# Mass Effect Legendary Edition



## CovertSovietBear (Jul 8, 2021)

I played and beat Mass Effect Andromeda last year and was impressed by the visuals and gameplay. I enjoyed the non-linear exploration aspect of the game and read every bit of lore/description for anything I came across, with planets and moons being the most interesting. 

I went into the game knowing little to nothing and so skipped most of the cutscenes which was a big mistake looking back. Read into the lore online a bit more but couldn't connect the game with the others in the series (Protheans, Mass relays, etc.) and bought the legendary edition to play through the originals. 

After digging too far for info online I decided to start and finish Mass Effect 3 (decided on synthetic-organic integration). Although a lot more linear it was really fun to play, but the movement was the most frustrating aspect of the game. Whenever I wanted to run my character would duck, or vice versa. Had to lower the difficulty on some portions strictly due to gameplay mechanics rather than gunplay or enemy difficulty. 

Currently making my way through Mass Effect 1 and 2. 
*Any others on here who enjoy the series? *

Gameplay wise Andromeda was better (Anthem feels like Andromeda 2.0 imo) but mostly feels like natural progression for the game.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 9, 2021)

I still refuse to acknowledge bioware's ending to ME3. It completely soured me on a series that I enjoyed a great deal overall.

That being said I feel like of the original trilogy ME2 is the best game. ME3 dumbed down the mechanics and levels way too much from ME2 (which was only slightly dumbed down from ME1). ME2 had a great balance of action/shooter/rpg elements, whereas ME1 was a much clunkier shooter/action game in favor of RPG elements, and ME3 streamlined the RPG elements of ME2 to the point that they were irrelevant on easier difficulties. ME2 also improved the character design, the side quests were all pretty cool and level design was massively improved over ME1. ME1 only had a few really standout side quests, and the level design was god awful/repetitive.
The only thing I found annoying about ME2 was the stupid planet scanning. Granted, it was far better than having to manually do the same material gathering on copy pasted planets in ME1, but that's not saying much. 


I'm still pretty apprehensive about trying Andromeda given all the flack it got for half assed dialogue and animations.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 9, 2021)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I still refuse to acknowledge bioware's ending to ME3. It completely soured me on a series that I enjoyed a great deal overall.
> 
> That being said I feel like of the original trilogy ME2 is the best game. ME3 dumbed down the mechanics and levels way too much from ME2 (which was only slightly dumbed down from ME1). ME2 had a great balance of action/shooter/rpg elements, whereas ME1 was a much clunkier shooter/action game in favor of RPG elements, and ME3 streamlined the RPG elements of ME2 to the point that they were irrelevant on easier difficulties. ME2 also improved the character design, the side quests were all pretty cool and level design was massively improved over ME1. ME1 only had a few really standout side quests, and the level design was god awful/repetitive.
> The only thing I found annoying about ME2 was the stupid planet scanning. Granted, it was far better than having to manually do the same material gathering on copy pasted planets in ME1, but that's not saying much.
> ...



Did you mostly dislike the lack of options for the ME3 ending or how they got there over the series, OR a mix of both? 
Looking forward to starting up ME2 once I'm done with ME. 

Dialogue felt the same for me when comparing ME3 to Andromeda, except the "dead eye stare" was jarring at first. It's a solid game if we're mainly focusing on gameplay mechanics. The planet scanning also lets you acquire useful items and powerups unlike ME3 where it was only used to collect fuel for local cluster exploration. Side quests were more interesting as well and it compliments the open world aspect of the game.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 9, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Did you mostly dislike the lack of options for the ME3 ending or how they got there over the series, OR a mix of both?
> Looking forward to starting up ME2 once I'm done with ME.
> 
> Dialogue felt the same for me when comparing ME3 to Andromeda, except the "dead eye stare" was jarring at first. It's a solid game if we're mainly focusing on gameplay mechanics. The planet scanning also lets you acquire useful items and powerups unlike ME3 where it was only used to collect fuel for local cluster exploration. Side quests were more interesting as well and it compliments the open world aspect of the game.


Mostly how they ended the series, regardless of which option you choose. I tried all the different permutations and it really didn't matter in the end, they were all basically the same. It was a cheap shitty way to end an overall relatively well written series, especially because they weren't pushing a narrative about destiny/inescapable fate. I would have been fine with it had they foreshadowed something like that from the beginning in the series but they never did. Plus they shot themselves in the foot as far as telling any kind of story post-shepherd. With the gates being destroyed and everyone essentially stranded they really can only do prequels leading up to the shepherd era. They were clearly scrambling to come up with a somewhat definitive conclusion to the trilogy, and it showed. The "redo" of the ending they released after hugely negative fan reactions was equally as bad. It was essentially the same thing but tweaked a bit. 


The Shepherd indoctrination fantheory is a far better ending than bioware came up with, so I choose to believe that one was "canon". 

Compare that with a game like Fallout New Vegas, where your choices at the end of the game (and throughout) make a huge impact in terms of how the game ends. THAT is how you do a game with multiple endings. Don't bother giving me the option of multiple endings if they're not that substantially different.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 9, 2021)

KnightBrolaire said:


> Mostly how they ended the series, regardless of which option you choose. I tried all the different permutations and it really didn't matter in the end, they were all basically the same. It was a cheap shitty way to end an overall relatively well written series, especially because they weren't pushing a narrative about destiny/inescapable fate. I would have been fine with it had they foreshadowed something like that from the beginning in the series but they never did. Plus they shot themselves in the foot as far as telling any kind of story post-shepherd. With the gates being destroyed and everyone essentially stranded they really can only do prequels leading up to the shepherd era. They were clearly scrambling to come up with a somewhat definitive conclusion to the trilogy, and it showed. The "redo" of the ending they released after hugely negative fan reactions was equally as bad. It was essentially the same thing but tweaked a bit.
> 
> 
> The Shepherd indoctrination fantheory is a far better ending than bioware came up with, so I choose to believe that one was "canon".
> ...



Throughout both games I always wondered if some of your options were trivial in nature. Does this merely affect the response I receive from the NPC, while still giving me the same dialogue once that interaction is over?

..."Blank Shepard stare"


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## Mathemagician (Jul 9, 2021)

I want to buy this game. But there is just so much game to game through. Like, do I even have that much time to game? I put an easy 50+ hours into my first ME1 playthrough (I had to read each shiny thing - worldbuilding!!!). 

I just, I just don’t know if I have it in me. Respect for anyone powering through them all.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 9, 2021)

Mathemagician said:


> I want to buy this game. But there is just so much game to game through. Like, do I even have that much time to game? I put an easy 50+ hours into my first ME1 playthrough (I had to read each shiny thing - worldbuilding!!!).
> 
> I just, I just don’t know if I have it in me. Respect for anyone powering through them all.



I LOVED reading every shiny new piece of lore, thing, planet, etc.
I powered through ME3 this weekend and put off a trip with friends to do it. As you alluded to, very time consuming. 
It's worth getting but gotta stay consistent with it imo. If you want to get Andromeda it's not as much as a venture as the trilogy combined.


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## Choop (Jul 9, 2021)

Haven't bought the Legendary Edition yet (since it's only been about a year since I last played ME3) but I'll probably snag it later this year if/when it goes on sale again. ME2 seems like it is generally considered the best of the originals since it grew the most from it's predecessor while still maintaining quality. I really liked ME3 as well tbh, even with the big dumb ending being what it is (they are?). ME3 is dumber than 2 in a lot of ways, but it's also still really fun.

I also haven't played Andromeda! The launch was bad and that put me off, but apparently it's been fixed at least up to a point. I'll give it a go at some point in the near future.


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## Mathemagician (Jul 9, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> I LOVED reading every shiny new piece of lore, thing, planet, etc.
> I powered through ME3 this weekend and put off a trip with friends to do it. As you alluded to, very time consuming.
> It's worth getting but gotta stay consistent with it imo. If you want to get Andromeda it's not as much as a venture as the trilogy combined.



You actually reminded me that I own Andromeda from PSN or something. Ooooh, that’s fun. I love sci-fi and not spending money.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 9, 2021)

Choop said:


> I also haven't played Andromeda! The launch was bad and that put me off, but apparently it's been fixed at least up to a point. I'll give it a go at some point in the near future.



Andromeda is worth it, and I also got it on sale last year :-0
I would wait for the price to drop as well during a flash sale or something, I have it on Playstation.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 9, 2021)

Mathemagician said:


> You actually reminded me that I own Andromeda from PSN or something. Ooooh, that’s fun. I love sci-fi and not spending money.



Same. Especially the not spending money part lmao.
I bought it on PSN and of course it was free a couple months later, assuming you added to your library I think you can play it.


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## Lorcan Ward (Jul 9, 2021)

I was hyped for the legendary edition but in the end they didn’t really ad anything new to a game I bought and played 10 years ago. Compared to what beamdog did with the infinity engine games I couldn’t justify the price. 



KnightBrolaire said:


> Compare that with a game like Fallout New Vegas, where your choices at the end of the game (and throughout) make a huge impact in terms of how the game ends. THAT is how you do a game with multiple endings. Don't bother giving me the option of multiple endings if they're not that substantially different.



thread derail but New Vegas and it’s intertwining plots and choices are a work of brilliance. It’s not just pick A, B and for a few quests C. It’s pick option D which opens up another option C but locks you out of another option A. I wonder if we will ever see another RPG with that level of choice.


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## BlackMastodon (Jul 10, 2021)

Wait. OP, are you playing the series backwards (ME:Andromeda > ME3 > ME1/2)?

I loved the streamlined gameplay in Andromeda and ability to multiclass/customize each class, but man were the story and characters forgettable compared to the trilogy. 
I barely gave a shit about any of my crew members whereas just about every crew member in all of the trilogy games has something super interesting going on. 

I'm so disappointed that Andromeda was a flop and I hope it means BioWare doesn't sideline permanently. At least Anthem was trash so it gives me hope that they'll go back to ME sooner. 

Also, yeah they did kinda fuck themselves over with continuing after the trilogy but I'd love some prequel stuff like the Krogan uprising or even the First Contact War with the Turians. There's so much lore to drive stories.


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## Ralyks (Jul 10, 2021)

Honestly I think Andromeda's biggest fault was it had "Mass Effect" attached to the name. It's a perfectly fine game. Yes, it was rough when it came out but it sounds like it's been fixed up.


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## TedEH (Jul 10, 2021)

Ralyks said:


> Honestly I think Andromeda's biggest fault was it had "Mass Effect" attached to the name. It's a perfectly fine game. Yes, it was rough when it came out but it sounds like it's been fixed up.


+1 to this. I feel like so many games end up "failing" to be a follow up that franchise fans want, but are otherwise perfectly fine products in their own right. Andromeda wasn't mind-blowing, but it was fine. It had bugs, but name me a game that has no bugs.

I think playing the series out-of-order defeats a lot of what the narrative was going for, and potentially robs you of being able to see the progression for what and why it was. At the same time, I get that people play games with a focus on different elements, so maybe it doesn't matter. I liked the narrative of the whole original series, but I'm also not one to nitpick that kind of thing. Plot holes? Don't care, if its interesting. Lack of choices? Also kinda don't care as long as I was entertained.

I think at some point I gave up on the idea of "your choices in video games _really matter_" given that more games do it "wrong" than "right". I mean, this wasn't the first game to give you a cop-out button-press multiple choice choose-your-ending. I think several Deus-Ex games did it, and those games are highly regarded. (And I know, I know, they "didn't promise meaningful narrative branches".) I think I also refuse to let the last 30 minutes of a game spoil the fact that however many dozens of hours across three games up to that point were very engaging.

It's been long enough since I played these though that I have trouble picking a "best" one. Probably 2 though.


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## SpaceDock (Jul 10, 2021)

Been playing the Legendary Edition and beat ME1 in 11 hours, but didn’t really do any side missions. 

I thought Andromeda was the best of the series for sure. The mechanics and locations were amazing. Really sad that so many people crapped on it for bugs at release, looked perfect compared to Cyber Punk or Skyrim.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 10, 2021)

BlackMastodon said:


> Wait. OP, are you playing the series backwards (ME:Andromeda > ME3 > ME1/2)?
> 
> I loved the streamlined gameplay in Andromeda and ability to multiclass/customize each class, but man were the story and characters forgettable compared to the trilogy.
> I barely gave a shit about any of my crew members whereas just about every crew member in all of the trilogy games has something super interesting going on.
> ...


Yeah I'm playing it out of order since I bought and played Andromeda first. I got sucked into reading all the lore and arguments online (Remnant vs Prothean/Leviathan tech) so I went back and played ME3 to finish the ending, so now I'm rounding out with 1/2. 
Hoping they come out with something good for ME5, the teaser trailer doesn't point to anything definitive other than Liara.


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## Merrekof (Jul 10, 2021)

Has someone ever played Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic? This was in my mind the "prequel" to the ME series. Both were made by Bioware IIRC.

SW:KOTOR laid the groundwork by recruiting a squad, levelling up, build tactics around the strength and weakness of your squad. The choices you made throughout the game had great effect on the plot or future bonusses. (For example: piss off some guys on a planet and suddenly medpacks rise in price)
KOTOR 1 had a great plot, KOTOR 2 not so much.

Mass Effect 1 went on from this and got a whole lot better. Mass Effect 2 took the flaws from ME1 and fixed them. ME3 felt a little less open-world but it was the plot ending that was the biggest bummer of all!

Never played Andromeda because if the shitstorm it left on the internet. I never gave it a fair chance either tbh.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 10, 2021)

TedEH said:


> I think playing the series out-of-order defeats a lot of what the narrative was going for, and potentially robs you of being able to see the progression for what and why it was. At the same time, I get that people play games with a focus on different elements, so maybe it doesn't matter...Lack of choices? Also kinda don't care as long as I was entertained.


I enjoyed Andromeda for what it was but the constant references made me go back and check out the game in full. It was never on my radar until I started reading about the reapers and leviathan online, then I knew I had to go back and play them. Like you said as long as your entertained, and for me Andromeda had the visuals and gameplay to match. Playing ME1/3 has had me appreciate the dialogue and choices more as I skipped most of those scenes whenever I could in Andromeda just so I could go back into actual gameplay.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 10, 2021)

SpaceDock said:


> Been playing the Legendary Edition and beat ME1 in 11 hours, but didn’t really do any side missions.
> 
> I thought Andromeda was the best of the series for sure. The mechanics and locations were amazing. Really sad that so many people crapped on it for bugs at release, looked perfect compared to Cyber Punk or Skyrim.



I'm a few hours into ME1, let's see if I can beat 11hrs haha. 
The first set piece in Andromeda that was really visually striking was the destroyed moon (planet?) mission, buy yeah Andromeda is great on its own if we're not comparing to the other games in the series.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 10, 2021)

Merrekof said:


> Has someone ever played Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic? This was in my mind the "prequel" to the ME series. Both were made by Bioware IIRC.
> 
> SW:KOTOR laid the groundwork by recruiting a squad, levelling up, build tactics around the strength and weakness of your squad. The choices you made throughout the game had great effect on the plot or future bonusses. (For example: piss off some guys on a planet and suddenly medpacks rise in price)
> KOTOR 1 had a great plot, KOTOR 2 not so much.
> ...


Never played it but that totally makes sense. Cool to see companies learning and applying mistakes from previous games. Were they games focused on the RPG element over anything else?


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## wankerness (Jul 10, 2021)

Andromeda fucked up the combat in a *huge* way - they completely removed the ability to manually cast squadmates' powers, resulting in you just having to depend on stupid AI and not being able to manually deal with enemy armor/shields or save yourself with clutch CCs from teammates like you could in the first three games. If you ignore everything about your squadmates, the combat is definitely more fluid and superior to the earlier games. I HATED that change, though.

Regarding the plot/characters, they were pretty damn bad compared to 1-3. Your player character in particular is incredibly unappealing, especially with the hideous default character models and the wonky facial expressions. It's amazing how they're actually worse than games that were nearly 10 years older. And none of your teammates come close to the lineup in 1/2/3. It's like they hired the people who designed/wrote James (imo the worst squadmate in the first three games) and asked for a game where all your teammates are that uninteresting.

I played through the whole thing and didn't mind it that much, but it definitely feels like an off-brand spinoff that could have used a lot more polish. I like the more "open world" feeling ala ME1 with the vehicle, but so much of the stuff on the planets is blatant filler that it kind of undermines any appeal that would have had.

ME3>2>1=Andromeda, but none of them are bad games.

I'm going through the legendary edition on Insanity right now. ME2 is the worst in terms of story and some horrendous mechanics (the hammerhead's scaling on insanity makes it nearly unplayable), but the best in terms of characters and side-missions (the loyalty missions are almost all great). ME3 is the best in terms of gameplay and it's not even close. 

ME3's story is pretty good, definitely better than 2's, but it suffers HARD from Rise of Skywalker syndrome. Like, you get a promising story that lays out all these great new characters, tells a pretty solid self-contained plot, and leaves the threat of the Reapers with 1. But then, a totally different writing team came in for ME2 and said "hey, we're going to just blow up and/or ignore almost every single thing that you started with 1," and then 3's team had to somehow try to reconcile the two plots and conclude them all and they had less than 2 years to do it (seriously, the shortness of the development time between 2 and 3 was ridiculous, much like that between the new star wars trilogy). 2 hit an idiotic reset button by literally killing off the main protagonist and blowing up his ship but then having the evil society from 1 just hire every single main character from the first game so your ship/crew are almost all back and acting the same way as they did in 1. It's very bad. It's just covered up by how good all the characters are.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 10, 2021)

wankerness said:


> Andromeda fucked up the combat in a *huge* way - they completely removed the ability to manually cast squadmates' powers, resulting in you just having to depend on stupid AI and not being able to manually deal with enemy armor/shields or save yourself with clutch CCs from teammates like you could in the first three games. If you ignore everything about your squadmates, the combat is definitely more fluid and superior to the earlier games. I HATED that change, though.
> 
> Regarding the plot/characters, they were pretty damn bad compared to 1-3. Your player character in particular is incredibly unappealing, especially with the hideous default character models and the wonky facial expressions. It's amazing how they're actually worse than games that were nearly 10 years older. And none of your teammates come close to the lineup in 1/2/3. It's like they hired the people who designed/wrote James (imo the worst squadmate in the first three games) and asked for a game where all your teammates are that uninteresting.
> 
> ...



To your first point and after playing ME3, I didn't like that I needed to control my squadmates. I like the ability for them to go and do their own thing in Andromeda, which kind of rendered the positioning system sorta useless (aka go here or there). 

I am still really confused about the Illusive man and how that ties to ME2. This Bruce Wayne wannabe goes from rogue good guy to indoctrinated Reaper pawn? There are loose ends that I'm still tying up


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## wankerness (Jul 10, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> To your first point and after playing ME3, I didn't like that I needed to control my squadmates. I like the ability for them to go and do their own thing in Andromeda, which kind of rendered the positioning system sorta useless (aka go here or there).
> 
> I am still really confused about the Illusive man and how that ties to ME2. This Bruce Wayne wannabe goes from rogue good guy to indoctrinated Reaper pawn? There are loose ends that I'm still tying up



If you play on higher difficulties, having squad powers on manual usage is absolutely crucial to nuking down specific enemies and stripping defenses/knocking them down/throwing them away from you/setting up biotic combos. If you play on normal then you can just leave it on auto-cast and play like you're a solo character with dumb backups that just do damage like ME:Andromeda, but you'll be missing a ton of depth, especially in 3, where they added so many possible combos with tech/biotic powers triggering detonations off one another if used back to back.

I would VERY highly recommend playing ME3 on at least hardcore, since its difficulties are a lot more forgiving than 1/2. However, I've never played the game starting at level 1, since I only have played imported characters, and as you start at level 30 with a ton of powers if you import from ME2, I'm guessing your character is very basic and limited.

Of COURSE you're confused about the plot if you skipped 1 and 2!!! It's the culmination of an extremely story-heavy trilogy!

If you play them out of order you're missing out a TON of plot and also character import mechanics. Each game allows you to import a completed game from the previous game, which also starts you out in the game at a much higher level, and leads to interactions with different NPCs, entirely different characters even available to you as squadmates, and plot developments and rewards than you get starting at 0 and not having any progress from the previous games. Playing them 3-2-1 is a recipe for major disappointment and leading to you thinking Andromeda is the best cause you'll similarly want to skip through all the dialogue and character stuff cause you won't know what any of it means or have any attachment to characters.


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## TedEH (Jul 11, 2021)

Merrekof said:


> Never played Andromeda because if the shitstorm it left on the internet. I never gave it a fair chance either tbh.


I've gotten into the habit of trying to avoid or ignore online reviews of sequels or follow ups to thinks I like, since the internet seems to invariably throw shit fits at the slightest deviation from what was expected or wanted.


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## Wc707 (Jul 11, 2021)

I love 1-3. Some of the best games of this generation. Garrus, imo, IS the best squad mate and character. Just the dynamic that can be created between him and Shep is awesome. 
Each game is interesting with choices: the first one as Renegade is funny, the 2nd retains that goofy pull your gun when you dont wanna talk anymore shit, but the 3rd REALLY hammers in your decisions, and I think thats awesome. Sometimes there is filler [resource farming/probing Uranus], but I genuinely think the time and thought they put into the franchise and each game was awesome.
The ending choices of 3 were...polarizing. I can understand their logic and the options that were presented, but it wasnt delivered the best. It was too sudden and awkward.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 11, 2021)

wankerness said:


> If you play on higher difficulties, having squad powers on manual usage is absolutely crucial to nuking down specific enemies and stripping defenses/knocking them down/throwing them away from you/setting up biotic combos. If you play on normal then you can just leave it on auto-cast and play like you're a solo character with dumb backups that just do damage like ME:Andromeda, but you'll be missing a ton of depth, especially in 3, where they added so many possible combos with tech/biotic powers triggering detonations off one another if used back to back.
> 
> I would VERY highly recommend playing ME3 on at least hardcore, since its difficulties are a lot more forgiving than 1/2. However, I've never played the game starting at level 1, since I only have played imported characters, and as you start at level 30 with a ton of powers if you import from ME2, I'm guessing your character is very basic and limited.
> 
> ...



I tried playing on higher difficulties but the mechanics kept making me restart the mission and not the enemies themselves, would rather have fun than grind out nonsense (God of War 3, Dark Souls). 

Guess I'll have to see what I can import from ME1 once I start ME2. I enjoy the overall story over any individual character, kinda peeking into whatever conflict and struggles those characters arose from and not necessarily what the actual character comprises of. Let's see what new interactions and NPCs I get to on this playthrough. 

Overall my favorite is still Andromeda. Visuals are too good and I don't have any nostalgia from the first few.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 11, 2021)

Wc707 said:


> The ending choices of 3 were...polarizing. I can understand their logic and the options that were presented, but it wasnt delivered the best. It was too sudden and awkward.



Would you have rather had the 3 options presented differently, i.e. more story to fill in, or other/different options?
The Shepard indoctrination fan theory was an interesting ending and alternative.


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## Merrekof (Jul 11, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Never played it but that totally makes sense. Cool to see companies learning and applying mistakes from previous games. Were they games focused on the RPG element over anything else?


I wouldn't say mistakes. It was more like polishing something that is already pretty good.
And yes, they were RPG's. The combat wasn't like a shooter game like ME123 but more like a point an click type of combat. The rest of the game was more or less the same as ME. Start off poor and untrained, get some guys/girls/droids to join the gang, do a main quest and a bunch of optional quests, get some cash, buy new weapons/armor/grenades/upgrades/... And defeat the bad guys! There were also some minigames available like a Star Wars version of drag racing and Blackjack. Mess up some stuff and you could lose a valuable teammate or the possibility to do certain sidequests.

Knights of the old Republic remains at the top of my favourite game list actually. I like it better than ME because..well it's Star Wars.


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## wankerness (Jul 11, 2021)

Kotor1 and 2 (well, the patched pc version) are both very good turn-based rpgs. I played through them a few years ago, they hold up decently. The character morality/choices and squad stuff are really the only similarities to ME in terms of gameplay.


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## Wc707 (Jul 11, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Would you have rather had the 3 options presented differently, i.e. more story to fill in, or other/different options?
> The Shepard indoctrination fan theory was an interesting ending and alternative.


Yeah maybe more story to fill in and lead up to it. I guess thinking more about it, they do kinda present the 3 choices for organics in missions and side quests throughout the whole trilogy [go here and save these people, destroy or help Legions people, help joker get some electric lady love, etc].
I have heard of and seen the points in the story that showcase Shep possibly being indoctrinated. It is plausible, but I would be inclined to believe his/her squad mates would notice Shep being like Saren.


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## BlackMastodon (Jul 12, 2021)

I chose to believe the indoctrination theory because it was the most interesting and made the ending of ME3 sting less. I don't even necessarily mind the end result so much, just the fact that it all boiled down to choosing 1 of 3 literal paths for the ending bugged me. If you were "locked in" to an ending based on major choices you make in the games them that would've been better imo (I think Witcher 3 does this, right?).


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## wankerness (Jul 13, 2021)

BlackMastodon said:


> I chose to believe the indoctrination theory because it was the most interesting and made the ending of ME3 sting less. I don't even necessarily mind the end result so much, just the fact that it all boiled down to choosing 1 of 3 literal paths for the ending bugged me. If you were "locked in" to an ending based on major choices you make in the games them that would've been better imo (I think Witcher 3 does this, right?).



yeah, ME3 definitely has the least apparent consequences to choices in it. I mean, you can choose the nice or mean option for almost everything in the entire game no matter what you’ve done up to that point since the renegade/paragon level is almost completely irrelevant. There’s only a couple places where it matters.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 13, 2021)

BlackMastodon said:


> I chose to believe the indoctrination theory because it was the most interesting and made the ending of ME3 sting less. I don't even necessarily mind the end result so much, just the fact that it all boiled down to choosing 1 of 3 literal paths for the ending bugged me. If you were "locked in" to an ending based on major choices you make in the games them that would've been better imo (I think Witcher 3 does this, right?).



Personal canon is the best and only canon :-0


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## Choop (Jul 13, 2021)

Like a moron I put off playing ME3 for a long time because the ending reception was really bad, but after having played it like a year ago I honestly wasn't too bothered by it. The worst part about it IMO is the presentation and how you arrive to the end choice, like it feels obvious that the developers weren't really sure how to end the series for good and work it in seamlessly. They just made the reapers too powerful -- it pretty much necessitated the ultimate deus ex machina lol. ME3 was still really fun; I wish I had played it years earlier.


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## sakeido (Jul 13, 2021)

Choop said:


> Like a moron I put off playing ME3 for a long time because the ending reception was really bad, but after having played it like a year ago I honestly wasn't too bothered by it. The worst part about it IMO is the presentation and how you arrive to the end choice, like it feels obvious that the developers weren't really sure how to end the series for good and work it in seamlessly. They just made the reapers too powerful -- it pretty much necessitated the ultimate deus ex machina lol. ME3 was still really fun; I wish I had played it years earlier.



a lot of the problems with ME3's ending was cuz ME2 didn't do nearly enough to advance the plot.. ME2, you think you're going to be striking some tremendous blow against the Reapers but nah you just kill one proto-reaper in the end. So all they do is establish that everybody's fucked and your best efforts made practically no difference to the war as a whole, then they leave themselves one game to wrap everything up.

In the end, I didn't really care about the main plot that much.. I just wanted good endings for my team and the Citadel DLC did a fantastic job with that.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 13, 2021)

Choop said:


> Like a moron I put off playing ME3 for a long time because the ending reception was really bad, but after having played it like a year ago I honestly wasn't too bothered by it. The worst part about it IMO is the presentation and how you arrive to the end choice, like it feels obvious that the developers weren't really sure how to end the series for good and work it in seamlessly. They just made the reapers too powerful -- it pretty much necessitated the ultimate deus ex machina lol. ME3 was still really fun; I wish I had played it years earlier.



I've completely let go of considering any reviews, even from friends. If trailers look interesting, then I'll play the game and if I like it, I like it and nothing more.


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## CovertSovietBear (Jul 13, 2021)

sakeido said:


> a lot of the problems with ME3's ending was cuz ME2 didn't do nearly enough to advance the plot.. ME2, you think you're going to be striking some tremendous blow against the Reapers but nah you just kill one proto-reaper in the end. So all they do is establish that everybody's fucked and your best efforts made practically no difference to the war as a whole, then they leave themselves one game to wrap everything up.
> 
> In the end, I didn't really care about the main plot that much.. I just wanted good endings for my team and the Citadel DLC did a fantastic job with that.


I didn't know that whole sequence was DLC! I just wanted it to end honestly, wasn't sure if it was a comedic break to ground you from all the action while I played through the game. Didn't play the Leviathan DLC portion so I'll have to circle back and play through that as well.


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## Choop (Jul 13, 2021)

I missed out on the DLC too since I played a borrowed copy of ME3 on PS3, so that's at least some motivation to play Legendary Edition!~


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## wankerness (Jul 13, 2021)

The Citadel dlc for ME3 is generally considered about the best thing in the entire series if you love the characters, and I know for some furious with the ending to ME3 it functioned as an acceptable apology and the "real" ending for the characters. It's loaded with great character moments and really funny callbacks to random things in the first two games (ex stupid dialogue that was repetitive in 1, or the Blasto ads you could hear in ME2, etc). It also includes some extremely frustrating combat sections depending on your class/difficulty, but hey. From a narrative/character perspective it's the best way the series could have gone out.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 10, 2021)

sakeido said:


> a lot of the problems with ME3's ending was cuz ME2 didn't do nearly enough to advance the plot.. ME2, you think you're going to be striking some tremendous blow against the Reapers but nah you just kill one proto-reaper in the end. So all they do is establish that everybody's fucked and your best efforts made practically no difference to the war as a whole, then they leave themselves one game to wrap everything up.
> 
> In the end, I didn't really care about the main plot that much.. I just wanted good endings for my team and the Citadel DLC did a fantastic job with that.


Just played through ME1 and I'm a few hours into ME2. So far the mechanics, plot, cutscenes are all insanely better than 1/3. Currently on the first Collector mission (horizon?) but to me the ME2 feels more in line with Andromeda than 1/3. Looking back, ME3 now feels odd when compared to the rest of the series. ME1 is just rough but ME2 is great.


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## sakeido (Aug 10, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Just played through ME1 and I'm a few hours into ME2. So far the mechanics, plot, cutscenes are all insanely better than 1/3. Currently on the first Collector mission (horizon?) but to me the ME2 feels more in line with Andromeda than 1/3. Looking back, ME3 now feels odd when compared to the rest of the series. ME1 is just rough but ME2 is great.


ME2 was my favorite in the series by miles. I really liked ME1 and 3 but ME2 is imo one of the greatest games of all time and the best 3rd person shooter I've ever played.

Sure the plot didn't go very far but I didn't care. The loyalty missions and the stress of the final mission were just perfection


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 10, 2021)

sakeido said:


> ME2 was my favorite in the series by miles. I really liked ME1 and 3 but ME2 is imo one of the greatest games of all time and the best 3rd person shooter I've ever played.
> 
> Sure the plot didn't go very far but I didn't care. The loyalty missions and the stress of the final mission were just perfection


The dialogue/cutscenes were what set the game apart. Seems like they regressed with 3 and Andromeda as well.


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## p0ke (Aug 16, 2021)

wankerness said:


> The character morality/choices and squad stuff are really the only similarities to ME in terms of gameplay.



That + I'd say they have a similar atmosphere in general. Combat is completely different though. I love the Kotor games, but Kotor2 is just so buggy, I never managed to finish it. I bought them both for a few € a while ago, and once again ended up rage quitting Kotor2 because it crashed and corrupted my save multiple times.

As for ME, I was super hyped when ME1 originally came out. It didn't dissapoint. But then there was a pretty long gap between it and ME2, so by the time that came out I had kinda lost interest in gaming in general. So now I'm definitely looking forward to getting the Legendary edition, but I'm waiting until the price comes down properly.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 16, 2021)

p0ke said:


> That + I'd say they have a similar atmosphere in general. Combat is completely different though. I love the Kotor games, but Kotor2 is just so buggy, I never managed to finish it. I bought them both for a few € a while ago, and once again ended up rage quitting Kotor2 because it crashed and corrupted my save multiple times.
> 
> As for ME, I was super hyped when ME1 originally came out. It didn't dissapoint. But then there was a pretty long gap between it and ME2, so by the time that came out I had kinda lost interest in gaming in general. So now I'm definitely looking forward to getting the Legendary edition, but I'm waiting until the price comes down properly.



Wouldn't be surprised if it gets lowered to $40 soon. I buy games when they eventually get lowered to $20, and don't start me on Steam sales


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## Merrekof (Aug 16, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Wouldn't be surprised if it gets lowered to $40 soon. I buy games when they eventually get lowered to $20, and don't start me on Steam sales


The last time I spent full price on a game was 10 years ago. Since then Steam sales and some free games here and there if you set up an account on a game webstore. 

I believe I bought ME I and II on a steam sale. Can't remember what I paid for these.


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## wankerness (Aug 16, 2021)

p0ke said:


> That + I'd say they have a similar atmosphere in general. Combat is completely different though. I love the Kotor games, but Kotor2 is just so buggy, I never managed to finish it. I bought them both for a few € a while ago, and once again ended up rage quitting Kotor2 because it crashed and corrupted my save multiple times.
> 
> As for ME, I was super hyped when ME1 originally came out. It didn't dissapoint. But then there was a pretty long gap between it and ME2, so by the time that came out I had kinda lost interest in gaming in general. So now I'm definitely looking forward to getting the Legendary edition, but I'm waiting until the price comes down properly.



KOTOR2 is a famous case where you NEED to get the huge unofficial patch on PC to have a good experience - it fixes scads of bugs and other minor issues and basically makes it feel like a polished experience. Much like Elder Scrolls:Oblivion.


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## p0ke (Aug 16, 2021)

wankerness said:


> KOTOR2 is a famous case where you NEED to get the huge unofficial patch on PC to have a good experience - it fixes scads of bugs and other minor issues and basically makes it feel like a polished experience. Much like Elder Scrolls:Oblivion.



Yeah, the problem is I'm playing it on Xbox... It's not nearly as buggy as it was back in the day, but the only way to progress in the game is to keep saving into multiple slots all the time. 
I haven't encountered other bugs though - originally on og Xbox it for example froze during the prologue, well, it didn't actually freeze but a droid in a cutscene got stuck in a wall and it just kept waiting. The only way to get past that was to telnet into the xbox and change the droid's trajectory using some debug commands 



CovertSovietBear said:


> Wouldn't be surprised if it gets lowered to $40 soon. I buy games when they eventually get lowered to $20, and don't start me on Steam sales



It was already on sale for around 45€, but I'm also waiting for ~20€.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 18, 2021)

I just got done playing Mass Effect 2 and can tell why everyone likes it the most. The dialogue, gun progression and mechanics were all better than 1/3. 3 seems like a mechanical/gameplay regression but it looks better, and the series would've been better if they kept 3 the way 2 was setup. I rather prefer having to augment a set of weapons slowly (sniper damage, AR damage) rather than continually buy the next iteration of a weapon. I had Collector armor and weapons by the end so that was ironic in a way.

I chose to keep the Collector base but unfortunately my favorite alien Garrus died while on the mission. Was not expecting that but at least I have Mordin and Legion. With Tali also dead I'm not sure if I can make peace between the Geth and Quarians if/when I play ME3 again. Last time I chose the Geth over the migrant fleet. 

Going to play through Andromeda again now that I have a better appreciation of the series.


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## Merrekof (Aug 21, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> Last time I chose the Geth over the migrant fleet.



I got them both to stand down and stop fighting.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 21, 2021)

Merrekof said:


> I got them both to stand down and stop fighting.


My friend did that too, I didn't even get the option to do so 
Have you seen that Legendary Edition infographic? Seems like I always go against what everyone else does. I got Wrex killed, I saved the Underground Reaper queen, I chose the colonist storyline, Mordin survived the suicide mission while Garrus died. Same thing happened to me when I played Detroit: Become Human, I got an ending that 1% of people got, while other people had a more common ending. Most were around 30% I believe


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## SpaceDock (Aug 25, 2021)

Got finished ME2 and made it through the suicide mission without losing anyone. I haven’t played any of these since they first came out. ME2 was so much better than 1. Looking forward to doing ME3 after a few week break.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 25, 2021)

SpaceDock said:


> Got finished ME2 and made it through the suicide mission without losing anyone. I haven’t played any of these since they first came out. ME2 was so much better than 1. Looking forward to doing ME3 after a few week break.


ME2 was great, what did you do for everyone to survive? I assume loyalty missions may have done it.


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## SpaceDock (Aug 26, 2021)

CovertSovietBear said:


> ME2 was great, what did you do for everyone to survive? I assume loyalty missions may have done it.



I think there were three ship upgrades that help you get to the base safely, the cut scenes even say dumb stuff like “glad we upgraded the plating, derp.” From there, yes I had loyalty from all team mates. I sent Tali into the pipe (tech skills), made Garreth leader of the second squad both times, send Grunt back to the ship with the doctor, used the ansari bionic lady forgot her name for shielding me through the short cut. I used Jacob and Miranda as my squad the whole mission. I think that was it. And yes, totally romanced Miranda lol.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 26, 2021)

SpaceDock said:


> I think there were three ship upgrades that help you get to the base safely, the cut scenes even say dumb stuff like “glad we upgraded the plating, derp.” From there, yes I had loyalty from all team mates. I sent Tali into the pipe (tech skills), made Garreth leader of the second squad both times, send Grunt back to the ship with the doctor, used the ansari bionic lady forgot her name for shielding me through the short cut. I used Jacob and Miranda as my squad the whole mission. I think that was it. And yes, totally romanced Miranda lol.


The only upgrade my ship had was the laser/gun upgrade, and the med bay upgrade seemed frivolous. I had Tali go through the pipes as well, and the squad leader was Garrus for the second part of the mission (Asari lady). I thought the Asari would die but Garrus was swept away by the swarm. I tried to romance Miranda but I'm not sure you can do it as female shepard, looked up some charts after trying 5 times w/ new dialogue. My goal was Liara but I somehow messed that up after she replaced the Shadow Broker hahaha
I had Collector weapons and armor so I was practically just taking back MY base at that point. ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL


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## SpaceDock (Aug 26, 2021)

That’s funny, I used the collector armor and weapons as well, I thought they were the best.


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## wankerness (Aug 27, 2021)

I’ve beaten me2 about 10 times and only ever lost one person in the suicide mission (first playthrough I didn’t have consistent enough morality choices to stop jack and Miranda fighting so I lost Jack’s loyalty and she got dissolved by the swarm!). If you do everything possible before progressing the main missions it seems hard to fail, unless I guess you do things like tell Legion to lead the squad or grunt to go in the vent.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 27, 2021)

Interesting, I did skip ship upgrades and loyalty missions so that must've impacted survivability. I'll have a better starting point once I pickup ME3 after I finish Andromeda. Currently 25hrs in and trying to complete every side mission before the major missions, or at least what it's allowing me to complete. Missing the mass relays and the ability to explore other areas though, but still as time consuming as ever.


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## wankerness (Aug 27, 2021)

So you skipped some of the major loyalty side missions in ME2, but find the side missions in Andromeda to be compelling enough to do all of them? Wow! I guess there's someone for everyone.


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## CovertSovietBear (Aug 28, 2021)

wankerness said:


> So you skipped some of the major loyalty side missions in ME2, but find the side missions in Andromeda to be compelling enough to do all of them? Wow! I guess there's someone for everyone.


Kinda, I wanted to run through the main plot points on my first run for ME2 and pushed off some side missions to complete the game faster. With 1 run of Andromeda completed I wanted to see what else was going on which would help me upgrade my character past the basic necessities, but I do feel the Andromeda side missions a bit more compelling as they're not as strictly tied into the needs of your crew specifically.


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## SpaceDock (Aug 28, 2021)

I still think andromeda was great


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## Merrekof (Aug 29, 2021)

SpaceDock said:


> I still think andromeda was great


And you have every right to think that. I haven't played Andromeda because of all of the negativity involved in the beginning. And I rarely play games these days, with a wife, two kids and a busy job schedule there is barely any time left for gaming.
I might download it anyway if I get it on a discount though.


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## KnightBrolaire (Oct 23, 2021)

this shit made me cackle


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## TedEH (Oct 23, 2021)

That's so much better than I expected.


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## BlackMastodon (Oct 23, 2021)

Likewise, that was extremely well done and would probably still be better than Goldmember.


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## Lorcan Ward (Oct 23, 2021)

That was amazing haha


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