# Tuning a guitar in fifths



## Anthony (Jun 21, 2008)

Okay, I've seriously been interested in tuning in fifths, but I've always encountered problems that have out weighed the pros.

I can't seem to make any proper arpeggio shapes. Just simple 1-3-5 shapes. They're just too spread out. Is there any way to over come this?

Also, when shredding, is there anyway to avoid shifting towards the nut when ascending- scales? It makes shredding impossible.


Ideally, I want this tuning to work. Real bad. I want the low E, I want the high E. In 6 strings. I want to get a steinberger transtrem, and take it everywhere.


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## Durero (Jun 21, 2008)

Dude you have to start thinking in 4-notes-per-string patterns:


```
|4| |5| |6| |7|
| |7|1| |2| |3|
| |3|4| |5| |6|
| |6| |7|1| |2|
| |2| |3|4| |5|
| |5| |6| |7|1|
| |1| |2| |3|4|

*numbers here are scale degree numbers, not tab.
```
No position shifting required. The stretches can be challenging, but cellists do it all the time 

4-notes-per-string is definitely an alternate-picker's dream come true! 

Can you see your 1-3-5 shapes in there?

I'm not sure what the transtrem has to do with this, can you clarify?


Unless you want to end up with an _extremely_ low 6th string, I'd recommend starting with the highest pitched string you can find, such as Garry Goodman's high A's (which can reach B4 on a 25.5" scale), and going down from there.

(Assuming a 25.5" scale...)
For example: C2 G2 D3 A3 E4 B4 low to high. (standard octave numbers are E2 for low E and E4 for high E of standard 6-string tuning)

Without Garry's strings the highest practical all 5ths tuning would be: Ab1 Eb2 Bb2 F3 C4 G4

However neither of these tunings would allow for bending upwards on your highest string more than a semitone without the string breaking, so if your into bigger bends on your highest string and you want to use a transtrem then: F1 C2 G2 D3 A3 E4

But don't count on the transposing function of a transtrem working with any accuracy in anything other than standard tuning using calibrated strings. The transposing function is very finicky!

Hope this helps


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## distressed_romeo (Jun 21, 2008)

In terms of seventh arpeggios, try fingering them 2 or 3 notes per string. Pentatonics can easily be played three notes per string in one position, which is one of the big perks of this tuning, as it makes legato pentatonic licks a breeze.

To avoid awkward position shifts you'll either need to work on your stretch, or develop some new tapping chops (watch some vids of Trey Gunn, as he tunes the melody side of his Warr guitars in fifths). You really will have to re-learn everything from the ground up, but it's totally worth it. I really ought to string up another guitar in New Standard or Crafty Fifths sometime, as I really enjoyed it the first time round...


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## Anthony (Jun 21, 2008)

Thanks to both of you. 

As far as the transtrem goes, I just want one . It s a baritone, and I plan on going really low, like E or F#. I just have crazy gas for the guitar.

I actually have 2 guitars strung is Bb new standard, on fretless, and one acoustic. It's interesting to toy around in, but I need better strings, as I want to go complete fifths.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 21, 2008)

I had fun with 5ths tuning, If i had a 6 string, thats the tuning it would be in. I had a 6er in G-D-A-E-B-F# (Whole tone below Drop A on a 7 to whole tone up from the regular high E in std. tuning).


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## Durero (Jun 21, 2008)

Anthony said:


> s far as the transtrem goes, I just want one . It s a baritone, and I plan on going really low, like E or F#. I just have crazy gas for the guitar.


Do you mean the Steinberger Trans-Scale? The baritone with the moveable capo?


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## Anthony (Jun 21, 2008)

Shit, yeah. I was eating dinner, and it popped into my heaad randomly. I take a bite, then "Oh shit, its Transcales!".


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## Durero (Jun 21, 2008)

Right, then completely disregard my transposing comment about the Trans-Trem. The Trans-Scale should have no trouble working perfectly with any tuning.


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## Anthony (Jun 21, 2008)

I have my RGA in F- E right now with an 80 on the bottom. Brutal.


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## ElRay (Jun 23, 2008)

Anthony said:


> I can't seem to make any proper arpeggio shapes. Just simple 1-3-5 shapes. They're just too spread out. Is there any way to over come this?


Many proponents of fifths-based/all-fifths would say: "That's the point." Part of the goal is to break-out of the standard "rut", not just increase your range, or make cello-based music easier to play. Hence my labeling DR's Fifths-based tuning: HTHAIMTPANIMT (How The Hell Am I Going To Play A Non-Inverted Major Triad).

DR is the Alternate Tuning Guru here, and Durero is the granddaddy (He's at the low end of the old-folks range here ) of the theorists. Do some more searches, you'll find usefull stuff on fifth-based tunings. I've added some tags to this thread.

Ray


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## Durero (Jun 23, 2008)

^ 

HTHAIMTPANIMT is gold!


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## Anthony (Jul 2, 2008)

Honestly, I don't see myself using this tuning for much longer. For what I do with guitar, it's just unwise. At least at the moment. 
I'm glad I tried it, and I spent a lot of time with it.


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