# Dean Guitars - Why all the hate?



## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 4, 2010)

first off i want to say this is not a dean hate thread. i tried to find a thread about this subject. i'm just trying to get logical answers to all the negative stuff i read about them on this site.

i've been playing for 15 years and only been on this forum for a few months but i have run across several threads where dean's are bashed-not just a few either. i see alot about dimebag's (rip) name being used.

i had an older dean acou/elec that was decent and was planning to get one of dave mustaine's angel of deth v's. if it is anything like his sig jackson i own, it should be a great guitar. they seem to have a strong line of artists too:

dave mustaine, rusty cooley, michael angelo batio, micheal schenker, rick peterson, michael amott , jeff berlin & lets not forget brett michaels 

there seem to be alot of metal bands & artist as well as rock & jazz. so i want to know what all the hates about - former owners or those with experience with the guitars, what's the deal?


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## Knossos (Jun 4, 2010)

About 50% of it is to do with them annihilating Dimebag's credibility.
The other 50% is largely down to bad design.


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## ittoa666 (Jun 4, 2010)

I have nothing against their USA models that don't rape dime's name, but I do have something against their low quality shit. Then there's the fact that the companies namesake is gone.


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## PnKnG (Jun 4, 2010)

Nuff said:
Dimebag Darrell of Damageplan and Pantera - Pictures, Video, Bio


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## ephrion (Jun 4, 2010)

The guitars are ugly, 95% of the time. When they aren't ugly, they're overpriced.


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## poopyalligator (Jun 4, 2010)

Like everybody has said. They continuously make dimebag signature guitars that he never played. Not only that, most of the productions guitars that you a see in stores are usually not made very good at all. They finally started to use OFR bridges on some of their more expensive guitars, and to me they just arent worth the price tag that they carry. I have never played a dean guitar that I have liked before except for a USA made Michael Angelo Batio model. Dean is just not my cup of tea, and i think that reverberates with a lot of people on here as well.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 4, 2010)

PnKnG said:


> Nuff said:
> Dimebag Darrell of Damageplan and Pantera - Pictures, Video, Bio


 

wow, ive never seen this.....i counted 33 dime models in 09 alone!

i cant believe their motto - in his vision


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 4, 2010)

Pretty much the rape of the Dimebag name. Its disgusting. I would never buy a Dean for that reason, and I'm not a Dimebag fan, I just think its immoral.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Jun 4, 2010)

^ This man speaks the truth.


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## Murmel (Jun 4, 2010)

ephrion said:


> When they aren't ugly, they're overpriced.


x10


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 4, 2010)

i was not a really huge dime fan, but did own one of his washburn ml's (which was a nice axe). i did meet him once at a dallas stars hockey game & like everyone says he was a cool dude. i can see all the hate about dime's name being used but that spawns another question - who is letting them use his name?


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## shogunate (Jun 4, 2010)

I'm pretty neutral on the dime issue. Not a hater, not a huge fan  And it's probably his family or his girl Rita that authorize the use of his name with Dean and (even more hate on SS.org) Krank  Same thing has gone on with artists for decades; Jimi Hendrix now has signature guitars with artwork "inspired" by his doodles that sell for thousands of dollars 

Now to my own generic reasons for not liking them: I've never played one I like, and there's like what, 4 body shapes that each come in 66 gimmicky finishes each? I don't jive with the necks, always felt squarish to me but that's preference, naturally. Their tremolo systems always looked and felt crazy, and too many a time I would tune the whole damn thing to perfection, locked the nut, pulled one divebomb and the whole thing was out again  Never could figure out how Trivium did it for so long  

And, Mr. Zelinsky himself stepped away and now has his own rapidly growing company. When a company's founder and namesake decides to get uninvolved, that seems to say something iffy about the going-ons in my eyes. Ok enough


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## Leon (Jun 4, 2010)

I absolutely loved my Dean Evo 7. Fucking massive tone for $300


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## auxioluck (Jun 4, 2010)

vampiregenocide said:


> Pretty much the rape of the Dimebag name. Its disgusting. I would never buy a Dean for that reason, and I'm not a Dimebag fan, I just think its immoral.



This. It's disgusting how much they have capitalized on a death. Even Fender didn't rape SRV's name the way Dean raped Dimebag's.

Not to mention the people with bad personalities they have under their brand.

And the fact I've never met a Dean I enjoyed playing.

That's why I will never buy a Dean.


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## Leon (Jun 4, 2010)

auxioluck said:


> Not to mention the people with bad personalities they have under their brand.



Sounds like you're ready to be endorsed by them!


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## auxioluck (Jun 4, 2010)

Leon said:


> Sounds like you're ready to be endorsed by them!



Oh, come on now Leon...you know what I'm saying.


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## Kwonnie (Jun 4, 2010)

Dean's look cool to me even if they're a bit cheesy in their design. The playability and prices, however, is another issue. I can't stand the feel of their cheap wood either.


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## soliloquy (Jun 4, 2010)

i say the reason behind deans hatred is mostly due to grape vine. one person says he had a bad experience, and the word spread out and sooner or later, deans reputation is significantly hurt. 

look at BC RICH for example. a few years ago, they had their import line down the gutter, and now they are trying really hard to come back yet its not sticking. 

i say sure, dean had a few issues with their QC, but i think they have solved them since 2008. dean used to be made by another factory in early 2000s in korea where the QC was pretty steady and on par with other brands. they switched to UnSung factory and their qc went down and their prices went up. but i think since then they have either boosted their QC or have just switched factories again?

i used to have a Dean V79. sure, it had a few issues, and hence i sold it after a month of owning it, but since then i picked up PRS SE, a few agiles, a schecter c-1 classic, and a few others, and i have yet to find a guitar that played quiet like that. 

i have yet to hear anything bad about the new Soltero line...well, they are discontinued now though...


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## Alberto7 (Jun 4, 2010)

I don't really "hate" Dean guitars per se. Just that the one's I've tried haven't been my cup of tea; they're really uncomfortable to me, and feel rather "cheap" for the price they sell. I also sort of dislike people that own a Razorback just because it's the cool guitar to have, and because according to them it looks cool (there's a lot of people like that).

However, that's just my opinion!


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## Vyn (Jun 4, 2010)

I wouldn't not buy a guitar based on what brand it was. If when I picked it up it played good and had the tone I was after when plugged in, it doesn't matter if it's a Dean, BC Rich, ESP or even a strat, if you like the feel and sound of it, buy it.

That been said and done, I don't like how Dean has continually flogged Dime's name for all that it's worth. They don't need to lol. They have Mustaine, Michael Amott, Karl and Dallas, Shencker, Angelo Batio and a number of other fantastic guitarists. Seems pointless to flog off mostly Dime.


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## yacker (Jun 4, 2010)

I own a dean Exotica FM acoustic and a Dean Sledgehammer 5 string bass and love both of them to death. The acoustic has been serving me well for 9 years and was only 300 dollars or something when I got it. The bass was a bit more, but has been serving me well for quite some time also. 

I'm not trying to come in here as the dean fanboy or anything, but I will say if you come across one of their "affordable" acoustics that has been setup properly, there's not much else that competes in the same price range. I really like their basses in general, there are few I've played that I didn't like, but they obviously aren't the best in the world or anything.

All that said, my god their six in line headstocks are ugly.  Couple that with any of their electric guitars that aren't dime ripoffs or what appears to be cheap starter guitars being in an astronomical price range and I can see why they get hated on here. I think the ugliness of some of their headstocks bears repeating too.


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## ibznorange (Jun 4, 2010)

the higher end dean mustaines are wonderful axes, but 80% of their line is quite horrid for the money. I have to RTM a LOT of deans


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## CrushingAnvil (Jun 5, 2010)

Vyn said:


> I wouldn't not buy a guitar based on what brand it was. If when I picked it up it played good and had the tone I was after when plugged in, it doesn't matter if it's a Dean, BC Rich, ESP or even a strat, if you like the feel and sound of it, buy it.
> 
> That been said and done, I don't like how Dean has continually flogged Dime's name for all that it's worth. They don't need to lol. They have Mustaine, Michael Amott, Karl and Dallas, Shencker, Angelo Batio and a number of other fantastic guitarists. Seems pointless to flog off mostly Dime.



Karl is with KxK unless someone can correct me.

I've never liked a Dean...They've just always felt cheap.

The RC7 on the other hand looks well made and it looks like it plays nicely.


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## drenzium (Jun 5, 2010)

They probably paid half of their endorsee artists to switch over to their company. I know for a fact there would be no reason other than money for Dave Mustaine to switch from ESP to Dean. That's why I don't like them, it's the same reason i don't like Krank either.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 5, 2010)

idk, imo they shouldnt be hating on a guitar company unless they've played them, then they have a right to speak. Although i dont like what they are doing with dime's name i did buy a razorback back when they first came out, with they're 3 different models.


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## chucknorrishred (Jun 5, 2010)

Vyn said:


> I wouldn't not buy a guitar based on what brand it was. If when I picked it up it played good and had the tone I was after when plugged in, it doesn't matter if it's a Dean, BC Rich, ESP or even a strat, if you like the feel and sound of it, buy it.


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## Aurochs34 (Jun 5, 2010)

yeah aside from the entirety of shit that's come along with the smearing of Dime onto fucking everything, which is obviously complete shit, they did have a lot of QC issues for a pretty long time. I think they were basically resolved with the return of Dean himself...but now he's gone again. 

I have a Soltero. love that fucker. BUT, they're discontinued and DBZ is basically making them now since it's his design anyway...called the "Bolero"...no joke. 
Every other Dean I've played hasn't been too hot, but that's just my experience.

And yes, buy a guitar for what it is for you. Fuck brand names.

They rape the innocent things in life.


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## Vyn (Jun 5, 2010)

CrushingAnvil said:


> Karl is with KxK unless someone can correct me.
> 
> I've never liked a Dean...They've just always felt cheap.
> 
> The RC7 on the other hand looks well made and it looks like it plays nicely.



He's still endorsed by Dean and still plays his Deans live and on the records.


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## guitareben (Jun 5, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> dave mustaine, rusty cooley, michael angelo batio



For me, this is one reason. To much dull metal shredders etc. I really dislike all of them, well maybe not mustaine, but MAB....Rusty cooley.... ugh. Its names like this that make an image of dean guitars being pure metal/unmusical (not that metal isn't musical, but i find lots of it to be, in my head, unmusical) and shred guitars. They don't even look very shreddy tbh either (ibanez look more shredderish). In fact the whole dean look, for me, is just metal guitars. Which doesn't appeal to me. At all ^^ . 

And they have way overused dimebag, and the dimebag guitars look disgusting. And i don't like Dimebag either *sighs* . I haven't even come on to the headstocks yet....

Anyway basically the whole dean image, from the looks to the guys who use them, for me just doesn't appeal to me at all.

(And, a friend has had a some problems with his dean recently to ^^ )


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## Scar Symmetry (Jun 5, 2010)

Probably because:

A) 99% of their guitars are complete wank 

B) Dimebag Darrell

That's about the crux of it.


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## Andromalia (Jun 5, 2010)

Only Dean I've owned is a Mustaine angel of deth and it was on par with similarly priced LTDs and such. Plus the mustaine pups are excellent.
That said, I've have not seen more Dean haters than Gibson bashers (say, Holy Explorer and constant QC complaints a few years back for USA models), Jackson bashers (Boooo shit since bought by Fender) and [insertrandombrandhere] bashers.
Dean apparently had its ups and downs with QC, but nearly all the brands have such issues in their history.

About the milking of Dime's name, I'd think Dime would be happy that even unto death he can bring money to his family. I do dislike the big DIME logos on their headstocks but that's juste aesthetics.


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## Hosenbugler (Jun 5, 2010)

I think that my main reason for not liking Dean guitars is that, on the whole, they suck. Also, their artist roster is like reading a who's-who of people whose music I don't like or want to listen to ever. And they are ugly, almost without exception.


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## Jack Secret (Jun 5, 2010)

They don't use hot girls in ads anymore like they did in the 80's.


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## chucknorrishred (Jun 5, 2010)

jackson bought by fender???!!??

also, didnt vinnie moore go to dean?


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## InTheRavensName (Jun 5, 2010)

For what it's worth, I've never played one of the Razorbacks that didn't have something wrong with it, their QC seems fucking awful on those, badly finished fretwork, paint damage, etc etc. That said, there's something about their Korean stuff that I really like, the black/gold series, exotic series etc actually kick ass, I missed the fuck out of my black/gold V so I grabbed the bubinga exotic off eBay and it's excellent. The best advice I can give to anyone on this subject though is BUY USED. The price of these things falls to <50% of the RRP on the used market, and for the £210 shipped I paid for the V, well...I wouldn't have picked anything else


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## ShadyDavey (Jun 5, 2010)

vampiregenocide said:


> Pretty much the rape of the Dimebag name. Its disgusting. I would never buy a Dean for that reason, and I'm not a Dimebag fan, I just think its immoral.





As much as I was a Dime fan, and also like Schenker and Cooley there's no way I'd give them any of my custom.


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## RenegadeDave (Jun 5, 2010)

None of the import Deans that I've tried particularly wowed me for the money. I've never seen a 79 series on the shelf, which I feel should be the majority of their line rather than the minority. The Dean guitars I have played were terrible values new. The Dime guitars I tried were inexcusable. A dimebucker, ok quality component technically even if not my cup of tea, but then their off brand neck pickup and a really dodgy trem at the same pricepoint where ESP/LTD gives you two name brand pickups and at least an FR1000 if not OFR? That's inexcusable. 

Kind of a quirk that gets me is I hate graphics on guitars, and Dean primarily has graphics on their guitars. I know that comes down to preference, but I feel like Dean uses the "grade schooler uses stickers to decorate their trapper keeper" approach to finishing guitars. As over done as it is, some nice quilt/flame veneers and subtle trans/burst finishes would be great. 

Additionally, the price on their USA line is ridiculous. They charge $1400 off the shelf for their unfinished, unmaplecap'd MHG line of guitars. You can get a nice Carvin, a Gibson Studio explorer of V, a Nice Fender, nearly low end USA jacksons all for that same price. I've never seen one on the shelf so maybe they are the tits, but they spend so much on marketing in different guitar magazines I can't imagine that the premium price is because the quality far exceeds the entry level of the other American lines. 

Hell you can get a USA Fender Highway 1 for $700. You can buy a Gibson "Worn" series USA guitar for about $800-900 (essentially the equivalent of the MHG series, all mahogany guitar with simplistic finish). Why is the entry level USA dean nearly twice what the entry level Fenders and Gibsons go for? It's not like they're using quality components the others aren't (in house pickups, vs in house pickups vs inhouse pickups). The Fender even has a Nitro finish (as I understand is more labor intensive than a regular finish) but is cheaper to make because of bolt on construction. 

And the nail in the coffin for me is the arrogance at which they go about marketing their products like they're the best guitars in the world. That's such a ridiculous claim that no reasonable adult should make.

That said, I'd like to pickup a secondhand 79 series Z at one point.


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## Banana Wedgie (Jun 5, 2010)

Razorbacks is why everybody hates Dean. You spend £300 more than the top ML/V/Z for one of these, and their not even as good.

Same with the Dimebag stuff... there is a few decent (like the Washburns and a few Dime From Hell, with its authentic Bill Lawrence pickup), but otherwsie, his signature line is overpriced and sort of worthless...

Other Dean guitars, ML/V/Z, Hardtail and the other signature series stuff, is really good! I knew from picking up both the Dave Mustaine signature guitar, and Michael Schenker guitar, that I would love it.

Also, the Exotic series stuff - I tryied one that had been sitting in a store most of its life - everybody in the store told me I should get it because of its amazing, underpriced, unproduced pickups - I agreed with them. And - exdemo this is - the price tag was only £300  I would have been prepared to pay way more than that!

Great guitars, IMO. Mostly.


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 5, 2010)

I'm sure they make some good guitars, but when the founded of a company leaves because he hates seeing what it has become, and the most publicized endorser of that company is someone who has been dead for several years, you have to wonder about their integrity.

That and IMO they don't do anything very interesting.


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## Esp Griffyn (Jun 5, 2010)

I always thought D-bag sucked as a guitarist and musician and general, but that is beyond the scope of this thread. I hate Dean because their designs suck and the quality of them is utter shit for the money you pay. I couldn't care about D-bags integrity being posthumously erroded every time they roll out another crappy D-bag sig model he never used, but it does have the effect of making Dean look completely shameless. Mostly though, it's the abysmal quality and designs. Even a £3000 hand built razorback or Dime shaped thing is going to suck because it's a terrible shape, it's uncomfortable to play and hold.

And that headstock


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## Xiphos68 (Jun 5, 2010)

I played a Razorback one time that was made in Korea. It was cool as all could get out. But the neck felt bad, pickups weren't great, and I wasn't all about the tremolo. For all of that guitar you have to pay 1300$. Which isn't worth it at all. The only Dean guitar I've ever liked was a cheap 7 string vendetta they use to make. It was pretty cool and the pickups sounded decent too. Besides that I've never played a Dean I've actually liked.


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## Sebastian (Jun 5, 2010)

Esp Griffyn said:


> Even a £3000 hand built razorback or Dime shaped thing is going to suck because it's a terrible shape, it's uncomfortable to play and hold



For me the "ML" shape is the most comfortable shape ever, both in the sitting and standing position. Perfect.

and the headstock, the Dean/WashburnDime headstock fits the shape , IMO an ML with a regular headstock looks... a bit weird


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## soliloquy (Jun 5, 2010)

for those who say that dean is just a metal brand, they did create the dean soltero and hardtail. and they do have someone like Leslie West in thier roster!!!!

for those who aren't familiar with LW:







but i mean, seriously, LOOK at these things!!



















also, perhaps mustain didn't move over to dean for money but due to his relationship with the metallica guys. perhaps ESP was giving them a bigger name and daves ego got in the way?

he normally is a dick about these kinda things, yet he genuinely seems happy with them. 

ammot claims he switched over to follow his idol, shenker. same is true for vinnie moore


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## Philligan (Jun 5, 2010)

chucknorrishred said:


> jackson bought by fender???!!?



Sadly, yeah. And the price of Jacksons skyrocketed. They're so expensive it blows me away. Here in Canada (at least for a while) an RR5 was 1600 bucks. You can get a brand new ESP Eclipse II for 1700 bucks.

Handmade > factory.


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## Murmel (Jun 5, 2010)

shogunate said:


> I would tune the whole damn thing to perfection, locked the nut, pulled one divebomb and the whole thing was out again  Never could figure out how Trivium did it for so long


Trivium most likely didn't get licensed FRs on their guitars but originals. And they were probably hand made too, unlike the factory versions of them which are shit. Kinda sad, I do like the ML shape but the headstock is awful, even though I can't see any other headstock matching the body.. It's a comfortable shape too if you ask me.

But.. Every Dean I've played has been awful and felt like a 100$ Squire..
And fuck the name-rape, they should show some respect to Dime.


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## Jack Secret (Jun 5, 2010)

Dean made a limited edition Rik Emmett of Triumph V as well. So limited, I never saw it for sale anywhere. 

EDIT: It's on Amazon for $3450 USD. The F**K I'd spend that much on a Dean.


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## budda (Jun 5, 2010)

The hate is because it's trendy to hate dean. Some people actually have legitimate reasons, but I get the feeling most don't.


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## jbcrazy (Jun 5, 2010)

budda said:


> The hate is because it's trendy to hate dean. Some people actually have legitimate reasons, but I get the feeling most don't.


 
Yes I LOVE the Hardtail. Well.. I LOVED the hardtail. As in I don't own one anymore. Their USA stuff is well well made. At least back in the 90s early 2000s. I haven't kept up with the new stuff even before Dean Zelinsky had left.

I do agree that what they're doing to Dimebag is just wrong on so many levels. Let him and his name rest. So much disrespect.


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## White Cluster (Jun 5, 2010)

US made

Korean Made


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 5, 2010)

budda said:


> The hate is because it's trendy to hate dean. Some people actually have legitimate reasons, but I get the feeling most don't.


 
The general concensus is that either their use of the Dimebag name is wrong or that they don't make good guitars.


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## InTheRavensName (Jun 5, 2010)

White Cluster said:


> US made
> 
> Korean Made



I've played loads of solid korean Deans, and owned two. If you can get one used there aren't many better options in the price range IMO.


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## xxGuy (Jun 5, 2010)

The quality in general of their guitars went way down a few years ago, the production models they put out now just feel really cheap. The fact that they milk Dime's name is pretty unsettling, considering Dime said many times that he did not like "signature guitars", that they were just labels- I believe Dean even has a Dime amp on the market now.


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## Daggorath (Jun 5, 2010)

If you're defending Dean then it definitely isn't on rational grounds. Go to a music shop that stocks Deans and play a guitar then play a number of other guitars around the same price from different brands. There's rather a large difference in both features and quality.

This is not to say that ALL Deans suck, but that there are far better options out there for the money.


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## AliceAxe (Jun 5, 2010)

I had no bias until I tryed one of the 7 strings recently. I hated it. The feel of it was awful , it made NOT want to play it. thats rare for me I'm a sucker for cheep guitars. 
But it did have a much lower price than the other 7s , it was definatly an 'entry level' guitar. So you are getting what you pay for, and as long as your intent is to buy a low-priced entry level guitar, than I guess its a fair deal. Personaly if I didnt have the cash for top gear (which I never do) I would rather buy an old cosmeticaly beat up guitar or one I could repair , that I like the feel of

I also hate the blatant exploitation of Dime. But then thats a common thing with any dead artist isn't it? Doesnt make it right tho.


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## Rashputin (Jun 5, 2010)

ephrion said:


> The guitars are ugly, 95% of the time. When they aren't ugly, they're overpriced.



Agreed. I just find them "plasticy" and unstable. Ive played some of the mid priced ones, but they left me with a really cheap impression. Everything from the neck, the finish to the hardware seemed cheap. Then again I havent tried the higher priced ones.

And many of them are uglier than "#¤"#¤. Even a lower priced LTD feels thighter and higher quality than those overpriced Deans.

If anybody disagrees; great! Somone obviously likes these guitars, so thats good for Dean. I think Dimebag (RIP) is a HUGE part of the reason why the company is still around.


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## misingonestring (Jun 5, 2010)

ephrion said:


> When they aren't ugly, they're overpriced.


 
This also applies to Gibson guitars.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Jun 5, 2010)

To be honest I actually want to have a cheap dean, just because of the crappiness.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 6, 2010)

wow, alot of responses to this thread. seems alot of people feel the same way about deans & have a valid reasons for their opinions. a few who love them have also chimed in & conclude some if it is grapevine...so to sum up:

1. the total "rape" of the dimebag name
2. poor quality materials & guitars
3. q.c. issues - letting crap & little details go out the door
3. overpriced compared to other models in the same price range

thanks guys - right or wrong, this thread has helped me understand why they are hated so much here.

i have the titles to my next few threads:

gibson guitars - why all the hate? 
fender guitars - why all the hate? 
krank amps - why all the hate? (see: dean guitars - why all the hate)


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## soliloquy (Jun 6, 2010)

the dimebag name rape is kind of a moot taht dean themselves aren't exactly responsible for, but dimes family. his wife and brother milk the name. dean just sits in the back and says 'sure, we make money, so whatever', while his wife is saying 'i dont do shit, and my husband was famous. lets milk him more. dean, will you help me?'

kurt cobain is dead, yet you still hear him over the radio
2 of the beatles are dead
michael jackson is dead
elvis is dead
hendrex is dead...

etc, yet you see radio, tv, music, guitar companies constantly make money off of the dead guys.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 6, 2010)

...well bad as i hate to i'd still like one of mustaine's angel of deth v's (used at least). anyone out there played one yet? how does it compare to dave's jackson king sig (i have) in terms of neck speed & comfort?

i plan on getting another washburn dime ml like i had but one of higher end model any suggestions?


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## Sebastian (Jun 6, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> i plan on getting another washburn dime ml like i had but one of higher end model any suggestions?



Checkout the 3ST's and of course the Dime 3's.

There's an awesome Lightningbolt on ebay right now http://cgi.ebay.com/Dimebag-3-USA-Dimebolt-Washburn-/200476018773?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Guitar&hash=item2ead4d4855

Sebastian = BIG Washburn Dime Fan


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## Murmel (Jun 6, 2010)

misingonestring said:


> This also applies to Gibson guitars.


As long as Gibson don't go over the top and make the fugliest guitars the world has ever seen they're great guitars.
But yeah, they are still WAAY overpriced too. When it comes to Gibson and Fender I honestly think that the name makes up for half the price.

Not saying that they're shit, the high end Gibsons and Fenders are incredible.


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 6, 2010)

soliloquy said:


> the dimebag name rape is kind of a moot taht dean themselves aren't exactly responsible for, but dimes family. his wife and brother milk the name. dean just sits in the back and says 'sure, we make money, so whatever', while his wife is saying 'i dont do shit, and my husband was famous. lets milk him more. dean, will you help me?'
> 
> kurt cobain is dead, yet you still hear him over the radio
> 2 of the beatles are dead
> ...


 
And making money of any of those (beyond listening to their music) is still not right either if its done in an extortionist way. I don't think I've seen anything in the same vein with those guys as Dean are doing to Dime.



Murmel said:


> As long as Gibson don't go over the top and make the fugliest guitars the world has ever seen they're great guitars.
> But yeah, they are still WAAY overpriced too. When it comes to Gibson and Fender I honestly think that the name makes up for half the price.
> 
> Not saying that they're shit, the high end Gibsons and Fenders are incredible.


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## Vyn (Jun 6, 2010)

^ Please tell me that shit ain't a real guitar 0.o


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## Psionicist (Jun 6, 2010)

I dont like Dean because I think their customer service sucks. I emailed them a few years back asking 2 questions about the Corey Beaulieu line of guitars and if I could get one left-handed. They gave me a 1 sentence reply "those arent in stock" or something like that. Didnt even Try to give me any other information. If I am not worth your effort in an email, your guitars aren't worth my effort in terms of $. 

I liked Pantera but wasnt a huge Dime fan, but some of those finishes make the guitars look like they ought to be sold at a flea market.


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 6, 2010)

Vyn said:


> ^ Please tell me that shit ain't a real guitar 0.o


 
I'm afraid it is. Its a Gibson Moderne, and there are worse Gibsons believe me.


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## KahlerPlayer (Jun 6, 2010)

I am a dimebag fan and when i heard about them bringing out the guitar he designed in tribute of him i couldn't believe it! I ordered one immediately and when i got it, the floyd rose licensed piece of shit always went out of tune. Seymour Duncan DIMEBUCKER just ruled the guitar and neck pickup was fightingly HORRIBLE.
2 years later there was a disgusting amount of dean razorbacks on the market, and i regret ever buying one now. Also they are possibly the cheapest deans you can buy on ebay now because NOBODY WANTS THEM!

RIP DIME


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## Murmel (Jun 6, 2010)

vampiregenocide said:


> And making money of any of those (beyond listening to their music) is still not right either if its done in an extortionist way. I don't think I've seen anything in the same vein with those guys as Dean are doing to Dime.


I never said that they DIDN'T make ugly guitars


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## oremus91 (Jun 6, 2010)

Philligan said:


> Sadly, yeah. And the price of Jacksons skyrocketed. They're so expensive it blows me away. Here in Canada (at least for a while) an RR5 was 1600 bucks. You can get a brand new ESP Eclipse II for 1700 bucks.
> 
> Handmade > factory.



That's a ridiculous price for an RR5, but it's probably the shop you went to along with the fact you're in Canada. My buddy in Laval pays more for everything. 

Honestly though, Jackson guitars are still great (aside from the look of these new 7s.. lol) and people are overreacting hardcore to the buyout (which btw was like 10+ years ago). Fender owns Charvel and treats them with respect and they make a fantastic fiddle still. Not to mention if you buy a USA model of Jackson it's still the same people making those along with the custom shops as before the Fender ownership.


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## alecisonfire (Jun 6, 2010)

to be totally honest, i dislike them for the following:
10% the whole dime issue
80% havent ever picked one up that i liked
10% michael angelo batio is a clown


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 6, 2010)

vampiregenocide said:


> I'm afraid it is. Its a Gibson Moderne, and there are worse Gibsons believe me.


 
that guitar is horrid!!! its as ugly as the new epi zack wylde coffin guitar!

infact my next thread will be: if there were only two guitar models in the world, which would you choose?

a) Gibson Moderne

b) Epi Coffin

c) neither - i'd become a drummer


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## MaKo´s Tethan (Jun 6, 2010)

This thread about Darrel make thinks in Hello Kitty. You can have anything you want with his name, sadly, now Darrel is just a brand, a product, an stupid Hello Kitty. And thats make me not only hate Dean, also the capitalism, the fuckin market, and the stupid world, but...did you ever think in the pos mortem Ibanez Jem? dude, those 777 different finished models will be great!!!!!!!!


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## Bloody_Inferno (Jun 6, 2010)

^ That may be All_¥our_Bass' dream setup.


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## Ironbird (Jun 6, 2010)

> 1. the total "rape" of the dimebag name
> 2. poor quality materials & guitars
> 3. q.c. issues - letting crap & little details go out the door
> 3. overpriced compared to other models in the same price range



I'll also add this to your list:

5. the giant headstock

Trust me, this bugs the HELL out of many guitarists.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 7, 2010)

MaKo´s Tethan;2008461 said:


> This thread about Darrel make thinks in Hello Kitty. You can have anything you want with his name, sadly, now Darrel is just a brand, a product, an stupid Hello Kitty. And thats make me not only hate Dean, also the capitalism, the fuckin market, and the stupid world, but...did you ever think in the pos mortem Ibanez Jem? dude, those 777 different finished models will be great!!!!!!!!


 
you may be on to something - he's got 33 guitars, an amp (s)?, stickers - is there a pedal also? who else is using it? what else have they used his name on?



Ironbird said:


> I'll also add this to your list:
> 
> 5. the giant headstock
> 
> Trust me, this bugs the HELL out of many guitarists.


 
yes, you are right, also:

6. never played one i liked
7. they feel cheap


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 7, 2010)

Really, it only comes down to the image that they give out. 

The USA stuff is pretty nice, and is priced rather competitively when compared with other, mainstream USA made brands (Gibson, Fender, Hamer, etc.).

The import stuff isn't bad either. Yeah, there are a fair share of lemons, but has anyone looked at all the absolute GARBAGE that Jackson, Ibanez, Agile, Squire, Epiphone, and others have been putting out in the same price bracket? 

The really low end stuff is crap, but so are 95% of guitars in the under $200 range. 

As for their designs (including "copies") they really aren't that weird or unique. I tend to like their Soltero and Hardtail shapes just as much as the Les Paul and PRS they are closest too copying. 

Just about all the hate comes from A) those who like Dime more than his image, B) those who look at Dime's "rape" as immoral, C) those who played a low-end bolt-on, D) those who've gotten a lemon, and ESPECIALLY E) those who have _read_, or _heard _of how "bad" the $1000 and under Deans are.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Jun 7, 2010)

Bloody_Inferno said:


> ^ That's All_¥our_Bass' dream setup.


Fixed 

I do have a fair amount of Hello Kitty stuff in my room too, but not quite like that-well not yet anyway.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 7, 2010)

^ all i have is the hello kitty key chain 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Just about all the hate comes from A) those who like Dime more than his image, B) those who look at Dime's "rape" as immoral, C) those who played a low-end bolt-on, D) those who've gotten a lemon, and ESPECIALLY E) those who have _read_, or _heard _of how "bad" the $1000 and under Deans are.


 
max is right, as usual. add to the growing list:

8. those who have _read_, or _heard _of how "bad" Deans are.


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## Vyn (Jun 7, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Really, it only comes down to the image that they give out.
> 
> The USA stuff is pretty nice, and is priced rather competitively when compared with other, mainstream USA made brands (Gibson, Fender, Hamer, etc.).
> 
> ...



This.


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## Rich5150 (Jun 7, 2010)

I have an Import Soltero Standard that is actually a killer guitar, Low action beefy as hell in the tone dept and killer sustain


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## Banana Wedgie (Jun 7, 2010)

This isn't even relevant, but...

What do Dean haters here think of DBZ guitars?


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 7, 2010)

Banana Wedgie said:


> This isn't even relevant, but...
> 
> What do Dean haters here think of DBZ guitars?



I think they're absolutely fucking hideous. I mean to each his own, and they seem to be quality, but I can't look at them for too long without my stomach starting to hurt and my gag reflex to start twitching. 

I've seen some REALLLLY fugly guitars in my days and the DBZ line-up is just about some of the worst as far as non-novelty, production guitars go. 

I will say though, that I applaud them for taking the high road and not making all carbon copies of other designs, like 90% of makers out there.


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## Banana Wedgie (Jun 7, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I've seen some REALLLLY fugly guitars in my days and the DBZ line-up is just about some of the worst as far as non-novelty, production guitars go.



I agree - with most of their stuff - but I did like the look of the Cavalos and Mondials.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 7, 2010)

Banana Wedgie said:


> I agree - with most of their stuff - but I did like the look of the Cavalos and Mondials.



Some of them aren't too bad, then again the Cavallo is a pretty straight forward V and the Mondial is just the Dean Hardtail PRS-type shape. In fact the Imperial isn't too bad either.

Actually, just looking at their site again, and it seems a lot of the models I really didn't like have "gone missing". I guess they got the hint.


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## Rich5150 (Jun 7, 2010)

I actually dig the Bird of Pray though it looks like I would snap it in half if i got too agressive with it


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 7, 2010)

dbz??? i though you meant dragon ball z 

i actually saw some of these on ebay a few months ago but was not sure about them - the do look well built. here is the link if anyone cares to see the collection so far:

*DBZ Guitars Collection including boutique guitar models to guitars for beginners*

*also notice the head stocks arent as massive...someone was listening *


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## vampiregenocide (Jun 7, 2010)

Banana Wedgie said:


> This isn't even relevant, but...
> 
> What do Dean haters here think of DBZ guitars?


 
They looks nice enough, wouldn't mind trying one.


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## eaeolian (Jun 7, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, there are a fair share of lemons, but has anyone looked at all the absolute GARBAGE that Jackson, Ibanez, Agile, Squire, Epiphone, and others have been putting out in the same price bracket?



Uh, in the mid-range ($600-$1000) where most of the Dean imports live, the Jacksons kick the shit out of them, as does what Schecter has in that range. That said, in that range they're not particularly bad, although their lows tend to be lower than the other "big names", in my experience.

Anything sub-$400 is a crap shoot, anyway. At that price, the Agiles are probably the *best* of what I've played.


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## damigu (Jun 7, 2010)

Vyn said:


> I wouldn't not buy a guitar based on what brand it was. If when I picked it up it played good and had the tone I was after when plugged in, it doesn't matter if it's a Dean, BC Rich, ESP or even a strat, if you like the feel and sound of it, buy it.



i couldn't agree more.

if it feels and sounds right, it doesn't matter what brand it is.

of my guitars, my favorite is a vintage dean, actually. i had never heard of dean when i bought it--i just picked it up due to the unique shape and it played excellently and i knew i had to have it.



soliloquy said:


> i say the reason behind deans hatred is mostly due to grape vine. one person says he had a bad experience, and the word spread out and sooner or later, deans reputation is significantly hurt.


 
i'm pretty sure you're right, combined with the dimebag thing.

during the 90's, when tropical music owned dean, the quality was extremely inconsistent. and they're still recovering from that bad reputation.

since armadillo bought them, they've improved quality greatly. the quality is currently on par with every other big brand of guitar. but the continued reputation biases people.



shogunate said:


> And, Mr. Zelinsky himself stepped away and now has his own rapidly growing company. When a company's founder and namesake decides to get uninvolved, that seems to say something iffy about the going-ons in my eyes. Ok enough



actually, zelinsky hasn't been an owner of dean since the late 80's. the current owner, elliott rubinson, is just nice and dedicated enough to the brand that he brought zelinsky back into the fold as a sort of creative/design head.

but zelinsky himself is a total flake. he didn't "decide to get uninvolved"--it was a mutual decision between dean guitars and zelinsky that he needs to GTFO because the company was getting increasingly unhappy with his behavior and attitude.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 7, 2010)

damigu said:


> actually, zelinsky hasn't been an owner of dean since the late 80's. the current owner, elliott rubinson, is just nice and dedicated enough to the brand that he brought zelinsky back into the fold as a sort of creative/design head.
> 
> but zelinsky himself is a total flake. he didn't "decide to get uninvolved"--it was a mutual decision between dean guitars and zelinsky that he needs to GTFO because the company was getting increasingly unhappy with his behavior and attitude.


 
this is pretty intresting....where did you get the info? link? i'd like to read more about it. do you know where he stood on the whole dime thing?


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## damigu (Jun 7, 2010)

i'm on the dean forum and that shit was all they were talking about when it went down.


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## soliloquy (Jun 7, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> this is pretty intresting....where did you get the info? link? i'd like to read more about it. do you know where he stood on the whole dime thing?




zelenski claims that the reason he left dean the second time around is due to what people were doing to HIS guitars. he left dean in the 80's coz he was getting annoyed by the hair metal super strats with floyds on them. he left in the 2000's coz apparently to him the QC was failing and what he wanted wasn't happening. 

but then again, zelenski, though a lot of people say is a great guy, he is known for bad mouthing the checz repulbic deans where many of their owners claim to be on par or superior to any other USA guitars...so go figure.. 






MaxOfMetal said:


> The import stuff isn't bad either. Yeah, there are a fair share of lemons, but has anyone looked at all the absolute GARBAGE that Jackson, Ibanez, _*Agile*_, Squire, Epiphone, and others have been putting out in the same price bracket?
> 
> The really low end stuff is crap, but so are 95% of guitars in the under $200 range.




i generally agree with you for everything you say around the forum, except the agile part 

the 200 for agile is actually worth about 400ish in retail for other brands. 

so the rondo equal to the 200 dollar jackson/ibanez/schecter/dean would/may be the SX...

but then again, i've seen the SX and Valencia brands in guitar stores go for about 4-500 dollars, so go figure


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 8, 2010)

soliloquy said:


> i generally agree with you for everything you say around the forum, except the agile part
> 
> the 200 for agile is actually worth about 400ish in retail for other brands.
> 
> ...



Considering the many Agiles with uneven frets, marks on the fretboard from improper filing, defects in the wood, and various finish flaws I'd say, while they are a better _value_ compared to some brands, they do produce their fair share of lemons. Not to mention the dozens of people who have received guitars with improper specs.

What I was saying was that at the price levels where the majority of these guitars are being offered ($500 - $1000) by various makers, there is still a chance of getting a lemon.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 8, 2010)

well, i see a lot of people have had bad experiences with dean. However i have a razorback, rc7 and avalanche 7 and there is nothing wrong with them. They didnt come with warped necks, sounding like shit, or even "cheap peices" they may be cheap but none of my guitars feel cheap to me(except for the avalanche cuz it wasa $200 steal). Im thankful for what i have and dont cry about a guitar because it isnt good enough.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 8, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> well, i see a lot of people have had bad experiences with dean. However i have a razorback, rc7 and avalanche 7 and there is nothing wrong with them. They didnt come with warped necks


 
thats good to hear, cause i still plan on getting that mustaine v. like i said i had an older one in the past & it was good. wasnt sure about the newer stuff since i read alot of neg. things about them hear. hopefully when i post a ngd for it that only positive things will be said.

the whole dean / zelinski thing is crazy - i need to research this more. does anyone know why dime left washburn & went back to dean?


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 8, 2010)

i think washburn was bought out by dean, idk exactly but im probably wrong.

but ive played some of the mustaine v's in guitarcenter and they're pretty decent.
When there are a lot of negative feedback on a guitar company on a forum i ignore it and decide for myself, half of these people(our ss.org brothers and sisters) either havent played a dean in a while or got really unlucky, or just played a dean that some asshole fucked up in the store. which there are a lot of those....assholes screwing things up in stores.

so many guitars ive picked up missing the 9v battery or all the ibby's ive played missing the trem bar.


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## damigu (Jun 9, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> i think washburn was bought out by dean, idk exactly but im probably wrong.



absolutely not. washburn is dean's biggest rival.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 9, 2010)

damigu said:


> absolutely not. washburn is dean's biggest rival.



Yeah, Washburn is owned by a different company. 

How are they each other's biggest rivals? I know they're competition in the industry, but do they have a history together?


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## damigu (Jun 9, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, Washburn is owned by a different company.
> 
> How are they each other's biggest rivals? I know they're competition in the industry, but do they have a history together?



both have a similar market share (dean has a little less). both also make their business by having a some outlandish shapes. and both have dimebag signature models.

neither are really so big that they compete with gibson/fender/ibanez, but they're both are lot bigger than brands like agile and turser.


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## soliloquy (Jun 9, 2010)

/\ well, i would say, if anything hamer and dean have a friendly rivalry.
washburn is just a USA company that brings lots of 'mehs' from everyone about their product. much like peavey. though they make amazing guitars, people look over them


if i'm not mistaken, dime left dean because dean ceased to exist, which caused the contract between dime/dean to end. and dime wanted a new guitar, but dean himself wasn't there, and the company was being sold through sears for 80 bucks a guitar, if that....

while dean was non-existant, dime tried out with Jackson but was rejected, BC RICH (via Kerry King) didn't reply, washburn did. so he went to washburn. 

come 2000, dean was back up via armadello corp, and Dime was still loyal to dean, so he switched over.


but, i am often wrong, so i wont be surprised if i'm wrong again. MaxofMetal may know better


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 9, 2010)

damigu said:


> both have a similar market share (dean has a little less). both also make their business by having a some outlandish shapes. and both have dimebag signature models.
> 
> neither are really so big that they compete with gibson/fender/ibanez, but they're both are lot bigger than brands like agile and turser.



Maybe a decade or so ago. 

Look at Washburns current line up of guitars as well as artists, then compare it to Dean. 

Washburn is pushing their rather standard shaped (Super Strat, Tele/SC, and V) HM series, with the Idol and X series being reduced to an all time low. As of now they make zero "pointy" guitars. Their artist roster (even a couple years ago) has been focused on some older Metal guys (Nuno and Paul) and the newer generation of extreme metal (Metalcore and Technical Death Metal). Dean is doing almost the exact opposite with various pointy and not so common shaped guitars being endorsed by Shredders and old rockers. 

You can't really compare their positions as long standing (with a couple hiccups here and there) American guitar companies with active custom shops to import only, "new" companies like Agile and Jay Turser. 

As far as market share goes, I wouldn't say Washburn has ANYTHING over Dean, especially now that Washburn has changed hands, and a bunch of their artists have jumped ship. Washburn has been fighting to stay afloat in the mainstream for years now, and it looks like this new owner may be their death null, unless they can REALLY turn things around with the HMs. All the internet hate aside, Dean is doing better than they have in years. Whether that's do to hype, artist roster, or genuinely making nice guitars is up in the air.


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## damigu (Jun 9, 2010)

1/ as you said, washburn just recently changed their focus. but that doesn't change what's been going on between them for a long time, or the guitars on the walls of guitar stores. there are still a lot of pointy and weird shaped washburns out there, including the current HM series "V" with its weird melted/bendy look and pointy tips.

2/ if you read what i wrote, you'll see that i didn't compare them to agile and turser. i specifically said washy and dean are *NOT* comparable to agile and turser.

3/ as for market share, a lot of guitarists out there are still barely aware of dean. it was my 5th or 6th year of playing guitar before i heard of them and i had been aware of washburn long before. same is true of most guitarists. washburn may be heading south, but they still have more name recognition than dean.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 9, 2010)

every guitar company has their fuck ups, ugly guitars,fan boys and people who hate them because of what their friend said on the internet. /end thread.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 9, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> every guitar company has their fuck ups, ugly guitars,fan boys and people who hate them because of what their friend said on the internet. /end thread.



Though all companies have unique histories. 

You can't compare Gibson hate, Halo hate, and Ibanez hate.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 9, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Though all companies have unique histories.
> 
> You can't compare Gibson hate, Halo hate, and Ibanez hate.



true, i dont particularly like ibanez *hides* for the same reason alot of these guys dont like dean. There are some ibby's that i play(like the xiphos) that i'd love to own. but alot of them feel cheap to me and awkward to play which alot of people say "oh its because of the shitty factory set up" which in my mind i just think "stop making excuses" even though i know this is partially true and the same goes for every guitar company. not every guitar you pick up is going to have an amazing or even good set up. which is why you should set it up yourself and then judge.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 9, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> true, i dont particularly like ibanez *hides* for the same reason alot of these guys dont like dean. There are some ibby's that i play(like the xiphos) that i'd love to own. but alot of them feel cheap to me and awkward to play which alot of people say "oh its because of the shitty factory set up" which in my mind i just think "stop making excuses" even though i know this is partially true and the same goes for every guitar company. not every guitar you pick up is going to have an amazing or even good set up. which is why you should set it up yourself and then judge.



And that's fine. 

Though, look at companies like Halo, who legitimately put out garbage. There's no poor setup issue there. They simply make guitars which are not properly made.


----------



## MorbidTravis (Jun 9, 2010)

lol when think of guitar companies that think they are godly and dont even know they are putting out shit i think of devries.


----------



## metalstrike (Jun 10, 2010)

Well the only Dean I've ever tried (the MAB sig model) was garbage. 

Especially for the $1300 asking price


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## spattergrind (Jun 10, 2010)

I think agree with what people are saying on here and i just wanted to add that there very bass heavy guitars....like gibsons...


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## damigu (Jun 10, 2010)

spattergrind said:


> I think agree with what people are saying on here and i just wanted to add that there very bass heavy guitars....like gibsons...



but that isn't true of all of their guitars.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 11, 2010)

this info is a little older but according to this list wash (#11) is ahead of dean (#14)

Best Guitar Manufacturers as ranked by shareranks

Best Guitar Manufacturers - Top 10 - Internet's definitive top list - most, greatest of everything ranked User Contributed Rankings - ShareRanks.com

im doing a thread about this list too.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 11, 2010)

dean is on there twice lol


----------



## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 11, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> dean is on there twice lol


 
 your right - but if you look closely (i missed it the first time) the dean/prs is ranked #14, dean is #34! so it is worst then expected!


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 11, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> this info is a little older but according to this list wash (#11) is ahead of dean (#14)
> 
> Best Guitar Manufacturers as ranked by shareranks
> 
> ...



Looks like a data-less list compiled by "internet goers" opinions and nothing more. 

I wouldn't put much weight in this.

Come on, Godin being number 3?
Who the hell is Jackson/ESP?
Yamaha? They've just about given up in the guitar/bass market.
Les Paul? That's not a brand.
The the fuck is a "Dean/PRS"?
Norman?

This list has to be a joke.


----------



## Fred the Shred (Jun 11, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looks like a data-less list compiled by "internet goers" opinions and nothing more.
> 
> I wouldn't put much weight in this.
> 
> ...



^ This pretty much sums it up. It's as reliable as the polls that stated Kirk Hammett was the best guitar player ever some 20 years ago or everyone who swears by some guitar maker's quality without even having SEEN one of their guitars in the flesh, let alone play it.

The internet is absolutely filled with people who will take other people's opinions as their own without any questions or tangible information that lets them make an informed statement. These lists are, of course, a manifestation of this phenomenon.


----------



## Sebastian (Jun 11, 2010)

soliloquy said:


> BC RICH (via Kerry King) didn't reply



It's hard to send someone a prototype without replying you know ?


----------



## soliloquy (Jun 11, 2010)

Sebastian said:


> It's hard to send someone a prototype without replying you know ?




ahh! i stand corrected. 
any idea why then Dime ditched BC RICH and went over to washy?


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## Sebastian (Jun 11, 2010)

soliloquy said:


> ahh! i stand corrected.
> any idea why then Dime ditched BC RICH and went over to washy?



Because the Washburn's he got were better. Much better


----------



## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 11, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looks like a data-less list compiled by "internet goers" opinions and nothing more.
> 
> I wouldn't put much weight in this.
> 
> ...


 


Fred the Shred said:


> ^ This pretty much sums it up. It's as reliable as the polls that stated Kirk Hammett was the best guitar player ever some 20 years ago or everyone who swears by some guitar maker's quality without even having SEEN one of their guitars in the flesh, let alone play it.
> 
> The internet is absolutely filled with people who will take other people's opinions as their own without any questions or tangible information that lets them make an informed statement. These lists are, of course, a manifestation of this phenomenon.


 
 that is what is so funny about lists like this - people sometimes dont notice things and start going nuts about who is better then who. others will read and see the error & stupidity - it is worth some laughs 

the internet is the modern day newspaper & just like in the past, you cant always believe what you read in print.


----------



## MorbidTravis (Jun 11, 2010)

lol the newspaper is still like that, when my house burnt down they got all the streets and city wrong and said "a mother a her 5 children barely escaped from their burning home" ya i dont have 4 siblings and my dogs dont count. and we definitely got out in time to be safe


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## Rick (Jun 11, 2010)

Sebastian said:


>



Nothing screams metal like a truck stop.


----------



## soliloquy (Jun 11, 2010)

going back to dean,

i just received my dean soltero standard. very kick ass guitar!!! 
its very resonant and just plays great! there are a few blems in the clear coat, but its minute. is it the best guitar i've played? no, but it certain does play like a more expensive guitar than it originally is. 

i'll post pictures of it maybe sunday or monday...

in the mean time, its some shredding time!


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 11, 2010)

Rick said:


> Nothing screams metal like a truck stop.



If you've ever toured the US, places like Love's and Flying J are an "oasis in the desert". 

I still get a smile when I pass one.


----------



## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 12, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> If you've ever toured the US, places like Love's and Flying J are an "oasis in the desert".
> 
> I still get a smile when I pass one.


 
you forgot to mention the "iron skillet" - food, drinks, baths, phones (before cell's) & video games. you could also get your shoes shined or your knife sharpened. also the gift shop has helped me save face more then once 



soliloquy said:


> going back to dean,
> 
> i just received my dean soltero standard. very kick ass guitar!!!
> its very resonant and just plays great! there are a few blems in the clear coat, but its minute. is it the best guitar i've played? no, but it certain does play like a more expensive guitar than it originally is.
> ...


 
cool, i'd like to see that. any dean lovers got anything to say?


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 12, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> you forgot to mention the "iron skillet" - food, drinks, baths, phones (before cell's) & video games. you could also get your shoes shined or your knife sharpened. also the gift shop has helped me save face more then once



How could I forget! 

The one in El Paso was a life saver on my last move (FL to AZ). I think it was in El Paso, though it may have been in NV. I was pretty out of it. 

Sorry for the OT banter.


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## Wannabe Prodigy (Jun 12, 2010)

My 300 dollar Dean Strat that's about 7 years old made in Korea is phenomenal. In some ways it's better than my USA Jackson.

The pups are a little weak but even them are pretty good for the price. I'm gonna put some new pups in it for sure.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 13, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> How could I forget!
> 
> The one in El Paso was a life saver on my last move (FL to AZ). I think it was in El Paso, though it may have been in NV. I was pretty out of it.
> 
> Sorry for the OT banter.


 
no worries, if im not talking about guitars, im thinking about food . and shout outs to all the chinese all you can eat buffets - if it werent for you guys id weigh about a 60lbs less....ok, back on topic.



> =Wannabe Prodigy;2015730]My 300 dollar Dean Strat that's about 7 years old made in Korea is phenomenal. In some ways it's better than my USA Jackson.


 
sounds like you have a keeper there. i know what you mean, every once in a while you get a gem. i have a neck-thru squire that feels better then any mim or usa fender ive played. but this is rare!

on the other hand i have a few korean made guitars and they are decent & well made but i dont think they compare to my 2 usa jacksons. also had and rr1 - its hard to beat their quality.


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## Andromalia (Jun 13, 2010)

Well, Gibbons once bought 20 or so random low end guitars from an asian manufacturer (Cort ? Don't remember), dismantled them all and took the best of the 20 necks, the best of the 20 bodies, the best of the 20 everything to build a new guitar and he said it was pretty stellar. I remember this from reading an article some 10-15 years ago so I don't remember the details. ^^


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## stuz719 (Jun 13, 2010)

For interest, check out the tone this guy gets from his Dean Baby Z and Dean amp.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 13, 2010)

is it supposed to be played in clean?


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 13, 2010)

Andromalia said:


> Well, Gibbons once bought 20 or so random low end guitars from an asian manufacturer (Cort ? Don't remember), dismantled them all and took the best of the 20 necks, the best of the 20 bodies, the best of the 20 everything to build a new guitar and he said it was pretty stellar. I remember this from reading an article some 10-15 years ago so I don't remember the details. ^^


 
 cort! are you kidding me? that was my first guitar. there was a black explorer they made called the effector. anyone else have one of these or remember them? had built in effects like wah & distortion. i loved that guitar - got it for my birthday back in 1986! straight out of the sears catolog. it was the poorboy's ibanez dt-555 destoyer II.


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## AhsanU (Jun 15, 2010)

Well, as an owner of 4 Dean guitars, 2 of which are USA models, I can understand the hate that Dean Guitars receives.

I completely agree with the notion that they've raped Dimebag's name. There are plenty of Dime models out there, and virtually everyone on the Dean Guitars forums wasn't too happy at Winter NAMM because of the introduction of even more Dime models. The two import Dean's I own have been repainted, and I had the painter not include Dime's name anywhere on the guitar.

Dean's import guitars is a whole other story. They're notoriously known for being "hit or miss", as far as quality goes of course. I've owned 6 import Deans, and 3 of them have been real shotty quality. Their line of import guitars definitely has issues, and getting a used model is always a better choice because of the high price of new ones. I really can't look at an import Dean then at an Agile and somehow justify spending 400-600 more on a guitar that is no better.

But what it is for me, is the feel and playability of their instruments. I just love the soft V neck shape of the Razorback and Razorback V's. My two USA models feel great, and sound great.

To each his own I suppose.


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## AliceAxe (Jun 15, 2010)

M3CHK1LLA said:


> cort! are you kidding me? that was my first guitar. there was a black explorer they made called the effector. anyone else have one of these or remember them? had built in effects like wah & distortion. i loved that guitar - got it for my birthday back in 1986! straight out of the sears catolog. it was the poorboy's ibanez dt-555 destoyer II.


 
heehee thats kinda neat. I know nothing of their guitars, but I've got an old Cort stand I got out of a sears catalog around that time  other stands have come and gone may they rest in pieces, but that thing is still solid - heavy duty toughness.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 16, 2010)

AhsanU said:


> Well, as an owner of 4 Dean guitars, 2 of which are USA models, I can understand the hate that Dean Guitars receives.
> 
> I completely agree with the notion that they've raped Dimebag's name.
> But what it is for me, is the feel and playability of their instruments. I just love the soft V neck shape of the Razorback and Razorback V's. My two USA models feel great, and sound great.
> ...


 
if ya like it, stick with it - to each his own 

ive read alot of reviews on the dean i want - all possitive: 9's and 10's in the ratings. better be for the price + mustaine is still around to make sure its good stuff.



AliceAxe said:


> heehee thats kinda neat. I know nothing of their guitars, but I've got an old Cort stand I got out of a sears catalog around that time  other stands have come and gone may they rest in pieces, but that thing is still solid - heavy duty toughness.


 
they were awesome for the money. i still have mine too. they also made it in white, my future brother-in-law at the time had one w/ four black stripes ala mathis jabbs........well, he still is my brother-in-law 

man i wish i had that stand - buy it for $15


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## damigu (Jun 16, 2010)

what it boils down to is this:

every name brand guitar has its amazing models and its stinkers. no one should judge a whole company based on a single experience.
(nor on whether they think dime's name is being whored out or not since he liked to whore it out himself while he was still alive--he had his name on tons of shit, just like every other guitarist who makes it)

i actually pity people who dismiss whole brands out of hand like that. they'll never know what gems they're missing.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 17, 2010)

^ and you sir make a good point also

today one of my ebay searchs turned up new hendrix guitar strap

*Levys Levy's Jimmy Jimi Hendrix Series Guitar Strap - eBay (item 310225020273 end time Jul-05-10 21:11:02 PDT)*

*apparently he has 8 models to choose from *

*42 items pull up for SRV*


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## Caveman (Jun 17, 2010)

Well I hate dean right about now. the dime models really need to stop...

but i own a dime o flame and a washburn dime as well. and in comparison the dime-o-flame is way better. first off it came with the sig dimebucker. the washburn had washburn brandpickups. the trem was absolute junk on the washburn. the dime-o-flame was at least a sick shredder although when i set the action to where i wanted it the floyd couldnt raise pitch past a whole note. after a deeper route and adding a tremol-no and evh d tuna its one of the best playing guitars i own.

also i own a customized dean evo 7 that tears it up as well. really odd neck joint but suprisingly nice.
also i picked up one of the dean Dimebag heads off ebay super cheap recently. not the worlds most variable tone amp but it does impress for the price.

my experience with dean has always been good. i just feel embarrassed to actually show off my dean gear.

now when someone likes their gear but doesnt wanna show it off because the brands gotta bad name thats when a company should realise the financial blow its about to take. when everyone abandons them completely


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## soliloquy (Jun 17, 2010)

man, i'm so embarrassed to own this! (  not really. this is just an excuse to post some pics  )


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 18, 2010)

^ SWEET AXE


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## soliloquy (Jun 18, 2010)

it does have its issues, but they all can be over looked when you consider its playability, its tone and sustain.


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## guitareben (Jun 18, 2010)

Hosenbugler said:


> I think that my main reason for not liking Dean guitars is that, on the whole, they suck. Also, their artist roster is like reading a who's-who of people whose music I don't like or want to listen to ever. And they are ugly, almost without exception.



This.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 18, 2010)

^


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## Arctodus (Jun 18, 2010)

The czech made ones are fuckin' sweet if you can find one. 

I bought a cheap ass dean for shits and giggles. I actually liked the body resonance for being extremely cheap wood (paulownia wood or whatever) Almost had acoustic qualities to it and was very loud. But I got rid of it because it wouldn't stay in tune for shit and there were so many design flaws that pissed me off.

In short, stay away from the dime ones. If you like how a higher made korean, czech or america one feels/play. Don't scamper away from it just because it says "dean" on it. Ignore the damn brand label.


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 21, 2010)

i noticed when i went to look at mustaines sigs again they added this:







this just doesnt look quite right to me. its supposed to be killer but i like the v better. the bridge & heasdstock seem off.

hey, didnt hetfield play a white explorer  yup!


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## ZaeYeL (Jun 22, 2010)

stuz719 said:


> For interest, check out the tone this guy gets from his Dean Baby Z and Dean amp.




i laughed through the whole thing


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## chucknorrishred (Jun 22, 2010)

^^  sounds like its farting


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## M3CHK1LLA (Jun 23, 2010)

someone else on the forum started a thread - something about vomiting in their mouth???

with a picture of this:






yup, a dime bass


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## kamello (Sep 29, 2010)

i have a Dean vendetta 4.0, and an Epi '96 Rebel, the one's that are builded like tanks , but the vendetta is fair way better than the epi in sound, i feel it pretty solid even compared to the Epi, and since i bought it, i never had to tune it

and about dimebag, i never tested any razorback, i don't like the design and every fucking model have only 22 frets


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