# Mayones prices go up too much !!!



## Ziricote (Nov 27, 2016)

Hi everyone,

I tried spec a custom Mayones last month and retail price was in the $7000. Dealer told me I can receive the 40% off retail on custom order that has retail over $7000. This means my price was going to be only $4200. I was very happy with this dealer. I contact this dealer a few days ago to make order but things change. I received the email today telling me that the Mayones company has increase prices by 10% for dealers starting the this November. Instead of increase the total retail prices on the paper for customers, they simply increase the dealer price by 10%. This means the dealers cannot give the same deals anymore. My same guitar is up to the $4900 now as he say best deals I can received is only the 30% off retail now to make up for the 10% in loss he gets on all new orders going the forward from here. I dont want the Mayones anymore and Im sad. This is annoying 

I know this guitars are the best but I cant afford this guitars. What else should I buy? Maybe the Suhr? But they dont do the binding and Hannes bridge options I needed with the Mayones.


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## Yodel (Nov 27, 2016)

From a European point of view those prices are ridiculous (same as the price tags on Mesas here in the old world)... Buy domestic, make America great again


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## Ziricote (Nov 27, 2016)

Yodel said:


> From a European point of view those prices are ridiculous (same as the price tags on Mesas here in the old world)... Buy domestic, make America great again



The dealer in US says prices are around $200 for customs into US, $150 to shipping, then if he does free shipping for me then another $100, so prices will always be in the $450 more in the US. That is why the Mayones is always a little more in the US. I tried order from dealer in EU and he said $150 for shipping and alerted me to my customs fees could be in the $200 so I had to add $350 to the price in total. I figured to just order from my own dealer in this country I live in but now the prices increase by 10%. I also asked why if the US dollar is strong does the prices stay in the US dollar and he says because the Mayones company buys most of their supplies through the US so they are paying more by their standards


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## narad (Nov 27, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> I also asked why if the US dollar is strong does the prices stay in the US dollar and he says because the Mayones company buys most of their supplies through the US so they are paying more by their standards



Except that the biggest component in Mayones pricing is labor...


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## possumkiller (Nov 27, 2016)

Yodel said:


> From a European point of view those prices are ridiculous (same as the price tags on Mesas here in the old world)... Buy domestic, make America great again



While I've played many awesome American guitars, I have yet to find one that matches the attention to details of ESP custom shop.


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## narad (Nov 27, 2016)

possumkiller said:


> While I've played many awesome American guitars, I have yet to find one that matches the attention to details of ESP custom shop.



Suhr, Tyler, Anderson


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## ramses (Nov 27, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> ... $4200 ...



If you were willing to pay that for a Mayones, you should look into PRS or Suhr.


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## Yodel (Nov 27, 2016)

narad said:


> Except that the biggest component in Mayones pricing is labor...



Polish labor is dirt cheap, like US looking at Mexico-cheap


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## Ziricote (Nov 27, 2016)

ramses said:


> If you were willing to pay that for a Mayones, you should look into PRS or Suhr.



It was a good deal for the guitar I design, had highly figured walnut top with custom inlays and all the hardware and special knobs, piezo, and exotic neck. I dont want PRS. I dont like the PRS guitars. They dont even do the normal scale length or use SS frets and Suhr wont do the Schaller Hannes bridge I want. Also custom PRS quote was 11K when I try to spec one


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 27, 2016)

god at 4K you can get completely custom guitars from a number of builders. You could get a waghorn or daemoness at that price. I've always thought Mayones were quite overpriced for the options I've seen on them.


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## Yodel (Nov 27, 2016)

With current USD/EUR conversion they charge you guys roughly twice as much for e.g. a mid-tier Setius (~2000&#8364; vs. ~4000$); think global-buy local.

I don't think that no American luthier is proficient enough to understand the technical drawings that come with a Schaller Hannes (it even comes with a stencil drawing to tape to the body) and the 7string model costs ~170&#8364; here in Europe.


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## Rawkmann (Nov 27, 2016)

I don't have any first hand experience, but maybe look into BlacKat Guitars? I follow them on Facebook and their guitars look amazing and prices seem reasonable.


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## narad (Nov 27, 2016)

Yodel said:


> With current USD/EUR conversion they charge you guys roughly twice as much for e.g. a mid-tier Setius (~2000&#8364; vs. ~4000$); think global-buy local.



This is just silly. 
A.) A nicely-spec'd setius will come in < $3200. A poorly spec'd one much cheaper.
B.) Salaries in these countries are entirely different. They're price with respect to local markets.

If there's a huge inequality in such markets, as there are in the recent post-Brexit world, then just buy a Mayones from an international dealer and pay in euro. I.e., think global-buy global.

It's cheap to import into the US -- 9 times out of 10 I never got charged on things going into the US, and when I did it was like 8%. Us guys in 20% VAT type of countries have a much harder time with luxury items. Plus you even get to skim the VAT off dealers in Germany or so when you buy from the US. Definitely had some really good deals going this route before.

FWIW OP: I definitely wouldn't care about a hannes bridge when it comes to specs. Hipshot sounds much better.


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## Andromalia (Nov 27, 2016)

Mayones stopped being good value a long time ago. At that price I'll pick a PRS or a high end US brand with a much better resale value.


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## OlisDead (Nov 27, 2016)

Andromalia said:


> Mayones stopped being good value a long time ago. At that price I'll pick a PRS or a high end US brand with a much better resale value.




This. And I saw a few ones with paint flaws recently that don't make me wanna pay the price tag.


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## feraledge (Nov 27, 2016)

Yodel said:


> I don't think that no American luthier is proficient enough to understand the technical drawings that come with a Schaller Hannes (it even comes with a stencil drawing to tape to the body) and the 7string model costs ~170 here in Europe.



Sully gets the goods.


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## Casper777 (Nov 27, 2016)

Owning 2 Regius (6 and 7) I like them very much but I can also say that those are some heavily overpriced guitars!! Nothing in a Mayones justifies a 4500$price tag.


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## JMO831 (Nov 27, 2016)

Casper777 said:


> Owning 2 Regius (6 and 7) I like them very much but I can also say that those are some heavily overpriced guitars!! Nothing in a Mayones justifies a 4500$price tag.



I would have to agree. And don't get me wrong, I love Mayones. I own/have owned a couple Regius models and 2 MBC Duvell Elites. But with that being said, I probably wouldn't pay over $3500 for a Mayones. 

They are incredibly smooth guitars and include a very high level of attention to detail. But these incremental money grabs have really turned me away. And even now, U.S. dealers are selling decently spec'd models for close to 5k. Can you imagine how the domestic market is going to be now?!

I'm also intersted to see how top dealers in Europe factor in this price bump, specifically within the context of U.S. buyers. I find that buying from these dealers is WAY cheaper than in the U.S.


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## Hollowway (Nov 27, 2016)

NFW I'd pay that for a mayones. Waaay too many other options out there for that kind of cash.


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## Pikka Bird (Nov 28, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> ... the Mayones company buys most of their supplies through the US ...



Hardware too? Schaller and ABM are German so they should look into a direct connection if they don't already have one.


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## thinkpad20 (Nov 28, 2016)

feraledge said:


> Sully gets the goods.



What is this gorgeous instrument?


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## SullyGuitars (Nov 28, 2016)

thinkpad20 said:


> What is this gorgeous instrument?



That's one of my 624 models that I built earlier this year. Glad you like it!

Sully


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## laxu (Nov 28, 2016)

While the Schaller Hannes bridge is kinda cool, does Mayones really do anything that you couldn't get from Kiesel for example?


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## narad (Nov 28, 2016)

laxu said:


> While the Schaller Hannes bridge is kinda cool, does Mayones really do anything that you couldn't get from Kiesel for example?



Make a good guitar?


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## pylyo (Nov 28, 2016)

narad said:


> Make a good guitar?





wanted to write down almost the same thing haha.

btw, when are we getting back those darn likes?


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## pylyo (Nov 28, 2016)

repost


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## OlisDead (Nov 28, 2016)

I loved all the Mayones I've had (I was an endorsee for a few years a while ago) but I must admit that the asked price for one is a bit too much now considering most of them have really weak figured tops. And I'd be pissed to have those kind of paint flaws at that price point :

























It might be nothing for most of people but it's a big deal to me at that price. I must admit that playability is really nice on Mayones though.


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## FourT6and2 (Nov 28, 2016)

That price is ridiculous. Contact Omega Music in Belgium. They can hook you up. You'll wind up paying less by buying from a dealer in Europe than from a dealer in the USA.


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## JMO831 (Nov 28, 2016)

OlisDead said:


> I loved all the Mayones I've had (I was an endorsee for a few years a while ago) but I must admit that the asked price for one is a bit too much now considering most of them have really weak figured tops. And I'd be pissed to have those kind of paint flaws at that price point :
> 
> 
> 
> ...



To be fair, that green Duvell was designed as a prototype (this is confirmed by Mayones). 

I agree with the comment above me, Omega is great. I actually am about to pick up that green ebony guitar they are selling. They will hook you up.

Weirdly, I find a lot of US buyers "in the know" purchasing Mayones from Europe. And then I also know that some Europe-based buyers go to U.S. markets because of the VAT.


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## OlisDead (Nov 28, 2016)

JMO831 said:


> To be fair, that green Duvell was designed as a prototype (this is confirmed by Mayones).
> 
> I agree with the comment above me, Omega is great. I actually am about to pick up that green ebony guitar they are selling. They will hook you up.
> 
> Weirdly, I find a lot of US buyers "in the know" purchasing Mayones from Europe. And then I also know that some Europe-based buyers go to U.S. markets because of the VAT.



I've seen this on many Duvells, not prototypes. I never saw this on any Regius/Setius though but it's a silly mistake that keeps me away from buying one. It's kinda amateur to see such beautiful guitars with those paint drips.


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## Jonathan20022 (Nov 28, 2016)

Mayones is worth the 3.5k range that you see them selling for, if you're paying more than 4k for one and it isn't a masterbuilt or a decked out custom build then it's not worth it.

Also the flaws that dude pointed out are like, sub miniscule. I've seen M2M strandbergs with severe paint leaks past the binding, and those cost up to twice what a Mayones will cost you. I've had 9 or so Mayos before, and if anything they're consistent across the board. Been disappointed personally with a few brands recently, a lot of which are held in extremely high regard from people who aren't customers/owners. The guitars are awesome and if someone enjoys it they'll pay what they feel is worth it to own that guitar.


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 28, 2016)

narad said:


> Make a good guitar?



them's fighting words boy


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## mastapimp (Nov 28, 2016)

One option is to talk to another dealer. They should be familiar with the price sheets and they may be able to get you a better deal. Don't feel like you're locked in unless you've made a deposit or a down payment already. The 40% off MSRP is kinda standard, but you can find some people willing to go lower, especially if you pre-pay. 

Second, if you've spec'd out the guitar and you're willing to drop over $4K, it's kind of ridiculous to jump to another brand you're unsure of. If you are dead-set on binding and a hannes bridge and want to stick with the dealer, just save up a little longer...it'll be worth it. You don't want to drop that kind of money on something that you're going to complain about later. 

I spec'd out a masterbuilt regius 7 wasabi with a few custom mods and paid $5350. In the end, i got the exact guitar I wanted with all the features and have had zero regrets. If i was off by a few hundred dollars and settled for something different, I may be singing a different tune.


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## narad (Nov 28, 2016)

KnightBrolaire said:


> them's fighting words boy



Of course not all Kiesels are bad guitars. Just order yours with the delete crap guitar option (code: -CRAP)*

*no return-policy


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## OlisDead (Nov 28, 2016)

Jonathan20022 said:


> Mayones is worth the 3.5k range that you see them selling for, if you're paying more than 4k for one and it isn't a masterbuilt or a decked out custom build then it's not worth it.
> 
> Also the flaws that dude pointed out are like, sub miniscule. I've seen M2M strandbergs with severe paint leaks past the binding, and those cost up to twice what a Mayones will cost you. I've had 9 or so Mayos before, and if anything they're consistent across the board. Been disappointed personally with a few brands recently, a lot of which are held in extremely high regard from people who aren't customers/owners. The guitars are awesome and if someone enjoys it they'll pay what they feel is worth it to own that guitar.



"That dude" thinks it's unacceptable at that price tag no matter if it's a Mayones or a Strandberg. If you accept it, it's your opinion and your way to set the bar of "high end guitars" but it's not mine.
Just as you I've owned/seen/played hundreds of guitars and I know many high end brands that don't have this kind of problems.

As said earlier Mayones are good guitars but to me they're becoming too expensive for what you have. Just my opinion on the matter.


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## Jonathan20022 (Nov 28, 2016)

I didn't say it wasn't unacceptable, I'm just saying that if you have to point it out zoom into a photo to show someone that then it's not too big of a deal in my eyes. A neck gap is unacceptable, poor construction, badly cured woods, poor fretwork. Trust me, every one of them has slipped up every now and then, let's not kid ourselves. Instruments will stop having minute and minuscule issues when you remove the aspect of a person working on it at any one time in it's production.

Price is subjective on the matter, I'd pay 3.5-4k for a Mayo depending on it's specs. But I know I really enjoy the ones I own.


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## Ziricote (Nov 28, 2016)

mastapimp said:


> One option is to talk to another dealer. They should be familiar with the price sheets and they may be able to get you a better deal. Don't feel like you're locked in unless you've made a deposit or a down payment already. The 40% off MSRP is kinda standard, but you can find some people willing to go lower, especially if you pre-pay.



But this is the whole point of this thread started. I am told that the days of 40% off retail for us is gone. The dealers dont receive less than 40% even. No dealers is going to be able to do better than 25%-30% off ever again. I did try another dealer and its true. That is my point but I appreciate your other points. I might just buy this guitar for the $4900 and there will be NGD eventually


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## narad (Nov 28, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> But this is the whole point of this thread started. I am told that the days of 40% off retail for us is gone. The dealers dont receive less than 40% even. No dealers is going to be able to do better than 25%-30% off ever again. I did try another dealer and its true. That is my point but I appreciate your other points. I might just buy this guitar for the $4900 and there will be NGD eventually



What are your specs that come out to $4900? Seems hard to believe the price is reasonable given all the decked out $4k Mayones models out there.


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## budda (Nov 28, 2016)

Why do you absolutely have to have the Hannes bridge?

If you have $4200 for a guitar, order a fully customized guitar built by a luthier with a good reputation. It doesn't have to say "Mayones" to be incredible.


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## Ziricote (Nov 28, 2016)

narad said:


> What are your specs that come out to $4900? Seems hard to believe the price is reasonable given all the decked out $4k Mayones models out there.





budda said:


> Why do you absolutely have to have the Hannes bridge?
> 
> If you have $4200 for a guitar, order a fully customized guitar built by a luthier with a good reputation. It doesn't have to say "Mayones" to be incredible.



OK I decided to not do Hannes bridge. Everyone says they dont sound good because saddles is made from plastic? Ive heard Hipshot is amazing but standard ABM bridge and TOM bridge sound best? Im cut my costs by going normal pickups and normal ABM bridge. Im doing custom inlay, walnut top, SS frets, Hybrid binding, TEW maple neck, Carbon reinforcement neck rods, luminlay, gloss top and matte backside, Pale Moon ebony fretboard, scalloped fretboard. I wanted piezo but costs is too high too. I might have to cut some specs. Im still working on it 

I do not want normal luthier. I get into situation I dont know regarding unknown reputation and too long build time. I will never wait this 2-3 years. My only options is Kiesel, Mayo, Suhr for decent build times and quality and experience with the 7 strings.


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## narad (Nov 28, 2016)

I mean, depending on the inlay. But clearly a similar Mayo doesn't need to break the bank:

https://reverb.com/item/3485618-mayones-regius-7-misha-mansoor-mmcw-claro-walnut


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## budda (Nov 28, 2016)

Well Kiesel has their fair share of issues, Mayones just had a price jump... I'd be contacting Suhr.

Or buying two really nice PRS on the used market (but that's because I know I like PRS).


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## Ziricote (Nov 28, 2016)

narad said:


> I mean, depending on the inlay. But clearly a similar Mayo doesn't need to break the bank:
> 
> https://reverb.com/item/3485618-mayones-regius-7-misha-mansoor-mmcw-claro-walnut



Thank you, but this one is used and location in Europe. I do not want used guitars. Its also says $150 for shipping. I will also have to pay taxes with customs. Plus I dont have full money now and dealer says new order deposit is only $1400


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## budda (Nov 28, 2016)

If you don't have the money, why are you looking at $4,200 guitars?

That is where a wait of 2 years would be handy - to come up with the rest of that money.

There's tax when you order from the dealer too.

Buy the guitar when you actually have $4200 + taxes.


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## narad (Nov 28, 2016)

budda said:


> Well Kiesel has their fair share of issues, Mayones just had a price jump... I'd be contacting Suhr.
> 
> Or buying two really nice PRS on the used market (but that's because I know I like PRS).



But yea, did we not learn our lesson from last time? Mayones had a "price jump" in 2013/2014, which resulted in none of their guitars selling in the US, and dealers ultimately slashing prices on everything. Mayones was cheaper last year than they were the year before. I don't know why they would raise prices again, but it seems to only affect those people who want to put in US custom orders -- all the in stocks go on sale.


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## budda (Nov 28, 2016)

narad said:


> But yea, did we not learn our lesson from last time? Mayones had a "price jump" in 2013/2014, which resulted in none of their guitars selling in the US, and dealers ultimately slashing prices on everything. Mayones was cheaper last year than they were the year before. I don't know why they would raise prices again, but it seems to only affect those people who want to put in US custom orders.



I can't give you an accurate figure, but I can tell you that most companies world-wide have annual price increases. A new fender strat has almost doubled in price in the last 2 years alone.

Personally I don't know why the OP is so hung up on Mayones when there's many other places to spend his money for a guitar as equally well built.

Hell if he buys in Canada he saves 30% based on exchange rates alone.

I find it interesting that he doesn't even have half the cost of a brand new guitar available but he's very worried about buying new. Money management is important, even if people like to pretend it isn't.

Signed:

guy with small balance owing on a guitar who's about to start putting away for his next tour van.


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## Hollowway (Nov 28, 2016)

budda said:


> Personally I don't know why the OP is so hung up on Mayones when there's many other places to spend his money for a guitar as equally well built.



Well, this is the same guy that was asking about buying a $14,000 B2.


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## Snarpaasi (Nov 29, 2016)

budda said:


> Well Kiesel has their fair share of issues, Mayones just had a price jump... I'd be contacting Suhr.
> 
> Or buying two really nice PRS on the used market (but that's because I know I like PRS).



What kind of issues Kiesel has had lately? I've only read about 12th fret markers from which the other was not aligned correctly. The other one that comes to my mind is thin bursts.


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## KnightBrolaire (Nov 29, 2016)

Snarpaasi said:


> What kind of issues Kiesel has had lately? I've only read about 12th fret markers from which the other was not aligned correctly. The other one that comes to my mind is thin bursts.



I haven't heard about anything recently either. They've been churning out good stuff the last couple of months.


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## Maddreg (Nov 29, 2016)

Wow, 4k+... Isn't Padalka or Lepsky preferable in this case? Surely Mayo are well known and you can sell one without an effort but I think 50% of its price is just for the brand name...


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## Petar Bogdanov (Nov 29, 2016)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I haven't heard about anything recently either. They've been churning out good stuff the last couple of months.



Kisesel is doing side markers by CNC now.


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## laxu (Nov 29, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> OK I decided to not do Hannes bridge. Everyone says they dont sound good because saddles is made from plastic? Ive heard Hipshot is amazing but standard ABM bridge and TOM bridge sound best? Im cut my costs by going normal pickups and normal ABM bridge. Im doing custom inlay, walnut top, SS frets, Hybrid binding, TEW maple neck, Carbon reinforcement neck rods, luminlay, gloss top and matte backside, Pale Moon ebony fretboard, scalloped fretboard. I wanted piezo but costs is too high too. I might have to cut some specs. Im still working on it
> 
> I do not want normal luthier. I get into situation I dont know regarding unknown reputation and too long build time. I will never wait this 2-3 years. My only options is Kiesel, Mayo, Suhr for decent build times and quality and experience with the 7 strings.



Don't worry about fixed bridge tonal differences. The Hannes will sound fine as would a Hipshot or ABM. If there is a huge price difference between them I would be just fine with a simpler bridge too. That said, I would avoid a TOM simply because it's a ....ty, really old design that just happens to be cheap to manufacture and is used by some popular guitar designs so it has perpetuated to this day. TOM offers no benefits over more modern designs.

Now that I've read your specs there are probably a few that Kiesel for example would not do or would only do for a significant upcharge. If you like their base models then it's at least worth sending them an email and ask as overall it could end up being cheapest but it also means you would have to come up with the rest of the money sooner since they have undoubtedly the shortest build times. 

If you are going for a 7-string, I would instead skimp on some of the more expensive choices like a roasted maple neck and pale moon ebony fretboard and spend that money towards having a multiscale guitar made. Of course that takes your bridge concerns out too since most just use Hipshot/ABM single saddles or Hipshot angled bridges.

Scalloped fretboard could be done by any competent luthier afterwards too so if a specific company doesn't want to do it, you could just have it done later. That said, I feel that your build right now has a bit of "throw every cool feature on a single guitar" thing going on. It's understandable if this is your first custom or what you consider your dream guitar.


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## pylyo (Nov 29, 2016)

laxu said:


> That said, I would avoid a TOM simply because it's a ....ty, really old design that just happens to be cheap to manufacture and is used by some popular guitar designs so it has perpetuated to this day. TOM offers no benefits over more modern designs.



Again, what a pile of bollocks hahaha. 
That said, and I don't wanna be rude, but it would be the best if you could stop giving a ....ty advices, as you obviously got no clue what are you talking about, mate. And you are just proving it with pretty much every post you make.
Go and make some exp first, play some good guitars, before you start writing BS and confusing people.

To OP: As for the bridges. Keep on your mind that with HS you will have the highest action out of all three options, unless you shim the neck, which is impossible with Regius. It's quite thick bridge and it feels really high on picking position too, almost like a TOM. 
I had over 20 Regiuses (with all 3 bridges you are mentioning) and dozens of other Mayo models and my favorite bridge is their ABM option, just because of its sheer comfort, control (there are no any edges or anything) and crazy low action you can get with it. It looks the cleanest too.
If you have any options of trying before buying, that would be great. But you can't go wrong with any of the three really.


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## laxu (Nov 29, 2016)

pylyo said:


> Again, what a pile of bollocks hahaha.
> That said, and I don't wanna be rude, but it would be the best if you could stop giving a ....ty advices, as you obviously got no clue what are you talking about, mate. And you are just proving it with pretty much every post you make.
> Go and make some exp first, play some good guitars, before you start writing BS and confusing people.



Please go ahead and enlighten me instead of a silly ad hominem attack. Why should the OP consider a TOM over pretty much any modern fixed bridge design?


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## pylyo (Nov 29, 2016)

Not saying he should pick it over anything, if you haven't noticed.
But your comments are hilarious, so make your self a favor, go pick a good Les Paul, Gustavsson, Nik Huber, Hartung, Momose, Hartung etc., TOM equipped guitars. TOM has it's own qualities in feel and sound, probably the most dynamic of all bridges as well and usually has the strongest zing or ring out, which many prefer. But they are definitely completely opposite of what you are saying about them. 
Mods, sry for offtopic.


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## laxu (Nov 29, 2016)

pylyo said:


> Not saying he should pick it over anything, if you haven't noticed.
> But your comments are hilarious, so make your self a favor, go pick a good Les Paul, Gustavsson, Nik Huber, Hartung, Momose, Hartung etc., TOM equipped guitars. TOM has it's own qualities in feel and sound, probably the most dynamic of all bridges as well and usually has the strongest zing or ring out, which many prefer. But they are definitely completely opposite of what you are saying about them.
> Mods, sry for offtopic.



I simply don't agree with you on that. I do own several TOM bridge guitars and to me the design not only requires a precise neck angle (or alternatively recessing), most models have limited intonation range and saddles are helt with flimsy retainer wire or C-clips. Some have play in the posts (which for example Tonepros fixes with locking screws). I don't feel it has any tonal benefits that could be directly attributed to just the bridge design.

I feel its prevalence is more because it's easily available from many vendors and guitarists being so steeped in tradition might not accept a LP style guitar with anything else.


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## narad (Nov 29, 2016)

Call it ....ty all you want -- my best sounding guitars have TOMs. I think the only real criticism one can raise is with the neck angle / comfort, which are easily remedied by recessing the bridge. It may not be your favorite, but it's clearly not ....ty.


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## pylyo (Nov 29, 2016)

narad said:


> Call it ....ty all you want -- my best sounding guitars have TOMs.



Same here.


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## Aso (Nov 29, 2016)

Ziricote said:


> OK I decided to not do Hannes bridge. Everyone says they dont sound good because saddles is made from plastic?


I own the trans-white Sully 624 posted earlier in this thread. If you lived near me I would invite you over to try the Hannes bridge. I took the leap of faith to get a guitar with one and it's now my favorite bridge. The guitar has amazing sustain and the bridge is really comfortable for palm muting. I like the bridge so much that all my current in process custom order guitars will have a Hannes bridge.



Ziricote said:


> I do not want normal luthier. I get into situation I dont know regarding unknown reputation and too long build time. I will never wait this 2-3 years. My only options is Kiesel, Mayo, Suhr for decent build times and quality and experience with the 7 strings.


I know Sully's build times are usually around the six to eight month range for a full custom guitar, he is amazing to work with and the guitars turn out amazing. So I would say not to rule out a small luthier. You would be surprised that there are many good builders out there even though it seems the forums are full of bad stories dealing with small builders.


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## Andromalia (Nov 29, 2016)

laxu said:


> Please go ahead and enlighten me instead of a silly ad hominem attack. Why should the OP consider a TOM over pretty much any modern fixed bridge design?



Er... because it works as well ? Designs that stand the test of time usually are the designs that work. I have guitars with TOMs, hipshots, floyd rose, gibraltars, yadda yadda. The only difference, really, is the time to get used to a new type when you discover it. As long as it's manufactured in resilient metals that don't chip and get burrs over time you'll be ok.

Don't forget that TOMs aren't 1960s bridges. They're today's bridges, manufactured with today's equipment and tolerances. Some very expensive guitars come with TOMs and their owners don't seem to complain.


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## thinkpad20 (Nov 29, 2016)

pylyo said:


> Again, what a pile of bollocks hahaha.



Not a huge fan of the insults in this post but I have to agree. TOMs are pretty awesome. I like how they feel on my hand when palm muting, and I've had no problem getting great action/intonation/etc when set up by a good tech.


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## FourT6and2 (Nov 29, 2016)

1)
I would not pay $4k for any Mayones. I have three. And I paid $2,800 for my Duvell Koa Limited and my 2016 Duvell Buckeye Burl MBC. Both are fantastic guitars and worth $2800 in my eyes. But not $4,000. No way. Not even a Regius is worth that to me. A bit of binding on the body and a neck-thru design does not equal a $2,000 markup.

2)
I've always played guitars with either TOM bridges or wraparound (like PRS). And got along with them just fine. After getting my Duvells, I gotta say... I prefer the Hipshot. Sound-wise, I couldn't make an accurate comparison because a Duvell is much different than a Les Paul, for example. But as far as playability, I prefer the flat feeling of the Hipshot over the raised TOM.


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## High Plains Drifter (Nov 29, 2016)

Jonathan20022 said:


> I didn't say it wasn't unacceptable, I'm just saying that if you have to point it out zoom into a photo to show someone that then it's not too big of a deal in my eyes.



I saw that bleed-through on the green one last week when I was checking out the owners NGD thread. I wasn't looking for any imperfections at all and in fact was pretty surprised to see any finishing flaws on an otherwise stunning guitar. 

I'm not on any side of this... just wanted to say that even though it didn't detract from the overall beauty, it was at least to me very noticeable simply at a quick glance... just as it would have been on a much cheaper instrument. Likely that it made me cringe a little since it was along the [prominently seen] top edge. Maybe in a less conspicuous area I wouldn't have even noticed... idk. 

I don't have the funds for a $4000+ guitar but if I was shopping, this might deter me from such a builder.


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## CapnForsaggio (Nov 29, 2016)

Honestly, these imperfections don't bother me.

They are masking the binding and staining the tops. This stain stuff wicks everywhere. I think they would have to sand it out. This might ruin the shape of the edge. 

I honestly don't know how they would manufacture these without this happening occasionally. I guess maybe route for a laminate binding after the staining process? Honest question if anyone knows....

I don't think masking will ever get there.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 29, 2016)

I'll truely take a ToM guitar over a Hipshot bridge. Just works best for me.

Also weren't Mayos pretty ....ing cheap before they got the Warwick treatment?


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## ikarus (Nov 29, 2016)

warwick treatment?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 29, 2016)

Used to be reasonably priced, but raised their prices to insanity because hype.


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## Jonathan20022 (Nov 29, 2016)

The whole anti TOM movement over the last 5-7 years has been hilarious, the TOM is fantastic and setting one up is easier than pretty much every other bridge accounting for your radius being set. That alone is a huge time saver over a single saddle setup for people who don't have the tools to setup their radius properly.

Hipshots/Schaller/ABM are all nice as well, but the TOMphobia recently is so funny. Pretty much any new player lists that they don't want a guitar with a TOM when asking for guitar purchase advice. I bought a Jackson SLS3 a few months back and it sounds and resonates so wildly.

Mayos could be found for 2k all the time a few years back, they jumped in price due to demand and the fact that they expanded their wood choices and hardware choices. And the reason for the excessive inflation was due to Mayones USA, being a distributor AND dealer at the same time for the entire country. That's a very large conflict of interest and prices actually decreased a bit in 2016 since Mayo USA is no longer a thing anymore. AFAIK Mayones just ships to dealers directly rather than going through a distributor. As anyone knows, when you throw another mouth to feed in a chain, prices go up. So there's at least an explanation besides just calling it hype.

The only hype based inflation in price has been a few select brands I saw grow from lower 2k pricing to 4k+ in the span of 2-3 years. And Blackmachine obviously, but even past the pricing directly from Doug inflation on those was caused by owners pretending there's some mystique unavailable elsewhere.

EDIT: Just thought I'd throw in my experience with the Hannes, it looks cool and there is no perceivable tonal difference that I can't account for in different tonewood choice between guitars with a Hipshot and Hannes. The acoustic "loudness" people refer to on Hannes guitars is completely lost on me, it's just another bridge design in my eyes and it does look rather cool.


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## narad (Nov 29, 2016)

Jonathan20022 said:


> Mayos could be found for 2k all the time a few years back, they jumped in price due to demand and the fact that they expanded their wood choices and hardware choices. And the reason for the excessive inflation was due to Mayones USA, being a distributor AND dealer at the same time for the entire country. That's a very large conflict of interest and prices actually decreased a bit in 2016 since Mayo USA is no longer a thing anymore. AFAIK Mayones just ships to dealers directly rather than going through a distributor. As anyone knows, when you throw another mouth to feed in a chain, prices go up. So there's at least an explanation besides just calling it hype.



You're kind of on it, but adding another middleman was actually beneficial to the pricing situation, since the previous single middleman was pricing with no anchor to reality whatsoever. Now the dealers have more power and seem to ground them to normal prices given that they actually have stock and stores etc. 

That one distributor was basically playing the blackmachine game of "let me ask whatever I want on ebay and maybe someone will offer me more than I actually expect." Had 6-string MBC regiuses up at $7-10k sometimes. Never sold there, but sat there long enough to give a lot of the public the impression that that was the price for a decent Mayones.


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## UnderTheSign (Nov 29, 2016)

narad said:


> B.) Salaries in these countries are entirely different. They're price with respect to local markets.


Not really anymore. A lot of the bigger eastern European names have quickly adjusted their prices to the Western market over their local one. They've priced to the hype. 



Ziricote said:


> Thank you, but this one is used and location in Europe. I do not want used guitars. Its also says $150 for shipping. I will also have to pay taxes with customs. Plus I dont have full money now and dealer says new order deposit is only $1400


Lets be fair here - if you don't have the money for a guitar, don't buy it.


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## narad (Nov 29, 2016)

UnderTheSign said:


> Not really anymore. A lot of the bigger eastern European names have quickly adjusted their prices to the Western market over their local one. They've priced to the hype.



Dude, I went to a bunch of the euro dealer sites to double check before I made that comment. By far the cheapest mayones prices I've seen at that scale. Like every page has a regius for < 3k euro when you cut out the VAT. It's currently much cheaper than the US dealers, and more to the point, not noticeably different from where they were priced over the past 2-3 years of my Mayones dealer price stalking.


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## FourT6and2 (Nov 29, 2016)

narad said:


> Dude, I went to a bunch of the euro dealer sites to double check before I made that comment. By far the cheapest mayones prices I've seen at that scale. Like every page has a regius for < 3k euro when you cut out the VAT. It's currently much cheaper than the US dealers, and more to the point, not noticeably different from where they were priced over the past 2-3 years of my Mayones dealer price stalking.



Also keep in mind that the advertised retail price you see on a website is not the actual purchase price in most cases. If you call or email the shop and ask what their best price is, it's typically a good bit lower. That's how I got my Duvell's so cheap (well not 'cheap' but affordable lol).


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## mastapimp (Nov 30, 2016)

FourT6and2 said:


> Also keep in mind that the advertised retail price you see on a website is not the actual purchase price in most cases. If you call or email the shop and ask what their best price is, it's typically a good bit lower. That's how I got my Duvell's so cheap (well not 'cheap' but affordable lol).



Exactly...I have one of the new Jackson Dave Davidsons on the way and I got it for $3700...they're finally hitting the streets and dealers are asking for $4700. If they move a lot of guitars, they will certainly go lower than asking price.


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## UnderTheSign (Nov 30, 2016)

narad said:


> Dude, I went to a bunch of the euro dealer sites to double check before I made that comment. By far the cheapest mayones prices I've seen at that scale. Like every page has a regius for < 3k euro when you cut out the VAT. It's currently much cheaper than the US dealers, and more to the point, not noticeably different from where they were priced over the past 2-3 years of my Mayones dealer price stalking.


Yes, but that's not what I'm saying. They're not priced according to Polish wages. A Dutch or German lower specced custom can be had for 2-3k and our wages are close to twice theirs.
Like I said, they're priced to the Western market, not their local/eastern European.


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## narad (Nov 30, 2016)

UnderTheSign said:


> Yes, but that's not what I'm saying. They're not priced according to Polish wages. A Dutch or German lower specced custom can be had for &#8364;2-3k and our wages are close to twice theirs.
> Like I said, they're priced to the Western market, not their local/eastern European.



No, they're not priced according to Polish wages, but they're not priced to the western market either. Then they wouldn't be twice as much in the US, or more expensive in the US than in the UK, which pays much higher costs to actually get them into the country. The prices are becoming more standardized (i.e., there's a price list), but it's clear that some dealers take advantage of the higher expectations of the US market, where the closest thing to a lot of Mayones is probably PRS Artist series / wood library / private stock, and boutique guitars commonly get into the 5-10k range. But this is just stupid arguing about this -- they're way cheaper in Europe.


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## Dyingsea (Nov 30, 2016)

What I have not quite understood about Mayones pricing going through the roof in recent years is how many just sit and sit and sit now. Are they willing to sell less at a higher price vs. move more volume? I guess that's the model now but they simply do not move like Suhr, PRS, etc. and will never really be a huge player in that ballpark IMO. They are still very niche when it comes to the general player population.


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## littleredguitars2 (Nov 30, 2016)

buy used


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## pylyo (Dec 1, 2016)

littleredguitars2 said:


> buy used



+1
most of these 2nd hands are pretty much newish, as folks really do take good care about their expensive guitars.


Also, I would like to apologize to a member Iaxu for the harsh words I've written to him in earlier posts. There was no reason for them, even though we disagree on some stuff. 
Sorry and cheers mate.


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## laxu (Dec 1, 2016)

pylyo said:


> +1
> most of these 2nd hands are pretty much newish, as folks really do take good care about their expensive guitars.
> 
> 
> ...



No worries! A lot of things regarding guitars are based on opinion and personal experience because scientific data just often isn't available. Sometimes we agree, sometimes we don't. 

I do agree with going for a used guitar if OP can lax some of the things he wants in specs. Seems a decent amount of Mayones models on the used market. Of course that is no longer a dream guitar then so I fully understand still wanting to order one.


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