# Metallica tabs are now illegal?



## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2014)

So I just went on UG to download One to play. I thought I had it, but I can't find it on the computer. I clicked on the tab, and a pop up said it had been removed at a request from the publisher. I checked the others, and found the same thing. WTF? Is this a Lars thing? I wish someone would just tell the guy to go into investment banking if he wants to be a millionaire, and to stop pulling stunts like this. Do they really make that much more from selling tab books that it makes sense to send lawyers after everyone tabbing their music?


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## TRENCHLORD (Feb 4, 2014)

They'd just hate to have more cover bands whooping their a-- on their own classics .


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2014)

Yeah, well when I buy some of the crap riffs they cast aside (http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ge...11-metallica-may-auction-off-their-riffs.html) and record my own music Lars better protect me, too! Lord knows it's not like anyone can just listen to music and figure out what they're playing. Oh, wait...


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## TRENCHLORD (Feb 4, 2014)

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, well when I buy some of the crap riffs they cast aside (http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ge...11-metallica-may-auction-off-their-riffs.html) and record my own music Lars better protect me, too! Lord knows it's not like anyone can just listen to music and figure out what they're playing. Oh, wait...


 
Oh man , in recent years they'd be better off buying riffs rather than selling riffs IMO.


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## Dayn (Feb 4, 2014)

There's quite a lot of articles in law journals about the topic. As far as I can discern, there hasn't been any case to test it. In jurisdictions that provide copyright holders with derivative rights, such as the US (from memory), tablature of existing songs would be infringing unless it fell under an exception.

But until someone stands up to test it, people will fold. Especially when so many tabs out there are direct rips from published books. That's not on. Websites will remove them upon request because they're just hosting it and have no stake in the matter. They don't want liability. Especially if they generate ad revenue by hosting tabs... they'd be ....ed.

It's a really interesting topic that I want to address, but I'm already swamped by work and research projects as it is... I'd rather play music, than write about tablature of music.


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## axemanrio (Feb 4, 2014)

WTF! Lars is doing his best to stay Mr.Popular.


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## Leveebreaks (Feb 4, 2014)

Hollowway said:


> I wish someone would just tell the guy to go into investment banking if he wants to be a millionaire?


 
Waaaay too late for that.

Tab publishing is still big business, but I doubt it will make a huge impact on his ability to buy shit paintings.
Just a thought for everyone always blaming Lars...they do have an extremely proactive management team that will seek to defend Metallica's copyrights by any means necessary.

Oh yeah and UG is pretty shit too. The last 5 tabs I have looked at were wrong in major ways. Use your ears, I can't think of a riff they wrote that is so fast it can't be transcribed by ear.


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## Leveebreaks (Feb 4, 2014)

I have the Tab book for Justice still though somewhere, I'll try and dig it out and scan it for you.


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## Yo_Wattup (Feb 4, 2014)

Leveebreaks said:


> I have the Tab book for Justice still though somewhere, I'll try and dig it out and scan it for you.



I wouldnt worry about it man, those .gp5 tabs will be up on pirate bay faster than any of Metallica's riffs.


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2014)

Yeah, I mean it's not the end of the world. I can transcribe it myself. But that's the issue: if someone can listen to it and figure it out, why is it illegal to put it online? I guess it would be like writing down all of the words in a movie and posting that online. Except that I've seen that done, and no one gets up in arms about that.


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## chopeth (Feb 4, 2014)

Leveebreaks said:


> I have the Tab book for Justice still though somewhere, I'll try and dig it out and scan it for you.



I think that this is the worst tab book I own, full of mistakes...


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## Yo_Wattup (Feb 4, 2014)

chopeth said:


> I think that this is the worst tab book I own, full of mistakes...



I know a guy who went to a Metallica signing and he got them to sign a Metallica tab book. Kirk just laughed at all the errors in the tabs. This is why I don't use tab books, unless they are written by a member of the band. (Scale the Summit comes to mind)


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Feb 4, 2014)

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I mean it's not the end of the world. I can transcribe it myself. But that's the issue: if someone can listen to it and figure it out, why is it illegal to put it online?



Because under copyright law, this qualifies as derivative work. Even if the person producing the tablature is not making a profit off of their transcription, the fan transcription itself can theoretically dilute the market and damage revenue potentially earned by a licensed product. Intellectual property rights also ensure that the copyright owner can control the manner in which their product or brand is packaged and presented. Imagine that the KKK put up some racist garbage on YouTube and illegally synchronized the video with the song that you worked on for a year to cope with the loss of a family member. After discovering that they used your song in this manner (hopefully contrary to your original intentions ), you would probably be happy to know that laws are in place that can easily help to remove your newfound and unwilling association to the Racist Bastards of America. Provided you paid the $35 fee to file your copyright, that is.

Copyright isn't perfect, but it gives protection to creators that I think encourages creation. Some entities are vigilant about policing their copyrights, some are more lax. Disney and Metallica are two examples of corporations that famously protect their copyrights. Every single tab on UG is illegal (unless otherwise stated by the owner of the copyright), as is every cover on YouTube (as well as all unlicensed broadcasts of songs), so I am not offended that Metallica is pursuing their legal claim. They are among the few who actually do. If anything, it is a proof of the law.


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## TeeWX (Feb 4, 2014)

Mr. Big Noodles said:


> Every single tab on UG is illegal (unless otherwise stated by the owner of the copyright), as is every cover on YouTube (as well as all unlicensed broadcasts of songs), so I am not offended that Metallica is pursuing their legal claim.



So covering a song is illegal? How do tiny unknown cover bands get the rights to cover songs? Or don't they?


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Feb 4, 2014)

They probably don't. Usually, that is the venue's responsibility. Most venues that license music do so under a general license that they have to pay periodically. When I say "venue", that could mean anything from the Madison Square Garden to the radio at McDonald's. ASCAP has a form that you can fill out to to help apply for the appropriate licensing. Some venues take a risk and operate without a license. In rural Minnesota a venue can probably get away with doing unlicensed covers, because it is not very likely that a representative of ASCAP or BMI is sitting at the bar every night. A club in Hollywood? Forget it - they're paying that general license. One venue I've played at in Canoga Park does not buy any licensing, but they also have a no covers policy. In a county that has so many people working in the entertainment industry, it is not wise to stage unlicensed performances of copyrighted works. However, there are a few sorts of venues that have a sort of "social immunity": my brother was in Burbank High School's show choir, which performs nothing but copyrighted music, and they don't purchase licensing despite the fact that nearly every parent of the kids involved in this program probably works for a corporation that owns copyrights to the music they perform. I think Disney has threatened legal action one or two times, but it rarely escalates beyond threats because it's bad publicity to sue grade schools. Churches are infamous for illegal performances, but once again, who is going to sue a church? Sometimes, you can pick your battles.


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## innovine (Feb 4, 2014)

Is it illegal to transcribe something for my own use? Ie is it the publishing of a transcription that's infringing, not the transcription itself?


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Feb 4, 2014)

Yes, it's illegal, but who is going to know? Is it illegal for me to burn a CD for a friend?


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## Ralyks (Feb 4, 2014)

chopeth said:


> I think that this is the worst tab book I own, full of mistakes...


 
Yup, the AJFA book is notorious bad. Pretty sure I just gave it away at some point, it was so bad.


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## drgamble (Feb 4, 2014)

innovine said:


> Is it illegal to transcribe something for my own use? Ie is it the publishing of a transcription that's infringing, not the transcription itself?


 
Copyright has more to do with distribution or public performance of said material. Distributing a copyrighted work in any form is illegal. It is perfectly legal for you to make copies of a cd or tape for your own personal use as you bought a license to do so when you bought the album/tape/download. The problem comes in with distribution or public performance. You are perfectly within your own rights as a license holder to transcribe music for your own personal use. It does not matter at all if you make any money off of infringing on copyright.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Feb 4, 2014)

^ That. Never ye mind what I said.


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2014)

innovine said:


> Is it illegal to transcribe something for my own use? Ie is it the publishing of a transcription that's infringing, not the transcription itself?



innovine...Iovine? Jimmy? STAY OUT OF OUR THREAD and stop trying to entrap SW!!!


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## Nag (Feb 4, 2014)

axemanrio said:


> WTF! Lars is doing his best to stay Mr.Popular.




Lars ? Popular ?





Seriously now, I just downloaded a bunch of GP5 tabs (including the One tab with 300 votes on it) from UG and they all work... 

Problem seems to be on your side


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## RedDog22 (Feb 4, 2014)

Hollowway said:


> So I just went on UG to download One to play. I thought I had it, but I can't find it on the computer. I clicked on the tab, and a pop up said it had been removed at a request from the publisher. I checked the others, and found the same thing. WTF? Is this a Lars thing? I wish someone would just tell the guy to go into investment banking if he wants to be a millionaire, and to stop pulling stunts like this. Do they really make that much more from selling tab books that it makes sense to send lawyers after everyone tabbing their music?


yeah. I went to that site ystrdy & was looking for tabs and 90% of the ones I was looking for were for subscribers/members only.  Then I stumbled upon an old bookmark for another tab site and all the stuff I was looking for was there for free AND had a midi option to hear it played. I'll be going to the other site FIRST from now on. It had Morbid Angel & Slayer- all free tabs  (at least the tracks I looked for)


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## Robby the Robot (Feb 4, 2014)

Weird. I downloaded a Master of Puppets tab two-three weeks ago just fine.


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## skeels (Feb 4, 2014)

Hollowway said:


> ....if he wants to be a millionaire...
> 
> Oh wait. He is.


 
Fixed for ya there man.


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## Hollowway (Feb 4, 2014)

Nagash said:


> Seriously now, I just downloaded a bunch of GP5 tabs (including the One tab with 300 votes on it) from UG and they all work...
> 
> Problem seems to be on your side



Huh. I'll try it again tonight. I'm not registered on UG (or if I am I don't remember my login), so if that's the issue I'll register and then try.


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## Nag (Feb 5, 2014)

I'm not registered either...


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## illimmigrant (Feb 5, 2014)

This is too funny.
After hearing Metallica perform One at the Grammy's I decided I wanted to do a cover from scratch and record guitars, bass, drums, mix and master it out of pure respect/tribute. I don't know the whole song, so I went to UG to download the GP files and got the same messages. That they had been removed by publisher's request... so yeah, I dropped the idea lol.


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## s4tch (Feb 5, 2014)

I can download Metallica tabs without any issue or legal warning. Anyway, if someone is experiencing some issues, drop me a PM; a couple of months ago, I downloaded a Guitar Pro tab for each Metallica song. The whole package is like 400kB, I can upload it somewhere.


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## chopeth (Feb 5, 2014)

s4tch said:


> I can download Metallica tabs without any issue or legal warning. Anyway, if someone is experiencing some issues, drop me a PM; a couple of months ago, I downloaded a Guitar Pro tab for each Metallica song. The whole package is like 400kB, I can upload it somewhere.



But... are the tabs the same as in their tab books? In that case, I'm not interested (since I have the first five)


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## viesczy (Feb 5, 2014)

If some big company could potentially lose $, even $1, they are sure to get their $ by having the offending folks removed the content that might cost them that $1. 

Now question about these so called 'mistakes'. It is the error in the musical notes or "error" in where the correct musical notes are played? 

One is an actual error and one is a choice of where to play the correct note.

Derek


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## illimmigrant (Feb 5, 2014)

weird. I was using a windows computer elsewhere just now and I could download the tab. However, now at home, using my mac, I get the message saying that the tab has been removed. I might PM one of you for it, if you don't mind.
Can someone click on the link and let me know if they see the same thing? I'm trying to get the tab with the 300 reviews on it.
One Guitar Pro (ver 3) by Metallica @ Ultimate-Guitar.Com


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## secondsun22 (Feb 5, 2014)

The app still works. It can load their tabs on my tablet and phone just fine


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## secondsun22 (Feb 5, 2014)

The UG app(normal and pro) still have metallica


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## drgamble (Feb 5, 2014)

I just have to add about copyright law that you could pay a nominal fee, about $40/500 distributions and copyright your own transcription for profit.


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## wankerness (Feb 8, 2014)

This isn't a metallica thing, this is a music industry thing. Powertabs.net, which is still my vote for best tab site that ever existed, got destroyed several years ago when the owner kept getting threatened with legal action by various parties for posting tabs. It wasn't that they were pissed about tab book copies, it wasn't that they were pissed about tabs of songs that have legitimate books out there, it was that they were pissed that transcriptions of their bands existed at all. It didn't matter if there was no legal transcription available, the tabs were still illegal. Many artists had to be removed who didn't have a single published transcription book out there. At least with Metallica songs they have the excuse of "most of the tabs out there have legal songbooks, so it's stealing our business when people get free ones!!!" That is not true for barely any other band, though. Especially when it comes to anything other than guitar tabs.

A lot of other big tab sites have gotten destroyed over the years the same way. Usually they'll start with just taking down the specific artists that earned them the threats, but usually more and more tabs keep disappearing until the site goes. 

I'm sure these things almost always happen without the band having anything to do with it. It's just the companies that care about such petty ridiculous crap. As far as I could tell just about all tabs posted anywhere on the net are technically illegal unless it's of public domain music. :/ It's really unfortunate. I just stopped uploading anything I tabbed after powertabs.net went down and all my tabs got the name taken off them and were reposted on UG under other peoples' names, I just use them for personal use only.


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## Alex Kenivel (Feb 8, 2014)




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## TeeWX (Feb 10, 2014)

viesczy said:


> Now question about these so called 'mistakes'. It is the error in the musical notes or "error" in where the correct musical notes are played?
> 
> One is an actual error and one is a choice of where to play the correct note



I was thinking the same thing. I come across a lot of tabs that play it just like you see the guy doing in the music video, but I just play it my own way anyways. Usually it's because they do excessive position shifts that just aren't necessary. A lot of times if there's a new technique in there I'll try and learn the riff in as many positions as I can to benefit myself as a player.


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## HoneyNut (Apr 3, 2014)

Leveebreaks said:


> Waaaay too late for that.



Hahaha. Correct!


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