# Anyone else not great at playing?...



## JimF (Mar 10, 2016)

Just wondering if I was the only one in this boat: Im not a great guitarist. I've been playing about 20 years, done a few recordings, plenty of gigs etc. I'm a solid rhythm player, but not great at leads. I cant sweep, I have sketchy alternate picking technique. However I always push my self with recordings, and recently I've fallen back in love with playing (Thank you to my Jackson 7 string guitar!) but since the advent of Youtube and all these 11 year old sweep picking virtuosos, is there anyone left who's just average like me? 
It seems like every webcam-filmed pickup demo is from someone who is insanely talented, am I the only hack thats left?


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## Emperor Guillotine (Mar 10, 2016)

Same boat, man. I've actually put playing in the backseat the past few years so that I can learn all that I can about production (moving on to mixing/engineering soon). As a result, my playing has rather suffered and I've become stagnant in technique. A lot of people tell me that I'm a good player, but when I see videos of the 11-year old sweep-picking virtuosos or the guys who are nothing but "look, Instagram, here's a lick!" players, I feel completely average.


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## oc616 (Mar 10, 2016)

*raises hand*

My guitar hero was Dino Cazares. All I ever cared about was that mechanical right hand articulation. I can't sweep, I can't tap too well, I can't even play higher notes at a great speed without excessive use of open notes. 

I blame Fear Factory and Deftones for my lack of care regarding unnecessary wankage


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## AliceLG (Mar 10, 2016)

Me: Hi, my name is Luis and I can't alternate-pick well, or sweep-pick at all.
Everyone else: Hiiiiiii Luuuuuuuuiiiiiiiiiiis



I'm a good rhythm player and riffer/chugger, but soloing, or shredding, is where I fail. I never learned sweeping and after 16 years playing I don't see the point. I'm good at tapping and when I want to widdly-widdly with some arpeggio I turn it into a tap/string-skipping lick.

We make do with what we've got I guess


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## lucasreis (Mar 10, 2016)

Been playing since 1991 and I can't solo for ..... 

My technique got better. I can solo like Jerry Cantrell, one of my guitar heroes, but I can't solo like John Petrucci (and I would love to). I don't know why I find it so hard to solo. I can play fast black, thrash, any kind of metal, intricate riffs, I can figure out odd time signatures and i play everything by ear, I would call myself a tuning specialist as I can identify and tune to any song I hear by ear, without having to resort to tuners and whatnot. And I think I'm miles better than when I started, but whenever I try to solo, even if it's fast, it doesn't make sense. I would love to get better in that department.

It also doesn't help that I love Dino Cazares and Stephen Carpenter's work. But even without soloing I think these guys work is outstanding.


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## High Plains Drifter (Mar 10, 2016)

I think that there are many many people out there that fall into the category of being not as good as they would like to be... or not as good as so-and-so... or not able to do certain techniques as quickly/ perfectly as so-and-so. 

I'm in that category. But at the same time, I'm also aware that there can be certain pitfalls associated with being being able to play any lick, any sweep, any progression, etc. With no place higher to go ( not for all but certainly for many) there is a "burnout" that can occur. 

May sound like a comforting BS excuse... to try to feel better about being a mediocre player, but at least in my humble opinion, it gives you constant room to grow, a consistent thirst to progress, a great desire to continue practicing, and ultimately more goals to strive for. And even though there are things that you can't quite do or that you struggle with, there may be other aspects/ techniques that you do quite well. 

I also feel that it's easy to hear a short snippet of someone and blindly think that they are just fantastic, but we all know that most people although awesome at this or that, may not be quite as competent with other things. Someone may be wicked with certain soloing techniques, or with certain picking styles, etc... but maybe they aren't so great at writing, or playing rhythm, etc. That's why I picked up seven-strings, and subsequently a bass. It's not because I suck at guitar ( which I don't think that I do anyway) but it's because there was more inside of me that I needed to set free. We all have our strengths and weaknesses after-all. 

My point is that even if someone is awesome and you suck, that as long as music flows through us and is a true part of us, that we should always feel that being a player vitally helps to complete the loop. Sure we may all go thru periods of stagnation, frustration, etc... but if we really FEEL music in the way that I hope everyone here does, that one form of playing or another, will continue to be a positive release and identity. 

Doesn't matter "how good" imo. That's awfully subjective anyway. The whole point for the majority of us is to have fun. Simply having a guitar, an amp, and a desire gives us that. Be thankful for any and all music-related talents, aspirations, desires that you DO have. 

Whether we are challenging ourselves or whether we are simply blowing apart the stress of the day by playing something familiar and rejuvenating, be thankful that the music is inside of you and that you are able to be a part of the most wonderful aspects of living life as a human being... creating music! For me... music is my life. It flows through me in good times and in bad. It fills me with substance, it defines me, it refreshes me, and it makes me whole. I pity those that will never give themselves that chance... or worse, those that just don't have the ability. What a shame that would be.

We could have after all, picked up a set of golf-clubs instead. 

Jam on brother.


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## TedEH (Mar 10, 2016)

JimF said:


> Im not a great guitarist.



I think 90% of guitarists are not what I'd call "great" guitarists. Nothing wrong with that though. IMO, it's more about using what you've got than making sure that you can show off Guitar Technique #581. I can barely sweep pick, so I avoid using it. But I can play some mean rhythm, and do those slow, bendy, "emotional" sounding leads. I've also got a lot more acoustic/clean playing skills than a lot of my friends that I'd think of as "shredders".

I was trying to convince a friend the other day to play more- but they were convinced they suck, cause they can't do much more than strum some chords- but who cares as long as it's fun to play? Said friend happens to be good at coming up with vocal melodies, is much better at the actual writing-songs part of the whole deal than I am- and there's nothing wrong with just playing to your own strengths. Each new thing you learn is just more tools, and you won't learn more of those things by stopping because you're discouraged.


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## Triple7 (Mar 10, 2016)

JimF said:


> Just wondering if I was the only one in this boat: Im not a great guitarist. I've been playing about 20 years, done a few recordings, plenty of gigs etc. I'm a solid rhythm player, but not great at leads. I cant sweep, I have sketchy alternate picking technique. However I always push my self with recordings, and recently I've fallen back in love with playing (Thank you to my Jackson 7 string guitar!) but since the advent of Youtube and all these 11 year old sweep picking virtuosos, is there anyone left who's just average like me?
> It seems like every webcam-filmed pickup demo is from someone who is insanely talented, am I the only hack thats left?



Pretty much describes me as well.


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## thrsher (Mar 10, 2016)

this thread makes me happy! where do i sign up!


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## Captastic (Mar 10, 2016)

JimF said:


> Just wondering if I was the only one in this boat: Im not a great guitarist. I've been playing about 20 years, done a few recordings, plenty of gigs etc. I'm a solid rhythm player, but not great at leads. I cant sweep, I have sketchy alternate picking technique. However I always push my self with recordings, and recently I've fallen back in love with playing (Thank you to my Jackson 7 string guitar!) but since the advent of Youtube and all these 11 year old sweep picking virtuosos, is there anyone left who's just average like me?
> It seems like every webcam-filmed pickup demo is from someone who is insanely talented, am I the only hack thats left?



+1

Playing makes me happy...so I continue to slug away at it. And every once in a great while, amongst all my mediocre playing, I actually play something brilliant. That keeps me going...


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## odibrom (Mar 10, 2016)

we always suck when looking up. Once upon a time I was having some sailing classes in a small wind powered boat and the instructor said something like this: it seams that we don't evolve in our journey, because our goal doesn't comes as fast as we might wish (wind powered boat, ok?), but when we look back we can see how much we have already accomplished... sounds kind of poetic, but this is me brightening this a bit, I am almost sure he sounded more brute.

Bruce Lee said something like "there are no limits, only plateaus, and we shouldn't stay there much time..." so I think it is time for us to challenge ourselves and go play our ....ing guitars!


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## gunch (Mar 10, 2016)

riffers > shredders anyways


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## vilk (Mar 10, 2016)

I am and always have been "sloppy"

I don't understand how or why. I'm just never "tight". I can practice the same song all day long, and I can even play it note for note and at the proper speed... but it will be sloppy. Pick sounds, open string sounds, notes that don't ring with good clarity. 
I can sweep, I can multi-finger tap, I can improv shred in pentatonic minor (you know, the "classic rock" scale)... but I want to be "tight"...


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## BrailleDecibel (Mar 10, 2016)

oc616 said:


> *raises hand*
> 
> My guitar hero was Dino Cazares. All I ever cared about was that mechanical right hand articulation. I can't sweep, I can't tap too well, I can't even play higher notes at a great speed without excessive use of open notes.
> 
> I blame Fear Factory and Deftones for my lack of care regarding unnecessary wankage



Dino was also my guitar hero, along with Munky and Head from KoRn, Mike DeWolf of Taproot, Chris Anderson and James Santiago of 40 Grit, etc....none of whom are shredders, so I was never really inspired to burn up the fretboard. I always focused more on playing tightly, and my songwriting. Soloing is cool when it's done tastefully, but if it's just pure wankity-wank, it doesn't hold my attention for long...give me a great riff with a killer groove any day. Awesome thread idea, JimF!


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## lemeker (Mar 10, 2016)

If I told everyone how long I have been working on trying to learn how to sweep, i'd get laughed at. 

I'm good enough to play the majority of the songs I want to play. Alot of the tech death stuff I can't mainly because of some of the sweeping. I can write songs well enough to get my point across, I do need to really sit down and take my lead playing a little more seriously, but its not a race, and i'll get there in time.

I'll never be a "pro" or a shredder like Gilbert or Satch, and while I admire their playing, im perfectly fine with it.


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## The Omega Cluster (Mar 10, 2016)

Does anybody ever find themself great?


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## TheBloodstained (Mar 10, 2016)

I suck at playing, I suck at writing, I suck at recording and I suck at producing.

However, I have fun doing my thing. I'll pick up the guitar and attempt to learn new tunes. I'll play along to the ones I already know. I'll sit and mindlessly noodle around with different sounds. Every now and then I'll come up with a riff, which I then use a couple of hours to record with bas and programmed drums, and then upload the 10 to 30 seconds of awkward playing to my soundcloud. I've written and recorded countless of sketchy demo pieces, and I've forgotten almost all of them again when I consider them done.

I'll never be good at anything music related, but I'm having so much fun doing my thing, and it really is an important outlet for me in this day and age. I love it


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## Duosphere (Mar 10, 2016)

JimF said:


> It seems like every webcam-filmed pickup demo is from someone who is insanely *talented*, am I the only hack thats left?



Talented = somebody who put time, effort and passion to learn something.

Did you do those things?
If yes, how much did you do?
Have you ever had a guitar teacher?
Results depend on what you wanna reach and how much time, effort and passion you'll put to reach it.

Some people think talent is something supernatural and some players were born talented, nope, we all were born with empty memories.
Some players practice 6-8 hours per day so obviously they're talented.
It all depends on what type of guitarist you wanna be, a rhythm player will take much less time than a virtuoso.


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## Ralyks (Mar 10, 2016)

I'd say my playing fell off after I left college, and I practically took 2015 off due to depression living in Buffalo and then the arrival of my first child (who did not cause the depression, that blame still goes to Buffalo). It probably didn't help that in college, I spread myself so thin trying to learn as much as possible between Jazz/Improve, Classical, Theory, History, Composition, Production, etc, which making hour commutes to and from campus and working 30 hour weeks while taking 15 - 18 credits at a time, that I was good at a lot of things, but not great at specific things.

So yeah, I know how that is. Have definitely gotten back into it the past few months, and hopefully going to be getting another 7 string soon.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 10, 2016)

lemeker said:


> If I told everyone how long I have been working on trying to learn how to sweep, i'd get laughed at.



6 years here, still can't. I've been practicing the outro sweep from Between the Buried and Me's "Mordecai" since I was in high school, and the outro from Polyphia's "An Evaporation" / After the Burial's "Berzerker" intro (just the 3 string one) and the main riff in "A Steady Decline" for years now, I can barely play them.
Any sweep I haven't been practicing for years? Forget it.

Another poster in another thread made a comment that I found to describe me (and I'd imagine a LOT of other people on this forum, if they took an honest look at themselves), where he said something along the lines of


> "I seek out and buy lots of nice high end gear so that I don't have any excuses / can't blame the guitar for my own shoddy playing"


Where I'm glad I've had this mentality, there certainly were some aspects of my sound that were the result of poor gear rather than poor technique, but now that my stable is more or less starting to fill with quality equipment, my own deficits are pretty glaring.

I can't write, I know no music theory and no matter how hard I try, it never clicks for me when I try to learn it. Been playing something like 8 years now and I still have trouble with pull-offs, for whatever reason; the note is never as loud as I know it should be. I cheat with hammer-ons a lot too, just by picking all the notes. As a result, I've gotten the pick hand of _god_, but still play wrong. 

But I can still learn a whole new song and be able to play it spot on from memory in under 20 minutes, due to my monster picking speed can play / jam on riffs that makes a lot of people who play 'correctly' astounded (string skipping every other note from the E string to the B string at 200 bpm? Sure), and I can lay down an improv rhythm pretty well too I think.

Point is, to me, I'm an 8+ year beginner. Personally, I know that I do almost everything 'wrong.' And yet, most players who do everything 'right' that I've met, players who can sweep all day, players who can play every DT solo ever penned, most couldn't care less. The way I see it, it's just a different way of doing things, as long as you progress it, maybe you'll wind up with some new technique that others will someday try to emulate, who knows. I try not to let it bother me.

This post came out a lot longer than I thought it would. I think about this alot, if you couldn't tell. Self esteem issues and what not.


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## JimF (Mar 10, 2016)

High Plains Drifter said:


> I think that there are many many people out there that fall into the category of being not as good as they would like to be... or not as good as so-and-so... or not able to do certain techniques as quickly/ perfectly as so-and-so.
> 
> I'm in that category. But at the same time, I'm also aware that there can be certain pitfalls associated with being being able to play any lick, any sweep, any progression, etc. With no place higher to go ( not for all but certainly for many) there is a "burnout" that can occur.
> 
> ...




Fantastic post! Really enjoyed reading that!


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## JimF (Mar 10, 2016)

Duosphere said:


> Talented = somebody who put time, effort and passion to learn something.
> 
> Did you do those things?
> If yes, how much did you do?
> ...




Ah yes, the flipside to the acceptance of medicrity! My level of motivation isnt my greatest trait! 
Very good point though.


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## ArtDecade (Mar 10, 2016)

I'm a really good player. That's what all this expensive gear means, right?


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## Great Satan (Mar 10, 2016)

I'm a lazy player. To the bone. 
I'm only about 60-65% as good as i 'should' be given the amount of time i been playing (about...16-17 years? i guess?)

However, i strongly believe limitation makes for better music.
I'd sooner listen to Keith Richards or the Ramones all day than, say, name any virtuoso acrobatics guitarist out there.

Songs > Solos.


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## larry (Mar 10, 2016)

Hi guys 

Playing since 95'. 
Good at: alt picking, metronomes, ear training to learn repertoire
Bad at: sight reading, improv, sweeps
I'm better at finishing songs than writing them.


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## Mprinsje (Mar 10, 2016)

i'm a very average player as well, but i can riff and write songs so it all works out.


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## lucasreis (Mar 10, 2016)

ArtDecade said:


> I'm a really good player. That's what all this expensive gear means, right?



Strangely enough I'm seen as this badass player by my friends, musicians or not, because I'm knowledgeable about 7 strings and ERG's and because I know a lot of tunings and also because of my gear.  If they knew how much of a hack I am!


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## CapnForsaggio (Mar 10, 2016)

Do you have fun rockin out? I have fun rocking out!

For me, it is entirely about touching the 'ether' for a moment at a time. My favorite Simpsons episode describes it perfectly:


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...cnHmSmrPKOUBopgZ0S5tmQ&bvm=bv.116573086,d.cGc


"I AM AMAAAAZZZING!"


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## synrgy (Mar 10, 2016)

Guilty. Watching everyone's videos and checking out their Soundclouds, etc, I often presume I'm the worst player on the forum. AND I get worse as I get older.

But it's still fun, and that's what matters to me.


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## Mega-Mads (Mar 10, 2016)

Well it's all about how much time and effort you put into it. I'm currently completely creatively stagnated and maybe only play for about 2-3 hours a week. A few years back i rehearsed twice a week with my band and was really pushing myself to get better. Now a days it's all about my job and weightlifting :S


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## odibrom (Mar 10, 2016)

Another from friend Bruce Lee: "Remember, success is a journey, not a destination. have faith in your ability. You will do just fine".

Wanted to post the meme from facebook, but didn't work out well...


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## Aymara (Mar 10, 2016)

As long as my wife falls asleep, when I play, I think I'm at least good at composing lullabies. 

Joking aside, it has a reason, that many bands have a rhythm and a lead guitarist and not only one, right?


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## High Plains Drifter (Mar 10, 2016)

CapnForsaggio said:


> For me, it is entirely about touching the 'ether' for a moment at a time.
> 
> "I AM AMAAAAZZZING!"



Not on topic but this is how I determine if a guitar stays or goes. There has to be that moment where the guitar and I become one lol... at least in a manner of speaking. If I never "mesh" on that ether-level then the guitar goes bye bye. It may not happen instantly but within days or weeks I need to have an "as one" experience or I know that that particular axe just isn't for me.


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## bostjan (Mar 10, 2016)

Every once in a while I get full of myself. I'll write something and think: "Wow, that's good!" record it and think to myself: "This is great!" Post it somewhere online and listen to crickets chirp as the response. Then I go on youtube and type in random guitarist names and wonder why I even bother trying to play an instrument so many others have mastered to levels far beyond what I can do.

Just remember that a guitar is like a paintbrush. You can get really really good at using it, but if all you ever paint is a beige bedroom wall, it doesn't much matter. There'll always be some guy out there who can throw a sponge into a bucket and make a self-portrait that looks better than what you could ever imagine. It's just life - we all want to be the best at something, but the odds of that happening are astronomically small. Just be the best you can be at what you really like doing, and be sincere. Maybe no one will notice you, but at least, if they do, you were doing something right.


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## TedEH (Mar 10, 2016)

bostjan said:


> if all you ever paint is a beige bedroom wall, it doesn't much matter.



I think, in guitar playing and beige bedroom wall painting alike, sometimes a lack of feedback is good feedback. Nobody is telling you that you suck, which is feedback in itself.  And there's probably someone silently saying to themselves "I'm so terrible at painting bedrooms, I'm glad it was done for me by someone who knew what they were doing."


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## Petar Bogdanov (Mar 10, 2016)

I'm a terrible guitar player. I actually quit for 5 years because I sucked and my gear sucked and I had no money and I had no privacy. There are way too many brilliant, innovative, precise guitarists out there.

But you know what? I just like playing guitar. When I saw a workmate bring a guitar to work I knew I had to have one. So I bought one. I don't care how much I suck, because I like the gear, I like music and I like making things, even if it's crap.


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## JeremyRodriguez5544998 (Mar 10, 2016)

I know how you feel! I'm confident in my playing, but it seems like the internet has just been giving the new generation so many advantages as far as learning how to play these days. All these free resources and tutorials and stuff! 

Oh ya. Let's not forget the little teenagers getting signed to big record labels now!


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## NicePants (Mar 10, 2016)

I think anything can be achieved with enough time and energy put into it. The only question is how much time are you willing to spend or how much can you feasibly put into it with your other responsibilities eating up your day. I don't like the idea that some people say you need natural talent to play guitar. All those people who are amazing at it put countless hours into being great. Some people do "get it" at a quicker rate than others though. I believe that some people are naturally inclined at it and don't plateau nearly as much or can break through those plateaus very quickly and absorb knowledge and build technique at a faster rate, but everyone has to pay their dues to become great. Didn't Steve Vai say something like he was never really talented at guitar and had to pour himself into it to get good?


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## Aymara (Mar 10, 2016)

Most of us are hobby players, right? So the most important thing is, that we have fun playing, that it makes us happy and lets us forget our job for a few hours.


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## awake69 (Mar 10, 2016)

I consider my playing kind of...."meh". Like everyone else, I have fun and pick up a few new skills here and there along the way. I know I'll never be Vai or Petrucci, but it's still a blast and when it's not, then I'll quit.


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## Alex Kenivel (Mar 10, 2016)

I'm the worst guitar virtuoso ever..


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## AngstRiddenDreams (Mar 10, 2016)

The prog/shred infatuation on here can make you feel inadequate for sure. In the last year I've gotten way into punk/sludge/hardcore/doom and it was only then that I realized it's not necessary to be a technical wizard.


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## IChuckFinleyI (Mar 10, 2016)

I quit caring about being a sweeper or shredder. For the most part, the stuff I write doesn't have any insane soloing parts. If I do feel that if it does call for something like that, then I can hand pick every note, start slow and practice it over and over and over again until I can do it at whatever speed I want. 

I can't improv sweeping or shredding at all. It's a weakness for sure, but as I said above, it's really not a part of my style.


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## Sumsar (Mar 10, 2016)

I am pretty much on the other boat: I can do the sweep, tapping, alternate-picking and so fort, and I spend a .... ton of time getting there, not really doing much homework in either high-school or university for that matter, instead just practicing guitar.

However, while I do enjoy being able to do those things, it is not really a very usable skill set to have. I got into song-writing these last years and in the process of trying to write "good" songs I found that 99% of the time you are not playing lead guitar. And if you do put a solo in a song, it usually works better if you stick to a few well thought out notes and arpeggios instead of the whole "see how fast I can wank!".

Writing good songs and good riffs is so much more important than wanking skills, I think I can say somewhat in retrospect.

Oh and btw even when you feel that you are good at the instrument, you still find yourself totally owned by 6 year old youtube kids - There is always someone with faster and "better" playing than you.


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## DeathChord (Mar 10, 2016)

After many many years of playing I've come to the conclusion that there are many great players out there, I'm just not one of them and I'm totally OK with that.

I can riff all night long and keep time really well but whats most important to me is the freedom the guitar allows me to be just me and after all these years of mediocrity Its still fun and I'm still inspired to keep playing.

All of you who have responded here are proof that it means something to us personally, were still here aren't we? we still chase it,we still enjoy it!

The 11 year old may well blow me away with technique but they can't touch me when it comes to getting laid!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Mar 10, 2016)

oc616 said:


> *raises hand*
> 
> My guitar hero was Dino Cazares. All I ever cared about was that mechanical right hand articulation. I can't sweep, I can't tap too well, I can't even play higher notes at a great speed without excessive use of open notes.
> 
> I blame Fear Factory and Deftones for my lack of care regarding unnecessary wankage



 All of my guitar heroes mostly focused on rhythm playing, so I never worked on my lead playing. 

I TRY to play lead, but my ....ing ring and pinky finger are too weak and slow.  I can get away with rhythm playing, but my fretting hand is just too slow and inaccurate for intricate playing.

EDIT: I'd love to take lessons, though. That, or find a way to increase my fretting hand speed.


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## wakjob (Mar 10, 2016)

On my best days ... all warmed up... I'm a mediocre player, at best.

I get compliments on my playing all the time, but I know the truth of how I rank.


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## Emperor Guillotine (Mar 10, 2016)

AngstRiddenDreams said:


> The prog/shred infatuation on here can make you feel inadequate for sure. In the last year I've gotten way into punk/sludge/hardcore/doom and it was only then that I realized it's not necessary to be a technical wizard.


Same here. That's actually why the latest demos that I have been working on have more "-core" elements to them.



TheBloodstained said:


> I suck at playing, I suck at writing, I suck at recording and I suck at producing.
> 
> However, I have fun doing my thing. I'll pick up the guitar and attempt to learn new tunes. I'll play along to the ones I already know. I'll sit and mindlessly noodle around with different sounds. Every now and then I'll come up with a riff, which I then use a couple of hours to record with bas and programmed drums, and then upload the 10 to 30 seconds of awkward playing to my soundcloud. I've written and recorded countless of sketchy demo pieces, and I've forgotten almost all of them again when I consider them done.
> 
> I'll never be good at anything music related, but I'm having so much fun doing my thing, and it really is an important outlet for me in this day and age. I love it


Ditto.



High Plains Drifter said:


> I think that there are many many people out there that fall into the category of being not as good as they would like to be... or not as good as so-and-so... or not able to do certain techniques as quickly/ perfectly as so-and-so.
> 
> I'm in that category. But at the same time, I'm also aware that there can be certain pitfalls associated with being being able to play any lick, any sweep, any progression, etc. With no place higher to go ( not for all but certainly for many) there is a "burnout" that can occur.
> 
> ...


Some good words in there, HPD.


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## Nlelith (Mar 11, 2016)

I'm learning to play for 2,5 years already... around 2 hours of practice every day, with metronome and all that... that's not counting the time I spend to watch/read lessons/technique tips/etc.

Still suck at playing pretty much anything.

My playing isn't fluid, my muting sucks, I often can't play songs in original tempo (even the rhythm), and it takes hundreds of takes to record something, when I decide to.

I feel like I'm barely making any progress at all. But when I do, it's usually due to some new tip I learned or something like that. So I highly recommend to try to learn new things whenever you feel like you're stuck in your skill progress. By the way, maybe anyone has some other tips for indirect improvement of skill other than practice? I know that playing with other people should work, but how about picking up different instrument as well (keys, for example) or something like that?


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## Aymara (Mar 11, 2016)

AngstRiddenDreams said:


> In the last year I've gotten way into punk/sludge/hardcore/doom and it was only then that I realized it's not necessary to be a technical wizard.



I'm hugely inspired by the post-Punk aera of the 80ies and I can give tons of examples of great bands, e.g. Killing Joke, that have a good guitarist, but you won't find guitar solos in their songs.

So yes, for many styles it's just not neccessary.

But again, who cares as long as we have fun playing. And when there are people liking our music, we definitely did it right.

There will alway be someone, who is better, but who cares ... making music is no competion contest, right? At least for hobby players. If music is your job, it might be different.


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## AngstRiddenDreams (Mar 11, 2016)

But what about Fugazi!?!?


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## Aymara (Mar 11, 2016)

Nlelith said:


> My playing isn't fluid, my muting sucks, I often can't play songs in original tempo (even the rhythm), and it takes hundreds of takes to record something, when I decide to.



Guess what ... my muting is great, my tempo too, because I'm a former drummer, but when I record something I play like a beginner and need several takes too.

I still wonder, why that never happenend on stage back in the days


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## Aymara (Mar 11, 2016)

AngstRiddenDreams said:


> But what about Fugazi!?!?



They are a great band, but is one of them a virtuoso? I don't think so.


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## AngstRiddenDreams (Mar 11, 2016)

Oh I was just referring to you mentioning Killing Joke. It got me stoked so I was excitedly asking if you like Fugazi haha


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## Aymara (Mar 11, 2016)

AngstRiddenDreams said:


> It got me stoked so I was excitedly asking if you like Fugazi haha



Sure I like them, though they are more a Punk than a Post-Punk band in my opinion.

What I meant are bands like Killing Joke (already mentioned), Joy Devision, Bauhaus, Punishment of Luxury, Big Black, The Cult, Fields of The Nephilim, Sisters of Merci, Chameleons, etc.

But my influences can be found in electronic and Industrial stuff too, from early EBM stuff like Front 242, Frontline Assembly up to heavier stuff like Ministry or KMFDM.

But it all started with the musical revolution called Punk, with bands like The Vibrators, Ramones, Stiff Little Fingers and yes, even the Sex Pistols ... but except SLF, that was in the late 70ies.


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## Pav (Mar 11, 2016)

You know, my first guitar teacher ever once told me "you're always your own toughest critic." Those words have stuck with me for my entire because they're so true. No one will ever be as critical of your playing as you, because no one else will ever hear/see/feel the tiny little mistakes that you notice while playing. If you were to ask me point-blank how good I think I am, I'd say I'm absolutely horrible and can barely play a damn thing...which even the logical half of me knows isn't true.

I tend to be the opposite of most people...I spent years and years wishing I could play like Alexi Laiho (go ahead and laugh). Consequently, I can sweep pick, alternate pick and generally "shred" aimlessly and sound convincing. But as soon I start playing any riffs that require real tightness anymore, I just want to vomit all over myself in disgust.


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## Fathand (Mar 11, 2016)

JimF said:


> Just wondering if I was the only one in this boat: Im not a great guitarist.* I've been playing about 20 years, done a few recordings, plenty of gigs etc*. I'm a solid rhythm player, but not great at leads. I cant sweep, I have sketchy alternate picking technique. However I always push my self with recordings, and recently I've fallen back in love with playing (Thank you to my Jackson 7 string guitar!) but since the advent of Youtube and all these 11 year old sweep picking virtuosos, is there anyone left who's just average like me?
> It seems like every webcam-filmed pickup demo is from someone who is insanely talented, am I the only hack thats left?



I'd say as long as you/me/we can do those things and be happy, the various nameless youtube-shredders are meaningless. 

I know a ton of people who are not educated musicians, not technically or gear oriented and as players like me, average at best. But they still release a boatload of music and do gigs constantly. In my book, that still wins likes on youtube and proves that it's not what you got, but what you do with it. 

Me? I've been a sloppy guitarist for 20 years and a sloppy bassist for 10.


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## Aymara (Mar 11, 2016)

Pav said:


> "you're always your own toughest critic."



Yes, but there are exceptions to this rule, be it good guitar teachers or good bandmates, e.g. a superb drummer criticising your bad timing


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## dhgrind (Mar 11, 2016)

mediocre skill, expensive gear. my love for death metal and grind core keeps me coming back for crazy stuff. I don't ever expect to get famous with my playing, I just want to put together a local weekend warrior band that keeps playing that one hole in the wall venue til we're all well into our 60's and cant hear .....


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## TheWarAgainstTime (Mar 11, 2016)

I'd say I'm a solid player; good, but not great. 

I definitely excel at rhythm playing more than leads/shredding, but can be passable at the latter with enough focus/time. My lead playing is mostly single line stuff with lots of bending and vibrato or outlining chord shapes with basic alternate picking and/or slides. Plus I can fart out some of the most fiercely mediocre three-string sweeps you ever did hear  Working on rhythm playing a lot helped my right hand and alternate picking more than any lead-based exercises, though  I'm always working to get better/cleaner, and it's nice seeing gradual progress here and there  

I can't write to save my life, though. I've written a grand total of maybe four complete songs and have tons of little bits and riffs without a home. I usually like what I write, but I create so little at a time when I'm not collaborating with a band or friend, you know? I've also never tried getting into recording myself, so I'd probably be terrible at that for at least a sizable chunk of time


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 11, 2016)

Pav said:


> wishing I could play like Alexi Laiho (go ahead and laugh).



Bruh Alexi is solid.


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## ZeroS1gnol (Mar 11, 2016)

When are you a good player really? 

My former band was looking for a second guitarist, so I started out by asking around in my network of musicians. The general response was: I know a couple of players, but they all can't hit your technical level. 

I get all kinds of praise from people, telling me that they think I'm pretty good. However, I don't think I'm that good at all, on a technical level especially. I see people ripping it up on the internet all the time, doing things that I can only dream of. 

I think my biggest strength is that I know how to write a song, which I highly prefer over high technicality. What use is technicality if you're not able to create a good song?


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## TheBloodstained (Mar 11, 2016)

Also... I guess this is kind of relevant to the topic of this thread?


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## Mvotre (Mar 11, 2016)

i used to think that I played fairly nice, until I tried to record something 

actually I think this is just the BEST way to check your playing. Record something, and then you can hear the timing fails, the chocked notes, open string ringing and all that mess. Recording one music I believed I learned more than from months playing at random.


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## skeels (Mar 11, 2016)

Some legendary guitarists were notably sloppy. Angus and Malcolm Young, Jimmy Page, Buckethead... I grew up around a lot of guys who were obsessed with "technique" but very few actually could master morevthan one or two styles of music anyway, much less originate their own style. Music is too diverse to define as "great" or "not-great" unless it truly moves you. Can you do that with solos? Yes. Can you do it with songs? Yes. Can you do it consistently? Can you do it forever? Can you play like everyone else? Can you play like yourself? 

I never could "quote" licks from more than a few players but I could from a lot of different styles. I was a jerk of all trades. But it helped me develop a style that wasn't like anyone else. I played metal, but I would chicken pick and do all this weird bat .... stuff where other players would go "what the heck was that?"

Don't get hung up on being "great" when you can be weird.


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## Chokey Chicken (Mar 11, 2016)

Aymara said:


> Guess what ... my muting is great, my tempo too, because I'm a former drummer, but when I record something I play like a beginner and need several takes too.
> 
> I still wonder, why that never happenend on stage back in the days



It happens live with everyone all the time. Its just that in the studio, you want perfection. Live, you want good enough. That doesn't mean slacking while playing live, but it does mean a missed pinch harmonic or flubbed note once in a while doesn't halt the show. You just play through it, while you'd stop and start over again if you were recording. 

As for skill, I'm mediocre. I can't shred to save my life, but I'm not really interested in that. I like melodic leads, and I adore rhythmically interesting rhythm playing. I'm passable in that regard, but I'm not the greatest. I record decently well too, unlike people I know who can bumble through solos better than me. They may be able to play sloppy solos, but I can play intermediate to fairly complex rhythm really cleanly.


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## bostjan (Mar 11, 2016)

Sumsar said:


> I am pretty much on the other boat: I can do the sweep, tapping, alternate-picking and so fort, and I spend a .... ton of time getting there, not really doing much homework in either high-school or university for that matter, instead just practicing guitar.
> 
> However, while I do enjoy being able to do those things, it is not really a very usable skill set to have. I got into song-writing these last years and in the process of trying to write "good" songs I found that 99% of the time you are not playing lead guitar. And if you do put a solo in a song, it usually works better if you stick to a few well thought out notes and arpeggios instead of the whole "see how fast I can wank!".
> 
> ...



^ This guy knows what's up.

If you listen to the "greats," they all tend to have one thing in common, that they suck you into a song, then throw a lick or two into a solo that blow your face off. Maybe those guys have side projects of absolute shred pandemonium, but that's not what put them on the radar.


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## Duosphere (Mar 11, 2016)

bostjan said:


> If you listen to the "greats," they all tend to have one thing in common, that they suck you into a song, then throw a lick or two into a solo that blow your face off. Maybe those guys have side projects of absolute shred pandemonium, but that's not what put them on the radar.



To be able to do that, you need technique.
Technique = vocabulary.
If your vocabulary is small, you'll only play penta boxes and sound like 99% of players out there.
If your vocabulary is big, you can CHOOSE how you wanna blow people faces off, maybe with a thousand notes per second or only one magical phrase.
To be able to do that you need knowledge and technique is part of that knowledge.
Technique has nothing to do with speed, speed is speed just it.Technique is knowing how to use whatever vocabulary you have to move people hearts.

Generally lazy people say "players with great technique have no feeling".
That's the lamest excuse for not practicing ever.
Ask them to hear their feelings, you will only hear boring penta boxes with out of tune bends.
Andy Timmons is the perfect example, no matter how great his technique is, most of his songs have phrases that blow people faces off BUT he choose that path because his vocabulary allows him to choose.
99% of For The Love of God is about melody, melody created with amazing technique that makes a guitar cry


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## lucasreis (Mar 11, 2016)

Duosphere said:


> To be able to do that, you need technique.
> Technique = vocabulary.
> If your vocabulary is small, you'll only play penta boxes and sound like 99% of players out there.
> If your vocabulary is big, you can CHOOSE how you wanna blow people faces off, maybe with a thousand notes per second or only one magical phrase.
> ...



I think guitar players with and without technique can create music with feeling. I agree that there's a persecution to guitar players with technique form people who aren't technical. But the opposite also happens. I think beauty can be found in very technical music and in music that's not technical at all as well.

For the Love of God sends shivers down my spine, it's one of the greatest songs ever in my opinion. And I would say the same about Down in a Hole by Alice in Chains, and that song isn't technical at all. Both have a HUGE amount of feeling and sound great.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 11, 2016)

Mvotre said:


> i used to think that I played fairly nice, until I tried to record something
> 
> actually I think this is just the BEST way to check your playing. Record something, and then you can hear the timing fails, the chocked notes, open string ringing and all that mess. Recording one music I believed I learned more than from months playing at random.



Oh man, this is so true. That was such a wake up call that first time 

It also instantly makes you realize that the sound guys are 100% as much of an artist as the people they're recording, ever since I dipped my feet into DIY recording the amount of respect I've gained for guys like Taylor Larson and Joey Sturgis who nail it _every, single, time_ is ridiculous.


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## punisher911 (Mar 11, 2016)

In my opinion I'm barely a tolerable guitar player. I write songs with simple riffs in the same scales because I'm comfortable there. Same thing with chords. Key or G or C because I'm just not good at barre chords. If only I had the drive to practice and play everyday, I'm sure I'd get better. I've been noodling on guitar/bass since 2005 off and on.

Luckily, I have a ton of riff ideas and songs started so I just started a new band and I'm the sole guitar player, so guess I will be forced to get better and write more intricate songs.


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## vilk (Mar 11, 2016)

I want to learn how to get good at using a tremolo bar / floating bridge.

Like, if you ever listen to an Andy LaRocque guitar solo, he's practically using it all the while he's playing, and it adds excellent effect to the solo. You could be a very skilled guitarist but if you don't ever practice on a floating bridge you might not be very good with it. Or, you could be like me, and do have access to a floating bridge but still never ever even try use it.


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## Arkeion (Mar 11, 2016)

I'm not great, but I can definitely be a lot better. My lack of consistency is what kills me. I played for 6 years, quit for 4, and just started back about 8 months ago. I've knocked a lot of the rust off, but I can't help but imagine how gnarly my playing could be if I had just stuck with it.


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## vilk (Mar 11, 2016)

^idk if you've been reading along this thread, but even if you stuck with it you still might not be gnarly!


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## Arkeion (Mar 11, 2016)

vilk said:


> ^idk if you've been reading along this thread, but even if you stuck with it you still might not be gnarly!



I haven't!  but I'm not gonna read it, knowing I could be forever bad would be devastating to my potential development lol


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## Rosal76 (Mar 11, 2016)

vilk said:


> I want to learn how to get good at using a tremolo bar / floating bridge.



+1

I'm gonna start using the tremolo bar again. I can do simple dive bombs and stuff Slayer does in their solos but want to use the bar the way Morbid Angel guitarist, Trey Azagthoth, Eddie Van Halen, Joe Satriani and Steve Vai do.


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## ProtoTechDeath (Mar 11, 2016)

Sumsar said:


> I am pretty much on the other boat: I can do the sweep, tapping, alternate-picking and so fort, and I spend a .... ton of time getting there, not really doing much homework in either high-school or university for that matter, instead just practicing guitar.
> 
> However, while I do enjoy being able to do those things, it is not really a very usable skill set to have. I got into song-writing these last years and in the process of trying to write "good" songs I found that 99% of the time you are not playing lead guitar. And if you do put a solo in a song, it usually works better if you stick to a few well thought out notes and arpeggios instead of the whole "see how fast I can wank!".
> 
> ...



I completely agree. I worked for years and years to be able to sweep and alternate pick comfortably. I spend a solid year staying at home and doing nothing but running arpeggios, scales... only to realize I hate playing lead. I suppose there was a certain amount of insecurity that came with dedicating that much time to learning how to play technically well, this idea that if you can't immediately tell how good I am in the first 3 seconds of me playing, then all my practicing was wasted. But it's stressful to hold yourself to such a standard and to be worried about how others feel about what you're playing, and then you find out most people aren't even impressed with it and/or don't even care to occupy their head-space with your accomplishments. Plus, you can always jump on YouTube and find a video of some 3 year old North Korean child playing the sh*t out of some flamenco.

Mood, atmosphere, and meaningful musical passages are so much more difficult to conjure than "impressive" sounding licks, but those are the parts of music that make it worth listening to. Not saying there isn't a place for that kind of wanky stuff, as there certainly cause to bring absolute chaos and cacophony to your songwriting. The trick is trying not to end up a one-trick pony. (Someone earlier mentioned vocabulary).

For those of you who do want to comfortably use the staples of being "good", there's a misconception with hours practiced = getting better. You can practice 7 hours a day every day, but if you spend that time jamming E minor blues tracks, you'll never learn to sweep or alternate pickup. You'll just end up with some tasty blues licks and early onset arthritis. It's been said to death, sure, but there's absolutely zero substitute for rehearsing what you want to play slow TO A CLICK, then gradually increase the tempo a few bpm at a time. Don't move on until you can play it at that tempo flawlessly. There's no short cut or fast track, that's the only way to do it.


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## Mathemagician (Mar 11, 2016)

I can sweep passably, tap with up to 4 fingers well, and alternate pick like a boss. I can't play ONE song all the way through, nor am I good at keeping time. Been playing since '03, and only started using a metronome in like '10. The problem being, 80% of my practice and improvements happened between '03-'06. So I play like 4 hrs a month now (total) to a click, but I'm just baaaaad. And I can't play chords. Seriously. I can recognize them, but switching between them you'd think I learned the G and D chords last week. Because I did. lol. 

I still own 7 guitars. ....'s my hobby and I LOVE it.


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## Arkeion (Mar 11, 2016)

Mathemagician said:


> I can sweep passably, tap with up to 4 fingers well, and alternate pick like a boss. I can't play ONE song all the way through, nor am I good at keeping time. Been playing since '03, and only started using a metronome in like '10. The problem being, 80% of my practice and improvements happened between '03-'06. So I play like 4 hrs a month now (total) to a click, but I'm just baaaaad. And I can't play chords. Seriously. I can recognize them, but switching between them you'd think I learned the G and D chords last week. Because I did. lol.
> 
> *I still own 7 guitars. ....'s my hobby and I LOVE it.*



Almost to the point I've considered myself a guitar *collector* and not a guitar player


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## Vres (Mar 11, 2016)

Mathemagician said:


> I can sweep passably, tap with up to 4 fingers well, and alternate pick like a boss. I can't play ONE song all the way through, nor am I good at keeping time. Been playing since '03, and only started using a metronome in like '10. The problem being, 80% of my practice and improvements happened between '03-'06. So I play like 4 hrs a month now (total) to a click, but I'm just baaaaad. And I can't play chords. Seriously. I can recognize them, but switching between them you'd think I learned the G and D chords last week. Because I did. lol.
> 
> I still own 7 guitars. ....'s my hobby and I LOVE it.


You invested a sh*tload of money into guitars but not enough time to learn to play them? I think it's about time indeed. Make use of them! You'll love your instruments more.


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## Mathemagician (Mar 11, 2016)

Crescendo said:


> You invested a sh*tload of money into guitars but not enough time to learn to play them? I think it's about time indeed. Make use of them! You'll love your instruments more.



I hear you man. I practiced 20-30 hours a WEEK back in HS. Got busy with college/career/etc. I really need to go back to square one and relearn my fundamentals cleanly. Or. And hear me out. Or I can bang out an hour of fun or more sloppily playing Far Beyond the Sun. As I make more time I intend to actually "git gud". But for now I'm just gonna learn Children of Decadence and see how far I can get, 'cause my girl still thinks I'm cool. Or lies to me a just the right amount.


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## broj15 (Mar 11, 2016)

Never learned how to sweep. Never had any desire to. I also have an EXTREMELY limited knowledge of theory. It might sound like a cop out, but I think most forms of wankery are boring, devoid or emotion, and just overall lame. 

song writing ability >>>>> technical "prowess" hands down.


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## ghostOG (Mar 11, 2016)

Been playing metal for 23 years and I still suck. It's disgusting to think Kirk Hammet and others were like 17 years old when they started, and I've been playing longer than he was alive and still can't play leads clean. I can't alternate pick at half tempo worth a damn, can't play lead which includes any kind of tapping or arpeggios, can't up-pick (cowboy's from hell verse riff).
I can down pick fast, alternate pick clean at full speed, have good timing and rhythm, and know a lot of Slayer covers. If I can't play something it's usually because my right picking hand can't do it.


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## BucketheadRules (Mar 11, 2016)

Lead playing-wise, I'm firmly of the opinion that no matter if your picking etc is sloppy, if your bends and vibrato are good then you'll sound good anyway. That really is the most important thing.


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## TheHandOfStone (Mar 11, 2016)

Like my name suggests, I am a strong alternate picker. I can't do any of that other crazy stuff you kids do.


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## punisher911 (Mar 11, 2016)

Should have mentioned that earlier... I was a HUGE collector! Owned so many guitars that I could barely even play! Bought Buzz's rg2228 from him. Had a FF 8 from Blackwater. Bought Agiles from Keith Merrow. All the while couldn't bring myself to actually get good on the darn things...


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## NicePants (Mar 11, 2016)

Just wanted to add to my older post, while I do think that any level of playing is achievable with enough time and effort, I believe greatness in guitar is subjective like many people on here has posted. If you can make someone feel something with your playing, I'd say you're great or you have the potential to be, even if you're playing extremely simple riffs and solos and you don't have the technical ability of Shawn Lane or Guthrie Govan. 

Hell, I'd say as long as you can perfect just a few expressive techniques like bending and vibrato, you could make phenomenal sounding music if you keep at it. It's mostly subjective anyway, considering most people listening to you aren't going to care that you hit that diminished arpeggio spot on if it sounds passable. Just look at all the guitarists on youtube. For every handful of guitarists with flawless technique and beautifully expressive playing, you have hundreds and thousands that sound like their guitar is suffering from multiple gunshot wounds. Just knowing good vibrato almost puts you in an elite tier. (Not saying there's anything wrong with posting your attempts at something on youtube if they're not flawless, just trying to point out that expressive technique can make something sound better and nearly professional if you can do it well enough).


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## High Plains Drifter (Mar 11, 2016)

4 pages says this could be the biggest crappiest band ever formed! 

Seriously... bet it would be awesome... weird no drums lol but awesome.


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## bulb (Mar 11, 2016)

To the OP, I feel your pain dude. Everyone can play circles around me and I'm just working at getting better at my own pace, which is painfully slow. At the end of the day, I guess we have to remember that this is supposed to be fun hahah.


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## bpprox22 (Mar 11, 2016)

These posts make me happy.

I started guitar at 17, joined a punk band, and played power chords till I started college. I didn't appreciate guitar back then like I do now. Playing shows was what really what tickled my fancy.

After putting down the guitar for a few years (complete regret), I picked it back up about a year ago. It's safe to say that I suck majority of the time but I am getting better -- very slowly. 

If there is one piece of advice I can give from one sucky guitarist to another:

_Play with guitarists who are better than you!_

Assuming they are patient, they can critique you and give you so many helpful tips and tricks. Remember, they've been where you are.


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## MrBouleDeBowling (Mar 12, 2016)

It's a matter of perspective. By overall musician standards, I'm a very good guitarist. By metal standards, I'm average at best. I greatly improved over the last 2 years but I should be a far better lead player than I am for the time I have been playing guitar. Playing tight rythms and singing/growling at the same time is where my strenght is. Not that I lack the skills to become a good lead player, but I don't bother learning super complicated stuff. I write the music that I want to hear, I'm happy with it and my guitars are my tools to do it. I can indeed play a few leads but I'm no Malmsteen or Brodrerick and I don't feel the need to be. 

If you're happy with your skills, why worry about it? Some lead players in my town even told me they were jealous of how tight my rythm playing is. I couldn't believe it, they are incredible guitarists who I never though they would say anything good about me as a musician.


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## Aymara (Mar 12, 2016)

High Plains Drifter said:


> 4 pages says this could be the biggest crappiest band ever formed!
> 
> Seriously... bet it would be awesome... weird no drums lol but awesome.



No problem, I'm a former drummer ... played the last time about 30 years ago. That should fit perfectly into a bunch of crappy guitarists


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 12, 2016)

Aymara said:


> No problem, I'm a former drummer ... played the last time about 30 years ago. That should fit perfectly into a bunch of crappy guitarists



I'm mainly a drummer, but I never learned how to do anything with proper technique, cannot calibrate my pedals correctly, and after 8 years of practice, still cannot blast at tempos where it's actually used. 

Where are all the bassists that can't keep a groove and end up trying to play guitar on bass, only know how to mirror the guitar, and can't do any of the cool slappy popping stuff? This can be fun.


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## Blytheryn (Mar 12, 2016)

I started playing guitar when I was 14, and that's when most of my woodshedding happened. I'd play all day after school and most weekends I'd just sit in my bedroom with tabs and videos. I had lessons and a real drive to get better, but after high school real life kicks in, and you find yourself having less time to sit and practice or develop some other hobbies that compete with playing.

I can alternate pick, sweep pick, and do some tapping stuff, but theorywise I don't know jack. Also I'm .... at writing my own/playing leads. But then again it's the best hobby in the world.


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## Sumsar (Mar 12, 2016)

Regarding the general message of this thread: You don't have to be a shredder to write good songs:
Yesterday I sat down to learn one of my favorite Behemoth songs "Lucifer". I qucikly realized that this was going to be the most easy song I have learned in years. It simply consist of two riffs, neither of which I would say is hard. So yeah, pretty much nailed it on the first time I played it through 
Regardless it is still one of my favorite songs of theirs. I guess it just goes to show that you don't need to do super technical conveluted stuff to write good songs either. Two riffs and some 100 year old polish poem about satan and you are good to go 

(vid is probably nsfw even though it is censored)


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## Aymara (Mar 12, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Where are all the bassists that can't keep a groove and end up trying to play guitar on bass, only know how to mirror the guitar, and can't do any of the cool slappy popping stuff? This can be fun.



Well, I'm also a bassist, but I can't help with the described fault ... I fear my timing is too good 

But crappy slapping technique is no problem, because I play fretless


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## metale (Mar 12, 2016)

I've been playing on and off for almost 20 years (since my 14), and there was a time when I could play everything that came in my head. I was in a band, I played every day, we jammed every weekend, life was good.

Then work came, marriage came, children came, no time/place/excuse to play, and I became a miserable player.

I don't shred unless you count Slash's Knocking on a Heaven's Door solo as shredding. My picking hand isn't all that bad, thanks to my teenage years emulating Hetfield, but as far as left hand goes I have to take the '98 Frusciante aproach: less is more, keep it as simple and tasty as possible or I'll mess it up.

I try to make up for it with making it just sound nice, play with feeling, etc (or so I tell myself).

On the meantime, I can't bring myself to stop buying guitars


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## Lorcan Ward (Mar 12, 2016)

The better you get a guitar or anything for that matter the more critical you get. Even if you can sweep and do all that technical stuff you will still find hundreds of areas to improve on and every know and then convince yourself you suck. You will just keep setting your goals higher and higher.


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## OmegaSlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

I'm not a great player because I'm inconsistent and all over the place.
There are things that I can do well, even some fast sweeps, and some easier things where I play like an idiot who first picked a guitar.
My extreme weakness is playing 2 notes per string fast...pentatonics are my nightmares.


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## MrTorture (Mar 12, 2016)

You say you've done a few recordings and plenty of gigs, then obviously you are "good enough". It doesn't matter which techniques you use to create your music.
No need to learn sweeping, or any other technique, if you don't want to.


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## Korbain (Mar 12, 2016)

Im pretty rough around the edges as a guitarist, but i get the job done lol I write, record, etc. And every song im more and more proud of, in the end as long you have fun playing .... it.


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## Winger (Mar 12, 2016)

I'd like to take this opportunity to thank all the guitar players who think they suck, but are brave enough to post their playing on youtube, soundcloud or where ever.

You inspire me.

Yes, you read that right.

You inspire me.

Just this morning, I woke up and did a quick perusal of social media and this guy popped up.


link 

He doesn't have great chops. In some of his videos you can hear and see him struggling. So what! I find myself being inspired and enjoying people like him just as much as I enjoy people in successful bands. I watched his video, got out of bed, picked up the guitar and played for a few minutes. Just like I've done countless times with players and bands I admire.

So... while it's important to assess where your playing is from time to time, don't be thinking your efforts go unnoticed or unappreciated.

And thanks for posting.


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## Science_Penguin (Mar 12, 2016)

My improv sucks. If I have time to write my solos or learn one that's written I can probably do it. Unless it has sweep picking, I have NEVER been good at that, I just tap it or do the Paul Gilbert string skipping thing.
I'm just not one of those people who can pull something awesome out of nowhere, unless it's REAL simple blues stuff.

The thing I've realised about shredding, though- and the reason I'm not ultra-worried about getting better at it- is that no matter how fast you play, it still has to be musical, or it likely won't register as anything but jumbles of notes. 
It's something that occurred to me when I realised "Huh... y'know the intro to Rising Force's solo is awesome, but I don't remember a damn thing beyond that..."

Bottom line, playing fast, not nearly as important as writing good solos. That's what I'd like to learn.


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## Nlelith (Mar 13, 2016)

OmegaSlayer said:


> My extreme weakness is playing 2 notes per string fast...pentatonics are my nightmares.


Huh, I'm on the same boat. For some reason, I can play 3 notes per string much faster than 2 notes per string. Even though it should be more difficult due to constant changing of pick slanting... while playing pentatonics mostly uses one pick slant direction.


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## Aymara (Mar 13, 2016)

I found a video by chance, that fits nicely into this thread, I think:



And I have a personal story to tell, that proofes that he is right.

As a teenie I played bass in a band and the guitarist was a really talented guy, who also could play bass quite good.
One day we visited a music shop and saw a fretless bass there. We were both curious to try it out and we both sucked badly.
My conclusion was: I will never be able to play fretless, if even this superb guitarist can't do it.

Then over ten years later my last band broke apart for the typical reasons, one became father, the next began studying in a far away city, etc.. and I didn't play any instrument for nearly two decades for similar reasons.

Then a few years ago I became to know of the Oud, a fretless Arabic lute, that absolutely fascinated me and when I had the chance to buy one, which is not easy in Europe, I couldn't resist.

I played it every day and it took me just two weeks to be able to play some simple riffs and melodies, so that my wife said: You're starting to sound good.

Long story short ... one year later I bought a fretless bass 

Conclusion: Never say never


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## Darren James (Mar 13, 2016)

Love this thread as I can relate. I've been playing for 16 years on and off and I'm ok at best. I'm not as fast as I use to be or as tight do to life in general, kids, house etc. I've been playing mostly blues and blues rock these days as I can't shred or sweep pick like I use too but even then I was sloppy. One thing I've been doing is playing to backing tracks on YouTube and man is it fun. I'm not great at timing and no longer have time to play in bands but I still enjoy writing my own music. I have an obsession with gear like most and often find myself saying,"why buy that, your sloppy and can't play as much". I then get over it and realize that I just love playing and love music as its my life. I've seen so many guitar players that are sloppy in the blues category yet they are so good. In the end, we are our own worst critic and it's all about the enjoyment that counts.


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## JimF (Mar 13, 2016)

Glad I'm among like minded people!


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## onefingersweep (Mar 13, 2016)

I'm not great, I'm not even that good but I don't suck either. Of course I'm not nearly as good as I'd like to be but who really is? I think most people always want to improve.

In the end of the day it comes down to how well you can express yourself with the instrument you're playing, not how many notes you are able to play. If super fast shredding is what you "visualize" in your head and you can't perform it with your instrument then you have something to work on. If not, there's absolutely no need to learn it. The only thing that really matters is how well you're able to (re)create the stuff that you "hear" in your head.


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## onefingersweep (Mar 13, 2016)

Nlelith said:


> Huh, I'm on the same boat. For some reason, I can play 3 notes per string much faster than 2 notes per string. Even though it should be more difficult due to constant changing of pick slanting... while playing pentatonics mostly uses one pick slant direction.



Nope it's harder to reach speed with less notes per string. Try playing one note per string with alternate picking and you'll see. Just take any simple arpeggio that you would normally sweep and see how fast you can play it alternate picked or try somthing fun like Paganini's 16th Caprice, it's rather unpleasant piece of music to try to play with a an electric guitar with distortion, without muting the notes. It's a piece of music that makes you realize how much you suck haha


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## Unleash The Fury (Mar 13, 2016)

there's a lot of things I'm not great at, like shredding. but something I do feel is my strong point, is coming up with cool riffs. so yeah, I can write stuff!


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## onefingersweep (Mar 13, 2016)

Unleash The Fury said:


> there's a lot of things I'm not great at, like shredding. but something I do feel is my strong point, is coming up with cool riffs. so yeah, I can write stuff!



How can you not be great at shredding with a nickname like that?!


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## Rosal76 (Mar 13, 2016)

Winger said:


> He doesn't have great chops. In some of his videos you can hear and see him struggling. So what! I find myself being inspired and enjoying people like him just as much as I enjoy people in successful bands.



+1.

I too, am greatly inspired and hugely thank all the Youtubers who post videos of themselves playing my favorite songs. It shows me that individuals who are bedroom guitar players can play the music just as well as the musicians who wrote it. Another thing that inspires me are technically proficient guitar players who state/show that they have trouble playing other bands/their own music. Cannibal corpse guitarist, Pat O'Brien, stated that he had trouble with Monstrosity songs. * Pat did not record anything with Monstrosity as he was only a touring guitaritst. And then there is a Youtube video that shows ex-Megadeth guitarist, Chris Broderick, struggling to play the solo to. "This is how the story ends". A solo Chris wrote himself. Tells me, "hey man, these are human beings playing guitar, not machines".


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## Steinmetzify (Mar 13, 2016)

I'm not great. I wouldn't even say I'm good. People that don't know how to play guitar tell me they think I am, but we all know how THAT goes lol.

One thing that made me proud....there's a guy in my city that I jam with occasionally. Dude spent most of 20 years taking lessons, learning Metallica solos, etc and he's pretty damn good. He shows me stuff, we trade gear around, things like that.

When that Riffs Beards and Gear riff contest came around last year or whenever, I busted out something in about 2 mins and posted it up, just for fun. Dude told me he heard it and it got stuck in his head enough that he had to learn it. The fact that I wrote a piece of 'music' that got so stuck in someone's head that they actually had to sit down and learn it so it'd shut up in their brain was cool to me.

I play guitar because electric distorted guitar is the coolest noise in the world to me, with acoustic/acoustic sims doing clean melodies a close second. 

I have moments of what I would think of as inspired....be sitting here messing around and stumble on something that's different (for me) and good. Record it, double it, and it's cool. 

It's a hobby for me...going thru different guitars and modelers and whatever. I'm a busy 42 year old guy that has a woman and a kid and a business. I don't expect nor want to have a career in music; it's just something that I do for me when I want some alone time. Could I be better? Sure. Do I get better every time I do a drumjam on a forum or something? Yeah. Could I benefit from lessons? Sure could. Do I get caught up in GAS and scheme and sell stuff and do other things when I could be playing instead? Yeah....I do. Part of the game. 

tl;dr: Count me among the 'I suck too' crowd...


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## The omnipotent one (Mar 13, 2016)

I don't think that I'm a great guitarist, but I'd like to think of my playing like a knife. Structured practice sharpens it, and going without dulls it. Sometimes I pick up a guitar after a while of not playing and I can't believe I'm playing so poorly. But I know that I've played harder material in the past, so I can do it again. Understanding that, I get the motivation to practice and get better.


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## will_shred (Mar 13, 2016)

Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses really. I would say that i'm a good player but not a great musician. I think people have a self defeating mindset when they see someone as a "talented" player. The only difference between someone who is "talented" and someone who isn't is: How they practice, what they practice, and how much they practice. There are lots of reasons why people might not be able to put in hours a day practicing or learning theory or writing music or some combination of all of them. I mean think about it, if you want to be a professional musician, it's your job, so that's all you're going to do with all your free time is hone that skill. Most people just don't have that kind of time, or just want to have fun, which is I think where most of us are. 
I love being able to play very well, I guess I take pride in that. I have no problem sitting down for hours and practicing one lick until I just got it down. It started with sweeping which i'm pretty proficient at, and i'm working on my speed picking ala Paul Gilbert, I can play mean blues too. My metal soloing is also a work in progress, but i'm getting better steadily as I learn more theory and improve my technique. However, the lost opportunity cost is time I could be spending writing music. I play in a band, and the leader of the band is an incredibly proficient writer. He has a discography of probably 7-10 albums and the dude is like 25. His technique is pretty good, but he spends more time writing music then he does working on his technique, so my sound is a little tighter then his. I mean, later today i'm going to jam with another friend who has been playing half as long as me, and writes way better music then I do. 

I can write single riffs, but just don't have the patients to sit down and write a whole song. I've only written like 2-3 songs in my 12 years of playing. Recorded none of them, even though I have all the equipment and software necessary to put together an album if I really wanted to.  still though, guitar and music is just what keeps me sane and brings light into my life.


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## thraxil (Mar 13, 2016)

One summer in college, I failed to find a job or internship and ended up stuck back at my parents' house in the middle of nowhere (central Maine) with nothing to do (this was pre-internet). I spent the whole summer practicing guitar eight hours a day or more. Scales with the metronome, picking exercises, learning every solo in every Guitar World magazine I had available. By the end of the summer I was really good (relative to when I started). But I realized that a lot of the shred stuff that had really impressed me before mostly just came down to putting in the time practicing. I'm convinced that pretty much anyone, regardless of "talent" that puts in those hours of practice can play that stuff. I actually got kind of disillusioned and got way more into weirder, less technical players as a result. Technique no longer impressed me nearly as much as creativity and songwriting. I'm still impressed by incredible technique, but what really gets me now is when I hear a guitarist and know that despite the fact that I could play anything they played note for note without a problem, I could never in a million years have come up with what they did.

Anyway, the rest of college and life intervened and I pretty much put guitar down for about ten years, and since I've picked it back up again I can't really be arsed to do the whole woodshedding thing all over, so now I suck again too  Nevertheless, I have more fun playing now and not worrying about my skills than I did back then, and I think I'm writing much more interesting material and actually developing my own voice.


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## Darren James (Mar 13, 2016)

thraxil said:


> One summer in college, I failed to find a job or internship and ended up stuck back at my parents' house in the middle of nowhere (central Maine) with nothing to do (this was pre-internet). I spent the whole summer practicing guitar eight hours a day or more. Scales with the metronome, picking exercises, learning every solo in every Guitar World magazine I had available. By the end of the summer I was really good (relative to when I started). But I realized that a lot of the shred stuff that had really impressed me before mostly just came down to putting in the time practicing. I'm convinced that pretty much anyone, regardless of "talent" that puts in those hours of practice can play that stuff. I actually got kind of disillusioned and got way more into weirder, less technical players as a result. Technique no longer impressed me nearly as much as creativity and songwriting. I'm still impressed by incredible technique, but what really gets me now is when I hear a guitarist and know that despite the fact that I could play anything they played note for note without a problem, I could never in a million years have come up with what they did.
> 
> Anyway, the rest of college and life intervened and I pretty much put guitar down for about ten years, and since I've picked it back up again I can't really be arsed to do the whole woodshedding thing all over, so now I suck again too  Nevertheless, I have more fun playing now and not worrying about my skills than I did back then, and I think I'm writing much more interesting material and actually developing my own voice.



I agree on so many levels. Personally, I'll take a good riff or a meaningful solo/lead over shred any day. I find most shred to be boring and I'm just not into it these days. I find a good song writer more impressive then someone who can show off on a guitar but I definitely still appreciate it. When I was younger, all i did was practice and my playing back then was a lot tighter because of it.


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## monkeysuncle (Mar 13, 2016)

Bad player here checking in! I'm not great by any means, from 1 to 10 I'd say I hang around 3 maybe 3 1/2 on a good day. I've never been too concerned about being able to do all the flashy stuff, mainly just playing riffs I like/trying to come up with stuff that interests me and getting those sounds outta my head. Although there are those days I get discouraged the main thing I try to remember is that I do this for fun and if I'm not I put it down. 
The best days that always make me feel good as a player are when I'm at work and get a riff in my head and just wanna go home and play. Grab some beers, play, look at the time and realize 3 hours have gone by.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 14, 2016)

This is like the guitar player's group therapy thread, SSO edition. 
Now with 10% more thall.


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## Aymara (Mar 14, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> This is like the guitar player's group therapy ...



The question is, who is the psychiatrist?


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## Unleash The Fury (Mar 14, 2016)

monkeysuncle said:


> Bad player here checking in! I'm not great by any means, from 1 to 10 I'd say I hang around 3 maybe 3 1/2 on a good day. I've never been too concerned about being able to do all the flashy stuff, mainly just playing riffs I like/trying to come up with stuff that interests me and getting those sounds outta my head. Although there are those days I get discouraged the main thing I try to remember is that I do this for fun and if I'm not I put it down.
> The best days that always make me feel good as a player are when I'm at work and get a riff in my head and just wanna go home and play. Grab some beers, play, look at the time and realize 3 hours have gone by.



that's that creative ambition that some people have! I always come up with riffs in my head at work and when I do then my creative juices get flowing.


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## Jaek-Chi (Mar 14, 2016)

This thread has made me feel surprisingly good about myself. Great to see i'm not the only one. 

When it comes to riffs there isn't much i can't play, i play a lot of tech death which is very technical, and rarely is there a song i actually can't play.

Then it comes to the solo's.... yeah that needs some work haha. I have decent feel with my lead playing, but widdly widdly faster kinda stuff im a mess, can't even remotely do it. This is put down to both my average alternate picking abilities and partially the fretting hand also. 

i'd really like to get through one of the few necrophagist songs i can play INCLUDING the solo though haha.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 14, 2016)

Aymara said:


> The question is, who is the psychiatrist?



Bulb, obviously.


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## Nlelith (Mar 14, 2016)

Is it just a hobby, if I constantly keep writing music? Like, not just riffs, but full songs with drums/synths/etc.? The fact that I'm much better at composing than playing guitar (at least I hope I am  ) is probably the most frustrating thing about all this... Most of the time my finished (midi) songs will only be heard by 2-3 close friends of mine and that's it. I'll probably write 2-3 albums by the time when I'll actually be able to play and record them. IF everything goes well and my plans won't be ruined by something... This makes it hard to decide what should I focus on, and what should I expect from my music in general...


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## Maniacal (Mar 14, 2016)

I'm crap these days, but unfortunately that is mainly due to having other jobs in order to make ends meet. Gone are the days of 8 hour practice sessions and learning the hardest pieces I could find. I blame an inordinately saturated market for music teachers and affiliated products.


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## rokket2005 (Mar 14, 2016)

I'm not nearly as good of a guitar player now as I was when I was in college. Back then I was taking lessons, and had jazz band and combos at least 4 days a week and practicing all the music for that on the side. Now while I'm not as good at guitar I've also taken up piano, bass, vocals, and engineering and production so I'm much more well rounded and a better songwriter by far. Perhaps a worthwhile trade off in my case.


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## TedEH (Mar 14, 2016)

I've been realizing lately that how I feel about my skill level on any instrument seems to be tied pretty closely to how I feel in general.


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## Dawn of the Shred (Mar 15, 2016)

I used to be the same way but took lessons from my buddy i jammed with. But taking lessens from Jason Richardson on bandhappy helped me HUGELY! Now i can sweep and i never thought that would happen.


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## Louis Cypher (Mar 15, 2016)

Great thread 

Realised long ago I will never be as good as I wish I was!! LOL! And have to say I am no where near as good as I even USED to be! But I have come to accept that you know life just gets in the way and changes, work, wife or GF, now for me I have a gorgeous 10 week old daughter so my priorites changed and that and so back in the day when I could practice for 4 to 6 hours a day they are long gone but I wouldn't change that for anything as my wife and daughter are the most important things in my life now and as much as I LOVE playing guitar thats just way it is and I love it 

I am def in the Can't Sweep for Sh1t club! haha I have never been able to sweep. Alternate picking is dreadful as I always cheated and just legato'd EVERY! LOL! 

Actually since Xmas I been trying to make an effort to have at least half hour to hour when I can and I have gone back to basics like scales, modes, finger exercises etc even brought a couple of the old REH George Lynch DVD's, found Richie Kotzens Rock Chops full video on youtube along with Paul Gilberts Intense Rock II that I used to have back in the day on VHS haha!! I am trying to relearn some things that I have gotten sh1te at or was never any good at in the first place. 

No matter what your ability long as your still loving playing & learning & rocking the fcuk out of your favourite guitar when you can then life is good!!


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## blacai (Mar 15, 2016)

I should buy a new guitar and check if my skill improves.
I'd heard it works like that.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 15, 2016)

blacai said:


> I should buy a new guitar and check if my skill improves.
> I'd heard it works like that.



It for real does. 
I don't know if it's just that new gear motivates me to play more or what, but I do feel like I get better when I do


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## JimF (Mar 15, 2016)

My new/first 7 stringer inspired me to get practicing again, it put the fun back into it, it felt new but familiar!


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## blacai (Mar 15, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> It for real does.
> I don't know if it's just that new gear motivates me to play more or what, but I do feel like I get better when I do



After hard researching I managed to calculate the following graphic







As you can see, it is only after 30 guitars that you may be over average.


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## Fraz666 (Mar 15, 2016)

This is my favorite thread


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## Genocyber (Mar 15, 2016)

I've been playing on and off since '96... Consider myself meh at best... but I have fun with it though... and I have discovered recording can be heaps of fun as well... oh and i'm a guitar hero to my kids lol they can have the stockpile of nice gear when i'm done...


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## Aymara (Mar 15, 2016)

Genocyber said:


> oh and i'm a guitar hero to my kids lol



Aren't that the nicest fans you can think of?


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## NicePants (Mar 15, 2016)

blacai said:


> After hard researching I managed to calculate the following graphic
> 
> 
> 
> ...



.... dude, according to that chart Lil Wayne kicks my ass at guitar.


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## avinu (Mar 15, 2016)

Checking in. I always considered myself an average "metal" player. After finally getting around to sitting down to track a full song I now realize just how sloppy my technique really is. It's honestly quite disconcerting and has been stressing me out a bunch. I'm seriously gonna have to step up my chops just to get passable takes. .... sucks.


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## blacai (Mar 16, 2016)

NicePants said:


> .... dude, according to that chart Lil Wayne kicks my ass at guitar.



so what?
Sure he does.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 16, 2016)

avinu said:


> Checking in. I always considered myself an average "metal" player. After finally getting around to sitting down to track a full song I now realize just how sloppy my technique really is. It's honestly quite disconcerting and has been stressing me out a bunch. I'm seriously gonna have to step up my chops just to get passable takes. .... sucks.



The feels are real, dude. 
Especially since the moment you start trying to record is a moment where you kind of feel good, you know? Like you feel ready and confident. Then you run your take, go through it, and then realize that no, you're not, and you practically have to relearn how to play guitar now because being tight and having good technique is a whole other art form in and of itself 

The road never ends. At least it's a fun one, though.


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## wakjob (Mar 16, 2016)

avinu said:


> Checking in. I always considered myself an average "metal" player. After finally getting around to sitting down to track a full song I now realize just how sloppy my technique really is. It's honestly quite disconcerting and has been stressing me out a bunch. I'm seriously gonna have to step up my chops just to get passable takes. .... sucks.



Everyone wants to be tighter than a digital quantizer when playing metal.


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## Sumsar (Mar 16, 2016)

^Yeah I guess many people don't realize just how edited alot of music is today, its especially bad in metalcore and djent, so I can see people getting fustrated with not being able to replicate what is basicly computer sounds on a guitar.
I guess the same things goes for drummers too.


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## WolleK (Mar 16, 2016)

My own quote to this topic: It´s like having S*x, you don´t have to be good to enjoy it.


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## Sumsar (Mar 16, 2016)

^"Playing guitar is just like having sex: Pick her up, plug in and make her scream" 

Yeah I know its a bad joke but fun none the less


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## blacai (Mar 16, 2016)

Sumsar said:


> ^"Playing guitar is just like having sex: Pick her up, plug in and make her scream"
> 
> Yeah I know its a bad joke but fun none the less



Exactly. The more you pay the more she screams.


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## mdeeRocks (Mar 16, 2016)

I am still getting better every day. 
Longest break I took was about 4 days during last 5 years or so. I feel mentally uncomfortable if I can't play guitar during the day. I mostly practice though, no noodling.

I have issue with being extremely pissed off if I can't play stuff I want (which sometimes is quite complex) - and it needs to be effortless, so only every day practice can enable that.

I have very little to no interest in gear. had 2 guitars for years until my main guitar neck started to thin out at the back, then I bought another.


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## cwhitey2 (Mar 16, 2016)

I feel like I should be way better than I am. My drummer always insists that I'm awesome...but he's just a drummer 


I dedicated almost 5 years, 5 hours a day minimum to practicing (don't practice nearly as much now, maybe 3 times a week for 2 hours). Can't sweep worth for crap. I can riff all day. I have just accepted that I will be a rhythm player for the rest of my life.


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## extendedsolo (Mar 16, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> The feels are real, dude.
> Especially since the moment you start trying to record is a moment where you kind of feel good, you know? Like you feel ready and confident. Then you run your take, go through it, and then realize that no, you're not, and you practically have to relearn how to play guitar now because being tight and having good technique is a whole other art form in and of itself
> 
> The road never ends. At least it's a fun one, though.



meh, focus on writing good solos. Not everyone can have flawless technique and be a great player ala Steve Morse and/or guthrie govan. 

There are a whole lot more flawless players that are boring and have no personality in their playing. There's a guy on Instagram that posts a lot that comes to mind. FLAWLESS beyond flawless technique, but good lord it's uninteresting. I could probably name 10 players like that in 10 seconds

Like someone else said, have fun.



cwhitey2 said:


> I feel like I should be way better than I am. My drummer also insists that I'm awesome...but he's just a drummer
> 
> 
> I dedicated almost 5 years, 5 hours a day minimum to practicing (don't practice nearly as much now, maybe 3 times a week for 2 hours). Can't sweep worth for crap. I can riff all day. I have just accepted that I will be a rhythm player for the rest of my life.



SWEEPING! The most overrated of all techniques. I bet you are awesome in a band context since you can riff all day.



Duosphere said:


> To be able to do that, you need technique.
> Technique = vocabulary.
> If your vocabulary is small, you'll only play penta boxes and sound like 99% of players out there.
> If your vocabulary is big, you can CHOOSE how you wanna blow people faces off, maybe with a thousand notes per second or only one magical phrase.
> ...



This sounds like it was written by a jazz musician. That's what I love about a lot of jazz players is that it is assumed that they are good already, so it strips away all of that surface stuff and allows you to just create. Vocabulary cannot be overstated.


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## cwhitey2 (Mar 16, 2016)

extendedsolo said:


> SWEEPING! The most overrated of all techniques. I bet you are awesome in a band context since you can riff all day.



I know, but I like the actual sounds sweeps make 


I like to think I'm pretty decent in a band setting, people say I am...but I also feel I can do better


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## espdna (Mar 16, 2016)

i suck.


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## classicalmetal24 (Mar 17, 2016)

I'm genuinely interested in why some people can sweep and some can't, and it's probably not just the sweeping technique either, but it has been brought up a bit in this thread. I see people who say they have practiced X amount of hours every day and still can't do it, why can't they do it? is there something they are misunderstanding??

It took me 3 weeks to get my sweep picking at a solid level where it sounds good and makes sense, but then there are people who can't get it down at all? How? is it something caused by their brain that just stops them from being able to do it?

I'm not saying this to try and be a douche or condescending, I'm just legitimately curious as to the reasons why.


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## Vrollin (Mar 17, 2016)

I have way more gear than my talent is worth... That would piss a lot of people off, but a the end of the day, I worked for it and it's what makes me happy. If only my playing skills were better than my ebay skills...


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## Aymara (Mar 17, 2016)

WolleK said:


> It´s like having S*x, you don´t have to be good to enjoy it.



... but the more you improve, the more you enjoy it ... and not only you 



classicalmetal24 said:


> but then there are people who can't get it down at all? How? is it something caused by their brain that just stops them from being able to do it?



The band name _Stiff Little Fingers_ might be a possible explanation, but I think the keyword is "stiff" and not "little".


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## classicalmetal24 (Mar 17, 2016)

So it's a problem with the finger joints?


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## Aymara (Mar 17, 2016)

classicalmetal24 said:


> So it's a problem with the finger joints?



Maybe, maybe not. The same problem exists in sports, some people are pretty stiff and e.g. this topic is one of the first trainings in martial arts, to get rid of this stiffness.

In most cases, this stiffness can be trained away. But if we compare to sports again, some people need much longer than others.


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## Unleash The Fury (Mar 17, 2016)

I think when people say they can't alternate pick for the life of them, it probably has more to do with their picking hand. it could be different but at least that's how it it for me. I've been playing for 15+ years and still can't alternate pick cleanly and as fast as I'd like to. people who've been playing for only a few years can probably do that better than I can. just like someone else said, there's 10 year old kids playing the serrena arpeggios


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## blacai (Mar 17, 2016)

If you can't sweep picking maybe you were using the incorrect method for learning.

Not all the people are able to learn the same way. Lot of factors are involved. I know one guy who can sweep really nice with 2 1/2 fingers(injured...)

It is like learning languages. It takes more or less depending on your interest, patience, constancy and used method.


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## Stijnson (Mar 17, 2016)

Been playing for about 11 years and I've never been satisfied with my playing. When I was younger I just wanted to play fast, sweep and play lots of solos. After a few years I told myself to stop trying to play stuff that's to fast for my skills, I figured, speed will come with time. I don't have the time, nor discipline, to play scales and licks with a metronome gradually increasing in speed. But I can play much faster and cleaner now then I could then, ofcourse. Without really trying. 
Instead, I focused more on 'sounding' good, finger tone if you will. I'm glad I did. Even if I could play fast, it would be useless if I sounded like crap. So while I'm still not very fast, I can make slow solos sound pretty decent.

Besides that, I suck at writing riffs that I like (damn you Marc Holcomb), and generally never finish any good song ideas that I do have.

But I made peace with all this a long time ago, I thoroughly enjoy playing these days because I put less stress on myself while playing, and stopped caring that I wasn't so fast, and an 11 year old on youtube is.

Bear in mind, anything people (including me), put on youtube, could be a snippet of something that they nailed, but they might butcher the rest of the song. I mean they could have done a 100 takes for that one solo or riff. I tend to get annoyed after about 4 takes, and I'll pick the least bad one of those to possibly share or upload.


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## classicalmetal24 (Mar 17, 2016)

> I mean they could have done a 100 takes for that one solo or riff. I tend to get annoyed after about 4 takes, and I'll pick the least bad one of those to possibly share or upload.



If they really did attempt it 100 times to do a youtube upload, then they're doing this whole practice thing seriously wrong.


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## cwhitey2 (Mar 17, 2016)

classicalmetal24 said:


> I'm genuinely interested in why some people can sweep and some can't, and it's probably not just the sweeping technique either, but it has been brought up a bit in this thread. I see people who say they have practiced X amount of hours every day and still can't do it, why can't they do it? is there something they are misunderstanding??
> 
> It took me 3 weeks to get my sweep picking at a solid level where it sounds good and makes sense, but then there are people who can't get it down at all? How? is it something caused by their brain that just stops them from being able to do it?
> 
> I'm not saying this to try and be a douche or condescending, I'm just legitimately curious as to the reasons why.




I have come to accept that I physically cannot sweep. Something in my fretting hand just won't allow it to happen. I can pick most styles except for hybrid picking and finger picking.

I have had guitarists quit tryouts after they realized I alternate pick 90% of my licks


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## Rosal76 (Mar 17, 2016)

classicalmetal24 said:


> It took me 3 weeks to get my sweep picking at a solid level where it sounds good and makes sense, but then there are people who can't get it down at all? How? is it something caused by their brain that just stops them from being able to do it?
> 
> I'm not saying this to try and be a douche or condescending, I'm just legitimately curious as to the reasons why.



I love the technique so much that everytime I see a arpeggio in a guitar tab book for a band's album and/or Guitar World magazine lesson, I'm gonna look at it with interest and most likely play it. There were times in the past when sweep picking was the lesson for the whole day. I blame that on the REH Yngwie Malsteen VHS instructional video and mini tab book that I have.  I believe because I have a high interest in that particular articulation and spent countless hours on it, I became good at it. On the other hand, in the past, I was not good and playing complex chords that appear in classical guitar music and two hand tapping because I did not have a high interest in those techniques. I like those techniques now and can play them but in the past I had a lot of trouble executing them.


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## classicalmetal24 (Mar 17, 2016)

Rosal76 said:


> I love the technique so much that everytime I see a arpeggio in a guitar tab book for a band's album and/or Guitar World magazine lesson, I'm gonna look at it with interest and most likely play it. There were times in the past when sweep picking was the lesson for the whole day. I blame that on the REH Yngwie Malsteen VHS instructional video and mini tab book that I have.  I believe because I have a high interest in that particular articulation and spent countless hours on it, I became good at it. On the other hand, in the past, I was not good and playing complex chords that appear in classical guitar music and two hand tapping because I did not have a high interest in those techniques. I like those techniques now and can play them but in the past I had a lot of trouble executing them.



For me it just made sense, "so all I do is sweep my pick across the string while fretting the notes in the arpeggio separately? Makes sense" and then it worked....


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## Rosal76 (Mar 17, 2016)

classicalmetal24 said:


> For me it just made sense, "so all I do is sweep my pick across the string while fretting the notes in the arpeggio separately? Makes sense" and then it worked....





Mind over matter.

... And then there was that Frank Gambale arpeggio lesson that appeared in Guitar World magazine a few years ago. Being a fan of arpeggios/sweep picking, I jumped at it right away thinking I could breeze through it like the Yngwie fan that I was. 

Mind over matter? Yeah, mind over matter that I won't rip this magazine apart and bash the guitar over my head.  Jokes aside, Frank's arpeggios in that lesson were freaking hard to execute.


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## classicalmetal24 (Mar 17, 2016)

Rosal76 said:


> Mind over matter.
> 
> ... And then there was that Frank Gambale arpeggio lesson that appeared in Guitar World magazine a few years ago. Being a fan of arpeggios/sweep picking, I jumped at it right away thinking I could breeze through it like the Yngwie fan that I was.
> 
> Mind over matter? Yeah, mind over matter that I won't rip this magazine apart and bash the guitar over my head.  Jokes aside, Frank's arpeggios in that lesson were freaking hard to execute.



That means I now have to go check them out, lol thanks.


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## lucasreis (Mar 17, 2016)

I can play fast and complicated riffs no problem, my picking hand is also really fast but my hands are really heavy and I think that's a problem that makes me not a great soloing guitar player. I think I also need to understand more the theory of it before attempting it. Maybe I'll go study again


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## extendedsolo (Mar 17, 2016)

Rosal76 said:


> Mind over matter.
> 
> ... And then there was that Frank Gambale arpeggio lesson that appeared in Guitar World magazine a few years ago. Being a fan of arpeggios/sweep picking, I jumped at it right away thinking I could breeze through it like the Yngwie fan that I was.
> 
> Mind over matter? Yeah, mind over matter that I won't rip this magazine apart and bash the guitar over my head.  Jokes aside, Frank's arpeggios in that lesson were freaking hard to execute.




Oh man I would love to see those


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## Ordacleaphobia (Mar 18, 2016)

classicalmetal24 said:


> I'm genuinely interested in why some people can sweep and some can't, and it's probably not just the sweeping technique either, but it has been brought up a bit in this thread. I see people who say they have practiced X amount of hours every day and still can't do it, why can't they do it? is there something they are misunderstanding??
> 
> It took me 3 weeks to get my sweep picking at a solid level where it sounds good and makes sense, but then there are people who can't get it down at all? How? is it something caused by their brain that just stops them from being able to do it?
> 
> I'm not saying this to try and be a douche or condescending, I'm just legitimately curious as to the reasons why.



I think it's the same reason some people can't play music in general, or work on cars; some people just don't "get it." They don't have the aptitude.
It irritates me to no end because I know that sweeping should be so [email protected]$!%#@ easy, but yet my brain and my fingers must speak different languages because whenever I try to play any at speed, it all falls apart. 

You know how when it's super early-December cold, the heat JUST got turned on but you're really feeling an 8am jam sesh? Your fingers are cold, and it takes you a few minutes before they start to 'listen' as well as they normally do? It's kind of like that, but all the time. They just don't cooperate.



Stijnson said:


> writing riffs that I like (damn you Mark Holcomb)



Dude for real.
Mark is a wizard.


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## Aymara (Mar 18, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> I Your fingers are cold, and it takes you a few minutes before they start to 'listen' as well as they normally do? It's kind of like that, but all the time. They just don't cooperate.



That's a good explanation of what I called stiffness above.


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## Rizzo (Mar 19, 2016)

Hey guys, playing since 2007.

Good at: absolutely anything, ha. who do you think I am, a noob? you bet dude. i'm a pro.
Bad at: credibility.

So, yeah.
I'm trying.


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## wakjob (Mar 19, 2016)

Sweeping is like dancing...

Some people just have that loose "swagger" and look natural out there on the floor.

Then there's "stiffs" ... like me. It's like trying to teach a metal player to play funk.


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## JustMac (Mar 19, 2016)

Not-great player checking in. I've identified my fatal flaw: I'm just a lazy sod, I lack the commitment to playing to a metronome in increasing intervals, it's just not in me. Plus I'll tell myself I will stick to one GP file to learn one song start to finish, and then give up after 3 bars or something. Same with scales, I'll just learn it for a while and see if it sticks with me. I swear I have undiagnosed ADD or something 


Everytime I think I'm getting better I keep going back to trying to play 'the Escapist Notion' by the Haarp Machine (also Extension to One) and the wind is taken right out of my sails. I know the guitarist got in crap for not being able to do their songs live, but I'm pretty sure Nick Llerandi (their fill-in player) played them flawlessly live. For me that song will always be the unicorn of modern metal riffing. It also serves as the bar for what I think my physical limitations are, I'm genuinely convinced you need to be gifted in co-ordination to play it properly.


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## Unleash The Fury (Mar 19, 2016)

JustMac said:


> Not-great player checking in. I've identified my fatal flaw: I'm just a lazy sod, I lack the commitment to playing to a metronome in increasing intervals, it's just not in me. Plus I'll tell myself I will stick to one GP file to learn one song start to finish, and then give up after 3 bars or something. Same with scales, I'll just learn it for a while and see if it sticks with me. I swear I have undiagnosed ADD or something
> 
> 
> Everytime I think I'm getting better I keep going back to trying to play 'the Escapist Notion' by the Haarp Machine (also Extension to One) and the wind is taken right out of my sails. I know the guitarist got in crap for not being able to do their songs live, but I'm pretty sure Nick Llerandi (their fill-in player) played them flawlessly live. For me that song will always be the unicorn of modern metal riffing. It also serves as the bar for what I think my physical limitations are, I'm genuinely convinced you need to be gifted in co-ordination to play it properly.



you just get discouraged very easily, that's all! I have no advice for you because actually I'm the same way. So I feel your pain


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## avinu (Mar 26, 2016)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> The feels are real, dude.
> Especially since the moment you start trying to record is a moment where you kind of feel good, you know? Like you feel ready and confident. Then you run your take, go through it, and then realize that no, you're not, and you practically have to relearn how to play guitar now because being tight and having good technique is a whole other art form in and of itself
> 
> The road never ends. At least it's a fun one, though.



Yes, I was definitely hyped right before tracking as well then as soon as I listened back I was just like fuuuuu.


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## couverdure (Dec 1, 2016)

I listen to simpler genres, mostly pop punk, to balance out the heavy and technical stuff I often listen to and attempt to play. Tom DeLonge isn't really that great of a player but he's one of my favorite guitarists despite being a total nutjob (and I think the new Blink album is great even if he got replaced by Matt Skiba). Speaking of Skiba, he only started playing the guitar when he formed Alkaline Trio but he made an entire discography worth of great songwriting.

As for "You can't have really nice gear if you aren't skilled", I think having the amount of money to afford and knowing how to use them isn't equal to earning great skills but it could help you inspire to get better because of how refreshing it can be (I started playing more when I changed to heavier string gauges). I always eye out for great gear like the Dual Rectifier because a lot of pop punk bands/records have used it and the tones coming from them sound really great to my ears.


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## extendedsolo (Dec 1, 2016)

couverdure said:


> I listen to simpler genres, mostly pop punk, to balance out the heavy and technical stuff I often listen to and attempt to play. Tom DeLonge isn't really that great of a player but he's one of my favorite guitarists despite being a total nutjob (and I think the new Blink album is great even if he got replaced by Matt Skiba). Speaking of Skiba, he only started playing the guitar when he formed Alkaline Trio but he made an entire discography worth of great songwriting.
> 
> As for "You can't have really nice gear if you aren't skilled", I think having the amount of money to afford and knowing how to use them isn't equal to earning great skills but it could help you inspire to get better because of how refreshing it can be (I started playing more when I changed to heavier string gauges). I always eye out for great gear like the Dual Rectifier because a lot of pop punk bands/records have used it and the tones coming from them sound really great to my ears.



To follow up on your first paragraph; it doesn't matter what gear or how many notes you can play, if you are a good song writer that trumps everything else. There are guys that can shred and write a good song (Loomis) but most guys cannot. Song writing is a skill unto itself that takes years of practice and elbow grease, just like getting great chops. Skiba and Delonge could write a great song on an Esteban guitar. 

As far as sweep picking goes, I would say if you can't do it, find another strength and build on that. I've never thought "WOW what a great solo, needs more sweeps though" Maybe you can develop tapping or alternate picking. Maybe work on your ear instead. Not a big deal if you can't sweep, since most sweeping sounds kinda lame anyway. Perhaps we should listen to a guitar master pretty much say what I've thought for a long time. (edit: Selkies from BTBAM and a lot of loomis songs like Psalm of Lydia sound awesome and sweep)



This is the type of trash I'm talking about. Guy can write, but him playing here is diarrhea


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## exo (Dec 1, 2016)

Self professed not great player checking in. 22 years, a lot of lead work still eludes me........but I've had people telling me I'm a good player for my rhythm work for enough years I guess I'm not as terrible as I believe I am. The thing that gave me any degree of confidence was having some friends in a deathmetal band I think is absolutely AWESOME, and the realization that I can jam out and play what THEY do. I still think I'm nothing particularly special.......but I know what I can do, if that makes sense.

+1 on the "record yourself" stuff people have said. I sorta feel like I've made more small "detail" oriented improvements in the last 2 weeks of working up demos in GarageBand than I had in the previous 2 YEARS.. It let's you know where your flaws are SO much better than just jamming out does........


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## mdeeRocks (Dec 2, 2016)

wakjob said:


> Sweeping is like dancing...
> 
> Some people just have that loose "swagger" and look natural out there on the floor.
> 
> Then there's "stiffs" ... like me. It's like trying to teach a metal player to play funk.



I know a lot of good metal players who can play funk just fine. Rhythmic structures are very similar.


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## hairychris (Dec 2, 2016)

Played guitar since the late 80s. Crap at it. Been in bands so have annoyed other people with my bad playing. Not my problem.

I also play bass. Crap at that too. My band hasn't thrown me out yet so whatever.

And that's before we get into any synth/electronic stuff that I also do. Christ that's awful.

I have *fun* therefore I don't care.



EDIT: I also own quite a lot of gear. I have had a lot of time to pick it up. I also am in my 40s and don't have a family so pffft.


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## scrub (Dec 2, 2016)

I'm very average. been trying to alternate pick with a metronome for years. Still slow as molasses.


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## Mathemagician (Dec 2, 2016)

Been playing with a metronome this year. (Since I've started practicing again regularly). Still slow and garbage when I play to a click, still bought 2 guitars this year. Lol. Just working my way through rock discipline, and a select few songs that are basically glorified exercises. Having a lot of fun though, as the metronome allows me to tangibly measure progress. Slow. Slow. Progress. Lol.


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## bloc (Dec 2, 2016)

Took a 2+ month long break from guitar after playing for more than 10 years now. Never touched them or even thought about them. Focused on other hobbies instead.

I revisited guitar playing about a month ago now and I feel very refreshed. Things seem easier to play and I feel much more relaxed and loose when I play stuff. Mind you, I'm not shreddy mcfun.... or anything, but I def see a difference. Hell, even sweeping seems more relaxed.

I think the only thing that has suffered over the break is stamina during fast downpicking.


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## High Plains Drifter (Dec 2, 2016)

hairychris said:


> Played guitar since the late 80s. Crap at it. Been in bands so have annoyed other people with my bad playing. Not my problem.
> 
> I also play bass. Crap at that too. My band hasn't thrown me out yet so whatever.
> 
> ...



Dunno why but I sincerely like this post. Early 40's w/ no family here... and a few guitars as well. Maybe that's partly why. 

Trying to look objectively at my own playing, I'd say that I'm fairly proficient at what I'm comfortable with. It's when I get out of my comfort-zone that it falls short pretty quick. I guess that's a catch-22. It allows me to perfect the types/ styles of music that I'm already familiar with, but it unfortunately keeps me from learning/ practicing new techniques at times. Also tbh I still am pretty envious of what some people can do... blown away sometimes, but that's normal I guess. 

I guess in the end, as long as we feel that whatever we play is therapeutic and enjoyable, then that's most important. It doesn't frustrate me that I'm not laying down Friedman/ Batio/ Ohmura/ Gilbert type shreds... especially since that's not honestly what I enjoy listening to the most anyway. I was raised on rock, funk, blues, and metal and so I suppose it's cool being able to keep up with most of that.


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## ncfiala (Dec 2, 2016)

I've been playing for almost five years (although I didn't really even touch it for over a year when I was going through divorce) and I have a ton of nice gear, but I think I suck. I have never practiced to a metronome. I can't sweep and I don't like the way it sounds so I found other ways to play arpeggios. I'm an economy picker but when it's not fast enough I use a lot of two-handed tapping and have become somewhat proficient at that. The way that I play is mostly geared around avoiding my own shortcomings by finding other ways to do things.


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## 70Seven (Dec 2, 2016)

On forums users usually exaggerate how good they are, here's a fun thread to be honest with each other and ourselves hehe. 

Been playing around 20 years. I'm very one dimensional or a one trick pony, and I'm ok with that. Good at what I know and pretty bad everywhere else.

Started playing in the mid 90's, James Hetfield was my main influence. I wanted to be a Rhythm player and nothing else, never cared about solos or leads. Got pretty good at down picking early on. Then progressed to learning song by other Thrash metal bands, Megadeth Slayer ect... Speed, down picking and power chords have been my thing ever since. 

I got into Dream Theater in early 2000's (still love them), learned some of their songs but that was above me skill wise. Got into some Satriani and even tried learning some Steve Vai. Never got the solo thing, learned some parts, had a hard time learning the whole solos, always a part I couldn't figure out. 

Last year I gave up all solos and focus only on thrash metal rhythm playing. I'm still learning Metallica and Megadeth songs and love playing more than ever. 

I play rhythm, and I play fast. That's pretty much it. And I love it!

And what other people give me a hard time for, I've been playing nothing but Ibanez RG for 20 years. I'm so use to it now everything else just feels uncomfortable. For a rhythm player a Les Paul or ESP Eclipse should make more sense, but I'm a Ibanez RG guy.


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## stevexc (Dec 2, 2016)

I run the gamut from "terrible" to "mediocre", depending on the day.


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## Gravy Train (Dec 2, 2016)

I am not a great player by any stretch of the imagination, but I play as well as I can and enjoy every second of it. I don't do it to impress anyone or be the next shred master. I am strictly a rhythm player and am happy with that. People who give other people .... about their playing can go screw themselves for all I care (even though I've met a few very talented/skilled players and they have always treated me with respect and kindness).


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## TedEH (Dec 2, 2016)

I'm usually a rhythm player, but lately because of a bunch of situations requiring stand-in guitarists and parts to be shuffled around, I've been having to take more lead roles lately... which is nice in some ways but highlights how different those two roles are... and how bad a lead player I am. 

I'm pretty convinced that a large number of "lead players", myself included, basically have just one or two "tricks" but otherwise BS their way through the whole "lead" thing.


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## Double A (Dec 2, 2016)

Honestly, I value songwriting chops more then technical virtuosity. You can sweep every note on your guitar but if you can't write a coherent composition that all means squat.

Personally... I can sweep, I am not great at it but it is not something I really concentrate on, it is a little something I can pull out as a flourish but you will not see me sweeping up and down the fretboard.


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## exo (Dec 2, 2016)

70Seven said:


> On forums users usually exaggerate how good they are, here's a fun thread to be honest with each other and ourselves hehe.
> 
> Been playing around 20 years. I'm very one dimensional or a one trick pony, and I'm ok with that. Good at what I know and pretty bad everywhere else.
> 
> ...




That's actually me in a nutshell. Learned to play via Metallica CDs and tab books, cut my teeth on Hetfield and Mustaine riffs. I was playing the rhythm parts for Master of Puppets 3 months after I picked up a guitar, and never really WANTED to play the flashy leads. Your post sounds uncannily similar to my own experience, except for these days I gravitate more towards melodic deathmetal and blackmetal than thrash stuff on BC Rich guitars rather than RG's.....


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## exo (Dec 2, 2016)

stevexc said:


> I run the gamut from "terrible" to "mediocre", depending on the day.




One more example of why the "like" button was such an important feature......


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## Aymara (Dec 3, 2016)

Double A said:


> Honestly, I value songwriting chops more then technical virtuosity.



That's an important point. Many Metal fans rate technique higher than musical feeling.

I remember, that I was totally shocked about the outcome of the Mayones Solo Contest ... there was a woman from Italy with a Schecter, who for my taste blow away every other competitor, but the didn't have the slightest chance to win.



This woman might not be the fastest player, but she has so much feeling, that tops most schredders.

Conclusion: Many people in this thread might be better players as they think of themselves ... who knows


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## EmaDaCuz (Dec 3, 2016)

Playing since 1989, first electric 1994.
I am a tight rhythm player, at least this is what I have been told. I take that.

But, soloing is a NO NO NO NO. Technically, I think I am capable of shredding. Practically, I suck. I think it is because I don't like solos and I simply don't care being tight. When I play the few solos I have written, slow and soulful, they sound great.

I have been trying to methodically learn sweep picking, and I keep failing. I do sweep at times, but I have no control over it... it just happens. Tapping, impossible. Fast alternate picking, bah... I gave up


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## Petef2007 (Dec 3, 2016)

Pushing myself to try and be a shred god was actively ruining my enjoyment of the guitar. 

I'm not a magnificent guitarist but i'm not incompetent. I can play Iron Maiden, Metallica, Megadeth, Testament, Helloween etc etc but I can't play solos by guys like Petrucci, Laiho and Loomis. 

So I took a few steps back and figured I could either enjoy playing the stuff I could, or frustrate myself trying to learn how to play the stuff I couldn't.

I get far more enjoyment from playing through to Powerslave than I do sitting there trying to get 4 note per string licks up to speed. Shredding bores me after a while anyway.


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## ASoC (Dec 3, 2016)

I always rate myself as intermediate-advanced, despite other people saying that I'm really good. I've had a solid rhythm technique since I started 8 years ago, because Papa Het got me into guitar, but I never bothered to learn to alt-pick  

The past couple of years I've been trying to improve my technique and alt-picking is much easier than it seemed at first. I think the hardest solo I've managed to learn is the Icarus Lives solo, but that took a solid week of taking it down to half speed and I'm still probably cheating  I firmly believe that if I practice enough my hands will learn to go fast. But, I'm not willing to put in the work to learn to sweep, so I stick with alt-picking, legato, and tapping. I play purely for my own enjoyment (though I would love to be in a band if I had the time) so I'm ok with slow, steady progress.


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## wankerness (Dec 3, 2016)

I am not very good at all, but it was sort of the path I set myself on! I've NEVER really given a s*** about fast solos, I just like COOL RIFFS and/or layered guitar parts with cool harmonies/thick chords. Basically, if a guitar part doesn't sound good by itself, or isn't something that interlocks with another in a cool way, I'm not very interested in it. Solos very rarely do! I worshipped at the altar of Opeth and Novembre and Katatonia and the like, and would learn their stuff all the way through but usually just ignore the solos, whether I could play them or not. That's what I wanted to do with my recordings, too. I've never been interested in soloing, and as a result, I've never gotten very fast! 

I think the last time I cared about rock solos was in high school when I was playing stuff like the solos from One and Fade to Black  The same thing happens when I play jazz (i'm mainly a bass player in jazz groups) - I HATE soloing! 

This all said, I play a bunch of fingerstyle and solo acoustic stuff, cause that sounds good by itself and isn't a bunch of single high notes. Ex, I love stuff like playing Pat Metheny's One Quiet Night album, or even out of some silly fingerstyle books I have of Movie Themes and Disney songs! Part of Your World and Beauty and the Beast and The Bear Necessities on fingerstyle guitar are


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## MetalViking (Dec 3, 2016)

Really not good here, but man I am having a blast with my 7 string.


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## extendedsolo (Dec 4, 2016)

wankerness said:


> I am not very good at all, but it was sort of the path I set myself on! I've NEVER really given a s*** about fast solos, I just like COOL RIFFS and/or layered guitar parts with cool harmonies/thick chords. Basically, if a guitar part doesn't sound good by itself, or isn't something that interlocks with another in a cool way, I'm not very interested in it. Solos very rarely do! I worshipped at the altar of Opeth and Novembre and Katatonia and the like, and would learn their stuff all the way through but usually just ignore the solos, whether I could play them or not. That's what I wanted to do with my recordings, too. I've never been interested in soloing, and as a result, I've never gotten very fast!
> 
> I think the last time I cared about rock solos was in high school when I was playing stuff like the solos from One and Fade to Black  The same thing happens when I play jazz (i'm mainly a bass player in jazz groups) - I HATE soloing!
> 
> This all said, I play a bunch of fingerstyle and solo acoustic stuff, cause that sounds good by itself and isn't a bunch of single high notes. Ex, I love stuff like playing Pat Metheny's One Quiet Night album, or even out of some silly fingerstyle books I have of Movie Themes and Disney songs! Part of Your World and Beauty and the Beast and The Bear Necessities on fingerstyle guitar are




Are you a Joe Pass or Jim Hall fan? Julian Lage?


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## BlackMastodon (Dec 4, 2016)

Been playing for close to 14 years and I'm my own worst enemy/critic. I know I'm not a shredder but I never wanted to be, it never fancied me. Agree that I prefer good songwriting and rhythm/feeling over speed and technicality. 

Haven't really touched my guitars since May.  I got a new interface though so I'll start recording myself and playing along to drum tracks and songs, hoping that'll help me improve. How well I play also varies from day to day, some days I'm so disappointed in my playing that I stop after 5 minutes. Usually coming back after a hiatus I do come back refreshed and excited to be playing, makes a big difference.


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## crankyrayhanky (Dec 4, 2016)

I spend most of musical times trying to write cool tunes and record them. I feel confident in those areas. Solo time is hit or miss because I simply don't focus as much there. 
After 30+ years of playing, I'm finally getting a few arpeggios down well. 

I like this ^ better than the guy who plays arpeggio exercises for a solo. That goes from impressive to weak really fast


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## Anquished (Dec 5, 2016)

I've been playing for roughly 3-4 years now and I'd consider myself somewhere between awful and passable. I learn by just trying to play stuff through tabs, maybe a couple of scale exercises and taking advice from far better guitarists on my technique.

My playing seems to have evolved as I acquire new gear. For example, when I upgraded from my small combo amp to my proper amp and cab set up I could hear my sloppy muting and other mistakes more clearly. Although these days I generally hold myself from purchasing new gear if I haven't made significant progress to justify it in my head. 

I have fun though so I'm happy.


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## wankerness (Dec 5, 2016)

extendedsolo said:


> Are you a Joe Pass or Jim Hall fan? Julian Lage?



I've never heard of Joe Pass or Julian Lage, guess I should check them out. My only experience with Jim Hall comes from the album with Pat Metheny!


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## extendedsolo (Dec 5, 2016)

wankerness said:


> I've never heard of Joe Pass or Julian Lage, guess I should check them out. My only experience with Jim Hall comes from the album with Pat Metheny!



Some of Joe Pass's stuff can get a little out there for me, but any of the Virtuoso albums are great if you are into solo guitar players. Julian Lage is closer to Pat Metheny than is Jim Hall. All of those guys are great players.


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## couverdure (May 15, 2017)

I want to revisit this thread because I'm feeling the same way again. It seems like most of the people here claim that their influence from riff-heavy/almost lead-less players is the reason why they can't play well, but I feel like I'm the opposite because Between the Buried and Me is the reason why I got into playing guitar since I started four years ago. I've been getting into power metal recently and the majority of the genre contains extended technical solos played in fast tempos.

For the first two years of my playing, I only knew how to play open chords and kept on playing easy acoustic songs until I figured out what a power chord was when I discovered Drop D tuning from my teacher, who I had for a year. Ever since then, I have focused more on playing electric than acoustic, but I didn't have a proper amp to play on until two weeks ago. I've been trying to learn the first three seconds of My Will Be Done by Unearth for a year and I still don't know how to nail it, even though it's just a simple B minor arpeggio.

Another pressure I'm having is that I don't know how to play a complete song and I struggle showing off my playing in front of anyone. My dad keeps telling me to play a whole song for him and I get too nervous so I end up playing at least a verse and chorus, or just a I-V-vi-IV progression and let him figure out what song I'm playing (which is pretty much every song ever made haha). My dream is to start a band and a career in music one day but my personal problems are making me lose hope in what I want to achieve in life, and if I do start I'm probably gonna end up looking like the people in this video.


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## prlgmnr (May 15, 2017)

Firstly, I've seen Dragonforce play about as badly as that.

Secondly, I've been playing guitar for 20 years and this week I can finally play the intro Little Wing, which for one reason or another has eluded me up until now.

I can certainly play stuff that would be considered harder, and there's probably even more stuff that would be considered a lot easier that I can't play, but my point was only not to get stuck on trying to play the same three seconds of something - try it for a bit, if it isn't coming off, leave it a few months and have another go, work on something else.

Sometimes something doesn't come off because you haven't got the technique right, and sometimes it's just that you haven't got the listening skills to really hear it yet.


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## Shoeless_jose (May 15, 2017)

Dont get down for me I was in a band when i was 18 and 19 we jammed every day had our own material we were pushing ourselves and i felt like i could learn anything. (Had Eruptiom mostly nailed). The band split over some bull.... and i lost my mojo completely creativity gone can barely write a riff after i had written all our material for botj guitars and bass. I neglected my guitars for a lomg time after this. Sold off a lot of gear. Would try and get back at it every once and a while with no luck. This went om for 10 years. Although each time i tried gettimg back to playing i found i could learn something i hadnt been able too before...although there was also lots of things i couldnt play anymore that i could before.

Anyways finally getting back into things seriously again and i figure with current recording and fake drum options i can at least create something cool again even if i never get up to the top echelons of technical skills


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