# Pissed off rant post thing...



## Nik (Oct 30, 2005)

I don't think I was cut-out to be in a band. Either that, or I live in a shitty place when it comes to bands.

We've only had one meet so far and it was disasterous. Our bassist came with a guitar and it turned out that he doesn't like playing bass. I'm not big on starting a band with 2 guitarists. Anyway, my drummer doesn't want to get rid of him cause their pals even though he blows at guitar even though he's been playing for 8 years.  

We've canceled something like 20 meets so far because someone always can't make it or be reached.  

I'm starting to get really pissed off. I had really high aspirations. I devote all my free time to guitar and I'm always ready to jam, but the others... I guess they have lives or some crap like that. Something always comes up 

Still, this is ridiculouls. I'm not a bossy person and I try not to get pushy, but if this doesn't start working soon, I'm gonna start smacking the other people around  

Anyone else suffer like this?


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## Dylan7620 (Oct 30, 2005)

bands are funny really.... never do thery seem to work out like *you* plan. i wish i could just not hurt any of my firends feelings and pick certain people out to make a supergroup of sorts with my friends that can play really well, but its way harder than that. everyone does their own thing. if he can't keep up on guitar why is there any more reason for him not to play it? i have lots of friends that can "play guitar" but i'm not going to play in a band with them just because they are my friends. sometimes it has to come to the point where you just say "look dude, you're cool and all... but ur playing is on a totaly different level and its not gonna work" lol, i was always so passive before being in bands, now its like 
me:"damnit you fucked up on that one part" 
bass player:"shut up"
me: "no, you suck at bass"
bass player:"im great, eat a dick dylan"
me: *sigh*


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## Drew (Oct 30, 2005)

Well, being in a band is less about YOUR music than the BAND's music, and sometimes it's tough when there's a conflict of interest between what you think is right and what someone else does. 

Still, you need to set some sort of a band schedule. Keep it firm, just like a job - say, meet once a week, Thursday nights from 8-10, come hell and high water. Choose a time as a group, and then make sure everyone holds to the commitment - only cancel in the msot extreme circumstances. 

Aside from that, two guitarists in a band works quite well, but two guitars and no bass does not. Either find a new bassist, or tell the bassist that until they find a replacement, he's on bass. I'd start a band with vocals, bass, and drums before I'd play with vocals drums and guitar.


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## Ken (Oct 30, 2005)

For most people, the math works out like this:

band + different aspirations = time drain with no results.

Good luck with all that. I haven't been in a band since 92, and I'm only now getting the itch to try again. All the while knowing what a pain in the ass it is.


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## Nik (Oct 30, 2005)

Drew said:


> Well, being in a band is less about YOUR music than the BAND's music, and sometimes it's tough when there's a conflict of interest between what you think is right and what someone else does.
> 
> Still, you need to set some sort of a band schedule. Keep it firm, just like a job - say, meet once a week, Thursday nights from 8-10, come hell and high water. Choose a time as a group, and then make sure everyone holds to the commitment - only cancel in the msot extreme circumstances.
> 
> Aside from that, two guitarists in a band works quite well, but two guitars and no bass does not. Either find a new bassist, or tell the bassist that until they find a replacement, he's on bass. I'd start a band with vocals, bass, and drums before I'd play with vocals drums and guitar.



Thanks for your sympathy, guys!

I agree that what matters is what the band want's to do, not what I want to do.

The problem is, they keep putting it off and not taking it seriously so we can't even sit down and decide what to play as a BAND. I'm willing to listen to what they want to do, if we'd get together in the first place.

I'm definitely gonna set up a rigorous schedule and start pushing them. The problem is, I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings...

Anyway, I think I know how to get rid of that one bassist-turned-guitarist dude. Thing is, he doesn't seem very interested in the band but comes cause the drummer keeps calling him. But the only reason the drummer calls him is cause he doesn't want to kick him out because their friends. Is that twisted or what. Anyway, I'm a leads sort of guy and if we do keep him, it'll be for rhythm only.

I'm gonna tell him that if he wants to stay in the band, he's gonna have to tune down to B since I'm getting a 7 string soon. My guess is that he won't want to bother with that and he'll just leave.

Anyway, I'm meeting with my drummer in 20 mins. Cross your fingers that things go better than they have so far


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## eleven59 (Oct 31, 2005)

I guess I lucked out big time with the fact that I found 3 good friends who happen to have similar interests in music as me. The downside is that it took years of me and the bassist searching for the rest of the band. We started out with a different singer and no drummer. The singer was quickly replaced, but it took years to find a decent drummer. We're really happy with our band now.


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## Naren (Oct 31, 2005)

[Bitter response]

You're lucky you HAVE a band.

[/Bitter response]


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## Nik (Oct 31, 2005)

You really are lucky.

Yesterday's band practice was alright, as good as it can get with just drums and guitar  (No bassist  )

Anyway, we were doing it at the guy's church cause he has a nice drumkit there. I did some crazy shredding on clean tone in the harmonic minor while my drummer was grooving and it was awesome. Blew everyone there away 

You know, though, I always wondered, looking at ebay, how all these people with nice 7s chipped the paint. Well now I know. Klutz drummers.

My drummer dropped the CDs I had brought first and broke the case of my Change of Seasons CD. Then later he tripped on my guitar cable and knocked the guitar down. Thanfully I haven't got my new Ibanez yet and it was my crappy Squier... However he ripped my guitar cable ... : /

I envy you and your band and your lack of such stupid troubles.


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## noodles (Oct 31, 2005)

Drummers can be a pain. I had one drummer chuck a drum stick at me ("I just wanted to get your attention...") and left a divot in the top of my '87 Soloist. My bassist had to drag me out of the room before he got six divots placed in his forehead from a Noodles slap shot.


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## Vince (Oct 31, 2005)

Nik said:


> You know, though, I always wondered, looking at ebay, how all these people with nice 7s chipped the paint. Well now I know. Klutz drummers.



Corners of rooms are your friends. Don't leave the cables out where they can be tripped on.

In our rehearsal pad, we basically have a square room, 15x15. We have 4 guys in the band and each one of us has a corner... drums in one corner, bass amp in one corner, guitar amp in one corner, and vocals in the corner by the entry door.

I have my amp right in the corner, with my guitars next to it against the wall and OUT OF THE WALKWAY. My instrument cable is plugged into the front of my rack, and the slack is tucked behind the 4x12, so basically it looks like my cable is coming from the back of the amp. I do this so no one trips on it.

In 14 years of playing guitar, I have a grand total of 3 dings. All three are in my RG 7620, none on any other guitars. One of them I think is just paint flaked off, one was caused by fellow SS.org'er Flesh-Eating Monkey (  ), and the third was caused by accidentally hitting it with a cello last year in my recording room. None of them are bad, and none of them are over 4 mm in size.


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## Nik (Oct 31, 2005)

noodles said:


> Drummers can be a pain. I had one drummer chuck a drum stick at me ("I just wanted to get your attention...") and left a divot in the top of my '87 Soloist. My bassist had to drag me out of the room before he got six divots placed in his forehead from a Noodles slap shot.



That sucks dude. I'm starting to have second thoughts about gigging my new Ibanez 7 when it arrives. I think I might just keep it home...



desertdweller said:


> Corners of rooms are your friends. Don't leave the cables out where they can be tripped on.
> 
> In our rehearsal pad, we basically have a square room, 15x15. We have 4 guys in the band and each one of us has a corner... drums in one corner, bass amp in one corner, guitar amp in one corner, and vocals in the corner by the entry door.
> 
> ...



Point taken.

My Squier, crappy guitar as it is, has a pretty solid paint job. I have dropped it, knocked it over, and put it through all sorts of torture and there are no chips in the paint. There's a nasty ding where a this one person dropped a bowl of fruit on it, and the fretboard is missing a chunk, but other wise the guitar's mint


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## Drew (Oct 31, 2005)

Gutiars are made to get banged up - once you learn to accept the first ding or so, it's cool. I should post some closups of my UV.


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## eaeolian (Oct 31, 2005)

Drew said:


> Gutiars are made to get banged up - once you learn to accept the first ding or so, it's cool. I should post some closups of my UV.



Surprisingly - since I take no special precautions - my Jackson 7 has remarkably few dings. You should see the Zion that was my main 6 for years, though - it looks like ti was dragged behind a truck.

They're tools. If you want a pristine guitar, put it in a glass case.


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## noodles (Oct 31, 2005)

Nik said:


> That sucks dude. I'm starting to have second thoughts about gigging my new Ibanez 7 when it arrives. I think I might just keep it home...



Do NOT do this. I was pissed at my drummer because he was thoughtless and rude, not because he put a ding in it. If it had gotten dinged up when he broke a stick and sent it flying into me live, I would have been totally cool with that. I put far more dings and scratches into a guitar when I'm going  on stage than any clueless loser would cause. My Soloist has dings from bouncing the whammy bar off the top. Hell, one time I the crowd got me so into it, I slammed out an open E, held the guitar out over the crowd, and watched them rip all six strings off the guitar in front of me. That scratched the shit out of the paint, but who cares? The feeling I got from that gig would have almost made it ok if they snapped the headstock off.



eaeolian said:


> They're tools. If you want a pristine guitar, put it in a glass case.



What he said. In the end, it's simply a matter of knowing a good tech to fix any major stuff. If you have a bolt-on and around $200, you can get a brand new paintjob.


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## Christopher (Oct 31, 2005)

Yep, I'm with you boys on this one. My Pet is starting to look much more "road worthy" over the months that I've had it. I just past my 1 year aniversary with it and it is a "player" for sure now. I knew it would get dinged, it's just the law of probability really. As much time as that thing spends around my neck it's bound to get some tough love.


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## telecaster90 (Oct 31, 2005)

Meh, my band isn't workin out well. 

Our drummer punched a locker the other day and broke his knuckles, so we aren't gonna practice for a while. The bass player digs some cool music but isn't that good of a bass player. The other guitar player is alright at guitar. I'm tryin to get something else goin, though. Something like Zep or Pink Floyd


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## Drew (Oct 31, 2005)

noodles said:


> Hell, one time I the crowd got me so into it, I slammed out an open E, held the guitar out over the crowd, and watched them rip all six strings off the guitar in front of me. That scratched the shit out of the paint, but who cares? The feeling I got from that gig would have almost made it ok if they snapped the headstock off.



That's fuckin' awesome, man.  

Tele, I'm with you - I'd love ti start a band looking to find some common ground between Tool and Pink Floyd. I just haven't gotten off my ass and done anything about it yet.


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## telecaster90 (Oct 31, 2005)

Drew said:


> That's fuckin' awesome, man.
> 
> Tele, I'm with you - I'd love ti start a band looking to find some common ground between Tool and Pink Floyd. I just haven't gotten off my ass and done anything about it yet.



Well, there's this 8th grader that I know who digs Floyd and plays guitar, and some kid on myspace who goes to my school said he plays bass and would be interested in it. All I need now is a drummer and a keyboard player.


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## Nik (Oct 31, 2005)

noodles said:


> Hell, one time I the crowd got me so into it, I slammed out an open E, held the guitar out over the crowd, and watched them rip all six strings off the guitar in front of me. That scratched the shit out of the paint, but who cares? The feeling I got from that gig would have almost made it ok if they snapped the headstock off.



Whoa dude!


Just for the record, I come from the John Petrucci school of thought--I like to keep my gear squeaky new and I don't do crazy stuff like that. I just play my guitar.

That might change once my 7 comes though  I just can't wait to start dishing out the heavy shit once it comes.


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## 7 Dying Trees (Oct 31, 2005)

Bands are very funny things. You think everything is OK, and then next minute it stinks and you discover nasty shit. It's weird, very very weird. 

But it's more fun than the bad bits mostly, so I keep doing it!


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## Dylan7620 (Oct 31, 2005)

7 Dying Trees said:


> Bands are very funny things. You think everything is OK, and then next minute it stinks and you discover nasty shit. It's weird, very very weird.
> 
> But it's more fun than the bad bits mostly, so I keep doing it!


+1

you can't join a band with the intention that no feeling are going to get hurt. it simply does not work. and if you are getting an ibanez 7 it IS going to get chipped. i was going to go on a killing rampage the first scratch i got in mine, then came the second one. its a player, i PLAY it  if u dont have any marks on it, ask yourself "are you rockin in the free world?"


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## Vince (Oct 31, 2005)

I don't necessarily agree that guitars are just "tools". Maybe to some they are, and I'm not dissing you for having that opinion. Please don't take offense to this statement, but I have more respect for the instrument than that. I take excellent care of all of my guitars. I would freak if my drummer threw a stick at me while holding a guitar. I've put approximately $1000 into each guitar I own, and I try to be frugal about what money I spend and what I save. I wouldn't throw a drum stick at a $1000 television, would you?

Eh, that's just my opinion. I guess it depends on the guitar you own too. A beater guitar, yeah I probably wouldn't care, but none of my guitars are beaters.


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## Vince (Nov 1, 2005)

holy shit I killed the thread. Sorry about that!


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## Naren (Nov 1, 2005)

I agree with you, Vince. I highly value my guitars. And, from looking at them from just a few feet away, they all look beautiful. Look up close and you'll see some very small dings. None of them were from carelessness. The one ding is from when my tremolo bridge broke and snapped back into the cavity, ripping a part of the wood off from the inside of the cavity. You can't see that unless you're a few inches or a foot in front of the guitar (because the bridge now covers most of it up). The other ding is so small that I have no idea how it got there. And then there's one ding which is small (but the biggest one I have) that mysteriously appeared after I sent it to Ibanez for repair. But none of these are noticable unless looked at closely. My Gibson is also similar. It's got a few almost invisible scratches on the back side and one very tiny dent on the front bottom side (that you can't see except from very close).

I don't freak out when these things happen, but I do feel very bad at the moment they do and try to avoid them as much as possible.


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## Ancestor (Nov 1, 2005)

I think that you should keep looking for other people to jam with, but take what you have in hand for all it's worth. 

You're right, though. The band will never go anywhere if everyone can't cheerfully make it to practice *at least* twice a week.


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## 7 Dying Trees (Nov 1, 2005)

Hell, I have tried to baby guitars, but when you go for it live then sometimes dents and chips just happen and you have no idea why. Always been one of the attitude that guitars are there to be played, and if they stay pretty and mint, cool, if they don't then that's cool as well...

I have some nasty dings in my black UV from various things such as it falling on the floor and chipping off the paint on the back between the jackplug and the jack cavity, and it already had some major bangs that had been repaired when i got it. I call it character. 

As long as the dings are my fault it's something i can live with. If other people do it (like when i went away and came back to find something weird had happened to my 2027) then it's harder to stomach. But i consider all my guitars as keepers unless there's no other way, so I am fine with it.


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## Naren (Nov 1, 2005)

Have you seen Steve Vai's EVO? It has so many dents and scratches all over it. Go to his site and look at his section on it. He has pictures of it and stories about the damage. He also called it "character" like you, 7 Dying Trees.


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## 7 Dying Trees (Nov 1, 2005)

Going back to the band thing:

Finding people to play with that are on the same page is like banging your head against a nail ridden brickwall sometimes. You get timewasters, people who think they can play (like me), people that just want to be in a band but don't want to put in the work, etc etc etc. 

In the end, it's just better to compromise up to a certain point (which has to happen) and then after that put your foot down. 

At the end of the day though, there's nothing better than playing something you wrote and watching people headbang to it, or hear it on a demo/album, it rocks, it really does!

Bands can be the worst and best thing, it's kind of like being in a marriage, you go through good times, bad times and sometimes you get divorced. And the same bitchiness from both sides along with hurt feelings still happens, you just pick yourself up and try again.

Oh, and one VERY important point: if you EVER make money out of it, split it equally, regardless of who writes most/designs t-shirts/writes lyrics. This'll stop bad feelings, resentment and people leaving, or there being a bad vibe. Trust me on this. At the end of it, everyone will be performing a role, wether it is press, promotion, is good at interviews, can write killer riffs, plays drums like a motherfucker, moves bowels with their bass playing or draws peoples eyes to the stage with their antics.

Everyone in the band is there for a reason and makes the band what they are, and all are cogs in the machine. If a cog fails, try to fix it, if it repeatedly fails get rid of it.

And most importantly have fun.

James


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## 7 Dying Trees (Nov 1, 2005)

Naren said:


> Have you seen Steve Vai's EVO? It has so many dents and scratches all over it. Go to his site and look at his section on it. He has pictures of it and stories about the damage. He also called it "character" like you, 7 Dying Trees.


It is, I know where the damage comes from, and the guitar still plays the same. It's like the scars you have on your body, you remember where they came from and they tell a story. If you never plan on selling a guitar and love it, then as long as it plays and sounds good cosmetics come second.

It's like "sharing" an experience with your guitar really.


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## Shawn (Nov 1, 2005)

Naren said:


> Have you seen Steve Vai's EVO? It has so many dents and scratches all over it. Go to his site and look at his section on it. He has pictures of it and stories about the damage. He also called it "character" like you, 7 Dying Trees.


Now that guitar has alot of character.

Like 7 Dying Trees, I tried to baby all my guitars but sometimes it happens where you'll find a ding or scratch that you had no idea how it got there.

The first ding is the hardest.  

After that, it's all good.


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## 7slinger (Nov 1, 2005)

I hate bands...

my band right now is a trio, and the bass player and drummer have proclaimed me leader and primary songwriter, which is fine...

however, when I write new stuff, the response I get is inevitably "it doesn't sound like it's going anywhere" or "it sounds like it needs something else" or "all the riffs have the same feel." 

of course, they are never able to suggest anything more than "maybe another different riff, somewhere between the beginning and the end." Thanks alot for that input  

the drummer never offers any riffs/ideas of his own to work with, and the bass player stopped, citing that not enough of his ideas were making it into songs, so he wasn't going to "waste his time" offering ideas anymore...do you think he has any idea how many riffs I go through that never get used? my guess is no  

I'm the one trying to write songs, I'm the one trying to find a vocalist for the band, I'm the one trying to learn how to be a producer so I can record demos of us with equipment that I bought  

...I hate bands.


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## 7slinger (Nov 1, 2005)

repeat...I hate bands.


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## eaeolian (Nov 1, 2005)

desertdweller said:


> I don't necessarily agree that guitars are just "tools". Maybe to some they are, and I'm not dissing you for having that opinion. Please don't take offense to this statement, but I have more respect for the instrument than that. I take excellent care of all of my guitars. I would freak if my drummer threw a stick at me while holding a guitar. I've put approximately $1000 into each guitar I own, and I try to be frugal about what money I spend and what I save. I wouldn't throw a drum stick at a $1000 television, would you?
> 
> Eh, that's just my opinion. I guess it depends on the guitar you own too. A beater guitar, yeah I probably wouldn't care, but none of my guitars are beaters.



I take good care of my tools, too, Vince - I just had a driver drill that I've had since 1989 finally die on me last week.  Quality tools should last a long time if you take care of them, but they can ultimately be replaced. I don't plan on replacing my Jackson 7, but I didn't plan on buying it at all three years before that, so who can say?

I know where you're coming from, though - I try to take care - but I don't go around wanting to kill people if my stuff gets scratched. Doing it intentionally will get some ire...


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## Naren (Nov 1, 2005)

Shawn said:


> Now that guitar has alot of character.
> 
> Like 7 Dying Trees, I tried to baby all my guitars but sometimes it happens where you'll find a ding or scratch that you had no idea how it got there.
> 
> ...



Completely agree with you and 7 Dying Trees. If I came across like I disagreed, then sorry. I meant "character" as a quote from Vai, not as anything mocking or whatever. 

Like I said above, I try to keep my guitars as pristine as possible, but inevitably something will happen sooner or later, so I try not to sweat it. Like you said, Shawn, the first ding is always the hardest. Don't know if after that, it's all good. But, after that, it's definitely easier.


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## Drew (Nov 1, 2005)

Shawn said:


> Now that guitar has alot of character.



Yeah, but my UV is catching up!


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## Shawn (Nov 1, 2005)

Drew said:


> Yeah, but my UV is catching up!


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## eleven59 (Nov 6, 2005)

I have a three guitar Warwick Rockstand that I put my two guitars on at practice or shows, and put both guitars and my bass on when at home. I don't know how, but when putting back my 7-string I must have bumped it one on either the 6-string or the bass (it sits between them, I'm weird about order and routine lol Besides, they look cool going from short to tall like that lol) and took a little chip out of the edge. I don't really mind since I don't baby my guitars or anything (it's not uncommon to see duct tape on them to keep the cable from shorting out when my jack/cable is going funny on me and I don't have time to fix/replace it), the downside is that it's right where my arm meets the edge of the guitar, so it adds an extra speedbump...


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## The Dark Wolf (Nov 6, 2005)

7 Dying Trees said:


> Bands can be the worst and best thing, it's kind of like being in a marriage, you go through good times, bad times and sometimes you get divorced. And the same bitchiness from both sides along with hurt feelings still happens, you just pick yourself up and try again.


Ain't this the truth. I've found that 2 things are _essential_, even more than drive, dedication, and ambition, to my thinking.

1. Humility
2. Patience

Enjoying the people you play with and developing friendships with them doesn't hurt, either. And making sure you stay open to all kinds of new things- songs ideas, band directions, band member changes- helps alot.

Just my 2 cents


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