# Mesa Boogie Mini Recto Thread



## JP Universe (Aug 24, 2011)

Well I've searched the forums and only heard FAKE but here it is...... The real deal!

Mesa Boogie Vacuum Tube Guitar and Bass Amplifier

Best gear release in 2011 IMHO


----------



## TRENCHLORD (Aug 24, 2011)

Hell Yeah!!!


----------



## Hollowway (Aug 24, 2011)

Holy cow it's for real! I thought the fake looked like a little too much work for just a joke!


----------



## Floppystrings (Aug 24, 2011)

I want clips.

I thought it was fake too lol.


----------



## MobiusR (Aug 24, 2011)

Mesa releasing this means they won the micro amp war LOL


----------



## Enter Paradox (Aug 24, 2011)

>had worked for several months prior to buying new gears
>didn't buy anything major yet
>this came out


----------



## evilsaint (Aug 24, 2011)

When are they going to release MINI Mark VI ?


----------



## theo (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh crap that is so cool! I love the mini cabs too!
If an axe FX 2 wasn't going to be my next purchase, I'd be all over this


----------



## TRENCHLORD (Aug 24, 2011)

evilsaint said:


> When are they going to release MINI Mark VI ?


 
"in the future you do see"


----------



## Kwirk (Aug 24, 2011)

I am totally buying one of the mini cabs.

BECAUSE THEY'RE FUCKING CUTE.


----------



## Wookieslayer (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah the cabs look cool


----------



## JP Universe (Aug 24, 2011)

Can't stop thinking about them... I mean, I don't really need them but oh man I WANT


----------



## Andromalia (Aug 24, 2011)

Not even a line out, and 10 w is still too loud for an apartment, not sure this is going to be a killer. Especially since what people expect from rectos is in large part based on the 6L6s.
Mesa pricing in Europe will likely make it a non contender, too, it will likely cost 800 or more.

I have been tempted to send back my tubemeister to try this one, but only for a few seconds.


----------



## flexkill (Aug 24, 2011)

well I own a Night train, Rebel 20, gigmaster 15w, and now I will own this lunchbox Recto!!!!! Life is good!!!!!


----------



## Wookieslayer (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah it should have a line out IMO... lame. But at least they're making one


----------



## Floppystrings (Aug 24, 2011)

JP Universe said:


> Can't stop thinking about them... I mean, I don't really need them but oh man I WANT



All I have to do is buy 30 other things and then this thing!


----------



## Rook (Aug 24, 2011)

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

I WAAAAAANT

GAAA
FUUUU
FFUNITTOHFVKUDRYIFGVFGG




nice.


----------



## Ishan (Aug 24, 2011)

Andromalia said:


> Not even a line out, and 10 w is still too loud for an apartment, not sure this is going to be a killer. Especially since what people expect from rectos is in large part based on the 6L6s.
> Mesa pricing in Europe will likely make it a non contender, too, it will likely cost 800 or more.
> 
> I have been tempted to send back my tubemeister to try this one, but only for a few seconds.



Yea, the power rating miss the sweet spot for apartment rig (1w ) and due to the terrible importer we have I'd expect it to be in the 1000/1200 range myself


----------



## 7 Dying Trees (Aug 24, 2011)

Now this looks utterly sexy. I think I may need to get one as a mini stack. Pure sex!


----------



## cwhitey2 (Aug 24, 2011)

Mini slant cab 

Holy hell how did i not know this was comin out!

Now seeing this i pretty much know what im getting for a tube practice head!!!

As long as it sounds like its big bro than im sold on it


----------



## Stealthdjentstic (Aug 24, 2011)

If it sounds more like a single recto than a dual/triple I wont bother.


----------



## Mordacain (Aug 24, 2011)

10 Watts is definitely too loud for apartment use, but EL-84s clip early, so I doubt you'll have to crank it to get the nasty.

Personally, I love the idea of EL-84's, they have a ballsiness that 6V6s just don't have in this particular power arena, but still have a chimey top-end similar to EL-34s. I think it'll be hot. Just when I'd thought I'd not get another tube amp...


----------



## technomancer (Aug 24, 2011)

Only downside is if the leaked sheet is correct it's $999 which is expensive for what it is


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 24, 2011)

technomancer said:


> Only downside is if the leaked sheet is correct it's $999 which is expensive for what it is



Would that be MSRP or Street? If that's not MSRP I'd rather pick up a 50 watt Single Rec.

I don't know how I feel about the use of EL84s. All the EL84 amps and power sections I've used have sounded quite far removed from what I'd call "classic Recto tone". 

Randall Smith is no slouch though, I'm guessing he compensated for that via the preamp and trans.


----------



## technomancer (Aug 24, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Would that be MSRP or Street? If that's not MSRP I'd rather pick up a 50 watt Single Rec.
> 
> I don't know how I feel about the use of EL84s. All the EL84 amps and power sections I've used have sounded quite far removed from what I'd call "classic Recto tone".
> 
> Randall Smith is no slouch though, I'm guessing he compensated for that via the preamp and trans.



You forget this is Mesa, MSRP and street are the same thing.

Gotta' be honest this doesn't interest me. Now give me a lunchbox Mark and I might have to do some damage to the credit card  (I figure that's unlikely though due to the power options on the full sized Mark V)


----------



## lurgar (Aug 24, 2011)

Video samples "Coming in a day or two"

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


----------



## themike (Aug 24, 2011)

Offically announced and added to Mesa's website

Mesa Boogie's Mini Rectifier Twenty-Five


----------



## TemjinStrife (Aug 24, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Would that be MSRP or Street? If that's not MSRP I'd rather pick up a 50 watt Single Rec.
> 
> I don't know how I feel about the use of EL84s. All the EL84 amps and power sections I've used have sounded quite far removed from what I'd call "classic Recto tone".
> 
> Randall Smith is no slouch though, I'm guessing he compensated for that via the preamp and trans.



Have you played an F-30? That gets some fantastic Recto-style sounds, with amazing sparkly cleans, out of 2 EL84s.


----------



## maxoom (Aug 24, 2011)

And they kept it in da house like Krank and Carvin no import.
No Made in China half sells me right there.Seems way overpriced though. I would buy a single 50 used instead.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 24, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> Have you played an F-30? That gets some fantastic Recto-style sounds, with amazing sparkly cleans, out of 2 EL84s.



I've played an F100 and thought is sounded almost nothing like a Recto. Though that was not EL84 driven.


----------



## djpharoah (Aug 24, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> Have you played an F-30? That gets some fantastic Recto-style sounds, with amazing sparkly cleans, out of 2 EL84s.


I have and it's no where close. Very different beast when compared to any Recto.

If this thing goes for $999 I'd still rather pickup the 5150III 50W micro head whenever that comes to fruition and on sale.


----------



## lemeker (Aug 24, 2011)

this just made my day........

not as many bells and whistles as others like the V3m (which I think they are going after more so than say Orange and their Dark Terror), I still want to sit down and jam on one, but I see myself owning one for sure........it'd be cool if they do this with the roadster and add reverb!!

now here's to hoping they keep it reasonably priced.....


----------



## 22km Tombstone (Aug 24, 2011)

Only thing I noticed that gets the  is only 8 and 4 ohm outputs. WAT?
I have a 16 ohm cabinet.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 24, 2011)

22km Tombstone said:


> Only thing I noticed that gets the  is only 8 and 4 ohm outputs. WAT?
> I have a 16 ohm cabinet.



You do realize that it's 100% safe to run a 16ohm cab on an amp rated for 4 and/or 8 right?


----------



## 22km Tombstone (Aug 24, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> You do realize that it's 100% safe to run a 16ohm cab on an amp rated for 4 and/or 8 right?



! No, I didn't.  Good to know!


----------



## vanhendrix (Aug 24, 2011)

Is 25 watts enough to gig with? I'm trying to assemble a second smaller rig that doesn't weigh as much as my house. Since the 5150 III 50w has clearly been sent to development hell.... This is looking very sexy.

Edit: Nevermind. You can't set this thing to have a separate volume/sound for solos.


----------



## Ninetyfour (Aug 24, 2011)




----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 24, 2011)

vanhendrix said:


> Is 25 watts enough to gig with? I'm trying to assemble a second smaller rig that doesn't weigh as much as my house. Since the 5150 III 50w has clearly been sent to development hell.... This is looking very sexy.



It should be fine as long as you don't have many clean parts that you need to have extra loud. 

If you gig at places with PAs you can gig with as little as 1 watt. ​


----------



## themike (Aug 24, 2011)

vanhendrix said:


> Edit: Nevermind. You can't set this thing to have a separate volume/sound for solos.


 
Boost/OD pedal. 




MaxOfMetal said:


> If you gig at places with PAs you can gig with as little as 1 watt.



I want a backline of just 20 of these things all mic'd up


----------



## mountainjam (Aug 24, 2011)

This amp looks really cool. As far as the high price, I'de bet your paying for convenience. A 20 oz drink usually costs more than a 2 liter. Same concept kinda.


----------



## chronocide (Aug 24, 2011)

I owned a Recto and never got along with it, but obviously (as demonstrated by this thread) there'll be people clamoring for these.

Shame they'll be far too expensive for what they are once they get over here.


----------



## SnowfaLL (Aug 24, 2011)

its a pretty awesome idea, and I LOVE seeing more companies making these micro amps, people are finally "getting it" that you dont need 300W tube amps with ten 4x12s (theres nothing more annoying than jamming with metal guitarists who dont understand louder doesnt equal better, it equals not hearing the mix properly + ear damage).. so I applaud Mesa for that, and if I wanted a Recto sound, i'd look into it. I wonder if its going to be the Recto clean channel, or if they are going to adapt one of their actual decent clean channels like the Roadking/Mark V into it, that would make it worth it..

But I still think the Carvin V3M is the winner for micro amps. Im praying they release a mini Legacy II, that'd be my dream amp, least until theres a Mini ENGL SE (ok, thats me really dreaming lol)


----------



## Sicarius (Aug 24, 2011)

7 Dying Trees said:


> Now this looks utterly sexy. I think I may need to get one as a mini stack. Pure sex!


Let me pet it when you guys come through Houston again 

I really hope this is like $600, 'cause I'd buy one.


----------



## djpharoah (Aug 24, 2011)

Sicarius said:


> I really hope this is like $600, 'cause I'd buy one.


It's $999 according to Sweetwater.


----------



## Sicarius (Aug 24, 2011)

That's stupid.


----------



## flexkill (Aug 24, 2011)

djpharoah said:


> It's $999 according to Sweetwater.



Pack of elixers are 50$ according to Sweetwater (ok little embellishment there, but you get my meaning). I wouldn't get a price for anything from Sweetwater!

I just listened to the videos on their site...and it sounds pretty damn good!!!!


----------



## IB-studjent- (Aug 24, 2011)

If they make this rack-mountable I'd have to buy it


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 24, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Mini ENGL SE (ok, thats me really dreaming lol)



Could always pair an SE preamp with a small power section like a Mesa 20/20 or Peavey 40/40. 



Sicarius said:


> That's stupid.



Not really. It's an American made Mesa. Not a cheap import like a lot of these mini amps have been. 

It's still pricey, but it comes with the territory.



IB-studjent- said:


> If they make this rack-mountable I'd have to buy it



Could always get a Recto Pre and a Mesa power amp.


----------



## Sicarius (Aug 24, 2011)

It just seems over priced with the rest of the mini amp heads in the sub 900 category (street).

I got really excited for this too :/


----------



## themike (Aug 24, 2011)

Sicarius said:


> It just seems over priced with the rest of the mini amp heads in the sub 900 category (street).
> 
> I got really excited for this too :/



American made compared to produced over seas. Also comes with the territory of being in business for decades and establishing yourself as nothing short of an amazing company and product line. BMW's were probably cheaper when they were a newer company haha


----------



## great_kthulu (Aug 24, 2011)

there are some sound clips up, sounding pretty good, we will have to wait and see on price though


----------



## cardinal (Aug 24, 2011)

Price seems fine for a well made, American built product. I'm a bit wary because they've made claims in the past that other, small EL84 amps bring the Recto fury. Those amps all sounded nice, but nothing like a Recto IMHO. Maybe they finally got it. In the end though, a Recto to me needs a tube rectifier, so I can't really say I'm interested, but kudos to Mesa for delivering something that it seems like a lot of people wanted.


----------



## JP Universe (Aug 24, 2011)

If they ever do a Mark 5 utilising this idea i'm all over it.... As much as I love this it makes no sense for me to get it considering I have a Single Recto and a 2x12


----------



## Stealthdjentstic (Aug 24, 2011)

Looks like I was wrong 

A little pricey, especially seeing as you can get rectos for like 700 dollars.


----------



## SnowfaLL (Aug 24, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Could always pair an SE preamp with a small power section like a Mesa 20/20 or Peavey 40/40.



Yea thats what I will do if im not happy with the Axe-FX, as the SE is the only real amp I think can satisfy me.. but still; theres always something different when an amp is "combined", rather than a seperate preamp and poweramp setup. They always end up sounding not as good as full heads imo (even when it supposively is the exact same preamp and poweramp)

Also, theres a difference in having a unit thats 20" wide (rack) and 16" wide like the Carvin V3M or other mini heads. Pretty significant when you are looking for a small portable head.


----------



## Jzbass25 (Aug 25, 2011)

God I sort of want this... but I'd instantly sell my soul for a Mark V mini.


----------



## MatthewK (Aug 25, 2011)

Yep, gonna have to get one of those cute bastards.


----------



## asmegin_slayer (Aug 25, 2011)

I have to admit, I'm really digging it.


And the cabinets!!! lol

1x12 slant







straight


----------



## Stealthdjentstic (Aug 25, 2011)

AFX thru carvin power amp and mesa 1x12's.


----------



## atticmike (Aug 25, 2011)

Disregarding the price, way more interesting than these tiny terrors 

Wonder what the street prices will be like.


----------



## antman95 (Aug 25, 2011)

looks bad ass


----------



## Nialzzz (Aug 25, 2011)

Ooooooaft! This is gorgeous! Even though its a Mesa, I'd feel like a bit of a goon firing this up at a gig hahaha. I just wish it had a DI out for studio use!


----------



## maxoom (Aug 25, 2011)

Glad I listened to the clips on this cause I no longer have any gas for it.
Still prefer my Krank Rev jr`s over this one.It`s OK but for close to a grand it really does not do anything better or as good as what I got.


----------



## evilsaint (Aug 25, 2011)

Video Clips Mesa Boogie's Mini Rectifier Twenty-Five
Awesome !


----------



## Pedrojoca (Aug 25, 2011)

maxoom said:


> Glad I listened to the clips on this cause I no longer have any gas for it.
> Still prefer my Krank Rev jr`s over this one.It`s OK but for close to a grand it really does not do anything better or as good as what I got.



IMO, I don't think you can say that about clips made by the company itself... If you take a look at the original recto clips, they aren't any better, yet you see it's full power played by guys like us in this forum. Self-Made audio clips usually suck, and they called one of them modern metal, while probably having someone who has no clue on modern metal play it.


----------



## Key_Maker (Aug 25, 2011)

Too pricey for home use, too small for live use 

I will wait for the High Gain Rebel from Egnater


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 25, 2011)

Key_Maker said:


> Too pricey for home use, too small for live use
> 
> I will wait for the High Gain Rebel from Egnater


 
What's Mesa pricing like where you're at? 

Too small for live use? Says who? Wattage does not translate into volume. As far as absolute volume levels, a 25 watt will put out 99.9% the same decibels as a 100 watt amp. The only trade off with lower wattage is less clean headroom.


----------



## Key_Maker (Aug 25, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> What's Mesa pricing like where you're at?
> 
> Too small for live use? Says who? Wattage does not translate into volume. As far as absolute volume levels, a 25 watt will put out 99.9% the same decibels as a 100 watt amp. The only trade off with lower wattage is less clean headroom.



It's a Mesa, it's pricey and i really don't care if it is made in Usa, China or Niger. I know that you pay extra cash just for the brand and the hype and for home practicing there's better options like Blackstar, Egnater, Orange or buy something in used section with 1,5k can buy a 2x12 cab + rectifier/6505/T2/etc + attenuator + nova system.

25W for live or rehearsal use is not enough, if you want some tight, crushing, and defined tone for metal, you will require more headroom, that's why a 6505, a dual rectifier or any metal amp has bigger power stage.


----------



## viesczy (Aug 25, 2011)

So the vids are up, sounds capable & all, but all I can focus when watching the vids are that guy's fingernails in the modern metal/chunk vids! Those are talons! Illegal for him to have his hands in his pockets in 15 states because those are concealed weapons! 

Back to the amp, sounds good!

Derek


----------



## TemjinStrife (Aug 25, 2011)

djpharoah said:


> I have and it's no where close. Very different beast when compared to any Recto.
> 
> If this thing goes for $999 I'd still rather pickup the 5150III 50W micro head whenever that comes to fruition and on sale.



It's got quite a lot of Mark flavor and the cleans are awesome, but it gets very close to the Recto 'feel' and tonality, albeit with the mids focused higher.

Also, I'd rather pay $1k for a MIA Mesa than for a MIM 5150iii... the IIIs sound great, but I'd rather not have to worry about reliability.


----------



## 7slinger (Aug 27, 2011)

why the hell is 'mini' so damn cool?

I'm diggin this, though the clips could be better, specifically the heavy ones (which are the tones I'm most interested in)

I want to build a damn 'mini' arsenal of amps for at home, $ be damned


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 27, 2011)

Key_Maker said:


> It's a Mesa, it's pricey and i really don't care if it is made in Usa, China or Niger. I know that you pay extra cash just for the brand and the hype and for home practicing there's better options like Blackstar, Egnater, Orange or buy something in used section with 1,5k can buy a 2x12 cab + rectifier/6505/T2/etc + attenuator + nova system.
> 
> 25W for live or rehearsal use is not enough, if you want some tight, crushing, and defined tone for metal, you will require more headroom, that's why a 6505, a dual rectifier or any metal amp has bigger power stage.


 
For $1.5k I could get it and a cab, and some effects too. It's only $1k here it seems. I do think the $1.5k is extreme though. You paying for quality of build and componets as well as the name, not to mention Mesa's amazing customer service should anything go wrong with the amp. 

Try taking a 2x12, Recto, Attenuator, and Pedalboard accross town to a gig using public transit.  That's where this thing is being aimed, to those playing smaller clubs, and who need to travel light. 

Just because it's 25 watts doesn't mean it's silent, not by a long shot. That's still plenty loud to get you evicted. In fact it's just about as loud as any 50 or 100 watt amp. Remember, wattage is not equal to volume. 

As for playing live, if you use venues with real PA systems, you don't need a high wattage amp anyway. How else do you think large acts who use small combos (Bassman, Princeton, Single Rev, Steel King, Boogies, etc.) play larger gigs. 

It might not fit your needs, that's fine, though it's not right to make such broad statements.


----------



## 7slinger (Aug 27, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Just because it's 25 watts doesn't mean it's silent, not by a long shot. That's still plenty loud to get you evicted. In fact it's just about as loud as any 50 or 100 watt amp. Remember, wattage is not equal to volume.



I use my 40w splawn for gigs - #1 statement I get from sound guys is "TURN IT DOWN"


----------



## Pedrojoca (Aug 27, 2011)

7slinger said:


> I use my 40w splawn for gigs - #1 statement I get from sound guys is "TURN IT DOWN"



25w and 40w in tubes goes a long way in percieved volume


----------



## bostjan (Aug 27, 2011)

asmegin_slayer said:


> And the cabinets!!! lol
> 
> 1x12 slant



Wha? ... 1x12 Slant? I'm assuming that the whole speaker is slanted and not just the top half of it. 

I love the idea of the cab's. The amp is great, too, but for live shows I would much prefer a little more headroom.


----------



## TemjinStrife (Aug 27, 2011)

Pedrojoca said:


> 25w and 40w in tubes goes a long way in percieved volume



No it doesn't. My 30w Budda Superdrive (4xEL84) 1x12 combo keeps up with my friend's 60W 6505+ 1x12 combo without a problem.


----------



## jnukes2 (Aug 27, 2011)

A mini Mark would really be so awesome... I'm still going to try this out.


----------



## IB-studjent- (Aug 28, 2011)

^ YUSS


----------



## VILARIKA (Aug 28, 2011)

I'm gonna sell my Dual Rec and get like 5 of these tiny lunchboxes


----------



## 7slinger (Aug 28, 2011)

Pedrojoca said:


> 25w and 40w in tubes goes a long way in percieved volume



I don't really know what you mean by this

5150, 5152, Sig:X, Rivera KR55, Dual Rec, Splawn, Mesa 50/50.

These are amps I've owned and gigged with.

Every one of them waaaay more volume on tap than I've ever needed in 10 years for a gig.

I'm not playing arenas or venues that hold thousands, but any of these amps ranging from 40w up to 100w has been enough for the clubs I do play, which are the same ones the metal bands that aren't playing to thousands play at

edit: If you want spanking bright squeaky cleans at high volume, more wattage is your friend. I don't think the 40w Splawn would be my pick for this, but the 55w Rivera had the best cleans I've ever had on an amp and were plenty loud without breaking up


----------



## vanhendrix (Aug 28, 2011)

The squeaky clean thing is really important for me, and I think that will be something difficult to gauge in a guitar store. What seems loud in the store might be nowhere near your stage volume and you end up having a different experience with the amp. This would be something I'd like to try in a real situation before sinking what seems like a whole bunch of cash into.


----------



## gilsontsang (Aug 28, 2011)

I am so excited for this, I am owning a triple rectifier right now, can't wait to see what an el84 power section will do !


----------



## atticmike (Aug 29, 2011)

fuck this. In terms of price, you can get plenty other amps that are not trimmed to less features such as a "mini" version of a famous brand. 

Particularly the used market of Mesas is so big, it can easily compete with their off the stock sales


----------



## Mordacain (Aug 29, 2011)

atticmike said:


> fuck this. In terms of price, you can get plenty other amps that are not trimmed to less features such as a "mini" version of a famous brand.
> 
> Particularly the used market of Mesas is so big, it can easily compete with their off the stock sales



I'm not sure if I follow your point. The idea of a mini amp is that the output section starts to clip earlier than a larger amp at a lower volume. The "trimming of features" as you put it is essential in a small amp design for space constraints as well as simplifying the design to make the most of the lower clean headroom.

With regards to used pricing, its kind of pointless to compare used pricing to a newly released product. If no-one buys the new product, then there will never be a used product to circulate. My


----------



## atticmike (Aug 29, 2011)

Mordacain said:


> I'm not sure if I follow your point. The idea of a mini amp is that the output section starts to clip earlier than a larger amp at a lower volume. The "trimming of features" as you put it is essential in a small amp design for space constraints as well as simplifying the design to make the most of the lower clean headroom.
> 
> With regards to used pricing, its kind of pointless to compare used pricing to a newly released product. If no-one buys the new product, then there will never be a used product to circulate. My


 
Totally agree with you and you are right about the output section functioning better on lower volumes as with a regular amp (perfect for recording purposes in small environments). However, my reference to used prices was just trying to put emphasis on people accommodating their buck for the best performance. 

If the amp is relatively close-priced to a regular head, then is surely make sense to maybe live with a louder volume and all the benefits, even if it is right off the shelves.


----------



## 7slinger (Aug 29, 2011)

I hope side armor is an option for the 1x12s


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Aug 29, 2011)

7slinger said:


> I hope side armor is an option for the 1x12s



By Dio I hope you're not joking.


----------



## getaway_fromme (Aug 29, 2011)

atticmike said:


> If the amp is relatively close-priced to a regular head, then is surely make sense to maybe live with a louder volume and all the benefits, even if it is right off the shelves.



But it's really, really small. For an amp head that easily weighs 30 lbs, it's just the convenience of being able to carry it with one hand that makes the price worth it.

Point being, it may not make sense to you, but it does for myself and many others.


----------



## XEN (Aug 29, 2011)

The head and cab together weigh about 18 pounds less than my Mark IV
If I were in the market for another tube amp I'd be on this.


----------



## daos_27 (Aug 30, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> But I still think the Carvin V3M is the winner for micro amps. Im praying they release a mini Legacy II, that'd be my dream amp, least until theres a Mini ENGL SE (ok, thats me really dreaming lol)


 
Mini ENGL Savage or ENGL SE at 30 - 40 watts would be killer preferably the SE with just channels 1, 2 and 4 and reverb but definately with the 2 bottom boost functions and a lower wattage mode.

Or a mini 30 - 40 watt Mesa Roadster with the lonestar cleans and recto distortion with reverb and a lower wattage

Or a Mini Rivera K-Tre Reverb head 

Or even a mini Framus Cobra head would be killer to see! 

Actually to expect any new metal amp at all from Framus would be dreaming... I am beggining to think that they fluked the Cobra and Dragon and not game to try another metal amp


----------



## EvilEmuofDoom (Aug 30, 2011)

I pre-ordered one the morning they were available! It's killing me not knowing when it's even going to ship. FINALLY a Mesa Recto I can play in the bedroom


----------



## Floppystrings (Aug 31, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> No it doesn't. My 30w Budda Superdrive (4xEL84) 1x12 combo keeps up with my friend's 60W 6505+ 1x12 combo without a problem.



He said tube wattage goes a long way.

That means he said tube wattage is loud.

So why are you disagreeing?


----------



## AvantGuardian (Aug 31, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Just because it's 25 watts doesn't mean it's silent, not by a long shot. That's still plenty loud to get you evicted. In fact it's just about as loud as any 50 or 100 watt amp. Remember, wattage is not equal to volume.
> 
> As for playing live, if you use venues with real PA systems, you don't need a high wattage amp anyway. How else do you think large acts who use small combos (Bassman, Princeton, Single Rev, Steel King, Boogies, etc.) play larger gigs.



Yes, true, BUT if you're playing an amp running 2xEL84 with a loud rock band and you don't mic it at rehearsals, you're likely diming the volume to keep up and you'll burn through power tubes a lot faster than if you were running a 40-50 watt rig. Also, forget about having a real "clean" sound at any significant volume. From my experience with my H&K 2xEL84 combo, there just isn't a lot of headroom there.

I think these high gain lunchbox rigs probably make nice studio amps, or if you live in a house where you can play at reasonably loud volumes, they could be cool, but the 18-25 watt amp is just lost on me. They're not loud enough to be my rehearsal/gigging rig and they're too loud to crank up at home (townhouse with shared walls). If I had a detached house though, I'd probably be real tempted to grab something like this just for playing around with and home recording.


----------



## SnowfaLL (Aug 31, 2011)

AvantGuardian said:


> Yes, true, BUT if you're playing an amp running 2xEL84 with a loud rock band and you don't mic it at rehearsals, you're likely diming the volume to keep up and you'll burn through power tubes a lot faster than if you were running a 40-50 watt rig. Also, forget about having a real "clean" sound at any significant volume. From my experience with my H&K 2xEL84 combo, there just isn't a lot of headroom there.
> 
> I think these high gain lunchbox rigs probably make nice studio amps, or if you live in a house where you can play at reasonably loud volumes, they could be cool, but the 18-25 watt amp is just lost on me. They're not loud enough to be my rehearsal/gigging rig and they're too loud to crank up at home (townhouse with shared walls). If I had a detached house though, I'd probably be real tempted to grab something like this just for playing around with and home recording.



Thats also another reason why the Carvin V3M is great, its actually 50 watts (4xEL84) which is just enough (imo) to be able to be viable for any situation. (and enough headroom for cleans, which 25W struggles with) - - - The Mesa ones being 25W is barely enough in my opinion, they should of made it at least 40, if not 50-60.


----------



## Mordacain (Aug 31, 2011)

AvantGuardian said:


> Yes, true, BUT if you're playing an amp running 2xEL84 with a loud rock band and you don't mic it at rehearsals, you're likely diming the volume to keep up and you'll burn through power tubes a lot faster than if you were running a 40-50 watt rig. Also, forget about having a real "clean" sound at any significant volume. From my experience with my H&K 2xEL84 combo, there just isn't a lot of headroom there.
> 
> I think these high gain lunchbox rigs probably make nice studio amps, or if you live in a house where you can play at reasonably loud volumes, they could be cool, but the 18-25 watt amp is just lost on me. They're not loud enough to be my rehearsal/gigging rig and they're too loud to crank up at home (townhouse with shared walls). If I had a detached house though, I'd probably be real tempted to grab something like this just for playing around with and home recording.



I used to jam with a loud drummer with my Blackstar HT5 (5 watt). I would barely punch halfway on my HT20 (20 watt) with the same drummer. Personally I just don't see the need for massive wattage if you're not playing arenas. Even if you are, Brian May used a bazillion AC-30's (30 watt) and I seriously doubt you could ever complain you couldn't hear him loud & clear.

Perhaps I don't understand, but I thought massive headroom was really only useful if you are trying to amplify a clean tone and make it loud (and still clean). The point for most metal / heavy crunch tones is to get Output tube saturation / clipping & speaker distortion (which happens along with output tube clipping at any wattage, not necessarily when reaching the speaker's maximum wattage rating).


----------



## AvantGuardian (Aug 31, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Thats also another reason why the Carvin V3M is great, its actually 50 watts (4xEL84) which is just enough (imo) to be able to be viable for any situation. (and enough headroom for cleans, which 25W struggles with) - - - The Mesa ones being 25W is barely enough in my opinion, they should of made it at least 40, if not 50-60.



Yep. That's primarily why I got a V3M. Sounds good, super portable, gets loud and its cheap! 



Mordacain said:


> I used to jam with a loud drummer with my Blackstar HT5 (5 watt). I would barely punch halfway on my HT20 (20 watt) with the same drummer. Personally I just don't see the need for massive wattage if you're not playing arenas. Even if you are, Brian May used a bazillion AC-30's (30 watt) and I seriously doubt you could ever complain you couldn't hear him loud & clear.
> 
> Perhaps I don't understand, but I thought massive headroom was really only useful if you are trying to amplify a clean tone and make it loud (and still clean). The point for most metal / heavy crunch tones is to get Output tube saturation / clipping & speaker distortion (which happens along with output tube clipping at any wattage, not necessarily when reaching the speaker's maximum wattage rating).



Well, I don't know. It may be my practice room or something, but I'm speaking from experience with my H&K 2xEL84. Maybe if it was just me and the drummer I'd be okay, but with another guitar, bass, and vox, I had to crank it to be audible and the clean tone became more of an overdrive tone at that volume. I use a 50watt 2x6L6 head now and I feel like I'm getting some push on the power tubes but not to a point where its muddy or overly saturated.


----------



## TemjinStrife (Aug 31, 2011)

Floppystrings said:


> He said tube wattage goes a long way.
> 
> That means he said tube wattage is loud.
> 
> So why are you disagreeing?



Probably quoted the wrong post.


----------



## 4Eyes (Aug 31, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> they should of made it at least 40, if not 50-60.


there is one simple reason why not - single recto


----------



## Rook (Aug 31, 2011)

The people who keep mentioning a mini-Mark, have you ever seen a Mark IV short head in person? They're tiny!


----------



## Mordacain (Aug 31, 2011)

Fun111 said:


> The people who keep mentioning a mini-Mark, have you ever seen a Mark IV short head in person? They're tiny!



True, but when I think mini Mark I'm thinking a smaller, simplified Mark V...similar to this Mini Recto concept with 6V6's or EL84s (and ideally a 5 watt mode).

Honestly, I could live without Channel 2 on the Mark V and just the II & IV modes on Channel 3.

/Edit - I should also mention the defining element for a mini head for me is overall wattage and 30 watts is where I draw the line


----------



## SnowfaLL (Sep 1, 2011)

Fun111 said:


> The people who keep mentioning a mini-Mark, have you ever seen a Mark IV short head in person? They're tiny!



They are still quite large, by new-lunchbox amp standards.. if i recall, a mark IV shorthead is 19.5"W, at least 8"H (for head only) and like 12"D, At that rate why not just get a rack with Axe-FX and a 2U poweramp, lighter and same size.

the appeal of these "lunchbox" amps is they are significantly smaller than racks; usually around 17" width; about the size of the old 10W practice amps companies put out. That makes their portability unreal (not to mention, good luck carrying a Mark IV with one hand! they are like 70 lbs, where as the Mini Recto/Carvin V3M/Tiny terror are all under 25 lbs)

If you are ok with lugging around a normal Recto or something in the first place, dont even bother with these mini amps. Its target demographic is people who play like 3 times+ a week and don't want to carry around two 4x12s and a 70 lbs head (really, anything over a 2x12 and 60W is overkill under stadium gigs anyways imo) - say goodbye to your back/knees in 10 years


----------



## SirMyghin (Sep 1, 2011)

That is a pretty cool amp, albeit 10W is hardly quiet, if I can measure its volume beside my Mark in 10W. It does have an FX loop though, something a lot of the smaller amps are missing. 

12 lbs is monster light too, I want to hear this thing in action/demo one when I run into it. 

Nick, if you are damaging your body lifting something as palty as a 70 lb object, you can't be in very good shape to begin with. If you hurt your knees and back, it is a combination of being in bad shape, and not knowing how to lift stuff properly. You take care of your body over time, and it will take care of the tasks you require of it. Granted most people today have terrible posture, gait, and joint allignment, but that is their own fault for allowing their body to atrophy.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Sep 1, 2011)

AvantGuardian said:


> Well, I don't know. It may be my practice room or something, but I'm speaking from experience with my H&K 2xEL84. Maybe if it was just me and the drummer I'd be okay, but with another guitar, bass, and vox, I had to crank it to be audible and the clean tone became more of an overdrive tone at that volume. I use a 50watt 2x6L6 head now and I feel like I'm getting some push on the power tubes but not to a point where its muddy or overly saturated.


 
Though, once again, wattage is not an indication of volume, but headroom. Those some very different things. It's quite possible between the amp itself, the room, EQ, and the speaker array you were using that your H&K was drowned out. I can just about promise that wattage was not the culprit. 

The volume difference, as in the actual amount of air the amp is able to push and be louder, between 25 watts and 50 watts is just about inaudible to the human ear, even at the same "settings".


----------



## TemjinStrife (Sep 1, 2011)

Fun111 said:


> The people who keep mentioning a mini-Mark, have you ever seen a Mark IV short head in person? They're tiny!



They're also pretty heavy, not necessarily an easy carry.


----------



## Sephael (Sep 1, 2011)

atticmike said:


> If the amp is relatively close-priced to a regular head, then is surely make sense to maybe live with a louder volume and all the benefits, even if it is right off the shelves.


Benefits like eviction and tinnitus? 




SirMyghin said:


> Nick, if you are damaging your body lifting something as palty as a 70 lb object, you can't be in very good shape to begin with. If you hurt your knees and back, it is a combination of being in bad shape, and not knowing how to lift stuff properly.


 Any place I have ever worked anything 70 lbs or more fell into the category of team lift because it is easy enough to hurt your back on them, especially if they are not an idea shape for lifting.


----------



## ss22 (Sep 2, 2011)

Sephael said:


> Benefits like eviction and tinnitus?
> 
> 
> Two words: hot. plate.
> ...


----------



## SnowfaLL (Sep 2, 2011)

SirMyghin said:


> That is a pretty cool amp, albeit 10W is hardly quiet, if I can measure its volume beside my Mark in 10W. It does have an FX loop though, something a lot of the smaller amps are missing.
> 
> 12 lbs is monster light too, I want to hear this thing in action/demo one when I run into it.
> 
> Nick, if you are damaging your body lifting something as palty as a 70 lb object, you can't be in very good shape to begin with. If you hurt your knees and back, it is a combination of being in bad shape, and not knowing how to lift stuff properly. You take care of your body over time, and it will take care of the tasks you require of it. Granted most people today have terrible posture, gait, and joint allignment, but that is their own fault for allowing their body to atrophy.



I'll highlight the important part of my post you missed.



> Its target demographic is people who play like 3 times+ a week and don't want to carry around two 4x12s and a 70 lbs head (really, anything over a 2x12 and 60W is overkill under stadium gigs anyways imo) - *say goodbye to your back/knees in 10 years*



So yes, if you were a WORKING musician (im not talking one gig a month like most metal bands, im talking 3-5 shows a WEEK).. that adds up over time. 10 years down the road, thats not a fun situation. Has nothing to do with "being out of shape".. Its like saying being a runningback in football for 5 years in the NFL isnt going to totally destroy their body, but if only they were "in shape", they would be perfectly fine? .. Consistantly Added stress over your body over time is not a good idea, look at most Carpenters (im friends with many), they have fucked up joints by the time they are 50-60, as im sure most occupations where people have to lift 100 lbs consistently are, REGARDLESS of their physical shape.

Its no coincidence that when you see most of these new metal bands with 4x12s and 300W tube heads, their stage sound is CRAP because they dont understand how volume works (like someone said earlier, 50W and 100W is virtually the same, except headroom) or how band mixing works (how many crappy bands can you only hear guitar and no vocals/bass?? How about drummers literally hitting through their snares because they have to play that hard to keep up with the guitarists amp, giving overall NO dynamics in the song??) - *Maybe a generalization*, but more often than not when I go jam with a metal guy who says "You need a 4x12 and 100W+ tube amp", they dont understand proper volume/mixing/dynamics. A good band/player understands that you dont need to turn your amp to "11" to play, you need to BALANCE the mix and have everyone be heard properly. You don't need a 4x12 in ANY situation, if you have a well-constructed 2x12, or even a closed back oversized 1x12. Add in how 4x12s can be, with their dispersion and beaming. 

So you can go play a 4x12 like that.. but I see no point until you are playing Ozzy-like stadium gigs. THEN you add on the weight and crap you have to bring around every practice AND gigs for the next 10 years, not to mention being a pain in the ass to ask your friends to help you loading in the 4x12s/80lbs heads sometimes (If the gig is in a 2nd level of a building, Im assuming we're not all bodybuilders like Sirmyghin to carry a 4x12 up stairs by ourselves) 

Use a 4x12 if you want, but I just know for ME, its not worth it, costwise, tonewise, volumewise and practicality. And its not because im "out of shape". What a bullshit response to give to someone whos opinion is different than yours. 

I guess the past 2 years of all these companies making Mini amps like the EVH 5150, this Mini Recto, Vox Nighttrain, Carvin V3M and Orange Tiny terrors (huge sellers) are all specifically made for people who are just "out of shape" who can't lift the real thing?


----------



## TemjinStrife (Sep 2, 2011)

I will say there is a justification for high watt tube amps for people who want that high-headroom clean or distorted tone without power tube sag. Very few people who have a Triple Rec put the volume anywhere near above 10 o'clock.


----------



## Sephael (Sep 2, 2011)

ss22 said:


> Two words: hot. plate.


adding another $300 or so to the equation on one side kinda nulls your previous comment about same price range, since for something like a used 6505 that is almost a 50% increase in cost.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Sep 2, 2011)

Sephael said:


> adding another $300 or so to the equation on one side kinda nulls your previous comment about same price range, since for something like a used 6505 that is almost a 50% increase in cost.


 
Well, if you're talking used I've seen Hot Plates go for as little as $100 on CL.


----------



## daos_27 (Sep 6, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Thats also another reason why the Carvin V3M is great, its actually 50 watts (4xEL84) which is just enough (imo) to be able to be viable for any situation. (and enough headroom for cleans, which 25W struggles with) - - - The Mesa ones being 25W is barely enough in my opinion, they should of made it at least 40, if not 50-60.


 

At 25 Mesa watts it will be more like 30 - 35 watts anyway! There will definitely be a good amount of distortion headroom and with Mesa Amps you don't need to crank the gain on the clean to get more volume so much as you do Orange amps etc so it will have more clean headroom than the Dual Terror 30 and many other smaller amps anyway 

25 watt is a good start it is still better than 15 and hopefully there will be a bigger brother like with the Mesa TA15 and TA30 and the GigMaster 15 and GigMaster 30 the Rebel 20 and Rebel 30 the Krank Jr 20's and Jr 50's and Tiny Terror and Dual Terror etc. 

I am sure (well I am seriously hoping for anyway) they will release a 40 watt bigger brother. And hopefully with the lonestar cleans and reverb. A footswitchable solo boost or 2nd master volume in addition to footswitchable reverb and I would easily pay the retail of a full blown Dual Recto or Roadster for it!!

Either way just a 40 watt version with a 5 or 10 watt mode with the lonestar cleans is really all I would ask for. A mini Roadster at 40 watts and not much bigger than the mini Recto would be the best mini tube head on the planet 

Forget mini Mark amp heads if your after that you don't want balls out Recto Style distortion anyway and you already have the Lonestar Classic, the TA15, TA30 and the Mesa Express 5:25 which can do cleans and thick fat rock very well.

...Not to mention (again) the small chassis mark heads! Plus the old DC studio 22 and DC35 which were the stripped down Mark IV in a smaller lighter package at lower watts  

But a mini amp such as the Dual Recto has never been done and this is a real turning point here in terms of users having their say and finally getting heard and getting what they want so keep putting your requirements forward and we shall be heard we are the market! 

Keep up the good work Mesa and give us a 40 watt version with reverb and Lonestar Cleans!


----------



## atticmike (Sep 6, 2011)

Five years from now, we'll probably find ourselves in a smiliar situation:"I'm torn between getting either the regular, small or medium Mark VI. However the small one has similar watts, the medium offers a channel more and weighs as much as the small brother. I heard that the od channel of the small sounds inferior to the medium sized Mark VI but is on the same level as the regular head. Cleans are probably the best part of the small Mark and exceed the regular head beyond its awesomeness"


----------



## gilsontsang (Sep 12, 2011)

el84 recto, I don't know what to say except... GAS!


----------



## Hybrid138 (Sep 22, 2011)

Mini-Recto


----------

