# Engl Thunder 50w. Yay or Nay?



## zeaoth (Apr 11, 2011)

Wanted to get a Fireball but it's way too loud and on top of that pricey as hell. Following some youtube clips and judging from the sound of the Thunder, it really is awesome. Now my question is, how does this thing handle a 7 or 8 string? Has anyone tried this out with any 8s? Also any recommended cabs that go well with this. I wanna get a nice brutal death metal sound.


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## TRENCHLORD (Apr 11, 2011)

Probably sounds sweet, but in my opinion if you want a brutal tone at rehersal level, the added low end tightness of a 100/120/150watt will prevail. For personal practice or bedroom jammin 50w is perfect.


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## Chickenhawk (Apr 11, 2011)

EDIT:

doublepost


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## Chickenhawk (Apr 11, 2011)

The actual difference in volume between 100 watts and 50 watts is extremely minimal.


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## evilsaint (Apr 11, 2011)

Get the Fireball 60. It has more gain and modern tone. 

New black facelift looks really great.


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## TRENCHLORD (Apr 11, 2011)

The volume difference is slight, the difference in depth and authority is certainly/instantly noticable.


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## zeaoth (Apr 11, 2011)

evilsaint said:


> Get the Fireball 60. It has more gain and modern tone.
> 
> New black facelift looks really great.



Is the $400 extra worth it?

Also any cab recommendations? 2x12? I don't mind getting a 4x12, but I don't know if that will be too loud.


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## evilsaint (Apr 11, 2011)

zeaoth said:


> Is the $400 extra worth it?
> Also any cab recommendations? 2x12? I don't mind getting a 4x12, but I don't know if that will be too loud.


 
To me, YES. 
I'm using Mesa cab with ENGLs. ENGLs sound great with V30 speakers, but some people hate them.


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## BabUShka (Apr 11, 2011)

Chickenhawk said:


> The actual difference in volume between 100 watts and 50 watts is extremely minimal.



True, but face the facts that a 100w amp needs to be pushed a bit higher to get a descent tone out of it. 
And that volume/dynamic differens is a big factor if your gonna use the amå at home. 

Check out the Orange Thunder 30 or ENGL Screamer, Marshall JVM combo. 
Or topp + 1x12 cab for home use.. I've had 4x12, 2x12 and 1x12 cabs and different amps.. There is no reason to buy a big amp and big cab for home use.


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## Dvaienat (Apr 11, 2011)

I second the Fireball 60. It will handle 7 and 8 string guitars excellently, with perfect clarity. The Engl Thunder will do just as well. Boost it with a boost or OD pedal if you want a tighter more smooth tone.


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## Lankles (Apr 11, 2011)

zeaoth said:


> Wanted to get a Fireball but it's way too loud and on top of that pricey as hell. Following some youtube clips and judging from the sound of the Thunder, it really is awesome. Now my question is, how does this thing handle a 7 or 8 string? Has anyone tried this out with any 8s? Also any recommended cabs that go well with this. I wanna get a nice brutal death metal sound.



Played death metal in ADGCFad with my Thunder 50 for years. Handled live situations and rehearsals with an exceptionally loud drummer just fine. We used a fairly chunky tone but it could still pull off tight, precise riffing when necessary. I could not recommend it strongly enough. Eventually I boosted it with an MI Audio Tube Zone, but I could have done without it just as well. 

If you can afford the fireball though, feel free. Either way =


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## BabUShka (Apr 11, 2011)

Kinda think that the Thunder is more versatile and clear in tone than the Fireball.. 
Fireball has an AMAZING punch and chugg worse than a tsunami and tighter than a asian... 
Only too bad it's got no crunch at all and sound so scooped and fizzy.. Myabe the F100 is a better upgrade, but then again, the price matters.. 

Screamer 50 s a bit better version of the Thunder 50 imo.. Very alike, but got more options. 
Still the thunder 50 is a good amp. I like amps with clear tone as Marshall, Laney etc.. Thats why i like the Thunder 50 and Screamer better than the Fireball  
Most people underestimate tube amps with a booster i front!!


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## Acatalepsy (Apr 12, 2011)

It's a great amp, I use it at home for practise and it fits the bill very well. I also occasionally use it as a backup for my Savage SE and the couple of times I've had to use it it's done very well. Hard to beat for the money and sounds ridiculously aggressive with a boost in front of it.


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## Wookieslayer (Apr 12, 2011)

BabUShka said:


> Fireball has an AMAZING punch and chugg worse than a tsunami and tighter than a asian...


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## Rook (Apr 12, 2011)

The best way to quiet up a head is to get a smaller cab.

Buy the 60W powerball head (the tiniest bit louder than the 50W thunder) which will definitely do 7 and 8 string stuff and buy a 112 cab.

You'll be miked up most of the time you play gigs anyway, and you can run your head really hard into a 112 without being told to turn down.


Most of the best live sounds I've heard recently (depending on the venue) are from small speaker enclosures.


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## Andromalia (Apr 12, 2011)

50 watts is way more than enough to rehearse or do shows. And way too much for bedroom jamming. Wanna sound good in your bedroom ? Get a 5 watt or lower head. (Or one of those new minis with variable wattage).
My 20:20 power amp is enough to get the army looking for the guy who has a secret weapon to make tiles jump all over the place near my house in 5 minutes.


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## col (Apr 13, 2011)

BabUShka said:


> True, but face the facts that a 100w amp needs to be pushed a bit higher to get a descent tone out of it.



That's entirely dependent on the design. Wattage has nothing to do with it. I can get great low volume tone out my Herbert which is 180W, but I have to turn my EHX Magnum 44 watt solid state power amp to band rehearsal levels to get a good tone out of it.



Fun111 said:


> The best way to quiet up a head is to get a smaller cab.



That won't really lower your volume at all. My 2x12 is as loud as my 4x12. It will give you less low end though.

The best way to get good low volume tone is to get an amp with a good master volume that relies heavily on preamp gain (Engl) and a cab with speakers that have low sensitivity, or early breakup, like Jensen C12Q's or Celestion Greenbacks.

The Thunder is a very bright amp, so take that into consideration when deciding which amp you'll go with. You can reduce the brightness by loading it with dark preamp tubes, like JJ's.


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## Rook (Apr 13, 2011)

col said:


> That won't really lower your volume at all. My 2x12 is as loud as my 4x12. It will give you less low end though.



Are they similar cabs with the same speakers?

Think about it, 100W each into four speakers is going to be significantly louder than 100W each into two. The difference is more noticeable still with a single 12". I could run my Roadster way harder into my recto 212 than the 412, and could even crank it in my house without annoying the neighbours. I couldn't dream of doing that with the 412. I actually found the bass was much more noticeable, but quite boomy.

It's not my opinion though man, for the same power head, fewer of the same speaker means less volume. The speaker will be the same volume, but it won't carry as much and there are fewer of them.

I also don't think JJ's could be considered 'dark tubes', it absolutely depends on the amp.


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## TRENCHLORD (Apr 13, 2011)

412: get the cops called in 10 minutes. 2x412: get the cops called in 5 minutes. 212: have a nice jam session!


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## Acatalepsy (Apr 13, 2011)

Andromalia said:


> 50 watts is way more than enough to rehearse or do shows. And way too much for bedroom jamming. Wanna sound good in your bedroom ? Get a 5 watt or lower head. (Or one of those new minis with variable wattage).
> My 20:20 power amp is enough to get the army looking for the guy who has a secret weapon to make tiles jump all over the place near my house in 5 minutes.



You'd be surprised how good the Thunder 50 sounds at bedroom levels!


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## Gryphon (Apr 13, 2011)

zeaoth said:


> Is the $400 extra worth it?
> 
> Also any cab recommendations? 2x12? I don't mind getting a 4x12, but I don't know if that will be too loud.


 
Avatar 2x12 w Celestion G12K100 or a used Mesa 2x12


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## alfred (Apr 13, 2011)

zeaoth said:


> Wanted to get a Fireball but it's way too loud and on top of that pricey as hell. Following some youtube clips and judging from the sound of the Thunder, it really is awesome. Now my question is, how does this thing handle a 7 or 8 string? Has anyone tried this out with any 8s? Also any recommended cabs that go well with this. I wanna get a nice brutal death metal sound.


 
Thunders totally handle 7 & 8 string, I put my rg 7321 and my RGA 8. I play in my room, but I also record.

I do not use full bass, but 3/4, but full treble then middle at 12', and it is one of the best way to play djent/ melo death stuff ... for me and my little wallet XD.

I could try to record a sample of Fear Factory's "Zero Signal" if you want. PM me and I could do it buddy


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## Vostre Roy (Apr 13, 2011)

Using a Engl Thunder 50 with a Peavey Triple XXX 4x12 cab. Gotta say like everyone, its not a brutal, mind-blowing gain, but its a good overall amp. When used on distortion, its will have a bright sound, not that much bottom, but that can be caused by my cab, so I can't tell. The clean, to me, is mind-blowing tho. Its my second amp, first one was a Fender Fm212R combo (yes, I'm still a noob lol), and the clean was one of my major concern. I forgot about my Fender after a 5 mins try, it sound so warm its crazy (in my noob opinion, don't forget)

Only problem I got with it is the fact that you got 1 Eq for both the overdrive and clean channels. I'll buy and try a tubescreamer in it soon enough, if you wan't I'll come back with ya and tell you if that compensate for the lack of brutality (hope so, as the other guitarist of my band plans on getting a Peavey 3120 lol)


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## Acatalepsy (Apr 13, 2011)

I don't know what these people are talking about saying that it doesn't have enough gain- it has plenty! I play brutal dm on it and it does fine!


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## Vostre Roy (Apr 13, 2011)

Acatalepsy said:


> I don't know what these people are talking about saying that it doesn't have enough gain- it has plenty! I play brutal dm on it and it does fine!


 
Well, I'll put it in other words: It got enough gain, but a little more could be even beter


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## Inazone (Apr 13, 2011)

Now that I have one, I have to suggest that you at least consider a Carvin V3M if you want something that can do high-gain but at lower volumes. It has a 7/22/50-watt mode selector, three channels with three tone modes each, and an EQ "expander" for additional tweaking. I had the Thunder on my "short list" for a lower-wattage amp, but it just didn't seem to have the versatility I wanted once I looked beyond my current style of metal.


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## Lankles (Apr 13, 2011)

Mine has seismic low end when put through my Orange HP412, but it was pretty neutered through my decrepit old Marshall VS412. Nothing wrong with the head's bass. 

Only the irretrievably deranged would need more gain than a Thunder 50 can provide.


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## zeaoth (Apr 13, 2011)

Someone mentioned a Fireball and now I want one. I'm assuming that the Fireball 60 is better than a Thunder? Obviously louder, how about tone wise?


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## zeaoth (Apr 13, 2011)

alfred said:


> Thunders totally handle 7 & 8 string, I put my rg 7321 and my RGA 8. I play in my room, but I also record.
> 
> I do not use full bass, but 3/4, but full treble then middle at 12', and it is one of the best way to play djent/ melo death stuff ... for me and my little wallet XD.
> 
> I could try to record a sample of Fear Factory's "Zero Signal" if you want. PM me and I could do it buddy



Hey, I got the same guitars.  Would definitely appreciate it if you gave me an idea of how it would sound on both guitars. What kind of p/u's do you have in your RG7321 and RGA8?


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## col (Apr 14, 2011)

Fun111 said:


> Are they similar cabs with the same speakers?
> 
> Think about it, 100W each into four speakers is going to be significantly louder than 100W each into two. The difference is more noticeable still with a single 12". I could run my Roadster way harder into my recto 212 than the 412, and could even crank it in my house without annoying the neighbours. I couldn't dream of doing that with the 412. I actually found the bass was much more noticeable, but quite boomy.
> 
> ...



I guess we'll just agree to disagree then.


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## BabUShka (Apr 14, 2011)

zeaoth said:


> Someone mentioned a Fireball and now I want one. I'm assuming that the Fireball 60 is better than a Thunder? Obviously louder, how about tone wise?



I doubd you will hear any differense in volume, as they both play loud as hell. 
The Fireball has much more balls than the Thunder. What is best, depends on your taste.. 
If you want clearness and definition, go for thunder. 
If you want awesomeness, but yet scooped and a bit fizzy, go for FIreball. 

Still, a Screamer is something in bethween Thunder and Fireball. 
Really, check it out. Very underrated amp. 
Same bout the Blackmore. 
It is imo one of the best amps amps inm its price range.. 
If you want a real amp, same money for a Blackmore and a good 2x12 cab.


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