# Ibanez RG2228 and RGA8 owners beware!



## Barney (Oct 22, 2010)

SCROLL DOWN FOR UPDATES!

Hello everyone!

I'll try to cut this short and be as clear about the case as possible.
(English is not my mother tongue.)

I'll start with the bad news:
The nut on my RGA8 got ruined. It just simply broke.
Be extremely careful when tightening it or yours will end up like mine.
Just check the photos.

There are 2 big problems with the nut on the RGA8 (and probably with the one on the RG2228&#8230; if the hardware is the same):

1 - design flaw. 
The screws that hold down the pads are identical. 
Their length is the same for the pad(s) that hold(s) down the thinner strings as 
for the ones that hold down the thicker strings. 
The thicker strings will allow less grooves to catch the base of the nut.

2 - the nut is made of crap. 
This should not happen to a quality material.
IMO the worst thing that could happen to a quality material (like steel) is 
that the grooves wear out fast(er).

This thing just broke to pieces.

I tried to figure out what happened and came up with this:
The thickest string (D'Addario 74) did not let the screw to catch the base of the nut
tightly enough and held it back. It could not go deeper so it tore the base apart.

This problem could be solved if Ibanez put longer screws in the pads that hold down 
the thicker strings and made the thing from quality metal, not crap.

There is one more thing to mention about this case before anyone starts calling me a noob idiot:
This was not "done" by me. It was "done" by a friend of mine who is a professional luthier, builds and repairs 
instruments and has dealt with many many guitars with locking nuts and has not seen such thing.
This never happened to any of the guitars in his hands so far. So I don't think it's his fault. 

I don't really know what to do now. Ask for a replacement part and hope to get it free? 
This nut costs 175(!) US dollars according to ibanezrules.com ! (I live in Europe though&#8230


All the best,

Barney

Oh, I almost forgot! The small screw/bolt in the bridge (the 3rd one in the back) got ripped out from the wood also.
(The counterpart to be exact) Same day. I know it's friday but it isn't the 13th, is it?


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 22, 2010)

Looks like the finish just came off. Call up your country's Ibanez distro, this should be replaced for free via the warranty.


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## Mvotre (Oct 22, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Looks like the finish just came off. Call up your country's Ibanez distro, this should be replaced for free via the warranty.



finish? look at the last photo.. theres metal missing 

must be a mega ultra cheap metal, by the way


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## Barney (Oct 22, 2010)

Yeah, there is actually a big piece missing from there where it's grey and 
there are cracks in the nut that might not be noticable just by looking at these shots.

The 2nd photo is the best.


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## Customisbetter (Oct 22, 2010)

I actually Filed the nut on my RG2228 and that finish is super hard. I believe your nut might have been bunk and you should get it replaced fairly easily. 

Also, Looking again, the nut on the RGA is VERY different than that on the RG8.


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## vampiregenocide (Oct 22, 2010)

I would expect the hardware on the 2228 is a bit better, being a prestige, though this is the first time I've heard of this issue on an RGA8.


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## possumkiller (Oct 22, 2010)

What a POS. Thats crazy. Too many parts being made of die cast turd metal nowadays.


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## Barney (Oct 22, 2010)

I checked the replacement parts list at Ibanez.com | Parts
and the nuts do differ:

no. 2LN1MAA001 is for the RGA8 
and
no. 2LN00AA001 is for the RG2228

ibanezrules.com has the RG nut in stock that is sold for $175.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 22, 2010)

Customisbetter said:


> I actually Filed the nut on my RG2228 and that finish is super hard. I believe your nut might have been bunk and you should get it replaced fairly easily.
> 
> Also, Looking again, the nut on the RGA is VERY different than that on the RG8.





The RG2228 uses the Gotoh made 2LN00AA001, while the RGA8 uses the OEM made 2LN1MAA001. Different part numbers with different specs and makers.


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## leonardo7 (Oct 22, 2010)

And now we have yet more proof for anyone wondering why the Japanese made Ibanez guitars are more expensive than the Indonesian etc made ones. Also, if the hardware is different, makes you wonder about the grades of body wood thats underneath all that paint.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 22, 2010)

leonardo7 said:


> Also, if the hardware is different, makes you wonder about the grades of body wood thats underneath all that paint.



Same thing that's underneath the paint of any Cort made guitar.  

Cort is the world's largest guitar maker by a significant margin, and do work for just about all the guitars coming out of Korea and Indonesia.


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## Prime (Oct 22, 2010)

Bad casting... I friggin hate die cast.


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## Customisbetter (Oct 22, 2010)

Max, I know this is slightly OT, but am I correct in thinking that Agile, Epiphone, and Schecter are owned by another entity other than Cort?


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 22, 2010)

Customisbetter said:


> Max, I know this is slightly OT, but am I correct in thinking that Agile, Epiphone, and Schecter are owned by another entity other than Cort?



Schecter are made by Cort, that I know for sure. Agile looks to be made by Saein, one of the smaller South Korean OEMs. As for Epiphone, they're actually made at a Gibson owned facility in China.

It should be noted that Cort doesn't really "own" anything other than the facility and their own in-house Cort branded instruments. They're merely contracted out by ESP, Hoshino Gakki, etc. to make their guitars as OEM.


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## Customisbetter (Oct 22, 2010)

Huh I guess I learn something new errahday


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## Guamskyy (Oct 22, 2010)

Customisbetter said:


> Huh I guess I learn something new errahday



Ditto  But just spelled right!


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## Barney (Oct 22, 2010)

OK. I'm gonna e-mail thomann tomorrow (I got it from them) and ask for a replacement part. ( As far as I can see we agree that it should be covered by the warranty.)
If they are willing to send me a new one, I'll try to convince them to give me the superior nut that's on the RG2228 'cause I do not wish to encounter this problem again. 
Maybe they'll agree that it's better to use the superior one rather than changing the nut every month.. I got this guitar 2 weeks ago approx. so it's kinda ridiculous.


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## Customisbetter (Oct 22, 2010)

I almost guarentee the rg8 nut won't fit.


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## Barney (Oct 23, 2010)

It's is possible but I'm not sure. 
The width of the neck at the nut on the RG differs by 1mm. 
RGA is 55, RG is 54 wide.

UPDATE: I sent an e-mail to thomann about the problems. 
(bridge screw ripping out the counterpart from the body + the nut problem)
I requested a replacement nut. (The RGA type) 
The bridge will be fixed by my luthier friend on monday or tuesday.


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## Barney (Oct 23, 2010)

A few thoughts on the Ibanez guitars and mine especially.

8 string guitars are quite new instruments. 
(Let's forget about the custom handmade things like Conklins etc.. for now.)
Ibanez probably made a mistake and did not think about this being a problem. 
(the screw is too short in the "bass" pad of the nut.)
I'm a bit disappointed, but I'm not mad at anyone. Shit happens.
RGA8s are fine guitars but there is some more work and tweaking required to make them really good. They'll probably come out with new improved 8string models in a few years and those will be better and more stable.

Back to the hardware and electronics: The difference in hardware, the EMGs and the obviously better construction of the japanese made RG2228s still do not justify the price difference IMO. You can buy 2 RGA8s from the price of one RG2228. I think the pricing on the RG is nonsense. 

I still like this guitar, cause it's mine and it's sexy.  The headstock looks much better on this then the RG.


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## Koshchei (Oct 23, 2010)

I think that Ibanez cut costs too far - think CBS Fender or Norlin Gibson during the 1970s. Not sure if it's because of the horrendous global economy, or just profit whoring, but these things are normally tested before a product is green-lighted by management for release to the public. A guitar is supposed to last 100+ years, not 60 days.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> I think that Ibanez cut costs too far - think CBS Fender or Norlin Gibson during the 1970s. Not sure if it's because of the horrendous global economy, or just profit whoring, but these things are normally tested before the product is green-lighted by management for release to the public. A guitar is supposed to last 100+ years, not 60 days.



It seems the Cort production is what is at fault, and Ibanez not working with them fast enough to fix the error. The cheap hardware material is an industry wide issue it seems. 

All the things that seem to be going wrong with the RGAs has been tested heavily, and in practice functions wonderfully on the RG2228.

As for your comparisons, you have to remember, Fender and Gibson owned and operated their production facilities. Ibanez does not. They are simply a brand of Hoshino Gakki, which is primarily just a design and marketing firm. There have been numerous issues with Cortek's Indonesian facility as of late. Another factor is the distribution system which Hoshino Gakki uses, which leaves much of the QC outside of Cortek, in the hands of the distributor, which can vary greatly. Ibanez can't break their contract with Cort, as there are no other facilities equipped to handle the output.


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## SpaceDock (Oct 23, 2010)

I have had no problems with my RG2228, it seems solid as it gets. I think many of the bridge post problems can be the fault of people adjusting the bridge posts without loosening the back post and so it gets too much stress and pulls out. This problem with the nut seems to be from over torquing the nut screws. The nut does not need to be set so tight that it could break any metal. I have owned well over 20 locking bridge guitars and I have never stripped a single part or cross treaded anything. Respect your guitars and the limitations of their components. Setting up solid does not mean cranking down the screws. 

Just my 2 cents


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## Koshchei (Oct 23, 2010)

I agree with you to a point. Cort is contracted by the parent company to produce x number of an item at a particular price point y. 

Unless Ibanez simply said "make these as cheap as you possibly can, in order to compete with Agile, who is eating our breakfast in the 8 string market", there would have been a lot of back and forth during product development to strike a balance between cost, reliability, and quality.

While Cort did manufacture these turds, it was still Ibanez management who green-lighted the instruments for release, so responsibility still lies with them for this cock-up.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> I agree with you to a point. Cort is contracted by the parent company to produce x number of an item at a particular price point y.
> 
> Unless Ibanez simply said "make these as cheap as you possibly can, in order to compete with Agile, who is eating our breakfast in the 8 string market", there would have been a lot of back and forth during product development to strike a balance between cost, reliability, and quality.
> 
> While Cort did manufacture these turds, it was still Ibanez management who green-lighted the instruments for release, so responsibility still lies with them for this cock-up.



I never said this was not in some way Ibanez's fault, they do hold much of the blame, namely because they chose to stick with the existing 8-string hardware and not simplifying it, I feel that was their critical error, and I love the Fixed Edge. A simply flatmount bridge and proper corian nut would have negated these issues (or issue, as there seems to be only one RGA8 with a broken nut, unless there are other substantiated reports). 

While it did fall into Ibanez's hands to green-light the production, it's still Cort's responsibility to follow through with the production and to stick to a given level of quality, seeing as there are dozens of perfectly functional RGA8s it can only be assumed that the design itself is sound, can it not? As far as I know the prototypes of these guitars didn't have significant issues, but then again, no one but Ibanez knows that. 

Like I said, Ibanez still hold the blame though.


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## Koshchei (Oct 23, 2010)

What are your views regarding the cheap hardware issue that seems to be bringing down a lot of manufacturers? You know a fuck of a lot more than most people on the board, and probably have some useful/valuable insight as to why it's happening, and what can be done to correct it...

The last 5 or so years have been a real golden age for small luthiers and for players looking for instruments that go beyond the tired 22 fret/six string cliche, and it would be a shame to go back to the way things used to be (ie $400 plywood Samicks that don't float, and come with hardware that's been pre-rusted).


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> What are your views regarding the cheap hardware issue that seems to be bringing down a lot of manufacturers? You know a fuck of a lot more than most people on the board, and probably have some useful/valuable insight as to why it's happening, and what can be done to correct it...
> 
> The last 5 or so years have been a real golden age for small luthiers and for players looking for instruments that go beyond the tired 22 fret/six string cliche, and it would be a shame to go back to the way things used to be (ie $400 plywood Samicks that don't float, and come with hardware that's been pre-rusted).



Well, it's the same reason that $400 to $700 market has exploded. People don't really care who makes their instruments, or where they were crafted. All they really care only about how much "bang for buck" they get. It's a completely understandable practice which has been harbored quite well with the age of technology. I'm not knocking it. Twenty to thirty years ago (and beyond) folks cared more about craftsmanship than they did about the raw specs. This meant that more people were more willing to pay a premium for a well built product, that was made by skilled, trained craftsman who genuinely loved their _chosen_ occupation. 

The same thing has happened to hardware. No one cares if their trem was made by a machine shop that's been around for decades who only hires trained professionals and that they use the utmost materials. They care if it's "an OFR" or "not licensed", that might have flown a decade or two ago, but these days it's not that simple. 

Where some makers once prided themselves on using genuine Gotoh or Schaller hardware, now have to go for Chinese and sometimes Korean made OEM stuff, which is not made to the same tolerances, using the same level of materials, just to be able to compete in the market. Unfortunately for users of 7+ stringed instruments, it's worse. We're still a niche market, and that typically leads to cheaper hardware on production models, as the parts are significantly cheaper to have made OEM in China, as even the bigger hardware makers don't offer a lot of 7+ string options. 

The reason that the small builders have "exploded" is because tools, training, and CNC machines are getting cheaper and more accessible. Not to mention the "custom" market has gotten a lot more popular. These smaller builders are able to use "the best" hardware and parts, so they're not as heavily affected by the shift to cheaper parts the large scale manufacturers are making. 

The biggest player in this whole thing is Cort, plain and simple. They make more guitars in a couple months than most of their competitors make in a year. Thus, when they choose to use a certain OEM or vendor for parts and materials they tend to set the industry trend.


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## Barney (Oct 23, 2010)

I think there is a nice discussion going on here now and I'd like to thank everyone for the posts even if they are a bit OT.

Back to the 2228 for a sec.
I've checked Ibanez's online parts catalog again. The nuts differ, but the bridge is exactly the same on the RGA and the RG.
The bridge problem seems to be quite common with the RGAs, but I have not seen any threads about an RG owner experiencing the same thing. AFAIK basswood is a softer wood than mahagony. I wonder why the 3rd screw/bolt does not
get ripped out from their guitars...


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Barney said:


> I think there is a nice discussion going on here now and I'd like to thank everyone for the posts even if they are a bit OT.
> 
> Back to the 2228 for a sec.
> I've checked Ibanez's online parts catalog again. The nuts differ, but the bridge is exactly the same on the RGA and the RG.
> ...



Yep, the bridge units are exactly the same. 

What is different though, is A) the quality of wood used, and B) the mounting of the center height/angle adjustment bolt. 

The truth is, the wood on typical Cort made guitars is far from the best stock around. It's typically purchased from large "factory farms" from Asian sources. Don't get me wrong, it's not "bad" wood, it's just not A grade stock. For instance, the typical body blank you get from sites like LMII or Stew Mac is of better quality. As for the wood used by Fujigen (the Japanese maker of Ibanez, as well as other brands) they have a much smaller output, and their product A) costs more, and B) held to a higher standard. As such, they have more "freedom" to hunt down a high quality, yet long term stable, source for wood. The Basswood that Fujigen uses in the production of guitars, is high quality. Not to mention, higher quality Basswood is easier to get and cheaper. 

Though, I will say, that guitarists need to wake up and start reading up on dendrology. For a group of folks who take pride in the woods used in their instruments, they tend to not really know a lot about them. For instance, the term "Mahogany" does not refer to a single wood. There is no "Mahogany Tree", what there is, is a group of woods with _similar_ properties that gets _called_ Mahogany. What does that mean exactly? It means that two "Mahogany" bodied guitars can actually be made using wood from two different trees, not just different individual plants, but different species, family, etc. Just something to consider. 

As for the anchoring of the bolt. It looks that the RGA8's don't have the same long, wide inserts in the wood to keep the screw from pulling out, like it has on some RGA8s. As a few who have worked on RGA8s have mentioned, all that really needs to be done, is to sink a larger, longer insert into the wood, and it should be solid, as it's the same on the RG2228. 

Another thing to consider: experience. Typically, those buying $1600+ 8-string guitars are not new to guitars, as such, they tend to know how to work on them. How things should work, and how much adjustment/force is needed to handle a given task. I'm not saying that's why they're breaking, but it's certainly a factor.

Of course, the QC on RG2228s is far higher, so there's a better chance of catching the "bad ones" before they make it to the end user.


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## Koshchei (Oct 23, 2010)

Is there any action that consumers can take to protect their interests? What sort of self-advocacy would make it back to the manufacturers? My fear is always that the manufacturer will be so out of touch with their target market that they'll mistake a boycott on their product because it's built like crap for a lack of interest, and choose to discontinue instead of improving quality.

Speaking personally, I hate guitars with finishes because I can't see the wood underneath - by your argot, I'm a huge "wood queen". I need to know that the instrument was made well with top shelf materials, or little things about it will bug me to the point that I can't enjoy it.

Good point on "mahogany". There are several closely related species in the Yucatan peninsula and Cuba that are "mahogany". Everything else that's being advertised as mahogany isn't -- it may have similar tonal properties to mahogany, but it's a completely different plant with very different characteristics.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> Is there any action that consumers can take to protect their interests? What sort of self-advocacy would make it back to the manufacturers? My fear is always that the manufacturer will be so out of touch with their target market that they'll mistake a boycott on their product because it's built like crap for a lack of interest, and choose to discontinue instead of improving quality.
> 
> Speaking personally, I hate guitars with finishes because I can't see the wood underneath - by your argot, I'm a huge "wood queen". I need to know that the instrument was made well with top shelf materials, or little things about it will bug me to the point that I can't enjoy it.
> 
> Good point on "mahogany". There are several closely related species in the Yucatan peninsula and Cuba that are "mahogany". Everything else that's being advertised as mahogany isn't -- it may have similar tonal properties to mahogany, but it's a completely different plant with very different characteristics.



Well, we could just start only buying guitars made with quality components, but it's not a very easy task. Not everyone has the option to go for the nicer, more expensive guitars. Not to mention years of quality Korean imports have really changed what many view as an "expensive" guitar. The makers have shown, if you want quality components, you're going to have to pay for them. Cheap hardware isn't going anywhere, it's here to stay. The best we can do is inform ourselves and fellow musicians to why _this_ component is better and more expensive than _that_ component, even if the spec sheet is oh so similar. 

When I use the term "Wood Queen" I'm speaking more to those who choose to make general assumptions about different woods and their tonal properties with A) very little experience, B) going off of "hear say", C) not factoring that guitars are greater than the sum of their parts, and/or D) all the above. The kinda folks who refuse to play, or even consider a guitar because it's not made out of "tonewoods". That term in itself is just marketing jargon. The term itself dates back centuries and was originally referring to baroque instruments, such as the Lute. The term was used to describe the handful of woods used by these luthiers, and then told to their often not too well informed clients to make it seem like they were made with something special, not just the same stock that was used for their table, chair, or cart. Its just a way to make timber seem more special than it really is. I'm a firm believer that the guitar's body wood is but a small part in the sound that eventually hits your ears. I don't think it's "pointless" like some, but I don't look at it as the cornerstone of the sound of a guitar. The weight and resonance, yes, but lets not forget the electronics involved, as well as the player. Wanting to know your guitar is made with proper stock is NOT being a "Wood Queen". I always look in the neck joint of the solid finished guitars I get. 

The same "issue" with Mahogany can also, similarly but not exactly, be applied to Ebony and Rosewood. The idea that "Ebony" is always darker and tighter grained than "Rosewood" is a fallacy. It can happen amongst the nearly two dozen species of each, but it's in no way a "rule" or matter of "fact".


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## Koshchei (Oct 23, 2010)

100% onboard with you with respect to the wood's contribution to tone. Also true re ebony. Towards the outside of the truck, the wood is actually a gorgeous blond. Same properties as the black heartwood, just a different colour. 

I take the view that a large part of a person's ability to appreciate an instrument also comes from aesthetic qualities - the shape, curves, grain of the wood, etc. While aesthetic beauty shouldn't affect our ability to play a particular instrument, I think that still manages to, to some extent. 

You're right too - the point of origin is no longer any indication of quality. Threads like this are extremely effective in conveying to the customer whether a particular product is shit or not (remember Halo?), but one has to hope that companies like Ibanez read them too. I was looking at their forums to see what sort of fallout they were getting from the RGA 8 bridge issue, and the responses seem to be along the lines of "Don't be silly. Our guitars leave the factory perfect."


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 23, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> 100% onboard with you with respect to the wood's contribution to tone. Also true re ebony. Towards the outside of the truck, the wood is actually a gorgeous blond. Same properties as the black heartwood, just a different colour.
> 
> I take the view that a large part of a person's ability to appreciate an instrument also comes from aesthetic qualities - the shape, curves, grain of the wood, etc. While aesthetic beauty shouldn't affect our ability to play a particular instrument, I think that still manages to, to some extent.
> 
> You're right too - the point of origin is no longer any indication of quality. Threads like this are extremely effective in conveying to the customer whether a particular product is shit or not (remember Halo?), but one has to hope that companies like Ibanez read them too. I was looking at their forums to see what sort of fallout they were getting from the RGA 8 bridge issue, and the responses seem to be along the lines of "Don't be silly. Our guitars leave the factory perfect."



There is actually Ebony that is very light colored, almost white. I've actually had people call me a liar for telling them that not all Ebony is jet black and nearly grain-less. 

I'm with you on the aesthetics aspect as well. As much as I like to say I'm only in it for the playability and/or tone, but really, I like having a guitar that makes me happy to look at. I've bought several guitars over the years, simply because they'd look awesome played live. 

Don't look at the Ibanez forum as a great source of info, or as a true take on the company. It's NOT run by Ibanez itself, or it's parent company Hoshino Gakki. It's actually run by the one of the US' Ibanez importer. The forum has had it's extreme ups and downs over the last couple of years. There was once a lot of really knowledgeable folks there, but most have moved on. You're most likely to run into an Artcore player, or even an Iceman player opposed to RG or S players, and forget about 7 and 8 string players coming there often. The Ibanez employees (or, HUSA as I should say) are lower level sales and setup guys, not designers, marketing folks, or builders. They're a cool bunch of folks, but are quite limited to what they can say/do, and once again, they don't have _direct_ links to Hoshino Gakki. 

Ibanez reps do monitor stores and local repair shops though. What needs to happen is folks not just holding onto these "defective" instruments, and to return them, or send them in for repairs. That's the best way to tell Ibanez that something is wrong. Random bad reviews on the internet are not something 99% of companies care enough about these days.


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## Barney (Oct 23, 2010)

Thanks for all the input/info. 
Yeah, I know that the name "mahagony" covers a lot of different woods.

I'm also a fan of natural finishes. There's nothing more beautiful than a huge 17 inch jazz box with natural finish. I used to drool over photos of such instruments that can be found on different manufacturers' or luthiers' websites.

I'm not a big fan of "heavy metal"-looking guitars. Never was.
The black finish on the RGA is okay. 
I mean you could wear a tuxedo and it would not look so out of place IMO. 
The shape of the body is not specifically "metal" and the headstock either.
If I had the money to get a custom instrument built it would probably be made without any paint. Maybe stained wood to bring out the figures in the wood and then clear gloss finish. For example Tosin's new LACS is something I'd love to have, but maybe with a different top. 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

" responses seem to be along the lines of "Don't be silly. Our guitars leave the factory perfect." "

Of course they do. It's a minor thing that the designers of the company forgot.
You just cannot use the same screws for the nut's pads with 8-string guitars. Simple.
They are long enough to hold the thinner strings, but if You put heavier things on the bass side (I have a 54 for the 7th and a 74 for the 8th) it won't be enough.

I removed all the pads and screws from the nut and checked them carefully. 
With the 74 gauge string on (which is not horribly thick) the screw can barely catch 
the grooves in the base. I suppose it would not be such a big a problem if the nut was made from something harder. Who knows. It got torn apart.
If you put a longer screw in (I guess that 1-2 more milimeters would be enough) more grooves can be caught in the base, thus the whole thing becomes more stable and it won't break probably. End of story.


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## Koshchei (Oct 24, 2010)

The problem that you're having with your nut was exacerbated by the short screw, but ultimately, what it came down to was that the nut was made of shitty die-cast inexpensive white metal with way too much porosity. For it to have torn apart like that, it would have had air bubbles all through it, making it really spongy. Due to the mechanics of a locking nut, it would have inevitably failed because it's not the right material to use.

A steel, or sintered bronze nut wouldn't have failed in that way, and would have added maybe $10 to the price of the guitar.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> would have added maybe $10 to the price of the guitar.



See, thinking in terms of individual instruments just doesn't work on such a large scale that they are now produced at. 

If Cort's output of guitars per month is 100,000 units (just a random figure that's easy to work with), adding $10 in materials can come out to $1,000,000. It's harder for them to just throw around $10 or $20 here and there on such a large scale without considerable thought. 

On top of all of that, that $10 will quickly double, triple, and quadruple by the time the average Joe is ready to buy the guitar (Isn't markup a lovely thing? ). Ask some guys on here who call $700 guitars expensive whether they want to shell out an extra $40 for a better locking nut on a guitar who's trem they'll probably wind up blocking. 

Especially considering, it's probably cheaper to buy ten cheap ones than a single high quality one. That means that even if the end user needs to get the nut replaces multiple times, it still works out being cheaper. 

The one guitar company that I think truly "gets it" in regard to production (albeit not large scale mass produced) is Chapman. They acknowledge the stock hardware and electronics are sub-par (not sub standard) and deliver a product which is a very well built guitar that's incredibly affordable, you just have to replace certain components to make the guitar truly great. It's novel, but I feel it has the potential to really change the industry if exploited by larger scale makers. Though, to be honest, I think it'll be another 100 years, before _most_ guitarists want to instantly re-fit their _new_ guitar.


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## Barney (Oct 24, 2010)

BTW:
Depending on the answer from thomann about a replacement nut I might forget about the idea of a locking nut on this thing a get a regular one put on. I will not pay a cent for this to be replaced by the same shitty nut.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Is Thomann the Ibanez importer/distributor or just the dealer you purchased from?


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## Koshchei (Oct 24, 2010)

Re the nuts, very true. The challenge that Ibanez is having right now is that by putting much cheaper proprietary components on their guitars, they're not really realizing any savings - for what they save in production costs, they're paying double the difference in reputation.

The mentality didn't use to be "anything less than a prestige Ibanez is shit" - that's only been since Ibanez switched from Cort's South Korean plant to Indonesia. South Korean Ibanez guitars were, all things considered, pretty good - not earth shattering, but certainly likely to last more than 2 months.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Koshchei said:


> Re the nuts, very true. The challenge that Ibanez is having right now is that by putting much cheaper proprietary components on their guitars, they're not really realizing any savings - for what they save in production costs, they're paying double the difference in reputation.
> 
> The mentality didn't use to be "anything less than a prestige Ibanez is shit" - that's only been since Ibanez switched from Cort's South Korean plant to Indonesia. South Korean Ibanez guitars were, all things considered, pretty good - not earth shattering, but certainly likely to last more than 2 months.



Actually, it's only very recent that there has been a lot of Indo Ibanez hate, and it has very little to do with the production of the guitars, and more to do with the suppliers opting for cheaper materials. Granted, once again, Ibanez has to green-light it, but if they are to make a profitable, low end 8-string, they need to be thrifty. 

It all comes back to the price people want to pay. The used market, dealer direct brands, and the mass availability of replacement parts has most people shunning guitars over a certain price. In order to compete with the pricing the larger makers which have their instruments built OEM like Ibanez and ESP are in the position where something has to be sacrificed. It's not going to be their profits, nor should it. 

Non-Japanese made Ibanez guitars have always been looked on negatively. Even going back to the early 90's. Do you remember how much shit the EX series used to get? I know players who stopped playing Ibanez for years just because of how much the EX series "devalued" the brand name. 

Switching plants was also not 100% in Ibanez's hands (neither was it in ESP's hands, etc.). Cort Korea has been involved in something of a black eye for the industry, namely protesting over working conditions and a little "mini-scandal". In reaction, Cort decided to shift a lot of their production (for all brands) to their Indonesian facility. Things were rocky for the first year or two, unlike the rocky first decade of using Cort Korea, but the quality has picked back up to where the MIK stuff was. Though, the location of the factory the guitar is being built has nothing to do with who provides the OEM hardware. 

Also, lets not get ahead of ourselves. This is the first case of a serious structural failure of a nut I've seen after about 8 months of being widely available with many sold. Saying that all RGA8s, or even all Ibanez guitars are effected like this is tantamount to me saying that all Carvin fretwork is shit because the 3rd and 7th fret on my Icon 5 were too low. There will always be lemons, especially at lower price points. 

Given the fact that the RG7321, XPT700, XPT707, S2170, S470, and other non-MIJ Ibanez guitars are so popular around here, as well as other forums and the people whose guitars I work on, I can only assume that the idea of "anything less than a prestige Ibanez is shit" is not widely held in most circles. 

For the record, I was one of the assholes who said Ibanez was going into the toilet back in 03' when they ramped up Korean production. The first several runs were AWFUL. I would bitch and moan about every negative aspect. But you know what happened? I started to be proven wrong. I'd be working on a Korean Ibby and notice the production was getting better extremely quickly amongst production runs. The same goes for the current Indo stuff. I dare you to compare ten 01" MIK Ibanez guitars to ten 08' MII Ibanez guitars. Then compare ten 07' MIK Ibanez guitars to ten 10' MII Ibanez guitars. The results will be quite entertaining.


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## Double A (Oct 24, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Also, lets not get ahead of ourselves. This is the first case of a serious structural failure of a nut I've seen after about 8 months of being widely available with many sold. Saying that all RGA8s, or even all Ibanez guitars are effected like this is tantamount to me saying that all Carvin fretwork is shit because the 3rd and 7th fret on my Icon 5 were too low. There will always be lemons, especially at lower price points.


No one is saying all of Ibanez guitars are shit (although to me most are). But this certainly does effect their reputation overall. To have so many RGA8's have the same defect really, really puts a black eye on the quality of a whole line of guitars that Ibanez produces. That cannot be seen as anything but bad even to Ibanez fanboys.

I for one was seriously considering an RGA8 as my first 8 string but after all of this crap I won't even bother and will just get an Agile.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Double A said:


> No one is saying all of Ibanez guitars are shit (although to me most are). But this certainly does effect their reputation overall. To have so many RGA8's have the same defect really, really puts a black eye on the quality of a whole line of guitars that Ibanez produces. That cannot be seen as anything but bad even to Ibanez fanboys.
> 
> I for one was seriously considering an RGA8 as my first 8 string but after all of this crap I won't even bother and will just get an Agile.



I never said it didn't effect the reputation, as it does obviously reflect bad on them as a whole. Though, understand that the RGA8 is a single guitar in a niche market. 

Though, once again, I know of only five RGA8s to have the bridge issue between here, the Ibanez forum, and Jemsite. I've owned six Agiles with some pretty significant defects (regardless of price), yet that doesn't make me think _all_ Agiles are shit. 

Would I buy an RGA8? I don't think so, at least not without playing it first. Though, that goes for any guitar I buy, especially those under $1000.

I'm not trying to make Ibanez look better, as there's no way to change the facts. Nor am I excusing them. I'm just conveying why the industry as a whole is in the position that it is in. Believe it or not, I'm not even an Ibanez "fanboi". I'm just someone who loves guitars and can look at the industry regardless of brands. I've been a Carvin player, Gibson player, Taylor player, Charvel player, and so on.


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## Barney (Oct 24, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Is Thomann the Ibanez importer/distributor or just the dealer you purchased from?



Thomann is a huge german company who ships to whole Europe. 
They sell everything basically. PA, studio gear, instruments and accessories... amps, effects... everything.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Barney said:


> Thomann is a huge german company who ships to whole Europe.
> They sell everything basically. PA, studio gear, instruments and accessories... amps, effects... everything.



I know Thomann is a dealer, but do they also handle the distribution/importation in your country? 

I'm asking this because, typically, it's not the dealer who would handle a situation like this, but the distributor/importer. The dealer can exchange the instrument and possibly handle a replacement part or two, but typically they don't have the authorization to do stuff like pay for repairs or reimburse you for a "better" replacement. 

You should really find out who handles Ibanez in your country and either call them or send them an e-mail.


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## Barney (Oct 24, 2010)

I know the local distributor, but they are douchebags and I'd rather not talk to them about anything. (They'd probably tell me to fuck off... or get me the part I need in like 4-5 months and then sell it to me for a ridiculous amount of money.)
Thomann offers 3 years of warranty for everything they sell. 
It should not be a big deal for them to mail me a nut. I requested the same model that's originally on the RGA. I sent them the photos, a short description about the problem(s cause the bridge problem is also present).
I sent them the original part no. of the nut that's from the Ibanez site.
I also wrote that they do not have to care about the bridge problem since the luthier/guitar tech that I know will repair it for me. He said it's not a big deal.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 24, 2010)

Cool. I just wanted to make sure. 

I know over here in the US, it's better to go through the Distro, I wasn't aware the one over in your neck of the woods sucks. I tend to here that quite often unfortunately.

Hoshino really needs to do a better job of maintaining their importers and make sure they treat their customers right. I know the Canadian, Brazilian, and Australian Ibanez distros are known for being exceptionally awful.


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## Malkav (Oct 25, 2010)

You can add the South African distributor to that list as well...been waiting over 6 months since I asked for new ferrules for my RG321MH and I've been waiting for about 4 years and have reordered around about 6 times for the white collars for my trem arms.

From what I can tell though talking to them it's Ibanez themselves, or Hoshino if you wanna be specific, that simply don't care enough to bother sending stuff and many of their orders just get ignored. I think their claim holds some truth as the company I work for used to be the distributor but decided to stop because they were sick of the constant uphill that any attempt to get spares etc out of Hoshino would become, also the pricing on certain things was just overboard. The trem arm collars for instance are R15 which is almost $2 each! in a 3rd world country where minimum wage is like R1700 a month.


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## Barney (Oct 28, 2010)

Update:
The bridge has been fixed and it's better than it ever was. (Obviously. LOL)

Still waiting for the reply from Thomann about the replacement nut.


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## Barney (Oct 28, 2010)

Oh! I forgot.
Totally OFF TOPIC, but since we are on ss.org:

When I went for my baby I saw an Agile 7-string telecaster (!) lying there on the workbench.
Maple neck with maple fretboard, ash body, black pickguard. 
Natural finish, with a "not so telecaster-ish" headstock. 
The guys were working on it. The owner wanted a humbucker in the bridge position.
SD Custom got put in there.


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## Krauthammer (Oct 29, 2010)

> " responses seem to be along the lines of "Don't be silly. Our guitars leave the factory perfect." "
> 
> Of course they do. It's a minor thing that the designers of the company forgot.
> You just cannot use the same screws for the nut's pads with 8-string guitars. Simple.
> ...



I own the RG2228, and when I got the guitar, about the 3rd string change and Pup switcheroo, the screw the locks the string in place at the bridge snapped off like butter when clamping back into place for the 4th string saddle. That was under warranty, thus free fix. Semi-recently, like 6 months ago, and I have been using an .080 gauge for my low E, and changed strings again, but the locking nut for strings 8 and 7 would no longer screw into itself. I've had locking trems for over 10 years, and I know not to torque those much, if at all. Using just fingers, I can get it to screw in so it looks like its still on there and doesn't fall off, but it's not truly "locking" on my 8 and 7th strings. Not actually a problem, since its fixed bridge design. But, above there were mentions of longer screws for locking nuts. Where, o where can I find these, and be guaranteed that they are not the same length as the original screws?


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## Barney (Oct 29, 2010)

I'm thinking about putting on an 80 gauge string instead of the 74 that I have currently.
I tune to drop E also. The 74 is a bit floppy. Unfortunately I don't know where to get a longer screw either, but probably start checking all the big sites that sell guitar parts like stewmac, allparts, etc. I'll let you know if I find anything.


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## Barney (Oct 29, 2010)

...


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## Krauthammer (Oct 30, 2010)

> ........



Sorry, I couldn't find anything direct about a longer screw for giant strings under the locking nut. I am thinking, however, that any hardware store should be able to take care of this problem. I remember going to one, but always finding something too long, or it wouldn't fit through the nut hole. Last sentence, that is definitely what she said. Couldn't resist that one. I'm lame.


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## Barney (Oct 30, 2010)

LOL XD


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## jymellis (Oct 30, 2010)

i have a few longer, stainless steel allen head metric screws that will work. where are you located?


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## JoeMalov (Oct 31, 2010)

So, for the RGA8 users, what's the general consensus of a good gauge to use for a low E? With every other string in standard. I was going to try a .74 and see how that fared.


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## Barney (Oct 31, 2010)

A 74 string is okay for low E but I'll probably switch to 80.
It's almost impossible to make it sound totally clear unless you have really high action.
I have a 0.2mm shim under the saddle of the 8th string and it still buzzes. Not too bad though.
It's not a really big step up from 74 to 80 but I'm concerned about the locking nut being usable.

If you read the thread-opener post, you'll see that even the 74 managed to get my nut ruined.
A 80 gauge string would probably fit, but you cannot really tighten the screw. 

(Still waiting for the reply from Thomann after a week of contacting them. I'd really like to get a replacement nut. - I'll probably send them a message tomorrow if they do not answer till noon. We're in the same timezone.)

I really like the RGA8, so I would not tell anyone not to get it.
You just have to be aware of the nut problem and the bridge problem that cannot be avoided. (IMO - You'll have to face that sooner or later...)

For people who are just getting (or thinking about getting) an RGA8: 

Once you have it, take it to a reliable luthier/guitar tech and get this done:

Step 1:
take the counterpart of the bridge screw out. It can be done with an allen wrench (Size 4, but I'm not sure about that.) You just have to turn it counter-clockwise and it should come out. Don't worry about small pieces of wood getting ripped out around the hole.

Step 2: drill a bigger hole and fill it with wood that's really hard. (Glue it in.)

Step 3: drill a new hole in the wood for the counter-part and use some black paint to cover the "modification".

Step 4: put the counter-part back in the hole.

Done. Better than ever.

This was done to my guitar and it's fine now.


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## Barney (Nov 6, 2010)

update:

I got an e-mail from thomann yesterday.
They have ordered the replacement part and gonna mail it to me once they get it.


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## Eric Christian (Nov 7, 2010)

Barney, 

I'd be curious to know if you were ever aware of what strings actually came on the guitar from the factory? The Ibanez website doesn't seem to have much in the way of a spec sheet like Jackson does so its hard to tell what they put on it. However, .074 sounds quite large. Does the entire string even go into the tuning peg? 

Might be worth taking the nut to a welding shop and see if they can weld it up and tap the thread back into it. Then go to your local fastener warehouse and find a longer allen machine screw.


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## Barney (Nov 8, 2010)

The factroy strings are a 9-54 7string set (D'Addario) plus a 65 as the 8th. (I'm not sure, it might be a 64...) The point is: it is really, really thin for even an F#. Floppy as hell.
I've read that some of the guys who post here use 80 gauge strings for the 8th or even 90!
Jeff Loomis uses a 62 gauge string for the low Bb on his sig model that has a 26.5 scale.
The RGA8 has a 27 inch scale. So the 74 as the 8th is not thick at all.

I use this set:
9 11 16 22 32 42 - rotosound nickel set (aka roto pinks)
54 74 D'Addario nickel wound

I'd love to put rotos on as the 2 "bass" strings but the company does not make strings in such gauges and they do not sell them individually either. Too bad.
They sound smoother than most strings I tried and somehow they are a bit looser than others tuned to the same pitch. The 3 high plain strings sound sweet. They also last longer than others, especially D'Addarios.


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## Barney (Dec 6, 2010)

UPDATE! 

Look what I got in the mail today:







Yay! 

The invoice is pure LOL - "Price EUR: 0.00" 

I'm also changing the strings from
9 11 16 22 32 42 54 74 
to
9 11 16 22 32 42 56 80

I might change the 42 to 44... I'm not sure about that.

And now for something completely different:

I really like this guitar but the stock pu sounds utter shit and it's driving me crazy.
I thought about getting a pair of good old BKP Cold Sweats but I'm totally broke at the moment... 
so...
If there is anyone who's ditching EMG808s and willing to sell me one for a reasonable price, please send me a PM. European guys preferrably, since I do not wish to pay for additional shipping costs from overseas. Thanks a million!


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## Barney (Dec 6, 2010)

One more thing:

If anyone wants my spare string tree (or whatever it is called - you can see it in the picture) send me a PM, I'll mail it to you for free.


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## Barney (Dec 9, 2010)

Thank you Ibanez!

The new nut has longer screws in it. 1-2mms more.


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## arsonist (Dec 11, 2010)

you think this problem is avoidable simply by getting a longer screw?


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## Barney (Dec 11, 2010)

I think it is.
I'd also suggest forgetting about locking the nut on the 2 lowest strings.
Just put on the pad, turn the screw and once you feel the resistance turn it carefully, just a little so it would not fall off. Just forget about the idea of the pad actually holding the tuning on the 8th string. To bo honest... I never understood Ibanez's idea behind this bridge and the locking nut. A simple bridge like a hipshot would have been just fine.


(Ha jól emlékszem te is épp 8. húr dilemmában vagy, illetve RGA8-at veszel. Én most váltok 80as E húrra, de neked simán jó lehet a 74 alulra. Még kell pár nap mire meglesz a "nagy m&#369;tét" - új húrok/új nut felszerelése - aztán meglátom hogy m&#369;ködik a dolog. Megnézem még a csavarokat a nut-ban, a vékony húrokhoz tök felesleges hosszú, illetve van egy tartalék 74es húrom még. Ha te F#-re akarsz hangolni, akkor oda jó. Ha gondolod postán elküldöm neked a húrt, meg hosszabb csavart a nut-ba.)


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## arsonist (Dec 15, 2010)

Jaja, fasza, isten vagy!

Egyébként nem akartam beleszólni naon mer 8 húrossal még 0 tapasztalatom, de (és akkor ezt angolul hogy a többi fütyi is értse)

The same thing happened to me with my Jackson DXMG once. We used to have a death metal band where we tuned down to H, so I had to use .013 sets. What happened, very similary, was that at practice once (a few minutes after locking the nut), I hear this weird kind of "turning screw" sound, and all of a sudden: *PING*, i see the top of the screw of the nut with the thickest strings is flying through the air. For me, it was literally only the top part of the screw, which you turn with the allen wrench. 
The fucked up thing: the entire screw stayed in the nut, with no top that you could turn to get it out. I was pretty worried because I though i'm gonna have to get it drilled out or just never fixed. But I took it to Oroszlánbarlang (the dudes from Vintage sent me there lol, dunno why) and they took care of it (I have no idea how) in like 1 day. 
When I went back to pick it up, the dude told me that since I use really thick strings on the guitar, after they got the remainder of the previous screw out, they put in a newer, much longer one. This is basically for the same reason: almost all of the tension was being counteracted on just a little part of the screw, and that's why it just popped. Longer screw = better distribution of the force keeping the screw down.


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## arsonist (Dec 15, 2010)

Ja de egyébként veled ugye nem történt meg ez a csúnya csavar/fémlemez kitép&#337;s sztori a húrlábak mögött?


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## Barney (Dec 15, 2010)

Dehogynem... szerintem elkerulhetetlen.


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## Eric Christian (Dec 15, 2010)

Barney said:


> To be honest... I never understood Ibanez's idea behind this bridge and the locking nut. A simple bridge like a hipshot would have been just fine.


 
Whats not to understand? Makes total sense to me. I think the general idea is that locking it down and using the fine tuners is much quicker and easier than using the tuning pegs...


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## arsonist (Dec 16, 2010)

Barney said:


> Dehogynem... szerintem elkerulhetetlen.



Nemmondod? S hogy/kinél javíttattad meg?


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## CONTEMPT (Dec 16, 2010)

arsonist said:


> ...We used to have a death metal band where we tuned down to *H*...



God damn that's deep.


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## AlexThorpe (Dec 16, 2010)

CONTEMPT said:


> God damn that's deep.




Just in case you or anyone didn't know, H is the same note as B in some countries such as Germany, and I believe Russia, and possibly Switzerland and Austria. Not too certain on some of those, though.


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## Barney (Dec 16, 2010)

I believe most of the eastern-european countries use H instead of B. 
I'm not sure though...


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## Barney (Dec 16, 2010)

Tóth Zoltán - StageShop/Amarant Guitars 
&#336; javította meg nekem, évek óta &#337; birizgálja minden hangszerem, kiváló szakember.


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## CONTEMPT (Dec 16, 2010)

AlexThorpe said:


> Just in case you or anyone didn't know, H is the same note as B in some countries such as Germany, and I believe Russia, and possibly Switzerland and Austria. Not too certain on some of those, though.



Ah, I figured it was the deep tuning version of turning the amp up to 11.


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## arsonist (Dec 17, 2010)

Nnnna Bárni akkor itt hivatalosan mondom köszönetemet, mert itthon évek óta keresek olyan állandó embert akihez szívesen vinném a hangszeremet. Ha bármi el&#337;fordul ezzel az RGA8assal, akkor mindenképp hozzá viszem, hisz ezek szerint már van tapasztalata is velük.
Örök hála!!


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## Barney (Dec 17, 2010)

A Zoli évek óta készít csodálatos hangszereket és a "szakma" apraja-nagyja hordja hozzá a gitárjait... akusztikus gitárok, jazzgitárok, metálbalták, mindenfélét.
Nézd meg a stegeshop honlapján a "Barátaink" menüpontot.


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## Barney (Dec 17, 2010)

Hja, ha jót akarsz, akkor elé mész a problémának azzal, hogy még az el&#337;tt megcsináltatod azt a kis biszbaszt, miel&#337;tt kiszakad.


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## arsonist (Dec 18, 2010)

Filóztam rajta, de felvettem a kapcsolatot itt a fórumon egy mukival aki Ibanezeket javít már a sötétközépkor óta, és igazából annyiban igazat adok neki, hogy nem érdemes megjavítani azt, ami nincs elb*szva. Ha megjavítható ez a para amiután bekövetkezik, akkor meg sztem végképp nincs rá feltétlenül szükség. De nemtom, majd felveszem vele a kapcsolatot, és megkérdem hogy mennyibe fájna egy ilyen "preventív" m&#369;tét. Ha valami racionális árat mond akkor lehet hogy bevállalom!
Mit mondhatok neki, kit&#337;l hallottam róla? 

U.I.: tegnap jött meg a gityó, hát ezek tényleg baszott jó hangszerek


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## Barney (Dec 18, 2010)

Nah, asszem akkor jofele karacsonyod lesz iden. 
Ha azt mondod, hogy a Barnabas-tol, akinek szinten RGA8 van, akkor vagni fogja.
A tieddel egyutt 4 darab RGA8-rol tudok az orszagban, ebbol 2 megfordult mar a Zolinal.
Elmondom mi a problema es miert erdemes elebe menni:
A csavarnak van egy ellendarabja a faban alul ami ugy van belerakva, hogy kivul is menetes, szoval egyszeruen bele van tekerve a faba.
A fa tul puha, illetve valoszinuleg tul nagyra furjak gyarilag a lukat, illetve a menet "hornyai" nem eleg nagyok kivul, ezert nem fog elegge. Ezek osszessege miatt tudja kitepni a fabol a csavar.
Nekem azt csinalta a Zoli, hogy kivette, a lyukat betomte valami kemenyebb faval, amit valami brutal ragasztoval beragasztott. Miotan ez megszaradt, furt egy uj lyukat, majd ha jol emlekszem beleragasztotta az ellendarabot. Ezutan lefestette feketere, soval nem latszik a mutet. Sokkal erosebb mint a gyari.
En ezt elore megcsinaltatnam, hogy ne az legyen, hogy a legszarabb pillanatban kiszakad es akkor anyazhatsz, meg hivogathatod a Zolit, hogy jaj ez van, mikor tudna megcsinalni. 
A nut-tal vigyazz, majd adok hozza csavart.


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## arsonist (Dec 18, 2010)

Fasza, millió kösz!
Szabad megkérdeznem hogy neked mennyibe fájt ez az operáció?


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## Barney (Dec 19, 2010)

Erre nem igazan tudok mit mondani, ugyanis mi nagyon joban vagyunk a Zolival, mar akkor o tekergette a gitarjaimat amikor meg szinte ismeretlen volt es a Stageshop is egy icipici bolt volt par akusztikus gitarral. Kb. 6 eve. - Szerintem par ezer forintbol meg fogod uszni, de pontosat csak a Zoli tud mondani. 

For those who do not speak hungarian:
we were discussing the bridge problem, how it can be solved, and a local luthier who fixed it for me.


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## arsonist (Dec 20, 2010)

Rendben fasza, a honlapon lév&#337; árak alapján én sem számítok nagyon vad munkadíjra  Köff!!


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## Samarus (Dec 20, 2010)

The build quality of mine is pretty poor too


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## Barney (Dec 20, 2010)

I would not call the build quality poor. It's a fine instrument. 
Not a Prestige or a Custom Handmade instrument, but not bad.


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## Andromalia (Dec 21, 2010)

AlexThorpe said:


> Just in case you or anyone didn't know, H is the same note as B in some countries such as Germany, and I believe Russia, and possibly Switzerland and Austria. Not too certain on some of those, though.



Weird, I know for sure austria uses the italian note names, as do the french and spanish, and Mozart and bach stuff was written with italian nomenclature (do, ré, mi, fa, sol, la, si, do.) I'm not aware of a specifically eastern european notation.

Edit: all right I was wrong: 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Note


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## arsonist (Dec 22, 2010)

yeah


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## arsonist (Dec 22, 2010)

Hallod Bárni egyébként ezeken a húrmagasságot csakis azzal a labilis csavarral lehet szabályozni?


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## Barney (Dec 22, 2010)

Van az a 2 nagy t&#337;csavar oldalt, azokkal lehet a híd magassasságát (és d&#337;lését) szabályozni, úgy m&#369;ködik mint egy sima Les Paul-okon található húrláb. 
A kis csavar hátul csak arra van, hogy valamennyi terhelést levegyen a 2 nagy t&#337;csavarról.
Én mondjuk megkérd&#337;jelezhet&#337;nek tartom ennek értelmét vagy hasznosságát, de ki tudja.
Húrláb buzera el&#337;tt a kis csavart ki kell lazítani (vagy akár ki is venni a helyér&#337;l), majd ha be van l&#337;ve a dolog a 2 t&#337;csavarral, utána visszatenni és visszahúzni.
Én azt mondom, hogy onnantól, hogy érzed az ellenállást a csavarban maximum egy negyedet húzz rajta óvatosan.


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## arsonist (Dec 22, 2010)

Ja mer habár már felhívtam a Zoltánt és megdumáltuk hogy Jan elején viszem hozzá, gondoltam óvatosan azért annyit megbuherálok rajta hogy kényelmesebb legyen. A képekb&#337;l amiket raktam láthatod hogy elég magasan állnak most a húrok. 
A húrok kilazítása után a nagy csavarokkal óvatosan megpróbálkoztam, de igazságszerint nem akartak mozdulni, így annyiban is hagytam a dolgot, nem akarom er&#337;ltetni :S nem vágom, lehet hogy csak túl óvatos vagyok.


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## Barney (Dec 22, 2010)

Fasza. Írj ha már tudod mikor lesz a "m&#369;tét" és akkor beviszem a csavart a nut-hoz.


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## arsonist (Dec 22, 2010)

isten vagy \m/


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## Barney (Dec 24, 2010)

Hova akarod hangolni? 
Azert kerdezem, mert nekem megjottek az uj hurjaim, es igy lett egy felesleges 54es meg egy 74es. Egy 9-42es set-hez 7dik, meg 8dik hurnak H-ra, illetve F#-re hangolva pont jo.
En egy kicsit feljebb mentem, 56os lesz H-nak meg 80as alulra, mert nekem E-re van hangolva a 8dik es a 74es vekony ehhez.
Ezeket is neked adom, ha gondolod. stringsdirect.co.uk-tol vannak, onnan tudsz rendelni egyesvel ilyeneket. (Vagy amilyet akarsz  )

Edit:

English translation:

What tuning would you like to use?
I'm just asking because I got my new strings so I got a leftover 54 and a 74.
They are just fine as a 7th and 8th added to a 9-42 set if you tune them to B and F#.
I went a bit higher and will be using a 56 for B and an 80 for the low E. The 74 is bit thin for this.
I'll give them to you if you want them and you can order more from stringsdirect.co.uk one-by-one. (Or whatever you want to use.  )


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## JaeSwift (Dec 24, 2010)

I'm pretty sure your not allowed to consistantly post in non-English languages here.


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## Barney (Dec 24, 2010)

You may be right... sorry everyone.

I added english translation where I could edit the post(s).

We were discussing the setup and talking about the local luthier who's gonna take care of his RGA8 also.

I will use english from now on.


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## arsonist (Dec 25, 2010)

óóó nagyon kedves t&#337;led, elfogadom &#337;ket szívesen!
egyel&#337;re standard fiszre hangolok jaja, amíg kiismerem a hangszert. aztán a kés&#337;bbiekben majd lehet hogy én is leejtem dropped-ra, de addig ez így ahogy


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## Marv Attaxx (Dec 25, 2010)

Guys, really 
The official language of ss.org is English so please try to write in English. Doesn't need to be perfect but at least we understand each other


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## Psycho J (Dec 25, 2010)

Marv Attaxx said:


> Guys, really
> The official language of ss.org is English so please try to write in English. Doesn't need to be perfect but at least we understand each other


 
And yet there is member from all over the world.  I think you guys need to realize English isn't spoken by everyone. If you want to read what they are saying google translate it then.


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## adrock (Dec 25, 2010)

Psycho J said:


> And yet there is member from all over the world.  I think you guys need to realize English isn't spoken by everyone. If you want to read what they are saying google translate it then.



it's part of the "new" forum rules. no posting in other languages besides english. rules are rules.


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## Marv Attaxx (Dec 25, 2010)

Sevenstring.org - Announcements in Forum : Beginners/FAQ
Article 10 
English isn't my first language either but how would you like it if I'd just keep on writing in German?


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 25, 2010)

Psycho J said:


> And yet there is member from all over the world.  I think you guys need to realize English isn't spoken by everyone. If you want to read what they are saying google translate it then.



I more than realize that, but I don't think it's too much to ask that those who choose to participate in this site to speak in the language of the majority of those on the site which includes the Admin and Mod team. By that same token, I can't go to one of the several EU based and expect everyone to use Google Translate (which is shit if you've every really used it) to understand and then reply to me. This isn't a "new" rule, it's been around since the site's inception back in 04'. You'll note that we have MANY members from France, Germany, Sweden, Norway, Portugal, Spain, The Netherlands, Brazil, India, etc. who manage to type English well enough to use this site quite frequently. 

To those speaking "not English", please feel free to do so via PMs. *You're not in trouble, nor are you getting reprimanded.* Speaking a foreign tongue isn't something you get banned for, it's just common courtesy to us, the Mods, which have to police this site that you post in a language we're accustomed to.


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## Barney (Dec 25, 2010)

Sorry guys and thank you for the reminder.

arsonist you should switch to english too and please pm me when you are taking the axe to Zoli for the surgery.  I'm checking the forum few times a day. 

Short english summary of our previous discussion:

I told arsonist that the bridge screw problem will occur eventually so it's better to get it "fixed" before anything happens. Get the couterpart taken out, a piece of some harder wood glued in, re-drilled and the part re-fitted. I also told him that it's wise not to overtighten it. When you start to feel the resistance, do not turn more than a quarter... He tried to lower the action by making some adjustments to the bridge but it did not work. Maybe he was too cautious. You better leave such jobs to pros.


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## arsonist (Dec 26, 2010)

Excellent, thanks!


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## arsonist (Dec 28, 2010)

Hey Barney:
are these the kind of strings you use?

D'Addario Nickel Wound Single (.080) from Strings Direct

I think i'm just going to order 1 to try it out!


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## Barney (Dec 28, 2010)

Yes, I ordered Rotosound Pinks (9-42 set) + D'Addario singles (56 + 80).
Rotos sound smooth and they feel good for my fingers. They last long also. 
(for me at least.)
I hate the usual D'Addarios, especially their plain strings since they don't last more than 1 day and they feel bad and sterile.
But... that's why they are good for "bass" strings. They have more chime.

I'd suggest to wait a bit. I'll give you the 74 I have, it's good if you tune it to F#.
You can try it and if you wish to go higher in tension then you may order the 80.
You may also buy more than one then, since the shipping costs are the same for 1 string a bunch also.


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## JaeSwift (Dec 28, 2010)

Barney said:


> Yes, I ordered Rotosound Pinks (9-42 set) + D'Addario singles (56 + 80).
> Rotos sound smooth and they feel good for my fingers. They last long also.
> (for me at least.)
> I hate the usual D'Addarios, especially their plain strings since they don't last more than 1 day and they feel bad and sterile.
> ...



I'm gonna agree with your point here. I just finished setting up my own made guitar (which has the RGA 8 neck and bridge) and whilst I set it up without fret buzz, there's some clunk and buzz coming from the nut (probably because I unwound the end of the string) and it doesn't intonate too well. Shame that I bought 3 0.74s -_- I'll be switching to 0.80 soon, most likely ernie balls as I really like the tone from those strings.

EDIT:

To those of you who are afraid of getting the problem where you pull the stud out of the wood, take the stud out by using a screw that will fit in it (a random one, not the one used to hold the bridge, just one that fits the size of the inserts), grab some pliars and pull straight up. Repeat that process for all the inserts, then throw some Epoxy around them (tape off the inner screw coils cuz you dont want glue there) and insert them back, then leave it rest over night.


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## Barney (Dec 28, 2010)

Yeah, the counterpart in the body for the small screw/bolt has a short lead-in part where it fits an allen-wrench (size 3 maybe...) and then as you go deeper it tightens up and has the grooves for the bolt.


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## arsonist (Dec 28, 2010)

Oh yeah man i'm definately gonna wait for that 74 too, but i'm gonna get an 80 just to try out a dropped-E tuning. I wanna see if it makes sense, or if it's just too low for me :]


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## Barney (Dec 28, 2010)

I'm not tuning down to drop E to have E as the lowest note.
I do it for the relationship between the strings. 
Take a look at a 6 string guitar... let's say: E string, 3rd fret. That's a G. I grab a Gmaj7 there.
8 string guitar: that's cool, since I have the 5th of the chord on the 7th string on the same fret (same position) and then I have the root note again one string lower on the 8th string. You get the idea. 
You can create nice wide chord voicings and basslines.


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## JaeSwift (Dec 28, 2010)

arsonist said:


> Oh yeah man i'm definately gonna wait for that 74 too, but i'm gonna get an 80 just to try out a dropped-E tuning. I wanna see if it makes sense, or if it's just too low for me :]



I originally used the 0.74 with the guitar tuned down half a step and it still didnt intonate properly. Now that I'm in drop E it didnt really get that much worse but the problem is still there.


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## heilarkyguitar (Jan 3, 2011)

SpaceDock said:


> I have had no problems with my RG2228, it seems solid as it gets. I think many of the bridge post problems can be the fault of people adjusting the bridge posts without loosening the back post and so it gets too much stress and pulls out. This problem with the nut seems to be from over torquing the nut screws. The nut does not need to be set so tight that it could break any metal. I have owned well over 20 locking bridge guitars and I have never stripped a single part or cross treaded anything. Respect your guitars and the limitations of their components. Setting up solid does not mean cranking down the screws.
> 
> Just my 2 cents


 yep i'm not the only dic here lol


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## JamieB (Jan 7, 2011)

Ive had my RGa8 for ages and i dont understand why that has done that mines been perfect throughout the durations of owning it. 

Hope it gets sorted


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## JamieB (Jan 7, 2011)

You must have been tightening it with a bit more force than you should have done thinking about it.


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## VinnyLemieux (May 4, 2011)

The RG2228 models are supposed to be way more solid than the RGA8. Ive heard about the bridge problems but not the nut before but the point is that it was always on the RGA8 models ive never heard of it being on a RG2228 Before


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