# A harmonic minor sweeps?



## Ibanezplayer (Dec 11, 2008)

So let me start off by saying my theory experience is a bit limited aside from the basics, however I was just wondering how to figure this out...my buddy asked me to play sweep arpeggios "in A harmonic minor - following a 1 6 5 4 3 7 1 progression."....what does this mean? and what would that even look like?


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## All_¥our_Bass (Dec 11, 2008)

A minor contains the notes
A B C D E F G

A harmonic minor contains the notes
A B C D E F G#

When people use numbers for chord changes they always label the root or 'home' chord as 1 the one after that as two and so on.

1 Am
2 Bdim
3 Cmaj
4 Dmin
5 Emaj
6 Fmaj
7 G#dim

So your chord progression is
Amin(1) Fmaj(6) Emaj(5) Dmin(4) Cmaj(3) G#dim(7) Amin(1)

EDIT: Fixed number typo.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Dec 11, 2008)

What he said, but you got your numbers wrong, Bass. Should be Amin(1) Fmaj(6) Emaj(5) Dmin(4) Cmaj(3) G#dim(7) Amin(1).

Ibanezplayer, I suggest learning the roman numeral system when dealing with chords. In numerals, that progression is i IV
V iv #viiº i. Capital numerals are major, lowercase are minor, and lowercase with a º are diminished. I write #viiº to indicate that the tonic of the VII chord (spelled GBD in A minor) has been altered (the resulting chord being G#BD, or G# diminished).


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## Ibanezplayer (Dec 11, 2008)

I understand that the numbers are supposed to correspond to the chords in the key, however do the arpeggios have to have all of the notes within the scale or do the notes within the arpeggios have to come from the chords in the given progression?


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## ilikes2shred (Dec 11, 2008)

Ummm.... Yes. Both.

All the chords contain only notes from the scale, so if you sweep using only the notes in each chord, you will be using the only notes off the scale. I assume you know this.

So assuming he is using the diatonic triads, sweeping with only the notes of each triad could sound a little boring. I would probably choose to use the notes of the chord and any complimenting notes in the scale. Maybe try some 7's and 9's, I think those sound good with the majority of chords...

I would stray from using ALL the notes on the scale during each individual chord as some notes are very contrasting (augmented fourths, minor seconds...). However you can use this approach and have it sound good, you just have to know how you want it to sound.


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## TonalArchitect (Dec 11, 2008)

Ibanezplayer said:


> I understand that the numbers are supposed to correspond to the chords in the key, however do the arpeggios have to have all of the notes within the scale or do the notes within the arpeggios have to come from the chords in the given progression?





The Roman numerals give the scale tone on which the chord is to be built. Then stuff like upper-case (major), lower-case (minor), and other suffixes like min7, maj7, (dominant)7, a degree symbol (diminished), and a + sign (augmented), and so on, tell you _what_ type of chord to build with the tone signified by the Roman numeral as the root.

So, in A harmonic minor, the progression V7-i signifies this:

A dominant seven chord built on the fifth degree of the scale:

So in A harmonic minor we have E7 or E G# B D

going to an A minor chord A C E.

Also, don't get caught up too much in the Roman numeral system; it's just a lazy shorthand method of writing chord progressions.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Dec 11, 2008)

It was a typo, I fixed it.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Dec 11, 2008)

Remember what I said about that #viiº? Forget about it, the leading tone viiº is so frequent in minor that theorists just use viiº. bVI, bII, and the like are, however, shown with root note modification.

Don't forget that arpeggios are only melodic chords. You would play an Ami arpeggio over an Ami chord. You could also play a Cmaj arpeggio over Ami to get an Amin7 effect. There's nothing you can't do, but some things sound more diatonic than others.

So yeah, Ami, spelled ACE, is the same as an A minor arpeggio, spelled ACE. If you fret a chord and play each string separately, you are, in effect, playing arpeggios. For this reason, you will sometimes hear people call arpeggios "broken chords".



If you play a i iv V (Ami Dmi E) progression in A minor, and play an A minor scale over the Ami, a D minor scale over the Dmi, and an E major scale over the E, then you end up with polymodality, which is not the same as arpeggiation.


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## JakeRI (Dec 11, 2008)

yeah, every one is spot on, the only thing i would say would be to play the full tetra chord 
i.e.
A-7
A C E G

its particularly important with the E chord, because instead of just being and Emaj, its now an E dominant 7 (E7)


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## Ibanezplayer (Dec 12, 2008)

So this is what I came up with, nothing to fancy just basics....timings probably a bit off but if this is right then I'll learn that next.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Dec 13, 2008)

> yeah, every one is spot on, the only thing i would say would be to play the full tetra chord
> i.e.
> A-7
> A C E G
> ...



Tetrachords are the first four notes of a scale, not a chord with four notes, and they're usually not played as a single chord. An A minor tetrachord is ABCD, A major is ABC#D, A lydian is ABC#D#, and so on.

But right on with the E7, that'll make the minor kickass.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Dec 13, 2008)

I understand the resolution is stronger with a E7 instead of an Em7, but I never liked the sound of a major V chord in a minor key, it's like all of a sudden your depressing song is all happy.


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## Stan P (Dec 17, 2008)

Definitely do E7! 

Better E7 with b9 that goes like E-G#-B-D-F

Or even E-G#-B-D-F-G#-B - up and down and add some diminished runs for betetr taste!


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Dec 17, 2008)

Minor V's aren't used very often, because it lacks the leading tone. Dominant 7's might be a bit bright for a minor key, but they allow for some nice harmonic minor action.


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## All_¥our_Bass (Dec 17, 2008)

I understand why it's "better" from a voice leading perspective, it's just not what I like to use. Sorry I'm going all OT with these comments.


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## Stan P (Dec 18, 2008)

It's all subjective ... I like to use 4 or 5 tone arpegios for jazzier vibe.

All my Dominants usually have flat 9 and all minors have 6th or 7th in them.


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## PirateMetalTroy (Dec 18, 2008)

This is why I just get people to play/show me what the hell they're talking about.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Dec 18, 2008)

Well, it really is a personal choice, to use v or V, but as long as you understand it, keep on truckin'. Certain things will make a V sound more minor, though, like a neapolitan chord (major chord built on the bll) going to V to i. But that's all tonal voice leading stuff; few twentieth century composers and few romantic composers are known for adhering to a two-hundred year old system of harmony.


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## Harry (Dec 18, 2008)

Might sound like an odd suggestion, but learning the modes of the harmonic minor scale really help to easily pin down how arpeggios like the one you need are constructed.
Weird suggestion I know, but it's worked for me


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## Stan P (Dec 26, 2008)

PirateMetalTroy said:


> This is why I just get people to play/show me what the hell they're talking about.



Easy pattern for Vb9 on 6 strings:

1---|---|-0-|---|---| 
2---|-0-|---|---|-0-|
3---|---|-0-|---|---|
4---|-0-|---|---|-0-|
5---|---|-0-|---|---|
6---|---|---|---|---|

Easy pattern for m7 on 6 strings:

1---|-0-|---|---|---| 
2---|-0-|---|---|-0-|
3---|-0-|---|---|---|
4---|-0-|---|-0-|---|
5---|---|---|-0-|---|
6---|-0-|---|---|-0-|

Easy pattern for m6 on 6 strings (gypsy sounding):

1---|-0-|---|---|---| 
2---|-0-|---|-0-|---|
3---|-0-|---|---|---|
4-0-|---|---|-0-|---|
5---|---|---|-0-|---|
6---|-0-|---|---|-0-|

Sweep away


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## Splatter (Dec 29, 2008)

Ibanezplayer said:


> So this is what I came up with, nothing to fancy just basics....timings probably a bit off but if this is right then I'll learn that next.



The second arp you have tabbed out here isn't what I think you're going for.. I assume you want an F maj arp. Move the E on the A string up a fret (7 to 8), and the G# on the B string up a fret (9 to 10).


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