# Is this a good idea?



## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

So I was at the local music store trying out their 7-strings (they actually had 3 7-strings  ) when I walked past the PA section.

I'm in the market for a new amp cause my Spider II just isn't cutting it in terms of tone. Now, I have a PodXTLive that I absolutely love, and I'm interested in amplifying that. Atomic amps sound nice, but aren't as powerful as I'd like them (at least not yet).

So, I couldn't help but notice that PA speakers are fairly cheap compared to amps. I can get two nice, big, decent-quality PA speakers for a fairly good price (and I'm trying to learn vocals, so a PA would help there, too.)

I'm just curious, the PodXT has a special setting for PA, and it's supposed to sound really nice through a PA. Is a PA a viable alternative to buying a guitar amp? Is it a good idea, if I plan on using my PodXT, to just buy a really nice PA to amplify it for concerts?


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## nyck (Oct 14, 2006)

Yeah, a PA would be a good option for a podxt, but it won't feel like a tube amp(duh)

I run my Podxt with a Rocktron Velocity 120 poweramp and an Avatar 4x12. It works really well and the rocktron is pretty transparent. I don't get the feel of a tube amp though, so I think I'm gonna get a tube head or something like that soon.

What do you mean by amplify guitar for concerts? If you're in a band, any reputable venue should have a PA that you could plug directly into with the Pod. My poweramp and cab cost me around 500 total.


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## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

nyck said:


> Yeah, a PA would be a good option for a podxt, but it won't feel like a tube amp(duh)
> 
> I run my Podxt with a Rocktron Velocity 120 poweramp and an Avatar 4x12. It works really well and the rocktron is pretty transparent. I don't get the feel of a tube amp though, so I think I'm gonna get a tube head or something like that soon.
> 
> What do you mean by amplify guitar for concerts? If you're in a band, any reputable venue should have a PA that you could plug directly into with the Pod. My poweramp and cab cost me around 500 total.



The feel of tube amps doesn't concern me too much right now--I love my tone plugged-in directly into my computer, and if I can amplify that signal accurately for live shows, then that'd be perfect  

For concerts, I mean live playing in general. We're not doing concerts yet, but we are getting there (we actually got offered a gig the other day, but I had to turn it down cause bassist broke his wrist  ) Anyhow, not all places have PA, and for places that do have PAs, I can have that extra Ooompf.

Just curious, how powerful is your poweramp and cab?


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## Popsyche (Oct 14, 2006)

Nik said:


> So I was at the local music store trying out their 7-strings (they actually had 3 7-strings  ) when I walked past the PA section.
> 
> I'm in the market for a new amp cause my Spider II just isn't cutting it in terms of tone. Now, I have a PodXTLive that I absolutely love, and I'm interested in amplifying that. Atomic amps sound nice, but aren't as powerful as I'd like them (at least not yet).
> 
> ...



You will be missing the tactile response of a tube amp on full throttle, as it interacts with the the guitar and pickups. This is the phenomenon known as touch. You can generate a cool but unvarying tone from your modelers, but tube tone touch is a tool that has only one source. [/rant]


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## nyck (Oct 14, 2006)

Nik said:


> The feel of tube amps doesn't concern me too much right now--I love my tone plugged-in directly into my computer, and if I can amplify that signal accurately for live shows, then that'd be perfect
> 
> For concerts, I mean live playing in general. We're not doing concerts yet, but we are getting there (we actually got offered a gig the other day, but I had to turn it down cause bassist broke his wrist  ) Anyhow, not all places have PA, and for places that do have PAs, I can have that extra Ooompf.
> 
> Just curious, how powerful is your poweramp and cab?


How powerful is my rig? It's super loud dude. I could take on any venue with my rig, although I'm not in a band at the moment. At high volumes, nothing clips harshly, or starts getting muddy or annoying. It's just really punchy and clear. The thing I miss is the tube touch, like Popsyche said.
As long as you have some efficient speakers(I got 2 Vin30s and 2 G12H30s) in a good cab with atleast a 100 watt SS poweramp, then you're good to go.


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## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

Thanks fellas!

Are the Flextone's tube powered?

There are a lot of Line 6 modellers out there. I suppose I've never experienced 'touch' since I've been cranking my Spider II modeling amp. Would a PA work like my Spider II in terms of tone amplification (except, more accurately)?


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## nyck (Oct 14, 2006)

Line 6 doesn't have/or haven't ever made a tube amp. 
The PA is going to take your Podxt tone you hear in your headphones and amplify it pretty much very similarly.


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## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

nyck said:


> Line 6 doesn't have/or haven't ever made a tube amp.
> The PA is going to take your Podxt tone you hear in your headphones and amplify it pretty much very similarly.



So is there any difference between buying a big Vetta amp, or buying a nice, powerful PA and using that to amplify your Pod?


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## Popsyche (Oct 14, 2006)

I tried out one of those Spider II amps, and it does have some touch to it's modeling. A PA system will sound like playing through your stereo, usually not good!


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## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

Popsyche said:


> I tried out one of those Spider II amps, and it does have some touch to it's modeling. A PA system will sound like playing through your stereo, usually not good!



Yeah, but doesn't the PodXT also apply some touch to it's modelling? I would assume that if the Spider does it, so would the much superior PodXT.

Thanks for your help guys!


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## nyck (Oct 14, 2006)

Nik said:


> So is there any difference between buying a big Vetta amp, or buying a nice, powerful PA and using that to amplify your Pod?


I've never tried a vetta so I can't really comment. Donnie's had both a pod and vetta so he can chime in hopefully. 

The pod still feels like a solid state amp. No real touch feeling behind it. It's very very slight if there is any.


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## Popsyche (Oct 14, 2006)

Nik said:


> Yeah, but doesn't the PodXT also apply some touch to it's modelling? I would assume that if the Spider does it, so would the much superior PodXT.
> 
> Thanks for your help guys!



I'll bet that the POD also has some cabinet modeling in there somewhere. That might be worth experimenting with through the PA cabinets you have in mind.


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## nyck (Oct 14, 2006)

Popsyche said:


> I'll bet that the POD also has some cabinet modeling in there somewhere. That might be worth experimenting with through the PA cabinets you have in mind.


The podxt does have cabinet models in there. It's got just about every type of cab.


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## distressed_romeo (Oct 14, 2006)

I once saw someone using the setup you described, and while you could probably get by with it, I wouldn't recommend it. It makes the tone sound more digitised and less like a real amp. Given that some people think PODs sound too artificial on their own, it's not an ideal combination.


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## Nik (Oct 14, 2006)

Alright, thanks a lot fellas! I guess I'll be looking into Atomic Amps. Is it possible to amplify both vocals and guitars (PodXT) with a single amp?


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## XEN (Oct 15, 2006)

I'm most likely buying a PA to run my POD man, and I _have_ the Atomic Reactor 112. The POD will sound "digitized" if it is not set correctly through no matter what amp you use, even the Atomic. Plugging a POD into a PA does not negate the true tube feel; the true tube feel is not in the POD, or any Line 6 product, in the first place. What you have is a model of tube tone that tries its best to give you the SOUND of a mic'ed tube amp. The only way to get tube feel is with a tube amp. There's also no rule that says you can't run PA cabs with a tube power amp...!

I'm going to be playing a 10 string "guitar" tuned down to E1 so I need something that will push out the low end without sacrificing the highs. The Atomic can handle the frequencies, but not the levels I require.


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## Nik (Oct 15, 2006)

^Cool man, thanks for the info  

Just curious, though, since Atomic Amps are tube powered, doesn't that give you some tube characteristics? I mean, there's no point in going with tubes otherwise...

In any case, I'd love to go to the store and crank things up, but there's no guarantee that they'd let me...


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## XEN (Oct 16, 2006)

Well, they do advertise the amp as "colorless". Sure, there's a hint of added warmth and responsiveness, but that's all, just a hint. True tube feel comes from the combination of a tube preamp and a tube power amp. The reason why tube amps like Mesa and the like sound and feel so good is because there is a gain stage in the power section, not just the preamp. It's literally power amp overdrive. That's why you have to crank them to find their sweet spot.  Then you have to use an attenuator to play the thing with the same tone at bedroom levels. I am a tube purist, but the power section of the Atomic operates more like a classic hi-fi amp. Yes, it is a tube power amp, but it offers nothing more than clean power which you could get from any other type of amp. 

Also, I think it was completely asinine of them to design a 212 50 watt version and make it MONO! How fucking stupid is that??? All of the modelers are stereo. How much effort would it have taken to put 2 of the 18 watt power sections in that 212 and call it a day? DAMN! They lost my business for good with that stupid move, so if you really want an Atomic, mine will be available very soon.


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## Nik (Oct 16, 2006)

Hmm, well it's something I'll look into.

In any case, the next I buy will probably be a 100W half-stack, so unless Atomic Amps release a 100W cab designed for Pods, I probably won't buy from them. Oh, and it better be stereo lol.


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## InTheRavensName (Oct 16, 2006)

...Sabaton use a PODxt and a Vox Tonelab SE into the PA, and they sounded great!

...and Meshuggah go straight to the PA too


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## Nik (Oct 16, 2006)

InTheRavensName said:


> ...Sabaton use a PODxt and a Vox Tonelab SE into the PA, and they sounded great!
> 
> ...and Meshuggah go straight to the PA too



Don't Meshuggah use Vetta IIs? In any case, I would imagine that a Vetta and a PodXT straight into the PA would be almost the same thing... ?


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