# Small head for metal



## likegluelikecrew (Mar 8, 2013)

Hey guys 

I've been looking to buy my first bass head (I'm mainly a guitar player), I have a max budget of £500, but the cheaper the better really. It also needs to be small enough to be carried in a backpack.

The tone I'm going for is that metallic, distorted but not fuzzy kind of tone. Heres an example: 


The main choices I've been looking are; the Orange Bass Terror 500 (£490) or the Aguilar Tone Hammer 350 (£450). Others I've looked at are the Markbass Little Mark 250 (but i've read they're very clean) and the Ampeg PF 350 or 500.

The bass I'm using is a Squier Vintage Modified Jazz 4 string in standard tuning, going to replace the nickel plated strings with some stainless steel ones too. I also don't want any pedals in front of the amp, I'm a simple kind of guy 

Any help/suggestions will be much appreciated


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## Isaiah (Mar 8, 2013)

You dont often get decent distorted bass tones with just a head. Id suggest researching and getting a decent pedal.


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## TedEH (Mar 8, 2013)

Isaiah said:


> You dont often get decent distorted bass tones with just a head. Id suggest researching and getting a decent pedal.



I think that's a matter of opinion. I've always preferred the distortion you get from a good head than from pedals, but it's probably a matter of taste. The sound from the example can probably be provided by a head or decent preamp pretty easily.

I'd be more worried that an amp that can fit in your backpack might not be able to compete with the volume pushed out by the rest of the band if you plan on jamming with a whole band or playing shows, and depending on the kind of tone you use, how good your cabinet is, how loud your guitarists are, etc.


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 8, 2013)

I use a Tone Hammer 500 and a VT Bass pedal to get the flavor of overdrive I'm looking for. The Aguilar has the grunt, and the VT Bass adds the "clang."


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## WaffleTheEpic (Mar 8, 2013)

For about that price, couldn't you swing a Darkglass preamp and just go straight to the computer?


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## cGoEcYk (Mar 8, 2013)

I think all of your choices are good. Try 'em if you can and see what you like, with MarkBass probably being my least favorite of those options. I think a Sansamp VT/BDDI etc are all good tools for getting a more aggressive sound. Only a few bass amps are naturally voiced awesomely for metal tones (Mesa Carbine M3 might suit you but probably isnt cheap in UK) while most seem to be designed a little more well rounded for more traditional styles. Sansamp overcomes that and gives you mad additional tone options IMO. I prefer more vintage voiced amps with some hair in the preamp and burly midrange with the Sansamp... you can play more aggressively with a little bit spongier give that way than on a super clean amp.


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## likegluelikecrew (Mar 8, 2013)

TedEH said:


> I'd be more worried that an amp that can fit in your backpack might not be able to compete with the volume pushed out by the rest of the band



I've been lending a Laney RB9 300w from my friend and that has been plenty loud enough, all of these are 300w or more so I think I should be ok



TemjinStrife said:


> I use a Tone Hammer 500 and a VT Bass pedal to get the flavor of overdrive I'm looking for. The Aguilar has the grunt, and the VT Bass adds the "clang."



Thats a sweet setup! Would you say the 500 is worth the extra cash over the 350? Do you have to run the 500 cranked with a band to be heard or do you think I could get away with the smaller option?



WaffleTheEpic said:


> For about that price, couldn't you swing a Darkglass preamp and just go straight to the computer?



I want an amp for playing live and practicing, not recording, although Darkglass stuff does sound amazing



cGoEcYk said:


> I think all of your choices are good. Try 'em if you can and see what you like, with MarkBass probably being my least favorite of those options. I think a Sansamp VT/BDDI etc are all good tools for getting a more aggressive sound. Only a few bass amps are naturally voiced awesomely for metal tones (Mesa Carbine M3 might suit you but probably isnt cheap in UK) while most seem to be designed a little more well rounded for more traditional styles. Sansamp overcomes that and gives you mad additional tone options IMO. I prefer more vintage voiced amps with some hair in the preamp and burly midrange with the Sansamp... you can play more aggressively with a little bit spongier give that way than on a super clean amp.



Most of them I wouldn't be able to try out which is why I resorted to posting here, the only one I know of which I can try locally is the Orange. I'm thinking it might make more sense to go for the cheaper option of the Ampeg PF500 and put the money i'd save towards a Sansamp pedal


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 8, 2013)

If you can swing it, I'd say go for the TH500. That extra couple watts can make all the difference if you're pushing an 8 ohm cabinet... and the FX loop/preamp out is pretty handy.


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 8, 2013)

WaffleTheEpic said:


> For about that price, couldn't you swing a Darkglass preamp and just go straight to the computer?



It's hilarious that everyone on this site seems to think that all anyone needs is DI or that all anyone does is record at home.

Places I play, we get PA for the vocals and that's it.


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## likegluelikecrew (Mar 8, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> If you can swing it, I'd say go for the TH500. That extra couple watts can make all the difference if you're pushing an 8 ohm cabinet... and the FX loop/preamp out is pretty handy.



The 500 is def the option I want to take, just means longer saving, or sell some other gear on



TemjinStrife said:


> It's hilarious that everyone on this site seems to think that all anyone needs is DI or that all anyone does is record at home.
> 
> Places I play, we get PA for the vocals and that's it.



QFT. Or places that do have a PA, but have dumb engineers that try to take your bass DI without a DI box, then tell you to turn your amp down because it's clipping the mixing board. What a joke


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## Igotsoul4u (Mar 8, 2013)

Gallien Krueger MB fusion is a great value and sounds great.


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## knifefightintheor (Mar 9, 2013)

Our bassist has the Terror Bass and it cuts through and sounds amazing. Just my $0.02

I'm not a bass player so I can't comment on "feel" or anything of the sort, sadly.


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## GenghisCoyne (Mar 11, 2013)

WaffleTheEpic said:


> For about that price, couldn't you swing a Darkglass preamp and just go straight to the computer?


 what he said


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## likegluelikecrew (Mar 12, 2013)

GenghisCoyne said:


> what he said





likegluelikecrew said:


> I want an amp for playing live and practicing, not recording



.


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## WaffleTheEpic (Mar 12, 2013)

Whoa man, chill out. Didn't know you were looking for playing live.

In that case, you can't go wrong with MarkBass or Behringer.
Guitar heads also give a pretty sweet distorted bass tone, actually. Played in a band for a few years and my bass player used a guitar head through a bass cab as his set up.

I also +1 the Terror Bass. Orange products can do no wrong by me.


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 12, 2013)

Markbass's thing is "clean and warm" not "grindy and distorted." And I've had a Behringer kickback bass combo for ages, but I wouldn't rely on it for recording or gigging. Doesn't sound particularly great, and reliability is a HUGE issue.

He was also looking for a "small" amp head. Any guitar amp that's going to function well in a bass context (aside from maybe the Crate Powerblock) is going to be bulky and heavy, or else underpowered.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 13, 2013)

Eden makes a couple small heads that would be worth checking out. I have their hybrid state preamp and can get some really sweet distortion and drive from the tube blend on it. Its pretty organic sounding too so it won't gut your tone and make it sound like a bad midi track lol


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 13, 2013)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Eden makes a couple small heads that would be worth checking out. I have their hybrid state preamp and can get some really sweet distortion and drive from the tube blend on it. Its pretty organic sounding too so it won't gut your tone and make it sound like a bad midi track lol



Unfortunately, the WTX260 was a POS. I haven't played the WTX500, and IIRC it's pretty much just a clean/warm amp.


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## WaffleTheEpic (Mar 14, 2013)

Just gonna pop back in here, probably to the detriment of poor Temjin over here (he seems to have an aneurysm every time I post something), but Dunlop is releasing a pretty sweet MXR bass overdrive pedal. Sounds nice and grindy. Sure, it's not a head, but you could pair it with a MarkBass and get that nice metal sound you're looking for.

Look on the Jim Dunlop Guitar Products Facebook page ( http://www.facebook.com/dunlopmanufacturing ) for the demo by Evan Brewer. Pretty nice tone on it, you might like it.

Edit: another video http://youtu.be/5nu5VEcPFfs


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## TemjinStrife (Mar 14, 2013)

The new MXR Bass Overdrive? It's a Pork Loin with a blanket over it 

I really wanted to like it, but it is super dark in both the overdrive side and the "clean blend" side. You're better off getting a Way Huge Pork Loin (also a Dunlop product, btw) which is a great OD option for bass AND guitar.


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## carcass (Mar 14, 2013)

for this parcitular sound, try to look for Behringer BDI21, it is a clone of famous Sansamp BDDI and honestly, it is really great deal for the buck


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## cGoEcYk (Mar 15, 2013)

Hartke VXL is another good Sansamp clone. It's a little more versatile with some other tone shaping features but isnt true bypass. For ~$70 it will get u in Sansamp territory though.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 15, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> Unfortunately, the WTX260 was a POS. I haven't played the WTX500, and IIRC it's pretty much just a clean/warm amp.



I haven't gotten a chance to play them yet....but that's disappointing to hear  I have the WT1000 Navigator and its one of the most versatile heads I've ever played through...I was hoping the smaller versions might have been decent, I wanted to get one for my practice/jam session rig...bummer....


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## GRUNTKOR (Mar 15, 2013)

Ampeg PF500 rules. I know, I have one. Put it through a 4ohm cab and it gets loud, plus you can get some grind out of the preamp


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## Mwoit (Mar 15, 2013)

TemjinStrife said:


> Markbass's thing is "clean and warm" not "grindy and distorted." And I've had a Behringer kickback bass combo for ages, but I wouldn't rely on it for recording or gigging. Doesn't sound particularly great, and reliability is a HUGE issue.
> 
> He was also looking for a "small" amp head. Any guitar amp that's going to function well in a bass context (aside from maybe the Crate Powerblock) is going to be bulky and heavy, or else underpowered.



I'd like to contribute to this thread by saying Markbass' are ALL about clean and warm. They sound fab for that. 

Grind and distort? Nope. I own a Markbass F1 and a Darkglass B7K, and they both go together like a oil and water. 

So at the moment, I'm trying to get rid of my F1 for something else.


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## dax21 (Mar 15, 2013)

Can't you run the B7K into effects return or something and just use the power amp section of the markbass?


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## Mwoit (Mar 19, 2013)

dax21 said:


> Can't you run the B7K into effects return or something and just use the power amp section of the markbass?



I did, but it didn't work as well as I thought it would. Maybe it's the cab, or I need to play louder. I'll test it in the future!


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## Alex_GFY (Mar 20, 2013)

my first foray into bass was a Hartke LH 500 with an M80, worked out well, until i needed to get louder


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## iron blast (Mar 25, 2013)

if weight wasn't an issue I'd suggest a Ampeg B2re head. They can be had super cheap Ive seen as low as $150 us dollars :O They deff sound good and grindy for metal and will be loud enough for most local gigs 250 watts rms a channel I powered two Ampeg 4x10's with mine. One big issue for you might be the weight as its fairly heavy and a big 2 space rack at this price you could buy a cab and the head and still have cash for a distortion if it wasn't evil enough already for you. I assure you it would be tho as I used it in a black metal band and in a buddy's deathcore band.


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