# PA System...What to Get?



## scottro202 (Sep 26, 2010)

So, I'm in an alternative/blues rock band. 

We need a PA. We've been discussing different ways of going about it.

There are 2 main parties in the debate. My drummer and me. I say, we all spend about $200, I get powered monitors, someone gets a unpowered mixer, 2 people get one powered main, and we'll have a kickass PA system.

My drummer thinks we should get some cheaper PA, each spend $50-$75, and we'd all own it collectively. I want each of us to own thing out of the whole package. That way, if we break up, or one of us moves/quits/gets fired/suddenly combusted in an attempt of setting the guitar on fire, we won't have a mess of who-owns-what and whose-money's-whose.

What do you guys think? Also, we're starting to play parties and places where we NEED our own PA. We've been going out of my keyboard amp for vocals for now 


Cheers for any advice!!!


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## MaxOfMetal (Sep 26, 2010)

Definitely go with the "each member owns a piece" method. 

Also, I gotta recommend going Carvin for the PA itself.


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## scottro202 (Sep 26, 2010)

Alright. now, do we go with powered mixer + unpowered speakers? Or unpowered mixer + powered speakers?


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## MaxOfMetal (Sep 26, 2010)

scottro202 said:


> Alright. now, do we go with powered mixer + unpowered speakers? Or unpowered mixer + powered speakers?



Well, with your budget (assuming around $1000) I'd go with powered mixer and passive cabs, for no other reason than you'll have more options as far as cabs in that price range.

This would get the job done quite well, and it's pretty damn close to your budget: http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/single.php?product=XP1000L-1503&cid=102


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## SargeantVomit (Sep 26, 2010)

Always buy individual pieces, never buy collectively.

That being said, up your budget by at least double, 200 dollars wont buy you anything worth having and will be a waste of money. With that in mind, buy what meets your immediate needs now and plan to add in the future.

Do you plan to run anything other than the vocals through the PA? Kick drum? How many channels do you need? 

Here's a basic setup that should handle small to medium gigs where you need to bring your own PA.

Two of these. (2 members each buy one at ~375)
Buy Yamaha S115V Club Series V Speaker | Unpowered Cabinets | Musician's Friend 

Two of these (either split between two or someone cough up a little extra)
Buy Yamaha BR12M 12" 2-Way Monitor Pair | Unpowered Stage Monitors | Unpowered Cabinets | Musician's Friend

This mixer (with vocal effects included)
Buy Behringer XENYX X1222USB 16 Ch USB Mixer with Effects | Unpowered Mixers | Musician's Friend
These mics (which are identical to SM58's and perfect for stage use)
Buy Behringer XM8500 Microphone 3-Pack | Live Microphone Packages | Musician's Friend
These stands (buy one get one free)
Buy On-Stage Stands Tripod Mic Stand With Boom Buy One Get One Free | Microphone Booms | Musician's Friend
These cables for the stationary mics
Buy Musician's Gear Lo-Z Mic Cable 20 Feet 2-Pack | Microphone Cables | Musician's Friend
This cable for your main singer since it's longer.
Buy Shure C50J Microphone Cable | Microphone Cables | Musician's Friend
That's for another member at ~$380

You could probably get away without monitors at least for now, they aren't really necessary. You'll still need speaker stands on top of that, and a power amp to drive it all.


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## scottro202 (Sep 27, 2010)

GAH. Now my drummer's all "It sound selfish to buy it all one by one". We're four 16 year old boys in a band, there is no reason NOT to buy individually. My drummer is doing the equivalent of assuming our singer and his girlfriend will end up getting married and staying together forever.

I told him if he wanted to spend less, that's fine. But he's still all "It's selfish, wah wah wah." He told me how The Bastard Suns, his drummer's teacher's band (Check em out, awesome band) own nearly everything collectively, the bassist's bass, the drummer's kit, etc. Well, they're 27-29 year olds, not 16 year olds 

And Srgt. Vomit, $200 a piece if really maxing it out for us even. Remember, we're a bunch of 16 year olds, one of us with a good paying job atm


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## MaxOfMetal (Sep 27, 2010)

Have you guys considered renting?


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## scottro202 (Sep 27, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Have you guys considered renting?



Hmmm...... I like where this is going. And no to answer your question.

How much would a place charge for a PA like/slightly better than what you guys are suggesting, for like, one night/gig?


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## SargeantVomit (Sep 27, 2010)

If you can't afford to shell out the scratch for something decent, you should consider renting when you need to (which you can do collectively) and saving up for individual pieces in the meantime. Renting a basic PA like I suggested above from your local music store should only cost 30-40 dollars per night. So like 6-8 dollars per member each time you gig which is probably like 3-4 times a month. It's really affordable.

It's NEVER a good idea to buy gear collectively. Ever. Even at 27-29 it's a terrible idea. You will eventually part ways. How many bands last your entire life with the same members? None. Ever. It's easier to have your monitors walk out the door with so-and-so who paid for them when they quit the band than it is to argue about it and try and work out an agreement after the fact.


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## MaxOfMetal (Sep 27, 2010)

scottro202 said:


> Hmmm...... I like where this is going. And no to answer your question.
> 
> How much would a place charge for a PA like/slightly better than what you guys are suggesting, for like, one night/gig?



Well, just realizing you guys are 16, you may run into some problems. 

It really depends on the rules of the place you (or your parents in this case, on your behalf) rent from. Most places rent out stuff for increments of days and weeks, as well as charge for where you're taking their equipment. 

Typically, you'll be looking at a pretty low fair price for the rental itself, but there's typically a decently sized, refundable deposit. 

Call up some local music stores and investigate. Tell them exactly what you'll need, how long you'll need it, etc.


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## scottro202 (Nov 24, 2010)

Instead of making another thread about a PA, I figure i'll bump my own thread.

So, my drummers dad wants us to buy a PA, then have us work it off  Please tell me I'm not the only one who thinks this is an awful idea?


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 24, 2010)

If your drummer's dad is willing to put out the cash, then by all means let him. 

Though, get in writing that each band member will be responsible for paying back thier own, even share of the cost of the PA. Then be sure to always pay with a check.


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## scottro202 (Nov 24, 2010)

See, my only problem with my drummer's dad buying it, is once we work it off, it'll be ours, which is going completely against my original belief (That I still hold) that it's not a good idea to own it collectively.

and they don't seem to have problem with the money, it's the general belief that they own it as "a unit". Which I guess has a bit of novelty to it, but I'm not buying it (pun not intended).


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 24, 2010)

That's the beauty of having a paper trail of how much you payed off. Let's say you wind up paying $300. That means that $300 worth of that system belongs to you. If you guys split up tomorrow, and you payed your dues, they'll owe you $300 in gear.


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## scottro202 (Nov 24, 2010)

My drummer's dad doesn't want us to pay it off, he wants us to work it off. If we just work it off, we have no objective way to say who owes how much.


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## MaxOfMetal (Nov 24, 2010)

Then what do you have to lose really?


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## scottro202 (Nov 24, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Then what do you have to lose really?



Hmmm... I guess nothing. I just really dislike the idea of owning it as a whole (I'd be an awful communist), but I guess if I'm not dropping any cash it's no biggie. I'm tired from our gig tonight and I'm probably overreacting a bit


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## kennydoe (Jan 7, 2011)

I think buying collectively is a good idea...but there should be some provisions.

Everybody kicks in $xxx.xx - let's say $200. Write up a little document that says "if johnny leaves in year 1, the rest of us will buy him out of his share, assuming that the person who replaces johnny will put in his $200. After the first year, the $200 becomes $180 (10% depreciation) and about $20-30 per year after that. If he stays for 5 years, he most certainly got his fair use out of it and can walk away.

You also have to decide who's going to pay for repairs when something breaks.

Somebody's dad offering to buy a little system sounds good. He wants to do something for you guys and he's being supportive. It will make him feel good to do so. If that's the case, however, it should belong to the person who's father bought it. In the sprit of 'fair', the person who'owns' the PA should get a few extra bucks, assuming you made some money at the gig. In that case, the band should also agree to contribute to repairs and maintenence.


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## SamSam (Jan 9, 2011)

In my current band our singer has decided to pay for the PA. The reason that this is the best way IMO is simple. The rest of us have had to pay well over a thousand pounds on our individual rigs, bar the singer who only really needs a microphone. I didnt think it would be fair that after paying what we have already that we should also pay 75% of the PA. Also if you ever break up the singer will need a PA to join another band. Because the average group of adults will tell you to GTFO if you don't have your own gear. We now have a PA which cost s £1000 but thats a drop in the water when my amp head alone cost over £2k. 

Obviously it's each to their own. But I see this as he most fair way to share out the expensive hobby that is being in a gigging band.


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## scottro202 (Jan 10, 2011)

SamSam said:


> In my current band our singer has decided to pay for the PA. The reason that this is the best way IMO is simple. The rest of us have had to pay well over a thousand pounds on our individual rigs, bar the singer who only really needs a microphone. I didnt think it would be fair that after paying what we have already that we should also pay 75% of the PA. Also if you ever break up the singer will need a PA to join another band. Because the average group of adults will tell you to GTFO if you don't have your own gear. We now have a PA which cost s £1000 but thats a drop in the water when my amp head alone cost over £2k.
> 
> Obviously it's each to their own. But I see this as he most fair way to share out the expensive hobby that is being in a gigging band.



Well, our singer also plays guitar. And we're all doing vocals, so to say that wouldn't be fair to him.

And we ended up doing what I wanted to do before, everyone buy a piece


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## ZEBOV (Jan 20, 2011)

EDIT: Nevermind, I didn't see that everyone already bought a piece.


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