# DYING to learn Jazz



## DoomJazz (Oct 21, 2011)

Im absolutely killing to learn how to play me some sweet sweet jazz guitar, but I have NO clue how to go about it. Help? Links? Ect? I Love You All.


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## Gravy (Oct 21, 2011)

Mark Levine's Jazz Theory

The most comprehensive book on playing jazz pretty much ever. It goes from immediate beginner but it starts to progress very quickly. One of the best things about the book is it gives you transcriptions and the recordings they're from so you can listen (so important in jazz). There are 2/3+ footnotes on each page of recordings to check out. I've heard the internet keeps it places if you wanted to check it out. BUT if you can't read music you won't get much out of this book. Jazz becomes a lot easier once you can read music.

I would heavily recommend getting a teacher but obviously that's expensive. Hopefully someone else can recommend some sites to start learning since I don't know any good ones. For very basic stuff, learn the major scale and its modes (and the scale formulas), how to read chords (i.e, Bb7b9#5) and what notes are in these chords. Start with the basic minor, major and dominant 7s.

Start listening to Django, Charlie Christian and Wes Montgomery if you haven't already. Between the 30s and 60s they were the top guitarists. Other important players are Freddie Green, Grant Green and Joe Pass (at the very least). Also get Kind of Blue by Miles Davis. If you want to know anything else please ask. Sorry if I've repeated things you already know!


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## SirMyghin (Oct 21, 2011)

Do you know your chords? If I told you to give me D7/A in the 5th position, could you do it? Basic chord knowledge is a great place to start in Jazz, knowing your fretboard in and out is also imperative (and a stumbling block for me, it is taking a long time). 

Listening as Gravy has said is very important.


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## Gravy (Oct 21, 2011)

As SirMyghin said, knowing your fretboard in and out is imperative. However knowing certain positions isn't as important as the chords to begin with.

I forgot to include this in my post. It's a standard called 'There Will Never Be Another You'. 'Autumn Leaves' is another suggestion that fits this criteria. They both contain the basics of jazz harmony and no fancy chords, though you can reharmonise/add chords to the tunes so much.

As an absolute basic you should learn to play these chords. This site has the basic shapes you can use. You'll notice they're all the same shapes just moved around on the root. Eventually you'll want to keep the chords pretty close together on the fretboard and not make any massive jumps.

Next you see that every chord on this chart functions in a ii-V-I progression in some way (diatonic harmony). If you don't know what this is type it into google and you should get some good explanations. It is the most important chord sequence in jazz.

Knowing the notes in your chords and arpeggios becomes the next step here. You can make a solo purely out of chord tones (notes in the chord) and it will sound good. If you transcribe a lot of solos, you see that's basically all they're doing. Scales confuse things. Using arpeggios to begin with promotes good voice leading (finding the closest note of the next chord). If you wanted to use scales you could do a large amount of this chart on Ebmaj, Abmaj and Bbmaj but you would clash on some chords.

Oh, and learning the head (tune) is essential. It can act as an melodic anchor when you solo.







Again, please ask if you have questions. As you can see, I can talk far too much about jazz... In any case, these are a few of a basics you need to know to play jazz. I hope it's not scaring you off!


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## Solodini (Oct 21, 2011)

What they said. SchecterWhore would recommend Ricci Adams music theory site, I'd recommend my own book for learning the functional theory which jazz requires. You can check out free sample chapters at the link in my sig. Let me know how you get on, whether you need any help, have any suggestions of improvements or however you get on. If like to know what you think.

If you know the basics of theory and chord construction specifically then I'd suggest learning about voice leading. That's what forms the closely voiced chord movements mentioned above. Playing around with trying to play things in as many different ways and places on the neck is my recommendation of how to learn the neck inside out. Think of what notes you're playing in melodies and chords, play them elsewhere or even just displace one or two notes and see what effect this has on the overall sound. Look for links/similarities in things and how they vary. That makes you aware of things like ii V I movements mentioned above. 

If you have any further questions then I'll happily help where I can.


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## Trespass (Oct 21, 2011)

Learn rootless drop 2 voicings on strings 1-4, and 2-5 and their inversions for each major chord type (major7, minor 7, m7b5, dominant 7). This is actually pretty easy, as you'll realize that rootless drop2 voicings are actually rooted drop2 voicings of other chords. Dm7 is actually rooted drop2 Fmaj7 chords etc.

Fmaj7: F A C E
Dm7: D F A C (E) (voicing the nine despite it not being explicitly written into the score is incredibly common post-50s piano voicings [see Bill Evans rootless piano voicings, where this whole post comes from])

Knowing the rootless voicings and inversions of each major chord type on string sets 1-4, 2-5 will allow you to comp comfortably in pretty much any situation. Even modern harmony, like major7#11, can be broken down with these voicings 

i.e. play rootless drop2 Em7 over Cmaj7#11

Em7: (E) G B D F#
Cmaj7#11: C E G B F#

Rootless voicings is pretty much the gateway drug to the tonal ambiguity that is jazz post 1950s. From there, quartal harmony, "So What" chords, dense cluster voicings continue to promote that ambiguity.

----

Remember: 80% of the time, you're not the soloist- You are comping. Getting good at that early is a key to you playing as much as possible.


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## in-pursuit (Oct 22, 2011)

Trespass said:


> Remember: 80% of the time, you're not the soloist- You are comping. Getting good at that early is a key to you playing as much as possible.



this is important enough to be posted twice. you'd be surprised how many people think that knowing how to shred the melodic minor, diminished and whole tone scales = being able to play jazz. comping in jazz is something that, if done well, can be just as satisfying and impressive as playing the lead. so as already stated make an effort to learn all the most common chords and their inversions across all strings and you'll be well on your way.


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## SnowfaLL (Oct 27, 2011)

Trespass said:


> Learn rootless drop 2 voicings on strings 1-4, and 2-5 and their inversions for each major chord type (major7, minor 7, m7b5, dominant 7). This is actually pretty easy, as you'll realize that rootless drop2 voicings are actually rooted drop2 voicings of other chords. Dm7 is actually rooted drop2 Fmaj7 chords etc.
> 
> Fmaj7: F A C E
> Dm7: D F A C (E) (voicing the nine despite it not being explicitly written into the score is incredibly common post-50s piano voicings [see Bill Evans rootless piano voicings, where this whole post comes from])
> ...



Yea I gotta agree that THIS post is one of the biggest "keys" to being a working jazz musician.. Everyone always says "know every chord and every inversion at every position and every altered scale and arpeggio to go along with them" which is the ultimate goal, but it makes things SUPER complicated obviously. When it comes down to it, you will most likely play in a band and you need to NOT step on the feet of other instruments; ie you will most likely never play a low E string if you have a bassist around, and depending on what the piano is doing that may chop off another portion of your fretboard. Its a very delicate situation guitar has; as you are the one adapting to the other instruments.. Bass always plays in their range, and piano gets first pick at what they want to do generally, guitar is made to fill in the gaps (unless you are the melody instrument, which is usually taken by horns)

Focus on your "colour" notes; 3rds and 7s, and your extension note if it requires one.. The root is usually covered by bass, and the 5th is not too important unless its a dim/aug or so. Using just afew notes, you should have enough choices to add some of your own flavour to the changes.

Of course it depends on what you want to learn jazz to do; if you are playing with a band, recognize that comping is pretty much 90% of what you do. improvising can be based solely off chord tones in those comping patterns, so unless its a trio or somewhere in which you have an extended solo (going through the changes more than once or twice per solo) don't focus too much on solos until your comping is solid solid solid.

Learn enough sightreading to read the melody (and use/slightly alter the rhythms/phrases in the solo) and the rest of the time, spend all on comping. 

(remember, depending on the instrumentation also, you can't alter your chords too much; if you have bass and piano there, I wouldnt substitute for a completely different chord on the fly without knowing what they will do, you might get a very dissonant clash if they are playing straight and are unaware of your substitution)


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## SirMyghin (Oct 27, 2011)

Trespass said:


> Learn rootless drop 2 voicings on strings 1-4, and 2-5 and their inversions for each major chord type (major7, minor 7, m7b5, dominant 7). This is actually pretty easy, as you'll realize that rootless drop2 voicings are actually rooted drop2 voicings of other chords. Dm7 is actually rooted drop2 Fmaj7 chords etc.




I have seen this "drop 2" voicing thing thrown around a bit, but myself am unfamiliar with it. What exactly defines 'drop 2'?


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## Solodini (Oct 27, 2011)

If I remember right it's taking the 2nd note of the voicing and dropping it to the bottom, right?


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## SnowfaLL (Oct 27, 2011)

Solodini said:


> If I remember right it's taking the 2nd note of the voicing and doing it to the bottom, right?



Yeh something like that.. I believe it comes from piano, or rather notation where if you have a root position chord on the staff its stacked obviously all on the lines or spaces, so you take the 2nd note and drop it an octave.. On piano, instead of having the beginner "C E G B" chord, it would be G C E B, making it sound better and most likely benefit in voice leading

or something like that; been afew years since ive been in school. On guitar though, it may be odd to call them drop 2 and etc, since guitar chords are structured much different than whats on a staff/piano in the first place, but thats what they are so from a theory standpoint it makes sense.


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## SirMyghin (Oct 27, 2011)

So a standard 2nd inversion chord = effectively drop 2? figured it would be something more than dialect. As in just another way of telling your which inversion you are using?


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## Solodini (Oct 27, 2011)

I think I may have heard of 2nd inversion drop 2, and other inversions as drop 2s but that could be bull.


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## SirMyghin (Oct 27, 2011)

I am sure that Trespass fellow will return and set us all right sooner or later.


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## SnowfaLL (Oct 27, 2011)

Not quite, although it seems that way talking about basic chords.. But drop-x can be used and ARE used on inversions themselves; therefor its not always going to be "5th on bottom" or etc, like a 1st or 2nd inversion will be. 

Again, drop voicings are more for piano/arrangement, but it can also give you a bigger interval than a simple inversion would (which is meant to keep everything still clustered together, just switching the notes) where as drop voicings are more spaced out and open usually.. Thats why I dont think it would be correct to really talk about drop-x voicings on guitar (an instrument where notes are naturally clustered due to overlapping notes on diff stringsets) - but what he meant was more just learn all your inversions in the upper stringsets, thats what is ultimately important on guitar.

The way I look at it is more like Drop voicings moves the note, regardless of what it is in the chord.. and inversions move the specific inversion itself. But I dont even think about them at all on guitar


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## SirMyghin (Oct 27, 2011)

So it depends on voicing, and if you voiced your C as C G E you would be dropping the E below?


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## brutalwizard (Oct 28, 2011)

google jamplay account trial for 7 days, i know certain artists offer them occasionally 
find one that still works
dl every jazz lesson with the free account they gave you 
do them at your own pace, they teach in a manner that seems like a uneducated musician would understand.

uneducated as in not fluent in theory and reading ans such


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## JPMike (Oct 28, 2011)

Well, I haven't read all the posts in the thread, but I am going to give you some basic ideas. 

Learn your chords and especially, LEARN THE II-V-I shape, I would say in all tonalities. 

Try playing the chords as jazz eights, then impro over this, with a jamtrack or band in a box or record your own self, to I chord scale. For example, if we have Dm7-G7-Cmaj7, play over it on C Major scale. This is a really good start. 

After you get the hang of it, try playing and avoid the 4th note of the scale which in this case is F and try playing the 3rd and 7th interval more of each chord. 

Another great way, to play nice lines is play arpeggios and not just scales. Arpeggio's notes fit better in each chord and give a nicer sound. So go, Dm7 arpeggio, G7 arpeggio and Cmajor 7 arpeggio. 

Also keep in mind, most jazz players play more the 3rd and the 7th. 
For exaple the bass player might be playing the tonic of each chord and you the guitar player can feel in with just the 3rd and the 7th. 

well, there are many ideas and concepts you can try, but I think those ones are the most basic.

Edit: NickCormier pretty much says everything, I wouldn't recommend any books but just one, it's kinda old but it's good, Garrison Fewel's Jazz Improvisation book. And also get a Real Book and learn pieces you like. Good begginers pieces, would be "Blue Bossa", "Summertime", etc.


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## Mr. Big Noodles (Oct 29, 2011)




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## SirMyghin (Oct 29, 2011)

^^

As informative as ever chap.


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## SnowfaLL (Oct 29, 2011)

SchecterWhore contributed enough to theory threads on this forum; he can have one free troll pass.


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## kung_fu (Oct 29, 2011)

That was no troll. We just don't know enough theory to decipher its meaning


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