# Shawn Lane Tone



## includao

What you guys think about Shawn Lane's tone?

I'm have been experimenting with the way he changes the angle of the pick.

Shawn's thumb position meant that the pick was flat against the pad of his index finger. Not on the side like the standard position or Yngwie. With the Yngwie method, a downstroke has the neck side of the pick hitting the string first. So to get the slicing effect, using Shawn's particular method you angle the pick up or using the Yngwie/stardard style angle the pick down.

Example (it's not my picture) (in this case showing a extreme angle):









The result is a smoother attack. 

The advantages of tilting the pick upwards instead of downwards? To me it would seem that the angle of the pick in relation to the strings is more radical this way, which means that there's less resistance from crossing the string while picking. This could very well lead to greater speed and more fluid string crossing (smoothness). Also since the pick "slices through" the string instead of flicking it, *the picking will most likely sound more legato* than it does when picked normally as the string isn't moved so much by the pick.

Then again I can think of one major downside to this mode of picking too, or at least one aspect you'll have work it out and compesate for some how. For one, because the picking sounds more legato this way accenting notes or playing really staccatto will require a slight change in angle and the force.


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## distressed_romeo

Yeah, I've analysed this before. My own default picking style is what you termed the 'Yngwie' approach, although I also use the Steve Morse method, where the pick is at the same angle as Shawn's technique, only held with two fingers (greater projection and string crossing ability at the expense of less speed, and making sweeping virtually impossible). I've found it's perfectly possible to get the 'legato picking' effect you describe using the Yngwie method, with a little experimentation.

Tuck Andress wrote a really detailed article on this. It's a fascinating read.

http://www.tuckandpatti.com/pick-finger_tech.html


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## includao

distressed_romeo said:


> Yeah, I've analysed this before. My own default picking style is what you termed the 'Yngwie' approach, although I also use the Steve Morse method, where the pick is at the same angle as Shawn's technique, only held with two fingers (greater projection and string crossing ability at the expense of less speed, and making sweeping virtually impossible). I've found it's perfectly possible to get the 'legato picking' effect you describe using the Yngwie method, with a little experimentation.
> 
> Tuck Andress wrote a really detailed article on this. It's a fascinating read.
> 
> http://www.tuckandpatti.com/pick-finger_tech.html



That article from Tuck is amazing!
Shawn Lane's picking is a George Benson picking style approach. (its like Benson, but with the floating hand)

They are all based primarily on the oscillatory movement of the wrist.

But what you guys think about Shawn Lane's tone?


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## distressed_romeo

His tone was fucking great. The thing I liked most was that you couldn't really hear the technique in all his licks; by that I mean it didn't sound like picking bit, followed by legato bit, followed by hybrid picking bit. It was all one beautiful, fluid approach.

Only issue with the Tuck article is that it doesn't really deal with the issue of muting when you're playing with a distorted sound...it's all based on playing with a clean jazzy tone. Other than that, it's probably the best analysis I've ever seen on the subject.


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## Durero

That's a fantastic article DR! Thanks for posting that. Definitely food for thought.


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## distressed_romeo

No problems!

Has anyone else noticed that Chris Amott (ex-Arch Enemy) held his pick in the same way as Shawn Lane?


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## includao

distressed_romeo said:


> No problems!
> 
> Has anyone else noticed that Chris Amott (ex-Arch Enemy) held his pick in the same way as Shawn Lane?



Wow, never. Going to check it.


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## distressed_romeo

^You can see it pretty clearly in the video for 'The Immortal'. Actually, he's another guy whose picking sounded much smoother and cleaner than is normal. For comparison's sake, compare his solo in that tune to Michael's, as Michael holds his pick in a more normal way, and so his picking runs have more 'grind'...


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## distressed_romeo

^You can see it pretty clearly in the video for 'The Immortal'. Actually, he's another guy whose picking sounded much smoother and cleaner than is normal. For comparison's sake, compare his solo in that tune to Michael's, as Michael holds his pick in a more normal way, and so his picking runs have more 'grind'...


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## distressed_romeo

^You can see it pretty clearly in the video for 'The Immortal'. Actually, he's another guy whose picking sounded much smoother and cleaner than is normal. For comparison's sake, compare his solo in that tune to Michael's, as Michael holds his pick in a more normal way, and so his picking runs have more 'grind'...


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## Pauly

Woah that was in depth, and also triple post ftw! ^


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## DDDorian

I have an old Guitar Player lesson in which Shawn talks about "one-note-per-string shredding". He mentions that he doesn't particularly like sweeping as the technique brings undue attention to itself and then goes through an example or two of how he might play sweep patterns without sweeping, using hybrid picking or subtle muting.

(for the record, I really don't like his tone at all, at least not on any of the recorded stuff I've heard)


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## includao

DDDorian said:


> I have an old Guitar Player lesson in which Shawn talks about "one-note-per-string shredding". He mentions that he doesn't particularly like sweeping as the technique brings undue attention to itself and then goes through an example or two of how he might play sweep patterns without sweeping, using hybrid picking or subtle muting.
> 
> (for the record, I really don't like his tone at all, at least not on any of the recorded stuff I've heard)



undue attention? tension? i dont get it.

are you going to transcribe what exactly he teachs/says like you have done before with others articles and lessons? Like in the DDDorian's Guitar Lesson/Column DDDirectory?


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## Durero

DDDorian said:


> (for the record, I really don't like his tone at all, at least not on any of the recorded stuff I've heard)


I'm not crazy about his tone on his solo album 'Powers of Ten', but I really like his tone on 'Temporal Analogues of Paradise'. I love pretty much everything I've heard of him playing with Jonas Hellborg(<- is that a metal name or what?)


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## Pauly

includao said:


> undue attention? tension? i dont get it.



What he means is that the actual 'sound' of a sweep itself is very identifiable, to the point where he feels it detracts from the music because you listen and go 'sweep picking!' rather than paying attention to the actual notes. Or something like that.


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## distressed_romeo

Here's an example of the kind of lick DDDorian is talking about...

Incidentally, the ascending version of this arpeggio sounds pretty cool if you substitute the pluck from the middle finger with an upstroke of the pick, Al DiMeola style...


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## kmanick

Vinnie Moore does a lot of that as well, "sequencing" I believe is the term, makes playing arps much more "musical", he's got some great exercises
that focus on this technique on his first instructional video.


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## distressed_romeo

Greg Howe and Michael Romeo do too, although they tend to tap rather than pick patterns like that.


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## includao

Thanks for the file example DD! You are one of the coolest guys from sevenstring.org


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## right_to_rage

I decided to bring this back from the dead because obviously Shawn had a phenomenal picking technique.

My thumb bends backwards like his, and I've been picking in a similar way to him for like 5 years. The only difference is that I don't hold the pick with the pad of i, and the tip of p, but rather the pads of both i and p. Weird.

Also, can anyone give insight into Lane's right hand muting techniques? It kind of looks like he uses his palm and sometimes the front thumb flesh of his hand. Did he use any anchoring?


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## Jongpil Yun

lol @ thread creator's picture. I looked at it and thought it was myself, and figured this was an old thread I made that I didn't recognize. Then I looked at the name. Seriously dude, your hands look like mine.

Anyways, I literally stole my picking technique from Shawn Lane. Around three weeks after I first picked up the guitar I went hunting for videos of people with the best technique I could find. Shawn Lane fit the bill -- I don't think his picking technique has been surpassed yet, from Rusty Cooley to Leandro Lemos or whatever the fuck his name is.

Anyways, my biggest problem with the style is that it's hard to hit pinch harmonics.

Anyways, about that style giving you a more legato sound, I'm not sure. Mine is pretty damn attack-y. 

PS: I actually hate his tone. It lacks differentiation to me.


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## stubhead

> I actually hate his tone. It lacks differentiation to me.



That's heresy around here, boy.... 

I bought the "Paris" DVD and it's not nearly as good as the Hellborg "Indian" CD's. Lane _clicks_ on almost every note - at first I thought it was because his action is so low, but I'm pretty sure it's an electronic artifact of his rack compressor kicking in and out - I can make mine sound that way, but when it's set _wrong_. The faster he plays, the worse it sounds.

I also noticed right away that he seems really disconnected from the rest of the band. There's a point at 10:25 into the first song, "Who Would You Like To Be." Lane is playing sustained notes with brief flurries, with his octave/slowdown echo toys wailing away (neat-o toys, for sure). The band kicks into a doubletime thing, which with Hellborg and Selvaganesh is pretty driving indeed. It's a big fat softball lobbed up for any decent guitarist to _smoke_ - Lane doesn't even _notice_, he just keeps playing the exact same stuff. I keep thinking, what would _McLaughlin_ do with an opportunity like that? Hell, _I_ could play a better solo right then - any guitarist who can play 16th notes could too.

Lane also lights up a cigarette _every time_ somebody else is soloing, which seems insulting - like he can't wait to get out of there and go do something more important. That kind of shit would get you fired from most every band I've ever been in, contempt for your bandmates does _not_ lead to the best playing. You can see from their facial expressions that the Indian musicians are also pretty "impatient" (disgusted?) with Lane's electronic stuff, even though I think it might be cool in a different context where it didn't seem so self-indulgent. The first song of the second set, Lane goes so nutty the Indians and the audience both look like they wish _they_ could leave. I actually like that stuff - who doesn't like to hook three delays together? - but it's sure a disconnect.... Lane might as well have been playing to a click track, maybe he thought those gobs of meat on stage with him _were_ his click track.

I guess Hellborg was impressed enough with Lane's musical talents to put up with his "eccentricities", he just seems to me like a guy who should have stuck to studio work (and he apparently felt the same way). Wearing sunglasses on a dark stage, sitting on a high chair that places him above the rest of the band - even Hellborg looks over at him sometimes like "WTF?" At least the studio albums were great and _Hellborg_ plays great on the DVD - _Guitar Player_ magazine actually picked that DVD as one of the "50 Greatest Guitar DVDs" but they were picking the "best" of Kiss, AC/DC & Queen too - good thing the world allows for different tastes I guess. 

P.S. (Buy the Shakti DVD if you want to hear the _real_ stuff....)


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## DDDorian

^^Heh, well I think "contempt" is a bit too harsh a word, but I generally agree with your post. There was speculation that Lane actually had some sort of condition that affected his nervous system and compelled him to play as fast as he could most of the time; when you consider how haphazard his left hand looks at times, it's not to hard to believe...


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## distressed_romeo

Apparently Lane had gotten bored with the Indian/Western crossover thing towards the end and was looking forward to playing more Jazz-rock stuff in the future...


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## Jongpil Yun

OK well his tone is quite a bit better in his Vigier days, but watching a lot of his instructional videos makes me cringe. I can't stand the way it sounds. When you say he "clicks" on every note, you're talking about his pre-Vigier days too, I think, because I only hear the click on a lot of his lesson videos, but in his performance videos with a Vigier I don't hear it. His vids with what looks like a Charvel also sound better, but whatever.

One of my favorite videos:


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## Luan

I've readed that Shawn could hold the pick that way because of the shape of his thumb or something like that.
Like not everybody will be able to hold it just like him.


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## Jerich

good luck i have spent my whole guitar career since i heard him for the first time at A.I.M...in 87...and still come no where near the man was a Phenom!!!


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## Jongpil Yun

Luan said:


> I've readed that Shawn could hold the pick that way because of the shape of his thumb or something like that.
> Like not everybody will be able to hold it just like him.



Not really. His thumb bends a bit further back than mine, but it's mostly fine.


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## Luan

> All right, well I had a chat with Shawn's old tech and great friend (my teacher), and he explained to me that Shawn's style of holding the pick is only effective when you are extremely double jointed, as Shawn was. For regular jointed people, he said that it is best to use a more standard way.



Taken from Lane's forum.


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## Jongpil Yun

I wouldn't consider myself "double-jointed" at all (whatever that means) but I get pretty much the same pick angle pretty easily.


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## Durero

stubhead said:


> I also noticed right away that he seems really disconnected from the rest of the band...
> Lane also lights up a cigarette _every time_ somebody else is soloing, which seems insulting...


If you haven't heard about Shawn's extreme health problems & suffering I can understand your interpretation of his behavior. You might re-evaluate after reading this interview: ..:: richardhallebeek ::..

[QUOTE="Richard Hallebeck interview with Shawn Lane]:: One thing I was wondering, how's your health? There's many stories circulating but I'd like to hear the real deal from you. 

OK. I've had all my life a skin condition called psoriasis, I have really bad. (shows dry rash on arms and elbows) It's on the elbows and knees, and it's dry and there's no cure. I've had it, it's gotten better, it's gotten worse, but I've had it all my life. Sometimes I've had it so bad that it covered my entire body practically. It's really painful. The only thing you can use for it is Cordizone. But I had it so much over every part of my body and I used Cordizone treatment so much I got Cordizone poison and developed what's called 'cushion syndrome' from too much Cordizone in the body. So I had to stop with all the Cordizone medicins and can't do anything for it. It won't go away it just keeps getting worse and worse. But the cordizone doesn't work, it just temporarily works and it comes back worse even. So it's horrible. But if that was about enough, it's funny because Psoriasis is related to arthritis and there's actually besides ostio arthritis which is just wear and tear for old people and rumatoid arthritis which is your own immune system attacking itself, there is another category called psoriaty arthritis where the prosiasis and arthritis are linked in some way that they don't quite understand. And I always had psoriasis but about 3 ½ , 4 years ago I started getting arthritis really bad. That was first in my knees, where it made it hard to walk and I thought, well, obviously because I'm very heavy it makes it hard to walk and it's harder and so it hurts more and stuff. I could see that maybe if I lost some weight then I could walk better and be OK. But then this arthritis attacked everywhere, all in my hands, my neck, my arms and every bone in my body. I couldn't even move and I had to take lots of pain medicines to try to live.It hasn't really got any better because there's not really a cure for arthritis or psoriasis.All they can do is give some medications that help a little bit but it doesn't really help a lot. And so I have to take pain medicines and I'm sick of my stomach a lot. And if I don't take it, then I just hurt so bad that I can never even leave the bed, I'm just totally crippled, so. I'm in really bad shape. The problem is that in America, there's no health care, national health care.And I never had the money for insurance, so I couldn't even get health care anywhere. I could only go to the charity doctors and then get maybe some more Celebrex or Biox, but no real extreme treatments. Finally, after years of trying I got the state-funded health care. It took a long time and a lot of paper work and I just got that. So now I may be able to get other care, I may be able to treatments that were to expensive before. That could make the arthritis better. Until then, you know, it hurts my playing and my fingers aren't as loose as they used to be. But if I rest a lot and I tour, and I just basically just rest and then show up and play then I'm OK. But stress and other physical functions tire me out and I can't do anything. I can still play concerts and live with it and hopefully it'll get better and I can have a little more stamina. [/QUOTE]


Keep in mind this interview was in 2001, and Shawn's health deteriorated further until his death in 2003 - at the age of 40  . I think it was brave of him to perform at all, considering the extreme pain he was in.


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## stubhead

I hadn't realized that Lane was in so much pain, I know his lungs were bad. I do really understand that chronic pain can change _everything_ - I've already had my neck fused because of spinal problems, and there's nothing good to look forward to - it certainly does redefine your life. I also understand that he lived and breathed improvisation, and that's always a hit-or-miss proposition - when you go out on stage and jump off a cliff every night, you just can't know what's going to happen. Even McLaughlin has his off moments. He played at both the Crossroads Festivals, and in 2004 he never really seemed to connect (to my ear at least). In 2007, he played brilliantly.


(btw, that "vicioustruth" guy on YouTube also downloaded all of Jeff Beck's set from Crossroads 2007 - the good stuff never made it onto the DVD's).

I just think it's kind of a shame that Shawn Lane's only big _video_ performance seems off to me. If you want to hear him play way better, SugarMegs.org has a _killer_ Hellborg-Lane performance with drummer Andrea Marchesini from a private show in Calcutta in 2003. They're playing material off of the "Personae" CD. No clicking tone, and it's much more ROCK - his electronics don't seem so jarring and he's really plugged in to the drummer and Hellborg.
SugarMegs Streaming Server

Just scroll down to Hellborg Lane Marchesini 2003-02-08. 
You can also find another show with the same lineup at:
bt.etree.org | Community Tracker - Details for torrent "Hellborg-Lane-Marchesini 2003-02-21 Tripura House Private Show, Calcutta"


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## includao

Has anyone developed a legato type of sound with Shawn Lane picking technique?


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## vontetzianos

I know that Shawn used a boutique head called a Gjika. Something like the one below






I think that would have helped his tone out. I love his tone, and his setup really allows for a really clean, smooth overdrive. I actually havn't heard the Gjikas other than with Shawn's work but apparently they are amazing amps.


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## ShadyDavey

According to Shawn on his REH Video his amp/pedal set-up was as follows (this is just a list - the exact signal chain is something I haven't been able to pin down).

Unnamed Chorus and Delay
Westbury W20 "The Tube" overdrives. 
Nady Tube Overdrive (based on the above)
4 Holmes "Mississippi Mud" amplifiers in a Delay chain to create his own acoustic environment - the first is in real time, the second is around 10ms after that, followed by 12-13ms and finally 18ms or thereabouts. These amps came with a 4 x 10 enclosure loaded with Celstion G10L-35's. 

He definately also used the Gjika single-ended stereo amp but its a matter of debate as to which amplifier appeared on which track. It seems that Shawn liked the Holmes for Rhythm/clean parts and the Gjika for lead tones. In post Powers of Ten videos he always appeared to play the Holmes live with either the Westbury or Nady pedals for distortion. 

As for guitars - well, I'm sure we've all seen the Charvel 750 XL Fusion (made in '89) as well as the Roland GR 300 Synth guitar (built by Ibanez) and the Ibanez custom-made model based on the neck from the Roland. After that came the ubiquitous Vigier Shawn Lane model - he never used "hot" pickups as he preferred those with an output around that of a PAF Pro. D'addario strings (normally 9's) and Jazz III picks. 

Edit - Shawn also allowed his pick to move somewhat when he wasn't playing fast passages which gave him a more organic sound rather than the relentless pick attack we hear from many guitar players. Sure, he locked it into that "George Benson" style when ripping but there was certainly a deft touch when he wasn't  

Lastly - a massive handful of natural talent and humility


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## Excalibur

includao said:


> Has anyone developed a legato type of sound with Shawn Lane picking technique?


I have, it's hard to people to tell which of my lines, and which ones are legato'd, I'm almost as loose and relaxed as Shawn too, but nowhere near as fast or proficient though.


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## distressed_romeo

The interview where he talks about his gear...


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## ShadyDavey

Thats the one 

I still have no idea what chorus/delays he used...


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## distressed_romeo

He definitely used the Line 6 DL4 later on, but beyond that I'm not sure...


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## ShadyDavey

I know a man I can ask.....will do so tomorrow. I'm going through a bit of a Shawn Lane revival atm and man....I do love his tone. 

I'm GASing for a 750xl as I was lucky enough to play one in '89 but couldn't afford it at the time. I went back after payday and the damn thing had gone never to be seen again but its possibly the nicest 6er I've played if you don't mind archtops and can put up with a reasonably sized neck.


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## Stengah_2012

ShadyDavey said:


> I know a man I can ask.....will do so tomorrow. I'm going through a bit of a Shawn Lane revival atm and man....I do love his tone.
> 
> I'm GASing for a 750xl as I was lucky enough to play one in '89 but couldn't afford it at the time. I went back after payday and the damn thing had gone never to be seen again but its possibly the nicest 6er I've played if you don't mind archtops and can put up with a reasonably sized neck.



I've found a web page that talks about the Charvel 750XL (link), and it states that it had a short scale neck. I'm guessing a 24.75" scale? Can anyone confirm this? 

I'd love to build something similar to this guitar through Warmoth eventually. They're actually quite stunning, I had always though Lane played some sort of Soloist. 

EDIT: I apologize for the thread derail, by the way!


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## Blackrg

yes, They are gibson scale and they rock

The other Jackson?Charvel that has the similar scale is the Fusion

Dont know why companies dont make these superstrats

I have the Warmoth conversion neck myself, and they are great


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## ShadyDavey

Aye, its a 24 3/4" (Gibson) scale and they are indeed bloody gorgeous. They were only a very short production run but I can honestly say that while it is a "dream" guitar the second-hand market really is dodgy as a lot of the examples are fairly well-loved


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## Excalibur

I've got his Guitar on backlist for my 20th birthday present, I'm pretty psyched


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## ShadyDavey

Excalibur said:


> I've got his Guitar on backlist for my 20th birthday present, I'm pretty psyched



The Vigier sig. model?

Very nice indeed - I want one SO badly given how easy they are to play and the fact its almost a perfect 6'er imo (that, or a Parker Fly Mojo).


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## Stengah_2012

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I take it Lane used a 24.75" instrument because of his hands being smaller? At least, compared to guys like Paul Gilbert, for example. 

I've been so wrapped up in longer scale guitars (27"+) because of lower tunings, but a 24.75" scale would make the stretches a hell of a lot easier. It's not a bad idea for me either; my palms are wide, but I have shorter fingers, so a 1-5 fret stretch is my maximum on a 25.5" scale guitar. 

Does anyone know what pickups were used in his Charvel? ShadyDavey, I know in one of your earlier posts in this thread (and the video that was posted) that Lane used lower output PAF style pickups (at least with his Ibanez), but I can't find anything about what his Charvel was loaded with.


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## ShadyDavey

Ah, interesting question Rob - I don't actually know.

Those 750xl's came with Jackson pickups as standard of course, and they're actually quite powerful. They also come with a pickup cover on which Shawn has clearly removed but I have no idea if he kept the standards or switched in something else - he never really seemed to worry that much as long as they weren't too hot so I'd hazard a guess that they're standard. 

I'll look around and see if I can dig anything up. 

As for the scale - yeah, it makes some stretches a little easier but there's not really a massive difference in the size of the frets, I think its simply that with a little lower string tension it feels more comfortable. I've never really thought about it too much as I had both 24 3/4 and 25.5 length guitars but my main was a DC 200 in 24 3/4.

The Vigier's are 25.5 so it might be that he just liked the way they sounded? 

Edit:

Did some digging - the later 750's didn't have pickup covers, but I haven't found much about the actual pickups themselves....*back to searching*...


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## distressed_romeo

Judging by the interviews I've read, it doesn't seem like he was hugely fussy about the specifics of his guitars. It seems like the only consistent element was a totally straight neck and stupidly low action, which I suspect is what attracted him to the Vigiers...

Just looking on the Vigier website as I type this. Apparently the PUs in his sig were Dimarzio Air Classics, but I don't know if that was standard in all his instruments.


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## Blackrg

stubhead said:


> Just scroll down to Hellborg Lane Marchesini 2003-02-08.
> You can also find another show with the same lineup at:
> bt.etree.org | Community Tracker - Details for torrent "Hellborg-Lane-Marchesini 2003-02-21 Tripura House Private Show, Calcutta"



Nice reco Stub.. it's playing now.. really good

Much better playing than the album i have


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## ShadyDavey

distressed_romeo said:


> Judging by the interviews I've read, it doesn't seem like he was hugely fussy about the specifics of his guitars. It seems like the only consistent element was a totally straight neck and stupidly low action, which I suspect is what attracted him to the Vigiers...
> 
> Just looking on the Vigier website as I type this. Apparently the PUs in his sig were Dimarzio Air Classics, but I don't know if that was standard in all his instruments.



Aye, even with his (at the time) brand-new Ibanez he was very vague about pickups - I just don't think he worred too much as you say 

Its all in the fingers


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## Excalibur

ShadyDavey said:


> The Vigier sig. model?
> 
> Very nice indeed - I want one SO badly given how easy they are to play and the fact its almost a perfect 6'er imo (that, or a Parker Fly Mojo).


 The Vigier sig model indeed.


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## ShadyDavey

Excalibur said:


> The Vigier sig model indeed.



I feel I can only express myself with an emoticon:




Or possibly two:


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## justreleased09

`Q1
Q`1Q`1Q11QQ


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## distressed_romeo

justreleased09 said:


> `Q1
> Q`1Q`1Q11QQ



Ummmm...what?


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## ShadyDavey

Still no word on the effects (I suppose it could be from the Profex I know he used a couple of times) but a more comprehensive list of guitars:


Burst strat with BOA.
White strat in the testing vid.
Couple of different LPs.
An SG.
The Jackson Soloist.
The Charvel custom model.
A 7 string black Ibanez.
An Ibanez S series in the guitar player tribute issue.
The Roland guitar.
Various Vigier's
Richard Hallebeek's Brian Moore C90.


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## Stengah_2012

Cool info Dave, thank you. 

I'm obsessing over the Charvel 750XL now. I really, really want some sort of short-scale, mahogany superstrat, and I can't find one short of a custom shop or ordering various parts through Warmoth or other similar companies.


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## ShadyDavey

Its not really a popular choice for many people but I don't really know why. I guess some people are opposed to the short scale?

The only real options are a Carvin (I had a DC200 that was quite awesome and for a little more cash you could with a Mahogany body/ebony board kind of deal) or possibly a Caparison? The Carvin is clearly (at least in the UK) the cheaper option so other than waiting for a 750XL or equivalent to turn up on Ebay I don't know what to suggest.

(I'm fancying the idea of a short scale myself with my damaged digits so I have been looking).

Edit:

Would appear that as far as his Delay/Chorus its going to remain a mystery with the exception of the post-Profex era. Blatant quote from the MM forum:



> ahh yes........ don't forget to mention the Trace Elliot acoustic amps that Shawn can be seen using throught the Vinayakram period in conjunction with the Peavey. Don't forget those. Also don't forget that he didn't OWN any of this gear that you keep listing. He would use whatever was available and lying around, more than likely running the outs of the ProFex straight into the effects returns of any old amp. This is the best way to eliminate excessive eq'ing and preserve the sounds of the patches. These patches can all be heard in the aforementioned AIM video where Shawn makes it perfectly clear that there is no secret weapon pedal or other to his otherworldly sound, other than his otherworldly ears.
> 
> The only other rig that bears mentioning is the Westbury overdrive + Holmes Head. The Gijka is a hi fi stereo head that only amplified the delayed signals sent to the other cabinets Shawn would use to compensate for poor room acoustics. All this is discussed in the Power Licks video.


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## distressed_romeo

What about his compression effects, that's a huge factor in getting his clean tones?


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## ShadyDavey

Yeah, its just down to unamed pedals. I'm doing some more digging but as he really wasn't a gear whore he just tended to use whatever he could get his hands on for the most part (the exceptions being the known guitars/amps etc).

The only other information (again, cut/pasted and thanks to the MM forum):



> Report this post
> Reply with quote
> 
> 
> by *Laedan Kiana* &#187; Thu Jun 05, 2008 11:17 am
> Jeez....shite sure is getting tense around here already without a certain someone we all know and love to hold us together. What i posted was certainly a no shitter Savitri, and it seemed to me you have been around here long enough to remember a certain certified gear nut named Termite Boy who would start a new thread every week about pro-fex II's and shite......anyways ..... maybe i'm wrong bro and i apologize for sounding all mighty and stuff.
> 
> Here ya go...................Assuming everyone already knows about the guitars, the equipment breaks down into two phases.
> 
> POT era
> 
> Holmes mississippi blues master
> Westbury od
> 
> The incredible custom power amps you guys have already mentioned were used strictly for Shawn's "quadraphonics" system which is basically a series of four different delay lines running to seperate amps and cabinets. Shawn never mentioned, that i know of anyway, what type of delay units he was using but i remember the system seemed quite elaborate compared to the next era of his gear.
> 
> Hellborg era
> 
> Peavey Pro-fex II (custom designed for Shawn with special eq curves that simulated the sound of the Holmes amps he had been using up to that time.) Was the main source of everything that you hear from this era. I think Shawn had maybe ten or eleven different presets that he had put together from Background clean to screaming clean sound that almost feedsback it would seem that Shawn was so famous for. Sorry i'm rambling. Point is ....you can't have this piece of gear.....it was custom. So the question is moot........as Jesse Jackson would say.
> 
> He would plug the pro-fex into the effects loop of whatever amps he could borrow or rent for a particular gig which in my opinion lent a certain inconsistency from gig to gig as far as his sound goes. For instance in the Paris dvd you can see that he was plugged into Trace Elliot acoustic amps that were very popular back in the 90's. Could that be why his pick attack is so enhanced on that gig compared to any other i have heard?? Probably. Point is though, he was bypassing all the amps circuitry by plugging the Peavey into the effects loop and probably had a global eq that allowed him to adapt the Pro-fex to whatever different power and speakers he was plugging into in order to preserve the sound of his patches.
> 
> looping.
> 
> early looping was a Lexicon Jamman and later Shawn favored the Line6 delay modellers. 2 or 3 at a time if i remember. He loved the ability to play the loops backward lending the carnatic flavor of certain indian instruments. He would further effect loops with a Digitech ISP33b pitch shifter which was basically Digitechs budget consumer answer to all the hoopla that was being made over Eventide harmonizers back in the day.





> Willys/Willies Era:
> 
> Roland GR 303
> Holmes bluesmaster?
> Westbury OD
> 
> 
> 
> PoT Era
> 
> Gjika amps to record with.
> Strats (I read this someplace)
> Charvel 750XL in lemon-y colour. (jcfonline forum research says solid colour 750XLs may all be basswood, BTW!)
> Ibanez Ghostrider?/Ibanez custom guit
> 
> Live rig, I dunno.
> 
> HLS:
> 
> When was the switch to Vigier? I have seen Willjay posting a pic of bearded, thinner Shawn with the 750XL.
> Vigier Excalibur guitar(s)
> 
> When was the ProEFX unti dominant with the Lane rig?
> Heard rumours he used a POD a few times.
> Not sure what his "stock" rig was.
> 
> "Icon" era
> 
> Custom(?) Vigier guitar, which the Lane signature was based on.
> Loop-y pedals. Rack gear. Must watch PARIS DVD for clues!



Sorry I can't help more - its perhaps one of those questions thats never going to be answered.


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## distressed_romeo

As you said, it seems like he wasn't really that fussy about anything in his rig...

It would almost certainly be more productive to just experiment with settings on your own rig to get his tone, and then examine his technique in great detail!


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## ShadyDavey

Yes, yes it would!!

It just fries my tiny mind somtimes. I mean.....musicality I can dig. Technique I can dig.....Tone I can dig.....all of it, all of the time wipes me out. 

Have you slowed down some of his runs with software? I really want to do a cover of "The Way it has to be" from Tri-tone so I gave it a cursory poke (its only got a couple of quick sections) and the sheer speed isn't so intimidating as exactly what he plays. The melodic ideas, the tone....as well as his vibrato and feel.....there are about 20 seconds of fast licks in a 4:39 song but man.....they're just fabulous.

His tone does remind me of Eric Johnson's in places - the way it seems to breath and react under picking whilst retaining warmth and clarity. I think that a decent tube amp and pedal could be made to work quite nicely


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## Excalibur

If anyone wants me to post an indepth analysis of Shawn Lane's picking, just ask


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## vontetzianos

Excalibur said:


> If anyone wants me to post an indepth analysis of Shawn Lane's picking, just ask


 
Please do.


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## ShadyDavey

vontetzianos said:


> Please do.



I'd be interested to see an indepth analysis beyond the stuff Troy Grady has done (as well as the other links from this thread) - would be cool 

I spoke to WJ about Chorus/Delay pedals and he's admitted to being no expert (even while he does have a million, million clips) so I'm going to hit up the Memphis Monster forum for any info that they might have.


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## distressed_romeo

ShadyDavey said:


> I'd be interested to see an indepth analysis beyond the stuff Troy Grady has done (as well as the other links from this thread) - would be cool
> 
> I spoke to WJ about Chorus/Delay pedals and he's admitted to being no expert (even while he does have a million, million clips) so I'm going to hit up the Memphis Monster forum for any info that they might have.



Troy Grady needs to get his fucking film finished!


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## SnowfaLL

Woah thats odd.. I also pick on an angle like that, altho over the past year ive been trying to fix it and pick flat to the strings, cause I feel it hinders my upward sweeps, the pick misses the strings sometimes.. and I dunno.

I think I actually learned this method from Metallica in the early days, i read that James tilted his pick on a 45 degree angle, to get this more "chuggier" attack on power chords, rather than the standard metal style.. and since it was my first year of playing, the habbit was formed.. Its neat to know that someone as proficient as Lane also did this, so maybe there is hope for me to not have to correct it.


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## Dusty201087

Oh god, sorry to bump this topic, Lane is just one of my heros and I've never noticed how he picked until now! Very interesting. I've been noodling for about an hour with it and, damn, once you get used to it it really seems to make a difference. I'm not double jointed, but I have crazy hitchhikers thumb, so while I don't do near as an extreme angle as Shawn I can still get that angle. Very helpful/informative topic, I entend on experimenting with this style a lot . 

On a side note, does anyone know if Lane used economy or alt picking? I'm sure he could shread circles around most using both though 

And I would love to see the in-depth of his picking 



ShadyDavey said:


> The Vigier's are 25.5 so it might be that he just liked the way they sounded?



I think the Vigier signatures (at least the one on their website) is a "24.8" scale, rather than 25.5". I know I've never heard a LOT of tonal difference between a 24 3/4 and a 25.5, it was probably more for the huge stretches he did, which would help a bit. I'd be all over the idea but I can't even play a 24th fret until about a 27" scale, I have fatass fingers 

One last thing about him lighting up when others are soloing, the dude was a BIGTIME chain smoker. He probably couldn't really help it. I've never played in a band before, but I don't really see how getting a cig out and lighting up would be that bad when someone else has the center stage


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## ShadyDavey

Yeah, I know the Sig's are 24.8" but typed 25.5" for some reason - go figure  

I think the slightly smaller scale length was simply a factor due to the slightly lower string tension and commensurately smaller stretches (even if both were only marginal) and the fact that at that point in his career he really was suffering from reduced ability as a result of his arthritis.

He used alternate picking predominantly, although there are a few places where he used economy.


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## Dusty201087

ShadyDavey said:


> Yeah, I know the Sig's are 24.8" but typed 25.5" for some reason - go figure
> 
> I think the slightly smaller scale length was simply a factor due to the slightly lower string tension and commensurately smaller stretches (even if both were only marginal) and the fact that at that point in his career he really was suffering from reduced ability as a result of his arthritis.
> 
> He used alternate picking predominantly, although there are a few places where he used economy.



Yeah I'd imagine the shorter scale the better when you had arthritis as bad as he did  

And sweet. I don't think I'm going to switch over to this picking style full time, but I definitely will experiment more with it  Good topic!


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## ShadyDavey

Check out his video's if you can dude, they're definately worth watching even just to cop a few licks from


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## freepower

Massive Shawn Lane nut checking in... got 4.3GB of Lane sitting on the hard-drive as we speak.



> His tone was fucking great. The thing I liked most was that you couldn't really hear the technique in all his licks; by that I mean it didn't sound like picking bit, followed by legato bit, followed by hybrid picking bit. It was all one beautiful, fluid approach.



I'd say this is a lot to do with the fact that he didn't really think as a guitarist - he heard Bird, he used those licks, he heard Franz Liszt, he used those licks... whichever instrument he was on. He was a sick, sick, sick keyboard player, and a mean drummer.



> Have you slowed down some of his runs with software? I really want to do a cover of "The Way it has to be" from Tri-tone so I gave it a cursory poke (its only got a couple of quick sections) and the sheer speed isn't so intimidating as exactly what he plays. The melodic ideas, the tone....as well as his vibrato and feel.....there are about 20 seconds of fast licks in a 4:39 song but man.....they're just fabulous.



He has that wonderful Holdsworthian thing where you could kill for the ideas he throws away, eh? Seriously though - the changes he could follow and the ideas he PHRASED at speed...

I mean, way up there at like, 16nps or so, everyone else is playing sequenced major scales or sweep licks... and Shawn's outlining chord substitutions and legato saxophone lines. Absolutely mind boggling. 



> His tone does remind me of Eric Johnson's in places - the way it seems to breath and react under picking whilst retaining warmth and clarity. I think that a decent tube amp and pedal could be made to work quite nicely



Interestingly, EJ and Shawn really dug each other, you'll hear the cliffs of dover lick all through Shawn's improv and EJ was influenced a fair bit by Shawn's approach to pentatonics - similarities all over the place if you look - even in their rhythm playing.



> I bought the "Paris" DVD and it's not nearly as good as the Hellborg "Indian" CD's. Lane _clicks_ on almost every note - at first I thought it was because his action is so low, but I'm pretty sure it's an electronic artifact of his rack compressor kicking in and out - I can make mine sound that way, but when it's set _wrong_. The faster he plays, the worse it sounds.



I did wonder about that as well - Shawn had some pretty weird tone preferences but whatever he was aiming for with that sound I don't get it.



> Lane also lights up a cigarette _every time_ somebody else is soloing, which seems insulting - like he can't wait to get out of there and go do something more important. That kind of shit would get you fired from most every band I've ever been in, contempt for your bandmates does _not_ lead to the best playing. You can see from their facial expressions that the Indian musicians are also pretty "impatient" (disgusted?) with Lane's electronic stuff, even though I think it might be cool in a different context where it didn't seem so self-indulgent. The first song of the second set, Lane goes so nutty the Indians and the audience both look like they wish _they_ could leave. I actually like that stuff - who doesn't like to hook three delays together? - but it's sure a disconnect.... Lane might as well have been playing to a click track, maybe he thought those gobs of meat on stage with him _were_ his click track.



Thats actually my favourite guitar solo ever, just goes to show how subjective music is - he always talked about the primal connections between blues and indian trad and I see that as his defining musical statement of his ideas.



> Wearing sunglasses on a dark stage, sitting on a high chair that places him above the rest of the band - even Hellborg looks over at him sometimes like "WTF?"



I would guess that the whole sunglasses/hat thing was to do with self-image. Who wants to be a young, brilliant musician trapped in a bloated, dying body? God forbid I said that (and indeed, don't on the MM forums, as his family still read the posts there), but Shawn had a rough, rough hand dealt to him and he coped better than I would have. 

As for the chair - well, he couldn't really stand. Honest to God.

And the smoking I don't see the problem with. If I was playing with 4 other musicians who could hold the stage single handed I'd probably leave them that much space as well.

That said, totally dug your post btw. 



> If anyone wants me to post an indepth analysis of Shawn Lane's picking, just ask



Go on, I'll correct your mistakes, padawan. I'll answer a few quickies...



> Also, can anyone give insight into Lane's right hand muting techniques? It kind of looks like he uses his palm and sometimes the front thumb flesh of his hand. Did he use any anchoring?



He mutes with the palm and then it's pretty much all left hand muting. The guys left hand muting skills are ridiculous.

As for anchoring, never on electric guitar, although I've seen him briefly pinky-anchor on his little acoustic travel-guitar.



> All right, well I had a chat with Shawn's old tech and great friend (my teacher), and he explained to me that Shawn's style of holding the pick is only effective when you are extremely double jointed, as Shawn was. For regular jointed people, he said that it is best to use a more standard way.



I'll totally +1 that. Shawn had crazy rubber hands - for most people, trying to copy his picking technique will just end up with extra tension and that's not good at all. Unless you can get his picking angle completely loose you're better off with a simpler Paul Gilbert hold, which I think is probably the most universally useful picking style.

I actually had a pupil a few years back with hands as flexible as Shawn... we'll see where he ends up, eh?


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## cyril v

impressive bump. i must've missed this a bunch of times. thanks


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## includao

i have normal thumbs and i can do the same benson picking technique without any undue tension. 


the problem is not with the THUMB. the pick position changes the ATTACK ANGLE. the attack angle make you concentrate yourself from movements of the wrist


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## toneslinger

Hello toneslinger here I can add some to this discussion.

After shawn had passed I had done alot of research on his sound his equipment ect,
I found the guys who programmed the profex for shawn one of them being the guy
who actually built shawns holmes heads he had moved from holmes to peavey
after holmes stopped...

After finding these guys and asking permission from Diane Shawns Mom and
getting the green light from her I was fortunate to work with the original settings.

These were sealed from the public after I found them and tracked these guys down
at Dianes request..
She asked that I not make those public and I wont but I can answer some questions here about delay and chorus and compression.

The profex 2 units have all that built in.
The delay times and overdrive settings were included in the basic patches.

There were two basic patches one 3 band eq one 4 band.
Inititally I surmised those might be pedal steel patches
even checked those against the pedal steel and hair band patches peavey
released from the factory...

none were close !

Keep in mind the guys that programmed this unit for Shawn worked at peavey one of which had worked for Holmes before this.

I even tracked down the speaker source and spoke with the man 
whos grandfather delivered those speakers to Holmes and Peavey.

He had no idea his grand dad had delivered any speakers to Holmes 
until his grand dad confirmed that for us.

Back to the programming of the profex ..

They basically captured the frequency curve of the Holmes westbury combination 
and loaded that into the profex 2.

The settings are so complex you could set 1000 people down with the same units
and say have at it and none would get them correct.

I programmed a unit for the Lane family and sent them that including
the settings I had to figure out which were not included.

compression chorus reverb ect.

I noted Shawn used valve verbs for reverb
they sounded great and better than whats built in to the profex 2 settings.

I dont have those so I used what was inside the profex 2.

What I can say is the signal chain is most important
ie where things are placed in the chain and it makes a huge difference 
in the sound if verb is before or after delay ect.

I cant share the settings nor wont as I promised the family I would not do that.

I can just say that the compression and chorus are built in and 
you indeed can find the settings with experimentation.

Thats how I found what I consider to be the closest efx settings..

The trans fex pro heads peavey came out with have same ram card
but longer delays and better verbs.

You can add 7 efx together on those and you cant do that on the profex 2

Which is why I feel he used different verbs not only for sound sake but
to free up space in the profex 2.

I kinda of combined the best delay times I have which I copped from Eric Johnson
who Ive known for about 32 years now.

So some of the settings Ive made have hybrid efx settings...

Some are as close as I can get to Shawns original recordings...
Its taken several years to do that.

Working at it daily for along time....

The best clues I can give are these.

experiment with placement of efx ie what goes first in chain.

Most all of the settings are there minus the eq stuff which 
I can say are the most complex settings and Id never have come close to those
without help.

But just as Shawn said there are many many sounds in there and if you take the time
you can get about any sound you want...

They are in there and you can find them but it takes hours and hours of tweaking and using your ears...

There is the lesson I learned even having the basic settings
I still had to go song by song and figure delay times and efx
placement ect to HEAR what sounded spot on to me.

Most of the profex 2 units are being hoarded by pedal steel players
cause Buddy Emmons uses them.

I thought woah wonder if they are pedal steel settings ?
So I went line by line comparing..

None were even close and none of the hair band settings were close either.

This makes sense as the guys cloned shawns holmes head and pedal
together and they were after that sound not pedal steel or hair band sounds.

But I can assure you all none were close and I did go through each one
even other pedal steel settings made by others and none came close.

What I can say is with these settings any guitar sounds awesome
to prove that I took my least favorite guitars that sounded not so great
and played them through this unit.

Behold great sound great tones never before heard from those guitars.
Even noticed that the tone knobs REALLY worked on these guitars and made
a huge difference where as before nothing helped them.

I feel besides Shawns great touch and feel and photographic memory
this is key to why any guitar sounds fantastic through this unit.

There are some mods you can do to those units 
one battery less mod and brown burr chip mods.

I did those for all my profex units and heads.
So I wont ever loose those settings once programmed in.

You can back those to a card as well....
make sure the card has a fresh 5 year battery before you even start though
as those all go out too and thats why.

Anyway I thought Id share what I can here to those seeking the same as I was.
It can indeed all be found within the profex 2 or even better transfex pro heads.

Though I wont ever play like Shawn did I at least can get in the ball park of that tone
which in my opinion is the best I have ever played and heard.

I own 3 68 plexi 100s one of which was Ejs for 16 years we traded heads.
I own 2 twins A quinn dumble 150 watt head 4 holmes heads with 2 holmes 4 10 cabs.

So I had quite a bit to compare too..
I owned a bogner 100b and a two rock custom reverb.
Swore Id never ever sell the bogner...

The profex 2 and transfex pro heads ate it alive 
same with that two rock..

I sold them both.

I did side by side ab comparisons with both amps and
sold them both that day.

I have never had better tone in my life and Ive been chasing it since 
1978 when I first heard and saw and met Ej.

For those who think solid state sucks and you cant get great tone from solid state
you would be real shocked to know you can.

The only tubes in this system are the preamp tubes in the westbury pedals !

The rest is solid state ..

No one was more shocked than me and I have those tube amps
and they sit silent as investments now.

So chorus compression and some of the delay he used was built right into the profex 2
the verbs he used valve verb units by peavey.

Later he used 3 line 6 delays ..
But one thing was consistent in all of Shawns rigs..

The peavey profex 2

Even Bob gjika told me Shawn ran some preamp before his
preamp power amp setup.

He said it was some crappy peavey thing and had no idea why on earth shawn used that 
and refused not to ever stop using it.

Bobs amps are amazing but I played them and they did not sound like shawn or ej.
This was when Shawn was alive I worked at an amp company in Austin.

Bob said oh Shawn puts his own tubes in them and thats why they sound like they do and I dont know which kind so I cant help you.

That was true He did retube them..

What Bob and most others missed was that preamp !

What was consistent throughout Shawns life ?
Holmes mud amps with westbury tube pedals.

What did they clone for him at peavey in the crappy preamp as Bob put it ?

Holmes mud amps and the westbury tube pedal.

Why didnt Bobs amps sound like Shawn straight in ?

Because he did not have Shawns preamp to make them do 
as he said.

I know I have played Bobs amps and though he makes beautiful amps
none that I played sounded anything like Shawns.

I hope this clears some things up..

No one can or will ever replace Shawn though and I gave my word
id never share the specifics or the exact settings as those are private
and sealed from the public...

I wont do that either as I gave my word I wont.

The answers are right there before you all inside the profex 2.

You have to spend hours with it to find them..

I spent 2 years with mine ...

Take the time you can get very close if you do.

Hope this helps 

peace


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## BlackMetalVenom

I was never interested in anyone else's tone really, or Shawn's for that matter.
But damn sir if your post isn't helpful and informative. +1 
I think everyone is going to go off and gas for some delay, chorus, and reverb pedals.


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## toneslinger

BlackMetalVenom said:


> I was never interested in anyone else's tone really, or Shawn's for that matter.
> But damn sir if your post isn't helpful and informative. +1
> I think everyone is going to go off and gas for some delay, chorus, and reverb pedals.




Well Im sure everyone has what they are looking for by now 
Sorry for long post cant explain with less really..

I was always searching for different tones Ej Shawn ect
wont make me play any better but it helps inspire me
to be better.

Life is indeed too short to not have good tone.


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## amfahim

Excalibur said:


> If anyone wants me to post an indepth analysis of Shawn Lane's picking, just ask


 

Sorry to pick up this topic once more, but I am a Lane fanatic and new to the forum, so I would LOVE to see the indepth analysis!

thanks in advance!


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## ShadyDavey

You might have to PM the dude, not sure how often he visits SS.org these days but I know he mod's on UG so that might be the place to ask


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## freepower

I'm the mod on UG, he's banned. 

Plus, having done a seriously in depth look at Shawn's picking - he's not doing that much unusual apart from the backwards angle, he's just much, much better than most people. 

If you want to get started take a look at this vid and take a look at Shawn (the close ups of the right hand in Power Licks are especially helpful) -


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## amfahim

Oh ok. Thanks both shadey and freepower, I do have both power licks and power solos and am trying to change my normal right hand technique to something like him, but it's taking a lot breaking down my existing method of so long. Now that I am trying to follow this particular bent thumb style, I am noticing quite a few other greats have the same style as well. Just noticed Steve Vai has a pretty bent thumb, although he doesn't angle the pick upwards. Any thoughts?


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## freepower

To be honest, unless your hands are flexible enough to do the bent back thumb thing comfortably, I think it's a bad idea. If it happens naturally (a lot of people can easily hyperextend their thumbs  ) then it's really not a huge deal, it certainly won't make you better than just angling the "normal" way, it's just another way of cutting through the strings a little easier. 

A few other guys that do it are George Benson and Tosin Abasi, both very, very nifty players.


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## ShadyDavey

freepower said:


> To be honest, unless your hands are flexible enough to do the bent back thumb thing comfortably, I think it's a bad idea. If it happens naturally (a lot of people can easily hyperextend their thumbs  ) then it's really not a huge deal, it certainly won't make you better than just angling the "normal" way, it's just another way of cutting through the strings a little easier.
> 
> A few other guys that do it are George Benson and Tosin Abasi, both very, very nifty players.



Ah, there you are! 

Yeah, absolutely +1 on the above. Trying to perform with the bent thumb style only causes massive tension if you're not physiologically disposed towards it - I found it slowed me down quite significantly compared to "Vanilla" style.


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## suffo20

includao said:


> What you guys think about Shawn Lane's tone?
> 
> I'm have been experimenting with the way he changes the angle of the pick.
> 
> Shawn's thumb position meant that the pick was flat against the pad of his index finger. Not on the side like the standard position or Yngwie. With the Yngwie method, a downstroke has the neck side of the pick hitting the string first. So to get the slicing effect, using Shawn's particular method you angle the pick up or using the Yngwie/stardard style angle the pick down.
> 
> Example (it's not my picture) (in this case showing a extreme angle):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The result is a smoother attack.
> 
> The advantages of tilting the pick upwards instead of downwards? To me it would seem that the angle of the pick in relation to the strings is more radical this way, which means that there's less resistance from crossing the string while picking. This could very well lead to greater speed and more fluid string crossing (smoothness). Also since the pick "slices through" the string instead of flicking it, *the picking will most likely sound more legato* than it does when picked normally as the string isn't moved so much by the pick.
> 
> Then again I can think of one major downside to this mode of picking too, or at least one aspect you'll have work it out and compesate for some how. For one, because the picking sounds more legato this way accenting notes or playing really staccatto will require a slight change in angle and the force.




The top photo is how I hold my pick exactly. I have tried to tilt my pick the other way and play normally but I just cant do it cause I have been holding my pick that way for so many years. For me..I had to learn to really relax my picking hand holding it this way because if I tense up too much then I start to push my force of the grip of the pick back into my thumb and it causes my muscle between my thumb and first finger to swell so much that I end up losing the control of the pick and cant pick right. But I have learned to relax it alot.


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## marshall law

Just to confirm from shawn lane himself on the REH power licks video, shawn used Dimarzio PAF pro's in both the charvel 750xl as well as the ibanez. the ibanez's PAF pro was a air version which dimarzio only made for him but you can mod any PAF pro yourself by removing the metal screw retainers and leaving a gap between the magnets edge and polepieces.
His vigiers came with Dimarzio air classics.


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## Emperor Guillotine

^^^ Congrats on necrobumping this thread after 3-4 years, man... -.-
Nady TD-1, anyone?


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## marshall law

Emperor Guillotine said:


> ^^^ Congrats on necrobumping this thread after 3-4 years, man... -.-
> Nady TD-1, anyone?



so you are saying the info is outdated and not usable?


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## coffeeflush

Anyone uses his augmented fourths tuning ? 
Is it comfortable ? What string gauges do you use ?


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## pawel

marshall law said:


> so you are saying the info is outdated and not usable?



A big benefit is finding out that the original photo in the OP is mine 

I have tried picking like this for a bit, but never had the speed and accuracy to fully benefit from it and given that it did not work with my hybrid picking, I ended up dropping it.


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