# Horizon Devices Preamp Pedal



## Vyn (Jul 11, 2018)

This went up last week for the survey (which was emailed to all previous Precision Drive customers I think):



And now there's a teaser pic on Instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlGOe0EBtlq/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

This with a Powerstage 170 sounds drool-worthy. Be interesting to see what additional features are on it.


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 11, 2018)

It'll probably be too pricey for me to care about. I'm sure it'll sell well, and I could see there being a version II after user feedback.


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## Vyn (Jul 11, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> It'll probably be too pricey for me to care about. I'm sure it'll sell well, and I could see there being a version II after user feedback.



One of the questions on the survey was pricing (How much would you pay, cheaper = less features, more expensive = more features) and from memory the price ranged from $249US to $369US.


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 11, 2018)

Honestly, I just need a clean preamp as a pedal platform.


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## narad (Jul 12, 2018)

Killer feature: somehow making an OD sound the Strymon Riverside doesn't already do for $300.


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## Bearitone (Jul 13, 2018)

I suggested building in a clean preamp with a fixed EQ like the AMT Legend2 pedals.

Does the fixed EQ suck? Yes but at least you get a clean channel that’ll get the job done without having to add a separate preamp pedal to your board.


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## Bearitone (Jul 13, 2018)

Vyn said:


> One of the questions on the survey was pricing (How much would you pay, cheaper = less features, more expensive = more features) and from memory the price ranged from $249US to $369US.



I just said the highest price. I would rather them make something really great, a possible all-in-one solution, for an extra $60. 

If i can truly ditch my gate and OD it will be worth it


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## Spinedriver (Jul 13, 2018)

I'm guessing that if they needed the kind of noise gate Misha was describing, this isn't going to be just an "od" pedal, it's probably going to have some pretty serious gain to it.
I suggested that it be a "dual" pedal like the Fulltone pedals where there's both a 'boost' side and main 'pre amp' side that can be used independently of each other. I'd say that $299 would put it in line with most of the 'higher end' distortion pedals like the Empress Heavy, Tightmetal, etc... More than that & I can see people taking a pass.


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## lewis (Jul 14, 2018)

is this designed to pair with the Precision drive, or is it going to be alot more money and basically include a version of the PD built in?


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## Vyn (Jul 14, 2018)

lewis said:


> is this designed to pair with the Precision drive, or is it going to be alot more money and basically include a version of the PD built in?



I think it's going to be designed as a preamp pedal that can be directly fed out to -insert line level- device here. It might have some sort of boost built in but my guess is that will be dependent on the amount of features people are willing to pay for. Can't see them building the PD into it, that wouldn't make any sense.


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## lewis (Jul 14, 2018)

Vyn said:


> I think it's going to be designed as a preamp pedal that can be directly fed out to -insert line level- device here. It might have some sort of boost built in but my guess is that will be dependent on the amount of features people are willing to pay for. Can't see them building the PD into it, that wouldn't make any sense.


sweet so PD > this preamp > power?

Sounds a pretty rad little setup.


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## Vyn (Jul 14, 2018)

lewis said:


> sweet so PD > this preamp > power?
> 
> Sounds a pretty rad little setup.



That's what I'm hoping for. PD > Apex > Powerstage 170 has the potential to be a sick compact rig.


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## lewis (Jul 14, 2018)

Vyn said:


> That's what I'm hoping for. PD > Apex > Powerstage 170 has the potential to be a sick compact rig.


yeah it really does. Shame the PD didnt have that latching footswitch feature that the Fortin 33 had. Because turning off the PD would then automatically change to the clean tone on the Apex?
could of been nice but still.

Love those powerstages. If I wasnt going FRFR route with my future Ax8, i would have gotten one and a monitor cab for stage sound.
But alas im not so.


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## I play music (Jul 14, 2018)

Vyn said:


> This went up last week for the survey (which was emailed to all previous Precision Drive customers I think):
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That video is so annoying.


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## bulb (Jul 14, 2018)

I play music said:


> That video is so awesome.



Thanks dude!


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## bulb (Jul 14, 2018)

Also, this pedal will definitely not need a PD in front of it to sound tight, but the PD does play well with it, so I could see people who happen to own the PD already using the two together!


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## mnemonic (Jul 14, 2018)

So will it be kind of 5150 flavored or something totally different? Or is that still up in the air at the moment?


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 14, 2018)

Just got an email saying pre-orders will be available July 28th at $299.

Also




I wonder if this is based on the MXR 5150 OD, just tweaked to Misha's taste.


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## Bearitone (Jul 14, 2018)

I just hope it sounds fackin evil. Stoked to hear a demo


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## Beheroth (Jul 14, 2018)

i was expecting this to be like a darkglass for guitar kind of meme, but it lacks an xlr out and some control over the mids, lo and hi mid controls would have been nice or at least a semi para mid control.

looks like they went for the lower price and less options





also no fx loop


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## Bearitone (Jul 14, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> i was expecting this to be like a darkglass for guitar kind of meme, but it lacks an xlr out and some control over the mids, lo and hi mid controls would have been nice or at least a semi para mid control.
> 
> looks like they went for the lower price and less options
> 
> ...


Bro an “effects loop” is literally just a gap in the chain between the preamp and poweramp. 

All you do is put “effects loop” pedals in between this pedal and the poweramp.

And a built in gate and OD is more than most preamp pedals on the market have. Also, this was a community driven preamp pedal. If it wound up being $300 with less features than you expected it’s because that’s what people voted on


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 14, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> i was expecting this to be like a darkglass for guitar kind of meme, but it lacks an xlr out and some control over the mids, lo and hi mid controls would have been nice or at least a semi para mid control.
> 
> looks like they went for the lower price and less options
> 
> ...


You put the fx loop effects, uh... after the preamp? Why would you need an FX loop? It's not like it does a lead boost, or bypass to other device sorta thing like the Pro series Amptweakers.


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## Beheroth (Jul 14, 2018)

fx loop between preamp and cabsim
also useful if there was an xlr out


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## A-Branger (Jul 14, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Honestly, I just need a clean preamp as a pedal platform.


this^^

I find myself using only a couple of patches on my Line6Firehawk, and I know if Iget a Helix I would do the same. And with the release of the HelixFX thing with IR loader on it, I really only need a good pre-amp. This pedal could fit the bill nicely, but then Im lacking on the clean dept, same as the Rev pedal.... Im bit exited about the tube pre-amp pedals from Victory as they do have dual channels, but then the Kraken is really a Dirt and DIRT channels, unless you put the gain on CH1 on 0.6.... or get the Countess version, but then Im not sure if the dirt chanel would be what I want

and donno who makes a clean pre-amp pedal... and even if, then I would ahve to tap dance to change channels, which defeats the purpose of it


Still pretty keen to hear this new pedal tho!!


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 14, 2018)

A-Branger said:


> this^^
> 
> I find myself using only a couple of patches on my Line6Firehawk, and I know if Iget a Helix I would do the same. And with the release of the HelixFX thing with IR loader on it, I really only need a good pre-amp. This pedal could fit the bill nicely, but then Im lacking on the clean dept, same as the Rev pedal.... Im bit exited about the tube pre-amp pedals from Victory as they do have dual channels, but then the Kraken is really a Dirt and DIRT channels, unless you put the gain on CH1 on 0.6.... or get the Countess version, but then Im not sure if the dirt chanel would be what I want
> 
> ...


I think you may just want to check out the Two Notes Le Clean. You get a clean and overdrive channel in the Fender vein. The overdrive channel can be set on the verge of breakup (which is how I use it), and it pairs nicely with pedals. You can also go cleaner on the overdrive channel, and use it like two clean channels. Plus you can mix them in various ways and so on.

Just a thought.


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## A-Branger (Jul 14, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> I think you may just want to check out the Two Notes Le Clean. You get a clean and overdrive channel in the Fender vein. The overdrive channel can be set on the verge of breakup (which is how I use it), and it pairs nicely with pedals. You can also go cleaner on the overdrive channel, and use it like two clean channels. Plus you can mix them in various ways and so on.
> 
> Just a thought.


yeh cool, thanks

Ideally I would want clean/dirt on the same pedal. Like on an amp, so one step and change chanel.... Yes, I play Metal, but I also want my cleans, and by clean I mean nice cleans not semi-dist


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 14, 2018)

A-Branger said:


> yeh cool, thanks
> 
> Ideally I would want clean/dirt on the same pedal. Like on an amp, so one step and change chanel.... Yes, I play Metal, but I also want my cleans, and by clean I mean nice cleans not semi-dist


While you'd have to turn off pedals and stuff, you can go from channel A (the cleaner channel) to channel B (the clean/crunch channel) with one step.


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## sylcfh (Jul 14, 2018)

A-Branger said:


> yeh cool, thanks
> 
> Ideally I would want clean/dirt on the same pedal. Like on an amp, so one step and change chanel.... Yes, I play Metal, but I also want my cleans, and by clean I mean nice cleans not semi-dist






AMT SS-11b.


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## NateFalcon (Jul 15, 2018)

Does it have 2-9v power supplies?


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 15, 2018)

Interesting. Modern metal tone pedal? Is it usable as both a preamp and as a distortion box? I’ve been finding some distortion pedals to be significantly noisier than I want.


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 15, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Interesting. Modern metal tone pedal? Is it usable as both a preamp and as a distortion box? I’ve been finding some distortion pedals to be significantly noisier than I want.


I think they might be creating a ground loop issue or something.


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## Vyn (Jul 15, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Just got an email saying pre-orders will be available July 28th at $299.
> 
> Also
> 
> ...



I hate to say this but I'd buy it purely on aesthetics. That looks clean as fuck.


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## narad (Jul 15, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> i was expecting this to be like a darkglass for guitar kind of meme, but it lacks an xlr out and some control over the mids, lo and hi mid controls would have been nice or at least a semi para mid control.
> 
> looks like they went for the lower price and less options
> 
> ...



I don't get the FX loop comment but agree on the mid controls. Borrow the band-EQ from the darkglass alpha-omega, would have been cool. Well, borrow MXR's, naturally.


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## Beheroth (Jul 15, 2018)

narad said:


> I don't get the FX loop comment



fx loop between the preamp and the cab sim would have been nice or even necessary in the case of an xlr out


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## narad (Jul 15, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> fx loop between the preamp and the cab sim would have been nice or even necessary in the case of an xlr out



That poor reading comprehension's on me


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 15, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> I think they might be creating a ground loop issue or something.



I wouldn’t think the dirt pedals themselves should do that. It’s not like 60 cycle hum though...just a shitload of hiss. In some cases high-frequencies, in other cases pink noise.

Edit: After a little bit of testing, the excessive noise isn’t coming from the pedal(s). More testing needed...


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## I play music (Jul 15, 2018)

A-Branger said:


> this^^
> 
> I find myself using only a couple of patches on my Line6Firehawk, and I know if Iget a Helix I would do the same. And with the release of the HelixFX thing with IR loader on it, I really only need a good pre-amp. This pedal could fit the bill nicely, but then Im lacking on the clean dept, same as the Rev pedal.... Im bit exited about the tube pre-amp pedals from Victory as they do have dual channels, but then the Kraken is really a Dirt and DIRT channels, unless you put the gain on CH1 on 0.6.... or get the Countess version, but then Im not sure if the dirt chanel would be what I want
> 
> ...


One option I can think of is the Hotone Mojo Attack. It has also a power amp, but you don't have to use it when you don't need it and it's still very compact and costs less than a lot of preamps.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 15, 2018)

sylcfh said:


> AMT SS-11b.



Always wanted to try this. It seems like it has some great sounds on board. Kinda like a Recto/5150/SLO hybrid. Doesn't seem to have a lot of gain on board, though.



Deadpool_25 said:


> I wouldn’t think the dirt pedals themselves should do that. It’s not like 60 cycle hum though...just a shitload of hiss. In some cases high-frequencies, in other cases pink noise.
> 
> Edit: After a little bit of testing, the excessive noise isn’t coming from the pedal(s). More testing needed...



Like I said in the other thread, you might have a defective Helix FX.

Also, while we're on the topic of pure clean preamps...

Ethos Clean II and Shiftline Twin II. The former being an SS pre based on a Dumble circuit, and the latter being a tube pre based on the Fender Twin. 

There's also the Kingsley Maiden and Squire. You can request one of those to be based on either the Dumble, Twin, or Vox AC30.


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## sylcfh (Jul 15, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Always wanted to try this. It seems like it has some great sounds on board. Kinda like a Recto/5150/SLO hybrid. Doesn't seem to have a lot of gain on board, though.





I think the SS-20 has more gain, even though it has only one tube.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 15, 2018)

sylcfh said:


> I think the SS-20 has more gain, even though it has only one tube.



Yeah the SS20 has more gain, but it seems a bit more stiff in the videos I've seen. The SS11B seems more organic.


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## sylcfh (Jul 15, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Yeah the SS20 has more gain, but it seems a bit more stiff in the videos I've seen. The SS11B seems more organic.




It has a FET going into the tube instead of a clipping diode. I think it's the best of both worlds. A full voltage tube and a JFET.


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## katsumura78 (Jul 15, 2018)

We need to hear this thing.


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 15, 2018)

katsumura78 said:


> We need to hear this thing.


Don't worry, Misha will demo it soon via livestream so we can all hear how well the tight mode allows it to go, "Ba dunt kuh junt, bah dunt da doont."


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## Gmork (Jul 15, 2018)

sylcfh said:


> AMT SS-11b.


Always wanted to try these, could never decide which one idprefer though.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 15, 2018)

can i get one silkscreened with _just have fun with it_ on it?


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 15, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> can i get one silkscreened with _just have fun with it_ on it?


I kinda want one with a bad Japanese translation, like "Just fun it with have!" on it.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 15, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> I kinda want one with a bad Japanese translation, like "Just fun it with have!" on it.


it better be called the kawaii guy mk2


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## Seabeast2000 (Jul 15, 2018)

Introducing, the JHAFWI.


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## narad (Jul 16, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> I kinda want one with a bad Japanese translation, like "Just fun it with have!" on it.



Ha, dude, bad Japanese translations aren't just swapping the word order of things.


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## prlgmnr (Jul 16, 2018)

narad said:


> Ha, dude, bad Japanese translations aren't just swapping the word order of things.


That was a bad bad Japanese translation.


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## IbbyAddict (Jul 16, 2018)

hey guys sorry to be the dumbass but if i just have some solid state amplifer that only has a clean channel, can i plug this pre amp in and it will become the entire amps tone? does that even make sense idk


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## Bearitone (Jul 16, 2018)

IbbyAddict said:


> hey guys sorry to be the dumbass but if i just have some solid state amplifer that only has a clean channel, can i plug this pre amp in and it will become the entire amps tone? does that even make sense idk



No matter what the poweramp will always flavor the tone so you can’t bypass that but you can bypass your solidstate’s preamp with the apex preamp (which is also solidstate lol) if you have an effects loop.

You go guitar>apex-preamp>Effects-return-input

If you don’t have an effects loop then your tone will always be influenced by the preamp of your current amp head. If you really want to keep the amp and use the apex as your main tone then you can always have the amp modded to have an effects loop.


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## bulb (Jul 16, 2018)

IbbyAddict said:


> hey guys sorry to be the dumbass but if i just have some solid state amplifer that only has a clean channel, can i plug this pre amp in and it will become the entire amps tone? does that even make sense idk



Yup! Just plug it in front of the amp on the clean channel and when you turn the pedal on you will have a tight high Gain tone!


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## bulb (Jul 16, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> can i get one silkscreened with _just have fun with it_ on it?



You 100% should get one and then get that silkscreened on it, would be so awesome haha!


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## bulb (Jul 16, 2018)

katsumura78 said:


> We need to hear this thing.



Clips coming soon obviously!


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 16, 2018)

sso _e x c l u s i v e, _it can be yours for 10 easy payments of 16.99 *does not include shipping and handling* also this is a joke


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## A-Branger (Jul 16, 2018)

I know the "just have fun with it" started here and I think on the peavy amp tread?.... but I didnt followed too closely, so from where it started?

I just wanna understand the joke


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 16, 2018)

A-Branger said:


> I know the "just have fun with it" started here and I think on the peavy amp tread?.... but I didnt followed too closely, so from where it started?
> 
> I just wanna understand the joke



Nah, actually started here in a thread where Misha claimed Periphery made no money in an interview.

http://www.sevenstring.org/threads/misha-just-have-fun-with-it.328712/page-14#post-4856828


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## Seabeast2000 (Jul 16, 2018)

Can the knobs be labeled "Just, Have, Fun, With and the switch is It"?


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## devastone (Jul 17, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Honestly, I just need a clean preamp as a pedal platform.


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## Andromalia (Jul 17, 2018)

narad said:


> Ha, dude, bad Japanese translations aren't just swapping the word order of things.



Well there's not much else you can do in english. I still shudder when I think about all the spelling errors and genre mistakes on "french" bakeries and cafés names I saw when I lived there though.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 17, 2018)

Andromalia said:


> Well there's not much else you can do in english. I still shudder when I think about all the spelling errors and genre mistakes on "french" bakeries and cafés names I saw when I lived there though.


to be fair, french is considered the hardest of the romantic languages. It has a lot of weird spellings/accents/rules compared to spanish or italian. 
my favorite butchered french was when I met a girl with the last name beauchamp, and her family pronounced it Beechumm. It was almost as bad as when I had a teacher who went by cook instead of koch (which some americans butcher as cock, kotchh).


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## Sogradde (Jul 17, 2018)

Koch is german though.


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## Andromalia (Jul 17, 2018)

A lot of french people have german names in the east of France, givent the territory changed hands multiple times. (A part of France was german from 1870 to 1918, and then add to that the people who simply have german ancestors)
About italian though, I never saw another language where irregular verbs were actually the majority. XD


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 17, 2018)

Sogradde said:


> Koch is german though.


yeah, but i was more just segueing into other butchered last names.


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## Sogradde (Jul 17, 2018)

Andromalia said:


> A lot of french people have german names in the east of France, givent the territory changed hands multiple times. (A part of France was german from 1870 to 1918, and then add to that the people who simply have german ancestors)
> About italian though, I never saw another language where irregular verbs were actually the majority. XD


Give it back!!11


KnightBrolaire said:


> yeah, but i was more just segueing into other butchered last names.


I see. Baguette.


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## Andromalia (Jul 17, 2018)

They don't want to go back, we're the world champîons now.  BWAHAHAHA*cough*


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 18, 2018)

Looking forward to hearing this pedal. My guess is the tone will be Peavey 5150BL or Invective in a box. I’d buy that. But it’s going to have to be pretty special to beat out the Revv G3.


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## I play music (Jul 18, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> yeah, but i was more just segueing into other butchered last names.


Speaking of butchered last names: Diezel does NOT sound like "diesel"  That has always been cringe worthy for me.


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 18, 2018)

I play music said:


> Speaking of butchered last names: Diezel does NOT sound like "diesel"  That has always been cringe worthy for me.



DEET-zel


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## Bearitone (Jul 18, 2018)

I never knew that!


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 21, 2018)

narad said:


> Killer feature: somehow making an OD sound the Strymon Riverside doesn't already do for $300.



Man A few weeks ago I’d have agreed completely, but I just did a shootout between the Riverside, BE-OD, Revv G3, and AMT P2 and R2 pedals. I tried everything both in the loop and in front of a DSL40CR. The Riverside, as good as it is, finished last. Surprised the hell out of me.


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 22, 2018)

@bulb Will the Apex be usable as a distortion pedal in front of a clean amp?


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## Thrashman (Jul 22, 2018)

That's the purpose.


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## Thrashman (Jul 22, 2018)

EDIT: Doubleposted by accident - Sorry!


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 22, 2018)

Thrashman said:


> That's the purpose.



I’m not sure that’s true. “Preamp” implies it is designed for use into an effects loop, power amp, or direct into something (interface, mixing console, etc).

Running into the front of a clean amplifier makes use of the amp’s preamp section. People don’t typically run one preamp into another in this context.

Which isn’t to say this won’t work...


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## Beheroth (Jul 22, 2018)

bulb said:


> Yup! Just plug it in front of the amp on the clean channel and when you turn the pedal on you will have a tight high Gain tone!


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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 22, 2018)

@Beheroth 
Oh yeah. Forgot that post. Thanks!


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## wlfers (Jul 23, 2018)

Edit: Whoopsie, ignore this. Saw you did a write-up in a different thread.


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## Avedas (Jul 23, 2018)

They really spammed that <name> parameter in today's newsletter email.


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## Constructivist (Jul 25, 2018)

Check this out. The ultimate Ola is messing with it.


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## Spinedriver (Jul 25, 2018)

It's funny, he's reviewing it but they don't even have it listed on their website yet.


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## mikah912 (Jul 25, 2018)

From Ola's review and everything else I've seen, it truly does look like a rebadged MXR 5150 pedal with a bad cab sim tacked on. Would love to see a shootout between the two....


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## oneblackened (Jul 25, 2018)

It sounds an awful lot like an MXR 5150...


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 25, 2018)

>bulb's sig amp is a rebadged 5150
>bulb's preamp pedal is prob a rebadged 5150 pedal
>is anyone really surprised here?


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## Seabeast2000 (Jul 25, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> >bulb's sig amp is a rebadged 5150
> >bulb's preamp pedal is prob a rebadged 5150 pedal
> >is anyone really surprised here?



Meme please.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 25, 2018)

The906 said:


> Meme please.


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## prlgmnr (Jul 25, 2018)

Does this mean Bulb is somehow rebadged EVH?


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 25, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


>


Idjentical*


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## TheRileyOBrien (Jul 25, 2018)

Sneak peek of the new Misha Sig!


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## I play music (Jul 25, 2018)

mikah912 said:


> From Ola's review and everything else I've seen, it truly does look like a rebadged MXR 5150 pedal with a bad cab sim tacked on. Would love to see a shootout between the two....


Well to be honest that has to be expected. Misha is not an engineer, so I guess the engineering has to be done by MXR. And why would they reinvent the wheel when they can just take any pedal they already have, slightly modify it and be done with it. If they invented something new (and that takes time = money), they'd probably release it under their own brand first. 
I imagine it like this: 
Mishka "Hey MXR I want a cool new pedal that is an overdrive with an added gate called Precision Drive"
MXR "Sure, we have the GT-OD, should not be too much work to add the gate circuit we also already have from the 5150 overdrive and make it still fit into housing"
Mishka "Hey MXR I want a cool new preamp, 5150 style with a cab sim"
MXR "Sure no problem we already have a 5150 pedal, let's quickly add our cab sim circuit"


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## Seabeast2000 (Jul 25, 2018)

"Hey MXR, can you lend me that veneering iron?"


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## mikah912 (Jul 25, 2018)

I play music said:


> Well to be honest that has to be expected. Misha is not an engineer, so I guess the engineering has to be done by MXR. And why would they reinvent the wheel when they can just take any pedal they already have, slightly modify it and be done with it. If they invented something new (and that takes time = money), they'd probably release it under their own brand first.
> I imagine it like this:
> Mishka "Hey MXR I want a cool new pedal that is an overdrive with an added gate called Precision Drive"
> MXR "Sure, we have the GT-OD, should not be too much work to add the gate circuit we also already have from the 5150 overdrive and make it still fit into housing"
> ...



Love the guy, but I see this as a test of the strength of his brand when the MXR 5150 can be had all day gently used at half the price of this. Since Misha's a member here, maybe he'll weigh in on what's different besides the cab sim and...a "tight" switch (not like the 5150 was too saggy or flubby to begin with).


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## MFB (Jul 25, 2018)

TheRileyOBrien said:


> Sneak peek of the new Misha Sig!



I think that's the same blue as one of his cars, so it's confirmed


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## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 25, 2018)

Scratch scrat scrat ka scratch. Yuckasuarus. I guess I didn't have enough funs with it.


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## op1e (Jul 25, 2018)

Well at least they made the MXR 5150 pedal work into an FX return now and not sound muffled.


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jul 25, 2018)

one more for shits and giggles


----------



## Constructivist (Jul 26, 2018)

So no DI on this thing? How do you connect it straight on a USB interface?


----------



## narad (Jul 26, 2018)

prlgmnr said:


> Does this mean Bulb is somehow rebadged EVH?



I'm pretty sure there was a thread here along those lines like 3-4 years ago. Like a fan saying Misha's like the next EVH and then 10 pages of hate.


----------



## lewis (Jul 26, 2018)

@Ola Englund is it possible to see a follow up to this being used in/with the Satan? and being boosted by a 33 etc


----------



## narad (Jul 26, 2018)

lewis said:


> @Ola Englund is it possible to see a follow up to this being used in/with the Satan? and being boosted by a 33 etc



Dude, it was into the clean channel...


----------



## lurè (Jul 26, 2018)

the tight swith makes sense but the pedal doesn't work well at all with the PD.


----------



## lewis (Jul 26, 2018)

narad said:


> Dude, it was into the clean channel...


whats that got to do with anything? lol

This would sound emphatically better in the Satans efx loop than it would this tremoverb thing and using the 33 instead would have been cool to see.


----------



## StevenC (Jul 26, 2018)

lewis said:


> whats that got to do with anything? lol
> 
> This would sound emphatically better in the Satans efx loop than it would this tremoverb thing and using the 33 instead would have been cool to see.


Why is a Satan's power amp better than a Rectifier's power amp?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jul 26, 2018)

>using a satan with a boost based off a djent preamp into another djent preamp


----------



## mnemonic (Jul 26, 2018)

I’d like to see him do a video of it into the fx return of the Satan since that’s how he demo’d the Revv G3, and I’m interested in how those compare. The Revv sounded very good.


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 26, 2018)

narad said:


> Dude, it was into the clean channel...



It was into the effects loop towards the end


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 26, 2018)

mnemonic said:


> I’d like to see him do a video of it into the fx return of the Satan since that’s how he demo’d the Revv G3, and I’m interested in how those compare. The Revv sounded very good.


He did. Watch trough the whole video and he switches to effects loop towards the end


----------



## StevenC (Jul 26, 2018)

kindsage said:


> He did. Watch trough the whole video and he switches to effects loop towards the end


I think he means through the FX loop of the same amp as the Revv went through, which was the Satan. Which is a fair request I suppose.


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 26, 2018)

Oh. Well, it’s close enough to tell if you want the pedal or not imo


----------



## Thrashman (Jul 26, 2018)

"The Apex and PD suck together"

after hearing one guy pair them not even tweaking them and with the PD volume on 10 and the mids completely scooped on the Apex  
Of course it will sound like ass (imo).

I think the Apex sounds sick and I'm curious to hear the sweep of the cab sim knob. I think this and the PD as a pair can be a swiss knife of gain sounds.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 26, 2018)

Why does everything from Ola lately sound scratchy in general, and weird when it sustains? The G3 for instance, when he plays a chord and lets it sustain, doesn't sound too open in the high end. I don't check out everything he posts, but the past couple videos (G3, Apex) have this quality to them.


----------



## narad (Jul 26, 2018)

StevenC said:


> Why is a Satan's power amp better than a Rectifier's power amp?



And why stop there? I need to hear this pedal through the Diezel Herbert clean channel! Showdown time! HD preamp through the Ultra-lead clean channel vs. HD preamp through the Engl SE clean channel vs. HD preamp through the 5150 clean channel vs. HD preamp through the JCM800 clean channel.

If you have some high gain monster amp, stop looking at a preamp pedal and just learn how to use an EQ pedal. You will be better off for it.


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 26, 2018)

Thrashman said:


> "The Apex and PD suck together"
> 
> after hearing one guy pair them not even tweaking them and with the PD volume on 10 and the mids completely scooped on the Apex
> Of course it will sound like ass (imo).
> ...



I'm curious as well as to why he didn't try the cab sim knob at different levels just to see what it does.

Not only that but apparently, $299 is just the "pre-order" price. After the release date, it goes up to $320. Pretty steep compared to other pedals in that price range like the Empress Heavy, Tightmetal that offer more features like onboard boost, more sophisticated eq, etc..


----------



## Shoeless_jose (Jul 26, 2018)

narad said:


> And why stop there? I need to hear this pedal through the Diezel Herbert clean channel! Showdown time! HD preamp through the Ultra-lead clean channel vs. HD preamp through the Engl SE clean channel vs. HD preamp through the 5150 clean channel vs. HD preamp through the JCM800 clean channel.
> 
> If you have some high gain monster amp, stop looking at a preamp pedal and just learn how to use an EQ pedal. You will be better off for it.



Yeah exactly this, like obviously everyone has different uses for different pieces of gear.... but I feel like pedals like this are meant to provide the sound of a big fire breather of an amp in a more affordable/portable. 

But I guess the thing is to have every djent gear there is. need to run the PD into the APEX into fx loop of invective. I just hope these pedals come in satin finishes.


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jul 26, 2018)

https://flic.kr/p/MoQfem
gut shot of the apex from bulb's ig pg


----------



## narad (Jul 26, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> https://flic.kr/p/MoQfem
> gut shot of the apex from bulb's ig pg



Damn, there's more than 8 tone cylinders in there!


----------



## bulb (Jul 27, 2018)

sevenstring gonna sevenstring


----------



## mnemonic (Jul 27, 2018)

Thanks guys for letting me know that a simple request (not demand!) for comparisons of preamps using similar poweramps from a guy who does lots of gear demos, is just an unreasonable request.


----------



## narad (Jul 27, 2018)

mnemonic said:


> Thanks guys for letting me know that a simple request (not demand!) for comparisons of preamps using similar poweramps from a guy who does lots of gear demos, is just an unreasonable request.



My replies were more pointed toward @lewis and his weird notion that a random Randall poweramp is going to create an "emphatically better" sound than a Mesa poweramp. I feel like that'd be in the running for bonkers comment of the year. Like Mesa -- who are they even? How long have they even been making poweramps?

We'll get a slight hint of EL-34 vs 6L6 in that comparison, and that's about it. And why? To inform people which $1500-$2000 high gain amp to buy in order to get the best sound from a $300 pedal, completely circumventing the entire reason you buy the high-gain amp in the first place. Yea dude, I don't think that's an unreasonable request, but it is a pretty bonkers one.

The tone's supposed to come primarily from the pedal. That's why there's even a cab sim.


----------



## icipher (Jul 27, 2018)

I still don't really understand the point of this pedal. Everybody and their grandmothers have high gain amps or digital rigs nowadays.

I have a KSR Orthos. Why would I want this pedal to a part of my signal chain when my amp is already the epitome of amazing high gain tone? I already have the Precision Drive and Fortin 33.

I am genuinely curious what the point of this pedal is. The only thing I can come away with is that it'd be helpful to take a fender or marshall into modern high gain territory. The problem with that is those people aren't really interested in the Misha tone anyways or they would have bought an amp more in line with that sound.


----------



## StevenC (Jul 27, 2018)

Remember last month when they had that survey?

Well it was actually a competition to see who would guess the specs exactly.

The prize is $21 off your new Apex purchase.


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 27, 2018)

icipher said:


> I still don't really understand the point of this pedal. Everybody and their grandmothers have high gain amps or digital rigs nowadays.
> 
> I have a KSR Orthos. Why would I want this pedal to a part of my signal chain when my amp is already the epitome of amazing high gain tone? I already have the Precision Drive and Fortin 33.
> 
> I am genuinely curious what the point of this pedal is. The only thing I can come away with is that it'd be helpful to take a fender or marshall into modern high gain territory. The problem with that is those people aren't really interested in the Misha tone anyways or they would have bought an amp more in line with that sound.



I think preamp pedals are the sh*t and are bringing us closer to full rigs mounted to pedal boards.
Who wouldn’t want their whole rig on one board?

If KRS released a 2 channel Orthos preamp pedal and a pedal-poweramp, that sounded tits, you would still take the big tube head?

Let’s take it a step further, the preamp and poweramp are solidstate meaning no tube maintenance, no waiting for the tubes to warm up, etc...

It’s all win.
The technology is almost there and growing demand will push it along quickly


----------



## narad (Jul 27, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I think preamp pedals are the sh*t and are bringing us closer to full rigs mounted to pedal boards.
> Who wouldn’t want their whole rig on one board?
> 
> If KRS released a 2 channel Orthos preamp pedal and a pedal-poweramp, that sounded tits, you would still take the big tube head?



Unfortunately that's a big (borderline physically impossible) if. We'd all love it if it existed, but it doesn't.


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 27, 2018)

narad said:


> Unfortunately that's a big (borderline physically impossible) if. We'd all love it if it existed, but it doesn't.



Doesn’t yet*


----------



## narad (Jul 27, 2018)

kindsage said:


> Doesn’t yet*



I don't see any way for the technology to get there using solid state components, or any indication of it progressing toward that really. It'll be digital before it's solid state.


----------



## icipher (Jul 27, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I think preamp pedals are the sh*t and are bringing us closer to full rigs mounted to pedal boards.
> Who wouldn’t want their whole rig on one board?
> 
> If KRS released a 2 channel Orthos preamp pedal and a pedal-poweramp, that sounded tits, you would still take the big tube head?
> ...



I would love to ditch the head. I hate lugging gear to shows and we play out twice a month or so. 

Whole rig on one board sounds nice, but aren't you forgetting the poweramp?


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 27, 2018)

narad said:


> I don't see any way for the technology to get there using solid state components, or any indication of it progressing toward that really. It'll be digital before it's solid state.



If you’re talking about preamps the technology is already there for digital, tube, and solidstate. There are phenomenal sounding SS preamp pedals out there.

An SS poweramp that rivals a Fryette has yet to come to the guitar world but, that doesn’t mean it isn’t a possibility for the future.


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 27, 2018)

icipher said:


> I would love to ditch the head. I hate lugging gear to shows and we play out twice a month or so.
> 
> Whole rig on one board sounds nice, but aren't you forgetting the poweramp?



True i sort of went off track with that. I was trying to answer your question about the point of preamp pedals.

In my mind the point of preamp pedals is to get one more piece of gear off of the rack/cab and onto the board. Right now it’s just preamps but, i really do think it will soon be poweramps too.


----------



## lewis (Jul 27, 2018)

Hahaha so precious


----------



## wlfers (Jul 27, 2018)

icipher said:


> I still don't really understand the point of this pedal. Everybody and their grandmothers have high gain amps or digital rigs nowadays.



I've been looking for a pedal as a portable live backup. I run a rack, and if my preamp dies mid-set, I'd rather quickly grab a familiar preamp already dialed in from my bag and run it into my power amp, than see whose amp I can borrow and dial on the spot.

I'm not interested in this specific pedal, just giving a reason why someone with a powerful rig might want a portable, relatively inexpensive pedal. Even if it doesn't sound as good as your head/rack.


----------



## TheTrooper (Jul 27, 2018)

Guys, do You know that YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT if You don't want to/don't like it, right?

A Charvel San Dimas is Identical to a Dinky, to a HH Strat and any other Superstrat on the market, basically.
Does it mean they will stop making them because of that?
I don't think so.
Neither will MXR/Horizon Devices.


----------



## narad (Jul 27, 2018)

kindsage said:


> If you’re talking about preamps the technology is already there for digital, tube, and solidstate. There are phenomenal sounding SS preamp pedals out there.
> 
> An SS poweramp that rivals a Fryette has yet to come to the guitar world but, that doesn’t mean it isn’t a possibility for the future.


----------



## bulb (Jul 27, 2018)

TheTrooper said:


> Guys, do You know that YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT if You don't want to/don't like it, right?



STOP TALKING NONSENSE!! 

Guys, don’t listen to him, he’s wrong. You DO have to buy it. Preorder it just to be safe, especially if you aren’t interested in it. That’s the rule, and you know it. If we don’t stick to the rules then we just have chaos. Let’s not have chaos, please!


----------



## Seabeast2000 (Jul 27, 2018)

Can always wait for the Joyo JHAFWI clone for $37.


----------



## FitRocker33 (Jul 27, 2018)

I’m not going to buy it. IM going to steal it by shoving it down my pants and creating a diversion by running out of the store yelling “ICARUS LIVES!!!”

They’ll just think I’m on some pot gummies or something and write me off


----------



## bulb (Jul 27, 2018)

FitRocker33 said:


> I’m not going to buy it. IM going to steal it by shoving it down my pants and creating a diversion by running out of the store yelling “ICARUS LIVES!!!”
> 
> They’ll just think I’m on some pot gummies or something and write me off



If that actually works, you will have earned it!


----------



## FitRocker33 (Jul 27, 2018)

Yup and it takes the party in my pants to a whole ‘Notha level


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 27, 2018)

icipher said:


> I still don't really understand the point of this pedal. Everybody and their grandmothers have high gain amps or digital rigs nowadays.
> 
> I have a KSR Orthos. Why would I want this pedal to a part of my signal chain when my amp is already the epitome of amazing high gain tone? I already have the Precision Drive and Fortin 33.
> 
> I am genuinely curious what the point of this pedal is. The only thing I can come away with is that it'd be helpful to take a fender or marshall into modern high gain territory. The problem with that is those people aren't really interested in the Misha tone anyways or they would have bought an amp more in line with that sound.



More & more people are wanting a 'backup' in case their amp conks out before or during a gig, so rather than have a "modeller" like a Zoom or Boss type thing, people have been getting "pre amp" pedals like the AMT Legend II pedals or something similar that's small, easy to carry and can sound decent running directly into a sound board and sound really pretty decent. That and even at home recording directly into an interface with one of these is a lot easier than setting up an amp & cab, getting the mic just right, etc.. Especially if noise is an issue with neighbors or others in the house where cranking an amp isn't an option.


----------



## bulb (Jul 27, 2018)

I hope the pedal does well, I’m obviously super stoked with it and getting props from Ola made me really happy.

I’d like to think that most people here would hope the pedal does well! If that’s you, then thanks! Wish us luck haha!

I might be wrong but I do get the sense a couple people here are really hoping this pedal ends up being a complete failure, those people are weird. I hope those guys eventually find healthier ways to sleep at night.


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 27, 2018)

bulb said:


> I hope the pedal does well, I’m obviously super stoked with it and getting props from Ola made me really happy.
> 
> I’d like to think that most people here would hope the pedal does well! If that’s you, then thanks! Wish us luck haha!
> 
> I might be wrong but I do get the sense a couple people here are really hoping this pedal ends up being a complete failure, those people are weird. I hope those guys eventually find healthier ways to sleep at night.



It'll be interesting to hear a few more demos (Pete Thorn, Fluff, etc..) to really see what other people can get out of it. Personally, I'd be very interested in picking one up if it wasn't for the fact that in CDN money, it'll be well over $450 after taxes and that's pretty pricey for a single drive pedal. 

Overall though, given the success of the Precision Drive, I think this one will do just as well. It'll just take a few more demo videos to really give people a good idea of what kind of range the pedal has. It worked for the Friedman BE-OD (people were drooling over that one once the demos started coming out) as well as the new Revv G3. Just have some patience and soon enough, they'll be selling pretty quick.


----------



## Vyn (Jul 27, 2018)

There's a few situations I can see this being useful:

- Recording/demoing on the road. This and a 2i2 = win. Advantage over plugins is that you're not sucking as much processing power/battery which on the road with a laptop is a thing.

- Rehearsal spaces. For example, where I live there are plenty of rehearsal spaces available for $$ per hour/two hour slot, however they mostly cater towards blues/jazz/coverbands so you've got mainly clean amps, possibly something British-crunchy but mostly non-high gain amps available. Something like the Apex/-insert pre-amp pedal here- means you can have a decent rehearsal tone out of the venue's VOX without having to cart a whole rig around.

- Actual live rig. This, a PD (or other boost/OD), a powerstage and you have a metal rhythm rig that fits on a Pedaltrain Nano. I have no idea how that would sound but in a shitty venue with a terrible sound guy and a half tanked audience I don't think anyone is going to notice that you're not playing through a 120w tube head.


----------



## oracles (Jul 28, 2018)

Spinedriver said:


> It'll be interesting to hear a few more demos (*Fluff*)



Fluff pedal demos, and just his demos in general are about the worst way I can think of to get an accurate feel or understanding of what a product actually sounds like. His PD demo was nothing short of appalling, and his fuzz pedal demos are somehow, even worse.


----------



## Soya (Jul 28, 2018)

oracles said:


> Fluff pedal demos, and just his demos in general are about the worst way I can think of to get an accurate feel or understanding of what a product actually sounds like. His PD demo was nothing short of appalling, and his fuzz pedal demos are somehow, even worse.



This is correct.


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jul 28, 2018)

brett kingman or andy from proguitarshop/reverb do some of the best pedal demos around imo.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> STOP TALKING NONSENSE!!
> 
> Guys, don’t listen to him, he’s wrong. You DO have to buy it. Preorder it just to be safe, especially if you aren’t interested in it. That’s the rule, and you know it. If we don’t stick to the rules then we just have chaos. Let’s not have chaos, please!


Sounds like dialog from an Italian horror film.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 28, 2018)

FitRocker33 said:


> Yup and it takes the party in my pants to a whole ‘Notha level


It's the apex of party in the pants parties.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> I hope the pedal does well, I’m obviously super stoked with it and getting props from Ola made me really happy.
> 
> I’d like to think that most people here would hope the pedal does well! If that’s you, then thanks! Wish us luck haha!
> 
> I might be wrong but I do get the sense a couple people here are really hoping this pedal ends up being a complete failure, those people are weird. I hope those guys eventually find healthier ways to sleep at night.


I don't hope it's a failure, but Ola's demo sounded like scratching a windbreaker or something. Then again, as I pointed out, that is the case with that last couple demos of his that I've checked out.


----------



## narad (Jul 28, 2018)

Vyn said:


> There's a few situations I can see this being useful:
> 
> - Recording/demoing on the road. This and a 2i2 = win. Advantage over plugins is that you're not sucking as much processing power/battery which on the road with a laptop is a thing.
> 
> ...



Seems like a stretch. I think the best use is probably the same as any other preamp pedal: you're on a budget, you have an amp already, but it's a Fender or it's some other very non-5150 style of distortion, and you just want a different option. Is that not the main reason people buy preamp pedals, and have bought preamp pedals for more than a decade?


----------



## mikah912 (Jul 28, 2018)

I think a demo that really delves into the effectiveness of the onboard gate and the "sweep" of the cab sim sounding good would change the conversation for the better. At the very least, it'd counter the "rebadge" narrative. 

I definitely don't "hope" it will fail, and I think Horizon Devices - as a brand - will prosper in any case. The buzz they garner is something lots of brands would kill to have. I anticipate just as robust a debate once that Toneforge Misha Mansoor plug-in drops....


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 28, 2018)

oracles said:


> Fluff pedal demos, and just his demos in general are about the worst way I can think of to get an accurate feel or understanding of what a product actually sounds like. His PD demo was nothing short of appalling, and his fuzz pedal demos are somehow, even worse.



To be honest, aside from Pete, Brett & Ola, he was the only other name I could think of off the top of my head that regularly does "high gain" demos (for better or for worse). lol


----------



## bulb (Jul 28, 2018)

Spinedriver said:


> To be honest, aside from Pete, Brett & Ola, he was the only other name I could think of off the top of my head that regularly does "high gain" demos (for better or for worse). lol



Other than Rabea and Keith, who else is there?


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 28, 2018)

Unpopular opinion but I dig agufish and arnoldplaysguitar.


----------



## cmtd (Jul 28, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Unpopular opinion but I dig agufish and arnoldplaysguitar.



I’d like to see Arnold’s take on it as well. Enjoy his content


----------



## bulb (Jul 28, 2018)

Not familiar with either, why is it an unpopular opinion? Are they controversial?


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jul 28, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Unpopular opinion but I dig agufish and arnoldplaysguitar.


I like arnold, but his tones are fucking atrocious a lot of times.


----------



## lurè (Jul 28, 2018)

He's obsessed with fretwork so you should be fine with a pedal.


----------



## lurgar (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> Not familiar with either, why is it an unpopular opinion? Are they controversial?



Arnold can have some interesting takes on guitars, but he nitpicks everything to a huge degree. I'm honestly surprised he's ever happy with anything. And I really don't like his tone most of the time, but that's not a dealbreaker.


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Jul 28, 2018)

The Apex sounds great but when he hooked up the Precision with it I was blown away.

So awesome on so many levels.


----------



## mikah912 (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> Other than Rabea and Keith, who else is there?



Any particular reason YOU haven't, Misha? (Other than lack of available time....). Your Fractal cab demos were pretty thorough.


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> Other than Rabea and Keith, who else is there?



Exactly. I mean, there are a lot of other reviewers but they either don't do much (if any) high gain stuff (That Pedal Show, Gearmandude, etc..) or they just demo things they've bought. That being said, the Precision Drive has tons of different demos so I'm sure that the Apex will have a pretty decent sampling as well after it gets released.


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Jul 28, 2018)

icipher said:


> I still don't really understand the point of this pedal.
> 
> Why would I want this pedal to a part of my signal chain when my amp is already the epitome of amazing high gain tone?
> 
> I already have the Precision Drive.



Chopped up and replied.

Not everyone has a $2,500 amp.

Do you gig? What if your amp breaks down mid set?

You already have the PD, great. Did you hear how amazing this worked with the PD?


TBH I had no desire to buy the PD. I didn't need one and while I know its not strictly a "Djent" pedal, thats the impression I got and that isnt my thing.

I dont NEED a Preamp pedal either but after seeing Ola's demo I now want both the PD and the Apex.


----------



## bulb (Jul 28, 2018)

We are live for preorders!!
www.horizondevices.com

Orders are coming in a lot faster than we anticipated!! Thanks so much for your support guys, and I really do hope you love the pedal, I think it sounds so damn good haha!

Also this pedal was designed to not need a boost in front of it, but when I tested it with the PD in front it went into crazy dj0nt territory, which is kinda sweet if that’s your thing!


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> Not familiar with either, why is it an unpopular opinion? Are they controversial?



I've seen a couple of people here that aren't big fans of either, for whatever reason (especially Agufish). But I dig them because they both tend to be honest and get down to the nitty gritty, especially Arnold.


----------



## frogman81 (Jul 28, 2018)

This pedal is pretty tempting. I missed the memo that preamp pedals existed at all and that people are taking their tones seriously/potentially “recording-quality”. I love the simple all-in-one idea as I’m not a knob-tweaker, and unfortunately can’t blast a dual rec in the basement. My question is: is this the first quality preamp pedal with a built-in cab sim, or is there competition that I should consider??


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jul 28, 2018)

I quite like Agufish. I also like Robert Baker. He’s not as big a gear demo’er but I like his stuff. Definitely more of an 80’s lean though.


----------



## btbg (Jul 28, 2018)

frogman81 said:


> This pedal is pretty tempting. I missed the memo that preamp pedals existed at all and that people are taking their tones seriously/potentially “recording-quality”. I love the simple all-in-one idea as I’m not a knob-tweaker, and unfortunately can’t blast a dual rec in the basement. My question is: is this the first quality preamp pedal with a built-in cab sim, or is there competition that I should consider??



Any of the amt legend series pedals which have cab sim, kartakou beast box, Airis has a couple of preamp pedals coming out, there’s the amptweaker tight metal.. nothing new.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 28, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> I quite like Agufish. I also like Robert Baker. He’s not as big a gear demo’er but I like his stuff. Definitely more of an 80’s lean though.


Robert Baker is cool. I like his instructional vids mostly.


----------



## Beheroth (Jul 28, 2018)

bulb said:


> Other than Rabea and Keith, who else is there?



MrExcane and Dennis Kayzer both get pretty nasty


----------



## frogman81 (Jul 28, 2018)

frogman81 said:


> This pedal is pretty tempting. I missed the memo that preamp pedals existed at all and that people are taking their tones seriously/potentially “recording-quality”. I love the simple all-in-one idea as I’m not a knob-tweaker, and unfortunately can’t blast a dual rec in the basement. My question is: is this the first quality preamp pedal with a built-in cab sim, or is there competition that I should consider??



Disregard. I read up on it a bit today. Found the Mooer preamp pedals etc.. Ordered the Apex


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 28, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> MrExcane and Dennis Kayzer both get pretty nasty



Excane does do some pretty badass demos but they've mostly been Darkglass & more 'boutique' pedals. I'd be awesome of he did one for the Apex but I think it might be a longshot.


----------



## Spinedriver (Jul 28, 2018)

btbg said:


> Any of the amt legend series pedals which have cab sim, kartakou beast box, Airis has a couple of preamp pedals coming out, there’s the amptweaker tight metal.. nothing new.



Tech21 has been making them for years. Granted, they aren't as high gain as this one but they very much do have a 'speaker sim' output. There's the US Steel pedal, the GT2 and the current Fly Rig pedals can go either direct or into the front of an amp.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jul 28, 2018)

Not sure I need it, but I ordered one anyway. Guess I’ll have to compare it with the Invective lol. And a few other pedals.


----------



## narad (Jul 29, 2018)

frogman81 said:


> This pedal is pretty tempting. I missed the memo that preamp pedals existed at all



They are sometimes referred to as..."distortion pedals"


----------



## mniel8195 (Jul 29, 2018)

Does this pedal have power amp simulation when going direct? When I have used my Be od into torpedo wall of sound or cab it sounded better with the power amp sims on. Wondering how they get around this for direct recording.


----------



## bulb (Jul 29, 2018)

mniel8195 said:


> Does this pedal have power amp simulation when going direct? When I have used my Be od into torpedo wall of sound or cab it sounded better with the power amp sims on. Wondering how they get around this for direct recording.



It doesn't have poweramp simulation because that's kind of a weird one. Most of the time "poweramp simulation" is effectively just another eq curve, makes sense when you have just an IR like the Torpedo, but when it's a single contained sound it's less necessary. Hope that makes sense.


----------



## bulb (Jul 29, 2018)

frogman81 said:


> Disregard. I read up on it a bit today. Found the Mooer preamp pedals etc.. Ordered the Apex


Hell yeah! Thanks for the support dude, and I hope you love it!


----------



## Ziricote (Jul 29, 2018)

Why is everyone doing this "crowdfunding" type purchase "pre-order pay in full" pay in full many months before receiving this product when they can just wait for product to be in-stock?


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jul 29, 2018)

Ziricote said:


> Why is everyone doing this "crowdfunding" type purchase "pre-order pay in full" pay in full many months before receiving this product when they can just wait for product to be in-stock?



I don’t have time for patience.


----------



## SnowfaLL (Jul 29, 2018)

wonder how it'd sound into the Boss Katana?? hmm.. I'm tempted, gotta admit. Mainly for that gate and the "simpleness" of it all. Might be badass to pair with the Katana for its pretty amazing cleans at under $500. Gig-ready rig under $700? Yea.


----------



## narad (Jul 29, 2018)

Ziricote said:


> Why is everyone doing this "crowdfunding" type purchase "pre-order pay in full" pay in full many months before receiving this product when they can just wait for product to be in-stock?



To save $30.


----------



## bulb (Jul 29, 2018)

Ziricote said:


> Why is everyone doing this "crowdfunding" type purchase "pre-order pay in full" pay in full many months before receiving this product when they can just wait for product to be in-stock?



1. For the same reason people tend to preorder most things, this isn’t unique in that respect. Lots of companies offer their products for preorder, and I happily preorder things all the time.

2. The Precision Drive was out of stock for a while when it launched post preorder, so people who preordered secured theirs, and this will guarantee you get yours when it launches and not have to wait.

3. You will also save 30 bucks. I know I love to save money when I buy things.


----------



## bulb (Jul 29, 2018)

Ziricote said:


> Why is everyone doing this "crowdfunding" type purchase "pre-order pay in full" pay in full many months before receiving this product when they can just wait for product to be in-stock?



1. For the same reason people tend to preorder most things, this isn’t unique in that respect. Lots of companies offer their products for preorder, and I happily preorder things all the time.

2. The Precision Drive was out of stock for a while when it launched post preorder, so people who preordered secured theirs, and this will guarantee you get yours when it launches and not have to wait.

3. You will also save 30 bucks. I know I love to save money when I buy things.


----------



## rexbinary (Jul 29, 2018)




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## Deadpool_25 (Jul 29, 2018)

Man Keith’s playing is always cool but I’m always impressed with his video quality too. And I like what I’m hearing from the pedal so far. Glad I preordered. No room on the board for it though...hmmm


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 29, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Man Keith’s playing is always cool but I’m always impressed with his video quality too. And I like what I’m hearing from the pedal so far. Glad I preordered. No room on the board for it though...hmmm



Time for a bigger board


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jul 29, 2018)

kindsage said:


> Time for a bigger board



You shut your face.


----------



## Vyn (Jul 30, 2018)

rexbinary said:


>




Well that answers the powerstage 170 question. Holy smokes that sounded good!


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 30, 2018)

Vyn said:


> Well that answers the powerstage 170 question. Holy smokes that sounded good!


Right? Very interested in the PowerStage now


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jul 30, 2018)

The dog wanted pets and he just ignores it? Pft! Screw Keith. 

I think Misha needs to include a "the pedal pets the doggo" option so this doesn't happen in the future. (it does sound better than Ola's demo though)


----------



## Ziricote (Jul 30, 2018)

bulb said:


> 1. For the same reason people tend to preorder most things, this isn’t unique in that respect. Lots of companies offer their products for preorder, and I happily preorder things all the time.
> 
> 2. The Precision Drive was out of stock for a while when it launched post preorder, so people who preordered secured theirs, and this will guarantee you get yours when it launches and not have to wait.
> 
> 3. You will also save 30 bucks. I know I love to save money when I buy things.



I thought the $30.00 saved is only for the first 500 units, but I see people posting that they confirm they are order number 1200 etc? If I order this today then I will save the $30?


----------



## bulb (Jul 30, 2018)

Nah 299 is the preorder price! Also the order number is just a general number, not related to your Apex order.


----------



## mikah912 (Jul 30, 2018)

bulb said:


> Nah 299 is the preorder price! Also the order number is just a general number, not related to your Apex order.



Slightly off-topic, but will we see any demo videos of the Toneforge plugin? I'm interested in a preorder, but the lack of content + the "no demo" policy is making it a mighty leap of faith.


----------



## Shoeless_jose (Jul 30, 2018)

Kind of curious to try something like this into my JCM 900 just running the amp clean


----------



## icipher (Jul 30, 2018)

kindsage said:


> Right? Very interested in the PowerStage now



It is intriguing, but if we're ditching our heads, what do we do about delays we'd normally run in the FX loop?


----------



## Bearitone (Jul 30, 2018)

icipher said:


> It is intriguing, but if we're ditching our heads, what do we do about delays we'd normally run in the FX loop?



You put them in between the preamp and poweramp


----------



## icipher (Jul 30, 2018)

kindsage said:


> You put them in between the preamp and poweramp



Ah, I didn't know it was that simple. Cool!


----------



## wakjob (Jul 30, 2018)

icipher said:


> Ah, I didn't know it was that simple. Cool!



That's where it's located within an amps circuit too.
Just a little fyi.


----------



## feraledge (Jul 31, 2018)

Keith's demo is great, but the only excuse I would have had for buying a preamp pedal is if it would be an easier/cheaper solution than buying a Torpedo Captor to record my actual head with. The raw tracks directly into the interface answer my question: Captor. 
I do think this sounds pretty solid, but under just about every scenario, I don't see me ever going preamp. In which case, I'm not the target audience. Still tempted by that PD though.


----------



## R34CH (Jul 31, 2018)

Eff, that Merrow track was a banger.


----------



## goobaba (Jul 31, 2018)

This looks awesome, but I can't wait that longggggggg


----------



## Kyle Jordan (Jul 31, 2018)

Gotta admit, the Merrow demo sounded really damn good.


----------



## I play music (Jul 31, 2018)

Kyle Jordan said:


> Gotta admit, the Merrow demo sounded really damn good.


I somehow agree, but listen to his other videos, they sound even significantly better if you ask me.


----------



## Vyn (Jul 31, 2018)

I play music said:


> I somehow agree, but listen to his other videos, they sound even significantly better if you ask me.



They are, but there's also significantly more money in the other videos. $300 pedal + $300 power amp VS however much x boutique amp/kemper costs.


----------



## I play music (Aug 1, 2018)

Vyn said:


> They are, but there's also significantly more money in the other videos. $300 pedal + $300 power amp VS however much x boutique amp/kemper costs.


You are right but for me it also showed that the pedal does not offer anything that I cannot already have from for example the AMT preamps that cost only about half as much, even less if bought used. And since these have been around for years it should not be too difficult to find used ones. 
A better cab sim would have been a convincing point for the Apex preamp but like pretty much all analog cab sims I think it does not sound good from the videos I've seen (Ola and Keith). Something with IRs like the newer Darkglass Ultra pedals but for guitar could have been great. But they didn't do this and that's why I don't see how this brings anything better to the table than the many other options already out there. 
But I'm sure it sells well because Misha has enough fan boys buying it, so he probably doesn't care if it's any better as long as he can earn money with it


----------



## Taikatatti (Aug 1, 2018)

Preordered. Looking to sell my kemper and setting up a small pedalrig with this, powerstage 170 and a wireless. XLR out would have been a nice touch, maybe on the apex v2? 

Anyway gj Misha!


----------



## LeviathanKiller (Aug 1, 2018)

With Misha being someone who has had custom IR packs produced and released (for Axe-Fx via ML Sound Lab) you would have thought they would've really knocked the cab sim through the roof by doing _something_, anything other than the generic cab sim. A missed opportunity sadly imo


----------



## mikah912 (Aug 1, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> With Misha being someone who has had custom IR packs produced and released (for Axe-Fx via ML Sound Lab) you would have thought they would've really knocked the cab sim through the roof by doing _something_, anything other than the generic cab sim. A missed opportunity sadly imo



To be fair, that may not have been an option from the MXR base parts he had available to him in design. There are pedals now that do IR loading in concert with preamps (e.g. Atomic Amps Amplifirebox), but that's a different architecture (amp modeling) and would likely require WAY more R&D than was done here.


----------



## I play music (Aug 1, 2018)

mikah912 said:


> To be fair, that may not have been an option from the MXR base parts he had available to him in design. There are pedals now that do IR loading in concert with preamps (e.g. Atomic Amps Amplifirebox), but that's a different architecture (amp modeling) and would likely require WAY more R&D than was done here.


That's exactly why I from a customer side don't get the purpose of this product. It's sold as some super innovative product when it's actually just already existing "MXR base parts" as you say. I'm actually really surprised how this sells without bringing anything new to the table. Appears like marketing is more important than actual innovation.


----------



## mikah912 (Aug 1, 2018)

I play music said:


> That's exactly why I from a customer side don't get the purpose of this product. It's sold as some super innovative product when it's actually just already existing "MXR base parts" as you say. I'm actually really surprised how this sells without bringing anything new to the table. Appears like marketing is more important than actual innovation.



I don't know about that. It's not for me at all, mind you, but I see it as a perfect analogue to the Peavey Invective (and really Misha's philosophy to gear, in general). Instead of re-inventing the wheel, he takes an established standard everyone loves (the 5150), adds modern tweaks for functionality (slightly tweaking the preamp, adding a configurable gate and a cab sim...for emergencies, I guess) and rebadges it with his brand's aesthetic. 

So it's modern metal tone in an easy-to-use analog box with extra features that plays well with existing analog gear. Innovative? No. But it's a fresh choice in a market where there aren't a ton of choices with those features already. If you'd only use the preamp portion, by all means get a MXR EVH 5150 pedal. But if you DO want the gate and the option to have a backup emergency cab sim....you probably won't get it elsewhere for $300. Certainly not in a single pedal.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Aug 1, 2018)

Vyn said:


> They are, but there's also significantly more money in the other videos. $300 pedal + $300 power amp VS however much x boutique amp/kemper costs.


I wish the power amp was only $300.


----------



## oracles (Aug 1, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> With Misha being someone who has had custom IR packs produced and released (for Axe-Fx via ML Sound Lab) you would have thought they would've really knocked the cab sim through the roof by doing _something_, anything other than the generic cab sim. A missed opportunity sadly imo



Adding the ability to load IRs to the pedal would've created a significant price increase, which defeats the primary focus of what they were going for here, which is an affordable preamp pedal. If the demand is there, I'm sure Misha and Horizon would be open to exploring adding the ability to use his IRs with the pedal, but the result of what this pedal ultimately is, is feedback from the intended userbase through surveys, open polling etc in the Horizon group. Say what you want about the pedal itself, but Horizon is a brand that does actually listen to and engage with their user base. 

The pedal is of no use and no interest to me, but some of the vitriol here just seems like complaining for complaining's sake, or looking for reasons not to like it because of someone's personal feelings towards Misha/Horizon. 

For what the pedal is and what it's designed to do, I think it's a viable option, and clearly the preorder purchase numbers reflect that. I have no stock in the pedal or the brand, like I said, I have no interest or intent to purchase one whatsoever, but I think some of the expectations people have for a $300 pedal are a little unrealistic.


----------



## I play music (Aug 1, 2018)

mikah912 said:


> There are pedals now that do IR loading in concert with preamps (e.g. Atomic Amps Amplifirebox





mikah912 said:


> But if you DO want the gate and the option to have a backup emergency cab sim....you probably won't get it elsewhere for $300. Certainly not in a single pedal.



Atomic Amplifirebox is 299$, it has a gate, a GOOD cab sim and even additional effects.


----------



## mikah912 (Aug 1, 2018)

I play music said:


> Atomic Amplifirebox is 299$, it has a gate, a GOOD cab sim and even additional effects.



It's also a digital modeler, which is immediately disqualifying to some, and the gate is simply not comparable to what I've read and heard regarding the Apex.

Very cool product in its own right, but it's different.


----------



## Bearitone (Aug 1, 2018)

mikah912 said:


> I don't know about that. It's not for me at all, mind you, but I see it as a perfect analogue to the Peavey Invective (and really Misha's philosophy to gear, in general). Instead of re-inventing the wheel, he takes an established standard everyone loves (the 5150), adds modern tweaks for functionality (slightly tweaking the preamp, adding a configurable gate and a cab sim...for emergencies, I guess) and rebadges it with his brand's aesthetic.
> 
> So it's modern metal tone in an easy-to-use analog box with extra features that plays well with existing analog gear. Innovative? No. But it's a fresh choice in a market where there aren't a ton of choices with those features already. If you'd only use the preamp portion, by all means get a MXR EVH 5150 pedal. But if you DO want the gate and the option to have a backup emergency cab sim....you probably won't get it elsewhere for $300. Certainly not in a single pedal.



I don’t know about that last part. Considering just the preamp portion i definitely hear a difference between this and the 5150 pedal. While the preamp portions sound similar i don’t think one is a substitute for the other


----------



## mikah912 (Aug 1, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I don’t know about that last part. Considering just the preamp portion i definitely hear a difference between this and the 5150 pedal. While the preamp portions sound similar i don’t think one is a substitute for the other



I'm sure he tweaked the voicing, but I think my point was moreso about not paying the extra $100-$150 if you don't want the extra features....just settle with something similar for less. If you do want them, however.....pretty darn good value.


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 1, 2018)

oracles said:


> Say what you want about the pedal itself, but Horizon is a brand that does actually listen to and engage with their user base.



Which IMO is very bit of equal to if not more important than the actual product. I thought the pedal sounded great. I did not look too much into the details of the cab sim since I have many other things to square away before I would be able to buy an Apex (plus I had a different preamp in mind) but the fact that they engage with their customers/fans is something that will keep them relevant in this business for a long time.


----------



## Sogradde (Aug 1, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> With Misha being someone who has had custom IR packs produced and released (for Axe-Fx via ML Sound Lab) you would have thought they would've really knocked the cab sim through the roof by doing _something_, anything other than the generic cab sim. A missed opportunity sadly imo


Im with you on this one. If it came with an optional IR loader it would be a 10/10. But maybe he'll release a satin coated IR loader with input and output gates? Lol.
(No hard feelings @bulb , you're still a cool dude in my book)


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Aug 1, 2018)

I hope somebody tests this against a Revv G3 and a Tightmetal Pro.


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 1, 2018)

MASS DEFECT said:


> I hope somebody tests this against a Revv G3 and a Tightmetal Pro.


Only have videos online to compare but from what I have heard and for my tastes, the Revv cannot be touched.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Aug 1, 2018)

yeah. the revv got that juicy sag.


----------



## Bearitone (Aug 1, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Only have videos online to compare but from what I have heard and for my tastes, the Revv cannot be touched.


I think @Deadpool_25 got one and an AMT R2 and preferred the R2. The Revv may be able to be touched


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 1, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I think @Deadpool_25 got one and an AMT R2 and preferred the R2. The Revv may be able to be touched


Haven't played either but to me the Revv sounded way better in any videos that I saw. R2 seemed pretty fizzy on the top end and I just prefer the tone of the G3 over any pedal I have ever heard.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 1, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Haven't played either but to me the Revv sounded way better in any videos that I saw. R2 seemed pretty fizzy on the top end and I just prefer the tone of the G3 over any pedal I have ever heard.



I didn't find the R2 fizzy.

Sure, if you use the built-in cab sim it'll sound like fizzy ass, but compared to something like the P2 it's a bit darker. Sounds much better as a preamp running into a power amp + cab, or with impulses.

I actually preferred the R2 over the 3-ch Triple Recto I had because it wasn't as fizzy, scooped, and muddy.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 1, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I think @Deadpool_25 got one and an AMT R2 and preferred the R2. The Revv may be able to be touched





Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Haven't played either but to me the Revv sounded way better in any videos that I saw. R2 seemed pretty fizzy on the top end and I just prefer the tone of the G3 over any pedal I have ever heard.



Yeah I did prefer the R2. The G3 is really good though and is definitely deserving of a tryout. The R2 can get fizzy if you get the highs up...like a real Rectifier lol. The G3 can do that too though. Both have powerful EQs.

And...FWIW, I’m probably going to sell the G3. The three AMT pedals plus the BE-OD (and the incoming Apex!) are plenty for me (might even end up selling the BE-OD).

And sorry for temporary derail! Back to the APEX!


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 1, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Yeah I did prefer the R2. The G3 is really good though and is definitely deserving of a tryout. The R2 can get fizzy if you get the highs up...like a real Rectifier lol. The G3 can do that too though. Both have powerful EQs.
> 
> And...FWIW, I’m probably going to sell the G3. The three AMT pedals plus the BE-OD (and the incoming Apex!) are plenty for me (might even end up selling the BE-OD).
> 
> And sorry for temporary derail! Back to the APEX!


Yeah I guess youtube can go either way.

Isn't the BE more like a low gain OD though? Like nowhere near enough gain to use on its own? That is the impression I got.

I have the Buxom Boost but have yet to try the BE-OD


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 1, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Yeah I guess youtube can go either way.
> 
> Isn't the BE more like a low gain OD though? Like nowhere near enough gain to use on its own? That is the impression I got.
> 
> I have the Buxom Boost but have yet to try the BE-OD



If the BE-OD is anything like the real thing... trust me, you will never run out of gain. 

The Dirty Shirley is meant to be their low-gain overdrive, I'd imagine. But the BE-OD has a shiiit-ton of gain.

Go to 1:26 in this video and see how low he has the gain set.


----------



## Bearitone (Aug 1, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Yeah I guess youtube can go either way.
> 
> Isn't the BE more like a low gain OD though? Like nowhere near enough gain to use on its own? That is the impression I got.
> 
> I have the Buxom Boost but have yet to try the BE-OD


How do you like the buxom?


----------



## Spinedriver (Aug 1, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Yeah I guess youtube can go either way.
> 
> Isn't the BE more like a low gain OD though? Like nowhere near enough gain to use on its own? That is the impression I got.
> 
> I have the Buxom Boost but have yet to try the BE-OD



From the demos I've seen, the BE-OD has just as much (if not more) gain than the MXR 5150 if that tells you anything. That and there's an internal trim pot on the BE-OD that allows you to either add or dial back the gain & most demos are with the gain at noon, so there's even more on tap than what they are using.


----------



## narad (Aug 1, 2018)

oracles said:


> For what the pedal is and what it's designed to do, I think it's a viable option, and clearly the preorder purchase numbers reflect that. I have no stock in the pedal or the brand, like I said, I have no interest or intent to purchase one whatsoever, but I think some of the expectations people have for a $300 pedal are a little unrealistic.



Yea, I actually liked the sound of it in pretty much every demo, and think the preamp+gate idea is pretty good if you don't already have one. But some of the comments on here are really baffling. 

Among many demographics this appeals to, this also seems like it's a hit with people who don't own any pedals or know anything about pedals at all. I would have expected guys to be like, "Yes! A good guitar preamp with gate and IR, cool!" but instead they're like, "Wow! Preamps are in pedals now!? Deposit sent!"


----------



## I play music (Aug 2, 2018)

narad said:


> I would have expected guys to be like, "Yes! A good guitar preamp with gate and IR, cool!"


IR would be cool, but this preamp pedal does not have it 


narad said:


> but instead they're like, "Wow! Preamps are in pedals now!? Deposit sent!"


Yep. This.


----------



## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

I play music said:


> IR would be cool, but this preamp pedal does not have it
> 
> Yep. This.



It has an IR, but not a loader


----------



## Beheroth (Aug 2, 2018)

narad said:


> It has an IR, but not a loader








it's analog
proof from the horizon faq :
*Can I load my own cabinet IR?*
The Apex’s cabinet simulator is analog and built-in, meaning you can’t change the impulse response. However, you can easily disable the cab sim by turning the knob to the left and use the Apex with your favorite 3rd party IR’s. 

also this is interesting :
*What is the Cab sim modelled after?*
The Apex’s analog cabinet simulator is modelled after a modern 4x12 loaded with V30 speakers.


----------



## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> it's analog
> proof from the horizon faq :
> *
> Can I load my own cabinet IR?*
> ...



Oh, lame.


----------



## mikah912 (Aug 2, 2018)

narad said:


> Oh, lame.



You can't run an IR at full resolution in a pedal without some sort of processer power behind it to make sure you can play it with no discernable latency. That would take the already crazy wiring inside to a new level and make it a completely different product.

Amplifirebox can do that because it's already a modeler running on a SoC (system on a chip). This is an analog pedal. Making it anything but that would require firmware programming and a whole bunch of other stuff. In short, this would become the Toneforge Misha Mansoor plug-in shoved into a small pedal enclosure.

Which would be awesome, actually, but probably not on their product map anytime soon.


----------



## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

mikah912 said:


> You can't run an IR at full resolution in a pedal without some sort of processer power behind it to make sure you can play it with no discernable latency. That would take the already crazy wiring inside to a new level and make it a completely different product.
> 
> Amplifirebox can do that because it's already a modeler running on a SoC (system on a chip). This is an analog pedal. Making it anything but that would require firmware programming and a whole bunch of other stuff. In short, this would become the Toneforge Misha Mansoor plug-in shoved into a small pedal enclosure.
> 
> Which would be awesome, actually, but probably not on their product map anytime soon.



Just saying that analog cab sims aren't...on _my_ product map anytime soon.


----------



## Vyn (Aug 2, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> also this is interesting :
> *What is the Cab sim modelled after?*
> The Apex’s analog cabinet simulator is modelled after a modern 4x12 loaded with V30 speakers.



That makes sense when you think about it - V30 loaded 4x12 is a very common and familiar sound in the metal world.


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 2, 2018)

Vyn said:


> That makes sense when you think about it - V30 loaded 4x12 is a very common and familiar sound in the metal world.


Definitely the standard imo.

I guess having an IR loader built in would be a super cool option but not a necessity. The work involved would have probably warranted double the price.


----------



## cmtd (Aug 2, 2018)

Running this into a mooer radar would let you load irs, and be a fairly inexpensive, compact option. 

Saw this in the horizon group. I’m pretty convinced there are a ton of preorders/sales coming from people like this.


----------



## I play music (Aug 2, 2018)

Vyn said:


> That makes sense when you think about it - V30 loaded 4x12 is a very common and familiar sound in the metal world.


Well it's basically just marketing writing saying "We _tried_ to make it sound somehow like a normal cab."


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Aug 2, 2018)

cmtd said:


> Running this into a mooer radar would let you load irs, and be a fairly inexpensive, compact option.
> 
> Saw this in the horizon group. I’m pretty convinced there are a ton of preorders/sales coming from people like this.



oh wow. lol. bro, you got 100+ preamps in the AX8 already.


----------



## Ola Englund (Aug 2, 2018)

lewis said:


> @Ola Englund is it possible to see a follow up to this being used in/with the Satan? and being boosted by a 33 etc


Sorry I already sent the pedal further to another Youtube... things went quick!


----------



## Xaios (Aug 2, 2018)

cmtd said:


> Running this into a mooer radar would let you load irs, and be a fairly inexpensive, compact option.
> 
> Saw this in the horizon group. I’m pretty convinced there are a ton of preorders/sales coming from people like this.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 2, 2018)

I finally listened to that Keith video. That actually sounds real fucking killer. And the cab sim sounds surprisingly decent. I've heard muuuch worse. 

Also, I can understand wanting a Precision Drive into an Axe FX/AX8 (didn't really dig any of the ODs), or having an Apex for an FX8, but this shit?



cmtd said:


>


----------



## Bearitone (Aug 2, 2018)

We were all ignorant of how gear worked when we started playing/getting into gear. This dude just has more money to throw at his hobbies


----------



## Vyn (Aug 2, 2018)

kindsage said:


> We were all ignorant of how gear worked when we started playing/getting into gear. This dude just has more money to throw at his hobbies



Also there's a ton of different ways to going about building a rig now. Until you've tried a modeler vs tubes vs pedals vs plugins vs whatever (and there's >9000 varrients of each now), you're not really know what works for you.


----------



## SnowfaLL (Aug 2, 2018)

I pre-ordered one, I plan on potentially using a rig of a Fryette Power station with a Tech 21 Blonde or something infront of it, with the Apex in between as a high-gain channel.. Should be a pretty awesome little rig with a cabinet. Simple and to the point, getting sick of hours of tweaking my axe-fx.


----------



## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

kindsage said:


> We were all ignorant of how gear worked when we started playing/getting into gear. This dude just has more money to throw at his hobbies



"Has more money" is somehow now a euphemism for having less common sense?


----------



## Bearitone (Aug 2, 2018)

narad said:


> "Has more money" is somehow now a euphemism for having less common sense?


I wasn’t aware preamps were common sense


----------



## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I wasn’t aware preamps were common sense



What's the better boost, my boost or my preamp? Do I need this preamp as a boost into my other preamp, that is literally hundreds of preamps with full parametric EQ and onboard boosts? I searched youtube and no one seems to be doing what I'm suggesting, but I'd rather not read into that.

Dude needs to spend some time just learning how to use what he has. No online community or new pedal is going to fix that.


----------



## lewis (Aug 3, 2018)

Ola Englund said:


> Sorry I already sent the pedal further to another Youtube... things went quick!


Ah thats ok dude. Thanks for replying


----------



## wlfers (Aug 3, 2018)

kindsage said:


> I wasn’t aware preamps were common sense



One might expect someone who is gear whore-y enough to be aware of preorders for the apex, to also maybe know about preamps.

That is, unless the marketing is that superb that it makes AX8 users wonder if they need it.


----------



## Spinedriver (Aug 3, 2018)

narad said:


> What's the better boost, my boost or my preamp? Do I need this preamp as a boost into my other preamp, that is literally hundreds of preamps with full parametric EQ and onboard boosts? I searched youtube and no one seems to be doing what I'm suggesting, but I'd rather not read into that.
> 
> Dude needs to spend some time just learning how to use what he has. No online community or new pedal is going to fix that.



True, but at the same time there are a number of people on here that would recommend using an HM-2 "as a boost" when clearly that's only if you're looking for a very specific kind of tone. For most people, it would be one of the last pedals they'd think of to use as a boost.

I was pretty stupid about pedals & stuff when I first started out but then again, there was also no such thing as internet to look anything up either..  
If the person repeatedly asks 'how do I use this' or ' which one goes before that one', rather than just experimenting & finding out which one _they_ like the sound of best, it's kind of a sign that perhaps they might not be playing for very long.


----------



## Shoeless_jose (Aug 4, 2018)

I understand being a bit in the dark with gear when starting out, but it's not like he has some zoom/digitech multifx and is trying to improve on that, dude already has an AX8 so he clearly intends to be serious about gear.

I'm in no way going after the Periphery guys for this, because good for them for building the loyalty and revenue up, but they seem to have a huge following of people that view the specs on their gear as the only acceptable gear.

I'm happy that they have such a loyal customer base that allows them to put out cool products and make a good living.

Just some of the ignoramus people that buy everything they put out is mind blowing.


----------



## mnemonic (Aug 4, 2018)

You know what they say about a fool and his money.


----------



## narad (Aug 4, 2018)

Spinedriver said:


> True, but at the same time there are a number of people on here that would recommend using an HM-2 "as a boost" when clearly that's only if you're looking for a very specific kind of tone. For most people, it would be one of the last pedals they'd think of to use as a boost.



That's more of a legacy thing though. The HM-2s made sense because it was suitable as a boost for achieving some legendary sounds, just sort of happened to have a good default EQ, and was cheap and readily available. If that's the only sound you care about, it's a smart move. But I feel the better recommendation these days is to just get a nice parametric boost and you have that and a million other options. 

Similar sort of mentality applies here: if you're on the market, i.e. you haven't bought anything yet, get the pedal that's supposed to do the thing you want it to do. Don't ask -- hey, can I get tubescreamer sounds out of a fuzz face? Just get the tubescreamer, etc.


----------



## Spinedriver (Aug 4, 2018)

narad said:


> That's more of a legacy thing though. The HM-2s made sense because it was suitable as a boost for achieving some legendary sounds, just sort of happened to have a good default EQ, and was cheap and readily available. If that's the only sound you care about, it's a smart move. But I feel the better recommendation these days is to just get a nice parametric boost and you have that and a million other options.
> 
> Similar sort of mentality applies here: if you're on the market, i.e. you haven't bought anything yet, get the pedal that's supposed to do the thing you want it to do. Don't ask -- hey, can I get tubescreamer sounds out of a fuzz face? Just get the tubescreamer, etc.



I guess the big question is how 'experienced' is the person who posted the comment ? Back in the day, I figured OD pedals were useless unless you played country or blues because they don't have very much gain to them. It never really occurred to me (or pretty much anyone else I knew at the time) that stacking one with another distortion pedal or gain channel of an amp can produce really good results. That and add to the fact that there are literally hundreds of od/distortion pedals out there now, so it can be sometimes hard to figure out if a certain pedal is an overdrive, (high gain) distortion or fuzz. Some say the DS-1 is a high gain distortion pedal but it's not even in the same ballpark as a Tightmetal or AMT R2.

The only time I start ignoring questions is when they repeatedly ask the same one over & over again even though multiple people have given clear easy to understand answers.


----------



## lurè (Aug 4, 2018)

double post


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Aug 4, 2018)

I have the Helix and PD and pre-ordered the Apex. *Shrug* 

I like options and it's not like it damaged the bank account, so why not?


----------



## bulb (Aug 4, 2018)

IbanezIsLife said:


> I have the Helix and PD and pre-ordered the Apex. *Shrug*
> 
> I like options and it's not like it damaged the bank account, so why not?



I hope you love it!!


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 4, 2018)

Anyone have any experience with the Nux Solid Studio? Seems like it could be a cool option to pair with the Apex (or other) preamp.


----------



## LeviathanKiller (Aug 5, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Anyone have any experience with the Nux Solid Studio? Seems like it could be a cool option to pair with the Apex (or other) preamp.



Why not just use a Mooer Radar instead?


----------



## I play music (Aug 5, 2018)

bulb said:


> I hope you love it!!


I love how this guy always disappears when people here have discussions about technical stuff like if his pedal is basically an MXR 5150 Overdrive or the analog cab sim. But when someone mentions interest in buying one of his products, then he immediately appears out of nowhere. It's almost as comical as the guy wanting to buy a preamp for his AX8 without understanding what it actually does 

Btw Misha why do you not have a vendor account like Balaguer, Sully and the other guys here on this forum selling stuff?


----------



## lewis (Aug 5, 2018)

I play music said:


> I love how this guy always disappears when people here have discussions about technical stuff like if his pedal is basically an MXR 5150 Overdrive or the analog cab sim. But when someone mentions interest in buying one of his products, then he immediately appears out of nowhere. It's almost as comical as the guy wanting to buy a preamp for his AX8 without understanding what it actually does
> 
> Btw Misha why do you not have a vendor account like Balaguer, Sully and the other guys here on this forum selling stuff?


Tbf though, bulb answered in full about the differences between this and the 5150 OD on the live stream where he is demo'ing the APEX


----------



## Vyn (Aug 5, 2018)

lewis said:


> Tbf though, bulb answered in full about the differences between this and the 5150 OD on the live stream where he is demo'ing the APEX



Yeah it was confirmed in the Horizon Devices live stream on launch day. The whole circuit is completely different to the 5150. Interesting comment as well about how the 5150 still needs a boost in front to deal with lower tunings where as the Apex is just plug and play.


----------



## narad (Aug 5, 2018)

Vyn said:


> Yeah it was confirmed in the Horizon Devices live stream on launch day. The whole circuit is completely different to the 5150. Interesting comment as well about how the 5150 still needs a boost in front to deal with lower tunings where as the Apex is just plug and play.



5150 amp needs a boost for lower tunings.
5150 pedal needs a boost for lower tunings.

I mean, completely different? It's a distortion pedal, it's going to have some things in common. I guess I'd like to hear someone post-pedal eq'ing on the 5150 pedal vs. the apex and see how close they come out. Not a dig at the overall concept: if you want an apexy sound out of the box I see on reason not to buy that, for simplicity's sake + the gate. But I think they'd probably come out pretty similar sounding and it would surprise the pedal noobs.


----------



## mnemonic (Aug 5, 2018)

I’d be curious to see the circuit, I’ve seen plenty of pedals and amps with three components changed that were ‘totally different’.

To be fair, changing the right three components, you can totally change the sound. Even just changing pot tapers or values can make people think it’s totally different, given people tend to be allergic to varying too far from noon with their EQ these days.

Not that I would expect Horizon to release a schematic.


----------



## Vyn (Aug 5, 2018)

narad said:


> 5150 amp needs a boost for lower tunings.
> 5150 pedal needs a boost for lower tunings.
> 
> I mean, completely different? It's a distortion pedal, it's going to have some things in common. I guess I'd like to hear someone post-pedal eq'ing on the 5150 pedal vs. the apex and see how close they come out. Not a dig at the overall concept: if you want an apexy sound out of the box I see on reason not to buy that, for simplicity's sake + the gate. But I think they'd probably come out pretty similar sounding and it would surprise the pedal noobs.



I actually have zero experience with the 5150 pedal, was thinking of grabbing a cheap used one to test against the Apex when it arrives.


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Aug 5, 2018)

I play music said:


> I love how this guy always disappears when people here have discussions about technical stuff like if his pedal is basically an MXR 5150 Overdrive or the analog cab sim. But when someone mentions interest in buying one of his products, then he immediately appears out of nowhere. It's almost as comical as the guy wanting to buy a preamp for his AX8 without understanding what it actually does
> 
> Btw Misha why do you not have a vendor account like Balaguer, Sully and the other guys here on this forum selling stuff?



If he responded to every negative thing in this thread, he'd be arguing with random internet people all day. A lot of the stuff you guys are asking about, they already addressed in the live stream.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 5, 2018)

mnemonic said:


> I’d be curious to see the circuit, I’ve seen plenty of pedals and amps with three components changed that were ‘totally different’.
> 
> To be fair, changing the right three components, you can totally change the sound. Even just changing pot tapers or values can make people think it’s totally different, given people tend to be allergic to varying too far from noon with their EQ these days.
> 
> Not that I would expect Horizon to release a schematic.



I think the closest we'll get is a gut shot they posted on Instagram.

Also there's a bit of backstory in the post as well, saying the pedal's actually been in development for awhile now. 

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bls19mBBEGJ/?hl=en&taken-by=horizon_devices


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 5, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> Why not just use a Mooer Radar instead?



Because, options. I’m sure the Mooer is great. Just curious to see if anyone knew about this pedal. /shrug


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 5, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Because, options. I’m sure the Mooer is great. Just curious to see if anyone knew about this pedal. /shrug



I feel like the Mooer Radar is the best bet out of all the recent IR loaders. Small footprint, 3rd party IRs, and has an on-board EQ.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 5, 2018)

Was there actually a livestream about this pedal? Is it saved anywhere? My main question is about its use as a preamp into an amp’s FX loop. I’m sure you’ll get a good high gain tone, but what about when you turn it off and want a good clean tone? That’s a good thing about the AMT pedals—they have great gain tones using the preamp output, and then a pretty good clean when the pedal is disengaged.


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Aug 5, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Was there actually a livestream about this pedal? Is it saved anywhere? My main question is about its use as a preamp into an amp’s FX loop. I’m sure you’ll get a good high gain tone, but what about when you turn it off and want a good clean tone? That’s a good thing about the AMT pedals—they have great gain tones using the preamp output, and then a pretty good clean when the pedal is disengaged.



Yea there was a Livestream up on Facebook and Instagram. It's still up on the Horizon Devices Facebook group. He plugged it into the FX loop on it as well, I remember that.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Aug 5, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Was there actually a livestream about this pedal? Is it saved anywhere? My main question is about its use as a preamp into an amp’s FX loop. I’m sure you’ll get a good high gain tone, but what about when you turn it off and want a good clean tone? That’s a good thing about the AMT pedals—they have great gain tones using the preamp output, and then a pretty good clean when the pedal is disengaged.



It 's true bypass. So yeah, it's just gonna be a unfiltered clean sound it seems.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 5, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> Why not just use a Mooer Radar instead?





HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I feel like the Mooer Radar is the best bet out of all the recent IR loaders. Small footprint, 3rd party IRs, and has an on-board EQ.



Have you guys actually looked at that Nux Solid Studio?

Again, I’m not saying it’s better than the Mooer. It just seems to be worth a look. I’m not at all an IR guy. I have very little need for (so very little experience with) IRs and such. 

On paper, the Radar has more cabs and more mics, and you can load your own IRs easily via computer. The Nux seems to have lower latency, higher resolution, and more connection options. Also I’m not sure how the custom IR loader works in terms of 3rd party IRs. It says you can load them, but it looks more cumbersome from what I can tell.

Anyway, just seemed like it might be a cool product worth a look.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 5, 2018)

Cool, I’ll check out the live stream. And that’s another cool thing about the AMT pedals...I have one and could run the Apex into that clean preamp lol. It works well with the BE-OD and G3, and even other AMT pedals set to drive output.


----------



## Spinedriver (Aug 5, 2018)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Have you guys actually looked at that Nux Solid Studio?
> 
> Again, I’m not saying it’s better than the Mooer. It just seems to be worth a look. I’m not at all an IR guy. I have very little need for (so very little experience with) IRs and such.
> 
> ...



It looks like the Nux is very 'plug n' play'. Turn the knobs to taste and off you go. The thing is, if you load in some different impulses, you'd have to remember where each one is because unlike the Mooer Radar, there's no screen to tell you what's loaded into that specific spot.

I have a Radar and I'll agree that the layout of the Nux does make it look easier to use. With the Radar, you have to use the one knob on it to navigate menus, change parameters, etc.. so it does take some patience. So in a sense it's ease of use (Nux) vs a lot more options (more pre-sets, power amp simulation, 3 types of 5 band parametric eq with the Mooer Radar). That being said, Hotone also has a new IR loader that looks pretty promising. It's called the "Binary Cab" and had I not bought the Radar, this might have been my 2nd choice.







http://www.hotoneaudio.com/products/Binary/Binary/2018/0224/262.html


----------



## Veldar (Aug 7, 2018)

Do guitar players ever use preamp pedals? I know bassist do a lot, but you guys normally get mic'd on stage?


----------



## goobaba (Aug 8, 2018)

Veldar said:


> Do guitar players ever use preamp pedals? I know bassist do a lot, but you guys normally get mic'd on stage?



This is essentially distortion pedal, but being branded as a "preamp" because that is how these pedals are being used these days. It can still be put in front of a traditional amp like a distortion pedal, but now the use case for distortion pedals has increased. You can plug it direct into a power amp and power a cab, plug it into an audio interface with or without cab simulation and record. Bass preamp pedals are essentially the same thing as distortion/gain pedals as well.


----------



## Taikatatti (Aug 11, 2018)

Anybody got shipment info? Mine is stuck at ”your shipment is confirmed”. 

Was there an estimated shipping date that i missed?


----------



## bracky (Aug 11, 2018)

January

I’m figuring MXR will only build these for Horizon if they buy 500 up front. Thus the long wait.


----------



## Taikatatti (Aug 11, 2018)

bracky said:


> January
> 
> I’m figuring MXR will only build these for Horizon if they buy 500 up front. Thus the long wait.




Thanks!


----------



## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 16, 2018)

kindsage said:


> How do you like the buxom?


Sorry just now seeing this. I love the Buxom, it was the best boost for the JP2C out of the 5 boosts I had at the time. Unbelievable tone but I had to sell the Mesa and I am considering selling the Buxom for this AMT R2 or a Rev G3.

The buxom is awesome but IMO all boosts work better with certain amps. The only negative I can even say about the pedal is that the construction to me felt "cheap" compared to a lot of other pedals I have owned


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Aug 16, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Sorry just now seeing this. I love the Buxom, it was the best boost for the JP2C out of the 5 boosts I had at the time. Unbelievable tone but I had to sell the Mesa and I am considering selling the Buxom for this AMT R2 or a Rev G3.
> 
> The buxom is awesome but IMO all boosts work better with certain amps. The only negative I can even say about the pedal is that the construction to me felt "cheap" compared to a lot of other pedals I have owned



R2 and G3 are both awesome but don’t sleep on the BE-OD. That thing is also a beast. I think people kinda pigeonhole it into a MIAB pedal but that doesn’t come close to telling the story. It’s a bit scooped and does a damned good modern metal thing it you want it to. With that said, i reallllly wish it had a mid control instead of a tight control (or both). All 3 pedals are definitely worthy of consideration.


----------



## makecamera (Sep 4, 2018)




----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Sep 5, 2018)

Surely Rabea knows the difference between a distortion pedal and a preamp. I'm not watching a 20 minute video to see whether or not he then later tried it going into a poweramp like it's meant to be used.


----------



## Spinedriver (Sep 5, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Surely Rabea knows the difference between a distortion pedal and a preamp. I'm not watching a 20 minute video to see whether or not he then later tried it going into a poweramp like it's meant to be used.



Not really. He did try using it direct into his audio interface and tweaked the "cab" knob a bit and it wasn't very impressive. What made me laugh is that in the beginning of the demo, he clearly had the gain on the amp turned up. So, in essence he was using the "preamp" pedal as a boost.


----------



## narad (Sep 5, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Surely Rabea knows the difference between a distortion pedal and a preamp. I'm not watching a 20 minute video to see whether or not he then later tried it going into a poweramp like it's meant to be used.



That difference being marketing and a B/M/T EQ.


----------



## Bearitone (Sep 5, 2018)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Surely Rabea knows the difference between a distortion pedal and a preamp. I'm not watching a 20 minute video to see whether or not he then later tried it going into a poweramp like it's meant to be used.



Seriously. In Misha’s breakdown of how you can use the pedal i don’t even think he mentions being able to put it direct to a poweramp or effects return.

There’s a reason they’re leaving it out in demos too and it probably has to do with marketing


----------



## LeviathanKiller (Sep 5, 2018)

So...

Sells pedal called "Apex Preamp"
Cannot use as preamp


----------



## bulb (Sep 5, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> So...
> 
> Sells pedal called "Apex Preamp"
> Cannot use as preamp


You most definitely can use it as a preamp in every sense!
If you have a sweet clean channel it can be nice to have the extra control and it feeds well into that, like for example on my Lonestar, but if not just put it into the fx loop return and it will sound awesome!


----------



## LeviathanKiller (Sep 5, 2018)

bulb said:


> You most definitely can use it as a preamp in every sense!
> If you have a sweet clean channel it can be nice to have the extra control and it feeds well into that, like for example on my Lonestar, but if not just put it into the fx loop return and it will sound awesome!



That needs to be demoed then
Are there any videos out there with it being used like that?


----------



## bulb (Sep 5, 2018)

LeviathanKiller said:


> That needs to be demoed then
> Are there any videos out there with it being used like that?


Keith's video is him using the pedal into a SD powerstage poweramp and out to a miked cab. 
Literally being used a preamp in the literally literal definition there. Sounds awesome too!


----------



## lewis (Sep 5, 2018)

bulb said:


> Keith's video is him using the pedal into a SD powerstage poweramp and out to a miked cab.
> Literally being used a preamp in the literally literal definition there. Sounds awesome too!


not to mention your live streams were pure "preamp" pedal setup. 
You even tried a bass (and it sounded great haha) so its not like the demo bases havent been covered.


----------



## bulb (Sep 5, 2018)

lewis said:


> not to mention your live streams were pure "preamp" pedal setup.
> You even tried a bass (and it sounded great haha) so its not like the demo bases havent been covered.


Yup!
In the first stream I actually compared the sound of the front end of the amp to the fx loop return. It was great in both ends (that's what she said)


----------



## LeviathanKiller (Sep 5, 2018)

bulb said:


> It was great in both ends (that's what she said)



oh my


----------



## Spinedriver (Sep 5, 2018)

bulb said:


> You most definitely can use it as a preamp in every sense!
> If you have a sweet clean channel it can be nice to have the extra control and it feeds well into that, like for example on my Lonestar, but if not just put it into the fx loop return and it will sound awesome!



I was gonna say, kind of odd to include a "*cab" *knob if it wasn't meant to go direct...


----------



## SnowfaLL (Nov 12, 2018)

Do we have any updates on the timeframe of this pedal? still on target?


----------



## bulb (Nov 28, 2018)

SnowfaLL said:


> Do we have any updates on the timeframe of this pedal? still on target?


Yup it’s looking like it will be shipping 1st or 2nd week of Jan so right on target as it stands!


----------



## icipher (Jan 7, 2019)

anyone get any tracking info yet?


----------



## alvo (Jan 7, 2019)

Man, I'm still waiting. Hopefully they ship out this week.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jan 7, 2019)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Not sure I need it, but I ordered one anyway. Guess I’ll have to compare it with the Invective lol. And a few other pedals.



I had to read back in this thread to remember whether or not I ordered one lol. So they’re supposed to start shipping soon?


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Jan 7, 2019)

Deadpool_25 said:


> I had to read back to this thread to remember whether or not I ordered one lol. So they’re supposed to start shipping soon?



Lol I actually almost cancelled mine since my rig changed since then. But, I decided to keep my pre-order cuz I'm sure it can only enhance my tone and I would hate to cancel it now,right before it ships.


----------



## bracky (Jan 15, 2019)

If I don’t get this in Jan 2019 I will seriously wonder why I preordered this thing in July 2018. Steel Panther announced, took preorders, manufactured, and delivered much faster with their amazing puss melter pedal.


----------



## I play music (Jan 15, 2019)

bracky said:


> I will seriously wonder why I preordered this thing in July 2018.


To bite yourself in the ass when maybe you find out that at Namm some company announces a preamp that you'd like more ... and is sold immediately without preorder


----------



## Soya (Jan 15, 2019)

bracky said:


> If I don’t get this in Jan 2019 I will seriously wonder why I preordered this thing in July 2018. Steel Panther announced, took preorders, manufactured, and delivered much faster with their amazing puss melter pedal.


So much for the much lauded MXR production capabilities yeah?


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jan 15, 2019)

Maybe I’ll just post mine up for sale...


----------



## bracky (Jan 15, 2019)

I know Bulb is reading this...


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jan 15, 2019)

Soya said:


> So much for the much lauded MXR production capabilities yeah?


The Pussy Melter pedal was probably produced by the same company that builds pedals for Wampler, apparently Bogner, and other companies.


----------



## bracky (Jan 15, 2019)

Oh I know the Apex will be awesome but there truly was not a whole lot of incentive to preorder beyond me being a fanboy I guess. Dammit! I hope it ships soon. Fun will be had!!!


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 15, 2019)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> The Pussy Melter pedal was probably produced by the same company that builds pedals for Wampler, apparently Bogner, and other companies.



Boutique Amp Distribution?


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jan 15, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Boutique Amp Distribution?


The name escapes me.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 15, 2019)

Spaced Out Ace said:


> The name escapes me.


Checking their website, they list Wampler and Bogner Pedals


----------



## bracky (Jan 15, 2019)

All Pedal out of Kentucky made the P-Melter.

https://all-pedal.com/


----------



## Spaced Out Ace (Jan 16, 2019)

So wasn't the company I thought (the one Jazzy Jeff mentions), but same idea nonetheless.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jan 22, 2019)

Any updates on when this’ll start shipping?


----------



## bracky (Jan 22, 2019)

I’m contemplating canceling my order and putting the money towards a invective.


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Jan 22, 2019)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Any updates on when this’ll start shipping?



They posted on Facebook that they would start shipping this week


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Jan 22, 2019)

bracky said:


> I’m contemplating canceling my order and putting the money towards a invective.



Heads up, there's like a $45 cancelation fee. Already contemplated cancelling as well...until I found out about that fee.


----------



## Deadpool_25 (Jan 22, 2019)

IbanezIsLife said:


> Heads up, there's like a $45 cancelation fee. Already contemplated cancelling as well...until I found out about that fee.



Hm. Didn’t know about that when I preordered. I was contemplating canceling as well but maybe not now.


----------



## IbanezIsLife (Jan 22, 2019)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Hm. Didn’t know about that when I preordered. I was contemplating canceling as well but maybe not now.


Yup, same man. I recently got rid of my Helix and got a Kemper and I've been loving the tones I've been getting from it. So as a result, my excitement for it kind of dipped. But I'm a fan of Horizon Devices products and it sounds amazing, so fuck it. Imma try and incorporate it


----------



## Bearitone (Jan 23, 2019)

I am ready and waiting to buy one of yall’s used Apex preamp


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jan 23, 2019)

lmao 45$ cancellation fee, that's a new one


----------



## bracky (Jan 23, 2019)

I’m not sweating it if it’s a week or three late. Still thinking about that invective though.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 23, 2019)

Wrong thread


----------



## icipher (Jan 24, 2019)

will we get an email when the apex's are about to ship?


----------



## bubbastain (Jan 24, 2019)

bulb said:


> Invective is so sick!!



Local GC had an Invective so I had to plug in and try it. Gotta say it was pretty damn impressive. Killer amp for sure.


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## bracky (Jan 24, 2019)

bulb said:


> Invective is so sick!!



I’ll find out next week.


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## soul_lip_mike (Jan 25, 2019)

bulb said:


> Yup, you should get an email with tracking info!



Still patiently waiting. Can't wait to try it out.


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## alvo (Jan 29, 2019)

I received an email notification that the pedal has shipped. Mine should be coming this Friday.


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## Veldar (Jan 30, 2019)

How does Bulb not need a vender account


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## gunch (Jan 30, 2019)

Veldar said:


> How does Bulb not need a vender account



That’s a good question


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## Frostbite (Jan 30, 2019)

silverabyss said:


> That’s a good question


AFAIK, it's because he's not the one posting the threads talking about the products and trying to sell them, they're always started by someone else and he just pops in for info


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## technomancer (Jan 30, 2019)

Frostbite said:


> AFAIK, it's because he's not the one posting the threads talking about the products and trying to sell them, they're always started by someone else and he just pops in for info



No it's because we don't police threads and nobody has bothered to report that he's posting in here. He's allowed to post on stuff he is endorsing but not on Horizon Devices because he's one of the principals in the company, unless he wants to sign up for a Vendor account. Vendors are not allowed to promote stuff they are selling, endorsers are allowed to talk about their signature gear.


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## bulb (Jan 30, 2019)

technomancer said:


> No it's because we don't police threads and nobody has bothered to report that he's posting in here. He's allowed to post on stuff he is endorsing but not on Horizon Devices because he's one of the principals in the company, unless he wants to sign up for a Vendor account. Vendors are not allowed to promote stuff they are selling, endorsers are allowed to talk about their signature gear.



Thanks pal, it’s much appreciated! <3


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## technomancer (Jan 30, 2019)

bulb said:


> Thanks pal, it’s much appreciated! <3



Just have fun with it  AKA I don't really care, go fight with Alex


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## wespaul (Jan 31, 2019)

IbanezIsLife said:


> Heads up, there's like a $45 cancelation fee. Already contemplated cancelling as well...until I found out about that fee.



I preordered mine last year and I purchased the Precision Drive with it as well. I remember shipping shenanigans taking place and they sat on my PD for 2-3 weeks before it shipped. Support basically gave no reason than “lol that’s weird” and offer free picks to make up for it. I had them clarify my preorder was in the first batch. 

Now my buddy literally preordered his a week ago and was told he was in the 2nd batch. Last Monday he gets a notification that it’s shipped and will be here Friday (tomorrow). 

I contacted John in support and asked what the hell is going on that I have no update on mine and my buddy swings in at the last second, gets in the second shipment, and how is he getting his before me? Silence. I get no reply at all. 

I have no idea what’s going on, but screwing up shipping on two separate products months apart doesn’t leave me with a lot of faith. I am really pissed. If I don’t hear anything tomorrow I am going to request a refund, and I better not be hit with some bs $45 cancellation fee. As far as I’m concerned, if it doesn’t ship in January then they didn’t deliver on their end and I shouldn’t have to eat a fee because of that.


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## IbanezIsLife (Jan 31, 2019)

wespaul said:


> I preordered mine last year and I purchased the Precision Drive with it as well. I remember shipping shenanigans taking place and they sat on my PD for 2-3 weeks before it shipped. Support basically gave no reason than “lol that’s weird” and offer free picks to make up for it. I had them clarify my preorder was in the first batch.
> 
> Now my buddy literally preordered his a week ago and was told he was in the 2nd batch. Last Monday he gets a notification that it’s shipped and will be here Friday (tomorrow).
> 
> ...



Damn that sucks man. For what it's worth, I saw that all pre-orders will be fulfilled by Friday. I emailed John at customer support and he got back to me almost immediately with tracking info. Mine will be here tomorrow as well. I didn't get the first shipment info though. Be sure to check your spam and junk folders to make sure their emails aren't going in there. Surely, yours will be at your doorstep tomorrow... hopefully anyway. Maybe Misha will read this and get to the bottom of it. Best of luck


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## bulb (Jan 31, 2019)

wespaul said:


> I preordered mine last year and I purchased the Precision Drive with it as well. I remember shipping shenanigans taking place and they sat on my PD for 2-3 weeks before it shipped. Support basically gave no reason than “lol that’s weird” and offer free picks to make up for it. I had them clarify my preorder was in the first batch.
> 
> Now my buddy literally preordered his a week ago and was told he was in the 2nd batch. Last Monday he gets a notification that it’s shipped and will be here Friday (tomorrow).
> 
> ...



Hey dude, had words with John, sorry about that, your pedal will go out tomorrow!

We are upgrading your shopping to expedited as well!


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## Deadpool_25 (Feb 1, 2019)

Preorders went live on July 28th.
I ordered on July 28th. 
Haven’t seen any shipping info yet.


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## IbanezIsLife (Feb 1, 2019)

Alright just got mine hooked up to my Kemper...


Love my tone with my Kemper so I was going to cancel the Apex. But I decided to keep my pre-order and holy fucking shit I'm glad I did. This thing sounds BEASTLY.


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## wespaul (Feb 2, 2019)

bulb said:


> Hey dude, had words with John, sorry about that, your pedal will go out tomorrow!
> 
> We are upgrading your shopping to expedited as well!



Thanks for connecting with John. After waiting all day for a shipping update, I had to contact him yet again to be told that, basically, it didn’t ship out and is now due to ship out Monday.

I know your name is attached to this, and it probably sucks hearing issues like this, but this is incredibly frustrating knowing my buddy ordered his a week ago, was told he was in the second batch, and he is now at home playing with it. While I’m sitting here, preordered months ago, constantly getting the run-around. 

I’ll deal with a couple errors here and there, but this has been a constant issue from day one. I’ve decided against purchasing the nano because of how I’ve been dealt with, and as excited as I’ve been for news about future pedals (the rumors of an ambient pedal, in particular), I’ve lost confidence in the company and will take future business elsewhere. Thank you for trying, though.


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## bulb (Feb 2, 2019)

wespaul said:


> Thanks for connecting with John. After waiting all day for a shipping update, I had to contact him yet again to be told that, basically, it didn’t ship out and is now due to ship out Monday.
> 
> I know your name is attached to this, and it probably sucks hearing issues like this, but this is incredibly frustrating knowing my buddy ordered his a week ago, was told he was in the second batch, and he is now at home playing with it. While I’m sitting here, preordered months ago, constantly getting the run-around.
> 
> I’ll deal with a couple errors here and there, but this has been a constant issue from day one. I’ve decided against purchasing the nano because of how I’ve been dealt with, and as excited as I’ve been for news about future pedals (the rumors of an ambient pedal, in particular), I’ve lost confidence in the company and will take future business elsewhere. Thank you for trying, though.



I understand your frustration dude, I’m sorry we couldn’t do more to get it out to you. I just hope you love the pedal when you get it and that hopefully softens the blow.

We have had a few crises on the backend setting up with this new fulfillment company and also with the weather not playing nice that really had us way further on our back foot than any of us would have liked. At any rate I appreciate your patience thus far!


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## bracky (Feb 2, 2019)

John told me mine would ship yesterday. It didn’t. I was also a day one preorder.

It’s not a huge deal but the fullfilment company needs a talking to I think.


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## bulb (Feb 2, 2019)

bracky said:


> John told me mine would ship yesterday. It didn’t. I was also a day one preorder.
> 
> It’s not a huge deal but the fullfilment company needs a talking to I think.



To be a bit more transparent, we switched shops and fulfillment between preorder launch and now and this ended up causing a massive problem with a lot of orders at the last minute to where John has to manually fulfill hundreds of orders.

This is why things aren’t necessarily in order, and it’s definitely annoying on all ends but we are still learning and will make sure we don’t have this problem again!


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## SnowfaLL (Feb 2, 2019)

Yea I contacted John and he said he saw my order on the backend, and it should ship friday (yesterday) but I didnt receive any tracking #/emails yet.. Hopefully monday!


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## bracky (Feb 2, 2019)

Now I’m feeling bad for poor John. Lol

Thanks for the explanation. You rock man! \m/


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## Deadpool_25 (Feb 2, 2019)

bulb said:


> If it’s not in your spam, email [email protected] and we will get this sorted out!



I emailed John and he sent my tracking number saying the Apex was delivered to my mailbox. What?? So first opportunity I get, I check and...sure as shit, there it is! Sweet! I guess tracking was just never sent out, but I can deal with that. The Apex is in hand! I’ll try it out a little later today. Thanks Misha!


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## bracky (Feb 2, 2019)

I better go check my box. Lol


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## bulb (Feb 2, 2019)

bracky said:


> Now I’m feeling bad for poor John. Lol
> 
> Thanks for the explanation. You rock man! \m/



It's been a rough week for him for sure, but this is also his job haha.
What sucks is that even with the internal backend issues, we would have been on time if it hadn't been for this weather as our pedals got stuck for a while just on the way to fulfillment...


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## Bearitone (Feb 2, 2019)

Crazy weird there’s an Apex preamp for sale used at my local GC


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## Soya (Feb 2, 2019)

bulb said:


> What sucks is that even with the internal backend issues...



Too right, seafood gets me every time.


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## bracky (Feb 11, 2019)

My Apex is finally arriving today. 

Any tips or tricks to get the best sound out of it?


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## Spaced Out Ace (Feb 11, 2019)

bracky said:


> My Apex is finally arriving today.
> 
> Any tips or tricks to get the best sound out of it?


EQ it with your ears and not your eyes.


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## bracky (Feb 11, 2019)

Oh I will.

Something I’m wondering. Is this device digital? Like does it use modeling such as a Mooer micro preamp or is it clipping diodes and such?


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## Bearitone (Feb 11, 2019)

bracky said:


> Oh I will.
> 
> Something I’m wondering. Is this device digital? Like does it use modeling such as a Mooer micro preamp or is it clipping diodes and such?



Nope. All analog

If you’re worried that’ll effect sound quality, don’t. Modeling is not needed to make a great solidstate preamp


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## bulb (Feb 11, 2019)

bracky said:


> My Apex is finally arriving today.
> 
> Any tips or tricks to get the best sound out of it?


Just start with everything at noon and tweak to taste, don’t be afraid to use extreme settings if you think it sounds good, we designed the range of controls to always sound good!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Feb 11, 2019)

bracky said:


> My Apex is finally arriving today.
> 
> Any tips or tricks to get the best sound out of it?



...

...

Seriously?
No one's saying it?

...Just have fun with it?


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## bulb (Feb 11, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> ...
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


I mean I say it literally every other post, but have it pal.


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## bracky (Feb 11, 2019)

The last mile is always the longest. Delivery delayed until tomorrow. Living in the middle of nowhere does have some disadvantages I guess.


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## SnowfaLL (Feb 19, 2019)

heads up to Canadians - expect to pay customs.. mine is $70 cdn in customs. Also took a LONG time for shipping, since I was in that first batch and it's only arriving hopefully tomorrow? Maybe snowstorms had a part in that, but customs held it at least a week too. Hope its worth the wait/price!


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## Shoeless_jose (Feb 19, 2019)

So they switched to Peavey for fulfillment or what... amirite?


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## bracky (Feb 19, 2019)

It’s a killer preamp once you get it. I’m having a lot of fun with mine. Going from guitar-apex-mooer radar-scarllet it produces a fantastic range of tones.


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## bulb (Feb 19, 2019)

SnowfaLL said:


> heads up to Canadians - expect to pay customs.. mine is $70 cdn in customs. Also took a LONG time for shipping, since I was in that first batch and it's only arriving hopefully tomorrow? Maybe snowstorms had a part in that, but customs held it at least a week too. Hope its worth the wait/price!


Unfortunately with Customs it's a crapshoot. Sometimes you get hit, sometimes you don't. Either way I hope that you love the pedal!


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## btbg (Feb 20, 2019)

I actually inquired with Horizon and they advised me that if I request my apex to be shipped USPS that's do able. That way you won't be hit with FedEx ridiculous customs charges.


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## SnowfaLL (Feb 21, 2019)

wish I knew USPS was an option back then.. I dont even think it said FedEx on the website when I ordered, just "shipping". I'd be more hesitant to order if I knew it was fedex from the start =[

That being said, it is a good pedal. It is dead simple to use, and sounds great. Do I like it more than my AxeFX II or even Atomic Amplifire? I dunno.. (I know it wasnt made to compete vs them) but I'll probably keep it around in case I start up a smaller pedalboard - if this was a $150 pedal, it'd be a slamdunk.. I don't really buy pedals much though so maybe $300+ is the standard rates for preamp pedals these days.


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