# Dingwall education for an uninformed guitarist



## Petef2007 (May 17, 2020)

Ok guys, I'm probably be going to be taking the plunge into the world of high end bass guitars soon, and i'm very curious about these 'ere Dingwalls. 

I know they get plenty praised by people, but i'm genuinely curious what it is about them. 

I'm mostly looking at one of the NG or Combustion models, primarily as there's no way here in the UK can I afford a Z3 or Afterburner model. 

I'm pretty much going to be buying a 6 string, and going all in on one bass - I figure that I'd rather buy one and have it do all I want it to do (at least before I go fretless) rather than get a cheapish one now, save up for the Dingwall etc. 

I'm experienced with bass, so this isn't like i'm spending thousands on an instrument i've never played before. I'm just not experienced with the "scene" of bass - for example, we know why a Daemoness or Mayones gets praised, but I'm unsure what the equivalent is in bass.

So really what i'm asking is A - why are Dingwalls so praised and B - are the NG and Combustion models in the higher end bracket compared to other companies like, say, Ibanez and whatnot.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 17, 2020)

The NG models are part of the Combustion range, which is Dingwall's Chinese made line, hence the price tag being about half of a Canadian made model. 

Overall, the Combustion series has been very nice. The parts are solid, and construction has been consistently really good, having final assembly and QC done in Dingwall's recently expanded Canadian shop. 

That said, the appeal (outside endorsements by some popular artists) has been the extra long scale on the lowest string and pickup/preamp combination. So if neither of those things appeal to you, there are plenty of amazing basses in the $2k+ range that these fall in that can be had, some of them better or worse depending on your needs. 

For the record I have two MIC Dingwalls with a third on the way, and a Canadian bass coming down the pike. Though, I'm also a fan of other basses, so I feel I can be fairly objective here.


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## Bigsby (May 17, 2020)

i think what makes Dingwalls so praised is the 37" scale length and the crystal clear definition of the low strings even when tuned down low and the Darkglass Electronics on the NG's give it an aggressive tone if you need it and it can be dialed back to be as smooth as butter there's really just a special something about the tones that no other basses out there have IMO.
Even though these basses are "Made in China" their NG's and Combustions go through final inspection and setup in Canada and i don't think i've seen an NG2 in the wild that had any issues QC wise. mine came in flawlessly and it's been my every day bass for years and still absolutely 0 issues. even though these basses are pretty pricey i think they're absolutely worth every penny and sometime in the near future i'd love to get me another

Compared to other multi-scale basses on the market right now like Ibanez, Kiesel, Schecter they all seem to top out at around 35"" scale length.the longest of the 3 i listed being the Schecter coming in at 36" which isn't a bad thing necessarily, it's just a preference thing. i personally don't enjoy playing anything lower than like drop G# on 35" scale length and i don't really like super thick strings so having that extra 1-2" that no other production bass has is a huge + for me.


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## Petef2007 (May 17, 2020)

Thanks for the responses guys. 

Yes I must admit the scale length was what was drawing me to them - I'm wanting to be able to play stuff like Rush, Maiden, Tool etc with the top 4, but also be able to downtune also without having to invest in a different instrument for modern styles and whatnot. As I mentioned, I may only be getting the one bass, so I need to be able to cover everything with it (as much as reasonably possible). 

I didn't know the combustions were Chinese, although I suppose that matters less and less these days, especially if the final QC is done in Canada anyways. 

The Darkglass thing is something that I'm very curious about. I know about their pedals and such, but have no clue about the preamp in the instrument itself. Same with the pickups - to use an analogy, I know what sorts of sounds I can and can't get out of say EMGs, but I've not encountered the pickups and preamp on an NG before, or any of the Dingwalls really. 

I'd love someone with a full on Canadian bass to share their experiences too about how much (if any) of a step up they are from the Chinese ones. While a full Canadian one seems like overkill for a first high end bass, if I need to save I could - but it sounds like the NG is great too, so maybe that's all the bass I need if it can cover what I'm after.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 17, 2020)

I've played several Canadian Dingwalls, and that's why I took the dive on one. 

Quality is beyond reproach. 

That said, most Combustions will get you 90% of the way there. They are consistently really, really good. 

Think of it as the difference between an LTD Deluxe/1000 series and an ESP Original. 

As far as flexibility, the pickups and electronics in all the Combustion range models can get you a multitude of tones. Obviously they're not going to sound exactly like a Ric (early Rush), a P-Bass with flats (Iron Maiden), or a Wal (Tool), but the baseline tone is solid, and with enough outboard tone shaping you can get various core sounds. That all said, these are modern sounding basses. Think Ibanez SR/BTB, MTD, Roscoe, etc. Contemporary, active, soapbar humbucker equipped basses.


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## Merrekof (May 18, 2020)

Oh man, I wanted a Z3 but they are way out of my budget. So I bought a Comb. Hands down the best bass I've ever played. This thing made me play stuff I couldn't play before.

Sound wise, every note cuts trough clearly. The 5 way knob switch gets you several sounds, it is a modern sounding bass ofcourse so don't expect a classic.

Build quality is top notch. There is nothing bad about it. 

Since you are from the UK, I assume you'll be buying from Bass Direct? They have the biggest Dingwall selection in the world.


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## Avedas (May 18, 2020)

I bought a 5 string jazz bass last year. It sounded awesome but the low string was basically useless to my ears and fingers.

On a whim I tried an NG-2 at a local shop a few months later. I sold that J bass and now I own an NG-2. I only play half step down but my god that low string has no competition. There's a huge amount of tonal flexibility between the pickup selections and the Darkglass preamp.

I did notice recently that my frets are getting scratched to shit, and I've only used Dingwall strings so far.


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## Merrekof (May 18, 2020)

Avedas said:


> I bought a 5 string jazz bass last year. It sounded awesome but the low string was basically useless to my ears and fingers.


Yes, especially this. I owned several basses from various brand in various price ranges. I've been playing 5 strings exclusively for the last decade. And all the basses I owned had an underwhelming low B string or a too prominent high G string. EQ can fix a lot but then you have compromise somewhere. The multiscale bass however, gets the best out of every individual string. This was by far, the best improvement for me


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## Winspear (May 18, 2020)

I will say there is a LOT of improvement to be gained with regular 5 string basses by stringing them up with something like D'addarios 107 balanced set and single_ tapered_ 145. Still not great for downtuning, but makes even a 34" 5 string bass perform fantastically in standard tuning.


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## A-Branger (May 18, 2020)

these basses get the praise as mentioned before because the extra scale lenght. Only the LTD would match that as a production instrument. (theres also Ormsby, but the bass run was a small run so they are hard to find). The build of the instruments are great, and the pickups/electronics are amazing too. The brand is coming from a highend market, so they would always have that with them, these being the first "affordable" of their line.... Plus it was the signature bass from Nolly, so that help the hype too

pickups are great (not sure if they still using nordstrand to build them?).. and the electronics pre-amp is good too. And it also helps its "darkglass" a brand name is getting a lot of recognition with their pedals. So the name helps to sell, specially in the metal niche (that uses the pedals) and guitar players market

now for the "pre-amp".... is not technically a "pre-amp" as you would think a guitar pre section is... In the bass world on-board pre-amp, think about it as an EQ. Because thats what it is, an on-board EQ. Difference of the darkglass vs others is their choice of frequencies(and bell curves), they use 70Hz-500Hz-2.8kHz Other brands would use different bands.Thats pretty much it (Bartolini for example uses 30Hz-selectable mid of 250/500/800Hz-10kHz ). If you want the "darkglass" sound, then get a pedal. Your bass is not going to sound like the BK3 or one of their amps is what Im trying to say

also these basses got a more/less unique pickup configuration. And pickup configuration/shape/position is everything in the bass world. Its more/less a Stingray approach (in their 2 pickup models) with a slight twist, so that plus the scale lenght gives then their own particular sound

also, Im sorry but I need to ask.... Have you played a 6 string before? I know you saying "I figure that I'd rather buy one and have it do all I want it to do", Im just asking if that refers to the sound of the bass, or are you saying that as well for the 6 string part of it?


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## I play music (May 18, 2020)

Avedas said:


> I did notice recently that my frets are getting scratched to shit, and I've only used Dingwall strings so far.


That's to be expected because Dingwall basses have nickel silver frets and Dingwall strings are stainless steel. I like to have it the other way round usually so my frets last forever ;-)


Petef2007 said:


> Ok guys, I'm probably be going to be taking the plunge into the world of high end bass guitars soon, and i'm very curious about these 'ere Dingwalls.
> 
> I know they get plenty praised by people, but i'm genuinely curious what it is about them.
> 
> I'm mostly looking at one of the NG or Combustion models, primarily as there's no way here in the UK can I afford a Z3 or Afterburner model.


A word of warning: A lot of strings may not be long enough for a bass with that scale length. So before buying one I recommend you thinking about what strings you plan to use on it and check they fit.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 18, 2020)

I play music said:


> A word of warning: A lot of strings may not be long enough for a bass with that scale length. So before buying one I recommend you thinking about what strings you plan to use on it and check they fit.



The market has started filling the gap decently well, outside of Dingwall's own strings, D'Addario, Elxir, DR, Sadowsky, Rotosound, Fodera, and a few others offer "extra long scale" strings that are compatible with Dingwall basses. You might need to order them online or from the manufacturer, but it's not so bad given how infrequently bass strings are usually changed.


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## I play music (May 19, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The market has started filling the gap decently well, outside of Dingwall's own strings, D'Addario, Elxir, DR, Sadowsky, Rotosound, Fodera, and a few others offer "extra long scale" strings that are compatible with Dingwall basses. You might need to order them online or from the manufacturer, but it's not so bad given how infrequently bass strings are usually changed.


I got the impression that most of those "extra long scale" strings are made for 35" scale or so. Is there something like a knowledge base with a collection of all strings that do fit a Dingwall bass?


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## MaxOfMetal (May 19, 2020)

I play music said:


> I got the impression that most of those "extra long scale" strings are made for 35" scale or so. Is there something like a knowledge base with a collection of all strings that do fit a Dingwall bass?



You need about 38.75" to work on a 37" scale Dingwall, obviously the more wiggle room the better, and some brands you can push up the silk to get said wiggle room. 

Typically:

- Short = 30" to 32"
- Regular = 33" to 35"
- Long = 34" to 36"
- Extra Long = 36" to 40" (that's the longest I remember seeing off hand)

Here's a helpful list of most of what's out there: https://www.fretnation.com/Bass-String-Lengths-by-Manufacturer_ep_47-1.html


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## I play music (May 19, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> You need about 38.75" to work on a 37" scale Dingwall, obviously the more wiggle room the better, and some brands you can push up the silk to get said wiggle room.
> 
> Typically:
> 
> ...


Thanks! 
Looking at this page from the brands you have mentioned D'addario and Elixir are below 38,75" so NOT long enough. DR, Sadowsky, Rotosound and Fodera would be long enough but I'd have to check what's available from those here.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 19, 2020)

I play music said:


> Thanks!
> Looking at this page from the brands you have mentioned D'addario and Elixir are below 38,75" so NOT long enough. DR, Sadowsky, Rotosound and Fodera would be long enough but I'd have to check what's available from those here.



The Elixir work, I've used them. The taper sits in the nut, but it tunes up fine and hasn't hurt anything. 

I've heard folks on the Dingwall board have success with the D'Addario, so I guess take it with a grain of salt. 

That list is also just scrapped from the respective brands' websites. There could be inconsistencies. 

The point still stands: strings are not a problem big enough to preclude buying a Dingwall. 

Would they be as popular if strings weren't available?


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## TedEH (May 19, 2020)

I don't have much to add, but I've tried one of the Chinese Dingwalls once and was definitely impressed with it. I probably would have gone for one by now, but it's not really "my sound" in a bass. It's far too modern to my ears. If I was made out of money, I'd absolutely be looking into a Super-J though.


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## Mwoit (May 19, 2020)

Just a heads up, I'm based in Scotland and I own 2 ABZ6 bass guitars, which are the lowest price point Canadian bass guitars.

I bought them through Bassdirect on the 0% finance program (not sure if you're applicable) which made financing them much easier. In terms of strings, be careful and make sure that the strings are buy a long enough. I use Kalium but tax is killer! If I played bass way more often, I would change strings more often and not use Kalium to save money, although I do think they're great. I've used [Newtone] based in Derbyshire and they definitely do Dingwall length strings (which they have kindly sent new strings when I found out they weren't long enough!).

In terms of tone, there's nothing that quite sounds as clear as a Dingwall for better or for worse. It plays fantastically, is built like a tank and sounds clear. The difference between my two models are one is green with a wenge neck and triple pickups, and the other is blue with a maple neck and twin pickups. They are built consistently, and I don't think I'll sell them as they are keepers.


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## A-Branger (May 20, 2020)

I play music said:


> I got the impression that most of those "extra long scale" strings are made for 35" scale or so. Is there something like a knowledge base with a collection of all strings that do fit a Dingwall bass?



I had an Ormsby bass with the 36.9" scale on the lowB

D'addarios and ErnieBalls extralong/superlong strings sit in the nut on the middle tapper. The string tapers twice, the middle bit is the one sits on the nut.

As Max said, its not ideal, but it worked fine. D'addarios were terrible and the sound died on me in a matter of couple of days, similar thing happen to me in the past. The strings sound good, then one day they decide to die and *bam!* the do really quick, lik e"wtf is with my bass today?" quick

Ernie balls sit in the nut a little bit better, like they are a tiny bit longer, still not "perfect". My next purcahse was gonna be Elixirs extra long but I had to sold the bass before I was able to.

So yeah, the popular brands got strings long enough, but only in one string gauge (as pretty much most 5 string sets are). So if you are planing on de-tuning, or dropping to a .125 for the B instead of the .130, then you would need to get custom strings

and since you are planing on getting the 6 string version, then you would have to get custom order strings eitherway, so I guess it wont be much of an issue. You just need to buy the single highC string in a normal scale which every brand does


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## I play music (May 21, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Would they be as popular if strings weren't available?


Ok maybe I'm wrong then. I thought that for example the Ibanez multiscale basses were not any longer so that normal strings still fit. But maybe that reason was someone's invention.


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## I play music (May 21, 2020)

A-Branger said:


> So if you are planing on de-tuning


For me personally that would be the main reason to get a Dingwall.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 21, 2020)

I play music said:


> Ok maybe I'm wrong then. I thought that for example the Ibanez multiscale basses were not any longer so that normal strings still fit. But maybe that reason was someone's invention.



Honestly, I think it's half not wanting to be too out there from most bassists and also not having to buy another set of strings in bulk, all of thier basses ship with the same bulk D'Addario set, regardless of scale/string count. The exception being signature stuff. 

Though there's definitely a perception that strings are impossible to find (not really true anymore), enough so that question takes up the majority of posts on Dingwall social media and such. 

Are string options more limited than a 34" four string? Definitely. Is there a reasonable amount of options right now? I think so.


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## Merrekof (May 21, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Though there's definitely a perception that strings are impossible to find (not really true anymore)


This reminds of that Floyd Rose Speedloader disaster..


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## MaxOfMetal (May 21, 2020)

Merrekof said:


> This reminds of that Floyd Rose Speedloader disaster..



Yeah, that was a shit show end to end. It was totally born from a board meeting. Tons of solid ideas, but horrendous execution.


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## A-Branger (May 21, 2020)

I play music said:


> For me personally that would be the main reason to get a Dingwall.


kinda.

like playing a multiscale guitar in E standard, playing a Dingwall in B standard offers you a better tension and a clearer sound for the low strings, specially the B

But yeah, main advantage is to be able to de-tune to lower registers 



I play music said:


> Ok maybe I'm wrong then. I thought that for example the Ibanez multiscale basses were not any longer so that normal strings still fit. But maybe that reason was someone's invention.



could be. But also majority of bass players out there dont have the need to detune lower than a 5 string bass B. Even I would say most of metal music doesnt need the bass to go lower than that either, its more of a de-tuning a 4 string rather than going extra low. Its only in the niche market of the more "modern/dj0nt" metal music than you would see bass player trying to keep up with a 8 string guitar.

there is a market for such long scale need, but its not as big, so my guess is that Ibanez is jsut playing safe. Even that a 37" didnt felt as long as I though, its still might be a bit scary for a lot of people. Also "regular" packs of bass strings are all over the place in tension, so any multiscale option would help to even out a bit that. And I kinda like the new models start at 33", would help to give the G string a bit more rounded sound. I know a longer scale would give better attack, which is good for the lowB, but I dont need that for the G, it already has a lot of bite. If not Im planing a 33-35" bass build atm


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## Merrekof (May 21, 2020)

To go further on the long scale strings, haven't tried anything else bit Dingwall strings. These are fairly easy to get in Belgium. Order online through Bassdirect or Musik produktiv. 

And it isn't just better for low tunings, I found that neck multiscale to be a lot more comfortable to play. It didn't take 5 minutes to get used to at first. I find it harder to go back to the classic frets. 
I'd even say it is an upgrade for 4 string basses as well.


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## Merrekof (May 21, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, that was a shit show end to end. It was totally born from a board meeting. Tons of solid ideas, but horrendous execution.


I almost bought a speedloader Warlock, like really. I loved that sleek, clean headstock, had the cash on hand and ready to drop it but got doubts about it. I am glad I listened to my gut feeling and didn't buy it. Those guitars are worthless now..


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## MaxOfMetal (May 21, 2020)

Merrekof said:


> I almost bought a speedloader Warlock, like really. I loved that sleek, clean headstock, had the cash on hand and ready to drop it but got doubts about it. I am glad I listened to my gut feeling and didn't buy it. Those guitars are worthless now..



Can you believe folks still want money for guitars with those bridges?


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## Merrekof (May 21, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Can you believe folks still want money for guitars with those bridges?


Actually yes. You don't want to be the guy that spent 750 bucks (iirc) on a guitar that has no strings. So after that you decide you want to minimize the damage, I guess 

I'd still take one, for free though. Spend another 400 on a regular floyd and locking tuners, drill tuner holes and make the best of it. It was an NJ series, these were great value imo.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 21, 2020)

Merrekof said:


> Actually yes. You don't want to be the guy that spent 750 bucks (iirc) on a guitar that has no strings. So after that you decide you want to minimize the damage, I guess
> 
> I'd still take one, for free though. Spend another 400 on a regular floyd and locking tuners, drill tuner holes and make the best of it. It was an NJ series, these were great value imo.



If you're really into it, USA Floyd brand guitars pop up under $1k. I think they were like $3k originally.


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## Merrekof (May 21, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> If you're really into it, USA Floyd brand guitars pop up under $1k. I think they were like $3k originally.


Nah, I was referring to BC Rich speedloader guitars in general. I prefer the Ibanez trems over floyds anyway. I don't see myself buying a floyd rose guitar.

Also, second baby incoming, home improvement going on, corona crisis giving us uncertainties.. I'm not exactly in the position of spending more. I downsizing the collection anyway


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## laxu (May 24, 2020)

A-Branger said:


> kinda.
> there is a market for such long scale need, but its not as big, so my guess is that Ibanez is jsut playing safe. Even that a 37" didnt felt as long as I though, its still might be a bit scary for a lot of people. Also "regular" packs of bass strings are all over the place in tension, so any multiscale option would help to even out a bit that. And I kinda like the new models start at 33", would help to give the G string a bit more rounded sound. I know a longer scale would give better attack, which is good for the lowB, but I dont need that for the G, it already has a lot of bite. If not Im planing a 33-35" bass build atm



I vastly prefer the Ibanez multiscale lengths. I tried a couple of Dingwall NG2s earlier this year and found them very uncomfortable to play. Seemed like nice basses otherwise but so not for me.

I was heavily considering the Ibanez EHBs but so far have just decided to stick with my BTB33 as it plays well and does the job for me with a beefy enough low B.


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## Radau (May 30, 2020)

Had an NG3 6, wasn't super in love with it. I have an Afterburner 6 on order so we'll see how that goes


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## Brutal08 (May 31, 2020)

I just ordered a ng3 6 in ferrari green ETA spring 2021. Lets see how this compare to my thumb6 and taranis warwicks


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## redkombat (Jun 9, 2020)

I played knolly's dingwalls when perf played the club I used to work at. then a year or 2 later I played 2 Canadian 5 stringers. I loved the sound, found it was one of those great in the mix not great on its own types but it really cuts. honestly the big downside for me was it didn't feel as good in my hands as an Ibanez. if I had the $ id get one for studio hands down but if I got to pick and be choosy im sticking with Ibanez


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