# Noiseless Single Coils - Dimarzio Area or Fender N3?



## guitarfishbay (Nov 22, 2012)

Hi guys,

I'm considering switching to noiseless single coils and I'm looking for current experiences with Fender N3 pickups and Dimarzio Area pickups. Tonewise, I've posted some youtube urls below but if I was to name bands it would be Tides of Man, Circa Survive, Dredg - that kind of tone.

To confirm, I am looking at changing pickups on both a Strat and a Telecaster, so would welcome any comments relating to either set with either guitar.

Gear: 

Fender US Strat 2006, Alder body/Rosewood board, stock electronics, callaham trem block + saddles
Fender MIM telecaster 2010, Alder body/Maple board, stock electronics and hardware.

While I am well aware noiseless single coils won't sound the same as standard single coils, I am still interested in switching if the overall feel can be kept.

I am only interested in pickups which sound like low output single coils, I am not interested at all in anything 'hot', be it voiced like a single coil or voiced like a humbucker.

Low output, fairly low bass, with cutting highs. Just a typical thin Fender sound that would be identifiable in a mix. The main goal is to get something which sounds ballpark like a classic strat or tele, but without the hum in the single positions, because I'm going to be using them mostly with a fair bit of gain. The in between sounds are still important to me though, the tele would still need to recognisably jangle and the strat quack.

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I'll post some reference tones for what I'm going for:

Thin bridge single coil gain, guitars start at @22 seconds



In between sounds



Some general Tele sounds I like:



I have the right amps to get ballpark of these tones. I'm pretty sure those guys above are using AC30s (I own one) and Marshall JCM 900s or 800s (I have a Blackstar S104EL34 that can get ballpark to those tones).

I already have a noisegate but of course it cannot deal with noise when I am playing. I am certain I want to try noiseless pickups this time.

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Basically my Strat already sounds right but the hum can sometimes be ridiculous in my home studio. The MIM tele is a bit too hot currently, but I've lowered the bass side of the bridge pickup considerably and that has replaced some snarl and bite, but I still find it way too hot. Tele pickups are likely to be changed first.

I used to have a Baja with the Fender Broadcaster bridge which got in to the right ballpark. It sounded fantastic for really high gain, but was a total pain with the noise. Here is a reference for high gain with that guitar, but still (IMO) clearly sounds like a Tele, - riff starts at 17 seconds bajatelecasterrocktrack by maxmoujaes on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

An example of the strat high gain (lead) tone I go for : Strat Solo by maxmoujaes on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free

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So in summary, has anyone been satisfied with either Fender N3 or Dimarzio Area pickups in Strats or Teles when trying to keep recognisible thin, bass light and bright, traditional sounds but using higher gain?

If you weren't satisfied, why, and what did you change to?

Thanks!


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## Swyse (Nov 22, 2012)

I haven't personally tried any noiseless singles for a good period of time, so I can't help there. All I can do is suggest you try to find a guitar store near by carrying the fenders with noiseless pups. The american deluxe series from fender has the N3 pickups, the Eric Clapton signature has the Vintage Noiseless set. The only guitar I know with a Dimarzio Area pickup is the Ibanez Fireman, but its only the middle pickup and the whole guitar is nothing like a fender.


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## guitarfishbay (Nov 22, 2012)

Swyse said:


> I haven't personally tried any noiseless singles for a good period of time, so I can't help there. All I can do is suggest you try to find a guitar store near by carrying the fenders with noiseless pups. The american deluxe series from fender has the N3 pickups, the Eric Clapton signature has the Vintage Noiseless set. The only guitar I know with a Dimarzio Area pickup is the Ibanez Fireman, but its only the middle pickup and the whole guitar is nothing like a fender.



Thanks for your reply.

I'm aware of the Fender Deluxes and N3s. The N3s are also considerably cheaper than the Dimarzios. I think I would be happy with them but don't want to miss out on the Areas if they are worth the upcharge.

I didn't realise there was an area pickup in the fireman, I thought it was all injectors. I definitely know I don't want anything like injectors as they seem to have too much bass on paper. Unfortunately I'm most interested in the bridge and neck tones, but thanks very much for taking the time to reply.


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## RustInPeace (Nov 22, 2012)

Have you considered EMG SA's? David Gilmore uses them in conjunction with an active onboard EQ...I have a set in a heavily modded Ibanez rg350dx, minus the eq, and they sound pretty good to me. Not as "quacky" as I would like, but very sparkly and handles medium to high gain VERY well. I got a SRV "Little Wing" tone on them before through my Mark V.... I think I have an iphone video of it somewhere


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## tedtan (Nov 22, 2012)

This isn't specifically what you are asking about, but I keep hearing rave reviews of the Suhr Silent Single Coil System. It is just a backplate to replace the trem cavity cover, and cancells the noise. I don't know if you can get it separate from the Suhr guitars, but the Lindy Fralin Back Plate Noise Canceling System is the same thing. It's not super cheap, but it lets you use any pickups that you like the sound of without the noise.


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## guitarfishbay (Nov 22, 2012)

I have considered the EMGs. I'm concerned that they are described as higher output with higher midrange. I've generally found I like single coils to be quite thin and low output, mine are set quite low. I really like my single coil guitars to sound as different to my humbucker guitars as possible.

I'm leaning towards the Fender N3s due to price and liking the clips I've heard.

For the Tele I'm likely to put in N3s as it is only a MIM, and the cheaper pickups would be a more sensible investment so long as they are in the right ballpark.

With the US Strat I would be willing to pay the extra for the Dimarzios if it is worth paying the difference.


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## guitarfishbay (Nov 22, 2012)

tedtan said:


> This isn't specifically what you are asking about, but I keep hearing rave reviews of the Suhr Silent Single Coil System. It is just a backplate to replace the trem cavity cover, and cancells the noise. I don't know if you can get it separate from the Suhr guitars, but the Lindy Fralin Back Plate Noise Canceling System is the same thing. It's not super cheap, but it lets you use any pickups that you like the sound of without the noise.



This looks interesting.

I read the manual and found this:

"2. All pickups need to be wound in the same direction and the same magnetic polarity (if there is a RWRP pickup this 
pickup needs to be replaced with a regular one) "

On my Strat I have a RWRP middle pickup, so would have to replace that too. I'll have to do some more research on this route for the Strat.

The pickups on the Tele definitely want changing though, they are too hot currently.


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## tedtan (Nov 22, 2012)

We normally assume the EMGs are metal pickups, but David Gilmour's Strat tones and Vince Gill's Tele tones are pretty good with EMGs, so they can do more than metal. You are right that they have more mids, though; you would need to add the tone controll that allows you to cut the mids to get close to the tones you are seeking.

Having said that, I have experimented with the EMG single coils and gone back to passive pickups. They are a bit more versatile and have more "character" than the active pickups. I like both, but the passives work better for me, especially with single coils. As always, YMMV here.


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## Phlegethon (Nov 22, 2012)

if you're going to go the passive route then the dimarzio areas are the most "strat" sounding noiseless pickups going. here's the best demo I've heard of them, they're in an AM STD strat and in all honesty the areas are superior to traditional single coils in every way. I don't really hear anything but a traditional strat voice from the areas, although they are hum cancelling. 

emg's are significantly hotter than passives, but are also capable of doing strat things as well. as much as I'm a supporter of emg's ... I do believe their singles aren't as good as their humbuckers; and you would still have to contend with the fact that emg single coils are pushing a lot more signal than a passive. this would make doing anything clean harder than using a passive. 

I can't comment too much on the N3's haven't heard enough of them to give an impression, so if someone else has already I'd take what they said into account


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## Mordacain (Nov 22, 2012)

Dimarzio Areas all the way. In my experience, I've just never cared for any of the Fender Noiseless line and I've tried the Vintage, Hot, SCN and N3.

However, the Areas I absolutely LOVE! I use an Area 58 in the neck, Area 67 in the middle (most awesome mid pickup ever) and either a Heavy Blues or HB 2 in the bridge (though I am contemplating swapping in something hotter there). The 58 is nice, fat & crisp while the 67 is cutting and chimey. The only Area I don't particularly care for is the 61, which just sounds a touch too thin for my taste.


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## guitarfishbay (Nov 23, 2012)

Thank you very much for your replies guys.

I have purchased the following:

Tele: Dimarzio Area T and Area T neck - I found some excellent sound clips and thought the regular bridge area T sounded better than all the demos I found of the N3. The N3 lacked bite compared to the area T. Not scientific I know, but it seemed to be a running theme for me.

Strat: Area 61 Bridge, Area 67 Middle, Area 67 Neck. So the 67 neck seems to sound extremely similar to my current stock single coils. I really wanted to keep bright and chiming neck and middle pickups so I think the 67s are a better choice for me than the 58s. 

The 61 bridge seems a good choice for me, I almost went all 67s but was concerned the bridge might be too bright. I don't mind a slightly thin sound so I think the 61 will work great. I couldn't find any impressions from people who had tried anything other than the area 61 in the bridge, and since I've liked the demos I've heard I figured best to play it safe.

What is interesting is that I posted this exact same question to two other boards, and yet it was only the S7 crowd who replied at all! I would have thought I'd get less replies here with this being a majority metal board, but in fact the opposite was true. Thanks very much for the discussion guys. I will post my impressions when they are installed!


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## Sang-Drax (Nov 23, 2012)

I know nothing about pickups but I'd like to say I quite liked the Dredg song.


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## tedtan (Nov 23, 2012)

Glad you got it sorted, guitarfishbay - I think you will be happy with your choice.


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## wakjob (Nov 23, 2012)

Area 61' thinner sounding than the 58'? 

My experience has been the other way around in the neck position at least. Both great pickups though.


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## guitarfishbay (Dec 3, 2012)

Ok they're in, here are my impressions.

MIM Standard Telecaster - Dimarzio Area T bridge / Area T neck.

I just went for the standard setup here, there are hotter bridge pickup options but I decided against them, and I'm pretty glad I did. The regular area T bridge is more than hot enough for me and it balances very well with the neck pickup. Tone wise I am very happy with the set. The bridge snarls and the middle position chimes and the neck is fairly rounded. It sounds just like a good Tele without the hum. It didn't take me long to get the pickup heights sorted and I am very happy with the sound. A definite improvement in tone over stock MIM pickups. The areas sound much more 'classic' despite not being true single coils.

Noise wise the neck pickup is pretty much as quiet as a humbucker, and the bridge is noisier but much less noisy than a regular single coil. This is to be expected due to the bridge plate design of a telecaster and was confirmed to me by Dimarzio (and many forum posts) as 100% normal. If you wish to read the Dimarzio quote I have included it below.



Dimarzio Tech said:


> The Area T bridge pickup will be noisier than the neck pickup if the Tele bridgeplate is made of ferrous (magnetic) steel, which many of them are. The situation is created by the internal construction of the pickup. Humbucking pickups use two identical coils to eliminate hum. The Area T is not a humbucking pickup. It is a hum-cancelling pickup, and the two coils are not identical. They depend on a precise balance to cancel hum, and a magnetic bridge upsets this balance. We have been aware of this from the design stage and tried many approaches to change it, but our final decision was to release the pickup, because we feel the sound quality should not be compromised, even though it may not offer complete hum elimination. A brass or stainless steel bridge plate will lower the hum to the same level as the neck pickup. Brass tele bridges are fairly common and inexpensive. Stainless steel bridges are more expensive and only made by a few companies.



US Standard Strat (06) - Area 61 Bridge / Area 67 middle / Area 67 neck

I decided to avoid the area 58 and I think I'm glad I did. The area 67s are supposed to be brighter than the 58s, but the area 67s are noticeably duller on top than the standard strat pickups were. This isn't a major problem as the general character is there and it does sound good, it just sparkles a little less. What I'm finding with the 67s is that the sound of the neck or middle pickups is great in isolation, but neck and middle together isn't as 'stratty' as it was before. It still sounds like a strat, but if the in between sounds are your favourites there is no advantage to the areas as a RWRP middle makes pos 2 and 4 quiet on a regular strat anyway.

The bridge 61 is pretty bright and thin, but bright in a 'zingy'and sharp kind of way if it is adjusted near the strings. I lowered the treble side to the point it sounded best and then used that as the 'template' for the output of the rest of the set. Of the three, the 61 is the most removed tonally from classic strat single coils IMO. It still sounds like a strat, but the 67s are more convincing IMO. I'm unsure if a full 67 set would be good idea, however I do think position two (bridge 61 and middle 67) is quite convincing. Hum wise, they're really quiet.

Despite the 'string pull' advantages to the Area series I have the pickups set fairly low, actually about the same height as I had the originals at. I think they sound best here personally.

So, was it worth it?

With the Tele 100% yes. The guitar sounds better and is much quieter. I'd recommend the area T set to anyone wanting less hum but a classic Tele sound.

With the Strat - not sure yet. The tones I like are pos 5, 3, and 2. Pos 4 and 1 were nicer with the stock pickups IMO. The pickups are extremely height sensitive. So far the sticking point is the treble side of the bridge pickup, as it is pretty much dictating roughly the heights of the neck and middle pickups. 

I did manage to get pos 4 sounding nicer but it involved raising the area 67s to the point where the bridge pickup was either too quiet when left at its best sounding position, or if I raised it up to match volume it was too bright. I'm going to keep an eye out on ebay for used strat noiseless bridge pickups just in case I can't get on with this area 61.

Sorry for lack of clips, I didn't have time and also it is hard to do pickup swap tests scientifically anyway due to the variable nature of pickup height, output and tone. When I have time I will post up clips of the tones I am getting with the Areas.


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## tedtan (Dec 3, 2012)

Glad to hear you're liking the Tele pickups.

On the Strat, Dimarzio will switch out the pickups wihtin the first 30 days if you are unsatisfied and want to try another model (at least they do this in the US). Also, are you counting position 1 as the bridge (like Fender) or the neck (like I've seen on a lot of other manufacturers at different times)?


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## guitarfishbay (Dec 4, 2012)

tedtan said:


> Glad to hear you're liking the Tele pickups.
> 
> On the Strat, Dimarzio will switch out the pickups wihtin the first 30 days if you are unsatisfied and want to try another model (at least they do this in the US). Also, are you counting position 1 as the bridge (like Fender) or the neck (like I've seen on a lot of other manufacturers at different times)?



I'm counting position 1 as the bridge.

I think I've got it sorted now. I played with the heights more last night and I've got it so that when I leave the bridge/middle tone pot rolled off slightly the whole guitar sounds pretty good. I still think I might swap the middle pickup on to the neck tone control at a later date but for now I'm happy.

What I'm finding is the area 61 bridge definitely needs a tone pot to tame the highs IMO. The area 67 middle and neck sound pretty good through stock 250k pots left wide open. My strat is currently wired with volume, neck tone, and bridge/middle tone. The neck tone has a push/push pot which activates the neck pickup in pos 1 for pseudo Tele tones, and pos 2 for all 3 pickups on tones.

Area T pickups are definitely great! I think they sound even better than the broadcaster/twisted tele set I had in a previous Baja tele, plus less hum!


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## tedtan (Dec 4, 2012)

Glad to hear you got it sorted, guitarfishbay.


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## Mordacain (Dec 4, 2012)

guitarfishbay said:


> Ok they're in, here are my impressions.
> 
> MIM Standard Telecaster - Dimarzio Area T bridge / Area T neck.
> 
> ...



Yea, your findings replicate mine on many points. The 61 was not unpleasantly thin, but thinner than I wanted out of a bridge pickup. Oddly enough, despite being fatter, the 58 has a bit more sparkle on top in the neck and balances with the 67 when used together. The 67 I was not terrifically fond of in the neck position since it seemed a touch too trebly there while in the middle it was perfect.


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