# Locking Schecter tuners on a C-7 Hellraiser, worth the wait?



## thinktank (Feb 21, 2009)

I am thinking about pulling the trigger on a nice c-7 hellraiser, with the 707-TWs but just noticed that the new 09 models have schecter locking tuners. 

I have locking tuners on both my ESP's (EC-1000 and Viper-1000) and it is so easy to change strings but holding tune was not especially great, very good but not great. 

I actually have a older c-7 hellraiser with the grovers and the thing stays in tune like you cant believe. 

So should I pull the trigger on the hellraiser with the grovers but with the 707-TWs (for $850) or wait for the 09? Does anyone know if the 09s are going up in price?

Thanks fellow 7-stringers!


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## I_infect (Feb 21, 2009)

I think they're great on the C-8, but worth the wait? Nahh... I'm very used to grovers and would almost rather them. The locking tuners do what they're supposed to do, so I can't complain, but I'd go either way.


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## BlindingLight7 (Feb 21, 2009)

i thought locking tuners where supposed to keep you gitty in tune...they just lock in the string? =\


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## PirateMetalTroy (Feb 21, 2009)

Get both!


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## yevetz (Feb 21, 2009)

I am don't belive in korean hardware


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## gunshow86de (Feb 21, 2009)

BlindingLight7 said:


> i thought locking tuners where supposed to keep you gitty in tune...they just lock in the string? =\



They help it stay in tune because they lock the string. Because the string can't slip like on regular tuners where the string is wrapped around the post, you will have constant tension. Which means the string won't come out of tune, at least for that reason.

If your locking tuners weren't holding the guitar in tune, you were stringing them wrong. With locking tuners, you want to have as little string-wrap as possible. The string should basically make slightly more than a right angle at the tuning post. If you wrap the string all the way around the post even once, you have defeated the purpose of the locking tuner.



I say, get the older one and buy some quality locking tuners. A set of Schaller lockers would be about $70 plus tax, and would be way better quality than the Schecter brand ones.


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## Elysian (Feb 21, 2009)

thinktank said:


> I am thinking about pulling the trigger on a nice c-7 hellraiser, with the 707-TWs but just noticed that the new 09 models have schecter locking tuners.
> 
> I have locking tuners on both my ESP's (EC-1000 and Viper-1000) and it is so easy to change strings but holding tune was not especially great, very good but not great.
> 
> ...



if your ESP's have a stock plastic nut, thats more of the cause of tuning instability than the tuners.


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## heffergm (Feb 21, 2009)

If you're really anal about how you wind your strings around normal tuning keys, they really won't slip, so for me it's a non-issue.

That said, I dig lockers because it makes restringing that much quicker/easier.


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## technomancer (Feb 21, 2009)

It's not a big deal to replace the stock Grovers with Schaller mini locking tuners, it's a direct swap so why wait 

Also holy crap Hellraisers are up to $850? That's insane.


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## 70Seven (Feb 21, 2009)

I would get the one with Grovers, I trust Grovers more when it comes to tuners, locking or not.


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## I_infect (Feb 21, 2009)

technomancer said:


> Also holy crap Hellraisers are up to $850? That's insane.



Yeah, the 7FR's are at $999 now, as much as the Loomis.


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## thinktank (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks for all of the info guys, really helpful. To answer one of the posts my ESPs each have Earvana compensated nuts and I tune them down a lot; they still hold tune much better than most of my other guitars. 

The grovers on my current C-7 are awesome but I love changing strings on lockers, so fast and easy. 

I just cannot imagine that the new models with the locking tuners would be cheaper than $850 even though they are going from a name brand like Grover to Schecter's house model lockers.

Whichever model I choose (most likely grover equipped model) I am really looking forward to the EMG 707-TWs. I can't wait to hear what that 7 string beast will sound like with some single coil distorted bridge action! I have an 81/85 set in my ESP viper and have really been thinking of swapping those out for the tapped versions just to add more versatility.


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## cyril v (Feb 21, 2009)

which locking tuners would you guys recommend between the schallers and the planetwaves...? Sperzals? Anyone tried 'em all?

They're all around the same price, so thats not really an issue.

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## leonardo7 (Feb 22, 2009)

I_infect said:


> Yeah, the 7FR's are at $999 now, as much as the Loomis.


That was probably Schecters plan. Have them cheap until they have everyones attention, then bring the price up. I mean, what else can justify the insanely cheap prices Schecter has been selling their awesome guitars for?


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 22, 2009)

leonardo7 said:


> That was probably Schecters plan. Have them cheap until they have everyones attention, then bring the price up. I mean, what else can justify the insanely cheap prices Schecter has been selling their awesome guitars for?



Smart on their part because it worked


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## leonardo7 (Feb 22, 2009)

ESP and Schecter are run differently but are ultimately owned by the same people and built in the same factory. They didnt need to make much money while they were still growing as a company because they had money to get them through the phase of charging little and not making much. Now its time for them to fulfill their plan and have it pay off. Thats what I think.


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## Infused1 (Feb 22, 2009)

heffergm said:


> If you're really anal about how you wind your strings around normal tuning keys, they really won't slip, so for me it's a non-issue.
> 
> That said, I dig lockers because it makes restringing that much quicker/easier.



Agreed!


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## noodleplugerine (Feb 22, 2009)

gunshow86de said:


> They help it stay in tune because they lock the string. Because the string can't slip like on regular tuners where the string is wrapped around the post, you will have constant tension. Which means the string won't come out of tune, at least for that reason.
> 
> If your locking tuners weren't holding the guitar in tune, you were stringing them wrong. With locking tuners, you want to have as little string-wrap as possible. The string should basically make slightly more than a right angle at the tuning post. If you wrap the string all the way around the post even once, you have defeated the purpose of the locking tuner.
> 
> ...



Strings will stretch after use and go out of tune, no locking tuner can stop that.


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## Dusty201087 (Feb 22, 2009)

leonardo7 said:


> ESP and Schecter are run differently but are ultimately owned by the same people and built in the same factory. They didnt need to make much money while they were still growing as a company because they had money to get them through the phase of charging little and not making much. Now its time for them to fulfill their plan and have it pay off. Thats what I think.



I'm a bit anal about this, but ESP and schecters are not built in the same factory. LTD's and Schecters are, yes, but ESP's are handmade in Japan.

ESP =/= LTD.

And TC, if you don't go locking, do this:







Personally, I'd just go locking. It's great to wind strings like this if you don't have locking tuners, but I'm not going to lie, it can get a little frustrating trying to do this. Locking tuners are generally much more simple and you don't need to do this, just string, tune and lock.



noodleplugerine said:


> Strings will stretch after use and go out of tune, no locking tuner can stop that.



Actually, those planet wave trim-locking tuners or whatever they're called claim that the string never goes out of tune, but IDK, I've yet to read anything on them/use them.


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## thinktank (Feb 24, 2009)

Grover equipped model. 

I actually emailed Schecter and was told that the locking tuners are the only difference between the 08 and the 09 models. Just looking at the tuners up close you can see the difference between the high ratio grover tuners with double bushings and the rather average ones on the new locking schecter tuners. 

I am sure that the lockers are great and all but I would be willing to bet the Grover's cost more and are of a higher quality. Also, it is a 7 string guitar. My current Hellraiser only gets dropped to A if I want to play some Sepultura or Nile so I leave it in standard B most of the time. 

Also, the one I bought has a really spectacular quilted top that far surpasses most I have seen. My guitars are treated like art on my wall and looks do count to me in the long run. 

I will have to try the lockers some time after playing the grovers just to see.


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