# 6505+ 112 Tubes and Improvements



## cboysen (Oct 22, 2010)

Hi I hope I'm not asking something that has already been asked before, although the search function didn't seem to narrow my question down completely - So... I'll start by apologizing for 'using' your forum even though I do not own a 7-string guitar, I'd love to though.

First of all I'm a complete noob to all the technical stuff of amps and gear and right now I'm running a fairly simple/cheap setup with 
EPS LTD JH-600 --> BB preamp as clean boost --> 6505+ 112 --> Decimator G-string
Soon I'm going to purchase an Orange PPC412 to get the best out of my beloved 6505+ combo. 
So I was wondering if there was more I could do to improve upon my sound texture both on lead and rhythm - Going for a sorta (non-sizzly) Carcass sound in lead and a warm non-gritty clean on rhythm. I know the 6505+ isn't very renowned for its cleans, but I'm still getting fair results.
I'm thinking I could replace the stock preamp tubes for cleans to something more decent, whatever that is, I don't really care about the crunch abilities for this amp. Also I want to replace the stock 6L6 tubes for a punchier and defined warm lead tone - Any suggestions? Eurotubes seems to have some nice options, but I live in Denmark so that might be quite expensive. Also should i rebias if I change the tubes (to get the most out of it)?

If I were to change the stuck tubes, does anyone know the tube schematics for the 6505+ combo version - since it has 5 preamps and not 6 like the 6505+ head. For preamp tubes on cleans, I'm thinking ECC82 maybe.. but in what spot?

Another thing - As I might start to increase in number of pedals, Chorus, Delay, an EQ etc I'm imagining all the tap-dancing I'd have to do just to engage OD and Delay on a nice lead simultaneously when changing channel, and again when changing to rhythm I'd want to enable the EQ, Chorus and also disable OD and Delay at the same time.. Since I don't know a lot of people with 5-6 feet, there must be someone out there with the same problem, and not really having a whole rack-system in mind. I was thinking in lines of a DIY Metal stick that pushed all the 'buttons' at the same time  - or something smarter like a Boss LS-2.. Any ideas?

Thanks in advance
Chris

Uhm.. and sorry for the wall of text... of endless suffering


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## Dionysian (Oct 22, 2010)

Hej, og velkommen til ss.org. 

I don't know much about tubes honestly, but regardning your pedal problem i believe there are special pedal grouping pedals you can get that let you assign a number of pedals to a loop, which you can then toggle on or off simply by stomping that one pedal. if that makes sense. 

Eskil


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## warlock7strEMG (Oct 23, 2010)

cboysen said:


> Hi I hope I'm not asking something that has already been asked before, although the search function didn't seem to narrow my question down completely - So... I'll start by apologizing for 'using' your forum even though I do not own a 7-string guitar, I'd love to though.
> 
> First of all I'm a complete noob to all the technical stuff of amps and gear and right now I'm running a fairly simple/cheap setup with
> EPS LTD JH-600 --> BB preamp as clean boost --> 6505+ 112 --> Decimator G-string
> ...



i cant really help u with the pedal dilemma, as i only use and OD pedal myself and thats it. but i may be able to help with the other stuff....

first off, the stock speaker doesnt do the 6505+ any justice at all. the Orange PPC412 is gonna do wonders for your tone. they are very thick, warm and ballsy sounding with alot of midrange and low end. also somewhat dark with rolled off high end, so that ll eliminate alot of ur fizz and actually allow u to use ur presence knob without adding sizzle to ur tone. with the Orange, you should have no problem at all getting that Carcass -type tone from the lead channel.

im not sure which preamp tubes do what in the + combo, but if you can find out which one is V1, id recommend puttin a TungSol 12ax7 in that slot. it ll make the most difference in the amps overall tone. Tungsols are bright but also warm and very rich sounding. as a matter of fact, with one of these in V1, u can just about run any 12ax7 in the other slots and it ll still sound really fuckin good. id imagine it would make ur clean tone even better, the cleans on the + arent too bad to begin with.

for power tubes, go with a pair of SED Winged C 6L6's. they are supposed to be the best 6L6's u can get. ive read they are tonally similar to the Sylvania 6L6's that came stock in the older 5150's which supposedly sounded so good that when Peavey ran out of them and started using another brand, people started thinkin that Peavey changed the 5150 circuit and/or started using cheaper parts.

what are ur current boost pedal and amp settings? ive never used that boost before so i cant comment on how it works with any amp but i do know that the Maxon OD9 works wonders for the 6505+


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## noob_pwn (Oct 23, 2010)

sounds like you want some 5881 power tubes buddy!


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

Oh thanks for all the great answers so fast


> first off, the stock speaker doesnt do the 6505+ any justice at all. the Orange PPC412 is gonna do wonders for your tone. they are very thick, warm and ballsy sounding with alot of midrange and low end. also somewhat dark with rolled off high end, so that ll eliminate alot of ur fizz and actually allow u to use ur presence knob without adding sizzle to ur tone. with the Orange, you should have no problem at all getting that Carcass -type tone from the lead channel.



yeah that's so unbelievably true - I did change the stock speaker to an eminence governor right about one month ago - And for recording that's just amazing, but out in the field, one speaker doesn't do much justice, not matter what speaker it is, and since the governor is sorta replica v30, and the PPC412 is equipped with 4x V30s I thought that would do wonders - So I'm glad you're fond of the idea
Also the Orange PPC412 costs half the price of a Rectifier cab and they are seemingly the same quality wise and sound wise, where as the mesa cab should have a bit more boomy low-end and maybe better suited for the 6505+, and the Orange is a bit more directional and warm and transparent in the low-end - not saying it's lacking any of it and everyone seems to like the orange cab.

As for the 6505+ 112 circuit / tube positions I'll try to figure that out asap, maybe call some people with a deeper knowledge of amps and specifically peavey. 

Oh and I did try out a mesa cab as extension for the 6505+ 112 in a big music store in Copenhagen, got to play with the volume knob around 2-3 and already there it was a whole new world of good sound, so I really can't wait to get my cab. 



> what are ur current boost pedal and amp settings? ive never used that boost before so i cant comment on how it works with any amp but i do know that the Maxon OD9 works wonders for the 6505+



Well my current Amp settings is
Presence 4
Resonance 6 (or was it the other way around) 
no reverb (the gigs physical room size is plenty enough)
High 6
Mid 6
Low 6
Gain 4½ (6 without OD boost)

Pedal settings:
Volume: 8/10 (10 and my noise gate cant handle it anymore, becomes too compressed)
Low: 5 (12 o'clock)
High: 5½
Gain: 0

I found the Xotic BB preamp to be better than the ibanez and maxon overdrive pedals, about the same as the plus model from maxon, also about the same price that is. Anyone, it's really an amazing preamp with sustain for days and clarity and a solid transparent boost that really enhances your already only-to-be-dreamt-about tone - As for some might think that 6505+ 112 is worse than the 6505+ since it's a 60 watt instead of 120 and only 2 power tubes and 5 preamps, and it's made in china not USA. Well I cannot speak for reliability only it seems study as hell, but the sound quality is just euphoric and I actually like it more than the original 6505+, not saying it's better, but the sound texture is about the same, and you can get much greater tone on lower levels (duh) from the 6505+ 112, where as the 6505+ sorta needs to be cranked and thus destroy everyone in the club and piss of a bunch of sound technicians. (no I'm not advertising, just stating that it was by far the best buy I've done when it comes to music and gear)

Btw - Do you think the 6505+ 112 has a dedicated 'clean' preamp like it's big brother, or rather a mild rhythm tube slot? I don't want to affect the amazing lead tone with a tube that works against it.
But yes, the clean are just fine, but when you have to turn down the gain knob and up the volume, and then it's not that loud/loud enough.





> Hej, og velkommen til ss.org.
> 
> I don't know much about tubes honestly, but regardning your pedal problem i believe there are special pedal grouping pedals you can get that let you assign a number of pedals to a loop, which you can then toggle on or off simply by stomping that one pedal. if that makes sense.
> 
> Eskil



Yeah that's exactly what the Boss LS-2 does I think, also the Voodoo board seems to do the same thing, but then it gets quite rack-mount oriented.

Btw - How hard is it to change the tubes?

Chris


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

noob_pwn said:


> sounds like you want some 5881 power tubes buddy!


Does this require special bias-ing equipment? - And why exactly those, aren't they only 25watt and not 30 watt as the 6L6's (if that matters at all)?


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## Self Bias (Oct 23, 2010)

I do know that JJ 6l6s biased my 5150 combo perfectly. I would assume(?) that your 6505 is the same amp with 1 less speaker. No bias pot needed for combo, unlike heads.
These combos will push 4x12s great. The diff between 60 and 120 watts is that your drummer will bitch at 4.5 post amp instead of 4.2-haha.
A choke will do absolute wonders for a 5150/6505/6202, especially on the treble side of things. I found myself actually enjoying the top end freqs of the amp instead of cringing.
Don't have any valid input on cleans. Only time I'm playing clean is if an amp isn't on-haha.


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

Self Bias said:


> I do know that JJ 6l6s biased my 5150 combo perfectly. I would assume(?) that your 6505 is the same amp with 1 less speaker. No bias pot needed for combo, unlike heads.
> These combos will push 4x12s great. The diff between 60 and 120 watts is that your drummer will bitch at 4.5 post amp instead of 4.2-haha.
> A choke will do absolute wonders for a 5150/6505/6202, especially on the treble side of things. I found myself actually enjoying the top end freqs of the amp instead of cringing.
> Don't have any valid input on cleans. Only time I'm playing clean is if an amp isn't on-haha.



Enjoyed 
Yeah probably true about the volume, I'm not worrying about that at all. 
and uhm sorry for sounding noobish but... what's a choke?
So you're saying I could just buy a matched set of JJ 6l6s and I wouldn't have to worry about biasing at all... are they any better/worse/different than a pair of SED Winged C 6L6's that was mentioned earlier?

Thanks
Chris


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## Self Bias (Oct 23, 2010)

I ordered my choke from Mercury Magnetics. It's an inducter that cleans up DC voltage. Fairly simple installation- only 2 wires to solder. I mounted mine where my unused reverb used to be. Be careful working inside the amp, though. Those capacitors bite hard if you don't drain them.
I had installed 2 JJs in my 5150 before taking it in to an amp tech to have the bias mod done. He called back a week later saying that it was biased already and that there was no need for the bias pot. I hadn't purchased the 6l6s specifically for my amp- just went in somewhere and grabbed 2 tubes. I really don't know if all JJ 6l6s bias the same or if I got lucky. I do know that they make the perfect tubes for my amp, though. I intend to contact Eurotubes when it comes time to replace mine, to be sure.


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

Self Bias said:


> I ordered my choke from Mercury Magnetics. It's an inducter that cleans up DC voltage. Fairly simple installation- only 2 wires to solder. I mounted mine where my unused reverb used to be. Be careful working inside the amp, though. Those capacitors bite hard if you don't drain them.
> I had installed 2 JJs in my 5150 before taking it in to an amp tech to have the bias mod done. He called back a week later saying that it was biased already and that there was no need for the bias pot. I hadn't purchased the 6l6s specifically for my amp- just went in somewhere and grabbed 2 tubes. I really don't know if all JJ 6l6s bias the same or if I got lucky. I do know that they make the perfect tubes for my amp, though. I intend to contact Eurotubes when it comes time to replace mine, to be sure.



Sounds interesting, so what would the benefits be by doing this choke-mod? 
Also keep in mind that I have the 6505+ combo model, and it seems there is no need to bias that or so, unless you change the tubes completely to EL34. Oh and I'm already about to flee in terror just by hearing the word "just some wires and a bit of solder"  My tech-skills is to change a speaker, or a tube, otherwise just play the thing - Unless it's a computer I'm a complete retard whatsoever, but well.. I guess that's what youtube is for, everything can be learned.


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## noob_pwn (Oct 23, 2010)

cboysen said:


> Does this require special bias-ing equipment? - And why exactly those, aren't they only 25watt and not 30 watt as the 6L6's (if that matters at all)?



yes, they do have slightly less headroom. They work amazingly well in these amps. I didnt turn back after trying them in the modded 5150 i used to own. Changing any tubes and getting the right current flowing through them will require biasing equipment, although with stock 5150/6505's the bias range is very cold and narrow


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## Self Bias (Oct 23, 2010)

That raspy, piercing, angry bee treble response is mellowed quite a bit. I always hate the treble on my Peavey, and ran around 3.5. Now I go 4.5-50 on treble. Still going through Sheffield speakers, too. Those aren't terrible speakers, BTW.
You could have the install done fairly cheap by an amp tech.


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

noob_pwn said:


> yes, they do have slightly less headroom. They work amazingly well in these amps. I didnt turn back after trying them in the modded 5150 i used to own. Changing any tubes and getting the right current flowing through them will require biasing equipment, although with stock 5150/6505's the bias range is very cold and narrow



Thanks I'll definitely look into that!
The 6505+ Combo version seems to be biased a bit hotter afaik
It seems that the ideal option is to call some pro tech guy to do a proper job and then pay whatever it costs


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## cboysen (Oct 23, 2010)

Hmm about the tubes
would I be able to put a matched pair of Tung-Sol 6L6GC-STR in my 6505+ 112 without having to bias? and would that even be a good idea, sound wise?


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## warlock7strEMG (Oct 23, 2010)

cboysen said:


> Oh thanks for all the great answers so fast
> 
> 
> yeah that's so unbelievably true - I did change the stock speaker to an eminence governor right about one month ago - And for recording that's just amazing, but out in the field, one speaker doesn't do much justice, not matter what speaker it is, and since the governor is sorta replica v30, and the PPC412 is equipped with 4x V30s I thought that would do wonders - So I'm glad you're fond of the idea
> ...



oh wow, the Orange is half the price of a Recto cab there?!! fuck i need to move to Denmark haha. the Orange is actually about $100 more than the Recto cab here in the US. 

but yeah man, the Orange and Mesas are both extremely well built but to me it seems the Orange may be a little more robust in its contruction. and due to its size and depth the low end isnt boomy like the Recto cab is and the mids are more pronounced. the Recto is pretty big sounding, no doubt but to me the Orange is thicker sounding, if that makes any sense. not as much bass, but alot of low mids for extra girth. another cool thing about the Orange is the super thick grill cloth, it filters out alot of the harshness that V30's have and give the other overall tone a darker tone with smoothed out treble. 

changing out the stock speaker was a good move for sure, but like u said its only one speaker and its still in the smallish combo enclosure so it wont give u the same sound as 4 speakers in a heavy duty enclosure like the Orange cab will. with that said though, the Governor is a fantastic speaker, so definitely a good choice there!!! V30's to me sound best with this amp and the Governor is the best V30 copy that i have heard so far.

ive heard of Xotic BB preamp to be a good boost pedal, very transparent. although i do like to color that the OD9 gives to pretty much any amp, something more transparent will work beautifully with a high gain and already super midrangey like the 5150/6505 series. and ur settings are definitely good for both your pedal and ur amp. some people get way too overbearing with the gain and whatnot on the 6505's but the "666" EQ settings u have seemed to be used by alot of people with these amps and i see why, sounds nice and balanced and more or less perfect for any type of heavy stuff. though, with the Orange you may find urself using a little more presence.

the 6505+ 112 combos are really fucking sweet, im with ya there. the build quality, though made in China, still seems sturdy and top notch. i think its cool that Peavey made a more affordable addition to the 6505 series that sounds just as good as the more expensive ones do. and i know they really arent much quieter than the 120 head version but as u stated, its easier to get a better sound at a lower level due the earlier power tube saturation.

and this is just my 2 cents, but in my honest opinion, i know that 5881's are great tubes and work well for the regular 5150/6505 amps.....but in comparison the 6L6's they have less low end and are more focused on the higher midrange frequencies. this works well in complimenting and balancing out the darker, low midrange heavy voicing of the regular 5150/6505 but the voicing for the II/+ series is already leaning more to the upper range and has less low than the regular series, so while 5881's may sound good in the + series, i also feel that they may cause the amp to lose some of its thickness. thats why i think the 6L6's would be the better choice, and i have read nothing but good about the Winged C's. JJ's are really nice too and will bring up the bias a little, but its also my understanding that there is a high failure rating with JJ's.

one other thing, ive read good things about the added choke for 5150/6505's but first id would stick with doin enhancements that dont require any modding, such as new tubes, cab, etc to see if that gets u where u want to be tonally before u start modding anything.


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## cboysen (Oct 24, 2010)

warlock7strEMG said:


> oh wow, the Orange is half the price of a Recto cab there?!! fuck i need to move to Denmark haha. the Orange is actually about $100 more than the Recto cab here in the US.
> 
> but yeah man, the Orange and Mesas are both extremely well built but to me it seems the Orange may be a little more robust in its contruction. and due to its size and depth the low end isnt boomy like the Recto cab is and the mids are more pronounced. the Recto is pretty big sounding, no doubt but to me the Orange is thicker sounding, if that makes any sense. not as much bass, but alot of low mids for extra girth. another cool thing about the Orange is the super thick grill cloth, it filters out alot of the harshness that V30's have and give the other overall tone a darker tone with smoothed out treble.
> 
> ...



Thanks a lot! I couldn't agree more... on whatever there is to agree on of course ^^ 
I haven't tried all of the Ibanez and Maxon overdrives, but a good friend told me that this thing would slay the other stuff -but that's all down to preference, nevertheless dialing in the BB preamp really gives you a rock solid pro tone already there.
Anyhow, without bashing anyone on this forum and whoever else own any great metal amp - A lot of people seem to put the mid on 2-3 and bass on 7-8 and highs and 7-8, and gain almost the same. Now I don't know what tone they are looking for, but to me that's going to sound like someone in the kitchen with a frypan on max, if that makes any sense. Too much fizz, too much noise, no body - and even though it might sound good in some dark cellar, you will vanish the second the rest of the band starts playing - But I'm sure thats last years news in here. 

Well I'm glad to hear you like the Orange cab, always nice to have your thoughts approved - And basically Denmark doesn't really sell Orange cabs, I'm going to order from the UK and ship it to here, and even thats cheaper, it's like $860 for the Orange cab compared to $1829 for the Mesa - You gotta love those taxations. 
But well it seems that the 6505+ 112 will 'auto-bias' if you can call it that, if I put in some 6l6s of any kind - Now the only thing i need to figure out is which slots those preamps are working on, which one is v1,v2,v3,v4 and v5.  

Thanks
Chris


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## Self Bias (Oct 24, 2010)

It won't self bias- oh, hey- but it happens to fall into a range where the right tubes will bias with it. It's not likely the chinese tubes these come with do that. Mine was cold like the heads before the swap to JJs. I would make sure you have the right tubes. I think they go by grades that are relative to what currents are required to acheive a correct bias. Anybody have input on tube grades that would confirm this?


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## cboysen (Oct 24, 2010)

Self Bias said:


> It won't self bias- oh, hey- but it happens to fall into a range where the right tubes will bias with it. It's not likely the chinese tubes these come with do that. Mine was cold like the heads before the swap to JJs. I would make sure you have the right tubes. I think they go by grades that are relative to what currents are required to acheive a correct bias. Anybody have input on tube grades that would confirm this?



Hmm okay  Well I have no idea what power tubes will work or not, but in the music community you always have one geek-contact that can explain it to you in such a way you have no idea what he's talking about, but trust him enough to not screw up your amp, so well - No worries, those things are just a phone call away, I'm just not in such a hurry i'd start calling people in the weekends. 
But I think I'll go with some winged =C= despite their price-tag or some JJs.. Tung Sols has come to my mind too .. anyway, you've all really helped me clear up some stuff about my amp, and confirm some of the rest, so that's just a happy-ending of a good thread 

Thanks all
Chris


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## noob_pwn (Oct 24, 2010)

warlock7strEMG said:


> and this is just my 2 cents, but in my honest opinion, i know that 5881's are great tubes and work well for the regular 5150/6505 amps.....but in comparison the 6L6's they have less low end and are more focused on the higher midrange frequencies. this works well in complimenting and balancing out the darker, low midrange heavy voicing of the regular 5150/6505 but the voicing for the II/+ series is already leaning more to the upper range and has less low than the regular series, so while 5881's may sound good in the + series, i also feel that they may cause the amp to lose some of its thickness. thats why i think the 6L6's would be the better choice, and i have read nothing but good about the Winged C's. JJ's are really nice too and will bring up the bias a little, but its also my understanding that there is a high failure rating with JJ's.
> .


Speaking from direct experience with both mkI & mkII 5150s what you have said is not quite the case. From the way you have written this it sounds like you haven't actually tried it, well I have tried 3 brands of 5881s as well as just about every common 6L6 on the market with both types of 5150. What you said about the amp losing thickness is totally untrue, it is quite the opposite and although 5881s do slightly accentuate high-mids they aren't overbearing, nowhere near what EL34's are like for reference. They are very tubby, fat and rounded sounding tubes, very thick and harmonically rich. They have compressed highs and lows which works well in cleaning up the low, low flub 5150s have so you can dial in more natural sounding lows. They have much smoother highs and make these amps sing in these frequencies and cause them to lose alot of hashness. Overall they sound thicker with rolled of highs and lows, yes winged C's sound amazing but for what the OP wanted this fitted perfec in my opinion from my experience. Even though the +/II has a more upper mid voicing it is still somewhat scooped in this frequency compared to some other amps on the market and the 5881s do a fantastic job in cleaning the sound of this amp up. Although they may have a slightly shifted midrange voicing compared to a regular 6L6 I found this was secondary to it's other tonal characteristics of compressed/rolled high highs and low lows and a massively thick and rich midrange in general
How hot a set of tubes biases in a fixed/limited amp like a 5150 has nothing to do with the brand and everything to do with the tube's rating.
I know you are just trying to help and you seem to be well-read but without being a dick, please try to avoid posting inferred opinions like this it just creates misinformation


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## cboysen (Oct 24, 2010)

noob_pwn said:


> Speaking from direct experience with both mkI & mkII 5150s what you have said is not quite the case. From the way you have written this it sounds like you haven't actually tried it, well I have tried 3 brands of 5881s as well as just about every common 6L6 on the market with both types of 5150. What you said about the amp losing thickness is totally untrue, it is quite the opposite and although 5881s do slightly accentuate high-mids they aren't overbearing, nowhere near what EL34's are like for reference. They are very tubby, fat and rounded sounding tubes, very thick and harmonically rich. They have compressed highs and lows which works well in cleaning up the low, low flub 5150s have so you can dial in more natural sounding lows. They have much smoother highs and make these amps sing in these frequencies and cause them to lose alot of hashness. Overall they sound thicker with rolled of highs and lows, yes winged C's sound amazing but for what the OP wanted this fitted perfec in my opinion from my experience. Even though the +/II has a more upper mid voicing it is still somewhat scooped in this frequency compared to some other amps on the market and the 5881s do a fantastic job in cleaning the sound of this amp up. Although they may have a slightly shifted midrange voicing compared to a regular 6L6 I found this was secondary to it's other tonal characteristics of compressed/rolled high highs and low lows and a massively thick and rich midrange in general
> How hot a set of tubes biases in a fixed/limited amp like a 5150 has nothing to do with the brand and everything to do with the tube's rating.
> I know you are just trying to help and you seem to be well-read but without being a dick, please try to avoid posting inferred opinions like this it just creates misinformation



Alright-y then  So I play mostly melodic death metal and everything that can fit into that category, and you say the winged =C= is a good choice - this might just be what i want  Now what about the preamps, how do they affect both the lead tone and the clean stuff, I want the the tone to be smooth and not ear-piercingly icy but still without being dull
You know this effect you get when you start off with some low and slow metal riffing and you can just see how it crushes through the room together with the bass and still how those shredding solos cut through the mix like butter  well okay it's only a 60 watt combo 6505+ and not a Diezel Herbert orso, and my equipment is sorta limited so I shouldnt ask for too much.. but well.. any good preamps to consider.. I've heard it should be pretty much mix'n'max as long as you stay in the 12au7-range


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## warlock7strEMG (Oct 25, 2010)

noob_pwn said:


> Speaking from direct experience with both mkI & mkII 5150s what you have said is not quite the case. From the way you have written this it sounds like you haven't actually tried it, well I have tried 3 brands of 5881s as well as just about every common 6L6 on the market with both types of 5150. What you said about the amp losing thickness is totally untrue, it is quite the opposite and although 5881s do slightly accentuate high-mids they aren't overbearing, nowhere near what EL34's are like for reference. They are very tubby, fat and rounded sounding tubes, very thick and harmonically rich. They have compressed highs and lows which works well in cleaning up the low, low flub 5150s have so you can dial in more natural sounding lows. They have much smoother highs and make these amps sing in these frequencies and cause them to lose alot of hashness. Overall they sound thicker with rolled of highs and lows, yes winged C's sound amazing but for what the OP wanted this fitted perfec in my opinion from my experience. Even though the +/II has a more upper mid voicing it is still somewhat scooped in this frequency compared to some other amps on the market and the 5881s do a fantastic job in cleaning the sound of this amp up. Although they may have a slightly shifted midrange voicing compared to a regular 6L6 I found this was secondary to it's other tonal characteristics of compressed/rolled high highs and low lows and a massively thick and rich midrange in general
> How hot a set of tubes biases in a fixed/limited amp like a 5150 has nothing to do with the brand and everything to do with the tube's rating.
> I know you are just trying to help and you seem to be well-read but without being a dick, please try to avoid posting inferred opinions like this it just creates misinformation



i should have clarified that i was referring the Eurotubes JJ power tubes. Bob at Eurotubes selects JJ's rated to run hotter for Peaveys and other amps with fixed bias to help bring the bias up out of bein so cold. sorry for the generalized referenence to all JJ tubes.

and about the 5881's, i was just speakin my experience with 5881's vs 6L6's in other amps that werent really low mid voiced. i preferred the beefy low mids and bass of the 6L6. and all i was sayin is that it MIGHT not sound like what hes looking, just my opinion based on what ive heard from 5881's, but just simply a theory that i know i could be wrong about. and plus, he said is looking for a more Carcass type tone, which is a very beefy and low mid heavy, so 6L6's seem to me the better tube for that. 

obviously u have experience with 5881's in both 5150s and thats awesome, and therefor it gives u a valuable AND good opinion on the subject. but its still simply an opinion, its a forum so we are all entitled to share ours and its ok to have differing theories, but...not to be dick back to u, but dont act like ur opinion is better or more valuable than mine or anyone elses. no hard feelings tho


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## noob_pwn (Oct 25, 2010)

warlock7strEMG said:


> obviously u have experience with 5881's in both 5150s and thats awesome, and therefor it gives u a valuable AND good opinion on the subject. but its still simply an opinion, its a forum so we are all entitled to share ours and its ok to have differing theories, but...not to be dick back to u, but dont act like ur opinion is better or more valuable than mine or anyone elses. no hard feelings tho



I was not trying to undermine you or anything, I just felt what you recommended from inference was inaccurate from my direct experience, no offence taken.


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## warlock7strEMG (Oct 25, 2010)

noob_pwn said:


> I was not trying to undermine you or anything, I just felt what you recommended from inference was inaccurate from my direct experience, no offence taken.



good deal man, didnt mean to be too confrontational, so we re all good!!!
reminds me why i love this forum, full of good mature people!!!!


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## cboysen (Oct 25, 2010)

warlock7strEMG said:


> good deal man, didnt mean to be too confrontational, so we re all good!!!
> reminds me why i love this forum, full of good mature people!!!!



Yeah, exactly why I chose this forum instead of HC or UG... I wanted to post on the peavey forum, but kinda never got the activation email to set up the account, and trying to retreive the password just went "no can't do".. 

Anyhow ... Preamps for 6505+ (112?) ... Brutal Carcass-ish distortion and a nice warm Opeth clean.. yup I'm striving for the impossible, but I don't mind ruining the crunch stuff in order to get a nice clean - For all the Crunch-y stuff I'll hijack my friends old Marshall half stack... So anyone got some opinions... You say that the v1 preamp is the most dominant, but what about the others?... 
I still haven't figured out the setup of preamp slots though
Any help would be gladly appreciated!

Thanks
Chris


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## Self Bias (Oct 25, 2010)

The one closest to your input jack is v1. The one furthest away, 5th one, is the phase inverter. Kindof know what it does but not really- haha. I've been messing with all sorts of preamp tubes in all positions. Gold pin, Tung-Sol, Sovtek, Elect-harm, etc. The diffs are very subtle. The Ax7s don't really have a huge impact your tone like the power tubes do.
I don't bother with UG. A lot of the postings in that forum reflect more opinion and hearsay than actual experience. Just dicks with laptops, as opposed to people who want to give and get advice pertaining to their pastimes/hobbies.
Someone in a previous post stated that the power tubes have a grade relative to bias regardless of make. My JJs have "21" stamped in the base. I'm pretty sure this indicates the grade, but in what way I don't know. I do know that they are what I will use when it comes time to replace. Try to contact eurotubes, they know buttloads of crap about the Peaveys.


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## cboysen (Oct 25, 2010)

Self Bias said:


> The one closest to your input jack is v1. The one furthest away, 5th one, is the phase inverter. Kindof know what it does but not really- haha. I've been messing with all sorts of preamp tubes in all positions. Gold pin, Tung-Sol, Sovtek, Elect-harm, etc. The diffs are very subtle. The Ax7s don't really have a huge impact your tone like the power tubes do.
> I don't bother with UG. A lot of the postings in that forum reflect more opinion and hearsay than actual experience. Just dicks with laptops, as opposed to people who want to give and get advice pertaining to their pastimes/hobbies.
> Someone in a previous post stated that the power tubes have a grade relative to bias regardless of make. My JJs have "21" stamped in the base. I'm pretty sure this indicates the grade, but in what way I don't know. I do know that they are what I will use when it comes time to replace. Try to contact eurotubes, they know buttloads of crap about the Peaveys.



Oh good idea  I'll send them an e-mail as soon as possible, so just for your own preference sake, are there any tubes I should avoid more than other...reliability / sound?
Although I'm sure eurotubes could answer that question too though


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## Self Bias (Oct 25, 2010)

Actually, I'll contact them A.M. I live in the same town. I'm curious about not only the tube grade thing, but my Bugera as well. It's a 6505 clone that I installed el34s in for kicks. Wanted to see if I could get a doom/sludge sound out of it, as my 5150 hated that stuff. 
I'll give them a jingle and pass info on.


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## cboysen (Dec 27, 2010)

Self Bias said:


> Actually, I'll contact them A.M. I live in the same town. I'm curious about not only the tube grade thing, but my Bugera as well. It's a 6505 clone that I installed el34s in for kicks. Wanted to see if I could get a doom/sludge sound out of it, as my 5150 hated that stuff.
> I'll give them a jingle and pass info on.


Hey Self Bias - Old thread by now *bumpy* *bumpy*
Did you ever get in touch with Eurotubes? 

Marry Christmas btw  - Oh and I just ordered that PPC412 Today.. Hate when food and rent comes in the way of my hobby! Damn you reality.. Can't wait till it arrives though.


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