# Now that BK's are $200 a pop what are people gravitating towards



## kmanick

I love the Nailbomb and Holydiver 7 string bridge pickups but at $200 a pop now, that ain't happening.
Anyone figure out Equivalents to these from different makers?
I've got that RG3727 landing tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that PAF bridge pick up is getting yanked.
Normally a nailbomb would be my first choice but at $200 a pop ..................... not so much
What's out there that's similar that won't break the bank? Pegasus?


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## eaeolian

Still using Wolfetones.


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## eaeolian

The Pegasus was the most boring, bland pickup I've ever used. Since you need a 7, try a Suhr Hot 7 set.


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## KnightBrolaire

elysian
instrumental
guitarmory

All of them hang with BKPs and cost far less ime.


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## IwantTacos

eaeolian said:


> Still using Wolfetones.



super underrated around here. the fenris is a great hot pickup.


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## Zhysick

kmanick said:


> I love the Nailbomb and Holydiver 7 string bridge pickups but at $200 a pop now, that ain't happening.
> Anyone figure out Equivalents to these from different makers?
> I've got that RG3727 landing tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that PAF bridge pick up is getting yanked.
> Normally a nailbomb would be my first choice but at $200 a pop ..................... not so much
> What's out there that's similar that won't break the bank? Pegasus?



Duncan Custom? I feel is kinda similar to the Nailbomb... Ceramic or alnico (Custom 5 then)

JB for a Holydiver... Not the same but in the ballpark. 

A lot cheaper specially since you can probably find them used for cheap.


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## Mathemagician

EMGs still in my case usually. 

I don’t know what kind of tone a $400 pickup set gives but I hope it’s what people are looking for.


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## død

I was gonna go for a Miracle Man in my ESP, but when they raised their prices again, I ultimately ended up with a Black Winter, which I’m very happy with. Sure, I wasn’t able to get fresh and snazzy colors, but it sounds great for the dissonant hardcore I play in my band.


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## Tree

I would say Nazgul Sentient combo, or Alpha Omega should work well. If not Duncan let’s you swap them until you’re happy. 

I haven’t felt the need to go back to BKP in years since they’ve raised prices and SD has been pumping out this newer wave of pickups.


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## CanserDYI

I have Pegasus in multiple guitars and really enjoy them personally.


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## kmanick

I have a Pegasus in my 7620 and I do like it
I guess the other option with BK is trying the True Grit Bootcamp bridge. I did have one of those in my old 752AHM but that guitar was so bright nothing sounded "right" in it and that's why i sold it. too bad too because I loved the neck on it.
My main rig these days is a Splawn Supersport through Scumback M75/J75 mix. I have lots of Mids already (it's a 2203 type of circuit and the Scumacks are higher watt versions of Greenback type of speakers)
I'll have to take a look at the EQ waves of the True grit vs the duncan offerings.


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## kmanick

eaeolian said:


> Still using Wolfetones.


Does wolftone do 7's the "Fenris" sounds right up my alley


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## bostjan

In the USA?

Elysian
EMG
Dimarzio
Seymour Duncan

I missed the bandwagon for Lace and Fishman, and I think that bus already left the station. They sure were popular a couple years ago.


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## Crungy

Does Elysian have a website that works?


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## Dumple Stilzkin

Lundgren black heavens are nice and grindy, EMG 81’s are a classic. Going to try a Duncan distortion I’ve got lying around to replace a Dimebucker. I will not change out my 2 PRS guitar’s pickups, they’re awesome.


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## KnightBrolaire

Crungy said:


> Does Elysian have a website that works?


He's going to put it back online once he's done moving.


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## Crungy

Right on. Do you have much for 7 string Elysian reviews in your pickup thread?


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## KnightBrolaire

Crungy said:


> Right on. Do you have much for 7 string Elysian reviews in your pickup thread?


nope, only 6 and 8 string stuff currently. There are 7 string demos floating around from other people though


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## wheresthefbomb

If you're looking for a boutique USA builder I highly recommend Avedissian. Good stuff, good dude.


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## bostjan

Crungy said:


> Right on. Do you have much for 7 string Elysian reviews in your pickup thread?


Dunno how well this represents the current/upcoming product line, but: https://www.sevenstring.org/threads/elysian-tap-review.323021/


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## budda

Call me crazy but I leave guitars stock these days.


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## Mathemagician

Wild man


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## MFB

Joke's on you if you think I ever stopped repping Duncans over anything else


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## odibrom

Small custom shops IS THE THING. You'll get to learn about pickups and have a made to measure set for the price of regular DiMarzios or Duncans...


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## oracles

Instrumental 
Avedissian 
Lundgren


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## HeHasTheJazzHands

wheresthefbomb said:


> If you're looking for a boutique USA builder I highly recommend Avedissian. Good stuff, good dude.



Had a dude hype him up to me. If my preference wasn't actives, I'd check them out.


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## dhgrind

SD black winters. Literally crushes any other pickup I’ve tried. Active or passive.


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## Emperoff

Meh. I love my Pegasus/Sentient set. They're my favourite set across all my guitars, including BKPs, Elysians, etc. They just work for everything and their output is just right. They'are also a very balanced set across all positions.

To some people that will mean they are characterless. And you know what? I'm fucking tired of the "character" of a pickup getting in the way. To me the best pickups are the ones I forget they're in there.

Give them a try. They're cheap, and if you don't like them, just sell them.


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## kmanick

So I just remembered I have a brand new in the box Blaze custom and a duncan distortion I pulled from a 7620
I have no experience with the blaze custom in a mahogany bodied maple top 7
anyone???


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## Flappydoodle

End of the day, there’s nothing you can’t play with a JB. All sorts of iconic, much-loved music was recorded with a plain old JB and a good picking hand. 

Same for EMG 81. It just works. 

If you want to get fancy, Lundgren is good too. But most boutique pickups are stupid IMO. BKP is still just cheap plastic, magnets and wire just like every other pickup. Blowing up the price due to the hype machine doesn’t mean they are somehow magical. These things go through trends. Fishman was the new hotness for a while, and now that’s totally died down. Guess what - I’m mostly back to EMG now.


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## Kyle Jordan

EMGs (60X specifically)
Fluence Classics

I can cover all I need so far with these.


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## setsuna7

Fishman Fluence. you get two for the price of one BKP. Yes, I know BKPs are awesome as fuck, had a Painkiller in an Apex 2 I used to own, but in these trying times, the Fluences are a better value for money IMHO. you get (essentially) 3 pickups in one set.


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## Hoss632

Guitarmory have pretty nice pick ups and sets can be had starting around 260. As for Duncan and Dimarzio, the Alpha/Omega set and the Titan's come to mind if a modern metal tone is more what you are after.


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## odibrom

kmanick said:


> So I just remembered I have a brand new in the box Blaze custom and a duncan distortion I pulled from a 7620
> I have no experience with the blaze custom in a mahogany bodied maple top 7
> anyone???



The Blaze Custom with mahogany body guitar was my reference tone for a long time. Do care to think about the volume pot value since it WILL filter higher frequencies. I'm using 1 Mega ohm pots for open throaty tones. The high end shines clearly through these pots.


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## eaeolian

kmanick said:


> Does wolftone do 7's the "Fenris" sounds right up my alley



He'll do a rewind for you, if you send him a Duncan/Duncan Designed 7 string pickup, but it's hard to find A2 magnets in the right size for a Fenris. Never hurts to ask, though - I chat with him through FB all the time, just DM him.


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## Matt08642

DiMarzio for life.


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## FitRocker33

The Duncan Custom in my ESP USA eclipse sounds as good to me as a fair majority of BKPs I’ve tried. I felt that bare knuckles were worth their price when I first got into them in 2010, when they were like 130 for a decked out model. But nowadays I’m not a buyer at their current prices.


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## bigcupholder

I rarely even splurge for Duncans anymore now that they're 50% more than Dimarzios in Canada. They used to be roughly the same. I've been interested in BKPs before but I definitely wouldn't spend $400 on a set of pickups.

So my answer is Dimarzio I guess.


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## Alberto7

BKPs are so expensive that I'd honestly rather experiment with pickups elsewhere. I have two Holy Divers and an Emerald on a couple of my guitars. Fantastic pickups, but I don't want to pay that amount of money for pickups any more... and that is considering I got a comparatively good deal on a brand new Holy Diver and Emerald set.

Been eyeing DiMarzios as of late. I REALLY want to try Lundgrens, but they seem to be just barely cheaper than BKPs.


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## kmanick

RG 3727 landed today , beautiful guitar...........that sounds like a 7 string strat, this bridge PAF-7 is as horrendous as I remember it in the 752AHM I had it in


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## Hoss632

Also figured I'd add. Me personally I do eventually want to try a BKP set, specifically the Ragnaroks. But for more affordable stuff the EMG Hot 70's set, Dimarzio Fortitude/PAF, Dream Catcher Rainmaker, and a few various Duncan sets are tops. Along with Kiesel Thorium/ MD12SD, Illusionist and Berylliums.


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## kmanick

going t sit on modding this for a while , I forgot I have a 7620 getting some work done on it and I only need on e7, so I'm going to leave this as is until that comes back and then decide which one I'm keeping.
thanks for all of the suggestions, keep them coming


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## Eyelessfiend

I only own one set of BKPs currently and I love em but BKP was never my first go to for pickups. I almost always use a Duncan or DiMarzio. But there are some awesome pickups companies out there. Guitarmory is really cool and Dunable makes some great pickups as well. Lace pickups also have their own thing to em as well.


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## EdgeCrusher

I always just go for Dimarzios. Love the D-Sonic 7 in my RG7621, I don't think I'll ever replace it. I actually did swap it once with an alnico Nailbomb, but just put the D-Sonic 7 back in since I preferred the attack and tightness. I have a set of Holy Divers in my RG8, but only because I found a used set on here a few years back for the same price as a new set of Dimarzios and wanted to try them out. Otherwise I would have gone with D-Activator 8's. I still want to try these out someday. I seem to prefer ceramic magnet pickups for the immediate attack and pick response. 

BKP's are good, no doubt, but not the be all end all.


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## Konfyouzd

Still a hardcore DiMarzio user... 

Blaze Custom and Blaze Neck
PAF 7 Bridge - Air Norton 7 Neck


Only if I don't like what comes stock in a guitar.


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## oracles

I forgot to mention Lollar. I picked up a set of Imperials a while ago and they're incredible.


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## Guamskyy

Dimarzio and Fishman, but Fishman is pretty pricey too tbh


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## Avedas

Thankfully I'm not really in the market for humbuckers and won't be for the foreseeable future. The Silo set is definitely a favorite and I have it in two (soon to be three) guitars.

I've been diving into the strat world lately. My Delos has a BKP Mother's Milk set in it which is great, but I've been hankering for a set of Genesis pups lately. They do clones of pretty hard to find strat sets, or in the case of the Silver Sky a set that you don't have to buy a $2500 guitar to get.


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## gclef

I can get what i want from a few companies

Harmonic design for single coils
Dimarzio for humbuckers

Lace pickups
Tone rider
Rio grande

There are literally tons of good winders out there, and so many reasonably priced pickups.

There is definitely something close to every bare knuckle pickup. Well, at least close enough that pickup and eq adjustments will get you there.

Player also matters.

I know i have the ability to make any pickup sound like shit. I can also make just about anything sound the same.

Full shreds with the tone rolled down a bit in my rg520qs sound very close to the breeds in my rg921 with the tone all the way up.

And the breeds (set very low) in the 921 sound close to the 36th in my ec401v. A bit thicker, but i can eq the breeds brighter or the 36th mids up a bit to match them.

If the pickup is close to the sound i want, i can work with it.


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## Mountainman

I feel like Seymour Duncan and Dimarzio both really stepped up their game when Bare Knuckle and other smaller companies started to get big. Out of the smaller guys BG pickups has remained a good value and a great product.


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## Spaced Out Ace

$400 for a pair of pickups?


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## AltecGreen

Spaced Out Ace said:


> $400 for a pair of pickups?




$1500 a pair for pickups is not unheard of in the PAF type markets.


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## bubingaisgod

kmanick said:


> I love the Nailbomb and Holydiver 7 string bridge pickups but at $200 a pop now, that ain't happening.
> Anyone figure out Equivalents to these from different makers?
> I've got that RG3727 landing tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that PAF bridge pick up is getting yanked.
> Normally a nailbomb would be my first choice but at $200 a pop ..................... not so much
> What's out there that's similar that won't break the bank? Pegasus?



I have Fokin Uppercuts in my Padalka Space 7, probably one of the best pickups I've used.


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## bubingaisgod

EdgeCrusher said:


> I always just go for Dimarzios. Love the D-Sonic 7 in my RG7621, I don't think I'll ever replace it. I actually did swap it once with an alnico Nailbomb, but just put the D-Sonic 7 back in since I preferred the attack and tightness. I have a set of Holy Divers in my RG8, but only because I found a used set on here a few years back for the same price as a new set of Dimarzios and wanted to try them out. Otherwise I would have gone with D-Activator 8's. I still want to try these out someday. I seem to prefer ceramic magnet pickups for the immediate attack and pick response.
> 
> BKP's are good, no doubt, but not the be all end all.



I have a D-Sonic and Air Norton in my 7321. Been playing it for 10 years and still one of my favorite combos.


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## Spaced Out Ace

AltecGreen said:


> $1500 a pair for pickups is not unheard of in the PAF type markets.


Aren't they just selling vintage PAFs from gutted guitars?


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## AltecGreen

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Aren't they just selling vintage PAFs from gutted guitars?


No. Vintage pickups can be even more.


@narad has been tring to get me to try some K+T pickups. Those are $1500 a pair new.


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## Kyle Jordan

AltecGreen said:


> No. Vintage pickups can be even more.
> 
> 
> @narad has been tring to get me to try some K+T pickups. Those are $1500 a pair new.



I suddenly feel less crazy now for wanting a custom set of Alembic Activators.


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## Spaced Out Ace

AltecGreen said:


> No. Vintage pickups can be even more.
> 
> 
> @narad has been tring to get me to try some K+T pickups. Those are $1500 a pair new.


Lmao, Jesus Christ. Imagine spending that much on the first element on the chain. It doesn’t have nearly the effect on the sound quite like the speakers and amp do. 

Insane.


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## narad

AltecGreen said:


> No. Vintage pickups can be even more.
> 
> 
> @narad has been tring to get me to try some K+T pickups. Those are $1500 a pair new.



Yea, but I acknowledge is about equally cheap to get a Crews KTR, take the pickups out, and then do whatever you want with the actual guitar.


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## AltecGreen

narad said:


> Yea, but I acknowledge is about equally cheap to get a Crews KTR, take the pickups out, and then do whatever you want with the actual guitar.


True. 


A friend found a Crews for sale in Chicago and the pickups had been changed to something else.


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## AltecGreen

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Lmao, Jesus Christ. Imagine spending that much on the first element on the chain. It doesn’t have nearly the effect on the sound quite like the speakers and amp do.
> 
> Insane.




That market seems to be specific for those chasing vintage Gibson tones.


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## Bg999

I love BKPs but I was recently very impressed by the dimarzio Transition set I installed in a mahogany/maple top RG. Head and shoulders above the gravity storms, super dist, tone zone/air norton I had previously in the same guitar.
It sounds very close to the BKP in my other guitar, just fatter, less aggressive and not as loud.


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## Lorcan Ward

Mountainman said:


> I feel like Seymour Duncan and Dimarzio both really stepped up their game when Bare Knuckle and other smaller companies started to get big. Out of the smaller guys BG pickups has remained a good value and a great product.





Competition is a good thing. Both those companies have brought out some of the best pickups in recent years as a result. Same way everyone stepped up their when Fractal got big.


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## NoodleFace

I typically go nazgul/sentient, but nazgul can be kind of divisive. 

Recently I had the wr7 which had DiMarzio imperium's and they might be the best pickups I've heard in a long time. 

My schecter has fishmans and they're meh just like emgs


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## pahulkster

Yeah I was going to do a full electronics swap in an RR5 with some custom BKs and their pots/caps etc. The order was over $500 and I couldn't pull the trigger. Like usual I'll just end up changing the bridge pickup.


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## IwantTacos

don't sleep on suhr or ta either.


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## Emperoff

Honestly, I'm 99% sure a big part of BKP's success (and business model) resides in their customization options. If other manufacturers offered custom covers, their sales would probably take a big hit, now that the "BKPs are always better" hype is long dead.

Duncan, and Dimarzio are not short on models. But the "aesthetics" factor on pickups is completely dominated by BKP, specially as long as extended range pickups are concerned.


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## AltecGreen

Emperoff said:


> Honestly, I'm 99% sure a big part of BKP's success (and business model) resides in their customization options. If other manufacturers offered custom covers, their sales would probably take a big hit, now that the "BKPs are always better" hype is long dead.
> 
> Duncan, and Dimarzio are not short on models. But the "aesthetics" factor on pickups is completely dominated by BKP, specially as long as extended range pickups are concerned.




This is a good point. Duncan also offer custom pickups. But then the prices of those are similar to BKP's.


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## Stuck_in_a_dream

KnightBrolaire said:


> elysian
> instrumental
> guitarmory
> 
> All of them hang with BKPs and cost far less ime.


K, so Elysian's web site is not up yet (down since 8/6/2021), as for Instrumental, or Guitarmory, any idea if they accommodate custom orders for slanted MS pickups? If so, how would I contact them? 

Thanks.


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## KnightBrolaire

Stuck_in_a_dream said:


> K, so Elysian's web site is not up yet (down since 8/6/2021), as for Instrumental, or Guitarmory, any idea if they accommodate custom orders for slanted MS pickups? If so, how would I contact them?
> 
> Thanks.


both of them will do custom multiscale slants. Instrumental is usually easy to contact on facebook or instagram. Michael (the owner of Guitarmory) is super active on facebook, or you could try shooting them an email. 

I haven't dealt with guitarmory since they shifted part of their product line to overseas though.


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## elkoki

I don't really see a need for botique pickups especially since most metal guitar recordings are processed like crazy and most guitarist use amp sims and axfx type gear which makes even stock pickups sound decent. I'm ok with buying used Dimarzio's, Duncans and Fluences.... nowadays you can find a bunch of deals on open box Fluence's, people buy them, try them once and return them, then they're relisted for almost half the price.

I've never used any BKP's and I honestly don't need to, I can't see them wowing me anymore than a Dimarzio.


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## TheBolivianSniper

elkoki said:


> I don't really see a need for botique pickups especially since most metal guitar recordings are processed like crazy and most guitarist use amp sims and axfx type gear which makes even stock pickups sound decent. I'm ok with buying used Dimarzio's, Duncans and Fluences.... nowadays you can find a bunch of deals on open box Fluence's, people buy them, try them once and return them, then they're relisted for almost half the price.
> 
> I've never used any BKP's and I honestly don't need to, I can't see them wowing me anymore than a Dimarzio.



I never really bought into the hype and only wanted one for the fancy covers but I will say I'd shell out for a Cpig again. The pickup completely transformed the guitar I put it in and not that it sounded bad at first, it just sounded ungodly amounts of great after the swap on whatever setting I wanted. Not sure about anything else but that thing was magical. Probably the only thing that sounds more pissed off than an X2N or 81.


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## eaeolian

oracles said:


> I forgot to mention Lollar. I picked up a set of Imperials a while ago and they're incredible.



The Imperials are awesome if that's the tone you're after, but they're not really in the high-output area.


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## Hoss632

IwantTacos said:


> don't sleep on suhr or ta either.


agreed. TA's pick ups have sounded amazing in the samples that I've heard. And they aren't terribly expensive either


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## BabUShka

I consider myself as Seymour Duncan guy, thats usually my go-to brand.
But lately the BKP's just really grown on me. Most BPK I've had, sounds really good - and the models are so different from each other. Right now I have the Mules, Riff Raff and Emerald installed in my guitars. Pluss I have a Nailbomb thats going into my JP6 soon. lately had a set of Painkillers, VHII, Rebel Yell and Black Dog. I regret selling them. Im happy to pay tge extra $$$. Otherwise, the SH1/SH5 combo is my second choise.


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## Cyanide_Anima

I'm in love with the BKP Painkillers and Aftermath. They're just so crisp and so "even" sounding as far as string balance goes. The Lundgren pickups have a similar evenness but more sterile and "Meshuggah" sounding. Nothing really comes close to that type of sound that the BKP have dialed in for rhythms. The Duncan JB is my favorite pickup outside of those. I even like the Dimarzio Blaze pups. Can make do with just about any decent pickup, though. I really like the Crunchlab 7 for leads, since its so mushy and full sounding it works great for leads and cleans but not great for low tuned chuggy stuff.


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## Mountainman

BabUShka said:


> I consider myself as Seymour Duncan guy, thats usually my go-to brand.
> But lately the BKP's just really grown on me. Most BPK I've had, sounds really good - and the models are so different from each other. Right now I have the Mules, Riff Raff and Emerald installed in my guitars. Pluss I have a Nailbomb thats going into my JP6 soon. lately had a set of Painkillers, VHII, Rebel Yell and Black Dog. I regret selling them. Im happy to pay tge extra $$$. Otherwise, the SH1/SH5 combo is my second choise.


SH5 is one of my all time favorites, I have tried replacing it with a lot of high end pickups in my Les Paul and it always goes back in. Too bad Seymour hasnt put out a neck pickup I like nearly as much lol


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## Marked Man

Mountainman said:


> SH5 is one of my all time favorites, I have tried replacing it with a lot of high end pickups in my Les Paul and it always goes back in. Too bad Seymour hasnt put out a neck pickup I like nearly as much lol



The only SD neck pickup I love is the '59N. 

DiMarzio on the other hand has lots of great neck HBs. They are generally less sweet and more rounded on top. Sound fuller and more shred oriented to me, I really dig fast alt-picking and the pick attack rules bigly.


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## mpexus

Suhr Pickups. Basically "Boutique" pickups without the Trendy price on them because they are not made from "Elfs hairs" and have all that crap manbo jambo "boutique shit" keeps writing. They are just Pickups that sound nice and cost what Pickups should cost.


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## Spaced Out Ace

Marked Man said:


> The only SD neck pickup I love is the '59N.
> 
> DiMarzio on the other hand has lots of great neck HBs. They are generally less sweet and more rounded on top. Sound fuller and more shred oriented to me, I really dig fast alt-picking and the pick attack rules bigly.


I think Eddie was contemplating going SD bridge and DiMarzio neck when he was testing out pickups for his EBMM signature, so I don't find that comment very surprising.


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## Marked Man

mpexus said:


> Suhr Pickups. Basically "Boutique" pickups without the Trendy price on them because they are not made from "Elfs hairs" and have all that crap manbo jambo "boutique shit" keeps writing. They are just Pickups that sound nice and cost what Pickups should cost.



But unicorn horn bobbins as used in booootique pickups really bring out the highs!


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## Choop

I've always been partial to Duncan (and occasionally EMG).


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## hensh!n

KnightBrolaire said:


> I haven't dealt with guitarmory since they shifted part of their product line to overseas though.


I can tell you from my experience it's been a nightmare. Waiting 6+ weeks to receive a set that wasn't properly fitted to a standard active route is not a good sign. Furthermore the pickup they delivered was noticeably larger than standard 7-string EMG/Fishman sets. It was also so deep that I would have had to route the body just so the pickup wouldn't hit the strings after installation. Not to mention the mysterious email drop off whenever you need something from them. I'm currently amidst a PayPal dispute where it seems like they picked up my package from USPS, but because it doesn't show "delivered", PayPal won't process a refund yet. I'd be wary of them going forward.

Meanwhile I ordered a set from Seymour Duncan, which they delivered in less than a week completely to spec as referenced on their site. I also ordered from Adam of Elysian, who delivered a properly fitted 7-string soapbar set in 6 weeks.


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## KnightBrolaire

hensh!n said:


> I can tell you from my experience it's been a nightmare. Waiting 6+ weeks to receive a set that wasn't properly fitted to a standard active route is not a good sign. Furthermore the pickup they delivered was noticeably larger than standard 7-string EMG/Fishman sets. It was also so deep that I would have had to route the body just so the pickup wouldn't hit the strings after installation. Not to mention the mysterious email drop off whenever you need something from them. I'm currently amidst a PayPal dispute where it seems like they picked up my package from USPS, but because it doesn't show "delivered", PayPal won't process a refund yet. I'd be wary of them going forward.
> 
> Meanwhile I ordered a set from Seymour Duncan, which they delivered in less than a week completely to spec as referenced on their site. I also ordered from Adam of Elysian, who delivered a properly fitted 7-string soapbar set in 6 weeks.


Man that sucks to hear. The only problem I had with them was I bought a standard 7 string veteran bridge and an 8 string patriot bridge, which took something like 6 months to get them shipped to me. I get that they prob got swamped with orders and were shifting production, etc, but it was extremely annoying to wait that long for a simple order. I had to personally contact Adam, and he made sure my pickups got shipped out the next day. 

I've also had some hiccups and delays dealing with Elysian as well over the years, but Adam has always made things right, and he's actually good at communicating. Both of those things are so damn rare in the guitar world ime.

My only experience with SD is that their custom shop sucks ass at communicating, but they'll deliver eventually. I ordered an 8 string set of black winters for a custom build and I had to wait something like 4 months back in 2016.


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## død

mpexus said:


> Suhr Pickups. Basically "Boutique" pickups without the Trendy price on them because they are not made from "Elfs hairs" and have all that crap manbo jambo "boutique shit" keeps writing. They are just Pickups that sound nice and cost what Pickups should cost.


Fuckin’ this. Picked up a V60LP a couple of months ago, absolutely beautiful sounding neck pickup, and sounds mean as fuck when you crank up the gain. I’m realllly tempted to try out an Aldrich bridge at some point now.


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## Adieu

Marked Man said:


> The only SD neck pickup I love is the '59N.
> 
> DiMarzio on the other hand has lots of great neck HBs. They are generally less sweet and more rounded on top. Sound fuller and more shred oriented to me, I really dig fast alt-picking and the pick attack rules bigly.



Well that's pretty predictable, since most SD "sets" have unique neck pickups in name only... almost all except DD/BW are PAF winds with one of 2 different mags (very occasionally a couple other ones). They DO have different winds... per the specs... but the +/- difference is less than the actual tolerance of new-in-box SD pickups vs. official specs, so I'm tempted to call BS on that.

DiMarzio otoh has actual unique pickup models for neck use.


----------



## JimF

I'm glad someone else has spotted the BKP price hike. I thought it was just me!
One thing to bear in mind is that they're a UK company, and supply chains post-covid are wrecked. Also, the covid backlog and more importantly Brexit have shafted us big time. So perhaps the price increases are down to increasing costs. Tim's margin might be the same.
I've always fancied trying some BKP but I couldn't bring myself to try them when I already had pickups I loved.
I'm a huge SD Pegasus fan. The Nazgul is great but it can sound a bit harsh in some guitars, but the Pegasus just sounds "right". My tone is very similar to Ola Englunds so I'm planning on looking into his pickup choices pre Duncan Solar (Think they were the Custom, Custom 5, Custom Custom etc).
But I've got the Pegasus in 3 guitars, one 7 string tuned to Drop A, a 6 string tuned to Drop C, and a 6 string in standard, and I love them.


----------



## kmanick

I also have a Duncan distortion 7 laying around I wonder if I swap the magnet to an Alnico 5 it would warm it up without killing the essence of what it is? I like that pickup but it's a bit harsh on upper register notes.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

kmanick said:


> I also have a Duncan distortion 7 laying around I wonder if I swap the magnet to an Alnico 5 it would warm it up without killing the essence of what it is? I like that pickup but it's a bit harsh on upper register notes.


Alnico 8 might also be worth checking out. Just make sure it's a double thickness magnet.


----------



## Crungy

All this talk about bare knucks is kinda making we want some


----------



## hensh!n

KnightBrolaire said:


> Man that sucks to hear. The only problem I had with them was I bought a standard 7 string veteran bridge and an 8 string patriot bridge, which took something like 6 months to get them shipped to me. I get that they prob got swamped with orders and were shifting production, etc, but it was extremely annoying to wait that long for a simple order. I had to personally contact Adam, and he made sure my pickups got shipped out the next day.
> 
> I've also had some hiccups and delays dealing with Elysian as well over the years, but Adam has always made things right, and he's actually good at communicating. Both of those things are so damn rare in the guitar world ime.
> 
> My only experience with SD is that their custom shop sucks ass at communicating, but they'll deliver eventually. I ordered an 8 string set of black winters for a custom build and I had to wait something like 4 months back in 2016.


Yeah it's a bummer. My guitar has very specific active routing, so if you're BKP for example and don't conform to the traditional EMG/Fishman route, then further routing will be required in order to get the pickups to fit.

For Elysian pickups, I cut Adam some slack since from what I understand, he's a one man show. 

I haven't been able to get SD Custom Shop to respond to my emails at all (trying to order custom 7-string sets). Do you have any tips??? I put in a Duncan Custom recently and it sounds great for my tastes.


----------



## Jeffrey Bain

Schecter Pickups are super legit, just depends on what you're looking for. Any of their custom shop tiered pickups are awesome IME.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

hensh!n said:


> Yeah it's a bummer. My guitar has very specific active routing, so if you're BKP for example and don't conform to the traditional EMG/Fishman route, then further routing will be required in order to get the pickups to fit.
> 
> For Elysian pickups, I cut Adam some slack since from what I understand, he's a one man show.
> 
> I haven't been able to get SD Custom Shop to respond to my emails at all (trying to order custom 7-string sets). Do you have any tips??? I put in a Duncan Custom recently and it sounds great for my tastes.


Yeah, here's a tip, don't order from SD custom shop.


----------



## Emperoff

kmanick said:


> I also have a Duncan distortion 7 laying around I wonder if I swap the magnet to an Alnico 5 it would warm it up without killing the essence of what it is? I like that pickup but it's a bit harsh on upper register notes.



If you do that, you will turn it into a JB.


----------



## Guamskyy

Dimarzio has also been my fallback but after my fishman modern tosin set, I have those 2 choices now.


----------



## mrdm53

Fishman, but not Moderns. I love my KM8 set. Unfortunately they have to discontinue that series because Keith decide to not to be endorsed by them anymore for whatever purposes.


----------



## kmanick

Well I decided to go with Mikes recommendation and I have Suhr Hot 7 incoming for the bridge. I found a brand new Air Norton 7 (I'm finding all sorts of shit lately) in one of my Pickup draws so I'll throw that in the neck. I couldn't find a Suhr Hot 7 neck, if I like the bridge enough I may get the match for it. I've listened to a couple of vids of the Alldrich through a Splawn and I think I may end up loving this pickup.


----------



## Alberto7

Samarin said:


> ... So the feel factor is main from this perspective...


I think this is what it boils down to, for me.

For a listener, the pickup won't make that huge of a difference. At the end of the day, you can EQ any frequencies you want in or out of a mix/recording.

A pickup just makes me feel a particular way when I notice how it reacts to my playing. I play something and I expect to hear something in return, instantly. It's that transient sort of feedback that I think affects my judgement of a pickup.

... that's my running theory, at least.


----------



## Mura

I use Lundgren PU.
The M-series, a ruthless metal engine, is famous, but all the other PUs are great and Black Heaven is my favorite.

Also, I have ordered a PU from a Russian manufacturer called ARB Pickup and am waiting for it to arrive.
I can't say anything unless I actually use it, but as far as I can hear it on youtube etc., it seems to have a good sound.
The price is also very reasonable.


----------



## youngthrasher9

I loved the Dimarzio Titan set, but I know they’re not for everyone. I opted for the D-Activator bridge in my number 1, but I’ll be the first to admit I find it slightly bass heavy for b standard or lower. However there is a minor circuit mod one can do to improve tightness with passive pickups. I can’t remember exactly how to do it as it’s been 3+ years but it involves a resistor of a certain value.


----------



## mbardu

Get actual Schecter USA SuperChargers and thank me later.
You can probably get _the pair_ used for quite a bit less than those 200$.


----------



## kmanick

found a suhr Neck pickup to go with the Hot 7 bridge, hopefully getting them installed this weekend


----------



## eaeolian

død said:


> Fuckin’ this. Picked up a V60LP a couple of months ago, absolutely beautiful sounding neck pickup, and sounds mean as fuck when you crank up the gain. I’m realllly tempted to try out an Aldrich bridge at some point now.



The Aldrich is one of my favorite bridge pickups. They do, in general, make good pickups, that land somewhere between DiMarzio and Duncan in tone.


----------



## eaeolian

kmanick said:


> found a suhr Neck pickup to go with the Hot 7 bridge, hopefully getting them installed this weekend



Cool. I like the pair in my DR7 quite a bit.


----------



## DeathByButterslax

I can get Lundgrens locally for about 450CAD a set, which is quite cheaper than BK set right now. Currently, I have a BH, M6 and M8 set in my guitars. I am really digging them, I would like to try some Suhr stuff though


----------



## SCJR

Keep 'em.

Give Avedissian a try.


----------



## syzygy

youngthrasher9 said:


> I loved the Dimarzio Titan set, but I know they’re not for everyone. I opted for the D-Activator bridge in my number 1, but I’ll be the first to admit I find it slightly bass heavy for b standard or lower. However there is a minor circuit mod one can do to improve tightness with passive pickups. I can’t remember exactly how to do it as it’s been 3+ years but it involves a resistor of a certain value.


What is it that you like about the Titans? I only ask because there's one or two pickups I'd love to try down the line, and the Titan is on the top of that list


----------



## Marked Man

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Lmao, Jesus Christ. Imagine spending that much on the first element on the chain. It doesn’t have nearly the effect on the sound quite like the speakers and amp do.
> 
> Insane.



Speakers and cabs are HUGE. Real Tonefreaks know this. 

Pickups are also very important, but my upper limit is BKP.

I was just playing my D Activator set tonight and thinking how much fun it would be to have the same set in another guitar soon. Excellent cleans when split, which is often not the case for pickups as hot as these. They are killer for '80s inspired Thrash, which is one of my favorite stomping grounds.


----------



## youngthrasher9

syzygy said:


> What is it that you like about the Titans? I only ask because there's one or two pickups I'd love to try down the line, and the Titan is on the top of that list


They are incredibly articulate for the feeling of them, if that makes sense. It’s like the string clarity and note separation are great but there’s not as much “fight” to get the attack or output you want compared to most of the “tight” sounding pickups I’ve tried.


----------



## syzygy

youngthrasher9 said:


> They are incredibly articulate for the feeling of them, if that makes sense. It’s like the string clarity and note separation are great but there’s not as much “fight” to get the attack or output you want compared to most of the “tight” sounding pickups I’ve tried.


Thanks, that definitely is a selling point for me because I hate having to dig in super hard to get more attack! Another question, then, and I know this is a super lame question that everyone asks about every pickup ever, but how versatile are the Titans? I imagine that given Periphery's variety of sounds they can cover a number of styles, but what are the cleans/splits like? do they clean up decently?


----------



## youngthrasher9

syzygy said:


> Thanks, that definitely is a selling point for me because I hate having to dig in super hard to get more attack! Another question, then, and I know this is a super lame question that everyone asks about every pickup ever, but how versatile are the Titans? I imagine that given Periphery's variety of sounds they can cover a number of styles, but what are the cleans/splits like? do they clean up decently?


They clean up and split beautifully imo.


----------



## syzygy

youngthrasher9 said:


> They clean up and split beautifully imo.


Thanks! Probably gonna try and grab a covered set down the line then!


----------



## IwantTacos

mojotone also makes good pickups


----------



## cmpxchg

syzygy said:


> Thanks, that definitely is a selling point for me because I hate having to dig in super hard to get more attack! Another question, then, and I know this is a super lame question that everyone asks about every pickup ever, but how versatile are the Titans? I imagine that given Periphery's variety of sounds they can cover a number of styles, but what are the cleans/splits like? do they clean up decently?


I put a set of Titans in an Ibanez yesterday after I wasn't satisfied with the BKP True Grits in there (I love those pickups, but they were wrong for what I want from that guitar). So far, and this sounds like damning with faint praise but it's not intended as such, I'd call the Titans generically modern in a nice way. There's no cocked wah thing that I've noticed, the bass (in the bridge at least) isn't boomy, they're not super saturated all the time, they clean up nicely, they've still got the faster response that I associate with hotter/more modern voiced pickups vs PAF-voiced. The neck is maybe surprisingly warm and close in output to the bridge, but the split inner coils in series sounds great with low gain. I suspected I'd hate them, but I don't at all.


----------



## syzygy

Well then that's definitely what I'm looking for then, if it can be molded via EQ to whatever I want that's a definite bonus. And I also really like the 5 way Ibanez wiring where you have the neck pickup wired in parallel on 4th position, so if the neck pickup is super warm and has good output that's a super big selling point for me


----------



## cmpxchg

syzygy said:


> Well then that's definitely what I'm looking for then, if it can be molded via EQ to whatever I want that's a definite bonus. And I also really like the 5 way Ibanez wiring where you have the neck pickup wired in parallel on 4th position, so if the neck pickup is super warm and has good output that's a super big selling point for me


yeah, that's how I've got it wired. not as big of a fan of the neck in parallel as I am with other pickups, but it might need more height adjustments (haven't touched pole pieces yet).


----------



## syzygy

cmpxchg said:


> yeah, that's how I've got it wired. not as big of a fan of the neck in parallel as I am with other pickups, but it might need more height adjustments (haven't touched pole pieces yet).


Good to know. Take this with a grain of salt because I haven't personally tried them but I've heard that specifically the Titans are a set of pickups that are absurdly picky about pickup height, and that even small changes can have some pretty major results.


----------



## trickae

KnightBrolaire said:


> elysian
> instrumental
> guitarmory
> 
> All of them hang with BKPs and cost far less ime.


How have the guitarmory atlas' held up over the years? Do they compare to say Lundgrens, BKP's and Seymour Duncans?


----------



## KnightBrolaire

trickae said:


> How have the guitarmory atlas' held up over the years? Do they compare to say Lundgrens, BKP's and Seymour Duncans?


Atlas are solid. Not really my thing as they're very modern mid/djenty voiced in the vein of juggernauts or such. They're definitely comparable to BKPs, etc ime. 
I actually traded my atlas set for some jim root daemonums (which I still haven't bothered installing).


----------



## Legion

Guitarmory seems to have jacked up prices. Base models without covers and fancy bling seem ot be 190 bucks a pop...we're in "yeah nope" territory again, just like BKP


----------



## Zado

mbardu said:


> Get actual Schecter USA SuperChargers and thank me later.
> You can probably get _the pair_ used for quite a bit less than those 200$.



Nah, Schecter pups are not trendy enough.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

Legion said:


> Guitarmory seems to have jacked up prices. Base models without covers and fancy bling seem ot be 190 bucks a pop...we're in "yeah nope" territory again, just like BKP


they're 300$ a set now. Still cheaper than BKP or lundgren


----------



## TheBolivianSniper

fishmans are now within touching distance of Duncans on the used market and usually come with wiring


----------



## cmpxchg

I think I paid 175 for new Titans and I'm still really happy with them. I feel stupid for ignoring DiMarzio for so long. 


TheBolivianSniper said:


> fishmans are now within touching distance of Duncans on the used market and usually come with wiring


I wish I had some idea of which Fishmans might suit me better than the Moderns. Even with the low gain jumper, something about the Moderns doesn't sit right for me (mid spike, compression, something?). They're my first active pickup (in a Duvell) and idk, maybe I just need to swap them out for passives or try the Tosins or something. They are the only thing I don't love about that guitar.


----------



## Alberto7

cmpxchg said:


> I think I paid 175 for new Titans and I'm still really happy with them. I feel stupid for ignoring DiMarzio for so long.
> 
> I wish I had some idea of which Fishmans might suit me better than the Moderns. Even with the low gain jumper, something about the Moderns doesn't sit right for me (mid spike, compression, something?). They're my first active pickup (in a Duvell) and idk, maybe I just need to swap them out for passives or try the Tosins or something. They are the only thing I don't love about that guitar.


Not super sure what it is either, but I crank up the bass and low mids a lot on my Strandberg with Moderns. They're totally different sounding from my other guitars with passives. I like the cleans on the Moderns (especially the AlNiCo neck) better than most distorted sounds I can get from them.


----------



## Neon_Knight_

Marked Man said:


> Speakers and cabs are HUGE. Real Tonefreaks know this.
> 
> Pickups are also very important, but my upper limit is BKP.
> 
> I was just playing my D Activator set tonight and thinking how much fun it would be to have the same set in another guitar soon. Excellent cleans when split, which is often not the case for pickups as hot as these. They are killer for '80s inspired Thrash, which is one of my favorite stomping grounds.


I will never understand how D Activators aren't more popular.

I have 3 sets


----------



## Tree

Neon_Knight_ said:


> I will never understand how D Activators aren't more popular.
> 
> I have 3 sets


Half of the time I suggest pickups to people I feel like I end up saying D Activators 
It's probably even more than that. I just did in another thread yesterday.


----------



## Emperoff

What this thread is telling me (and it's a very good thing) is that pickup hype days are long gone. It seems there is no "favlour of the month" pickup anymore, since there are so many choices at the moment that there is something for everyone.

Both Fishman and BKP hype has dissappeared. Plenty of Fishman users are going back to EMG. "EMG sucks" days are also gone, and BKP killed their own hype with a huge price increase. This in turn made Lundgren pickups seem more affordable (since they've barely increased in price over the years and no import taxes are involved).

Not bad, I guess!


----------



## estin

^ i never understood the hype of fishman or bkp from a sound stand point. Marketing wise it seems to work when you come out with a new product and just price it at 1.5 - 2X higher than similar products. 

there was some artist that switched from emg to fishman and started saying how fishman tracks his playing so fast that he cant play emg anymore because they are just too slow....... meanwhile its an analog pickup with no latency that he is running through a wireless system through amps, through rack gear, into a PA, out PA speakers and likely monitoring on wireless in ears.


----------



## Wc707

estin said:


> ^ i never understood the hype of fishman or bkp from a sound stand point. Marketing wise it seems to work when you come out with a new product and just price it at 1.5 - 2X higher than similar products.
> 
> there was some artist that switched from emg to fishman and started saying how fishman tracks his playing so fast that he cant play emg anymore because they are just too slow....... meanwhile its an analog pickup with no latency that he is running through a wireless system through amps, through rack gear, into a PA, out PA speakers and likely monitoring on wireless in ears.


I believe that artist is Matt Heafy, from Trivium. I think he either said it on a livestream [he's very active on Twitch] or in an interview.
Edit: found it


Redirect Notice



"That was one of those things that were bugging me – I thought it was playing, feel, I thought I was getting too into it or something, but it’s perfectly locked-in now. I didn’t know that was a component of what I was missing.

What I’ve seen is there’s less latency. And it must be micro-milliseconds of latency that I got used to. But whatever it might have been, it’s less now. And that is so huge for me. *I’ve actually become a better player from these pickups* – I really have."


----------



## eaeolian

estin said:


> ^ i never understood the hype of fishman or bkp from a sound stand point. Marketing wise it seems to work when you come out with a new product and just price it at 1.5 - 2X higher than similar products.
> 
> there was some artist that switched from emg to fishman and started saying how fishman tracks his playing so fast that he cant play emg anymore because they are just too slow....... meanwhile its an analog pickup with no latency that he is running through a wireless system through amps, through rack gear, into a PA, out PA speakers and likely monitoring on wireless in ears.


Yeah, I saw that, too, but I don't remember who it was. It's hilarious, though.


----------



## eaeolian

Wc707 said:


> I believe that artist is Matt Heafy, from Trivium. I think he either said it on a livestream [he's very active on Twitch] or in an interview.
> 
> 
> 
> Redirect Notice


Yeah, that was it. He gets good tone, but I doubt the lack of latency in an inherently latency-free pickup is a part of it.


----------



## Wc707

eaeolian said:


> Yeah, that was it. He gets good tone, but I doubt the lack of latency in an inherently latency-free pickup is a part of it.


Yeah I agree. Seems like a marketing gimmick, honestly. But I guess the guys gotta diversify his income somehow


----------



## SCJR

cmpxchg said:


> I think I paid 175 for new Titans and I'm still really happy with them. I feel stupid for ignoring DiMarzio for so long.
> 
> I wish I had some idea of which Fishmans might suit me better than the Moderns. Even with the low gain jumper, something about the Moderns doesn't sit right for me (mid spike, compression, something?). They're my first active pickup (in a Duvell) and idk, maybe I just need to swap them out for passives or try the Tosins or something. They are the only thing I don't love about that guitar.



Just switched out moderns for the Abasis and it's a marked improvement.


----------



## eaeolian

Wc707 said:


> Yeah I agree. Seems like a marketing gimmick, honestly. But I guess the guys gotta diversify his income somehow


I'm sure he switched out something else.


----------



## Wc707

eaeolian said:


> I'm sure he switched out something else.


Hahaha true that. Him and Corey were loooongtime EMG guys, [Corey got his own SD set] so I was surprised he switched. Guess EMG didn't wanna make them a deal.. Most Triviut fans swear that Shogun [EMGs through 5150s] was the best tone they've every had.


----------



## lewstherin006

Ram 2500 with the 6.7 Cummins


----------



## Neon_Knight_

Tree said:


> Half of the time I suggest pickups to people I feel like I end up saying D Activators
> It's probably even more than that. I just did in another thread yesterday.


My perception is that they get recommended far more than used. Also, half the "recommendations" I see are along the lines of:

D Activators would probably work for you, but [insert EMGs / BKPs / Black Winters] are even better.

or

D Activators might work for you, but I found them too hot and awful for cleans.


----------



## STRHelvete

I just stopped by to see what everyone's talking about. I don't know anything about Lundgrens, BKPs, Fishmans or any of that. A simple Seymour Duncan Custom suits me just fine


----------



## ChrispyFinch

Duncan JB/Jazz sounds great in 90% of things imo, dimarzio otherwise. Just got a Dimarzio 36th Anni PAF set that sounds great in my V.
I will say that i've had BK warpigs in a few guitars and they have been my favorite pickup ever, but i dont actively buy them to swap into guitars.


----------



## Wusthof XIII

Admittedly, I didn’t go through all 7 pages of this thread, but I have 10 guitars and 7 of them have BKP’s installed.

The non-BKP bridge pickup that sounds absolutely amazing is the Lundgren M7 - you won’t be disappointed.


----------



## SCJR

wheresthefbomb said:


> If you're looking for a boutique USA builder I highly recommend Avedissian. Good stuff, good dude.


+1 for Avedissian. Had a set of Scythes in a heavily modded Duo Jet and that thing was so much fun.


----------



## chemicalcauses

I’m quite partial to my Lace pups. Also a big fan of Dimarzio.


----------



## epsylon

The trick is to buy the SDs and DiMarzios and EMGs from the people who swap them out for $400 BKPs.


----------



## estin

epsylon said:


> The trick is to buy the SDs and DiMarzios and EMGs from the people who swap them out for $400 BKP



he has revealed the way!


----------



## KnightBrolaire

epsylon said:


> The trick is to buy the SDs and DiMarzios and EMGs from the people who swap them out for $400 BKPs.


shh don't give away the secret


----------



## Neon_Knight_

epsylon said:


> The trick is to buy the SDs and DiMarzios and EMGs from the people who swap them out for $400 BKPs.


Unfortunately the UK used pickup market is really poor. On average, only about £10-15 cheaper than new (unless aesthetically damaged), so I'd prefer to pay full price and get a 2-3 year warranty.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

eaeolian said:


> Yeah, that was it. He gets good tone, but I doubt the lack of latency in an inherently latency-free pickup is a part of it.


Had good tone. Ever since he switched to Kemper and Fishman weeeeeeeeeeew his tone took a steaming cocked-wah shit. 


Wc707 said:


> Hahaha true that. Him and Corey were loooongtime EMG guys, [Corey got his own SD set] so I was surprised he switched. Guess EMG didn't wanna make them a deal.. Most Triviut fans swear that Shogun [EMGs through 5150s] was the best tone they've every had.


I thought the same thing but apparently Shogun was custom-wound Dean passives?


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

chemicalcauses said:


> I’m quite partial to my Lace pups. Also a big fan of Dimarzio.


Speaking of Lace, anyone ever tried the FInger Burners? Always wanted to check them out.


----------



## Eyelessfiend

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Speaking of Lace, anyone ever tried the FInger Burners? Always wanted to check them out.


I tried em them out in my ex bandmates strat. It was really crunchy like a Duncan Distortion but a bit rounder in the bass and didn't feel as hot. Compared to my strat with a Drop N Gain it was brighter, more top end and felt less hot. The Nitro Hemi is also pretty fun but was really picky about the guitar it went in


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Eyelessfiend said:


> I tried em them out in my ex bandmates strat. It was really crunchy like a Duncan Distortion but a bit rounder in the bass and didn't feel as hot. Compared to my strat with a Drop N Gain it was brighter, more top end and felt less hot. The Nitro Hemi is also pretty fun but was really picky about the guitar it went in


I had a Drop n Gain and I couldn't stand it.  Way EXTREMELY dark and mid-heavy.


----------



## Eyelessfiend

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I had a Drop n Gain and I couldn't stand it.  Way EXTREMELY dark and mid-heavy.


That's exactly how I would describe the Drop N Gain lol its probably the darkest pickup I've ever played and never would I have thought a pickup could have more mids than a Super 3 but the Drop N Gain does haha


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Eyelessfiend said:


> That's exactly how I would describe the Drop N Gain lol its probably the darkest pickup I've ever played and never would I have thought a pickup could have more mids than a Super 3 but the Drop N Gain does haha


It definitely does have a tight low end, but it's got a maaaaasssive midrange bump and no high end.

It's definitely the pickup that scared me off other pickups with stupid high DCR measurements. I think the D&G is like 25k? Which is actually the same as the Super 3. By comparison the previously mentioned Duncan Distortion and Nitro Hemi (EDIT: Whoops, that's the neck. bridge is 19k) are only 16k and the Finger Burners are 14k.


----------



## KnightBrolaire

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> It definitely does have a tight low end, but it's got a maaaaasssive midrange bump and no high end.
> 
> It's definitely the pickup that scared me off other pickups with stupid high DCR measurements. I think the D&G is like 25k? Which is actually the same as the Super 3. By comparison the previously mentioned Duncan Distortion and Nitro Hemi (EDIT: Whoops, that's the neck. bridge is 19k) are only 16k and the Finger Burners are 14k.


dcr is basically useless for apples to apples output comparison . Henries or millivolts are actually good indicators of output.


----------



## eaeolian

Wc707 said:


> Hahaha true that. Him and Corey were loooongtime EMG guys, [Corey got his own SD set] so I was surprised he switched. Guess EMG didn't wanna make them a deal.. Most Triviut fans swear that Shogun [EMGs through 5150s] was the best tone they've every had.



It's kinda hard to argue with that tone combination - it's up there with EMGs and a Recto for iconic.


----------



## eaeolian

epsylon said:


> The trick is to buy the SDs and DiMarzios and EMGs from the people who swap them out for $400 BKPs.



Even that's not what it used to be. Used Duncans used to go for $40. Now, people want 10% off MAP.


----------



## Wc707

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Had good tone. Ever since he switched to Kemper and Fishman weeeeeeeeeeew his tone took a steaming cocked-wah shit.
> 
> I thought the same thing but apparently Shogun was custom-wound Dean passives?


Yeah, it's the most cocked-wah tone I've ever heard. Not a fan.

I'll have to do some research and verify? 


eaeolian said:


> It's kinda hard to argue with that tone combination - it's up there with EMGs and a Recto for iconic.


----------



## budda

Well my vineham JM bridge pickup came in and got installed. That guitar sounds fantastic and like a JM should. 

Im debating a set of his Royal (A3) to mess with. His site description says the A2 is more compressed and that surprised me, but admittedly I have not done the deep dive in research.


----------



## STRHelvete

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Had good tone. Ever since he switched to Kemper and Fishman weeeeeeeeeeew his tone took a steaming cocked-wah shit.
> 
> I thought the same thing but apparently Shogun was custom-wound Dean passives?


Dean pickups are surprisingly good. I love the Time Capsules so much so that until I found the SD Custom, it was my favorite pickup


----------



## CanserDYI

I know most people hate the cocked wah tone, but with my 8 string, adding a wah at the beginning of my chain cocking it and setting the mix to 10% sounds great to me.


----------



## TheBolivianSniper

Does anyone have a cheap substitute for a ceramic Warpig

I don't have bare knuckle money and my metal X sounds so so stiff and mid focused

like yeah the ormsby pickups are tight and pretty clear but my amps are already decently tight and I'm tired of cranking the gain and smashing the strings


----------



## Wc707

CanserDYI said:


> I know most people hate the cocked wah tone, but with my 8 string, adding a wah at the beginning of my chain cocking it and setting the mix to 10% sounds great to me.


----------



## Alex79

TheBolivianSniper said:


> Does anyone have a cheap substitute for a ceramic Warpig
> 
> I don't have bare knuckle money and my metal X sounds so so stiff and mid focused
> 
> like yeah the ormsby pickups are tight and pretty clear but my amps are already decently tight and I'm tired of cranking the gain and smashing the strings



The BKP Brute Force isn't too far from the Ceramic Warpig; it sits kind of in between the Warpig and the Miracle Man IMO.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

CanserDYI said:


> I know most people hate the cocked wah tone, but with my 8 string, adding a wah at the beginning of my chain cocking it and setting the mix to 10% sounds great to me.


Probably sounds great on the lowest 3, but I cringe knowing how it would sound on the high strings.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Wc707 said:


> Yeah, it's the most cocked-wah tone I've ever heard. Not a fan.
> 
> I'll have to do some research and verify?
> 
> View attachment 106341











Guitar Messenger – Matt Heafy Interview (Trivium)


Guitar Messenger is an online music magazine dedicated to providing the highest quality and most in-depth guitar related interviews, lessons, news, and reviews possible.




guitarmessenger.com







> MH: I love talking about gear, by the way. *I’m not with Dean anymore, but at the time, I was using this Dean MKH seven-string prototype that we made with my custom pickups and this custom guitar. *We had really thick-ass strings. I believe in B standard, for the seven-string, we were using .13 to .68s, something ridiculous for standard tuning, because we knew it would sound thicker, and with Jazz 3 picks.
> 
> We went into a triple-splitting box. The first signal went into one specific kind of overdrive into a Peavey head, I believe it was a 5152, and then into a classic Marshall cab with two mics on top of that. The second signal was another overdrive from a different brand, probably an MXR OD, going into a Peavey 6505+, then into a Marshall White Tolex classic cab with two mics on top of that. I might be getting some of the details off wrong, but you get the general idea.
> 
> The next one was another overdrive pedal going into a classic Orange head into what I believe was a Mesa cab. So basically we had three different overdrives, three different heads, three different cabs and six different mics, and that was one guitar sound. That was one guitar sound a side – that wasn’t a split channel or anything, so all of that into one tone. So we did two of those, versus doing the normal four.
> 
> Normally what we did on our previous records, we’d do a DI, send it off to our mixer, they’d re-amp it, and we would have one guitar through one head on this side, one guitar through one head, one guitar through one head… four and four. But this time it’s the massive sound on each side, and then the middle guy that would show up every once in a while, and then a couple of overdubs that’ll show up somewhere else.



I'm also assuming this is the guitar









Dean Matt Heafy Custom 7 2008 Faded white | Reverb


listed here is my cherished Dean Custom Shop / Prototype Matt Heafy 7 string. this is THE GUITAR used to record the rhythm tracks on Trivium’s 4th album Shogun. made out of solid mahogany and adorned with an ebony fretboard, she sound absolutely massive. If you’ve heard the album or seen the less...




reverb.com


----------



## CanserDYI

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Probably sounds great on the lowest 3, but I cringe knowing how it would sound on the high strings.


Thats why I kept it low to 10% I PERSONALLY don't find the high end to be shrill or anything, but lets face it, I'm on those bottom 3 strings more than 75% of the time haha

I should just get a baritone for christ sake.


----------



## Tree

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Guitar Messenger – Matt Heafy Interview (Trivium)
> 
> 
> Guitar Messenger is an online music magazine dedicated to providing the highest quality and most in-depth guitar related interviews, lessons, news, and reviews possible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> guitarmessenger.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm also assuming this is the guitar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dean Matt Heafy Custom 7 2008 Faded white | Reverb
> 
> 
> listed here is my cherished Dean Custom Shop / Prototype Matt Heafy 7 string. this is THE GUITAR used to record the rhythm tracks on Trivium’s 4th album Shogun. made out of solid mahogany and adorned with an ebony fretboard, she sound absolutely massive. If you’ve heard the album or seen the less...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reverb.com


I really feel like they still recorded DIs and Colin just reamped.  
I doubt he still remembers, but I’d love to hear his input on what made it on the final record. I’m in the camp of Shogun being near sonic perfection.


----------



## Wc707

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Guitar Messenger – Matt Heafy Interview (Trivium)
> 
> 
> Guitar Messenger is an online music magazine dedicated to providing the highest quality and most in-depth guitar related interviews, lessons, news, and reviews possible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> guitarmessenger.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm also assuming this is the guitar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dean Matt Heafy Custom 7 2008 Faded white | Reverb
> 
> 
> listed here is my cherished Dean Custom Shop / Prototype Matt Heafy 7 string. this is THE GUITAR used to record the rhythm tracks on Trivium’s 4th album Shogun. made out of solid mahogany and adorned with an ebony fretboard, she sound absolutely massive. If you’ve heard the album or seen the less...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reverb.com


Shoot, you beat me. I was gonna search on my lunch. Well, I wish they woulda gotten a deal with SD cause that album does sound good. 

5k? Wooo buddy


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Wc707 said:


> Shoot, you beat me. I was gonna search on my lunch. Well, I wish they woulda gotten a deal with SD cause that album does sound good.
> 
> 5k? Wooo buddy


I assume they were in-house Dean pickups. Dean makes their own pickups and they actually sound great. I'm assuming the pickup in that guitar became the Dean MKH86 pickup in his sig guitar. Corey also had his own custom pickup in his guitar as well, but moved onto Duncan when he switched to Jackson.

Given he stuck with EMG for awhile, I kinda wonder how the Dean MKH pickup sounds.


----------



## Wc707

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I assume they were in-house Dean pickups. Dean makes their own pickups and they actually sound great. I'm assuming the pickup in that guitar became the Dean MKH86 pickup in his sig guitar. Corey also had his own custom pickup in his guitar as well, but moved onto Duncan when he switched to Jackson.
> 
> Given he stuck with EMG for awhile, I kinda wonder how the Dean MKH pickup sounds.


That would make sense they had custom sets. For some reason I thought those Custom 7s had emgs in them. 

Any idea why that Dean deal fell through? Seems like they toured, wrote, did videos and guitar playthroughs with those Dean models but then they just disappeared.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Wc707 said:


> That would make sense they had custom sets. For some reason I thought those Custom 7s had emgs in them.
> 
> Any idea why that Dean deal fell through? Seems like they toured, wrote, did videos and guitar playthroughs with those Dean models but then they just disappeared.


I actually wonder if he even liked the Deans?  Seems like he went for them because they offered him an endorsement and Gibson didn't. The Crusade wasn't even recorded with a Dean and Shogun was recorded with a custom guitar that allegedly wasn't 100% built to his specs? Seems like he always wanted that Gibson endorsement and Dean was just a placeholder.


----------



## Paul Hawk

kmanick said:


> I love the Nailbomb and Holydiver 7 string bridge pickups but at $200 a pop now, that ain't happening.
> Anyone figure out Equivalents to these from different makers?
> I've got that RG3727 landing tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that PAF bridge pick up is getting yanked.
> Normally a nailbomb would be my first choice but at $200 a pop ..................... not so much
> What's out there that's similar that won't break the bank? Pegasus?


Great news I have a Bare knuckle Holy Diver 7 bridge black 4 conductor new in the box it has been hooked up but for testing only and its not $200. Also, I have the same pup in 6 string zebra if the price is right I may sell that one but the 7 project never happened so someone should be rocking this incredible 7 pup!
DM me Paul.


----------



## Wc707

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I actually wonder if he even liked the Deans?  Seems like he went for them because they offered him an endorsement and Gibson didn't. The Crusade wasn't even recorded with a Dean and Shogun was recorded with a custom guitar that allegedly wasn't 100% built to his specs? Seems like he always wanted that Gibson endorsement and Dean was just a placeholder.


I'm guessing you're right. They both seemed ambivalent to those Deans anytime they had to describe them. 
Oh, The Crusade; _the _album i tend to ignore in their discography. I know Ascendancy was recorded with Matt's black Les Paul loaded with EMG in the Pull Harder video, but Gunshot has a white LP. I know he's said his dad gave him that black LP guitar.
Can't blame him for holding out for what he wanted, even though he got Epiphone instead haha


----------



## Tree

Wc707 said:


> I'm guessing you're right. They both seemed ambivalent to those Deans anytime they had to describe them.
> Oh, The Crusade; _the _album i tend to ignore in their discography. I know Ascendancy was recorded with Matt's black Les Paul loaded with EMG in the Pull Harder video, but Gunshot has a white LP. I know he's said his dad gave him that black LP guitar.
> Can't blame him for holding out for what he wanted, even though he got Epiphone instead haha


Ascendancy was actually not recorded with the LP for some reason despite Andy Sneap's insistence:

"yeah it kinda depends on whats needed, actually I can't remember if it was a 5150 or a boogie now...how bad is that , it was only a few weeks ago. I told these guys to use emg's before we started and I was ignored, so it was a real struggle with the gtrs, as even if you are reamping, if the pick up is weak, its not going to be great, and there was a real 2k spike in the gtrs I was fighting all through the mix...oh well. I think it came out good though, people seem to be liking it, I'm a bit burnt with it cause I was going back and forth with the label on mixes (too many outside opinions) and would you believe due to a mistake at the plant, they pressed my favourite (not the labels favourite) mixes. Quite rare those sort of mistakes go in your favour."

Maybe the LP wasn't setup or was in for repair at the time. I seem to remember finding that they used a guitar loaded with SD Invaders at some point, but it's been years so it would be hard to find if I'm not imagining this.


----------



## Wc707

Tree said:


> Ascendancy was actually not recorded with the LP for some reason despite Andy Sneap's insistence:
> 
> "yeah it kinda depends on whats needed, actually I can't remember if it was a 5150 or a boogie now...how bad is that , it was only a few weeks ago. I told these guys to use emg's before we started and I was ignored, so it was a real struggle with the gtrs, as even if you are reamping, if the pick up is weak, its not going to be great, and there was a real 2k spike in the gtrs I was fighting all through the mix...oh well. I think it came out good though, people seem to be liking it, I'm a bit burnt with it cause I was going back and forth with the label on mixes (too many outside opinions) and would you believe due to a mistake at the plant, they pressed my favourite (not the labels favourite) mixes. Quite rare those sort of mistakes go in your favour."
> 
> Maybe the LP wasn't setup or was in for repair at the time. I seem to remember finding that they used a guitar loaded with SD Invaders at some point, but it's been years so it would be hard to find if I'm not imagining this.


Wow, this is cool information! 

Really Invaders? I'll have to listen to the album again and see if I can hear that nuance. I woulda never guessed.


----------



## Tree

Wc707 said:


> Wow, this is cool information!
> 
> Really Invaders? I'll have to listen to the album again and see if I can hear that nuance. I woulda never guessed.


It was 100% passives, as Andy was pissed that they (either Trivium or Jason Suecof, whom they recorded with) ignored his request to track with the EMGs. 

Don't quote me on the exact model, as I'm not sure  I seem to remember that it was either an Invader in the bridge, or possibly a Bill Lawrence L500xl. I'd really have to do some digging to verify. Searching through the old Sneap forum is a bit of a chore when you're trying to find something super specific.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

It's funny going back and reading ancient posts about Trivium. I see some people calling Matt a douche and whatnot, then you realize Matt was only like... 18? 19? at the time?



Tree said:


> It was 100% passives, as Andy was pissed that they (either Trivium or Jason Suecof, whom they recorded with) ignored his request to track with the EMGs.
> 
> Don't quote me on the exact model, as I'm not sure  I seem to remember that it was either an Invader in the bridge, or possibly a Bill Lawrence L500xl. I'd really have to do some digging to verify. Searching through the old Sneap forum is a bit of a chore when you're trying to find something super specific.



I remember seeing some REALLY old videos of Matt, like from the early 2000s. Apparently he owned a black and silver Washburn Stealth? And I think Corey was using Duncan-loaded Jacksons so they might've tracked it with those for some reason.


----------



## Tree

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> It's funny going back and reading ancient posts about Trivium. I see some people calling Matt a douche and whatnot, then you realize Matt was only like... 18? 19? at the time?
> 
> 
> 
> I remember seeing some REALLY old videos of Matt, like from the early 2000s. Apparently he owned a black and silver Washburn Stealth? And I think Corey was using Duncan-loaded Jacksons so they might've tracked it with those for some reason.


Dude, mid 2000’s internet absolutely *hated* Matt and Trivium as a whole. It was nuts. Very undeserved ire, but that’s the way metal elitists roll.

Also, yeah I’m pretty sure it was a Washburn Stealth now that you mention it. I kept picturing an ML shape in my head as I was writing these replies out. I think Matt usually records all the rhythms, so it would make sense.


----------



## yan12

I will chime in and say this. I am a Schecter player these days, but I still have guitars by ESP, Jackson, Ibanez, Gibson.

I think for the money, Schecter USA pickups are very underrated. You can find used ones on Reverb regularly and they are a steal at $75 price range.

My two favorites for hard rock/metal (thrash) are the Apocalypse and Brimstone. The Brimstone is not as open sounding but super tight and focused. Not very bass heavy but really responds well to a tone knob. Easily in the Dime territory depending on your rig. The Apocalypse is my go to for VH tones/overtones and up to very heavy thrash...but it actually works quite well in all of those situations.

A hallmark of Schecter USA pickups is they really clean up well with the volume rolled back and are very clean. I have scored a few on Reverb and it always works out for me.


----------



## Xaeldaren

yan12 said:


> I will chime in and say this. I am a Schecter player these days, but I still have guitars by ESP, Jackson, Ibanez, Gibson.
> 
> I think for the money, Schecter USA pickups are very underrated. You can find used ones on Reverb regularly and they are a steal at $75 price range.
> 
> My two favorites for hard rock/metal (thrash) are the Apocalypse and Brimstone. The Brimstone is not as open sounding but super tight and focused. Not very bass heavy but really responds well to a tone knob. Easily in the Dime territory depending on your rig. The Apocalypse is my go to for VH tones/overtones and up to very heavy thrash...but it actually works quite well in all of those situations.
> 
> A hallmark of Schecter USA pickups is they really clean up well with the volume rolled back and are very clean. I have scored a few on Reverb and it always works out for me.



I can vouch for this. I had a 7-string Banshee Elite that came with Supercharger Mach 7 pickups that I ended up swapping for BKP Silos because I had more money than sense. It didn't fix the problems with the guitar, which could only be rectified by a luthier doing some fretwork and setup magic. Sadly, I got really sick and had to sell the guitar just as soon as I got it to where I wanted it, and I could fully appreciate how amazing the Silos where. Hindsight being what it is, I would be very happy with Schecter USA pickups in any well-made guitar, and I say this as someone who just got BKP Polymaths in my Mayones.


----------



## Wc707

Tree said:


> Dude, mid 2000’s internet absolutely *hated* Matt and Trivium as a whole. It was nuts. Very undeserved ire, but that’s the way metal elitists roll.
> 
> Also, yeah I’m pretty sure it was a Washburn Stealth now that you mention it. I kept picturing an ML shape in my head as I was writing these replies out. I think Matt usually records all the rhythms, so it would make sense.


I never understood why they hated him. He looked like every other metalcore kid on the scene.
Those guys could[still do] _shred_ for their age.
Shit, all those songs off Ascendancy are major right-hand workouts. 

Matt has said in several live streams he records all rhythms so they're "consistent". Except 1 passage in Insurrection that Corey did because, at the time, Matt couldn't keep up with the intense down-picking Corey wrote.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Wc707 said:


> I never understood why they hated him. He looked like every other metalcore kid on the scene.
> Those guys could[still do] _shred_ for their age.
> Shit, all those songs off Ascendancy are major right-hand workouts.
> 
> Matt has said in several live streams he records all rhythms so they're "consistent". Except 1 passage in Insurrection that Corey did because, at the time, Matt couldn't keep up with the intense down-picking Corey wrote.


I remember people giving Trivium so much shit back in the day. A bunch of teenagers that can out-play and out-write most of the adults in the room. 

Then again a lot of metalcore bands around the time got a lot of shit. I know Killswitch Engage did from the elitists. I imagine Trivium got a lot of shit because they were branded as a Metallica-ripoff metalcore band.

In particular I went back to some threads here and saw someone gave shit to Heafy because he CLAIMS he stopped using Gibson (back in '06, when he switched to Dean) because they didn't give him an endorsement, called him a douche and whatnot. Heafy was like... 18? Give him some slack.


----------



## Wc707

Se


HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I remember people giving Trivium so much shit back in the day. A bunch of teenagers that can out-play and out-write most of the adults in the room.
> 
> Then again a lot of metalcore bands around the time got a lot of shit. I know Killswitch Engage did from the elitists. I imagine Trivium got a lot of shit because they were branded as a Metallica-ripoff metalcore band.
> 
> In particular I went back to some threads here and saw someone gave shit to Heafy because he CLAIMS he stopped using Gibson (back in '06, when he switched to Dean) because they didn't give him an endorsement, called him a douche and whatnot. Heafy was like... 18? Give him some slack.


Seriously, really good songwriting for how old they were and just overall. 
Only hate I've ever seen for KsE was Howie leaving. 
Well jeez, I'd be butthurt too if I didn't get the endorsement I wanted, even thoughi kinda did later in life haha


----------



## Legion

I grew up in an environment where death/black metal was considered "tr00" and any "core" was seen as "gay"/other casually homophobic slurs. KsE (As Daylight Dies/End of Heartache) and Trivium (especially Ascendancy) were HUGE HUGE HUGE influences on my musical growth, and even to this day I find myself casually strumming the riffs to Pull Harder or Arms of Sorrow almost instinctively as soon as I pick up a guitar. Boy do I remember my peers mocking me for liking them. I was eventually peer pressured into hating them, but as soon as my environment changed and I made new friends my love for those bands came right back like a boomerang


----------



## maliciousteve

I try and stick with whatever comes stock in the guitar I'm buying. In the extremely unlikely event I do change pickups I usually go with Seymour Duncan or IronGear. Bareknuckle has unfortunately lost me as a customer, they're just way too expensive for me. I get why they are, but it's a no from me.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

Wc707 said:


> Se
> 
> Seriously, really good songwriting for how old they were and just overall.
> Only hate I've ever seen for KsE was Howie leaving.
> Well jeez, I'd be butthurt too if I didn't get the endorsement I wanted, even thoughi kinda did later in life haha


I prefer KSE with Howard. Jesse is fine, but I'm more of a Howard fan.


----------



## Audiowonderland

I put dimarzio Titans in my Jackson js32 seven stringer


----------



## Crungy

Spaced Out Ace said:


> I prefer KSE with Howard. Jesse is fine, but I'm more of a Howard fan.


Howard fans unite


----------



## Wc707

Crungy said:


> Howard fans unite


----------



## Mathemagician

The guys discussed multiple times after they left dean that they did not like the guitars. Apparently they had poor build quality left and right, and the headstocks were prone to snapping, etc. it was a big enough deal that they essentially chose to end the relationship.

As for getting in with Dean they for sure got attention from their own growing fame and then Dimebag’s wife gifting them a Razorback, that likely helped pave the way for them as well. So when an offer came in they took it seriously. 

But yeah they said the guitars were not holding up on tour.

As for the epiphone that was a choice by Matt that he’s been super open about. He knew his fans skewed younger and wanted his fans to actually be able to afford his signature gear.


----------



## STRHelvete

Crungy said:


> Howard fans unite


Jesse was better. Howard was technically more proficient but Jesse had way more soul and emotion, which is what matters in a singer


----------



## MattThePenguin

The two guitars I have both have ceramic Warpigs and I don't want to know what life is like without them but if I ever get another guitar I guess I will find out lol


----------



## Emperoff

STRHelvete said:


> Jesse was better. Howard was technically more proficient but Jesse had way more soul and emotion, which is what matters in a singer



A lot of this. Watching Jesse screaming always makes me want to break things 

Howard also happened to be a massive dork when I met them after a show. I remember a fan asking: _"what does* jerk* mean?". _I explained, and then he showed me his signed poster with "jerk" as Howard's signature. The guy was very dishearted. Not cool.


----------



## TheBolivianSniper

just snagged a set of fishmans with full wiring and pots for $200, it seems like anything that's not an Abasi/Merrow set goes for peanuts on the used market


----------



## katsumura78

Ordered a set of these for a soon to be mine PRS Mushok Baritone. Wanted a Rabea baritone but am I the only one who doesn’t want that single coil in the neck? This was the cheaper route to go regardless. The ML3 Pro’s aren’t cheap and I’ve never ordered from a dealer overseas before. It’s like none of them can give me an out the door price on one.


----------



## Emperoff

katsumura78 said:


> Ordered a set of these for a soon to be mine PRS Mushok Baritone. Wanted a Rabea baritone but am I the only one who doesn’t want that single coil in the neck? This was the cheaper route to go regardless. The ML3 Pro’s aren’t cheap and I’ve never ordered from a dealer overseas before. It’s like none of them can give me an out the door price on one.
> View attachment 107412



A set like that for 7-string soapbars was like 530€ last time I got a quote. Fuck them. I ended up buying them off used on Reverb.


----------



## narad

So the answer to "now that bkps are $200 a pop, what are people gravitating towards?" is BKPs?


----------



## cmpxchg

the new production SDs are $150 each with a cover and the pound has been plummeting vs the dollar, so maybe BKPs don't seem excessive anymore


----------



## katsumura78

Emperoff said:


> A set like that for 7-string soapbars was like 530€ last time I got a quote. Fuck them. I ended up buying them off used on Reverb.


I don’t blame you man. I bought from Music Store Live. They gave me a good price so I said screw it. Hope they live up to the hype but I’ve only been disappointed by BKP once so ?


----------



## Emperoff

narad said:


> So the answer to "now that bkps are $200 a pop, what are people gravitating towards?" is BKPs?



In my case, it was out of "need". I wanted:
A - 7-string "active sized" form factor
B - Alnico magnets
C - Warm sounding "non djent" tone

And the only company doing that at the moment is BKP


----------



## KnightBrolaire

cmpxchg said:


> the new production SDs are $150 each with a cover and the pound has been plummeting vs the dollar, so maybe BKPs don't seem excessive anymore


Nah BKPs are still currently pricier for their sig offerings. Polymaths are 370$ right now for a basic open bobbin pickup set and over 400$ a set for covered options per their website. For non sig offerings though (eg Black Dog, VHII, etc), it's around 310$ for an uncovered set and 330 for covered.


----------



## MrWulf

I always wanted to try a pair of Nailbomb or Warpigs but brand new its a steep ask, while the used market is no good. But luckily the Lundgren M7 is filling that void pretty well. Granted that came in stock of my guitar lmao


----------



## Neon_Knight_

MrWulf said:


> I always wanted to try a pair of Nailbomb or Warpigs but brand new its a steep ask, while the used market is no good. But luckily the Lundgren M7 is filling that void pretty well. Granted that came in stock of my guitar lmao


I think many of us would be willing to pay BKP prices *if* we were confident a pickup set would be the right pickup choice for us, but are apprehensive of taking the financial risk. You can't do a direct comparison of two sets and then pick your favourite, unless you pay for more than one set (even with their exchange policy, you only have one set in your possession at a time). As it is, I can buy two sets of DiMarzio / SD pickups for less than one set of BKP, which makes it far more viable to buy multiple sets and then re-sell any I don't want to keep (after taking as much time as a I like to test/compare them).

Based on reviews, I'd be keen to try ceramic Nailbombs, ceramic Warpigs and Painkillers, but that would set me back about £950. I've opted to play it safe by ordering multiple sets of D Activators (after liking the stock D Activators in my XPT700) and popular pickups that have stood the test of time (e.g. Super D + PAF Pro). I'm about to test Evolutions, Black Winters and Blackened Black Winters, as it would be a bit boring to have D Activators in everything (I have Ibbys with Tone Zone + Air Norton and DiMarzio/IBZ sets that I want to swap out). Those three sets cost me <£450 and any loss on reselling them will be less (in £ not %) it than would have been with the BKPs.


----------



## MrWulf

I have 5 different guitars and they have M7, Black Winter, Nazgul/Sentient, and Fishman KM. I also have played Alpha/Omega, Warpigs Alnico, PAF7, 81/85, Jeff Loomis Blackout and Aftermath (way too many Aftermath). At this point i dont even have pickup GAS anymore. I just want to try those BKP models but at 300$ a pop its not worth it.


----------



## Soulthief

I have an bkp aftermath in my Ibby (rgd2127) 10 years or so ago when I installed it, I liked it a lot. Today, I don't like it as much. 
Looked at other bkp but yeah, to expensive. 
Gravitating towards a SD custom now. 

But... For some reason DiMarzio and Seymour Duncan are very hard to get your hands on over here


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## TheBolivianSniper

I mean I just couldn't find a soapbar sized 7 string passive that could do more gritty stuff and get old school without the signature Duncan grind which I can't stand. I would've bought a Black Winter set or some Distortions but I don't like the low mids on the former and I'd have to order the latter which would be as expensive as getting the used Nailbomb/Cold Sweat set I just got, without the pretty covers.


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## ErockRPh

I'm still mid-build, so I can't say that I've used them yet, but I settled on a set of Lace Dragonauts instead of BKP Warpigs for the 6-string I'm working on right now.


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## Wusthof XIII

kmanick said:


> I love the Nailbomb and Holydiver 7 string bridge pickups but at $200 a pop now, that ain't happening.
> Anyone figure out Equivalents to these from different makers?
> I've got that RG3727 landing tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that PAF bridge pick up is getting yanked.
> Normally a nailbomb would be my first choice but at $200 a pop ..................... not so much
> What's out there that's similar that won't break the bank? Pegasus?



I have 11 guitars and most of the bridge pickups I replaced with Bare Knuckle pickups. My most recent guitar purchase was a Schecter Tempest Blackjack which came stock with Lundgren M6 humbuckers, or if you’re putting into a 7-string they would be M7’s. The Lundgrens sound absolutely amazing! I won’t be swapping them out for BKP’s. I am absolutely impressed with the Lundgrens.


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## DarrellM5

I try to find guitars with the pickups I'd like already installed. I just got an ESP E-II M-II NT with BK Aftermaths and I'm really impressed with them. My Strandberg Boden and Suhr Modern Satin have the Suhr SSH+/SSV pickups and they're amazing. My Suhr Pete Thorn Sig Standard has the Suhr Thornbucker +/Thornbucker combo and it's terrific as well. The Nazgul/Sentient pickups in my Schecter KM-7 and Banshee 6 Passive are perfect, as are the JB/59's in my Charvel San Dimas.

Aftermarket I like DiMarzio 36th Anniversary PAF's and SD Black Winters.


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## Emperoff

DarrellM5 said:


> I try to find guitars with the pickups I'd like already installed.



That sounds like a very agressive and unnecessary filter to me.

If I had to buy a sevenstring based on the pickups I like, I wouldn't buy anything.


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## Mountainman

I've been considering grabbing a set of higher powered humbucker sized p90s, and unless I am missing something the Bare Knuckles seem to be going for a little over $150/piece which seems pretty in line with a lot of "boutique" brands.

Definitely higher than Duncan or Dimarzio, but they don't offer what I am looking for so I would have to hit up Seymours custom shop which would take longer, and probably cost more too.


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## Wusthof XIII

Mountainman said:


> I've been considering grabbing a set of higher powered humbucker sized p90s, and unless I am missing something the Bare Knuckles seem to be going for a little over $150/piece which seems pretty in line with a lot of "boutique" brands.
> 
> Definitely higher than Duncan or Dimarzio, but they don't offer what I am looking for so I would have to hit up Seymours custom shop which would take longer, and probably cost more too.



I initially had a Seymour Duncan custom shop humbucker in my drop C guitar and did not like the tone at all. I eventually replaced it with a Bare Knuckle Juggernaut, which I LOVE.


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## Mountainman

Wusthof XIII said:


> I initially had a Seymour Duncan custom shop humbucker in my drop C guitar and did not like the tone at all. I eventually replaced it with a Bare Knuckle Juggernaut, which I LOVE.


Bare Knuckles are sweet pickups, there is a reason demand has allowed them to jack up prices. 

Also, I am inclined to not buy from the SD Custom Shop since meeting MJ at a guitar show and she had kind of an attitude to her that she didn't really want to answer questions. Not sure if she had a bad customer upset her (been there working with the public), or something but it still feels a little offputting.


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## Emperoff

Mountainman said:


> Bare Knuckles are sweet pickups, there is a reason demand has allowed them to jack up prices.



Yeah, it's called _marketing_.


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## Mountainman

Emperoff said:


> Yeah, it's called _marketing_.


I can't disagree. I remember the marketing over scatter winding and other stuff they used to do that all the fan boys got super excited over. About 10 years ago I think I, remember posting about a Seymour Duncan Custom/59 set I got and was really excited about on another forum and getting laughed at for wasting money on "Seymour Generics". Fanboys suck. I was turned off of the brand for a long while over them.

That being said, I will stand by what I said, they are sweet pickups. I really like the Mules and the Holy Divers. They're good pickups, but I feel I can get just as good from other makers, many of them cheaper. Unfortunately, many of the smaller guys I like have raised prices a good bit too so they are not always the great deal they used to be.


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## BTS

Neon_Knight_ said:


> I think many of us would be willing to pay BKP prices *if* we were confident a pickup set would be the right pickup choice for us, but are apprehensive of taking the financial risk. You can't do a direct comparison of two sets and then pick your favourite, unless you pay for more than one set (even with their exchange policy, you only have one set in your possession at a time). As it is, I can buy two sets of DiMarzio / SD pickups for less than one set of BKP, which makes it far more viable to buy multiple sets and then re-sell any I don't want to keep (after taking as much time as a I like to test/compare them).
> 
> Based on reviews, I'd be keen to try ceramic Nailbombs, ceramic Warpigs and Painkillers, but that would set me back about £950. I've opted to play it safe by ordering multiple sets of D Activators (after liking the stock D Activators in my XPT700) and popular pickups that have stood the test of time (e.g. Super D + PAF Pro). I'm about to test Evolutions, Black Winters and Blackened Black Winters, as it would be a bit boring to have D Activators in everything (I have Ibbys with Tone Zone + Air Norton and DiMarzio/IBZ sets that I want to swap out). Those three sets cost me <£450 and any loss on reselling them will be less (in £ not %) it than would have been with the BKPs.


I agree with you here. I would pay the prices if I had some confidence I was getting a pickup I really liked - my experience with BKP is just a bit too variable in terms of what ive liked and have not liked, not in terms of quality: Ive had a Cbomb bridge and nailbomb neck, the CBOMB bridge was pretty cool but perhaps wasnt what i really wanted and really disliked the NB neck; had a judggernaut bridge which didnt do it for me but have continued to use because I couldnt bothered paying money to replace; had a Ragnarok set which I really like, in particular the bridge; had the VHII neck which is fine, but wasnt what I was really after; had a holy diver bridge which was great but moved that guitar along; played an aftermath bridge a few times and it was fine and did what was on the label, but wouldnt buy for myself. 

Now i am umming and rring about getting a polymath or silo set.. or a mix. I am a hobby player and cant justify the expense of buying both and testing and dont want to have to try to move on any more pickups in the 2nd hand market. The other element is that all the marketing by BKP guys like Nolly and Rabea etc make killer content... it is really hard to figure out what it really sounds like or would sound like in my setup, when those guys produce such great material.

On lundgrens, I would absolutely give em a try but there is soo little information out there on them.


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## Hoss632

Wusthof XIII said:


> I have 11 guitars and most of the bridge pickups I replaced with Bare Knuckle pickups. My most recent guitar purchase was a Schecter Tempest Blackjack which came stock with Lundgren M6 humbuckers, or if you’re putting into a 7-string they would be M7’s. The Lundgrens sound absolutely amazing! I won’t be swapping them out for BKP’s. I am absolutely impressed with the Lundgrens.


How do you like that Tempest over all? I've been very interested in it, especially given the price for the specs.


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## Hoss632

BTS said:


> I agree with you here. I would pay the prices if I had some confidence I was getting a pickup I really liked - my experience with BKP is just a bit too variable in terms of what ive liked and have not liked, not in terms of quality: Ive had a Cbomb bridge and nailbomb neck, the CBOMB bridge was pretty cool but perhaps wasnt what i really wanted and really disliked the NB neck; had a judggernaut bridge which didnt do it for me but have continued to use because I couldnt bothered paying money to replace; had a Ragnarok set which I really like, in particular the bridge; had the VHII neck which is fine, but wasnt what I was really after; had a holy diver bridge which was great but moved that guitar along; played an aftermath bridge a few times and it was fine and did what was on the label, but wouldnt buy for myself.
> 
> Now i am umming and rring about getting a polymath or silo set.. or a mix. I am a hobby player and cant justify the expense of buying both and testing and dont want to have to try to move on any more pickups in the 2nd hand market. The other element is that all the marketing by BKP guys like Nolly and Rabea etc make killer content... it is really hard to figure out what it really sounds like or would sound like in my setup, when those guys produce such great material.
> 
> On lundgrens, I would absolutely give em a try but there is soo little information out there on them.


Depending on what you want sound wise you could go several different ways combining Nolly and Rabea's sets together. To my ear their sets are opposites. By that I mean The Silo bridge has a warmer fatter tone to my ear than the Polymath, but the neck pick ups are the opposite, where the Silo is very jangley and the polymath has a huge warm tone which sounds great for leads. If I were to pair the 2 I'd probably do a silo bridge and polymath neck just because of what I like tonally.


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## Legion

Just scooped up a used set of 7 string Elysian Moderns (Which are equivalent to Trident I's) for 185 bucks shipped.


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## Wusthof XIII

Hoss632 said:


> How do you like that Tempest over all? I've been very interested in it, especially given the price for the specs.



I absolutely love it. Super fast neck and all the tone you need with some leftover from the Lundgrens. I have 6, 7 and 8-string guitars from Fender, to PRS and Schecter asking to be picked up and played each morning and I am grabbing the stock Schecter Tempest Blackjack first with no regrets. I play through a choice of Orange or Mesa heads (Mesa Badlander 50-watt head, Orange TH30 head, Mesa Rectoverb 25-watt head or Orange Rocker 15 head) and each one loves the Tempest. If you play any form of metal, this is the guitar you’ve been waiting for. Although I do have an order with Sweetwater when the Schecter Solo II Supreme see thru blue burst is in stock. I am guessing that one will be my new favorite. But you can’t go wrong with a Tempest. It’s uniquely beautiful and sounds amazing.


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## Hoss632

Wusthof XIII said:


> I absolutely love it. Super fast neck and all the tone you need with some leftover from the Lundgrens. I have 6, 7 and 8-string guitars from Fender, to PRS and Schecter asking to be picked up and played each morning and I am grabbing the stock Schecter Tempest Blackjack first with no regrets. I play through a choice of Orange or Mesa heads (Mesa Badlander 50-watt head, Orange TH30 head, Mesa Rectoverb 25-watt head or Orange Rocker 15 head) and each one loves the Tempest. If you play any form of metal, this is the guitar you’ve been waiting for. Although I do have an order with Sweetwater when the Schecter Solo II Supreme see thru blue burst is in stock. I am guessing that one will be my new favorite. But you can’t go wrong with a Tempest. It’s uniquely beautiful and sounds amazing.


Good to know. I do like the Schecter Thin C neck on the tempest as it's the same as the one on my c-1 platinum. Glad to know the quality is still there, and that the Lungren's are worth it. I've heard demo's from cleans, to metal and even some pop punk and those pups seem to do them all quite well. I'm just trying to decide if I want a blackjack model, reaper custom, or a sun valley exotic hardtail as the upgrade to the c-1. Tough choices for sure.


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## Wusthof XIII

Hoss632 said:


> Good to know. I do like the Schecter Thin C neck on the tempest as it's the same as the one on my c-1 platinum. Glad to know the quality is still there, and that the Lungren's are worth it. I've heard demo's from cleans, to metal and even some pop punk and those pups seem to do them all quite well. I'm just trying to decide if I want a blackjack model, reaper custom, or a sun valley exotic hardtail as the upgrade to the c-1. Tough choices for sure.



You’re right, you can’t go wrong, although I love the uniqueness of the Tempest body shape. I am excited to see how the Lundgren Black Heavens sound in the Solo II Supreme. 

EDIT: Found this…


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## Emperoff

Legion said:


> Just scooped up a used set of 7 string Elysian Moderns (Which are equivalent to Trident I's) for 185 bucks shipped.



Congrats! 

My Elysian Trident IIs sound like nothing I've ever tried before. They have a very "woody" character, if that makes any sense. The neck pickup is super creamy but never boomy at the lower strings (unlike basically any other neck pickup out there).

It's not a sound I always look for since I'm more of a strat-ish neck pickup kind of guy (and I do most of my lead work on the bridge pickup), but haven't tried anything that comes close to it for playing leads.


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## ParanoiaEngine

I don’t think anything beats the bareknuckle ragnarok for aggressive metal tone. Something in the response of the mids sounds really punchy and has a good bark for the palm mutes. I think actives are missing the transient frequencies for pick attack aggression so passive is my choice and ragnarok seems to be the best imo


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## Legion

I...done did it.
Went and ordered a set of Elysian Goliaths. 
Let's see how this turns out.


God damn I've gone whole hog on Elysians.


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## Hoss632

Right now I'm gravitating towards a set of Duncan Black Winters. Main thing is deciding on if I'm going to keep my guitar which is loaded with EMG's and completely gut and rewire it for passives, or sell it and get something with passives and swap the pick ups that way. Probably the ladder as I'm not 100% in love with the current guitar as it is.


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## Neon_Knight_

Hoss632 said:


> Right now I'm gravitating towards a set of Duncan Black Winters. Main thing is deciding on if I'm going to keep my guitar which is loaded with EMG's and completely gut and rewire it for passives, or sell it and get something with passives and swap the pick ups that way. Probably the ladder as I'm not 100% in love with the current guitar as it is.


You forgot the best option: keep your existing guitar with EMGs and buy an extra guitar to load with Black Winters.


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## Strobe

Why, still BKP's, peasants! 

I kid, I do not currently own any BKP's. Most I have played have been excellent, however. That said, pickups are a thing where there are so many good options - the difference between which is pretty small. In a mix especially, it's really splitting hairs. It's about as much about how they feel and respond as it is about the actual EQ profile.

Some of my pickups that I really dig:

Fishman Fluence Classics, Abasis, and the strat/tele sets
Dimarzio Illuminators (favorite passives at the moment)
Dimarzio Tone Zone / Air Norton for rock (just so thick in a satisfying way)
Seymour Duncan Custom 5 / Jazz (Custom 5 is really tight and feels good for thrashy stuff)


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## narad

I just grabbed a black hawk bridge since it was like $115 a pop and it always stood out as one of the better sounding BKPs from the demos.


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## Tree

narad said:


> I just grabbed a black hawk bridge since it was like $115 a pop and it always stood out as one of the better sounding BKPs from the demos.


Post back with results! Those are some of the only BKPs that have had my interest in the last few years, and I've been curious myself seeing them around a similar price point.


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## katsumura78

Black hawks are great! The split coil tones are those are killer too. Had them in an RGA121 and it was a perfect match.


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## narad

The only question is whether they are alnico or ceramic, since it's mystery auction pickups. If there's an easy way to tell, please let me know. I guess I don't want to dissemble the thing though


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## KnightBrolaire

narad said:


> The only question is whether they are alnico or ceramic, since it's mystery auction pickups. If there's an easy way to tell, please let me know. I guess I don't want to dissemble the thing though


There's no easy way without taking it apart . It's totally reversible so long as you don't damage the wires during the dismantling . Just peel back the tape and warm up the wax with a hair dryer, then pop out the the magnet.


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## syzygy

Tree said:


> Post back with results! Those are some of the only BKPs that have had my interest in the last few years, and I've been curious myself seeing them around a similar price point.


Well, just expect lows that are thick but not muddy, mids that are strong but not overbearing, and highs that are present but not icepicky


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## sakeido

Just installed a Fortitude... hotter than I expected. Way, way hotter. I really like the tonal balance, maybe a bit too bassy as is so I may drop the height a bit, but quite enjoying it so far. I would have preferred less output but ah well I'll just dial back the gain on my patches.

Next up to try is to put my Black Heaven in the USA Charvel and finally play 7 string again when my Nazgul/Sentient set shows up


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## ArtDecade

I use the stock pickups in my guitars.


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## Tree

ArtDecade said:


> I use the stock pickups in my guitars.


Dork. Only real guitarists obsess over nuances that no one else notices. You must hate all of your guitars. I see no other reason for such abuse.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands

sakeido said:


> Just installed a Fortitude... hotter than I expected. Way, way hotter. I really like the tonal balance, maybe a bit too bassy as is so I may drop the height a bit, but quite enjoying it so far. I would have preferred less output but ah well I'll just dial back the gain on my patches.
> 
> Next up to try is to put my Black Heaven in the USA Charvel and finally play 7 string again when my Nazgul/Sentient set shows up


Not surprised it seems bassy, given thats what the marketing seemed to imply. A PAF with more lows.


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## manu80

SP CUSTOM in France, Dominger, but they're all gearing to the same prices at the end....
Even the 2nd hand pickup have increased of around 20 euros in 2 yrs....


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## sakeido

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Not surprised it seems bassy, given thats what the marketing seemed to imply. A PAF with more lows.


a "touch" more lows they say... and it's way more than that. I thought my PRS 57/08 was a classic PAF with basically no changes... maybe that's not the case because I wouldn't put it and the Fortitude in the same category at all. Especially with the Fortitude being so hot, it's lost a lot of the touch sensitivity I think you get from lower output pickups.


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## Hoss632

Neon_Knight_ said:


> You forgot the best option: keep your existing guitar with EMGs and buy an extra guitar to load with Black Winters.


Great option. But I got a good offer on the guitar just sold it. So for now I have no axe. But I'll get one before years end. Not sure exactly what just yet.


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## Neon_Knight_

Hoss632 said:


> Great option. But I got a good offer on the guitar just sold it. So for now I have no axe. But I'll get one before years end. Not sure exactly what just yet.


No guitar...very sad times! :'(


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## Hoss632

Neon_Knight_ said:


> No guitar...very sad times! :'(


I honestly didn't think I would be as down as I am. But yeah it's kinda sucked.


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## Neon_Knight_

Hoss632 said:


> I honestly didn't think I would be as down as I am. But yeah it's kinda sucked.


Any reason to delay replacing it, other than indecision about what to get?


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## profwoot

Just about all my guitars have bkps and I bought a Strandberg with plans to load it with my set of bkp polymaths, but the Suhr Aldrich pickups that came in it continue to impress. So I would probably give Suhr a look next time I'm in need (not sure if they're any cheaper).


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## HeHasTheJazzHands

profwoot said:


> Just about all my guitars have bkps and I bought a Strandberg with plans to load it with my set of bkp polymaths, but the Suhr Aldrich pickups that came in it continue to impress. So I would probably give Suhr a look next time I'm in need (not sure if they're any cheaper).


About $130 a piece IIRC.


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## Hoss632

Neon_Knight_ said:


> Any reason to delay replacing it, other than indecision about what to get?


Funds are a bit tight at the moment as well.


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## sylcfh

Lace for over 15 years now.


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## gunch

I was listening to Far Beyond Driven the other day and like 

Damn guys just get L500XLs


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