# Custom 8-string luthier



## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

Hey guys,

I'm really considering getting a custom 8-string guitar maybe in the next few months, and I've been considering who I should go to in turns of getting a custom, so I need your suggestions!

I was initially hoping to get one from Jesse the Illustrated Luthier since I've heard good things about him from both Bulb and Tosin, but I heard he's no longer making anything at least for the time being. 

I emailed Sherman but I haven't got any replies yet, but I've heard both good and not-so-good things about them.

I'm also considering Ran Guitars, as well as Oni Guitars. I've heard many good things about Bernie Rico Jr (especially from Bulb!), but his website is down at the moment so I couldn't get any information. Since I want a guitar based on an ESP shape (Arrow to be exact - Japanese only model for the time being), so I don't know if Bernie Rico Jr does custom shapes or not. 

Anyone has any suggestions of which luthier I should turn to? Obviously the price matters too, of course I'm prepared to pay a bit of money for the custom made instrument to my specifications, but not anything near the USD7600 from ESP's online quotation system. I'm hoping the price would be around USD 3000, and I have to say I don't know how much the Bernie Rico Jr and Oni will cost. Besides the shape, the configuration I want is quite basic actually. By the way, I haven't decided whether I want a fixed-scale or fan-fretted yet.

I also live in Hong Kong, so there is no "domestic luthier" for me... so the luthier will have to provide international shipping! Thanks guys!


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## ralphy1976 (Jan 10, 2011)

............ otherwise?


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## Metalus (Jan 10, 2011)

If not Bernie Rico, id go with ......... as well. He lives in Switzerland and does international shipping

http://.................com/


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## Metalus (Jan 10, 2011)

Oops forgot his name is banned

"............"


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

Metalus said:


> Oops forgot his name is banned
> 
> "............"



Then how did ralphy1976 type it out?

I haven't really looked into it but it doesn't seem there is a "customs" option on the webiste though? 

The pictures on the Ran Guitars site look like they're really well made though! Ran is not as recommended?


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## UnderTheSign (Jan 10, 2011)

By making a typo, the T at the end isn't supposed to be there. If you e-mail him, he'll work stuff out with you.

I think BRJ will end up being just a bit above 3 grand, haven't seen any prices on Oni's but I do know someone sold one on here for $2.2k

How set are you on the Arrow shape? I don't know about BRJ or Oni but I know Patrick (H) isn't a big fan of V's and most builders aren't too keen on building someone elses shapes. RAN would build you pretty much everything you want, though.


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

UnderTheSign said:


> By making a typo, the T at the end isn't supposed to be there. If you e-mail him, he'll work stuff out with you.
> 
> I think BRJ will end up being just a bit above 3 grand, haven't seen any prices on Oni's but I do know someone sold one on here for $2.2k
> 
> How set are you on the Arrow shape? I don't know about BRJ or Oni but I know Patrick (H) isn't a big fan of V's and most builders aren't too keen on building someone elses shapes. RAN would build you pretty much everything you want, though.



I wouldn't mind if it's a little over 3 grand, as long as I don't have to pay more than 50% deposit! 

I've been playing V's for quite some time and they really work for me, I don't necessarily want it to be EXACTLY the same as the ESP Arrow, but sometime along the sides of that, I wouldn't mind if the luthier does a little change to make it their style! In fact I probably don't want it to look exactly the same, don't want it to be an ESP-copy, but it could be ESP-inspired though! 

I did get a reply from Ran and I'm happy with the quote, just that I have to say I don't know much about it to make a decision right away. Like I mentioned above, the pictures do look like they're quality guitars though...


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## ralphy1976 (Jan 10, 2011)

yes, sorry it was not intentional, i have always typed his name wrongly (which use to annoy him a bit). Patrick's guitars are not 100% custom in the sense that he has a line of thought as to what his creation should be.

having said that he is not stupid, he will try to accommodate your ideas of course.


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

Thanks for the tips!

I'll send him a message and see how it'll turn out!


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## Asrial (Jan 10, 2011)

You could also try to order a dæmoness, I think they do ship internationally, and they can make pretty much any bodyshape.


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

Asrial said:


> You could also try to order a dæmoness, I think they do ship internationally, and they can make pretty much any bodyshape.



I've also looked at Dæmoness before, but I didn't look much further since it doesn't have 8-string as an option, obviously I haven't emailed to ask but just saying why I didn't consider it in the first place.

I think I might have to rephrase my question a bit... obviously different people have different preferences towards different brands... so there will be lots of opinions. I think I should ask...

1. If I can only choose ONE company, which one should it be that is reasonable? For example blackmachine is out of the question for its price and the wait time even if they still take orders.

2. Out of the ones mentioned, Ran, Oni, Bernie Rico Jr, ......... or even Dæmoness (if they offer 8-string), is there any one that I *SHOULD NOT* go with? Or any one of them would make equally as beautiful instruments that will just be fine?

Thanks once again!


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## Eric Christian (Jan 10, 2011)

One I'm considering is Guerilla Guitars.


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## TMM (Jan 10, 2011)

I can't speak to all the luthiers you mentioned, but all (at least at some point or another) have made some really nice, high-quality guitars. That said, the level of service provided by those luthiers is nowhere near to equal across the board.

Speaking from my personal experience, I could not recommend a better builder than Dan @ Oni. Seriously, he's very good at staying in contact, working with you to get exactly what you want... and that's all beside the fact that he's a level 99 Samurai guitar builder.

Mine:


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

TMM said:


> I can't speak to all the luthiers you mentioned, but all (at least at some point or another) have made some really nice, high-quality guitars. That said, the level of service provided by those luthiers is nowhere near to equal across the board.
> 
> Speaking from my personal experience, I could not recommend a better builder than Dan @ Oni. Seriously, he's very good at staying in contact, working with you to get exactly what you want... and that's all beside the fact that he's a level 99 Samurai guitar builder.
> 
> Mine:



Man that's an awesome looking guitar! 

Actually I have also emailed Dan @ Oni and he hasn't replied yet, probably because it's sleeping time in Australia! 

I've also looked at Oni Guitars before, and fell in love at first site, I believe it was from the post where Bulb played someone's Carbon 8, I just fell in love with it... I would totally really consider getting one of those if it's not my first custom, as I'd mainly want to go with the V shape. However if there is one thing I don't like as much, that would be Oni's headstock design... 

I heard that Dan has a Gojira V somewhere although I've never seen it, I would love to though... I did see a draft picture of an Oni V shape guitar but I don't know if that's the one.



Thaeon said:


> V!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If Dan would take the ESP Arrow as reference and give it some Oni touches... 

By the way, here is the mockup I did for the ESP Arrow... basically I just put a 8 string neck from Stephen Carpenter's guitar onto the 6-string Arrow body... which is my intention anyways, I would like to keep the width of the 6-string just with the fatter 8-string neck.






Although the specs would be all different, for example I'd want the ABM single string saddle instead of the Hipshots, possibly just one bridge pickup etc...


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## technomancer (Jan 10, 2011)

Oni, KxK, Daemoness are some reputable builders that I'd look at for an eight string... after his behavior on this site I would stay clear of Switzerlander and Sherman has been ill and has a lot of customers waiting for their instruments currently 

If you're completely hooked on copying an ESP design you'll pretty much have to go to Ran as none of the builders in this thread will do exact copies. If you just want a V shape and are willing to work it out KxK would probably be willing to build something in that style and Oni has worked on a V design (obviously from the pics above). Daemoness also does outstanding work, but I have no idea if Dylan would be down for a custom V shape.

Couple picks of my purple KxK beastie


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## OrsusMetal (Jan 10, 2011)

Yeah, not many luthiers are too keen on doing copies. If you are dead set on the V, I'm betting Ran would be your best bet to get the design just the way you want. Although, If I were you, I'd go for an Oni. There will be one in my future.


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

technomancer said:


> Oni, KxK, Daemoness are some reputable builders that I'd look at for an eight string... after his behavior on this site I would stay clear of Switzerlander and Sherman has been ill and has a lot of customers waiting for their instruments currently
> 
> If you're completely hooked on copying an ESP design you'll pretty much have to go to Ran as none of the builders in this thread will do exact copies. If you just want a V shape and are willing to work it out KxK would probably be willing to build something in that style and Oni has worked on a V design (obviously from the pics above). Daemoness also does outstanding work, but I have no idea if Dylan would be down for a custom V shape.
> 
> Couple picks of my purple KxK beastie



Actually when I was researching earlier here and I came across your pictures also, I was amazed at the purple parts! Also a gorgeous guitar!



OrsusMetal said:


> Yeah, not many luthiers are too keen on doing copies. If you are dead set on the V, I'm betting Ran would be your best bet to get the design just the way you want. Although, If I were you, I'd go for an Oni. There will be one in my future.



Seems like Oni is a popular choice eh? But yea like I mentioned, actually I don't want an exact copy of the ESP Arrow, but I just want something close to that, actually hoping a luthier would help me "modify" one  I already got the brief quote from RAN, and although I'm happy with it, but I also don't want an exact copy that's why I'm still looking around.

I guess I'll just wait for Dan to reply to see if he's willing to work something out! And if Oni... fanned or not fanned?  Meanwhile I'll also check out KxK. Thanks again guys!


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## Bobulot (Jan 10, 2011)

+




=
?




This is probably nowhere near as balanced as the original Oni V design though.


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## CONTEMPT (Jan 10, 2011)

UnderTheSign said:


> By making a typo, the T at the end isn't supposed to be there. If you e-mail him, he'll work stuff out with you.
> 
> I think BRJ will end up being just a bit above 3 grand, haven't seen any prices on Oni's but I do know someone sold one on here for $2.2k
> 
> How set are you on the Arrow shape? I don't know about BRJ or Oni but I know Patrick (H) isn't a big fan of V's and most builders aren't too keen on building someone elses shapes. RAN would build you pretty much everything you want, though.



I think I remember hearing somewhere that the average Oni pricetag is around $4k, but I'm not 100% on that.


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## CFB (Jan 10, 2011)

Dan told me a year ago that the multiscales start at $4k. Remember that prices are not fixed and will change over time. If you want to know what it would cost today you would have to e-mail him. I'm writing this so nobody comes along and reads this in six months and is pissed that the prices may have changed.


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## troyguitar (Jan 10, 2011)

That Oni RR8 looks perfect in its original design (of course I say that because I started building myself a fanned RR8 2 years ago with an almost identical design ). I bet that would have amazing balance. If I were buying a super expensive custom, that is where I'd go. However, if you want to spend a little less money (and not get a multi-scale) I'd probably go with Ran or KxK - whichever ends up cheaper.


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## UnderTheSign (Jan 10, 2011)

noizfx said:


> 2. Out of the ones mentioned, Ran, Oni, Bernie Rico Jr, ......... or even Dæmoness (if they offer 8-string), is there any one that I *SHOULD NOT* go with? Or any one of them would make equally as beautiful instruments that will just be fine?


There have been some complaints about RAN but their overall reputation is still pretty good. Some people don't like Huf very much because of previous things happening on these boards but I have yet to hear about an unhappy customer. Never heard anything bad about BRJ, Oni or Daemoness.

I'll second whoever it said though - if you want a copy, you're best off going with RAN (or some another eastern European builder for that matter). With all due respect to them of course, those seem to be the only ones that have no problems at all reproducing an existing shape, mainly due to how copyright works over there.


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## noizfx (Jan 10, 2011)

Bobulot said:


> +
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow that's near perfect! I would shift the "concave center" more to the right side, like the RR, and with a slightly shorter horn, then reverse the headstock so that the tuners are on the top, then that'd be perfect! Then if Dan would give me a quote...



CFB said:


> Dan told me a year ago that the multiscales start at $4k. Remember that prices are not fixed and will change over time.



Yea in that case maybe I won't get it fanned... since I've never tried one I'm afraid I won't be able to get used to it either  I've seen people who can still shred like crazy on the multiscale but I know that's not gonna be me lol.

I asked Rob at KxK and he's willing to do it, but let's just say the price is more attractive at Ran... however even though Dariusz at Ran is willing to do an exact replica, but I still want to change it somehow as I also don't want an exact copy.


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## elite8 (Jan 11, 2011)

*mod edit: try saying what happened with your personal Sherman order instead of making epic generalizations next time. Last warning before a ban comes down*


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## noizfx (Jan 11, 2011)

elite8 said:


> dont go with sherman whatever you do.



Yea man thanks for the tips, just learned that apparently Sherman has been sick as pointed out by technomancer so that sucks, but since he never replied so I guess I still wouldn't be able to start getting my order made by him even if i didn't find out about his current situation!


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## daniboy (Jan 12, 2011)

i believe dan resides somewhere near brisbane? queensland is having massive flood issues even brissy is not spared. maybe that's why you haven't heard back. hope dan is fine.


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## noizfx (Jan 12, 2011)

daniboy said:


> i believe dan resides somewhere near brisbane? queensland is having massive flood issues even brissy is not spared. maybe that's why you haven't heard back. hope dan is fine.



Yea he's located around the Brisbane area from what the Oni site says, and I had the exact same thought! I heard it's like around 75% of Queensland is affected by the flood so that sucks, definitely hope Dan is fine! Although I also can't wait for him to reply me but I'm sure you can understand that feeling!


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## thrsher (Jan 12, 2011)

you should check out vik guitars.


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## noizfx (Jan 12, 2011)

thrsher said:


> you should check out vik guitars.



Thanks I'll go look into it, although I don't know if they do custom shapes...


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## FrostyTheDroMan (Jan 12, 2011)

That Oni looks SAAWEEEEEEET!!


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## noizfx (Jan 13, 2011)

FrostyTheDroMan said:


> That Oni looks SAAWEEEEEEET!!



If only it can come true


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## Jzbass25 (Jan 13, 2011)

That kxk is soo purple but it gives me happy feelings hahaha


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## Daken1134 (Jan 17, 2011)

What about Roter? he will do any design you want regardless starting a pretty reasonable price. im sure you can get just about whatever you would like under 3 grand


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## technomancer (Jan 17, 2011)

Daken1134 said:


> What about Roter? he will do any design you want regardless starting a pretty reasonable price. im sure you can get just about whatever you would like under 3 grand



Yeah what a genius idea, quick go order from somebody that got banned from here for fucking over their customers. BRILLIANT!


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## fabeau (Jan 17, 2011)

Hello everybody!
I am also looking for a custom fanned 8 string. I mailed with Dan some weeks ago (before the flood issues actually). I definitely want an Oni Guitar but he told me that waiting times are 12-18 months  ..so I may block my slot and having another guitar. I contacted some luthiers recently and for price/time/reliability I am currently taking into consideration mainly Grosmann or Ran. Do you have any suggestions between these two? I am mainly considering european solutions, just for avoiding paying the 20% more on custom taxes!


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## technomancer (Jan 17, 2011)

fabeau said:


> Hello everybody!
> I am also looking for a custom fanned 8 string. I mailed with Dan some weeks ago (before the flood issues actually). I definitely want an Oni Guitar but he told me that waiting times are 12-18 months  ..so I may block my slot and having another guitar. I contacted some luthiers recently and for price/time/reliability I am currently taking into consideration mainly Grosmann or Ran. Do you have any suggestions between these two? I am mainly considering european solutions, just for avoiding paying the 20% more on custom taxes!



Wait for the Oni


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## fabeau (Jan 17, 2011)

technomancer said:


> Wait for the Oni




Because of the superb quality of Dan's works of because you suggest to stay far from those two luthiers?


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## noizfx (Jan 17, 2011)

fabeau said:


> Because of the superb quality of Dan's works of because you suggest to stay far from those two luthiers?



I'm also stuck in the same dilemma! LOL... And good thing I didn't look into Roter, I'm still new here so I don't quite know what happened before but good thing I avoided it 

From what I heard from some of the guys here, there is nothing wrong with Ran. Apparently there had been some issues and little complaints here and there (research showed that UPS screwed up the shipping to two customers both in Spain so they got the wrong guitars), but overall reputation is still good? So I also hope there isn't any reasons that I shouldn't go with Ran, because that's the one that seems more possible to me now.

However though, I have to say I do want an Oni more... Dan actually emailed me after a while saying that he's extremely busy especially after the flood, and like mentioned, 12 to 18 months wait. Even though I really want an Oni, but the price is quite significantly higher... And I might not get the design I like. Dan said he doesn't copy directly, which I totally respect, which in fact I don't an exact replica either. Hopefully I can work something out with him, however he hasn't replied yet after that.

Again, the Oni would be much more expensive and a longer wait time, so I might not be able to afford/wait. In that case I would have to go with Ran, so I hope there isn't anything bad about the Ran either!


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## fabeau (Jan 17, 2011)

Noizfx I think I will go in your same direction 
Both grosmann and Ran asks an honest price for an 8 string fanned custom. I guess I will buy from one of them and then patiently wait for Dan's baby  Well at that time I may ask him for a 9 string!


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## technomancer (Jan 17, 2011)

fabeau said:


> Because of the superb quality of Dan's works of because you suggest to stay far from those two luthiers?



Dan's work is fantastic  Ran seems to do some quality work, though there have apparently been some recent horror stories (there's a thread about Ran in the 7 string section IIRC). Grossman was banned from here for having issues following the rules and being obnoxious.

Also if you're interested in a super-strat shaped 8 with fanned frets KxK is looking at doing a discounted run if there is enough interest. There's a thread on it in the Dealers section.


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## noizfx (Jan 17, 2011)

technomancer said:


> Dan's work is fantastic  Ran seems to do some quality work, though there have apparently been some recent horror stories (there's a thread about Ran in the 7 string section IIRC). Grossman was banned from here for having issues following the rules and being obnoxious.
> 
> Also if you're interested in a super-strat shaped 8 with fanned frets KxK is looking at doing a discounted run if there is enough interest. There's a thread on it in the Dealers section.



Only if Dan will have the time to reply and work something out with me, and I might sell a kidney for an Oni!


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## technomancer (Jan 17, 2011)

noizfx said:


> Only if Dan will have the time to reply and work something out with me, and I might sell a kidney for an Oni!



Yeah if you asked for a quote it sometimes takes Dan a bit to research things and get back to you.


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## fabeau (Jan 18, 2011)

I see, Techno..thanks for suggestions.
What about ViK Guitars? They look amazing..and he seems very reliable.


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## bostjan (Jan 18, 2011)

As a proud owner of two Oni's, I recommend them 100%.

Think of it this way - would you rather wait 18 months for the guitar that will have every option you've ever wanted and change the way you look at guitars, or spend your money on something else and 18 months later, still not have the guitar that will be everything you've ever needed in an instrument?

The Oni pickups are as good, if not better, as any high-end boutique pickups I've ever tried for ERG in metal.

As far as multiscale instruments, I feel that it is enough of a tonal advantage to get multiscale no matter how many strings the instrument has.


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## noizfx (Jan 18, 2011)

bostjan said:


> As a proud owner of two Oni's, I recommend them 100%.
> 
> Think of it this way - would you rather wait 18 months for the guitar that will have every option you've ever wanted and change the way you look at guitars, or spend your money on something else and 18 months later, still not have the guitar that will be everything you've ever needed in an instrument?
> 
> ...



The truth is, Dan's first reply was that he might not be able to help me out due to the shape that I want. However like I said a couple of times, I do not want an exact replica of the ESP Arrow either, and Dan himself is also working on some V designs so he said he _MIGHT_ be willing to do it.

If Dan is willing to do it and work out a design that we're both happy with, even if it costs more I might still go with the Oni even though I'll have to save up more for the deposit. I have enough money for the deposit after I get paid next week for the Ran, but not the Oni. If anything, actually I've been wanting an Oni for quite some time now so I might just go with his regular Ebony 8 model! If I just haven't been wanting that Arrow for a while, I would totally just love the Oni 8...

Speaking of pickups, you would also rate the Oni pickup high up eh? Initially I was going for the Blackout 8s, then I wanted the BKP Painkillers, but you're also saying that the Oni is on par or better than those? You think the Oni pickups are good for those djenty tones also?


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## fabeau (Jan 18, 2011)

Thanks for sharing you useful opinion, Bostjan!
My other "problem" on having an amazing but expensive Oni guitar as my first custom is that I am not so sure of specs. Which scale? Maybe I get a 25.5-28.5 and find that is not what I really want. Same for woods.
So it could be better to "make experiment" on a cheaper guitar and then have my ultimate Oni guitar in a couple of years.
About the multiscale choice I am actually going in that direction moreover for having a good tension on lower strings while keeping relatively small diameter and fast playability on high strings. With my current 8 string is impossible to have a fast picking in 0.90 F# string


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## fabeau (Jan 18, 2011)

noizfx said:


> Speaking of pickups, you would also rate the Oni pickup high up eh? Initially I was going for the Blackout 8s, then I wanted the BKP Painkillers, but you're also saying that the Oni is on par or better than those? You think the Oni pickups are good for those djenty tones also?



You may use passive Oni pickups coupled with Blackouts preamp!


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## noizfx (Jan 18, 2011)

fabeau said:


> You may use passive Oni pickups coupled with Blackouts preamp!



Thought of that before too, I was thinking about doing the same thing with my 6-string Q-Tuner but I heard adding the Blackouts preamp will make the tone pretty much the Blackouts, in that case I might as well go directly with them instead of using the BKPs or the Oni pickups?

Yes it will be cool if it can hold the characteristics of both pickups, but again, I heard it'll sound mostly like the Blackouts.


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## noizfx (Jan 24, 2011)

Pretty sure I'll be getting an Oni now!


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