# Drum humanization



## venndi (Feb 20, 2015)

Hi

I'm using LPX and EZDrummer2. When I import the drum MIDI files, what should be the velocity, for kick, snare, hi-hats, cymbals, toms?
The maximum is 127...
After that, how much should be the "+ - random velocity" humanization, and the "position random".
In logic, under humanize->position, can't figure out, how its working...I alweys get a huge random position...
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/150220/Screen_Shot_2015-02-20_at_5.11.53_PM_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.png


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## JamesM (Feb 20, 2015)

I've played with automatic humanization, but it really doesn't do the trick reliably or robustly. I've taken to investing the time in assigning each hit's velocity by hand. It's worth the trouble.


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## noise in my mind (Feb 20, 2015)

What James said, you really have to move each hit around slightly. Do the same with the velocities. Unless you want your drums to sound like a machine (not a bad thing).


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## venndi (Feb 21, 2015)

But where should I start? Should I set all to 120 velocity, then where I think that should be harder, then just set to 125-127?
About position how should I set? The random thing isn't good?
Again about velocity...what is your optimal velocity(standard), for kickdrum, snare, cymbals, toms?
How make you this?


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## Sumsar (Feb 21, 2015)

So with velocities in EZdrummer as far as I know the sound will change on the setting, just like in real life - if you hit a snare drum hard it make one sound and if you hit it soft it makes a very different sound. So choose the velocity that you think sounds good for each drum - it may not be the same for all the drums. You can always crank up the volume of the drum it you like the sound of it at low velocities.

Now don't just assign random velocities to the hits but try and think about what a real drummer would do. For example if the drummer hits the hi-hat on all 8 subdevisions he will properly hit the hi-hat harder on the beats where he also hit the snare drum. Use the velocities to emphasize the groove.

Regarding timing is a bit harder. This is about feel and groove - should the drummer in general be abit behind the beat, or should he be ahead of the beat and by how much? It is pretty much learning by doing, of cause if you dunno what to do try to listen to what a real drummer does for a certain beat .. for example if you want a blast beat to sound really aggresive the distance between snare and kick drum hits should not be the same, the snaredrum should be closer to the (leading) kick hits. Over time you will learn what sounds good for various beats.


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## Necris (Feb 21, 2015)

venndi said:


> But where should I start? Should I set all to 120 velocity, then where I think that should be harder, then just set to 125-127?
> About position how should I set? The random thing isn't good?
> Again about velocity...what is your optimal velocity(standard), for kickdrum, snare, cymbals, toms?
> How make you this?



No, keep your average hits somewhere between 90 and 105 or so, that way the accents (115+) actually sound noticeably different. If you want a more "human" sound nearly maxing out the volume of every single hit and having such a miniscule gradation of intensity between your average and hardest hits is ridiculous.
By the same token ghost notes can drop down pretty much as far as you want below your average hits as long as they're still audible.

The random placement algorithm isn't really that useful, if you want to humanize your rhythms you're going to have to alter the timings note by note, without altering them so greatly that they're noticably "off-time". There is no real rule, drummers tend to float around a tiny bit. This will likely be the most time consuming portion of drum programming.


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## Sumsar (Feb 21, 2015)

Necris said:


> This will likely be the most time consuming portion of drum programming.



In short: quit programming drums and just learn to play them yourselves or spend the time to find a good drummer - will take less time and have better results


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## noise in my mind (Feb 22, 2015)

Sumsar said:


> In short: quit programming drums and just learn to play them yourselves or spend the time to find a good drummer - will take less time and have better results



Not sure about "better results" thing, I fool my professional drummer friends all the time with my programmed drums lol. I think (like with most things) the more you practice programming the more you will create your own style and workflow.


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## russmuller (Feb 23, 2015)

^I have to agree somewhat with this. The main advantage to programmed drums is that they allow for incredible sound quality without all the trouble, variables, and costs associated with good drum recordings.

A good drummer will give you the right feel, but then you've got to have a good kit, good room, good tools, and good ears to get a good sound. Not to say that it can't be done with a decent drummer on pro-sumer gear in sub-optimal conditions, but it all depends on the music/production and what you can get away with.



Sumsar said:


> In short: quit programming drums and just learn to play them yourselves or spend the time to find a good drummer - will take less time and have better results



^I actually took the middle path on this one. I took drum lessons for about a year and a half. I'm a terrible drummer, but my programming improved immensely from what I learned and practiced.


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## Sumsar (Feb 23, 2015)

You guys took my (apparently not very obviously) ironic / humorous comment way to seriously. However I completely agree with you - By far the most expensive / hardest thing to do regarding recordings is to get good drums.
I personally have teamed up with a pretty good drummer and I am pushing him alot to get him even better ("Yeah you totally nailed those blastbeats for that song in 180 bpm, now lets write a song thats in 220 bmp") And together we have spent about 1500 - 2000 euro on preamps and mics to be able to record some pretty good drum sounds - and thats kinda how cheap it gets, which is to much for a lot of especially younger people.


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## WhiteWalls (Feb 24, 2015)

Programming drums is incredibly easier if you know how to play drums, or even if you can't physically play them (the coordination, dexterity and limb independence needed does not grow overnight) at least you should know what every piece of the kit is, how many different articulations it has, and how the different velocity ranges relate to the sound.
If you have time, watch some really good drummers who play natural drums and cover a wide range of styles. One I always recommend is Gavin Harrison, he has a lot of videos where he plays all kinds of songs.

To give you an example, the snare is by far the hardest to humanize because you have regular hits, rimshots, ghost notes, blasts, melodeath style kick and snare patterns, etc.
All of these require very different settings, but it's hard to pinpoint an universal "range" for a certain hit because velocities also vary widely among different libraries.
I use mainly Superior Drummer, and I must keep velocities lower in general if I use Metal Foundry compared to Metal Machine for example, because the sounds are recorded differently.


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## Konfyouzd (Feb 24, 2015)

noise in my mind said:


> Not sure about "better results" thing, I fool my professional drummer friends all the time with my programmed drums lol. I think (like with most things) the more you practice programming the more you will create your own style and workflow.



Indeed. I have one drummer that goes all overly critical on drum parts I haven't fully composed and he'll bitch that the cymbals sound weird (ignoring that I've yet to even touch them) and suggest I need him to play it (also ignoring that he can't play the kick drum part). Then after I spend some time editing velocities it's far "superior" to anything I've gotten from him.


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## Konfyouzd (Feb 24, 2015)

Oh shit you knw what else can help with you velocities? Do you have a keyboard or drum pad? Sometimes I'll drum out double bass parts with my fingers on my keyboard in some subdivision of what I actually want to be played...

Then I just speed it up or slow it down as needed. The fact that I actually played it with my fingers gives it more of the realistic accented feel and then on top of that, I can look at those velocities, see the general pattern to them and try to mimic *that* when I write drums from there on out.

Same with the snare. Sometimes I'll do a really generic double bass roll with the snare in even intervals to get an idea of how much the snare fluctuates when played in conjunction with the kick. This is something else that after having done it a few times and having looked at the velocities, you can start to kind of mimic/fudge to taste.

Then I learned to do drags and all kinds of other snare techniques that I admittedly don't know the name of (but I know the sound of) by just creating snare hits and moving the velocity until it sounded right in context. Certain things are just going to be trial and error if you're not a drummer, I think.

And it's easy to say, "Just learn to play drums," but in my band I play guitar, bass, soprano and tenor saxophone and I'm learning trumpet. Someone else can play drums... I have my hands full considering I play all those AND do all the recording. 

Another thing I've noticed is that once things start getting into REALLY high speeds, the need to lower velocities becomes more apparent. For instnace, I have a song that has a gravity blast in it... For the longest time my gravity blasts sounded like a cheap cartoon machine gun. lowering the velocity on the kick and snare in parts where they get played that fast actually helped a ton and it still ended up sounding like it was the same overall volume as the higher velocity stuff. 

It's like some ppl have already mentioned... Certain hits will just sound more natural at certain velocities.

Thinking about it logically helps too... 

As the speed goes up, it's likely they're using a slightly lighter touch to facilitate moving that quickly. Or at least they're using a lighter touch than they would for a Lars Ulrich style "boom-crack" beat (You know... Kick, snare, kick, snare, kick,snare...).


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