# "Secrets of an Ex-Guitar Center employee



## Drew (Aug 15, 2007)

Secrets of an ex-Guitar Center employee - The Gear Page

Just lifted this from Jemsite... It's actually pretty honest, good advice from the other side, and worthy of a read.


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## Zepp88 (Aug 15, 2007)

I read the first few paragraphs, they were rather accurate. 

Too tired to read the whole thing right now.


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## InTheRavensName (Aug 15, 2007)

I'm jealous of you guys and GC, closest we get is soundcontrol...never had a complaint about pricing or service, but they don't generally have the same levels of stock and choice you guys get


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## Zepp88 (Aug 15, 2007)

Not all Guitar Centers are great. The Fredericksburg GC is probably similar to Sound Control


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## Krunch (Aug 15, 2007)

Yes ours is awful.


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## Zepp88 (Aug 15, 2007)

Krunch said:


> Yes ours is awful.



 

You know...I've probably met you. I used to be in GC ALOT.....hanging out until closing and even helping out with things sometimes....


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## D-EJ915 (Aug 15, 2007)

> have them order you a fresh new one....that can be swapped out when the new one comes in. They'll do that to save the deal....but before you leave make sure you get that in writting on the sales receipt incase he forgets to order it for you....or gets fired.


lol  I did that, dude _did_ eventually get fired. But anyway because he was a lazy douche I traded my $150 JS1 for my H-207


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## Krunch (Aug 15, 2007)

Zepp88 said:


> You know...I've probably met you. I used to be in GC ALOT.....hanging out until closing and even helping out with things sometimes....



I doubt it  I'm usually on a mission there and don't stick around long to jibba-jabba. 

Also, on my previous statement, to clarify: I'm talking more about the fact that the store is tiny and has the worst selection of any GC I've been to. The guys that work there are cool, and three of them have hooked me up well on a few occasions so I have no complaints about them. /respect to the commission employees.


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## Durero (Aug 15, 2007)

Good stuff to know.


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## sakeido (Aug 15, 2007)

I wish we had Guitar Center up here. We have Long & McQuade and they are great with their return policy (and their financing terms are REALLY generous) but the selection sucks. I hear all these stories about guys getting to try out VHTs, Engls, Bogners and Riveras in stores in stuff and I am lucky if I can find an Orange or Soldano to riff on..


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## Groff (Aug 15, 2007)

"Pick 1 dude to work with at GC...and stick with him. He'll be your buddy and hook you up after he sees you're his repeat customer. "

You have NO clue how much trouble this saves. As an ex-GC employee I can say that situations like this have created massive drama behind the scenes. People prancing around doing NOTHING and getting into arguments with someone else who's helping what they claim is "THEIR CUSTOMER".

I also got pissed off when someone would grind me on a price for an entire HOUR and then I make a deal with them on the floor model, and then when we pack it up they ask "Can I have one in a box?" fuck the fuck off! 

Things aren't marked up as much as they seem. A $3000 roland drumset may only make $150 profit, not giving us any room to move. I have never worked in a more stressful work enviroment than GC.

I have to disagree with his first point though, the employee's DO care about their customers, and corporate cares about their customers, Every week we're trained on how to be polite (most don't listen and are still pushy) and we're literally FORCED to create a list of 20 people we're made follow up calls on (nothing i've never done on my own though). GC is a tough place to make money if you're not in pro audio or guitars, so yeah, we want to make friendships with our customers, not rip them of.

He's right about the certifications too, I made it to B level, and was ONE product test away from A (which i would have been only the second to get in that store). These tests usually took a week to be administered, and many many pages of material to be read. So yeah, not all the employee's are idiots.

Story time:
I had this rich guy come in, in his NICE bmw FYI, for a month, every week on thursday, to try and tell me that he saw an iron cobra double pedal for $199 (on the internets!). I politely told him the COST (which we're not allowed to do) and tried to tell him that the pedal he was looking at was the iron cobra JR... He finally came in with a "print out" of the ad he found (which was obviously a bad MS paint job) and claimed it was real. Only he forgot to shop out the "JR" logo off the description. He never came back.

Which brings me to my last rant, i'd also like to point out that if a customer is wanting an unfair price drop on an item, and even a fucking MANAGER can't convince them that the price can't be lowered anymore (happened MANY times... people are cheap as hell!) we're fully authorized to tell them, if they don't like my deal, to leave the goddamn store and try and find a better one (not that blunt, but you get the idea)

...Wow that felt good to rant like that.


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## zimbloth (Aug 15, 2007)

Dude, GC sucks more than anything in the universe. They don't have good selection. They just have the usual Gibson, PRS, Fenders, and other than that, a SEA of low end imports. Once in a blue moon they get a nice guitar or amp in, but not very often. They have Mesas and Marshalls, but when they get a VHT or Bogner in, 99.9% of the time it's just a used one a customer sold to them.

I'm an ex-GC employee too and I can tell you I had a much difference experience than you, in terms of management, competence, and how the other salesmen treated/cared for the customers. I quit because I felt ashamed and dirty being associated with that company and that environment. 

One time a customer came in looking for a specific guitar that he had been saving up for. Problem is, it was an ESP. GC doesn't carry ESP. At the time, Mars Music was around and they sold ESP. A fellow salesmen told the customer that we didn't carry ESPs. Then the customer, dejected, asked if he knew of another store that sold ESP? The salesmen told him that no stores around here sell ESP, which was a lie. Then the guy left. He could have just said "I don't know", but no, just a flat out lie. I was like "dude, why didn't you just tell the guy the truth, don't you think when he finds out Mars has ESPs, that he's going to think you and GC are lying douchebags?". He was like "fuck that guy man". If he had just told the truth, he would have A) not been an asshole and B) earned goodwill with the customer and he likely would have come back. Instead, I never saw that guy again.


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## Jason (Aug 15, 2007)

Awesome fucking read. Anyone who ever bitches about GC should have to read that.. Sticky that mofo.


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## D-EJ915 (Aug 15, 2007)

The Va Beach GC is pretty good, it blows shit out of the water in comparison to the suck-ass Charlotte one


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## Battousai (Aug 15, 2007)

the music shops over here are cool and have decent gear but theyre soo limited..

the only brands available are the usual fender,esp,jackson,randall/washburn,gibson,prs(fuckin expensiiiiiive over 3000$ each),marshall bc rich etc

you cant get mesa amps,vht, or engl,a store just recently started bringing in line6 gear.. and the esp dealer cant get you an LTD guitar on order because his deal with esp is that he has to buy a minimum amount for that specific model (i asked for a SC 607B,i dont know how true that is tho... he was pushing for m to get a custom as my first 7 stringer..which is kinda assholeish)


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## Stitch (Aug 15, 2007)

All of that is so goddamn accurate. I am fortunate enough to NOT work on commission, but my ex-store-manager (who got demoted) is totally paranoid from all the weed he has smoked over the years and is convinced the user logins on the till are means for the owner (who hates him) to check up on on his sales progress as an excuse to fire him. Its painful when my colleague gets all bitchy about who served a customer first, be it for a guitar, amp strings or even fucking plectrums.

To everyone on this board:

*Don't, ever, ever, ever, ever EVER tell the employees of your local guitar shop about your rig, gear, gigs you've played, stuff you want to buy etc. UNLESS THEY ASK YOU FIRST. TRY AND KEEP RESPONCES SHORT AND SWEET UNLESS YOU KNOW THE DUDE PERSONALLY*, and even then, be aware that just because he's smiling doesnt mean he'd rather be somewhere else. Its is without a doubt one of the most cripplingly painful parts of my job - dealing with people determined to tell me about everything they ever owned and why they liked/hated it.


Don't slag off the music either. I've had enough of this german twit who comes in, slags off Necrophagist, and promptly tells me that Hank Marvin is a better player, because he has 'feel' and 'passion'. Fuck off. 

Don't march in and straight away ask to see the manager/guitar tech. You are just being rude by a)assuming I am not either and b)suggesting I am not capable of helping you. The amount of times the problem with someones guitar was easily diagnosed by me without interrupting more valuable members of comparably busier staff...

And finally, don't assume you know more than your assistant. People wouldn't guess it, but I have near-as-dammit encyclopedic knowledge of just about every Fender, Charvel, Jackson, Marshall, Vox, Burns, Yamaha, Boss, DOD, Jim Dunlop, Gibson, and Schecter product ever made. Don't tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about. I'll just laugh when you leave and won't give a shit if you ask for a discount.

And don't get me started on Ibanez. Guaranteed, sir, that I know more than you.



[/rant]


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## josh821 (Aug 15, 2007)

The problem with GC is that their pay is so horrible (unless it's been drastically changed since 2002) that they can't keep people around who know what they're talking about. I worked at a GC in Jersey for 6 months, worked my ass off, and was pretty much told that I'd be their first assistant manager (they just opened) if I was looking to get the position. I turned them down and ended up quitting.

The reason? I made 5.15 an hour and had to drive 45 minutes to get there and had to deal with the high stress realities of commission based retail sales. Even at the pay I would've received in that position I couldn't see how I was ever going to make any worthwhile cash. I wasn't the only one either. One guy in the whole store made commission for the first 2 months we were open and that brought him up to 8 dollars an hour, whoopee. He also stole many many sales to be able to do that and since we were new a lot of people didn't know how to fight back against that. Shit, we had people who worked doing live sound and people who'd been to college for audio who quit within 90 days because there was no way for them to make minimum wage (5.15 was actually LESS than minimum wage in Jersey at the time). You really can't build a company with well trained and knowledgeable employees that way.

In comparison, the next I landed was at Radioshack which is also commission based. The set up was somewhat similar except they offered many many SPIFFs which would usually double your commission. I was making 14 dollars an hour with less effort the first month of being at that job. Those rates are comparable at all.

Unfortunately GC doesn't lie about saying they're pay is competitive in their industry though. I worked at Sam Ash, in Manhattan even, for 6 months and averaged 7 dollars an hour (that went through Christmas time as well). Compare all this to my local mom and pop music store run by a couple of public school teachers. They told me, when I was a teenager who didn't know anything, that they'd pay me $10/hour under the table.

So yeah, the guys at GC quite often probably won't know what they're talking about or, probably more often than that, will just try and sell you the items with the largest profit margin and try to tell you they're just like the industry standard (with 0 profit margin) that cost you a little more but keep in mind that this is a terrible job they're doing.


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## jacksonplayer (Aug 15, 2007)

I troll the closest GC almost every weekend checking for interesting used guitars. I think I've gotten the reputation there as "that crazy fusion dude." 

But that store has some good salespeople and no dickheads. They've never given me any problems, and I'm basically the King of the Tire Kickers. I am prone to buying stuff on occasion, though, and they know it.


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## Drew (Aug 15, 2007)

stitch216 said:


> All of that is so goddamn accurate. I am fortunate enough to NOT work on commission, but my ex-store-manager (who got demoted) is totally paranoid from all the weed he has smoked over the years and is convinced the user logins on the till are means for the owner (who hates him) to check up on on his sales progress as an excuse to fire him. Its painful when my colleague gets all bitchy about who served a customer first, be it for a guitar, amp strings or even fucking plectrums.
> 
> To everyone on this board:
> 
> ...



 Shit, I'd buy stuff from you.


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## Stitch (Aug 15, 2007)

Nothing wrong with tirekickers - they are the ones that spend ages wasting your time, then blow out £1700 ($3500) on two Duesenbergs from Germany - as happened to me yesterday.

Dude spends a lot of time 'kicking tires' over it, comes in and buys two - talk about unexpected, but I'm not ungrateful. I'm the glad the guy did it, and it always serves as a reminder to be nice to EVERYONE (except the Gibson owners) 



Drew said:


> Shit, I'd buy stuff from you.



Haha, but what do you mean by that?


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## Drew (Aug 15, 2007)

I mean, if you worked in a guitar shot around me, I'd totally buy gear there, since you seem to know what you're talking about and that amused me..


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## HighGain510 (Aug 15, 2007)

The one thing I don't dig about the local guitar center is that they assume too much. I went in the other day to buy a strap for my incoming EBMM and asked the guy if they had any Ernie Ball straps in stock. He tells me no, which was fine, but then proceeds to suggestive sell shit to me that I don't want or need. Conversation after he told me they don't carry EBMM straps was like so:


"No, sorry we don't carry Ernie Ball straps."

"Oh okay, thanks anyways...."

"Well wait, what kind of music do you play?"

"Metal mostly, but bluesy stuff too...."

"Oh, well then clearly you want this set of DiMarzio Clip-Lok Straplocks!"


Uhhhh what?! When did I say "I want clip-locks!" in that conversation? Fucking stupid.... if you sell gear DO NOT assume that someone wants something because they might fit a stereotype. Any time I go to that guitar center and head to the accessories department I avoid that dick like the plague because he treated me like I had no idea what I wanted. News flash: I buy $4K guitars, if I tell you I want something SPECIFIC, don't try to sell me whatever you can to make the sale.   I understand trying to make the sale for commission, but telling me that because I like a certain style of music I must not know what I want is just plain idiotic on your part.


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## Groff (Aug 15, 2007)

zimbloth said:


> I quit because I felt ashamed and dirty being associated with that company and that environment.



 

I quit because the pay was horible, and the work enviroment was completely hostile. On the floor things were always calm, but behind the whse door there was a war of epic proportions there.

I also left because there were only three of us that worked there that actually listened to what we were told about treating costomers and actually had souls!


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## HighGain510 (Aug 15, 2007)

Drew said:


> Secrets of an ex-Guitar Center employee - The Gear Page
> 
> Just lifted this from Jemsite... It's actually pretty honest, good advice from the other side, and worthy of a read.



Actually you just lifted it from The Gear Page Drew!  Hittin' the sauce a bit early in the day, aren't we?


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## Rick (Aug 15, 2007)

Pretty decent read.


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## Drew (Aug 15, 2007)

HighGain510 said:


> Actually you just lifted it from The Gear Page Drew!  Hittin' the sauce a bit early in the day, aren't we?



Um, actually, no, I DID lift it from Jemsite. 

http://www.jemsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66735

I just also, as you so succulently put it, don't assume anything because of what a link says.


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## HighGain510 (Aug 15, 2007)

Drew said:


> Um, actually, no, I DID lift it from Jemsite.
> 
> http://www.jemsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66735
> 
> I just also, as you so succulently put it, don't assume anything because of what a link says.



Oh okay, you saw the link to the story TGP on Jemsite. In the end still took the information from TGP though, eh?  Just sayin'.... you know... hehe...  I didn't assume though, the link does direct you to a post on The Gear Page.  Trust me, I don't make assumptions because I don't like people assuming things about me. It's not a one-way street with me!


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## Drew (Aug 15, 2007)

HighGain510 said:


> Oh okay, you saw the link to the story TGP on Jemsite. In the end still took the information from TGP though, eh?  Just sayin'.... you know... hehe...  I didn't assume though, the link does direct you to a post on The Gear Page.  Trust me, I don't make assumptions because I don't like people assuming things about me. It's not a one-way street with me!



Learn how to take a joke at your expense, foo!


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## HighGain510 (Aug 15, 2007)

It hurts so bad!!!


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## sakeido (Aug 15, 2007)

Man listening to all these responses makes me feel guilty... but my motivation is good! When I tell them what gear I have had, and why I didn't like it, it is because I am hoping they are going to point out something I might like and haven't thought of my own (you know, because they have an encyclopedic knowledge of gear)


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## HighGain510 (Aug 15, 2007)

sakeido said:


> Man listening to all these responses makes me feel guilty... but my motivation is good! When I tell them what gear I have had, and why I didn't like it, it is because I am hoping they are going to point out something I might like and haven't thought of my own (you know, because they have an encyclopedic knowledge of gear)




That's pretty much the same thing I have done, with some VERY specific suggestions as to what TYPE of sound I want to get. I haven't played EVERY amp out there, so if there's something that might come really close I don't mind them suggesting it, but it's when I say "I really love Mesa high gain, what would you suggest?" and they come back with "How about this Crate SS? Or maybe this Marshall MG 1x12 combo perhaps?", THAT is when I get pissed! I try to tell them (when they ask, of course) what type of gear I use and what type of sounds I'm looking for, but then again I know a lot more these days about gear, so when I shop I'm usually looking at eBay unless it's strings or picks and I need them ASAP.


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## B Lopez (Aug 16, 2007)

My local GC is actually really cool (San Jose, CA). Dudes there are friendly, and the older ones/longer term employees know their stuff. (Will still pressure for a sale though, but not like a new guy will). Their freaking hilarious to boot.


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## FortePenance (Aug 16, 2007)

We don't have GC here, we have this place called Tom Lee. The local TL is really cool to visit, and I know all the salespeople and we're good friends. The major Tom Lee (where they have authentic signed Gilbert, Slash, Herman Li and Vai guitars @[email protected]) is alright too, but they just aren't as friendly.


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## Ancestor (Aug 16, 2007)

The fact that they are commission based says it all. But the problem is that it shouldn't. There should be a minimum hourly against commission. 

When I go to Sam Ash or GC, I'm usually interested in buying something. Hell, I'm ALWAYS interested in buying something. But salespersons, you need to ease up and attract with honey not vinegar. Offer the lower price if you have it to give. Show me why I should buy it here. Don't queer your sale at the end by to trying to sell the extended warranty. Sometimes I want it, sometimes I don't. You'll find that out the First time you ask the question. 

The bottom line is, according to the postulate of G.A.S., we want to buy. But most people can tell when they're getting bullshitted, and it's totally disrespectful. 

I've worked sales a lot. I know it sucks. I feel sorry for each and every employee that has to deal with a constant pressure like that. It takes a hurculean amount of patience to deal with. I always keep that in mind, too.

*edit*

And then, of course, you have someone on the opposite side telling you, "Don't sell that at the lowest price. Bringing down the total sales for the store... etc., etc." That job is a BITCH! You have my sympathies.


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## Vision (Aug 16, 2007)

I still haven't figured out what "g.a.s." is.


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## FortePenance (Aug 16, 2007)

Gear Acquisition Syndrome. S'like when you see a guitar/amp/pedal/etc. and you want it really bad.


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## thedownside (Aug 16, 2007)

Ejaculadhesive said:


> Gear Acquisition Syndrome. S'like when you see a guitar/amp/pedal/etc. and you want it really bad.



you dont have to see it, or even know it exsists.... i often times new new gear, just cause i dont have any new gear


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## Jeff (Aug 16, 2007)

I worked at GC as well (for a very limited time). I disagree that corporate actually cares about their customers, as opposed to the bottom line. If they cared about their customers, they wouldn't have 100% commission based salespeople. 

Commission based sales, especially 100%, creates a cut throat atmosphere where all the salesman cares about it getting you out the door with something in a bag, and less money in your wallet. 

This is just my opinion, of course, but it creates an incredibly tense work environment between employees, and that trickles down to the customer.

If GC could possibly care less about someone, it's their own employees. Hence the 90 day lifespan. 

I'd like to see a statistic as to who was fired after that time period, and who just quit (like me).


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## Stitch (Aug 16, 2007)

Ancestor said:


> When I go to Sam Ash or GC, I'm usually interested in buying something. Hell, I'm ALWAYS interested in buying something. But salespersons, you need to ease up and attract with honey not vinegar. Offer the lower price if you have it to give. Show me why I should buy it here.



You are missing a huge fundamental piece here - shops need to make money. There is no point discounting things if there is no need to, especially if the shop makes more money. It is very rare that being £10 cheaper than the competition means all of their customers will come to you, so any argument that being cheaper attracts more customers doesnt hold as much water as some believe.

Mnay people view a discount as their indelible right - but I guarantee you, if we sold everything at the best price we could possibly do, people would _still_ ask for a discount or my 'best price on that'. And I have yet to have ONE customer who doesnt get moody as hell when you say you can't take any money off it. Many people fail to realise that shops aren't maiing 100+% profit on many things at all. Something I shouldn't really say but will anyway - in the UK at least, the 'best price' online for an Epiphone Les Paul Std. is about £10-20 over the buy-in price. We just don't make money off them, we rely on sales of strings, bags, effects, amps, leads - essentially, aftermarket sales - to recoup the cost of having the Epiphone in stock - because while we may make £10 off it, it sbeen taking up space where a BC Rich could have made us much more actual profit - even if they are half the price. (Figure that yourself, I can't say much more) 



Ancestor said:


> And then, of course, you have someone on the opposite side telling you, "Don't sell that at the lowest price. Bringing down the total sales for the store... etc., etc." That job is a BITCH! You have my sympathies.


Welcome to the fundamentals of business.  Customer wants cheapest price, seller once most profit.


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## Alex-D33 (Aug 16, 2007)

Although I do not have a GC in my town ( Canada ) Country . I do agree with the Guy on many points and thus every body who walks into a Music store can adopt the same philosophy .. Great find Drew . thanks 

oh !! and how is your UVWPH COMING ALONG ..SETUP & STUFF .


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## Drew (Aug 16, 2007)

She plays like a charm, dude.  Were you the one I owed neck shim pictures to? If so, I didn't have to do anything to it, but I'm SURE Chris will want me to set something up for him when next he's in town, so I'll tell him to bring a camera.


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## Alex-D33 (Aug 16, 2007)

Drew said:


> She plays like a charm, dude.  Were you the one I owed neck shim pictures to? If so, I didn't have to do anything to it, but I'm SURE Chris will want me to set something up for him when next he's in town, so I'll tell him to bring a camera.



 YUP!! THAT'S ME ..I would very much like if you & Chris could take a few pic's thanks again Drew .


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## garcia3441 (Aug 16, 2007)

Ejaculadhesive said:


> Gear Acquisition Syndrome. S'like when you see a guitar/amp/pedal/etc. and you want it really bad.



And you're willing to eat Ramen noodles everyday for 2 or 3 months straight to buy it.


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## msherman (Aug 16, 2007)

What I am curious about is how they determine what a used instrument is valued at, and who sets that limit?

I know that it`s trade in value is a maximum of 25% of list price.
The reason I would like to know is at my local GC, they have a Hamer Korena Artist Archtop that is #23 of the 100 limited editions (which I made) and they want $1900 firm for it. The sales guy told me that there were only 100 made and thats why they wanted top $$ for it.
He was suprised when I informed him that indeed it was #23 of the first limited editions, but 2 years later due to popular demand, we started building them as regular production models, so they really are not that rare.
They had a MSRP of $2,399.

I know what they paid for it. So what gives here......are they trying to hit a home run off of some unsuspecting person?


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## Stitch (Aug 16, 2007)

I can't speak for GC but at my work we work on a basic equation where second hand value ~= 2/3 of the new price. So you get half of that (or basically 1/3 of its new value).

The rules obviously vary if the instrument is particularly mint, paricularly beaten, or rare/desirable/old.

Unfortunately, actualy quality doesn't come into it. Otherwise we would never have bought in that BC Rich Bronze Beast i've been working on all day.  What a piece of junk.


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## Azyiu (Aug 17, 2007)

Nice read.  Honestly, I never have any really bad experience with GC, and a buddy of mine used to work at the Tucson store! So I pretty much knew how things are done there.


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## kmanick (Aug 17, 2007)

the guys at the GC in Boston will ben dover backward to "hook you up"
if you're actually a 'repeat" customer.
I've always had good experiences at that particular GC.


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## Ralyks (Jan 30, 2013)

Haven't had much problems with the store in Buffalo so far... And actually applied there yesterday because I need a damn job while I do my Masters on non of the bank jobs have called me back  . I feel like working at GC is going to be a mistake, but damn I need an income.


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## Dakotaspex (Jan 30, 2013)

Holy necro-bump, Batman.


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