# Books I've Read



## neon_black88 (Jun 6, 2007)

Hey guys I started reading heaps recently, I need some reccomendations. So far (recently) 

I've read:

Starship Troopers
American Psycho
Trainspotting
The Acid House

For my next i'm thinking of reading a classic:

Bram Stokers Dracula
Sherlock Holmes
Heart Of Darkness
Frankenstein
Conan the Barbarian (ok not really a classic)

Can anyone reccomend me one?


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## Naren (Jun 6, 2007)

So you're reading all books that are based on movies or movies that were made out of books?

Is that the kind of book you want recommended? Or is it more specific and just movies that were turned into books?

I could recommend a zillion books, but I want to know what kind of a book you're looking for. Since you haven't given any direction of what you're looking for, I could recommend "The Brothers Karamazov" by Fyodor Dostoyevsky, but you might not like those kinds of novels.


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## Chris (Jun 6, 2007)

Pick up Malazan instead. 

Or if you really want a classic, can't go wrong with To Kill a Mockingbird if you haven't read that. It's brilliant.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> So you're reading all books that are based on movies or movies that were made out of books?
> 
> Is that the kind of book you want recommended? Or is it more specific and just movies that were turned into books?
> 
> I could recommend a zillion books, but I want to know what kind of a book you're looking for. Since you haven't given any direction of what you're looking for, I could recommend "The Brothers Karamazov" by Fyodor Dostoyevsky, but you might not like those kinds of novels.



Well I never really read alot, so I didn't really have a direction to go in, so im starting with movies that were books first because hey, I liked those movies. And then books by the same authors, beacause I liked those books. Movies are my gateway into the world of books, haha. In my defence I found out the Acid house was a movie AFTER I read it . 

And you can reccomend me anything you think is good as long as you give me a reason, im pretty open minded and I usually like pretty much any book I read.



Chris said:


> Pick up Malazan instead.
> 
> Or if you really want a classic, can't go wrong with To Kill a Mockingbird if you haven't read that. It's brilliant.



Im not really into fantasy, unless it contains conan cause hes pretty baddass.  
Or science fiction that isnt nerd science fiction (no offence nerds)


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## Chris (Jun 7, 2007)

Koontz's Frankenstein (two books) is pretty badass as well.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 7, 2007)

Read The Stand. Forget those other books and do it now.

Its the middle of the day over there, get up and go get a copy from the book store.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 7, 2007)

Why are you still reading this? 

Go get a copy.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> Why are you still reading this?
> 
> Go get a copy.



Hmmm


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## ohio_eric (Jun 7, 2007)

Go read some Vonnegut!!!!

Slaughterhouse-Five and Cat's Cradle are good places to start.


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> Read The Stand. Forget those other books and do it now.
> 
> Its the middle of the day over there, get up and go get a copy from the book store.



The Dark Tower completely destroys The Stand, foool. 

If you like insanely creepy occultic horror and just plain fucking super weird shit, I recommend stuff by HP Lovecraft. As a good starting point, I recommend this book: Amazon.com: The Best of H. P. Lovecraft: Bloodcurdling Tales of Horror and the Macabre: Books: H.P. Lovecraft,Robert Bloch

That book rocks. Read some of the user comments.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> The Dark Tower completely destroys The Stand, foool.



well, i dunno if he's down for reading a 7 book series. 
NB88-- you got a copy yet?


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> well, i dunno if he's down for reading a 7 book series.
> NB88-- you got a copy yet?



Eh, The Stand's 1200 pages or so. Dark Tower is like 4,400 pages or so, when you include all 7 books. Not that much of a difference.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> The Dark Tower completely destroys The Stand, foool.
> 
> If you like insanely creepy occultic horror and just plain fucking super weird shit, I recommend stuff by HP Lovecraft. As a good starting point, I recommend this book: Amazon.com: The Best of H. P. Lovecraft: Bloodcurdling Tales of Horror and the Macabre: Books: H.P. Lovecraft,Robert Bloch
> 
> That book rocks. Read some of the user comments.



I dont know why I didnt think of that earlier


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> I dont know why I didnt think of that earlier



He's one of my favorite authors. I've read everything he's ever written and I can say that the collection in that link is the best collection I've seen out there. It's missing "At The Mountains Of Madness" and "The Case Of Charles Dexter Ward" which are among my favorite Lovecraft stories, but, other than that, it's got pretty much all my favorites (Dreams In The Witch House, The Dunwich Horror, The Shadow Out Of Time, etc. etc. etc.). 

As for why it's missing "At The Mountains of Madness" and "The Case of Charles Dexter Ward," both of those are novellas and very long (compared to his usual short stories). AtMoM is over 100 pages long if I remember correctly.

Anyway, I highly recommend that book.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Couldn't find any h.p. lovecraft at the shops I went to . I would have got the stand but it was 24 bucks, I ended up getting red dragon for 9 bucks and I havent seen the film . Im definetly gana hunt down some lovecraft though.


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

Another movie book, eh? 

You need to get into some books that were not made into movies or based on movies...

Either order the books you want off the internet or special order them at a bookstore.

And what bookstore doesn't have any HP Lovecraft or Stephen King?! I mean, I've NEVER been to a bookstore that hasn't had any books by either of them (even here in Japan, ever bookstore has either some of their books in Japanese). Was the bookstore you went to the size of your bedroom?


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> Another movie book, eh?
> 
> You need to get into some books that were not made into movies or based on movies...
> 
> ...



Haha It was just a local shopping center, they had steven king but only the overpriced book store had the stand, Ill try the bigger shopping center tommorow for some hp lovecraft though. And at least I haven't seen red dragon haha. 

Also the the hp lovecraft book you recommended is 29 bucks, jesuss. For 35 pages!


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Haha It was just a local shopping center, they had steven king but only the overpriced book store had the stand, Ill try the bigger shopping center tommorow for some hp lovecraft though. And at least I haven't seen red dragon haha.



Well, that kind of explains it. If they don't have the book I recommended, special order it. Don't just buy whatever HP Lovecraft they have just because "this is the only book they have." What they have might be a mediocre book like "The Dream-Quest Of The Unknown Kadath." And I think if you bought that, you'd have a really poor opinion of Lovecraft.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> Well, that kind of explains it. If they don't have the book I recommended, special order it. Don't just buy whatever HP Lovecraft they have just because "this is the only book they have." What they have might be a mediocre book like "The Dream-Quest Of The Unknown Kadath." And I think if you bought that, you'd have a really poor opinion of Lovecraft.



35 pages is a miss print right?


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> 35 pages is a miss print right?



For what? For "The Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath"? Where did you read that? That book would be about 130-150 pages or so if it didn't have any other short stories in it, but it definitely would, at least, include a few short stories and would probably be 250-300 pages.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> For what? For "The Dream Quest of the Unknown Kadath"? Where did you read that? That book would be about 130-150 pages or so if it didn't have any other short stories in it, but it definitely would, at least, include a few short stories and would probably be 250-300 pages.



Nah sorry I mean the one you recommended


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Nah sorry I mean the one you recommended



Take a look at the amazon page again, dude. It's not 35 pages long; it's 432 pages long. I own that book myself and my brother and best friend have bought it before.

Amazon.com: The Best of H. P. Lovecraft: Bloodcurdling Tales of Horror and the Macabre: Books: H.P. Lovecraft,Robert Bloch

Where'd you get the idea it was 35 pages long?


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## neon_black88 (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> Take a look at the amazon page again, dude. It's not 35 pages long; it's 432 pages long. I own that book myself and my brother and best friend have bought it before.
> 
> Amazon.com: The Best of H. P. Lovecraft: Bloodcurdling Tales of Horror and the Macabre: Books: H.P. Lovecraft,Robert Bloch
> 
> Where'd you get the idea it was 35 pages long?



Just an angus and robertson website I was reading, figured it would be a typo though. 29 bucks is still so steep for a book, but Ill definetly pick it up if I see it or ill get them to order it in.


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## Kotex (Jun 7, 2007)

To kill a mockingbird  lol
Instead, read "Paradise lost", it's awesome.


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## Drew (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Hey guys I started reading heaps recently, I need some reccomendations. So far (recently)
> 
> I've read:
> 
> ...



Given what you've kisted, I'd pass on most of your "classic" list for now. Eventually pick up Heart of Darkness as it's pretty short, but it's a dark and dense read. Watch "Apocalypse Now" immediately after you finish, too. 

Vonnegutt is a good idea - Slaughterhouse-Five would fit in well with what you've just read. I'd also grab Hunter S. Thompson's "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" soon, if I were you. 

For American classics, I'd throw out Hemmingway's "The Sun Also Rises" and from an earlier generation, Mark Twain's criminally-underrated "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court." 

In fact, it's so underrated I'll start a thread about it.


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Just an angus and robertson website I was reading, figured it would be a typo though. 29 bucks is still so steep for a book, but Ill definetly pick it up if I see it or ill get them to order it in.



$29 bucks? I bought mine for about US $10, which seems like the perfect price for a 432 page paperback.

What is angus and robertson? Anyway, how could a book with 16 short stories in it be 32 pages long?  That's like 2 pages or less a story.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 7, 2007)

Naren said:


> Eh, The Stand's 1200 pages or so. Dark Tower is like 4,400 pages or so, when you include all 7 books. Not that much of a difference.


Only 3,200 pages?  


My copy was 800 pages and change. I figure thats reasonable.


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## Naren (Jun 7, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> Only 3,200 pages?



 Yeah, but 3,200 pages of awesomeness.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 8, 2007)

Drew said:


> Given what you've kisted, I'd pass on most of your "classic" list for now. Eventually pick up Heart of Darkness as it's pretty short, but it's a dark and dense read. Watch "Apocalypse Now" immediately after you finish, too.
> 
> Vonnegutt is a good idea - Slaughterhouse-Five would fit in well with what you've just read. I'd also grab Hunter S. Thompson's "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" soon, if I were you.
> 
> ...



Ive read fear and loathing, great


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## forelander (Jun 8, 2007)

Naren said:


> $29 bucks? I bought mine for about US $10, which seems like the perfect price for a 432 page paperback.
> 
> What is angus and robertson? Anyway, how could a book with 16 short stories in it be 32 pages long?  That's like 2 pages or less a story.



Australian book store. As with most things, books in Australia are overpriced. A paperback is typically around 20 AUS bucks.


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## Vegetta (Jun 9, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Couldn't find any h.p. lovecraft at the shops I went to . I would have got the stand but it was 24 bucks, I ended up getting red dragon for 9 bucks and I havent seen the film . Im definetly gana hunt down some lovecraft though.




This used book shop i go to has 3 first edition, mid 40's August Derleth Cthulu Mythos novels and I desperately want to buy them but they are a bit on the pricey side @ $175 each

I would suggest Perdido Street Station by China Mieville


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## DelfinoPie (Jun 9, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Ive read fear and loathing, great



In that case I recommend reading "The Rum Diary" but Hunter S. Thompson. It's currently in the pre-production stages of being made into a film.

Its my favourite book by him


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## neon_black88 (Jun 13, 2007)

Im half way through red dragon, I got a store to order in the best of HP lovecraft from overseas and it should be here in a few weeks, might pick up the stand in the next few days.


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## Naren (Jun 13, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> Im half way through red dragon, I got a store to order in the best of HP lovecraft from overseas and it should be here in a few weeks, might pick up the stand in the next few days.





I love the ideas Lovecraft came up with. Just awesome.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 14, 2007)

I bought the Stand today so ill get into that after I finish red dragon. The guy working at the store I bought and ordered the books from had read every Steven King and HP Lovecraft novel, when he asked me where I was getting the great reccomondations from I said "an internet guitar forum"  He was a musician too, what makes us so good?


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## Naren (Jun 14, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> I bought the Stand today so ill get into that after I finish red dragon. The guy working at the store I bought and ordered the books from had read every Steven King and HP Lovecraft novel, when he asked me where I was getting the great reccomondations from I said "an internet guitar forum"  He was a musician too, what makes us so good?



It's a mystery about what makes us so good.  But the fact remains.

And, as a side note, I was sarcastically and bitterly thinking that I should make a thread called "Books I've Read" and write over 1000 of the books I've read by now. Of course, I can't remember all the books I've read by now...


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## neon_black88 (Jun 14, 2007)

Haha, I have read alot more than that, actually not much. But Ive only really started getting into reading lately. But these are the books I actually have a memory of reading and my one word reviews:

The Hobbit (meh)
Lord Of the Rings: Fellowship (meh)
Lord Of the Rings: Two Towers (meh)
Lord Of the Rings: Return Of the King (meh)
American Psycho (Yes!)
Trainspotting (Yes!)
Starship Troopers (Yes!)
The Acid House (Yes!)
Kite Runner (Meh)
1984 (hmm)
Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas (Yes!)
Hell's Angels: The Strange and Terrible Saga of the ect... (Interesting!)
Almost Finished Read dragon and its a good read

BTW Naren how old are you?


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## Makelele (Jun 14, 2007)

I've also read a lot of books. Lately I've read "The First King of Shannara" by Terry Brooks and "A Feast for Crows" by George R.R. Martin (I highly recommend the "A Song of Ice and Fire" series - it's brilliant). Right now I'm reading "Red Rabbit" by Tom Clancy.


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## Naren (Jun 14, 2007)

neon_black88 said:


> The Hobbit (meh)
> Lord Of the Rings: Fellowship (meh)
> Lord Of the Rings: Two Towers (meh)
> Lord Of the Rings: Return Of the King (meh)
> ...



BLASPHEMY! How could such amazing masterpieces be "meh"? I've read "Two Towers" and "Return of The King" 9 times each, "Fellowship" 10 times, and "The Hobbit" about 5 times. All absolutely amazing novels. I first read The Hobbit when I was 7 years old. First read Fellowship when I was 9 years old.

I'm 24 years old. I graduated from college with an English degree (Creative Writing concentration) a little over 2 years ago. When in college, besides the normal huge amounts of reading, I had to do a LOT of reading for classes.


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## Makelele (Jun 14, 2007)

Naren said:


> BLASPHEMY! How could such amazing masterpieces be "meh"? I've read "Two Towers" and "Return of The King" 9 times each, "Fellowship" 10 times, and "The Hobbit" about 5 times. All absolutely amazing novels. I first read The Hobbit when I was 7 years old. First read Fellowship when I was 9 years old.



I agree. I read the books when I was about the same age ("The Hobbit" in Swedish and the rest in Finnish). I think I should read them again, in English this time, because a book is always better in its original language.


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## Naren (Jun 14, 2007)

Makelele said:


> I agree. I read the books when I was about the same age ("The Hobbit" in Swedish and the rest in Finnish). I think I should read them again, in English this time, because a book is always better in its original language.



Very true.  Half of my bookshelf in my apartment is novels in Japanese and the other half is novels in English. The original language is always better. And, if you don't have the ability in the original language, then you can go with the translation.

LotR is an awesome series.


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## neon_black88 (Jun 15, 2007)

I liked them I mean I did end up reading all four of them just fantasy is defenetly not my genre. Finished red dragon I can start the stand now


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## Metal Ken (Jun 15, 2007)

Did you get that copy of The Stand yet?


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## Naren (Jun 15, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> Did you get that copy of The Stand yet?



Did you fucking even read his most recent post?  or any of his posts on the previous page?

Ya must be blind, I swear.


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## Metal Ken (Jun 15, 2007)

I dont have to "Read" through "posts" on "pages". What do you take me for?


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## Naren (Jun 15, 2007)

Metal Ken said:


> I dont have to "Read" through "posts" on "pages". What do you take me for?



 Oh, I see. Then maybe you don't have to "respond" to "posts" on "pages" either.

[action=Naren]takes Metal Ken for a drug addict with an extremely short memory.[/action]


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## Kotex (Jun 19, 2007)

The Hobit kicked ass, but I didn't like the trilogy so much. o_0


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## forelander (Aug 7, 2007)

I hated the lord of the rings series, and I'm 3/4 through mountains of madness by lovecraft and it's not working for me too well either. I think both authors have a similar tone, where they write like an encyclopedia, which does nothing at all for me. The lovecraft story I can understand considering he's writing from a scientist's perspective, and I'm gonna read some more stories before I make up my mind, but lord of the rings was honestly the worst book I've ever read.


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## Naren (Aug 7, 2007)

forelander said:


> I hated the lord of the rings series, and I'm 3/4 through mountains of madness by lovecraft and it's not working for me too well either. I think both authors have a similar tone, where they write like an encyclopedia, which does nothing at all for me. The lovecraft story I can understand considering he's writing from a scientist's perspective, and I'm gonna read some more stories before I make up my mind, but lord of the rings was honestly the worst book I've ever read.



Then you obviously have no taste in literature... or a really short attention span. I can tell, dude. I was an English major. 

Lord of The Rings are some of the best books I've ever read (and I've read at least 1000 books by now, no kidding) and HP Lovecraft is my favorite horror author. 

Personal opinion? Nah. You're just flat out _*wrong*_.


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## forelander (Aug 8, 2007)

Naren said:


> Then you obviously have no taste in literature... or a really short attention span. I can tell, dude. I was an English major.
> 
> Lord of The Rings are some of the best books I've ever read (and I've read at least 1000 books by now, no kidding) and HP Lovecraft is my favorite horror author.
> 
> Personal opinion? Nah. You're just flat out _*wrong*_.



Keep in mind, I started the dark tower thread, so my attention span obviously isn't short and I do have some taste. 

I just don't dig authors that spend pages detailing the quality of colour of leaves. When scenery takes on more importance than story is when I get bored. 

I also found the story predictable and the characters one dimensional. Prime example is


Spoiler



when Gandalf 'died' the way the book was written made it incredibly obvious that he wasn't really dead and it had no impact whatsoever.


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## Naren (Aug 8, 2007)

forelander said:


> Keep in mind, I started the dark tower thread, so my attention span obviously isn't short and I do have some taste.
> 
> I just don't dig authors that spend pages detailing the quality of colour of leaves. When scenery takes on more importance than story is when I get bored.
> 
> ...



Actually The Dark Tower is a good example to your attention span being short. Sorry. Considering that Stephen King is considered "easy reading" by anyone into classic literature who has read his stuff.

Some people who are into HP Lovecraft and JRR Tolkien who have met people who can't get into it have noticed that those people have trouble reading old styles of writing from the early part of the 1900s and anything before that (JRR Tolkien wrote the LOTR series in the 1930s and 1940s and HP Lovecraft wrote all of his stories i nthe 1930s). So you may be one of othose people who just can't read classic literature and old styles of writing.


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## forelander (Aug 8, 2007)

Naren said:


> Actually The Dark Tower is a good example to your attention span being short. Sorry. Considering that Stephen King is considered "easy reading" by anyone into classic literature who has read his stuff.
> 
> Some people who are into HP Lovecraft and JRR Tolkien who have met people who can't get into it have noticed that those people have trouble reading old styles of writing from the early part of the 1900s and anything before that (JRR Tolkien wrote the LOTR series in the 1930s and 1940s and HP Lovecraft wrote all of his stories i nthe 1930s). So you may be one of othose people who just can't read classic literature and old styles of writing.



I don't have trouble reading the stuff, I just don't like the way style is used. As I say I'm only halfway through one of Lovecraft's stories so I don't really have an opinion yet, but it definitely seems better than Tolkien so far. The writing would be better if the pages of description were spent describing something interesting. I read Tess of the d'Urbervilles and hated it because 3 pages were spent describing turnips and 1 line would describe key events in the story. 

Whether or not I like / can read old style writing aside, you haven't addressed the fact that I don't like the story of Lord of the Rings - or do the masses say I'm stupid if I don't like the story as well?


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## Naren (Aug 8, 2007)

forelander said:


> I don't have trouble reading the stuff, I just don't like the way style is used. As I say I'm only halfway through one of Lovecraft's stories so I don't really have an opinion yet, but it definitely seems better than Tolkien so far. The writing would be better if the pages of description were spent describing something interesting. I read Tess of the d'Urbervilles and hated it because 3 pages were spent describing turnips and 1 line would describe key events in the story.
> 
> Whether or not I like / can read old style writing aside, you haven't addressed the fact that I don't like the story of Lord of the Rings - or do the masses say I'm stupid if I don't like the story as well?



That would be opinion there. Personally I love the story of the Lord of the Rings. Hence the fact that I've read the three books 9 times each (10 times for "Fellowship") and "The Hobbit" about 3 times. 

Obviously if you aren't interested in the story, then you aren't gonna want to read it. But that makes me wonder why you would start reading a novel for a book which has a story you aren't interested in.

I can see people not liking Lovecraft's writing style. He has a style where he doesn't use much dialogue and does a lot of description. But the stories themselves are very interesting. Mountains of Madness doesn't really get eerie and super weird until they get in the plane and fly over the mountains (all of Lovecraft's stories eventually turn weird and eerie).

But, if you haven't liked it so far, you might not like it when you've finished reading it as well.


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## forelander (Aug 8, 2007)

I'm hoping some cool shit is gonna happen. I actually like Lovecraft's description, I find his use of language absolutely brilliant. As for starting a book whose story I'm not interested, well I didn't realise Lord of the Rings lacked the features I like until I read it. I was going to stop about 1/3 through when I realised the story was less than I expected but I refused to let a book beat me in such a manner.


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## Naren (Aug 8, 2007)

Maybe it's the kind of book you either love or hate. I love the entire LOTR series and anything connected to it and pretty much everyone I know who has read it has said that it's absolutely amazing. You're the first person I've encountered who has read it and not said that it blew them away and they loved it.  So I guess there ARE people out there who don't like it.


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## noodles (Aug 8, 2007)

I am desperately looking for China Mieville's awesome rant about Tolkein being the boon of fantasy writers everywhere.

He basically took this awesome story idea, and totally ruined it with all these pointless songs, long-winded descriptions of inanimate objects, and little side stories that have nothing to do whatsoever with what is going on. Then he glasses over these epic battles in like four pages. I couldn't even get through the last book, I just got sick of being so fucking bored by his I'm So Terribly Impressive Because I Am An English Professor writing. If I wanted all of that, I'd just wait for The Hobbit on fucking Broadway.

The *only* time I had been more thoroughly bored by something that was supposed to be such a big deal was when I was forced to read Michener's "The Source" in high school. It was the same level of eye clawing mediocrity.


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## Ivan (Aug 8, 2007)

noodles said:


> I am desperately looking for China Mieville's awesome rant about Tolkein being the boon of fantasy writers everywhere.



Could this be what you were looking for?

China Mieville: Tolkien - Middle Earth Meets Middle England


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## noodles (Aug 8, 2007)

Nah, the one I'm thinking of starts with "J R Tolkein is a wet on the arse of fantasy literature." That article you linked is a good read, though.


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## ohio_eric (Aug 8, 2007)

noodles said:


> Nah, the one I'm thinking of starts with "J R Tolkein is a wet on the arse of fantasy literature." That article you linked is a good read, though.



A wet on the arse???? 

I'm with noodles on Tolkein and the whole overrated LOTR series.


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## Ivan (Aug 8, 2007)

It's actually a *wen* on the ass. 

I believe this is slightly off-topic, but anyways, here's the part of the rant. I'm still trying to find the whole thing as I'm interested in subject myself.

&#8220;Tolkien is the wen on the arse of fantasy literature. His oeuvre is massive and contagious&#8212;you can&#8217;t ignore it, so don&#8217;t even try. The best you can do is consciously try and lance the boil. And there&#8217;s a lot to dislike&#8212;his cod-Wagnerian pomposity, his boys-own-adventure glorying in war, his small-minded and reactionary love for hierarchical status-quos, his belief in absolute morality that blurs moral and political complexity. Tolkien&#8217;s clichés&#8212;elves &#8216;n&#8217; dwarfs &#8216;n&#8217; magic rings&#8212;have spread like viruses&#8221; - China Miéville

_edit:_ I believe this is the whole thing. I have yet to form an opinion about it. 
james roy | musings | steampunk - the new genre


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## Drew (Aug 8, 2007)

noodles said:


> I am desperately looking for China Mieville's awesome rant about Tolkein being the boon of fantasy writers everywhere.
> 
> He basically took this awesome story idea, and totally ruined it with all these pointless songs, long-winded descriptions of inanimate objects, and little side stories that have nothing to do whatsoever with what is going on. Then he glasses over these epic battles in like four pages. I couldn't even get through the last book, I just got sick of being so fucking bored by his I'm So Terribly Impressive Because I Am An English Professor writing. If I wanted all of that, I'd just wait for The Hobbit on fucking Broadway.
> 
> The *only* time I had been more thoroughly bored by something that was supposed to be such a big deal was when I was forced to read Michener's "The Source" in high school. It was the same level of eye clawing mediocrity.



 

Though, to be fair, The Hobbit is way less "I'm So Terribly Impressive Because I Am An English Professor" than TLoTR. That's probably why I preferred it as much as I did - as it's only in the 300 page range, instead of 3,000 or so, there's a lot less of the tangental stuff, a lot more of the great story, and when he spends 6 pages on a battle, then that's 1/50th of the total story, instead of 1/500th.


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## forelander (Aug 8, 2007)

noodles said:


> I am desperately looking for China Mieville's awesome rant about Tolkein being the boon of fantasy writers everywhere.
> 
> He basically took this awesome story idea, and totally ruined it with all these pointless songs, long-winded descriptions of inanimate objects, and little side stories that have nothing to do whatsoever with what is going on. Then he glasses over these epic battles in like four pages. I couldn't even get through the last book, I just got sick of being so fucking bored by his I'm So Terribly Impressive Because I Am An English Professor writing. If I wanted all of that, I'd just wait for The Hobbit on fucking Broadway.
> 
> The *only* time I had been more thoroughly bored by something that was supposed to be such a big deal was when I was forced to read Michener's "The Source" in high school. It was the same level of eye clawing mediocrity.



My feelings exactly.


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## DelfinoPie (Aug 9, 2007)

Books I've read in the last 3 days (because I've been on the night-shift):

Day 1. Michael Crichton - Congo
Day 2. Bret Easton Ellis - Less than Zero
Kurt Vonnegut - Slaughter House 5
Day 3. Jack Kerouac - Big Sur

And in order of favourite:

Less than Zero
Big Sur
Slaughter House 5
Congo



Bill Hicks said:


> Looks like we got a reader.


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