# Blackmachine B6+1



## StevenC (Apr 24, 2019)

They're finally making 7 string B6s!

Here's the prototype:


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 24, 2019)

Well that's not confusing.


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## narad (Apr 24, 2019)

About time. Looking good.


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## WiseSplinter (Apr 24, 2019)

Nice! I don't see anything about this on their website though, do they have a private forum or social media group where they release this info?
Also ... Blackmachine do headless guitars now? Was not expecting that when I landed on the their page.


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## StevenC (Apr 24, 2019)

Feline posted it on Facebook.

£2900 for this prototype


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## Defyantly (Apr 24, 2019)

For some reason to my eyes this looks like a super chunky guitar.


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## Wolfhorsky (Apr 24, 2019)

I could care less about it. Srsly after all these years... a sevenstring B6? Wow.


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## jephjacques (Apr 24, 2019)

I mean, good job finally coming out with one after the market has done an end-run around them, I guess


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## Flappydoodle (Apr 24, 2019)

And that's if you can get the guys at Feline to actually reply to emails, answer the phone, or provide any sort of service at all.

A year or so ago I fancied the idea of a B6. No reply. I was back in the UK, called them. No answer.

Hardly confidence inspiring when they're asking almost £3K for something


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## cardinal (Apr 24, 2019)

Looks like a 7-string Blackmachine. Glad to see it available.


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## Humbuck (Apr 24, 2019)

I never had any problem communicating with Feline...hell, I even got an email return from Doug.


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## Jonathan20022 (Apr 24, 2019)

These are utterly boring instruments, if anyone's perfected the art of selling the silhouette of something desirable. It's Blackmachine and Feline.


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## Albake21 (Apr 24, 2019)

Cool? Horrible name and too many years, too late. £2900 ($3750 USD) is just not worth compared to how many options we have now a days.


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## narad (Apr 24, 2019)

Jonathan20022 said:


> These are utterly boring instruments, if anyone's perfected the art of selling the silhouette of something desirable. It's Blackmachine and Feline.



Well, boring to some, minimalist to others. A flatmate once said my B6 was my nicest looking and sounding instrument. I don't agree with either of those, but there is some charm to it. 

£2900 is a bit high I think compared to Dylan, or Waghorn, purely on the grounds of customization and customer service, but for what it is, it looks like a nice guitar. And Feline's fretwork has always looked really nice. He's a British luthier, so you're only go so low on price.


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## cardinal (Apr 24, 2019)

My opinion, which probably isn't even worth $0.02, is this: it's the iconic Blackmachine look, an official "Blackmachine" product, and presumably will be readily available and high quality. Wish it were cheaper (and a B6+2), but if you want these things, this is what you've got to pay.


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## BigViolin (Apr 24, 2019)

I'd hit it.


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## Lemonbaby (Apr 24, 2019)

Are Blackmachines still a thing? On the other hand, companies like Ormsby still seem to sell their copies...


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## Mathemagician (Apr 24, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Well that's not confusing.



B-7 was already taken by Jackson. Lol.


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## Lorcan Ward (Apr 24, 2019)

This was made about 3-4 years ago to test out blackbird 7 pickups. Feline has enough work with their own line of guitars and tech work so they only make a handful of blackmachines every so often. There's guys in the Uk who could churn them out for Doug but that's not his thing. The market is still there for them anyway.


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## Ed the sock (Apr 24, 2019)

Lorcan Ward said:


> This was made about 3-4 years ago to test out blackbird 7 pickups. Feline has enough work with their own line of guitars and tech work so they only make a handful of blackmachines every so often. There's guys in the Uk who could churn them out for Doug but that's not his thing. The market is still there for them anyway.



They are primarily a busy repair shop, so that work has always come first, and a strong reputation for fretwork, so lots of players around London use them for that.
Not very good with email, but you ALWAYS get through on the phone - assuming you call when they are open.


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## Chrisesp (Apr 24, 2019)

Flappydoodle said:


> And that's if you can get the guys at Feline to actually reply to emails, answer the phone, or provide any sort of service at all.
> 
> A year or so ago I fancied the idea of a B6. No reply. I was back in the UK, called them. No answer.
> 
> Hardly confidence inspiring when they're asking almost £3K for something



Similar experience. Emailed them about the availability of a B6 for when I return to the UK. Jonathan replied saying it was perfect timing, they were just finishing some etc. I replied with some queries I had and nothing was ever heard again, despite a follow up email. Lost my interest right there.


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## narad (Apr 24, 2019)

Chrisesp said:


> Similar experience. Emailed them about the availability of a B6 for when I return to the UK. Jonathan replied saying it was perfect timing, they were just finishing some etc. I replied with some queries I had and nothing was ever heard again, despite a follow up email. Lost my interest right there.



Same here.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 24, 2019)

Flappydoodle said:


> And that's if you can get the guys at Feline to actually reply to emails, answer the phone, or provide any sort of service at all.
> 
> A year or so ago I fancied the idea of a B6. No reply. I was back in the UK, called them. No answer.
> 
> Hardly confidence inspiring when they're asking almost £3K for something





Chrisesp said:


> Similar experience. Emailed them about the availability of a B6 for when I return to the UK. Jonathan replied saying it was perfect timing, they were just finishing some etc. I replied with some queries I had and nothing was ever heard again, despite a follow up email. Lost my interest right there.





narad said:


> Same here.



Pshhh...you guys just aren't cool enough. 

You wouldn't understand.


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## narad (Apr 24, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Pshhh...you guys just aren't cool enough.
> 
> You wouldn't understand.



It just lends more credence to the authenticity of Feline's operations, because Doug has a long history of ignoring my emails, or only replying to the first and not the follow ups. Jonathan proudly continues the legacy!


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## Flappydoodle (Apr 24, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Pshhh...you guys just aren't cool enough.
> 
> You wouldn't understand.



Seriously. I wondered if there's a special handshake or something. Or I need to attach a screenshot of my bank balance so he'll take me seriously. Such a strange operation. But if they're super busy, backlogged etc., I suppose they don't need to worry about pleasing people.



Ed the sock said:


> They are primarily a busy repair shop, so that work has always come first, and a strong reputation for fretwork, so lots of players around London use them for that.
> Not very good with email, but you ALWAYS get through on the phone - assuming you call when they are open.



Since you seem to know more about them, do they happen to keep any B6 models in stock? i.e. if I physically went to the store, would I be able to play one?


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## illimmigrant (Apr 25, 2019)

I could have sworn the hype for these guitars was long dead. Seems to me they took too long.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Apr 25, 2019)

Meh. Call me when they'll let you customize it at all. 

Don't get me wrong, it's a cool addition and I'd love a B6[+1] (lol), but it just seems so unnecessarily locked down.


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## BigViolin (Apr 25, 2019)

Demand exceeds supply and will continue to, so no they don't need to care about you or me and our screwed up sense of consumer entitlement.


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## Chrisesp (Apr 25, 2019)

BigViolin said:


> Demand exceeds supply and will continue to, so no they don't need to care about you or me and our screwed up sense of consumer entitlement.



The thing is though, I told Jonathan on the first email that I wanted one, and it wasn't like I was stringing him along email after email. My second email was simply asking what the deposit and total price would be, what other pickup options were available, and whether or not it had had stainless steel frets (all of which aren't stated on their website), but I never heard back from him.


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## Ordacleaphobia (Apr 25, 2019)

BigViolin said:


> entitlement.



God it irks me how often people use this word improperly.


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## Velokki (Apr 26, 2019)

Jonathan's a top-of-the-line builder. My B6 was immaculate. But his business skills... well, there are none. I swear that sales and the business side of things are painful for him - he's much more of a creative artisan, who would probably gladly outsource everything regarding the business side. I really think that he could do a lot better if there was a part-time marketing guy doing everything else for him, and he could just focus on the building.

I think this is a really big problem with builders. People who build great guitars aren't usually great businessmen. The personality types just rarely match. That's why you rarely see an engineer doing sales records, or a great sales guy doing breakthrough clinical research, haha!


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## Andromalia (Apr 28, 2019)

That's an expensive bare plank of ash.
Those must be pretty cheap to do, all things considered. Never really got the BM hype other than ebony tops look cool.


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## narad (Apr 28, 2019)

Not like it would take a lot of time or effort to put a quilt maple slice on it and stain it some sick color, but that's just not the brand. It'd be like blackmachine copying skervesen copying blackmachine.


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## Flappydoodle (Apr 28, 2019)

Velokki said:


> Jonathan's a top-of-the-line builder. My B6 was immaculate. But his business skills... well, there are none. I swear that sales and the business side of things are painful for him - he's much more of a creative artisan, who would probably gladly outsource everything regarding the business side. I really think that he could do a lot better if there was a part-time marketing guy doing everything else for him, and he could just focus on the building.
> 
> I think this is a really big problem with builders. People who build great guitars aren't usually great businessmen. The personality types just rarely match. That's why you rarely see an engineer doing sales records, or a great sales guy doing breakthrough clinical research, haha!



Every Dylan needs a Barnes, haha

Those two really were great. I had questions, and Barnes answered everything with patience, professionalism and was very clear about everything. I get the feeling that Dylan doesn't enjoy the business side either, so it's really good to have a partner to handle that sort of thing.

But for Feline, if they're already backed up etc., can't really blame him for not hiring somebody to try and attract more customers.


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## Lorcan Ward (Apr 28, 2019)

A lot of people have asked but Doug says no. He wants the specs kept as is and leave any wood combos to his other guitars. You could just order a custom Feline for a lot less with higher specs. Doug chose Jonathan since they're friends rather than Feline's ability to supply the demand for B6s. If only Doug had pushed for a production line and expanded the BM business like Strandberg with multiple levels. 


I had a guitar re-fretted by Feline, it wasn't much hassle, got lucky I guess!


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## maliciousteve (Apr 28, 2019)

I've got nothing but positive experiences with Jonathan. He's modified my Strat and done a top quality job too. Even bought/traded guitars from him years ago.

I've met up with him a few times over the years and he's always been a nice chap with plenty of stories and always lets me try out his guitars (even some in progress builds). I've always had good communication with him over the phone and through emails too.


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## Velokki (Apr 29, 2019)

Yeah, and he's an amazing chap to talk to over the phone. Really helpful, knowledgeable and all-around nice dude. But the money-oriented, raw business side? He loathes it. My experience.


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## 777timesgod (May 1, 2019)

When are they going to take it to the paint room? Oh wait...


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## Backsnack (May 1, 2019)

Seems a little spendy for what that is, but is a Blackmachine, so that's to be epxected I suppose.

Are they still running a 1 year+ waitlist?


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## Velokki (May 1, 2019)

Backsnack said:


> Seems a little spendy for what that is, but is a Blackmachine, so that's to be epxected I suppose.
> 
> Are they still running a 1 year+ waitlist?


I would wager you'd get a new B6 immediately or within a 2 month timeframe. Don't know about B6+1.


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## _MonSTeR_ (May 1, 2019)

narad said:


> It'd be like blackmachine copying skervesen copying blackmachine.



i kind of imagine this as a Keanu Reeves meme?!?!?!?


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## Backsnack (May 8, 2019)

Velokki said:


> I would wager you'd get a new B6 immediately or within a 2 month timeframe. Don't know about B6+1.


That's an improvement. I seem to remember some sort of waitlist problems some years ago when their popularity was peaking around here and other guitar forums.


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## Dyingsea (May 8, 2019)

Velokki said:


> I would wager you'd get a new B6 immediately or within a 2 month timeframe. Don't know about B6+1.



Or since it's been stated the guy hates the business side you take your chance on a deposit and don't see your guitar after numerous deadlines are missed... either way. That's pretty much how all these start. Hype + no business plan = forthcoming ss.org non-delivery after 1,2,3,4,5 + years threads.


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## Humbuck (May 8, 2019)

Blackmachine B6's are not and have never really been that hard to get...new or used. You got your hype/myths mixed up.


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## Casper777 (May 9, 2019)

This type of thread make me want to sell my B6 right away... 

And I can only confirm that even being a customer of Feline with my B6 (was lucky to catch him when some B6 were available so got one in 1 week), he never replied to any other mail from me...

Imediately made me love it less haha... 

Anyway, my B6 sound good, is nice and comfy, but no magic there... and I would say the damn thing stays in tune less than my 1K korean guitars...


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## Wolfhorsky (May 9, 2019)

Casper777 said:


> (...) the damn thing stays in tune less than my 1K korean guitars...


This is not the first time i see this type of info here and there. I wonder why


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## Casper777 (May 9, 2019)

Wolfhorsky said:


> This is not the first time i see this type of info here and there. I wonder why



Shitty headstock design?!?


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## Humbuck (May 9, 2019)

Well I have 2 B6's. Older and newer versions. They both get a lot of use and they stay in tune just fine as do all my guitars.


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## Casper777 (May 9, 2019)

Humbuck said:


> Well I have 2 B6's. Older and newer versions. They both get a lot of use and they stay in tune just fine as do all my guitars.



Lucky you... maybe mine had wood that wasn't dry enough... I should settle now after 2 years 
I love the Blackbird pickups on this one though... one of my favorite pickup set ever!!


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## Jonathan20022 (May 9, 2019)

Gonna mirror that, my pair of B6's did not hold tune that well at all. Sperzel and Hipshot alike, and Hipshot makes better tuners between them, so you can infer what the weak link was there between the hardware and the instrument itself.


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## Humbuck (May 9, 2019)

What do you think the weak link was then?


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## Fred the Shred (May 9, 2019)

I am not privy to the Feline builds since what I've owned and played over the years was all Doug built, but by far the most frequent tuning killer is the nut slots and / or lubrication, when it comes to fixed bridge guitars.


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## xzacx (May 9, 2019)

IME a properly cut nut clears up most non-trem related tuning issues unless the neck is truly unstable or you’ve got some seriously shoddy hardware. Then again I prefer a blocked Floyd which holds its tuning better than any hardtail even with a properly cut nut.


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## Humbuck (May 9, 2019)

Fred the Shred said:


> I am not privy to the Feline builds since what I've owned and played over the years was all Doug built, but by far the most frequent tuning killer is the nut slots and / or lubrication, when it comes to fixed bridge guitars.



Exactly my point.


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## sakeido (May 9, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Pshhh...you guys just aren't cool enough.
> 
> You wouldn't understand.



it's true, back when I had a blackmachine deposit in Nolly knew more about my build than I ever did


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## Jake (May 9, 2019)

I've never received a response with quite serious inquiries to Feline about these so I guess I'll join that club 

I would love to acquire one of these but you know when they only pop up once every 6 months for $5k it's not worth it. I'll keep my Regiuses I guess


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## Wolfhorsky (May 9, 2019)

This thread is beginning to look like


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## Jake (May 9, 2019)

Wolfhorsky said:


> This thread is beginning to look like


Realistically at this point I'll just have Skervesen build me a raptor that I at least know I'll get


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## mlp187 (May 9, 2019)

You know how there are big box retailers that will sell gold plated HDMI cables as a necessity at an unreasonable mark-up? Then some person will buy these things and swear to high heaven that their sound quality and picture are better, therefore justifying the expense?
I feel like if I buy a Blackmachine I won't be able to help becoming one of those people.
That being said, I still love the aesthetics.


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## Humbuck (May 9, 2019)

They're just not for everybody.


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## Flappydoodle (May 9, 2019)

Jake said:


> Realistically at this point I'll just have Skervesen build me a raptor that I at least know I'll get



Plus you can customise it


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## Wolfhorsky (May 10, 2019)

Jake said:


> Realistically at this point I'll just have Skervesen build me a raptor that I at least know I'll get


Nebelung is superior to Raptor imho.


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## 777timesgod (May 10, 2019)

Casper777 said:


> Lucky you... maybe mine had wood that wasn't dry enough... I should settle now after 2 years
> I love the Blackbird pickups on this one though... one of my favorite pickup set ever!!



Perhaps the problem is at the bridge or tuners? Did you try a swap to make sure that it is not a hardware issue?


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## Xaios (May 10, 2019)

sakeido said:


> it's true, back when I had a blackmachine deposit in Nolly knew more about my build than I ever did


Shame about what happened afterwards...


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## sakeido (May 13, 2019)

Xaios said:


> Shame about what happened afterwards...



bailing for one shady, flaky custom builder for a straight up thief... I'm a dumbass.

it's been 10+ years since then and I still don't have any custom guitars except for my Suhr, which I bought already made


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## Thrashman (May 14, 2019)

So happy to see this finished. Remember seeing the body and neck at the workshop when I was there and I was super excited.

Hopefully they'll make something out of the B4 (bass) as well, because that thing was fucking immense.


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## Xaios (May 14, 2019)

sakeido said:


> bailing for one shady, flaky custom builder for a straight up thief... I'm a dumbass.
> 
> it's been 10+ years since then and I still don't have any custom guitars except for my Suhr, which I bought already made


In fairness, Sherman had really been outed yet by that point as the crook we'd all discover that he was. From outside appearances everything seemed normal, and the guy had developed years worth of positive reputation on this site. SSO also hadn't endured nearly as many fly-by-night luthiers at that point either, so the signs weren't as obvious as they are now. I think this was all before BRJ or even the Roter debacle. Doug, meanwhile, was already known for being fairly capricious, which certainly would have made him seem like the riskier choice, and also hadn't reached the point where his guitars achieved the mythological status they have now. Who'd have known back then that people nowadays would be willing to drop some truly insane coin on his builds.


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## Ordacleaphobia (May 14, 2019)

Thrashman said:


> Hopefully they'll make something out of the B4 (bass) as well, because that thing was fucking immense.



Yo, wut? That sounds sick- are there any pictures of this floating around?


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## MAJ Meadows SF (May 17, 2019)

I am totally baffled by the headless builds. I thought that was an April fools joke. But I've been in the dark for a while.

B6+1 does look pretty nice, but I just can't get into it anymore. Good to see it finally become a production reality.


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## Musiscience (May 17, 2019)

What happened to Blackmachine during all these years? It really seems to me like this is too little too late. The hype really lost traction for most of us at this point. 

They really had a massive business opportunity to manufacture/build more guitars a few years ago. In my opinion, they could have capitalized on it when Blackmachine were considered to be the unicorns of guitars. What happened during all these years of radio silence and small batches? This brand was such a missed opportunity for Doug.


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## StevenC (May 17, 2019)

I think people need to realise that Doug isn't building guitars for fame and fortune, but because he likes to do it sometimes for his friends and occasionally other people. If he wanted to build a guitar company with regular product lines and have them available in all the stores, he would have.

Doug doesn't really care about the hype or capitalising on it.


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## Lemonbaby (May 17, 2019)

StevenC said:


> [...] wanted to build a guitar company with regular product lines and have them available in all the stores, he would have.
> 
> Doug doesn't really care about the hype or capitalising on it.


That urban legend's wide spread, but did he tell you in person? It's not like all people who didn't grow their business ideas into an empire did that on purpose. In 99% it's rather lack of business savvy, bad timing/decisions, missing skills/capital, bad luck or a mixture of those.


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## StevenC (May 17, 2019)

Lemonbaby said:


> That urban legend's wide spread, but did he tell you in person? It's not like all people who didn't grow their business ideas into an empire did that on purpose. In 99% it's rather lack of business savvy, bad timing/decisions, missing skills/capital, bad luck or a mixture of those.


Yes he did.


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## Lemonbaby (May 17, 2019)

StevenC said:


> Yes he did.


Interesting guy... do you happen to know what he does for a living?


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## StevenC (May 17, 2019)

Lemonbaby said:


> Interesting guy... do you happen to know what he does for a living?


Not a clue. Met him a few times through a mutual friend and he's always been friendly and replied to my emails. Conversation never got to that, mostly just guitar talk, design philosophy and stuff.


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## _MonSTeR_ (May 17, 2019)

I heard he likes BMX - maybe he's the world's most successful bicycle courier?


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## Lorcan Ward (May 17, 2019)

Musiscience said:


> What happened to Blackmachine during all these years? It really seems to me like this is too little too late. The hype really lost traction for most of us at this point.
> 
> They really had a massive business opportunity to manufacture/build more guitars a few years ago. In my opinion, they could have capitalized on it when Blackmachine were considered to be the unicorns of guitars. What happened during all these years of radio silence and small batches? This brand was such a missed opportunity for Doug.



IF Doug had branched out I could imagine a big Korean line of B6 and B2/B7/B8 with veneer tops, then a UK and US semi-custom shop making customer spec orders. They'd be as big as Strandberg with the right minds behind it. A number of people tried to get the ball rolling but were turned down. 

Doug scarcely built guitars for a few years but he designed a headless recently and has gotten back into it. He opened the order book for them and sold a bunch of in-stocks. The hype is still alive cause the prices were crazy.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 17, 2019)

Honestly, I think the timing is really good. 

Most of the Blackmachine clone builders are either out of business or have moved on to their own designs/copying someone else.


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## Deep Blue (May 17, 2019)

Would love this even more with those clear pickup bobbins I've seen on a few of the B6's.


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## MAJ Meadows SF (May 19, 2019)

Just from reading and listening to people who know him, not so much the few one-on-one emails, I don't think he cares to turn the brand into a commercial success. There's satisfaction in the prestige of doing something unique or just better than most others, and keeping it rare and coveted. That could partly be elitism and narcissism to some folks, though that doesn't strike me as entirely accurate for the guy. That's not to say he isn't capitalizing on the hype and flipping prices we've seen.


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## Thrashman (May 20, 2019)

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Yo, wut? That sounds sick- are there any pictures of this floating around?



I have a few lying around somewhere, I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post them though.


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## Humbuck (May 20, 2019)

Thrashman said:


> I have a few lying around somewhere, I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post them though.



Why not? I think everybody knows what it's going to look like anyhow? It's just nice to see pics.


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## Xaios (May 22, 2019)

I can't confirm this myself or tell you where I heard it (because it was years ago and I honestly don't remember), but what I remember hearing was that Doug is an aeronautical engineer or somesuch by day. Again, take with a big grain of salt.


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## prlgmnr (May 22, 2019)

I've heard he solves crimes and brings down corrupt governments by night.


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## narad (May 22, 2019)

Has anyone seen Doug and Elon Musk in the same room at the same time before?


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## Humbuck (May 23, 2019)

I've heard he was an engineer of some type as well.


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## Lozek (May 23, 2019)

Xaios said:


> I can't confirm this myself or tell you where I heard it (because it was years ago and I honestly don't remember), but what I remember hearing was that Doug is an aeronautical engineer or somesuch by day. Again, take with a big grain of salt.



No, Doug was a guitar repair guy for many years before he started building for himself.


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## Lorcan Ward (May 23, 2019)

He worked on basses a lot which is where he got the idea to use more exotic woods and stiffer neck woods for his guitars.


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## Xaios (May 23, 2019)

Lozek said:


> No, Doug was a guitar repair guy for many years before he started building for himself.


I stand corrected.


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## Ordacleaphobia (May 23, 2019)

prlgmnr said:


> I've heard he solves crimes and brings down corrupt governments by night.



He's the hero SSO deserves, but not the one it needs right now; so we'll joke about him. Because he can take it, because he's not a luthier. He's a craftsman, an artisan; *a d̶a̶r̶k̶ ̶k̶n̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ marketing machine.*


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## Soya (May 23, 2019)

I feel like he's the opposite of a marketing machine, and his customers did the work for him?


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## Ordacleaphobia (May 24, 2019)

Genius, no?


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## Lorcan Ward (May 24, 2019)

He did next to no marketing apart from guitar shows. The best marketing move he did was not doing any since that only added to the aura of them. It was right time, right guitar and the right customers/players until the hype took off and drove them to be flipped.


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## Ordacleaphobia (May 24, 2019)




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## Soya (May 24, 2019)

Really proud of that one huh?


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## jwade (May 28, 2019)

Flappydoodle said:


> And that's if you can get the guys at Feline to actually reply to emails, answer the phone, or provide any sort of service at all.
> 
> A year or so ago I fancied the idea of a B6. No reply. I was back in the UK, called them. No answer.
> 
> Hardly confidence inspiring when they're asking almost £3K for something


That’s weird, Jonathan responds nearly immediately every time I’ve ever messaged him on Facebook.


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