he showed his contract.


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## leonardo7 (Jun 4, 2013)

Im not buying it. I believe Ola dropped him first. If Jim could he would still be taking deposits for Bodens. Better believe that!


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## Sicarius (Jun 4, 2013)

It was mentioned around the same time he was talking about the hardware, I think. 

He hadn't received any new Boden orders since Dec. 

He was saying that he'd ordered a ton of wood to maintain the contract to keep raw materials in stock for any order that came in, but no new ones had come in since Dec.

To be honest, I don't see why Ola S. went with S7G to begin with. They're a young company still getting their feet on the ground, I understand wanting to help them out a little, but shouldn't he have known better than to give such an important and expensive product to them? It makes sense that they'd be looking for a bigger, better equipped company to handle the orders after a certain point, but why not tell them that upfront, or just wait until the better company was already lined up? 

I believe what Jim was saying in the video (the long one was the only one I saw), his expressions, his demeanor, while not 100% customer service, that's a man in a situation he's tired of, and has gotten to the point where it's no longer worth it to him to keep a smile on and bite his tongue about anymore.

If I had the money I'd probably get one of the used S7Gs that pop up on the Used GC site every now and then.


This is just my .02$ on it.


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## technomancer (Jun 4, 2013)

Man the spin is awesome


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## Gilbertsgotbrootz (Jun 4, 2013)

I really wanna see those videos . I never liked jim the 2 times I had to talk to him on the phone . Paul and Allan on the otherhand were awesome to deal with helping with everything they could .


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## RagtimeDandy (Jun 4, 2013)

Anyone happen to get Jims hour rant before it was removed? That needs to be posted since half of us missed it lol


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## BlackStar7 (Jun 5, 2013)

It seems strange to me he's claiming they haven't gotten any Boden orders since December - what are these weird nonstandard ones they've been recently showing on their FB page from then? They posted these pictures the day before this thread started (May 23), claiming they were "Only doing some very limited one off stuff, maybe about 25 or 30 custom pieces, and that will be it":













Are these orders from last year? I just find it odd- I can't remember there being any word that they were doing a run of something like these.


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## leonardo7 (Jun 5, 2013)

They probably have had the OK to fix up old B stocks and sell em as they wish. Those are probably ones with worm holes that never had the walnut tops glued on or were removed. Or maybe they just started building them recently, figuring its a sure sell since they need money bad, but say they are older B stocks.


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## straightshreddd (Jun 5, 2013)

I really want to see these videos some of you are talking about. Youtube searches have lead me to nothing.


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## Captain Butterscotch (Jun 5, 2013)

straightshreddd said:


> I really want to see these videos some of you are talking about. Youtube searches have lead me to nothing.



Shortly after the videos were posted they got switched to private.


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## 7stg (Jun 5, 2013)

Here are some videos I watched. The longer S7 Guitars updates videos are informative.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Curranproducer/videos

Seems like good guys under some stress and pressure, small company trying to manage everything, and I think they are trying. They are working long hours. Money is tight at the moment. It sounds like they want to genuinely put out a quality product.


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## straightshreddd (Jun 5, 2013)

Just watched some. Man. As I've said before, I feel that Jim is a nice guy and watching him really try to keep his chin up in the vids makes me really sympathize for him and his team. Shit must be intense over at the S7 camp since the shitstorms.


EDIT: After fully watching the vids. His team looks like a bunch of f*ck offs. Jim's, like, sweaty and worried while these guys are nonchalant and chillin'.

Interesting.

EDIT 2: I'm high and don't wanna seem like an asshole, but a few of the guys in the vids seemed a little "whatever-the-f*cky".


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## DISTORT6 (Jun 6, 2013)

straightshreddd said:


> EDIT 2: I'm high and don't wanna seem like an asshole, but a few of the guys in the vids seemed a little "whatever-the-f*cky".



DRTY JRZY! 
Thanks for the laugh, bro!


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## Rev2010 (Jun 6, 2013)

straightshreddd said:


> EDIT: After fully watching the vids. His team looks like a bunch of f*ck offs. Jim's, like, sweaty and worried while these guys are nonchalant and chillin'.



Dude, you should've seen the first vid that is now private. In that one he goes off on his unhappy customers with all sorts of insults. _That_ was the bad one.


Rev.


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## jacksonplayer (Jun 6, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> They probably have had the OK to fix up old B stocks and sell em as they wish. Those are probably ones with worm holes that never had the walnut tops glued on or were removed. Or maybe they just started building them recently, figuring its a sure sell since they need money bad, but say they are older B stocks.



Jim basically said that in one of the videos. I'm not sure they're all B stocks, but either returns or guitars that were being made as production stock. It'll be interesting to see if he still tries to get three grand for them, given what's happened recently.


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## leonardo7 (Jun 6, 2013)

The two videos that are pure comedy are the ones that are now private. The first one is the hour long rant. Here is some of the second one.
Jim and S7G VS Strandberg Trolls:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7t7eoz494h481sy/Jim and S7 VS. Strandberg trolls.mp4


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## underthecurve (Jun 6, 2013)

If these are indeed B stocks, I wonder if S7 is marking them as such? Companies usually put a little b stock stamp or 2nd stamp on them. This seems important because in the future when someone is evaluating the guitar, if they were to find a manufacturing defect, it wouldn't reflect poorly on the name as a whole.


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## AscendingMatt (Jun 6, 2013)

^ those bodens look terrible IMO. Thanks for that 14 min vid, wow jim is just making himself look so bad. i kinda feel sympathetic is that weird?


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## SimonEriksson (Jun 6, 2013)

I only knew about S7 because of Ola Englund, despite that I live rather close to the great Ola Strandberg. 

I feel sorry for Jim, I truly do, I get that some of the guitars they've made haven't been perfect but the guy seems like a good guy and I can understand his frustration.

That being said, the saying "don't bite off more than you can chew" seems appropriate here. They (s7) could obviously not handle the task given to them. 

I hope that the new Washburn Strandberg guitars will be great and I hope Jim and S7 get back on their feet and that their future guitars will be great.


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## straightshreddd (Jun 6, 2013)

Rev2010 said:


> Dude, you should've seen the first vid that is now private. In that one he goes off on his unhappy customers with all sorts of insults. _That_ was the bad one.
> 
> 
> Rev.



True. Maybe that's why they're private now. I wish there was a way to see them. This whole thing is like an interactive, dramatic novel with videos and shit. I'm sincerely interested.




DISTORT6 said:


> DRTY JRZY!
> Thanks for the laugh, bro!




haha No prob, bud 


EDIT 2: Nevermind


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## 7stg (Jun 6, 2013)

leonardo7 said:


> The two videos that are pure comedy are the ones that are now private. The first one is the hour long rant. Here is some of the second one.
> Jim and S7G VS Strandberg Trolls:
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/7t7eoz494h481sy/Jim and S7 VS. Strandberg trolls.mp4



Definitely a rant, but if people were complaining about the issues raised in this video they were wrong, not Jim. The finish is done right, If the customer wanted a gloss finish that is what they should have requested. The bridges are installed by the book and function as designed.


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## Insinfier (Jun 6, 2013)

7stg said:


> Definitely a rant, but if people were complaining about the issues raised in this video they were wrong, not Jim. The finish is done right, If the customer wanted a gloss finish that is what they should have requested. The bridges are installed by the book and function as designed.



That's actually the better video. I watched it first and I was on his side.

Then I saw the second video with him calling out customers by name.

Then I watched another video with him telling the world about his financial problems.

Messy.


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## 7stg (Jun 6, 2013)

Insinfier said:


> Messy.



 Definitely where he goes wrong.


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## Seikilos (Jun 20, 2013)

BlackStar7 said:


> It seems strange to me he's claiming they haven't gotten any Boden orders since December - what are these weird nonstandard ones they've been recently showing on their FB page from then? They posted these pictures the day before this thread started (May 23), claiming they were "Only doing some very limited one off stuff, maybe about 25 or 30 custom pieces, and that will be it":
> 
> 
> 
> ...



that's chris letchford's signature model being held by travis levrier. I saw both of those guys shred it up at the highline bar in seattle on the 5th, with mouth of the architect and intronaut. awesome show! Unfortunately for chris, during the dark horse song his tone knob went out and he literally dropped the guitar on the stage and took out his pink quilt jackson usa and continued the set. It being the second day of the tour, and maybe a little more than a month since the release of the signature guitar, I find the quality of these instruments questionable. The design is supposed to be ergonomic, yet there was chris, having to bust open his electronics cavity and replace a tone pot at the very start of a tour. not convenient or ergonomic at all, if you ask me! Ola needs to make sure these instruments meet the needs of the users.


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## wannabguitarist (Jun 20, 2013)

^That's not Travis from Scale the Summit


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## ola_strandberg (Jun 20, 2013)

Seikilos said:


> that's chris letchford's signature model being held by travis levrier. I saw both of those guys shred it up at the highline bar in seattle on the 5th, with mouth of the architect and intronaut. awesome show! Unfortunately for chris, during the dark horse song his tone knob went out and he literally dropped the guitar on the stage and took out his pink quilt jackson usa and continued the set. It being the second day of the tour, and maybe a little more than a month since the release of the signature guitar, I find the quality of these instruments questionable. The design is supposed to be ergonomic, yet there was chris, having to bust open his electronics cavity and replace a tone pot at the very start of a tour. not convenient or ergonomic at all, if you ask me! Ola needs to make sure these instruments meet the needs of the users.



And it^ is not Chris' signature model. 

During the gig, Chris had to change his battery. His prototype has the battery in the control cavity, but the production model has an easy access battery compartment.


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## Seikilos (Jun 20, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> And it^ is not Chris' signature model.
> 
> During the gig, Chris had to change his battery. His prototype has the battery in the control cavity, but the production model has an easy access battery compartment.



i apologize ola. it sure does look like the guitar and person i mentioned, but being someone completely different i'm face palming myself right now, dude!


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## ramses (Jun 21, 2013)

Seikilos said:


> i apologize ola. it sure does look like the guitar and person i mentioned, but being someone completely different i'm face palming myself right now, dude!



There's your battery easy access:


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## ChrisLetchford (Jun 21, 2013)

ola_strandberg said:


> And it^ is not Chris' signature model.
> 
> During the gig, Chris had to change his battery. His prototype has the battery in the control cavity, but the production model has an easy access battery compartment.




Correct was a total noob and played on the same battery since I got the guitar in Jan. Kept telling myself to change it, but kept for forgetting. Thats why I bring a back up though! 

And yes, not Travis in the pic, and not my sig. Any of mine that were ordered or being ordered are going to be made at Washburn. 

Didn't get a chance to check out the content of the thread, hopefully whatever it is was resolved. Obvious production move was for the best Im guessing.


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## Xaios (Jun 21, 2013)

ramses said:


> There's your battery easy access:



Dat back.


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## BlazinmanFly (Jul 1, 2013)

That's unacceptable I would pissed if that was me


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## Timothy Brookbanks (Nov 19, 2013)

Sorry to hear about your experience. It is a crock of shit to pay $3000 for a b stock custom guitar.

This is my experience. 

I ordered a neck-thru 8 string explorer (such a bad ass idea), quoted around $3000 which I paid the 40% deposit. Build times were said to be between 4-6 months.

I spent 18 months in Canada for the reason of investing in professional grade gear, the guitar being the most important part. After 14 months of bad communication (being communicated to in video's - what a crock of shit) I receive a message saying that the neck on the guitar is broken. Three months after that and I am still waiting to be reimbursed. I also need to get reimbursed for a bus ticket I bought to pick up the guitar (travel more than 24 hours out of my way to accommodate Jim).
 
I am 25 years old, I don't have a lot of cash, my family needs that money. Now Jim isn't responding and all I receive are messages such as "You're not the only one waiting for money."

So frustrated and broke. 

Buy Ibanez.


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## fps (Nov 19, 2013)

Timothy Brookbanks said:


> Sorry to hear about your experience. It is a crock of shit to pay $3000 for a b stock custom guitar.
> 
> This is my experience.
> 
> ...



That's so bad I really feel for you, no-one should have to go through an experience like that, that is terrible.


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## capoeiraesp (Nov 19, 2013)

That's appalling. Did he seriously say '"you're not the only one waiting for money"?


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## Samark (Nov 19, 2013)

Timothy Brookbanks said:


> Sorry to hear about your experience. It is a crock of shit to pay $3000 for a b stock custom guitar.
> 
> This is my experience.
> 
> ...



That is shocking, worst customer service I have ever seen.


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## prestige_worldwide (Mar 24, 2014)

that is horrible what S7 did to you. Worm holes are unacceptable. On the full body shot of the Boden, the picks don't seem to be symmetrical. The neck pup looks like it on more of an angle. 

I hope everything works out for you bud


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