# Artist signature models jumped shark?



## scrub (Dec 30, 2015)

I'm looking for people's opinion on this. I think there are way too many signature models available on the market now. I understand why companies do it. They know people will buy the guitar used by their favorite players. But c'mon...Lzzy Hale gets a signature guitar?! It's totally watered down now and it's frankly insulting to the great players who truly deserve sig models.

Am I on an island here? It's possible I am.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 30, 2015)

Lzzy Hale is the leader of one of the most popular hard rock bands right now. 

Also, companies care more about making a profit. They give sigs to people who will be sure as .... to sale guitars.


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## fps (Dec 30, 2015)

Why pick on one of the only women who happens to have a signature model? She leads an enormously popular rock band, she's definitely one of the more deserving signature guitar modellers, not least because she'll shift 'em.


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## Miek (Dec 30, 2015)

you're a dork


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## Unleash The Fury (Dec 30, 2015)

Artists no longer get sig models because of their talent, they get them because of their popularity,which is what makes money. Sysnyster Gates got a significant model a long time ago, it's because of his image


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## The Mirror (Dec 30, 2015)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Sysnyster Gates got a significant model a long time ago, it's because of his image



One has to say that he is indeed a great guitarist, though. Not in the wake of Avenged Sevenfold, as they are pretty standard hard-rock / metal stuff, but he is after all a trained jazz player. 

But basically you are right. He got his sig because of Avenged Sevenfold and all the kiddies loving them.


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## Miek (Dec 30, 2015)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Artists no longer get sig models because of their talent, they get them because of their popularity,which is what makes money. Sysnyster Gates got a significant model a long time ago, it's because of his image



It was ALWAYS marketing


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## Zalbu (Dec 30, 2015)

Lzzy Hale having a signature model is more justifiable than somebody like, say, Keith Merrow or Mark Holcomb, why single her out? You don't get a signature model based on how many notes a second you can play, it's because of marketability and popularity. 

And having more signature models on the market is never a bad thing if it means that there's more guitars on the market with unique specs or features. I couldn't care less about signature guitars that only offers different paintjobs than stock guitars or something like that, but you won't be able to get the specs Mark Holcomb have on his PRS on any other PRS guitar.


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## JohnIce (Dec 30, 2015)

Lzzy Hale ....ing rocks.


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## Adam Of Angels (Dec 30, 2015)

Remember when there was a Kurt Cobain sig since forever ago? And a Pete Townsend sig? Or how about the guys from the Rolling Stones? There have always been signature models for outright bad guitarists, and it's about money - nothing else.


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## potatohead (Dec 30, 2015)

If her sig didn't have that gold pickguard I would seriously consider buying one. White Explorers are the .....


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## scrub (Dec 30, 2015)

Miek said:


> you're a dork



Care to expand?


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## 7 Strings of Hate (Dec 30, 2015)

In all fairness, I'm into music and I have no idea who lizzy hale is or her band.

I dont think the OP was bagging on her in any way. I think it was more eluding to the fact that guitar gods should have sigs, and it now way is that woman a guitar god the likes of the greats.

I personally think sig guitars are childish. Just a way to make money. I'v owned sigs before, but its because they happen to be a guitar I like and in no way because of the artist the sig was made for. Its all just marketing and fanboi stuff IMO.


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## OmegaSlayer (Dec 30, 2015)

We're like how many here on SS?
78000 users of which let's say 10000 active (exagerating the number btw)
We're the most annoying and picky customers of the world about guitars and don't factor that much in the big scheme of millions of players, even when we buy more than one guitar each year.
So, our opinion is ant crap.
Still...people deserving a sig and not having one annoys me neverthless


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## fps (Dec 30, 2015)

7 Strings of Hate said:


> In all fairness, I'm into music and I have no idea who lizzy hale is or her band.
> 
> I dont think the OP was bagging on her in any way. I think it was more eluding to the fact that guitar gods should have sigs, and it now way is that woman a guitar god the likes of the greats.
> 
> I personally think sig guitars are childish. Just a way to make money. I'v owned sigs before, but its because they happen to be a guitar I like and in no way because of the artist the sig was made for. Its all just marketing and fanboi stuff IMO.



Sigs were always a way to make money, and they were always based on popularity and what would sell. It's never been about being a guitar god, but Lzzy Hale is a guitar goddess to a lotta people, and more power to 'em. Eric Clapton isn't a guitar god to me, do I care if he has a sig? Nope, it's about having an audience and who will buy the guitars. 

Frankly I haven't got a clue who half the people are who are getting signature models these days. I just didn't like the singling out of one of the only women who's playing guitar and getting some serious near-mainstream popularity.


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## scrub (Dec 30, 2015)

7 Strings of Hate said:


> In all fairness, I'm into music and I have no idea who lizzy hale is or her band.
> 
> I dont think the OP was bagging on her in any way. I think it was more eluding to the fact that guitar gods should have sigs, and it now way is that woman a guitar god the likes of the greats.
> 
> I personally think sig guitars are childish. Just a way to make money. I'v owned sigs before, but its because they happen to be a guitar I like and in no way because of the artist the sig was made for. Its all just marketing and fanboi stuff IMO.



thank you. i'm not bashing lzzy hale. i can name 10 dudes who i feel the same way about. She just happened to come to mind.


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## Miek (Dec 30, 2015)

scrub said:


> Care to expand?



because having a signature model isn't affected by anything except being visible and being marketable. the idea that signature models could "jump the shark" could only possibly be held if you don't realize that you are not the target demographic


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## Emperor Guillotine (Dec 30, 2015)

The players may suck, but it is all about branding and name recognition. Someone sees an artist's name on a guitar, and they will want to buy it if perhaps they like the artist, want to play like the artist (style-wise), or if they just want to be a "rockstar" like the artist.

Profit for the companies - just like what many others have already said.


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## Triple-J (Dec 30, 2015)

I actually think sigs serve a purpose that most people haven't mentioned here and it's the fact that they get the beginners hooked on guitar.

I'm a pretty good example of this as my second guitar was a Fender Jagstang and the fact that it was a quality guitar that cost a lot more than my permanently out of tune and constantly feedbacking Hohner rockwood and was the sig of the guy who inspired me to play in the first place lit a fire under my ass and was the point where I became more serious about playing.

Sigs are a brilliant gateway for beginners they're a significant part of guitar culture and yes they also exist to make a profit for big companies too but I don't subscribe to the idea that someone has to be deemed worthy enough to have one.


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## goldsteinat0r (Dec 30, 2015)

It has nothing to do with who "deserves" a signature, its all about sales, branding, and name recognition. Thats literally it. The requirements have nothing to do with playing skill, and everything to do with what deal they can make with the artist and how little money they can spend creating a special model for them. 

Gibson, for example, has been very smart to give a couple of big metal names their own signature Epiphone models. They're affordable, super easy to mass produce and they can mark them up much more relative to the cost. For example, a Bjorn Gelotte Signature Epi LP is 800.00 (and its actually a good value at that price), and it more than likely costs only marginally more to make than an Epi LP Standard that sells for 350.00. Same with the MKH Les Paul. Its a way to cover the market for people like us without committing the expense of producing a line of Gibson Guitars for someone a lot of people have never heard of.


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## ArtDecade (Dec 30, 2015)

scrub said:


> It's totally watered down now and it's frankly insulting to the great players who truly deserve sig models.



Who determines those that "deserve" it? I am a better guitar player than Tom Delonge (formerly) of Blink-182 and he had a signature Fender and Gibson. That said, I think his album sales are a tiny bit higher than mine.


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## Rosal76 (Dec 30, 2015)

I own a U.S. custom shop, B.C. Rich Kerry King Wartribe Warlock and the status of Slayer and/or Kerry King has nothing to do with it. A lot of people will often think that I purchased the guitar because Slayer is my favorite band, Kerry King is one of my favorite guitar players and that I like tribal tattoos. The truth of it all is that when I purchased the guitar, I rarely listened to Slayer anymore. I love Slayer for the fact that they are one of 3 bands (Megadeth and Metallica being the other 2) that got me into heavy metal but it ends there. I purchased the Wartribe because B.C. Rich Warlocks are my favorite body shape from the company, not because Kerry plays them.


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## Zalbu (Dec 30, 2015)

And honestly, even Buckethead has a signature Gibson guitar, both a high end model and a Les Paul Studio. He's not exactly the most marketable dude out there but he shreds like a m'fer and the guitar has some sweet, unique specs. It really makes me wonder how many of those guitars they actually manage to sell since you almost have to be a Buckethead fanatic to know about his guitars.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 30, 2015)

Zalbu said:


> And honestly, even Buckethead has a signature Gibson guitar, both a high end model and a Les Paul Studio. He's not exactly the most marketable dude out there but he shreds like a m'fer and the guitar has some sweet, unique specs. It really makes me wonder how many of those guitars they actually manage to sell since you almost have to be a Buckethead fanatic to know about his guitars.



He's one of the more well-known shredders, especially because of his time with GnR. 

Also, his sig model was a limited edition model.


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## Emperor Guillotine (Dec 30, 2015)

Zalbu said:


> And honestly, even Buckethead has a signature Gibson guitar, both a high end model and a Les Paul Studio. He's not exactly the most marketable dude out there but he shreds like a m'fer and the guitar has some sweet, unique specs. It really makes me wonder how many of those guitars they actually manage to sell since you almost have to be a Buckethead fanatic to know about his guitars.


They were limited edition and aren't made or sold anymore. Gibson probably didn't think that they would sell that well, so they just did a short run to see what would happen.


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## ArtDecade (Dec 30, 2015)

G&R is pretty high profile and even that wasn't enough to break Buckethead into the mainstream. Lets be honest... A man with a KFC bucket on his head is always going to be difficult to market in middle-America.


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## OmegaSlayer (Dec 30, 2015)

I'm 100% sure that if we make a poll here about who's the guy that hasn't a sig and deserves one, there would be at least a 15% disagreement with the top ranking guitarist.


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## DeathChord (Dec 30, 2015)

I personally never thought Id own a signature guitar, not only because I never found one with the looks or specks I liked but I always knew the actual guitar would never make me a better player. 



Things changed for me and the M80M came into production and for a sig model it had everything I was looking for, tone wood, scale length and pickups and body style. 
I could phucking care less whose name is behind it as long as the guitar has something to offer that works better for me as a musician. 



Playing eight string has challenged me to push myself outside of my comfort zone and Im grateful for that, it just so happened that the Meshuggah model fit the need.


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## aesthyrian (Dec 30, 2015)

Who the hell cares? Honestly. I think I cared about this crap when I was 14. I was also mad that the K7 existed, and that Noodles from The Offspring had a sig. model, but that's just stuff stupid 14 year old's care about.


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## ArtDecade (Dec 30, 2015)

aesthyrian said:


> Who the hell cares? Honestly. I think I cared about this crap when I was 14. I was also mad that the K7 existed, and that Noodles from The Offspring had a sig. model, but that's just stuff stupid 14 year old's care about.



Maybe he is 14...?


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## Zalbu (Dec 30, 2015)

ArtDecade said:


> G&R is pretty high profile and even that wasn't enough to break Buckethead into the mainstream. Lets be honest... A man with a KFC bucket on his head is always going to be difficult to market in middle-America.


Exactly, I wouldn't even say that it's common knowledge that he played in Guns N Roses. People just associate them with Slash.


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## A-Branger (Dec 30, 2015)

who cares, the more the better. At least these guitars come with a nice specs and color not to be found in any other model out there.

let take Lizzy sig (to keep the example here). An explorer with block inlays!!. Im sold just because of that, where have you seen that?, and with body/neck binding too. The color scheme is pretty cool for me too. But you can easily change the pickguard and pups

other than that you are stuck with the plain red/black/yellow korina and maybe another limited color that ws released in the past?, all with dots ect ect.

and like that many other. 

I dont care about the "artist", but I care about the guitar, and the sigs just happen to be the ones I tend to GAS more about, because I like the specs/color more. I own a sig, and 3 out 5 guitars I have in mind as my top GAS are sigs, if not a 5 out of 5

example:

I own the Ibanez STM-1. Iceman from the guy of Dragon Force.
For me the best thing of the guitar is that his name is no-where to be found on it LOL. I only like 1, maybe 2 songs out of that band, and after I read quite a few interviews and videos about them and this dude (even their crap website at that time), I lost most of my respect to them as a band and guitar player. But.......

Ibanez iceman.....white....chrome hardware.....one volume knob....pups are black and the bride is zebra......weird but cool......dimarzio evolution......neck trough......24 frets!!....iceman with 24 frets......block inlays......neck with white binding.......white body with black binding........floating tremolo (I was looking into a guitar at that point)........ 

so in other words the perfect guitar I was looking for, and at a amazing "cheap" price. The only only thing I actualy hate about it, is the 6 in line tuning pegs instead of the 3+3 of an iceman.

so I dont care about whos sig is and their crap band. But they came up with an amazing spec guitar and thats what Im buying


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## Jaxcharvel (Dec 30, 2015)

I'm not a big signature guitar guy, but some of them have some truly slamming specs (and some are gimmicky turds) that can't be had on typical production models. Take the AW7 as an example. I'm not the biggest Whitechapel fan. I dig em, but certainly not enough to buy a sig from one of their THREE guitarists. But the specs on it when it was released was very hard, if not impossible to find said specs on a production model. So I bought one. It's also a way for companies to try out different specs to see how marketable it is.


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## coreysMonster (Dec 30, 2015)

In a world where Daisy Rock Guitars is a thing I openly embrace Lzzy Hale's signature guitar and wish she had a dozen of them.


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## A-Branger (Dec 30, 2015)

Jaxcharvel said:


> I'm not a big signature guitar guy, but some of them have some truly slamming specs (and some are gimmicky turds) that can't be had on typical production models. Take the AW7 as an example. I'm not the biggest Whitechapel fan. I dig em, but certainly not enough to buy a sig from one of their THREE guitarists. But the specs on it when it was released was very hard, if not impossible to find said specs on a production model. So I bought one. It's also a way for companies to try out different specs to see how marketable it is.



same here, I dont really care much about Whitechapel. Its an ok band for me but after many listens I cant get much into it, and I dnt see the reason for the 3 of them having a sig each either.

but... I loved the ZH7 and I almost bought one last year if it wasnt because bills piled up. I loved the LTD horizon 7, nice quilt black, ebony, block inlays, dimarzios. locking tunners. For me it was a pretty awesome looking guitar. Still is, and Im starting to wonder for the new EC model this year.


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## wankerness (Dec 30, 2015)

coreysMonster said:


> In a world where Daisy Rock Guitars is a thing I openly embrace Lzzy Hale's signature guitar and wish she had a dozen of them.



Haha, I agree totally with this. BUT, I believe the OP that he wasn't trying to complain about her specifically. I can see why nerds on this board would be mad that the poppy artists get the signature models, but it makes a hell of a lot more sense. Who's going to buy the Tosin Abasi signature model other than a hundred or so bedroom djent champs, all of whom are on this board? Same deal with Devin Townsend or whoever. They make far LESS sense to me. 

Some of the signature models of poppy doofs end up being surprisingly good, too. I remember the Mike Mushock (or however it's spelled) baritone guitar was one of the very best in its price range, was much easier to find than any other ones, and we only got it because of that stupid band and those ****ing "Outside" and "So Far Away" songs! I'm all for good guitars, I don't care whose name is used to advertise them, more signature models really doesn't hurt anyone IMO.


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## coreysMonster (Dec 30, 2015)

wankerness said:


> Haha, I agree totally with this. BUT, I believe the OP that he wasn't trying to complain about her specifically. I can see why nerds on this board would be mad that the poppy artists get the signature models, but it makes a hell of a lot more sense. Who's going to buy the Tosin Abasi signature model other than a hundred or so bedroom djent champs, all of whom are on this board? Same deal with Devin Townsend or whoever. They make far LESS sense to me.
> 
> Some of the signature models of poppy doofs end up being surprisingly good, too. I remember the Mike Mushock (or however it's spelled) baritone guitar was one of the very best in its price range, was much easier to find than any other ones, and we only got it because of that stupid band and those ****ing "Outside" and "So Far Away" songs! I'm all for good guitars, I don't care whose name is used to advertise them, more signature models really doesn't hurt anyone IMO.


It's funny you should mention both of them because Devin Townsend's rhythm guitarist plays a Mike Mushok signature pretty much exclusively. 

Yeah I agree, signature guitars with or without unorthodox specs are only a good thing for everybody. Good for guitar companies, the artists themselves and especially the customers. I mean at the end of the day if the guitar sucks don't buy it, but I haven't encountered many signature guitars that are really THAT bad.


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## Explorer (Dec 30, 2015)

I had never heard of Halestorm until I read this topic just now.

I watched some concert footage, learned a little bit about Lzzy Hale and guitarist Joe Hottinger.

The question asked from the Peanut Gallery over here: "Isn't Lzzy getting a signature guitar, and not Joe, like if Ann Wilson got a signature guitar and not Nancy Wilson? Geez, isn't he tearing it up playing a Flying V right there in the concert clip, while she's just singing? What is Gibson waiting for? Also, why are those music videos cut so that there's no clear shots of Joe's blowing up that guitar solo? It's like they don't want you to notice the guy's talent!"

It *is* funny that the guy tearing it up isn't worthy of a sig and gets pushed into the background to boot, at least in the concert clips I found. It was quite a contrast to various vids from, say, Evanescence, which don't hide band members.


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## Jaxcharvel (Dec 30, 2015)

She's the focal point of the band. Sure, he's an incredible guitarist, but without her they are an average hard rock band that would have never gotten a second glace. The fact that she's a very good singer, is ridiculously hot, AND she plays guitar makes her a marketable wet dream. No one is ever gonna really give a .... about her "other" guitar player, no matter how good he is.


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## Chokey Chicken (Dec 30, 2015)

I think it's great for the simple fact that we get unique finish options on otherwise run of the mill guitars. I like my mtm 80 because it's got a reverse headstock, one knob, and mahogany body. I like the KM7 because trans-white flame is sexy, coil splits, one knob, and pickup placement. I like Doris Yeh's sig bass because purple/silver burst is legit impossible to find otherwise. I like Lzzy Hale's explorer because it's a white explorer with block inlays and gold. Brendon Small's and Bill Kelliher's explorers are also great looking guitars that you cant get outside of their sigs really.

Some artists have a lot of technical skill. Technical skill doesn't write great music. Case in point, Dimebag was an amazing guitarist, but one of his most memorable riffs (the main riff for "walk") can be learned in two minutes and consists of very few, very slowly played, notes. You don't need to be an amazing instrumentalist to write good music. Good music gets followers. Followers are consumers. Consumers spend money. They spend money on trying to emulate their idols. What better way to mimic your idols than to use their "signature" gear?

Silly logic, but it's how things go, and it makes plenty of sense. I'll just keep buying the guitars that I think look/play well. If it happens to have someone's name on it somewhere, I'm not going to complain. I also won't rag on which artists do and don't deserve sigs.


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## MatthewK (Dec 30, 2015)

I'm pretty sure Gibson already had the "Les Paul" designed before he had anything to do with it.


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## The Hiryuu (Dec 30, 2015)

When did Lizzy Hale drop the I in her name? Or is it some kind of in-joke?


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## Chokey Chicken (Dec 31, 2015)

The Hiryuu said:


> When did Lizzy Hale drop the I in her name? Or is it some kind of in-joke?



To hell if I know. I was only made aware of her through that song she did with Lindsey Stirling and that's how her name was spelled.


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## Floppystrings (Dec 31, 2015)

It's interesting how long James Hetfield went without a signature guitar.


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## ArtDecade (Dec 31, 2015)

Floppystrings said:


> It's interesting how long James Hetfield went without a signature guitar.



Hetfield began his endorsement with them in 1988 and didn't get a proper signature model until 1996. I guess if you look at his schedule, it kinda makes sense though. The Black Album came out in 1991 and then it was massive touring time. Wherever We May Roam Tour (91-92), G&R Tour (92), Nowhere Else To Roam (93), .... Hits The Sheds Tour (94). So it probably wasn't until late-94 / early-95 during the Load sessions that he really had a chance to sit with prototypes and get something he wanted out to the market. ESP probably would have loved to have something out back in 91/92 but James seems to do things at his pace. Always has, always will.


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## ArtDecade (Dec 31, 2015)

ArtDecade said:


> Hetfield began his endorsement with them in 1988 and didn't get a proper signature model until 1996. I guess if you look at his schedule, it kinda makes sense though. The Black Album came out in 1991 and then it was massive touring time. Wherever We May Roam Tour (91-92), G&R Tour (92), Nowhere Else To Roam (93), .... Hits The Sheds Tour (94). So it probably wasn't until late-94 / early-95 during the Load sessions that he really had a chance to sit with prototypes and get something he wanted out to the market. ESP probably would have loved to have something out back in 91/92 but James seems to do things at his pace. Always has, always will.


 All speculation of course, but there were few busier bands than Metallica in the 90s. 


EDIT: Meant to edit the above, not quote myself.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Dec 31, 2015)

Allow me to take you back to the year 2000.

Nu-Metal was en vogue.

Girls with Rachel haircuts were dancing to the Thong Song.

Rock radio stations and music video shows were playing a song by a band called Crazy Town.

Oh, do you not remember Crazy Town? Here, let me show you their one and only "hit:"





Wasn't that awful? Like seriously major league terrible?

They were a one-hit wonder, and that was their lone hit. That was probably the only song anyone who wasn't actually a member of the band had ever heard.

HOWEVER!

Schecter, in their infinite wisdom, gave a signature model to Crazy Town's guitarist.

This band:








This guitarist:







...and this guitar:









Soooooooo yeah.

If such a thing a signature models jumping the shark were possible, it didn't happen recently with the likes of Lizzy Hale.

It happened fifteen years ago when everybody's current darling Schecter gave that eyesore of a signature model to the guitarist in a one-hit rap-rock band.


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## canuck brian (Dec 31, 2015)

I always like seeing artist signature guitars - i feel like we get a little insight into the artist and the company.

Like this - i feel like Dean's creative team got wicked drunk with guys from FFDP and came up with this abomination. 






Or when Fender thought a Courtney Love sig was needed....


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## piggins411 (Dec 31, 2015)

Holy ..... I did NOT know the guy from Crazy Town has a sig.


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## coreysMonster (Dec 31, 2015)

Grand Moff Tim said:


> Wasn't that awful? Like seriously major league terrible?


I love that song and you will shut your face! 

It's insane that he has a signature but seriously I really do like that song


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## ArtDecade (Dec 31, 2015)

piggins411 said:


> Holy ..... I did NOT know the guy from Crazy Town has a sig.



Grand Moff Tim _is_ the guitar player in Crazy Town. 

EDIT: Actually the guitar player in Crazy Town called himself "Rust Epique". I wish I was kidding. He also died of a heart attack in 2004. Again, I wish I was kidding. He was only 36.


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## Andromalia (Dec 31, 2015)

> let take Lizzy sig (to keep the example here). An explorer with block inlays!!. Im sold just because of that, where have you seen that?


On explorer pros. 



> It's funny you should mention both of them because Devin Townsend's rhythm guitarist plays a Mike Mushok signature pretty much exclusively



He plays a Framus Panthera now.

Facts people, _facts_.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Dec 31, 2015)

coreysMonster said:


> I love that song and you will shut your face!
> 
> It's insane that he has a signature but seriously I really do like that song



I'm sorry to hear about your condition. 

Don't lose heart, though! Apparently people suffering from profound hearing loss can get a thing called an Auditory Brainstem Implant, and though it might not allow you the hearing of a "normal" person, you'd at least no longer be completely deaf. Science is neat!


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## wankerness (Dec 31, 2015)

coreysMonster said:


> I love that song and you will shut your face!
> 
> It's insane that he has a signature but seriously I really do like that song



I like how it's just one riff from RHCP's "pretty little ditty" looped over and over and over >:O Sampling a song and turning it into a hit is annoying enough when it's from old song (ex Bittersweet Symphony or Just the Two of Us or I'll Be Missing You or whatever), but taking a direct sample from a song from a band that's still more popular than you when you do it is really sad. It clearly worked, though!


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## Andromalia (Dec 31, 2015)

Grand Moff Tim said:


> ...



LMAO post of the month.


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## Unleash The Fury (Dec 31, 2015)

wankerness said:


> I like how it's just one riff from RHCP's "pretty little ditty" looped over and over and over >:O Sampling a song and turning it into a hit is annoying enough when it's from old song (ex Bittersweet Symphony or Just the Two of Us or I'll Be Missing You or whatever), but taking a direct sample from a song from a band that's still more popular than you when you do it is really sad. It clearly worked, though!



wait, is that violin riff on bittersweet symphony looped over and over sampled from its original song? if so what song is it?


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## Floppystrings (Dec 31, 2015)

ArtDecade said:


> All speculation of course, but there were few busier bands than Metallica in the 90s.
> 
> 
> EDIT: Meant to edit the above, not quote myself.



If James had signed with Gibson, dang, all that monies.

I'm a huge fan of ESP so I'm he didn't switch. They still make the best Explorers (Edwards MIJ):






^and it costs less than a Gibson.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 31, 2015)

Floppystrings said:


> If James had signed with Gibson, dang, all that monies.



It almost happened, reportedly. He had a signature Iron Cross in the works that didn't happen for whatever reason, so he did it with ESP.


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## Hollowway (Dec 31, 2015)

When kim Kardashian gets a sig, we will have officially jumped the shark. And don't laugh - you know SOMEONE has already started scheming for that.


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## Mprinsje (Dec 31, 2015)

Hollowway said:


> When kim Kardashian gets a sig, we will have officially jumped the shark. And don't laugh - you know SOMEONE has already started scheming for that.



imma buy it.


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## USMarine75 (Dec 31, 2015)

http://www.amazon.com/Kardashian-Autographed-Signed-Pretty-Airbrush/dp/B00AP837QQ

^ I'm just gonna leave this here...


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## austink (Dec 31, 2015)

My take on sig models is that if a company is willing to give them to an artist, the must be worthy of one. Most come out and are completely unappealing to me as they are plastered with what can be boiled down to marketing marketing material (graphics, inlays etc. Think Sinister Gates schecter)

I think companies like prs do sigs well. I bought a Holcomb because sans the truss rod cover it has no other markings on it and it finally offered the specs I wanted on a USA made prs. I think companies like esp go a little extreme on making their sig models so obviously "someones" guitar, but I know there is an audience looking to play a guitar that looks like their hero's.


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## downburst82 (Dec 31, 2015)

Grand Moff Tim said:


> Allow me to take you back to the year 2000.
> 
> Nu-Metal was en vogue.
> 
> ...




This is going to be my uncoolest post ever...but...the schecter SIG was actually for Antonio "trouble" Valli NOT Rust Epique who was already out of the band by the time schecter came into the picture

So this guy 






They also had another guitarist Kraig "sqrl" Tyler who was schecter endorsed and had a custom 5 string guitar from them if I remember correctly.

.....I liked Crazy Town...they were my guilty pleasure 


*edit* just to add more constructively to the SIG guitar discussion one of my all-time favorite guitars was my Schecter M33 mike tempesta signature guitar, he was the guitar player for powerman 5000...you know Rob Zombie's brother Spider's band..... 

I thought one of there albums was ok but wasn't really a big fan or anything, I certainly didn't buy the guitar because of him (though he seems like a cool guy, works artist relations for jackson now I believe) I bought it because it was a great playing guitar that I loved the look and specs of.


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## will_shred (Dec 31, 2015)

Unleash The Fury said:


> Artists no longer get sig models because of their talent, they get them because of their popularity,which is what makes money. Sysnyster Gates got a significant model a long time ago, it's because of his image



If artists had signature models based on talent alone i'm sure guitar companies would be lining up around the block to give free guitars to a good amount of posters on this forum. There are plenty of talented guitar players in the world. Signature guitars are not given away based on talent, its a business decision made by the company to sell more guitars, hence they give them to popular artists. That's the way its always been, and that's the way it always will be. It's not that complicated. Or do you think that they do it from the goodness and generosity of their corporate heart to those who really really deserve free guitars?


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## wankerness (Dec 31, 2015)

Unleash The Fury said:


> wait, is that violin riff on bittersweet symphony looped over and over sampled from its original song? if so what song is it?



It's a string arrangement of some Rolling Stones song. They got the rights to sample the song, but then their manager said "oh what you added to your song also ripped it off and exceeded the terms of the contract you signed," so The Rolling Stones then sued The Verve and managed to get something around 100% of the profits they earned from the song/album, causing them to break up.


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## A-Branger (Dec 31, 2015)

Floppystrings said:


> If James had signed with Gibson, dang, all that monies.
> 
> I'm a huge fan of ESP so I'm he didn't switch. They still make the best Explorers (Edwards MIJ):




yeah I always wonder why he didnt had a sig with Gibson, or the never had a explorer sig till now. All paperwork I guess

But I think it was his lost more than Gibson. There is no other player out there that has promoted the explorer shape as much as him. When you see an explorer you right away think of metallica. And I think part of the popularity of those guitars is still hugely thanks to James.

So it was a some kind of "free" advertising for Gibson all this years


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## A-Branger (Dec 31, 2015)

wankerness said:


> I like how it's just one riff from RHCP's "pretty little ditty" looped over and over and over >:O Sampling a song and turning it into a hit is annoying enough when it's from old song (ex Bittersweet Symphony or Just the Two of Us or I'll Be Missing You or whatever), but taking a direct sample from a song from a band that's still more popular than you when you do it is really sad. It clearly worked, though!



I was just about to say that.

and funny thing is they didnt even "play" the song. Probabe was a big lip sync in top of what the DJ was "pretending" to play..... they had a DJ didnt they?... all the bands in that moment had one lol


I grow up playing RHCP on bass and I knew that song up side down on bass and was kinda annoying having to explain everyone who heard me play that it was a Red Hot song and not a Crazy Towm 

so as I knew how the bass was played I could tell easly the bass player in the music video and in performanc didnt play it ..... He wasnt even on the right side of the fretboard, not even close LOL


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## A-Branger (Dec 31, 2015)

and speaking of Schecter and their choices at artist sigs at that point in time.

they also had one for the guy of Papa Roach 






at that point they also had like 1 hit wonder

but to be bit more fair, at least this guys had another 2 more hits? on that album. It was one of those MTV hores band, when MTV was good to watch. And to be fair they still are playing today?? or recently? but more like EMO music rather than nu-metal

still, a guitar with a gigant cockroach on it and ppl buy it lol


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## PFlynn (Dec 31, 2015)

I don't really have any gripes about signature models. I only own one and it's just a Squier Mike Dirnt P-bass. (Which is actually a pretty great bass.) I do agree that some players probably don't deserve one, based on skill level, but I do understand that these companies have to make a profit, and that's a great way to do it. 

What really bugs me about it is when artists jump around with different manufacturers constantly. I couldn't even guess how many signature models Paul Stanley has had. Same with Richie Sambora. What's worse is the way Dean has completely bled the well dry on the Dimebag name. It's disgraceful.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Dec 31, 2015)

downburst82 said:


> This is going to be my uncoolest post ever...but...the schecter SIG was actually for Antonio "trouble" Valli NOT Rust Epique who was already out of the band by the time schecter came into the picture




I've never been so happy to not be knowledgeable about a band.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 31, 2015)

A-Branger said:


> yeah I always wonder why he didnt had a sig with Gibson, or the never had a explorer sig till now. All paperwork I guess



Like I said, there was apparently a Iron Cross sig in the works. James supposedly owned a prototype, but nothing ever happened.

Funny enough, after he got the ESP Iron Cross in 2009/2010, he started to drift away from Gibson and went back to mostly using ESPs again (save for the usual Ken Lawrence and James Trussart). In the mid-late 2000's, he was almost all Gibson, using his "Rusty" Explorer and his personally modified Iron Cross.



Grand Moff Tim said:


> I've never been so happy to not be knowledgeable about a band.



I don't know... Being annoyed about company releasing a limited edition signature model, under their newly-formed import guitar brand, to a one-hit-wonder band seems to cause more anguish than just knowing random tidbits about a band.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Dec 31, 2015)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I don't know... Being annoyed about company releasing a limited edition signature model, under their newly-formed import guitar brand, to a one-hit-wonder band seems to cause more anguish than just knowing random tidbits about a band.




You joke, but I still don't really like Schecter for precisely that reason. 

They were trying to rebuild their image with their new line, and they did so by handing out signature models to anyone with a video on TRL, and me being the Too Cool For School 19 year old at the time, that left a lasting negative impression of the brand in my mind.

Like people have pointed out in this thread, signature models for artists you don't like just means you aren't the target market. A side effect of that is that when a company releases a large number of (or even nothing but) signature models for artists I don't like, the company is pretty much telling me I'm not the entire brand's target market. There's nothing wrong with that, of course, and I'm not losing any sleep over it or anything, but that's a consequence companies have to keep in mind when releasing signature models.

I realize Schecter has come a long way since then, but they haven't really done anything to redeem themselves in my eyes. Of course, I'm just one guy, so there's no real reason for Schecter to give a sh!t about what some random guy thinks about their brand or their artist roster. 

On the other hand, I've spent about $10k on gear over the last year and a half, so they'd better hope I'm unique in having formed a negative impression of them.


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## Hollowway (Dec 31, 2015)

wankerness said:


> It's a string arrangement of some Rolling Stones song. They got the rights to sample the song, but then their manager said "oh what you added to your song also ripped it off and exceeded the terms of the contract you signed," so The Rolling Stones then sued The Verve and managed to get something around 100% of the profits they earned from the song/album, causing them to break up.



Are you serious? That sucks! I'm all for people creating original music and stuff, but that was an awesome song, and owed VERY little to the sample. It was 100% about the lyrics and lyrical melody. That's a pretty ....ty thing for the Stones to do. You know they only did it when they saw the song was getting popular. It's not like I can stop supporting the Stones, though, because I already hate them. ....tiest band from that era.


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## thedonal (Jan 1, 2016)

Aren't about half of Gibson's 50,000 variations on the Les Paul any any given time signature models?

If they're doing it to help support an artist they like, that's fine-but why not endorse rather than make a production signature?

I do think it saturates the model in an arena where there are far too many variations on Strat, Les Paul etc.

I thought it ironic that the AFD Les Paul was a signature model based on a copy of a Les Paul. A cover of a cover! 

I have nothing against musical instrument companies help artists out- traditionally, musicians make very little money- but sometimes I just see it as adding to the insane amount of choice available. And for short lived artists, it seems like a lot to go to for a sig model that won't sell in 6 or 12 months.


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## Demiurge (Jan 1, 2016)

The only satisfactory answer to why so-and-so has a signature model has to be because it's financially advantageous to the company. Contemplating it as a reward for musicianship or whatnot just leads to endless rounds of "____ has one but ____ doesn't- WTF?"

Not that I can't resist piling-on, though... think of your favorite player who plays off-the-shelf guitars... and remember when Gibson gave Kiefer Sutherland a model? Gibson Custom Inspired By Kiefer Sutherland Semi-Hollow KS-336 Electric Guitar | Musician&#39;s Friend (It bears mentioning that he plays, owns a studio, collects, etc. but he is obviously best-known as Jack Bauer.)


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## bzhan1 (Jan 1, 2016)

As a man, it goes against me belief to pay another man to put their name on my guitar. It makes no sense when you can find pretty much any specs you want from a production or custom.


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## Chokey Chicken (Jan 1, 2016)

bzhan1 said:


> As a man, it goes against me belief to pay another man to put their name on my guitar. It makes no sense when you can find pretty much any specs you want from a production or custom.



Sound logic... "I want that exact guitar but with nobody's name on it. I think I'll spend 6k+ on a custom." lol

People should just buy what they like. Names mean nothing.


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## Edika (Jan 1, 2016)

Don't know if it was mentioned before but the Lizzy Hale Explorer looks awesome. I haven't seen her name plastered all over the guitar so it could just be an Explorer (a kick ass Explorer) that Lizzy plays.

All the rest has been covered and by other members and the OP himself so no point in debating them. I don't like sig models that are too extravagant and have the name of the player plastered all over. There are however several sigs that are very tastily made with really good specs that I wouldn't mind owning as the aesthetics appeal to me. 

Then it's just the small matter of if it's a kick ass playing guitar that sounds awesome .


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## beerandbeards (Jan 1, 2016)

Funny story... all of my guitars are signature models 
Petrucci
Merrow 
Schuldiner

Each one is a little more special than your typical production model. The Schuldiner tribute was the only one I bought for fanboism. The others are just great guitars.


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## Andromalia (Jan 1, 2016)

A-Branger said:


> But I think it was his lost more than Gibson. There is no other player out there that has promoted the explorer shape as much as him. When you see an explorer you right away think of metallica. And I think part of the popularity of those guitars is still hugely thanks to James.



Depends, in not-metal-circles the answer is more "that guy from Scorpions" and Billy Gibbons (yeah, because of ONE videoclip ^^...which were Deans, to boot ) than Metallica.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 1, 2016)

EDIT: I'm justgonna assume it's sarcasm.


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## Rosal76 (Jan 1, 2016)

beerandbeards said:


> The Schuldiner tribute was the only one I bought for fanboism.





I was gonna buy one not only because I'm a fan of Death/Chuck Sculdiner but I also wanted a B.C. Rich Stealth guitar. I would have also liked to have a replica of his green Stealth with the green flame maple but it's a U.S. custom shop and cost a lot of money.


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## Great Satan (Jan 1, 2016)

To be honest, more often than not i've been dissuaded form buying a guitar 'because' it had someone's name attached to it.
Usually it'd be someone from some band i didn't like (or didn't particularly know) & even though i might like the specs of the guitar stock, 
i still wouldn't want the name association on it. Call me fickle.

I've gotten over that somewhat, but instead of buying whole guitars i now tend to go for signature pickups (much cheaper) & stick them in something i paid very little for that plays well.

So far i've stuck a EVH Frankenstrat humbucker into a cheap strat & a SD Retribution (Fear Factory/Dino sig) into a cheap 7-string Jackson, 
both have since become my fav guitars (& among my cheapest).

Next i might put some more generic/non-sig paf style humbuckers into a epi SG i have lying around to see if i can cop some ac/dc style sounds.
Will turn out way way way cheaper than buying an Angus Young sig guitar


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## Rosal76 (Jan 1, 2016)

Great Satan said:


> I've gotten over that somewhat, but instead of buying whole guitars i now tend to go for signature pickups (much cheaper) & stick them in something i paid very little for that plays well.



+1.

That's what my friend did. He purchased Steve Vai signature pickups from DiMarzio and put them in his $500 Ibanez RG. And it sounds great. He saved a lot of money in the process.


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## Great Satan (Jan 1, 2016)

Rosal76 said:


> +1.
> 
> That's what my friend did. He purchased Steve Vai signature pickups from DiMarzio and put them in his $500 Ibanez RG. And it sounds great. He saved a lot of money in the process.



Its the way to go i'm tellin you! 

I also tend to forgo the tone knob & just go with the one volume dealio using a SD Liberator (solderless vol knob) so i can swap the pickup out for something else relatively easily if i want.


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## Mathemagician (Jan 1, 2016)

I'm about to cave and put dimarzios in my SBMM JP70, because I can't find anything wrong with it to justify upgrading the guitar itself, especially since I want to block the trem anyways. It's just super comfortable. I play it more than my late 90's MIJ soloist or prestige RG since it's my only 7. It's a sig. But that only seems to bother douchebags who enjoy seriously "rating/judging" guitarists. Most people could give a rats ass about that as long as it plays awesome/has the specs they want.


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## Hollowway (Jan 1, 2016)

Andromalia said:


> Depends, in not-metal-circles the answer is more "that guy from Scorpions" and Billy Gibbons (yeah, because of ONE videoclip ^^...which were Deans, to boot ) than Metallica.



+1. I don't really think Metallica when I think Explorer. But I DO think of The Scorpions. And I guess ZZ Top, but only if I'm thinking of fuzzy Explorers. 

What do Billy Gibbons' guitar and an unshaven Magellan have in common? They're both fuzzy explorers. Ba dum TISH.


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## bzhan1 (Jan 1, 2016)

Chokey Chicken said:


> Sound logic... "I want that exact guitar but with nobody's name on it. I think I'll spend 6k+ on a custom." lol
> 
> People should just buy what they like. Names mean nothing.



I think you missed the point there buddy


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## ArtDecade (Jan 2, 2016)

All my guitars are signature models, too.

Gretsch 6120 _Chet Atkins_
ESP/LTD _James Hetfield_ Iron Cross (Traded my Gibson _Les Paul_ Studio for it)


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## marcwormjim (Jan 2, 2016)

bzhan1 said:


> I think you missed the point there buddy



Don't know what his problem is, but I think I got ya: I beltsand Leo Fender and Orville Gibson's names off my guitars to preserve my masculinity, too.


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## Zalbu (Jan 2, 2016)

bzhan1 said:


> As a man, it goes against me belief to pay another man to put their name on my guitar. It makes no sense when you can find pretty much any specs you want from a production or custom.


Even wanting something as simple as stainless steel frets or HSH pickup configuration limits your options severely unless you go custom and I don't have that kind of money to spend.  

Keith Merrows signature guitar is a godsend because, as he said himself, he specced it out like a custom shop guitar but at a price your average guitarist can afford.


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## ArtDecade (Jan 2, 2016)

On the subject of signature who-zits and what-zits, is anyone else surprised that Michael Schenker never had a signature wah? #MissedConnections


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## Alex Kenivel (Jan 2, 2016)

Grand Moff Tim said:


> .... odels for artists you don't like just means you aren't the *Target Market.* A side effect...



New song name!


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## Spicypickles (Jan 7, 2016)

A-Branger said:


> yeah I always wonder why he didnt had a sig with Gibson, or the never had a explorer sig till now. All paperwork I guess
> 
> But I think it was his lost more than Gibson. There is no other player out there that has promoted the explorer shape as much as him. When you see an explorer you right away think of metallica. And I think part of the popularity of those guitars is still hugely thanks to James.
> 
> So it was a some kind of "free" advertising for Gibson all this years



You'd be surprised. I know on this site it doesn't seem like it, but a TON of people associate the explorer with that dude from U2. Remember, metal is very much a minority, even something as global as metallica.


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## Spicypickles (Jan 7, 2016)

Hollowway said:


> Are you serious? That sucks! I'm all for people creating original music and stuff, but that was an awesome song, and owed VERY little to the sample. It was 100% about the lyrics and lyrical melody. That's a pretty ....ty thing for the Stones to do. You know they only did it when they saw the song was getting popular. It's not like I can stop supporting the Stones, though, because I already hate them. ....tiest band from that era.





Quoted just so people see this. What a dick-head move. .... those guys.


Their music is already chitty enough.


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## stevexc (Jan 7, 2016)

Tommy Lee had a signature guitar.

I think it's okay for Lzzy Hale to get one too.


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## coreysMonster (Jan 7, 2016)

Grand Moff Tim said:


> I'm sorry to hear about your condition.
> 
> Don't lose heart, though! Apparently people suffering from profound hearing loss can get a thing called an Auditory Brainstem Implant, and though it might not allow you the hearing of a "normal" person, you'd at least no longer be completely deaf. Science is neat!


Science is indeed neat, I hear they can regrow a complete tongue these days, to give to people without taste.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 7, 2016)

coreysMonster said:


> Science is indeed neat, I hear they can regrow a complete tongue these days, to give to people without taste.



I ....ing love this forum.


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## Given To Fly (Jan 8, 2016)

coreysMonster said:


> Science is indeed neat, I hear they can regrow a complete tongue these days, to give to people without taste.



This is going on my page of "Quotes." 

As for signature gear, I have owned a lot of Steve Vai's signature gear and John Petrucci's signature gear over the years but have since tailored everything down to my JPX-7. One reason to consider signature models is if they improve on an existing product. For example, I thought the Morley Bad Horse was brilliant solely because it was switchless. I felt that was an improvement over every other wah pedal at the time. That is a small example but the thought process behind it can help separate signature into two categories: marketing gear and improved gear. 

Another thing, when a new signature guitar comes out my mindset has changed from "A new signature guitar by so-and-so! It must be great!" to "How is this guitar different and do the differences make it better than the competition?"


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## blacai (Jan 8, 2016)

What about nikki stringfield ?


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## Mprinsje (Jan 8, 2016)

blacai said:


> What about nikki stringfield ?



who dat is?


Fretboard inlay looks gaudy as hell though


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## blacai (Jan 8, 2016)

Mprinsje said:


> who dat is?
> 
> 
> Fretboard inlay looks gaudy as hell though



One of the guitarists in the iron maidens

Yes, I hate the inlays... but other specs are cool


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## CaptainD00M (Jan 8, 2016)

canuck brian said:


> I always like seeing artist signature guitars - i feel like we get a little insight into the artist and the company.
> 
> Like this - i feel like Dean's creative team got wicked drunk with guys from FFDP and came up with this abomination.



I'm pretty sure Paul Read Smith had to get drunk through creating this one:







Or that other one where Paul's standing with Mark and looking like he wants to die because of the thing he had to create. I can't seem to find that pic though :/


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## Grand Moff Tim (Jan 8, 2016)

coreysMonster said:


> Science is indeed neat, I hear they can regrow a complete tongue these days, to give to people without taste.




If that'd mean having to listen to Crazy Town, science can keep their lab-tongues and I'll continue living my tasteless life.


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## A-Branger (Jan 8, 2016)

CaptainD00M said:


> I'm pretty sure Paul Read Smith had to get drunk through creating this one:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



when you want to play an explorer/firebird so bad but your contract doesnt allow you to play anything that is not a PRS


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## DISTORT6 (Jan 8, 2016)




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## SDMFVan (Jan 8, 2016)

My major takeaway from this thread is that Schecter has made the worst signature guitars of all time.


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## Thanatopsis (Jan 17, 2016)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> He's one of the more well-known shredders, especially because of his time with GnR.
> 
> Also, his sig model was a limited edition model.


As well known as he might be after playing with GnR, he still seems to have a fairly small fan base. As a huge Buckethead fan, I've seen him live quite a few times and it's always been in fairly small venues and never sold out. Usually pay about $20-25 for tickets. From talking to other people at shows, it seems 90% of his fans are guitarists too(though that's no big surprise). I doubt Gibson ever solder more than a few hundred of the more expensive sig model. Probably not too many of the cheaper one either although probably slightly more.


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## oc616 (Jan 18, 2016)

Not saying whether these musicians deserve them or not (both Misha and Chris do!) but Jackson made only one 8 available this year and it's a Misha Mansoor sig for $5000. Also look at this and tell me it's worth the asking price: Jackson Chris Broderick Soloist&#8482; HT 7, Ebony Fingerboard, Black with Case 2803157803 &#8203;


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## Spicypickles (Jan 20, 2016)

Those prices are in mooseknuckles, being from Canada.


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## wakjob (Jan 20, 2016)

Uh, "jump the shark"? 

Okay. I'm lost... as usual. I can't keep up with pop culture or internet jargon.

P.S. I'd buy a Grace Potter flying V in a heartbeat if I had the cash.


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## Great Satan (Jan 20, 2016)

Saw this today; https://youtu.be/lzl60Kyoy0Q
Billy Corgan has a new sig with Reverend guitars.

Discuss


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## Great Satan (Jan 20, 2016)

wakjob said:


> Uh, "jump the shark"?
> 
> Okay. I'm lost... as usual. I can't keep up with pop culture or internet jargon.



That particular idiom happens to be pre-internet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark


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## Demiurge (Jan 20, 2016)

Great Satan said:


> That particular idiom happens to be pre-internet
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark



I like how the entry also references "Nuke the Fridge"- is that the better term for Dean's Dimebag guitars?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 20, 2016)

Great Satan said:


> Saw this today; https://youtu.be/lzl60Kyoy0Q
> Billy Corgan has a new sig with Reverend guitars.
> 
> Discuss



I'd say he deserves it since Smashing Pumpkins is one of the biggest and influential alt-rock bands out there. Hell, he already had a signature model with a bigger company.


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## Great Satan (Jan 21, 2016)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I'd say he deserves it since Smashing Pumpkins is one of the biggest and influential alt-rock bands out there. Hell, he already had a signature model with a bigger company.



That's why it seemed a little odd to me, i mean what a fender sig with sig pups not good enough? lol
Still i have respect for both Corgan's songwriting abilities and his capacity to use whatever's at his disposal for creating unique guitar tones,
what the reasoning is behind this new sig is beyond me but he does mention something about a single guitar not being versatile enough to make it through a full pumpkins set.


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