# Fanned-Fret, 8-String V



## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

I got to thinking today... I thought to myself, "Qucifer, you know what would be really badass... A fanned-fret, 8-string V."

Wouldn't it?


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## Ishan (Oct 23, 2008)

You'll have to do a lot of work on the V shape for it to not look too bulky but it's quite a good idea


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## Variant (Oct 23, 2008)

Personally, I'd rather add frets than fan them.  That said, I've got a V design I've been tinkering, though I'm only planning to apply it to sixers and seveners. Maybe I'll mock one up on a eighter when I get to it.


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## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

Now that I've been playing one for a while... Fanned-fret 8's are definitely the way to go...

I just think a nice, all-black, ebony-boarded V would look pretty sweet.


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## Apophis (Oct 23, 2008)

interesting


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## bulletbass man (Oct 23, 2008)

If you could find an ebony blank big enough an ebony top would be pretty fucking killer imo.

But thats going to be a real bitch to find.

Or something like a Korina body with walnut top. That would be killer as well.


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## Randy (Oct 23, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Now that I've been playing one for a while... Fanned-fret 8's are definitely the way to go...
> 
> I just think a nice, all-black, ebony-boarded V would look pretty sweet.



PM me some more specs, and I'll see what if I can render an idea of what that'd look like.


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## bulletbass man (Oct 23, 2008)

Variant said:


> Personally, I'd rather add frets than fan them.  That said, I've got a V design I've been tinkering, though I'm only planning to apply it to sixers and seveners. Maybe I'll mock one up on a eighter when I get to it.


 

I don't see how fanned frets and extra frets are really comparable. The whole idea is so you have a multi scale string lengths. Cant really do that by simply adding frets (unless you do the wierdest fret jobs ever, would make steve vais boards look normal)


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## Crucified (Oct 23, 2008)

i'm not a big fan of V shapes. they feel funny to me when i play them


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## Elysian (Oct 23, 2008)

i think an asymmetrical bodied fanned fret V would look sweet.


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## larry (Oct 23, 2008)

Crucified said:


> i'm not a big fan of V shapes. they feel funny to me when i play them



+1


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## Variant (Oct 23, 2008)

bulletbass man said:


> I don't see how fanned frets and extra frets are really comparable. The whole idea is so you have a multi scale string lengths. Cant really do that by simply adding frets (unless you do the wierdest fret jobs ever, would make steve vais boards look normal)



The scale isn't the concern, the tension is, IMHO. Make the scale long enough for the low stings, tune down the high ones and add frets to make up for the notes lost. Throw a nice capo into the situation and the flexibility grows even more. I love the one on my Steinberger Synapse. I just don't see the advantage of adding the difficulty of dealing with all the skewed frets into the situation.


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## Elysian (Oct 23, 2008)

Variant said:


> The scale isn't the concern, the tension is, IMHO. Make the scale long enough for the low stings, tune down the high ones and add frets to make up for the notes lost. Throw a nice capo into the situation and the flexibility grows even more. I love the one on my Steinberger Synapse. I just don't see the advantage of adding the difficulty of dealing with all the skewed frets into the situation.



have you ever played one? i have not, but i've heard its absurdly easy to get used to...


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## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

Fanned frets are a total non-issue playing-wise. I was completely taken aback at how much it didn't bother me. When you look at the guitar from across the room, it looks strange. When you're actually playing one, you don't even notice.


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## Variant (Oct 23, 2008)

Elysian said:


> have you ever played one? i have not, but i've heard its absurdly easy to get used to...



Yeah, I played a Novax Charlie Hunter model a ways back and couldn't get the feel for it. I suck enough as it is playing while not looking at the fretboard with straight frets.  I don't need any additional difficulty added into the mix, especially when I can get the necessary range out of a conventional single-scale guitar. With the Octave Plus strings out there now, I can't see why you'd need the multi-scale setup TBH, at least so far as seven or eight strings go.


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## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

Randy said:


> PM me some more specs, and I'll see what if I can render an idea of what that'd look like.



Randy... Cool! If you don't get this, I'll also PM it to you...

I'd probably expect this to be something like my Sherman. 28.5" scale on the bass side, 25.5" scale on the treble side. Perpendicular fret around the 7th. I'd probably want passives like the Nordstrand that Mike is using, or the customs that Dan winds.

I think a 4+4 or a 3+5 headstock are the only real way to pull off an 8-string headstock. Although, who knows... the fanned scale might actually help an inline 8-work out.

Either an asymmetrical or a symmetrical V would be fine with me...



Variant said:


> Yeah, I played a Novax Charlie Hunter model a ways back and couldn't get the feel for it. I suck enough as it is playing while not looking at the fretboard with straight frets.  I don't need any additional difficulty added into the mix, especially when I can get the necessary range out of a conventional single-scale guitar. With the Octave Plus strings out there now, I can't see why you'd need the multi-scale setup TBH, at least so far as seven or eight strings go.



Different strokes, I guess... I really like how the long-scale sounds on the low end of the guitar, and I prefer the shorter scale sound on the treble side. With each string falling into the scale range, it really gives the guitar a nice even sound across the entire range.

You probably can do the same thing with straight frets. I play straight fret guitars, too. I just think a fanned-8-string-V would be spectacularly cool.


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## Variant (Oct 23, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Different strokes, I guess... I really like how the long-scale sounds on the low end of the guitar, and I prefer the shorter scale sound on the treble side. With each string falling into the scale range, it really gives the guitar a nice even sound across the entire range.



Well, I'm a convert to longer scales for certain (Play 28 5/8" now, will go 30 1/3" on my next axe) but I don't really hear the difference on the high side of things.  But then, I'm not stringing a piano-tight high E on there anywhere. I'm tuned down a fifth everywhere, six more frets would put me back in the same range of an everyday sixer.


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## noodles (Oct 23, 2008)

I've got to get Rob to revisit this one of these days.


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## wannabguitarist (Oct 23, 2008)

Other than looking to be as big as me that KxK is awesome


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## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

Sweet! Rob is actually who I was thinking about when I started thinking about this... Except, instead of a natural-finish... I was think glossy black... Maybe some bevels like your KxK V...


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## Elysian (Oct 23, 2008)

i'd love to see Rob do that with the ProtoV shape/headstock, i think thatd be awesome.


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## gaunten (Oct 23, 2008)

Variant said:


> Well, I'm a convert to longer scales for certain (Play 28 5/8" now, will go 30 1/3" on my next axe) but I don't really hear the difference on the high side of things.  But then, I'm not stringing a piano-tight high E on there anywhere. I'm tuned down a fifth everywhere, six more frets would put me back in the same range of an everyday sixer.


 
wow, a fifth, does that mean you tune down to a B on the low string?
how does that sound? and what string you using? 110?


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## Qucifer (Oct 23, 2008)

Elysian said:


> i'd love to see Rob do that with the ProtoV shape/headstock, i think thatd be awesome.



Absolutely.

Hell, if he'd be willing to do it... I'd most likely be very interested in having one made...

Once the Sherman is done, that is...


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## Shawn (Oct 23, 2008)

Crucified said:


> i'm not a big fan of V shapes. they feel funny to me when i play them


Me too.


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## noodleplugerine (Oct 24, 2008)

I think Assymetric is the way to go, long tail on the bass side, shorter tail on the treble side, so that it flows with the fan. Would look amazing.


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## Variant (Oct 24, 2008)

gaunten said:


> wow, a fifth, does that mean you tune down to a B on the low string? and what string you using? 110?



Yeah, "drop" tuned to A0 with a .110, it's not on there now (as I'm tuned to G1 to write music with Marco / Cadenhead), but the Synapse is nuts easy to switch out strings on. The tension on 28 5/8" is just about what the .065 F#1 is on the 27" RG2228. Needless to say, it's a touch floppy, which is why I'd like to go to 30 1/3".



> how does that sound?



See: 'Spasm' on Re-Nothing by Meshuggah (in Bb0).


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## guitarbuilder93 (Oct 24, 2008)

ENOUGH TALK. WE NEEDS MOCKUPS NOWS.


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## gatesofcarnage (Oct 24, 2008)

guitarbuilder93 said:


> ENOUGH TALK. WE NEEDS MOCKUPS NOWS.


 CORRECT!


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## 7deadlysins666 (Oct 24, 2008)

An 8 string Rhoads-like V (different design, but that type of asymmetrical) would be epic. I tried to PM but it will not load? 

Qucifer.... I see you're out of Charlotte, which is like an hour and a half from me..... you in a band? My band has is really trying to get into the Charlotte/Raleigh/Winston Salem area...maybe we could trade some shows.


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## Randy (Oct 25, 2008)

_As I imagined it:_


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## Durero (Oct 25, 2008)

That looks great!


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## dpm (Oct 25, 2008)

Pretty damn cool idea


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## Stealthdjentstic (Oct 25, 2008)

noodles said:


> I've got to get Rob to revisit this one of these days.



If you can pull something off that looks as great as that i will give you madddd props. Good luck!


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## Hawksmoor (Oct 25, 2008)

That looks awesome...


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## 7deadlysins666 (Oct 25, 2008)

I am thinking Hard about changing my custom Tele-7 to fanned frets. I think im going to do it.


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## eegor (Oct 25, 2008)

Randy said:


> _As I imagined it:_



WOW. I'm not a fan of V's, but that is absolutely fucking sexy. I would love to have that.


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## Qucifer (Oct 25, 2008)

Oh my...

Now _that's_ what I'm talking about... 

That is seriously badass... pretty much exactly what I was imagining!!!



Randy said:


> _As I imagined it:_


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## controversyking (Oct 25, 2008)

eegor said:


> WOW. I'm not a fan of V's, but that is absolutely fucking sexy. I would love to have that.




WANT**

Great rendering btw/ what program are you using? Blender?


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## yellowv (Oct 25, 2008)

That guitar would be the most metal guitar ever to be forged.


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## Randy (Oct 25, 2008)

Stealthtastic said:


> If you can pull something off that looks as great as that i will give you madddd props. Good luck!



I just so happened to find myself with some spare time this evening, so I made up a couple different finishes; for shits and giggles.













controversyking said:


> WANT**
> 
> Great rendering btw/ what program are you using? Blender?



Thanks! 

I use AutoCAD for the initial design (all to scale, so I could technically print them up to make templates) and then they go into Illustrator. 

If I need to tweak my raster images, I do it in Paint Shop Pro (I could never get into Photoshop )


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## eegor (Oct 26, 2008)

Holy SHIT that second one is awesome.


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## noodleplugerine (Oct 26, 2008)

Randy said:


>



BUFF.

GIEV.

NOW.

BUILD IT.

However, I've seen more than enough Wenge recently, how about some Black Limba wings or something?

More mockups!!!


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## Qucifer (Oct 26, 2008)

Ok...

So, it appears that KxK isn't taking orders at the moment.

Who else would be a good choice to build it?

Randy... these mockups are awesome! Any chance you could do one in silverburst?



7deadlysins666 said:


> Qucifer.... I see you're out of Charlotte, which is like an hour and a half from me..... you in a band? My band has is really trying to get into the Charlotte/Raleigh/Winston Salem area...maybe we could trade some shows.



I'm actually between bands for the last year and a half... I'm going through a big woodshedding period and upgrading my education a bunch online with Berklee.

If you happen to come through Charlotte, let me know! I'd love to come check you guys out...


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## theshred201 (Oct 26, 2008)

Ormsby guitars has been doing lots of multi-scale stuff lately.

Guitar 1















Guitar 2















Guitar 3.











Might be a good one to look into, though he IS in Australia (If the prices on his quote page are in Australian dollars though then they are priced pretty darn nicely, and if they are in USD they still aren't too bad). However, he does come to the states every year and typically drops off some guitars when he does if I can remember correctly.

Sherman has also been doing some fanned stuff lately.
Oni does lots of fanned stuff.
There are a couple other companies I was planning on mentioning but I can't remember right now.


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## darren (Oct 26, 2008)

Wow... i haven't seen Perry's work since i stopped going to ProjectGuitar... he's making some STUNNING stuff. That ash one is amazing!


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## Randy (Oct 26, 2008)

noodleplugerine said:


> However, I've seen more than enough Wenge recently, how about some Black Limba wings or something?



Thanks! 








Qucifer said:


> Randy... these mockups are awesome! Any chance you could do one in silverburst?



Thanks! Now have it built. 









darren said:


> Wow... i haven't seen Perry's work since i stopped going to ProjectGuitar... he's making some STUNNING stuff. That ash one is amazing!



Co-sign. 

Perry's works has always been extraordinary, and the things I've been seeing lately are a cut above that.


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## dpm (Oct 26, 2008)

plus the aussie dollar is in far worse shape than it was a couple of months back, so you'd be getting a bargain.


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## BigPhi84 (Oct 26, 2008)

Nice idea.


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## noodleplugerine (Oct 26, 2008)

Randy said:


> Thanks!



Even better!!!! The silbertburst looks cool aswell, I just love natural guitars.

And Ormsby make GORGEOUS guitars. Give the man a call!!!


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## bulletbass man (Oct 26, 2008)

theshred201 said:


> Sherman has also been doing some fanned stuff lately.
> Oni does lots of fanned stuff.
> There are a couple other companies I was planning on mentioning but I can't remember right now.


 

Speaking quicifer has a fanned fret oni and has a fanned fret sherman currently being built i'm fairly sure he knows both of those guys make fanned fret guitars.

Those ornsby guitar throw out still get you rep points though. That is definitely a cut above last time i saw his work (as someone else said).


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## Qucifer (Oct 27, 2008)

Yes... I have an Oni from Dan, and I've got a Sherman in-progress. So, I have no problem with the quality produced by either of those guys. They're both amazing...

Correct me if I'm wrong, Dan... but I don't think this is something that Dan would be interested in doing. I don't know if Mike would, either.

Elysian has offered to possibly throw his hat in the ring...

What abour Ran? What's the verdict on those guys... It seems like the kind of thing that would be right up their alley.


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## Randy (Oct 27, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> What abour Ran? What's the verdict on those guys... It seems like the kind of thing that would be right up their alley.



Can't say I know, although, Hexer seemed really pleased with his and it even won GOTM that one time...

Plus, those guys will make anything.


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## Rob_KxK (Oct 27, 2008)

Qucifer, the KxK ProtoVii-8's are already being made and will be available
early next year. 30"-28.5" scales with blackouts or 808/707 pickups with
custom individual graphtech saddles. Sorry, no build pics.

Rob


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## Qucifer (Oct 27, 2008)

Rob_KxK said:


> Qucifer, the KxK ProtoVii-8's are already being made and will be available
> early next year. 30"-28.5" scales with blackouts or 808/707 pickups with
> custom individual graphtech saddles. Sorry, no build pics.
> 
> Rob



Thanks for responding, Rob.

That sounds close, but not quite what I'm looking for. I don't know how much flexibility you're willing to offer on that build? Specifically, I'm looking for a slightly shorter scale, with more fan... (28.5-25.5). I'm also interested in passive pickups, although I'd probably be willing to go with blackouts in a pinch. If you're already building them, then you're probably not doing these on a custom-basis, correct?

Is there any more information about the ProtoVii-8 online anywhere? If we're talking about the guitar on page 2 of this thread (which it sounds like), that looks pretty darn close... The headstock used in the mockups on this thread is what I would want, instead, though.

If those changes are feasible, I'd like to get on the list to place an order for one. I'd be happy to put down a deposit. You're definitely who I had in mind to build this guitar...


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## Rob_KxK (Oct 27, 2008)

Qucifer, the guitar looks similar to the ProtoVii-7 that Dave posted
in the dealer section. There were slight body modifications and the head
was made for 4+4 but the same basic shape.

Since you are looking for a custom speced guitar please contact noodles
and let him know the specs you need.


Rob


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## Qucifer (Oct 27, 2008)

Got it! That's what I'll do...

Thanks for the help!



Rob_KxK said:


> Since you are looking for a custom speced guitar please contact noodles
> and let him know the specs you need.
> 
> 
> Rob


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## controversyking (Oct 27, 2008)

** Noob question ** 

Whats the benefit or tonal difference with the slanted frets vs. straight ones?
.. or why would you have your frets slanted?


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## Qucifer (Oct 27, 2008)

controversyking said:


> ** Noob question **
> 
> Whats the benefit or tonal difference with the slanted frets vs. straight ones?
> .. or why would you have your frets slanted?



This is a bit of a FAQ... but this should point you in the right direction:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/69060-fan-fretting.html


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## Qucifer (Oct 31, 2008)

After looking at that 8-string Ormsby in the other thread... He might be a great choice to build this guitar. I have a feeling it'd look pretty nice with that same 8-string headstock on it...


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## Randy (Oct 31, 2008)

_Something like this, perhaps:_


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## Elysian (Oct 31, 2008)

that doesn't look very good with that V at all


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## Randy (Oct 31, 2008)

Hmmm... I kinda liked it. 

The overall length of it is kinda short, so it looks "stumpy" in comparison to how long the body is. But, they share some similar curves and points.


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## LEWY7777777 (Oct 31, 2008)

It looks amazing and brutal!


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## Elysian (Oct 31, 2008)

Randy said:


> Hmmm... I kinda liked it.
> 
> The overall length of it is kinda short, so it looks "stumpy" in comparison to how long the body is. But, they share some similar curves and points.



thats how i felt when i saw it, it looks stumpy, like someone missing their hand or something  it just doesn't lend itself well to something so long, imo V's should have pointy headstocks


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## BRUTALIZER GUITARS (Oct 31, 2008)

God I just want to see this thing built also I dont like that headstock on the V design, 

this would be cool!! AAAA Quilted maple top dyed a nice green with a flamed maple fretboard and Ash Body


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## Qucifer (Oct 31, 2008)

You realize that you're my hero for doing that, Randy? I was going to ask you if you'd do that... but you already went through all the trouble of doing those mockups, so I didn't want to ask you for anything else...

But, I really like that. I can understand that viewpoints of folks who think it looks "stumpy"... but I think it looks kind of "thick" and "tough"... it reminds me a little bit of what B.C. Rich might do with a fanned 8-string V.

This will get built... it's just a matter of finding the right builder and the right design tweaks. But, it's going to happen. 



Randy said:


> _Something like this, perhaps:_


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## Randy (Oct 31, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> You realize that you're my hero for doing that, Randy?



You'll be my hero if you get it made. 

In anycase, don't be afraid to ask for anything... it's a pleasure to help out and something I enjoy doing regardless. 

Good luck.


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## eegor (Oct 31, 2008)

Randy said:


> _Something like this, perhaps:_





Please, stick with the other headstock.


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## Ramsay777 (Oct 31, 2008)

eegor said:


> Please, stick with the other headstock.






PLEASE!


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## Elysian (Oct 31, 2008)

i think i'd like ormsby's headstock so much better if he narrowed it near the top and gave it straight string bull. right now it looks far too thick, and imo straight string pull is just absurdly more aesthetically pleasing. i like the basics of his headstock design, i just wish he'd even give it a try with straight string pull.

i actually suggested it to him in the thread with the fanned 8 that that headstock pic is from, and he just ignored it, go figure.


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## Qucifer (Oct 31, 2008)

Randy...

Here's an idea... let's try reversing the Ormsby headstock... Maybe that'll balance it out slightly differently? The top of the Ormsby headstock is slightly longer than the bottom... maybe the headstock would flow better with the body shape if it were reversed.

All you pukers... let me know if you have any other ideas?


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## Elysian (Oct 31, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Randy...
> 
> Here's an idea... let's try reversing the Ormsby headstock... Maybe that'll balance it out slightly differently? The top of the Ormsby headstock is slightly longer than the bottom... maybe the headstock would flow better with the body shape if it were reversed.
> 
> All you pukers... let me know if you have any other ideas?



my idea's already thrown in the pot  i'd love to see a mockup of my idea, hell maybe ormsby should see a mockup, i think itd look sharp as hell


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## Randy (Oct 31, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Randy...
> 
> Here's an idea... let's try reversing the Ormsby headstock... Maybe that'll balance it out slightly differently? The top of the Ormsby headstock is slightly longer than the bottom... maybe the headstock would flow better with the body shape if it were reversed.



The concept is sound. 

I reversed it and quick exported a black and white version so you can mull it over:








Elysian said:


> my idea's already thrown in the pot  i'd love to see a mockup of my idea, hell maybe ormsby should see a mockup, i think itd look sharp as hell



Sounds like a really great idea. Only problem is that to achieve the direct string pull, the whole headstock has to be elongated and the whole thing has a slower taper and less room for "curve" on the sides (like the original).

That being said, the finished product keeps coming out an inch bigger than it's original size, and looking very similar to the Sherman 4+4, but with the Ormsby tip on it (which, because of the taper, is now 1/2 it's original size).

*EDIT:* More or less how it keeps coming out:


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## Qucifer (Nov 1, 2008)

Randy said:


> I reversed it and quick exported a black and white version so you can mull it over:



There's a problem with reversing it... the tuners no longer "flow" with the fan. The treble side tuners are farther away from the nut than the bass side tuners... I'd originally asked Mike Sherman if he could reverse his usual headstock on the fanned 8 he's building me, and he ran into the same problem.


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## Strictly 7 (Nov 1, 2008)

Hello again! Jim from Strictly 7 here. Just wanted to remind everyone of our upcoming Guitar Wars contest. Please follow the link below to read the main post about this topic. Didn't want to be accused of spamming the site with the same exact post on each thread. We have an 8-string and 10 string Warr guitar entrant already...more would be nice



http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...y-ohio-pa-or-indiana-players.html#post1261689

Thanks!
Jim/Strictly 7


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## Randy (Nov 1, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> There's a problem with reversing it... the tuners no longer "flow" with the fan. The treble side tuners are farther away from the nut than the bass side tuners... I'd originally asked Mike Sherman if he could reverse his usual headstock on the fanned 8 he's building me, and he ran into the same problem.



Yeah... there's "ways around it" but they'll ultimately end in revising the entire headstock design anyway, and you'll have very little of the original left.

Personally? If you liked the Ormsby 4+4 then go with it. It's your guitar, and plus, it'll probably look 1,000 times better on an actual instrument rather than a glorified drawing. 

If you've got anybody willing to cut you your own design from scratch, we could work on designing one from the ground up. Then you'll have something that'll work with the flow of the guitar, but won't be a trademark/copyright issue for someone to build.


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## twiztedchild (Nov 1, 2008)

those look tastey  I'd play them IF i had the cash to buy one


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## noodleplugerine (Nov 1, 2008)

Am I the only person that still thinks this looks the best?:






Although, 






That top one does look really good actually.

Any chance you can do a full render with the new straight pull headstock?


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## Elysian (Nov 1, 2008)

i think the straight pull headstock looks great, longer and all! wow it looks good.


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## TimSE (Nov 1, 2008)

noodleplugerine said:


> Am I the only person that still thinks this looks the best?:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thats the one!


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## eegor (Nov 1, 2008)

noodleplugerine said:


> Am I the only person that still thinks this looks the best?:



No. I still like that one better.


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## Qucifer (Nov 1, 2008)

Randy... Mike Sherman was kind enough to share a sketch of the design he'll be using for V headstocks... Can we try this one on?


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## Randy (Nov 1, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Randy... Mike Sherman was kind enough to share a sketch of the design he'll be using for V headstocks... Can we try this one on?



Oh, NOW you tell me... 



















If I get some time later tonight, I'll see what I can do.


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## Neil (Nov 1, 2008)

^ These straight string pull ormsbys look really nice.


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## twiztedchild (Nov 1, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Randy... Mike Sherman was kind enough to share a sketch of the design he'll be using for V headstocks... Can we try this one on?



Sherman is going to be making V's now?? Awesome!


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## noodleplugerine (Nov 1, 2008)

Randy said:


> Oh, NOW you tell me...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Look better than the initial ormsby inspired ones, but the first batch of renders you did are the best looking so far imo.


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## Qucifer (Nov 1, 2008)

Neil said:


> ^ These straight string pull ormsbys look really nice.



Personally, I disagree... I think they look too stretched out and long.

So far, I think the original Ormsby design looks the best of them all. 





Randy said:


> Oh, NOW you tell me...
> 
> If I get some time later tonight, I'll see what I can do.



I'm going to owe you a couple of beers when this guitar is done.


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## Randy (Nov 1, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Personally, I disagree... I think they look too stretched out and long.
> 
> So far, I think the original Ormsby design looks the best of them all.




Stick to your guns, dude. 




Qucifer said:


> I'm going to owe you a couple of beers when this guitar is done.



I'll hold you to that. 

EDIT: Wow, you guys are really putting my through my paces. 

[action=Randy]wipes the sweat from his brow[/action]

Also, this is probably the only time you'll see an all black guitar with a Sherman headstock.


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## noodleplugerine (Nov 2, 2008)

So the main difference to the first headstock and the Sherman one, is that Sherman's is 4/4 and slightly shorter. I think both look great. The Ormsby ones can't compete.


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## bulletbass man (Nov 2, 2008)

That sherman looks the best imo. A sherman V shall be intresting.


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## Elysian (Nov 2, 2008)

damn the sherman headstock is perfect.


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## Randy (Nov 3, 2008)

Elysian said:


> damn the sherman headstock is perfect.



That guy's a friggin' design machine.


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## Thrashmanzac (Nov 3, 2008)

has anyone contacted perry about this yet, if you guys are interested. i think he has an account here


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## Qucifer (Nov 3, 2008)

Thrashmanzac said:


> has anyone contacted perry about this yet, if you guys are interested. i think he has an account here



I have, yes.

He actually brought up a good point... his only negative feedback on the design is that it's likely to be fairly neck-heavy.


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## Elysian (Nov 3, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> I have, yes.
> 
> He actually brought up a good point... his only negative feedback on the design is that it's likely to be fairly neck-heavy.



thats V's for you, toss in 2 more tuners and an 8 string neck, and yeah, it'll likely be neck heavy, unless you build it out of the heaviest wood you can find or make it 2" thick


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## Randy (Nov 3, 2008)

Elysian said:


> thats V's for you, toss in 2 more tuners and an 8 string neck, and yeah, it'll likely be neck heavy, unless you build it out of the heaviest wood you can find or make it 2" thick



And chamber the upper wing. 

I had all that in mind when I designed it, anyway. 

Plus, careful strap button placement.


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## Qucifer (Nov 4, 2008)

Randy said:


> And chamber the upper wing.
> 
> I had all that in mind when I designed it, anyway.
> 
> Plus, careful strap button placement.



Chamber the upper wing? Explain?

Here's a wacky thought... would there be any way to adjust the V shape slightly, so that we could move the strap button forward of the heel, without it looking goofy?

There's a bunch of space on the top of half of the neck, where a strap button could go without interfering with the playability of the guitar.


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## GazPots (Nov 4, 2008)

Can you not fashion a small pocket with cover that allows various weights to be placed in to suit certain playing postures. My immediate thought was small blocks of various metals but it could be anything really.


IE heavier the weight the higher the neck will rise when worn etc. Lighter or no weights if you like the guitar level or slightly imbalanced etc. Or even just build a weight into the body and have it as part of its construction so its not visible.


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## Qucifer (Nov 4, 2008)

GazPots said:


> Can you not fashion a small pocket with cover that allows various weights to be placed in to suit certain playing postures. My immediate thought was small blocks of various metals but it could be anything really.
> 
> 
> IE heavier the weight the higher the neck will rise when worn etc. Lighter or no weights if you like the guitar level or slightly imbalanced etc. Or even just build a weight into the body and have it as part of its construction so its not visible.



That's what I was assuming that Randy was talking about when he mentioned "chambering the upper wing"... but I wanted to make sure...


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## GazPots (Nov 4, 2008)

I thought chambering was a weight relief measure.

Edit - he means get heavy ass wood and have a thick body _then_ chamber it to relieve some weight.


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## Qucifer (Nov 4, 2008)

GazPots said:


> I thought chambering was a weight relief measure.
> 
> Edit - he means get heavy ass wood and have a thick body _then_ chamber it to relieve some weight.



Ahhhh! Indeed... I see.


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## Randy (Nov 4, 2008)

GazPots said:


> I thought chambering was a weight relief measure.
> 
> Edit - he means get heavy ass wood and have a thick body _then_ chamber it to relieve some weight.





Think wenge wings, and a hollowed out upper wing. Wouldn't effect the tone much, because (if it's a neck-thru)the pickups and the bridge will be mounted on the same piece as the neck and headstock.

However, it also might give the guitar some added acoustic resonance since the asymmetrical V design can be acousically "thin" sometimes... due to the lack of body mass. 

EDIT: As long as the body's kept reasonably heavy, especially on the bottom, you could _probably_ get away with slightly more "traditional" strap pin locations.


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## Qucifer (Nov 4, 2008)

Randy,

I've been discussing some ideas with Perry Ormsby... One of the things he suggested might be to move the neck back into the body slightly... If you look at this KxK design, it looks like Rob did something similar:







Maybe we could do something like that... extend the line of the upper wing so that it angles a bit more toward the headstock, with a bigger heel carve in the back--creating a spot to move that forward strap button closer to the headstock, without screwing up the 'V' look...

Thoughts?


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## Randy (Nov 4, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Thoughts?



Sounds very practical and, because of the fanned frets, the extension blends into the shape very well.


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## Qucifer (Nov 5, 2008)

Here's another round of feedback from Perry Ormsby...






Another idea... would we gain anything from making the shape a symmetrical V instead of an asymmetrical V? Both wings could still aim farther toward the headstock than a "traditional" V... and the lower wing could have a fairly deep and pronounced cutout...


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## ormsby guitars (Nov 5, 2008)

Qucifer said:


> Here's another round of feedback from Perry Ormsby...
> 
> 
> 
> Another idea... would we gain anything from making the shape a symmetrical V instead of an asymmetrical V? Both wings could still aim farther toward the headstock than a "traditional" V... and the lower wing could have a fairly deep and pronounced cutout...



Lower wing being lengthened will work towards shifting the center of gravity, but would throw off the balance of the actual design I feel. Two equal horns with an "Alexi" cutaway, look kinda funky to my eyes.

Ive thought of a trick that would actually look quite cool with this paint and body design, AND would solve the weight issue, but let me think it through for a day or so before I throw it out there for comment. It will add to the overall weight, which as per our emails, you know Im not keen on. It wont add as much as some other suggestions though.

Thanks to Randy for the artwork, its so much easier to visualize. I might have to put you on my payroll


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## Randy (Nov 5, 2008)

ormsby guitars said:


> Thanks to Randy for the artwork, its so much easier to visualize. I might have to put you on my payroll



Sounds good to me. Just know that the name on my driver's license reads "cash". 

In all honesty though, it's been a really neat project to work on. If you ever need anymore help, don't be afraid to ask.


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## Elysian (Nov 5, 2008)

could always consider doing a 2" thick body, that might help alleviate it some.


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## bulletbass man (Nov 5, 2008)

You could try making the lower wing longer but rounding out the back of the wing more so it retains an assymetrical look.


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## willybman (Nov 6, 2008)

im new to this site but that shit looks great


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## LEWY7777777 (Nov 23, 2008)

I think its very original, and true to form like an actual race car -not the road going imitation. Its different and fresh, the headstock design falls inline with the rest of the guitars lines -it does have a fat look , but I believe that look.
Just take a look at some other guitars some are so ridiculous because the idea doesn't match the form or the make-up on the face goes off theme from the purpose because of natural incompatibility. Just some cents. I personaly prefer elongated inline reverse headstocks yet I am still open to what looks good and when it doesn't. And I believe the styling aspect of your design- looks great.



Randy said:


> _Something like this, perhaps:_


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## Cool711 (Nov 24, 2008)

Headstock looks kinda chunky.


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## vansinn (Nov 24, 2008)

Cool711 said:


> Headstock looks kinda chunky.



I strongly disagree. I'm not normally a V fan, but this desighn works all the way, with all lines matching and leading to one another.
If anything, maybe I'd extend the part of the head right after the forth upper tuner just a tad, for a more prolonged look to match the overall pointy lines.
Oh, and I'd definately choose the black/silver 'burst' color scheme; it's so hard core metal yet elegant at the same time and screams for blistering fast shreds.


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## Thrashmanzac (Nov 24, 2008)

would look awesome with a jackson slmg, or whatever they are headstock imo


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## noodleplugerine (Jan 10, 2009)

Any news?


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## hufschmid (Jan 10, 2009)

looks nice


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## Koshchei (Jan 10, 2009)

Randy said:


> I just so happened to find myself with some spare time this evening, so I made up a couple different finishes; for shits and giggles.



Ok, it's official. When I get another guitar, it will be this one. Randy, your designs are incredible


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## Dusty201087 (Jan 11, 2009)

Koshchei said:


> Ok, it's official. When I get another guitar, it will be this one. Randy, your designs are incredible



Nice! That headstock was IMO the best 

Can't wait to hear it and read about how it plays.


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## Koshchei (Jan 11, 2009)

Dusty201087 said:


> Nice! That headstock was IMO the best
> 
> Can't wait to hear it and read about how it plays.




LOL, in my case, it'll be a while - She Who Much Be Obeyed let me get two Carvins last year, and is oiling the hedge clippers to emasculate me if I dare to dream. Too much.


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## Dusty201087 (Jan 11, 2009)

Koshchei said:


> LOL, in my case, it'll be a while - She Who Much Be Obeyed let me get two Carvins last year, and is oiling the hedge clippers to emasculate me if I dare to dream. Too much.



Ah  We understand. I will be waiting for the NGD topic patiently then


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