# Everyone's weakest technique...



## distressed_romeo (Jan 29, 2007)

What areas of technique does everyone have to work hardest at? By this I mean the physical act of playing, not things like theory, sight-reading or aural skills.

For me it's pure alternate picking for lead playing (not so much of an issue for rhythm). Don't know why, but for some reason sweeping and legato came pretty naturally to me early one, whereas speed-picking didn't. It's started to come together in the past year or so, but obviously, there's always something that needs improving.
IM-style fingerpicking is still awkward for me as well, although that seems to be a common complaint.


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## DDDorian (Jan 29, 2007)

Right-hand muting while playing with distortion has long been and still is my biggest problem, much to my chagrin.


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## Popsyche (Jan 29, 2007)

Timing! All thee time timing!


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## OzzyC (Jan 29, 2007)

playing anything with 16ths over 120 

and sometimes i have a little trouble with getting the correct fingeting for chords im not to familiar with...like F7(#5)


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## Nik (Jan 30, 2007)

Sweeping. My hands just refuse to do it.

And I would assume two-handed, multi-string tapping, Eklundh style, although that's so crazy I've never even attempted it


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## Tybanez (Jan 30, 2007)

Jeez,where do i start. My alternate picking is a bugger. I have put in time in the past two years. I have been playing for 17 years and did not know how to practice alternate picking till I got John Petruccis DVD. Wow, Much thanx to JP for that.His DVD is worth its weight in gold to me.


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## Cancer (Jan 30, 2007)

Kiss closing women in bars, seems I can get there numbers, but after that ...nada.

Oh wait, you mean guitar techniques...

For me its classical guitar fingerpicking, I could never get comfortable with that, maybe someday, but not today.


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## HotRodded7321 (Jan 30, 2007)

Nik said:


> Sweeping. My hands just refuse to do it.



 I can do 4 string sweeps....that's it. for now, anyways. I'm slowly getting better, but for some reason, I just can't nail em.


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## Alpo (Jan 30, 2007)

I have the most trouble with complicated chord shapes. My left hand doesn't want to cooperate, and the right hand goes down with it.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Jan 30, 2007)

trills/hammer-ons/pull-offs that make no use of the index finger, legato, and tapping chords (with either or both hands).


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## Durero (Jan 30, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> For me it's pure alternate picking for lead playing (not so much of an issue for rhythm).


Funny, I'd say it's the same for me, but certainly not because sweep-picking came early or easily. 

I spent many years practicing full-on Gilbert-style alternate-picking shredding, and became pretty fast at it. I thought Frank Gambale was an alien freak, and that sweep-picking was impossible for mere human beings.

Then around '93 I met a friend who sweep-picked all the time - and did it right in front of my face! 
So I thought I should give it another go - and after about 2 years of practice I began to feel confident enough to prefer it over alternate-picking. Without really noticing, I preceded to abandon alternate picking for leads and sweep and/or legato everything. 

I quite miss the alternate picking speed I used to have, and the aggressive pick sound it makes - but I have a hard time sustaining that much tension in my arm when I can sweep notes faster with about a quarter of the effort.

Now I try to practice the alternate picking sometimes, but I'm not sure I'll ever get my old speed & sound back.


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## Ancestor (Jan 30, 2007)

String skipping, which sucks because I just wrote a song that skips a string in the main riff. And by string skipping, by no means am I talking about the insane speeds that Gilbert achieves. Just normal speed. But I'm working on it.


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## JPMDan (Jan 30, 2007)

Alternate picking
Sweeping
String Skipping
Legato
Tapping


yeah.... slacker right here!


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## nitelightboy (Jan 30, 2007)

Lately, I haven't been playing much. Actually, I don't think I've played since around Halloween. SO I've been working on getting my sound tightened up again for the past week or so. While I'm doing that, I'm working on my alternate picked string skips.


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## Metal Ken (Jan 30, 2007)

strict alternate picking in scales above 160bpm... i can get it there, but then i have to work my ass off to keep it above that.


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## eaeolian (Jan 30, 2007)

I'd say I need work in every area other than actually picking up the guitar. 

My legato-style playing sucks. I could also use more triplet work in the 120-160 range - I'm fine faster than that, but very sloppy in that BPM range. Although changing my right hand technique has helped that a lot...


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## Metal Ken (Jan 30, 2007)

eaeolian said:


> I'd say I need work in every area other than actually picking up the guitar.
> 
> My legato-style playing sucks. I could also use more triplet work in the 120-160 range - I'm fine faster than that, but very sloppy in that BPM range. Although changing my right hand technique has helped that a lot...



The thing that made me click in getting my left hand to do things it needed it do in that BPM range was modifying my technique slightly. Kinda like the difference between walking and running, you cant exactly run by walking really really fast. Once i had that realization, i was able to progress more easily.


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## eaeolian (Jan 30, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> The thing that made me click in getting my left hand to do things it needed it do in that BPM range was modifying my technique slightly. Kinda like the difference between walking and running, you cant exactly run by walking really really fast. Once i had that realization, i was able to progress more easily.



That's a good analogy, and one I never though of - the "gait" is certainly different. Thanks!

When we played with Zero Hour back in November, Jasun suggested that I "tighten up" my right hand (I played with my ring and pinky finger "splayed out"), and it's definitely helped tighten that up. However, I suspect that I'll just have to spend more metronome time to really get it to when I want it...


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## Emperoff (Jan 30, 2007)

Well, I think my weak points would be...

- Muting
- Left-Right hand sync on alternate picking (I pick damn faster than my left hand can handle)
- 5-string sweeps


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## Metal Ken (Jan 30, 2007)

eaeolian said:


> That's a good analogy, and one I never though of - the "gait" is certainly different. Thanks!
> 
> When we played with Zero Hour back in November, Jasun suggested that I "tighten up" my right hand (I played with my ring and pinky finger "splayed out"), and it's definitely helped tighten that up. However, I suspect that I'll just have to spend more metronome time to really get it to when I want it...



Yeah, i had this 'barrier' for a while at 135BPM... i couldnt get past it, and i couldnt figure out what i was doing wrong. 
i could play faster when i wasnt playing with a metronome, quite easily in fact - but i wanted to get my technique better, hence the metronome practice. But for some reason when i hit that tempo, it just wouldnt go, AT ALL. It was like a roadblock. then i stepped back and took a look at it, and thats when i realized, i had gotten the 'walk' as fast as i could get it, so i modified my technique and see if i could still keep it in time, and low and behold it worked. the only thing was practicing that particular type of playing is kinda hard to do since you can't exactly practice it slow. Thats probably why it took me a while to get what was going on there.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Jan 30, 2007)

Fucking EVERYTHING. I'm so sloppy at everything. But one major thing I REALLY want is the ability to compose. I can't compose for shit, and if I could, I could deal with sloppy technique.


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## god_puppet (Jan 30, 2007)

My alternate picking for lead has been getting better the past couple of months. I think the technique i have to work most at is my legato and tapping.


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## SevenatoR (Jan 30, 2007)

Alternate picking escapes me. I gave up on it a long time ago and started using a circular-economy thing that works a lot better for me. The weird thing is that if I spend time working on alternate picking, it improves my circular picking.


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## Desecrated (Jan 30, 2007)

Everything, I dont think I´m good a t a single thing and I´m slow as hell, cant play good over 150 bpm. which is a real problem cause my music is mostly written in 180 so when ever I have to lay down guitar it takes forever and sounds shit anyway


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## Aghorasilat (Jan 30, 2007)

Learning other peoples stuff....


and also maintaining picking. That seems to be one of those things that if you do not do everyday it goes away.

Sight reading.....But then again I have never had to use it in the real world and I heard holdsworth doesn't read....God I sound Ignorant. 


Santiago Dobles
www.aghora.org


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## Drew (Jan 30, 2007)

eaeolian said:


> I'd say I need work in every area other than actually picking up the guitar.







Aghorasilat said:


> Learning other peoples stuff....




That's a biggie for me too - I just don't have the patience for it. I'm more of an improv player anyway, and I enjoy making my own shit up more than learning someone else's. The problem is, I also am aware that learning someone else's licks is a great way to get you outside of your "comfort box" and make you grow as a player. It's a tough one...

For me, though, sweeping. My sweeping fucking blows. Not that the rest of my technique is a fuck of a lot better - I basically just let my legato carry me - but that's the one that I reallly just can't get down.


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 30, 2007)

Aghorasilat said:


> Learning other peoples stuff....
> 
> 
> and also maintaining picking. That seems to be one of those things that if you do not do everyday it goes away.
> ...



I'm terrible at sitting down and learning stuff as well, not because I can't do it; my ear's good enough for me to pick up most music pretty quickly, but by the time I've worked out and notated a whole song, there's always the annoying little voice at the back of my head that tells me I could have come up with about 100 ideas of my own in the same length of time.

That's similar to the problem I have with alternate picking...it's just pushing your 'bottom level' up each day that requires a lot of dedication. I mean it's one thing getting all your picking licks perfectly precise and clean at any speed when you have your own equipment, and you have as long as you want to warm up, but what happens when you're in a guitar shop or a friends house, and they put a guitar into your hand and ask you to play something?



SevenatoR said:


> Alternate picking escapes me. I gave up on it a long time ago and started using a circular-economy thing that works a lot better for me. The weird thing is that if I spend time working on alternate picking, it improves my circular picking.



I'm much more into economy picking in my lead playing (still tend to alternate pick rhythm parts for extra punch), but I still practice alternate picking, as it's an important component in good economy picking, and it's still a good discipline for hand-to-hand coordination.


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## kung_fu (Jan 30, 2007)

I hadn't really analyzed my alternate picking technique until a few weeks ago, i discovered that when crosing strings I "sweep" or economize the motion instead of continually alternating. My problem is that i economize while crossing from higher to lower strings, but when going from low to high i have a tendancy to continually alternate. This results in me being able to play descending scales faster than i can ascending. Definately something i need to work on.


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## Hexer (Jan 30, 2007)

hmmm...... lead-playing in gerneral I think

especially:

my left hand!!! strength, speed, precission, coordination

sweeping. when I practice it for some time I can sweep descending (high to low) pretty ok (not good by any means though) but me sweeping ascending (low to high) is just horrible. I also kinda got away from really wanting to perfect sweeping as I'm kinda under the impression that everyone who uses it a lot sounds pretty repetitive, boring and most of the guys sound very similar. there are exceptions of course, no question. but I think I have more important things to practice first that I can do more with

legato!!! I'm getting better at it but it needs a lot more improvement

tapping. I'm kinda good with simple tapping stuff like those triplet-licks ( like -17-15-12-... you get the idea) and I use my 2nd finger for that without any problems (can keep the pick right where it is when picking) but I really need to work on more complex stuff and using more than 1 finger (you can do really nice things with that but I need to practice more and come up with some good stuff of course)

and WHAT THE HELL is that "running"-"technique" you guys are talking about? can anyone explain to me the differences in technic/style/whatever in playing fast as opposed to playing at "normal" speed?


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## MetalMike (Jan 30, 2007)

Strict alternate picking at moderate speeds. I took the Jason Becker, start fast and work to improve your accuracy method with alternate picking rather than take it slow and build up. It worked great for me and I can alternate pick at high speeds but those in between speeds kill me. Because of the point I'm at with economy/sweep picking I don't practice alternate picking as much as a should. I have no motivation to alternate pick at moderate speeds, which sucks.


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## Jason (Jan 30, 2007)

Anyone who has heard me play..Everything  I got a good sense of melody..that's about it


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## Nidolf (Jan 30, 2007)

I'm bad at sweeping, but It's not something I aspire to be really good at either so I guess it doesn't bother me to much 

Also practicing the same thing over and over for longer times beats me. (Starting slow, building up...)


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## Mastodon (Jan 30, 2007)

Definately sweep picking. Everything else seems to have come to me easily but no matter how slow I practice sweep picking it always sounds disjointed. I've tried different attack approaches but so far no success.


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## Aghorasilat (Jan 30, 2007)

Drew said:


> That's a biggie for me too - I just don't have the patience for it. I'm more of an improv player anyway, and I enjoy making my own shit up more than learning someone else's. The problem is, I also am aware that learning someone else's licks is a great way to get you outside of your "comfort box" and make you grow as a player. It's a tough one...



Yeah I agree



distressed_romeo said:


> I'm terrible at sitting down and learning stuff as well, not because I can't do it; my ear's good enough for me to pick up most music pretty quickly, but by the time I've worked out and notated a whole song, there's always the annoying little voice at the back of my head that tells me I could have come up with about 100 ideas of my own in the same length of time.



Yeah I agree I sometimes feel like damn...I could be writing music!



distressed_romeo said:


> That's similar to the problem I have with alternate picking...it's just pushing your 'bottom level' up each day that requires a lot of dedication. I mean it's one thing getting all your picking licks perfectly precise and clean at any speed when you have your own equipment, and you have as long as you want to warm up, but what happens when you're in a guitar shop or a friends house, and they put a guitar into your hand and ask you to play something?



Yeah That is tough I learned that if you can't play good on a piece of shit....you need to work more. So the last few years I have been practicing on an acoustic with thick gauge strings and relatively higher action than my electric guitars. But that all goesout the windo when I see Allan Holdsworth on Video and I REALIZE.......FUCK I SUCK!


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

Yeah, I divide my time fairly evenly between acoustic/classical guitar and electric, which helps keep my chops up when real life starts getting in the way.


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## Shaman (Jan 31, 2007)

NOthing, I am perfect  

No, just kidding. I think the weakest aspect of my playing is my right hand stamina. In alternate picking it's OK, but I suck at fast downstroke stuff.

The problem with my left hand is that weird chords often give me a hard time.

Then, I don't have the patience to learn other people's songs too. I have been working on it these days though.

I need to work on my tapping too and I would want to know more scales too.


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## JD80 (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> What areas of technique does everyone have to work hardest at? By this I mean the physical act of playing, not things like theory, sight-reading or aural skills.
> 
> For me it's pure alternate picking for lead playing (not so much of an issue for rhythm). Don't know why, but for some reason sweeping and legato came pretty naturally to me early one, whereas speed-picking didn't. It's started to come together in the past year or so, but obviously, there's always something that needs improving.
> IM-style fingerpicking is still awkward for me as well, although that seems to be a common complaint.




I think strict alternate picking is objectively *the* hardest skill to master on guitar. I came to this realization while watching MABs Speed Kills, where he demonstrates alternate picking, economy picking, sweep picking, and legato. He starts off with alternate picking and says (paraphrasing) This is the first, and most difficult technique. At the time, I was likehuh? No, thats the easiest. But once you start to incorporate all these techniques, it really is the hardest. 

Ive only been sweeping for about 6-7 months, and economy picking for maybe 3-4 (finally starting to get it), and I think those two techniques are better than my alternate picking in terms of how clean they are at what speed. Ive been playing for about 8 years now (although only very seriously in the past year).




Hexer said:


> sweeping. when I practice it for some time I can sweep descending (high to low) pretty ok (not good by any means though) but me sweeping ascending (low to high) is just horrible. I also kinda got away from really wanting to perfect sweeping as I'm kinda under the impression that everyone who uses it a lot sounds pretty repetitive, boring and most of the guys sound very similar. there are exceptions of course, no question. but I think I have more important things to practice first that I can do more with



My guitar teacher had me start out learning to do descending sweeps because he said they were easier. I have the complete opposite problem. My ascending (low to high strings) sweeping is definitely better than my descending, and especially with my economy picking. My ascending economy picking (especially with 3 notes per string scales and what not) totally slays my descending economy picking technique. I think its because I relax my arm and wrist and use gravity to assist the motion, but I dont have that advantage when going back down, so I tense up more. 

Anybody else have this issue?




MetalMike said:


> Strict alternate picking at moderate speeds. I took the Jason Becker, start fast and work to improve your accuracy method with alternate picking rather than take it slow and build up. It worked great for me and I can alternate pick at high speeds but those in between speeds kill me. Because of the point I'm at with economy/sweep picking I don't practice alternate picking as much as a should. I have no motivation to alternate pick at moderate speeds, which sucks.



I have the exact same issue. I fucking hate playing 16ths at like 130-140 bpm. It just really makes me mad because it seems like I can play the same thing easier at like 150-160 sometimes. 

What exactly is Jason Beckers method for improving alt. picking?


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

JD80 said:


> My guitar teacher had me start out learning to do descending sweeps because he said they were easier. I have the complete opposite problem. My ascending (low to high strings) sweeping is definitely better than my descending, and especially with my economy picking. My ascending economy picking (especially with 3 notes per string scales and what not) totally slays my descending economy picking technique. I think its because I relax my arm and wrist and use gravity to assist the motion, but I dont have that advantage when going back down, so I tense up more.
> 
> Anybody else have this issue?
> 
> ...



It wasn't a problem with the big arpeggio sweeps, but when I started economy picking scales and 3-1-3 type patterns, I found it much easier descending than ascending for some reason. I don't know why. It's fine (OK, adequate...) going in both directions, as I practiced my ass off to get it together.

Apparently Jason did the same as Shawn Lane when developing speedy alternate picking; you start as fast as possible, even if it's pretty sloppy, and then practice to clean it up, in other words the opposite of how John Petrucci and Pablo Gilberto practice.

That's a good observation about alternate picking; when you start out it seems easy and comfortable, but once you take it to a higher level you realised how many in-built difficulties there are. I'd also agree with what a few people have already said, that it's probably the hardest technique to maintain on guitar. If I go without playing for a few days, then when I pick it up, I can usually start doing all my sweep and legato stuff straight away, but alternate picking a complex passage will kill me.

Probably the best resource I've seen on it is Troy Stetina's 'Speed Mechanics for Lead Guitar' book. Personally I think the MAB stuff is a little overrated (no flaming please...it's purely a personal opinion).


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## mefrommiddleearth (Jan 31, 2007)

well having only been doing this for about two years there are alot of areas that I'd really like to be better at (i.e. most stuff) but I would say my biggest weakness as a play is in the combination of a couple of things

*I only know a few simple songs all the way through
*have difficulty playing in time to a metronome anything more difficult than a few riffs
*to eager to move onto more complex stuff before having the basics down really solidly


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## Kotex (Jan 31, 2007)

I suck at everything.


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## Leon (Jan 31, 2007)

.jason. said:


> Anyone who has heard me play..Everything  I got a good sense of melody..that's about it





i have an excellent ear, but no theory knowledge to speak of. i could stand to know a bit more theory (ok, i could stand to know ANY theory ).


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## JD80 (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> It wasn't a problem with the big arpeggio sweeps, but when I started economy picking scales and 3-1-3 type patterns, I found it much easier descending than ascending for some reason. I don't know why. It's fine (OK, adequate...) going in both directions, as I practiced my ass off to get it together.
> 
> Apparently Jason did the same as Shawn Lane when developing speedy alternate picking; you start as fast as possible, even if it's pretty sloppy, and then practice to clean it up, in other words the opposite of how John Petrucci and Pablo Gilberto practice.
> 
> ...




I think theres definitely something to that method: start off playing as fast as possiblefor this reason: You use the same technique playing fast as you do slow. John Pettruci always says in his video, use the same technique at all speeds, but I think its very difficult in practice to actually accomplish this without frequently practicing at near top speed. I agree MABs stuff is over-rated, but he also expressed that point of view. 

Ive found the best way to work on anything, but esp. alt. picking is to split time equally (more or less) between:

1. Playing very fast near top speed to work on right hand relaxation and form.

2. Play with a metronome up through the speeds  John Pettruci style, for accuracy and synchronizing your hands together. 

3.Play super slow, or as Jamie Andreas says no-tempo speed to really get control of your fingers  making sure theyre doing the exact right thing with minimal tension. 

+1 on speed mechanics. Some day Im going to get back to flight of the bumblebee and really master that one. The last few times I attempted it, I just wasnt ready for it yet. Stuck at about 130 bpm and kinda sloppy. The parts on the first 4 frets + open strings just kill me.


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## Aghorasilat (Jan 31, 2007)

JD80 said:


> I think theres definitely something to that method: start off playing as fast as possiblefor this reason: You use the same technique playing fast as you do slow. John Pettruci always says in his video, use the same technique at all speeds, but I think its very difficult in practice to actually accomplish this without frequently practicing at near top speed. I agree MABs stuff is over-rated, but he also expressed that point of view.
> 
> Ive found the best way to work on anything, but esp. alt. picking is to split time equally (more or less) between:
> 
> ...




Slow temp (60 - 80bpms) work all subdivisions (Jon Maclaughlin way) and also method used by fastest double bass drummers I know ...Sean R, Derek Roddy, George K. (Nile), And Giann Rubio.

If it works for their feet it will work for my wrist and fore arms. 
If you can pick as fast ast their feet go you can sure as hell pick faster than most out there. 


I prefer the picking fluidity if Paul Gilbert , Maclaughlin, Yngwie to JP's.

i think the hardest think for me is economy picking


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

JD80 said:


> +1 on speed mechanics. Some day Im going to get back to flight of the bumblebee and really master that one. The last few times I attempted it, I just wasnt ready for it yet. Stuck at about 130 bpm and kinda sloppy. The parts on the first 4 frets + open strings just kill me.



Confession time...I can alternate pick FOTBB at full speed, but I don't use the fingerings Troy shows in SMFLG, as I found them excessively awkward, and worked out a new approach that suited my picking style better.



Aghorasilat said:


> Slow temp (60 - 80bpms) work all subdivisions (Jon Maclaughlin way) and also method used by fastest double bass drummers I know ...Sean R, Derek Roddy, George K. (Nile), And Giann Rubio.
> 
> If it works for their feet it will work for my wrist and fore arms.
> If you can pick as fast ast their feet go you can sure as hell pick faster than most out there.
> ...



+10000 for practicing different rhythmic subdivisions! A cool variation on that is to tap your foot whilst playing a repetitive pattern, but then start introducting metric modulations, tapping your foot in time to the new pulse without breaking your picking fluidity.
For instance, start off by playing five notes per click in 3/4, but then say, change the placing of the accents so it becomes a 15/16 rhythm, or triplets in a 5/4 rhythm, whilst keeping the pulse even.

It feels wierd at first, but can inspire some great riffing ideas, and does wonders for your phrasing and picking control.


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## JD80 (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Confession time...I can alternate pick FOTBB at full speed, but I don't use the fingerings Troy shows in SMFLG, as I found them excessively awkward, and worked out a new approach that suited my picking style better.



I'm going to try that. I've thought about rearranging the fingerings, but I was always too lazy to do so. I can definitely get rid of many of those annoying open string parts by shifting everything up 5 frets and utilizing the 7th string.


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## Nik (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> Apparently Jason did the same as Shawn Lane when developing speedy alternate picking; you start as fast as possible, even if it's pretty sloppy, and then practice to clean it up, in other words the opposite of how John Petrucci and Pablo Gilberto practice.



Wow, I actually used that method when I first started playing, and after 1-and-a-half years of playing guitar, I could actually do some shredding.

This is great for improv, but it sucks if there's an exact, specific melody you have to play really fast, because then you have to work with a metronome.

I actually thought that this was pretty bad practice, so I've been working with a metronome for the last year or so. Still, it makes me feel better to know that Jason and Shawn used this method--I guess it really does work. I just think that you have a lot of development at first, and then it sort of plateaus and progress slows down, so in the long run, getting clean shredding by this method takes about as long as playing slow and speeding up.

Thanks for sharing that, though, I'm in high spirits now


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

Nik said:


> Wow, I actually used that method when I first started playing, and after 1-and-a-half years of playing guitar, I could actually do some shredding.
> 
> This is great for improv, but it sucks if there's an exact, specific melody you have to play really fast, because then you have to work with a metronome.
> 
> ...



One similar idea that's really helped me is one that Troy Stetina and John Petrucci have both written about; you practice in bursts, playing a few bars at normal speed, and then a couple at double speed, and keep alternating like that for a few minutes without stopping. It's great, as it gives you both control and stamina.


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## Nik (Jan 31, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> One similar idea that's really helped me is one that Troy Stetina and John Petrucci have both written about; you practice in bursts, playing a few bars at normal speed, and then a couple at double speed, and keep alternating like that for a few minutes without stopping. It's great, as it gives you both control and stamina.



Wow, that sounds good, I'll definitely try this tomorrow.

Another thing worth noting, though, is that playing good is also a psychological thing. This will sound sort of lame, but hearing that Shawn Lane and Jason Becker used a similar method to learn as mine made me feel much better about my playing, which I used to think was a sloppy way to cheat.

Because you mentioned that, I just had an amazing practice session. Being psychologically upbeat and confident that you can pull off all your licks makes your technique tremendously better. 

To quote the Matrix,

"Don't think you can. Know you can."


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## distressed_romeo (Jan 31, 2007)

Nik said:


> Wow, that sounds good, I'll definitely try this tomorrow.
> 
> Another thing worth noting, though, is that playing good is also a psychological thing. This will sound sort of lame, but hearing that Shawn Lane and Jason Becker used a similar method to learn as mine made me feel much better about my playing, which I used to think was a sloppy way to cheat.
> 
> ...


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## JJ Rodriguez (Feb 2, 2007)

My SONIC MOTION could use a bit of work, I'm only at 50 nps.


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## ib7321 (Feb 2, 2007)

Without a doubt sweeping. I can get most of the patterns down but making my left hand and my right coordinate is just not happening


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## Hexer (Feb 4, 2007)

JD80 said:


> My guitar teacher had me start out learning to do descending sweeps because he said they were easier. I have the complete opposite problem. My ascending (low to high strings) sweeping is definitely better than my descending, and especially with my economy picking. My ascending economy picking (especially with 3 notes per string scales and what not) totally slays my descending economy picking technique. I think its because I relax my arm and wrist and use gravity to assist the motion, but I dont have that advantage when going back down, so I tense up more.
> 
> Anybody else have this issue?



I talked with a friend of mine about my probs with sweeping and he basically said the same thing as you. he found ascending quite a bit easier. my problem is, descending i just sweep my pick over the strings in a very smooth even motion, but with ascending "sweeps" I just cant seem to do the same thing. I always end up doing a lot of little downstrokes basically instead of one fluid motion

oh yea, and I guess I could use some more theory knowledge. I really (and I mean REALLY) suck when it comes to theory


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## Aghorasilat (Feb 4, 2007)

Do sweeping with Metronome slow and RELAX hands completely.

that should help a lot.


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## sakeido (Feb 5, 2007)

I can tremolo pick hella fast, do sweeps, tapping and everything, but I can't play with a metronome to save my life. Doing tracks on the computer along to an EZdrummer beat are just totally out of the question because I can't fucking play in time if I don't have a real human drummer there with me for some reason. Its also why all of our songs have a durm intro, so I can figure out the pace before I have to start playing


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## Aghorasilat (Feb 5, 2007)

sakeido said:


> I can tremolo pick hella fast, do sweeps, tapping and everything, but I can't play with a metronome to save my life. Doing tracks on the computer along to an EZdrummer beat are just totally out of the question because I can't fucking play in time if I don't have a real human drummer there with me for some reason. Its also why all of our songs have a durm intro, so I can figure out the pace before I have to start playing




that is crazy. You should still try it really is good for your brain to develope that type of timing.

Maybe try like drum loops?


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 5, 2007)

sakeido said:


> I can tremolo pick hella fast, do sweeps, tapping and everything, but I can't play with a metronome to save my life. Doing tracks on the computer along to an EZdrummer beat are just totally out of the question because I can't fucking play in time if I don't have a real human drummer there with me for some reason. Its also why all of our songs have a durm intro, so I can figure out the pace before I have to start playing



Why don't you try playing reeeeally slowly whilst tapping your foot, as I'll bet the problem is that your internal clock and your hands aren't perfectly in sync, hence you having to rely on the dummer?


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## Mastodon (Feb 5, 2007)

Hmmm, what about in my case where I can't play with a metronome at all?

(I think it may be that I just don't know HOW to play to the metronome)


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## Hexer (Feb 5, 2007)

Mastodon said:


> Hmmm, what about in my case where I can't play with a metronome at all?
> 
> (I think it may be that I just don't know HOW to play to the metronome)



I can help you with that: what your supposed to do is play IN TIME 


 


I just ordered a copy of Troy Stetinas Speed Mechanics for lead guitar  lets see what this can do for me, I'm really looking forward to it!!


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## skattabrain (Feb 5, 2007)

sakeido said:


> I can tremolo pick hella fast, do sweeps, tapping and everything, but I can't play with a metronome to save my life. Doing tracks on the computer along to an EZdrummer beat are just totally out of the question because I can't fucking play in time if I don't have a real human drummer there with me for some reason. Its also why all of our songs have a durm intro, so I can figure out the pace before I have to start playing



dude, that's the one skill you need! 

seriously ... it comes fast ... it's a mental thing but you need to exercise it. play along with some CD's ... you might find that more natural and it's playing in time.

ya gotsa feel da rhythm bro!


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## Rick (Feb 6, 2007)

My weakest technique?

Guitar.


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## sakeido (Feb 6, 2007)

skattabrain said:


> dude, that's the one skill you need!
> 
> seriously ... it comes fast ... it's a mental thing but you need to exercise it. play along with some CD's ... you might find that more natural and it's playing in time.
> 
> ya gotsa feel da rhythm bro!



this post is rated R 

Started playing with a metronome tonight petrucci-style
fucking frustrating as a motherfucker god fucking damn it fuck shit fuck! Watching him shred 16ths at 176 and I can barely keep the time in 8ths at 200


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## Korbain (Feb 6, 2007)

Timing! i can keep time yes, but there are times it just shits me up a wall for some strange reasons


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 6, 2007)

sakeido said:


> this post is rated R
> 
> Started playing with a metronome tonight petrucci-style
> fucking frustrating as a motherfucker god fucking damn it fuck shit fuck! Watching him shred 16ths at 176 and I can barely keep the time in 8ths at 200



START SLOWLY!!!!! You're after rhythmic control, not speed! If you jump in at the fast tempos it'll retard your ability to keep control on the rhythm. Do that, and the speed will follow in time.


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## Durero (Feb 6, 2007)

sakeido said:


> this post is rated R
> 
> Started playing with a metronome tonight petrucci-style
> fucking frustrating as a motherfucker god fucking damn it fuck shit fuck! Watching him shred 16ths at 176 and I can barely keep the time in 8ths at 200


I'd suggest playing quarter notes at 120 first. Seriously, it's not a picking technique issue, but a matter of sensitizing yourself to the underlying beat of everything you play.

Try all downstrokes at 120 and see if you can feel the difference between when you are slightly ahead of the beat, slightly behind the beat, or right on it.


Folks who are new to this type of practice often don't realize that faster is not necessarily more difficult. We all have a range of comfortable speeds to play a piece or exercise at, and at first that range can be very narrow. 

As our playing techniques develop that allows us to play at faster tempos with less difficulty, but as our _rhythm_ skills improve that allows us to play at slower tempos without getting sloppy and wandering all over the beat.

So I'd suggest to anyone practicing this skill to see what your comfort range is - i.e. how fast _and_ how slow you can play your exercise accurately. Recording yourself and listening back to see how well your notes line up with the beat is so valuable it should be considered a mandatory part of the process.


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## wretchedspawn (Feb 6, 2007)

I can't alternate pick when switching strings at all. I've been an economy picker since I started playing. It just felt natural. Also I can't get faster than 16th notes at 220 bpm. I can do it in little bursts but that is it. I found that practicing a lot of wide interval and 4-6 note per string exercises really help with my speed and accuracy. I use a lot of the Francesco Fareri and Rusty Cooley(especially 7 deadly sins) stuff off of Chops From Hell.


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## distressed_romeo (Feb 6, 2007)

wretchedspawn said:


> I can't alternate pick when switching strings at all. I've been an economy picker since I started playing. It just felt natural. Also I can't get faster than 16th notes at 220 bpm. I can do it in little bursts but that is it. I found that practicing a lot of wide interval and 4-6 note per string exercises really help with my speed and accuracy. I use a lot of the Francesco Fareri and Rusty Cooley(especially 7 deadly sins) stuff off of Chops From Hell.



There's a really good article on Tom Hess' website, written by one of his students, where he argues that economy picking takes less time to master than alternate picking. From my own experiences, and having heard countless stories like yours, I totally agree with that.

Regarding developing speed, have you tried the 'bursts' method that Troy Stetina describes in 'Speed Mechanics for Lead Guitar'? What you do is get a metronome going, and practice at a speed you can execute easily for a little bit, then do a few bars at double speed, then back to the original tempo, and so forth, alternating like that. It'll give you speed, stamina and control. Trust me, it works!


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## eaeolian (Feb 6, 2007)

rg7420user said:


> My weakest technique?
> 
> Guitar.



I'll drink to that.


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## wretchedspawn (Feb 7, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> There's a really good article on Tom Hess' website, written by one of his students, where he argues that economy picking takes less time to master than alternate picking. From my own experiences, and having heard countless stories like yours, I totally agree with that.
> 
> Regarding developing speed, have you tried the 'bursts' method that Troy Stetina describes in 'Speed Mechanics for Lead Guitar'? What you do is get a metronome going, and practice at a speed you can execute easily for a little bit, then do a few bars at double speed, then back to the original tempo, and so forth, alternating like that. It'll give you speed, stamina and control. Trust me, it works!


 
I've actually read that article before. I'll definitely try the "bursts" method you described. Sounds like it should work.


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## ElRay (Feb 7, 2007)

Swing. Can't play it, can't dance it.


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## JD80 (Feb 7, 2007)

distressed_romeo said:


> There's a really good article on Tom Hess' website, written by one of his students, where he argues that economy picking takes less time to master than alternate picking. From my own experiences, and having heard countless stories like yours, I totally agree with that.



I am really tempted sometimes to just say screw alternate picking and develop a style solely based around economy picking. I keep going back and forth....sometimes I think economy is the way, other times I think I will use mainly alt. picking and throw in economy picking for 3 nps runs that call for it....

So frustrating, but after reading that troy grady stuff it really surprised me that some of the masters (Yngwie, MAB) mainly use a small subset of picking patterns and just really f'ing master those, and primarily stick with those patterns when improvising....

Decisions, decisions....


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## Mastodon (Feb 7, 2007)

Hmmm, maybe try learning some classical stuff like Moto Perpetuo by Pagininni to develop alternate picking.

At least, that's what my teacher gave me early on to develop it. He noticed that I caught onto it fairly effortlessly, we eventually figured out that it was because my right hand was already used to alternating motions from playing viola.

Haha, so maybe go back in time and tell yourself to pick up a bowed instrument?


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## Kakaka (Apr 10, 2007)

Fast string skipping, I´d really like to improve on that.


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## Gilbucci (Apr 10, 2007)

I BLOW at legato. I hate how some people do it so effortlessly. I was looking back in this thread, and I read that Shawn Lane and Becker played without a metronome, is this true? I'm going with the Cooley method right now, which is, grabbing a bunch of licks I suck ass at, and working on them with a timer, watching my muting, picking, etc. It's helped so far.


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## whatthe17 (Apr 11, 2007)

Alternate and Finger picking have always given me trouble.


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## jufob (Apr 11, 2007)

Trying to restrain myself and keep all the obvious technique of the month playing out of my phrasing or at least cloak it somehow. It is difficult, frustrating and a constant challenge to me.


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## kmanick (Apr 11, 2007)

since I started takng lessons again 3 weeks ago, I've found that I completely suck at wide interval legato licks and tapping using more than 1 finger.
My teacher loves to show me these wide freaking lines that have all these big (to me anyway) stretches in them and he connects them while moving up thru all the positions up the neck
I've been very humbled, every time I start to feel like I'm getting better he shows me another technique or a tapping line that I can't play for the life of me.  
I never realized how simplistic my playing is compared to some of these fusion guys that just burn(like my teacher)


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## All_¥our_Bass (Apr 11, 2007)

Tremolo picking, playing with a lighter touch (picking hand) when at higher tempos.


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## telecaster90 (Apr 12, 2007)

Honestly? Practicing in general. I pick up the guitar alot to just dick around, but settling down to practice with goals in mind is hard for me. If I do that, it'll open the doors for everything else to go right


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## XEN (Apr 12, 2007)

telecaster90 said:


> Honestly? Practicing in general. I pick up the guitar alot to just dick around, but settling down to practice with goals in mind is hard for me. If I do that, it'll open the doors for everything else to go right


 
Glad I'm not alone....

I really struggle with practicing. If it feels like work I generally shut down. In fact there have been times where I would just go withough even touching the guitar for months at a time. I feel like any improvement I make is by accident. lol I have made strides in the last few months since I got the Mark IV though. I can't help but plug in and play when it sounds that damn good.


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## fathead (Apr 12, 2007)

urklvt said:


> I really struggle with practicing. If it feels like work I generally shut down.



Me too, I swear I've got tab ADD , after a while all those numbers and lines just give me a headache. I've spent my fair share of time with a metronome the last few years and it gets harder and harder to stay focused. More than anything I just crave a beat to play over. The best investment I've made in my practice routine was to pick up a Fretlight. They're not the best made guitars by any stretch but it has really me helped turn loose on a chord progression and see the patterns. And the red lights don't give me tab lock. It kind of shifts scales from being monotonous patterns into something you can learn from while doing something musical.

I'd really like my legato and sweeps to be better.


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## Roundhouse_Kick (Apr 12, 2007)

At the moment I'm really tring to focus on meking my playing sound cleaner and in control. I have big trouble connecting different ideas seamlessly - I have quite a decent range of techniques but I struggle to put them together.

And I'm AWFUL at improvising. If you give me a chord sequence and tell me to play some lead over it off the bat you'd think I'd been playing guitar for a couple of weeks haha!


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## Brett89 (Apr 12, 2007)

Weakest technique? 

Picking


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## DelfinoPie (Apr 12, 2007)

After watching G3 live in Denver I have the urge to practice throwing the guitar over my shoulder and doing lots of jump-kicks, just like Yngwie


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## telecaster90 (Apr 12, 2007)

telecaster90 said:


> Honestly? Practicing in general. I pick up the guitar alot to just dick around, but settling down to practice with goals in mind is hard for me. If I do that, it'll open the doors for everything else to go right




I'd like to add comping and sweeping to this list.

So yeah, those too. 

If we can branch this into other instrument's techniques, my traditional grip sucks hard and my left hand is pretty weak.


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## Unknown Doodl3.2 (Apr 15, 2007)

I can sweep really well for the amount of time I've incorporated it and its become a big part of my playing, I can also do legato work pretty decently, but my strict. alt. picking is weak in comparison. I can't even tremolo pick THAT fast, and on good days my alt. is around 160 in chromatics very cleanly and 145-155 doing scalar runs... I just need to sit down and practice the hell out of it... I also think a huge part of what's holding me back is the voice in my head saying "you'll never do it...."


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## Alex-D33 (Apr 15, 2007)

Nothing to complaint here I got every aspect of playing & all the Technics down .! perfection at it's best I should say ...















































Only joking around with you guys have lots of thing to work on ..when doing scales I have a fuck load of trouble to ascend to the higher notes when starting on the lower one's...and that pisses me off !!!......


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## Zepp88 (Apr 17, 2007)

Sweep picking, and locking to a metronome have to be my biggest issues. I try to play the Nevemore - Psalm Of Lydia solo constantly, but at a very slow speed  no fun there. Now that we know in which areas we suck, are there any REALLY helpful DVDs available to remedy our suckage?


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## reese_apoc (Apr 18, 2007)

HotRodded7321 said:


> I can do 4 string sweeps....that's it.  for now, anyways. I'm slowly getting better, but for some reason, I just can't nail em.



i'm lucky if i can even do a 3 string sweep properly. but, i've only been playing for 2 years with no real training so i can imagine that such an advanced technique will take a crapload of time and patience, so i don't mind. i'll just keep at it.


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## oompa (Apr 20, 2007)

im extremely lefthanded (meaning i can barely hold my weewee with my righthand while peeing), and my biggest weakness is my righthand technique.

when im stringskipping while alternate picking at "high" speed, unpleasant upstrokes just turns to economy picked downstrokes against my will.

my sweeps are not to be proud of either.


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## TheMasterplan (Apr 22, 2007)

My weakest spots as far as technique seems to be a plague: Sweeping. I can clear three string sweeps, four gets a little sloppy then five is just bad for me. I really have been practicing sweeps, I just never seem to get much better :/

Another thing I notice I do is if I'm not paying enough attention I play things a little bit faster or slower than they should be. 

Also, for whatever reasons, when I play scales too quickly the rwrong fingers come down. Either I'll hit one before the other [not the good way] or sometimes my pinky and ring finger come down simultaneously.


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## Your Majesty (Apr 25, 2007)

Sweeping - its a technique I have always struggled at.


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## Bound (Apr 25, 2007)

Your Majesty said:


> Sweeping - its a technique I have always struggled at.



same


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