# What is that effect Chuck used on his solos?



## Naren (Jul 31, 2008)

I've actually wondered this for a very long time now, but almost every solo by Chuck Schuldiner of Death has this weird effect on it and I have no idea what it is. An example that comes to mind would be the intro to "Trapped In A Corner" (off "Individual Thought Patterns"), but he literally uses it on every single album, on pretty much every single solo. I don't know how to describe it, but it sounds kinda phased, almost kinda harmonized or "chorus," but... if you're a fan, you should know what I'm talking about.


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## stuh84 (Jul 31, 2008)

I know what you mean, by the sounds of it, I think he will have double tracked the leads, its got that sort of slightly phasey sound when notes aren't played exactly in time with each other. Thats more of a hunch than anything though.


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## ire_works (Jul 31, 2008)

Well , you can definately hear him double his leads on Sound Of Perserverence , but on the parts he did on _Voice Of The Soul_ , he did octaves of the lead lines , so that might be what we're hearing.


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## Xtremevillan (Jul 31, 2008)

IIRC it was "slight reverb"


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## stuh84 (Jul 31, 2008)

Xtremevillan said:


> IIRC it was "slight reverb"



Yeah but thats not whats changing the sound, I'm pretty sure its double tracking all parts that makes them sound quite weird.


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## Naren (Jul 31, 2008)

ire_works said:


> Well , you can definately hear him double his leads on Sound Of Perserverence , but on the parts he did on _Voice Of The Soul_ , he did octaves of the lead lines , so that might be what we're hearing.



No, I'm not talking about an octave difference or even a harmonized lead.

I saw a video of Death playing live and the second guitarist was playing rhythm guitar, he was playing the lead, and the solo was played with the same effect as on the album.

I do know what some people are saying about it sounding like a doubled lead, but it doesn't sound like a normal doubled lead. In fact, it doesn't sound really like a doubled lead at all. It has a little of that kind of a sound to it, but...

I really wonder what it was. There are solos on the Death records that are harmonized, whether by octaves or other intervals, but that's definitely not what I'm talking about.


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## stuh84 (Jul 31, 2008)

Do you have any live examples, as I listened to a studio version of Trapped In A Corner, and that was definitely harmonized


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## Elysian (Jul 31, 2008)

i think chuck liked to use a slow, deep chorus on his leads...


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## Naren (Jul 31, 2008)

stuh84 said:


> Do you have any live examples, as I listened to a studio version of Trapped In A Corner, and that was definitely harmonized



I'd have to go find one, but maybe he was using a pedal that simulated that sound live, because the other guitarist was definitely just playing rhythm guitar. I don't know how else they'd do it.

And, another thing is that generally the other guitarist's solos didn't have this harmonized-sounding effect, but Chuck's almost all did.



Elysian said:


> i think chuck liked to use a slow, deep chorus on his leads...



It does sound a lot like a chorus, but different from any of the chorus pedals I've owned. I use chorus on a lot of my leads, but it sounds nothing like that (I'm sure I set my chorus completely different than he did, though).


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## stuh84 (Jul 31, 2008)

The live version I just watched of that (Trapped In A Corner from Live in LA) both guitarists were playing the lead harmonized, and when the other guitarist was playing only rhythm, it sounded like a standard solo to me. I aint saying yer wrong, as I haven't seen the clip you are referring to, just so far, everything I've seen, I've seen harmonization.


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## Elysian (Jul 31, 2008)

Naren said:


> I'd have to go find one, but maybe he was using a pedal that simulated that sound live, because the other guitarist was definitely just playing rhythm guitar. I don't know how else they'd do it.
> 
> And, another thing is that generally the other guitarist's solos didn't have this harmonized-sounding effect, but Chuck's almost all did.
> 
> ...



to me, it sounds a lot like my old Boss CE-2 chorus, set on full depth and almost minimal speed. and just think, if he's double tracking his leads, each track is gonna have its own chorus, which can really change the sound


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## stuh84 (Jul 31, 2008)

Elysian said:


> to me, it sounds a lot like my old Boss CE-2 chorus, set on full depth and almost minimal speed. and just think, if he's double tracking his leads, each track is gonna have its own chorus, which can really change the sound



Yeah, I'm with you on this, chorus for single lines, harmonized as well. Mental sound, and I bet, get 2 Valvestate 8100s, 2 guitarists, put the chorus on, and harmonize in 4ths, and you'll sound like Death.


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## Elysian (Jul 31, 2008)

the only way i can get close to chucks lead tone on any modeler i've used is saturating it with chorus


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## Stealthdjentstic (Jul 31, 2008)

i always thought he just used harmonization on his solo's


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## canuck brian (Jul 31, 2008)

Chuck had stated in interviews that he was using that Valvestate head with "a touch of chorus."


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## Xtremevillan (Jul 31, 2008)

oh yeah! I forgot if it was chorus or reverb.

it was chorus.


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## Naren (Jul 31, 2008)

Yeah, I think chorus and harmonization are the two main elements.

It just doesn't sound like normal harmonization.



stuh84 said:


> The live version I just watched of that (Trapped In A Corner from Live in LA) both guitarists were playing the lead harmonized, and when the other guitarist was playing only rhythm, it sounded like a standard solo to me. I aint saying yer wrong, as I haven't seen the clip you are referring to, just so far, everything I've seen, I've seen harmonization.



I had never seen a live performance of that song.

I can see them doing that intro harmonized since there was no rhythm guitar, but I find it weird that the solos were normal without that effect.


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## DDDorian (Aug 1, 2008)

Elysian said:


> to me, it sounds a lot like my old Boss CE-2 chorus, set on full depth and almost minimal speed. and just think, if he's double tracking his leads, each track is gonna have its own chorus, which can really change the sound



+1 - he lays the chorus on pretty thick, so stuff like fourth- and fifth-based harmonies sounds almost like a quadruple-tracked harmony. As for the live clip, it could very well be post-production. I haven't seen _Live in LA_ so I don't have a clue though.


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## Naren (Aug 1, 2008)

DDDorian said:


> +1 - he lays the chorus on pretty thick, so stuff like fourth- and fifth-based harmonies sounds almost like a quadruple-tracked harmony. As for the live clip, it could very well be post-production. I haven't seen _Live in LA_ so I don't have a clue though.



Very possible.

And I checked out some more live videos on YouTube and some of the effect I'm talking about was in a lot of the videos, but was there to a much lesser extent than on the albums. I think the sound comes just as much from the chorus as it does from the harmonization.


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## Shawn (Aug 1, 2008)

Individual Thought Patterns is a great album and i've always liked the sound of his leads, also on Human too.


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## eaeolian (Aug 1, 2008)

I believe it's the ValveState chorus, although I think he had an ADA Flanger (that will also do chorus) at one point on the "Human" tour. That was a long time ago, though, so I'm not sure.


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## Naren (Aug 1, 2008)

^From everyone's answers, that seems to be the most accurate answer.


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## neoclassical (Aug 1, 2008)

eaeolian said:


> I believe it's the ValveState chorus, although I think he had an ADA Flanger (that will also do chorus) at one point on the "Human" tour. That was a long time ago, though, so I'm not sure.



IIRC the old valve states did not have chorus (have to ask my old buddy his are from the same era). Chuck used to use an old CE-2 and an MXR phaser from what I've been told by a fairly dependable source. I think there is also a list of his equipment out on the net. I'll look again and post if I find it.

Adam


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## Mattayus (Aug 1, 2008)

could be a touch of delay too? sounds like it to me anyway


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## Nick (Aug 1, 2008)

my guess is its a really tight chorus so that there is no 'dual sound' effect it just sounds like one sound but a bit wierd.

I know exactly what your talking about though Naren, It sounds cool as fuck imo


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## Naren (Aug 1, 2008)

I also think it sounds cool as fuck. And Death is the only band I've ever heard that has that kind of sound, so I was wondering what he was using to get it. To me, it just sounded kinda like chorus and phaser (just a little) and kinda harmonized, but I really couldn't tell.


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## petereanima (Aug 1, 2008)

chuck used the 8100 valvestate, without chorus, and what i've read from many sources he used the boss chorus and a mxr phase, as already mentioned.


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## 7 Dying Trees (Aug 1, 2008)

neoclassical said:


> IIRC the old valve states did not have chorus (have to ask my old buddy his are from the same era). Chuck used to use an old CE-2 and an MXR phaser from what I've been told by a fairly dependable source. I think there is also a list of his equipment out on the net. I'll look again and post if I find it.
> 
> Adam


THe 8200 did, i know, i drooled over that amp for years


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## DeathShred1 (Aug 2, 2008)

All the interviews I have read Chuck said he used the Marshall 8200 head and the full size 4x12 Marshall cabs. I know on the Human cd he said in a interview he used randall amps for the recording. Live Chuck had the sound guy do his effects for him.


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## Ancestor (Aug 6, 2008)

From the actual source, Jim Morris at Morrisound Studios:



> Robert ---
> 
> Nice to hear from you!!!
> 
> ...


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## Lozek (Aug 6, 2008)

I got this one. A friend of mine techs for Cynic and their Road Manager is the same guy that Road Managed Death. There was a very secret weapon that comprised a lot of Chucks tone and the chorus effect you're talking about. Drum roll..........it was a...........1x10 Kallien Krueger bass combo owned by the Road Manager!!!!

Apparently there was 'just something' that Chuck loved about playing through this amp, especially the Chorus. Whether that's what you hear on the record I couldn't tell you, but I do know that live, behind those walls of Valvestates was a tiny little bass amp comprising most of Chucks tone.


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## Ancestor (Aug 6, 2008)

Lozek said:


> Whether that's what you hear on the record I couldn't tell you, but I do know that live, behind those walls of Valvestates was a tiny little bass amp comprising most of Chucks tone.



Go back one post before yours and read the quote.  That's directly from the recording engineer.


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## chaztrip (Aug 6, 2008)

What is Jim Morris refering to when he stated this: "Tuning was the most time consuming thing because both Chuck and I were pretty particular about it."

Is he talking about getting the guitars 100% spot on? or some weird tuning? I thought most of their stuff was 1 step down?


anyway Chuck was a  guitar player


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## eaeolian (Aug 6, 2008)

chaztrip said:


> Is he talking about getting the guitars 100% spot on? or some weird tuning? I thought most of their stuff was 1 step down?



Getting the tuning spot on. It's amazing how much difference a couple of cents can make when you're quadruple-tracking...


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