# 20" Neck-Radius Guitars?



## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

I can't find anything on the net regarding guitars made with a 20" neck radius. I'm having a custom 7-string built and the "standard" radius offered by the builder is the 20" radius. Before I make a decision as to whether this is going to work for me, I need to spend a little bit of time with one. I don't care whether it's a 6-string or 7-string, I just wanna play an electric guitar with a 20" neck radius.

Anyone know of any?


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## ibanez4lifesz (Mar 5, 2014)

The Music Man JPXI and JPXII both have 20" radius fretboards.


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

ibanez4lifesz said:


> The Music Man JPXI and JPXII both have 20" radius fretboards.



Cool! I know there aren't any MM dealers around here, though. Know of any Ibanez, ESP/LTD, Jackson, Fender, Epiphone/Gibson, or Charvels that may use a 20" radius?


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## Cabinet (Mar 5, 2014)

20" is excellent for djent, you'll be fine.


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## Tyler (Mar 5, 2014)

Nails In Your Coffin said:


> Cool! I know there aren't any MM dealers around here, though. Know of any Ibanez, ESP/LTD, Jackson, Fender, Epiphone/Gibson, or Charvels that may use a 20" radius?



to my knowledge none of those offer a 20". your best bet is either a carvin with having them specialize it with order 22 (i think its called) or going with an EBMM


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

Cabinet said:


> 20" is excellent for djent, you'll be fine.



I'm not interested in "djent," I prefer to play something a little more challenging that open, palm-muted strings.


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## Mik3D23 (Mar 5, 2014)

Chords (not talking power chords here) might be a bit challenging on such a flat radius, but shredding might be a little easier. Also, less of a chance of "fretting out" when bending but I think once you get to 14"/16" you don't really have much of an issue with that anymore anyway. I know there's a couple people on here who have built infinite radius guitars and actually like it.


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

Mik3D23 said:


> Chords (not talking power chords here) might be a bit challenging on such a flat radius, but shredding might be a little easier. Also, less of a chance of "fretting out" when bending but I think once you get to 14"/16" you don't really have much of an issue with that anymore anyway. I know there's a couple people on here who have built infinite radius guitars and actually like it.



Provided I wanna get a Floyd put on it, I guess I should probably go with some sort or radius on it that's not so flat.

What's your opinion on a Kahler? I know Floyds are manufactured for like a 10" radius.


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## straightshreddd (Mar 5, 2014)

Personally, I find it easier to play faster legatos and shreddy lines on flatter radii and easier to play rhythm and fast palm muted riffs on more rounder radii. While one would adapt regardless of radius, it'd be best to shoot for what's more comfortable for you.

I find 14" to be a perfect medium, but one day down the line, I plan on getting a custom with a compound radius of 14"-16". 

20" seems like it'd be way too flat for comfort for me. But, if you're already used to Ibanez's 16", you might dig the 20".


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

straightshreddd said:


> Personally, I find it easier to play faster legatos and shreddy lines on flatter radii and easier to play rhythm and fast palm muted riffs on more rounder radii. While one would adapt regardless of radius, it'd be best to shoot for what's more comfortable for you.
> 
> I find 14" to be a perfect medium, but one day down the line, I plan on getting a custom with a compound radius of 14"-16".
> 
> 20" seems like it'd be way too flat for comfort for me. But, if you're already used to Ibanez's 16", you might dig the 20".



I have a Warmoth "Wizard" neck that I _think_ has as Radius from 10-14", but I'm not sure. I also have a 2003 Jackson USA KV2, which I think has a radius of 12-16" radius. I find the Jackson's neck to be more comfortable, but width-wise, it's very thin. I can't "chord" as well as what I can on the Warmoth, which has a wider neck. I find the Jackson neck is easier to solo on than the Warmoth, but the Warmoth is easier to play chords on.

My main concern with a 20" neck is that it's going to be a problem to play bar-chords and such, plus with a Floyd, the string action is going to be higher in the middle of the neck than on the sides, making for an uneven string action.


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## pink freud (Mar 5, 2014)

Have you ever played a classical guitar? Different animal, but they usually have a fairly flat fretboard radius.


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

pink freud said:


> Have you ever played a classical guitar? Different animal, but they usually have a fairly flat fretboard radius.



I can't say I have. I have a Taylor 414CE, but I'm not sure how close that is to a 20" radius.


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## InfinityCollision (Mar 5, 2014)

Taylors are 15" radius iirc. If you can find a Rainsong to try out, those are 20".

Most classical fretboards are flat (infinite radius), but a crossover model might have a 20" or 24" radius.


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## Mik3D23 (Mar 5, 2014)

Nails In Your Coffin said:


> Provided I wanna get a Floyd put on it, I guess I should probably go with some sort or radius on it that's not so flat.
> 
> What's your opinion on a Kahler? I know Floyds are manufactured for like a 10" radius.



According to this:
Original 7-String | Floyd Rose Frequently Asked Questions
The 7 string floyds have a 20" radius at the bridge saddles.
I don't have an opinion on Kahler as unfortunately I've never tried one. I've heard good and bad things about them, the bad mostly being that if you're accustomed to Floyd you might not like Kahler. Also, I've heard they aren't as accurate at returning to it's zero point than a Floyd.


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

InfinityCollision said:


> Taylors are 15" radius iirc. If you can find a Rainsong to try out, those are 20".
> 
> Most classical fretboards are flat (infinite radius), but a crossover model might have a 20" or 24" radius.



I know it's a really long shot, but would you happen to know what radius a 1983-1985 B.C. Rich N.J. Series Mockingbird has? That's probably my electric guitar with the flattest radius.



Mik3D23 said:


> According to this:
> Original 7-String | Floyd Rose Frequently Asked Questions
> The 7 string floyds have a 20" radius at the bridge saddles.
> I don't have an opinion on Kahler as unfortunately I've never tried one. I've heard good and bad things about them, the bad mostly being that if you're accustomed to Floyd you might not like Kahler. Also, I've heard they aren't as accurate at returning to it's zero point than a Floyd.



I've also heard that about the Kahler, but mainly when it comes to doing pull-ups, not dives. I've never played a guitar with a Kahler. Whenever I run into a guitar with a tremolo, it's _always_ a Floyd or some other type of Floyd-type bridge like Ibanez's tremolo.

Given Floyd's 7 string tremolo is set up for a 20", the 20" radius may not be a big issue. Given the 7's wider neck, I wonder if it sort of "offsets" what otherwise would be a more optimal radius on a 6-stringer. I'm thinking maybe something like a 12-16" radius on a 7-string would be really, _really_ round...


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## InfinityCollision (Mar 5, 2014)

Nails In Your Coffin said:


> I know it's a really long shot, but would you happen to know what radius a 1983-1985 B.C. Rich N.J. Series Mockingbird has? That's probably my electric guitar with the flattest radius.


No idea, sorry. B.C. Rich isn't really my thing. If I had to guess, I'd say 12" or 16" at most.



> Given the 7's wider neck, I wonder if it sort of "offsets" what otherwise would be a more optimal radius on a 6-stringer. I'm thinking maybe something like a 12-16" radius on a 7-string would be really, _really_ round...


In my experience a wider neck does benefit from a relatively larger radius, but it's not a huge change just by adding one string. Think of it this way: you want the midpoint of the fretboard on the wider neck to be at most no higher relative to the edges than it would be on the narrower neck. That necessitates an increase in radius since the arc is longer. There's a few 8-strings around 12-16" compound radius though... Most are at least 16". 7-strings have a bit more variety. I typically prefer a flatter radius anyway; the 16" radius on my 7 is pretty comfortable but I don't think I'd want to go any lower.

For what it's worth, I feel the concerns over chording at flatter radii are overstated. But I've done a lot chording on flat fretboards, so take that as you will


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 5, 2014)

InfinityCollision said:


> No idea, sorry. B.C. Rich isn't really my thing. If I had to guess, I'd say 12" or 16" at most.
> 
> 
> In my experience a wider neck does benefit from a relatively larger radius, but it's not a huge change just by adding one string. Think of it this way: you want the midpoint of the fretboard on the wider neck to be at most no higher relative to the edges than it would be on the narrower neck. That necessitates an increase in radius since the arc is longer. There's a few 8-strings around 12-16" compound radius though... Most are at least 16". 7-strings have a bit more variety. I typically prefer a flatter radius anyway; the 16" radius on my 7 is pretty comfortable but I don't think I'd want to go any lower.
> ...



From what I understand, Carvin's 7-strings have a standard radius of 20", and everyone I've ever talked to who have owned Carvins love them. It sounds stupid, but maybe I'm guessing they're probably on to something with the 20" standard radius.


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## InfinityCollision (Mar 6, 2014)

Only the DC7X has 20" radius standard. The other 7-strings are all 14" standard with 20" as an option.


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 6, 2014)

InfinityCollision said:


> Only the DC7X has 20" radius standard. The other 7-strings are all 14" standard with 20" as an option.



I guess I'll probably wind up having to take a 120 mile round trip to try a JPX. Is that guitar the USA-built one or the Korean one? One of them has a 15" radius and I don't wanna drive the distance for nothing.


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## Svava (Mar 6, 2014)

Nails In Your Coffin said:


> I guess I'll probably wind up having to take a 120 mile round trip to try a JPX. Is that guitar the USA-built one or the Korean one? One of them has a 15" radius and I don't wanna drive the distance for nothing.



They all have 15 inch radii until the JPXI which has a 20. I think the XII does as well, the 13 and the Majesty have 17 inch Radii.




Also nobody should worry about chording being an issue. Classical guitarists, as mentioned earlier, usually have flat FLAT necks, and they chord better than anyone.

The only thing on a 7 string (in my experience) that precludes easy chording is string spacing. I could barely most chords on my Ibanez 927 QMF because the strings were so damn close together, and I don't have notably thick fingers. 

15 inch clearly works though- A Change of Seasons was written on a 7 string with a 15" radius and that song features a few first inversion fifth-string-root major 7th chords, and as far as I'm concerned if you can fret that on a guitar you can fret anything on that guitar xD


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## Nails In Your Coffin (Mar 6, 2014)

Svava said:


> They all have 15 inch radii until the JPXI which has a 20. I think the XII does as well, the 13 and the Majesty have 17 inch Radii.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info on the JPs. A trip this weekend may be in order...


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## -42- (Mar 6, 2014)

Mik3D23 said:


> Chords (not talking power chords here) might be a bit challenging on such a flat radius, but shredding might be a little easier.


I've never heard of people having trouble chording on flatter fretboard. I think the flat/round fretboard is just a matter of preference as opposed to a dichotomy of shredding vs chording.


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## Konfyouzd (Mar 6, 2014)

I played some guitars with a straight 20" radius and I didn't really like it... Up top it was awesome, but down on the rhythm end it didn't feel right. The best radius I've felt thus far is the jackson 12 - 16 compound radius. 

I think something around 14 - 18 would be awesome for me personally.


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## Svava (Mar 6, 2014)

Played a JP12 - 6 at Arlington GC today.

That's a sick guitar right there - I'd say you can't go wrong with it!

Though I liked the standard JP better because of the unfinished neck- I like matte or unfinished xD

Tone of the XII was better though....

If only I was Johnathan and I had 900 EBMM's xD


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## groverj3 (Mar 6, 2014)

Konfyouzd said:


> I played some guitars with a straight 20" radius and I didn't really like it... Up top it was awesome, but down on the rhythm end it didn't feel right. The best radius I've felt thus far is the jackson 12 - 16 compound radius.
> 
> I think something around 14 - 18 would be awesome for me personally.



I'd love to see (and play!) a 10-20" compound radius. It just sounds crazy


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