# What is the purpose of odd guitar tunings?



## kenken27 (Sep 1, 2011)

I've been playing guitar for years, and every once in awhile I'll run into a band that uses an unconventional tuning. For example, The Tony Danza Tap Dance Extravaganza uses E B E B E F# B e. I can see the purpose of using drop tunings, but isn't it possible to play a song in a "regular" tuning and get the same results by changing some finger positions? I can see how these tunings might make playing some riffs easier, but I'm wondering if any of these odd tunings allow you to create sounds that are just not possible in a more conventional tuning. Also, when playing in open tunings, such as open C, I feel as if it restricts my possibilities musically. Is there something I'm missing here?


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## clockworksam (Sep 1, 2011)

Its alot to do with chord voicing imo, the sound of notes conventionally played lower on the neck when played in a different tuning in a higher position often dont "sing" as much, I think this tuning in particular is to carry alot of low dissonance in the guitars bottom end


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## anne (Sep 1, 2011)

I use my F# A C# D A C# tuning to chord while holding drone notes that aren't the root/tonic, and to play clusters like C C# D. If the cluster had an A in it, you could even play four adjacent notes. The spacing of the four bottom strings also makes it really easy to shape chords grammatically (min, maj, dim, aug, sus, 1st inv, 2nd inv, etc.) without even thinking about it, since it's all based off of a bar chord, so it's much easier just to write music. If I were forced into standard tuning, I'd never write another good chord progression again. It's much easier to slide complex chords this way too, without redundant notes or unwanted inversions. And in the case of my F# C# A D# B F# tuning, I get dropped eight-string range on six strings. Also, the voicing thing is big for sure. Chords that sound awesome on an F# A C# D spacing sometimes don't sound anywhere near as good on an F# C# A D spacing because it's so much farther apart. I don't think any of this would work so well if I had any interest in a shreddable guitar, but nuts to that.


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## Dayn (Sep 1, 2011)

Phrasing, pure and simple. I have my six-string in open Dsus2 so I can easily play full-bodied chords and drone away on the open strings and sound good. On an extended-range instrument, you can have it in standard and add a high G; that's an odd tuning, having a minor third between the top two strings, but the world for phrasing opportunities is opened up with alternative tunings.


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## Ishan (Sep 1, 2011)

I use open tunings for the chord voicing they allow (and yes some tunings make chords available that were impossible to play before). I'd love to try open Em on my 8 string as it provides a lot of big chords and push you to go out of your comfort zone with scales as they aren't placed as you remember them.
Standard tuning is a convention, you can use whatever tuning you like and still be as creative as anyone  Go tell guys at Guitar Craft there NST tuning is wrong and limiting, they'll laugh their ass of at your expense


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## Solodini (Sep 1, 2011)

I support what the other have said about phrasing and chord voicings. It may be limiting to them learn other songs but similarly, you could say standard tuning is limiting and everything you play in standard should be transposed to the alt tuning. Similar to Ann, I often tune my 6es to AFCGCF to have range more than 7 string on a 6 and be able to accompany myself more. There are chords in that tuning whih I couldn't play on a 6 otherwise. It's generally for specific intervals I want to reach which I would otherwise write for separate instruments but want to play the piece on ome guitar. I think bands signature timings generally arise from necessity to achieve live what they would otherwise multitrack.


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## Scar Symmetry (Sep 1, 2011)

It boils down to the way you are used to playing guitar and the way you approach the instrument. Regular tunings are great for lead work, but the possibilities are crazy when you mix things up. Experiment and see what works for you and what doesn't, you could even create your own tuning that allows you to express yourself exactly. It will be annoying trying to figure out optimum string gauges, but if you want to do it then it would surely be worth it.


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## richardJ (Sep 1, 2011)

I have one acoustic guitar which is tuned in Open C (C-G-C-G-C-E) which gives me endless options in played all kinds of things. Most notably, lead work isn't even that much harder, if you're a pattern-oriented guitarist: you can repeat patterns over the 3 sets of strings 

So in conclusion: it boils down to phrasing and chord voicing.


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## drgamble (Sep 1, 2011)

If you play slide guitar, open tunings are the way to go for chord voicings. I also know that the Black Crowes used an open E tuning for "She Talks to Angels". You can maybe get somewhat close in standard tuning, but the open E tuning allows for fuller sounding chords.


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## anne (Sep 1, 2011)

The real reason I actually started alternate tuning was because I was too lazy and impatient to learn your crazy standard tuning chord charts and such. all-guitar-chords.com is scurrryyyyyy


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## SirMyghin (Sep 1, 2011)

anne said:


> The real reason I actually started alternate tuning was because I was too lazy and impatient to learn your crazy standard tuning chord charts and such. all-guitar-chords.com is scurrryyyyyy



Chord charts are silly things anyway, BYOC - Build your own chords . Chord charts,sites and 'guitar chord bible' type books thrive on a lack of understanding. They give you the easy reward, you never look farther, they get more traffic/business.

Chord construction a bit reason I haven't used alternate tunings. I have never run into a chord/embellishment that I could not voice the way I want in standard tuning


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## Solodini (Sep 1, 2011)

SM, I agree with you to an extent: it's important to be able to play the music or an arrangement thereof without reliance on a specific tuning but the chord voicings a specific tuning brings up shouldn't be underappreciated. They're still good chord voicings and the altered tuning they may be in is no way inferior to standard tuning. If a tuning works for your expression then there's nothing wrong with it.


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## SirMyghin (Sep 1, 2011)

Solodini said:


> SM, I agree with you to an extent: it's important to be able to play the music or an arrangement thereof without reliance on a specific tuning but the chord voicings a specific tuning brings up shouldn't be underappreciated. They're still good chord voicings and the altered tuning they may be in is no way inferior to standard tuning. If a tuning works for your expression then there's nothing wrong with it.



I never said it was inferior, I just said in my experience I have never needed to change tunings to voice my chords. If I was going to change tuning though, I would go perfect 4ths, like my bass, as some of the voicings I get out of that are just too awesome. Then again I am tapping those voicings as some are veritably impossible


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## ElRay (Sep 1, 2011)

Ishan said:


> Go tell guys at Guitar Craft there NST tuning is wrong and limiting, they'll laugh their ass of at your expense


Too true. For those not familiar with NST (aka Fripp's New Standard Tuning, aka Crafty Tuning, aka C-Pentatonic Tuning) it's: CGDAEG -- The bottom four strings are tuned in 5th (same notes as a cello), the 2nd is up a 5th (to cover the range of a violin) and then the 1st string is up a minor 3rd (to add some easy extensions, density, etc.). Plus, this tuning gives extra range in the same number of strings, standard scale lengths, single scales, etc.

Then in the other directions, you have M3 Tunings (all Major 3rds). These actually reduce the range (a 7-string has the same range of a standard 6-string); however, they make denser, piano-like, chords possible; eliminate many chord substitutions; put at least two full octaves in one position; make sight reading easier, make single note runs easier, all scale & chord shapes movable, etc. The main down sides are that you lose the E-A-D drones that are common in "Classical" pieces and most Open/Folk chords are impossible to play. To many, that's not a loss at all.

Ray


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## Solodini (Sep 1, 2011)

SirMyghin said:


> I never said it was inferior, I just said in my experience I have never needed to change tunings to voice my chords. If I was going to change tuning though, I would go perfect 4ths, like my bass, as some of the voicings I get out of that are just too awesome. Then again I am tapping those voicings as some are veritably impossible



Fair enough. I guess I had just misinterpreted the statement about never encountering a chord you couldn't voice the way you wanted in standard as disregarding alt tuned chords in other people's stuff. My bad. I'm of the same mind as you when it comes to voicing my own stuff, for the most part. Stuff intended for 8 string FADGCFAD obviously needs reimagining for 6 string AFCGCF but it's all usually manageable in some sense. Often the tapping comes in to play, as you mentioned. As we all here know, however, the extended range is nice to have if you can use it.


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## drgamble (Sep 1, 2011)

SirMyghin said:


> Chord charts are silly things anyway, BYOC - Build your own chords . Chord charts,sites and 'guitar chord bible' type books thrive on a lack of understanding. They give you the easy reward, you never look farther, they get more traffic/business.
> 
> Chord construction a bit reason I haven't used alternate tunings. I have never run into a chord/embellishment that I could not voice the way I want in standard tuning



How would you play a chord like the than e-c#-f-a#-b-f# chord in standard tuning with quick changes to an open e major e-b-e-g#-b-e? The answer is you have to "fake" the voicing and yet it still don't sound right. By the way, this is the opening chords for "She Talks to Angels" played in open e. The second chord is fingered like a b7 chord in standard tuning. If I remeber right Soundgarden's "Good Eye Closed" uses a e-e-e-e-e-e tuning and there are definitely some voicings there that you can only hope to fake in standard.


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## SirMyghin (Sep 1, 2011)

drgamble said:


> How would you play a chord like the than e-c#-f-a#-b-f# chord in standard tuning with quick changes to an open e major e-b-e-g#-b-e? The answer is you have to "fake" the voicing and yet it still don't sound right. By the way, this is the opening chords for "She Talks to Angels" played in open e. The second chord is fingered like a b7 chord in standard tuning. If I remeber right Soundgarden's "Good Eye Closed" uses a e-e-e-e-e-e tuning and there are definitely some voicings there that you can only hope to fake in standard.



e-c#-f-a#-b-f#, first I would drop the f# from the f# chord, then I would probably also drop the 5th (c#), I would keep 3 a#, the 11 b, and in this case the split 7s (e and f). The e and a# are going to drown out most of the chord either way in my experience. so e f b a#, well beyond managable, and if I have room I'll bring back the root, which I should be able to do:

0x3302, if I wanted the C# I suppose I could voice it as 043302. That really is not that bad of a chord. I have seen much worse.


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## drgamble (Sep 1, 2011)

Like I said you could fake it, but the open tuning does make it easier to play the song with the right voicings. That's really the biggest thing is that it does make some chord changes a lot easier to play and some tuning like the Soundgarden example that can give you a different sound. It's definitely more popular with certain genres more than others and is really done just to make it easier to play. Come to think of it, that really the only reason for a drop tuning anyway, it makes it easier to play power chords and make changes faster.


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## SirMyghin (Sep 1, 2011)

drgamble said:


> Like I said you could fake it



I gave you the full chord, no omissions, it doesn't need to be faked  . Going from the Am6/9 (b5, +m6) to E maj is as simple as lifting the finger on the 1st string and sliding back a fret, while moving one other finger to cover the repeated octave E. I understand what you are saying, but it is best not to build this up as a daunting impossible task. I am sure there are better more difficult examples out there, I just know I could probably pull it off. 

As far as what you consider 'faking' it depends what is important, and in a chord like that, every note is not important. Seeing as you want to go to a E though, that chord is like Am6/9( no b5, + m6) on further reflection, or some other nonsense.


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## Explorer (Sep 1, 2011)

I like tunings like drop D and DADGAD on six-string, as well as standard tuning. Standard tuning makes it easy to play in several keys. Drop D and DADGAD impose some automatic filters regarding open strings, and so some things are easier to do. 

Turning away from guitar for a moment, the autoharp makes it easy to play chords corresponding to the chords on the chordbars. As one tries to get further and further away from what the chordbars impose, one must invest more and more technique in overcoming the built-in filters.

Similarly, tunings which make certain things easier by imposing filters are great for those things which incorporate those filters. Tunings which don't have such inherent filters (extensions of standard tuning, full fifths/fourths/thirds) require the brain and fingers to impose the filters, so those tunings are more versatile, but require more work to master.


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## starslight (Sep 7, 2011)

Standard tuning is great because it can give you almost any kind of sound if you've got the knowledge and/or creativity to find it. But sometimes you need a certain specialized kind of thing and standard just won't give it up, so you whore around a bit and catch all kinds of interesting harmonic diseases.


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## piggins411 (Sep 7, 2011)

While we're on the subject, can any of you tell me what these tunings would be? As in, are they open chords? Or do they seem designed to make a piece easier to play? One of my favorite bands uses some of these, and I was curious, especially about the ones involving capos


First, put a Capo on 3rd fret
Second, put a Banjo Capo on 5th fret, covering first 4 strings only
Once capos are in place, tune to G# F C F G# D#


E A F# D A D

D# A# G D# G# F

tune to E C G C A F
THEN put a Capo on 3rd fret

D# A# F D# G# F


First, tune to D B G D G C
THEN put a Capo on 8th fret


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## Winspear (Sep 8, 2011)

Well, the ones involving just a capo a purely using it to transpose the tuning. Nothing interesting there, just a way of playing in a transposed tuning without having to tune the guitar up and break your strings haha. Like how some 12 string guitarists tune down to D standard then capo the 2nd fret, to avoid breaking their octave G string. (Effectively having a short scale guitar in standard tuning).

"First, tune to D B G D G C
THEN put a Capo on 8th fret"

That's a pretty crazy tuning. D13sus4, sounds more like a Cmajsus2 with D in the bass to me. That's a really nice chord. I'll be using that haha! Of course, transpose that up to the 8th.

"D# A# F D# G# F"
Eb sus2 with added something


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## Solodini (Sep 8, 2011)

I'd call the DBGDGC tuning Gadd11, by looking at it but I haven't listened to it.

The D#A#FD#G#F tuning I would call Eb/D#9sus4.


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## starslight (Sep 8, 2011)

FWIW the band with the awesome tunings is This Town Needs Guns and they are pretty great. Watch their guitarist and it's obvious that, whatever the tunings' purposes are, they are not to make things simple (he's not fretting over the neck in tribute to MAB, he's doing it to get over the banjo capo).


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## anne (Sep 9, 2011)

piggins411 said:


> D# A# G D# G# F



It's Eb Bb G Eb Ab F. From there it should make more sense. It kills me when people post tunings because more often than not, they use the wrong accidentals and, while they get the pitches right, they miss the meanings of the notes.


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## Duelbart (Sep 9, 2011)

Aren't accidentals arbitrary when out of context?


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## celticelk (Sep 9, 2011)

^---Theoretically, yes, but I think Anne has a very good point: it's much easier to see that the tuning in question is Ebmaj with a 4 and 2 on top when it's written as flats than as sharps.


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## piggins411 (Sep 9, 2011)

starslight said:


> FWIW the band with the awesome tunings is This Town Needs Guns and they are pretty great. Watch their guitarist and it's obvious that, whatever the tunings' purposes are, they are not to make things simple (he's not fretting over the neck in tribute to MAB, he's doing it to get over the banjo capo).




I'm glad someone recognized it! Dude Tim Collis is a sick guitarist. I was wondering how many people here listened to them.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Sep 9, 2011)

I dont really use any weird tunings but I would if I wasnt so lazy. The weirdest tuning I've used is ADADGBE with my old dm band that used 6's in drop D.


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## 80H (Sep 10, 2011)

different tunings inspire new music. 
different tunings force new ways of thinking. 
different tunings open new possibilities. 

why _wouldn't_ someone investing time in the instrument explore tunings? so much of the fun that i have with the instrument is exploring and finding new things, since day 1. can't imagine playing in standard every day year in and year out

edit: 
"Finally, a Jeet Kune Do man who says Jeet Kune Do is exclusively Jeet Kune Do is simply not with it. He is still hung up on his self-closing resistance, in this case anchored down to reactionary pattern, and naturally is still bound by another modified pattern and can move within its limits. He has not digested the simple fact that truth exists outside all molds; pattern and awareness is never exclusive.
Again let me remind you Jeet Kune Do is just a name used, a boat to get one across, and once across it is to be discarded and not to be carried on one's back." - Bruce Lee


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