# Black Veil Brides uses fake cabs



## JoeyBTL (Jun 24, 2013)

Apparently this is a big deal today or something but...

Bronx drummer calls out Warped band for using "fake amps" | Punknews.org

"Our third bit of Warped Tour weirdness in the past few days as Bronx and Mariachi el Bronx drummer Jorma Vik called out Warped headlining act, Black Veil Brides for using potemkin (i.e. fake) amplifiers during their set. The drummer posted pictures of the hollow amplifiers along with a caption:

'A friend of mine took this photo at warped tour. This is what the kids are calling "rock n roll" these days. I'm lighting fire to every drum I have and becoming an investment banker.'

Black Veil Brides vocalist Andy Biersack defended this practice with this not-really-an-explanation:
'We use staging in our stage show. Also these are tattoos, I wasn't born with the batman logo on my arm.' "

As much as I really don't care for BVB, people these days need to get their heads out of their asses. I can't even begin to name the amount of bands that use dummy backlines these days and over the past ~50 years.


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## Sofos (Jun 24, 2013)

Slayer uses dummy backlines, I have no problem with it. A lot of it is advertising. Maybe their cab company wanted cabs up there, but the band had no use for them. So they just used shells.


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## rjnix_0329 (Jun 24, 2013)

Yeah...that is the insane ramblings of someone who hasn't toured extensively or even been to many concerts in the last 45 years.


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## Hyacinth (Jun 24, 2013)

Yeah...bands have been doing this for ages. BVB are a hugely faggy band, but they're not doing anything that countless HUGE names have done before them.


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## jephjacques (Jun 24, 2013)

whoooo caaaaares


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## bcolville (Jun 24, 2013)

As long as they're actually playing who cares what the stage looks like


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## JEngelking (Jun 24, 2013)




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## GRUNTKOR (Jun 24, 2013)

no worse than immortal then


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## lookslikemeband (Jun 24, 2013)

At least they're lighter to carry around. Bet their roadies are happy.


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## thrsher (Jun 24, 2013)

GRUNTKOR said:


> no worse than immortal then



are the dummys engl? that would be even funnier if they weren't


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## GRUNTKOR (Jun 24, 2013)

nah, they're marshalls!






you can see the back of the engls on the left of the picture


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## Black Mamba (Jun 24, 2013)

People are seriously upset over this?


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## Dommak89 (Jun 24, 2013)

jephjacques said:


> whoooo caaaaares



immediately remembered this



But seriously, what's the big deal?


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## thrsher (Jun 24, 2013)

if i was engl, i would use this as advertising!!! so good.


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## Señor Voorhees (Jun 24, 2013)

Because everyone knows that real rock and roll is played through 15 different full stacks at at the same time. This really isn't anything new, and whoever has their panties in a bunch needs to pick on something more important than the fake cabs... Like, you know, the shitty music.


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## Sinborn (Jun 24, 2013)

I'm gonna guess The Bronx is a punk band. Typical ignorance is typical. I'll bet he thinks Meshuggah sucks cause they don't even have fake cabs on stage.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 24, 2013)

[QUOTE="Edgy" Punk Rocker]
This is what the kids are calling "rock n roll" these days.
[/QUOTE]

Bands have been using dummy amps and cabs since the '70s, you twatwaffle.


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## ElRay (Jun 24, 2013)

JoeyBTL said:


> ... potemkin (i.e. fake) ...


How did this word:


> Potemkin 1 |p&#601;&#712;tem(p)kin|
> a battleship whose crew mutinied during the Russian Revolution of 1905 when in the Black Sea, bombarding Odessa before seeking asylum in Romania. The incident persuaded the tsar to agree to a measure of reform.


start meaning fake?

I can deal with vibrato tail pieces being called "tremolo" and I can deal with infinite radius fretboards being called "zero", but this is totally 

Ray


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## User Name (Jun 24, 2013)

total lawl at the comments section. there are really some stupid people out there haha.


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## -42- (Jun 24, 2013)

My dad was playing shows in the sixties/seventies where bands would buy amps/cabs and just leave them onstage to make their backline look impressive. Dummy cabs are nothing new and the only people who care about this are the tweens who never caught on and IMNs looking for yet another excuse to dislike Black Viel Brides.


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## Robrecht (Jun 24, 2013)

ElRay said:


> How did this word:
> 
> 
> > Potemkin 1 |p&#601;&#712;tem(p)kin|
> ...



The battleship was named after an 18th century Russian general who, according to a popular story, once erected a fake village to impress a visiting head of state. So, all in all, a pretty apt name for this phenomenon.

Those two other things will always be a mystery though.


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## xwmucradiox (Jun 24, 2013)

rjnix_0329 said:


> Yeah...that is the insane ramblings of someone who hasn't toured extensively or even been to many concerts in the last 45 years.



The Bronx were touring and putting out records when the kids in BVB were probably in elementary school. Last time I saw them the singer smashed a beer bottle on his head and then rolled in the pile of broken glass on stage.


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## Xaios (Jun 24, 2013)

xwmucradiox said:


> The Bronx were touring and putting out records when the kids in BVB were probably in elementary school. Last time I saw them the singer smashed a beer bottle on his head and then rolled in the pile of broken glass on stage.



That doesn't make his statement any less moronic.

I can find *plenty* of things not to like about BVB. Complaining about their partaking in the _*time-honored tradition*_ of fake cabs, though?

Please.


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## ArtDecade (Jun 24, 2013)

And in other news, there are weather patterns and things happening.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 24, 2013)

xwmucradiox said:


> The Bronx were touring and putting out records when the kids in BVB were probably in elementary school. Last time I saw them the singer smashed a beer bottle on his head and then rolled in the pile of broken glass on stage.



Oh, so you're confirms the theory that he is insane. Thanks.


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## User Name (Jun 24, 2013)

xwmucradiox said:


> The Bronx were touring and putting out records when the kids in BVB were probably in elementary school. Last time I saw them the singer smashed a beer bottle on his head and then rolled in the pile of broken glass on stage.


if this is true then that guy must just be insanely ignorant.


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## metal_sam14 (Jun 24, 2013)

The only reason anybody is upset about this is because they need another reason to hate BVB. 

Even John Petrucci runs dummy cabs/heads for stage show, I sure as shit would if someone would carry them for me


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## ArtDecade (Jun 24, 2013)

xwmucradiox said:


> Last time I saw them the singer smashed a beer bottle on his head and then rolled in the pile of broken glass on stage.



Sounds like a fun show... 
God, I am getting too old!


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## Heroin (Jun 24, 2013)

I don't care at all if they use dummies, as long as they're actually playing their instruments 

it's kinda weird though, I feel like its completely unnecessary and it doesn't take away or add to the show any more. I guess its just more "rock n roll" like that.


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## User Name (Jun 24, 2013)

Heroin said:


> I don't care at all if they use dummies, as long as they're actually playing their instruments
> 
> it's kinda weird though, I feel like its completely unnecessary and it doesn't take away or add to the show any more. I guess its just more "rock n roll" like that.


i for one refuse to watch any show where the band doesnt have a "wall" of "amps" behind them.


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## iamthefonz (Jun 24, 2013)

Fake amps? Please, move into the twenty first century.

We need to start setting up empty Axe-Fx units on stage. That'll show em!


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## Hyacinth (Jun 24, 2013)

iamthefonz said:


> Fake amps? Please, move into the twenty first century.
> 
> We need to start setting up empty Axe-Fx units on stage. That'll show em!



I use a literal _wall_ of dummy ENGL heads and cabs. Then I run an Axe Fx direct into the board.


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## Rick (Jun 24, 2013)

User Name said:


> i for one refuse to watch any show where the band doesnt have a "wall" of "amps" behind them.



Then don't go to a Fear Factory show.


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## WhiteWalls (Jun 24, 2013)

I want to become famous for the sole reason of having a huge wall of dummy Axe-Fxs printed on cardboard then actually using a Pocket Pod for my sound. Whoever gets me a slot on a huge festival will have the honor to take the picture, Immortal-style


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## TheWarAgainstTime (Jun 24, 2013)

I just...I can't even... 

Next thing you know, people are gonna be starting riots over bands that use IEM's or whose drummers use click tracks because, you know, consistent playing and saving your hearing are actually bad, "fake" things and rock n roll ain't about that life


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## Bloody_Inferno (Jun 24, 2013)

metal_sam14 said:


> The only reason anybody is upset about this is because they need another reason to hate BVB.


 
This.

Bands have been doing this for donkey years, so what's the point in getting upset over it just because a certain trendy band that's not well liked happens to be doing just that? Big deal.

Hell, even when there's a wall of amps onstage, not all of them are on anyway... unless you're Yngwie. 

At least Rush do it properly and are miles ahead of other bands. Their onstage gear >>>> most band's real gear:


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## PyramidSmasher (Jun 24, 2013)

Ive always wondered why the audience would ever give a shit about the size of the guitarists rig but I dont think it's cheating in any way as a guitarist to have dummy cabs.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 24, 2013)

Bloody_Inferno said:


>



Hughes and Kettner should totally start selling time machines.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Jun 24, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Hughes and Kettner should totally start selling time machines.


 
 Especially if it filters the suck out of bands with the touch of a button.


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## InfinityCollision (Jun 24, 2013)

Señor Voorhees;3612767 said:


> Because everyone knows that real rock and roll is played through 15 different full stacks at at the same time.



Yup.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 24, 2013)

"Maximum volume yields maximum results."


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## 4000 (Jun 24, 2013)

on a side note, has any band ever actually played thru that many marshall cabs before legitimately?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 24, 2013)

4000 said:


> on a side note, has any band ever actually played thru that many marshall cabs before legitimately?



See: Almost every band in the late 60's, 70's, 80's, and early 90's. 

Slayer does use real Marshall cabs under the dummy ones. The Modefour ones. Those are ....ing awesome.
And as brought up earlier, Yngwie Malmsteen uses everything in his backline.


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## EdgeC (Jun 24, 2013)

This thread reminds me of Airbourne at the Big Day Out a few years ago.


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## Ironbird (Jun 25, 2013)

I just ended up schooling a friend on Facebook over this. 

How is this new and/or wrong?


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## Datura (Jun 25, 2013)

GRUNTKOR said:


> no worse than immortal then




To be fair on immortal, their guitars don't seem to require amplifiers anyway.


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## Slunk Dragon (Jun 25, 2013)

Umm, why is this a big deal?

Unless the band claims their whole live rig is all legitimate amps and cabs, shut up and let them actually earn their living. A big point of their gig IS to ENTERTAIN, you know.


Just my 2 cents, though. *shrugs*


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## theo (Jun 25, 2013)

I don't see why fake amps are such a big deal. It's just part of the props.
Personally I like the no amps approach though 


Also another notable user of shells is Petrucci


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## mcsalty (Jun 25, 2013)

from now on during any show i play, i'm going wireless and putting my amp somewhere out of sight, and running a dummy patchcord into a bunch of empty roadcases


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## theo (Jun 25, 2013)

Better yet! buy some entry level 15W practice amp and make it appear as if you're running that live!


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## Slunk Dragon (Jun 25, 2013)

theo said:


> Better yet! buy some entry level 15W practice amp and make it appear as if you're running that live!



All the cool kids use 15W Kmart amps, not these silly, thousand dollar GOOD amps.


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## theo (Jun 25, 2013)

True tone comes from the fingers!


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## Leuchty (Jun 25, 2013)

I refuse to watch movies and plays where fake blood is used.

Its real or nothing baby...


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## Sofos (Jun 25, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> "Maximum volume yields maximum results."



My ears, from experience, can confirm those are all real. That and the fact that their live show causes blackouts in some cities.


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## BucketheadRules (Jun 25, 2013)

Bloody Inferno beat me to it, but I came here to post Rush's onstage gear. Geddy just goes direct into the sound desk I think, so uses a load of weird stuff just to fill the space - there have been time machines, refrigerators, clothes dryers, and the rotisserie ovens and steampunk time machines we saw earlier.

When he was using the rotisserie ovens he actually also had a "chef" attending to the chickens inside during shows.

He's just a badass.


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## drgamble (Jun 25, 2013)

theo said:


> Better yet! buy some entry level 15W practice amp and make it appear as if you're running that live!








If you look closely you can see that Nirvana was using the Marshall micro stacks for props onstage for the In Utero tour. I thought it was hilarious.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Jun 25, 2013)

BucketheadRules said:


> Geddy just goes direct into the sound desk



He did up until the Time Machine tours where he uses Orange Cabs offstage. Basically Geddy and Alex swapped and now Alex goes direct.


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## ArtDecade (Jun 25, 2013)

drgamble said:


> If you look closely you can see that Nirvana was using the Marshall micro stacks for props onstage for the In Utero tour. I thought it was hilarious.



Zappa beat them to it by about 25 years... He used the Pignose amp live and in the studio.


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## drgamble (Jun 25, 2013)

ArtDecade said:


> Zappa beat them to it by about 25 years... He used the Pignose amp live and in the studio.



Nirvana didn't actually use those amps, if you look even closer you can see the real Marshall miced up behind the drum riser. They were just using the mini stacks for show as a joke because most bands used a wall of dummy amps.


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## signalgrey (Jun 25, 2013)

im sorry but who the .... cares about the Warped Tour since like 2002? They have just gotten ....ing worse and more commercial every year and are miles and miles away from what it used to be about.

fake backlines? WHO GIVES A SHIT?


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## BIG ND SWEATY (Jun 25, 2013)

i think in the Anvil documentary they mic'd up some small practice amps and played that one huge show in japan, at least i think they did.


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## Don Vito (Jun 25, 2013)

signalgrey said:


> im sorry but who the .... cares about the Warped Tour since like 2002? They have just gotten ....ing worse and more commercial every year and are miles and miles away from what it used to be about.
> 
> fake backlines? WHO GIVES A SHIT?


hawt scene bishes bro

not that i've gotten any ;_;


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## ArtDecade (Jun 25, 2013)

Don Vito said:


> hawt scene bishes bro
> 
> not that i've gotten any ;_;



Careful, mate - the average age at those shows is about 16.


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## Don Vito (Jun 25, 2013)

I'm 18 it's awwwwwright( not really though ;_; )


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## Rev2010 (Jun 25, 2013)

Boy, dude got annoyed at a fake wall of amps... and didn't even know this has been common practice like forever.... maybe it's better if he gives up drumming cause any musician that finds this as a new practice has their head up their ass anyhow.

I guess we should also stop using fancy lighting, VJing, dressing up in costumes, creating animatronic band mascots, etc since in his opinion it should only be about the music, nothing more I guess huh? Some people really need more valid things to be upset about lol 


Rev.


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## ArtDecade (Jun 25, 2013)

Rev2010 said:


> Boy, dude got annoyed at a fake wall of amps... and didn't even know this has been common practice like forever.... maybe it's better if he gives up drumming cause any musician that finds this as a new practice has their head up their ass anyhow.
> 
> I guess we should also stop using fancy lighting, VJing, dressing up in costumes, creating animatronic band mascots, etc since in his opinion it should only be about the music, nothing more I guess huh? Some people really need more valid things to be upset about lol
> 
> ...



This guy has been a drummer in a punk band for over 10 years and he is still alive? He's doing it wrong. Poser.


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## Jakke (Jun 25, 2013)

How the sweet .... is dummy cabs something to get one's panties in a bunch over?

What this basically is is that angsty teenagers, the subsection of angsty teens that don't worship BvB, basically needs another reason to feel superior over other angsty teens (the ones that do like BvB) based on taste in music:
-OMG you like BvB??? Bro, they don't even use real amps live!!! I bet they don't even have real instruments!! BAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

The fact is that BvB is pretty terrible, apart from the singer having a cool voice, but there are plenty of legitimate ways of disliking them without showing one's ignorance and attack them for something major bands have been doing for some 40 years. The interesting part is furthermore that if they gave up the theatrics, they'd be a decent commercial post-grunge band, think something like Nickelback with a younger image.


Which is really tiring for the adults that have to see this bullshit. I have for some reason teen facebook friends, and I have been bitchslapping away all day. ....


I should also add that I prefer to have a good amount of stage volume from my amp, so I try to use at least one halfstack. Also, it does look kool


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## Esp Griffyn (Jun 25, 2013)

BVB absolutely stink, but this is the non-story of the century.


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## Jakke (Jul 10, 2013)

Bumbing because Machine Head:
OMG SCOOP OF THE CENTURY

And Machine Head's response:
"DOES MACHINE HEAD USE FAKE AMPS?
------------
Wow?

While it seems absurd that El Paso, Texas based radio station 95.5 FM, KLAQ Official would choose to go through the effort to post this on their website, we guess in-light of the big hub-bub about Black Veil Brides getting "called out" by the drummer for The Bronx for having "fake cabs" on the Warped tour earlier this month, some "brain-donor" over at the station has decided to drop the "newsflash of the century" and "call out" Machine Head for having "fake amps" too! A practice that for over 40 years now has been common-place in rock 'n roll going back to the days of Van Halen and AC/DC. 

For the record, Machine Head "back" ANY band that uses dummy cabs in hopes of giving their fans a better, more impressive show. That includes the Black Veil Brides, who like many young musicians (and Machine Head) use direct-to-PA amp modeling gear like Fractals and Kempers. At least Black Veil Brides are playing their instruments, and not waving their hands along to a ....ing laptop!! 

Machine Head have 2 cabinet set-carts in the shape of our diamond logo, we use half of the 4 cabs for live sound, the ones labeled "live" in the "smoking gun photos" are actually that, a real LIVE cabinet, that's plugged in (as you can see in the photo), that make sound, have real speakers, plug into a "real amp", and has a mic in front of it that sends our face-melting guitar tones out to the crowd via the PA. The ones that our guitar techs labeled (for some reason, in bright green flourescent gaff tape)"dummy" are actually real cabs too, with real speakers and everything, but we only have so many amps to power them, and really who gives a shit, because ALL the cabs are REAL!!

Quick history lesson for grizzled 24 year-old heavy metal veteran Lisa Sanchez: Since the dawn of heavy music, bands have used dummy cabinets as part of an often-impressive looking stage design. When Slayer played the Mayhem Festival last year and had 2 giant upside-down crosses made out of Marshall cabinets, that lit on fire, guess what? They weren't all plugged in! 

When Rob Halford of Judas Priest rides his Harley thru a swinging gate of Marshall stacks, guess what? Those are "dummies" too. In fact, the only "dummy" here is the one taking pictures, taking liberties, while standing on our stage, as our uninvited guest, and writing up the "controversial scoop", and then Tweeting and Facebooking about it.

How about calling out someone for something that really matters instead of bands who are only helping people escape for a little while? 

What exactly are you trying to do here?

Here's what, you're attempting to create a controversy to get hits on your website, and this response should do just that. In fact, we're already giving you and your radio station website too much traffic via this response. 

Hope you enjoy the free press.

You're welcome!


- Robb and Phil
"


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## Forkface (Jul 10, 2013)

....ing KLAQ should start worrying about the music the play instead of going around complaining about stuff like that 
...don't get me wrong, if I ever wanna listen to Halestorm or Black Veil Brides, I'll tune right in


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## slapnutz (Jul 10, 2013)

You can just see what he wants to say...


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## indreku (Jul 10, 2013)

I think it is moronic to think all those amps on stage are turned on and are playing at full volume. I've seen alot of walls of amps and I really hope they aren't turned on, because if you are on stage and the blast from them and wouldn't be able to hear monitor(if these are even used any more).
I've done few small shows where there was small PA only for vocals and keys, everything else was straight forward.

I don't understand who still thinks that the sound is coming straight from the stage and not the PA, everything is mic'ed and no way in a huge venue like that there is any possibility that the trummer would be heard or even guitars and bass in the back.


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## SDMFVan (Jul 10, 2013)

Robb Flynn said:


> Quick history lesson for grizzled 24 year-old heavy metal veteran Lisa Sanchez.



This made me LOL.


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## petereanima (Jul 10, 2013)

indreku said:


> I don't understand who still thinks that the sound is coming straight from the stage and not the PA, everything is mic'ed and no way in a huge venue like that there is any possibility that the trummer would be heard or even guitars and bass in the back.



Pretty much everyone not beeing a musician. Most of them don't waste a second thought about it also, because they do the right thing: they don't care.


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## ferret (Jul 10, 2013)

Their response seems a tad bit unfair. I'm sure the site certainly is just trying to generate some traffic, hey, that's what business is about. But the author didn't really make a controversy about it... quite the opposite they seemed to be stating that "Lots of bands do this" and ended with "Is this even a big deal?"

I guess they have a right to be annoyed at being used as another example, but I don't think the piece was trying to slam them or anything either.


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## Curt (Jul 10, 2013)

FWIW, I dislike The Bronx about equally to BvB.
Anyone who makes statements like that about dummy amps/cabs deserves a solid thump on the head to shake them from their fantasy world. even at small venues some bands will use dummy cabs.


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## Thep (Jul 10, 2013)

Climate change affects businesses, which informs them to proffer solutions and strategies to help manage the risks and pursue opportunities. According to the Harvard Business Review, the buildup of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere is changing the earth&#8217;s climate at the rate unprecedented in history. The year 2005 was the warmest on record, and the ten warmest years have all occurred since 1980. Ice in the Arctic, the Antarctic, and Greenland is melting, and virtually all of the world&#8217;s glaciers are shrinking.

Discuss the environmental impacts that the excessive backlines of metal bands have on our society. Be sure to mention the carbon footprint of 12-36 guitar cabinets in comparison to an axe-fx.

time limit: 20 min.


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## Carver (Jul 10, 2013)

i have no idea who these bands are. and i plan on keeping it that way.


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## Curt (Jul 10, 2013)

Carver said:


> i have no idea who these bands are. and i plan on keeping it that way.


Generic metalcore, and generic punk.

Sums it up...


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## Carver (Jul 10, 2013)

great now i know too much about them. well... looks like its head in the oven for me.


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## Curt (Jul 10, 2013)




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## Rick (Jul 10, 2013)

slapnutz said:


> You can just see what he wants to say...



I like how you can see a miked up cabinet underneath that little table lookin' thing next to the stacks on stage right.


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## Louis Cypher (Jul 10, 2013)

When I read the OP all I could think of was a Family Guy style sketch where you see this blokes reaction/rants to various different things:

Stewie: what, like the time Jorma Vik from that band Bronx found out that The Hills was a staged & scripted TV show.....

Cuts to scene of Jorma Vik watching The Hill's credits and then reading the disclaimer "&#8220;The following program may contain scenes that have been created purely for entertainment purposes" 

"God, Damin it!! If this is what the kids are calling "Reality TV" these days. I'm lighting fire to every copy of Heat and Hello magazine I have and become an investment banker.'


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## indreku (Jul 11, 2013)

Carver said:


> i have no idea who these bands are. and i plan on keeping it that way.


 
1/2 of this done...

But calling BVB a metalcore band is tad bit to much
They should be somekind of (moster) glam metal thing(not that I really care or wish to care).


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## Metal_Webb (Jul 11, 2013)

I'll just leave this here . The relevant bit is at 0:28


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## Carver (Jul 11, 2013)

indreku said:


> 1/2 of this done...
> 
> But calling BVB a metalcore band is tad bit to much
> They should be somekind of (moster) glam metal thing(not that I really care or wish to care).


 so they are kind of like "the darkness" or what ever the hell that glam band that fell off the face of the earth a few years ago was called.. you know the dudes with the tight pants and stupid hair, and stupid songs? but these guys actually think they are being serious?  eyeliner. is so metal.. you just dont know


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## wat (Jul 11, 2013)

Lol who cares if a band uses fake cabs? It looks cool. Newsflash: the cool looking lights at rock shows is controlled by a technician and weren't just magically conjured by the band

This is some serious babby shit


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## Louis Cypher (Jul 12, 2013)

According to UG.com Machine Head have now been dragged in to this non fcuking story as well as pics have surfaced of their empty cabs.... This could be one of the most pointless non "controversy's" of the decade.....

Edit: Quote from Robb Flynn on MH facebook:
"When Rob Halford of Judas Priest rides his Harley thru a swinging gate of Marshall stacks, guess what? Those are 'dummies' too. In fact, the only 'dummy' here is the one taking pictures, taking liberties, while standing on our stage, as our uninvited guest, and writing up the 'controversial scoop,' and then Tweeting and Facebooking about it."


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## Don Vito (Jul 12, 2013)

Louis Cypher said:


> When Rob Halford of Judas Priest rides his Harley thru a swinging gate of Marshall stacks


He actually does this? brb buying Judas Priest tickets


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## Bloody_Inferno (Jul 12, 2013)

Don Vito said:


> He actually does this? brb buying Judas Priest tickets



Not only does Rob do that, but he's also once crashed the bike and cracked his head open and broke his nose. Bleeding from his skull, he still kept performing. 

That, is metal. Much more awesome than this silly fake stacks controvery.


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