# Peavey 6505+ or Engl Powerball?



## 1metalman1 (Mar 1, 2008)

I don't know which one to get. I am unable to try any of these amps out so i will have to rely on your experience. I am in a death metal band and want an amp that can deliver an aggresive distortion but also retain clarity at high volumes. Thanks for any help.


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## zimbloth (Mar 1, 2008)

I'd take the Peavey 6505. If you're looking for aggression and brutality you'd definitely want the 6505 over the 6505+. I've owned the Powerball, I just found it was really clinical and processed sounding for my liking. I like the 6505/5150 a lot more, it's warmer yet also more aggressive. If you're in a death metal band I know you'd be happy with the 6505, assuming you paired it with a good cab.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Mar 1, 2008)

5150 > Powerball
Savage 120 > both


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## Jagw (Mar 1, 2008)

I think both will do the job for what you want. If you just want aggressive distortion, the 6505 will do the job. But the Powerball can deliver that with good cleans and a bit more versatility.

Basically, if you're happy with balls-to-the-wall heaviness... get the 6505. If you want something that can do that, and more.... get the powerball.


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## angryman (Mar 2, 2008)

zimbloth said:


> I'd take the Peavey 6505. If you're looking for aggression and brutality you'd definitely want the 6505 over the 6505+. I've owned the Powerball, I just found it was really clinical and processed sounding for my liking. I like the 6505/5150 a lot more, it's warmer yet also more aggressive. If you're in a death metal band I know you'd be happy with the 6505, assuming you paired it with a good cab.


 

+1
I own a MkI 5150 & fancied something different so I tried the powerball & despite the cleans, it doesn't really do anything the 5150/6505 doesn't already do better IMHO it is a cool amp & looks metal as fuck but it does sound very clinical compared to the 5150's very open & organic brutal tone.
If you're still interesred in an Engl i'd say check out a Fireball, they sound alot more brutal & organic than the powerball to me.
I'm actually looking at buying a Fireball myself.


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## Nightcrawler (Mar 2, 2008)

Yeah, 5150 does that 5150 tone and does it really well. The other guitar player in my band has one, and his midrange used to be thicker than mine, but with a few tweeks it became comparable. The powerball however, has more defined low end, definately more versatile, with the clean/crunch/2lead channels and two master volumes, the tone manipulation is all there. 5150 is cheaper though, and depending what you're meaning to use it for could be of better value. 
I really gotta check out some other Engls amps though to give a better opinion, none around these parts though.


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## loktide (Mar 2, 2008)

apples and oranges

both amps have different features and have a different sound character. Powerball has (good and usable) cleans, the 5150 doesn't. 

i would say the powerball is more modern and compressed, whereas the 5150 is pure metal rawness. Both can be heavy as fuck. If you can't decide, then get the 5150 because it's cheaper. If you want something in between, i would give the fireball a try. It's less compressed and more raw sounding than the powerball and still has great cleans.

edit: seeing you're from wales, the price difference may not be that high.


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## Groff (Mar 2, 2008)

zimbloth said:


> I'd take the Peavey 6505. If you're looking for aggression and brutality you'd definitely want the 6505 over the 6505+



Really?

I've only played the 6505+ and did find it to be lacking a TINY bit of gain, granted I did have the gain down a smidge, it got a little too saturated when I turned the gain up... Putting a bloody murder in front of it made it perfect... How does it differ from the 6505/5150? Because I've been looking into this amp.


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## Apophis (Mar 2, 2008)

Personally I like Engl batter, but it's matter of taste


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## Codyyy (Mar 2, 2008)

Apophis said:


> Personally I like Engl batter, but it's matter of taste



I would like to eat a cake made from this ENGL batter


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## Lucky Seven (Mar 2, 2008)

Codyyy said:


> I would like to eat a cake made from this ENGL batter



Angle food cake? ENGL = Engel = Angel


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## zimbloth (Mar 2, 2008)

TheMissing said:


> Really?
> 
> I've only played the 6505+ and did find it to be lacking a TINY bit of gain, granted I did have the gain down a smidge, it got a little too saturated when I turned the gain up... Putting a bloody murder in front of it made it perfect... How does it differ from the 6505/5150? Because I've been looking into this amp.



The 6505+ isn't lacking in gain. That's not what I was getting at. Both have loads of gain, but the regular 5150/6505 has a more aggressive, raw, in-your-face nature to it, while the 5150 II/6505+ is a little more smooth and polished, not as brutal or aggressive. The gain is comparable, but gain is not what gives the amp it's character. The "brutality" that is associated with the 5150 has to do with it's midrange character mainly. The 5150 II/6505+ is just a little more scooped sounding, not as raw.

Both are really nice amps, but anyone looking the heaviest, most brutal Peavey - the 5150/6505 is it.


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## noodles (Mar 2, 2008)

^ 

There is no finer example of this than Soilwork's "Predator's Portrait". That is the quintessential 5150, with that aggressive upper midrange grind. The 5150 II just doesn't have that character at all, which actually makes it a much better hard rock amp.


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## warlock7strEMG (Mar 2, 2008)

zimbloth said:


> The 5150 II/6505+ is just a little more scooped sounding, not as raw.




more scooped? really? i found that they were actually had more emphasis on the mids than the regular 5150/6505, could have just been me though as i have never played the 2 side by side to compare. but yeah the II/+ is definately smoother in a way and not as raw for sure


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## noodles (Mar 2, 2008)

warlock7strEMG said:


> more scooped? really? i found that they were actually had more emphasis on the mids than the regular 5150/6505, but yeah definately smoother and not as raw for sure



In my experience, the 5150 has more mids. Those mids just happen to be extremely focused, the same way that ceramic magnet pickups have more mids than alnico magnet pickups, yet sound scooped because the mids are all focused in the upper end of the midrange.


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## zimbloth (Mar 2, 2008)

warlock7strEMG said:


> more scooped? really? i found that they were actually had more emphasis on the mids than the regular 5150/6505, could have just been me though as i have never played the 2 side by side to compare. but yeah the II/+ is definately smoother in a way and not as raw for sure



Yeah, trust me both are good amps, but the 5150 has a much more aggressive, in-your-face sound than the 5150 II. Really I stand behind what I made in my last post, and I agree with Noodles mostly as well 

The bottom line is, both amps can get the job done, but if someone is looking for the best Peavey possible for extreme metal stylings, the 5150/6505 is the way to go. For a more polished version without all the aggressive midrange grind, the 5150 II/6505+ is a good option.


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## 1metalman1 (Mar 3, 2008)

I am probably going to get the Peavey 6505. As this would be my first valve amp then i can only compare it to what i have already, a marshall MGDFX250 with an eq and uber metal pedal in front. So i would probably think the valve amp is ten times better. In time when i have listened to/played many valve amps then i would be able to make a better discision. It will do for now, lol. 

P.S i'm going to get a Vader 4X12 straight back cab to go with the Peavey.


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## Groff (Mar 3, 2008)

zimbloth said:


> The 6505+ isn't lacking in gain. That's not what I was getting at. Both have loads of gain, but the regular 5150/6505 has a more aggressive, raw, in-your-face nature to it, while the 5150 II/6505+ is a little more smooth and polished, not as brutal or aggressive. The gain is comparable, but gain is not what gives the amp it's character. The "brutality" that is associated with the 5150 has to do with it's midrange character mainly. The 5150 II/6505+ is just a little more scooped sounding, not as raw.
> 
> Both are really nice amps, but anyone looking the heaviest, most brutal Peavey - the 5150/6505 is it.



Interesting. I haven't gotten a chance to play a 6505/5150, only the + model. I'll have to check it out. Although, a big turn off is that it doesn't have seperate EQ's for the clean and distortion channel, which I need, as i'm not balls out all the time on the overdrive channel. My cleans are eq'd quite differently on my current amp.


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## nordhauser06 (Mar 3, 2008)

Engl > 6505*+*. If you're going down the Peavey route, get a real 5150. 

Edit: Better?


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## zimbloth (Mar 3, 2008)

nordhauser06 said:


> Engl > 6505. If you're going down the Peavey route, get a real 5150.



Dude the 5150 and 6505 are identical. Come on man


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## nordhauser06 (Mar 3, 2008)




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## noodles (Mar 3, 2008)

1metalman1 said:


> I am probably going to get the Peavey 6505. As this would be my first valve amp then i can only compare it to what i have already, a marshall MGDFX250 with an eq and uber metal pedal in front. So i would probably think the valve amp is ten times better. In time when i have listened to/played many valve amps then i would be able to make a better discision. It will do for now, lol.



Do yourself a favor and pick up a Tung Sol 12AX7 for V1, and an overdrive pedal. Pick up a Bloody Murder from Joe, or if you don't have that much money, a used TS7, and send it to him to mod when you have more cash. I can't stress enough how important that overdrive pedal is.


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## JMad81 (Mar 3, 2008)

I had a 5150 and then picked up a powerball. After trying the PB out I immediately sold the 5150. Its way tighter and is way more versatile. 5150s/6505s are brutal amps though. I just think the ENGL is much better, than again, it costs a lot more too. You gotta know to really boost the mids with a PB though. Its a scooped sounding amp so you gotta put mids in and it cuts fine.


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## Groff (Mar 4, 2008)

noodles said:


> Do yourself a favor and pick up a Tung Sol 12AX7 for V1, and an overdrive pedal. Pick up a Bloody Murder from Joe, or if you don't have that much money, a used TS7, and send it to him to mod when you have more cash. I can't stress enough how important that overdrive pedal is.



That's pretty much the golden rule(s) right there.


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## Nick (Mar 4, 2008)

Powerball - Zyklon

5150/6505 - Old machinehead (like them or not, the tone on the more things change was IMO the embodiement of what a 5150 does)


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## Brord (Mar 4, 2008)

Get the 5150 (6505) it stomps all over the powerball imho. It's way more agressive, thick, in your face, unpolished, it has loads of RAW power to it. 
The shared eq (which -in my opinion- is one of the nicest eq's to work with btw) isn't that much of a problem, I quite like it, the tone of the clean channel matches the one of the lead channel really good this way. If u play some clean passages the clean on the 5150 will be just fine. Btw, the powerball's clean isn't that great either.... yes, it's really clean but also cold, lifeless and sterile. I would pick the 5150 over the powerball anyday of the week in about every setting.


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## Groff (Mar 4, 2008)

Brord said:


> The shared eq (which -in my opinion- is one of the nicest eq's to work with btw)



 When I was playing on the 6505+ I was quite amazed at how the EQ knobs reacted with one another.


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## Brord (Mar 4, 2008)

Yeah those are pretty cool to work with, not hard to dial in at all... like the complete opposite of rectifiers hahaha.

In my opinion THIS: YouTube - The Haunted - Bury Your Dead is exactly what a 5150 sounds/should sound like.


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## JMad81 (Mar 4, 2008)

Brord said:


> Get the 5150 (6505) it stomps all over the powerball imho. It's way more agressive, thick, in your face, unpolished, it has loads of RAW power to it.
> The shared eq (which -in my opinion- is one of the nicest eq's to work with btw) isn't that much of a problem, I quite like it, the tone of the clean channel matches the one of the lead channel really good this way. If u play some clean passages the clean on the 5150 will be just fine. Btw, the powerball's clean isn't that great either.... yes, it's really clean but also cold, lifeless and sterile. I would pick the 5150 over the powerball anyday of the week in about every setting.



The cleans on my old 5150 were god awful at stage volume and I love my powerball cleans.


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## Stitch (Mar 4, 2008)

nordhauser06 said:


> Engl > 6505. If you're going down the Peavey route, get a real 5150.



Idiot.



zimbloth said:


> Dude the 5150 and 6505 are identical. Come on man







JMad81 said:


> The cleans on my old 5150 were god awful at stage volume and I love my powerball cleans.



In its defense, the 5150/6505 doesn't pretend to have a clean channel. It's entitled "Rhythm" and should be used as such.

If you want sparkly cleans then get a telecaster and a Blackface


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## nordhauser06 (Mar 4, 2008)

Stitch said:


> Idiot.



Thought the kid was referencing to the 5150 II.


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## Groff (Mar 4, 2008)

nordhauser06 said:


> Thought the kid was referencing to the 5150 II/6505+.



Fixed. 

Does anyone know how much one a 5150/6505 weighs? Just curious, my B52 is quite heavy.


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## Stitch (Mar 4, 2008)

Peavey.com said:


> * 120 watts (rms) into 16, 8, or 4 ohms (switchable)
> * Five 12AX7 preamp tubes and four 6L6GC power amp tubes
> * High and low gain inputs
> * 2-channel preamp switchable on front panel or remote footswitch
> ...



Not sure if that means lbs or kg's, but I'd assume lb's since Americans insist in using stupid weight standards.


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## nordhauser06 (Mar 4, 2008)

I just don't understand why we havn't switched to the metric system yet.


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## Groff (Mar 4, 2008)

Stitch said:


> Not sure if that means lbs or kg's, but I'd assume lb's since Americans insist in using stupid weight standards.



Hmmm... Yeah, It's a little lighter. The B52 is a monster to carry. And yeah, our measurement system sucks...



nordhauser06 said:


> I just don't understand why we havn't switched to the metric system yet.



While the metric system is MUCH easier to interpret (especially true for anyone who has ever sifted through a drawer full of sockets and wrenches...) I think there are too many idiots in this country to make a smooth transition. Plus just how many cars are on the road today with MPH only?


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## John_Strychnine (Mar 4, 2008)

TheMissing said:


> Hmmm... Yeah, It's a little lighter. The B52 is a monster to carry. And yeah, our measurement system sucks...
> 
> 
> 
> While the metric system is MUCH easier to interpret (especially true for anyone who has ever sifted through a drawer full of sockets and wrenches...) *I think there are too many idiots in this country to make a smooth transition.* Plus just how many cars are on the road today with MPH only?


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## ibznorange (Mar 4, 2008)

TheMissing said:


> While the metric system is MUCH easier to interpret (especially true for anyone who has ever sifted through a drawer full of sockets and wrenches...) I think there are too many idiots in this country to make a smooth transition.


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## Groff (Mar 4, 2008)

It's the truth, think of how many people would think gas prices skyrocketed becuase they didn't understand that a L is smaller than a Gal... It's not like people read the friggin' newspaper anymore. There was a story the other day where people in Ohio thought Obama was muslim and didn't know the national anthem... WATCH THE GODDAMN NEWS!

...Now back on topic...

I'm glad this thread exists, I've been seriously considering a 6505/+, especially with the price point it's at. This answers a lot of my questions.


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## 1metalman1 (Mar 4, 2008)

Should just get the 6505 rather than the 6505+. The reason i was thinking about getting the + model was because it allows eq control on lead and rhythm channels. But as there isn't really a clean channel then i could just use the volume pot on my guitar to get a clean tone on the less ditorted channel. I would save a few hundred £'s, if i got the 6505.


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## Brord (Mar 5, 2008)

1metalman1 said:


> Should just get the 6505 rather than the 6505+. The reason i was thinking about getting the + model was because it allows eq control on lead and rhythm channels. But as there isn't really a clean channel then i could just use the volume pot on my guitar to get a clean tone on the less ditorted channel. I would save a few hundred £'s, if i got the 6505.



well there is some sort of clean channel on both the 5150 (6505) as well as the 5150 II (6505+)

5150: 
rythm= clean and crunch, u have to select either of those options on the amp itself by pushing a button (not footswitchable, unless u mod it) it also has a bright button on this channel. The clean gives u a good enough clean when u play metal, the crunch can give u easily enough gain to play death metal.

lead= no push buttons for any options, this is your lead channel (obviously) this is where u get that sick 5150 tone u hear on most records.

Most people use the rythm channel with the crunch button NOT engaged (this gives u the clean sound) and the gain set pretty low, but u could also use it as another distorted channel so u have two gain channels which are footswitchable. U can footswitch between the rythm (crunch engaged or not, it's own prefference) and lead channel.

5150II:
Also a rythm and a lead channel BUT. 
Rythm= this also has the bright and crunch button but this time u CAN switch with ur footswitch between clean and crunch.

lead= same options as 5150 but people say it's less brutal. I have no experience with the 5150 II but I do know the 5150 slays.

The 5150 II has seperate eq's for rythm and lead channel. The 5150 only has one, both for rythm and lead channel.

That about sums it up.
Both the 5150 as well as the 5150II are way more versitile then they get credit for...


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## 7 Dying Trees (Mar 5, 2008)

6505/5150 is a great amp, i love mine, although there's one or two things you need/can do:

- Retube it. This is a must. Go to eurotubes and get one of their 5150 retube kits, enough people here recommend the tung sol as well, so that'll be worth doing. 

- You can go two ways, either one for a bias modded or non-bias modded. If you get a new 6505 it'll not have the bias mod, this is an aftermakrket thing.

- Bias mod it. This isn't too hard for a tech with a diagram to do, it basically stops the amp being biased cold, but then again, you may like that anyway!

- If you really need a seperate eq for the cleans, buy an eq pedal and put it in the loop. It'll allow you to have a different EQ on the clean channel. Or just get a g-major or something for all your effects and put it in the loop, and use the relay jack on the g-major to switch the amp.

As for the powerball, i can't comment.


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## 1metalman1 (Mar 5, 2008)

I think i'm defo gonna get the 6505 over the + model. I will be using the lead channel most of the time anyway. We may have songs in the future that require the clean channel but for now i don'really need it. I will have to have more info on where to get bias kits and all that mod stuff thats just been said. I'm a tube amp and mod newbie.


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## 7 Dying Trees (Mar 5, 2008)

Actually, I really quite like the rythm channel cranked up as well, so if you're not even using cleans, well...


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## 7 Dying Trees (Mar 5, 2008)

1metalman1 said:


> I think i'm defo gonna get the 6505 over the + model. I will be using the lead channel most of the time anyway. We may have songs in the future that require the clean channel but for now i don'really need it. I will have to have more info on where to get bias kits and all that mod stuff thats just been said. I'm a tube amp and mod newbie.


Bias kits? THe bias mod is a solder job inside the amp. You can buy the retube + bias probe from eurotubes, but if you are toitally new, then I'd get a tech to take care of all that stuff, as, well, screwing about next to 4-500V plate platages isn't exactly good for your health if it goes wrong...


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## Brord (Mar 5, 2008)

1metalman1 said:


> I think i'm defo gonna get the 6505 over the + model. I will be using the lead channel most of the time anyway. We may have songs in the future that require the clean channel but for now i don'really need it. I will have to have more info on where to get bias kits and all that mod stuff thats just been said. I'm a tube amp and mod newbie.



Yeah def go with the 6505, the clean on it will be just fine! U could use the extra cash to invest in a nice cab (I have good experience with a recto cab, but Vader should be great also) and perhaps a boost of some sort (or emg's/blackouts, actives go GREAT with this amp).


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## budda (Mar 5, 2008)

I myself live by seperate EQ's, so i'd need the 5150II/6505+.

and dont let anyone tell you it can only do metal. a retube and a bias helps ANY amp. boosting it with a JoBo pedal will put a grin on your face, fact of life. i know both those have been mentioned, but i felt like reminding everyone 

enjoy the new amp.


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## Stitch (Mar 5, 2008)

THe II/+ models contain an extra preamp tube that cleans up the whole signal path, allowing for a genuine clean channel, in case anyone is wondering.


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## christpuncher66 (Oct 5, 2009)

ive never heard or seen an engl in person, but id say that the 5150/6505 is clearer at high volumes than the 5150ii/6506+


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## Vstro (Oct 5, 2009)

loktide said:


> apples and oranges
> 
> both amps have different features and have a different sound character. Powerball has (good and usable) cleans, the 5150 doesn't.
> 
> ...


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## AbaddonHammer (Oct 5, 2009)

I'd say go with the 6505 with a quality noise gate (if you dont already have one), specifically an ISP Decimator, they work wonderfully.

You really cant go wrong with them based on your description of what you want. As long as you have a quality pickup that is clear and not muddy, the 6505 will nail your sound requirments pretty damn well.


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## Rick (Oct 5, 2009)

I'd say this is a year and a half old thread.


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## K-Roll (Oct 5, 2009)

Rick said:


> I'd say this is a year and a half old thread.



nice.. I own a 6505+ with Tung Sol in V1 and JJ as the rest with a matched JJ quad in th poweramp section. It is a bit better, than with those stock Rubys it came with. 
But what I wanted to point out is, that I really do not think 5150 equals 6505 and 5150II equals 6505+ even if many say so (and Peavey as well). My technician who made a 'surgery' on the amp said, that nowdays, peavey uses cheaper parts and different transformators, than it used to. And you can really feel it under your hand, that there is some lifeless sound going out of those new machines it jsut does not play OK I' say.. I am still thinking of selling my 6505+ and getting an old 5150 mk1, which I hope will make a difference IMHO.


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## Leuchty (Oct 5, 2009)

Check the date of the thread people!!!


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## Samer (Oct 5, 2009)

Going to throw my opinion out there now: 

I have owned a 5150, and a 6505+ as well as an ENGL POWERBALL v2

IMO the ENGL is better for tight metal and cleans, the 5150 is better for RAW aggressive stuff but i had a hard time getting it tight.

Both amps are good, and i would recommend picking them both up if you can, but over all if i had to pick one i would go with the POWERBALL, it has the exact tone i am looking for (Bulb / Meshuggah / Zero Hour) tightness and minimal noise.


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## Mattnh79 (Dec 18, 2009)

5150 iii, 3 independant channels, clean, rythym, and lead, and all have independant eq's


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## Insightibanez (Jan 19, 2010)

I got an ENgl Powerball with Z5 pedal for sale if interested. Hit me up [email protected] if your interested


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## primerib (Jan 22, 2010)

to the OP: I've had both the Powerball v2 and the 6505+. I still have the 6505+.

(dammit, just noticed this thread was recently "revived")


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## Johnology (Feb 7, 2010)

I've been considering between these two as well, the 6505+/Powerball, so far the only thing i have decided is that i don't need the plus since the cleans on the 6505 is pants anyway, but i really need a versatile amp with good cleans so i think i'm leaning towards the powerball.


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## budda (Feb 7, 2010)

tip: go make a thread, instead of bumping this ancient one


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## leonardo7 (Feb 7, 2010)

Dammit. I just read the entire thread and just realized this is a very old thread. Sucks.  I wanted to ask that since the 5150/6505 is clearly more raw sounding than the ii/+ where does the iii fit in? More like the ii/+ or 5150/6505?


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