# Advice modding a multiscale guitar



## Wolfos (May 7, 2018)

Hey guys,

I had the idea of snagging one of those super cheap ibanez multiscale guitars and modding them to try my hand at a few things.

My main questions for now are how to find out angles for pickups + bridges. The scale is 25.5-27

The guitar is the Ibanez RGMS7, here is a link to the specs. http://www.ibanez.com/products/eg_d...3&cat_id=1&series_id=1&data_id=343&color=CL01

My full intentions are to change everything basically except the neck. I want to upgrade the tuners, pickups, bridge, volume knobs, pots, switch, jack, refinish the body and head and smooth the frets.

As for now the only thing I'm needing help with to start are like I said, how do I find out the angles of the pickups and bridge and also if the bridge can be a single plate multiscale hipshot style or if this one has odd spacing and will require the ABM single style.

Thanks in advance!


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## odibrom (May 7, 2018)

For the angles, use the "D" string as reference since you have a 7 stringer. This strings represents the axis of the neck, so it should be a viable reference.

As for the bridge, I believe that guitar has a 12th fret perpendicular, so the angle should be around the same ball park as the nut... but feel free to correct me.


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## Wolfos (May 7, 2018)

odibrom said:


> For the angles, use the "D" string as reference since you have a 7 stringer. This strings represents the axis of the neck, so it should be a viable reference.
> 
> As for the bridge, I believe that guitar has a 12th fret perpendicular, so the angle should be around the same ball park as the nut... but feel free to correct me.



Thank you for the reply. So your saying the bridge should be the same angle as the nut, just in the opposite direction? I suppose I could always just try to measure both bridge and pickups manually.

I've also heard bareknuckle can match existing baseplates, I'm not sure if there are others.


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## Knarbens (May 8, 2018)

odibrom said:


> As for the bridge, I believe that guitar has a 12th fret perpendicular, so the angle should be around the same ball park as the nut... but feel free to correct me.



Let me correct you  That would only be the case if the top and bottom string would run parallel. But since the neck is tapered (string spread at the bridge > string spread at the nut) the angles at the nut and the bridge are different.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Fret Find 2-D and proper measuring tools (calipers, ruled straight edge, protractor, etc.) are going to be your best friends. 

Measure everything out, check your work, compare with what you want to replace anything with. 

None of this is rocket science, and unless you completely goof off it should be almost harder to screw up than to get damn close to right.


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## odibrom (May 8, 2018)

Knarbens said:


> Let me correct you  That would only be the case if the top and bottom string would run parallel. But since the neck is tapered (string spread at the bridge > string spread at the nut) the angles at the nut and the bridge are different.



"around the same ball park" is different than saying "equal". Their angle values will be similar, close if you will. Again, using the 4th string as a refrence can be a starting place for measurements, since it is the axis of the whole guitar structure...

Thanks for adding to the subject.


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## bostjan (May 8, 2018)

Cool idea. If you are routing the pickup cavities, then I'd say that pretty much any angle will work better than none, but yeah, Fret Find 2D should make short work of the problem. Hopefully its still around. I know the site tends to disappear from time to time.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

Thanks for the tips guys. If anyone could point me in the right direction for repainting (stu-mac?) And maybe a better multiscale but that would be great! I assume this will be cheap plastic.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

Just an update I have a switchcraft barrel jack, cts 500k pots, hipshot O-ring knobs and copper foil coming my way.

Still searching for tuners, bridge, but and bridge replacement.


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## diagrammatiks (May 8, 2018)

I would get one of the Harley Bentons if you are going to put that much work in it anyway.

mainly because that parallel why god why


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

diagrammatiks said:


> I would get one of the Harley Bentons if you are going to put that much work in it anyway.
> 
> mainly because that parallel why god why


 Your meaning the parallel 12th fret? This model is in store locally and I've played it, the 12th fret parallel doesn't bug me though I prefer the 9th I really hardly notice it.

Plus the mmibanez I found was actually much cheaper than the harley benton. It was used, had finish damage, and it was in Canada so no shipping or added duty. I basically got it for $350 Canadian total.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Just an update I have a switchcraft barrel jack, cts 500k pots, hipshot O-ring knobs and copper foil coming my way.
> 
> Still searching for tuners, bridge, but and bridge replacement.



Foil is good for pickguards and cavity covers, but shielding paint is king.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

Shielding paint... I dont think I've heard of that. Yes the foil was for my cavity and cover.

Is it better simply because there are no seams? Because I was told that the copper foil when layers is the equivalent to no gaps or seams.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Shielding paint... I dont think I've heard of that. Yes the foil was for my cavity and cover.



Don't get me wrong, foil will work and can look kinda cool, but the paint is so easy to work with to get into all the little corners. Great for pickup routes and even the channel the pickup wires go through. 

I find it does a better job, easier. Win-win.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Don't get me wrong, foil will work and can look kinda cool, but the paint is so easy to work with to get into all the little corners. Great for pickup routes and even the channel the pickup wires go through.
> 
> I find it does a better job, easier. Win-win.



Ahh I see well that makes sense since it's a liquid. I didnt realize it existed, I'm assuming I'll have to order it online.

While your here is there a difference between these two 5 way switch styles? The ibanez has the square style one in it but locally they sell the rounded versions like in the 2nd photo I'm not sure if there's a quality difference or if it's just space limitations in the cavity.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

I've never seen shielding paint in stores, but I haven't really looked. I've always purchased online. 

As far as the switches, they're primarily different designs. They both have eight tabs capable of the same switching schemes. The dimensions and quality can vary on both. Unless you're having having problems with the existing switch, I'd leave it. They're very simple devices and until they fail you're fine keeping it stock. Ibanez has always used fairly good stock electronic components, switches, pots, jacks, wire, etc. unless we're talking the GIO range and other lowest end/entry level models.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I've never seen shielding paint in stores, but I haven't really looked. I've always purchased online.
> 
> As far as the switches, they're primarily different designs. They both have eight tabs capable of the same switching schemes. The dimensions and quality can vary on both. Unless you're having having problems with the existing switch, I'd leave it. They're very simple devices and until they fail you're fine keeping it stock. Ibanez has always used fairly good stock electronic components, switches, pots, jacks, wire, etc. unless we're talking the GIO range and other lowest end/entry level models.



I have a photo of the current control cavity. It's an Indonesian guitar and sounds like garbage plugged in lots of interference like hissing, crackling etc. Its probably a perfect storm of terrible pickups, no shielding and bad soldering.

Although I was Impressed with how tidy the cavity is my last Indo guitar looked like a tornado hit.


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## bostjan (May 8, 2018)

Wow, that's interesting. Routed the sides of the cavity specifically to the pots? How bizarre.

I think that the cavity is shielded already. Conductive paint uses little particles of oxidized metal, so it appears kind of carbon gray in color.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> I have a photo of the current control cavity. It's an Indonesian guitar and sounds like garbage plugged in lots of interference like hissing, crackling etc. Its probably a perfect storm of terrible pickups, no shielding and bad soldering.
> 
> Although I was Impressed with how tidy the cavity is my last Indo guitar looked like a tornado hit.



The black paint in the cavity is shielding paint. 

Clean up the wiring and soldering first to see if that makes a difference.


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## Wolfos (May 8, 2018)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The black paint in the cavity is shielding paint.
> 
> Clean up the wiring and soldering first to see if that makes a difference.



Oh really? I didnt think they did that on the Indo guitars, unless that's just standard practice. Yes I'll clean up all the wiring/soldering. I'll have to tear everything out anyway because I'm going to refinish the guitar so I'll need to heat gun + scrape everything off. I'm sure the pickups are half the problem too.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Oh really? I didnt think they did that on the Indo guitars, unless that's just standard practice. Yes I'll clean up all the wiring/soldering. I'll have to tear everything out anyway because I'm going to refinish the guitar so I'll need to heat gun + scrape everything off. I'm sure the pickups are half the problem too.



Shielding paint has been pretty much the standard for production guitars since the 90's. It's cheaper and easier for manufacturing, so you'll see it even on super cheap stuff.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 8, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Oh really? I didnt think they did that on the Indo guitars, unless that's just standard practice. Yes I'll clean up all the wiring/soldering. I'll have to tear everything out anyway because I'm going to refinish the guitar so I'll need to heat gun + scrape everything off. I'm sure the pickups are half the problem too.



Shielding paint has been pretty much the standard for production guitars since the 90's. It's cheaper and easier for manufacturing, so you'll see it even on super cheap stuff.


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## Wolfos (May 9, 2018)

Anyone have a direction to point me for paint? Ultimately I'll wait until the black coat is off. If the mahogany underneath has a decent grain I'll try to do a tobacco burst finish. If not I'll do a metallic red with a bit of sparkle.

Picture ideas on finish.


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## LiveOVErdrive (May 9, 2018)

You probably know this already but refinishing with a solid color is easier if you use the existing finish as a base coat. Just sand it. And test to make sure the new finish won't react weird.


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## Wolfos (May 9, 2018)

LiveOVErdrive said:


> You probably know this already but refinishing with a solid color is easier if you use the existing finish as a base coat. Just sand it. And test to make sure the new finish won't react weird.



Yes but part of me is curious what the mahogany looks like underneath. I mean most likely it's probably crap but you never know, and if it is nice I think a tobacco stain would be killer. 

Chances are I will just stick with the red solid colour since I'm a busy guy and like easy. Any advice on the headstock? Do I just tape the crap out of it to make sure the paint only touches the top?


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## MaxOfMetal (May 9, 2018)

Look up a whole bunch of finishing tutorials and go with an option that best fits your skill level, schedule and budget. Some need hundreds of dollars in equipment and a booth, others a couple rattle cans.


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## Wolfos (May 11, 2018)

LiveOVErdrive said:


> You probably know this already but refinishing with a solid color is easier if you use the existing finish as a base coat. Just sand it. And test to make sure the new finish won't react weird.



I just thought right now, if it's so much easier (and I know it is) why do so many people go down to the wood. I'm always seeing people use the heat gun and scraper to refinish even with a solid colour.


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## MaxOfMetal (May 11, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> I just thought right now, if it's so much easier (and I know it is) why do so many people go down to the wood. I'm always seeing people use the heat gun and scraper to refinish even with a solid colour.



Depends a lot on the condition of the existing finish and what you want the outcome to be, not to mention what method and products you plan on using.


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## bostjan (May 11, 2018)

My preferred method, and I'm by no means an expert, is to strip down to the wood using a palm sander, then, donning rubber gloves, I rub in Rit dye, with a lighter colour starting from the centre and a darker colour starting from the edge, until I am satisfied with the result, then I clear coat over it with a couple spray cans and let the guitar hang for quite some time to cure, then sand down with a fine sandpaper and water, and repeat the spray/cure/wetsand steps again.

While I haven't had anything come out looking like level A+ professional (really just because of the clear coating), I've been happy with the results.


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## Wolfos (May 11, 2018)

bostjan said:


> My preferred method, and I'm by no means an expert, is to strip down to the wood using a palm sander, then, donning rubber gloves, I rub in Rit dye, with a lighter colour starting from the centre and a darker colour starting from the edge, until I am satisfied with the result, then I clear coat over it with a couple spray cans and let the guitar hang for quite some time to cure, then sand down with a fine sandpaper and water, and repeat the spray/cure/wetsand steps again.
> 
> While I haven't had anything come out looking like level A+ professional (really just because of the clear coating), I've been happy with the results.



And that's how you go about getting the tobacco burst type style of stain? I'll be looking that up for sure.


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## LiveOVErdrive (May 11, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> I just thought right now, if it's so much easier (and I know it is) why do so many people go down to the wood. I'm always seeing people use the heat gun and scraper to refinish even with a solid colour.


That's a good question. I should be clear that I haven't done any REfinishing before so I haven't actually done this method before. However in my experience finishing, the smoother your base is the smoother your final coat will be. And scuff sanding a super hard factory finish would give you a very smooth base indeed. 

Plus, you know, less sanding.


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## Wolfos (May 11, 2018)

LiveOVErdrive said:


> That's a good question. I should be clear that I haven't done any REfinishing before so I haven't actually done this method before. However in my experience finishing, the smoother your base is the smoother your final coat will be. And scuff sanding a super hard factory finish would give you a very smooth base indeed.
> 
> Plus, you know, less sanding.



Unfortunately the reason I got mine for so cheap was there's a huge finish crack and chips around the volume knob. I dont think I can sand and paint over this so I'll have to bring it down to the wood.

Anyway that's all fine by me I'll figure that out, now that the guitar is here I have to measure the pickup and bridge angles. The bridge I hope isn't weird to measure as it's not in a uniform line heres a picture. I was hoping to fit the normal hipshot multiscale bridge over these holes, if not I'll have to order single solo pieces.


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

Anyone have tips on removing string ferrules? Do I just push them through from the other side with a screwdriver? I tried it for a bit but I wasn't really getting anywhere, i didnt want to use a hammer just in case it chipped the wood.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 12, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Anyone have tips on removing string ferrules? Do I just push them through from the other side with a screwdriver? I tried it for a bit but I wasn't really getting anywhere, i didnt want to use a hammer just in case it chipped the wood.


I use a decent thickness hex key with a rubber mallet to lightly tap em out. If they're not coming out it's prob because they're stuck on the lacquer/clear coat. Stick a warm soldering iron in the ferrule for a bit to loosen the ferrule from the clear coat.


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I use a decent thickness hex key with a rubber mallet to lightly tap em out. If they're not coming out it's prob because they're stuck on the lacquer/clear coat. Stick a warm soldering iron in the ferrule for a bit to loosen the ferrule from the clear coat.



I'll try that now, while I have you here, bareknuckle says they dont make pickups higher than a 16° angle, and ofcourse mu pickups measure 12° neck and 17° bridge.

Any suggestions on where to get those made? And what type to get? I'm into Erra's tone right now pretty hard if that helps.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 12, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> I'll try that now, while I have you here, bareknuckle says they dont make pickups higher than a 16° angle, and ofcourse mu pickups measure 12° neck and 17° bridge.
> 
> Any suggestions on where to get those made? And what type to get? I'm into Erra's tone right now pretty hard if that helps.


depending on the pickups that you have in the multiscale right now, I'd say do a baseplate swap. If that's not an option then hit up elysian or instrumental or mjs/fokin for customs.
You'll probably want something more modern voiced for that kind of sound, so I'd say the javelin II, sfty3 or a bkp impulse set would serve you well. If you have a brighter sounding guitar then I'd pick the impulse set (the javelin ii and sfty3 are relatively bright pickups and might be overbearing).


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> depending on the pickups that you have in the multiscale right now, I'd say do a baseplate swap. If that's not an option then hit up elysian or instrumental or mjs/fokin for customs.
> You'll probably want something more modern voiced for that kind of sound, so I'd say the javelin II, sfty3 or a bkp impulse set would serve you well. If you have a brighter sounding guitar then I'd pick the impulse set (the javelin ii and sfty3 are relatively bright pickups and might be overbearing).



So by baseplate swap you mean take a straight set and attach them to the Ibanez baseplate? If that's the case and I can do it myself I have a set of dimarzio Illuminators I might as well do it to. Its s project guitar and I'm happy enough with the sound of the illuminator.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 12, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> So by baseplate swap you mean take a straight set and attach them to the Ibanez baseplate? If that's the case and I can do it myself I have a set of dimarzio Illuminators I might as well do it to. Its s project guitar and I'm happy enough with the sound of the illuminator.


yup, just take a straight set and swap em onto the angled baseplate.


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> yup, just take a straight set and swap em onto the angled baseplate.


Awesome, that's why I love being on this site, you guys rock.


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## LordCashew (May 12, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Anyone have tips on removing string ferrules? Do I just push them through from the other side with a screwdriver? I tried it for a bit but I wasn't really getting anywhere, i didnt want to use a hammer just in case it chipped the wood.



I've used a screw, small enough to fit through the string hole at the inner end of the ferrule but big enough to grab there. After screwing it in, you can pry the ferrule out from the back using a flatbar/nail puller. Of course you'll want to place something on the lever point to protect the guitar's finish.

I imagine KnightBrolaire's idea will work, but just thought I'd toss it out there just in case.


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

LordIronSpatula said:


> I've used a screw, small enough to fit through the string hole at the inner end of the ferrule but big enough to grab there. After screwing it in, you can pry the ferrule out from the back using a flatbar/nail puller. Of course you'll want to place something on the lever point to protect the guitar's finish.
> 
> I imagine KnightBrolaire's idea will work, but just thought I'd toss it out there just in case.


Thanks for the tips!

KnightBrolaire's idea worked like a charm, I had them all out in about 30 seconds! She's nothing but a husk now, off to peeling that finish off tonight.

The chip at the bottom was me trying to gauge how easily a hair dryer would work... it didn't go do well.


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## Wolfos (May 12, 2018)

Well that took about 15 minutes after using a heat gun lol.

I also know why the paint chipped, right at the volume knob the wood split into the control cavity.... awesome, so there goes my idea for staining the wood. I'll have to fill that and strengthen it somehow because the wood above the control cavity is thin and flimsy and could easily crack again after I paint this.


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## Wolfos (May 14, 2018)

Standing tonight and painting this week! Shell be as red and glittery as Jessica rabbit I hope!








Anyone know where I can get a Waterslide Ibanez logo replacement?


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## MoonJelly (May 15, 2018)

Just search 'Ibanez logo' on eBay. lots of colors available


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## Wolfos (May 15, 2018)

MoonJelly said:


> Just search 'Ibanez logo' on eBay. lots of colors available



Thanks, I did and have one on order! Now I'm trying to locate a blank nut long enough to file into the multiscale shape I need. This plastic on has got to go!


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## MoonJelly (May 15, 2018)

Corian scraps work great as a nut material. Just check with a local store that does counter tops, they may give you some for free.


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## Wolfos (May 21, 2018)

Hey there, so as I went to town with the heat gun and torched + scraped all the paint off the guitar I must have gotten a little too close to the neck wood.

There are three dark brown burn marks around the headstock area of the neck now ugh does anyone know if I can just stand this out and then re seal the neck?

Any advice would be great.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 21, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> Hey there, so as I went to town with the heat gun and torched + scraped all the paint off the guitar I must have gotten a little too close to the neck wood.
> 
> There are three dark brown burn marks around the headstock area of the neck now ugh does anyone know if I can just stand this out and then re seal the neck?
> 
> Any advice would be great.


 You should be able to sand it out unless you really torched the wood.


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## bostjan (May 22, 2018)

If you can't sand it out, you might have to bake the whole thing; be the first one on your block to have an Ibanez baked maple neck.


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## Wolfos (May 22, 2018)

bostjan said:


> If you can't sand it out, you might have to bake the whole thing; be the first one on your block to have an Ibanez baked maple neck.



Well I'll start by saying I have zero experience in guitar building, but the neck is a 5 peice maple walnut, and has the fretboard on it. Wouldn't baking it compromise the glue?


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## bostjan (May 22, 2018)

Sorry, I need to remember to put the joking/shitpost emoji when I'm not being serious. Yes, I imagine baking the neck with the frets and fretboard and everything on it would be a bad idea, although I know polymer clay inlays can be baked (~130-135° C) in the fretboard without compromising the glue. I think to bake maple, though, you have to go to 150° C or higher. At any rate, if the temperature is hot enough to caramelize the sugars in the wood, it'd likely be high enough to cause PVA to decompose.


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## Wolfos (May 22, 2018)

bostjan said:


> Sorry, I need to remember to put the joking/shitpost emoji when I'm not being serious. Yes, I imagine baking the neck with the frets and fretboard and everything on it would be a bad idea, although I know polymer clay inlays can be baked (~130-135° C) in the fretboard without compromising the glue. I think to bake maple, though, you have to go to 150° C or higher. At any rate, if the temperature is hot enough to caramelize the sugars in the wood, it'd likely be high enough to cause PVA to decompose.



I had a feeling it was a joke but because of my inexperience with building I couldn't be sure. 

You seem to know a bit. When I sand the neck down do I have to seal it a specific way or can I just rub it with gun stock oil or something similar.


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## bostjan (May 22, 2018)

There might be a way to seal it with oil, but I think regular gun stock oil won't seal the maple well enough. I've always used spray-can lacquer, and I've had good luck with that. You have to be careful which kind you use, because some lacquers will feel sticky, even after curing, and I've even seen one that reacted with the rubber on a guitar stand. A hardened lacquer will keep the maple from oxidizing (turning dull grey) and will also protect the wood from minor scuffs and from moisture.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 25, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> I had a feeling it was a joke but because of my inexperience with building I couldn't be sure.
> 
> You seem to know a bit. When I sand the neck down do I have to seal it a specific way or can I just rub it with gun stock oil or something similar.


you could apply danish oil(aka linseed oil) or tung oil or tru-oil (which is just a brand name for a proprietary version of linseed oil) if you want an oiled neck. maple has relatively tight closed pores so it really doesn't need much in the way of finish, especially if you like the feel of the bare wood. danish oil or tru-oil will add a bit of an amber sheen and help bring out the figure of the wood a bit. Both of those tend to plasticize and cure hard after a while (though not nearly as hard as a good automotive poly). Tung oil also plasticizes/cures hard, but it's clearer and doesn't color the wood as much as danish/tru-oil. 

If you want to retain the look of raw maple you'd be better off spraying with a good polyurethane/whatever (preferably an automotive clear since they're far more durable than most rattle can finishes).
Whatever you do, don't use cheaper home improvement clear coats, most of them don't cure properly or get as hard as automotive clear (spraymax 2k is hard as a rock in 24 hrs or less ime). I used minwax poly 2x and it basically didn't cure for more than a year. I set the test guitar on the carpet and the back became textured by my carpet. I held the guitar and then my fingerprints gushed into the clear coat. Basically don't use that crap unless you're going for a very thin sealing coat.


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## Wolfos (May 25, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> you could apply danish oil(aka linseed oil) or tung oil or tru-oil (which is just a brand name for a proprietary version of linseed oil) if you want an oiled neck. maple has relatively tight closed pores so it really doesn't need much in the way of finish, especially if you like the feel of the bare wood. danish oil or tru-oil will add a bit of an amber sheen and help bring out the figure of the wood a bit. Both of those tend to plasticize and cure hard after a while (though not nearly as hard as a good automotive poly). Tung oil also plasticizes/cures hard, but it's clearer and doesn't color the wood as much as danish/tru-oil.
> 
> If you want to retain the look of raw maple you'd be better off spraying with a good polyurethane/whatever (preferably an automotive clear since they're far more durable than most rattle can finishes).
> Whatever you do, don't use cheaper home improvement clear coats, most of them don't cure properly or get as hard as automotive clear (spraymax 2k is hard as a rock in 24 hrs or less ime). I used minwax poly 2x and it basically didn't cure for more than a year. I set the test guitar on the carpet and the back became textured by my carpet. I held the guitar and then my fingerprints gushed into the clear coat. Basically don't use that crap unless you're going for a very thin sealing coat.



It's awesome that you posted this, so the paint I'm doing, (finishing today) I'm doing at my buddy's work, and auto body shop! I heard someone suggest their paints for better quality and durability. 

I was just thinking about if using there poly would be a better choice. I was hoping for an oil as I like the really thin raw feel. Both of my current guitars have a bare feeling neck and I can feel the pores/grain as I play and I like it.


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## KnightBrolaire (May 25, 2018)

Wolfos said:


> It's awesome that you posted this, so the paint I'm doing, (finishing today) I'm doing at my buddy's work, and auto body shop! I heard someone suggest their paints for better quality and durability.
> 
> I was just thinking about if using there poly would be a better choice. I was hoping for an oil as I like the really thin raw feel. Both of my current guitars have a bare feeling neck and I can feel the pores/grain as I play and I like it.


I'm in some guitar building/finishing groups, and there's lots of super experienced guys in there that chime in about rattle can finishes vs auto finishes. It's not that rattle can finishes can't look good, it's more that experienced painters have a lot more control with sprayguns/custom paints/etc. Prep work and keeping the paint layers thin are paramount to getting good finishes regardless of what kind of paint you use. I still struggle with the whole thin coats of paint thing since I'm pretty impatient.

Reasons to oil the neck: can feel the wood grain, easy to do, easy to repair, easy to remove if you don't like it, will slightly tint the color of the wood.
Reasons to poly the neck: more durable, retains raw color, can still feel super smooth and fast, more difficult to remove if you change your mind.


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## MoonJelly (May 25, 2018)

In my experience Minwax brand products are inferior to...every alternative I've tried. Varathane brand poly--you can pick up from Home Depot and brush on (+1 for the flooring stuff as it's extra hard when dry), it's the only thing cheaper than Spraymax that I've seen a really good result from.







Here's a cherry scrap after 3 coats, no sanding or buffing.


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## Wolfos (May 25, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I'm in some guitar building/finishing groups, and there's lots of super experienced guys in there that chime in about rattle can finishes vs auto finishes. It's not that rattle can finishes can't look good, it's more that experienced painters have a lot more control with sprayguns/custom paints/etc. Prep work and keeping the paint layers thin are paramount to getting good finishes regardless of what kind of paint you use. I still struggle with the whole thin coats of paint thing since I'm pretty impatient.
> 
> Reasons to oil the neck: can feel the wood grain, easy to do, easy to repair, easy to remove if you don't like it, will slightly tint the color of the wood.
> Reasons to poly the neck: more durable, retains raw color, can still feel super smooth and fast, more difficult to remove if you change your mind.



I might try to stick with oil then because they tick all my likes. I like that feel, I want it to be easy, and when I make a mistake... and I will, it will be easy to fix haha. I'm extremely gentle to my guitars anyway so I dont care over if it's super durable or not on the neck. Also the discoloration doesnt bug me. I dont really like that super pale white maple look anyway.

I will be honest though, the 3 burn marks are behind the headstock so I really only need to be sanding around there but chances are because I'm sanding there, I should sand everywhere to keep it all even. Seems like a lot of extra work though.


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## bostjan (May 25, 2018)

MoonJelly said:


> In my experience Minwax brand products are inferior to...every alternative I've tried. Varathane brand poly--you can pick up from Home Depot and brush on (+1 for the flooring stuff as it's extra hard when dry), it's the only thing cheaper than Spraymax that I've seen a really good result from.


I'll have to try that. I'm always nervous about wipe on poly, since I've never really tried it, and I fear that I'd end up having a hard time getting it on smoothly without little bubbles or something.


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## LiveOVErdrive (May 25, 2018)

bostjan said:


> I'll have to try that. I'm always nervous about wipe on poly, since I've never really tried it, and I fear that I'd end up having a hard time getting it on smoothly without little bubbles or something.


It's so thin you don't get bubbles.


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## Wolfos (May 31, 2018)

Update!

So I have a friend that works in an auto body shop and he let me use his paint booth for a couple nights. I didnt habs a ton of time because they are super busy so I made the best of it. 

After several coats, sanding etc I now have the guitar back at my house. Now heads up no this is not a pro job because it's the first time I've ever painted so yes there are bubbles, slight runs etc but I feel I did a pretty decent job considering my experience level.

One regret I have is I wish I taped better around the headstock I had a bit of paint overspray I'll need to sand out... oh well.

Here are some pictures. The paint I chose from their booklet looked really Ferrari red to me but in the end looked more like burnt copper on the guitar on well still neat so I emphasized this by adding golden flakes to the colour.


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## Wolfos (May 31, 2018)

Sorry for the crap photos I took them while I was supposed to be spending quality time with my family lol.


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## Wolfos (Jun 1, 2018)

A little advice please! I'm putting the bridge together and the hipshot single saddles and the ibanez dont match. I'd like to know what solution to use I'll post pictures to show what I mean.

#1 (preferred solution) can I have the string go through the slot in the plate instead of the hole? If so I can use the top screw hole and drill a bottom one new. See pic





#2 do I have to keep the string hole through the hole on the base plate? If so I'll have to drill 2 new holes. And one of the previous holes will show below the bridge. See pic





#3 Should I just use the old ibanez base plate? It's made for the guitar but its chrome and my theme was supposed to be red and black. See pic


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## Knarbens (Jun 1, 2018)

It looks like the intonation will work out right in #1 as the small recesses for the height adjustment screws go all the way up to the front hole on both bridges. 

The small slot is for a piezo wire, but maybe you could still use it as a string through body hole. 

I'd go with #1, drill the second hole at the end of the bridge to fix it and test if the string through body still works.


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## bostjan (Jun 1, 2018)

Darn. I guess those saddles aren't really a direct replacement. If you knew before painting, it wouldn't be a problem.

You might want to try your thickest string through that slot first, just to make sure it will fit.


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## Wolfos (Jun 1, 2018)

Knarbens said:


> It looks like the intonation will work out right in #1 as the small recesses for the height adjustment screws go all the way up to the front hole on both bridges.
> 
> The small slot is for a piezo wire, but maybe you could still use it as a string through body hole.
> 
> I'd go with #1, drill the second hole at the end of the bridge to fix it and test if the string through body still works.





bostjan said:


> Darn. I guess those saddles aren't really a direct replacement. If you knew before painting, it wouldn't be a problem.
> 
> You might want to try your thickest string through that slot first, just to make sure it will fit.



Yes I checked my thickest string .060 and it easily fits. I just wasn't sure how imperative it was to put the string through the other hole in the baseplate.

I'll go with option #1 and just use a ruler and pencil to mark where I should drill a little pilot hole for the 2nd screw.

Thanks guys!


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## Wolfos (Jun 1, 2018)

Jeez, ordering things online is brutal I've been waiting for conductive paint and a little piece of copper tape for weeks.

Things are at a standstill until at least the paint shows up ughh. I tried looking in Canada but found nothing.


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## Wolfos (Jun 20, 2018)

Ok so 20 days later the parts have all arrived and I hurriedly put it all together. The wiring hasn't finished so I cant a test to how the pickups sound yet but I feel like the guitar transformation was pretty good. Literally everything has been changed out, pretty satisfied with the result.


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## Lorcan Ward (Jun 20, 2018)

That looks so much better now!


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## Wolfos (Jun 20, 2018)

Lorcan Ward said:


> That looks so much better now!


Thanks, I forgot to mention all the upgrades to it.

-Hipshot open gear locking tuners
-Hipshot o ring knobs
-Hipshot solo bridge saddles 
-500k CTS pots
-Switchcraft barrel jack
-Grounded all cavities with either graphite paint or copper tape
-pickups rebuilt by Elysian pickups to match their Trident II set.

It's all went pretty well except the bridge pieces are a fair bit thinner than the Ibanez ones so I had to basically max out the screws to get a good height.


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