# Mesa Mini Rec vs. H&K Tubemeister 18



## Nonservium (Jul 11, 2012)

So I'm looking at buying a smaller lunchbox sized amp. I've looked through a large chunk of the available options and have boiled it down to 2:

The Mesa Boogie Mini-Rectifier & the Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 18.

Both are fairly flexible and have two channels. The HK nearly has three if you consider the boost. The Mesa has EQ for both channels and 4 modes split between those two channels. The FX loop has a hard bypass which is nice as well. I've spent a lot of time playing my friends older Dual Rec as well as the Dual Rec model in the L6 HD500 and I really like both tone wise which is why I'm leaning towards picking one of these up. (Ola's metal demo also made me go HOLY SHIT as well lol)

The K&H model has two channels but I think the EQ is shared between the two? Can any of you confirm this? It lacks the hard bypass on the FX loop but it, to me, makes up for it with the redbox output and power soak stuff. Plus it just looks awesome. The Chappers demo on this spoke well of it and Nick at the AxePalace also talked highly of it. I have never played on anything made by H&K so I'd be taking a bit of a leap here.

My questions to you guys are is the Mesa really worth the extra ~$400? Which do you think would be better for mostly metal? And finally, since the Mesa has 4 or 8ohm outputs can I pair it with a 2x12 cab such as an Orange PPC that has a 16ohm rating on it?

If any of you have either of these, please chime in with your thoughts and let me know what you like and don't like.


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## budda (Jul 11, 2012)

food for thought: the recto mini won't sound like its bigger siblings because it's so much smaller. It will probably sound much closer to the single rectifier.


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## Sephael (Jul 11, 2012)

Each channel has separate volume and gain, but share standard eq. Volume isn't so mixh volume though, you use the power soak more to get the volume you want. 

The $400 difference...for that you can grab a TightMetal (with sidetrak) for awesome high gain, and a good delay pedal.


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## Drew (Jul 11, 2012)

budda said:


> food for thought: the recto mini won't sound like its bigger siblings because it's so much smaller. It will probably sound much closer to the single rectifier.



It's a totally different beast, actualy - the EL84s have a much different sound. I loved it, actually, but my taste in tone is probably a little different than most of this board. It'd be an awesome gritty blues rock or hard rock amp, that could also do metal fairly well (as Ola demonstrated). I have no idea how it'd compare to the H&K, having never played one.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 11, 2012)

With a boost to tighten things up, the H&K sounds like it could handle high gain pretty easily.


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## MetalThrasher (Jul 11, 2012)

I have never played the H&K but out of the two I would recommend it. I had the Mini Recto and I returned it. Bought it on a Friday and took it back Monday. It was a loud amp for its size. I had it running through my Orange PC412 cabinet. The tones I got were good, it has nice amount of gain on tap and for the three days I had it I did find a couple of settings that I liked. However, the reason why I took it back was because of the feedback I was getting from the amp. It was insane! I tried 3 different guitars and still got the same annoying feedback. I have 3 other amps including a Mark III and none of them had that annoying overkill feedback that the Mini Recto gave me. I'd try the H&K as its priced a lot cheaper than the Mini Recto.


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## SirMyghin (Jul 11, 2012)

^^^

Sounds like a tube issue.


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## Nonservium (Jul 11, 2012)

Yeah that would be annoying as hell. At this point I think I am leaning towards the H&K at this point. The fact that I haven't played either makes the price point issue sort of hard to get over. Thanks for all the input guys.


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## MetalThrasher (Jul 11, 2012)

SirMyghin said:


> ^^^
> 
> Sounds like a tube issue.



I was thinking about that as well. I just didn't want to deal with it so I returned it. Maybe I did get a dud.


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## Nonservium (Jul 11, 2012)

MetalThrasher said:


> I was thinking about that as well. I just didn't want to deal with it so I returned it. Maybe I did get a dud.



You were right to do that, if it wasn't and you still had to return it you'd be out the cost of tubes as most places won't take them back.


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## 7stringDemon (Jul 11, 2012)

Played the H&K yesterday with an RG7321 in Drop A and I have to say, this little thing got pretty heavy! And the cleans were damn good! And the crunch was nice and smooth but still had a nice grind to it. Really couldn't get a bad tone out of this thing. I was on the 1W setting since I had to play at a lower volume.

No experience with the Mini Rec, sadly.

Though didn't Carvin just come out with a Lunchbox V3? Or was it a Legacy? 

EDIT: Yes they did! Both actually!

http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/V3M

http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/VL300

Not sure if you're looking for low watts or small size though. Because they're both small but the V3M is 50W and the VL300 is 100W.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

I was looking for small size and low watts. That V3M is perfect!!! I never would've even thought of Carvin.


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## Underworld (Jul 12, 2012)

Personnaly, I tried the mini recto last week and was not impressed. Cool for hardrock, rock in general, but not for 7 string death metal, even boosted (IMO). 

Have you think of the Baron Snott Watt? It is a 7 watts amp at the 650$ price point.


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## Sam MJ (Jul 12, 2012)

How about the EVH 5150 III mini? That's definitely gonna have the gain.



Heres a vid of it at low volumes


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## Zado (Jul 12, 2012)

carvin v3 mini?


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## Sephael (Jul 12, 2012)

Needing to play at night some times but still wanting pure tube goodness made the H&K so desirable for me personally, the power soak goes to full silent. I run to a small 4 channel mixer and can play through headphones. And when you are on the full soak mode you can go direct out and not need a cab connected for a load.

Don't know how it is on other amps, but with the tubemeister the poweramp section is voiced differently for both channels.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

That's exactly what I liked about the H&K, the power soak is very useful. How does the H&K handle lower tunings like Drop-C or Drop-A on a 7?

I spent some time looking at the Carvin V3M and it seems to be the most versatile of them all thus far. 

I haven't had a chance to really dig into the 5150iii but I'll get to it.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

I'm guessing the 5150 III 50w isn't out yet as it's listed as coming soon or not available at MF and Sam Ash? Any idea on a release date for this thing? It's pricey but packs some punch with it's options. The Carvin is still looking very nice at this point.


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## troyguitar (Jul 12, 2012)

I've played the H&K and liked it well enough but would probably choose the new Legacy 3 mini head despite (or perhaps because of) it being 100 watts. You will never run out of headroom and the tones just sound much smoother. Of course I've only heard Vai playing through it so it's not exactly a fair comparison


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## purpledc (Jul 12, 2012)

I would avoid the V3M and that is from a carvin fanboy. If your looking for tight high gain metal tones the mini recto is the way to go. Any reports of bad feedback i think should be chalked up to bad tubes, poor eq settings or gain settings. Any high gain amp can feedback if the gain and treble/presence controls are dialed too high. 

The reason i dont recommend the V3M (owned one for 7 or 8 months) is the lack of definition. They are a very dark sounding amp and they dont crunch up very well. Power chords lack definition. Swapping the power tubes for JJ's helps a lot but it aint no recto thats for sure. If you like crisp attack you dont want the v3m. If you want a more fluid like soloing tone then it very well could be right up your alley. Me? when I play a power chord I want people to know its a power chord. 

As for the price difference the reason the mesa is more money than the HK is due to the fact that the mesa is made in the USA with primarily US and Japanese internal parts being utilized throughout. The HK is made in china with mostly chinese parts. This doesnt matter to a lot of people now but it is a fact that US production and high end parts will substantially increase the cost of an item which is what your seeing there. 

And having played the mini recto I can tell you that thing sounds just as good as its big brother. When you plug into it you know its a recto. The V3M IMHO sounds NOTHING like a big V3.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

purpledc said:


> I would avoid the V3M and that is from a carvin fanboy. If your looking for tight high gain metal tones the mini recto is the way to go. Any reports of bad feedback i think should be chalked up to bad tubes, poor eq settings or gain settings. Any high gain amp can feedback if the gain and treble/presence controls are dialed too high.
> 
> The reason i dont recommend the V3M (owned one for 7 or 8 months) is the lack of definition. They are a very dark sounding amp and they dont crunch up very well. Power chords lack definition. Swapping the power tubes for JJ's helps a lot but it aint no recto thats for sure. If you like crisp attack you dont want the v3m. If you want a more fluid like soloing tone then it very well could be right up your alley. Me? when I play a power chord I want people to know its a power chord.
> 
> ...



For a bit of rounding out of your statement, what guitars did you run through that V3M?


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## TemjinStrife (Jul 12, 2012)

I'd take the Mini Rec over the Tubemeister any day, having spent a little time with the Rec and a bit more with the Tubemeister.

The Tubemeister just sounds like a "small amp." The Mini Rec doesn't.


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## Underworld (Jul 12, 2012)

Nonservium said:


> I'm guessing the 5150 III 50w isn't out yet as it's listed as coming soon or not available at MF and Sam Ash? Any idea on a release date for this thing?


 

They ARE out! I bought mine in january 

Seriously nice amp, but not really a bedroom amp! And not lunchbox sized either!


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

Hmmm, wonder why is hows up unavailable?


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## Andromalia (Jul 12, 2012)

I have an H&K, it's the only amp I kept with the axe 2 as it's very practical to go jam someplace. you can get into "dry" high gain territory with it but, yeah, no oldschool swedish death metal.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

Andromalia said:


> no oldschool swedish death metal.



What would you compare it to? Have you used a external boost on the high gain or just the one it came with? 

I like old death metal :-(


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## Andromalia (Jul 12, 2012)

Well I'd say you can get modern tones with it without too many problems, as low end isn't really the issue and you can't get a lot with this at 1 watt as the speakers aren't pushed enough. I'dsay, it's good up to 90es Slayer territory for live playing. With the appropriate mixing/mastering cheatcodes you can get any amp to sound virtually like anything on a recording anyway.
I haven't used any external pedal with it, as I also own an axefx2 this amp is just used to go jam at friend's places with gear easy to transport and most importantly light. That and my Les Paul and here we go. (most of my friends have a spare 1x12 cab around)


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

I was thinking the H&K + a 2x12 would be what I would do initially but now I'm just flustered lol. 

I think I've found one I can go play so I'll test is out Saturday and see if I like it or not. I wish I could get my hands on a mini-rec as well but that's probably not gonna happen. If that Carvin has issues handling a power chord then that's not gonna work.

I'd love to just pick up one of the Orange amps but they're a rip-off at that price point with only one channel.


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## TemjinStrife (Jul 12, 2012)

My favorite "mini" amp for gigging under $600 is, far and away, the Jet City JCA22H. Great crunch and awesome lead channels, very loud, cuts great in a band, quite cheap ($400 new) and quite versatile.

The Blackstar HT-5 has a greater variety of sounds, but just isn't quite loud enough to hold up against a drummer through a 2x12.


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## Nonservium (Jul 12, 2012)

So I just got around to checking out that Baron Snott Watt. That's pretty fuckin sick. If it had a floor switch I'd be down. Gonna email them and see what that would run if it's an option.


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## leonardo7 (Jul 12, 2012)

Dude Ive never touched the H&K but its hard to believe anything beating the mini Rec w an OD in front.


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## wakjob (Jul 12, 2012)

Engl Gigmaster? Comes in 15 or 30 watts.


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## purpledc (Jul 12, 2012)

Nonservium said:


> For a bit of rounding out of your statement, what guitars did you run through that V3M?




Carvin CT6 with custom low output humbuckers tuned to drop C

Carvin SH550 semi hollow body. Tone rider alnico II humbuckers standard tuning.

Carvin Ultra V with EMGs. Standard tuning. 


The worst of them was the CT in drop C. Thing just couldnt handle the lows and had no chug.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 12, 2012)

leonardo7 said:


> Dude Ive never touched the H&K but its hard to believe anything beating the mini Rec w an OD in front.



Personally, I prefer the H&K. It's cheaper and seems to get a better tone, for my tastes.


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## leonardo7 (Jul 12, 2012)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Personally, I prefer the H&K. It's cheaper and seems to get a better tone, for my tastes.



Well I know tone is subjective but Ive definitely got to try this H&K then. By the way, have you tried the Mesa Mini Rec? It sounds way different than my two channel Triple Rec. the leads are creamier, and its the tightest Rectifier Ive ever played by far. They really did something right w the Mini Rec.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 12, 2012)

I never tried it, but I've heard quite a few clips, and it just isn't my thing. EL84's are probably my least favorite power tubes, so that's kind of a downer for me. 

EDIT: Wait... the H&K has EL84's also... Da fuq!?


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## TemjinStrife (Jul 13, 2012)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I never tried it, but I've heard quite a few clips, and it just isn't my thing. EL84's are probably my least favorite power tubes, so that's kind of a downer for me.
> 
> EDIT: Wait... the H&K has EL84's also... Da fuq!?



ITP: Psychoacoustic confirmation bias


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