# Why do people hate on Wes Borland?



## Matti_Ice (Feb 25, 2011)

I was a youngin' back when the furry of Limp Bizkit hit the music scene, and I admit I wore a red Yankees hat, white t-shirt and jeans for most of my middle school life, hell the band was even 50% of the reason I begged my mom for a 7 string for my first guitar (Korn being the other 50%). I forgot about Limp for a while but the other day I was listening through their albums and WOW! Now that I have progressed as a guitarist I really appreciate Wes Borland's playing! Hes got some killer riffs that range from heavy to just beautiful. Great use of effects, interesting chord progressions, etc. one of the first mainstream guitarists to tune as low as F#...sure hes not a shred master and Fred Durst is a douche AND LB is just "frat boy rock", but the newer stuff from Unquestionable Truth and Gold Cobra I think show promise. Why do so many people hate on Wes?!


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## gunshow86de (Feb 25, 2011)

Two words; Fred Durst. His personality _is_ Limp Bizkit. I don't hate Wes, but I can't listen to Limp Bizkit anymore because it's so juvenile (musically and lyrically).


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## Matti_Ice (Feb 25, 2011)

gunshow86de said:


> Two words; Fred Durst. His personality _is_ Limp Bizkit. I don't hate Wes, but I can't listen to Limp Bizkit anymore because it's so juvenile (musically and lyrically).


 
Very true, thats why I said Unquestionable Truth and Gold Cobra were showing promise, it seems like maybe Fred has grown up a little, changed subject matter. He really needs to take a LOOOOOONG look in the mirror


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## Double A (Feb 25, 2011)

Play Nu metal they said...


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## synrgy (Feb 25, 2011)

Might have had something to do with quitting LB citing 'artistic integrity', then rejoining the band a few years later when he needed the paycheck?

IMHO = I have nothing against him as a player. I'm actually quite fond of the majority of his work.


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## DVRP (Feb 25, 2011)

Wes has always been in my eyes; a great guitarist. The clean stuff he writes for LB is actually sweet imo. He writes some catchy stuff, for me at least.


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## adrock (Feb 25, 2011)

i love wes borland. always have, always will.


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## BucketheadRules (Feb 25, 2011)

I think if they lost the DJ bloke and the useless chump in the red cap, they could have had a half-decent band on their hands with Limp Bizkit. It'd still have a fucking stupid name though...

Wes is a great guitarist.


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## Randy (Feb 25, 2011)




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## Matti_Ice (Feb 25, 2011)

This is what I love about sevenstring.org, the people. Even when people have the chance to go on hateful rants, its nothing but honest positive criticism. One of the most mature forums ever lol


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## Randy (Feb 25, 2011)

Well, you're just in time for an Emmure hate thread and some poop jokes. Also, women have kooties and big stinky ugly faces.


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## zero_end (Feb 25, 2011)

I actually like some of his creations, especially with his Black Light Burns albums, but the whole "artistic integrity" situation of him (and actually claiming that on interviews and thrash talking about his past) then going back to LB and being good 'ole Wes again (and again telling on an interview that the "cool crowd" -meaning he didn't made the big bucks he used to with LB-, the few fans that bought into the "artistic integrity" thing, weren't that "cool", B$!)

So that makes him rather inconsitent and quite hypocritical imo and a bit of a douchebag too.

Still like Black Light Burns tho...


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## SenorDingDong (Feb 25, 2011)

He actually writes some tasteful stuff, I just hate Fred Durst, he's a bigger dickbag than Dave Mustaine, and thats a hard feat to accomplish.


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## Nimgoble (Feb 25, 2011)

...People hate on Wes Borland?


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## Joose (Feb 25, 2011)

Wes Borland is the shit. Him and Sam Rivers are 2 of the coolest people I've ever had the pleasure of hanging out with on multiple occasions.


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## djpharoah (Feb 25, 2011)

People hating on WB??


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## xMaNgOxKusHx (Feb 25, 2011)

Randy said:


> Well, you're just in time for an Emmure hate thread and some poop jokes. Also, women have kooties and big stinky ugly faces.


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## Overtone (Feb 25, 2011)

I never bothered listening to LB but I remember thinking those contacts were annoying looking quite a few times. Back then I assumed that by default dreads, baggy clothes, and extreme stuff like white makeup and lipstick meant douchey music and long hair and tight jeans meant glory.


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## somniumaeternum (Feb 25, 2011)

Overtone said:


> I never bothered listening to LB but I remember thinking those contacts were annoying looking quite a few times. Back then I assumed that by default dreads, baggy clothes, and extreme stuff like white makeup and lipstick meant douchey music...


 
Pretty much what I got out of it. Never really liked the style and never really liked his playing. Can't say he's a bad player (in fact, I haven't heard enough to really formulate an informed opinion) just never was into it so never really bothered...


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## Matti_Ice (Feb 25, 2011)

Nimgoble said:


> ...People hate on Wes Borland?


 Apparently you don't watch his vids on youtube and follow discussions on other sites lol They do my friend, they do


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## Demiurge (Feb 25, 2011)

I dunno... as long as I can remember there has always been a decent portion of the population talking themselves into liking Wes Borland despite how much they dislike Limp Bizkit. 

To be honest, I can't really think of any other guitarist out there with popularity despite their association with a controversial band. In most other cases, if a band blows, every member is considered to be a bum. I think it's fair to judge a musician by the projects they choose to be a part of, but hell, I'm sure there are plenty of people who ended up with gigs that were beneath them that they made the best of.


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## mattofvengeance (Feb 25, 2011)

Demiurge said:


> I dunno... as long as I can remember there has always been a decent portion of the population talking themselves into liking Wes Borland despite how much they dislike Limp Bizkit.
> 
> To be honest, I can't really think of any other guitarist out there with popularity despite their association with a controversial band. In most other cases, if a band blows, every member is considered to be a bum. *I think it's fair to judge a musician by the projects they choose to be a part of, but hell, I'm sure there are plenty of people who ended up with gigs that were beneath them that they made the best of*.



John 5. I had no idea what that dude was capable of based solely off the crap he did with Manson.


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## Steve08 (Feb 25, 2011)

I've always maintained that LB minus Fred Durst are highly competent musicians.

The drummer is rather bomb as well:


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## vampiregenocide (Feb 25, 2011)

Wes Borland is a brilliant guitarist, a talented vocalist and a ridiculous painter. He had a choice between joining Limp Bizkit or Marylin Manson's band. Whatever his reasons he worked for years to get there and has earned himself the right to make that choice.


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## Rick (Feb 25, 2011)

Randy said:


> Well, you're just in time for an Emmure hate thread and some poop jokes. Also, women have kooties and big stinky ugly faces.



Sweet. 

I've always loved Wes Borland. The "artistic integrity" and then lack of moolah was a bit of a headscratcher but, whatever.


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## matt397 (Feb 25, 2011)

I love the shit out of wes borland. I remember thinking when I heard counterfeit for the first time that it was like the heaviest thing I'd ever heard  3 dollar bill y'all was such a good album an Significant Other is pretty solid as well. Im definately a fan of his solo stuff as well and as was already mentioned he is a phenominal painter.

Although I can understand how some people might not "get" this:


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## PyramidSmasher (Feb 25, 2011)

The bassist from From First To Last?


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## adrock (Feb 25, 2011)

PyramidSmasher said:


> The bassist from From First To Last?


hahaha, at one point he was. and it was from first to last's best album imo, some solid riffage on there.


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## highlordmugfug (Feb 25, 2011)

matt397 said:


> Although I can understand how simple might not "get" this:



Duke Lion Fights the Terror is an absolutely awesome disc.

I like Wes because, for the most part, his playing is really interesting. And I can say with 99.99% confidence that anyone who hates on him does so almost solely because of Limp Bizkit (aka Fred Durst).


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## mountainjam (Feb 25, 2011)

Just watched my first wes youtube vid...the riff he plays in the piezo demo is a 99% rip off from satch's mountain song.


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## BrainArt (Feb 25, 2011)

mattofvengeance said:


> John 5. I had no idea what that dude was capable of based solely off the crap he did with Manson.



Idk, I love John 5s work with Manson. Then again, Manson is one of my favorites. And I love John 5s work in general.



vampiregenocide said:


> Wes Borland is a brilliant guitarist, a talented vocalist and a ridiculous painter. He had a choice between joining Limp Bizkit or Marylin Manson's band. Whatever his reasons he worked for years to get there and has earned himself the right to make that choice.


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## signalgrey (Feb 25, 2011)

Im not an LB fan....at ALLL.
BUT!






also...i win


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## -42- (Feb 25, 2011)

Please don't neg rep me.


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## TXDeathMetal (Feb 26, 2011)

Randy said:


> Well, you're just in time for an Emmure hate thread and some poop jokes. Also, women have kooties and big stinky ugly faces.



Randy is allowed to say this because he is a member of the He-Man Woman Hater's Club.


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## gunshow86de (Feb 26, 2011)

I have to admit something; this thread inspired me to pull out my old Limp Bizkit and Korn albums from my foot locker.

Nostalgia, nostalgia everywhere. Ahhh, middle school. Life was so simple back then.


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## Variant (Feb 26, 2011)

I agree with this thread, I've seen very little hate for Wes Borland, dude is cool. Limp Bizkit, on the other hand, is anything but cool.


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## Scar Symmetry (Feb 26, 2011)

gunshow86de said:


> Two words; Fred Durst. His personality _is_ Limp Bizkit. I don't hate Wes, but I can't listen to Limp Bizkit anymore because it's so juvenile (musically and lyrically).



This.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Feb 26, 2011)

Ryan's right, next to no hate for Wes but so much for Fred Durst


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## Triple-J (Feb 26, 2011)

Wes took the groove of Helmet and mixed it in with the clean sounds of the Cure and Portishead he was and still is one of the few original guitarists of the Nu-Metal/late 90's era that had a style of his own and he doesn't mouth off about how original or great he is either so I can't see why anyone would want to hate him.

As for him coming back to LB for the money I was cynical about it too but having watched the Black Light Burns "Anvil Pants" dvd it turns out that he was paying for most of BLB's touring plus during their 1st tour he hired a promoter for the band who ripped them off and did absolutely nothing so they really got stung financially so if it is for the money I don't blame him.


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## CrownofWorms (Feb 26, 2011)

Don't have a problem with wes borland. But LB just aint my taste and Fred Durst is a douche


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## adrock (Feb 26, 2011)

signalgrey said:


> Im not an LB fan....at ALLL.
> BUT!
> 
> 
> ...


h88888


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## ZackP3750 (Feb 26, 2011)

I like Wes' clean tone and some of the riffs he comes up with. He can write some decent stuff, but I was really surprised to hear he produced "Weak and Powerless" on A Perfect Circle's aMotion remix album. I still prefer Borland's version over the actual album cut.


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## Nimgoble (Feb 26, 2011)

I rather enjoy his guitar playing. I don't like Limp Bizkit, but I can understand him going back. We all like to eat and at least he get's to play guitar while earning money.


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## mhickman2 (Feb 26, 2011)

I personally loved limp bizkit while he was with them. Though their lyrics were juvenile like 99% of bands out there, I loved their sound and energy. Pretty good live performances IMO.


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## CooleyJr (Feb 26, 2011)

Most of the Wes Borland hate is "Bandwagon hating". He's a good musician and is richer than 99% of us. Why hate?


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## op1e (Feb 26, 2011)

I love the 1st half of Cruel Melody by BLB. The rest of it all kinda runs together, but I guess thats what spacey and ambient kinda stuff does.


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## leonardo7 (Feb 26, 2011)

Why do people say people hate on Wes Borland when Ive never really heard of people hating on Wes Borland? Hes always been nothing short of amazing! Its cool and fun to discuss Wes Borland but the thread title is retarded IMO.


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## JamesM (Feb 26, 2011)

He has a fantastic sense of melody. Period. People can hate all they want.


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## AlucardXIX (Feb 27, 2011)

Black Light Burns is amazing. Just wondering when they will ever release that second full length they talked about years ago now. 

Wes's playing in LB is definitely fun.

But I think it can be settled on that if Wes, John, and Sam left LB and formed their own metal band, it would be nothing short of awesome.


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## adrock (Feb 27, 2011)

mhickman2 said:


> I personally loved limp bizkit while he was with them. Though their lyrics were juvenile like 99% of bands out there, I loved their sound and energy. Pretty good live performances IMO.


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## Matti_Ice (Feb 27, 2011)

leonardo7 said:


> Why do people say people hate on Wes Borland when Ive never really heard of people hating on Wes Borland? Hes always been nothing short of amazing! Its cool and fun to discuss Wes Borland but the thread title is retarded IMO.


 
I've been watching videos of him (interviews, lessons, live, etc) and 90% of the comments are how horrible his playing is, how sloppy he is, how ANYONE could be a better guitarist than him. I bought some LB stuff on Amazon, for gigs I looked at the reviews BAM! More apparent guitar gods rippin on Borland. Few forums I've brought him into discussions and get laughed at. So in this community no, apparently he gets his deserved respect but other places...not so much


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## BrainArt (Feb 27, 2011)

Matti_Ice said:


> I've been watching videos of him (interviews, lessons, live, etc) and 90% of the comments are how horrible his playing is, how sloppy he is, how ANYONE could be a better guitarist than him. I bought some LB stuff on Amazon, for gigs I looked at the reviews BAM! More apparent guitar gods rippin on Borland. Few forums I've brought him into discussions and get laughed at. So in this community no, apparently he gets his deserved respect but other places...not so much








Plain and simple. Like what you like, and don't care about what other people say about it.


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## slapnutz (Feb 27, 2011)

I agree with the common thought here. People dont really hate WB that much .... its probably that they are already exhausted from hating Fred Durst. He is probably a nice hateshield for Wes.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Feb 27, 2011)

Wes wins in everything he does. 

Plus this.


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## vampiregenocide (Feb 27, 2011)

Matti_Ice said:


> I've been watching videos of him (interviews, lessons, live, etc) and 90% of the comments are how horrible his playing is, how sloppy he is, how ANYONE could be a better guitarist than him. I bought some LB stuff on Amazon, for gigs I looked at the reviews BAM! More apparent guitar gods rippin on Borland. Few forums I've brought him into discussions and get laughed at. So in this community no, apparently he gets his deserved respect but other places...not so much


 
Youtube is also full of morons talking about how Slipknot suck in the comments for every single metal music video. These keyboard warriors are morons and not worth taking note of.


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## Kali Yuga (Feb 27, 2011)

It's dumb fun music. I still like Limp Bizkit, and have since I was 10.


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## GRUNTKOR (Feb 27, 2011)

Wes was the guy who got me into heavy music back in '99. I was fourteen and had never heard stuff like that before. Of course, soon after I discovered real metal bands but Wes was who got my attention initially


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## Bloody_Inferno (Feb 27, 2011)

Also there was a lot of originality in Wes' playing even in the early days. The 7 string with the extra high E was only accidental but he used it well and tastefully during the first 2 LB albums. He also used tapping in a more rhythmic and textural way (which wasn't common back then) like in ReArranged among others. 

And let's not forget the 4 string custom with the low F# for Stalemate and Nookie. 

Wes was also one to always follow his muse and never sit still. He abandoned the 7 and 4 string guitars, leave LB did a ton of random bands like Big Dumb Face, Eat the Day etc. Good on him to do so. The Unquestionable Truth on the other hand...  ... still, whatever. 

Also Big Dumb Face (which is awesome), were apparently covering Holy Wars... The Punishment Due on their live shows. And that to me is a definite plus.


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## Jontain (Feb 28, 2011)

LB fan in my adolescence and always thought Wes was an interesting character and a good guitarist.


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## gunshow86de (Feb 28, 2011)

"Now I know why you wanna hate me, cause hate is all the world has even seen lately!"Fred knew how to shake off the haters.


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## Konfyouzd (Feb 28, 2011)

Two words... Sour grapes


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## Daggorath (Feb 28, 2011)

CooleyJr said:


> Why hate?





CooleyJr said:


> is richer than 99% of us.



Answered your own question really.


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## Metalguy (Feb 28, 2011)

Id say Wes is an average guitarist. I read an article on him saying the reason he dressed in costumes was because he was ashamed of his band. I think he meant Fred. His voice is so lame, and on top of that he raps. John and Sam are both great musicians. If they ditched Durst and Lethal, and hired a decent singer, they would be great.

Wes brought some legitimacy to the band, but not enough to dilute Freds douchebaggery. 

He is like mentioned above an awesome artist..


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## Konfyouzd (Feb 28, 2011)

The man played his role in the band... 

Ppl hate on him bc he doesn't live up to their expectations... But they want to be in his shoes so they don't even live up to their own expectations... I'm sure Borland doesn't give 2 shits...


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