# Are Macs really better for recording purposes?



## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

I've been thinking about getting a Macbook Pro lately, and I figured this would be a good place to ask if it's worth it. Are they really better/more stable for recording. What are advantages/disadvantages?


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## Razzy (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm a PC tech, and the ONLY reason I'd get a Mac is for recording. They RAPE you on the price of their systems for what you get, but, Max OSX is not a bad operating system, and Logic is pretty sweet. If you've got the cash, and you understand that you're paying twice as much for the same hardware as if you went with a Windows machine, only because of the operating system, then go for it.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

I definitely understand about the pricing. I have to say my biggest issues with Apple are their pricing and Steve Jobs' smugness. The PC I have right now is a pretty powerful dual core machine, and can run Cubase and all pretty well, but I guess I just want to know how much of a difference there is between the 2 (in terms of ease of use for recording and mixing really)


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## PeteyG (Jun 19, 2010)

Having been brought up a mac user, I personally prefer Macs over anything else any day. HOWEVER I would say go with what you are used to if you already have a good enough setup, and as long as you aren't planning on going into a line of work where you need to be fluent with the industry standards for production.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

That's a really good point. I dont exactly have a "set up", I'm just using a POD X3 Live/Toneport for all of my recording right now into Cubase with Addictive Drums. Light but effective. I've heard a lot of really great things about Logic though.


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## Gameboypdc (Jun 19, 2010)

A Mac is 99.9% safe from viruses, spyware and malicious threats that flood the internet these days. This is not a argument for all you PC users. I've first hand attempted for years to find a actual working virus or malicious ware for mac just for the purpose of proving this point. Mac's are also equal if not better in some ways with options for software and compatibility for recording. Logic being a very user friendly professional recording daw with little to no hardware limitations, unlike M-Audio's Protools which is very picky and limited without a wallet full of cash for plugins. I know Nuendo and Cubase offer more options for audio hardware interfaces when compared to ProTools, but based on prices for the software alone, it seems like Nuendo and Cubase cost more just for the software and I don't really hear much about what plugins come bundled. Where as I can vouch for Logic having a extensive arsenal of software plugins built in. Logic also runs smooth with midi and for the longest time Protools had limited support for *not sure about Nuendo and Cubase*. Even if your not a Logic fan other software is available for Mac users. So my suggestion is use your logic *no pun intended* and invest in a safe easy to use Mac laptop or desktop for recording. Now I know some of you would say that you can get more for your money buying a PC. While that may be true when looking at the technical details of what is in your machine before software is installed, but at least I never have to reinstall my OS, where as most PC users have to wipe drives and reinstall software and the OS every so often. Having used and own many PC computers for gaming and or recording machines I know first hand that installing a Windows OS takes quite a bit of time even with Windows 7, and after so many installs you have to contact Microsoft and have them either send you or activate CD keys for you just to allow you to install your OS again. Otherwise you have to re-purchase your OS and repeat all your updates including Direct X and reinstall all of your software. Even if you partition your OS to a faster running HD and use repair to fix or reinstall your OS you still may have affected your program directory and fixing that involves at least a few software programs needing to be reinstalled. These are just some of the many problems with PC computers that for some reason get overlooked by their cheaper price.

The only drawback that I can find with a Mac is their inability to use the common freeware programs and vst's like the TSE preamp sim. The other issue with Mac's is the lack of support for computer games. Then again all that is squashed anyway because now due to the Intel switch from Apple users are capable of installing Windows on your Macintosh and switch between the two. Considering doing that would allow your Mac to be vulnerable to malicious attacks that effect hardware and really defeat the safety factor behind the Mac OS, but in return it would allow you a open door to both the PC and Mac world. So when you look at the price you pay for a Mac think about how user friendly and safe the OS is when compared to Windows.

Cheers!


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## PeteyG (Jun 19, 2010)

Yeah I know what you mean, Logic is great, but what you're feeling is a part of wondering if another program can do everything better than what you currently use. In reality the way I look at the differing DAW's is that they're good for varying things, many people would say that Logic is great for the creative processes, and Protools is great for perfecting the production of something, and I'd be inclined to agree.

That being said all DAWs do the same basic thing, they allow you to produce music, and for the most part you can get equally good results from almost all of them, Cubase included. The major thing I find with Logic is the ease of use and it's user friendliness whilst being a professional level DAW, but if you're looking to do some high quality demoing, you can use a program such as Garageband (comes in the Apple iLife package, not a professional DAW) and get more decent sounds than a lot of other people might, and it's even easier to use.

It's really down to how much you want to get into production, personally I'd stick with Cubase in your position and learn as much about production on that as I could. That way if you are in the position in the future to move onto a more production focused setup, with a mac and whatnot and using Logic it would simply be a case of adapting your personal recording techniques to that different DAW and the differing features and making yourself feel at home on the layouts.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

You both make some really good points. Granted, I do all of my writing in Guitar Pro at the moment (mostly because I find writing drums to fit the music much easier that way...just me though)

I've used Sonar and Cubase and there are things about both that I really like. I find Sonar's interface to be more user friendly and Cubase seems to run much more smooth with less chance for drop out. 

I'm kind of torn because my PC is definitely more powerful than the Macbook I want and I paid a lot less in parts. I would like a laptop, and I hate the usb drop out problems I've had with the POD on here, I cant even use my POD because of a hardware incompatibility with Windows 7.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

Was just looking at laptops in the same price range and cheaper. I'm still amazed that in the price range of less than a 13in Macbook Pro I could get a Windows laptop with hardware specs that are higher. I honestly cannot stand Apple's pricing, let alone the amount of money they make on each unit sold of everything they sell.


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## Gameboypdc (Jun 19, 2010)

AlucardXIX said:


> Was just looking at laptops in the same price range and cheaper. I'm still amazed that in the price range of less than a 13in Macbook Pro I could get a Windows laptop with hardware specs that are higher. I honestly cannot stand Apple's pricing, let alone the amount of money they make on each unit sold of everything they sell.




Read my post. I believe I explained the typical PC/Mac price argument.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

Yea I know what you mean. I'm actually considering selling my 8 string(I rarely play the thing, and everything I write has that typical Meshuggah sound to it) if I buy a MBP. 

Also, my point about the profit per unit sold goes for every Apple product. They make so much off of each iPod/iPhone they sell it's sickening.


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## Razzy (Jun 19, 2010)

Gameboypdc said:


> Read my post. I believe I explained the typical PC/Mac price argument.



You argued some points, but let me touch base with you on a couple of them.

Viruses- Virus writers are in it for the money, they scam people, to make money. If you're spending hours writing a program to make a bunch of money, who are you going to attempt to infect? Certainly not less than 20% of the market share. That is why there are no viruses for the Mac OS, not because it's actually safer, or harder to crack, but because the malware just is not written for it.

Macs Running Windows - An Apple PC while able to run Windows satisfactorily for most users. (When I say this, I mean users who do basic things like word processing, and checking their email.) BUT, for gaming, they can't compete, because you can't really customize your hardware, and you will ALWAYS see better straight up performance on a custom built machine.

The price difference between Macs and PC's is still unacceptable, especially since Apple started using Intel parts, because now they're running VERY SIMILAR hardware.

-Razzy


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## GorillaSalsa (Jun 19, 2010)

EDIT: I don't mean to sound like I'm attacking you, Gameboypdc. You're cool in my book. I agree that Macs are quality machines, but the price premium outweighs any tangible benefits you might reap from using a mac vs. a pc.

Razzy pointed out some of the stuff, but just to hammer it home:



Gameboypdc said:


> A Mac is 99.9% safe from viruses, spyware and malicious threats that flood the internet these days. This is not a argument for all you PC users.



It most certainly is an argument. The vast majority of security to be found with a mac lies in it's relative obscurity. As PCWorld notes:



> Let's be completely clear: there are absolutely no technical barriers preventing worms or viruses from infecting the Mac platform. A cursory review of Apple's own security updates will reveal a long list of vulnerabilities that a knowledgeable attacker could easily exploit in a Mac virus or worm. Some of these flaws have been public for weeks or months before Apple released fixes for them.



That said, I'm not trying to infer that macs are unsafe. PCWorld further notes in the same article:



> But despite the opportunities, we have yet to see any widespread malware for Macs; your risk of infection is essentially zero.





Gameboypdc said:


> Mac's are also equal if not better in some ways with options for software and compatibility for recording. Logic being a very user friendly professional recording daw with little to no hardware limitations, unlike M-Audio's Protools which is very picky and limited without a wallet full of cash for plugins. I know Nuendo and Cubase offer more options for audio hardware interfaces when compared to ProTools, but based on prices for the software alone, it seems like Nuendo and Cubase cost more just for the software and I don't really hear much about what plugins come bundled. Where as I can vouch for Logic having a extensive arsenal of software plugins built in. Logic also runs smooth with midi and for the longest time Protools had limited support for *not sure about Nuendo and Cubase*. Even if your not a Logic fan other software is available for Mac users. So my suggestion is use your logic *no pun intended* and invest in a safe easy to use Mac laptop or desktop for recording.



Logic is $600, Reaper is $60 and is just as capable. However, only Reaper is multi-platform.



Gameboypdc said:


> Now I know some of you would say that you can get more for your money buying a PC. While that may be true when looking at the technical details of what is in your machine before software is installed, but at least I never have to reinstall my OS, where as most PC users have to wipe drives and reinstall software and the OS every so often.



I've literally never done this on my PC, and I've owned it for over a year. I never did it on the one I owned for five years previously.



Gameboypdc said:


> Having used and own many PC computers for gaming and or recording machines I know first hand that installing a Windows OS takes quite a bit of time even with Windows 7, and after so many installs you have to contact Microsoft and have them either send you or activate CD keys for you just to allow you to install your OS again. Otherwise you have to re-purchase your OS and repeat all your updates including Direct X and reinstall all of your software. Even if you partition your OS to a faster running HD and use repair to fix or reinstall your OS you still may have affected your program directory and fixing that involves at least a few software programs needing to be reinstalled. These are just some of the many problems with PC computers that for some reason get overlooked by their cheaper price.



So the OP should spend double the money so he doesn't have to deal with a sluggish reinstall once every two years?



Gameboypdc said:


> The only drawback that I can find with a Mac is their inability to use the common freeware programs and vst's like the TSE preamp sim.


That's a pretty big drawback, man.



Gameboypdc said:


> The other issue with Mac's is the lack of support for computer games. Then again all that is squashed anyway because now due to the Intel switch from Apple users are capable of installing Windows on your Macintosh and switch between the two. Considering doing that would allow your Mac to be vulnerable to malicious attacks that effect hardware and really defeat the safety factor behind the Mac OS, but in return it would allow you a open door to both the PC and Mac world. So when you look at the price you pay for a Mac think about how user friendly and safe the OS is when compared to Windows.


Once again, why should the OP spend double the money on hardware to use the operating system he could use on a regular computer.

To the OP:

If you buy quality hardware and don't browse anywhere you wouldn't stick your dick or wallet into, you can have a PC that's just as capable and reliable as a Mac. I know because I do. I can't remember the last time I've had a virus, spyware, or anything I didn't want on there, really.


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## Razzy (Jun 19, 2010)

GorillaSalsa said:


> Razzy pointed out some of the stuff, but just to hammer it home:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



We should be friends, lol

To the OP:

I'm definitely a PC guy, but, if you're ok with the horrible, unethical price difference of a Mac, and really love Logic, which I personally do, and would buy a Mac, just for Logic, as well as the way pro tools works with a Mac, go for the Mac. The only reason not to, when looking at recording capabilities, is the ridiculous price difference.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm going to wait a bit and read up more and see how everything goes.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 20, 2010)

i would recommend a new 2010 mac book pro, i use it for protools and logic. and its great, for me being a pc user until 2 months ago, i find mac being easier to use.

just drag and drop an audio file into your session instead of file>import audio>search> etc


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## Isan (Jun 20, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> i would recommend a new 2010 mac book pro, i use it for protools and logic. and its great, for me being a pc user until 2 months ago, i find mac being easier to use.
> 
> just drag and drop an audio file into your session instead of file>import audio>search> etc



uhmm most tools i have ever used support drag and drop


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## Gameboypdc (Jun 20, 2010)

Ok well many of you all have made a good overall point which to some extent I expected, but to clarify the virus issue. Whatever reason people write viruses, the point is I can't find one not even to save my own life ,but in seconds I can find one on my PC running Windows. So no matter how you look at it a Mac is just flat out dumb proof and safe. I also think that a Mac is totally worth the extra money just for that reason.

Now I remember something being mentioned about Logic being $600 and Reaper $60 and a $60 DAW may be everything someone may need to record in a little home studio, but it's not gonna offer anywhere near what Logic offers right out of the box as far as professional recording.

Now I understand you haven't had to reinstall your OS yet... and that's great, but that's not the case for everyone. With family and friends in the tech support business including myself in the past I first hand received calls often on a daily basis dealing with customers whom suffer from malicious attacks on their PC often rendering them unable to even prevent their computer from uncontrollable restarting which at this point pretty much tells the customer that they have to start over. In some rare cases it's salvageable, but usually not. So with that said my point was, the whole potential issue can be avoided with a Mac. Oh and by all means you can find me a worm/virus or any malicious ware for my Mac please let me know because I have yet to find anything aside from just a few old stories and the same PC argument stating it's still possible. I can't agree till I see proof and ill stand by that point until proven wrong.

In regards to the gaming drawback. Yes gaming on a Mac is limited and I can go around and around on how upsetting that can be, but lets face it Mac's are work horses.Which I myself use and have used a Mac as a senior graphic designer, texture artist and concept artist for years in the video gaming industry designing and creating video games. Many if not most major production companies in the video/gaming and music industries use Mac's. They are not meant to play every multi format console game released or run every piece of best buy/newegg PC building hardware or community designed plugin or software. With all that said it's like comparing apples to oranges. Both are fruit ,but they taste totally different. Some things are better in one area that others lack and vise versa. Both can be good in their own ways.

I own a PC capable of running VST's such as TSE ,but I went ahead and purchased a ENGL E530 anyway which correct me if I'm wrong was the module the TSE preamp sim was based on. I did this knowing and planning to purchase a AxeFX Ultra which at this point in time seems to blow everything out of the water. Did I feel like I'm blowing money? No. Did I feel TSE free VST offered a equal quality sound to the physical rack hardware? No. Is that my opinion? Yes. So in that context this whole argument is based on opinion. You don't have to agree with me ,but everything I have stated here in this thread has been based off of first hand experience and the open door to prove me wrong is still always there. I understand money is most common argument from PC lovers/builders and a important factor, but so is quality and if you think a PC will take care of your needs then by all means go for it. As the OP stated "Are Macs really better for recording purposes?" and I answered so take it for what it is, just my opinion.

Overall everything i've stated in regards to drawbacks really are not that bad. I know some of you beg to differ, but again if your serious about doing music the extra cash for a Mac is a good long term investment. Don't just take my word for it. Look around, do your research and whatever your solution is I hope it works well for you.

Cheers!


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 20, 2010)

Well like almost everyone here I definitely do have the aspiration to make music in the long run and possibly make money off of it one day. I see me possibly getting a Mac as yet another tool for making music that could increase my productivity and possibly the quality of the final product. 

I really appreciate all the opinions, no matter how differing. I have a custom built PC that runs games great, so I really wouldn't need to worry about that. Not to mention that Steam is on Macs now and a bunch of games I have on Steam are compatible with Macs.

Also, I'm sure some of you know I do a lot of stuff on youtube. I know Macs are great for video editing, which as of right now I've yet to find a program that is both stable and easy to use for editing videos on PC. Hell I use Sonar 8 for my video editing right now...


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 20, 2010)

one thing to consider, portability. i can take my mac anywhere, but my desktop cant come with me.(obviously, i know)


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## Ben.Last (Jun 20, 2010)

First, let me start off with the virus thing: I've never once gotten a virus on my PC and I download torrents like a mother fucker. Never a single problem. Also, if we're talking dedicated home studio computer then there's not even any reason for it to be online.

Now, I LOVE Logic. It was the first DAW I used though so that probably has a lot to do with it. Right now I'm using FL Studio and I just haven't been able to get used to the work flow. However, I would much rather learn to use one of the many capable PC compatible DAWs out there rather than pay the retarded price that Apple charges for their computers. At this point, it's really laughable how ridiculous Apple is in their ability to shovel crap down peoples' throats and tell them that it's cake. They are honestly at the top of my list of bullshit corporations. That being said, if money were not an option, I'd suck it up and buy a mac just for the convenience of Logic (however, I'd dump every single bit of non-essential crap off of it)

There really is nothing innate about Macs that makes them better for recording. Once upon a time they were THE recording computers. Not so much anymore. Are the majority of studios still running macs? Yes. And many will be quick to point that out. However, what they'll leave out is that that percentage is dropping. Rather quickly in all likelyhood.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jun 20, 2010)

Build yourself a PC from the ground up and make it a recording beast. Even with premium components and heavy specs it'll still be cheaper than even a less powerful Mac. 

As L2S said,you really shouldn't need to go online on a studio/recording computer, so the virus issue is moot. 

Unless you're 100% dead set on Logic, I don't really see a reason to go Mac.


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## Wookieslayer (Jun 20, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Build yourself a PC from the ground up and make it a recording beast. Even with premium components and heavy specs it'll still be cheaper than even a less powerful Mac.
> 
> As L2S said,you really shouldn't need to go online on a studio/recording computer, so the virus issue is moot.
> 
> Unless you're 100% dead set on Logic, I don't really see a reason to go Mac.



OH herro...


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## Daemoniac (Jun 20, 2010)

It all depends which you prefer working with 

I have absolutely no problems with either system (PC or Mac), but as I'm a gamer too and don't have the cash to run a Mac (and because the MBP's didn't have a big enough screen...) I stuck with PC. One day I'll have both, but whatever.


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## Daemoniac (Jun 20, 2010)

Razzy said:


> You argued some points, but let me touch base with you on a couple of them.
> 
> Viruses- Virus writers are in it for the money, they scam people, to make money. If you're spending hours writing a program to make a bunch of money, who are you going to attempt to infect? Certainly not less than 20% of the market share. That is why there are no viruses for the Mac OS, not because it's actually safer, or harder to crack, but because the malware just is not written for it.
> 
> ...


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## CFB (Jun 20, 2010)

Demoniac said:


> It all depends which you prefer working with



This x1000000

A recording computer is not ment to be a gaming computer, not something you use to browse the web or something so store your photos and music on. If you like Mac buy a mac. If you like PC buy a PC.

One platform isn't better then the other because they do diffrent things well. Buy what you like, not what other people like.


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## Fred (Jun 20, 2010)

Gameboypdc said:


> So in that context this whole argument is based on opinion. You don't have to agree with me ,but everything I have stated here in this thread has been based off of first hand experience and the open door to prove me wrong is still always there.



Of course it is, but I'm not sure how seriously I can be expected to take your opinion when you can go from horrendously sweeping generalisations like this...



Gameboypdc said:


> at least I never have to reinstall my OS, where as most PC users have to wipe drives and reinstall software and the OS every so often.



...to back-pedalling, self-evident statements like this:



Gameboypdc said:


> Now I understand you haven't had to reinstall your OS yet... and that's great, but that's not the case for everyone.



I've been running and maintaining PCs at home and at work since we first got a 95 machine back in 97 or thereabouts, and out of those dozens of machines I've not once had to reinstall my OS, nor had to wipe a drive. Provided you have some incredibly basic know-how, it is phenomenally easy to avoid issues that would make it necessary to do so.

I have no beef with Macs aside from the pricing and the incredibly limited choice of models and specs, but I have plenty with misplaced and misleading generalisations.


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## ZXIIIT (Jun 20, 2010)

I have both,

Mac is used for recording (mixing, mastering) going online, storing pics and band videos.
PC is used only for EZDrummer, Fruity Loops, Goldwave, guitar pro, photoshop, movie maker and storing music.


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## TimothyLeary (Jun 20, 2010)

my fear with pc's is this:







So I stay with mac..


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## wlfers (Jun 22, 2010)

Gameboypdc said:


> So no matter how you look at it a Mac is just flat out dumb proof and safe. I also think that a Mac is totally worth the extra money just for that reason.



Whoaaa hold up now. Dumb proof and safe? I myself have always owned a PC, but speaking about all my friends who have macs, iphones (and even i have an ipod) Macs are totally "unsafe" in that they're interface is so locked in and software controlled.

How many times has your ipod become unusable until you plugged it back in to a computer once you got home? Same with the Iphone, software crash, no way to remove a f*ing battery just to reset it if it locks up and the soft reset doesn't work. Now one could be stuck in the middle of nowhere no cellphone no gas to get home. Macbook? 2x I've seen a weird crash that rendered the laptop useless until taken to a macstore where they reset everything. 

My PC laptop? Has a soft reset, the ability to take out and replace the batter myself, a battery drain option, oh look I can actually open the back and diagnose each hardware piece physically one by one without voiding warranty... etc. Something doesn't work? I go to the nearest frys(or newegg) and replace it. 

Its not necessarily a bad thing that pc's aren't Idiot proof. The open nature of the pc, which to you seems a negative thing, is amazing in that I have a universe of options!


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## Customisbetter (Jun 22, 2010)

I'm not going into which is better argument because it depends on the user.

I will say that i myself require both for various reasons, and enjoy recording on both platforms.

BTW Im using Logic Pro Mac-side and Reaper PC-wise.

Addins are SSD and EZD


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## theperfectcell6 (Jun 22, 2010)

One thing I've had to face with my Mac is the fact that there are so many awesome .dll's out there and Macs don't support them. Other than that fact, its awesome! I have both Logic 9 and Ableton Live and they run great! If you are doing video editing too, I'd go with the Mac. But its needed to say you can get a sweet windows setup for a lot cheaper. I'm an Apple fanboi so I would say go Mac all the way, and get an Apogee One interface, they are awesome lil guys! I'd be surprised if you were dissapointed.


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## synrgy (Jun 22, 2010)

I can't say anything that hasn't already been said, really. It truly just boils down to the preference of the user. There is essentially *nothing* hardware specific on either side that would give you any true advantages over the other.

That said, my big issue with macs is based on personal experience, and is thus: When something does go wrong (and no matter what kind of computer you get, mac or pc or other, something WILL go wrong) on the mac, as a user you are very, VERY limited in your abilities to troubleshoot and/or find resolution. There's no BIOS to speak of. My safety-net with PC is that I've been working with it for most of my life and am generally able to intuit solutions when necessary even if I don't know them right off the bat. I can't apply those skills to Mac because they simply don't offer those kinds of tools to the user.

When I lived in Hawaii, I did all my music work on an iMac G4, and it was the single worst computing experience of my life. I had a bad OS install, such that I could not drag icons *at all*, and if you understand OSX, you know that not being able to drag is tantamount to complete uselessness. To make matters worse, the same bugs in our OSX install were such that it absolutely refused to let me format the hard drive or reinstall OSX from scratch. It would just freeze mid-process or not allow me said process in the first place. It was total misery.

Further, my ex girlfriend, who really only uses her computers for word processing, email, and World of Warcraft, managed to burn through 3 macbook pros in as many years. That's is just fucking asinine. All 3 suffered simultaneous hard drive/battery/lcd screen failures. I didn't think that was physically possible, much less 3 times in a row.

The other guitar player in my band bought a macbook pro 2 years ago, and 1 year ago the lcd screen completely failed. He took it to the Mac store and they told him he'd have to spend $1200 to replace the screen -- about the same as a new laptop outright.

So, while there's *technically* no advantage one way or the other, my personal experience would still try to steer you towards PC. That's just my experience though, and I know I'm in the minority there.


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## theperfectcell6 (Jun 22, 2010)

athawulf said:


> How many times has your ipod become unusable until you plugged it back in to a computer once you got home? Same with the Iphone, software crash, no way to remove a f*ing battery just to reset it if it locks up and the soft reset doesn't work. Now one could be stuck in the middle of nowhere no cellphone no gas to get home. Macbook? 2x I've seen a weird crash that rendered the laptop useless until taken to a macstore where they reset everything.


 
The newer generation Apple gear has gotten a lot better with these kind of problems. My old iPods acted up as well as my old iMac, which are probably from about '05. Now I have a Macbook Pro, iMac, and iPod that have never been a problem whatsoever. So where you are somewhat right, they are becoming more and more reliable in this field.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 22, 2010)

theperfectcell6 said:


> One thing I've had to face with my Mac is the fact that there are so many awesome .dll's out there and Macs don't support them. Other than that fact, its awesome! I have both Logic 9 and Ableton Live and they run great! If you are doing video editing too, I'd go with the Mac. But its needed to say you can get a sweet windows setup for a lot cheaper. I'm an Apple fanboi so I would say go Mac all the way, and get an Apogee One interface, they are awesome lil guys! I'd be surprised if you were dissapointed.



Well you know me, I'm always posting vids on youtube haha. 

I'm still in a debate stage. I took my 8 string to a Guitar Center yesterday and they offered me $350 for it...I felt insulted, but understand why they offered such a low price (not an in demand instrument/certain demographic of players use them, not your average guitarist)


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## Cancer (Jun 22, 2010)

Probably said already, but you can run Windows on your Mac, while its very difficult (but not impossible) to do the reverse. It's like having two computers for the price of one.


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## synrgy (Jun 22, 2010)

Cancer said:


> Probably said already, but you can run Windows on your Mac, while its very difficult (but not impossible) to do the reverse. It's like having two computers for the price of one.



That was already tackled, yes. And it's not really accurate, either.

Sure, mac *can* run windows now, but not at the level of processing power you need to run audio apps reliably. Word processing, email, fine. Not 16 tracks of 24 bit audio at 192Khz, though.


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## asmegin_slayer (Jun 22, 2010)

Macs and Pc's do great for recording.

Just a matter of which platform you prefer.

I went out on a limb and spent almost 2k on Imac when they released it back in 08. After getting used to the OS I was really impressed and hooked on it. The line 6 software loaded up perfectly for what I needed to do and recording was a sinch with Logic pro. Its no cheap plastic computer, this is a well designed computer with a aluminum casing.

Don't let price get in the way over quality.


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## Ben.Last (Jun 22, 2010)

theperfectcell6 said:


> The newer generation Apple gear has gotten a lot better with these kind of problems. My old iPods acted up as well as my old iMac, which are probably from about '05. Now I have a Macbook Pro, iMac, and iPod that have never been a problem whatsoever. So where you are somewhat right, they are becoming more and more reliable in this field.



I have had issues with my iphone and itunes on a fairly regular basis. I'm on my 2nd iphone because the first one bricked during a simple sync (my sister has one as well and it wouldn't sync at all). Itunes refuses to update normally. I don't know if I'd say their issues are any worse than any other brand. The problem is they've put this ideal out there that they're so easy, simple and damn near invincible and it's not true. Not to mention that they've created a pretty shitty situation for those who DO end up having issues both in customer service and the customer's ability to troubleshoot on their own.



asmegin_slayer said:


> Its no cheap plastic computer, this is a well designed computer with a aluminum casing.
> 
> Don't let price get in the way over quality.



Ummm... my PC has an aluminum case and is more powerful that a Mac that would cost twice as much. That's the great thing about PCs, you're not limited to the 6 middle of the road models that Best Buy stocks.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 22, 2010)

That's actually great to know that Line6 stuff works really well with it, because I'm pretty much stuck with my Pod/toneport for right now. 

Again, I really appreciate all the opinions on both platforms. Seeing that I have a rather powerful desktop at the moment, things like gaming are no matter if I get a Macbook Pro. 

You'll all know soon enough if I decide to buy one or not haha


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## asmegin_slayer (Jun 22, 2010)

Lern2swim said:


> I have had issues with my iphone and itunes on a fairly regular basis. I'm on my 2nd iphone because the first one bricked during a simple sync (my sister has one as well and it wouldn't sync at all). Itunes refuses to update normally. I don't know if I'd say their issues are any worse than any other brand. The problem is they've put this ideal out there that they're so easy, simple and damn near invincible and it's not true. Not to mention that they've created a pretty shitty situation for those who DO end up having issues both in customer service and the customer's ability to troubleshoot on their own.



I hate itunes, but can't say I never had a problem syncing.





Lern2swim said:


> Ummm... my PC has an aluminum case and is more powerful that a Mac that would cost twice as much. That's the great thing about PCs, you're not limited to the 6 middle of the road models that Best Buy stocks.



I'm sorry i forgot to mention the imac has a built in computer inside a giant screen that barely over 2 inches. Plus still able to upgrade the ram/hard drive and video card if you wish. 

Sure your computer may cost less. But I'm quite happy not worrying about reinstalling windows once a year and install individual drivers, running antivirus/sypware crap that takes up resources.

OH MY GOD, I MISS MY PC!


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## Ben.Last (Jun 22, 2010)

asmegin_slayer said:


> I'm sorry i forgot to mention the imac has a built in computer inside a giant screen that barely over 2 inches. Plus still able to upgrade the ram/hard drive and video card if you wish.



I have mine plugged into a 34 inch lcd hdtv. 

Also, I call into question the logic of having everything built into the monitor. They don't do it with DVD players (well, they do, but only for cheap, no name crap TVs) and such, why would I want it with my computer? (I always loved having to catch my CDs when the shot out of the side of the monitor when I was using a Mac for Logic in class too. Haha)



asmegin_slayer said:


> Sure your computer may cost less. But I'm quite happy not worrying about reinstalling windows once a year and install individual drivers, running antivirus/sypware crap that takes up resources.



The myth about having to reinstall windows once a year is just that, a myth. This is proven. Go to Lifehacker to find the data. If someone pumps their PC full of crap it may help, but it's never necessary. Also, the fact that my PC does have more power at half the cost means that I have resources to spare for that antivirus program. Not to mention, if you're on the net, PC or Mac, you'd be a fool not to have some kind of antivirus software. So... really... all moot points.


Anyway, this probably isn't helping the OP whatsoever


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## Zami77 (Jun 22, 2010)

Lots of good arguments on both sides. Im personally a PC man, but i'd love to try a mac. The only thing stopping me is the ridiculous price. As many others have said, you can pay half the price and get double the power. The deals get even better if you build your own PC (which is what im planning to do very soon.) Also, PC is reliable as long as you don't go on shady sites *cough* porn *cough*. In the end, go with whatever you want. To the OP, Id recommend getting a really good PC and just disabling the wireless card, and only using it for updates. Then, the viruses are just a moot point.

p.s. Just a thought, but it seems a lot more people are getting macs now because they're so safe, however, once a lot of people get the macs, they're going to start getting viruses, and those high prices wont hold up at all!


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## asmegin_slayer (Jun 22, 2010)

Lern2swim said:


> I have mine plugged into a 34 inch lcd hdtv.
> 
> Also, I call into question the logic of having everything built into the monitor. They don't do it with DVD players (well, they do, but only for cheap, no name crap TVs) and such, why would I want it with my computer? (I always loved having to catch my CDs when the shot out of the side of the monitor when I was using a Mac for Logic in class too. Haha)



I get your viewpoint and we can agree to disagree. I just think that apple does a great job designing there software to work great for there hardware.



Lern2swim said:


> Not to mention, if you're on the net, PC or Mac, you'd be a fool not to have some kind of antivirus software. So... really... all moot points.



Can you point to a recent mac virus? Because I haven't ran one for over 2 years and never encountered one.



Lern2swim said:


> Anyway, this probably isn't helping the OP whatsoever



yup


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## Winspear (Jun 22, 2010)

I've been running PC for years - I've never had any serious issues at all. PSU has gone a few times but I know Mac users who have various problems just as frequently so...

PC is cheaper, performs just as well from my experience as a Mac. 

I prefer the interface of a PC.

The only plus I see of a Mac is that I'd expect it's easier to get all the hardware set up properly etc. for audio work. Though I'm only guessing that - I've never set up a Mac.

Replaced my old desktop with a custom made ADK audio laptop this week. 
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/computers-electronics-it-and-gaming/122250-neld.html

8GB RAM, 500GB HDD, i5 2.4Ghz, 17", 64 bit - £1350. (I payed another 300 ontop of that for shipping and customs from the U.S).

Now if you wanted a Mac...
Apple (United Kingdom) - Mac - Which MacBook is right for you? - Comparison Chart
£1900 and your losing 4GB RAM.

The answer is simple in my eyes, unless you want Logic, which is fully understandable


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## Yaris (Jun 22, 2010)

Am I the only one here who records with a hackintosh? I built it for about $400 and it runs Garageband and Logic flawlessly. Best of both worlds


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 22, 2010)

Please, do explain!


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## Yaris (Jun 22, 2010)

Well, the legality is questionable, but I will let it be know that I bought copies of all the software I use. I don't feel like it would be best to go into detail here. Google is your friend.


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## wlfers (Jun 23, 2010)

theperfectcell6 said:


> The newer generation Apple gear has gotten a lot better with these kind of problems. My old iPods acted up as well as my old iMac, which are probably from about '05. Now I have a Macbook Pro, iMac, and iPod that have never been a problem whatsoever. So where you are somewhat right, they are becoming more and more reliable in this field.



I don't know where the somewhat right comes in, if there is a problem, its a simply a problem. And I dont know how newer generation you're speaking of, at least in terms of iphones. 2 close friends of mines had theirs crap out, one purchased last december and one not 3 months ago.

As is the general consensus of this thread, it boils down to personal preference. I will stand by my pc, maybe unfairly due to the fact that I'm used to it, but also because if anything goes wrong I'm open to way more troubleshooting options and less expensive replacement parts.


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## El Caco (Jun 23, 2010)

athawulf said:


> Whoaaa hold up now. Dumb proof and safe? I myself have always owned a PC, but speaking about all my friends who have macs, iphones (and even i have an ipod) Macs are totally "unsafe" in that they're interface is so locked in and software controlled.
> 
> How many times has your ipod become unusable until you plugged it back in to a computer once you got home? Same with the Iphone, software crash, no way to remove a f*ing battery just to reset it if it locks up and the soft reset doesn't work. Now one could be stuck in the middle of nowhere no cellphone no gas to get home. Macbook? 2x I've seen a weird crash that rendered the laptop useless until taken to a macstore where they reset everything.
> 
> ...



Never and we have 6 iPods in this house, they have the occasional app crash which does no harm and you just reload it. The interface on a Mac is not locked in, OS X and iOS are not the same thing. OS X and iOS are both very idiot proof however.

If you have Apple Care and something goes wrong with your Mac, you don't need to go anywhere, they come to you. I could change battery and RAM in my Macbook Pro myself, if they have now changed it to someone else replacing the defective part for less than the price it would cost me to purchase that part it is a welcome change. However if it is under warranty why would I want to diagnose the issue myself, go to the shop and buy the part myself and then install that part myself if I can have someone do all of that for me for free?



synrgy said:


> That was already tackled, yes. And it's not really accurate, either.
> 
> Sure, mac *can* run windows now, but not at the level of processing power you need to run audio apps reliably. Word processing, email, fine. Not 16 tracks of 24 bit audio at 192Khz, though.



Rubbish, I ran Windows on my iMac and it ran better than any other Windows PC I have owned however I don't see the point of buying a Mac and then paying for a copy of Windows to install on it, it's not worth it for me and I choose to live without windows.

As you can tell from my post so far I like Macs and I'm not going to get any further into the Mac vs PC thing at this time, I'm over answering all the "Macs are more/too expensive" BULLSHIT and all the other ignorant crap that gets spread by fanbois in both camps. All I want to add to this thread is the Windows VST thing again, I prefer Macs, I avoid Windows but if I was getting a new computer for the purpose of recording I might be going for Windows over a Mac just because I am unable to use the Windows VST's I want to use on a Mac.


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## TreWatson (Jun 23, 2010)

I'd say invest in an Apple developer's License ( just so that it's legal for you to tinker with their system, they're a couple hundred bucks, but i'm not so sure what the policy is on it these days anymore)

then go to Newegg,while looking up The OSX86 project, purchase powerful parts that are OSX86 compatible, and then build your own hackintosh.

My Dell inspiron 1525 was a hackintosh before the motherboard fried due to a recall i got to way too late, so now i have a DEAD hackintosh.

but i would recommend looking into it, buying the parts and installing OSX actually worked incredibly well, and i basically had a computer more powerful than a standard mac G5 for a little more than half the price(couldnt afford to buy/build though  ). I was considering doing it on my Desktop too, since Windows 7 is running like Crap and I no longer do any kind of Gaming on it.

just something to think about to kind of circumvent some costs, but still get you a mac, if you want it


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## DomitianX (Jun 23, 2010)

There is something to say about what DAW you are using and hardware compatibility.

If you troll the Digi forums, there are a ton of dudes that have issues with certain PCs and incompatibilities with certain firewire cards, certain chipsets, etc.

I have a friend that is running into that right now. He bought a Digi003 rack and is having random weird issues and its boiling down to hardware. He hooked it up to a MacPro and his issues went away.

Apparently the Dell computer he bought has a TI chipset which is recommended for Firewire stability, but its the wrong version of TI chipset or something goofy.

If you are going to stick with Cubase or Sonar you should be safe on just about any PC with a proper firewire card, but if you plan to maybe make a career out of it and plan to move to Digi since its a pretty standard platform in most studios, you may want to look at a Mac. Troll the forums and count the number of posts about problems with PCs compared to the problems with Macs and its clear Digi is more stable on a Mac. Not that its any better, but because Apple does a good job of standard hardware there are less variables to the number of weird hardware that Digi needs to deal with.

Cut your teeth in Sonar/Cubase, learn the basics like micing cabs, getting a quality signal in and all the other basics and if you feel you want to maybe get a gig doing production work, think about making the jump to the Mac side. Or do some serious research to make sure whatever hardware you buy is 100% compatible.

Myself I love Logic so I will be 100% Mac for my recording. I ran Sonar for a few years, but once I played with Logic for a while I made the switch.


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## TreWatson (Jun 23, 2010)

asmegin_slayer said:


> I'm sorry i forgot to mention the imac has a built in computer inside a giant screen that barely over 2 inches.


also just wanting to point out, that after walking into my local HHgregg like a month ago, PCs have that too.


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## ephrion (Jun 23, 2010)

Absolutely not.

EDIT:

I mean, I could write a lot about why Macs aren't any better. But there isn't any point. A computer is a computer. An Apple computer is extremely limited and extremely expensive. A Windows computer is dirt cheap and has vastly more options. If you want an Apple and are prepared to pay the upcharge, by all means, do so. But if you've never used one before and don't have literally thousands of extra dollars to blow on a brand name, Windows is the obvious choice for audio.


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## yacker (Jun 23, 2010)

First, I'm a member on several forums that just lock these sorts of threads immediately because it becomes a flame war. It's pretty inevitable. I could go on and on about my opinion, but who cares. There was one thing that I just couldn't overlook though.



MorbidTravis said:


> one thing to consider, portability. i can take my mac anywhere, but my desktop cant come with me.(obviously, i know)



I'm sorry man, but was this really meant to be an argument? There are pc laptops there are mac laptops. There are mac desktops there are pc desktops. I don't get where you're coming from there.


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## shredfreak (Jun 23, 2010)

Personally can't see the point of going mac at all. Way too expensive & too limitied since i use a lot of freeware vst plugins.

Problem with pc's is that there are tons of manufacturers for hardware wich increase the chance of issue's if you don't know what you're doing. So it's best to research thourougly when building your own machine.

OS reinstalling is entirely dependant of your own use really. I never had a virus or anything on my system but i know ppl that download torrent's a lot who do.

Honestly can't see the benifit that a mac would have. Given a properly specced computer it should smoke a similar mac in terms of performace & stability.


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 23, 2010)

I've got a PC sitting in my room right now that isnt done(re-building with old/new parts, just a weaker system than what I use now)

I might look into making it a W7 64 bit with 4gb of ram for recording purposes, we'll see.


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## Ewan (Jun 23, 2010)

I just bought a second hand Macbook pro. Yeah, it was £700 but it's got a core 2 duo 2.2GHz, 2GB RAM and 120 GB HDD, i.e it's easily powerful enought to run Logic, which I'm buying tomorrow. The cheapest new equivalent mac is £1500, slightly higher spec but nothing that will make it more useful or more able to run Logic.
If your going to run a DAW, specs are largely useless, buy whatever will run the software you want to run. You don't need the latest machine.
I've already got a PC so I could have persevered with that, but I've recently upgraded to windows 7 and my Logic 5.5 ( the last PC version of Logic) isn't working flawlessly with this, and neither is my sound card. It was starting to fall over on my current PC anyway (it had too much RAM) So now I'm biting the bulet. I haven't got time to learn a whole new DAW.
Definately look around for a second hand Mac, especially if you've already got a PC.


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## wlfers (Jun 23, 2010)

s7eve said:


> Never and we have 6 iPods in this house, they have the occasional app crash which does no harm and you just reload it. The interface on a Mac is not locked in, OS X and iOS are not the same thing. OS X and iOS are both very idiot proof however.
> 
> If you have Apple Care and something goes wrong with your Mac, you don't need to go anywhere, they come to you. I could change battery and RAM in my Macbook Pro myself, if they have now changed it to someone else replacing the defective part for less than the price it would cost me to purchase that part it is a welcome change. However if it is under warranty why would I want to diagnose the issue myself, go to the shop and buy the part myself and then install that part myself if I can have someone do all of that for me for free?



Once again I don't see how "Never" and Occasionally" align. I'm not saying ipods suck (although itunes might ), just I get rather annoyed at products with no hard reset option. 

Also I wouldn't be content only being able to access just the battery and ram. My laptop gives me full access to my cd drives, both graphics processors, harddisk, ram, cpu, etc etc. Last year I had a problem with flickering running two gpu's in SLI- cracked open the bottom, removed the bridge and done deal. Didn't have to bring it in nor did I void any warranty. 

That's great that you keep warranties on your laptops, is it free the first year then 100$ per consecutive year? I tend to have long term relationships with my computers and the only hardware maintenance (not including personal upgrades) I've ever had to do required no replacement parts, driving my computer anywhere (except to the gas station to use the air hose to clean dust out of my old old comp).


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## shredfreak (Jun 23, 2010)

AlucardXIX said:


> I've got a PC sitting in my room right now that isnt done(re-building with old/new parts, just a weaker system than what I use now)
> 
> I might look into making it a W7 64 bit with 4gb of ram for recording purposes, we'll see.



Do need to keep in mind that some of the older recording interfaces don't really match well with 64 bit though. Friend of mine has a tascam & it crashes a lot when using vst plugins on his 64bit. Used it on mine (32bit) & it worked great.


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## wlfers (Jun 23, 2010)

shredfreak said:


> Problem with pc's is that there are tons of manufacturers for hardware wich increase the chance of issue's if you don't know what you're doing. So it's best to research thourougly when building your own machine.



That's one thing that did annoy me, that a certain brand graphics card could have separate manufacturers. But it also has a benefit in that there are so many options for me to check out when they aren't so costly.


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## asmegin_slayer (Jun 23, 2010)

shredfreak said:


> Honestly can't see the benifit that a mac would have. Given a properly specced computer it should smoke a similar mac in terms of performace & stability.



If you compared a PC windows machine and a Mac Windows machine I'll like to see that. But both platforms are written entirely different. And I'm a firm believer that Software drives hardware!

Also, its funnny that there have been reports from people that OSX runs better on PC hardware and Windows runs better on Mac hardware...


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## El Caco (Jun 23, 2010)

athawulf said:


> Once again I don't see how "Never" and Occasionally" align. I'm not saying ipods suck (although itunes might ), just I get rather annoyed at products with no hard reset option.



The never was in response to the ridiculous claim that iPods freeze all the time and can only be remedied by connecting to your computer, as I said we have 6 and this has never happened. Years ago the fat iPod Nano would freeze occasionally but it could be unfrozen in a few seconds with a simple reset, since that model I have never seen an issue apart from an app crash and surely you cant hold Apple responsible for what 3rd party software does. I say it is a credit to Apple that an app can crash due to poor code and not have any negative impact beyond having to reopen the app, it is a long way from the Windows based smart phones I used to own that would have a full system crash on a daily basis with no 3rd party software at all, backup was a religion back then.


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## El Caco (Jun 23, 2010)

Oh and I will just point out that new iPods can also be reset without connecting to computer.


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## shredfreak (Jun 23, 2010)

asmegin_slayer said:


> If you compared a PC windows machine and a Mac Windows machine I'll like to see that. But both platforms are written entirely different. And I'm a firm believer that Software drives hardware!
> 
> Also, its funnny that there have been reports from people that OSX runs better on PC hardware and Windows runs better on Mac hardware...



Yeah i've heard that aswell but i've yet to see OSX run on pc & vica versa honestly. So far i've only heard rumours.

I really can't say for certain if mac would beat PC, If you both give them comparable stats, then maybe MAC can be better. BUT ... mac will ALWAYS loose to PC since their parts are a whole lot more expensive. 



Gameboypdc said:


> Ok well many of you all have made a good overall point which to some extent I expected, but to clarify the virus issue. Whatever reason people write viruses, the point is I can't find one not even to save my own life ,but in seconds I can find one on my PC running Windows. So no matter how you look at it a Mac is just flat out dumb proof and safe. I also think that a Mac is totally worth the extra money just for that reason.



Mate i'd hate to burst your bubble here but mac is nowhere near as safe as windows is at this point. The security is in fact horrible at best. Mac viruses, trojans, worms, ... are extremely hard to find solely because mac's do not sell at all. Why would anyone in his right mind write a virus for an operating system that is barely used? Knowing that most of those are written by bored college students who try to be funny & software corporations.

If the OP doesn't intend to torrent the fuck out of his system he shouldn't be worried about viruses, trojans, reinstalling his operating system every 5 months (yes that happens but more importantly is WHY does it happen) or any of that crap.



TimothyLeary said:


> my fear with pc's is this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Dude .... Are you for real???

Posting an as good as useless pic doesn't really prove anything. Apart from having a machine that isn't suited at all for real time audio handling.

I actually took the liberty of downloading that program & here is what my system looks like with it.





A lot better i would say 

Said it before really, Do your research if you're going with a PC & spec it out. Or just consult a tech who knows his shit basicly. It does take a horrible amount of time to get a kickass machine all specced out according to your budget if you need to download tons of datasheets.

I kinda went the reversed way & get the best audio interface to go with my system running reaper. Although i do recommend that when building one to already choose an interface & program to use for best results. 

Think the op's best bet atm is to screw around a bit with different DAW programs & then select the one most to his liking. I personally recommend reaper because of ease of use, customizability (it looks a bit messy standard) & low use of resources (this amazed me the most actually).

Sorry for the long post but i just despise those macboi's who think they have a better system just because it costs more . While essentially they're running a standard desktop computer not suited for audio processing at all ...


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 23, 2010)

I ran the same program and got this on my PC right now.


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## wlfers (Jun 23, 2010)

s7eve said:


> The never was in response to the ridiculous claim that iPods freeze all the time and can only be remedied by connecting to your computer, as I said we have 6 and this has never happened. Years ago the fat iPod Nano would freeze occasionally but it could be unfrozen in a few seconds with a simple reset, since that model I have never seen an issue apart from an app crash and surely you cant hold Apple responsible for what 3rd party software does. I say it is a credit to Apple that an app can crash due to poor code and not have any negative impact beyond having to reopen the app, it is a long way from the Windows based smart phones I used to own that would have a full system crash on a daily basis with no 3rd party software at all, backup was a religion back then.





s7eve said:


> Oh and I will just point out that new iPods can also be reset without connecting to computer.



Pointing out that ipods crash does not equate to a "ridiculous claim that iPods freeze all the time and can only be remedied by connecting to your computer"

You're arguing with points I've never brought up. I'm citing the facts that ipods can and do crash (just like anything else), but the part that bugs me is that there is no (keyword) hard reset for them. I'm fully aware that there is a soft reset, when this fails the options are to let the battery drain or plug it into the computer.


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## wlfers (Jun 23, 2010)

shredfreak said:


> Sorry for the long post but i just despise those macboi's who think they have a better system just because it costs more . While essentially they're running a standard desktop computer not suited for audio processing at all ...



Yeah, whenever I've heard that macs are better from acquaintances and I ask "why?" they always seem to come up short with an answer. If they want to pay extra for specs on par with my pc that's totally great for them if they dig the interface better- but i'll still be amazed each time to hear the "its better because i heard so" mindset.

After your post I'll think Ill give reaper a try, Ive been bouncing back between an old copy of sony acid I had, a sonar trial, and protools over at my old engineering gig.


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## yacker (Jun 23, 2010)

When I went shopping for a laptop I legitimately took that latency checker program around with me on a usb key and ran it on all the laptops in the stores.

I ended up buying a laptop with a return policy online, found out it had latency issues I couldn't remedy and sent it back and made the support person run it on the other model computer they were offering me before I'd accept another computer. All I can say is I'm happy that program exists.


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## asmegin_slayer (Jun 24, 2010)

shredfreak said:


> Yeah i've heard that aswell but i've yet to see OSX run on pc & vica versa honestly. So far i've only heard rumours.



Mac on PC


Windows on Mac




shredfreak said:


> I really can't say for certain if mac would beat PC, If you both give them comparable stats, then maybe MAC can be better. BUT ... mac will ALWAYS loose to PC since their parts are a whole lot more expensive.



The reason the parts are expensive is because OS X computers don't have multiple hardware manufacturers competing to make cheaper hardware, they single source the hardware from Apple. So it is more expensive. Basic economics.

Also, Apple for years has put in a lot of software already in OSX that windows doesn't/didn't offer. example: Imovie/Itunes/Garageband/Oxford American Dictionary[/QUOTE]




shredfreak said:


> Mate i'd hate to burst your bubble here but mac is nowhere near as safe as windows is at this point. The security is in fact horrible at best.



ALL OS are not safe. There is not one better then the other.



shredfreak said:


> solely because mac's do not sell at all.



I beg to differ, AppleInsider | Apple profits soar 50% on record sales of 3.36M Macs, 8.7M iPhones

Yeah OSX has a small percentage in the computer market. but you know what, thats alright.




shredfreak said:


> Said it before really, Do your research if you're going with a PC & spec it out. Or just consult a tech who knows his shit basicly. It does take a horrible amount of time to get a kickass machine all specced out according to your budget if you need to download tons of datasheets.



Hey! something that I can agree.




shredfreak said:


> Sorry for the long post but i just despise those macboi's who think they have a better system just because it costs more . While essentially they're running a standard desktop computer not suited for audio processing at all ...



I don't think any of us praised to being mac fanbois. If so, how is that anything different to you?


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## AlucardXIX (Jun 24, 2010)

yacker said:


> When I went shopping for a laptop I legitimately took that latency checker program around with me on a usb key and ran it on all the laptops in the stores.
> 
> I ended up buying a laptop with a return policy online, found out it had latency issues I couldn't remedy and sent it back and made the support person run it on the other model computer they were offering me before I'd accept another computer. All I can say is I'm happy that program exists.



That is a pretty awesome idea! Will have to keep that in mind haha.


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## MorbidTravis (Jun 24, 2010)

synrgy said:


> That was already tackled, yes. And it's not really accurate, either.
> 
> Sure, mac *can* run windows now, but not at the level of processing power you need to run audio apps reliably. Word processing, email, fine. Not 16 tracks of 24 bit audio at 192Khz, though.


what are you recording that is 192khz?


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## yacker (Jun 24, 2010)

AlucardXIX said:


> That is a pretty awesome idea! Will have to keep that in mind haha.



Yup, and the laptop I ultimately ended up with has never had dropout issues due to IRQ problems (different pieces of hardware and their drivers that don't play nicely with each other and the cpu) which is what that program checks for if memory serves me.


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## Khesahn (Jun 24, 2010)

I´ll second the hackintosh.. I Dual boot OS X snow leopard and Win XP.

But even though I use osx i mostly use cubase le 4 anyways cause i hate programming drums in piano roll >_<


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## synrgy (Jun 24, 2010)

MorbidTravis said:


> what are you recording that is 192khz?



Some of my interfaces are made to run at that level, and I get lower latency at 192 than I do at 41, 48, etc when running through those interfaces. Don't ask me to make sense of it; I just work with what my hardware/software gives me. Also, I'm not talking about _recording_ specifically; just audio generally, whether in _or_ out.

And if I didn't make it clear in my initial post -- I'm only speaking from experience. I'm not regurgitating something I heard some place, and I'm not saying my experience is common. I think I said the exact opposite, actually -- that my experience is in the minority, so far as I'm aware.


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## wlfers (Jun 25, 2010)

A little off topic, but I dled reaper and I'm digging the hell out of it this far!


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## Andromalia (Jun 25, 2010)

The MAC/PC virus debate is a wrong one. Getting a virus on your PC is a case of a faulty chair/keyboard interface.
MAC advantage was, once, SCSI. That's gone as serial ATA etc is up to or even better than SCSI now.
The only reason to buy a MAC is it's OS, or if you wanna use a mac-only software. Or want a shiny (expensive) design.


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## rectifryer (Jul 5, 2010)

^^^SATA3 FTW. 

MAC is a novelty and I dont care if someone is afraid to face that.


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## controversyking (Jul 6, 2010)

When it comes to top of the line laptops their pricing is actually fairly competitive. 

I was a hardcore Windows user who wouldn't touch a MAC... but once I started using one I've never gone back.

the OS is far superior... and everything simply... works.

Its that simple and beautiful. The integration between software is seamless, and that the fact that the software is optimized specifically for the hardware makes everything run smooth and you never have compatibility errors.

The only downside which was stated prior is that you miss out on some sweet freeware. Many new programs are coming out dual platform ( i mean we just got steam which opened a ton of doors for gaming) though which is kind of nice.

I LOVE macs for media primarily because of Final Cut. I have been playing around with Garageband some though and it is a surprisingly powerful tool. There's nothing I havent been able to do on it that I could do on ProTools LE I think (the cheapest version that came with the interface), and considering it came packaged I was impressed. Also alot of the modules built into Garage Band and Sound Track are pretty awesome. I have several types of delay, verb, compression and EQ's I get to play with for no extra charge =]


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## Marmaduke (Jul 6, 2010)

I have had my imac or about 6 months or so, and I have to say that I am absolutely loving it (especially logic 9!!!) but as controversyking has pointed out, the biggest problem is that some programs, especially freeware, won't work 

There are some really nice vst plugins out there as freeware and these don't work with logic you can only use audio units (AU) plugins which is really annoying sometimes.


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## Ben.Last (Jul 6, 2010)

10 years on PCs and I've never had compatibility errors with software. I read the requirements and if my computer has met them, the software has worked.


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## alex103188 (Jul 6, 2010)

Different strokes, man, different strokes.

I use a mac and got it used for super cheap through a friend, and it works great. I'm sure a pc would do the trick as well.

Use a pc if it makes you happier!

/thread


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## Moro (Jul 6, 2010)

PCs are cheaper and get the job done. This days, there's not much of a difference since Apple is using the same chips. Apple's pricing is just too much.

Regarding the Macs, if any of you don't want to spend extra money on a DAW, you could try Ardour instead of Logic. It's available for Linux and Mac and it can run any VST plugins. ardour - the digital audio workstation


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## 74n4LL0 (Jul 7, 2010)

I'd say go with pc...
You already have a PC, and from what you say it's quite good.
With the money of the Mac you can buy 2 PCs and there are really a lot of choices (you can get a laptop now and a fixed in 3 years or 2 fixed in 3 and 6 years).


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## AlucardXIX (Jul 7, 2010)

I actually ended up buying a Macbook Pro. I sold a bunch of odds and ends that I had for years and got myself a decent sum of money to help fund it. I've loved it since I got it. iMovie alone has made me fall in love with it, editing my youtube videos is so easy with it, much smoother than anything I've used on Windows. Once I get home from vacation I'm going to try to install Logic 9 and get to recording my album!

Thanks for all the opinions guys. I still absolutely love my PC, but I'm definitely loving this Macbook!


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## AlucardXIX (Jul 7, 2010)

Apologize for the double post, the wifi at this hotel is horrid...


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## controversyking (Jul 9, 2010)

I think the main media editing strong point for Mac's is in video editing. FAR SUPERIOR video editing at the lower end level (and arguably on the higher end as I strongly prefer Final Cut to Avid).

With music editing I think it can go either way pretty easily, as all the top of the line programs (ProTools, Superior Drummer, Pods, etc.) all work dual platform. Now, you can get into the argument of cost vs integration, but that's separate from the question asked in this thread.

Macs may get the stereotype of being better due to garage band coming pre-installed (vs nothing pre-installed on a PC), but again there's a lot of freeware out there that some will argue is almost as good. BUT, you wouldn't argue which system is superior based off of introductory software anyway, so it makes that kind of pointless.

just my


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## onpalehorse (Jul 9, 2010)

go linux bro!


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## synrgy (Jul 9, 2010)

controversyking said:


> Macs may get the stereotype of being better due to garage band coming pre-installed (vs nothing pre-installed on a PC)



Having used GarageBand, I'd rather have nothing. 

But seriously, worst music program ever. I'd rather use FruityLoops version 2.


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## Vangoatguitar (Jul 9, 2010)

Yeah I agree ^^ Garage band is terrible.


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## asmegin_slayer (Jul 9, 2010)

Meh, argue all you want about garageband. I was just happy that it immediately recognized my POD X3 and Superior with such ease. I don't think it ever really crashed on me either.


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## controversyking (Jul 9, 2010)

asmegin_slayer said:


> Meh, argue all you want about garageband. I was just happy that it immediately recognized my POD X3 and Superior with such ease. I don't think it ever really crashed on me either.





Garageband is surprisingly powerful once you dive into it. Using your keyboard as a midi controller, excellently picking up all of your AU's and VST plugins (superior, Kore player, Guitar Rig 4, Pods, etc all instantly pop up) as well as coming with a nice host of its own modules, easy editing tools, a nice midi editor (not as good as ProTools but still decent), etc. Once you set your export settings so it doesn't fail compress your files its pretty sweet. The simple looking UI made it great to learn on.

Its not Logic or ProTools, but its a powerful tool if you dive into it.


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## flawlesswarrior (Jul 9, 2010)

I dont know if this has been said yet sorry if it has but there are hacked versions of the Mac OSX out there that you can download and install to try it out before you buy it. I used to want a mac until i did this and that kinda turned me off of the whole mac thing. Plus you could see if the recording really is that much better with it. If your PC is as strong as you said you shouldn't have a problem finding one that will work for you.


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## asmegin_slayer (Jul 9, 2010)

flawlesswarrior said:


> I dont know if this has been said yet sorry if it has but there are hacked versions of the Mac OSX out there that you can download and install to try it out before you buy it. I used to want a mac until i did this and that kinda turned me off of the whole mac thing. Plus you could see if the recording really is that much better with it. If your PC is as strong as you said you shouldn't have a problem finding one that will work for you.



Yeah you can do that, but you'll have a bunch of issues when updating it. The OSX OS was meant to work specifically to the hardware that apple designed, NOT regular pc hardware.


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## ArtDecade (Jul 9, 2010)

Logic and MainStage are simply amazing. - Apple User since 1986! 
That being said, having the option to use programs on both platforms is always a plus.


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## Ben.Last (Jul 9, 2010)

asmegin_slayer said:


> Yeah you can do that, but you'll have a bunch of issues when updating it. The OSX OS was meant to work specifically to the hardware that apple designed, NOT regular pc hardware.



Except for the fact that, at this point, the hardware is the same on both (except, of course, it still costs more to get it in an Apple case)


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## El Caco (Jul 9, 2010)

You missed the point, OS X is only designed to run on specific hardware, a Mac is designed in such a way to give the user a certain experience that Windows is not designed to give, windows is simply a platform for people to give a computer instructions to perform a task. The Mac experience is more involved, Apple have considered every aspect of the customers computer experience right from the point of purchase, they try to offer the most efficient and enjoyable computer experience to every person in a way that would require a person with no experience to be able to perform the tasks they would wish to with as little training as possible and without negative consequence punishing them for their inexperience and ignorance.

To achieve this the Apple research and develop every aspect of this experience and it is a lot more involved than just an operating system, as a result the initial expense is greater. The premium for the initial expense is understood by those that understand and appreciate the Mac experience and the advantages it provides, it is simply economics and Apple users can see the value. This perception of value is also realised in second hand prices.

The fact is that stating that the hardware is the same because many of the components used by Apple are available to windows user is not reasonable and not 100% factual, for example a generic PC does not have a Mac's logic board and is forced to run using a mother board OS X was not designed to work with. You are comparing Apples and Oranges but do not realise it. The Mac is a total package, the Mac experience can only be guaranteed on Mac hardware and if ones "Mac" experience is OS X on a PC they have not really tried a Mac or OS X and are unfairly handicapping Apple in the comparison.

I'm deliberately repeating myself because this has been explained so many times and yet people don't get it, the only way to give yourself a chance at getting it is to own a mac for a period of time. So again a little different just to drive it home. A computer is harware + drivers + OS + software + security. Windows is an OS, if one chooses the build your own method it is the users responsibility to ensure that the hardware, drivers, OS and software is all compatible and will provide an optimum experience all the time, currently this is next to impossible to do. Mac is more than an OS, it is hardware + drivers + OS + security with some software and full support for developers to ensure continued software compatibility. This means a Mac is in a better position to achieve an ongoing optimal experience. This means higher initial costs. The higher initial costs are offset by lower ongoing costs and reduced costs in other areas. Either systems total cost may work out cheaper depending on the individuals needs when the total cost is measured over a period of time.

So either system can be more expensive when all costs are factored and for many people the total expense will close with either choice. The final choice should come down to what you feel more comfortable or enjoy using more. Both systems have advantages and disadvantages but for the purpose of answering the original question one more time even though it has been answered a number of times already. For a recording only machine Windows has some advantages which are silly to ignore unless you are a fan of Logic. This final statement is just my opinion, if you are a fan of Logic or like me a fan of Macs in general and if you are serious about home recording you are best off having a second windows machine connected to your Mac for the advantages that have been mentioned. Yes you can run Windows on a Mac but if you wish to record in Logic and use windows based software and VST's that are not available on a Mac is is better to have a separate Windows PC as an audio processing device, but that is just my opinion on what an optimal setup would be.


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## AlucardXIX (Jul 9, 2010)

I really enjoy my Macbook Pro. Yes the original price was a bit steep, but as a laptop, I honestly dont know if I could enjoy a Windows laptop. The ease of use with the trackpad is awesome. Garageband is simple enough to do some basic audio editing in, and iMovie has changed how I do videos for youtube. I'll wait to try Final Cut until I reach the limits of iMovie.


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## controversyking (Jul 10, 2010)

AlucardXIX said:


> I really enjoy my Macbook Pro. Yes the original price was a bit steep, but as a laptop, I honestly dont know if I could enjoy a Windows laptop. The ease of use with the trackpad is awesome. Garageband is simple enough to do some basic audio editing in, and iMovie has changed how I do videos for youtube. I'll wait to try Final Cut until I reach the limits of iMovie.



*off topic of the thread*

The cheaper Final Cut Express is actually still pretty good if you ever chose to upgrade* Especially for the $180 it costs.  I honestly rarely use any of the extras that come with Studio vs Express so don't feel like you have to go big there. Once you switch though, you'll start questioning how you ever could've used anything less in the first place!!


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