# Very good GuitarCustom from Vaschenko V.I.



## da771 (Aug 23, 2009)

Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî


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## setsuna7 (Aug 23, 2009)

Dude,everything is in Russian,How do expect any of us to understand?


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## playstopause (Aug 23, 2009)

Google translate?


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## thedonutman (Aug 23, 2009)

Just look at the pictures?


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## RG7 (Aug 23, 2009)

I can read russian!
+1 for me.


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## gunshow86de (Aug 23, 2009)

Just look for all the titles with the number 7 or 8 in them.

Check out this one:





And this one:





7-string John 5 Tele:





Extended scale Horizon:


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## canuck brian (Aug 23, 2009)

Nice logos.


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## Thin_Ice_77 (Aug 23, 2009)

What the fuck is with the headstock on the Tele?


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## InCasinoOut (Aug 23, 2009)

Thin_Ice_77 said:


> What the fuck is with the headstock on the Tele?


 That's how John 5's sig. Tele is.


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## guitarplayerone (Aug 23, 2009)

Here's the link to the build thread


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## Thin_Ice_77 (Aug 23, 2009)

InCasinoOut said:


> That's how John 5's sig. Tele is.


Ah. Well, it looks like even worse than normal Tele headstocks, and that's saying something.


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## InCasinoOut (Aug 23, 2009)

guitarplayerone said:


> Here's the link to the build thread


man, copy or not, the craftmanship on that just looks damn impeccable.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 23, 2009)

Nothing wrong with copies of other guitars, so long as you don't put their logo on your headstock. Putting their logo on the headstock is a BIG fail in my book.


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## zindrome (Aug 23, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Nothing wrong with copies of other guitars, so long as you don't put their logo on your headstock. Putting their logo on the headstock is a BIG fail in my book.



+1 on that

That's just crossing a wee thin line of scruples that instantly takes it from a great, well made guitar to .... a fake.. sorry, that's just how I feel.
They do look good tho


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## InCasinoOut (Aug 23, 2009)

zindrome said:


> +1 on that
> 
> That's just crossing a wee thin line of scruples that instantly takes it from a great, well made guitar to .... a fake.. sorry, that's just how I feel.
> They do look good tho


 agreed. i'm really curious about how it stands up against a j custom with the exact same specs though.


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## romper_stomper (Aug 23, 2009)

I don't care what the hell the headstock says or who the hell is behind it. If it's a well built item, play ball.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 23, 2009)

So I guess if you got charged full price for a fake Rolex you'd be cool with that? This guy might not tell his customers they're Ibanez, but once they get resold who knows who will do what. It's really bad business ethics to pass your work off as someone else's. And if these guitars are so great, why wouldn't you want to proudly put your company name on the headstock? From the pics they look nice enough, why wouldn't someone want to take credit for it? Ran copies the shit out of everyone else, but he puts his name on it, and he makes a damn fine guitar. That's the kind of copying I'm cool with.


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## pirateparty (Aug 24, 2009)

Forgery aside, that guitar is immaculate and I want it


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## da771 (Aug 24, 2009)

I badly know English language, forgive please 

This master has the logo, but at will will write that the customer wants. It makes them.

I am the owner of its guitar, sounds very much cool !!!

Great tone , great voicing , great harmonics.

Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî

Original logo

Here samples of wood for crafted of guitars from Vaschenko V.I.

Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî

very very nice


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## etohk (Aug 24, 2009)




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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 24, 2009)

da771 said:


> I badly know English language, forgive please
> 
> This master has the logo, but at will will write that the customer wants. It makes them.
> 
> ...



That's cool he has his own logo, but even if his customer wants an Ibanez logo it's not cool to put it on. I don't know his prices,but say that customer that requests an Ibanez logo goes and puts the guitar on ebay and tries to pass it off as an LACS Ibanez and asks twice what he pays for it? That's not cool.


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## signalgrey (Aug 24, 2009)

Thin_Ice_77 said:


> Ah. Well, it looks like even worse than normal Tele headstocks, and that's saying something.




booooo...teles are classic clunkers. plus he used that headstock for above the nut bending tricks. fyi.


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## Stitch (Aug 24, 2009)

He really does go all out.


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## Stitch (Aug 24, 2009)

The standard of workmanship is incredible. 

Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî


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## da771 (Aug 24, 2009)

Vaschenko does not forge serial numbers on an underside 
Its guitars sound better originals!!!

Uses the sustained tree

Maple for neck age of 20 years!!! 

In a photo the sample originals headstock



Stitch said:


> The standard of workmanship is incredible.
> 
> Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî




It is my guitar.
Then I will show more photos





final
no serials


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## Battousai (Aug 24, 2009)

how do you order one and whats the price range ?


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## Marv Attaxx (Aug 24, 2009)

Stitch said:


> The standard of workmanship is incredible.
> 
> Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî


Yeah, it looks amazing 
Fake or not, those guitars seem to be really really nice!
The neckjoint, the frets, the inlay, the neck in general...everything seems to be perfect.
The Ibanez guys should hire him for LACS 

EDIT:


da771 said:


> Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî
> 
> Original logo
> 
> ...




Holy Crap


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## da771 (Aug 24, 2009)

Battousai said:


> how do you order one and whats the price range ?



1100 and more

my guitar -1600



Marv Attaxx said:


> Yeah, it looks amazing
> Fake or not, those guitars seem to be really really nice!
> The neckjoint, the frets, the inlay, the neck in general...everything seems to be perfect.
> The Ibanez guys should hire him for LACS




Yes


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## Marv Attaxx (Aug 24, 2009)

da771 said:


> 1100 and more
> 
> my guitar -1600
> 
> ...


Rubles? Euro?? Dollar???


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## darbdavys (Aug 24, 2009)

da771 said:


> 1100 and more
> 
> my guitar -1600
> 
> ...


1600 rubles?


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## Daemoniac (Aug 24, 2009)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Rubles? Euro?? Dollar???




^ Souls of children 

EDIT: I should also add, the workmanship really is just fucking fantastic  Just amazing...


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## Stitch (Aug 24, 2009)

da771 said:


> Vaschenko does not forge serial numbers on an underside
> Its guitars sound better originals!!!
> 
> Uses the sustained tree
> ...



Sorry man, it wasn't meant to be an attack on your guitar. It's absolutley drop dead gorgeous. 

I'm very jealous! Can you tell us any more about the ordering process?


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## Marv Attaxx (Aug 24, 2009)

darbdavys said:


> 1600 rubles?


Ok, I just checked how many euros 1600 rubles would be...Hellyeah, 34 euros for such a great guitar 



Demoniac said:


> ^ Souls of children


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## Battousai (Aug 24, 2009)

you still didnt answer me on how to order one dude!


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## Marv Attaxx (Aug 24, 2009)

Battousai said:


> you still didnt answer me on how to order one dude!


Is there anybody who's fluent at russian and english?
I'd like to know more about the ordering process, too


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## Stitch (Aug 24, 2009)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Is there somebody who's fluent in russian and english?
> I'd like to know more about the ordering process, too



Vova.


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## da771 (Aug 24, 2009)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Is there somebody who's fluent in russian and english?
> I'd like to know more about the ordering process, too



It is necessary registry on Ôîðóì Ãèòàðíîãî Ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî 0-1

And to write to the master about the order
Or at a forum it is created topics

price in $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ dollars

master will arrive on September, 1st

It mail vashvalera (dog) yandex.ru


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## cyril v (Aug 24, 2009)

thats some amazing shit right there. congrats on the guitar.


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## arktan (Aug 24, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Nothing wrong with copies of other guitars, so long as you don't put their logo on your headstock. Putting their logo on the headstock is a BIG fail in my book.



Agreed. And isn't it illegal by the way?


Are there any customer reviews of his guitars?


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 24, 2009)

arktan said:


> Agreed. And isn't it illegal by the way?
> 
> 
> Are there any customer reviews of his guitars?



I'd say he's probably out of reach of the copyright laws.


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## Dusty201087 (Aug 24, 2009)

Demoniac said:


> ^ Souls of children



I wish more companies took those as payment...


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## djpharoah (Aug 24, 2009)

Love the guitars but as soon as he put "J Custom Ibanez" on the headstock it failed for me. Totally don't like people doing that to guitars cuz it's not a JCustom.


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## Fred the Shred (Aug 24, 2009)

I have to agree there. They look absolutely awesome, but the replication of copyrighted logos is something I could never condone.


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## GazPots (Aug 24, 2009)

thedonutman said:


> Just look at the pictures?



Looks like my real J custom, minus the stupid shark though.


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## yevetz (Aug 24, 2009)

This is a second luthier that I saw on post USSR space that can do a good guitars


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## op1e (Aug 24, 2009)

Must...have....Strat.... That really is my dream guitar. Even has the big Hendrix style headstock I love. And isnt ruined with a bridge humbucker, however the Floyd could go.
They are seriously infringing though. Warmoth isnt even allowed to make Strat and Tele style necks without a license. Otherwise, Douglas would probly be doing it like crazy.


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## da771 (Aug 25, 2009)

"minus the stupid shark though" ----- it's my project !!!!!

28" baritone, 
neckthrough
honduras machogony
ebony fredboard

low F tuning
Meshuggah


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## IconW (Aug 25, 2009)

Great looking guitar dude! I just love it!


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## Sang-Drax (Aug 25, 2009)

These are among the most amazing pieces of wood I've ever seen. 

I wouldn't order one with another company's logo, but to each its own


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## da771 (Aug 31, 2009)

Started *NEW* project

Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî

body - korina


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## Esp Griffyn (Aug 31, 2009)

GazPots said:


> Looks like my real J custom, minus the stupid shark though.



Gutted because you don't have a shark inlay too? 

I am totally against putting logos on, I'd rather have the builders on logo on it rather than Ibanez. The workmanship however, is absolutely top grade, and that shark inlay is some of the best inlay work I've seen in ages!


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## hufschmid (Aug 31, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> but say that customer that requests an Ibanez logo goes and puts the guitar on ebay and tries to pass it off as an LACS Ibanez and asks twice what he pays for it? That's not cool.








not cool at all 

Thats actually a serious copyright infrigement there 

Be proud of what you build and dont place a logo from an other company just because you think it will sell better 

Be yourself!!!


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 31, 2009)

hufschmid said:


> not cool at all
> 
> Thats actually a serious copyright infrigement there
> 
> ...


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## Sepultorture (Aug 31, 2009)

nice RG copy, but not liking that angled neck, blech



hufschmid said:


> not cool at all
> 
> Thats actually a serious copyright infrigement there
> 
> ...



i would have to agree there man, i was talking quotes with Sabastion about a custom RG, and if i was to have anything, i'd like the Ibanez style logo in the metallic look, but would read ROTER, not Ibanez


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 31, 2009)

Sepultorture said:


> nice RG copy, but not liking that angled neck, blech



Angled neck would be necessary for the TOM bridge. You could recess the TOM, but I would prefer neck angle.


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## Ruins (Aug 31, 2009)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Is there somebody who's fluent in russian and english?
> I'd like to know more about the ordering process, too


i speak fluent, reading is little bit harder though, i read and understand everything. writing it's a problem, i have never learned it even though Russian is one of my mother languages.


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## TMM (Aug 31, 2009)

InCasinoOut said:


> agreed. i'm really curious about how it stands up against a j custom with the exact same specs though.



I suspect the short answer to this is, 'better and cheaper', and by cheaper I mean, 'priced within reason for what it is', which is something you just can't say about 'high end' Ibanezes.

+1 though, on using the copied company's logo... that's really poor practice.


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## Ketzer (Aug 31, 2009)

the logo business is a double-edged sword. If he has the Ibanez logo on his guitar, it will give Ibanez good press if people play his guitar and like it or see him playing that guitar and like it. I don't think it qualifies as taking money from Ibanez, because from the specs on the guitar and the price paid for it, he would not have bought an Ibanez if he hadn't bought this. If the guitar was low-quality and would reflect poorly on the company's name, i could see a legitimate argument, but when it's obscenely high-quality, like these ones, i don't see what the moral issue is. (Note, I know there's a dangerous precedent and a slippery slope involved here, I'm just talking about this particular luthier.)


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## MaxOfMetal (Aug 31, 2009)

Ketzer said:


> the logo business is a double-edged sword. If he has the Ibanez logo on his guitar, it will give Ibanez good press if people play his guitar and like it or see him playing that guitar and like it. I don't think it qualifies as taking money from Ibanez, because from the specs on the guitar and the price paid for it, he would not have bought an Ibanez if he hadn't bought this. If the guitar was low-quality and would reflect poorly on the company's name, i could see a legitimate argument, but when it's obscenely high-quality, like these ones, i don't see what the moral issue is. (Note, I know there's a dangerous precedent and a slippery slope involved here, I'm just talking about this particular luthier.)



It's all about integrity. Of course in the micro view, this is just ONE really high quality guitar that happens to be branded falsely. Though, imagine if a customer requests "not so great" specs and decided to put an Ibanez label on the headstock? 

In a perfect world it wouldn't matter what it says on the headstock, but in a world full of scammers and people who base all their opinions on looks and representation, that just doesn't fly. 

As you even stated yourself, there is a slippery slope. Who gets to judge who gets to use false labels and those who don't.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 31, 2009)

Yeah, the fact of the matter is is that it's NOT an Ibanez, so he shouldn't be using their logos. Period. The quality of the guitar doesn't matter, in fact, I would say that his guitars are probably on par with or far exceed the quality of any Ibby out there, judging by the looks of them, and the fact you can choose your specs and it's a true custom. Like I said though, that has nothing to do with him branding his guitars as Ibanez.


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## MaxOfMetal (Aug 31, 2009)

Everyone here is calling them amazing simply from looks, I'd rather play one before I comment on anything other than aesthetics. This wouldn't be the first time everyone has seen an amazing looking guitar that might not be as amazing playing, of a guitar. 

That being said, it certainly looks top notch.


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## mickytee (Aug 31, 2009)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Everyone here is calling them amazing simply from looks, I'd rather play one before I comment on anything other than aesthetics. This wouldn't be the first time everyone has seen an amazing looking guitar that might not be as amazing playing, of a guitar.
> 
> That being said, it certainly looks top notch.



obviously. we can only judge it based on aesthetics, and thats what we're doing.
we're not saying it plays amazing by the pics, we're saying that we can tell that the craftmanship and appearance of the guitar is top notch.

its awesome but imo, the bridge pickup is too far from the bridge.


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## S-O (Aug 31, 2009)

at that price, ibanez ought to be asking him to put their logos on such great guitars! 

I am neither for or against logo on such guitars. If it's what a customer wants...


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## yevetz (Aug 31, 2009)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Is there anybody who's fluent at russian and english?
> I'd like to know more about the ordering process, too



Yeah dude, I can help. If you still need it


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## da771 (Sep 1, 2009)

If it's what a customer wants...[/QUOTE]

Yes this my desire.

I wanted Ibanez
I wanted 28 "baritone
I wanted old radial maple neck through body
I wanted gonduras mahogony
I wanted abalon shark in 12 fret
I wanted ebony fretboard
I wanted ToM
I wanted the highest quality of manufacturing and a sound
And I am all have received!!!

I very much like guitars Ibanez but that that I want was not present

It not IBANEZ, and a variation on this theme 
It Ibanez my dream, Ibanez to me of it could not give 

*This guitar not for sale.
It is my personal guitar*

http://guitarmaster.forum24.ru/?1-1-0-00000070-000-0-0-1250915369


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## drmosh (Sep 1, 2009)

da771 said:


> Yes this my desire.
> 
> I wanted Ibanez
> I wanted 28 "baritone
> ...



look stunning. I hope it plays as good as it looks.

how much did you pay if you don't mind me asking?


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## da771 (Sep 1, 2009)

It not a secret

1600$ full cost

The master has now begun the new project
Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî

You too have a chance to receive a guitar of the dream for the reasonable price

It is possible to observe of creation process online and to correct it


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## AeonSolus (Sep 1, 2009)

da771 said:


> Yes this my desire.
> 
> I wanted Ibanez
> I wanted 28 "baritone
> ...



People said the same when i made my two Blackmachine-Inspired six and seven string guitars, i haven't even done NGD Threads because i'm not in the mood of getting bashed for "ripping" or "stealing" or "insulting" Doug and Blackmachine. It's your guitar, Your Money, Your owns specs and it won't be for sale  why so much hate and bashing towards people like us that do these kind of stuff? at least for the ones that don't intend to resell it as it was the real thing..., Because, no matter what you do, even if you slap a proper serial number and logo on the headstock and use the hardware directly off an ibanez, it won't be an ibanez, it'll always be *your* guitar, made by the hands of the people at *Vaschenko V.I.*.

Keep it up mate.


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## da771 (Sep 1, 2009)




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## drmosh (Sep 1, 2009)

da771 said:


> It not a secret
> 
> 1600$ full cost
> 
> ...



amazing price, but it would be very hard for me to deal with the russian dudes. I don't speak a word of russian, aside from the obvious words


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 1, 2009)

AeonSolus said:


> People said the same when i made my two Blackmachine-Inspired six and seven string guitars, i haven't even done NGD Threads because i'm not in the mood of getting bashed for "ripping" or "stealing" or "insulting" Doug and Blackmachine. It's your guitar, Your Money, Your owns specs and it won't be for sale  why so much hate and bashing towards people like us that do these kind of stuff? at least for the ones that don't intend to resell it as it was the real thing..., Because, no matter what you do, even if you slap a proper serial number and logo on the headstock and use the hardware directly off an ibanez, it won't be an ibanez, it'll always be *your* guitar, made by the hands of the people at *Vaschenko V.I.*.
> 
> Keep it up mate.



Did you label it as a Blackmachine? If so it's not cool. If it's has the same shape as a Blackmachine, then whatever. I don't frown on copies, I frown on people using the same logo as a company. It's a question of ethics. Also the dude is making money on it. He shouldn't be making money with Ibanez's name, even if the customer knows it's not an Ibby. This guy might not be planning on selling it as an Ibanez, but what about the next guy who might not have the same morals comes along, pays $1600 for an Ibby copy, complete with a serial number (which there are pics on his site of him doing) and then throws it up on eBay as an LACS for twice the amount?


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## kmanick (Sep 1, 2009)

that thing looks like a non trem'd verision of my J-custom?????


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## GazPots (Sep 1, 2009)

Yep, i think we can safely say the JC rg7-1 DBK (or rg8527 if you like ) was the insiration for that model.


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## AeonSolus (Sep 1, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Did you label it as a Blackmachine? If so it's not cool. If it's has the same shape as a Blackmachine, then whatever. I don't frown on copies, I frown on people using the same logo as a company. It's a question of ethics.



Well, i utilized the aesthetics of blackmachine, and funny thing, I'm making a back plate that reads "NOT A Blackmachine...Built In Dominican Republic..Osoria Customs" or something like that just for the Shet 'n' giggols . Logos are a whole diferent thing, i'm not too fan of that either, but if he's up to it, let him be..Karma or Chuck Norris will get him if he sells it as if it was a real LACS or something, i'm sure he won't do as he stated it's his dream guitar


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 1, 2009)

I don't believe in karma or Chuck Norris. I'm sure THIS guy won't sell it off as an LACS, I'm talking about one of his many other customers, especially the customer who got an Ibby serial number and everything printed on the back of the headstock.


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## pirateparty (Sep 1, 2009)

Yeah exactly, I need to confiscate it and play it forever so it doesn't fall into the wrong hands.


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## cddragon (Sep 1, 2009)

^ 
just tell me if you need help with it anytime, I'd be more than happy to take care of such a nice instrument even for a while 



I agree 'bout the logo and S/N stuff - it's just wrong and this guy's awesome work should have his name on it


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## pirateparty (Sep 1, 2009)

Hell, if I built this guitar I would make a decal of my face and put it on the headstock.

Or something like this:


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## Ketzer (Sep 1, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> I don't believe in karma or Chuck Norris. I'm sure THIS guy won't sell it off as an LACS, I'm talking about one of his many other customers, especially the customer who got an Ibby serial number and everything printed on the back of the headstock.



That guitar belongs to the Topic creator, which the guy used as a template.


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## Rorschach (Sep 1, 2009)

Ketzer said:


> That guitar belongs to the Topic creator, which the guy used as a template.



Exactly. He did not forge the S/N. Heck, there´s even a pic of the back side, without S/N in this very thread!


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## da771 (Sep 2, 2009)

pirateparty said:


> Hell, if I built this guitar I would make a decal of my face and put it on the headstock.
> 
> Or something like this:




Hi
You can order a guitar of your dream with *yours log*o

http://guitarmaster.forum24.ru/?1-1-0-00000072-000-20-0-1251827243








mahogony 30 years !!!
&#1052;&#1072;&#1093;&#1072;&#1075;&#1086;&#1085;&#1100;, &#1090;&#1072;&#1085;&#1075;&#1077;&#1085;&#1089; 50&#1093;480&#1093;1400 
30 &#1083;&#1077;&#1090; &#1082;&#1086;&#1084;&#1085;&#1072;&#1090;&#1085;&#1086;&#1081; &#1089;&#1091;&#1096;&#1082;&#1080;


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

Ketzer said:


> That guitar belongs to the Topic creator, which the guy used as a template.



i was just about to point this out, it's very obvious IMO since the guitar that showed the back of the headstock w/ the SN was a three-piece neck and the final product had a 5 piece. I believe it was posted to reference the maple color and for no other reason.











also, IMO theres nothing wrong with using the Ibanez logo. if thats what the customer wants, then why should it matter.? Some people just happen to like the Ibanez logo... I know if I were in the same situation I would've gotten an Ibanez logo. For instance I planned on getting a replacement RG body, and would've just added it to my 7620 neck. Additionally I would've picked up a replacement 5-piece neck w/ebony board later on down the road. I most certainly would've used an Ibanez logo myself.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

Everyone thinks I'm talking about the topic creator...I am not. I didn't know the one with the S/N was actually owned by the topic creator though.

I guess it's an agree to disagree thing  If I put out a product, and someone wanted to use my shape and create a copy, whatever, imitation is the highest form of flattery. However if they wanted to brand it as mine, I would be supremely pissed, and it's not good business ethics at all.


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## canuck brian (Sep 2, 2009)

> also, IMO theres nothing wrong with using the Ibanez logo. if thats what the customer wants, then why should it matter.?






It matters in a lot of countries where ripping off the name of another company is simply illegal. This is nothing more than high quality custom Chibanez. Same shit.

How about this - I want a KxK copy and I want KxK's name on the headstock. I specifically don't want Rob to make it. I want this guy to make the KxK copy. Is that ok? It's what **I** the customer want, so it's cool, right? No. It's not ok. 

I think i'm going to call my band Opeth, cover their tunes and say they're mine. They won't mind. I won't even have to come up with original songs!


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## Sang-Drax (Sep 2, 2009)

canuck brian said:


> I think i'm going to call my band Opeth, cover their tunes and say they're mine. They won't mind. I won't even have to come up with original songs!


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## hufschmid (Sep 2, 2009)

The problem is that we see this more and more in any thype of subject...

Guitar speaking, Doug told me last day that there is a dick in russia who is offering perfect replicas of his instrument, yet this person does not use the trademark blackmachine... I still find this lame especially since this person is clearely immitating the design itself...

Those people enjoy immitating anything which is successfull, you will never see for exemple an immitation of an instrument which is not popular in forums, and those people know that there is a market here because not all of us can afford to buy the real thing as the real price...

Ibanez is a big company so they probably dont give a shit, but imagine what they are doing to small artisans, litterally stealing the designs that we have taken so many years to perfect, then selling it much cheaper because of course those people dont live in expensive countries and believe me that for the price they sell them, in their country they make a lots of money doing this.... 

Just thought I would share some of my opinions here...


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## MF_Kitten (Sep 2, 2009)

actually, ibanez cares alot. they put up a counterfeit warning on their website, warning people about fake ibanez guitars.

i think that any proper builder should refrain from faking a guitar. i wouldn´t even replicate a headstock if i were a builder. i´d at least change it up just a tad, making it my own. the headstock seems to be kind of a "signature" for some luthiers, and certainly for many guitar companies.


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

canuck brian said:


> It matters in a lot of countries where ripping off the name of another company is simply illegal. *This is nothing more than high quality custom Chibanez. Same shit.*



except it's not a copy and doesn't have a serial # on it. but it is what the customer wanted...

If I remember correctly, there was a Steve Vai vid where he was showing lots of guitars (Jems) among his collection... now several of them were complete customs not built by Ibanez. I guess you'd consider them Chibanez as well... now is that an insult or a term, because I think knock-off sounds better and doesn't discredit the instrument.




> How about this - I want a KxK copy and I want KxK's name on the headstock. I specifically don't want Rob to make it. I want this guy to make the KxK copy. Is that ok? It's what **I** the customer want, so it's cool, right? No. It's not ok.



Now, if you're trying to pass it off as a KxK, thats completely different. It's not like the OP said he bought this guitar from LACS or anything. He definitely didn't attempt to make anyone second guess that it's anything but an amazing custom based off of an RG w/an Ibanez logo.



> I think i'm going to call my band Opeth, cover their tunes and say they're mine. They won't mind. I won't even have to come up with original songs!



You mean like a cover band?:

Le*z* Zepplin
Led Zepplica
Iron Maiden*s*
Symbolic
Schism
Zappa plays Zappa
Fan Halen
etcetc

sounds like an idea i've heard tossed around before.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

Those bands are named differently. Brian meant he should name his band Opeth and play the same songs.

If a customer wants you to break the law it doesn't make it right.

And it's not just this dude we're talking about. All the power to him, he got Ibanez on the headstock and doesn't plan to sell it. What about the next customer who isn't so attached to the guitar and might have low moral fibre? No one has addressed that issue yet.


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## CrushingAnvil (Sep 2, 2009)

It's Illegal, Get over it whoever is disputing it


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

It's not even about it being illegal, it's wrong from an ethical standpoint  When I'M arguing about ethics, you know something is fucking wrong


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## canuck brian (Sep 2, 2009)

If it says Ibanez on the headstock, it's a copy. 

Steve Vai has many guitars that are called Jems that are not made by Ibanez, nor do they actually have the logo on them. And for the record, i would actually call any guitar with an Ibanez logo on teh headstock that isn't actually an Ibanez a wanna be Chibanez. 

Why would you get an Ibanez logo on the headstock (which is also an Ibanez knock off) if you didn't intend on giving people the impression you had a custom Ibanez? Even up close, i'd be probably convinced that it was some artists LACS that they sold off. This is why most countries have these things called laws in place to prevent people from doing this.

KxK - So you're saying it's totally cool to rip off Rob's design, his logo and his headstock so long as I'm not actually trying to give people the impression that the KxK logo, headstock and design isn't actually a KxK. Man, i could make a killing doing Blackmachine copies too!  Maybe I can get a hold of the same place that does Doug's nameplates! 

You got a myspace with music Cyril? I'm thinking that I want to get some new tunes out to my fans and I'd like to rip off your music. I'll make sure to tell people that it's not my music if they ask.

Dont' want to give people the wrong idea about your guitar not being an Ibanez? Dont' put an Ibanez logo on the Ibanez headstock on the non-Ibanez guitar.

Music - read JJ's response.



cyril v said:


> except it's not a copy and doesn't have a serial # on it. but it is what the customer wanted...
> 
> If I remember correctly, there was a Steve Vai vid where he was showing lots of guitars (Jems) among his collection... now several of them were complete customs not built by Ibanez. I guess you'd consider them Chibanez as well... now is that an insult or a term, because I think knock-off sounds better and doesn't discredit the instrument.
> 
> Now, if you're trying to pass it off as a KxK, thats completely different. It's not like the OP said he bought this guitar from LACS or anything. He definitely didn't attempt to make anyone second guess that it's anything but an amazing custom based off of an RG w/an Ibanez logo.


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

You seem to be of the opinion that you're opinion is somehow more valid than mine... but to make you're argument you're just just take a single instance and then going x100000 with it. it's quite comical but hardly makes what you're saying reflect what I was saying.

If we'd follow you're logic, I guess you could say that my first guitar I got (old acoustic) that I threw a metallica sticker on and an Ibanez logo decal... means I am in metallica and an ibanez endorsee because i put the sticker on there. So, that automatically means I was trying to defraud someone with it... I suppose I should've put it up on ebay and sold it off as an LACS? what do you think?

As an aside, I suppose you've never heard of cover bands though... or just cover songs? Holy shit Brian, Children of Bodom covered a slayer song!! should I not like it because they didn't create it? Why would Children of Bodom cover a slayer song if they didn't intend on giving people the impression they were Slayer? Even up close, i'd be probably convinced that it was slayer.

edit: just throwing it out there, but besides chris broderick's LACS guitars, and Tobin's RGA... most of my favorite "Ibanez" guitars aren't made by Ibanez and are what you'd refer to as 'Chibanez'... so maybe I'm just silly like that.

We'll have to agree to disagree; as a craftsman I'm sure you hold your opinion closer to your heart than i would.


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## canuck brian (Sep 2, 2009)

cyril v said:


> You seem to be of the opinion that you're opinion is somehow more valid than mine... but to make you're argument you're just just take a single instance and then going x100000 with it. it's quite comical but hardly makes what you're saying reflect what I was saying.



Actually I think the law is more valid than your opinion. You're saying that putting an Ibanez logo on an Ibanez copy is totally cool. I'm saying it's not and using other examples to show this.



> If we'd follow you're logic, I guess you could say that my first guitar I got (old acoustic) that I threw a metallica sticker on and an Ibanez logo decal... means I am in metallica and an ibanez endorsee because i put the sticker on there. So, that automatically means I was trying to defraud someone with it... I suppose I should've put it up on ebay and sold it off as an LACS? what do you think?



You missed my logic. The guitar in question is an Ibanez clone. It looks like an Ibanez. It has an Ibanez headstock. Your first shitty acoustic doesn't. You didn't have your first acoustic custom built to LOOK like an Ibanez. You didn't have a custom guitar built to look like one and then slap an Ibanez logo on the headstock. I say this is bad, you say there is no problem.

I applied the same logic to music regarding Opeth.



> As an aside, I suppose you've never heard of cover bands though... or just cover songs? Holy shit Brian, Children of Bodom covered a slayer song!! should I not like it because they didn't create it? Why would Children of Bodom cover a slayer song if they didn't intend on giving people the impression they were Slayer? Even up close, i'd be probably convinced that it was slayer.



Did you bother reading my post at all? Or JJ's? Where the hell did I say cover band? I said I would name my band Opeth and play all of their songs. I'll make sure that I'll play countries that won't nail me for copywright infringement on their NAME. 



> edit: just throwing it out there, but besides chris broderick's LACS guitars, and Tobin's RGA... most of my favorite "Ibanez" guitars aren't made by Ibanez and are what you'd refer to as 'Chibanez'... so maybe I'm just silly like that.



If your favorite guitars aren't made by Ibanez and ALL have Ibanez logos on the Ibanez shaped headstock, then yeah, they're ripoffs. I can't really see how you don't grasp this concept. 

If you mean your favorite guitars use the RG shape and have their own design of headstock and logo, then no, they're not Chibanez. I use the RG body design because I love it. I have my own headstock and my own logo. Nobody is going to get the impression that my guitars are Ibanez, just obviously inspired by them.



> We'll have to agree to disagree; as a craftsman I'm sure you hold your opinion closer to your heart than i would.



No shit.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

cyril v said:


> You seem to be of the opinion that you're opinion is somehow more valid than mine.



Him being a luthier I would argue that it actually is. He's in a position where potentially with enough time and name recognition, this COULD happen to him, and he'd have to deal with people putting his logo on stuff.


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## TMM (Sep 2, 2009)

sorry, is this thread still going?


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## hufschmid (Sep 2, 2009)

cyril v said:


> As an aside, I suppose you've never heard of cover bands though... or just cover songs? Holy shit Brian, Children of Bodom covered a slayer song with their permission!!



fixed a copyright issue



JJ Rodriguez said:


> It's not even about it being illegal, it's wrong from an ethical standpoint  When I'M arguing about ethics, you know something is fucking wrong


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

Shut up or I'm building a Blackdroid bass with shitty fretwork and selling it to someone in Sweden.


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## hufschmid (Sep 2, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Shut up or I'm building a Blackdroid bass with shitty fretwork and selling it to someone in Sweden.



that would be actually epic, you being the builder and selling it to somebody in sweden


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## Justin Bailey (Sep 2, 2009)

if I could speak russian I'd get in contact with him for one of his guitars...


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

canuck brian said:


> If your favorite guitars aren't made by Ibanez and ALL have Ibanez logos on the Ibanez shaped headstock, then yeah, they're ripoffs. I can't really see how you don't grasp this concept.



I didn't say I had trouble comprehending your farce... it's just that I really don't think a one-off is as big of a problem as you make it out to be. *Mountains out of molehills*... 

It's not that I can't grasp why your panties are in a bunch, I just don't think this particular build is a big a deal in the grand scheme of things.

chibanez or whatever... shannon's spalted maple Jem 7 is bar none my favorite fake Ibanez. granted, it'd be just as amazing without the ibanez logo but it just looks right with it.

-what are your opinions of people buying replacement bodies and necks? I mean, I'm wondering if you think they shouldnt be able to do that or if they take off the finger board if you think they should have to scrape off the logo too. where would the line in the sand be? I'd say if its such a sensitive issue that you'd either have to have an all hands in approach or a non at all to be totally logical with it.

-how about the people that turn their 7620/7321 into Green dots and change the logo and all... I'd say "it's their guitar, who the hell should care... as long as they aren't trying to sell it off to people as a true green dot.".


> No shit.



forum tough guy, everyone watch out. 

edit: Wasn't Ibanez started as a company that completely did knock off's? I mean, wtf.. how can you complain about a logo but just throw up a green flag when a company changes a two sharp edges into rounded ones and calls it a new name.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

Tough guy? He didn't threaten you in any way 

Shannon's spalted 7 has an Ibby neck. If someone uses a part that's genuine and bears a logo, they don't need to take it off, people just shouldn't put it on anything they build. Should replacement necks bear the logo? Not unless they come from Ibanez. If you peel off the fretboard or mod it in some way, it's still an Ibanez, you've just modded it yourself. There's a world of difference between that and copyright infringement. I don't see why it's that hard to see the distinction


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## Trev (Sep 2, 2009)

hufschmid said:


> The problem is that we see this more and more in any thype of subject...
> 
> Guitar speaking, Doug told me last day that there is a dick in russia who is offering perfect replicas of his instrument, yet this person does not use the trademark blackmachine... I still find this lame especially since this person is clearely immitating the design itself...
> 
> ...


 

Interesting that someone would try to imitate a design as specifically carried out as Doug's. Epic case of .


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## canuck brian (Sep 2, 2009)

cyril v said:


> forum tough guy, everyone watch out.



By saying "no shit" I simply accented your point. If you think I threatened someone, then take it up with a mod. Let me know when they laugh at you.

My panties are in fact, not in a bunch. I looked at that guy's website and almost EVERY SINGLE guitar is a rip off. If you honestly dont' see a problem with the guy profiting off ripping off other established companies, please do not ever go into any profession that requires ethics.

Ibanez was also a company that started with knock offs. That pesky thing called "laws" put an end to that.

Anyways, trying to make you see logic (actually two luthiers have now attempted that) is kinda like this:  So I'll stop now.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

At least Ibanez used their own logos (to my knowledge) back in their knock off days


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

canuck brian said:


> By saying "no shit" I simply accented your point. If you think I threatened someone, then take it up with a mod. Let me know when they laugh at you.
> 
> My panties are in fact, not in a bunch. I looked at that guy's website and almost EVERY SINGLE guitar is a rip off. If you honestly dont' see a problem with the guy profiting off ripping off other established companies, please do not ever go into any profession that requires ethics.
> 
> ...



whatever dude, I said I completely understand your stance, that just doesn't mean I have to completely agree with it. I thought that much was clear when I said "we'll agree to disagree". Can you guys not see that?

Legality and morals/ethics does not equate to logic... when there is demand and absolutely no supply, someone steps in to fill the void. if it were any other company that actually has options for customers, I'd completely agree with you.... but there isn't and I don't agree.

Also , I probably should have said "forum badass", I half expected you to add "-sherlock" to the end of that line. lol, either way i was joking. don't take my posts too seriously as that'll lead to more 

I hope you guys don't take my posts as being negative towards you... i'm a fan of both of your brands myself. I just don't completely agree with ya. 

------------
Have you guys seen the Virtual Ibanez Guitar builder program? well, I happen to think if I wanted to create something completely to my stanrdards like you do with that program, you should be able to buy it. I'll just leave it at this; if Ibanez would open up their custom shop to the public, there wouldn't be a market at all for this stuff. Not saying it's not completely unethical, a bit assholish or whatever... just saying that Ibanez pretty much created the need for people to want customized Ibanez's and don't really offer much in the way of options for normal people.

If someone wants a KxK, Bowes, Hufschmid, ESP to their specs, theres little stopping them... fire off a phone call/e-mail and have the cash. If you want a custom Ibanez from Ibanez, you're about 100% screwed for choice. Thats why every other person gets a black Ibanez and then mods the hell out of it... they're just going through the motions and more than likely would dive in head first if Ibanez allowed them the chance.

/done. i understand why my opinion is not going to win you guys over, didn't even mean to make it look like i was going to try to... just stating my view on the matter.


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## hufschmid (Sep 2, 2009)

Well in my case I'm a human, not a CNC so if anybody would copy my designs, it will anyway not me from me the original creator 

Ibanez are mass produced using cnc machines so if you copy one your going against the original cnc machine and the programmer 

This was suposed to be a joke


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## cyril v (Sep 2, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> At least Ibanez used their own logos (to my knowledge) back in their knock off days



lol, true. but still... after they got sued, they rounded off the edges on their gibson clones and suddenly everyones okay with it. I think theres a double standard in that.



hufschmid said:


> Well in my case I'm a human, not a CNC so if anybody would copy my designs, it will anyway not me from me the original creator
> 
> Ibanez are mass produced using cnc machines so if you copy one your going against the original cnc machine and the programmer
> 
> This was suposed to be a joke



If someone copied your stuff, that'd be pretty screwed up... but with Ibanez and the other crap I bitched about (no Custom shop for public), I really don't feel too bad for them since they alienate people like that, not only that, they were the original chibanez.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 2, 2009)

If anything, I'm sure we can all agree this shows the demand for a public Ibanez custom shop


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## thedonutman (Sep 2, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> If anything, I'm sure we can all agree this shows the demand for a public Ibanez custom shop



+1

I know it's immoral and everything, but those guitars still look pretty damn cool


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## da771 (Sep 3, 2009)

Hello guys 
Hot discussion here

I ordered two guitars

Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî 1-1-0-00000070-000-0-0-1250915369

And

Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî 1-1-0-00000071-000-0-0-1250448092










On this guitar another logo VVCustom (Valery Vaschenko)
I ordered this guitar for other guy 
It is very very happy with a guitar

*Valery Vaschenko the professional guitar builder* 

contact:
mail: vashvalera(doggy)yandex.ru
ICQ:	393729245


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## da771 (Sep 3, 2009)

It's cooool sound

Good luck guys


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## cyril v (Sep 3, 2009)

on that last link, what kind of pickups are going into that build? i saw a picture of blackouts and i saw that it has the battery hookup... just confused.


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## da771 (Sep 3, 2009)

But this baritone are put custom made active pickup
BlackOuts for J-custom


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## cyril v (Sep 3, 2009)




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## da771 (Sep 9, 2009)

da771 said:


> Hi
> You can order a guitar of your dream with *yours log*o
> 
> Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî
> ...



*This 30 years mahogony in action* 

Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî


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## da771 (Sep 12, 2009)

*Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî*


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## snuif09 (Sep 12, 2009)

damn i really like that inlayed logo of the builders name if i had the money id get one with the builders logo just to respect him and by playing it make the word spread about it cause when your on stage people are going to thinkm "hey thats an ibanez lets buy that cause he plays that" so i think only using your own logo is better


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## da771 (Sep 15, 2009)

New day !!!!


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## mattofvengeance (Sep 15, 2009)




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## da771 (Sep 15, 2009)

mattofvengeance said:


>



no problem **
*[email protected]
icq 393729245*


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## mattofvengeance (Sep 15, 2009)

Scratch that. I take it these are his makes as well? If so, about how much do his 8 strings cost? I hasn't any reubels


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## da771 (Sep 15, 2009)

mattofvengeance said:


> Scratch that. I take it these are his makes as well? If so, about how much do his 8 strings cost? I hasn't any reubels




Payment in dollars 
Cost ask the master 
[email protected]
icq 393729245


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## mattofvengeance (Sep 15, 2009)

da771 said:


> Payment in dollars
> Cost ask the master
> [email protected]
> icq 393729245



Thanks, dude. I just sent him an email. How much are yours going to cost you?


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## da771 (Sep 15, 2009)

???????

My guitar cost 1600$ -1700$


my english bad


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## mattofvengeance (Sep 15, 2009)

Oh ok. That's a great price for the craftsmanship. I hope they play as well as they look.


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## da771 (Sep 15, 2009)

mattofvengeance said:


> Oh ok. That's a great price for the craftsmanship. I hope they play as well as they look.







mattofvengeance said:


> Oh ok. That's a great price for the craftsmanship. I hope they play as well as they look.


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## da771 (Sep 20, 2009)




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## snuif09 (Sep 20, 2009)

well im going to save up some money so i can buy one xD damn thats some great building =)


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## hufschmid (Sep 20, 2009)

Very nice guitars man


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## da771 (Sep 20, 2009)

_*dream colour*_

































    

_link this project_
Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî


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## JJ Rodriguez (Sep 20, 2009)

I would have personally gone for the "triple step", dying it black and sanding it back before adding the final colour to add some depth and shit to that flame, would look sick on that top.


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## Xiphos68 (Sep 20, 2009)

thedonutman said:


> Just look at the pictures?


No way!!!!!!!!!


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## Sang-Drax (Sep 23, 2009)

^ I really dig the black flamed PRS-esque just behind the OP's PseudoIbanez 



JJ Rodriguez said:


> I would have personally gone for the "triple step", dying it black and sanding it back before adding the final colour to add some depth and shit to that flame, would look sick on that top.



So that's what 'triple step' means. I've always wondered... good to know. Now there's one more thing I've learned on these forums


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## da771 (Oct 16, 2010)

*NEW 28.6" 7 strings thru neck baritone !!!*

Ôîðóì]Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî
Ôîðóì]Ôîðóì ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî ãèòàðíîãî ìàñòåðà Âàëåðèÿ Âàùåíêî



[/URL][/IMG]


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## kmanick (Oct 16, 2010)

Craftsmanship looks great on these but........................
I hope this guy does not put fake serial #'s on these.
I'm always on the look out for an iJCRG7DKB.
Knowing that someone is making really good replicas 
and using fake serials #'s and putting on Ibanez logos would just infuriate me to no end.
I don't want to have to 2nd guess every Jcustom I see now as to whether or not it's authentic.


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## Isan (Oct 16, 2010)

WOW


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## da771 (Oct 17, 2010)

No serial numbers!!!


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## HaloHat (Oct 17, 2010)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> It's really bad business ethics to pass your work off as someone else's. And if these guitars are so great, why wouldn't you want to proudly put your company name on the headstock?


 
+1 What he said...


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