# 2nd OAF build - long scale



## Hollowway (Jan 21, 2012)

Alright, I guess I may as well start this build thread. I've got a couple of builds I want to do with a couple of luthiers over the next couple of years, and this one has been in the sort-of-design phase for a while now.

I haven't decided for sure on whether we're doing a 10 string 30-34" or a 9 string 28-32", but it's one of the two. I think it'll be the 10, so I'll write out the specs for that for now.

30-34" fanned scale
Tuning: G#0 to E4
Top: Buckeye burl (see pic)
Neck: Bamboo or Maple (Still have to decide)
Bodywood: Not sure yet, but there will be a sandwiched slice of ebony or padouk in between. I'm thinking maybe ash for the body?
FB: Still deciding. Tom is taking the buckeye to his local exotic wood shop to try to match up something cool for the fretboard. Maybe we'll end up with a dark piece of birdseye maple. Or something with two tones (like sapwood/heartwood).
Pickups: We probably can't do anything production, due to the fan, so maybe just two sets of 6 string pickups in reverse P style orientation. Or I might contact Merlin or something. 
Bridge: Custom plate by Tom with Graphtech Piezos

Here's the top I bought in December:






So anyone have any experience with Merlin pups? I see they have a couple different models.


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## Rusti (Jan 21, 2012)

Awesome top! buckeye is pretty expensive 
Whats its thickness?


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## Hollowway (Jan 21, 2012)

Rusti said:


> Awesome top! buckeye is pretty expensive
> Whats its thickness?



Yeah, it ain't cheap! But I love the stuff, so I had to do it. The billet is super thick - 2 inches or so. So we're looking at 1.0" thickness for a top. I'd like to cut it into 2 full 0.5" thick tops, but Tom said he's not sure it can be cut that thin. So we'll see.


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## Winspear (Jan 21, 2012)

This pleases me greatly.


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## Hollowway (Jan 21, 2012)

EtherealEntity said:


> This pleases me greatly.


Haha, good! It stresses me out greatly! I can't decide if I can handle the 34" scale or if I should just do the 28-32" as a 9 string. I go back and forth hourly on the decision.


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## in-pursuit (Jan 21, 2012)

just go 30-34", you know you want to. if it doesn't work out for you I'm sure you could find a buyer for it  also that top is going to be gorgeous!


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## Solodini (Jan 21, 2012)

If the scale is too much then you can capo it.


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## Hollowway (Jan 21, 2012)

in-pursuit said:


> just go 30-34", you know you want to. if it doesn't work out for you I'm sure you could find a buyer for it  also that top is going to be gorgeous!



Yeah, I know. My concern is that if I don't do that length then I will end up ordering one in the future because I won't get it out of my system. I may just have to borrow Holdsworth's hands when I play it, though!

And Solodini, that's a great idea, and I will likely do that. But I also considered doing a shorter scale length for everything except the lowest string (a la M.A.N.) and sort of have a split scale that way.


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## Purelojik (Jan 21, 2012)

DAT BUCKEYE


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## thrsher (Jan 21, 2012)

def. jelly of the buckeye....been looking around for a good piece to buy...where did you find it?


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## MetalDaze (Jan 21, 2012)

Nice wood!


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## Hollowway (Jan 21, 2012)

thrsher said:


> def. jelly of the buckeye....been looking around for a good piece to buy...where did you find it?



Actually I think we're going to get two separate tops out of it, if you're interested.


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## TomAwesome (Jan 22, 2012)

Woah, that's pretty interesting.


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## in-pursuit (Jan 22, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Actually I think we're going to get two separate tops out of it, if you're interested.



if someone else doesn't want to take you up on that, I'd be keen


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## Hollowway (Feb 3, 2012)

Alright, fellas, tell me what you think of this. I had the buckeye sent to Tom, and he took it over to his wood guy and they looked at a bunch of different woods and took pictures of them (I want something for the fretboard that matches with the body). I think we're going to go with either a pink/red ivory FB with sapwood or maybe a tulip wood board. You guys know anything about the properties of tulipwood? I don't know much about it.

We're also likely doing a macassar ebony neck, swamp ash body and a thin sandwiched piece of ebony between the top and body.


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## Valennic (Feb 3, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Alright, fellas, tell me what you think of this. I had the buckeye sent to Tom, and he took it over to his wood guy and they looked at a bunch of different woods and took pictures of them (I want something for the fretboard that matches with the body). I think we're going to go with either a pink/red ivory FB with sapwood or maybe a tulip wood board. You guys know anything about the properties of tulipwood? I don't know much about it.
> 
> We're also likely doing a macassar ebony neck, swamp ash body and a thin sandwiched piece of ebony between the top and body.



I may sound biased, but I think a ziricote board would look damn sexy in that combination, especially a nice dark piece, or hell, even one with some sapwood. Between those two, I'd say the first option you have. Pink/red ivory is fucking gorgeous when its a nice piece.


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## mountainjam (Feb 4, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Alright, fellas, tell me what you think of this. I had the buckeye sent to Tom, and he took it over to his wood guy and they looked at a bunch of different woods and took pictures of them (I want something for the fretboard that matches with the body). I think we're going to go with either a pink/red ivory FB with sapwood or maybe a tulip wood board. You guys know anything about the properties of tulipwood? I don't know much about it.
> 
> We're also likely doing a macassar ebony neck, swamp ash body and a thin sandwiched piece of ebony between the top and body.


Pink ivory is beautiful wood. I was going to use it on a previous build but couldnt find a large enough piece. Never heard of tulipwood tho. Just googled it, imo go for the pink ivory if you can get your hands on it


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 4, 2012)

Wow that top is amazing, psyched to see this build.


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## Purelojik (Feb 4, 2012)

god i absolutely love watching OAF builds here. it just makes me wanna build more. that and the vik guitars forum...


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## Levi79 (Feb 4, 2012)

We need bigger pics of that phenomenal chunk of wood! This build will be insane!


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## Trem (Feb 4, 2012)

Nice piece, never see it that big. I've often seen the billets the size for making pens that were unbelievable and thought they would be sweet to make a top with if could be found in bigger slabs. Especially the colored, like green and orange marble types. Looks like it is pretty heavy and brittle?


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2012)

Yeah, from what I can see tulipwood is the same basic color as pink ivory, but it is striped with yellows, too. I'd ideally like a piece with sapwood in it. I've been jonesing for a sapwood/heartwood FB for a while now. And I think I want to have Tom do an ebony binding on the fretboard so it will match the neck. Then the fretboard will look like its inset into the ebony neck. 
Not sure if I want to do any sort of inlays, though. I don't want it to be too busy. And I can't do side blocks because the fan is difficult to navigate just by side markers, so I gotta noodle on that a little more.


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## Valennic (Feb 4, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, from what I can see tulipwood is the same basic color as pink ivory, but it is striped with yellows, too. I'd ideally like a piece with sapwood in it. I've been jonesing for a sapwood/heartwood FB for a while now. And I think I want to have Tom do an ebony binding on the fretboard so it will match the neck. Then the fretboard will look like its inset into the ebony neck.
> Not sure if I want to do any sort of inlays, though. I don't want it to be too busy. And I can't do side blocks because the fan is difficult to navigate just by side markers, so I gotta noodle on that a little more.



Why not ask Tom to do what Ola did for Mishas strandberg? Compensated side dots, so you can accurately find yourself on the other side.


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## Solodini (Feb 4, 2012)

That and having fingerboard wood used as fret markers so not only does the fboard look set in but looks like it's locked into the binding via the markers.

The tulipwood looks amazing!


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2012)

Valennic said:


> Why not ask Tom to do what Ola did for Mishas strandberg? Compensated side dots, so you can accurately find yourself on the other side.



What do you mean about the compensated dots? Do they line up with the center of the frets at the middle of the board, as opposed to the center of the frets at the low string? That's a cool idea. I'm going to have a lot more fanning than Bulb did, but it might still work.


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## Valennic (Feb 4, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> What do you mean about the compensated dots? Do they line up with the center of the frets at the middle of the board, as opposed to the center of the frets at the low string? That's a cool idea. I'm going to have a lot more fanning than Bulb did, but it might still work.



Yeah, he had em line up along the side where the treble side frets would end up being.

Best pic I could find of it.


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2012)

Valennic said:


> Yeah, he had em line up along the side where the treble side frets would end up being.



Who's idea was it? Bulb's? That's pretty clever. That should be standard on all fans, if you ask me.


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## Valennic (Feb 4, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Who's idea was it? Bulb's? That's pretty clever. That should be standard on all fans, if you ask me.



I'm not sure honestly . I think it was a collaborative idea, but I agree. It really is an awesome little innovation that should be standard. Having the side dots on the bass side is pretty useless, because you can generally tell where you are from just looking down and seeing fret edges. The treble side would be considerably more difficult.


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## Winspear (Feb 4, 2012)

Yeah that seems like a pretty cool idea. On my Vik I am having standard side dots for the bass end, and dots on the treble side of the fretboard.

I.e opposite of this


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## JaeSwift (Feb 4, 2012)

Om nom nom looking forward to seeing more, that Buckeye burl is stunning. Tom hinted a few of your plans for it!


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## scherzo1928 (Feb 4, 2012)

If it helps, on my fanned 7 I have black side markers, and also little golden MOP dots on the treble side of the board. They don't stand out waay too much since it has a pau ferro board, but they certainly help me find myself.


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## Hollowway (Feb 12, 2012)

Tom soaked the burl in wood hardener (as you must do since it's a burl) and look at the color pop on this. Man, I can't wait!


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 12, 2012)

That top looks like some sort of modern abract painting of a forest.


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## Hollowway (Feb 12, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> That top looks like some sort of modern abract painting of a forest.



Totally. Kind of reminded me of Van Gogh's Starry Night...


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## Tom Drinkwater (Feb 13, 2012)

That burl is awesome! Considering this is the first time I've had a chance to work with any burl this has been quite a learning experience. The guy that sawed it is an acoustic builder and we were both puckered pretty hard during the process!! It turned out really well. 

The burl is very lightweight and its consistancy is almost like cork until you stabilize it with the wood hardener. It is going to look incredible when it is finished. I'd love to get my hands on a big cherry burl for a guitar! 

We'll have to consider that compensated side dot thing, pretty cool idea.


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## Hollowway (Feb 14, 2012)

OK fellas, here's the rough sketch of the design. I sent Tom a picture of the Cyan headless someone posted a while ago, and he handed that to Eric to work from. I told them I wanted a shape that had some sort of bevels or edge rounding, etc. so we could see some of the swamp ash body wood, potentially. Plus, we're thinking of doing an ebony thin sandwiched piece between the top and body. Eric is redesigning it with 9 strings (since I decided against the G#0 10th string) and maybe a modified HS that matches the lines of the body a little more.


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## scherzo1928 (Feb 14, 2012)

awesome body shape, and I agree that a HS that matched the body better would be killer.


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## Hollowway (Feb 14, 2012)

scherzo1928 said:


> awesome body shape, and I agree that a HS that matched the body better would be killer.



Yeah, I had no idea that Eric did that kind of stuff, so I'm sure he'll be able to come up with something cool.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 14, 2012)

That looks wicked man!


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## in-pursuit (Feb 15, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Eric is redesigning it with 9 strings (since I decided against the G#0 10th string)


 
son, I am disappoint.

in other news that design looks freaking hot


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## Hollowway (Feb 15, 2012)

in-pursuit said:


> son, I am disappoint.
> 
> in other news that design looks freaking hot



Cuz you favor the G#0? Or a high A? I'm torn about adding that G#0 or not.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 15, 2012)

How are you going to amplify this btw?


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## Hollowway (Feb 15, 2012)

Double post


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## Hollowway (Feb 15, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> How are you going to amplify this btw?



With the 50 CL or Tuzzia. They sound good with my current 10. Low, but not bassy for the C#1.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 15, 2012)

Oh cool, have you though of a dual bass/guitar rig setup like some touchstyle guys do?


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## Hollowway (Feb 15, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Oh cool, have you though of a dual bass/guitar rig setup like some touchstyle guys do?


Yeah I have an el cheapo Peavey bass combo amp I could use to mess around with. .I guess I'd have to wire the guitar for two separate outs? .I actually like the guitar sounds of low notes, but it might be cool to have a different tone on the bass amp. .But no way I'm going to learn touch style. .I already suck at one technique. .I don't need to suck at two! .


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 15, 2012)

You could wire it for two outs then use something like an afx that has two ins that let you run two completely different signal chains, that way you could keep bass notes from sounding overly bassy and treble notes from sounding overly harsh.


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## Hollowway (Feb 16, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> You could wire it for two outs then use something like an afx that has two ins that let you run two completely different signal chains, that way you could keep bass notes from sounding overly bassy and treble notes from sounding overly harsh.



:sigh: That's actually a pretty awesome idea. Now I will start thinking about an Axe Fx. And you know what that means!


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 16, 2012)

Hey just curb your silver covered shrimp eating habit for 12 hours and thats like 2k right there.


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## in-pursuit (Feb 16, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Cuz you favor the G#0? Or a high A? I'm torn about adding that G#0 or not.



I was selfishly hoping you'd go down to G#0, mostly just as a matter of curiosity. as it stands I'm adding 3 strings and going over an octave and a half below what I usually use so I thought I'd draw the line there, but there is this nagging voice in the back of my head that keeps askings me "why didn't you just go for the extra string? why, why, why, hmmm?" 

I definitely understand how you feel though. it's so hard and it is a big leap of faith when there's no real way of trying beforehand and in this case no real way of even hearing how it would sound before you decide to drop the $$$.


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## Hollowway (Feb 16, 2012)

in-pursuit said:


> I was selfishly hoping you'd go down to G#0, mostly just as a matter of curiosity. as it stands I'm adding 3 strings and going over an octave and a half below what I usually use so I thought I'd draw the line there, but there is this nagging voice in the back of my head that keeps askings me "why didn't you just go for the extra string? why, why, why, hmmm?"
> 
> I definitely understand how you feel though. it's so hard and it is a big leap of faith when there's no real way of trying beforehand and in this case no real way of even hearing how it would sound before you decide to drop the $$$.



Yeah, it's mostly the pickup choices that are going to make the decision, I think. The 9 string will fit Lace pups, but the 10 would need customs. And I want to do something more aggressive than the Villex I have in my 10 from last year. And Tom suggested a downtuned instrument, so B0-D4, (or just drop B) and then I could get everything except for G#, A, A#. In that sense I'm not sure it makes sense to add a whole other string for 3 notes.


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## Hollowway (Feb 16, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> You could wire it for two outs then use something like an afx that has two ins that let you run two completely different signal chains, that way you could keep bass notes from sounding overly bassy and treble notes from sounding overly harsh.



You know, the other thing I could do is do overly slanted pickups. I always wanted to try that. So the treble side would be closer to the neck than normal and the bass side closer to the bridge. Kind of like Durero's custom crazy-axe guitar.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 16, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> You know, the other thing I could do is do overly slanted pickups. I always wanted to try that. So the treble side would be closer to the neck than normal and the bass side closer to the bridge. Kind of like Durero's custom crazy-axe guitar.



Yeah actually the multiple outs idea is something I learned about when he was teaching me here in Vancouver when I was a wee lad. He's actually going to build a full blown multi out system so each string has it's own out. I forget how exactly everything works and whatnot but it's really really cool and I'm excited to see his builds once he gets going.


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## in-pursuit (Feb 16, 2012)

yeah he has a very good point. my 9 will basically be standard tuning down to the 7th, then 8th and 9th strings dropped a tone each. when you think of it that way, in terms of range, an extra string doesn't seem to hold its value much. but to me the extra strings aren't just about going lower and getting a wider total range, but also being able to span a wider range in a single hand position. an extra string is always going to give you at a minimum an extra 5 semitones if you stay in one position, an extra 7 if you go for a "dropped" 10th string. 

just thinking out loud if I may, by having a 10 string guitar with the low string dropped all the way down from G# to E, you could effectively span 4 octaves in a single hand position.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Feb 17, 2012)

> Yeah actually the multiple outs idea is something I learned about when he was teaching me here in Vancouver when I was a wee lad. He's actually going to build a full blown multi out system so each string has it's own out. I forget how exactly everything works and whatnot but it's really really cool and I'm excited to see his builds once he gets going.


 
Check out this guy- Paul Rubenstein - Instruments

He makes hexaphonic magnetic pickups, single string pickups and custom pickups in any string number with individual outs for each string. He was making the breakout/fanout boxes too. I haven't talked to Paul in a year or so but he's good option for a guitar with every string having it's own output. 



> yeah he has a very good point. my 9 will basically be standard tuning down to the 7th, then 8th and 9th strings dropped a tone each. when you think of it that way, in terms of range, an extra string doesn't seem to hold its value much. but to me the extra strings aren't just about going lower and getting a wider total range, but also being able to span a wider range in a single hand position. an extra string is always going to give you at a minimum an extra 5 semitones if you stay in one position, an extra 7 if you go for a "dropped" 10th string.


I like tunings where each lower string is only a one step lower than the previous. I also like reentrant tunings. Check out the classical 10 and alto 11 string tunings.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Feb 17, 2012)

Oops! I almost forgot to mention that I picked up some things for this build at Rare Woods USA yesterday. I need to spend some time today milling the lumber but then I'll take pics. I'll send the pics to Holloway and let him enjoy them first though ; )


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## TomAwesome (Feb 17, 2012)

Lookin' fancy!



Hollowway said:


> You know, the other thing I could do is do overly slanted pickups. I always wanted to try that. So the treble side would be closer to the neck than normal and the bass side closer to the bridge. Kind of like Durero's custom crazy-axe guitar.



Actually, I'd imagine that would help keep the tonal balance more consistent, especially over such a broad range. Not a bad idea at all.


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## Hollowway (Feb 18, 2012)

So we decided on a macassar ebony neck and a yellowy birdseye maple FB with a macassar ebony binding. I've wanted an ebony neck since I saw the Jackson CS guitar with one (somebody on here had). And I thought the birdseye would have a cool "inset" look if the neck and binding were the same wood. 

Anyway, here's the ebony Tom picked up:


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## Hollowway (Feb 20, 2012)

Tom picked up the Birdseye. I reeeeally wanted to put a heartwood/sapwood FB on this guitar (since I've wanted one for so long) but I'm concerned that it would be too busy with the buckeye. So we decided on birdseye. Tom says it's actually less white than it appears in the photos, plus he's going to use an amber tinted oil varnish, which should yellow it a little to match the yellow of the body.

In other news, I contacted virtually everyone who might make custom pickups, and Pete from Vintage Vibe got back to me saying he's totally up for it. If I did a 9 string I could use the Lace bars, but I'd need a custom for the 10. So now I'm back to thinking about the 10 again. Arrrrggghhh! I'm going back and forth.
Lastly, I'm thinking I will do the fan of the pickups so that the neck pup is the same fan as the bridge. That puts the bass side a little closer to the bridge to get a little crisper tone.


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## Thrashmanzac (Feb 20, 2012)

holy shit, that ebony and birdseye looks amazing!


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## elq (Feb 20, 2012)

Hollowway said:


>


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## Hollowway (Mar 12, 2012)

OK, fellas, I have a question. I've decided to do G#0 to E (so a 10 string) and I'm going to do a 5" fan. (I tried the 6" fan and it's too difficult to handle the chording at the 1-3 frets.) The question is should I do 27-32" or 28-33"?


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## Solodini (Mar 13, 2012)

26-31?


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## Purelojik (Mar 13, 2012)

macassar ebony binding? thats awesome but with my limited experience working with that wood for my fretboard. the thing is suuuper hard and brittle. how do you make it a binding? im really curious


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## Hollowway (Mar 13, 2012)

Purelojik said:


> macassar ebony binding? thats awesome but with my limited experience working with that wood for my fretboard. the thing is suuuper hard and brittle. how do you make it a binding? im really curious



It's a one step process for me: Have Tom do it.  

Actually, I don't much know the answer to that, but he didn't seem concerned.


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## Hollowway (Mar 13, 2012)

Solodini said:


> 26-31?



Yeah I could, but since I'm only going to E4 I don't really need to shorter scale length, so I'd rather reserve the fan for the low end and go 32 or 33".


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## Danukenator (Mar 13, 2012)

I've been saving up for an OAF before collage takes the ability to get one for the next twenty years. Damn, the gas shall kill me!


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## Hollowway (Mar 24, 2012)

So this is officially a semi hollow build now. I'm trying to come up with some interesting sound holes. I'll let Eric have a stab at it, since he's the pro, but I messed around on the computer last night and came up with a few options. Any one of them stand out over the others? Or does it look too weird to have such a straight line with a curvy body?


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## thrsher (Mar 24, 2012)

I like the third one


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## Munch (Mar 25, 2012)

Damn, I like all but #2. I think #3 meshes the best with the bevel on the top edge though. Man, this is going to be so rad.


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## mountainjam (Mar 25, 2012)

I like #3


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## BlackMastodon (Mar 25, 2012)

Definitely 3. Number 2 and 4 remind me too much of the Adidas logo.


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## Miek (Mar 25, 2012)

I think it looks too much like the addidas logo either way, try doing some kind of implied circle on one end of the rays, so it looks like the imperial Japanese flag


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

Miek said:


> I think it looks too much like the addidas logo either way, try doing some kind of implied circle on one end of the rays, so it looks like the imperial Japanese flag



 I would, but I already have that underway with my KxK scale 8 semi-hollow:


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## Miek (Mar 25, 2012)

That was actually where I got the idea!


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

Couple of other ideas I mocked up. I think it might look cool to have the cuts extend to the edge of the guitar.


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## Solodini (Mar 25, 2012)

I'd say number 1 is the best, by far. The lines look better perpendicular (ish) to the straight line of the body shape and the subtle curve gives it enough variation to detract from being to Adidas, as well add blending with the body curves.

The straight lines of of the edge of the guitar are cool but possibly uncomfortable, impractical to make and easy to damage.


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## Winspear (Mar 25, 2012)

Jesus christ this is going to be awesome. You're making me GAS for more stuff!

I think following the shape of the body with the cuts would be cool, like this:






So with the straight edge of the body they are straight like you did, but the ends of them follow the curve like the red line.

That bodyshape is incredible.


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

Solodini said:


> and easy to damage.



Crap, that's actually a really good point. I didn't think of that.


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## Necromagnon (Mar 25, 2012)

Great design! Modern, smooth, sexy!






Purelojik said:


> macassar ebony binding? thats awesome but with my limited experience working with that wood for my fretboard. the thing is suuuper hard and brittle. how do you make it a binding? im really curious


Bending Iron. When the ebony is around 2 mm thick, a little wet and heat at around 140°, it's like chewing gum.


PS: I also prefer the 1st version, and I prefer as it's drawn.


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## Rap Hat (Mar 25, 2012)

I know it might be a little fragile, but I think the first pic in the extended edge set looks the best by far. Properly futuristic and blends well with the lines of the guitar. It might get in the way of your arm while playing though.

1, 2, and 4 of the first set could use a slight curving of some of the lines to match the outer edge and bevel.


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## scherzo1928 (Mar 25, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Couple of other ideas I mocked up. I think it might look cool to have the cuts extend to the edge of the guitar.


 
I really really like this one. But I would advise agaist it with a buckeye burl top. Maybe with something like maple or normal ash.

It's given me some nice ideas for one of my axes though... since it will be very heavily chamebered I might add some soundholes, and those are very tempting.


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## technomancer (Mar 25, 2012)

I have no comments on what to do, but just wanted to say that design is awesome


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## s_k_mullins (Mar 25, 2012)

technomancer said:


> I have no comments on what to do, but just wanted to say that design is awesome



^ This  
The designs are great!


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## UnderTheSign (Mar 25, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Couple of other ideas I mocked up. I think it might look cool to have the cuts extend to the edge of the guitar.


This one, all the way.


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

I did one more, and Tom said this is more what he'd be leaning toward. Definitely more conservative, but I do like the aggressiveness of the multiple slices in the others.


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## Purelojik (Mar 25, 2012)

that is a killer body shape dude!


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

Purelojik said:


> that is a killer body shape dude!



Yeah, thanks. It was designed by our own urklvt (Eric) based on a couple of body styles I like and the want to have bevels cut out to reveal the back body wood.


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## Solodini (Mar 25, 2012)

Have you thought of just having a cut away follow the body contour? What I mean is, for my tele, I plan to have a sound hole which is S shaped follow the shape of the body. Try a body shaped parallel sound hole.


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2012)

Solodini said:


> Have you thought of just having a cut away follow the body contour? What I mean is, for my tele, I plan to have a sound hole which is S shaped follow the shape of the body. Try a body shaped parallel sound hole.



Yeah, that's what I tried to do in that last iteration. Is that what you mean?


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## Winspear (Mar 26, 2012)

Yeah I guess he didn't see that picture yet  I like that, it looks great.


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## Solodini (Mar 26, 2012)

Kinda but extended to follow the concave bit as well. It would kinda be like a reversed modern f hole.


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## trickae (Mar 26, 2012)

dude tha guitar looks awesome


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## Necromagnon (Mar 26, 2012)

Solodini said:


> Kinda but extended to follow the concave bit as well. It would kinda be like a reversed modern f hole.


I think it will make a to huge sound hole. 
IMO, what I like here, is it's very discrete, small size, sexy. It reminds me, in fact.


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## Hollowway (Jun 17, 2012)

OK, guys, I need a little more input. Which design do you like better? Eric (urklvt) did a scooped version, which is kind of cool, but I can't decide.


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## Erazoender (Jun 17, 2012)

Very nice, but I feel like that extreme of a fan is going to rape your hands.

But if you're comfortable with it, I think I'm lenient with the 2nd design. While I think the first one is really cool as it looks like a reverse explorer, the second one has more balance in its design. Flows better imo. Can't go wrong with either though.


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## Hollowway (Jun 17, 2012)

Yeah, it's a 5" fan. Being 10 strings, it doesn't feel as wide (on the fret find printout). I think it will be a bit of a challenge to adapt to, but I really need a long lower end length to be able to use thinner strings (which I love). And I have trouble with stretches on my 28.625" Intrepid, so I can't really go much longer there.


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## Solodini (Jun 17, 2012)

#2, for the above reasons.


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## Necromagnon (Jun 17, 2012)

The same.


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## BlackMastodon (Jun 17, 2012)

Definitely number 2. Seems to flow a lot better with the fan of the strings.


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## IB-studjent- (Jun 17, 2012)

2!


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## Winspear (Jun 17, 2012)

2! I love scoops, but looks aside that will just be so much more comfortable (if you play in classical position)


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## skeels (Jun 17, 2012)

All I can say is...

HOLY FREAKING BALLS! !!!!!

Sorry I can't be of more assistance ...



Did I say holy freaking balls?

I did? 

Okay. Good...

Okay ...(deep breath)... scoop and cutouts to edge ...

Whew.. need a nap now...


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## Durero (Jun 17, 2012)

I like 2 too.


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## TemjinStrife (Jun 17, 2012)

No scoop for me. The Jazz-bass style lower bout looks a lot cleaner.


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## Winspear (Jun 18, 2012)

I forgot to mention, that's like, the nicest design I've seen. Ever.


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## Hollowway (Aug 19, 2012)

Ok people of Sevenstring, lend me your eyes!

We've got buckeye burl for the top, mahogany for the body, Macassar ebony for the neck, and I can't decide if I like Birdseye maple or this yellow heart like stuff. Which do you think would look best?


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## ThePhilosopher (Aug 19, 2012)

Birdseye, I friggin' love birdseye.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Aug 19, 2012)

Dunno but this is awesome. I love eric's designs too, I usually am not one for ergo stuff but he makes them look like Lisa Ann


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## in-pursuit (Aug 19, 2012)

is that yellow heart in the second pic? it looks very nice.


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## Hollowway (Aug 19, 2012)

in-pursuit said:


> is that yellow heart in the second pic? it looks very nice.



Yup. I thought about going with that because the buckeye has so much yellow in it. I love Birdseye, but I don't want it to clash with the yellow in the buckeye. Basically I want the woods to match as well as possible. What do you think?


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## in-pursuit (Aug 19, 2012)

I'm leaning pretty strongly towards that yellow heart, I know I would pick that if it were my choice. I know what you mean about the birdseye clashing, I think it would probably end up being too pale against the buckeye.


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## TomAwesome (Aug 20, 2012)

Hollowway said:


>



Thisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisonethisone.


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## Hollowway (Aug 21, 2012)

Ok, next question guys: bloodwood neck or ebony neck (dark Macassar - maybe dyed more black)? I'm stuck on the damn FB and neck wood. (the body will be mahogany if that helps).


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## ThePhilosopher (Aug 21, 2012)

Bloodwood would be a nice contrasty color I think.

And I want to have the only multi-scale ebony neck in 2012.


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## Electric Wizard (Aug 21, 2012)

Bloodwood would be pretty unique. I think depending on the exact hue it could look either really cool or a bit off.

I think ebony would go no matter how your particular pieces were specifically colored, but in my opinion it lacks the uniqueness that your other choices like yellowheart and bloodwood have. (Which in reality doesn't mean much other than your e-penis length around guitar forum snobs)


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## Hollowway (Aug 23, 2012)

^ Yeah, that's the challenge. Not being able to actually see the woods in person means that it could be super cool or totally obnoxious. I can definitely see the advantage to living near an exotic wood joint and going in and holding the woods.


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## Winspear (Aug 23, 2012)

Photobucket makes me sad.


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## skisgaar (Feb 2, 2013)

Is this even a thing anymore?


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## DeathClown (Feb 25, 2013)

Oh god, please finish this!


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## Hollowway (Feb 25, 2013)

Yup. This build is going to have the mahogany body, buckeye top, Ceylon satinwood FB, bloodwood neck. There's going to be a thin ebony slice between the body and top, too. We just increased the fan to 6", and are going with a 27-33" length. I'm not sure when Tom will actually start, but he's got the new shop up and running now, so I think it's just a matter of time.

I ended up moving the Mac ebony neck and Birdseye FB over to my headless XEN 9. That one will have a burled maple top and bloodwood body. Same situation on that, build wise. Hopefully soon! 

Also, I'm leaning toward Aaron from Black Water to do the pups for the 10 string. I haven't actually heard his pickups, be he will do custom stuff, and will use wood bobbins.


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## joebalaguer (Feb 25, 2013)

Hollowway said:


> I did one more, and Tom said this is more what he'd be leaning toward. Definitely more conservative, but I do like the aggressiveness of the multiple slices in the others.



REALLY dig this.


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## ixlramp (Feb 26, 2013)

Good to see you going with such long scales, the low G# needs all the scale it can get. G# is the lowest i've ever tuned and that's on a 35" bass. Gorgeous design and a fascinating project.


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## Hollowway (Feb 26, 2013)

ixlramp said:


> Good to see you going with such long scales, the low G# needs all the scale it can get. G# is the lowest i've ever tuned and that's on a 35" bass. Gorgeous design and a fascinating project.



Yeah, and even at 33" I'm worried about the tone. But there's a limit to how far I can go with the scale length on the high E and B. I want to keep some mellowness to those, and I don't think I can deal with a larger fan and still do barre chords on the lower frets. This is definitely a situation where Dan's (Oni) e-frets (or whatever those crazy curved ones are called) would be awesome, because you could increase the curve toward the bass side and maybe eke out another inch or two.


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## ixlramp (Feb 28, 2013)

Don't worry, there are 33" scale ERBs out there with C#0 and F#0 strings and the owners are very happy, it's more down to string and construction quality. Perhaps a good idea to keep the lowest tuner post a good distance from the nut (3 inches) so that you can use bass strings such as the super flexible Circle Ks for the lowest strings. Having more choice for the low strings will make life easier, otherwise you may be dependant on custom strings from O4P


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## ixlramp (Feb 28, 2013)

... so i suggest using guitar saddles that also work with bass ball ends, and slotted top load too since you may eventually want to use gauges of around .150 for the G#. The thicker a string is the higher it's minimum practical tension is, i find that 30 pounds is the very rough minimum for strings of around .145 although i realise a guitarist would be comfortable going a little looser. I was using a .145 tuned to G#0 on 35" and it was right on the borderline of loosing good tone and being impractically floppy, i have an extremely light touch too. So i am thinking you may want to use strings of around .145+ for G#.

String through body would create a sharp angle over the saddle which thick strings do not like, you would be forced to try and find strings with a very long tapered section. Also you would not be able to use CK bass strings which seem to be the best and most flexible super-thick strings available, they seem to work just as well for guitar as for bass. CK guitar strings are not long enough for your design and only go up to .106.

As for the tuners, since you're going 4+6 you have some leeway there too move the upper tuner posts away from the nut by one inch, to allow you to use bass strings.


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## Hollowway (Mar 7, 2013)

Update: here's the latest design, 27-33". Now I'm Oakland Axe Factory and XEN Instruments biggest fan - literally!


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## Stealthdjentstic (Mar 7, 2013)

I really want that shape as a headless 7. Omnom.


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## Hollowway (Mar 7, 2013)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> I really want that shape as a headless 7. Omnom.



Yes, but that little piece on the headstock is cold hardened steel, sharpened to a scimitar blade. A headless, on the other hand, is too blunt of an object for the br00tz.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Mar 7, 2013)

That headstock does look pretty badass! You need to order 7's from now on so i can buy them off you!


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## Brill (Mar 7, 2013)

lol those pickups are huge.
looks fucking awesome


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## IkarusOnFire (Mar 8, 2013)

I'm really diggin the headstock shape. Making a headstock that has style and originality is extremely difficult. Props on that.

Concerning bloodwood vs ebony for a neck, you should take into consideration that bloodwood will turn rather brownish with age. Even with a finish. While UV treatment may halt the process, it will loose that great bloodred luster


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## Durero (Mar 8, 2013)

Very nice!


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## Winspear (Mar 8, 2013)

That is super badass.


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## thrsher (Mar 8, 2013)

really intrigued about how you will like to bloodwood body/neck on each build! cant wait to see these comes to life


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## XEN (Mar 8, 2013)

Are we going to have to make it a standard xen model?


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## Hollowway (Mar 8, 2013)

IkarusOnFire said:


> I'm really diggin the headstock shape. Making a headstock that has style and originality is extremely difficult. Props on that.
> 
> Concerning bloodwood vs ebony for a neck, you should take into consideration that bloodwood will turn rather brownish with age. Even with a finish. While UV treatment may halt the process, it will loose that great bloodred luster



Huh. I read that bloodwood was the only reddish wood that didn't brown wih age, unlike paduak, purplehart, etc. I don't mind a bit of browning, but I don't want a poo neck, either.


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## IkarusOnFire (Mar 9, 2013)

Hollowway said:


> Huh. I read that bloodwood was the only reddish wood that didn't brown wih age, unlike paduak, purplehart, etc. I don't mind a bit of browning, but I don't want a poo neck, either.



As far as I know - all these dark red woods go darker. However, I would take a luthiers advice over mine - since I have but the internet and a set of Staunton chess pieces to back me up 

Anyway, to add some visuals to what my experience with the wood is, I'll post some pictures of my chess set here:
First one is just the bloodwood part of the set, the second one I put a piece in with the boxwood part, which looks like a lot like maple  Second picture is not a very good example of color, and don't mind the dusty shelf 













//M

EDIT: Also bear in mind, that my screen (and most likely most the screens you guys are using) aren't calibrated to show real color - so some might find this to be either very bright or dark  I also realize, this may invalidate these visuals completely, but oh well...take or leave it


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## Hollowway (Mar 9, 2013)

That rook has a pretty sweet deep wine color. If the bloodwood darkens to that, I'd be totally fine with it. It's the brown color I want to avoid. Thanks for the pics, too! It's nice to actually see something that has aged.


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## jimwratt (Mar 10, 2013)

Dis gon be gud


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## IkarusOnFire (Mar 10, 2013)

Hollowway said:


> That rook has a pretty sweet deep wine color. If the bloodwood darkens to that, I'd be totally fine with it. It's the brown color I want to avoid. Thanks for the pics, too! It's nice to actually see something that has aged.




No problem there mister - glad to be of help. It does have this dark wine look to it, definately better than the other red woods when ages imho 

Also finishes nicely!


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## Pikka Bird (Mar 10, 2013)

Ikarus: Have you been reenacting "This land" with those dinosaurs?


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## JEngelking (Mar 10, 2013)

God damn is this thing intense. Looking forward to seeing the end product.


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## penguin_316 (Mar 10, 2013)

I think the design so far is sounding pretty cool, but i dont care for any of the suggested F-hole designs.


Having said that, remember....Bloodwood, Ebony, Purpleheart are all heavy woods for a neck. I know from experience, do you homework to avoid neck dive. Purpleheart is like the concrete of wood though if you want to use a stinger of it.


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## IkarusOnFire (Mar 10, 2013)

Pikka Bird said:


> Ikarus: Have you been reenacting "This land" with those dinosaurs?



Haha, I was just waiting for someone to comment on those... I've been playing Dino-riders!


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## Yimmj (Mar 13, 2013)

talk about pushing the absolute limit of creativty and imagination off the cliff into an ocean of originality, holy F*** thats cool


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## CD1221 (Mar 23, 2013)

.... update?????


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## Hollowway (Mar 24, 2013)

CD1221 said:


> .... update?????



No real update. I think Tom is working on the run he's doing so I don't think he's started this yet. I also have a XEN 9 on order, and I don't think he started that yet, either. Hopefully soon, though!


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## CD1221 (Mar 24, 2013)

I am just impatient.This beast needs to be born!


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## Eden57 (Mar 24, 2013)

You've been holding out on me Hollowway, this is gorgeous!!

I've never seen a buckeye burl, that looks like something you'd see from Hubble!


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## Danukenator (Mar 24, 2013)

I'll note, Eric it is an absolute pleasure to deal with on custom stuff like this. I wanted a change made to the HSC model and in a couple days he came back with the HCC model.


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## Nag (Mar 24, 2013)

just seen the latest design on page 6, and I was like.... fuck, this thing's gonna get bigger than Tom's ViK 

some dudes like it big...


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## crg123 (Mar 24, 2013)

This is going to be incredible.


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## Hollowway (Mar 25, 2013)

I'll post up the final drawing again soon. Eric and I decided to go back to the previous sound holes (the ones on the top and bottom at the waist of the body). The XEN sound hole just looked too cramped wherever it went. The XEN 9 we're doing will have the new sound hole, though. I literally can just barely contain myself in trying to wait for these. I want to go to sleep and wake up when they're done!


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