# NGD - Kiesel Vader 7



## Chokey Chicken (Apr 14, 2015)

Crappy pictures first, then first impressions.






















And I particularly like the spider web looking deal going on in this picture:






I've literally only had it for a couple hours now, so you might chalk it up to the honeymoon phase, but I'm in love with this stupid thing. More so than I've ever been with any other guitar in fact. I seem to recall a picture of one next to an m8m (or m80m, I can't recall) where it was dwarfed in comparison. I figured it'd be fun to sit it next to two different short scale guitars (the 24.75 inch Gibson, and the 22.5 inch Fender) and it's still remarkably small in comparison. These things play insanely well, and I'm extremely excited to put some time in with it. The high fret access is some of the best I've ever experienced, similar to that of the KM7. I don't have a scale so I can't really weigh it, but the thing is light as a feather. (mine's not chambered either, so I'm interested in what a chambered one would feel like.) It's just a blast to play, and the pickups are definitely keepers in my opinion. Given the limited time I've spent with them, they're not insanely high output, and there's a good amount of high end bite. I found myself favoring, possibly for the first time ever, to fiddle with the tone knob instead of messing with the amp settings in order to clean it up a bit. With the tone knob set to 10 or 11 instead of 12, it gets you a really nice tone.

I was curious going into this as to how Kiesel would wire up the 5 way switch. It appears that the first position is bridge humbucking, the second position is the inside coil of the bridge pup, third position is both pups inside coils, fourth position neck pup inside coil, and fifth was neck humbucking. Again, I've only spent a very brief amount of time with the guitar, but given these coil options and the tone knob, you have an insane variety of sounds to work with. It sounds massive and clear with distortion, crunches like a motherfvcker, and the cleans are delightful. (coil split cleans are heaven to me.)

I had high hopes going into this guitar, and I certainly wasn't disappointed. One thing is beyond certain, and it's that this guitar has made Kiesel and Carvin guitars a surefire company for me to throw money at. If their other guitars look and play anywhere near as nicely as this guy does, I can definitely see a bunch more in my possession in the next few years.

I'll continue updating this thread if I run into any hiccups with it. I gave it a few looks over and everything seems to be in pretty good order. I can definitely tell that if you get aftermarket pickups that the ears/tabs are definitely going to need a trimming to fit in the routes, but honestly these pickups are absolutely beautiful and it'd be a shame if people want them swapped out. 

As for flaws, I haven't really run into any yet. The frets are perfect, every note rings out and there's not even a hint of sharp fret ends. The scale length, even for my girly hands, is a treat to play on. For anyone interested, I remember seeing a couple folks ask, I've tuned it down to Drop G and there was plenty of room to tune lower. The knobs turn like butter, and getting it in tune is a snap. Also, I'm not sure if I just lucked out or if the neck is insanely stable, but the guitar arrived perfectly in tune. Straight out of the shipping box I was able to play along with songs in standard tuning. The two things that I'd consider flaws on my guitar are the ever so slightly crooked side dots (12th fret is noticeable, 1 or 2 others may be slightly askew), and it looks like someone scratched the end of the hipshot "headstock." Certainly nothing worth getting worked up over, but they are indeed flaws. (The hipshot hardware is remarkable by the way.)

In the vein of decreebass' NGD, I'll post my specs/cost because why not.

7 STR VADER HEADLESS: $1249
BURL MAPLE TOP: $400
DEEP TRIPLE STEP STAIN: $0
TRANS NIGHT BURST: $40
NO TOP INLAYS-SIDE DOTS ONLY: $0
STAINLESS STEEL JUMBO FRETS: $40
DROP SHADOW LOGO SILVER/BLACK: $20
ULTIMATE SOFT HEADLESS CASE (which is a great case): $50
-$100 for the options discount.

That's $1699 total.

On top of that, I used a credit card that was just opened that gave you $200 statement credit if you spent over 1k in the first month, so I really only spent $1500 when all was said and done. Not bad for an American made guitar with a fancy schmancy top.

I'll hopefully post some sound clips, daylight pics, (damn overcast on and off today) and further impressions in the next couple of days after I spend some quality time with it.


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## JSanta (Apr 14, 2015)

FANTASTIC! I went for very similar specs on mine and I'm glad to see even something a bit simpler looks amazing. Super happy you finally received it


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## 77zark77 (Apr 14, 2015)

Beautiful ! Big big congrats !


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## feraledge (Apr 14, 2015)

Congrats on a fine NGD! 
Thanks for the write up and especially the comparison pics! Did you play it with a strap yet? Just curious how the smaller body sits on you when standing up compared to a full size guitar.


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## Alex Kenivel (Apr 14, 2015)

Finally got your stupid guitar! 

HNGD


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## HighGain510 (Apr 14, 2015)

Hoochie mama! That came out stellar man, major congrats! I really dig that finish against burl, if I do end up grabbing a Vader 8 I am likely going with either a flamed maple top or a burled maple top, and this one has me pushing more towards burl again!


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## pott (Apr 14, 2015)

Beautiful... That top is incredible.

It's crazy how those specs add-up. I keep trying to design one for less than 1.7k but there's just no way! Chambering and 5 piece necks are a must


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## IChuckFinleyI (Apr 14, 2015)

Nice!


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 14, 2015)

I've played it with a strap now and it balances perfectly. It's a tad bit weird though because the bridge is so far back, it definitely has a different feel compared to a standard guitar. Not a good or bad thing, imo, but it is different. Other than that it's not terribly different.

Not sure off hand what chambering or 5 pieces cost, but you'd shave $400 off if you skip the burl/figured top. Might entirely be possible to get something for ~$1700. I feel it's worth the price though considering what it's got going for it. My Les Paul cost right around 1800 and it's nothing terribly unique. Mediocre top, standard frets, standard/common bridge pieces/hardware.


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## JSanta (Apr 14, 2015)

Chokey Chicken said:


> I've played it with a strap now and it balances perfectly. It's a tad bit weird though because the bridge is so far back, it definitely has a different feel compared to a standard guitar. Not a good or bad thing, imo, but it is different. Other than that it's not terribly different.
> 
> Not sure off hand what chambering or 5 pieces cost, but you'd shave $400 off if you skip the burl/figured top. Might entirely be possible to get something for ~$1700. I feel it's worth the price though considering what it's got going for it. My Les Paul cost right around 1800 and it's nothing terribly unique. Mediocre top, standard frets, standard/common bridge pieces/hardware.



I am right around $1700 for mine, and I feel like I'm getting everything I want. Certainly doable.


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## lewstherin006 (Apr 14, 2015)

Congrats bro that top is extra awesome!


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## russmuller (Apr 14, 2015)

HOLY CRAP that thing is gorgeous!!!!! HNGD!!!!


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## ferret (Apr 14, 2015)

Fantastic, though I STILL can't quite get over the thing about the arm cut and tops.

Love the top itself though, and nightburst.

Are you using the top or bottom strap button on the end? I was a little uncomfortable till I switched to the bottom, and suddenly it felt natural.


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 14, 2015)

Just posted in your thread about the strap button. Bottom button really seems the way to go. 

As for the top cut off, I'm not really bothered by it, though I can understand why some folks are opposed to it. The bevel is really cozy though, and I'd hate to see a blocky version for the sake of having a drop top.


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## decreebass (Apr 15, 2015)

Absolutely stunning! Congrats - and thanks for the shout out


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## Daf57 (Apr 15, 2015)

Love it! Congrats, man!


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## QuantumCybin (Apr 15, 2015)

Awesome! I swear every Vader I see posted on Carvin's Instagram shows up here as a NGD  but congrats!


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## haymez (Apr 15, 2015)

Wow. That top is fantastic.


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## Eclipse (Apr 15, 2015)

I love the top! Never heard of Kiesel before today.


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## ferret (Apr 15, 2015)

Kiesel is Carvin Guitar's parent company, after they split off from the Amp/ProAudio half.


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 15, 2015)

Snagged some outside pictures today since it was super non-cloudy today. Still loving it, and have been playing it nearly nonstop. Got a picture of the little scratch on the "headstock" cap too. Re-recording some tracks using this guitar and I'm loving it.

And yes, Kiesel is for all intents and purposes just a re-branded Carvin. The majority of the models currently made by what is now called Kiesel still have "Carvin" written on the headstock.

I'm so glad you mentioned the lower strap button feeling more comfortable, Ferret. I played around with the strap in both positions today, and I can't imagine it any other way now. Upper fret access (ie: anything 12th fret or higher) is way better using the lower button in my experience.


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## ferret (Apr 15, 2015)

It's still overcast here! That nightburst is nice in the sun.

I was talking to Chris H briefly today and mentioned the bottom strap button thing. I think they need to do another technical video or some updated product description covering some of the "little things" we're coming up with.

Also, regarding the end cap and the sharp string edges! When my tech buddy changed strings for me today, he didn't tighten the hex bolt till after cutting the string. He clipped and just let it slip back a little, then tightened, so that the edges weren't protruding. I should have thought of that.


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## raisingfear101 (Apr 15, 2015)

ferret said:


> It's still overcast here! That nightburst is nice in the sun.
> 
> I was talking to Chris H briefly today and mentioned the bottom strap button thing. I think they need to do another technical video or some updated product description covering some of the "little things" we're coming up with.
> 
> Also, regarding the end cap and the sharp string edges! When my tech buddy changed strings for me today, he didn't tighten the hex bolt till after cutting the string. He clipped and just let it slip back a little, then tightened, so that the edges weren't protruding. I should have thought of that.



Speaking of that, I saw a video of a guy changing the strings on a strandberg. Instead of clipping the strings, he tightened the string down with the screws, then bent the string upwards towards the fretboard, and crimped the string that way, so the sharp part is well inside the head cap. I don't know how similar the Vader is and if it would work though.

Edit: Found the video (wasn't a Strandberg though).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCEO8WdfRIw


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## MAJ Meadows SF (Apr 15, 2015)

Totally badass. Those are _not_ crappy pictures by any stretch either. Awesome looking Vader!


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## Alice AKW (Apr 16, 2015)

Purple and blue finish over a burl top on a headless baritone 7 string?

Girl you're after my heart. That thing is gorgeous! HNGD!


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## rapterr15 (Apr 16, 2015)

I thought having the neck painted the same color as the body is $120 (according to the builder). Can that charge be gotten around? Or do the translucent finishes automatically come like that or something?


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 16, 2015)

Honestly, I'm not positive. Looks like if you wanted it painted satin it'd be $120. I left it clear gloss. Not sure what the difference between painted and clear satin is either. Perhaps it's worth asking if you call to order, but the standard option just had it match the rest.


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## rapterr15 (Apr 16, 2015)

I've never had a gloss neck guitar, as I've always had Ibbys. How do you like the feel of gloss? Doesn't your thumb kinda get stuck sometimes when sliding up or down?


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 16, 2015)

I know some folks have issues with that, but it's never been a problem for me. You can also satinize it yourself with steel wool if you don't mind destroying resale value.


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## Andrenighthound (Apr 16, 2015)

Look great!! Beautiful top! I'm getting another Vader made with a Cali Nightburst which has the clear center, on a plain maple top! I love the way the back of the neck looks!!!


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 16, 2015)

The calibursts look nice. There was a cali aqua burst that they posted on Facebook that gave me ideas. Might get a 6 or 8 with that over quilt.


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## crystallake (Apr 16, 2015)

Beautiful guitar! I keep saying that a V7 is my next axe.


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## feraledge (Apr 16, 2015)

Chokey Chicken said:


> I know some folks have issues with that, but it's never been a problem for me. You can also satinize it yourself with steel wool if you don't mind destroying resale value.



I've never had issues with taking steel wool destroying resale value. It's not a permanent thing. It's obvious when it's been done, but you can buff it and build it back up to gloss fairly easy. In fact, if you go the steel wool route, you need to go back over it pretty often because matte finishes build up gloss easily. I used to prefer matte, but I'll take tru-oil over anything. 
But I guess the point of getting a semi-custom guitar is to get what you want in the first place.


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## fr4nci2c0 (Apr 16, 2015)

I have a headless 6 and they are head and shoulders in terms of comfort and weight above headstock guitars. headstock guitars are way heavier than headless guitars. How light is this 7? chambered body right?


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## mr coffee (Apr 16, 2015)

An often missed suggestion is to tape over your pickups while using steel wool. You don't want steel particles finding their way into the windings.

-m


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 16, 2015)

I never considered buffing it out, which is pretty simple to do indeed, and good god yes, tape up the pickups. Steel wool is messy and you really don't want it gumming up the works.

As for how much it weighs, I'm not sure, but it is not in fact chambered. That said, it is pretty darn light. I'll see if I can't get a measurement with my wife's scale she uses for weighing our snakes.

edit: 6.4 pounds is what the scale tells me.


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## SnowfaLL (Apr 16, 2015)

I bought my ST300T with gloss and the intention of buffing it to satin later, but honestly its not really that big of an issue that I've felt the need to do it yet. So try it out, never know.

Chokey, whats the wood wings? whats the neck wood? I'm assuming maple neck + alder but would like confirm. I'm highly contemplating a Nightburst V7 but I'm noticing the wood types really change the color. Alder seems more teal than the maple here, which is kinda light blue?? I know Mahogany is very teal, which is unfortunate as thats what I was going to get.


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## Chokey Chicken (Apr 16, 2015)

Yup, standard maple with alder wings. Maple and ash are bright woods and will appear like the maple neck through the night burst color. Alder is a bit darker, as is mahogany so it'll be a darker tint. The burl is dyed black before the color is applied so it shows darker. I'll upload an image of it before it got color in a few.


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## Matthew (Apr 17, 2015)

Your kaleidoscope top is the most insane thing I've ever seen.

HNGD!


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## oremus91 (Apr 17, 2015)

Just when you think you've decided on a Boden OS7, here comes someone with a V7 NGD thread.


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## shadowlife (Apr 18, 2015)

That top/finish is unbelievable.
HNGD!


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## rochesterbox (Apr 18, 2015)

Wow after this thinking of seriously grabbing one of these!


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