# Line 6 "SEE" announcement - 1.19.12



## SnowfaLL (Dec 23, 2011)

So as I mentioned in the POD thread, Line 6 is gearing up to make a huge announcement at NAMM 2012. To quote MusicRadar, "Line 6 is set to unveil "the most significant product announcements in the history of the company."

NAMM 2012: Rumours and what we know so far | MusicRadar.com

No idea if it has anything to do with their Pods, or if it even has to do with Guitar (remember their wireless systems are a flagship portion lately) - but should be something worthwhile hopefully. Why is NAMM so far away..

On the website, the front page says "SEE" in red, followed by 1.19.12

Line 6 | Guitar Amplifiers, Effects Pedals, Wireless Microphones, Recording Software

Any guesses? Please keep the Line 6 bashing to yourself.


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## pearl_07 (Dec 23, 2011)

A new wireless would be great so then the prices for X50's would finally drop. It could be anything. New recording interface, rackmount power amp, new Vetta III, new addition to their Variax line(it better not be this haha).


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## nojyeloot (Dec 23, 2011)

pearl_07 said:


> A new wireless would be great so then the prices for X50's would finally drop.


^
THIS, OH PLEASE OH PLEASE.

I've toyed with the idea that they will attempt to bring something to the table that will rival the AxeFX II. Doubt it though.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 23, 2011)

nojyeloot said:


> ^
> THIS, OH PLEASE OH PLEASE.
> 
> I've toyed with the idea that they will attempt to bring something to the table that will rival the AxeFX II. Doubt it though.



I doubt it'll be anything in the modelling world though, as they said its going to be revolutionary. Only thing in that I could think of, would be like a HD500/Vetta with the DT (bogner) tube power section all in one (or how about in a 2U rack OMG drool), now that would be pretty awesome. I doubt thats it though.


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## AySay (Dec 23, 2011)

They cloned the AxeFX for half the price.


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## USMarine75 (Dec 23, 2011)

I love my Vett II head. I have yet to have someone bash it after having played it through a proper rig (not the POS Line6 cab that might be the worst I have ever heard).

I got mine new for $1299 on sale back in the day and I dont regret it one bit. It may not be 100% as good as a Diezel Herbert or Engl Powerball, but it's pretty damn close for having 80 amps that can be blended, as well as hundreds of effects/cabs/mics/etc in true stereo 2x150W...

*tl;dr - I would love a Vetta III personally...*


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## BlindingLight7 (Dec 23, 2011)

"hopes for cloned axe-fx"


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## Cancer (Dec 23, 2011)

The only thing that would REALLY matter is a true competitor to the Axe-Fx, and I won't even fart in it's direction unless it has two TigerSHARC chips.


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## celticelk (Dec 23, 2011)

If I was in the market for a do-it-all modeler, I can't see myself choosing a made-in-China Line 6 over a made-in-the-US Fractal.


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## Lorcan Ward (Dec 23, 2011)

Pod HD Mark II 

The POD HD Pro was only just released so theirs no way they would be releasing another modeler when they still have to release Pod Farm HD and the model packs. They still have a lot of marketing left to do on that product.


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## USMarine75 (Dec 23, 2011)

My Vetta II head was $1299... it is an all in one preamp/amp with 2x150W. (The 2x12 combo was around $1600 not on sale)

Axe-FX II, plus 300W stereo power amp, and case... $3500? Add a 2x12 and you're around $4k.

Axe-FX is better based on the demos/songs that I've heard... but if you're not a touring/recording/discerning hard-core musician it's hard to justify the price increase. Also, it depends on the genre. The Axe-FX djents better, but I'll A/B my Vetta against an Axe-FX for Hendrix or EVH any day. And IMO if you pump it through mains at a club you can't tell the difference between the Vetta simulations and the real amps anyways (let alone a Vetta vs Axe-FX), especially at loud volumes.

And just me but with todays global economy I dont care where shit is made. I don't buy American, mostly because a lot of American products are shit and overpriced. The last Amrerican car I owned was a 1970 Mercury Cyclone Spoiler with a 351 Cleveland that I bought in 1992. Oh, and I used to work on high end circuit boards and most of the components are Chinese anyways, regardless of the country of manufacture.


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## BlindingLight7 (Dec 23, 2011)

USMarine75 said:


> *a lot of American products are shit and overpriced.*
> 
> *most of the components are Chinese anyways, regardless of the country of manufacture.*


That pretty much somes it up, what you think is American isn't americqan at all, just cause it's assembled here doesn't mean shit. 

And I completely agree that most American products are disgustingly overpriced and of horrible quality.


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## Spinedriver (Dec 23, 2011)

Maybe they're stealing Digitech's idea and making an ALL tube amp head (even though the Digitech ones never actually materialized).

The only other thing I can think of that could relate to "see" might be a Pod HD that can interface with a tablet (like Digitech's RP that uses an iPad for an interface or maybe an upgraded version of Amp Farm that could be on par with Amplitube or Guitar Rig. 

Anything other than that, I can't really see them calling a new Variaxe or wireless unit "the most revolutionary product in the company's history".


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## Stealthdjentstic (Dec 23, 2011)

I still think its pathetic a multi-million dollar company like Line6 cant beat the previously ghetto setup cliff n' crew had. You would think a huge ass dev team could beat some guy in his basement but I guess not.


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## vanhendrix (Dec 23, 2011)

I'm very curious about this. Don't know what the 'see' clue could possibly mean though


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 23, 2011)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> I still think its pathetic a multi-million dollar company like Line6 cant beat the previously ghetto setup cliff n' crew had. You would think a huge ass dev team could beat some guy in his basement but I guess not.



They could match/beat if they spent the money into it, put the expensivest chips and parts into their units, and etc. But L6 knows their niche is under $600 units so that is what they are catering for. Keep in mind, L6 develops TONS of products such as the wireless units (best wireless units out there atm?) and Variax, Amps (spiders and DT's and Vetta's) and tons of other things; the pod is only a small portion of their company. Fractal has ONLY one thing they work on, 100% R&D goes into that, 100% of the company is focused on that one product. and Fractal isnt just one guy in a basement either; he has lots of people working for him.

Its just not profitable for L6 at this point to compete vs Fractal, but thats not to say they couldnt do it and do it convincingly. Thats not their market. I doubt competiting with Fractal is even one of their goals to be honest.

The market for $2500+ units is quite slim as it is, where as the $600 units can be sold in every guitar store in the world, and is affordable for everyone (hobbiest and professionals). They could sell ~5000 units for $2500 each, or sell a million units at $600.. I wonder what makes more sense for them..


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## celticelk (Dec 23, 2011)

BlindingLight7 said:


> That pretty much somes it up, what you think is American isn't americqan at all, just cause it's assembled here doesn't mean shit.



It means that a few more of my countrymen might have jobs. That's a little more than "shit" to me. And yes, I'm well aware that quite a few of the components are Chinese-made - does that mean that I shouldn't reward the companies who are at least making the effort to have SOME of the work done here?


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## teabagger (Dec 23, 2011)

Heck all they need to do is introduce custom IR supports and the HD would be killer.... I hope its this.


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## flint757 (Dec 23, 2011)

Why is everything always black and white in conversations 

Anyhow anything would be cool since I'm not really in the market for anything ATM.


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## jam3v (Dec 23, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> They could match/beat if they spent the money into it, put the expensivest chips and parts into their units, and etc. But L6 knows their niche is under $600 units so that is what they are catering for. Keep in mind, L6 develops TONS of products such as the wireless units (best wireless units out there atm?) and Variax, Amps (spiders and DT's and Vetta's) and tons of other things; the pod is only a small portion of their company. Fractal has ONLY one thing they work on, 100% R&D goes into that, 100% of the company is focused on that one product. and Fractal isnt just one guy in a basement either; he has lots of people working for him.
> 
> Its just not profitable for L6 at this point to compete vs Fractal, but thats not to say they couldnt do it and do it convincingly. Thats not their market. I doubt competiting with Fractal is even one of their goals to be honest.



Great points, but, even if they sank all their resources into developing an "Axe-Killer" it's certainly not guaranteed they would be successful. The enthusiasm that birthed the AxeFX has a lot to do with its quality.


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## Blasphemer (Dec 23, 2011)

teabagger said:


> Heck all they need to do is introduce custom IR supports and the HD would be killer.... I hope its this.



I doubt thats what the big "see" change is, but I hope they do instate it.

I'm putting my money on a Vetta III with HD models.


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## teabagger (Dec 23, 2011)

> The only thing that would REALLY matter is a true competitor to the Axe-Fx, and I won't even fart in it's direction unless it has two TigerSHARC chips.


I think the modeling companys should jump on the ARM bandwagon, phones/tablets have pushed that industry forward leaving us with chipsets like the quadcore tegra 3. Easier programming and cheaper production, win win.


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## djinn314 (Dec 23, 2011)

USMarine75 said:


> I love my Vett II head. I have yet to have someone bash it after having played it through a proper rig (not the POS Line6 cab that might be the worst I have ever heard).
> 
> I got mine new for $1299 on sale back in the day and I dont regret it one bit. It may not be 100% as good as a Diezel Herbert or Engl Powerball, but it's pretty damn close for having 80 amps that can be blended, as well as hundreds of effects/cabs/mics/etc in true stereo 2x150W...
> 
> *tl;dr - I would love a Vetta III personally...*



Dude I was seriously getting ready to buy a Vetta II Combo for myself. This thing would make me go NUTS


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## pitbulltodd (Dec 23, 2011)

teabagger said:


> Heck all they need to do is introduce custom IR supports and the HD would be killer.... I hope its this.



i really hope it's this but i doubt it


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## pitbulltodd (Dec 23, 2011)

celticelk said:


> If I was in the market for a do-it-all modeler, I can't see myself choosing a made-in-China Line 6 over a made-in-the-US Fractal.



not everyone has the means or can afford to spend $2000 on an amp modeler thus the reason to choose a made in china line 6.


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## xCaptainx (Dec 23, 2011)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> I still think its pathetic a multi-million dollar company like Line6 cant beat the previously ghetto setup cliff n' crew had. You would think a huge ass dev team could beat some guy in his basement but I guess not.



Guess who sold the most amps worldwide in 2010? Line 6! Their spider range is the most purchased amp in the world. 

Axe FX do one thing, and do it extremely well. Line 6 are huge, offer A LOT of products and own the patent for modeling technology. Funnily enough with each purchase of AXE FX, some of that $ goes towards line 6 anyway! I doubt Line 6 are concerned, or wanting to venture into the market Fractal are at. And considering I could purchase 6 HD500's for what an Axe FX 2 goes for here, I don't want to either, haha. 

It's literally like comparing Mayones or Black Machine to Gibson/Fender. Two entirely different scale companies with two entirely different directions.


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## xCaptainx (Dec 23, 2011)

that being said, I'm really looking forward to seeing what this is. I doubt it's anything to do with wireless, as their G30/50/90 range just came out.

I'm kind of hoping its In Ear systems, as I really, really want one from line 6 haha. Although the SEE hint is pretty misleading. 

I'm hoping it's a new amp, with a redesigned floorboard. I've got a matrix poweramp/HD500 setup and the only thing stopping me from getting an HD pro is having to use the older style floorboard setup.


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## technomancer (Dec 23, 2011)

I really wish people would figure out Line 6 and Fractal are not really in the same market and let it go


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## SirMyghin (Dec 23, 2011)

Judging by the 'see' hint, it can only be one thing





technomancer said:


> I really wish people would figure out Line 6 and Fractal are not really in the same market and let it go



Come on now, we have shown time and time again around here that musicians would rather ignore economics than even think about it a little


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## Blasphemer (Dec 23, 2011)

SirMyghin said:


> Judging by the 'see' hint, it can only be one thing
> 
> 
> 
> ...




If I could have a holophoner... Oh man that would be awesome


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## Cancer (Dec 23, 2011)

technomancer said:


> I really wish people would figure out Line 6 and Fractal are not really in the same market and let it go



I find this funny ONLY because I discovered the Axefx here, on this forum, from a forum member, while investigating alternatives to the Vetta because I got tired of wanting for Line 6 to release a rack version of the Vetta. Without knowing numbers I'd wager that Line 6 is only more profitable because, instead growing with the age demographic of a market they created, they instead appealed to the "lower common denominator". It's kinda sad too, because for awhile, they owned that market. They WERE the standard in modeling, and they threw it away.

You're right though, it's not the same market, and it's not because Line 6 abandoned it, probably for more of these $$$$$$$$.

At this point, for Line 6 to get me back as an "original buyer", they will have to release nothing short of an Axefx killer, and I don't think they will EVER get bak the Fractal owner who cut there teeth on POD's.

God help Line 6 if Cliff released a lower price Axefx, or if he starts using Far East manufacturing.


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## flint757 (Dec 23, 2011)

To be quite frank you aren't paying for the assembly or the hardware. You are paying for the software in the hardware and the aftermarket support. Otherwise when hardware prices drop so should the product cost and since it isn't going down that signals to me you're paying for the software. Not to mention with each new release he kills the old one so he isn't trying to appeal to everyone. Technically he could keep up the old ones in production and lower the price and keep the new ones at current pricing and make more money IMO. But then the aftermarket support would suffer so...


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 24, 2011)

Shall I remind you guys that this is a thread on Line 6, not on other products. Please stay on topic. Its very unlikely this will be a new Pod anyways since they just released one last year.


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## XEN (Dec 24, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Shall I remind you guys that this is a thread on Line 6, not on other products. Please stay on topic. Its very unlikely this will be a new Pod anyways since they just released one last year.


Agreed.
At this point I'm guessing it's something visual. I know, major stretch of the imagination considering the teaser clue...
Perhaps a way to visualize virtual pedalboard layout changes without having to use a computer.
I don't think they'll do something like the Digitech iPad thingy, but with all the tech they've been putting into ios lately it would not surprise me.

That being said, the key word, announcements, was plural, so who knows?


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 24, 2011)

Yea I really pray it isnt something to do with the iphone/ipad/apple.. but I have a hunch it may be. Oh well, dissapointing if it is but thats what all companies seem to do now. Lets hope it has nothing to do with that


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## flint757 (Dec 24, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Yea I really pray it isnt something to do with the iphone/ipad/apple.. but I have a hunch it may be. Oh well, dissapointing if it is but thats what all companies seem to do now. Lets hope it has nothing to do with that



Definitely disappointing since that isn't all that astounding. too much mobile device hype lately. I know its the way to the future and what not, but i don't care that much about my phone and I'd rather walk around with a laptop than a tablet.


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## TemjinStrife (Dec 24, 2011)

celticelk said:


> If I was in the market for a do-it-all modeler, I can't see myself choosing a made-in-China Line 6 over a made-in-the-US Fractal.



Glad you have the ability to pay the extra $2000+. Most people don't.



Cancer said:


> The only thing that would REALLY matter is a true competitor to the Axe-Fx, and I won't even fart in it's direction unless it has two TigerSHARC chips.



This is a level of digital corksniffery pretentiousness that I never thought I'd actually see 



Stealthdjentstic said:


> I still think its pathetic a multi-million dollar company like Line6 cant beat the previously ghetto setup cliff n' crew had. You would think a huge ass dev team could beat some guy in his basement but I guess not.



Quoting the below for emphasis:



xCaptainx said:


> Guess who sold the most amps worldwide in 2010? Line 6! Their spider range is the most purchased amp in the world.
> 
> Axe FX do one thing, and do it extremely well. Line 6 are huge, offer A LOT of products and own the patent for modeling technology. Funnily enough with each purchase of AXE FX, some of that $ goes towards line 6 anyway! I doubt Line 6 are concerned, or wanting to venture into the market Fractal are at. And considering I could purchase 6 HD500's for what an Axe FX 2 goes for here, I don't want to either, haha.
> 
> It's literally like comparing Mayones or Black Machine to Gibson/Fender. Two entirely different scale companies with two entirely different directions.



Exactly. Line 6 doesn't need to "beat" the Axe-Fx in fidelity; they concentrate on providing modeling guitar solutions to your average or starting guitarist. 

They sell hundreds or thousands of PODs, Spiders, and the like for every one Axe-FX.

A better comparison is Jet City/Blackstar vs. Diezel/Two Rock. Jet City and Blackstar sell thousands of pretty damn good-sounding units to beginning, semi-pro, weekend warrior, and hobbyist musicians who don't have the desire or ability to spend $4k on an amplifier. Diezel and Two-Rock sell a small number of units to a very discriminating crowd with a lot of money to spend on an amplifier. 

Diezel and Two-Rock do not have to beat Jet City and Blackstar at their own games; rather, they continue to plug along at the high-profit-margin boutique area, while letting Jet City and Blackstar use their economies of scale and bang-for-the buck to duke it out in the low-profit-margin "consumer" range.


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## vanhendrix (Dec 24, 2011)

I like the idea of an axe-alternative. For me, as soon as you go digital you've crossed the line, everything within that realm is just different degrees of supposed 'realism'. Even the most realistic modeling isn't 'real'. At all. What it can do however is be outrageously handy and useful. 

For example, records sound better than CDs because the sampling rate of a digital medium can never perfectly replicated the sinewave of audio. Fair enough, but I'm not going to carry 1000 goddamn records with me when I'm walking down the street with my headphones on. So the companies should focus on _that_ in my opinion.

Most professional musicians use axe fx live because it replaces their entire rig in 2 neat rack spaces and is dead simple to operate. Stop trying to win the 'sounds almost as good' wars and focus on the usuefulness of the product! Imagine if iPods were marketed to have sound quality that 'models the best record players' instead of their ability to hold a gajillion songs. 

So anyways, a cheap axe? I'm in. I have a couple extra rack spaces anyways


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## ArrowHead (Dec 24, 2011)

Line 6 has introduced tons of modeling amps and heads over the years. No matter how cool, no new modeling amp or processor would be the most "revolutionary" thing they've introduced. Likelyhood is that this will be a completely different product.

And for those chanting for an axe-fx competitor: Stop. Axe-fx is a line 6 competitor, not the other way around. Line 6 have the top selling amp and top selling wireless units on the market. They already introduced their top of the line modeling amps and processors. Fractal Audio has their niche, but I doubt they are much more than a blip in the sales figures for Line 6.

The HD series is already here. The DT amps are already here. It's time to start requesting features (i.e. impulse loading, higher wattage DT heads, more amp models, etc...) and stop expecting them to create a completely different product they don't need in their lineup because their current product isn't as popular as Axe-FX.

If you want an axe-fx get an axe-fx. Don't keep expecting Line 6 to make you one.


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## Explorer (Dec 24, 2011)

Cancer said:


> Without knowing numbers I'd wager that Line 6 is only more profitable because, instead growing with the age demographic of a market they created, they instead appealed to the "lower common denominator". It's kinda sad too, because for awhile, they owned that market. They WERE the standard in modeling, and they threw it away.



An alternate view:

If you look at topics on The Gear Page, although there's a core membership dedicated to using only analog pedals, and others who are open to digital pedals as well, there's quite a few people who love how the M series simplified gigging. It's not a group of newbies who are only playing in their bedrooms. 

I only play out occasionally at this point (well, I did until the hand operations, so that's on hold), and I bought the M13 *and* the M9 last year. I didn't get a POD HD because the current consensus at TalkBass (also mostly made up of older players) is that the X3 is better for the bass stuff, so I'm sticking with that for the moment. 

I don't know how valid your "age demographic" idea is. I've just pointed out two online populations where the older, more experienced players like the new Line 6 gear, and others I know who are accepting of modelers like the gear as well. 

I especially like that my Line 6 gear has cost me less than $600 total. 



urklvt said:


> At this point I'm guessing it's something visual. I know, major stretch of the imagination considering the teaser clue...
> Perhaps a way to visualize virtual pedalboard layout changes without having to use a computer.



I also think it's a way to see and edit every part of the modeling chain simultanously. That's been one of the bigger criticisms of modelers, that they don't allow editing on the fly equivalent to having discrete pieces of gear.

A control surface equivalent to that Doepfer controller which allowed physical editing of every parameter of the Yamaha DX7, combined with a current setting indicator like on the Nord keyboards... that would be awesome.


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## celticelk (Dec 24, 2011)

^^^^^^ I'll add to that analysis that the guys on the Loopers' Delight list, who also trend older and are pretty discerning about gear, tend to be fans of the M-series modelers as well. I bought an M5 despite my strong preference for American-made gear because there's literally nothing else currently available that does what it does, and what it does fits a specific need that I have for rounding out my board.

I tend to agree with Explorer's analysis of the "SEE" idea as well: features on their recent products suggest that L6 is moving in the direction of making the entire signal chain visible and tweakable simultaneously. In any event, I'll be interested to see what they do.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 24, 2011)

wow im surprised by the knowledgable people here who realize Line 6 doesnt care about competing with Fractal, and their market is completely different.. I figured when I started this post, id have 50 people saying "If its not the axe-fx, who cares, L6 sucks LOLZ" like on every other shitty forum. Its amazing, and a reminder why I post here still after 6 years.

Moving on though, like I said I have my doubts it will be anything modelling based, as the Pod HD series just came out last year. Maybe they will do a firmware upgrade with Impulses and release a few new products along with it (Spider HD or Vetta) - but I personally think its gonna be something completely outside the modeling world.

I know its unrealistic.. but I really want a DT25 like amp that has a complete HD500 built in (more amps, and effects) along with the Bogner tube section still, at least 50 watts and ideally SMALLER (like the size of a Carvin V3M) - Basically a tube-powered Vetta. I know its pretty much impossible, but I can dream!


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## Rick (Dec 24, 2011)

Vetta III with tubes or rackmount plzkthkzbai


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## pitbulltodd (Dec 24, 2011)

i still wish it would be an impulse respone loader, maybe just in the hd pro but i'm sure it's not. they really would increase there sales if they did that.


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## op1e (Dec 24, 2011)

A new HD147 with actual HD modelling would be nice. I like the size of that head over the Vetta. This whole "SEE" thing and signal chain tweak-ability you suggest lends me to believe its gonna be a visual interface, ala Tablets, and trying to eat into Amplitube's marketshare. Hate to admit it, but that's probably it. Software has a higher profit margin, since there's no manufacturing involved.


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## Explorer (Dec 24, 2011)

If they made an iPad version of the HD, with all the M series effects, that would be seriously bad ass. 

----

Maybe I'm just not looking at this from the correct angle, but could someone enlighten me about what the word "SEE" might have to do with a largely non-visual product like an amp? I just don't get it.


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## Pedrojoca (Dec 24, 2011)

Why do I visit an announcement thread so much time before the actual announcement?

I LOVE to see that ss.org actually comes up with amazing product ideas xD


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## gunshow86de (Dec 24, 2011)

My "wildly off-base without a shred of evidence" prediction;

A new Variax guitar with an integrated POD HD. You dinosaurs can stick with your FRFR setups, try going guitar straight into PA.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 24, 2011)

I read an amazing idea from another forum that I thought I would share.. Of course, very unlikely L6 or any company will ever release something like this.. but would be amazing if it was made somewhere by someone.

So its a 2x12 cabinet for in-room sound (or 1x12 with tweeter for flatter PA range) with a poweramp portion; similar to the Atomic FRFR, but in addition to the poweramp, it has an Impulse-preamp solely for the purpose of loading custom impulses.. So when you connect into the poweramp, you have the option to turn ON the impulse, or keep it off and just go into the poweramp (impulses are loaded thru USB or something from your computer) - This makes it possible to run whatever modeller you use, be it Boss, Digitech, HD500, Axe-FX, etc and use this cab for your Redwirez or other impulses. Obviously more beneficial for modellers that don't have impulse loading capabilities already.

I think it'd be quite cool, especially if released by L6 as pairing it with the HD500 would solve many issues most people have (wanting impulse loading and FRFR setup)


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## SirMyghin (Dec 24, 2011)

gunshow86de said:


> My "wildly off-base without a shred of evidence" prediction;
> 
> A new Variax guitar with an integrated POD HD. You dinosaurs can stick with your FRFR setups, try going guitar straight into PA.



That would be a mother of gigging machines right there. Not needing anything but your axe would be pretty amazing.


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## shanejohnson02 (Dec 25, 2011)

I'm thinking it'll either be the all-in-one axe as previously mentioned, or maybe a hybrid all-in-one amp head with an HD pre and a Bogner tube section.


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## kherman (Dec 25, 2011)

Honestly, I hoping it's something with the M13.
A new version maybe.
Something with more versatility, less coloring, and is a true 4CM.
I personally think the 4CM with the current M13 is something they or someone stumbled across by accident.


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## themike (Dec 25, 2011)

Affordable Digital In Ear Monitors! Probably not but it's a good idea.


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## metal_sam14 (Dec 25, 2011)

pod farm 3 with HD models?


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## BlindingLight7 (Dec 25, 2011)

"SEE" would mean something visual, right? maybe a guitar controlled light sampler thing?


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## Deadnightshade (Dec 25, 2011)

Only a few people here seem to understand the part of the announcement that goes a little something like:

*"the most FREAKIN' significant product announcements in the history of the company."*


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## Blasphemer (Dec 25, 2011)

th3m1ke said:


> Affordable Digital In Ear Monitors! Probably not but it's a good idea.



Like I said with the user loadable IRs - probably not the case, but sweet jesus I hope they break into that market...


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## Iamasingularity (Dec 25, 2011)

Hmmm, I know its unlikley but maybe a new series of Bass POD? Something to do with Bass effects processing?


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## Hemi-Powered Drone (Dec 25, 2011)

Something tells me it will be something like the Spyder with a full POD integrated. I'm expecting to be underwhelmed.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 26, 2011)

Why do I think it's going to be something like this:







Regardless, if it's Line 6 we know it'll be affordable, readily available, built pretty solid, and sound pretty good. Line 6 gets a lot of flack, even here, which is odd because some of the most revered members on here cut their teeth on Line 6 gear and made it sound pretty awesome, but I still think dollar for dollar they make some great products. I'd take the cheapest POD over most low end preamps and amps out there.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 26, 2011)

Im just praying that this whole "SEE" hint means more so that the unit, whatever it is, will have its own integrated touch-screen (can you imagine real amps, like the Vetta or Spider having a touchscreen interface for your controls? that'd be kinda cool).. rather than another iphone/ipad product. I don't think Line 6 is as shifty as Digitech is though, to make a huge announcement fuss over a rehashed old unit incorprating the ipad. Line 6 wouldnt do that. If it truely is something using an iphone/ipad, its going to be something completely new, not just the HD500 with an ipad touchscreen like Digitech.

Line 6 truely wants to put out the best products in their market (under $1500) - and I doubt they'd make a huge announcement like this for something crappy. Hell, they didnt make a huge announcement like this for the DT series, which is pretty game-changing itself. This should be something really worth the announcement/waiting til NAMM to release.


----------



## capoeiraesp (Dec 26, 2011)

Apparently it's a wifi wireless unit


----------



## Iamasingularity (Dec 26, 2011)

capoeiraesp said:


> Apparently it's a wifi wireless unit



And your source would be?


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 26, 2011)

someone said they know a friend who works inside L6 and said that is it.. And maybe it is, but we can't be sure yet, its just a rumor. I dont see how that would connect with the "SEE" hint though.. and I doubt they would hype a wifi wireless unit this much.


----------



## capoeiraesp (Dec 26, 2011)

Iamasingularity said:


> And your source would be?



Sorry, should've said that there's been word of it being a wifi wireless unit.


----------



## Iamasingularity (Dec 26, 2011)

capoeiraesp said:


> Sorry, should've said that there's been word of it being a wifi wireless unit.



No problem, nothing serious here. I hope this is not gonna be a apple touch interface product. I would hate to have to buy a new Ipad just for that. Although the idea of a rack processor with touch interface is cool, I think knobs/buttons are more accurate and reliable for dialing tones. Nevertheless I`m interested in what Line6`s got in store thats so groundbreaking.


----------



## TomAwesome (Dec 26, 2011)

If it's a Vetta II reissue for a few hundred bucks, I'll buy one. It won't be, though.



vanhendrix said:


> I like the idea of an axe-alternative. For me, as soon as you go digital you've crossed the line, everything within that realm is just different degrees of supposed 'realism'.



Not necessarily. If all you're going for is realism, then sure, but a lot of the benefit of digital modeling is doing things you can't do on a real amp. I loved my Vetta because I liked it for what it was, not as a realistic modeler. Similarly, while I originally got the Axe-FX because of the combination of realism and convenience, one of my favorite things about it now is how I can tweak the amp sims to my liking to a degree that might not even be possible with a real amp. I think I still prefer Vetta/X3 generation Line 6 modeling to HD modeling, because the X3/Vetta models are more their own sound, and the HD models seem to me more like watered down versions of real amps (not that they sound bad, but I have my Axe-FX for more realistic amp sounds).



vanhendrix said:


> For example, records sound better than CDs because the sampling rate of a digital medium can never perfectly replicated the sinewave of audio. Fair enough, but I'm not going to carry 1000 goddamn records with me when I'm walking down the street with my headphones on. So the companies should focus on _that_ in my opinion.



A lot of people perceive vinyl to sound better because it adds a pleasant warmth to the sound. It's the whole "analog warmth" thing. Digital audio is a cleaner and more accurate representation of the source audio, even with its pixelation. Higher resolution audio would be great, but it's not pushed so much, largely because MP3 audio is the norm, and most people just can't tell much of a difference.


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## loktide (Dec 26, 2011)

nah, they won't reboot the pod HD so soon.

a new flagship amplifier incorporating their HD tech seems the most obvious, imo.


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## ArrowHead (Dec 26, 2011)

Too Many People said:


> a new flagship amplifier, Vetta 3, Some kind of amp, AMP amp, AMP, A new amp, ampity amp.




People need to stop and think here: A company that has put out TONS of modeling amplifiers is not going to claim a new amplifier is *the most revolutionary announcement in the company's history*. Especially after spending all year promoting their Variax+HD500+DT25 as the "ULTIMATE GUITAR RIG". 

This is going to be a new product. NOT a variation on something they've done before. That's my 2 cents.

And keep checking the Line 6 page, folks. No one here seems to have noticed that the message has undergone a "CHANGE".

Visual controller like some have suggested REALLY seems to fit the bill now.


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## vanhendrix (Dec 26, 2011)

capoeiraesp said:


> Apparently it's a wifi wireless unit



That's what their wireless units already do.


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## UnderTheSign (Dec 26, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Regardless, if it's Line 6 we know it'll be affordable, readily available, built pretty solid, and sound pretty good. Line 6 gets a lot of flack, even here, which is odd because some of the most revered members on here cut their teeth on Line 6 gear and made it sound pretty awesome, but I still think dollar for dollar they make some great products. I'd take the cheapest POD over most low end preamps and amps out there.


Same here. I love my POD HD. For the 250 I paid, it beats the shit outta anything you can get for the price.


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## 7slinger (Dec 26, 2011)

Rezamatix on Rig Talk said:


> Line 6 is working in audio over Wifi. My friend works there, telling me about new wireless systems running over wifi, no more RF transmissions.



take this for what it's worth


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## g-zs (Dec 26, 2011)

Maybe they just change site's layout and that's all


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## JPhoenix19 (Dec 26, 2011)

7slinger said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rezamatix on Rig Talk*
> _Line 6 is working in audio over Wifi. My friend works there, telling me about new wireless systems running over wifi, no more RF transmissions.
> _
> ...




Wait... what? Last I checked, WiFi uses RF's- just a different frequency band.


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## Spinedriver (Dec 26, 2011)

Somehow I can't see a slight advancement in a wireless transmitter as being 'revolutionary'.


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## HighGain510 (Dec 26, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> I doubt it'll be anything in the modelling world though, *as they said its going to be revolutionary.*



Line 6 says (and apparently must truly believe...) that EVERYTHING they do is revolutionary.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 26, 2011)

HighGain510 said:


> Line 6 says (and apparently must truly believe...) that EVERYTHING they do is revolutionary.



Where do they say that on every product released?? Or is that just your perception because you want to hate on them?

Infact, they wern't even the ones who said this product would be revolutionary themselves; its the media outlets saying that.

If you don't have anything worth mentioning on topic without being a line 6 basher, please take your comments to another thread.


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## ArrowHead (Dec 26, 2011)

Spinedriver said:


> Somehow I can't see a slight advancement in a wireless transmitter as being 'revolutionary'.



What if we follow the idea further. Say it's a touchscreen visually interfaced patchbay with built in Wifi that will interact wirelessly with a whole future slew of line 6 pedals, effects, interfaces, variax guitars, and DT Amps? And everything connected to a single wireless central hub where you can visually adjust or control any parameter on any piece of gear in the chain?


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## flint757 (Dec 26, 2011)

ArrowHead said:


> What if we follow the idea further. Say it's a touchscreen visually interfaced patchbay with built in Wifi that will interact wirelessly with a whole future slew of line 6 pedals, effects, interfaces, variax guitars, and DT Amps? And everything connected to a single wireless central hub where you can visually adjust or control any parameter on any piece of gear in the chain?



That would be epic. If you could use some sort of switcher to make even non line 6 pedals in the chain that would be even more epic. It would certainly make programming things easier.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 27, 2011)

HighGain510 said:


> Line 6 says (and apparently must truly believe...) that EVERYTHING they do is revolutionary.



Look at their track record, most of their big releases _are_ revolutionary. 

Cheap, quality digital amp modeling, affordable digital wireless, digital guitar modeling, high end, solid state modeling amps, computer based amp and effect simulation, hybrid modeling and tube amps, combination interface and emulation, etc. The list goes on. They might not have invented a lot of that, but they sure helped to get it to more guitarists than anyone before them.


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## xCaptainx (Dec 27, 2011)

why does everyone think it's a new wireless? they already have introduced a new digital wifi wireless! the G30/50/90! that was a year ago! 

Personally I don't think it's a guitar/amp at all. I think it's going to be something they havent done before. Possibly software based. Maybe focusing more on drums, or vocals?


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## HighGain510 (Dec 27, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Where do they say that on every product released?? Or is that just your perception because you want to hate on them?
> 
> Infact, they wern't even the ones who said this product would be revolutionary themselves; its the media outlets saying that.
> 
> If you don't have anything worth mentioning on topic without being a line 6 basher, please take your comments to another thread.



Sure thing chief, and since you're a moderator I'll go right ahead and do that. Oh wait. 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Look at their track record, most of their big releases _are_ revolutionary.
> 
> Cheap, quality digital amp modeling, affordable digital wireless, digital guitar modeling, high end, solid state modeling amps, computer based amp and effect simulation, hybrid modeling and tube amps, combination interface and emulation, etc. The list goes on. They might not have invented a lot of that, but they sure helped to get it to more guitarists than anyone before them.



I've never said their products are crap, however with the amount of recycling they do and marketing to hype something up as THE NEXT BIG THING!!!! ZOMG! when it turns out to be more regurgitated technology is a constant trend with Line 6. I'm not bashing them, I'm just saying I'd prefer to see what it is before I go shouting their praises.  I realize they HAVE put out some very nice tech in the past, the problem is that they have rested on their laurels forever and most of their "new" technology is just more of the same stuff they have already put out.  They already have a line of wireless tech (which I like) so if it's just a tweak to that, I'm not freaking out and lining up to hand them money is all I'm saying.


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## petereanima (Dec 27, 2011)

8-string Variax with Bulb-POD-preset sounds, in HD. The "Djentiax".







metal_sam14 said:


> pod farm 3 with HD models?



While I dont think this will be it, I still say: in satan's name PLEASE! Do want. 



I have no idea what it will be, but I am tempted to believe L6 when they announce something as "reviolutionary"..they brought out revolutionary products before, and while I didnt enjoy or even care for every single one of it - I approve of almost everything they released.

And btw - the whole PODvs.AXEFX thing is starting to get ridiculous. Owning both, I say that no one here would hear the difference between those 2 on the final product of a produced record. :trollface:


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## xCaptainx (Dec 27, 2011)

It could be a 7 string variax? I'd love one!


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## shanejohnson02 (Dec 27, 2011)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Why do I think it's going to be something like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's just fashionable. Line 6 doesn't use "real" amps, so it can't "sound" real, or so common sense would follow. In reality, the audience usually can't tell the difference. I've been experimenting with using my HD 500 for channel switching and effects, and it works wonderfully.


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## Deadnightshade (Dec 27, 2011)

Generally I think that most of their products are well-thought in terms of not being gimmicky.Maybe more like opting for them to work together,which is smart on their behalf,as they have their main products and the supplementary ones that compliment their best sellers. 


UNLIKE that ridiculous iPad digitech pedalboard Max posted.Sorry,but I don't own an iPad and even if i did,i wouldn't put in under my feet in any case.Come on we're asking for sturdy metallic cases and digitech proceeds to put a fetish expensive piece of fragile equipment on a freakin' pedalboard?Just my two cents...








petereanima said:


> And btw - the whole PODvs.AXEFX thing is starting to get ridiculous. Owning both, I say that no one here would hear the difference between those 2 on the final product of a produced record. :trollface:





Side by side in the same song,you definitely can...Comparing two different bands with the one using axe-fx and the other pod hd , most likely not..

What people don't understand is that the axe-fx like controls that were released in the 1.31 pod HD firmware bring the two units closer than ever,but only a few seem to use them to their full potential,thus the corksniffery that we experienced some pages before.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 27, 2011)

I so want to respond to the trolls, but its pointless. Reminds me of talking to Apple fanboys who buy a Macbook Pro JUST to surf youtube, thinking they'll never crash or get a virus lol  

in RELATED news; the Line 6 website updated to "See. Change. 1.19.12" - interesting.. Maybe we'll get more hints within the next couple of days before NAMM.


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## JPhoenix19 (Dec 27, 2011)

petereanima said:


> And btw - the whole PODvs.AXEFX thing is starting to get ridiculous





It's a good day to be a PC rig user.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 27, 2011)

JPhoenix19 said:


> It's a good day to be a PC rig user.



I agree.. Can't wait til that pedal that you can load VST's into is released (SM audio I believe?) - Especially if the Pod HD is made into software. Definitely will have to look into that if it ever comes out.


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## JPhoenix19 (Dec 27, 2011)

To bring it back on topic:

Although I doubt that this is it, if Line 6 comes out with something iPod/iPad related like MaxOfMetal said I'm going to punch someone in the throat. I'm still waiting for the Android platform to catch up in the mobile amp modeling market, if it will ever happen at all. Someday I may actually have to break down a buy a damn iPad.

Now as was said earlier, some of the implications of WiFi over audio could be interesting. For instance: using my laptop's WiFi NIC as an interface between my guitar, amp modeling software, and amplifier/speakers is a cool idea assuming they had a way of minimizing the latency.

All this talk of Line 6 reminds me that I still have yet to try their PODfarm software. Time to see if they have a demo version.


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## ArrowHead (Dec 27, 2011)

HighGain510 said:


> I realize they HAVE put out some very nice tech in the past, the problem is that they have rested on their laurels forever *and most of their "new" technology is just more of the same stuff they have already put out.*



Have you tried the HD modelers or the DT amps? I'm guessing it's "no", or "I played one for ten seconds in a store/at a friend's"

Yes, I agree. Line 6 rested on their laurels for about 10 years, regurgitating and re-packaging the same modeling tech, sounds, and hardware over and over. I won't deny that at all. 

However, the HD series is something NEW. I've been a line 6 user for way over 10 years now, and NOTHING that came before it is the same as the HD. It's the first modeling product that isn't a re-hash. Same with the DT amps. Same with their wireless lineup. Granted, the new Variax COULD be considered a re-hash, but the reality is that the originals were crappy unplayable axes often, and it NEEDED the re-boot.

But hey, 3 years ago I would actually agree with most everything you've said. You just need to catch up to their current gear, I'm guessing.


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## Hemi-Powered Drone (Dec 27, 2011)

capoeiraesp said:


> Apparently it's a wifi wireless unit



But that would be terrible in many places that have heavy network traffic. Plus someone could fuck with the network if it's at a concert or something. I doubt Line 6 is at a Gibson level of failure.


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## USMarine75 (Dec 27, 2011)

I'll still A/B my Vetta II head with anything on the market... IMO may not be _better_ but it certainly holds its own. I love the hybrid direction their going by adding tubes to the modeling.

And the JTV89 Variax shreds... just wish they had a trem option on that model.

Also, love my Line6-made Bogner Alchemist.

So... a Vetta III with multiple tube options would be perfect for me...

Line 6 test: 

Variax JTV-89: 

Alchemist: 

Vetta II HD:


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## Iamasingularity (Dec 27, 2011)

Hmm Vetta III. Would blow the sharks out the water. Also it reminds me, Is a used Vetta II Head for 500$ a good deal?


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## Shask (Dec 27, 2011)

Deadnightshade said:


> What people don't understand is that the axe-fx like controls that were released in the 1.31 pod HD firmware bring the two units closer than ever,but only a few seem to use them to their full potential,thus the corksniffery that we experienced some pages before.



Interesting. What would you recommend to "use them to their full potential" ?


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 27, 2011)

Yea if they could do a Vetta III with Bogner tube power section, switching like the DT series, and somehow get it in a 2U rack space, or even a small combo like the DT25 is (25W is fine) - I'd be pumped. I kinda want to pick up a DT25 already but eh waiting to see what NAMM brings from multiple companies first.


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## USMarine75 (Dec 27, 2011)

Iamasingularity said:


> Hmm Vetta III. Would blow the sharks out the water. Also it reminds me, Is a used Vetta II Head for 500$ a good deal?


 
Extremely... new they were $1700. I got mine for 1200 and thought that was a steal. But, only concern is that it works properly. I have read posts in other forums about lots of bitching trying to get them fixed. I have no experience with their customer service so I don't have an opinion on it. So again my concern is that a Vetta isn't something you can fix yourself or have a local repair shop fix (e.g. no simple tube replacement). I'd be concerned with something like that and no warranty. But, hell.... for that price it's probably worth it anyways. Test drive it first if you can. And if it comes with an FBV (short or long) pedal than hell yeah its a great deal.

And make sure you update firmware to 2.5... you get 80 total amps (instead of original 60?) plus other cabs/mics/etc upgrades.

(Just do NOT play it through a Line6 cab they are trash and will make the Vetta (or anything) sound like piss.)


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## Iamasingularity (Dec 27, 2011)

USMarine75 said:


> Extremely... new they were $1700. I got mine for 1200 and thought that was a steal. But, only concern is that it works properly. I have read posts in other forums about lots of bitching trying to get them fixed. I have no experience with their customer service so I don't have an opinion on it. So again my concern is that a Vetta isn't something you can fix yourself or have a local repair shop fix (e.g. no simple tube replacement). I'd be concerned with something like that and no warranty. But, hell.... for that price it's probably worth it anyways. Test drive it first if you can. And if it comes with an FBV (short or long) pedal than hell yeah its a great deal.
> 
> And make sure you update firmware to 2.5... you get 80 total amps (instead of original 60?) plus other cabs/mics/etc upgrades.
> 
> (Just do NOT play it through a Line6 cab they are trash and will make the Vetta (or anything) sound like piss.)


 
Yeah, I`ll try it out. It doesn`t come with a FBV, but I can pick the short one up for a 20 bucks. 80 amps and other stuff? Sounds great! I heard Line 6 cabs are poop. Might look for a Vetta cab then.


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## 7slinger (Dec 27, 2011)

7slinger said:


> take this for what it's worth





JPhoenix19 said:


> Wait... what? Last I checked, WiFi uses RF's- just a different frequency band.





I don't know anything about any of it, just reposted what I saw


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## Spinedriver (Dec 27, 2011)

If I'm not mistaken, Digitech was fairly excited when they were announcing the new iPad interface.

Since the HD just came out, the Spider Valve series are just that, I'm thinking that there's a decent chance the 'big unveil' is going to be a re-vamped Vetta with perhaps a small touch screen interface (say, smartphone sized). You have to admit it would be innovative and the first of it's kind.


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## JamesM (Dec 27, 2011)

I'm gonna go ahead and guess Spider V.


Or if they wanted to be really stupid, it will be eye-tracking effects or something wacky. "See" is in red.

EDIT:
Another guess, Line6's take on the Kemper amplifier.


----------



## shawngs (Dec 28, 2011)

Everything I'm about to say is pure speculation and my own personal opinion.... I could be right and I could be waaaay off base. I guess I'll find out when everyone does on 1/19.

Line 6 recently updated their Pod HD 500/Pro software to version 1.4 which includes a host of new MIDI options so this seems to point to what they may be doing. I'm thinking it may be a higher end MIDI foot controller. One that can be used on any MIDI gear and is not made, necessarily, to specifically interact with only other Line 6 equipment. It will, of course have easy and full integration with Line 6 gear but the main goal for L6 will be to have it become THE industry standard for a MIDI pedal board. In my opinion it will be similar in size/features as the Fractal MFC-101. This would allow it, on a larger pedalboard like the Pedaltrain Pro, to sit right beside their M13 or beside other misc pedals. I'm hoping, if I am right, that they will also come out with expansion options for it as well...

The 'See' part of their 'See. Change. 1.19.12' campaign implies that it will be very visually stimulating or provide visual feedback. The 'Change' part implies that it can be used to change things (settings?) or will be a game changer. It could also represent a change in the way that L6 is doing things or a change in their direction.

My second guess would be an iPhone/iPad product of some sort.

Full disclosure: I know that Line 6 is a company that everyone loves to hate. I've been a fan and have used their products ever since the Axsys 212. No, I do not work for Line 6 and I do not know anyone that works for Line 6. I'm just a technology geek.


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## SnowfaLL (Dec 28, 2011)

shawngs said:


> Everything I'm about to say is pure speculation and my own personal opinion.... I could be right and I could be waaaay off base. I guess I'll find out when everyone does on 1/19.
> 
> Line 6 recently updated their Pod HD 500/Pro software to version 1.4 which includes a host of new MIDI options so this seems to point to what they may be doing. I'm thinking it may be a higher end MIDI foot controller. One that can be used on any MIDI gear and is not made, necessarily, to specifically interact with only other Line 6 equipment. It will, of course have easy and full integration with Line 6 gear but the main goal for L6 will be to have it become THE industry standard for a MIDI pedal board. In my opinion it will be similar in size/features as the Fractal MFC-101. This would allow it, on a larger pedalboard like the Pedaltrain Pro, to sit right beside their M13 or beside other misc pedals. I'm hoping, if I am right, that they will also come out with expansion options for it as well...



I'd be quite happy with that, as long as it was small enough to fit in my plans (or have multiple versions of it, some with fewer switches) - as I was planning on rigging up a small tube amp like the VHT 12/20 or Fender blues jr (fx loop mod) with a HD Desktop in a small box for a portable practice amp, but really hate the fact the HD desktop only works with the old FBVs, no MIDI pedals. If something comes out utilizing the FBV/L6 Link and MIDI, that'd be pretty awesome.

Doubt thats what the announcement is, although since they said "Announcements" we could see a new FBV/MIDI controller along with an amp or something.


----------



## petereanima (Dec 28, 2011)

shawngs said:


> Line 6 recently updated their Pod HD 500/Pro software to version 1.4 which includes a host of new MIDI options so this seems to point to what they may be doing. I'm thinking it may be a higher end MIDI foot controller. One that can be used on any MIDI gear and is not made, necessarily, to specifically interact with only other Line 6 equipment. It will, of course have easy and full integration with Line 6 gear but the main goal for L6 will be to have it become THE industry standard for a MIDI pedal board. In my opinion it will be similar in size/features as the Fractal MFC-101. This would allow it, on a larger pedalboard like the Pedaltrain Pro, to sit right beside their M13 or beside other misc pedals. I'm hoping, if I am right, that they will also come out with expansion options for it as well...



+



NickCormier said:


> If something comes out utilizing the FBV/L6 Link and MIDI, that'd be pretty awesome.
> .






FWIW: some guys on a german guitar-forum, are currently developping a small adapter for the Line6 shortboard, so it can be used with the Axe FX, doing everything the MFC-101 does...Beta-tests are all positive..(check HERE for some info) - so this WILL see the light of day in the near future anyway. (because when it works with the Axe, it will work with most other stuff also)


----------



## SnowfaLL (Dec 28, 2011)

petereanima said:


> +
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yea I actually just saw that tonight, may look into it. I love the Shortboard FBV Mark II cause it has the same number of switches as the X3L (what i've been gigging with for the past 4 years) yet it is about 5 inches smaller, so it saves much needed space on stage. Not to mention, the FBV can actually fit in a rack for transporting if you have 2U empty, which is pretty awesome.

The other midi controllers like the MFC-101 and GCP, are just way too massive in size for my ideal rig. Not to mention costing 4-5 times the amount the FBV would. And I dig the Line 6 volume/wah controller so you wouldnt have to buy a mission or etc. The other midi controller I was looking at and will probably pick up is the PEAK FCB8N but then I need a volume/wah controller too, so the FBV if that box is designed would compete against that.


----------



## djinn314 (Dec 28, 2011)

NickCormier said:


> Yea I actually just saw that tonight, may look into it. I love the Shortboard FBV Mark II cause it has the same number of switches as the X3L (what i've been gigging with for the past 4 years) yet it is about 5 inches smaller, so it saves much needed space on stage. Not to mention, the FBV can actually fit in a rack for transporting if you have 2U empty, which is pretty awesome.
> 
> The other midi controllers like the MFC-101 and GCP, are just way too massive in size for my ideal rig. Not to mention costing 4-5 times the amount the FBV would. And I dig the Line 6 volume/wah controller so you wouldnt have to buy a mission or etc. The other midi controller I was looking at and will probably pick up is the PEAK FCB8N but then I need a volume/wah controller too, so the FBV if that box is designed would compete against that.



I always thought about getting the behringer midi controller for the two expression pedals. I thought it wasn't too badly priced either. Is there a reason why the FBV is better? I'm also curious how long the cords are for it?


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## Iamasingularity (Jan 10, 2012)

Line 6 - Mobile Keys


----------



## bmth4111 (Jan 10, 2012)

Iamasingularity said:


> Line 6 - Mobile Keys


Is that really line 6s new product... If so im to dissapointed.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 10, 2012)

Iamasingularity said:


> Line 6 - Mobile Keys



There is no reference to "SEE" at all in there. I highly doubt that's what all the fuss is about.


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## XEN (Jan 10, 2012)

As non-revolutionary as these things may be I already started GASing for the 49 key version. My ipad IS my rig right now.
I stay broke! </hawaiian>


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## Cancer (Jan 10, 2012)

Just putting this out there: I don't think there's alot of Line 6 hate. Speaking for myself, my only issue with them has been with recent Pod developments. The rest of their product line kicks insane amounts of ass.


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## celticelk (Jan 10, 2012)

bmth4111 said:


> Is that really line 6s new product... If so im to dissapointed.



It's their new product at CES. They'll have something else at NAMM.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 10, 2012)

Our local Line 6 rep (I'm a local line 6 endorsee) says NO ONE in the industry knows. He's off to NAMM soon and then to Line 6 straight after for what he believes is training/overview of the new product. 

So anyones guess is as good as those in the know right now, haha.


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## Blood Ghost (Jan 10, 2012)

So basically, what we're all hoping for is an all tube amplifier available in stack, combo and rack format, with any tubes of your choice. Even tube rectification. It will have digital amp and effects processing and the ability to sound like every amp ever made. EVER. They'll make a looper which has infinite tracks, so that erases the need for a band. They will release a wireless mic and guitar system that has no loss whatsoever and pretty much sounds like you're using a ten foot cable. It never shorts out. They'll release an in-ear monitoring system which has it's own rack mixer unit if you still do the band thing, and the same quality from their wireless guitar and mic range. Oh yeah, each will have infinite MIDI capability that you control with your thoughts. The essence of God will be included in each device, and will be available in a bundle for roughly $600.

Sound about right? Let's keep our fingers crossed.


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## celticelk (Jan 10, 2012)

Blood Ghost said:


> So basically, what we're all hoping for is an all tube amplifier available in stack, combo and rack format, with any tubes of your choice. Even tube rectification. It will have digital amp and effects processing and the ability to sound like every amp ever made. EVER. They'll make a looper which has infinite tracks, so that erases the need for a band. They will release a wireless mic and guitar system that has no loss whatsoever and pretty much sounds like you're using a ten foot cable. It never shorts out. They'll release an in-ear monitoring system which has it's own rack mixer unit if you still do the band thing, and the same quality from their wireless guitar and mic range. Oh yeah, each will have infinite MIDI capability that you control with your thoughts. The essence of God will be included in each device, and will be available in a bundle for roughly $600.
> 
> Sound about right? Let's keep our fingers crossed.



Drop it to $399 and I'll consider it. I wouldn't pay more for this thing than an iPad.


----------



## HighGain510 (Jan 10, 2012)

MaxOfMetal said:


> There is no reference to "SEE" at all in there. I highly doubt that's what all the fuss is about.



Yeah it isn't, the announcement is supposed to drop at NAMM. This was announced at CES this morning.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/01/10/line-6-throws-more-midi-love-at-idevices-intros-mobile-keys-key/


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## Stealthdjentstic (Jan 10, 2012)

Well that was dissapointing


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 10, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Well that was dissapointing



What's disappointing is some users inability to read.


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## themike (Jan 10, 2012)

Hey, if I owned an iPad that Mobile Keys thing would be kinda cool. I had KB37(?) when they first introduced it and it was cool to have the interface, POD Farm and a midi controller all in one. 

As far as everyone else saying that it's a midi controller non-exclusive to Line6 products that would be amazing, as well as insanley smart on their part. I've owned several line 6 floorboards, and floor based POD units and have had not 1 single complaint about their construction. I even used a POD XT Live as a channel changer for my old Engl. I think they could do VERY well if they made it highly customizable, including options and modes for all the possible products and uses we could get out it!


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## Iamasingularity (Jan 11, 2012)

Sorry if I dissapointed anyone, I just posted that because I knew the guys at Line6 would make an ipad interfaced rig. I just thought I should share it with the people here.


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## Leuchty (Jan 11, 2012)

Maybe a Digital Modelling Power Amp.

Switch between 6L6's, EL34's, KTxx, etc characteristics.


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## jordanky (Jan 11, 2012)

CYBERSYN said:


> Maybe a Digital Modelling Power Amp.
> 
> Switch between 6L6's, EL34's, KTxx, etc characteristics.



That would be a cool idea! Our Line 6 rep mentioned this 'announcement' a few months back actually but he himself didn't even know what it was yet. I've pestered him since then but they must be good at keeping quiet in a big way. The time is drawing closer though!


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## flint757 (Jan 11, 2012)

If they are trying this hard to keep it a secret then it has to be pretty damn good.


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## ZEBOV (Jan 11, 2012)

Last time I witnessed a musical instrument company release something "revolutionary", many asked if it was a joke, and learned that it wasnt. We (the entire community of musicians) were just totally floored and even offended at the sheer stupidity of it. That was Gibson and the Firebird X. Hundreds of people posted on Gibson's website that they were switching to PRS because of the Firebird X. Me personally, I hadn't been that shocked since 9/11/2001. No joke. 
I doubt Line 6 will be that stupid, but I still find myself bracing for it.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 11, 2012)

I doubt it's going to be a midi foot controller, or a poweramp or anything. 

Bear in mind this is line 6, they are mass market and creating such a specific product catering to a, lets be honest, smaller market than the spider amp loving general public wouldnt really be as 'revolutionary' as the pod was when that was announced. Again, the spider amp was THE most sold amp in 2010. HUGE numbers. That's the market size they are going for. Midi foot controllers would be a pitiful amount compared to a new pod or general market product. 

NO idea what this is going to be. Maybe a Podfarm HD? Or new variax? who knows. I guess we'll find out at NAMM!


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 11, 2012)

Word on the street is it is a digital mixer and speaker of some sort. Maybe a FRFR system for their HD500, may be wireless connection between it and the mixer too. 

Name is "Stagescape" and "Stagesource", as registered trademarks under Line 6 was recorded for those two recently - Trademarks of Line 6, Inc. (45 trademarks)


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## xCaptainx (Jan 11, 2012)

awesome find, thanks man!


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## Spinedriver (Jan 11, 2012)

I can't remember where I read it but someone had suggested that perhaps they might be releasing a cab with FR speakers that would have built in cab emulation much like a Variax. In this case though, it would emulate a 'British 4x12' or 'Treadplate 4x12', etc... I gotta admit, if they can pull it off, it would add a whole new dimension of versatility to a person's rig.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 11, 2012)

that was me a few pages back. Pure speculation and a huge stab at the dark. 

I'm thinking now perhaps it wont even be guitar related at all. Possibly P.A or live sound orientated.


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## bhakan (Jan 11, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> I can't remember where I read it but someone had suggested that perhaps they might be releasing a cab with FR speakers that would have built in cab emulation much like a Variax. In this case though, it would emulate a 'British 4x12' or 'Treadplate 4x12', etc... I gotta admit, if they can pull it off, it would add a whole new dimension of versatility to a person's rig.


I would love FRFR speakers where you could load your own IR's, or a small box that could load them (not like this is happening)


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 11, 2012)

on that trademark site, theres also a product called the Digitech "iStomp" - along with empty pages on digitech's website for it.. Sounds like Digitech is introducing some kinda pedal that can load in effects as if it was an App.. along with a "iStomp Store" so maybe you can purchase what effect/amp model/etc you can put into the pedal..

Goggle "Digitech iStomp" and look at the tailings...

NAMM will be interesting I guess.


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## flint757 (Jan 11, 2012)

NickCormier said:


> on that trademark site, theres also a product called the Digitech "iStomp" - along with empty pages on digitech's website for it.. Sounds like Digitech is introducing some kinda pedal that can load in effects as if it was an App.. along with a "iStomp Store" so maybe you can purchase what effect/amp model/etc you can put into the pedal..
> 
> Goggle "Digitech iStomp" and look at the tailings...
> 
> NAMM will be interesting I guess.



Souds like there just extending from there ipad modeller thing they already have.

Why on earth would anyone want to have a $600 computer where the foot is going to be stomping.


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## celticelk (Jan 11, 2012)

NickCormier said:


> on that trademark site, theres also a product called the Digitech "iStomp" - along with empty pages on digitech's website for it.. Sounds like Digitech is introducing some kinda pedal that can load in effects as if it was an App.. along with a "iStomp Store" so maybe you can purchase what effect/amp model/etc you can put into the pedal..
> 
> Goggle "Digitech iStomp" and look at the tailings...
> 
> NAMM will be interesting I guess.



Something like TC's TonePrints pedals, maybe?


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 11, 2012)

thats what it sounds like. guess we'll see at NAMM. Im hoping this Digitech iStomp thing is their successor to the GSP/RP line; with updated amp sims. Im stuck with just the RP250 right now and man.. does it suck lol esp after going from the HD500 back to digitech =/


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## Iamasingularity (Jan 12, 2012)

NickCormier said:


> thats what it sounds like. guess we'll see at NAMM. Im hoping this Digitech iStomp thing is their successor to the GSP/RP line; with updated amp sims. Im stuck with just the RP250 right now and man.. does it suck lol esp after going from the HD500 back to digitech =/



Why did you go from the HD500 back to the digitech???


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 12, 2012)

Iamasingularity said:


> Why did you go from the HD500 back to the digitech???



I eventually plan on upgrading to the Axe-FX standard but since im joining the military next week I will be gone for 8 months and don't need any gear, so no point buying anything right now... thought I could survive the last 2 months with the RP250 but man is it even uninspiring and makes me almost not even want to play guitar =[ Oh well.


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## Iamasingularity (Jan 12, 2012)

NickCormier said:


> I eventually plan on upgrading to the Axe-FX standard but since im joining the military next week I will be gone for 8 months and don't need any gear, so no point buying anything right now... thought I could survive the last 2 months with the RP250 but man is it even uninspiring and makes me almost not even want to play guitar =[ Oh well.



Oh, thank kinda does suck. Aren`t you gonna take some gear with you? I`ve seen many take a guitar and a micro amp to where they`ve been stationed/camping. Not playing for that long, will diminish your skills dude.


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## technomancer (Jan 13, 2012)

Let's try to keep this remotely on topic


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## xCaptainx (Jan 13, 2012)

If it's a FRFR system, or powered monitor of some sort, I'm going to get one. I've been toying with the idea of selling my cab (blackstar artisan) and going mackie or QSC K10 for some time now and this would push me into doing that, especially if it connects wirelessly or via the Line 6 link. 

My cabinet just sits at practise room and I use backline cabs most of the time. If I can't take a powered monitor, I'll have the Matrix GT800FX poweramp to take with me. REALLY REALLY hope it's powered cabs now, I have GAS for a product that doesn't even exist yet hahaha!


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## HeavyMetal4Ever (Jan 14, 2012)

I heard they were moving into complete band modelling. Tweak a few knobs and out comes a generic metalcore breakdown, tweak some others and you get some smooth jazz...many will like the music but others will claim it's just too digital and another sign of the coming 2012 apocalypse.

Rock on!


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## Spinedriver (Jan 14, 2012)

HeavyMetal4Ever said:


> I heard they were moving into complete band modelling. Tweak a few knobs and out comes a generic metalcore breakdown, tweak some others and you get some smooth jazz...many will like the music but others will claim it's just too digital and another sign of the coming 2012 apocalypse.
> 
> Rock on!



Just like Guitar Hero.... but FOR REALZ !!!!!!!


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## djinn314 (Jan 17, 2012)

If it's what you guys are talking about I'm gonna have to trade and sell some fucking gear. I'm dying to get rid of my half stack (I simply can't find a band around here so it's losing it's value to me) I was about to buy the HD Pro and run it into that Tech 21 Power Engine but I think I can wait two days...I think


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## Shask (Jan 17, 2012)

2 more days... it feels like everyone is waiting for this!


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## guy in latvia (Jan 18, 2012)

^ hell yea, im anxious to see what theyve come up with, ive always been a fan of line 6, even tho i dont own any of their gear anymore...


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## nangillala (Jan 18, 2012)

Some kind of active monitor/FRFR solution/whatever would be really interesting. They could sell them to people that use Line6 stuff as well as people using the Axe Fx, Digitech and whatnot. Would be interesting to see what innovations they've come up with. Let's wait one more day


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## DC23 (Jan 18, 2012)

I'm always up for anything interesting to go along with my axe...anxiously waiting! Although the 'see' comment does feel like the new product will ave a big visual component, so we'll see!


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## Sepultorture (Jan 18, 2012)

Fuck NAMM Tomorrow man, Gunna SEE what this bitch is fianlly and see all the tasty pic porn flying in, can't effing wait to see all the new toys, this is indeed the musicians christmas \m/


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## DC23 (Jan 18, 2012)

Sepultorture said:


> can't effing wait to see all the new toys, this is indeed the musicians christmas \m/



Definitely second this. I can't wait! Get to see what I am going to spend all year saving for hahaha


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 18, 2012)

well now that the Boss GT-100 (newest version of the GT-10) is announced, and Digitech apparently has something coming.. It'll be interesting to see.

I just want something smaller like the TC Nova system, with high quality amp sims included. I know it'll never happen but any company that can give me that, I'll get it for sure. If Line6 made a "mini" HD500 version, with only 8 buttons and no expression pedal. That'd be sweet.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 18, 2012)

It should be interesting to see what they come up with... Although I must say that the little "COSM" logo on the top of the GT doesn't instill much confidence.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 18, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> It should be interesting to see what they come up with... Although I must say that the little "COSM" logo on the top of the GT doesn't instill much confidence.



They claim that it was completely redone, so I hope it sounds better.


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## GunpointMetal (Jan 18, 2012)

if they're still calling it COSM I bet they just added some general filter EQ to try and squelch the cocked wah sound and called it new COSM. Plus, that thing is fugly as hell.....I'd stick with the HD500 even if the GT-100 did sound better just cause it looks like a rack from the eighties puked near a volume pedal.


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## Spiff (Jan 19, 2012)

I'm so happy I decided to wait with buying a multi-fx until NAMM, hopefully there will be new units just like the GT-100 being announced within hours, weeh!

Slightly off-topic: Are there any good sources of announcements and info from NAMM2012 short of trolling various forums, live blogs and such?


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## SnowfaLL (Jan 19, 2012)

Spiff said:


> I'm so happy I decided to wait with buying a multi-fx until NAMM, hopefully there will be new units just like the GT-100 being announced within hours, weeh!
> 
> Slightly off-topic: Are there any good sources of announcements and info from NAMM2012 short of trolling various forums, live blogs and such?



Not really.. thats how I get 99% of my info; google searching hardcore, and other forums that break news way faster than here lol

speakin of which. Sounds like this announcement was the PA/stage gear stuff I mentioned a long time ago, hinted from that trademark register website

Some kinda FRFR monitor for the HD500/etc?? and a digital Mixer, maybe with effects onboard, wireless signal, hmmhmm? Guess we'll find out for sure in afew hours.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

It's on their website now!


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## loktide (Jan 19, 2012)

meh


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

Putting this out there now, am 100% certain I'll buy an L3t. I've been thinking about using a powered monitor with the HD500 and having a line 6 branded one makes sense, especially with all the nifty features the L3t has. 

Watch this space! I'm going to put my order in as soon as NZ's line 6 rep gets back from NAMM hahah.


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## matisq (Jan 19, 2012)

line6.com is now updated with info about new products


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## guy in latvia (Jan 19, 2012)

ugh...goddamn website is constantly crashing/under maintenance...

edit: now that ive had a look, gotta say, great idea! the mixing system seems like a real step up! props to line6!


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## TomAwesome (Jan 19, 2012)

All right, so... Line 6 PA gear? Not too mindblowing.


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## Ishan (Jan 19, 2012)

This is revolutionary boring


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

The digital mixer is pretty awesome/new. Also the more I read about the L3T, the more siked I am on it. It's going to be awesome with the HD500.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

The thing about the monitors is that they're 1,400 watts ... just slightly overpowered for using with a Pod or modeler either at home or on a stage.

I agree, it was a great big build up and *fizz*. That announcement, unless you're a club owner or do a lot of live sound, was a dud.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

well yeah it's obviously aimed at people who need p.a equipment. 

And about the watts, really? The most popular (from what I can tell on forums) powered monitors for gigging guitarists would be the Mackie 1521 (1600w) or 1531 (1800w) for Fractal. A line 6 l3T @ 1400w seems like a good (and probably cheaper) alternative to that.


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## Romeg (Jan 19, 2012)

Tam-param-pam!
*Free v2.0 Firmware Update For POD® HD Multi-effect News
Where is peavey 5150, soldano, or other cool stuff?????????
*


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## ShadyDavey (Jan 19, 2012)

I suspect the P.A applications whilst valid, aren't the main thrust of it's intent. That said I also think it's going to sound great with _any_ modeller currently enjoying some popularity. 

Waiting for demos.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

xCaptainx said:


> well yeah it's obviously aimed at people who need p.a equipment.
> 
> And about the watts, really? The most popular (from what I can tell on forums) powered monitors for gigging guitarists would be the Mackie 1521 (1600w) or 1531 (1800w) for Fractal. A line 6 l3T @ 1400w seems like a good (and probably cheaper) alternative to that.



Really ?? I would think that anything above 500-600 watts would be too hard to get a decent level without blowing the rest of the band off the stage. Just by doing the math, if you turn it up to '2' (out of 10) you'd be using roughly 280 watts which is a hell of a lot. Granted you can adjust the output of the modeler to bring the volume down but it just seems that unless you're playing an arena or something, a speaker with that much power would be too hard to control at a low setting.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

I guess I'll have to review when I get one, hehe.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

Romeg said:


> Tam-param-pam!
> *Free v2.0 Firmware Update For POD® HD Multi-effect News
> Where is peavey 5150, soldano, or other cool stuff?????????
> *



Apparently the 2 new models are of an Ampeg 'Flip Top' bass amp and a Marshal plexi. Seems that the new Pod is definitely NOT geared towards metal players. At least the XT had a Metal Shop pack within the first 6 months or so.

Also, it looks like Digitech's big announcement is the "iStomp". A single pedal that can be loaded with any 1 effect at the same time. The downside is that apparently you have to have an iPad or iPhone in order to load it. :\

http://digitech.com/en-US/products/istomp


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

I use my HD500 with a matrix GT800FX poweramp. The current range of amps do 'metal' VERY well, especially the dual rect and engl setups (the engl being my favourite at the moment) 

More stoked on the bass option than another 'metal' amp option.


----------



## Isan (Jan 19, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> Really ?? I would think that anything above 500-600 watts would be too hard to get a decent level without blowing the rest of the band off the stage. Just by doing the math, if you turn it up to '2' (out of 10) you'd be using roughly 280 watts which is a hell of a lot. Granted you can adjust the output of the modeler to bring the volume down but it just seems that unless you're playing an arena or something, a speaker with that much power would be too hard to control at a low setting.



1 word ... HEADROOM!


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## Rook (Jan 19, 2012)

^Exactly, particularly in the low end. low cleans will be very clear and punchy, and more headroom is more accuracy.

Just reading about the L3s and L3t - Line6 brings FRFR to the masses! I think they look really cool!


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## Lorcan Ward (Jan 19, 2012)

Romeg said:


> Tam-param-pam!
> *Free v2.0 Firmware Update For POD® HD Multi-effect News
> Where is peavey 5150, soldano, or other cool stuff?????????
> *



Still no IR loader


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## HighGain510 (Jan 19, 2012)

Darn, I was hoping to see something new in the modeling arena from Line 6 but it is still probably too close to the release of the POD HD for them to be releasing anything that big. The speakers and mixer look very cool, I'll be interested to see some of the reviews and the pricepoints of these items, probably not super useful for me personally but I can see the market they are appealing to and if the prices are right they could sell a lot of those!  The L3T seems pretty neat though, I'd be curious to hear that paired up with an Axe-Fx II to see how it sounds.


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## Andromalia (Jan 19, 2012)

Depends on price, I could be interested in that L3T thingie to pair with the axe2 I get tomorrow.


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## cwhitey2 (Jan 19, 2012)

xCaptainx said:


> The digital mixer is pretty awesome/new. Also the more I read about the L3T, the more siked I am on it. It's going to be awesome with the HD500.


----------



## Blasphemer (Jan 19, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> Seems that the new Pod is definitely NOT geared towards metal players.



I don't think thats necessarily true. I can imagine it just takes quite a bit longer to accurately model a high gain amp, other than a mid-gainer. I feel like we'll see a 5150, but its just going to take a while.


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## ShadowFactoryX (Jan 19, 2012)

honestly i think the whole thing is a really cool self integrated approach to pa systems
and i really really like those pa speakers, i might have to switch to FRFR now


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## cyril v (Jan 19, 2012)

I would've thought all the people using modelers live (not just L6 users) would be psyched about this, I guess not, but I'm not sure why. 

Seems like a decent product, and I'm glad they're finally updating that archaic site, the parts of it that are working look good.


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## Harry (Jan 19, 2012)

I think it's a pretty cool range of stuff


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## celticelk (Jan 19, 2012)

ShadowFactoryX said:


> honestly i think the whole thing is a really cool self integrated approach to pa systems
> and i really really like those pa speakers, i might have to switch to FRFR now


 
I would certainly consider getting one of those speakers to accompany my new HD500 if I ever need to play live.


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## ShadowFactoryX (Jan 19, 2012)

reading more on that mixer
i really really really want one

behringer's x32 seemed epic, but has a hefty price tag


this seems super efficient, but i love how you can split the signals to different speakers
it really is a smart mixer, and if the price is right, i can see this selling big time


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## XEN (Jan 19, 2012)

It seems to me that they might just have started a revolution in PA design.
I'm actually quite stoked about it.


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## Sepultorture (Jan 19, 2012)

DUNNO IF I'D BUY ONE but it's definitely an intuitive step in the right direction


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## Blasphemer (Jan 19, 2012)

I'm looking to start reshaping my bands livesound, and these mixed with a sub might be just what were looking for. I'll definitely give them a shake


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## ShadowFactoryX (Jan 19, 2012)

urklvt said:


> It seems to me that they might just have started a revolution in PA design.
> I'm actually quite stoked about it.



same here

think of it in this way...

if you had all the features this ONE unit has, how big of a mixer, and how many rack units would you need to do what this thing does? not including all the great features you would have available on a DAW, but on the go.
Plus, if you have a portable HD, you can use it as a mobile recording unit.
Just one piece!

seems like most people on here will just write this off, because its not guitar specific
but im quite impelled to own one at this point just buy reading all of its features


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## xCaptainx (Jan 19, 2012)

yeah in built effects, user friendly interface, 20 second looper to record inputs for mix testing (no more 'ok snare please.....keep going..........keep going.........keep going........jesus, keep going please....) 

The user friendly interface is a huge selling point for me. They are right, for people venturing into live sound or who want a straight up, robust sound system with plenty of options, this will be great. It'll do what the POD did for guitarist venturing into the modelling/digital area.


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## ZXIIIT (Jan 19, 2012)

L3T, I am excite.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

They did say that it was going to be one of the most innovative things they've ever come up with. 

As I said before, the L3T's do look like a fantastic idea but not very practical for either using at home or in a small jam space. For live purposes, a set of those paired with the new mixer would be probably the best thing a small club could buy.


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

xCaptainx said:


> I use my HD500 with a matrix GT800FX poweramp. The current range of amps do 'metal' VERY well, especially the dual rect and engl setups (the engl being my favourite at the moment)
> 
> More stoked on the bass option than another 'metal' amp option.



I was just referring to the fact that there are only 3 or 4 of them and with each update they only seem to be focusing on "vintage" amps.


----------



## brector (Jan 19, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> As I said before, the L3T's do look like a fantastic idea but not very practical for either using at home or in a small jam space.



Well I plan on getting a Mackie HD1221 for home use to go with my HD500 - and it is 1200W lol

-Brian


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## bhakan (Jan 19, 2012)

I really want to know how the &quot;electric guitar mode&quot; sounds. I use a Mesa Studio preamp to record, and it would be cool to be able to bring that and a speaker like this around, instead of shelling out for a full rack rig with a poweramp, cab, etc., but I doubt the internal cab sims will be any good.


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## Rick (Jan 19, 2012)

That's it? Doesn't affect me at all.


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## GunpointMetal (Jan 19, 2012)

bhakan said:


> I really want to know how the &quot;electric guitar mode&quot; sounds. I use a Mesa Studio preamp to record, and it would be cool to be able to bring that and a speaker like this around, instead of shelling out for a full rack rig with a poweramp, cab, etc., but I doubt the internal cab sims will be any good.


 Are there supposed to be built in cab sims? I thought it was just an EQ voicing that would probably accentuate mids/mid highs and relax some the lows and crystalline top end?


----------



## bhakan (Jan 19, 2012)

GunpointMetal said:


> Are there supposed to be built in cab sims? I thought it was just an EQ voicing that would probably accentuate mids/mid highs and relax some the lows and crystalline top end?


"Rather than sending the signal from the guitarists floorboard to an amplifier and then micing the amp, this L3t mode features an overall frequency response that emulates the sound of a 212 combo amp" I assumed this meant there was a cab simulator in it, but it could very well mean what you said also.


----------



## pitbulltodd (Jan 19, 2012)

Rick said:


> That's it? Doesn't affect me at all.


This^


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## Spinedriver (Jan 19, 2012)

Looks like a single L3T is gonna run approx $1,200 USD.

Line 6 StageSource L3t | Sweetwater.com

Cheaper than a new Mesa 4x12 cab, so I guess it all depends on how the 'modes' sound.


----------



## flint757 (Jan 19, 2012)

Theyare breaking into expensive territory that Stagescape controller thing is 2500 that's more than an axe-fx. Not sure what it does, but damn.


----------



## pitbulltodd (Jan 19, 2012)

Spinedriver said:


> Looks like a single L3T is gonna run approx $1,200 USD.



huh, i never thought line 6 stuff would be out of my budget, LOL

i think i might just go back to a tube head into a 2x12 cab


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 19, 2012)

pitbulltodd said:


> huh, i never thought line 6 stuff would be out of my budget, LOL
> 
> i think i might just go back to a tube head into a 2x12 cab



You do know the DT line is more expensive then this?


----------



## pitbulltodd (Jan 19, 2012)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> You do know the DT line is more expensive then this?



yep but a bugera head isn't and i already have a 4x12 with v30's in it.

if they would have included an IR Loader with this then i may have stuck with the podhd stuff


----------



## Larrikin666 (Jan 19, 2012)

Not a lot of information about the power amp they're putting in these.


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## ShadowFactoryX (Jan 19, 2012)

Larrikin666 said:


> Not a lot of information about the power amp they're putting in these.



this

but 1200 really isnt that bad, for the immense headroom and obscene amount of power behind these


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## Larrikin666 (Jan 19, 2012)

Considering I can get two Mackie HD1221s for $647 each, I'm not sold on these yet. I have Mackie, EV, and QSC monitors for my Axe-FX. There's a difference in feel between my QSC K10s and Mackie HD1221s. I find it odd that Line 6 went with 10" drivers but also had guitar players in mind. 

Also, the tone controls on these monitors pretty much defeat the purpose of FRFR for guitarists. The idea is to replicate the tone that will be going to the front of the house. If you're tweaking lows, mids, and highs on the monitor, then you aren't getting a very accurate representation of your FOH sound.


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## DavidLopezJr (Jan 20, 2012)

Bass amp model added is what excited me the most... lol


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## getaway_fromme (Jan 20, 2012)

Wow. I was totally into these until I saw the price tag.

Dangerous ground, Line 6.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 20, 2012)

? 1200 is around the same price tag as an orange, soldano, mesa cab etc. Most people moving from FRFR would have a typical poweramp/cab setup which would cost even more. 

Plus where I am, I'm fairly confident this is going to be cheaper than the mackie FRFR range anyway, so I'm stoked, haha.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 20, 2012)

Larrikin666 said:


> Also, the tone controls on these monitors pretty much defeat the purpose of FRFR for guitarists. The idea is to replicate the tone that will be going to the front of the house. If you're tweaking lows, mids, and highs on the monitor, then you aren't getting a very accurate representation of your FOH sound.



Perhaps, when the controls are at 12 o'clock, they are bypassed, kinda like the active EQ on a lot of bass gear. 

So you can have a true FRFR system that you can tweak to the room on the fly if needed.


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## Larrikin666 (Jan 20, 2012)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Perhaps, when the controls are at 12 o'clock, they are bypassed, kinda like the active EQ on a lot of bass gear.
> 
> So you can have a true FRFR system that you can tweak to the room on the fly if needed.



I thought about that, but they didn't specify go into enough detail. They pushed the "it sounds like a 2x12" aspect a bit more.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 20, 2012)

*Electric Guitar mode
*Electric Guitar Mode was designed to accommodate the modern guitarist who uses a multi-effects floorboard device such as the Line 6 POD®. Rather than sending the signal from the guitarists floorboard to an amplifier and then micing the amp, this L3t mode features an overall frequency response that emulates the sound of a 212 combo amp. *The dual 10 speakers play full range, with the horn adding only the smallest amount of sparkle to the sound.* Users of the Line 6 POD HD500 or POD HD Pro can plug directly into the L3t L6 LINK input on the control panel for digital audio and logic integration. This mode also provides Virtual Tilt-Back, which optimizes the speakers tuning to achieve an upward tilt to its main axis and aim the sound towards the performer.

Looking forward to finding out more about it.


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## Rook (Jan 20, 2012)

$1200?!?!?! That's crazy! I'd be amazed if these were real competition for a PAIR or HD1221's for $100 more.




xCaptainx said:


> ? 1200 is around the same price tag as an orange, soldano, mesa cab etc. Most people moving from FRFR would have a typical poweramp/cab setup which would cost even more.
> 
> Plus where I am, I'm fairly confident this is going to be cheaper than the mackie FRFR range anyway, so I'm stoked, haha.



$100 cheaper isn't much cheaper, lol.


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## HighGain510 (Jan 20, 2012)

Larrikin666 said:


> Considering I can get two Mackie HD1221s for $647 each, I'm not sold on these yet.



Did Mackie end up fixing the reliability issues with those yet though? I thought I had seen another report of one of the newer ones still catching fire or whatever not long ago on FB (maybe Tosin?)?


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## Hemi-Powered Drone (Jan 20, 2012)

I guess that's revolutionary. 
The interface looked a lot like Garage Band...


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## HighGain510 (Jan 20, 2012)

Huh... if it's actually $1200 for an L3t I guess I'm not in any rush to sell my Fryette 2/50/2 and will just put another $600 out towards a cabinet like I had planned to originally.  The concept is really cool and the execution looks pretty nice (assuming tone and reliability are up there), but the price is an instant boner-kill.  $2500 for that mixer might turn off a lot of the guys who were looking at them too as folks on other forums said they were interested but it didn't have enough inputs, if they are going to release a larger model with more inputs down the road at an even higher price I don't see them moving a ton of these units.


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## Rook (Jan 20, 2012)

HighGain510 said:


> Did Mackie end up fixing the reliability issues with those yet though? I thought I had seen another report of one of the newer ones still catching fire or whatever not long ago on FB (maybe Tosin?)?



I think it was the 3-ways that had trouble.

My 1221's 3 months old, gets used every day and used particularly loudly once or twice a week, the thermal light hasn't even come on let alone fires haha. I believe its resolved.


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## xCaptainx (Jan 20, 2012)

Fun111 said:


> $1200?!?!?! That's crazy! I'd be amazed if these were real competition for a PAIR or HD1221's for $100 more.
> 
> 
> $100 cheaper isn't much cheaper, lol.




In NZ, the Mackie HD1221 retails for $2,000 NZD (which is $1,600 USD) QSC K series are much the same. 

The 1531 is $2,699 NZ. This is exactly why I havent gone FRFR yet. 

Our local line 6 distro is really, really competitively priced with relative american prices so I'm presuming it's going to be around $1,500 NZ. So the L3T, for NZ options, will be $500 less. 

NZ's quite remote and the distro presumably push much more line 6 products, hence the price differences. 

I'm an NZ line 6 endorsee, so hopefully I'll be able to suss something.


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## Larrikin666 (Jan 20, 2012)

HighGain510 said:


> Did Mackie end up fixing the reliability issues with those yet though? I thought I had seen another report of one of the newer ones still catching fire or whatever not long ago on FB (maybe Tosin?)?



I've been running two for a few weeks now. I spoke to a few different Mackie dealers in the last few months. They didn't have direct knowledge about what Mackie fixed, but they said there had been a significant decline in the amount of warranty repairs being brought into the shop.



Fun111 said:


> I think it was the 3-ways that had trouble.
> 
> My 1221's 3 months old, gets used every day and used particularly loudly once or twice a week, the thermal light hasn't even come on let alone fires haha. I believe its resolved.



Same here. They're damn heavy, but they sound awesome. I haven't had to crank mine too much though. 



xCaptainx said:


> In NZ, the Mackie HD1221 retails for $2,000 NZD (which is $1,600 USD) QSC K series are much the same.
> 
> The 1531 is $2,699 NZ. This is exactly why I havent gone FRFR yet.
> 
> ...



That's rough man. Sounds like your prices are just as inflated as Australia's.


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## HighGain510 (Jan 20, 2012)

Fun111 said:


> My 1221's 3 months old, gets used every day and used particularly loudly once or twice a week, the thermal light hasn't even come on let alone fires haha. I believe its resolved.





Larrikin666 said:


> I've been running two for a few weeks now. I spoke to a few different Mackie dealers in the last few months. They didn't have direct knowledge about what Mackie fixed, but they said there had been a significant decline in the amount of warranty repairs being brought into the shop.



Ah right on, I was hoping that had been fixed by now!  I also hope for the folks grabbing an L3t or two that they don't suffer the same issues out the gate that the Mackies did, I don't see it going well if they're selling them for $1200 and one catches on fire!


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## Larrikin666 (Jan 20, 2012)

HighGain510 said:


> Ah right on, I was hoping that had been fixed by now!  I also hope for the folks grabbing an L3t or two that they don't suffer the same issues out the gate that the Mackies did, I don't see it going well if they're selling them for $1200 and one catches on fire!



That's why I was concerned about the power amps they are using. Making reliable, high-watt power sections can be difficult. If they came out of the gate saying that had partner with someone like Crown to use their amps, then I'd be very impressed. I haven't seen any good pictures of the back, so I'm worried about overheating issues. Heat dispersion is something that takes a few tries to refine generally. Maybe they absolutely nailed it though, and these will work with no issues.


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## matisq (Jan 21, 2012)




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## xCaptainx (Jan 21, 2012)

WNAMM12: Line 6 StageSource L3t, 1400 Watt 3 way powered loudspeaker system (Video) -Sonicstate.com you guys should watch this, it's well worth it and explains the L3T capabilities really well. 


righto, at the end of the video he explains that there is also going to be an L3M

Which is basically the L3T without the EQ/effects/variax controls on the side, and is more of a straight up monitor. Spec wise (power, size etc) it's the same. 

L3T retails at $1199. L3M will be $999. 

Based on that, practically for a FRFR use with the HD500, the L3m sounds like the way to go, especially if you're using it in straight P.A mode for a true FRFR system. That being said, The L3T would be great to have just to have that option for further tweaking if you use Electric Guitar mode and want some more E.Q control, or use it for other means. 

So the L3M looks great and even cheaper.


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## BobSmoke (Jan 24, 2012)

Not sure if this is the right place to put this- mods please feel free to move I'd I've guessed wrong. 

Anyway, thought this was interesting. Certainly should make live mixing alot simpler. 

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Chime in with your sixpence guys.


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## Ibanez09 (Jan 24, 2012)

Link doesn't bring you to a video.


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## BobSmoke (Jan 24, 2012)

Odd. Works for me, but I'm on an iPhone here. 

Try this. 


Cheers for the heads up fella.


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## Prestofly (Jan 24, 2012)

so...i want this


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## scherzo1928 (Jan 24, 2012)

BobSmoke said:


> Odd. Works for me, but I'm on an iPhone here.
> 
> Try this.
> 
> ...




 That's awesome!!!!


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## Iamasingularity (Jan 25, 2012)

Damn, that thing needs to be rack mountable.


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## meambobbo (Jan 25, 2012)

xCaptainx said:


> *Electric Guitar mode
> *Electric Guitar Mode was designed to accommodate the modern guitarist who uses a multi-effects floorboard device such as the Line 6 POD®. Rather than sending the signal from the guitarists floorboard to an amplifier and then micing the amp, this L3t mode features an overall frequency response that emulates the sound of a 212 combo amp. *The dual 10 speakers play full range, with the horn adding only the smallest amount of sparkle to the sound.* Users of the Line 6 POD HD500 or POD HD Pro can plug directly into the L3t L6 LINK input on the control panel for digital audio and logic integration. This mode also provides Virtual Tilt-Back, which optimizes the speakers tuning to achieve an upward tilt to its main axis and aim the sound towards the performer.
> 
> Looking forward to finding out more about it.



If it's using the larger speakers to produce the higher frequencies, it will have a similar variance in on vs. off axis sound as a real guitar cab. Not sure if you WANT to emulate that... As for "virtual tilt-back", it sounds like it will just brighten up the tone to compensate for that. I'm scared of both of these "features". I'd make sure I kept them off...permanently.


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## demoniaco (Jan 25, 2012)

Id rather get the Mackie 1608...


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## MF_Kitten (Jan 26, 2012)

if only all the local shows i played when starting up had that damn soundscape mixer


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## xCaptainx (Jul 9, 2012)

our line 6 distro have received their soundsource shipment. I'm borring an L3T tomorrow night for band practise, to try out with the HD500. I'll post results upon my return home!


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## xCaptainx (Aug 3, 2012)

Righto so I now own an L3M. I wrote a review of the L3T after my first practise with it, and I just got back from doing my first show

Initial impressions of the L3T can be found Community: had a full evening with the L3T powered monitor + HD500 (gig volume review)

I've been tweaking my tone slightly now that I have a full range setup. Totally happy and confident with using the L3M as backline. Last night was great, just pushed the 4x12 backline out of the way, put my L3M up in it's place and then took the mic XLR cable and stuck it in the HD500 instead.

It's LOUD. And does a great job with being multi directional, in fact it was much, much better than using a 4x12. We had it behind our stage scrims and I had a few kids asked me what thell it was while I was packing down, they had no idea I wasn't using a traditional setup haha. 

Highly recommended, I love mine. I havent compared it to others but my line 6 contact in NZ went to the line 6 factory for training on the product in January, they had a whole bunch of monitors in the similar price range (mackie, QSC) and the L3T/L3M blew them all out of the water.


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