# My 11 string guitar design (a mockup you really wanna mock)



## frozenfrets (Jun 12, 2011)

*newest mockup HERE*

Good day, guys. I new here & been around looking for some mockup threads, then inspired to draw one. I use photoshop, the whole things were drawn, except the tuning machine, bridge, & truss rod cover. I take the fretboard from Here it is.

















still have no idea what wood I'm going to use, but in this mockup I'm using walnut with cocobolo top (dunno will it work or not), & macassar ebony fingerboard. It's 11 string with 48 frets (not sure if it's possible though), 30" - 33" scale fanned. Kahler 7229 (pre-ordered maybe?) with 2 ABM individual bridge for those 2 upper strings. Grover locking rotogrip 502, custom floyd rose locknut (2 pieces then welded maybe), with 2 7 string blocks, & 1 6 string block. Custom inlay, gold hardware, bolt on neck, 11 pieces neck (padouk-ferro maybe? Is it possible to use more than 2 kind of woods for neck? I'm thinkin bout using 5 different woods).

I'm thinkin about using bartolini hs5.4, emg ab, pa2, spc, & vpc (possible?). A custom pickup will also be used, maybe alnico V or something (for metal, any idea?)

Well it's a mockup for my future build, yeah future > dunno exactly when I can (afford &) build it 

What do you think, guys. I'm new to design a mockup. Thanks

recently I've been using this picture as my PC wallpaper  <- OOT


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## metalman_ltd (Jun 12, 2011)

Looks pretty sweet man do it up. 48 frets? Haha have no clue if that would work.


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## frozenfrets (Jun 12, 2011)

metalman_ltd said:


> Looks pretty sweet man do it up. 48 frets? Haha have no clue if that would work.



Lol I have no idea either, maybe I'll just make it 42 or 36 if 48 is not possible


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## Adam (Jun 12, 2011)

I found 41 frets using vintage sized mandolin wire worked for my 11 string at the 30" scale.
Any more and it would be a bit difficult to fret accurately, 44 may be the most I would do at that scale length.


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## Hollowway (Jun 12, 2011)

Dude, that is INSANE! You MUST make that! I do have a couple of concerns, though. I think all the extra frets will be unusable unless you switch to whole steps or greater (leave some frets out) to get your fingers in there. Also, if you're planning on tuning G# to high A I would consider putting a single bridge saddle on the high A because I can pretty much guarantee whammying a 30" A4 will be a short-lived endeavor.


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## Floody_85 (Jun 13, 2011)

That thing is epic man!! I personally wouldnt go with so many frets. Apart from that, its nuts! Mad skills on photoshop too!


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## frozenfrets (Jun 13, 2011)

Adam said:


> I found 41 frets using vintage sized mandolin wire worked for my 11 string at the 30" scale.
> Any more and it would be a bit difficult to fret accurately, 44 may be the most I would do at that scale length.



Actually your 11 string thread was my inspiration to create this mockup  maybe I'd just make the lowest fret fretless. Err do I have to use bass tuning machine for the low strings? Thanks



Hollowway said:


> Dude, that is INSANE! You MUST make that! I do have a couple of concerns, though. I think all the extra frets will be unusable unless you switch to whole steps or greater (leave some frets out) to get your fingers in there. Also, if you're planning on tuning G# to high A I would consider putting a single bridge saddle on the high A because I can pretty much guarantee whammying a 30" A4 will be a short-lived endeavor.



Thanks  How about frow low E to high E? is it possible? I mean like E standard but doubled to the lower E. I guess I'm goin to change the bridge to 7 string fanned kahler & single bridge for the rest, I'm not sure if tremolo-ed low notes will sound good :/



Floody_85 said:


> That thing is epic man!! I personally wouldnt go with so many frets. Apart from that, its nuts! Mad skills on photoshop too!



Woot thanks


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## Jontain (Jun 13, 2011)

Lol that looks nuts, will the lower horn not hinder access to the higher frets?


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## Edika (Jun 13, 2011)

It is a very nice design and quite aggressive . Th only thing not sitting right with me is the headstock. There is to much wood and empty space on the upper part of the headstock that it seems kind of awkward (for me at least). Also it might make the guitar more neck heavy!


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## Alberto7 (Jun 13, 2011)

I really like this, actually! It looks pretty damn exotic! . However... If that's how it's going to look, how do you plan on fretting the 11th string at the 1st fret? I think it's just a mockup design flaw, but I just wanted to point that out.

Looking forward to seeing a build thread for this! 

EDIT: 1000th post!


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## CD1221 (Jun 13, 2011)

Epic mockup is epic.




Bravely go forth, my man. May the lutherie gods guide your way and lead you to victory. Return to us often with tales and images of your conquests, that we may all share your glory.


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## SD83 (Jun 13, 2011)

frozenfrets said:


> still have no idea what wood I'm going to use, but in this mockup I'm using walnut with cocobolo top (dunno will it work or not), & macassar ebony fingerboard. It's 11 string with 48 frets (not sure if it's possible though), 30" - 33" scale fanned. Kahler 7229 (pre-ordered maybe?) with 2 ABM individual bridge for those 2 upper strings. Grover locking rotogrip 502, custom floyd rose locknut (2 pieces then welded maybe), with 2 7 string blocks, & 1 6 string block. Custom inlay, gold hardware, bolt on neck, 11 pieces neck (padouk-ferro maybe? Is it possible to use more than 2 kind of woods for neck? I'm thinkin bout using 5 different woods).







Totally possible  If I remember correctly, more pieces of wood increase the chance of the woods reacting differently on changing temperatures etc, so you might sooner or later be able to feel the glue lines. Different kinds of wood increase the problem, though I don't know how much. 



frozenfrets said:


> Well it's a mockup for my future build, yeah future > dunno exactly when I can (afford &) build it
> 
> What do you think, guys. I'm new to design a mockup. Thanks


Epic design! I agree, you HAVE TO build it. Reminds me of an old 9-string bass design I drew years ago.
As Jontain mentioned before, you might want to move the lower horn away from the neck a bit, right now it looks like it's going to be rather uncomfortable to reach the higher frets. And maybe try to make the upper horn longer, just to see how that looks, as that might help with the balance.


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## Winspear (Jun 13, 2011)

Absolutely awesome! Good job



Alberto7 said:


> how do you plan on fretting the 11th string at the 1st fret?



I think you'll find that's a zero fret  I.e. that 'triangle' of space is not played.


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## flo (Jun 13, 2011)

Alberto7 said:


> ... If that's how it's going to look, how do you plan on fretting the 11th string at the 1st fret? I think it's just a mockup design flaw, but I just wanted to point that out.



?
I don't quite get your question, or maybe you got the mockup wrong? He's using a perpendicular locking nut, and the first fret is a "zero fret", instead of using a slanted nut in the same position. I did that too on my eightstring, it's easier this way.


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

I'm really not a fan of thoe inlays but aside from that those are pretty damn cool.


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

I'm really not a fan of thoe inlays but aside from that those are pretty damn cool.


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## frozenfrets (Jun 13, 2011)

Thanks for the nice responses everybody 



Edika said:


> It is a very nice design and quite aggressive . Th only thing not sitting right with me is the headstock. There is to much wood and empty space on the upper part of the headstock that it seems kind of awkward (for me at least). Also it might make the guitar more neck heavy!



Yea I know  mm it looks cool for me .. somehow  I once tried to make it smaller but it became un-proportional, so I just 'ctrl+Z' to get the 'blade' design back hehe.



Jontain said:


> Lol that looks nuts, will the lower horn not hinder access to the higher frets?





SD83 said:


> As Jontain mentioned before, you might want to move the lower horn away from the neck a bit, right now it looks like it's going to be rather uncomfortable to reach the higher frets. And maybe try to make the upper horn longer, just to see how that looks, as that might help with the balance.



Yea thanks for the idea, I realized (just now) that the most upper frets are not reachable with this design of lower horn. Planning to modify it a little bit to make it a bit deeper. But it'll seem that the cutaway will be damn close to the pickups, will it matter?


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## Alberto7 (Jun 13, 2011)

EtherealEntity said:


> Absolutely awesome! Good job
> 
> 
> 
> I think you'll find that's a zero fret  I.e. that 'triangle' of space is not played.





flo said:


> ?
> I don't quite get your question, or maybe you got the mockup wrong? He's using a perpendicular locking nut, and the first fret is a "zero fret", instead of using a slanted nut in the same position. I did that too on my eightstring, it's easier this way.



You guys are absolutely right. I didn't see that at first, for some reason, nor did I really read the OP in detail the first time... My bad!


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## jayarpeggios (Jun 13, 2011)

tremolo on an 11!??!?! I don't think that's possible but I am all for watching you try  The design is very over the top but since its an 11 string it seems very suiting haha. Anyways I like it keep refining this mockup and keep up posted. Good luck!


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

jayarpeggios said:


> tremolo on an 11!??!?!


 
How did I not notice that?


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 13, 2011)

jayarpeggios said:


> tremolo on an 11!??!?! I don't think that's possible but I am all for watching you try  The design is very over the top but since its an 11 string it seems very suiting haha. Anyways I like it keep refining this mockup and keep up posted. Good luck!


 
Kahler has made perfectly functional 9-string, 10-string, and fanned fret trems, so as long as they're setup and installed properly (the second part seems to be a challenge for some builders), it's perfectly doable.


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## Erick Kroenen (Jun 13, 2011)

Looks killer for the 40 + frets make it fretless, the design its awesome i've read that the more woods your are using in a neck you will have a bad response from the woods because each one resonates in a different way, make it maple with bubinga stripes and paint the stripes in different colours, as for the body walnut would be great! the bridge thing its not my stuff but great overal

edit: i cant wait to see new mockup's


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 13, 2011)

dirgesong said:


> i've read that the more woods your are using in a neck you will have a bad response from the woods because each one resonates in a different way


 
Tell that to Alembic, Conklin, Prat, Benevette, Fodera, etc.


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

Yea I think someone has been drinking too much of the tonewood Koolaid.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 13, 2011)

Konfyouzd said:


> Yea I think someone has been drinking too much of the tonewood Koolaid.


 
It's okay, there's enough of that out there to drown all the fish in the sea.


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)




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## Evil7 (Jun 13, 2011)

Your nut should be angled as well for a fan fret design...


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 13, 2011)

Evil7 said:


> Your nut should be angled as well for a fan fret design...


 
Looks like he's using a zero fret, which would negate the need for an angled nut.


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looks like he's using a zero fret, which would negate the need for an angled nut.


 
So it's fine either way? I saw some of the older Rondo multiscales done like that.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 13, 2011)

Konfyouzd said:


> So it's fine either way? I saw some of the older Rondo multiscales done like that.


 
As long as the headstock end of the string is angled properly it doesn't matter if it's sitting in a traditional nut, using a lock nut, or going over a zero fret. 

A zero fret is essentially a nut, just one that the strings sit on, opposed to sit in. When you have a zero fret though, you still need a "true" nut, to make sure the strings align properly and stay in place.


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## Evil7 (Jun 13, 2011)

Never knew any of that.... man... my wise comment was not so wise


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## Erick Kroenen (Jun 13, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Tell that to Alembic, Conklin, Prat, Benevette, Fodera, etc.


 
sorry Sr. i said i've read im not a luthier i read Prat's site about neck's makes sense and i found this too


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## Konfyouzd (Jun 13, 2011)

What the hell is that? The headstock looks like those paddles they used to use to whip children in school.


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## Erick Kroenen (Jun 13, 2011)

i found that here 
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ba...ourse-15-string-prat-basses-now-finished.html



as reference that everything is possible!


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## BlackMastodon (Jun 13, 2011)

Too. Many. Strings. Everywhere!


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## frozenfrets (Jun 14, 2011)

Hehe I've got nothin to do so I tried to modify the mockup a little bit, like you guys said that the lower horn seems uncomfortable.





By hell_boo at 2011-06-14





By hell_boo at 2011-06-14





By hell_boo at 2011-06-14

yea the lower cutaway is now a little bit deeper, & farther distance from the neck to the lower horn, then I made the upper horn a bit longer to make it looks balanced. The horn extension looks a lil bit rough, since I'm not a pro so I just use clone stamp lol, can see the joints. Also made the contour light effect a bit smoother, for artistic purpose only  More distance between the knobs so each of them are accessible. Hell I don't understand but the head seems bigger and bigger


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## Erick Kroenen (Jun 14, 2011)

what are your measurements for the neck please?


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## Goatchrist (Jun 14, 2011)

Bad ass


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## Deadnightshade (Jun 14, 2011)

Looks good for such an extreme design,however keep in mind that although the upper horn seems kewl and stuff,it's gonna stick out more that you expect in real life + possible balance problems,since its maximum height exceeds by far the height of the curve in that body side.If i were you,i'd retain the upper horn just bring it back until it's at least at the same height.


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## frozenfrets (Jun 15, 2011)

dirgesong said:


> what are your measurements for the neck please?



In this mockup, it was 30"-33". But I guess if it's too much, nearly impossible to be built, I'd reduce the frets to 44, 42, or even 36 hehe. Just to make it more reasonable to build. Or maybe I'd change to single coil pickup & all fixed bridge to make em fit perfectly 



Deadnightshade said:


> Looks good for such an extreme design,however keep in mind that although the upper horn seems kewl and stuff,it's gonna stick out more that you expect in real life + possible balance problems,since its maximum height exceeds by far the height of the curve in that body side.If i were you,i'd retain the upper horn just bring it back until it's at least at the same height.








well *maybe* there'll be no problem bout the size of the horn, curve, & things. I tried to compare my design to ibanez rg2228 (rough comparison, not really precise). I tried to show the distance of the (horizontal lining from the) neck to the curves (back & middle) & horn.

The blue lines belong to my design, red lines belong to rg2228, green squares show the differences (x,y) of distance between my design & rg2228, & purple squares show the difference of distance between back curves of rg2228 & horns of my design.


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## Randomist (Jun 15, 2011)

dirgesong said:


> Looks killer for the 40 + frets make it fretless, the design its awesome i've read that the more woods your are using in a neck you will have a bad response from the woods because each one resonates in a different way, make it maple with bubinga stripes and paint the stripes in different colours, as for the body walnut would be great! the bridge thing its not my stuff but great overal
> 
> edit: i cant wait to see new mockup's



Multilaminar necks are pretty common, in neck-through guitars especially. There is no detrimental effect on tone as I understand it. AFAIK the glued laminates all behave as a single peice of wood with combined tonal properties rather than each lamina having its own.


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## UnderTheSign (Jun 15, 2011)

Now that you've shown the superstrat size comparison... I'd try and make the body bigger or heavier or you're gonna get some neck dive!


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## BlackMastodon (Jun 15, 2011)

With that big of a headstock you will definitely need a bigger body.


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## -42- (Jun 15, 2011)

That is terrifying.


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## Trespass (Jun 15, 2011)

I'm definitely into it, and the design, but I do agree on the neck dive thing.

Also, your comparison isn't exactly accurate - A 30"-33" fan guitar is not going to overlay that nicely over a 25.5" superstrat. I think this exacerbates the problem. Some refining is going to be necessary. 

Take your mockup and get the shape printed to size at a print shop, then glue it to cardboard and cut it out. From there, figure what works from an ergonomic perspective and refine.


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## Mindcrime1204 (Jun 15, 2011)

He compared it to the RG2228 which I believe is a "27 scale


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## BR10N (Jun 15, 2011)

Oh my goodness! I'm signed out of SS.org for one week and this is what goes on!? Hehe.

The mockup is looking beast.


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## ixlramp (Jun 16, 2011)

I love your design!


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## flo (Jun 17, 2011)

BR10N said:


> Oh my goodness! I'm signed out of SS.org for one week



Why?

Back on topic:

I think you wouldn't have to change the bodyshape if you only make it thick enough, it'll be fine.

I think however that a bigger body and a smaller headstock would look more harmonic, imo.


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## felixmartin (Dec 26, 2012)

frozenfrets said:


> Hehe I've got nothin to do so I tried to modify the mockup a little bit, like you guys said that the lower horn seems uncomfortable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



YO, I sent a private message!


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## goldsteinat0r (Dec 26, 2012)

What the actual fuck


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## bob123 (Dec 26, 2012)

SD83 said:


> Totally possible  If I remember correctly, more pieces of wood increase the chance of the woods reacting differently on changing temperatures etc, so you might sooner or later be able to feel the glue lines. Different kinds of wood increase the problem, though I don't know how much.



Not to be a dick, but this is completely wrong. The total opposite is true. The only way the wood will move is if you take frequent showers with it, or leave if in your sauna for a few days. 

More pieces you glue together, the more strength and stability the wood has, point of diminishing returns applies.


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## Hollowway (Dec 26, 2012)

Wait, so this thread was bumped to announce that a PM was sent to the OP?  How much sense does that make?


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## bob123 (Dec 26, 2012)

Hollowway said:


> Wait, so this thread was bumped to announce that a PM was sent to the OP?  How much sense does that make?





Wrong thread mate. Lol


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## BIG ND SWEATY (Dec 26, 2012)

bob123 said:


> Wrong thread mate. Lol



actually the dude right before the one you replied to quoted the "recent" mockup to say he sent a pm


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## xxvicarious (Dec 27, 2012)

Dear OP: Make me a 24 fret 8 string version of that, without fanned 
frets and a blank ebony fretboard 

Seriously though... that thing is ridiculously badass!


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## Viginez (Dec 28, 2012)

looks mean


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