# Ibanez 2019 New Stuff



## Sogradde

I'm actually surprised Mathias didn't open this thread but well. Winter NAMM is coming and it's about time we start speculating, look at new stuff and cringe over black guitars with brown fretboards.

First new model is online on the homepage: FRIX6FDQM (Iron Label)


Looks kinda neat but after all these years I still think the regular Ibanez headstock does not fit to the FR. Something softer would suit it much better, maybe even the AZ headstock.

There is also a new limited series coming (probably Japan only?) the Gold Collection:


Not exactly my cup of tea but some 80s shredder dude will probably drool over either of those.

Last but not least, I saw a new J. Custom on Instagram, which had a really cool resin top: JCRG1801


I like those resin woodwork thingies, no matter how cheesy they are. Even better if someone builds LEDs into it to make it glow. 

It's also noteworthy that Rich of Ibanez Rules dropped a cryptic "11/1" on the Jemsite forum. I don't know if that means "November 1st" which would make sense but nothing happened on November 1st, or January 11th. We'll see I guess. I also heard rumors about Ibanez adding more Fishmans but those could be wrong.


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## PunkBillCarson

Oh my God... I love that finish, please tell me I'm not the only one.


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## RiksRiks

Non of those tickle my fancy but anyways...
Following in case there are new colors for AZ2402.


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## guitaardvark

I'm really not a fan of gradients like on that FR but damn that thing is beautiful.


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## Hollowway

I’d normally ask, “do you think they’ll come out with an 8 string trem?” But I know that’s like high school me asking, “do you think she’ll call me?”


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## prlgmnr

I'll look forward to these getting to shops in the UK just in time for me to get distracted by next years NAMM offerings.


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## LordHar

That gold collection will also be available in Europe.


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## Seabeast2000

Thanks Soggrade. Subscribed.


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## Restarted

I really don't need another OD, but that gold TS9 is calling my name. Thankfully no money, no space on board, and no outputs on power supply are left.


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## cardinal

Hollowway said:


> I’d normally ask, “do you think they’ll come out with an 8 string trem?” But I know that’s like high school me asking, “do you think she’ll call me?”



That would be awesome. The current 852MPB has been around for a while (two years, I think?), so I'm kind of expecting the 852MPB to get the axe, but I'm also somewhat worried that it won't be replaced with another Prestige 8-string. I sure hope it'll be replaced with something new, even if just a new finish. Of course a Lo Pro 8 would be magnificent. Don't know why 8-string trems seem to be so niche.


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## Seabeast2000

Alluding to some kind of us semi custom operation over on jemsite maybe?


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## Kyle Jordan

Ibanez doing an ESP USA type deal would make me fail No Fap November without touch. 

One can dream.


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## cardinal

Kyle Jordan said:


> Ibanez doing an ESP USA type deal would make me fail No Fap November without touch.
> 
> One can dream.



The guy who started the LACS is now building on his own: Mike Lipe. I have one of his 7 strings, and he is fantastic (even called me a few times to make sure everything was good). So it won't say Ibanez on the headstock, but if you want some of that LACS magic: Mike Lipe is the way to go.


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## Kyle Jordan

cardinal said:


> The guy who started the LACS is now building on his own: Mike Lipe. I have one of his 7 strings, and he is fantastic (even called me a few times to make sure everything was good). So it won't say Ibanez on the headstock, but if you want some of that LACS magic: Mike Lipe is the way to go.



I saw you mention him elsewhere here and put his name in my “Potential Builders” folder. I’m still eyeing the RG852M as a mod platform.


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## cardinal

Kyle Jordan said:


> I saw you mention him elsewhere here and put his name in my “Potential Builders” folder. I’m still eyeing the RG852M as a mod platform.



The 852 is awesome. Lipe makes 8 strings too, but his build will be a good bit more expensive than finding a used 852 to work with if you're ok with the basic 852 confines.


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## Kaura

That solid gold RG is straight out of my dreams.


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## KnightBrolaire

that fr is the tits


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## bnzboy

goddamn


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## Bloody_Inferno

I've played that FR, and it's one of the better Iron Labels I've tried out. It's taken a long time for the line to get more consistent with quality so I'm glad the model I played was good. 

It's also made me reconsider my stance towards gradient finishes.


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## Sogradde

The906 said:


> Alluding to some kind of us semi custom operation over on jemsite maybe?


Are you referring to the comment made by Rich? I would love an Ibanez semi-custom shop but Rich recently had a limited run done for his shop (similar to the Axe Palace runs) and I think that is the extent of his influence.

Personally I hope for more RG652AHM models. I like the current line-up but there is nothing in there that screams my name (yet). I'd also like more S prestiges.


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## cardinal

In response to an Instagram question over a 7-string AZ, officialibanezguitars responded something like "we'll have to see!" I presume they would have just ignored the question if there was zero chance of a 7-string AZ, but obviously they could just be stirring the pot.


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## Seabeast2000

Sogradde said:


> Are you referring to the comment made by Rich? I would love an Ibanez semi-custom shop but Rich recently had a limited run done for his shop (similar to the Axe Palace runs) and I think that is the extent of his influence.
> 
> Personally I hope for more RG652AHM models. I like the current line-up but there is nothing in there that screams my name (yet). I'd also like more S prestiges.



Yeah, that thread. Not sure so much his influence as his intel at work but I don't know. This is pre-NAMM hype season so its fun for the fun of it. 
There are at least 2 current 652s and the SW exclusive 657 I'd grab if I could justify it before outletting some other stuff first.


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## Albake21

From the Ibanez wiki about the JCRG1801.

"A certificate of authenticity is included with each guitar. It's believed that only three examples were produced for Japan. It's unclear how many are being produced for other markets, but the number is presumably quite small."


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## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> From the Ibanez wiki about the JCRG1801.
> 
> "A certificate of authenticity is included with each guitar. It's believed that only three examples were produced for Japan. It's unclear how many are being produced for other markets, but the number is presumably quite small."



Sugi made too, which is a first.


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## Ordacleaphobia

That JC is megatits and potentially worth debt if more than a couple show up stateside.

Usually not a fan of the FR shape but something about this one just comes off as more appealing to me, must be the finish. Hopefully this is a good year for Ibanez, it's been a couple of years since they've wow'd me with new stuff.


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## Albake21

Oh one more thing, a little bird told me that Ibanez plans to bring back the RG XL series. Just thought I'd throw that out there. I have no idea if it will be this year, but they are working on it.


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## Seabeast2000

Albake21 said:


> Oh one more thing, a little bird told me that Ibanez plans to bring back the RG XL series. Just thought I'd throw that out there. I have no idea if it will be this year, but they are working on it.



School me, is this a baritone?


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## Albake21

The906 said:


> School me, is this a baritone?


27" scale


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## Seabeast2000

Albake21 said:


> 27" scale



Well that would be swell.


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## bnzboy

Albake21 said:


> Oh one more thing, a little bird told me that Ibanez plans to bring back the RG XL series. Just thought I'd throw that out there. I have no idea if it will be this year, but they are working on it.



It would be sweet if they bring it back as MIJ


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## Ordacleaphobia

bnzboy said:


> It would be sweet if they bring it back as MIJ



Please stop before I psych myself up for something that won't happen.


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## Sogradde

Albake21 said:


> Oh one more thing, a little bird told me that Ibanez plans to bring back the RG XL series. Just thought I'd throw that out there. I have no idea if it will be this year, but they are working on it.


That'd be so rad! One of the guys from KoRn used to play an RG1077XL with white PUs and white potis. That exact guitar got me hooked up to 7-strings.
However, wouldn't that interfere with RGD sales?


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## Ordacleaphobia

Sogradde said:


> That'd be so rad! One of the guys from KoRn used to play an RG1077XL with white PUs and white potis. That exact guitar got me hooked up to 7-strings.
> However, wouldn't that interfere with RGD sales?



They may just cannibalize it. I really don't see why the RGD line needs to exist if there are XL variants.


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## Sogradde

Ordacleaphobia said:


> They may just cannibalize it. I really don't see why the RGD line needs to exist if there are XL variants.


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## Andromalia

A gold RG would be sexy, I suppose it's going to be a stupidly priced limited edition ?


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## Leviathus

I'm hopin for a new JEM/UV, bout time for a fresh model.


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## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> They may just cannibalize it. I really don't see why the RGD line needs to exist if there are XL variants.


Call me crazy, but I definitely notice a difference between 26.5" and 27" scale. So it's totally possible they can coexist. Plus the fact they are a different body.


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## cip 123

Can they just reissue the rg2228 already?


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## KnightBrolaire

i guess I can hold off picking up that rgdrir7m if they're re-releasing the XL line


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## Seabeast2000

KnightBrolaire said:


> i guess I can hold off picking up that rgdrir7m if they're re-releasing the XL line


Have you considered the RGDTIRX7AHMFXPB?

Ooops, I was thinking you were joking, I looked for a reverse headstock version but nonetheless the RDGIR7m LOOKS good to me. Never played one though.


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## AdenM

Why does the return of the FR have to be in Iron Label form :/


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## KnightBrolaire

AdenM said:


> Why does the return of the FR have to be in Iron Label form :/


because they already have prestige and uppercut versions


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## KnightBrolaire

The906 said:


> Have you considered the RGDTIRX7AHMFXPB?
> 
> Ooops, I was thinking you were joking, I looked for a reverse headstock version but nonetheless the RDGIR7m LOOKS good to me. Never played one though.


the dir7 is a solid guitar, i've played a couple and aesthetically it ticks all the boxes for me


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## Ordacleaphobia

Albake21 said:


> Call me crazy, but I definitely notice a difference between 26.5" and 27" scale. So it's totally possible they can coexist. Plus the fact they are a different body.



Never played a 26.5" guitar so I can't really comment, but isn't the body virtually identical save for the bevel? And with the arm contour on most modern RGs, a bevel isn't really necessary. They totally can, I just don't see a _need _for both.....which may be why we don't currently have any RGXLs


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## Vyn

The difference with 27 versus 26.5 is fuck all in terms of fret width - that extra .5" is spread over all the frets, it's nothing. The tension difference for the same brand/gauge strings is noticeable though.


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## jaxadam

Holy smokes that J Custom...


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## JustinRhoads1980

PunkBillCarson said:


> Oh my God... I love that finish, please tell me I'm not the only one.




Your not! I find it very classy and elegant! It is like if you have black coffee and you put in your cream and it is settling and such. At least that is how I look at it


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## PunkBillCarson

JustinRhoads1980 said:


> Your not! I find it very classy and elegant! It is like if you have black coffee and you put in your cream and it is settling and such. At least that is how I look at it




If it comes in a 7 string, I'm buying it, no questions asked.


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## AC.Lin

Albake21 said:


> Oh one more thing, a little bird told me that Ibanez plans to bring back the RG XL series. Just thought I'd throw that out there. I have no idea if it will be this year, but they are working on it.


Don't do this to my heart. It can't take that much.


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## Kaura

The gold RG is listed on Thomann. The price (1,849€/1,621£) is actually pretty tempting.

https://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_rg657ahm_gdf.htm?ref=intl&shp=eyJjb3VudHJ5IjoiZ2IiLCJjdXJyZW5jeSI6IjIiLCJsYW5ndWFnZSI6ImVuIn0=


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## Kyle Jordan

An MIJ 1077XL or 8 string would be extremely hard to pass up. The OG 1077XL is one of the best Ibanez models I’ve ever played.


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## cardinal

Kyle Jordan said:


> An MIJ 1077XL or 8 string would be extremely hard to pass up. The OG 1077XL is one of the best Ibanez models I’ve ever played.



I've had dozens of Ibanez 7s, and that 1077XL is the one I miss the most. And I don't even really prefer 27" scales. It was just a very nice guitar somehow.


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## Imalwayscold

Kyle Jordan said:


> An MIJ 1077XL or 8 string would be extremely hard to pass up. The OG 1077XL is one of the best Ibanez models I’ve ever played.



This reason why mine is going to the grave with me


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## MASS DEFECT

More RGR please.


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## Boojakki

I'm glad there will be another FR in the line, was afraid they phase them out. I really like FR's and this new model will be mine!


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## AdenM

KnightBrolaire said:


> because they already have prestige and uppercut versions



I know there is currently an Uppercut model, but I don't believe there's been a normal Prestige since the 1620, no?


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## KnightBrolaire

AdenM said:


> I know there is currently an Uppercut model, but I don't believe there's been a normal Prestige since the 1620, no?


Technically the uppercut series is prestige, but yeah they haven't had any other prestige FRs since 2014 when the 1620 was out.


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## JustinRhoads1980

PunkBillCarson said:


> If it comes in a 7 string, I'm buying it, no questions asked.



If they come out with a 7 string floyd model I might have to give that some consideration


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## couverdure

Let's be honest, when was the last time Ibanez brought back models they haven't produced in over a decade? The most recent I could think of is the non-Gio AX models but those were only standard non-Prestige models. There's too much wishful thinking in this thread and I doubt they'd make any more Prestige models other than the ones they already have but in different finishes.

That said, I'd like them to bring back the X series since the Xiphos gets a lot of love here and I love the looks of the V-Blade, which they only made for a year.


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## lewis

couverdure said:


> Let's be honest, when was the last time Ibanez brought back models they haven't produced in over a decade? The most recent I could think of is the non-Gio AX models but those were only standard non-Prestige models. There's too much wishful thinking in this thread and I doubt they'd make any more Prestige models other than the ones they already have but in different finishes.
> 
> That said, I'd like them to bring back the X series since the Xiphos gets a lot of love here and I love the looks of the V-Blade, which they only made for a year.


I would buy a Xiphos if they brought it back. Especially reversed headstock.

must NOT have shark inlays though


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## MaxOfMetal

couverdure said:


> Let's be honest, when was the last time Ibanez brought back models they haven't produced in over a decade?



2018: RG550 and RG570 (Technically released earlier, but 2018 was the first year of worldwide availability.)
2016: UV Swirls 
2015: PS Series 
2014: No returns this year, too busy with the Uppercut models and a bunch of new MIJ Sigs.
2013: Brought back MIJ Artist models.
2012: No old stuff exactly, probably because this was the year J.Custom stuff came back to the US officially, but since there hadn't been any since 89' does that count? 
2011: Return of the AT100
2010: Technically the return of MIJ RGAs, if you consider the modified shape. 

There's more, but I think the point has been made. As much as Ibanez pushes new stuff, they often bring back something at least every other year.


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## Seabeast2000

Nitpicky BS opinion here. Ibanez' line branding kinda sucks. It sort of comes off as "what the kids might like" as seen from a Boomer demographic. "prestige", "iron label", etc. They should also rebrand their "standard" to separate it more from the better/best stuff. Kind of like ESP maybe. 
Dots too, do something different than standard dots on the MIJ stuff. Anything ungaudy or just no inlays. Dots on a Wizard can stay on the revival models.


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## MaxOfMetal

The906 said:


> Nitpicky BS opinion here. Ibanez' line branding kinda sucks. It sort of comes off as "what the kids might like" as seen from a Boomer demographic. "prestige", "iron label", etc. They should also rebrand their "standard" to separate it more from the better/best stuff. Kind of like ESP maybe.
> Dots too, do something different than standard dots on the MIJ stuff. Anything ungaudy or just no inlays. Dots on a Wizard can stay on the revival models.



I agree, they have way too many different "series". They should have stuck to the naming scheme from around 2011.

J.Custom - Best
Prestige - Better and MIJ
Premium - Good and Indo
Standard - Basics
GIO - Beginner 

The offshoots from the core series just overly complicates things.


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## Sogradde

The906 said:


> Nitpicky BS opinion here. Ibanez' line branding kinda sucks. It sort of comes off as "what the kids might like" as seen from a Boomer demographic. "prestige", "iron label", etc. They should also rebrand their "standard" to separate it more from the better/best stuff. Kind of like ESP maybe.
> Dots too, do something different than standard dots on the MIJ stuff. Anything ungaudy or just no inlays. Dots on a Wizard can stay on the revival models.


I honestly like most of the Iron Labes from a design point of view. I tried many as well because I wanted to like them but what always kept me from buying was the quality.
If they A: lowered the price to standard series levels or B: Produced Iron Labels in Japan, I'd buy some.


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## Seabeast2000

Sogradde said:


> I honestly like most of the Iron Labes from a design point of view. I tried many as well because I wanted to like them but what always kept me from buying was the quality.
> If they A: lowered the price to standard series levels or B: Produced Iron Labels in Japan, I'd buy some.


yeah, I don't mind the Iron labels one bit. There's several I'd take home. Just the "branding" I guess.


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## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> I honestly like most of the Iron Labes from a design point of view. I tried many as well because I wanted to like them but what always kept me from buying was the quality.
> If they A: lowered the price to standard series levels or B: Produced Iron Labels in Japan, I'd buy some.


I guarantee if they produced Iron Labels in Japan, they would sell like crazy. The iron labels have such good ideas but typically play like shit...


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## Avedas

I saw a guy with a Legator at the studio the other day. A well-marketed Iron Label could have saved him from his fate.

More seriously, I think Japanese Iron Labels would be great. They have features that the other lines don't touch and if the quality were up to par for the price tag they'd be an excellent option.


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## couverdure

MaxOfMetal said:


> 2018: RG550 and RG570 (Technically released earlier, but 2018 was the first year of worldwide availability.)
> 2016: UV Swirls
> 2015: PS Series
> 2014: No returns this year, too busy with the Uppercut models and a bunch of new MIJ Sigs.
> 2013: Brought back MIJ Artist models.
> 2012: No old stuff exactly, probably because this was the year J.Custom stuff came back to the US officially, but since there hadn't been any since 89' does that count?
> 2011: Return of the AT100
> 2010: Technically the return of MIJ RGAs, if you consider the modified shape.
> 
> There's more, but I think the point has been made. As much as Ibanez pushes new stuff, they often bring back something at least every other year.


I was thinking in the lines of the more niche models like the Xiphos, baritone RG XLs, the RGA121, and RG2228.
The RG550 has been reissued many times before with the previous latest one being Japan-only in 2013, the signature models' return were the result of the artists going back to Ibanez, and the swirl UVs were for the 25th anniversary of Passion and Warfare.

I can't think of a reason for Ibanez to reissue any of those first four models I mentioned unless there's a huge demand outside of SSO. The closest we'll get to having an RGA121 reissue is the JBBM20 sig, which is based on JB Brubaker's green/white RGA121. _Maybe_ we could get a RG2228 reissue in 2022 or something since that would be fifteen years since the original launch of the mode.


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## MaxOfMetal

couverdure said:


> I was thinking in the lines of the more niche models like the Xiphos, baritone RG XLs, the RGA121, and RG2228.
> The RG550 has been reissued many times before with the previous latest one being Japan-only in 2013, the signature models' return were the result of the artists going back to Ibanez, and the swirl UVs were for the 25th anniversary of Passion and Warfare.
> 
> I can't think of a reason for Ibanez to reissue any of those first four models I mentioned unless there's a huge demand outside of SSO. The closest we'll get to having an RGA121 reissue is the JBBM20 sig, which is based on JB Brubaker's green/white RGA121. _Maybe_ we could get a RG2228 reissue in 2022 or something since that would be fifteen years since the original launch of the mode.



The point still stands, they do bring back models and motifs from previous years and decades, just look at all the anniversary reissue models they've done over the years.

But of course, they have to bring back stuff that's going to sell, especially if it's pricier MIJ models.

I miss the Xiphos and RG2228 as well, but I can see why they went away and aren't likely to come back. The only chance we have of niche stuff coming back is if a popular artist chooses them as a Sig.


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## PunkBillCarson

I don't know if I know what a GREAT guitar feels like or something, but I have just much fun with my Iron Label as I do my LTD BK-600.


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## Albake21

PunkBillCarson said:


> I don't know if I know what a GREAT guitar feels like or something, but I have just much fun with my Iron Label as I do my LTD BK-600.


Which a MIJ Prestige would blow both the Iron Label and LTD out of the water.


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## PunkBillCarson

Albake21 said:


> Which a MIJ Prestige would blow both the Iron Label and LTD out of the water.




I mean, maybe, but for me either I don't notice the things you guys all talk about or it's just too small for me to consider. If a guitar sounds great and plays good enough for me and doesn't fret out or lose tuning on me, it's a good guitar.


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## Boojakki

Well, personally I have more fun with my two recently acquired Iron Labels than I had with the three Prestiges I had before... Mostly because of the neck profiles. So... I happily buy another IL before I buy another Prestige. It's all personal preference of course.





Afaic, both are killer guitars for the money. I can't wait to get the new gradiant colored FR...


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## Albake21

PunkBillCarson said:


> I mean, maybe, but for me either I don't notice the things you guys all talk about or it's just too small for me to consider. If a guitar sounds great and plays good enough for me and doesn't fret out or lose tuning on me, it's a good guitar.





Boojakki said:


> Well, personally I have more fun with my two recently acquired Iron Labels than I had with the three Prestiges I had before... Mostly because of the neck profiles. So... I happily buy another IL before I buy another Prestige. It's all personal preference of course.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Afaic, both are killer guitars for the money. I can't wait to get the new gradiant colored FR...



More power to you guys! Your wallets will definitely thank you.


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## Andromalia

The one thing I credit Ibanez for is having realised their pickups aren't really what we want, and their outside brand pickup offering has been multiplied by a lot. That was my main peeve with the brand a few years ago. Sure, there always were a few models with DM/SDs, but nowadays you get much more choice.

And for some reason I want that gold RG......


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## spork141

HAHAHA Black guitars with brown fretboards! I always wondered why Ibanez brass look at those prototypes and go....yeah....ship that!





Sogradde said:


> I'm actually surprised Mathias didn't open this thread but well. Winter NAMM is coming and it's about time we start speculating, look at new stuff and cringe over black guitars with brown fretboards.
> 
> First new model is online on the homepage: FRIX6FDQM (Iron Label)
> View attachment 65018
> 
> Looks kinda neat but after all these years I still think the regular Ibanez headstock does not fit to the FR. Something softer would suit it much better, maybe even the AZ headstock.
> 
> There is also a new limited series coming (probably Japan only?) the Gold Collection:
> View attachment 65019
> 
> Not exactly my cup of tea but some 80s shredder dude will probably drool over either of those.
> 
> Last but not least, I saw a new J. Custom on Instagram, which had a really cool resin top: JCRG1801
> View attachment 65020
> 
> I like those resin woodwork thingies, no matter how cheesy they are. Even better if someone builds LEDs into it to make it glow.
> 
> It's also noteworthy that Rich of Ibanez Rules dropped a cryptic "11/1" on the Jemsite forum. I don't know if that means "November 1st" which would make sense but nothing happened on November 1st, or January 11th. We'll see I guess. I also heard rumors about Ibanez adding more Fishmans but those could be wrong.


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## Kaura

Andromalia said:


> The one thing I credit Ibanez for is having realised their pickups aren't really what we want, and their outside brand pickup offering has been multiplied by a lot. That was my main peeve with the brand a few years ago. Sure, there always were a few models with DM/SDs, but nowadays you get much more choice.
> 
> And for some reason I want that gold RG......



I know I shouldn't complain as long as they don't put the god-awful stock in-house pickups in their guitars but man, everytime they put out a guitar with HSH config, you already know that it's going to have Dimarzio Air Norton/True Velvet/Tone Zone combo. Just like that gold RG has, for example.


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## lurè

I'm gonna contact Ibanez and ask which god do I have to prey to have stainless steel frets on the Prestige line.


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## MaxOfMetal

lurè said:


> I'm gonna contact Ibanez and ask which god do I have to prey to have stainless steel frets on the Prestige line.



If it's such a big deal, get it refretted at some point. It'll probably be close in price to the upcharge they'd add to get them from factory or grab an Uppercut.


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## I play music

MaxOfMetal said:


> If it's such a big deal, get it refretted at some point. It'll probably be close in price to the upcharge they'd add to get them from factory or grab an Uppercut.


I think some people (me included) don't really know where to go for a refret. I mean via internet I can find a luthier somewhere but I don't know how to tell if he's good or not. So a guitar that already comes with stainless steel frets would be more comfortable to me because then I don't have to search a luthier, all the other stuff like setups I can do myself.


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## TheUnknownOne

Gotta love some MIJ Iron Label, but considering the brand actual strategy, they would reach the 2k++ price tag, and for that amount I'd rather buy an ESP or any high-end LTD and the pickup set of my choice.


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## Lindmann

PunkBillCarson said:


> I mean, maybe, but for me either I don't notice the things you guys all talk about or it's just too small for me to consider. If a guitar sounds great and plays good enough for me and doesn't fret out or lose tuning on me, it's a good guitar.


That's how I feel too.
All the talk about quality 
Specs, features and looks is all what matters to me. I struggle noticing quality differences between entry level guitars and mid-tier guitars.


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## gunch

I highly doubt it but if Ibby makes a new premium (esp. if had a dope top/finish) or prestige AX with the new carve/bevel that will be boner time


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## diagrammatiks

Came looking for s’s

No s’s

#slivesmatter


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## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> Came looking for s’s
> 
> No s’s
> 
> #slivesmatter



I have a feeling that unless a really big name artist picks up the Saber, we're not going to see much, aside from maybe some new colors. 

Now, more than ever, Ibanez is very artist driven. Just look at the Sig/Non-Sig ratio of the AZ series.


----------



## A-Branger

MaxOfMetal said:


> I have a feeling that unless a really big name artist picks up the Saber, we're not going to see much, aside from maybe some new colors.
> 
> Now, more than ever, Ibanez is very artist driven. Just look at the Sig/Non-Sig ratio of the AZ series.


well you got Nita now.... and the Dragon force guy always been, and someone else dont remember.

But yeah, at this moment Ibanez is pushing hard the AZ series, I dont think they are gonna worry about the S series much more like you say, one new color or a funky Iron Label....... IF..... chances are they might do a weird finish Iron label for the AZ


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> well you got Nita now.... and the Dragon force guy always been, and someone else dont remember.
> 
> But yeah, at this moment Ibanez is pushing hard the AZ series, I dont think they are gonna worry about the S series much more like you say, one new color or a funky Iron Label....... IF..... chances are they might do a weird finish Iron label for the AZ



No offense to either Nita or Herman, but neither are that extremely popular in 2018. 

Nita is really only known in guitar circles, and Dragonforce has not had either a certified album or charting single since 2006. 

Both are great players with a loyal, cult following, but I was thinking something more high profile. 

Too bad Kiko didn't stick with Sabers, his SA models were awesome.


----------



## ExileMetal

I'm hoping Ibanez just goes a little crazy and makes a fanned fret MIJ guitar. As someone else mentioned the 852MPB has been around for a long time; feels like the 8 string market is so small and specific that something that feels more boutique may do better? A plain black 8 string MIJ probably wouldn't sell someone like me who already has two, but if it was something more, I wouldn't be able to resist.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ExileMetal said:


> I'm hoping Ibanez just goes a little crazy and makes a fanned fret MIJ guitar. As someone else mentioned the 852MPB has been around for a long time; feels like the 8 string market is so small and specific that something that feels more boutique may do better? A plain black 8 string MIJ probably wouldn't sell someone like me who already has two, but if it was something more, I wouldn't be able to resist.



Yeah, those solid color RG852 and RG2228 models were the best.


----------



## jephjacques

The bridges were more trouble than they were worth but I really miss those solid colors! I still regret parting with my 2228as.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

jephjacques said:


> The bridges were more trouble than they were worth but I really miss those solid colors! I still regret parting with my 2228as.



After the first revision they were much better. The RG852s were supposedly identical, but they just never had that "thing" about them that the locking ones did.

I bought and sold RG2228s twice before deciding I needed to keep one. I was loosing too much selling them. I've had mine cased up since last year, but I know the second I sell it or trade it I'm going to decide I want to play 8s again.

I keep saying I'm going to throw a trem on it, but I'm too wishy-washy.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

My wish: maple fretboard (prefeably birdseye), black reversed headstock with full Ibanez logo (with that V), HS and black hardware with lopro edge. Colors: jewel blue, black, white. 
Am i alone?


----------



## Kaura

Wolfhorsky said:


> full Ibanez logo (with that V)
> Am i alone?



I really hope Ibanez never starts using that with their higher end models. It instantly makes any Ibby look like a low-end/mid-range model, imo.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Kaura said:


> I really hope Ibanez never starts using that with their higher end models. It instantly makes any Ibby look like a low-end/mid-range model, imo.



I guess it depends how long you've been into Ibanez. All my favorite old Ibanez guitars use the check.


----------



## Kaura

MaxOfMetal said:


> I guess it depends how long you've been into Ibanez. All my favorite old Ibanez guitars use the check.



Got my first Ibanez back in 2005. I can't remember if they used the simple logo back then, but I do remember disliking the full logo even back then.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Kaura said:


> Got my first Ibanez back in 2005. I can't remember if they used the simple logo back then, but I do remember disliking the full logo even back then.



That's close to the time, 2003, they switched over to the non-check Prestige branded MIJ stuff.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Kaura said:


> I really hope Ibanez never starts using that with their higher end models. It instantly makes any Ibby look like a low-end/mid-range model, imo.


I’m into ibanez since 1998 and that makes me an old prick here


----------



## Dumple Stilzkin

I wonder if they ever release the RG7550, just the same as the genesis 550 reissue but one more string. That would be a dream come true.


----------



## AirForbes1

Dumple Stilzkin said:


> I wonder if they ever release the RG7550, just the same as the genesis 550 reissue but one more string. That would be a dream come true.


----------



## spork141

The full ibanez logo (with the V) is the best. THe new logo is boring. Its just their name.

Yes Im an oldish fart. Hope they paint the original logo on everything as well has more reverse headstocks.


----------



## Kyle Jordan

MaxOfMetal said:


> I guess it depends how long you've been into Ibanez. All my favorite old Ibanez guitars use the check.



My 1997 S540FM and ‘03 UV777 both had the swish. 

The swish logo is the best logo. The others look naked and barren.


----------



## StevenC

MaxOfMetal said:


> After the first revision they were much better. The RG852s were supposedly identical, but they just never had that "thing" about them that the locking ones did.
> 
> I bought and sold RG2228s twice before deciding I needed to keep one. I was loosing too much selling them. I've had mine cased up since last year, but I know the second I sell it or trade it I'm going to decide I want to play 8s again.
> 
> I keep saying I'm going to throw a trem on it, but I'm too wishy-washy.


I love the fixed Edge III on those guitars and it'd be cool to see it make a comeback at some point. I think only the Meshuggah guitars still have them. Do they even still make the M8M?


----------



## spork141

OK so you know what I am hoping for? Ibanez doesn't really do RG style archtops. Not the real way at least. I'm thinking ESP Horizon / PRS core style. The RG is flat. The RGD is beveled, and the RGA is barely arched. They don't have those aggressive scoops like the Horizons or even Schecter does. Not sure why they play it so safe. Likely cost, but either way I always hope ibanez dabbles in those areas.


----------



## Sogradde

spork141 said:


> OK so you know what I am hoping for? Ibanez doesn't really do RG style archtops. Not the real way at least. I'm thinking ESP Horizon / PRS core style. The RG is flat. The RGD is beveled, and the RGA is barely arched. They don't have those aggressive scoops like the Horizons or even Schecter does. Not sure why they play it so safe. Likely cost, but either way I always hope ibanez dabbles in those areas.


If the RGA and S series are any indicator for how expensive slightly arched bodies are, a properly arched guitar would most likely make it J.Custom tier expensive.
Also the people who are hoping for a new RGA prestige would probably torch the Ibanez HQ.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

StevenC said:


> I love the fixed Edge III on those guitars and it'd be cool to see it make a comeback at some point. I think only the Meshuggah guitars still have them. Do they even still make the M8M?



The M8M is still in production. Apparently they sell enough of them still that they started building them in small batches vs. one-off orders sometime in the last year or so. I'm surprised that model has had such longevity. The M8M was a real gamble, and it looks like it paid off. 

Now that they're having Sugi make J.Customs I hope that we'll see more from that shop. Sugi is an Amazing builder, and Ibanez can have some great designs.


----------



## Ben Pinkus

That Quilt Graduation Burst Iron Label looks nice!


----------



## laxu

All I need for 2019 is a 5-string multiscale BTB bass model.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Boojakki said:


> Well, personally I have more fun with my two recently acquired Iron Labels than I had with the three Prestiges I had before... Mostly because of the neck profiles. So... I happily buy another IL before I buy another Prestige. It's all personal preference of course.
> 
> Afaic, both are killer guitars for the money. I can't wait to get the new gradiant colored FR...



This has always kind of upset me about Ibanez- the neck profiles on the Iron Labels are _*so damn comfy*_, the only MiJ one that comes close is the Super Wizard HP and I'd still take the Nitro Wizard carve every time.



Kaura said:


> I know I shouldn't complain as long as they don't put the god-awful stock in-house pickups in their guitars but man, everytime they put out a guitar with HSH config, you already know that it's going to have Dimarzio Air Norton/True Velvet/Tone Zone combo. Just like that gold RG has, for example.



Hey man don't sleep on the V7/V8. Those are surprisingly good stock pickups, especially the older ones from like the early/mid 2000s. I've actually known guys that deliberately swapped those _into_ their guitars. The INFs and the Quantums are garbage though, I'll give you that.



diagrammatiks said:


> Came looking for s’s
> No s’s
> #slivesmatter



For real. When will they realize the S is their best body shape? 
Really killed me last year with that Premium when they were going to launch both an S and RG variant of the 1070 and then they canned the S. Glad it looks like they brought it back.
....now if only there were more fixed bridge Prestige options....



ExileMetal said:


> I'm hoping Ibanez just goes a little crazy and makes a fanned fret MIJ guitar. As someone else mentioned the 852MPB has been around for a long time; feels like the 8 string market is so small and specific that something that feels more boutique may do better? A plain black 8 string MIJ probably wouldn't sell someone like me who already has two, but if it was something more, I wouldn't be able to resist.



If they want to start shipping MiJ multiscales they're going to have to fix their parallel fret placement. I love my FF Iron Label, but the parallel on the 12th fret just makes the low end of the guitar so much more uncomfortable than it needs to be- and if I paid MiJ pricing for it, I'd be a little miffed. Scoot that sucker back to the 7th, 8th fret and I'd throw down in a heartbeat.


----------



## Boojakki

Ordacleaphobia said:


> This has always kind of upset me about Ibanez- the neck profiles on the Iron Labels are _*so damn comfy*_, the only MiJ one that comes close is the Super Wizard HP and I'd still take the Nitro Wizard carve every time.



This.


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> This has always kind of upset me about Ibanez- the neck profiles on the Iron Labels are _*so damn comfy*_, the only MiJ one that comes close is the Super Wizard HP and I'd still take the Nitro Wizard carve every time.


Intersting... I didn't mind it too much on the 6 strings, but the 7 string Nitro neck is most uncomfortable neck I've ever played. The nitro has way too big of shoulders. The reason I don't mind the shoulders on prestige models is because they are thin enough to make up for the shoulders.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Albake21 said:


> Intersting... I didn't mind it too much on the 6 strings, but the 7 string Nitro neck is most uncomfortable neck I've ever played. The nitro has way too big of shoulders. The reason I don't mind the shoulders on prestige models is because they are thin enough to make up for the shoulders.



To be fair I'm mostly speaking regarding 6s; never had an Iron Label 7. The most comfortable 7 neck I've _played_ from them though was my buddy's RG1527 for sure. 
I sold my old SIX20 a while back because it just didn't feel well put together, but I always find myself wishing whatever guitar I was playing still had that neck


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> To be fair I'm mostly speaking regarding 6s; never had an Iron Label 7. The most comfortable 7 neck I've _played_ from them though was my buddy's RG1527 for sure.
> I sold my old SIX20 a while back because it just didn't feel well put together, but I always find myself wishing whatever guitar I was playing still had that neck


I will say, I do sometimes miss my RGIX20FESM. That guitar was by far the best Iron Label I ever played. I still wish I kept it and then just refinished the neck with a tung oil finish.

To be honest, the Wizard II is pretty similar to the Nitro so you could always try and find one of those from the mid 2000s.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Albake21 said:


> I will say, I do sometimes miss my RGIX20FESM. That guitar was by far the best Iron Label I ever played. I still wish I kept it and then just refinished the neck with a tung oil finish.
> 
> To be honest, the Wizard II is pretty similar to the Nitro so you could always try and find one of those from the mid 2000s.



Ironically, I hate the Wizard II. I don't know why, I should love it on paper. Can't stand it though.
Guitarists have to be some of the pickiest people on the planet.


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Guitarists have to be some of the pickiest people on the planet.


Truer words have never been spoken on SSO...


----------



## A-Branger

laxu said:


> All I need for 2019 is a 5-string multiscale BTB bass model.



I would say yes to it, but being BTB it would have their usual 19mm string spacing and 47mm nut widht.... which both are a big nope for me, an the reason why I went down with the BTB33

plus as much as I love my BTB horns, I know Ibanez wont be doing those for a multiscale if it happens, and more likely use the stupid new (old school) design where the horn lines wont match and with that stupid bevel scoop things on them


----------



## laxu

A-Branger said:


> I would say yes to it, but being BTB it would have their usual 19mm string spacing and 47mm nut widht.... which both are a big nope for me, an the reason why I went down with the BTB33
> 
> plus as much as I love my BTB horns, I know Ibanez wont be doing those for a multiscale if it happens, and more likely use the stupid new (old school) design where the horn lines wont match and with that stupid bevel scoop things on them



I don't mind the new design too much but I agree that the wider neck and string spacing would give me pause. I just don't like the SR body design visually.


----------



## dirtool

RG1027 with reverse headstock and edge/edge-zero bridge, I'd fucking get one.


----------



## StevenC

All I want from Ibanez this year is a MIJ 8 string Maxxas and Turbot


----------



## TheUnknownOne

I got a big GAS on that one... That top is a real success IMO


----------



## TheUnknownOne

Plus it has luminlays and it's decently priced here (700€)

Going to pull the trigger, Price, features and the choice to use a laquer rather than a satin finish will make that one a great gig-proof guitar !


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

TheUnknownOne said:


> Plus it has luminlays and it's decently priced here (700€)
> 
> Going to pull the trigger, Price, features and the choice to use a laquer rather than a satin finish will make that one a great gig-proof guitar !



Nice. Loved it when I played it and seriously thought about getting one myself. One of the few Iron Labels that floored me.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Nice. Loved it when I played it and seriously thought about getting one myself. One of the few Iron Labels that floored me.



Nice ! Did you notice any issue or minor flaws on the one you tried ?


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

TheUnknownOne said:


> Nice ! Did you notice any issue or minor flaws on the one you tried ?



Surprisingly no. Most Iron Labels I've tried have varied from sub standard to almost right but one or more glaring flaws. This was one that was great right off the bat. I did try it at a store where they're picky with their models as well as give it a good setup when they sell.


----------



## guitaardvark

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Hey man don't sleep on the V7/V8. Those are surprisingly good stock pickups, especially the older ones from like the early/mid 2000s. I've actually known guys that deliberately swapped those _into_ their guitars. The INFs and the Quantums are garbage though, I'll give you that.



Gotta respectfully disagree with you there, though this is entirely subjective. I couldn't stand the V7/V8 in my S5521Q, but I've sworn by the Quantums in my S1520FB for years. The V7/V8 sounded great but only on low gain or split coil and muddied up quickly under a lot of gain. The Quantums are very balanced with a very cool throaty sound when splitting coils. I could see how people think they're too flat though. I swapped out my Quantum bridge for a Titan which sounds extremely similar, and I know that's one of the biggest critiques about the Titan.

I suppose it all just depends on what you're looking for. Personally, I see the Quantum as more versatile and the best stock pickup I've played to date.

I'll still agree that Infinities are disgusting and unusable though


----------



## lewis

the ibanez stock pickups are terrible. V series and the INF pickups are simply unusable.

Ive recently inherited the latter in an RG i picked up, even with the tonal shaping of the Ax8, they are terrible.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

guitaardvark said:


> Gotta respectfully disagree with you there, though this is entirely subjective. I couldn't stand the V7/V8 in my S5521Q, but I've sworn by the Quantums in my S1520FB for years. The V7/V8 sounded great but only on low gain or split coil and muddied up quickly under a lot of gain. The Quantums are very balanced with a very cool throaty sound when splitting coils. I could see how people think they're too flat though. I swapped out my Quantum bridge for a Titan which sounds extremely similar, and I know that's one of the biggest critiques about the Titan.
> 
> I suppose it all just depends on what you're looking for. Personally, I see the Quantum as more versatile and the best stock pickup I've played to date.
> 
> I'll still agree that Infinities are disgusting and unusable though



I've heard some good things about the older Quantums before they started remaking them recently. 
Never had a guitar with one of the older sets though; so I can totally believe this.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

the v7/v8 were some of the worst pickups I ever used back in the mid 2000s. Just a muddy pile of garbage compared to the evo2 and d-activator/titan sets I installed in the same guitar afterwards. 
Unless they've completely redesigned them, I'd rip them out of any new ibby immediately.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

KnightBrolaire said:


> the v7/v8 were some of the worst pickups I ever used back in the mid 2000s. Just a muddy pile of garbage compared to the evo2 and d-activator/titan sets I installed in the same guitar afterwards.
> Unless they've completely redesigned them, I'd rip them out of any new ibby immediately.



Well yeah, obviously compared to actual pickups 
I'm just saying as stock pickups, they aren't bad.

For someone as into pickups as you are, I'd be shocked if any stock pickup didn't sound like nails on a blackboard to you, haha.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Well yeah, obviously compared to actual pickups
> I'm just saying as stock pickups, they aren't bad.
> 
> For someone as into pickups as you are, I'd be shocked if any stock pickup didn't sound like nails on a blackboard to you, haha.


actually I liked the stock oem pickups in a bunch of my cheaper guitars over the last few years (agile LP, jackson gus g star, ibby mini-destroyer, prs mushok, laguna ss). I've only swapped the pickups out of 4 of those 5 so far, but that's more because I need a way to justify owning multiple guitars 
They have definitely been exceptions to the rule though, as most cheap guitars have terrible oem pickups ime. The ibby fusion edge pickups are ok sounding though.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Yeah the Agile stocks were pretty good from what I can remember from mine. Same with PRS.

My justification is that I need a guitar for each tuning I play in, because switching tuning is a headache and you can't get the perfect setup using the same strings for everything!
You can borrow it if you want


----------



## MFB

The stock single coil in my Talman is actually pretty solid, I've considered swapping it just because that's always my mindset, but I haven't cared enough to commit to finding a new T style coil that I want to go in.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Yeah the Agile stocks were pretty good from what I can remember from mine. Same with PRS.
> 
> My justification is that I need a guitar for each tuning I play in, because switching tuning is a headache and you can't get the perfect setup using the same strings for everything!
> You can borrow it if you want


great minds think alike 
i actually have most of my guitars in different tunings ranging from standard to weirder stuff like karnivool style (b f#b gbe) or mastodon esque (agcfad). that's just for the 6 strings, I have like 6 different tunings I play around with on my 8 strings


----------



## Sogradde

Two new J.Custom prototypes. The red one is supposedly a Sugi.



https://www.digimart.net/cat01/shop1484/DS04950882/



https://store.ishibashi.co.jp/ec/pro/disp/1/03-313832000


----------



## bnzboy

Sogradde said:


> Two new J.Custom prototypes. The red one is supposedly a Sugi.
> 
> View attachment 65184
> 
> https://www.digimart.net/cat01/shop1484/DS04950882/
> 
> View attachment 65185
> 
> https://store.ishibashi.co.jp/ec/pro/disp/1/03-313832000



The red one looks killer and I am sure its quality would be amazing but damn... 7K CAD for an Ibanez


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> Two new J.Custom prototypes. The red one is supposedly a Sugi.
> 
> View attachment 65184
> 
> https://www.digimart.net/cat01/shop1484/DS04950882/
> 
> View attachment 65185
> 
> https://store.ishibashi.co.jp/ec/pro/disp/1/03-313832000



They're both Sugi. Anything with the serial numbers pressed into the end of the fretboard will be Sugi built.


----------



## Boojakki

TheUnknownOne said:


> ...and it's decently priced here (700€)


ORLY?! Here (Germany) they want 800€...


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Sogradde said:


> View attachment 65185
> 
> https://store.ishibashi.co.jp/ec/pro/disp/1/03-313832000



Brooooooooo
J. Custom GAS at all time high. Rapidly approaching unsafe levels. Evacuate all wallets and sellable valuables.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MFB said:


> The stock single coil in my Talman is actually pretty solid, I've considered swapping it just because that's always my mindset, but I haven't cared enough to commit to finding a new T style coil that I want to go in.



Yeah the stock pickups on the import Talmans are surprisingly good for what they are. Certainly better than the V7/V8 Infinitys on RG. Different kettle of fish but whatever. 

Hadn't I already known what I wanted on my 2 Talmans, I would have kept the stocks on for longer.


----------



## Richter

So are the old Quantums different from the new ones? I'd never change mine on my '97 S540fm, favorite stock pickups ever.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Richter said:


> So are the old Quantums different from the new ones? I'd never change mine on my '97 S540fm, favorite stock pickups ever.



If you believe what people say on the internet. I never looked too far into it so I don't have anything concrete, but that's what I've heard.
They used to be Prestige stock pickups (like on the S1520 that was mentioned earlier). Then got discontinued for a while, and recently starting coming with the cheaper Indonesian standard series stuff.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Richter said:


> So are the old Quantums different from the new ones? I'd never change mine on my '97 S540fm, favorite stock pickups ever.



Yes. 

The old ones were copies of certain DiMarzio designs and made in Japan by Fujigen or South Korea by what would become Cortek and Artek. The newest incarnations are OEM stock from China.


----------



## cardinal

Could be for other reasons, but Ikebe Gakka has a lot of RG852MPBs on “outlet” pricing, so maybe they’re going to be discontinued (just as easily could be because that finish chips if you breath on it, so anything in a store might have to be discounted). 

If it is discontinued, sure hope it’s replaced with another 8-string Prestige.


----------



## StevenC

cardinal said:


> Could be for other reasons, but Ikebe Gakka has a lot of RG852MPBs on “outlet” pricing, so maybe they’re going to be discontinued (just as easily could be because that finish chips if you breath on it, so anything in a store might have to be discounted).
> 
> If it is discontinued, sure hope it’s replaced with another 8-string Prestige.


Hopefully with an 8 string Edge.

Maxxas shape optional


----------



## trem licking

StevenC said:


> Hopefully with an 8 string Edge.
> 
> Maxxas shape optional



8 string edge would be an instant buy from me


----------



## jephjacques

I saw the 852 listed as "discontinued 2018" so that's probably why they're closing them out. The 8 string market in general seems to have contracted a lot in the last 2 years, I hope this doesn't mean the end of Prestige line 8s :\

It's just as likely they're simply discontinuing these particular flavors of 852. Maybe we'll get some matte black ones with Fishmans, to piss off all the BurlKnuckle fans >


----------



## Kyle Jordan

jephjacques said:


> I saw the 852 listed as "discontinued 2018" so that's probably why they're closing them out. The 8 string market in general seems to have contracted a lot in the last 2 years, I hope this doesn't mean the end of Prestige line 8s :\
> 
> It's just as likely they're simply discontinuing these particular flavors of 852. Maybe we'll get some matte black ones with Fishmans, to piss off all the BurlKnuckle fans >



Yeah this is a bit concerning. I'm hoping they have another 8 string Prestige in the wings. Not Ibanez related but topic related, I'm hoping the LTD EC-1008 doesn't get the axe this upcoming year.


----------



## Sogradde

It's not necessarily the 8 string that is getting the axe, it's the finish. According to Rich, the 6-string version of that guitar is discontinued aswell so I suppose the finish will go but there will still be an 8-string Prestige.


----------



## cardinal

Sogradde said:


> It's not necessarily the 8 string that is getting the axe, it's the finish. According to Rich, the 6-string version of that guitar is discontinued aswell so I suppose the finish will go but there will still be an 8-string Prestige.



Hope so. The finish has been around for two years I think, so discontinuing the finish totally makes sense. Ibanez unfortunately discontinued the S5528LW without a replacement, and I guess a few of us are worried the same could happen to the 852MPB. 

I’m certainly not holding my breath for a version with a Lo Pro 8 but that would be amazing. I’d probably buy two within the year. But for some reason 8-strings with trems are exceedingly rare despite it working well.


----------



## Sogradde

This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi). 

But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:


> The R7131E22J4 features a poplar burl top on a swamp ash body bolted to a wenge and purpleheart neck *with an asymmetric profile* and Velvetouch finish and a selected wenge fingerboard with pearl and abalone Tree of Life vine inlay.


Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I'd be fine with them skipping a year or two on the MIJ 8s if it means they come out with something more interesting down the line. 

It's a strategy they've applied in the past: take a model/configuration out of rotation, make some changes, and then bringing it back when demand is higher.



Sogradde said:


> This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi).
> View attachment 65247
> But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:
> 
> Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.



They've done asymmetrical necks in the past, but I haven't seen a Sugi one before, so take this with a grain of salt.

Previous Ibanez asymmetrical necks have been a little rounder, with the apex of the rear profile moved around 1/2" to 3/4" closer to the bass side. You really only feel it if you hang your thumb over, or place your thumb exactly down the center of the neck. If you're like most players and place your thumb somewhere between the extremes, you probably won't notice it right away. I also tend to find it more noticeable further up the neck, but there's probably a technique factor there. 

Honestly, I think it's something of "spec sheet padding" as it typically appears on more boutique instruments, which is where they're goings with these.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Man I need to figure out a way to handle my J. Custom GAS this year because it's starting to get ridiculous. Gotta find a good deal on an old one through Reverb or something before I find myself putting down for a new one 

I don't think they're going to axe the MiJ 8s entirely either; that was a big part of their marketing for the last few years was "First in 7, Best in 8" or something along those lines. With how popular it is and with the success of the Meshuggah sigs that have the same bridge, I can see them reissuing the RG2228 at the very least before they go.
Realistically though, I'm expecting an RG852 refresh. Couple new finishes. If we're dreaming then maybe a model with an 8 string variant of the Tight-End R.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi).
> View attachment 65247
> But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:
> 
> Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.


As much as I love this, the tree of life inlay does not work on this one. This absolutely needed to be either dots or no markers at all.


----------



## Kaura

Sogradde said:


> This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi).
> View attachment 65247
> But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:
> 
> Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.



That top looks like the fucking big bang or a close-up photo of the sun. When it comes to burls, Ibanez have only made some ugly ones but that thing is a beauty. If that doesn't turn all the burl-haters' minds then I don't know what would.


----------



## Sogradde

Albake21 said:


> As much as I love this, the tree of life inlay does not work on this one. This absolutely needed to be either dots or no markers at all.


Really? I feel it's the only model outside of JEMs where it fits.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> Really? I feel it's the only model outside of JEMs where it fits.


With that top, color, and black hardware, it looks so mean and almost metal looking. So with the inlays it kinda ruins it. Like it doesn't know what it wants to be.

With that said, I would give my left nut for one of these...


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Sogradde said:


> Really? I feel it's the only model outside of JEMs where it fits.



Yeah I think it works here too. Although it's no secret that I love the J. Custom vine. 
The whole point (imo) is to have this nasty, aggressive machine, but the vine gives it that nice refined polish on top. The contrast totally makes the look, I think.
That's why I don't really care as much for the "pretty" JCs, or at all really for the more spartan ones without the inlay. I like the duality.


----------



## gunch

I'd take tree of life all day over poplar burlf


----------



## slayer6699

Sogradde said:


> This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi).
> View attachment 65247
> But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:
> 
> Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.


Amazing top and like for the inlays!
I don't like tremolo's so i prefer it with a fixed bridge if that possible.Also the jack placement isn't bad for the classical position?


----------



## lewis

Sogradde said:


> This one looks new to me aswell (another Sugi).
> View attachment 65247
> But what's really interesting about it, is the neck. According to the wiki:
> 
> Has anyone tried these before? This is the first time I hear about it but apparently Ibanez uses these necks since 2010.


omg!!

A roasted blank maple fretboard with SS frets and luminlays, would make that my favourite ever Ibanez.

I wish Ibanez done a few different versions of the same guitar and adjusted price a little according to said changes.
That top and neck is amazing. Just dont like the fretboard/inlay


----------



## prlgmnr

lewis said:


> would make that my favourite ever Ibanez.


Everyone's favourite Ibanez is one they make but with some features it doesn't have.


----------



## Sogradde

The latest J.Custom I posted just confirms to me, that most Ibanez would look much better with black hardware. Chrome and even black chrome are just not cool enough.


----------



## lewis

prlgmnr said:


> Everyone's favourite Ibanez is one they make but with some features it doesn't have.


haha truest post ever


----------



## lewis

Sogradde said:


> The latest J.Custom I posted just confirms to me, that most Ibanez would look much better with black hardware. Chrome and even black chrome are just not cool enough.


YES!!!!!

I HATE "cosmo" black. It is utter trash


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

lewis said:


> YES!!!!!
> 
> I HATE "cosmo" black. It is utter trash



I love the cosmo look but until they can figure out how to make it not tarnish from looking at it funny, it needs to stay on the shelves. 
--
Post your fantastical, unrealistic-but-fun-to-imagine NAMM dreams. I pray for a fixed bridge 6 string Saber that's got a Tight-End bridge variant to accomodate for the arched top. 
And if it comes in that green / grey quilt that the S5570s came in? Ooh boi my wallet would be a-hurtin'. Tack multiscale onto that and I don't care how much it costs, I'd find a way to afford it


----------



## Sogradde

This as a prestige would be nice.



I like the Blackmachine'ish aesthetic a lot. I remember there being a similar model with a black top but I can't seem to find it anymore, that would be nice too. 

This should be a regular model too:



Mostly because I missed my chance on getting one. Or at least a 6-String version.


----------



## Shoeless_jose

That Luke Hoskins RG signature prototype but with a trem would be heaven.

I swear every ibanez model that has the look I like is fixed bridge, or its got the features I like and a trem but it's puke burst, like I just wish they would choose one feature set and aesthetic and make a fixed and trem variant of it.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> This as a prestige would be nice.
> View attachment 65281
> 
> 
> I like the Blackmachine'ish aesthetic a lot. I remember there being a similar model with a black top but I can't seem to find it anymore, that would be nice too.
> 
> This should be a regular model too:
> View attachment 65282
> 
> 
> Mostly because I missed my chance on getting one. Or at least a 6-String version.


Funny enough that top one is actually a 26.5" scale. It also comes in two other colors. These were so damn cool when they came out, but Japan only, and not prestige. I would love to have this as a prestige too.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Albake21 said:


> Funny enough that top one is actually a 26.5" scale. It also comes in two other colors. These were so damn cool when they came out, but Japan only, and not prestige. I would love to have this as a prestige too.



Yeah those were super cool- weren't they the Shimamura exclusives?
I remember a member here jumped through all of the hoops to get one of those imported to Europe and the result was much less than impressive...standard series is kind of a bummer sometimes.


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Yeah those were super cool- weren't they the Shimamura exclusives?
> I remember a member here jumped through all of the hoops to get one of those imported to Europe and the result was much less than impressive...standard series is kind of a bummer sometimes.


Yup with Shimamura Gakki. There are still several on ebay for a small amount of $800 to $1000+ lol


----------



## Cromatic

I would like to see more natural wood finishes on prestiges. And more guitars without an outer burst fade. I love my rg652mpbfx, but aside from a more sturdy finish I would have loved if the top was just straight up darkened poplar burl without the black edges. Like Mayones does it.


----------



## odibrom

Sogradde said:


> (...)
> 
> This should be a regular model too:
> View attachment 65282
> 
> 
> Mostly because I missed my chance on getting one. Or at least a 6-String version.



I've seen one in UK and other in Itally (for almost double the price of the first) selling on Reverb this week... Grab them! I'd done that myself but am out of cash flow...


----------



## xzacx

Sogradde said:


> This as a prestige would be nice.
> View attachment 65281
> 
> 
> I like the Blackmachine'ish aesthetic a lot. I remember there being a similar model with a black top but I can't seem to find it anymore, that would be nice too.
> 
> This should be a regular model too:
> View attachment 65282
> 
> 
> Mostly because I missed my chance on getting one. Or at least a 6-String version.



I wouldn't be able to resist this with a rosewood board and double cream pups—basically a Burst-inspired RG. Isn't there actually a pretty similar older J Custom? Might be ebony board though.


----------



## MFB

xzacx said:


> I wouldn't be able to resist this with a rosewood board and double cream pups—basically a Burst inspired RG. Isn't there actually a pretty similar older J Custom? Might be ebony board though.



Cream? Nah son, _zebra_ on them bad boys


----------



## A-Branger

Sogradde said:


> This as a prestige would be nice.
> View attachment 65281
> 
> 
> I like the Blackmachine'ish aesthetic a lot. I remember there being a similar model with a black top but I can't seem to find it anymore, that would be nice too.



yeah there was a tread in here http://www.sevenstring.org/threads/new-ibanez-rgr-models.314479/ Those are the RGRs

I wonder why Ibanez hasnt jumped on those more, with the current trends those would sell pretty well specially with the longer scale. I much rather then trying to copy Mayones/BlackMachine looks, rather than trying to copy Kiesel with the funky un-matcing colors and vomit burl tops


----------



## Humanoid

Albake21 said:


> Funny enough that top one is actually a 26.5" scale. It also comes in two other colors. These were so damn cool when they came out, but Japan only, and not prestige. I would love to have this as a prestige too.



I have the current model in the picture. The quality of it is quite nice even if it's not a Prestige model. Also, the QM6 pickups sound better than a few alternatives I tried.


----------



## Vyn

A-Branger said:


> yeah there was a tread in here http://www.sevenstring.org/threads/new-ibanez-rgr-models.314479/ Those are the RGRs
> 
> I wonder why Ibanez hasnt jumped on those more, with the current trends those would sell pretty well specially with the longer scale. I much rather then trying to copy Mayones/BlackMachine looks, rather than trying to copy Kiesel with the funky un-matcing colors and vomit burl tops



For what it's worth, the finish on the black RGRs is stupif fucking thin. I've already chipped the front of my 6.


----------



## Miek

Albake21 said:


> Funny enough that top one is actually a 26.5" scale. It also comes in two other colors. These were so damn cool when they came out, but Japan only, and not prestige. I would love to have this as a prestige too.


are you thinking of the rgr652ahf?


----------



## MatiasTolkki

lewis said:


> the ibanez stock pickups are terrible. V series and the INF pickups are simply unusable.
> 
> Ive recently inherited the latter in an RG i picked up, even with the tonal shaping of the Ax8, they are terrible.



V1/V2s in my RG5000 would like a word with you. Those things sounded incredible through my standard pedal board, and are definitely the best Ibanez pups I've tried.

Special acknowledgement goes to the Core tone bridge pup on the Roadcores, those things are absolutely amazing.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

As for my dream Ibanez that I hope comes out at NAMM:

RG750 reissue. The 770s get ALL the reissues, but a 750 in Violet Pearl or Heather pearl, with a 550 line that has Five alarm orange and Atlantic blue... absolute perfection. Also, Square heels are perfectly fine with me.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

So, should we expect to see some evertune equipped models into the 2019 iron label line ?


----------



## Metropolis

TheUnknownOne said:


> So, should we expect to see some evertune equipped models into the 2019 iron label line ?



Guess not because Ibanez uses their own licensed hardware made by Gotoh or few other factories in Asia.


----------



## A-Branger

I dont think so. Ibanez has always (or for the most part) used their own designed bridges.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Is the Evertune even that popular? I've seen few of the LTDs with them, no one seems to care about the VGS models anymore. Kiesel offers it now, but no one seems to excited.


----------



## Lindmann

At least I am excited.
I absolutely love it.

Solar guitars has them as well.


----------



## canuck brian

Kaura said:


> I really hope Ibanez never starts using that with their higher end models. It instantly makes any Ibby look like a low-end/mid-range model, imo.



No swoosh on the headstock makes Ibanez guitars look like imposters to me. Checkmark headstock + no model indicator = win (mostly because it's probably old as hell.) I have a weird mental thing where I automatically believe in my head that the guitar is inferior without a swoosh...and I know that's very ridiculous.

JEM without a swoosh? GET OUT.

Also the swoosh makes you play faster. It's proven.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Lindmann said:


> At least I am excited.
> I absolutely love it.
> 
> Solar guitars has them as well.



I was giving them the benefit of the doubt as Solar is both newer and most I've seen around the web are non-Evertune models.


----------



## cardinal

MaxOfMetal said:


> Is the Evertune even that popular? I've seen few of the LTDs with them, no one seems to care about the VGS models anymore. Kiesel offers it now, but no one seems to excited.



I kinda wish LTD would knock it off too. I know that you can’t please everyone, but they have at least two models that I would love it they had just opted for more standard/typical specs. The M1008 or whatever and the EC1008 would be absolutely incredible to me if they just hadn’t fanned the frets or gone Evertune, respectively. I don’t see either flying off the shelves as is; simplifying the specs at least would have made them cheaper if not more palatable to most players.


----------



## possumkiller

Evertune+Fishman+Burbevelone+rainbow diarrhea burst fade=WIN!!!!!!!!!¡


----------



## fps

MaxOfMetal said:


> Is the Evertune even that popular? I've seen few of the LTDs with them, no one seems to care about the VGS models anymore. Kiesel offers it now, but no one seems to excited.



From what I gather it's outstanding for touring professionals with tuning needs. That's not a lotta people.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

fps said:


> From what I gather it's outstanding for touring professionals with tuning needs. That's not a lotta people.



I'm not questioning the units themselves, it just seems like no one really cares about them anymore. Obviously not "no one", but there are Evertune variants of some of the most popular guitars and they're still something of a rarity. 

They're probably selling enough to keep them in rotation on LTDs and similarly priced import guitars, but probably not enough for other brands to start offering them on large scale production guitars.


----------



## Kaura

canuck brian said:


> I have a weird mental thing where I automatically believe in my head that the guitar is inferior without a swoosh...and I know that's very ridiculous.



Indeed, because the swoosh is only used on the low/mid-tier models. I guess it's just a generation thing. Like I said before, I grew up with the non-swoosh logo so I prefer it.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Kaura said:


> Indeed, because the swoosh is only used on the low/mid-tier models. I guess it's just a generation thing. Like I said before, I grew up with the non-swoosh logo so I prefer it.



i don't care, as long as it says ibanez and is MIJ i'm perfectly happy with it.


----------



## fps

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm not questioning the units themselves, it just seems like no one really cares about them anymore. Obviously not "no one", but there are Evertune variants of some of the most popular guitars and they're still something of a rarity.
> 
> They're probably selling enough to keep them in rotation on LTDs and similarly priced import guitars, but probably not enough for other brands to start offering them on large scale production guitars.



Yes, I guess if you're Evertune it's the holy grail to be part of production models and that's always going to be what they're shooting for.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

fps said:


> Yes, I guess if you're Evertune it's the holy grail to be part of production models and that's always going to be what they're shooting for.



Of course Evertune wants everyone to make Evertune models, but it seems like it would be a hard sell.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

MaxOfMetal said:


> Of course Evertune wants everyone to make Evertune models, but it seems like it would be a hard sell.



To me it's not so different than offering Trem and Fixed bridge variants, like Ibanez often does for Iron Label and Prestige models. I'm pretty sure they sold much more RGAIX6 fixed bridge model than trem-ones by the way.

Then, there is the proprietary hardware thing to consider


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TheUnknownOne said:


> To me it's not so different than offering Trem and Fixed bridge variants, like Ibanez often does for Iron Label and Prestige models. I'm pretty sure they sold much more RGAIX6 fixed bridge model than trem-ones by the way.
> 
> Then, there is the proprietary hardware thing to consider



Adding SKUs adds cost.

Trem and fixed bridge are known quantities, Evertune not so much.

You have to look at it as "will enough Evertune models sell to make up the cost of adding a SKU". 

I think in order for Ibanez to start offering Evertune models there would have to be an artist involved. That's typically how Ibanez does it, they're very artist driven when it comes to new products.


----------



## canuck brian

Kaura said:


> Indeed, because the swoosh is only used on the low/mid-tier models. I guess it's just a generation thing. Like I said before, I grew up with the non-swoosh logo so I prefer it.



You misread - I see guitars without the swoosh as inferior. All the old early 90's ones I own are swooshed.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

MaxOfMetal said:


> Is the Evertune even that popular? I've seen few of the LTDs with them, no one seems to care about the VGS models anymore. Kiesel offers it now, but no one seems to excited.



I don't think it is, either. 
I think a lot of it boils down to additional cost. We've seen the addition of an evertune tends to add...what, like $3-400 on to list price? As a consumer you'd have to really, really care about always being in tune for that level of extra cost to be worth it and I'd assume that's a small pool of people.


----------



## Mathemagician

fps said:


> From what I gather it's outstanding for touring professionals with tuning needs. That's not a lotta people.



That is one thing I’ve noticed too. Lots of metal guitarists who primarily play fixed bridge models have moved over to evertune because it makes life so much easier for them. They already have 2-4+ guitars with them on tour so it’s not like they’re Drop tuning in the fly.


----------



## Xaios

All I want for Christmas is for Ibanez to throw the Vine of Life inlay in the trash.


----------



## Lindmann

Ordacleaphobia said:


> As a consumer you'd have to really, really care about always being in tune for that level of extra cost to be worth it


In my eyes the "always in tune" thing is not even the biggest advantage of it. For me the "perfect intonation regardless of scale length or string gauge" is where it's at.
To be able to tune low without the hassle of frets too far apart or super thick strings.

But I think, a lot of metal guitarist just aren't aware of this and consequently aren't willing to pay the upcharge.


----------



## Leviathus

Xaios said:


> All I want for Christmas is for Ibanez to throw the Vine of Life inlay in the trash.



How dare you.


----------



## Andromalia

MaxOfMetal said:


> Is the Evertune even that popular? I've seen few of the LTDs with them, no one seems to care about the VGS models anymore. Kiesel offers it now, but no one seems to excited.



Their setup requires you to read a manual, we all know how it ends up with the general public. It's likely condemned to stay a niche bridge for that reason alone.


----------



## InHiding

It’s weird that people buy their extremely overpriced j customs. You can get a killer Mayones for cheaper. They look better too. Some cheaper models are sometimes ok though. I got a cool one about a year ago. I agree with the chrome black suck. It looks good but it’s not a finish that should be used due to the ridiculous wear.


----------



## ThomasUV777

InHiding said:


> It’s weird that people buy their extremely overpriced j customs. You can get a killer Mayones for cheaper. They look better too. Some cheaper models are sometimes ok though. I got a cool one about a year ago. I agree with the chrome black suck. It looks good but it’s not a finish that should be used due to the ridiculous wear.



Have you ever played an "overpriced" J-custom? To me, they're worth every penny. The craftsmanship and perfection of the setup are just out of this world.


----------



## InHiding

Most people seem to think their guitar always has the best setup ever. I believe they are good, but they are overpriced. I setup my own guitars thank you and I got 4 ibanez guitars including the jem 10th which I guess should be comparable to a j custom??? It’s fine, my regular Regius was a bit better, I maybe got lucky with that one though.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

InHiding said:


> Most people seem to think their guitar always has the best setup ever. I believe they are good, but they are overpriced. I setup my own guitars thank you and I got 4 ibanez guitars including the jem 10th which I guess should be comparable to a j custom??? It’s fine, my regular Regius was a bit better, I maybe got lucky with that one though.




Or maybe your tastes don't line up with everyone else's?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

InHiding said:


> You can get a killer Mayones for cheaper.



In Europe, yes. In just about the rest of the world JCs are cheaper and more abundant.


----------



## RiksRiks

InHiding said:


> It’s weird that people buy their extremely overpriced j customs. You can get a killer Mayones for cheaper. They look better too. Some cheaper models are sometimes ok though. I got a cool one about a year ago. I agree with the chrome black suck. It looks good but it’s not a finish that should be used due to the ridiculous wear.


I swore by Mayones, but lately the more guitars by them I play, the more I realize they are mostly average TO MY TASTE AND PREFERENCES, so paying a huge premium for one, I don't know man! There has been a couple or three than have been beyond perfection but I'd say that sounds rather risky considering the price.

Also, the price difference is huge here in Japan. Mayones are way too expensive. They are almost twice the price as one of the new AZ and in my experience, they are not twice the quality, albeit they are more premium in a lot of ways.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

InHiding said:


> It’s weird that people buy their extremely overpriced j customs. You can get a killer Mayones for cheaper. They look better too. Some cheaper models are sometimes ok though. I got a cool one about a year ago. I agree with the chrome black suck. It looks good but it’s not a finish that should be used due to the ridiculous wear.



I highly doubt that a Mayones or any guitar really will be much "better" than a nice J. Custom. 
When you're paying that kind of money, you're mostly paying for aesthetics and a pedigree, both of which are subjective. 

But yes, you do have a point. Some of the J. Customs are obscenely priced. That spalt one from what, last year? Was like 4 or 5 grand?


----------



## Kaura

RiksRiks said:


> I swore by Mayones, but lately the more guitars by them I play, the more I realize they are mostly average TO MY TASTE AND PREFERENCES



For me it used to be complete opposite before I tested out some Mayoneses. I used to think (Prestige) RGs were the shit, but after trying out a Mayones, they just felt like shit.

Of course all the RGs I've tried and owned have been sub-2000€ and the Mayoneses I tested were +2000€ but I just wonder if J Customs would actually offer any improvement over Prestiges playing-wise. 

I fear that RG as a guitar design is just not as good as I used to think or simply just not for me. The Mayoneses were just a joy to play compared to RGs which of course I've enjoyed playing over the years but now I realise that there was always just something off about them and nowhere near the "perfect guitar" for me.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Lindmann said:


> In my eyes the "always in tune" thing is not even the biggest advantage of it. For me the "perfect intonation regardless of scale length or string gauge" is where it's at.
> To be able to tune low without the hassle of frets too far apart or super thick strings.
> 
> But I think, a lot of metal guitarist just aren't aware of this and consequently aren't willing to pay the upcharge.



and this is why music is shit today. everything pitch perfect and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have pro tools or evertune and they sounded amazing.


----------



## A-Branger

Lindmann said:


> In my eyes the "always in tune" thing is not even the biggest advantage of it. For me the "perfect intonation regardless of scale length or string gauge" is where it's at.
> To be able to tune low without the hassle of frets too far apart or super thick strings.



you have 0 idea on how this bridge works and the uniqueness of it, and how intonation is achieved.

I got perfect intonation on my fixed bridge guitar, same with my bass. I just need to adjust my bridge to achieve such thing. No matter where I am and what I play, as long as I stick to the same string gauge and to the same tuning my intonation would never change. Same with whatever guitar you currently have

Evertune bridges work by tension. If you know how a floyd works, picture that but for each individual string now (as a starting point as it is different). The bridge is settup so each string you put in has a fixed tension. This tension would be equal to "X gauge string in Y tunning", so the idea is IF theres a change in temperature and your neck moves (for example), then this new change in tenstion is compensated by the springs under the bridge, as the bridge would want to keep the fixed amount of tension you set it up to, by default keeping your guitar in tune. Reason why you can even set the bridge so sensitive that you cant even make a bend as every time you pull the string for a bend (increasing tension), the springs would counteract in order to stay "in tune"

intonation has nothing to do with it

this bridge has same intonation range as a normal fixed bridge, so its up to you, to set up the intonation point of your guitar. (or the physical spot where the guitar bridge would sit relative to the nut), once you set the spot, the "saddle" would stay there and would work its tunning maggic from such spot.

you wanna change tunnings?, cool, so what exactly you want to do?, just de-tune your guitar?.... cool, so now you change the tension of each string, now the bridge doesnt work as you initially set it up. So IF you want to change tunning AND keep the functionality of the bridge, then you need the allan key and you change the "tunning" in the bridge (or the amount of tension required per string)

you wanna change string gauges?... cool, unless your new tunning and new string gauges result in the exact tension per string as your intitial settup, then you would have to again, change the setting of your bridge. And like any other regular guitar, fix the intonation of your bridge for the new tuning. This bridge wont magically change your scale lenght. Remeber its you the one who tells the saddle where to stay

remember that


Lindmann said:


> I
> To be able to tune low without the hassle of frets too far apart or super thick strings.


reason for it is to keep a desired amount of tension on a string. Lets say you are happy with your low E on a 25.5" guitar?, but now you want to tune your guitar to a low B, so what are your options?:

-de-tune your guitar to B..... this would make the B string floppy, still "playabe?" but you want the same feeling of your E so you can play fast and precise riffs..... so you then have to increase the tension of your string, so your options are:

-Increase the gauge. You go from a 42 to a 56 (or something like that, donno exact numbers), this would give you the same amount of tension, BUT now you have a big fat string to play on, so you loose a bit of tone clarity.

-Increase scale lenght. the longer the scale, the more tension required to achieve same note. So you get a 27" guitar, so now instead of using a 56, you can get away with a 48 or 52 (again random numbers that I havent calculate), this new thinner string would give you a better crisp tone and a thinner string that feels better to play.


evertune bridges wont magically give you extra tension. You settup the amount of tension on them. Thye only have a certain range of tension to work with. REason why if you like your guitar settup with a really high amount of tension in your strings, you actualyl need to buy a higher tension saddle replacement, one that has a different range. Thats for lets say tunning to standard E with a 52 string (example with no real calculated numbers here), but if you try to put a 42 string on the same saddle, due to tension now your bridge would tune that string to a higher A, so you are going to keep trying to "tunne it down" to E and you would find the limit range of the bridge before you reach E, as the bridge only has so muhc range to work with and you are going to reach the limit of it in F# (for example). So now you would need to change your saddle for a regular tension range one so you can achieve your E at 42


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

A-Branger said:


> sup yall its me its ya boy A-Branger just showin up to drop some knowledge on whatever it is we're talkin about today



Informative/10.


----------



## couverdure

MatiasTolkki said:


> and this is why music is shit today. everything pitch perfect and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have pro tools or evertune and they sounded amazing.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

couverdure said:


>



said like a true young person.


----------



## Soya

How's your Kiesel?


----------



## Lindmann

A-Branger said:


> you have 0 idea on how this bridge works and the uniqueness of it, and how intonation is achieved (...)


You’re missing the point. Or I should have given you more detail. Sorry about that.
Let me explain.

Let’s assume you prefer 25,5” scale due to better playability.
And you prefer rather slim strings due to their better tone.


If you now tuned your regular-bridged guitar down to A you’d have to
a) Be careful of not fretting too hard as the string tension is so low that you can easily detune it by applying to much finger pressure (particularly nasty when playing chords)
b) Pick very lightly in order not to pick the note sharp.

If that’s okay for you then…fine…The Evertune then won’t help you there.
But if you like to pick very hard, especially to get that certain tone, then you either have to increase the string gauge or use a baritone.
Or…you could use an Evertune bridge where you can pick as hard as you want…you will always hit the note right at its center. Not a few cents sharp. Not a few cents flat.

I get that this might not be for everybody. Some folks just prefer baritones. Or prefer picking very carefully. Or they don’t even tune low.
But for me the ability to tune low, play standard scale, play thin strings and STILL to pick very hard to get this very crushing tone…that is what makes it worth the additional 400$.
I would rather spend 400$ less on pickups. In my experience the hard picking adds way more to the tone than any pickup swap could do.


----------



## Lindmann

MatiasTolkki said:


> and this is why music is shit today. everything pitch perfect and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have pro tools or evertune and they sounded amazing.



This could be said about any innovation in the guitar world.
(the old man yelling at a cloud meme would be appropriate here…oh wait…)


and this is why music is shit today. everything sounding good and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have stellar pickups and they sounded amazing

and this is why metal music is shit today. everything distorted and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have high gain amps and they sounded amazing

and this is why metal music is shit today. everything creative and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have Floyd rose bridges and they sounded amazing

…


----------



## InHiding

But music is shit today so you are wrong


----------



## Metropolis

InHiding said:


> But music is shit today so you are wrong



Yeah, stop creating music then.


----------



## canuck brian

MatiasTolkki said:


> and this is why music is shit today. everything pitch perfect and all... the blues and jazz guys of the 40s and 50s didn't have pro tools or evertune and they sounded amazing.



You're listening to the wrong music. There's tons of amazing music being made these days and not everyone is using Protools to fix things.


----------



## Kaura

Protools? Can't believe someone still uses that grandpa of DAWs.


----------



## JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo

MatiasTolkki said:


> said like a true young person.



Said like a jaded old fart.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hey let's argue about more completely subjective things! 

Or not. Leave Mati and his new buddy who's hiding to their own devices.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

OliOliver said:


> Said like a jaded old fart.



Jaded? There are plenty of newer bands that I listen to, and my point went completely unaddressed anyway. Ask yourself why classic bands with classic, groundbreaking albums are considered that. Did they need perfect pitch tuning? Did they need to downtune to drop Z flat? it's specifically the metal bands pushing things in that direction, then when they cant play in time, they call it "prog." Sorry but having pristine production and exactly perfect everything in music makes it boring as fuck. I own LOTS of new albums from lots of newer bands, but I always end up going back to Andy Timmons' Ear Xtasy, any number of Queen albums or early priest stuff. Why? Has nothing to do with being jaded, but with exactly what I just took my precious time to type out. Now fuck off so I can stare at my japanese green card that i got the other day that states i'm a "Permanent resident."


----------



## Lord Voldemort

It's always fun when people prefer mistakes and flaws in their music, like that's the deciding arbiter of what they'll listen to and support. 'Did you hear that wrong note? This music is awesome, super raw and not produced in pro tools probably!'

Call me old fashioned, but I exclusively judge a composition by notes it contains and the order they're placed in. It it's performed perfectly awesome, I'm able to hear it as intended. 

Anyways, check out those Ibanez models for 2019!


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Ahem... getting back on track...



MaxOfMetal said:


> I think in order for Ibanez to start offering Evertune models there would have to be an artist involved. That's typically how Ibanez does it, they're very artist driven when it comes to new products.



It's pipe dreaming, but since Joe Satriani has praised Evertune a fair bit, I was hoping for him to push for an Evertune JS for his next odd hartail line. And pioneering the FX Edge before anyone else, makes me think Ibanez giving him an Evertune equipped production model is more likely. From the JS600/700 to 1600/2000 coming out once every few years, he's sort of due for another one now. 

...that is unless Satch has since moved on from them.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Ahem... getting back on track...
> 
> 
> 
> It's pipe dreaming, but since Joe Satriani has praised Evertune a fair bit, I was hoping for him to push for an Evertune JS for his next odd hartail line. And pioneering the FX Edge before anyone else, makes me think Ibanez giving him an Evertune equipped production model is more likely. From the JS600/700 to 1600/2000 coming out once every few years, he's sort of due for another one now.
> 
> ...that is unless he's since moved on from them.



As far as I know he hasn't gotten a LACS with one. Previous hardtail JS models were preceded by customs first, but Joe gets what Joe wants, so that would definitely be a way to make it happen. 

Speaking of artists and bridges, it would be great if they could finally work out putting the Linear Trem on a JEM. They got really, really close a couple years ago. It makes you think what the demands on both sides that it still hasn't happened yet. Here's to hoping.


----------



## Vyn

Kind of want them to re-release the Xiphos but out of their current artist roster I don't think anyone would be keen on promoting it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> Kind of want them to re-release the Xiphos but out of their current artist roster I don't think anyone would be keen on promoting it.



They can't. It's cursed. 

Look at the launch artists for it. You had Peter Joseph, who pretty much stopped making music, Muhammed from Necrophagist who stopped making music, and I shouldn't have to mention Oli Herbert.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> They can't. It's cursed.
> 
> Look at the launch artists for it. You had Peter Joseph, who pretty much stopped making music, Muhammed from Necrophagist who stopped making music, and I shouldn't have to mention Oli Herbert.



I was half hoping they'd do a limited tribute model but then Jackson would probably get pissy.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> I was half hoping they'd do a limited tribute model but then Jackson would probably get pissy.



I think those are typically in poor taste, especially if the artist didn't have an actual signature model.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think those are typically in poor taste, especially if the artist didn't have an actual signature model.



The Paul Grey bass was a nice touch a few years ago


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> As far as I know he hasn't gotten a LACS with one. Previous hardtail JS models were preceded by customs first, but Joe gets what Joe wants, so that would definitely be a way to make it happen.
> 
> Speaking of artists and bridges, it would be great if they could finally work out putting the Linear Trem on a JEM. They got really, really close a couple years ago. It makes you think what the demands on both sides that it still hasn't happened yet. Here's to hoping.



I didn't even realise Vai had gotten that close to having them. Hell, Vai's been tight lipped about what he's doing with amps post Carvin… but that's a whole different subject completely.

I'd like to think that the gold JS2000 with the evertune highly publicized on their website wasn't a retrofit, or perhaps it was really well done more than the obvious chorme boy retrofits where there's obvious cavity fillings from the Edge routings. But agreed. If there's one guy in the Ibanez roster to champion the Evertune, it's Satch. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> They can't. It's cursed.
> 
> Look at the launch artists for it. You had Peter Joseph, who pretty much stopped making music, Muhammed from Necrophagist who stopped making music, and I shouldn't have to mention Oli Herbert.



Sssshhhh! I was sort of trying to be one of those ambassadors, had I went on to that Slayer/Gojira tour and beyond but then... ah dammit.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> I didn't even realise Vai had gotten that close to having them. Hell, Vai's been tight lipped about what he's doing with amps post Carvin… but that's a whole different subject completely.
> 
> I'd like to think that the gold JS2000 with the evertune highly publicized on their website wasn't a retrofit, or perhaps it was really well done more than the obvious chorme boy retrofits where there's obvious cavity fillings from the Edge routings. But agreed. If there's one guy in the Ibanez roster to champion the Evertune, it's Satch.
> 
> 
> 
> Sssshhhh! I was sort of trying to be one of those ambassadors, had I went on to that Slayer/Gojira tour and beyond but then... ah dammit.



Wasn't that JS from like four or five years ago? I would have figured more would have come of it by now, seeing as he's had multiple new Sigs since then.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> Wasn't that JS from like four or five years ago? I would have figured more would have come of it by now, seeing as he's had multiple new Sigs since then.



Yeah, it's whenever Satch releases a hardtail sig once in a blue moon between all his other sigs with whammys. All with unusual specs like mahogany body and even dual P90s. The last hardtail was the JS1600, before he got any Evertunes installed. That model was 8 years ago.

I guess in fairness, jumping to alder bodies, 24 frets, new Dimarzios and a Sustainiac are already huge and abundant changes in the JS line.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Yeah, it's whenever Satch releases a hardtail sig once in a blue moon between all his other sigs with whammys. All with unusual specs like mahogany body and even dual P90s. The last hardtail was the JS1600, before he got any Evertunes installed. That model was 8 years ago.
> 
> I guess in fairness, jumping to alder bodies, 24 frets, new Dimarzios and a Sustainiac are already huge and abundant changes in the JS line.



If I remember correctly, most of his hardtail models have been trying to somewhat replicate certain non-Ibanez guitars he uses/has used in the studio.

I loved the JS700.


----------



## A-Branger

Lindmann said:


> You’re missing the point. Or I should have given you more detail. Sorry about that.
> Let me explain.
> 
> Let’s assume you prefer 25,5” scale due to better playability.
> And you prefer rather slim strings due to their better tone.
> 
> 
> If you now tuned your regular-bridged guitar down to A you’d have to
> a) Be careful of not fretting too hard as the string tension is so low that you can easily detune it by applying to much finger pressure (particularly nasty when playing chords)
> b) Pick very lightly in order not to pick the note sharp.
> 
> If that’s okay for you then…fine…The Evertune then won’t help you there.
> But if you like to pick very hard, especially to get that certain tone, then you either have to increase the string gauge or use a baritone.
> Or…you could use an Evertune bridge where you can pick as hard as you want…you will always hit the note right at its center. Not a few cents sharp. Not a few cents flat.
> 
> I get that this might not be for everybody. Some folks just prefer baritones. Or prefer picking very carefully. Or they don’t even tune low.
> But for me the ability to tune low, play standard scale, play thin strings and STILL to pick very hard to get this very crushing tone…that is what makes it worth the additional 400$.
> I would rather spend 400$ less on pickups. In my experience the hard picking adds way more to the tone than any pickup swap could do.



aaaammmm I got you now, and sorry if I mistaken you before  

I get it, you want to get the evertune to work in its mos sensitive setting, so while you cant make any bends, you also wont loose pitch of a note no matter how ahrd you hit it, like you said. Only two problems with your idea:

1- you still would be playing with "sloppy" strings. But hey if it is what you like then perfect

2- The Evertune might wont have the range to accomodate your desired low tension tunning. And before you jump on a guitar with an evertune, I would recomend you to go to a string tension calculator, see whats your settup, and then go to the Evertune website and check that the system can handle those low tension string settings. How how thin you can get away with on the strings before the system wont work


----------



## Lindmann

A-Branger said:


> 1- you still would be playing with "sloppy" strings. But hey if it is what you like then perfect


Yep. They're still kinda sloppy.
That is why I go for a middle ground and combine the Evertune with slightly thicker strings.



A-Branger said:


> And before you jump on a guitar with an evertune, I would recomend you to go to a string tension calculator


A already have an Evertune guitar for two years now.
All the stuff I wrote wasn't theory but my very own experience.
I had no problems getting down to drop G with a .64 gauge G string (standard saddle)


----------



## couverdure

Aren't the Wintersun dudes using EverTune on their Ibanez? I remember Jari getting a custom RGD with what it appears to be a basic gold Gotoh trem because the LACS didn't have the option for it, and he replaced it with an ET. Teemu also has modified JBM100s with them as well.

If Ken Susi were still with Ibanez, I'm sure he'd push the EverTune into their guitars like what he's doing with Fishman's Fluence pickups and their artists (which Ibanez are already doing with their 6-string Iron Label fanned RGD and the Luke Hoskin sig). That also made me wonder if he's also responsible for getting Wintersun use those since I'm starting to see the combination of those two a lot lately (Head from Korn and recently Matt Heafy comes to mind).


----------



## lewis

evertune should now be the main hardtail bridge really.
Seems odd to me that some companies refuse to just accept it and move with the times.

I get that some of them have invested heavily over the years in their own hardware (Ibanez for example with the Gibraltar bridges) but if they went Evertune instead, people would be fine paying a higher price so its not like they would be down money.


----------



## A-Branger

Lindmann said:


> Yep. They're still kinda sloppy.
> That is why I go for a middle ground and combine the Evertune with slightly thicker strings.
> 
> 
> A already have an Evertune guitar for two years now.
> All the stuff I wrote wasn't theory but my very own experience.
> I had no problems getting down to drop G with a .64 gauge G string (standard saddle)


all good then  I would sit down here quietly for now


----------



## MaxOfMetal

lewis said:


> evertune should now be the main hardtail bridge really.
> Seems odd to me that some companies refuse to just accept it and move with the times.
> 
> I get that some of them have invested heavily over the years in their own hardware (Ibanez for example with the Gibraltar bridges) but if they went Evertune instead, people would be fine paying a higher price so its not like they would be down money.



Just like folks with Floyds, when folks see all those moving parts they get scared. 

It doesn't matter if the system is objectively better (which the jury is still out on), folks don't want to deal with any perceived setup complications. 

As for folks paying the premium, I'd wager the non-Evertune EC1000s outsell the Evertune variant. At least from what I've seen.


----------



## Metropolis

couverdure said:


> Aren't the Wintersun dudes using EverTune on their Ibanez? I remember Jari getting a custom RGD with what it appears to be a basic gold Gotoh trem because the LACS didn't have the option for it, and he replaced it with an ET. Teemu also has modified JBM100s with them as well.
> 
> If Ken Susi were still with Ibanez, I'm sure he'd push the EverTune into their guitars like what he's doing with Fishman's Fluence pickups and their artists (which Ibanez are already doing with their 6-string Iron Label fanned RGD and the Luke Hoskin sig). That also made me wonder if he's also responsible for getting Wintersun use those since I'm starting to see the combination of those two a lot lately (Head from Korn and recently Matt Heafy comes to mind).



Yes, but they're aftermarket installations made by estonian luthier kaurkukkur. I don't know about their relationship with Fishman, but I gues Jari also likes that active kind of sound.
https://www.instagram.com/kaurkukkur/


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

lewis said:


> evertune should now be the main hardtail bridge really.
> Seems odd to me that some companies refuse to just accept it and move with the times.
> 
> I get that some of them have invested heavily over the years in their own hardware (Ibanez for example with the Gibraltar bridges) but if they went Evertune instead, people would be fine paying a higher price so its not like they would be down money.



Yeah, I wouldn't be so sure about that. I know I wouldn't, not with the upcharge that currently comes bundled with an Evertune. It's almost enough for a second guitar, sometimes. 
A standard hipshot bridge is more than comfy enough for me and if I want to splurge I'll get a Schaller. If they can figure out how to get the Evertune in the hands of customers for a substantially lower upcharge (I'm talking 50-60%) then sure, but I don't even know if that's feasible.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Yeah, I wouldn't be so sure about that. I know I wouldn't, not with the upcharge that currently comes bundled with an Evertune. It's almost enough for a second guitar, sometimes.
> A standard hipshot bridge is more than comfy enough for me and if I want to splurge I'll get a Schaller. If they can figure out how to get the Evertune in the hands of customers for a substantially lower upcharge (I'm talking 50-60%) then sure, but I don't even know if that's feasible.



I think we're already there. 

The EC1000 without Evertune: $870 to $1000 depending on color.

The same EC1000 with Evertune: $900 to $1100

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/search.php?s=Ec1000

Smaller builders are probably using so few due to demand that they buy individual units instead of going wholesale.


----------



## Xaios

lewis said:


> evertune should now be the main hardtail bridge really.
> Seems odd to me that some companies refuse to just accept it and move with the times.
> 
> I get that some of them have invested heavily over the years in their own hardware (Ibanez for example with the Gibraltar bridges) but if they went Evertune instead, people would be fine paying a higher price so its not like they would be down money.


A) The vast majority of proprietary hardware isn't used because it's better than aftermarket solutions out there. While exceptions exist (for example, Ibanez has several trems that are arguably as good if not better than an OFR), the simple fact is that it's mostly used because it's cheaper, and thus allows for either lower selling prices and/or higher margins. It's a business decision, and a smart one at that. Why pay $200 for an Evertune (assuming they can be had with that kind of discount at volume) when you can slap a $20 in-house hardtail on that will generally do the job just fine, keep the costs down, and sell the guitar at a more attractive price point. Only seasoned, serious players are going to care enough about the extra tuning stability this system affords to the point where they're willing to pay a premium for it, so its marketability is limited at best.

B) Call me when they get rid of the hideous branding on the plate, then we'll talk. Until that day comes, no thank you.


----------



## InHiding

Evertune looks kinda ugly and I will never believe it works before I try it out for at least five to ten years to see that it works long term. All that is never going to happen of course.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

InHiding said:


> Evertune looks kinda ugly and I will never believe it works before I try it out for at least five to ten years to see that it works long term. All that is never going to happen of course.




This is an incredibly flawed way of thinking, I must say. Not wanting to try something, fine, but applying demerits without even giving something a chance to work for you?


----------



## possumkiller

PunkBillCarson said:


> This is an incredibly flawed way of thinking, I must say. Not wanting to try something, fine, but applying demerits without even giving something a chance to work for you?


Honestly, the Evertune is just as appealing to me as the Edge FX. "All the pain in the ass and complications of a trem plus all the whammy and dive bomb capability of a ToM!" Well, actually, at least the Edge FX looks cool. The Evertune looks like the 1990s Volvo of guitar bridges.


----------



## Miek

possumkiller said:


> Honestly, the Evertune is just as appealing to me as the Edge FX. "All the pain in the ass and complications of a trem plus all the whammy and dive bomb capability of a ToM!" Well, actually, at least the Edge FX looks cool. The Evertune looks like the 1990s Volvo of guitar bridges.


haha overbuilt, unkillable, and with all the aesthetic grace of a Lego Borg cube? not inaccurate. I think it's just a niche product that is in very early ages of the technology. if it can be refined or downsized I think it'll become more commonplace.

also I'm an big block letter ibanez logo guy.


----------



## Hollowway

possumkiller said:


> Honestly, the Evertune is just as appealing to me as the Edge FX. "All the pain in the ass and complications of a trem plus all the whammy and dive bomb capability of a ToM!" Well, actually, at least the Edge FX looks cool. The Evertune looks like the 1990s Volvo of guitar bridges.



100% agree. It’s like when you see this super cute girl in a car ahead of you, with super nice long hair, and you switch lanes, weave in and out of traffic, and finally pull up slightly ahead of her, and look diagonally back into her car, to see if her face is as cute as you figured it would be based on her hair. And she looks back at you. And she’s got a beard. Because she’s a dude. That’s me when I see an 8 string with that damn Edge FX, and feel this momentary excitment that Ibanez made an 8 string trem. Only to have the Edge FX look back at me, saying, “Nope! My fat as is just sitting here bolted to the guitar. I ain’t dive bombing shit!” I swear to god, it’s the Jabba the Hut of bridges. Disgusting, fat, and ultimately evil.


----------



## iamaom

Hollowway said:


> 100% agree. It’s like when you see this super cute girl in a car ahead of you, with super nice long hair, and you switch lanes, weave in and out of traffic, and finally pull up slightly ahead of her, and look diagonally back into her car, to see if her face is as cute as you figured it would be based on her hair.


No wonder California is famous for shitty drivers.


----------



## possumkiller

iamaom said:


> No wonder California is famous for shitty drivers.


Isn't _everywhere_ famous for shitty drivers?


----------



## Seabeast2000

So...I really wonder what Ibanez has up its sleeve for 2019. I am getting the vibe that its just not a new niche model type offering or Kandy Metallic Superflake finish options across the board (although that would be sweet). 
...ahh speculation....such a fail every year.


----------



## SDMFVan

I think the two things that are going to always hurt Evertune are 1) Tuning ain't that hard and 2) You'll never convince purists that hogging out that much wood doesn't impact tone negatively.


----------



## odibrom

^^ You sold me on 1.

Personally, I'm not a fan of Evertune, I prefer by many miles a well setup floyd-rose. Also, these Evertunes don't come with piezos nor have that possibility, so, it's a no go/don't care for me. But I do appreciate the effort and engineering behind it.


----------



## Seabeast2000

SDMFVan said:


> I think the two things that are going to always hurt Evertune are 1) Tuning ain't that hard and 2) You'll never convince purists that hogging out that much wood doesn't impact tone negatively.



I remember going to NAMM 2000 and seeing this huge robotic tuning mechanism installed on an LP. I mean, it seemed like it was half the body volume. Never heard nor saw it ever again. Evertune is tiny compared to that.


----------



## canuck brian

The only thing i don't like about the Evertune bridge is the amount of wood you need to remove from a guitar to install one. I mean they're not for me at all, but I completely understand the desire to have something on your guitar to make sure it never ever ever ever goes out of tune.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I just don't think I'll ever understand being so averse to something as simple as tuning. Especially now. 

I mean, years ago you had to invest in an expensive, bulky and difficult to use tuner if you wanted the highest level of accuracy and instant, real time tracking. Now, $100 can get you all that and more. Heck, even $50 will get you a great tuner. 

I get that it takes a couple minutes, but who doesn't have a couple minutes or even just some seconds? 

Maybe it's because of my background.


----------



## possumkiller

Idk I mean, you gotta be _pretty_ lazy if turning a little peg every now and then is such a debilitating obstacle.


----------



## Seabeast2000

The906 said:


> I remember going to NAMM 2000 and seeing this huge robotic tuning mechanism installed on an LP. I mean, it seemed like it was half the body volume. Never heard nor saw it ever again. Evertune is tiny compared to that.



I had to find this...Its the Transperformance system. Gotta start somewhere right?


----------



## possumkiller

The906 said:


> I had to find this...Its the Transperformance system. Gotta start somewhere right?


Apart from all the robot shit and the keyboard, the actual bridge hardware part looks pretty badass. Kind of like a kahler.


----------



## I play music

possumkiller said:


> Apart from all the robot shit and the keyboard, the actual bridge hardware part looks pretty badass. Kind of like a kahler.


This. And it looks like it just tunes the guitar. While the Evertune removes the slightly going sharp with the pick attack that any non-Evertune guitar has. I think this is why an Evertune will never sound like a normal guitar, not so much because of the removed wood. Also, I think this going slightly sharp with the pick attack is even more pronounced on bass which probably is why there is no bass version of the Evertune. The difference in sound would be even more apparent.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

possumkiller said:


> Honestly, the Evertune is just as appealing to me as the Edge FX. "All the pain in the ass and complications of a trem plus all the whammy and dive bomb capability of a ToM!" Well, actually, at least the Edge FX looks cool. The Evertune looks like the 1990s Volvo of guitar bridges.



That's...actually a great description 
I really like the EdgeFX though and wish there was a 6 string variant. I really love the feel of a trem but hate having one because of all of the maintenance and setup, when I don't even use the floating feature. I just like it as a bridge.


----------



## Sogradde

possumkiller said:


> Idk I mean, you gotta be _pretty_ lazy if turning a little peg every now and then is such a debilitating obstacle.


I know you're probably being sarcastic but this is absolutely not the point of an evertune bridge.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Ordacleaphobia said:


> That's...actually a great description
> I really like the EdgeFX though and wish there was a 6 string variant. I really love the feel of a trem but hate having one because of all of the maintenance and setup, when I don't even use the floating feature. I just like it as a bridge.



There's always the Fixed Lo-Pro.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

MaxOfMetal said:


> There's always the Fixed Lo-Pro.



I had no idea that thing existed. 
What did they put those on?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Ordacleaphobia said:


> I had no idea that thing existed.
> What did they put those on?



The JS2000, MTM1 and RG2520FE.

Grabbing a used MTM1 would probably be the easiest way to give it a go.


----------



## possumkiller

Like the feel of a trem but hate the hassle? Use a Hipshot.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

possumkiller said:


> Like the feel of a trem but hate the hassle? Use a Hipshot.



This is exactly what I do


----------



## prlgmnr

The906 said:


> I had to find this...Its the Transperformance system. Gotta start somewhere right?


Wonder if you could program like an LFO into it


----------



## Leviathus

WHERES THE JEMS?!?!??!?!?!


----------



## Lindmann

possumkiller said:


> Idk I mean, you gotta be _pretty_ lazy if turning a little peg every now and then is such a debilitating obstacle.


Before I had my evertune guitar it happened frequently that my guitars went out of tune on stage right in the middle of a song.
I hated it, because the songs were rather busy so I could not take a little break to tune the damn guitar.

Second thing is what I explained earlier.
When the guitar is tuned down and you neigher have a baritone neck or thick strings, the note is sharp in the moment you pick and then the pich goes down until the note is flat.
If you're okay with this...if you're after this djent kinda sound...good for you.
But if not...well...there's the evertune (if you don't wanna go 27" scale or .70 gauge stings).

It's more than just lazyness.


----------



## possumkiller

Lindmann said:


> When the guitar is tuned down and you neigher have a baritone neck or thick strings, the note is sharp in the moment you pick and then the pich goes down until the note is flat.
> If you're okay with this...if you're after this djent kinda sound...good for you.
> But if not...well...there's the evertune (if you don't wanna go 27" scale or .70 gauge stings).
> 
> It's more than just lazyness.


But is that really all it's for? And if you want to change your tuning you have to redo the tension springs all over again?


----------



## Andromalia

That's what having more than one guitar is for.


----------



## possumkiller

Or if you don't, that's what having a fixed bridge is for. 

If I wanted every guitar locked to a single tuning, they'd all have Floyds...


----------



## Lindmann

possumkiller said:


> And if you want to change your tuning you have to redo the tension springs all over again?


I this case you would turn the allen screws.
It is as hard or quick as changing tuning on a regular guitar.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

I just wish we'd get more possible models in here instead of trying to say why our decisions are better. Whatever works for you may not work for others and you don't need to explain yourself or your purchase.

I wish Ibanez would bring us more 8's. The 852s are getting old. I just got a TAM100 so maybe bring back the edge fx


----------



## cip 123

I play music said:


> This. And it looks like it just tunes the guitar. While the Evertune removes the slightly going sharp with the pick attack that any non-Evertune guitar has. I think this is why an Evertune will never sound like a normal guitar, not so much because of the removed wood. Also, I think this going slightly sharp with the pick attack is even more pronounced on bass which probably is why there is no bass version of the Evertune. The difference in sound would be even more apparent.


I haven't read all of this thread so don't know if it's been brought up in the conversation before. 

But I'm fairly certain you can set the evertune to act normally like a regular bridge, or you can set it so even bending the strings(or picking hard) won't change the pitch.


----------



## AirForbes1

My main concern with an Evertune is changing tunings. I don't know anyone who has one, so I can't check it out. I saw the video of Ola showing his guitar set up in Drop C, then tunes up to D standard. For the guys that have them, how easy is it to go from E to Eb and D standard? I'm pretty sure that means that you can't use the "no bend" feature, which is fine. Can you do that without using the key?


----------



## Vyn

AirForbes1 said:


> My main concern with an Evertune is changing tunings. I don't know anyone who has one, so I can't check it out. I saw the video of Ola showing his guitar set up in Drop C, then tunes up to D standard. For the guys that have them, how easy is it to go from E to Eb and D standard? I'm pretty sure that means that you can't use the "no bend" feature, which is fine. Can you do that without using the key?



TBH, if you're going Evertune and multiple tunings, you're up for multiple guitars. Heck even with a normal hardtail it's way easier to have multiple guitars set up for different tunings.


----------



## AirForbes1

Vyn said:


> TBH, if you're going Evertune and multiple tunings, you're up for multiple guitars. Heck even with a normal hardtail it's way easier to have multiple guitars set up for different tunings.



I was thinking that. I have an Eclipse with a TOM and 11-49 strings let me tune from D to E and it's okay (not perfect, but fine for my use). It's not so much that I want an Evertune, it's that I want an Ltd. BW-1


----------



## odibrom

The thing with the evertune bridge is the same as a floyd rose: one tuning per guitar. The only difference is the obvious absence of the vibrato effects via the vibrato bar. Depending on the Evertune setup one can or cannot have the possibility to bend the note pitch. Changing tunes on the fly is not advisable, that is a feature for the more traditional hard tail / fixed bridge guitars... or so it seams to be as far as I can understand its use and functions.


----------



## A-Branger

get a Drop pedal and happy days


----------



## odibrom

A-Branger said:


> get a Drop pedal and happy days



That's a functional solution for full tuning drops, however if only one string is dropped, these pedals don't help. If the guitar is a 6 stringer, go MIDI, if 7+, buy a new guitar or go with fixed bridges...


----------



## A-Branger

odibrom said:


> That's a functional solution for full tuning drops, however if only one string is dropped, these pedals don't help. If the guitar is a 6 stringer, go MIDI, if 7+, buy a new guitar or go with fixed bridges...






AirForbes1 said:


> how easy is it to go from E to Eb and D standard?



Drop pedal and happy days. Also apparently theres a way to do "dropD" on an evertune according to that Ola video, so there ya go.

Or get your evertune guitar for your mayority of tunnings (lets prettend Standard stuff), then keep your previous guitar for the other stuff (DropX stuff), chuck the Drop pedal and happy days till you can afford the next GAS


----------



## AirForbes1

A-Branger said:


> Drop pedal and happy days. Also apparently theres a way to do "dropD" on an evertune according to that Ola video, so there ya go.
> 
> Or get your evertune guitar for your mayority of tunnings (lets prettend Standard stuff), then keep your previous guitar for the other stuff (DropX stuff), chuck the Drop pedal and happy days till you can afford the next GAS



Yeah. Though I don't know who I'm kidding. I just want a BW-1. I don't why I'm trying to look for ways to justify it, I'm a grown-ass man and already have a bunch of guitar related stuff that I don't "need".


----------



## Lindmann

odibrom said:


> TChanging tunes on the fly is not advisable, that is a feature for the more traditional hard tail / fixed bridge guitars... or so it seams to be as far as I can understand its use and functions.


How do you come to this conclusion?
I don't change tunings often, but when I do I just use the little allen key that comes with the bridge and turn the respective screws.
Takes me a minute or two (unless I want to tune it up or down several whole notes at once).


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Lindmann said:


> How do you come to this conclusion?
> I don't chance tunings often, but when I do I just use the little allen key that comes with the bridge and turn the respective screws.
> Takes me a minute or two (unless I want to tune it up or down several whole notes at once).



Don't bother, I've been saying the same thing about locking bridges for years and no one believes me.


----------



## Lindmann

Yeah.
When I bought my first trem guitar I was kinda scared because everyone was like 'these are super hard to get in tune. You better just block the trem'.
I did not block the trem. Got it set up and tuned in no time once I understood the concept.
Now I am wondering what everyone was so scared of.


----------



## AirForbes1

Locking bridges don't worry me, I've got a guitar with an Edge trem. But, you get something for the lack of convenience. With the Evertune, I'm not sure. Not for or against it, just don't know.


----------



## odibrom

Lindmann said:


> How do you come to this conclusion?
> I don't change tunings often, but when I do I just use the little allen key that comes with the bridge and turn the respective screws.
> Takes me a minute or two (unless I want to tune it up or down several whole notes at once).



Hey, if you're in the middle of a gig and have that allen key with you at hand so you can retune your guitar, good for you. I didn't say it was difficult, I just wouldn't place myself in that spotlight... About trems and retunes on the fly, it depends on their setup, obviously, but a full floating floyd-rose has to be previously locked...

And we're again sliding away from IBANEZ 2019 guitars... any more pics to show? This thread is lacking pics, that's what we're all here for...


----------



## canuck brian

MaxOfMetal said:


> Don't bother, I've been saying the same thing about locking bridges for years and no one believes me.



I'm with you on that! I've always just made sure my fine tuner on the low E (and B on 7's) were in far enough to drop tune them. Never had an issue onstage with the other guitar player's tuning.


----------



## A-Branger

odibrom said:


> And we're again sliding away from IBANEZ 2019 guitars... any more pics to show?


too early to have the dealers brochures leak out on the internet. Usually that happens closer to NAMM


----------



## Vyn

A-Branger said:


> too early to have the dealers brochures leak out on the internet. Usually that happens closer to NAMM



Can confirm that there exists new model numbers on the distributors end and that some dealerships have seen them. No photos though, codes only.


----------



## A-Branger

Vyn said:


> Can confirm that there exists new model numbers on the distributors end and that some dealerships have seen them. No photos though, codes only.


awesome so that means this yeear we have the RGTHEJCJCPQJFP92838848OJFJOS902OKD0-54642-X! woooooo!!!


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

A-Branger said:


> awesome so that means this yeear we have the RGTHEJCJCPQJFP92838848OJFJOS902OKD0-54642-X! woooooo!!!



RG the double J. Custom in a Puke Quilt Juice Fade finish, dealer sample serial no. P92838848 (Ibanez building guitars in Poland now!?!?) Original Just for Jerking Off Sample, 9 string, limited run of 20 (dealer keyed the number in wrong it's 20 not 02), OK for global distribution, ships tuned to D0. MSRP is $5464.20 minus whatever your dealer discount is.

Ibanez really stepping it up this year it seems. Stoked for the Mayones collaboration.


----------



## Miek

since this is kind of a general ibanez thread, what's the deal with the rg652 model name? did they just drop the 4 digit prestige system? are we just assuming the 1 prefix?


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Miek said:


> since this is kind of a general ibanez thread, what's the deal with the rg652 model name? did they just drop the 4 digit prestige system? are we just assuming the 1 prefix?



From what I can recall (and I'm sure Max will be right in here with a perfect explanation any minute now), under the old system the prefix number indicated what 'tier' the guitar was on. So even though they were all Prestige line guitars, some were 'nicer' than others, and those got higher numbers. I think now they've kind of walked that back and have shifted their philosophy to be a bit more clear in that a Prestige is a Prestige is a Prestige, and any higher than that is a J. Custom. As a result, you don't need the prefix number anymore. 

What I'm curious about is the significance of the 52, but I don't know if I want to dive that deep into the Ibanez hieroglyphic system.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

They've gone back to a three digit for Prestige RGs. The Sabers and other Prestige series guitars are keeping the four digit, but that could change. 

It's basically a hybrid system of old, pre-Prestige MIJ stuff and the four digit. 

It goes:
Series/String Count/Pickups/Pickup Configuration

So an RG752 is an RG with 7 strings loaded with DiMarzio pickups in an HH configuration without pickguard. 

While an RG657 is an RG with 6 strings loaded with DiMarzio pickups in an HSH configuration with no pickguard. 

If the last number is a 5, like the RG655, you get an HSH configuration with pickguard. 

Anything after the numbers are modifiers, such as "AH" for Ash bodies, "M" for Maple fretboards, "FX" for non-Trem, etc. The last two to three letters are the color code. 

So an RG652AHMFXNGB is an RG with 6 strings, DiMarzio pickups, HH with no pickguard, an ash body, maple board, fixed bridge in the Nebula Green Burst finish.

It's actually probably the most descriptive they've ever been, which is why the model numbers have turned into so number/letter soup.


----------



## Soya

Max I think you know more about Ibanez than I know about life in general.


----------



## Miek

MaxOfMetal said:


> They've gone back to a three digit for Prestige RGs. The Sabers and other Prestige series guitars are keeping the four digit, but that could change.
> 
> It's basically a hybrid system of old, pre-Prestige MIJ stuff and the four digit.
> 
> It goes:
> Series/String Count/Pickups/Pickup Configuration
> 
> So an RG752 is an RG with 7 strings loaded with DiMarzio pickups in an HH configuration without pickguard.
> 
> While an RG657 is an RG with 6 strings loaded with DiMarzio pickups in an HSH configuration with no pickguard.
> 
> If the last number is a 5, like the RG655, you get an HSH configuration with pickguard.
> 
> Anything after the numbers are modifiers, such as "AH" for Ash bodies, "M" for Maple fretboards, "FX" for non-Trem, etc. The last two to three letters are the color code.
> 
> So an RG652AHMFXNGB is an RG with 6 strings, DiMarzio pickups, HH with no pickguard, an ash body, maple board, fixed bridge in the Nebula Green Burst finish.
> 
> It's actually probably the most descriptive they've ever been, which is why the model numbers have turned into so number/letter soup.


haha I'm glad I still understand the naming scheme even if the prefix number has been dropped!


----------



## s2k9k

LOVE THIS




Last but not least, I saw a new J. Custom on Instagram, which had a really cool resin top: JCRG1801
View attachment 65020

I like those resin woodwork thingies, no matter how cheesy they are. Even better if someone builds LEDs into it to make it glow.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Miek said:


> haha I'm glad I still understand the naming scheme even if the prefix number has been dropped!



I kind of hated that ambiguous first digit in the last Prestige naming scheme. It was supposed to mean appointment tier, but it rarely translated into tangible things.

It usually just meant "we made this one subjectively prettier so give us another $300 to $500". It could be as simple as different pickups, or a whole different wood combo.


----------



## Hollowway

So...anyone got the new product codes? Based on what Max said, we can get a fair idea of what to expect even without the photos.


----------



## Sogradde

Wish I could post new stuff but Ibanez is doing ye olde radio silence on social media.


----------



## Leviathus

Yeah Ibanez never really teases or leaks too much at all, the most we got last year was like the AZ neck joint.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Leviathus said:


> Yeah Ibanez never really teases or leaks too much at all, the most we got last year was like the AZ neck joint.



Around 2014 they really clamped down on dealers who leaked stuff. There used to be a few fairly consistent leakers.


----------



## Hollowway

It makes you wonder whether it would be financially advantageous to move NAMM to November. If they could actually get the debuting products out by the holiday shopping season, they might actually increase sales.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> It makes you wonder whether it would be financially advantageous to move NAMM to November. If they could actually get the debuting products out by the holiday shopping season, they might actually increase sales.



Honestly, they need to just stop with NAMM altogether. 

Having one or two big trade shows a year was fine two or three decades ago, but we live in the internet age now. Musical instrument technology and trends are progressing faster and faster. 

Now it's just the big brands having a dick measuring contest over who can have the most ridiculous booth with the most booth girls. Then you have the smaller brands just trying to out weird each other. It serves no real purpose other than to have the industry fellate itself.


----------



## Seabeast2000

MaxOfMetal said:


> Honestly, they need to just stop with NAMM altogether.
> 
> Having one or two big trade shows a year was fine two or three decades ago, but we live in the internet age now. Musical instrument technology and trends are progressing faster and faster.
> 
> Now it's just the big brands having a dick measuring contest over who can have the most ridiculous booth with the most booth girls. Then you have the smaller brands just trying to out weird each other. It serves no real purpose other than to have the industry fellate itself.



Is NAMM itself a for-profit venture? Or does it use its revenue to just cover costs (on paper lol)?


----------



## gunch

s2k9k said:


> LOVE THIS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Last but not least, I saw a new J. Custom on Instagram, which had a really cool resin top: JCRG1801
> View attachment 65020
> 
> I like those resin woodwork thingies, no matter how cheesy they are. Even better if someone builds LEDs into it to make it glow.



Cool to see Ibanez get into the resin game, you'd expect something trendy like that to pop up on an Iron Label or Premium first


----------



## Sogradde

November is way too late anyway. It usually takes new models about 3-6 months to arrive here in europe. I think the first Genesis models arrived as late as August here in Germany.


----------



## Hollowway

Sogradde said:


> November is way too late anyway. It usually takes new models about 3-6 months to arrive here in europe. I think the first Genesis models arrived as late as August here in Germany.



We don’t care about when our guitars arrive in your shit hole countries, anyway. Ibanez is a great American brand! Don’t believe the fake news. Put Christ back in christmas. ‘MURICA!!


----------



## Sogradde




----------



## MaxOfMetal

The906 said:


> Is NAMM itself a for-profit venture? Or does it use its revenue to just cover costs (on paper lol)?



They have 501(c)(3) status, but that doesn't necessarily mean they aren't profit driven altogether.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> They have 501(c)(3) status, but that doesn't necessarily mean they aren't profit driven altogether.



Are you serious? That’s odd. I’m surprised they were able to get that. You’d think they’d just be a regular Corp, and never claim profit, rather than being that. 

I agree with you about them just dropping the whole thing. I never thought about it like that, but you’re right about it being unnecessary since the internet ramped up to where it is. I still wanna go one day, though.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> Are you serious? That’s odd. I’m surprised they were able to get that. You’d think they’d just be a regular Corp, and never claim profit, rather than being that.
> 
> I agree with you about them just dropping the whole thing. I never thought about it like that, but you’re right about it being unnecessary since the internet ramped up to where it is. I still wanna go one day, though.



Someone once told me it had to do with the venue and insurance, but that's definitely not my area of expertise.

I've been to Winter NAMM 6 times. Some of the demonstrations are really cool, and if you like getting autographs and talking to more famous musicians it's cool. It used to be really awesome seeing stuff no one else had seen yet, and finding some of the weirdness. But it seems like every year that's less and less the case.


----------



## StevenC

I thought of another one: Bring back the 9 string Prestige, except with 30" and an Edge III FX9.

Also it's a Maxxas


----------



## possumkiller

Lindmann said:


> I this case you would turn the allen screws.
> It is as hard or quick as changing tuning on a regular guitar.


So if I am following correctly, the Evertune is basically so people can tune down to drop w and still use their .009-.042s without worrying about pushing the notes sharp when they pick a string or fret a note?


----------



## Lindmann

There are still some limits though.
A long as you stay in a certain range of string tension, then: yes
Otherwise: no

The range for standard saddles is 10 - 28 pounds.
You can actually buy saddles for higher or lower tension, but I doubt that you can maintain playability with this kind of tensions.

So you still need a reasonable tuning/string gauge ratio.
But you can get away with thinner strings as you normally would.


----------



## ThePIGI King

StevenC said:


> I thought of another one: Bring back the 9 string Prestige, except with 30" and an Edge III FX9.
> 
> Also it's a Maxxas



I'd love a new RG90. Minus BKPs. Keep it the same as the previous otherwise. They're scarce, and I love my RG9.


----------



## Hollowway

Lindmann said:


> There are still some limits though.
> A long as you stay in a certain range of string tension, then: yes
> Otherwise: no
> 
> The range for standard saddles is 10 - 28 pounds.
> You can actually buy saddles for higher or lower tension, but I doubt that you can maintain playability with this kind of tensions.
> 
> So you still need a reasonable tuning/string gauge ratio.
> But you can get away with thinner strings as you normally would.



Wait, so how would that work? Are you saying that if I normally would do a .074” for a F# on my 8 string, at about 25 lbs, I could go down to like 12 lbs, and it’s not going to wobble out of tune? It would sound the same? If that’s the case, I need to get one of these. That means I could tune way down, yet keep the clarity of a thinner string.


----------



## Lindmann

The get me wrong...the strings will still be wet spaghetti. 
It only helps against picking it out of tune. 

I for one have 15 lbs on the lowest string and there's no wobbling around the note. But it is still a different feeling compared to 25 lbs.

So it comes down to if your able to play on 12 lbs or not. 

The tone is different though due to the thinner strings.


----------



## Xaios

I want a guitar that literally yells the word "BUUUUURRRRRLLLL" whenever I play it.


----------



## beerandbeards

Desert Yellow Sun under black light


----------



## Sogradde

Some tease for the Jem fans out there


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> Some tease for the Jem fans out there


Couldn't that mean something related to his music/himself over Ibanez?


----------



## Sogradde

Ssssh. Let's have faith!


----------



## A-Branger

whats the tease? another relic white Jem?, theres nothing on that post that points to a new model


----------



## Vyn

Is it next year or the year after that's 30 years of the Jem/Universe? Can't remember. Can guarantee there will be some super expensive Sugi models again as a result.


----------



## StevenC

Vyn said:


> Is it next year or the year after that's 30 years of the Jem/Universe? Can't remember. Can guarantee there will be some super expensive Sugi models again as a result.


2018 was the JEM 30th anniversary, they did the pink, green, and yellow JEMs. 2020 is the Universe 30th anniversary, so we'll probably get some more swirls or something.


----------



## Vyn

StevenC said:


> 2018 was the JEM 30th anniversary, they did the pink, green, and yellow JEMs. 2020 is the Universe 30th anniversary, so we'll probably get some more swirls or something.



Cheers for that. Pretty sure old man Gilbert is up for an anniversary model at some stage


----------



## StevenC

Vyn said:


> Cheers for that. Pretty sure old man Gilbert is up for an anniversary model at some stage


Pink Destroyer please Ibanez


----------



## Vyn

StevenC said:


> Pink Destroyer please Ibanez



Not gonna lie, not even going to care what the price tag would be on that one.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Ha, what would your sig "anniversary" Ibanez be using your first Ibby plus additions/customizations? My 29th anniversary Ibanez would be an RG570 w/ maple board in whatever sort of maroon that was and a JB. Had no idea what I was buying at the time but it was a huge step up from the red Squier Bullet I had.
EDIT: I just wanted to say I'd buy that combo reissue in a heartbeat.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Well, Ibanez has changed their site design a bit, that's new.


----------



## couverdure

The906 said:


> Well, Ibanez has changed their site design a bit, that's new.


The artists page is harder to navigate now because it goes through multiple pages instead of a single big one, and countries are separated instead of being regrouped from the artists' names in alphabetical order.
They also still have players who no longer play their guitars (JD from Ice Nine Kills and Andy from Thy Art = Music Man, Acle Kahney = Mayones, Ihsahn = Aristides, Alexia from ESTK and McRocklin = Kiesel, etc.).
At least their pictures aren't just their faces anymore so I can see the guitars easily. Oh, and Vogg's profile has been restored, since I remember it being removed when the accusations happened which has been disproved.

I might sound super nitpicky but Ibanez really needs a better website management.


----------



## Seabeast2000

couverdure said:


> The artists page is harder to navigate now because it goes through multiple pages instead of a single big one, and countries are separated instead of being regrouped from the artists' names in alphabetical order.
> They also still have players who no longer play their guitars (JD from Ice Nine Kills and Andy from Thy Art = Music Man, Acle Kahney = Mayones, Ihsahn = Aristides, Alexia from ESTK and McRocklin = Kiesel, etc.).
> At least their pictures aren't just their faces anymore so I can see the guitars easily. Oh, and Vogg's profile has been restored, since I remember it being removed when the accusations happened which has been disproved.
> 
> I might sound super nitpicky but Ibanez really needs a better website management.



Yeah, its different, something about how the individual finishes are shown up front though is better than the old drill down way. The USA site now reminds me of the UK site or was it the JP. Seems like I saw a similar flow not too long ago when spying overseas line ups.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

It's nice not having to click on a specific sub-series for each shape.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

Has Ibanez ever done a 7 neck that is slightly thinner front to back than the current 752 - 19mm 1st fret and 21mm 12th fret? I've gotten so darn used to the 17mm and 19mm on my 652s.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TheShreddinHand said:


> Has Ibanez ever done a 7 neck that is slightly thinner front to back than the current 752 - 19mm 1st fret and 21mm 12th fret? I've gotten so darn used to the 17mm and 19mm on my 652s.



Old UV7 necks could get absolutely stupid thin, but it wasn't consist. That's back when they were hand shaped so there wasn't as uniform a thickness in production. 

The thinnest I found was about 16mm to 18mm. Most were about 17.5mm to 20mm. 

Things thickened up a little in 1997, and from 1998 on they were rounder and a tad thicker.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

MaxOfMetal said:


> Old UV7 necks could get absolutely stupid thin, but it wasn't consist. That's back when they were hand shaped so there wasn't as uniform a thickness in production.
> 
> The thinnest I found was about 16mm to 18mm. Most were about 17.5mm to 20mm.
> 
> Things thickened up a little in 1997, and from 1998 on they were rounder and a tad thicker.



Knew you would know, thanks! I wouldn't mind them going back to a thinner one personally, but that's me.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TheShreddinHand said:


> Knew you would know, thanks! I wouldn't mind them going back to a thinner one personally, but that's me.



I'd settle for a MIJ Universe that's not a special/limited model.


----------



## Viginez

MaxOfMetal said:


> Old UV7 necks could get absolutely stupid thin, but it wasn't consist. That's back when they were hand shaped so there wasn't as uniform a thickness in production.
> 
> The thinnest I found was about 16mm to 18mm. Most were about 17.5mm to 20mm.
> 
> Things thickened up a little in 1997, and from 1998 on they were rounder and a tad thicker.


was there a difference between the later uv from 96 vs. earlier models till 94?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Viginez said:


> was there a difference between the later uv from 96 vs. earlier models till 94?



The spot production 96' Green Dots were made mostly of leftover parts from prior to 95'. 

So they're just about identical, including the hand shaped, somewhat inconsistent necks.


----------



## cardinal

I had a first year Greendot and a later Silverdot. The Silverdot neck felt “normal” by my experience with modern Ibanez 7 necks. The Greendot neck was about the thickness of two sheets of paper. It was ridiculously thin.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> I had a first year Greendot and a later Silverdot. The Silverdot neck felt “normal” by my experience with modern Ibanez 7 necks. The Greendot neck was about the thickness of two sheets of paper. It was ridiculously thin.



Yeah, the Silver Dot received a new batch of necks. It was too time consuming to re-work the Green Dot necks. I've found them to be more uniform, but supposedly they only made one or two batches of these due to low demand and short production run.

The Silver Dot was a place holder. They knew they needed something on the market, and Steve was working on the redesign of the Universe already. It's actually, by production numbers, the rarest of the UVs.


----------



## Vyn

TheShreddinHand said:


> Has Ibanez ever done a 7 neck that is slightly thinner front to back than the current 752 - 19mm 1st fret and 21mm 12th fret? I've gotten so darn used to the 17mm and 19mm on my 652s.



On paper the 752 necks are substantially thicker but I don't find any issues going between my 752s and my 652s. They feel different but it's still comfortable.


----------



## Albake21

Vyn said:


> On paper the 752 necks are substantially thicker but I don't find any issues going between my 752s and my 652s. They feel different but it's still comfortable.


Really? When I go back and forth it makes my RG752 feel like a baseball bat.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> Really? When I go back and forth it makes my RG752 feel like a baseball bat.



I think that's a profile thing. The contemporary 7s, starting with the later RG1527s had rounder profiles, especially compared with most MIJ 6s with rather flat profiles.


----------



## Albake21

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think that's a profile thing. The contemporary 7s, starting with the later RG1527s had rounder profiles, especially compared with most MIJ 6s with rather flat profiles.


Actually my RG1527z feels rounder than my (no longer own) RG752. The 752 felt way flatter. Could be wrong, but that's how I remembered it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> Actually my RG1527z feels rounder than my (no longer own) RG752. The 752 felt way flatter. Could be wrong, but that's how I remembered it.



It's been awhile since I played both back to back, but I remember them being fairly similar. Then again, it was an big dot, early RG1527, not the more recent Z.


----------



## Vyn

Albake21 said:


> Really? When I go back and forth it makes my RG752 feel like a baseball bat.



Could also be technique - I do have large hands and play with my thumb in the middle of the neck as much as possible.


----------



## Albake21

Vyn said:


> Could also be technique - I do have large hands and play with my thumb in the middle of the neck as much as possible.


I also have large hands, but I play with my thumb all the way around the neck so I notice the neck thickness way more than the average player. It's definitely a downside to my style of playing lol


----------



## Vyn

Albake21 said:


> I also have large hands, but I play with my thumb all the way around the neck so I notice the neck thickness way more than the average player. It's definitely a downside to my style of playing lol



Ah gotcha. Yeah, thumb in the middle means you don't notice it much.


----------



## cardinal

Albake21 said:


> Actually my RG1527z feels rounder than my (no longer own) RG752. The 752 felt way flatter. Could be wrong, but that's how I remembered it.



There’s still some variation from guitar to guitar, too. I had two 1527Ms at the same time, and the necks were noticably different thicknesses.


----------



## BTS

I love my rgr652 neck profile, its wide for me, but it just works...only seven (which i barely touch anymore) that feels comfortable after the rgr652 is the kxk i have.


----------



## Kyle Jordan

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think that's a profile thing. The contemporary 7s, starting with the later RG1527s had rounder profiles, especially compared with most MIJ 6s with rather flat profiles.



I wonder if this is why I always preferred the neck on my '03 UV777BK to most later Ibanez 7 necks. I know my particular S8 is loved because the neck is flat with big shoulders like Ibanez of old.


----------



## couverdure

If anyone here cares about their acoustics, Ibanez Japan posted a neat-looking white acoustic guitar with a maple fretboard on Instagram.


----------



## Albake21

couverdure said:


> If anyone here cares about their acoustics, Ibanez Japan posted a neat-looking white acoustic guitar with a maple fretboard on Instagram.


I don't play or even own an acoustic, but that actually looks really cool. I always wondered why maple wasn't used more on acoustic guitars.


----------



## Jeff

Albake21 said:


> I don't play or even own an acoustic, but that actually looks really cool. I always wondered why maple wasn't used more on acoustic guitars.



Yeah I don't know why it isn't. If I could have any guitar made to my specs, it'd be a Breedlove Concerto shape, in all Myrtlewood with a 2-piece baked maple neck. That'd absolutely kill.


----------



## A-Branger

Albake21 said:


> I always wondered why maple wasn't used more on acoustic guitars.



"tradition"


----------



## Seabeast2000

A-Branger said:


> "tradition"



So does "spot" in "spot model" mean anything? Acronym? Spot in time?


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Yeah it means a spot in time, like just one or two batches of that model will be produced as opposed to it being a long term production run.


----------



## Hollowway

I spy white binding on that FB, too! 

I need another standard acoustic like I need another...ok, I don’t need ANY more guitars. But, if that shows up in a 7 with a cutaway, I’d have a hard time saying no!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> "tradition"



It was actually almost more common to see maple and even perloid and other synthetics on the fretboards of early North American guitars. From around 1900 to right before WWII.

The "tradition" you speak of took hold later, in the 40's and 50's. You can thank Martin for that. Though it was less of Martin and all of the imitators who flooded the market with dreadnought clones. If Martin had used something else, that's probably what would have come into fashion.

To add:

Rosewood coming into fashion has almost always been about economics. Until the last decade it was extremely plentiful, thus cheap, easy to work and much more forgiving than similar woods. It's far less prone to cracking as ebony, especially at that time, and didn't need a finish like maple.


----------



## A-Branger

MaxOfMetal said:


> easy to work



one of the main reasons people still use wood over other materials for building guitars..... plus the "tradition" part of things too


----------



## laxu

MaxOfMetal said:


> It was actually almost more common to see maple and even perloid and other synthetics on the fretboards of early North American guitars. From around 1900 to right before WWII.
> 
> The "tradition" you speak of took hold later, in the 40's and 50's. You can thank Martin for that. Though it was less of Martin and all of the imitators who flooded the market with dreadnought clones. If Martin had used something else, that's probably what would have come into fashion.
> 
> To add:
> 
> Rosewood coming into fashion has almost always been about economics. Until the last decade it was extremely plentiful, thus cheap, easy to work and much more forgiving than similar woods. It's far less prone to cracking as ebony, especially at that time, and didn't need a finish like maple.



This pretty much applies to a lot of things in guitars. Mahogany, alder and maple are staples of electric guitars not because they are the best sounding but because they are available, inexpensive and easy to shape. Those factors come in far before any "tonewood" aspects. Same goes for the ubiquitousness of the Tuneomatic bridge. It's by all measures a pretty shit bridge design but it's cheap and "traditional" so it keeps getting pushed on new models even by brands who aren't bound by tradition.

Last year I tried some acoustics that had the back and sides of the body made of thermo-treated maple. I actually really liked how they sounded and preferred them to the same manufacturer's more traditional wood models.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> one of the main reasons people still use wood over other materials for building guitars..... plus the "tradition" part of things too



I think there's a meaningful difference between traditions founded in fashion and those founded in utility. The use of wood falls closer to utility in that regard. 

Wood is cheap, plentiful, light, strong, renewable, recyclable, easy on tools, and it's use has been mainstream for so long that tools and techniques for its working are incredibly accessible. 

Right now using alternatives is very rigid and expensive. The more popular wood alternative makers are pretty much stuck with a single body/neck block.


----------



## A-Branger

oh yeah of course. Im referring mostly to the tradition part of things of the utility. The ease to work with, plus all the available knowledge and tools for it.

But I also mention "tradition" as in "thas what a guitar should be like", you know he "50's was the best era" mentality that comes into place too. We in this group/forum are more open to weird unique shapes, and specs. But most of the guitar market (and bass too) still are strongly based on the tried and tested formula of making guitars. You know the "strat/LP" market-ish and their sub-cultures/shapes/models

just like you mention, rosewood was used due to ease to work, durability and price. But a lot of people still want it today mostly because "thats what guitars are supposed to be made of" rather than any other aspect of it. People learn and grew up seeing rosewood in their favourite guitars, so they want that in theirs, just "because" ......way more than of "tone", feeling, price, looks, or any other reason


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> oh yeah of course. Im referring mostly to the tradition part of things of the utility. The ease to work with, plus all the available knowledge and tools for it.
> 
> But I also mention "tradition" as in "thas what a guitar should be like", you know he "50's was the best era" mentality that comes into place too. We in this group/forum are more open to weird unique shapes, and specs. But most of the guitar market (and bass too) still are strongly based on the tried and tested formula of making guitars. You know the "strat/LP" market-ish and their sub-cultures/shapes/models
> 
> just like you mention, rosewood was used due to ease to work, durability and price. But a lot of people still want it today mostly because "thats what guitars are supposed to be made of" rather than any other aspect of it. People learn and grew up seeing rosewood in their favourite guitars, so they want that in theirs, just "because" ......way more than of "tone", feeling, price, looks, or any other reason



While that's definitely an aspect within parts of the guitar market, I tend to find places like this swing pretty fat the other way. 

The idea that something is "bad" because it's traditional.

Honestly, most of the guitar market just buys what they can afford based on what their favorite artist uses and could not care less about individual specs.


----------



## Avedas

couverdure said:


> If anyone here cares about their acoustics, Ibanez Japan posted a neat-looking white acoustic guitar with a maple fretboard on Instagram.


Awesome, I don't own an acoustic anymore so this might be on my radar next year.


----------



## Given To Fly

MaxOfMetal said:


> While that's definitely an aspect within parts of the guitar market, I tend to find places like this swing pretty far the other way.
> 
> The idea that something is "bad" because it's traditional.



You are right, consistently. Also, in debates about wood and tone, if you choose to partake, say "wood tone" because it takes on an entirely new and accurate meaning. For example, a trombone is a brass instrument. Brass is a metal. Do we say "tone metal?" Just a thought.


----------



## possumkiller

Given To Fly said:


> You are right, consistently. Also, in debates about wood and tone, if you choose to partake, say "wood tone" because it takes on an entirely new and accurate meaning. For example, a trombone is a brass instrument. Brass is a metal. Do we say "tone metal?" Just a thought.


I've found milled steel to be a far better tone metal than cast zinc when it comes to bridges.


----------



## laxu

Given To Fly said:


> You are right, consistently. Also, in debates about wood and tone, if you choose to partake, say "wood tone" because it takes on an entirely new and accurate meaning. For example, a trombone is a brass instrument. Brass is a metal. Do we say "tone metal?" Just a thought.



You will notice a difference in metals. I went a bit back and forth on a Tele with 3 brass saddles vs 6 steel saddles and preferred the tone of the brass because it was less bright but liked the better intonation of the 6 saddle model.

The fault in tone wood debates is mostly by limiting it to wood when alternative materials are perfectly fine for guitars too and the hardware materials and construction matters too. It's hard to pinpoint the effect on exactly one thing unless you can change that easily like you can with a bridge.


----------



## ixlramp

About Evertune.

It doesn't magically make loose strings act normally in every way, as is somewhat implied. It only removes the pitch sharpness on attack and helps with pitch issues, you still have a loose string with the tone, playability and all the other problems of that.

It will never replace a fixed bridge because it isn't, it's 6 floating trem bridges, each with much less mass and inertia than a standard trem, so has the tone caused by a softer, non-rigid connection to the guitar. It's ok if you like that tone, but you also don't have the trem ability.

Looking at ESP and Solar Evertune models, they don't have locking nuts. So at one end of the guitar you have something that causes pitch problems, and at the other something very expensive to deal with that. Seems ridiculous.
It seems to me a fixed trem bridge plus a locking nut is a far better solution overall, not quite as pitch-perfect but nearly as good, and an actual rigid fixed bridge so better tone.


----------



## novocaine

The question is where is the 2019 catalog? Isn’t it usually released about this time.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

novocaine said:


> The question is where is the 2019 catalog? Isn’t it usually released about this time.



It used to leak around this time, but the actual catalog isn't officially released until the day before the show.


----------



## lewis

Im craving so hard for a Xiphos.

But im thinking more about buying a blank body and just building my own. Maybe making it a headless


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Australia gets something nice at least.









> In celebration of 40 years strong in Australia, we are excited to release the Limited Edition 40th Anniversary Ibanez model the RG40AH-RR (Ruby Red).
> 
> Only 40 Limited Edition 40th Anniversary Ibanez electric guitars have been produced and they have now landed in Australia.
> 
> The 40th Anniversary Ibanez guitar has a Super Wizard HP 5 piece Maple/Walnut neck with a Bound Birdseye Maple fretboard with a custom 40th Anniversary designed plate joint.
> 
> The Ruby Red guitar features DiMarzio® pickups with Edge Tremolo. This one-time-only model comes fitted with a transparent pickguard, and a second optional black pickguard is included all held within a matching Custom Ruby Red leather case.





























Now, I've already got a ruby red RG570 so it's not like I need one of these, but hot damn, do I want one bad!


----------



## Sogradde

Are those luminlays?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Australia gets something nice at least.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, I've already got a ruby red RG570 so it's not like I need one of these, but hot damn, do I want one bad!



Looks "off" to me. 

I think it's the black pickups and plastics with chrome hardware.


----------



## possumkiller

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looks "off" to me.
> 
> I think it's the black pickups and plastics with chrome hardware.


I think it's the black plastics with white neck binding with no headstock binding and chrome hardware with black pickguard screws but chrome poles on black pickups.

EDIT: At least it's not diarrhea bursted burbevelone...


----------



## vilk

Die, square heel!!


----------



## LordHar

I wish they would make an AZ with those colors.


----------



## cardinal

Why is the neck bound?!?! Is this an ease-of-manufacturer thing for maple fretboards? Just looks weird on that style of Ibanez, particularly with the color scheme.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Why is the neck bound?!?! Is this an ease-of-manufacturer thing for maple fretboards? Just looks weird on that style of Ibanez, particularly with the color scheme.



Should have done red binding and chrome plastic bits.


----------



## Sogradde

My vote goes out for a 2" abalone binding and skull/cross inlays.


----------



## Leviathus

vilk said:


> Die, square heel!!


----------



## A-Branger

uhg, only thing good is the laminated neck with birsdeye fretboard with white binding and no-dots..... anything else NOPE


----------



## eightsixboy

I like it actually but yea the binding is a no no for me. No fret markers either is a no no. Would have been so much better with off centre fret markers and no binding.


----------



## possumkiller

Nothing about it really screams "Australia" either. It needs like some kind of kangaroo inlay or a Road Warrior mural on the body.


----------



## possumkiller

Ahhh the ad says a black pickguard is included. Hopefully B/W/B as that would definitely tie in with the rest of the red/white/black theme.


----------



## Vyn

In terms of exclusives, I think this takes the cake for the most boring one we've received.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> In terms of exclusives, I think this takes the cake for the most boring one we've received.



I don't think it's boring. Just kind of ugly. 

I'm sure there will be some cool ones, as it's a good platform to spruce up.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Vyn said:


> In terms of exclusives, I think this takes the cake for the most boring one we've received.



Still beats the Southern Cross RG30th. You can't mod out the inlays. At least this one hints you to mod away by throwing an extra pickguard.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Still beats the Southern Cross RG30th.



Yeah, that one was freaking weird.


----------



## Musiscience

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, that one was freaking weird.



I just googled it and don’t get what’s so weird about it. Just a white and black RG with dot inlays in the shape on a cross at the 12th fret.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Musiscience said:


> I just googled it and don’t get what’s so weird about it. Just a white and black RG with dot inlays in the shape on a cross at the 12th fret.



It's the inlays. I get the 12th fret, but the others are weirdly in between offset and centered position. It's just a little jarring to my eyes.


----------



## odibrom

Is it some sorte of constellation graphic thing at the 12th fret? Sorry, I'm out of this loop.

It's in fact weird... not sure how I feel about it. It's not as bad as center dots, but also not good... those stars... not working for me.


----------



## Seabeast2000

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crux


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Dunno if I'm late here, but I just saw this video and it seems Andy Timmons is rocking a AT'd AZ.


----------



## Musiscience

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's the inlays. I get the 12th fret, but the others are weirdly in between offset and centered position. It's just a little jarring to my eyes.



Oh I didn't even notice at first. I notice it now, odd choice but I have seen much worse.


----------



## Hollowway

Musiscience said:


> Oh I didn't even notice at first. I notice it now, odd choice but I have seen much worse.



Yeah, it might be a swing and a bit of a miss, but as I've stated before, I have a huge amount of respect for a company like Ibanez that is willing to put out offbeat stuff that isn't necessarily "safe." The Ashulas, the SR7VIISC, the original Jem, etc. They do weird stuff that a lot of other companies are scared to do. Or maybe it's a Japanese thing? The JDP ESPs are pretty out there, as well.


----------



## Dayn

I'd be fine with that Southern Cross inlay if it had the proper shape to it... I wonder how many bogans bought it to go with their tattoo.


----------



## LordHar

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Dunno if I'm late here, but I just saw this video and it seems Andy Timmons is rocking a AT'd AZ.




According to posts on the jemsite forum, there will be 5 new AZ signature models, The Andy TImmons being one of them, and the 2019 lineup will be revealed on 1/1/2019.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

LordHar said:


> According to posts on the jemsite forum, there will be 5 new AZ signature models, The Andy TImmons being one of them, and the 2019 lineup will be revealed on 1/1/2019.



Andy confirmed the guitar on his facebook page today:

ATZ-100 (meaning MIJ)
Cruiser bridge x2
Cruiser neck x1

He says specifically that this one will be a little more vintagey because he usually uses a cruiser bridge pup in the neck of his AT100 and this one he went with the cruiser neck.


----------



## adriangrizzly

LordHar said:


> According to posts on the jemsite forum, there will be 5 new AZ signature models, The Andy TImmons being one of them, and the 2019 lineup will be revealed on 1/1/2019.


Let's guess. The 2 guys of polyphia, the 2 guys of chon and sam bell or lee wrathe?


----------



## MatiasTolkki

adriangrizzly said:


> Let's guess. The 2 guys of polyphia, the 2 guys of chon and sam bell or lee wrathe?



andy timmons is confirmed, please read my post.


----------



## JoeyBTL

Marco Sfogli posted a teaser of a new guitar, which certainly looks like an AZ.


----------



## cdnpunk

I saw picture of a black AZ find it anymore. I wonder if it is a new addition or just a prototype.


----------



## couverdure

cdnpunk said:


> I saw picture of a black AZ find it anymore. I wonder if it is a new addition or just a prototype.


Were you referring to Alessandro Cortini's repainted AZ2204? It's from Nine Inch Nails' Rig Rundown video, and he also has some other Ibanez including the UB804 upright bass, a black Talman, and a LACS RG.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

cdnpunk said:


> I saw picture of a black AZ find it anymore. I wonder if it is a new addition or just a prototype.




Was it Alessandro Cortini's custom AZ by any chance?






EDIT:  ed


----------



## Sogradde

couverdure said:


> Were you referring to Alessandro Cortini's repainted AZ2204? It's from Nine Inch Nails' Rig Rundown video, and he also has some other Ibanez including the UB804 upright bass, a black Talman, and a LACS RG.


Ugh, that thing legitimately looks like a gio. Chrome hardware and black finish is a big no no for me. 

To cleanse your eyes: 



I know I know, it's off topic because it's an Axe Palace limited run but I really really really like this guitar and I'm kinda heartbroken because I didn't manage to get one.


----------



## BrailleDecibel

Sogradde said:


> Ugh, that thing legitimately looks like a gio. Chrome hardware and black finish is a big no no for me.


I hope to inspire this exact same reaction, in a LOT of people, with my music one day, because nu-metal combined with djent. Maybe Ibanez is onto some serious shit if they release this as a model so Chris can buy 10...well, if they add 2 more strings to it.


----------



## Hollowway

Dayn said:


> I'd be fine with that Southern Cross inlay if it had the proper shape to it... I wonder how many bogans bought it to go with their tattoo.



That’s not the proper shape? I know nothing of it, but I googled it and that looked accurate to me. What does the actual one look like?


----------



## Seabeast2000

Who was asking about the coral 550? Nobody? Somebody?


----------



## odibrom

^^ what was that? not sure if the guy is just goofing/trolling around or if he is taking himself seriously... ouch... and yes, I did watch the whole video...


----------



## AC.Lin

The906 said:


> Who was asking about the coral 550? Nobody? Somebody?



Can we talk about that "karate-chop" at 0:30 ? Yes i made it this far.

Everytime i come across this guy on youtube, i still get amazed. More by his hair than his play style though.

And yes he's dead serious and not a troll, unfortunately.


----------



## Lindmann

This must be comedy. 
At first I wasn't sure, but as soon as the startet throwing chops at the guitar there was no doubt about it.


----------



## Seabeast2000

odibrom said:


> ^^ what was that? not sure if the guy is just goofing/trolling around or if he is taking himself seriously... ouch... and yes, I did watch the whole video...



I don't know man, I really don't know. Internet.


----------



## Sogradde

He's right though. I couldn't play that.


----------



## Leviathus

yo that vid is f00kin awesome!


----------



## Seabeast2000

Sogradde said:


> He's right though. I couldn't play that.



If someone calls Guitar Protective Services, at least all of those axes will become a ward of the state and out of that abusive environment.


----------



## Seabeast2000

OK, it seems this is his thing. Unappreciated baffoon under guise of talent or something.


----------



## skmanga

any new 8's? only reason im here...
last year i wait for ibanez.... Kiesel or someone else can get my money


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Slightly off topic, but anyone catch Bruno Mars's custom RG?

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bn9K2w_gY4r/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=5eeagi6hf99y

It's just a modded RG550 with 3 EMG SAV Xs, but it's reignited my want for a 3S RG bad. Albeit black pickguard and Dimarzio rail singles, I even wanted the exact same colour too.


----------



## cip 123

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Slightly off topic, but anyone catch Bruno Mars's custom RG?
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/p/Bn9K2w_gY4r/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=5eeagi6hf99y
> 
> It's just a modded RG550 with 3 EMG SAV Xs, but it's reignited my want for a 3S RG bad. Albeit black pickguard and Dimarzio rail singles, I even wanted the exact same colour too.



That's pretty slick, I see he has a couple Albert Lee EBMM's or 1 that he changed the pickguard and added multi colour singles to. Is Bruno a gear nerd?


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

skmanga said:


> any new 8's? only reason im here...
> last year i wait for ibanez.... Kiesel or someone else can get my money



Just try and find a used TAM100 at a good price. That's what I did


----------



## cip 123

skmanga said:


> any new 8's? only reason im here...
> last year i wait for ibanez.... Kiesel or someone else can get my money


We're all just waiting for the RG2228 to come back. Or in an Ideal world an RG550-8


----------



## cardinal

I think I’m happier with the RG852 because I don’t want to deal with a locking nut and bridge without a trem. Some new wood and finish choices would be cool, and of course we need it to be renamed the RG852FX so that there will be the RG852 with a Lo Pro 8.


----------



## Dayn

Hollowway said:


> That’s not the proper shape? I know nothing of it, but I googled it and that looked accurate to me. What does the actual one look like?


The side stars are kind of high and wide. I can forgive the left one being higher than normal, but it's still quite distorted. It's like it was squished and stretched in Paint.


----------



## Vyn

cardinal said:


> I think I’m happier with the RG852 because I don’t want to deal with a locking nut and bridge without a trem. Some new wood and finish choices would be cool, and of course we need it to be renamed the RG852FX so that there will be the RG852 with a Lo Pro 8.



All they have to do is make the RG852 in either a white or a black and it will sell twice as well as that 'poo in the swimming pool' burl burst finish.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> All they have to do is make the RG852 in either a white or a black and it will sell twice as well as that 'poo in the swimming pool' burl burst finish.



They just have to bring them back. 

They had both an black and white RG852 available at the same time not too long ago.


----------



## Leviathus

Flame or quilt production model 852 would get my vote.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> They just have to bring them back.
> 
> They had both an black and white RG852 available at the same time not too long ago.



I thought I had seen them in a catalouge somewhere, along with the purple hardtail 752 (incidentally, another hot guitar).


----------



## Albake21

Can anyone get to Ibanez.com? At least in the US, I can't get to it. I just get a loading screen. Kinda looks like a new site.


----------



## Mathemagician

Thicker necks. Wizard III’s!!!


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Mathemagician said:


> Thicker necks. Wizard III’s!!!



MIJ Wizard II=best neck ever


----------



## Leviathus

Albake21 said:


> Can anyone get to Ibanez.com? At least in the US, I can't get to it. I just get a loading screen. Kinda looks like a new site.


Works for me and i'm in the states, they did indeed re-do their site a few weeks ago.


----------



## Mathemagician

MatiasTolkki said:


> MIJ Wizard II=best neck ever



The dozens of us in the “Wizard III Neckz = Best Neckz Club” disagree.


----------



## Albake21

Leviathus said:


> Works for me and i'm in the states, they did indeed re-do their site a few weeks ago.


Hmm that's strange. Maybe if I clear my cache that will fix it. Thanks for letting me know it's on my side, not Ibanez.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Leviathus said:


> Works for me and i'm in the states, they did indeed re-do their site a few weeks ago.



It works at this moment, has been super spotty with the front page loading after the update. IME.


----------



## Albake21

Sorry but you are all wrong.... The classic Wizard I or the Wizard HP is the best followed by the thinner Super Wizard.


----------



## MickD7

Dayn said:


> I'd be fine with that Southern Cross inlay if it had the proper shape to it... I wonder how many bogans bought it to go with their tattoo.



Judging by the amount that I’ve encountered over the years I’d say a few did. Christ Australians are weird like that. Look it’s cool that we got considered for another guitar, I’d take red over Green and Gold or with the Australian flag on it. 

I would have backed a Road Warrior RG


----------



## possumkiller

ESP is disappoint for another year. Ibanez better do some good shit this year. Like a prestige RG7 that doesn't have a veneer or uglyburst finish. RG7***XL reissue would be amazing. Or RGA7 prestige...


----------



## Ivars V

Albake21 said:


> Can anyone get to Ibanez.com? At least in the US, I can't get to it. I just get a loading screen. Kinda looks like a new site.



if you disable adblock, it redirects to your regional ibanez website.


----------



## oremus91

possumkiller said:


> ESP is disappoint for another year. Ibanez better do some good shit this year. Like a prestige RG7 that doesn't have a veneer or uglyburst finish. RG7***XL reissue would be amazing. Or RGA7 prestige...













I don't know, I'm pretty stoked about these, and I'm a huge ESP fan but almost always disappointed with their releases. I thought they had a lot of innovative stuff in the 2019 teasers, what don't you like?


----------



## possumkiller

oremus91 said:


> I don't know, I'm pretty stoked about these, and I'm a huge ESP fan but almost always disappointed with their releases. I thought they had a lot of innovative stuff in the 2019 teasers, what don't you like?


Purple fade over a burl veneer with hacked up pickup covers and random gold polepieces for a start...


----------



## Jeff

Ivars V said:


> if you disable adblock, it redirects to your regional ibanez website.



Yup. And they now have generic ads on their site. Very tacky.


----------



## couverdure

Jeff said:


> Yup. And they now have generic ads on their site. Very tacky.


I don't have AdBlock installed but I don't see any ads on their site. Then again, I'm from Asia so the site redirects me to the Asia region page. What I don't like about it though is the new layout that looks like it was only designed for mobile devices in mind and it doesn't mesh well in desktop browsers.


----------



## Andromalia

Looks like that's the current web design trend in Asia. PC market is not that big there.


----------



## oremus91

possumkiller said:


> Purple fade over a burl veneer with hacked up pickup covers and random gold polepieces for a start...



Well I'm just ecstatic that ESP is finally offering something that isn't satin black.


----------



## possumkiller

oremus91 said:


> Well I'm just ecstatic that ESP is finally offering something that isn't satin black.


I would be happier with nice solid and metallic colors. Or visually appealing transparent colors over visually appealing wood like they used to do. Transparent colors over ash, mahogany and figured maple... 

All I really want is for them to release an M-II Deluxe as a 7.


----------



## Jeff

couverdure said:


> I don't have AdBlock installed but I don't see any ads on their site. Then again, I'm from Asia so the site redirects me to the Asia region page. What I don't like about it though is the new layout that looks like it was only designed for mobile devices in mind and it doesn't mesh well in desktop browsers.



They were Disqus ads, showing when I went to a particular guitar. Looks like it's just regular Disqus comments now. However, site doesn't work with an Ad blocker installed, and even with it off, the site is horrendously slow (and I'm on a 1Gb connection).


----------



## possumkiller

I get generic clickbait ads as well.


----------



## oremus91

possumkiller said:


> I would be happier with nice solid and metallic colors. Or visually appealing transparent colors over visually appealing wood like they used to do. Transparent colors over ash, mahogany and figured maple...
> 
> All I really want is for them to release an M-II Deluxe as a 7.



For the record, burl is a figured maple


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Why are we talking about that overpriced ESP brand in an Ibanez thread?

With the current Genesis line being discontinued for 2019, anyone think we're gonna get a new line of Genesis next year?


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MatiasTolkki said:


> With the current Genesis line being discontinued for 2019, anyone think we're gonna get a new line of Genesis next year?



Wait, the Genesis line's being discontinued? Oh well, I guess we'll just have to wait until the bring the RG550 out again in the next 4-5 years. 

Maybe the Genesis AR line Japan had a few years earlier gets introduced to the rest us? That'd be nice actually.


----------



## beerandbeards

Man I thought the Genesis line was going to be a permanent fixture in the lineup. Interesting....


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Wait, the Genesis line's being discontinued? Oh well, I guess we'll just have to wait until the bring the RG550 out again in the next 4-5 years.
> 
> Maybe the Genesis AR line Japan had a few years earlier gets introduced to the rest us? That'd be nice actually.



It's discontinued for Japan anyway. Look at Ikebe and all the outlet prices, plus it says in kanji "Special production discontinuation price."

The Genesis ARs failed miserably, so i doubt Ibanez would be willing to release them again.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

I was just reminded on IG that Ibanez and Vemuram are collaborating on a new pedal. I've known about this for some time, but both parties are being tight lipped about it, aside from the IG story of Pete Thorn doing a short demo. 

It's going to be another OD pedal sure, but I'm still genuinely curious. I love the NuTube Screamer, which is a fine collaboration with Korg.


----------



## possumkiller

oremus91 said:


> For the record, burl is a figured maple


If you can call knotted and rotten figured. And except for when it isn't maple which is almost always since poplar burl is the magic wood of choice.


----------



## Sogradde

oremus91 said:


> For the record, burl is a figured maple


----------



## lewis

so still no new Xiphos?

Looks like im 100% building my own Xiphos project next year then.


----------



## Xaios

lewis said:


> so still no new Xiphos?
> 
> Looks like im 100% building my own Xiphos project next year then.


They've hardly revealed anything. Patience, grasshopper.

Although yeah, there's probably no Xiphos.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Xaios said:


> They've hardly revealed anything. Patience, grasshopper.
> 
> Although yeah, there's probably no Xiphos.


Jan 1st is the official planet-wide reveal, so I have read.


----------



## manu80

honestly , have any of you seen the XPIR from 3 yrs ago? the iron label xiphos .
Never seen in europe, nowhere...those looked awesome !


----------



## lewis

manu80 said:


> honestly , have any of you seen the XPIR from 3 yrs ago? the iron label xiphos .
> Never seen in europe, nowhere...those looked awesome !


Yeah exactly! What a stealthy stunner that is!?!

Where are they? No real reason to just stop selling them.
Would make perfect multiscales now too


----------



## MaxOfMetal

manu80 said:


> honestly , have any of you seen the XPIR from 3 yrs ago? the iron label xiphos .
> Never seen in europe, nowhere...those looked awesome !



Those were great just because you could swap in an awesome MIJ neck.


----------



## manu80

saw one on ebay, with scuffs etc..
never in a shop , online, or reverb or pre owned etc....


----------



## KnightBrolaire

burl is just a type of figuring, it can occur on a number of woods including walnut, buckeye, poplar, maple, redwood, and elm. It's just a tree tumor/infection that causes some crazy grain structure.


----------



## Bdtunn

I hoping for a lefty az. Got my hands around one today and that neck is pure super duper awesome sauce


----------



## cardinal

I’m very curious if there will be a 7-string AZ. Seems like definitely it would fit into the line up and the progressive vibe of the guitars, but they’d have to commit to the hardware/trem or use the Lo Pro 7, which seems to go against the AZ vibe. 

I have zero hope of an 8-String AZ, though.


----------



## odibrom

The AZ's neck was really a disappointment for me... and the fact they're 6 stringers...

I really doubt there will be a 7 or 8 stringer AZ, it doesn't look like it's their target market... but do I know?


----------



## hatena6

Some prestages are revealed.
https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610533
https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610532
https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610503
https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610501
https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610494


----------



## LordHar

hatena6 said:


> Some prestages are revealed.
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610533
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610532
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610503
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610501
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610494



And so it begins... exciting colors I must say


----------



## possumkiller

Macassar ebony fretboard, luminlays, mahogany body, fixed bridge RG7 MiJ in a color other than black with direct mount passives. Isn't that pretty much what SSO has always been begging Ibanez for?

I like it. On my list. Can't wait to see more.


----------



## mlp187

That walnut prestige is boner fuel for me.

I hope to see it stateside.


----------



## mlp187

possumkiller said:


> View attachment 65811
> Macassar ebony fretboard, luminlays, mahogany body, fixed bridge RG7 MiJ in a color other than black with direct mount passives. Isn't that pretty much what SSO has always been begging Ibanez for?
> 
> I like it. On my list. Can't wait to see more.



It still won’t be good enough. We’re a picky group! 

I like it though.


----------



## possumkiller

I hope they do a lo pro version of the 7 though. That blue RG3070 is the definition of a classy RG.


----------



## LordHar

From The Ibanez Japan instagram account. Ibanez RG3050-TKF


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

hatena6 said:


> Some prestages are revealed.
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610533
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610532
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610503
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610501
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610494



Interesting! Surprised that there are so many mahogany RG's (w/ no maple tops), very cool. I like the color choices as well.


----------



## possumkiller

LordHar said:


> From The Ibanez Japan instagram account. Ibanez RG3050-TKF


This as a 7 would be so badass.


----------



## xzacx

possumkiller said:


> View attachment 65811
> Macassar ebony fretboard, luminlays, mahogany body, fixed bridge RG7 MiJ in a color other than black with direct mount passives. Isn't that pretty much what SSO has always been begging Ibanez for?
> 
> I like it. On my list. Can't wait to see more.



If only it had a 28.32” scale length. So close, yet so far away.


----------



## couverdure

xzacx said:


> If only it had a 28.32” scale length. So close, yet so far away.


As always, the scale length spec begging. Pretty odd number you chose though.


----------



## xzacx

couverdure said:


> As always, the scale length spec begging. Pretty odd number you chose though.


I was just being a dick and made a random number up, suggesting that people would still find fault with this haha. I prefer 25.5” myself.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

possumkiller said:


> Macassar ebony fretboard, luminlays, mahogany body, fixed bridge RG7 MiJ in a color other than black with direct mount passives. Isn't that pretty much what SSO has always been begging Ibanez for?
> 
> I like it. On my list. Can't wait to see more.



That looks killer, although...it looks more like Rosewood than Ebony, but whatever 
Sounds like my ideal 7; I wish I played them enough to justify picking up another one haha. Converting from the Yen shows a price of around $1500ish too, which doesn't sound too bad considering Ibanez's recent MiJ pricing.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

hatena6 said:


> Some prestages are revealed.
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610533
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610532
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610503
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610501
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/610494



Wouldn't count on these coming to the US, or even Europe. 

The only region still using the older four-digit Prestige naming scheme is Japan. 

Perhaps they'll make a few changes for the export market...or they're going back to the old naming conventions for Prestige RGs.


----------



## Sogradde

EU still has the RG3775FZ and RG2550Z listed as of 2018.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> EU still has the RG3775FZ and RG2550Z listed as of 2018.



Those aren't new models though. They're holdovers from 2014/2015, hence the Edge Zero.


----------



## possumkiller

MaxOfMetal said:


> Those aren't new models though. They're holdovers from 2014/2015, hence the Edge Zero.


More like 2008. I bought my RG2550Z-GK in 08.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

possumkiller said:


> More like 2008. I bought my RG2550Z-GK in 08.



The RG2550Z actually got a "refresh" in 2015 with new pickups and colors, as well as no more neck binding. There was also a spec change in 2010 for the switch to the HP series necks.

But yeah, that's probably the oldest model in the Prestige lineup.


----------



## cip 123

Anyone think they just look cheap? That combined with the dimarzio "fusion" pickups make me wonder where these will land on the price point in the UK.


----------



## Albake21

LordHar said:


> From The Ibanez Japan instagram account. Ibanez RG3050-TKF


I want this so badly...


----------



## AdenM

Welp. Mahogany FX RGs make me mad I sold my 570 this year. If we see any of these stateside I see an Ibanez in my future.


----------



## dirtool

possumkiller said:


> View attachment 65811
> Macassar ebony fretboard, luminlays, mahogany body, fixed bridge RG7 MiJ in a color other than black with direct mount passives. Isn't that pretty much what SSO has always been begging Ibanez for?
> 
> I like it. On my list. Can't wait to see more.



Haven't gas an Ibanez for years.....I want it


----------



## LordHar

https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/589979





https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/589978


----------



## MaxOfMetal

LordHar said:


> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/589979
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/589978



Those aren't new. They came out in 2017 and are now discontinued.

They're part of the 2018-2019 outlet sale on Ikebe, not 2019 models.


----------



## LordHar

MaxOfMetal said:


> Those aren't new. They came out in 2017 and are now discontinued.
> 
> They're part of the 2018-2019 outlet sale on Ikebe, not 2019 models.



I stand corrected 

https://www.guitar.co.uk/brand/ibanez?limit=all

Here are what seem to be some 2019 artcore models


----------



## Metropolis

Finally they are ditching the rosewood fretboards, dat blue RG7 is also quite classy. Would look awesome with zebra or covered pickups.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Metropolis said:


> Finally they are ditching the rosewood fretboards, dat blue RG7 is also quite classy. Would look awesome with zebra or covered pickups.



Folks will still complain. 

Them being _rosewood_ was never the problem. The issue was they were never _jet_ _black_, which macassar isn't.


----------



## possumkiller

MaxOfMetal said:


> Folks will still complain.
> 
> Them being _rosewood_ was never the problem. The issue was they were never _jet_ _black_, which macassar isn't.


Yeah. In that ESP China link someone was whining about an EII having a "rosewood" fretboard instead of jet black ebony. Then another was complaining of the dye rubbing off on his fingers from his jet black dyed ebony fretboard...


----------



## lewis

can i just add, I have nothing against what wood anything is, its the colour Im firmly against.

Stopping using Rosewood (because of its browness) is a big win to me, thats instantly cancelled out if its replacement, Macassar ebony, is as brown as rosewood.

So dumb. CITES was surely an opportunity to start thinking and using non wood alternatives more than anything?
Why isnt Richlite more popular? Available in all colours (including brown for those weird people that like poo coloured guitars)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

lewis said:


> Why isnt Richlite more popular?



Cost.

Wood is so damn cheap, and still sells incredibly well. There's no incentive to change.


----------



## LordHar

And probably because most people prefer wood over glued paper


----------



## MaxOfMetal

LordHar said:


> And probably because most people prefer wood over glued paper



It would probably be more honest to say most people wouldn't know the difference.


----------



## cardinal

MaxOfMetal said:


> It would probably be more honest to say most people wouldn't know the difference.



That’s what these message boards are for! To inform the masses that the guitars they thought they were happy with are in fact inferior because they’re made of materials that they shouldn’t like because they weren’t around 60 years ago.


----------



## oremus91

Sogradde said:


> View attachment 65783



Funny out of context of course, but I meant in the context of the ESP, which was maple.


----------



## oremus91

So Rich from Ibanezrules confirmed "5 new AZ models" on the jemsite page? Very e x c i t e.


----------



## Seabeast2000

New RGD model:


----------



## MaxOfMetal

The906 said:


> New RGD model:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 65840



Good old swamp ass.

That's also just the MRW model from a few years ago. Who says it's a 2019?


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> Good old swamp ass.
> 
> That's also just the MRW model from a few years ago. Who says it's a 2019?



 Same swamp ass model with a pickup swap.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

MaxOfMetal said:


> Cost.
> 
> Wood is so damn cheap, and still sells incredibly well. There's no incentive to change.



Yeah, wood is so cheap, it’s almost like it grows on trees!


----------



## A-Branger

LordHar said:


> And probably because most people prefer wood over glued paper



for something small like a fretboard, you wont have any tonal differences. But you would have more neck stability, as your glued paper wont be contracting/expanding due to the moisture in the air 

....plus it can be made in jet black.... so finally your black guitar can look black and not black with some brown on it


but yeah its all about perception and marketing, Havent heard a complain about it on an Aristides. But if you sell it as "glued paper" yup, folks are gonna think its "bad" and your guitar would sound bad because of it and it would look cheap


----------



## odibrom

LordHar said:


> And probably because most people prefer wood over glued paper



You know paper is made of wood...


----------



## Seabeast2000

MaxOfMetal said:


> Good old swamp ass.
> 
> That's also just the MRW model from a few years ago. Who says it's a 2019?



It was here or the Too Funny Guitars thread, I chose here.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Is anyone else giggling because of the RGD naming structure? RGDIX. hehe They said DIX


----------



## A-Branger

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> Is anyone else giggling because of the RGD naming structure? RGDIX. hehe They said DIX


----------



## Musiscience

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> Is anyone else giggling because of the RGD naming structure? RGDIX. hehe They said DIX


----------



## lewis

Ah man. Im bummed because my favourite model is missing

The RGA91kjkjdkkusghghghghgooahe-0937927QM


----------



## prlgmnr

lewis said:


> Ah man. Im bummed because my favourite model is missing
> 
> The RGA91kjkjdkkusghghghghgooahe-0937927QM


I didn't realise they'd made one with both a quilt AND the hghghgooahe


----------



## lewis

prlgmnr said:


> I didn't realise they'd made one with both a quilt AND the hghghgooahe


Think it was only released in Japan haha


----------



## prlgmnr

I'd have bought one if it just had a hardtail, a maple fretboard with no inlays, different pickups, 6 strings instead of 7, a different body shape, a 5 piece neck, locking tuners, adjustable strap buttons, an oiled finish, stainless steel frets. And a block heel.


----------



## lurè

lewis said:


> Ah man. Im bummed because my favourite model is missing
> 
> The RGA91kjkjdkkusghghghghgooahe-0937927QM


----------



## lewis

prlgmnr said:


> I'd have bought one if it just had a hardtail, a maple fretboard with no inlays, different pickups, 6 strings instead of 7, a different body shape, a 5 piece neck, locking tuners, adjustable strap buttons, an oiled finish, stainless steel frets. And a block heel.


I would have just bought one if it didnt have a poo brown fretboard


----------



## cip 123

Bunch of new models added as "Avaliable to order" on UK site guitarguitar under new arrivals

https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/products/?Ordering=2


----------



## possumkiller

https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/181218336247008--ibanez-rg2027xl-dtb-2019

Holy fuck cock! It's an RG1077XL!!


----------



## Metropolis




----------



## 77zark77

https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/181218336226008--ibanez-pgmm21-mgn-metallic-light-green-2019
https://images.guitarguitar.co.uk/cdn/large/150/181218336226008f.jpg?

nice color, but... but....


*Fretboard : * Treated New Zealand Pine 

THAT is new (to me at least)

EDIT : and no inlay at 21th fret


----------



## Sogradde

Oh gawd, my wallet..
A prestige with SS frets and Fishmans.


----------



## AC.Lin

possumkiller said:


> https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/181218336247008--ibanez-rg2027xl-dtb-2019
> 
> Holy fuck cock! It's an RG1077XL!!


OMFG IH PUKEQSGHNF PQIEH?SPDIQHS¨DJ.¨QSOIJDF¨DSJ¨F


----------



## Seabeast2000

Sexy line up.


----------



## Albake21

Well.... what did I tell you guys? I told you guys the XL was coming back.


----------



## possumkiller

NVM it's ruined. Those dots on the 24th fret aren't lined up with the rest of the dots.


----------



## cip 123

Still no 2228 so I don't really care lol


----------



## possumkiller

cip 123 said:


> Still no 2228 so I don't really care lol


What about a 5328?


----------



## Albake21

I didn't think I'd actually see it, but there's a new 8 and 9 string for those guys asking.


----------



## possumkiller

They've got some hideous new finishes too. I guess they are competing with Kiesel for the ugliest finish ever.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Ugh, more new "series". It's becoming meaningless.


----------



## possumkiller

It also looks like they added another iron label series called axion label?


----------



## Sogradde

I'm pretty sure the 5000 series is replacing the Uppercut models as well as the Axion Label replacing the Iron Label series.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> I'm pretty sure the 5000 series is replacing the Uppercut models as well as the Axion Label replacing the Iron Label series.



That's what it's looking like so far, but if that's the actual case, it makes even less sense. 

EDIT: Looks like Iron Label is sticking around.


----------



## TGN

Albake21 said:


> I didn't think I'd actually see it, but there's a new 8 and 9 string for those guys asking.



There seems to be these two:

Ibanez RG5328-LDK:




and

Ibanez RGIR9FME-FDF:


----------



## Sogradde

MaxOfMetal said:


> EDIT: Looks like Iron Label is sticking around.


That's dumb. But no MIJ, no care.


----------



## Kaura

TGN said:


> View attachment 65898



WTF is that input jack placement?


----------



## Zahs

Kaura said:


> WTF is that input jack placement?



Pretty sure that a coil split switch.


----------



## Hollowway

Kaura said:


> WTF is that input jack placement?


That’s just a switch. The input jack is in the fret marker on the fifth fret


----------



## possumkiller

Hollowway said:


> That’s just a switch. The input jack is in the fret marker on the fifth fret


No that's just a dot. The output jack is on the rear of the high e tuner. The jack tip acts as the tuner post.


----------



## Kaura

Zahs said:


> Pretty sure that a coil split switch.



Oh, now I see it.


----------



## lurè

ss frets and the xl series back...


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

I like the caliburst I mean ocean RGD


----------



## Siggevaio

Classy! Finally a new prestige model that I'm actually interested in. Also interesting to see a PGMM that isn't based on a previous PGM, unless we get a new PGM as well. Looked cool as well so I would love to see a big one.


----------



## Vyn

So Ibanez just stole $10k out of my wallet next year.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

So far so good. Got that prestige 8 in my sights.


----------



## cardinal

The 2077 and 5328 are boss. I’ll complain about the bound fretboards (looks weird on an Ibanez to me), but the original 1077/2077 was bound so I’ll allow it for at least that one.

And SS frets on the 5328! Pretty cool.


----------



## eightsixboy

Finally they are doing SS frets on more prestiges. Even less reason for the Premiums to still exist lol.

The RGR5227 looks almost perfect, SS frets, a non boring colour.


----------



## A-Branger

love this finish, even that I hate HSH and tremolos. But still the finish is awesome, taken from the Jcustom with Myrtle top. But it does gives me ideas for a future build  

Als seems they bring the swish thing ont he headstock back for the Premium line. Which gives a nice difference to the Prestige, specialy since they made the Premium font similar to Prestige and it gets confusing visually.

Love they using Wenge for the fretboard

and as always.......

"why the poo brown fretboards?" complain  they got the chance to find some cool stuff (which they seem to did with premium lines with wenge), but now the other lines get an even lighter brown wood than rosewood. That JB white sig looks soo wrong with that fretboard..... Oh well

Looking forward to the bass lineup


----------



## Kaura

Just when I got done shit talking about fades, Ibanez releases something like this:






Thank god it's not Prestige so I don't have to worry about buying it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal




----------



## eightsixboy

A-Branger said:


> love this finish, even that I hate HSH and tremolos. But still the finish is awesome, taken from the Jcustom with Myrtle top. But it does gives me ideas for a future build
> 
> Als seems they bring the swish thing ont he headstock back for the Premium line. Which gives a nice difference to the Prestige, specialy since they made the Premium font similar to Prestige and it gets confusing visually.
> 
> Love they using Wenge for the fretboard
> 
> and as always.......
> 
> "why the poo brown fretboards?" complain  they got the chance to find some cool stuff (which they seem to did with premium lines with wenge), but now the other lines get an even lighter brown wood than rosewood. That JB white sig looks soo wrong with that fretboard..... Oh well
> 
> Looking forward to the bass lineup



Just realized this has an edge trem, actually half tempted to buy a Premium now. For years my main gripe was why the edge 3 on such expensive Premium guitars, now finally a proper trem. 

Poo brown is ok as long as its not rosewood lol. As you said, wenge is awesome, especially for a fingerboard.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

eightsixboy said:


> Just realized this has an edge trem, actually half tempted to buy a Premium now. For years my main gripe was why the edge 3 on such expensive Premium guitars, now finally a proper trem.



Edge 3s were only on standard models (and the Sam Totman sig), never on premiums. Trems on premiums were almost always the Edge Zero 2 (seafoam Jem and AZs being the exceptions). 

Either way I'm on board for the premium line to have Edges, which I much prefer to the EZ2 anyway. 

Speaking of AZs, no leaks on them yet....


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

YEah definitely getting the rg2027xl


----------



## PunkBillCarson

Kaura said:


> Just when I got done shit talking about fades, Ibanez releases something like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank god it's not Prestige so I don't have to worry about buying it.




Any word on a seven string version of that? Tell me those aren't Fishmans...


----------



## Albake21

eightsixboy said:


> Just realized this has an edge trem, actually half tempted to buy a Premium now. For years my main gripe was why the edge 3 on such expensive Premium guitars, now finally a proper trem.
> 
> Poo brown is ok as long as its not rosewood lol. As you said, wenge is awesome, especially for a fingerboard.


For the first time ever, Premium actually has my attention. The biggest hold back for me was the awful bridge, but with an Edge it definitely has my interest. 

So far so good, Ibanez.


----------



## Quiet Coil

PunkBillCarson said:


> Any word on a seven string version of that? Tell me those aren't Fishmans...



Those aren’t Fishmans (BKP’s).


----------



## couverdure

Metropolis said:


>



Looks like Andrew Baena's getting another green guitar soon.


----------



## cip 123

possumkiller said:


> What about a 5328?


Meh, I'm mainly just wanting an RG2228 not in Black, but the Used price here in the UK I can't really complain they're very cheap.

Still hoped to see one in a different colour.


----------



## Hollowway

Metropolis said:


>



I don’t know enough about how Ibanez does stuff, but what are the odds we’ll see this color on a 7 with a trem? I’d kill for that!


----------



## Hollowway

I don’t want to be a dick, but can someone find the guy at Ibanez wearing a brown shirt, blue jeans, black belt, and black shoes, and tell him to stop fucking designing guitars? That thing is hideous.


----------



## Curt

The only ones im feeling out of this new lineup is the Axion Label S and the 7 string Axion label RGD


----------



## A-Branger

Hollowway said:


> I don’t want to be a dick, but can someone find the guy at Ibanez wearing a brown shirt, blue jeans, black belt, and black shoes, and tell him to stop fucking designing guitars? That thing is hideous.


----------



## possumkiller

Kaura said:


> Just when I got done shit talking about fades, Ibanez releases something like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank god it's not Prestige so I don't have to worry about buying it.


It's like all the disgusting mockups made as a joke in the VRG builder are coming to life for some reason


----------



## Vyn

Hollowway said:


> I don’t want to be a dick, but can someone find the guy at Ibanez wearing a brown shirt, blue jeans, black belt, and black shoes, and tell him to stop fucking designing guitars? That thing is hideous.



I actually love it because it's every meme/gripe about modern metal presented in one offensive package


----------



## ThePIGI King

Blue 9 string? I don't have a blue guitar...and here I was thinking I'd buy an 8527 in 2019...


----------



## cardinal

Nice touch to have a 5mm top on the new RGD things. Makes the beveling and finish look much better IMHO. 

Pretty stoked for the 8328. Not my perfect guitar but has some great features (passive pickups, SS frets, 27” scale) and with a MiJ Ibanez, it’s a safe bet that I can take it out of the box and play it right away with no issues.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

So is there like a page showing all the new Ibanez stuff? Any good looking 7's? (and by that, I mean, good to the average person, not someone who plays customs all the time.)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

PunkBillCarson said:


> So is there like a page showing all the new Ibanez stuff? Any good looking 7's? (and by that, I mean, good to the average person, not someone who plays customs all the time.)



There's a link a couple pages back of some models that GuitarGuitar (a shop in the UK) let out of the bag a little early. 

If the past is any indicator, the US will probably get a few of these UK region models, typically in different finishes. 

The official releases for what we, US, will be getting aren't going to be out until early next year, barring a retailer letting the cat out of the bag early. 

So anyone not in the UK should be cautious about falling for any of these models, as there is no guarantee any of them will make it to North America.


----------



## cardinal

Great point that these specific models might not make it to the US. But I assume that overall the States will see at least some of these series coming to the US. The big news to me seems to be a 5000 Prestige series with stainless steel frets and ash bodies, which at least I like a lot. And a some series similar to the Iron Labels but with maybe fancier specs. Presumably each region will get some examples of 6, 7, and 8 strings in these various series, though the finishes and such might differ.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Great point that these specific models might not make it to the US. But I assume that overall the States will see at least some of these series coming to the US. The big news to me seems to be a 5000 Prestige series with stainless steel frets and ash bodies, which at least I like a lot. And a some series similar to the Iron Labels but with maybe fancier specs. Presumably each region will get some examples of 6, 7, and 8 strings in these various series, though the finishes and such might differ.



We'll definitely get some cool stuff, being the biggest single market we typically get even more stuff, and with no Edge Zeros in sight, these are all fair game to make it over here. 

Again, I think it's stupid on Ibanez' part to further dilute the Prestige series, but it doesn't seem too bad so far. 

I await the endless "is 5000 series better than Prestige" and "should I get an Iron Label or Axion Label" threads.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

40 years later......
" Is the 10k better than the 977D series?"
"Are space craft moon steel frets better than those crappy old stainless steel frets?"


----------



## cardinal

Seems like the 5000 series is part of the "prestige" line, just with SS frets? Looks like there will be at least 3000 series as well, with typical nickel frets. It was more confusing with the Genesis line which was MiJ but for some reason not labeled "Prestige" (maybe just to keep the logo off the headstock for old-times sake?). 

Having both the Axion Label and Iron Label seems odd, but originally the Iron Label was supposed to be this black-out METAL stuff, I think. So maybe they will just return the Iron Label to that and make the funky/trendy finishes as Axion Label, which might actually help with some confusion. 

Positive way to look at it, I guess, is that Ibanez will be offering a ton of models to populate all of those series (I guess there will be Prestige (with at least a few different levels of specs), Premium, Axion label, Iron Label, and Standard?), so at least there will be plenty of variety. MiJ no-brainer quality. Premiums with the fancy spec sheets. Axion with funky finishes. Iron Label with stripped down and black feature sets. And then the Standard stuff.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

I think guitarguitar found out. The models were removed from site


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Seems like the 5000 series is part of the "prestige" line, just with SS frets? It was more confusing with the Genesis line which was MiJ but for some reason not labeled "Prestige" (maybe just to keep the logo off the headstock for old-times sake?).
> 
> Having both the Axion Label and Iron Label seems odd, but originally the Iron Label was supposed to be this black-out METAL stuff, I think. So maybe they will just return the Iron Label to that and make the funky/trendy finishes as Axion Label, which might actually help with some confusion.
> 
> Positive way to look at it, I guess, is that Ibanez will be offering a ton of models to populate all of those series (I guess there will be Prestige (with at least a few different levels of specs), Premium, Axion label, Iron Label, and Standard?), so at least there will be plenty of variety. MiJ no-brainer quality. Premiums with the fancy spec sheets. Axion with funky finishes. Iron Label with stripped down and black feature sets. And then the Standard stuff.



I completely understand what they're trying to do, but I'm a guitar nerd. Specifically a guitar nerd that knows too much about Ibanez for their own good. 

I just don't think it's wise to fragment the range so much. Your average Joe guitar player will probably be more confused by this, as it's going to throw out all reasonable naming conventions...again, and bring unneeded complexity to what was once a very straight forward product lineup.

I also thought it was dumb to label the reissues of the RG5 models a different series.


----------



## Metropolis

In the Axion Label series specs there was mentioned "subzero fret treatment", wonder what that really is


----------



## Kaura

possumkiller said:


> It's like all the disgusting mockups made as a joke in the VRG builder are coming to life for some reason



Maybe that's why I love it. At least it's not headless.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Metropolis said:


> In the Axion Label series specs there was mentioned "subzero fret treatment", wonder what that really is



Marketing bullshit if I had to guess.


----------



## Metropolis

MaxOfMetal said:


> Marketing bullshit if I had to guess.



Most likely, why not to just make better fretwork without any marketing gimmicks.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Metropolis said:


> Most likely, why not to just make better fretwork without any marketing gimmicks.



They're probably trying to play off those "cryogenic" strings that some folks are really into. 

They can't really guarantee better fretwork, but they can guarantee they applied some mumbo-jumbo to the fret material to give it magic powers.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

"Hey man, I got cryogenic frets! I mean, I know they rip my hands open, but... cryogenic, man!"


----------



## cip 123

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> I think guitarguitar found out. The models were removed from site


Glad I posted the link last night haha.

If it says avaliable to order on there it should be new. Those sterling models though I don't think they're "new" are new coming in haven't seen many in the UK at all.

I'll keep my eye on the page though doubt they'll make another leak.


----------



## cardinal

MaxOfMetal said:


> They're probably trying to play off those "cryogenic" strings that some folks are really into.
> 
> They can't really guarantee better fretwork, but they can guarantee they applied some mumbo-jumbo to the fret material to give it magic powers.



I think the cryogenic treatments really do help harden steel and ferric metals, but I think normal frets are mostly brass and some nickel? I don't know that cryogenic treatment has been show to do much for those alloys, so i seems a bit weird here unless they are cryogenic treated SS frets, which seems like complete overkill.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Vyn said:


> I actually love it because it's every meme/gripe about modern metal presented in one offensive package



It's got a flame top though, needs a shitty burl one 
--
Looks like Ibanez is killin' it this year so far, though. I've counted like 3 guitars I want to pick up so far, which is definitely more than recent years. Nice to see some interesting Prestiges get released again.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> I think the cryogenic treatments really do help harden steel and ferric metals, but I think normal frets are mostly brass and some nickel? I don't know that cryogenic treatment has been show to do much for those alloys, so i seems a bit weird here unless they are cryogenic treated SS frets, which seems like complete overkill.



I'm sure there's something to the process itself, it's more of the application of it that I'm not optimistic of.


----------



## cip 123

BTW guitars aren't actually down, you can still see them if anyone has a link to whatever guitar it was 

https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/181218336244008--ibanez-rg5328-ldk-2019


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Marketing bullshit if I had to guess.



Could be worse. It’s just a matter of time now before we see Kieselogenic treated frets.


----------



## ExileMetal

I'm hoping there's more interesting stuff for US catalog. The best offering by far is the 2027; mostly disappointed that the 8 string model is intensely boring. I wonder why they didn't just make the 8 string version of the RGR that already exists in an 8 string format; it's 75% of that guitar but has absolutely none of the appeal.


----------



## gunch

Who is Axion label aimed at, nerds with science/space plural noun band names?


----------



## possumkiller

silverabyss said:


> Who is Axxxion label aimed at, nerds with science/space plural noun band names?


Dave Mustain fans I guess?


----------



## xwmucradiox

I've seen hints about a new baritone for 2019. Stoked to see what comes out on that end since I no longer play 7s.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

silverabyss said:


> Who is Axion label aimed at, nerds with science/space plural noun band names?



Fan of Kiesel, Schecter and ESP/LTD?



xwmucradiox said:


> I've seen hints about a new baritone for 2019. Stoked to see what comes out on that end since I no longer play 7s.



Other than the new RGXL?


----------



## xwmucradiox

MaxOfMetal said:


> Other than the new RGXL?



I guess if they're doing a 6 in addition to the 2027XL reissue. I had the 6 string from that series (RG470XL) and it was garbage so I don't have high hopes. Ideally it would be fixed bridge and not an RG.


----------



## Frostbite

Honestly super pumped to get the XL series back. I was really close to pulling the trigger on a 2077xl that Axe Palace was selling but I waited too long


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

xwmucradiox said:


> I guess if they're doing a 6 in addition to the 2027XL reissue. I had the 6 string from that series (RG470XL) and it was garbage so I don't have high hopes. Ideally it would be fixed bridge and not an RG.



Yeah'd I'd be a hell of a lot more excited for a 6. I don't down tune my 7s too far (the lowest I go is Drop A, _*maybe*_ Ab), but my sixers go down almost as far (Drop Bb), so a 6 string XL would definitely grab my attention.

Just...for the love of god, please no light brown fretboard.


----------



## possumkiller

A prestige SZ would be badass.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Hm if there is one finish I want them to copy from Kiesel, it is the arctic finishes. I like the teal and blue one. They did it on an AEW acoustic cheapo line. Give it to us on a braitone 7


----------



## gunch

If they made a AX premium or axion with a unicorn burlf finish and crazy timbers I’d probably get it ‍


----------



## MatiasTolkki

well, looks like Ibanez is finally putting OEs on premiums. I havent seen any pics, but it's being rumored all over the place.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MatiasTolkki said:


> well, looks like Ibanez is finally putting OEs on premiums. I havent seen any pics, but it's being rumored all over the place.



There's a pic a couple pages back.


----------



## Aaron

After a quick view of the 2019 catalog i can assure you this is the best year for 7s i could ever remember. EVER!


----------



## Seabeast2000

PunkBillCarson said:


> So is there like a page showing all the new Ibanez stuff? Any good looking 7's? (and by that, I mean, good to the average person, not someone who plays customs all the time.)


Get the hel l out of here with your peasant tastes and values.


----------



## Seabeast2000

PunkBillCarson said:


> So is there like a page showing all the new Ibanez stuff? Any good looking 7's? (and by that, I mean, good to the average person, not someone who plays customs all the time.)


Get the hel l out of here with your peasant tastes and values.


----------



## A-Branger

cardinal said:


> Nice touch to have a 5mm top on the new RGD things. Makes the beveling and finish look much better IMHO.



fully agree there, they look far better. But I still think they should have done the burst to the edge of the body and no the edge of the flat top part of the gutiar


----------



## Vyn

The natural/stained finishes on the Iron Lable RGD bevels are crimes against humanity.


----------



## possumkiller

A-Branger said:


> fully agree there, they look far better. But I still think they should have done the burst to the edge of the body and no the edge of the flat top part of the gutiar


They really want people to know it's a top and not a venniere. Bursting to the edge would have covered up the proof. I think they should have just left out the burst period.


----------



## Musiscience

When I saw that green reverse headstock 7 string I was very excited, but since I read that they come with SS frets, I'm literally having a seizure.


----------



## NeglectedField

Sorry to break the thread of discussion but I am vibing with that RG Prestige hardtail with the Fishmans.


----------



## Sogradde

Found this on the 'gram.


----------



## cardinal

Ishibashi has that and some others up

https://store.ishibashi.co.jp/ec/pro/disp/1/03-313849900-3342


----------



## Leviathus

Still hate that switch placement, cool J. custom though.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Leviathus said:


> Still hate that switch placement, cool J. custom though.



This...

And and also, why do they need the coil tap switch? Couldn't they have done it like the JS series with pull push pots on the volume and tone? This way just looks like an unnecessarily drilled hole in the otherwise lovely guitar.


----------



## cip 123

_MonSTeR_ said:


> This...
> 
> And and also, why do they need the coil tap switch? Couldn't they have done it like the JS series with pull push pots on the volume and tone? This way just looks like an unnecessarily drilled hole in the otherwise lovely guitar.




Depends how it's operating with the fishmans, fishman actually provide multiple push pull pots. But there are lots of options for configurations, for all we know it could be 2 push pulls plus the switch.

From memory with fishmans you get 2 voicings(1 push pull) a high frequency cut (1 push pull) and coil split (maybe the switch?) .... Or it's just ibanez being ibanez


----------



## _MonSTeR_

cip 123 said:


> Depends how it's operating with the fishmans, fishman actually provide multiple push pull pots. But there are lots of options for configurations, for all we know it could be 2 push pulls plus the switch.
> 
> From memory with fishmans you get 2 voicings(1 push pull) a high frequency cut (1 push pull) and coil split (maybe the switch?) .... Or it's just ibanez being ibanez



Aaaaaah!!!

That makes a lot more sense then! Thanks for the clarification.


----------



## A-Branger

cip 123 said:


> Or it's just ibanez being ibanez


that would be my vote.

personally I rather a mini-switch than a pull/push pot. Much quicker and convenient to activate


----------



## spacebard

Love these new J-Custom 

*R5121B14E1*





*R3112A44L3*






*R9441F22G5*






*R7131E22J4*


----------



## Kaura

The red one would be close to perfect with gold hardware. Same goes for that last one. I think I said this before but the black hardware makes it look like a low-end model, imo.


----------



## eightsixboy

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Edge 3s were only on standard models (and the Sam Totman sig), never on premiums. Trems on premiums were almost always the Edge Zero 2 (seafoam Jem and AZs being the exceptions).
> 
> Either way I'm on board for the premium line to have Edges, which I much prefer to the EZ2 anyway.
> 
> Speaking of AZs, no leaks on them yet....



I meant Edge Zero II, don't know why I keep saying edge III. 

AZ there will be more sigs I'm pretty sure, hopefully other colors and some more 24 fret versions with maple tops besides the MM1.


----------



## eightsixboy

spacebard said:


> Love these new J-Custom
> 
> *R5121B14E1*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R3112A44L3*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R9441F22G5*
> 
> View attachment 65967
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R7131E22J4*



2018 stuff

http://ibanez.wikia.com/wiki/P:2018_RG_J_Custom_models


----------



## Leviathus

spacebard said:


>



This one's awesome!!!


----------



## Albake21

spacebard said:


> Love these new J-Custom
> 
> *R5121B14E1*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R3112A44L3*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R9441F22G5*
> 
> View attachment 65967
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *R7131E22J4*


That last one is still cool as hell to me... I'd seriously consider it if it came to the US for a reasonable price.


----------



## diagrammatiks

S matters too guys.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

diagrammatiks said:


> S matters too guys.



I wish they'd do a genesis S540 in lipstick red.


----------



## TGN

MatiasTolkki said:


> I wish they'd do a genesis S540 in lipstick red.



Or a S540-7 perhaps ... I tend to prefer 24 fret models though.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

TGN said:


> Or a S540-7 perhaps ... I tend to prefer 24 fret models though.



id rather have 24 fret also, but that wouldnt be an S Genesis if it was. 

Also, it wouldnt be if it was a 7 string either, 6 strings only.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

With no more 22-fret MIJ necks across the board, I don't think a 22-fret Saber reissue is likely. I could definitely be wrong though.


----------



## 77zark77

I like the poplar/blue one but I don't understand why the logo isn't s simply blue


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Ibanez website now updated with new models. 

https://www.ibanez.com/na/news/detail/20181229144347.html

Pretty great lineup so far.


----------



## Albake21

Oh come on... are you telling me that awesome brown one from Ikebe is a Japanese exclusive?


----------



## Seabeast2000

Impressed. Lots to talk about for sure.

5 sigs of artists I don't know but they look tasty.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Ibanez website now updated with new models.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/na/news/detail/20181229144347.html
> 
> Pretty great lineup so far.



Eh.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> Eh.



Not the same level as last year admittedly. Only one new S, and the bass lineup is less stellar this time around.

But I am glad there's a 12 string electric available.

EDIT: I would've been more excited about the return of the ART series but after scoring a 76 2350CS, I've lost all interest.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Not the same level as last year admittedly. Only one new S, and the bass lineup is less stellar this time around.
> 
> But I am glad there's a 12 string electric available.
> 
> EDIT: I would've been more excited about the return of the ART series but after scoring a 76 2350CS, I've lost all interest.



There was a lot of talk about how great the 7-string offerings were going to be, as well as tons of variation and diversification of the AZ platform, but it looks like that translates into just two Prestige-level 7s (both RGs) and the same AZ with different finishes. 

Fans of the lower tier models, Iron Label/Axiom Label, are certainly in for a treat thought. 

There are positives, for sure, but nothing for me. 

Some interesting stuff:

-RG550DX? Interesting choice for a reissue. 
-The Affirma is back, albeit in Premium dress.
-A Premium JEM7V, didn't see that one coming. 
-The Saber really is the red-headed step child. Ouch.


----------



## Siggevaio

I wish Andy Timmons gave his signature a bigger update than just the neck. Also the Polyphia guys... Such ugly guitars


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> There was a lot of talk about how great the 7-string offerings were going to be, as well as tons of variation and diversification of the AZ platform, but it looks like that translates into just two Prestige-level 7s (both RGs) and the same AZ with different finishes.
> 
> Fans of the lower tier models, Iron Label/Axiom Label, are certainly in for a treat thought.
> 
> There are positives, for sure, but nothing for me.
> 
> Some interesting stuff:
> 
> -RG550DX? Interesting choice for a reissue.
> -The Affirma is back, albeit in Premium dress.
> -A Premium JEM7V, didn't see that one coming.
> -The Saber really is the red-headed step child. Ouch.



Yeah, all the new AZs are all signatures as well. The Andy Timmons model being billed as a 20th anniversary model.

My guess with the 7 string lineup is being catered to the mid priced crowd. At least the 2 prestige models are cool. And at least there's a new prestige 8 that doesn't look like turd in a swimming pool.

My tastes have since gone weirder as I get older. So I'm fascinated with the SRMDs for some reason.

Yeah the S really copped the short end here. But with my sole S540 currently being surrounded by a plethora of RGs, Xs and Talmans, I can't talk.


----------



## Hollowway

No skunkworks stuff this year. I love when they come out of nowhere with an Ashula or SR7VIIISC. Not this year, though.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Bloody_Inferno said:


> Yeah, all the new AZs are all signatures as well. The Andy Timmons model being billed as a 20th anniversary model.
> 
> My guess with the 7 string lineup is being catered to the mid priced crowd. At least the 2 prestige models are cool. And at least there's a new prestige 8 that doesn't look like turd in a swimming pool.
> 
> My tastes have since gone weirder as I get older. So I'm fascinated with the SRMDs for some reason.
> 
> Yeah the S really copped the short end here. But with my sole S540 currently being surrounded by a plethora of RGs, Xs and Talmans, I can't talk.



The Timmons is the only interesting one. At least it has a different neck shape and bridge. 

The other 7s are OK. Kinda gaudy, but I know that's "in" now. While the new Prestige 8 is much better than the current, can't say it's interesting at all. They definitely played it safe there. 

I've noticed a trend in short scale basses in general, which is cool. 

The problem with the Sabers is they've been pushing roughly the same model for like 10 years now. No one wants a veneer topped, HSH Saber for 50% more than most RGs.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Hm I want that multiscale 7 string


----------



## gunch

Yeah kind of bummed, the new RGs are cool but they've neglected anything that isn't a hollowbody, AZ or RG 

Also axing the ARZ to bring back the ART?


----------



## ThePIGI King

So, only 3 I'm interested in, kinda bummed.

Question, the RGIR9 has a Nyatoh body wood? Thats a new one.


----------



## Seabeast2000

MaxOfMetal said:


> There was a lot of talk about how great the 7-string offerings were going to be, as well as tons of variation and diversification of the AZ platform, but it looks like that translates into just two Prestige-level 7s (both RGs) and the same AZ with different finishes.
> 
> Fans of the lower tier models, Iron Label/Axiom Label, are certainly in for a treat thought.
> 
> There are positives, for sure, but nothing for me.
> 
> Some interesting stuff:
> 
> -RG550DX? Interesting choice for a reissue.
> -The Affirma is back, albeit in Premium dress.
> -A Premium JEM7V, didn't see that one coming.
> -The Saber really is the red-headed step child. Ouch.



Standard dots seem to be deprecated as well. Which is a nice touch on any guitar let alone an (presumed)$1800 Prestige. Thanks Ibanez. Also wonder what survived from 2018.


----------



## cardinal

Definitely played it reasonably safe with the RG5328, but the specs are a nice upgrade and at this point just offering an 8-string could be considered daring.


----------



## cip 123

I really like Scottie's new AZ.

Interesting in specs it seems the polyphia guys have some sig Dimarzio's, or at least for this model.


----------



## Kaura

Once again all the cool finishes (and pickups) are reserved to indo-crap models. I mean, I'm not sure about the RGA's and RGD's but since they don't have the Prestige logo on the headstock I assume they aren't Prestige.


----------



## toiletstand

for some reason i kept thinking the luke hoskin model was gonna be an rga. looks awesome though. lots of cool offerings. i cant wait to see what kinda exclusive runs music shops are gonna pull with the prestige rg7s


----------



## pfizer

Was kinda hoping for some more new colors for their AZ Prestige line, but I guess Marco's new signature is all we're getting for now. 

Also hoped for the off-chance that they'd bring back some RGA Prestige goodness but it was a long-shot anyway. 

Luke Hoskin's new sig looks nice but I kinda wish it was a Prestige model instead.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

pfizer said:


> Was kinda hoping for some more new colors for their AZ Prestige line, but I guess Marco's new signature is all we're getting for now.
> 
> Also hoped for the off-chance that they'd bring back some RGA Prestige goodness but it was a long-shot anyway.
> 
> Luke Hoskin's new sig looks nice but I kinda wish it was a Prestige model instead.



Fear not. I am sure theyll price it close to one


----------



## icipher

What the heck are "sub zero treated frets"? I searched Google and saw nothing.


----------



## Boojakki

icipher said:


> What the heck are "sub zero treated frets"? I searched Google and saw nothing.



Their way of calling "cryogenically treated" frets as such.

BTW: I kinda like the EH10, the MSM100, the RG5120M and the RGR4220M


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

icipher said:


> What the heck are "sub zero treated frets"? I searched Google and saw nothing.


Guessing it's probably something like Gibson's 'cryogenic' treatment. Basically it is supposed to harden the frets so they don't wear as fast afaik.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

----This channel has some brief demos of a bunch of the new models.

Not sure how I feel about the Axion Label's having luminescent headstock logos.


----------



## Quiet Coil

On the one hand there’s nothing that would replace both my DCM100 and KM7 mkII. On the other hand I get to keep my DCM and KM7.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Goooooddddddd the J. Customs this year are just screaming my name. Impulse control in 2019 is gunna be a struggle.

Thank god the S series got no respect this time around. I'm such a sucker for the sabers I don't think I could help myself.


----------



## I play music

https://www.ibanez.com/eu/news/detail/20181225111333.html
EU lineup looks slightly different





If this one had stainless steel frets I could not contain myself


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I play music said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/news/detail/20181225111333.html
> EU lineup looks slightly different
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If this one had stainless steel frets I could not contain myself



Now that's freak'n cool.


----------



## Ron Head

Here's a link to almost all new Ibanez 2019 ones :
https://www.ibanez.com/na/news/deta...tZyfAYRDrTpWrV0jN1gufUvDXrxgJ_drDxx1DbxeXJyiA
.. to bad the 2027 topic is closed ; I didn't look here for sevens
anyway , happy new gear everyone !


----------



## myrtorp

Probably my favourite of the bunch!


----------



## lewis

myrtorp said:


> Probably my favourite of the bunch!


Well SHIT!
..................Im guna need this

EDIT : Only 25.5 inch scale for the 7 string /\ ??? wtf


----------



## icipher

lewis said:


> Well SHIT!
> ..................Im guna need this
> 
> EDIT : Only 25.5 inch scale for the 7 string /\ ??? wtf



Yeah man, i don't get why ibanez has so many 7 strings with 25.5. Once I played a 26.5 or 27 it was immediately clear how much better a fit it was for 7 strings if you're tuning below B standard. At least Schecter gets it.


----------



## lewis

icipher said:


> Yeah man, i don't get why ibanez has so many 7 strings with 25.5. Once I played a 26.5 or 27 it was immediately clear how much better a fit it was for 7 strings if you're tuning below B standard. At least Schecter gets it.


weird as hell. Thats me out then. (although the brand new fan fret models with Fishmans and this one look sweet)

26.5 at least


----------



## 77zark77

WOW !!! I'd love to have the AZ HS, the ATZ100 and the PGMM21, see I'm not so old and nostalgic !


----------



## Xaios

lewis said:


> Well SHIT!
> ..................Im guna need this
> 
> EDIT : Only 25.5 inch scale for the 7 string /\ ??? wtf





icipher said:


> Yeah man, i don't get why ibanez has so many 7 strings with 25.5. Once I played a 26.5 or 27 it was immediately clear how much better a fit it was for 7 strings if you're tuning below B standard. At least Schecter gets it.


This is why.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

icipher said:


> Yeah man, i don't get why ibanez has so many 7 strings with 25.5. Once I played a 26.5 or 27 it was immediately clear how much better a fit it was for 7 strings if you're tuning below B standard. At least Schecter gets it.



That's actually the only new 7 that's 25.5". The other four are 26.5" or 27". It's not a new trend either, as they currently have more 26.5" than 25.5" in the regular, non-Sig lineup, it's just most signature models are spec'd at 25.5" by the artist.

I prefer 25.5", but I really don't mind a 1" or 2" difference these days.


----------



## possumkiller

I play music said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/news/detail/20181225111333.html
> EU lineup looks slightly different
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If this one had stainless steel frets I could not contain myself


Fuck! Moving to Europe is finally gonna pay off!


----------



## Xaios

I play music said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/news/detail/20181225111333.html
> EU lineup looks slightly different
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If this one had stainless steel frets I could not contain myself


Fucking love it. The only thing I'm not down with are the fretboard dots because I think they're too big. Other than that though, grand slam.

Also, who thought it would be a good idea to throw a black bridge on that JBM with gold tuners and gold pickup covers?


----------



## diagrammatiks

Meeeeh

Are the polyphia guys trolling. They can’t be serious with those guitars. 

The rgixl7 is easily the prettiest one. It’s an iron label so no one here will admit to liking them. But my kids eat all my money so I’m excited for some more backup options. 

The rgaixu is now the rga60l. Umm ok Ibanez. That’s Nissan level nonsense right there. 

One new s. Meeehhhhh


----------



## MaxOfMetal

possumkiller said:


> Fuck! Moving to Europe is finally gonna pay off!



Available in the US too! 

https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/rg752m_00_01.html


----------



## Seabeast2000

Kaura said:


> Once again all the cool finishes (and pickups) are reserved to indo-crap models. I mean, I'm not sure about the RGA's and RGD's but since they don't have the Prestige logo on the headstock I assume they aren't Prestige.


I think you'll see a "Made in Japan" header for those. Otherwise, they are not MIJ. At least that is my assumption.


----------



## Ammusa

They've changed specs on the old models as well. The RGR752AHBF now has Macassar Ebony board instead of rosewood.


----------



## icipher

Xaios said:


> This is why.



I am going to have to respectfully argue that MOST people who voted 25.5 either haven't been able to play an extended scale or are only tuning standard B. The clarity, tension without having to use bass strings, and playability of a 26.5 or 27 scale is undeniable. Unless you're a very small person with short arms i can't see why one would prefer 25.5 on a 7.


----------



## I play music

MaxOfMetal said:


> Available in the US too!
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/rg752m_00_01.html


So Canada and Mexico don't get it or why is it not on the North American page for the new models?


----------



## Ammusa

"Nyatoh body"????


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I play music said:


> So Canada and Mexico don't get it or why is it not on the North American page for the new models?



Check the URL, that is the page for the US

It's not a new model, it's just a new color, so I guess they didn't include it on the announcement page. Or they just screwed up. 

EDIT: Yeah, I don't see it on the Canadian or Mexican Ibanez sites, so it might just be coming to the United States.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

Kinda bummed that theres no new extreme shapes.


----------



## JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo

lewis said:


> weird as hell. Thats me out then. (although the brand new fan fret models with Fishmans and this one look sweet)
> 
> 26.5 at least



THIS. I NEED THIS.


----------



## lewis

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> Kinda bummed that theres no new extreme shapes.


I KNEW this would happen. No Xiphos return yet again and even the Falchion is sweet and getting no love.

Ploughing ahead with my Xiphos build in 2019 then.



OliOliver said:


> THIS. I NEED THIS.



Its a stunner. The best new offering imo. Looks sweeeeeet.


----------



## kamello

holy shit, I remember that many years ago, @Kodee_Kaos made me a mockup of my "ideal Ibanez" and ended up with this




now, I would prefer a Tight-End bridge and reverse headstock but it's still pretty close to what was my "ideal Ibanez" back then before everyone and their mother started doing those Misha-ish Blue Bursts

and now Ibanez releases this 




the 18 YO inside me would be crazy with this, so I might try to score this or the fanned-chamaleon one, but Im _slowly _getting desinterested in that typical "dj0nt" aesthetic after so much over-exposure to it, in fact, it would have been great to see these type of models a few years back, when the only options we had in the metal market were black and black cherry

now, regarding the rest of the line-up; I love the fact that from around 2016 and onwards Ibanez actually started to use colors, before that, reading through a catalogue was like watching a funeral procession, hopefully the quality of the instruments themselves is good


also, @MaxOfMetal, Im also missing some more new Prestiges here, but atleast from a market pov, I believe it makes sense. Schecter was getting a good deal of the market (atleast here in South America) competing with mid-low prices, better looks than most Indo Ibanez, and a better spec-sheet that could atract more people aside from the nerds in this forum that focus on fret finish and glue residues, although I definitely prefer better quality over better specs, and my experience with the entire range of no-USA Schecters (from Omen up to KM's) have been terrible


----------



## PunkBillCarson

I'm drooling over that second one...


----------



## Obsidian Soul

icipher said:


> I am going to have to respectfully argue that MOST people who voted 25.5 either haven't been able to play an extended scale or are only tuning standard B. The clarity, tension without having to use bass strings, and playability of a 26.5 or 27 scale is undeniable. Unless you're a very small person with short arms i can't see why one would prefer 25.5 on a 7.


I think we also have to respect that there is a horde of people that are not on any guitar forum and do not understand the point of an extended scale length.It's the same parellel as how forumites here do not understand how George Lynch signatures are being made and sold like hot cakes to this day.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

I mean for this matter, why not get rid of anything below 25.5 if people aren't going to downtune? Oh yeah, because... Preference...


----------



## Hollowway

icipher said:


> What the heck are "sub zero treated frets"? I searched Google and saw nothing.



Meet Ibanez's new fret dresser!


----------



## PunkBillCarson

^Think he's going to be able to keep up with the demand of all the high school kids who fall for the gimmicks?


----------



## Hollowway

PunkBillCarson said:


> ^Think he's going to be able to keep up with the demand of all the high school kids who fall for the gimmicks?


If he doesn't, they will "finish him."


----------



## PunkBillCarson

I hope they've got a high schooler named Hanzo Hasashi or it's not happening.


----------



## Obsidian Soul

The two Ibanez RGXLs look up my alley,especially with the natural one having a reverse headstock,a hardtail bridge,and a coil tap.

Also,I've never seen Nyatoh used for a guitar,but I don't believe in tonewood so...


----------



## PunkBillCarson

Is this coming to US?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

PunkBillCarson said:


> Is this coming to US?



Yep.

https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/rgd61al_1p_01.html


----------



## I play music

kamello said:


> holy shit, I remember that many years ago, @Kodee_Kaos made me a mockup of my "ideal Ibanez" and ended up with this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now, I would prefer a Tight-End bridge and reverse headstock but it's still pretty close to what was my "ideal Ibanez" back then before everyone and their mother started doing those Misha-ish Blue Bursts
> 
> and now Ibanez releases this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the 18 YO inside me would be crazy with this, so I might try to score this or the fanned-chamaleon one, but Im _slowly _getting desinterested in that typical "dj0nt" aesthetic after so much over-exposure to it, in fact, it would have been great to see these type of models a few years back, when the only options we had in the metal market were black and black cherry
> 
> now, regarding the rest of the line-up; I love the fact that from around 2016 and onwards Ibanez actually started to use colors, before that, reading through a catalogue was like watching a funeral procession, hopefully the quality of the instruments themselves is good
> 
> 
> also, @MaxOfMetal, Im also missing some more new Prestiges here, but atleast from a market pov, I believe it makes sense. Schecter was getting a good deal of the market (atleast here in South America) competing with mid-low prices, better looks than most Indo Ibanez, and a better spec-sheet that could atract more people aside from the nerds in this forum that focus on fret finish and glue residues, although I definitely prefer better quality over better specs, and my experience with the entire range of no-USA Schecters (from Omen up to KM's) have been terrible


It's one of those guitars where I find the back waaay prettier than the front


----------



## Xaios

icipher said:


> I am going to have to respectfully argue that MOST people who voted 25.5 either haven't been able to play an extended scale or are only tuning standard B. The clarity, tension without having to use bass strings, and playability of a 26.5 or 27 scale is undeniable. Unless you're a very small person with short arms i can't see why one would prefer 25.5 on a 7.


Here's the thing: if all these people aren't detuning their guitars to drop-Q and don't want strings that feel like piano wire under the fingers, that's their prerogative. I'd hazard a guess that, even if that's not the majority of 7 string players, it's still likely the dominant plurality. Given that Ibanez still makes most of their 7s in 25.5" scale, they clearly see that there's a market for it.


----------



## kamello

holy shit I didn't saw the back before <3


----------



## Vyn

Xaios said:


> Here's the thing: if all these people aren't detuning their guitars to drop-Q and don't want strings that feel like piano wire under the fingers, that's their prerogative. I'd hazard a guess that, even if that's not the majority of 7 string players, it's still likely the dominant plurality. Given that Ibanez still makes most of their 7s in 25.5" scale, they clearly see that there's a market for it.



As someone who lives in B standard and Drop A, 25.5 is more than fine


----------



## A-Branger

MaxOfMetal said:


> -The Affirma is back, albeit in Premium dress.


for the bass world in Ibanez, Premium is as best as its gonna get. Technicaly they have a Prestige line, but its been the Wenge/wenge/wenge and wenge SR since like 10 years ago. Premium basses is their "top of the line". and for their price and quality I wouldnt want a Prestige one at all. Every premum I have tried its been amazing. And at a price that reach a limit too. Basses are more expensive than their guitars, their prestige bass price is bit too much for me

As an owner of an EDA905 (same-ish shape, configuration). Love those affirmas... BUT... that fretboard end cutout uhg... might look pretty, but that seem soo uncomfortable for slapping (as I like to hit the edge of the fretboard with my thumb). Also 48mm spacing nut its a nope for me... it doesnt say bridge spacing but giving the wide but Im guessing it would be 19mm like the BTBs, which is another nope. Also love they improved the electronic controls for the mag/piezzo combo compared to my EDA.

also that neck heel oooooohhhhhhhh <3 it surprise me Ibanez making such sexy smooth neck heel like that



MaxOfMetal said:


> -A Premium JEM7V, didn't see that one coming


and with ebony and the right tremolo bridge (for what I read in here), so thats pretty awesome



MaxOfMetal said:


> -The Saber really is the red-headed step child. Ouch.



now thats the perfect example why I hate the color department of Ibanez. Such a beautiful color fade top/finish... bt then they decided to stain the back of the guitar in red... why? why red? why?.... if you dont want to use one of the colors of the top (or same finish), just let wood be wood and let it natural, but red?? uhg



Siggevaio said:


> Also the Polyphia guys... Such ugly guitars



I actualyl dig them lots. The black one with gold looks much better in "real" photos, looks awesome in his instagram. personally I would rather with normal maple instead, I think they woudl look much better, but the AZ its all about the roasted maple. They still look awesome too



kamello said:


>



now SEE how much much MUCH better it looks when the burst is from the guitar edges and not from the flat top.... 1028309182931X times better!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> now thats the perfect example why I hate the color department of Ibanez. Such a beautiful color fade top/finish... bt then they decided to stain the back of the guitar in red... why? why red? why?.... if you dont want to use one of the colors of the top (or same finish), just let wood be wood and let it natural, but red?? uhg



It's a figure of speech. Google it.


----------



## I play music

Honestly I would have expected some new multiscale SR bass 
The Affirma bass looks interesting though, same concept as the NS Design WAV with the single pickup + piezo. Wouldn't mind trying that out.


----------



## MickD7

diagrammatiks said:


> Meeeeh
> 
> Are the polyphia guys trolling. They can’t be serious with those guitars.



Go see them live and you will have your questions answered on that one bud. 

Kind of bummed we didn’t get a proper full size Gilbert model, the RG 7 string choices this year are very cool though. One day we will see some more S series hopefully even a return of he 8 string.. one can dream


----------



## A-Branger

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's a figure of speech. Google it.


lol I get it now

but yeah I was taking advantage of your mention of it to rant about they awfull choice of stain color for it


----------



## MaxOfMetal

A-Branger said:


> lol I get it now
> 
> but yeah I was taking advantage of your mention of it to rant about they awfull choice of stain color for it



Where are you seeing a red Saber?

You're complaining about the back of the guitar?


----------



## ixlramp

Good to see the Affirma, however in some places i'm seeing 'limited for 2019' which is disappointing.
I love what Ibanez do but almost all the most interesting and unusual guitars and basses are discontinued after 1 or 2 years:
Xiphos, Falchion, Halberd, Affirma, EDA/EDB/EDC, Grooveline etc.
Some of those Axions look lovely, futuristic (one looks terrible).


----------



## gunshow86de

Ammusa said:


> "Nyatoh body"????



I'm Nya-ot gonna be buying that crap.


----------



## soldierkahn

https://www.guitar.co.uk/catalog/pr...xl-dtb-prestige-7-string-dark-tide-blue-2019/

SOLD!!!!! I was gonna get the Axe Palace RGDRUC7, but not now.... the XL is back


----------



## A-Branger

MaxOfMetal said:


> Where are you seeing a red Saber?
> 
> You're complaining about the back of the guitar?



yeah Im complaining about the red stain of the back of the body. A common thing for Ibanez to do. Still dont get why the red stain and dont jsut leave the body in natural instead


Also



I really dont mind that purple nebula burst thing. Maybe with black pickup covers would look better. And also the reason why I dont like black matte gutiars no matter how awesome they look in catalogs. That guitar would be a few days old with a few people touching it for demos, yet it already have couple of buff shinny spots on it

Love these guys videos. They should have way more followers


----------



## cip 123

https://www.dawsons.co.uk/ibanez-rgew521mzw-electric-guitar-natural-flat



Dawsons in the UK have several models up on their youtube so you can assume these are the real (UK) prices and that you won't have to wait till spring time to finally play one. 

Ibanez may be on the ball getting these out there quick.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

well the japanese market got hosed so far. No update to the website yet and GC is still only RG550. Meh, i should learn not to get my hopes up.


----------



## Jeff

Wow, really psyched to see a bunch of guitars made out of Indonesian furniture wood. :\


----------



## eightsixboy

Nothing really exciting except Marco finally gets a MIJ sig and that green seven string with SS frets. Was hoping for more Prestige AZs instead of tons more premiums.


----------



## Mathemagician

And from my lofty perch I heard the shredding of a thousand notes and looked down at the shredders and whispered “Wizard 3”.


----------



## Leviathus

Gotta say the new premium AZ sigs are horrendous.


----------



## Damagedjustice

I am a little humble and a 550dx - a japanese shark-toothed rg again after a long time ... fixed with it


----------



## LordHar

http://www.ibanezrules.com/images/new_factory/2019/pages/19_Ibz_New_WinterProduct_Book_med.pdf


----------



## MatiasTolkki

LordHar said:


> http://www.ibanezrules.com/images/new_factory/2019/pages/19_Ibz_New_WinterProduct_Book_med.pdf



Man those genesis are so goddamn nice. I'm glad Ibanez is keeping the line in this sort of limited way. 

I hate 7 string guitars but that yellow 752


----------



## LordHar

I really like some of the (sometimes surprising) new models, but the simple lack of color choices keeps being annoying.


----------



## Hollowway

I just saw the Jem with the ebony FB. Now that’s a cool looking guitar! I could never get behind the white, gold, and brown. But black? Si, senor!!


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Hollowway said:


> I just saw the Jem with the ebony FB. Now that’s a cool looking guitar! I could never get behind the white, gold, and brown. But black? Si, senor!!



I think they are trying to undercut the used market, since the older JEMs had Ebony boards and the used prices, especially here in Japan, have shot up in price the last couple years. I think they've gone up from around 160,000 yen to over 200,000 in the last 5 years or something crazy like that.


----------



## BlueTrident

Am I the only one gassed for the Luke Hoskins signature model?


----------



## Edika

Some really nice offerings from Ibanez. That green reverse headstock prestige is yummylicious! I'm guessing the Axion line is a rebrand of the higher specced Iron Label models.


----------



## Sparkplug

That Iron Label XL makes me very happy. Hopefully it's gonna be available in europe and is not one of those indomade-lemons others posted here over the past years.


----------



## possumkiller

So that fan fret rgd axiom 7...

Is that bursted edge a chameleon paint or just pink on the bottom edge and blue on top?


----------



## couverdure

Am I the only one here who likes the new signature AZs? I was hyped when I saw pics of the CHON and Polyphia dudes playing AZs that weren't the ones that were already available. Maybe it's because not a lot of people here listen to them.

This could also mean a potential non-Premium/Prestige AZ line in the near future since they're quite priced high right now due to their specs.

Also Mario's production sig is an improvement over the prototype he had last year, though I wish it was still HH.










I'd also like it if Tim's sig was still based on the shell pink AZ he used here, but his Gibson-inspired sig looks great too.


----------



## TiffuZeless

Is it me, or is Ibanez overcharging for almost everything RG - RGD - RGA related on this catalogue, with the RGIXL7 being an exception?
I mean... Almost all of them are over $1k.
For example, the new flamed top 7 string RGD is nice, but will it be $1200 nice?
I really want it to be, deep in my heart, but honestly I don't think it'll be - kinda like what happened with the Schecter KM7 MKIII (at least the first batch).
Former owner of a 1077XL, will wait until the 2027XL enters the used market.


----------



## I play music

And a Jatoba fretboard actually can also look good, when combined with an orange finish (RG80E)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TiffuZeless said:


> Is it me, or is Ibanez overcharging for almost everything RG - RGD - RGA related on this catalogue, with the RGIXL7 being an exception?
> I mean... Almost all of them are over $1k.
> For example, the new flamed top 7 string RGD is nice, but will it be $1200 nice?
> I really want it to be, deep in my heart, but honestly I don't think it'll be - kinda like what happened with the Schecter KM7 MKIII (at least the first batch).
> Former owner of a 1077XL, will wait until the 2027XL enters the used market.



Looks like there's going to be a roughly 7% price increase at most, which isn't too surprising given the market right now. 

But keep in mind, the most dealers will be able to work down that price (GC/MF sales and Inspection Only tier from Ibanez Rules), they just won't be able to post it. 

Nothing seems outrageous price wise compared to the mainstream competition (Schecter and ESP/LTD). 

I'm a pessimist though, so I was actually surprised to see the MIJ to be rather line-priced with what's already available.


----------



## TiffuZeless

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm a pessimist though, so I was actually surprised to see the MIJ to be rather line-priced with what's already available.



Welp, must assume so did I.
Was waiting for the XL and 5000 series to be a "new uppercut", over $2k.
Glad it didn't.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TiffuZeless said:


> Welp, must assume so did I.
> Was waiting for the XL and 5000 series to be a "new uppercut", over $2k.
> Glad it didn't.



Yeah, the prices on the 5k series stuff is really surprising. That's a LOT of guitar for under $2k.

Not sure what the point of the Uppercut series is now. With no new/updated models in the series I have a feeling they're either going to wait til summer or next year to overhaul or just kill it outright.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

TiffuZeless said:


> Is it me, or is Ibanez overcharging for almost everything RG - RGD - RGA related on this catalogue, with the RGIXL7 being an exception?
> I mean... Almost all of them are over $1k.
> For example, the new flamed top 7 string RGD is nice, but will it be $1200 nice?
> I really want it to be, deep in my heart, but honestly I don't think it'll be - kinda like what happened with the Schecter KM7 MKIII (at least the first batch).
> Former owner of a 1077XL, will wait until the 2027XL enters the used market.



1099 (probably 125,000 yen) for the Genesis is PERFECT pricing for a low end MIJ guitar. the only company that will give you THAT kind of price over here is Fujigen themselves and they just make Strat copies.


----------



## TiffuZeless

MatiasTolkki said:


> 1099 (probably 125,000 yen) for the Genesis is PERFECT pricing for a low end MIJ guitar. the only company that will give you THAT kind of price over here is Fujigen themselves and they just make Strat copies.



That's indeed true.
The Genesis is an exception. The MII stuff is what I'm talking about.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

TiffuZeless said:


> That's indeed true.
> The Genesis is an exception. The MII stuff is what I'm talking about.



Yeah the MII is turning into their version of the LTD's from ESP. LTDs come with lots of fancy tops and stuff for much cheaper than their E-II or ESP brethren. Ibanez is using it as an excuse to keep costs low, but the last couple MIIs I've played were less than stellar so i'm concerned with the immense focus on that factory when they are releasing such affordable MIJ stuff like the Genesis. It makes buyers wonder "well, if you can do these for this cheap, why not other stuff too?" Sends a weird message.


----------



## MikeyLHolm

How would you compare the sound of a traditional basswood/alder+maple+regular frets to these new RG5120 AMD RGR5220?
Considering they have mahogany bodies with ash top, bound b.e maple and SS frets.

Mahogany should make it darker and SS frets on other hand are brighter than regular ones.


----------



## possumkiller

Yeah they are going to have to get the indo quality at a $1500 level before I consider paying that much. Even $1000. I'd buy the Genesis or a used prestige first. The iron label I owned briefly had nice fretwork but the overall fit and finish was on par with the standard Indo and GIO series. Slapping a bunch of fancy hardware and features on a turd only makes for a very expensive turd...


----------



## laxu

Are they discontinuing the "Bass workshop" range or just not adding anything to them?

Damn, still no multiscale BTB...


----------



## Santuzzo

that yellow RG7 does look VERY, VERY nice


----------



## Triple-J

Musicradar posted a preview with UK prices most of it's been seen here already but there's a FR model I haven't spotted elsewhere in the finish which seems to be the guitar trend of 2019.





https://www.musicradar.com/news/namm-2019-ibanez-unveils-over-40-new-electric-guitars


----------



## Carl Kolchak




----------



## Sogradde

Good: 
- 5000 series is pretty dope and one of them will definitely end up in my collection. Also amazing price point. Uppercut upcharge makes no sense now though.
- RG762 in yellow looks mighty cool.
- Return of the 2027XL
- Fishmans everywhere

Bad: 
- No new S models.
- No RGA prestige.
- No cool J.Customs (at least not in the EU). I want that green emerald RG and the pink RGA!

Ugly:
- All those wasted woods & finishes on overpriced indo guitars. 

I'm laughing and crying at the same time.


----------



## Jeff

So MIJ is pretty much priced at what I’d expect, whil MII gets more expensive AND uses garbage woods. Ugh. I guess I should tell everyone to get off my lawn, while I pine for the good old days.


----------



## couverdure

Quoting @Jeff's post from the RG2027XL thread:


> SS.org: “screw Indo guitars. MIJ only”
> Also SS.org: “Awesome MIJ. Too expensive though”


----------



## Jeff

couverdure said:


> Quoting @Jeff's post from the RG2027XL thread:



I definitely don’t think th MIJ stuff is too expensive. I just wish they weren’t cheaping out on their entry and midrange. Not everyone can afford a $1500+ guitar.


----------



## cardinal

Man I want one of those RG5328s. The pics on Ibanezrules looks good to me.


----------



## ExileMetal

It might be time to reconsider the Indo guitars. Rich from IbanezRules said he's seen a quality increase and is now stocking them to see how it goes. I personally love my RG7PCMLTD and reach for it just as often as my Prestiges.


----------



## cip 123

TiffuZeless said:


> Is it me, or is Ibanez overcharging for almost everything



Welcome to ibanez for the last 5 years.


----------



## Zado

Triple-J said:


> Musicradar posted a preview with UK prices most of it's been seen here already but there's a FR model I haven't spotted elsewhere in the finish which seems to be the guitar trend of 2019.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.musicradar.com/news/namm-2019-ibanez-unveils-over-40-new-electric-guitars


This really is the year of the black to white faded finish. And I still wonder why.


----------



## Sogradde

cip 123 said:


> Welcome to ibanez for the last 5 years.


That's ESP imho.
MIJ Ibbies are getting cheaper every year it feels. First the Genesis series, now the 5000 models, which seem to undercut the Uppercut (lmao) models. It's just the Premium /X Label stuff that is getting crazy.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> That's ESP imho.
> MIJ Ibbies are getting cheaper every year it feels. First the Genesis series, now the 5000 models, which seem to undercut the Uppercut (lmao) models. It's just the Premium /X Label stuff that is getting crazy.



To be fair to the Premium and other "between" series guitars, they've been upping the specs year over year.

They only came out in 2013 and in that time we've seen them progress from Standard series with EMGs and lower tier trems to the stainless steel frets, Gotoh hardware, boutique pickups and flourishes like Luminlay.

The only real issue is consistency of quality, which by many accounts is beginning to get better.

This is $1100:





Not even 10 years ago you had to pay $4k+ and wait two years to get those specs and you were still taking a gamble if something playable was going to show up, if at all.


----------



## I play music

Jeff said:


> So MIJ is pretty much priced at what I’d expect, whil MII gets more expensive AND uses garbage woods. Ugh. I guess I should tell everyone to get off my lawn, while I pine for the good old days.


I don't know why you would call the wood garbage... have you seen their wood storage or already tried said instruments?


----------



## MatiasTolkki

cip 123 said:


> Welcome to ibanez for the last 5 years.



Much longer than that, they have increased prices every year for the past 6 years or so.


----------



## possumkiller

ExileMetal said:


> It might be time to reconsider the Indo guitars. Rich from IbanezRules said he's seen a quality increase and is now stocking them to see how it goes. I personally love my RG7PCMLTD and reach for it just as often as my Prestiges.


Maybe. I got to take a quick look at a couple of recent premiums at a local shop. I didn't get to play anything but they didn't seem to have the glaring flaws of the iron labels I tried a couple of years ago. I want to get back and really try them out. I really hope the trend of using the same trem units as the Japanese guitars spreads through the entire premium x/labels.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

anyone read Rich's wood guide and wood changes thing? I wonder why mahogany was dropped, it wasnt on CITES last i saw.


----------



## I play music

ExileMetal said:


> It might be time to reconsider the Indo guitars. Rich from IbanezRules said he's seen a quality increase and is now stocking them to see how it goes. I personally love my RG7PCMLTD and reach for it just as often as my Prestiges.


That guitar was indeed quite cool. Too bad it was only a limited model...


----------



## Jeff

I play music said:


> I don't know why you would call the wood garbage... have you seen their wood storage or already tried said instruments?



Do you know what the wood they're using is usually used for? Indonesian furniture. They're cost-cutting as much as possible, instead of concentrating on quality.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MatiasTolkki said:


> anyone read Rich's wood guide and wood changes thing? I wonder why mahogany was dropped, it wasnt on CITES last i saw.



There have been species of mahogany on the CITES appendices since the 90's.

From the looks of it they're switching to either woods entirely grown in Asia or farmed. 

Probably trying to somewhat future-proof their supply chain, at least for the immediate future.



Jeff said:


> Do you know what the wood they're using is usually used for? Indonesian furniture. They're cost-cutting as much as possible, instead of concentrating on quality.



I don't know, my handrails on my stairs and pocket doors to my dining room say mahogany is great for furniture too.


----------



## cardinal

MatiasTolkki said:


> anyone read Rich's wood guide and wood changes thing? I wonder why mahogany was dropped, it wasnt on CITES last i saw.



Part of it probably is just local sourcing. I wonder if also they’re just using a more accurate name for the species they are using. I doubt what most manufacturers use is truly “mahogany.”


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Those RGEW's have cool roasted necks and boards. Love it


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Part of it probably is just local sourcing. I wonder if also they’re just using a more accurate name for the species they are using. I doubt what most manufacturers use is truly “mahogany.”



They're actually moving to Sapele which is a hell of a lot closer to what "real" mahogany is that the various unnamed stuff used today.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> Do you know what the wood they're using is usually used for? Indonesian furniture. They're cost-cutting as much as possible, instead of concentrating on quality.



What if I told you. It’s all just wood.


----------



## Carl Kolchak

Now if Ibanez would only consider making some acrylic-bodied guitars...


----------



## TheUnknownOne

Man, I want that S so bad !


----------



## gunshow86de

diagrammatiks said:


> What if I told you. It’s all just wood.



May I subscribe to your newsletter?


----------



## Jeff

diagrammatiks said:


> What if I told you. It’s all just wood.



Then I'd happily sell you guitars made out of cheap, mediocre wood.  The jotoba fretboards look awful. I don't see it getting better with cheaper woods being used for 2019.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Carl Kolchak said:


> Now if Ibanez would only consider making some acrylic-bodied guitars...


Luthite!!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Then I'd happily sell you guitars made out of cheap, mediocre wood.  The jotoba fretboards look awful. I don't see it getting better with cheaper woods being used for 2019.



Jotoba isn't really that cheap. More expensive than most non-figured maple, and close to the price of East Indian Rosewood before most stopped offering it. Sapele is also more expensive than most of the nato wood that was being used before.


----------



## Carl Kolchak

The906 said:


> Luthite!!


I'd want the weight of acrylic.


----------



## cardinal

Love that the 752MDY has an unbound fretboard. A quick mod with a black pickguard, and that thing will be what a lot of folks have dreamed about.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Jotoba isn't really that cheap. More expensive than most non-figured maple, and close to the price of East Indian Rosewood before most stopped offering it. Sapele is also more expensive than most of the nato wood that was being used before.



Well it looks like absolute cheap shit. They should have used Pau Ferro.


----------



## I play music

Jeff said:


> Do you know what the wood they're using is usually used for? Indonesian furniture. They're cost-cutting as much as possible, instead of concentrating on quality.


Good luck finding a wood species used in guitars that is not also used in furniture...
The "traditional tone woods" have all been selected because they were cheap. That doesn't mean the resulting instruments are not good. What's important is the craftsmanship


----------



## Obsidian Soul

Jeff said:


> Then I'd happily sell you guitars made out of cheap, mediocre wood.  The jotoba fretboards look awful. I don't see it getting better with cheaper woods being used for 2019.


Let's say the wood choice affects the tone straight out of the box.Once you add your compression,EQ,overdrive,noise gate,and etcetera,do you really think your "wood" is going to matter with all of that stuff running?I think we should play them first before we write them off as cheap furniture wood that's good for nothing.


----------



## guitar4tw

ExileMetal said:


> It might be time to reconsider the Indo guitars. Rich from IbanezRules said he's seen a quality increase and is now stocking them to see how it goes. I personally love my RG7PCMLTD and reach for it just as often as my Prestiges.



Awesome. If there's one guy I'd buy an indonesian made Ibanez from, it's Rich. Detailed pictures and an honest description of the guitar you're about to buy, and with the added setup tiers he provides it would probably end up being a really well playing instrument that could match more expensive guitars.

One of the reasons I haven't bought a non-MIJ Ibanez is that I refuse to buy them blind with the QC being more hit and miss, and there is no local store where I live that carry an inventory of them to try either. But if Rich/Ibanezrules starts selling them, I can see myself buying one this year. The guy really does amazing work.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Well it looks like absolute cheap shit. They should have used Pau Ferro.



So you don't like how it looks. Cool. 

Now stop spreading the "they're cheaping out" bullshit. 

The fact is that most of the more common woods aren't going to be a available in the near future, not for a significant upcharge (for the same stuff) and tons of red tape when exporting.


----------



## Randy

MaxOfMetal said:


> Sapele is also more expensive than most of the nato wood that was being used before.



It's a shame sapele even being mentioned in the same breath as nato or any of the other "wtf is that?" boat anchor woods that go in guitars that are so cheap that they're marketed as "solid wood" only. 

Not that there's anything wrong with obscure or inexpensive woods (especially since alder, poplar, basswood and some species of mahogany are among the cheapest, yet they are some of the best sounding and most revered guitars in existence) but sapele is a VERY unique sounding and visually striking piece of wood. It's not a 'poor man's alternative to mahogany', it's it's own thing. If the prices are even remotely close to the cheap end of the lumber spectrum, it's only by virtue of the fact everything else has been overharvested and they haven't gotten a chance to ruin that supply yet.


----------



## mlp187

I’m really butthurt about getting gig bags instead of hard cases.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mlp187 said:


> View attachment 66006
> I’m really butthurt about getting gig bags instead of hard cases.



Yeah. The dealer cost for the raw cases is low enough you'd think it would be a better selling point to just include them. Lame.


----------



## Sephiroth952

mlp187 said:


> View attachment 66006
> I’m really butthurt about getting gig bags instead of hard cases.


Has that not always been the case (hah) with the premium line?

Also that XL 7 is giving me major gas.


----------



## AdenM

The prestige RGs we got look awesome, I'm a bit sad we didn't get the Japanese mahogany-bodied/ebony-boarded prestiges just yet though.

Glad that Ibanez has found something people love in the AZ series, but it seems like a lot of the prestige line for other body shapes is being gutted, even looking at the Japanese models. Is the price point just not a big seller anymore?


----------



## cardinal

guitar4tw said:


> Awesome. If there's one guy I'd buy an indonesian made Ibanez from, it's Rich. Detailed pictures and an honest description of the guitar you're about to buy, and with the added setup tiers he provides it would probably end up being a really well playing instrument that could match more expensive guitars.
> 
> One of the reasons I haven't bought a non-MIJ Ibanez is that I refuse to buy them blind with the QC being more hit and miss, and there is no local store where I live that carry an inventory of them to try either. But if Rich/Ibanezrules starts selling them, I can see myself buying one this year. The guy really does amazing work.



Yeah, and Rich can do a fret level right there without having to drop ship it to someone else first. Seems like a great way to go with a MII Ibanez and not have to worry about it.


----------



## mlp187

@Sephiroth952:
Not entirely. My M80M, RG7PCMLTD, and
I can’t remember the other model number right now all came with a hard shell case.

ETA: Only the two named models came with a case. I forgot i bought the third case. It was an RG927FXQM, came with a gig bag. 

Also, the 2017 premium RGs came with hard cases.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mlp187 said:


> @Sephiroth952:
> Not entirely. My M80M, RG7PCMLTD, and
> I can’t remember the other model number right now all came with a hard shell case.



Didn't the M80M come with a soft shell?


----------



## mlp187

MaxOfMetal said:


> Didn't the M80M come with a soft shell?


It was a hard case w/ nylon exterior. Would that considered soft shell?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mlp187 said:


> It was a hard case w/ nylon exterior. Would that considered soft shell?



I honestly don't remember. I've only handled the case once. It just seemed like a bag around rigid foam. I wasn't sure there was a plastic backing.


----------



## possumkiller

cardinal said:


> Love that the 752MDY has an unbound fretboard. A quick mod with a black pickguard, and that thing will be what a lot of folks have dreamed about.


Yeap


----------



## mlp187

MaxOfMetal said:


> I honestly don't remember. I've only handled the case once. It just seemed like a bag around rigid foam. I wasn't sure there was a plastic backing.


So i just squeezed and tapped my case to determine the material, and it seems like there is plastic backing, but can’t tell for sure. Who doesn’t love a good mystery?


----------



## Vyn

That's a real shame, the premium gig bags were kinda cool.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> So you don't like how it looks. Cool.
> 
> Now stop spreading the "they're cheaping out" bullshit.
> 
> The fact is that most of the more common woods aren't going to be a available in the near future, not for a significant upcharge (for the same stuff) and tons of red tape when exporting.



You’re pretty rude and combative, for being a moderator. 
When they’re switching to cheap Indonesian woods that no one else uses, they’re cheaping out.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> You’re pretty rude and combative, for being a moderator.
> When they’re switching to cheap Indonesian woods that no one else uses, they’re cheaping out.



And you're pretty rude and argumentative for being a regular dude. 

I've already explained that 1) the woods they're switching to aren't objectively cheap compared to other industry standard options, 2) that there are good reasons to switch to more easily procured species. 

As for no one else using them, take a look around. Brands such as ESP/LTD, Jacksob/Charvel and SBMM are using the same woods. 

But it doesn't matter because you've already decided, based on nothing but your subjective dislike of how some of it looks, that they're "cheaping out". 

If they really wanted to make things cheaper, they could use all maple. That's pretty much the cheapest hardwood you're going to find that's still structurally sound. 

It's probably also worth mentioning that just about all the Indonesian, South Korean and Chinese manufacturers are using Asian sourced woods at this stage of the game. When you see "mahogany" on a spec sheet on a production guitar under a certain price you're getting any of a number of "trade woods" that they can legally call " mahogany". That's when you get into stuff like nato and a Asian mahogany that aren't even the same species as "genuine mahogany" but look pretty similar.


----------



## Soya

MatiasTolkki said:


> Much longer than that, they have increased prices every year for the past 6 years or so.



Does Japan not have inflation?


----------



## Obsidian Soul

That's right guys.The Panga Pangas,Nyatohs,Pau Ferros,and Bubinga are coming to destroy your tone.


----------



## PunkBillCarson

I, for one, am excited about these new woods being used to make guitars.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> And you're pretty rude and argumentative for being a regular dude.
> 
> I've already explained that 1) the woods they're switching to aren't objectively cheap compared to other industry standard options, 2) that there are good reasons to switch to more easily procured species.
> 
> As for no one else using them, take a look around. Brands such as ESP/LTD, Jacksob/Charvel and SBMM are using the same woods.
> 
> But it doesn't matter because you've already decided, based on nothing but your subjective dislike of how some of it looks, that they're "cheaping out".
> 
> If they really wanted to make things cheaper, they could use all maple. That's pretty much the cheapest hardwood you're going to find that's still structurally sound.
> 
> It's probably also worth mentioning that just about all the Indonesian, South Korean and Chinese manufacturers are using Asian sourced woods at this stage of the game. When you see "mahogany" on a spec sheet on a production guitar under a certain price you're getting any of a number of "trade woods" that they can legally call " mahogany". That's when you get into stuff like nato and a Asian mahogany that aren't even the same species as "genuine mahogany" but look pretty similar.



Really? Who else is using Nyatoh in a $700-$1000 guitar? A wood used by no one else. And yeah, in my opinion, having seen several examples, Jatoba looks cheap and awful as a fretboard. Using more maple would have been better.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Really? Who else is using Nyatoh in a $700-$1000 guitar? A wood used by no one else. And yeah, in my opinion, having seen several examples, Jatoba looks cheap and awful as a fretboard. Using more maple would have been better.



None that have it on their spec sheets.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> None that have it on their spec sheets.



Cool. Be happy with the cheap Ibanez guitars then.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Cool. Be happy with the cheap Ibanez guitars then.



I think you missed the point. 

Oh well. I look forward to having this same lovely exchange when the 2039 catalog comes out and you're pissed that the cheap Ibanez guitars built in the Congo are switching it up to use one of the few woods still not completely banned by CITES.


----------



## Jeff

Obsidian Soul said:


> That's right guys.The Panga Pangas,Nyatohs,Pau Ferros,and Bubinga are coming to destroy your tone.



Pau Ferro and bubinga have been used for awhile. Nyatoh is basically Nato, which has also been used for quite awhile. In cheap guitars.

EDIT

Nyatoh and nato aren’t the same, though they’re both cheaper wood alternatives to mahogany.


----------



## Kaura

Obsidian Soul said:


> That's right guys. The Panga Pangas,Nyatohs,Pau Ferros,and Bubinga are coming to destroy your tone.



Don't ever talk to me or my Pau Ferro fretboarded guitars again!

""


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think you missed the point.
> 
> Oh well. I look forward to having this same lovely exchange when the 2039 catalog comes out and you're pissed that the cheap Ibanez guitars built in the Congo are switching it up to use one of the few woods still not completely banned by CITES.



Nope. I got your point. I just don’t give a shit, since it doesn’t really affect me anyway. I’m not in the market for a cheap guitar.

I do think it’s interesting that you’re inferring that Ibanez is being more honest by calling it nyatoh now, when everyone else is still calling it mahogany.

EDIT

And actually, no; I hope by 2039 we’re exploring more alternative methods of construction than wood. Both Richlite and Blacktek look and feel far nicer than Jatoba as a fretboard.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Nope. I got your point. I just don’t give a shit, since it doesn’t really affect me anyway. I’m not in the market for a cheap guitar.



Then why complain so much?



> I do think it’s interesting that you’re inferring that Ibanez is being more honest by calling it nyatoh now, when everyone else is still calling it mahogany.



In my travels I've visited some of the large OEMs and they'll use whatever they have on hand. Like I said, the term "mahogany" just refers to a handful of woods from various genus and species that kinda have similar properties. The "real" stuff has been banned in one way, shape, or form since the 90's and early 00's, or is just too expensive for mass production and new and different species are cultivated to fill the orders.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

I’m liking the RGR5227MFX. Talk to me about these bare knuckles though? They any good? Similar to any DiMarzio set out there?

Also, for those that have played the Gibraltar bridge, what’s the height similar to? As flush as a lo-pro? Lower? Higher?


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Then why complain so much?
> In my travels I've visited some of the large OEMs and they'll use whatever they have on hand. Like I said, the term "mahogany" just refers to a handful of woods from various genus and species that kinda have similar properties. The "real" stuff has been banned in one way, shape, or form since the 90's and early 00's, or is just too expensive for mass production and new and different species are cultivated to fill the orders.



Oh sorry. I didn’t know my opinion wasn’t valid unless it was shared by you.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Oh sorry. I didn’t know my opinion wasn’t valid unless it was shared by you.



Take a chill pill dude. 

I've never said your opinion is wrong, I just don't know why you're making such a point about the woods of guitars you're not even interested in buying. You brought that up, not me. 

I'm just trying to discuss this stuff objectively. If you can't, don't.


----------



## Type_R3387

Just placed an order for the 2027XL. I was informed that these were scheduled to arrive in March, possibly a bit earlier. Now begins the long wait....Looking forward to throwing in a Lundgren M7 set when it arrives!


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Take a chill pill dude.
> 
> I've never said your opinion is wrong, I just don't know why you're making such a point about the woods of guitars you're not even interested in buying. You brought that up, not me.
> 
> I'm just trying to discuss this stuff objectively. If you can't, don't.



I just think it’s disappointing, when other companies are making guitars that look good, and don’t look cheap as hell. I used to love Ibanez (still love my old four).

And now you’re telling me when to post and when not to? I guess there’s a reason you have a rep on other forums.


----------



## StevenC

Jeff said:


> Pau Ferro and bubinga have been used for awhile. Nyatoh is basically Nato, which has also been used for quite awhile. In cheap guitars.
> 
> EDIT
> 
> Nyatoh and nato aren’t the same, though they’re both cheaper wood alternatives to mahogany.


So are all possible guitars made from nato cheao guitars, or only all the cheap guitars made from nato? Like if there was a Private Stock made of nato or a Ken Lawrence, would it be garbage or not?


----------



## Jeff

StevenC said:


> So are all possible guitars made from nato cheao guitars, or only all the cheap guitars made from nato? Like if there was a Private Stock made of nato or a Ken Lawrence, would it be garbage or not?



I don’t know. I’ll let you know when I play a Private Stock made of nato.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> I just think it’s disappointing, when other companies are making guitars that look good, and don’t look cheap as hell. I used to love Ibanez (still love my old four).
> 
> And now you’re telling me when to post and when not to? I guess there’s a reason you have a rep on other forums.



Again, calm down. Post whatever you want, wherever you want, whenever you want. You're welcome to reply or not. 

Jeez. Happy new year.


----------



## Sogradde

Jeff said:


> And now you’re telling me when to post and when not to? I guess there’s a reason you have a rep on other forums.


Dude are you drunk?


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Again, calm down. Post whatever you want, wherever you want, whenever you want. You're welcome to reply or not.
> 
> Jeez. Happy new year.



Cool thanks! 



Sogradde said:


> Dude are you drunk?



On life.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

TheShreddinHand said:


> I’m liking the RGR5227MFX. Talk to me about these bare knuckles though? They any good? Similar to any DiMarzio set out there?
> 
> Also, for those that have played the Gibraltar bridge, what’s the height similar to? As flush as a lo-pro? Lower? Higher?



I haven't played anything with those pickups yet. 

As for the bridge, it seems to be somewhat polarizing. Some love it and some hate it. I didn't think it was too bad. I'd rather have a Lo-Pro, but it's fine. If you anchor your hand on the top/back part of the bridge it can be a little sharp, but if you just rest your hand along the back or anchor below the bridge/pickups it's plenty out of the way.


----------



## Jeff

The Bareknuckles on the RGA Iron Label sounded good. Not sure they’re worth the premium over SD’s or Dimarzios.


----------



## Obsidian Soul

Sogradde said:


> Dude are you drunk?


It's okay.Jeff isn't mad at us;he's mad at the woods


----------



## Jeff

Obsidian Soul said:


> It's okay.Jeff isn't mad at us;he's mad at the woods



Mostly just Jatoba and nyatoh, to be fair. I’m more even keeled in terms of other woods.


----------



## A-Branger

like this forum is a niche for metal and ERG players. I wonder if there is a forum out there for jazz people and over there everyone is flipping over the new hollow bodies. Someone is getting mad they put the worn pickups, other is happy they finally put block inlays, a guy is exicetd about the AM Expressionist macassar ebony, while other is hatting the finish of it and the sea foam color


----------



## cardinal

I for one am am excited by the general direction of the ‘19 catalog. The 5000 series is neat and includes an 8 string. If Rich starts supplying the Indo stuff, that’ll be a nice way to get it without having to worry about QC. The new RGDs look cool to me. The return of the XL is boss. 

Just need Lo Pro 8...


----------



## gunshow86de

A-Branger said:


> like this forum is a niche for metal and ERG players. I wonder if there is a forum out there for jazz people and over there everyone is flipping over the new hollow bodies. Someone is getting mad they put the worn pickups, other is happy they finally put block inlays, a guy is exicetd about the AM Expressionist macassar ebony, while other is hatting the finish of it and the sea foam color


----------



## eightsixboy

Don't know why Ibanez keep sticking with that disgustingly thick white binding on the RGA's. 

https://www.ibanez.com/na/products/detail/rga61al_1p_01.html

Pick of the bunch is the MSM100 for me. 

https://www.ibanez.com/na/products/detail/msm100_00_01.html


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Don't know why Ibanez keep sticking with that disgustingly thick white binding on the RGA's.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/na/products/detail/rga61al_1p_01.html
> 
> Pick of the bunch is the MSM100 for me.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/na/products/detail/msm100_00_01.html



The binding is the least offensive part on that thing. 

It's great that Marco finally got a MIJ Sig. He's a great player and has been using Ibanez forever. I hope the green is as rich in real life.


----------



## AirForbes1

guitar4tw said:


> Awesome. If there's one guy I'd buy an indonesian made Ibanez from, it's Rich. Detailed pictures and an honest description of the guitar you're about to buy, and with the added setup tiers he provides it would probably end up being a really well playing instrument that could match more expensive guitars.
> 
> One of the reasons I haven't bought a non-MIJ Ibanez is that I refuse to buy them blind with the QC being more hit and miss, and there is no local store where I live that carry an inventory of them to try either. But if Rich/Ibanezrules starts selling them, I can see myself buying one this year. The guy really does amazing work.



For sure. The knock on the Indo guitars is the is the uneven quality. Some fine, some not so much. Rich will basically vet all the stock in addition to his set-up packages.


----------



## Hollowway

gunshow86de said:


>



 Totally!


----------



## Type_R3387

AirForbes1 said:


> For sure. The knock on the Indo guitars is the is the uneven quality. Some fine, some not so much. Rich will basically vet all the stock in addition to his set-up packages.


 Not to derail the thread....I just wanted to second what you stated. If anyone is pondering buying an Ibanez (Indo, Prestige, Sugi, whatever), Rich is the man to speak to. He went above and beyond the call of duty when I ordered my M8M recently. He knows everything Ibanez, is meticulous and will not sell you on anything you don’t need. I can not recommend him enough!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Type_R3387 said:


> Not to derail the thread....I just wanted to second what you stated. If anyone is pondering buying an Ibanez, Rich is the man to speak to. He went above and beyond the call of duty when I ordered my M8M recently. He knows everything Ibanez, is meticulous and will not sell you on anything you don’t need. I can not recommend him enough!





Rich is a fucking legend.


----------



## ThePIGI King

cardinal said:


> Just need Lo Pro 8...



This has been said for years, and people like Tony MacAlpine actually have a trem'd 8. The only reason I like 7s is due to trems. Schecter has(had?) a trem'd 8. Ibanez needs to catch up. I'd buy.

Even further dreaming - an HSH trem'd 9 string RG? Hell. Bring back MiJ 9s, but get rid of the BKPs so it can be under $3K. Ibanez needs to take back the ERG game.


----------



## cip 123

ThePIGI King said:


> This has been said for years, and people like Tony MacAlpine actually have a trem'd 8. The only reason I like 7s is due to trems. Schecter has(had?) a trem'd 8. Ibanez needs to catch up. I'd buy.
> 
> Even further dreaming - an HSH trem'd 9 string RG? Hell. Bring back MiJ 9s, but get rid of the BKPs so it can be under $3K. Ibanez needs to take back the ERG game.




Just remember who's gonna buy them.

8 string is already niche, 8 string trem even more so.

9 string even more so, 9 string trem HSH? Probably just you.


----------



## Hollowway

ThePIGI King said:


> This has been said for years, and people like Tony MacAlpine actually have a trem'd 8. The only reason I like 7s is due to trems. Schecter has(had?) a trem'd 8. Ibanez needs to catch up. I'd buy.
> 
> Even further dreaming - an HSH trem'd 9 string RG? Hell. Bring back MiJ 9s, but get rid of the BKPs so it can be under $3K. Ibanez needs to take back the ERG game.


I'm going to guess that the Venn for an 8 string player and for a trem lover has virtually no overlap. There MUST be a reason we don't see these things. It could be that trem players skew older (because they grew up when they were used more), and 8 string players skew younger. Older players turn their nose up at 8s, and younger players are scared off by Floyds. Maybe that's it? I mean, personally I'm in the same camp as you. I only buy 7 string Ibby trems because an 8 doesn't exist with one. And I ain't playing that Schecter abomination. I don't have nearly enough chest hair or gold chains to play anything as gaudy as that blinged out abalone atrocity.


----------



## Hollowway

cip 123 said:


> Just remember who's gonna buy them.
> 
> 8 string is already niche, 8 string trem even more so.
> 
> 9 string even more so, 9 string trem HSH? Probably just you.



And me! Don't forget me. I also make poor life decisions for super niche instruments!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

When it comes to the really niche stuff it seems like they need a popular artist to push through the development and bring in new players. 

Some of the first prototypes of what would become the RG2228 had trems. They just never caught on.


----------



## cip 123

Hollowway said:


> And I ain't playing that Schecter abomination. I don't have nearly enough chest hair or gold chains to play anything as gaudy as that blinged out abalone atrocity.



2019 Schecter catalog still ain't fully out, who knows they might just pop out with the Banshee elite 8FR 

(Except they seem to be going all 80's with the super shredder lines nowadays)


----------



## cip 123

MaxOfMetal said:


> When it comes to the really niche stuff it seems like they need a popular artist to push through the development and bring in new players.
> 
> Some of the first prototypes of what would become the RG2228 had trems. They just never caught on.


Well Tosin was arguably, between Meshuggah, their biggest 8 artist. So I don't see it happening anytime soon, unless djent develops a viral sub-genre featuring Steve Vai levels of trem abuse.


----------



## Seabeast2000

cip 123 said:


> Well Tosin was arguably, between Meshuggah, their biggest 8 artist. So I don't see it happening anytime soon, unless djent develops a viral sub-genre featuring Steve Vai levels of trem abuse.



If we can get Jeff Beck to start playing 2PT trem'd 8s, we'll have it made.


----------



## cip 123

The906 said:


> If we can get Jeff Beck to start playing 2PT trem'd 8s, we'll have it made.


Now theres the gap in the market, someone get on this!


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Soya said:


> Does Japan not have inflation?



not really, but every year has had some pretty sharp increases, especially on signature models. i remember seeing some guitars jump like 20-30k yen in one year.


----------



## eightsixboy

MaxOfMetal said:


> The binding is the least offensive part on that thing.
> 
> It's great that Marco finally got a MIJ Sig. He's a great player and has been using Ibanez forever. I hope the green is as rich in real life.



Being a 4mm top you'd hope it has a ton of depth and a nice rich color.

I hope its not silly expensive, anymore then the Tom Quayle or Martin Miller sig and I'm out, $3999 AUD retail and your heading into Suhr Territory.


----------



## trem licking

I can't believe no one has even attempted a trem'd 8 just based on the fact that floyd has them available! just try it for a year... the hellraiser c8 fr has been around for quite some time and is still on sale through schecter's site and some online retailers, so it has got to be selling somewhat. I constantly praise my hellraiser, it's a great guitar! it also works/stays more in tune more than any of my other guitars. I'd like just 1 more 8 string with a floyd, for variety. 8's are my home base nowadays and I pretty much require a floyd variant trem... hell, I'd even buy another schecter if they came out with another model.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

I do want this. I've been meaning to get a short scale 4 string for a while. And I'm liking this more than the Talman.


Also I've noticed on the AU site that they've brought back the AE255BT acoustic, which wasn't on last year. Interesting...


----------



## Ibanez Rules

MaxOfMetal said:


> Rich is a fucking legend.


That's what this nurse keeps telling me!

The real meat of the news are the material changes coming, cases went to soft cases now to gigs, mahogany [which has been a substrain of something else for many years anyway] to whatever the plug in choice, and of course the pending price increases on the existing models coming 2/1, and there has not been a price increase for a long time in the US, it is overdue and is not excessive. They've been eating alot of permitting costs and this will put them back on the profitable side of the equation.

Lots of discussion on woods here, and not to be the lone tree hugger, but the industry has got to move to sustainable logging and forestry or they won't be building guitars by 2039. We all know the serious "tone" woods are all gone or so expensive they're the playground of the elite, what is left is becoming more difficult to obtain and more expensive [rosewood] and costs alot just to be able to import [and I don't believe they're going to make any rule changes when they vote in March, the word is everybody has been smiling and agreeable in all the meetings, but when they take the vote, the countries that asked for the protection of their trees will win in the end]. Taylor locked up the ebony trade which is a good thing as that took away the stigma of staining it because almost all of it is stained now. The only thing that bugs me is I had to pay $400 more on my prop to get it and this year they're going to give it away for the @ $133 price increases coming.

And as for woods, where's the argument that only the pickups make any difference in tone, woods mean nothing? I am kidding of course, but those guys are good for a laugh!

As for handling some Indo now, Premiums - it seems like I get 1 in 5 that is passable but when I have done special orders from the regular line [JIVA's, etc] I've found the quality to definitely be better that it used to be. Not that it doesn't take 5 hours to turn a JIVA into a sweet instrument but they pass inspection where the Premiums won't [and still take 5 hours] When I was looking thru the catalog my rep was trying to push me into the new Axions of course and considering I always look at them and ask "why can't they make cool stuff like this in Japan!?" so to even my surprise I ordered and will see where the road goes. I know they sell, Premiums sold but were just too much trouble getting guitars to pass inspection, they just wasted too much time.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Bloody_Inferno said:


> I do want this. I've been meaning to get a short scale 4 string for a while. And I'm liking this more than the Talman.
> 
> 
> Also I've noticed on the AU site that they've brought back the AE255BT acoustic, which wasn't on last year. Interesting...



I know next to zero about basses, what's so good about having a shorter scale on them?


----------



## Jeff

Bloody_Inferno said:


> I do want this. I've been meaning to get a short scale 4 string for a while. And I'm liking this more than the Talman.
> 
> 
> Also I've noticed on the AU site that they've brought back the AE255BT acoustic, which wasn't on last year. Interesting...



That is pretty tasty.


----------



## Jonathan20022

The cheapo tonewood snobbery is kind of annoying to read, the logic falls short because in an alternate reality where mahogany, ebony, and quilted maple are not in popular demand. Purists would scoff at the move away from several decades of the same wood combos being used over and over. Mother nature doesn't dictate that Koa/Cocobolo/Rosewood's price, it's the demand and use in the industries that use them.

If that shit isn't going to move and warp on me, and it sounds good then use it why should I care? Half of these new guitars are painted with a solid color anyways so how "pretty" they are is kind pointless discussion to have.

Even when you can see them, Jatoba is quite literally 99% there I don't see what you're talking about Jatoba being and ugly wood 

First one is Jatoba/2nd is Roasted Maple from last year


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Jonathan20022 said:


> The cheapo tonewood snobbery is kind of annoying to read, the logic falls short because in an alternate reality where mahogany, ebony, and quilted maple are not in popular demand. Purists would scoff at the move away from several decades of the same wood combos being used over and over. Mother nature doesn't dictate that Koa/Cocobolo/Rosewood's price, it's the demand and use in the industries that use them.
> 
> If that shit isn't going to move and warp on me, and it sounds good then use it why should I care? Half of these new guitars are painted with a solid color anyways so how "pretty" they are is kind pointless discussion to have.
> 
> Even when you can see them, Jatoba is quite literally 99% there I don't see what you're talking about Jatoba being and ugly wood
> 
> First one is Jatoba/2nd is Roasted Maple from last year




Woooo Jatoba is pretty. gimme more of that


----------



## TGN

Hollowway said:


> I'm going to guess that the Venn for an 8 string player and for a trem lover has virtually no overlap.



Matthias Eklundh comes to mind. He tends to go for the trem from time to time


----------



## Sogradde

Ibanez Rules said:


> That's what this nurse keeps telling me![...]


Hey Rich, cool to have you chime in!

I'd like to know one thing though: Who is supposed to actually filter out the lemons? Factory side QC appears to be very limited to "does it work or not?" as it seems. I've seen you rant about how you had to send back loads of maple neck Prestiges due to them being warped and having bad fretwork IIRC, so is it the distributor then or the retailer (what about limited runs though)? I can't remember if I've ever held an indo Ibanez in my hands that was actually worth the price, yet I always read about those mystical "on par with my Prestige" speciemen that seem to only appear in the US. Are the german distributors/retailers so much more lazy, are they ignorant or do they have no say in this?


----------



## possumkiller

Shamray made an 8 out of jatoba and ash or may have been all jatoba back in 07-08ish. I just remember them saying it was heavy as fuck because of how dense and hard the jatoba is. It's been on their order form for years.


----------



## LordHar

https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/ae315fmh_1x_02.html

This is interesting. The fretboard is 'cultured maple' and looks pretty dark. By cultured they mean painted maybe? Or some sort of chemical treatment?


----------



## gunch

Nice to hear from you, Rich!


----------



## guitar4tw

LordHar said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/ae315fmh_1x_02.html
> 
> This is interesting. The fretboard is 'cultured maple' and looks pretty dark. By cultured they mean painted maybe? Or some sort of chemical treatment?


No, it means that it has been exposed to the complete works of Bach, Beethoven and Mahler. 

In all seriousness though, I think it has to do with it being heat treated, which Ibanez seems to do a lot of. But judging by the color there is probably some staining involved, as well.


----------



## Kaura

LordHar said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/ae315fmh_1x_02.html
> 
> This is interesting. The fretboard is 'cultured maple' and looks pretty dark. By cultured they mean painted maybe? Or some sort of chemical treatment?



Google translate says "cultured" can mean something that has "gone sour". Or the same as (I don't know what it's called in English) how wood used for housebuilding gets treated so it withstands weather better.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

LordHar said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/ae315fmh_1x_02.html
> 
> This is interesting. The fretboard is 'cultured maple' and looks pretty dark. By cultured they mean painted maybe? Or some sort of chemical treatment?


When You google it, google shows the link to the non-existing Ibanez site. The description related to the link is: "thermo aged", to it is basically the maple that went through some baking or pressure baking process.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

I hate the brown color of the fretboards. I would like to see much more maple or slightly aged (vintage tint) maple fretboard equipped guitars. Why Ibanez, why?


----------



## couverdure

Wolfhorsky said:


> I hate the brown color of the fretboards. I would like to see much more maple or slightly aged (vintage tint) maple fretboard equipped guitars. Why Ibanez, why?


Because boutique guitar companies, namely Suhr and Music Man, are putting out guitars with baked maple fretboards as a prestige (no pun intended) spec, so Ibanez is following suit.


----------



## I play music

Type_R3387 said:


> Not to derail the thread....I just wanted to second what you stated. If anyone is pondering buying an Ibanez (Indo, Prestige, Sugi, whatever), Rich is the man to speak to. He went above and beyond the call of duty when I ordered my M8M recently. He knows everything Ibanez, is meticulous and will not sell you on anything you don’t need. I can not recommend him enough!


Can the M8M still be ordered? I thought it disappeared from the Ibanez website and stores some time after the introduction of the M80M...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I play music said:


> Can the M8M still be ordered? I thought it disappeared from the Ibanez website and stores some time after the introduction of the M80M...



It's still listed as active on the Ibanez site. A number of retailers have it available for order, not in stock, but still available to be ordered.


----------



## I play music

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's still listed as active on the Ibanez site. A number of retailers have it available for order, not in stock, but still available to be ordered.


https://www.ibanez.com/eu/artists/detail/79.html
It says "past model (no longer available)" down there


----------



## Jeff

Jonathan20022 said:


> The cheapo tonewood snobbery is kind of annoying to read, the logic falls short because in an alternate reality where mahogany, ebony, and quilted maple are not in popular demand. Purists would scoff at the move away from several decades of the same wood combos being used over and over. Mother nature doesn't dictate that Koa/Cocobolo/Rosewood's price, it's the demand and use in the industries that use them.
> 
> If that shit isn't going to move and warp on me, and it sounds good then use it why should I care? Half of these new guitars are painted with a solid color anyways so how "pretty" they are is kind pointless discussion to have.
> 
> Even when you can see them, Jatoba is quite literally 99% there I don't see what you're talking about Jatoba being and ugly wood
> 
> First one is Jatoba/2nd is Roasted Maple from last year



I’ve photographed several of the Ibanez guitars with Jatoba, and it looks like cheap wood. IMHO. YMMV. The new body woods may end up sounding fine, I guess we’ll find out.

Sorry if that’s annoying for you to read.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I play music said:


> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/artists/detail/79.html
> It says "past model (no longer available)" down there



Huh. Didn't notice that. Maybe Rich will chime in.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Jeff said:


> I’ve photographed several of the Ibanez guitars with Jatoba, and it looks like cheap wood. IMHO. YMMV. The new body woods may end up sounding fine, I guess we’ll find out.
> 
> Sorry if that’s annoying for you to read.



It might feel cheap but we may all be surprised and these new "tone" woods might not be half bad. I'll wait and see for myself, but I am quite happy that Ibanez is using something different to give us all a taste of different woods. Sure they might be cheap shit from the woods in Indonesia, but who knows? We may start swearing by these woods in a year.


----------



## jl-austin

As far as Jatoba is concerned, I actually like it. Especially on the lower priced guitars, I would much rather prefer Jatoba over cheap rosewood. I never liked the cheap, dark, dry rosewood used on inexpensive guitars. I have Jatoba on 2 guitars now, no issue. 

It is a little more red than I prefer (especially on my black RGRT421), but the latest trend is roasted maple, and Jatoba doesn't really look much different than that.

As far as sound is concerned, I have an '99 RG7621 and an '18 RG7421 (Jatoba fretboard), and to be honest, I like the sound of the RG7421 better. 

I have always thought that musicians are stuck in a rut. I always thought, "how are we going to find the next thing" if we all use same woods used for ages?


----------



## Xaios

Jeff said:


> it looks like cheap wood.


You keep saying this, but at the end of the day the quality of how a wood "looks" is extremely subjective and ultimately defined by the biases of the observer. Given that you haven't provided any clearly defined metric that you're comparing it to, how exactly does it look "cheap" to you? What are the qualities that it possesses or lacks appearance-wise that make it look "cheap"? Also, more specifically, why should I believe that, when you say "cheap," you don't just mean that it doesn't conform to your personal aesthetic preferences? Because, honestly, I kinda doubt you're exactly an authority on what visual qualities a piece of wood must possess in order to be considered desirable, at least no more so than myself or any number of other posters here.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

MaxOfMetal said:


> I haven't played anything with those pickups yet.
> 
> As for the bridge, it seems to be somewhat polarizing. Some love it and some hate it. I didn't think it was too bad. I'd rather have a Lo-Pro, but it's fine. If you anchor your hand on the top/back part of the bridge it can be a little sharp, but if you just rest your hand along the back or anchor below the bridge/pickups it's plenty out of the way.



Thanks. I also would have preferred a lo-pro. May have been an insta-buy for me with one. I keep mulling it over.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> I’ve photographed several of the Ibanez guitars with Jatoba, and it looks like cheap wood. IMHO. YMMV. The new body woods may end up sounding fine, I guess we’ll find out.
> 
> Sorry if that’s annoying for you to read.



not annoying. just flabbergastingly nonsensical.

it's fucking. it grows on trees. what then hell does cheap wood look like.

wood is expensive because it's rare or it's been overharvested. not because someone shit pure cobalt in the cracks.


----------



## cardinal

All chime in with my two cents:

I’ve had way too many guitars and couldn’t tell you what one species of wood might sound like compared to another. 

What seems more important is the builder knowing what he’s working with and selecting the right piece. 

Whatever material these production factories are using, the pieces are random, and it’s just going to be a roll of the dice about how resonant or whatever each guitar will end up. 

So I wouldn’t worry about these changes.


----------



## Jeff

Xaios said:


> You keep saying this, but at the end of the day the quality of how a wood "looks" is extremely subjective and ultimately defined by the biases of the observer. Given that you haven't provided any clearly defined metric that you're comparing it to, how exactly does it look "cheap" to you? What are the qualities that it possesses or lacks appearance-wise that make it look "cheap"? Also, more specifically, why should I believe that, when you say "cheap," you don't just mean that it doesn't conform to your personal aesthetic preferences? Because, honestly, I kinda doubt you're exactly an authority on what visual qualities a piece of wood must possess in order to be considered desirable, at least no more so than myself or any number of other posters here.



How is anyone a "visual authority" on wood? It's all subjective, man. An opinion. I've seen a lot of Ibanez guitar with Jatoba fretboards. *To me*, it doesn't look good. It looks like really bad, dried out Rosewood. Pau ferro, like that used on LTD's, looks nicer. I don't give a shit what you do or don't believe.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Wow, I don't check this thread for a day an it absolutely explodes.



soldierkahn said:


> SOLD!!!!! I was gonna get the Axe Palace RGDRUC7, but not now.... the XL is back



I was wondering when you'd pop in about that XL 



cip 123 said:


> Dawsons in the UK have several models up on their youtube so you can assume these are the real (UK) prices and that you won't have to wait till spring time to finally play one.
> 
> Ibanez may be on the ball getting these out there quick.




That looks hot. If that thing was MiJ or maybe even a Premium I'd be all over it.


BlueTrident said:


> Am I the only one gassed for the Luke Hoskins signature model?



I was really hoping it'd be an RGA, not sure if I'm still into it if it's not.



MaxOfMetal said:


> Not sure what the point of the Uppercut series is now. With no new/updated models in the series I have a feeling they're either going to wait til summer or next year to overhaul or just kill it outright.



I thought I read somewhere that they were discontinuing the Uppercuts? In any case yeah, I totally agree...seems redundant. 



cardinal said:


> Love that the 752MDY has an unbound fretboard. A quick mod with a black pickguard, and that thing will be what a lot of folks have dreamed about.



Yeah I don't know why unbound fretboards aren't more popular; binding feels cheap to me imo- unless it's very tastily done. Stuff like ivoroid or wood binding looks fantastic but the cheap white or black stuff you see most of the time bums me out.



mlp187 said:


> I’m really butthurt about getting gig bags instead of hard cases.



Yeah that's kind of bogus; especially with the prices on some of these guitars. Real shame; I wish they used the soft-shell case that the Premiums got in the EU market. I'd take that thing over most actual hard cases. 



Ibanez Rules said:


> considering I always look at them and ask "why can't they make cool stuff like this in Japan!?"



Rich out there asking the real questions. 



Jonathan20022 said:


> Even when you can see them, Jatoba is quite literally 99% there I don't see what you're talking about Jatoba being and ugly wood
> 
> First one is Jatoba/2nd is Roasted Maple from last year





Spoiler



They both look terrible.


----------



## Albake21

The more and more I look at it, I may give the RGD71ALMS a try. I kinda like the look of it too. Alright Ibanez, I'll give your MII one more shot, but 3 strikes and your out.


----------



## Jeff

I wonder if the SRC6 is still around. Love mine, and I don’t think it gets the recognition it deserves.


----------



## Rawkmann

Is Ibanez just phasing out the S series? Sure there's a couple new models but the overall representation is pretty sad. Overall not a fan of any of these new models really, but everyone has different tastes. I do miss the direction Ibanez was going circa 2008-2010, and the prices have gotten so high it's hard to call Ibanez a good value anymore.


----------



## possumkiller

They just need to invest in richlite across the board. It can be black or brown or whatever color.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Rawkmann said:


> Is Ibanez just phasing out the S series? Sure there's a couple new models but the overall representation is pretty sad. Overall not a fan of any of these new models really, but everyone has different tastes. I do miss the direction Ibanez was going circa 2008-2010, and the prices have gotten so high it's hard to call Ibanez a good value anymore.



Yeah I don't know why the S series gets no respect. It's by far their best shape imo. 
If I had to guess it's price. It seems like throughout their entire history you can have an RG and an S that are identical in every way, but the RG will be noticeably cheaper. I can only assume that they're more expensive to produce, so if they priced them similarly, they'd take a hit. Sucks though. 

I think they'll be in a good place price-wise once they get their MiI stuff figured out. The Premiums look like they're selling at around where the Prestiges were when they won Ibanez the value crown, so if they get consistent they'll be sitting real pretty. Sounds like they're making progress on that front too, which is good to hear. I love Ibanez but buying new stuff from them always makes me nervous these days.


----------



## Jeff

Rawkmann said:


> Is Ibanez just phasing out the S series? Sure there's a couple new models but the overall representation is pretty sad. Overall not a fan of any of these new models really, but everyone has different tastes. I do miss the direction Ibanez was going circa 2008-2010, and the prices have gotten so high it's hard to call Ibanez a good value anymore.



I hope not, but I definitely lost interest in the S series when they went 24 fret. I know it was a popular request, but to me they were never supposed to be an RG with a different body. They were their own thing.


----------



## possumkiller

Jeff said:


> I hope not, but I definitely lost interest in the S series when they went 24 fret. I know it was a popular request, but to me they were never supposed to be an RG with a different body. They were their own thing.


Yeap


----------



## Rawkmann

Might be an unpopular opinion but I wished Ibanez just would have revamped the S line instead of introducing the AZ series. Especially if they brought back the old SV line with the more vintage styled necks and hardware.


----------



## Seabeast2000

The My Little Pony sig is OK with me, really. Its not boring black or grey. I'd probably swap those pup covers though.


----------



## Siggevaio

TheUnknownOne said:


> Man, I want that S so bad !


 Alright, so I know pretty much NOTHING about finishes, but is the finish on the RG5121 the kind that gets glossy after a while? Typically where you've rested your arm on the body etc.


----------



## Zado

https://www.instagram.com/p/BsIEta2H5rp/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1ckve1xyazziz

Mmmuuuuuuuhhhhh


----------



## Azathoth43

Well, looks like I have two new guitars to buy this year. Anyone know when the 2019's will become available?


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

RG2027XL preordered. 

Can we stop fighting about woods? We aren't Lumberjacks.


----------



## possumkiller

Zado said:


> https://www.instagram.com/p/BsIEta2H5rp/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1ckve1xyazziz
> 
> Mmmuuuuuuuhhhhh


Holy shit! 


That is fugly as hell like all the other new AZ models.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

The906 said:


> The My Little Pony sig is OK with me, really. Its not boring black or grey. I'd probably swap those pup covers though.
> 
> View attachment 66048




I was down to get the 7 until I saw it's price. For a few hundred more, I can get a Prestige 7. Specifically, that yellow one


----------



## Kaura

possumkiller said:


> Holy shit!
> 
> 
> That is fugly as hell like all the other new AZ models.



I hear you! I'm usually all for black & gold but somehow that model just reminds me of these cheap-ass Wilkinson guitars they used to sell in department stores. 

Also, wtf is that bridge pickup? Not quite a humbucker-size, not quite a single-coil. P90?


----------



## Ibanez Rules

Sogradde said:


> Hey Rich, cool to have you chime in!
> 
> I'd like to know one thing though: Who is supposed to actually filter out the lemons? Factory side QC appears to be very limited to "does it work or not?" as it seems. I've seen you rant about how you had to send back loads of maple neck Prestiges due to them being warped and having bad fretwork IIRC, so is it the distributor then or the retailer (what about limited runs though)? I can't remember if I've ever held an indo Ibanez in my hands that was actually worth the price, yet I always read about those mystical "on par with my Prestige" speciemen that seem to only appear in the US. Are the german distributors/retailers so much more lazy, are they ignorant or do they have no say in this?



At the factory level or at the distributor level? IMO from what I've seen the factory will pretty much pass thru anything that is a completed guitar. It doesn't matter what is screwed up with it, that's for the distributor to catch. They're in the business of filling an order and on a tight schedule, overloaded with more work than they can handle, and are cutting back on what takes hand work to try and increase output since they cannot expand the factory. IMO the only true solution is for Sugi and Ibanez to partner in a new factory to build exclusively for Ibanez.

Now at the distributor level, the checkers are trained as to what is passable and what isn't, which is why I'd never make it as a checker. Although there have been some checkers actually doing real rejections if you've seen some of the comments on the seconds I buy, many of them I would have been crucified for returning and I rub it in every time I get one. What is rejected they have to put an order in for the problem, pocket crack, needs body, hump neck, needs neck, and then it goes on a rack until the factory builds the next run of that model and then build the extra body. Logistically it's a nightmare and much of the time they make a financial settlement with the factory and the sell it off as a second, or sell pallet loads off to MIRC as reclamation.



MaxOfMetal said:


> Huh. Didn't notice that. Maybe Rich will chime in.



They had 3 of them when I picked one up last month? It's not on any discontinued list, and anything on the website can be wrong at any time, just like my site where much of it is wrong most of the time 

I was just informed the link above is the EU site so they may be discontinued there and not in the US. Or, their site could just be wrong


----------



## Ibanez Rules

On a different note, I notice the whole site has changed since my last visit, and can anybody tell me how to fix my signature file? It's showing SIGPIC where my mini banner used to be.


----------



## xzacx

cardinal said:


> All chime in with my two cents:
> 
> I’ve had way too many guitars and couldn’t tell you what one species of wood might sound like compared to another.
> 
> What seems more important is the builder knowing what he’s working with and selecting the right piece.
> 
> Whatever material these production factories are using, the pieces are random, and it’s just going to be a roll of the dice about how resonant or whatever each guitar will end up.
> 
> So I wouldn’t worry about these changes.



I couldn't agree with this more. Species of wood doesn't even cross my mind outside of aesthetic considerations. I've owned enough guitars to know that an individual piece either sounds good or it doesn't. And just because one example of that guitar sounds good doesn't mean the next will. Maple and mahogany Les Pauls can sound like anything from a Tele to muddy and flubby mess.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

possumkiller said:


> Holy shit! That is fugly as hell like all the other new AZ models.



Strongly agree.
Got a healthy chuckle out of Tim's comment on the post though.


----------



## Albake21

Rawkmann said:


> Might be an unpopular opinion but I wished Ibanez just would have revamped the S line instead of introducing the AZ series. Especially if they brought back the old SV line with the more vintage styled necks and hardware.


I couldn't agree more. Although (as much I don't like the AZ series) they do have a new neck profile dedicated to the SV series.


----------



## Randy

Ibanez Rules said:


> On a different note, I notice the whole site has changed since my last visit, and can anybody tell me how to fix my signature file? It's showing SIGPIC where my mini banner used to be.



I haven't played around with it myself, but it looks like the whole 'SIGPIC' script got nixed, so you just insert your sig image the same way you would add an image to a post. I'm assuming you can host it here but I don't see an 'upload file' button, so I'm assuming you're better off hosting the pic elsewhere and just pasting the URL.


----------



## cip 123

Personal preference, not a huge polyphia fan but I really like those sigs, especially scotts. 

They're better than some of the models ibanez are releasing this year... *tries not to throw up at the, Unicorn fart burst, RGA*


----------



## A-Branger

Ordacleaphobia said:


> or maybe even a Premium I'd be all over it.



do Im reading this properly??? someone in SSO is saying that they would be all over that guitar if it was a PREMIUM?!?! are you guys getting softer now or wut?? 

see, I told you the Premiums arent that bad


----------



## Xaios

A-Branger said:


> do Im reading this properly??? someone in SSO is saying that they would be all over that guitar if it was a PREMIUM?!?! are you guys getting softer now or wut??


It's a trick. Get an axe.


----------



## mlp187

A-Branger said:


> do Im reading this properly??? someone in SSO is saying that they would be all over that guitar if it was a PREMIUM?!?! are you guys getting softer now or wut??
> 
> see, I told you the Premiums arent that bad


There are more of us than you think!


----------



## Sephiroth952

MaxOfMetal said:


> Huh. Didn't notice that. Maybe Rich will chime in.


Looks like the new M8M is a revision. The past model shown is version 1.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

A-Branger said:


> do Im reading this properly??? someone in SSO is saying that they would be all over that guitar if it was a PREMIUM?!?! are you guys getting softer now or wut??
> 
> see, I told you the Premiums arent that bad



Hah, yeah....that Iron Label I picked up a few months ago has made me a bit more open to their MiI offerings, not gunna lie.
Especially since a guitar like that would definitely be in the $2k range if it was from Japan


----------



## I play music

Sephiroth952 said:


> Looks like the new M8M is a revision. The past model shown is version 1.


Yep I think you got it, that must be it. 
So the new version now has Jatoba, that Jeff guy will be amazed to hear about his favorite wood Jatoba in a 6000€ guitar 


I think it would be cool to have a Prestige series Meshuggah guitar, like in the new 5000 series with stainless steel frets for around 2000€. M8M is a bit too expensive and the M80M I tried was not so impressing quality-wise.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Kaura said:


> Also, wtf is that bridge pickup? Not quite a humbucker-size, not quite a single-coil. P90?



https://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/the-tone-garage/what-is-a-mini-humbucker

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini-humbucker


----------



## Xaios

mlp187 said:


> There are more of us than you think!


----------



## Seabeast2000

Is the ftm33 still available? That is a true beast.


----------



## Jeff

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> RG2027XL preordered.
> 
> Can we stop fighting about woods? We aren't Lumberjacks.



We did. I'm stubborn, every disagrees with me, and I'm fine with that. 

Serious question: I wonder how wenge compares to jatoba in terms of cost; we've still got one of those limited edition fade Premiums with the wenge board, and it looks and feels awesome.


----------



## gunshow86de

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> Can we stop fighting about woods? We aren't Lumberjacks.



Can we still wear high heels, suspendies, and a bra?


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> I hope not, but I definitely lost interest in the S series when they went 24 fret. I know it was a popular request, but to me they were never supposed to be an RG with a different body. They were their own thing.



Yes yes the only difference between any two guitars is how many frets they have. 

An Aristides. It’s just an rg with a different body.


----------



## Obsidian Soul

xzacx said:


> I couldn't agree with this more. Species of wood doesn't even cross my mind outside of aesthetic considerations. I've owned enough guitars to know that an individual piece either sounds good or it doesn't. And just because one example of that guitar sounds good doesn't mean the next will. Maple and mahogany Les Pauls can sound like anything from a Tele to muddy and flubby mess.


I have a Jackson 7 string with a floyd rose and the new Stephen Carpenter 7 string tele,and they sound the opposite of what I expected.The Jackson is heavy,dark,and flubby while the ESP is about the same weight but really bright.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Jeff said:


> We did. I'm stubborn, every disagrees with me, and I'm fine with that.
> 
> Serious question: I wonder how wenge compares to jatoba in terms of cost; we've still got one of those limited edition fade Premiums with the wenge board, and it looks and feels awesome.




I am so down for Wenge. I have a TAM100 with wenge neck and board and its very awesome


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

I don't really like the look of jatoba. Reminds me too much of my first guitar's "Rosewood" Fretboard


----------



## Jeff

diagrammatiks said:


> Yes yes the only difference between any two guitars is how many frets they have.
> 
> An Aristides. It’s just an rg with a different body.



Don’t be a dick. I know there are more differences than that, but one of the main appealing points was the 22 fret neck.


----------



## Sephiroth952

I agree, the S series should have stayed 22 frets.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I could take or leave the fret count, but they definitely made more interesting 22-fret Sabers than 24-fret ones. 

I understand it's a whole separate neck SKU, but I don't see why they couldn't keep both around.


----------



## Sephiroth952

MaxOfMetal said:


> I could take or leave the fret count, but they definitely made more interesting 22-fret Sabers than 24-fret ones.
> 
> I understand it's a whole separate neck SKU, but I don't see why they couldn't keep both around.


I mean thats what they are doing with the current AZ's. :/


----------



## Jeff

Was someone asking about the Meshuggahs? All three (including the $6K one) are still in the catalog.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Was someone asking about the Meshuggahs? All three (including the $6K one) are still in the catalog.



There was just some confusion as the M8M was listed as "no longer in production", but it's just a spec revision like the M80M and FTM33 recieved last year: no more rosewood.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> There was just some confusion as the M8M was listed as "no longer in production", but it's just a spec revision like the M80M and FTM33 recieved last year: no more rosewood.



Nope, still rosewood on the expensive one M8M. The M80M is Jatoba now.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Nope, still rosewood on the expensive one M8M. The M80M is Jatoba now.



Nope. 

https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/m8m_33_02.html

"Pau Rosa"


----------



## Ibanez Rules

Randy said:


> I haven't played around with it myself, but it looks like the whole 'SIGPIC' script got nixed, so you just insert your sig image the same way you would add an image to a post. I'm assuming you can host it here but I don't see an 'upload file' button, so I'm assuming you're better off hosting the pic elsewhere and just pasting the URL.



Thanks, I just found where to change it in the drop down.


----------



## LordHar

Ibanez Rules said:


> Thanks, I just found where to change it in the drop down.



Hey Rich, can you say something about the solid red AZ Prestige that I saw on ibanezrules.com, or do we have to wait until NAMM?


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MatiasTolkki said:


> I know next to zero about basses, what's so good about having a shorter scale on them?



Generally short scale basses are mostly favored for size and comfort. But the low tension and shorter scale does give a darker sound, not too dissimilar to an upright. Put on flatwounds and it's classic Motown sound. Guys like Stanley Clarke and Jack Cassidy swear by short scales. Paul McCartney's Hofners were short scales. Juan Alderete, uses his for his dub/hip hop sessions but has a 30" for some Marilyn Manson songs.


----------



## Ibanez Rules

LordHar said:


> Hey Rich, can you say something about the solid red AZ Prestige that I saw on ibanezrules.com, or do we have to wait until NAMM?


That had a 1/1 release date so it's pubic knowledge. If it's not on ibanez.com it's because it was a fall spot model but with a 1/1 live date.
1/1 was NAMM for the world day, with the exception of some dealers leaking early as usual. It's taken them a decade to realize you can't have 3 different regional release dates. Expect there will be show only models, should be a limited JC, Paul Stanley will probably want to do a green colored mirror, and there is always a couple last minute additions so you may will want to check the 24th.


----------



## LordHar

Ibanez Rules said:


> That had a 1/1 release date so it's pubic knowledge. If it's not on ibanez.com it's because it was a fall spot model but with a 1/1 live date.
> 1/1 was NAMM for the world day, with the exception of some dealers leaking early as usual. It's taken them a decade to realize you can't have 3 different regional release dates. Expect there will be show only models, should be a limited JC, Paul Stanley will probably want to do a green colored mirror, and there is always a couple last minute additions so you may will want to check the 24th.



Thanks as always for the inside info. So there is still hope for me to buy a HSS Prestige AZ that isn't blue


----------



## mpexus

Sephiroth952 said:


> I agree, the S series should have stayed 22 frets.



The good thing of them having 22 frets is that they never got to the popularity of the RG's, so we can get early 90's MIJ Sabres for 300-400 euros. Some people in Europe try to sell them for much higher values, but they stay on Reverb for ever.


----------



## soldierkahn

Ordacleaphobia said:


> Wow, I don't check this thread for a day an it absolutely explodes.
> I was wondering when you'd pop in about that XL




lol, you know me all too well. i cant wait to get that 2027 in my hands !!! ..... Ebony, yyyyyyyuuum.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

mpexus said:


> The good thing of them having 22 frets is that they never got to the popularity of the RG's, so we can get early 90's MIJ Sabres for 300-400 euros. Some people in Europe try to sell them for much higher values, but they stay on Reverb for ever.



I underestand the appeal but 22frets is the reason why I sold my korean SA to a Friend. Makes no sense to own a lightweight shred weapon with only 22 frets IMO


----------



## Wolfhorsky

The S series looks hideous with the body binding.
For me, the definition of the Sabers:
SSH or HSH. No body binding. Full neck binding. Side dots or pearlesque and diamond-shaped markers. Black hardware on solid colors (black, blue, green and red metallics). Gold hardware on flame/quilted maple tops with cool colors. Ohhh and LoPro Edge.
Maybe i am old or sth, but early-to-mid 90s models had that mojo.

https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/s520_03.html
Hahahaha they made the same finish like i did here:
http://www.sevenstring.org/threads/nogd-lil-devil-heavy-modified-ibby-s.330307/


----------



## odibrom

I like the Sabers with 24 frets, though I have none of those. My first "real" guitar was a '93 saber that still lives around me, modified, obviously, but only on the pickups and wiring.

I lust for a 24 fret, 7 stringer, LoPro Edge Saber like the S5527 or the S5427... I couldn't get one at the time and missed the shot. They never done (afaik) a double edge S 7 stringer as they've done with the 6 stringers S2020X... man, that would be awesome...


----------



## Albake21

odibrom said:


> I like the Sabers with 24 frets, though I have none of those. My first "real" guitar was a '93 saber that still lives around me, modified, obviously, but only on the pickups and wiring.
> 
> I lust for a 24 fret, 7 stringer, LoPro Edge Saber like the S5527 or the S5427... I couldn't get one at the time and missed the shot. They never done (afaik) a double edge S 7 stringer as they've done with the 6 stringers S2020X... man, that would be awesome...


Same! I'd love to find one of those S 7 strings. I wish they made more...


----------



## dirtool

so RG3327 is Japan exclusive?


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Nope.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/m8m_33_02.html
> 
> "Pau Rosa"


Interesting. 2019 catalog says differently. I wonder which is accurate.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Interesting. 2019 catalog says differently. I wonder which is accurate.



I mean, what are the odds they put together a whole new spec sheet and web page for the new variant, which follows new materials conventions, on accident vs. accidentally copy and pasting last year description? I think that's the only one that lists "Pau Rosa" too. Though, I haven't checked everything. It's also pretty interesting that Vai and Satch get to keep rosewood. I guess they have enough pull. 

Do you have a link to the actual catalog? I've only seen the "new stuff" pamphlet and a couple of pics of some pages.


----------



## odibrom

... I always thought that _Pau Rosa_ was _Rosewood_, since it's the exact/direct translation. Google, however has a different idea about it 

... on a more serious tone, wikipedia seams to have a pretty straightforward info on this and... yes, Pau Rosa is some sort of Rosewood...


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> I mean, what are the odds they put together a whole new spec sheet and web page for the new variant, which follows new materials conventions, on accident vs. accidentally copy and pasting last year description? I think that's the only one that lists "Pau Rosa" too. Though, I haven't checked everything. It's also pretty interesting that Vai and Satch get to keep rosewood. I guess they have enough pull.
> 
> Do you have a link to the actual catalog? I've only seen the "new stuff" pamphlet and a couple of pics of some pages.



You’re probably right. 

No, I don’t have a link, I’ve got the actual PDF which I don’t think is for public consumption yet.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

odibrom said:


> ... I always thought that _Pau Rosa_ was _Rosewood_, since it's the exact/direct translation. Google, however has a different idea about it
> 
> ... on a more serious tone, wikipedia seams to have a pretty straightforward info on this and... yes, Pau Rosa is some sort of Rosewood...



It's not Dalbergia though: https://www.wood-database.com/pau-rosa/

Per CITES it is not rosewood, but similar: https://www.delta-intkey.com/citeswood/en/www/caebobg.htm

So it's the "nato" of rosewood.


----------



## odibrom

Thanks for the input @MaxOfMetal

I'm no botanic but the wiki page says the following:
From _Dalbergia_ species

Amazone Rosewood, Para Rosewood (_Dalbergia spruceana_)
Bahia Rosewood, (Brazilian) Tulipwood, *Pau Rosa*, *Pinkwood*, *Bois de rose* (_Dalbergia decipularis_), (_Dalbergia frutescens_)
...
The Wood database site calls it
Scientific Name: _Bobgunnia fistuloides, B. madagascariensis_ 
(syn. Swartzia fistuloides, S. madagascariensis)​
So, which source is more reliable?

I'm not trying to be a what google translated Pau Rosa to, just want to learn...


----------



## Jeff

I think pau rosa was used on the limited "reclaimed wood" PRS guitars from last year. If so it......basically feels and looks like rosewood anyway. 

*EDIT
*
Nope, it was a different wood I can't pronounce. Nevermind.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

odibrom said:


> Thanks for the input @MaxOfMetal
> 
> I'm no botanic but the wiki page says the following:
> From _Dalbergia_ species
> 
> Amazone Rosewood, Para Rosewood (_Dalbergia spruceana_)
> Bahia Rosewood, (Brazilian) Tulipwood, *Pau Rosa*, *Pinkwood*, *Bois de rose* (_Dalbergia decipularis_), (_Dalbergia frutescens_)
> ...
> The Wood database site calls it
> Scientific Name: _Bobgunnia fistuloides, B. madagascariensis_
> (syn. Swartzia fistuloides, S. madagascariensis)​
> So, which source is more reliable?
> 
> I'm not trying to be a what google translated Pau Rosa to, just want to learn...



What does the source link on the Wiki page say exactly? What are you looking at?

Looking at the full list of Dalbergia on Wikipedia, there is no source link to Pau Rosa, and the dalbergia frutescens page makes no mention of it.


----------



## mlp187

Edit (my original statement): That photoshop hackjob on RGIXL7 headstock is giving me nightmares.
Just had to get that off my chest.

Edit (my correction): just saw a real stock photo. Well goddamnit that’s really how the model looks.


----------



## Jeff

SRC6 is still there, now made of okoume. I wish they did a different color; I want a second one.


----------



## Albake21

dirtool said:


> so RG3327 is Japan exclusive?


Yup looks like it. Same with the RG3050.... the only one I really wanted.


----------



## Cromatic

dirtool said:


> so RG3327 is Japan exclusive?


Apparently ;( There are just too many bright colors this year. I don't get it. It would be nice to see other finish options on the rg752. I would buy the green or the yellow 7 prestige if it came in a more classy finish.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Interesting

https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html


----------



## cardinal

I assume the only definition of pau rosa that matters to Ibanez is the one that CITES will look at. I love the M8M guitar; I just could not handle that scale length, which is a huge bummer. It looks really cool, though.



LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html



That's awesome. They should have gone all in, though, and hacked in an Edge trem too.


----------



## Xaios

LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html


----------



## I play music

LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html


I think I've seen something similar from Fender before...Strat neck on an acoustic. I like it.


----------



## Frostbite

LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html


----------



## Albake21

LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html


That thing looks absolutely awful... I like it.


----------



## gunshow86de

Frostbite said:


>



That guitar unzipped you!


----------



## Andromalia

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looking at the full list of Dalbergia on Wikipedia, there is no source link to Pau Rosa, and the dalbergia frutescens page makes no mention of it.



She's obviously Ferro's wife.


----------



## Saraceal

I'm going to try and say this as neutral as I possibly can. I've moved away from Ibanez in the past couple years but I'm always open to try new ones if the right model comes out. I genuinely feel like the 2019 lineup is kinda just weird. At least it is to me. The prestige models are just kind of ugly to me (I really dislike the flat colors used), and I'm still unsure of the quality of premium models since the ones I've tried are extremely hit or miss. Also, the new signature models seem odd to me. I'm pretty happy about Luke Hoskin getting one because he absolutely deserves it at this point in his career. They've been a band for almost two decades. For the CHON and Polyphia ones though, I feel like it's only because Ibanez know that the younger generation of players will buy them in droves. Personally, that is not the kind of music I like at all (I'm into more underground metal, the kind that has 30 people show up to a show), but hasn't the style CHON and Polyphia play gotten less popular? Maybe I'm completely wrong (and I probably am) since I'm not involved in that scene at all, but there's just something weird about releasing CHON and Polyphia signature models this early into their career. It all just feels very transparent that it's for money. And yes, that is a big point for ANY signature model (making money from fans), but I don't know, it seems odd. 

I'm going to think on it and try and actually explain my feelings once I know what to say but I just wanted to get that out there.


----------



## vilk

Saraceal said:


> players will buy them in droves
> 
> 
> it's for money



...it's almost like they're a _business_ or something!!


----------



## Andromalia

Ok had a few moments to actually check the models, that S is pretty sexy. I'm unlikely to buy any because I don't live in Windsor castle and really don't need another guitar, but that's a pretty cool offering there.


----------



## Saraceal

vilk said:


> ...it's almost like they're a _business_ or something!!



I said that though. I also did mention I couldn't really verbalise what I find odd about them, but hopefully I can soon. I do like the snarky reply though, that rules

Honestly as much as I don’t want to admit it’s probably because of personal feelings I have towards the bands.

I definitely wasn’t saying it doesn’t make sense on a business side of things though because it does. I probably just didn’t say what I meant correctly.


----------



## Xaios

Saraceal said:


> but hasn't the style CHON and Polyphia play gotten less popular?


I don't know about CHON, but Polyphia's Youtube channel (which, let's face it, is as probably as objective as it gets nowadays when trying to gauge an artist's popularity) has over 60 million views. For comparison sake, that's nearly FOUR TIMES as many as Periphery's channel. Ibanez would be _insane_ to ignore that.


----------



## Saraceal

Xaios said:


> I don't know about CHON, but Polyphia's Youtube channel (which, let's face it, is as probably as objective as it gets nowadays when trying to gauge an artist's popularity) has over 60 million views. For comparison sake, that's nearly FOUR TIMES as many as Periphery's channel. Ibanez would be _insane_ to ignore that.



Wow really? I guess I really underestimated how much draw they have, huh?

It’s definitely about how I personally feel about those two bands then. That’s a great way to judge things, basing it on personal feelings. It never went wrong ever once in history.


----------



## mlp187

Saraceal said:


> Wow really? I guess I really underestimated how much draw they have, huh?
> 
> It’s definitely about how I personally feel about those two bands then. That’s a great way to judge things, basing it on personal feelings. It never went wrong ever once in history.


Don’t be too hard on yourself, people do this in different areas of their lives all the time. Props for recognizing it.


----------



## mpexus

TheUnknownOne said:


> I underestand the appeal but 22frets is the reason why I sold my korean SA to a Friend. Makes no sense to own a lightweight shred weapon with only 22 frets IMO




Doesn't bother me 22 vs 24.... as long as its not 21 I'm ok. Its just that the 22 frets kinda seem to have "handicapped" the S series value and I dont mind it at all 

Also 22 or 21 frets never stopped Satriani or Malmsteen (among others).


----------



## 77zark77

Please guys don't be so ..... (put here the word you want, I don't speak English for a long time) but see some catalogs from the 80s/90s
and ask yourself : who's that guy ?

I personnaly like the PGMM21 and the Iceman ukulele 'cos it's fun !
I like the fact there's more 7string and more reverse headstocks, but will continue to prefer some good second hand stuff


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Xaios said:


> I don't know about CHON, but Polyphia's Youtube channel (which, let's face it, is as probably as objective as it gets nowadays when trying to gauge an artist's popularity) has over 60 million views. For comparison sake, that's nearly FOUR TIMES as many as Periphery's channel. Ibanez would be _insane_ to ignore that.



That's something that old guys like me sometimes miss. How guitarists are "famous" these days is different to how they were "famous" when I was a kid. "Record" sales don't count like they used to, for the kids "youtubers" are the new guitar heroes and it looks like Ibanez have taken notice of that.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

I kinda dig this one:
https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/rgd61al_1p_01.html
Looks very familiar to my Skerv Lupus.
What is Panga Panga wood?
There’s something fishy about it ;-)


----------



## Maximal

I just don't get the Prestige lineup at this moment. The Indo line gets a guitar like the RGA60AL that looks killer but probably plays like poop and the top of the line Prestiges are all solid color guitars. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind that they have a simple looking workhorse guitar like the RG5121 in their lineup, but it is priced 500 Eur over the RG652, which looks a lot more expensive, but has no stainless steel frets and Dimarzios. Right now I have to choose between a superb specced guitar that looks like Gio but costs 1800 Eur and some nice looking ones that are either lower specced or made in Indonesia.


----------



## 77zark77

The question that maybe can answers others is : what is that "axion label" for ?


----------



## Albake21

Wolfhorsky said:


> I kinda dig this one:
> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/rgd61al_1p_01.html
> Looks very familiar to my Skerv Lupus.
> What is Panga Panga wood?
> There’s something fishy about it ;-)


It's literally just a cheaper looking Kiesel Aries with their Cali burst.


----------



## gunshow86de

77zark77 said:


> The question that maybe can answers others is : what is that "axion label" for ?



For marketing purposes (i.e. to differentiate between the "standard" Indo made stuff).


----------



## Frostbite

77zark77 said:


> The question that maybe can answers others is : what is that "axion label" for ?


It's for kids who play "prog metal" but really just chug and put synth behind it


----------



## mikah912

Albake21 said:


> It's literally just a cheaper looking Kiesel Aries with their Cali burst.



Thought the exact same thing. The actual color is Kiesel's Aquaburst, but with a Caliburst add-on to make that middle portion extra light and natural.


----------



## Maximal

77zark77 said:


> The question that maybe can answers others is : what is that "axion label" for ?



For people that dug up some sso threads from 2013 and read that you absolutely need Aftermaths to Djent.


----------



## 77zark77

I can translate Iron in French (fer) and it sounds metal but Axion ? what's the reference ?


----------



## possumkiller

Maximal said:


> Right now I have to choose between a superb specced guitar that looks like Gio but costs 1800 Eur.


Being able to distinguish a cheap beginner guitar with a solid color from a high quality guitar with a solid color seems to be a big problem for a lot of younger players. I guess that's why slapping a veneer and some trendy hardware on a shit guitar sells so well.


----------



## Albake21

Maximal said:


> For people that dug up some sso threads from 2013 and read that you absolutely need Aftermaths to Djent.


.....are you saying you don't? Uh oh...


----------



## possumkiller

What did people djent with before all this djent gear was being invented in 2008?


----------



## Mathemagician

Wolfhorsky said:


> I kinda dig this one:
> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/rgd61al_1p_01.html
> Looks very familiar to my Skerv Lupus.
> What is Panga Panga wood?
> There’s something fishy about it ;-)



It’s a great looking color on a well-done shape. I want that Luke Hoskins (sp?)


----------



## gunshow86de

77zark77 said:


> I can translate Iron in French (fer) and it sounds metal but Axion ? what's the reference ?



I think Axion is pronounced like 'action.' It's spelled that way because they hired this guy to do marketing.


----------



## Andromalia

Dave Mustaine's gonna sue them.


----------



## Xaios

possumkiller said:


> What did people djent with before all this djent gear was being invented in 2008?


They djidn't.


gunshow86de said:


> I think Axion is pronounced like 'action.' It's spelled that way because they hired this guy to do marketing.


Probably correct. Sounds like "action," but also looks like "Axiom," another word-salad ingredient that's popular with the half-baked metalhead-philosopher crowd.


----------



## vilk

Axion is a word that is obviously very scientific or mathematic and therefore very modern progressive metal from 5 years ago


----------



## Andromalia

77zark77 said:


> I can translate Iron in French (fer) and it sounds metal but Axion ? what's the reference ?



L'axe fion de fer ca fait très metal.



> Being able to distinguish a cheap beginner guitar with a solid color from a high quality guitar with a solid color seems to be a big problem for a lot of younger players. I guess that's why slapping a veneer and some trendy hardware on a shit guitar sells so well.


Signatures also play a role, the Vai premium is more expensive than a RGR 652/752 prestige 6/7 string.


----------



## Xaios

_MonSTeR_ said:


> That's something that old guys like me sometimes miss. How guitarists are "famous" these days is different to how they were "famous" when I was a kid. "Record" sales don't count like they used to, for the kids "youtubers" are the new guitar heroes and it looks like Ibanez have taken notice of that.


I think it comes down to the fact that, for a long time, the only "famous" guitar hero type players were the ones who had managed to firmly entrench themselves in the larger musical pantheon during the time when technical skill-based music was popular. During the 90s, it's not like famous players that everyone already knew like EVH, Hammett or Vai suddenly lost their audience, but it became a lot harder to break into the guitar-hero scene if you weren't already there, because popular music as a whole shifted away from that style. Really only a handful of players managed to do it, such as Dimebag, Zakk Wylde and (to a lesser degree of course) Petrucci. The internet era finally allowed guitarists to, at least to some degree, bypass the requirement of making music that was generally popular in order to connect to a wider audience of other guitarists. Obviously even in the dormant times of shred, really dedicated fans of the style could always get it from places like the Shrapnel catalog, but that did nothing to help connect artists with new, younger prospective listeners. Youtube gave people who wanted to hear that kind of music but didn't know where to look for it an easy way to find it.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

these are tasty af


----------



## Paul McAleer

So so so excited for this man.

I want more 7 string Ibanez's with trems


----------



## gunshow86de

Alternate theory: they called them Axion because Aries was already taken.


----------



## odibrom

This yellow and that green... a perfect pair...


----------



## lurè

the yellow one deserves a pickguard


----------



## Seabeast2000

gunshow86de said:


> Alternate theory: they called them Axion because Aries was already taken.


I did not know this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axion

MUST be the source of the name....


----------



## lurè

Yup, sevenstring guitars and quantum physics what an original combo!


----------



## A-Branger

_MonSTeR_ said:


> That's something that old guys like me sometimes miss. How guitarists are "famous" these days is different to how they were "famous" when I was a kid. "Record" sales don't count like they used to, for the kids "youtubers" are the new guitar heroes and it looks like Ibanez have taken notice of that.



yeah, people love to bash "youtubers" like if they didnt had any merit, but what they fail to realise is that youtube is the new magazine for guitar brands. Back in the day I only knew about new gear by magazine adds, or if I see someone playing a guitar on an MTV music video. Magazines are almost dead, but youtube brings out soooo many eyes. Same way companies used to slap a photo of their new shinny gear on a magazine, now they jsut send that guitar to the youtuber (magazine subscription) of their choice with the best reach or niche to their brand.

I got mates who had toured the US a few times and europe with their band, yet they are almost broke. While someone in youtube can still do a day job and do their videos in their spare time and make bit of money. And if they are "famous" they can make it in a way full time and find money around, something a "famous" band these days barely manage to do so. So yeah "youtubers" arent real musicians.... *roll eyes* 

a guy in a band can show their gear to X amount of people, out of which a % would be the target market of the guitar brand (depends on their music style too). While a youtuber can have a way way way bigger % of potential buyers watching the channel. So yeah, brands love youtubers as its their perfect advertising platform 



77zark77 said:


> I can translate Iron in French (fer) and it sounds metal but Axion ? what's the reference ?



sounds like science and space, since all the finishes are stuff like "Nebula Burst".... plus it got an "X" on the name, nothing mroe awesome and metal than having a name with an X on it, like "Rex" 



possumkiller said:


> What did people djent with before all this djent gear was being invented in 2008?



JPs bro JPs.... all hail our mighty Lord of Prog Petrucci


----------



## odibrom

lurè said:


> the yellow one deserves a pickguard



Blasphemy... to hell with pickguards, let the yellow shine trough and blind your eyes...


----------



## gunshow86de

The yellow one deserves to be Road Flare Red.


----------



## lurè

odibrom said:


> Blasphemy... to hell with pickguards, let the yellow shine trough and blind your eyes...


What about a transparent pickguard?


----------



## A-Branger

lurè said:


> What about a transparent pickguard?


blasphemy!!!!


----------



## Leviathus

Do you guys even Ibanez? I can't wait for someone to put a black guard on that 752DY, and maybe some pink pickups and green knobs too.


----------



## odibrom

That is a direct and unquestionable ... the pickguards, I mean...


----------



## Leviathus

Triggered?


----------



## gunshow86de

^
We all know that is an Ibanez's final form.


----------



## A-Branger

Leviathus said:


> Triggered?



I can let that one go because the swirl and because Mr Vai


----------



## Miek

gunshow86de said:


> ^
> We all know that is an Ibanez's final form.


in my experience it's either that, or a raw, angry, beat to shit violence machine

no in between


----------



## cip 123

Just saw the prices from Andertons for the new lines

https://www.andertons.co.uk/ibanez-...doD7R0D&sc_llid=22869&sc_eh=019639624d47378d1

£1800 for a prestige?!

You must really WANT one of these guitars to buy one in the UK imo. A used RG1527 will set you back about £500 give or take (£450 if you don't mind a few dings), even throwing in the most expensive pickups you won't touch £1800, and you'll still have prestige. 

I understand peoples want for new guitars etc, but honestly the used market for Ibanez just makes these guitars so unreasonable imo. 

Heck you could buy a used prestige and refinish it the same as these new ones and not even touch £1800.

Do these seem worth it in the US if you guys have prices yet?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cip 123 said:


> Just saw the prices from Andertons for the new lines
> 
> https://www.andertons.co.uk/ibanez-...doD7R0D&sc_llid=22869&sc_eh=019639624d47378d1
> 
> £1800 for a prestige?!
> 
> You must really WANT one of these guitars to buy one in the UK imo. A used RG1527 will set you back about £500 give or take (£450 if you don't mind a few dings), even throwing in the most expensive pickups you won't touch £1800, and you'll still have prestige.
> 
> I understand peoples want for new guitars etc, but honestly the used market for Ibanez just makes these guitars so unreasonable imo.
> 
> Heck you could buy a used prestige and refinish it the same as these new ones and not even touch £1800.
> 
> Do these seem worth it in the US if you guys have prices yet?



Not everyone wants to put hundreds of dollars and weeks (or months) worth of work into a 8 to 16 year old (12 to 27 if we loop pre-Prestige MIJ RG7s) used guitar without warranty and aged moving parts and playing surfaces and who knows what level of care over those years.

It's not like these are that expensive. They're still under $2k. Folks pay more than that for Indo Strandbergs.


----------



## cip 123

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not everyone wants to put hundreds of dollars and weeks (or months) worth of work into a 8 to 16 year old (12 to 27 if we loop pre-Prestige MIJ RG7s) used guitar without warranty and aged moving parts and playing surfaces and who knows what level of care over those years.
> 
> It's not like these are that expensive. They're still under $2k. Folks pay more than that for Indo Strandbergs.


Fair point about Strandy I forgot about them. But let's not forget how revered some of those older Ibby's are.

I totally get the new over used and understand I'm firmly in the "Give me a good used deal anyday" camp. 

I still struggle looking at that price though, as I do with Indo Strandbergs, to see the value. Interested to hear who thinks they are "Worth it?" compared to the price. Though everything is getting more expensive these days so...


----------



## Santuzzo

MY favorite of those new Ibbys so far would be that yellow RG7 and the new Andy Timmons signature.
That being said, I think I'll still pass on a new Ibanez and save up for a JP15-7 instead.


----------



## sirbuh

So that green rg is prlly happening...


----------



## ixlramp

I like that Altstar acoustic, finally a modern acoustic without a super-old-fashioned headstock.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cip 123 said:


> Fair point about Strandy I forgot about them. But let's not forget how revered some of those older Ibby's are.
> 
> I totally get the new over used and understand I'm firmly in the "Give me a good used deal anyday" camp.
> 
> I still struggle looking at that price though, as I do with Indo Strandbergs, to see the value. Interested to hear who thinks they are "Worth it?" compared to the price. Though everything is getting more expensive these days so...



I know they're not "cheap" but are they an objectively bad deal for most guitarists? 

For under $2k you're getting a lot with these and I can't see any other mainstream manufacturer offering the specs and craftsmanship at a significantly lower price.

What else is out there? You have the Schecter KMs, a few 600 series LTD models, a couple of E-IIs, all line priced for the most part. Depending on specs you could probably get a Kiesel for $100 to $200 cheaper, said and done. 

Back when you could grab Suhr pro models for about $1200 these would have been pretty pricey by comparison, but now even the cheapest those come up is about $1600 and it's 6-string only.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

cip 123 said:


> Just saw the prices from Andertons for the new lines
> 
> https://www.andertons.co.uk/ibanez-...doD7R0D&sc_llid=22869&sc_eh=019639624d47378d1
> 
> £1800 for a prestige?!
> 
> You must really WANT one of these guitars to buy one in the UK imo. A used RG1527 will set you back about £500 give or take (£450 if you don't mind a few dings), even throwing in the most expensive pickups you won't touch £1800, and you'll still have prestige.
> 
> I understand peoples want for new guitars etc, but honestly the used market for Ibanez just makes these guitars so unreasonable imo.
> 
> Heck you could buy a used prestige and refinish it the same as these new ones and not even touch £1800.
> 
> Do these seem worth it in the US if you guys have prices yet?



Don't forget that the GBP has tanked in the last couple of years. Ibanez Prestige guitars, being Japanese are "made" in JPY and so with the exchange rate being what it is compared to say 2015 (135 compared to 195), these are going to look expensive at the moment.


----------



## Kodee_Kaos

kamello said:


> holy shit, I remember that many years ago, @Kodee_Kaos made me a mockup of my "ideal Ibanez" and ended up with this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now, I would prefer a Tight-End bridge and reverse headstock but it's still pretty close to what was my "ideal Ibanez" back then before everyone and their mother started doing those Misha-ish Blue Bursts
> 
> and now Ibanez releases this



Holy crap that was ages ago! You have good taste.


----------



## Maximal

cip 123 said:


> Just saw the prices from Andertons for the new lines
> 
> https://www.andertons.co.uk/ibanez-...doD7R0D&sc_llid=22869&sc_eh=019639624d47378d1
> 
> £1800 for a prestige?!
> 
> You must really WANT one of these guitars to buy one in the UK imo. A used RG1527 will set you back about £500 give or take (£450 if you don't mind a few dings), even throwing in the most expensive pickups you won't touch £1800, and you'll still have prestige.
> 
> I understand peoples want for new guitars etc, but honestly the used market for Ibanez just makes these guitars so unreasonable imo.
> 
> Heck you could buy a used prestige and refinish it the same as these new ones and not even touch £1800.
> 
> Do these seem worth it in the US if you guys have prices yet?





cip 123 said:


> Just saw the prices from Andertons for the new lines
> 
> https://www.andertons.co.uk/ibanez-...doD7R0D&sc_llid=22869&sc_eh=019639624d47378d1
> 
> £1800 for a prestige?!
> 
> You must really WANT one of these guitars to buy one in the UK imo. A used RG1527 will set you back about £500 give or take (£450 if you don't mind a few dings), even throwing in the most expensive pickups you won't touch £1800, and you'll still have prestige.
> 
> I understand peoples want for new guitars etc, but honestly the used market for Ibanez just makes these guitars so unreasonable imo.
> 
> Heck you could buy a used prestige and refinish it the same as these new ones and not even touch £1800.
> 
> Do these seem worth it in the US if you guys have prices yet?



Kind of the problem for me is that there are few reasons why a modern Prestige is worth the extra £$€ over a 10 year old one as there is so little progression. SS frets are a step in the right direction but the RG could be such a cool canvas for all sort of things. I don't understand why they didn't release an 'all naked wood with fancy top' RG when Blackmachines were the thing, why flamed tops are pretty much reserved for J-Customs or why they won't try some fancy finishes or whatever. Even ESP with their E-II line is doing a much better job in making guitars that make me excited. With Ibanez I know that I'll get a good guitar in the Vibe of that 80s Shred thing but I think only few people dream of owning a RG5121 when they could drool over a Regius instead.

At the same time, I don't think the pricing itself is that bad, all the Korean made guitars are getting more and more expensive, the new KM-7 is not even that much cheaper than the RG 5xxx and ESP charges quite a bit more for their Japanese made E-II line.


----------



## A-Branger

here we go again. People complaining about the price of the new guitar because they know about that one 15+ yr old guitar got sold once by X amount of money.

no matter how many times I hear the "get an used Prestige" to every argument. The times I decided to check the used market I never found one, and if I found one, it was no where near the mystical cheap figure everyone raves they are


you want second hand?, cool, go get second hand. You cant compare second hand prices to brand new prices. Second hadn market dont dictates the prices for new gear


----------



## I play music

Maximal said:


> but I think only few people dream of owning a RG5121 when they could drool over a Regius instead.


I would prefer the RG5121, not a fan of the Regius shape. And the Duvell is basically Mayones' version of the RG shape. 
If what you want can be found at a good price on the used market, then buy used. The thing is in my experience you can't be picky when buying used. For example I can find some 7 string Prestige Ibanez, yes. But it might be black with a dry rosewood fretboard and a bit of fretwear, obviously no SS frets and no reversed headstock, in short no RGR5227MFX if that's what one really wants.


----------



## I play music

Question: The RGR5227MFX has a "Transparent Fluorescent Green front". Does that really mean the guitar front glows in the dark or is the name misleading?


----------



## lurè

The axion and iron label are spec'd thousands times better then the past years prestige.
Years ago a set of bareknucle on a mid tier instrument was uncommon, you were pretty much forced to swap your ibz pickups or stay with your paf or emg. Also locking tuners exc..
I dont know if we have reach the point where these series a "better" then the old Prestige models but, on paper, they're a step forward Just for the specs.


----------



## possumkiller

"Specs" aren't worth anything if the guitar isn't put together and finished well enough.


----------



## lurè

That's why people are still buying Prestige new or used, they're still the go to if you want quality.
But I remember when iron labal were shit and now are "try before you buy".
I won't be surprised if this axion label is actually good.


----------



## cip 123

MaxOfMetal said:


> I know they're not "cheap" but are they an objectively bad deal for most guitarists?
> 
> For under $2k you're getting a lot with these and I can't see any other mainstream manufacturer offering the specs and craftsmanship at a significantly lower price.
> 
> What else is out there? You have the Schecter KMs, a few 600 series LTD models, a couple of E-IIs, all line priced for the most part. Depending on specs you could probably get a Kiesel for $100 to $200 cheaper, said and done.
> 
> Back when you could grab Suhr pro models for about $1200 these would have been pretty pricey by comparison, but now even the cheapest those come up is about $1600 and it's 6-string only.


Not an objectively bad choice I think my hang up on guitars at that range is back to my original point, what they've just released has to be something you really "Want". It's the same with that new KM7 or the Strandbergs, you really gotta want exactly that. I know a lot of people who will buy things with specs close enough to what they want and be happy. Ibanez has been making great guitars for decades which is why a used prestige is a good deal, especially given what they've released this year, almost no new S series. Plenty great spec'd ones out there already, because they've been releasing them for years, and they're not exactly falling apart what with Ibanez build quality.



_MonSTeR_ said:


> Don't forget that the GBP has tanked in the last couple of years. Ibanez Prestige guitars, being Japanese are "made" in JPY and so with the exchange rate being what it is compared to say 2015 (135 compared to 195), these are going to look expensive at the moment.


Absolutely, everything is getting more expensive, I like some prices they're coming out with though, the premiums including that S 7 string seems really tasty for the price.



Maximal said:


> Kind of the problem for me is that there are few reasons why a modern Prestige is worth the extra £$€ over a 10 year old one as there is so little progression. SS frets are a step in the right direction but the RG could be such a cool canvas for all sort of things. I don't understand why they didn't release an 'all naked wood with fancy top' RG when Blackmachines were the thing, why flamed tops are pretty much reserved for J-Customs or why they won't try some fancy finishes or whatever. Even ESP with their E-II line is doing a much better job in making guitars that make me excited. With Ibanez I know that I'll get a good guitar in the Vibe of that 80s Shred thing but I think only few people dream of owning a RG5121 when they could drool over a Regius instead.
> 
> At the same time, I don't think the pricing itself is that bad, all the Korean made guitars are getting more and more expensive, the new KM-7 is not even that much cheaper than the RG 5xxx and ESP charges quite a bit more for their Japanese made E-II line.



THIS. Put much more eloquently than I have put it so far  A prestige is worth it, but there hasn't been much progression on them, which is why the used market imo is such a gold mine, a lot of whats been released up until the past couple of years with the addition of wenge necks, and so on has just been refinishes and updated trem systems. But the original trem systems hold up so well anyway, the necks feel great, and they're build with some of the highest quality you'll find from a big brand.

I would argue that with Korean stuff creeping up, it would be the perfect opportunity for Ibanez to undercut them. A few simply spec'd Prestige with say SS frets? But I do see that they've gone pretty much all out on the specs.



A-Branger said:


> here we go again. People complaining about the price of the new guitar because they know about that one 15+ yr old guitar got sold once by X amount of money.
> 
> no matter how many times I hear the "get an used Prestige" to every argument. The times I decided to check the used market I never found one, and if I found one, it was no where near the mystical cheap figure everyone raves they are
> 
> 
> you want second hand?, cool, go get second hand. You cant compare second hand prices to brand new prices. Second hadn market dont dictates the prices for new gear



Yea this misses pretty much every point I tried to get at. I specifically said the UK market and asked if they were worth it in other countries (Specifically the US). I know the UK market pretty well because I sit there like most of us lusting after guitars. And the Used Ibanez market in the UK has been very good over the past couple of years.

You live in Australia and all I know about Australia is that everything is expensive from what I understand about your exchange rate no?

I said that I understand people wanting new gear and that I am in the camp of a good used deal is better, but my point is the level of quality of a prestige has always been top notch. These guitars will play brilliantly no doubt about it...but so will a used one.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cip 123 said:


> Not an objectively bad choice I think my hang up on guitars at that range is back to my original point, what they've just released has to be something you really "Want". It's the same with that new KM7 or the Strandbergs, you really gotta want exactly that. I know a lot of people who will buy things with specs close enough to what they want and be happy. Ibanez has been making great guitars for decades which is why a used prestige is a good deal, especially given what they've released this year, almost no new S series. Plenty great spec'd ones out there already, because they've been releasing them for years, and they're not exactly falling apart what with Ibanez build quality.
> 
> 
> Absolutely, everything is getting more expensive, I like some prices they're coming out with though, the premiums including that S 7 string seems really tasty for the price.
> 
> 
> 
> THIS. Put much more eloquently than I have put it so far  A prestige is worth it, but there hasn't been much progression on them, which is why the used market imo is such a gold mine, a lot of whats been released up until the past couple of years with the addition of wenge necks, and so on has just been refinishes and updated trem systems. But the original trem systems hold up so well anyway, the necks feel great, and they're build with some of the highest quality you'll find from a big brand.
> 
> I would argue that with Korean stuff creeping up, it would be the perfect opportunity for Ibanez to undercut them. A few simply spec'd Prestige with say SS frets? But I do see that they've gone pretty much all out on the specs.
> 
> 
> 
> Yea this misses pretty much every point I tried to get at. I specifically said the UK market and asked if they were worth it in other countries (Specifically the US). I know the UK market pretty well because I sit there like most of us lusting after guitars. And the Used Ibanez market in the UK has been very good over the past couple of years.
> 
> You live in Australia and all I know about Australia is that everything is expensive from what I understand about your exchange rate no?
> 
> I said that I understand people wanting new gear and that I am in the camp of a good used deal is better, but my point is the level of quality of a prestige has always been top notch. These guitars will play brilliantly no doubt about it...but so will a used one.



Of course actually wanting the guitar would be a prerequisite before even considering the price. If you don't want something, unless it's stupid cheap/free you'll be perfectly fine doing without.

But, while the used market certainly exists, I can't think of any consumer product manufacturer that considers the second hand market when producing current/new models and their subsequent pricing. I doubt BMW cares how much a 10 year old 3 Series goes for when they price their 2019 MY, or if Apple cares how much someone is selling they're iPhone 8 on eBay for.


----------



## odibrom

I play music said:


> Question: The RGR5227MFX has a "Transparent Fluorescent Green front". Does that really mean the guitar front glows in the dark or is the name misleading?



Judging by the videos I've seen so far, my bet is that it's just a name for a very bright green color. It might look cool under the right light but I doubt about Fluorescent or Fosforescent behavior (the first glows under ultraviolet light and the second gathers light energy to then glow in the dark... or the other way around...).

Fluorescence:






Fosforescence (generally comes in hues of green, blue an yellow?):





... however, I might be wrong and the green may be in fact fluorescent as they advertise/name it...


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> Of course actually wanting the guitar would be a prerequisite before even considering the price. If you don't want something, unless it's stupid cheap/free you'll be perfectly fine doing without.
> 
> But, while the used market certainly exists, I can't think of any consumer product manufacturer that considers the second hand market when producing current/new models and their subsequent pricing. I doubt BMW cares how much a 10 year old 3 Series goes for when they price their 2019 MY, or if Apple cares how much someone is selling they're iPhone 8 on eBay for.



Not a good analogy but it’s neither here nor there. BMW doesn’t care about a 10 year old 3 series because objectively they are pieces of shit compared to a newer car. 

A used prestige is like pretty much the same. 

But whatever guitars cost what they cost and rates are going up across the industry. So that’s just life.


----------



## xzacx

A-Branger said:


> you want second hand?, cool, go get second hand. *You cant compare second hand prices to brand new prices. *Second hadn market dont dictates the prices for new gear



You keep missing the point with this. You're right that second hand prices don't necessarily dictate the price of new gear, but they do dictate consumer behavior. Sometimes when people have a set budget to spend—let's just say $1k—they shop around to see what the most they can get for that money is. Those people are absolutely comparing second hand prices to new prices, and depending on where they live, there could be a lot more attractive options for $1k used.



possumkiller said:


> "Specs" aren't worth anything if the guitar isn't put together and finished well enough.


This can't be overstated enough. Specs don't equate to quality. People insist on stainless frets for something that will barely be around long enough for and NGD and Instagram post.




diagrammatiks said:


> Not a good analogy but it’s neither here nor there. BMW doesn’t care about a 10 year old 3 series because objectively they are pieces of shit compared to a newer car.
> 
> A used prestige is like pretty much the same.
> 
> But whatever guitars cost what they cost and rates are going up across the industry. So that’s just life.



Exactly. Also, BMW has to worry about new EPA standards, new safety regulations, etc. And there's also the fact that car consumers actually _want_ something new and more advanced, whereas Gibson spends each year telling people how much their Historics are even closer to the '50s.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> Not a good analogy but it’s neither here nor there. BMW doesn’t care about a 10 year old 3 series because objectively they are pieces of shit compared to a newer car.
> 
> A used prestige is like pretty much the same.
> 
> But whatever guitars cost what they cost and rates are going up across the industry. So that’s just life.



Pretend I said Corolla. 

I stand by my point: manufacturers aren't fighting their own used gear.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Leviathus said:


> Do you guys even Ibanez? I can't wait for someone to put a black guard on that 752DY, and maybe some pink pickups and green knobs too.



That was my plan exactly.


----------



## A-Branger

diagrammatiks said:


> BMW doesn’t care about a 10 year old 3 series because objectively they are pieces of shit compared to a newer car.



you missing the point of the example. see it as "car brand" not worrying about their "X" 10yr old model, you took it too literal




xzacx said:


> but they do dictate consumer behavior. Sometimes when people have a set budget to spend—let's just say $1k—they shop around to see what the most they can get for that money is. Those people are absolutely comparing second hand prices to new prices, and depending on where they live, there could be a lot more attractive options for $1k used.



then those poeple are not the target market for a brand. Those people are on the second hand market. Again, you cant compare one with the other. You want new?, you can only get it new..... you can get a really good care in mint condition instrument case queen never giged guitar. but it would never be "new"



Manufactures do not price their instruments around what the guitar center second hand section, pawn shops, and ebay are doing.... Their prices are made on the cost of the build, cost of R&D, marketing, wages, bussiness stuff, dealers/stores profit and their own profit. This made across the range.... Maybe MAYBE (random example that might wont apply to Ibanez) a X model prestige would be in theory "cheaper" to do than a premium, but perceived value comes into play there too. You cant have the lower tier brand be the more expensive choice, so you price the other higher to keep the ranks...... in theory, but some brands could play that as "here a cheap basic, but Jap made VS a top of the range full spec, but Indo"

Brands do not care about how are you re-selling their guitars for. But hey do care about the used market, as it shows them what models are popular, and which are in demand, so they can spec the next line to waht people "want"..... either in colors/wood/pickups/finishes/ect



MaxOfMetal said:


> I stand by my point: manufacturers aren't fighting their own used gear.


^^ yup


----------



## Exchanger

eightsixboy said:


> Don't know why Ibanez keep sticking with that disgustingly thick white binding on the RGA's.



But...but...I love it...I'm still lurking around for a good deal on a RGAIX7FM...or a similar model. To me that guitar as the perfect aesthetics (apart maybe from the gray top, a bit dull), and great specs (HH passive w/ coil-split, no tone)
The RGA61AL would be a good contender, but the staining is a little too exotic for my taste, and I miss the fretboard binding. And an ebony or otherwise dark fretboard. And a seventh string. Ok maybe it's not such a good centender after all.


----------



## Maximal

MaxOfMetal said:


> Pretend I said Corolla.
> 
> I stand by my point: manufacturers aren't fighting their own used gear.



But that's just not how the market works. If you put out the same product for 30 years and in this case a product that has no inherent expiry date, the used market will reduce your revenue. Most industries are very good at creating a demand for the new product, such that buying the old one feels like a compromise. This is one of the reasons why all tech companies try their best to put out a new killer in their phones feature every year. Car companies are also a great example of this, sure you can buy a ten-year-old car, but it will look old, miss all the new shenanigans and have a less efficient engine. 
Obviously, the guitar industry has all this vintage thing going on, but that's mostly Fender and Gibson territory. Ibanez has been the state of the art guitar 30 years ago, but they kept reiterating the same product over all those years without many changes, at least in the Prestige line. If you ask a 10-year-old kid to chose between a 2018 and 1998 BMW, I bet most will pick the newer one, just from an aesthetic standpoint because the older one looks stale in comparison. If you show the same kid two Ibanez guitars from 1998 and 2018, they probably won't be able to make any kind of justified decision. The weird thing is that they have a lot of more modern options in their line-up, but only in their lower-tier lines. If you want one of the Axion Label guitars you have to buy a new one, with a Prestige RG it is a completely different thing.


----------



## xzacx

A-Branger said:


> then those poeple are not the target market for a brand. Those people are on the second hand market. Again, you cant compare one with the other. You want new?, you can only get it new..... you can get a really good care in mint condition instrument case queen never giged guitar. but it would never be "new"
> 
> Manufactures do not price their instruments around what the guitar center second hand section, pawn shops, and ebay are doing.... Their prices are made on the cost of the build, cost of R&D, marketing, wages, bussiness stuff, dealers/stores profit and their own profit. This made across the range.... Maybe MAYBE (random example that might wont apply to Ibanez) a X model prestige would be in theory "cheaper" to do than a premium, but perceived value comes into play there too. You cant have the lower tier brand be the more expensive choice, so you price the other higher to keep the ranks...... in theory, but some brands could play that as "here a cheap basic, but Jap made VS a top of the range full spec, but Indo"



I haven't seen anyone say that brands price new instruments in consideration of used—that's a straw man argument. And we aren't brands here—we are people that buy guitars, which is why it's relevant when people don't see particular instruments as being worth the money. That's always from the consumer perspective when people say "buy a used Prestige." 

It's not just a consumer consideration for guitars though. To bring back the car analogy, maybe not a 10-year-old BMW, but a 2016 coming off a lease is seen by a lot of people as a good deal when they can save $15k off the price of a 2019. The difference here is that the 2019 is actually updated, unlike a lot of guitars that maybe are just a new color or different bridge configuration. So guitars have the benefit of being even more attractive used—unless a particular finish/spec combo wasn't previously available. If you want new, whether a car, guitar or whatever, then yes, it doesn't matter. But the option is always there and something people have to decide for themselves if they're trying to make an informed purchase.


----------



## Sogradde

Imo the pricing of the RG 5xxx series is really competetive. It's a MIJ, cheaper than the Uppercut series, albeit being essentially the same guitar in a different (read: More exciting) colour, close to the price level of many modern MIK guitars. 
Premium and Iron/Axion Label models are genuinely out of control but Prestiges are on point.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Maximal said:


> But that's just not how the market works. If you put out the same product for 30 years and in this case a product that has no inherent expiry date, the used market will reduce your revenue. Most industries are very good at creating a demand for the new product, such that buying the old one feels like a compromise. This is one of the reasons why all tech companies try their best to put out a new killer in their phones feature every year. Car companies are also a great example of this, sure you can buy a ten-year-old car, but it will look old, miss all the new shenanigans and have a less efficient engine.
> Obviously, the guitar industry has all this vintage thing going on, but that's mostly Fender and Gibson territory. Ibanez has been the state of the art guitar 30 years ago, but they kept reiterating the same product over all those years without many changes, at least in the Prestige line. If you ask a 10-year-old kid to chose between a 2018 and 1998 BMW, I bet most will pick the newer one, just from an aesthetic standpoint because the older one looks stale in comparison. If you show the same kid two Ibanez guitars from 1998 and 2018, they probably won't be able to make any kind of justified decision. The weird thing is that they have a lot of more modern options in their line-up, but only in their lower-tier lines. If you want one of the Axion Label guitars you have to buy a new one, with a Prestige RG it is a completely different thing.



We're discussing two different points: demand vs. price.


----------



## Albake21

I just think they are slightly overpriced. Not too much, just like $100 to maybe $200 cheaper would be more ideal. With that said, even at the set prices you are getting a phenomenal guitar that's worth the price tag.


----------



## ExileMetal

I'm mostly tempted by the 6-string trem models and the 7 string fanned fret RGD and Yellow RG7.

I can't really justify 6-strings much because I just don't play 'em, and I've got this one on the way so I can't justify the other two since I already have too many 7's. Ahh well, we'll see. I mainly want to see the dark wood necks and fanned fret on Prestiges, no idea if it'll ever happen though. That dream might have died when Tosin left Ibanez.


----------



## diagrammatiks

A-Branger said:


> you missing the point of the example. see it as "car brand" not worrying about their "X" 10yr old model, you took it too literal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> then those poeple are not the target market for a brand. Those people are on the second hand market. Again, you cant compare one with the other. You want new?, you can only get it new..... you can get a really good care in mint condition instrument case queen never giged guitar. but it would never be "new"
> 
> 
> 
> Manufactures do not price their instruments around what the guitar center second hand section, pawn shops, and ebay are doing.... Their prices are made on the cost of the build, cost of R&D, marketing, wages, bussiness stuff, dealers/stores profit and their own profit. This made across the range.... Maybe MAYBE (random example that might wont apply to Ibanez) a X model prestige would be in theory "cheaper" to do than a premium, but perceived value comes into play there too. You cant have the lower tier brand be the more expensive choice, so you price the other higher to keep the ranks...... in theory, but some brands could play that as "here a cheap basic, but Jap made VS a top of the range full spec, but Indo"
> 
> Brands do not care about how are you re-selling their guitars for. But hey do care about the used market, as it shows them what models are popular, and which are in demand, so they can spec the next line to waht people "want"..... either in colors/wood/pickups/finishes/ect
> 
> 
> ^^ yup



Uhh how else are you supposed to take care. 

Car companies don’t care about 10 year old cars because they are garbage. 

Car companies care a shit load about previous model years and just off lease cars. That’s why the only reason cpo programs exist. 

You should absolutely care about your used stock if the thing your trying to sell is exactly the same as the thing you sold 10 years ago.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> I just think they are slightly overpriced. Not too much, just like $100 to maybe $200 cheaper would be more ideal. With that said, even at the set prices you are getting a phenomenal guitar that's worth the price tag.



On anything about $1k+ it's pretty easy to get $100 or $200 off. Remember, those prices are the minimum advertised price, not the lowest they can actually be sold for. Heck, even Ibanez Rules will sell you an "inspection only" model below MAP.


----------



## cardinal

With the JEM7VP, I'm hoping that the UV70P will be brought up to snuff maybe next year? It looks like the 70P specs were updated for this year (panga panga fretboard), but it sure would be nice to see a Lo Pro 7 on it (and necks that are centered, did they ever fix that?)


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Pretend I said Corolla.
> 
> I stand by my point: manufacturers aren't fighting their own used gear.



Maybe not manufacturers, but retailers definitely worry about the used market. When you can get a Schecter C1 for $500 in clean condition, and a new one is twice that, why would you buy the new one from the retailer? If manufacturers don’t consistently do interesting things each year, buying new isn’t as compelling.


----------



## FILTHnFEAR

A-Branger said:


> no matter how many times I hear the "get an used Prestige" to every argument. The times I decided to check the used market I never found one, and if I found one, it was no where near the mystical cheap figure everyone raves they are
> 
> Second hadn market dont dictates the prices for new gear



What you're missing on your first point is that you're in Australia. I get it, the used market there is limited. The great deals on used Prestige's you hear about from those of us in the States are not mythical. I can get on GC at any given time and have a rather nice selection of used Prestiges at good prices to choose from along with having a 30 day guaranteed return policy for whatever reason. That's not an option for everyone, I get, but it is for a lot of us. Hence why you hear about it so often.

On your 2nd point, you're correct, used prices aren't going to dictate what Ibanez will price their new guitars at, but those used prices will be a big consideration for those of us with a lot of options when making a purchase. At least for me it does. I'd love one of these 2019 Prestige Ibby 7 strings, and I might snag one, like the yellow 752 or that 2027xl, but at $1600-$1800(not complaining about price at all, I get it) I have to consider something used in the same quality/fit/finish range that is easily around $1000. So used prices/options do matter.


----------



## possumkiller

ExileMetal said:


>


Ibanez and ESP really need to let Nick design some standard models for them. This and that silver Horizon 7 are the coolest guitars I've seen in a while.


----------



## AirForbes1

I was hoping for more AZ models. Though it seems like the sigs are basically different finish AZs, I can't really see any differences just on specs alone (though I haven't done any real deep digging, TBH).


----------



## InCasinoOut

Looks like the CHON dudes are getting their own signature guitars, according to Mario's Instagram. They've been playing custom AZs for a while, turns out those must have been prototypes for the sigs. Mario's is lavender with a pearloid pickguard, sharkfin inlays, and HSS, and Erick's is flat black, gloss black pickguard, Tele single coil neck, HB bridge.

Good for them, those dudes deserve it. I remember first getting into CHON and they were shredding the shit out of cheapo RG421s!!

EDIT: LOL i'm late in the game. sorry guys.


----------



## I play music

FILTHnFEAR said:


> I can get on GC at any given time and have a rather nice selection of used Prestiges at good prices to choose from along with having a 30 day guaranteed return policy for whatever reason. That's not an option for everyone, I get, but it is for a lot of us.


I think that only exists in the U.S.A., I haven't seen guitar stores in Europe selling any used gear (except for special old Fender/Gibson stores etc. but that's something else...).


----------



## Siggevaio

I play music said:


> I think that only exists in the U.S.A., I haven't seen guitar stores in Europe selling any used gear (except for special old Fender/Gibson stores etc. but that's something else...).


That's common in Sweden as well, and probably the rest of Scandinavia. I don't think I've ever been in a music store where they don't sell used gear.


----------



## I play music

Siggevaio said:


> That's common in Sweden as well, and probably the rest of Scandinavia. I don't think I've ever been in a music store where they don't sell used gear.


Ok that's interesting. Do they also put used stuff online? The only thing I've seen in Germany was that one guy was allowed to let his amp in the show room after buying a new one and the store would sell it for him and give him the money *afterwards if it sells*. And that might have been an exception for a friend. I guess for most stores here buying used stuff is too risky because most of it might sit forever and take up important floor space. Or maybe they sometimes have 2 or 3 used guitars and I've just never noticed but I don't think so.


----------



## Ibanez Rules

Leviathus said:


> Triggered?





A-Branger said:


> I can let that one go because the swirl and because Mr Vai


I can't let that one go


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Maybe not manufacturers, but retailers definitely worry about the used market.



Do they though? Most retailers have a robust used business. Look at GC/MF, they have a whole branch of their business devoted to used gear that they paid pennies for. Then there's Music Go Round which is based almost entirely on used gear.


----------



## A-Branger

yes, theres a LOT of used guitars, that is what gonna happen after that many years. But with cars you can keep adding electronic aid stuff to "make it better" (which I dont agree) to rpevious years. But what can you do with guitars?, yes, there is some improvements here and there, but honestly there isnt much stuff "new" to keep adding. Other than a new combination of color/woods.

Yes, Ibanez was "the top of the spec modern guitars".... back in the day. They created themself their name. Now they know what sells, and what works for them. And what is "Ibanez". Same way you see Gibson/Fender "stuck on a look", Ibanez and every brand out there would be the same. And RG is an RG, and for them an RG means this X specs/looks

"why they sell black guitars-----because people buy black guitars-----because theres only black guitar to buy from----because people want black guitars"

Ibanez see what sells for them, so they stick with what they know, with a few "risk" here and there. Why the Prestige line still looks like a plain dark blue guitar?..... because thats what they sell for them, and because thats what they see fit for that line.

You want the fancy top/woods weird stuff of the premium line on a Prestige?..... its going to raise the price up, and eventually become a "JCustom" wihtout the label and the inlay.... get it now?


"but Ibanez doesnt innovate, look at those old basic Prestige RGs"....... then can I turn your head around to the AZ line???

again, Ibanez is on the bussiness to sell you a new guitar. IF you want an used prestige, then you are not the target market. But someone else will, because out there (believe it or not) someone wants a shinny brand new guitar from the store rack.


"but how Ibanez is gonna sell the same blue RG new when theres 1023091x used ones for half the price?"..... Same way as EBMM keeps selling the same 3 colors of their Stingray since 20 years, with little to no teaks and improvements over the years (except for the revamp of the last year stingrays, that would last another 20 yrs prob)



Ibanez Rules said:


> I can't let that one go


I was meaning to the clear pickguard.

someone suggested a clear pickguard for dont remember the model we were talking about. I say its blasphemy to think such things, as I dont agree with clear pickguards. Then they showed me the Jem, so I was like "ok ok, I can let that clear pickguard pass because it does looks awesome"


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Do they though? Most retailers have a robust used business. Look at GC/MF, they have a whole branch of their business devoted to used gear that they paid pennies for. Then there's Music Go Round which is based almost entirely on used gear.



A. I wouldn’t use those companies as shining examples in the MI industry at the moment and B. in the context of what new lines to carry? Yes. They worry about used gear. Worrying about making money and worrying about what to carry are two separate things.


----------



## Ibanez Rules

A-Branger said:


> I was meaning to the clear pickguard.
> 
> someone suggested a clear pickguard for dont remember the model we were talking about. I say its blasphemy to think such things, as I dont agree with clear pickguards. Then they showed me the Jem, so I was like "ok ok, I can let that clear pickguard pass because it does looks awesome"



It was the 752MDY, I knew what you meant, you said you could let that one go, and I was saying no way I could let that guitar go


----------



## Leviathus

Rich, upload a FTLOG cover on it!


----------



## cardinal

The RG80E is cool. The orange is a fun color and the EMGs are a nice upgrade to that model.


----------



## Ibanez Rules

Leviathus said:


> Rich, upload a FTLOG cover on it!


If I could do stuff like that my site wouldn't look like it did in the 90's


----------



## Leviathus

No sarcasm, i quite enjoy browsing ibanezrules.com, brings me back to the good old wild west internet days.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Leviathus said:


> No sarcasm, i quite enjoy browsing ibanezrules.com, brings me back to the good old wild west internet days.



Most of my browsing is on mobile and it's great having a basic, easy to navigate site.


----------



## Obsidian Soul

I was looking at random youtube videos of the new Ibanez guitars,and an unboxing/review video of the RGD61ALMS with a guy speaking another language with subtitles popped up.He had a few cosmetic blemishes,but then between the ringing and the battery compartment I resented the guitar...and it's not even mine!

I don't know if I can go back to Ibanez if their quality control is that bad.


----------



## sirbuh

axion pre-orders hitting sweetwater


----------



## BusinessMan

Triple-J said:


> Musicradar posted a preview with UK prices most of it's been seen here already but there's a FR model I haven't spotted elsewhere in the finish which seems to be the guitar trend of 2019.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.musicradar.com/news/namm-2019-ibanez-unveils-over-40-new-electric-guitars



Anyone else notice this seems to be the “in” finish?


----------



## MikeH

BusinessMan said:


> Anyone else notice this seems to be the “in” finish?


Honestly, I can’t fucking stand most of the gradient finishes. I do like the Luke Hoskins model, but that’s about all I’ve seen that looks good. Something about it looks incredibly cheap to me.


----------



## BigPhi84

Hello to all the old SS.org members. Sorry if you were bombarded by my "likes" on your posts. I just came in to do my yearly "Ibanez New Stuff" lurking. Can't believe I just read all 53 pages (25 of those pages must have been debates on Evertune Bridges, tonewood, "Ibanez messed up one spec from my dream guitar" and new vs. used prices! I guess SS.orgers haven't changed at all!) Glad to see so many old members still actively posting on this site. I wish I had the time and discipline to be an active member. Miss you all very much. Take care, and I hope that 2019 is a great year for you!


----------



## Samark

LeviathanKiller said:


> Interesting
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/alt30_5b_01.html



Ugly as sin. But, that ol' school Ibanez logo is perfection


----------



## cardinal

Finally a 7-string RGA with a tremolo
https://reverb.com/item/18035655-pr...string-electric-guitar-blue-lagoon-burst-flat


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Finally a 7-string RGA with a tremolo
> https://reverb.com/item/18035655-pr...string-electric-guitar-blue-lagoon-burst-flat



To be fair they did have the RGA427Z some years back, MIJ RGA 7 with a trem. It just suffered from poor pickups in soap bar housings (before everyone had a soap bar option) and it was pretty expensive for what it was.

But this actually seems nicer looking. The price is good too.


----------



## cardinal

MaxOfMetal said:


> To be fair they did have the RGA427Z some years back, MIJ RGA 7 with a trem. It just suffered from poor pickups in soap bar housings (before everyone had a soap bar option) and it was pretty expensive for what it was.
> 
> But this actually seems nicer looking. The price is good too.



Forgot about that one. Man I hated that iteration of the RGA shape. My fav was the one with no scoops on the horns, but that RGA427Z had scoops but no binding along the horns which looked terrible to me, plus the soap bars. What should have been an epic guitar instead I thought was awful.


----------



## BusinessMan

MikeH said:


> Honestly, I can’t fucking stand most of the gradient finishes. I do like the Luke Hoskins model, but that’s about all I’ve seen that looks good. Something about it looks incredibly cheap to me.



I agree. The only one I like is the red tide finish on the most recent Jackson demmelitions. Even then, it’s hard to mess up a black/red finish


----------



## Randy

BusinessMan said:


> Anyone else notice this seems to be the “in” finish?



Not a coincidence. Just like the poplar burl burst trend, all these guitars are made in the same couple of factories and they likely retool for a couple new techniques every year and offer it to the companies they build for.


----------



## jwade

Kind of a huge bummer that Ibanez is using Nyatoh.


----------



## gunch

Nyantoh :3c


----------



## Andromalia

=^^=


----------



## Albake21

cardinal said:


> Forgot about that one. Man I hated that iteration of the RGA shape. My fav was the one with no scoops on the horns, but that RGA427Z had scoops but no binding along the horns which looked terrible to me, plus the soap bars. What should have been an epic guitar instead I thought was awful.


Agreed, but I'll take any damn MIJ RGA now a days.


----------



## Jake

Albake21 said:


> Agreed, but I'll take any damn MIJ RGA now a days.


If they could just give me one Prestige RGA again I would be happy 

I guess the JBM100 does the trick for me for now though. But I'd like more haha


----------



## MatiasTolkki

jwade said:


> Kind of a huge bummer that Ibanez is using Nyatoh.



Why? They can get it easier for their indonesian factories, and only snobs would actually diss a wood because it's "cheap." Hey wait, Jeff Kiesel likes to bash Basswood all the time but it has served Ibanez well for decades


----------



## bmth4111

I'm surprised no one is really going in on how damn ugly that rg752m is. I mean holyshit such great guitar specs (everything I want) but Ibanez continuously chooses shit colors for the guitar. I really want a new rg752m just cant stomach the recent colors. I just pray that they give us more colors for the model this year.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

bmth4111 said:


> I'm surprised no one is really going in on how damn ugly that rg752m is. I mean holyshit such great guitar specs (everything I want) but Ibanez continuously chooses shit colors for the guitar. I really want a new rg752m just cant stomach the recent colors. I just pray that they give us more colors for the model this year.



The yellow one? That thing is yummy.


----------



## bmth4111

Yeah, way to bright for me haha. And last years trans blue with the hideous binding makes me sad.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

bmth4111 said:


> Yeah, way to bright for me haha. And last years trans blue with the hideous binding makes me sad.



Oh that burl or spalted top one? Yeah that was ugly as sin. Ibanez trying to be Jeff Kiesel only makes Ibanez look bad.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MatiasTolkki said:


> Oh that burl or spalted top one? Yeah that was ugly as sin. Ibanez trying to be Jeff Kiesel only makes Ibanez look bad.



I don't believe they did a burl or spalted RG752M. Though, they did so many spot models of those I might be forgetting one.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

MaxOfMetal said:


> I don't believe they did a burl or spalted RG752M. Though, they did so many spot models of those I might be forgetting one.



Maybe it was a premium, I cant keep track of all the guitars ibanez pumps out anymore...


----------



## jwoods986

Finally, some 6-string, H/H, Lo-Pro guitars! The last couple years have been frustrating, with some guitars so close - RG652 and 752 for example, but one of those 3 key elements (for me) missing.


----------



## Xaios

bmth4111 said:


> I'm surprised no one is really going in on how damn _*AWESOME*_ that rg752m is.


FTFY.


----------



## Surveyor 777

Xaios said:


> FTFY.



Yeah, I hadn't planned on getting another RG for a long time (and probably won't) but that yellow RG752 REALLY tempts me.


----------



## eightsixboy

The yellow RG752M is sick. Whats not to like? They have already had a limited see-through white, the AHM blue burst, blue and black with trems. Bout time they did a crazy non boring colour 7 string with a trem imo. 

Depending on the price for the green 5000 series this year might be the first in a while I don't buy any new Ibanez. Gotta love been in Australia as we are probably the only market to NOT get the 752M. WTF Ibanez seriously.


----------



## Curt

eightsixboy said:


> The yellow RG752M is sick. Whats not to like?




25.5" scale is what. 

If the 2027xl was getting the eye burning yellow treatment I would jump on it so fast.

But I pretty much only tune to drop G# or drop F# or some variation thereof, and 25.5" just does not cut it below drop A without needing mega thick and unmusical strings


----------



## Hollowway

Curt said:


> 25.5" scale is what.
> 
> If the 2027xl was getting the eye burning yellow treatment I would jump on it so fast.
> 
> But I pretty much only tune to drop G# or drop F# or some variation thereof, and 25.5" just does not cut it below drop A without needing mega thick and unmusical strings



You’re a better man than I am, because I was just going to say “fretboard dots.”  It’s 2019 people, we have a CNC. Let’s retire the dots and do something cool. Or nothing. Or offset. I don’t really care, but please, no more centered, normal sized dots. /rant


----------



## possumkiller

What's wrong with dots?


----------



## Exchanger

To me it makes it look like a piece of old furniture or board game. Imagine putting a Bigsby trem on a multiscale RG. Vintage can be nice, but that would just look out of place.


----------



## lurè

I'm fine with the 25.5" scale and I love dots and fret inlays in general. Probably will never buy a guitar with no inlays; I'd rather have those abalone bars then a clean fretboard.

I agree the yellow rg is tasty af but this 6 string prestige 5120m looks absolutely fabolous on Thomann video. It's a shame It doesnt come in 7string.


----------



## Lindmann

possumkiller said:


> What's wrong with dots?


They are boring.
Same old dots time and time again.


----------



## Sephiroth952

I hope the new 550DX's sell well, maybe then Ibanez will bring back more sharkie equipped models, or even better the ghost sharkies.


----------



## cardinal

Lindmann said:


> They are boring.
> Same old dots time and time again.



Schecter has shown time and again that there are far worse things than dots.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Sephiroth952 said:


> I hope the new 550DX's sell well, maybe then Ibanez will bring back more sharkie equipped models, or even better the ghost sharkies.



Ghost sharks are pretty cool; I could get into that.
Can't stand standard dots but I really like the small dots like they used on the SV5470 though, or even smaller offset dots.


----------



## Lindmann

cardinal said:


> Schecter has shown time and again that there are far worse things than dots.


I actually liked the Gothic cross inlays that the hellraiser had.
But...yeah...matter of taste.

There are more important things than inlays but I wished the guitar manufacturers where less tradition-oriented with inlays.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Dots or nothing for me.


----------



## Sephiroth952

I loved the full sized offsets on the original premium run.


----------



## BTS

I was worried i wouldnt like the centered dots on a recently acquired rg... and... it turns out it doeent matter to me at all, in fact, its been nice having them.


----------



## Miek

yeah I've got normal ass dots on my rgr652 and I really don't mind in general. think it doesn't fit the vibe if the guitar but the dots themselves are really nice up close


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Big black center dots on maple look cool to me - a reminder of strat pedigree.
But on bound black fretboard i prefer offset dots - JPM layout.


----------



## Vyn

Can confirm that Australian dealers are getting MSRP price lists either on Friday or Monday.


----------



## mlp187

Sephiroth952 said:


> I loved the full sized offsets on the original premium run.


Gorgeous, Sephiroth. The guitar is too. 
I’m still upset about Ibanez cheaping out on the cases.


----------



## jwade

MatiasTolkki said:


> Why? They can get it easier for their indonesian factories, and only snobs would actually diss a wood because it's "cheap." Hey wait, Jeff Kiesel likes to bash Basswood all the time but it has served Ibanez well for decades


You're making assumptions about why I'd consider it a bad thing. Nothing in your post has any relevance whatsoever to the fact that nyatoh is part of yet another nearly endangered species that is (surprise surprise) being overharvested heavily, to the point that massive sections of rainforest are being destroyed, villages being pushed out of ancestral areas, animals are losing their habitats, etc etc. 

Ibanez jumping on board to contribute to severe overharvesting in the rainforests is a bummer.


----------



## I play music

jwade said:


> You're making assumptions about why I'd consider it a bad thing. Nothing in your post has any relevance whatsoever to the fact that nyatoh is part of yet another nearly endangered species that is (surprise surprise) being overharvested heavily, to the point that massive sections of rainforest are being destroyed, villages being pushed out of ancestral areas, animals are losing their habitats, etc etc.
> 
> Ibanez jumping on board to contribute to severe overharvesting in the rainforests is a bummer.


I totally agree with your opinion but you already could have given reasoning when you first posted about nyatoh because after someone complaining about the color of a certain wood it's easy to think your complain is similar...when actually you have a point.


----------



## Xaios

cardinal said:


> Schecter has shown time and again that there are far worse things than dots.


There are fouler things than dots in the deep places of the NAMM.


----------



## Hollowway

Xaios said:


> There are fouler things than dots in the deep places of the NAMM.



A couple of guys at the local music store were telling me that in the '80s Dean Zelinksy would hire these girls off the street to hang out at the booth, and if you put in a big enough order for Dean instruments he would send one of the girls back to your hotel room. They said it was just crazy in the '80s.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

I play music said:


> I totally agree with your opinion but you already could have given reasoning when you first posted about nyatoh because after someone complaining about the color of a certain wood it's easy to think your complain is similar...when actually you have a point.



This is why being CLEAR in what you want to say is important.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Some stray observations I've got while browsing through the updated site:

They've brought back the SRC6 (with changed wood specs) and the AE255BT. Really cool to see them back at the roster. I might have to snag one of each before I miss out again...
The Talman guitar line is gone. A bit sad as they were fine instruments, but since I already own 2 (in strat and tele spec) so I'm not all too fussed. The Talman bass line is still around.


----------



## Given To Fly

Xaios said:


> There are fouler things than dots in the deep places of the NAMM.


Tradition?
Dots are traditional. They work as guides on the fretboard which was probably considered an innovation at one point. For the RG752MDY, the might be traditional, but they also look really good. They tie the aesthetics of the headstock with the aesthetics of the body together using the neck which highlights the symmetry of the 7 strings. 
I would not take the road through Mor...NAMM unless I had no other choice.


----------



## spudmunkey

jwade said:


> nyatoh is part of yet another nearly endangered species that is (surprise surprise) being overharvested heavily, to the point that massive sections of rainforest are being destroyed, villages being pushed out of ancestral areas, animals are losing their habitats, etc etc.
> 
> Ibanez jumping on board to contribute to severe overharvesting in the rainforests is a bummer.



Is it really? I always thought it was the "safer" option compared to teak. the wikipedia article for the wood is a bit odd...it says it's both a sustainable resource, and yet later says that environmental groups have raised concerns about excessive harvesting and deforestation. I used to work for a company that used to sell teak outdoor furniture, and then we had 3 "value" lines that were made from plantation-grown Nyatoh. Compared to teak, it was supposed to be the more 'responsible' option...but unfortunately, because it grew so much quicker, it was so much softer and aged so muhc more poorly...you'd probably have to replace it 2 or 3 times in the same lifespan of a teak set.


----------



## I play music

spudmunkey said:


> Is it really? I always thought it was the "safer" option compared to teak. the wikipedia article for the wood is a bit odd...it says it's both a sustainable resource, and yet later says that environmental groups have raised concerns about excessive harvesting and deforestation. I used to work for a company that used to sell teak outdoor furniture, and then we had 3 "value" lines that were made from plantation-grown Nyatoh. Compared to teak, it was supposed to be the more 'responsible' option...but unfortunately, because it grew so much quicker, it was so much softer and aged so muhc more poorly...you'd probably have to replace it 2 or 3 times in the same lifespan of a teak set.


Actually I have no idea but I think to have heard that Nyatoh is a whole family of species so it would be possibly that some Nyatoh species is endangered and some other is not.


----------



## Metropolis

Axion Label pricing is ridiculous, from 999 euro's to 1299. You can buy a RG652 in that price range.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Metropolis said:


> Axion Label pricing is ridiculous, from 999 euro's to 1299. You can buy a RG652 in that price range.



Yeah, but the kind of player who wants an Axion isn't into such antiquated guitars as simple RGs with DiMarzios. They're too progressive for that.


----------



## Sogradde

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?


That's about half the money I'd have to pay for an RGA in germoney so go for it?
The only "cheap" RGA (which still costs more than yours does) is this one, with doggo bite marks. You know, for that extra _*bite *_in your toanz!_ 


_


----------



## Albake21

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?
> 
> View attachment 66172
> View attachment 66173


Damn for that price, I'd snatch that up and pay for a nice refinish.


----------



## Exchanger

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, but the kind of player who wants an Axion isn't into such antiquated guitars as simple RGs with DiMarzios. They're too progressive for that.



I'm a proghead and I'm happy with RG's + DiMarzios (among other things). Those Axion thingies do have interesting look and specs, albeit a bit weird (the "only on the edge" chameleon, cool, but for me doesn't match well with the RGDIX bevel). But yeah, they're a bit pricy for what it is and I'd have to thin out my collection first.


----------



## prlgmnr

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?
> 
> View attachment 66172
> View attachment 66173


Can confirm proceed on chosen course and initiate purchase.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?



In a heartbeat. I wouldn't even refinish it; the VLF finish is one of my favorites they've done. Does mark easy, though.


----------



## possumkiller

Exchanger said:


> (the "only on the edge" chameleon, cool, but for me doesn't match well with the RGDIX bevel)


Yeah it's not even only on the edge. It's like only on the inner edge of the outer edge lol.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?
> 
> View attachment 66172
> View attachment 66173


 Considering the upgraded pickups (all you really would want/need to mod one of these with as everything else is good) and if the frets are in decent condition I'd say it's worth it.


----------



## kamello

TheUnknownOne said:


> Off-topic but boys, I found that used RGA nearby with Nazgul/Sentient pickups. The owner wants 400€, but I might consider a refinish. Should I pull the trigger ?
> 
> View attachment 66172
> View attachment 66173




DOOO EEEEEEEEEEET!
I miss my RGA 321 so much


----------



## MatiasTolkki

People crying about inlays when the purpose of inlays is to know what fret you're on. Who the hell cares whether they're dots or sharkteeth? Does a PICTURE affect your playing? If so, you need to get back to practicing.


----------



## xzacx

MatiasTolkki said:


> People crying about inlays when the purpose of inlays is to know what fret you're on. Who the hell cares whether they're dots or sharkteeth? Does a PICTURE affect your playing? If so, you need to get back to practicing.



Why care what finish a guitar has in that case? Does a COLOR affect your playing? Of course not, but if people are spending good money on a guitar they obviously want to like how it looks too. Not that crazy of a concept.


----------



## ThePIGI King

xzacx said:


> Why care what finish a guitar has in that case? Does a COLOR affect your playing? Of course not, but if people are spending good money on a guitar they obviously want to like how it looks too. Not that crazy of a concept.


#SilkOrSatin


----------



## Sephiroth952

MatiasTolkki said:


> People crying about inlays when the purpose of inlays is to know what fret you're on. Who the hell cares whether they're dots or sharkteeth? Does a PICTURE affect your playing? If so, you need to get back to practicing.


Man its almost as if part of buying a guitar is its aesthetic or something.


----------



## Vyn

Interesting to note that while a number of endorsed but non-sig artists have LACS Icemans of various specs now, it would be a great chance to bring back the ICT500/ICT700 or something along those lines as the only options are either Sam Totemans Sig (which IMO has been shafted specs wise to make it cheaper but then again that could also be what specs he prefers now) or a Paul Stanley Sig.


----------



## Hollowway

MatiasTolkki said:


> People crying about inlays when the purpose of inlays is to know what fret you're on. Who the hell cares whether they're dots or sharkteeth? Does a PICTURE affect your playing? If so, you need to get back to practicing.



Cool looking guitars literally make me want to practice.


----------



## Sephiroth952

Vyn said:


> Interesting to note that while a number of endorsed but non-sig artists have LACS Icemans of various specs now, it would be a great chance to bring back the ICT500/ICT700 or something along those lines as the only options are either Sam Totemans Sig (which IMO has been shafted specs wise to make it cheaper but then again that could also be what specs he prefers now) or a Paul Stanley Sig.


Do you mean you want more iceman sigs or just icemans in general? Because they currently do offer a non-sig model as well.

https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/ic520_03.html


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Sephiroth952 said:


> Do you mean you want more iceman sigs or just icemans in general? Because they currently do offer a non-sig model as well.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/ic520_03.html



That Iceman model isn't available in the AU site unfortunately. There are some rare occurrences when a few models that aren't region available show up, but I doubt these will for the most part.


----------



## Vyn

Sephiroth952 said:


> Do you mean you want more iceman sigs or just icemans in general? Because they currently do offer a non-sig model as well.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/usa/products/detail/ic520_03.html



@Bloody_Inferno beat me too it. That model isn't available to us.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

On the inlay thing... I think there’s a big difference between “I don’t like it” and the often used excuse of, “I find it confusing when inlays aren’t _insert whatever fossilised mammoth shell in the shape of a potato_ _is flavour of the month this month”._

Folks should just be more honest and say, ‘I don’t like these’, or ‘I prefer something else’... otherwise Matias’ point stands, and those guys need more woodshed.
_
_


----------



## jwade

I play music said:


> I totally agree with your opinion but you already could have given reasoning when you first posted about nyatoh because after someone complaining about the color of a certain wood it's easy to think your complain is similar...when actually you have a point.


I had pasted a link to an article that talked about nyatoh but it apparently was deleted for some reason. Here it is again: http://www.rainforestrelief.org/Wha.../By_Tree_Species/Tropical_Woods/N/Nyatoh.html


----------



## prlgmnr

_MonSTeR_ said:


> On the inlay thing... I think there’s a big difference between “I don’t like it” and the often used excuse of, “I find it confusing when inlays aren’t _insert whatever fossilised mammoth shell in the shape of a potato_ _is flavour of the month this month”._
> 
> Folks should just be more honest and say, ‘I don’t like these’, or ‘I prefer something else’... otherwise Matias’ point stands, and those guys need more woodshed.


It really ought to go without saying that when I, or someone, says "this fucking shithouse thing doesn't look much better than that PRS where someone rough-cut a great chunk out of the body", or whatever, that we're not speaking to some great objective truth but simply delivering our own personal opinion on the matter.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

prlgmnr said:


> It really ought to go without saying that when I, or someone, says "this fucking shithouse thing doesn't look much better than that PRS where someone rough-cut a great chunk out of the body", or whatever, that we're not speaking to some great objective truth but simply delivering our own personal opinion on the matter.



False. My opinions are all divine truth.


----------



## ThePIGI King

Ordacleaphobia said:


> False. My opinions are all divine truth.


I tell my girlfriend and boss that all the time, and for whatever reason I'm still not making a ton or getting breakfast in bed...


----------



## Andromalia

I just saw that my "spend on music stuff" fund is in the green again. Tempted by either the S with the wenge neck (I like my Ibanez SR bass with a similar neck a lot) or go dwarf and pick that gold(en) RG.



> False. My opinions are all divine truth.



Yeah but at three believers that's a pretty small divine truth.


----------



## LordHar

https://issuu.com/ibanezgermany/docs/_ibanez_katalog2019_web_doppelseite

Complete (european) catalog


----------



## cardinal

Kind of a weird thing to obsess over, but I really want that STX5E guitar stand in that catalog and can't find something similar in the US market. Hopefully it's coming State side.

https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/stx5e_01.html

I like stands that don't end up with any pressure on the neck one way or another.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> Kind of a weird thing to obsess over, but I really want that STX5E guitar stand in that catalog and can't find something similar in the US market. Hopefully it's coming State side.
> 
> https://www.ibanez.com/eu/products/detail/stx5e_01.html
> 
> I like stands that don't end up with any pressure on the neck one way or another.



There's a three guitar version on Amazon for $30.

Not Ibanez brand, or five guitars, but maybe worth a look. Sorry, no link, I'm on mobile.

EDIT: ChromaCast Multiple Guitar Stand (CC-TGS) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01G4B2X2Q/?tag=sevenstringorg-20


----------



## diagrammatiks

The new line and naming scheme doesn’t make any sense. 

The s61al looks awesome though. I wish they could put all the s specs I want into one guitar tho


----------



## cardinal

MaxOfMetal said:


> There's a three guitar version on Amazon for $30.
> 
> Not Ibanez brand, or five guitars, but maybe worth a look. Sorry, no link, I'm on mobile.
> 
> EDIT: ChromaCast Multiple Guitar Stand (CC-TGS) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01G4B2X2Q/?tag=sevenstringorg-20



Thanks. Unfortunately, given my failings, a few 5-guitar stands would work a lot better for me than the 3-guitar stands.


----------



## TheUnknownOne

Some models have been added to thomann's catalog. The new S61AL is 1000€ which seems fair for the specs if you don't mind an indo guitar.
New kiesel-like RGDs are 1000 bucks too, which seems pricey because you don't get the fishmans or bkps for that price...
However the prestiges are a bit pricey : 1799€ for an RG5121 and 1.999€ (!) for the RG5120 with maple fretboard


----------



## I play music

TheUnknownOne said:


> Some models have been added to thomann's catalog. The new S61AL is 1000€ which seems fair for the specs if you don't mind an indo guitar.
> New kiesel-like RGDs are 1000 bucks too, which seems pricey because you don't get the fishmans or bkps for that price...
> However the prestiges are a bit pricey : 1799€ for an RG5121 and 1.999€ (!) for the RG5120 with maple fretboard


Here are all the new Thomann Ibanez prices for anyone interested: https://www.thomann.de/de/search_dir.html?oa=rel&sw=ibanez
I was surprised to find the RGD "Axe Place" in the list: https://www.thomann.de/de/ibanez_rgdr7ucs_dyf.htm
Wish it was an RG XL instead of RGD


----------



## Sogradde

TheUnknownOne said:


> However the prestiges are a bit pricey : 1799€ for an RG5121 and 1.999€ (!) for the RG5120 with maple fretboard


They're about 400€ cheaper than the RG6UCS so that's cool in my book. SS frets have become really important to me as the standard nickel frets on Ibanez guitars are simply too soft for me. I've had my S6521Q for about 7 months now and there are already significant creases in the frets. Getting my frets dressed is really expensive and right now I don't have the space nor tools to do anything that goes beyond a pickup swap myself.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum




----------



## nsimonsen

Is anyone else really put off by the black bridge on the new JBM, considering the pickups and tuners are gold?

Such a cool guitar, but every time I see it.......that little detail puts me off.


----------



## mlp187

nsimonsen said:


> Is anyone else really put off by the black bridge on the new JBM, considering the pickups and tuners are gold?
> 
> Such a cool guitar, but every time I see it.......that little detail puts me off.


Well goddamnit. I am now!


----------



## Albake21

nsimonsen said:


> Is anyone else really put off by the black bridge on the new JBM, considering the pickups and tuners are gold?
> 
> Such a cool guitar, but every time I see it.......that little detail puts me off.


His other sigs are like that too. Honestly I much prefer it, especially on the white. Too much gold looks gaudy. Either black pickups and gold bridge or gold pickups and black bridge IMO.


----------



## Curt

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, but the kind of player who wants an Axion isn't into such antiquated guitars as simple RGs with DiMarzios. They're too progressive for that.


TBH I'd love a simple RG with Dimarzios. Just not Dimarzio PAF7s. Honestly Though, as much as I was considering the $1200 Axion RGD, I might just find an old Vampire Kiss 7620, throw an imperium set in it and call it a day.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

nsimonsen said:


> Is anyone else really put off by the black bridge on the new JBM, considering the pickups and tuners are gold?
> 
> Such a cool guitar, but every time I see it.......that little detail puts me off.



Yep, something would have to go, either the gold or the black, it’s all supposed to match in my book. On the JBM100, the bridge is black and the rest of the hardware is gold, but the guitar itself is black so I don’t mind.

But there’s one guy on here (sorry can’t remember who you are) that changed out the black bridge on this 100 for gold and it looks amazing...


----------



## soldierkahn

Hollowway said:


> You’re a better man than I am, because I was just going to say “fretboard dots.”  It’s 2019 people, we have a CNC. Let’s retire the dots and do something cool. Or nothing. Or offset. I don’t really care, but please, no more centered, normal sized dots. /rant




For the love of God yes. this. lol

The only fix Ive found for those dull and centered dots is to cast glow in the dark replacements. While their position annoys me without the benefit of the glow, with the glow, i actually like for them to be centered because more of the fretboard lights up


----------



## Leviathus

So will there or will there not be any show only release Ibby's unveiled this week at NAMM? I'm hoping yes, but not getting my hopes up.


----------



## soldierkahn

nsimonsen said:


> Is anyone else really put off by the black bridge on the new JBM, considering the pickups and tuners are gold?
> 
> Such a cool guitar, but every time I see it.......that little detail puts me off.



I wasnt a fan of the blending of the three colors. It would be great either being grey and black, or grey and gold. Me personally, if I was gonna settle on the JBM to satisfy my Prestige RGA needs, I think i was swap all the hardware for the new cosmo black. I know im gonna catch a lot of hell for that choice, but after seeing how it looked brand new on the DCM100, i really liked it alot.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Leviathus said:


> So will there or will there not be any show only release Ibby's unveiled this week at NAMM? I'm hoping yes, but not getting my hopes up.



There might be a few Summer 2019 models being previewed at the show, along with any limited models not announced, but every regular catalog model has been shown.


----------



## jwoods986

It's gotten to be like the SuperBowl ads, showing them before the show, WTF?


----------



## cardinal

Some of the new models are showing up at Ikebe. The RG5328 looks great IMHO

https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/614026

The 752MDY looks AWESOME here.

https://www.ikebe-gakki.com/ec/pro/disp/1/613701


----------



## StevenC

Come on, Ibanez. I'll even settle for a Maxxas reissue with only 6 or 7 strings.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

StevenC said:


> Come on, Ibanez. I'll even settle for a Maxxas reissue with only 6 or 7 strings.



Given the history, you'd think they would have done _something_ with the Maxxas by now.


----------



## cardinal

Things like the Maxxas are the reason Ibanez needs to turn lose its Bass Workshop guys on the guitar range. Some of those basses are just wild and pretty entertaining. It'd be fun to see that way out-side-the-box thinking directed to a few guitars.


----------



## spudmunkey

Leviathus said:


> So will there or will there not be any show only release Ibby's unveiled this week at NAMM? I'm hoping yes, but not getting my hopes up.



It's all about getting maximum exposure. Like CES, people often schedule their booth visits in advance, especially if they have interviews lined up. So if a maker has a new model to show off, they will want to make sure that everyone knows about it and works it into their plans, rather than announcing it AT the show, some people might miss it either by just not be able to work another stop into their schedule, or they might just not actually hear about it until then.

It's like retailers putting out their summer clothes in February...they want it in front of customers' faces so that when they ARE in the market, they've already seen their goods for 3 months, so it's already on their mind and it isn't up to the consumer to stumble across it in the short window when they are actually shopping.


----------



## Leviathus

They've waited until the show for plenty of unvailings in the past, remember this just a few years ago...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Leviathus said:


> They've waited until the show for plenty of unvailings in the past, remember this just a few years ago...



Like I said, limited editions are often left till the show, but this isn't an anniversary year, to my knowledge. Maybe we'll see something neat?


----------



## Albake21

I just want this guitar... Damn you Japan and your exclusives!


----------



## odibrom

I was afraid this one had the block heel... it hasn't!, it's the AANJ...






It's tempting, just for the color it has...


----------



## cardinal

odibrom said:


> I was afraid this one had the block heel... it hasn't!, it's the AANJ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's tempting, just for the color it has...



The pics on the Ibanez website make it look lame. But here, you can see the glory of the DY finish, and wow I really love it.


----------



## Surveyor 777

The 752 was tempting for me and I finally decided that I am planning to get it. I love the color and I want another 7.


----------



## StevenC

MaxOfMetal said:


> Like I said, limited editions are often left till the show, but this isn't an anniversary year, to my knowledge. Maybe we'll see something neat?


30th anniversary of the last year of the Maxxas!!!!

MX5 with and Edge and 8 strings, please Ibanez!


----------



## odibrom

cardinal said:


> The pics on the Ibanez website make it look lame. But here, you can see the glory of the DY finish, and wow I really love it.



My financial status has improved a little this year so I might be on the look out for more guitars (7s only). The Ibanez catalogue has 3 contenders, the Green, the Blue and the Yellow... The green is way cool but is fixed, the others are top, but are basswood... I'd so much prefer mahogany on those. It resonates with me better...


----------



## Hollowway

soldierkahn said:


> For the love of God yes. this. lol
> 
> The only fix Ive found for those dull and centered dots is to cast glow in *the dark replacements*. While their position annoys me without the benefit of the glow, with the glow, i actually like for them to be centered because more of the fretboard lights up



Just found my next band name in your sentence. The Dark Replacements will be my new edgy metal alternative act.


----------



## Hollowway

Leviathus said:


> So will there or will there not be any show only release Ibby's unveiled this week at NAMM? I'm hoping yes, but not getting my hopes up.



I hope so, too. I'm hoping so from ALL the major manufacturers.


----------



## Miek

this year's fujigen offerings for solid body players are pretty tight. not into axion label at all.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

cardinal said:


> The pics on the Ibanez website make it look lame. But here, you can see the glory of the DY finish, and wow I really love it.



I'd probably split the difference between the two. It'll be bright, and looks to be much closer to the original DY than the RG550XX models, but it probably won't be always-in-a-lightbox bright.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum




----------



## lewis

XIPHOS?
XIPHOs
XIPHos
XIPhos
XIphos
Xiphos
xiphos
xipho
xiph
xip
xi
x
.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

AkiraSpectrum said:


>




Fuck yeah! A not stupid PGM! I'm into it.


----------



## xzacx

AkiraSpectrum said:


>




I don't think I'd actually buy it, but this is so cool. Any excuse for a new video of Paul playing is good enough for me too.


----------



## toiletstand

Thats a sick looking guitar


----------



## Leviathus

Who saw this one coming? Super cool, glad it's Fujigen too. Wonder what MAP will be...


----------



## cardinal

^ Great news for a Fujigen build for one of these Anniversary sig models. The Sugi builds are awesome but man those prices...


----------



## Leviathus

And lol @ his Sgt. Peppers jacket.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

Here's a review:


----------



## StevenC

So much for the pink Destroyer...


----------



## Seabeast2000

Cool, never saw any PGM up close. Is body the same cut as an RG?


----------



## bnzboy

Man Paul is such a nice cool dude. He responded to my email when I sent questions about his gear back in my highschool days. Good to see he is s till going fresh and strong!


----------



## 77zark77

looks and sounds good ! too bad I just bought a PGM301 ! NGD in a few days...


----------



## Jeff

AkiraSpectrum said:


>




That looks awesome


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

MaxOfMetal said:


> Fuck yeah! A not stupid PGM! I'm into it.



Hey, those Firemen are awesome. You take that back! 

All seriousness that new PGM looks great and those PG13s sound awesome.


----------



## USMarine75

That PGM is perfect. 

I pre-ordered one of these because I had points and it only cost me $170.


----------



## 77zark77

^This one also is tempting me. Please tell us, when it's in your hands if there's a dot (or not) at 21th fret !


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Albake21 said:


> I just want this guitar... Damn you Japan and your exclusives!



HAHAHAHA We deserve some love over here, considering Ikebe gets all the good stuff and it NEVER trickles here into Nagoya... You would think it would when this is where Hoshino gakki's head offices are but whatever the fuck.


----------



## BigViolin

"I got carried away"

I like when Paul gets carried away.


----------



## Seabeast2000

$2599 street.


----------



## Leviathus

Blown away someone hasn't criticized Paul's abhorrent "thumb over the neck" technique yet, what a noob....


----------



## eightsixboy

Leviathus said:


> Blown away someone hasn't criticized Paul's abhorrent "thumb over the neck" technique yet, what a noob....



His hands are so big i don't think he has a choice or would make any difference for him.


----------



## Vyn

So my local received a shipment of most of the Iron Label/Axion Label guitars yesterday. The XL example they received was flawless and played extremely well, they've done a great job on them. The Axion Label stuff is really nice, the quality is about the same as Iron Label bit with more insane specs.

Me spending the day in Seven Heaven:


----------



## Sogradde

Vyn said:


> The Axion Label stuff is really nice, the quality is about the same as Iron Label


Shame. :/


----------



## Miek

I know I'm biased but my hand hurt looking at that pic. I could feel the phantom frets digging into my hands. to be fair, only my rgaix7 had fretsprout, the S was immaculate


----------



## Vyn

Sogradde said:


> Shame. :/



Was to be expected though - same factory and the difference in specs is reflected in the price. That being said, the examples the store got have all been very good, our distribution network here takes care of use with QC really well.


----------



## Albake21

Wow Ibanez is usually really late at getting models into stores. That XL actually looks pretty cool.


----------



## Miek

I know I'm in the minority but nothing except the new pgm appeals to me. axion label is mostly tasteless to me, and most new prestiges, while dope, offer nothing new to me


----------



## Miek

but the new pgm IS cool as hell


----------



## Emperor Guillotine

So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.

(And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperor Guillotine said:


> So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.
> 
> (And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)



I'm pretty sure they'll give anyone an AZ signature model right now. They're pushing that series like crazy. 

So if anyone out there wants an Ibby contract, start playing AZs.


----------



## Restarted

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm pretty sure they'll give anyone an AZ signature model right now. They're pushing that series like crazy.
> 
> So if anyone out there wants an Ibby contract, start playing AZs.



Sounds good to me. The prestige AZ I tried was better than any other Ibanez I've ever played by miles. They did a great job with those for sure. 

Personally I really want that purple AS hollowbody. Already told my wife I'm getting it when I have the chance


----------



## lewis

Emperor Guillotine said:


> So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.
> 
> (And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)


probably why some of the industry's most respected, are jumping ship.

I see Dino Cazares is the latest > Ormsby


----------



## MaxOfMetal

lewis said:


> probably why some of the industry's most respected, are jumping ship.
> 
> I see Dino Cazares is the latest > Ormsby



Artists go where the money and exposure (which in itself leads to more money) are. 

They have to eat, and further thier careers. It's just how it goes.


----------



## Andromalia

Not sure Dino's going to get rich by going to a small scale australian company. Even if they order stuff from WMI nobody other than gear nuts have ever heard of them, and half of those likely following the "controversies" and facebook drama.


----------



## Bastian93

MaxOfMetal said:


> Artists go where the money and exposure (which in itself leads to more money) are.
> 
> They have to eat, and further thier careers. It's just how it goes.



And companies go to artists where they get exposure for their brand as well. Looking at the instagram numbers Polyphia (149k followers) is almost as big as Paul Gilbert (190k). It´s not like the Polyphia guys are unknown nobodies.
Those numbers might not be important for us and I´m not saying thats they way it should be, but I´m sure the marketing department of Ibanez is happy that they have those guys on board.


----------



## Albake21

Miek said:


> I know I'm in the minority but nothing except the new pgm appeals to me. axion label is mostly tasteless to me, and most new prestiges, while dope, offer nothing new to me


I'm definitely in that boat. I think a couple of the Axions are cool, but I won't touch one with a 10 foot pole. The prestiges don't appeal to me at all, especially with the vibrant colors... not my thing. The only two 2019 prestiges I liked are fucking Japanese exclusives. Sadly no Prestige S or RGA.


----------



## Siggevaio

Emperor Guillotine said:


> So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.
> 
> (And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)


 They have been releasing original music and played Ibanez guitars for something like 7 years. Considering that they aren't even 25 (I think) yet that's a pretty long time. You don't have to like them and neither do I, but come on, it can't be that unreasonable that they get signatures. Tom Quayle and Martin Miller got signatures last year, what have they done to deserve signatures apart from playing music that's (maybe) more to your liking? Quayle isn't releasing music and didn't even play Ibanezes before and Miller just posts covers on YouTube, apart from ONE solo album that came out years ago. Polyphia are probably one of the most popular instrumental acts right now, of course they are gonna get signatures. So if we are completely objective here, who deserves a signature the most? It would be really stupid of Ibanez to wait until Polyphia aren't popular any more to release their signature, or wait and see if they become more popular before they do. 

I know you didn't mention Miller and Quayle so maybe you feel the same way about them, but it's common that people think that just because an artist isn't to their liking they don't deserve any success.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Emperor Guillotine said:


> So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.
> 
> (And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)



*cough* t-mac *cough*


----------



## MatiasTolkki

lewis said:


> probably why some of the industry's most respected, are jumping ship.
> 
> I see Dino Cazares is the latest > Ormsby



Dino's case seems to be very different because of the lawsuit, and Ibanez only made his sig in extremely limited numbers.

Also I wouldnt call Fear Factory "industry's most respected" when I never even heard of them until the Dino sig was announced. They are minor in the grand scheme of things.


----------



## prlgmnr

MatiasTolkki said:


> Also I wouldnt call Fear Factory "industry's most respected" when I never even heard of them until the Dino sig was announced. They are minor in the grand scheme of things.



For heaven's sake.


----------



## xzacx

MatiasTolkki said:


> I wouldnt call Fear Factory "industry's most respected" when I never even heard of them until the Dino sig was announced. They are minor in the grand scheme of things.



I know you’ve said you aren’t a kid before, so we can’t attribute this to that, but did you just get into guitars recently? I think Fear Factory kinda suck personally, but they’ve been a 
big deal since the early ‘90s. They’ve played on multiple Ozzfests, have had other members with a signature guitar, and have been on the biggest metal record labels.


----------



## sirbuh

Lots of get off my lawn going on in here.
FF is pretty boring on average but they got near first mover status on the whole metronome playing style. 
And sure the metrosexuals in Polyphia have that entitled air about them, but I guess that sells now.

All of which distracts from the tasty green-ness of '19.


----------



## Seabeast2000

sirbuh said:


> Lots of get off my lawn going on in here.
> FF is pretty boring on average but they got near first mover status on the whole metronome playing style.
> And sure the metrosexuals in Polyphia have that entitled air about them, but I guess that sells now.
> 
> All of which distracts from the tasty green-ness of '19.



Just a random observation, I thought they were all the same guy edited into the video I saw.


----------



## Sogradde

I'm not much of a fan of Polyphia or Chon but holy moly...
For a bunch of niche instrumentalists in various sub-sets of a niche genre you guys sure are superficial.


----------



## Kaura

Emperor Guillotine said:


> So, the trust-fund cringelords behind Polyphia got signature models? Wow, that was fast. Ibanez was super quick to pop them out. Typically, an artist has to be with the brand for years and do something substantial to get a signature model guitar with the artist’s name on it, and Polyphia have done neither.
> 
> (And then you have the artists who’ve been with Ibanez 10-20 years and never get a signature model.)



To be fair, Jake Bowen got his signature lineup started back in 2014 and to think that Periphery's debut album only came out 4 years prior so Polyphia getting the deal now is not surprising to me since they've been around for almost as long.


----------



## prlgmnr

sirbuh said:


> Lots of get off my lawn going on in here.
> FF is pretty boring on average but they got near first mover status on the whole metronome playing style.
> And sure the metrosexuals in Polyphia have that entitled air about them, but I guess that sells now.
> 
> All of which distracts from the tasty green-ness of '19.


It's not so much "get off my lawn", as someone stomping all over the lawn and then being like "I've never heard of grass, I don't know what you're talking about".


----------



## BigViolin

Ibanez would be so much more successful if they just started listening to small minded people with limited business acumen who live in worlds that extend about to the tip of their own noses.

Not that I would associate that way of thinking with anyone here...just sayin'.


----------



## Seabeast2000

sirbuh said:


> All of which distracts from the tasty green-ness of '19.



Tasty green-ness is the word indeed. I might have to shift some assets around to get that 5220.


----------



## I play music

The906 said:


> Tasty green-ness is the word indeed. I might have to shift some assets around to get that 5220.


I wish they'd also done the RG5328 in the same green-ness, reverse headstock, maple board style  Maybe next year haha


----------



## trem licking

still no edge 8 trem... yawn. lets see what 2020 brings.


----------



## NeglectedField

trem licking said:


> still no edge 8 trem... yawn. lets see what 2020 brings.



Maybe because there isn't sufficient demand for it.


----------



## cardinal

NeglectedField said:


> Maybe because there isn't sufficient demand for it.



I think he and I might buy enough between us to justify.


----------



## Leviathus

I do hope the lo-pro meets an RG8-string one day, it's a void in the guitar universe that needs filling.


----------



## trem licking

These new models are great and all... But take a damn leap and let me dive that F# into sonic dirt


----------



## Leviathus

trem licking said:


> These new models are great and all... But take a damn leap and let me dive that F# into sonic dirt



Hahaha, exactly!


----------



## MatiasTolkki

xzacx said:


> I know you’ve said you aren’t a kid before, so we can’t attribute this to that, but did you just get into guitars recently? I think Fear Factory kinda suck personally, but they’ve been a
> big deal since the early ‘90s. They’ve played on multiple Ozzfests, have had other members with a signature guitar, and have been on the biggest metal record labels.



i seriously didn't even notice their existence until Dinos sig came out. korn, slipknot, nin those guys i heard of at the time, but never FF.


----------



## Albake21

To be honest, I've never heard of Fear Factory either until Dino's sig with Ibanez. Maybe it's my age, not sure.


----------



## ThePIGI King

cardinal said:


> I think he and I might buy enough between us to justify.



Plus me and Holloway. I'd have to own mininum 3. And if they had more colors, 3 of each.


----------



## cardinal

Albake21 said:


> To be honest, I've never heard of Fear Factory either until Dino's sig with Ibanez. Maybe it's my age, not sure.



I think they were one of the bigger names in the 90s for then-modern metal. I think I had two or three of their albums and didn’t really like any of them, but I bought them just because I wasn’t sure what else there was to buy at the time.


----------



## Hollowway

ThePIGI King said:


> Plus me and Holloway. I'd have to own mininum 3. And if they had more colors, 3 of each.



Hells yes! I’m 100% sure that if I’m a good enough human to make it to heaven, I’ll walk through the pearly gates, and St. Peter will hand be a Prestige 8 string with a Edge 8. (I’d like to think he’ll then point me to where the redhead and Asian girls are hanging out, but I’m not sure if that’s what heaven is really about.) Maybe Steve Vai will also be up there, having just released the Jem888, and I’ll get one of those, too.


----------



## MikeH

Despite the guys in Polyphia being the most insufferable little shitheads I've ever forced myself to sit and listen to talk, those new signatures are sick as hell and I want one.


----------



## BTS

I certainly dont want to turn this into *would have been an insta buy if x...y..z.. etc*, but wow i wish they had made an fixed bridge of the 
*RG5120M. *


----------



## BTS

100% agree, but i just dont ill get on with the neck on those ...



MikeH said:


> Despite the guys in Polyphia being the most insufferable little shitheads I've ever forced myself to sit and listen to talk, those new signatures are sick as hell and I want one.


----------



## Curt

*slams fist on table*

MORE TREMS ON 7 STRING RGAs


And some damn prestige RGAs would be nice


----------



## ThePIGI King

Hollowway said:


> Jem888



And I'll take a green one, the pink one, a BFP one, one to match my UV777, and then why not the DNA swirl one too.

8 string MiJ Jem is what wet dreams are made of.


----------



## lurè

An UV888 or and 8 string genesis collection would probably be too cool for my wallet.

I'm also dreaming of a xiphos re-release: 7 or 8 string, chameleon finish and tremolo.


----------



## eightsixboy

Vyn said:


> Was to be expected though - same factory and the difference in specs is reflected in the price. That being said, the examples the store got have all been very good, our distribution network here takes care of use with QC really well.



Our distribution network ie Australis, suck balls when it comes to checking for QC, as in they don't check anything before sending it to dealers. Have found this out the hard way many many times over the years. They leave it up to the stores to send stuff back they aren't happy with and they in turn just send it to other unsuspecting dealers. 

BTW what store was that? Surprised they had a J Custom hanging on the wall.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

lurè said:


> An UV888 or and 8 string genesis collection would probably be too cool for my wallet.
> 
> I'm also dreaming of a xiphos re-release: 7 or 8 string, chameleon finish and tremolo.



Cant be a genesis if the 8 string wasn't even produced until the 00s. That's the whole point of the GC; to reproduce older models that were popular in the late 80s-early 90s, something an 8 string was NEVER part of.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MatiasTolkki said:


> Cant be a genesis if the 8 string wasn't even produced until the 00s. That's the whole point of the GC; to reproduce older models that were popular in the late 80s-early 90s, something an 8 string was NEVER part of.



Tell that to the Genesis RG521.


----------



## Taikatatti

Ibanez is winning me over this year. Loving that 27' 7-string rg.


----------



## LordHar

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=173754465403


----------



## wannabguitarist

People really seem to hate Polyphia here


----------



## TheShreddinHand

wannabguitarist said:


> People really seem to hate Polyphia here



Yeah, I hope no one goes to Dimarzio's home page and sees the current pics rotating there.


----------



## nistley

TheShreddinHand said:


> Yeah, I hope no one goes to Dimarzio's home page and sees the current pics rotating there.


Oh no, how could they do this to me, I wish I had a dollar bill rain following me. Such an unnerving rock star image. I think I need to see Robert Plant in tights sing about how much love he's got to feel better.


----------



## cip 123

Polyphia seem to be doing the 80's rockstar thing but in the modern day and I think it's hilarious.

I think they know too, I follow them and see what they get up to, I don't think the way they act is 100% serious. It is like this glorified pseudo 80's vibe to their actions, drugs, alcohol, money, girls. 

Except the riff that drop panties ain't played through a JCM800 and a pink humbucker anymore, it's played through a fractal and a mini humbucker.


----------



## Randy

wannabguitarist said:


> People really seem to hate Polyphia here



There's other people doing what they do, better (Plini, Owane, Zyetcki). They're talented but their music lacks substance, which makes the hype and the imagery like they're the second coming of Vai/Satch/Malmsteen *excruciating*.


----------



## I play music

nistley said:


> Oh no, how could they do this to me, I wish I had a dollar bill rain following me. Such an unnerving rock star image. I think I need to see Robert Plant in tights sing about how much love he's got to feel better.







And here I thought Abasi already had bad taste with design and clothes... these guys are like at least ten times as bad


----------



## lurè

I think Tosin has a good taste for clothing.
These two guys from polyphya look like two trap rappers holding a guitar.


----------



## cip 123

I mean, it's all the same really 



lurè said:


> I think Tosin has a good taste for clothing.
> These two guys from polyphya look like two trap rappers holding a guitar.



Their style now is basically trap with guitars so...


----------



## Cheap

To me it looks like they're trying to see how far they can push these ridiculous personas while making the style of music they want to. Sort of reads like Satchel from Steel Panther. I don't think I've ever seen anyone attack social media the way they do and it only seems to be helping their cause and getting them more and more opportunities. If their songwriting chops (not playing chops, very different) were as good as their business ideas I think they'd be pretty unstoppable

Edit: With all that said and to stay on topic, Tim's signature is disgustingly close to the Mateus Asato Suhr sig model (and with the way he seems to worship him it makes it a little grosser). It's definitely my favorite of the AZ sigs but only because of how much I love the Asato Suhr..


----------



## nistley

Are you guys seriously putting down their music? Their stuff is the only guitar music I can play with non-musician friends of mine that seems enjoyable.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Cheap said:


> To me it looks like they're trying to see how far they can push these ridiculous personas while making the style of music they want to. Sort of reads like Satchel from Steel Panther. I don't think I've ever seen anyone attack social media the way they do and it only seems to be helping their cause and getting them more and more opportunities. If their songwriting chops (not playing chops, very different) were as good as their business ideas I think they'd be pretty unstoppable
> 
> Edit: With all that said and to stay on topic, Tim's signature is disgustingly close to the Mateus Asato Suhr sig model (and with the way he seems to worship him it makes it a little grosser). It's definitely my favorite of the AZ sigs but only because of how much I love the Asato Suhr..



Is their songwriting their weak point? I actually think their writing is super tasty, as much as I resist the modern guitar/djent/sweater-and-capris stuff.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

nistley said:


> Are you guys seriously putting down their music? Their stuff is the only guitar music I can play with non-musician friends of mine that seems enjoyable.



I'm especially putting down their music. It used to be good.
Now...just straight garbage. Chon and Owane especially take this idea and actually make it not only listenable, but good.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Ordacleaphobia said:


> I'm especially putting down their music. It used to be good.
> Now...just straight garbage. Chon and Owane especially take this idea and actually make it not only listenable, but good.



Honestly, I'm divided on it. On the NLND album, I like half of the songs and think the other's are garbage. I love the one with Jason Richardson on it. That song is stuck in my head frequently. The collab with Ichika is also good.

I'm flexible enough to enjoy the different phases of their music but I'm not into every song of theirs still yet.


----------



## Cheap

Adam Of Angels said:


> Is their songwriting their weak point? I actually think their writing is super tasty, as much as I resist the modern guitar/djent/sweater-and-capris stuff.



I think there's usually only a couple tracks off each of their releases that really do anything for me. Although that's generally based on how little I get out of loop-based music--even with the monster drummer they have who tries really hard to keep things interesting. These dudes can write undeniable riffs, but they don't scale up to being great songs to me. That goes for most instrumental bands I listen to though, myself included


----------



## wannabguitarist

Ordacleaphobia said:


> I'm especially putting down their music. It used to be good.
> Now...just straight garbage. Chon and Owane especially take this idea and actually make it not only listenable, but good.



They actually weren't on my radar until I saw them play with Chon (local favorite here in SD) and they stole the show. I didn't think the older material was that interesting, but NLND ended up being one of my favorites from 2018.

I enjoy Chon, Plini, and Owane but they all sound like ambient/relaxing take on instrumental prog while Polyphia, at least the new material, feels dancier. The dirtier trap feeling grooves are fun, but that's just me


----------



## StevenC

2020: The Year of the Maxxas


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Maybe I'm just still upset because I crowdfunded a metal album and was handed a pop-rock album.
If that's your jam go ahead; but the taste that move left in my mouth and again with their attitude afterward is so bad that I probably wouldn't be able to get into anything they write even if they go back to the Inspire / Resurrect style.

They absolutely should have sigs- they have the following and the chops to back it up. I just personally detest the Polyphia brand.


----------



## Vyn

I think a lot of us are just jaded that these guys got sigs in a relatively short amount of time where artists like Brodreick (who ended up leaving for Jackson) never got one after years of being with the company (That white RGA7 still haunts my dreams).


----------



## Randy

nistley said:


> Are you guys seriously putting down their music? Their stuff is the only guitar music I can play with non-musician friends of mine that seems enjoyable.



On an ERG-centric music forum, that's not an especially high bar.


----------



## Randy

Vyn said:


> I think a lot of us are just jaded that these guys got sigs in a relatively short amount of time where artists like Brodreick (who ended up leaving for Jackson) never got one after years of being with the company (That white RGA7 still haunts my dreams).



Maybe for some. I hope they make a billion dollars and they get all the signature gear they can. I still think their music is dumb.


----------



## Vyn

Randy said:


> Maybe for some. I hope they make a billion dollars and they get all the signature gear they can. I still think their music is dumb.



That's why I'm pissed off about the Polyphia sigs - prog/dance metal band gets sigs over (at the time) a guitarist in arguably one of the biggest metal acts of all time (Megadeth).


----------



## StevenC

Vyn said:


> I think a lot of us are just jaded that these guys got sigs in a relatively short amount of time where artists like Brodreick (who ended up leaving for Jackson) never got one after years of being with the company (That white RGA7 still haunts my dreams).


Literally about to get an Ibanez sig and then he jumped ship to Jackson. See: RGA427Z


----------



## Opion

It took a while for me to come around with Polyphia, but it took me watching them do a live play through of their song 40oz that made me go "damn these guys can really play". And they have fun while doing it, too. (seriously, search it on youtube - they kill it, and that song has one of the dopest sweep riffs I've heard lately)

It's the same story every time when other people are successful and are having a good time, while simultaneously not giving a fuck what other people think about them. Haters gonna hate  That being said, I totally get why people feel their sigs are undeserved, but let's face it - they've got a huge fanbase, and what successful company doesn't want to break into new markets? Polyphia, Chon, Martin Miller and Tom Quayle all helped design the AZ, which IMO is one of the best Ibanez designs they've come out with recently. I have to give them that.

One comment I do have about the Chon/Polyphia sigs, I can dig how they are all completely different from each other in specs. Kinda lame when a signature model is just a stock model but just in a fancy finish and the only significant upgrade is some signature pickup. They've all got totally different vibes and seems like they are really taking a chance with that, so seems like Ibanez is confident they will sell- but we'll see about that. The red Polyphia sig is the only one I could ever see myself playing TBH.


----------



## RiksRiks

I don't want to make this thread any more Polyphia-centric than it already became BUT

I honestly can't believe that people think their "attitude" is serious, their social media is full of self depreciating jokes that just make it seem very obvious that they're just pushing their images for fun, not because they actually believe themselves to be entitled.

Anyways, I get people who don't like their music, I personally agree with previous comments saying that Plini, CHON and Owane make good music but feels more like ambient or focused on the composition, and Polyphia feels dancier, not everyone's cup of tea and that's ok

About their signatures, I don't know, to me they look like straight out of an online guitar designer, and don't feel very compelled to buy one. Although their pickups should be interesting to try.



Opion said:


> One comment I do have about the Chon/Polyphia sigs, I can dig how they are all completely different from each other in specs. Kinda lame when a signature model is just a stock model but just in a fancy finish and the only significant upgrade is some signature pickup. They've all got totally different vibes and seems like they are really taking a chance with that, so seems like Ibanez is confident they will sell- but we'll see about that. The red Polyphia sig is the only one I could ever see myself playing TBH.



Although I agree with this comment.


----------



## Vyn

StevenC said:


> Literally about to get an Ibanez sig and then he jumped ship to Jackson. See: RGA427Z



Going to have to fill me in on this one. I know he was in the process of talking/designing a potential guitar, didn't realise it was actually made in numbers and then re-branded.


----------



## StevenC

Vyn said:


> Going to have to fill me in on this one. I know he was in the process of talking/designing a potential guitar, didn't realise it was actually made in numbers and then re-branded.


That's basically exactly what happened. There was going to be a signature Ibanez RGA, presumably 6 and 7 because that was released. Then just before NAMM we here he's getting a signature Jackson, a week of teasing and then it's shown off. Get to NAMM and Ibanez suspiciously have a fully relaunched RGA line, 2 Prestige guitars with specs close to what Broderick would have had, and no one endorsing the RGA. As you can see with the AZ, when Ibanez wants to launch or relaunch a shape, they do it with lots of artist support. This was missing, RGA427Z arrived late in the year and disappeared quickly because it had soapbar actives when the world was moving away from that, powered by 2 AA batteries. It was a strange year.


----------



## Randy

Those RGA soapbars and the EQ scoop switch, uuuuggghhhh


----------



## eightsixboy

Vyn said:


> I think a lot of us are just jaded that these guys got sigs in a relatively short amount of time where artists like Brodreick (who ended up leaving for Jackson) never got one after years of being with the company (That white RGA7 still haunts my dreams).



Signature models used to mean something, like a badge of honor, now they are given out like candy it seems. They still mean something obviously but it's less about loyalty and more about making a quick buck on the flavour of the month it seems.


----------



## wannabguitarist

eightsixboy said:


> Signature models used to mean something, like a badge of honor, now they are given out like candy it seems. They still mean something obviously but it's less about loyalty and more about making a quick buck on the flavour of the month it seems.



Man, it's always been about business. No company is going to tool up a production line out of loyalty to an artist


----------



## aesthyrian

Jeeze, you guys take these signatures models much too personally. I get it, I'm also upset that Luke Hoskin only gets a premium signature model, I get it. But come on guys, calm down.


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> Signature models used to mean something, like a badge of honor, now they are given out like candy it seems. They still mean something obviously but it's less about loyalty and more about making a quick buck on the flavour of the month it seems.


Remember Steve Vai? Back in the 80s he was a big deal and all the guitar companies wanted to sign him as an signature artist. Ibanez were successful and most of the other companies collapsed. Ibanez made lots of money and is today ubiquitous with technical guitar music and still make lots of money because of this.

All that is to say, Ibanez owes a lot to the Maxxas and should reisuue it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

StevenC said:


> That's basically exactly what happened. There was going to be a signature Ibanez RGA, presumably 6 and 7 because that was released. Then just before NAMM we here he's getting a signature Jackson, a week of teasing and then it's shown off. Get to NAMM and Ibanez suspiciously have a fully relaunched RGA line, 2 Prestige guitars with specs close to what Broderick would have had, and no one endorsing the RGA. As you can see with the AZ, when Ibanez wants to launch or relaunch a shape, they do it with lots of artist support. This was missing, RGA427Z arrived late in the year and disappeared quickly because it had soapbar actives when the world was moving away from that, powered by 2 AA batteries. It was a strange year.



He ghosted them a few weeks before NAMM, they had to redo catalogs and all kinds of stuff at the last minute. 

They, the 6 and 7 strings, were going to have custom pickups, but they couldn't use them so they just threw in whatever they could get on short notice, which were the Lo-Z pickups/electronics. They should have thrown in whatever passives, but I remember there was another reason they couldn't. 

The RGA420 and RGA427 were so limited because they were just the original batch made in expectation.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

wannabguitarist said:


> Man, it's always been about business. No company is going to tool up a production line out of loyalty to an artist



 Usually the loyalty happens after the business. 

Regarding Vai, everyone knows that he was sought after by every guitar company and their mums. But the flipside of the coin was that Hoshino really needed a mainstay artist they could push to market for the current shred era while they were slowly getting their stride of unique instruments post lawsuit. Ibanez just happens to build the exact guitar Vai wanted. In turn Satch got on board because of Vai, and also being a shred player at the right climate. 

It shouldn't come as a surprise that the Chon and Polyphia guys got sigs (I am surprised that their bassists didn't or perhaps that's still pending). They capitalized on the nu metal trend and now they can capitalize on the Gucci hipster prog scene. It doesn't always last long (Matt Bachand, Asking Alexandria sigs) but that's how marketing works sometimes. Say what you will about Chon and Polyphia (I'm not a fan personally) but I respect both for working hard and touring for many years to get where they are. And admittedly I'm warming up to their sigs, at least there's not a gradient finish in the lot.


----------



## narad

MaxOfMetal said:


> The RGA420 and RGA427 were so limited because they were just the original batch made in expectation.



Maybe they cancelled out of spite, but that was like one of the best spec'd Ibanezes I can remember. Tried to track down a 427 for forever.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

narad said:


> Maybe they cancelled out of spite, but that was like one of the best spec'd Ibanezes I can remember. Tried to track down a 427 for forever.



It took years for retailers to finally sell them all. I know it took DCGL almost three to unload thiers.

The price was pretty high, but they were stuck since they spent so much to develop and then nothing. Had to recoup somewhere.


----------



## Andromalia

StevenC said:


> Remember Steve Vai? Back in the 80s he was a big deal and all the guitar companies wanted to sign him as an signature artist. Ibanez were successful and most of the other companies collapsed. Ibanez made lots of money and is today ubiquitous with technical guitar music and still make lots of money because of this.



In my opinion, on the contrary they fucked up big time. They snatched Vai and Satriani, sure, but ESP got the big sellers and they were a much smaller operation than Ibanez back then. Especially since the Satch models are a bit weird with their fender-ish neck and are technically not shred guitars at all. ESP certazinly made more money with the LTD sigs than Ibanez did with low end JEMs. I think they missed their opportunity because in the 90es, Ibanez was the only brand with entry level guitars that didn't suck. In France *everybody* had them before graduating to Gibson/Fender/Lag/Vigier - or ESP it they were really rich. Higher end Ibanez (RG 550 etc) didn't appeal to people at all - probably because Ibanez was seen as an entry level brand. Signing some rythm dudes would likely have broadened their playerbase in Europe, especially since the shred/glam thing was over already when metal became more mainstrea less underground and high school dudes were buying their firsy guitar to play something else than Led Zeppelin and punk songs.


----------



## StevenC

Andromalia said:


> In my opinion, on the contrary they fucked up big time. They snatched Vai and Satriani, sure, but ESP got the big sellers and they were a much smaller operation than Ibanez back then. Especially since the Satch models are a bit weird with their fender-ish neck and are technically not shred guitars at all. ESP certazinly made more money with the LTD sigs than Ibanez did with low end JEMs. I think they missed their opportunity because in the 90es, Ibanez was the only brand with entry level guitars that didn't suck. In France *everybody* had them before graduating to Gibson/Fender/Lag/Vigier - or ESP it they were really rich. Higher end Ibanez (RG 550 etc) didn't appeal to people at all - probably because Ibanez was seen as an entry level brand. Signing some rythm dudes would likely have broadened their playerbase in Europe, especially since the shred/glam thing was over already when metal became more mainstrea less underground and high school dudes were buying their firsy guitar to play something else than Led Zeppelin and punk songs.


OK, but then because of Vai you had all the 7 string players of the 90s and 2000s playing Ibanez. And because all the 7 string players were playing Ibanez, when they wanted 8 strings they went to Ibanez.

Anecdotally, the only person I know who owns an Ltd or ESP worked for the company, and every other guitar player I know has an Ibanez.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Region matters. 

Ibanez was never really as popular in Europe as they were in the US. It's one of the reasons there's so many weird old Euro market models, they were trying all kinds of stuff to see if it would stick. 

On the other hand, ESP had always had a bigger presence in Europe and the Russian Federation. Mainly because they kept making Gibson and Fender copies a solid decade or two longer than Ibanez, they just pulled them from the North American market.


----------



## eightsixboy

wannabguitarist said:


> Man, it's always been about business. No company is going to tool up a production line out of loyalty to an artist



Your missing the fact it was or used to be about the loyalty/relationship first. Why do you think Vai got his sig? They had a great relationship first and foremost and he wanted to grow Ibanez, and vice versa. Same can be said for almost all the artists of the 80's/90's who got sigs. There was a reason only few got them back in the day or why a lot of the older guys stick with the brands they were first with. 

Now, like with the Chon/Polyphia sigs, it's clear its about making a quick buck for Ibanez. Is that a problem? No not really, but to people like myself and I'm sure to others it just means these "signature artists" are more about them making money then rewarding loyalty or any relationship they have with the company. It's not like these sig AZ models provide anything to us players anymore then a regular AZ unless you really want to pretend to be Scott lepage and wear silk pants or something. 

If you even look at the Poloyphia guys, they were playing EBMM's less then a year ago, basically endorsed by them and now magically they have Ibanez sigs out of the blue. Good for them, we'll see which company they are with in a year or two I guess and the AZ sig's will be a forgotten thing. 



StevenC said:


> Remember Steve Vai? Back in the 80s he was a big deal and all the guitar companies wanted to sign him as an signature artist. Ibanez were successful and most of the other companies collapsed. Ibanez made lots of money and is today ubiquitous with technical guitar music and still make lots of money because of this.
> 
> All that is to say, Ibanez owes a lot to the Maxxas and should reisuue it.



I don't know what that really has to do with my comment but yea Vai chose Ibanez based on their relationship and the fact they could build the guitar he wanted more then a number Ibanez could throw at him. If you watch the mini doco about vai/Ibanez they talk about this. If anything it proves my point as Vai and Ibanez wanted to grow together and have a long lasting thing. These days its like players just get a sig model and then jump ship whenever some $$$ is thrown at them. 

Yes Vai would catapult which ever company he chose but that's not really relevant to any of the sig players of today, especially non of the new AZ sigs.


----------



## sakeido

why do people on the internet get so mad when businesses do things that'll make them money? you do know that's the whole goal of business right? they are literally obligated to turn profits

I'm surprised a band like Polyphia with that level of YT plays/IG follows/whatever is big enough to warrant not one but two sigs but maybe that's just an indication of how hurting guitar is as an art form these days.

god damn that shit is horrible though. music to keep your virginity to.


----------



## eightsixboy

Anyways after playing the new green 7 string I can't say they are worth the pricetag. As much as a J Custom, atleast over here in Aus, and besides the SS frets no better then a regular RG752 which is like 1/2 the price. Would be cheaper to buy a RG752 and put SS frets on it and still have $$$ lest over imo.


----------



## eightsixboy

sakeido said:


> why do people on the internet get so mad when businesses do things that'll make them money? you do know that's the whole goal of business right? they are literally obligated to turn profits
> 
> I'm surprised a band like Polyphia with that level of YT plays/IG follows/whatever is big enough to warrant not one but two sigs but maybe that's just an indication of how hurting guitar is as an art form these days.
> 
> god damn that shit is horrible though. music to keep your virginity to



I'm not mad just disappointed. I mean SOOOOOOOO many other plays deserve sigs from Ibanez long before the Polyphia guys. 90% of the guitar players also won't even know who Chon are either so I doubt its about making money of those AZ's and more about them been buddies with Polyphia and saying hey they want an ugly sig model as well please.


----------



## Masoo2

eightsixboy said:


> I'm not mad just disappointed. I mean SOOOOOOOO many other plays deserve sigs from Ibanez long before the Polyphia guys. 90% of the guitar players also won't even know who Chon are either so I doubt its about making money of those AZ's and more about them been buddies with Polyphia and saying hey they want an ugly sig model as well please.


Isn't it fair to say that the group of people who would traditionally listen to Polyphia and CHON also have a lot of overlap with those that tend to b uy gear?

More broadly speaking metal has always been the genre to push in terms of signature gear for the longest time, right? Well, that started to die down a bit and you began seeing sigs for guys like John Mayer sprouting up. So I see this more as a reflection of "what music is trendy right now and will get people to actually buy guitars/shares overlap with people who buy guitars" rather than "90% of people won't even know CHON so it's not about money"

Cause the listener demographic is a bit different than the gear-buying demographics


----------



## StevenC

In the time I've been aware of Ibanez I've been totally unfamiliar with basically all of their artists. Other than Vai, Satriani, Gilbert, Timmons, Meshuggah and AAL, I don't like any of their sig artists' music. Jake Bowen, Luke Hoskin, Munky, Paul Stanley and Paul Waggoner are all nobodies who make music I don't like.

But Ibanez thinks they can make more money from them than other people.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Why do you think Vai got his sig? They had a great relationship first and foremost and he wanted to grow Ibanez, and vice versa.



Vai became an Ibanez artist in late 1986, and launched the JEM in early 1987. What great relationship? 



> It was also a Maxxas which helped convince Steve Vai to come to Ibanez as an endorser. At the time Vai, who was a member or David Lee Roth's band, was being wooed aggressively by Kramer, Yamaha and other guitar companies, but Ibanez desperately wanted him to become the face of their franchise.
> 
> Lasner presented Vai with a prototype of the semi-hollow Maxxas prior to a show in the fall of 1986, but the chambered body quickly proved to be an issue as it produced horrific feedback when Vai plugged it into his stage amps and played at his preferred performance volume during a sound check.
> 
> Hoshino USA created a new customized Maxxas prototype with a solid body and an Edge tremolo. This prototype would become the basis of the MX2. The prototype was finished in a garish green and pink snakeskin pattern with the knowledge that Vai favored attention grabbing color schemes. Ibanez worked with Vai's parents to get the guitar placed under the family Christmas tree. The Maxxas demonstrated that the company was willing and able to think "outside the box" when it came to guitar design, which was important to Vai, and he signed on shortly after receiving the gift.





eightsixboy said:


> Anyways after playing the new green 7 string I can't say they are worth the pricetag. As much as a J Custom, atleast over here in Aus, and besides the SS frets no better then a regular RG752 which is like 1/2 the price. Would be cheaper to buy a RG752 and put SS frets on it and still have $$$ lest over imo.



Must be an Australia thing, as the 5000 series is abouar 30% to 50% cheaper than J.Customs over here. 

They're actually only a couple hundred dollars more than an RG752.


----------



## Soya

StevenC said:


> In the time I've been aware of Ibanez I've been totally unfamiliar with basically all of their artists. Other than Vai, Satriani, Gilbert, Timmons, Meshuggah and AAL, I don't like any of their sig artists' music. Jake Bowen, Luke Hoskin, Munky, Paul Stanley and Paul Waggoner are all nobodies who make music I don't like.
> 
> But Ibanez thinks they can make more money from them than other people.


Paul Stanley is a nobody?


----------



## eightsixboy

MaxOfMetal said:


> Vai became an Ibanez artist in late 1986, and launched the JEM in early 1987. What great relationship?



Your'e assuming that because of a short time frame there was no great re pour between them?

I get the point you are making but that hardly is relevant in comparison to the new AZ sigs been released considering those guys are known to get associated with tons of brands already. 

In Vai's case he had basically no association with anyone besides carvin back in the 80's, which he is still with btw, so its not like he was with Charvel or someone then like nah stuff you guys Ibanez is where the $$$ is at and went there.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Your'e assuming that because of a short time frame there was no great re pour between them?
> 
> I get the point you are making but that hardly is relevant in comparison to the new AZ sigs been released considering those guys are known to get associated with tons of brands already.
> 
> In Vai's case he had basically no association with anyone besides carvin back in the 80's, which he is still with btw, so its not like he was with Charvel or someone then like nah stuff you guys Ibanez is where the $$$ is at and went there.



I'm sure they got along great, seeing as Ibanez head hunted him and was dead set to make him thier flagship artist.

Even if they didn't get along they were going to make the JEM, the deal was inked before they really knew each other.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> Vai became an Ibanez artist in late 1986, and launched the JEM in early 1987. What great relationship?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Must be an Australia thing, as the 5000 series is abouar 30% to 50% cheaper than J.Customs over here.
> 
> They're actually only a couple hundred dollars more than an RG752.



RRP on the RGR752AHBF - $2499AUD
RRP on the RGR5227MFX - $3399AUD

There's $900 between the two - I don't have any idea of what the margins are on either but assuming a similar percentage street price would still show around a few hundred AUD difference. Unsure of what the J.Custom 7 would be as we didn't get it as a local market model but from memory the 6 string J Customs RRP between $4299AUD and $4699AUD depending on spec. Street price is obviously lower, although I don't think I've seen a current model JC street for anything less than around $3500AUD.

TL;DR - 5000 series is less a mid point between the current Prestige line and JC, it's more towards the Prestige line even in Aus


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> RRP on the RGR752AHBF - $2499AUD
> RRP on the RGR5227MFX - $3399AUD
> 
> There's $900 between the two - I don't have any idea of what the margins are on either but assuming a similar percentage street price would still show around a few hundred AUD difference. Unsure of what the J.Custom 7 would be as we didn't get it as a local market model but from memory the 6 string J Customs RRP between $4299AUD and $4699AUD depending on spec. Street price is obviously lower, although I don't think I've seen a current model JC street for anything less than around $3500AUD.
> 
> TL;DR - 5000 series is less a mid point between the current Prestige line and JC, it's more towards the Prestige line even in Aus



Over here the RG752DY is $1600 and the RG5227MFX is $1900. The JCRG8527 is $3200.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> Over here the RG752DY is $1600 and the RG5227MFX is $1900. The JCRG8527 is $3200.



Are those prices USD and street or MSRP?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> Are those prices USD and street or MSRP?



USD and MAP

Certain dealers will be able to come in 5% to 15% lower, but can't advertise as such.


----------



## eightsixboy

Vyn said:


> RRP on the RGR752AHBF - $2499AUD
> RRP on the RGR5227MFX - $3399AUD
> 
> There's $900 between the two - I don't have any idea of what the margins are on either but assuming a similar percentage street price would still show around a few hundred AUD difference. Unsure of what the J.Custom 7 would be as we didn't get it as a local market model but from memory the 6 string J Customs RRP between $4299AUD and $4699AUD depending on spec. Street price is obviously lower, although I don't think I've seen a current model JC street for anything less than around $3500AUD.
> 
> TL;DR - 5000 series is less a mid point between the current Prestige line and JC, it's more towards the Prestige line even in Aus



Best price I have gotten on the 5000 series was $2699 but that was mates rates, everywhere else was $2799-2899. The earlier RG752's were RRp $1999 and the limba top one is $2499 as you said. I got mine for $1700 which seems to be the going rate for the RG752's. 

RRP aside I don't see there been $1000 difference in them. SS frets are under $50 for the material and about $300-400 labour so not that expensive anyway. The pickups are either going to be up your alley or not, they are very clear high gain, so not really for me but obviously more what they wanted for the guitar. 

The J Customs are only 6 stringers but still relevent as the 6 string 5000 series is the same as the 7 anyway. The J Customs are normally low 3's with an RRP of $3999-4299 depending on model. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Over here the RG752DY is $1600 and the RG5227MFX is $1900. The JCRG8527 is $3200.



Which is sad and annoying that we aussies get so screwed on pricing. The difference in price should be uniform regardless or region. They have tacked on like $600-700+ to the RRP over here for what reason lol?


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> Your'e assuming that because of a short time frame there was no great re pour between them?
> 
> I get the point you are making but that hardly is relevant in comparison to the new AZ sigs been released considering those guys are known to get associated with tons of brands already.
> 
> In Vai's case he had basically no association with anyone besides carvin back in the 80's, which he is still with btw, so its not like he was with Charvel or someone then like nah stuff you guys Ibanez is where the $$$ is at and went there.


For what it's worth, Polyphia have been officially endorsing Ibanez since March 2015. 2019-2015>1987-1986

Vai no longer works with Carvin, because that is not a company anymore and Kiesel don't make amps.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Which is sad and annoying that we aussies get so screwed on pricing. The difference in price should be uniform regardless or region. They have tacked on like $600-700+ to the RRP over here for what reason lol?



Market size and distribution of product mix is very important. 

The US market is over a dozen times bigger than the Australian one, and our numerous big box musical instrument dealers help drive down costs significantly. Not to mention that having two other relatively large markets "next door" helps. 

They don't plan on selling as many 5000 series in Australia, thus they raise the price to offset quantity to turn the desired profit.


----------



## eightsixboy

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm sure they got along great, seeing as Ibanez head hunted him and was dead set to make him their flagship artist.
> 
> Even if they didn't get along they were going to make the JEM, the deal was inked before they really knew each other.



Honestly I doubt Steve would do it if he hated them or the brand, he doesn't seem like the type to just work with whoever. I'm sure other companies could have made a similar guitar to the Jem anyway, especially ESP or Jackson at the time. The vibe I got from the doco and what I read previously is they had a mutual respect already and it was just about getting the guitar done to his specs. 

I could be wrong but that seems like how almost all those guys went with their chosen companies. Just look at Morse/Petrucci/Richardson with EBMM, Mattias with Caparison etc, Petrucci especially as it is a classic case of Ibanez not doing what they should for the artist and he left, they seem to do that a lot come to think of it. They also lost Broderick, Friedman, sure there is more I've forgotten. 

I just can't see any of the Polyphia guys been there in a few years, they'll end up with a different brand for sure. Then on the flip side, long term loyal artists like Nita only gets a Indo sig after having years of LACS guitars, they should have at least done both MIJ and Indo as that guitar has 1000x more uniqueness and marketability then some random AZ sig of non mainstream artists. Marco only now finally gets a MIJ after been with Ibanez for 15+ years.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Honestly I doubt Steve would do it if he hated them or the brand, he doesn't seem like the type to just work with whoever. I'm sure other companies could have made a similar guitar to the Jem anyway, especially ESP or Jackson at the time. The vibe I got from the doco and what I read previously is they had a mutual respect already and it was just about getting the guitar done to his specs.
> 
> I could be wrong but that seems like how almost all those guys went with their chosen companies. Just look at Morse/Petrucci/Richardson with EBMM, Mattias with Caparison etc, Petrucci especially as it is a classic case of Ibanez not doing what they should for the artist and he left, they seem to do that a lot come to think of it. They also lost Broderick, Friedman, sure there is more I've forgotten.
> 
> I just can't see any of the Polyphia guys been there in a few years, they'll end up with a different brand for sure. Then on the flip side, long term loyal artists like Nita only gets a Indo sig after having years of LACS guitars, they should have at least done both MIJ and Indo as that guitar has 1000x more uniqueness and marketability then some random AZ sig of non mainstream artists. Marco only now finally gets a MIJ after been with Ibanez for 15+ years.



He obviously liked them enough to give them a second chance, granted Ibanez played it dirty and got his parents involved. 

But it had a lot to do with Ibanez wanting Vai above all else. Luckily, it worked out in thier favor. If he had been a flash in the pan, or was incredibly difficult to work with, we'd be having a much different conversation. 

What's with this whole "brand should do this and that" for an artist? Endorsements are two way streets, as in both sides need to benefit from the arrangement. These deals also involve contracts which stipulate the responsibilities of both parties. Artists know what they're getting into, or at least they should, at signing. 

Artists typically move on based on the deal they recieve, which is 99% of the time compensation ($$$) based. Broderick left Ibanez because FMIC gave Jackson more money to on-board artists. That's why there was an explosion of new Jackson artists five or so years ago.


----------



## eightsixboy

StevenC said:


> For what it's worth, Polyphia have been officially endorsing Ibanez since March 2015. 2019-2015>1987-1986
> 
> Vai no longer works with Carvin, because that is not a company anymore and Kiesel don't make amps.



Weird how they can be rocking EBMM though during that time though. I don't remember seeing them with any Ibanez except when they very first came out, they also played jacksons and stuff. The last few years seemed to be solely EBMM. 

If they were a company still then I'm sure he would be though. He still plays/gigs the legacy amp series. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Market size and distribution of product mix is very important.
> 
> The US market is over a dozen times bigger than the Australian one, and our numerous big box musical instrument dealers help drive down costs significantly. Not to mention that having two other relatively large markets "next door" helps.
> 
> They don't plan on selling as many 5000 series in Australia, thus they raise the price to offset quantity to turn the desired profit.



Well that sounds kind of silly to be honest. Trying to justify a much higher price tag then everywhere else for that reason. They would loose more sales due to that then making money back from what they would sell. How can they justify selling the indo AZ's for a RRP of $2499 over here, but can't see the sense in bringing in the 5000's series at the same price as the US? 

They have always been funny with what they bring in here. Like they will only get 6 in a whole year of the AHM 7 strings and that's it, they all sell almost instantly and then they don't bring anymore in even though they are a catalog model in USA/EU for the following year and they knew they all sold out, they will then bring in way to many indo AZ's and over overpriced Indo Premiums which basically never sell well over here. They seriously need a shake up in their management and whoever makes these decisions.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> Weird how they can be rocking EBMM though during that time though. I don't remember seeing them with any Ibanez except when they very first came out, they also played jacksons and stuff. The last few years seemed to be solely EBMM.
> 
> If they were a company still then I'm sure he would be though. He still plays/gigs the legacy amp series.
> 
> 
> 
> Well that sounds kind of silly to be honest. Trying to justify a much higher price tag then everywhere else for that reason. They would loose more sales due to that then making money back from what they would sell. How can they justify selling the indo AZ's for a RRP of $2499 over here, but can't see the sense in bringing in the 5000's series at the same price as the US?
> 
> They have always been funny with what they bring in here. Like they will only get 6 in a whole year of the AHM 7 strings and that's it, they all sell almost instantly and then they don't bring anymore in even though they are a catalog model in USA/EU for the following year and they knew they all sold out, they will then bring in way to many indo AZ's and over overpriced Indo Premiums which basically never sell well over here. They seriously need a shake up in their management and whoever makes these decisions.



Local distributiors and importers decide what model to bring to market in thier region, and negotiate the price they pay relative to quantity that then sets the sale price at retailers based on the specific distributor-retailer agreement.


----------



## eightsixboy

MaxOfMetal said:


> He obviously liked them enough to give them a second chance, granted Ibanez played it dirty and got his parents involved.
> 
> But it had a lot to do with Ibanez wanting Vai above all else. Luckily, it worked out in thier favor. If he had been a flash in the pan, or was incredibly difficult to work with, we'd be having a much different conversation.
> 
> What's with this whole "brand should do this and that" for an artist? Endorsements are two way streets, as in both sides need to benefit from the arrangement. These deals also involve contracts which stipulate the responsibilities of both parties. Artists know what they're getting into, or at least they should, at signing.
> 
> Artists typically move on based on the deal they recieve, which is 99% of the time compensation ($$$) based. Broderick left Ibanez because FMIC gave Jackson more money to on-board artists. That's why there was an explosion of new Jackson artists five or so years ago.



With Petrucci it seemed like they didn't care, he wanted something changed on the guitar and they were basically like yeah no. Seemed pretty clear cut he wasn't getting what he wanted in the guitar and Ibanez weren't on the same page to what he was "worth" as an artist on their roster. 

"brand should do this and that" Well we don't know what the case with Broderick or others were, can't assume the artist or Ibanez didn't do what was required of them. I'm just saying that it doesn't seem like Ibanez cared/were fussed if artists leave or not. They have now lost Dino and the dude from Korn as well.


----------



## eightsixboy

MaxOfMetal said:


> Local distributiors and importers decide what model to bring to market in thier region, and negotiate the price they pay relative to quantity that then sets the sale price at retailers based on the specific distributor-retailer agreement.



Well if that is the case then my comment about Australis been terrible holds up to be true then lol.


----------



## couverdure

eightsixboy said:


> If you even look at the Poloyphia guys, they were playing EBMM's less then a year ago, basically endorsed by them and now magically they have Ibanez sigs out of the blue. Good for them, we'll see which company they are with in a year or two I guess and the AZ sig's will be a forgotten thing.


Tim and Scott have been Ibanez endorsers for four years, pretty much since the release of the Finale music video/Equal Vision re-release of their debut album Muse. Their EBMM endorsement only lasted around the original release of the album (Champagne and 87 are the only official music videos that feature them playing JPs and they came out nearly half a decade ago. Every other video has them playing Ibanez).


And even in their early days, Tim has been using Ibanez guitars before the company ever reached out to them.



I might be a massive Polyphia fanboy here but as someone who's been following them for years, I think they totally deserve the sigs. You're just making it sound like Ibanez are just throwing endorsements to virtually every popular guitarist like Kiesel and Ernie Ball usually does.

For CHON's case, I think they also deserve it since they've also been using their guitars for years, and they were the cheaper Indo models to boot so the quality didn't affect their devotion to them.


----------



## narad

So... do you think they're rewarding these guys for years of loyalty, or that they want to sell a bunch of Ibanezes to young metal instagram kids?


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> I could be wrong but that seems like how almost all those guys went with their chosen companies. Just look at Morse/Petrucci/Richardson with EBMM, Mattias with Caparison etc, Petrucci especially as it is a classic case of Ibanez not doing what they should for the artist and he left, they seem to do that a lot come to think of it. They also lost Broderick, Friedman, sure there is more I've forgotten.



Friedman has jumped around between Gibson, PRS, Ibanez and now back to Jackson; he was at Ibanez the longest since leaving Megadeth. Broderick disappeared from Ibanez without telling them, and Dave Mustaine claims he told him to get a signature guitar with a real company like Jackson. The best report I can find is that Petrucci left Ibanez just because he wanted something not Ibanez.



eightsixboy said:


> Weird how they can be rocking EBMM though during that time though. I don't remember seeing them with any Ibanez except when they very first came out, they also played jacksons and stuff. The last few years seemed to be solely EBMM.
> 
> If they were a company still then I'm sure he would be though. He still plays/gigs the legacy amp series.



Except that's not true. They've only been playing Ibanez electrics since 2015, at least publicly. All their social media posts are Ibanez guitars. I'd never seen them with anything else until I went back to look for it.

Also, Vai is working with Synergy now on a signature module.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> With Petrucci it seemed like they didn't care, he wanted something changed on the guitar and they were basically like yeah no. Seemed pretty clear cut he wasn't getting what he wanted in the guitar and Ibanez weren't on the same page to what he was "worth" as an artist on their roster.
> 
> "brand should do this and that" Well we don't know what the case with Broderick or others were, can't assume the artist or Ibanez didn't do what was required of them. I'm just saying that it doesn't seem like Ibanez cared/were fussed if artists leave or not. They have now lost Dino and the dude from Korn as well.



It's all business. I don't know why that's such a difficult concept for folks. Not aiming that at you specifically, as with every new NAMM cycle the same notion of endorsements being based on arbitrary concepts of "loyalty" and "appreciation" and "deserving" comes up, when in actuality this is all based on financial decisions and legal agreements negotiated by teams of people who aren't necessarily the artist themselves or even musicians for that matter.


----------



## couverdure

narad said:


> So... do you think they're rewarding these guys for years of loyalty, or that they want to sell a bunch of Ibanezes to young metal instagram kids?


I would say it's both since they did influence those types of people, but I also wouldn't consider those bands to be Instagram kids because Polyphia started out as a post-hardcore band with vocals and had virtually no social media presence before they went instrumental, and CHON were formed in 2008.

I know Tim and Scott shared some riffs there but so do a lot of guitarists who've been around longer than them, that's just the nature of social media.


----------



## narad

I think if you've got 150k instagram followers, your market is instagram kids. Or maybe tightening things up a bit, I'd say a disproportionate amount of people who know Polyphia know them via social media, vs. albums and touring.

That said, I love the dark groovey vibe they have with the new drummer. It's just that business is business.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

narad said:


> So... do you think they're rewarding these guys for years of loyalty, or that they want to sell a bunch of Ibanezes to young metal instagram kids?



I think they're hoping that these younger players are going to have long careers that sell tons of guitars. It's no secret that Ibanez let thier signature artist roster "mature". They need some young talent. 

Social media is a thing. While I'm not saying it's a true barometer of an artist's fanbase, it's definitely an indicator and one that'll likely get more accurate in determining who has the potential for making them money the more ubiquitous it becomes. 

Promoting the Ibanez brand is definitely a factor. It's advertising.


----------



## Konfyouzd

BigPhi84 said:


> Hello to all the old SS.org members. Sorry if you were bombarded by my "likes" on your posts. I just came in to do my yearly "Ibanez New Stuff" lurking. Can't believe I just read all 53 pages (25 of those pages must have been debates on Evertune Bridges, tonewood, "Ibanez messed up one spec from my dream guitar" and new vs. used prices! I guess SS.orgers haven't changed at all!) Glad to see so many old members still actively posting on this site. I wish I had the time and discipline to be an active member. Miss you all very much. Take care, and I hope that 2019 is a great year for you!


----------



## possumkiller

Idk. I never heard of polyphia before the AZ teasers. I still haven't bothered to listen to them. I don't care really. However, at least they aren't like the previous batch of YouTube guitarists that jumped from one douchebag shady builder to the next while keeping quiet about issues and stringing their unfortunate fans along. Stuff like BRJ, S7G, Sherman, Decibel, Vik...


----------



## Exchanger

StevenC said:


> Jake Bowen, Luke Hoskin, Munky, Paul Stanley and Paul Waggoner are all nobodies who make music I don't like.



Nobodies...lol
So on one hand, some people complain that it's just business, and on the other hand when they just hire some "obscure" guy eventhough it "might" not be profitable, it's also wrong... I think we shouldn't read too much into that. Artists change their minds, companies change their minds, products evolve, tastes evolve. Sure it's tempting to feel betrayed when an artist leaves a brand you like for another one, or when a brand ditches an artist you like to pick up one you don't...but really, is it worth it ?


----------



## Sogradde

eightsixboy said:


> Then on the flip side, long term loyal artists like Nita only gets a Indo sig after having years of LACS guitars, they should have at least done both MIJ and Indo as that guitar has 1000x more uniqueness and marketability then some random AZ sig of non mainstream artists. Marco only now finally gets a MIJ after been with Ibanez for 15+ years.


I read somewhere that Nita chose to release an indo sig over an MIJ one because the japanese version would've been too expensive. I think Kiko's sig kinda proves that point.
Loyalty doesn't matter in this at all though.


----------



## StevenC

Exchanger said:


> Nobodies...lol
> So on one hand, some people complain that it's just business, and on the other hand when they just hire some "obscure" guy eventhough it "might" not be profitable, it's also wrong... I think we shouldn't read too much into that. Artists change their minds, companies change their minds, products evolve, tastes evolve. Sure it's tempting to feel betrayed when an artist leaves a brand you like for another one, or when a brand ditches an artist you like to pick up one you don't...but really, is it worth it ?


My point was that I don't like their music, so they aren't going to sell me an Ibanez. Intending to lampoon the notion that because the other guy doesn't like Polyphia they shouldn't have signature guitars. I don't really care who gets an Ibanez signature unless it's a guitar I really like.


----------



## couverdure

If this were 2002, this thread would be complaining about Korn getting Ibanez sigs because nu metal was, and still is, the butt of all metal genres and to an extent mainstream music.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

couverdure said:


> If this were 2002, this thread would be complaining about Korn getting Ibanez sigs because nu metal was, and still is, the butt of all metal genres and to an extent mainstream music.



Man, it's crazy to think back to how long ago that was. I remember the rumors in 2000 about getting sigs. 

That said, back in 2000 Korn was fucking on fire! Even if you didn't like Nu Metal you were listening to Issues. The thing went to #1 on Billboard. That was something of a watershed moment for 7s. Thier success and popularity arguably lead to the release of the RG7321 which helped get more folks into 7s than anything else up until that point.

Oh, memories.


----------



## cardinal

My two cents: 

1) Ibanez “gave” signature guitars to folks in hopes they’ll sell. I’m not super familiar with these new guys, but I gather they have a large social media following. People bothering to have found and followed them on YouTube and such are not just ordinary folks listening to music: they are extremely likely to be gear heads like us and likely to buy stuff!!! 

Makes sense to me, especially with Ibanez wanting to launch the AZ line. Whose’s to say that Ibanez wouldn’t have released a number of these AZ variants anyway, and just found a winning situation to release them as sig models for artists with lots of guitar-buying followers. 

2) it’s hard to analyze Ibanez’s past decisions because they may have been mistakes! Or were the best decision then but wouldn’t be now. 

Loosing Petrucci seems to have been horrible as EBMM was able to launch nearly an entire brand on his name. It wouldn’t surprise me if Ibanez regrets that; but maybe that is part of the push to introduce the AZ and such: recognizing that perhaps their line up did have a gaping hole and they are desperate to fill it quickly. 

As with any gear, buy it if you like it. Don’t buy it if you don’t. Ibanez will do it’s thing, and sometimes it’ll hit home runs (Jem/RG with the Vai relationship) and sometimes it may make mistakes (imagine if Ibanez had worked with Petrucci and launched all of those sigs and new models instead; they sure seem to sell).


----------



## possumkiller

They should do a K7 reissue.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

possumkiller said:


> They should do a K7 reissue.



We're coming up on the 20th anniversary of the K7, 2021. I wonder if we'll see something.


----------



## possumkiller

cardinal said:


> a gaping hole and they are desperate to fill it quickly.


----------



## odibrom

MaxOfMetal said:


> Man, it's crazy to think back to how long ago that was. I remember the rumors in 2000 about getting sigs.
> 
> That said, back in 2000 Korn was fucking on fire! Even if you didn't like Nu Metal you were listening to Issues. The thing went to #1 on Billboard. That was something of a watershed moment for 7s. Thier success and popularity arguably lead to the release of the RG7321 which helped get more folks into 7s than anything else up until that point.
> 
> Oh, memories.




... we could argue that it's because of that that this forum was created... hence its name?... let those Chon and Poliphia guys get their signs, good for them even if one doesn't like their music.




possumkiller said:


> They should do a K7 reissue.



There are 2 blue K7s for sale at my local used stuff web site for about 1300€ each. both mint or in pretty good shape. One of them is on sale for more than 1 year already, Hell, I think it was up when I got my 2nd RG2027X almost 3 years ago...


----------



## jwoods986

Soya said:


> Paul Stanley is a nobody?



I'm glad I'm not the only one that caught that -lol. He has probably sold more albums and played in front of more people than all those others combined! Certainly more than any one of them individually.

Also, I wouldn't call Munky a nobody either. Although, I can't imagine that his sig. sells that many (I guess enough to keep making them?).


----------



## PunkBillCarson

couverdure said:


> If this were 2002, this thread would be complaining about Korn getting Ibanez sigs because nu metal was, and still is, the butt of all metal genres and to an extent mainstream music.



I don't know, man, the butt? Because it's progressive/djent these days that sounds like synchronized duck farts.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

PunkBillCarson said:


> I don't know, man, the butt? Because it's progressive/djent these days that sounds like synchronized duck farts.



Yeahhh djent _*did*_ kind of take nu-metal's thunder on the whole "just shit on me relentlessly" front.

Admittedly not hard to do when you come across band names like 'Aviations' and other random, nonsensical pluralizations.


----------



## narad

Soya said:


> Paul Stanley is a nobody?



It's a joke. Paul Stanley, that is.


----------



## eightsixboy

narad said:


> So... do you think they're rewarding these guys for years of loyalty, or that they want to sell a bunch of Ibanezes to young metal instagram kids?



Its the later of course lol. Can't be taken seriously on the tube or gram without the current trend gear.



StevenC said:


> Friedman has jumped around between Gibson, PRS, Ibanez and now back to Jackson; he was at Ibanez the longest since leaving Megadeth. Broderick disappeared from Ibanez without telling them, and Dave Mustaine claims he told him to get a signature guitar with a real company like Jackson. The best report I can find is that Petrucci left Ibanez just because he wanted something not Ibanez.
> 
> 
> 
> Except that's not true. They've only been playing Ibanez electrics since 2015, at least publicly. All their social media posts are Ibanez guitars. I'd never seen them with anything else until I went back to look for it.
> 
> Also, Vai is working with Synergy now on a signature module.



So what about all the videos and posts on them playing EBMM guitars? Or did they take them down? The vid they did with Jason with only EBMM guitars. They had heaps of posts with them. Yes they were playing Ibanez, they also had Jacksons. Will they get a Jackson sig now as well due to that?

Petrucci left becuase Ibanez wouldn't build stuff to his specs and EBMM were more then happy to, this has been documented many times from people who have spoken to John. I think it was becuase of a 7 string or something.

Yes Vai is working with Synergy now becuase Carvin doesn't exist anymore. Can't continue a relatiionship for a company that doesn't exist, hardly the same as ceasing to work with a company anymore because you don't want to.



MaxOfMetal said:


> It's all business. I don't know why that's such a difficult concept for folks. Not aiming that at you specifically, as with every new NAMM cycle the same notion of endorsements being based on arbitrary concepts of "loyalty" and "appreciation" and "deserving" comes up, when in actuality this is all based on financial decisions and legal agreements negotiated by teams of people who aren't necessarily the artist themselves or even musicians for that matter.



It's not at all hard to grasp, not saying it isn't, yes it's all business, I think the EBMM st.vincent sig pointed this out quite clearly to people, for me anyway its just sad they feel obliged to follow a current trend because of a certain minority group or trend, just like the whole "lets copy Kiesel" that Ibanez and Schecter have done the last few years with those hideous beveled looking iron labels. It makes brands less unique and to common between each other, like a wall of guitars that all look the same regardless of brand.

It looks like people have differing opinions on this subject, some hate these types of sigs and some like them, each to their own.

I will say that if they released the Scott lepage sig as just a normal AZ model, and was maybe a MIJ version at similar price as the TQM1 and MM1 I think it would be a really nice guitar, of all the new sigs that at least looks like it had some thought put into the aesthetics, just a shame its as $$$ as it is and is still MII, its similar price to the standard prestige AZ's which is crazy, why would anyone pick that over the standard MIJ version


----------



## gunch

Last I heard Carvin Audio came back as a seperate company from kEY-zel


----------



## Seabeast2000

narad said:


> It's a joke. Paul Stanley, that is.


 hey! He was made for lovin' you baby.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Strike through for impact.


----------



## spudmunkey

silverabyss said:


> Last I heard Carvin Audio came back as a seperate company from kEY-zel



Yes, exclusively preamp pedals, in terms of guitar gear...and a random selection of (what I assume are just re-branded) live performance audio-type products.


----------



## odibrom

The906 said:


> Strike through for impact.
> 
> View attachment 66614



In my book, that means "no go" or "wrong answer", something to cut out or thrash... bad logo decision... I wonder how long will it hold...


----------



## Vyn

Just got my hands on the 2027XL. Holy shit. Ibanez have knocked it out of the park with this one. Lighting in the store is a bit shit, will see if I can grab a photo of the finish tomorrow. Nicest extended range 7 I've played in a long time.


----------



## A-Branger

gone for a few days and got bunch of pages to catchup....havent read all the post but:

whats the big deal with Polyphia and you guys jealousy? who cares? guitars are beautiful (to me), and at their worst it only gives you guys more options to buy.

as already posted before from other people, Polyphia were already endorsed for few years, as soon as the AZ line was announced they were almost the first to get customs AZs, so they ave been playing and touring with those since the AZ announcement, like what 2/3 years?, if not I was actually expecting their sigs to come out last year.

as for "they dont deserve it!" argument:

already mentioned that most Ibanez artist sigs were introduced in their early careers. I only knew about Tosin and Jake because Ibanez. Not sure how long Dragonforce had as a career when they got theirs but I think they just had trough the fire and flames(or whatever name) song blew up and then Ibanez gave them sigs to the two of them. Also Petrucci only got his jsut after Pull me Under became a hit, so he was an almost un-known artist/band by then, ect ect

back them was eassier for a band to break out and "make it", these days not so much unless you are a pop/rnb/whatever artist. Heck evens tuff like normal rock is hard, go think about bands you know and all of them are quite old. Most of those artist or already have long endorsements, previous sigs, ect. Also remember Ibanez tend to like shredders a bit more than a regular riff guy of a big rock band. Its their brand image so thats what they chase more.

Polyphia fills all their boxes: New artist (before another brand snatch them), shreders on a guitar soloing driven music (all about the guitar), well known (or at leats enough with good followers/numbers)... plus the perfect music/style/look/ect to the AZ range. Seriusly, it fits sooo perfect. I wouldnt see Meshugah playing a AZ, nor didnt fit me Polyphia playing RGs either. The AZ fits their music better, and waht they want to market the AZ line for


"but they havent earn it yet!!!!!...."

cool, but who does at this time??....seriously, who is out there right now who is BIG, or HUGE, who can play PLAY, and who is "new" in the industry so its not a brand hopper with a long history of previous sigs/deals/ect


----------



## Vyn

Excuse the fingerprints


----------



## odibrom

... soooo you bought a new guitar?


----------



## Vyn

odibrom said:


> ... soooo you bought a new guitar?



*Buying. I've had a deposit on this for a while, just need to pay it off. Finally rocked up at the store yesterday and got to have a bit of a play. So worth the wait!


----------



## ExileMetal

The grain on that fingerboard is awesome, nice!


----------



## odibrom

Vyn said:


> *Buying. I've had a deposit on this for a while, just need to pay it off. Finally rocked up at the store yesterday and got to have a bit of a play. So worth the wait!



NGD soon is then to be expected...


----------



## Nick

oh well, 2027 incoming for me then....


----------



## odibrom

... I already have 2 of those 2027s... but mine are the double edge versions, which are 25.5", not 27" (?)... I'm also quite curious on these ones...


----------



## Musiscience

Vyn said:


> View attachment 66809
> 
> 
> Excuse the fingerprints



This is beautiful! I didn’t expect them to hit the stores so soon after namm. Can’t wait for an rg5220m NGD, this guitar speaks so much to me.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

A-Branger said:


> gone for a few days and got bunch of pages to catchup....havent read all the post but:
> 
> whats the big deal with Polyphia and you guys jealousy? who cares? guitars are beautiful (to me), and at their worst it only gives you guys more options to buy.
> 
> as already posted before from other people, Polyphia were already endorsed for few years, as soon as the AZ line was announced they were almost the first to get customs AZs, so they ave been playing and touring with those since the AZ announcement, like what 2/3 years?, if not I was actually expecting their sigs to come out last year.
> 
> as for "they dont deserve it!" argument:
> 
> already mentioned that most Ibanez artist sigs were introduced in their early careers. I only knew about Tosin and Jake because Ibanez. Not sure how long Dragonforce had as a career when they got theirs but I think they just had trough the fire and flames(or whatever name) song blew up and then Ibanez gave them sigs to the two of them. Also Petrucci only got his jsut after Pull me Under became a hit, so he was an almost un-known artist/band by then, ect ect
> 
> back them was eassier for a band to break out and "make it", these days not so much unless you are a pop/rnb/whatever artist. Heck evens tuff like normal rock is hard, go think about bands you know and all of them are quite old. Most of those artist or already have long endorsements, previous sigs, ect. Also remember Ibanez tend to like shredders a bit more than a regular riff guy of a big rock band. Its their brand image so thats what they chase more.
> 
> Polyphia fills all their boxes: New artist (before another brand snatch them), shreders on a guitar soloing driven music (all about the guitar), well known (or at leats enough with good followers/numbers)... plus the perfect music/style/look/ect to the AZ range. Seriusly, it fits sooo perfect. I wouldnt see Meshugah playing a AZ, nor didnt fit me Polyphia playing RGs either. The AZ fits their music better, and waht they want to market the AZ line for
> 
> 
> "but they havent earn it yet!!!!!...."
> 
> cool, but who does at this time??....seriously, who is out there right now who is BIG, or HUGE, who can play PLAY, and who is "new" in the industry so its not a brand hopper with a long history of previous sigs/deals/ect



I dont like these modern guys' music but thats not here nor there. I think the BEST artist for the AZ is Andy Timmons, HANDS DOWN. His style of playing, and his AT100 being closely spec'd to what the AZs are what makes him the one person who shoulda got one FIRST, not any of these other guys. 

Now I'm not shitting on polyphia even if i personally think they're music is shit: I just think the better endorser for the AZs is Andy Timmons.


----------



## I play music

Vyn said:


> View attachment 66809
> 
> 
> Excuse the fingerprints


I thought the 24th fret inlay might just be off on the first photo because maybe they added the inlays in photo shop or something to have it ready in time and their prototype didn't have inlays or whatever... but looks like the 24th fret inlay really is in a different height than the others  Other than that it's really a beautiful guitar though...


----------



## A-Branger

MatiasTolkki said:


> I dont like these modern guys' music but thats not here nor there. I think the BEST artist for the AZ is Andy Timmons, HANDS DOWN. His style of playing, and his AT100 being closely spec'd to what the AZs are what makes him the one person who shoulda got one FIRST, not any of these other guys.
> 
> Now I'm not shitting on polyphia even if i personally think they're music is shit: I just think the better endorser for the AZs is Andy Timmons.



Yeah Andy Timmons is a perfect fit. Like you said since he already had an RG spec like an AZ line is. He should had have his last year too. At least he got it this year too.

But Polyphia with their more “pop”-ish (not metal) music and their more clean/single coil-ish sound fits the AZ line great. That plus the shredder part of them is the reason why they got it (IMO) as opposed to lest say the guy from Tesseract whos is a bigger band and hes been endorsed longer, but hes into RGDs And his playing is more riff bassed. Maybe he could get one in the future too? Since Jake and the guy from BTBAM got one. But to push the AZ line Polyphia is a better fit


----------



## The 1

Go look at Polyphia's social media following/presence, compared to Andy Timmons or those other guys. Polyphia appeals to a younger fanbase, and they connect with those fans. They also are indeed more pop-ish, and that's a good thing in Ibanez' eyes.

Signatures are based on marketing and sales potential, not who is "worthy". On this basis, I really can't think of many guitarists today who would be more "deserving". Ibanez absolutely made the right move giving Polyphia sigs, it would've been really stupid not to. If anything, I'm surprised they didn't get sigs when the AZ first launched.


----------



## nikt

Vyn said:


> View attachment 66809
> 
> 
> Excuse the fingerprints



It's missing the middle pickup...


----------



## Vyn

nikt said:


> It's missing the middle pickup...



My picking hand doesn't miss it  Seriously, I think every HSH guitar I've owned I've ended up removing the single coil in the middle or winding the screws out so that it's as flat as possible against the body otherwise it gets annihilated by my picking hand


----------



## Albake21

Vyn said:


> My picking hand doesn't miss it  Seriously, I think every HSH guitar I've owned I've ended up removing the single coil in the middle or winding the screws out so that it's as flat as possible against the body otherwise it gets annihilated by my picking hand


I've never owned an HSH guitar that I didn't immediately lower the middle pickup as far as it can go. Nothing pisses me off more than scraping a middle pickup with my pick.


----------



## A-Branger

Vyn said:


> My picking hand doesn't miss it  Seriously, I think every HSH guitar I've owned I've ended up removing the single coil in the middle or winding the screws out so that it's as flat as possible against the body otherwise it gets annihilated by my picking hand


The reason why my GAS for a Jem was fully killed. 5 years GASing for one, all gone in 5 seconds of playing lol


----------



## ThePIGI King

How the hell do you guys play??? I mean, my pick hardly, if at all, goes under the strings. I've never touched a pup with my pick, unless it was on purpose. Didn't you guys learn how to hold a pick? Don't hold it from the top


----------



## Kaura

ThePIGI King said:


> How the hell do you guys play??? I mean, my pick hardly, if at all, goes under the strings. I've never touched a pup with my pick, unless it was on purpose. Didn't you guys learn how to hold a pick? Don't hold it from the top



Do you even djent, brah? When I'm doing some extreme chugs I'm basicly scraping the top of the body with the pick. 

But yeah, f*ck middle pickups. I always thought I was weird when I got my first HSH guitar and the middle pickup got in my way all the time but I'm glad I'm not the only one.


----------



## odibrom

My first electric guitar was an HSS, my second (which I still own but rarely play) is an HSH and these have been my go to guitars from 92/3 until 2001. By the end of 2001 I bought my first 7 stringer, which is HH and never ever got back to HSH guitars again... Now, whenever I play the only HSH, the middle pickup seams to find its way to block my pick, but my picks also got heavier and thicker and... metal, really, they're made of 4mm thick steel... no middle pickup for also.


----------



## eightsixboy

ThePIGI King said:


> How the hell do you guys play??? I mean, my pick hardly, if at all, goes under the strings. I've never touched a pup with my pick, unless it was on purpose. Didn't you guys learn how to hold a pick? Don't hold it from the top



Are you the same guy spurting this crap last time?

There is a reason players like Petrucci, Morse, Kiko, Paul Gilbert etc all have their middle pickups wound low, you hit it when you pick, especially if you play hard. Has nothing to do with "proper technique".

Just watch some of Troy Grady's stuff and you'll see how much your pick actually goes under the string.


----------



## eightsixboy

A-Branger said:


> gone for a few days and got bunch of pages to catchup....havent read all the post but:
> 
> whats the big deal with Polyphia and you guys jealousy? who cares? guitars are beautiful (to me), and at their worst it only gives you guys more options to buy.
> 
> as already posted before from other people, Polyphia were already endorsed for few years, as soon as the AZ line was announced they were almost the first to get customs AZs, so they ave been playing and touring with those since the AZ announcement, like what 2/3 years?, if not I was actually expecting their sigs to come out last year.
> 
> as for "they dont deserve it!" argument:
> 
> already mentioned that most Ibanez artist sigs were introduced in their early careers. I only knew about Tosin and Jake because Ibanez. Not sure how long Dragonforce had as a career when they got theirs but I think they just had trough the fire and flames(or whatever name) song blew up and then Ibanez gave them sigs to the two of them. Also Petrucci only got his jsut after Pull me Under became a hit, so he was an almost un-known artist/band by then, ect ect
> 
> back them was eassier for a band to break out and "make it", these days not so much unless you are a pop/rnb/whatever artist. Heck evens tuff like normal rock is hard, go think about bands you know and all of them are quite old. Most of those artist or already have long endorsements, previous sigs, ect. Also remember Ibanez tend to like shredders a bit more than a regular riff guy of a big rock band. Its their brand image so thats what they chase more.
> 
> Polyphia fills all their boxes: New artist (before another brand snatch them), shreders on a guitar soloing driven music (all about the guitar), well known (or at leats enough with good followers/numbers)... plus the perfect music/style/look/ect to the AZ range. Seriusly, it fits sooo perfect. I wouldnt see Meshugah playing a AZ, nor didnt fit me Polyphia playing RGs either. The AZ fits their music better, and waht they want to market the AZ line for
> 
> 
> "but they havent earn it yet!!!!!...."
> 
> cool, but who does at this time??....seriously, who is out there right now who is BIG, or HUGE, who can play PLAY, and who is "new" in the industry so its not a brand hopper with a long history of previous sigs/deals/ect



Its not about jealousy, whats to be jealous about? I would rather have a bunch of LAC's then an indo sig. None of the guys who have gotten indo sigs in the past have ever used them, Marco barely used his, always used his other Ibanez RG's, Kiko never ever used his indo sigs, vai was spotted once with a pink indo Jem at a charity event and thats about it. 

I think the reason some are salty about it is its just so half ass'd, like they were rolling out the sigs one after another and just going through their roster or something. None of them look good except the Scott lepage one, I doubt their going to sell a bunch of them at the price they want for them, IMO go all out and do a proper sig or don't bother, consumers don't want to spend that much on a indo sig model when you can get a normal prestige for the same or less. 

It's the same with the Jiva sig, apparently she wanted to keep costs down so didn't want a MIJ sig but the irony is her indo sig is still waaaaaaay overpriced anyway.



Vyn said:


> View attachment 66809
> 
> 
> Excuse the fingerprints



Please tell me thats the case they come in?

Looks like the RG852 cases which are so pretty


----------



## Vyn

eightsixboy said:


> Its not about jealousy, whats to be jealous about? I would rather have a bunch of LAC's then an indo sig. None of the guys who have gotten indo sigs in the past have ever used them, Marco barely used his, always used his other Ibanez RG's, Kiko never ever used his indo sigs, vai was spotted once with a pink indo Jem at a charity event and thats about it.
> 
> I think the reason some are salty about it is its just so half ass'd, like they were rolling out the sigs one after another and just going through their roster or something. None of them look good except the Scott lepage one, I doubt their going to sell a bunch of them at the price they want for them, IMO go all out and do a proper sig or don't bother, consumers don't want to spend that much on a indo sig model when you can get a normal prestige for the same or less.
> 
> It's the same with the Jiva sig, apparently she wanted to keep costs down so didn't want a MIJ sig but the irony is her indo sig is still waaaaaaay overpriced anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> Please tell me thats the case they come in?
> 
> Looks like the RG852 cases which are so pretty



Yeah, that's the case. I was taken aback initially because I was expecting the regular red finishing of the normal Prestige case haha.


----------



## couverdure

eightsixboy said:


> I think the reason some are salty about it is its just so half ass'd, like they were rolling out the sigs one after another and just going through their roster or something. None of them look good except the Scott lepage one, I doubt their going to sell a bunch of them at the price they want for them, IMO go all out and do a proper sig or don't bother, consumers don't want to spend that much on a indo sig model when you can get a normal prestige for the same or less.


You do know that Polyphia's fans are the same kind of people who would buy anything with a Supreme label on it, right? That might be my impression judging by their appearances and personalities, but their fans are willing to spend that much money on guitars very similar to the ones their favorite guitarists play.


----------



## eightsixboy

couverdure said:


> You do know that Polyphia's fans are the same kind of people who would buy anything with a Supreme label on it, right? That might be my impression judging by their appearances and personalities, but their fans are willing to spend that much money on guitars very similar to the ones their favorite guitarists play.



Even more reason for them not to have a sig lol. 

Seems like its more important these days to be seen with the cool trendy gear in your IG posts then it is about actually caring about he quality of the gear you are playing.


----------



## eightsixboy

Vyn said:


> Yeah, that's the case. I was taken aback initially because I was expecting the regular red finishing of the normal Prestige case haha.



Thats awesome, I hope its all the new Prestige models then including the 5000 series. 

The color looks great, I'm sure you're stoked about it


----------



## couverdure

eightsixboy said:


> Even more reason for them not to have a sig lol.
> 
> Seems like its more important these days to be seen with the cool trendy gear in your IG posts then it is about actually caring about he quality of the gear you are playing.


I get it, you want every signature model to be made in Fujigen. I'm honestly getting sick of the "No MIJ, no care" mentality and the assumption that everyone can afford five JEM7Vs and a J Custom that's going around here. It's a lose-lose situation either way if people can't afford them, but I'm still fine with Tim & Scott/Mario & Erick putting out accessibly available sigs sooner.


----------



## Hollowway

couverdure said:


> You do know that Polyphia's fans are the same kind of people who would buy anything with a Supreme label on it.



That’s hitting dangerously close to my pizza preference there, buddy! *shakes fist*


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

The 1 said:


> If anything, I'm surprised they didn't get sigs when the AZ first launched.



My guess is that over the span of 2 years (1 year before and 1 after the AZ's launch) prototype versions were road tested and artists were given time to design their final product (Chon and Polyphia had custom AZs on tour). Or perhaps Martin Miller and Tom Quale may have just crossed that finish line first.


----------



## TGN

Bloody_Inferno said:


> My guess is that over the span of 2 years (1 year before and 1 after the AZ's launch) prototype versions were road tested and artists were given time to design their final product (Chon and Polyphia had custom AZs on tour). Or perhaps Martin Miller and Tom Quale may have just crossed that finish line first.



From various interviews I got the impression that Martin was involved quite early in the AZ development process.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

eightsixboy said:


> Are you the same guy spurting this crap last time?
> 
> There is a reason players like Petrucci, Morse, Kiko, Paul Gilbert etc all have their middle pickups wound low, you hit it when you pick, especially if you play hard. Has nothing to do with "proper technique".
> 
> Just watch some of Troy Grady's stuff and you'll see how much your pick actually goes under the string.



I know I've hit a middle pickup quite a few times at stores when trying them out because of the pole pieces, but I still wont lower my middle blue velvet too far on my 550 because I have it set up for out of phase with the bridge and neck pups, and I need that tone fro Brian may sorta stuff.


----------



## Kaura

Some people in this thread sound like they think AZ is a Andy Timbers (or whateverthefuckhisnameis) signature model instead of just a body type that Ibanez is trying to push to all kinds of people they're capable of hence getting the Polyphia and Chon guys to appeal to younger generations and some of the old guys to appeal to them.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

couverdure said:


> I get it, you want every signature model to be made in Fujigen. I'm honestly getting sick of the "No MIJ, no care" mentality and the assumption that everyone can afford five JEM7Vs and a J Custom that's going around here. It's a lose-lose situation either way if people can't afford them, but I'm still fine with Tim & Scott/Mario & Erick putting out accessibly available sigs sooner.



I hate the indos, but i see a need for them. I wouldnt say "Dont make em," my position is more of "Ibanez you douchebags, get the QC up at your indo factory so you actually have some goddamn consistency, like the MIJs."


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Kaura said:


> Some people in this thread sound like they think AZ is a Andy Timbers (or whateverthefuckhisnameis) signature model instead of just a body type that Ibanez is trying to push to all kinds of people they're capable of hence getting the Polyphia and Chon guys to appeal to younger generations and some of the old guys to appeal to them.



Asshat, it's Andy Timmons, and he plays circles around the polyphia guys.


----------



## aesthyrian

This anti-Polyphia circle jerk just needs it's own thread at this point. No one gives a shit how qualified any of us may think an artist is to deserve a signature from a guitar brand we don't own. Just stop, you're all becoming more cringe-worthy than Polyphia themselves.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

TGN said:


> From various interviews I got the impression that Martin was involved quite early in the AZ development process.



Yeah, Martin and Quayle were definitely part of the development prior to the launch. I'm also guessing that's why their sigs didn't deviate from the standard models too much.

As for all this silly sig talk... buy my music so I can get an AZ sig!  You don't have to like it, but hey, I'm allowed to do some shameless self promotion every now and then. BUY MY STUFF!


----------



## Seabeast2000

aesthyrian said:


> This anti-Polyphia circle jerk just needs it's own thread at this point. No one gives a shit how qualified any of us may think an artist is to deserve a signature from a guitar brand we don't own. Just stop, you're all becoming more cringe-worthy than Polyphia themselves.



My AZ sig is going to have a giant single coil in the middle position.


----------



## Vyn

ThePIGI King said:


> How the hell do you guys play??? I mean, my pick hardly, if at all, goes under the strings. I've never touched a pup with my pick, unless it was on purpose. Didn't you guys learn how to hold a pick? Don't hold it from the top



For reference:



I've always had issues striking the middle pickup, especially when downpicking aggressively.


----------



## Sogradde

couverdure said:


> I get it, you want every signature model to be made in Fujigen. I'm honestly getting sick of the "No MIJ, no care" mentality and the assumption that everyone can afford five JEM7Vs and a J Custom that's going around here. It's a lose-lose situation either way if people can't afford them, but I'm still fine with Tim & Scott/Mario & Erick putting out accessibly available sigs sooner.


I talked to the guitar guy in my local shop recently. He told me he doesn't stock prestiges anymore because they don't sell. The only ones you can get are the ones hanging in the showroom.
Dunno if this is just germans being german or if this is indicative of the market but I found that quite interesting actually.


----------



## Lindmann

Not every guitar player is a guitar enthusiast willing to spent that kind of money.
I for one am having a hard time justifying a guitar purchase above 1500€, even if I can afford it.
The law of diminishing returns combined with beeing a stingy motherfucker makes these guitars pretty unattractive.

SSO packed with so many real enthusiasts might not be representative for the real word.


----------



## prlgmnr

Is it _really _this hard to understand that different people play the guitar in a wide range of different ways?

"I don't like a middle pickup because I hit it by accident with the pick"

"What are you talking about, I _never_ hit my middle pickup with a pick, you must be completely lacking in brain and motor function"


----------



## I play music

Sogradde said:


> I talked to the guitar guy in my local shop recently. He told me he doesn't stock prestiges anymore because they don't sell. The only ones you can get are the ones hanging in the showroom.
> Dunno if this is just germans being german or if this is indicative of the market but I found that quite interesting actually.


What shop is this? I think guys willing to spend more usually go to bigger shops with a big selection of guitars interesting to them. Small local shops in my experience have 99% customers buying starter sets or guitars or single strings because they broke one and don't have spares etc. Occasionally the old blues granddad liking strats or Les Pauls might come in but that's it. Meaning the only guitars some local shops can sell in the >750€ range are probably strats and Les Pauls. The Ibanez Prestige guys probably go to one of the few big shops where they can try the whole Prestige lineup ... or order online.


----------



## AirForbes1

I'm also in the no middle pickup club. I could live with it, but it's going to get chewed up. Since I rarely use it (I like the parallel bridge or inner coils just fine for straty sounds), I'd rather just not have it. 

It's obviously a thing. I'm not shocked that anyone here has the same issues. Guthrie Govan has his middle pickup way low, Martin Miller has no middle pickup and those guys....to say that they can play and have excellent technique is an understatement.


----------



## Fierce_Swe

No middle pickups for me plz........


----------



## Sogradde

I play music said:


> What shop is this? I think guys willing to spend more usually go to bigger shops with a big selection of guitars interesting to them. Small local shops in my experience have 99% customers buying starter sets or guitars or single strings because they broke one and don't have spares etc. Occasionally the old blues granddad liking strats or Les Pauls might come in but that's it. Meaning the only guitars some local shops can sell in the >750€ range are probably strats and Les Pauls. The Ibanez Prestige guys probably go to one of the few big shops where they can try the whole Prestige lineup ... or order online.


www.justmusic.de
The biggest one we have in northern germany, apart from PPC Hannover.


----------



## Lindmann

Oh da wollte ich morgen auch hin.


----------



## diagrammatiks

eightsixboy said:


> Its not about jealousy, whats to be jealous about? I would rather have a bunch of LAC's then an indo sig. None of the guys who have gotten indo sigs in the past have ever used them, Marco barely used his, always used his other Ibanez RG's, Kiko never ever used his indo sigs, vai was spotted once with a pink indo Jem at a charity event and thats about it.
> 
> I think the reason some are salty about it is its just so half ass'd, like they were rolling out the sigs one after another and just going through their roster or something. None of them look good except the Scott lepage one, I doubt their going to sell a bunch of them at the price they want for them, IMO go all out and do a proper sig or don't bother, consumers don't want to spend that much on a indo sig model when you can get a normal prestige for the same or less.
> 
> It's the same with the Jiva sig, apparently she wanted to keep costs down so didn't want a MIJ sig but the irony is her indo sig is still waaaaaaay overpriced anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> Please tell me thats the case they come in?
> 
> Looks like the RG852 cases which are so pretty



I’ve spent a ton of time with a couple of jivas at the store. They are easily as good as any other 1500 guitar. That’s all that really matters


----------



## I play music

Sogradde said:


> www.justmusic.de
> The biggest one we have in northern germany, apart from PPC Hannover.


I've only gone to a Justmusic once and their offering was a bit disappointing. They had loads of <500€ guitars and super expensive Fender/Gibsons but their selection of higher quality modern guitars was quite lacking across all brands. Actually I didn't see a single guitar I was really interested in.
I think we don't have a lot of options worth mentioning here in Germany. Thomann, Music Store, Pro Music Tools, anything else?


----------



## Bastian93

I play music said:


> I've only gone to a Justmusic once and their offering was a bit disappointing. They had loads of <500€ guitars and super expensive Fender/Gibsons but their selection of higher quality modern guitars was quite lacking across all brands. Actually I didn't see a single guitar I was really interested in.
> I think we don't have a lot of options worth mentioning here in Germany. Thomann, Music Store, Pro Music Tools, anything else?



Station Music near Ulm is quite interesting. I´ve never been there ( yet) but looking at the website they have lots of high end guitars in stock. Hope I find the timeto check out the shop in person soon.


----------



## Andromalia

Sogradde said:


> www.justmusic.de
> The biggest one we have in northern germany, apart from PPC Hannover.



Probably OT but won't create a topic just for it, why is it that all the big music internet stores in europe are located in Germany ? More favorable tax situation or something ?


----------



## Millul

Andromalia said:


> Probably OT but won't create a topic just for it, why is it that all the big music internet stores in europe are located in Germany ? More favorable tax situation or something ?



The biggest economy in the EU - that should seal it, I think...


----------



## I play music

Bastian93 said:


> Station Music near Ulm is quite interesting. I´ve never been there ( yet) but looking at the website they have lots of high end guitars in stock. Hope I find the timeto check out the shop in person soon.


First time I hear that name. 


Millul said:


> The biggest economy in the EU - that should seal it, I think...


Germany is also somewhat the center of the EU geographically. Guess that's also an advantage logistically.


----------



## soldierkahn

cardinal said:


> The pics on the Ibanez website make it look lame. But here, you can see the glory of the DY finish, and wow I really love it.



Don't kill me but I'd love it more with a black binding for contrast


----------



## ThePIGI King

prlgmnr said:


> Is it _really _this hard to understand that different people play the guitar in a wide range of different ways?
> 
> "I don't like a middle pickup because I hit it by accident with the pick"
> 
> "What are you talking about, I _never_ hit my middle pickup with a pick, you must be completely lacking in brain and motor function"



 I'm just trying to understand how it's being held to accomplish that. Because, as I said, when I play, so very little of my pick is exposed, to where unless I had the middle pup touching the string, I would not hit it. Rather than bashing, I was more curious and asking about what makes people hit it.

I do, usually, come off as abrasive and rude. Or so my gf tells me


----------



## eightsixboy

couverdure said:


> I get it, you want every signature model to be made in Fujigen. I'm honestly getting sick of the "No MIJ, no care" mentality and the assumption that everyone can afford five JEM7Vs and a J Custom that's going around here. It's a lose-lose situation either way if people can't afford them, but I'm still fine with Tim & Scott/Mario & Erick putting out accessibly available sigs sooner.



The indo AZ's arn't good anyway, nor are they cheap, people are making out like they are affordable alternative when they are not. Why on earth would someone buy an indo AZ over a RG652/657 when they are only a few hundred apart? The Prestige AZ's arn't like double the indo prices either, around a 1/3 more. 

I wanted more then anything to like the Indo AZ's cause of that burst yellow finish they had, tried like 4-5 of them, all terrible. Over cut nut slots, very bad fret buzz (more then you would expect on a SS fret guitar), paint issues, all the necks felt super light and dead, like the wood is over dried cheap maple. Direct comparison to the standard Prestige AZ2402 was night and day difference, and the price difference is only like $600. If you can afford a $1299 indo AZ chances are you can get the Prestige for $1899, just wait and save up for it. 



aesthyrian said:


> This anti-Polyphia circle jerk just needs it's own thread at this point. No one gives a shit how qualified any of us may think an artist is to deserve a signature from a guitar brand we don't own. Just stop, you're all becoming more cringe-worthy than Polyphia themselves.



Well considering we are the consumer don't you think our opinion matters? Pretty sure Ibanez marketing would care about the people buying their guitars lol. 



ThePIGI King said:


> I'm just trying to understand how it's being held to accomplish that. Because, as I said, when I play, so very little of my pick is exposed, to where unless I had the middle pup touching the string, I would not hit it. Rather than bashing, I was more curious and asking about what makes people hit it.
> 
> I do, usually, come off as abrasive and rude. Or so my gf tells me



It's mainly just ends of the strings ie: either side of the E strings. Can't imagine someone hitting the middle pup from picking say between the D or g string. If you play a lot of heavier music with fast picking most find the middle pup in the way, where only talking like 2-3mm here. If you took a super slow mo of the pick angle and depth whilst playing some chugga chugga stuff or fast alt pick stuff on the high E you'd be surprised how much your pick moves.


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> Well considering we are the consumer don't you think our opinion matters? Pretty sure Ibanez marketing would care about the people buying their guitars lol.


No. 

The number of people who don't buy a product is a dumb way to judge the success of that product. 7.5 billion people won't buy these guitars. They care about who will buy them.


----------



## aesthyrian

eightsixboy said:


> Well considering we are the consumer don't you think our opinion matters? Pretty sure Ibanez marketing would care about the people buying their guitars lol.



Oh don't flatter yourself


----------



## narad

aesthyrian said:


> Oh don't flatter yourself



Found the Yelp reviewer.


----------



## eightsixboy

StevenC said:


> No.
> 
> The number of people who don't buy a product is a dumb way to judge the success of that product. 7.5 billion people won't buy these guitars. They care about who will buy them.



Ah what? I don't think the consumer base for Ibanez or guitars in general is the entire population. 

I was just making a point that they obviously don't care about the missed sales of their current consumer base or people in the industry. 

A lot of marketing firms base products on potential lost sales from making one product vs another, this is nothing new lol. 

I'm not really into Ibanez anymore due to their crappy decisions over the last 5-7 or so years, they used to be great, there line up was so good in the mid 2000's up until around 2012, now they are just barely OK with their range and prices. You can buy much better guitars that are MIJ or MIK for the same of less money now from other brands. Hell you can even buy much better MII guitars for way less then what Ibanez do them for cough Schecter cough

They are just fueling this trend of massively overpriced indo guitars and now the market is over saturated with them. A lot of people including myself just aren't buying new guitars anymore because of this, they are just simply not worth the $$$ anymore. The only exception to this rule that Ibanez have done recently is the RG550's, pretty much the only really good thing they have done for the last few years.


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> Ah what? I don't think the consumer base for Ibanez or guitars in general is the entire population.
> 
> I was just making a point that they obviously don't care about the missed sales of their current consumer base or people in the industry.
> 
> A lot of marketing firms base products on potential lost sales from making one product vs another, this is nothing new lol.
> 
> I'm not really into Ibanez anymore due to their crappy decisions over the last 5-7 or so years, they used to be great, there line up was so good in the mid 2000's up until around 2012, now they are just barely OK with their range and prices. You can buy much better guitars that are MIJ or MIK for the same of less money now from other brands. Hell you can even buy much better MII guitars for way less then what Ibanez do them for cough Schecter cough
> 
> They are just fueling this trend of massively overpriced indo guitars and now the market is over saturated with them. A lot of people including myself just aren't buying new guitars anymore because of this, they are just simply not worth the $$$ anymore. The only exception to this rule that Ibanez have done recently is the RG550's, pretty much the only really good thing they have done for the last few years.


Isn't your profile picture a 2016 Ibanez?


----------



## MatiasTolkki

eightsixboy said:


> Ah what? I don't think the consumer base for Ibanez or guitars in general is the entire population.
> 
> I was just making a point that they obviously don't care about the missed sales of their current consumer base or people in the industry.
> 
> A lot of marketing firms base products on potential lost sales from making one product vs another, this is nothing new lol.
> 
> I'm not really into Ibanez anymore due to their crappy decisions over the last 5-7 or so years, they used to be great, there line up was so good in the mid 2000's up until around 2012, now they are just barely OK with their range and prices. You can buy much better guitars that are MIJ or MIK for the same of less money now from other brands. Hell you can even buy much better MII guitars for way less then what Ibanez do them for cough Schecter cough
> 
> They are just fueling this trend of massively overpriced indo guitars and now the market is over saturated with them. A lot of people including myself just aren't buying new guitars anymore because of this, they are just simply not worth the $$$ anymore. The only exception to this rule that Ibanez have done recently is the RG550's, pretty much the only really good thing they have done for the last few years.



the roadcores were great axes, but the us only got the cheap ones, not the MIJs. i had an SGM and boy was that a nice guitar.


----------



## Vyn

I'd argue that Ibanez IS listening to their customer base, at least the Japanese one. The product line-up this year is in line with quite a few of the trends in Japan at the moment (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong @MatiasTolkki )


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Vyn said:


> I'd argue that Ibanez IS listening to their customer base, at least the Japanese one. The product line-up this year is in line with quite a few of the trends in Japan at the moment (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong @MatiasTolkki )



the AZs are proof of this. they have been selling quite well because no one wants a double locking trem, and for price points, they beat suhr and anderson by quite a bit.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

eightsixboy said:


> I was just making a point that they obviously don't care about the missed sales of their current consumer base or people in the industry.



That's pretty self explanatory. 

You can't chase every sale, you have to weigh which ones are worth while.

As big as Hoshino is, they're handicapped by thier tiered business model, they just don't have the ability to release every single model that every niche might want. 



> I'm not really into Ibanez anymore due to their crappy decisions over the last 5-7 or so years, they used to be great, there line up was so good in the mid 2000's up until around 2012, now they are just barely OK with their range and prices. You can buy much better guitars that are MIJ or MIK for the same of less money now from other brands. Hell you can even buy much better MII guitars for way less then what Ibanez do them for cough Schecter cough
> 
> They are just fueling this trend of massively overpriced indo guitars and now the market is over saturated with them. A lot of people including myself just aren't buying new guitars anymore because of this, they are just simply not worth the $$$ anymore. The only exception to this rule that Ibanez have done recently is the RG550's, pretty much the only really good thing they have done for the last few years.



A lot of this is through the lens of being based in Australia, which by all accounts is a horrendous place to buy production guitars given the small market, price of freight, and taxes assessed. 

In North America, thier biggest market, prices have been trending down for almost the last decade, and product mix has been getting better and better at the same time. 

Do they make everything I want at the price I want? Of course not. I don't see myself buying a new Ibanez any time soon, but that has to do with my own preferences.


----------



## waffles

Why did they removed almost all of the EMG-equipped guitars in the Iron Label line?

Actually, what the hell happened to the Iron Label line? Those new colorful finishes suck and don't scream 'all-out metal' at all, which what I believe the Iron Label line is supposed to be.


----------



## diagrammatiks

waffles said:


> Why did they removed almost all of the EMG-equipped guitars in the Iron Label line?
> 
> Actually, what the hell happened to the Iron Label line? Those new colorful finishes suck and don't scream 'all-out metal' at all, which what I believe the Iron Label line is supposed to be.



It's instagram metal. Not I wear all black and live with my mom metal.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> It's instagram metal. Not I wear all black and live with my mom metal.



Those aren't mutually exclusive.


----------



## Seabeast2000

diagrammatiks said:


> It's instagram metal. Not I wear all black and live with my mom metal.



I need to switch it up. Thanks.


----------



## Shoeless_jose

MaxOfMetal said:


> Those aren't mutually exclusive.


----------



## eightsixboy

StevenC said:


> Isn't your profile picture a 2016 Ibanez?



And? 

It was way over priced for what is was and only had a cheap veneer, only kept that guitar for about 3 months and traded it. Give me a RG8527 or RG3727 over the newer RG752's anyday of the week. The older Prestige were way better, better woods, better overall QC and specs.


----------



## StevenC

eightsixboy said:


> And?
> 
> It was way over priced for what is was and only had a cheap veneer, only kept that guitar for about 3 months and traded it. Give me a RG8527 or RG3727 over the newer RG752's anyday of the week. The older Prestige were way better, better woods, better overall QC and specs.


Yeah, I'd probably take a J Custom over not a J Custom too.


----------



## Vyn

FWIW, the RG752's are pretty good value for money (at least the non-spot model ones are) and are awesome quality. I understand if people gripe about the stock pickups not being as good, however most people are going to swap them anyway so I don't see it as an issue. The only feature they are probably lacking is SS frets however it's not that big of a deal breaker.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Vyn said:


> FWIW, the RG752's are pretty good value for money (at least the non-spot model ones are) and are awesome quality. I understand if people gripe about the stock pickups not being as good, however most people are going to swap them anyway so I don't see it as an issue. The only feature they are probably lacking is SS frets however it's not that big of a deal breaker.



People have gone decades without SS frets, dont see why it has become some sort of deal breaker. Ibanez uses Dunlop fretwire, some of the best on the market.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah I played the same guitar - I only owned one - from junior year of high school, through many bands and gigs, and only had it refretted when I was 33 years old. I have a light touch, and probably should have had a refret a few years before, but I think the “nickel frets are too soft” sentiment is exaggerated.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Hollowway said:


> Yeah I played the same guitar - I only owned one - from junior year of high school, through many bands and gigs, and only had it refretted when I was 33 years old. I have a light touch, and probably should have had a refret a few years before, but I think the “nickel frets are too soft” sentiment is exaggerated.



It's just a bunch of people trying to jump on some sort of bandwagon. I mean look at brian may, he has never once changed the frets on red special, and that guitar is well over 50 years old.


----------



## Avedas

I've had my MIJ Dinky since 2006 or so and the frets really are worn to shit, and I also play with a light touch. I mostly stopped playing it around 2012ish so most of the wear is from that in between period. The intonation has noticeably gone out in certain areas on it. I'll refret it with stainless whenever I feel like dropping $400 on it but for the moment it's still playable. I'm going to guess it was just made with kinda shitty fret wire but I'd really just prefer to have stainless and never worry about it again.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, all things being equal, I prefer SS for the lack of future maintenance (relatively speaking). For an upcharge like Kiesel does, it’s a no brainer. But I wouldn’t let it stop me from buying a guitar. It’s just not significant enough of an issue to me.


----------



## astrocreep

MatiasTolkki said:


> It's just a bunch of people trying to jump on some sort of bandwagon. I mean look at brian may, he has never once changed the frets on red special, and that guitar is well over 50 years old.



How long did he use .008, .009, .011, .016, 0.22, .034 strings?


----------



## Vyn

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, all things being equal, I prefer SS for the lack of future maintenance (relatively speaking). For an upcharge like Kiesel does, it’s a no brainer. But I wouldn’t let it stop me from buying a guitar. It’s just not significant enough of an issue to me.



That's really my major beef with SS frets, the additional costs because it's not like they have just taken an ordinary model and thrown SS frets on it (I'll be happy to pay the upcharge for that), they only appear on models with bonkers specs which themselves have an upcharge over standard specs


----------



## Albake21

Vyn said:


> That's really my major beef with SS frets, the additional costs because it's not like they have just taken an ordinary model and thrown SS frets on it (I'll be happy to pay the upcharge for that), they only appear on models with bonkers specs which themselves have an upcharge over standard specs


Which I never understood the big upcharge. SS frets barely cost more than nickel. They are only a couple dollars more...


----------



## Vyn

Albake21 said:


> Which I never understood the big upcharge. SS frets barely cost more than nickel. They are only a couple dollars more...



It does require different tooling and SS is harder on tooling so the upcharge for it is quite fair. It's only making them available on models with boutique pickups, exotic woods and crazy finishes that all cost a mint that's the problem. An extra $100-$200US for SS isn't a problem.


----------



## Mathemagician

$100 max. These are production models made enmasse. Even Kiesel only charged like $40 for a SS upgrade.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

The issue is that Ibanez can't just decide how much stainless steel frets cost, they're beholden to the builders, who can charge what they want. In the past Fujigen has been very averse to stainless steel frets, so I have a feeling they're making Hoshino pay big for it.



Mathemagician said:


> $100 max. These are production models made enmasse. Even Kiesel only charged like $40 for a SS upgrade.



Eh, it's all voodoo math. 

Now it's a "free" option, but the prices have gone up so it's just being baked in. 

Ibanez could likely do the same, but as been shown in the past, folks will only pay so much for a vanilla RG.


----------



## Avedas

MaxOfMetal said:


> In the past Fujigen has been very averse to stainless steel frets


Yeah, choosing fret material isn't even an option on their custom order forms


----------



## Hollowway

astrocreep said:


> How long did he use .008, .009, .011, .016, 0.22, .034 strings?



Holy hell, you’re not lying. I had to google that. Man, and I thought I had a light touch. That 34 on the low end is crazy! Imagine if he traded guitars with SRV, and then the look on each of their faces.


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> The issue is that Ibanez can't just decide how much stainless steel frets cost, they're beholden to the builders, who can charge what they want. In the past Fujigen has been very averse to stainless steel frets, so I have a feeling they're making Hoshino pay big for it.
> 
> 
> 
> Eh, it's all voodoo math.
> 
> Now it's a "free" option, but the prices have gone up so it's just being baked in.
> 
> Ibanez could likely do the same, but as been shown in the past, folks will only pay so much for a vanilla RG.



I mean now that they are converting and fgn is getting on board it doesn’t seem like a big deal. 

The 5000 series aren’t nearly as expensive as I thought they would be. 

The spot model xl that axe palace is doing is only 100 dollars more.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> I mean now that they are converting and fgn is getting on board it doesn’t seem like a big deal.
> 
> The 5000 series aren’t nearly as expensive as I thought they would be.
> 
> The spot model xl that axe palace is doing is only 100 dollars more.



It's likely easier to run the price into $1800+ guitars vs. trying it on stuff like the Genesis series that Ibanez has had a hell of a time trying to keep at a certain price point already.


----------



## AlexJPA

I want this one so bad!!


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Hollowway said:


> Holy hell, you’re not lying. I had to google that. Man, and I thought I had a light touch. That 34 on the low end is crazy! Imagine if he traded guitars with SRV, and then the look on each of their faces.


I would snap those strings like dental floss lol.


----------



## strangers

Another issue that's pushed the SS thing may be the move to Cobalt and steel strings. I definitely started wearing my nickel frets a lot faster after I switched strings a few years ago. I had a set of nickel frets leveled, and could see the beginning dents starting to show up within a couple of months.

My poor PRS' frets are worn down like the chiclet teeth hiding under a set of veneers. If I was still regularly playing it, I would be well on my way to a fretless.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

strangers said:


> Another issue that's pushed the SS thing may be the move to Cobalt and steel strings. I definitely started wearing my nickel frets a lot faster after I switched strings a few years ago. I had a set of nickel frets leveled, and could see the beginning dents starting to show up within a couple of months.
> 
> My poor PRS' frets are worn down like the chiclet teeth hiding under a set of veneers. If I was still regularly playing it, I would be well on my way to a fretless.



Folks just to seem to care a lot more and are more informed about fretwear in general. 

It used to be that folks wouldn't even look into a fret crown/dress until they felt and heard the issue with regular playing. Now, it seems to be a visual thing. 

Folks bring me guitars for fretwork that ten years ago, I, the guy with a vested interest in working on it, wouldn't even mention.


----------



## cardinal

This thing looks awesome: https://reverb.com/item/19910188-br...stige-7-rgr5227mfxtfg-trans-fluorescent-green

Just needs some fruity-colored pickup bobbins to give a Lockness-Green JEM vibe.


----------



## Vyn

AlexJPA said:


> I want this one so bad!!



The Kiesel Guitars signature RGD 

All seriousness aside, it's nowhere near that bright in person, definitely see if you can look at one IRL first.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

This is more acurate representation of how this guitar looks. Kinda meh for me.


----------



## Vyn

Grabbed a quick photo. It really is dependent on the light. In no light it looks very dark:


----------



## Metropolis

Vyn said:


> Grabbed a quick photo. It really is dependent on the light. In no light it looks very dark:
> 
> View attachment 67391



With MII Ibanez's there is chance to get a nice top or not so nice one like in this picture of yours. Of course they put all the nicest in stock photos, and most of them are something between. Somehow pics in Ibanez website are really different and almost false advertizing how it really looks like.


----------



## Vyn

Metropolis said:


> With MII Ibanez's there is chance to get a nice top or not so nice one like in this picture of yours. Of course they put all the nicest in stock photos, and most of them are something between. Somehow pics in Ibanez website are really different and almost false advertizing how it really looks like.



I understand that there's variation in the woods (at times I've ended up with MII tops that are actually BETTER than the stock photos). What I don't understand is how drastically the lighting varies on some of these. On hard to photograph finishes (the Genesis 550 line), sure, however the variation on that RGD is massive.


----------



## Leviathus

Uggh those beveley Indo RGDs are so awful.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Leviathus said:


> Uggh those beveley Indo RGDs are so awful.



If they were in a solid color, they'd look pretty cool, but these kiesel cloned RGDs are just awful.


----------



## Free_Oaks

MatiasTolkki said:


> If they were in a solid color, they'd look pretty cool, but these kiesel cloned RGDs are just awful.


I've got the blue one in laser blue I think it's called, it's a matte finish as well with some sparkle in it of you look closer and shine a light on it. Would've loved similar colours this year but nooo, for some reason they're going with the stupid bevels and flame tops.


----------



## jwoods986

Personally, I love the Surreal Blue Burst on the RGD. And in combination with the birds eye maple neck, I think it looks great! Plays great too, just played one again the other day and might picked up a used one.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Free_Oaks said:


> I've got the blue one in laser blue I think it's called, it's a matte finish as well with some sparkle in it of you look closer and shine a light on it. Would've loved similar colours this year but nooo, for some reason they're going with the stupid bevels and flame tops.



Yeah my complaint about it was the matte finish, I like a gloss finish on solid colors :/


----------



## Sogradde

I have to hijack my own thread at this point.
So, yesterday I went to the shop because some of the new 2019 models arrived and I was curious to see the 5000 models in person. All the maple board Ibbies (witht he exception of the 550 reissue) had massive fret sprout to the point where careless sliding could have cut my fingers open. I have never seen this happen from any other manufacturer to this extent. Is maple so much more volatile when it comes to humidity compared to other wood species? Did they buy low quality wood? What's going on here? I really don't feel like adding 10% of the price on top just to have my luthier file them down after buying.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Sogradde said:


> I have to hijack my own thread at this point.
> So, yesterday I went to the shop because some of the new 2019 models arrived and I was curious to see the 5000 models in person. All the maple board Ibbies (witht he exception of the 550 reissue) had massive fret sprout to the point where careless sliding could have cut my fingers open. I have never seen this happen from any other manufacturer to this extent. Is maple so much more volatile when it comes to humidity compared to other wood species? Did they buy low quality wood? What's going on here? I really don't feel like adding 10% of the price on top just to have my luthier file them down after buying.




My maple rdix7 was perfect. Dunno what’s going on there.


----------



## lewis

Leviathus said:


> Uggh those beveley Indo RGDs are so awful.



We are getting these kiesel wannabes every year meanwhile their original shapes (xiphos/falchion and the likes) remain on the scrap heap?

These ones look particularly terrible. Deary me. The axiom thing looks ok but still kind of Hotwheels looking


----------



## Dayn

lewis said:


> We are getting these kiesel wannabes every year meanwhile their original shapes (xiphos/falchion and the likes) remain on the scrap heap?
> 
> These ones look particularly terrible. Deary me. The axiom thing looks ok but still kind of Hotwheels looking


By coincidence, I was looking trying to see if a Halberd was available anywhere in Australia still.

I don't need it, but for an 'extreme' shape, the Halberd was so classy, particularly the white one. It'd be amazing if they were reintroduced.


----------



## lewis

Dayn said:


> By coincidence, I was looking trying to see if a Halberd was available anywhere in Australia still.
> 
> I don't need it, but for an 'extreme' shape, the Halberd was so classy, particularly the white one. It'd be amazing if they were reintroduced.



Hell yeah. The Halberds were way more interesting than these RG kiesel copies.

The only thing i didnt really like on them was the ibanez 3 + 3 headstock. I just dont dig those.
Inline reverse headstock on them hands down.
But yeah some seriously cool shapes getting abandonded.
What were those 80s shapes they were doing too that look like the Gus G sig body shape?
Those were cool too.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Dayn said:


> By coincidence, I was looking trying to see if a Halberd was available anywhere in Australia still.
> 
> I don't need it, but for an 'extreme' shape, the Halberd was so classy, particularly the white one. It'd be amazing if they were reintroduced.





lewis said:


> Hell yeah. The Halberds were way more interesting than these RG kiesel copies.
> 
> The only thing i didnt really like on them was the ibanez 3 + 3 headstock. I just dont dig those.
> Inline reverse headstock on them hands down.
> But yeah some seriously cool shapes getting abandonded.
> What were those 80s shapes they were doing too that look like the Gus G sig body shape?
> Those were cool too.



Just like how ESP/Ltd. needs to be making more mid-range to high-end versions of the FRX shape.


----------



## lewis

LeviathanKiller said:


> Just like how ESP/Ltd. needs to be making more mid-range to high-end versions of the FRX shape.


agreed on that!

the Super strat shape market is pathetically over saturated now.

(im guilty of it myself - tonight im using a super strat Ibanez live)
but there is an issue here.
Most people here or read "modern metal band" and if its the UK, 9/10 they are using Ibanez super strat shape. haha

Cant wait to get my Xiphos finished and gig with it.


----------



## prlgmnr

lewis said:


> agreed on that!
> 
> the Super strat shape market is pathetically over saturated now.
> 
> (im guilty of it myself - tonight im using a super strat Ibanez live)
> but there is an issue here.
> Most people here or read "modern metal band" and if its the UK, 9/10 they are using Ibanez super strat shape. haha
> 
> Cant wait to get my Xiphos finished and gig with it.


Saw this: https://reverb.com/item/20516481-ibanez-xv-500-1985-purple-pink-halfburst

this morning and thought of you straight away


----------



## lewis

prlgmnr said:


> Saw this: https://reverb.com/item/20516481-ibanez-xv-500-1985-purple-pink-halfburst
> 
> this morning and thought of you straight away


OH.....MY......GOD

its absolutely incredible.
Like some sort of Xiphos meets modern Ergonomics (kinda)

And the bubble gum colours are awesome. Why the hell do Ibanez have the rights to so many sweet shapes, and do absolutely nothing with them?
if this was made natural wood finish, had Fishmans in, luminlays and SS frets, I reckon it would fly out.

Even this locking nut is a good idea - 







its like we are going backwards haha


----------



## MatiasTolkki

That locking nut is absolutely lame. It doesnt keep tuning at all. I know, I had one with my DT355 with the pro rockr trem... the thing couldnt hold it's tuning for shit.



lewis said:


> OH.....MY......GOD
> 
> its absolutely incredible.
> Like some sort of Xiphos meets modern Ergonomics (kinda)
> 
> And the bubble gum colours are awesome. Why the hell do Ibanez have the rights to so many sweet shapes, and do absolutely nothing with them?
> if this was made natural wood finish, had Fishmans in, luminlays and SS frets, I reckon it would fly out.
> 
> Even this locking nut is a good idea -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its like we are going backwards haha


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

lewis said:


> We are getting these kiesel wannabes every year meanwhile their original shapes (xiphos/falchion and the likes) remain on the scrap heap?





Dayn said:


> I don't need it, but for an 'extreme' shape, the Halberd was so classy, particularly the white one. It'd be amazing if they were reintroduced.



Where were you guys in 2012?  It would've been nice to have more guys who liked those models back then. In still remember the Ibanez threads that year and they were mostly unanimous on them being ugly and wanted more RGs. I bought a Halberd and a Glaive out of spite. 

And yeah, a lot of the early 80s hardware Ibanez had were notoriously bad. I used to lust for that XV in my teens but after playing a roadstar with that bridge I ended up getting over it.


----------



## NeglectedField

MatiasTolkki said:


> That locking nut is absolutely lame. It doesnt keep tuning at all. I know, I had one with my DT355 with the pro rockr trem... the thing couldnt hold it's tuning for shit.



My friend (well I say friend...he was kind of a dick) had a Roadstar with I *think* a locking nut behind a regular nut like that, but it didn't actually work at all (not to mention the bridge or neck wasn't seated properly so the strings drifted sideways off the fretboard) so he came to assume that locking nuts didn't actually work and tried to tune my S270 by the tuners even though the locking nut was engaged. Idiot. 

But I digress. They are ugly things, those behind-the-nut locking nuts.


----------



## canuck brian

lewis said:


> OH.....MY......GOD
> 
> And the bubble gum colours are awesome. Why the hell do Ibanez have the rights to so many sweet shapes, and do absolutely nothing with them?



Terrible sales of the guitars. Everyone wanted a 7 string Iceman apparently and when Ibanez made it, nobody bought it as an example. They're not going to tool up for guitars that aren't going to make them money.

I didn't get to order that one fast enough unfortunately and got pulled from the lineup after 1 year i think.


----------



## sezna

Sogradde said:


> I have to hijack my own thread at this point.
> So, yesterday I went to the shop because some of the new 2019 models arrived and I was curious to see the 5000 models in person. All the maple board Ibbies (witht he exception of the 550 reissue) had massive fret sprout to the point where careless sliding could have cut my fingers open. I have never seen this happen from any other manufacturer to this extent. Is maple so much more volatile when it comes to humidity compared to other wood species? Did they buy low quality wood? What's going on here? I really don't feel like adding 10% of the price on top just to have my luthier file them down after buying.


I had a similar problem trying out one of the new white RGD3127 prestiges. The frets were all sprouted out. I wonder if it was a particularly dry wet year in Japan and the humidity dryness over here is just wrecking guitars...

edit: swapped dry/wet as pointed out below, I am an idiot.


----------



## Ibanez Rules

You mean a particularly wet year in Japan and very dry here.

Even Winter built guitars are coming in with some sprout.


----------



## sezna

Ibanez Rules said:


> You mean a particularly wet year in Japan and very dry here.
> 
> Even Winter built guitars are coming in with some sprout.


Yes you're right, my bad, common sense has left me for today. Edited.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

the xv is dope. I was legit considering getting one for a while there. it's like a sleeker hondo death dagger/sting.


----------



## Vyn

canuck brian said:


> Terrible sales of the guitars. Everyone wanted a 7 string Iceman apparently and when Ibanez made it, nobody bought it as an example. They're not going to tool up for guitars that aren't going to make them money.
> 
> I didn't get to order that one fast enough unfortunately and got pulled from the lineup after 1 year i think.



I was fucking furious at those 507's being US only, would have got two in a heartbeat.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> I was fucking furious at those 507's being US only, would have got two in a heartbeat.



One with shipping from an available region would have probably been better than the price on one downunda.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> One with shipping from an available region would have probably been better than the price on one downunda.



Getting a hold of one was the issue. Even guys in the US struggled getting a hold of them, the production numbers were really low. I've found a couple in Japan before however that was post-CITES (and getting stuff out of Japan was difficult before CITES, it's even harder now).


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> Getting a hold of one was the issue. Even guys in the US struggled getting a hold of them, the production numbers were really low. I've found a couple in Japan before however that was post-CITES (and getting stuff out of Japan was difficult before CITES, it's even harder now).



Not sure who was having problems getting them over here. Not only did I see two out in the wild go months without being sold, but GC/MF was blowing them out at $400 at the end.

The timing was really bad on them. They came out after Ibanez already decided to pretty much axe the X Series, and take the Iceman back to its roots. The year before we lost the Xiphos too. 

Honestly, you didn't miss much. The quality was pretty hit or miss on these and they were heavy and awkward to play, which is a bummer since the 6-string Icemen were fairly solid.


----------



## ekarinsm

I don't know how long I've been waiting for an 8-string multiscale Prestige offering from Ibanez, really want to upgrade from the Agile haha.

Oh the pain of being addicted to the Wizard neck...


----------



## diagrammatiks

ekarinsm said:


> I don't know how long I've been waiting for an 8-string multiscale Prestige offering from Ibanez, really want to upgrade from the Agile haha.
> 
> Oh the pain of being addicted to the Wizard neck...



Yikes wizard 8 string 12th paralle. I think you can replicate this by just taking your fretting hand and smashing the entire thing into the nearest wall.


----------



## ekarinsm

diagrammatiks said:


> Yikes wizard 8 string 12th paralle. I think you can replicate this by just taking your fretting hand and smashing the entire thing into the nearest wall.


Hahaha, yeah they should move the neutral point to around 7th or 8th fret for sure. Only if the Strandberg wasn't so expensive...


----------



## eightsixboy

Sogradde said:


> I have to hijack my own thread at this point.
> So, yesterday I went to the shop because some of the new 2019 models arrived and I was curious to see the 5000 models in person. All the maple board Ibbies (witht he exception of the 550 reissue) had massive fret sprout to the point where careless sliding could have cut my fingers open. I have never seen this happen from any other manufacturer to this extent. Is maple so much more volatile when it comes to humidity compared to other wood species? Did they buy low quality wood? What's going on here? I really don't feel like adding 10% of the price on top just to have my luthier file them down after buying.



The wood isn't as dry nor as good/old as it used to be, each year I've seeing the woods get greener and greener, I had a 2013 RG752 next to a 2018 RG752 the other day and the difference is staggering. Its honestly to the point now where I don't think I'll buy a new Ibanez again as the maple quality even on the prestiges now is pretty crap. 

It's not just Ibanez either, noticed similar trend on most brands sub $1500-$2000.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

eightsixboy said:


> The wood isn't as dry nor as good/old as it used to be, each year I've seeing the woods get greener and greener, I had a 2013 RG752 next to a 2018 RG752 the other day and the difference is staggering. Its honestly to the point now where I don't think I'll buy a new Ibanez again as the maple quality even on the prestiges now is pretty crap.
> 
> It's not just Ibanez either, noticed similar trend on most brands sub $1500-$2000.



We dont know where Fujigen gets their wood stock from, but if it was gotten anywhere in western japan (anywhere from Osaka to Kagoshima basically), there have been torrential floods the past 2-3 years in those areas, thanks to typhoons combined with the rainy season jet streams. There's not a whole lot you can do when nature is involved dude, especially the absolute insane levels of rain seen in Oita/Fukuoka and Hiroshima in the last 2 years. if that means you wont buy MIJ ibanezes, realizing they might need a tune up because mother nature decided to take a massive shit all over this country, then dont buy any, it'll leave more for the rest of us.

Oh and let's not forget that Hokkaido, last year, got hit with a 6.8 or something earthquake right in the middle of their rainy season, which caused massive mudslides all over the mountains and hillsides up there, and then they were met with even more rain AFTER the quake as well. If you're not gonna support Japanese workers because of coloring of wood, then you're just heartless.


----------



## Mathemagician

So idk if it was the fan or what, but I played that 8 string rosewood FB ibanez with the fanned fretboard and let me tell you, it was kind of awful and I don’t mean quality. 

Basically felt like the fan was “extreme”. This was my first time touching a fan in person so I don’t have much experience. But the low notes were super far apart as where the high strings. 


I always imagined fans would feel kind of slight. I did only play it for a couple of minutes but I was like “I don’t think I could play scales on this OR low string power chords...”. 

Maybe it’s my smaller hands? Idk. Just wasn’t impressed and made me second guess ordering a 7 string fan from GOC last month. 

Seriously it wasn’t build quality or anything like that, just not sure about the fan.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Mathemagician said:


> So idk if it was the fan or what, but I played that 8 string rosewood FB ibanez with the fanned fretboard and let me tell you, it was kind of awful and I don’t mean quality.
> 
> Basically felt like the fan was “extreme”. This was my first time touching a fan in person so I don’t have much experience. But the low notes were super far apart as where the high strings.
> 
> 
> I always imagined fans would feel kind of slight. I did only play it for a couple of minutes but I was like “I don’t think I could play scales on this OR low string power chords...”.
> 
> Maybe it’s my smaller hands? Idk. Just wasn’t impressed and made me second guess ordering a 7 string fan from GOC last month.
> 
> Seriously it wasn’t build quality or anything like that, just not sure about the fan.



I purchased an Ormsby AND a GOC so imagine my concern lol
Especially on the Ormsby since they have one of the widest fans


----------



## Mathemagician

Ok we can be scared together.


----------



## mullet_

The Ibanez Prestige i was looking actually has maple fretboard. Should we just avoid maple Ibanez?


----------



## RiksRiks

LeviathanKiller said:


> I purchased an Ormsby AND a GOC so imagine my concern lol
> Especially on the Ormsby since they have one of the widest fans



Nah dude, IMHO, between all the fanned frets, Ibanez got the least favorable design. Ormsby's a little extreme but I didn't feel it weird in a seven string. 
I believe GOC has a fan similar to that of Strandberg, which IMO is the best one for 8 string guitars, but well, to each his own.

I hope you like your guitars!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Mathemagician said:


> I did only play it for a couple of minutes



There's probably the problem. 

As a proponent of fanned frets, I often explain that it's not like reinventing the instrument and your playing, but there definitely is an adjustment period. 

Not to mention there are still tons of factors involved. 

I wouldn't use this short time with a single guitar dissuade you from other fanned guitars or basses.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

LeviathanKiller said:


> I purchased an Ormsby AND a GOC so imagine my concern lol
> Especially on the Ormsby since they have one of the widest fans


The ormsbys are pretty comfy. I was skeptical when I bought the first one but it felt really go, even for stupid stretched out extended chords.
The ibby multiscales are fine imo (newer versions are much comfier)
The LTD multiscales are quite solid (I really liked the 6 string multiscale a looot).
The jackson multiscales are solid as well (the blue sparkle 7 string was a blast to play and I almost bought one at GC).
Honestly the parallel fret location isn't a huge deal so long as you're not doing stupidly stretched out extended chords. If you are going to do more of those, then yeah, the ibby one is the worst of the lot (the others are better for that kind of stuff). If you just want to play br00tz, all of them are good.

We're living in a golden age boys, one where you can walk into a guitar center and grab a production line multiscale ERG off the wall instead of having to get a custom or an agile (nothing wrong with agiles imo).


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Mathemagician said:


> So idk if it was the fan or what, but I played that 8 string rosewood FB ibanez with the fanned fretboard and let me tell you, it was kind of awful and I don’t mean quality.
> 
> Basically felt like the fan was “extreme”. This was my first time touching a fan in person so I don’t have much experience. But the low notes were super far apart as where the high strings.
> 
> 
> I always imagined fans would feel kind of slight. I did only play it for a couple of minutes but I was like “I don’t think I could play scales on this OR low string power chords...”.
> 
> Maybe it’s my smaller hands? Idk. Just wasn’t impressed and made me second guess ordering a 7 string fan from GOC last month.
> 
> Seriously it wasn’t build quality or anything like that, just not sure about the fan.



As someone who owns one of these fanned Ibanii, no- it's not just your hands.
The other guys are right that the newer ones aren't as bad, and mine is a 6 so the issues were probably much more noticable on the 8, but the fan design that Ibanez uses is just not optimal, and toward either extreme end of the board, you can feel it. The spacing is just...bad.

That said though, it does grow on you, and since mine is a 6 and I'm just playing bruutz on it anyway, I love it. Don't think I'd recommend an 8 string variant, though.


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> As someone who owns one of these fanned Ibanii, no- it's not just your hands.
> The other guys are right that the newer ones aren't as bad, and mine is a 6 so the issues were probably much more noticable on the 8, but the fan design that Ibanez uses is just not optimal, and toward either extreme end of the board, you can feel it. The spacing is just...bad.
> 
> That said though, it does grow on you, and since mine is a 6 and I'm just playing bruutz on it anyway, I love it. Don't think I'd recommend an 8 string variant, though.


Okay I'm glad I'm not alone. My Kiesel Vader Multiscale 7 feels awesome, but when I tried an Ibanez 7 string multiscale, it was almost unplayable to me. It just felt extremely weird and the spacing felt huge.


----------



## Andromalia

MatiasTolkki said:


> We dont know where Fujigen gets their wood stock from, but if it was gotten anywhere in western japan [...].



Knowing the usual japanese policies on wood use, I'd bet the wood is imported. Japan is to my knowledge the no1 wood import market worldwide. They won't touch their forests.



> Ibanii



WTF XD


----------



## diagrammatiks

Ordacleaphobia said:


> As someone who owns one of these fanned Ibanii, no- it's not just your hands.
> The other guys are right that the newer ones aren't as bad, and mine is a 6 so the issues were probably much more noticable on the 8, but the fan design that Ibanez uses is just not optimal, and toward either extreme end of the board, you can feel it. The spacing is just...bad.
> 
> That said though, it does grow on you, and since mine is a 6 and I'm just playing bruutz on it anyway, I love it. Don't think I'd recommend an 8 string variant, though.



Looks like they moved the parallel to the 14th? But like why. Why do this.


----------



## Sogradde

New sig model for Martin Miller:


> Introducing the MM1JR-THP, the first ever AZ shortscale model in Transparent Hot Pink. With the latest signature model for guitarist Martin Miller now every player can become a picking master! Featuring a S-TECH WOOD Roasted Maple Shortscale neck and fretboard that was explicitly designed to fit children and players with very small hands, the MM1JR comes loaded with all the unique features that make the AZ series the instrument of choice for so many advanced players: Flame Maple top, Mahogany body, Seymour Duncan Hyperion pickups (HH), Gotoh® MAGNUM LOCK machine heads w/H.A.P., Gotoh® T1802 tremolo, Bone nut, Stainless Steel frets, Luminlay side dot inlays, and the dyna-MIX10 switching system. The unique THP finish gives the guitar a cool and vibrant pink-ish look on the front that matches perfectly with the darker tone on the back. Includes case.






Really like the colour but I'm not a fan of short scales.
Also, I could be wrong but the heel looks slightly different from the regular AZ models.


----------



## Musiscience

So it looks like Ibanez is releasing the Axe Palace limited RGD as a regular model. That makes me happy as I really wanted one but the chances of finding one used down the line when limited to 12 units was very slim.


----------



## Avedas

Short scales


----------



## diagrammatiks

Short scales. Why.


----------



## Albake21

Huh... as awesome as it is for everyone else, I honestly feel bad for the twelve people that bought one of the limited runs. They no longer have an exclusive guitar and I'm sure it was slightly more expensive like all of those exclusive runs.


----------



## Seabeast2000

So 25.5"?


----------



## Albake21

The906 said:


> So 25.5"?


They are talking about the Martin Miller signature being a short scale, not the RGD. I'm guessing it's 24.75" or something similar.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Avedas said:


> Short scales



Yeah, seems Paul Gilbert's mini has started something of a trend. 



Albake21 said:


> Huh... as awesome as it is for everyone else, I honestly feel bad for the twelve people that bought one of the limited runs. They no longer have an exclusive guitar and I'm sure it was slightly more expensive like all of those exclusive runs.



Ibanez withholds the right to use anything designed by retailers.

They've done this in the past, especially with J.Customs. 

When it comes to stuff like this, it's an easy target to take over. 

But yeah, if I was someone who bought it with exclusivity in mind I'd probably be annoyed, as it's in fairly bad taste to make a 1:1 copy. At least change the inlay or something.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Post your LRG s!


----------



## Albake21

Also real quick, I can't find that yellow RGD on Ibanez' site anywhere.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> Also real quick, I can't find that yellow RGD on Ibanez' site anywhere.



https://www.ibanez.com/na/products/detail/rgdr7ucs_00_01.html

It's not showing up on the US site, but it's coming to Canada, so it'll be pretty easy to grab one.


----------



## Sogradde

MaxOfMetal said:


> Ibanez withholds the right to use anything designed by retailers.
> 
> They've done this in the past, especially with J.Customs.
> 
> When it comes to stuff like this, it's an easy target to take over.
> 
> But yeah, if I was someone who bought it with exclusivity in mind I'd probably be annoyed, as it's in fairly bad taste to make a 1:1 copy. At least change the inlay or something.


I was giving them the benefit of the doubt as I thought it's just the coincidental release of an RGD7UCS in a different color but the reverse headstock is quite a giveaway. Pretty much a dick move in my book.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> I was giving them the benefit of the doubt as I thought it's just the coincidental release of an RGD7UCS in a different color but the reverse headstock is quite a giveaway. Pretty much a dick move in my book.


Actually I'm now realizing it is technically different. The Axe Palace one is made of Mahogany while the Production one is Basswood. Unless one of those is a mistake.

Also the neck on the Axe Palace is Maple/Walnut while the production model is Maple/Wenge.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> I was giving them the benefit of the doubt as I thought it's just the coincidental release of an RGD7UCS in a different color but the reverse headstock is quite a giveaway. Pretty much a dick move in my book.



On one hand, it's kind of shitty to the 12 original buyers and Ace Palace, on the other hand now those who missed out on the original run can buy one, possibly at a lower price.

It's a tough call.


----------



## Albake21

MaxOfMetal said:


> On one hand, it's kind of shitty to the 12 original buyers and Ace Palace, on the other hand now those who missed out on the original run can buy one, possibly at a lower price.
> 
> It's a tough call.


Well funny enough, there are still slots available for that run. I wouldn't be too happy if I were Axe Palace right now.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> Actually I'm now realizing it is technically different. The Axe Palace one is made of Mahogany while the Production one is Basswood. Unless one of those is a mistake.
> 
> Also the neck on the Axe Palace is Maple/Walnut while the production model is Maple/Wenge.



It's pretty bad on Ibanez' part that there's a roughly 50% chance they just copied and pasted the wrong specs. 



Albake21 said:


> Well funny enough, there are still slots available for that run. I wouldn't be too happy if I were Axe Palace right now.



Ouch. 

It would be even shittier if the production one shipped first.


----------



## nikt

Axe Palace limited have mahogany body and the standard series 2019 have basswood.

You can order them on thomann already
https://www.thomann.de/pl/ibanez_rgdr7ucs_dyf.htm


----------



## Sogradde

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's pretty bad on Ibanez' part that there's a roughly 50% chance they just copied and pasted the wrong specs.


I assume it's intentional as the original Uppercut RGD is made of basswood aswell. 
This would be a really weird coincidence.

@zimbloth Any info on that?


----------



## Surveyor 777

Maybe I'm a dope, but I'm not believing any "new models" that are "released" today.


----------



## ThePIGI King

Surveyor 777 said:


> Maybe I'm a dope, but I'm not believing any "new models" that are "released" today.


Hard to debate, there's a link to them for sale through a reputable dealer.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ThePIGI King said:


> Hard to debate, there's a link to them for sale through a reputable dealer.



I'm seeing "coming soon" and "5 - 6 weeks" everywhere. Have you seen them "in stock"?


----------



## Randy

Not sure what qualifies as a "small" upcharge but mahogany over basswood is a discernible difference, even if it's hidden by the paint. Those of us that have been around long enough remember what it's like to have only one color and one body wood to choose from, so if you buy into the concepts of "tonewood" at all, that difference alone makes the Axe run worth it.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

They took one of the Axe palace runs last year and produced it for the Japanese market. I think it was the blue quilt one.


----------



## trem licking

Mahogany over basswood is def worth an upcharge


----------



## Seabeast2000

All these years and so many non-basswood models and Ibanez goes back to the pipe for a high-end RGD.


----------



## Musiscience

I really wonder why they would announce these 2 months following NAMM v.s. at NAMM along with the DSY RG 7 string model.

It's a dick move for sure for Axe Palace. On the other hand, it will give the opportunity to many others to own one now and in the future as a lot more people will get the chance to buy one.


----------



## ThePIGI King

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm seeing "coming soon" and "5 - 6 weeks" everywhere. Have you seen them "in stock"?


You can add it to your cart from Thomann and purchase it, even if it is just a pre-order. Since they're a reputable dealer I'd say it's safe to say that they are for sale.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Lorcan Ward said:


> They took one of the Axe palace runs last year and produced it for the Japanese market. I think it was the blue quilt one.



lol, really? That's kind of shitty too, considering The Axe Palace is a western store. 
"Oh this model is cool and people seem to like it, lets only produce it for the domestic market and block off production for the area of the world that originally designed it"

Ibanez _really _does not have much faith in the western market, do they?


----------



## Kaura

All the people complaining about the short scale on the Martin Miller can honestly piss off. How many standard/extended scale guitars are there on the market for you who want them? Lots. How many models are there for us people with smaller hands? Not many, especially in that price range. Are we just supposed to just settle for the cheap beginner models? 

Not a big fan of the finish on the Miller model but that's the first AZ I could see getting.


----------



## Vyn

Ordacleaphobia said:


> lIbanez _really _does not have much faith in the western market, do they?



Most of the Western guitar market is still Strats and Les Pauls


----------



## diagrammatiks

Kaura said:


> All the people complaining about the short scale on the Martin Miller can honestly piss off. How many standard/extended scale guitars are there on the market for you who want them? Lots. How many models are there for us people with smaller hands? Not many, especially in that price range. Are we just supposed to just settle for the cheap beginner models?
> 
> Not a big fan of the finish on the Miller model but that's the first AZ I could see getting.



This is a bad argument and you should feel bad. 

I guess bass players are just an illusion. 

And lisax and yo-yo are just miming to midi. 

You don’t have to settle for anything. You just have to realize that hand size doesn’t have anything to do with it.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

Lol it still seem slike an April Fool's joke and secretly they want us GASing


----------



## JoeyBTL

Even though its a joke, Martin Miller has said that he had a tough time choosing the color of his sig and was quite closing to picking pink. So maybe thats what it was! I think it would be a sick color to release anyway. April fools is a good way for them to put it out and there see how many people actually want it haha


----------



## Hollowway

Musiscience said:


> I really wonder why they would announce these 2 months following NAMM v.s. at NAMM along with the DSY RG 7 string model.
> 
> It's a dick move for sure for Axe Palace. On the other hand, it will give the opportunity to many others to own one now and in the future as a lot more people will get the chance to buy one.



Yeah, ESP also did that to Nick. He ordered (for himself) that super cool lavender colored Steph model through their custom shop. ESP accidentally sent it to Stephen himself. He loved the color. And now ESP made it a production model.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Musiscience said:


> I really wonder why they would announce these 2 months following NAMM v.s. at NAMM along with the DSY RG 7 string model.



NAMM's role and importance is fading and the manufacturers know it. 

Companies need to move faster as there is greater competition in an even more ever changing market, and one way to do that is to be continuously developing and readying development of new models.

There's a reason we've been seeing an uptick in dealer models. Why put in the R&D and risk when a retailer will do all the work for you?


----------



## Sogradde

Whelp, the purple AZ was an April Fool's joke. Some people still tried to preorder one. 
The DY RGD seems to be real tho.


----------



## diagrammatiks

I wouldn’t be surprised if they made a 5000 series xl as well. The upcharge on that dealer run was insignificant.


----------



## MetalHex

Before I made this account when I was lurking, someone made a comment asking for a XIPHOS?!, it started out with all caps, then got less and less, smaller and smaller each line that said Xiphos, and eventually just ended with a "." As if it just faded into the abyss.

It was the absolute funniest and best comment I have ever seen. Kudos to the person that said that.


----------



## Kaura

diagrammatiks said:


> This is a bad argument and you should feel bad.
> 
> I guess bass players are just an illusion.
> 
> And lisax and yo-yo are just miming to midi.
> 
> You don’t have to settle for anything. You just have to realize that hand size doesn’t have anything to do with it.



Eh, I'll have to stand behind my words and say, if you want to cycle a mile in 5 minutes (or whatever) then it's possible no matter whether you're using a fixed gear bike or a 10-gear bike but it sure as hell is easier to do it with the 10-gear bike. My point is, it's not like I or anyone else with small hands find it impossible to play guitars with big fretboards but there's no denying it wouldn't be more comfy to play a guitar that fits better your hand size. 

I understand that scale length is an important feature for most guys here and it is for me to but you don't see me running to a thread about some new 9-string multiscale behemoth and say "ewww, extended scale!".


----------



## Jeff

Sogradde said:


> Whelp, the purple AZ was an April Fool's joke. Some people still tried to preorder one.
> The DY RGD seems to be real tho.



that's dumb. That guitar wasn't off the rails enough to be a good 4/1 joke.


----------



## Musiscience

Jeff said:


> that's dumb. That guitar wasn't off the rails enough to be a good 4/1 joke.



Agreed. A Meshuggah signature shortscale sunburst archtop would have been better.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Kaura said:


> Eh, I'll have to stand behind my words and say, if you want to cycle a mile in 5 minutes (or whatever) then it's possible no matter whether you're using a fixed gear bike or a 10-gear bike but it sure as hell is easier to do it with the 10-gear bike. My point is, it's not like I or anyone else with small hands find it impossible to play guitars with big fretboards but there's no denying it wouldn't be more comfy to play a guitar that fits better your hand size.
> 
> I understand that scale length is an important feature for most guys here and it is for me to but you don't see me running to a thread about some new 9-string multiscale behemoth and say "ewww, extended scale!".



Plenty of people do this whenever new players ask about extended scale stuff. It’s just as silly.


----------



## StevenC

Musiscience said:


> Agreed. A Meshuggah signature shortscale sunburst archtop would have been better.


I mean, as long as it looked like a lawsuit Ibanez, I think most Meshuggah fans would believe that.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

So is the yellow rgd available in US?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> So is the yellow rgd available in US?



Technically no, at least as far as I know. But it's coming to Canada and the exchange rate is very favorable to the US, so it shouldn't be too hard to get.


----------



## A-Branger

Kaura said:


> Eh, I'll have to stand behind my words and say, if you want to cycle a mile in 5 minutes (or whatever) then it's possible no matter whether you're using a fixed gear bike or a 10-gear bike but it sure as hell is easier to do it with the 10-gear bike. My point is, it's not like I or anyone else with small hands find it impossible to play guitars with big fretboards but there's no denying it wouldn't be more comfy to play a guitar that fits better your hand size.
> 
> I understand that scale length is an important feature for most guys here and it is for me to but you don't see me running to a thread about some new 9-string multiscale behemoth and say "ewww, extended scale!".



but how really small your hands are?. 

I get your point. going from a 34" bass to a 33" was tiny ichy bitty better when doing that one riff on A Change of Seasons thats played on the 2-5 fret. But everythig else is fine. Now I got a multiscale bass with 37" low B and I can still play the riff no problem, obiusly on a 33" was more comfortable VS a 37". But everything else on the neck feels pretty muhc the same. And 27.8" vs 25.5" (as watching my multiscale from across the room with "too lazy to propertly meassure it") is what 1-1.5 frets size difference. So taking a 25.5" guitar tune down to Eb, put a capo on the first fret(or second), does that solve all your problems and make it so much more comfortable?

genuine interest, I keep reading people saying "because I got small hands"..... and yeah I could say the "but my bass", but fair enough I dont do stretchy chords on my bass so theres that


----------



## Kaura

A-Branger said:


> but how really small your hands are?.



I don't know how to measure them but trust me when I say; small. Like my whole palm and fingers are about as long as a tubescreamer. 

Anyhow, I don't feel like debating over this issue. People can use whatever scale length for all I care. I'm still happy that there's short scale guitars on the market but I feel like a bit more to choose from wouldn't hurt.


----------



## Musiscience

MaxOfMetal said:


> Technically no, at least as far as I know. But it's coming to Canada and the exchange rate is very favorable to the US, so it shouldn't be too hard to get.



Very favorable to the US at the moment is indeed the right way to put it. 

*cries softly while looking at current Canadian prices*


----------



## Jonathan20022

Kaura said:


> I don't know how to measure them but trust me when I say; small. Like my whole palm and fingers are about as long as a tubescreamer.
> 
> Anyhow, I don't feel like debating over this issue. People can use whatever scale length for all I care. I'm still happy that there's short scale guitars on the market but I feel like a bit more to choose from wouldn't hurt.



I'm going to honestly side with you on this one if that MM was a production model, I find it a little ridiculous that people are complaining when the same guitar in teal would have been available in a 25.5" scale. We lose nothing while the people who want to try and or need a shorter scale guitar have their option, I guess every guitar ever has to be an HH Fishman loaded Super Strat with a fixed bridge or else it's not appealing.


----------



## ThePIGI King

Jonathan20022 said:


> I'm going to honestly side with you on this one if that MM was a production model, I find it a little ridiculous that people are complaining when the same guitar in teal would have been available in a 25.5" scale. We lose nothing while the people who want to try and or need a shorter scale guitar have their option, I guess every guitar ever has to be an HH Fishman loaded Super Strat with a fixed bridge or else it's not appealing.


Thats like the worst guitar ever! HSH Dimarzio or SD Trem guitars forever.

Also, I've nothing against 24.75". The Epi les paul I used to play was a favorite growing up.


----------



## Sogradde

Short scale HSH guitar with a non-locking trem and poo-coloured jatoba fretboard would be the absolute antithesis to a dream guitar for me.
That thing would land in the bin faster than you can say "But chinese Strandberg copies are worse!"

(I don't hate short scale guitars, I'm all for variety)


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> Short scale HSH guitar with a non-locking trem and poo-coloured jatoba fretboard would be the absolute antithesis to a dream guitar for me.
> That thing would land in the bin faster than you can say "But chinese Strandberg copies are worse!"
> 
> (I don't hate short scale guitars, I'm all for variety)


It's all good, I'll say it. I hate short scale guitars.


----------



## LegacyOfOddGod

Albake21 said:


> The more and more I look at it, I may give the RGD71ALMS a try. I kinda like the look of it too. Alright Ibanez, I'll give your MII one more shot, but 3 strikes and your out.



If you get a chance, would love to hear how it felt and how was the quality control.


----------



## A-Branger

Jonathan20022 said:


> I'm going to honestly side with you on this one if that MM was a production model, I find it a little ridiculous that people are complaining when the same guitar in teal would have been available in a 25.5" scale. We lose nothing while the people who want to try and or need a shorter scale guitar have their option, I guess every guitar ever has to be an HH Fishman loaded Super Strat with a fixed bridge or else it's not appealing.



dont get me wrong I have 0 problme with Ibanez releasing short scale guitars. I was trying to understand mroe about what a lot of people seem to always complain here "I have small hands"

my real problem was that if it was real and not a April's Fools joke, they were gonna release such an awesome and beautiful color only in short scale, and thats sad  that color needs to be free for everyone to buy. We need more bright and stupid color guitars out there


----------



## canuck brian

diagrammatiks said:


> Short scales. Why.


 Probably something to do with the guy that helped design his own signature guitar.


----------



## diagrammatiks

canuck brian said:


> Probably something to do with the guy that helped design his own signature guitar.



Or designed his own April fools joke. 

Same difference.


----------



## RiffRaff

Can we all take a minute to appreciate how good this new RG1070FM premium is...







Dimarzios - Check
Original Edge - Check
Stainless steel frets - Check
Gotoh locking tuners - Check
Classic mahogany & maple combo - Check

Very classy


----------



## LeviathanKiller

RiffRaff said:


> Can we all take a minute to appreciate how good this new RG1070FM premium is...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dimarzios - Check
> Original Edge - Check
> Stainless steel frets - Check
> Gotoh locking tuners - Check
> Classic mahogany & maple combo - Check
> 
> Very classy



And now I want a guitar with a panga panga fretboard. That looks super sleek but with some nice visual texture.


----------



## Musiscience

There is a new review online of the RGR5220M. Probably a paid review by Ibanez but it's really not helping my GAS. Really want one of these and the new DSY RGD7UCS.

Edit: I love green guitars.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Musiscience said:


> There is a new review online of the RGR5220M. Probably a paid review by Ibanez but it's really not helping my GAS. Really want one of these and the new DSY RGD7UCS.
> 
> Edit: I love green guitars.




His jump-cuts make me wanna barf


----------



## Musiscience

LeviathanKiller said:


> His jump-cuts make me wanna barf



It doesn't make me want the guitar less, sadly


----------



## xzacx

Musiscience said:


> There is a new review online of the RGR5220M. Probably a paid review by Ibanez but it's really not helping my GAS. Really want one of these and the new DSY RGD7UCS.
> 
> Edit: I love green guitars.




For what it's worth, I tried one of these in person and thought it was kinda cheap feeling/looking, particularly with the matte finish and too-bright binding. It was set up pretty well though and fretwork was good. I'll put it like this though, I was interested in either the 7 in this color of this or the Desert Yellow one, and kinda lost interest after playing it. (Although the Desert Yellow one would address both of those issues by being a gloss finish and not having binding.)


----------



## Musiscience

xzacx said:


> For what it's worth, I tried one of these in person and thought it was kinda cheap feeling/looking, particularly with the matte finish and too-bright binding. It was set up pretty well though and fretwork was good. I'll put it like this though, I was interested in either the 7 in this color of this or the Desert Yellow one, and kinda lost interest after playing it. (Although the Desert Yellow one would address both of those issues by being a gloss finish and not having binding.)



That's disappointing to hear. I was really interested in these as I like Ibanez, green and SS frets.


----------



## xzacx

Musiscience said:


> That's disappointing to hear. I was really interested in these as I like Ibanez, green and SS frets.


I don't have a ton of Ibanez experience, so maybe I'm not the best to judge, but it definitely didn't excite me. But there was also a 550 reissue right next to it that I thought felt considerably nicer. I usually think stuff with matte finishes feel kinda cheap though, so personal taste could be part of it too.


----------



## Albake21

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but those green Prestiges seriously look like cheap $400 Indo guitars. Absolutely nothing on them screams "$1900". For that money, there are SO many better options. Sad... I love Ibanez, but this is a miss in my book.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Albake21 said:


> Maybe I'm in the minority here, but those green Prestiges seriously look like cheap $400 Indo guitars. Absolutely nothing on them screams "$1900". For that money, there are SO many better options. Sad... I love Ibanez, but this is a miss in my book.


Those are $1900? Holy cheeze-whiz
They definitely do not look like it. +1 on that


----------



## trem licking

they have SS frets and a mahogany body... looks awesome to me. lower price would be nice, as is with anything, but 1900 isn't too out of line compared with other things these days.


----------



## Vyn

trem licking said:


> they have SS frets and a mahogany body... looks awesome to me. lower price would be nice, as is with anything, but 1900 isn't too out of line compared with other things these days.



Throw in inflation and $1900 for a guitar of those specs is actually pretty good.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Yeah, I'm not sure what is so cheap or bad spec wise on these. 

Who else is doing MIJ, stainless steel frets, BKPs, and Gotoh hardware for under $2k? I know ESP and Schecter aren't. 

Not to mention, that $1900 is MAP. You can order one for less today from Ibanez Rules if you go for inspection only, which is the same level as most retailers anyway. 

I'm not really into the color either, but that's a taste thing.


----------



## xzacx

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, I'm not sure what is so cheap or bad spec wise on these.
> 
> Who else is doing MIJ, stainless steel frets, BKPs, and Gotoh hardware for under $2k? I know ESP and Schecter aren't.
> 
> Not to mention, that $1900 is MAP. You can order one for less today from Ibanez Rules if you go for inspection only, which is the same level as most retailers anyway.
> 
> I'm not really into the color either, but that's a taste thing.



I didn't have an issue with the price until I played it. The specs are good and stuff I guess, but to me the guitar itself wasn't as nice as the $1k 550 it was hanging next to. So in that context, it seems overpriced. If you really want the low-end BKPs, and are willing to pay that much of a premium for stainless, I don't think it's out of line. I just wasn't real impressed with it for the money.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

xzacx said:


> I didn't have an issue with the price until I played it. The specs are good and stuff I guess, but to me the guitar itself wasn't as nice as the $1k 550 it was hanging next to. So in that context, it seems overpriced. If you really want the low-end BKPs, and are willing to pay that much of a premium for stainless, I don't think it's out of line. I just wasn't real impressed with it for the money.



These are basically pandering to the "spec sheet queens". The folks who judge solely on what the spec sheet says.

But, as we know, guitars are more than the sum of thier specs. 

Again, I'm not really into these either. I don't like the colors, I'm indifferent to fret material and stock pickups, etc. I think the current Genesis models and a return to solid colors is far more compelling. But that's my personal preference, and doesn't remove from the market value these have. 

Honestly, I wish they had just overhauled the Uppercut models. Give us a couple new models and colors. I don't see why they needed a whole new series.


----------



## xzacx

MaxOfMetal said:


> These are basically pandering to the "spec sheet queens". The folks who judge solely on what the spec sheet says.
> 
> But, as we know, guitars are more than the sum of thier specs.
> 
> Again, I'm not really into these either. I don't like the colors, I'm indifferent to fret material and stock pickups, etc. I think the current Genesis models and a return to solid colors is far more compelling. But that's my personal preference, and doesn't remove from the market value these have.
> 
> Honestly, I wish they had just overhauled the Uppercut models. Give us a couple new models and colors. I don't see why they needed a whole new series.


Yeah totally agree with that. If you’re someone that judges a guitar based on specs, there’s nothing to complain about.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, I'm not sure what is so cheap or bad spec wise on these.
> 
> Who else is doing MIJ, stainless steel frets, BKPs, and Gotoh hardware for under $2k? I know ESP and Schecter aren't.
> 
> Not to mention, that $1900 is MAP. You can order one for less today from Ibanez Rules if you go for inspection only, which is the same level as most retailers anyway.
> 
> I'm not really into the color either, but that's a taste thing.



FWIW, I don't think people are saying it's cheap or bad spec-wise.
I think it's more just that the overall _*look *_of the guitar is just...sub-par for what you'd expect from that price bracket. I'm kind of inclined to agree.

But that is, like you said, just a taste thing. I'm sure there's someone out there that's totally stoked on it and I'm sure it'll be a great guitar for them.


----------



## Albake21

Ordacleaphobia said:


> FWIW, I don't think people are saying it's cheap or bad spec-wise.
> I think it's more just that the overall _*look *_of the guitar is just...sub-par for what you'd expect from that price bracket. I'm kind of inclined to agree.
> 
> But that is, like you said, just a taste thing. I'm sure there's someone out there that's totally stoked on it and I'm sure it'll be a great guitar for them.


This. I'm not saying the guitar is literally spec'd cheaply, I'm just saying it looks cheap and no where near the price tag.


----------



## MetalHex

I agree that matte colors look cheap. Particularly, this green reminds me of an Agile Epic in green minus the fugly pink pickups.

Maybe that is the reason I equate it with it being cheap looking. I just prefer a glossy finish.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

MetalHex said:


> I agree that matte colors look cheap. Particularly, this green reminds me of an Agile Epic in green minus the fugly pink pickups.
> 
> Maybe that is the reason I equate it with it being cheap looking. I just prefer a glossy finish.


 
I'm usually a huge fan of matte but the combo between this particular shade of green/brown on the fretboard just really doesn't work for me.
Totally made the same association with Agile though. First thought out of the gate.


----------



## Burtallica

I just got one of these and am really enjoying it. Paid less than the $1900 MAP, but still take my review with a grain of salt as I'm sure subconsciously I'm justifying my purchase to myself a little bit.
This one hit all the specs that I've been wishing for in a MIJ Ibanez for a while now: mahogany, reverse headstock, maple board, green. It came set up really well with low action and a smooth neck. I recently got one of the RGR 652 wild cherry blossoms from the Axe Palace run and this 5220 neck feels sliiiiiiiiiiiightly thicker to me. Not usually a fan of matte finishes but this one looks really nice to me... to the point that I don't feel like I'm going to make any shiny spots on it in the near term (we'll see how it holds up after a few months).

My main complaints are:
-The BKP pickups. They're ok but seem to go from zero to aggressive very quickly. I might just need to get used to them since I've been playing on DiMarzio's for 20 some odd years. 
-The white binding on the fretboard. I don't mind it on the body and head but I'm not a huge fan of the bound fretboard.


----------



## sezna

That green RGR has all the specs I'd like but I am not a huge fan of the color. Are there comparable reverse headstock prestiges with perhaps gloss finishes? Oh Ibanez wizards, teach me


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

sezna said:


> Oh Ibanez wizards, teach me



HAHA GET IT


----------



## Albake21

sezna said:


> That green RGR has all the specs I'd like but I am not a huge fan of the color. Are there comparable reverse headstock prestiges with perhaps gloss finishes? Oh Ibanez wizards, teach me


The glacier blue one with Fishmans is glossy, at least I'm pretty sure it is.


----------



## Musiscience

Albake21 said:


> The glacier blue one with Fishmans is glossy, at least I'm pretty sure it is.



It is glossy, but not reverse headstock though. 

Otherwise, the glacier blue finish looks stunning IMO.


----------



## Albake21

Musiscience said:


> It is glossy, but not reverse headstock though.
> 
> Otherwise, the glacier blue finish looks stunning IMO.


I really love the glacier blue one too. Still way too much for me, but maybe in the next year or two a used one will pop up.


----------



## Musiscience

Ikebe has one of the new RGD in stock and it looks glorious.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

I actually really like the aesthetics and overall look of those green RGR's. To each their own I guess.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Every company, including Ibanez, should make some research of what people actually want. Surveys on FB can easily show what is „trendy”. Then the process of decission making: what is more profitable, good enough etc.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Wolfhorsky said:


> Every company, including Ibanez, should make some research of what people actually want. Surveys on FB can easily show what is „trendy”. Then the process of decission making: what is more profitable, good enough etc.



Ya I’m sure every company already does this.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Wolfhorsky said:


> Every company, including Ibanez, should make some research of what people actually want. Surveys on FB can easily show what is „trendy”. Then the process of decission making: what is more profitable, good enough etc.



Folks who nerd over guitars and fill out free surveys =/= people who actually buy guitars in the near future. 

Ibanez, like most all big guitar companies gather industry data to decide what to build. Stuff like talking to retailers, distributors, artists, and monitoring social media and even forums such as this (there are at least four current/past Ibanez employees on this forum and I'd be surprised if there weren't similar numbers from other brands).


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> Folks who nerd over guitars and fill out free surveys =/= people who actually buy guitars in the near future.
> 
> Ibanez, like most all big guitar companies gather industry data to decide what to build. Stuff like talking to retailers, distributors, artists, and monitoring social media and even forums such as this (there are at least four current/past Ibanez employees on this forum and I'd be surprised if there weren't similar numbers from other brands).



Also ibanez’s entire target audience isn’t the 12 people that post on this forum. 

Otherwise all their guitars would be reverse headstock stainless steel frets and would all cost 299.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

MaxOfMetal said:


> Folks who nerd over guitars and fill out free surveys =/= people who actually buy guitars in the near future.
> 
> Ibanez, like most all big guitar companies gather industry data to decide what to build. Stuff like talking to retailers, distributors, artists, and monitoring social media and even forums such as this (there are at least four current/past Ibanez employees on this forum and I'd be surprised if there weren't similar numbers from other brands).


I totally get it, but every year I see ppl here complaining "why, Ibanez, why". Maybe SSO is not the place with representative cohort.

Maybe simple online builder with "project of the month" would be nice instrument to gain data.


----------



## Musiscience

Wolfhorsky said:


> I totally get it, but every year I see ppl here complaining "why, Ibanez, why". Maybe SSO is not the place with representative cohort.
> 
> Maybe simple online builder with "project of the month" would be nice instrument to gain data.



I think the best way to see what sells and gather attention is to allow more and more small runs with specs voted by consumer. That way the consumer who is ready to buy can have the specs he wants when a run is planned and Ibanez can release the model (like the DSY RGD) later if it sell well or gains the attention of other dealers or consumers. It seems like a win-win model. 

Like you said, an online builder would be a great idea too. 

Surveys can be tricky. Like you said, results are often dependent on how and where the information has been gathered and may not be representative of the population they are targetting. In the event that the sample is representative of the whole population, you always run the risk of having so many different opinions that you end up with something like the Homer Mobile.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Musiscience said:


> I think the best way to see what sells and gather attention is to allow more and more small runs with specs voted by consumer. That way the consumer who is ready to buy can have the specs he wants when a run is planned and Ibanez can release the model (like the DSY RGD) later if it sell well or gains the attention of other dealers or consumers. It seems like a win-win model.
> 
> Like you said, an online builder would be a great idea too.
> 
> Surveys can be tricky. Like you said, results are often dependent on how and where the information has been gathered and may not be representative of the population they are targetting. In the event that the sample is representative of the whole population, you always run the risk of having so many different opinions that you end up with something like the Homer Mobile.


Homer Car 
But, theoretically, online builder should give much interest. People could vote for the best projects. And then limited runs of the most popular and easy to make models.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Wolfhorsky said:


> I totally get it, but every year I see ppl here complaining "why, Ibanez, why".



They're never going to make everyone happy. No brand will, at least while still remaining profitable.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

Ibanez are killing it at the moment IMO. I wish these were around years ago. If I had no guitars I'd get these 3 tuned to E, Eb, D and call it a day.(Plus a nice 7 of course).


----------



## Seabeast2000

Wolfhorsky said:


> I totally get it, but every year I see ppl here complaining "why, Ibanez, why". Maybe SSO is not the place with representative cohort.
> 
> Maybe simple online builder with "project of the month" would be nice instrument to gain data.



Relatively speaking, this is a grand slam year for an Ibanez catalog, IMO. There was a time certain groups of us fans would shit our pants when Ibanez put out just a slightly different version of a basswood-solid-color standard MIJ RG. Like OH MY GOD A MAPLE BOARD!!! Then go back the next year to 3 different blue/black/red shades of exactly the same old previous config. 
Max has already said it and knows way more about Ibanez stuff than I do but the 2019 catalog is like Ibanez trying weed and wearing their hair down in their first year of college, to me. They seem to be profoundly conservative, historically. 
I'm glossing over some random-->abandoned unique models over the decades, but you get it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

The906 said:


> Relatively speaking, this is a grand slam year for an Ibanez catalog, IMO. There was a time certain groups of us fans would shit our pants when Ibanez put out just a slightly different version of a basswood-solid-color standard MIJ RG. Like OH MY GOD A MAPLE BOARD!!! Then go back the next year to 3 different blue/black/red shades of exactly the same old previous config.
> Max has already said it and knows way more about Ibanez stuff than I do but the 2019 catalog is like Ibanez trying weed and wearing their hair down in their first year of college, to me. They seem to be profoundly conservative, historically.
> I'm glossing over some random-->abandoned unique models over the decades, but you get it.



The biggest limiting factor for Ibanez has always been manufacturing, which is why they've always kept the MIJ offerings fairly straightforward, eliminating many models year after year. Fujigen just doesn't have the capacity of ESP's 5 or 6 facilities, or gone 99% SK/Indo like Schecter. They need to stay relatively lean if they're to bring anything to market, and especially if they're going to bring anything to market timely, which has been thier biggest challenge the last decade. 

The limits of thier operations also bleeds into what exactly they can offer while still being competitive price wise. They're at the mercy of thier OEMs. They tried bringing Prestige products to SK, but the results weren't satisfactory. 

While that speaks directly to MIJ offerings, the side effect of being limited on the high end options is that they can't over spec the lower end stuff without causing significant confusion in the marketplace. Sure, us geeks can spot the difference (and the effect on the instrument) between a Prestige, Premium, and Standard from a mile away. But the average customer? Not quite.


----------



## jaxadam

Lorcan Ward said:


> Ibanez are killing it at the moment IMO. I wish these were around years ago. If I had no guitars I'd get these 3 tuned to E, Eb, D and call it a day.(Plus a nice 7 of course).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes please.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Lorcan Ward said:


> Ibanez are killing it at the moment IMO. I wish these were around years ago. If I had no guitars I'd get these 3 tuned to E, Eb, D and call it a day.(Plus a nice 7 of course).




Ya me too except all s’s. Oh wait.


----------



## Seabeast2000

Le Sabre is on le mierde list avec Ibanez.


----------



## c7spheres

I've been waiting for Ibanez to just make a 25.5" scale 7 string with an Ebony fretboard non reverse headstock with top mounted voluted neck, and 3pc maple neck for over 20yrs now. The closest they came was the Rg7Cst and that still had a rear mount nut same with the rg2027x but it had a rosewood fretboard. They have made every spec I want on a mass production guitar already for years, they just refuse to combine them. The issue isn't making what is wanted it's combining the specs that are wanted into 1 guitar. I firmly believe Ibanez should become a parts supplier/semi custom shop and just start focusing on making parts available with a few limited example models available. If I could just order the parts I wanted I'd happily paint and assemble the guitar myself, or take it to a local luthier etc. I hate how they also dumb down the models like the Jake Bowen one. I saw it when the La Shop just made his guitar nad was like"Finally a 7 string with a Low Pro and Ebony fretboard in an RgA Style!" then it came out and was a completely differetn guitar with his name on it. Different bridge, different fretboard etc. Then I was like" that ain't his fn guitar!" See, One guitar gets purchased by me, one does not. End of rant : [


----------



## diagrammatiks

c7spheres said:


> I've been waiting for Ibanez to just make a 25.5" scale 7 string with an Ebony fretboard non reverse headstock with top mounted voluted neck, and 3pc maple neck for over 20yrs now. The closest they came was the Rg7Cst and that still had a rear mount nut same with the rg2027x but it had a rosewood fretboard. They have made every spec I want on a mass production guitar already for years, they just refuse to combine them. The issue isn't making what is wanted it's combining the specs that are wanted into 1 guitar. I firmly believe Ibanez should become a parts supplier/semi custom shop and just start focusing on making parts available with a few limited example models available. If I could just order the parts I wanted I'd happily paint and assemble the guitar myself, or take it to a local luthier etc. I hate how they also dumb down the models like the Jake Bowen one. I saw it when the La Shop just made his guitar nad was like"Finally a 7 string with a Low Pro and Ebony fretboard in an RgA Style!" then it came out and was a completely differetn guitar with his name on it. Different bridge, different fretboard etc. Then I was like" that ain't his fn guitar!" See, One guitar gets purchased by me, one does not. End of rant : [



The jbm100 is his guitar tho. They just didn’t make a 7 of it for some reasons. 

Oh ok. The reason is that there are no Japanese signature 7 string guitars. I guess fgn gonna fgn


----------



## Jake

diagrammatiks said:


> The jbm100 is his guitar tho. They just didn’t make a 7 of it for some reasons.
> 
> Oh ok. The reason is that there are no Japanese signature 7 string guitars. I guess fgn gonna fgn


I was about to say the JBM100 is a 1:1 of Jake's, mine is incredible and I wish they would just do a 7 of it.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Wolfhorsky said:


> I totally get it, but every year I see ppl here complaining "why, Ibanez, why". Maybe SSO is not the place with representative cohort.
> 
> Maybe simple online builder with "project of the month" would be nice instrument to gain data.



Yeah it's easy to forget that we're a very small vocal minority around these parts. Hell I bet 7s are only 10% of their sales volume if that.



diagrammatiks said:


> Ya me too except all s’s. Oh wait.



YEAH SABRE FANS ARE PEOPLE TOO.
It irks me how little respect that line gets. It's far and away their best shape.


----------



## c7spheres

Jake said:


> I was about to say the JBM100 is a 1:1 of Jake's, mine is incredible and I wish they would just do a 7 of it.



I just looked at the JBM27 in the Ibanez site again. It seems they changed them yet again. His original 7 string is a basswood body, they were released with mahogany instead and a rosewood fretboard instead of ebony and an Edge-Zero II trem instead of a Lo Pro edge trem. Who knows what else is different. Now, they changed that altered model again and now are using a Nyatoh body and Jatoba fretboard, which seems to be Ibanez's new wood for many guitars, Nyatoh is apparently cheaper less durable wood from what I've read, and Jatoba seems to be Harder but more prone to cracking/splitting like ebony, but Nyatoh looks like mohagany. So really this is only something that looks kinda like his guitar and nothing actually like it. Just take his name off it if it's not what he uses, or even close to it. The woods and bridge are completely different. I'm just using this guitar as an example of how they give the pro a custom instrument, dumb it down, cheapen it and change it up and make it look the same for mass market, then make it even cheaper later on. They did this also with the Dino model. I was thinking hell yeah I'll buy that, Yet again, Ebony fretboard changed to Rosewood, and they did it with the Steve Vai model as well. So it seems basically Ibanez just flat out lies about what the artists actually use. There is no asterik with fine print saying something like the artists guitar is different. I'm leaving this rant. I'm sick of Ibanez. Esp does it too though, to be fair. BooHoo : )


----------



## diagrammatiks

c7spheres said:


> I just looked at the JBM27 in the Ibanez site again. It seems they changed them yet again. His original 7 string is a basswood body, they were released with mahogany instead and a rosewood fretboard instead of ebony and an Edge-Zero II trem instead of a Lo Pro edge trem. Who knows what else is different. Now, they changed that altered model again and now are using a Nyatoh body and Jatoba fretboard, which seems to be Ibanez's new wood for many guitars, Nyatoh is apparently cheaper less durable wood from what I've read, and Jatoba seems to be Harder but more prone to cracking/splitting like ebony, but Nyatoh looks like mohagany. So really this is only something that looks kinda like his guitar and nothing actually like it. Just take his name off it if it's not what he uses, or even close to it. The woods and bridge are completely different. I'm just using this guitar as an example of how they give the pro a custom instrument, dumb it down, cheapen it and change it up and make it look the same for mass market, then make it even cheaper later on. They did this also with the Dino model. I was thinking hell yeah I'll buy that, Yet again, Ebony fretboard changed to Rosewood, and they did it with the Steve Vai model as well. So it seems basically Ibanez just flat out lies about what the artists actually use. There is no asterik with fine print saying something like the artists guitar is different. I'm leaving this rant. I'm sick of Ibanez. Esp does it too though, to be fair. BooHoo : )




This seems like a weird complaint man. 

The lower line has always had different specs then the Japanese sig when there are two versions. 

The jbm100 is exactly his guitar. There are no other production prestige rgas. The only Japanese sig seven made right now is munky’s. 

There’s a good chance that all the Asian mahogany guitars were always nyatoh. It’s collequially called Philippines mahogany and people label it mahogany all the time. 

Ibanez has been a lot more specific recently because of cites. 

Now it’s weird that they do it this way. The prs Holcomb se has no problem getting the ebony right. But it’s almost always been this way.


----------



## c7spheres

diagrammatiks said:


> This seems like a weird complaint man.
> 
> The lower line has always had different specs then the Japanese sig when there are two versions.
> 
> The jbm100 is exactly his guitar. There are no other production prestige rgas. The only Japanese sig seven made right now is munky’s.
> 
> There’s a good chance that all the Asian mahogany guitars were always nyatoh. It’s collequially called Philippines mahogany and people label it mahogany all the time.
> 
> Ibanez has been a lot more specific recently because of cites.
> 
> Now it’s weird that they do it this way. The prs Holcomb se has no problem getting the ebony right. But it’s almost always been this way.




Good point. I'm not aware that there is actually 2 different production versions of the guitar, where can I find each version? When I see the picts of Jake playing his guitar, it is not the same as the guitars Ibanez sells, but Ibanez advertises it as if it is. That's all I'm saying. Both the 6 and 7 strings in picts I see of him have Ebony fretboards and Lo Pro's. The 7 string has a basswood body (not sure abut the 6) and the production models are different.

It's possible Ibanez has been using the same philippines mahogany the entire time and just updated the website to be more accurate, which is nice because that tells if the price is reasonable for the quality of wood used.

I haven't looked into Munkys guitar, but I know that the Dino and Vai guitars are also different. They are obviously a Custom Shop or something . I've never seen Vai play a guitar with an Edge-Zero II and every pict I see of Dino with his guitars have Ebony Fretboards. I'm not really complaining about the fact they are different so much as I am about transparency, because if I didn't know what to look for, like many people, I would feel a bit deceived, and that is borderline unethical without some form of upfront fine print saying "hey this isn't really what so and so plays"

On a different subject, I really do like the new Axe Palace rgd 7 string with the ebony fretboard. Now just make it a 25.5 scale with a normal headstock  Or there was the Ibanez Rules customs that came out with Ebony fretboards at a 25.5 scale, now just take off the dots now It seems it never ends and they will never please everyone, that's why they need to just sell the parts of individual guitars like I originally was saying, Then we can just order the parts we want and make our own guitar : ) Sorry, I'm experimenting with the gif emoji things, what the hell is this thing?


----------



## MikeyLHolm

Burtallica said:


> I just got one of these and am really enjoying it. Paid less than the $1900 MAP, but still take my review with a grain of salt as I'm sure subconsciously I'm justifying my purchase to myself a little bit.
> This one hit all the specs that I've been wishing for in a MIJ Ibanez for a while now: mahogany, reverse headstock, maple board, green. It came set up really well with low action and a smooth neck. I recently got one of the RGR 652 wild cherry blossoms from the Axe Palace run and this 5220 neck feels sliiiiiiiiiiiightly thicker to me. Not usually a fan of matte finishes but this one looks really nice to me... to the point that I don't feel like I'm going to make any shiny spots on it in the near term (we'll see how it holds up after a few months).
> 
> My main complaints are:
> -The BKP pickups. They're ok but seem to go from zero to aggressive very quickly. I might just need to get used to them since I've been playing on DiMarzio's for 20 some odd years.
> -The white binding on the fretboard. I don't mind it on the body and head but I'm not a huge fan of the bound fretboard.



I have one as well (http://sevenstring.org/threads/ngd-is-it-mean-is-it-green-oh-yes-it-is-ibanez-rgr5220m.334427). To me it does not feel or look like a cheap guitar. I guess some people just don't dig the matte finish and pictures can be bit weird with it. Guitar sustains and rings great. And is ofc easy to play. Lots of PROs so don't bother listing 'em. It's damn solid and fun guitar and I'm happy with my purchase.

Oh yeah and the guitar is acoustically very loud. My girlfriend things Basswood RG3770 is toy guitar and this actually real one when she has to listen me play with headphones on.

My CONs are something along these lines:

-It weights quite a bit, but in the end not more than Les Paul. But it was sorta surprise since I didn't pay attention to this.

-Fret ends were quite damn sharp. This tends to happen a lot with (especially) maple and our climate during winters (Finland). I've had to get my RG3770DX-LB and 2k+ Les Paul (not maple obv.) fret ends done also. This is cheap and very minor operation so really not big deal. Some of these went to warranty also. From current axes Vigier Excalibur Kaos is only one that I didn't need to fix the fret ends.

-BKPs: I'm really not sure about these. Feels like I want more mids as these should be quite neutral pups. Cleans and neck pickup seem good tho even tho I don't use neck much with distorted tones. Haven't played that much in band environment since I got the guitar. Just need more Rock N' Roll and rawness on the bridge. I did order green/black Dimarzio Super Distortion and PAF Pro. If these don't cut it then we'll see with something like Seymour Duncan JB.


----------



## StevenC

c7spheres said:


> Good point. I'm not aware that there is actually 2 different production versions of the guitar, where can I find each version? When I see the picts of Jake playing his guitar, it is not the same as the guitars Ibanez sells, but Ibanez advertises it as if it is. That's all I'm saying. Both the 6 and 7 strings in picts I see of him have Ebony fretboards and Lo Pro's. The 7 string has a basswood body (not sure abut the 6) and the production models are different.
> 
> It's possible Ibanez has been using the same philippines mahogany the entire time and just updated the website to be more accurate, which is nice because that tells if the price is reasonable for the quality of wood used.
> 
> I haven't looked into Munkys guitar, but I know that the Dino and Vai guitars are also different. They are obviously a Custom Shop or something . I've never seen Vai play a guitar with an Edge-Zero II and every pict I see of Dino with his guitars have Ebony Fretboards. I'm not really complaining about the fact they are different so much as I am about transparency, because if I didn't know what to look for, like many people, I would feel a bit deceived, and that is borderline unethical without some form of upfront fine print saying "hey this isn't really what so and so plays"
> 
> On a different subject, I really do like the new Axe Palace rgd 7 string with the ebony fretboard. Now just make it a 25.5 scale with a normal headstock  Or there was the Ibanez Rules customs that came out with Ebony fretboards at a 25.5 scale, now just take off the dots now It seems it never ends and they will never please everyone, that's why they need to just sell the parts of individual guitars like I originally was saying, Then we can just order the parts we want and make our own guitar : ) Sorry, I'm experimenting with the gif emoji things, what the hell is this thing?


I don't know what to tell you... Ibanez uses cheaper parts on their cheaper guitars. They're pretty transparent on that. It may shock you that Ibanez artists aren't using the cheapest guitars in their line. They never made a Japanese JBM7, and I don't think they've ever put a LoPro 7 on anything not Japanese.

Steve Vai likes original Edges and LoPros, so that's what have always been on his Japanese guitars, except the years when they were using Edge Pros for copyright reasons. All the JEMs and UVs with an Edge Zero II have been Premium models, and everything with a worse trem has been lower than that. Steve is so well associated with Edges that he's had Premium models with original Edge.


----------



## Jeff

Sogradde said:


> Short scale HSH guitar with a non-locking trem and poo-coloured jatoba fretboard would be the absolute antithesis to a dream guitar for me.
> That thing would land in the bin faster than you can say "But chinese Strandberg copies are worse!"
> 
> (I don't hate short scale guitars, I'm all for variety)



Ha, I knew that’s why I don’t like Jatoba; it’s poop-colored. It really is!


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> Ha, I knew that’s why I don’t like Jatoba; it’s poop-colored. It really is!



Rosewood is poop colored as well.


----------



## ThePIGI King

diagrammatiks said:


> Rosewood is poop colored as well.


Some higher end guitars have nice rosewood boards. I've seen some UVs with nice ones, as well as a friend's ESP. I don't know why so many people hate rosewood. Do yall not realize many woods are brownish naturally?


----------



## diagrammatiks

ThePIGI King said:


> Some higher end guitars have nice rosewood boards. I've seen some UVs with nice ones, as well as a friend's ESP. I don't know why so many people hate rosewood. Do yall not realize many woods are brownish naturally?



You should probably see a doctor if you have maple colored poo.


----------



## c7spheres

diagrammatiks said:


> Rosewood is poop colored as well.


I prefer my poop in the Ebony flavor. I like poop without any pearly dots in it or crazy vines. I like my poop black and plain with nothing in it.


----------



## spudmunkey

Any wood can be poop colored if you eat the right crayons.


----------



## spudmunkey

ThePIGI King said:


> . I don't know why so many people hate rosewood.



A) it's geberally more open-grain than ebony or maple. It feels more rough, and also is harder to keep clean.

B) because, like bolt-on neck construction, they are so often used on inexpensive guitars. So even though their are wonderful examples of both when material and labor costs are spent appropriately for a not-garbage guitar, those barrel bottoms are usually rosewood & bolt on which sullies their reputation a bit.


----------



## Hollowway

Rosewood can be beautiful, but like Spud was saying, they're often used on inexpensive guitars, with seemingly no design thought. I have acoustics with rosewood, and have zero issue with that. I even have some appropriately colored electrics that match the rosewood tone that are nice. But, IMO, almost all blue colors don't match the brown of rosewood or jatoba. White certainly doesn't. Gloss black doesn't. (Weathered flat black looks nice, though!) Oranges, yellows, naturals, etc. can make rosewood look really cool, though!


----------



## Sogradde

A seafoam green guitar with a rosewood neck (!) is the only acceptable instance of using rosewood. In any other case, it's the inferior choice to maple, ebony and any form of synthetic fretboard material.


----------



## Albake21

I went to guitar center to try out some of the new 2019 models. Just like as I expected, the Axion Labels were just garbage. Played and felt like $200 guitars. The green prestiges definitely looked better in person, but sadly I couldn't play them.


----------



## Jonathan20022

I never got the logic of Rosewood Fretboard not being acceptable, but the second it's used both in the neck and fretbord it's suddenly that much more desirable. 

I think you guys are putting way too much thought into this, Rosewood is tried and true and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. People want Ebony, even though it's brittle and cracks easily and it's just for the color and non-porous nature. In general I see the point tossed around that it "feels" smoother, how often are your fingertips touching your fretboard? 

I understand that people care about aesthetics, but goddamn man. If they dyed Rosewood jet black and then used it as a replacement for Ebony, would half of you even care?


----------



## A-Branger

Jonathan20022 said:


> If they dyed Rosewood jet black and then used it as a replacement for Ebony, would half of you even care?


nope, as long as it looks black Im more than happy to it, and donno why theres so much stigma to dye fretboards. Like Hollowway was saying, the color tone of the tipical rosewood brown is very hard to match and look good. Prime example an all black out guitar with a medium light tone of brown. Its like wearing a black shirt and pants but then using a brown belt.

I dont care much about the "feel", or even less about the "tone" of the fretboard, as long as it is black Im happy..... or maple, or some other cool exotic woods used in context.

and like Sogradde says. A guitar in seafoam green with a normal rosewood fretboard AND neck, its something beautiful. Any light pastel color works great too.

and yes, having both the neck and fretboard is a much desired thing, because it is unique. It is different, and its a "dark color neck". Same way we hate rosewood because it is used in everything including 100$ guitars. We kinda have the same deal with maple necks. We accept them and we usually think "meh its alright, stays stable, looks good"...... but bring something "diffeent" and oooooooooooohhhhh <3 and whats more different than the "opposite color" of maple?  get it? plus theres something apealing as having the WHOLE neck as one material, no un-matched headstock (to both body and fretboard), it jsut looks cool, no matter what wood used. And honestly for my seafoam GAS I much rather wenge than rosewood. Gives the same dark brown look, but looks cooler (for me)


----------



## secretpizza

I'd agree with @A-Branger - ebony feels nice, but on the Ibbys I've played where they dye the rosewood super dark (I'm thinking specifically of the RGR752), it felt and sounded great, and alleviated my OCD by not being a light brown board on a black guitar.


----------



## Albake21

I mean if the rosewood was dyed black, I have no complaints. Really the only reason I like ebony is for the looks. Sure it's smoother, but not a big deal for me. I just like that a black or maple board looks better with way more combinations of colors. Rosewood on the other hand just doesn't work with a lot of body colors. It also just reminds me of traditional instruments, which I have no desire for.


----------



## Andromalia

Expensive rosewood can be pretty tight. Don't forget most rosewood we see on guitars is on the cheap side, including most of what's on an Ibanez.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

With proper maintenance and _actually playing the instrument_, most all rosewood will darken considerably. So even if you're very "dye averse", it'll get dark eventually. Usually in just a few years, not decades.


----------



## Albake21

MaxOfMetal said:


> With proper maintenance and _actually playing the instrument_, most all rosewood will darken considerably. So even if you're very "dye averse", it'll get dark eventually. Usually in just a few years, not decades.


True, I've had a couple rosewood boards that ended up very dark over time and with a good amount of fretboard oil. But even still, it's not ebony. I will say though my SV5470 is SUPER dark. Pretty much looks like ebony in most lights.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> True, I've had a couple rosewood boards that ended up very dark over time and with a good amount of fretboard oil. But even still, it's not ebony. I will say though my SV5470 is SUPER dark. Pretty much looks like ebony in most lights.



Part of the oxidation process darkens the rosewood. So it'll go black eventually, unless it's certain, typically much rarer and more expensive, varieties. 

But it's becoming a moot point as much of the MIJ (only stuff really worth buying, IMHO) Ibanez lineup has switched to maple and ebony, with rosewood primarily sticking around on specific signature models at the request of the artist (Vai and Satch).


----------



## spudmunkey

Jonathan20022 said:


> I never got the logic of Rosewood Fretboard not being acceptable, but the second it's used both in the neck and fretbord it's suddenly that much more desirable.



Agreed. There's *some* sense to it, in that it *usually* means that the neck and fretboard is a single piece of wood...but even without that, "tone" (rosewood is a highly-regarded acoustic body wood), and also combine that with this configuration only seemingly available from higher-end companies who generally use high quality woods, and I think people are finally at that point willing to look past the "seen most often on low-budget guitars" reputation.



Jonathan20022 said:


> I think you guys are putting way too much thought into this, Rosewood is tried and true and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. People want Ebony, even though it's brittle and cracks easily and it's just for the color and non-porous nature. In general I see the point tossed around that it "feels" smoother, how often are your fingertips touching your fretboard?
> 
> I understand that people care about aesthetics, but goddamn man. If they dyed Rosewood jet black and then used it as a replacement for Ebony, would half of you even care?



My fingers are in contact with the fretboard enough that every time I play my shitty Chinese Taylor knock-off, with a black-dyed fretboard (I don't know if it's light-colored ebony, or dyed something else), my fingertips get black on them.


----------



## Sogradde

Jonathan20022 said:


> I never got the logic of Rosewood Fretboard not being acceptable



"Well yes, my last name *is* actually Kiesel! How did you guess?"


(I'm kidding)


----------



## Avedas

My j.custom's rosewood board is really dark. Not ebony dark, but it's not far off either.

And my fingers definitely hit the fretboard enough for me to hate that awful lacquered maple Fender does


----------



## Hollowway

Jonathan20022 said:


> I never got the logic of Rosewood Fretboard not being acceptable, but the second it's used both in the neck and fretbord it's suddenly that much more desirable.
> 
> I think you guys are putting way too much thought into this, Rosewood is tried and true and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. People want Ebony, even though it's brittle and cracks easily and it's just for the color and non-porous nature. In general I see the point tossed around that it "feels" smoother, how often are your fingertips touching your fretboard?
> 
> I understand that people care about aesthetics, but goddamn man. If they dyed Rosewood jet black and then used it as a replacement for Ebony, would half of you even care?



This should probably be in the Unpopular Opinions thread, but I 100% only care about the aesthetics of the fretboard. And yes, I’d gladly take a dyed black rosewood (or jatoba) board. I just hate brown. Throw in MOP dots if you REALLY want to see be go ballistic.

In fact, I don’t believe that wood makes any significant difference in guitar tone, so I also choose my body woods based on price and looks alone. I will now turn around, and prepare to be shot.


----------



## Hollowway

Andromalia said:


> Expensive rosewood can be pretty tight. Don't forget most rosewood we see on guitars is on the cheap side, including most of what's on an Ibanez.



Yeah, good rosewood is actually beautiful. For that reason I’m much more open to rosewood used on a custom than I am to rosewood used on a cheap ass guitar.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

all I want is more guitars with richlite boards.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Maple or black richlite. Let Ebony and Rosewood species grow in forests ;-) 
I would like to see more dyed maple boards, for example black or deep purple dyed birdseye maple board with black body.


----------



## odibrom

Wolfhorsky said:


> Maple or black richlite. Let Ebony and Rosewood species grow in forests ;-)
> (...)



Let it be made law and punish the prevaricators...


----------



## Leviathus

I think guitars being made of wood gives them good variance and identity instrument to instrument, it's gonna suck when all guitars are made of synthetics and all sound the same.


----------



## Jeff

diagrammatiks said:


> Rosewood is poop colored as well.



Not like Jatoba it isn't.


----------



## spudmunkey

I had a former coworker who hated walnut because it was "poopie colored". She also called felt, "itchy butt fabric". She was weird, and couldn't hold her booze, but I miss her. Ha!


----------



## Musiscience

KnightBrolaire said:


> all I want is more guitars with richlite boards.



How can I like this comment twice? (pls Gibson purists, don't burn down my house)

Edit: It would also be great if big CIEs would invest in developing synthetic materials such as arium for their instruments. I never heard an Aristides owner say they missed the tone woods.


----------



## xzacx

Musiscience said:


> I never heard an Aristides owner say they missed the tone woods.



They're too busy telling everyone how loud their guitars are unplugged.


----------



## Hollowway

KnightBrolaire said:


> all I want is more guitars with richlite boards.



I can’t help but wonder if these are being held back by a name that screams 1950s technology naming. It just sounds like Bakelite, or any of the other “lite” things. Let the Aristides guys come up with something like Arium, and maybe everyone would go for it.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Hollowway said:


> I can’t help but wonder if these are being held back by a name that screams 1950s technology naming. It just sounds like Bakelite, or any of the other “lite” things. Let the Aristides guys come up with something like Arium, and maybe everyone would go for it.


 rocklite calls their rosewood alternative sundari, that sounds pretty exotic


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> I can’t help but wonder if these are being held back by a name that screams 1950s technology naming. It just sounds like Bakelite, or any of the other “lite” things. Let the Aristides guys come up with something like Arium, and maybe everyone would go for it.



If anything I'd feel that would boost the sales in an industry that is at least 80% folks chasing after designs, tones, and vibes from the 50's.


----------



## Hollowway

KnightBrolaire said:


> rocklite calls their rosewood alternative sundari, that sounds pretty exotic



It does, and holy crap it looks good! I just looked it up, and that stuff is amazing! I’d be down for that on my guitars for sure.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> If anything I'd feel that would boost the sales in an industry that is at least 80% folks chasing after designs, tones, and vibes from the 50's.


Huh. That’s a really good point. Maybe it’s just in the marketing, then. I could see Joe Balaguer throwing a richlite FB on one of his retro models and promote it exclusively on that ‘50s vibe. It’s possible that the big brands just aren’t promoting it right, maybe.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> Huh. That’s a really good point. Maybe it’s just in the marketing, then. I could see Joe Balaguer throwing a richlite FB on one of his retro models and promote it exclusively on that ‘50s vibe. It’s possible that the big brands just aren’t promoting it right, maybe.



I don't think there's any marketing that's going to a) convince manufacturers to switch to it for no reason, and b) convince the majority of players that a wood substitute is preferable, folks just love wood. 

What really needs to happen is popular artists need to start insisting on its use for signature models. That's probably the fastest way to wider acceptance.


----------



## Seabeast2000

So is Richlite totally stable over time? Inert to UV and all that?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

The906 said:


> So is Richlite totally stable over time? Inert to UV and all that?



It's not impervious to all, but compared to wood it might as well be. 

It's used outdoors to side houses, so it's fairly resilient.


----------



## MetalHex

Only it hasnt had the chance to see if it can stand the test of time. Its still in its infancy.

We dont know how richlite "ages" yet.

(Actually I dont know how long its been around for)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MetalHex said:


> Only it hasnt had the chance to see if it can stand the test of time. Its still in its infancy.
> 
> We dont know how richlite "ages" yet.
> 
> (Actually I dont know how long its been around for)



It's not a new product. I believe it was developed in the 60's, give or take a decade. 

It's not even something "special" in the sense that it's just known materials put together in a trademarked way. All it is, is paper and resin that is then baked.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Richlite is very often used in KFCs and McDonnald’s.


----------



## possumkiller

Tubescreamers should be the new unit of measurement. What scale length is that? Oh, it's 8.25 Tubescreamers. How long of a cable do you need? 57 Tubescreamers.


----------



## odibrom

Leviathus said:


> I think guitars being made of wood gives them good variance and identity instrument to instrument, it's gonna suck when all guitars are made of synthetics and all sound the same.



Yes, but we're running out of this _wood thing_... let's start using recycled and man-made materials (from recycled stuff), specially if they have a low carbon footprint...

... and there's plenty of variables to get guitars to sound and have different characters...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

odibrom said:


> Yes, but we're running out of this _wood thing_... let's start using recycled and man-made materials (from recycled stuff), specially if they have a low carbon footprint...
> 
> ... and there's plenty of variables to get guitars to sound and have different characters...



Wood is a renewable resource, we're just terribly impatient and completely indifferent to the idea of conservation. 

But I completely agree, I'd love to see more variety in materials, especially if they're more environmentally friendly and ethically sourced/produced. 

I think the biggest issue is that it seems every company pushing man-made materials forward makes their guitars look like spaceships and alien dildos for some reason.


----------



## Sogradde

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think the biggest issue is that it seems every company pushing man-made materials forward makes their guitars look like spaceships and alien dildos for some reason.


Are you implying we're not all secretly GASing for dat sweet a$$ Teuffel Birdfish?


----------



## odibrom

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think the biggest issue is that it seems every company pushing man-made materials forward *makes their guitars look like spaceships and alien dildos for some reason*.



Hahaha, we've had this argument exchange before and then I showed you the Ibanez Ergodyne guitar series which looked pretty coll in my book (kind of a mix between the Sabers and the Satriani's models)... but they could improve in some parts of the concept... imo...


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> Wood is a renewable resource, we're just terribly impatient and completely indifferent to the idea of conservation.
> 
> But I completely agree, I'd love to see more variety in materials, especially if they're more environmentally friendly and ethically sourced/produced.
> 
> I think the biggest issue is that it seems every company pushing man-made materials forward makes their guitars look like spaceships and alien dildos for some reason.



And then for some reason the spaceships and dildos only come in 24.75 22 fret 6 string modes.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> Are you implying we're not all secretly GASing for dat sweet a$$ Teuffel Birdfish?



I'd qualify those the same as Michael Spalt Hybrids: less wood, but still wood, as those interchangeable "tone bars" are usually wood. 

Really cool stuff though.

I was talking more like Basslab, Aristides, Flaxwood, etc.



odibrom said:


> Hahaha, we've had this argument exchange before and then I showed you the Ibanez Ergodyne guitar series which looked pretty coll in my book (kind of a mix between the Sabers and the Satriani's models)... but they could improve in some parts of the concept... imo...



And again, I'll remind you those have been out of production for decades. 



diagrammatiks said:


> And then for some reason the spaceships and dildos only come in 24.75 22 fret 6 string modes.



Flaxwood? I think they're 25.5". But I know what you mean.


----------



## Sogradde

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'd qualify those the same as Michael Spalt Hybrids: less wood, but still wood, as those interchangeable "tone bars" are usually wood.


I didn't even know they were interchangeable. I will now remain silent and wait for the inevitable tone wood discussion escalation.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

I don’t mind wood-resin hybrids. They look so cool.


----------



## A-Branger

my 300$ acoustic I had (Tanglewood) had a black "eboncore" fretboard. Looked great. Brands should use that for their cheap range instead of the cheap rosewood (or whatever wood used now)


----------



## Jonathan20022

Vigier makes some of the best stuff out there as well, if they adopted Richlite or other composite fretboards I'd jump into one. But they're a very forward thinking company, their trems have features and advancements that you'd expect companies to implement at some point in the last few decades. Their zero fret is segmented and completely replaceable when they do inevitably wear in from the constant string pressure, the 90/10 neck is also amazing and negates the need for a truss rod in their guitars. 

There's no shortage of companies looking to innovate, with the rate that fretboards shrink and dry out/crack I'd imagine at least seasoned musicians would be open to composite fretboards. But I've seen some ignorant shit from the more conservative players out there, I just don't take them as seriously when they make claims to their guitars never having all these problems but they don't seem to notice their guitar's relief is mile high and their frets are poking out.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jonathan20022 said:


> Vigier makes some of the best stuff out there as well, if they adopted Richlite or other composite fretboards I'd jump into one. But they're a very forward thinking company, their trems have features and advancements that you'd expect companies to implement at some point in the last few decades. Their zero fret is segmented and completely replaceable when they do inevitably wear in from the constant string pressure, the 90/10 neck is also amazing and negates the need for a truss rod in their guitars.
> 
> There's no shortage of companies looking to innovate, with the rate that fretboards shrink and dry out/crack I'd imagine at least seasoned musicians would be open to composite fretboards. But I've seen some ignorant shit from the more conservative players out there, I just don't take them as seriously when they make claims to their guitars never having all these problems but they don't seem to notice their guitar's relief is mile high and their frets are poking out.




I mean if you only play like 1 note a bar cuz you playing with feel none of this stuff matters. 

Just have fun with it.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

A-Branger said:


> my 300$ acoustic I had (Tanglewood) had a black "eboncore" fretboard. Looked great. Brands should use that for their cheap range instead of the cheap rosewood (or whatever wood used now)


Yeah, martin uses richlite on their lower-mid tier acoustics and it's pretty nice. I think taylor also uses it but don't quote me on that.
Plus, richlite comes in all kinds of colors so it opens up a lot of possibilities aesthetically speaking, especially since the material won't fade like the more common colorful woods (purpleheart, padauk, etc).


----------



## Dumple Stilzkin

KnightBrolaire said:


> Yeah, martin uses richlite on their lower-mid tier acoustics and it's pretty nice. I think taylor also uses it but don't quote me on that.
> Plus, richlite comes in all kinds of colors so it opens up a lot of possibilities aesthetically speaking, especially since the material won't fade like the more common colorful woods (purpleheart, padauk, etc).


Just imagine what Jeff Kiesel could do with all those new color combinations. WWJKD?


----------



## Exchanger

Jonathan20022 said:


> I understand that people care about aesthetics, but goddamn man. If they dyed Rosewood jet black and then used it as a replacement for Ebony, would half of you even care?



I know I wouldn't



Musiscience said:


> Edit: It would also be great if big CIEs would invest in developing synthetic materials such as arium for their instruments. I never heard an Aristides owner say they missed the tone woods.



The thing with Arium is that I think it's patented and it's kind of what makes Aristides exclusive, and it's supposed to have enhanced sonic properties. Other manufacturers would have to come up with their own materials, which might simply not be worth the investment, or potentiel elgal implications.
Fun coincidence, I found on reverb a cheap fretless bass with a phenolic resin fretboard (practically richlite to) and I'm quite set on buying it.


----------



## narad

Exchanger said:


> The thing with Arium is that I think it's patented and it's kind of what makes Aristides exclusive, and it's supposed to have enhanced sonic properties. Other manufacturers would have to come up with their own materials, which might simply not be worth the investment, or potentiel elgal implications.



The more I think about it, the less it makes sense to be patented. Perhaps the process could be patented, but I imagine there's lots of other methods developed in the past 30 years to create similar composites. Maybe more likely is that there's lots of composites out there, but Aristides just has lots of cool finishes and good marketing  

It's like richlite. If Gibson does it, bad, if Aristides does it, great! The big companies probably just know their customers and what is marketable to them (at this time).


----------



## Lindmann

So the days of endless tone-wood debates will be gone soon and we will have our endless tone-resin debates then.

...who's complaining about discussing the same crap over and over again now....huh?


----------



## Lindmann

Inevitable double post


----------



## MetalHex

Not using wood =/= better for the enviroment. Whatever material they use next won't make polluting-smokestacks go away. The art of dyeing itself is supporting the petro-chemical industry.

As Max said wood is renewable. What these companies should do is buy some land and grow wood specifically for harvesting wood materials.....wait they already do that. (Read an artical years ago that talked about tree farms for paper. They said that for every 13 trees harvested, 87 more are planted to take their place and more)

So then maybe what we need to do as customers is start demanding woods that are more abundant even if they are less pleasing to the eye.


----------



## lewis

cant we start scooping up all the worlds plastic and turn them into guitars?

I would happily opt for that over wood everytime if companies started offering production models made from plastic - especially if they had made an effort to go somewhere and clean up places of the Earth.


----------



## MetalHex

lewis said:


> cant we start scooping up all the worlds plastic and turn them into guitars?
> 
> I would happily opt for that over wood everytime if companies started offering production models made from plastic - especially if they had made an effort to go somewhere and clean up places of the Earth.


Sure but all of that melting plastic and chemical solvents for ink removal and such isnt going to be good for the enviroment.

But yeah if you can remove a huge pile of plastic junk and turn it into new plastic junk then i guess that will be a good thing.


----------



## efiltsohg

High quality rosewood has no tonal or visual comparison (most other woods are noticeably brighter sounding). Maybe people hate rosewood because of the garbage indian stuff on cheap guitars. Maybe people are mistaking wenge/pau ferro/bubinga/whatever else being substituted nowadays for rosewood.


----------



## diagrammatiks

efiltsohg said:


> High quality rosewood has no tonal or visual comparison (most other woods are noticeably brighter sounding). Maybe people hate rosewood because of the garbage indian stuff on cheap guitars. Maybe people are mistaking wenge/pau ferro/bubinga/whatever else being substituted nowadays for rosewood.




Oh you must be new here.


----------



## DEUCE SLUICE

MetalHex said:


> Not using wood =/= better for the enviroment. Whatever material they use next won't make polluting-smokestacks go away. The art of dyeing itself is supporting the petro-chemical industry.
> 
> As Max said wood is renewable. What these companies should do is buy some land and grow wood specifically for harvesting wood materials.....wait they already do that. (Read an artical years ago that talked about tree farms for paper. They said that for every 13 trees harvested, 87 more are planted to take their place and more)
> 
> So then maybe what we need to do as customers is start demanding woods that are more abundant even if they are less pleasing to the eye.



Exactly, there's a big difference sustainability-wise between a fast-growing domestic like maple and rosewood or ebony. 

I'm about to take delivery of another bass from Chris Stambaugh, and this time (and everything going forward) I made a conscious effort to spec out only domestic woods: ash neck, walnut body with an alder tone block. The top is from a piece of old-growth redwood that had sunk to the bottom of a river in Mendocino County in the mid-1800's, and the fingerboard is Richlite. This thing is the kind of bass that really needed an ebony board, but I've checked out Richlite across multiple manufacturers and couldn't tell the difference. Chris said it works really well, just is a bit harder on his saw blades.

That said, I suppose it should be a bit like food - make guitars using the woods that are available locally wherever you're making them.


----------



## Soya

But American woods are boring! Africa gets all the cool stuff


----------



## Exchanger

narad said:


> The more I think about it, the less it makes sense to be patented. Perhaps the process could be patented, but I imagine there's lots of other methods developed in the past 30 years to create similar composites. Maybe more likely is that there's lots of composites out there, but Aristides just has lots of cool finishes and good marketing



As far as I know, the story goes like this :
Some guy who's a bit of an inventor (I think his name is Enserink) came up with the material 10-20 years ago and started Catalyst guitars. These look like they could be made out of wood. He then sold the company to someone else who renamed it to Aristides. I don't know if Arium is patented per se but it's definitely their "secret formula", and it's not just some replacement for wood, it's supposed to have better resonance etc... one could argue it's only a marketing thing. When they started out, they didn't have all those fancy finishes, so I wouldn't attribute their success to just that. I would say it's a smart move though, since they're not using wood and couldn't jump on the figured wood trend, they came up with other ways to make eye-candy.

And in the end it's not so easy to do, resins tend to be significantly more dense than wood : making just a fretboard out of resin doesn't affect the weight too much, but a whole instrument ? You would need to come up with a less dense formula that's strong enough, or you need to otherwise lighten the design (hollowing out for example...I once tried such a guitar at the musikmesse like 7 years ago or so, I think it was Flaxwood). Then you have to convince the tonewood boys that your material is better than wood. Again, it probably makes sense for a lot of companies to not even bother and just stick to wood, no need for new techniques, new tools, new marketing...


----------



## narad

Exchanger said:


> As far as I know, the story goes like this :
> Some guy who's a bit of an inventor (I think his name is Enserink) came up with the material 10-20 years ago and started Catalyst guitars. These look like they could be made out of wood. He then sold the company to someone else who renamed it to Aristides. I don't know if Arium is patented per se but it's definitely their "secret formula", and it's not just some replacement for wood, it's supposed to have better resonance etc... one could argue it's only a marketing thing. When they started out, they didn't have all those fancy finishes, so I wouldn't attribute their success to just that.



Well, they did bomb originally! 

I'll say a 1.5 USD/EUR ratio wasn't helping them out much, but their original market was more TheGearPage, and those guys were not so amenable to the idea nor the results. I also prefer my wood guitars over Aristides in that I often like brighter sounds and Aristides, to me, have a slightly darker Alder-ish sound. I'll say their current market niche really suits their strengths, but I wonder if they'll ever be able to make something that sounds like a great les paul or telecaster (Aristides tele right around the corner rumors would have it...)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Exchanger said:


> or you need to otherwise lighten the design (hollowing out for example...I once tried such a guitar at the musikmesse like 7 years ago or so, I think it was Flaxwood)



Just about all the "not wood" guitars and basses are hollowed out to some degree.

Basslab goes the furthest and makes nearly completely hollow instruments.


----------



## A-Branger

Exchanger said:


> and it's supposed to have enhanced sonic properties



marketing translation: It has the same density as wood X which is normaly used in guitar bodies


----------



## narad

I mean, if someone could explain what "enhanced sonic properties" even is, I'd at least have to consider it's not utter bullshit. But because we derive our notion of what sounds good from existing wood guitars, it seems flawed. And similarly, no one agrees on that anyway, so doubly flawed.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Soya said:


> But American woods are boring! Africa gets all the cool stuff


mexico and central/south america gets even cooler stuff like ziricote/bocote/cocobolo though


----------



## Exchanger

A-Branger said:


> marketing translation: It has the same density as wood X which is normaly used in guitar bodies



I'm just repeating what I heard. It goes beyond just density, it's a porous material and the air bubbles allow for better resonance like tiny acoustic bodies within the body, and it also has extra sustain etc... I understand your skepticism, and I'm not too sure myself how much serious science went into that, but there is apparently some research papers done about it at a technical university in the Netherlands. But that's beside the point in the end, it is indeed marketing and if it works well enough that people buy it, then the job is done.



narad said:


> I mean, if someone could explain what "enhanced sonic properties" even is, I'd at least have to consider it's not utter bullshit. But because we derive our notion of what sounds good from existing wood guitars, it seems flawed. And similarly, no one agrees on that anyway, so doubly flawed.



We could also admit that woods are actually quite flawed and that a synthetic material could be much more accurately controlled in terms of acoustic properties, manufacturing etc... Personally I don't care so much, but assuming that wood is better because of tradition is also a flawed reasoning.


----------



## narad

Exchanger said:


> We could also admit that woods are actually quite flawed and that a synthetic material could be much more accurately controlled in terms of acoustic properties, manufacturing etc... Personally I don't care so much, but assuming that wood is better because of tradition is also a flawed reasoning.



I'm not saying that. I'm saying our measuring stick of "better" is flawed. "Better" is undefinable here. So "enhanced" should also be a red flag for anyone thinking about whether there's real scientific substance to these claims.


----------



## diagrammatiks

I don’t know why people get so mad about marketing when it’s clearly marketing. 

What do you want them say. 

Hey it’s aristides. We made a guitar out of goop. It’s pretty ok. We guess.


----------



## narad

diagrammatiks said:


> I don’t know why people get so mad about marketing when it’s clearly marketing.
> 
> What do you want them say.
> 
> Hey it’s aristides. We made a guitar out of goop. It’s pretty ok. We guess.



I don't get mad at the marketing. I get sad at the people who believe the marketing. They deliver pretty great guitars, and they have fancy colors, so they honestly don't need the BS marketing pseudoscience.


----------



## Exchanger

narad said:


> I'm not saying that. I'm saying our measuring stick of "better" is flawed. "Better" is undefinable here. So "enhanced" should also be a red flag for anyone thinking about whether there's real scientific substance to these claims.


Oh ok, I misread you then. I agree with you. "enhanced sonic properties" is just me summing up what I heard, take it with a grain of salt  
They do seem to have some science to back it up. Whether that's solid or even relevant is not my call.
The ones that I tried out were surely confortable and sounded good, but I didn't hear or feel anything special. Then again I'm not super picky, a well set up RG with decent pickups will make me happy.


----------



## diagrammatiks

narad said:


> I don't get mad at the marketing. I get sad at the people who believe the marketing. They deliver pretty great guitars, and they have fancy colors, so they honestly don't need the BS marketing pseudoscience.



Of course they do man. If everyone else is marketing like that you need to too. They aren’t gonna win any awards for doing it right.


----------



## MetalHex

A true test would be for a company to make an acoustic guitar entirely out of goop! Then you can really see how their resonanating qualities are compared to traditional acoustics. I would guess they wouldn't sound no where near as good as wood guitars


----------



## Avedas

Isn't like less than half of the guitar by volume made of Arium? Doubt it would translate well to acoustics at all.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Dumple Stilzkin said:


> Just imagine what Jeff Kiesel could do with all those new color combinations. WWJKD?


Yeah, doood. Pretty RAD, bruh... I’ll call it vomit burst ;-))


----------



## MetalHex

Wolfhorsky said:


> Yeah, doood. Pretty RAD, bruh... I’ll call it vomit burst ;-))


No, SPARKLY PINK vomit burst on buckeye burl top!


----------



## Albake21

MetalHex said:


> No, SPARKLY PINK vomit burst on buckeye burl top!


Hell I'd play it just to piss people off.


----------



## Wolfhorsky

Regarding Aristides: i wonder what effect You would have if You made fiber-glass-epoxy skeleton and fill it with the expanding foam. I bet that the sound would be 90% there ;-)

Regarding woods: i am into making/ordering guitars with local, popular and easily grown species. My Lupus II is maple, pear, swamp ash and poplar burl. „Normal” woods (not exotic ones) are great. Strats and teles with maple boards are pure „eco friendly” approach (well, almost - since they only harvest trees, not planting them).


----------



## I play music

Guys, this is the Ibanez thread, so for discussing Aristides maybe go to the Aristides thread


----------



## Seabeast2000

I play music said:


> Guys, this is the Ibanez thread, so for discussing Aristides maybe go to the Aristides thread


This is the power of poo.


----------



## Musiscience

The906 said:


> This is the power of poo.






Also: apologies for mentioning Arium, didn’t mean to derail the thread.


----------



## Exchanger

Avedas said:


> Isn't like less than half of the guitar by volume made of Arium? Doubt it would translate well to acoustics at all.



Nah more than that, I saw the inside of one. But because of the cosntruction, I'm not sure how you could make it a hollow body without making it very thick.



Wolfhorsky said:


> Regarding Aristides: i wonder what effect You would have if You made fiber-glass-epoxy skeleton and fill it with the expanding foam. I bet that the sound would be 90% there ;-)



You're not that far off. There's a thin outer shell of plastic (don't remember which type) which is filled with Arium, which looks a bit like hardened foam indeed.


----------



## A-Branger

Exchanger said:


> I'm just repeating what I heard. It goes beyond just density, it's a porous material and the air bubbles allow for better resonance like tiny acoustic bodies within the body, and it also has extra sustain etc... I understand your skepticism, and I'm not too sure myself how much serious science went into that, but there is apparently some research papers done about it at a technical university in the Netherlands. But that's beside the point in the end, it is indeed marketing and if it works well enough that people buy it, then the job is done.


yeah I know. Im not having a go at you, just making fun of the reality of marketing  

which to be honest, and I think I had said here a few times, if they market those man-made fretboards in the proper way then everyone would want one of those instead of crying for rosewood because tradition and fender.

"hey we got this renewable, dairy free, cage free, organic, glutten free, hipster material. It has better resonant properties than traditional woods, you dont need to oil it, you wont be needed to fix your trussrod anymore, it has the smoothes feel ever which makes you play FASTER (lighting bolts appears), its made from re-cycling materials, IT SAVES THE TREES!!!!!!!!... ect ect"


----------



## Sogradde

It's technically not a new Ibby but man.. I've spent all my money like two weeks ago. Genuinely mad right now. </3


----------



## adrianb

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think the biggest issue is that it seems every company pushing man-made materials forward makes their guitars look like spaceships and alien dildos for some reason.



Oh, what i would give for a Strat with a composite body, composite neck+fingerboard colored to look like maple, and stainless 58118 frets...


----------



## Velokki

adrianb said:


> Oh, what i would give for a Strat with a composite body, composite neck+fingerboard colored to look like maple, and stainless 58118 frets...


The boys in the Netherlands have got ya


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Velokki said:


> The boys in the Netherlands have got ya




Aristides can make a fine bloated Saber with speed holes and a few token single coils, but not a Strat.


----------



## adrianb

Velokki said:


> The boys in the Netherlands have got ya



I was really hoping that would be the case, then i realized i don't like their body shapes and they don't offer anything more traditional-looking.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

Sogradde said:


> It's technically not a new Ibby but man.. I've spent all my money like two weeks ago. Genuinely mad right now. </3
> 
> View attachment 69125



Think I may be ordering this.


----------



## ThePIGI King

Nick always puts out guitar pre-orders after I buy stuff. He secretly doesn't want my business I guess. But if he gets me a MiJ trem 8, neither hell or high water or my adulting will stop me!

I'm already excited for the NAMM 2020 thread so I can hope for guitars I won't get again.


----------



## odibrom

adrianb said:


> I was really hoping that would be the case, then i realized i don't like their body shapes and they don't offer anything more traditional-looking.



Maybe Flaxwood can help you then... http://www.flaxwood.com/home/


----------



## narad

MaxOfMetal said:


> Aristides can make a fine bloated Saber with speed holes and a few token single coils, but not a Strat.



The SSO definition of a strat is something with single coils and a non-floyd trem. The NGD will use the phrase "quack sound".


----------



## diagrammatiks

narad said:


> The SSO definition of a strat is something with single coils and a non-floyd trem.



Isn’t that a strat


----------



## MetalHex

A strat is like a superstrat. Just not.....super


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> Isn’t that a strat



Strats apparently:


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> Strats apparently:



Well those can’t be strats. They need 3 strat single coils.


----------



## narad

Ah, I left out the need for a middle pickup, otherwise you can't use the phrase "quack sound". But yea, with middle pickups these would all be SSO strats.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> Well those can’t be strats. They need 3 strat single coils.



Not Strats apparently:


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not Strats apparently:



According to the militant tele group any tele shape without tele pickups isn’t a tele. 

So checks out.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

We're just being pedantic at this point. We all know what a Stratocaster is, and we all know that having a couple base specs of one doesn't necessarily make any guitar platform a Strat, in either feel (neck shape, fretboard radius, body cuts, bridge type) or sound (pickup type and location and bridge type again).

Just like not everything with two humbuckers a stop tail is a Les Paul.



diagrammatiks said:


> According to the militant tele group any tele shape without tele pickups isn’t a tele.
> 
> So checks out.



I thought we were talking Strats.


----------



## narad

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not Strats apparently:



These are all just typical Aristides-style guitars, but made of wood. +1 for the plastic there, but that's just a thin layer, ideally the whole guitar would be made of multiple layers of such material with some sort of foam insides.


----------



## diagrammatiks

MaxOfMetal said:


> We're just being pedantic at this point. We all know what a Stratocaster is, and we all know that having a couple base specs of one doesn't necessarily make any guitar platform a Strat, in either feel (neck shape, fretboard radius, body cuts, bridge type) or sound (pickup type and location and bridge type again).
> 
> Just like not everything with two humbuckers a stop tail is a Les Paul.
> 
> 
> 
> I thought we were talking Strats.



Like obscenity I’ll know it when I see it. 

I think riff trauma’s Aristides in his ngd is pretty close. But it’s not really a strat.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Then what makes a strat? Fender has several revisions on the base 'strat' model, if it's the sum of it's parts then how much of it does another brand need to use to be able to make their own take on a strat and call it that? If it isn't design then the Silver Sky can't be labeled PRS' take on a strat, and neither can Suhr's Classic S Type.

It's just kind of pointless to make distinctions of that level because not even the Fender Strat can have a pinpointed replicate-able tone if we're going to acknowledge that no two guitars made from the same woods will sound *completely *identical. IE: SRV's original guitar vs his replicated signature, which can be strung the same and have the same setup but inherently the woods will not be a 100% match to his original sound.

Inherently putting single coils into a guitar with a smooth/vintage feeling tremolo will get you in the same ballpark and vibe as picking up a strat would. When I owned my SSS 060, I played the kind of music and licks I would play on my Suhr Strat.


----------



## adrianb

odibrom said:


> Maybe Flaxwood can help you then... http://www.flaxwood.com/home/



Seen those before, didn't like them either.


----------



## adrianb

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not Strats apparently:



For some reason, i feel a pang of cognitive dissonance everytime i see a Strat with a pickup config other than SSS...


----------



## prlgmnr

adrianb said:


> For some reason, i feel a pang of cognitive dissonance everytime i see a Strat with a pickup config other than SSS...


Does it make a sort of mental quacking sound?


----------



## adrianb

prlgmnr said:


> Does it make a sort of mental quacking sound?



Your avatar... is that the Ultima 8 inventory screen?


----------



## narad

Jonathan20022 said:


> Inherently putting single coils into a guitar with a smooth/vintage feeling tremolo will get you in the same ballpark and vibe as picking up a strat would. When I owned my SSS 060, I played the kind of music and licks I would play on my Suhr Strat.



Logic's pretty flawed, right? Starting from nothing, "Inherently putting six strings on a guitar with a 25.5" scale will get you in the same ballpark and vibe as picking up a strat would." "When I owned one guitar I played the same kind of music and licks I would play on my [explorer/les paul/telecaster/strat]." Back off or zoom in as far as you'd like, you can play whatever on whichever.


----------



## prlgmnr

adrianb said:


> Your avatar... is that the Ultima 8 inventory screen?


Ultima Underworld.

I once thought "what should I use for an avatar-I know, The Avatar" and then I stuck with it.


----------



## adrianb

prlgmnr said:


> I once thought "what should I use for an avatar-I know, The Avatar" and then I stuck with it.



I had a feeling that was going to be the explanation.

As for the mental sound... what did the duck say to the Avatar?


----------



## Jonathan20022

narad said:


> Logic's pretty flawed, right? Starting from nothing, "Inherently putting six strings on a guitar with a 25.5" scale will get you in the same ballpark and vibe as picking up a strat would." "When I owned one guitar I played the same kind of music and licks I would play on my [explorer/les paul/telecaster/strat]." Back off or zoom in as far as you'd like, you can play whatever on whichever.



Sure, but what I'm referring to is that at least for me, I play softer/clean/bluesy stuff on my Single Coil equipped guitars. And likewise when I play the right guitar with a hot humbucker I'll bust out Battery or Take No Prisioners.

I'm sure you do the exact same thing on a micro scale since you really only have 2 - 3 guitars that can be classified as strats. Anything on the other point I was making about what parts of a strat do other manufacturers have to use to be classified as a strat?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I think the point is that folks want something familiar, and for 99.9% of players, an Aristides, Flaxwood, Basslab, etc is unfamiliar, even if not totally alien, and that doesn't just apply to the mechanics of the guitar, but also the aesthetics.


----------



## narad

I was pushing a slightly different point. If we hopped over to TGP, maybe we would find some guy there that was 99% the guy you think of when you think TGP, but that has a guitar he thinks of as his metal guitar, maybe like a strat with EMG HB pickups or something. That's sort of what I see with all the guys hanging out over here and getting some SSS aristides or strandberg or something and calling it a strat. 

Like the ash vs alder, slab vs veneer, 2 vs 6 screw, or strat neck profile debate, these are some of the bigger things strat guys obsess over. And over here people are throwing a strandberg trem on something, with SSS BKP impuless, it's just like, dude, call that a strat all you want but you're a million miles away.

Naturally you can use whatever, but to appreciate what makes the instrument what it is you have to at least get a bit hands-on with the things purists debate about and understand where your weirdo strat-ish thing fits in there.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

Ordered a 7 on Nick's run yesterday! He hit it out of the freakin' park with this one. Maybe I would have done ebony over maple and I may replace the pickups (no experience with these BKs, always been a Dimarzio guy) but otherwise, guitar is as I'd spec it! It's gonna be a long wait to November!


----------



## Albake21

TheShreddinHand said:


> Ordered a 7 on Nick's run yesterday! He hit it out of the freakin' park with this one. Maybe I would have done ebony over maple and I may replace the pickups (no experience with these BKs, always been a Dimarzio guy) but otherwise, guitar is as I'd spec it! It's gonna be a long wait to November!


The new pink one? If so, yeah an ebony board would have looked way better with the contrast of the pink. The maple makes the guitar look too bright for my tastes. The pink flame is absolutely gorgeous though.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

Albake21 said:


> The new pink one? If so, yeah an ebony board would have looked way better with the contrast of the pink. The maple makes the guitar look too bright for my tastes. The pink flame is absolutely gorgeous though.



I would've been fairly interested if it had been. I can't get with maple boards 95% of the time.


----------



## Sogradde

To be fair, from the top of my head I can think of at least 5 pink Ibbys with a dark fretboard. This is the first one with a maple one. Pretty bummed I don't have the funds for one but maybe I'll be able to snag one when they turn in.
Can you even preorder on AxePalace from outside the US?


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> To be fair, from the top of my head I can think of at least 5 pink Ibbys with a dark fretboard. This is the first one with a maple one. Pretty bummed I don't have the funds for one but maybe I'll be able to snag one when they turn in.
> Can you even preorder on AxePalace from outside the US?


You can? I can only think of one, an RGT. This color is a Japanese exclusive.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Just off the cuff,

RGPR2





That Axe Palace RG752 run they did a little while ago





And the RG2820QZ Wild Cherry Blossom, which looks more orange than it does pink but I've seen one in person and it's definitely pink.


----------



## xzacx

Yeah lots of options for that. I don’t like maple boards myself but I think it’s cool they did it that way for variety since there’s so many already with dark boards. Would have been weird to do it again since AP did pretty much that exact guitar already.


----------



## LeviathanKiller

I hadn't realized that did that already. That looks perfect.


----------



## Sogradde

Jonathan20022 said:


> Just off the cuff,
> 
> RGPR2
> 
> That Axe Palace RG752 run they did a little while ago
> 
> And the RG2820QZ Wild Cherry Blossom, which looks more orange than it does pink but I've seen one in person and it's definitely pink.


I would like to add 






and




(Although as @Albake21 already mentioned, the latter is a JP exclusive colour).


----------



## Rosal76

Jonathan20022 said:


> That Axe Palace RG752 run they did a little while ago



That guitar freaking nice but I didn't think it would need 5 screws to hold down the truss rod cover.  Or is that for something else???


----------



## Jeff

Having gotten several of the Jatoba-boarded Ibby's in at the shop, I still really don't like it. It's just a milky poopy color, and it feels weird to me. I wish they'd just do what companies like Reverend are doing, and use alternative substances like Blackwood-Tek or Richlite.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> I would like to add
> 
> View attachment 69189
> 
> View attachment 69191
> 
> 
> and
> 
> View attachment 69190
> 
> 
> (Although as @Albake21 already mentioned, the latter is a JP exclusive colour).


First one is cherry blossom, not pink, (my all time favorite Ibanez color) which is mostly a Japanese and LACS exclusive besides one limited model. The second one is the RGT I was talking about, the only trans pink (world wide) Ibanez I know of. The third is a Japanese only j-custom.


----------



## Albake21

@Jonathan20022 Just like my message to Sogradde, the first one is incredibly rare. The second and third are cherry blossom, it's not pink. The second one was super limited with only 12 made while the third one is the RG2820QZ which was Japanese only for one year. A model that I have been trying to find/buy for years now. The only ones I've found were in Japan but with the rosewood cites, I cannot import them.


----------



## TheShreddinHand

Albake21 said:


> The new pink one? If so, yeah an ebony board would have looked way better with the contrast of the pink. The maple makes the guitar look too bright for my tastes. The pink flame is absolutely gorgeous though.



Yes, that's the one. I'm not too picky on my fretboard woods (maple, ebony, rosewood) so I was game either way.


----------



## Sogradde

Albake21 said:


> First one is cherry blossom, not pink, (my all time favorite Ibanez color) which is mostly a Japanese and LACS exclusive besides one limited model. The second one is the RGT I was talking about, the only trans pink (world wide) Ibanez I know of. The third is a Japanese only j-custom.


Well, you're not wrong but if you want to be super accurate, the question was how many pink Ibbies are there with a maple fretboard vs a dark fretboard. 
The lack of availability is actuall a blessing though, otherwise plenty of us would have an abysmal credit score.


----------



## Albake21

Sogradde said:


> Well, you're not wrong but if you want to be super accurate, the question was how many pink Ibbies are there with a maple fretboard vs a dark fretboard.
> The lack of availability is actuall a blessing though, otherwise plenty of us would have an abysmal credit score.


I don't care about my credit, money situation or anything like that. If an RG2820QZ WCB pops up I'll sell any guitar in my collection for it. It's the only guitar I've been searching years for!


----------



## Sogradde

Albake21 said:


> I don't care about my credit, money situation or anything like that. If an RG2820QZ WCB pops up I'll sell any guitar in my collection for it. It's the only guitar I've been searching years for!


Not if I see it first..


----------



## Burtallica

Did someone say pink guitars?












IMG_0578 2



__ Burtallica
__ May 8, 2019



RGR652WCB and RGT320Z


----------



## odibrom

Call me macho man or whatever, but I can't go with pink guitars. To me they just look like they were supposed to be RED, but didn't quite make it there...


----------



## Hollowway

I love the maple with the pink. And these (the AP ones) have the natural sides and back, which is cool. But, I got a WCB from the last AP run, so I think I need to sit this one out.


----------



## MetalHex

odibrom said:


> Call me macho man or whatever, but I can't go with pink guitars. To me they just look like they were supposed to be RED, but didn't quite make it there...


Totally agree.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

odibrom said:


> Call me macho man or whatever, but I can't go with pink guitars. To me they just look like they were supposed to be RED, but didn't quite make it there...



Depends on the pink. 

There's nowhere near enough love for Shell Pink:







Or even Burgundy Mist:


----------



## prlgmnr

Nothing shows how completely comfortable you are in your own masculinity than confidently rocking a pink guitar.

Edit:

Everyone, get your wallet out and then google "EDWARDS E-SN7-194MF"


----------



## Sogradde

If I had to design a signature guitar for myself, it would be this: 

(With less switches though and probably H/S pickups).

Wouldn't mind it one bit while chugging the br00tz.


----------



## DredFul

Sogradde said:


> If I had to design a signature guitar for myself, it would be this:
> (With less switches though and probably H/S pickups).
> 
> Wouldn't mind it one bit while chugging the br00tz.



Ibanez plz endorse this man


----------



## MrWulf

Why cant Ibanez make more neck through RG/RGD? I know the AANJ neck joint is their trademark but still...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MrWulf said:


> Why cant Ibanez make more neck through RG/RGD? I know the AANJ neck joint is their trademark but still...



Fujigen charges stupid money for that option.


----------



## MrWulf

MaxOfMetal said:


> Fujigen charges stupid money for that option.



Man im a sucker for neck through guitar and the RGD shape is pretty much up there for me alongside the Archtop Soloist and Agile's Archtop double cut. But no neck through RGD feelsbadman


----------



## Adieu

odibrom said:


> Call me macho man or whatever, but I can't go with pink guitars. To me they just look like they were supposed to be RED, but didn't quite make it there...



What's the world coming to.... next, you'll be blaspheming against spandex and hairspray???


----------



## Sogradde

I spy with my little eye...




Now that I got your hopes up: It's Japan only but(!) it's part of the new series with SS frets and Fishmans/BK pickups.
I for one am looking forward to see that line expanded. All we need is an RGA Prestige now.

Link


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Sogradde said:


> I spy with my little eye...



BRUH!



> Now that I got your hopes up: It's Japan only



You right bastard 
It's even a fixed bridge, too...


----------



## Albake21

Oh come on! Japan gets so many awesome Ibanez exclusives!


----------



## Adieu

Sogradde said:


> I spy with my little eye...
> 
> View attachment 70533
> 
> 
> Now that I got your hopes up: It's Japan only but(!) it's part of the new series with SS frets and Fishmans/BK pickups.
> I for one am looking forward to see that line expanded. All we need is an RGA Prestige now.
> 
> Link



This trips on the 1st pointy-headstock-era Ibanez rule of thumb: THE GOOD ONES ARE ALL PLAIN. 

Wacky but solid colors ok, fancy tops nope


----------



## Leviathus

Maybe my favorite lookin' AZ so far.


----------



## AkiraSpectrum

Leviathus said:


> Maybe my favorite lookin' AZ so far.


so so so so much want.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

That thing is like one string away from a must-have for me. Absolutely love the color.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Sogradde said:


> I spy with my little eye...
> 
> View attachment 70533
> 
> 
> Now that I got your hopes up: It's Japan only but(!) it's part of the new series with SS frets and Fishmans/BK pickups.
> I for one am looking forward to see that line expanded. All we need is an RGA Prestige now.
> 
> Link




This is a hard tail s with ss frets. 

I am 

So

Erect


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Albake21 said:


> Oh come on! Japan gets so many awesome Ibanez exclusives!



That are all insanely expensive. We havent had a good japan-only, affordable model since the MIJ roadcores.


----------



## MatiasTolkki

Leviathus said:


> Maybe my favorite lookin' AZ so far.



I prefer that orange one, but this one looks REALLY nice.


----------



## Vyn

Some gorgeous J Customs being posted on the Ibanez Japan Instagram lately. Wonder if they will make it out of Japan?


----------



## _MonSTeR_

MatiasTolkki said:


> That are all insanely expensive. We havent had a good japan-only, affordable model since the MIJ roadcores.



Expensive is all relative though... a week’s wage? A month’s? For a McDonalds worker? Or a Hollywood actor?

All the big companies have folks in charge of marketing who will understand and set pricing structures...


----------



## Adieu

The Japanese have A LOT of singles who burn through truly ungawdly sums of money on various collecting and hoarding habits

If you have a brand with serious recognition power and DON'T offer them a tiered way of spending $1-2-3-4-5k+ on shineys and preciouses, you're doing something wrong


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Eh, they're just pushing out a ton of exhibition models that'll languish unsold for years until one of the few remaining Ibanez super collectors grabs them in a lot deal.

Ibanez does this every decade or so with JC models.


----------



## Sogradde

diagrammatiks said:


> This is a hard tail s with ss frets.
> 
> I am
> 
> So
> 
> Erect



I'm thinking about having my S6521 refret with stainless steel because I seem to scrape through Ibanez' normal fret material like it's candy.
Unfortunately none of the luthiers in my city offer SS frets and I'm quite wary of Thomanns PLEK service as I've read plenty of horror stories about it but once it's done I'll happily tease you with it.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Eh, they're just pushing out a ton of exhibition models that'll languish unsold for years until one of the few remaining Ibanez super collectors grabs them in a lot deal.
> 
> Ibanez does this every decade or so with JC models.



I wanna be one of the few remaining Ibanez super collectors. I didn’t even know that was a thing, and now I want to be it.  

Are these the guys that Rich will buy a bunch of stuff off of and sell? I remember a few “collections” he was selling guitars from a few years ago.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> I wanna be one of the few remaining Ibanez super collectors. I didn’t even know that was a thing, and now I want to be it.
> 
> Are these the guys that Rich will buy a bunch of stuff off of and sell? I remember a few “collections” he was selling guitars from a few years ago.



You name it and there's probably a collector of it. 

Yeah, those are some examples.


----------



## Leviathus

This one might be the ugliest though IMO, reminds me of a piece of furniture from my grandparent's house. Would be better without the guard on it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Leviathus said:


> This one might be the ugliest though IMO, reminds me of a piece of furniture from my grandparent's house. Would be better without the guard on it.



I could do without the pickguard too, and would probably prefer a different hardware color, but I kind of like it.


----------



## Leviathus

The white plastics are what throws it off for me. If they were black it'd be better, but then it's almost the Tom Quayle model.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

We were just talking about pink guitars too.


----------



## Adieu

MaxOfMetal said:


> We were just talking about pink guitars too.



This baked maple thing is like a Frida Kahlo-grade unibrow on an otherwise hot chick

It's confusing my boner


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Adieu said:


> This baked maple thing is like a Frida Kahlo-grade unibrow on an otherwise hot chick
> 
> It's confusing my boner



I'd probably prefer bright, not baked, maple too. As far as looks go. 

I will say though, in person, it works much better. It's less harsh than the company renders make it look contrasting with the lighter colors.


----------



## Acme

It's insane how much of a difference the colour of the pickups and the knobs make. This pink Ibby looks weird to me, on the other hand, I love how the Charvel DK24 looks.


----------



## diagrammatiks

_MonSTeR_ said:


> Expensive is all relative though... a week’s wage? A month’s? For a McDonalds worker? Or a Hollywood actor?
> 
> All the big companies have folks in charge of marketing who will understand and set pricing structures...



expensive. more then matias can spend right right now 

insanely expensive more then matias can save up in three months of complaining that he'll never buy something something.


----------



## couverdure

Acme said:


> It's insane how much of a difference the colour of the pickups and the knobs make. This pink Ibby looks weird to me, on the other hand, I love how the Charvel DK24 looks.


It reminds me of Marc Okubo's pink Kiesel.


----------



## NotDonVito

dude some of these guitars look like something a guy in a straw fedora and demin vest would pose with in an old navy ad


----------



## Adieu

couverdure said:


> It reminds me of Marc Okubo's pink Kiesel.




That looks SOOO much better than it sounds, alas


----------



## Seabeast2000

Where are these AZ pics coming from?


----------



## LordHar

The906 said:


> Where are these AZ pics coming from?



From the Ibanez Japan website and Ibanezrules.com it seems.


----------



## Seabeast2000

LordHar said:


> From the Ibanez Japan website and Ibanezrules.com it seems.



Ahh there they are on IR, with all the info too!


----------



## MatiasTolkki

diagrammatiks said:


> expensive. more then matias can spend right right now
> 
> insanely expensive more then matias can save up in three months of complaining that he'll never buy something something.



Most AZs cost around 230,000 yen with tax, depending on the model. The price you guys pay if you have someplace like Ikebe ship it to you excludes Japanese consumption tax, which is 8% (going up to 10 in October this year).


----------



## Boojakki

Speaking of baked maple... I ordered a RGEW521-MZW today  Should get it end of next week...


----------



## _MonSTeR_

MatiasTolkki said:


> Most AZs cost around 230,000 yen with tax, depending on the model. The price you guys pay if you have someplace like Ikebe ship it to you excludes Japanese consumption tax, which is 8% (going up to 10 in October this year).



Which by the time it gets to the UK would be about £2100 or so. Which is broadly equivalent to the cost of a top of the range Prestige RG and several hundred less than a Japanese JEM or JS. Admittedly it's not RG550 money, but it looks to be ballpark for other guitars of its ilk... Certainly nowhere near "insanely expensive", for Ibanez that's more in line with some of the £7000 RG j-customs or the Sugi-built Anniversary UVs


----------



## Musiscience

_MonSTeR_ said:


> Which by the time it gets to the UK would be about £2100 or so. Which is broadly equivalent to the cost of a top of the range Prestige RG and several hundred less than a Japanese JEM or JS. Admittedly it's not RG550 money, but it looks to be ballpark for other guitars of its ilk... Certainly nowhere near "insanely expensive", for Ibanez that's more in line with some of the £7000 RG j-customs or the Sugi-built Anniversary UVs



It's not "insanely expensive". But some models are more expensive than some of the Suhr Moderns it's trying to emulate (Modern Satin). I owned several Ibanez Prestige and they are great guitars, no doubt about that. But the quality is nowhere near a Suhr. 

There is not a single universe in which I would choose an AZ over a Suhr Modern at the same price.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Musiscience said:


> It's not "insanely expensive". But some models are more expensive than some of the Suhr Moderns it's trying to emulate (Modern Satin). I owned several Ibanez Prestige and they are great guitars, no doubt about that. But the quality is nowhere near a Suhr.
> 
> There is not a single universe in which I would choose an AZ over a Suhr Modern at the same price.



I’m the other way, price for price, and solid colours, I’d much rather have the Ibanez...


----------



## Sogradde

The AZs are not exactly my cup of tea design wise but curiosity got the better of me and I had to try them at the store. They are very nice guitars well worth the price tag. I don't think I remember a single flaw on the ones I've tried and the neck profile is damn comfy.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Musiscience said:


> It's not "insanely expensive". But some models are more expensive than some of the Suhr Moderns it's trying to emulate (Modern Satin). I owned several Ibanez Prestige and they are great guitars, no doubt about that. But the quality is nowhere near a Suhr.
> 
> There is not a single universe in which I would choose an AZ over a Suhr Modern at the same price.



Have you seen the price increases on the Modern Satin models? You're looking at $2500 at least now. Back when you could grab them for $2k flat it was a no-brainer, but Suhr bumped up the price of their whole lineup by about $500.

Not to mention the AZ are a good bit cheaper compared to Suhr and Anderson internationally.

An AZ Prestige for $2000 or a Suhr Modern Satin for close to $2700. That's a tougher call.

The pricing on the LE models is wacky though. Hard pass.


----------



## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> Have you seen the price increases on the Modern Satin models? You're looking at $2500 at least now. Back when you could grab them for $2k flat it was a no-brainer, but Suhr bumped up the price of their whole lineup by about $500.
> 
> Not to mention the AZ are a good bit cheaper compared to Suhr and Anderson internationally.
> 
> An AZ Prestige for $2000 or a Suhr Modern Satin for close to $2700. That's a tougher call.
> 
> The pricing on the LE models is wacky though. Hard pass.



Was just about to say that purchasing a Suhr or an Anderson (or really any US made guitar at the moment) makes no sense price-wise unless you happen to live in the US.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Prices really aren’t comparable at all anymore. And some moderns stains are listed at almost 3k now in places other then the us. 

Plus the last modern satin I tried wasn’t any better playability wise out of the box then an az premium. The premium just had more cosmetic defects. 

Although I’ll never love the az the comparison isn’t that easy.


----------



## Albake21

Personally from what I've played the Suhrs played better than AZs in terms of feel and quality, but honestly I just think that shows how inconsistent Ibanez has always been. The AZs are a great value over a Suhr, but the Suhr still has that premium feel to it that the AZ doesn't have. Personally I'd probably still stick with the AZ though for cost unless I found a used Suhr for a stupid low price.


----------



## Jeff

Adieu said:


> This baked maple thing is like a Frida Kahlo-grade unibrow on an otherwise hot chick
> 
> It's confusing my boner



You're entitled to your wrong opinion, however wrong it may be.  Roasted maple is the best. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Have you seen the price increases on the Modern Satin models? You're looking at $2500 at least now. Back when you could grab them for $2k flat it was a no-brainer, but Suhr bumped up the price of their whole lineup by about $500.
> 
> Not to mention the AZ are a good bit cheaper compared to Suhr and Anderson internationally.
> 
> An AZ Prestige for $2000 or a Suhr Modern Satin for close to $2700. That's a tougher call.
> 
> The pricing on the LE models is wacky though. Hard pass.



Suhrs have gotten way more expensive, and the Prestige AZ's are nuts too, especially the MIJ sig models. I don't get why people don't just build a partscaster or have a good tech do it. Get what you want for nearly half the price, same or better quality.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Suhrs have gotten way more expensive, and the Prestige AZ's are nuts too, especially the MIJ sig models. I don't get why people don't just build a partscaster or have a good tech do it. Get what you want for nearly half the price, same or better quality.



Not everyone has the ability or tools to do it themselves, and finding a skilled tech/luthier to do a great job isn't a given depending on where they live. It's easy see the appeal of a ready-made guitar.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not everyone has the ability or tools to do it themselves, and finding a skilled tech/luthier to do a great job isn't a given depending on where they live. It's easy see the appeal of a ready-made guitar.



I guess I'm lucky. A tech nearby with 30+ years who will assemble anything for $200. Small price to pay for getting what I want for way less dough.


----------



## Musiscience

MaxOfMetal said:


> Have you seen the price increases on the Modern Satin models? You're looking at $2500 at least now. Back when you could grab them for $2k flat it was a no-brainer, but Suhr bumped up the price of their whole lineup by about $500.
> 
> Not to mention the AZ are a good bit cheaper compared to Suhr and Anderson internationally.
> 
> An AZ Prestige for $2000 or a Suhr Modern Satin for close to $2700. That's a tougher call.
> 
> The pricing on the LE models is wacky though. Hard pass.



I just checked and the one I saw was indeed an LE model. Hard pass indeed for 2.5k.


----------



## Jeff

Holy shit, a Modern Satin is up to $2700. Yikes.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Holy shit, a Modern Satin is up to $2700. Yikes.



Not even the cool colors either. 

https://www.humbuckermusic.com/collections/suhr-modern-satin

The ones for $2100 are 2018 models that are no longer available. Everything starts at $2700 now. 

To put that in perspective, the custom M7 I ordered in 2017 was $3500 delivered. That same guitar is almost $4200 now. Ouch.


----------



## Seabeast2000

I like that aqua AZ, a lot. That is all.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not even the cool colors either.
> 
> https://www.humbuckermusic.com/collections/suhr-modern-satin
> 
> The ones for $2100 are 2018 models that are no longer available. Everything starts at $2700 now.
> 
> To put that in perspective, the custom M7 I ordered in 2017 was $3500 delivered. That same guitar is almost $4200 now. Ouch.



Just not worth it, IMO. We had four guitars in today; two Andersons, a Suhr and a EBMM Axis. They’re all nice guitars, but only the Andersons were something I’d say “wow, that’s a $3500 guitar”.


----------



## Vyn

Jeff said:


> Just not worth it, IMO. We had four guitars in today; two Andersons, a Suhr and a EBMM Axis. They’re all nice guitars, but only the Andersons were something I’d say “wow, that’s a $3500 guitar”.



I think this has something to do with the quality of imports these days. A $1500 import actually plays pretty damn well compared to what one did 10-15 years ago so while there is still a difference in quality between an import and a high end instrument, the gap feels less than what the price gap reflects


----------



## Jeff

Vyn said:


> I think this has something to do with the quality of imports these days. A $1500 import actually plays pretty damn well compared to what one did 10-15 years ago so while there is still a difference in quality between an import and a high end instrument, the gap feels less than what the price gap reflects



That and companies like Suhr don’t want to move from California, and I can’t blame them. But it’s damn expensive to live in Cali, and they have to pay their guys.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> Just not worth it, IMO. We had four guitars in today; two Andersons, a Suhr and a EBMM Axis. They’re all nice guitars, but only the Andersons were something I’d say “wow, that’s a $3500 guitar”.


 A 3500 Anderson is rare these days. 
The fancy angels routinely go for 5k

Still kicking myself for not picking up a few more baritones a few years ago


----------



## Jeff

diagrammatiks said:


> A 3500 Anderson is rare these days.
> The fancy angels routinely go for 5k
> 
> Still kicking myself for not picking up a few more baritones a few years ago



Yeah I guess those have gone up too. For that money I’d much rather get a regular core PRS and a loaded Warmoth.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Jeff said:


> Yeah I guess those have gone up too. For that money I’d much rather get a regular core PRS and a loaded Warmoth.



Ya but a core pro is like 3600 average now new.

I paid 3500 for my Anderson 7. the baritone was only 1800 used. the tele was 1700 used. 
I'd have a hard time buying another new Anderson. Although if they actually made metal oriented guitars I'd be tempted.

All the long time regulars here have old timers syndrome though. This shit used to cost a nickel!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

diagrammatiks said:


> Ya but a core pro is like 3600 average now new.
> 
> I paid 3500 for my Anderson 7. the baritone was only 1800 used. the tele was 1700 used.
> I'd have a hard time buying another new Anderson. Although if they actually made metal oriented guitars I'd be tempted.
> 
> All the long time regulars here have old timers syndrome though. This shit used to cost a nickel!



There's just more competition now. 

When I bought my first M7 no one was really making boutique semi-custom 7-strings. Even Anderson had just started releasing batches of DT7s. 

Now there's ESP and Schecter in the mix. 

I love my M7s, but it's hard to not consider ESP's or Schecter's USA shops when they're about a grand or more less for similar specs.


----------



## Jeff

diagrammatiks said:


> Ya but a core pro is like 3600 average now new.
> 
> I paid 3500 for my Anderson 7. the baritone was only 1800 used. the tele was 1700 used.
> I'd have a hard time buying another new Anderson. Although if they actually made metal oriented guitars I'd be tempted.
> 
> All the long time regulars here have old timers syndrome though. This shit used to cost a nickel!



PRS have taken like six years to go up $400 though. The increases haven’t been nearly as fast and furious.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> PRS have taken like six years to go up $400 though. The increases haven’t been nearly as fast and furious.



That's mostly because they somewhat "future-proofed" their pricing a decade or so ago. 

Paul is really smart, he probably knew that the guitars would get cheaper per unit to build as manufacturing matured and economies of scale would swing in their favor. Or maybe it was just luck. Regardless, they've been able to maintain margins without significant increase and because legacy pricing was already very high relative to the market the impact on retail price hasn't been significant. 

They've also been steering seasoned core buyers towards higher margin, yet not that much more expensive (again, relatively speaking) Artist and Wood Library offerings. 

The PS take-up has been on the rise too. Not to mention the success of the import range. 

It's a very smart move keeping the Custom 22 and 24 at the same price.


----------



## Adieu

Jeff said:


> That and companies like Suhr don’t want to move from California, and I can’t blame them. But it’s damn expensive to live in Cali, and they have to pay their guys.



That's pretty damn odd

Because regular normal guys out here in SoCal tend to talk about cutting their losses and moving to Texas or Utah or something


----------



## binz

Boojakki said:


> Speaking of baked maple... I ordered a RGEW521-MZW today  Should get it end of next week...
> 
> View attachment 70540



I'm also really tempted for this or the dark one (cz ending I think). those rgew look super nice and have a fixed bridge
Do you know if one can change for active pickups like Fishman fluence in case you don't like the prodivded ones?


----------



## Jeff

Adieu said:


> That's pretty damn odd
> 
> Because regular normal guys out here in SoCal tend to talk about cutting their losses and moving to Texas or Utah or something



John Suhr said straight out on a podcast (I think it was Friedman's?) that he has no desire to uproot his employees and go somewhere cheaper. He likes where he's at. I get it, I do. But in no way, shape or form do I think Suhr guitars are worth their asking price anymore, when compared to a well built Warmoth/USA Custom/Musikraft.


----------



## Andromalia

I work for a US company whose headquarters are in OC, a lot of the employees there are efffectively working poor, while getting paid better than me. Because a company is located in an expensive area doesn't mean the employees are compensated accordingly.


----------



## Jeff

Andromalia said:


> I work for a US company whose headquarters are in OC, a lot of the employees there are efffectively working poor, while getting paid better than me. Because a company is located in an expensive area doesn't mean the employees are compensated accordingly.



Of course not. I was specifically speaking about Suhr in particular, based on what John Suhr himself said.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Andromalia said:


> I work for a US company whose headquarters are in OC, a lot of the employees there are efffectively working poor, while getting paid better than me. Because a company is located in an expensive area doesn't mean the employees are compensated accordingly.



I’m in a similar situation, I work for the U.K. subsidiary of a Silicon Valley company headquartered in Menlo Park, where Facebook is based. Starting salary in the Menlo office is *rumoured *to be huge just to a) stop folks automatically moving to google or Facebook and b) to be able to put a roof over their head...

Then again my house is tiny compared to some guys I know in the states for similar monetary costs because land where I am is expensive, so it’s all relative...

At least my healthcare is free ... (for now)


----------



## diagrammatiks

_MonSTeR_ said:


> I’m in a similar situation, I work for the U.K. subsidiary of a Silicon Valley company headquartered in Menlo Park, where Facebook is based. Starting salary in the Menlo office is *rumoured *to be huge just to a) stop folks automatically moving to google or Facebook and b) to be able to put a roof over their head...
> 
> Then again my house is tiny compared to some guys I know in the states for similar monetary costs because land where I am is expensive, so it’s all relative...
> 
> At least my healthcare is free ... (for now)



Starting salary for qualified people in those parts is easily 225k plus benefits.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

diagrammatiks said:


> Starting salary for qualified people in those parts is easily 225k plus benefits.



And our guys there are usually PhDs from Stanford, MIT or what have you. I may earn a fraction of that, but at least I can buy a house where I live 

Anyway back to Ibanez 2019...

I’m personally disappointed with the seeming lack of higher end prestige HSH guitars from Ibanez, I know they do a lot of market analytics and stuff to see what sells, but I’m still annoyed/surprised that HH with a fancy switch has replaced HSH so completely! I do wonder if it was John Petrucci’s fault with his rise in popularity and the original JPM100 having HH and fancy switching.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

_MonSTeR_ said:


> And our guys there are usually PhDs from Stanford, MIT or what have you. I may earn a fraction of that, but at least I can buy a house where I live
> 
> Anyway back to Ibanez 2019...
> 
> I’m personally disappointed with the seeming lack of higher end prestige HSH guitars from Ibanez, I know they do a lot of market analytics and stuff to see what sells, but I’m still annoyed/surprised that HH with a fancy switch has replaced HSH so completely! I do wonder if it was John Petrucci’s fault with his rise in popularity and the original JPM100 having HH and fancy switching.



Blame everyone's shitty picking technique. 

That was one of the biggest complaints that they've fielded over the years: "my pick keeps hitting the middle pickup".

It doesn't help that most big names in guitar these days don't use middle pickups.


----------



## laxu

Jeff said:


> Y
> Suhrs have gotten way more expensive, and the Prestige AZ's are nuts too, especially the MIJ sig models. I don't get why people don't just build a partscaster or have a good tech do it. Get what you want for nearly half the price, same or better quality.



Partscasters do have the most significant dive in value if you try to sell one though and as mentioned, not everyone has the skills or a good tech nearby to do it.

I don't see much point in paying more than US Fender or G&L prices for a Strat or Tele unless it's some fancy finish (e.g. relic) which are not easy to do well cheaply.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

laxu said:


> I don't see much point in paying more than US Fender or G&L prices for a Strat or Tele unless it's some fancy finish (e.g. relic) which are not easy to do well cheaply.



Everyone makes a Strat. 

It's all about finding the maker that caters to the minute details and random minutiae that tickles your fancy. It's less about quality (they all tend to make great stuff) and more about subtlety. A Nash, G&L, Suhr, and LsL can all be great Strats, but for typically very different players.


----------



## laxu

_MonSTeR_ said:


> I’m personally disappointed with the seeming lack of higher end prestige HSH guitars from Ibanez, I know they do a lot of market analytics and stuff to see what sells, but I’m still annoyed/surprised that HH with a fancy switch has replaced HSH so completely! I do wonder if it was John Petrucci’s fault with his rise in popularity and the original JPM100 having HH and fancy switching.



I don't mind this. I went from a H/S/H Ibanez RG550 to a H/H Carvin C66 and don't feel like I lost really anything of importance. It's still got coil splits and the middle position could be setup to be both humbuckers, both coil split or parallel etc. I've never had the problem but many complain about the middle single coil getting in the way of their picking.


----------



## diagrammatiks

_MonSTeR_ said:


> And our guys there are usually PhDs from Stanford, MIT or what have you. I may earn a fraction of that, but at least I can buy a house where I live
> 
> Anyway back to Ibanez 2019...
> 
> I’m personally disappointed with the seeming lack of higher end prestige HSH guitars from Ibanez, I know they do a lot of market analytics and stuff to see what sells, but I’m still annoyed/surprised that HH with a fancy switch has replaced HSH so completely! I do wonder if it was John Petrucci’s fault with his rise in popularity and the original JPM100 having HH and fancy switching.



Yup blame people’s shitty ass technique. Or inability to stick a super hot middle coil in there and deck it against the body. 

Hsh is best. Speaking of which going to try and buy another sv and s next month.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

MaxOfMetal said:


> "my pick keeps hitting the middle pickup".



When you sometimes hit the neck pickup on certain guitars 

It is a good thing they listen to their customers otherwise we'd still have endless complaints of the high E slipping off the board on their 7s. 

Maybe if there was a much bigger emphasis on neck singles and new models from BKP, DiMarzio, Duncan etc it would bring back middle pickups.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Does anyone actually want a neck single though? I always figured these were the sort of things that folks said they wanted, said they’d buy and then stayed away from in droves!


----------



## iamaom

I've never had a problem with middle S pickups on any guitars until I got a fender and put a SD pickup in with non-flat poles. The D string, if I remember, had its pole piece so high that I swear you could see the string dipping over it and I'd always hit it with my pick. Now I always use pickups whose poles are flush.


----------



## Adieu

_MonSTeR_ said:


> Does anyone actually want a neck single though? I always figured these were the sort of things that folks said they wanted, said they’d buy and then stayed away from in droves!



I'm more surprised by the persistence of the neck humbucker, to be honest


----------



## Jeff

laxu said:


> Partscasters do have the most significant dive in value if you try to sell one though and as mentioned, not everyone has the skills or a good tech nearby to do it.
> 
> I don't see much point in paying more than US Fender or G&L prices for a Strat or Tele unless it's some fancy finish (e.g. relic) which are not easy to do well cheaply.



Oh absolutely. You've got to do one because you want it and intend on keeping it. The resale value is a nose dive. Even if you want a good relic, MJT does every bit the job of Fender or G&L though.


----------



## MetalHex

Some people really like to dig their pick into the strings aggressively like myself. And where I anchor my hand happens to be in perfect position to smack into a middle pickup every single time. 

Plus I think HSH guitars are fugly


----------



## Albake21

MetalHex said:


> Some people really like to dig their pick into the strings aggressively like myself. And where I anchor my hand happens to be in perfect position to smack into a middle pickup every single time.
> 
> Plus I think HSH guitars are fugly


This. This so much.


----------



## diagrammatiks

MetalHex said:


> Some people really like to dig their pick into the strings aggressively like myself. And where I anchor my hand happens to be in perfect position to smack into a middle pickup every single time.
> 
> Plus I think HSH guitars are fugly


 
All wrong.


----------



## MetalHex

Albake21 said:


> This. This so much.


Lol. Im thinking maybe part of the fact that I think theyre ugly come from knowing that the middle pickup will get in my way.


----------



## Albake21

MetalHex said:


> Lol. Im thinking maybe part of the fact that I think theyre ugly come from knowing that the middle pickup will get in my way.


This could be true. Although even when I lower the middle pickup to it's lowest point, it still looks ugly. I think it just looks very cluttered with a middle pickup. I like my guitar's electronics to be simple. Just like how I like having no tone knob, a volume push/pull, and a 3 way blade/switch.


----------



## adrianb

MaxOfMetal said:


> Blame everyone's shitty picking technique.
> 
> That was one of the biggest complaints that they've fielded over the years: "my pick keeps hitting the middle pickup".



This cracked me up. In all my years of playing i have yet to hit the middle pickup on my Strat.



_MonSTeR_ said:


> Does anyone actually want a neck single though? I always figured these were the sort of things that folks said they wanted, said they’d buy and then stayed away from in droves!



Personally that's how i think the neck position is supposed to sound: with a single coil. Think Yngwie lead tone.  It could also be a single-sized twin blade with a coil split, which is what i have in my Strat.


----------



## Lindmann

adrianb said:


> This cracked me up. In all my years of playing i have yet to hit the middle pickup on my Strat.


Now that I know that everybody is doing it, I think I should sit down and adjust my technique so that I will hit the middle pickup some day as well.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

MaxOfMetal said:


> Blame everyone's shitty picking technique.



Yeahhhh....sorry guys


----------



## diagrammatiks

I’m sorry the second you say anchoring and you hit the middle pup I blank out completely. 

I file that under I can’t play a seven string because I need to wrap my thumb over and why have 24 frets it’s only 2 more notes.


----------



## MetalHex

Albake21 said:


> This could be true. Although even when I lower the middle pickup to it's lowest point, it still looks ugly. I think it just looks very cluttered with a middle pickup. I like my guitar's electronics to be simple. Just like how I like having no tone knob, a volume push/pull, and a 3 way blade/switch.


Agree


----------



## Sogradde

HSH is dead. HS is where it's at boys. Move with the times duh!


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Sogradde said:


> HSH is dead. HS is where it's at boys. Move with the times duh!



I thought HS died in 94 when Ibanez canned the RG565?


----------



## Sogradde

It HAS to come back because I want one.


----------



## Bloody_Inferno

Sogradde said:


> It HAS to come back because I want one.



Have you considered the new JS models?

EDIT: There's also the Chon Erick Hansel sig, as well as the modding an RG550 with a HS pickguard option.


----------



## Sogradde

I know, I just don't like pickguards. 
JS models are straight up ugly.


----------



## lurè

Only ERG HSH are ugly.

Pickguards are cool af.


----------



## Jeff

Sogradde said:


> I know, I just don't like pickguards.
> *JS models are straight up ugly*.


----------



## Sogradde

Jeff said:


>


The second I figured out the JS doesn't even have an angled headstock, it died for me.

I don't like pickguards for practical reasons though. I tend to bump into them alot when I play while moving on stage. I also have that irrational fear of slitting my wrist on one and bleeding to death. Fight me.


----------



## diagrammatiks

Ibanez's direction is being picked by a bunch of weirdos.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

diagrammatiks said:


> Ibanez's direction is being picked by a bunch of weirdos.



I think we’re supposed to call them... Accountants...


----------



## ThePIGI King

Sogradde said:


> The second I figured out the JS doesn't even have an angled headstock, it died for me.
> 
> I don't like pickguards for practical reasons though. I tend to bump into them alot when I play while moving on stage. I also have that irrational fear of slitting my wrist on one and bleeding to death. Fight me.


I have never heard of anyone saying anything like that about a pickguard. I'm kind of amused.

HSH is king. Give me more UVs, TAM10(0)s, and don't dis the OG Saber shape. Joe is keeping her alive and I'd like to keep it that way in hopes of a reissue.


----------



## spudmunkey

Sogradde said:


> I don't like pickguards for practical reasons though. I tend to bump into them alot when I play while moving on stage. I also have that irrational fear of slitting my wrist on one and bleeding to death. Fight me.



Do...do you know what a pickguard looks like? How do you "bump into" a pickguard on an RG? It sounds like your fear is a bit misguided....although to be fair, you did say "irrational"...


----------



## Sogradde

What do you mean? I can't be the only one who gets stuck on the edge of a pickguard..? :/


----------



## Seabeast2000

Sogradde said:


> What do you mean? I can't be the only one who gets stuck on the edge of a pickguard..? :/


Drunk windmilling or what?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> The second I figured out the JS doesn't even have an angled headstock, it died for me.



Any benefits of an angled headstock are negated by the locking nut and full-length 3-piece construction.


----------



## Jeff

Sogradde said:


> The second I figured out the JS doesn't even have an angled headstock, it died for me.
> 
> I don't like pickguards for practical reasons though. I tend to bump into them alot when I play while moving on stage. I also have that irrational fear of slitting my wrist on one and bleeding to death. Fight me.



I don’t notice any issues with straight headstocks; in fact, I prefer them. As for the pick guard, you’d have to have a pretty weird technique to even notice it. But whatever floats your boat!


----------



## Sogradde

I know you guys are making fun of me but it is what it is. 
My preference for angled headstocks is an aesthetic one.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Sogradde said:


> My preference for angled headstocks is an aesthetic one.



It's all good. Thought it was a functional thing. 

I'm the same way with string trees. Just don't dig them.


----------



## jwoods986

diagrammatiks said:


> I’m sorry the second you say anchoring and you hit the middle pup I blank out completely.
> 
> I file that under I can’t play a seven string because I need to wrap my thumb over and why have 24 frets it’s only 2 more notes.



Yeah, maybe you should inform that Michael Angelo guy not to anchor his picking hand, it's bad technique


----------



## diagrammatiks

jwoods986 said:


> Yeah, maybe you should inform that Michael Angelo guy not to anchor his picking hand, it's bad technique



let's not beat around the bush. if some random guitar hero of yours was sucking dick for crack you'd be next in line.


----------



## USMarine75

_MonSTeR_ said:


> Does anyone actually want a neck single though? I always figured these were the sort of things that folks said they wanted, said they’d buy and then stayed away from in droves!


----------



## _MonSTeR_

USMarine75 said:


> View attachment 70750



That’s what I mean though! The only people I see going on about wanting an Ibanez RG with a neck single are on here... so I guess the rest of the Internet is happy with HH...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

_MonSTeR_ said:


> That’s what I mean though! The only people I see going on about wanting an Ibanez RG with a neck single are on here... so I guess the rest of the Internet is happy with HH...



Those HS RG anniversary models from a few years ago sold incredibly well. So I don't think the want for the HS pickup configuration is that far skewed.


----------



## Albake21

Yeah if anything I feel like more people outside of SSO prefer the HS config over everyone here. I've been gassing for an HS config for a while now.


----------



## xzacx

HS (or HSS) is the most practical configuration there is for this style of guitar IMO. If I care about a neck humbucker tone, I’m sure not gonna get to get it with a 24 fret, 25.5” scale bolt-on with a trem. I’d rather have a more traditional neck single option than such a compromised (relatively speaking) approximation of what I want from a neck hum. That’s not to say I think there’s anything wrong with HH, and if I only had one guitar that would probably be my choice. But I think HS offers a more idealized option when it comes to super Strats.


----------



## Ordacleaphobia

Definitely a HH guy myself but I absolutely would not be opposed to an HS guitar; that sounds like it could be fun.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

See I think the Ibanez neck humbucker sound is the ‘right’ one, because that’s the sound I grew up with and associate with that position. As much as anything probably Petrucci on Images and Words and the Live in Tokyo ‘video’ (yes I had it on vhs)...

All the grandpas with their old fashioned Les Paul malarkey just don’t cut it to my ears. 

The I realise I’m in my 40s and passion and warfare was 30 years ago!!!!!!!


----------



## Richter

HSH rule, love that spanky second position (or is it fourth?) for that Intervals type of sound.


----------



## USMarine75

I use middle, 2, and 4 all the time (or series/parallel on SS guitars). So does most of the music community outside of djent. YMMV


----------



## USMarine75

WTF I just discovered this...







But it's $1500 for a MII with a gig bag? WTF? And I don't like that the fact that it's MII (or Premium series) is not on reseller sites or listed on the Ibanez site (that I could find)?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> WTF I just discovered this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But it's $1500 for a MII with a gig bag? WTF? And I don't like that the fact that it's MII (or Premium series) is not on reseller sites or listed on the Ibanez site (that I could find)?



It says Premium on it, but it's on the back of the headstock. Same as how the Prestige ones don't say it on the front either. 

The naming convention gives it away too, along with price, but you'd have to be an Ibanez fan in general to pick up on it. 

As a general rule: "How do you know an Ibanez is made in Japan? Don't worry, they'll tell you."


----------



## BigViolin

It's a sig model from one of the Chon dudes.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> It says Premium on it, but it's on the back of the headstock. Same as how the Prestige ones don't say it on the front either.
> 
> The naming convention gives it away too, along with price, but you'd have to be an Ibanez fan in general to pick up on it.
> 
> As a general rule: "How do you know an Ibanez is made in Japan? Don't worry, they'll tell you."


Yeah but didnt the online Ibanez catalog separate Premium guitars from Prestige last year? And didn't they usually say Premium in the title? Just weird. It reminds me of how with EVH it got to the point you had to have the reseller like MF open the box and look at the back of the headstock or sticker to see country of manufacture.


----------



## Jeff

BigViolin said:


> It's a sig model from one of the Chon dudes.



Listening to Chon is more effective than Tylenol PM.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Yeah but didnt the online Ibanez catalog separate Premium guitars from Prestige last year? And didn't they usually say Premium in the title? Just weird. It reminds me of how with EVH it got to the point you had to have the reseller like MF open the box and look at the back of the headstock or sticker to see country of manufacture.



Signature models always appear separately from the non-sig. models. 

The actual catalog has "Premium" right next to the model name:

http://www.hoshinogakki.co.jp/pdf/ibanez/catalog/2019USA.pdf

The website shows the Premium branding on the back of the headstock as well:


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> Signature models always appear separately from the non-sig. models.
> 
> The actual catalog has "Premium" right next to the model name:
> 
> http://www.hoshinogakki.co.jp/pdf/ibanez/catalog/2019USA.pdf
> 
> The website shows the Premium branding on the back of the headstock as well:



That's different than their website though that doesnt seem to list it other than recognizing nomenclatures/numbering conventions.

Nor do resellers seem to be making it "obvious":
https://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/ibanez-am153qa-artstar-series-electric-guitar
^ lists country of manufacture

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/gui...l-signature-electric-guitar?rNtt=eh10&index=1
^ does not

I don't see Premium, country of origin, or anything that hints this is not a MIJ.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> That's different than their website though that doesnt seem to list it other than recognizing nomenclatures/numbering conventions.



And a picture of the back of the headstock that clearly says "Premium" and "Made In Indonesia". 

That picture of the back of the headstock is pulled directly from the product page on the Ibanez website.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> And a picture of the back of the headstock that clearly says "Premium" and "Made In Indonesia".
> 
> That picture of the back of the headstock is pulled directly from the product page on the Ibanez website.



Still missing my point. Also not featured on some reseller sites.

https://www.americanmusical.com/Item--i-IBA-EH10-LIST
^ not mentioned, only in a pic if you zoom in.

Ibanezrules is only site I found which clearly says Chon dude gets his own sig "in a Premium".

We'll agree (or not) to disagree. You think a pic clearly and obviously showing that it's a MII in the PDF catalog but not on the manufacturer website nor most resellers is due diligence. I disagree and think it's disingenuous and dubious at best.

Also... Unless things have changed, one of the reasons why companies were moving their production lines to Indonesia was due to S Korea trying to unionize and wanting fair labor wages (the bastards). We're now at the point where MII guitars are going for $1500 without a case and people are complaining that MIA Gibsons are overpriced? I can buy a MIA Gibson SG 2019 for $900-2k depending on model. It may have shit QC and a cracked headstock when it arrives, but at least it comes with a damn hard case.

[edit: Oh F me I admit you were right all along. If you go to the Ibanez website it is clearly and obviously shown that it's a Premium MII if you scroll all the way down to the section about the tuners and read the back of the headstock in the small angled-away-from-the-camera non-zoom photo. I mean, it doesn't say Premium or MII anywhere, and they accidentally (?) left that photo out of the main photo section above with, but that is still obviously clear enough. Derp I'm a dummy.]


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Still missing my point. Also not featured on some reseller sites.
> 
> https://www.americanmusical.com/Item--i-IBA-EH10-LIST
> ^ not mentioned, only in a pic if you zoom in.
> 
> Ibanezrules is only site I found which clearly says Chon dude gets his own sig "in a Premium".
> 
> We'll agree (or not) to disagree. You think a pic clearly and obviously showing that it's a MII is due diligence. I disagree and think it's disingenuous and dubious at best.



Absolutely nothing about this guitar points to it being anything other than MII. 

The official catalogs say it's Premium. The manufacturer's website shows detailed pics that reveal series (Premium) and origin (Made In Indonesia). At least two of the largest dealers (Ibanez Rules & Sweetwater) either mention explicitly that it's MII or show detailed pics where it can be seen. 

There are numerous websites with advertisements and "reviews" who mention either the series, country of origin, or both. 

Nowhere on Ibanez' site is it mentioned or inferred that it is MIJ. 

If anyone is legitimately interested in this guitar all they have to do is Google it and there are multiple first page links that tell you exactly what this is.

Anyone who cares enough about where this is built should have some sort of idea about how to figure out country of origin, which in this case is really easy. Even if you're not a regular Ibanez player. 

Not to mention if you try it out in person, it's right on the guitar. 



> Unless things have changed, one of the reasons why companies were moving their production lines to Indonesia was due to S Korea trying to unionize and wanting fair labor wages (the bastards). We're now at the point where MII guitars are going for $1500 without a case and people are complaining that MIA Gibsons are overpriced? I can buy a MIA Gibson SG 2019 for $900-2k depending on model... with a damn hard case. It may have shit QC and a cracked headstock when it arrives, but at least it comes with a damn hard case.



Chill dude. It's just guitars.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> Absolutely nothing about this guitar points to it being anything other than MII.
> 
> The official catalogs say it's Premium. The manufacturer's website shows detailed pics that reveal series (Premium) and origin (Made In Indonesia). At least two of the largest dealers (Ibanez Rules & Sweetwater) either mention explicitly that it's MII or show detailed pics where it can be seen.
> 
> There are numerous websites with advertisements and "reviews" who mention either the series, country of origin, or both.
> 
> Nowhere on Ibanez' site is it mentioned or inferred that it is MIJ.
> 
> If anyone is legitimately interested in this guitar all they have to do is Google it and there are multiple first page links that tell you exactly what this is.
> 
> Anyone who cares enough about where this is built should have some sort of idea about how to figure out country of origin, which in this case is really easy. Even if you're not a regular Ibanez player.
> 
> Not to mention if you try it out in person, it's right on the guitar.
> 
> 
> 
> Chill dude. It's just guitars.



Huh? Literally can't possibly disagree more.

AMS, MF/GC, Zzounds, CME all dont have any mention of MII. Where did Sweetwater say it because I didnt see it there either. Only Ibanezrules.

Here's the enlarged photo from Ibanez website. It's the only mention anywhere and the photo is not in the main photo section, only below and off to the side in the section about tuners. And the MII part is strangely blurry. But that cursive Premium is a dead giveaway.






I also think referring to it as "AZ style" is disingenuous, since AZ is a MIJ line.

Meh whatever. We have polarized viewpoints of "truth in advertising". Hey man, I can't be responsible for the damage to the guitar I sold you on Reverb. If you clearly look at pic #7 you can see the crack, even though the photo was clearly not focusing on the crack but on something else. I didn't mention it anywhere, but that photo is the only obligation I had to notify you. True? Maybe. Shady. Definitely.

And the PDF is funny. That's the only place they list country of manufacture. Well, kind of. Where it is MIJ they have in bright red MADE IN JAPAN. For the EH10 it says Premium in cursive off to the side, yet strangely in that same box where it says MADE IN JAPAN, it's left blank. No MADE IN INDONESIA? Hmm. Seems legit. Lol


----------



## diagrammatiks

USMarine75 said:


> Huh? Literally can't possibly disagree more.
> 
> AMS, MF/GC, Zzounds, CME all dont have any mention of MII. Where did Sweetwater say it because I didnt see it there either. Only Ibanezrules.
> 
> Here's the enlarged photo from Ibanez website. It's the only mention anywhere and the photo is not in the main photo section, only below and off to the side in the section about tuners. And the MII part is strangely blurry. But that cursive Premium is a dead giveaway.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also think referring to it as "AZ style" is disingenuous, since AZ is a MIJ line.
> 
> Meh whatever. We have polarized viewpoints of "truth in advertising". Hey man, I can't be responsible for the damage to the guitar I sold you on Reverb. If you clearly look at pic #7 you can see the crack, even though the photo was clearly not focusing on the crack but on something else. I didn't mention it anywhere, but that photo is the only obligation I had to notify you. True? Maybe. Shady. Definitely.
> 
> And the PDF is funny. That's the only place they list country of manufacture. Well, kind of. Where it is MIJ they have in bright red MADE IN JAPAN. For the EH10 it says Premium in cursive off to the side, yet strangely in that same box where it says MADE IN JAPAN, it's left blank. No MADE IN INDONESIA? Hmm. Seems legit. Lol
> View attachment 70781



Ya but you're never really obligated to say where something is made in advertising. 
You can't say it's made somewhere it's not. 
Brands definitely do advertise it if it's a good thing. 
And you have to say where it's made someone on the thing itself. 
But in advertising? 

It's not like every amp that's made in China or Asia has a big MIC in the advertising.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Huh? Literally can't possibly disagree more.



And that's perfectly fine. 



> AMS, MF/GC, Zzounds, CME all dont have any mention of MII. Where did Sweetwater say it because I didnt see it there either. Only Ibanezrules.



Do those sites mention the country of origin of every other guitar listed? This is more of an industry thing than specifically an Ibanez issue. 

Sweetwater shows clear pictures of the guitar, including the Premium branding and origin. 

The same with GC, and Peach Guitar (first page Google result), AMS, NYME (first page Google result, also lists Indonesia as country of origin), and Zzounds. 



> Here's the enlarged photo from Ibanez website. It's the only mention anywhere and the photo is not in the main photo section, only below and off to the side in the section about tuners. And the MII part is strangely blurry. But that cursive Premium is a dead giveaway.



If they genuinely wanted to hide the country of origin, why bother with that picture anyway?



> I also think referring to it as "AZ style" is disingenuous, since AZ is a MIJ line.



?



> Meh whatever. We have polarized viewpoints of "truth in advertising". Hey man, I can't be responsible for the damage to the guitar I sold you on Reverb. If you clearly look at pic #7 you can see the crack, even though the photo was clearly not focusing on the crack but on something else. I didn't mention it anywhere, but that photo is the only obligation I had to notify you. True? Maybe. Shady. Definitely.



I mean, if Googling your used guitar on Reverb returned half a dozen links on the first page detailing on the problems, whose fault is it really? 

I'm all for consumer protections, but at some point you have to row your own canoe and maybe do a little research before dropping $1500 on a guitar you otherwise know nothing about.


----------



## USMarine75

diagrammatiks said:


> Ya but you're never really obligated to say where something is made in advertising.
> You can't say it's made somewhere it's not.
> Brands definitely do advertise it if it's a good thing.
> And you have to say where it's made someone on the thing itself.
> But in advertising?
> 
> It's not like every amp that's made in China or Asia has a big MIC in the advertising.



They do. It's clearly listed right under the MIC sticker. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> And that's perfectly fine.
> 
> 
> 
> Do those sites mention the country of origin of every other guitar listed? This is more of an industry thing than specifically an Ibanez issue.
> 
> Sweetwater shows clear pictures of the guitar, including the Premium branding and origin.
> 
> The same with GC, and Peach Guitar (first page Google result), AMS, NYME (first page Google result, also lists Indonesia as country of origin), and Zzounds.
> 
> 
> 
> If they genuinely wanted to hide the country of origin, why bother with that picture anyway?
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> I mean, if Googling your used guitar on Reverb returned half a dozen links on the first page detailing on the problems, whose fault is it really?
> 
> I'm all for consumer protections, but at some point you have to row your own canoe and maybe do a little research before dropping $1500 on a guitar you otherwise know nothing about.



You won the internets today with Peach Guitar... who can argue with that kind of reference.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> They do. It's clearly listed right under the MIC sticker.
> 
> 
> 
> You won the internets today with Peach Guitar... who can argue with that kind of reference.



Sorry you got bummed because the pretty guitar you just discovered was mean to you.


----------



## diagrammatiks

USMarine75 said:


> They do. It's clearly listed right under the MIC sticker.
> 
> 
> 
> You won the internets today with Peach Guitar... who can argue with that kind of reference.



so you're saying that this 

https://www.guitarcenter.com/EVH/5150-III-100W-3-Channel-Tube-Guitar-Amp-Head.gc#productDetail

is clearer then the az premium advertising?


----------



## USMarine75

diagrammatiks said:


> so you're saying that this
> 
> https://www.guitarcenter.com/EVH/5150-III-100W-3-Channel-Tube-Guitar-Amp-Head.gc#productDetail
> 
> is clearer then the az premium advertising?



Huh? No. I literally addressed this earlier.



MaxOfMetal said:


> Sorry you got bummed because the pretty guitar you just discovered was mean to you.



Now you get it.


----------



## USMarine75

FWIW... I'm not hating on Ibanez (I don't have anything against the Spanish).

It's actually more pervasive when it comes to country of manufacture. I'm 100% positive as of a year or two ago, MF/GC always had country of origin listed in the specs of the guitars. Whether it is because they just cut and paste what the manufacturer has listed on their website or not, they definitely don't seem to list that anymore for most guitars, except when it comes to MIJ and they are listing that as a feature. But I know MII and MIK used to always be listed at least on those sites.

I mean, c'mon... I'm racist AF... there's no way I'd buy some knockoff Indonesian strat.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> FWIW... I'm not hating on Ibanez (I don't have anything against the Spanish).
> 
> It's actually more pervasive when it comes to country of manufacture. I'm 100% positive as of a year or two ago, MF/GC always had country of origin listed in the specs of the guitars. Whether it is because they just cut and paste what the manufacturer has listed on their website or not, they definitely don't seem to list that anymore for most guitars, except when it comes to MIJ and they are listing that as a feature. But I know MII and MIK used to always be listed at least on those sites.
> 
> I mean, c'mon... I'm racist AF... there's no way I'd buy some knockoff Indonesian strat.



I think we've reached the point where most folks don't care about where the guitar is made. Not that we haven't been at that point already, I just think it's seeped into the enthusiast market as well as the weekend warriors. 

To the point that it's just a non-issue. 

I've seen the PDFs of the sell sheets that Ibanez sends retailers and they do include country of origin (it's basically the catalog section plus blurb). Retailers just don't see a reason to post that, and as long as they don't misprint MSRP or MAP, Ibanez doesn't seem to care how much of the sell sheet they repost.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think we've reached the point where most folks don't care about where the guitar is made. Not that we haven't been at that point already, I just think it's seeped into the enthusiast market as well as the weekend warriors.
> 
> To the point that it's just a non-issue.
> 
> I've seen the PDFs of the sell sheets that Ibanez sends retailers and they do include country of origin (it's basically the catalog section plus blurb). Retailers just don't see a reason to post that, and as long as they don't misprint MSRP or MAP, Ibanez doesn't seem to care how much of the sell sheet they repost.



Well glad to see you've declared everyone enlightened since a year or two ago, when I tried a bunch of MII Premiums at Sam Ash Manhattan and came away impressed. I made a comment on here and got roasted, including IIRC by you saying negative stuff that Indo craftsmanship just wasnt there yet (I believe you commented on bad fretwork and poor wood).


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Well glad to see you've declared everyone enlightened since a year or two ago, when I tried a bunch of MII Premiums at Sam Ash Manhattan and came away impressed. I made a comment on here and got roasted, including IIRC by you saying negative stuff that Indo craftsmanship just wasnt there yet (I believe you commented on bad fretwork and poor wood).



Quality has improved as manufacturing matures. It took a long time for Cort SK to get good, and it took some time for Cort Indonesia to get good.

I still think some of the Indo lines are, in my opinion, sub par. Not that they aren't getting better, but I'm still not ready to buy an Iron Label/Axiom Label. Especially not for what they're asking new. Same goes for other makers. I don't think I've ever panned (or "roasted" anyone for that matter) Indo, or any other country of origin, as a whole. 

I'm certainly not above buying guitars from "not-America/Western Europe/Japan", I love my Eastman. One of my favorite Ibanez is an Artcore from the early 00's. 

Now, I'm a picky fuck. I've been working on guitars for too long, so I'll judge them based on my experience and expectations. I try to be honest and I don't really have a horse in the game. Heck, I don't even really care for much Ibanez anymore.


----------



## Albake21

Jeff said:


> Listening to Chon is more effective than Tylenol PM.


Glad I'm not the only one. I remember since 2014 my buddy showing me them and I just couldn't get into them at all.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Albake21 said:


> Glad I'm not the only one. I remember since 2014 my buddy showing me them and I just couldn't get into them at all.



Every song is just that mellow bridge or intro before the fun stuff starts...only the fun never really happens. 

Great chill background music, but there's no way I can actively listen to it.


----------



## xzacx

USMarine75 said:


> I also think referring to it as "AZ style" is disingenuous, since AZ is a MIJ line.



How is AZ a MIJ line? I must have missed something on these—I've mostly seen the Premium versions so I associate it with that more than Prestige.


----------



## Jeff

xzacx said:


> How is AZ a MIJ line? I must have missed something on these—I've mostly seen the Premium versions so I associate it with that more than Prestige.



They’re equally represented by MII and MIJ. The dude is literally riled up over a line he really doesn’t know much about.


----------



## USMarine75

Jeff said:


> They’re equally represented by MII and MIJ. The dude is literally riled up over a line he really doesn’t know much about.



Yup I riled and dumb. I made mistake not knows teh AriZona line is mixed so now I fuckboy douche. Derpity. I dont even own any guitars Im just a fuckboy trolling Ibanez. You brang intelligence to convo... Can I be your friend?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Yup I riled and dumb. I made mistake not knows teh AriZona line is mixed so now I fuckboy douche. Derpity. I dont even own any guitars Im just a fuckboy trolling Ibanez. You brang intelligence to convo... Can I be your friend?



You're starting to cross the line from friendly banter into just being rude for the sake of it. 

Don't be that guy. Please.


----------



## diagrammatiks

This escalated quickly


----------



## Sogradde

What the fuck man?


----------



## USMarine75

Haha not a big fan of internet douchebag flame comments from nowhere. Hence my not a fan of, you know, the internet. 

Max is entitled to his opinion. I disagree. I think $1500 for an Indo guitar with a soft case is absurd. That's just me? Fine. I also think companies have actively gone out of their way to minimize country of manufacture as of late. I'm positive resellers listed it regardless of whether good/bad just a year ago (like MF), but hey maybe Im wrong. 

Should buyer's know LTD is MIK and ESP is MIJ? Maybe. Is having it clearly shown in a pic of the back or headstock acceptable enough? To some (maybe many), like Max? Yup. 

I guess I know nothing because I thought the sig AZ's like Martin Miller were all MIJ. I thought the only MII were Premiums, hence the designation (like LTD was for ESP). Again obviously Im an asshole who knows nothing about Spanish guitar companies for thinking something so stupid. 

And this idea that I'm all riled up is just a d-bag's attempt at an anonymous internet dig for flame's sake. I literally turned my laptop towards my wife and said I'm buying this when I get back to the US. And when I discovered it was MII I told her I'd be buying from MF so I had 45 days and the ability to exchange in case I got a lemon. Damn, I know what you're thinking... calm down, asshole. Quit getting so riled up. FWIW I apologized to the wife and we had make-up sex. 

But then again we all know I'm obv such a 'merica fuck yeah guy with my MAGA hat since I would never actually buy anything made in Indonesia... or Korea.

Now get off my lawn. I only have a few minutes to play authentic before I have to be in court.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Haha not a big fan of internet douchebag flame comments from nowhere. Hence my not a fan of, you know, the internet.
> 
> Max is entitled to his opinion. I disagree. I think $1500 for an Indo guitar with a soft case is absurd. That's just me? Fine. I also think companies have actively gone out of their way to minimize country of manufacture as of late. I'm positive resellers listed it regardless of whether good/bad just a year ago (like MF), but hey maybe Im wrong.
> 
> Should buyer's know LTD is MIK and ESP is MIJ? Maybe. Is having it clearly shown in a pic of the back or headstock acceptable enough? To some (maybe many), like Max? Yup.
> 
> I guess I know nothing because I thought the sig AZ's like Martin Miller were all MIJ. I thought the only MII were Premiums, hence the designation (like LTD was for ESP). Again obviously Im an asshole who knows nothing about Spanish guitar companies for thinking something so stupid.
> 
> And this idea that I'm all riled up is just a d-bag's attempt at an anonymous internet dig for flame's sake. I literally turned my laptop towards my wife and said I'm buying this when I get back to the US. And when I discovered it was MII I told her I'd be buying from MF so I had 45 days and the ability to exchange in case I got a lemon. Damn, I know what you're thinking... calm down, asshole. Quit getting so riled up. FWIW I apologized to the wife and we had make-up sex.
> 
> But then again we all know I'm obv such a 'merica fuck yeah guy with my MAGA hat since I would never actually buy anything made in Indonesia... or Korea.
> 
> Now get off my lawn. I only have a few minutes to play authentic before I have to be in court.



Have you considered ordering from Rich at Ibanez Rules? I know it's already pricey for what you're getting, but with a Silver or above package it'll be great out of the box. 

Sorry to come off as a salesman. Rich is just a great dude so I'll recommend him when appropriate.


----------



## gunch

Chon's first self titled EP shreds


----------



## MaxOfMetal

gunch said:


> Chon's first self titled EP shreds



I've only listened to Grow and Homey.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> Have you considered ordering from Rich at Ibanez Rules? I know it's already pricey for what you're getting, but with a Silver or above package it'll be great out of the box.
> 
> Sorry to come off as a salesman. Rich is just a great dude so I'll recommend him when appropriate.



Indeed. Ive actually bought from him before and I've dropped a lot of recommendations on here in the past to buy from him. I Can't say enough good things. Worth every penny for his attention to detail. 

Its actually why I went to his site to check the country of manufacture because I figured if anyone is legit it's him lol.


----------



## gunch

They were a lot more metal


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Indeed. Ive actually bought from him before and I've dropped a lot of recommendations on here in the past to buy from him. I Can't say enough good things. Worth every penny for his attention to detail.
> 
> Its actually why I went to his site to check the country of manufacture because I figured if anyone is legit it's him lol.





Dude is the real deal.



gunch said:


> They were a lot more metal




Thanks, I'll give it a listen later.


----------



## Sogradde

USMarine75 said:


> [...]


How is Ibanez to blame for resellers not stating the country of origin?
Ibanez is way more transparent than virtually any other manufacturer.


----------



## USMarine75

Sogradde said:


> How is Ibanez to blame for resellers not stating the country of origin?
> Ibanez is way more transparent than virtually any other manufacturer.



Literally _not_ my point.

That's why I said it was more pervasive than anything Ibanez was doing... that it seems to have become an industry standard (agreeing with what Max said, just differing in approval/disapproval) to not list country of manufacture any more on many of the reseller websites. This was certainly not true just a couple years ago.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Literally _not_ my point.
> 
> That's why I said it was more pervasive than anything Ibanez was doing... that it seems to have become an industry standard (agreeing with what Max said, just differing in approval/disapproval) to not list country of manufacture any more on many of the reseller websites. This was certainly not true just a couple years ago.



I think it was around 2016 or so. 

Whenever PRS SE and LTD1000 stuff went to Indonesia from SK.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think it was around 2016 or so.
> 
> Whenever PRS SE and LTD1000 stuff went to Indonesia from SK.



Somehow I missed the normalization of MII and MIC production.

Peavey was crapped on for years for even "allowing" a line of MIK Wolfgangs (ca 2000)... and those junk MIK ones became counterfeit MIA ones with hilarious fake SNs and such. Then Peavey moved a lot of production to China but claimed it wouldnt affect the final product due to CNC use and non-Chinese sourced parts. Yet that pretty much destroyed any credibility they had in the market because the MIC end product just wasnt where it is now with the likes of Epiphone, and the profits went downhill to the point where they havent recovered as a guitar manufacturer since. It didnt help that they closed the Meridian shop and when they tried to "rerelease" the HP2 they failed due to the inability to get the product into the hands of dealers (which is funny necause that was why EVH left Musicman).

Tl;dr fuck these import garbage guitars...

I"m waiting for my nice Leo Fender made G&L Tribute S500 to arrive in the mail. We can all agree only white dudes from Corona can make a proper guitar.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Somehow I missed the normalization of MII and MIC production.



It was easy to miss, as it was [purposely] done without mention. If it wasn't for the few more (but not totally) honest brands and internet sleuths we would have known less. 

It began a long while ago, back in the early 00's. Think 01' to about 05' depending on brand. That was the first wave, when Cort Indonesia was up and running. That's when Ibanez moved the Standard series to Indonesia from SK. Schecter did the same with just about everything below Hellraiser and Blackjack a year or two later. ESP initially chose China, but folks gave them hell so they moved the lower series stuff to Indonesia too eventually. They do both now from what I understand. 

Then more recently the last of the holdouts moved to Indonesia. The higher end LTDs and PRS SE stuff. 

Schecter still uses SK on some stuff, and LTD does a few, mostly signature, models there too. 

Ibanez invested heavily with Cort Indonesia, hence their part ownership in the facility that makes the Premium models.


----------



## Acme

USMarine75 said:


> Again obviously Im an asshole who knows nothing about Spanish guitar companies for thinking something so stupid.



Am I missing something? Or is this some kind of an inside joke? Ibanez is a Japanese company as far as I know.


----------



## Kaura

USMarine75 said:


> I"m waiting for my nice Leo Fender made G&L Tribute S500 to arrive in the mail. We can all agree only white dudes from Corona can make a proper guitar.



Lol, no. It's actually kinda sad that my Chinese made sub-400€ Strat plays as well as some of the Strats made by "white dudes in Corona" that I've tried.


----------



## Jeff

USMarine75 said:


> Yup I riled and dumb. I made mistake not knows teh AriZona line is mixed so now I fuckboy douche. Derpity. I dont even own any guitars Im just a fuckboy trolling Ibanez. You brang intelligence to convo... Can I be your friend?



Dude, take a breath. They’re just guitars.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Acme said:


> Am I missing something? Or is this some kind of an inside joke? Ibanez is a Japanese company as far as I know.



_"Hoshino Gakki decided in 1935 to make Spanish-style acoustic guitars, at first using the "Ibanez Salvador" brand name in honor of Spanish luthier Salvador Ibáñez, and later simply "Ibanez."_


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think it was around 2016 or so.
> 
> Whenever PRS SE and LTD1000 stuff went to Indonesia from SK.



Higher end PRS SE didn’t start going to Indonesia until 2018, and the difference is imperceptible.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Higher end PRS SE didn’t start going to Indonesia until 2018, and the difference is imperceptible.



But the SE Standard were MII then, right?

I don't think there's much of a quality gap either.


----------



## Jeff

MaxOfMetal said:


> But the SE Standard were MII then, right?
> 
> I don't think there's much of a quality gap either.



Which is why the Internet outrage is a bit unfounded, IMHO. But to each their own.

EDIT

yes, Standards were always MII. Customs just started there last year.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Jeff said:


> Which is why the Internet outrage is a bit unfounded, IMHO. But to each their own.



I don't know if it's as much about the quality as it is the value proposition. 

Again, I'm cool with it, but I can see some folks not being so.


----------



## USMarine75

There's a whole ton of recency bias going on here, because not too far back this place was full of recommendations to stay away from MII Premium Ibanez guitars because of QC issues, bad fretwork, dead wood, etc... and tons of recommendations to buy a used MIJ Prestige instead. But whatever I'll stick with my MAGA guitars.



Jeff said:


> Which is why the Internet outrage is a bit unfounded, IMHO. But to each their own.



I love how, even though I expressly stated I'd still buy one, but simply have an issue with thinking MII guitars have reached the point where $1500 without a case is acceptable, again allow me to reiterate - I plan on buying one and even discussed from whom with Max, somehow equals INTERNET OUTRAGE in your mind? I'm not saying you're a dick, Jeff, I'm just saying you have dick tendencies.


----------



## Jeff

USMarine75 said:


> There's a whole ton of recency bias going on here, because not too far back this place was full of recommendations to stay away from MII Premium Ibanez guitars because of QC issues, bad fretwork, dead wood, etc... and tons of recommendations to buy a used MIJ Prestige instead. But whatever I'll stick with my MAGA guitars.
> 
> 
> 
> I love how, even though I expressly stated I'd still buy one, but simply have an issue with thinking MII guitars have reached the point where $1500 without a case is acceptable, again allow me to reiterate - I plan on buying one and even discussed from whom with Max, somehow equals INTERNET OUTRAGE in your mind? I'm not saying you're a dick, Jeff, I'm just saying you have dick tendencies.



Go fuck yourself, dude. You don’t know me.

Seriously, @MaxOfMetal, this kind of shit behavior is allowed here?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> There's a whole ton of recency bias going on here, because not too far back this place was full of recommendations to stay away from MII Premium Ibanez guitars because of QC issues, bad fretwork, dead wood, etc... and tons of recommendations to buy a used MIJ Prestige instead.



Quality can change. Processes change. Personnel changes. Tooling changes. Management decides to allocate more or less to QA/QC. Bad batches can taint opinions, just as good ones can.


----------



## _MonSTeR_

Wait is the outrage over the PRS or the Ibanez being made somewhere? Even US built Fender custom shop guitars hand made by Ron Thorn are “imports” to all but one single country...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hey @USMarine75 and @Jeff lets simmer down a little bit. Please.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Can we talk about Ibanez 2020? 

Because Jakey's teasing something.

https://twitter.com/JakePeriphery/status/1146795519668301824


----------



## Jeff

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Can we talk about Ibanez 2020?
> 
> Because Jakey's teasing something.
> 
> https://twitter.com/JakePeriphery/status/1146795519668301824



Isn’t it a little soon for that?


----------



## USMarine75

EDIT

yes, Standards were always MII. Customs just started there last year.[/QUOTE]


_MonSTeR_ said:


> Wait is the outrage over the PRS or the Ibanez being made somewhere? Even US built Fender custom shop guitars hand made by Ron Thorn are “imports” to all but one single country...



Nah. It's the internet and because I completely disagree with someone and I feel I have enough proof for me to feel a certain way, the flamey trolls have to surface and try to stoke a fire that doesnt exist.

Literally my only issue was I was surprised to see that MII guitars without cases now command $1500 to no ones surprise but me. I have zero issues with paying $1k for MIK and I own a bunch... but at that price point of the EH10 I disagree (was actually shocked) with the valuation. Again, I said several times I'm most likely going to buy one, but I'm interested to see the reviews. And to reiterate, I literally just bought a MII G&L and spewed all over several threads about how excited I am and how it has zero negative reviews from what I can find. I bought it over a MIM Fender or used MIJ.

I think someone tried to suggest I care about resale hence the concern over MII but nope... I own a metric fuckton of low value guitars like older non-Wolfgang Peaveys. If it's good then it's good. If a MII guitar A/B'd against a MIJ/MIM/MIA/etc is as good then I could less care. My MIK Loomis is one of the best guitars I own (and that's comparing against three PRS PS I own).

Anyways, I'm sure some more trolls will pop up to tell me how I know nothing about Ibanez, but I'm happy to see them branching out and making more "traditional" superstrat designs like the (MIJ only duh) AZ line, and even the more flashy but still atypical (not RG or S bodies) like the EH or Polyphia sig guitars.

Tl;dr the INTERNET OUTRAGE is palpable lol.

Anywho, back to Ibanez and Trump... nothing to see here.


----------



## Leviathus

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Can we talk about Ibanez 2020?
> 
> Because Jakey's teasing something.
> 
> https://twitter.com/JakePeriphery/status/1146795519668301824



Wake me up when the new UV is here.


----------



## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> More on the level of the "standard" series stuff.
> 
> The thing about Indonesian Ibanez (and many other brands too) is that it's inconsistent in quality. Definitely something you should try before buying, or purchase from a shop with a solid return policy/good customer service.



Btw this was the first hit I got for "Ibanez Indo". Literally all I was referencing when I thought $1500 was a lot based on what I had heard on this very board regarding MII Ibanez.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Btw this was the first hit I got for "Ibanez Indo". Literally all I was referencing when I thought $1500 was a lot based on what I had heard on this very board regarding MII Ibanez.



Here's what I was commenting on:

_"The iron labes were about the same quality as the premiums right? Only more "metal oriented" in look and sound?

I've never tried an indonesian Ibanez. How is the craftsmanship compared to the japanese?"
_
The Iron Label weren't meant to be 1:1 with Premiums. They are spec upgraded Standard models.

And I stand by what I said about inconsistent quality. That's why I recommended a dealer like Ibanez Rules who goes above and beyond to make sure you get a great example of whatever model you order

Just giving some context.


----------



## Jeff

USMarine75 said:


> Nah. It's the internet and because I completely disagree with someone and I feel I have enough proof for me to feel a certain way, the flamey trolls have to surface and try to stoke a fire that doesnt exist.
> 
> Literally my only issue was I was surprised to see that MII guitars without cases now command $1500 to no ones surprise but me. I have zero issues with paying $1k for MIK and I own a bunch... but at that price point of the EH10 I disagree (was actually shocked) with the valuation. Again, I said several times I'm most likely going to buy one, but I'm interested to see the reviews. And to reiterate, I literally just bought a MII G&L and spewed all over several threads about how excited I am and how it has zero negative reviews from what I can find. I bought it over a MIM Fender or used MIJ.
> 
> I think someone tried to suggest I care about resale hence the concern over MII but nope... I own a metric fuckton of low value guitars like older non-Wolfgang Peaveys. If it's good then it's good. If a MII guitar A/B'd against a MIJ/MIM/MIA/etc is as good then I could less care. My MIK Loomis is one of the best guitars I own (and that's comparing against three PRS PS I own).
> 
> Anyways, I'm sure some more trolls will pop up to tell me how I know nothing about Ibanez, but I'm happy to see them branching out and making more "traditional" superstrat designs like the (MIJ only duh) AZ line, and even the more flashy but still atypical (not RG or S bodies) like the EH or Polyphia sig guitars.
> 
> Tl;dr the INTERNET OUTRAGE is palpable lol.
> 
> Anywho, back to Ibanez and Trump... nothing to see here.



Pointing out that you’re mistaken about a line doesn’t make someone a troll, dude. But yes, let’s continue with the name calling. Apparently you didn’t get the warning from Max.
The MIJ AZ’s have always been $2000+. Not sure why a $1500 signature would have ever been misconstrued as an MIJ guitar in the first place, but whatever.


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## MaxOfMetal

Come on guys, I don't want to close this down. You don't have to make up, but just move on. 

@USMarine75 @Jeff


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## USMarine75

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's pretty disingenuous that you didn't post what I was actually replying to.
> 
> Here's what I was commenting on:
> 
> _"The iron labes were about the same quality as the premiums right? Only more "metal oriented" in look and sound?
> 
> I've never tried an indonesian Ibanez. How is the craftsmanship compared to the japanese?"
> _
> The Iron Label weren't meant to be 1:1 with Premiums. They are spec upgraded Standard models.
> 
> And I stand by what I said about inconsistent quality. That's why I recommended a dealer like Ibanez Rules who goes above and beyond to make sure you get a great example of whatever model you order.



Sweet Jeebus, man. I apologize I didn't repost the entire thread or include the proper preamble and citations. 

So you literally still can't admit I had a point when (IMO) I stated I was shocked that MII guitars were at the $1500 price point yet? Whatevers man. You said Indo Ibanez guitar quality wasnt there yet. You were speaking in general. And that was all I was referencing. And a ton of negative comments came up and I thought it was funny yours was the first.


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## USMarine75

Jeff said:


> Pointing out that you’re mistaken about a line doesn’t make someone a troll, dude. But yes, let’s continue with the name calling. Apparently you didn’t get the warning from Max.
> The MIJ AZ’s have always been $2000+. Not sure why a $1500 signature would have ever been misconstrued as an MIJ guitar in the first place, but whatever.



Because im dumb and know nothing about guitars obviously. Is it difficult being so cool?

Yes, I too often think well obviously this guitar is only $1500 so it must be MII... said no one ever.


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## MaxOfMetal

USMarine75 said:


> Sweet Jeebus, man. I apologize I didn't repost the entire thread or include the proper preamble and citations.
> 
> So you literally still can't admit I had a point when (IMO) I stated I was shocked that MII guitars were at the $1500 price point yet? Whatevers man. You said Indo Ibanez guitar quality wasnt there yet. You were speaking in general. And that was all I was referencing. And a ton of negative comments came up and I thought it was funny yours was the first.



Sorry, reread what you posted. I thought you were still going on about something else. I've edited my post above. 

Again, that's my bad. 

I guess I was surprised to hear that someone who is typically really knowledgeable didn't know about what has been somewhat of a growing industry norm for the last several years. It's hard to convey the nuance of some of this stuff on the net.


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## MaxOfMetal

Ugh, never mind.

Ya'll can take this to PM or wait for the 2020 thread.

I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.


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