# Agile Interceptor 8 strings!



## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

*EDIT*
FYI - these are available for preorder:

http://www.rondomusic.com/interceptorstd8.html

http://www.rondomusic.com/interceptorpro828nat.html

http://www.rondomusic.com/septor8.html

http://www.rondomusic.com/septor827.html
*EDIT*

<commence original thread for your reading pleasure>

Exciting News!

Kurt and I are working on specs for a pair of 8-string _Interceptors_! 

This is a follow-up poll to the discussion which took place in this thread:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...st-in-an-agile-8-string-for-lead-players.html

The plan is to offer a Standard (bolt-on) and a Pro (neck-thru) model.

The common specs to both will be:
Kahler USA Hybrid tremelo
24 frets, 16" fretboard radius
Dual Cepheus Pickups

The Standard will feature a mahogany body and solid color finishes, perhaps these three:
White w/ Gold Hardware, Ebony/Rosewood fretboard (classic Randy Rhoads scheme)
Bright Red w/ Black Hardware, Maple Fretboard (looks like Ibanez RG550 or a Jackson/Charvel/ESP shredder)
Basic Black w/ Black Hardware, Rosewood fretboard for the boring folks

The Pro will feature an alder body with a flame or quilt top and trans finishes, most likely with the choice between natural and perhaps trans blue/black. Fretboards will most likely be maple on natural and rosewood on colors.

*I'm interested to hear opinions on finishes, but here's the main question I have for this poll:*

Regarding scale length - A number of people have expressed interest in 25.5" whilst others are adamantly opposed to it. What Kurt and I are considering is to compromise by doing one of the following (please don't suggest making all 4 variations, the market just is not big enough yet):

Offer the Standard in 25.5" and the Pro in 27"
Offer the Pro in 25.5" and the Standard in 27"

I think the first option is better since the bolt-on is likely to have better definition in the lower register due to its construction so that will work to offset the concern people have about the scale being too short. Am I right? Vote/discuss away!

I don't know if this will help or hurt, but I made a REALLY ugly mockup of the white Standard in MS Paint. If anyone has skill with real mockups, feel free to contact me to donate your skills!


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## darren (Mar 11, 2009)

I think you should reverse the body woods on the Standard and Pro. A solid mahogany bolt-on is going to have a lot of that mahogany tone, and i think a neck-thru maple and alder is perhaps going to be too bright, especially with an extended scale.

Also, if i'm not mistaken, the Kahler locking nut uses a 15" radius, so you might want to design the fretboard radius to match that. This is the reason why the Intrepids have a 15" radius board.


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## goth_fiend (Mar 11, 2009)

I must say the standard being 25.5" and the pro going 27" sounds fine, I would perfer a 30" scale, but thats what customs are for right? I might be on the ship for this depending on price, but I will say this the pro should be quilt topped!


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

darren said:


> I think you should reverse the body woods on the Standard and Pro. A solid mahogany bolt-on is going to have a lot of that mahogany tone, and i think a neck-thru maple and alder is perhaps going to be too bright, especially with an extended scale.
> 
> Also, if i'm not mistaken, the Kahler locking nut uses a 15" radius, so you might want to design the fretboard radius to match that. This is the reason why the Intrepids have a 15" radius board.



The radius is going to be whatever matches the Kahler, for some reason I thought it was 16" but we'll be sure to get that right.

The body wood idea is interesting. I don't have a lot of practical experience with these things so for the most part I'm going on second-hand knowledge. Do you think that the brightness of the bolt-on construction will not be enough to balance the potential muddiness of the mahogany?


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## amassivetree (Mar 11, 2009)

Will this be the only way to get a Kahler interceptor? Im kind of digging the extended scale length now that I've got my Intrepid, although I understand it might not be for everybody.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

I forgot to mention:

Please explain the reasoning behind your votes if possible. I'm interested to see some other thoughts.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 11, 2009)

I voted for the standard at 27" simply because I'd rather buy a bolt on and I want the extended scale, maybe they should offer both 25 and 27 scale 8 stringers like the 7 string models. Also why not keep all the hardware black on the models?


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

It's not a Ford Model T, it's a full-featured specialty guitar. Why not have some different cosmetic options?


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## synrgy (Mar 11, 2009)

voted.

do eet!! 

Like the sound of the white/gold. Been GAS-ing for a white 7 or 8... (*edit* -- that isn't a Schecter)


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 11, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> It's not a Ford Model T, it's a full-featured specialty guitar. Why not have some different cosmetic options?



Options are bad 

lol j/k

I'm just really GASing for a white baritone 8  with either black or chrome hardware, gold is too much bling for my style...


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## eegor (Mar 11, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> It's not a Ford Model T, it's a full-featured specialty guitar. Why not have some different cosmetic options?


 
I would just like to say that this is the first time I have deemed a statement true.



Also, I voted for a 25.5" standard and a 27" pro. This is because was really interested in getting a neck-thru 8 with dual passives, but they weren't available on the last run of Intrepids, therefore I ordered a Pro and a Standard to get the best of both worlds. Now that a neck-thru 8 string is going to be offered with dual passive pickups, I'm going to try as hard as physically possible to get one, but I'm not much of a shredder, so i require a longer scale length.

One more thing: that RR style 8 sounds incredibly awesome. Do that with an ebony board and I'm sold.


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## The Echthros (Mar 11, 2009)

I voted neither simply because I think that the majority of the players are still getting the instrument to get the extended low range and 25.5 wont cut it. make both of them 27


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## DrewsifStalin (Mar 11, 2009)

this is retarded. you cant have an 8 string in 25.5 the intonation will be shit beyond shit.

Plus im gonna end up buying a standard since its the version with the passive style route, please dont make me stuck with a 25.5 inch scale


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

il_echthros_777 said:


> I voted neither simply because I think that the majority of the players are still getting the instrument to get the extended low range and 25.5 wont cut it. make both of them 27



That's why the majority of the models (read: every other 8-string Rondo makes and has ever made) already have the longer scale.

The idea is to have a single model at 25.5", a single model at 27", and keep ALL of the rest at the long 28.625" - it's not about replacing the current lineup.


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## The Echthros (Mar 11, 2009)

i can see why you would want both options in scale...but i dont think you should have to choose between the bolt standard or neck through pro to get the scale you want. If i want a higher quality pro model I'd want to choose between the 25.5" if I wanna shred the shit out of an high A OR the option of going with a 27" if I want to do some serious F# riffage. It shouldn't be that "well...i tune to F#...so i guess i gotta get the standard" or vice versa, yaknow?

its not a matter of replacing the lineup either, so we agree there. this is an all together different instrument. but why the limitations? 

if this is a spin off the other thread arguing about getting an 8 string shred guitar then I can see where the scale is an issue...but I think in the end, as Darren's proposal eventually went, you'll find alot more people will be going for the extended bass range


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## Ruins (Mar 11, 2009)

it would be awesome if it would be available in natural oil finish and the transparent that he offers black, blue , green, red, purple


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## FlamesOfDestiny (Mar 11, 2009)

Ruins said:


> it would be awesome if it would be available in natural oil finish and the transparent that he offers black, blue , green, red, purple



I'd be all over a purple 8!


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## The Echthros (Mar 11, 2009)

I'd personaly like to see mahogany taken out all together to further seperate this model from the intrepid. neck through alder or ash, naked or finished, ebony or maple fingerboards, dual passives,at 27" would be most nice. and for the shred guys you know those wood combos would reign supreme!


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## possumkiller (Mar 11, 2009)

couldnt you do a 25.5 and a 30? man i was really hoping for a 30. i do get the guys who want the 25.5 for a high a or even if they want to try and keep the low range. i just think 25.5 is the beginning, 28.625 intrepid being the middle ground and a 30 would be the long end. honestly after playing the rg2228 i really dont think there is enough difference in 25.5 and 27 inch scale length to warrant making each model. just my opinion tho.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

il_echthros_777 said:


> i can see why you would want both options in scale...but i dont think you should have to choose between the bolt standard or neck through pro to get the scale you want. If i want a higher quality pro model I'd want to choose between the 25.5" if I wanna shred the shit out of an high A OR the option of going with a 27" if I want to do some serious F# riffage. It shouldn't be that "well...i tune to F#...so i guess i gotta get the standard" or vice versa, yaknow?
> 
> its not a matter of replacing the lineup either, so we agree there. this is an all together different instrument. but why the limitations?



I understand your concerns, but it's simply a matter of demand. There aren't enough people buying things like this to justify 4+ different models.

New Note: It looks like we might be developing an 8-string Agile Tremelo system for the standard! This should bring the price down considerably and also allow us room to be sure the design allows for proper intonation.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 11, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> I understand your concerns, but it's simply a matter of demand. There aren't enough people buying things like this to justify 4+ different models.
> 
> New Note: It looks like we might be developing an 8-string Agile Tremelo system for the standard! This should bring the price down considerably and also allow us room to be sure the design allows for proper intonation.






What if they sold the bodies with all the hardware ready to go and then sold 2 or 3 different bolt on necks (25.5, 28.75, 30) that you buy separately and assemble them at home? 

That 8-string tremelo sounds like an awesome idea, kurt is the man


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## FlamesOfDestiny (Mar 11, 2009)

Tommy Van Dyke said:


> What if they sold the bodies with all the hardware ready to go and then sold 2 or 3 different bolt on necks (25.5, 28.75, 30) that you buy separately and assemble them at home?



Wouldn't the bridge have to be at different positions depending upon with neck you used?


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## darren (Mar 11, 2009)

Not if the neck is designed right.

28.625" scale is two frets longer than a 25.5" scale neck.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 11, 2009)

FlamesOfDestiny said:


> Wouldn't the bridge have to be at different positions depending upon with neck you used?





I really don't know, that'd be too bad if you did have to have different bridge positions...


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

darren said:


> Not if the neck is designed right.
> 
> 28.625" scale is two frets longer than a 25.5" scale neck.



So?

That idea is actually brilliant IMO. This might work out great.

For the bolt-on model we could have three different models that use the same exact body:

25.5" model with 24 frets
27" model with 25 frets
28.625" model with 26 frets

I'm not going to make any promises, but I will see what I can do.


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## Krankguitarist (Mar 11, 2009)

DrewsifStalin said:


> this is retarded. you cant have an 8 string in 25.5 the intonation will be shit beyond shit.



Can't imagine there would be many problems with intonation if someone was to use a High-A string.


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## djohns74 (Mar 11, 2009)

My only practical concern with different length necks on the same body would be balance of the final instrument.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

The extra length compared to the regular Intrepid neck would only be 3.125" on the 28.625" neck and 1.5" on the 27" neck.

The longer one might be a little neck-heavy but I bet the 27 especially would be fine.

I know there exist baritone-scale conversion necks and people buy them, so my thought is they can't be that bad. Anyone ever had a problem with one before?


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## Emperoff (Mar 11, 2009)

For god's sake, not a kahlers please, they're just fugly 



DrewsifStalin said:


> this is retarded. you cant have an 8 string in 25.5 the intonation will be shit beyond shit.



I agree 100&#37;


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## Galius (Mar 11, 2009)

I want one....but 28-30 scale length.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

Emperoff said:


> For god's sake, not a kahlers please, they're just fugly
> 
> 
> 
> I agree 100%



Kahler is the -only- 8-string tremelo system on the market today. Not only that, but it can be set to fixed-bridge mode with the turn of a screw similar to the Parker vibrato bridge.

*Question for those who say 25.5" 8-string will not work/intonate/whatever:

Have you actually tried one?*

I see this talk all of the time on this forum, but I have not seen a single example of someone providing evidence for that claim.

I _have_, however, seen folks in the main Intrepid thread having problems intonating the first string on their _28.625"_ guitars... If you go to 30" that is only going to get worse.


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 11, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Exciting News!
> 
> Kurt and I are working on specs for a pair of 8-string _Interceptors_!
> 
> ...


:haha that mockup is awful in OP's post. Sorry, i just found it hilarious, but I did have my wisdom teeth removed earlier today and am staying drugfull for as long as possible so that may play a part in it. I haven't voted yet, mostly because I think that they should both be 27" I would like to try an alder, neck through, 27" pro though (mostly becaue I'm already getting a mohogany Intrepid and would like a little variation in sound). I would also NOT like a locking nut, but I don't reallu think I'd need the tremelo either... I just like the body shape and loved the feel of my Intrepid.

Here's my Ideal:
27" scale
neck through
Alder
Dark/deep purple trans finish (if trans is short for transparent)
Black hardware
Dual Cepheus
NO TREMELO (I'm just saying.  this is after all, MY ideal) :

Taking into account what Darren said about alder... I'd say... That I still want to try the alder. I might just have to change my playing style a bit. Last thing, if this has a locking nutt, I won't be buying one. Will it?


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

Hey I spent like an hour on that in MS Paint! 

The locking nut is definitely going to be on there. If you really don't want it you could quite easily put a regular nut in its place. Hell, I would do it for you for free if you paid for shipping and the new nut...


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 11, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Hey I spent like an hour on that in MS Paint!
> 
> The locking nut is definitely going to be on there. If you really don't want it you could quite easily put a regular nut in its place. Hell, I would do it for you for free if you paid for shipping and the new nut...


You're a good man.  I just change tunings too often to want to mess with that.:
EDITlus I've never messed with them before and I'd like too mess around with and learn on one before I commit to paying for it, ya know?
DOUBLE EDIT: And it looks great. I'm just legally high right now... That must be why I think it looks great.  I'm just joking. That's the most I expected when I read "MS Paint" anyway. I'm proud of you, son. I have to go take more medicine now.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

I totally understand. Starting out with one of the most complicated bridges as your first trem is probably not the greatest idea in the world.

Also, I had my wisdom teeth removed a few years ago so I remember the Vicodin effect. Good stuff! No pain whatsoever for me.


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## eegor (Mar 11, 2009)

Yes, if you make a 30" with 27 frets I would love you.


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## Mike_F (Mar 11, 2009)

Maybe make a model without a Kahler?
i agree 27 frets would be awesome, but with a 27" scale.

One of the finishes should be the bloodburst over a flame maple top.


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## troyguitar (Mar 11, 2009)

Mike_F said:


> Maybe make a model without a Kahler?
> i agree 27 frets would be awesome, but with a 27" scale.
> 
> One of the finishes should be the bloodburst over a flame maple top.



Just in case you didn't know, the Kahler can be locked down with the turn of a screw making it just a big fixed-bridge. Yeah I know it would be adding to the cost for people who only want a hardtail, but making two separate models increases the cost for everyone due to the increased labor and materials costs.

27-frets isn't going to happen on a 27" unless you get a custom.

Bloodburst - I don't know. I don't know the sales numbers for the various finishes nor how many different finishes Kurt will be able to do for each model (if any).


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 12, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Just in case you didn't know, the Kahler can be locked down with the turn of a screw making it just a big fixed-bridge. Yeah I know it would be adding to the cost for people who only want a hardtail, but making two separate models increases the cost for everyone due to the increased labor and materials costs.
> 
> 27-frets isn't going to happen on a 27" unless you get a custom.
> 
> Bloodburst - I don't know. I don't know the sales numbers for the various finishes nor how many different finishes Kurt will be able to do for each model (if any).


I didn't know that about the Kahler locking so that makes me lean towards buying it even more. And I can very much understand the cost reasons behind not offering both. So... is there a chance of a 30" or is that just people wanting one talking about it I'm recalling (drugses stillses)?


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## troyguitar (Mar 12, 2009)

30.5" has been requested once or twice, but it's not up for consideration in this particular run. 

I wouldn't be surprised if a 30.5" Intrepid comes at some point, but that one would definitely have a fixed bridge. 

I could be wrong, but I don't think there's a chance in hell of getting a low F# (or lower as people would be want to do with such a scale) to intonate on the current Kahler design. Even if it could intonate properly, there likely would not be enough range of motion in the saddles to also have the first string intonate correctly as well. And even if you solve that one somehow, there's the fact that a string that long tuned that low might not have any tuning stability at all with trem usage. (Though there exist trem systems for bass, so maybe it would work? Who knows)


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 12, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> 30.5" has been requested once or twice, but it's not up for consideration in this particular run.
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised if a 30.5" Intrepid comes at some point, but that one would definitely have a fixed bridge.
> 
> I could be wrong, but I don't think there's a chance in hell of getting a low F# (or lower as people would be want to do with such a scale) to intonate on the current Kahler design. Even if it could intonate properly, there likely would not be enough range of motion in the saddles to also have the first string intonate correctly as well. And even if you solve that one somehow, there's the fact that a string that long tuned that low might not have any tuning stability at all with trem usage. (Though there exist trem systems for bass, so maybe it would work? Who knows)


You mean to intonate properly at 30"-30.5" scale length right? Because if there's no chance of getting it to intonate at that low of a note, why the fuck build an 8 string with a kahler? This scares me being as my prefered tunign would be F standard. Please explain. Also, 30.5" Intrepid fixed bridge=sex.


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## troyguitar (Mar 12, 2009)

It's not a question of whether a single string will intonate, but whether there is enough range in the saddles to get both the highest and the lowest strings to intonate at the same time. Especially with people possibly wanting to tune to Drop E (EBEADGBE) and BEADGBEA on the same guitar.

If the 8th string, for example, needs to be 0.5" further away from the nut than the 1st string for them to both intonate properly but the Kahler saddles only have a range of 0.4" then you won't be able to do it.

I have to say that I don't know if this will actually be a concern yet (it's something I'll be testing this weekend) nor do I know for certain if scale length will actually affect it significantly.


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## Pewtershmit (Mar 12, 2009)

Is there seriously that much of a demand for a kahler 8 trem on one of these things? 

If this happens, and it comes down to two models of it, scale isn't nearly as important as trem / fixed. 

I bitch around with getting my lo pro 7 to intonate and sit correctly. I can't see any tech having fun setting up one of these.


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## somn (Mar 12, 2009)

why a 27 scale? ive see a big demand for 25 and 30 scales. 
i think you should put a poll for colors tho. i do think its cool that you included black.

with the kahlers i have played with ive needed to replace the 7th and 6th roller and string hooks to support strings that are wider and have wider ties at the ball end as some string brands did not fit. intonation has been great but with quality issues in rondo i would be on end. and the nut, an 80 is a very very tight fit i had to losen the built in string tree so it can fit but then an 80 at that scale is kinda tight at least for me. i dont see any good for a F at 25 as for a high A i couldnt tell you.

a 30 scale 8 string with a kahler painted blood burst over quilt would rock tho .


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## darren (Mar 12, 2009)

You could always do what we did with the Intrepid and ship it with a flat-mount bridge and the user can do an aftermarket Kahler mod. I honestly can't see a huge demand for 7-strings with Kahlers. An 8 with a Kahler might have more appeal, because it's the only 8-string trem out there. But i don't see people falling over themselves for an Agile with a Kahler. The bridge itself will likely be 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the guitar!


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## Galius (Mar 12, 2009)

what he said


darren said:


> You could always do what we did with the Intrepid and ship it with a flat-mount bridge and the user can do an aftermarket Kahler mod. I honestly can't see a huge demand for 7-strings with Kahlers. An 8 with a Kahler might have more appeal, because it's the only 8-string trem out there. But i don't see people falling over themselves for an Agile with a Kahler. The bridge itself will likely be 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the guitar!


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## amassivetree (Mar 12, 2009)

I think I might have voted too soon (against both options). After thinking about it some more, I think I could live with a 27" scale after all. I'd like an ERG with a trem, and now that the interceptors are back in stock I'm itching to get one. If we could do something very close to the interceptor pro spec ( neck-thru, flame top. 27", red stain), I would totally jump on that.

I would push for the Kahler (maybe we need another poll), because as I mentioned in a previous thread, I'm half thinking of installing one now (and I'm very glad the intrepid was designed with this in mind), but am hesitant to cut up such a pretty guitar and be left with holes in the back. For people who are against the Kahler, is it because it is a trem, a locking trem, or specifically Kahler?

I would think that it would save a ton of time in trying to get this into production vs. trying to re-engineer or adapt an existing trem design to an eight, which seems like more work to tool up for than designing a strat-stype hardtail bridge.


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## Cancer (Mar 12, 2009)

il_echthros_777 said:


> I voted neither simply because I think that the majority of the players are still getting the instrument to get the extended low range and 25.5 wont cut it. make both of them 27




While I could see 25.5 scale being great for shredders (high A) I really have to agree with this sentiment. Personally I think the 27" scale should be the minimum scale for any ERG 7 and up. 

The addition of the Kahler is pure genius. Not only is it a very functional bridge (I heard it can made hardtail with the turn of a screw now ....woot) it also resolves the tremolo install issues with the previous Interceptors had.

If this ends up going to production, I think I would buy this.

BTW, any chance of converting the current Interceptor Pros to Kahlers, that would rule.


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## troyguitar (Mar 12, 2009)

You don't think every wanktastic bedroom shredder in the world would want to have a trem-equipped 8-string? (I count myself as part of that group, no offense intended at all)

IIRC people on here seemed to be practically drooling over that one Ibanez LACS which has a trem.

Besides, the previous thread I did seemed to indicate that there were indeed people who were interested.


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## Cancer (Mar 12, 2009)

darren said:


> You could always do what we did with the Intrepid and ship it with a flat-mount bridge and the user can do an aftermarket Kahler mod. I honestly can't see a huge demand for 7-strings with Kahlers. An 8 with a Kahler might have more appeal, because it's the only 8-string trem out there. But i don't see people falling over themselves for an Agile with a Kahler. The bridge itself will likely be 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the guitar!



Not to hijack but I have to tell this story.....

I purchased a used Interceptor Pro 27 for Technomancer about 2-3 months ago, during the setup I snapped off one trem claws screws in the cavity (the drill holes were very tight, to the point were I stripped the original screws, replaced them, and then snapped one of the second set while adjusting it). That guitar is currently at a luthier, who while initially inspecting the guitar told me that "the trem route isn't very good" and showed me the places where the posts have been routed almost through the wood, and a couple of other issues.

My response "well, its a work in progress...."

Moral of the story, of all the issues about the Interceptor that have surfaced, and then been resolved, the trem installation remains to be one of it's biggest issues. The addition of Kahler not only resolves the installation issue, but on a perception level removed the last bit of "cheap" hardware on the Interceptor.

*My only hope is that they countersink the baseplate, that way they can keep the string height consistent with current Interceptors*.

Right now I'm debating about either blocking my current Interceptor, or installing a Kahler, I'll probably block it and be done, but if new Interceptor with Kahlers were released I would definitely purchase 2.


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## J-Twin (Mar 12, 2009)

Newbie here; so not sure how much my opinions count. But anyway, here's what I'm looking for:



whichever wood sounds best w/ low tunings (alder?)
ditto bolt/thru
shortest scale that would intonate properly w/ F# (or E?) I know this is controversial, but I'd really like 25.5" (I don't mind a little flub, hell, I'm used to doing low A on a 25.5 lol) that changeable neck idea seems brilliant!
Kahler USA Hybrid (I'd add one anyway)
non-locking nut (or changeable)
24 frets
ebony (preferably) or rosewood
dual passives
5-way switch (or 3-way linear that could be switched)
quilt maple option
transparent red option (blood burst? "tribal red"?)
black hardware option
About the Kahlers--I know the Halos [ducks] are a bit of a question mark, but they use them for super-low tunings, and super-wide tunings, too (like the 10-string).

Thanks for all your great info and work w/ Kurt!


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 12, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> It's not a question of whether a single string will intonate, but whether there is enough range in the saddles to get both the highest and the lowest strings to intonate at the same time. Especially with people possibly wanting to tune to Drop E (EBEADGBE) and BEADGBEA on the same guitar.
> 
> If the 8th string, for example, needs to be 0.5" further away from the nut than the 1st string for them to both intonate properly but the Kahler saddles only have a range of 0.4" then you won't be able to do it.
> 
> I have to say that I don't know if this will actually be a concern yet (it's something I'll be testing this weekend) nor do I know for certain if scale length will actually affect it significantly.


Oh okay, I got it know.


darren said:


> You could always do what we did with the Intrepid and ship it with a flat-mount bridge and the user can do an aftermarket Kahler mod. I honestly can't see a huge demand for 7-strings with Kahlers. An 8 with a Kahler might have more appeal, because it's the only 8-string trem out there. But i don't see people falling over themselves for an Agile with a Kahler. The bridge itself will likely be 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the guitar!


I'm feeling this.


somn said:


> why a 27 scale? ive see a big demand for 25 and 30 scales.
> i think you should put a poll for colors tho. i do think its cool that you included black.
> 
> with the kahlers i have played with ive needed to replace the 7th and 6th roller and string hooks to support strings that are wider and have wider ties at the ball end as some string brands did not fit. intonation has been great but with quality issues in rondo i would be on end. and the nut, an 80 is a very very tight fit i had to losen the built in string tree so it can fit but then an 80 at that scale is kinda tight at least for me. i dont see any good for a F at 25 as for a high A i couldnt tell you.
> ...


Yeah, we've had the break the ice 8 string (Intrepids), and now the break the ice 8 string with trem and smaller scale (Interceptors), Now when do we get the 8 string with even further extended scale(30"-30.5")? I've seen people mentioning this since the beggining, why not this? Better question: When this?


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## somn (Mar 12, 2009)

darren said:


> You could always do what we did with the Intrepid and ship it with a flat-mount bridge and the user can do an aftermarket Kahler mod. I honestly can't see a huge demand for 7-strings with Kahlers. An 8 with a Kahler might have more appeal, because it's the only 8-string trem out there. But i don't see people falling over themselves for an Agile with a Kahler. The bridge itself will likely be 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of the guitar!





Galius said:


> what he said



come to think of it i forgot that the current 8s are set for after market mods such as the kahler i gotta give props to darren to that


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## djohns74 (Mar 12, 2009)

Hey all, I talked to Troy earlier and volunteered to do some mock-ups for this project since he was asking about that earlier. I'm certainly no darren when it comes to these things but I think I can get the basic idea across with your help, plus I generally have the time to make tweaks going forward as you guys decide what features you want.

Here's my first stab at it. It should all be pretty darn close to proper scale, and of course some things, like the knobs and pickups, are obviously just placeholders. Also, darren, I apologize in advance for stealing your tuners.  I have to make new ones eventually anyway to support multiple hardware colors.

Let me know what you think.


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## MF_Kitten (Mar 12, 2009)

djohns74 said:


>



I would add that adding white or cream binding to that would be sweet as hell, and if you´re making it non-binding, then aving it totally matte/satin would look good.

i dunno about the specs of it, it´s not really my taste, but stylistically there´s a bunch of things that would look great 

so yeah. entirely red would be cool if it was matte, gloss would be nicer with binding, and matte red would look nice with binding too, obviously.

the direction of the tuners looks a bit weird, they´re all angled upwards... angle them straight out or a bit downwards, maybe?

"arched" top would look nice.

other than that, most of the interceptor/septor models would look nice as 8 string models, with the tribal red, green, purple, and trans black.


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## bulletbass man (Mar 12, 2009)

DrewsifStalin said:


> this is retarded. you cant have an 8 string in 25.5 the intonation will be shit beyond shit.
> 
> Plus im gonna end up buying a standard since its the version with the passive style route, please dont make me stuck with a 25.5 inch scale


 
I'm pretty sure these were in mind to be used with a high A. THough I don't know how well they would handle a kahler.

Either way I think both should be 27" personally.


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## Tombinator (Mar 12, 2009)

Aye, I'm voting for a 27" scale for both the standard and pro versions. An ebony fretboard would also be prime for the pro model.


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## Urbane (Mar 12, 2009)

if there 27" were gonna be forced to use o4plus strings for the high A or even G because i dont think a normal one will work will it?


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## djohns74 (Mar 12, 2009)

I knew I was forgetting something that makes the Interceptor what it is. A carved top! Wasn't completely sure how to pull that off in Photoshop, but here's a stab at it on a 27" Natural Pro. I also have a dark stain effect that I'm working on that's looking somewhat interesting. Fancy tops will be needed as well, though I always like the look of the neck thru wood showing through too.


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## Mike_F (Mar 12, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> I knew I was forgetting something that makes the Interceptor what it is. A carved top! Wasn't completely sure how to pull that off in Photoshop, but here's a stab at it on a 27" Natural Pro. I also have a dark stain effect that I'm working on that's looking somewhat interesting. Fancy tops will be needed as well, though I always like the look of the neck thru wood showing through too.


I'd be game for one just like that
But it would be killer if you did a mockup of that guitar, but with a flame maple top and a bloodburst finish.


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 13, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> I knew I was forgetting something that makes the Interceptor what it is. A carved top! Wasn't completely sure how to pull that off in Photoshop, but here's a stab at it on a 27" Natural Pro. I also have a dark stain effect that I'm working on that's looking somewhat interesting. Fancy tops will be needed as well, though I always like the look of the neck thru wood showing through too.


Gorgeous. Ebony board on the pro models=YES!


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## Cancer (Mar 13, 2009)

highlordmugfug said:


> Gorgeous. Ebony board on the pro models=YES!



Me likey....


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## Justin Bailey (Mar 13, 2009)

that was my vision of the original agile 8, maybe this can be the model for the interceptor 8.

Pay no attention to the wood/construction of the one, its just a quick mockup.

for the standard I was thinking alder or maybe ash body wood, maple neck, maple and rosewood fretboards, maybe dual and single pickuped versions


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## somn (Mar 13, 2009)

I've noticed alot of people are dreaming of a ERG 8 string carve toped blood burst. if ur doing this for everyone try considering this alot of us here want a black, bloodburst, or some bright color. A 27 and 30 scale seems just right as those custom high A string would still work at a 27 scale.


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## J-Twin (Mar 13, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> I knew I was forgetting something that makes the Interceptor what it is. A carved top!



Oh, yes, I forgot to mention that, too. I'm highly in favor of a carved top.  I believe the existing Interceptor body is flat enough on top to still use the flat mount Kahler, but I could be wrong.

I think binding would be great, too.

I love the 4x4 tuner arrangement, rather than the inverted in-lines I've seen on other Interceptors. 

Would it be possible to have three knobs: vol/vol/tone? I'd like that and a sliding selector switch.


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## djohns74 (Mar 13, 2009)

Here's the latest mock-ups I've been working on. The first three are essentially based on existing Interceptor models since most of those seem to be fairly popular. I went with a generic quilt top to get the idea of Tribal Blue and Red variants and a transparent black over flame top.

Bloodburst, at least how the actual finish looks on the Intrepids, is proving a difficult one to pull off, so I came up with a really dark red over the flame top that I think looks pretty neat. Finally, I liked Darren's Lizardburst a lot and was sorry it didn't make the final cut, so I decided to attempt a flame top version here for kicks.


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## Urbane (Mar 13, 2009)

that last one looks awesome actually


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## eegor (Mar 13, 2009)

They all look good. The Lizard Burst looks absolutely fantastic with that body shape and the maple fretboard.


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## demolisher (Mar 13, 2009)

NUMBER 3!


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 13, 2009)

Well done, man! Those look amazing, wish I could afford to rock them all!


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## FlamesOfDestiny (Mar 13, 2009)

The first and last ones look awesome!!!


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 13, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> Here's the latest mock-ups I've been working on. The first three are essentially based on existing Interceptor models since most of those seem to be fairly popular. I went with a generic quilt top to get the idea of Tribal Blue and Red variants and a transparent black over flame top.
> 
> Bloodburst, at least how the actual finish looks on the Intrepids, is proving a difficult one to pull off, so I came up with a really dark red over the flame top that I think looks pretty neat. Finally, I liked Darren's Lizardburst a lot and was sorry it didn't make the final cut, so I decided to attempt a flame top version here for kicks.


OMFGYES!!
Please make lizardburst. Please make lizardburst. I WANT.


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## Sir Euric (Mar 13, 2009)

I would definitely buy the black flame and the lizard burst, if they ever make them


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## amassivetree (Mar 13, 2009)

Those all look great! I esp like the tribal red, dark red, and black, but would be happy with any of them.


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## J-Twin (Mar 14, 2009)

Is it just me or do some Interceptors have pointer horns? Personally, I'm partial to the more rounded ones, or even Agile's PS body. Also, from the pics of Interceptor 7-strings w/ Floyds I think the top is flat enough for the Kahler.











Thanks for making those mock ups, Dave. They look awesome!


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## darren (Mar 14, 2009)

I think it was the second or third run of Interceptors, they went with more of a "Soloist" style body than the "RG" style body. I like these ones a lot as well, but to be honest, i think the pointier horns suit the overall design a bit better, with the angular, pointy headstock.


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## Rommel (Mar 14, 2009)

I like the pointier horns on the current Septors/Interceptors. As Darren mentioned it suits the look better. I wonder if Kurt could have the builder put the upper horn's strap button placed on the back instead of the usual location.

The mockups look nice too, especially that Lizardburst Flame.


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## djohns74 (Mar 14, 2009)

It may be worth noting that I originally made a reverse 8 in-line headstock for this to keep it more in-line with the existing Interceptor design. If we're thinking about making the design pointier, that might be a better fit. 

My experience with my Intrepid makes me suspect that issues with string length would limit the use of an in-line headstock to scale lengths of 27" or less, unless you're using bass strings for the bottom couple, but I think shorter scale (25.5 - 27) seems to be the main focus here anyway. 

An thoughts on either the look or the practicality here?


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## troyguitar (Mar 14, 2009)

My 25.5" 7-string with an in-line reverse headstock can barely accommodate a regular string on the low B. I don't think an in-line headstock will work very well.


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## Våd Hamster (Mar 14, 2009)

djohns74 said:


>




HAVE MERCY!  

I'd sell the other half of my soul for that. Where is the pup switch though? 





darren said:


> I think it was the second or third run of Interceptors, they went with more of a "Soloist" style body than the "RG" style body. I like these ones a lot as well, but to be honest, i think the pointier horns suit the overall design a bit better, with the angular, pointy headstock.





The rounded shape looks way too much like the C7 design IMO (not that there's anything wrong in that, I just already have one )

Oh yeah, and, make both the standard and pro 27 scale. It fits the low B better IMO, and generally I just think 25.5" 7s look disproportionate. Can't imagine that with an 8


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## ledzep4eva (Mar 14, 2009)

PLEASE offer a hardtail option!!


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## eegor (Mar 14, 2009)

I agree, a hardtail option would be good. Either a Hipshot or an Agile-designed recessed TOM style bridge would be optimal.


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## troyguitar (Mar 14, 2009)

What do you guys have against the built-in lockdown mechanism on the Kahler?


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## djohns74 (Mar 14, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> What do you guys have against the built-in lockdown mechanism on the Kahler?


For one thing, it'd be awfully expensive for a fixed bridge if that's the only way you'll ever use it.


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## Cancer (Mar 14, 2009)

ledzep4eva said:


> PLEASE offer a hardtail option!!




The Intrepid currently fulfills this need, does it not?


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 14, 2009)

I'm pretty sure that the kahler is half the point of this. The point of the Intrepid was to have an 8 string and the point of these Interceptors are to have an 8 string with a Kahler. I'd prefer a hardtail as well, but that's not what they are going for I believe.


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## Justin Bailey (Mar 14, 2009)

highlordmugfug said:


> I'm pretty sure that the kahler is half the point of this. The point of the Intrepid was to have an 8 string and the point of these Interceptors are to have an 8 string with a Kahler. I'd prefer a hardtail as well, but that's not what they are going for I believe.



the reason why the intrepids fretboard radius is 15 is so people can retrofit the kahler 8 to it.


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## eegor (Mar 14, 2009)

highlordmugfug said:


> I'm pretty sure that the kahler is half the point of this. The point of the Intrepid was to have an 8 string and the point of these Interceptors are to have an 8 string with a Kahler. I'd prefer a hardtail as well, but that's not what they are going for I believe.



Yes, I understand this. But It'd be cool if Kurt were to make it so both of these guitars had both options, so those of us that want Interceptor body shapes with hardtail bridges can have them, and those of us that want Intrepid body shapes with Kahlers bridges without having to retrofit can have those as well.

Oh well, I guess that's what the custom shop is for.


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 14, 2009)

Justin Bailey said:


> the reason why the intrepids fretboard radius is 15 is so people can retrofit the kahler 8 to it.


Yeah, but they didn't offer one that CAME with a kahler. Now they do. By your logic there's no reason to make one with a kahler because people can just add it to the Intrepid. I meant that the first was an offer of a cheap production 8. This is an offer of a cheap production 8 with a kahler.


eegor said:


> Yes, I understand this. But It'd be cool if Kurt were to make it so both of these guitars had both options, so those of us that want Interceptor body shapes with hardtail bridges can have them, and those of us that want Intrepid body shapes with Kahlers bridges without having to retrofit can have those as well.
> 
> Oh well, I guess that's what the custom shop is for.


It would be cool, but it would also be expensive and possibly a loss of profit being as not everyone wants one or the other. And yes that is what the custom shop is for. Perhaps one day we can get all the models with all the various options as productions. But first, interest must be judged and everything has to be tested out.
Give it time young fellows. Give it time.


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## J-Twin (Mar 14, 2009)

V&#229;d Hamster;1419700 said:


> The rounded shape looks way too much like the C7 design IMO (not that there's anything wrong in that, I just already have one )



Yeah, I think I'm wanting a C-8 w/ a Kahler, but w/o the expense and pain of adding the Kahler (and w/o the 808s & their weird routs).


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 14, 2009)

I think the pro model should come with the kahler and the standard should come with the agile low cost version of the kahler, I mean is it really so hard to turn the screw and convert the guitar back to fixed bridge? I guess it depends on how much it costs kurt to develop the low cost kahler...


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 14, 2009)

I prefer the pointier one myself. Lizardburst hell yeah.


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## J-Twin (Mar 14, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> It may be worth noting that I originally made a reverse 8 in-line headstock for this to keep it more in-line with the existing Interceptor design. If we're thinking about making the design pointier, that might be a better fit.
> 
> My experience with my Intrepid makes me suspect that issues with string length would limit the use of an in-line headstock to scale lengths of 27" or less, unless you're using bass strings for the bottom couple, but I think shorter scale (25.5 - 27) seems to be the main focus here anyway.
> 
> An thoughts on either the look or the practicality here?



Aesthetically I'm partial to the 4/side, but maybe y'all don't agree...


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## eegor (Mar 14, 2009)

You know, as far as options go, why doesn't Kurt pull a Carvin? Turn these kinds of things into a customizable production model with various options, having people pre-order their guitar based on given options (like his custom shop already is), and then make a few "in-stock" guitars with various options put on them that people can order if they don't want to wait. I'm no businessman, so I wouldn't know if this a practical, or even doable, idea for Kurt to engage at the moment, but it makes sense to me.

And I don't mean every model he has available, I'm referring solely to 7's and 8's, merely because no one else really does this kind of thing with extended-range guitars.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 14, 2009)

eegor said:


> You know, as far as options go, why doesn't Kurt pull a Carvin? Turn these kinds of things into a customizable production model with various options, having people pre-order their guitar based on given options (like his custom shop already is), and then make a few "in-stock" guitars with various options put on them that people can order if they don't want to wait. I'm no businessman, so I wouldn't know if this a practical, or even doable, idea for Kurt to engage at the moment, but it makes sense to me.
> 
> And I don't mean every model he has available, I'm referring solely to 7's and 8's, merely because no one else really does this kind of thing with extended-range guitars.



I really really like that idea 

except I don't want to be the one to tell the man how to run his business 

but man would everybody be happy!


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## eegor (Mar 14, 2009)

I'm not telling him how to run his business, I'm perfectly happy with how he does it. I'm just speaking speculatively.

I wouldn't have 3 out my 4 guitars if it wasn't for him (or this forum, but that's a different matter).

Now, back on topic, I'm not sure how I feel about the locking nut. I've never been a fan of those because any time I decide to use the first fret, whether it be a chord or riff or whatever, my hand keeps hitting it and it hurts quite a bit. Is there any way that could get replaced with locking tuners? Or does the Kahler trem work in such a way that it has to have a locking nut?


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## Pewtershmit (Mar 14, 2009)

locking bridge w/o locking nut = fail


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## eegor (Mar 14, 2009)

Issue resolved.


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## amassivetree (Mar 15, 2009)

I really dont think there is going to be an Agile knockoff of the Kahler.

First, because there are at least 3 lines of Kahler trems out there: the expensive USA one described in this thread ($a lot), the hybrid (which is a mix of US and foreign parts, and costs $259 for an 8, retail Kahler 7328 eight string tremolo system), and the X-trem, which is only available OEM for imports. The ESP/LTD Hanneman series for example, features all three: the X-trem on the low-cost bolt on, the hybrid on the nicer LTD, and the USA on the ESP version. 

The reason Kahler disappeared in the 90s was due to lawsuits, including some legal battles in the early 90s fighting Asian knockoffs Bridge-maker Kahler crafts resurrection that truly resonates | The San Diego Union-Tribune). I doubt they are going to let them be copied again without a fight, and it doesn't make sense to tool up to make a handful of very strange tremolos. 

Also, I dont understand why anyone would want a locking trem without a locking nut. A good question might be, do we want a Kahler (behind the nut, easier to manufacture/harder to screw up) or a Floyd locknut (as on the new BC Riches with Kahlers, for example).


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## Cancer (Mar 15, 2009)

amassivetree said:


> I really dont think there is going to be an Agile knockoff of the Kahler.
> 
> First, because there are at least 3 lines of Kahler trems out there: the expensive USA one described in this thread ($a lot), the hybrid (which is a mix of US and foreign parts, and costs $259 for an 8, retail Kahler 7328 eight string tremolo system), and the X-trem, which is only available OEM for imports. The ESP/LTD Hanneman series for example, features all three: the X-trem on the low-cost bolt on, the hybrid on the nicer LTD, and the USA on the ESP version.
> 
> ...



To keep the price down, I would say go with the LFR locknut, its cheap, easy to get and replace, and (most importantly) takes a greater variance of string gauges.

If this was the 90's, when the Kahler Flyer was the equivalent of what the Xtrem is today (import), then I would totally against it, but after seeing pictures of the Xtrem is looks like the fairly same spec, where the old Kahler Flyer looked (and was) noticeably cheaper. That being said, I honestly haven't tried a Kahler since they've reappeared, but I do know that the LFR install has to go. The Interceptor as it stands, holds it own against ANY popular production ERG IMO, but the LFR installation has been its Achilles heel.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 19, 2009)

Is it possible that they could make it so that the kahler is easy to install as an aftermarket mod but we use a cheap agile bridge that is designed to be easily replaced by the kahler, would that help the pricing?


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## AeonSolus (Mar 19, 2009)

I'm pretty sure the kahler debate is not because of the price it adds to the actual final product, but because of the looks of it isn't it maybe? This one is about functionally and versatility. For example, Van Halen IMO has the ugliest guitar in the business, being it the wolfgang-type body or the partscaster, yet he made history and played the hell out of them, plus It's a "Shredder" guitar, it *NEEDS* a trem to fill that concept (and please don't drop the paul gilbert bomb, he's something else , plus back in the day he used them too ) i'm pretty sure that Petrucci can go out and play a Hello kitty guitar and the looks won't make his playing anyworse (but his pride will be sent to hell ), if anyone thought i was too blunt, Don't feel offended or anything, just saying.


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## amassivetree (Mar 19, 2009)

AeonSolus said:


> I'm pretty sure the kahler debate is not because of the price it adds to the actual final product, but because of the looks of it isn't it maybe? This one is about functionally and versatility. For example, Van Halen IMO has the ugliest guitar in the business, being it the wolfgang-type body or the partscaster, yet he made history and played the hell out of them, plus It's a "Shredder" guitar, it *NEEDS* a trem to fill that concept (and please don't drop the paul gilbert bomb, he's something else , plus back in the day he used them too ) i'm pretty sure that Petrucci can go out and play a Hello kitty guitar and the looks won't make his playing anyworse (but his pride will be sent to hell ), if anyone thought i was too blunt, Don't feel offended or anything, just saying.



The main rationale I think (to summarize a few threads) is that it is the only eight-string tremolo on the market and the Kahler is designed to be easy to install. Someone said in one of these threads that the only issue people really have with the Interceptor Pro is the trem. Not only is it only a licensed Floyd, but there have been some people who had issues with the installation (routing for the posts, and in the first run spring cavity in back could have been shallower). The Kahler routing doesn't need to be as precise, and removes less wood : there is no need to cut a spring cavity in the back of the guitar. On fulcrum tremolos (strat / floyd / etc) there is a very weak point between the spring/bridge cavity and bridge pickup, with a hole going clean though the guitar (where the posts mount). The Kahler avoid this vulnerability (I've had a few cheap guitars break here, and its another point you need very precise installation work). Some people also just plain like Kahlers ( I nearly got an LTD hanneman before I decided I needed more strings (thanks guys!)).I think these are also the reasons why there is a parallel Kahler-interceptor thread in the seven string forum right now.


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## TMM (Mar 21, 2009)

So long as they look like this, I'm all for it:


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## JonnHatch (Mar 21, 2009)

goth_fiend said:


> I must say the standard being 25.5" and the pro going 27" sounds fine, I would perfer a 30" scale, but thats what customs are for right? I might be on the ship for this depending on price, but I will say this the pro should be quilt topped!




Please God NO on the quilt top!! Flame all the way. If there is flame i will buy 2.


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## amassivetree (Mar 24, 2009)

What is the status of this project? Have people asked kurt? It seems there is a rough consensus of specs here, basically an interceptor pro with a kahler and extra string, and maybe a shorter neck.


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## kurtzentmaier (Mar 24, 2009)

amassivetree said:


> What is the status of this project? Have people asked kurt? It seems there is a rough consensus of specs here, basically an interceptor pro with a kahler and extra string, and maybe a shorter neck.



Put intrepid pre-orders page up just today. Trying to workout final details on Interceptor 8s - but with Frankfurt coming up, lots to get done... Will try to have something up tomorrow - thinking of a Septor 8 (fixed bridge) and Interceptor 8 (Kahler) both available in 25.5 and 27". Both with Bolt on and neck through. Working out final variations / options / details now. Want to try to have something for everyone without driving factory crazy with too many options. Kahler: Checked samples of Hybrid and all Chinese versions. As a result, will be using Kahler Pro (ALL USA made) version. Also worked out a great price with Kahler late last week. So it's looking good. 

Kurt


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## eegor (Mar 24, 2009)

Sounds good! Thanks for the update.


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## Justin Bailey (Mar 24, 2009)

wow, very awesome to hear! Thanks for the update, Kurt! One of my main put offs about the intrepid was the body shape, but now that these may see the light of day I may just have to get one, provided I can find the funds.


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## Cancer (Mar 25, 2009)

kurtzentmaier said:


> Put intrepid pre-orders page up just today. Trying to workout final details on Interceptor 8s - but with Frankfurt coming up, lots to get done... Will try to have something up tomorrow - thinking of a Septor 8 (fixed bridge) and Interceptor 8 (Kahler) both available in 25.5 and 27". Both with Bolt on and neck through. Working out final variations / options / details now. Want to try to have something for everyone without driving factory crazy with too many options. Kahler: Checked samples of Hybrid and all Chinese versions. As a result, will be using Kahler Pro (ALL USA made) version. Also worked out a great price with Kahler late last week. So it's looking good.
> 
> Kurt



Dude, seriously. No lie, no bs, no messing around. You build this (Interceptor 8, 27, Kahler bridge). I'm in for 2. Also, not to derail, definitely considering changing the bridge on the Interceptor 7's to Kahler's too, IMO it would resolve the last issue on a really great guitar.


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## kurtzentmaier (Mar 25, 2009)

Justin Bailey said:


> wow, very awesome to hear! Thanks for the update, Kurt! One of my main put offs about the intrepid was the body shape, but now that these may see the light of day I may just have to get one, provided I can find the funds.



You are not the only one. I Got a lot of custom order requests for the Interceptor in an 8, but custom pricing to build just one was too high for most people. So that means we must do it as part of regular production.

kurt


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## troyguitar (Mar 25, 2009)

<Troy runs off to see if it's too late to cancel his Schecter order>

I'll be buying one Interceptor-825 - two if I can cancel my C7 HR FR order from Guitar Center...


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## vansinn (Mar 25, 2009)

I hope you'll excuse me for this additional suggestion, now that Kurt has already posted that work is in progress - which I think is simply great news!

Shredders have expressed wanting the shorter scale and chuggers a longer scale.
Not all shredders will add that A4 string, but rather downtune, and it also seems many chuggers would like an even longer scale.

So.. keeping everything else as already detailed by Kurt, why not build the two scale versions in 26" and 27.5" / 28" ?

The rationales being:

Shredding on a 26" will feel just about as on a 25.5", but that extra half inch might make low end string selections easier, especially for those of us wanting a crisp tone, and having the top A4 string should be just as dooable with one of Gerry's strings anyways.
(I've mentioned before I'd postinstall two Sperzel drop tuners and have the A4 string)

Based on reading the previous threads/polls, it seems to me many chuggers will like the longer 27.5" or 28" scale, especially when downtuning.

I'm also thinking such a scale lineup may better distinguish this new series from the existing Agile series.


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## Fred (Mar 25, 2009)

TMM said:


> So long as they look like this, I'm all for it:



Bahaha, thanks dude, but that's exactly what I'm praying these things don't look like!

Ah well, at least I have a hardtail, bolt-on and 30" scale, .

I would be horrifically tempted by the 27" Lizardburst though, must admit... Never owned a guitar with a trem in my life but hell, why not!


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## troyguitar (Mar 25, 2009)

kurtzentmaier said:


> Kahler: Checked samples of Hybrid and all Chinese versions. As a result, will be using Kahler Pro (ALL USA made) version. Also worked out a great price with Kahler late last week. So it's looking good.
> 
> Kurt



Hey Kurt,

Just to clarify here, when you say Pro series do you mean the "2xx8" series available through Kahler directly or the "7xx8" Hybrid series?

If it's the former you might have even more orders than anticipated, those trems are REALLY expensive to buy as an individual consumer. I could see people buying them for the trem alone like some did with Kramers back in the 80's...


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## kurtzentmaier (Mar 25, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Hey Kurt,
> 
> Just to clarify here, when you say Pro series do you mean the "2xx8" series available through Kahler directly or the "7xx8" Hybrid series?
> 
> If it's the former you might have even more orders than anticipated, those trems are REALLY expensive to buy as an individual consumer. I could see people buying them for the trem alone like some did with Kramers back in the 80's...



PLanniing on Pro 2228 in black as of now.

Kurt


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## troyguitar (Mar 25, 2009)

Sexy. I think I need to buy two.


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## MF_Kitten (Mar 25, 2009)

i saw these on rondomusic just now. very interesting! my interest in 8+ string instruments includes long baritone scales though, so these wouldn&#180;t really work for me. i can imagine the excitement for people who like high a strings, or just shorter scales


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## Justin Bailey (Mar 25, 2009)

kurtzentmaier said:


> You are not the only one. I Got a lot of custom order requests for the Interceptor in an 8, but custom pricing to build just one was too high for most people. So that means we must do it as part of regular production.
> 
> kurt


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 25, 2009)

now for one of life's tougher questions, the 27 in black flame or blue


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## darren (Mar 25, 2009)

Great work, guys... that Septor 8 in natural ash looks


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## djohns74 (Mar 25, 2009)

Cool, that was a ridiculously fast turn-around time! 

Kurt, if you need any tweaks done to the mock-up or would like any other variations made, just let me know. I've already made a fixed bridge version in anticipation of that being offered. I could whip up full mock-ups of that in the other color options pretty easily, for example.


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## kurtzentmaier (Mar 25, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> Cool, that was a ridiculously fast turn-around time!
> 
> I could use a a mock-up of the Septor Standard 827 in black flame and BLue flame. i stuck a switch in on the mock ups that were done on the Interceptor 8s. I think those are good enough. Thanks!
> I put these up fast, but still I want to be very cautious on this first run. First under $800 8 string with trem and all... Not sure what problems we are going to run into.... and I have serious doubts about holding that $800 price on future runs. If I am not careful, this could be the only 8 string loss leader ever made!
> ...


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## MF_Kitten (Mar 25, 2009)

just curious here, but would it be possible sometime in the future to have a smaller run of 30" scale guitars? if not 8 strings, then 6 or 7 strings? i think that would be awesome! i&#180;ve got the AB-3500 28" scale baritone, and feel that even longer would be even nicer.

the active pickups in that, by the way, which electronics are they meant to go with, like what value pots should it have? mine came with 250k pots, which confused me.


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## EBH Jaymz (Mar 25, 2009)

can i get a link to the ordering of these? i just caught the thread and am not trying to run through all these pages!!!


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## kurtzentmaier (Mar 25, 2009)

MF_Kitten said:


> just curious here, but would it be possible sometime in the future to have a smaller run of 30" scale guitars? if not 8 strings, then 6 or 7 strings? i think that would be awesome! i&#180;ve got the AB-3500 28" scale baritone, and feel that even longer would be even nicer.
> 
> the active pickups in that, by the way, which electronics are they meant to go with, like what value pots should it have? mine came with 250k pots, which confused me.



If these sell ok and I can actually make a profit at $799 I don't see why not.

Agile Interceptor Standard 8 (Deposits for July Delivery)


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## MF_Kitten (Mar 25, 2009)

kurtzentmaier said:


> If these sell ok and I can actually make a profit at $799 I don't see why not.
> 
> Agile Interceptor Standard 8 (Deposits for July Delivery)



awesome


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## troyguitar (Mar 25, 2009)

Holy crap you got the Kahler Pro AND a TON of options and kept it at $800?

I might be buying 3 or 4 of these things...

This is turning out way better than I had hoped for.

When is the deadline to make my preorder?


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## djohns74 (Mar 25, 2009)

Here's some Septors. Added pickup selector and truss rod cover, changed to a non-locking nut and made the logo a little closer to realistic size and position. My version of ash doesn't look all that much like the real one pictured on the site, but what can you do. It wasn't really necessary since there's already a real picture there anyway, it was just for fun.


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## AgileLefty (Mar 25, 2009)

holy crap!!

kurt - can you PLEASE make just one model left handed? preferabley this one....

Agile Septor Standard 827 (Deposit for July Delivery) at HomeOld

i understand though if you want to see how the first run goes. i just hope these sell good so we can have a second run with some lefty options.

as always, you are the man!!!


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## cyril v (Mar 26, 2009)

holy hell that was fast... i guess i'll have to wait until the next run because i've already got something in the pipeline and i'm kinda low on cash...


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## Hollowway (Mar 26, 2009)

I can't get the site to load to look at those Interceptor down payments. I think all of SS.org is trying to get on that page. We're going to crash poor Kurt's site! We luvs our 8s!


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## darren (Mar 26, 2009)

Kurt, you should think about deleting the truss rod covers. They really are huge and ugly.


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 26, 2009)

Hollowway said:


> I can't get the site to load to look at those Interceptor down payments. I think all of SS.org is trying to get on that page. We're going to crash poor Kurt's site! We luvs our 8s!


 Yeah it won't let me on either  Quite bothersome actually. Everybody chill so I can check em out.


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## Hollowway (Mar 26, 2009)

OK, so I'm not sure which Interceptor 8 to get - and I want to see those colors. Is the Lizard Burst a new color? I don't see that on any of the 7 string Interceptors. The blue black and reds are there, but no green. Anyone have a live example of what this might look like?



highlordmugfug said:


> Yeah it won't let me on either  Quite bothersome actually. Everybody chill so I can check em out.



Hey, I just figured out that there's something wrong with the link itself scratch Try typing in manually Agile Interceptor Standard 8 (Deposits for July Delivery) at HomeOld and it should work. Or just go to rondomusic.com and click on the 8 string link at the top of the page. I got it to work that way and the site snapped right up.

edit: Huh, it won't let me type the URL directly into my post^^. It converts it to that weird link.


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## highlordmugfug (Mar 26, 2009)

Hollowway said:


> OK, so I'm not sure which Interceptor 8 to get - and I want to see those colors. Is the Lizard Burst a new color? I don't see that on any of the 7 string Interceptors. The blue black and reds are there, but no green. Anyone have a live example of what this might look like?
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, I just figured out that there's something wrong with the link itself scratch Try typing in manually Agile Interceptor Standard 8 (Deposits for July Delivery) at HomeOld and it should work. Or just go to rondomusic.com and click on the 8 string link at the top of the page. I got it to work that way and the site snapped right up.


Lizardburst was one of the colors that was voted on for one of the runs (second I think) that didn't get enough votes then but still kicks ass.

I WAS trying to go directly to rondomusic.com I didn't even try the links. It finally worked for me though. After like 30+ minutes.


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## troyguitar (Mar 26, 2009)

Lizardburst is my #1 choice. I'm going to buy:

Interceptor Standard 25.5" Lizardburst Maple fretboard

Interceptor Standard 25.5" Blue Flame, Maple fretboard

Then Maybe an Interceptor Pro 25.5" Rosewood board

and maybe a Septor 25.5" in Ash...


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## Hollowway (Mar 26, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Lizardburst is my #1 choice. I'm going to buy:
> 
> Interceptor Standard 25.5" Lizardburst Maple fretboard
> 
> ...



Yeah, I think I'm going to go with the Lizard Burst 25.5 too. I'd like to see it in person, but it's just too cool of a color to pass up either way . I'm still playing with the string tension applet to make sure I don't want to do the 27" scale. I think I'll put a high A on there, but I want the option of going back to the low F# if that extra high string jacks up my playing. I think I'll be alright with a 74 (or 75 or whatever) or something in that area, tho. The big thing is that I still have all these ukuleles around the house. Oh, wait, no - those are my six-strings. Either way they seem like a joke now, with all the 7s and 8s I'm getting!


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## Våd Hamster (Mar 26, 2009)

Ordering a Lizardburst 27 today.


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## darren (Mar 26, 2009)

Here's the original rendering of Lizard Burst on an Intrepid:


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## djohns74 (Mar 26, 2009)

Huh, looks quite a bit different with the flame. Also, my burst is a lot darker. I wonder what the final plan is, darker burst, flame/no flame? I think I went mostly off of memory when I made that mock-up.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 26, 2009)

Well that seals the deal, thanks darren, troy, dave and kurt, I just ordered the standard 27 lizard burst! I am so stoked!!!!!! Can't wait for the crazy super baritone run of these bad boys!


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## Justin Bailey (Mar 26, 2009)

these look awesome! I wonder would having a flat top single pickup version be easier and cheaper to manufacture? Because I think one of those would look awesome, offer it in natural and black stain, so people can get their meshuggah on.


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## mlp187 (Mar 26, 2009)

BONERJAM '09!!! HOLY SHIT!

I find that guitar (mock-up) very attractive.



darren said:


> Here's the original rendering of Lizard Burst on an Intrepid:


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## J-Twin (Mar 26, 2009)

Wow, these look amazing! Thanks Kurt!! 

Is there/will there be a Rosewood/Tribal Red/25.5" option? 

Do we know yet what the materials & grain patterns will be for the tops?

what about the nut, locking? non-locking?


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## Fred (Mar 26, 2009)

Agile Septor Standard 827 (Deposit for July Delivery) at HomeOld

No way... I recognise that guitar, haha! This is so fucking typical. Ah well, I guess the $430 extra I paid is pretty much covered by the the fact I got a 5-piece neck with 30" scale and 27 frets with ebony instead of rosewood. Still, would have jumped on one of these or the tremmed version had they been available last year!

As it is, I wish wish wish I could justify pulling the trigger for a 27" lizard burst! I'll have to wait for a second run, but at least by then we'll have seen how the real finishes turn out.


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## Tommy Van Dyke (Mar 26, 2009)

Fred said:


> Agile Septor Standard 827 (Deposit for July Delivery) at HomeOld
> 
> No way... I recognise that guitar, haha! This is so fucking typical. Ah well, I guess the $430 extra I paid is pretty much covered by the the fact I got a 5-piece neck with 30" scale and 27 frets with ebony instead of rosewood. Still, would have jumped on one of these or the tremmed version had they been available last year!
> 
> As it is, I wish wish wish I could justify pulling the trigger for a 27" lizard burst! I'll have to wait for a second run, but at least by then we'll have seen how the real finishes turn out.



Oh fred, me and the rest of the 8 string interceptor brigade applaud your bravery in getting this brute built. Shoot, think of the extra $450 as: 
$100 ebony fretboard upcharge
$100 30" scale increase
$200 bucks for getting that beast before everyone else, I hate the fact that I won't get to jam on mine until July (also making you the ring leader)
$50 for owning the most famous 8 string interceptor yet 

okay, thats reaching on the last two things but, hey, thanks for making this possible!


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## Fred (Mar 26, 2009)

Haha, really, I have absolutely nothing to feel sour about. Never been happier with a guitar, but I'm a penny-pinching Englishman - gotta find _something_ to whinge about, . Serious props to Kurt!


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## Hollowway (Mar 27, 2009)

So anyone have any idea how long these pre orders generally last? i.e. when do I have to sign up by?


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## J-Twin (Mar 27, 2009)

J-Twin said:


> Is there/will there be a Rosewood/Tribal Red/25.5" option?



Thanks, Kurt!!


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## troyguitar (Mar 27, 2009)

Hollowway said:


> So anyone have any idea how long these pre orders generally last? i.e. when do I have to sign up by?



I don't know, but I hope it lasts at least through next week so I can actually get my order(s) in!


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## JJ Rodriguez (Mar 27, 2009)

I'm trying to convince myself I don't need 8 strings right now


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## MFB (Mar 28, 2009)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> I'm trying to convince myself I don't need 8 strings right now



ONE OF US! ONE OF US! ONE OF US!


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## Adam (Mar 28, 2009)

MFB said:


> ONE OF US! ONE OF US! ONE OF US!



Gooble gobble!, gooble gobble!





But seriously under $800 wow


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## iShred92 (Apr 3, 2009)

Personally I prefer the look of ebony or rosewood necks to maple what do you think?


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## possumkiller (Apr 3, 2009)

totally diggin the rosewood


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## djohns74 (Apr 3, 2009)

iShred92 said:


> Personally I prefer the look of ebony or rosewood necks to maple what do you think?


Generally? I prefer the look of maple. On the Lizard Burst, I DEFINITELY prefer the look of maple. 

That's just me though, I know a lot of people around here have a series hard-on for ebony, which is cool, to each his own.


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## Hollowway (Apr 3, 2009)

djohns74 said:


> Generally? I prefer the look of maple. On the Lizard Burst, I DEFINITELY prefer the look of maple.
> 
> That's just me though, I know a lot of people around here have a series hard-on for ebony, which is cool, to each his own.


 

Yeah, I'm one of those who has a serious hard-on for ebony, but I actually like the maple on the Lizard. I could go for the ebony as well, but I'm not actually pissed off about the maple on that (like I usually am about maple). The only thing I'm not super thrilled with is that Agile maple typically is very white - not really maple in color. That being said, Ebony isn't likely an option for the 8s, so I'll take maple over rosewood anyday (that green is beggin for either maple or black - not brown).


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## Urbane (Apr 4, 2009)

on the interceptor pro i didnt realize he was putting EMG"s on it i thought he was going to go with the passives


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## iShred92 (Apr 5, 2009)

a 28.625 black flamed septor would be cool


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## daos_27 (Apr 6, 2009)

troyguitar said:


> Exciting News!
> 
> Kurt and I are working on specs for a pair of 8-string _Interceptors_!
> 
> ...


 
I would seriously recommend you do not use Alder! Alder has a very thin sound which would make the bottom end sound shit in a 7 string let alone an 8 i would not use Alder on anything... Stick with Mahogany or Ash. You can not go wrong with either and all Ash woods are pretty good quality and tend to be almost as light in weight as Alder but again Alder would be too light and the thing would be neck heavy... Really dont think it would work! 

Lastly i think you should use the flat mount kahlers not the pivoting kahlers and please make a few avaiable in Lefty with kahler trems at 27" scale the 25.5 makes no sense unless the users want to tune it like a 7 string with one extra high string on the bottom... 

They should all have the option of passive or active pickups and no more single bridge pickup only guitars! Cheers~


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## cvinos (Apr 6, 2009)

I'd like it to be 27". Finish a see through black on ash body. Black hardware. Neck through, definitely. Ebony fretboard. Passive pickups.

Well I'd also prefer a fixed bridge string through model.


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## amassivetree (Apr 6, 2009)

New posters, you know these are already up for pre-order at Rondo, right?


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## troyguitar (Apr 6, 2009)

FYI - these are available for preorder:

Agile Interceptor Standard 8 (Deposits for July Delivery) at HomeOld

Agile Interceptor Pro 8 (Deposits for July Delivery) at HomeOld

Agile Septor Standard 825 (Deposit for July Delivery) at HomeOld

Agile Septor Standard 827 (Deposit for July Delivery) at HomeOld


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## G0DLESSENDEAVOR (Apr 7, 2009)

I voted standard at a scale of 25.5 and pro at 27, there should be more length to the scale as these are eight strings, not fender strat's anymore. 27 to 30 is the best for an extended guitar. Of course I could just order a custom like I've being planning on but I want to experiment with Agile's first. 
I'd also go with darren's comment on the combination of wood's. The white solid or quilted top with gold hardware is a great option. I'm in love with Steve Vai's white jem and those option's will be the closest to an extended guitar.


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## J-Twin (Apr 8, 2009)

Hollowway said:


> So anyone have any idea how long these pre orders generally last? i.e. when do I have to sign up by?



Has anyone heard when the cut-off date is for getting in on this run?

Also, the Kahler 2228K is a studmount, right?  I was hoping for the flatmount.


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## vansinn (Apr 8, 2009)

^ according to Kahler, Tremolo and Bridge Specifications, the 2228 is a studmount; dunno if the 'K' version is different.

Apart from (me also) preferring flat rather than stud mount, another thing puzzeling me is the claimed need for a 15" radius due to the Kahler; in my book a flatter radius would be much preferable on a shredder axe.
AFAIK, Kahlers can be adjusted to a larger radius range, though the above page only says 'adjustable', not by how much (think I've seen this mentioned somewhere, but can't locate it).


EDIT: Thanks Troy, forgot to think nuts


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## troyguitar (Apr 8, 2009)

The bridge is indeed the studmount version. I believe K denotes the color.

Regarding the radius: The bridge is adjustable to a certain extent, but the range of its adjustment is centered at 15" and the locking nuts are made for a 15" radius so the only way to get a flatter radius would be to do a compound 15" - XX" (more $$$) or to have the locking nuts modified (not gonna happen unless you do it yourself).

15" is a relatively flat radius though... Warmoths standard compound radius is 10 - 16, Fender uses like 9.5, Gibson uses 12, and Jackson uses 12 - 16 or 14 - 16.


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## 006 (Apr 10, 2009)

I too would like to know when the cut-off is - I'm scraping the money together for a deposit on a standard!!!!!

~006+1(2?)

It was April 9 - TODAY ((((((((((((


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## kurtzentmaier (Apr 11, 2009)

Ok, had to cut orders off so we could get production done in time for the July ship date. People who put orders in ordered:

Interceptor Pro 8 Nat 27"
Interceptor Pro 8 Nat 25"
Interceptor Standard 8 Maple Fretboard 27" Scale Lizard Burst
Interceptor Standard 8 Maple Fretboard 25.5" Scale Lizard Burst
Interceptor Standard 8 Rosewood Fretboard 27" Scale Black Flame 
Septor (fixed bridge with Interceptor Body Style) 27" Scale Nat Ash
Septor (fixed bridge with Interceptor Body Style) 27" Scale Blue Flame

People voted with their wallets, so that's what we will produce in the first run. I will make a few extras of each type in case any flaws are found that the factory misses. There may be some extras available based on that for sale in July. Pricing is comming in higher than expected (my fault for rushing to try to have these ready for July) so those that got in on this received a one time low price. Depending on your comments and how these work out, we can start taking deposits for the next batch at the end of July or Early August.

Thanks everyone!
kurt


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## Eisi_dt (Apr 26, 2009)

The Interceptor Pro isn't available in the blue flame finish?


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## Meldville (Aug 10, 2009)

if only I could get that setpor in a lizard burst, I'd be a-movin' to 8s!


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## Dethfield (Aug 10, 2009)

i may be in the minority here, but the one thing i really want for an agile 8 string is abalone dot inlays on the maple necks. I dislike the lack of inlays


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## Meshugger (Aug 11, 2009)

...and i want a Tribal Red 8-string Interceptor with a reverse headstock and a rosewood/ebony fretboard. For some reason, i do not like the maple fretboard. 

/crosses fingers for the next Interceptor run


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## Hollowway (Aug 11, 2009)

Meshugger said:


> ...and i want a Tribal Red 8-string Interceptor with a reverse headstock and a rosewood/ebony fretboard. For some reason, i do not like the maple fretboard.
> 
> /crosses fingers for the next Interceptor run


 
I agree about the reversed headstock, but for me the "coolness" factor in a reverse comes from the angle. to me, the straight run of the strings on the Agile reverse makes it look pretty similar to the standard. I absolutely love the Jackson reverse, though.


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