# Carvin V3M vs 5150III mini vs 6505+ head for extreme metal



## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

So i'm saving some money to get a head for rehearsals and some gigs and this my top three(All running trough a Carvin Cab 2x12 with Celestions V30's):

-Carvin V3M
-EVH 5150 III mini head
-Peavey 6505+/5150 II head

At the moment i have a 6505+ 112 that i love a lot, ir sounds pretty brutal but is a pain in the A** move it around for rehearsals and gig so i'm going to change to head & cab configuration. What do you think? I play mostly metal (insane gain, low tunnings) but also want a good clean.

I think that the Carvin has great features but on the online tests sounds fizzy on hi gain seetings do you thing a boost will help it? I have a MXR classic overdrive (tube screamer TS9 copy) for clean boost, will it help? I think that the Celestions could help ot even more than the Carvin stock Speakers

On the other hand my favorite choice is the 5150 III 50 watts, three channels, fx loop, small size for easy transporting, 12ax7 and 6l6's instead the el84's that the Carvin has. I can´t try it at my country (it must be shipped from USA) and in some reviews they say that it is not as brutal as the original 5150 or the II and + versions, is it true??? Will my Tubescreamer help? I really like some demos, but nothing compares to try it by yourself it sounds great at low volumes so i can use it at home without the neighbours calling the cops hahaha

Finally we have the 6505+/5150 II head, nothing to say, this amp is more than badass, it is brutal, has "nice" cleans and Fx loop, cost the same i think i cant go wrong with this one, but i want a little amp so it's size is a "con" but awesome still.

So... which one do you think is the best and why? Thanks to all in advance, as usually you help me a lot with the poinst of view and reviews!

Cheers from Mexico!


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## Atomshipped (Jul 18, 2012)

EVH > Peavey > Carvin


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## TheProgWay (Jul 18, 2012)

TS808 + 5150II, next question.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

Atomshipped said:


> EVH > Peavey > Carvin




You think? But why? I know the 5153 100 watts version kills but what about the mini version? Is the same just with the shared EQ and less headroom than the 100 watts version? I really love the Mini!


So the Maxon will do the job too? Maybe i upgrade my MXR but first i need to buy the amp, i love my 5150II/6505+ even it is china made


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## Razzy (Jul 18, 2012)

Alejandro Moreno said:


> You think? But why? I know the 5153 100 watts version kills but what about the mini version? Is the same just with the shared EQ and less headroom than the 100 watts version? I really love the Mini!
> 
> 
> So the Maxon will do the job too? Maybe i upgrade my MXR but first i need to buy the amp, i love my 5150II/6505+ even it is china made



You're not going to notice 50W missing playing metal, you probably won't even notice playing cleans. As far as the shared EQ between the clean and crunch channels, you have to deal with that on the 6505+ anyway, so you're not losing anything by going with the 5150 III.

My vote is 100% for the EVH.


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## TheProgWay (Jul 18, 2012)

I almost guarantee you will notice a difference going from higher to lower wattage. This has been discussed many times on this forum actually. I remember this guy making a thread about why anyone ever needs more than 50 Watts of power. The replies were very interesting, they pointed to things like headroom which you'd like to consider and the myth of saturating a 50W more at the same volumes of 100W. Also, 100W isn't twice louder than 50W. You may want to search this thread up


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

Razzy said:


> You're not going to notice 50W missing playing metal, you probably won't even notice playing cleans. As far as the shared EQ between the clean and crunch channels, you have to deal with that on the 6505+ anyway, so you're not losing anything by going with the 5150 III.
> 
> My vote is 100% for the EVH.




I see, you are right, and i don´t play a lot of crunch stuff anyway just lead and clean. And if you tell me that it is like his big brother i'm convincing myself to buy it! 

I also read that it isn´t made that well (more delicated than a Peavey tank) However i was planning to make a case for it since it is too small.

I want a reliable amp, i don´t plan to sell it on a long time thats why i'm so insecure jeje


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

TheProgWay said:


> I almost guarantee you will notice a difference going from higher to lower wattage. This has been discussed many times on this forum actually. I remember this guy making a thread about why anyone ever needs more than 50 Watts of power. The replies were very interesting, they pointed to things like headroom which you'd like to consider and the myth of saturating a 50W more at the same volumes of 100W. Also, 100W isn't twice louder than 50W. You may want to search this thread up




I'll search it, as far as i know the differences between the the 50 and 100 watts are 3 decibels and more headroom, but i want to know if the Mini version has enough gain to play that extreme because i cant try it by myself, and well, the head version cost the double so icant be able to buy it hehe.


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## Razzy (Jul 18, 2012)

Alejandro Moreno said:


> I see, you are right, and i don´t play a lot of crunch stuff anyway just lead and clean. And if you tell me that it is like his big brother i'm convincing myself to buy it!
> 
> I also read that it isn´t made that well (more delicated than a Peavey tank) However i was planning to make a case for it since it is too small.
> 
> I want a reliable amp, i don´t plan to sell it on a long time thats why i'm so insecure jeje



There were some problems with the 100W version when they came out, but they've been fixed for AGES now.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

But both versions are good quality made? The mini is made in Vietnam and the 100 it made in... Mexico? Ensenada Factory i think.


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## madrigal77 (Jul 18, 2012)

Get a used 100w EVH for the price of the 50w new.


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## Atomshipped (Jul 18, 2012)

There will be a definite headroom difference. My 100W amp's clean channel doesn't break up with the volume at half way, where my 30W amp's clean channel gets AC/DC crunch at half way. The volume difference, however, is unnoticeable. In fact, my 30W 1x12 combo seems louder than my 100W head through a 4x12 at times (that being said, it's a VHT combo vs. a low end (but still all tube) Marshall head). 

With a 50W head, you'll still have more than enough clean headroom, but you'll get the drive channels to saturate a little sooner. As people have pointed out, the 5150III mini is still amazing with the volume turned almost all the way down and is more than "brutal" enough for you or anyone. Lesser wattage is often said to be slightly better for lead playing, but honestly the 5150III mini is great for both rhythm and lead at any volume. It's all kinds of awesome.

The Carvin head will have less gain and a different voicing all together. Some people love it but for your style of music it's not great. It's more geared towards rock and not metal; kind of a thicker, and more liquid-like. It's great for lighter rock but not even in the same class as amps like the Mesa Mini Rectifier, EVH 5150 mini, and so on, which are more "metal" amps.

The 6505+ as said is tried and true. You will undoubtedly be able to get good tone out of it. However, the 5150III mini has better cleans, is easier to transport, and sounds much better at low volumes and will work better for any gigs you could potentially be playing.

Just go with the 5150III mini 


(I'm tired and I editted this several times so I may seem a little scatter-brained but this is all correct)


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 18, 2012)

Id like to buy an used EVH but i don´t know if they be willing to send it to Mexico( because shipping its a huge amp! hahaha, taxes etc) i need to buy it new. :/





Atomshipped said:


> There will be a definite headroom difference. My 100W amp's clean channel doesn't break up with the volume at half way, where my 30W amp's clean channel gets AC/DC crunch at half way. The volume difference, however, is unnoticeable. In fact, my 30W 1x12 combo seems louder than my 100W head through a 4x12 at times (that being said, it's a VHT combo vs. a low end (but still all tube) Marshall head).
> 
> With a 50W head, you'll still have more than enough clean headroom, but you'll get the drive channels to saturate a little sooner. As people have pointed out, the 5150III mini is still amazing with the volume turned almost all the way down and is more than "brutal" enough for you or anyone. Lesser wattage is often said to be slightly better for lead playing, but honestly the 5150III mini is great for both rhythm and lead at any volume. It's all kinds of awesome.
> 
> ...




Wow thanks!!! 

I see i havent tred a lot of amps tough to make a good argument, so i see i think i also "clean" that break with my vol pot, am i right? however i think it will handle good my clean settings i don´t play on that big shows just locak gigs for 50-100 max persons

I think that drive channels saturate sooner is great for me! I play mainly at home but sometimes i jam with my friends and carrying up the 6505+ combo kills my back hahaha

I had a lot of doubst about it, itps size, the fact that is a signature amp, and the wattage but hey, i haven´t played it so i can´t say a lot, i like both rythms (altough i habe only basswood and alder guitars) and leads and if it give me a roaring rythm tone and a great lead i'll be so happy! 

Yeah i'v been thinking the same the fact that it has el84 tubes doesn´t help, it sounds more like a stoner drive channel but since i can´t try it by myself i needed some advice, it has a lot of cool features, threes indepedent channels, boost, reverb, cool design, carry bag, great cleans etc. But it seems like you say that doesn´t suits my style, i need a really tight hi gain channel, a lot of definition and great low end

It seems that the lil monster kills every amp on the list, and if it has that Fender Cleans... i'm served i will use at home along my stompboxes so i guess you are completly right!

I already sell my 6505+ and saving some bucks to have all the money, i hope to buy it this year. Time will tell, in the mean time some hard work will the job.

Thank you a lot, Atom and everybody to take some time to answer me, i think about all your advices  i think there is not much left to say, the mini will cross the border  i'll tell my impression when it arrives

Thank you all again! Keep it metal


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## rjnix_0329 (Jul 18, 2012)

madrigal77 said:


> Get a used 100w EVH for the price of the 50w new.



I would LOVE to do this, but I've been looking around for quite awhile, and the 100w version doesn't seem to pop up used very often, and they don't last long when they do...


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## MF_Kitten (Jul 18, 2012)

the 5150 III mini is apparently an AMAZING amp, and people say it sounds better than the full-sized one. It has more controls too, i think, unless they added those to the full sized one already.


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## Zado (Jul 18, 2012)

Razzy said:


> There were some problems with the 100W version when they came out, but they've been fixed for AGES now.


some 50w had issues too,a friend of mine got his own and sold it after a couple of days


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## EOT (Jul 18, 2012)

I'd go for the 6505+ out those three. They can definately bring the brootz. 
And if you're tuning low, the more watts the the better IMO. I haven't played the other two.


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## Kali Yuga (Jul 18, 2012)

I am, and always have been a 5150 player. I recently bought a 5150 III 50w. I sold two Peaveys soon afterwards, a 6505 and 5150+. The EVH is simply better in every possible way. 50w is more than enough too.


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## Atomshipped (Jul 18, 2012)

You can definitely clean up whatever breakup you get on the clean channel, but that might mean getting less volume. The more volume the more break up; whether it's from the amp's volume or your guitar's limiting how much volume there is. Regardless, it'll be great sounding for home playing and will probably be loud enough (definitely, with mics) for gigs (depending on the situation, of course).

Think of it as your 6505+ improved in every single way. You'll love it. No need to worry. It can easily provide rhythm and lead tones.

The Carvin does have nice features and even if it has nice cleans it's the kind of drive you want for metal. You could probably get something usable with a boost, but there are so many amps in the same price range that do the job so much better. EL84s really aren't great metal tubes. They may sound good, but the way they start compressing and distortion very early isn't good for metal where you need/want everything to be articulate and precise.

I'm not sure about the cleans but they're definitely much better than the 6505+. If it really does sound like a Fender, than that is great. 

Your hard work will pay off.


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## Underworld (Jul 18, 2012)

Go with the EVH mini. It has all the sound of its big brother, but in a smaller box and a fraction of the price. It's not a lunch box sized amp either - it still has 2 6L6 and 6 12AX7, plus big ass trannies. 

In terms of gain, anything over noon is stupidly over-saturated! You will never lack gain with this amp. I play an 8 string with medium-powered pickups, and have the gain knob at about 10oclock (slightly boosted with a TS type pedal), and I get angry, in your face death metal rhythm sounds. 

The clean channel is also to die for. Fender type of clean that said.


EDIT : I have mine since january, gigged with it, and I play it about 7-8 hours a week at band volume, never got a single problem. 50 watts are more than enought, even with a loud drummer. And BTW this amp has all the headroom you need. I can play this amp unboosted with my 8 string and still sounds tight. I just prefer the saturation and compression of a boosted amp!


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## Scattered Messiah (Jul 18, 2012)

As is the consensus in this tread:
for your needs, the EVH mini seems to be the best choice.

Although comparing a 100w amplifiers clean channel breakup to the breakup point of a 30w amp is next to uninformative, as these 2 amplifiers almost surely have different curcuits. Therefore it need'nt be the wattage that is causing the difference, but rather a difference in design 
But let me assure you, as long as you do not intend to amplify an 9string tuned to Dropc# in it's full range, the 50w will deliver enough headroom and power for everything.
[side note: A stricly linear speaker with 50W applied onto it is, in theory, twice as loud as if it would get fed with 5w]

PLUS the EVH mini is small, and believe me, a 6505+ is not really a light amp to carry either.

PLUS you get really good cleans out of this amp, instead of the 6505, whose "cleans" I personally always found rather lacking. with the traditional evh-amp distorted tone 


What, imho, is more important for your needs [tight, ultrabr00tal, low, distorted stuff] than the wattage of the amplifier [after a certain point] is your speaker cabinet!


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## potatohead (Jul 18, 2012)

I've had a V3M for about a year and a half. It is a great amp, but I agree it's not the best for metal. I play mostly older trash and what not and it's great for that but for real downtuned stuff where you need tons of clarity there are probably better choices. I have one guitar with an 81 in it in drop C and it's just so-so with that. I think it's a great lead head though and produces a lot of really nice, searing tones.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 20, 2012)

Thank you guys!!! I&#8217;ll answer all of you (i don´t how to multiquote various messages)

-rjnix_0329
Yeah, I wish I could get a used full size or the mini version, but it will cost me a lot to pay taxes, shipping etc and well I can barely pay the amp jeje

-MF_Kitten
I think that the mini version is a great amp on every way! I love even it&#8217;s look (I have a pahse 90 EVH that I love too, they just rock!) Ican´t wait for buying it and crank it up J about the controls I like it simple, two channles, the crunch channel wont be used a lot (I guess)

-Zado
I hope I won´t have any issue on it&#8230; returning it will be the hell itself&#8230;

-EOT
I really dig my 6505+ but I think if I can get the same on a small package and better cleans I think I will go for it! But you are right, the 6505+ can really bring the brootz

-Kali Yuga
That&#8217;s a great compration having two diferent versions, if you really dig it I think I will do the same! And you are right I don&#8217;t play at stadiums so 50w headroom will be enough for me

-Atomshipped
I see, I like to play with my vol and tone knobs so I think that will be a great thing, however I don´t lpay on that bog places, just little pub&#8217;s and stuff like that so I think that my vol needs are not thaaat extreme, I&#8217;ll use it mainly at home, some jams with friends and &#8220;studio&#8221; recording so if I get nice tone at low volumes this amp will be killer for my main usage!
Yeah I really liked the Carvin at first (the hi gain flag me catched me ) then I heard some demos and I tought that it was matter of EQ, I love the lot of features, and I can get it with the official leader on Mexico with a great price, but you are right el84&#8217;s tubes are not my thing, but why did Mesa put that kind of tubes on the mini rectifier? I considered it too but it has the same problem sound fizzy and loose.
I do like my 6505+ I also thinked about turning it into a cab, but still kinda big for transporting. If it is greater than my Peavey with Fender cleans I&#8217;m served and can die happy hahaha
I think it will, I&#8217;m saving everything I have, the bus change, buying less things selling some&#8230; Time will tell! J

-Underworld

Thanks for reading! I really had a lot of doubts before this thread, here in Mexico the mainly valve amps that you can find are Marshalls so we doesn´t have a lot of models to choose, my 6505+ was a lucky deal, and I bought it used but mint condition, so I just bought it and really dig it!
Wow, you alredy told me that you can have a nice tight sound on ultra low tunning but if it can handle your 8 strngs it will handle my 6 Jeje and if it is reliable and can handle gis, rehearsals and constant playing it will be great. But i´m afraid of getting a bad unit&#8230; wish me look that postage won&#8217;t hurt that baby&#8230;

-Scattered Messiah
I wish I lived on USA to play all that kind of great gear! But your opinion help me a lot.
I see, I tought that more wattage means less break up (for me it has logic) but like I said I haven´t tried a lof of valve amps to judge.
I just have 6 strings hahahaha i play on drop B, C standard and D standard planning to get a 7 strings Carvin and a 8 strings Agile I&#8217;m not that low for the moment 

Yeah, the 6505+ head must weight a lot although isjust a head (however it is easier to carry than my combo hahaha)
Yeah, the 6505+ cleans are pretty usable but I tend to use a low chorus and some delay to make it better and I like it! So no complains at all but if I can´t get any better cleans they are welcome
Yeah I really need an insane drive channel ! with a lot of defition being tight as you said, I think that the Carvin 2x12 Cab with v30&#8217;s upgrade is great for it, isn´t it? 

-potatohead
I wish it had 6l6&#8217;s and a more tight sound, it would be a perfect amp for me (it&#8217;s price, features and sound) I think is great for 80&#8217;s thrash. I really dig modern tones plus tight sound, however I thinked that if I dial the settings and using a clean boost it would sound better . It really rocks, but all that was said on this thread I think that afterall it isn´t my amp.


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## mniel8195 (Jul 20, 2012)

i have always loved the recorded sound and the easy eq of the 5150's. I chose the 5150 III 50 watt and matching cab for portability and versatility. Lets face it very few people need a 100w head. My new rig will be showing up this coming week. I guess the coolest thing about the evh head is channel one is fender clean, channel two is a hot rodded marshall, and channel three brings the brootz with a higher quality tone that the 5150 is missing. plus you get midi as well. its a 5150 evolved forsure. its like having three heads in one. Covers alot of ground for how simple it is laid
out.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 20, 2012)

Yeah, i think i could use a 100 for live performances, i have thinking about an Engl Fireball but it will be later, do you like the Celestions Heritage??? Do you think are Metal Enough? The carvin costs a lil bit less bucks but i'm curious about the matching cab plus you can "lock" the amp and avoid moving it. I love Fender's cleans with somo strats or bright guitars but honestly i didn't think that i would buy a Fender amp for brootz hahahaha

Fender+Marshall+Murder 5150+small size=my dream amp, i can't wait for playing it!

how much does it costed to you? I saw it 999 dlls in Musician's Friend site


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## mniel8195 (Jul 20, 2012)

i think its worth it personally. listen to gojira's new album i believe thats a evh through evh speakers. i think the v30's will be a little better in a live setting but not worth it when you weigh the benefits of the matching cab.


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## Atomshipped (Jul 20, 2012)

*IN MY EXPERIENCE* EL84s aren't necessarily loose or fizzy. It can definitely be a matter of design. My VHT Super 30 combo uses four EL84s and is the opposite of loose and fizzy. No matter how much treble you pile on it doesn't get any of that gross high end saturation; rather it gains this great percussive presence. It's completely unsaturated in all the right ways. Also, the amp is far from loose. It's got this great low end that has this thickness and warmth without being too bassy or anything and works extremely well in a mix. So, in my experience, EL84's don't mean loose or fizzy. They can definitely be with some amps though; any tubes can be loose or fizzy depending on the amp. The thing about EL84s is that they compress and distort very early, whether that's something you want or not.


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## mniel8195 (Jul 20, 2012)

i purchased mine used. you may be able to get 15% off musicians friend if you call them


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 20, 2012)

mniel8195 said:


> i think its worth it personally. listen to gojira's new album i believe thats a evh through evh speakers. i think the v30's will be a little better in a live setting but not worth it when you weigh the benefits of the matching cab.




Mmmm now i don´t know hahaha it coost like 120 dlls more than the Carvin Cab and i can Barely pay the Carvin one. Mmmmm i'll think about it. Also the matching cab in white color looks sooo great, damn gas!

I'll buy to another dealer(i thik that if i buy it from MF they will make me pay some % taxes) it will cost me around 1203 dlls the head and, 615 dlls the carving cab both shipping included.

Thanks for the answer atom, so if tubes don´t make the amp fizzy would be the capacitors and resistances? It's a great point of view, some people (like me) tend to judge just because the videos on youtube, and the may help, and they may not, nothing like own the amp and use it for a long time, but why does the Mini Rectifier sounds fizzy too? Mesa make great "tight" amps, why does that model doesn't sound like that?


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## rosso (Jul 21, 2012)

Hey man, why don't you mod your Peavey 6505+ combo into a head ??? 

That's what I did and the result is this:


























Here is the link to the building thread with WIP pictures (it's a bulgarian forum for musicians):
Peavey 6505+ 112 combo to head

This way you will save A LOT of money - the mod only costs about 30 euro.


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## Atomshipped (Jul 21, 2012)

Honestly I don't know the answer to that.  Really though, there is no answer. There are far too many components that contribute to the sound you hear to say something sounds the way it does due to a certain part. You can get different sounds with similar parts and similar sounds with different parts. You shouldn't look for an amp by searching for one with these tubes and those capacitors or whatever; rather listen to the amp and judge amps based on how they sound to you. For example, imagine you played a Marshall amp in the store and loved it. That doesn't mean everything with EL34 power tubes will sound good to you and you should only look for amps using them. Also imagine you tried an Orange amp in the store and didn't like the top end fizz. That doesn't mean you should avoid other amps with EL84 power tubes. There are so many variables in how things sound that it's impossible to say an amp sounds the way it does due to a specific component.

(once again I'm really tired and that didn't directly answer your question, sorry.  In summary, no specific parts really dictate how an amp sounds. It's just kind of an overall thing I guess, don't know how to say it... all the parts and circuits and whatever work together. DON'T JUDGE AN AMP BY ITS PARTS! lol. okay. im done.)


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## purpledc (Jul 21, 2012)

Alejandro Moreno said:


> Mmmm now i don´t know hahaha it coost like 120 dlls more than the Carvin Cab and i can Barely pay the Carvin one. Mmmmm i'll think about it. Also the matching cab in white color looks sooo great, damn gas!
> 
> I'll buy to another dealer(i thik that if i buy it from MF they will make me pay some % taxes) it will cost me around 1203 dlls the head and, 615 dlls the carving cab both shipping included.
> 
> Thanks for the answer atom, so if tubes don´t make the amp fizzy would be the capacitors and resistances? It's a great point of view, some people (like me) tend to judge just because the videos on youtube, and the may help, and they may not, nothing like own the amp and use it for a long time, but why does the Mini Rectifier sounds fizzy too? Mesa make great "tight" amps, why does that model doesn't sound like that?



the main issue with the v3m is many feel it just was a poorly thought out design. Some felt like they rushed it and having owned a V3 and V3M I can tell you they sound NOTHING alike. They are similar in features and that is it. The V3M has a very flubby low end out of the box. I think its 50% the amps design and 50% the choice of el84's they chose for that amp. If you put JJ el84's in it it really helps focus the low end but it aint perfect. And IMHO you definitely need a boost if you want a good articulate metal tone. I just really felt they missed the fucking boat with that amp. I dont think they did enough R&D and simply paired the V3 preamp design to the power amp of their VT50. 

as far as the mini recto gos, I dont think that amp sounds fizzy. I think some owners dial in too much presence and treble and that will give you fizz in any amp. Some amp manufacturers design there amps so no one can dial in "stupid" settings. Then there are other manufacturers who feel its best to give the customer the freedom to dial in any sound no matter how tasteless it may be. There are a few other contributing factors when talking about "fizz". Some other elements that will make a particular amp sound fizzy are pickups, strings, and most importantly (imho) speakers. Some speakers just have a buzzy sound when played at low volume. But really roar when cranked. And vice versa some speakers sound amazing at low volume and when you crank them they turn into a hornets nest. In any case I NEVER watch a youtube video and pass judgement on a piece of gear no matter how many bad videos are made of it. I need to hear it with my own ears before I will either shit on it or recommend it. That is why you wont see me talk much about the Axe FX II, or BKP pickups. I dont think people should recommend shit that they havent even played on.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 23, 2012)

rosso said:


> Hey man, why don't you mod your Peavey 6505+ combo into a head ???
> 
> That's what I did and the result is this:
> 
> ...



WWWWWWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWWWW  

IT LOOKS GREAT!

I love the smooth tolex that you used! It looks so niiiiiice! 

But i'm not that good with the DIY thing, and i already sell the 6505+

However it would be a good idea, but still i should buy a new cab for a home amp, and well, i need some better cleans. 

Anyway thanks for the idea, you are pretty good at mods I wish i had that talent!


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 23, 2012)

Atomshipped said:


> Honestly I don't know the answer to that.  Really though, there is no answer. There are far too many components that contribute to the sound you hear to say something sounds the way it does due to a certain part. You can get different sounds with similar parts and similar sounds with different parts. You shouldn't look for an amp by searching for one with these tubes and those capacitors or whatever; rather listen to the amp and judge amps based on how they sound to you. For example, imagine you played a Marshall amp in the store and loved it. That doesn't mean everything with EL34 power tubes will sound good to you and you should only look for amps using them. Also imagine you tried an Orange amp in the store and didn't like the top end fizz. That doesn't mean you should avoid other amps with EL84 power tubes. There are so many variables in how things sound that it's impossible to say an amp sounds the way it does due to a specific component.
> 
> (once again I'm really tired and that didn't directly answer your question, sorry.  In summary, no specific parts really dictate how an amp sounds. It's just kind of an overall thing I guess, don't know how to say it... all the parts and circuits and whatever work together. DON'T JUDGE AN AMP BY ITS PARTS! lol. okay. im done.)




You really make your point, and i got it! So don't worry  Like i said, i wish i could go to music stores and play the amps that i want, but i can't... However i will be more reflexive and think more about the features and opinions that people can give me, nothis is just black and white, there is a lot of gray tones in the middle, i really apreciate your words  

I think that even the player makes the diference, everybody has his touch on the sound


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## Alejandro Moreno (Jul 25, 2012)

purpledc said:


> the main issue with the v3m is many feel it just was a poorly thought out design. Some felt like they rushed it and having owned a V3 and V3M I can tell you they sound NOTHING alike. They are similar in features and that is it. The V3M has a very flubby low end out of the box. I think its 50% the amps design and 50% the choice of el84's they chose for that amp. If you put JJ el84's in it it really helps focus the low end but it aint perfect. And IMHO you definitely need a boost if you want a good articulate metal tone. I just really felt they missed the fucking boat with that amp. I dont think they did enough R&D and simply paired the V3 preamp design to the power amp of their VT50.
> 
> as far as the mini recto gos, I dont think that amp sounds fizzy. I think some owners dial in too much presence and treble and that will give you fizz in any amp. Some amp manufacturers design there amps so no one can dial in "stupid" settings. Then there are other manufacturers who feel its best to give the customer the freedom to dial in any sound no matter how tasteless it may be. There are a few other contributing factors when talking about "fizz". Some other elements that will make a particular amp sound fizzy are pickups, strings, and most importantly (imho) speakers. Some speakers just have a buzzy sound when played at low volume. But really roar when cranked. And vice versa some speakers sound amazing at low volume and when you crank them they turn into a hornets nest. In any case I NEVER watch a youtube video and pass judgement on a piece of gear no matter how many bad videos are made of it. I need to hear it with my own ears before I will either shit on it or recommend it. That is why you wont see me talk much about the Axe FX II, or BKP pickups. I dont think people should recommend shit that they havent even played on.



I see, but the fact that it won a lot of awards i tought that they made it very reliable, and Carvin make really great quality products mmmm that's weird, and well if a i buy the Carvin, buying new tubes and the bias adjustment it would be kinda the price of the 5150 III mmm i have the OD mmmm

You think? I haven't tried it yet, and i think i wont jeje, i didn´t know that some companies make the amps "fools-less". However i don´t EQ that extreme is almost flat, bass 6-7 and mids y and highs 5. The speakers would be v30's so i think is a positive thing, my pickups are mostly Ibanez V series, Fernandes active p.u.'s then i will switch to Seymour and DiMarzio and maybe EMG.

And yeah! Nothing like tetsing the gear before a good judgement but for my bad look i can't so i have to do "blind shopping" and as far as it goes i am satisfied with my gear. I think that i like to hear peoples opinion but wuth the argument that they used the gears first, i cant either recommend something that i haven tried in my life


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## djpharoah (Jul 25, 2012)

5150 III is the best then the 6505+. The V3m is not even in the same league.


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## purpledc (Jul 25, 2012)

djpharoah said:


> 5150 III is the best then the 6505+. The V3m is not even in the same league.




agreed. The carvin is a solid amp from a reliability standpoint but the tone is seriously lacking. Its a shame too because if the sound was as good as the feature list it would be fucking unstoppable.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

djpharoah said:


> 5150 III is the best then the 6505+. The V3m is not even in the same league.






purpledc said:


> agreed. The carvin is a solid amp from a reliability standpoint but the tone is seriously lacking. Its a shame too because if the sound was as good as the feature list it would be fucking unstoppable.


 


I see, i think the V3M is no longer an option but.... what about the Dark Terror?

The Dark Terror would be cheaper and i could use it at home volume, is it tight enough? I don't have a band ofr the moment so it would be a good option too... What do you think? 

By the way, i almost have the money for the Cab!!!!  So things are kinda going well, let's hope to keep it that way!!!

Thanks a lot for the support!


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## troyguitar (Sep 5, 2012)

I'd still consider the Legacy 3 for a small Carvin head. I've only heard Vai playing through one so far, but he sounded great even on the 7-string. The demos sound way better than the V3M to me.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

troyguitar said:


> I'd still consider the Legacy 3 for a small Carvin head. I've only heard Vai playing through one so far, but he sounded great even on the 7-string. The demos sound way better than the V3M to me.




That's a good point but,for my bad luck it cost a lot more, even more than the 5153 and i don't own a 7 string for the momente . 

Have you ever tried the Dark Terror? I think it woul go nice with the Carvin Vintage 30 but i heard a lot that it sounds fizzy

Any toughts?


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## wakjob (Sep 5, 2012)

I love the Carvin company. Great products. Made in America.

But, like Egnater, all their amps just sound generic to my ears. No real defining sound or tone to them. It's a good tone, don't get me wrong. Just not really ear twisting enough for me.

I don't know if this link will work. They are having trouble over at this forum at the moment. But this poster made some awesome clips of his new 5150 III 50 watter.

NAD! 5150 III 50w - Marshall Amp Forum


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## technomancer (Sep 5, 2012)

Alejandro Moreno said:


> I see, i think the V3M is no longer an option but.... what about the Dark Terror?
> 
> The Dark Terror would be cheaper and i could use it at home volume, is it tight enough? I don't have a band ofr the moment so it would be a good option too... What do you think?
> 
> ...



The 5150III 50w is fantastic at low volume, I own one  The current production ones are also being built in the same factory in Mexico as the 100w


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

wakjob said:


> I love the Carvin company. Great products. Made in America.
> 
> But, like Egnater, all their amps just sound generic to my ears. No real defining sound or tone to them. It's a good tone, don't get me wrong. Just not really ear twisting enough for me.
> 
> ...



I see, well for features the Carvin is so great! But like all of you said it lacks somewhat of tone and well, it is cheap but not that cheap... So if i'm going to use my money it must be a good product.

My computer says that it has some kind of virus, do you have the same problem? But yeah! The 5150 sounds GREAT on videos! That's why i'm triyng to save all that i can... But let's be honest, it will take some more time...




technomancer said:


> The 5150III 50w is fantastic at low volume, I own one  The current production ones are also being built in the same factory in Mexico as the 100w



You think? i'd love to try it by myself! I like that even more, Mexico (My country) makes good quality products, I like the Fender guitars made on Ensenada California, but damn... I need more time to achieve all the money


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## wakjob (Sep 5, 2012)

I'm running a Mac so... I've been in and out of that site all day. So far no problems.

Lets try this. Trying to bypass the Marshallforum site and go straight to the one clip.

http://208.106.174.111/music/Clip.mp3

PS I love MIM Fender products.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

wakjob said:


> I'm running a Mac so... I've been in and out of that site all day. So far no problems.
> 
> Lets try this. Trying to bypass the Marshallforum site and go straight to the one clip.
> 
> ...




Hahahaha maybe because i use a pc and Windows vista hahahaha.

I loved the "bypass" sounded like a pedal  But the clip... wow sounds so f*ing good!!! I really liked, sounds with alot of definition!!!! Damn i'm gasing more!!!!

And yeah, MIM Fender products apre pretty impressive! I think even amps are made here


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## Atomshipped (Sep 5, 2012)

Both the Dark Terror and 5150III can sound good at low volumes. The Dark Terror will be more fizzy/loose (in most cases) and have that "way too much overdrive" sound that's cool for some stuff but probably not what you're looking for. It's easy to dial in and versatile considering its controls, but the 5150III would be more suited for you I think.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

Atomshipped said:


> Both the Dark Terror and 5150III can sound good at low volumes. The Dark Terror will be more fizzy/loose (in most cases) and have that "way too much overdrive" sound that's cool for some stuff but probably not what you're looking for. It's easy to dial in and versatile considering its controls, but the 5150III would be more suited for you I think.




Yeah! Everybody have been nice and kind to me and say that it would be my perfect amp, but let's be honest, i don't work and college some kind uses almost all my money so i save all that i can (step by step) Dark Teror would be a good option but also i want a pretty tight sound with a clear distortion, maybe i can buy the cab and a practice amp for the moment and keep saving for the 515' for jams, rehearsals and gigs, mmm


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## wakjob (Sep 5, 2012)

Alejandro Moreno said:


> Hahahaha maybe because i use a pc and Windows vista hahahaha.
> 
> I loved the "bypass" sounded like a pedal  But the clip... wow sounds so f*ing good!!! I really liked, sounds with alot of definition!!!! Damn i'm gasing more!!!!
> 
> And yeah, MIM Fender products apre pretty impressive! I think even amps are made here



Haha, Right! He had two clips, but the other one isn't working or no longer exists. But that one clip alone is pretty convincing. I need another amp like I need a another hole in my head. I shouldn't have listened to it again...damn you.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

wakjob said:


> Haha, Right! He had two clips, but the other one isn't working or no longer exists. But that one clip alone is pretty convincing. I need another amp like I need a another hole in my head. I shouldn't have listened to it again...damn you.



I really like the sound of this baby! With a seven strings and active pickups it should KILL!!! I'm still gasing a lot!!! 

Hahhaah sorry, bro. It was my intention to do that, but hey! There is alwas space for a new amp!


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## smucarolina (Sep 5, 2012)

I have owned several 5150 II/6505+ heads...I would take the EVH over it all day. More clarity and the red channel is just out of this world. 

Also...the EVH 5150 III 50 watt is now made in Mexico, not Vietnam.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 5, 2012)

smucarolina said:


> I have owned several 5150 II/6505+ heads...I would take the EVH over it all day. More clarity and the red channel is just out of this world.
> 
> Also...the EVH 5150 III 50 watt is now made in Mexico, not Vietnam.



All of you are giving me more reasons to save more! Well i think if i buy a lil amp to practice i will be able to get all the money for the 5150, if everything is fine i will but it on xmas!

Edit: Well i think i wont miss my 6505+ combo hahahahaha 

Mexico rules!


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## Shannon (Sep 6, 2012)

Some have addressed concerns with the V3M about if it'll do metal.
My question for those saying no.....do you own one or are you going off youtube vids?
I own one & the gain on tap is absolutely ridiculous. I'm a high-gain nut & usually crank it up on most amps. With the V3M, all my drive knobs are at 12 o'clock or BELOW!


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 7, 2012)

Shannon said:


> Some have addressed concerns with the V3M about if it'll do metal.
> My question for those saying no.....do you own one or are you going off youtube vids?
> I own one & the gain on tap is absolutely ridiculous. I'm a high-gain nut & usually crank it up on most amps. With the V3M, all my drive knobs are at 12 o'clock or BELOW!




I see, mmmmm i can get one almost new for a good price shipping included! But i'm not that sure.

In some videos sounds weird, but as you said they are just videos, nothing like plugging your guitar, an overdrive as clean boost and turn the gain and volume up!!!



In this video sounds pretty sick and tight! So i'm still confused! It cost more less than the 5150, but i don't know... I want to try it!

What do you think?

You guys must hate me  I can't decide! So many choices....


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## Shannon (Sep 10, 2012)

Take advantage of Carvin's return policy.
Buy it. Try it. Don't like it? Send it back within the alloted time.


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## edsped (Sep 10, 2012)

Just remember that you'll have to cover return shipping.


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## groverj3 (Sep 10, 2012)

Honestly, I'd go with the Carvin. They take some tweaking, but if you don't like it you can send it back, as others have said.


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## Wrecklyss (Sep 10, 2012)

I have the V3, but not the V3M. In my experience with Carvin amps (i also have an X100B), stock, they leave something to be desired. The factory tubes aren't great and the bias is way cold. A set of JJs and adjusting the bias to proper values makes them really sound great. 

If the V3M is anything like it's big brother, it takes some adjustment to get it to sound right. The tone knobs are really sensitive, so it's not a "set your EQ to normal values and BAM" amp, you have to play around with it. It took me about a week to get my V3 where i wanted it, but it is awesome for low tunings. Big brother with new tubes and properly set bias can get downright mean, i'd like to think the micro could too, given the same type of attention.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 11, 2012)

Shannon said:


> Take advantage of Carvin's return policy.
> Buy it. Try it. Don't like it? Send it back within the alloted time.



If i buy it, it would be from a friend, it bought it new but never uses it anymore. So i cant return it ):



edsped said:


> Just remember that you'll have to cover return shipping.





groverj3 said:


> Honestly, I'd go with the Carvin. They take some tweaking, but if you don't like it you can send it back, as others have said.



I'm still thinking about buying it, but i'm not that sure mmmm also... money is a problem, i had to pay some things about college 



Wrecklyss said:


> I have the V3, but not the V3M. In my experience with Carvin amps (i also have an X100B), stock, they leave something to be desired. The factory tubes aren't great and the bias is way cold. A set of JJs and adjusting the bias to proper values makes them really sound great.
> 
> If the V3M is anything like it's big brother, it takes some adjustment to get it to sound right. The tone knobs are really sensitive, so it's not a "set your EQ to normal values and BAM" amp, you have to play around with it. It took me about a week to get my V3 where i wanted it, but it is awesome for low tunings. Big brother with new tubes and properly set bias can get downright mean, i'd like to think the micro could too, given the same type of attention.



Mmmm damn, if i buy new tubes and then send it to get the bias adjusted it will cost me almost the price of the 5150 are they that bad from stock? Mmmmm I heard a lot of good things of the V3, the V3M has awesome features too! I wish i could have bot...


So savings are kinda the same, just the cab money and no job... That sucks


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## Darkanus (Sep 11, 2012)

Read this:
Carvin.com BBS :: View topic - V3M. Replace your tubes ASAP (well it depends)

I own a V3M with a Mesa Rectifier 2X12 and did what this guy suggested, and he's right.


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## Curt (Sep 11, 2012)

I highly recommend the 5150 III 50w. When I had to get rid of my Roadster, I was using a 6505 112 as well. But I wasn't all too thrilled with it. One trick pony and the likes... So I sold it and one of my 2x12 cabs, picked up the 5150 III mini and I would go as far as to say I enjoy it more than any amp i've owned. It is killer at low volumes, which my roadster wasn't terrible at but this is heaps more responsive. Huge, yet articulate and with a solid midrange response. The topend is very cutting which I would say can be a good or bad thing... But I love it. Versatile as my old Roadster, and at half the size.  

Edit: I should probably change my signature as the roadster is indeed long gone. :/


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## nostealbucket (Sep 11, 2012)

5150 iii sounds like a chainsaw.
Peavey 5150 sounds like a machete.
Carvin sounds like a steak knife.


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## Curt (Sep 11, 2012)

nostealbucket said:


> 5150 iii sounds like a chainsaw.
> Peavey 5150 sounds like a machete.
> Carvin sounds like a steak knife.


 fooking win.


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## Underworld (Sep 11, 2012)

nostealbucket said:


> 5150 iii sounds like a chainsaw.
> Peavey 5150 sounds like a machete.
> Carvin sounds like a steak knife.


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## Shannon (Sep 11, 2012)

Darkanus said:


> Read this:
> Carvin.com BBS :: View topic - V3M. Replace your tubes ASAP (well it depends)
> 
> I own a V3M with a Mesa Rectifier 2X12 and did what this guy suggested, and he's right.



I outfitted mine with JJs when I got mine & haven't looked back.


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## Alejandro Moreno (Sep 12, 2012)

Darkanus said:


> Read this:
> Carvin.com BBS :: View topic - V3M. Replace your tubes ASAP (well it depends)
> 
> I own a V3M with a Mesa Rectifier 2X12 and did what this guy suggested, and he's right.





Shannon said:


> I outfitted mine with JJs when I got mine & haven't looked back.



For my bad luck if i want new tubes i must import them aswell plus... i don´t know hot to set the bias, what if i die? hahahaha Mmmm maybe i can consider the change of tubes.




Curt said:


> I highly recommend the 5150 III 50w. When I had to get rid of my Roadster, I was using a 6505 112 as well. But I wasn't all too thrilled with it. One trick pony and the likes... So I sold it and one of my 2x12 cabs, picked up the 5150 III mini and I would go as far as to say I enjoy it more than any amp i've owned. It is killer at low volumes, which my roadster wasn't terrible at but this is heaps more responsive. Huge, yet articulate and with a solid midrange response. The topend is very cutting which I would say can be a good or bad thing... But I love it. Versatile as my old Roadster, and at half the size.
> 
> Edit: I should probably change my signature as the roadster is indeed long gone. :/



A friend of mine bought a roadster and he deosn´t liked it, he told me that you really, really need to crank the vol up to get a decent sound so he sold it. Yeah the 6505+ combo is the same think, a lot of volume and the stock speaker isn'r that great but wuth a swap of tubes and a v30 on it it kills! Versatility is a great option for me! I'm still gasing for the 5150 maybe i can wait more and still practicing with my guitar link and the Overloud TH2 

You can keep it like a memory, it looks killer too! 




nostealbucket said:


> 5150 iii sounds like a chainsaw.
> Peavey 5150 sounds like a machete.
> Carvin sounds like a steak knife.



Hahahahahahahahahaha I loved the "Machete" thing, well machetes are cool (ask my country mates or Jason Voorhees) But i still prefer the Chainsaw!!! 

Update: Well i got 80 bucks more for the head! But still is a long road to get all the money...Let's be optimist and keep going with this


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## Alejandro Moreno (Dec 27, 2012)

Update!  


















It really looks nice! But I haven't tryed it yet. Can i plug my 6505 to use the cab? I only have guitar cables. Will I blow up the amp? 

I¿m still saving money for the EVH and after all i will buy it on Ebay, if yu know a good deal with one of it let me know!!! I really will appreciate it, believe me. 

And again, thanks to all for the support!


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## Wookieslayer (Dec 28, 2012)

Nice score! Make sure u get a speaker cable for it!


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## sawtoothscream (Dec 28, 2012)

eve think about turning the 6505+ 112 into a head?


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## Alejandro Moreno (Dec 29, 2012)

Wookieslayer said:


> Nice score! Make sure u get a speaker cable for it!



I think i will get a Planet waves speaker cable or maybe Fulltone. Do you have on on mind? 



sawtoothscream said:


> eve think about turning the 6505+ 112 into a head?



I did, but I'm not that good on the DIY stuff, plus the 6505 is already sold, I'm waiting for some money and if everything goes right I will buy the EVH next month! Srsly, if you know a good deal of a EVH let me know. 

Another Update! I tried the Cab yesterday, damn, it sounds so good!! But i read that i need to crank the amp to take the speakers to the "sweet spot".


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## sear (Dec 29, 2012)

I still find it hilarious that the 6505+ 112 is basically the exact same size as a 2x12 yet for some reason they only went with 1 speaker. The "oversized" cab does add a lot of low-end, it's by far the biggest-sounding 1x12 I've ever heard (especially with a new speaker), but I don't get why they didn't just make a 2x12 6505+ instead.

The 5150 III is killer, I'm sure it'll sound massive through that cab of yours.


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## sawtoothscream (Dec 29, 2012)

sear said:


> I still find it hilarious that the 6505+ 112 is basically the exact same size as a 2x12 yet for some reason they only went with 1 speaker. The "oversized" cab does add a lot of low-end, it's by far the biggest-sounding 1x12 I've ever heard (especially with a new speaker), but I don't get why they didn't just make a 2x12 6505+ instead.
> 
> The 5150 III is killer, I'm sure it'll sound massive through that cab of yours.




Amps already to heavy lol, I put a swampthang in mine and it sounds good enough and loud enough at practice, might add a 1x12 cab in the future for it though ti make it more full


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