# Fanned frets without trying: how big a risk? Especially those who didn't like it...



## pott (Sep 29, 2014)

'Very big' is what I'm fully expecting 

My head has been turned (by a) GAS and b) promises of ergonomics) by all the fanned fret guitars, on this forum in particular. Most seem to share two things in common:
1) used by technically proficient players 
2) made my niche builders (e.g. Strandberg, Toone) or full-custom builders (Ormsby, Blackwater, Conklin...)

I happen to be:
1) a very technically unproficient player
2) never had a non-production guitar

I also happen to LOVE luthierie and nothing motivates me more to play than a guitar I truly love and bond with. I'm a useless player, but I don't care too much: I play for myself.

I decided to go with a Waghorn for my first custom, and chose a 25"-26" fret on a 6 strings. Here's the kicker: I've never played a fanned guitar, and could never try any. There's none here. At all. True story; it IS Luxembourg, after all.

To the fanned-frets first-timers:
1) what made go this way?
2) how big a risk was it for you?
3) if you didn't like it, why not? Stay subjective: that's the point 

Thanks!


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## ElysianGuitars (Sep 29, 2014)

It's not a risk at all, in my opinion. I love multiscale. I never played one until I built one, but it's completely comfortable, and as long as your fan isn't extreme, when you look down on the frets from playing position you'd never know they were fanned, it's such a subtle change in perspective. If your parallel fret is 8 then the fan winds up very comfortable and even, and aligns with where your hand wants to go when you chord. I'm not a great guitar player, but you don't have to be to play a multiscale guitar. 25-26" will hardly be noticeable at all.


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## AboutBlank (Sep 29, 2014)

Wouldn't worry about a 1" fan, I started also from zero with a 2" fan and love it.

It is a little bit different but nothing to write home about, imo. The advantages are far bigger than the little time you need to get used to it...


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## haieb (Oct 31, 2014)

I played a FF stradberg last week for the first time. It had a 0.75" fan and I only needed like 2 minutes to get used to it. My next guitar will be definitely a 1" ff  My first custom Skervesen(currently being built) doesn't come with ff cause I was to scared and didn't want to ruin the whole build. IMO the fear I had was a little pointless.


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## 7JxN7 (Oct 31, 2014)

I bought an Agile Pendulum (fanned fret) 7 at the beginning of this year to play around with until my custom is built. Took me about 5 - 10 minutes to get my head around the feel.

I always liked the idea of a longer scale length, but for playing leads and using the higher strings it never felt right to me. However I love the feel of the lower strings on a 7 at a 27 inch scale. Fanned frets was more of a visual thing, than a feel thing for me to get use to. And it almost lets your wrist feel a little bit lazy due to you not having to manipulate its orientation as much while moving up and down the neck.

I was kind of worried before I first got to own one, but looking back there wasn't that much of a risk and i found something that I really liked in the design in the end. 

This is obviously just my experience, and truthfully you really won't know how you feel about it until you give it a go.


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## RV350ALSCYTHE (Oct 31, 2014)

The only thing that mildly concerned me in the beginning was the lack of pickup options.
Once I received the guitars I found them to be fine and I've been enjoying them ever since.

I started with a Dingwall Combustion as my first try and that quickly flowered into a bunch of multiscale goodness:
I made my own fanned 8 and really enjoyed it above my straight scales so I started buying some production and customs
Pendulum 82527
Pendulum 102730
Crusher FF8
Still waiting on 2 Siggery FF8s 

1) what made go this way?
-I wanted the playability of a 25.5" scale for the high strings. I found straight scales to be a bit shrill at 27" and beyond. I also did not want to sacrifice much scale length for the bass side. I tried 25.5" 8 strings and the low end wasn't clear enough for my tastes. I've developed tendon issues in my fretting wrist (unrelated to guitar initially), which was exasperated by extra wide boards and long stretches. I don't have to bend my wrist as much as I do on my straight scaled ergs, and the benefit is felt on both ends of the fanned board.

2) how big a risk was it for you?
-The initial Dingwall purchase was a "risk" as I've never heard of the company before, had no experience with fanned frets or an extended scale bass. It turned out to be the best purchase I've ever made in regards to bass gear.
-my first fanned guitar purchase was a Crusher order, I couldn't wait and snagged a couple Siggery build spots to tide me over until the crusher was built/delivered. The Siggerys are still MIA and the crusher wasn't due for a year so I impulse purchased an Agile Pendulum 82527. My only concern were the pickups, if they didn't sound good I'd be stuck with modding it to fit Lace bars as nothing else is readily available in a 9 string passive. I found the cepheus passives to be fine and I didn't need to swap them.
I enjoyed this guitar so much that I bought a 102730 a few months later and I'm enjoying this thing even more.
The Crusher FF8 was delivered yesterday and it is indescribable how awesome it is, makes the Agiles feel like clunky blocks of wood. 

3) if you didn't like it, why not? Stay subjective: that's the point 
-I can't imagine a reason I wouldn't like multiscale over straight scale.
I've got a homebuild 8 that has a 3.5" fan and even this is relatively simple to play. The perpendicular is set at the 12th, so you'd assume that playing near the extreme nut would be difficult, but I find it beneficial for fast play as my wrist is even straighter.


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## foreright (Oct 31, 2014)

As said above, with a 1" fan, no risk at all - I have a couple of fanned guitars and many people have played them with no-one ever struggling or saying they didn't like it. A lot of it depends on the placement of the perpendicular fret (I usually place it at or between 7 and 8) but IMO you won't notice it at all unless you're at the very extreme ends of the fretboard.


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## Deegatron (Oct 31, 2014)

Im also not a super techically proficient player. 
I've built 2 mutiscales both with a 25.5" - 24-3/4" scale. 10th fret paralell.
I REALLY like the softer feel on the high E string. I find it smoother, softer and much more enjoyable to play. I do however find it slightly more difficult to play chords on the 1st fret. this is because i like a very narrow neck at the nut 1.625" or so. (i have small hands) the multiscale makes the neck feel a little wider than it actually is. 

The two main limitations for multiscale building are bridge options and pickup options. the rest is easy peasy. this can be a factor if you want say a tune-o-matic or a shaller hannes or something rather than the single string bridges......

All the above being said, a strait scale 25.5" guitar is still my main player.... I do plan to build another multiscale... I keep hoping i'll get the feel right on it and it'll all work out. but so far im not quite there yet. (that being said im very much an ammeture luthier as well)


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## DistinguishedPapyrus (Oct 31, 2014)

It makes alot of difference too where the perpendicular fret is... for instance some Strandberg's have a perpendicular nut... I've also seen people build a guitar with a perpendicular bridge, and all the frets were fanned. I never played FF but I (almost) built a 2" FF 8 string, perp. 7th. (I say almost cause the headstock crapped out, I botched up the neck trying to repair it, and then just scrapped the whole build cause it was a set neck and I couldnt un-glue it), but as far as I could tell holding the guitar it felt like it woulda been real easy to get used to the fan. 

If I had to do it again, I think I'd go for something subtle like a 6 string 0.75" fan, and probably have the nut perpendicular, just cause that seems the most comfortable to transition to. That and I just love the subtle look of the scale and fretboard in general. 

Like this: 

http://strandbergguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/IMG_0435.jpg


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## Serratus (Nov 1, 2014)

I built a 7-string with a 2" fan (iirc) and it was extremely easy to get used to, as has been said before. 
And I agree with what's been said, that the position of the fan centre makes a lot of difference - I think mine had the 9th fret as the centre, and if I did it again then I'd change that to around the 6th. This is because I had no problem at all with the fan at the body end of the neck, but at the head end it could be a bit uncomfortable for some things. For example, doing a full F bar chord wasn't easy with so much slope at the nut. So I would change to more fan towards the body and less towards the head.
Again, I think a 1" fan will be very easy to get used to


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## OWHall (Nov 1, 2014)

I play a strandberg Boden 7 with a 25-25.75" scale. My brother was shredding on it for ten minutes before I inquired, "what do you think of the fanned scale?"
His response...
"oh yeah! I didn't notice!"
Nuff said


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## jarnozz (Nov 1, 2014)

Im in the proces of building a classical fanned guitar and have finished the fretboard.
It has an 1" fan and just placing your fingers on it shows how nice they are.
Chords are way easier to form and the hand is in a more relaxed angle down the whole board!


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## Winspear (Nov 1, 2014)

I went for a huge 4.5" fan on my custom 9 string without ever having touched a multiscale, even an 8 string, or anything beyond 27" before. 
I was fully confident because I printed out a Fretfind template full scale first and spent plenty of time holding it under my strings etc. Try it! Search for Fretfind 2D  Let me know if you need any help with the parameters.


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## Promit (Nov 1, 2014)

I have an Agile Pendulum 7 string, 25.5 - 27. Bought it about a year ago. It's going up for sale later this week.

Honestly because I bought a passive equipped guitar, I basically have one choice of pickup: the Lace XBar/Deathbar. And it turns out I don't like those pickups, at least not in this guitar. Something about the sound just doesn't sit well with me. In retrospect, I may have had a very different experience with the guitar if I'd bought it with active pickups.

As far as the fanned fret thing, eh. It's fine, but I find myself more indifferent than anything. It's not what I would spend my money on nowadays.


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## Prophetable (Nov 1, 2014)

There are lots of good sounding 7 string passive pickups...


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## Promit (Nov 1, 2014)

Prophetable said:


> There are lots of good sounding 7 string passive pickups...


That fit a four inch fan route? And may need to be rail-type to avoid pole misalignment?


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## Prophetable (Nov 1, 2014)

Fair enough.


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## Eliguy666 (Nov 1, 2014)

There aren't too many options for good blade/custom-built/bar pickups, but the options that do exist are incredibly high quality.
Lace's bar pickups are quite cheap, and provide a flat, clear response that EQs well, Blackwater already have four separate pickup voicings available with their pickups (I can only attest to the quality of the Neodymium Modern, which is by far my favorite pickup I've played), BKP are increasingly doing fanned pickups (though their availability is sporadic in availability and available fan angle, from what I've seen), and Q-Tuners seem well loved enough, if a bit ugly.

Back to the main question, I can play multiscale guitars incredibly comfortably. They're not necessarily _more_ ergonomic, but the benefits of a longer scale on low strings are incredible.


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## fantom (Nov 4, 2014)

Rhythm parts I agree are no issue at all. The tone and string feel is different, but not enough to really convince me it matters. Playing leads... a different beast. For reference, 25.5"-27" 7 string Skervesen compared to a 25.5" Rico Jr... I'll throw in, no inlays on the fingerboard (which is important). The fan on the Skervesen centers on the 7th fret. 

*Playing anything higher than the 15th fret can easily get you "off" by 1, both by feel and visually*. Obviously, it goes away with practice, but it took more than a few days to really feel confident.


1) Arpeggios are not "stacked" vertically and require minor shifts during the sweep. As an example, a F#m arpeggio at the 21st fret on the A string (standard tuning). The pinky needs to come back a good distance when it plays the high E string. Quick modal runs also require readjusting your left hand, especially if you are "anchored" to a specific fret (It's a bit easier when you can move your left hand around). Obviously, "shifting" is a bad way to think, it's more "slanting" and being fluid about changing strings (especially for wide runs and string skips).

2) To compensate during leads, I noticed that I "looked" more at the fingerboard. With no inlays & side markers that are far away from the high E string, visually things don't line up (the dot on the edge of the fingerboard). In some cases, the dot lines up with a higher fret on the higher strings (oops). In non-ideal lighting, this can be a bit annoying.


Other notes, I've played a Strandberg and several other 7 strings. To me, the neck contour and action (how low can it go?!) are far bigger factors than the fanning. I, for one, could not appreciate the Strandberg "ergo" neck. I also wish the Skervesen had a more "centered" profile. Those were FAR more noticeable to me than the fanning.


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## Fretless (Nov 4, 2014)

I really want to have a fan fret 30-28 so I can have a bit more control over the high end without having too much trouble getting a custom bridge. Saddly i don't know anyone who will make me one(hint hint to anyone who'd be willing to make one for me.)


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## Necromagnon (Nov 4, 2014)

pott said:


> To the fanned-frets first-timers:
> 1) what made go this way?
> 2) how big a risk was it for you?
> 3) if you didn't like it, why not? Stay subjective: that's the point


1) I wanted to try building and playing it
2) I'm a very bad guitar and bass player, so I tohought it could barely be worse. 
3) I like it.

The bass is 35-33" fanned, 5 strings, with the 5th fret perpendicular (or the 7th?). It's a fairly huge fan, considreing the notsohuge number of string, thus neck width. But still, it plays easily (as easy as a 35" bass anyway), and I found ff to be very usefull on the upper frets. I can cover a 6 frets gap on several strings without any problem. For bass, it's pretty useless, but I guess for shredders' guitar, it's a must have. I also like the angled fret on the upper frets still that fits the "deployement" movement of the left hand (or right for wrongly built players) when sweeping.

Also, I tried a 25-26" (IIRC) 6 string guitar at the Guitar Show in Montreal back in 2011, with the bridge nut being perpendicular, and it plays surprisingly well. So, all this to say: you don't take too much risks at all.


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## JP Universe (Nov 4, 2014)

My only regret was that I didn't go for a bigger fan first up


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