# The BRJ Black Friday Thread (Only for updates for/by customers.)[Ad Free]



## aslsmm

hey guys, so im sure im not the only one who popped a bonner up to the chin when informed of the black friday bernie rico jr sale. 

I wanna here what other ss members ordered. heres mine. with a pic! haha suck it!
















so this is the basic out line of what it will look like. 

it is going to be a gun metal grey finish (up charge) 7 string with a set of bkp burnt chrome miracle mans. 

also the fret board will be blank. and there wont be a trem. 
specs
27 fretts
26 3/16 scale
hip shot
neck through
vixen

well come on guys out with the guitar details.

im looking at getting this around april or may-ish.


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## geofreesun

mine:
hesperian 727
27 frets
25.5 scale
hip shot
maple neck through
flame maple top
dimarzio LqFire and CrLab
1 volume with splits


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## Evil7

Thats nice! 
I plan to send him and other great builders Info / presskit of my band when we are finished recording our album in a professional studio. We will be shopping our music to labels, so I thought why not shop around for great endorsements as well! 

Congrats! I really like his guitars!


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## Isan

Hesperian 727 Slant 
27 frets
26 1/3 scale
hip shot
maple neck through
quilt maple top
DiMarzio LiquiFire and CrunchLab


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## teqnick

Got a deposit down on a hesperian slant. Final specs will be kept under wraps though 

All i can say is.. It will be the dopest dope i've ever smoked. Ever smoked.


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## AvantGuardian

I put down a deposit for a Hesperian sixer. Bernie was very accommodating of a couple of little customizations that I asked for. Super excited about this epic deal!


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## ev1ltwin

this is such a sick sale that i can't take part of because i have to pay off an engagement ring and save for a wedding. i must be doing it wrong.

i'll just have to keep saving for a strictly 7 next year. i'm really jealous of you guys


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## aslsmm

^^ dude killer avatar


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## ev1ltwin

aslsmm said:


> ^^ dude killer avatar



lol thanks. my photobucket is filled with gems.

i'm a maryland grad, and i'm having trouble determining if a duck or a turtle is a shittier mascot. i'm gonna go with duck, but at least your football team doesnt suck.


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## aiur55

Hesperian Slant 
24 frets
26 1/3 scale
hip shot
maple neck through
flame maple top
DiMarzio LiquiFire and CrunchLab direct mount, non slant mounted

I wonder if I should go for the headstock with the extra little spike, it looks pretty cool.

So excited, I want to be cyrogenically frozen until the guitar is ready to be shipped  driving me NUTS


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## killertone

Got a Hesperian 7 on the way. Exact specs under wraps. Gonna be one of the sickest 7's this place has ever seen.


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## msalazar

Payed my deposit yesterday, Hesperian 7 flame top, all mahogony, 26 3/16. I can't wait.


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## Hollowway

aiur55 said:


> I wonder if I should go for the headstock with the extra little spike, it looks pretty cool.



You mean the Diva HS? That's not a bad idea. I might have to do that as well....


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## Cancer

Isan said:


> Hesperian 727 Slant
> 27 frets
> 26 1/3 scale
> hip shot
> mahogany neck through
> quilt maple top
> DiMarzio LiquiFire and CrunchLab


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## joaocunha

Burnt chrome covers will fit great with that paint job.


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## noob_pwn

My 3rd rico order, the other 2 are just about to ship


Body Shape: Jekyll Slant Top
Number of Stings: 6
Headstock Style: Reversed Inline 
Top Wood Selection: Quilted maple cap
Head Sock Plate Wood Selection: Matching Cap
Color/Finish: Hand Oiled Finish on back, custom &#8220;cognac&#8221; stain on top 
Neck Construction: Neck Thru 
Neck Material Wood Selection: Maple
Body Wings Wood Selection: Mahogany
Bridge Type: Schaller Hannes
Nut Type: Hand Carved Bone
Nut Width: same as last 2
Pickup Routes: 2 humbucker direct mount
Fretboard: Ebony
Fretboard Inlay: offset dot abalone inlays (no extra charge, as told by bernie)
Fretboard Radius: same as last 2
Frets -Total Frets 27 (Dunlop 6100)
Scale Length: 26 3/16" 
Headstock Binding: None
Neck Binding: Ebony
Body Binding: None
Pickup Brand: bareknuckle customer supplied (probably C-pig bridge/rebel yell neck)
Tuners: Grover Locking Mini
Hardware Color: Black 
Strap Pin/Buttons: Dunlop flushmount Strap Buttons
String Gauge: 12-60 cleartone
Tuning: Drop Ab


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## Invader

Mine will be a Hesperian Slant Top 725 with 26 1/3" scale and the Crunch Lab / Liquifire combo. I'm trying to decide between the mahogany neck vs. maple neck...

Also, some of you are talking about going with the Diva headstock. Is it an option? I've been thinking about it as well, and was under the impression that it's too late for those kind of changes to be made?


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## aslsmm

well i think that since bernie got way more responses then he projected, that he decided to go "what the hell" and do some orders that are more complicated. he sounds like a hell of a guy, he knows he can get 3000 a pop but he is giving all of us such a great deal. he is probablly going to make a lot of money from this as well. this is just a win win. i stayed up all night youtubing brj guitars and reading reviews and interviews with bernie. im stoked.


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## Isan

I just want to give everyone the heads-up. 


I haven't asked him yet, but it is VERY likely that if you were not in the first 5 orders of each model, then you will not be getting these in February, but later. So don't start bitching if this is the case!


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## ryanoddi

Made a deposit for a Hesperian 727
Flame maple top (possibly with blackburst edges, haven't decided on that yet though)
Maple neckthru
Mahogany wings
Hipshot
Bare Knuckle Painkillers w/ black cover
26 1/3 scale
27 frets
no fret markers (aside from the top)

I wasn't planning on getting another guitar for another year or so, but I couldn't pass this deal up! Guess I'm gonna have to wait a little longer to get my Axe FX Ultra... fuck it, who needs a savings account! lol


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## aslsmm

i told him that mine can wait till june if it needs to. im in no hurry.


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## AvantGuardian

Isan said:


> I just want to give everyone the heads-up.
> 
> 
> I haven't asked him yet, but it is VERY likely that if you were not in the first 5 orders of each model, then you will not be getting these in February, but later. So don't start bitching if this is the case!


 
Yeah, I know he mentioned a 90-120 day build time for the additional orders in the BF thread. Sounds pretty ambitious to me, but I'm sure there are some economies of scale to be realized when building a bunch of very similar guitars. For the time being, I'm optimistic and hoping for the best, but its not like my life will be ruined if I don't get my guitar in the estimated time frame.


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## Isan

I hope march at latest which still means first quarter next year i will


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## ev1ltwin

ignore my earlier post about not having money to put down a deposit because i'm saving for a wedding. my fiancee actually encouraged me to spring for a 7 string hesperian. this is why she's my fiancee.

i put down my deposit earlier today, and i'm gonna hammer out the specs with Bernie next week. so fuckin boosted


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## Hollowway

I have an 827 with 2 pups and flamed maple going. I was considering getting that wicked violet stain, but I think I'll keep it natural. (I have a custom Jekyll on order that will have a top stain, so this'll be different.)

For those of you who have orders in but are keeping the specs under wraps, why not let everyone know what they are? I appreciate the suspense, but if you've got a good idea some of the rest of us might benefit.


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## Invader

Hollowway said:


> For those of you who have orders in but are keeping the specs under wraps, why not let everyone know what they are? I appreciate the suspense, but if you've got a good idea some of the rest of us might benefit.




+1

I'd love to get a stain going on with the top and headstock, so if anyone has specd something along those lines, sharing the upcharge and other stuff would be nice. I know I could just ask Bernie, but I know he's getting a ton of emails at the moment and I'd rather not bother him with every little detail.


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## abstract

Wha? I...didn't....know...about...this... FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

...not that I have money anyway. But still. Refer to previous rage bellow.

Edit: Ah, here we are.


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## ev1ltwin

my specs are gonna be as follows:

727
mahogany neck
natural flame maple cap
2 pickups (not sure if i want to keep the LF/CL or go PK neck/C-bomb bridge)
26 3/16" scale

and the stuff i'm not sure about: 

i think i'm gonna go with 2 volumes (no tone), each with a push/pull for series/parallel, and a 3 way switch. 

i dont know about the different neck profiles offered, but my ideal profile would be a D-shape about 19mm at 1st to 21mm at 12th (pretty close to the profile for a an esp m-ii bolt-on or an ibanez rg1527).

as i posted earlier, i'll know more next week when i actually hammer out the details. cheers!


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## aslsmm

i actually changed my specs with bernie. 
i thought that the hesperian and vixen were the only two body shapes he is willing to do, and because i hate thin guitar bodies i went with the vixen cause it has more bulk, BUT (there are no cats in america....haha, i love fivel) he said he could do a jekyll body wich is more wide then the hesperian body, so i'm going 
jekyll body-no upcharge
OFR- 250 upcharge
gun metal grey paint job on the body neck and head stock- 350 upcharge.
and thats about it. im waiting to hear back on weather or not i'll get a break on the paint job if i provide my own pups. i realize im getting such a good deal as it is but i figured id ask.


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## Prydogga

Darn, still no email from Bernie, and now I know that Jekylls are on the table. :/ Oh well. Maybe next time (I know he said no next time, but I can hope.)


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## aslsmm

you can call him. or just send him a DP. he probably just hasn't got to you email yet.


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## Hollowway

aslsmm said:


> i actually changed my specs with bernie.
> i thought that the hesperian and vixen were the only two body shapes he is willing to do, and because i hate thin guitar bodies i went with the vixen cause it has more bulk, BUT (there are no cats in america....haha, i love fivel) he said he could do a jekyll body wich is more wide then the hesperian body, so i'm going
> jekyll body-no upcharge
> OFR- 250 upcharge
> gun metal grey paint job on the body neck and head stock- 350 upcharge.
> and thats about it. im waiting to hear back on weather or not i'll get a break on the paint job if i provide my own pups. i realize im getting such a good deal as it is but i figured id ask.



You mean a thicker body? I figured an OFR wouldn't be possible with the thin body. I'm definitely thinking about a Jekyll now too! But only if he can do that slant top, because I love that.


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## NeoTheMaggot

I'm with Asismm, i'm in no hurry to get my guitar i just cannot wait for it to get here but i'm still willing to wait. Also i can't wait to see pictures of everybody's guitars from this deal. from the sounds of things, there should be some pretty epic guitars coming soon.


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## Hollowway

So I emailed Bernie as well, but he said no dice to the Jekyll body. Sounds like you got a one time deal, aslsmm! It's cool with me, though, because I really want the thinness, and they're remarkably similar anyway. I also asked about a Kahler, but it's a $475 upgrade, and would require the body to be not as curved on the face, so I'm not going that route (see what I did there? ). I really want to keep that curved body look.


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## noob_pwn

Prydogga said:


> Darn, still no email from Bernie, and now I know that Jekylls are on the table. :/ Oh well. Maybe next time (I know he said no next time, but I can hope.)



He'll get back to you man, he's just been fucking smashed by so many orders because of this sale it's not funny

The poor guy has been getting up at 4am to try and reply to everyone's emails while he's been having thanksgiving with his family, and building guitars. Send him another one or give him a phone call and leave a message is my advice, your email may have slipped through because of the sheer volume he's had in the last few days


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## Might-is-Right

I went with Hesperian 8 string, two pu's, flame top with a dark stain (TBD later). Hopefully I got in fast enough to be in the first group of 15 if not I'll live but damn I cant wait to get my fat little hands on that thing!


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## Hollowway

Might-is-Right said:


> I went with Hesperian 8 string, two pu's, flame top with a dark stain (TBD later). Hopefully I got in fast enough to be in the first group of 15 if not I'll live but damn I cant wait to get my fat little hands on that thing!


Did you do an actual stained top or just a darker oil finish? Another one of us was doing the darker oil.


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## Joeywilson

I'm hopefullly putting my deposit down pretty quick!

I'm so stoked, I've wanted a Rico forever. This is gonna rule the hardest: 27 frets, dimarzio crunchlab and liquifire pickups, hipshot bridge, and it's a rico Jr. Thats everything I need in a guitar.


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## aslsmm

lucky me. i asked on the phone and he said it was cool. actually he said that the jekyll and the hesperian were the same except for thickness and the curved top. maybe i misunderstood him. either way he is the shit. he was way cool.


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## SpaceDock

I got in on this too!

Hesperian Slim 627 
Black Burst on Quilted Maple
2 Duncan pickups 
Original Floyd 
Glow in the Dark Side Markers

Now the wait begins....


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## Emperoff

Here's what I ordered! This is my first custom and I'm excited as hell! 

Body Shape: Hesperian Slant Top
Number of Strings: (7)
Headstock Style: Reversed Inline
Top Wood Selection: (Quilted Maple cap)

Head Sock Plate Wood Selection: Matching Cap
Color/Finish: Hand Oiled Finish (with trans black/purple burst top)
Neck Material Wood Selection: (maple)

Body Wings Wood Selection: Mahogany
Bridge Type: HipShot
Pickup Routes: (Two pickups)
Fretboard: (maple fretboard)
Fretboard Inlay: None, side dot markers only
Fretboard Radius: 20"
Frets - (total 24 frets) (Dunlop 6100)
Scale Length: (26 3/16")

Something like this, but with the hesperian shape, Hipshot brdige and no pickup rings:


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## Invader

I'm probably going with something like this:





I'm still undecided whether to leave the maple natural or have a stain going on under the clear and burst.

I also noticed that these guitars as standard will come with ebony fretboard binding. I wonder what maple or flamed maple binding would look like with the ebony board...

My specs otherwise are:


Body Shape: Hesperian Slant Top
Number of Strings: 7
Headstock Style: Reversed Inline
Top Wood Selection: Quilted Maple cap

Head Sock Plate Wood Selection: Matching Cap
Color/Finish: Hand Oiled Finish on the back and sides, burst + possibly a stain on the top and headstock face
Neck Material Wood Selection: Mahogany

Body Wings Wood Selection: Mahogany
Bridge Type: HipShot
Pickup Routes: Bridge and neck
Fretboard: Ebony
Fretboard Inlay: None
Side markers: Regular dots
Fretboard Radius: 20"
Frets - 27
Scale Length: 26 3/16"


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## Hollowway

Dang, those are nice finishes on those! I'm still on the fence about flame/oil vs quilt/stain. The oiled finish looks super cool, but those two examples are pretty killer too.


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## Invader

My example pic only has black burst and clear coat on natural maple. Bernie told me that this would be a 350$ upcharge.


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## Hollowway

Invader said:


> My example pic only has black burst and clear coat on natural maple. Bernie told me that this would be a 350$ upcharge.



Yeah, the paint/stain upcharge is $350. I just gotta decide if I like that better or totally natural better.


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## Might-is-Right

Hollowway said:


> Did you do an actual stained top or just a darker oil finish? Another one of us was doing the darker oil.



Still working that out with Bernie, I'll shoot you the pics we talked about later in the week. Bernie said he would have them to me by wednesday.

I gotta say though that 350 upcharge for that burst is looking pretty sweet!


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## Emperoff

Bernie will do any kind of finish as he told me. Depending on what you want the upcharge will vary from 300$ to 500$. Looks like stained tops run for 350$ as people seem to get the same amount.


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## kruneh

I have an 8 string on order.
Think I might even be in the first batch 
However, I haven´t done much else than the original specs with mine, but I´ve spent more and more time thinking about a stained quilted top.
I have a couple of pics somewhere of some awesome finishes from Bernie. 
Gotta talk to him about it when he´s ready for it.

One other thing I´m not sure about is the slanted neck pickup.
Time will tell I guess.


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## NeoTheMaggot

I asked bernie about the slanted pick up too. my order will be only be 24 frets(which is quite alright with me) but the neck pup will not be slanted which i find much more appealing. Other than that i haven't don't much to mine either because i think the base models are incredibly sexual they way they are.


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## ryanoddi

I asked him for a quote on a blackburst (around the edge of the body) and he said it'd be $350. While keeping the natural finish on the inside


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## thrsher

i got an order in as well. for a 6 string since i put a deposit on the kxk fanned 7 and already have an order for an 8 with jim lewis. 
mahogany neck
black burst edges with a dark stain on the top
27 in scale! everything else standard!


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## killertone

Hollowway said:


> For those of you who have orders in but are keeping the specs under wraps, why not let everyone know what they are? I appreciate the suspense, but if you've got a good idea some of the rest of us might benefit.



Ok, ok. 

Mine will Have the following: 

Body Shape: Hesperian Slant Top
Number of Strings: 7
Headstock Style: Reversed Inline 
Top Wood Selection: Quilted Maple
Head Stock Plate Wood Selection: Matching quilt maple cap
Color/Finish: Hand Oiled Finish
Neck Construction: Neck Thru 
Neck Material Wood Selection: Mahogany
Body Wings Wood Selection: Mahogany
Bridge Type: String thru body with TOM bridge
Nut Type: Hand Carved Bone
Neck profile: Shredder
Pickup Routes: two humbuckers
Controls: 1 volume, 3 way toggle pickup selector
Fretboard: Ebony
Fretboard Inlay: None, side dot markers only
Fretboard Radius: 20"
Frets -Total Frets 24 (Dunlop 6100)
Scale Length: 25.5"
Headstock Binding: None
Neck Binding: Ebony
Body Binding: None
Pickup Brand: BKP Aftermath 7 
Tuners: Grover Locking Mini
Hardware Color: Black 
Strap Pin/Buttons: Dunlop Strap Buttons
String Gauge: 10-56 
Tuning: BEADGBE


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## ev1ltwin

killertone, do you know how much the upgrade for BKPs is? 

I put a deposit down for a hesperian 7, and I'm wondering whether I should keep the LF/CL combo or do a PK neck/C-Bomb Bridge. I am gonna do a mahogany neck with 26 3/16" scale so I can dabble in both AEADGBE and BEADGBE. I'm thinking 10-59 gauge. 

I've heard great things about the LF/CL, but there are so many BKP fanboys that post here, that it's tough not to over-analyze and second guess myself. Any thoughts are appreciated


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## aiur55

ev1ltwin said:


> killertone, do you know how much the upgrade for BKPs is?
> 
> I've heard great things about the LF/CL, but there are so many BKP fanboys that post here, that it's tough not to over-analyze and second guess myself. Any thoughts are appreciated




I too would love to know.

And for those that were wondering before, the diva headstock is a go!


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## elq

I ordered a 6. Mahogany body and wings. flamed top. plain old oil finish. I will be sending a painkiller and a q-tuner to Bernie.


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## killertone

ev1ltwin said:


> killertone, do you know how much the upgrade for BKPs is?
> 
> I put a deposit down for a hesperian 7, and I'm wondering whether I should keep the LF/CL combo or do a PK neck/C-Bomb Bridge. I am gonna do a mahogany neck with 26 3/16" scale so I can dabble in both AEADGBE and BEADGBE. I'm thinking 10-59 gauge.
> 
> I've heard great things about the LF/CL, but there are so many BKP fanboys that post here, that it's tough not to over-analyze and second guess myself. Any thoughts are appreciated



I asked Bernie about doing an Aftermath bridge and a Duncan '59 neck and he told me it was a $175 upcharge. I may end up sending him a '59 that I already have and getting the Aftermath and sending it to him as well. I have a while before he is ready for the pups!


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## ev1ltwin

killertone said:


> I asked Bernie about doing an Aftermath bridge and a Duncan '59 neck and he told me it was a $175 upcharge. I may end up sending him a '59 that I already have and getting the Aftermath and sending it to him as well. I have a while before he is ready for the pups!



Thanks for the info man. I think it would make more sense just to get it with the LF/CL. If I dont like em, I can always sell em and get some different pups. 

I'm having a hard time waiting for Bernie to email me inquiring about my spec preferences. How am I gonna last 4 months?!


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## kruneh

I ordered an 8 with two BK pickups.
All mahogany, even though maple might be a better choice for an 8 string. 
Quilted top with a stain I still haven´t decided what will be, but I´m close..
Ebony board, reverse inline headstock and pretty much like what were offered in the sale ad.


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## AvantGuardian

I ordered a Hesperian 6, maple neck, mahogany wings. Bernie said a birdseye maple fretboard and 26 3/16" scale would be no problem. Haven't thought much about pickups yet, but I'm sure I have a little time to figure that out.


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## toiletstand

I'm having trouble deciding on an upgraded finish :/


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## NeoTheMaggot

anyone else already loosing sleep over the wait for these too?


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## Isan

lol


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## technomancer

NeoTheMaggot said:


> anyone else already loosing sleep over the wait for these too?



If so you're in sad shape and REALLY shouldn't have ordered a custom as you're in for your own personal hell


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## NeoTheMaggot

lol i have no problem waiting because it'll be well worth it but god damn i am so excited.


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## aiur55

I just pretend I didn't order the guitar, but every time this thread pops up under "new threads"...i get nutty.


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## NeoTheMaggot

that is what i should do, just make myself think i missed this once in a lifetime opportunity and just be mad at myself. But honestly working for the money to pay for it is going to be incredibly gratifying.


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## toiletstand

a lot of my excitement comes from this being the first guitar that i don't own second hand.


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## yacker

My one bit of advice for those of you who haven't decided on pickups is to be very up front with Bernie about your intentions/indecisions. From my own conversations with Bernie about my custom which has been in the works for a long, long time I've gathered that he does a different route for each brand of pickup. The covered BKP's especially require their own special route. 

So I wouldn't rush to your email to let him know or anything, since these will take a while to complete, but last minute changes that require Bernie to reroute pickup cavities will just cause more headaches for him. For those of you who think you may want to change out pickups later, you have to keep in mind they may require some routing work and I don't know if that's what you want to have done to your high end Rico guitar.

Just some advice from someone with some first hand experience on the subject.


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## Hollowway

tltstand said:


> I'm having trouble deciding on an upgraded finish :/



Me too. I'd like the wicked violet that he does (on the quilted maple), but for $350 savings, the oil finish on the flame looks damned nice, too.


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## teqnick

Deciding on a finish, and either flame or quilt was very tough. Everything he does looks phenomenal! I'm way more at ease now that everything is finalized though. It's safe to say that I can forget I even have a custom guitar in the works


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## Invader

I chose quilted maple so I'm practically stuck with at least the black burst since I don't really like bare quilted maple. 

Does anyone happen to have any pics of guitars with maple/flamed maple neck binding on them? I'm thinking black burst + faux binding on the body and flamed maple binding on the neck would be a pretty sweet looking combination.


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## Jexey

8 string, 2 pups (inquired today as to whether I could get aftermaths) and flamed maple. 

Other than that keeping it stock.
Outstandingly excited. I cannot wait for the NGD's to start pouring in.


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## Hollowway

Well, I switched to a quilted maple top after seeing this:
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/138105-bernie-rico-jrs.html

I emailed Bernie to ask if that was a standard oil finish or what, and he said it was. That's a pretty sweet looking axe, no?


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## kmanick

Hollowway said:


> Well, I switched to a quilted maple top after seeing this:
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/138105-bernie-rico-jrs.html
> 
> I emailed Bernie to ask if that was a standard oil finish or what, and he said it was. That's a pretty sweet looking axe, no?


 
isn't that his "Trans Natural"
I'm so jealous of all you guys I would've loved to grab one of these too.
for all of you asking about the CR/LF combo.
My hesperian is all mahogany too and I have this set in there.
It works pretty well, I liked the LF right from the start but wasn't too sure about the CL, but it's 
growing on me, it's a Ceramic magnet bridge PUp which I haven't used in a long time , I got used to
Alnico's in the bridge so i had to "re-EQ" a little bit, but I like it now. 
It's super tight and very defined, a little 'thin" sounding for playing lead but not bad.
I'm probably going to throw either a Rebel yell or a Nailbomb in there at some point, but you guys should 
try them for yourselves before paying an upcharge for something you may not even need . 
if you're more of a rhythm player thna a led player you'll probably love it.
Oh and I'd go with a quilt over a flame, Bernie's quilts look absolutely amazing in person.


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## ev1ltwin

kmanick said:


> isn't that his "Trans Natural"
> I'm so jealous of all you guys I would've loved to grab one of these too.
> for all of you asking about the CR/LF combo.
> My hesperian is all mahogany too and I have this set in there.
> It works pretty well, I liked the LF right from the start but wasn't too sure about the CL, but it's
> growing on me, it's a Ceramic magnet bridge PUp which I haven't used in a long time , I got used to
> Alnico's in the bridge so i had to "re-EQ" a little bit, but I like it now.
> It's super tight and very defined, a little 'thin" sounding for playing lead but not bad.
> I'm probably going to throw either a Rebel yell or a Nailbomb in there at some point, but you guys should
> try them for yourselves before paying an upcharge for something you may not even need .
> if you're more of a rhythm player thna a led player you'll probably love it.
> Oh and I'd go with a quilt over a flame, Bernie's quilts look absolutely amazing in person.



thanks for all the useful info! Originally I had wanted flame maple, then after the thread Hollowway referenced, I was sure I wanted quilted maple... then i see this pic, and i'm not sure anymore:






I'm just gonna wait until Bernie asks me about my specs, and I'll tell him to flip a coin


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## Jexey

Flame FTMFW!


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## NeoTheMaggot

That last picture is a beautiful example of flamed maple. I can't wait to see how the slab on mine turns out.


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## aslsmm

i wish that i wasn't getting mine painted cause i love flame and quilted maple tops, but i also love his gun metal finish. after all was said and done with mine, it went from 1499+ shipping to about 2000+shipping. but its still better than 3000-3500+ shipping.


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## Pascal-Darrell

hey guys, little question here: is the Jekyll shape avaible in the black friday deal or just the hesperian ? "aslsmm" said something about that...
I would love to have a Jekyll instead of a Hesperian.
Can anyone help with that question ?

cheers


----------



## Isan

No jekyll ...


----------



## technomancer

If you read the thread it appears there have been different answers. Call / email Bernie to get a definitive answer


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

i tried to but I haven´t heard from him the last few days :s


----------



## ev1ltwin

Just finished laying out the specs with Bernie:

Body Shape: HESPERIAN
Number of Stings: 7 
Headstock Style: REVERSE INLINE 7
Top Wood Selection: QUILTED MAPLE
Head Sock Plate Wood Selection: QUILTED MAPLE
Color/Finish: OIL
Neck Construction: Neck Thru 
Neck Material Wood Selection: MAHOGANY
Body Wings Wood Selection: MAHOGANY
Bridge Type: HIPSHOT
Nut Type: BONE
Nut Width: STANDARD
Pickup Routes: 2 ROUTES, CRUNCH/LIQUIFIRE
Fretboard: EBONY
Fretboard Inlay: NONE, SIDE DOTS ONLY
Fretboard Radius: 20"
Frets -Total Frets 27 FRET
Scale Length: 26 3/16
Headstock Binding: NONE
Neck Binding: NONE
Body Binding: NONE
Pickup Brand: DIMARZIO
Tuners: GROVER LOCKING
Hardware Color: BLACK 
Strap Pin/Buttons: STANDARD
Neck Contour: SHREDDER (D-shape, 18mm at 1st, 21mm at 12th)
String Gauge: TBD
 Tuning: TBD

It will have one volume and a 3-way switch.


----------



## toiletstand

sweet!


----------



## Hollowway

Isan said:


> No jekyll ...





Pascal-Darrell said:


> hey guys, little question here: is the Jekyll shape avaible in the black friday deal or just the hesperian ? "aslsmm" said something about that...
> I would love to have a Jekyll instead of a Hesperian.
> Can anyone help with that question ?
> 
> cheers



Yup, no Jekyll. That was one of the first questions I asked him. I suspect assilm is getting a thicker Hesperian, based on what his conversation with Bernie was.


----------



## toiletstand

i cant wait for when all these guitars start coming in. I wanna see what everyones getting.


----------



## teqnick

Oh yeah. It will be cool to see the same guitar over and over again for sure.


----------



## aslsmm

no comment on the jekyll. but NGD will reveal th body style. i guess bernie has taken a few special requests but can't take to many. any way i am already at 2100 after the OFR and grey paint job. i can't wait.


----------



## toiletstand

teqnick said:


> Oh yeah. It will be cool to see the same guitar over and over again for sure.




but think of all the cool lighting! the different backyards and rooms!


----------



## teqnick

tltstand said:


> but think of all the cool lighting! the different backyards and rooms!



that's true. 

Rico in the forest, rico at the zoo, my rico is natural, how about you?!


----------



## Invader

teqnick said:


> Oh yeah. It will be cool to see the same guitar over and over again for sure.



Judging by this thread alone, I would be surprised if they all looked the same.


----------



## Emperoff

teqnick said:


> Oh yeah. It will be cool to see the same guitar over and over again for sure.



You sure? Because you can change whatever you want on it. I'm pretty sure they won't look all the same


----------



## Hollowway

teqnick said:


> Oh yeah. It will be cool to see the same guitar over and over again for sure.



Really? I thought you had a skunk works thing going with yours. Something different, no?


----------



## teqnick

Hollowway said:


> Really? I thought you had a skunk works thing going with yours. Something different, no?



Oh it shall be something fun, I just felt the need for a smart ass comment


----------



## Jexey

If anyone has received a targeted ship date or any progress photos from Bernie feel free to share


----------



## Isan

if you were the in the first five orders of the 6 7 or 8 ,respectively, then ship date should be early february .....


----------



## Might-is-Right

Isan said:


> if you were the in the first five orders of the 6 7 or 8 ,respectively, then ship date should be early february .....



Thats good news because I'm pretty sure I'm in the first five for the 8s. Now I have to find a way to keep my mind off of it until then...

Worked with Bernie on the finish and decided to go with the upgraded black trans burst.


----------



## kruneh

This is not a rant, but I think people need to relax a bit.
It´s two weeks since the sale, and with upgraded specs, and especially the upgraded finish, we´re looking at another time frame.
I´ve talked to Bernie via mail about my specs and it is a done deal for me, but I haven´t really got any final spec sheet or any confirmation yet.
I ordered an 8, didn´t change much from the original specs, but went for a different finish. 
I might be in the first batch for the 8 strings, but no way I´m expecting it to show up early in february.
I´m just as eager as anyone else to see progress photos, to get my guitar and all that, but I know it´s not gonna happen in a while.


----------



## toiletstand

i dont mind the long wait it gives me time to get the cash together without actually having to be really strapped. Spec wise i think everything is pretty much finalized.


----------



## Invader

I managed to get on the first batch of 7's, but ironically I'm in no rush. 

I'm actually still trying to decide which finish to get....damn this is hard.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

I sort of wish I had put in an order for a baritone 6 string. Oh well


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

i was thinking about doing the same actually but in the end went with the 7 string.


----------



## Jexey

For a baritone 6 string I'd want fanned frets, so I didn't loose playability. That's one hell of an upcharge from bernie


----------



## Invader

Does anyone know how much the upcharge would be for a Bareknuckle bridge pickup? I'm looking at the Ceramic Warpig at the moment.


----------



## aslsmm

just buy the pup and he should put it in for free. other wise the upcharge will be the cost of the pup + bernies time to order it.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

any of these start to come in yet?


----------



## toiletstand

somehow i feel that we probably wont see any for another month or so. would be nice though!


----------



## Hollowway

At the earliest, I would think. A number of us have been waiting for quite a while for customs, so I don't think he's going to put those on further hold to do these. I'm guessing summer. Which is fine, because I understand that customs usually end up taking longer than originally predicted.


----------



## toiletstand

we got a good deal and on top of that we were able to send in our own specs. so like i said before waiting isnt a big concern for me


----------



## Jexey

I went on vacation the first couple weeks of this month. Went through guitar withdrawl. By the end of the vacation I was having dreams about my incoming Rico 8 ... rigoddamndiculous!


----------



## AvantGuardian

Well, the lead time was supposed to be 60 days for the first 15 guitars, which would be coming up in the next week or two. I know I got in after the first 15 deposits were already down, so I'm hoping to see mine in the next few months. I'll be patient, but I'm definitely curious to see when those first 15 actually do roll out.

EDIT: Just looked at Bernie's post - he quotes 90-120 days for the guitars after the initial 15. Sounds like a pretty aggressive timeline to me.


----------



## WillDfx

I made it in the initial 15 demograph for my 6 string. 
Knowing that the original lead of 60 days was fast approaching, I emailed bernie last week for a curious update. He said mine and others were still in the wood shop. I'm not entirely sure what part of the process they are at as he didn't elaborate. But he is completely swamped and I would fully understand a slight delay. 

Even though I would bawl like baby


----------



## elq

Azure Haze said:


> I made it in the initial 15 demograph for my 6 string.
> Knowing that the original lead of 60 days was fast approaching, I emailed bernie last week for a curious update. He said mine and others were still in the wood shop. I'm not entirely sure what part of the process they are at as he didn't elaborate. But he is completely swamped and I would fully understand a slight delay.
> 
> Even though I would bawl like baby



"In the wood shop", almost certainly means they don't looks quite like guitars yet, saw dust is still being made.

A fair warning, do not count on getting your guitar in the time stated, you are only setting yourself up for disappointment. Case in point, I'm still waiting for a BRJ from http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/de...rico-jr-7-8-string-custom-run-axe-palace.html note the scheduled completion date carefully please... and note that this is true for just about every luthier, not just Bernie.


----------



## WillDfx

I completely understand how custom shops get swamped, but what I don't understand is why in the Axe Palace run add is it stated that the guitars are well along in production but yet one year later your still waiting. I would love to think that the 60 day lead for our Black Friday run is going to stand true, I know its not. I find it pretty discouraging that your still waiting for yours one year later. I have faith in Bernie, I do. But when a small lead time turns into a year for one, its most likely going to pan out that way for others.


----------



## kmanick

you guys need to chill out. Bernie does most of the work on these himself and if one of his "guys" does it he goes over it and checks it himself to make sure it's right.
Mine took 10 1/2 months and he was not anywhere near as buried with orders then as he is now.
Be patient, you guys (I hate you all ) are going to be getting amazing freaking guitars for an incredible price.
I've had mine now since early November and I can comfortably say (honeymoon phase is over) that this is easily one of, if not "the" nicest 7 strings I've ever laid my hands on. (Shit it's one of the nicest guitars I've ever seen period)
You guys are going to freak when you get them, just give Bernie plenty of space,
he will do what he can, as fast as he can.


----------



## Duke318

Keep in mind that he had these in production long before the black friday run was announced (at least for the first batch).


----------



## Hollowway

Duke318 said:


> Keep in mind that he had these in production long before the black friday run was announced (at least for the first batch).



Well, I doubt that. I was in the first 15 because I sent my deposit in within hours of the sale announcement, and I still got to decide between flamed or quilted maple, so not a whole heck of a lot could have been done on them if that was still an open option. 
Nevertheless, they're going to be VERY nice instruments, and even if they take 6-9 months, that's still a relatively short time to wait for a custom instrument. I think we can all just kick back and wait for them, because it'll be worth it, I'm sure.


----------



## technomancer

Duke318 said:


> Keep in mind that he had these in production long before the black friday run was announced (at least for the first batch).





Hollowway said:


> Well, I doubt that. I was in the first 15 because I sent my deposit in within hours of the sale announcement, and I still got to decide between flamed or quilted maple, so not a whole heck of a lot could have been done on them if that was still an open option.
> Nevertheless, they're going to be VERY nice instruments, and even if they take 6-9 months, that's still a relatively short time to wait for a custom instrument. I think we can all just kick back and wait for them, because it'll be worth it, I'm sure.



Well, then Bernie probably shouldn't have said they were pre-built in preparation for the sale and that they'd be ready in 60 days  I don't have one on order so I'm going to leave it at that.


----------



## Duke318

If it makes you guys feel better, I emailed him a week or two ago and he said they're still on schedule for a February completion (the first batch).


----------



## WillDfx

I emailed him two days ago, he said they will be delayed as expected.


----------



## Emperoff

Well, that's actually good news for me. More time to gather money! 

Seriously guys. Made to order sutff almost ALWAYS delays. If we're talking about a great deal that kicks in much more customers than your regular work schedule you're gonna be swamped. That's a fact. 

However, even though you're swamped and the orders will take more time, they are already (or partially) payed so we're talking about secure customers. This is basic business marketing stuff and whoever thought the guitars would be ready in time (the ones after the initial batch at least) is just crazy. Look what happened with Roter... A little business like them couldn't handle that and screwed it up. Bernie has a pristine reputation that won't screw it up delivering "imperfect" guitars for rushing them into completion. 

Everything I've seen from him is amazing, so think about it this way. Better wait a little longer than having an instrument built under Bernies regular standards. I can wait to have mine, but I can understand that he got a shitload of orders in about two months and that delays WILL happen.


----------



## WillDfx

^ completely agree 100%

The only reason I'm worried is because I'm in need of a new 7  
So I'm just trying to decide if I have enough time to get the one I'm after, and then be ready for my Rico. But I can't wait to see all of the incredible NGD's that will be filtering in over the next couple of months.


----------



## steelhorse

Wonder what happened to his website(s)?


----------



## WillDfx

He started reconstruction on the new site shortly after offering the Black Friday sale. And it's been amiss ever since. I can't wait for it to be back up, and see all the new gallery pictures!!


----------



## yacker

steelhorse said:


> Wonder what happened to his website(s)?



It sounds like he had a falling out with his web guy and has been trying to get the web shit back together since. To the tune of him making a new account on this forum for that sale because he didn't have access to the old account which was run by the web guy. That's my limited understanding of it.


----------



## steelhorse

yacker said:


> It sounds like he had a falling out with his web guy and has been trying to get the web shit back together since. To the tune of him making a new account on this forum for that sale because he didn't have access to the old account which was run by the web guy. That's my limited understanding of it.



Really? Sounds like a typical Bernie ploy to me.

Delays followed by excuses, followed by endless delays

Ask him why he had a falling out, could betrayal and deceipt on his part have anything to do with it? The truth is the webguy did everything he could to promote Rico, but he grew tired of having to basically lie to customers about why their guitars were not done month after month.

Bernie is on the brink of going under if he hasn't already which is why with another desperate move he got rid of the webguy and hired another company or guy and had his "artists" do his bidding on facebook and the like for him, that's just how he works.

I personally know what happened with that situation.

As for handbuilt by Bernie Rico Jr. Lies. The woodshop guy hand builds them, and speaking of the woodshop guy notice how you never hear of him? 

Ed paints them, the woodshop guy builds them so Bernie does what?

Oh and good luck getting those sale items. You may get them....one day, but if the disappearing website is any indication, he's gone.

Epic in Oz got totally screwed out of thousands if you don't believe me.

I salute all the members here. Most are truly stand up. Good luck!


----------



## Isan

Please enlighten us !


----------



## ev1ltwin

wtf lurker post


----------



## aslsmm

Hey man im totally not trying to be a dick but hearing this deffinatly puts some negative questions in my mind. I have heard nothing good about bernis guitars up till this point. I im asking for some sort of articles or proof that would back up these claims. Seriously not trying to be a dickhead im just woundering how much if any weight is to this.


----------



## leonardo7

steelhorse said:


> Really? Sounds like a typical Bernie ploy to me.
> 
> Delays followed by excuses, followed by endless delays
> 
> Ask him why he had a falling out, could betrayal and deceipt on his part have anything to do with it? The truth is the webguy did everything he could to promote Rico, but he grew tired of having to basically lie to customers about why their guitars were not done month after month.
> 
> Bernie is on the brink of going under if he hasn't already which is why with another desperate move he got rid of the webguy and hired another company or guy and had his "artists" do his bidding on facebook and the like for him, that's just how he works.
> 
> I personally know what happened with that situation.
> 
> As for handbuilt by Bernie Rico Jr. Lies. The woodshop guy hand builds them, and speaking of the woodshop guy notice how you never hear of him?
> 
> Ed paints them, the woodshop guy builds them so Bernie does what?
> 
> Oh and good luck getting those sale items. You may get them....one day, but if the disappearing website is any indication, he's gone.
> 
> Epic in Oz got totally screwed out of thousands if you don't believe me.
> 
> I salute all the members here. Most are truly stand up. Good luck!



I think someone might be the web guy?  Only 9 posts and the first posts are all praise for BRJ as well as notifying the forum of certains sales BRJ has had. Now its bashing time as well as stating that you have inside info on Bernie? Im sure theres some truth in it but at the same time it would be stupid for any of us to trip on Bernie right now. Im in on the run too by the way. Everyone will get their guitars and everything will be Awesome!


----------



## Isan

thinking the same .... IP check should be in order


----------



## Miek

Steelhorse, if you care about anyone else, as opposed to dissing on Bernie, you wouldn't say "trust me," you wouldn't use appeals to emotion - you would back up your statements with facts. I don't know if you're right or if you're wrong, but that's certainly not the point. It's just plain foolish, and insulting, to be honest, to present an idea like this based purely on your say-so.


----------



## steelhorse

Miek said:


> Steelhorse, if you care about anyone else, as opposed to dissing on Bernie, you wouldn't say "trust me," you wouldn't use appeals to emotion - you would back up your statements with facts. I don't know if you're right or if you're wrong, but that's certainly not the point. It's just plain foolish, and insulting, to be honest, to present an idea like this based purely on your say-so.



Like I said don't take my word for it base it on what is evidently right before your eyes; the delays, the disappearing site, Epic's break down and fallout, the dealers that were all dropped. Epic laid a ton of cash as payment up front for guitars that they'll never get. Those are facts.

Like I said, I hope he comes through for you all, but it's not looking real good from where I'm watching.

And there were 2 webguys. One of them was with him for over a decade and what happened to him? Gone.

You know it's a tough thing to accept but the truth is sometimes very painful.


----------



## yacker

steelhorse said:


> Wonder what happened to his website(s)?



I guess that was less of a question and more of a let me tell you.

Does that make you John?


----------



## Invader

steelhorse said:


> You know it's a tough thing to accept but the truth is sometimes very painful.



You bable on about the truth, but all you provide us in terms of "proof" are your own speculations. Fact is, no one here knows you. Who are you? (I know, he's the fired web guy, but lets give him the benefit of doubt till thats confirmed).

Why on earth would we rather trust some random keyboard warrior on a message board than a reputable builder who has put out some killer instruments for years now and has taken good care of his customers?


----------



## Invader

steelhorse said:


> Like I said don't take my word for it base it on what is evidently right before your eyes; the delays, the disappearing site, Epic's break down and fallout, the dealers that were all dropped. Epic laid a ton of cash as payment up front for guitars that they'll never get. Those are facts.



The delays? Bernie is swamped with orders at the moment due to his unbelievable sales on Black Friday and Holiday. The delays were to be expected. If you're talking about previous cases, I don't know anything about that as I haven't been paying that close attention.

The disappearing site? If the site's undergoing a major overhaul, there's bound to be some down time. This is the first time the site's actually been down completely after the black friday sale.



steelhorse said:


> And there were 2 webguys. One of them was with him for over a decade and what happened to him? Gone.



Huh? What has that got to do with anything? People come and go. I know many people who have changed jobs after years of being at the same company.


----------



## noob_pwn

This steelhorse dude is a piece of shit and a known con artist,
His real name is Nate Esteban and he lives in alaska, he has screwed over epic guitars, boogie street guitars and Bernie himself just to name a few.
I'm sticking up for bernie because i know the guy, he's honest, works his ass off and has pride in his work that I have never seen from any other luthier. In my opinion he also makes the best guitars money can buy. 
Don't buy any of the crap this guy is talking, none of it is true, I'm sure Bernie will chime in because he is aware of this thread, If you have any questions you can call him.


----------



## eaeolian

Hmm. This is getting interesting. Can either of you substantiate what you're saying?


----------



## noob_pwn

I spoke to bernie earlier this evening my time (i live in australia), I know the owners of epic guitars personally and can also get them to chime in if needed.

I honestly think we all need to hear the full story from BRJ to clear this up but i would encourage anybody concerned about their orders to contact Bernie himself if they have any concerns

edit: I have also used this forum for the last 3 years and i know how things work around here, this guy has 10 posts, i wouldn't be talking out of my ass if i wasn't well informed. Jamie from epic lives an hour away from me, he isn't having a fallout with bernie, in fact he has some new custom orders on the way right now, epic guitars is doing great.


----------



## aslsmm

Invader said:


> Why on earth would we rather trust some random keyboard warrior


 
i wish i was a keyboards warrior. im just a key board squire.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Bernie isn't "going under" by any means. His website is down because it's being completely recreated from the ground up. His new web guy is in the process of getting the new site up and running. I saw the shell of the new site when I visited his shop during the NAMM show. It looks great. 

Nate, I understand that you're probably upset over losing your job, but this trolling shit isn't really doing any good. You come on here trying to convince everyone that Bernie is the bad guy, which is just not cool. You already lost all credibility when you sabotaged Bernie's website a while back, stating all the same bullshit from this thread. Give it a rest and find a new job already.


----------



## aiur55

It would be nice to hear from Bernie himself. The thing that got me is that the "scammer" steelhorse has nothing to gain from telling us this....

Anyway, I would understand if there was a delay, especially if Bernie just tells us.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

aiur55 said:


> The thing that got me is that the "scammer" steelhorse has nothing to gain from telling us this....



He has a lot to gain from it. He's trying to hurt Bernie's business because he's pissed off that he got fired for not doing his job. It's that simple.


----------



## WillDfx

Yeah man, Shit that guy's actin' teh foo. I have complete faith in Bernie, and if anything was going on I'm sure he would be the first to say something. Not some shady lurker, that's most likely hellbent on bringing us down to his level.


----------



## Invader

I don't know how things work in the US, but over here shit like this wouldn't fly. Talking smack about someone can get you in trouble if you can't back up your words.


----------



## Prydogga

Has Bernie pressed charges against Nate for the misuse of his twitter or whatever it was for slander? Seems like the right thing to do. Or at least make sure his next employers are *really* careful about hiring him.


----------



## steelhorse

It's cool that a few here took it for what it was; a head's up.

Do your research, ask ALL the questions and have ALL of the information available, then make an informed decision. 

Hey even us lurkers may know things you don't.


----------



## steelhorse

Bernie didn't press charges against anyone. Talking smack as usual.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

steelhorse said:


> Bernie didn't press charges against anyone. Talking smack as usual.



Consider yourself lucky.


----------



## Prydogga

steelhorse said:


> Bernie didn't press charges against anyone. Talking smack as usual.



I never implied that he said he was going to it, I implied that you crossed a line, and he could have done something about it. 

Look, I'm guessing your time in this thread and most likely SS.org is nearly up, so have fun with your grudge, it probably would have been easy to accept being let go, and move on for another job, instead of imposing a vendetta against the guy who is almost unanimously agreed to be one of the greatest luthiers to grace the board, with a glowing reputation.

So really, any harsh claims against Bernie just reinforce your grudge, and don't do anything to harm his business in the long run.


----------



## Isan

Steelhorse sounds like devries ..... make false claims ... people destroy your claims .... make claims again .....


----------



## BernieRicoJr

I'm happy to tell you the facts about my business. Steelhorse (Disgruntled ex-employee)is attempting to make it sound as if it's a bad thing that I have a small group of employees in my business. But here's the reality- 

Do I have helpers in the wood shop? You bet. This small team of skilled luthiers have been with the Rico family for many, many years. They are responsible for the basic construction of all guitars. Once they are done with their part, the guitars come to me for sanding, shaping of the neck profile, bevels, routes, etc. 

Do I have a paint and prep guy? Absolutely. Ed does some of the most amazing finishes you'll find on any guitar, anywhere. He does the preliminary prep, and shoots the color. I do all the wet sanding and buffing. 

What do I do? Everything else. I do the fretting, electronics, oil finish work, fine details, cut the nut by hand, assembly, custom fabrication, inlay, shipping and receiving, full setups, etc... as well as all the other aspects that make the business run- Ordering of woods, materials, parts, handling customers, answering floods of emails and phone calls... 

Do I ever get delayed? God yes. BRJ Guitars is a small company with a ton of business. While we are optimistic about providing USA customs in a reasonable amount of time, it's unrealistic to say that we've met every deadline we've set. 

Am I going out of business, and why is your website down? Hell no. If anything, we are expanding business. We are busier now than we've ever been. The website is down because we had to start over after letting go of our two web developers. I will be the bigger man here, and I won't say why we let them go. But, it was necessary. The new website is nearly complete, and it's very nice. My lack of an active website is not an indication of me "going out of business". It's an indication that we are expanding into newer, better times. 

As for delays on this particular run? Yes, there will be some delays past the originally quoted build times. The reason? We received nearly ten times the orders we had originally anticipated. Because this was a production run, we planned to build and assemble every guitar at the same time. However, the majority of the guitars sold during this run were essentially turned into guitars with full custom shop options. Almost none of these guitars retained the original specs posted in the sale ad. That will delay things a bit. The guitars that DID retain the specs in the ad will be completed before the others in the run that had significant changes to the spec. Believe it or not, there are still customers from that run who have yet to decide on specs for their guitar. 

Fact- These guitars are high quality instruments, hand built in the USA. 

Thanks for your time, guys! If you have any questions or concerns as a result of what Nate has told you, feel free to contact me personally. 

-Bernie


----------



## ev1ltwin

i guess this means i'll be one of the first to get my guitar? not sure when that will be, but i'm okay with that. thanks for stepping in bernie and others for clarifying everything.


----------



## MetalDaze

BernieRicoJr said:


> The guitars that DID retain the specs in the ad will be completed before the others in the run that had significant changes to the spec.


 
I knew there had to be some advantage with sticking with the specs on the deal! I never lost the faith


----------



## Isan

dmccarthy said:


> I knew there had to be some advantage with sticking with the specs on the deal! I never lost the faith



Yay us !


----------



## UnderTheSign

BernieRicoJr said:


> Do I have helpers in the wood shop? You bet. This small team of skilled luthiers have been with the Rico family for many, many years. They are responsible for the basic construction of all guitars. Once they are done with their part, the guitars come to me for sanding, shaping of the neck profile, bevels, routes, etc.
> 
> Do I have a paint and prep guy? Absolutely. Ed does some of the most amazing finishes you'll find on any guitar, anywhere. He does the preliminary prep, and shoots the color. I do all the wet sanding and buffing.
> 
> What do I do? Everything else. I do the fretting, electronics, oil finish work, fine details, cut the nut by hand, assembly, custom fabrication, inlay, shipping and receiving, full setups, etc... as well as all the other aspects that make the business run- Ordering of woods, materials, parts, handling customers, answering floods of emails and phone calls...
> 
> Do I ever get delayed? God yes. BRJ Guitars is a small company with a ton of business. While we are optimistic about providing USA customs in a reasonable amount of time, it's unrealistic to say that we've met every deadline we've set.


Good post Bernie.
I don't see the problem with having other people do work for you as well. Neal Moser has shop apprentices and people working for him all the time, doesn't make his guitars bad, nor does it change the fact the man does amazing setups. People don't honestly expect you to chime out dozens of instruments and run a full company ALL by yourself, I hope


----------



## josh pelican

Aaron, my buddy Steve has the gunmetal Vixen. If I'm not mistaken, he dropped Bare Knuckles into it, too.

I haven't heard anything but good about it. If I could do a BRJ justice, I would buy six. Maybe I'll get a bass.


----------



## SirMyghin

Excellent Post Bernie, no one with reasonable production can work entirely alone, and I am sure more people get that. So I don't really understand how a dig like that would hold any sway.


----------



## BernieRicoJr

SirMyghin said:


> Excellent Post Bernie, no one with reasonable production can work entirely alone, and I am sure more people get that. So I don't really understand how a dig like that would hold any sway.



Well, Nate made it sound as if I was misleading people into thinking that I flew to Brazil to cut down some trees, then widdled them into guitars 100% by myself. 

There are certain aspects of the build that I have qualified people for. Such as the paint work, for example- Ed is a phenomenal painter. I wouldn't hide his work from anyone! He's no secret! 

Anyway, no sense in beating a dead horse. I just felt the need to jump on and give some truth to these claims about what I do/don't do. 

And Nate, you might want to think long and hard about what you're trying to do here. I would advise you to cut this childish nonsense. I'd really hate to take this to the next level. 

Back to work for me!


----------



## WillDfx

HOOO-RAAA Bernie!


----------



## Emperoff

Fuck this shit. 20min drive away from my home lives the best luthier in Spain. Does he got other people working with him? YES. Does he ever delays FUCK YES (actually there's a 1 year waiting list and he's accepting no orders).

Did Bernie dissappeared? NO. He's replied every mail I've sent him in 1-4 days.


I would, however, advise against pressing charges to the guy. The warning is there and he should stop now, because I think a big fine and some prison time for an angry ex-worker may be a bit overkill and something he may regret his entire life. But if he doesn't stop it... I suppose there's no other way.


So now, to ease the wait... FREE GAS FOR EVERYONE!: Flickr: Search Eric McKenna's photostream


----------



## Vyn

Drama aside, Bernie's guitars are some of the most beautiful I've ever seen, and that's just from photographs.

How would one get in contact? Very interested in one of these beasts.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I´ve also a Rico in order, can´t wait for it  it will be awesome for sure ! 

And I don´t know why, but it makes me happy that all you guys have so much faith in Bernie as I have.

I´ve also talked to Wes the last days, it seems that all is going fine 

And the post from Bernie was great, think he´s a really honest guy. 

Cheers dudes


----------



## Jexey

steelhorse said:


> As for handbuilt by Bernie Rico Jr. Lies. The woodshop guy hand builds them, and speaking of the woodshop guy notice how you never hear of him?


 
....




BernieRicoJr said:


> Well, Nate made it sound as if I was misleading people into thinking that I flew to Brazil to cut down some trees, then widdled them into guitars 100% by myself.





BernieRicoJr said:


> There are certain aspects of the build that I have qualified people for. Such as the paint work, for example- Ed is a phenomenal painter. I wouldn't hide his work from anyone! He's no secret!



Yeah, definitely sounds like B's obviously taking all the credit for the work that goes into his guitars. Must be one hell of a widdler.  



Vyn said:


> Drama aside, Bernie's guitars are some of the most beautiful I've ever seen, and that's just from photographs.
> 
> How would one get in contact? Very interested in one of these beasts.


 
Give him a call or email him.
[email protected]

Just make sure you're serious if you're going to inquire a luthier. Custom instruments are almost always well over 2k and take a long time to make, and luthiers are normally very busy people.


----------



## josh pelican

I'm starting to think when I'm serious about getting a new guitar (seven), it might just be a BRJ.


----------



## JJ Rodriguez

josh pelican said:


> Aaron, my buddy Steve has the gunmetal Vixen. If I'm not mistaken, he dropped Bare Knuckles into it, too.
> 
> I haven't heard anything but good about it. If I could do a BRJ justice, I would buy six. Maybe I'll get a bass.



Pffft, fuck worrying about doing it justice, look at all the shit I have


----------



## infernalservice

I have a Black Friday on order (maple fretboard!), and its my 2nd Rico thus far. I can personally vouch for Bernie and say nothing but positive things. I remember getting a voicemail one day and I hear a thumping guitar running down a chromatic scale and then Bern's voice saying "Guess what that is? Your guitar is done dude!" I called him back right away and we shot the shit for like 20 minutes. A day later Bernie calls me as he is leaving the post office to tell me he just shipped the guitar. You CANNOT beat his level of customer service. Like a few luthiers, his guitars play, sound, and look amazing, but Bern goes the extra mile with his customer service. I can't wait for all the NGD threads from Black Friday to start pouring in.


----------



## MetalDaze

Bernie's site is back up.


----------



## MetalDaze

Anyone check in with Bernie lately on the Black Friday guitars? 

Last time I emailed him, he was thinking end of February, but that was about a month ago.


----------



## Invader

dmccarthy said:


> Anyone check in with Bernie lately on the Black Friday guitars?
> 
> Last time I emailed him, he was thinking end of February, but that was about a month ago.



I asked about a rough estimate two weeks ago, but haven't gotten a response. I've noticed it takes a lot longer than before for Bernie to answer emails at the moment.

I'm in no rush so I haven't harassed the man since my last email two weeks ago.


----------



## Hollowway

dmccarthy said:


> Anyone check in with Bernie lately on the Black Friday guitars?
> 
> Last time I emailed him, he was thinking end of February, but that was about a month ago.



Yeah, tough call. I talked with him last week about a snafu he ran into with my custom. I know he's pretty backed up (he's finishing up customs from last year). I still think anytime in the next few weeks is wildly optimistic.


----------



## Isan

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, tough call. I talked with him last week about a snafu he ran into with my custom. I know he's pretty backed up (he's finishing up customs from last year). I still think anytime in the next few weeks is wildly optimistic.





I will just give you a heads up, Looking at last years run that was supposed to ship early february..... 


Expect May-ish



I hope sooner but I HIGHLY doubt it


----------



## aslsmm

i was actually about to post the question about his ETA on the BF guitars just now. glad to see im not the only one having trouble getting ahold of him. i asked him for a final bill like 3 or 4 times and i get nothing. i wanna pay him but i get no response, haha. I know hes backed up so im not worried. i just wanna be waiting instead of waiting ans having to pay ya know.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Not that he needs it, but I'm going to speak up and vouch for Bernie. Not only is he great at what he does, but he's one of the coolest, most stand up people I know. Make no mistake about it.


----------



## Hollowway

aslsmm said:


> i was actually about to post the question about his ETA on the BF guitars just now. glad to see im not the only one having trouble getting ahold of him. i asked him for a final bill like 3 or 4 times and i get nothing. i wanna pay him but i get no response, haha. I know hes backed up so im not worried. i just wanna be waiting instead of waiting ans having to pay ya know.



My guess is that he won't take a final payment until the guitar is done and ready to ship. I think he'll just want to keep it consistent with his normal billing process. I think that's the way he does them all.


----------



## aslsmm

oh i had no idea. wow thats fine too i guess, i just sleep better at night knowing that i dont have a payment looming over head.


----------



## Isan

I wish bernie would setup timed webcams in his work shop .... kinda like bungie , where it takes a picture every hour or so


----------



## WillDfx

I spoke to B about 3 weeks ago and he said my guitar will be an additional 4-5 months from now due to the custom options I went with. So I would guess everyone with the basic standard options he offered should get there's in about 2-3 months from now. I know he is putting all his effort in these guitars, he's treating them each individually like total custom orders.


----------



## thrsher

i spoke to bernie two weeks ago and he said he was hoping for the first run of theem to been done in 60 days. mine was pretty much a stock except 27in scale and blackburst edging. i also ordered a 6 string so i was in the intial run order


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Bern treats every single guitar the same. Even the short import run he did a few years back received ridiculous attention to detail once he got his hands on them. So, the wait is going to be worth it. If i were you guys, i would be releived that he's taking time to do things the right way rather than rushing.


----------



## Emperoff

thrsher said:


> i spoke to bernie two weeks ago and he said he was hoping for the first run of theem to been done in 60 days. mine was pretty much a stock except 27in scale and blackburst edging. i also ordered a 6 string so i was in the intial run order



Yeah, it's pretty busy and indecisive bastards like me don't make him things easier... 

Have patience guys, the guitars will be awesome!


----------



## Isan

Azure Haze said:


> I spoke to B about 3 weeks ago and he said my guitar will be an additional 4-5 months from now due to the custom options I went with. So I would guess everyone with the basic standard options he offered should get there's in about 2-3 months from now. I know he is putting all his effort in these guitars, he's treating them each individually like total custom orders.


Yeah as i guessed may-ish


----------



## aslsmm

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.. We need a little patience.


----------



## WillDfx

thrsher said:


> i spoke to bernie two weeks ago and he said he was hoping for the first run of theem to been done in 60 days. mine was pretty much a stock except 27in scale and blackburst edging. i also ordered a 6 string so i was in the intial run order



Yes I also got one of the first batch 6-ers, but as I said anything custom is most likely on the backburner for now so he can finish the basic standard ones first.


----------



## Invader

Azure Haze said:


> I spoke to B about 3 weeks ago and he said my guitar will be an additional 4-5 months from now due to the custom options I went with. So I would guess everyone with the basic standard options he offered should get there's in about 2-3 months from now. I know he is putting all his effort in these guitars, he's treating them each individually like total custom orders.



Wow, I had a hunch that I won't be seeing my Hesperian until summer, and it seems I was correct. 

The only thing I'm worried about is the exchange rate - when the time comes to send the second payment, I hope it will be as good as it is today.


----------



## AvantGuardian

Okay, who bailed on their order?:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/de...modded-black-friday-guitar-available-now.html

Nice to see one of these is complete, and it looks super nice.


----------



## kmanick

Invader said:


> Wow, I had a hunch that I won't be seeing my Hesperian until summer, and it seems I was correct.
> 
> The only thing I'm worried about is the exchange rate - when the time comes to send the second payment, I hope it will be as good as it is today.


you can pay Bernie in full at anytime you have a pm incoming.


----------



## mikernaut

Bernie does incredible work . I still say my Jekyll 6 is probably the best guitar I have ever played/owned. You guys are in for a treat if you haven't played a BRJ yet.

That being said I've also been waiting over 1 year for my 7string from him, and being that I got laid off from Activision in 2009 this is one of the few things I have to look forward too so I'm dying here.

Hopefully you guys won't have to wait as long.


----------



## MetalDaze

Have any Black Friday folks heard anything recently? I've left Bernie a couple of vmails and emails, but haven't received a response.


----------



## WillDfx

dmccarthy said:


> Have any Black Friday folks heard anything recently? I've left Bernie a couple of vmails and emails, but haven't received a response.



I haven't had any response to my emails or calls either. Although I put in a new order for a Jekyll 7, and had a response within hours.


----------



## mikernaut

He can be tough at times to get a hold of, I'm sure he's insanely busy with all the orders he has going. I can usually get brief replys back using his yahoo email address.

He contacted me right after my above post (#189) and my Jek 7 Custom should be shipping out any day now. Although it wasn't part of the "black friday" run,
I can totally sympathize , it's tough to wait and be patient, but g'damn his quality is incredible.


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> He contacted me right after my above post (#189) and my Jek 7 Custom should be shipping out any day now. .


  Glad to hear it! I'm hoping that my Jekyll 8 won't be too far behind (although he did need to remake it. But he's going to rush it.)


----------



## MetalDaze

BernieRicoJr said:


> This is a limited production run that we have started specifically for the Black Friday sale. The lead time is 60 days, and only 5 each will be available at this price. A deposit of $600 is required to secure your build.


 
April bump


----------



## mikernaut




----------



## leonardo7

Still waiting Mike?


----------



## Isan

=/


----------



## kruneh

I emailed Bernie back in february with a question regarding the finish I had chosen, but haven´t heard anything back.
That´s fair enough, I know he´s busy and I suppose he will contact me when time is due.
I know this is gonna take some time, and I´m cool with that too.
But I think a lot of people are dissapointed when there´s no word of the Black Friday guitars at all.
So maybe a little heads up from Bernie would do good for business


----------



## toiletstand

worth repeating



Azure Haze said:


> I spoke to B about 3 weeks ago and he said my guitar will be an additional 4-5 months from now due to the custom options I went with. So I would guess everyone with the basic standard options he offered should get there's in about 2-3 months from now. I know he is putting all his effort in these guitars, he's treating them each individually like total custom orders.


----------



## mikernaut

leonardo7 said:


> Still waiting Mike?



yep , although I got a email this morning saying he should have a tracking number for me today.  . Previously to that he said he was "out of commission ", so I dunno if he was sick or busy with personal stuff.


----------



## BernieRicoJr

Good morning guys,
Sorry for the late replies to calls and emails. I'd like to give you an idea of what we're dealing with in regards to this Black Friday run of guitars. The initial amount we made available sold within a matter of hours. Once they were allocated, we left it open so other people could get in on the sale, but the lead time would be increased from what was initially stated. 
Truth be told- We took orders for over 100 guitars that weekend. Being a small custom shop, we can only build a few guitars at a time. We are building them in the order we received them. Due to the sheer volume of guitars, and the many, many changes people have made to them, the lead times have increased. In addition, my wood supplier, and some parts suppliers have had a hard time keeping up with the orders I've placed for these guitars, and some materials are still on back-order. 
The first batch is near the end of the woodshop phase. I will have pictures soon for those that have requested them. I can't stress it enough, we do not want to make anyone's guitar a "rush job". Each one of these are treated with the same amount of attention as any custom guitar that I build. The wait is painful, I know, but believe me when I say- it will be worth it. 

Another cause for delay is the fact that I've been pretty under the weather. I'm having some health issues. I know that probably doesn't matter to some, as you have commissioned me to build you a guitar, rain or shine.But, it has effected my ability to put in the hours that I normally could. We're still pulling some serious overtime, regardless. 


I've said this to most of you already, but I'll reiterate- While I don't have a solid completion date at this very moment, we are doing the best we can to get your guitars completed in a timely manner. I don't want to rush anyone's guitar. Perfection, and your happiness is most important to me. Making sure you get the best guitar you've ever played is paramount to my business. I will send updates and pics as time allows. Thank you for your patience and understanding. Your guitar will be worth the often painful wait, believe me. 

-Bernie


----------



## toiletstand

youre the man bernie


----------



## IB-studjent-

Ordered my Hesperian slant top a few months ago, might get some BKP instead of the crunch lab/liquifier cambo, but they do feel tempting to keep and try out. It's a bummer that bernie couldn't get me some flush mounts other than if i send them to him  but who cares its still flipping awesome


----------



## aiur55

Hope you feel better soon bernie. Looking forward to your next update.


----------



## MetalDaze

Since I've been responsible for the last two 'bumps', I would like to say THANK YOU.

Personally, I have no fear that I'll receive a guitar eventually and that it will be awesome. I think giving us an update one a month saying, "i haven't forgotten about you guys and here's where we stand..." would satisfy most people and probably reduce the amount of direct emails asking for an update.

A little love goes a long way 

We are all just waiting for the day we can do this:


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Hope you get well soon !


----------



## thrsher

i personally HATE being THAT GUY that is constantly hounding, emailing etc. so simple, generic update is good enough, eventually though, everyone is going to need to where their order stands idividually. if my guitar is not even in woodshop, thats fine but i/people who are not there yet need to know that specifically.


----------



## TomAwesome

Thanks for taking the time to post an update, Bernie.  Over 100 guitars? Damn! Kudos for making the offer that widely available. Thanks for not rushing it. I'm sure the wait will be well worth it.  Oh, and feel better soon.


----------



## Rommel

I didn't place an order for the "Black Friday" run, but just wanted to say, hope you feel better Bernie.


----------



## Invader

BernieRicoJr said:


> I can't stress it enough, we do not want to make anyone's guitar a "rush job". Each one of these are treated with the same amount of attention as any custom guitar that I build.



I might be stating the obvious here, but the above is what matters most to me. I don't mind waiting if it guarantees a top notch quality.

Thanks Bernie for chiming in, and get well soon!


----------



## killertone

I appreciate the update, I sent an email that went unanswered over a month ago so I will take this info and keep being patient. I am excited to see the guitar and very happy that you are not bullshitting anyone or rushing guitar that may not live up to your excellent build quality.


----------



## kmanick

BernieRicoJr said:


> Making sure you get the best guitar you've ever played is paramount to my business. I will send updates and pics as time allows. Thank you for your patience and understanding. Your guitar will be worth the often painful wait, believe me.
> -Bernie


 
^ this X 1000
My Hesperian completely smokes any other 7 I've ever played 
Be patient guys Bernies guitars are on a whole other level.

I pity my other 7's , they dont stand a chance against my BRJ


----------



## mikernaut

Sooo close.... my guitar is with Fed Ex in Chicago, hopefully it will be here tomorrow for a long overdue NGD


----------



## toiletstand

im excited for ya dude. cant wait


----------



## kmanick

mikernaut said:


> Sooo close.... my guitar is with Fed Ex in Chicago, hopefully it will be here tomorrow for a long overdue NGD


 
Allrighty then!!!
finally the beast is on it's way!


----------



## Emperoff

mikernaut said:


> Sooo close.... my guitar is with Fed Ex in Chicago, hopefully it will be here tomorrow for a long overdue NGD



So they're finally shipping! FUCKTON OF PICS ARE ON DEMAND!!


----------



## Might-is-Right

Emperoff said:


> So they're finally shipping! FUCKTON OF PICS ARE ON DEMAND!!



Mike's guitar is a custom from over a year ago. 

I don't think we're going to get any black friday guitars shipping for a few months at best.

I know I may get flamed for saying this but Bernie's last post in this thread didn't do anything to ease my concerns. We still don't have any concrete timeline for the original batch of 15. Now there is mention of materials on backorder from suppliers etc. Wasn't part of the 60 day promise due to the claim that these guitars were already in "mid production" pre sale offer? 

I really hope its just a case of poor planning and over promising but when I see posts like the one in the dealers section where that custom Jekyll is passed off as a black friday guitar that is now for sale it makes me wonder if there isn't more to the story. I hope not and I really do hope Bernie is back on his feet and feeling better.


----------



## thrsher

Might is right

i agree with you and im not afraid to speak up. bernies rep. proceeds him and it will uphold for now so we will see what happens in the next 3 months, that will make or break this in my book


----------



## aiur55

Did anyone that requested picture get them yet? It would be nice to have some WIP posts here.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

aiur55 said:


> Did anyone that requested picture get them yet? It would be nice to have some WIP posts here.



Not sure who this one belongs to, but Bernie told me it's one of the original 15 from the BF run that the customer changed up a bit. From what I can tell, most people ended up changing their guitars quite a bit from what they were originally supposed to be. Looks killer, imo. 





Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## MetalDaze

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Not sure who this one belongs to, but Bernie told me it's one of the original 15 from the BF run that the customer changed up a bit. From what I can tell, most people ended up changing their guitars quite a bit from what they were originally supposed to be.


 
I am in the first five of the 7's and went with the standard specs. 

No pics; no completion date.


----------



## Isan

dmccarthy said:


> I am in the first five of the 7's and went with the standard specs.
> 
> No pics; no completion date.



I am somewhere in the 15 aswell. 
I think this is pretty expected for a custom guitar man. (sucks that it is  )


----------



## toiletstand

i almost went with a spalted top for mine. damn
that looks amazing.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

dmccarthy said:


> I am in the first five of the 7's and went with the standard specs.
> 
> No pics; no completion date.




I don't know what to say my man. I just posted a pic he sent to my cell phone. I don't know much about the run, personally. I didn't order one. But, I'm not sure Bernie gives actual "completion dates", as that would be pretty tough for him to do. Pics, however, will probably start popping up more pretty soon. Hang in there, dudes.


----------



## thrsher

i dont hound thy guy, i didnt ask for pics, but he did say anything outside of the standard specs were supposed to take longer and people that stuck with the specs were supposed to be done first, at least i recall that? anyone else?

me personally on my order, which i dont know where it falls in the pecking order, but i did place it way before the actually black friday sale was a 6 string with the standard specs but 27 in scale and a blackburst finish.


----------



## MetalDaze

Isan said:


> I am somewhere in the 15 aswell.
> I think this is pretty expected for a custom guitar man. (sucks that it is  )


 
Yep, we are all in the same boat.

I also have a Jackson Custom Shop order that is going to take a year to complete. I haven't bugged them once because they set the expectation correctly.

While I am waiting, I got tempted by the Black Friday deal with the promise of 60 days if I made the first cut. If Bernie had said it would take longer, I would have passed. But, I took him at his word and now I wait.

If he could set a new date, I would patiently wait again. But since it's still unknown, I get restless. I would understand better if I had changed the specs around or missed that first cut.....

Maybe I need to stop reading these boards for a while and get back to playing 

EDIT: In the spirit of full disclosure, I did have one custom option...LEFTY. That might mean that I have to wait 2 years!!!!!!  (just kidding, I really am looking forward to this guitar, but the lack of concrete info is just killing me)


----------



## Might-is-Right

Isan said:


> I am somewhere in the 15 aswell.
> I think this is pretty expected for a custom guitar man. (sucks that it is  )



I'm not trying to come off as unreasonable. Normally I'd agree with you 100% but I think this is unacceptable given the circumstances. 

The problem I have with the lack of information is there was indication given before the sale that specified that the guitars for this run were already in the works. We are now a few months past the "due date" and we're not even seeing pics or getting ANY kind of date. When we do get communication there seems to be alot of inconsistencies with what was originally stated or promised.


----------



## AvantGuardian

I am going to be patient here, but I definitely agree with the sentiment that accurate build times would be nice. Hopefully everyone who got in on this deal did their homework and came to the realization that custom builds often take far longer than the advertised build time. Still, the practice of quoting one build time, requiring significant money up front, and consistently delivering a finished product considerably later than the advertised time seems a bit dishonest.

If BRJ said it would take a year to build, I'd probably still have put my money down and I'd feel better about the honesty in the build time quote. I'm sure its easier to get people to pony up their deposits though if you advertise a quick, but unrealistic build time. This isn't meant to be a personal jab at Bernie - I put my money down knowing full well this is going to take awhile and if I get an amazing guitar out of this sometime this year, I'll be happy. The BF deal is a great price, and everything I've heard about the quality of BRJ guitars has been fantastic. I'm just kind of frustrated with the practice of quoting build times that have no bearing in reality whatsoever. Seems like several small luthiers that get a lot of press on this forum make a habit of doing that.


----------



## kmanick

FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWKK!!!!
that looks killer 



DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Not sure who this one belongs to, but Bernie told me it's one of the original 15 from the BF run that the customer changed up a bit. From what I can tell, most people ended up changing their guitars quite a bit from what they were originally supposed to be. Looks killer, imo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## Emperoff

For God's sake. Don't act like if you were kids. I mean, did you actually expected the custom guitars being built at the promised date? No single guitar builder (that I know of) is inmune to unexpected complications, delays in supplies, or other stuff that may delay the construction of the guitar.

I know the wait can make people anxious, but hey! I'm waiting as well and haven't started a flame war against Bernie.

Think about it this way: Time replying e-mails and making pictures for +100 guitars = less time for actually building them. Maybe some of the guys who live nearby and have visited his store can make another phototrip or something


----------



## AvantGuardian

Emperoff said:


> For God's sake. Don't act like if you were kids. I mean, did you actually expected the custom guitars being built at the promised date? No single guitar builder (that I know of) is inmune to unexpected complications, delays in supplies, or other stuff that may delay the construction of the guitar.



Well, for me at least I think I'm just tired of builders advertising a build date that is basically impossible to meet. What is the point of that? The only thing I can think of is to generate more interest/business, which strikes me as a little bit dishonest. Most of us know the estimated build times are BS, but why has that become such a common business practice? If I tell my boss I'll have a report done by Friday, it damn well better be done by Friday. If I miss a few deadlines, I'll be out looking for a new job. That kind of stuff doesn't cut it in most industries. I guess because BRJ is the only guy you can get a BRJ guitar from, people are willing to deal with that. Same with any other small, unique builders.


----------



## Might-is-Right

Emperoff said:


> For God's sake. Don't act like if you were kids. I mean, did you actually expected the custom guitars being built at the promised date? No single guitar builder (that I know of) is inmune to unexpected complications, delays in supplies, or other stuff that may delay the construction of the guitar.
> 
> I know the wait can make people anxious, but hey! I'm waiting as well and haven't started a flame war against Bernie.
> 
> Think about it this way: Time replying e-mails and making pictures for +100 guitars = less time for actually building them. Maybe some of the guys who live nearby and have visited his store can make another phototrip or something



I don't think anyone is trying to start a flame war against Bernie, certainly not me. I think I've been pretty accurate in pointing out facts.

The issue isn't so much that twice the promised build time has past, the issue is more with the lack of communication and any indication of when we can realistically expect to see what we paid for.


----------



## MetalDaze

Might-is-Right said:


> I don't think anyone is trying to start a flame war against Bernie, certainly not me. I think I've been pretty accurate in pointing out facts.
> 
> The issue isn't so much that twice the promised build time has past, the issue is more with the lack of communication and any indication of when we can realistically expect to see what we paid for.


 
I agree.

Trust me, I want Bernie to build me an exceptional guitar that makes everyone I know want to place an order for one. I only started bumping this thread to see if others had any info because many vmails and emails to Bernie went unanswered.


----------



## Emperoff

AvantGuardian said:


> Well, for me at least I think I'm just tired of builders advertising a build date that is basically impossible to meet. What is the point of that? The only thing I can think of is to generate more interest/business, which strikes me as a little bit dishonest. Most of us know the estimated build times are BS, but why has that become such a common business practice? If I tell my boss I'll have a report done by Friday, it damn well better be done by Friday. If I miss a few deadlines, I'll be out looking for a new job. That kind of stuff doesn't cut it in most industries. I guess because BRJ is the only guy you can get a BRJ guitar from, people are willing to deal with that. Same with any other small, unique builders.



Obviously you haven't worked with "pay later" orders in your company. When you send goods to another company and you expect the money in say, maybe two weeks and it takes two months, you can't do much about it but wait. You can of course ditch that customer forever so you don't have to wait so long, but you'll be losing a customer...

The difference here, is that we've paid a non-refundable deposit, we can't do much but wait, and then, when we receive our guitars months later we'll be happy bitches with our new guitar, and won't tell Bernie that we will never do business with him again, because we will be happy with our guitar and we may even order another (knowing beforehand that it will take a long time).

Oh wait, there is really no difference at all... It's just business man, every luthier runs one, and the amount of communication will probably depend on the amount of work.


However, there's some builders that offer some kind of compensation for the delays (Like the -100$ that Rob at kxk did). I'm pretty sure that nobody would complain if this was the case


----------



## eaeolian

Emperoff said:


> For God's sake. Don't act like if you were kids. I mean, did you actually expected the custom guitars being built at the promised date? No single guitar builder (that I know of) is inmune to unexpected complications, delays in supplies, or other stuff that may delay the construction of the guitar.



Jackson - an admittedly larger operation, but one that does considerably more volume, too - told me 18 months when I ordered my CS Soloist. It was actually a few weeks early.

There's nothing wrong with it taking a long time to build a guitar, but if you were told 60 days initially, he should stopped taking orders when he exceeded his capacity to produce them that quickly. This is not an uncommon problem with small builders, but that doesn't make it right. How many people would not have ordered if they knew it was going to take a year instead of 60 days?


----------



## adrock

eaeolian said:


> Jackson - an admittedly larger operation, but one that does considerably more volume, too - told me 18 months when I ordered my CS Soloist. It was actually a few weeks early.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with it taking a long time to build a guitar, but if you were told 60 days initially, *he should stopped taking orders when he exceeded his capacity to produce them that quickly. This is not an uncommon problem with small builders, but that doesn't make it right.* How many people would not have ordered if they knew it was going to take a year instead of 60 days?


exactly


----------



## WillDfx

eaeolian said:


> Jackson - an admittedly larger operation, but one that does considerably more volume, too - told me 18 months when I ordered my CS Soloist. It was actually a few weeks early.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with it taking a long time to build a guitar, but if you were told 60 days initially, he should stopped taking orders when he exceeded his capacity to produce them that quickly. This is not an uncommon problem with small builders, but that doesn't make it right. How many people would not have ordered if they knew it was going to take a year instead of 60 days?




completely agree my friend.


----------



## djpharoah

eaeolian said:


> How many people would not have ordered if they knew it was going to take a year instead of 60 days?



</end thread>


----------



## mikernaut

I think Jackson is slow because Mesh keeps whoring up the Jacksons and keeping them busy  hahaha.

Unfortunately Customs and things of quality take time, although it ends up being longer then we like, I think we realize this going into it and just want to be kept in the loop and given a somewhat accurate timetable and updates.

Most people when going with Jackson or ESP are already aware that it will be atleast 1 year. I've had communication breakdowns dealing with them too. When I ordered a CS XTRR with Jackson I wanted bright lime/Chartreuse green finish and before they even checked with me they painted it absinthe frost and completed the guitar. So they had to redo the whole guitar. 

It really shouldn't be hard to check the specs and mockups, but somehow errors still happen. I'm bummed that my new BRJ got the wrong inlays but atleast Bern is taking care of it. I've waited this long, I can wait some more to get the guitar I have my heart set on.


----------



## Emperoff

eaeolian said:


> Jackson - an admittedly larger operation, but one that does considerably more volume, too - told me 18 months when I ordered my CS Soloist. It was actually a few weeks early.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with it taking a long time to build a guitar, but if you were told 60 days initially, he should stopped taking orders when he exceeded his capacity to produce them that quickly. This is not an uncommon problem with small builders, but that doesn't make it right. How many people would not have ordered if they knew it was going to take a year instead of 60 days?



The point is that whatever the builder says, getting a custom made guitar in 60 days is highly unlikely. I knew what I was doing when I ordered it. It happens everyday with most small builders. I mean, that timeframe is just unrealistic.

The opposite goes with Jackson. I think 18 months is a FAR more plausible completion date, so they have more than enough time. My point is that people that expects a custom guitar being built in two months (whatever the seller says) is crazy. 

And no, it doesn't make it right. But what did you expect? The deposits are non-refundable so there's always room for more orders, and since people have already paid, they can't do nothing but wait. Plain and simple.


----------



## Invader

Emperoff said:


> The point is that whatever the builder says, getting a custom made guitar in 60 days is highly unlikely. I knew what I was doing when I ordered it. It happens everyday with most small builders. I mean, that timeframe is just unrealistic.



The difference here is, this sale was advertised as being for partly completed guitars, hence the 60 day estimate for completion. The guitars weren't supposed to be built from the ground up, which would take a year+.

Would I have ordered one if I knew the build time would be a lot longer? Probably yes, but I can see people saying no to that.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

If some of you aren't willing to wait for a full custom guitar at half the price it would have normally been, you should have bought an Ibanez at Guitar Center. 

Bernie extended this deal primarily to Sevenstring.org members to show his appreciation for the people who have supported him and his craft. This was supposed to be a "standard" run, and almost NONE of you left them standard. Seriously, we're talking every change possible (piezos, custom scales, radius, bodies, headstocks, bridges, finishes, inlays, woods, etc.). Some people managed to change to a different model guitar, altogether, by cleverly requesting small spec changes over the course of a month or two. In fact, people are STILL requesting changes on a daily basis. Some of you (you know who you are), have been a serious pain in the ass. 95% of the guitars sold that weekend are full customs. 

Bernie is a friend of mine, and I talk to him a couple times a week. If you had any idea the amount of shit he's had to deal with on this run, you might understand the cause of the delay, and might feel horrible for bitching about it. The guy is working really hard for you. If you just can't handle the wait, sell your spot like others have. 

This has definitely been a learning experience for BRJ. It definitely hasn't gone the way he planned. What started as a production run, ended up being 100 half-priced custom guitars. But don't worry, I'm sure he won't do it again. 

Sorry to sound like a dick about it, but it's not like the dude is taking his sweet ass time building these because he's lazy.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

i left my guitar almost exactly as the standard model is. i didn't add anything that he didn't say i could when he listed the sale. the only thing i changed was that i chose to have my neck pick up not slanted. I did this because i didn't want take advantage of the great deal he was offering but getting such a low priced guitar and then adding bunches of other things to still have it cost less than any regular custom would've been. that being said, wait sucks but i want my guitar to look exactly how i like it/ordered it and if wanting makes that happen, i can do that. Also I can't thank Bernie enough for extending his sale from the first 15 guitars and giving me an opportunity to own my own custom shop guitar, He was extremely generous to do so. The wait is worth it.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

NeoTheMaggot said:


> I can't thank Bernie enough for extending his sale from the first 15 guitars and giving me an opportunity to own my own custom shop guitar, He was extremely generous to do so. The wait is worth it.



That's exactly why he didn't "stop taking orders when he exceeded his capacity to produce them that quickly". He didn't want anyone to miss out if they wanted one of his guitars. It's a wicked deal, regardless of the wait. Seriously.


----------



## thrsher

all i have to say is, i bitch here and not at bernie because i am a business man and i get it all. he could have easily have said, all 15 are accounted for and thats it. he didnt have to take in as many as orders as he did, he didnt have to say, these guitars are already in production, i believe he made mistakes and as you said he will learn from his experince.


----------



## thrsher

i can only imagine how much hounding he is getting but people need a place to vent and this is the post for it


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

thrsher said:


> all i have to say is, i bitch here and not at bernie because i am a business man and i get it all. he could have easily have said, all 15 are accounted for and thats it. he didnt have to take in as many as orders as he did, he didnt have to say, these guitars are already in production, i believe he made mistakes and as you said he will learn from his experince.



The original 15 were, and still are in mid production. Out of those first 15, only a couple of them remained "stock". Those are near the end of the woodshop phase, according to B. The others barely even resemble the original guitar and had he had to start from scratch. You're right, he didn't have to continue taking orders after the 15 were accounted for. But, you're a business man, I'm sure you can connect the dots.


----------



## eaeolian

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Bernie is a friend of mine, and I talk to him a couple times a week. If you had any idea the amount of shit he's had to deal with on this run, you might understand the cause of the delay, and might feel horrible for bitching about it. The guy is working really hard for you. If you just can't handle the wait, sell your spot like others have.



Honestly, given that he let people work outside the bounds of the initial deal, I don't feel bad about it at all. I know of at least two other small builders that learned that the hard way, and one of them went out of business because of it.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

eaeolian said:


> Honestly, given that he let people work outside the bounds of the initial deal, I don't feel bad about it at all. I know of at least two other small builders that learned that the hard way, and one of them went out of business because of it.



There's no doubt it was an ambitious move. If I gathered up 5 of my friends to build 100+ custom guitars, it would take us a lifetime. But I highly doubt it's going to sink Bernie's boat. It's just going to take some time to complete. 

Also, cool story bro. Way to show optimism for a small business man, who tried to do something nice for our beloved forum.


----------



## Invader

For the record, I personally am not bitching. Far from it. Bernie's service has been a class act regarding these Black friday builds.

I was just commenting on the thing that seems to confuse people. I've said it many times before in this thread: I don't mind the wait. I've ordered a custom guitar before, and it took 13 months, three months longer than initial estimate.

I've made several changes on my order, and I know for a fact that I won't be seeing my guitar anytime soon.

That said, Bernie has my support, I trust him 100%.


----------



## toiletstand

its kind of a bummer to see things starting to turn this way :/. i understand why some will be impatient but delays do happen. going into this deal i knew it was gonna take a while and for me its worth it.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Hey guys,

I can understand that a few of you are a bit pissed but seriously as Keith said, wasn´t the deal still fu**ing great ?! 

For me this deal was a "once in a lifetime" chance to get a custom guitar.
I talked with him about a custom guitar beforehand and I admitted that it was still a bit pricy for me (I´m a student and short of money  ), but then he told me about the BF Deal and I took the chance...

I´ve also asked if he´s willing to do a few custom options for me, and now afterwards I feel somewhat bad about it :/ 
I didn´t know that so much people had placed an order so I thought I he´s ok with it it would´nt be such a big deal. How wrong I was...

Also I think the waittime will be worth it, no doubt about that !

Overall I´m pretty happy with how it went so far...
If I have a question he tries to answere my mails if he have time (I´m just sending one if its really important, no worries ! )
And an other cool dude you sure all know told me he will send me some pics in the next time, which would be really awesome 

Now I only have to wait, looking forward to receive "MY DREAM GUITAR" 

And maybe I´ll order another one in a few years if I earn more money  
I hope for Bernie that other guys who placed an order think alike...

( Btw. does someone know, maybe Keith, if he´s doing well again ? Heard he had some health problems.... ) 

Just my thoughts about that...


----------



## MetalDaze

DIOBOLIC5150: If you can be the voice of Bernie that would be great. 

I read on here that some people hear from Bernie all of the time, but then others call and send email and get no reponse. I'm one of the latter people. 

Truth be told, I've been drooling over the Lefty Diva he has posted on his site, but considering I can't get any update on my current build from him, I would be nuts to try and buy it.


----------



## eaeolian

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Also, cool story bro. Way to show optimism for a small business man, who tried to do something nice for our beloved forum.



There's pitfalls to everything, especially overreaching when you're a small business. The other builder is doing just fine, thank you, and one reason for that is that he was honest about it when he screwed up and took too many orders.

BRJ is delivering guitars that are well made, even if they'll be late, so he should be fine in the long-term. I sincerely hope that our forum members have learned their lesson with *that* from some other builders, but that's a different discussion.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

dmccarthy said:


> DIOBOLIC5150: If you can be the voice of Bernie that would be great.
> 
> I read on here that some people hear from Bernie all of the time, but then others call and send email and get no reponse. I'm one of the latter people.
> 
> Truth be told, I've been drooling over the Lefty Diva he has posted on his site, but considering I can't get any update on my current build from him, I would be nuts to try and buy it.



PM me your full name and what you ordered, I'll get you whatever update I can.


----------



## kmanick

Bernie went so far over his inital 15 orders............you guys should resign yourself to the fact that it's probably going to take 8-12 months for him to catch up and forget about it.
Mine took 11 months when i was initially told 4-6.
I could give a crap. Come Play my Hesperian and you'll see the wait is sooooooooooooo
freaking worth it. I just dropped mine off with my tech to change my bridge pickup adn do a little trussrod adjustement and his jaw dropped when I opened the case.
these are amazing instruments.
If I had the cash to burn I would order another BRJ7 in a heart beat and just forget about it until it's ready.
Did Bernie overextend himself here?
shit ya.
Did he do it to be a jerk or did he do it to be able to give a bunch of guys the opportunity to own a very expensive beautiful instrument at basically 1/2 the price it would normally cost? And he let you change the specs on them even!!
Cut him some slack, he's doing whatever he can to catch up and given time he will.
He took a lot of orders, you don't want him to outsource this shit do you?
IF you live in the Boston area you are more than welcome to swing by and check mine out (we can meet at the Axe-Palace) so you can see in person how awesome these guitars are.


----------



## Emperoff

Invader said:


> For the record, I personally am not bitching. Far from it. Bernie's service has been a class act regarding these Black friday builds.
> 
> I was just commenting on the thing that seems to confuse people. I've said it many times before in this thread: I don't mind the wait. I've ordered a custom guitar before, and it took 13 months, three months longer than initial estimate.
> 
> I've made several changes on my order, and I know for a fact that I won't be seeing my guitar anytime soon.
> 
> That said, Bernie has my support, I trust him 100%.



Same here. I just don't see anything different here than most other builders. I mean, EVERY luthier that does this kinds of limited runs gets a truckload of orders, because people that otherwise would never be able to afford a custom inmediately jumps on the bandwagon (like me ).

Then, the builder gets swamped by orders (hell, he even got ill) and delays happen. It has happened before, and it will happen again. And when everything is finished, Bernie will think about if the extra income is worth the extra work and headaches. If it does, maybe he'll do another run. If not, he won't.

What I don't understand is why people keep bitching after the smoking deal that we got. If you're not willing to wait, don't order a custom guitar.


----------



## leonardo7

Hey if Bernie collected $600 from 100 people then that can only mean he has over $1000 from each person coming. Thats $100,000 + that Im sure Bernie wants just as much as we all want our guitars. It would be in his best interest to get these done as fast and proper as possible and Im sure thats what hes doing.


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## ovation22

Sadly, I missed the black friday deal. I was hoping this might be an annual thing? I would love to get in on the deal if it ever happens again. The original specs on a Hesperian Slant Top 727 is all I would want. If it wouldn't be more work for Bernie to keep track of I would even offer to take over someone waiting.


----------



## mikernaut

I already have a mock up completed for what would be my 3rd Rico. I'm actually considering selling off most my CS ESP's and a CS Charvel to fund it. To me his guitars are that good. Damn my GAS. lol

When my 1st BRJ arrived I played it for about 20mins and instantly knew I was going to order a 7 string at that point. My mind was made up, I was that impressed.

I'll admit I have been frustrated with the wait and other things during the build but in the end I still and try to express my enthusiasm for the quality of his work. It's like when you stumble across a unknown talented band and you just want others to be exposed to this new found joy.


----------



## WillDfx

All I have to say is, Bernie is the man! He can take as long as he needs to on my orders. I'm just so exuberant about being apart of something that is as revolutionary as Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars.


----------



## aslsmm

haha i love this thread, As the OP i demand it not get closed......please.... 


seriously though guys this thread isnt for releasing stress about the delayed build times or define what is right or wrong for a builder to advertise. it is for your guitar specs and udates. if you have not recieved an update from bernie feel free to ask on here, no bitching and no defending bernies honor. start a different thread for that shit. 


there are two facts
1- bernie got overzealous and now he is paying for it. 
2- we are getting some bad ass guitars

diabolic5150 i apreciate the fact that you can vouche for bernie and that your in oregon (im in albany) but keep in mind tone of voice dosnt come across in peoples post, so some one might be simply stating a fact and it can sound like their bitching. lets try to keep this open for our benefit of keeping each other updated. 

i love all my fellow ss,o members....... accept jymellis...... im just kidding, jym rocks the fuckin free world.


----------



## TheJokker

if bernie was only expecting to sell 20 guitars and maybe a few more it would have been impossible for him to give an accurate estimated build time to those early buyers. when he realized he might sell 40 or 50 it would still be impossible to give accurate build times considering he would eventually sell 100. being overzealous? absolutely not. underestimating the demand for his guitars at that price point? yes.

even if it takes a year that is still better than most custom shops and you got a $1000 dollar discount. i can't help but feel anyone who feels they have a right to complain about their deal needs a douche. i don't think you can find anybody to match the deal you have with bernie.


----------



## Emperoff

leonardo7 said:


> Hey if Bernie collected $600 from 100 people then that can only mean he has over $1000 from each person coming. Thats $100,000 + that Im sure Bernie wants just as much as we all want our guitars. It would be in his best interest to get these done as fast and proper as possible and Im sure thats what hes doing.



Considering there's about two guitars with the original specs, you should probably be looking from $200,000.



aslsmm said:


> seriously though guys this thread isnt for releasing stress about the delayed build times or define what is right or wrong for a builder to advertise. it is for your guitar specs and udates.
> 
> i love all my fellow ss,o members....... accept jymellis...... im just kidding, jym rocks the fuckin free world.



Ok, so I'll post my final specs then, just for the sake of it:

- 7 strings Hesperian Slant
- Maple neckthru with 16" radius ebony board and maple binding (oiled)
- Mahogany wings
- Quilted maple top on trans black/purple burst finish (natural on back and sides)
- Hipshot fixed bridge
- Dimarzio Crunchlab & Liquifire set with Petrucci wiring.
- Black hardware
- Stainless steel frets

And yes, I'm one of the people who changed specs from time to time. Actually I ordered the guitar at last minute, so the specs were kinda rough


----------



## leonardo7

Emperoff said:


> Considering there's about two guitars with the original specs, you should probably be looking from $200,000.
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, so I'll post my final specs then, just for the sake of it:
> 
> - 7 strings Hesperian Slant
> - Maple neckthru with 16" radius ebony board and maple binding (oiled)
> - Mahogany wings
> - Quilted maple top on trans black/purple burst finish (natural on back and sides)
> - Hipshot fixed bridge
> - Dimarzio Crunchlab & Liquifire set with Petrucci wiring.
> - Black hardware
> - Stainless steel frets
> 
> And yes, I'm one of the people who changed specs from time to time. Actually I ordered the guitar at last minute, so the specs were kinda rough



Mine is basically the exact same specs but I decided to go with mahogany neckthru with an 81-7 in the bridge. I have a couple ESPs that are maple neck thru so I figured its a nice chance to try something different so Im getting a mahogany neck. I too made a last minute adjustment. Im gonna call Bernie, add some elaborate fret work and then get all upset cause its not ready in one more month


----------



## aiur55

The finish will definitely make yours take longer.

I just got mine all stock, with 2 pickups and oiled. Am I the stock-est BRJ BF guitar?


----------



## Hollowway

Emperoff said:


> The point is that whatever the builder says, getting a custom made guitar in 60 days is highly unlikely. I knew what I was doing when I ordered it.


 
I think you're being a bit harsh on the people who are wondering where their guitar is. So you're saying that you think Bernie was lying or ignorant when he gave a 60 day time frame, and you knew he couldn't deliver, and you are criticizing others for not making the same assumptions? That's ridiculous. I'm as big of a Rico Jr fan as anybody - the BF order of mine is the 3rd BRJ for me - so I'm well aware of what his build times are. But you can't assume that everyone will know that their 60 day guitars won't show up for several months. Heck even you thought the BF guitars were starting to roll in! People like you, Keith, me, kmanick, etc. etc. know how the luthier industry works, with timelines, delays, etc., but to say that someone who isn't prepared to hand over their money and just close their eyes should just buy a production guitar from GC is condescending. No one here is complaining about the deal or the quality of BRJs. I think a lot of people are worried and want to know that everything is OK, not get yelled at for asking.


----------



## Hollowway

aiur55 said:


> The finish will definitely make yours take longer.
> 
> I just got mine all stock, with 2 pickups and oiled. Am I the stock-est BRJ BF guitar?


 
Nope, right there with you! I got mine with two pups, too. An 8 string. I jumped on that the minute I saw the post!  Just way to good of a deal to pass up.


----------



## possumkiller

Maybe Ill come into some extra cash when someone is wanting to sell their spot lol. I really wish I couldve got into this one.


----------



## Emperoff

Hollowway said:


> I think you're being a bit harsh on the people who are wondering where their guitar is. So you're saying that you think Bernie was lying or ignorant when he gave a 60 day time frame, and you knew he couldn't deliver, and you are criticizing others for not making the same assumptions? That's ridiculous. I'm as big of a Rico Jr fan as anybody - the BF order of mine is the 3rd BRJ for me - so I'm well aware of what his build times are. But you can't assume that everyone will know that their 60 day guitars won't show up for several months. Heck even you thought the BF guitars were starting to roll in! People like you, Keith, me, kmanick, etc. etc. know how the luthier industry works, with timelines, delays, etc., but to say that someone who isn't prepared to hand over their money, have a deadline missed and no communication should just buy a production guitar from GC is condescending. No one here is complaining about the deal or the quality of BRJs. I think a lot of people are worried and want to know that everything is OK, not get yelled at for asking.



When did I say that Bernie was lying or ignorant? He said the completion dates _*before*_ getting the orders, so it's quite easily to see why they don't match. I'm pretty sure that if he knew that he was going to get 100 orders, the timeframes would have been different 

I'm not criticizing anyone, man. But I certainly believe that some people should do a little bit of research before ordering a custom guitar, because this kind of things happen everyday. If people didn't know what they were getting into, they shouldn't have ordered the guitar because that's how custom guitars usually work.


----------



## Hollowway

Emperoff said:


> I'm not criticizing anyone, man. But I certainly believe that some people should do a little bit of research before ordering a custom guitar, because this kind of things happen everyday. If people didn't know what they were getting into, they shouldn't have ordered the guitar because that's how custom guitars usually work.



I know, I'm just saying that of the 100 or whatever people ordered the guitars, a few people have asked questions, and I just think those of us that have been on here a long time ought to try to help people out rather than tell them they shouldn't be bitching about it. Ordering a custom guitar these days seems like walking a mine field. You don't know if you're getting into a Rico, Strictly 7, KxK deal, or if you're getting into a Brutalizer, Roter, or Emperion deal. It's totally logical that someone who hasn't been around the block would get freaked out.


----------



## DDDorian

So he took in over 100 $600 deposits that weekend? That's $60,000, roughly twice the average family Income in the US. He can't pay some kid $7.00/hr to take some pictures and reply to an e-mail or two?

Keep in mind that $60k is conservative and doesn't count his outstanding previous orders/business. 

I don't see issues with getting pics when endorsees go to his shop for the day.


----------



## ECGuitars

DDDorian said:


> So he took in over 100 $600 deposits that weekend? That's $60,000, roughly twice the average family Income in the US. He can't pay some kid $7.00/hr to take some pictures and reply to an e-mail or two?
> 
> Keep in mind that $60k is conservative and doesn't count his outstanding previous orders/business.
> 
> I don't see issues with getting pics when endorsees go to his shop for the day.



Bear is mind that, that 60k doesn't drop into his pocket as profit. Most of that money is overhead for the cost of parts for each person's guitar. That is why it is a non-refundable deposit. There seems to be a communication issue, but speaking from a builders perspective 100 practically full blown custom guitars is a LOT. At around 50-75 or MORE hours a guitar just do the math, he should have been up front about the wait time but he didn't know he'd get such a huge response. Just my thoughts on the whole thing, you guy's are gonna get some sick guitars, just have a little patience.


----------



## Hollowway

ECGuitars said:


> At around 50-75 or MORE hours a guitar .


Is that a pretty accurate number? I've always wondered how long it takes for a professional to crank out a custom.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

DDDorian said:


> So he took in over 100 $600 deposits that weekend? That's $60,000, roughly twice the average family Income in the US. He can't pay some kid $7.00/hr to take some pictures and reply to an e-mail or two?
> 
> Keep in mind that $60k is conservative and doesn't count his outstanding previous orders/business.
> 
> I don't see issues with getting pics when endorsees go to his shop for the day.



I thought mods were supposed to keep comments like this in check, not fuel the fire. What Bernie does with his revenue is nobody's concern. You pretty much blow.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Keith, that's the second time you've attacked a Mod in this thread. Make it a third and you'll be gone longer than it's going to take for folks to start getting thier BRJs. 

You're getting way too worked up.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

MaxOfMetal said:


> Keith, that's the second time you've attacked a Mod in this thread. Make it a third and you'll be gone longer than it's going to take for folks to start getting thier BRJs.
> 
> You're getting way too worked up.



So let me get this straight, if my name was in blue, I could say whatever I wanted with no consequence. But, because it's not, I get threatened with a ban for spitting the truth? Funny stuff. 

I'm not really worked up, I'm just telling it like it is. I thought that was a low blow. The "mods" I "attacked", have done nothing but add fuel to the fire. I'm just trying to help people. In fact, I've gotten over 40 updates for people on this run since yesterday morning regarding their guitars. Ban away, and don't bother asking if I care.

Anyone else want an update- hit me up at [email protected] in case I get banned for some reason. lol


----------



## eaeolian

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> So let me get this straight, if my name was in blue, I could say whatever I wanted with no consequence. But, because it's not, I get threatened with a ban for spitting the truth? Funny stuff.



Nothing DDD or I said wasn't true, it just didn't match your perception of the situation. 



DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> I'm not really worked up, I'm just telling it like it is. I thought that was a low blow. The "mods" I "attacked", have done nothing but add fuel to the fire. I'm just trying to help people.



The mods you attacked (no quotes, because both things are true) have done nothing but point out possible holes in the story, which is one of our purposes here, y'know?

It's great that you're a BRJ endorser. It's also great that you're willing to go the extra mile to get people updates. What's sad is that you have to do it, when it's something the company should take care of it themselves, or be compensating you for doing so.


----------



## BernieRicoJr

eaeolian said:


> The mods you attacked (no quotes, because both things are true) have done nothing but point out possible holes in the story, which is one of our purposes here, y'know?




What, exactly, is the point of trying to point out "possible holes in the story"? How does that help anything? It raises unnecessary concerns. I can assure you, every one of these guitars are in production and being worked on AS WE SPEAK. I can't help but feel like you, and others, are wanting me to fail. The fact that you "mods" would question my business practices, and even try to tell me what I should do with my income, is beyond disrespect. Plain and simple. 

I created this sale for the sole purpose of giving players at Sevenstring the opportunity to own a USA custom at a price they could live with. Yes, it takes time. Yes, I got a lot of orders. Yes, there are delays as a result. If anyone is unwilling to live with that, please call or email me so we can work out a possible solution for you. If I don't answer right away, leave a message and I will do everything I can to get back to you ASAP. 

I'm pretty put off by the lack of support I've seen from the people who manage this site. I'm just going to go ahead and remove myself. I don't want to conduct business in an environment where the "powers that be" appear to have bad intentions. I will never, ever, offer anything like this again. 

I'm sorry to all, I'm just very sad to see this. I'm not going to get walked on by people. Here is all my contact information so you can inquire about your order if need be. 

Bernie Rico Jr.

Phone: 760-956-6619 
Fax: 760-956-3419 
Email: [email protected] 
17205 Eucalyptus, suite B5
Hesperia, CA 92345 *USA*


----------



## eaeolian

BernieRicoJr said:


> I'm pretty put off by the lack of support I've seen from the people who manage this site. I'm just going to go ahead and remove myself. I don't want to conduct business in an environment where the "powers that be" appear to have bad intentions. I will never, ever, offer anything like this again.



That, of course, is your option. My phrasing was easy to misinterpret there, so let's try "things that I think should have been handled differently", and call it even.

I haven't seen you being walked on. I've seen some debate about your handling of the situation, a lot of people that have no issues with the situation, and some that do, so it seems pretty fair. Obviously, you feel differently.

Our intentions are to support our users - that's our job as moderators. In my personal case, I feel like BRJ could have done a better job of updating the slew of customers that are users on this forum. That's all. You're not the first builder it's happened to, and you won't be the last, I'm sure.


----------



## possumkiller

Users=Consumers=Guys who want a hand made custom guitar for nothing and they want it right now and are going to whine and bitch about it until it gets here or it will be to the gallows for the builder.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

eaeolian said:


> It's great that you're a BRJ endorser. It's also great that you're willing to go the extra mile to get people updates. What's sad is that you have to do it, when it's something the company should take care of it themselves, or be compensating you for doing so.



It's all good man. I don't have to help, believe me. I wasn't asked, and I'm certainly not being compensated for it. I just wanted to help. Bernie has his hands full, and it's tough for him to keep up with everyone asking for an update. Because I talk to him on a regular basis, I figured it might make some people happy if I could get some info for them. I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, honestly. 

This has obviously gotten out of hand, and whether you'd like to admit it or not, a couple of the moderators offended someone who went out of their way to offer this community a good deal. Bernie is an amazing builder, I can't understand why you guys would take stabs at him or "find holes in the story". You fully disrespected one of the last remaining USA master luthiers. And now he left.


----------



## eaeolian

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> It's all good man. I don't have to help, believe me. I wasn't asked, and I'm certainly not being compensated for it. I just wanted to help. Bernie has his hands full, and it's tough for him to keep up with everyone asking for an update. Because I talk to him on a regular basis, I figured it might make some people happy if I could get some info for them. I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, honestly.



Fair enough, and I think it's commendable that you're doing it. 



DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> This has obviously gotten out of hand, and whether you'd like to admit it or not, a couple of the moderators offended someone who went out of their way to offer this community a good deal. Bernie is an amazing builder, I can't understand why you guys would take stabs at him or "find holes in the story". You fully disrespected one of the last remaining USA master luthiers. And now he left.



Honestly, I suspect he'll be back when he cools down, since we all can overreact when we read something we don't like - and I clarified my statement if he does come back to read it. On the flipside, mod or not I'm still allowed my opinion, and I still think BRJ should be doing a better job of updating people who've committed large sums of money to what's become a long-term project. I have no issue with what BRJ is doing other than that.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

The thing about all of this is.. If you can get a hold of Bernie, he'll give you an update, and then some. I consider Bernie a friend, based on the way he's treated me every time I've talked to him, whether it be about business or otherwise. That mother fucker is willing to go the extra mile for everybody he works with - that's the exact reason he introduced this run in the first place. You have to really consider that this discounted Black Friday run was a favor to SS.org members - if that favor takes longer to fulfill, we should be completely supportive of him. He could have taken 100 orders and made twice the money as usual, so it's not right to label him as anything other than a stand-up dude in this situation. Have some empathy, guys.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Well, I' figured I'd post this to attempt to cut down on answering more emails than I already do. 

This is the info I have at the moment, been pretty much telling everyone the same thing. How far along your guitar is, sort of depends on what number it is in the batch. 

Basically, the way they have been handling the production is on a day-to-day basis. So like, on a Monday, they work on the first 1-20 guitars, and by Friday, they are on orders 85-100+. They repeat that process from week to week. Because there's so many, you can get an idea why it's taking longer than expected. 

The first 20 guitars are near the end of the woodshop phase and are getting closer to the finishing stages. They are still likely to be at least 45 days out. 

That's just for the Black Friday run. He has a separate crew that's working on all other custom orders that were placed before and after the Black Friday run. 

The reason he hasn't gotten around to taking a bunch of pics of these guitars is because the wood shop is in a different location than the main shop Bernie works at all the time (doing finish work). But, he said he would do his best to take a picture of the guitars in wood shop, so people can get an idea of how large of a task it actually is. It's difficult for him to get individual pictures of each guitar for customers, because there's just so many, and it would be very time consuming to take that many pics to email one-at-a-time. However, he is going to be paying the wood shop extra to take additional progress pictures, which will hopefully happen soon for you guys. It hasn't happened yet, because he has some "secret projects" in there that he wants to keep under the radar. 

He told me to apologize for him for being so hard to contact, and he's doing his best to help everyone with their questions. Being a personal friend of his, it's a little easier to get in touch with him, so that's why I offered to lend a hand. 

Hope that helps a little. Basically, your guitar is getting closer. 

-Keith


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Not to mention, pretty much everybody added custom options to their builds. Bernie introduced the run with the intention of offering simple, bare-bones, hand-built guitars that are relatively quick to move through production without compromising quality. Try to get the "other" companies to be so lenient with their runs. A vast majority of you are getting guitars that don't even resemble the original guitars being offered, so don't get upset when they're not built in the original suggested time-frame, because you didn't actually order the original design. You ordered a custom, and there's wait times involved in custom guitars.


----------



## thrsher

keith- thank you


----------



## Might-is-Right

I'm going to chime in here as I was one who voiced some concerns over this situation.

First, I think alot of people in this thread really misinterperated what is being said. It's frustrating to see posts like, "quit bitching about the wait, your getting a great deal" etc. I don't think anyone was complaining about the wait per se but more the lack of communication about where the guitars are in the process. I find it pretty amazing that anyone would have issues or questions about the status of the guitars when there have been some pretty inconsistent statements from the start. I'm not going to list those here as my intention is not to bring Bernie's rep into question. I get it; things come up, shit happens, people get sick, suppliers fuck up, things don't go as planned. Thats part of being in business and that is fine, I have no problem with waiting. For what its worth, I would have gladly waited whatever time frame Bernie stated to get in on the sale.

The problem comes when months have passed and I'm not hearing anything and then emails go unanswered (Bernie did ultimately send me the form email about the delays). From a customer standpoint it defintley gives the impression that something may be wrong. Keith's update with what the plan and process is right now goes a long way to understanding what can be expected from here, I wish Bernie had sent that update instead of the less describtive email many of us received.

I don't want to hear the next part when someone is going to jump in now and give the "whole custom guitars take forever be grateful etc etc routine". That is not the issue and never has been with me. I want to know that this is not another one of the small luthier goes under dramas that happened from time to time. It is a brutal climate for the small business owner right now and it could happen to anyone.

Bernie, if your reading this, no one here wants you to fail. Much gets lost in translation in this format. Everyone here on this forum loves your guitars, appreciates the deal and wants to see you succeed. Your product is top notch, if the updates could be a little more consistent and specific it would go a long way.


----------



## thrsher

^ said it the best


----------



## possumkiller

All the guys who got weekly updates and progress pics on custom guitars from ESP, Jackson, Ibanez LACS, etc please raise your hand.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Here's some pics. From what I understand, these are in the first 15. One of them is for Armand, one for Pascal, and I'm not sure who the other one is for. He just sent them to my cell. More pics coming soon.

Quite obvious they weren't left with the original specs. Looking nice, though.


----------



## eaeolian

possumkiller said:


> All the guys who got weekly updates and progress pics on custom guitars from ESP, Jackson, Ibanez LACS, etc please raise your hand.



ESP, Jackson, and Ibanez don't directly come here and post offers, either. Apples <> Oranges.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

I want the middle one. That top is rad.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Here's another, I don't know the details of it. 




Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## Emperoff

Aren't those Jekylls, Keith? I thought the Jekyll shape was introduced longer on the sale, so I find it weird that those are from the first 15.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Emperoff said:


> Aren't those Jekylls, Keith? I thought the Jekyll shape was introduced longer on the sale, so I find it weird that those are from the first 15.



Actually, a lot of people (even right off the bat), wanted the Jekyll body instead. So he let them change it at no charge (I think). He even had people go for the Vixen and Diva body on this run. Basically opened up almost all of the shop options. I believe only about half of them are Hesperian bodies.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Hey Keith, the first one is mine  just got an picture by mail and now I see it here.

Have you an idea how the top looks in "real" ? (don´t know how to say it)
I can´t figure it out on the pic...


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Pascal-Darrell said:


> Hey Keith, the first one is mine  just got an picture by mail and now I see it here.
> 
> Have you an idea how the top looks in "real" ? (don´t know how to say it)
> I can´t figure it out on the pic...



I'm not sure mang. The wood is untreated, so it's hard to see the figuring in it. That, and it's a cell phone pic. What finish are you getting on it?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

See thru black  classy, but very nice in my opinion 

Also in the pu routes you can see the neck no ? or is it still the wood from the top ?
If it´s the neck wood then the rosewood neck hasn´t worked out...


----------



## Chris

> Make it a third and you'll be gone longer than it's going to take for folks to start getting thier BRJs.



Yeesh. That's just not right.



eaeolian said:


> *It's also great that you're willing to go the extra mile to get people updates. What's sad is that you have to do it, when it's something the company should take care of it themselves, or be compensating you for doing so.*



(Not addressing you, Mike, just quoting you for emphasis)

I think this is important here.

Threatening people with bans for getting heated at all in a situation like this, when they're only trying to help, is not something that helps the situation at all.

This is not my site anymore, so take my "advice" with a grain of salt. If someone's chiming in to try and make things right - especially if it isn't even their company, they deserve a little bit of leeway. From reading this thread, Keith has nothing vested in it that I can see, and he's going out of his way to help people.

Yeah, it sucks that he has to, but don't jump all over his shit for doing it. He's not the one building your guitars. You guys need to aim your frustrations in the right direction.


----------



## possumkiller

eaeolian said:


> ESP, Jackson, and Ibanez don't directly come here and post offers, either. Apples <> Oranges.


 
So I guess its probably just better if Bernie just doesnt post any offers here and everyone can pay full price and not get any updates or communication. 

The basic idea I get from all of this is Bernie was far too generous to people that obviously dont appreciate it. Anybody with any common sense could tell that the 60 day timeline was meant for the ORIGINAL guitars ONLY. I was happy to see him extend the deadline to place an order so that many other people could get such a great deal but I knew that all those other orders werent going to be finished in anwhere near that amount of time. Its just physically impossible. 

The deal was for a bare bones, limited option model. Everybody on here changed the rules on that and they expect that the rest of the rules didnt change because of it? 

Then because Bernie spends his time building guitars instead of posting progress pictures all over ss.org people get angry at him and even question his character and integrity. 

Just because we have nothing of particular importance to occupy our time and can spend all day posting on here doesnt mean Bernie doesnt have better things to do. Such as build your guitars. 

If I werent in the mess Im in I wouldve been on that deal like stink on shit and been happily waiting for the hundreds of NBRJD threads to slowly trickle in. Since he is known from little things like the GOOD guitars from B.C. Rich and has guys like Jed Simon and Keith on his roster AND isnt some noob building guitars in his garage, I could safely assume he isnt going to pull a Roter or a Brutalizer.


----------



## eaeolian

possumkiller said:


> Stuff...



You've said your piece, and I've said mine. Back to discussing the guitars.


----------



## mikernaut

Very cool to see some WIP pics. does anybody actually have a straight on shot of the Hesperian body? I'm kinda curious to see the differences? I know the horns are different but is the Hesperan body smaller or anything else?


----------



## aiur55

The sudden activity in this thread has made me GAS hard for my guitar...

Those shots are looking great! If it's not too much to ask, would add a +1 to the photo of a hesperian, preferably mine 

Thanks for updating us Keith!


----------



## leonardo7

mikernaut said:


> Very cool to see some WIP pics. does anybody actually have a straight on shot of the Hesperian body? I'm kinda curious to see the differences? I know the horns are different but is the Hesperan body smaller or anything else?



Mines gonna be a Hesperian. I do know that its a slimmer and maybe even smaller body. Theres definitely less wood in the body of a Hesperian compared to Jekyll. It would be nice to see a pic of both side by side.


----------



## EOT

Here's a pic on BRJ's website. It's from the "Berns gallery" on the home page. 

http://www.ricojrguitars.com/e107_p...llery/Hesperian_624_(with_Diva_Headstock).JPG


----------



## mikernaut

LOL so I type in "Rico Hesperian" in google images and I get some hot chick pictures that go to a thread of "babes" at Harmony Central because Kmanick replied to one of the pics. That a boy Nick 

Anyways I'm just really curious as to the slant top versions of the Hesperian and Jekyll. 


























loving the knobs on the last one.

it just looks like there's more of a "hook" to the horns of the Hesperian.. 

Maybe we should rename this thread the BRJ mega thread considering how active it has become.


----------



## MetalDaze

Aahhhhhhhhhhh.. Back to where we started. Pics of guitars I want to own


----------



## MetalDaze

Did someone mention a Diva?


----------



## mikernaut

wow a lefty to huh?


----------



## MetalDaze

mikernaut said:


> wow a lefty to huh?


 
I know, what are the chances.....a lefty in the body shape I like appears on his site. Does Bernie read minds?


----------



## ROAR

Those slant tops are just unreal.
Easily some of the best work I've ever seen.


----------



## mikernaut

I really want a Schaller Hannes bridge on a slant top Jekyll. That should work right? The Hipshot ones seem to work ok on those tops.


----------



## Hollowway

Edit: I'll just send a PM instead...


----------



## aiur55

That black burst is really making me want a black burst.


----------



## travis bickle

many, many thanks to bernie and keith for taking time to give us a heads up and im glad this thread has become civil. im quite grateful to be waiting for what i expect to be an absolutely mindblowing instrument.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

I'm literally just relaying a message. It's not for the sake of drama - if you want to contact him, use the info he left rather than using the forum to get his attention. That's what that means, more or less.


----------



## Prydogga

@Hollowway He's not provoking anything. He's just relaying what he's heard from Bernie, and I don't blame him, nor think his words would be cause for Bernie to stop posting here. It's clear this thread in general is the cause for that.


----------



## Hollowway

Adam Of Angels said:


> I'm literally just relaying a message. It's not for the sake of drama - if you want to contact him, use the info he left rather than using the forum to get his attention. That's what that means, more or less.


----------



## Invader

It's really nice to see some progress pics. I wonder if anyone else went with a HS-pickup configuration... (I hope not, it makes spotting mine in the bunch a lot easier. )


----------



## mikernaut

moar BRJ pron

Platinum Jek














Pigeon poo splatter?  or something else?  I still dig it


----------



## kmanick

keep in mind on the neckthru hesperians the neck sits in a little deeper than the bolt ons.
I was thrown a little when I first got mine and Bernie explained it to me. all of the hesperian pics in this thread so far are bolt ons.
mine (for comparison and mor pron)


----------



## Emperoff

Check out this Flickr page to see awesome photos of a lot of BRJs:

Bernie Rico Jr CUSTOM SPALTED '627' Jekyll Guitar at Boogie Street Guitars, Pittsburgh | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Instant GAS attack!


----------



## possumkiller

That Platinum is freakin badass. I love how colours like that show off the contours and cutouts.


----------



## mikernaut

It's really bad for my GAS to have Photoshop and numerous ideas. 

a single/hum platinum. (kinda messy but you get the idea)






a Demon/PII 540 inspired shape






Wicked Violet Jek 






How about a BRJ Tele?






I needz moar moneyz


----------



## Emperoff

mikernaut said:


> Wicked Violet Jek




Mine is gonna have a very similar concept to those ones. If I had photoshop skills I'd do a proper mockup  Anyway, this is one of the pictures I sent to Bernie to match the finish, but with the natural back like yours, and of course no EMGs or floyd:


----------



## possumkiller

mikernaut said:


> It's really bad for my GAS to have Photoshop and numerous ideas.
> How about a BRJ Tele?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I needz moar moneyz


 
OMFG

8 string please!


----------



## Hollowway

possumkiller said:


> OMFG
> 
> 8 string please!


----------



## mikernaut

Cool Emperoff. Are you going with a flame top or a quilt and what about inlays? or do you wanna leave some elements a surprise?


----------



## Invader

Anyone getting an abalone or mop logo inlay instead of a painted logo? I wonder what the upcharge would be for it.


----------



## toiletstand

im kicking in myself the ass for not going for the side inlays right about now haha.


----------



## Emperoff

Invader said:


> Anyone getting an abalone or mop logo inlay instead of a painted logo? I wonder what the upcharge would be for it.



I was wondering the same. Been thinking of a MOP one, it will stand out better.


----------



## josh pelican

Emperoff said:


>



OH FUCK. That is nice.

Also, I would buy a BRJ Tele. Spalted Maple. H/H pickup configuration. Especially if it had fanned frets.


----------



## mikernaut

Yeah those side inlays are killer, but I do recall they were a pricey upgrade.

MOP and Abalone "B" logo Pron.  As well as Jek headstock and Diva headstock.


----------



## Invader

Oh damn it Mike, you just made my decision regarding the logo even harder. They both look really nice.


----------



## toiletstand

yeah i recall the upcharge. i think i could swing it now though. lol dang. guitars look beautiful as always sir


----------



## Hollowway

kmanick said:


> keep in mind on the neckthru hesperians the neck sits in a little deeper than the bolt ons.
> I was thrown a little when I first got mine and Bernie explained it to me. all of the hesperian pics in this thread so far are bolt ons.
> mine (for comparison and mor pron)


Yeah, after seeing that Bernie did allow body style switches I sent an email to Keith and him last night asking about it. Keith told me fret access is the same on the Hesperian and Jekylls, which made me feel better, because that was a concern of mine. Did you ask for the neck to be seated further into the body? Because yours appears to have less high fret access than the flamed prototype slant Hesperian.

EDIT: Maybe it's because yours is a 24 fret model? I'm doing 27 fret like the proto, so maybe that's why.


----------



## eaeolian

Adam Of Angels said:


> I'm literally just relaying a message. It's not for the sake of drama - if you want to contact him, use the info he left rather than using the forum to get his attention. That's what that means, more or less.



Uh, injecting your personal opinion into it is not just relaying a message. This is as much as you needed to say, and the matter is closed.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Hollowway said:


> Keith told me fret access is the same on the Hesperian and Jekylls,



That's my understanding, but email Bernie about it. I'd feel bad if I was wrong. Either way, upper fret access isn't an issue on the Jekyll or Hesperian.


----------



## kmanick

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, after seeing that Bernie did allow body style switches I sent an email to Keith and him last night asking about it. Keith told me fret access is the same on the Hesperian and Jekylls, which made me feel better, because that was a concern of mine. Did you ask for the neck to be seated further into the body? Because yours appears to have less high fret access than the flamed prototype slant Hesperian.
> 
> EDIT: Maybe it's because yours is a 24 fret model? I'm doing 27 fret like the proto, so maybe that's why.


 
No that's just the way he does them.
Remember the horns on mine were trimmed down a bit from the usual Hseperian horns so that may be why it looks like my upper fret access is different.
Mine is 24 frets and I think the upper fret access is great (and I play up there all the time) 
look thru the other BRJ trheads in the dealers secion there are some pics of a purple Hesperian with a floyd and you can see that the floyd is set back on that one too. (but tht one has the "usual" horns on it.)
I found it here


----------



## Hollowway

kmanick said:


> No that's just the way he does them.
> Remember the horns on mine were trimmed down a bit from the usual Hseperian horns so that may be why it looks like my upper fret access is different.
> Mine is 24 frets and I think the upper fret access is great (and I play up there all the time)
> look thru the other BRJ trheads in the dealers secion there are some pics of a purple Hesperian with a floyd and you can see that the floyd is set back on that one too. (but tht one has the "usual" horns on it.)



Yeah, I like the look of the bridge being close to the end of the body (like a bass). Based on the 27 fret model (like in this thread: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...rico-jr-hesperian-slant-7-build-progress.html) i would guess that he backs the neck out an inch to allow for access to the higher frets. At least that's what it looks like, no?


----------



## Emperoff

Invader said:


> Oh damn it Mike, you just made my decision regarding the logo even harder. They both look really nice.



I think the MOP one looks awesome.


----------



## Invader

Emperoff said:


> I think the MOP one looks awesome.



I'd normally go with mop, but I think the abalone one would look killer with the purple burst finish I'm going with.


----------



## adrock

Hollowway said:


> Keith told me fret access is the same on the Hesperian and Jekylls, which made me feel better, because that was a concern of mine. Did you ask for the neck to be seated further into the body? Because yours appears to have less high fret access than the flamed prototype slant Hesperian.
> 
> EDIT: Maybe it's because yours is a 24 fret model? I'm doing 27 fret like the proto, so maybe that's why.





kmanick said:


> No that's just the way he does them.
> Remember the horns on mine were trimmed down a bit from the usual Hseperian horns so that may be why it looks like my upper fret access is different.
> Mine is 24 frets and I think the upper fret access is great (and I play up there all the time)
> look thru the other BRJ trheads in the dealers secion there are some pics of a purple Hesperian with a floyd and you can see that the floyd is set back on that one too. (but tht one has the "usual" horns on it.)
> I found it here...





Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I like the look of the bridge being close to the end of the body (like a bass). Based on the 27 fret model (like in this thread: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...rico-jr-hesperian-slant-7-build-progress.html) i would guess that he backs the neck out an inch to allow for access to the higher frets. At least that's what it looks like, no?



i'm pretty curious about this whole "neck position" situation you guys are discussing. basically, is bernie just shifting the bridge forward/back to line the last fret up with the cutaway?


----------



## Invader

adrock said:


> basically, is bernie just shifting the bridge forward/back to line the last fret up with the cutaway?



Isn't that how it's usually done? That's part of the reason why a 24 fret les paul looks off to me. The bridge has to be shifted forward in order to get a reasonable access to the two extra frets.






I too like the look of the bridge being close to the edge of the body, but on a 27 fret Hesperian which I'm getting, it's either that and bad fret access, or vice versa. Can't have both.


----------



## adrock

Invader said:


> Isn't that how it's usually done?


well, that's how it should be done. I've seen a fair share of guitars (not brj's) with the last fret well past the cutaway. I was more or less just clarifying what was going on


----------



## noob_pwn

reading the comments in this thread is pretty upsetting for me.
Bernie is an outstanding luthier and not a stand up guy, he works his ass off around the clock, hell the guy will even talk to me on the phone 4am his time because its convenient for me.

My 2 guitars i own that he built took longer than quoted BUT when i got them they were more amazing than i ever could have anticipated and the wait was so worth what i got in the end.

You guys need to cool your heels and realise he's only human and a small business operator, but at the same time he is honest and you WILL get your guitar eventually.


----------



## Invader

I thought we were past that drama already, wink wink nudge nudge, say no more


----------



## eaeolian

Yep. Next guy to try and pull a drama resurrection gets a month to think about it.


----------



## MetalDaze

So, I'm talking to Bernie about this Diva he has in stock. I need to figure out what finish to get. I'm thinking of either:

A) Natural with black burst
B) Natural with black bevels
C) Transparent blue

Obviously, C is alot different than the others. I just want to make sure that quilt stands out! What do you guys think?


----------



## aiur55

How bout transparent blue with black burst edges?


----------



## mikernaut

I'm not big on natural guitars. But it does look great on the 8string natural blackburst he has on his site.


----------



## Hollowway

Blue top, natural sides and back.


----------



## Emperoff

mikernaut said:


> I'm not big on natural guitars. But it does look great on the 8string natural blackburst he has on his site.



+1 The Blackbursts look awesome indeed


----------



## MetalDaze

Thanks guys. I've decided to go with a Trans Blue over the quilt with black bevels. Not a burst, just the bevels to frame the blue, leaving the sides and back natural. 

Sort of like Nolly's Jekyll:


----------



## mikernaut

Speaking of Nolly's guitars ,somebody needs to do a bright pink BRJ quilt or flame top, Along the lines of his pink Daemoness.


----------



## mikernaut

grab your spandex and hair spray it's retro Jekyll time!


----------



## heilarkyguitar

Gimme the green.....gimme the green one......


----------



## Hollowway

dmccarthy said:


> Thanks guys. I've decided to go with a Trans Blue over the quilt with black bevels. Not a burst, just the bevels to frame the blue, leaving the sides and back natural.



 Yeah, I think that's one of his best looking finishes. My custom is going to have a red top with the natural sides and back as well. Now, are you going to gloss the whole thing or just the top, and leave the back and sides oiled? I think that's how the original 828 Jekyll is.


----------



## toiletstand

mikernaut said:


> grab your spandex and hair spray it's retro Jekyll time!



ha send those to bernie they look sick!


----------



## travis bickle

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I think that's one of his best looking finishes. My custom is going to have a red top with the natural sides and back as well. Now, are you going to gloss the whole thing or just the top, and leave the back and sides oiled? I think that's how the original 828 Jekyll is.




Nice!! My hesperian will share the same finish. You have good taste sir. Haha.


----------



## mikernaut

made some more tele variants while I wait for Fedex to show up with another new toy.

played around with the lower horn but I still think I like the original Jekyll one





[/IMG]


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> made some more tele variants while I wait for Fedex to show up with another new toy.
> 
> played around with the lower horn but I still think I like the original Jekyll one



Dude, you're crazy! Those look really cool. I'm not a tele fan, but I really like what you did with it. Props for using the Diva HS, too.


----------



## toiletstand

theres a thread here where a guy mentions he was working with bernie on a tele model. wish he would update it!


----------



## mikernaut

tltstand said:


> theres a thread here where a guy mentions he was working with bernie on a tele model. wish he would update it!




Hmmmm I'm very interested to see about this. Although if Bernie would do a tele that's bad for my GAS , money and the other guitars in my collection that might get sold off. 

I'm really digging the gatorade/lime green version.


----------



## toiletstand

im really looking forward to it! that lime green is very cool too


----------



## Invader

tltstand said:


> theres a thread here where a guy mentions he was working with bernie on a tele model. wish he would update it!



Yeah, if I remember correctly, Adam Of Angels mentioned about the tele-prototype in a thread recently. I'd definitely like to see how that will turn out.


----------



## Jexey

27inch Purple flame hard tail tele 7 with lundgrens would turn the world upside down.


----------



## themike

Jexey said:


> 27inch Purple flame hard tail tele 7 with lundgrens would turn the world upside down.


 
Does that mean we would be ahead 12 hours or behind 12 hours?


----------



## MetalDaze

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I think that's one of his best looking finishes. My custom is going to have a red top with the natural sides and back as well. Now, are you going to gloss the whole thing or just the top, and leave the back and sides oiled? I think that's how the original 828 Jekyll is.


 
Yeah, oiled back and sides.


----------



## Jexey

th3m1ke said:


> Does that mean we would be ahead 12 hours or behind 12 hours?



The fabric of time as we knew it would burn away into oblivion


----------



## Emperoff

Jexey said:


> The fabric of time as we knew it would burn away into oblivion



Fuck, I'm hanged to this thread for pictures, don't ever do a lame bump like this again or i'll kill you all


----------



## Isan

Did anyone get any pics ?


----------



## toiletstand

havent asked yet. you?


----------



## thrsher

I emailed him acouple of days ago for an update and his response was a cut and paste copy of what he wrote april 7th in this thread

Not pleased


----------



## Hollowway

I wouldn't worry about it too much. I'm in agreement with most of us that think it'll take roughly as long as a regular custom. My custom is out of paint now, an it's been in for about 17 months. We hit a snag with it, so I would think we would expect these BF deals around the fall/winter. That's pure speculation, but they really are pretty much customs we're getting.


----------



## toiletstand

lol at the tags


----------



## thrsher

Hollowway said:


> I wouldn't worry about it too much. I'm in agreement with most of us that think it'll take roughly as long as a regular custom. My custom is out of paint now, an it's been in for about 17 months. We hit a snag with it, so I would think we would expect these BF deals around the fall/winter. That's pure speculation, but they really are pretty much customs we're getting.


 

and im totally cool with that but completely ignoring my question and just give me a cut/paste response is horrible customer service in my book. i just simple want to know where my guitar stands in production.


----------



## travis bickle

i agree with holloway, i've accepted the fact that i won't be receiving an instrument until either later this year, or early 2012.


----------



## Emperoff

travis bickle said:


> i agree with holloway, i've accepted the fact that i won't be receiving an instrument until either later this year, or early 2012.



Let's hope for kickass christmas presents then!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

just bumping to say i bought a spot on the BF list! got a standard 8 string build coming with a 28" scale. daaaamn i cant wait! make sure to post pics when you get em!


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Here's some Black Friday guitars that just came out of wood shop. 





Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Here's my slant top Jekyll. Stoked on it. It's not from the Black Friday run, but I thought I'd share anyway. 





Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## leonardo7

Epic! Cant Wait!


----------



## thrsher

sick one of those 6ers very well could be mine!!!


----------



## Jexey

Thanks for the update keith... Hopefully Bernie lets us know a month or so before they're completed so us meer mortals can scratch cash together to finish payment


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## noob_pwn

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Uploaded with ImageShack.us



pretty sure thats my one on the bottom right, thanks for sharing keith!


----------



## Hollowway

noob_pwn said:


> pretty sure thats my one on the bottom right, thanks for sharing keith!


 
Oh, so you had the slant top Hesperian with the ebony FB and the maple top, huh? 

Actually, I'm hoping that 8 on the top row is mine!


----------



## noob_pwn

Hollowway said:


> Oh, so you had the slant top Hesperian with the ebony FB and the maple top, huh?
> 
> Actually, I'm hoping that 8 on the top row is mine!




haha good point


----------



## Invader

No retro 2+5 headstocks in those pics makes me a sad panda.

j/k, I knew my guitar wouldn't be in that stage yet. 

Thanks for the pics, this is what this thread needs!


----------



## TheJokker

thrsher said:


> and im totally cool with that but completely ignoring my question and just give me a cut/paste response is horrible customer service in my book. i just simple want to know where my guitar stands in production.


so you would rather bernie spend hours everyday answering every single email instead of working on guitars? he is not a huge corporation; he is a small businessman. you got a super-sweet price on your guitar. there is not much profit left to pay for red carpet customer service. you will get exactly what you paid for...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Keith. If my charcoal top jekyll 727 comes out with a quilt maple even remotely as delightfully figured as that guitar, I'm going to immediately start sacrificing virgins to volcanoes. When I showed my wife these pictures, she literally said "Email that to Bernie and write 'this figure please'." 

I LOL'd.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Trying to get a spot in the BF run right now. Just gotta contact Bernie to ask a few questions about it and it should be all good. Really hoping it works out, I'm super excited! 

And awesome pics Keith! That top on yours is bad ass!


----------



## aslsmm

TheJokker said:


> so you would rather bernie spend hours everyday answering every single email instead of working on guitars? he is not a huge corporation; he is a small businessman. you got a super-sweet price on your guitar. there is not much profit left to pay for red carpet customer service. you will get exactly what you paid for...




I smell a troll, dont make me sick ernest with a super soaker full of milk on your ass!


----------



## mikernaut

Man ,I need a slant top Jekyll. watch out... Jens is trying to steal ur guitar. hehehe


----------



## kmanick

Invader said:


> No retro 2+5 headstocks in those pics makes me a sad panda.
> 
> j/k, I knew my guitar wouldn't be in that stage yet.
> 
> Thanks for the pics, this is what this thread needs!


 
You sir have exquisite taste


----------



## Neil

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Win*


Cheers for posting these! Thank Bernie if you see him too


----------



## MTech

Has anybody been able to get in touch with Jr lately?? I'd like to get an update and it seems next to impossible...it's be one thing if I got progress photos or saw anything of mine in any of these photos but not seeing it.


----------



## TheJokker

*mod edit: I smell somebody who's going to get banned if they don't knock off the crap*


----------



## ev1ltwin

sent this email yesterday:

_Hey Bernie,_
_It's been half a year since I last reached out to you. I'd appreciate any updates on my build or an ETA for when I'll be able to play this guitar._
_Thanks!_

I'll let you guys know if I hear anything back.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> Has anybody been able to get in touch with Jr lately?? I'd like to get an update and it seems next to impossible...it's be one thing if I got progress photos or saw anything of mine in any of these photos but not seeing it.



Yeah, I talked to him (email) about 2 or 3 weeks ago about my regular custom run. We're just waiting on some BKPs from Nick and then he can finish it up. Are you waiting for a regular custom or a BF? I have a BF order also, but no update on that.  Given his backlog of customs I would guess they're still several months away from completion, but that's just pure speculation.


----------



## aslsmm

In the words of tom petty

the waiting is the hardest part.


----------



## Hollowway

aslsmm said:


> In the words of tom petty
> 
> the waiting is the hardest part.



Yes, although I have no sympathy for you Black Friday types. I'm at 18 months on my custom. Of course I couldn't resist the BF deal either, so in that sense I'm right there with you!


----------



## noob_pwn

i got a few emails back from Jr earlier this week, don't sweat it dudes the guy is working his tail off at the moment to get these guitars out.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Yes, although I have no sympathy for you Black Friday types. I'm at 18 months on my custom. Of course I couldn't resist the BF deal either, so in that sense I'm right there with you!



I'm in the same boat as you with an even longer wait on one, around the same on 2nd and a small job that was supposed to take 2months tops and it's now 7 months later..got txt back the other day but I didn't know if it was legit reasoning for taking weeks to get back because it was so out in left field..but if you guys are waiting to at least I know it's everyone..I just see NGD's up and shop tours/photos etc and go


----------



## Isan

You may have better luck on the RicoJr Forums 
Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars &bull; Index page


----------



## Erick Kroenen

Isan said:


> You may have better luck on the RicoJr Forums
> Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars &bull; Index page



that forum it's always empty!


----------



## MetalDaze

Is that a Lefty Diva getting a nice blue paint job???? Yes it is!!!!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

did bernie send you that pic ?


----------



## MetalDaze

Not exactly. I heard that there were some new videos on Bernie's Facebook page and that my Diva was part of it.

Since I'm not a Facebook user, I asked if someone at BRJ could get me a copy of the video. They did and I was able grab that still off of it.

Also, this is not a Black Friday guitar, but I wanted to share on this thread anyway.


----------



## travis bickle

saw those black friday shots on facebook and am stoked that some may be getting their axes soon!!!! im sure it will be a few months until these start shipping. patiently waiting to be blown away. and i'll get to use my brj through my newly acquired axe-fx ultra / mesa 295 set up!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Hollowway

travis bickle said:


> saw those black friday shots on facebook and am stoked that some may be getting their axes soon!!!! im sure it will be a few months until these start shipping. patiently waiting to be blown away. and i'll get to use my brj through my newly acquired axe-fx ultra / mesa 295 set up!!!!!!!!!!!



Where did you see the BF shots on facebook? I can't find them....


----------



## toiletstand

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.228050790554151.75450.100000476940315

and possibly: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...1963267035.2191.100000476940315&type=1&ref=nf


----------



## travis bickle

tltstand said:


> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.228050790554151.75450.100000476940315
> 
> and possibly: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...1963267035.2191.100000476940315&type=1&ref=nf




Man, and to think, maybe, just maybe mine could be one of those. Haha.


----------



## ev1ltwin

ev1ltwin said:


> sent this email yesterday:
> 
> _Hey Bernie,_
> _It's been half a year since I last reached out to you. I'd appreciate any updates on my build or an ETA for when I'll be able to play this guitar._
> _Thanks!_
> 
> I'll let you guys know if I hear anything back.


 
Hi Ben, your guitar should be coming out of wood shop on or before the 4th of July, along with MANY others from the Black Friday run. From there, it moves on to the finishing stages of the build. We're getting closer! Thank you very much for your patience. I will send pics (and hopefully video!) as soon as possible. Currently, it's hard to give a solid completion date, due to the high volume of builds going, but I assure you we're getting there. We've picked up the pace as much as possible, but we can't rush things, as the quality of your guitar is extremely important to me.


----------



## toiletstand

sweet!


edit: also im kicking myself in the ass for not setting aside the cash to order the block inlays earlier in the build. D:


----------



## Hollowway

tltstand said:


> https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.228050790554151.75450.100000476940315
> 
> and possibly: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...1963267035.2191.100000476940315&type=1&ref=nf



Crap, those aren't working for me. Ah well, I'll take your word for it!


----------



## WillDfx

Hollowway said:


> Crap, those aren't working for me. Ah well, I'll take your word for it!



They won't work for me either...

Cheat Codes??


----------



## toiletstand

Hollowway said:


> Crap, those aren't working for me. Ah well, I'll take your word for it!




if you go to his facebook. go to photos. albums and view all. theres an album dedicated to black friday guitars


----------



## leonardo7

tltstand said:


> if you go to his facebook. go to photos. albums and view all. theres an album dedicated to black friday guitars



I want to see those pics. How do you find him on Facebook? I cant find him


----------



## thrsher

The pics in this thread are the pics from facebook


----------



## toiletstand

^^^ and https://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars


----------



## Invader

I can't seem to open the albums on facebook. Access denied.


----------



## toiletstand

here ya go 


DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Here's some Black Friday guitars that just came out of wood shop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> Here's my slant top Jekyll. Stoked on it. It's not from the Black Friday run, but I thought I'd share anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## Hollowway

Oh yeah I saw those posted in this thread. That's my red Jekyll 8 custom in the corner of the top photo.


----------



## toiletstand

looks awesome. i cant tell which is mine or if mines been photomofied haha.


----------



## Isan

Yay 75% in the woodshop ... whatever that means :|


----------



## Shrooms

Isan said:


> Yay 75% in the woodshop ... whatever that means :|



Basically there's a scale... Bernie shows the guitar to 100 people, in your case, 75 people have seen the guitar so far. So he needs to show another 25.


----------



## Isan

Shrooms said:


> Basically there's a scale... Bernie shows the guitar to 100 people, in your case, 75 people have seen the guitar so far. So he needs to show another 25.


----------



## toiletstand




----------



## Emperoff

Yet another bump with no pictures...


----------



## Invader

I got myself another spot on the Black Friday run. Now I'm getting a Hesperian 727 and a Hesperian 627 as well. 

Only downside is the wait is now twice as hard.


----------



## WillDfx

Invader said:


> I got myself another spot on the Black Friday run. Now I'm getting a Hesperian 727 and a Hesperian 627 as well.
> 
> Only downside is the wait is now twice as hard.



It'll be well worth the wait, huh Janne?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

does someone have some news ?


----------



## Invader

WillDfx said:


> It'll be well worth the wait, huh Janne?



It better be damnit, the wait is killing me.


----------



## geofreesun

i emailed bernie 2 days ago and he got back to me saying mine is already out of the woodshop, now in the finish phase. i sleep better now


----------



## Hollowway

geofreesun said:


> i emailed bernie 2 days ago and he got back to me saying mine is already out of the woodshop, now in the finish phase. i sleep better now



You mean your Black Friday guitar or a custom? I'm waiting for my custom (1.5 yrs in) and mine's out of the finishing stage and in the assembly stage, so I've got my fingers crossed. Problem is I don't know how long any of the stages last. i.e. I'm not sure if there's a wait to start construction, and then the actual build process takes 6 months, or if it's a consistent time line from the start. But I've got a Black Friday going as well, so hopefully they'll be cooking along from this point.


----------



## toiletstand

i think he tries to give them an equal amount of work through out the week. but since so many builds are in progress that might be why theres a delay.

honestly i dont know how builders divy up their work hours so this is just a guess haha


----------



## hswirlmaster

wonderful


----------



## Qweklain

Anyone have any updates? I only ask because there are three guitars under the "Work in progress" and one finished that are very clearly Black Friday models.


----------



## toiletstand

link?


----------



## thrsher

i dont even care anymore about the build anymore, someday it will get done and ill make the payment. im way more excited for my upcoming build with VIK


----------



## Emperoff

thrsher said:


> i dont even care anymore about the build anymore, someday it will get done and ill make the payment. im way more excited for my upcoming build with VIK



Looks like VIK is the current trend now


----------



## thrsher

i have a current order in with vik, before the run was proposed, vik customer service is oustanding to say the least


----------



## SpaceDock

Qweklain said:


> Anyone have any updates? I only ask because there are three guitars under the "Work in progress" and one finished that are very clearly Black Friday models.



Only the one "slim line" looks like part of the black friday run to me.

I emailed Bernie on Friday, first time in 5 months and still no response. Just keep waiting I guess.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, those aren't the Black Friday (or Christmas) sale guitars. Those are spec builds that are for sale. The Rude Purple one, for instance, has been up for several months. 

I sent him an email last week or the week before to get an update on my custom Jekyll, but no word back. My guess is that he's just super busy and isn't going to respond to all the emails.


----------



## mountainjam

I just heard from one of bernie's employee's yesterday that bernie was sick for a week and didn't work.


----------



## toiletstand

hope he gets better soon. hes been having health problems for a while.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Shitty, I hope it not from that time he had that hookers n cocobolo snortin party


----------



## Qweklain

The "Completed" Jekyll 727 Mahogany is clearly a BFR style. 
The "Work in progress" Hesperian 727 SlimLine is a BFR style. 
That "Work in Progress" Jekyll Neckthru - 727 Mahogany Top is a BFR style, and I say that because LOTS of people went Jekyll instead of Hesperian (not me). 

So, my bad, 2 "Work in Progress" ones and one "Complete." No, I do not know these are 100% BFR models, but I know he does not do just one volume and toggle as a standard which, to me, is the number one clue for me to believe my assumption.




Emperoff said:


> Looks like VIK is the current trend now



Yeah, this site seems to go through guitar trends more than a 13 year old girl goes through clothes trends.


----------



## Hollowway

Qweklain said:


> The "Completed" Jekyll 727 Mahogany is clearly a BFR style.
> The "Work in progress" Hesperian 727 SlimLine is a BFR style.
> That "Work in Progress" Jekyll Neckthru - 727 Mahogany Top is a BFR style, and I say that because LOTS of people went Jekyll instead of Hesperian (not me).
> 
> So, my bad, 2 "Work in Progress" ones and one "Complete." No, I do not know these are 100% BFR models, but I know he does not do just one volume and toggle as a standard which, to me, is the number one clue for me to believe my assumption.



Yeah, could be. But he's got those listed for sale, too. Plus he does slim lines other than the BFR sale. But the main reason that makes me think those are not yet BFRs that far along is that a few of us still have customs that are 1 to 1.5 years in the making. So I don't think he would stop work on those to catch up the BFR guitars. You might be right, though, and that would be super cool. I just think it would be weird if the guitar I ordered 9 months ago shows up here before the one I ordered 18 months ago!


----------



## toiletstand

crazy how we're coming up on a year all ready haha.


----------



## Qweklain

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, could be. But he's got those listed for sale, too. Plus he does slim lines other than the BFR sale. But the main reason that makes me think those are not yet BFRs that far along is that a few of us still have customs that are 1 to 1.5 years in the making. So I don't think he would stop work on those to catch up the BFR guitars. You might be right, though, and that would be super cool. I just think it would be weird if the guitar I ordered 9 months ago shows up here before the one I ordered 18 months ago!


Oh I know what some of you have going on in terms of wait, but there have been other guitars that have gone out in shorter times than some others. The example right off the top of my head is that one dude on here who ordered one and got it in like three or four months from scratch to finish. I do not think there is a whole lot of organization over there to be honest in terms of what comes first from what I can tell.

I know his slim line models are not just BFR specialties, but there are some people who have been waiting so long that other financial elements have come up and perhaps they can not afford them now so they go for sale on his site, at least that is my guess.



tltstand said:


> crazy how we're coming up on a year all ready haha.



It is both funny, but more so sad. Granted I personally do not care all that much, but I know there are a lot who are probably furious waiting this long, and I can not say I blame them. Now with that said, I certainly would not be disappointed if my guitar ended up being finished sooner than later at this point.


----------



## Emperoff

Assuming that most (if not all) of the BFR guitars are on the woodshop phase and Bernie is not there, I can see how that can greatly affect the e-mail response time.

If I was so busy with a truckload of guitars in the making and couldn't make updates myself, I suppose I'd grab some friend with a reflex camera and pay him for a quick photoshoot and post them here, avoiding the labour of replying thousands of emails. 

But then again, that's just me.


----------



## mountainjam

Maybe only the bfr customers are getting slow email response. I purchased the multiburst jekyll a month ago, and while Bernie has been slow to route it for another pickup and install the hardware, his employee, I think John is his name, always responds to my emails within a few hours.


----------



## Hollowway

mountainjam said:


> Maybe only the bfr customers are getting slow email response. I purchased the multiburst jekyll a month ago, and while Bernie has been slow to route it for another pickup and install the hardware, his employee, I think John is his name, always responds to my emails within a few hours.



Oh? Do you have any idea what the street value of John's email address is?! You're sitting on a gold mine!  
Seriously, hook a brotha up with a PM and an email addy!


----------



## mountainjam

Hollowway said:


> Oh? Do you have any idea what the street value of John's email address is?! You're sitting on a gold mine!
> Seriously, hook a brotha up with a PM and an email addy!


His name might not be John, I cant totally remember. But to be honest with you, Ive never even spoken to Bernie once. I bought a completed guitar, so Ive just been dealing with some dude at the shop. The email addresse is the one posted on the site, [email protected]


----------



## Isan

John does all the phone/email work I believe.


----------



## Hollowway

mountainjam said:


> His name might not be John, I cant totally remember. But to be honest with you, Ive never even spoken to Bernie once. I bought a completed guitar, so Ive just been dealing with some dude at the shop. The email addresse is the one posted on the site, [email protected]



Ah, OK, cool. I've been emailing Bernie at his own email address. I feel bad bugging him, so I'll try that one. Thanks.


----------



## toiletstand

sweet. post any info!


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

mountainjam said:


> His name might not be John, I cant totally remember. But to be honest with you, Ive never even spoken to Bernie once. I bought a completed guitar, so Ive just been dealing with some dude at the shop. The email addresse is the one posted on the site, [email protected]



Ah, yes! The 'PHANTOM"


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Ah, OK, cool. I've been emailing Bernie at his own email address. I feel bad bugging him, so I'll try that one. Thanks.


The question is does he actually get back to you...or at least has he recently... I've been trying and all i get is will catch up in a few days or next week...and/or some excuse..then never an update..or any photos.... then you get on here to see others NGD's, photo's on progress, tours of the entire shop.... and the months go by.....


----------



## Hollowway

So I got an email back from John right away. He said mine is getting clear coated, and then has to have the hardware, electronics, etc put in. But keep in mind this is for the custom I ordered well before the BFR. I didn't ask about that one because I think we're still pretty far off on those.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I´ve got a progress pic last week, so here it is


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

second try, if it doesn´t work can someone help ? maybe I´m too stupid -.-


----------



## toiletstand

upload it to imageshack


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/691/brjk.jpg/

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...a.1003346021257.162.1753055477&type=1&theater

sorry guys, it doesn´t worked, here´s the link


----------



## Invader

Here you go. Those controls, what will they all do?


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

You mean what won't those controls do 

awesome quilt btw!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

haha thanks dudes ^^

The controls: 

1 Magnetic Volume
1 Piezo Volume
1 Master Tone

3-way-switch
2 mini switches to split the humbuckers seperately
1 mini switch to activate the piezo : - only magnetic
- both
- only piezo 

That´s it


----------



## Hollowway

Pascal-Darrell said:


> haha thanks dudes ^^
> 
> The controls:
> 
> 1 Magnetic Volume
> 1 Piezo Volume
> 1 Master Tone
> 
> 3-way-switch
> 2 mini switches to split the humbuckers seperately
> 1 mini switch to activate the piezo : - only magnetic
> - both
> - only piezo
> 
> That´s it



Wow, nice! Is that a BFR guitar, or full custom?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

It´s one from the black friday run.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Pascal-Darrell said:


> It´s one from the black friday run.


 
then there's hope yet


----------



## IB-studjent-

I'm regretting I ordered a BRJ, could have got a better guitar built for the price I'm paying for the BRJ.


----------



## mikernaut

oh yeah , and what would that be?

I dunno what you guys are paying but in my experience it would be tricky to find guitars of this caliber at a competitive pricepoint . Jackson, ESP, etc. are alot more expensive. KxK and maybe Daemoness might be the closest companies I can think of.

Sure it's not the smoothest wait and I shared much of the same frustrations while waiting for my BRJ's , but once it arrives and you play it, you'll feel and hear how good his guitars are. 

Is there room for improvement on the communication side, "Yes" but if you want 'X" brand and quality sometimes you have to be alittle forgiving.


----------



## toiletstand

or maybe he should have researched what he was getting into before making such a huge investment


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> So I got an email back from John right away. .


That's awesome, I'm hoping I can get the same because I've now waited 9 months for something I was told would be done in 2 and I can't get any answers or photos while many others on here seem to have no problem or even get shop tours with dozens of photos.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

MTech said:


> That's awesome, I'm hoping I can get the same because I've now waited 9 months for something I was told would be done in 2 and I can't get any answers or photos while many others on here seem to have no problem or even get shop tours with dozens of photos.



Ugh, shitty, that's what always sucks about going with custom shops. You never know what will happen and it's a bit of a gamble


----------



## MTech

Stealthtastic said:


> Ugh, shitty, that's what always sucks about going with custom shops. You never know what will happen and it's a bit of a gamble


This shouldn't be a gamble..I'm waiting on 2 customs and was told another guitar I had would be fixed in 1-2months so I had something at least while I wait for the re-build of my 1st one I'd ordered clear back in 07 (check old NGD Post) and totally new one. I've been one of if not the biggest supporters of his work from the get go and the breakdown in communication and coming through on a persons word is really past the frustration level. If I'd get answers/photos instead of nothing or excuses and hear stories from other people/artists having issues it wouldn't seem so sketchy.


----------



## JamesM

I hate getting told one thing and getting another, especially when I have money and emotions invested in them. Best of luck. Knock on wood!


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

MTech said:


> This shouldn't be a gamble..I'm waiting on 2 customs and was told another guitar I had would be fixed in 1-2months so I had something at least while I wait for the re-build of my 1st one I'd ordered clear back in 07 (check old NGD Post) and totally new one. I've been one of if not the biggest supporters of his work from the get go and the breakdown in communication and coming through on a persons word is really past the frustration level. If I'd get answers/photos instead of nothing or excuses and hear stories from other people/artists having issues it wouldn't seem so sketchy.



For sure, the advantage to BRJ being the US though is that if it ever did go terribly wrong it's easy for you to pursue legal action.


----------



## kmanick

Invader said:


> Here you go. Those controls, what will they all do?


 
 look at the freaking quilt on that thing!!!!!

I feel your pain gentlemen.
I had to wait 11 months for mine and i was told 4-5 when I ordered it.
hang in there , I hardly ever play any of my other guitars anymore, my Hesperian so much fun to play and sounds so good, it was well worth the wait.
I tend to agree with most of the comments here as well, Bernie would do himself a lot of good if he hired someone just for a week or two and had him go thru all of his outstanding orders and get status's on them and get the guy to make some personal phone calls and take some pics.
That would alleviate a lot of stress around here for sure.
Shit if I lived out there I would do it for him for free. (that's how much I love my hesperian).


----------



## Emperoff

Fuck me, that quilt is insane!

We need Rhoadkiller to order another BRJ, since he got his custom there's no more "Bernie store & pics threads"


----------



## Isan

2 new BFR pics are up


----------



## thrsher

this is great to see but whats up with the first batch that came out of wood shop 2 months ago is what i want to know.


----------



## Rhoadkiller

Emperoff said:


> Fuck me, that quilt is insane!
> 
> We need Rhoadkiller to order another BRJ, since he got his custom there's no more "Bernie store & pics threads"



Oh dont worry lol its in the works  and there will be tons more pics Im thinking of a Jekyll 627 this time all mahogany body
(sapele if he can get it) slant top with a ebony fretboard a flamed maple neck with a floyd rose, neck through , extra access cut away side block inlays 1 volume one push pull 5 way switch 2 humbuckers or maybe a humbucker single coil combo all clear except the neck will be oiled 26 3/16 scale length ... 
Im organizing my thoughts of what i want before i purchase or place any order because i would have loved side block inlays on my current guitar i just never thought of it lol so this one will have a lot of things my 727 didnt get  expect pics !


----------



## mountainjam

So I just got word that bernie has run out cases, my just completed non bfr jekyll 727 wont be shipping until they arrive 

*mod edit: this thread is for information and / or progress on the Black Friday guitar run ONLY. Either start your own build thread or wait until you get the guitar and post a NGD*

My edit* sorry, I'm not sure if anybodys bfr guitars are done or not, just wanted to let people know why the guitars aren't shipping atm if there any completed.


----------



## mikernaut

Looks like Bern's back to work in his shop . Just got a WIP pic emailed to me. next stage "paint" 

So hopefully he's in good shape and cranking away on everyone's fiddles.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I am glad to hear that. I understand he was upgrading the shop so he could work more guitars through in one fell swoop.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Here's a bunch of BF guitars- 





Uploaded with ImageShack.us


----------



## toiletstand

holy shit


----------



## glassmoon0fo

sweet jesus! does anyone know about how many bf guitars were ordered? i was under the impression that it was about 50 or so...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Holy freaking shit is right! The boys in the shop have been going to town, big time!


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Hoelee fuck


----------



## Emperoff

So... which one is mine?


----------



## mikernaut

Holy cow that's alot of guitars! mines on the front table, very left with the little block inlays and white binding.


----------



## mountainjam

Check FB, he just uploaded a new vid


----------



## toiletstand

glassmoon0fo said:


> sweet jesus! does anyone know about how many bf guitars were ordered? i was under the impression that it was about 50 or so...


 i think between 100-150 ?


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

I'll be in Cali next weekend hanging out. I'll swing by his shop and take a bunch of pics/videos of this run for you guys.


----------



## toiletstand

youre the man


----------



## elq

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> I'll be in Cali next weekend hanging out. I'll swing by his shop and take a bunch of pics/videos of this run for you guys.





If you see any left-handed guitars there, please snap a pic or two 

Oh, and share the specs of your upcomming Vik too


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

elq said:


> If you see any left-handed guitars there, please snap a pic or two
> 
> Oh, and share the specs of your upcomming Vik too



I'll do what I can! Inevitably, I will neglect to take a picture of someone's guitar, and they'll get all mad at me. Haha!

I'll post the ViK info in a more appropriate spot so the mods don't chop my wang off again.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I'd watch out if I were you, Keith. With that many axes just kicking around he might put you to work when you show up.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I'd watch out if I were you, Keith. With that many axes just kicking around he might put you to work when you show up.



I won't touch anything, I promise! lol

I don't know how long we'll be at the shop though. Him and I are going to dinner with some friends from Nuclear Blast when I get there. But, I'll get some pics for sure!


----------



## Emperoff

Those are probably the first 20 to come out of the woodshop, which means that mine probably won't be there


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Keith: "Oh... Bernie and I are going to go eat the choicest of tender steaks made from magical cows that were raised on lucky charms and LSD with the fellows of Nuclear Blast Records." 

Me: "You lucky bastard... ONE DAY! OOOONE DAAAAAY!"


----------



## Qweklain

tltstand said:


> i think between 100-150 ?


Correct, Bernie himself stated that he was only expecting between 20-50, but ended up receiving 110+ orders, while most of those ending up being customized as full customs.


----------



## Isan

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> I'll do what I can! Inevitably, I will neglect to take a picture of someone's guitar, and they'll get all mad at me. Haha!
> 
> I'll post the ViK info in a more appropriate spot so the mods don't chop my wang off again.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

INCOMING - More Black Friday Guitars - YouTube i don't know how to embed if someone would be so kind as to help me but here's a vid bernie posted just a bit ago.


----------



## Isan

YouTube - INCOMING - More Black Friday Guitars


----------



## HarryLikesProg

i ordered the hesperian slant top 7 in february 2011. its rather stock, except has a rosewood neck and rosewood fretboard, 27inch scale, 24 frets, quilted maple top, single bridge pickup, natural oiled finish, master volume and tone, no switches. total? 3 grand. im so excited about it. i estimate a 2012 delivery.


----------



## MJS

NeoTheMaggot said:


> INCOMING - More Black Friday Guitars - YouTube i don't know how to embed if someone would be so kind as to help me but here's a vid bernie posted just a bit ago.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

HarryLikesProg said:


> i ordered the hesperian slant top 7 in february 2011. its rather stock, except has a rosewood neck and rosewood fretboard.



so Bernie is willing to do rosewood necks now ? how much was the upcharge instead of a lets say maple neck ?


----------



## mikernaut

*mod edit: this thread is for Black Friday run guitars only*


----------



## HarryLikesProg

the complete rosewood neck was an extra 500, as its difficult for him to find such long dimensions. its gonna be amazing to have a thru neck with lovely rosewood though.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

HarryLikesProg said:


> the complete rosewood neck was an extra 500, as its difficult for him to find such long dimensions. its gonna be amazing to have a thru neck with lovely rosewood though.




yeah he said something similar to me  , but thanks for the info  

Maybe if I have the money in a year or two I´ll order a second BRJ with a rosewood neck and a koa top, would be pretty epic


----------



## Emperoff

What is so spectacular about the rosewood necks that everyone is raving about nowadays? Or is it just the new trend?


----------



## Qweklain

Emperoff said:


> What is so spectacular about the rosewood necks that everyone is raving about nowadays? Or is it just the new trend?


It is just not too common and yes, a new trend. Lots of people like the look of all rosewood necks. Personally, I do not like rosewood at all, anywhere, in case you were wondering.


----------



## Valennic

This has nothing to do with your guys's builds, but I grew up in the town where he builds his shit, Hesperia. And then after moving to PA, I found out that he's based there.

Life is one fucked up bitch


----------



## technomancer

Qweklain said:


> It is just not too common and yes, a new trend. Lots of people like the look of all rosewood necks. Personally, I do not like rosewood at all, anywhere, in case you were wondering.



Actually rosewood necks are nothing new at all, they've been fairly common on high-end six strings like PRSs for years and on high end acoustics since before there were electric guitars. It's more about tone than aesthetics, some of the guys on here (Misha, Adam, etc) and some of the electric builders like EBMM have just started doing it recently.


----------



## elq

technomancer said:


> Actually rosewood necks are nothing new at all, they've been fairly common on high-end six strings like PRSs for years and on high end acoustics since before there were electric guitars. It's more about tone than aesthetics, some of the guys on here (Misha, Adam, etc) and some of the electric builders like EBMM have just started doing it recently.



This.

I was able to play a lefty PRS with a brazzy neck about two years ago. The owner refused my multiple (generous) offers to buy it on the spot. Since then I've been hunting for rosewood necked guitars and I've been in love - they sound and feel amazing.


----------



## SpaceDock

Bernie sent me a pic last night of mine, it still needs to be painted. Progress looks pretty good though.


----------



## mikernaut

Killer! love the side blocks. what's the paint job going to be?


----------



## SpaceDock

The natural black burst that he does. I've seen it on several of his guitars and it always looks great.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> The natural black burst that he does. I've seen it on several of his guitars and it always looks great.



Yeah, that's a cool finish. I was on the fence about that for mine but I decided to just go with the oil finish in the end. I've got a full custom I'm still waiting for, so I decided not to upgrade the BFR. But great choice on the blackburst.


----------



## toiletstand

really wish i had asked for those blocks! haha


----------



## Emperoff

tltstand said:


> really wish i had asked for those blocks! haha



They are included by default, IIRC.

I hope Keith can snap some pictures. The wait is killing me now more than ever, as the guitars are starting to pop.


----------



## Invader

Emperoff said:


> They are included by default, IIRC.



No, the BFR's come with side dots only. Bernie confirmed this in an email.

Here's my original post in the BFR Sale thread:
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2229175-post103.html


----------



## Emperoff

Invader said:


> No, the BFR's come with side dots only. Bernie confirmed this in an email.
> 
> Here's my original post in the BFR Sale thread:
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2229175-post103.html



I stand corrected then  However, those would look ugly on the maple binding that's going on mine


----------



## VILARIKA

There's gonna be a NGD every day due to the amount of BF orders


----------



## Invader

Emperoff said:


> I stand corrected then  However, those would look ugly on the maple binding that's going on mine



Oh, you're getting maple binding too? 

I think ebony blocks would look sweet with the maple binding.


----------



## toiletstand

didnt have the monies at the time. ah well theres always next time


----------



## Qweklain

technomancer said:


> Actually rosewood necks are nothing new at all, they've been fairly common on high-end six strings like PRSs for years and on high end acoustics since before there were electric guitars. It's more about tone than aesthetics, some of the guys on here (Misha, Adam, etc) and some of the electric builders like EBMM have just started doing it recently.


I never said it was new, just a new trend. This was not all that common until recently when, like you stated in your last sentence, others started doing it, hence the trend.


----------



## Hollowway

VILARIKA said:


> There's gonna be a NGD every day due to the amount of BF orders



Eeeeexcellent! And then the "I decided that 7 strings were enough for me, so I need to let this go to someone who will use it more than I" threads will start, and I get some more 8s... 

Actually, I might asked to be banned so I can't buy any of them.  My addiction is bad.


----------



## JPMike

Btw, here are some pics of my Hesperian Slimline 727, it's not done yet, going to root a neck pickup too, with a trans purple/black burst finish plus a Painkiller set with Tyger covers.












It's not actually a BFR guitar, but since I have already a Jekyll on the process, they let me have another guitar from stock in a low price. Bernie is the man!!


----------



## Hollowway

JPMike said:


> It's not actually a BFR guitar, but since I have already a Jekyll on the process, they let me have another guitar from stock in a low price. Bernie is the man!!



That's cool, but that makes me uneasy about buying Rico Jrs, because I never know if I'm getting a good price on one, since there doesn't seem to be a set pricing structure. I hope when he does that, and the BFR runs, etc., he's not inadvertently hurting his future prices.


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> That's cool, but that makes me uneasy about buying Rico Jrs, because I never know if I'm getting a good price on one, since there doesn't seem to be a set pricing structure. I hope when he does that, and the BFR runs, etc., he's not inadvertently hurting his future prices.



True about that, but I compare it to my first order and it's quite a good price for a second one.


----------



## mikernaut

Well the prices I got on my 2 BRJ's were still pretty good compared to what Jackson or ESP would have charged me for something with similar specs.


----------



## JPMike

mikernaut said:


> Well the prices I got on my 2 BRJ's were still pretty good compared to what Jackson or ESP would have charged me for something with similar specs.



I would prefer BRJ anyday over Jackson or ESP.


----------



## themike

JPMike said:


> I would prefer BRJ anyday over Jackson or ESP.


 
There no doubt in my mind you could have either company make something comparable to BRJ. Not to derail the love for Bernie - I think he's great, super nice, talented and going out of his way for a lot of customers nor do I have any sort of love for Jackson or ESP - I just know that their custom shop is very capable.


----------



## MetalDaze

*mod edit: this thread is for Black Friday run guitars only*


----------



## spawnsc

i wonder if he wil take orders again for this years BF?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

spawnsc said:


> i wonder if he wil take orders again for this years BF?


----------



## IB-studjent-

MaxOfMetal said:


>



That's what I thought


----------



## glassmoon0fo

i dont think he'd say no.






























he'd say HELL no.


----------



## JPMike

Rico Love!!!


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Hey guys. I got SO MANY pictures when I was at the shop this weekend. I tried to sort through them so I can just post BF guitars to the thread. Here's a few... There are more guitars in his shop than I had time to even look at. 

I have about 100 individual BF guitar pics, with the names of the owner. I just don't know how the hell I'm gonna share them all. Any ideas other than spending a bunch of time posting them all here? 






Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us




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Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Uploaded with ImageShack.us




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----------



## Isan

Thanks Keith ...


----------



## toiletstand

me love you long time. i think you can make public files on facebook. or you can share them on flickr. or a photobucket album?


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

tltstand said:


> me love you long time. i think you can make public files on facebook. or you can share them on flickr. or a photobucket album?



Yeah, I thought about that. The thing is, I'm not sure all of those customers came from sevenstring.org. I also don't know if everyone would be cool with me posting their name and a picture of their shit on the internet. Not really my place, imo. 

I guess, if you're reading this, and you want a picture of your guitar, hit me up on FB and I'll send you a picture there.


----------



## toiletstand

thanks dude


----------



## WickedSymphony

Thanks a ton, Keith!

Seeing all those pics makes me all giddy even though mine is probably at the very tail end of the build order


----------



## Trembulant

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Re: Hey guys....
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us




Nice Rack


----------



## geofreesun

i got a pic update from keith, just want to share it with you guys  and thanks so much to keith and of course bernie the man himself


----------



## TemjinStrife

Man, you guys all gave him gray hair!


----------



## ev1ltwin

Thanks to Keith for the pics!!!


Full shot







awesome quilt






...






I can't wait for this guitar! Actually, I probably will wait for a few months for it.


----------



## Hollowway

^ 

That's pretty sweet maple he's got on those. I was worried about my choice of quilted as opposed to flamed, but I'm really liking those quilts! Even as oil finishes those are going to look killer.


----------



## mikernaut

Anybody have the white jekyll with black binding? that's looking sexy


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

mikernaut said:


> Anybody have the white jekyll with black binding? that's looking sexy



Not sure, but that white archtop with the black binding back there is mine.


----------



## msalazar

When these files with names and pics are available, I want mine haha.


----------



## JPMike

Awesome pics right there.

True that white with the black binding is sick.


----------



## EOT

mikernaut said:


> Anybody have the white jekyll with black binding? that's looking sexy



If it's an 8 it might be mine.


----------



## mikernaut

it does look like an 8 by counting the tuner peg holes.


----------



## Isan




----------



## Neil




----------



## Emperoff

Neil said:


>




That may probably be my case 


PS: Keith, did you receive my PM?


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Emperoff said:


> Keith, did you receive my PM?



I probably did man, I just haven't got around to checking yet. Totally bit off more than I could chew by offering to send pics. On top of the million emails I normally get, I have a whole bunch more "wherz meh GUITAR PICZ!" emails. Haha, I'll do what I can. 

Sorry to those of who didn't get pictures. I didn't have time to get pics of everything.


----------



## Neil

haha no worries man  You are a king for getting some many pics!


----------



## travis bickle

Real cool of you keith to do do this. Im gonna assume my instrument will be completed sometime next year. Just gonna have to be patient.


----------



## Qweklain

travis bickle said:


> Real cool of you keith to do do this. Im gonna assume my instrument will be completed sometime next year. Just gonna have to be patient.


Agreed, cool offer of you Keith. I, too, will assume next year and just patiently wait, plus this way I can save the funds that I have recently blown on a Corvette.


----------



## Emperoff

Yeah, next year is probably most likely. But I'm fucking dying seen as everyone is getting pictures of his but not me. :sadpanda:

Maybe next time an endorser orders a custom mine is already out ot the woodshop and I'll get a chance to see it


----------



## Invader

Apparently my 727 is still in the woodshop, no pics of that one yet.

Here's my 627 however.

Thanks a metric (not imperial) ton, Keith! (edit: make that a metric fuckton since an imperial ton is bigger than a metric ton )


----------



## msalazar

Can't wait, just can't wait!


----------



## WillDfx

Oh dude, that makes me regret selling my slot to you 
But then I look at my 727, and think about my future endeavors with Bern and I get all giddy again


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

*"Guitars from the "Black Friday" production run will start shipping out next week." - Bernie Rico

Someone got some news/updates from Bernie ? 
*


----------



## Emperoff

Pascal-Darrell said:


> *"Guitars from the "Black Friday" production run will start shipping out next week." - Bernie Rico
> 
> Someone got some news/updates from Bernie ?
> *



I really hope I don't, as I have some expenses right now cause I thought these were going to ship around christmas 


EDIT: THANK GOD. You forgot to quote this sentence from Bernie: _"Still so many left to do!"_

I suppose those will be the ones with the original specs.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

He told me that mine will be ready in about 2 weeks. Don´t know what´s gonna happen with the others  

Maybe send him a mail so that he finish your guitar later ?


----------



## Emperoff

Pascal-Darrell said:


> He told me that mine will be ready in about 2 weeks. Don´t know what´s gonna happen with the others
> 
> Maybe send him a mail so that he finish your guitar later ?



According to their schedule, they work on the guitars based on when they were ordered, so I'm most likely at the bottom of the list anyway


----------



## MetalDaze

Pascal-Darrell said:


> *"Guitars from the "Black Friday" production run will start shipping out next week." - Bernie Rico*
> 
> *Someone got some news/updates from Bernie ? *


 
Was that on his Facebook? I really wish he'd either make his profile public or post this stuff on his website too.

So far I have been successful resisting the need for FB.


----------



## thrsher

it was on his FB profile.

customer service is terrible.


----------



## Emperoff

MetalDaze said:


> Was that on his Facebook? I really wish he'd either make his profile public or post this stuff on his website too.
> 
> So far I have been successful resisting the need for FB.



His profile IS public. You may need FB to visit it, though.


----------



## MetalDaze

When I go here Bernie Rico Jr. | Facebook I get prompted to login if I try to view his wall or photos.


----------



## Emperoff

MetalDaze said:


> When I go here Bernie Rico Jr. | Facebook I get prompted to login if I try to view his wall or photos.



Yep. Just checked. You need a facebook account to visit it


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

My Black Friday 8 is still in the works for what I know, and I'm still waiting for my custom Jekyll 7 since a year ago. I honestly have to say it's getting a little bit frustrating...


----------



## Emperoff

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> My Black Friday 8 is still in the works for what I know, and I'm still waiting for my custom Jekyll 7 since a year ago. I honestly have to say it's getting a little bit frustrating...



It's been almost a year since I ordered mine and I thought the wait would be harder... Guess I'm ready to order more custom shop guitars!


----------



## JPMike

Emperoff said:


> It's been almost a year since I ordered mine and I thought the wait would be harder... Guess I'm ready to order more custom shop guitars!



When did you order the guitar?? Plus, how much time they told you to wait for it?? 

Cause to me they told me, 3-4 months for the one I ordered from scratch and a month for the one from the bodies they got in stock.


----------



## IB-studjent-

*mod edit: the next person that posts a guitar not from the black friday run in here is getting some time off*


----------



## Emperoff

JPMike said:


> When did you order the guitar?? Plus, how much time they told you to wait for it??
> 
> Cause to me they told me, 3-4 months for the one I ordered from scratch and a month for the one from the bodies they got in stock.



Same as the rest: 4 months IIRC. Keith said they work on the guitars by order number, so the last guitars ordered will be the last to be finished.


----------



## kruneh

But where´s the pics?
Anyone that has pics of theirs should feel very welcome to post them


----------



## Emperoff

kruneh said:


> But where´s the pics?
> Anyone that has pics of theirs should feel very welcome to post them



Are you new here?


----------



## kruneh

Emperoff said:


> Are you new here?



Nope, I was refering to Keiths visit at the shop and the amount of pics he had 
At least a few of the people here should have pics or...?
I didn´t get any, so it would be cool to see some guitars that´s a bit further in the process.
Oh, forget it, it´s just guitars


----------



## Emperoff

kruneh said:


> Nope, I was refering to Keiths visit at the shop and the amount of pics he had
> At least a few of the people here should have pics or...?
> I didn´t get any, so it would be cool to see some guitars that´s a bit further in the process.
> Oh, forget it, it´s just guitars



Ask him. I did but it seems that my guitar isn't out of the woodshop yet, so I still don't have any. Perhaps you'll have more luck


----------



## kruneh

Emperoff said:


> Ask him. I did but it seems that my guitar isn't out of the woodshop yet, so I still don't have any. Perhaps you'll have more luck




Yep, I did, but it looks like mine is in the woodshop too.
I just though some of those 100+ pics would "belong" to some of the members here, but apparently not, save for a couple..


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

kruneh said:


> Yep, I did, but it looks like mine is in the woodshop too.
> I just though some of those 100+ pics would "belong" to some of the members here, but apparently not, save for a couple..



I sent out a lot of pictures to members here. Maybe they just haven't posted them in this thread. They're all over FB right now. 

I have nothing to do with these Black Friday guitars. I was just trying to do something nice by catching some pictures while I was there. I'm sorry to those who didn't get a picture. I don't work for BRJ, so if you are butt-hurt about not seeing your guitar, take it up with Bernie. 

I'm getting emails constantly now from people asking ME for a status update on their guitar, so I will repeat- I don't work for BRJ, I'm just an artist. I have nothing to do with this run, or any of your guitars.


----------



## kruneh

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> I sent out a lot of pictures to members here. Maybe they just haven't posted them in this thread. They're all over FB right now.
> 
> I have nothing to do with these Black Friday guitars. I was just trying to do something nice by catching some pictures while I was there. I'm sorry to those who didn't get a picture. I don't work for BRJ, so if you are butt-hurt about not seeing your guitar, take it up with Bernie.
> 
> I'm getting emails constantly now from people asking ME for a status update on their guitar, so I will repeat- I don't work for BRJ, I'm just an artist. I have nothing to do with this run, or any of your guitars.



Hey, I´m cool with that, and I´m not asking for updates on my guitar.
I just hope that the people that got pics would post them in this thread.
What you did, Keith, was a very cool thing that I´m sure people here appreciated a lot


----------



## thrsher

I got a pic of build but did not post it. I never post my WIP pics, if I ever get any


----------



## JPMike

Emperoff said:


> Same as the rest: 4 months IIRC. Keith said they work on the guitars by order number, so the last guitars ordered will be the last to be finished.



WoW, if that's so, that sucks big time. :S

Hmmm, and you can't do anything about it.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Thanks Keith for getting me a picture. It's very much so appreciated.


----------



## elq

Emperoff said:


> According to their schedule, they work on the guitars based on when they were ordered, so I'm most likely at the bottom of the list anyway



That's not quite true from what I've seen. 

Originally Bernie had (I think) 5 spots open for each config - I was the last order of the first 5 in the 6-string config. But my guitar is still in the wood shop - there are obviously more than 15 guitars outside of the wood shop.


----------



## leonardo7

There are going to be so many amazing BRJ guitars on this forum within a few months its going to be ridiculous. Hopefully most people will post NGDs. I spoke with Bernie last week and he seems to be a very nice guy who understands business and guitar making well. Its in his blood. These guitars are going to be awesome!


----------



## Hollowway

elq said:


> That's not quite true from what I've seen.
> 
> Originally Bernie had (I think) 5 spots open for each config - I was the last order of the first 5 in the 6-string config. But my guitar is still in the wood shop - there are obviously more than 15 guitars outside of the wood shop.



Yeah, that's definitely not true. Might be true generally speaking, but there are loads of exceptions it would seem.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

leonardo7 said:


> There are going to be so many amazing BRJ guitars on this forum within a few months its going to be ridiculous. Hopefully most people will post NGDs. I spoke with Bernie last week and he seems to be a very nice guy who *understands business* and guitar making well. Its in his blood. These guitars are going to be awesome!



Dunno about that


----------



## Emperoff

elq said:


> That's not quite true from what I've seen.
> 
> Originally Bernie had (I think) 5 spots open for each config - I was the last order of the first 5 in the 6-string config. But my guitar is still in the wood shop - there are obviously more than 15 guitars outside of the wood shop.



Dunno. That's what I was told. 



Stealthtastic said:


> Dunno about that



Yeah, it would have been a much wiser business practice to reject 120 orders for a minimum of 2000$ each.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperoff said:


> Yeah, it would have been a much wiser business practice to reject 120 orders for a minimum of 2000$ each.



Yes actually. 

Being a good business man is just as much about setting yourself up for consistent, long term positive cash flow. Not just hitting a bonanza. 

I know that seems counterproductive to most business moves we see, but think about it. 

Obviously BRJ was/is not equipped for this volume of orders at once. There's no arguing that one. When guitars that were promised to be done in two to four months aren't even "out of woodshop" nearly a year later it's quite clear that that many orders shouldn't have been approved. 

See the problem with getting a boat load of cash up front (the 120+ $600 deposits) and then loading your build queue to a stand still is that you now have significantly reduced income until that huge amount of orders finishes up. Want some proof of this? Look at the inflated prices that non-BFD guitars have been receiving. Never before this have I seen Vixens and Jekylls go for over $5k, and I've seen some decked out one offs go for roughly $4k. He needs to charge more because he doesn't have as much income because he can't complete guitars. 

Not to mention, huge, never ending queues is what destroys smaller builders. Look at how the attitudes have changed in this thread. Guys who were excited and hopeful are now sullen, and most don't even post in here anymore. 

Also, think about how much the Jekyll line has been devalued. The last thing you want as a builder is have to compete with bargain basement used prices on your instruments. You think after this folks are going to pay $2k for a Jekyll? He just blew out over a 100 of them at close to that price. I know I won't ever pay 90% of new price on a used, custom guitar.

Not knocking BRJ in this, as crazy as that sounds. Heck, if I had close to three years of customers throwing me money I'd have a REALLY hard time saying no. In an economy like this, it'd be the proverbial Golden Egg. 

Now, back on point, anyone else got some tasty build pics?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

If it doesn´t work again this time, here are the links  

ImageShack&#174; - Online Photo and Video Hosting

Log In | Facebook


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

btw, feel free to upload the pic if it works


----------



## JPMike

Pascal-Darrell said:


> If it doesn´t work again this time, here are the links
> 
> ImageShack&#174; - Online Photo and Video Hosting
> 
> Log In | Facebook



You are buying the Jekyll 626 with the slant top??


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

JPMike said:


> You are buying the Jekyll 626 with the slant top??




ehm no ? what you see is my custom 724 Jekyll from the black friday run


----------



## MTech

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yes actually.
> 
> 
> 
> Obviously BRJ was/is not equipped for this volume of orders at once. There's no arguing that one. When guitars that were promised to be done in two to four months aren't even "out of woodshop" nearly a year later it's quite clear that that many orders shouldn't have been approved.
> 
> See the problem with getting a boat load of cash up front (the 120+ $600 deposits) and then loading your build queue to a stand still is that you now have significantly reduced income until that huge amount of orders finishes up. Want some proof of this? Look at the inflated prices that non-BFD guitars have been receiving. Never before this have I seen Vixens and Jekylls go for over $5k, and I've seen some decked out one offs go for roughly $4k. He needs to charge more because he doesn't have as much income because he can't complete guitars.
> 
> Not to mention, huge, never ending queues is what destroys smaller builders. Look at how the attitudes have changed in this thread. Guys who were excited and hopeful are now sullen, and most don't even post in here anymore.



Well lets keep in mind that at the time he started this I was told his wood shop pushed out 45-60 guitars each cycle... so that in mind it should only take like 4 I believe it was 6 week cycles, to bang out all this.... obviously something happened there...... Also you must not of followed him very long because his guitars originally cost a fortune having to spend $5k+ to get anything with Mahogany as an option... it wasn't till the Jekyl was pushed and then later the *27 models came out that prices really dropped down.
The wait is over the top though, I've for a few I'm waiting for and the one was ordered YEARS ago and I still don't even have a photo of it in woodshop so reading through some of the threads is frustrating/infuriating when people get full on shots/tours etc and others including myself can't even get a hold of anybody let alone photos. I was told I'd have my one in Jan or Feb at latest and only in the past couple days was I told it's just about done and that my other one is in woodshop...yet not a single photo. It's extremely frustrating especially when communication used to be one of his strongest points/perks of the company, easily talking directly to the guy building your guitar.


----------



## Emperoff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Heck, if I had close to three years of customers throwing me money I'd have a REALLY hard time saying no. In an economy like this, it'd be the proverbial Golden Egg.



That's actually what I meant, but sarcasm doesn't seem to translate quite well on the internet.


----------



## JPMike

My Hesperian Slimline 727 after the first grain enhancement, I AM SO STOKED ABOUT IT!!!!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Just got off the phone with Bernie reguarding my two orders, I just feel the need to express how down to earth the man is, and how much care and passion he puts into every guitar he builds. Not to mention he's gonna receive an outrageous phone bill since international phonecalls are not free by any means (I actually feel a bit sorry for that haha) 

Some of the stuff I've just heard really amazes me:

-not only he builds every guitar, but he does every setup, tuning, intonation, cuts every nut, packs and ships every guitar, all by himself. And this has always been like that from day one. That's just insane!
-not only that, but he also takes all the photos you see on brj site/facebook (apart from the recent Black Fridays which were taken by Keith) and he does a great job with them imho.
-only stuff he doesn't do is painting/finishing (but as you already know, he has an awesome employee for that) and running the website.

If you're thinking "then why doesn't he hire one or more employees for that?", the fact is you can feel how much he cares about the business/company (he's almost litterally born into a guitar shop haha) and if there's anything that he can do reguarding a particular order, he just does it by himself. And I really prefer that way, despite more stress on his side, it's definitely better for every detail reguarding an order, from shape, to hardware, to phone calls/whatever. That makes me believe and support his works even more.

That being said, the wait for my Ricos has never been so good  I'm sure all of you that have placed an order will be extremely satisfied.


----------



## Hollowway

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Just got off the phone with Bernie reguarding my two orders...



Do you have two Black Friday orders or one plus a custom?


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Hollowway said:


> Do you have two Black Friday orders or one plus a custom?



A Black Friday 8 and custom 7.


----------



## JPMike

I got one custom order 7 and one stock 7. 


Btw, who has been talking to John on the phone more than Bernie??


----------



## MaxOfMetal

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Just got off the phone with Bernie reguarding my two orders



Wow, that seems like quite a feat these days. 



> -not only he builds every guitar,



Except he doesn't. The offsite, never seen "woodshop" tends to be the source of the body/neck/fretboard blocks. The finishing and inlay work is then done both in house by another person (his paint guy) or farmed out to Thorn respectively. 



> but he does every setup, tuning, intonation, cuts every nut, packs and ships every guitar, all by himself.



Except the stuff his small staff does on occasion. 



> And this has always been like that from day one.



Not quite, as he used to do more stuff on his own instead of the "woodshop" like pickup and trem routes. Hence how on older BRJs the routes can be "less than perfect".



> That's just insane!



You're telling me. 



> -not only that, but he also takes all the photos you see on brj site/facebook



Unless it's one of the countless photos of him working, hanging out with an artist, posing with a guitar, etc. Unless he just keeps a camera on a tripod with a remote, there are obviously tons of photos that would be impossible for him to take. 



> -only stuff he doesn't do is painting/finishing (but as you already know, he has an awesome employee for that) and running the website.



Don't forget the mysterious woodshop guy. 



> If you're thinking "then why doesn't he hire one or more employees for that?", the fact is you can feel how much he cares about the business/company



So he doesn't hire a few more staff member to better assist his customers because he cares? 



> (he's almost litterally born into a guitar shop haha) and if there's anything that he can do reguarding a particular order, he just does it by himself. And I really prefer that way, despite more stress on his side, it's *definitely better for every detail* reguarding an order, from shape, to hardware, to phone calls/whatever.



I wouldn't be jumping to such conclusions based on the fact that Mikernaut got a guitar with the wrong inlays. 



Once again, not digging on BRJ, but if you read even a few pages of this thread you'll see that a lot of that is either exaggerated or misleading.  

Now where are those awesome progress pics?


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

You're right about the inlay thing, but in my post I've just written what he told me, that's it


----------



## technomancer

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> You're right about the inlay thing, but in my post I've just written what he told me, that's it



He's right about everything... the fact that Bernie told you over the phone doesn't make it any less untrue


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Owned!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

technomancer said:


> He's right about everything... the fact that Bernie told you over the phone doesn't make it any less untrue



True or not, I think the quality of his works speaks for himself, just hope to receive mine asap, like most of us here


----------



## Hollowway

I know this is about the Black Friday builds, but for those of you who have one of each, did you place your custom before or after the BF build?
And I haven't gotten any responses from any emails to John in the past month. Are you guys getting in touch with him via email or just phone?


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> And I haven't gotten any responses from any emails to John in the past month. Are you guys getting in touch with him via email or just phone?



I tried John and was told he'd check...then was told "you're talking to Bernie already IDK why you emailed me" meanwhile all Bernie has been doing is giving excuses on why he never answers when he says to call or he never calls when he says to call. It's either somebody is sick, traveling, birthday, busy at shop, playing with kid, family friend committed suicide... Meanwhile the same days other people post they talked to him, he sent them progress photos etc etc... You're telling me somebody can take people on tours all through a shop, have other people take photos of 75% of the guitars in there, and can tell me something will be outta woodshop next week but then 2 months later I still can't even get a progress photo on something that was promised to be done in Jan/Feb?? It's irritating beyond belief and that's just 1 of the 3, the other 2 it's been a longer wait.


----------



## mikernaut

It's really a shame that there's drama still going on. I know I've been in the same "frustration/ lack of communication boat" as alot of you guys here. 

But when I did eventually get my guitars alot was forgiven because of how good and responsive the guitars are from Bernie and his crew. Sure there's still some bumps in the road and maybe I'm more forgiving then most but I still want to eventually get a third BRJ after going through it all.


----------



## Emperoff

mikernaut said:


> It's really a shame that there's drama still going on. I know I've been in the same "frustration/ lack of communication boat" as alot of you guys here.
> 
> But when I did eventually get my guitars alot was forgiven because of how good and responsive the guitars are from Bernie and his crew. Sure there's still some bumps in the road and maybe I'm more forgiving then most but I still want to eventually get a third BRJ after going through it all.



Well, you know how this goes... It's ss.org after all. The people who bitch the most are the ones who didn't even order a guitar.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperoff said:


> Well, you know how this goes... It's ss.org after all. The people who bitch the most are the ones who didn't even order a guitar.



Perhaps those with less at stake can see more objectively through some of the bullshit.


----------



## MTech

mikernaut said:


> It's really a shame that there's drama still going on. I know I've been in the same "frustration/ lack of communication boat" as alot of you guys here.
> 
> But when I did eventually get my guitars alot was forgiven because of how good and responsive the guitars are from Bernie and his crew. Sure there's still some bumps in the road and maybe I'm more forgiving then most but I still want to eventually get a third BRJ after going through it all.



I don't think you've been in the same boat but you've probably had a taste of it. I ordered my 1st one in 2007.....I didn't get it till 3/4 the way through 2009 and it was a lemon. After sending it back 2x to get fixed/built right I was told it would be re-built from scratch to just send new specs...it's 2011 and I STILL don't have the re-build let alone the other 2. Yet I can get on here and see NGD's, shop tours, people posting about talking with him.. When I actually get him on the phone I have to give specs again, or told it's in woodshop, or told it's coming out of woodshop next week..and than a month or 2 or 3 goes by before you can get him on the phone or to answer a question about my orders.... Sure I could've went off the wall about it, but he's supposed to be a friend and gave me his word he'd make it right...there's a saying "a man is only as good as his word"... and I'm still waiting.


----------



## Uncreative123

Makes me a little weary about putting down the deposit I'm being asked for when it's been over three weeks and I still haven't gotten a quote and my e-mails, messages, and texts all go unanswered. Obviously this is someone else going through Bernie and therefore not an issue with BRJ, but I know he has issues getting ahold of him and the whole thing is already rubbing me the wrong way.


----------



## Emperoff

MaxOfMetal said:


> Perhaps those with less at stake can see more objectively through some of the bullshit.



Most of the members that ordered a guitar know better than anyone about the issues, because they're suffering in their own flesh. We don't need anyone to come here to repeat again and again things that we already now, even less people that haven't ordered a guitar.

If that guy is amazed with BRJ, why should you ruin it for him? Most of us are pissed off with this issues. If that guy is not, better for him. 

We now what's happening. Some day we will receive our guitar, we will pay it, we will play it and the ones who don't like it will sell it, as always. Having people pissing off about how BRJ customer service sucks constantly without having even ordered a guitar from him doesn't make things any better for us.

You may want to create a separate thread for that, as I think that people following this thread since a year ago is well aware of the circumnstances.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperoff said:


> I think that people following this thread since a year ago is well aware of the circumnstances.



Given some recent posts I don't think that's accurate. 

Also, if you don't want others to chime in on a public forum, get a helmet. 

Part of the reason this is left open is for everyone to see what's going on, so when it comes time to order their own guitar they're better informed. 

If you want a progress thread full of folks ignoring what's going on, start one on the BRJ forums......if it doesn't get deleted again.


----------



## thrsher

we should have a rant section for stuff like this, i thought about making said thread but don't know the appropriate place for it


----------



## msalazar

Look what I found in my email!


----------



## JPMike

^ Nice!!! Rosewood neck Jekyll?


----------



## msalazar

Nope, ebony hesperian with ebony headstock!


----------



## JPMike

I was totally off. lol.

Amazing man, what kind of finish will it be??


----------



## Hollowway

msalazar said:


> Nope, ebony hesperian with ebony headstock!



Wait, what are the specs? You mean ebony FB, right? And this is BFR, correct?


----------



## Thrashmanzac

Hollowway said:


> Wait, what are the specs? You mean ebony FB, right? And this is BFR, correct?



do you mean BFR or BRJ? i am confused?


----------



## JPMike

Thrashmanzac said:


> do you mean BFR or BRJ? i am confused?



BFR= Black Friday Run


----------



## Thrashmanzac

JPMike said:


> BFR= Black Friday Run



ok yes i completly missunderstood you, i though you were talking about ball family reserve for some reason, please cut me some slack, i just watched the grand final and im a bit pissed. on a related note, from what i have seen in this thread the BFR (black friday run  ) guitars are looking amazing. although the wait time was longer than first stated, i think the end product will be well worth it


----------



## JPMike

^Well, if you want a good custom guitar, patience is a must!!


----------



## Thrashmanzac

thats what i mean haha, it was silly of brj to say they would be finished so quickly, but at the ame time i feel it was maybe a bit silly for people to expect a custom guitar in a few months. that being said, it sucks that customers had high hopes of receiving a guitar in such a short time in the first place. dont flame me


----------



## JPMike

Hahahahahaha!!

I won't flame you!!! I am in the same boat, just waiting for it to be complete.


----------



## Thrashmanzac

cool man! i cant wait to see these guitar complete, from what i have seen so far they look fucking amazing. i suggest (and i realise it may be a dumb sugestion) that when everyone has received their guitars, we have a thread entitled "black friday porn".


----------



## JPMike

Thrashmanzac said:


> cool man! i cant wait to see these guitar complete, from what i have seen so far they look fucking amazing. i suggest (and i realise it may be a dumb sugestion) that when everyone has received their guitars, we have a thread entitled "black friday porn".



hahahahaah!!!!

EPIC!!! It will be sick!!


----------



## mountainjam

I havent checked this thread in a while, but if people are having communication issues,
Call 760-956-6619 or email [email protected]
Granted I was told my guitar would take 3 weeks to get to me, and it took 2.5 months, I never had communication issues. John always responded quickly to me. Hell, I even had his personal cell phone number. Bernie is busy as hell, thats why John works for him. Talk to him. He will get you the details if Bernie cant.


----------



## MTech

mountainjam said:


> I havent checked this thread in a while, but if people are having communication issues,
> Call 760-956-6619 or email [email protected]
> Granted I was told my guitar would take 3 weeks to get to me, and it took 2.5 months, I never had communication issues. John always responded quickly to me. Hell, I even had his personal cell phone number. Bernie is busy as hell, thats why John works for him. Talk to him. He will get you the details if Bernie cant.



That's BS cause all John did was say "I don't see why you're messaging me when you're already talking to Bernie." and Bernie claims to be out because everybody is sick and dying of the flu but then the guy above just got a progress photo out of the shop so it makes no sense now does it. You were told 2-3 weeks? I was told 2 months tops and it's 10 and counting and that's on the "quick one" the other two are still an ongoing wait that's well over a year.


----------



## Jexey

Here you guys go. Thanks to the BRJ crew for sending me a progress picture.

Looking at the other orders, the quilted maple is a little more impressive. However, I have the flame and I'm really excited to see the flame guys tops more developed and up close. I think it looks a little more aggressive.

This is obviously an 8 string, I'm getting BKP aftermaths, a kill pot, switch, and volume controls. Natural finish. I didn't get inlays, I think the blocks would have looked really neat on this guitar in retrospect but it's going to be a beautifully clean looking guitar when it's finished. Debating asking BRJ about a piezo setup.

Cheers!

edit: sorry for the rotated picture. Maybe one of the mods can spin it clockwise for me?


----------



## JPMike

I've never talked to Bernie, I have been only talking to John this whole time.


----------



## mountainjam

MTech said:


> That's BS cause all John did was say "I don't see why you're messaging me when you're already talking to Bernie." and Bernie claims to be out because everybody is sick and dying of the flu but then the guy above just got a progress photo out of the shop so it makes no sense now does it. You were told 2-3 weeks? I was told 2 months tops and it's 10 and counting and that's on the "quick one" the other two are still an ongoing wait that's well over a year.



Relax man. Dont take your anger out on me. It was merely a suggestion


----------



## msalazar

It is a Black Friday Run, 26 3/16ths scale length, dimarzio crunchlab liquifire pickups. The only upgrade I got was the ebony on the headstock, damn, I can't wait!


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Man I feel bad for Mtech


----------



## Hollowway

Stealthtastic said:


> Man I feel bad for Mtech



Put me on that list, too. I've got a BFR on the way and a custom that was ordered 21 months ago. I did finally get through to Rico Jr and John, who said they needed to re-clearcoat the top and they expect it to be done in 3 more weeks. No info on my BFR, but I'm really hoping to get the custom first, otherwise I'll feel like a total goober for paying more for a guitar that took longer. I'm very excited to get them, and I hope it's soon.


----------



## JPMike

It's been around 2 months since my custom Jekyll and 1 and a half for my Hesperian that was in stock. 

So far, I was told the Hesperian will be complete soon, at the finishing process at the moment which means, I don't see any delays and will probably receive my guitars on time. Let's hope it stays that way.

The whole waiting thing for so long, actually turns you off... 

And I feel bad for MTech too, since 2007 and no guitar. 4 years? Come on!!


----------



## Emperoff

This thread is slowly turning into another Sherman thread...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperoff said:


> This thread is slowly turning into another Sherman thread...



I'm not really sure who that reflects poorer on.  

It does seem though that at least some folks are getting through to the BRJ camp. That's at least some sign of hope.


----------



## Emperoff

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm not really sure who that reflects poorer on.
> 
> It does seem though that at least some folks are getting through to the BRJ camp. That's at least some sign of hope.



Good thing for me is that I actually have no hurry


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Emperoff said:


> Good thing for me is that I actually have no hurry



Yeah, customs certainly aren't for those who need instruments quickly. One of the main reasons that guys in touring acts tend to shy away from smaller shops. Sometimes you NEED a replacement/backup/etc. and smaller Custom Shops simply can't do it. Even the bigger ones have trouble occasionally.


----------



## mountainjam

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, customs certainly aren't for those who need instruments quickly. One of the main reasons that guys in touring acts tend to shy away from smaller shops. Sometimes you NEED a replacement/backup/etc. and smaller Custom Shops simply can't do it. Even the bigger ones have trouble occasionally.


I think thats one of Bernies biggest problems, in the opposite way. If your a signed or noteable musician, Bernie immediately moves your guitar to the front of the line, and forgets about everybody else for the time being. It seems like bulb gets his brj's start to finish in 2 months, while some of these other guys wait years


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mountainjam said:


> I think thats one of Bernies biggest problems, in the opposite way. If your a signed or noteable musician, Bernie immediately moves your guitar to the front of the line, and forgets about everybody else for the time being. It seems like bulb gets his brj's start to finish in 2 months, while some of these other guys wait years



Which is another downside of being a "regular" player and going with a higher profile, yet still not large CS. 

Though, I do believe Bulb's two BRJs (Natural, neck-thru, 7 and White, bolt-on, 6) were "In Stock" models and not full on customs. Artists do seem to get their orders expedited though.


----------



## IB-studjent-

MaxOfMetal said:


> Which is another downside of being a "regular" player and going with a higher profile, yet still not large CS.
> 
> Though, I do believe Bulb's two BRJs (Natural, neck-thru, 7 and White, bolt-on, 6) were "In Stock" models and not full on customs. Artists do seem to get their orders expedited though.



Correct.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

MaxOfMetal said:


> Which is another downside of being a "regular" player and going with a higher profile, yet still not large CS.
> 
> Though, I do believe Bulb's two BRJs (Natural, neck-thru, 7 and White, bolt-on, 6) were "In Stock" models and not full on customs. Artists do seem to get their orders expedited though.



All the BRJ guitars I own right now were stock guitars, already near completion. When I got my endorsement with him, I originally spec'd out 3 guitars. Only one of them was put into production, and that was 1.5 years ago. I couldn't even guess as to when that one would be done. 

He does seem to expedite them faster for artists, which is pretty bad business. But, that's definitely not his biggest mistake at this point.


----------



## kruneh

Got this pic on mail this weekend, very cool to see it.
I haven´t had much contact with Bernie after the specs were done, so this was a pleasant surprise.
I think the promotional value of artists playing your brand is so much worth, that it´s just natural to give them a bit more priority.


----------



## JPMike

Personally, If those artists that were playing BRJs wouldn't make me that much want one. If you get what I mean, so if Bulb or Keith or anyone, got first in line it wouldn't matter that much to me, at least.


----------



## thrsher

i understand an expedite for artist, but non of his artist are exclusive to his brand. for that matter, i don't know any artist that is exclusive to any small CS. i plan on selling my guitar once it arrives, back in nov, i had a need for what i ordered and was under the impression i would get it quick. well things have changed over a year and i have no need for it anymore. since its such a hassle to get in touch with anyone, i have to just wait it out and get the build instead of trying to transfer it to someone cause i dont want it to reflect badly on me.


----------



## mountainjam

Expediting artists guitars to give a builder more exposure to the public and ultimately sell more guitars makes no sense when you cant handle the workload you already have. But reguardless, Im in love with my jekyll, and feel privilaged to have received it in months rather than years.


----------



## MTech

JPMike said:


> The whole waiting thing for so long, actually turns you off...
> 
> And I feel bad for MTech too, since 2007 and no guitar. 4 years? Come on!!



I got the one ordered 2007 in 2009 there's a NGD thread on it.... it looked incredible but it was a complete lemon and he asked me not to say anything at the time that he'd fix it STAT so I did this because the guy was somebody whom I considered one of my better friends seeing as we'd talk like 20x a day and he'd call me for constant input and ideas because from the time we'd first met his guitars weren't selling at all.. 

He did NAMM and got no new dealers or sales because his guitars were $3-$10k and at the time the woods were mainly Poplar and Maple and the Vixen was his body main style. So anyway I sent it back and it took from May till September for me to get it back...with the exact same problem yet again. 

The minor thing was the Tremol-No was installed wrong preventing it from fluttering and it couldn't be over because he ground out part of the trem block to attach it. 

The major issue was he used the wrong species maple for the fretboard it was too soft and wouldn't hold frets.. I took it to Fred K. (Chris Brodericks Tech) and he determined it had NINE bad frets and every time he hammered one back in another popped out.... again I sent it back and was told he'd take the fretboard off and put new one on...he supposedly did this to find out woodshop didn't plane the neck right so there was a bump towards the 12th fret which is why it was buzzing like crazy... 

So at this point he said this thing is jinxed and was just going to build an entirely new one to make up for it along with a special deal on a 2nd one... I still haven't got either of them.... In the meantime of this I have a guitar with a broken truss rod he said he'd make a neck for so I had something to play on at least and it's only take 1-2months Max..

I sent him the guitar in December and STILL do not have it back.. I was told they built the neck wrong twice...I have NOT received any progress photos... I have however been given stories including the flu, vacations, a family friend supposedly committed suicide by gasoline/fire like a human torch, then "drama at shop" and again more everybody has the flu I'm not in the shop... 

If all this was true I'd feel pretty bad because the guy has to have some of the worst luck ever but some of the stories are extremely far fetched. It doesn't sit well with the stories I get from other people either which includes artists. 

I finally got disgusted and emailed John after reading you guys post about him on here and he said "[FONT=&quot]Sorry to hear about your difficulty. I'll see what I can find out for you.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Sincerely,[/FONT]"Then I get an email back stating "Not sure why you are writing to me when you already text directly with Jr. Have a great day.Sincerely" 

Top that off with being told he's out this entire week with family down with the Flu and then I get on here to see 2-3 people with progress photos....So I'm sorry but how understanding can one person be when this is the kind've responses and answers I get?


----------



## elq

MTech said:


> ....



What. The. Fuck. 

And I thought I was a patient man. 

Good luck man.


----------



## djpharoah

MTech said:


> ....



Wow.


----------



## IB-studjent-

This is very discouraging, I knew this shit was being pulled with me so I told him I don't want mine anymore and that I'll just go for a finished one.


----------



## IB-studjent-

Bernie is a great guy, but the BFR run has really fucked things up for him. Once this run is over I'm guessing it'll be better.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Mtech, I´m sorry for you bro, can´t understand how this could happen. 

I think the only way to clear this is to speak to him personally. From my side everything went great so far and I´m really happy how my guitar turned out.

In my opinion he seems to be a great guy, hopefully you´ll find a solution with him.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Pascal-Darrell said:


> Mtech, I´m sorry for you bro, can´t understand how this could happen.
> 
> I think the only way to clear this is to speak to him personally. From my side everything went great so far and* I´m really happy how my guitar turned out*.
> 
> In my opinion he seems to be a great guy, hopefully you´ll find a solution with him.



Wait, you got your Black Friday guitar already?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

oh no, sorry for th emisunderstanding dude. I meant I´m really happy how the guitar turned out SO FAR, from the look and all the extras I wanted etc...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Pascal-Darrell said:


> oh no, sorry for th emisunderstanding dude. I meant I´m really happy how the guitar turned out SO FAR, from the look and all the extras I wanted etc...



So according to the photos you've viewed of a guitar ear marked as yours it seems to be that the specs haven't deviated? Gotcha. 

I was gonna say, you were really holding out on everyone.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

sorry dude, my english isn´t that good ^^ 

I´ve posted all my specs and a picture of the guitar a few pages ago. And if I´ll get some news I´ll let you all know. 

And if I receive the guitar (hopefully in the next months) I´ll do a review of course 

Or did I understood something wrong ?


----------



## technomancer

MTech said:


> I got the one ordered 2007 in 2009 there's a NGD thread on it.... it looked incredible but it was a complete lemon and he asked me not to say anything at the time that he'd fix it STAT so I did this because the guy was somebody whom I considered one of my better friends seeing as we'd talk like 20x a day and he'd call me for constant input and ideas because from the time we'd first met his guitars weren't selling at all..
> 
> He did NAMM and got no new dealers or sales because his guitars were $3-$10k and at the time the woods were mainly Poplar and Maple and the Vixen was his body main style. So anyway I sent it back and it took from May till September for me to get it back...with the exact same problem yet again.
> 
> The minor thing was the Tremol-No was installed wrong preventing it from fluttering and it couldn't be over because he ground out part of the trem block to attach it.
> 
> The major issue was he used the wrong species maple for the fretboard it was too soft and wouldn't hold frets.. I took it to Fred K. (Chris Brodericks Tech) and he determined it had NINE bad frets and every time he hammered one back in another popped out.... again I sent it back and was told he'd take the fretboard off and put new one on...he supposedly did this to find out woodshop didn't plane the neck right so there was a bump towards the 12th fret which is why it was buzzing like crazy...
> 
> So at this point he said this thing is jinxed and was just going to build an entirely new one to make up for it along with a special deal on a 2nd one... I still haven't got either of them.... In the meantime of this I have a guitar with a broken truss rod he said he'd make a neck for so I had something to play on at least and it's only take 1-2months Max..
> 
> I sent him the guitar in December and STILL do not have it back.. I was told they built the neck wrong twice...I have NOT received any progress photos... I have however been given stories including the flu, vacations, a family friend supposedly committed suicide by gasoline/fire like a human torch, then "drama at shop" and again more everybody has the flu I'm not in the shop...
> 
> If all this was true I'd feel pretty bad because the guy has to have some of the worst luck ever but some of the stories are extremely far fetched. It doesn't sit well with the stories I get from other people either which includes artists.
> 
> I finally got disgusted and emailed John after reading you guys post about him on here and he said "[FONT=&quot]Sorry to hear about your difficulty. I'll see what I can find out for you.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Sincerely,[/FONT]"Then I get an email back stating "Not sure why you are writing to me when you already text directly with Jr. Have a great day.Sincerely"
> 
> Top that off with being told he's out this entire week with family down with the Flu and then I get on here to see 2-3 people with progress photos....So I'm sorry but how understanding can one person be when this is the kind've responses and answers I get?



Wow


----------



## JPMike

MTech, I have no words. Really, there's nothing I can say about it. 

All I can say is be patient, or dunno, try contacting them again or maybe even go from the shop or make a new order and see how they will react. 

 God damn, I feel bad for you, bro.


----------



## MTech

Pascal-Darrell said:


> Mtech, I´m sorry for you bro, can´t understand how this could happen.
> 
> I think the only way to clear this is to speak to him personally.



Obviously I am/Do..and all I get is more excuses or no answer at all... it wouldn't be so aggravating if I at least got progress shots like everybody else seems to have no issue doing... So it's like do I keep believing everything or am I just being lied to and scammed... and if so how could somebody you considered a good friend do such a thing.


----------



## Invader

That's horrible! I too don't know what more to say than I feel for you, hang in there! I know personally what it feels like to receive a custom guitar that turns out to be a lemon.

I really hope all the BFR (and non BFR for that matter) guitars will eventually turn out to be flawless.


----------



## infernalservice

MaxOfMetal said:


> Which is another downside of being a "regular" player and going with a higher profile, yet still not large CS.
> 
> Though, I do believe Bulb's two BRJs (Natural, neck-thru, 7 and White, bolt-on, 6) were "In Stock" models and not full on customs. Artists do seem to get their orders expedited though.



Artists definitely see a quicker turn around. I ordered an in stock bolt on and didn't get it for almost 4 months. When I called to order it, Bern mentioned he also had a solid white one in stock. Two weeks later he told me bulb grabbed that white one. Not even two weeks after that I start seeing bulb's NGD threads all over on that guitar. That means Bulb only waited like 3 weeks tops for his.


----------



## MTech

So how about a good news post to get this thread back on track with a positive note 

I started my early afternoon off today by getting to have a 2 hour conversation with Bernie on the phone. Needless to say we discussed EVERYTHING from my concerns/issues to what a lot of people have brought up on this forum, and the few things just a couple have mentioned on here, and I got some good answers to most everything. So without any further wait I'll lay out some good informative stuff here cause I know a lot of people (myself included) all have a question or two we wanted to know.

Customer Service! Bernie admitted it's been hectic so he's come up with a pretty awesome idea here to bring things back down to earth and touch it back to how he intended to run things when he first started Rico Jr... Having a company that you can directly talk to the head of the company and the guy actually building your guitar. It would take too much time to call every individual person who has a guitar ordered and not everybody is looking to find things out or as curious as others so here's what he came up with.. He said what he's going to do over the next couple days is get a phone line setup that anybody on here that has a guitar in production/ordered (not just BFR) can call and speak DIRECTLY to him on the status of your current order. All you need is your name and your order number and if he's not available than all you've gotta do is leave a message and he will call you back asap. I'm sure a lot of you will be stoked about this needless to say

Next up he's going to start taking photos of the building process more so that everybody has an idea of what it actually takes to build a Rico Jr guitar. It'd add a lot of time to photograph the entire building process of everybody's guitars but he is at least going to get shots up to show what it takes and how much time goes into each and every one.

Woodshop.. Well we've determined the woodshop is not a magical fairytale place as questioned in another thread  The shop is his own private team that makes everything and Bernie does the Necks/Some Paints/Electronics/Setups etc. Basically things have slowed up because he had guys not performing to Bernie's standards and the issue is this.. When you're making a one off custom for somebody if 1 thing gets messed up then he's gotta start the whole guitar over again... Some guys had to be let go and now he's working with more orders than ever with fewer guys then before. He apologized and said he can understand the frustration. As for aartists he does have guys that wait just as long and sometimes longer..the cases you've seen that were sped up were because of guys that had to have something for a tour so obviously they get bumped up to meet a certain deadline because they're a touring national act and NEED that instrument. 


Also there will be another Black Friday Run this year...


j/k 

But I brought that up too and he said that if you remember correctly he said it was going to be a once in a lifetime opportunity... so needless to say those deals were a 1 time thing only and yes he did get more orders than he thought he would so it's taking longer than expected, but that was a 1 time special deal. 


Last but certainly not least he said my neck is apparently going to come out of woodshop this week or next and he's going to get me some progress photos on it and my 727 build.


----------



## IB-studjent-

^ this is probably the most useful thing anybody has said on this thread, thanks for the update buddy


----------



## Michael T

Hell yeah !!! So will the phone # be the same one we already have ?
Thanks MTech


----------



## MTech

IB-studjent- said:


> ^ this is probably the most useful thing anybody has said on this thread, thanks for the update buddy



Thanks You 


Michael T said:


> Hell yeah !!! So will the phone # be the same one we already have ?
> Thanks MTech



No... I also said why don't you just use the shop number but thing is EVERYBODY calls that..... 
The point of this is for existing customers who have an order in or a guitar already in production to have it so when you call you get Bernie and if you have your name and order number he will take the time to talk to you right there on the spot. So that way he knows when his "bat phone" so to speak rings it's a legit call from a order holding customer to get some answers/information on their order. it's not to call for quotes and randomness, or to discuss the great place you found for crepes when you went out for breakfast etc.... I guess he could use the shop number but than that means you basically need somebody else answering the phones to screen the important order calls over to Bernie Directly as long as he's there.

It makes sense because if you're going to place an order you can email in specs and request a quote...he can call you back etc... But for guys who have been waiting and have orders in this gives you the chance to touch base with him to go over any concerns you may have or answer questions w/o any issue or time lapse.

Also another thing that I forgot to mention, Ed Roman got an ear full about that ebay guitar.


----------



## djpharoah

MTech said:


> No... I said why don't you just use the shop number but thing is EVERYBODY calls that..... The point of this is for existing customers who have an order in or a guitar already in production to have it so when you call you get Bernie and if you have your name and order number he will take the time to talk to you right there on the spot. So that way he knows when his "bat phone" so to speak rings it's a legit call from a order holding customer. it's not to call for quotes and randomness, or to discuss the great place you found for crepes when you went out for breakfast etc..


----------



## kmanick

Wow MTech I had no idea your original one was a lemon. Shit that's one of my favorite ones I've seen so far. 
I'm glad you got a hold of him.
My Hesperian is a freaking amazing gutiar (One year later , yes I am still in love  ) when they come out right they are amazing instruments.
I hope you guys start getting yours soon, he took waaaaay too many orders on that Black Friday run, hopefully he can get a couple of good
shop guys to get things rolling again.


----------



## MTech

kmanick said:


> Wow MTech I had no idea your original one was a lemon. Shit that's one of my favorite ones I've seen so far.
> I'm glad you got a hold of him.
> My Hesperian is a freaking amazing gutiar (One year later , yes I am still in love  ) when they come out right they are amazing instruments.
> I hope you guys start getting yours soon, he took waaaaay too many orders on that Black Friday run, hopefully he can get a couple of good
> shop guys to get things rolling again.



I mentioned about the posts saying there was 160 or 200+ BFR's but he said there's not nearly as many orders in for the BFR as some people are claiming on here... he just had complications at the shop including some people needing to be let go so it's not a smaller crew working to churn these guitars out to the customers exact specs..... He's a perfectionist and I like to use this as an example for people to understand.... He had a customer (I think he posted on here??) that Bernie totally rebuilt his guitar because there was a mark in the mahogany on his guitar even though it was going to be a solid color...other manufactures would still use this... Another favorite builder of mine that comes to mind is McNaught, I was told by one of his endorsee's, that also plays a Rico, he'll use pieces like that to do solid over the back/sides and that's why it's a lower price than the totally trans finished ones. 

I know... most everybody who has seen it in pictures and even more in person have flipped out over how it came out..the top and color are absolutely incredible ...honestly that's what had me worried on my rebuild because the finish comes out different every time and even Bernie said the one on mine came out the best of any they've done so far..it was incredible. It was weird when I got it I only had a slight buzz and thought it was just from weather change from Cali out to Colorado, but we figured out it was one fret... I sent it back and he went to re-fret but it wasn't holding them so he put a new board on it and sent it back and they all started doing it again and that's when he realized the wood supplier gave him a flamed maple blank of the wrong species so it wasn't holding the frets. The Tremol-No was also the 1st as I suggested he check them out cause I'd known Kevan for some time so I had a sample one sent out for Bernie to try on mine and if he liked them offer them as an option or put on all Floyd Equipped guitars. That was the 1st time he'd worked with one obviously and after that he started running them through the polishing wheel to smooth them out big time and allow you to get maximum flutter while using one.

Needless to say it's a crazy feeling to have one of if not the best built guitar you've ever held in your hands...then something go wrong.....then waiting for another one while playing other manufactures guitars and the whole time thinking about your Rico.... he's really a perfectionist so it bummed him out a lot too because the other guitars didn't have any issues... A good thing of it though is I'm now getting SS frets and direct mounted pickups which I wanted from the beginning but he wasn't doing at the time.


----------



## MetalDaze

Proof that a little communication goes a long way.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MTech said:


> So how about a good news post to get this thread back on track with a positive note
> 
> I started my early afternoon off today by getting to have a 2 hour conversation with Bernie on the phone. Needless to say we discussed EVERYTHING from my concerns/issues to what a lot of people have brought up on this forum, and the few things just a couple have mentioned on here, and I got some good answers to most everything. So without any further wait I'll lay out some good informative stuff here cause I know a lot of people (myself included) all have a question or two we wanted to know.
> 
> Customer Service! Bernie admitted it's been hectic so he's come up with a pretty awesome idea here to bring things back down to earth and touch it back to how he intended to run things when he first started Rico Jr... Having a company that you can directly talk to the head of the company and the guy actually building your guitar. It would take too much time to call every individual person who has a guitar ordered and not everybody is looking to find things out or as curious as others so here's what he came up with.. He said what he's going to do over the next couple days is get a phone line setup that anybody on here that has a guitar in production/ordered (not just BFR) can call and speak DIRECTLY to him on the status of your current order. All you need is your name and your order number and if he's not available than all you've gotta do is leave a message and he will call you back asap. I'm sure a lot of you will be stoked about this needless to say
> 
> Next up he's going to start taking photos of the building process more so that everybody has an idea of what it actually takes to build a Rico Jr guitar. It'd add a lot of time to photograph the entire building process of everybody's guitars but he is at least going to get shots up to show what it takes and how much time goes into each and every one.
> 
> Woodshop.. Well we've determined the woodshop is not a magical fairytale place as questioned in another thread  The shop is his own private team that makes everything and Bernie does the Necks/Some Paints/Electronics/Setups etc. Basically things have slowed up because he had guys not performing to Bernie's standards and the issue is this.. When you're making a one off custom for somebody if 1 thing gets messed up then he's gotta start the whole guitar over again... Some guys had to be let go and now he's working with more orders than ever with fewer guys then before. He apologized and said he can understand the frustration. As for aartists he does have guys that wait just as long and sometimes longer..the cases you've seen that were sped up were because of guys that had to have something for a tour so obviously they get bumped up to meet a certain deadline because they're a touring national act and NEED that instrument.
> 
> 
> Also there will be another Black Friday Run this year...
> 
> 
> j/k
> 
> But I brought that up too and he said that if you remember correctly he said it was going to be a once in a lifetime opportunity... so needless to say those deals were a 1 time thing only and yes he did get more orders than he thought he would so it's taking longer than expected, but that was a 1 time special deal.
> 
> 
> Last but certainly not least he said my neck is apparently going to come out of woodshop this week or next and he's going to get me some progress photos on it and my 727 build.


 
If this is satire it's genius.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I´m really happy for you Mtech  things have turned out good in the end right ?


----------



## JPMike

^+1

Good to hear, that you actually came up to a solution and things are getting better.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Just received this from Bernie. Nice ebony top on headstock eh  finish has still to be applied, stoked!


----------



## JPMike

^Looks awesome!!


----------



## MTech

Surprised nobody noticed Bernie's awesome new 7 String Slant Top Single Cutaway (LP) style on the wall back there....


----------



## mikernaut

MTech said:


> Surprised nobody noticed Bernie's awesome new 7 String Slant Top Single Cutaway (LP) style on the wall back there....



I noticed 

I swear Misha mention something about a tele shape too that he was trying to get Bernie to make.


----------



## MTech

mikernaut said:


> I noticed
> 
> I swear Misha mention something about a tele shape too that he was trying to get Bernie to make.



I've got some really good photos of the 7 string LP it's for one of his smaller band artists..absolutely gorgeous looking.

I've been pushing the Tele shape for like 2 years..... I actually have a pretty major artist interested in getting a Tele off of him to the point where we traced a Fender Tele and send him the trace so he could tweak it out to his own design but he's been so busy we haven't seen anything yet... The plan was for my 3rd to be a 8 string Tele if I like the look he comes up with but otherwise I'm sticking with a Jekyl.


----------



## WillDfx

MTech said:


> I've got some really good photos of the 7 string LP it's for one of his smaller band artists..absolutely gorgeous looking.
> 
> I've been pushing the Tele shape for like 2 years..... I actually have a pretty major artist interested in getting a Tele off of him to the point where we traced a Fender Tele and send him the trace so he could tweak it out to his own design but he's been so busy we haven't seen anything yet... The plan was for my 3rd to be a 8 string Tele if I like the look he comes up with but otherwise I'm sticking with a Jekyl.



That LP Rico is being built for Ty Dietzler from Thousand Foot Krutch


----------



## mikernaut




----------



## MTech

mikernaut said:


>



I wouldn't get that can opener headstock lol
Honestly I thought the Retro headstock would work very well for the Tele.


----------



## JPMike

Too bad, I am not a classic Tele or LP fan.

But I would make a kinda redesigned tele shape.


----------



## Khoi

didn't really see this thread before, but I guess I'm in the same boat as everyone else, just waiting for their Black Friday guitar. I've been pretty patient and I guess I'm one of the earlier orders, but here's the picture he sent back on August 26th. I know I'm probably at least another month off to be honest... but I know when I get it, it'll be schweet


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Looks sweet as hell man


----------



## Qweklain

Looking at that guitar Khoi, reminds me Noob Saibot from Mortal Kombat lol.


----------



## aiur55

I shouldnt have left mine as a plain top....your guitar looks sweet!


----------



## Khoi

hahah thanks, flamed maple top with black burst! I was actually hoping the black burst would be a little more gradual, but this looks awesome too.

Getting aged nickel pickup covers, BKP nailbomb bridge, and cold sweat neck


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah, I've seen a lot of black burst BRJ guitars, and I've never seen one that doesn't have an edged look. It seems to be his "thing" when it comes to that particular finish. It grows on you when you've looked at it long enough, but I've always liked the elegance of a gradual burst a bit more. Awesome guitar there though, man!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

"guitar is still in the woodshop being cut, should be out by this week. Then off to the finish line, should be *at least a month* before your guitar is finished."


----------



## MetalDaze

So.......I just spent an hour on the phone with Bernie.

Whenever I see someone post that they talked with Bernie, I go, "WTF? He never talks to me...." So here's my story:

I have a Black Friday guitar on order (which I've received no update on in ages). I also decided to pick up an 'in stock' guitar earlier this year because I was tired of waiting for the BF and how often do you see a builder with an unfinished lefty hanging around? (I've posted a WIP thead on it separately - Trans Blue Quilt Diva).

But, I don't have the Diva yet either. Needless to say, I was getting pissed and sent yet another email to Bernie's email address on Sunday explaining that this is getting ridiculous and I'm at my wit's end.

I wake up today and check my email to find this:

"Hi Dave, 
I called you a couple times today, please give me a call on my cell when you get the chance. 760-xxx-xxxx. -Bernie"

Again, I had a WTF moment. I check my phone and sure enough, 2 text messages, 4 missed calls, and a vmail from Bernie. That's what I get for turning my ringer off.

Before I had the chance to call him this morning, here comes another incoming call from 760...... and it's Bernie.

For the next 60 minutes, we talked about the status of my guitars, the rundown of what's happening with the business, and some of the drama that surrounds all of this.

Everything he told me was consistent with what's been posted by the few that have actually talked to him. He made it clear several times that he's not offering up "excuses" but rather an "explanation" of what transpired over the last year. He's not hesitant to talk about what happened and he never wanted it turn out that way. But at this point "it is what it is" and he's determined to get everything back on track.

You could sum it all up by saying he's incredibly concerned about the quality of the guitars he turns out....whether that be the quality of the woodwork, the finish, or other fine details. Because of that he's had to fire guys that couldn't cut it in the woodshop, refinish guitars that had scratches on them, or otherwise start from scratch on some orders. That plus the fact that does the quality check on every guitar himself means that he's got a huge backlog of work in his queue.

He knows that people are unhappy and you can tell he's not incredibly happy with some of his staff (sorry if those guys are reading) with how they are responding (or not responding) to customer questions/concerns. That's why he's establishing a new number for customers with actual orders vs the main line so he can make it easier to get a hold of him.

He also said that after working through the current backlog, he's going to be implementing some changes in his shop in order to get back to the way things used to be.....hand built quality guitars delivered in a timely fashion with Bernie's personal touch. 

To be honest, I feel a billion times better about the guy and my orders after talking to him. Does it suck that it took this long to talk to him? Yes. Is he working through the "growing pains" of scaling his business? I believe so.

I sort of feel like this is a case of "no good deed goes unpunished". He bit off more than he could chew by offering the BF deal and he realizes that now. That is certainly no "excuse", but hopefully this provides more of an "explanation".


----------



## HaMMerHeD

The loudest lesson I am learning when reading this stuff as a wannabe builder is that if you have a one-time special offer like this, it would be smart to limit the number of orders you are willing to take.


----------



## geofreesun

i have received an email from bernie, my black friday special run guitar is complete!!! it's ready to ship. anyone else???
the email will give you a link with a password for you to complete your order on the brj website.


----------



## leonardo7

geofreesun said:


> i have received an email from bernie, my black friday special run guitar is complete!!! it's ready to ship. anyone else???
> the email will give you a link with a password for you to complete your order on the brj website.



Awesome!  Do you know if you were one of the first to order?


----------



## geofreesun

leonardo7 said:


> Awesome!  Do you know if you were one of the first to order?


i have no idea. maybe i am one of the first 15? at least the first 50 i think


----------



## toiletstand

nice!


----------



## Larrikin666

geofreesun said:


> i have received an email from bernie, my black friday special run guitar is complete!!! it's ready to ship. anyone else???
> the email will give you a link with a password for you to complete your order on the brj website.



Yeah. I got my email on Sunday. I paid this morning, so it should have shipped out this afternoon.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

pics please !!!  I hope that i´ll also receive an email from him in the next few days/weeks


----------



## leonardo7

Whoever gets to it first should start a "post your BRJ BFR NGD day here" thread. I have a feeling that thread will be alive and active for a very long time


----------



## MetalDaze

^^^ 

Yes, now that the log jam is breaking free, we should all be getting some happy emails from Bernie and crew


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

i got an email on the 22nd of Sept asking for final payment(which i paid in June) I emailed them asking what was up with the payment and they said yeah they messed up and not to worry it's been paid in full. but i haven't heard anything about it being finish(but i can only imagine they would ask for the bill of a finished product) and i even emailed john asking when my guitar would be done then after we got the whole payment thing figured out and i haven't heard back but I'm waiting for a box to randomly show up because i think that's how i'll find out my guitar is done


----------



## geofreesun

NeoTheMaggot said:


> i got an email on the 22nd of Sept asking for final payment(which i paid in June) I emailed them asking what was up with the payment and they said yeah they messed up and not to worry it's been paid in full. but i haven't heard anything about it being finish(but i can only imagine they would ask for the bill of a finished product) and i even emailed john asking when my guitar would be done then after we got the whole payment thing figured out and i haven't heard back but I'm waiting for a box to randomly show up because i think that's how i'll find out my guitar is done



surprises are always the best right~


----------



## Hollowway

geofreesun said:


> i have received an email from bernie, my black friday special run guitar is complete!!! it's ready to ship. anyone else???
> the email will give you a link with a password for you to complete your order on the brj website.



 No word on mine, and I was definitely in the first 15. And still haven't received my custom I ordered ages before the Black Friday run (John said another month). I appreciate all the stuff that he's going through, but if it were me I would finish up the older customs before I started finishing the sale items. I think in general people are more inclined to accept a long wait so long as it's first in first out. Otherwise it leaves a sour taste in the mouth of those of us that spent more money on a custom before the run only to receive the guitar after those that ordered them on sale.


----------



## geofreesun

Hollowway said:


> No word on mine, and I was definitely in the first 15. And still haven't received my custom I ordered ages before the Black Friday run (John said another month). I appreciate all the stuff that he's going through, but if it were me I would finish up the older customs before I started finishing the sale items. I think in general people are more inclined to accept a long wait so long as it's first in first out. Otherwise it leaves a sour taste in the mouth of those of us that spent more money on a custom before the run only to receive the guitar after those that ordered them on sale.


I totally agree with you on that first-in-first-out policy. it's strange to me that only a few people got the word from brj about their guitars being finished.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Exactly, but maybe yours was one of the ones that needed to be rebuilt? Who knows right?


----------



## Hollowway

Stealthtastic said:


> Exactly, but maybe yours was one of the ones that needed to be rebuilt? Who knows right?



Yeah it was. (The custom, that is.) Unfortunately I can't convince the part of my brain that wants it NOW to wait. C'est la vie, I guess.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Fuck the french indeed


----------



## Hollowway

Stealthtastic said:


> Fuck the french indeed


----------



## MTech

HaMMerHeD said:


> The loudest lesson I am learning when reading this stuff as a wannabe builder is that if you have a one-time special offer like this, it would be smart to limit the number of orders you are willing to take.


Keep in mind though that he took all the orders with the ability to churn out guitars pretty fast but than had to let go of employees....so now it's all kind've demand and orders and he's short staffed..and you can't just pull some schmuck in off the street and train them to build things up to his standards in a week..or months for that matter... even major name brands have told me they don't let anybody without 4+ years master luthiers experience even sand a neck.



geofreesun said:


> I totally agree with you on that first-in-first-out policy. it's strange to me that only a few people got the word from brj about their guitars being finished.


Depends on options though... for instance the prototype 627 had all kind've options etc and though it was started first, the first completed Jekyll was the 2nd one made that was just oil finished mahogany.... Plus like somebody said and you even said was the case, if yours got messed up then there's a rebuild which sends it all back to the beginning again. As with the emails he probably just replied to those that wrote him, and on top of that the ones he's got the scoop on (i.e. are outta shop etc)


----------



## Invader

I haven't heard back from Bernie for a while now. I've asked for a final payment invoice for over a month now. Seeing euro go from 1.44USD to 1.31USD while waiting for the invoice can get pretty depressing when there are several thousand dollars on the line.


----------



## Larrikin666

Hollowway said:


> No word on mine, and I was definitely in the first 15. And still haven't received my custom I ordered ages before the Black Friday run (John said another month). I appreciate all the stuff that he's going through, but if it were me I would finish up the older customs before I started finishing the sale items. I think in general people are more inclined to accept a long wait so long as it's first in first out. Otherwise it leaves a sour taste in the mouth of those of us that spent more money on a custom before the run only to receive the guitar after those that ordered them on sale.



Did you change anything on your Black Friday order that would add some build time? I want bone stock except for adding a neck pickup. I figured the least complex build would mean I got my guitar sooner.


----------



## thrsher

this whole rebuild is bullshit, if something needs to be reworked, contact the customer.....ridiculous. we are not psychics.


----------



## Hollowway

Larrikin666 said:


> Did you change anything on your Black Friday order that would add some build time? I want bone stock except for adding a neck pickup. I figured the least complex build would mean I got my guitar sooner.



No, my BFR is same as yours- just added a neck pup.

BUT... Good news! I just got an email from Bernie (or John - not sure) saying my custom is just about done. I'm not sure when my BFR will show up, but I'm expecting the custom soon.


----------



## MTech

So more good news for you guys at least... I talked to Bernie last night and he sent me a ton of photos of Diva's, Vixens, 727/827's and some of his family models that he's got almost done or done. I'm waiting on shots of my neck as it's supposed to be outta shop this week he said and the weeks almost done. However, he said he's got about 10 completes shipping next week.


----------



## MetalDaze

Well........start posting those pics!


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

That dragon inlay is sick!


----------



## leonardo7

People are so gonna go from "Im stressed Bernie is flaking and Im worried Im getting screwed over" to "Bernie is the man"


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> Whoo hoo! That one's mine! Finally!


----------



## MTech

leonardo7 said:


> People are so gonna go from "Im stressed Bernie is flaking and Im worried Im getting screwed over" to "Bernie is the man"



I was thinking the same thing. 




Hollowway said:


> Whoo hoo! That one's mine! Finally!


I about shit myself when I saw that one and I don't even like red guitars


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> I about shit myself when I saw that one and I don't even like red guitars



Thanks! I'm hoping the quilt pops a little more in person, but it's my first red guitar, and I did an natural, oil finished sides and back, so I'm pretty stoked about getting it. I ordered it through Zimbloth, so he's shipping a couple of Aftermaths to Bernie to put in it. I think those are probably not yet them, but maybe in a few days they're arrive.


----------



## mikernaut

Yay some new pics! I don't even like natural looking guitars but that last one is hawt!


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Thanks! I'm hoping the quilt pops a little more in person, but it's my first red guitar, and I did an natural, oil finished sides and back, so I'm pretty stoked about getting it. I ordered it through Zimbloth, so he's shipping a couple of Aftermaths to Bernie to put in it. I think those are probably not yet them, but maybe in a few days they're arrive.



Hard to get when doing an overhead with a cellphone I'm sure....I bet its more like this in person (http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/gu...-rico-jr-neck-thru-hesperian-cs-7-string.html)
IDK what else they'd be if it's yours and that's what you ordered...the only other passive 8's I know he's got is the new DiMarzios and he said he hasn't put them in anything yet.



mikernaut said:


> Yay some new pics! I don't even like natural looking guitars but that last one is hawt!



That's actually the one that's been on his page for a bit, he said they put a neck pickup in it and IIRC stained it purple.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> IDK what else they'd be if it's yours and that's what you ordered...



Yeah, they might be. I could have sworn Nick mailed them earlier in the summer, but I got an email from John at BRJ saying he hadn't received them, so I emailed Nick who said he'd ship them right out. So it's possible that the Aftermaths are in there, and that they both forgot they had them given how much time has passed. Otherwise maybe Bernie just dropped a set of PKs in. But I would think they wouldn't go through the effort of soldering the wrong pups in just for a photo or whatever.


----------



## JPMike

That RED BRJ looks hot and sexy!!


----------



## Winspear

Oh that's awesome! Nice bridge choice


----------



## Hollowway

Hollowway said:


> MTech said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whoo hoo! That one's mine! Finally!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aaaaand, that's not my guitar.  Apparently some one else likes double blade inlays at the 12th fret, red top natural back and sides and 2 pups, one volume, and Kahler. (Actually this might be the build that was done with the wrong woods so they rebuilt it last spring.) So as it turns out, mine does not have the pickups in and has not yet been assembled.
Click to expand...


----------



## glassmoon0fo

^Holy shit dude. knowing the backstory to this whole saga, I bet you're bout ready to cut a throat


----------



## Hollowway

glassmoon0fo said:


> ^Holy shit dude. knowing the backstory to this whole saga, I bet you're bout ready to cut a throat


 
Haha, well I would be if they hadn't told me it's just about done. I'm hoping to see it in the next 3 weeks, based on what John said in his email. I'm trying to stay optimistic.


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> Haha, well I would be if they hadn't told me it's just about done. I'm hoping to see it in the next 3 weeks, based on what John said in his email. I'm trying to stay optimistic.



2 and something weeks for mine. 

I feel you bro, I feel you.

Plus here's a pic of Bernie with my build.


----------



## mikernaut

Are those Green Jekylls I spy in the back?


----------



## JPMike

Might be.


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> Are those Green Jekylls I spy in the back?


 
Are those yours? That green looks cool!


----------



## MTech

JPMike said:


> Plus here's a pic of Bernie with my build.


----------



## mikernaut

Not mine, but I love bright green guitars. Actually thought about a neon green Jekyll before, but I still got a "Wicked Violet" quilt top idea I really wanna do. As seen in my mock ups. (1 hum, white binding, 27 frets)


----------



## JPMike

MTech said:


>



Hey MTech, actually this is not my guitar, lol.

Mine it's flame maple top and has no binding around the neck.


----------



## MTech

JPMike said:


> Hey MTech, actually this is not my guitar, lol.
> 
> Mine it's flame maple top and has no binding around the neck.



That's a different one I just tossed it up to show how much different there is from spray to finish and maybe we could see who it belongs too


----------



## Khoi

so anyone else get any e-mails saying their guitars are ready/shipping soon?


----------



## Isan

negative


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> so anyone else get any e-mails saying their guitars are ready/shipping soon?


I got another text with photos including one of mine ready for stain, I just have to load them up...there's 3 all natural finished flamed top ones that just shipped and he said the customers they belong too all know..so I don't wanna ruin anybody's NGD...see if anybody recognizes the specs as theirs
1 - 724 Hipshot w/ toggle & vol DiMarzios Flame Maple Top Ebony Board
2 - 627 Hipshot w/ 1vol, 1 EMG Flamed Top Ebony Board
3 - 727 Hipshot w/ toggle & vol & another much smaller knob (killswitch?) DiMarzios Flame Maple Top Ebony Board

Shot of mine outta woodshop ready for enhancement/staining.... I'm trying to decide which DiMarzio's to put in it so suggestions are welcome. (Mahogany Wings/Maple Neck&Top)


----------



## geofreesun

^ hell yeah i am one of the 3 you listed!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

no mail from bernie... checking my emails a couple of times every day is a huge pain in the ass ^^


----------



## MTech

geofreesun said:


> ^ hell yeah i am one of the 3 you listed!


Awesome! Did you get photos or do you care if photo is posted?? If so which one, 1-2-3?


----------



## geofreesun

MTech said:


> Awesome! Did you get photos or do you care if photo is posted?? If so which one, 1-2-3?


i am 3. i paid full amount last tuesday and asked for a tracking number. no response so far but it should be here before weekend? i don't have pix of the complete guitar, just a pic update from keith a few weeks ago, a guitar without hardware (see my previous post in the thread). do you happen to have any more info ?


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Did they actually tell you your guitar shipped or did you just pay off your bill? I'm asking because one of the #s Mtech said matches my build. But i have yet to hear anything about my guitar shipping, though i was sent a final bill on the 22nd of september(for a bill i paid on the 29th of june) after they found out that i had actually paid them then, they let me know but when i immediately after asked about how much more time it would be i haven't heard anything back. Am I stupid for being confused here?


----------



## geofreesun

NeoTheMaggot said:


> Did they actually tell you your guitar shipped or did you just pay off your bill? I'm asking because one of the #s Mtech said matches my build. But i have yet to hear anything about my guitar shipping, though i was sent a final bill on the 22nd of september(for a bill i paid on the 29th of june) after they found out that i had actually paid them then, they let me know but when i immediately after asked about how much more time it would be i haven't heard anything back. Am I stupid for being confused here?



number 3 is the same as my spec. bernie told me my guitar is ready to ship before i paid the bill, so i am hoping all is well...


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

for sure dude, also to clear up confusion #3 wasn't the one that matched mine! so you should be good to go


----------



## MTech

geofreesun said:


> i am 3. i paid full amount last tuesday and asked for a tracking number. no response so far but it should be here before weekend? i don't have pix of the complete guitar, just a pic update from keith a few weeks ago, a guitar without hardware (see my previous post in the thread). do you happen to have any more info ?


Sure Do, I have finished shots of all 3 before they shipped... he said the customers know but since nobody posted anything I didn't know if people were waiting to post a NGD or if he didn't send them a finished shot because I know he likes to send build teasers but not finished shots.. then it show up and freaks you out all the better as a total surprise.... These natural ones looks great though, so what is the extra knob then??
Neo - I shot you a PM of the one that's possibly yours.


----------



## geofreesun

MTech said:


> Sure Do, I have finished shots of all 3 before they shipped... he said the customers know but since nobody posted anything I didn't know if people were waiting to post a NGD or if he didn't send them a finished shot because I know he likes to send build teasers but not finished shots.. then it show up and freaks you out all the better as a total surprise.... These natural ones looks great though, so what is the extra knob then??
> Neo - I shot you a PM of the one that's possibly yours.



sweet~ thanks mtech! the miniswitch is for coil split. i asked for push-pull but Bernie told me that the body is too thin for that, so i asked for an extra mini toggle~ that looks gorgeous, will it be at my doorstep tomorrow?


----------



## MTech

geofreesun said:


> sweet~ thanks mtech! the miniswitch is for coil split. i asked for push-pull but Bernie told me that the body is too thin for that, so i asked for an extra mini toggle~ that looks gorgeous, will it be at my doorstep tomorrow?



See i thought it was a mini but you got the Petrucci style 3WT on there it looks like which I got him to start using a few years ago so I always think well it's split in middle so good to go... but you have all kind've options with a mini toggle split plus the 3WT.
I was gonna go natural or a stain on mine and actually ended up picking a color after seeing these 3 naturals all shipping out together cause yours is pretty close to my specs. 

All he told me was all 3 already shipped so should be there any day now..... I'm hoping it doesn't take long to stain/clean/oil mine cause now I'm real anxious.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> Sure Do, I have finished shots of all 3 before they shipped... he said the customers know but since nobody posted anything I didn't know if people were waiting to post a NGD or if he didn't send them a finished shot because I know he likes to send build teasers but not finished shots.. then it show up and freaks you out all the better as a total surprise.... These natural ones looks great though, so what is the extra knob then??
> Neo - I shot you a PM of the one that's possibly yours.



MTech, did you just get info on those 3, or do you have an idea on when they all will be coming? i.e. are some still months away, or is he rolling out a couple dozen in the next week or two?


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> MTech, did you just get info on those 3, or do you have an idea on when they all will be coming? i.e. are some still months away, or is he rolling out a couple dozen in the next week or two?


I just asked about those 3 he sent me yesterday. He told me this weekend about 10 were going out this week and then last night and this morning texted me bunch've photos of stuff in shop of which 3 were all natural and he said those 3 had all shipped.. I posted photos of some other shots he sent but a Mod deleted them.. aside form the purple ones posted there was a tight quilt natural (almost looked birdseye) a blue quilt with natural binding, a red Diva, and a White Vixen. 

Right now he seems to be just busting it to get these done to perfection as quickly as possible cause he feels really bad that everybody has been waiting since things slowed up when he let a few people go...tons of guitars in the background as you can see in a lot of the shots everybody posts including mine.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> I just asked about those 3 he sent me yesterday. He told me this weekend about 10 were going out this week and then last night and this morning texted me bunch've photos of stuff in shop of which 3 were all natural and he said those 3 had all shipped.. I posted photos of some other shots he sent but a Mod deleted them.. aside form the purple ones posted there was a tight quilt natural (almost looked birdseye) a blue quilt with natural binding, a red Diva, and a White Vixen.
> 
> Right now he seems to be just busting it to get these done to perfection as quickly as possible cause he feels really bad that everybody has been waiting since things slowed up when he let a few people go...tons of guitars in the background as you can see in a lot of the shots everybody posts including mine.



Cool, thanks. I really don't have an idea when my BFR will ship, but it was pretty standard (just added a neck pup) and I ordered within a few hours of him announcing the sale, so hopefully I'll be in one of these early shipments. Although I haven't received an email asking about final payment, so I'm not sure...


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Cool, thanks. I really don't have an idea when my BFR will ship, but it was pretty standard (just added a neck pup) and I ordered within a few hours of him announcing the sale, so hopefully I'll be in one of these early shipments. Although I haven't received an email asking about final payment, so I'm not sure...


Well the one 7 I posted was a flamed top slimline and he said somebody just had the neck pickup added to it but I think it was being stained purple too... If you haven' got anything on final payment then it's prob still in shop or maybe it's one that had a mishap in shop.... did you email him or john and ask what's up? John's been answering everybody within hours so it shouldn't be hard to get some answer...especially now that he's really trying to get on the ball with everything.

The guy who owns #2 just joined and posted a NGD
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/st...ernie-rico-hesperian-black-friday-guitar.html


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Mtech do you by any chance know the body and neck material for #1?


----------



## MTech

NeoTheMaggot said:


> Mtech do you by any chance know the body and neck material for #1?


I'm pretty sure all 3 are mahogany, flamed maple tops with ebony boards and maple necks.
I'm trying to see if it's yours but he doesn't have them down on location they're filed under name so I guess if anybody hasn't heard from John/Bernie themselves and wants to know what's up with there shoot me a PM w/ your name I can prob get you a quick answer cause he's actually been really on the ball with me here.

He is having me send him a list of all the names of people who PM'd me that want to know a status update on their build and he's going to give me status updates for everybody tomorrow when he's in the shop.


----------



## eaeolian

Watch it, MTech. Publicly disputing mod decisions *should* get you some time off. Next time PM us.


----------



## MTech

eaeolian said:


> Watch it, MTech. Publicly disputing mod decisions *should* get you some time off. Next time PM us.


I did PM first.. it was a mistake as he apparently didn't think the BFR run was on all body styles for some reason. So I've just been re-posting the shots of specific guitars people are asking about or that messaged me cause we figured out it's their order. (rather then putting up a ton of photos)


----------



## Larrikin666

I got an email and picture from Bernie today saying my guitar shipped out yesterday afternoon.


----------



## geofreesun

i still got no response from bernie... i believe mine is already shipped but i don't have it yet....i would really appreciate a tracking number


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> I got an email and picture from Bernie today saying my guitar shipped out yesterday afternoon.



That's one've the 3 I posted... Here's a better pic.


----------



## JPMike

MTech, you're working with Bernie? Since you get quite a lot of pics, going on!


----------



## MTech

JPMike said:


> MTech, you're working with Bernie? Since you get quite a lot of pics, going on!



No, I've known him for quite some time now and helped him out A LOT with ideas/shapes/features when he was first starting but had low sales. It wasn't uncommon for us to end up talking probably close to 20x a day. Now a lot of the ideas are being used and some are even his best sellers from what i can tell. I've been waiting forever on my remake as you all know now and my rant was kind've a wake-up call that got him on track and he's really trying to set things straight there and get this BFR sale complete. He's just trying to keep it simple so he isn't caught up talking to everyone which takes away from time to work/complete these guitars. He's pretty much back to his normal 3-4month turn around time which means these guitars are really gonna start shipping out now.


Speaking of for all the complaining about taking so long and wanting to know what's up I don't even have 10 names of people who want a status on their guitars..... IDK if some people didn't see my post since it's now on the page before this or what?? Anyway, if you want the status on your guitar I will have it TODAY if you PM me your name so I can put it on the list for Bernie to check, I'm gonna send it in sometime this afternoon.


*I Have 15 People For The List So Far* - 1:42PM


----------



## Khoi

again - thank you again for doing this! 

Glad to see everything is getting straightened out, this has definitely been a relief to long-waiters like me!


----------



## Hollowway

Thanks MTech! Looking forward to an update. I really appreciate your help.


----------



## MTech

Well I haven't got any new people added on in awhile here... I'm waiting for him to finish in the shop to tell me to send him over the list but I told him I have 15+ so far...


On a side note he's apparently working on my 7 now and just sent me a photo of the first step of the hand rubbed stain process and I think I just came


----------



## warhead78

Nice!


----------



## MTech

I haven't heard from anybody in awhile with exception of somebody just now so I put together the list and sent it in for now that way I'm not stuck having to be at home to send the list if he tells me to send it when I'm out eating dinner or something.


LIST IS IN 18 PEOPLE 


He said he's finishing dinner then going in to the shop and getting on this.

6:45PM West Coat - He's eating dinner then going in to the shop to get on this.


----------



## MTech

All updates have been PM'd out..... 
Nobody's even jumped in on here to say anything??

Some shipped, others were in final assembly, others in dry room, some in wood shop, and a couple were being rebuilt because of messed up spec (scale/radius) or something not up to his expectations (top/neck etc.)


----------



## toiletstand

mines "just about out of wood shop."

i was one of the later orders. thanks again mtech!


----------



## Hollowway

Mine's in the drying room. I'm guessing that means it's been oiled (that's the finish I chose) and is awaiting pickups and hardware. Not sure how long that's going to take, but there's a decent possibility I'll have a double NGD with the BFR and my custom showing up on the same day. How weird would that be?


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

If there was a gentlemen and scholar award on this forum it would go to MTech.


----------



## EOT

Mines in the drying room. MTech, you're awesome!


----------



## Emperoff

Mine is being rebuilt due to wrong scale and radius... Guess I won't see any progress pic anytime soon 

Thanks to Mtech for being so awesome anyway!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Mine is "ready for assembly" , thanks MTech !!!


----------



## Invader

My 627 is ready for final top coat/final clear finish. My 727 however had to be rebuilt. Apparently Bernie wasn't happy with the first build.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Had to be rebuilt, Bernie wasnt happy with the top. Oh well, i have a Strictly 7+1 that should be finished any day and need to pay for that one first, so it's prolly best that i dont get hit with both at the same time (bright siiiiiiiiide ).

and MTech...repped. thanks so much dude, thats hella cool of you


----------



## Rap Hat

MTech, just want to chime in that you rock for doing this! Mine is ready for assembly, so it's looking like I may get it sooner than expected. Bernie did have a question about payment, but I was able to clear that up with him this morning (note: I sent him a message at 7:00 am here, which would be around 4am in Cali, and he responded almost instantly. I'm thoroughly impressed!)


----------



## AvantGuardian

Apparently mine is being rebuilt due to a twist in the neck. Bummer. Oh well, patience. Thanks again for checking on it MTech.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

My guitar has shipped. Thanks again Mtech for all your help it's greatly appreciated


----------



## Isan

Ready for final assembly

Edit:final payment requested (was the wrong amount, but that will be fixed and I shall pay )


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> All updates have been PM'd out.....
> Nobody's even jumped in on here to say anything??
> 
> Some shipped, others were in final assembly, others in dry room, some in wood shop, and a couple were being rebuilt because of messed up spec (scale/radius) or something not up to his expectations (top/neck etc.)



Sent you a PM, sir.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Fed ex just dropped off a nice sized box


----------



## MTech

NeoTheMaggot said:


> Fed ex just dropped off a nice sized box



Told you it shipped 



I could put this in gear thread I guess but I want to aim it at you guys since we're all getting Rico's.... Wanted to see why a lot of you are getting CL/LF's instead of D-Activators? Reason I asked is I'm not throwing all the money down on BKP's, at least right now, and after asking a few artists I even had a BKP artist say the D Activators were the closest to the BKP's as that's what they used before BKP's and the CL/LF were too muffled/muddy sounding...


----------



## mikernaut

NeoTheMaggot said:


> Fed ex just dropped off a nice sized box



I eagerly await your "NGD" thread


----------



## geofreesun

mine will be here in like 24 hours ^.^ o man, love this feeling


----------



## kmanick

I can't wait to see all these new NGD threads


----------



## Isan

rico just got paid


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> Told you it shipped
> 
> 
> 
> I could put this in gear thread I guess but I want to aim it at you guys since we're all getting Rico's.... Wanted to see why a lot of you are getting CL/LF's instead of D-Activators? Reason I asked is I'm not throwing all the money down on BKP's, at least right now, and after asking a few artists I even had a BKP artist say the D Activators were the closest to the BKP's as that's what they used before BKP's and the CL/LF were too muffled/muddy sounding...



I kicked myself immediately for not changing the pickups when I ordered. I really don't vibe well with the CL/LF. At the time when putting my order in, I was worried about everyone and their mother customizing their guitars. I figured Bernie would get pissed off about that, so I didn't bother. I can always change pickups myself.


----------



## AvantGuardian

MTech said:


> I could put this in gear thread I guess but I want to aim it at you guys since we're all getting Rico's.... Wanted to see why a lot of you are getting CL/LF's instead of D-Activators? Reason I asked is I'm not throwing all the money down on BKP's, at least right now, and after asking a few artists I even had a BKP artist say the D Activators were the closest to the BKP's as that's what they used before BKP's and the CL/LF were too muffled/muddy sounding...



I requested D-Sonic/Air Norton I believe. I think I'm one of the few who prefer the D-Sonic over the Crunch Lab. Having owned both, I prefer the slightly lower output of the D-Sonic. I think it actually keeps things a little tighter, plus it doesn't push my amp into overdrive too early on the clean stuff. Never tried D-Activators though. Someday...


----------



## MTech

Changing pickups isn't such a big deal so if you haven't had yours shipped just ask him to switch them...

In fact I just mentioned this to him and told him what my one BKP artist said about the DA's being closest thing to them and he was like "Fuck if I knew that I'd of ordered a ton of DA's!" hahaha I told him he should make sure to check with some of these people before wiring up the original ordered pickups because multiple people have now said they wished they got DA's instead of the CL/LF they ordered.


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> Changing pickups isn't such a big deal so if you haven't had yours shipped just ask him to switch them...



I would love to get mine switched to Deactivators but he doesn't return emails.

Did you get my PM I sent yesterday?


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> I would love to get mine switched to Deactivators but he doesn't return emails.
> 
> Did you get my PM I sent yesterday?



Yes, he's gonna give me the status updates today and people keep randomly emailing me because they didn't pay attention to me asking for names for 2 days straight. I'm sending in the 2nd list now and it's another 7 people and I noted that you emailed and haven't heard back that you'd like DA's in your build now. 

Also he said if you guys are emailing to make sure you email the[FONT=&quot] [email protected][/FONT] email or call 760-956-6619 as there was an old email he had up that isn't active/has been lagging.


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> Yes, he's gonna give me the status updates today and people keep randomly emailing me because they didn't pay attention to me asking for names for 2 days straight. I'm sending in the 2nd list now and it's another 7 people and I noted that you emailed and haven't heard back that you'd like DA's in your build now.
> 
> Also he said if you guys are emailing to make sure you email the[FONT=&quot] [email protected][/FONT] email or call 760-956-6619 as there was an old email he had up that isn't active/has been lagging.



Cool. I am currently on tour in Europe so it is hard to call him but I will try that email address. I had been corresponding with him with a different email address and did not know he changed. His communication has been abysmal.


----------



## MTech

I just fired out the status for the last list so everybody is up to date (Please stop w/ the random messages, the whole point of doing a list was so it wasn't mass chaos and it actually had order to it)... I had so many random conversations and things coming in it got confusing so if anybody messaged me for the list and didn't hear back please shoot me a message with your name saying so and I'll get you your status ASAP but I'm pretty sure I PM'd everybody on the list.




*MOD EDIT: Throw it in the Dealer section. 
*


----------



## kruneh

Update for me: In paint. Getting ready for final clear fininsh. Then into the drying room.

Can´t wait to see how the colour turns out!

And major thanks to MTech


----------



## MTech

Posting this so it's bold and clear because people still keep PMing me.

Bernie said if you guys are emailing to make sure you email the[FONT=&quot] [email protected][/FONT] email or call 760-956-6619 as there was an old email he had up that isn't active/has been lagging.




*MOD EDIT: Try posting a link to that again and you're getting a nap. It has it's place, and now it has its own thread.*


----------



## killertone

I still have no idea when mine is coming even though I placed my order very early on, on the 24th of November 2010. 

Calling him today.


----------



## thrsher

i ordered mine on the 23rd and mine is ready for final clear coat if that helps


----------



## killertone

thrsher said:


> i ordered mine on the 23rd and mine is ready for final clear coat if that helps



Cool. For whatever reason, finding out about mine is proving to be damn near impossible. I sent the info to MTech and he didn't get any update from BRJ. I have emailed him directly to all known email addresses and have not received a reply to any of them. Phone call is next.


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> Cool. For whatever reason, finding out about mine is proving to be damn near impossible. I sent the info to MTech and he didn't get any update from BRJ.


^ this simply isn't true. You asked to switch pickups which I got confirmed. You then asked for an ETD which NOBODY got... I told you I would get your build status but it's the weekend you need to wait till he's back in.... I even pm'd you for your name and number to have him call you just like I did for the 727 UPS dropped and you have yet to reply.
Your guitar is ready for final assembly but waiting for the pickups you requested to have changed SATURDAY as they had to be special ordered.

*It's 3:15PM and I still haven't got any reply from killertone.*


Speaking of


MaxOfMetal said:


> If an Ibanez, ESP, or Jackson arrived with these flaws people would be out for blood.


Funny you mention that cause I also got PM'd some great examples....
" At last years NAMM they sold a beautiful 7 string soloist to Piney hills, and someone here bought it and had to return it because it was unplayable as the neck angle was way off. Or how about zimbloths KXK that was also a fucking disaster that was unplayable."


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> ^ this simply isn't true. You asked to switch pickups which I got confirmed. You then asked for an ETD which NOBODY got... I told you I would get your build status but it's the weekend you need to wait till he's back in.... I even pm'd you for your name and number to have him call you just like I did for the 727 UPS dropped and you have yet to reply.
> Your guitar is ready for final assembly but waiting for the pickups you requested to have changed SATURDAY as they had to be special ordered.
> 
> *It's 3:15PM and I still haven't got any reply from killertone.*


Dude, you need to calm down in a huge way. I have done nothing wrong at all. I have tried multiple times to contact Bernie and have had no reply. That is a fact. Your status "update" to me was only that you had communicated the pickup change to Bernie. Nothing else. No info about where my guitar was in production until you edited the post above. Understand that I see posts from others that you have helped and they got much more information about where their guitars were in production. It is reasonable for me, at that point, to not understand why I can't figure out what the deal with my guitar is. 

You made it sound like the pickup change was a simple thing in your earlier post. Don't act like all of a sudden I made some outlandish demand when you yourself said it was an easy thing to request and that you were surprised that no one had done it. That sounded like he had them in stock and would not be a big deal. Not my fault again.

Btw, I wasn't even that pissed off about Bernie's lack of communication with me, just a bit miffed. My posts are not scathing or out of line in any way. 

Thanks for any help you have given me so far. I'll take it from here.


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> I have tried multiple times to contact Bernie and have had no reply. That is a fact. Your status "update" to me was only that you had communicated the pickup change to Bernie. Nothing else. No info about where my guitar was in production until you edited the post above.
> 
> You made it sound like the pickup change was a simple thing in your earlier post.
> 
> Thanks for any help you have given me so far. I'll take it from here.



You messaged me on Saturday asking for an ETD and I said it's the weekend so I won't be able to get you a status from him till he's back in..all he sent me initially about yours was the pickup change was noted...and I told you that as soon as I heard back on the list.

The pickup change is easy thing to do.. People were saying they thought it would be a big pain as if they couldn't change their order etc.. so they were just leaving them as is instead of asking and then getting stuck with pickups they don't really want.. I said all you have to do it put in what pickups you want for sure... you asked they be changed and I let him know.

You are right int he fact it's going to take time, I didn't know he didn't have them in right now as he just told me today that he'd mass ordered CL/LF's for the BFR run as they are what he's doing standard on the BFR's because it was made out to him those pickups were "THE HOT THING" so he stocked up on loads of them.


----------



## eaeolian

MTech, you need to chill out. I don't care what you say about any guitar companies, but personal attacks on the users won't be tolerated. K?


----------



## thrsher

just call bernie. Mtech took on a huge burden by trying to help everyone and we shouldn't be attacking him/ bernie is trying to making himself available. its been a disaster but he is trying to get it in order. i spoke with him today about my build, and he is trying to accommodate everyone. guitars are shipping, guitars are being built, so we know our builds will eventually come.


----------



## MTech

eaeolian said:


> personal attacks on the users won't be tolerated. K?



Not attacking anybody I'm pointing out the facts. Anybody that messaged to be on the list knew they had to wait till he was in the shop which ment the people who didn't email when they were supposed to got put on a second list that I couldn't get back to until he was back in today.... So not giving the appropriate time needed to even get the information and painting it out like something isn't in the works is pretty uncalled for. 



thrsher said:


> just call bernie. Mtech took on a huge burden by trying to help everyone and we shouldn't be attacking him/ bernie is trying to making himself available. its been a disaster but he is trying to get it in order. i spoke with him today about my build, and he is trying to accommodate everyone. guitars are shipping, guitars are being built, so we know our builds will eventually come.



Exactly, Thrasher knows cause I wrote him and Killer while I was on the treadmill at the gym for crying out loud.


----------



## eaeolian

That wasn't the part of the post I was referring to, or removed. Just chill out. K?


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Everyone just man-hug and lets move on . MTech, people suck on the internet, but the vast majority of us REALLY appreciate what you're doing, even if the other 5% can't figure out how to properly show gratitude. Thanks bro.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

thrsher said:


> Mtech took on a huge burden by trying to help everyone



Indeed he did. I actually got hate-mail when I tried to help. I threw in the towel on that whole idea. 

Really cool of you Mtech, a lot of people appreciate what you're doing.


----------



## MTech

glassmoon0fo said:


> MTech, people suck on the internet, but the vast majority of us REALLY appreciate what you're doing, even if the other 5% can't figure out how to properly show gratitude. Thanks bro.





DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Indeed he did. I actually got hate-mail when I tried to help. I threw in the towel on that whole idea.
> 
> Really cool of you Mtech, a lot of people appreciate what you're doing.


I know, I wish I could sit some people by me to see half the shit I do/have done cause it'd blow a lot of peoples minds and take care of general clueless haters.

That and it's aggravating when everybody saw my post, if anyone has reason to bitch at Bernie it's me more than anybody....and my post is what lit a fire under his ass that he's really getting on the ball here.... but yet people have the nerve to neg rep me and call me his errand boy? I've been waiting since 2007 for my guitar so don't sit there and call me Biased etc.


----------



## eaeolian

I'm sure most appreciate the info updates - the negative side is always the most vocal. Regardless, let's move back to those instead of bitching about the state of affairs.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> but yet people have the nerve to neg rep me and call me his errand boy?



Seriously? That's just plain weird. I think we all appreciate what you're doing. A lot of pent up frustration with people not being able to communicate, so when you or Keith offer to be a conduit you end up opening a bit of a flood gate. Anyway, I was crying in my own beer until I heard how long you've been waiting for yours, so I appreciate your wanting to be part of the solution. 

Not to be a arm chair quarterback here, but it sounds like the #1 issue is thatt people have been irritated about the lack of communication for the past year or more, so I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't be easier to just hire a high schooler to come in for 5 hrs a week to answer emails. Maybe just print the emails, have BRJ disposition them, and then deal with the ones that are just updates. I probably shouldn't be offering suggestions to something I know absolutely nothing about, but I'm a male, so I see a problem and start thinking of a solution.


----------



## MTech

No you're right, but in me posting what he asked me to about his whole "special BFR status number etc" I some how turned into that person. It's fine because I waiting longer than everybody know how people feel so I feel pretty good being able to get everybody together and organize names to get them some idea of what's really going on with their guitar now that the wheels are really turning over at the Rico shop.... It's just aggravating when people try to bash or turn around and give me neg rep for doing so (hence errand boy comment) Bernie doesn't wish to come on here anymore because of how the mods seem bias to the point people say things to him and have even PM'd me..and as some have pointed out one of them even works for KxK, so I can understand him there... I'm kind of stuck in the middle there cause at the same time I talk to a couple of the mods here and there and to me they just carry a strong opinion on what they like best...and I know I do the same thing..but I like to at least check everything out and get a good grasp on the facts vs hearsay where as most of the people who try and trash Bernie, and some who praise his work, have never even played one.

The 727 people jumped on about it being "obviously sent like that" and the "proof" being "it's cracked under the finish but the finish is fine" apparently they don't know what an oil finish is.  It's pretty obvious the guitar was slammed down on the butt end by UPS, just as I've had happen to my friends Carvin, and I know somebody else had a V shipped t\where the box was fine just like the 727, but it was slammed down so hard the entire one wing broke. It's not hard to see how a guy carrying a 30lb box can pull it off the shelf, tip it length wise up, and drop it straight down on the bottom side.

Regardless, the fact is that Bernie is back on track here and it's looking like 2-4month wait times on new orders. This is great for new orders of course, but the key thing for BFR's is that they've started shipping and more NGD's are going to be coming quickly. He has John answering emails in the info email, and apparently whoever was checking the other email wasn't doing there job which he didn't know until some of you emailed me and I asked where you were emailing to get no response...so to those few Bernie says thanks as he was unaware the emails were being overlooked. He's asked any customers that have questions to please email the info email or call the number which I already posted on here.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, I know he probably doesn't like the criticism, but every luthier has his fans and detractors. I think the mods are definitely critical of him, but I don't think they're really giving a pass to any other luthier either. I happen to like Jim from Strictly 7 a lot, but he gets hammered pretty hard on here as well. Still, I'm on some other forums, specifically computers, and people have way higher standards for that sort of thing than for custom guitars. There's an issue with Macbook Airs taking 4-5 seconds to wake from sleep with Lion installed, instead of the 2 seconds with Snow Leopard, and people are out for BLOOD! 
Never the less, Bernie knows that his guitars are way behind schedule, and has been pretty quiet up until you got him to speak up, so a lot of the hypotheses on here were to be expected. We even had that disgruntled web designer state that he was soon to be out of business. Given what happened with everyone from Brutalizer Guitars to Emperion, I really started to worry that maybe I would never see my guitars. 

So anyway, I personally think it would do way more good for him to take a few minutes to periodically post on here just to state what is going on, and let people as him questions. Seems like whenever there is an argument on here the luthier disappears or bans himself, a la Huf, Sherman, etc. In fact, I'm going to make that Andy's #1 Rule of Luthiery - Communicate, communicate, communicate!


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah the communication is pretty much the biggest reason I went with Vik.


----------



## MTech

I saw that web designer posts but I'm not sure which guy it was cause the initial site was terrible...he got a slightly better one..and then somebody else he met promised to build him a site, failed miserably, and was trying to trash talk to make himself look better. I think his site now looks better then the original but it could be a lot better, but that's the least of my worries...right now I'd just like to see guitars start shipping so all of us (myself included) can get out guitars and hopefully really make some people realize that though waiting sucks it was worth it.

People acting like that are why builders and artists leave forums etc... too many people arguing over how they think things work etc but really they have no clue.



Stealthtastic said:


> Yeah the communication is pretty much the biggest reason I went with Vik.


When he called me about my post I went off about this and he realized how bad it got... I pointed out his big perk initially was how people could talk to the owner/builder of their custom handbuilt guitar...and I think it really served as a wake up call.. he feels terrible but at the same time he knows if he talks to everybody it's going to eat all the time finishing orders so now he's got the emails on track, I got you all to shoot me names which let me make a list and get it organized/easy for him to send status to everybody..and once he's caught up here I'm fairly confident it'll be like it was back in the beginning where things weren't so chaotic.


----------



## mikernaut

There needs to be a big SS.org convention so everyone can bring out their KxKs, BRJ's, BlackMachines, Decibels, Thorns, Daemonesses, Shermans, Strictly 7's, etc . and people can try them all out.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Organize one! We put one together here in Vancouver and there was tons of great gear


----------



## MTech

mikernaut said:


> There needs to be a big SS.org convention so everyone can bring out their KxKs, BRJ's, BlackMachines, Decibels, Thorns, Daemonesses, Shermans, Strictly 7's, etc . and people can try them all out.



It's called NAMM

I know not all these guys are there, I hope more of them start coming..I remember the 1st KxK I played and I LOVED the neck..it felt EXACTLY like Rusty's actual Dean (profile wise).


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> It's called NAMM
> 
> I know not all these guys are there, I hope more of them start coming..I remember the 1st KxK I played and I LOVED the neck..it felt EXACTLY like Rusty's actual Dean (profile wise).



One day I totally gotta get there. But don't you need to hook up with someone with a business or something? My friend a couple of years ago made a web site guitar store just to get into NAMM. He never even stocked anything.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah it used to be just anybody but now you need something.


----------



## MTech

Stealthtastic said:


> Yeah it used to be just anybody but now you need something.



When was that?? The whole point has been it's for dealers/buyers/sellers/artists and not to have the public running around like kids in disney land 

Last year they let a lot of public in and it was chaos, made some of the after parties suck too.


I know Bernie is going this year from what he said but IDK if he's gonna have a booth or just going....

Also on topic my guitar is apparently around 3 weeks out of being finished


----------



## killertone

I absolutely appreciate any help I have had with this. There is no question about that and I have thanked MTech in a post and a PM previously. I have only ever stated facts about what I am dealing with; never conjecture or fallacy. I also think all of my posts have been extremely level headed and professional regarding my particular situation. 

I am handling this 100% on my own now.


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech, can you possibly suggest to Bernie that he include tracking numbers when he lets someone know their guitar has shipped? It would make it easier to plan for having someone home to sign for it when it comes.


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> I absolutely appreciate any help I have had with this. There is no question about that and I have thanked MTech in a post and a PM previously.
> 
> I am handling this 100% on my own now.



Well Bernie said he was emailing you last night and wanted to call but I couldn't get a number from you..I told him you're obviously traveling but he still wanted to call.



Larrikin666 said:


> MTech, can you possibly suggest to Bernie that he include tracking numbers when he lets someone know their guitar has shipped? It would make it easier to plan for having someone home to sign for it when it comes.



I've said that since day one.
Did yours show up and you weren't there or?

Just got another update on mine..


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> I've said that since day one.
> Did yours show up and you weren't there or?



It hasn't shown up at all yet. Bernie said it shipped out last Tuesday. It's usually a 3 or 4 day ETA from CA to PA. I have no idea whether he required a signature or not for delivery. If he did, then a delivery hasn't been attempted yet because I don't have any notes from Fedex. I normally don't have anyone home to sign for things during the day, so I either need to know the exact day it is supposed to arrive or I'm stuck waiting until the delivery attempt is failed so I can go pick it up.


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> It hasn't shown up at all yet. Bernie said it shipped out last Tuesday. It's usually a 3 or 4 day ETA from CA to PA. I have no idea whether he required a signature or not for delivery. If he did, then a delivery hasn't been attempted yet because I don't have any notes from Fedex. I normally don't have anyone home to sign for things during the day, so I either need to know the exact day it is supposed to arrive or I'm stuck waiting until the delivery attempt is failed so I can go pick it up.



CA-PA takes 6 business days...
I'm seeing what's up.


----------



## MetalDaze

MTech said:


> Did yours show up and you weren't there or?
> 
> Just got another update on mine..


 

Nice... are you going trans blue on the back too?


----------



## MTech

MetalDaze said:


> Nice... are you going trans blue on the back too?


No and it's not "technically" trans blue.. I wanted that darker look like on Jeff Kendricks Custom ESP Eclipse or the Kiko Model so if you saw my earlier post it was actually stained black first and then gone over with the blue, it's going to look insane.


----------



## killertone

Just spoke to Bernie on the phone. I am currently on tour in Germany and he called and talked to me out here. I really appreciate that. 

I have the info I need on my guitar and am all set as far as that goes. 

Bernie was not aware that emails were not getting through to him and therefore did not know that people were not receiving replies. He just found this out last week. I feel confident, and you should too, that all is well.


----------



## Isan

he called me right before ya and yeah as you said all is well


----------



## Emperoff

Seems like things are finally getting better


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

Looking sexy Mtech( almost went with some very similar(I love blue guitars) but decided on natural instead


----------



## travis bickle

Many many thanks mtech!


----------



## Hollowway

MTech, you leaving the wood natural on the sides and back? Oiled? The orangy tone of mahogany contrasting with blue is one of the best looks, IMO. That's going to be killer.


----------



## MTech

NeoTheMaggot said:


> Looking sexy Mtech( almost went with some very similar(I love blue guitars) but decided on natural instead


I've wanted this particular blue (along with the faded blue jean PRS blue) for quite some time.... I was going to get natural cause I've wanted that too but since there seemed to be a plethora of all natural flamed top BFR's Bernie even wanted me to do something different. It's going to have some pretty sweet features when it's all said and done though. 



Hollowway said:


> MTech, you leaving the wood natural on the sides and back? Oiled? The orangy tone of mahogany contrasting with blue is one of the best looks, IMO. That's going to be killer.


Solid Black & Oiled Finish...only stain/clear will be on top the body & headstock. 
Bernie has been pretty ecstatic about how it's coming out so I can't even begin to explain how stoked I am.


----------



## EOT

EOT said:


> Mines in the drying room. MTech, you're awesome!


I talked to Bernie today. I guess my BF guitar had to be rebuilt due to an issue with the fretboard. The one in the drying room is a different build.

On another note, he is a super nice guy to talk to. And I do believe he is trying his best to get these things out, and to make all of us happy. This whole thing kinda turned into a mess, but I think it'll work out in the end. 

And thanks again to MTech for all his help in getting things moving again


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

has no one else gotten their guitars yet?


----------



## MTech

NeoTheMaggot said:


> has no one else gotten their guitars yet?


Gotta remember not everybody is off this board... I know Larrikin's one like yours is coming tomorrow.... he told me it'll be around 3 weeks for mine to be finished.


----------



## Isan

mine will be about two weeks out ... probably just ahead of mtech


----------



## Gor22don33

Thats nice! 
I plan to send him and other great builders Info / presskit of my band when we are finished recording our album in a professional studio. We will be shopping our music to labels, so I thought why not shop around for great endorsements as well! 

Congrats! I really like his guitars!


----------



## Valennic

Gor22don33 said:


> Thats nice!
> I plan to send him and other great builders Info / presskit of my band when we are finished recording our album in a professional studio. We will be shopping our music to labels, so I thought why not shop around for great endorsements as well!
> 
> Congrats! I really like his guitars!



I really hope you're not trying to score free things out of this. Even his endorsees pay full price for his guitars, and I don't know of any builder who has the time, patience, or extra money to build miscellaneous bands free guitars. 

But if you own their guitars already, that's not a problem.


----------



## Larrikin666

F my life. Just went to FedEx to pick up my guitar. My guitar I order was a Hesperian 727 with the CL/LF pickups. I got a Hesperian 827 with what looks to be D-activators.


----------



## thrsher

^ brutal


----------



## geofreesun

Larrikin666 said:


> F my life. Just went to FedEx to pick up my guitar. My guitar I order was a Hesperian 727 with the CL/LF pickups. I got a Hesperian 827 with what looks to be D-activators.


ouch that means your guitar is probably sent to someone else? but whatever the case, can we have some pix


----------



## thrsher

you know what...on bernies facbook, someone posted an 828 picture that he got saying his build was done that lives in PA as well and he might have your 7. if they got mxed up.


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> F my life. Just went to FedEx to pick up my guitar. My guitar I order was a Hesperian 727 with the CL/LF pickups. I got a Hesperian 827 with what looks to be D-activators.



So how's it play? 

Bernie just texted me to see what's going on cause he's at the dentist with his kid and somebody apparently hit him up saying somebody got a wrong guitar.
He sent both the same day and the cases apparently got switched so he knows where yours went..check your PM's. 

OH FWIW those are BKP's not DA's so see what you think 

Also Janne can you please PM me, I cleared my box out so I don't know which name is you on here and he just sent me photos of your guitar for you...


----------



## eaeolian

Larrikin666 said:


> F my life. Just went to FedEx to pick up my guitar. My guitar I order was a Hesperian 727 with the CL/LF pickups. I got a Hesperian 827 with what looks to be D-activators.



Bonus String!


----------



## Larrikin666

thrsher said:


> you know what...on bernies facbook, someone posted an 828 picture that he got saying his build was done that lives in PA as well and he might have your 7. if they got mxed up.



That post from 10/19 is me. That's the picture he sent before he shipped out the guitar. Is that what you're talking about?


----------



## thrsher

yup, i fail...sorry dude...thought that was an 8


----------



## Larrikin666

eaeolian said:


> Bonus String!



LOL. I can barely had playing on 7 strings with my short fingers. 8 would kill me.


----------



## mikernaut

Umm wow... this is getting downright silly.


----------



## IB-studjent-

Larrikin666 said:


> LOL. I can barely had playing on 7 strings with my short fingers. 8 would kill me.


Did you by any chance get a natural blackburst hesperian 8 ?


----------



## MTech

IB-studjent- said:


> Did you by any chance get a natural blackburst hesperian 8 ?


He got Jesse's Guitar & Vice Versa...


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> He got Jessie's Guitar & Vice Versa...



Yup. Everything is cool. I talked to Bernie. He was great. He apologized infinitely for the screw up and took full responsibility. I'm not upset at all. He's paying for all the shipping. Jesse also seems happy. When you're shipping that many guitars out at once, you're bound to throw a wrong label on.


----------



## geofreesun

i am just waiting for pic updates. online. don't keep us waiting


----------



## mikernaut

heh, you could totally do a NGD in the Extended Forum now


----------



## geofreesun

mikernaut said:


> heh, you could totally do a NGD in the Extended Forum now



ya that's what i thought. on a second thought, maybe the true owner should have a say here, he doesn't want to get scooped ~


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> He's paying for all the shipping. Jesse also seems happy. When you're shipping that many guitars out at once, you're bound to throw a wrong label on.



Put a note in the case for jesse to get on SS.org and post a NGD if he's not a member already.




geofreesun said:


> i am just waiting for pic updates. online. don't keep us waiting



I have photos of one of Janne's 2 BFR's but I wasn't gonna post if he didn't want them posted and he still hasn't PM'd me for them and i forget which SN is his on here cause i cleared my box after sending people their status.


Also I just texted Bernie to quit sitting at the Doctors Office playing the Where's Waldo Books to get back to the shop and finish out guitars..and make sure he ships mine to me.


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> Put a note in the case for jesse to get on SS.org and post a NGD if he's not a member already.



I talked to Jesse. He's been a member for a long time, but he's never posted. He got the bone stock 827 with Bareknuckle Painkillers. He and I both did a visual inspection on the guitars to make sure everything was cool. The 827 is beautiful. None of the top splitting that come up on the 727 another user posted. I'll be sure to post mine up when it gets here.


----------



## Invader

MTech said:


> Also Janne can you please PM me, I cleared my box out so I don't know which name is you on here and he just sent me photos of your guitar for you...



PM sent!


----------



## killertone

I am waiting on progress pics as well...


----------



## Invader

Tiny pics are tiny.


----------



## toiletstand

love it!


----------



## Invader

Funny thing is, I changed the color to swamp green a while back, but I've since second guessed my decision to the point where I kind of regretted it. I think I like the faded denim better after all.


----------



## Khoi

love the faded denim!


----------



## toiletstand

Invader said:


> Funny thing is, I changed the color to swamp green a while back, but I've since second guessed my decision to the point where I kind of regretted it. I think I like the faded denim better after all.


 its an amazing finish dude.


----------



## MTech

Invader said:


> I think I like the faded denim better after all.


The flame on your headstock really shows it just like on mine in this progress photos.. I can't wait till it's finished being stained/cleared. If he can nail the PRS Style Faded Blue Jean then I wanna get one down the road that looks like this....









*mod edit: final warning, you post one more "available" guitar outside of the Dealers section and you're getting a nap... and don't delete the warning this time*


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

I'm a very very happy man right now.


----------



## SpaceDock

MTech said:


> Bernie just sent this over, BFR w/ a few more BFR's in background!
> (Invader I picked yours out right away on the back of the rack)



Mine should have the same finish but quilted, two hum, Floyd, 627. Let me know if you see it.


----------



## ras1988

So what's going on in this thread guys?  Just picked up the spot for the guitar that was up on the dealer's section. It is quite exciting. Talked to Bernie at length about the build and was just awesome he is adding a route which is why I was on the fence about buying the guitar. He is really a stand up guy and even wants to keep a total albatross like me who joined in at the very end of the build to be totally happy with the final product. NGDs incoming gentlemen.


----------



## kruneh

Oh yes, that reddish one in the back, that´s mine 
Now, this made my day


----------



## thrsher

this blackburst was my build, hope whoever picked it up enjoys it.


----------



## Invader

MTech said:


> Bernie just sent this over, BFR w/ a few more BFR's in background!
> (Invader I picked yours out right away on the back of the rack)



Was this post deleted? Can't see it.

edit:
never mind, found it in the dealers section.


----------



## ras1988

thrsher said:


> this blackburst was my build, hope whoever picked it up enjoys it.



I picked this one up, we had talked earlier when you had it up for sale in the forum (emailed you earlier this week in fact). Jumped on it the second it came up on the dealer section. Funny how things work out.


----------



## eaeolian

thrsher said:


> this blackburst was my build, hope whoever picked it up enjoys it.



That's actually really nice, although it reminds me more of a Tobacco Sunburst than a Blackburst.


----------



## mikernaut

Francesco that looks magnificent.  As does the blackburst/tobaccoburst


----------



## technomancer

Invader said:


> Tiny pics are tiny.



Tiny pics may be tiny but that is looking sweet


----------



## Emperoff

Damn, those new pictures are driving me nuts. Shame I can't have pics of mine yet


----------



## Larrikin666

I'm heading over to FedEx now to pick up MY 727. LOL


----------



## Isan

Christmas ... soon


----------



## Emperoff

Larrikin666 said:


> I'm heading over to FedEx now to pick up MY 727. LOL



Pics, NAO!


----------



## Invader

Anyone know what the upcharge is for an abalone headstock logo? I figured I'd ask here first, rather than emailing B straight away.


----------



## MTech

Invader said:


> Anyone know what the upcharge is for an abalone headstock logo? I figured I'd ask here first, rather than emailing B straight away.


$150


----------



## JPMike

I can't get enough of BRJs.

I got 3 being built and I am getting one more when my Axe FX will be sold, lol.


----------



## Larrikin666

Emperoff said:


> Pics, NAO!



Photobucket is blocked here at work. I'll throw up a NGD thread as soon as I'm home.


----------



## geofreesun

Larrikin666 said:


> Photobucket is blocked here at work. I'll throw up a NGD thread as soon as I'm home.


crack down that firewall!!!


----------



## Isan

upload to anywhere else
hahah


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Hide My Ass! Free Proxy and Privacy Tools - Surf The Web Anonymously


----------



## Larrikin666

Pics are posted

Gentlemen....start your boners


----------



## TomAwesome

I didn't deviate from the stock options, so mine should be done before too much longer, right? Soon.


----------



## Larrikin666

TomAwesome said:


> I didn't deviate from the stock options, so mine should be done before too much longer, right? Soon.



I wouldn't be able to say that for sure. Seems like the ones shipping out right now are the bone stock ones. That's the mindset I was in when I initially put my order in.


----------



## EOT

TomAwesome said:


> I didn't deviate from the stock options, so mine should be done before too much longer, right? Soon.





Dont hesitate to give him a call-(760) 956-6619
That's best way to find out.


----------



## WillDfx

Invader said:


> Tiny pics are tiny.



Oh yeah I totally regret selling this guitar(slot) to you now Janne! I spec'ed out one bitch'n guitar though that's for sure! I knew Bernie would make the Denim stain look fabulous.


----------



## Jexey

Been working a lot with B over the phone lately. I don't give a shit about all the drama or the wait really, doesn't stop me from really enjoying the products that he puts out. And like everyone else is saying, he's a blast to talk to and extremely amicable and comforting to work with in person

I want to share the progress pictures of my 8 string. I'm going to be one of the last to receive it I believe, as I'm pretty sure we're installing a Piezo on the beast. (Fuck-Yes.)

Like I mentioned earlier, natural finish. No fret markings. Kill pot. BKP Aftermaths. Czech it out. Should be epic.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Nice, I think it's still too cool you guys scored customs for under 1700 dollars. Quite literally the deal of the decade.


----------



## MTech

Stealthtastic said:


> Nice, I think it's still too cool you guys scored customs for under 1700 dollars. Quite literally the deal of the decade.



You're going off base pricing though remember... after all the customizations some people added they're still approaching $3k after it's all said and done.


----------



## MetalDaze

It just so happened that I was jonesing for a natural flame top guitar, so I'm one of those base pricers 

That's a whole lot of guitar for the base model.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

No words


----------



## EOT

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> No words



Is that an 8!?!?!?


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

EOT said:


> Is that an 8!?!?!?



it is!


----------



## EOT

Sweet!!!


----------



## Isan




----------



## kmanick

Isan said:


>


Wow 
What a cool looking quilt on this one


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

That's one of the most unique quilted tops I've ever seen Isan! Congratz


----------



## Isan

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> That's one of the most unique quilted tops I've ever seen Isan! Congratz



thnx


----------



## Hollowway

How are you guys getting these in progress pics? From Bernie directly?


----------



## killertone

Hollowway said:


> How are you guys getting these in progress pics? From Bernie directly?



I would like to know as well.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> How are you guys getting these in progress pics? From Bernie directly?



Bernie has been sending out some as well as having me shoot them over to people who message me....
Speaking of which......


----------



## thrsher

now thats a quilt


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

MTech said:


> Bernie has been sending out some as well as having me shoot them over to people who message me....
> Speaking of which......



SHIEEEEEIIIIEEEEE*********!!!!!


----------



## Rap Hat

Dayum! I hope to god the quilt on mine is anywhere near as good as that one. AFAIK mine should be done any day, I got the "ready for assembly" message about 2 weeks ago and I'm just waiting to get the final bill now. On that note how does it work? Do you just get an email with a link?


----------



## Larrikin666

Rap Hat said:


> Dayum! I hope to god the quilt on mine is anywhere near as good as that one. AFAIK mine should be done any day, I got the "ready for assembly" message about 2 weeks ago and I'm just waiting to get the final bill now. On that note how does it work? Do you just get an email with a link?



You're probably still a few weeks off. He'll send you an email when it's all done asking if you're ready to pay. If you say yes, he'll shoot over the payment link. The guitar will ship out shortly after.


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

The past 3 quilts have been stunning as hell and all completely different. congrats on those tops fella's!


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> Bernie has been sending out some as well as having me shoot them over to people who message me....
> Speaking of which......



Dude, is that mine?! Please, please God let it be...


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Dude, is that mine?! Please, please God let it be...


Possibly if yours is Oil finished like that one already is....


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> Possibly if yours is Oil finished like that one already is....



Hot DAMN! Seeing that quilt makes it worth waiting how ever long is necessary. Ho-lee cow!

EDIT: So whaddaya think - another couple of weeks? I'm drooling over here!


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> EDIT: So whaddaya think - another couple of weeks? I'm drooling over here!



I know the black one that just sold on the dealer page which is just as complete he said would be 4 weeks tops.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

MTech said:


> I know the black one which is just as complete he said would be 4 weeks tops.




which black one ? mine ?


----------



## killertone

That quilt is sick. Makes me want to see mine even more. Supposed to get some pics soon.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

That guitar looks like it's on fire. Awesome. Making me want my BRJ. NOW!


----------



## Rap Hat

Larrikin666 said:


> You're probably still a few weeks off. He'll send you an email when it's all done asking if you're ready to pay. If you say yes, he'll shoot over the payment link. The guitar will ship out shortly after.



Thanks for the explanation! Since this is my first custom I don't know the specifics of the process, and it's easier to ask you guys than bug Bernie.


----------



## Isan

no updates in 3 days ? son i am disappoint


----------



## Emperoff

Isan said:


> no updates in 3 days ? son i am disappoint



Yeah, someone bumped the thread pointlessy with absolutely no updates or useful info. I am disappoint too


----------



## killertone

Here is a teaser pic I just got from Bernie. This is my BFG, a non slant top Hesperian 7. Quilt looks ridiculous. Thanks for the pic, Bernie!


----------



## MTech

New Progress shot!





Also my neck is supposedly FINALLY coming out of woodshop this week.


----------



## geofreesun

^ the middle tuning peg hole is way too big lol turn off the light!


----------



## MetalDaze

Look at that wicked shape on the wall!


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> New Progress shot!


 
Wow, I've never seen anything like that! Is that yours? Great idea!


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Wow, I've never seen anything like that! Is that yours? Great idea!


Yep. He was surprising me on his idea for the finish on the back. He's still going over to make the bevels perfect, and the neck is still oiled.


----------



## JPMike

MetalDaze said:


> Look at that wicked shape on the wall!



Misfits' bassist's bass!!


----------



## IB-studjent-

ya, that's mine (top left corner)


----------



## Khoi

never seen a guitar like that, and it is ridiculously awesome. I'm extremely jealous now!


----------



## Invader

Finally got an update regarding my orders. The BFR 627 should be done in 4 weeks, and the BFR 727 in 60 days. I really hope there won't be more delays.


----------



## Hollowway

Invader said:


> Finally got an update regarding my orders. The BFR 627 should be done in 4 weeks, and the BFR 727 in 60 days. I really hope there won't be more delays.



So we're you one of the later orders? And any idea what stage your guitar is in now (woodshop, paint, drying, etc.)?


----------



## Invader

Hollowway said:


> So we're you one of the later orders? And any idea what stage your guitar is in now (woodshop, paint, drying, etc.)?



I ordered the 727 the day the sale started. According the sale thread, I was one of the first five. I however changed the headstock design in February, and that, according to B, pushed my build time back a bit further.

I've no idea about the stage the 727 is in ATM.

I purchased the 627 slot in June, I don't know when it was ordered originally. Funny that it seems I'll receive the 627 before the 727.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*From here on out this thread is only for BRJ customers involved in the Black Friday run, and the updates on those guitars only. 

Any updates of non-Black Friday, as well as any guitars for sale belong in their respective threads and sections. 

That is all. Best of luck. *


----------



## Khoi

Invader said:


> Finally got an update regarding my orders. The BFR 627 should be done in 4 weeks, and the BFR 727 in 60 days. I really hope there won't be more delays.




did you contact Bernie asking for an estimated date of completion? From all the times I've contacted him, he gave me an extremely vague estimate, and they were obviously completely off


----------



## Hollowway

Invader said:


> I ordered the 727 the day the sale started. According the sale thread, I was one of the first five. I however changed the headstock design in February, and that, according to B, pushed my build time back a bit further.


 Ah. I'm in the first 5 for the 8 strings. Just trying to get a feel for where mine might be in the process. From what I can tell mine is just ready for hardware/electronics, but I don't know what that translates to tiime wise.


----------



## Invader

Khoi said:


> did you contact Bernie asking for an estimated date of completion? From all the times I've contacted him, he gave me an extremely vague estimate, and they were obviously completely off



I've sent half a dozen emails in the past two months, and just got a response yesterday. He still didn't answer all my questions, but I'm happy I got at least some kind of response.

Can't wait to see how the 727 turns out. If Ed can pull off the colour, it should be jaw-dropping. If you like purple, that is.


----------



## MTech

Hey guys I'm back sorry if you couldn't reach me and needed to but I replied to all PM's..
Still talking to Bernie, my inlays showed up and are being done this week so I'm hoping to have it ship this week at least...

*MOD EDIT: You know who the mods are. Use the PM system. *


----------



## VILARIKA

Is there more information on my order besides "Almost Out Of Production"? ...or an estimate as to how long it will be till it will be shipped?


----------



## MTech

I didn't save peoples names I just kept the PM's till he hit me back with a response and then deleted the PM's after I messaged you guys back. I did this as a favor because as everybody saw with my rant I know the frustration with this more than anyone... but he didn't give ANYBODY a completion date. However to give you an idea, he's saying guitars that just need hardware/paint which are complete to the point they're like the stock guitars for sale, will take 2 months max.


----------



## VILARIKA

MTech said:


> I didn't save peoples names I just kept the PM's till he hit me back with a response and then deleted the PM's after I messaged you guys back. I did this as a favor because as everybody saw with my rant I know the frustration with this more than anyone... but he didn't give ANYBODY a completion date. However to give you an idea, he's saying guitars that just need hardware/paint which are complete to the point they're like the stock guitars for sale, will take 2 months max.



Thanks, an estimated max time is all I need to know.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

At this point, I'd just stop asking. been told quite a few things that just havn't come to pass, and since we've ALL been throwing questions Bernie's way, you cant really say the squaky wheel will get the grease. These things will be done eventually, but if a regular order can go 2 years before delivery, for ANY reason, I don't hold on to hopes of getting my BFR anytime soon.


----------



## Khoi

glassmoon0fo said:


> At this point, I'd just stop asking. been told quite a few things that just havn't come to pass, and since we've ALL been throwing questions Bernie's way, you cant really say the squaky wheel will get the grease. These things will be done eventually, but if a regular order can go 2 years before delivery, for ANY reason, I don't hold on to hopes of getting my BFR anytime soon.



that's pretty much been my approach to it now. I think I've gotten over the point of wanting it now, but when it's done, it's done. 

It just sucks having your money held up and making sure you DO have the money when your guitar rolls around. The thing I'm worried most about is not having the money set aside, and then all of a sudden, you're guitar is done and can't pay for it that moment


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> It just sucks having your money held up and making sure you DO have the money when your guitar rolls around. The thing I'm worried most about is not having the money set aside, and then all of a sudden, you're guitar is done and can't pay for it that moment



Nobody said you have to wait for it to be done, if you have the spare money laying around then just pay it off and then when it's done you don't have to worry about anything it'll be shipped....or at least if you're that worried about it then shoot Bernie a message saying so and asking if you can get some kind of idea when it'll be done.


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> Nobody said you have to wait for it to be done, if you have the spare money laying around then just pay it off and then when it's done you don't have to worry about anything it'll be shipped....or at least if you're that worried about it then shoot Bernie a message saying so and asking if you can get some kind of idea when it'll be done.



I had no idea I could do that, I think I might do then! I've just been waiting with the money sitting there and it's so tempting to spend it 

I'll shoot him a message about that then, thanks


----------



## Invader

Khoi said:


> I had no idea I could do that, I think I might do then! I've just been waiting with the money sitting there and it's so tempting to spend it
> 
> I'll shoot him a message about that then, thanks



I've requested a payment link for my 627 3 months ago on several emails and still haven't received one. I hope you'll have more luck than me.


----------



## geofreesun

i recall that bernie had some email problem and the CORRECT email address was posted some time ago. for a long time he was not receiving emails because the address was wrong. so that could be something to look into. but why not just give him a call? that's way better than email.



Invader said:


> I've requested a payment link for my 627 3 months ago on several emails and still haven't received one. I hope you'll have more luck than me.


----------



## Emperoff

I'd hold my money until I'm sure the guitar has been built with the corrects specs. Better safe than sorry.


----------



## MTech

Invader said:


> I've requested a payment link for my 627 3 months ago on several emails and still haven't received one. I hope you'll have more luck than me.



I just got you info on your guitar and thought you talked to him then..why didn't you mention that....

Got more news on mine..just figuring out knob placement options (hence white dots) I changed it from what's pictured and there's 1 too many dots on here.


----------



## Invader

MTech said:


> I just got you info on your guitar and thought you talked to him then..why didn't you mention that....



After Bernie sent me the pics of the 627, I immediately replied to him directly. Honestly, I didn't know I should've mentioned it to you. I didn't want to bother you with any more questions.


----------



## MTech

I meant say something to him... Strange he didn't say anything back/send one..though might've got flustered with the bunch of other people he had to get deposit links to for the stock guitars/BFR guitars that opened up. Can try and get on it monday and even PM me if you ant cause I have to talk to him for sure on Monday so I don't end up with controls recessed in the wrong spots.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech, do you know if these are shipping consistently, and not many of them are getting posted as NGDs, or are they going out in small batches? It seems like a few shipped, and then things got quiet again.


----------



## MTech

It's going to be both...plus people don't seem to realize the BFR Special wasn't just for this site, it was listed right on his page so it's not like everybody on here are the only people getting them..... keep in mind that the woodshop runs on a schedule pushing out XX guitars every cycle and once they go to Bernie he's constantly working on the finished, normal inlays, fretwork, neck shaping, electronics cavity, controls being recessed etc... Also I found out once your guitar gets to the stage mine is in above, the controls are recessed, stained to match, and then it's final cleared and put in the over/dry room for about a week.. Once it's out you're looking at final sand/buff and assembly.

Edit: 11-21 I talked to Bernie this afternoon and he was shipping a bunch of guitars out but he added he's got all his regular orders along with the BFR orders too so keep that in mind... Also got some more BFR photos but since they're near finished I'm leaving it to the actual owners to post the shots if they want (at least 1 is on here for sure)


----------



## killertone

Update on my BFR guitar: Bernie was not happy with how the mahogany wings were matched and sent me a pic. I wasn't thrilled about it either even though the quilt top was killer. He offered to do a rebuild and give me a free finish upgrade so I went for it. I have waited this long and I decided I should get exactly what I want and Bernie agreed. Bernie said he could have it out of the wood shop in 45 days so we shall see. Gonna call him when I get home form Europe next week.


----------



## Hollowway

Wow, that's awesome about the freebies. Can't help but feel a little jealous about not getting anything for my complete rebuild, but I guess he doesn't have a set "policy" on stuff like that, and just works on it on the fly.


----------



## toiletstand

finally been a year. hope to see more NGD threads soon


----------



## VILARIKA

toiletstand said:


> finally been a year. hope to see more NGD threads soon



Looks like a lot of people still have ways to go till they get their BRJ's


----------



## Rap Hat

VILARIKA said:


> Looks like a lot of people still have ways to go till they get their BRJ's



Yeah - my last update a month ago was "ready for assembly", which I thought meant all it needed was the hardware put on and strung up. But the latest pic I got from Bernie shows it still needs all the holes drilled, then it can have the hardware put on and strung up.

Honestly I'm a little disappointed, mainly because there's no baseline here. Someone else got the "ready for assembly" update, then the next day got a payment link and had it shipped out. There's no description of what all this stuff is, so no one knows what "ready for assembly" or "out of the woodshop" or "in the woodshop" means.

It's not that I'm expecting this to be ready right away; I get the reality of this situation, so I know it could be months. Just that when I get told it's ready for assembly, the only baseline I have is the guy who had his finished the next day. If I know it'll be a few more months, I don't have to rush to have the final payment ready.


----------



## MTech

Talked to Bernie, he's using those new Titanium Floyds now as well... talk about expensive hardware. 

Also New Update.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I'm guessing you only get the titanium if you requested it. I would be thrilled if my guitar showed up with one installed, lol.


----------



## MTech

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I'm guessing you only get the titanium if you requested it. I would be thrilled if my guitar showed up with one installed, lol.


Um.. yes you def need to request that extra! Also some how even if you got it for BFR I don't see the price of the trem being 50% off ...though with the deal on the guitar that would be a good idea.


----------



## JPMike

Slant top, reminds me one of the projects, Bernie is currently building for me.


----------



## Invader

MTech said:


>



Wow, I love that shade of blue.


----------



## MTech

Invader said:


> Wow, I love that shade of blue.



Thanks!!
I sent him a photo of Jeff Kendricks custom ESP and said I wanted something like this but have it Really pop like some of the Kiko Sig's do.... He nailed it.

Also I talked to Bernie this morning and he's got a batch of guitars being prepped for Final Top Coat right now so as soon as those are sprayed, out of the dry room, and then the hardware is put on they'll be shipping and that means multiple NGD's.


----------



## Khoi

that shade of blue is absolutely stunning. Just saw the custom ESP you mentioned, turned out great!


----------



## Rook

MTech said:


> Also I talked to Bernie this morning and he's got a batch of guitars being prepped for Final Top Coat right now so as soon as those are sprayed, out of the dry room, and then the hardware is put on they'll be shipping and that means multiple NGD's.



Pics!


----------



## TomAwesome

That blue looks pretty sweet.


----------



## MTech

Fun111 said:


> Pics!



I didn't get any...


----------



## Khoi

well, as crazy as it sounds, I just picked up another Black Friday guitar slot. This time a 7-string. And I haven't even received my first one.. 

This one was one of the rebuilds, so I don't think it's even been started yet. All the specs were still changeable, and just got the confirmation from Bernie this morning. The ETA that the seller gave me was 3 months, so we'll see if it's actually expedited due to it being a rebuild.


----------



## Larrikin666

Khoi said:


> well, as crazy as it sounds, I just picked up another Black Friday guitar slot. This time a 7-string. And I haven't even received my first one..
> 
> This one was one of the rebuilds, so I don't think it's even been started yet. All the specs were still changeable, and just got the confirmation from Bernie this morning. The ETA that the seller gave me was 3 months, so we'll see if it's actually expedited due to it being a rebuild.



I did the opposite. I liked my 727 so much that I picked up someone's 627 slot.


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> Also I talked to Bernie this morning and he's got a batch of guitars being prepped for Final Top Coat right now so as soon as those are sprayed, out of the dry room, and then the hardware is put on they'll be shipping and that means multiple NGD's.




I wonder if one of those is mine.. my update stated that it was ready for final clear coat back on Oct 21, and even back in August it looked like my guitar was almost ready, with the body painted, holes drilled, and everything. 

Let's hope so!!!


----------



## Invader

Khoi said:


> I wonder if one of those is mine.. my update stated that it was ready for final clear coat back on Oct 21, and even back in August it looked like my guitar was almost ready, with the body painted, holes drilled, and everything.
> 
> Let's hope so!!!



Mine should be there too. Bernie told me four weeks three weeks ago.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Larrikin666 said:


> I did the opposite. I liked my 727 so much that I picked up someone's 627 slot.


 
I picked up two people's 8 string spots so there!


----------



## Hollowway

I'm figuring I must be in that batch. But knowing the steps doesn't give any indication of when we'll get them, unfortunately.


----------



## Larrikin666

glassmoon0fo said:


> I picked up two people's 8 string spots so there!



Well, I got one of the 827s shipped to me accidentally before my 727, so I figured a 627 would round out the entire range for me. The 827 felt amazing, but 8s still aren't necessary for me.


----------



## Khoi

let's just admit it, - all have problems 

waiting over a year for a (at the time) 2 month guitar, and still willing to wait more and even get another one and go through the trouble again!


----------



## MTech

Talked to Bernie yesterday and Ed is out sick so nothing is getting top coated till Tuesday and then they have to sit and bake in the dry room for several days before he pulls them out to buff, oil necks, and put on hardware....


----------



## MTech

Update from the shop.... everybody is back in and I think it's safe to say Bernie has a pile of BFR's & then some that are coming along for Paint/Oil etc..


----------



## MetalDaze

I see a lefty on the wall. Sweet!


----------



## TomAwesome

Is that a spalted top with an ebony strip down the middle? That one is going to look pretty slick.


----------



## MetalDaze

Just got some pics:


----------



## MTech

The one he sent me back/front photos of like the one above actually has a rosewood or ebony neck I want to say (he didn't reply which it was) but it looks gorgeous and has a nice stripe through the fretboard.


----------



## ras1988

MTech said:


> The one he sent me back/front photos of like the one above actually has a rosewood or ebony neck I want to say (he didn't reply which it was) but it looks gorgeous and has a nice stripe through the fretboard.



Was it a non-slant top Jekyll 7 string with a spalt maple top? If so it's probably a RW neck.


----------



## leonardo7

I had mine sent back to wood shop a couple months ago to add glow in the dark side blocks as well as a neck pickup. Bernie was nice enough to let me add those things. I just got these photos today. I wanted and clearly was assured that mine would be a mahogany neck and it isnt. But, I recently started to have regrets about not choosing a maple neck cause I already have 4 mahogany bodied Ibanez guitars so a maple neck is actually better Ive decided. I do see a line between the two top pieces of quilt, not sure if thats normal though. Also, the neck has a strong grain going all the way through the back of the neck, looks cool but I hope it doesnt present any issues like a knot would. Its probably all good. Overall, it looks badass, Im super stoked and now its just a matter of choosing a finish. Cant wait!!!!


----------



## elq

leonardo7 said:


> I wanted and clearly was assured that mine would be a mahogany neck and it isnt.



It's this kind of attention to detail that really shows the care that goes into these instruments...



leonardo7 said:


> I do see a line between the two top pieces of quilt, not sure if thats normal though. Also, the neck has a strong grain going all the way through the back of the neck, looks cool but I hope it doesnt present any issues like a knot would.



It looks like a mineral stain to me, almost certainly no big deal.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

So I have two build spots for 8s that I bought second-hand, and both are still in the wood shop, last time I checked (about 3 weeks ago). I just sent Bernie and email asking if I could add an Indigo finish on one, and a Red-to-gold burst like tosin's old LACS 7, both with taped off edges for the natural maple binding effect. What do you think are the odds that my request will be accepted? I ask because it seems a bit late in the game. I wouldn't even ask, but I just came into some money and would like to treat myself =). MTech, any help you could provide here?


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Anyone find it kind of hilarious yet sad that Leonardo always ends up getting his stuff with the wrong specs? First the Jackson CS, then Mayones, now BRJ


----------



## Hemi-Powered Drone

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Anyone find it kind of hilarious yet sad that Leonardo always ends up getting his stuff with the wrong specs? First the Jackson CS, then Mayones, now BRJ



But it always seems for the better. Either that or Leonardo is the most forgiving guy ever.


----------



## MTech

I told him about the colors you wanted he said he got the color change noted . also told him about the mixup on the wood with the neck, he said he called you.


----------



## leonardo7

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Anyone find it kind of hilarious yet sad that Leonardo always ends up getting his stuff with the wrong specs? First the Jackson CS, then Mayones, now BRJ



Haha I was wondering if anyone else noticed that! While it has happened a few times lately, its not like going out to eat fast food, its a guarantee that they will fuck up my order every single time I eat out at fast food, even at nice restaurants! I know of a guy who was endorsed by ESP and switched to Jackson mainly because he asked for a maple neck and was given a mahogany neck. With large companies you don't really get updates at all and its near impossible to change any specs or get an update on completion times as they change.

I talked to Bernie tonight over the phone about everything and all is well. Bernie is a super duper nice guy. Luthiers like him with the family history and knowledge dont exist. He could easily sell out and produce cheap quality guitars or just be the guy behind the company who doesn't really care much and does no work and has everything done overseas or with CNC machines, but he deals hands on with his customers and even does tons of the work himself such as wood selection, fretwork, some sanding, wiring, hardware installation and much more. To me thats huge! He has helpers, but as far as running the company and being involved, he really is a one man show, plus his shop is in a location that climate wise is ideal for guitar production. 

Bernie truly is a great guy and I am truly excited about this build and not skeptical of it whatsoever. The line in the wood is a non issue, its just a pattern in the wood. As far as getting a maple neck instead of mahogany, like I said, it was a blessing it turned out this way cause I started to regret asking for a mahogany neck. It looks like my build is rolling along nicely and once I get updated photos maybe I will post em.


----------



## HarryLikesProg

bernie is a funny guy. a real joker. see if you can see what's wrong with the couple of pics he sent me today. 















you guessed it! they are different guitars. the top one is a very nice 6 string, not mine. and the bottom one is my 7 string, lovely.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Ouch


----------



## SpaceDock

Huh, my progress pics looked to be at this stage several months ago. Seems like this run will be delivered over many months.


----------



## toiletstand

HarryLikesProg said:


> bernie is a funny guy. a real joker. see if you can see what's wrong with the couple of pics he sent me today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you guessed it! they are different guitars. the top one is a very nice 6 string, not mine. and the bottom one is my 7 string, lovely.



it would be pretty easy to mix up the pics if they werent named right away or especially if he uploaded a lot of pics at once. im sure hell set you up with the correct ones!


----------



## Invader

leonardo7 said:


> As far as getting a maple neck instead of mahogany, like I said, it was a blessing it turned out this way cause I started to regret asking for a mahogany neck. It looks like my build is rolling along nicely and once I get updated photos maybe I will post em.



This sounds really familiar!

I changed the finish on my 627 to a swamp green stain a while back. When Bernie sent me the process shots of the guitar, it was faded denim stain. Oddly enough, I had already started to regret my decision to go with swamp green.

This leads to the guestion: is Bernie psychic?


----------



## glassmoon0fo

MTech said:


> I told him about the colors you wanted he said he got the color change noted.


 
I assume that's for me? and



MTech said:


> also told him about the mixup on the wood with the neck, he said he called you


 
that's for leonardo7? I like my neck wood . rep either way for gettin shit done


----------



## Khoi

question - I never really had this specified, but do all the BFR guitars have the block inlays on the side? I haven't really seen enough pictures of the sides to verify that, I know the inlays were like a $200 upcharge, but even if you didn't get dot inlays, do they still have any on the sides?


----------



## MetalDaze

Khoi said:


> question - I never really had this specified, but do all the BFR guitars have the block inlays on the side? I haven't really seen enough pictures of the sides to verify that, I know the inlays were like a $200 upcharge, but even if you didn't get dot inlays, do they still have any on the sides?


 
I think it's safe to say there will be side dots like on any guitar, but not the side blocks.


----------



## Larrikin666

Khoi said:


> question - I never really had this specified, but do all the BFR guitars have the block inlays on the side? I haven't really seen enough pictures of the sides to verify that, I know the inlays were like a $200 upcharge, but even if you didn't get dot inlays, do they still have any on the sides?



You'd think I'd know the answer to this question since I've been playing mine nonstop...but I'm not 100% sure. I'm pretty sure they're block inlays on the side. LOL.


----------



## Khoi

Larrikin666 said:


> You'd think I'd know the answer to this question since I've been playing mine nonstop...but I'm not 100% sure. I'm pretty sure they're block inlays on the side. LOL.






Would you be able to check? I love the block inlays on the side, and I hope my guitar has it, but I didn't want to pay the additional upcharge just to have them

yours was completely stock, correct?

edit: nevermind, I just stalked your NGD, doesn't look like there are side blocks


----------



## mikernaut

I'm pretty sure the block side inlays are like a $200-300 upcharge. That is what I recall being told when I was ordering. Anyways they are not a standard option.


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> question - I never really had this specified, but do all the BFR guitars have the block inlays on the side? I haven't really seen enough pictures of the sides to verify that, I know the inlays were like a $200 upcharge, but even if you didn't get dot inlays, do they still have any on the sides?



Dots are stock.you have to ask for blocks or glow blocks and that's done in woodshop so it's not something that can just be added if it's already past that point. That's the only thing NOT on my 727 that's almost done I wish it had but it's a stock guitar outta BFR so I had to make due with what he could get to me. Also I FINALLY got photos of my new neck that I ordered last December.


----------



## leonardo7

Bernie was nice enough to send my guitar back to wood shop a few months ago for the addition of glow in the dark side blocks but it was an upcharge plus set things back several months. I plan to gig with this thing and having those glow in the dark side blocks on dark stages is going to be a huge asset.


----------



## Isan

glow in the dark tape


----------



## VILARIKA

Man, this BFR run looks like a huge mess 

It sucks that I can't even reach Bernie myself anymore... Fingers crossed that everyone has their orders made correctly!


----------



## Khoi

VILARIKA said:


> Man, this BFR run looks like a huge mess
> 
> It sucks that I can't even reach Bernie myself anymore... Fingers crossed that everyone has their orders made correctly!



I've been able to contact him no problem. It may take a couple days to get a response, but I've been to get through to him, as have other people.

It also doesn't help that so many customers have changed their specs in the middle of production, sold their spots, etc. (like me)


----------



## elq

It seems like both email addresses I know for bernie have turned into black holes. I'm just want to sell my damn spot and wash my hands of this mess, but can't confirm. 

For fucks sake.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Call?


----------



## elq

Nope - I want some kind of record of the interaction.

All this should take is "Yes. Please give me the new buyers email address, I'll work it out with him."


----------



## leonardo7

I might be interested in taking your spot. 
Id like to know:
6,7 or 8 string?
Trem or no trem?
Scale length
neck, body, fretboard and top woods

Thanks


----------



## MetalDaze

elq is a lefty.


----------



## leonardo7

MetalDaze said:


> elq is a lefty.




Scratch that! And good luck! You should just stick with it. Bernie wants these done as fast as possible and he really is hustling. Id hang in there. His guitars are notch!


----------



## WickedSymphony

Mine 










Just got these pics last night, now I'm rethinking my color choice and gonna see if I can get a last minute change if it isn't in paint already. Was planning on a deep purple burst, but now thinking of getting something done like that blue one Nolly got a while back. Tough choice, any advice would be appreciated! (Arrival of these pics seriously cut into my study time for finals last night )


----------



## elq

leonardo7 said:


> Scratch that! And good luck! You should just stick with it. Bernie wants these done as fast as possible and he really is hustling. Id hang in there. His guitars are notch!



Someone has already agreed to take my spot.

I already own a Rico, it's not the worst guitar I own, but it's lower quality than every other of the 6 small luthier built guitars I own - I'd rank it around a Carvin in terms of quality.

And honestly I don't care how fast you claim he's building them. I was in the first 5 for the 6 strings and asked for zero changes from the default specs - no paint, no special inlay... Perhaps if he were felling mahogany trees with a karate chop, milling the trees with guitar strings, drying the wood by hugging it close at night... I could see it taking this long.

Bernie's done fucked up. I will not order another guitar from him.


Edited to add, I don't mean to come off harsh. I'm really not all that bothered by how long it's taking him to build the guitars - I know shit happens, but his communication is just awful.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah the communication thing is becoming really evident seeing as Mtech is really the one doing any sort of communicating now


----------



## Invader

elq said:


> I already own a Rico, it's not the worst guitar I own, but it's lower quality than every other of the 6 small luthier built guitars I own - I'd rank it around a Carvin in terms of quality.



Could you please elaborate? In your ngd thread for the 828 you said the fretwork and fit/finish was impeccable.


----------



## elq

My definition of impeccable has changed significantly since the 828 NGD 

I'm not quite as ignorant


It's not a bad guitar, but I own FAR nicer guitars now.


----------



## SpaceDock

I don't think the perpetual changes to the orders is helping anything. I am really surprised that anyone would order a custom guitar without knowing what they want, am I wrong?

Elq, you should update your 828 thread if your mind has changed, that should help people decide in the future. Ngd's are usually glowing reviews, but once the honeymoon is over I think it is important to update for a more honest review. Hopefully it's not just a bashfest due to this build not coming along as fast as you had hoped.

I am considering this run to have full custom timeline since almost every guitar was a full custom even if yours was stock.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

SpaceDock said:


> I don't think the perpetual changes to the orders is helping anything. I am really surprised that anyone would order a custom guitar without knowing what they want, am I wrong?
> 
> Elq, you should update your 828 thread if your mind has changed, that should help people decide in the future. Ngd's are usually glowing reviews, but once the honeymoon is over I think it is important to update for a more honest review. Hopefully it's not just a bashfest due to this build not coming along as fast as you had hoped.
> 
> I am considering this run to have full custom timeline since almost every guitar was a full custom even if yours was stock.



You can't edit a post after 30 days or something like that unfortunately.


----------



## MetalDaze

Stealthdjentstic said:


> You can't edit a post after 30 days or something like that unfortunately.


 
For some reason I feel like that rule had to be put in place because of something Stealth did.

Why would I think that?


----------



## elq

I've bumped my 828 NGD thread with brief list of the quality issues that bug me with the guitar - http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/146095-new-brj-day-2.html#post2771715


----------



## Invader

elq said:


> I've bumped my 828 NGD thread with brief list of the quality issues that bug me with the guitar - http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/146095-new-brj-day-2.html#post2771715



Thank you for this. What bothers me the most is the fretwork. I've heard nothing but positive things about Bernies fret job. Anyone reading this who's received their Black Friday guitars, please chime in. Are your frets crowned properly?


----------



## mikernaut

While my guitar was not technically a BFR guitar it was completed somewhat recently and the frets are fine.( just got the wrong inlays) I think Bernie really should have stuck to being strict with the BFR guitar specs . That would have helped to cut down on confusion and errors with soo many orders in the works.

But ultimately he should have not taken on soo much work because now it seems the Quality Control really hasn't been up to par with what it was.

Alot of people are probably never going want to deal with BRJ after this. Personally I'd still like to order another guitar from him as I have still really liked the responsiveness/playability of the guitars I have gotten, but It would be foolish of me not to be concerned.


----------



## Larrikin666

Invader said:


> Thank you for this. What bothers me the most is the fretwork. I've heard nothing but positive things about Bernies fret job. Anyone reading this who's received their Black Friday guitars, please chime in. Are your frets crowned properly?



Everything on my 727 was perfect. The frets felt was great. I have zero complaints. It feels like a much more solid instrument than my JPX7 and RC7G. The top on my guitar is gorgeous....all the pieces and seams look tight and flush. Mine definitely has a bone nut....not a cheap piece of plastic. The one in ELQ's thread also looks like bone, but it's really hard to tell from a picture.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Theres no way I'd deal with him, I put in a quote for a guitar that wasnt even that loaded and they wanted $4800. I said it was a tad out of my budget as I expected mid 3k amd they emailed me back right after saying that they could knock 1k off the price. Thats not a very ethical way of selling your product IMO. $3800 is still way too much for something with the basic specs I asked for anyways.


----------



## mikernaut

You know I wonder if he pulled a Jackson move and raised prices/quoted high because of being too busy to really want to take on more orders. Both of my guitars were under $3k . 

$4800 sounds like ESP pricing, hehe


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Theres no way I'd deal with him, I put in a quote for a guitar that wasnt even that loaded and they wanted $4800. I said it was a tad out of my budget as I expected mid 3k amd they emailed me back right after saying that they could knock 1k off the price. Thats not a very ethical way of selling your product IMO. $3800 is still way too much for something with the basic specs I asked for anyways.



That's strange. Quote for mine (VERY loaded - OFR with piezo, shits and stuff) was way under that price.


----------



## Larrikin666

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> That's strange. Quote for mine (VERY loaded - OFR with piezo, shits and stuff) was way under that price.



Same here. I put in a quote for a ridiculous custom Tera 727with slightly modified shape, OFR, 27" scale, piezo, binding, AAA top....

It was only like $3800 initially....but Bernie cut it down quite a bit after a few emails.


----------



## technomancer

Just a reminder guys, if you're not involved with the run stay out of the thread.


----------



## MTech

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Yeah the communication thing is becoming really evident seeing as Mtech is really the one doing any sort of communicating now



Well to be fair all the people bitching right now haven't taken the time to PM me once so you can't look at me there...as soon as I read the last page about neck woods, a guy worrying that the wood having a grain pattern was going to make his neck unstable, and somebody wanting 2 color changes I copy/pasted it to Bernie and he contacted both of them right then and there... So anybody complaining is either emailing addresses that aren't the ones we all know I posted about 20x, not calling the shop and leaving a message on the machine about their situation, or haven't even PM'd me... so in other words they haven't really tried. I mean my phone went off this morning and it was Bernie with photos of more guitars coming out of woodshop. *before you all jump on me* Congrats to whichever one of you is getting this beauty...






What I've come to notice is some people go all off on here, then when I say something to Bernie they change their whole story and act like it never was remotely the issue they made it out to be on here.....and at the same time there's now a few people on here who want a report every other day...and if I was building the guitars I'd be losing my mind having to deal with that. I posted the photo he sent the other day to give an idea of the mass amounts of guitars he's working on. *even look at all the guitars UNDER the one above* It's not like he completes one and moves to the next, he does them in phases so he'll work on neck shaping one day, nuts/frets/inlays another (he does dot inlays himself) A lot of people are not grasping the fact that once the guitar is top coated it has to go in the oven/dry room for about a week.
His paint guy was out sick for half a week so that set back all the top coats that were to be done last week and if he's on schedule they got done yesterday instead. 

Also if elq has fret issues which I find as hard to believe as most of you, I know how Bernie is a perfectionist and all he'd have to do is send it back to Bernie and that would be fixed STAT.



Larrikin666 said:


> The top on my guitar is gorgeous....all the pieces and seams look tight and flush. Mine definitely has a bone nut....not a cheap piece of plastic. The one in ELQ's thread also looks like bone, but it's really hard to tell from a picture.



He only uses real hand cut bone...no plastic unless you ordered plastic...and it's hilarious to hear him talk about how much pride he has in his bone nuts.... 



Larrikin666 said:


> It was only like $3800 initially....but Bernie cut it down quite a bit after a few emails.



Right now you're looking at around $2500 base price on anything and from quotes I've had him do for people that PM'd me they seem to be almost $500-$1000 cheaper then quotes the people got from other sack ridden brands on here.


----------



## mikernaut

That guitar is sitting on my guitar


----------



## leonardo7

Yes I was someone who posted on here asking opinions without bringing my non issue up with Bernie first. It turned out not to be an issue as I had suspected but I just wanted opinions before bugging Bernie with retarded questions. Turns out Bernie would much much prefer we all go directly to him about concerns rather than post stupid shit on here as hes not gonna give anyone a hard time for any concerns you may have about your build. Id highly recommend everyone contact Bernie or MTech before posting any concerns on here.


----------



## MTech

leonardo7 said:


> Yes I was someone who posted on here asking opinions without bringing my non issue up with Bernie first. It turned out not to be an issue as I had suspected but I just wanted opinions before bugging Bernie with retarded questions. Turns out Bernie would much much prefer we all go directly to him about concerns rather than post stupid shit on here as hes not gonna give anyone a hard time for any concerns you may have about your build. Id highly recommend everyone contact Bernie or M Tech before posting any concerns on here.


You're a great example, you asked a simple question cause you just didn't know..but most in here can vouch they put up an issue or concern they're wondering (most being changing specs) then somebody else chimes in and starts stirring things up or throwing gas on the fire making a small question or concern practically turn into a Rico Bash Fest.

ELQ's guitar is a prime example..Bernie talks about bone so much I don't see him using plastic unless it was ordered like that...and he stated it was a $1700 guitar part of Zimbloths run..I wouldn't be surprised if the run was that cheap that the special run had used cheaper parts in the specs while focusing the money on the more important ones. Also the saddles intonate fine for whatever tuning it was ordered for so that's probably why short saddles weren't put on it...as others have stated the short saddles obviously aren't stock on many of the 8's out there because people are saying get them if you need to tune to E etc.

Also for the record Bernie just got back to me and said 
A: that guitar is over a year old. *correction over 2 years old*
B: that is a real bone nut. 
C: ELQ NOT ONCE complained about anything to him *OR HIS DEALER EVEN* about that guitar.
D: Has now asked that elq email him a number so he can get to the bottom of this and fix the situation.
E: He even said he'd of built you an entirely new one if you'd addressed these issues with him or Nick but you never did and you're saying you're perfectly happy with it as is for the price you paid, but you complain on here a year later yet you still won't let him fix the issues.


----------



## elq

MTech said:


> You're a great example, you asked a simple question cause you just didn't know..but most in here can vouch they put up an issue or concern they're wondering (most being changing specs) then somebody else chimes in and starts stirring things up or throwing gas on the fire making a small question or concern practically turn into a Rico Bash Fest.
> 
> ELQ's guitar is a prime example..Bernie talks about bone so much I don't see him using plastic unless it was ordered like that...and he stated it was a $1700 guitar part of Zimbloths run..I wouldn't be surprised if the run was that cheap that the special run had used cheaper parts in the specs while focusing the money on the more important ones. Also the saddles intonate fine for whatever tuning it was ordered for so that's probably why short saddles weren't put on it...as others have stated the short saddles obviously aren't stock on many of the 8's out there because people are saying get them if you need to tune to E etc.
> 
> Also for the record Bernie just got back to me and said
> A: that guitar is over a year old.
> B: that is a real bone nut.
> C: ELQ NOT ONCE complained about anything to him about that guitar.




I just checked. The nut on my 8 is bone, not plastic. Mea culpa.

I haven't complained because I don't care. I'm also not someone who has to eat beans and ramen for 6 months to afford this guitar, for someone who's young and fairly broke, poor quality can be a real nut kick.

A lot of the bash fest started with you oddly enough -

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2676304-post627.html
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2687771-post666.html


----------



## MTech

elq said:


> I just checked. The nut on my 8 is bone, not plastic. Mea culpa.
> 
> I haven't complained because I don't care.
> 
> A lot of the bash fest started with you oddly enough -



If you don't care then why'd you post it at all? Case/Point.

That's not the bash fest I meant, I was talking about the type of talk and bashing flamed on by mods etc which is why Bernie quit even coming on here..but I'm not getting into that because it's not the threads topic and the mods have been very cool lately...though Max was ever so quit to jump in about your nut saying it's plastic when it's not.

Yes I did post lashing out at Bernie, but I didn't wait till a year later to say something, I've been going back and forth with him and when I finally had it I blasted him publicly on here...that lit a fire under his ass and now he's doing something about my initial guitar problem which he'd known about the day I got the guitar, and that's why he's talking to me all the time... So yea I was PISSED, but now he's taking care of it and I kinda got thrown in the mix as the middle guy to help you all out because I know how frustrating it is not being able to reach him etc..so just to be nice I've been helping other people on here so they don't have the same issue.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

elq said:


> I haven't complained because I don't care.



If I'm not mistaken you've just bumped an almost year old thread to complain about it. Just sayin.

Anyway, apart from the binding everything looks totally fine to me, but again, it's just me.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*Okay guys, lets all take some deep breaths and get back on topic, this is supposed to be about the Black Friday run of guitars. *

*Jeez. *

I also like how me stating a pretty good way to determine if a nut is bone or not is "jumping". I don't remember posting that it wasn't, just that it looked odd and recommended a way to check it out.


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> He only uses real hand cut bone...no plastic unless you ordered plastic...and it's hilarious to hear him talk about how much pride he has in his bone nuts....




LOL. I can definitely back that up. He made sure to bring that up while we talked about my 727 the day it arrived. We had a nice chuckle about it.


----------



## MTech

MaxOfMetal said:


> I also like how me stating a pretty good way to determine if a nut is bone or not is "jumping". I don't remember posting that it wasn't, just that it looked odd and recommended a way to check it out.





MaxOfMetal said:


> As for the nut, bone doesn't usually "whisker" like that. It'll chip or turn to powder before that. If you really want to check, just smell it, they STINK when they're brand new.


I'm not going to get into that but I'm pretty sure the original post didn't have that word "usually" inserted in there.... because when i first read it I was jacked too thinking that why the hell did he put a plastic nut on that guitar? Then I figured they were ordered with them to cheapen it since he said it was $1700...then Bernie got back to me and said it was most certainly bone, and then elq posted photos showing so. 
Also that neck looks like maple with glue on it making it appear slightly darker.


----------



## elq

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> If I'm not mistaken you've just bumped an almost year old thread to complain about it. Just sayin.



I was asked to explain what I had issues with and I thought it better to bump my own thread then add noise here.


I shall bow out of this thread as I will no longer be a BF run customer soon.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MTech said:


> I'm not going to get into that but I'm pretty sure the original post didn't have that word "usually" inserted in there.... because when i first read it I was jacked too thinking that why the hell did he put a plastic nut on that guitar? Then I figured they were ordered with them to cheapen it since he said it was $1700...then Bernie got back to me and said it was most certainly bone, and then elq posted photos showing so.
> Also that neck looks like maple with glue on it making it appear slightly darker.


 
Sorry, but what does this have to do with the Black Friday run of guitars? 

Let's get this back on point. The more you, and others dwell on this, the further from the BFR it's getting. 

That goes for everyone, not just MTech. Next post completely unrelated to the topic of this thread is going to earn someone some time off. That goes for everyone as well. 

Sheesh.


----------



## MTech

Just delete your post and edit that out then. No big.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

No need to delete anything. Let's just move forward like adults.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Here's some pretty pertinent information. Bernie called me today to make sure he had all the details on my two builds straight, and to ask if there was anything else I wanted to have taken care of. We talked for about 30 minutes over two calls and from what i can gather, he's a super nice and personable guy who sounds stressed to hell and back about his situation. He explained that he'd had the issue of having his two contact emails being flooded with requests and such, that were not being handled properly by staff which led to a lot of confusion and lost time. He's still working to fix that personally. He was very accomodating of my request to have a finish added (one of them is just out of paint/finish and i opted NOT to ask him to strip it and repaint , although it's worth mentioning that it was an option). He also told me that it's in "final assemble" which did NOT necessarily mean that he'd be finishing it in the next few days. It simply meant that it was in that final stage with probably 20 other guitars, and it'll be done as soon as he can get to them all. 

Just to share my perspective, I think it's unbelievably awesome that he extended the BF sale, even if he overextended himself. We all knew when he opened that sale up that there would be complications, because when you give an inch, people take a mile and want more (finish options, scale options, pickup options, shape options, etc...). and the fact that someone dropped the ball on email communication is very unfortunate. But i can tell you from experience (I'm a high school band director) that dealing with everyone's questions, comments, and problems while trying to keep an organization/business running all at once is next to impossible, but I really do feel like he's doing his best. At the very least, you all know that you have a guitar on order and that it will be a pretty damn good instrument, and you will have paid no where near his normal asking price for it . I count myself among the silent majority that is more than willing to wait out the difficulties to get my hands on one (or two ) of these monsters!


----------



## JPMike

Well, my stock Hesperian SlimLine I have been waiting for around 4 months, the fretboard ended up getting warped... So that means, I have to wait like another 2-4 months more for another one to be rebuilt.  Yay!

In any case, I talked with Bernie on the phone today and as glassmoon said, he's super nice and cool guy and the options he gave me were good enough not to get me frustrated with the long wait. 

So I am happy, but I wonder which of my 4 orders is going to be done first.


----------



## killertone

As per the earlier fret questions, Frets on my Jekyll 7 are killer. Just sayin'. Not a BFR guitar, fyi. I do have a BFR on order that had to be rebuilt.


----------



## leonardo7

Bernie sent me a pic of it with some type of solution on it just to see how the quilt really looks. All I can say is Wow!! Im impressed! Now is the tough part of deciding on a color that will really make this quilt pop the most and that I will be happy with.


----------



## Rook

That is stunning!

And PRS's 'fire red' always did it for me on tops like that.


----------



## leonardo7

Fun111 said:


> That is stunning!
> 
> And PRS's 'fire red' always did it for me on tops like that.



You know, Im considering red actually


----------



## TomAwesome

Red would look great on that one. Do it.


----------



## MTech

leonardo7 said:


> Now is the tough part of deciding on a color that will really make this quilt pop the most and that I will be happy with.



I'm a whore for blue so I'm using that as an example but I'm sure you could do this finish with red as well..but since that top has the vertical lines in the middle and then more watery toward the outside I think a burst would make this thing pop big time... I'm going to give Suhr's whale blue burst as my suggestion... you could do that with red and it'd look pretty awesome too I think.


----------



## JPMike

I still thinking for what the finish will be on my new rebuild.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

I stole the indigo and natural binding idea for mines


----------



## killertone

I went with Tom Anderson Tiger's Eye Burst on my rebuild.


----------



## mikernaut

Nice choice GlassMoonOfo. I'm looking on getting something very close to that on a future BRJ.


----------



## Khoi

spces confirmed for my 2nd BRJ 7-string. 2-3month build time? Let's see how much that holds true, but I'm not expecting it.

for now, I just opted for the crunchfire/liquifire setup, I don't quite think that BKPs are in my budget right now (would go for Coldsweats), so we'll see how it pans out

getting this color purple, absolutely love it, can't wait!!


----------



## Hollowway

Not to cause a storm here, but I really wish the people requesting change orders had their guitars moved to the back of the line so those of us that ordered the guitars as listed for the sale, and haven't made any changes, could get them. I'm pretty teed off about the delay as it is, and then seeing people's guitars ordered after mine and with changes come out the same of ahead of mind is irritating. Not to mention that I have a full price custom ordered 2 years ago I still haven't received.

EDIT: Hopefully that doesn't sound like I'm harshing on you guys putting change orders in. That's not the issue - its more that I'd like to see some consistency and organization to the operation.


----------



## toiletstand

received an email the other day with progress pics and he also said:

"P.S. if you post on ss.org, please let peopleKnow that I'm personally handling their questions
On their BFR run."


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> Not to cause a storm here, but I really wish the people requesting change orders had their guitars moved to the back of the line so those of us that ordered the guitars as listed for the sale, and haven't made any changes, could get them. I'm pretty teed off about the delay as it is, and then seeing people's guitars ordered after mine and with changes come out the same of ahead of mind is irritating. Not to mention that I have a full price custom ordered 2 years ago I still haven't received.



When I bought someone's spot back in early Summer, thinking around May or June, I was told it'd be fine to change the spot to a 7 string since it was an 8. However, it would put me at the back of their build order and take 7-9 months for completion as opposed to the few months left on the almost complete guitar. It's been about 7 months now and I just got progress pics.

So according to what I was told and what my situation was, changing the specs did put me at the very back of the line and I was fine with that and felt it was fair. I'm not sure if that's how it was for everyone that had major spec changes, though, but at least that's what I was told for mine. 7-9 months does still seem pretty fast compared to other peoples' overall waits though, so I really don't know.

I'd say give the shop a call and see what's up with your orders if you can.



toiletstand said:


> "P.S. if you post on ss.org, please let people Know that I'm personally handling their questions
> On their BFR run."



Just wanna add that for people who have only tried e-mail, try giving the shop a call. I sent them an e-mail and wasn't sure I'd get a quick response, so I gave them a call and John answered and took pretty good care of me. He got back to me with a reply through e-mail a few hours after I called, and followed up the next morning with confirmation. I know from earlier on that their e-mail replies aren't the fastest (sometimes I didn't even get a response), but I would say calling them worked out pretty well. And if that doesn't work, a few people on here have been extremely helpful in contacting BRJ.


----------



## Hollowway

WickedSymphony said:


> When I bought someone's spot back in early Summer, thinking around May or June, I was told it'd be fine to change the spot to a 7 string since it was an 8. However, it would put me at the back of their build order and take 7-9 months for completion as opposed to the few months left on the almost complete guitar. It's been about 7 months now and I just got progress pics.



That's cool, that makes me feel much better. Sounds fairer that way. Thanks.


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> spces confirmed for my 2nd BRJ 7-string. 2-3month build time? Let's see how much that holds true, but I'm not expecting it.
> for now, I just opted for the crunchfire/liquifire setup, I don't quite think that BKPs are in my budget right now (would go for Coldsweats), so we'll see how it pans out
> getting this color purple, absolutely love it, can't wait!!



That Diva color scheme looks great.



Hollowway said:


> Not to cause a storm here, but I really wish the people requesting change orders had their guitars moved to the back of the line so those of us that ordered the guitars as listed for the sale, and haven't made any changes, could get them. I'm pretty teed off about the delay as it is, and then seeing people's guitars ordered after mine and with changes come out the same of ahead of mind is irritating. Not to mention that I have a full price custom ordered 2 years ago I still haven't received.
> 
> EDIT: Hopefully that doesn't sound like I'm harshing on you guys putting change orders in. That's not the issue - its more that I'd like to see some consistency and organization to the operation.



I agree but wasn't yours one of the ones that had to be rebuilt... Woodshop builds in phases just as Bernie does certain things in phases (SPEAKING OF WHICH HE'S DOING THE TOP COATS TODAY) So if yours had to be rebuilt that's going to be another 45-60days right there before it's even out of Woodshop.... Plus you're in California if you're that concerned why don't you take a trip down to his shop and see what's going on then you could at least get photos for everybody in the process. 

He accidentally shot me a message today that was supposed to go to woodshop so now I know somebody else also ordered 2 vixens w/ custom inlays and those both had to be rebuilt..lets just say he wasn't very happy about it in his message


----------



## WickedSymphony

MTech said:


> Woodshop builds in phases just as Bernie does certain things in phases (SPEAKING OF WHICH HE'S DOING THE TOP COATS TODAY)



Well, shit. I guess I picked a bad time to ask them to hold off on paint for mine. Guess I better make my choice quick 

E: But on the other hand, I'm glad I caught them before they started!


----------



## MTech

WickedSymphony said:


> Well, shit. I guess I picked a bad time to ask them to hold off on paint for mine. Guess I better make my choice quick
> 
> E: But on the other hand, I'm glad I caught them before they started!



It's gotta be painted before it's cleared so yours wouldn't be in the batch anyway.

Update though I just got a video sent to me Bernie shot footage of my guitar in the paint booth being cleared.. looks absolutely AMAZING and the Abalone Logo really pops on the headstock. I can NOT wait till it's finally done and in my hands. Should be a bunch of pre-christmas NGD's


----------



## WickedSymphony

MTech said:


> It's gotta be painted before it's cleared so yours wouldn't be in the batch anyway.
> 
> Update though I just got a video sent to me Bernie shot footage of my guitar in the paint booth being cleared.. looks absolutely AMAZING and the Abalone Logo really pops on the headstock. I can NOT wait till it's finally done and in my hands. Should be a bunch of pre-christmas NGD's



Well, either way that makes me happy, haha.

You gonna hold out on showing us that video until your NGD?


----------



## tjrlogan

I gots progress pics of mine this week...Thanks Bernie!  ....


----------



## Rook

Are these jekylls or hysperians? what's the difference?


----------



## tjrlogan

Fun111 said:


> Are these jekylls or hysperians? what's the difference?



Mine is a Hesperian. I'm not 100% sure what the difference is between it and a Jekyl....the body size I think (Hesperian is smaller).


----------



## MTech

Fun111 said:


> Are these jekylls or hysperians? what's the difference?



There's both... I always liked the Jekyll and never the SN as it looked like somebody took a Jekyll and slammed it on the floor so the body is huge and the horns are shorter..the Hesperian is like an in between of both... Mine is a Jekyll Slimline and his slant tops are full thickness in the middle and get smaller toward the outside like the Les Paul shape he's now doing.
Hesperian





Jekyll


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> I agree but wasn't yours one of the ones that had to be rebuilt... Woodshop builds in phases just as Bernie does certain things in phases (SPEAKING OF WHICH HE'S DOING THE TOP COATS TODAY) So if yours had to be rebuilt that's going to be another 45-60days right there before it's even out of Woodshop.... Plus you're in California if you're that concerned why don't you take a trip down to his shop and see what's going on then you could at least get photos for everybody in the process.



Actually, it was my full custom 828 that was built with the wrong neck wood (was built with mahogany, was supposed to be maple) last Feb. On Nov 20 John said he asked Bernie and Bernie said it would be ready to ship in 3 weeks, so that's right now. I emailed a couple of days ago to get the status on that one and the BFR, but haven't yet heard back. 

For my BFR, I don't know what the status is. I haven't had any luck getting an update from my emails, so I don't know. It might have been rebuilt? I've been emailing about both the custom and the BFR but I've only received that update on the custom. 

And I would love to head down to see the shop, but it's out in the boonies.


----------



## Hollowway

tjrlogan said:


> I gots progress pics of mine this week...Thanks Bernie!  ....



Did you talk with him on the phone or request pics through email, or? I've been trying to get a status update on mine, but haven't yet seen or heard anything.


----------



## Psyy

Does anyone know the address to email Bernie with? I've been trying to get a status update for a few months now through the gmail account I lost had contact with him through, but haven't heard anything. :/


----------



## MTech

If you haven't heard from him shoot me a pm with your name, email/number and model you ordered w/ number of strings. He'll be in touch with you STAT.


----------



## tjrlogan

Hollowway said:


> Did you talk with him on the phone or request pics through email, or? I've been trying to get a status update on mine, but haven't yet seen or heard anything.




No, I didn't contact him. I actually bought my spot from someone else here on the forum around July this year and that's the last time I spoke to Bernie before I got my update pics.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> For my BFR, I don't know what the status is. I haven't had any luck getting an update from my emails, so I don't know. It might have been rebuilt? I've been emailing about both the custom and the BFR but I've only received that update on the custom.
> 
> And I would love to head down to see the shop, but it's out in the boonies.



I thought you were on one of the lists I had of people to get a status for.. maybe I'm thinking of Invader cause you both post a lot.


----------



## ras1988

Any word back from Bern on the guitars that were in the clear/drying stages? Will we be seeing Christmas time NGDs or New Year NGDs? I had two builds that were in the clear coating steps and it's nail bittingly close. No real pressure here Mtech I don't want to bug the big man about it he has more important things to do than deal with than my excitable nature.


----------



## MTech

I'm supposed to talk to him later today but they just got cleared the end of last week and he told me they sit in the dry room for about a week... Mine still needs the inlays put on as well as the neck oiled and IDK if the frets are done yet.

Bernie said he's shipped 10 BFR guitars in the last 2 weeks alone. Guitars are out of dry room he's going to try and snap me some shots at some point today. My replacement neck for my non Rico Jr guitar was finished in woodshop last week and it's undercoated now ready for paint.


----------



## Khoi

guess none of those were mine 

seems that my guitars been cleared for finishing for the past 4-5 months.. back in July he said it was getting ready for electronics, but then in October it was ready for final clear stage? 

at this rate, I think I'll the rebuild before my ordered one 

I'm not complaining, as I know everyone in here is in the same boat, just saying


----------



## MTech

I just got a bunch of photo updates for you all give me a min here and I'll put them in this post...
He asked me to let you guys know...
" I'm one guy doing final assembly, topping frets, dress fretboard, drill holes for bridge & electronics, installing electronics including copper ground shield and conductive paint. I install tuners, make REAL BONE NUT BY HAND FROM SCRATCH! String, tune, setup, slot nut, make back plates, install strap pins, detail guitar then pack for shipping myself. Bernie does it all, All guitars in the pic's Bernie completes by himself not including him working in the wood shop with the guys. The ones painted I need to sand for buff and I sand & oil finish including all other stuff on the administrative end of things including ordering all parts."
~Bernie Rico Jr.


----------



## toiletstand

Nom nom nom


----------



## Hollowway

Dang those are hot! I'm supposed to be getting a photo update of mine and I'll post it as soon as it comes through. I'm glad I stuck with the natural cuz I dot have any oil finished guitars yet and those look pretty damn nice.


----------



## MTech

WickedSymphony said:


> Well, either way that makes me happy, haha.
> 
> You gonna hold out on showing us that video until your NGD?



Was waiting for it to dry so I had solid pics.
MOAR!!


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> Was waiting for it to dry so I had solid pics.
> MOAR!!




The color scheme for that black and brown guitar is seriously one of the nicest I've seen, I love it!


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> The color scheme for that black and brown guitar is seriously one of the nicest I've seen, I love it!


It's not brown it's clear so you can see the mahogany on the contours, and the maple on the neck.

He just said he had a cool idea so I let him do whatever and came out awesome.


----------



## Phrygian

seeing as i just bought Elq's spot in this run I'd like to welcome myself to this thread! I got word from bernie that the guitar is just about out of the woodshop!


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> It's not brown it's clear so you can see the mahogany on the contours, and the maple on the neck.



yeah I know, that's what I meant, definitely dig the design though


----------



## ikarus

@MTech: How is the color on the top called?


----------



## MTech

ikarus said:


> @MTech: How is the color on the top called?



IDK what you'd call it... I knew exactly what I wanted, I wanted the color like the Custom ESP's Jeff Kendrick plays... it's a darker shade of blue but it's all in how it's stained and sanded to get the colors to pop like that, just takes a little more work. 


Whichever one of you guys is getting this is one lucky SOB, check out what I woke up to see this morning from the BFR run...


Bernie finishing up a Hesperian 828 with Piezo system.






For those of you getting Piezo what cables are you using or how'd you plan on running it since it's stereo output?? I have a Parker Y Cable but somebody I used to tech for borrowed it and never gave it back . I just ordered a Stereo Spectraflex to match my 727 (blue/black wrap) and had them use a right angle on one end to go into the guitar and straight on the other. I figure that way I can use both Piezo/Magnetic into 1 amp and if I want to do two I can always get a splitter box so I can use 2 normal cables out of that at least till I get my Y cable back.


----------



## VILARIKA

MTech said:


> IDK what you'd call it... I knew exactly what I wanted, I wanted the color like the Custom ESP's Jeff Kendrick plays... it's a darker shade of blue but it's all in how it's stained and sanded to get the colors to pop like that, just takes a little more work.
> 
> 
> Whichever one of you guys is getting this is one lucky SOB, check out what I woke up to see this morning from the BFR run...
> 
> 
> Bernie finishing up a Hesperian 828 with Piezo system.



Damn, that's gonna be sweet when its done.


----------



## MTech

SEX!!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

do all piezo equipped guitars have a stereo output ? 

I played one of the mayones elements series with piezo and if I remember correctly it had only a mono output (which worked great with the piezo... )


----------



## Phrygian

MTech said:


> SEX!!





That finish is waaay too classy!


----------



## MTech

Pascal-Darrell said:


> do all piezo equipped guitars have a stereo output ?
> 
> I played one of the mayones elements series with piezo and if I remember correctly it had only a mono output (which worked great with the piezo... )



If you use a mono jack you'd only have 1 or the other... if you set it up with a 3 way mini toggle will be Magnetic/Both/Piezo (click to see wiring) like on a parker, or as they're setup with the Ghost Saddles like Bernie is using, they use a stereo (TRS) jack it's tip/ring deal otherwise you have to have 2 jacks which even when they do that (like on a petrucci) it's still stereo on the one or you run two mono cables.



VILARIKA said:


> Damn, that's gonna be sweet when its done.


It is done he just sent me a photo but I'm on my way out the door... Also have a RIDICULOUS oiled quilt top to post too.


----------



## MTech

More Sexy Time Including Finished 828 Ready To Ship.


----------



## Phrygian

Wow those look good!


----------



## MTech

Bernie wanted me to point this out to make it very clear.

BERNIE USES REAL BONE NUTS!










More Sexy BFR's


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Dear 8 pound 6 ounce baby jesus, those gold and yellow stains are gorgeous.


----------



## Hollowway

Man, I hope mine is in that batch. I got pics of my custom, which just got painted (it's still taped up in the photos. No hurry though. It's only been 23 months. ) and I'm hoping to get an update Monday on my BFR.


----------



## TomAwesome

It's a rainbow of tone!


----------



## kmanick

Holy crap!
lots of drool worthy pics popping up now!


----------



## Locrian

Those are some great looking shots. Can't wait to get some progress pics of mine, it should be pretty different then what most folks went for. Mahogany non-slant top.


----------



## Khoi

I really shouldn't look at this thread any more, it's just making me want mine even more!

thanks for the shots MTech, they look like fantastic guitars. So much good wood


----------



## WickedSymphony

Oh man, I wonder if mine is in that batch. I see one similar to what I just asked Bernie for the other day! 

And I don't want to quote it again on this page, but god damn MTech, I love the finish on yours!


----------



## MTech

WickedSymphony said:


> And I don't want to quote it again on this page, but god damn MTech, I love the finish on yours!


----------



## kruneh

Thanks a lot MTech for doing this 

That´s some sweet guitars right there.
Very cool to see such a variety in colours too.

Mine had colour last time I saw it, would be awesome if it was in this batch


----------



## ToupaTroopa

Man, I had some doubts earlier bc the guy I purchased the spot from back in June was emailing me telling me the guitar was finished. But I spoke to Bernie today and we figured out that the guitar was still in the OTHER dudes' name! Bernie checked my emails to the old email address and fixed everything up for me. So now I don't have to worry about being ripped off and I have a NGD coming soon!


----------



## Hollowway

So I got the update on mine. Apparently mine was built with a maple top not quilt, and just came out of the woodshop. At this point I just want a guitar of some sort soon, so I am trying to work out something with Bernie to just keep the flame instead of the quilt. I asked about my non BFR custom, and it's been delayed because it had to be rebuilt 3 times. So I'm looking at 5 total guitars being built for the two I'll end up getting. Drag.


----------



## JPMike

I am kinda on the same boat, I got 4 guitars waiting to be done. 

One of them, it was finished and ready to be shipped, but it had to be redone. So, it goes up again from the start to be rebuilt. 

I am growing impatient!!!


----------



## Larrikin666

Just took another 627 order off of someone's hands.


----------



## MetalDaze

Larrikin666 said:


> Just took another 627 order off of someone's hands.


 
How many BFR's will that be now....3 ?


----------



## MTech

I'm waiting on 4 and only have pictures of 1 (which isn't even one I ordered it's a stock guitar I got in on the BFR batch just to finally get a guitar since I've been waiting so long) so.....
My neck was ready for paint and they fucked up the truss rod on it, and did the same thing to 2-3 other guitars, plus he wasn't happy with the glow block side markers so that's being rebuilt now.


----------



## ikarus

Larrikin666 said:


> Just took another 627 order off of someone's hands.



Lucky man! 

If anyone wants to sell his BFR spot, PM ME!!!!


----------



## Larrikin666

MetalDaze said:


> How many BFR's will that be now....3 ?



3 BFRs and one custom order I put it on my own


----------



## MTech

NEXT TO BE FINISHED


----------



## Isan

MTech said:


> NEXT TO BE FINISHED



Believe the one in the middle is mine


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> NEXT TO BE FINISHED




any word on the ones that were already finished?


----------



## JPMike

This thread makes me impatient even more....

Some torturing process here!!


----------



## MTech

Khoi said:


> any word on the ones that were already finished?



Yea, I woke up to a message today that he's started final sanding and buff on the ones that just came out of clear.... don't get your panties in a bunch though cause he does that before he does all the fretwork and hardware etc. I've got a huge show the 29th I wanted to have mine for and he's saying probably not gonna happen cause he's going away for the holidays.



JPMike said:


> This thread makes me impatient even more....
> 
> Some torturing process here!!


You guys complain when you don't know what's going on so I get on his case to get me photos of a bunch of what he's working on...and you complain more cause it gives you GAS!

There's just no winning


----------



## Khoi

MTech said:


> Yea, I woke up to a message today that he's started final sanding and buff on the ones that just came out of clear.... don't get your panties in a bunch though cause he does that before he does all the fretwork and hardware etc. I've got a huge show the 29th I wanted to have mine for and he's saying probably not gonna happen cause he's going away for the holidays.
> 
> 
> You guys complain when you don't know what's going on so I get on his case to get me photos of a bunch of what he's working on...and you complain more cause it gives you GAS!
> 
> There's just no winning





cool, thanks for the updates! Looks like the New Year will be a pretty happy time


----------



## JPMike

@MTech, I know what's going on. Trust me.


----------



## phantaz

Am I the only one to get a BFR vixen style?


----------



## Hollowway

phantaz said:


> Am I the only one to get a BFR vixen style?



Vixen?! You mean body style? I thought there was just the option of the Hesperian? Or do you mean something else about the Vixen?


----------



## toiletstand

at first he offered the hesperian models after the initial 15 were snatched up he offered the vixens. then i think he opened it to either body shape.


----------



## Hollowway

Ah, ok. I'm not a fan of the Vixen shape. I love the Diva, though. Just have never committed to a V style before.


----------



## toiletstand

yeah i mix them up myself sometimes. heres the original thread http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/de...more-bernie-rico-jr-black-friday-guitars.html


----------



## Khoi

just got an update from the man himself this morning!

"Hey Brian,

Here is a pic. I will start assembly on your guitar.

Best Regards,
Bernie Rico."


Needless to say, I'M SUPER EXCITED NOW!


----------



## MTech

^That's after Final Sand/Buff




Hollowway said:


> Vixen?! You mean body style? I thought there was just the option of the Hesperian? Or do you mean something else about the Vixen?


You could get ANY of the body shapes.

*Also a lot of you are seeing all these new shots of the guitars being finished up and posting you wished you got in on the BFR sale. Many of you have been PMing me asking if you can still get in on the BFR, or if I know of anybody is selling their BFR spot, or what Stock guitars he has. To try and help you guys out I shot Bernie a message today asking him to send me over shots/specs on the Stock guitars he's got now. (Stock guitars are ones he just put through woodshop with all the BFR orders etc but they don't have any set buyer) I'll be listing them in the dealer section w/ reduced pricing as he sends the photos/specs. Technically they were built with the BFR batch, but that deal was only for people who put down a deposit when the BFR special was run so I'm not posting them in this thread so it stays On Topic. *


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> You could get ANY of the body shapes.



Oh, yeah but I meant with respect to the BFR sale. I know he's got loads of styles in general.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Oh, yeah but I meant with respect to the BFR sale. I know he's got loads of styles in general.


I know, I was talking about the BFR as well... there's people with Vixens/Diva's/Hesperians/Jekyll's.


----------



## Cancer

Does anyone have an email address for Bernie? I just want to check my status. Thanks.


----------



## EOT

Cancer said:


> Does anyone have an email address for Bernie? I just want to check my status. Thanks.



[email protected]

Try that one. He's not always real fast at responding though.


----------



## Locrian

EOT said:


> [email protected]
> 
> Try that one. He's not always real fast at responding though.



You won't get any response from that email. Try [email protected] or call 760-956-6619


----------



## EOT

You're right locrian. I keep forgetting which email address is the one that works.


----------



## Cancer

Thanks to you both.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> I know, I was talking about the BFR as well... there's people with Vixens/Diva's/Hesperians/Jekyll's.



Ah crap, really? He must have opened that up later. Early on I asked him for a Jekyll and he said Hesperians only. Well, hopefully someone ordered a Diva 8 they won't be happy with and will list it up FS.  Here's to helping my addiction.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Ah crap, really? He must have opened that up later. Early on I asked him for a Jekyll and he said Hesperians only. Well, hopefully someone ordered a Diva 8 they won't be happy with and will list it up FS.  Here's to helping my addiction.



A bunch of the ones I have posted have been Jekyll's..... I don't think there were any Diva 8's but I could be wrong..I know he built a sick one with flames and a a titanium floyd as mentioned before.

Anybody trying to reach Bernie or waiting on answers for status etc he's out till Tues after Christmas.


----------



## Hollowway

MTech said:


> A bunch of the ones I have posted have been Jekyll's..... I don't think there were any Diva 8's but I could be wrong..I know he built a sick one with flames and a a titanium floyd as mentioned before.
> 
> Anybody trying to reach Bernie or waiting on answers for status etc he's out till Tues after Christmas.



Yeah, I emailed him. No Diva 8s in this run. He said he scales everything up, size wise, so the neck doesn't dwarf the body. I think I'd want to see a mockup or someone elses order before I pull the trigger on one. But I do love me that body shape.


----------



## killertone

I wonder what happened to my Hesperian that had to be rebuilt? It had a beautiful quilt top on it.


----------



## MTech

Woke up to this...


----------



## JPMike

And I am still waiting for mine...


----------



## trippled

MTech said:


> A bunch of the ones I have posted have been Jekyll's..... I don't think there were any Diva 8's but I could be wrong..I know he built a sick one with flames and a a titanium floyd as mentioned before.
> 
> Anybody trying to reach Bernie or waiting on answers for status etc he's out till Tues after Christmas.



Hmm, good to know.

What does it mean as far as dates? Wer'e not really celebrating christmas here in israel (-:


----------



## Hollowway

trippled said:


> Hmm, good to know.
> 
> What does it mean as far as dates? Wer'e not really celebrating christmas here in israel (-:



 Good point! So he's likely gone this weekend for New Year's, but I could be wrong. I'd say give him a call or email today if you can. I wouldn't be surprised if he's in a least a little over the next 3 days, given the work load he's got. Most businesses over here are closed on the 2nd and reopened on the 3rd.


----------



## MTech

He came back to the shop Tue, forgot his phone yesterday, shot me over that photo today and was in and out of the shop... I asked him to hit me with some more but obviously as you can see from mine that means all the ones that just got final cleared/dried are getting final buff... after that he's gotta do the bone nut/fret dressing/neck oiling, hardware, and setup.

Also FWIW I called the shop today and John picks the phone right up...but otherwise leave message with your name/number/model & # strings on your guitar and he'll hit you back with the status if you haven't shot me over that info to get an email out.... Just try not to clog it up asking every other day like a few people have been...remember guys he's working on them in batches so every 45-60 days you have 45+ guitars come outta woodshop that need Bernie to shape the neck, paint/stained etc...then clear/dry for about a week..then buffing that batch etc...


----------



## Lirtle

Just payed mine off. Now I wait.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Bernie just sent me a pic of my 827, turns out there's an imperfection in the wood. He seems freaked out by it and wants to rebuild it, meanwhile I can barely see the damn thing . He's offering to add a trans finish to help cover it up, think I'll just take it as-is. After all, I'm in on this run for the awesome specs and playability, I'm not too hard-up about something so small for the price im paying . hopefully I'll have one of these puppies in my hands soon!


----------



## killertone

glassmoon0fo said:


> Bernie just sent me a pic of my 827, turns out there's an imperfection in the wood. He seems freaked out by it and wants to rebuild it, meanwhile I can barely see the damn thing . He's offering to add a trans finish to help cover it up, think I'll just take it as-is. After all, I'm in on this run for the awesome specs and playability, I'm not too hard-up about something so small for the price im paying . hopefully I'll have one of these puppies in my hands soon!



He did the same thing for me a month or so ago. I went with the rebuild.


----------



## Hollowway

Seems like he's rebuilding a lot of these.  Are these being sold to someone else when that happens? I know my rebuild because of the wrong specs had that happen.


----------



## killertone

Hollowway said:


> Seems like he's rebuilding a lot of these.  Are these being sold to someone else when that happens? I know my rebuild because of the wrong specs had that happen.



The amount of rebuilds seems pretty high to me. Not sure why that is. I don't care as long as I get the guitar I ordered though. 

I also wonder what happened to my rebuild. It was only because the mahogany wings were terribly matched and looked like they were 2 different kinds of woods. It had a killer quilt top.


----------



## JPMike

Same here, my 727 had some warping on the neck, which I couldn't even see, and he offered a rebuild on a new guitar, whatever specs I want. So ofcourse, I went with a rebuild.  But the waiting it's... frustrating!!!


----------



## SpaceDock

You know, I think it is much better to have Bernie be a perfectionist and wait longer for something you can appreciate for years, even if it takes years to get it. I have seen a lot of unhappy NGDs from other builders that ignored flaws. I think we'll all be better off in the end.


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> You know, I think it is much better to have Bernie be a perfectionist and wait longer for something you can appreciate for years, even if it takes years to get it. I have seen a lot of unhappy NGDs from other builders that ignored flaws. I think we'll all be better off in the end.



I totally agree with you, that's what I value in Bernie his proffesionalism and perfection.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

We agree there, Im super glad he felt the need to get in touch with me about such a minute problem, makes me feel like my build is in good hands. I'll see if I can get pics up of the inperfection, just to show how small it is (to me, anyway). If he isn't comfortable with sending out a guitar like that, I guess I'll just have to get it stained =)


----------



## MTech

glassmoon0fo said:


> Bernie just sent me a pic of my 827, turns out there's an imperfection in the wood. He seems freaked out by it and wants to rebuild it, meanwhile I can barely see the damn thing . He's offering to add a trans finish to help cover it up, think I'll just take it as-is. After all, I'm in on this run for the awesome specs and playability, I'm not too hard-up about something so small for the price im paying . hopefully I'll have one of these puppies in my hands soon!



This is what I was trying to get across to a lot of you when he talks about rebuilds.... he's THAT much of a perfectionist. Many other companies would cut out imperfections and fill them and paint over them... Bernie is so picky he wants to do a full rebuild on things so small that as you even said you could barely even see it.



Hollowway said:


> Seems like he's rebuilding a lot of these.  Are these being sold to someone else when that happens? I know my rebuild because of the wrong specs had that happen.



A wrong spec would go up as a stock guitar....that's different than a rebuild which is when something isn't right...like he had 2 the other week he said came out of woodshop where the body/headstock sizes weren't right so they both had to be done...and they were both for the same customer so I felt bad hearing that one.



JPMike said:


> Same here, my 727 had some warping on the neck, which I couldn't even see, and he offered a rebuild on a new guitar, whatever specs I want. So of course, I went with a rebuild.  But the waiting it's... frustrating!!!



Warping is obviously something you do not want... having a spot int he wood isn't such a big deal but he still wants to rebuild even with that as you just saw above.


----------



## killertone

Here is the pic that led to my rebuild. He suggested the rebuild to me, I didn't ask for it. That was cool of him.

This mismatch would have driven me nuts and Bernie was very upfront about it. I am very appreciative of that.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Wow. How'd that one even make it past the dude who was putting it together? That is really, REALLY strange.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ the outsides of the original three wood blocks probably looked matched, but as they planed the wood grain was different? If these come from larger wood blocks that could happen. I don't see him glueing together blocks that were so different intentionally. But it wouldn't matter at all if the back was painted.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

A good point man. I wasn't calling anyone out on it or anything. I seriously was curious as to how it would be possible to make something like that happen. And yes, were it painted, no one would be the wiser... hmmm.... RICO No. 2?!


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah I'd these rebuilds are all because of wood shop mistakes it sounds like he might need to have another come to Jesus meeting with those guys. We're seeing a fair number of rebuilds here and someone is not catching them very early.


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> We're seeing a fair number of rebuilds here and someone is not catching them very early.


When you're talking about 45-60 a batch it's not really that many with an actual issue..most of them are small imperfections that 99% of companies wouldn't care about. Something like a mistake on specs isn't a defect obviously, that's all miscommunication more than anything. There's very few I've heard about that have something legit wrong with them (like the 2 vixens I spoke of) but obviously if Bernie is trying to bust guitars out on his end he can't be in woodshop as much to have an eye on things.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

And once again, just to be concise about this - I am not blaming or think badly of Bernie at all. He's a kick-ass dude who is building me a kick-ass guitar that I hope is the start of a beautiful relationship of ass-kicking. You are absolutely right - just like the case with my axe - most companies would have filled the hairline fracture in the ebony and gone about their day. I am glad Bernie is as dedicated to fine guitar building as he is. He's one of a very few!


----------



## MTech

Haven't got any photo updates since Bernie has been out on vacation etc with the holidays so when he's been back in he's too busy working on guitars. I wanted to update on mine since obviously it's in with that batch which was just getting final buff etc. like 2 weeks ago. He's got all the fretwork done on mine and it's ready for electronics/hardware so that batch should be right around the same point.


----------



## MTech

I let Bernie know how some people seem to not understand he's got all the BFR's from all over the country, his site, this forum etc. plus normal orders so Bernie shot me over some photos to give people an idea of what he's got on his plate. This is just what he's got out of woodshop now and ALL the guitars pictured have to be finished 100% by Bernie. These photos were taken yesterday.











And these are finished ready to ship...


----------



## Phrygian

these are the ones that came out of the woodshop before christmas, or the batch before that? either way, bernie got his hands full, christ! What a guy


----------



## ras1988

Phrygian said:


> these are the ones that came out of the woodshop before christmas, or the batch before that? either way, bernie got his hands full, christ! What a guy


These seem to be the ones that got final clear/finish before Christmas because I can see my blackburst BFR on the rack and it was in that batch.



Thanks for the photos man, I really don't like to bother guitar making Zeus to send progress shots down from Olympus.


----------



## MTech

He shot them yesterday at like 7PM while he was sweeping up around the shop closing & talking to me... Blood Splatter/Gun Shot guitar is Sikk.


----------



## MetalDaze

What's his technique for the bullet holes? Can you specify a particular caliber?


----------



## Khoi

ah was hoping to see if my guitar was one of the ones ready to ship! 

Still waiting for his response about the final payment on my guitar....


----------



## MTech

Think you guys either aren't paying attention that you're emailing the wrong address OR you haven't shot me a pm with your name, email/number & what you ordered to get you status and/or whatever info you need or so Bernie can hit you back.

Especially now cause he accidentally downloaded all emails to hip laptop from the server so he doesn't know which were replied to etc now.


----------



## ikarus

Finally i can write in this thread.
I bought a BFR Hesperian 727 spot. Bernie said that the guitar is out of the woodshop. I can't wait to get my hands on this guitar! 

BTW: If anybody wants to get rid of his BFR 6-string Hesperian spot, pm me!


----------



## Khoi

just sent Bernie my final payment last night. Now the real wait begins!


----------



## MTech

Talked to Bernie and he's shipping a few guitars today..... Waiting on the bridge for mine which sucks because otherwise I'd have it, but the good news is I get to see him working on my guitar when I go out for NAMM. Needless to say I know how everybody is on here so I'll be sure to get photos of all the orders from guys on here that I can.


----------



## ikarus

MTech said:


> Needless to say I know how everybody is on here so I'll be sure to get photos of all the orders from guys on here that I can.



thanks, man!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

thanks MTech !


----------



## VILARIKA

Those pictures got me pretty excited, I can't wait to get it!


----------



## Isan

ikarus said:


> thanks, man!



Ditto


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> Talked to Bernie and he's shipping a few guitars today..... Waiting on the bridge for mine which sucks because otherwise I'd have it, but the good news is I get to see him working on my guitar when I go out for NAMM. Needless to say I know how everybody is on here so I'll be sure to get photos of all the orders from guys on here that I can.




I'm in L.A. for a month and would love to go out to the shop. I guess I should just email Bernie and ask him...


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> I'm in L.A. for a month and would love to go out to the shop. I guess I should just email Bernie and ask him...


I'm going up after NAMM, Bernie said if anybody with an order in or that has a Rico Jr is gonna be out and wants to swing by the shop they're more than welcome to come check it out.


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> I'm going up after NAMM, Bernie said if anybody with an order in or that has a Rico Jr is gonna be out and wants to swing by the shop they're more than welcome to come check it out.



Cool, because it seems there is some confusion about my BFG rebuild and I would like to make sure it is all straightened out. Kinda worried actually...

I'll be at NAMM as well playing at the Amptweaker booth on Sat and Sun.


----------



## Larrikin666

Talked to Bernie last night about the extra slots I purchased. We spent a lot of time chasing down details and making sure everything was perfect for the transfer. I'm really glad he cares that much to check every detail. I felt bad that he had to spend so much time doing that kind of stuff and not working on actual guitars. LOL. I apologize to everyone still waiting on guitars. I probably added a day to everyone's wait just from that.


----------



## ibanez4lifesz

Time to bring some life back into this thread. 

Just got this pic from Bernie...my Jekyll 6 is done, and will be on its way home soon. So excited, and NGD soon! 

BKP Aftermath in Bridge and a Duncan Jazz in the neck. Petrucci wiring with a single volume. If I understood Bernie correctly during our conversations, this is a new finish (oil/wax based) that he has been working on for a while. REALLY excited!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

on the phone with bernie right now talking about this guitar =) that shit is HOT!

edit: just got off the phone with bernie, he called to double check some of the mods I have on my guitars, and he let me know that I have one being prepped to ship in the next week or two. He mentioned this guitar so I checked to see if the pic was posted. I pretty much yelled "FUCK!" right in the middle of his sentence haha. it's a black stain that's been sanded back a bit, then oiled. pretty striking, I dig it! He mentioned doing it to my second 8 (which is almost ready for paint) but I'm not quite sure how that'd look on a flame top, plus i like the indigo and natural binding idea I have going now. but stay tuned  Considering how many BFR orders are on tap and how late I got my orders in, I wasn't expecting to hear from him for a minute. looks like things are moving along, so I'm pretty damn stoked


----------



## Rook

@ibanez4lifesz - holy shit! That looks amazing! GASing for my Rico so bad!


----------



## JPMike

Fun111 said:


> @ibanez4lifesz - holy shit! That looks amazing! GASing for my Rico so bad!



Totally +1.

It will be quite some time for my Ricos...


----------



## VILARIKA

By the beard of Zeus...


----------



## Khoi

ibanez4lifesz said:


> Time to bring some life back into this thread.
> 
> Just got this pic from Bernie...my Jekyll 6 is done, and will be on its way home soon. So excited, and NGD soon!
> 
> BKP Aftermath in Bridge and a Duncan Jazz in the neck. Petrucci wiring with a single volume. If I understood Bernie correctly during our conversations, this is a new finish (oil/wax based) that he has been working on for a while. REALLY excited!




holy hell, that's exactly the type of finish I was thinking of and was wondering if it was possible. Gonna shoot him an e-mail now, I wanted a painted quilt like that but not in glossy, that's beautiful! congrats!


----------



## Qweklain

I talked to Bernie today for roughly 45 minutes since I wanted to double check that all my specs were in line. They all are so everything is good there.

It is quite different when you finally put a voice to the face. He is definitely a cool dude and he is doing everything he can to get these done and said straight up he has no excuses, does not blame people being frustrated it is taking so long, and did not think it would get like this in the beginning. When I was talking to him he was setting up a guitar while talking. 

He also mentioned all the things that have been posted here before when people actually started talking to him and getting the truth from him vs. rumors thrown around. I am pretty sure the wait will definitely be worth it. Hang in there dudes, and possibly, dudettes!


----------



## SYLrules88

edit: sorry, got excited and posted but im not a customer.


----------



## toiletstand

i'm in love


----------



## TomAwesome

That looks great, ibanez4lifesz! Should we expect a name change to BRJ4lifesz?

In other news, mine should be done next week. YAY!


----------



## Qweklain

TomAwesome said:


> That looks great, ibanez4lifesz! Should we expect a name change to BRJ4lifesz?
> 
> In other news, mine should be done next week. YAY!


When I talked to him yesterday, I forgot to mention he did say three were ready to be shipped out and three more would probably be heading out late next week or early the week after. Maybe yours is one of those!


----------



## fords131

just purchased a 627 Jekyll spalted guitar. Bernie is a master craftsman. Great guitar


----------



## mikernaut

Awaiting Mtech's return from his namm trip  and moar BRJ pron


----------



## MTech

Hey guys just dropping a line I'm in the car with Bernie on the way to The shop while he's actually talkin to a customer on the phone who's raving about their new guitar. Wanted to drop a line on here for anybody who needs answers or info to shoot me a message with you name and guitar order. I'm going to get some photos while out here so no worries.


----------



## MTech

Taking photos now and sending them to those who pm'd me. He's got around 30 guitars that are 3-4weeks from shipping and most are guys on here...I gotta say photos do NOT do them justice.. I tried to get the lighting right to see mine how it actually looks..


----------



## thrsher

that finish looks awesome


----------



## Khoi

I will be shooting you a PM shortly


----------



## WickedSymphony

Pic of mine, courtesy of MTech!


----------



## thrsher

holy sh*t all of those guitars in the BG


----------



## MTech

The headstock shows the color best because the light blue that's all through it shows up way more in this shot.... this thing is so 3D it's ridiculous. Also whoever got the hand stained blue 828 that looks intense same with pascall's. Also the faded denim one looks way better in person.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Holy shit, dude. I hope when mine gets final paint the blue looks as awesome as yours does!


----------



## MTech

thrsher said:


> holy sh*t all of those guitars in the BG


Bernie Says What's Up?!?! 




Rack 2: 





Rack 3:





*MOD EDIT: For the last time, if it's not related to the BFR run, don't post it in this thread. *


----------



## WickedSymphony

Ebony tops and rosewood neckthru's  not something you see every day lol


----------



## Hollowway

Wow! Cool to see he's going for the exotic woods. When I ordered my custom a couple of years ago he wasn't really using anything crazy (I initially wanted a bloodwood FB). Cool to see things are progressing along far enough to have so many ship soon.


----------



## killertone

Got a pic of mine thanks to MTech. Rebuild is coming along nicely!! Wish I could see the quilt better. Oh wait, I will when I go out to the shop!


----------



## ras1988

So happy about the photos and the updates, thanks so much MTech. Can't wait till I get these in my hands.


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> Got a pic of mine thanks to MTech. Rebuild is coming along nicely!! Wish I could see the quilt better. Oh wait, I will when I go out to the shop!



Yea are you coming up or what???
I'm honestly surprised more people haven't posted anything after all he cool shots I posted up above from yesterday.

I just got done talking to the guys in the shop and checking out some of the guitars getting prepped for paint and had to jump on. It's really comical how some people try hating by insinuating the guitars aren't hand crafted etc. especially after seeing all of these. No 2 guitars are exactly alike, and looking at the fresh cores you can actually see the knife marks in some of them, as well as tell by the bevels and contours. I'm actually kicking it here typing this up while Bernie is finishing a Jekyll for the Faceless guitarist. I forget who PM'd me yesterday getting he trans blue quilt but your guitar is being sprayed in the next room as we speak.


----------



## kruneh

And the  goes to MTech for this pic


----------



## Phrygian

Holy shit these guitars are looking soooo good!


----------



## kruneh

To bad you´re a lefty or I´d let you try it


----------



## MTech

Phrygian said:


> Holy shit these guitars are looking soooo good!





kruneh said:


> To bad you´re a lefty or I´d let you try it



I read this to Bernie and he said "Hey Tell Him I got a lefty 6 string flame top sitting here!"


----------



## Phrygian

kruneh said:


> To bad you´re a lefty or I´d let you try it



haha! yeah, it's a frikkin curse...


----------



## Phrygian

MTech said:


> I read this to Bernie and he said "Hey Tell Him I got a lefty 6 string quilt top sitting here!"



Hmmm! PM me about that one, I think we might have to figure something out


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> Yea are you coming up or what???



Can you tell me where the shop is? I will be heading out there from Santa Monica. I need to get an idea of about how far it is and where it is so I can make arrangements with work. Thanks!


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> Can you tell me where the shop is? I will be heading out there from Santa Monica. I need to get an idea of about how far it is and where it is so I can make arrangements with work. Thanks!



The address is right on his site, I am gonna guess a good 2 hours from clear out there. The shop is way up in the desert area of Hesperia.

Those are 1 piece quartersawn necks.


----------



## TomAwesome

I like the orange one!


----------



## Rook

I have a rosewood NT on my upcoming BRJ (non BFR), maybe that'll find it's way onto my guitar!


----------



## ras1988

Fun111 said:


> I have a rosewood NT on my upcoming BRJ (non BFR), maybe that'll find it's way onto my guitar!



The spalt topped 727 in the pic I posted has a RW NT. It is amazing that he can find such huge blocks of RW that are not only visually pleasing but stable enough for a full length NT.


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> The address is right on his site, I am gonna guess a good 2 hours from clear out there. The shop is way up in the desert area of Hesperia.



Meant to PM you that. Oops. 

2 hours is about what I thought. Gonna try and work it out.


----------



## kmanick

kruneh said:


> And the  goes to MTech for this pic


 Holy crap Please tell me that has a maple fret board
Freaking gorgeous


----------



## MTech

Hey guys you should post up on here what you really wanna see or maybe we can start an "Official Rico Jr Guitars" Thread to do that so it's easier. I've got a whole photoshoot booth setup in here now and I'm getting shots of all the stock guitars so he can get them listed in the shop and most of them are 6 strings. He figured with it being SS.org and all there wouldn't be much interest but I know a ton of you at least play 6 & 7's. Basically that entire 1 by the wall of wood is ALL stock guitars. At the very least I'm going to get shots of everything so he can put them up on the Ricojrguitars.com site to get sold. 

Bernie is working on a flamed top 8 Jekyll BFR while I'm doing this and waiting for a special artist to arrive that's supposed to be stopping by the shop today since he couldn't make it yesterday. 

Also I've got confirmation there is "Green" coming and a few of you can guess what I mean...it's for a different artist then who I'm talking about stopping by.


----------



## travis bickle

man, have i been anxious to get in on the fun in this thread!!!!! this is what was in my inbox yesterday.


----------



## kruneh

kmanick said:


> Holy crap Please tell me that has a maple fret board
> Freaking gorgeous



Sorry, ebony.
Think of it as less appealing to you then


----------



## Larrikin666

Got some new pics from Bernie


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*Final warning. *

*This thread is for the BRJ Black Friday Run. If anyone would like to post shop visits, endorsee news, etc. feel free to make a proper thread in the proper forum section. *


----------



## MTech

MaxOfMetal said:


> *Final warning. *
> 
> *This thread is for the BRJ Black Friday Run. If anyone would like to post shop visits, endorsee news, etc. feel free to make a proper thread in the proper forum section. *



The guitars Bern & Jens are holding are BFR Guitars, I'm pretty sure the BFR owners would be extremely stoked to see a member of meshuggah has handled their guitars. What sub forum is it okay for things to be posted in then? They wanna know what's with the hate on Bernie and not wanting Jens on the board either now??


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I'm not debating this. Jens, or Bernie holding up pieces of wood doesn't count as BFR guitars. Nor is the fact Jens picked out a top. 

Like I said, you're free to post all that stuff in a seperate thread. Not sure what's so hard to grasp here.


----------



## MTech

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'm not debating this. Jens, or Bernie holding up pieces of wood doesn't count as BFR guitars.



I had a photo of Jens & Bernie holding up customers BFR's with ALL BFR's in the background as well as posts stating what guitars Bernie is working on ALL BFR'S, and you took them down.... You didn't answer what subforum it's ok to post the things going on with Bernie that won't get deleted.


----------



## noob_pwn

Hey guys, Bern sent me pics of mine the other day and I thought I'd post.
Was originally built as a 6, but seeing as I'm now playing 7's he sold that as stock and built me a 27" 7. What a dude. I've had him build me two guitars in the past and owned a 3rd. Great guy, fantastic guitars.


----------



## JPMike

I want my BRJs, so jelly seeing others guitars.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8218/bernieandmyaxe.jpg

Thanks for the pic MTech


----------



## toiletstand

looking good!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MTech said:


> I had a photo of Jens & Bernie holding up customers BFR's with ALL BFR's in the background as well as posts stating what guitars Bernie is working on ALL BFR'S, and you took them down.... You didn't answer what subforum it's ok to post the things going on with Bernie that won't get deleted.



None. Any pics of Bernie of his endorsees are not allowed here. Ever. We just all hate the ever living shit out of him. He should learn to be more like KxK and Jackson who are the best sponsors this forum has never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down, never gonna run around and desert you. 

Nah, just joking. Haha. 

Pics of shops can go in the Dealer section, like they have been for the past two years. Other folks who have done your job in the past have been pretty good about that, namely Keith, Nick and Rhoadkiller. I don't see why that's so difficult. A quick search shows three or so shop visits for Bernie, and only until very recently has it been a big issue that's getting folk's panties in a bunch. 

Also, it's not my job to follow what all guitars are, or are not BFRs. For all I know they all are, and they all aren't. Perhaps help us all out and just post guitars instead of Bernie playing with wood, as fun as playing with wood is. 

I don't know why you and Bernie feel like you deserve preferential treatment. You're being treated the same way Rob from KxK, Grossman, Jim from S7, Huf, Halo, etc. are. I'm sorry if Bernie put himself in a situation where things can be tense and he feels we are the cause of it. Once again, not sure how that could have happened.

All are equal. While some might not like that, that's how we roll here.


----------



## TomAwesome

Pascal-Darrell said:


> http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8218/bernieandmyaxe.jpg
> 
> Thanks for the pic MTech



Dayum!


----------



## killertone

Just got a hi res pic of my guitar. I am going with my original guitar and not the rebuild. The top is unreal and perfectly matched. The differences in the pic are only due to MTech's flash, the top is matched perfectly. Thanks for the pic MTech.


----------



## ras1988

killertone said:


> Just got a hi res pic of my guitar. I am going with my original guitar and not the rebuild. The top is unreal and perfectly matched. The differences in the pic are only due to MTech's flash, the top is matched perfectly. Thanks for the pic MTech.



Are you serious? That was going to get scrapped? Gotta go search the dumpster by Bernie's and get lots of glue and clamps if he gets rid of them by the old Gibson method.


----------



## MJS

Wow... love that top. 

I just had to go back through the thread to figure out why that would be rebuilt (pic of the back). 

Yeah... as much as I don't like when backs are off by that much, I wouldn't reject that one either after seeing the front. I'd probably have the back painted black, but that's just me (just the body, not the neck). 




ras1988 said:


> Are you serious? That was going to get scrapped? Gotta go search the dumpster by Bernie's and get lots of glue and clamps if he gets rid of them by the old Gibson method.



I could be wrong, but I doubt he'd scrap it over that. I'd guess that he'd paint the back and just sell it as an in-stock guitar, since there's really nothing wrong with it.


----------



## killertone

MJS said:


> Wow... love that top.
> 
> I just had to go back through the thread to figure out why that would be rebuilt (pic of the back).
> 
> Yeah... as much as I don't like when backs are off by that much, I wouldn't reject that one either after seeing the front. I'd probably have the back painted black, but that's just me (just the body, not the neck).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could be wrong, but I doubt he'd scrap it over that. I'd guess that he'd paint the back and just sell it as an in-stock guitar, since there's really nothing wrong with it.



Back will be painted black, neck will be satin, and the top is getting this finish:


----------



## JPMike

Looks amazing, I really wanna see all these NGDs popping up!!


----------



## travis bickle

killertone said:


> Just got a hi res pic of my guitar. I am going with my original guitar and not the rebuild. The top is unreal and perfectly matched. The differences in the pic are only due to MTech's flash, the top is matched perfectly. Thanks for the pic MTech.



sweet mother of god that is perfect. there will be an insane wave of ngd coming. now to contain myself from ordering another one.


----------



## MTech

MJS said:


> I could be wrong, but I doubt he'd scrap it over that. I'd guess that he'd paint the back and just sell it as an in-stock guitar, since there's really nothing wrong with it.



That one he'd just tell people (as he told the original buyer) the back was like that and see what they wanted to do and as I suggested to him have it painted black because the top looks insane in person...it's being stained right now so I may have photos a little later.

After being here for over a week I can see why it takes Bernie so long because people blow up his phone NONE STOP on the BFR's for status, to change specs over and over, to switch colors and then he's gotta order parts, wait for manufactures to send parts, deal with computer issues (trying to match color perfect on photos and print labels to send FedEx) it all adds up. Not including what's in production in the woodshop he's got over 220 guitars in here and 3/4 of them have to be finished by Bernie himself! I took all day to pull guitars off the rack and shoot photos for him/edit them down/get specs and post them all up to sell on here yesterday. He's working on three Hesperian 8's and a Vixen 7 simultaneously right now. Now I'm trying to continue doing that while taking breaks to shoot you guys BFR shots when I can including an action shot here or there...


----------



## Larrikin666

I got an awesome shot of Bernie working on one of my 627s. Hell yes.


----------



## Hollowway

Man, I appreciate that he's willing to let people make the changes and all, but there comes a time when I think he's gotta put his foot down. I worry that with all the change orders he's spending time on he's adding further delays to his business. And that just can't be good for his reputation. At any rate, I'm excitedly awaiting mine. And I'm reluctant to call or email him, because I know all that adds up, time wise. That's why it's cool that you're hanging out down there to get pictures to allow him to work on the builds. (Snap one of my 2 if you get a chance, btw!)


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> Just got a hi res pic of my guitar. I am going with my original guitar and not the rebuild. The top is unreal and perfectly matched. The differences in the pic are only due to MTech's flash, the top is matched perfectly. Thanks for the pic MTech.


No Prob! Also we didn't realize it till yesterday hat your rebuild is already out of woodshop so since it's stock he gave me the decision of what color to do on it since you're keeping the original... I know how much you guys liked that oil wax finish charcoal in the dealers section but wait till you see what I got Ed to do on this one...all I gotta say is silver. 



Hollowway said:


> Man, I appreciate that he's willing to let people make the changes and all, but there comes a time when I think he's gotta put his foot down. I worry that with all the change orders he's spending time on he's adding further delays to his business. And that just can't be good for his reputation. At any rate, I'm excitedly awaiting mine. And I'm reluctant to call or email him, because I know all that adds up, time wise. That's why it's cool that you're hanging out down there to get pictures to allow him to work on the builds. (Snap one of my 2 if you get a chance, btw!)



Well if you need something then definitely shoot me a PM &/or email Bernie because obviously if you need a spec change (specs dealing with wood/scale/inlay etc) it needs to be noted asap. Finished, hardware color, pickups all are done last and he messages before doing these to double check so that is not a concern. I will note though that you guys gotta realize Ed hand makes all the colors etc unless it's a stock color you can buy. So for those guys who want specific colors make sure you have the actual name of it or a good hi res photo. I had to identify a few colors for them while I was here like tigers eye, cognac, and road flare red because the color they thought it was or were shown wasn't accurate. 
There should be a line but it's really a double edged sword..he wants to make sure he builds you exactly what you want...but at the same time it is time consuming. He's got all these guitars in here and I have been helping out a ton while I have been here but even still I see how hard it is. There's a few people who email, call, text, PM pretty much every other day. I've said before he works on them in batches, not 1-2-3-4 solely working 1 at a time, and now that I've been here first hand I can say this... The photo above of him drilling...he was working on FOUR guitars today they all needed bridges mounted, holes drilled, Ferrules put in place etc. The plan was to get at least 1-2 of them totally finished but so much of the above happened that none of them could get finished. The normal UPS guy got sick and the guy replacing him never stopped today or yesterday but claimed to his boss he did (which he didn't because I heard him drive past and the paint guy saw him & even unlocked the door for him to come in when he was done delivering to the other businesses) so they shipped a bunch of figured wood back to sender. So add in dealing with the shipping company, trying to get the color on 3 guitars (today alone), then calling a few people back on their guitars he just shipped wed to see how they like them. It's about midnight and I'm taking a break from editing photos of stock guitars to be listed to reply to you. Meanwhile Bernie is planning to get into the shop around 8am to work on the guitars on a Saturday!

I am in the same bind as you guys and I am frustrated because I want my guitar but it's not Bernie at fault here. My guitar was in my hands but it still needs frets, bridge etc... He's waiting on my bridge to come which the manufacture is taking forever to send it to him (Pascals is probably the same bind as me because we have the same bridge) I even said something to the manufacture at NAMM because the Rep was staying at the same hotel as me and I ran into her after one of the parties. 

Anyway tomorrow is probably the last day I'll be out here at the shop so if you need photos or anything like that be sure to PM me STAT!


----------



## SpaceDock

I'll just leave this here, thank mtech.


----------



## trippled

.


----------



## Hollowway

trippled said:


> I have no clue when I'm going to see my guitar, I see so many build pics of BFR's here and I probably ordered mine allot before these guys, as far as I know my guitar wasn't even made yet, hence why I felt comfortable changing the shape.



Yeah, I was one of the first 5 for the 8 strings, too. Mine had to get a complete rebuild, so I figure I'm at the back of the line, so that may well be what happened with yours as well. If you actually could still change the body style my guess is it's not even been started. I'm not sure how he does the order of builds, but I know he's still got customs in process from before the BFR (one of mine) so my guess would be that he's also trying to finish those up, too. Not sure what the ETA would be, though. Did you PM MTech? He's still out there for the day.


----------



## MTech

trippled said:


> You Know, as much as I admire bernie, he wasn't suppoused to take that many orders and get into a situation where he can't handle the workload.
> 
> I did make a lot of changes, I even converted my guitar to be a jekyll slant top instead of the hesperian lately since I saw alot of hesperians in this thread that were looking really different from the original shape and I didn't like what I saw



They aren't all BFR'S it's ALL the guitars he's got ordered period. Obviously if you change the body shape, which you just said you did, he'd have to start the build all over. Which means your original guitar would be finished in woodshop and put up as a stock guitar. These guitars are done more by hand than pretty much everybody else out there from what I've seen so it takes time. Given the fact people wait much longer for guitars not nearly as handbuilt I'd say it's amazing Bernie can crank them out as fast as he does get them out.


----------



## Larrikin666

trippled said:


> You Know, as much as I admire bernie, he wasn't suppoused to take that many orders and get into a situation where he can't handle the workload.
> 
> I did make a lot of changes, I even converted my guitar to be a jekyll slant top instead of the hesperian lately since I saw alot of hesperians in this thread that were looking really different from the original shape and I didn't like what I saw si I asked bernie to do so only if it won't cause another delay.
> 
> I know he is trying hard but honestly after being one of the first 5 people that paid the deposit on the BFR and after waiting for a year and 2 months this is completely exaggerated, I emailed him in the beginning of this month regarding the current turn around and didn't recieve a response yet - at this point I'm truely considering selling my spot even though he made any chage I've asked for, I have no clue when I'm going to see my guitar, I see so many build pics of BFR's here and I probably ordered mine allot before these guys, as far as I know my guitar wasn't even made yet, hence why I felt comfortable changing the shape.



If you're selling...I'm buying. LOL. That's pretty much a standing offer for literally anyone who gets sick of waiting. I got my build order in EARLY and I did not make a single change. That's why I had my 727 in hand quickly. I already bought some user slots, and I'll continue to snatch up additional slots as they become available. I think you'll regret bailing at this point though. I remember that feeling of frustration and uncertainty. ALL of that disappeared the moment I got the guitar in my hands. Seriously. It's worth every second you wait.


----------



## trippled

.


----------



## trippled

Larrikin666 said:


> If you're selling...I'm buying. LOL. That's pretty much a standing offer for literally anyone who gets sick of waiting. I got my build order in EARLY and I did not make a single change. That's why I had my 727 in hand quickly. I already bought some user slots, and I'll continue to snatch up additional slots as they become available. I think you'll regret bailing at this point though. I remember that feeling of frustration and uncertainty. ALL of that disappeared the moment I got the guitar in my hands. Seriously. It's worth every second you wait.



Not if it won't happen in the next half year, I've been waiting patiently so much time and read all these frustrated posts and never said anything but I'm really getting tired of this..


----------



## Isan

trippled said:


> Not if it won't happen in the next half year, I've been waiting patiently so much time and read all these frustrated posts and never said anything but I'm really getting tired of this..



I am too


----------



## MTech

trippled said:


> Not if it won't happen in the next half year, I've been waiting patiently so much time and read all these frustrated posts and never said anything but I'm really getting tired of this..


Well you never messaged me and I have been out an entire week. I sat online talkin to larkin while I looked at ALL 3 of his guitars and sent him photos. I'm on the way to the airport now so I can't walk over pull your order paper and find your guitar. Bernie did everyone a favor with having such an insanely cheap sale and Larkin understands this hence he's got 3 and looking for more. The spots are in high demand because that pricing will never happen again. Not to mention if you sell your guitar you'd be able to make a big profit. I walked all over NAMM lookin at other companies etc and nobody had the same attention to detail yet some charge way more than Bernie & nobody complains there.... That's including builders who take even longer to complete. You're going off about a half price sale waiting 1 year for meanwhile I ordered my guitar back in 2007 got it in 2009 and thanks to the wood distributor supplying the wrong species had to return it for a rebuild... Which is what I've got in final assembly phase just now. Am I happy it took so long? NO, but you don't see me crying over it because I know what the final product is and I know he's actually working on it/has it almost complete.


----------



## trippled

.


----------



## toiletstand

im actually tryign to get the money together to pick up another bfr spot.


----------



## Rook

Can we have a formal BRJ thread in the Dealer section? I wanna get involved in this etc, see if I can get a little info on when my build starts as I don't wanna bug Bernie or fill up his inbox with pointless questions...

Please?


----------



## MTech

I'd start one but I'm literally boarding a plane and sending the guy above his status lol 
PM me if you need a status and I'll put you on list...look at the rack photos I posted as those are the ones up for assembly/completion.


----------



## Phrygian

Just so it's said: I'll seriously consider picking up another spot if anyone is selling a 7 or 8string lefty. Other than that, thanks Mtech for taking a little bit of the pressure of Bernies back and giving us GREAT updates and photos!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Bernie just sent me this little update on my Hesperian 8


----------



## Larrikin666

Wow. I absolutely love that purple.


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> Wow. I absolutely love that purple.



it's actually like a cobalt blue with violet through it. I used the good camera to realla get him a good size photo and try to show the color true as possible... it's GORGEOUS and the neck feels great.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

MTech said:


> it's actually like a cobalt blue with violet through it. I used the good camera to realla get him a good size photo and try to show the color true as possible... it's GORGEOUS and the neck feels great.



So, you handled it? Can you tell me a bit more details about it, how does it feel in person?  Really can't wait to have it...


----------



## kruneh

Looks stunning!
Really like the red one in the back too.


----------



## MTech

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> So, you handled it? Can you tell me a bit more details about it, how does it feel in person?  Really can't wait to have it...


Pretty much checked out every guitar in there since I was shooting photos for the stock guitars an djust seeing what was up with the BFR's/guitars in assembly. I was really surprised how light the guitars are with no hardware on them. Also after playing some of the other brands at NAMM I appreciate the shape and thickness of Bernie's necks even more. It seems like the new trend is making fretboards extremely wide and flat so they feel like a 2x4...I don't like that.. However on all the 727/824's etc the neck is very very comfortable and you can easily lay fours index across the entire fretboard. 
That Blue/Violet color Ed actually mixed up an entire bottle of when he made the one that sold in the dealer section so he used the same stuff for yours as well as the stock guitar I asked him to stain that color then oil/wax over it so it's got that silky matte finish going on. The way the light hits it makes it change from Blue to Violet so the more of an angle you get the more violet it turns but the blue is a very rich cobalt. It reminds me of what this guy did on his car just put on a figured maple top as a stain and black enhanced


----------



## Rook

I want a guitar that colour immediately.


----------



## andrx

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Bernie just sent me this little update on my Hesperian 8


effettivamente è la più bella


----------



## geofreesun

I would love to hear some updates on mine as well. MTech, I sent you a PM last week, can you put me on the list as well (about the rebuild)


----------



## toiletstand

that single cut on the rack looks awesome


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

MTech said:


> Pretty much checked out every guitar in there since I was shooting photos for the stock guitars an djust seeing what was up with the BFR's/guitars in assembly. I was really surprised how light the guitars are with no hardware on them. Also after playing some of the other brands at NAMM I appreciate the shape and thickness of Bernie's necks even more. It seems like the new trend is making fretboards extremely wide and flat so they feel like a 2x4...I don't like that.. However on all the 727/824's etc the neck is very very comfortable and you can easily lay fours index across the entire fretboard.
> That Blue/Violet color Ed actually mixed up an entire bottle of when he made the one that sold in the dealer section so he used the same stuff for yours as well as the stock guitar I asked him to stain that color then oil/wax over it so it's got that silky matte finish going on. The way the light hits it makes it change from Blue to Violet so the more of an angle you get the more violet it turns but the blue is a very rich cobalt. It reminds me of what this guy did on his car just put on a figured maple top as a stain and black enhanced



Thank you so much man, I really really appreciate. Virtual hug <3


----------



## VILARIKA

Did Bernie give discounts to anyone that had to have their order rebuilt because of some sort of flaw during the building process?


----------



## killertone

VILARIKA said:


> Did Bernie give discounts to anyone that had to have their order rebuilt because of some sort of flaw during the building process?



He offered me free upgrades which I took. I am satisfied with my situation.


----------



## TomAwesome

Any more info on that single cut?


----------



## glassmoon0fo

TomAwesome said:


> Any more info on that single cut?


 
when he called about my build, i mentioned the singlecut shape and he said it'd be available in 6, 7, and 8 strings, and that he had a bridge built by hipshot specifically for this guitar so that he could angle the neck correctly. how awesome is that?! If money allows, I'll be ordering one in 8 string format later this year


----------



## MTech

geofreesun said:


> I would love to hear some updates on mine as well. MTech, I sent you a PM last week, can you put me on the list as well (about the rebuild)



I'm back home and Bernie is out today..all the remaining people who need status that sent me their full name I'm supposed to get the info on this week.



toiletstand said:


> that single cut on the rack looks awesome


It's a BFR guitar that an artist ordered, it's a 7 string LP shaped slant top.



VILARIKA said:


> Did Bernie give discounts to anyone that had to have their order rebuilt because of some sort of flaw during the building process?


The guitars are already half off, he let them change the finish or things like that at no upcharge to be nice. Some of the rebuilds have been very fast though, there's a lefty rebuild he's got in paint already but the buyer decided to go with the original so I actually picked out the finish on the new one which will go into stock sale.



glassmoon0fo said:


> when he called about my build, i mentioned the singlecut shape and he said it'd be available in 6, 7, and 8 strings, and that he had a bridge built by hipshot specifically for this guitar so that he could angle the neck correctly. how awesome is that?! If money allows, I'll be ordering one in 8 string format later this year


All of his Hipshots are custom built to special specs for Bernie. Plus I was hanging out with the head of Hipshot for quite awhile at NAMM and gave him some new ideas he's extremely excited about so expect to see some bridges that no other manufacture makes.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

He's waiting on my bridge to come which the manufacture is taking forever to send it to him (Pascals is probably the same bind as me because we have the same bridge)

_So you also got a hipshot bridge with piezo saddles from garphtech ?

What´s the big problem with these bridges ? are they so hard to get ?


_


----------



## MTech

Pascal-Darrell said:


> _So you also got a hipshot bridge with piezo saddles from garphtech ?
> 
> What´s the big problem with these bridges ? are they so hard to get ?
> 
> 
> _



Yea, and no they're not. You have to either buy from them directly or you buy bridge wherever and have them sent to Graphtech who then has to drill them out for the wiring for the Piezo and mount the saddles..... He ordered them forever ago and they're still taking their dandy time. I said something to the sales person at NAMM (she was really nice) and then Bernie talked to her once I got up to the shop and told him what she'd said. She says they're pushing to get them out ASAP.

He needs the bridge before he can begin to drill the mounts, lineup the pickups etc etc.... So your guitar is on the top row on the rack w/ the plastic over it and mine is on the metal rack on wheels right in front of the wall. There's a bunch which he's waiting for the buyers to supply their pickups for as well.

*Who has their panties in a bunch that they Neg Rep me for stating somebody that wanted status & didn't have it never messaged me while I was right there with Bernie? Pretty ridiculous..... especially when the reason the persons build is taking so long is they took forever to finalize their specs before even getting the order in*


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

MTech said:


> Yea, and no they're not. You have to either buy from them directly or you buy bridge wherever and have them sent to Graphtech who then has to drill them out for the wiring for the Piezo and mount the saddles..... He ordered them forever ago and they're still taking their dandy time. I said something to the sales person at NAMM (she was really nice) and then Bernie talked to her once I got up to the shop and told him what she'd said. She says they're pushing to get them out ASAP.
> 
> He needs the bridge before he can begin to drill the mounts, lineup the pickups etc etc.... So your guitar is on the top row on the rack w/ the plastic over it and mine is on the metal rack on wheels right in front of the wall. There's a bunch which he's waiting for the buyers to supply their pickups for as well.




I hope they will be ready soon...
wondered why the guitar wasn´t getting further in the build process...

but if they really try to push them out asap it should be fine, I guess...


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> That one he'd just tell people (as he told the original buyer) the back was like that and see what they wanted to do and as I suggested to him have it painted black because the top looks insane in person...*it's being stained right now so I may have photos a little later.*


----------



## Hollowway

Donde esta single cut? I don't remember seeing anything on that other than the mockups. Is there a photo of one being built that I missed?


----------



## SpaceDock

^look on the rack next to Bernie in the eight string pic.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> ^look on the rack next to Bernie in the eight string pic.



Ah, I see it! I was thinking it was the tele model...


----------



## MTech

Hollowway said:


> Ah, I see it! I was thinking it was the tele model...



There's 2 Tele's in woodshop right now, an 8 & a baritone 6 for my buddy that replaced Wes Borland in Limp Bizkit.


----------



## toiletstand

mike smith?
cant wait to see those teles


----------



## mikernaut

I thought Bulb mentioned something about a Singlecut awhile back from BRJ?


----------



## ToupaTroopa

I will also gladly pick up someone's spot if it's an 8 string that isn't finished yet. I want an all rosewood neck if possible.


----------



## trippled

Well, bernie sent me 2 tops to choose from today, went with this one(looks fuckin amazing imho:






Can't wait!


----------



## SpaceDock

ToupaTroopa said:


> I will also gladly pick up someone's spot if it's an 8 string that isn't finished yet. I want an all rosewood neck if possible.



That would be awesome, but I doubt it will happen, rosewood neck I mean.


----------



## EOT

trippled said:


> Well, bernie sent me 2 tops to choose from today, went with this one(looks fuckin amazing imho:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait!



What is it!? That's going to be sweet!


----------



## SpaceDock

Wow, calling Rico is so much faster than email. He really wants to make sure people can communicate him during MTech's ban.


----------



## Lirtle

SpaceDock said:


> That would be awesome, but I doubt it will happen, rosewood neck I mean.



I was quoted an additional 600 for a rosewood neck.


----------



## SpaceDock

That's way cheaper than I would have thought


----------



## trippled

EOT said:


> What is it!? That's going to be sweet!



Suppoused to be burl maple, doesn't look like burl though, very cool top imho.


----------



## Rook

Lirtle said:


> I was quoted an additional 600 for a rosewood neck.



I was quoted 700, but mine's neck through.


----------



## Larrikin666

Hey guys. Feel free to PM me as well if you have any questions or concerns about your orders. I've talked to Bernie a ton recently. He asked me to help handle everything until MTech is back.


----------



## Larrikin666

New picture from Bernie


----------



## Lirtle

That maple board is sickkkkk


----------



## ToupaTroopa

SpaceDock said:


> That would be awesome, but I doubt it will happen, rosewood neck I mean.



I can always dream


----------



## SpaceDock

I think these will looks really hot once the hardware goes on. I've got two of these, one six one seven, and I'm trying really hard to imagine them completed. The black hardware on these natural finishes is really going to pop.

Larrikin666, I totally nabbed that seven a few days ago!


----------



## TomAwesome

I finished paying mine off last night. I R EXCITEBIKE


----------



## glassmoon0fo

TomAwesome said:


> I finished paying mine off last night. I R EXCITEBIKE


 
Same here dude!


----------



## SpaceDock

^ does that mean the guitars are ready for shipment or close to completion? Is he calling or sending emails now before shipment? I remember the 7/8 switcharoo and another guy that had no shipment notice, I hope he is confirming beforehand to avoid mistakes.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

He sent me the link and said all that was left to do was wire the pups and file the nut, that was on friday. From the way it was done, I dont expect that there would be any mix-ups


----------



## Khoi

SpaceDock said:


> ^ does that mean the guitars are ready for shipment or close to completion? Is he calling or sending emails now before shipment? I remember the 7/8 switcharoo and another guy that had no shipment notice, I hope he is confirming beforehand to avoid mistakes.



close to completion. I paid for mine on Jan 8th and it still hasn't shipped, but the clear coat had to be redone on mine =/ 

I assume the people who have recently paid the remaining balance are part of the 30 guitar patch that were about 3-4 weeks to be done


----------



## VILARIKA

Larrikin666 said:


> Hey guys. Feel free to PM me as well if you have any questions or concerns about your orders. I've talked to Bernie a ton recently. He asked me to help handle everything until MTech is back.



Hey man, I sent you a pm!


----------



## Larrikin666

VILARIKA said:


> Hey man, I sent you a pm!



Got it. Updates for you and Fun coming tomorrow.


----------



## Rook

Just to note, mine's not BFR so probably don't wanna post it here 

Really grateful dude, thanks.


----------



## Larrikin666

Fun111 said:


> Just to note, mine's not BFR so probably don't wanna post it here
> 
> Really grateful dude, thanks.



Good call. I'd be PM'ing that stuff anyways.


----------



## Lirtle

hey larrikin, did you get my pm?


----------



## Larrikin666

Lirtle said:


> hey larrikin, did you get my pm?



Yup. Sent the info to Bernie.


----------



## Lirtle

Thanks a lot man!


----------



## VILARIKA

Anyone get updates on their orders? It's been pretty quiet as of late...


----------



## ibanez4lifesz

My BRJ just got here...it was a custom stock order, but I got a picture of 3 other BFR guitars shipping with mine. 

Eric


----------



## VILARIKA

ibanez4lifesz said:


> My BRJ just got here...it was a custom stock order, but I got a picture of 3 other BFR guitars shipping with mine.
> 
> Eric



Just saw your thread man, Happy NGD! 

That finish looks so silky in the sunlight, I could stare at it for days. I love the look, it's smooth, simplistic, and catchy. Your review of the guitar makes me less patient to wait for mine!


----------



## Hollowway

No updates for me. I'm hoping to hear from Larrikin666 or MTech as to the status of mine. My BFR had to be rebuilt and I'm not sure where it is in the process and my custom was supposed to go out about a month ago, iirc.


----------



## Lirtle

Has anyone heard back yet? This is a long time to wait for an update. I know Bernie is busy but...


----------



## glassmoon0fo

yup, just got my completion pic today =). BTW, I'll be selling my second build spot as I have some monster med bills coming up. FS thread in the FS section!


----------



## SpaceDock

Just paid mine off, now the real wait begins!

Does anyone know if Bern sends an email or anything before he ships it or tracking info?


----------



## Larrikin666

Here are a few BFR 8 strings. They'll be heading out the door soon.







Everyone else waiting for updates. They're still coming.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

The one on the right is mines


----------



## TomAwesome

That's mine on the left.


----------



## ras1988

Larrikin666 said:


> Here are a few BFR 8 strings. They'll be heading out the door soon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone else waiting for updates. They're still coming.



These are the types of updates I do like to see, finished guitars ready for shipping. Just good to see Bern getting through the log jam of guitars at a good clip. Quick question to those who have had guitars shipped to them, does Bernie give you a notice of shipping with a tracking number? I am just a little curious because I am going to be away sporadically on business for a week or two and I may need to ask a favor from one of the neighbors to sign for and hold onto the package(s) as they come in.


----------



## VILARIKA

A couple more posted, ready to ship:






Haven't received much info on my order for quite awhile now, but i'm happy to see that people are getting theirs guitars in


----------



## ticklemeasian

does anyone have a picture of how bernie's charcoal burst look? i got a spot and that's the finish i am thinking of getting on it.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

ras1988 said:


> These are the types of updates I do like to see, finished guitars ready for shipping. Just good to see Bern getting through the log jam of guitars at a good clip. Quick question to those who have had guitars shipped to them, does Bernie give you a notice of shipping with a tracking number? I am just a little curious because I am going to be away sporadically on business for a week or two and I may need to ask a favor from one of the neighbors to sign for and hold onto the package(s) as they come in.


 
Mine hasnt shipped yet, but he mentioned that he ships all his guitars with a sig required, so I think you're good


----------



## JP Universe

I have followed this thread for around 9 months now and now i'm finally a part of the BF special!!!! Thanks to Thrsher for a smooth and easy transaction 

Specs

8 string Hesperian
Mahogony neck and body
flamed top
bridge only pickup bk painkiller
27.5 scale
sperzel tuners


----------



## ticklemeasian

i just got my hands on 2 spots, and i really want one of them to have a rosewood neck/mahogany wings. how much does bernie charge for something like that?


----------



## Hollowway

ticklemeasian said:


> i just got my hands on 2 spots, and i really want one of them to have a rosewood neck/mahogany wings. how much does bernie charge for something like that?



My guess is that your guitars are probably in woodshop at the very least, so it might be too late to change the wood on them. You could always call and ask him, though. You'll get a lot farther than asking people on here because it's right from the man himself.


----------



## Rook

The rosewood thru neck on my 6 was a $750 up charge.


----------



## ticklemeasian

Hollowway said:


> My guess is that your guitars are probably in woodshop at the very least, so it might be too late to change the wood on them. You could always call and ask him, though. You'll get a lot farther than asking people on here because it's right from the man himself.



one of them has not even enter woodshop yet. bernie and i are trying to finalize the specs right now. the other one is a standard specs 8 string. that one i am keeping as it is.


----------



## HeadBender

Finally I was lucky enough to get one 

727 - Cant wait to get it


----------



## MetalDaze

Black Friday Run;
That day was so long ago.
When will you arrive?


----------



## HeadBender

I guess in 10 days I will have it. Leaving USA tomorrow if all goes ok. The original owner received it a couple of days ago, but as he sadi 1 srting more than suits him....


----------



## Khoi

do all the BFR guitars come with a shirt???


----------



## themike

ticklemeasian said:


> i just got my hands on 2 spots, and i really want one of them to have a rosewood neck/mahogany wings. how much does bernie charge for something like that?


 
Bernie charges $400 upgrade for a Rosewood neck.

With that being said, you would have to ask him if it's acceptable to change on a Black Friday guitar. Those specs are kind of locked in stone unless he has spoken to you and offered it.


----------



## Larrikin666

Khoi said:


> do all the BFR guitars come with a shirt???



Yes. You were suppose to specify which size when you placed the order.


----------



## Hollowway

th3m1ke said:


> Bernie charges $400 upgrade for a Rosewood neck.
> 
> With that being said, you would have to ask him if it's acceptable to change on a Black Friday guitar. Those specs are kind of locked in stone unless he has spoken to you and offered it.



Wait, Fun111 said his was $750. Did you get a rosewood neck on yours?


----------



## Lirtle

This was stated earlier but I was quoted 600


----------



## leonardo7

Theres gonna be different prices depending on scale length and whether its a 6, 7 or 8 string plus dealer prices and availability change from time to time. Also, Id imagine that if your spec'ing out a 4K custom as opposed to a $2600 custom that a builder might shave the price on some things if its a super expensive build. I have no idea really but Im betting there are numerous factors that could affect the price difference of a rosewood neck upgrade.


----------



## Locrian

Hoping to hear an update soon.


----------



## Lirtle

Seriously. He's promised me an update every day for the past week and a half.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Looking good


----------



## VILARIKA

Lirtle said:


> Seriously. He's promised me an update every day for the past week and a half.



I emailed him yesterday and he said he was expecting a grandchild very soon. Still, he said he would give me an update by today, but I haven't received any mail yet. Given his situation, it's understandable. I say give it a couple more days and he will get back to giving people updates.


----------



## leonardo7

VILARIKA said:


> I emailed him yesterday and he said he was expecting a grandson very soon. Still, he said he would give me an update by today, but I haven't received any mail yet. Given his situation, it's understandable. I say give it a couple more days and he will get back to giving people updates.



Well that's cool his daughter is having a boy. That way he might be able to carry on the family tradition someday. Unless his daughter is into it.


----------



## VILARIKA

leonardo7 said:


> Well that's cool his daughter is having a boy. That way he might be able to carry on the family tradition someday. Unless his daughter is into it.



Meant to say grandchild, i'm not sure if it's a girl or boy.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

leonardo7 said:


> Well that's cool his daughter is having a boy. That way he might be able to carry on the family tradition someday. Unless his daughter is into it.



Unfortunately his daughter isn't into it...I guess we have to leave da job fo da boyz


----------



## Hollowway

I emailed him for an update and he apologized for the long wait and said its getting close. No specific date, though.


----------



## leonardo7

You guys should all just give Bernie a break! Let the man have a life! He knows whats going on and hes not gonna start slacking just because people stop calling and emailing him. I honestly dont think it helps to bug him so much. Just let the man do his job. Hes getting shit done, its just taking longer than expected but honestly thats the norm with a swamped custom shop. Just let him do what he does and everyones guitars will be done ASAP! Say what you want and do what you want but thats just what I would do, wait that is what Im doing! Ive got two builds with him and Im relaxed about it. No stress here.


----------



## Locrian

leonardo7 said:


> You guys should all just give Bernie a break! Let the man have a life! He knows whats going on and hes not gonna start slacking just because people stop calling and emailing him. I honestly dont think it helps to bug him so much. Just let the man do his job. Hes getting shit done, its just taking longer than expected but honestly thats the norm with a swamped custom shop. Just let him do what he does and everyones guitars will be done ASAP! Say what you want and do what you want but thats just what I would do, wait that is what Im doing! Ive got two builds with him and Im relaxed about it. No stress here.



I'm not stressed, just want to know the status of my build. I've been asking for an update for about 8 months now. I check in every one or two months and ask for an update on my build, and get told I'll hear something soon. I still have absolutely no idea what stage my guitar is in, if it's even started or if it's about to be finished, no clue whatsoever. I'm not in a rush, just would like some kind of information so I can figure out if I need to hold on to some cash, or if I can waste it on hookers and blow or whatever. I certainly don't harass the guy.


----------



## Hollowway

leonardo7 said:


> You guys should all just give Bernie a break! Let the man have a life! He knows whats going on and hes not gonna start slacking just because people stop calling and emailing him. I honestly dont think it helps to bug him so much. Just let the man do his job. Hes getting shit done, its just taking longer than expected but honestly thats the norm with a swamped custom shop. Just let him do what he does and everyones guitars will be done ASAP! Say what you want and do what you want but thats just what I would do, wait that is what Im doing! Ive got two builds with him and Im relaxed about it. No stress here.



How long have you been waiting for your builds?


----------



## leonardo7

Locrian said:


> I'm not stressed, just want to know the status of my build. I've been asking for an update for about 8 months now. I check in every one or two months and ask for an update on my build, and get told I'll hear something soon. I still have absolutely no idea what stage my guitar is in, if it's even started or if it's about to be finished, no clue whatsoever. I'm not in a rush, just would like some kind of information so I can figure out if I need to hold on to some cash, or if I can waste it on hookers and blow or whatever. I certainly don't harass the guy.



Totally makes sense and I agree that its too bad that he cant just give a simple status update. Unfortunately I dont think its such a simple task for him. Obviously right?? I mean, 200 people checking in once every month or two over a 10 month time period is 20-40 people potentially checking in every 4 weeks or so, not to mention the daily pricing and new customer inquiries, the people who email several times and then the people he is actually communicating with already. Ive been to his shop and seen his office. He has a file on every single build and rows and rows of hundreds of guitars. Obviously he doesnt know whats up off the top of his head. He would have to drop everything hes doing at the time he reads your email, find your file and then locate and find out whats up with it. Then after he has located your file from 200 of them, and then checked in with his wood shop guys and hear back from them, he then has to write that shit down and then go to the computer and find your email after probably getting 100 more emails since then, and email you back about it. By the time he even checks on your build he has probably gotten 100 other emails to sort through. And while dealing with all of this stuff lets not forget what he does best which is actually work on the guitars! He has to work on guitars too! He knows he took too many orders. He told me himself that hes aware of whats going on. Hes workin hard! Its not like hes gonna just hit you up and say OK your build is done, you have 3 days to make payment or it gets sold!


----------



## leonardo7

Hollowway said:


> How long have you been waiting for your builds?



Both are Black friday builds. I actually visited the man at his shop when we were on tour in October and one was in woodshop. That was 4 months ago. He asked me what color I wanted it to be about 2 months ago and emailed me about knob placement 4 weeks ago. All of this is because I was unable to decide on specs right away. My second build I bought into and we haven't even nailed final specs for it yet.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, I know where you're coming from. I kind of feel the same way. I sat silent for the first year or so with my non BFR custom, and he reached out to me because it needed to be rebuilt. My status updates started when others who ordered after mine got theirs, and I wanted to make sure mine wasn't lost in the mix. My personal opinion is that he (and many luthiers) should hire a part time high school student, or get a work study intern, to take photos and phone calls, etc. Because I agree - I would rather he work on guitars than talk to customers. But he does seem to like that, so that might be his preference.


----------



## Locrian

Didn't really mean for my posts to come off negative at all. I'm honestly stoked to be getting a guitar from the guy, and have no problem even if I have to wait another year for it. I run a small business myself, I get to experience all the fun of that firsthand all the time. Just the tiniest of tiny updates in the world on the status of it would work for me.


----------



## toiletstand

from Bernie's Facebook:

*Earlier this evening Bernie Rico Jr. was informed that his Grandmother has passed away. This is a very sad day for the Rico family. Due to this tragedy Bernie will temporarily be unavailable attending to this family matter. In advance he thanks you for your understanding during this very difficult time.*


----------



## VILARIKA

toiletstand said:


> from Bernie's Facebook:
> 
> *Earlier this evening Bernie Rico Jr. was informed that his Grandmother has passed away. This is a very sad day for the Rico family. Due to this tragedy Bernie will temporarily be unavailable attending to this family matter. In advance he thanks you for your understanding during this very difficult time.*



Sorry for his loss, he must have a lot of things going on right now.


----------



## Rook

Like others have said above, I've emailed him maybe once every couple of months so far, first time was to change a spec, second to see if my build was REALLY going be done by May.

First time he was super responsive, second time he didn't email back at all til a week later when I asked again when he emailed straight back saying he was out and he'd get back to me. As I doubt I'll get a guitar in May ill email him again in April cos I might be in Cali in August so I'll talk about maybe going and saying hi.


----------



## mikernaut

It's pretty hard to get through to him via email. Best bet is probably still to call, although I received an email on friday from him asking me to call him about my guitar.


----------



## Hollowway

Update! Just got this in the email from Bernie. It's going to have a blackburst top with gloss and natural, tung oiled back and sides. That's my favorite BRJ finish combo.


----------



## Phrygian

Photo Update! I am loving the figuring on this!  

I really hope I am seeing correctly when i see a hint of figuring on the fretboard!


----------



## SpaceDock

The pics of my guitar showed some figuring on the board as well, really nice stuff.


----------



## Michael T

Just got an update pic today also !! WOOT !!!
Going to be a Natural high gloss finish


----------



## Fiction

^ Nice figure


----------



## VILARIKA

Glad to see people are getting pic updates, hope to get mine soon also. Did he include any more info on your order besides the pic? Estimated completion date?


----------



## Michael T

^^ no further info, just a picture. he did ask if there were any questions so i shot him a few about completion time and such.


----------



## toiletstand

diva headstock looks sick!


----------



## WickedSymphony

Got this a while ago but never got around to posting it


----------



## geofreesun

got an update as well, so much love!


----------



## toiletstand

classy as fuck dudes. they look great


----------



## Larrikin666

WickedSymphony said:


> Got this a while ago but never got around to posting it




Gorgeous!


----------



## TomAwesome

SpaceDock said:


> Does anyone know if Bern sends an email or anything before he ships it or tracking info?



Anyone else want to comment on this? It would be nice to know without having to bother Bernie about it directly since mine has been done and ready to go for a couple weeks now, but I don't know whether or not it has been shipped, and I wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility for the UPS/USPS/whatever guy to neglect to leave a notice of attempted delivery.


----------



## mountainjam

TomAwesome said:


> Anyone else want to comment on this? It would be nice to know without having to bother Bernie about it directly since mine has been done and ready to go for a couple weeks now, but I don't know whether or not it has been shipped, and I wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility for the UPS/USPS/whatever guy to neglect to leave a notice of attempted delivery.



Bernie sent my guitar fed ex and gave me a tracking #. It wasnt part of the bfr run but I cant imagine hes not doing the same for you guys.


----------



## TomAwesome

All right then, thanks.


----------



## EOT

He didn't send tracking on mine. That was about a year ago though.


----------



## JP Universe

Getting a bright Purple/Pink flamed finish on mine.... Bernies speaking to his painter tomorrow. Got a progress pic as well.... (at work, can't post)

Bernie has been the best communicator so far that i've dealt with when it comes to guitars.


----------



## Hollowway

JP Universe said:


> Getting a bright Purple/Pink flamed finish on mine.... Bernies speaking to his painter tomorrow. Got a progress pic as well.... (at work, can't post)
> 
> Bernie has been the best communicator so far that i've dealt with when it comes to guitars.



Yeah post that pic!

Glad to hear he's been in good contact with you. .Who else have you had make customs for you? .


----------



## JP Universe

There are a few works in progress at the moment... I'd rather not mention any names though


----------



## MatrixClaw

VILARIKA said:


> A couple more posted, ready to ship:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't received much info on my order for quite awhile now, but i'm happy to see that people are getting theirs guitars in



If I'm not mistaken, the second one from the right is mine.

Should be here soon, had some last minute changes


----------



## JP Universe

GASSSSSS..... they are all looking sick. Here is my progress pic


----------



## mikernaut

Nice to see a bunch of updates rolling in. I talked to Bern on the phone the other day about the paint job my guitar is getting. He told me Ed spent a day trying to get the color right and they both weren't sure about the progress. He then emailed over a couple pics and I didn't mind what they had so I said I was fine with the "new-ish color " and to go for it!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

not really build-related, but I just bought that black friday 8 string from ebay . Should be here pretty soon, NGD and review to follow! And for those of you who may be wondering (I doubt anyone follows my posts that well), the money issues with my mom's med bills has been cleared up and all's well =). Been a good week so far 

EDIT: btw, I just realized, it's the guitar from this thread:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...ico-jr-hesperian-827-now-one-more-string.html


----------



## Michael T

I Don't know about the rest of you but i was handling the wait time up until I got that update picture. 
Now all the excitement has sat in and the wait is almost unbearable now.


----------



## AnarchyDivine88

glassmoon0fo said:


> not really build-related, but I just bought that black friday 8 string from ebay . Should be here pretty soon, NGD and review to follow! And for those of you who may be wondering (I doubt anyone follows my posts that well), the money issues with my mom's med bills has been cleared up and all's well =). Been a good week so far
> 
> EDIT: btw, I just realized, it's the guitar from this thread:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...ico-jr-hesperian-827-now-one-more-string.html



GAHH!! You bastard, I was watching that auction waiting to pounce!  Congrats dude, can't wait for the NGD. My only worry about it was when he listed it the first time, this thread was posted http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/188310-brj-hesperian-8-ebay.html and that picture of the fretjob was a little worrisome. He then took that picture off the auction when he relisted it as a buy it now. He said it was just bad lighting making it look like that, so hopefully that's the case. If not though, make sure you report it to ebay and have it taken care of, because he's not aloud to do that if that was the case. I'm sure it's not though.

Again, congrats, that's a sick deal. And if you ever for some reason lose your fucking mind and decide to sell it, let me know first.


----------



## MetalDaze

Bernardo Rico.
Your guitars are beautiful.
One day mine will come.


----------



## Locrian

Awesome to see some people getting updates.


----------



## MTech

toiletstand said:


> mike smith?
> cant wait to see those teles


No, Nate is who recorded the album and Mike toured for it.
The Tele is out of woodshop and i have pictures of it and 2 other new traditional shapes.

Anyway sorry for those of you who had questions or were bummed to not see any photos from NAMM or get any progress updates.

Also Bernie has been busy with the funeral planning etc and the baby didn't come till this week so today is his first day back in the shop.


----------



## Larrikin666

MTech said:


> No, Nate is who recorded the album and Mike toured for it.
> Anyway sorry for those of you who had questions or were bummed to not see any photos from NAMM or get any progress updates.



Oh snap! Who let you back in? LOL. Welcome back.


----------



## MTech

Larrikin666 said:


> Oh snap! Who let you back in? LOL. Welcome back.


Don't even get me started. 
On a side note though get your wallet ready for what I am about to list 



TomAwesome said:


> Anyone else want to comment on this? It would be nice to know without having to bother Bernie about it directly since mine has been done and ready to go for a couple weeks now, but I don't know whether or not it has been shipped, and I wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility for the UPS/USPS/whatever guy to neglect to leave a notice of attempted delivery.


He lets you know when he's shipping it.



MatrixClaw said:


> If I'm not mistaken, the second one from the right is mine.
> 
> Should be here soon, had some last minute changes


I got to check that one out for a bit while I was at the shop and it plays great plus looks classy. Wait till you see how good the bridge looks being as thick as they are custom made for him and gold.



AnarchyDivine88 said:


> GAHH!! You bastard, I was watching that auction waiting to pounce!  Congrats dude, can't wait for the NGD. My only worry about it was when he listed it the first time, this thread was posted http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/188310-brj-hesperian-8-ebay.html and that picture of the fretjob was a little worrisome.



The frets didn't remotely look like that when it shipped and you can ask Larkin cause it was accidentally shipped to him first and he played it and raved over it.


----------



## HRC51

Mr. Rico was kind enough to call me today. He wanted to let me know that he is ready to put the final finish and hardware on my guitar.

He does all the final drilling, nut filing, etc himself. Pretty impressive, but that's what makes them truly hand crafted.

How many Sevenstringer's out there can say that they got to talk to the person that made their guitar? In a world of mass production, that's pretty cool to me.

I can't wait!


----------



## Larrikin666

More update pics for one of my 6's


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Just got in the BFR 8 from Ebay! Setup was shit-tastic from the last seller, but I think it's because he took the tension off of the truss rod. I'm letting the new setup settle for a bit, but what I can tell you is the frets are perfect (so is the rest of the guitar, for that matter), but they're a little rough on the edges, or maybe it just feels that way because the neck is SO RIDICOULOUSLY THIN . I've gotten used to the more substantial S7 neck, so maybe it's just me. The painkillers are awesome once you find the right height for them, but I'm used to darker pickups in such a bright guitar, and I think a set of Warpigs or Black Dogs would work a bit better to warm it up a bit. upper fret access is absoloutly unreal. I'll offer up a proper NGD in the next day or two, along with a comparison to my S7 Cobra Exotic, so stay tuned folks.


----------



## noob_pwn

just got sent this - being prepped for clearcoat.


----------



## Phrygian

That's a smackin guitar noob_pwn!


----------



## ticklemeasian

glassmoon0fo said:


> Just got in the BFR 8 from Ebay! Setup was shit-tastic from the last seller, but I think it's because he took the tension off of the truss rod. I'm letting the new setup settle for a bit, but what I can tell you is the frets are perfect (so is the rest of the guitar, for that matter), but they're a little rough on the edges, or maybe it just feels that way because the neck is SO RIDICOULOUSLY THIN . I've gotten used to the more substantial S7 neck, so maybe it's just me. The painkillers are awesome once you find the right height for them, but I'm used to darker pickups in such a bright guitar, and I think a set of Warpigs or Black Dogs would work a bit better to warm it up a bit. upper fret access is absoloutly unreal. I'll offer up a proper NGD in the next day or two, along with a comparison to my S7 Cobra Exotic, so stay tuned folks.



want to see a video pronto! can't wait to get mine.


----------



## noob_pwn

Phrygian said:


> That's a smackin guitar noob_pwn!



why thankyou! I'm very stoked on it


----------



## HeadBender

HeadBender said:


> Finally I was lucky enough to get one
> 
> 727 - Cant wait to get it




So Guys,

It has arrived today.
My reactions were like this:
- Awsome.....
- Hm well okay, can be fixed
- Well, due to the construction....
- ?
- ??
- ???
- WTF????????????

Namely:
- Looks great for first look.
- Nut was out of its placed, but its only the nut. small amount of glue just to keep it in its place, no more, easy fix
- Balance is bad = Small body + Large neck
- Space between the maple and the ebony at a place, not glued or sanded correctly? Same at some places on the Top at the neck-top joint.
- Lower joint side looks a bit bad (like a small crack)
- Side dots appear to be either painted or just done in a hurry
- I wish they were painted....they are fuckin misplaced after the 12th frets!!!!! Instead of 15-17-19 etc its at 16-18-20-22-25


Any ideas what to do? The original owner who ordered it and just got it sold it immediately as he explained he rather wanted a sixer and not a 7.

So now Im here with it, in the EU, Im not even the original owner and with all these things,


----------



## leonardo7

HeadBender said:


> frets!!!!! Instead of 15-17-19 etc its at 16-18-20-22-25



WTF?!


----------



## MetalDaze

Wow you can totally see that in the picture now that I look closer.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Maybe the guy asked for it that way


----------



## HeadBender

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Maybe the guy asked for it that way



That was my Girlfriend's reaction as well 

I would say: no way


----------



## Phrygian

Holy shit! sorry to hear that dude, that sounds bad :/


----------



## MetalDaze

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Maybe the guy asked for it that way


 
You would think that would be something worth disclosing if you were the seller.


----------



## MetalDaze

Here's a semi-relevant story from the early days of Jackson:




> Charvel/Jackson: Tales From The Shop 1983-1987
> At NAMM this past weekend I had the opportunity to hang out with several original Charvel/Jackson Employees who were there in the early days from '83-86 and they shared TONS of stories/anecdotes...
> 
> "Tales From The Shop'...if you will. I laughed my ass of at most of them but here's one that was taken very seriously and STUCK with all of them.
> 
> This one dates from '84 or '85...none of them could recall exactly.
> 
> *The Lavender Telly*
> One day Mike Eldred was working at the last station on the line doing a final setup on a neck-thru Lavender colored Jackson Telly. Suddenly Mike froze in place. Then He snatched up the guitar quickly and headed across the shop floor directly to Grover's office with the guitar in hand.
> 
> About 5 minutes passed, then PA Loudspeaker in the shop crackled and a loud booming voice said 'Attention: ALL Employees to the shop floor...mandatory Company Meeting NOW!'
> 
> Soon Every Employee in the shop was standing around Grover. He was holding the Lavender Telly in his hands. He said very sternly
> 
> "I want every one of you to look at this guitar, our product, a FINISHED guitar at the end of the line and about to go out the door. Somebody tell me what's wrong with it....Pass it around"
> 
> The guitar was passed around to each employee to look at/inspect. Everything looked in order, fretwork was excellent, the finish was good, it played well, there were seemingly no flaws...no one could see any obvious defects.
> 
> With the guitar back in Grover's hands he says loudly 'WELL??* NOBODY *saw anything wrong??
> 
> Then he held it up high and pointed at the neck at the 12th fret "See this Inlay?" and then he turned it sideways to reveal the side dots perfectly in place ...AT THE ELEVENTH Fret!!!!
> 
> Without another word he walked over to the nearest bandsaw, put on a pair of safety glasses and proceeded to cut the guitar into many pieces....right thru strings, pickups and whatever else was in the path of the blade.
> 
> After it was completely shredded he turned off the saw and declared loudly. "Meeting OVER, now get back to work and stop FUCKING AROUND!" ​


----------



## HeadBender

MetalDaze said:


> You would think that would be something worth disclosing if you were the seller.



I confirmed with the Seller, he did order it with Standard Specs.


----------



## elq

Doh. Did you pay via paypal by chance? If so, file a complaint ASAP.

**elq waits for MTech to come in here and throw a fit that you talked about issues with a BRj guitar.*


----------



## Phrygian

Get skype credit, call Bernie


----------



## HeadBender

elq said:


> Doh. Did you pay via paypal by chance? If so, file a complaint ASAP.
> 
> **elq waits for MTech to come in here and throw a fit that you talked about issues with a BRj guitar.*




Again I got the guitar from the Guy who originally ordered it, so not directly from Bernie.


----------



## SpaceDock

Wtf! That is insane, how is that even possible to have the dots in the wrong places? I have never heard of anything so absurd. Is it really a Rico or is it some sort of knock off?


----------



## elq

HeadBender said:


> Again I got the guitar from the Guy who originally ordered it, so not directly from Bernie.



I understand that. 

Did you pay via paypal? If so, you very well might be able to get your money back.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah the seller not reporting the side dots being abnormal is a pretty big misrepresentation.


----------



## mikernaut

WTF  what is going on at the shop?

Also pretty terrible that the guy that sold it to you didn't mention any of the issues. Did you not see any pictures before you bought it?


----------



## MTech

HeadBender said:


> Again I got the guitar from the Guy who originally ordered it, so not directly from Bernie.



I shot this over to Bernie however IDK how long it's going to take for a reply as the reason I got on was to let yo know he has had yet ANOTHER death in the family. He got a call at 3am from his mother as another family member has passed who was living with her so he's got to take care of that along with the funeral already posted.

Thing is you weren't the original buyer and aside from the side marker issue I'm sure he didn't ship it with issues like that so whatever the guy did before selling it is the real question. Obviously if he received it like that he'd of returned it in the first place. Also if you're buying something I would think you'd make sure to get high quality photos, all this would of been easily shown in those.

Also this thread is for BFR Customers only so these re-sales/ebay guitars should be in their own threads. 



SpaceDock said:


> Wtf! That is insane, how is that even possible to have the dots in the wrong places? I have never heard of anything so absurd. Is it really a Rico or is it some sort of knock off?



Actually the Prototype 627 somebody just said they bought on ebay had issues with the side dots as well though they may of been fixed when he had the aftermarket scallop job etc done.




elq said:


> Doh. Did you pay via paypal by chance? If so, file a complaint ASAP.
> 
> **elq waits for MTech to come in here and throw a fit that you talked about issues with a BRj guitar.*



Not quite, though the original buyer should have said something.. At least he's acting now and now waiting 1-2 years to say a single word like you which most of everything you posted was a lie ( claiming non bone nut, wrong woods etc) but keep Trolling.

Which the only reason you are in here is to troll seeing as this thread is for something you are not **(Only for updates for/by customers.)*

*


mikernaut said:


> Also pretty terrible that the guy that sold it to you didn't mention any of the issues. Did you not see any pictures before you bought it?



Exactly my thoughts.


----------



## HeadBender

elq said:


> I understand that.
> 
> Did you pay via paypal? If so, you very well might be able to get your money back.



I did ,but as always Gift option, which is fine, cause I do not want to return it, or get money back or so.

I do like the guitar, plays and sounds great.
It needs a set-up, some fix that I can do, and aslo I will correct the side dots as well.

You know its just that this was not what I have expected from a BRJ


----------



## MTech

This is what kills me on here is people come on and blow up an issue then turn around and post


HeadBender said:


> I do like the guitar, plays and sounds great.



Completely contradicting everything previously complained about... I already pointed out that 99% of the people on here who say they have an issue when I bring it to Bernie's attention (to get it resolved ASAP for them because it's apparently a big deal they're posting about it) Bernie calls or emails them and they deny it and say there must of been a misunderstanding.

Anyway I made Bernie respond immediately about this and even though you are not the original owner and clearly it was not shipped with all these issues he's going to take care of it.


----------



## HeadBender

MTech said:


> This is what kills me on here is people come on and blow up an issue then turn around and post
> 
> Completely contradicting everything previously complained about... I already pointed out that 99% of the people on here who say they have an issue when I bring it to Bernie's attention (to get it resolved ASAP for them because it's apparently a big deal they're posting about it) Bernie calls or emails them and they deny it and say there must of been a misunderstanding.



First of all, I never said that I do not like it, or that I am here to blow up.
I got the guitar and shared what I have experienced, thats it.

The issues I have pointed out are still there, by tomorrow they will not disappear and I will not say otherwise.


----------



## SpaceDock

I don't think this instills much confidence for those of us still waiting on our guitars though. 

How can that even happen. It seems hard to fathom.


----------



## MTech

SpaceDock said:


> I don't think this instills much confidence for those of us still waiting on our guitars though.
> 
> How can that even happen. It seems made hard to fathom.



Not justifying it but there's been far worse things done by other companies, look at the Carvin the side dots were put UNDER the fretboard for example. Side markers are something that is easily fixed.

The fact still is that Bernie is taking care of it even though HeadBender's not the original purchaser and only 1 of these issues was for sure a manufacturing issue.


----------



## geofreesun

I don't know what you guys think, but I would (in future cases like this) call Bernie right away before posting on the forum. Of course, I would document every detail good or bad and tell a fuller story.


----------



## MetalDaze

MTech: It's hard to follow your posts when you keep editing them


----------



## MTech

MetalDaze said:


> MTech: It's hard to follow your posts when you keep editing them


If it's the last post I just add on to it but everybody is quick to speculate in cases like these so by the time I reply to something else I read boom 5more posts.

Just so it's clear on his customer service Bernie offered to call the 2nd hand buyer immediately but he declined due to it being late and is emailing instead.
I think it's pretty clear the side dot thing was a mistake and would accredit it to the tremendous stress being put on him by everything this past year and the family deaths and new comers in the last couple weeks.


----------



## HeadBender

Okay Guys, indeed I should have tried to contact Bernie right away, but as I am not the original owner I did not want to demand or ask for anything.

But the biggest surprise was Bernie himself, the way he immediately got back to me and discussed this over the phone. One thing is for sure, I haven't dealt with anyone this customer orientated before. 

Shit happens, everyone knows that but the way he handles it is something different. Even like this, me being the 2nd owner he does everything to solve whatever issues I have. 

My conclusion here: you can lay your trust in Bernie. Whatever comes up he will make sure you are happy and satisfied.

My issues are being resolved in the best possible way, so I am quite happy.


----------



## JP Universe

My thoughts -

Why didn't the original owner return it in the first place?

Original seller then sells it without disclosing full details?

Even though Bernie really shouldn't have to, he goes out of his way to help out Headbender.

Conclusion - From what i've read, the Original owner is a douche bag and I have absolutely no concerns with my BRJ BFR order


----------



## technomancer

*OK ENOUGH, THIS IS A USED GUITAR AND THIS DOESN'T BELONG IN THIS THREAD. IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO POST A NEW THREAD TO DEAL WITH THIS GUITAR GREAT, BUT IT'S DONE HERE*


----------



## MTech

Good news for the guys with the guitars in the group shots as the custom larger strings came in this week. Once he's back in from dealing with all the funerals etc all he has to do is slot the nuts and intonate the guitars then ship them out!





(Can't seem to find the group shot of the 3 natural 8's)


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Hope Bernie's dealing alright, I've lost a few family members this past year and it can really fuck with your head and your heart. Good vibes sent to the ricos


----------



## killertone

MTech said:


> Good news for the guys with the guitars in the group shots as the custom larger strings came in this week. Once he's back in from dealing with all the funerals etc all he has to do is slot the nuts and intonate the guitars then ship them out!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Can't seem to find the group shot of the 3 natural 8's)



That black guitar on the right was sent out at least a couple weeks ago and is already for sale in the classifieds...


----------



## MTech

killertone said:


> That black guitar on the right was sent out at least a couple weeks ago and is already for sale in the classifieds...


Yea....as the post says it's for the ones with larger strings...namely the ones in the 8 string group shot which I couldn't seem to find at the time....There's some 7/8's that wanted LARGE gauges which had to be custom made.

back OT Bernie said he'd be back working on everything Sunday but he went in today to address the nit picking about the prototypes which will of course be addressed in the appropriate thread.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Dag MTech, I go looking for this thread on the second page and you just bumped it haha. Just a heads-up, I put up some vids of my black friday 8 on my NGD thread if anyone wants to see one in action! I took it to my tech to set up and check out today, and he sized it up for a few minutes and asked me how much I paid for it. I told him, and he said, "you got a fucking deal, man. This guitar is the best thing youve brought me yet, it's flawless!" That's high praise coming from Mark L, he's torn me apart for asking him to make chicken soup with chicken shit guitars before (my favorite 7620 ). All you guys waiting on your axes, hang in there! You wont be disappoint.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

MTech, did you hear something new about our piezo bridges ?


----------



## MTech

Pascal-Darrell said:


> MTech, did you hear something new about our piezo bridges ?


They were coming in all together as a batch so I can only assume yours came in when mine did whenever I posted that was but it was amongst all the family issues he had. He said he was jumping back to the shop Sunday to start working on things. He's got that entire wall you saw all to the same point and I think he's going to take them 1 at a time to get 1-2 guitars a day done now rather than working on groups getting so much work done in a day on say 6 guitars doing the same thing to them. When he does the groups to try and get everybody done at the same point it just prolongs shipping so people think he's not doing anything but they ship in groups. If he does them 1 at a time then he can at least get 1 or more done every day he's in there.


----------



## Phrygian

I just realised something when looking at both my progress pics i got from Bernie,











Do you guys see it? that is not the same guitar in those pictures . I gotta send Bernie an e-mail about this


----------



## IB-studjent-

Phrygian said:


> I just realised something when looking at both my progress pics i got from Bernie,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you guys see it? that is not the same guitar in those pictures . I gotta send Bernie an e-mail about this



It certainly is not


----------



## Fiction

Nah man, when a guitar gets hung on a wall for ages , thanks to gravity the grain begins to slope downwards.


----------



## Phrygian

Fiction said:


> Nah man, when a guitar gets hung on a wall for ages , thanks to gravity the grain begins to slope downwards.


----------



## Fiction

At least he kept it inside, so the wood didn't start to tan.


----------



## Rap Hat

Thanks for posting that; I just looked at the pic from the FS thread here where I bought my spot and the pics that Bernie sent me and they're different. The FS thread listed it as an 825 but the pic had 24 frets. I hope I can chalk that up to JBCrazy posting the wrong pic... Though I just checked my payment form and that listed "824".

I'm assuming this is because Bernie is overwhelmed and pics are getting mixed up. Since mine was a "preowned" spot I'm not picky about the specs and 24 or 25 frets don't matter. At the very least in my case the pics I got directly from Bernie all show the same guitar, it's only the FS pic and the payment form that are off. It's definitely not enough of a concern to contact him (in case _someone_ reading misinterprets this as a personal attack against Bern).


----------



## Phrygian

Rap Hat said:


> Thanks for posting that; I just looked at the pic from the FS thread here where I bought my spot and the pics that Bernie sent me and they're different. The FS thread listed it as an 825 but the pic had 24 frets. I hope I can chalk that up to JBCrazy posting the wrong pic... Though I just checked my payment form and that listed "824".
> 
> I'm assuming this is because Bernie is overwhelmed and pics are getting mixed up. Since mine was a "preowned" spot I'm not picky about the specs and 24 or 25 frets don't matter. At the very least in my case the pics I got directly from Bernie all show the same guitar, it's only the FS pic and the payment form that are off. It's definitely not enough of a concern to contact him (in case _someone_ reading misinterprets this as a personal attack against Bern).



Yeah I'm not bashing Bernie either, I just think it's funny that I get photos of two different _left handed_ guitars.  You wouldn't think there would be to many to choose from! 

Hopefully the correct one is the second, i really like the figuring on it. And the faint figuring on the fretboard


----------



## Rap Hat

I wonder if yours was a rebuild? It looks like both have #405 in the neck pup route, which would explain the multiple lefties. I do hope the second is yours, I love that grain!


----------



## Phrygian

Rap Hat said:


> I wonder if yours was a rebuild? It looks like both have #405 in the neck pup route, which would explain the multiple lefties. I do hope the second is yours, I love that grain!



Thats true, i haven't seen the #405 in the first guitar before now. 

Bernie said the guitar had to be rebuilt because the fretboard cracked, but i assumed it only meant replacing the fretboard. Mtech also told me that they built a second lefty with the same specs as mine, but that one has been to the paint shop AFAIK. I'll see when i get a reply from him on this. 

Crossing my fingers for the second one!


----------



## Larrikin666

Phrygian said:


> Thats true, i haven't seen the #405 in the first guitar before now.
> 
> Bernie said the guitar had to be rebuilt because the fretboard cracked, but i assumed it only meant replacing the fretboard. Mtech also told me that they built a second lefty with the same specs as mine, but that one has been to the paint shop AFAIK. I'll see when i get a reply from him on this.
> 
> Crossing my fingers for the second one!




Agreed. That second one is awesome. You can chalk up the mixup to Bernie using his iphone for absolutely all emails and updates instead of an actual computer.


----------



## Hollowway

Got an out of the blue email from Bernie (i.e. I hadn't emailed him first). He said he's working on my custom now, and then will start on my BFR guitar right after. I don't have an ETA, but it's cool that he's starting (and shot me a quick email).


----------



## Rook

^when did you order your custom (non BFR)?


----------



## Hollowway

Fun111 said:


> ^when did you order your custom (non BFR)?



A little over two years ago. It's had to be rebuilt 2 times, so I think that's a good deal of what's caused the delay. If retrospect I should have just waited and done the BFR and saved some cash, but at the time I had no idea there would be a BFR. So when the BFR happened I went ahead and ordered another one.  Weak willed as I am!


----------



## leonardo7

*mod edit: DO NOT try to sell things outside the classifieds, it will get you banned*


Edit: Oops, sorry bout that!


----------



## Rook

Hollowway said:


> A little over two years ago. It's had to be rebuilt 2 times, so I think that's a good deal of what's caused the delay. If retrospect I should have just waited and done the BFR and saved some cash, but at the time I had no idea there would be a BFR. So when the BFR happened I went ahead and ordered another one.  Weak willed as I am!







How long we're you waiting before your build started the first time? Hahaha


----------



## Hollowway

Fun111 said:


> How long we're you waiting before your build started the first time? Hahaha



Yeah, I have no idea. I know the initial rebuild started around a year ago, and then it sounds like the 2nd rebuild started maybe in the fall or so? I'm not exactly sure. I didn't know it needed to be rebuilt the third time when it happened, only after when I inquired. And then my BFR needed a rebuild, too, but I don't know when, or where in the process it is. So yeah, it's taken a long time, which is why I was pretty excited to get an unsolicited email telling me he's working on them. Must mean we're getting pretty close. My big fear at this point is that I have a few customs in the works, and with my luck they'll all show up at the house at one time, and my wife will flip. It's a little hard to play that off!


----------



## Rook

^

Exact same situation


----------



## VILARIKA

It's been awfully quiet here...has anyone spoken to Bernie lately? I sent him an email a couple weeks ago, no response...


----------



## leonardo7

Hes workin hard and Im getting updated pics any day now


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah he's just bustin' balls in the shop right now. It's all good. He's working hard. I've got some updates in the luthiery section and he's posting finished guitars on almost every 2 or so days.


----------



## VILARIKA

Cool, I just needed some reassurance. I really haven't gotten much info on my order, just bad timing every time I ask for an update.


----------



## SpaceDock

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Yeah he's just bustin' balls in the shop right now. It's all good. He's working hard. I've got some updates in the luthiery section and he's posting finished guitars on almost every 2 or so days.



Where does he post the finished guitars? Could you post a link? 

I am trying not to bug him some can get these done, but the anticipation is driving me crazy.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, he doesn't post them all. Basically, there are a lot of guitars, and that would take a whole hell of a lot of time. Further, lots of people probably don't want their guitars plastered on the internet. And then, a good portion of people who are buying his guitars are not part of SS.org. You can check his facebook profile though - he seems to get one up there every couple of days or so.


----------



## Hollowway

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, he doesn't post them all. Basically, there are a lot of guitars, and that would take a whole hell of a lot of time. Further, lots of people probably don't want their guitars plastered on the internet. And then, a good portion of people who are buying his guitars are not part of SS.org. You can check his facebook profile though - he seems to get one up there every couple of days or so.



I think he was asking because you said you got some updates in the luthiery section. Where is that? On his forum you mean?


----------



## Hollowway

Dang, 3 guitars from the guy and this is the treatment I get?! Some people!


----------



## HarryLikesProg

to be honest, the wait for my guitar has been one of the most disappointing and stressful experiences of customer service ive ever encountered. i feel like its been excessively long than what was originally quoted. so much so that the need and excitement for my guitar is completely gone. every setback makes me seriously wonder what goes on in those workshops. huge details like guitars being built with the wrong woods make me physically ill. the lack of communication or solid time framing make me feel very vulnerable. as a music student in a top conservatorium, i needed this guitar and it just never came. i just want to get my guitar so i can put this experience behind me as a steep learning curve in ordering custom guitars. i didnt really want to say anything as my guitar is still being finished, but who knows when it will arrive. i just feel let down


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Oh heavens I didn't mean to imply Bernie had his own luthiery section. I was just saying that I had an update from Bernie (in picture form) in THIS luthiery, mods and Customs forum section. My bad for any mis-representation. Here's a link if you care to check it out.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...finally-update-brj-jekyll-727-while-back.html

I hear you guys on the long wait time. It's definitely been a learning experience for me as well. If I ever NEED a guitar, I'm certainly not going custom again. If I want a guitar and all my needs are met, for sure. But I've been waiting a year for this axe and at this point I really do need it to go forward with a major project I want to start. The thing that keeps me going is knowing that this guitar is going to be ridiculous when I finally get my hands on it (which SHOULD be in the nearer than farther future).


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Oh heavens I didn't mean to imply Bernie had his own luthiery section. I was just saying that I had an update from Bernie (in picture form) in THIS luthiery, mods and Customs forum section. My bad for any mis-representation. Here's a link if you care to check it out.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...finally-update-brj-jekyll-727-while-back.html
> 
> I hear you guys on the long wait time. It's definitely been a learning experience for me as well. If I ever NEED a guitar, I'm certainly not going custom again. If I want a guitar and all my needs are met, for sure. But I've been waiting a year for this axe and at this point I really do need it to go forward with a major project I want to start. The thing that keeps me going is knowing that this guitar is going to be ridiculous when I finally get my hands on it (which SHOULD be in the nearer than farther future).


 
fasho man, my second-hand rico 8 is spectacular! mine has been done for 3 weeks or so (from my understanding) and hasn't shipped yet, so Im gonna call him up and bug him tomorrow


----------



## mikernaut

It's frustrating but most custom shops will take at least a year. I know 1st hand from Jackson, ESP and BRJ. I've also had issues with my orders from the other companies too. (usually when it comes to the paintjob/colors I have ordered) Seems like custom shops just love to just go ahead and paint things and wing it.

My remake BRJ is over 1 year but I did get a few pics of it in paint and then talked to Bernie on the phone about the color 2 weeks ago. But I'm willing to wait it out because every time I sit down and play my BRJ's they just shine in the playing department. They are just soo responsive, they truly are a joy to play.


----------



## Locrian

mikernaut said:


> It's frustrating but most custom shops will take at least a year. I know 1st hand from Jackson, ESP and BRJ. I've also had issues with my orders from the other companies too. (usually when it comes to the paintjob/colors I have ordered) Seems like custom shops just love to just go ahead and paint things and wing it.
> 
> My remake BRJ is over 1 year but I did get a few pics of it in paint and then talked to Bernie on the phone about the color 2 weeks ago. But I'm willing to wait it out because every time I sit down and play my BRJ's they just shine in the playing department. They are just soo responsive, they truly are a joy to play.



I think it's the unrest from not knowing any kind of time frame, rather than the wait time itself, that causes some the frustration.


----------



## Hollowway

Update!! I'm getting pretty excited now. Here it is currently (from another email from Bernie. Unsolicited - seems like he's back on top of everything now).


----------



## IB-studjent-

Hollowway said:


> Update!! I'm getting pretty excited now. Here it is currently (from another email from Bernie. Unsolicited - seems like he's back on top of everything now).



He definitely is


----------



## Rap Hat

Some good news on my end; I wasn't sure if the guy I got my build spot from had ever sent the BK pickups to Bernie, and I wasn't too keen on having to spend more $. Talked to Bernie Last night, everything's sorted out . I'm doing a switch from Aftermaths to Painkillers too (at least that's what I intend, depends what I read about them).

Like what always happens, Bernie was kind enough to chat for almost 2 hours. We talked about guitars, life, and traded stories. He really is one of the nicest people I've worked with, and I hope he can plow through this last stretch and get back to the short lead times he was known for.


----------



## Rook

^Here's hoping


----------



## leonardo7

I was is the first general batch, here's mine! Progress is being made! Just sit tight everyone!


----------



## mikernaut

What pups you putting in that Alain?


----------



## leonardo7

mikernaut said:


> What pups you putting in that Alain?



As far as bridge: BKP Aftermath or Dimarzio Dactivator

Im going to be lowering the bass side of the neck pickup so it rests at an angle like I do with my STEF layout ESPs cause its exactly where I pick and I cant stand having a pickup right where I pick, but I wanted a neck pickup for the 27 frets. The whole point of having 27 frets is to solo up high so I definitely will be using the neck pickup, just need something high output to pair with one of those bridges and I haven't quite figured it out yet.


----------



## Michael T

Updates anyone ????


----------



## MetalDaze

I got an update a few days ago that he's just waiting for a bridge for my Lefty BFR.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

I recieved mine the other day, check my thread for the first Rico NGD for info. It's as promised, flawless instrument and a blast to play =)


----------



## SpaceDock

I am really wondering what's up, Bern told me 2.5 weeks 2.5 months ago. I keep emailing him and he responded a week ago saying he would check on my guitars, but nothing since. One guitar is painted and very custom, the other is stock except for adding neck pickup. I can't believe it's been so long. How did he ever expect to hit the 45-60 day mark? I also noticed he is putting out a ton of vixens now. I wonder if those were made before all of the BFR or if he is not working on the BFR as hard since he's not making as much money on them. I don't want to gripe too much, but this wait is killing me.


----------



## toiletstand

after he offered the original batch of hesperians and they sold out. bernie did the same sale again with the vixen body style. some of the ones you are seeing might be from that batch.


----------



## ras1988

SpaceDock said:


> I am really wondering what's up, Bern told me 2.5 weeks 2.5 months ago. I keep emailing him and he responded a week ago saying he would check on my guitars, but nothing since. One guitar is painted and very custom, the other is stock except for adding neck pickup. I can't believe it's been so long. How did he ever expect to hit the 45-60 day mark?



Ditto, in Jan. he told me 4 weeks to complete. Really hard to not feel butt hurt over this stuff when I paid him in full already but c'est la vie just going to trooper on and not make a ruckus until it's done. I get frustrated whenever I see someone else's build come up though, this thread is just full of heartbreak . We are going into typical custom shop build time frames anyway might as well look at it like that.


----------



## Larrikin666

SpaceDock said:


> I am really wondering what's up, Bern told me 2.5 weeks 2.5 months ago. I keep emailing him and he responded a week ago saying he would check on my guitars, but nothing since. One guitar is painted and very custom, the other is stock except for adding neck pickup. I can't believe it's been so long. How did he ever expect to hit the 45-60 day mark? I also noticed he is putting out a ton of vixens now. I wonder if those were made before all of the BFR or if he is not working on the BFR as hard since he's not making as much money on them. I don't want to gripe too much, but this wait is killing me.



Trust me, he's putting a ton of time into the BFR regardless of the dollar amount. He's put an absurd amount of time into mine so far. I totally understand the frustration with the wait. It certainly sucks. I was pretty pissed myself before I actually started talking to him regularly and eventually got my guitar.

As far as the Vixens go, he had a TON of Vixens very close to completion that he had in the shop for a few years. That's why all of those popped up for the March Madness sale. He mentioned having hundreds of Vixen bodies in his shop right now that aren't associated with anyone's order.


----------



## mikernaut

Well I've always been upfront about saying I love the quality from my BRJ's, but he should just not quote estimated arrival times because they are not close at all.


----------



## VILARIKA

The temptation of selling my order is getting to me...must..resist...


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

VILARIKA said:


> The temptation of selling my order is getting to me...must..resist...



Might as well wait now, it must be close.


----------



## IB-studjent-

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Might as well wait now, it must be close.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Getting really antsy, myself.

Mine was supposed to ship back at the end of January (got an email from him saying it would ship the next day), then nearly a month later, he told me he was going to ship it that day, but there was an issue and he called me on the phone about it and told me he was going to get it finished ASAP and ship it out within a week or two. Mid-March rolls around and he finally sent me a picture of the completed guitar, but it _still_ hasn't shipped yet; another month later.

He emailed me nearly 2 weeks ago, saying that he was working hard to get the guitar out, but I'm really confused on what all is left to do...? The hardware recesses are done (and I've seen that the hardware fits, because there's a picture a few pages back with my actual guitar in it), the paint is done, etc. All that should be left is to put it in a box and throw a label on it... 

My guitar was supposedly going to ship out nearly 3 months ago, but still hasn't. The others that were supposed to ship out with mine in February have already gotten to their owners and they're enjoying them. I don't mean to talk bad about him, because he seemed like a really cool guy on the phone, and I enjoyed talking to him and hearing his stories, but I just want to know what's taking so longgggg


----------



## SpaceDock

^ Im hoping this is due to a goober or too making it past qa and he is really digging into every guitar making sure they live up to his namesake. This is just a guess and me being hopeful, I am waiting as well. I don't think the couple bad Ngd's posted would attract too many customers. So he has to be really careful making sure they are perfect.


----------



## VILARIKA

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Might as well wait now, it must be close.



That's what I've been telling myself for awhile, then the guitar gets delayed again. Lack of communication doesn't help either, and the drawn out process has started to make me lose some interest. 

It's come to the point where I believe a conspiracy exists:


----------



## glassmoon0fo

^not the case man. Just got done playing mine, still pretty damn sweet! I'm lucky enough to actually own one though and havn't had to wait quite as long, so what do I know . I really do understand how waiting so long can piss one off, and understand I was VERY lucky to get mine so early on, just wish I could let you guys play mine to put you at ease. And even though Rob doesn't make any promises on delivery dates, I anticipate I'll be close to 2 years or more for my KxK build, so it's all part of the process. I wish Bernie didn't make datelines he didn't meet either, but at least we know about that character flaw. All I know is, lots of people are going to end up with a badass instruments for way less skrilla than they're worth, depends on who wants to wait


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well hey. That's fine and dandy. I know the guitar is going to be great, and I'm a patient man. But when I personally spoke to Bernie and I ordered my non-BFR guitar over a year ago, he told me that it would take him 4 months to build the guitar. I specifically told him that I would consider the order because I knew it would be a quality instrument, and that the build time was reasonable. 

I specifically told him that I was putting together a recording rig and was pursuing the production of a large-scale musical work and that the right instrument (his, particularly) was a crucial part of that project. He assured me that the guitar would be built in a timely fashion. I knew it wouldn't be four months, but I figured he would have gotten it to me within a somewhat reasonable time-frame. I certainly didn't think I'd be here without a guitar after this much time.

For a while I let a good amount of time go by (months, actually) before I called to request an update on the status of my build. They started telling me _last August_ that it would be ready in two weeks. Then it would be ready at the end of September - latest. Oh no... beginning of October because it needed more work from wood shop. Okay, fretboard issues - it'll be the end of November. Oh, neck had to be rebuilt. At some point in February, your guitar will be shipping for sure. That came and I got the "Oh your guitar will be ready in two weeks". No... it had to be re-clear-coated, but it's drying and it'll be a week and a half and your guitar will ship for sure! 

Now here we are mid April and I haven't heard jack diddly about my instrument since they told me that it would be shipping out by today or tomorrow, absolutely! 

This is, altogether, incredibly not cool. I realize that I'm not his only customer, but when I'm expecting a guitar and then have to call to find out that no, it went back to wood shop weeks ago, or that it had to be refinished because something got screwed up, it puts me in a really sore mood. Especially because the attitude about it is always the same - oh we're sorry it's taking so long, but hey don't worry dude your guitar is super top priority.

Like I said, I know the guitar is going to be disturbingly nice. There is no doubt about it. And I still believe that Bernie is a good guy who wants to turn out the best of instruments. But at this point, it's become a pretty big freaking joke with me and everyone that knows me about if I'll ever see the damn thing. 

Except that it's not a funny, ha-ha, let's all laugh type of situation. I paid really good money working a menial job (in which this guitar represents a chunk of my yearly income), often times cleaning up shit and puke off the floor, getting screamed at by assholes because their groceries are expensive, or putting out nightmarish mother fucking fiery situations because my subordinates can be class-A shit-for-brains, so that I could learn about audio engineering and eventually have this instrument as part of my studio arsenal, and I often feel like I'm just waiting on the wings. 

I've never bitched about this publicly, but at this point I feel let down big time.


----------



## Psyy

Is there some sort of way to get in touch with Bernie at least a touch more frequently than is currently possible? It seems every time he updates me on my guitar and I attempt a followup a few weeks later, he's moved to a new email address.


----------



## VILARIKA

Psyy said:


> Is there some sort of way to get in touch with Bernie at least a touch more frequently than is currently possible? It seems every time he updates me on my guitar and I attempt a followup a few weeks later, he's moved to a new email address.



Give him a call, it seems to be the best way to get in contact with him. I also consider it to be on the time consuming side on his part (he could use the time to continue working on builds), but at this point, I don't think it even matters


----------



## Larrikin666

Hey everyone. I just wanted to take a minute and let everyone know what's going on. Bernie ended up in the hospital for a bit. I don't want to go into details. He told me everything okay now, and he'll be back in the swing on things on Tuesday taking care of business. He apologizes immensely for the delays his health scare caused. If anyone talks to him in the next few days, send some good vibes his way. He definitely needs it right now.


----------



## toiletstand

hope he feels better soon


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Damn that sucks to hear, good vibes sent


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, I'm glad he's okay. Shit I figured something went down. I hope that he's back kicking and feeling better. Thanks for the update man.


----------



## VILARIKA

Hope he gets better as well.

I wish we didn't have to rely on another member to find out what's going on with Bernie though. A mass email would put a lot of people at ease, rather than leave people wondering why they haven't heard from Bernie or eventually figuring out that he was sick. Nonetheless, I hope he doesn't rush back into work.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I have to agree with Vilarkia. I understand that the man has been seriously ill, but it is unacceptable to me as a business practice to simply vanish into thin air without so much as a vague note as to what is going on. I really do wish the man the best and think he's still putting out an unparalleled quality of product. But I keep asking myself: my guitar was apparently quite close to being finished. But how long do I wait without contact of any sort from them before I start figuring out what I'm going to do about the fact that I still don't have a guitar?

As said before, I really do feel for the guy. I've been intensely ill when I was figuring out I was a celiac, and my spouse almost died of a flesh-eating bacterial infection in the hospital post-surgery. They were crazy times. I hardly knew my ass from a hole in the ground. I just hope that before too long we can find out any, ANY, information at all as a release from the actual company.


----------



## Adrian-XI

I bought a BFR spot a few weeks ago and I'm still waiting for a confirmation that the spot has been transferred over to me. I'm a fairly patient guy, but I need some piece of mind gosh darn it!


----------



## Khoi

Adrian-XI said:


> I bought a BFR spot a few weeks ago and I'm still waiting for a confirmation that the spot has been transferred over to me. I'm a fairly patient guy, but I need some piece of mind gosh darn it!



don't worry, I bought a spot back in January, and I don't even know if the specs are finalized yet, or if the guitar has even been started. It definitely takes time.


----------



## Imbrium998

Have mercy on the man fellas. I know that a good bunch of people have builds in the works and all, but if I was a builder and going in the hospital and it was for anything overnight+, I would not be as worried about whether you knew your build status or not. 
I hope that Bernie is back on his feet and rolling away back to making great guitars as soon as he can


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Larrikin666 said:


> Hey everyone. I just wanted to take a minute and let everyone know what's going on. Bernie ended up in the hospital for a bit. I don't want to go into details. He told me everything okay now, and he'll be back in the swing on things on Tuesday taking care of business. He apologizes immensely for the delays his health scare caused. If anyone talks to him in the next few days, send some good vibes his way. He definitely needs it right now.



Thanks for the update dude. Good to hear he's alright. Everyone here has GAS that needs to be relieved. But more importantly knowing he's up and getting back into the swing of life, let alone guitars, is good.


----------



## MetalDaze

I see Bernie deleted his Twitter account.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I don't think there are too many people here who are upset over the fact that Bernie was extremely sick and is getting on the mend before going back to work. I think the vast majority of frustrations stem from the fact that there has been absolutely no contact or word as to what is going on from the company.

I wish Bernie the best, and I hope that he's healing well - I certainly don't want him to rush back up into working his ass off and just hurt himself further. However, a simple mass email explaining that unforeseen circumstances have caused a temporary halt in production would have been a lot better a way to find out what's been happening than two weeks of silence, followed by a note on a forum, followed by more silence from the company.

I, for example, was expecting my guitar to be shipping, and then bam... I just couldn't get a hold of anybody and heard nothing from the company, and now it's been about a month since that point. It was over two weeks before I heard anything on ss.org about the whole situation, and I still have no idea as to what is going on. Keep in mind that this is not the first time that people have been totally and completely incapable of finding out what is going on with the guitars that they have paid for.

So yes, I have a lot of compassion for the man, but that doesn't mean I have to enjoy the poor customer service they have going. When my wife almost died of a flesh eating bacterial infection and was in the hospital ER for 12 days, I still called my work (including lots of my landscaping clients) and let them know I wasn't going to be in until it was resolved. I didn't, on the other hand, stop all contact with everybody, turn off the business phones, and just let the world ride it out wondering in idle speculation as to what was going on with the person that they have given their money to.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

^ I agree it's bad for business. I won't argue the cons of such practices, but the simple fact that quite a few people have thousands of dollars at stake requires a little more communication. Nothing detailed even, but an employee posting on the website "due to unforeseen circumstances, blah blah blah, we will be resuming operations soon". I'm still completely stoked to get my custom, but probably will look elsewhere for the next couple builds (besides ridiculous GAS buildup for other guitars). But again, all things aside, I'm glad things are ok and that we should be seeing some updates soon.


----------



## VILARIKA

Thank you for elaborating on my post


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Guess we all have a similar frame of mind here!


----------



## SpaceDock

This is the risk with custom builds like this, he is the only one who can do the work to give us the product we want. It's not like he can have someone else make the guitars for him when he is sick, right. Then it wouldn't be the same at all. This could happen to any of the custom builders out there. Just think if one of these guys dropped dead, we'd all be sol, god forbid. 

I noticed his website is "now accepting online payments." I hope I can get an update soon. I keep reading about all of the people buying more guitars from him and it makes me wish he'd finish what's on the plate before ordering seconds. Understandably he wants a steady stream of income, but this is taking forever and I could have bought several lightly used Rico's in the interim instead of him having my money and guitars. 

Get better soon and git-r-done.


----------



## djpharoah

SpaceDock said:


> he is the only one who can do the work to give us the product we want. It's not like he can have someone else make the guitars for him when he is sick, right.


Have you read this entire thread??


----------



## SpaceDock

^ yeah, but I don't think anyone can confirm that the guitars are farmed out. If they are then I think this would have been over a long time ago.


----------



## MetalDaze

The building part seems to work just fine. Just look at the pics with gobs and gobs of guitars hanging around his shop.

It's getting them out the door that seems to be the problem


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

SpaceDock said:


> ^ yeah, but I don't think anyone can confirm that the guitars are farmed out. If they are then I think this would have been over a long time ago.



Even if they arent he ISNT the only one working on them man. How much effort would it be for someone else working with him like the paint guy to send out an email? 


Not very much.




I can totally see why people are upset.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ no argument from me on that. If people can update a website or sell more guitars, why don't they take pics of purchased guitars or call people? Bernie doesn't have to do everything but maybe he thinks he does.


----------



## MetalDaze

BTW, is Stealth allowed to post in here since he's not a customer?


----------



## Rook

Bernie hasn't properly replied to one of my questions since last year. I agree, having someone who can simply look through a spreadsheet or whatever he keeps all his order info on and find out what's what isn't hard. His however many year old daughter could do it for pity's sake.
/rant


----------



## Khoi

an update from Bernie's facebook:

"IMPORTANT UPDATE ABOUT BERNIE!

Hello everybody, my name is Ivo Archer. I'm going to be helping Bernie out with his Facebook and YouTube accounts from now on.
To give you all a bit of an update, Bernie recently became very sick. He was admitted to hospital on April 11th for several days, and has been in recovery since that time. Under doctor's orders, he could not engage in any business related activity, but Bernie was under the impression that his phone, emails, and facebook were being looked after by another member of the team. They weren't though, as many of you have unfortunately found out first hand. Bernie only just found out the day before last that nobody had been replying to messages all this time! So, needless to say, that guy is no longer working with Bernie, and Bernie has asked me to help him manage his account here.
I was just speaking with Bernie on the phone yesterday, and he's feeling much better, and expects to be back to work at the shop sometime next week. He wants to send out his sincerest apologies for the recent lack of communication, as well as a heartfelt thank-you for all the well-wishes he has received in the past 3 weeks!
He wants you all to know that he has a whole new group of people working with him now to get things back in order, and to allow him to focus on his work in the shop, doing what he does best!

Also, in related news, we have a brand new website under development, which will be much more informative and user friendly. The online payment system has been re-vamped as well, and is SO much easier to use now. This new website is expected to be ready in approximately 4 weeks, so watch out for that!

Best regards,

Ivo"


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Sweetness dude. Thanks for sharing. I think some of us figured as much; shit happens and sometimes people can be unreliable. It's insane how hard it can be to find a decently reliable 'front desk' person. Glad he's mending well and looking forward to the new website and build updates!


----------



## Psyy

Did that Facebook update explain which email address to direct inquiries and updates to? I think I've got about four different accounts that I've spoken with Bernie through at one time or another.

EDIT: Oh, nevermind. Just Facebook and YouTube.


----------



## swollenpickle

Guhhh WOW!




MTech said:


> I just got you info on your guitar and thought you talked to him then..why didn't you mention that....
> 
> Got more news on mine..just figuring out knob placement options (hence white dots) I changed it from what's pictured and there's 1 too many dots on here.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ huh?


----------



## MetalDaze

SpaceDock said:


> ^ huh?


 
Never question a swollen pickle


----------



## VILARIKA

Anyone get updates on their order since the announcement made on facebook?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

From the sounds of it, Bernie is shooting to be back in the shop on Monday. He will need a day or two to get everything back in order, and then people will start hearing on the status of their builds. I talked with them as my order was basically getting ready to be completed before he became ill, and that is the news that I received.


----------



## Adrian-XI

I got an email explaining the delay in response, and Bernie asked me to ring him in a few days, so I tried today a few times but got redirected to a voicemail service. I'll try calling early next week.


----------



## killertone

I am getting super tired of waiting. Not trying to be a dick and I understand sickness happens, but I seriously hope that I receive at least one of my builds in the month or so. 

Yes, I realize that it won't happen.


----------



## Khoi

I think we are all feeling that way. I've been getting tired of having all my money being so tied up into this, it's getting frustrating. I've even been contemplating selling my 7-string spot, but I know it'll probably take forever waiting for e-mail correspondence to mediate that transaction with Bernie and go through all that stuff, which will slow down everyone elses' builds


----------



## glassmoon0fo

killertone said:


> I am getting super tired of waiting. Not trying to be a dick and I understand sickness happens, but I seriously hope that I receive at least one of my builds in the month or so.
> 
> Yes, I realize that it won't happen.


 
Sell em to me bro, I'll wait em out for you


----------



## killertone

glassmoon0fo said:


> Sell em to me bro, I'll wait em out for you





The quilt on my guitars is soooo sick that waiting it out will be worth it. 

By the way, when I went out to the shop a few months ago and met Bernie and saw my guitars, Bernie was super cool and very open to showing me around. Both of my guitars were in the paint shop and that is why I am wondering what is up. They were sooo close to being done, at least that is what it looked like. Hopefully soon!


----------



## mikernaut

I'm frustrated like many of you, but already having 2 BRJ's and loving how "lively" they play to the touch, I still want to put in an order for my 3rd. Seeing as I just got a new job after being unemployed for about 3 years, by god I might just have to do it even after all the turmoil and delays. Maybe I'm just a masochist.

Shame there's been issues with getting the guitars out the door. (sure it's hard to turn down orders , but at a certain point you gotta be realistic and not piss of your clientele. )
When you want something specific and for the most part know the bar of quality you will get, it's hard to settle/go with something else.

I need another beer while I wait


----------



## Larrikin666

Hey guys. Bernie was back in the hospital again for a few days. He was just released today. That's all the info I have for now.


----------



## Phrygian

Thanks for the update Larrikin! I hope Bernie has a speedy and full recovery soon, it must be serious if he's in and out like he's been.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Daaaamn, man I hate hearing that kind of news, hope he's ok.


----------



## SpaceDock

This sucks, hard.


----------



## toiletstand

Hope the man is all right. thanks for keeping us updated!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

This is pretty God awful. I just spoke with him about 4-5 days ago, and he seemed to be doing pretty damn good. Thought he was going to be back today and all. God, I just hope that the man is okay.

I hope that we can find out something about what's going on with him sooner than later.


----------



## VILARIKA

Wow, things must be hell for him right now. I hope he pulls through it and can get back on his feet.

At this point, I think I've lost so much interest in the guitar, it wouldn't be gratifying for me to get it anymore. The appeal has faded and it's a shame because I know this sale was a one-time thing, and I've heard so many good things about his guitars. I guess I'll see what this Strandberg line will turn into...

Does anyone know the process of selling your BFR spot? I hope it's not a big hassle for Bernie, I'd hate to add to his workload...


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I know exactly how you feel, I keep wanting to hang on but it's been so long and no end in site. Selling my spots would suck and I would feel really bad doing that to Bernie. If I could get a total refund right now I would and Id buy something I could actually play.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah guys. I know the feeling. I try to avoid speculation - perhaps it was just a checkup where the doctor wanted to monitor his status a bit more. We won't know until somebody talks to the company. I, for one, am going to wait until I can talk to him, or somebody in his company in the near future (hopefully within a day or two).

For the record, I really, REALLY, *REAAAAALLY* don't want it to go this way, but I'm not going to wait indefinitely for a guitar that I've already been waiting 14 months for if there is no guarantee as to when this axe is going to finally be finished. I understand that the man has been sick, and I am dreadfully sorry for that. But I've got a business to account for, and I've already been waiting 10 months longer than I was told I would wait. 

The sad part is I know that if I go out and buy an equally priced instrument and slam my Painkillers in it, it's not going to be even close to the quality of the guitar he is building for me, either aesthetically or playability wise. But I'm just going to have to wait and see and hope for the best.


----------



## leonardo7

Bernie texted me back today telling me hes getting better finally. He also thanked me for asking and said that it makes him feel better when people are concerned and support in times like this. Id say honestly just stick with it, alot of these guitars are very very close to being finished.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, that is something I'm very glad to hear. The dude has literally been through hell.

I don't want to sound like I'm arbitrarily bitching. It's still totally a first world problem, and in comparison to a man almost losing his life it's a very small issue to be complaining about. I have no illusions about it, especially because I know that this guitar is going to kick so much ass.

But let me be clear - the only reason that I'm all antsy is because I started hearing that my guitar would be finished in 2 weeks... back in August of 2011. So... I get a little nervous is all.


----------



## VILARIKA

At least the appeal of the guitar is still there for you man. I thinks it's died for me personally because I remember jumping the gun the day that he posted the black friday sale on Facebook. It was an amazing deal for a company that was getting a good amount of praise at the time. As time has passed, my interests changed, and I don't this guitar will suit my needs as much as I'd like it to...

I'm selling my spot from loss of interest, not my loss of patience ironically . I know people have had to wait much longer than me for their orders (a painful example is above my post), but at least they know down the line they will end up with something they are extremely happy with, unlike me. I guess this is where I get disconnected from the BRJ BFR thread .


----------



## Larrikin666

Selling a spot is quick and easy. Once you have someone lined up to buy it, you need need to shoot Bernie their name, address, phone number, and email address. He'll shoot a confirmation to you and the new buyer. Done deal. I've already bought two slots from other guys. I'd consider buying more too.


----------



## leonardo7

Bernie says that he has strict orders from his Doctor to rest up for a few. He says hes been trying to catch up on emails that his web guy left hanging. Hes also aware of his reputation cause of the wait time and realizes that it sucks for everyone that its just him doing all of the final assembly. Hes hoping to be back in the shop next week bustin balls!!!!


----------



## Hollowway

So what actually happened to him? Did he have a heart attack or something?


----------



## jbard

I'm looking to buy a spot or two if anyone is tired of waiting.


----------



## ikarus

jbard said:


> I'm looking to buy a spot or two if anyone is tired of waiting.



check out the marketplace. There is one for sale at the moment...


----------



## HRC51

I just had Bernie give me a call. He is on bed rest, but will be back in the office to check on things later this week. For now, he is taking all phone calls and dealing with customers directly.

He knows things got messed up, but wants everyone to know that he wants to get guitars into customers hands. 

I'm glad we finally got to speak to each other again. I have the same question as everyone here: when? That update should be coming soon.


----------



## Phrygian

My question is: Which?  

Great to hear that He is getting better and getting on top of things! Can Someone PM me the current email to him that He responds to? He's not answering the one I have.

Edit: thanks lirtle!


----------



## Lirtle

Whats his phone number? It'd be great if someone could PM me.


----------



## TomAwesome

Phrygian said:


> My question is: Which?
> 
> Great to hear that He is getting better and getting on top of things! Can Someone PM me the current email to him that He responds to? He's not answering the one I have.
> 
> Edit: thanks lirtle!



I'm having better luck with Facebook messages right now.


----------



## Qweklain

I have a feeling after this, that a lot of us are now going to be pushed out to beyond 24 months for our BFR guitar(s)...

I got an update pic about a month or two before this accident he had, but needed to have a new fretboard done due to a mistake in the inlays (which is why I did not post it here). Then came the accident, so I have a feeling this is going to get pushed out many more months. 

I have actually not cared it has taken this long at this point, but after getting an update pic and then reading _on here_ about the accident, my thoughts of potentially seeing it done in the next few months just got destroyed.


----------



## Khoi

the most frustrating part is that I know a lot of these guitars are soo close to finishing.. mine has been painted since August, then I get an update in January saying that it was ready for hardware, then delayed once more when the clearcoat had to be done. I know I'm not the only one that feels this way, but it's so close, yet so far away!


----------



## travis bickle

Im with Qweklain on this one. none of us should expect to receive these instruments until about next year or so. I know once I receive said instrument I will be elated, and I truly hope Bernie pulls through, but this whole experience has been a total nightmare. I was hoping to get another instrument from bernie, but will certainly refrain from doing so. 

I will continue to be patient from here, and again, truly hope that bernie's condition improves. not solely because of my instrument, but for the dude's well being.


----------



## killertone

Well, Bernie is back in the shop and he sent me this pic. I loooooove the paint job on this. I sent him an example of the finish and he nailed it. Could not be happier with it.


----------



## leonardo7

That thing is amazing!


----------



## SpaceDock

Faith slowly returning, maybe I can play my guitars by the end of summer.


----------



## Khoi

WOW, glad to see him back in action!

you are getting hooked up with sick tops killertone, first your Anderson, now the finish on this!


----------



## mikernaut

Lookin good, both the guitar and the Luthier. 

Glad he's back in action


----------



## killertone

Khoi said:


> WOW, glad to see him back in action!
> 
> you are getting hooked up with sick tops killertone, first your Anderson, now the finish on this!



I know, man. Totally lucky.


----------



## Locrian

Any recommendation on how I can get a hold of Bernie? I called and left a message and never got called back, and all 3 emails that I've used haven't led anywhere. Would love to know what stage my guitar is in, still have no idea at all. No rush, just want to satisfy my curiosity.


----------



## MatrixClaw

VILARIKA said:


> Wow, things must be hell for him right now. I hope he pulls through it and can get back on his feet.
> 
> At this point, I think I've lost so much interest in the guitar, it wouldn't be gratifying for me to get it anymore. The appeal has faded and it's a shame because I know this sale was a one-time thing, and I've heard so many good things about his guitars. I guess I'll see what this Strandberg line will turn into...
> 
> Does anyone know the process of selling your BFR spot? I hope it's not a big hassle for Bernie, I'd hate to add to his workload...



+1 to this, though at this point, I've waited this long, so I might as well wait it out  I really hope the wait is worth it.

Honestly, I wouldn't be so upset at this point, if it weren't for the fact that I already paid for the remainder of my guitar 4 months ago, when I was under the impression that it was going to ship within 2 weeks. 4 months later and it STILL hasn't shipped, though it should've been well past done months ago. The fact that I had to complete payment for a guitar that wasn't going to ship is kind of ridiculous to me. I could've really used that money in the past few months, but instead it's been tied up in a guitar I've yet to receive or even hear any news on in the past 2 months.


----------



## leonardo7

Mine:






Bernie is "Back and working my ass off hard! Trying my hardest and my best to get guitars done."


----------



## leonardo7




----------



## Phrygian

Looks great dude! I'm actually starting to get a little excited about my Guitar again. Go Bernie!

Edit: But I hope he is not rushing them to the point where QC's standard is lowered.


----------



## Larrikin666

leonardo7 said:


>




F me. I love that finish. God bless you for not ruining that with gold hardware.


----------



## Khoi

so sick. 

so is it done? will he be shipping it soon? or is it gonna stay like that for a few weeks before it's finally done and shipped? 

I saw another guy selling his BRJ that just finished, it looks like it was in the same stage as yours but it wasn't a BFR


----------



## leonardo7

I think its a matter of waiting on the BKPs at this point. I also havent asked if the frets are all dressed up either. But the hardware is in so it cant be too far off.


----------



## SpaceDock

Anyone get an update yet since he got back into the shop? I emailed last week and still haven't heard anything. My guitars had 2 1/2 weeks four months ago.


----------



## ryanoddi

SpaceDock said:


> Anyone get an update yet since he got back into the shop? I emailed last week and still haven't heard anything. My guitars had 2 1/2 weeks four months ago.



I sent him an email about a month ago with no response, so I sent a follow up email on Friday of last week I believe. He responded on Sunday morning apologizing for the lack of response. I guess he had someone answering emails that wasn't doing his job, and is no longer working there. He then sent me 3 photos yesterday around 2 pm. This has been a very long wait and I've been extremely patient. It's all starting to pay off with these photos!!! 

It's still gotta be buffed and there is obviously more to work to do, but these pictures are making the wait a bit better. 

The third photo wasn't really special.. it was just a shot of the back that is completely covered just like the fret board.


----------



## MetalDaze

Cool. What color are you going for? Is it sort of a brown stain?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

^ looks to me like a dark yellow with black stain enhancement.


----------



## ryanoddi

I'm not sure of the exact name of the color, we mainly discussed color over the phone, but I want to say he said something like tiger eye? I found a guitar that he did before in some build thread on here (can't remember where or who's guitar it was,) when I was searching for a color (he gave me a free upgrade because there was an issue w/ my guitar when it came out of the wood shop the first time, so he ended up having to start fresh.)

He said he remembered doing that one and could do that for me. I'm sure it's going to look a little different once he buffs it and finishes. I'm pretty excited how it's coming out... almost a little rusty looking.


----------



## MetalDaze

Totally know what you mean on not knowing the name of the color. When Bernie did my Diva, I sent him a pic and said, "like that". 

And sure as hell, it looked just like the pic


----------



## Phrygian

I e-mailed Bernie today, and -no kidding - He answered me within two minutes! I was extremely pleased with that. So, within the next few Days I'm finally gonna know Which Guitar is mine, and how far along it is. I must admit, I'm getting stoked! 

If its not too late, I Might Even want to Get it Stained instead of just oil. Green wax stain would look very Nice!


----------



## VILARIKA

Phrygian, what email did you contact him with?


----------



## travis bickle

got to rap to bernie for a while on monday, and will post some progress shots shortly. glad to hear him in great spirits. beyond stoked.


----------



## noob_pwn

can someone please PM me the email address BRJ is using now? I can't seem to get in touch with him about my guitar and he's usually quick to reply


----------



## toiletstand

can someone do the same for me please? looking to get in touch soon. want to message the right place. thanks!


edit: thanks phrygian!


----------



## Rook

*raises hand*

Could someone also share said email addy with me?


----------



## ryanoddi

Fun111 said:


> *raises hand*
> 
> Could someone also share said email addy with me?



pm'd


----------



## ryanoddi

MetalDaze said:


> Totally know what you mean on not knowing the name of the color. When Bernie did my Diva, I sent him a pic and said, "like that".
> 
> And sure as hell, it looked just like the pic



Exactly what I did, haven't seen it in person yet (obviously,) but the pic I found happened to be of an unfinished guitar as well... looks dead on to me!


----------



## Rook

Thanks guys


----------



## ikarus

could somebody please send me the right email adress too??

edit: thanks phrygian


----------



## Phrygian

Done


Edit: removed the quote of the message right above this one, heard people Get banned for that stuff


----------



## ras1988

So um, I have no idea if I upset him or what is going on but I emailed Bernie at *that* email about 5 days ago, and left a message at the shop (and now the shop # shoots me directly to VM). It seems that everyone is in direct communication just fine with Bernie. I am not going to get butt hurt over that part of it, I would just like some idea as to where my guitars are in the process they were both purchased as "in-stock" pieces and it has been about 8 months for one and 7 months for the other with all of the balanced paid off on one at the purchase point and the other being paid off at the start of the year. Has anyone else gotten the silent treatment?


----------



## Khoi

you aren't the only one. I e-mailed Bernie at the end of January, he then replied to me at the beginning of March telling me he'd contact me, and I haven't heard anything from him since.

I've used the e-mail he previously responded to me before, but it seems he may have changed it?


----------



## Rook

ras1988 said:


> So um, I have no idea if I upset him or what is going on but I emailed Bernie at *that* email about 5 days ago, and left a message at the shop (and now the shop # shoots me directly to VM). It seems that everyone is in direct communication just fine with Bernie. I am not going to get butt hurt over that part of it, I would just like some idea as to where my guitars are in the process they were both purchased as "in-stock" pieces and it has been about 8 months for one and 7 months for the other with all of the balanced paid off on one at the purchase point and the other being paid off at the start of the year. Has anyone else gotten the silent treatment?



I know what you mean about feeling like you upset him.

I've had zero contact for months on the email address, which is the same as what people here sent me, which many people seem to have some success with. I decided I wanted to just sell the spot and be done and he won't even acknowledge that.


----------



## TomAwesome

I just wanted to pop in to mention that mine came in today, and there are no issues with it. The specs are right, the frets are good, and as far as I can tell, everything is perfect. It was even almost in tune. I am pleased.


----------



## leonardo7

Bernie is sending me my invoice tonight and says it will ship Tuesday


----------



## MetalDaze

Right on! The wheels are turning once again in Hesperia


----------



## SpaceDock

I can't seem to get through on this direct email either, it is quite frustrating. I just keep hoping that I get my guitars so I can resume normal life. This has certainly been the most painful wait of my 30 year life.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

TomAwesome said:


> I just wanted to pop in to mention that mine came in today, and there are no issues with it. The specs are right, the frets are good, and as far as I can tell, everything is perfect. It was even almost in tune. I am pleased.


 
Pics? Congrats man!


----------



## Larrikin666

Yeah! That's what I like to come home to.


----------



## leonardo7

BKPs take too long so we decided for the Dimarzios for now. This is getting sent out on Tuesday


----------



## Larrikin666

God...I love that fade. I basically just told him to make my other 6 similar to that....but super purple in the center.


----------



## Phrygian

Got some photo updates from Bernie!

This is the one that is mine:











And It's looking great! hopefully it wont be too long till its done now!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Heck yeah guys. It's good to see him back in the saddle and working again. I got word that he's going to try and ship mine next week. I'm getting more and more stoked. Freaking out stoked, actually.


----------



## Qweklain

Phrygian said:


> Got some photo updates from Bernie!
> 
> This is the one that is mine:
> 
> (See pictures in original post)
> 
> And It's looking great! hopefully it wont be too long till its done now!


I really like that top! Almost looks like the pattern of a plaid shirt!


----------



## Larrikin666




----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Larkin,

What, exactly, is that color there?


----------



## Phrygian

Qweklain said:


> I really like that top! Almost looks like the pattern of a plaid shirt!



haha, true!


----------



## SpaceDock

TomAwesome said:


> I just wanted to pop in to mention that mine came in today, and there are no issues with it. The specs are right, the frets are good, and as far as I can tell, everything is perfect. It was even almost in tune. I am pleased.



All of these guitars need a mandatory NGD so we can live vicariously until ours arrive.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Larkin,
> 
> What, exactly, is that color there?



Blue denim stain. The blue was a bit brighter before buffing. I actually like it even more now. You really have the look for the blue, but it's definitely there.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Oh yeah! There it is! I am betting it's a little more blue in person too. For some reason on my monitor it has a slightly mossy appearance. Either way, I bet it's going to be freaking ridiculous.


----------



## ras1988

leonardo7 said:


> Bernie is sending me my invoice tonight and says it will ship Tuesday



It does renew faith to hear that things are going on and he is getting guitars out. He may be dealing with these on a batch basis and may not want to be burdened with the next "batch" till the current one ships. Thank you for the information it has definitely brought me some level of comfort.


----------



## WillDfx

Dude I totally regret selling that 6'er spot now! It looks crazy!!! It's cool to see it come this area regardless. Are you keeping the original pickups I requested? BKP c-bomb & DiMarzio Injector?


----------



## Larrikin666

WillDfx said:


> Dude I totally regret selling that 6'er spot now! It looks crazy!!! It's cool to see it come this area regardless. Are you keeping the original pickups I requested? BKP c-bomb & DiMarzio Injector?



I don't think so. I think Janne sent him a custom Seymour Duncan rail single spaced humbucker. I'm gonna have that sent back to Janne. I haven't picked anything yet. I really like the Crunch Lab in Bernie's guitars, so I'll probably have him put another in that guitar. Not sure about the neck.


----------



## Larrikin666

Updated pics for my Hesperian with maple board that Bernie just sprayed today.


----------



## Adrian-XI

^wow, that looks great!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Hot damn it's good to see bernie getting caught up! Can't wait till the NGDs start popping up


----------



## HRC51

I had a long phone conversation with Mr. Rico today.

WHAT A JERK!

No I'm kidding - he made me say that. Really nice guy with a good sense of humor. 

I have no idea when the guitar will be done, but I know that it is ready for the final clear coat. He has a lot of guitars in progress, and I have no idea how he keeps track. Luckily, we spoke in time to have him not apply the inlays. 

He took some some pictures for me as well.


----------



## ryanoddi

HRC51 said:


> I had a long phone conversation with Mr. Rico today.
> 
> WHAT A JERK!
> 
> No I'm kidding - he made me say that. Really nice guy with a good sense of humor.
> 
> I have no idea when the guitar will be done, but I know that it is ready for the final clear coat. He has a lot of guitars in progress, and I have no idea how he keeps track. Luckily, we spoke in time to have him not apply the inlays.
> 
> He took some some pictures for me as well.



dude. so jealous of that color! What is it? I would've definitely chose that color over mine. Don't get me wrong, I'm extremely happy with the color I chose, but shit... I might need another now


----------



## WillDfx

^ I second that. What the Hell is that stain called?


----------



## HRC51

Bernie said it's a triple burst that they just tried for the first time. He mentioned yellow and purple! Other people have now requested it, but so far, they have not been able to duplicate it. 

I think it will really jump out at you once the clear coat is applied.


----------



## Phrygian

Hot damn! that would look killer in satin!


----------



## mikernaut

Seeing as I just moved... should we place bets on where my guitar gets shipped and if he got the memo


----------



## MatrixClaw

SpaceDock said:


> Anyone get an update yet since he got back into the shop? I emailed last week and still haven't heard anything. My guitars had 2 1/2 weeks four months ago.



Yeah, I've emailed him 3 times, on two different emails, since he supposedly got back from the hospital with no reply.

Mine should've shipped months ago (with 3 others which people have long since gotten), but there was a mishap with it that was corrected quickly, but for some reason my guitar STILL hasn't shipped. You'd think if mine was going to ship with ones that have been in the hands of their owners for months, you'd make that one a priority to get finished and shipped ASAP...

I completely paid off my guitar 5 months ago, when it was supposed to ship. What angers me most is that I had to pay for the guitar way back then, under the pretense that it was going to ship within a week or two, and it's now 5 months later and not only do I not have the remaining $800+, but I also don't have a guitar to show for it, nor any communication as to what is happening with it...


----------



## Rook

I got my first correspondence in 4 months today, it wasn't with an update or any info, just a 'I'll look into it' message, which I've had before.

Maybe he'll come through with this one, we'll see!


----------



## Rook

Larrikin666 said:


> Yeah! That's what I like to come home to.
> 
> [awesome video]



That's sick! Bernie's such a cool guy, I just hope this all comes together.

How long have you been waiting for that, Chad?


----------



## Phrygian

I got an e-mail from Bernie today, an update where he stated he is working his ass of trying to update everyone as fast as possible, and he is working with answering phones, mails, looking for a new web guy (the last one got fired because he didn't do his job) and building guitars at the same time. 

So if you haven't gotten a reply from him for a while, try sending him a new email and he'll probably get back to you pretty soon!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

My 8 string is supposed to be finished this week. At least, that's what the man says...


----------



## mikernaut

He sure goes through a lot of webguys.


----------



## Larrikin666

Fun111 said:


> That's sick! Bernie's such a cool guy, I just hope this all comes together.
> 
> How long have you been waiting for that, Chad?



I'm actually the 3rd owner of that slot. It was originally Will's...then Janne's....now mine. I bought two 6 string slots right after I got my 7. I also have two full blown customs that I'm gonna have him start after he's completed everyone's BFRs.


----------



## Rook

So presumably the slot came into existence a long time ago then


----------



## Larrikin666

Fun111 said:


> So presumably the slot came into existence a long time ago then




I think I picked up both 6's a few months ago. They're all BFR guitars, so I assume the orders all got put in that same November in 2010.


----------



## Rook

OIC


----------



## WickedSymphony

Phrygian said:


> I got an e-mail from Bernie today, an update where he stated he is working his ass of trying to update everyone as fast as possible, and he is working with answering phones, mails, looking for a new web guy (the last one got fired because he didn't do his job) and building guitars at the same time.
> 
> So if you haven't gotten a reply from him for a while, try sending him a new email and he'll probably get back to you pretty soon!



Got the same e-mail from him this morning, too. 

Last I heard from him was 4 months ago after my guitar hit paint before all that stuff happened, but it's not like I've been trying to contact him anyway until this week so I'm not really worried. Mostly just curious since my guitar's already been painted I'd imagine it should be done soon-ish.


----------



## SpaceDock

I've been going back and forth with him for the last few days, no pics yet though. I think if anyone on here lives within a few hours should haul their ass to the shop and snap some pics for us, send a few emails, and maybe sweep up the shop for Berm. 

He could really use a hand, seems like.


----------



## Khoi

got an e-mail today saying what everyone else has said pretty much, that he's trying to catch up on updating customers, getting guitars done, etc.

told me he's be e-mailing an update later today, so we'll see


btw, this is a new one posted up on his Facebook page... I believe this one belongs to Killertone? Hopefully the owner doesn't mind me posting this


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Here's an update on my 8 string, looking good! Still missing offset dots, then it's ready!


----------



## leonardo7

Damn nice 8 string right there


----------



## Hollowway

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Here's an update on my 8 string, looking good! Still missing offset dots, then it's ready!



You mean on the FB? How is that going to happen? Isn't that a pre-fretting procedure, or no?

Also, for those wondering about the order he works in, I don't think it's FIFO. If there is any kind of a problem he doesn't stop the other work to catch it up, it just goes along with the others. And full customs don't have any priority over the BFRs. So, from what I can understand, if a guitar was ready to ship, or someone at some stage, and a lot of time has passed, it means something was screwed up, and either it needed to be rebuilt or somehow fixed. Generally he doesn't make a point of informing the customer at that point, he just moves on to fix it. My custom needs to be rebuilt 3 times and my BFR 2x, which is why there's been the delay there for me. So that's a possibility for some of you.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ these are looking great

As far as the offset dots, I'd say f it. That guitar is beautiful as is and dots wouldn't be worth a potential rebuild.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Hollowway said:


> You mean on the FB? How is that going to happen? Isn't that a pre-fretting procedure, or no?
> 
> Also, for those wondering about the order he works in, I don't think it's FIFO. If there is any kind of a problem he doesn't stop the other work to catch it up, it just goes along with the others. And full customs don't have any priority over the BFRs. So, from what I can understand, if a guitar was ready to ship, or someone at some stage, and a lot of time has passed, it means something was screwed up, and either it needed to be rebuilt or somehow fixed. Generally he doesn't make a point of informing the customer at that point, he just moves on to fix it. My custom needs to be rebuilt 3 times and my BFR 2x, which is why there's been the delay there for me. So that's a possibility for some of you.



Honestly don't know, asked him and said "no worries I'll put the dots", the initial october 2010 order does indeed have offset dots among the specs so he should know. As far as keeping it without inlays...I make tons of mistakes without 'em, my biggest problem.

I'm actually more concerned by the slightly offset pickup cavities...


----------



## kruneh

I don´t even care to email him, cause I know it won´t do any good to any of us.
Mine was painted half a year ago, so at least it´s not still in the wood shop..
Honestly, I am concerned about it showing up next year with wrong specs.
I´m sorry, I´ve kept my mouth shut long enough but this is really getting stupid.


----------



## VILARIKA

kruneh said:


> I don´t even care to email him, cause I know it won´t do any good to any of us.
> Mine was painted half a year ago, so at least it´s not still in the wood shop..
> Honestly, I am concerned about it showing up next year with wrong specs.
> I´m sorry, I´ve kept my mouth shut long enough but this is really getting stupid.



Just email him. I know emailing him might kill some of his valuable time, but suppose there's an error on your guitar when you do get it. You'll want him to fix it, and that will kill a ridiculous amount of time compared to just sending him an email .

Not to mention, he seems to be dedicating some time to answering everyone now. I'd say it's the best time to get your Q's out.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

I guess my 8 is finally ready!







The inlays look good (despite the pic's bad quality)






Back shot


----------



## djpharoah

^ So did he refret it?


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

djpharoah said:


> ^ So did he refret it?



dunno honestly, I just know he told me he was gonna put the inlays, and so he did.


----------



## Locrian

djpharoah said:


> ^ So did he refret it?



Don't see any reason why you'd have to refret with that style inlay.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I guess well find out when he gets it, but I don't think the frets would get in the way.


----------



## mikernaut

Lets hope the inlays aren't stickers 

I'm still waiting to hear some news on my redo guitar


----------



## Rook

Couple of people here who I'm looking forward to getting their guitars, cos I know they'll sell em.

My bank account's ready folks 

But seriously I'm pretty sure Bernie sent everyone the same update, and I've not heard from him since. I just want to know if my damn guitar exists.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Fun111 said:


> Couple of people here who I'm looking forward to getting their guitars, cos I know they'll sell em.
> 
> My bank account's ready folks
> 
> But seriously I'm pretty sure Bernie sent everyone the same update, and I've not heard from him since. I just want to know if my damn guitar exists.



Yep, haven't heard from him either after that update. I'm gonna give it a little bit more time then try again.


----------



## killertone

Khoi said:


> got an e-mail today saying what everyone else has said pretty much, that he's trying to catch up on updating customers, getting guitars done, etc.
> 
> told me he's be e-mailing an update later today, so we'll see
> 
> 
> btw, this is a new one posted up on his Facebook page... I believe this one belongs to Killertone? Hopefully the owner doesn't mind me posting this



That one isn't mine. I have a 7 string with a black oil finish that looks like this:


----------



## Khoi

killertone said:


> That one isn't mine. I have a 7 string with a black oil finish that looks like this:




ah, my bad! I thought I remembered you having that top with the gray finish, I was close though! either way, they both look sick!!


----------



## killertone

True!


----------



## Rap Hat

I'm surprised to hear that an update was sent out to "everyone". I haven't heard from Bernie since Feb., and my guitar's been paid off for 6 months, since I was told it was 'ready for assembly' and I had the $ (as Bernie told me, all it needed was hardware to be installed, it was completely done otherwise).

I've been pretty patient, with my only issue based on a miscommunication (if you could call it that; it had to do with the whole "ready for assembly" thing, which Bernie explained didn't mean the guitar was anywhere near being sent out because... Uhhh, some reason I guess?

I'm mainly surprised the guitar has been static literally since I got the spot in sept. of last year. It was apparently only needing hardware and final setup then, and I've made sure to ask if there were any issues the times we've talked.

I'm not saying I can't get in touch with him; every time I've tried he's been prompt with getting back. I'm just frustrated that I have to go out of my way to get any updates while he's sending out mass emails to others, and when we do talk I get told that it just needs hardware. I'd be more inclined to contact him if I thought it would be any different, but I know I'll come off the convo elated that he's working on it, only to get dejected 6 months later when no progress has been made but dozens of other people have had updates out of the blue.

Bernie is a nice guy and great to talk to, but this whole mess has really brought forth some serious disorganization to the point where I'm sure there's guitars he's just forgot about.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I have been thinking a lot about that as well. It doesn't make sense.

I was thinking about what Max said a long time ago, the flood of BFR guitars would lower the sale and resale of normally priced Rico's. Maybe this has been an attempt to slow that flow of instruments in order to better control their availability on the market and the pricing. 

Though, potentially others were right that Bernie had farmed these guitars out to another build shop to lower the price, like localized imports maybe from Mexico. That could have gone wrong and caused him to rebuild the guitars himself, hence the overworking and crazy QC problems. 

Hell, maybe he's just getting older and the shit is hard to do. 

Maybe I've just been obsessing about the guitar I should have gotten a year ago. Doesn't really matter until I see a guitar.


----------



## mikernaut

sigh, I typed up a rant in my frustration of playing the waiting game, but it's not going to help things in the end. bottom line ... alot of what has gone down is possibly going to hurt his Rep. I personally would still love to get a 3rd BRJ made ( even after all the chaos) but it's clear things are not as smooth as they used to be.


----------



## Isan

This thread still upsets me even after selling my slot off .... it is just totally bogus what he is doing to everyone.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I, too, am merely waiting for a guitar which I was told would be delivered, at latest, in September of 2011 (non-BFR). Bernie emailed me at the beginning of last week saying that it would be finished by this previous Friday... I am hoping that I will not be disappointed - yet again. I'm about one more delay away from saying screw it and politely requesting that my money and my self-supplied pickups be returned to me.

In the case that he is actually finished with my guitar, and I receive it in a timely manner, then everything will be up to how exceptional the instrument is. No matter what though, I am extremely reluctant to ever purchase a guitar from him again. I can't say that I would recommend him to any musicians who are looking for a custom instrument unless they have absolutely no strings attached to when they would like to receive, if they ever do, an instrument they paid good money for. 

The whole process has been a weird roller coaster ride from Hell and I would like it, quite frankly, to be finished with.


----------



## leonardo7

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I, too, am merely waiting for a guitar which I was told would be delivered, at latest, in September of 2011 (non-BFR). Bernie emailed me at the beginning of last week saying that it would be finished by this previous Friday... I am hoping that I will not be disappointed - yet again. I'm about one more delay away from saying screw it and politely requesting that my money and my self-supplied pickups be returned to me.
> 
> In the case that he is actually finished with my guitar, and I receive it in a timely manner, then everything will be up to how exceptional the instrument is. No matter what though, I am extremely reluctant to ever purchase a guitar from him again. I can't say that I would recommend him to any musicians who are looking for a custom instrument unless they have absolutely no strings attached to when they would like to receive, if they ever do, an instrument they paid good money for.
> 
> The whole process has been a weird roller coaster ride from Hell and I would like it, quite frankly, to be finished with.



Question for you, have you paid final balance due yet?

Im about to pay final balance due today and Bernie says he will ship mine either tomorrow or Wed at the latest. Ive seen pics of the final product so I have to assume its all good. I cant imagine paying and then not receiving the guitar this week, or next week. I have to say that I am excited.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I hope yours would be ready, but I paid for mine many months ago because he said it had two weeks.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Oh, I paid for my guitar in full a long, long time ago, when I was first told that the guitar would be ready to ship in the 3rd week of September, 2011. I just got an email back from Bernie after I asked if the guitar was ready (as he said it would be), and his reply was that it would be 100% finished this week. I am awaiting a reply as to whether it will ship this week or not.

I had intended to pay the guitar off regardless of if it was finished or not. I had the money, and I intended to invest into this instrument, so I wasn't peeved to pay it off and wait - I didn't want to end up in a position where with my luck the guitar would have been done and the money would have gone into some other purchase. I didn't believe, however, that I'd be almost 16 months in with no guitar. Had I known that from the get-go, I would have jumped on a J-custom or some other high-end production guitar, knowing that it wouldn't have likely been to the same quality and specs that I wanted. 

My only consolation is that I know the man is taking time and getting the details right with my instrument. We have discussed on numerous occasions that this will be my main axe and I need it to be solid and done properly. I anxiously await this guitar.


----------



## Rap Hat

mikernaut said:


> sigh, I typed up a rant in my frustration of playing the waiting game, but it's not going to help things in the end. bottom line ... alot of what has gone down is possibly going to hurt his Rep. I personally would still love to get a 3rd BRJ made ( even after all the chaos) but it's clear *things are not as smooth as they used to be*.



This is what bums me out the most. I remember reading way back about the 3-4 months build times, guitars going out to the high-end shops, rave reviews etc. I hopped on this knowing that people had been waiting almost a year by that point, but I'd been reassured there wasn't much of a wait left.

I really just want a nice guitar I can pick up and play, that doesn't have a multitude of problems off the bat. I'm stuck using my Agile Pendulum 8 since my other guitars all have major issues, and I'm worried this will be another $1000+ headache.


E: Ugh, I was just looking through my records and discovered I'd paid it off in December. Christ, it's been 7 months.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Can someone please PM me the email he's replying to people on? I have 3 different emails he's sent me emails from, and I've not gotten a single reply from any of them...


----------



## leonardo7

I have paid in full and I am guaranteed my guitar by Friday. I told him I want to use it Fri night.


----------



## MatrixClaw

leonardo7 said:


> I have paid in full and I am guaranteed my guitar by Friday. I told him I want to use it Fri night.



Good for you, at least someone's getting their guitar.

I paid my balance in full 6 months ago and haven't heard a peep from him in 2 1/2 months, despite my efforts to contact him several times. In fact, my guitar is pictured on the front page of his website, completed.


Would you mind sending me the email he's been communicating with you on? Either he's using a new one or he's just ignoring me at this point, since others seem to be getting plenty of replies....


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Just payed full balance, hope to receive it asap.


----------



## toiletstand

looking forward to seeing all the sweet new guitars


----------



## Hollowway

I'm hoping that I'll see my custom 828 sometime soon since it's been in before the BFRs (which I also have one of). Can't help but feel this, though:


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, Bernie just got back to me verifying that the guitar will be completed and shipped by this week. Until that axe is in my hands though, I'm going to sit on my freakish anxiety. I don't want to be let down again.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Just completed my payment as well, was told the guitar will be shipping next week. Hopefully, I'll get an awesome reason to post a NGD soon  Good luck to everyone else expecting their guitars in the coming week too!


----------



## Might-is-Right

WickedSymphony said:


> Just completed my payment as well, was told the guitar will be shipping next week. Hopefully, I'll get an awesome reason to post a NGD soon  Good luck to everyone else expecting their guitars in the coming week too!



Good luck Matthew, hope he comes thru for you...


----------



## WickedSymphony

Might-is-Right said:


> Good luck Matthew, hope he comes thru for you...



Thanks Ted, I hope so, too. And thanks again for the spot 

It's definitely been disheartening reading this thread, but I'm just trying to stay optimistic (which is quite unusual for me to be honest  ). I'm sure the guitar will be well worth the wait, though. 

But I really hope things start getting smoother for everyone who has one on order. Seems like a really shitty experience for most people here


----------



## Hollowway

You guys posting about getting your BFRs this week or next, remember that there is a standing order that I will find and kill anyone who get's their BFR before I get my 2.5 year old custom. No joke. I'm putting on my black hoodie now.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Hollowway said:


> You guys posting about getting your BFRs this week or next, remember that there is a standing order that I will find and kill anyone who get's their BFR before I get my 2.5 year old custom. No joke. I'm putting on my black hoodie now.



2.5 years? Rough!

Bernie is a cool guy and is always a pleasure to chat with, but clearly his office could use some structure. It really wouldnt be that hard to pay some college kid $200 to come in a few days every month or two and update people on the status of their guitars, and another to compile some sort of list of order dates and base the importance of completion based on the oldest order date, so people aren't getting so pissed over others getting their guitars before they do, eventhough they were "ahead in line."

Hell, I'd do it for free if I lived in California just so people start receiving their guitars and things weren't so chaotic...


----------



## Phrygian

Heck, I'd take that job and move there If I was offered it! I could'nt do it for free though because of the moving part


----------



## Larrikin666

^ Well.....I was actually scheduled to fly out there and do everything you mentioned, but I ended up needing to purchase a car out of the blue, so that entire trip got cancelled. I was gonna help out for a few days and get pictures taken, updates called/emailed, and help prioritize everything. I'd still like to do that, but it probably won't be until the fall.


----------



## leonardo7

MatrixClaw said:


> 2.5 years? Rough!
> 
> Bernie is a cool guy and is always a pleasure to chat with, but clearly his office could use some structure. It really wouldnt be that hard to pay some college kid $200 to come in a few days every month or two and update people on the status of their guitars, and another to compile some sort of list of order dates and base the importance of completion based on the oldest order date, so people aren't getting so pissed over others getting their guitars before they do, eventhough they were "ahead in line."
> 
> Hell, I'd do it for free if I lived in California just so people start receiving their guitars and things weren't so chaotic...





Phrygian said:


> Heck, I'd take that job and move there If I was offered it! I could'nt do it for free though because of the moving part





Larrikin666 said:


> ^ Well.....I was actually scheduled to fly out there and do everything you mentioned, but I ended up needing to purchase a car out of the blue, so that entire trip got cancelled. I was gonna help out for a few days and get pictures taken, updates called/emailed, and help prioritize everything. I'd still like to do that, but it probably won't be until the fall.



The dudes in the desert an hour or two north east of Los Angeles. Its not entirely a shit hole of a town but not exactly the type of place youd want to live. Central California sucks! Theres really nothing going on there, kind of a boring place honestly. No offense to Bernie or anyone who lives in the area but I couldnt do it even if I was desperate. Good place for building guitars though as the air is dry. Finding a local decent college kid to do that might be sort of hard. Not even sure theres a college nearby


----------



## MetalDaze

leonardo7 said:


> The dudes in the desert an hour or two north east of Los Angeles. Its not entirely a shit hole of a town but not exactly the type of place youd want to live. Central California sucks! Theres really nothing going on there, kind of a boring place honestly. No offense to Bernie or anyone who lives in the area but I couldnt do it even if I was desperate. Good place for building guitars though as the air is dry. Finding a local decent college kid to do that might be sort of hard. Not even sure theres a college nearby


 
Maybe he can find an old fart willing to drive from Palm Springs


----------



## MatrixClaw

leonardo7 said:


> The dudes in the desert an hour or two north east of Los Angeles. Its not entirely a shit hole of a town but not exactly the type of place youd want to live. Central California sucks! Theres really nothing going on there, kind of a boring place honestly. No offense to Bernie or anyone who lives in the area but I couldnt do it even if I was desperate. Good place for building guitars though as the air is dry. Finding a local decent college kid to do that might be sort of hard. Not even sure theres a college nearby



Hesperia, CA is only 15 minutes from University of La Verne, 13 minutes from San Joaquin Valley College, 12 minutes from Azusa Pacific University, 10 minutes from the Victor Valley College, 5 minutes from Brandman University and about a 45 min drive from San Bernardino, which for a job that would only require traveling a few days out of the month, isn't that bad for anyone, really


----------



## leonardo7

Status:

Mon 18th Bernie sends me balance due email
Mon 18th I ask Bernie when guitar will ship
Mon 18th Bernie says by Tues, Wed at the latest
Mon 18th I ask if I will get it by Fri 22nd for a gig possibly
Mon 18th Bernie says he will 2nd day air ship if I pay extra $35
Mon 18th Bernie promises I will have tracking and will receive by Fri
Mon 18th I pay balance due PLUS extra $35 for fast shipping
Mon 18th Bernie sends a thank you for payment

Wed 20th I receive no tracking

Thur 21st I contact Bernie and receive no response

Fri 22nd I receive no response, no tracking and NO GUITAR 

Sat 23rd Im wondering when guitar will arrive and will I get back my $35

-OK, so Ive attached no emotion to this, just hard facts, I wait patiently as he probably just got caught up and will send it next week-


----------



## kruneh

leonardo7 said:


> Status:
> 
> Disaster



At this point he shouldn´t act like that, I have serious doubt about the outcome to all of this.
Haven´t got a single reply.


----------



## SpaceDock

^this is really disappointing. I was hoping he could start finishing some of these.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Wow, that's pretty messed up. I'm worried about mine too now


----------



## conjurer_of_riffs

*Mod Edit: It would be better if you read the thread and note that the thread is ONLY for customer updates!*


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Hell. At this point I just hope the guy is okay. I haven't heard anything about my build either, which was apparently supposed to be 100% finished and shipped by the end of this week - scout's honor. The last thing that I heard was Tuesday night he said he'd send me pictures of the set up and finished product Wednesday night, and then Wednesday morning he emailed me to say that he was in the shop - then nothing.

The last time we had a disappearance, it ended up that the man was quite sick. Like I said, I just hope that everything is alright with him. Yikes.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

It's interesting how he has an entire workforce of "woodshop guys", painters, and "web guys", yet the second he's supposedly struck ill no updates are given or guitars are shipped, even those that seem to be shown as complete.

Sorry to butt in again, and I realize I'm breaking my own rule. I'm just bummed as all hell for the guys in here. Especially good dudes like Alain and Hollowway. 

I'm pulling for you guys.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Just so it's clear - I don't know what's going on at all. I'm just saying that I hope he's okay. More than likely he just didn't get shit done as fast as he thought he would and is still working. I was just hoping out that I hope he isn't MIA for too long.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Just so it's clear - I don't know what's going on at all. I'm just saying that I hope he's okay. More than likely he just didn't get shit done as fast as he thought he would and is still working. I was just hoping out that I hope he isn't MIA for too long.



I'm hoping that's the case as well. It would be terrible if he got ill again, not to mention another stop in communication would make people flip out more and that probably wouldn't help when the dude needs to rest a bit and get better. 

Anyway, he told me mine would be shipping out this coming week so we'll see what happens. Maybe he'll end up shipping all of ours at the same time.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

WickedSymphony said:


> I'm hoping that's the case as well. It would be terrible if he got ill again, not to mention another stop in communication would make people flip out more and that probably wouldn't help when the dude needs to rest a bit and get better.
> 
> Anyway, he told me mine would be shipping out this coming week so we'll see what happens. Maybe he'll end up shipping all of ours at the same time.



Hey - maybe he gets group discounts, right? 

Seriously though - disappearing luthier syndrome is a pretty nutty deal. And he seemed in such good spirits when we were shooting emails about the "final days" of my build. 

People that have been talking with me throughout this whole deal and I have a bit of a joke about being on the "two-week" list. I have been told on at least 7 different occasions that my guitar would "be ready to ship within 2 weeks". 

It looks like we've been bumped up to the "2 days" list, which I suppose will invariably be followed up with the "immediate future" list. I just hope there isn't a "lost in shipping" list as well as a "Oh your guitar wasn't the neon gravy colored?" list.


----------



## jake7doyle

how have i not seen this thread before!?!?! some incredible builds here!!


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> People that have been talking with me throughout this whole deal and I have a bit of a joke about being on the "two-week" list. I have been told on at least 7 different occasions that my guitar would "be ready to ship within 2 weeks".
> 
> It looks like we've been bumped up to the "2 days" list, which I suppose will invariably be followed up with the "immediate future" list. I just hope there isn't a "lost in shipping" list as well as a "Oh your guitar wasn't the neon gravy colored?" list.



I hope I don't end up being a part of those joke lists 

As it is, everyone I know already bugs me about when my guitar's gonna be done (though this would invariably happen regardless of the luthier since most of them aren't guitar players). And not that I have to answer to them or anything, but when they keep asking and all I can say is "I dunno" it starts racking up the nerves 

But hey, here's to hoping all is well


----------



## SpaceDock

leonardo7 said:


> Status:
> 
> Mon 18th Bernie sends me balance due email
> Mon 18th I ask Bernie when guitar will ship
> Mon 18th Bernie says by Tues, Wed at the latest
> Mon 18th I ask if I will get it by Fri 22nd for a gig possibly
> Mon 18th Bernie says he will 2nd day air ship if I pay extra $35
> Mon 18th Bernie promises I will have tracking and will receive by Fri
> Mon 18th I pay balance due PLUS extra $35 for fast shipping
> Mon 18th Bernie sends a thank you for payment
> 
> Wed 20th I receive no tracking
> 
> Thur 21st I contact Bernie and receive no response
> 
> Fri 22nd I receive no response, no tracking and NO GUITAR
> 
> Sat 23rd Im wondering when guitar will arrive and will I get back my $35
> 
> -OK, so Ive attached no emotion to this, just hard facts, I wait patiently as he probably just got caught up and will send it next week-



Did you try calling or just email?


----------



## Locrian

SpaceDock said:


> Did you try calling or just email?



I'm not leonard but I haven't had any of my calls returned in about a year, and every single email I've gotten has been the same reply, basically "I'll get you an update tomorrow". I have about 10 emails from him saying the exact same thing, with no follow up ever. Not a very fun experience.


----------



## ikarus

Locrian said:


> and every single email I've gotten has been the same reply, basically "I'll get you an update tomorrow". I have about 10 emails from him saying the exact same thing, with no follow up ever.



same here.


----------



## leonardo7

SpaceDock said:


> Did you try calling or just email?



Non of my communication back and forth has been through email. Im gonna be patient, I mean hes sent me pics of a finished guitar. Ive posted the pics in this thread. He was excited when I told him I was going to do that. he wanted me to post the pics in this thread. I cant fathom not getting the guitar this upcoming week, providing that hes in good health as Im pretty sure he is.


----------



## Hollowway

I'm just curious who the heck is getting all these guitars. There are no NGDs online, no dealers have any, there's only a couple on ebay, and I'm not seeing any artists getting them. Who the heck is buying them and hiding them? If I didn't know better I'd say only a handful were finished in the past year, but there must be loads of these getting churned out, because I can't imagine any other scenario.


----------



## mikernaut

Yeah, that's a good question. They seem to be very niche guitars. I know Nick at the Axe Palace has a few in stock / on order. But you don't see many others except maybe at Boogie Street's site.

If these were KXK's the obvious answer would be Technomancer is buying them all


----------



## leonardo7

Just heard from him. It appears as though right as he promised me last Mon that my guitar would go out by Wed, his wife reminded him that they had to go out of town to get some serious tests done from his last episode that put him out for 2 months. He says he will be back on Mon and my guitar is going out on Tuesday. If he has health issues then we really need to be supportive of him right now. Believe what you will but this is what I am being told by the man himself.


----------



## SpaceDock

A little bit of waiting is definitely worth having Rico's in the years to come.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

A better shot of the finished product, ready to be shipped!


----------



## Adrian-XI

Saw that on Facebook. Looks awesome dude!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah, I spoke with Bernie via text yesterday as well. It sounds like his plan is to get my guitar shipped, at the latest, by Thursday. We're going to talk a little more detail today or tomorrow. I'm just glad that the dude is okay and healthy enough to keep working. Sending positive vibrations to the man, for sure.


----------



## Larrikin666

leonardo7 said:


> Just heard from him. It appears as though right as he promised me last Mon that my guitar would go out by Wed, his wife reminded him that they had to go out of town to get some serious tests done from his last episode that put him out for 2 months. He says he will be back on Mon and my guitar is going out on Tuesday. If he has health issues then we really need to be supportive of him right now. Believe what you will but this is what I am being told by the man himself.




I can verify his health issues. Honestly, he has a lot on his plate outside of the shop right now. I was the first person he called after his first scare a few months ago. We agreed it's not best to put out there exactly what's going on, but rest assured he's not going to keel over and die tomorrow. He and I talk a lot. I wish I could express how much respect and admiration I have for him working through the health and personal issues that have to be on his mind constantly. 

I know I harp on this stuff a lot.


----------



## Rook

Larrikin666 said:


> I can verify his health issues. Honestly, he has a lot on his plate outside of the shop right now. I was the first person he called after his first scare a few months ago. We agreed it's not best to put out there exactly what's going on, but rest assured he's not going to keel over and die tomorrow. He and I talk a lot. I wish I could express how much respect and admiration I have for him working through the health and personal issues that have to be on his mind constantly.
> 
> I know I harp on this stuff a lot.



It is literally entirely my respect for you and your view that has stopped me from pushing for a slot sale (info from Bernie) and giving up. That said if it had all come together when I did advertise my slot for sale I'd have let it go...


----------



## Larrikin666

Fun111 said:


> It is literally entirely my respect for you and your view that has stopped me from pushing for a slot sale (info from Bernie) and giving up. That said if it had all come together when I did advertise my slot for sale I'd have let it go...



You have a particularly weird, raw deal going on man. I think there's something about your name that just doesn't resonate in Bernie's mind after he and I speak. He usually responds to my requests for specific updates within 48 hours. You, however, disappear into the ether until he and I speak again a few days later....then the cycle repeats. 

I have a personal interest in the update of your guitar simply because of the rosewood neck. I always like your insight into guitars, so your thoughts would end up swaying me one way or another when Bernie and I sit down to spec out my custom 7 in a few months.


----------



## Rook

^Exactly what I get! Even if it doesn't exist I just want to know that! So odd...

I really appreciate the effort you've put into that by the way man, if I'm ever in Pittsburgh...


----------



## travis bickle

final payment was made last week, and is close to completion. here's hoping for an onslaught of BRJ NGD's in the coming weeks!!!!!!!!


----------



## jbard

I got a couple updates on my 828. It's getting there:


----------



## MatrixClaw

Sent out another 4 emails to the various ones I've had contact through.

Finally got two replies back; both told me to call him, but both had different phone numbers. Neither number I've gotten an answer/reply from in the past. I honestly don't understand how someone can type out a paragraph reply that tells me to call him to discuss the guitar, but can't just answer the question in a sentence or two and save both of us the time. I don't want to call him during working hours and take away the inevitable hour of time the conversation is going to last from someone else's guitar. It's not my responsibility to keep myself updated on my guitar, he should be calling _me_


----------



## JP Universe

I'm just at the point of leaving him alone.... hell, I'm happy to wait for however long it takes. I'm much more interested in my other customs that are going on now.

Sucks for the guys that have their completed guitars ready to go! Best of luck to everyone!


----------



## leonardo7

Shipped!


----------



## MetalDaze

leonardo7 said:


> Shipped!


 
By Odin's beard, I sure hope it knocks your socks off.


----------



## ikarus

leonardo7 said:


> Shipped!



awaiting an epic NGD thread!


----------



## Rook

JP Universe said:


> I'm just at the point of leaving him alone.... hell, I'm happy to wait for however long it takes. I'm much more interested in my other customs that are going on now.
> 
> Sucks for the guys that have their completed guitars ready to go! Best of luck to everyone!



+1

The exact approach I'm taking


----------



## JerichoCheng

full payment since Mar ('ready for assembly')
i've sent few emails but just got the msg (update for you in the next day or two) everytime,
i sold my EBMM and paid off for the BRJ828, now i didnt have any 7s for my band practice and song recording,
just notice lot of builds also got delay ( 2.5yrs,,,,,?),
so frustrated, when can i receive the guitar


----------



## Mitochondria

Just bought Khoi's seven string spot. 

I am on board the BFR train... or rollercoaster


----------



## Hollowway

44 Lines said:


> Just bought Khoi's seven string spot.
> 
> I am on board the BFR train... or rollercoaster



And you can use it to record a song about 88 women...


----------



## leonardo7

She has arrived. I am impressed. 

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...r-hesperian-727-black-friday.html#post3073273


----------



## MetalDaze

leonardo7 said:


> She has arrived. I am impressed.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...r-hesperian-727-black-friday.html#post3073273


 

Awesome! So who's next? Anyone have news about an incoming shipment?


----------



## Khoi

all I got from my update a couple days ago is that my 6-string "will be done"


----------



## Mitochondria

Sure hope i get my guitar soon


----------



## MetalDaze

44 Lines said:


> I have his cell number if anyone really needs it. Who ordered one with scalloped frets? He was just finishing the scalloping and re-freting.


 
You should probably not give that to anyone unless Bernie gives permission. Otherwise, he'll most likely end up having to get a new number.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

^DEFINATELY THIS.


----------



## Mitochondria




----------



## Khoi

I'd edit that past post, people will be PMing you non-stop if they read that and don't read your latter post.

also, glad to see you got the details worked out with Bernie quickly!


----------



## Mitochondria

Khoi said:


> I'd edit that past post, people will be PMing you non-stop if they read that and don't read your latter post.
> 
> also, glad to see you got the details worked out with Bernie quickly!



Its done. Haha thanks for watching my back.


----------



## Phrygian

i got an update from bernie the other day, after I sent him a reminder that it had been three weeks since I was supposed to get my ETA update later that day. Well, without going into details he has ALOT to handle right now, aside of business. He's not sick AFAIK, but he has other issues at hand that are taking a huge toll on his time.

trust me, he is working hard at getting guitars done and shipped, but he has some other business that needs to be dealt with right now that may delay his work a little. Hang in there for him!


----------



## mikernaut

I'd love to get an actual update instead of the typical stock email . communication is still lackluster.


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> I'd love to get an actual update instead of the typical stock email . communication is still lackluster.



True, but there seems to be little correlation between the updates and when the guitar actually arrives, so I wouldn't worry about it too much. I've gotten updates whenever I ask about my custom (non-BFR) and I think I'm the current record holder for how long since it's been ordered.


----------



## Rook

^ I think so too!

My issue isn't with duration (9 months waiting here, no biggie) I just wanna know if I can sell my damn spot or if I even need to but that simple piece of info seems to confuse the shit outta him


----------



## WickedSymphony

mikernaut said:


> I'd love to get an actual update instead of the typical stock email . communication is still lackluster.



Yeh, my guitar was supposed to have shipped last week but I haven't heard anything about it since. I get that he's busy, hopefully not with health issues, and I've been really patient this whole time and tried not to bug him a lot but at the same time I feel like he should be letting me know that it's going to be late instead of me sitting here wondering what's going on. I know other people got their guitars recently and were really happy so it's not like I'm really worried, but still I'd like to know how much of a delay it is since I was told it would ship.

To his credit, he messaged me when there was an issue before which was great and it was resolved super smoothly, no problems. But communication should stay similar to that throughout the process.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

WickedSymphony said:


> I know other people got their guitars recently and were really happy so it's not like I'm really worried, but still I'd like to know how much of a delay it is since I was told it would ship



The wait is definitely bad, especially when, for example, I was told my guitar would have been done last... August or September. But having been told so many times that my guitar will absolutely ship, guaranteed, promise, etc., any messages to me feel a whole lot more like ear fodder to keep me occupied than anything else. 

I know that the guy has been through a lot of Hell recently, and I'm not just trying to be a mean cud. I do have compassion for the man's health and other struggles. But... when we talked after he was getting better from bedrest, I point-blanked him with "So it sounds like my guitar was pretty much almost finished before all this went down. How much work is left to do on my guitar? I can't imagine it being more than a week or two, but I don't know if what John was telling me was representative of reality."

His reply was that, at most, I had about 2 weeks of work left on my guitar. Here I am, almost two months later, and the latest shenanigan is that even though my guitar was supposed to ship 1.5 weeks ago (absolutely will be out by the beginning of that week), he's going to _try_ to get it out by Monday.

I hope that he's getting right as rain and that my guitar will miraculously actually show up this time. But considering how many repetitions of the same thing, it just kind of grays out any more.


----------



## Lirtle

I feel the same way. I wish Bernie could be a little more honest in his practice. I'd be so much less stressed out by this whole ordeal if I were provided with a somewhat accurate time frame from the start. 

I have paid for my guitar in full and have seen no evidence of it ever existing in any form(Apparently it had to be rebuilt) I know the wait will be worth it but I'm pretty bummed out by the experience thus far. It sucks when you're continually let down by someone.


----------



## Qweklain

Lirtle said:


> I feel the same way. I wish Bernie could be a little more honest in his practice. I'd be so much less stressed out by this whole ordeal if I were provided with a somewhat accurate time frame from the start.
> 
> I have paid for my guitar in full and have seen no evidence of it ever existing in any form(Apparently it had to be rebuilt) I know the wait will be worth it but I'm pretty bummed out by the experience thus far. It sucks when you're continually let down by someone.


I know how you feel man. For the most part, I have not cared it has taken this long. However, when I got an update pic months ago, there was a mistake in the inlays so the fretboard had to be redone to re-do the inlays, which in my mind means many, many more months added to wait time.

Thing that sucks is I am in the same boat of wait with an amp too that is close to two years wait time... at least I can get ahold of him, although the response is always the same crap there too.


----------



## SpaceDock

I was thinking about it, Bernie said he sold 100+ guitars with the BFR, he had many guitars from custom builds in the works prior to that, and I saw 50+ guitars sell with his March madness sale. Now I've only seen < 20 guitars finished via SS.org, FB, and his website pictures in the past year. How long will it really take for him to tackle the backlog that has grown? I have been getting the perpetual "2 weeks" for more than a year but at this rate it seems like it might take several years to get my guitars.


----------



## animalwithin

Glad I'm not the only one experiencing problems with Bernie. Here is what I was promised/guaranteed:

1.) Guitar would be done at or before May in time for my graduation (paid my deposit early November 2011)
2.) Constant texts/emails with pics and updates
3.) Half way through the build, he said I could drive down there (I'm 2 hrs away from him), we could design the pickguard together and wrap up any last minute details that I wanted in the guitar

Its been 8 months now, no guitar, he doesn't answer my texts/messages, and none of the above ever came to pass. I paid my $500 deposit but in all honesty, this hasnt been the most pleasant experience. I'll be the first person to say take your time and I'll be the last person to complain and I'm extremely sympathetic in the case of family/health problems but in the end all I wouldve liked was a quick email/text saying: "Hey Sam, I'm at so and so with your guitar, looks like we're gonna have to push production a bit." That would have sufficed, alas not even that happened. I don't even want the guitar anymore, there were some things we were supposed to talk about before he finished, I fear now that he just went with whatever and the guitar has things/looks different than what I wanted. I don't think there is a way to say I don't want the guitar anymore, I've asked a couple of people and they said that the deposit is enough to be a binding contract and I can't back out. What is this selling spots you guys speak of?


----------



## Locrian

If you can get a buyer, and get a hold of Bernie, someone can pay you the money you paid for your deposit, and have Bernie switch the order over to their name.


----------



## Hollowway

For the guys who have decided they don't want their builds, have you contacted Bernie and asked for a refund? His business does not offer refunds, but he might be open to it since he hasn't kept up his side of the agreement. He can sell those builds himself, and put them on the back burner and get through all of the ones people are waiting for. So he might go for it. It sure beats having a bunch of angry customers doing chargebacks on their credit cards.


----------



## animalwithin

Very true, thanks Hollowway! I'll keep you guys posted!


----------



## Vicious7

Yeah I got an email from him personally apparently saying he was uber sick and some dude he left in charge of responding to mails didn't actually do his job, so Bernie turned him into a guitar supposedly. I had a quote in the works as I was torn between him and a Siggery, and Marty was ridiculously prompt with his replies, BRJ responded to my quote questions in regards to him not wanting to do a matte black and I said go with the gloss like he wanted, though this was a few weeks ago, I imagine he's swamped with catch up work or something.


----------



## Fiction

Vicious7 said:


> though this was a few weeks ago.



To be honest, I'm really surprised Bernie is still taking orders from anyone


----------



## kruneh

Fiction said:


> To be honest, I'm really surprised Bernie is still taking orders from anyone



Exactly.
Why on earth would anyone order a custom from him now?
I can´t understand why he´s not trying to solve this.


----------



## Fiction

Not only that, but I mean.. He KNOWS He has a huge backlog, he should just say "Hey dude, sorry, but Ive got 5 million guitars in the workshop and the equivalent in pissed off customers" not "Yeah sure, I don't do matte, but I'll do a gloss"


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

^ This, right here, people should be setting off alarm bells. Think about it. Guy has more orders backed up than we even know, but he's still accepting money from people? Good God, man. Truly fucked up.


----------



## animalwithin

All the more reason why he should accept my wanting a refund email and not give me crap about it, assuming he'll even answer.


----------



## kruneh

Thing is, and I know this from personal experience because I´m doing my own firm, if you have just enough work then you have to little. You really have to have a bit more than you´re able to get through because you need to know that there is work not only for the next four month, but for a couple of years to come.
BUT, you gotta be straight up about it, and I´m shocked to see that people have paid in full several months ago and still have no clue when to get their guitars.
This is how to ruin your business.
Seriously, I don´t have much sympathy anymore.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I _CAN_ sympathize with his health issues. My wife almost died a few years back, and it was a totally screwed up time in our lives. It basically eventually lead to us having to live with my parents for 1.5 years at the age of 26 years old. Things like this will screw you up good.

However... I can't sympathize with a man who continues to dig his hole deeper by taking on more and more work when there is absolutely no way in hell it is responsible to do so. I've been waiting 17 months for my guitar. Some guys have been waiting longer. It's out of hand.


----------



## animalwithin

Spec, did you pay in full or just the deposit?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I paid in full back in the fall when I was told the guitar would be ready to ship in a couple of weeks. It's only recently that I really have become quite sore over the whole experience. I am, frankly, beginning to wonder if I will ever actually see the guitar. I know that sounds mean, but seriously: 17 months.

EDIT - Mine is a custom shop, not BFR. I didn't even know things got screwed with the BFR until well after I'd put in my deposit for the instrument in late February of 2011.


----------



## Vicious7

17 months is a really long time, especially when you paid full price... How many people I wonder are waiting on their guitars.

Does he build them by himself or does he have a team of people??? Build queues would work in this situation, get some people to help you out build-wise and go through all the emails/phone calls and whatnot, date them and set up a build order.

The people that want a refund, ie lotsa people, get a refund and he responds to all the people saying, "Ok, you guys get your guitars since youve been waiting longest, you guys have to wait a little longer", and so on, then he should close the queue until he's caught up...

Maybe I'm just naive....XD


----------



## MatrixClaw

Yeah. Honestly, I've gone from understanding to disappointed to pissed to completely irate at this point.

My guitar was done 5 months ago. I have several pictures that show it done, and several emails saying it'd ship within a week or two (when more cases came in). The 3 guitars mine was originally supposed to ship with have been in the hands of their owners for months, at least one of them has already been sold once or twice to a new owner.

I try to contact Bernie and all I get is "Give me a call tomorrow and we'll discuss it." I call, no answer, leave a message, no call back (Why should I have to call him anyway? I gave him my phone number in the original email, and he's called me before, so he has my number anyway. If he had time to email back, he could've just called me - It's not my problem to fix, it's his). Send another email, get a reply saying "I'm really busy right now, I'll send you an update within a few days at the latest." 2 weeks later, I send 2-3 more emails with no reply still. I let it slide and contact him again a few weeks later, and the whole cycle repeats.

I paid for my guitar 6 months ago, where the hell is it!? 

I understand the 3 month wait time was unrealistic, but 20 months now and I've already paid the full price for the thing? This is just HORRIBLE business practice.


----------



## animalwithin

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I paid in full back in the fall when I was told the guitar would be ready to ship in a couple of weeks. It's only recently that I really have become quite sore over the whole experience. I am, frankly, beginning to wonder if I will ever actually see the guitar. I know that sounds mean, but seriously: 17 months.
> 
> EDIT - Mine is a custom shop, not BFR. I didn't even know things got screwed with the BFR until well after I'd put in my deposit for the instrument in late February of 2011.


 
Yea, mine is a custom shop as well, shoud have recieved my guitar 4 months ago, I only paid the $500. I honestly think I can go on the rest of my life and I wound't hear from him. He got me confused several times early on, wouldn't be surprised if he forgot who I was. But I can't do that because if he comes to me who knows how long from now demanding his money and I don't have it, I'm screwed.

I've yet to get a clear answer from a lawyer regarding whether or not the deposit is a form of a contract. Some people have told me that it does hold me accountable to pay him the rest of the money, others have said its not and that I should email him telling him I no longer want the guitar. 

There must be something we can do other than sit and wait.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ four months is nothing compared to how long the rest of us have been waiting. I'm really surprised he is quoting build times that short when some people are over the two year mark now.


----------



## animalwithin

^ I agree with you man, I thought my 9 months of waiting was bad, until I read 17 months and 20 months. The wait isn't the worst part, all the lies and horrible communication is whats horrible.


----------



## Fiction

animalwithin said:


> Some people have told me that it does hold me accountable to pay him the rest of the money, others have said its not and that I should email him telling him I no longer want the guitar.



The point of a deposit is usually to guarantee your spot, and once the money is in it's usually spent on what's being built (Not necessarily your build.) So the chance of getting the $500 back would be pretty slim. But with Bernie, I don't know how his shop works, but I think he might already stock everything prior to ordering, as its such a large custom operation I assume he would have quite the stock of wood.

And if he hasn't started your build at all, and you're able to actually contact him, you _may_ be able to get refunded, but I wouldn't be too hopeful, unfortunately for your sake. And it's not his fault if he can't refund you, as that's the point of a deposit, its to lock you into the sale, and if you decide to ditch it, he keeps the deposit, but if he can, great.

Ask for a refund, if he can't you can try and fight it, or tell him to cancel your build, but the deposit will be his then. Sucks for him if he has started the build, but it sucks for you that he pushed you away from the build in the first place.


----------



## animalwithin

Thanks Fiction. At the moment, he can keep the deposit for all I care, I just don't want the guitar anymore and I want to be released from my obligation to pay for it, as others have told me I'm stuck with it.


----------



## Neil

^ I don't really understand how he is going to get the rest of the money out of you? Sue you for it? Would a court really let him win that case considering he gave false promises on build times?


Anyway, when he finally asks you to pay the rest of the money just keep telling him 'yeah I'm a little busy I'll pay you in 2 weeks man'


----------



## brutalwizard

animalwithin said:


> Thanks Fiction. At the moment, he can keep the deposit for all I care, I just don't want the guitar anymore and I want to be released from my obligation to pay for it, as others have told me I'm stuck with it.



If you only live 2 hours away go visit his shop talk to him in person.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

So we're all clear here, I don't hold any animosity toward the man and his business. I am not upset that there have been delays, although I do wish that he had been clearer about what I could have expected when problems arose. What I am upset about is that I have been consistently staved off and told that my guitar would be finished by a certain date. The date would then arrive, I would receive no notification of shipment, and by the time I got a hold of him several days later, he would have a new shipping date for me.

I am currently trying to work it out with Bernie. I want this to be a win-win situation for all the trouble this has been. I do actually want this guitar. I played one made by him a long ass time ago and it was one of the best electrics I've ever laid my hands on. I'm a weirdo, hippy, optimist who wants to see everyone succeed and elevate their consciousness to a higher state. I want for Bernie to get better, and I want everyone here to get a great guitar that brings joy to the people who experience their music. Strange, right? It also might make me one dumb, naive mother fucker.

But I also have expectations that I get what I've paid for. We will see. I should have an idea as to how my situation will be going with pretty dang soon.


----------



## animalwithin

Neil said:


> ^ I don't really understand how he is going to get the rest of the money out of you? Sue you for it? Would a court really let him win that case considering he gave false promises on build times?
> 
> 
> Anyway, when he finally asks you to pay the rest of the money just keep telling him 'yeah I'm a little busy I'll pay you in 2 weeks man'


 
I dont know either Neil, based on some feedback I have gotten, he has a right to demand the money from me upon completion of the guitar, whenever that may be, despite none of his promises/guarantees being upheld. I'm going to send him a long email reminding him of all he told me and then telling him to cancel the build (however much he has completed of it), and that I no longer want the guitar, and no longer interested in his services.

Much like Spec, I don't hate the guy, last we spoke (last year) he was really nice, but where this is leading is ridiculous and unfair to customers, I don't want to be waiting for this guitar for two years like some of the guys on here.

Brutal, I've thought of that, I still might, depending on what he says to the email I'm going to send him.


----------



## Lirtle

I just wanted to mention that even when i spoke to Bernie over the phone his attitude was rather crass. At one moment he spaced out and muttered something about me being a whiny customer. 

I wouldn't be a whiny customer if he knew how to run his business. Sorry if this is harsh but I'm fed up. I have resisted writing negative things about Bernie up until now hoping he would be able to prove me wrong...


----------



## animalwithin

Sent him a message through his email and his website about cancelling my order/build. Lets see what he says...


----------



## EOT

animalwithin said:


> I dont know either Neil, based on some feedback I have gotten, he has a right to demand the money from me upon completion of the guitar, whenever that may be, despite none of his promises/guarantees being upheld. I'm going to send him a long email reminding him of all he told me and then telling him to cancel the build (however much he has completed of it), and that I no longer want the guitar, and no longer interested in his services.
> 
> Much like Spec, I don't hate the guy, last we spoke (last year) he was really nice, but where this is leading is ridiculous and unfair to customers, I don't want to be waiting for this guitar for two years like some of the guys on here.
> 
> Brutal, I've thought of that, I still might, depending on what he says to the email I'm going to send him.



I'm pretty sure you're not legally bound to pay for the rest of the guitar. And he's not legally required to refund your deposit. If you are lucky he might though. I wouldn't be be to nasty with your email, but you should definitely let him know how you feel. This whole thing has gotten way out of hand.


----------



## theoctopus

> I'm pretty sure you're not legally bound to pay for the rest of the guitar.



Unless you signed a contract that explicitly stated that you were responsible for the total value of the guitar upon completion, he cannot hold you responsible for the remaining value of the build. Your deposit is a financial good-faith payment, not an initial payment. I'm pretty sure that if you took him to small claims court you would be able to get your deposit back, as well, assuming you were able to demonstrate that the time frame of this build far exceeded initial estimates. For $500, though, the time you would spend is probably not worth it.


----------



## animalwithin

Cool, that makes me feel better. I didn't ask for my deposit back. I reminded him of the time I paid the deposit, listed all the things he promised/guaranteed me at the time regarding the build and then told him that he failed to do all of what he promised. I said due to an extreme lack of communication/feedback despite my many efforts to communicate with him, complete disregard for a customer, and a string of failed promises has led me to no longer want the guitar and to cancel the order/build.

I think that's a very fair message. I didn't go off on him haha.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*Just a reminder folks, this thread is supposed to be for BRJ customers only, not just spectators. 

As for customers, it doesn't matter if it's a BFR or full custom as everyone seems to be in the same boat in that regard. 

If someone, who is not a current customers can somehow help in a meaningful way, then by all means, feel free to post. 

Best of luck guys, I'm still pulling for you. *


----------



## jbard

If I was two hours away, I'd have been to his shop already, possibly two times over. It seems most of us BFR customers paid full last fall. I paid the full amount in September 2011 after being told it was ready. I still have no clue as far as a date.

I know the guitar is out of paint. If I was two hours away I'd see if I couldn't just go finish it myself, or just grab it and have a local person finish it in 2-3 days, just to get it out of there. Maybe I'm held up from out of cases, as mentioned. No idea.


----------



## killertone

If I don't have my guitar(s) by January I will be flying to LA and driving to Hesperia to get them in whatever shape they are in. That is no joke.


----------



## animalwithin

jbard said:


> If I was two hours away, I'd have been to his shop already, possibly two times over. It seems most of us BFR customers paid full last fall. I paid the full amount in September 2011 after being told it was ready. I still have no clue as far as a date.
> 
> I know the guitar is out of paint. If I was two hours away I'd see if I couldn't just go finish it myself, or just grab it and have a local person finish it in 2-3 days, just to get it out of there. Maybe I'm held up from out of cases, as mentioned. No idea.


 
I thought about driving downt there but there were a few things that Bernie said we could design together before they went into the guitar. I didn't want to drive down there and see a guitar that looked different than what I wanted because he failed to meet with me and then have him tell me, "Its done, where's my money." I just want this experience behind me, if I have to wait another year for another custom luthier to make me a guitar, I'm fine with that, I'll probably get treated better.


----------



## Khoi

animalwithin said:


> Thanks Fiction. At the moment, he can keep the deposit for all I care, I just don't want the guitar anymore and I want to be released from my obligation to pay for it, as others have told me I'm stuck with it.



you can easily sell your spot, thereby getting your deposit back, and not having to pay for the finished product.

I sold my spot very quickly on the classifieds here, and then I e-mailed Bernie, told him the new customer's contact info and name, and he contacted them and settled with him.


----------



## jbard

The only issue is I think he said his is not a BFR. The main reason people (myself included) are willing to grab BFR slots is because the price is so low.


----------



## animalwithin

jbard said:


> The only issue is I think he said his is not a BFR. The main reason people (myself included) are willing to grab BFR slots is because the price is so low.


 
Yea, my build wasn't a BFR, its a custom Jekyll 7.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Khoi said:


> you can easily sell your spot, thereby getting your deposit back, and not having to pay for the finished product.
> 
> I sold my spot very quickly on the classifieds here, and then I e-mailed Bernie, told him the new customer's contact info and name, and he contacted them and settled with him.



It's funny that he can contact new customers to switch the old one's spot over, but he can't reply back to the people who've already paid him


----------



## paddy

Hi Gents
This is my first post here. I'm not a 7 string player but stumbled upon this interesting post and thought that I share my experience with you. And here's my story:
About 2 years ago I decided to order a custom jekyll guitar through a dealer and paid the 1/3 deposit upfront. And I was told of completion time of 3-4 months (he wants your business) and similarly to the stories here, it took longer than that. It took 12 months to complete. And again I was given the all familiar story (after 5-6 months in) about guitar having to be rebuilt again because it came out all wrong first time.
Any ways, I get the guitar a year on (at least I got the guitar). And these were my observations:

1) I asked "explicitly" for alder-maple combination but I got the mahogany-maple instead (well that's what it says on the certificate). Nothing wrong with mahogany. It's just that I fancied to have the alder-maple combo.

2) There were scratch marks (small ones that I think can be buffed away) at the back side of the body and at the back of the neck (around behind the first and second fret where he puts that cushin thing when he's working on the fretboard). Here's a picture he sent me before it was finished. As you can see that table has to rough a surface, so, my guitar must have got the scratches that way. Have a look at the pic:

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m39/ashkaneshghi/rico.jpg

3) The truss rod's end is very worn out. Either a used one or a truss rod that was abused when being installed. I need to be carefull when adjsting as the allen key rolls around easily.


4) *AND THIS IS THE BEST PART YET*. Have a look at this pic and tell me what you think of the inlay positioning after the 12th fret.
And the link:

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m39/ashkaneshghi/inlays.jpg

And yes, I did call him several times, left messages, must have emailed him a dozen times. Of course I didn't expect him to respond and he didn't surprise.

5) And lastly, and I don't know if I'm being anal about this one or not, but if you look at the link below, you might just be able to see that if I change the position of the spring, it will rub against the wood. I have added comments to the picture. If you zoom in you'll be able to read them.
And the springs are at an angle to the cavity anyways.
And the link:

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m39/ashkaneshghi/jekyll2.jpg

So there you go and this has been my experience. I wanted to add my voice to the others. And never rushed into doing this either. I'm only doing it now well over a year after I received my guitar. You hear people brag about quality of this product or that product (and that's why I ordered this guitar) but till you have first hand experience yourself, you don't know.
Anyways, I've not just described the problems. I've supplied the evidence for yourselves to see. My conclusion is that next time if I want to order a guitar, I will go for a bigger more reputable company (say jackson) because I'll feel safer. I'm fine if it takes longer. At least the will feel responsible.

Ask any questions that you like.

Regards


----------



## djpharoah

paddy said:


> ...


Folks need to stop being so limp dick'd when they get a shitty guitar in this price range or from other luthiers. The way you guys squirm waiting for these guitars with the horrible communications why do you all remain silent? Why wait a year?


----------



## Jexey

I'm not going to comment on paddy's post. I really don't know what to think about that. 

My experience is going a little better. Here's a video Bernie sent me. Communication is still slow but it's existant - I really haven't been pushing it or asking for status' etc, although I can see myself starting to get a little antsy in the future here.



I haven't seen anyone else getting a piezo set up in theirs. Mine is a little special.


----------



## animalwithin

djpharoah said:


> Folks need to stop being so limp dick'd when they get a shitty guitar in this price range or from other luthiers. The way you guys squirm waiting for these guitars with the horrible communications why do you all remain silent? Why wait a year?


 
I didn't, thats for sure. Jexey, be thankful, you have it way better than many of us.


----------



## MetalDaze

Jexey said:


> I'm not going to comment on paddy's post. I really don't know what to think about that.
> 
> My experience is going a little better. Here's a video Bernie sent me. Communication is still slow but it's existant - I really haven't been pushing it or asking for status' etc, although I can see myself starting to get a little antsy in the future here.
> 
> 
> I haven't seen anyone else getting a piezo set up in theirs. Mine is a little special.


 
Cool. Is that recent?


----------



## paddy

djpharoah !

Perhaps living far away from where guitar came from kind of gave me a cold feet with regards to my chances of sorting it out.
But I did try to contact him many times though. And he failed to respond. I wasn't gonna pay loads of money just to get a plane and go and see him and have him sort out the errors. I already had enough and decided to quit while ahead by not spending any more on it.
And of course when the opportunity comes up I will mention it. 
Anyhow, the point is:
I've moved on. I'm simply letting others know of what might (or might not) happen to them, so, they should consider all possibilities before pulling the trigger.

cheers


----------



## djpharoah

paddy said:


> @djpharoah
> 
> Perhaps living far away from where guitar came from kind of gave me a cold feet with regards to my chances of sorting it out.
> But I did try to contact him many times though.
> And of course when the opportunity comes up I will mention it. If we worry about why someone did or didn't mention it when, the we're forgetting the real problem here.



My comment wasn't targeted at you persay but rather the tons of people on here who feel they need to be quiet when purchasing a custom guitar from any luthier/small builder.

I'm aware of the real problem.


----------



## Phrygian

Can't people read the thread title? 

Not saying that what Paddy and others posts aren't interesting to see (especially in the light of the Jekyll 828 I had for a _short_ time) but this thread is only for BFR customers, even if it's looking more and more like a BRJ frustration thread.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MaxOfMetal said:


> *Just a reminder folks, this thread is supposed to be for BRJ customers only, not just spectators.
> 
> As for customers, it doesn't matter if it's a BFR or full custom as everyone seems to be in the same boat in that regard.
> 
> If someone, who is not a current customers can somehow help in a meaningful way, then by all means, feel free to post.
> 
> Best of luck guys, I'm still pulling for you. *





Phrygian said:


> Can't people read the thread title?
> 
> Not saying that what Paddy and others posts aren't interesting to see (especially in the light of the Jekyll 828 I had for a _short_ time) but this thread is only for BFR customers, even if it's looking more and more like a BRJ frustration thread.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ seriously I don't know whats worse, the waiting, the lack of response, or the perpetual bad news being dropped into this thread.


----------



## paddy

djpharoah said:


> My comment wasn't targeted at you persay but rather the tons of people on here who feel they need to be quiet when purchasing a custom guitar from any luthier/small builder.
> 
> I'm aware of the real problem.




I know I know. You're right also.
No worries


----------



## JP Universe

I think a lot of you are torturing yourselves by continually coming back into this thread 

At this stage i'm expecting my guitar to be done sometime in 2014. Mine came out of the woodshop about 6 months ago...

Oh well..... Plenty of other guitars to keep me occupied


----------



## EOT

JP Universe said:


> Oh well..... Plenty of other guitars to keep me occupied


 
 Not everybody has that luxury


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

My experience is going a little better. Here's a video Bernie sent me. Communication is still slow but it's existant - I really haven't been pushing it or asking for status' etc said:


> h6JcchNB5PI[/MEDIA]
> 
> I haven't seen anyone else getting a piezo set up in theirs. Mine is a little special.




Hey there !  I´ve also got a piezo system in my guitar. The guitar was finished up to this status, how it looks now, in september. I`ve seen no further progress pics...

But he said there was a problem with Graptech installing the piezo system in the hipshot bridge or something. Did you had similar problems ? 


Imageshack - pascalbrull.jpg

Anyway, the waittime and lack of communication is really horrible. I´m not pissed but this guitar was supposed to be my main "workhorse-guitar" and I also wanted to start writing and learning stuff for 7 string... 
It sucks saving up the money for a guitar you won´t know when it´s finished, when you could buy other stuff instead.


----------



## EOT

You don't owe him anything more. You just don't get the deposit back.


----------



## jbard

Well, here's a positive note! Bernie was able to get all the hardware done and asked for the string gauges I want to go with for setup. New pic, can't wait for it! I think the blackburst works for it.


----------



## Lirtle

Good news man!! I'm supposed to be getting a pic update today too.


----------



## MetalDaze

jbard said:


> Well, here's a positive note! Bernie was able to get all the hardware done and asked for the string gauges I want to go with for setup. New pic, can't wait for it! I think the blackburst works for it.


 
Yes, I would say that the blackburst looks killer!


----------



## jbard

Now with strings! I'm excited.


----------



## ras1988

Do you guys just get the updates out of the blue? 

I contacted Bernie 2 weeks back in response to a text he sent me a month ago saying he was working on 1 of my 2 guitars. He said he would send video then nothing. Texted him last week and he sent an "oops, typo" with no corrected response. I am okay with just photos or a "yeah, it's at ______ point" because it has been since about oh January that I heard much of anything about either of my two fully paid off instruments (excuse the butthurt cattiness, I know he is trying his damnedest to get these things out and it is just a guitar but it is also just a large chunk of change that is out of pocket).


----------



## Lorcan Ward

animalwithin said:


> "Based on my company policy, all sales are final, specially custom orders. You may sell you spot. If spot is sold then have new buyer contact me.
> 
> Your order is canceled."



Judging from most luthiers I've dealt with my guess is that it is a non-refundable deposit BUT you could get it back by selling your spot to someone else. Since you stated you wanted your build cancelled and (I hope)you gave the reason you hadn't seen any pics or heard anything about then you wouldn't have to pay anything. 

You should email Bernie again to get a clear idea of what a new buyer would be getting and if anything was started.


----------



## Jexey

Pascal-Darrell said:


> Hey there !  I´ve also got a piezo system in my guitar. The guitar was finished up to this status, how it looks now, in september. I`ve seen no further progress pics...
> 
> But he said there was a problem with Graptech installing the piezo system in the hipshot bridge or something. Did you had similar problems ?
> 
> 
> Imageshack - pascalbrull.jpg
> 
> Anyway, the waittime and lack of communication is really horrible. I´m not pissed but this guitar was supposed to be my main "workhorse-guitar" and I also wanted to start writing and learning stuff for 7 string...
> It sucks saving up the money for a guitar you won´t know when it´s finished, when you could buy other stuff instead.



The Piezo set up will be amazing. I checked out the picture of your guitar, that thing looks AMAZING! The wait sounds killer, but you'll get there.

I didn't hear about any problems with the graphtechs, but I can speak that piezos can be really touchy and hard to install. It's my understanding that sometimes they have to make some very unique modifications to get them in right.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Jexey said:


> The Piezo set up will be amazing. I checked out the picture of your guitar, that thing looks AMAZING! The wait sounds killer, but you'll get there.
> 
> I didn't hear about any problems with the graphtechs, but I can speak that piezos can be really touchy and hard to install. It's my understanding that sometimes they have to make some very unique modifications to get them in right.



Thanks man, I really like how it came out so far , so I hope it don´t get fucked up for some stupid reason. 

and yeah, I´m also very exited about the electronic setup with the piezo and all the stuff , will be a very flexible guitar 

Your guitar looks also very nice  is it a blue denim finish ?

(btw, I think you live "only" 1,5 hours away from me ^^ )


----------



## rifftrauma

Hi Guys,
Quick question (first post on SS so be easy). I ordered a Hesperian 627 from BRJ back in September 2011, and from what I remember word on the street was that it a 12-14 month build time. I haven't really kept in contact with the company since then, but I finally shot BRJ an email just asking for an update about 3 weeks ago. I got an email from Ivo saying Bernie was sick, but I haven't heard anything since then. Read through the forums to check on the legitimacy of this and I'm glad to hear he's doing better.

Anyone have any idea what the build times are up to now? I've seen numbers all over the place on the thread.

Also, could someone PM Bernie's email, I'd like to contact him directly if possible and see where I'm sitting in the queue. Thanks guys!


----------



## Hollowway

No one really knows what the build times are these days. There honestly isn't any good way for us on the outside to be able to tell, because there seems to be a decent amount of guitars that need to be rebuilt, which basically pushes them back to the beginning of the process and resets the clock on the build. I think I hold the current record as the longest build on a custom at about 31 months. Apparently it had to be rebuilt twice, and is now ready for drilling the holes for the hardware and assembly. But even then I don't know how long it will take. My guess is that on your build you're probably looking at another year to 18 months. The black Friday run is at 20 months now, and only a few have trickled out, so that huge glut has to move down the pipeline in front of yours. That being said, the orders arent being worked on or shipped in a typicaly FIFO method, so maybe yours will jump forward at some point. Of course, this is all speculation, as I have no idea what the heck I'm talking about!


----------



## Mitochondria

Is it just me or does it seem like bernie is churning out one a week now...


----------



## MetalDaze

We'll never know (unless someone finds a way to sneak a secret webcam into his shop ).

Keep in mind that people on ss.org aren't the only ones that order guitars from him, plus not everyone feels the urge to post NGD's (or post at all - lurkers, I'm talking to you ).


----------



## darren

Pascal-Darrell said:


> But he said there was a problem with Graptech installing the piezo system in the hipshot bridge or something.



Just as an FYI, Hipshot bridge base plates can easily be ordered with slots already machined in them to accommodate the piezo wires. In fact, Hipshot can even pre-load the bridge with the saddles if so desired. Hipshot and GraphTech have a really good working relationship.


----------



## WickedSymphony

44 Lines said:


> Is it just me or does it seem like bernie is churning out one a week now...



Mine was supposed to have shipped like 2 weeks ago so I don't know what's going on over there. Tried e-mailing him on Sunday, but haven't received a response yet. Anyone else have any luck?


----------



## SpaceDock

I got through last night, three weeks left. Wo really knows though, I am pulling for Bernie to get it done.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

darren said:


> Just as an FYI, Hipshot bridge base plates can easily be ordered with slots already machined in them to accommodate the piezo wires. In fact, Hipshot can even pre-load the bridge with the saddles if so desired. Hipshot and GraphTech have a really good working relationship.



I´ve red the mail again. I think what he actually wanted to say is that garphtech or hipshot took a long time to deliver the bridge, nut sure though...

But it´s good to hear that they work close together, so there schouldn´t be much problems


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, Bernie told me this morning that he was shipping today. Nonetheless, I have not received a tracking number for my package. If the guitar doesn't show tomorrow, or I don't get a tracking number tomorrow showing that my guitar is being delivered, there is going to be issues. It's time to put this stuff to rest, and I won't be waiting around for him.

I don't care what he says about my deposit. After this many promises, I will either have my guitar or I will have all, and I do mean *ALL* of my money back - including a refund for the BKP's that he installed in my guitar. This isn't a threat. It's just a guy that's fed up with waiting and hearing that things are good and then finding out nothing has happened.

I hope that it's all good. But I'm prepared to go as far as I have to to see that this is taken care of.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

My guitar should be shipped today, I hope.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Good luck to both of you!


----------



## MatrixClaw

Hope you guys get them, he still refuses to reply to any form of communication from me


----------



## Jexey

Pascal-Darrell said:


> Thanks man, I really like how it came out so far , so I hope it don´t get fucked up for some stupid reason.
> 
> and yeah, I´m also very exited about the electronic setup with the piezo and all the stuff , will be a very flexible guitar
> 
> Your guitar looks also very nice  is it a blue denim finish ?
> 
> (btw, I think you live "only" 1,5 hours away from me ^^ )


 
Yes, it's blue denim. I had a natural finish but snapped one day and had him change it after a few sleepless nights thinking about finishes and what suits me best.

I LOVE Belgium, but I just had to move back to the states. I'm in Florida now. It's no Germany!!!


----------



## mikernaut

I could use my guitar to cheer me up right about now, I got laid off back in 2009 then received my Jekyll, ( it was already paid off) wrong inlays , Bernie let me hang on to it while he does a rebuild. fast forward to now, still waiting on the rebuild , got laid off again. 

To make this even crazier I actually was just mailing a deposit to Zimbloth for my 3rd BRJ ( yeah, I'm a masochist for ordering another guitar given his current track record) well, that's now canceled.
Zimbloth quoted me 7- 9 month time frame. That made me chuckle.


----------



## MetalDaze

Putting aside the fact that you were willing to submit yourself to the torture again ..............

Why order through Nick rather than Bernie direct?


----------



## Mitochondria

It would be really nice to see how many BFR (and custom for that matter) guitars are still left. Just to see. Half of this problem is not having any clue if Bernie is really working his ass off now or taking more time that necessary.


----------



## JP Universe

I can't imagine him taking more time than necessary.... He's had health issues and is trying to take too much on = delay

EDIT - Massive delay


----------



## mikernaut

MetalDaze said:


> Putting aside the fact that you were willing to submit yourself to the torture again ..............
> 
> Why order through Nick rather than Bernie direct?



Well frankly I'm tired of trying to get responses from Bernie via email or phone. It rarely brings forth any solid information/ updates. I might have to pay a bit more thru a dealer but then I have a middle man to hound Bernie. If that makes much sense.


----------



## mountainjam

mikernaut said:


> Well frankly I'm tired of trying to get responses from Bernie via email or phone. It rarely brings forth any solid information/ updates. I might have to pay a bit more thru a dealer but then I have a middle man to hound Bernie. If that makes much sense.



A good friend of mine purchased his brj through the axe palace. He eventually got the guitar over 2.5 years (with the wrong specs and several manufacturing flaws) after ordering it, but it was a horrible experience for him. Nick could never get any info on the guitar, and when my friend would contact brj directly, he was told to ask Nick for info. LOL, its probably for the best you cancelled the order.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Jexey said:


> Yes, it's blue denim. I had a natural finish but snapped one day and had him change it after a few sleepless nights thinking about finishes and what suits me best.
> 
> I LOVE Belgium, but I just had to move back to the states. I'm in Florida now. It's no Germany!!!




Good choice  

And yeah, Belgium is pretty cool, altough it´s raining like hell these days when it´s supposed to be summer 

..but we have good beer  haha 

Anyways, would have been cool to check out each others guitars


----------



## paddy

mountainjam said:


> A good friend of mine purchased his brj through the axe palace. He eventually got the guitar over 2.5 years (with the wrong specs and several manufacturing flaws) after ordering it, but it was a horrible experience for him. Nick could never get any info on the guitar, and when my friend would contact brj directly, he was told to ask Nick for info. LOL, its probably for the best you cancelled the order.



Hey Mountainjam

I've had similar experience to your friend. Check out my (first) post on page 71. It's all there with pics and stuff. It was very much the same for me experience wise as well. But looking back I'm glad that I got my guitar in the end. It's gotten way worse since. And, I symphatise with people going through the pain. I think it's fair to say that he's got too many orders (more than he can handle) and I guess he's refusing to expand to have more people help him and as a result it's way above his head for a long time. But from his point of view it's not all that bad at all as he must've got a lot of money and continues to do so. So why should he care? (I know this is not the right but it's the way it is).
I'm thinking that people will continue to get messed about. And don't be surprised to see some in the end losing their money.

May be it's time that all the people that are suffering together to come up with a website and warn people off of approaching him. There's this luthier in the UK (http://www.simscustom.com) and because he's messed people about, they've come up with a website of their own (http://simswarning.com) to name and shame him. It's a thought.

Any ways, the way I see it, this (problem with brj guitars) shall continue to grow. He wants the money so he'll continue to accept orders and he will have them made and shipped whenever (that's his thinking). 
He's not ill. He's in better shape than all of us put together but of course he will say: I got ill, my mum got ill, my brother got ill, my dog got ill, I fell off a horse, etc, etc, etc ...
What else do people expect? And the gentleman that got a guitar in 2009 with wrong inlays, I don't think he's gonna see the remake (to be realistic) unfortunately for him.

One can also look at it this way: He had a black friday thing going and a lot of people jumped in to get discount guitars. And he accepted them all and he's got more than he can handle. Now parallel to that we have other customers that are wanting custom built guitars (and he will make more money out of these deals). Of course these people will get the priority and the black friday ones will get pushed back in the queue. I suppose even custom orders are being messed about but black friday ones are even more so.
He also had some problems a couple of years back when he fell out with some people, his site was hacked and all. I think some people will remember this.
Sorry about the long post. What I've said are not nice, but that's the way it is. This is the brutal reality.
Needless to say I decided some while back to only deal with a proper companies when I'm ordering any guitars. They'll be more honest and can be held accountable better.


cheers


----------



## djpharoah

paddy said:


> May be it's time that all the people that are suffering together to come up with a website and warn people off of approaching him. There's this luthier in the UK (Sims Custom Shop, Custom Built Guitars, Sims LEDs, L.E.Ds, Respray, Body Shop, Bodies, Scratchplates, Lasers and Pickguards by Martin Sims.) and because he's messed people about, they've come up with a website of their own (Sims Custom Shop Guitar Painting & Guitar Refinishing, Guitar Restoration Custom Handmade Guitars from Sims Custom Shop Patrick Sims) to name and shame him. It's a thought.


FYI - the Sims you're referring to is Patrick Sims who is from the USA and has scammed many people over the history of his being on the internet. He now owns/works at LGM Guitars. There's also a Sims in the UK who is unfortunately sharing the same name but not the same guy.


----------



## Johnmar

*MOD EDIT: Lets keep things in the present. *


----------



## MetalDaze

Isn't that mikernaut's replacement guitar on the lower left?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Johnmar said:


> I wish i had stealing skills.



At this point, we may all have to sneak into the shop and steal our guitars to get them. 

So I texted Bernie yesterday to ask if my guitar was shipping to my folk's house, as it was supposed to be shipped Thursday. His reply was that he was out of town for a couple of days for medical testing and that my guitar would ship Tuesday. 

So I asked straight up: Why did you tell me yesterday that the guitar was going to ship yesterday, if you were already out of town the day before that?    

His reply: He was going to have his guy pack and ship the guitar yesterday, but when he got to the shop, he said that Bernie had forgotten to create and install the backplate for my electronics...  

At least after the prodding, he admitted that he dropped the ball on that one, and said he was going into the shop as soon as he was in town (yesterday morning) to create said backplate and ship the guitar so that I would either receive it Saturday or Monday. It's his birthday on Monday, and he doesn't intend on being in the shop for it (not a big blame on him there, I think). After that, I didn't hear anything yesterday, and I'm going to text him again in a bit to see if he is going to USPS it today. I have a feeling, come Tuesday, I'm going to get some more bullshit excuse. One of my friends jokingly said he would reply: 

Tuesday: "Uh... yeah I accidentally stood in the full light of the moon the other night and became a werwolf, so it's going to be another week or so before I can ship your guitar."

Friday next week: "Oh hey... another update bud. I accidentally made your backplate out of pure silver, so I'm going to have to re-make that for you... call you next week."

Two weeks from then: "Oh hey man... I lost your guitar."

Provided that I hear something by the end of today, I'll be satisfied. His rep is definitely in the pits with me at this point though. It's been one of the, if not the most, fucked up experience I've had in a while.


----------



## SpaceDock

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, Bernie told me this morning that he was shipping today. Nonetheless, I have not received a tracking number for my package. If the guitar doesn't show tomorrow, or I don't get a tracking number tomorrow showing that my guitar is being delivered, there is going to be issues. It's time to put this stuff to rest, and I won't be waiting around for him.
> 
> I don't care what he says about my deposit. After this many promises, I will either have my guitar or I will have all, and I do mean *ALL* of my money back - including a refund for the BKP's that he installed in my guitar. This isn't a threat. It's just a guy that's fed up with waiting and hearing that things are good and then finding out nothing has happened.
> 
> I hope that it's all good. But I'm prepared to go as far as I have to to see that this is taken care of.



I really want to know what happened. I hope that Bernie came through, but if not that you were able to work something out. If this happens to me in a few weeks I'll be very upset.


----------



## paddy

djpharoah said:


> FYI - the Sims you're referring to is Patrick Sims who is from the USA and has scammed many people over the history of his being on the internet. He now owns/works at LGM Guitars. There's also a Sims in the UK who is unfortunately sharing the same name but not the same guy.



I'm glad that you rectified me.
This means that I can deal with those guys in the UK.
Cheers


----------



## Hollowway

Johnmar said:


> I wish i had stealing skills.



Where is that picture from? Is that a recent one or from earlier in the thread?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

From waaaaay earlier in the thread.


----------



## Hollowway

Oh, well that doesn't help any.  I thought that was an updated progress picture. Johnmar, I wish you also had knowing-when-to-post skills.


----------



## mikernaut

The last pics I received were back in February showing it in paint. Bernie and Ed weren't sure if the color was to my liking and apparently started stripping the headstock before showing me.  I saw the pics and while it wasn't my initial color choice ( which they couldn't seem to nail down) I said just go ahead with that color. 

Haven't gotten a update since.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, I just got word from the man himself. My guitar shipped and will be here on Monday. It's finally coming. Part one is done.

After roughly 1-2 weeks of playing, I will be bringing the guitar to my luthier for a full inspection. Provided that all is well with the instrument construction, I will end this with hopefully an excellent guitar. Prepare yourselves for an epic NGD at that point, which will also detail the entirety of my experience with this order. Good luck, guys. And wish me luck as well.


----------



## Hollowway

^ cool!


----------



## Khoi

just curious, did he send you a tracking number?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yes, he provided me with a tracking number right after asking me my t-shirt size. Apparently he left the birthday party at his house that his family was having for him to ship my guitar. I have to say, even though this has been a truly weird experience, provided that the guitar is in excellent condition, he at least finished really strong with me. Now... the wait.


----------



## Hollowway

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Yes, he provided me with a tracking number right after asking me my t-shirt size. Apparently he left the birthday party at his house that his family was having for him to ship my guitar. I have to say, even though this has been a truly weird experience, provided that the guitar is in excellent condition, he at least finished really strong with me. Now... the wait.



Yes, well I don't know that after missing all this time from work and being years behind on the orders taking Monday off for his birthday is a good idea. I'm glad he left today to ship it, but my personal feeling is Monday would be a day best spent working. I really want to either see my guitar or get a refund or something, because it's ridiculous that I've been waiting 31 months and there seems to be no motivation to deliver it. I'm resisting doing a chargeback on my credit card because Zimbloth would take the hit, but I've got to do something. I've emailed him a couple of times in the past week and haven't heard anything. Nick said he's going to try to get in touch with him and see if he can expedite it. It's really just putting the hardware on so he should be able to do that in one day.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Hey, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that all is well just because he shipped my guitar. This has been, as I said earlier, one of the most stressful and drawn out customer service experiences of my life. Even if angles fly out of my butthole when I strike the first chord, I have serious doubts about getting involved with another order from this man in my earthly time.


----------



## MetalDaze

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Even if angles fly out of my butthole....


 
The angled ones are brutal. If that happens, try some fiber to straighten them out


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Ah, the glories of auto-correct. Didn't even check it. That'd be... angels!


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

MetalDaze said:


> The angled ones are brutal. If that happens, try some fiber to straighten them out



Piss funny, lol.

Anyway, I am sitting here reading this whole thread and am feeling quite angry at Bernie and Co for what and is still happening. I must admit after reading everything that I was quite lucky to get my order (work in progress from the shop) to come to Australia in a half reasonable time, all be it with the wrong pick up configuration and OFR!

I took pride in receiving my Vixen, and while I still think it's the best guitar I have ever laid my hands on (I have played just about everything out there), it disturbs me now when my friends play my guitar and then say that they want one as well. I tell them about what is happening and they cant believe it. I feel the whole RICO image has been tarnished for good, and that works its way down to the owners as well. Its at a stage now where it is beyond repair. Should I feel lucky that I got mine? Well, No really. It should of been a normal business transaction that should of went without to many hiccups. With all thats gone on with all you blokes, I am so disappointed in the brand now, that every time someone says "You have a Rico, you lucky bastard:, I think, "meh", "if you only knew what was happening".

Please dont get me wrong here, I am not here to boast about getting a guitar from him, it's just I can't hold back now from all the bullshit excuses I see everyone here get, every time they want some info on their build. I'm with a couple on here, that if nothing is communicated properly and efficiently, then it's time to walk in to the bloody shop and take whats theirs. It looks like most dont want to "rock the boat", because they might upset him, or the guitar might be rushed. Bollocks on that. The power is in so many peoples hands here and when put together, I really do think that with most combining together, that there could be a good outcome. He seriously needs the biggest kick in the arse any builder has ever got. I struggle to fathom that someone can be so dumb as not to get someone in to take emails and calls on a daily basis, period! He is running away from a big problem, and with bullshit excuse after bullshit excuse and the non answering of emails and calls, and the time frame that this has been going on for, then still taking orders and deposits of others, is just the lowest thing I have seen from a custom builder. I think everybody should chip in and get a lawyer between yourselves and can this obvious abuse of trust and money, on its head! If I could do something to help out here from Australia, I would love too.

I know this is a big rant, but I feel gutted for you blokes that have been screwed around, and also for any new victims out there that have organised a build in the last year or two. 

I am hoping that one day everybody gets what they are after, and in a prompt fashion. If that does come about, I think the damage is done now and I know that even myself will never consider getting a guitar from Bernie, or anyone else for that matter whom has acted in such a way, ever again. This has been one of the most ludicrous and inefficient ventures I have ever read on a guitar forum. He needs an arse kicking, and he needs it now! I cannot fathom that someone can not be of self mind in decision making, but yet can go on and build guitars. Health issues or not, he has a certain responsibility towards his customers, and unfortunately, he has not come close. Surely someone else can take over this shithole mess and deal with everyone in a manner that is prompt and truthful. For fuck sake Bernie, pull your head in!


----------



## MatrixClaw

^Agreed on all counts.

This whole ordeal has completely ruined my image of ALL custom builders, not just Bernie. If I were to buy another high end guitar again, it will be a production model, or custom from a "big" company, because I really just don't want to have to deal with this BS again. I expected a higher level of customer service from a custom builder who is trying to nurture a relationship with the buyer, but there's been NO customer service at all. This whole ordeal honestly sickens me, mainly because the entire communication issue could be easily solved with little effort and monetary investment on his part, but he continues to make up excuses, rather than just being straight with the customer.


----------



## Qweklain

After reading all these pages over the almost two damn years now, I am starting to really get sick to my stomach with this deal. Waiting a year, for me, was no big deal, especially since other financial pursuits came up. Even without those financial alterations, a year or even a little more would did, and did not bother me. However, this is getting close to two years now, and he seems to be continuing to add to what seems an endless pile of orders, with what comes off as no end in sight to the current issues at hand with all of us, BFR orders and standard custom orders!

I just can not understand how one can have no organization (or so it appears) with his business practice and format of building, and not be bothered by that factor and try to rectify the situation, or modify his current practice by adding more people if necessary to get this done!! If I were in this situation, I would do whatever I could to get the guitars out at a solid steady pace where quality is retained, to not only preserve my chance for future business, but to not be constantly contacted by clients who not only are WAY beyond their reasonable time for their orders, but have been promised their order(s) to be shipped at certain times, only to have that statement be shattered more times than once.

Considering how many people here have had their guitars rebuilt and those guitars that are just "out of the magical woodshop," it would, in my opinion, be a much more practical approach for Bernie to just refund as many orders as he can for both BFR and standard orders. This way, many of us could simply move on and be rid of this headache, while he could focus a significantly larger amount of time and effort into the orders that are potentially close to being able to become completed.

I never thought it before, but at this point, I think it may be time to cut the time lost already patiently (mostly) waiting and just sell the spot and clean my hands and future financial funding that was to be for this of a dreadful experience that has no visible resolution in any practical time at this point.


----------



## MetalDaze

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Yes, he provided me with a tracking number right after asking me my t-shirt size. Apparently he left the birthday party at his house that his family was having for him to ship my guitar. I have to say, even though this has been a truly weird experience, provided that the guitar is in excellent condition, he at least finished really strong with me. Now... the wait.



What's the verdict?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Verdict is: There is currently a big heavy box at my parent's house waiting for me to pick it up first thing in the morning when I wake up. I had to close the place up at my job tonight, and I've got the next 3 days off. I'm planning to play the living Hell out of that guitar, post some pictures, post a test mix, and then bring it to my luthier for inspection on Monday. Hell yeah!


----------



## MetalDaze

The suspense is killing me


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well... I'm hammering away on it right now dialing in a patch on the Axe-FX II. And let me at least let you guys know... THIS GUITAR IS KILLER!!! KILLLLLERRRRR!!! Not only is it freaking beautiful, and I can find no flaws in it's design so far - the earth shattering sound that this thing is capable of... my God.

I can feel every chord resonate throughout the entire body and neck - it is, plain and simple, guitar sex. I called Bernie and left a message for him. He called me back and we spoke for a short bit. He apologized profusely for the long wait in receiving my guitar, and expressed serious sadness about how screwed up things have been lately. He says he is working hard on getting things back in order, and is very adamant about things getting better from here on out for his customers.

Easily among the finest guitars I've ever played including classicals, and easily the nicest guitar I've ever owned. I will take some pictures with a good camera this late afternoon, and will hopefully have some sound samples up by Thursday, but we will see.


----------



## MetalDaze

Speculum Speculorum said:


> THIS GUITAR IS KILLER!!! KILLLLLERRRRR!!!



Thank fucking god. If you had said anything less, I think we'd all be sending a lynch mob to Hesperia 

Horns up, Bernie! Let's see some more!


----------



## Larrikin666

Pics or it didn't happen. LOL


----------



## MetalDaze

Larrikin666 said:


> Pics or it didn't happen. LOL



Interesting angle  Maybe he's just pretending to have the guitar because Bernie used the Jedi mind trick to convince him that he has it.


----------



## Rook

Larrikin666 said:


> Pics or it didn't happen. LOL



+100000000


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Glad to hear man! I've always said, the custom game is fickle (this page = exibit A ) and things USUALLY don't go as planned, but no matter how screwed up things get at Bernie's shop, he's a good guy who builds rediculous guitars, and when you get one in your hand you'll know. Fuck yeah man, glad you enjoy your Rico, and to the rest waiting, don't get the blood pressure up cause they're worth the wait


----------



## mikernaut

So Angles/Angels flew out of your bottom? 

Glad it is impressing you after the long ordeal.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, glad to hear it! This gives me hope....


----------



## Qweklain

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, glad to hear it! This gives me hope....


Unfortunately, not me... this is only one out of how many both BFR and non-BFR that are how long overdue? You of all people Hollowway should be beyond reclaiming hope, unless you are literally holding your guitars you are owed right now.

I hate to be the Debbie Downer, but facts are facts...


----------



## brutalwizard

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well... I'm hammering away on it right now dialing in a patch on the Axe-FX II. And let me at least let you guys know... THIS GUITAR IS KILLER!!! KILLLLLERRRRR!!! Not only is it freaking beautiful, and I can find no flaws in it's design so far - the earth shattering sound that this thing is capable of... my God.
> 
> I can feel every chord resonate throughout the entire body and neck - it is, plain and simple, guitar sex.



So glad you got your guitar man!

Who is the tech you are taking it to here in the valley?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I'd tell you, but I'd fear that there would be a strong-arm robbery. 

Seriously though... the only tech worth taking a fine guitar to, in my humle little opinion, is Mr. Bolin.

EDIT - Here's the NGD guys - enjoy!

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...ekyll-727-56k-like-spider-swimming-honey.html


----------



## Hollowway

Qweklain said:


> Unfortunately, not me... this is only one out of how many both BFR and non-BFR that are how long overdue? You of all people Hollowway should be beyond reclaiming hope, unless you are literally holding your guitars you are owed right now.
> 
> I hate to be the Debbie Downer, but facts are facts...



Indeed. I'd say more but I'm typing with one hand because I'd driving to Boise to kill Spec. I'm a man of my word.

In all seriousness, though, I asked Nick to call Bernie and tell him that we need to either get my guitar wrapped up or just refund the money and move on. I really want the thing, but we're entering the 33rd month since I ordered it, and it was supposed to take 3 months start to finish. Bernie is not responding to my emails over the last couple of weeks to see if he's working on it. Hopefully Nick can get through. I want to avoid doing a chargeback on my CC since the immediate consequence is that Nick will be out of $1100. But at some point I go from being a patient man to a chump, and I have to do something.


----------



## EOT

6/25/2012...


Hollowway said:


> You guys posting about getting your BFRs this week or next, remember that there is a standing order that I will find and kill anyone who get's their BFR before I get my 2.5 year old custom. No joke. I'm putting on my black hoodie now.





Hollowway said:


> I'm typing with one hand because I'd driving to Boise to kill Spec. I'm a man of my word.



Apparently Spec, you should've told Bernie to hold on to your guitar a little longer


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, the people of Idaho have a lot of guns... and spare time...


----------



## Hollowway

Hey guys, someone PM me a working email addy for Bernie, if you could. I've sent him a few emails over the past month and haven't received any response.
Thanks.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Hollowway said:


> Hey guys, someone PM me a working email addy for Bernie, if you could. I've sent him a few emails over the past month and haven't received any response.
> Thanks.



^ I second that. Have always had good comms with him but not in the last month. Whoever knows please drop a line with it.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Qweklain said:


> I hate to be the Debbie Downer, but facts are facts...



Come on you gotta snap out of it Debb. You are starting to drag me down, m'kay? Wait, did you get the flu shot last year??

(guys I think he might have assburgers... )


----------



## Hollowway

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> ^ I second that. Have always had good comms with him but not in the last month. Whoever knows please drop a line with it.



Hopefully he's just hard at work on the guitars and finishing stuff up....


----------



## mikernaut

Well here's part of the issue the emails are being replied to by his father.  ( yes I know terrible humor, but how hard is it to get back via email with an update?)

Hello,

Bernie Rico here, I apologize for the delayed response to your request for
an update about your guitar. I am doing my best to work through my medical
condition. Please expect a delay on your request for an update for at
least a few more days. I will be updating you as soon as I can. Please
bare with me as I make my recovery.

Best regards,
Bernie Rico

status- month old email, no update still


----------



## WickedSymphony

^ I sent an e-mail 2 weeks ago and still haven't heard anything back. The last I heard was a full month ago that my guitar was supposed to ship out the following week.


----------



## Danukenator

mikernaut said:


> Hello,
> 
> Bernie Rico here, I apologize for the delayed response to your request for
> an update about your guitar. I am doing my best to work through my medical
> condition. Please expect a delay on your request for an update for at
> least a few more days. I will be updating you as soon as I can. Please
> bare with me as I make my recovery.
> 
> Best regards,
> Bernie Rico



I just read through the Emperion Mail? thread and that sounds very similar to a message sent by the company about how they are trying to fix the guitars and are working for no pay, etc.

IMO, I feel bad that Bernie is hurting, I'd feel bad for anyone. But, had he not bitten off more than he could chew, he would have been done with the run at his point.


----------



## mikernaut

It frustrates me to no end because I truly love the quality that comes out of his shop when they are firing on full, but it's really not that hard to keep constant updates to you customers via email these days no matter what is going on.


----------



## Hollowway

Out of curiosity, how many of you guys are getting something other than a slant top Hesperian for your BFR? When I signed up Bernie said it was only for those, and no other body styles. There were a few posts regarding that. But now I see people saying they are getting something other than that. True?


----------



## Neil

^ IIRC the vixen body shape was offered in the original BFR thread.


----------



## Hollowway

Neil said:


> ^ IIRC the vixen body shape was offered in the original BFR thread.



Ah, OK. I forgot about that, then. Thanks.


----------



## mikernaut

It makes me go hmmmm, because by the time I get my "correct" guitar, what can he possibly charge for the the current version that I have been playing over a year?


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> It makes me go hmmmm, because by the time I get my "correct" guitar, what can he possibly charge for the the current version that I have been playing over a year?



That's a good point. 

I'm getting EXTREMELY frustrated by the fact that I'm in way longer than others, and still have no guitar. Nick (Zimbloth) is going to try to get in touch with Bernie tomorrow to see what's up. And Spec is going to talk with him when they talk next. It's one thing for him to be behind. It's something else when he is pushing my build back behind more recent ones. That's pissing me off.

Edit: Good news - Bernie just emailed me back. He's assembling the guitar this week and will be sending some progress pics. He said he had to rebuild it 3 times due to neck issues, and barring another neck issue it will be done after assembly.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> Edit: Good news - Bernie just emailed me back. He's assembling the guitar this week and will be sending some progress pics. He said he had to rebuild it 3 times due to neck issues, and barring another neck issue it will be done after assembly.




Glad to hear you got some contact and the guitar is almost done! Your wait was ridiculously long. >_<


----------



## Khoi

Hollowway said:


> He said he had to rebuild it 3 times due to neck issues, and barring another neck issue it will be done after assembly.




is this normal for a builder to have this many rebuilds? I know it's been discussed before, but it's making me wonder... I mean my own guitar's clear coat had to be re-done and that's what is delaying it (I hope)


----------



## MetalDaze

Hollowayy will be officially entered into the BRJ record books:

* Longest build time - check
* Most rebuilds - check

Anything else?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Khoi said:


> is this normal for a builder to have this many rebuilds?



This is far from the norm. While many builders run into issues with materials that require reworks, it's not par the course, especially this many times for what seems to be the same issue. Especially on a style of guitar that the builder has already built numerous times. 



MetalDaze said:


> * Most rebuilds - check



Unfortunately, if you read through this thread there are a few who have needed just as many rebuilds.


----------



## Mitochondria

I agree with max. He has built enough guitars in his life to where it should be near flawless by now...


----------



## Mitochondria

Double post. Delete


----------



## MetalDaze

MaxOfMetal said:


> Unfortunately, if you read through this thread there are a few who have needed just as many rebuilds.


 
I thought the previous record holder was 2 rebuilds, but there's way too many pages now to go back and figure it out


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MetalDaze said:


> I thought the previous record holder was 2 rebuilds, but there's way too many pages now to go back and figure it out



I guess it comes down to semantics at this point. Rebuild? Refinish? Rework? It's all re-something.


----------



## Rook

^

Reminds me I the bit in a south park episode that goes 
'this is a special news report from CBS or NBC or CNN or whatever fuck you!'


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah rebuilds in general are abnormal. Its a good thing he is doing them instead of mailing out lemons though


----------



## Lirtle

Just out of curiosity how many of you guys that were told you had to get your guitar rebuilt actually saw the said faulty guitar?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I don't think he is going to advertise his mistakes by spreading pics around, though I have seen a few.


----------



## Lirtle

Right I was just checking if anyone received progress pics... I'm sure I'm just being overly skeptical.


----------



## SpaceDock

I thought the best "progress" needed rebuild picture was the ZOMBIE guitar that had the inlays in different positions from the side blocks. I don know how anyone could screw up that bad unless they were stoned.


----------



## Lirtle

Yeah that was terrifying


----------



## paddy

well, he didn't rebuild my guitar. Wrong body wood AND Side dots on even fret numbers (14, 16, etc)

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m39/ashkaneshghi/inlays.jpg

It should be obvious that this rebuild thing is an excuse to buy time, right?


----------



## Hollowway

paddy said:


> well, he didn't rebuild my guitar. Wrong body wood AND Side dots on even fret numbers (14, 16, etc)
> 
> http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m39/ashkaneshghi/inlays.jpg
> 
> It should be obvious that this rebuild thing is an excuse to buy time, right?



So you actually have that in your possession?  Does he know about those side dots?


----------



## paddy

Hollowway said:


> So you actually have that in your possession? Does he know about those side dots?



Yes I've got that guitar. tried to contact him via his phone, his 2 or 3 different email adds a lot of times that I had off him at the time, but he failed to get back to me. And why should he? when he can't even process the backlog he has, he doesn't want the xtra headache does he?
The whole story is on the page 72 of this thread if you wanted to have a look.

Cheers


----------



## Hollowway

paddy said:


> Yes I've got that guitar. tried to contact him via his phone, his 2 or 3 different email adds a lot of times that I had off him at the time, but he failed to get back to me. And why should he? when he can't even process the backlog he has, he doesn't want the xtra headache does he?
> The whole story is on the page 72 of this thread if you wanted to have a look.
> 
> Cheers



You have a post number? I have my user settings configured to show more posts per page than you.


----------



## Adrian-XI

^

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/3091924-post1777.html


----------



## paddy

Hollowway said:


> You have a post number? I have my user settings configured to show more posts per page than you.



Yes it is my very first post (dated 07-09-2012). Hope this helps.

cheers


----------



## Qweklain

MaxOfMetal said:


> I guess it comes down to semantics at this point. Rebuild? Refinish? Rework? It's all re-something.


Yes, all re-something indeed, and it is getting to that point where he needs to just do what needs to be done and friggin' REfund!!!

Honestly, it would be so much better and put most of us at ease (at least to some degree) if he would just keep everyone updated! It really is not that difficult, especially with technology these days, I mean come on...


----------



## killertone

Hollowway said:


> Out of curiosity, how many of you guys are getting something other than a slant top Hesperian for your BFR? When I signed up Bernie said it was only for those, and no other body styles. There were a few posts regarding that. But now I see people saying they are getting something other than that. True?



I am getting 2 full thickness Hesperian 7s. Both will have finishes as well.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

THE OFFICIAL BRJ BFR CIRCLE SCHEMATICS:

1. Bernie is a great guy and builds sweet arsed guitars.
2. Yeah, can't wait for mine, should be here soon.
3. Anybody got a current email address or phone number, I can't seem to get through.
4. Bernie doesn't seem to be responding, anybody got any info.
5. He's busy at the moment, probably working around the clock to get these kick arse guitars out. I spoke with him last week and mines in the paint shop. He's a great guy and a good communicator.
6. Yeah, not being rude, but I am getting a little bit frustrated with the lack of communication. I'm sure he is busy at the moment, and I don't want him to rush my guitar, because he is a perfectionist.
7. Yeah, why can't Bernie get someone to reply to the calls and emails?
8. Apparently he has been a bit crook at the moment, and he apologises for the delays and will get back to those whom have sent emails in a couple of days. Bernies a great bloke and a good communicator.
9. Sent more emails, no response in the last month.
10. Has anyone heard anything from anyone regarding where our guitars are at?
11. Got an email this morning from Bernie, saying the neck is screwed, so he's starting from scratch again. Glad he's not just sending out rubbish. He says to pass on that he is better now and getting on top of things, and has fired the guy looking after the emails, so all should be good. Bernies a great bloke and a good communicator.
12. Ive tried emailing him several times, and nothing, zip, zero. I'm fed up with this, I want a refund.
13. Yeah, Ive tried several times too. How can a handful of people get through and others like myself can't get through at all? This is beyond a joke!
14. Just got an email from Bernie. Mines shipping tomorrow, can't wait. It's all going to be worth it.
15. (4 days latter). Did you get your guitar? Nah not yet, Bernie said he had to go out of town for some medical treatment, so he'll get back on Monday and post it. Can't wait. It's all going to be worth it.
16. (2 weeks latter). Still havent got my guitar! Frustrating. Not responding to emails or phone calls at all.
17. (Somebody else). Got my guitar today, and may I just say that this thing SMOKES! I'm telling you now, hang in there everyone, these things are well worth the wait! Words can not express how this guitar feels and plays.............................................
AND BACK TO NO.1 ............................... CIRCLE COMPLETE!

THIS SHOULD BE STICKIED! It beats reading 75 odd pages over 5 nights.



Now this circle lasts a month! You can judge this by poor old HOLLOWAYS posts. 31 months, 32 months, 33 months, ...........................................



I know Bernie and Co read these posts so here goes..............

BUILD HOLLOWAYS GUITAR NOW! Make it your No1 priority and finish the F$%^&NG THING! This bloke deserves his guitar and some more. Ring him tomorrow personally and send photos and a detailed response on EXACTLY where this guitar is at! Period!


I'm sorry for the rant (especially Holloway), but this bloody circle never ends! I'm on the verge of scratching out the "B" on the headstock of my guitar, because it just frustrates me how a business can do this. My guitars worth declines by the day, as does everything to do with this brand. FIX IT NOW BERNIE!


----------



## Hollowway

^ Thanks, man! I appreciate the vote of priority.


----------



## mikernaut

Good luck Holloway, but if someone can't seem to grasp the concept of email updates/replying we are all hooped for the long haul. It seems to be a rocket science!


----------



## jbard

It appears my 8 is waiting on a case, so some others may be waiting for that G&G shipment as well. I know it's strung up and ready to go otherwise.


----------



## Phrygian

If BRJ was a pizza shop there would be a ton of free pizza's going on. 

/joke

I have given up on my build, I just don't care anymore. It has been rebuilt two times (once before I bought the spot last december) and it was oiled and presumably ready for assembly two months ago and then - silence. I'm




to selling it and never looking back.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

jbard said:


> It appears my 8 is waiting on a case, so some others may be waiting for that G&G shipment as well. I know it's strung up and ready to go otherwise.



Shit, I forgot about that one. Should fit in somewhere around point 14 I think.

Edit: Make that 15-16 .................


----------



## Larrikin666

What the hell is going on with G&G these days? That's two guitars of mine (BRJ and KxK) held up by cases at this point.


----------



## MetalDaze

We need a G&G bashing thread


----------



## Larrikin666

MetalDaze said:


> We need a G&G bashing thread



LOL. Seriously. I almost told Rob to ship my KxK in a garbage bag. I'm dying for that thing. I'll tell Bernie the same. I use soft cases anyways the majority of the time.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Welcome me aboard the train ride. I just bought someone's slot for a 7 string Vixen. I'm not even going there with when it will be done. I just hope a get a confirmation from Bernie that he has all my info with regards to the build. Best of luck to everyone!


----------



## Adrian-XI

MetalThrasher said:


> Welcome me aboard the train ride. I just bought someone's slot for a 7 string Vixen. I'm not even going there with when it will be done. I just hope a get a confirmation from Bernie that he has all my info with regards to the build. Best of luck to everyone!



Don't hold your breath. It took about 2 months to actually confirm that the spot had been transferred over to me when I bought it. Good luck!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Larrikin666 said:


> What the hell is going on with G&G these days? That's two guitars of mine (BRJ and KxK) held up by cases at this point.


 
How long have the cases been backlogged? Were they not ordered when the builds were commissioned?


----------



## mikernaut

So if my guitar is supposed to get Bare Knuckles installed in it ( which now is stated on the site that your supposed to buy them yourself and ship them to Bernie) I'm hooped even more... like all the other things weren't enough delay.

I do find it hard to believe that in most cases the rebuild excuse is legit.... it's more like the guitars are delayed coming for BRJ South if you catch my drift.

Anyways just checking in like most weekends to see the progress here, lol


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> So if my guitar is supposed to get Bare Knuckles installed in it ( which now is stated on the site that your supposed to buy them yourself and ship them to Bernie) I'm hooped even more... like all the other things weren't enough delay.



What, for the BFRs? Those pups were included. Customs need to have them mailed in, but the Painkillers were part of the run (at least for the 8 strings. The 7s may have had CL/LF).


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> What, for the BFRs? Those pups were included. Customs need to have them mailed in, but the Painkillers were part of the run (at least for the 8 strings. The 7s may have had CL/LF).



Yep, 7 strings had CL/LF.

Update on mine: should be sent out next week. We'll see.


----------



## gplayer51

Heard mine is just out of the woodshop and I have been on the ride for about 7 months now but I am pretty lucky cause mine is a Custom Build lol. And btw you dont have to send in pickups, the CL/LF come with the guitar even if you sent in BKPs,etc.


----------



## mikernaut

Well my guitar is a Custom and not in the BFR group. It's suppose to get white Aftermaths so I imagine he hasn't ordered them yet from BKP. Unless he wants me to ship this one back them swap the pups out.


----------



## Hollowway

gplayer51 said:


> Heard mine is just out of the woodshop and I have been on the ride for about 7 months now but I am pretty lucky cause mine is a Custom Build lol.



Yeah, hopefully you're on a fast track, but again, just because you have a quick woodshop build doesn't mean you're any closer to getting it. I'm not sure there's an established timeline for the different steps of the process. But maybe he's gotten that huge bulk through the process ahead of yours and build times have decreased.


----------



## gplayer51

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, hopefully you're on a fast track, but again, just because you have a quick woodshop build doesn't mean you're any closer to getting it. I'm not sure there's an established timeline for the different steps of the process. But maybe he's gotten that huge bulk through the process ahead of yours and build times have decreased.



Yeah i totally agree. My guess if all goes planned(which is highly unlikely lol) i should get it within a month and a half. And I will tell all of you guys how long it takes to get from paint to home once I get the thing.


----------



## Rap Hat

gplayer51 said:


> Yeah i totally agree. My guess if all goes planned(which is highly unlikely lol) i should get it within a month and a half. And I will tell all of you guys how long it takes to get from paint to home once I get the thing.



I would definitely not recommend "planning for the best" with the build. Any expectations you have for completion, throw them out. I'm not saying this to be a bummer or discourage you, just that actually expecting the guitar in a month and a half, even if it's a longshot, is setting yourself up for disappointment.

All you have to do is look at the guys here who had their guitars done, strung up and everything and have waited more than 2 months with no guitar. Or the (probably) 50 people with guitars that are finished except pickups, or hardware, or cases. Some of them, me included, have been in this stage for 8-9 months, with the majority of them paid off completely.

There was one guy who bought an in stock guitar which took around 7 months IIRC (and it was mostly complete from what I remember). Considering that the site says you'll have it in 30 days...


Right now it looks like there are maybe three or four guitars going out a month. It could be a little more and maybe he'll pump out a bunch soon, but he's gotta have a backlog of well over 100 instruments in various stages of completion. While I respect his work, I'm baffled that he won't take someone in and train them to do the assembly/final work. He's very proud that he does the final steps all himself, but it almost seems like an unnecessary hurdle to completion right now. If he gets sick again, or something comes up, all the work will stop and things will be delayed however long.


----------



## mikernaut

yup, Raphat is right "out of the wood shop" basically means nothing at this point. For everything that has been going on I would say that "term" is more like " ohhh yeah we have added it to the list of 100+ guitars to build, thanks for your money!"

I love my BRJ's quality but am soooooooooooooooooo tired of the horrible excuses and lack of communication.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, there is no way you'll see that guitar in a month/month and a half. While no one is precisely sure who does what steps, everyone agrees that several people work in the woodshop, but paint appears to be just one guy, and Bernie is the only (or close to it) guy who does everything else.


----------



## HarryLikesProg

This is my hesperian slant 7. It has an all rosewood neck and 27 inch scale. Looks pretty cool!


----------



## Hollowway

^Nice! Looks like its ready to ship.


----------



## WillDfx

HarryLikesProg said:


> This is my hesperian slant 7. It has an all rosewood neck and 27 inch scale. Looks pretty cool!



Looks great Harry! How's that Indigo 727 doing?


----------



## Rap Hat

gplayer - To clarify my earlier post, I hope you are able to get the guitar in a month and a half. That would be an awesome change from Bernie's regular issues and at the very least show that things are moving along.

It's tough for a lot of us when someone says their guitar will (or should) be done in _x_-amount of time. One the one hand it's kind of a dick move to say "no, it won't be", on the other hand it's even worse to encourage or confirm those expectations when we know they're most likely inaccurate. I'm of the mindset that if you have no expectations, it'll be a great feeling when the guitar is finally done and in your hands. I don't think anyone can fully disconnect that way, but it sure as hell beats the crash when a major promise is broken.

Each and every one of us should be able to be happy about our builds - while this thread comes off as very negative sometimes, in the end we all just want our guitars.


----------



## purpledc

I hate to say this and I mean no disrespect. I used to play BC rich guitar exclusively and Bernie Jr had a reputation for pulling this kind of stuff 10 years ago. So when I see these threads where guys dont understand why their guitars are taking this long or other delays and set backs, I really cant help but think that with as many debacles BRJ has had in the past it shouldnt really be a surprise to anyone. That isnt me trying to be a dick or shit on BRJ. I actually love his guitars and I love his fathers original designs even better. But I call things like I see it. And Jr. has the reputation he built for himself for a reason. And like most people like him he can only hold it together for so long before the same old shit starts happening again. Heres hoping he turns it around soon and has another streak of productive guitar making.


----------



## gplayer51

Rap Hat said:


> gplayer - To clarify my earlier post, I hope you are able to get the guitar in a month and a half. That would be an awesome change from Bernie's regular issues and at the very least show that things are moving along.
> 
> It's tough for a lot of us when someone says their guitar will (or should) be done in _x_-amount of time. One the one hand it's kind of a dick move to say "no, it won't be", on the other hand it's even worse to encourage or confirm those expectations when we know they're most likely inaccurate. I'm of the mindset that if you have no expectations, it'll be a great feeling when the guitar is finally done and in your hands. I don't think anyone can fully disconnect that way, but it sure as hell beats the crash when a major promise is broken.
> 
> Each and every one of us should be able to be happy about our builds - while this thread comes off as very negative sometimes, in the end we all just want our guitars.


Dude no offense taken at all, haha I have been reading these forums almost every day for the past couple months lol and I totally know where you are coming from. Thanks for the insight lol.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Finally got a hold of Bernie the other day, says he's going to get on my guitar ASAP and should hopefully have it done by Friday.

We'll see! Not gettin my hopes up just yet, but can't help but be somewhat excited.


----------



## Hollowway

MatrixClaw said:


> Finally got a hold of Bernie the other day, says he's going to get on my guitar ASAP and should hopefully have it done by Friday.
> 
> We'll see! Not gettin my hopes up just yet, but can't help but be somewhat excited.



This is a BFR guitar? And is yours one of the ones you paid the balance on months ago?


----------



## MatrixClaw

Hollowway said:


> This is a BFR guitar? And is yours one of the ones you paid the balance on months ago?



Yes and yes. My guitar was paid in full 6 months ago.


----------



## Hollowway

MatrixClaw said:


> Yes and yes. My guitar was paid in full 6 months ago.



Ah. Cool, then. I should be mad at you for getting it sooner than mine, but it's been paid for 6 months, so you really should have that in your possession.


----------



## Qweklain

Hollowway said:


> Ah. Cool, then. I should be mad at you for getting it sooner than mine, but it's been paid for 6 months, so you really should have that in your possession.


I think it is time for you to put on your black hood again...


----------



## Hollowway

Qweklain said:


> I think it is time for you to put on your black hood again...



Indeed. Shinigami rides again!


----------



## Khoi

Hollowway said:


> Ah. Cool, then. I should be mad at you for getting it sooner than mine, but it's been paid for 6 months, so you really should have that in your possession.



I paid mine in full about 8 months ago (in January), and it seems that the full payment doesn't correlate to the time of guitar completion 

I know others paid a long time ago as well, and I'm not sure how many of them actually got their guitars


----------



## Larrikin666

MaxOfMetal said:


> How long have the cases been backlogged? Were they not ordered when the builds were commissioned?



He told me it's been months since G&G filled any of his orders. Rob from KxK has had similar gripes about them recently.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Larrikin666 said:


> He told me it's been months since G&G filled any of his orders. Rob from KxK has had similar gripes about them recently.


 
If he's just waiting on cases, can't he offer those who have been waiting what seems like forever now, to have thier instruments shipped sans case, or with a generic case? 

Would anyone here be willing to skip out on the embossed logo case if it meant getting thier guitars shipped this week? Hollowway? Khoi? MatrixClaw? Mike?


----------



## Khoi

definitely not opposed to that, but I'm not sure where my guitar stands right now, so I don't know if mine is delayed due to the cases being delayed.


----------



## Larrikin666

MaxOfMetal said:


> If he's just waiting on cases, can't he offer those who have been waiting what seems like forever now, to have thier instruments shipped sans case, or with a generic case?
> 
> Would anyone here be willing to skip out on the embossed logo case if it meant getting thier guitars shipped this week? Hollowway? Khoi? MatrixClaw? Mike?




I sincerely doubt he'd have a problem with that. He counted off 8 completely finished guitars yesterday (mine included) that are completely done but don't have cases. I tried putting my Hesperian 7 in a few different hardcases I had laying around, but the shape of the body didn't match up too well. Personally, I'm gonna hold off on the right case. Same thing for my KxK.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Larrikin666 said:


> I sincerely doubt he'd have a problem with that. He counted off 8 completely finished guitars yesterday (mine included) that are completely done but don't have cases. I tried putting my Hesperian 7 in a few different hardcases I had laying around, but the shape of the body didn't match up too well. Personally, I'm gonna hold off on the right case. Same thing for my KxK.



Wow, 8 completed. I wonder if mine was one of them 

But I'd prefer to wait for a case that fit properly, too. Any idea how long it would take for him to get cases though?


----------



## MetalDaze

Bernie has been waiting for a case for my Diva since last November. Not sure if that helps gauge how long you will have to wait for a case.


----------



## Larrikin666

WickedSymphony said:


> Wow, 8 completed. I wonder if mine was one of them
> 
> But I'd prefer to wait for a case that fit properly, too. Any idea how long it would take for him to get cases though?



I'm not sure. Rob from KxK has been talking about a backlog on cases since last August. G&G told Bernie two weeks every time they've spoken, but I guess that's their stock answer for lead time. G&G makes cases for some MUCH bigger companies than these small custom shops, so I imagine these smaller places get put on the back burner a lot. Especially with them likely needing cases that different so significantly from standard Fender tweed case that G&G does regularly.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Larrikin666 said:


> told Bernie two weeks every time they've spoken.


 
Irony? 




Just a joke fellas.


----------



## Larrikin666

MaxOfMetal said:


> Irony?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just a joke fellas.



LOL. I thought about popping that in there as soon as I typed that sentence, but I'll leave the easy jabs to everyone else.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Larrikin666 said:


> I'm not sure. Rob from KxK has been talking about a backlog on cases since last August. G&G told Bernie two weeks every time they've spoken, but I guess that's their stock answer for lead time. G&G makes cases for some MUCH bigger companies than these small custom shops, so I imagine these smaller places get put on the back burner a lot. Especially with them likely needing cases that different so significantly from standard Fender tweed case that G&G does regularly.



Yeh, if that's the case then I might just rather get a generic case or work something out like getting the generic then just buying an actual case later whenever they're available. Really don't want to wait several months (or a year at this point I suppose) over a case...


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

No surprise, my guitar still hasn't shipped. "just waiting on cases"


----------



## MetalDaze

Sounds like we need some muscle to shake down the G&G guys and then get those cases delivered to BRJ and KxK.


----------



## Hollowway

Road trip? If mine were done I'd seriously make the 6 hour drive to Hesperia and get it, sans case.


----------



## gplayer51

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> No surprise, my guitar still hasn't shipped. "just waiting on cases"


Dude I saw your guitar on facebook a couple of weeks ago and it said ready to ship to customer. Man I feel for ya, I'd be pissed!


----------



## Qweklain

Are there no other suppliers of good cases that could be contracted with? Clearly G&G is not capable of handling the load they have taken on, so why don't Bernie and others on the roster start looking elsewhere for a company that can actually fulfill their obligations?


----------



## jbard

I guess Bernie and his father had used them since the 60s or something like that, so he's probably not in a hurry to use another company. G&G do make nice cases... Not sure what is messing them up.

In case this is some people's first BRJ, they aren't standard cases from them either, they are custom. My other BRJ G&G case has the BRJ diamond emblem woven into the outside of it.


----------



## Larrikin666

Yeah. Bernie and his father have a pretty strong relationship with G&G because of the them working with BC Rich all those years ago. I can also 2nd the fact that G&G makes very nice cases. I really love mine.

It would also cost quite a bit of money to source a new company to make cases. You're looking at designing, purchasing, tooling, test runs, blah blah blah. I hope it doesn't end up having to go that route.


----------



## WillDfx

Yeah my first two Rico's had the BRJ Logo on the case, one nicely woven and stitched. And the other had a painted on or stamped type of logo. But my newest Rico came with a case without a logo whatsoever, and the guitar actually didn't fit very well
All my G&G cases are of great quality look great. I have two currently and they are the best hardshell cases I own. Although If I were still in the running for the BFR I would certainly ask for mine to be shipped sans hardshell G&G to safe time. Maybe even order a decent gig bag and have it shipped to Bernie if he was cool, and you were comfortable doing so.


----------



## MetalThrasher

I'm glad Bernie contacted me via email this morning. He now has all my information for the Vixen slot I purchased. I just need to get back to him with regards on the setup and strings to be used whenever it's ready. The build is all stock and I'm not changing anything cosmetically. My only debate is the bridge pickup. Keep the crunch lab or put a d-activator in?


----------



## Larrikin666

MetalThrasher said:


> Keep the crunch lab or put a d-activator in?



I used to REALLY dislike the Crunch Lab, but there's something about the mahogany in Bernie's guitars mixing with that pickup that I love. I'd consider giving it a shot.


----------



## Qweklain

B contacted me today updating me to let me know he re-did my inlays which are correct now (based on his word). He also wanted me to send another picture depicting the coloring I want, which I sent him six different pictures to be sure haha!

I asked for a picture just to be sure the inlays are right, as they are not normal (and I am sure most will not like them) and just so I can see the thing is actually existent still!


----------



## Lirtle

I've finally received some photos. Looks like he's written "rush" in the bridge pickup cavity. Sweet.


----------



## SpaceDock

It's great to see a pile of guitars, but I feel like all of them need "RUSH" written on them.


----------



## Rook

Don't see a rosewood necked Jekyll in there moanmoanmoanmoanmoan


----------



## Phrygian

Not to be a party pooper,but mine has been at that stage since february and still is(afaik anyway).

Edit: your Guitar does look good though!


----------



## MatrixClaw

Got some new pictures of mine, completed with all the hardware and strings on it. Looks AMAZING, much better than I ever thought it would.

Haven't heard back when it'll be shipped, but hopefully gives hope to others that he might be cranking some out now...


----------



## travis bickle

i got a beautiful shot of my baby as well, strung up and just about ready to go.


----------



## travis bickle

im salivating.


----------



## Black Mamba

^^^

We all are!


----------



## Hollowway

Hey, anyone got a phone number for Bernie? I wanted to call him today to ask him a question about one of my builds (not an update or anything - I have a color question about the finish). I went to call him and I can't find the number in my emails. PM me if you have it.


----------



## TomAwesome

Oh damn, that red looks nice.


----------



## gplayer51

[QUOTE



[/QUOTE]

The Hesperian 7 with the Offset dots on the left is mine...Progress 

Edit: Not mine lolol


----------



## Khoi

looks so sick. 

let us know when it ships


----------



## ikarus

I got some progress pics too:


----------



## travis bickle

Thanks fellas, Im quite impressed with how its turning out. Now lets see how long G&G takes to supply bernie with cases.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Aside from one other guitar I found on the interwebz that I had Bernie model my guitar's finish after, I don't think the color of mine has ever been done on a guitar I've seen before.

I might be a bit biased... but I think mine is the best looking BRJ I've ever seen. So excite


----------



## jbard

Hmm I just got a DC800 carvin G&G case today... maybe a can send it to him empty and just get a back fill sent when they come in...


----------



## Rook

MatrixClaw said:


> Aside from one other guitar I found on the interwebz that I had Bernie model my guitar's finish after, I don't think the color of mine has ever been done on a guitar I've seen before.
> 
> I might be a bit biased... but I think mine is the best looking BRJ I've ever seen. So excite



Makes a claim like that with no pic to hand


----------



## MatrixClaw

Fun111 said:


> Makes a claim like that with no pic to hand


----------



## Adrian-XI

NICE! Hit up Larrikin666 for a gold 3-way!

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/de...ci-style-3-way-lever-switches-black-gold.html


----------



## Khoi

my jaw dropped. WOW.

the natural binding really sets it off... I have no idea how you aren't flying out there and picking it up personally, rather than waiting-god-knows-how-long for it to ship


----------



## Red&Die

Gold Handware WIN!!!!


----------



## Adrian-XI

Khoi said:


> the natural binding really sets it off...


Binding? Am I blind or are you just talking about the unstained sides of the top?


----------



## kruneh

Adrian-XI said:


> Binding? Am I blind or are you just talking about the unstained sides of the top?



Often called natural binding, so yes that´s what he meant


----------



## gplayer51

Got some updates and btw Matrix your guitar is SEXY!


----------



## geofreesun

^ maybe my eyes are weird. looks like the 4th hole on the headstock is a tiny bit off


----------



## Larrikin666

geofreesun said:


> ^ maybe my eyes are weird. looks like the 4th hole on the headstock is a tiny bit off



I noticed the same thing at first. The weird thing is that it appears to move if I look at my screen at a different angle. LOL. That's gotta be some weird illusion from the graining of the wood and the light.


----------



## Adrian-XI

kruneh said:


> Often called natural binding, so yes that´s what he meant



Ah ok, didn't know that


----------



## gplayer51

Larrikin666 said:


> I noticed the same thing at first. The weird thing is that it appears to move if I look at my screen at a different angle. LOL. That's gotta be some weird illusion from the graining of the wood and the light.



I did the same thing haha I looked from the left, idk I just hope its black magic lol

Edit: If you look at Ikarus's update pic (page 79) it has that same look it is an illusion lol


----------



## ryanoddi

Oh I'm thoroughly excited


----------



## ryanoddi

I'm not sure why the picture is sideways.... that's not how it's originally oriented.. but oh well, I guess you're gonna have to tilt your head


----------



## SpaceDock

These progress pics are really encouraging.


----------



## Jexey

Way to go brown dude. That's rare...very eloquent. That dragonburat guitar is making me crazy too. Good fkn job fellas


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> These progress pics are really encouraging.



Totally. Especially since they're so incredibly awesome. Those finishes are just blowing me away. I want to hit MatrixClaw over the head and snatch that blueburst.


----------



## technomancer

MatrixClaw said:


> Aside from one other guitar I found on the interwebz that I had Bernie model my guitar's finish after, I don't think the color of mine has ever been done on a guitar I've seen before.



Google caribbean burst


----------



## Jexey

Bernie's been really communicative with me as well. My guitar is in the drying room after the clear coat. I should have a strung up blue jean flame 8 with a piezo picture coming here shortly.


----------



## gplayer51

Jexey said:


> Bernie's been really communicative with me as well. My guitar is in the drying room after the clear coat. I should have a strung up blue jean flame 8 with a piezo picture coming here shortly.



I will be waiting for that amazing pic!!


----------



## ryanoddi

^^ Oh yea man, same here! That sounds like it's gonna be amazing!


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah I emailed him and got a response about my custom - it's in assembly now. Hopefully it'll come through soon!


----------



## JerichoCheng

I've also got a replied for my Hesperian 828, and he said the guitar ready to ship next week
CAN'T WAIT!!


----------



## gplayer51

Wow all is well for once on the BRJ thread
Congrats Holloway!!


----------



## Hollowway

gplayer51 said:


> Wow all is well for once on the BRJ thread
> Congrats Holloway!!



Well, ain't no fat lady singin', so let's not get too excited. 


(But I am cautiously optimistic.)


----------



## DC23

Can any of you guys tell me what sort of upcharges different finishes are on Bernie's BFR run? I'm kind of torn and don't know what I want to do with regards to the finish of my 727. Doing a burst with gloss on the front? How much extra would it be to have the back of the guitar finished in gloss black or a different color? Charges for matching headstock?

Just figured I'd ask here rather than emailing Bernie every time I think of a question.


----------



## kruneh

DC23 said:


> Can any of you guys tell me what sort of upcharges different finishes are on Bernie's BFR run? I'm kind of torn and don't know what I want to do with regards to the finish of my 727. Doing a burst with gloss on the front? How much extra would it be to have the back of the guitar finished in gloss black or a different color? Charges for matching headstock?
> 
> Just figured I'd ask here rather than emailing Bernie every time I think of a question.



I don´t know exact charges for different stuff, but I was quoted $350 for a trans coloured gloss top with matching headstock, and an oiled back.
So whatever you chose, I´d say roughly $350-500 total..?
Hope it helps 

Oh btw, haven´t heard from Bernie  
But it´s great to see that there´s some progress, and I´m genuinely happy for everyone of you who get some kind of response.


----------



## WillDfx

kruneh said:


> I don´t know exact charges for different stuff, but I was quoted $350 for a trans coloured gloss top with matching headstock, and an oiled back.
> So whatever you chose, I´d say roughly $350-500 total..?
> Hope it helps
> 
> Oh btw, haven´t heard from Bernie
> But it´s great to see that there´s some progress, and I´m genuinely happy for everyone of you who get some kind of response.




You have B7, you no need BRJ....... amirite?


----------



## kruneh

WillDfx said:


> You have B7, you no need BRJ....... amirite?



It says a lot when it´s easier to get a B7 than a BRJ


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

My guitar is ready to ship since two months, but still no sign of it, also emailed Bernie four times reguarding it but no answer, which is weird since he always answers and I perfectly know he's sending pics to other customers. It seems impossible to me that in two months he can't get a random case to ship it.

I usually stay away from complains but my patience is running off...


----------



## SpaceDock

I think he needs some sort of line manager that can prioritize work and update customers on progress. I have worked in build to order manufacturing and It really isnt that hard to organize hundreds of orders if you have some software like SharePoint or even good bookkeeping practices. I am very surprised that his operation seems so lax on th business end. One good business person is separating his shop from being hugely profitable. We all saw how many people pony up thousands for his guitars, if he could deliver them and move on to the next group, I am sure he would sell much larger volumes consistently.


----------



## JP Universe

Some good news. Unsolicited - Bernie just emailed me letting me know that my guitar is ready for the final clear finish and he just needs a pic of the electronics


----------



## Red&Die

Here is the updated pic what I received from Bernie yesterday, it will be Pearl White Jekyll 7 with abalone binding with gold hardware like PRS Dave Navarro style..


----------



## glassmoon0fo

That is TITS


----------



## MatrixClaw

Messaged Bernie twice this past week to see when my guitar would ship, no reply  The guitar is completely done... Hopefully it goes out soon...


----------



## Jexey

^^^ That was the 2000th reply on this thread.... isn't that some sort of epic record? or would it be an epic fail?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Jexey said:


> ^^^ That was the 2000th reply on this thread.... isn't that some sort of epic record? or would it be an epic fail?



Idunno, but wouldn't you have broken that record by adding the 2001st reply?


----------



## toiletstand

Red&Die said:


> Here is the updated pic what I received from Bernie yesterday, it will be Pearl White Jekyll 7 with abalone binding with gold hardware like PRS Dave Navarro style..



quoting because this needs to be seen on this page too. very nice! i see a denim quilt in the back too!


----------



## Larrikin666

toiletstand said:


> quoting because this needs to be seen on this page too. very nice! i see a denim quilt in the back too!



I thought that was my denim for a second, but it has too many knobs.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Bernie just emailed me today. He said that my Vixen is going to be ready to ship. Guess its time to fork over the rest of the money. I'm going to ask him to send me a picture of the guitar. Hopefully, I'll get it in a few weeks.


----------



## Jexey

toiletstand said:


> quoting because this needs to be seen on this page too. very nice! i see a denim quilt in the back too!


 
The denim quilt in the background is mine! The overknobbage is all the piezo crap I'll have going on

It's going to be hard to compete with that white guitar, what a great job they've done with it so far!


----------



## Qweklain

Qweklain said:


> B contacted me today updating me to let me know he re-did my inlays which are correct now (based on his word). He also wanted me to send another picture depicting the coloring I want, which I sent him six different pictures to be sure haha!
> 
> I asked for a picture just to be sure the inlays are right, as they are not normal (and I am sure most will not like them) and just so I can see the thing is actually existent still!


Well he indeed sent me a picture and the inlays are correct now. 

He also sent me another e-mail yesterday saying they (him and paint guy??) are in the process of staining/painting it, but are having troubles trying to get it a perfect combination of what I am looking for. Unlike the previous guy with the Caribbean Burst, I honestly have not seen the color burst I have asked for. I am sure a lot of people may raise an eyebrow to it, but I think it is going to come out bad-ass! 

I have been patient throughout most of this with the exception of the last couple months, but seeing that the inlays have been corrected and that more progress is being made, I am now content until whenever I see/hear more progress or am told it is done. I would have to guess that will not be until sometime next year, but as of right now, I am completely okay with that.

I would have to bet that I am not the only one here who feels the same way I do, and that is all a good amount of us here want is to get some update and/or contact to know we are not just being hung to dry!! A small piece of information and update is all we really want B, no matter how big or small!!


----------



## travis bickle

should be getting tracking info monday!!!! fuck.


----------



## killertone

Apparently I have been cut off from communication with Bernie. I used to get responses quickly and now I get nothing. Bummer.


----------



## SpaceDock

He usually takes a long ass time to respond to me unless it's during normal business hours.


----------



## BaconRays

Last time I talked to Bernie, he vented to me for about 20 minutes about how everything is fucked up. He is *EXTREMELY* busy because he had to fire his guy that answered the phones, and did all the emails and quotes. Out of 1800 hundred emails he responded to 50. 

Bernie told me personally, to tell everyone on this site to keep the love, and he is trying his hardest to get everyone's guitar finished and perfect. 

There was an issue with a handful of guitars a few weeks ago with the mad humidity here in California, where some of the fret boards started cracking, so he had to re-do them, which is a major set back. 

He wants everyone to know that he hasn't forgotten about you, and he needs the support now more than ever. Anyone talking shit about Bern, hasn't _REALLY_ spoken to him. He is a down to earth guy trying as hard as he can to build over 500 guitars pretty much by himself. All he asks is for your patience and your continuous support. 

The day I get my Jekyll will be the best day ever for sure.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

BaconRays said:


> he had to fire his guy that answered the phones



Isn't he on his fifth "web guy" at this point? 



> Anyone talking shit about Bern, hasn't _REALLY_ spoken to him.



Sorry, hard to support someone who threatens _paying customers_ with frivolous lawsuits when all they want is their guitars, or at least an e-mail/phone call.  

Hey Hollowway how are you doing? Still pulling for you buddy. 

It's good to see some good coming to this thread, it's been a long while.


----------



## BaconRays

He told me someone wanted their deposit back. When it clearly says no refunds, Bern was absolutely ready for a lawsuit.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

BaconRays said:


> He told me someone wanted their deposit back. When it clearly says no refunds, Bern was absolutely ready for a lawsuit.



That was not the case I was referring to, but good to hear he's putting time and energy into more of that and not speaking to customers who have been waiting as long as two years. 

With that, I'm backing out for now. I've been threatened enough by folks in the BRJ camp.


----------



## tjrlogan

Just wanted to chime in and say that Bernie's been pretty good with email communication on my black Friday build thus far. I got an email from him last week saying that the guitar is almost ready and he asked my what tuning I wanted, etc. I responded to him with a changed shipping address and he replied back the next day.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Hey Hollowway how are you doing? Still pulling for you buddy.



Where is Hollowway?

_Kubler-Ross's 5 stages of grief_
Denial
Anger
Barganing
Depression
Acceptance <--Hollowway


 Seriously, though, I emailed him a few times over the past couple of months and told him I really want to see mine (the non BFR) come through before any more of these BFRs because it's only fair to be FIFO at this point. He said it's currently in assembly and should be done soon. So hopefully. I'm frustrated, but I've calmed down considerably and at this point I'm just hoping it comes in the next couple of weeks.


----------



## Hollowway

BaconRays said:


> He told me someone wanted their deposit back. When it clearly says no refunds, Bern was absolutely ready for a lawsuit.



I'm not necessarily siding with the guy in this case, but the original agreement was a guitar in 3 months in exchange for payment, so I'm not sure the lawsuit would have really gone too far. However, like everyone has been saying the best way to solve any of this (short of completing the guitars) is communication. I can say personally that I've been extremely frustrated a number of times throughout this process, and just when I was ready to look into some way of ending the whole thing (the order, not my life ) I would be able to get in touch with him, talk about it, and we'd be cool again. I've seen that happen a number of times with other guys on here, too.


----------



## WickedSymphony

I dunno. I understand that he's in a rough spot and trying to get these guitars out, but it's hard to keep being hopeful. I've been told my guitar would ship 3 separate times in the past 2 months since I've paid, with the latest one supposed to be on Monday. I can't really say I'm counting on it at this point. I asked for pics earlier this week, and he said he would get them to me that day, but I still haven't gotten anything. If there are any problems with my build he just needs to let me know. There have already been a few with the paint and I've been completely cool about them each time because I know they'll get fixed.

I've already told him it's not the wait that bugs me, it's not knowing what's going on with my guitar or when I can realistically expect it, especially now after being told it would ship several times.



Hollowway said:


> Where is Hollowway?
> 
> _Kubler-Ross's 5 stages of grief_
> Denial
> Anger
> Barganing
> Depression <---Wicked
> Acceptance <--Hollowway


----------



## MJS

Hollowway said:


> ... and just when I was ready to look into some way of ending the whole thing (*the order, not my life* )



 

That actually made me laugh when you had to specify that you wouldn't be killing yourself.


----------



## Danukenator

BaconRays said:


> He is *EXTREMELY* busy because he had to fire his guy that answered the phones, and did all the emails and quotes. Out of 1800 hundred emails he responded to 50.



That was an issue that should have been resolved very quickly. It's his job to oversee his workers. After the first thousand emails that went unresponded you'd think a red flag may have been raised. 



BaconRays said:


> Anyone talking shit about Bern, hasn't _REALLY_ spoken to him.



Well that's the issue isn't it? People are talking shit because they can't communicate with he person who took their money.


----------



## Locrian

BaconRays said:


> Last time I talked to Bernie, he vented to me for about 20 minutes about how everything is fucked up. He is *EXTREMELY* busy because he had to fire his guy that answered the phones, and did all the emails and quotes. Out of 1800 hundred emails he responded to 50.
> 
> Bernie told me personally, to tell everyone on this site to keep the love, and he is trying his hardest to get everyone's guitar finished and perfect.
> 
> There was an issue with a handful of guitars a few weeks ago with the mad humidity here in California, where some of the fret boards started cracking, so he had to re-do them, which is a major set back.
> 
> He wants everyone to know that he hasn't forgotten about you, and he needs the support now more than ever. Anyone talking shit about Bern, hasn't _REALLY_ spoken to him. He is a down to earth guy trying as hard as he can to build over 500 guitars pretty much by himself. All he asks is for your patience and your continuous support.
> 
> The day I get my Jekyll will be the best day ever for sure.



It's easier to get the Pope on the phone than it is to get a hold of Bernie.


----------



## Isan

BaconRays said:


> He told me someone wanted their deposit back. When it clearly says no refunds, Bern was absolutely ready for a lawsuit.



He has broken already broken his agreement with the buyer when he quoted 2-3 months and it has been a year and half.
ANY court would rule that that is unreasonable amount of time and he would be forced to give a refund. 

TBH just sell the damn slot took me 10 minutes to get rid of mine...


----------



## glassmoon0fo

^aaaand in the process make it slower for those that are patient and want their guitar. 

He won't leave you guys out to dry, you'll all get great instruments, albeit later rather than sooner. IMO, if you can't afford to be out of a large sum of money for an extended period of time, you probably shouldn't be ordering custom guitars from anybody anyway. Everybody just chill.


----------



## Hollowway

glassmoon0fo said:


> ^aaaand in the process make it slower for those that are patient and want their guitar.
> 
> He won't leave you guys out to dry, you'll all get great instruments, albeit later rather than sooner. IMO, if you can't afford to be out of a large sum of money for an extended period of time, you probably shouldn't be ordering custom guitars from anybody anyway. Everybody just chill.



Yeah, I think 95% of us are just hanging in waiting patiently. But even Saint Monica would agree that mine is overdue. That being said, I know where it is in the process, and Bernie recognizes how long it's been, so I am optimistic.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

^Indeed


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I'm just weirded out that I haven't seen one fucking NGD since I got my guitar.


----------



## WickedSymphony

travis bickle said:


> should be getting tracking info monday!!!! fuck.



Any luck with yours? Mine didn't ship judging by lack of tracking info or contact.


----------



## travis bickle

WickedSymphony said:


> Any luck with yours? Mine didn't ship judging by lack of tracking info or contact.


 
nope. bernie did ask me for my tshirt size and shipping address, but haven't heard back since.


----------



## travis bickle

Received tracking info!!!!!! I wont be able to sleep until she arrives. Haha.


----------



## jbard

I got tracking info today, too. The cases must have come in. Good stuff.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Grats, guys!

Guess I'll chill for a few days and see if I hear anything.


----------



## Red&Die

We need NGD!!!!!! Please post some pics when you guys received the guitar!


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

This just in ......
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=489259861102718


----------



## MetalDaze

Well, I guess it's good to know that endorsees aren't in the front of the line 

Hollowayy, you are not alone!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

finally my Hesperian it's on its way. I hope for the best.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Still waiting for mine to be shipped


----------



## WickedSymphony

MatrixClaw said:


> Still waiting for mine to be shipped



Same here, man.


----------



## mikernaut

glad some people are finally getting their guitars, I'm still in limbo with a few other peeps


----------



## MatrixClaw

Bernie text me this morning and said my guitar will ship tomorrow. Got my fingers crossed!


----------



## SpaceDock

Hmm, wonder will mine will be ready?


----------



## Hollowway

There's a new green splatter Vixen on his FB page, and this sweet axe:







I don't know whose that is, but someone came up with some killer specs!

EDIT: To the owner of that white one:

Enjoy it before you die!! Muahahaha!

-Hollow "Shinigami" way


----------



## MJS

The white one's Keith Merrow's (more pics): https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.273923656042137.44502.241754565925713&type=1

Here's his Facebook post about it: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=489259861102718


----------



## WickedSymphony

Not sure, but looks like the blue one in the background of one of the green vixen pics might be mine. Hope that means it'll be done soon.


----------



## Hollowway

Got an update on my custom. He said he's working on the neck now, and just needs knob placement...


----------



## WillDfx

Hollowway said:


> Got an update on my custom. He said he's working on the neck now, and just needs knob placement...





I never thought I'd live to see the day...


----------



## elq

Hollowway said:


> Got an update on my custom. He said he's working on the neck now, and just needs knob placement...



Congrats! I guess it'll be delivered around late 2013 then?


----------



## kruneh

About time Hollowway, nice to see some progress!
For a second I thought that orange one in the background was mine, but nah, it´s not


----------



## Hollowway

elq said:


> Congrats! I guess it'll be delivered around late 2013 then?



 Don't jinx me, man!


----------



## travis bickle

out for delivery!!!!! expect a NGD post from me soon. beyond stoked.


----------



## Larrikin666

Nice! That finish compliments the figured top really well. Awesome choice.


----------



## Hollowway

Holy crap, here's the status today:






Specs (that aren't obvious)
Maple neck
Mahogany body
oiled back and sides
natural binding
Aftermath bridge and neck
Reverse Jekyll HS
28 frets


----------



## MetalDaze

How come only 8 strings?  Just kidding...

Bernie: Keep it up! Consistency is key and you will earn back all of your fans. Can't wait to see more


----------



## TomAwesome

Damn, son, that looks nice!


----------



## SpaceDock

We need some NGDs from the folks whose guitars got shipped last week!


----------



## Rook

Holloway receives BRJ...

INTERNET CAN'T HANDLE

BEGINNING SELF DESTRUCT SEQUENCE

Seriously I'm scared.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Guitar was supposed to ship yesterday. Still no word on its status


----------



## jbard

I got mine in today.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...black-friday-hesperian-828-a.html#post3167298


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Hope to receive mine this week, stoked!


----------



## travis bickle

just posted a NGD thread. i'll update the post with a proper review this weekend.

lhttp://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/210105-brj-black-friday-hesperian-727-a.html


----------



## Lirtle

Bernie is really crankin' 'em out. Just got this!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Guitar arrived at a friend's house today. All is fine, beside he split-coil switch apparently decided to be a killswitch. I was told there were two t-shirts in it, but there's just one (I won 3rd place in the BRJ contest and I'm still waiting for my t-shirt and strings prize), but no biggie. I just hope the guitar is worth the 2 years of wait when it arrives!

Also, both pickups have both pole rows with screws, so I guess Bernie mounted two Aftermaths instead of Aftermath bridge + Painkiller neck as I requested, but I'm not sure.


----------



## rifftrauma

I too recieved a totally unexpected email today direct from the man himself, very cool indeed, glad hes back in action.


----------



## Khoi

that neck looks ridiculous! and what is that inlay of?

can't wait for my update...


----------



## Larrikin666

rifftrauma said:


> I too recieved a totally unexpected email today direct from the man himself, very cool indeed, glad hes back in action.



Interesting. What made you opt for the 2+4 headstock?


----------



## rifftrauma

Got with Bernie about a year ago, custom inlay is going to be the Eye of Horus. I went with the 2+4 because I felt it kinda matched the Egyptian vibe, reminded me of a bird's beak. It's supposed to be an oil finish, but I saw the Denim blue jean Bernie threw up on his facebook page and I'm thinking of asking him to change it. Love the build so far...


----------



## Larrikin666

rifftrauma said:


> Got with Bernie about a year ago, custom inlay is going to be the Eye of Horus. I went with the 2+4 because I felt it kinda matched the Egyptian vibe, reminded me of a bird's beak. It's supposed to be an oil finish, but I saw the Denim blue jean Bernie threw up on his facebook page and I'm thinking of asking him to change it. Love the build so far...



Haha. Good call with the blue demin. That's what mine is.


----------



## MetalThrasher

WOW! Everyone's guitar is looking awesome! I can't wait to get my Vixen 7!


----------



## Red&Die

rifftrauma said:


> I too recieved a totally unexpected email today direct from the man himself, very cool indeed, glad hes back in action.



This neck is crazy!!!


----------



## Rook

Rifftrauma - did you say you ordered a year ago? Shit! I'm just coming up on my year anniversary in about 6 weeks.

I wasn't expecting to hear anything from Bernie til at least next year... Maybe there's a tiny bit of hope I'll hear before Christmas...

I wonder if he remembered I cancelled one of my slots too, wouldn't mind either way, I spec'd out a crazy 8 string.


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea this was totally unexpected. I shot Bernie and email about a month ago just trying to figure out where I was in the scheme of things. I was interested in ordering a couple of other guitars and didn't want 10K worth of GAS to hit all at once. Yesterday out of the blue I get pics of a guitar I didn't know existed, super stoked though. I shot him an email about the blue denim but he hasn't responded yet so...here's hoping.


----------



## absolutorigin

Glad to see guitars going to be people.


----------



## jbard

I got the specs all worked out for the second slot that I bought off another member. He looks to be back in his groove. I'm going to do trans black over the flame maple and gloss except with a satin neck; also offset block inlays like this:


----------



## toiletstand

very nice!


----------



## Rook

Hmmm maybe I'll try emailing him again then...


----------



## Michael T

^^^ I agree, I'm 2 months away from 2 year wait. I got my last update picture in February & it just needed finish & hardware. Last I heard from Bern was about 3-4 months back with no further reply's to my emails.

oh well, It'll get here when it gets here.


----------



## SpaceDock

I got an update a few weeks ago, unchanged since April. All they need is hardware and setup, he keeps saying two weeks. I am hoping I get the, before the two year mark. If this goes into 2013 I'll be pretty upset.


----------



## Isan

just fyi he told me two more weeks in april... of last year


----------



## MatrixClaw

Just got mine yesterday!

Alls I have to say is, WOW - The neck on this thing is second to none. I've owned some GREAT guitars in the past (Blackmachine B2, BRJ Jekyl 7, Black Droid, high end PRSs/Gibsons, Oni, USA Jackson, etc.), but this thing puts the rest to shame, no joke. The B2 was probably the nicest neck I've touched until now, but I've got to say, last week I was pissed that it's almost been 2 years, and now that I've finally got the guitar in my hands, it was worth every second.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Grats, Matrix! Go make a NGD thread


----------



## Michael T

Yes Matrix !!! Awesome. Now go make a NGD.


----------



## MatrixClaw

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/210365-ngd-nearly-2-years-making.html


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Sweet Matrix! Now go make....aw shit.


----------



## DarkSaga

Yay...got an update and progress pic out of the blue






Hopefully it will look like this soon!


----------



## Larrikin666

That binding really pops. I like it.


----------



## jbard

DarkSaga said:


> Hopefully it will look like this soon!



I own that Jekyll.


----------



## mniel8195

thats evil really dig it


----------



## DarkSaga

Hahahaha...are those Aftermaths in there????

I saw the run Nick (Axe Palace) did and was blown away by the sexyness of the black one that I had to get one too! 

Mine is gonna be identical to yours except having the 3 way up near the lower horn like on the Ernie Ball JP7's!!!!

Thanks for the full shot pic by the way....I have been looking for forever trying to find a good shot of a finished one


----------



## jbard

Yeah, this is from Nick's run. I was the one that snagged it. Those are painkillers, but they may be swapped for ceramic warpigs... we'll see how the 7 I have coming with warpigs sounds.

I can take a couple snaps of any angle, if you want. Just let me know.


----------



## DarkSaga

Yeah man...if you have the time....just snap a couple more pics at any sexy angle you want and post them here or send them to me through a pm! That would be much appreciated and sweeeeeet!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

FWIW I love the Painkillers in my guitar, but the powder coating on the pickups is weak as hell. A lot of material has flaked off, not from aggressive pick action, but so much as even accidentally touching (not banging into) the pickups while adjusting the height on them. It doesn't bother me too much - it's just slightly annoying.


----------



## Phrygian

I haven't heard back from Bernie for 3 months now, even though he promised me an update by the friday that week - all I really wanted to know was an ETA so I could plan my finances. 

So, I'm on the fence about selling this spot and just get rid of it 'cause I can't be bothered anymore with the lack of communication and unkept promises.


----------



## Rook

^Well I emailed him AGAIN last week having not heard from him since about January (emailing him once a month give or take), he got back to me within 2 days. He didn't actually answer me (or really seem to know what was going on) but he responded.

I asked if he could let me know where my guitar stood (or if in fact it even stood at all) and he responded asking who's slot I'd bought  I said I didn't buy a spot I ordered with him a year a go and gave him $1200, I'm now waiting for his response. If he's responding at the rate he did last week, I should hear from him today or tomorrow, we'll see. He is of course 8 hours behind me so I won't know til later today.


----------



## ronjhoser

I had a good visit to Bernie's shop yesterday to settle specs for my BFR build. Quite a hive of activity there. It's a bit chaotic, but they are knocking out some guitars at this point. I'll see what I got for photos when I get home in a few days.

I went from having only ever seen one Diva to seeing about 200 BRJs in various states of completion. Absolutely gorgeous guitars. After my visit, I'm tempted to buy another BFR slot if anyone is tired of hanging on. I am stoked to see how my first one turns out.


----------



## Rook

^Rosewood necked Jekyll 627?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

ronjhoser said:


> I had a good visit to Bernie's shop yesterday to settle specs for my BFR build. Quite a hive of activity there. It's a bit chaotic, but they are knocking out some guitars at this point. I'll see what I got for photos when I get home in a few days.
> 
> I went from having only ever seen one Diva to seeing about 200 BRJs in various states of completion. Absolutely gorgeous guitars. After my visit, I'm tempted to buy another BFR slot if anyone is tired of hanging on. I am stoked to see how my first one turns out.



awesome dude, a few nice pics is what we all wanna see to keep up our moral atm. looking forward to it !


----------



## Phrygian

Aaaaaaand I'm out! as soon as Bernie replies to my e-mail about swapping the spot over to the new owner I'm no longer a part of this waiting game. Good luck to all of you still in it!


----------



## Rook

^ it's precisely those emails that I never got a response from Bernie for.


----------



## Phrygian

^  Yeah I can't say I'm looking forward to how long this is gonna take..


----------



## EOT

Bernie never really got back with me when I asked about selling my slot. So I sold my slot and just sent Bernie the new owners name and contact info and that was that. I could only wait so long.


----------



## Hollowway

Here's some good news (at least for me): Bernie said my custom is shipping today. Woohoo!


----------



## toiletstand

FUCK YEAH


----------



## Phrygian

Congrats Holloway, I'm Happy for you! 



EOT said:


> Bernie never really got back with me when I asked about selling my slot. So I sold my slot and just sent Bernie the new owners name and contact info and that was that. I could only wait so long.



Yeah I did the same, I just sent him the contact info and requested a confirmation on the swap. It'd be Nice to Get a confirmation, but I've done what I can so i'm good.


----------



## jjcor

I guess I joined the waiting game now..... O well, not to worried about it at this time.


----------



## EOT

Phrygian said:


> Yeah I did the same, I just sent him the contact info and requested a confirmation on the swap. It'd be Nice to Get a confirmation, but I've done what I can so i'm good.



I don't think I ever got a confirmation. He did call me thinking I was the new buyer


----------



## Hollowway

So at the risk of sounding like a chump, do we normally get tracking numbers or does it just show up?


----------



## travis bickle

You'll get a tracking number.


----------



## ibanez4lifesz

Hollowway said:


> So at the risk of sounding like a chump, do we normally get tracking numbers or does it just show up?



I was promised a tracking number, but never got one, and it just showed up one day.


----------



## mikernaut

Hollowway said:


> So at the risk of sounding like a chump, do we normally get tracking numbers or does it just show up?



LOL, you should know this answer, for a guy who cant grasp the simple concept of email? yeah it will just arrive when it wants to.


----------



## Hollowway

This is the custom I bought through Nick and The Axe Palace, so I emailed Nick saying that we should square up. I asked him to confirm a couple of specs that I couldn't see in the photo, and then it should be shipped. So stay tuned for a NGD next week (hopefully)!!


EDIT: Neither Nick nor I could remember for sure how much I put down on it. So I went to my CC site online to November of 2009 to look up the payment.  I can't believe it's almost here!


----------



## Rook

I might have a party to celebrate, this is truly a momentous day on SSO.


----------



## Phrygian

It's confirmed, I'm out! I will be following this thread though(no posting  ) and look forward to seeing the different NGD's!


----------



## jjcor

Phrygian said:


> It's confirmed, I'm out! I will be following this thread though(no posting  ) and look forward to seeing the different NGD's!



So I guess Bernie was cool with it?


----------



## Rook

Phrygian said:


> It's confirmed, I'm out! I will be following this thread though(no posting  ) and look forward to seeing the different NGD's!



He e-mail'd you back?

If so, I'm gunna try once again to find out if my spot is open for selling.


----------



## Phrygian

jjcor said:


> So I guess Bernie was cool with it?



Yes he was!



Fun111 said:


> He e-mail'd you back?
> 
> If so, I'm gunna try once again to find out if my spot is open for selling.



yes he did, so try your luck dude! He can't stop you from selling it, and definitely not if you have a buyer for it already like I did.


----------



## Rook

EMail sent! I've tried selling before, I sent an email to Bernie then saying 'I'm seling it, can you confirm the guitar doesn't exist so the buyer can change specs'

Nothing.

He responded to me last week, maybe I'll get lucky again. I could sure use the money right now... Typically I have months and months of trouble free saving, as soon as I spend any of it, shit hits the fan and I need it 

Anyway, here's hopin.

EDIT: thanks for PM's guys but I won't be selling anything until I have an email from Bernie, not after last time...


----------



## MetalThrasher

So Bernie emailed me about three weeks ago saying the guitar was ready to ship and he sent me link to make payment. I paid the guitar in full now and no word from Bernie. I did try emailing him last week and no response. Guess I should try again and see what's up. I'm sure I'm not the only one who this happened to. I really don't care if I get the guitar in a week or a few months, I just want to know where I stand as the build is now completely paid for.


----------



## WickedSymphony

MetalThrasher said:


> So Bernie emailed me about three weeks ago saying the guitar was ready to ship and he sent me link to make payment. I paid the guitar in full now and no word from Bernie. I did try emailing him last week and no response. Guess I should try again and see what's up. I'm sure I'm not the only one who this happened to. I really don't care if I get the guitar in a week or a few months, I just want to know where I stand as the build is now completely paid for.



I'm in the same exact spot you are, except I paid like 3 months ago. I've emailed multiple times and keep hearing that it'll ship on whichever day. I tried emailing again on Friday night to see what's going on because it's been 3 weeks since the last ship date, but I still haven't heard back.

And just like you, it's not that it matters so much when it comes, I'd just like to know when it's actually going to so I'm not sitting here wondering the whole time.


----------



## Rap Hat

Yeah, I'm waiting on it to ship too, it's sorta frustrating. Had Bernie say he was gonna finish/ship it next week (about a month? ago), asked for the final payment (which I paid in December... Lol) and for string gauges and shit. I emailed him with proof of payment and the other info, and haven't heard back since.

I'm a little worried there'll be a headache involving the payment and him not having records, but that's just my paranoia considering how disorganized things have been.

Ugh.


----------



## kruneh

For some strange reason I think I´m perfectly fine with not knowing anything, and at least not having paid in full.
I ended up trying to get contact, got a reply that didn´t say anything about guitars at all.
That´s about it.


----------



## MetalDaze

I've gotta say.... when I do get the email for final payment, I'm going to get him on the phone first.

It's one thing to not hear anything when all you've put down is your deposit. If you are waiting for months after paying in full, that's not right.


----------



## killertone

I am paid in full on two guitars. Have been for 8 months on one and a couple months on the other. 

I did text with him the other day and he said one of my guitars was on his bench. He asked for electronics placement so I texted him a pic for reference.


----------



## Khoi

MetalDaze said:


> I've gotta say.... when I do get the email for final payment, I'm going to get him on the phone first.
> 
> It's one thing to not hear anything when all you've put down is your deposit. If you are waiting for months after paying in full, that's not right.



I paid mine in full in January when he said it was almost done... I haven't heard anything since


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

It's finally here! Hope to post a NGD asap.


----------



## Adrian-XI

It sucks to see all these nightmare stories, and then boom ^


----------



## gplayer51

My guitar looks Just like Francescos.. same color and even fret markers but in 7 string.

Now only if I could get a word on where I stand....


----------



## Hollowway

Just paid the final balance to Nick over at ye olde Axe Palace. He confirmed all the specs with Bernie, just to be sure. I originally wanted a reverse Diva HS, but he did a rev. Jekyll. Which is fine at this point. So hopefully the thing shows up at the end of the week. Theoretically I could just drive down and get the thing, but I'll let UPS do the dirty work.


----------



## SpaceDock

You should drive down and take lots of pics for the rest of us...pretty please?!


----------



## tjrlogan

Ok..feel free to laugh and mock me for this question....

Guitar is still being built. Bernie just emailed and asked for a pic of my "electronics placement". Anyone know what this means? Pickup positions? Tone/volume knobs? Im gonna ask him what it means...but I might get a quicker response from someone here.


----------



## MetalDaze

Unless you have something special going on (like piezo), I'm sure he's must asking where you want the volume knob/pickup selector. 

Some people like them close to the strings and others prefer them down and away. He doesn't drill the holes for those until towards the end of the build. Just find a pic of a guitar that you like the layout of and send it


----------



## tjrlogan

MetalDaze said:


> Unless you have something special going on (like piezo), I'm sure he's must asking where you want the volume knob/pickup selector.
> 
> Some people like them close to the strings and others prefer them down and away. He doesn't drill the holes for those until towards the end of the build. Just find a pic of a guitar that you like the layout of and send it



Thanks!!!


----------



## paddy

Hollowway said:


> Just paid the final balance to Nick over at ye olde Axe Palace. He confirmed all the specs with Bernie, just to be sure. I originally wanted a reverse Diva HS, but he did a rev. Jekyll. Which is fine at this point. So hopefully the thing shows up at the end of the week. Theoretically I could just drive down and get the thing, but I'll let UPS do the dirty work.



If I were you, I would've first asked for a photo (or two) of the finished guitar before parting with the last batch of my money, but, you've done it now so let's keep our fingers crossed.


----------



## WickedSymphony

paddy said:


> If I were you, I would've first asked for a photo (or two) of the finished guitar before parting with the last batch of my money, but, you've done it now so let's keep our fingers crossed.



He got a photo of the finished guitar a few pages back so he should be good, but as someone in that position, that's really good advice to anyone else going forward.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

WickedSymphony said:


> He got a *terribly taken* photo *at an off angle* of the *almost* finished guitar a few pages back so he should be good, but as someone in that position, that's really good advice to anyone else going forward.





Can't wait for the NGD Andy!


----------



## WickedSymphony

^ Well, fuck me for trying to be positive I guess


----------



## MaxOfMetal

WickedSymphony said:


> ^ Well, fuck me for trying to be positive I guess



Take no offense.  

I just hope everyone who gets photos will take a closer look as it's easier to deal with this kind of stuff before it ships, just ask mikernaut.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Take no offense.
> 
> I just hope everyone who gets photos will take a closer look as it's easier to deal with this kind of stuff before it ships, just ask mikernaut.



Yup, I agree. There's a lot of activity going on in that shop, and mine already had to be built 3 times, and then there were a couple of mix ups as to which builds were mine. Ultimately I wanted to make sure everything was cool, so I watched the video he sent me closely, and checked that photo over, and then asked Nick to confirm juuuuust in case. My main concern now is that I like my action low, and I know that Kahlers can get finicky if they're not recessed and the neck is not compensatorily angled back. But, redbeard had the original 828 Jekyll, and he said his played really well, so on that count I'm optimistic. Bottom line, if it plays as well as my 727 Jekyll I'll be a very happy man.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Just heard from Bernie about my Vixen 7! I need a day or two to think about where I should put the volume and pickup selector. Anyone have a pic of a Vixen 7?


----------



## Rook

Bernie's vanished to me again, christ I thought I was getting close to resolving this one way or another...

Genuinely glad you guys are having success with him though, if my guitar arrives this century, I'll be so happy. Not caring if I ever receive it or not though right now


----------



## Hollowway

Bernie just texted me that the Jekyll is shipping today. 

Edit: I've got the tracking number but it's not in the system yet. I'm not sure when to expect it, but hopefully early next week.

Edit 2: Estimated Delivery: September 18! I can't believe it's finally almost here. Now I'm all paranoid that the Kahler will be too high to get me my low action. But I'll try to think positive!


----------



## mikernaut

great news Holloway!, I did get an email myself from Bernie today and all I can say is  ...and If I get hired on to my new job ( under contract ) I will place my order for another BRJ after everything that has gone down.


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> great news Holloway!, I did get an email myself from Bernie today and all I can say is  ...and If I get hired on to my new job ( under contract ) I will place my order for another BRJ after everything that has gone down.



So how many do you have right now? (Including the one he just contacted you about.) 2, yeah? Or is there another one?


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

Still have to post a NGD, will do when I have proper pics and a couple samples, but for now my impressions are overall very positive.


----------



## absolutorigin

I just got off the phone with Bernie to discuss an order. I'm incredibly excited. This will be my first custom, and I will be going into his shop on wednesday to finalize specs and pick out some woods.

We talked a bit about his backlog of guitars. It seems he's in his rhythm again and is working real hard to pump these out for you guys. Of course, the infamous case issue was brought up haha. Hopefully there won't be too many problems, but of course some will be expected. But if he starts ignoring me I will be going down to his shop personally and start kicking doors down haha.


----------



## Hollowway

^ Dude, congratulations! 2015 is going to be an exciting year for you!


----------



## mikernaut

Hollowway said:


> So how many do you have right now? (Including the one he just contacted you about.) 2, yeah? Or is there another one?



I have 2 currently, a Jekyll 6 and 7. He is redoing the 7 with the proper inlays.

I wanna get another 6 for drop tunings when the bank account allows

Also looking forward to Francesco's review. you gonna make a clip by any chance ?


----------



## Hollowway

absolutorigin said:


> I will be going into his shop on wednesday to finalize specs and pick out some woods.



Are you pretty close to him? I'm about 6-7 hours away, so I haven't been in there, but one day I'd love to go in and check it out. I think he's still got a pretty big order backlog. But the squeaky wheel gets the grease, if you drop in there's a good chance he can keep your build moving along at a decent pace.


----------



## Hollowway

I might try to do a clip. I'm notoriously bad about that stuff. But I'll definitely do a full on NGD and review. I've got a Jekyll 7, and it is amazingly good. So I'm expecting that in the new one, but I'm a little worried about the Kahler because if it's too high there's no neck shimming option. I'll have to have it recessed. I'm not expecting it to be a problem, since Bernie had a lot of Kahler experience, but I like low action and my experience has been I have to fuss with all my Kahler guitars. Anyway, fingers crossed.


----------



## absolutorigin

Hollowway said:


> Are you pretty close to him? I'm about 6-7 hours away, so I haven't been in there, but one day I'd love to go in and check it out. I think he's still got a pretty big order backlog. But the squeaky wheel gets the grease, if you drop in there's a good chance he can keep your build moving along at a decent pace.



Given what seems to be his backlog of guitars I'm prepared to wait a while . I'm about 30-40 minutes away, so not bad. He says he just got in some killer wood so I'm curious to check it out. 

I know some custom guitar builders take a while, so I understand that. But I just hope the communication doesn't get too foggy. If he gives me the run-around, I will go down there and start kicking doors down.


----------



## jjcor

I talked to Bernie the other day on the spot I bought from Phrygian and he told me the guitar will be ready in less than 30 days! Here's to hoping!


----------



## Rook

Well I found out today just shy of my one year marker 'work has started on my guitar'. I don't know what that means, but for the first time in 10 months someone in that shop has even acknowledged I have an order with the company.

The guy who contacted me (in response to an email I sent about 8 weeks ago) said he's going to try find out where exactly it is and get pics if possible, but I'm not holding my breath.

Still, it's all progress.


----------



## Hollowway

_Sep 18, 2012 7:20 AM: _ *On FedEx vehicle for delivery*


----------



## MetalDaze

Holy shitballs, you need to give us some sort of update tonight


----------



## Hollowway

Never thought I'd utter the words, but I got it and just posted a NGD thread in the ERG section. I wasn't going to make you guys wait. Nothing cheeses me off more than when people get a guitar, state that they do, and then don't give us the eye candy for days. It shan't be done!


----------



## JPMike

I have 3 BRJs on the making, 2 as he said should be out for final assembly soon....

It's almost a year now of waiting...


----------



## Qweklain

Goddamn, I go from hearing people are finally getting their guitars, things start to seem like they are moving, and then I see Hollowway's 3-year custom with those flaws. I go from getting a minor spark of excitement thinking I may actually see mine sometime this year, to having a boot to the head come flying at me when I read that crap.

I am now very worried how mine is going to end up if I receive the damn thing, especially considering I am having a very custom burst, inlays, and carbon rods done. I just shutter now thinking about the possible horror I may see opening the case, which should not even be a thought crossing my mind with this kind of wait and money being spent...

Hollowway, I feel for you man, as that is just 100% unacceptable on all levels, even if it does play phenomenally.


----------



## Rap Hat

Man, all this is just awful to see. I'm sorry yours had issues, Holloway. I know it's been a massive wait and you've been profoundly patient.

It just seems like Bernie isn't putting his all into these guitars. It would be one thing if he was sending out great guitars with the occasional flaw, but just about every one that's come recently has had flaws. From my perspective it seems like he's overwhelmed and instead of taking a breather and working slowly one at a time he rushes from build to build, trying to pump them out without keeping the QC in check.

I said it before, but he *needs* an assistant to help with the work. Someone to say, "Hey, that guitar you're rushing through has a separated top and crappy side dots." Doing it all himself means if he's tired or stressed he might not notice or register issues before the guitar gets shipped. Then his rep gets slammed even more and the cycle continues anew.

I'm once again worried about my build. I'm almost certain it was from the initial offering (before he opened it up more), and it's been seemingly untouched for about a year. There's nothing fancy about it, no burst, no unique features. Well, there was supposed to be a coil tap and 25 frets but the coil tap was straight up forgotten by him and his payment system seems to have assigned me a completely different 24 fret guitar. Oh, and Aftermaths, but like everyone else he keeps on switching it to Painkillers.
I honestly just want a guitar with no mistakes, but there's no guarantee I'll even get the one that was listed in the spot I bought.


----------



## Red&Die

Anyone has any update from Bernie? I have called him 3 times and left message for asking the progress pics, but haven't hear from him...


----------



## ToupaTroopa

Finally finished with the roller coaster that is BRJ!


----------



## Phrygian

I know I am not really allowed to post anymore, but I just need to say this. 

[rant]
It took Bernie less than 24hrs to get back to the new owner of my spot and give him an ETA (which btw is less than 30 days..), when my only question to him for the last 10 months has been just that, an ETA. don't get me wrong, I'm very happy for the new owner that it looks like it works out, but I probably wouldn't have sold it had B told me the ETA instead of promising me an update within the week, every time. 
[/rant]


----------



## Rook

Bernie emailed me out if the blue yesterday asking about my spot, I replied and asked him a question (does it exist) to which I got no response.

My feelings regarding this guitar are so all over the place. I want it so bad but I just don't want any if the shit with it... Bah. If my biggest worry was a wait time, I'd be fine, but these sketchy NGD's...

That said, it's a solid colour with no 'top' as such, and I don't think I asked for stainless frets or anything remotely complicated, how wrong could it go? Two pickups, a bridge and 6 machine heads screwed to a bit of solid wood....


----------



## paddy

Phrygian said:


> I know I am not really allowed to post anymore, but I just need to say this.
> 
> [rant]
> It took Bernie less than 24hrs to get back to the new owner of my spot and give him an ETA (which btw is less than 30 days..), when my only question to him for the last 10 months has been just that, an ETA. don't get me wrong, I'm very happy for the new owner that it looks like it works out, but I probably wouldn't have sold it had B told me the ETA instead of promising me an update within the week, every time.
> [/rant]




But it doesn't mean if he's said to the new owner of your spot that it'll take 30 days, it will really take 30 days. He's just saying it.


----------



## Phrygian

The time's not really the point though, it's the fact he actually gave him a straight out answer and an ETA which he spent Almost 11 months not getting around to telling me.


----------



## MatrixClaw

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> It's finally here! Hope to post a NGD asap.



Holy hell, this is so epic!


----------



## paddy

Phrygian said:


> The time's not really the point though, it's the fact he actually gave him a straight out answer and an ETA which he spent Almost 11 months not getting around to telling me.



OK the above is YOUR point. And below is MY point (2 points in total)
And my POINT is that the ETA he's giving is a LIE anyways, so, why should it matter what he says? Do you think the fact that Bernie is giving him an ETA will be of any consolation to him. when he sees that the guitar is not going to be ready anywhere near the ETA, he's gonna feel like you, Cheesed off. Isn't it?
You should quite rightly be upset. And the new guy is going to be upset too.
cheers

And let me tell you why suddenly he came out of the blue to give the ETA response to the new guy. It's because he's "the new guy" and this is Bernie way of greeting the new guys (just like he must have greeted you in the beginning). But this is most probably the last he's gonna hear from him for a good while. 
So one can conclude, if you had pretended to be the new guy, you would've received a greeting and an ETA from him and then nothing for a long time. And then AGAIN would've become upset a second time. Hope you understand what I'm trying to say.

Cheers again


----------



## Larrikin666

Paddy, do you have a BFR on order?


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Are you the new guy, paddy?  jesus, beat that dead horse some more. Cheers!


----------



## Hollowway

glassmoon0fo said:


> Are you the new guy, paddy?  jesus, beat that dead horse some more. Cheers!



I read paddy's post with a British accent and it sounded very polite and intelligent to me.  


j/k paddy. I totally understood what you were saying, too, FWIW.


----------



## jjcor

> OK the above is YOUR point. And below is MY point (2 points in total)
> And my POINT is that the ETA he's giving is a LIE anyways, so, why should it matter what he says? Do you think the fact that Bernie is giving him an ETA will be of any consolation to him. when he sees that the guitar is not going to be ready anywhere near the ETA, he's gonna feel like you, Cheesed off. Isn't it?
> You should quite rightly be upset. And the new guy is going to be upset too.
> cheers
> 
> And let me tell you why suddenly he came out of the blue to give the ETA response to the new guy. It's because he's "the new guy" and this is Bernie way of greeting the new guys (just like he must have greeted you in the beginning). But this is most probably the last he's gonna hear from him for a good while.
> So one can conclude, if you had pretended to be the new guy, you would've received a greeting and an ETA from him and then nothing for a long time. And then AGAIN would've become upset a second time. Hope you understand what I'm trying to say.
> 
> Cheers again



Well Im the NEW guy who he responded too and said it would be less than 30 days (which after reading this thread for the past couple of years, I dont think it will be done by then). And honestly its not going to bother me if its NOT done within the 30 days. I really don't care when its done. Its the LEAST of my worries rightnow. And I think Bernie took interest in the fact that Im a machinist and he wanted me to make some parts for him to test out, so maybe thats why he's been in touch with me. Business to business. I understand peoples frustrations here but don't assume that Im getting my hopes up and Im going to be pissed when its not done. JS


----------



## paddy

thanks guys 
All I meant to say was that even if you get an ETA but it never get delivered, what's the point about it? 
What Phyrigian said is valid assuming he got a truthful ETA.
If he got a BS ETA, he would've been upset down the line again.
I hope Phyrigian doesn't take what I said the wrong way.

jjcor, OK so you you know what to expect and you're happy with it. That's fair enough. Just make sure you (ideally) inspect the guitar before the delivery (see Holloways's posts and my first posts about this). The duration of the build is NOT the only thing to worry about I'm afraid.

Larkin666 and glassmoon0fo, 
I don't have any one in order, but I already had one built with less than satisfactory result (same as Holloway's). You can look up my first post and see what I've had to say.

Holloway,
Nice one mate (another british one for you)


----------



## jjcor

Yea I've seen holloways. And believe me I'm going to check the guitar thoroughly that's for sure!


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

MatrixClaw said:


> Holy hell, this is so epic!



This is a similar, but better, shot. Sorry for the delay, I'll post a NGD soon.


----------



## killertone

Just an FYI so you guys know things are happening, I got a progress pic from Bernie yesterday. Hardware is on my guitar. Frets are being dressed now.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Things moving with my build, too. Finally got on the phone with Bernie, guitar should hopefully be on its way soon.


----------



## SnowfaLL

Bernie actually finally emailed me too; after afew months from my last email. Granted, my guitar (from the 2010 BFR) has been put on hold and hasnt even started production, but communication has been hard over the past year due to my joining the military so no internet for 6+ months and him, well you know. I don't blame him though, hes been helpful as hell when he does communicate; but all luthiers seem to slip on that front.

At this point, He said my spot is still there and pricing is the same if I want it.. Now im trying to decide if I want to keep going with it; Financially its not a concern at all anymore, its the issues im hearing about, and the fact I feel pretty satisfied with the guitars I already have on the way. Im not sure.. Hmm. 

What to do..


----------



## Khoi

After waiting almost 2 years for my BRJ, and getting a fully custom guitar ordered and delivered in less than a fraction of the time from another luthier with similar pricing, equal if not superior quality, superior communication, and superior options, I wouldn't do it.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

after owning my BRJ, I'd say do it . You guys already know I'm a supporter, no need to flame me. And hey, if you arent interested, hit me up. I'll gladly drop 1600 for another one of these.


----------



## mikernaut

Is this the correct address? ( sending over some BKP's)
Bernie Rico Jr Guitars Inc
17205 Eucalyptus Street, Hesperia, CA

And his website is unavailable currently


----------



## jjcor

Here's what he sent me about a week ago. Which is pretty much the same as you got there. 

Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars
17205 Eucalyptus B5
Hesperian Ca 92345


----------



## ras1988

Quick bump here. Just wanted to see if anyone has heard anything. Got to talk to Bern about 2 weeks ago and he said wheels were turning. I am kind of coming to the end of the line as far as my patience is concerned, I thought I had hit the Holloway level of acceptance but was sorely mistaken.


----------



## MetalDaze

No recent update for me.


----------



## SpaceDock

Still waiting here as well. I was told two weeks in march.


----------



## Michael T

Zero updates here either. Mine was supposed to be ready by X-mas last year but that didn't follow thru obviously


----------



## mikernaut

My BareKnuckles arrived on Monday according to UPS tracking/delivery confirmation. (signed by "montenegro"?) 

I had emailed Bernie when I shipped them to give him a heads up that they were coming and to politely say that I hope the guitar is good to go shortly since he now has the pups.

and.... no reply so far


----------



## MetalDaze

Well, at least someone is there signing for packages  Better than finding out the place is empty


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Well, fwiw, I've been in constant phone tag with Bernie over the past two weeks after eventual connection via Facebook from Ivo, the dude fielding his emails etc. Bernie emailed me too. I've got a full custom, and still waiting a decent status update. He's had pickups for a year from my BKP order, and verified it all too. He's said he is dedicated to completing these BF sale builds and not letting this backorder happen again, and it's really embarrassed him badly. But he is in the shop daily, even some weekends but to note he has a few hundred orders he's handling right now. This is collective info I've gotten from his shop and Bernie directly.

What I don't know or couldn't pry out is an order list, even priority, and I don't even have pictures for mine. I'm considering, based on progress, changing some options, which might push my build back a bit. As if that matters anymore, because there are some other guitars I'm GASing over badly (Kxf'ingK).

Last contact I had was last Friday. Hope someone gets a NGD up soon!


----------



## JerichoCheng

10 DAYS before Bernie emailed me mine one is ready for final set up,
hope can see some updates soon,
(since full paid in March)


----------



## mikernaut




----------



## Rook

I'm gunna resist paying in full til I've seen the guitar exists and it's going out the door to ship...


----------



## Birdman

Rook said:


> I'm gunna resist paying in full til I've seen the guitar exists and it's going out the door to ship...


----------



## killertone

I contacted Bernie earlier this week to see if he was going to be in the shop on on Thursday the 25th as i was going to be in the area and wanted to stop by. Didn't hear back from him until yesterday which was obviously past Thursday. Said he was in business meetings and not in the whole week so I doubt anything has been done to any guitars. Just thought I would let y'all know.


----------



## SpaceDock

I am really hoping I get mine before the two year mark. I paid for them back in February I think. At this point I really don't know what could be taking so long since they were fretted and had everything but hardware a year ago.


----------



## kruneh

So, did anyone else get a mail from this Chris G. at Rico Jr guitars?


----------



## MetalDaze

kruneh said:


> So, did anyone else get a mail from this Chris G. at Rico Jr guitars?



No, what did he say?


----------



## kruneh

MetalDaze said:


> No, what did he say?



Well, a lot of nice things about BRJ and he promised me a spesific update within 24 hours. If it was ok with me.... 
Well, I told him I was very ok with that.
He answered that he couldn´t find anything, so I had to send him the details from the deposit transaction.
I did.
And here we are, two weeks later.
Nothing.
It rocks man 





But it kinda seems that this Chris guy might be a new guy working for Bernie, and they´re trying to organize something.
But I don´t know.
Mine had colour one year ago, if there´s been any progress since... 
Who knows?
And I mean that literally..


----------



## gplayer51

killertone said:


> I contacted Bernie earlier this week to see if he was going to be in the shop on on Thursday the 25th as i was going to be in the area and wanted to stop by. Didn't hear back from him until yesterday which was obviously past Thursday. Said he was in business meetings and not in the whole week so I doubt anything has been done to any guitars. Just thought I would let y'all know.


 sounds fishy....


----------



## Might-is-Right

killertone said:


> I contacted Bernie earlier this week to see if he was going to be in the shop on on Thursday the 25th as i was going to be in the area and wanted to stop by. Didn't hear back from him until yesterday which was obviously past Thursday. Said he was in business meetings and not in the whole week so I doubt anything has been done to any guitars. Just thought I would let y'all know.



LMAO at "business meetings"


----------



## Khoi

I, along with most of you, am incredibly disappointed that this has almost reached the two year mark. I know we still have a month to go, but let's be honest, I don't see my guitar coming out in the next month if no progress has been made in over a year. Last August (2011), I was told my guitar was almost ready for hardware. I was told in January that it was almost done, and paid the guitar in full. Last I heard about my guitar was June 27, and all I heard was "That guitar will be done".

it sucks seeing all these other great custom shop luthiers pop up, and having your funds tied up for that long and not being able to put your money else where


----------



## ras1988

Would it be possible to consolidate some kind of mass message from all of the customers at this point (thinking some kind of letter with all of us undersigning it)? I mean really this has gotten rather out of hand for the most part.


----------



## MetalDaze

The law varies by state, but in general, you only need around 30 people for a class action lawsuit.

Anyone work for a company that offers legal advice to its employees?


----------



## ras1988

I think an open letter from the community and commonality that makes up his customer base for not only this build run but any build that has been held up recently should be enough to warrant a response of some sort. A class action suit is rather extreme but we can cross that bridge if we ever get to it.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I don't know that it would do much of anything except piss him off. I think our money has been spent and won't be refunded. I really don't think you can force the man to make guitars under the gun at all. The best we can all hope for is to get our guitars from the slow drip that his shop lets out maybe this year, maybe ten. Live and learn I suppose.


----------



## angus

Having been through this experience (and with a total time now of *six* years)- I can say honestly that something like a class-action lawsuit is going to be a waste of time. It will cost a lot of money, and all of you will get a lot of nothing out of it. 

If it were an individual case and the luthier was avoiding you in particular, showed no signs of progress and there was little hope of anything getting done, then it would be prudent to get a lawyer involved to help push things forward. However that doesn't appear to be the case here- he just appears to be slow and problem-prone. That is a different problem entirely.

Speaking about the world of luthiery in general, two years is not an extreme amount of time for a business with a lot of orders. In the bass world, it's a fairly routine estimate for a lot of the big name, boutique builders- my Foderas took about 2.5 years, and this was fast for them at the time. The difference, I suppose, is that most of them say it will take a few years, though even then they are usually late. 

In this case, I don't know if he is really at the volume that would warrant this much delay (other problematic luthiers here in the past were certainly not), but I don't know if legal action is really the right course this far in. It certainly isn't yet, honestly. Too early. 

Banding together and sending a letter to prompt a discussion and make it clear the volume of disappointment is a pertinent thing to do, if at least to try and open up a discussion with how to move forward to hurry up the process. 

For sure it is disappointing to be waiting this long, especially having paid in full as some have, but if the orders are trickling out in some ordered fashion, then there is at least some promise of fulfillment. The timescale is awful, and the rebuilds are a bad sign, so it doesn't speak well to the potential for the future of his business, but it doesn't necessary mean he is functioning *in bad faith or with malicious intention*...just awful business management.

There may come a time when it needs to go to the legal system, but I think it would be ineffective at this point in time. 

I've been through this before if anyone wants to PM me about opinions.


----------



## engage757

ras1988 said:


> Would it be possible to consolidate some kind of mass message from all of the customers at this point (thinking some kind of letter with all of us undersigning it)? I mean really this has gotten rather out of hand for the most part.




To do what? For what intents and purposes? You think Bernie doesn't know how many people are involved in this? A Class action will cost you all lawyer's fees, time and could force something bad to happen to the company (ie bankruptcy) and you may never get anything.


----------



## engage757

angus said:


> Having been through this experience (and with a total time now of *six* years)- I can say honestly that something like a class-action lawsuit is going to be a waste of time. It will cost a lot of money, and all of you will get a lot of nothing out of it.
> 
> If it were an individual case and the luthier was avoiding you in particular, showed no signs of progress and there was little hope of anything getting done, then it would be prudent to get a lawyer involved to help push things forward. However that doesn't appear to be the case here- he just appears to be slow and problem-prone. That is a different problem entirely.
> 
> Speaking about the world of luthiery in general, two years is not an extreme amount of time for a business with a lot of orders. In the bass world, it's a fairly routine estimate for a lot of the big name, boutique builders- my Foderas took about 2.5 years, and this was fast for them at the time. The difference, I suppose, is that most of them say it will take a few years, though even then they are usually late.
> 
> In this case, I don't know if he is really at the volume that would warrant this much delay (other problematic luthiers here in the past were certainly not), but I don't know if legal action is really the right course this far in. It certainly isn't yet, honestly. Too early.
> 
> Banding together and sending a letter to prompt a discussion and make it clear the volume of disappointment is a pertinent thing to do, if at least to try and open up a discussion with how to move forward to hurry up the process.
> 
> For sure it is disappointing to be waiting this long, especially having paid in full as some have, but if the orders are trickling out in some ordered fashion, then there is at least some promise of fulfillment. The timescale is awful, and the rebuilds are a bad sign, so it doesn't speak well to the potential for the future of his business, but it doesn't necessary mean he is functioning *in bad faith or with malicious intention*...just awful business management.
> 
> There may come a time when it needs to go to the legal system, but I think it would be ineffective at this point in time.
> 
> I've been through this before if anyone wants to PM me about opinions.




Agreed. Two years isn't bad in all honesty. This just seems like a luthier who had a lot of problems, business and personal, and was backordered too far to begin with. Over his head now.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

The problem that I see is that there is apparently no order at all by which the guitars come out of his shop. Further, the man has led with some pretty predatory tactics such as:

1. Continuing to give people false wait times of 6 months if they invest in a build with him
2. Giving people false lead times about how far along their product is and then completely, totally, 100% dropping the ball when he fails to meet said deadline.
3. He has, many times, informed people their guitar would be finished, and when the person pays in full, they simply don't hear back from him for perhaps months.
4. On numerous occasions people have received guitars from him that were not to the specifications that they ordered. The only offer is usually a rebuild, which at this point might be long into the future if they are ever completed. Such mistakes have included wrong pickups, paints/finishes, woods, bridge setups, additional bindings - there may be more that I'm missing.
5. He's turned out some real lemons too... ridiculous errors on instruments costing upwards of 3-4 grand that are inexcusable.

I don't think a lawsuit would do anything, as I'm pretty sure the man has used the money that people have invested into his company, and there is no reason to believe that one can squeeze blood out of the turnip.

The only thing that we can really do about this is believe that "truth will out", as they say. When people ask me about my guitar from him, I don't lie. I am fortunate in that it is of pretty excellent build quality, is free from major flaws - it is a guitar which is worth the money I paid for it. I do inform them that the customer service was, for the most part, atrocious, and that due to the way things have gone, I won't be asking him to build me any more instruments - ever.

Most people won't do this, as they are afraid if they piss off Bernie that they'll never see an instrument, but I think the best thing would be to let people know about this thread. Generally if people have questions about BRJ, I just say "Hey, Google his Black Friday deal".

They get the point pretty quickly.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Something has obviously happened between himself and the "ghost builders". I seriously don't believe he makes any of these guitars. He just gets em in raw and adds the finishes and hardware. Even that is to hard of a problem! 

BERNIE ...... SPILL THE FARKIN' BEANS ONCE AND FOR ALL! STOP FARKIN' EVERYONE AROUND! GET ON HERE AND LET EVERYONE KNOW EXACTLY WHAT IS HAPPENING! STOP SENDING OTHERS IN TO BAT AND DO YOUR DIRTY WORK!


----------



## ras1988

engage757 said:


> To do what? For what intents and purposes? You think Bernie doesn't know how many people are involved in this? A Class action will cost you all lawyer's fees, time and could force something bad to happen to the company (ie bankruptcy) and you may never get anything.





engage757 said:


> Agreed. Two years isn't bad in all honesty. This just seems like a luthier who had a lot of problems, business and personal, and was backordered too far to begin with. Over his head now.



Two years, isn't unreasonable for a build but when the quoted time is totally different, all projected completion dates are missed, excuses crop up, rebuild and reworkings occur it does breed a little uneasiness. My two builds were bought as "in-stock" builds in fall '11 and carried a completion rate of 4-6 months tops. I was told in January that completion was 4 weeks out and put in the remaining balance. Ever since then it has been a long string of disappointment. I would just like for him to be totally open to not only his current customer base on a macro level but his future customer base as well. There is a lot of money that handed over contingent on certain parameters and understandings. I don't think anyone deserves to be led about in that manner. Basically what Speculum Speculorum said.


----------



## SpaceDock

Well I sent bernie an email a couple days ago and sent him a text, now I am getting some auto reply sending me back to the [email protected] email address. Also the website is down again? Major déjà vu from a year ago..


----------



## Lirtle

Got the same auto reply.


----------



## Jexey

Has anybody had any correspondance in the last few months? I'm starting to get pissed. He sent me a picture of the guitar, told me it was drying then disappeared for the past three fucking months.


----------



## tjrlogan

Jexey said:


> Has anybody had any correspondance in the last few months? I'm starting to get pissed. He sent me a picture of the guitar, told me it was drying then disappeared for the past three fucking months.



Bernie's been relatively good at contacting me bout my build. I got a message today saying he should send a fedex tracking number shortly. Btw.....i didn't email him first asking for this info.


----------



## jjcor

Yea Bernie just called me about an hour ago to ask what kind of strings I wanted and tuning. And he also text me earlier this week to see if I still wanted the Di Marzio pups in it. He's really good at keeping in contact with me. But I really don't bother him about it to begin with. He mentioned that he wants people to know that he's been working on thier guitars and he has not bailed or anything. And he didn't know the website was down so he's having his guy go in to get it up and running again.


----------



## SpaceDock

jjcor said:


> Yea Bernie just called me about an hour ago to ask what kind of strings I wanted and tuning. And he also text me earlier this week to see if I still wanted the Di Marzio pups in it. He's really good at keeping in contact with me. But I really don't bother him about it to begin with. He mentioned that he wants people to know that he's been working on thier guitars and he has not bailed or anything. And he didn't know the website was down so he's having his guy go in to get it up and running again.


 

I got that call in February,


----------



## mikernaut

my patience and brain hurt.. like this-


----------



## gplayer51

Honestly Angus knows what he's talking about! I read the whole forum about the damn sherman ordeal.. Hes gone around the block a few times haha


----------



## RicoJR Guitars Production

An open letter to all SS.org members

Dear all ss.org members my name is Chris G, and I am the newly appointed production manager at Rico Jr Guitars.
Bernie Rico of rico Jr Guitars wanted me to post this letter to all of you today to give you all an understanding what is happening at Rico guitars.
He wanted me to post this letter exclusively on Sevenstring.org, prior to the press releases coming out this week.
Bernie has expressed to me he believes greatly in this forum and the people and moderators on it.

I am a guitar hobbyist but until recently have just been like a lot of you guys a fan and customer of Rico Jr Guitars.
My background has been in the running of production for a major high end furniture business which sells units throughout the world.
During the course of getting my Rico Jr Guitar built.
I shared my frustrations with the delay on my guitar build with Bernie himself. I shared my experience in production processes with Bernie, processes I have learned throughout my career in running a production environment.
It was after this exchange Bernie and his new business partners offered me the position I now hold, production manager for Rico Jr Guitars.
I am the first to be appointment in a greatly expanding team for 2013 and am ecstatic to be part of his family.

With this I am happy to present the following communications below.
BTW: I will be a regular reader and respondent to any matters regarding Rico Jr Guitars especially orders in production on this forum. 
In the future there will be a Global head of sales operations and a national head of Sales operations sitting under Bernie.
Bernie will be removing himself from any customer facing communications excepting the 12 Limited Exclusive Signature custom builds, you will here about in the upcoming releases for 2013.

As explained in the release below the communication process of dealing with customers on a daily basis was one of the key factors in holding up the delivery of guitars as Bernie needed to be focused on building. Many of you who have been trying to reach Bernie may have not got an answer since we have started migrating systems over the last couple of weeks. For this we apologize and can only state we are quickly becoming a stronger and better organization.

With that being said you are about to see an incredible change in the Rico Jr Guitar company a change that will make these hand built limited number guitars "in my view" become the most sought after guitars in the modern players arsenal.

If you have any enquiries you can contact me here or also contact me at 

[email protected]




For Imminent release week beginning Nov 5th 2012


Bernie Rico Jr. having the bloodline of being a 3rd Generation of master Guitar builder, and the family genetics behind one of the most prolific and iconic guitar brands in history, is now focused on doing what his father Bernie Rico Sr. Founder of "BC Rich Guitars" did, from the 70's to the early nineties in changing the face of the modern electric guitar.
Bernie Rico Jr is refocusing the business with his newly expanding team to have better systems, better customer support, better ranges of instruments and quicker turnaround times.


With the upcoming 2013 range, the knowledge, training, heritage and reputation that Bernie inherited from his father, along with the modern approaches he embodies provides a pathway to help him and the business realize their goals.


Todays guitar player is evolving and pushing boundaries that were never possible before. Traditional styles are fusing with new levels of creativity and guitars are moving from traditional 6 strings to 7, 8 strings and beyond with scales that are extended beyond what was thought possible. 
The marketplace is flooded with guitars that are manufactured with a focus on production numbers, even so called high end guitars are little more that mass
produced guitars with good quality hardware and finishes, but the art of completely hand built guitars, especially ones tailored to suit todays player are all but impossible to find. 

Bernie Rico Jr. is focused on delivering and building the ultimate in custom and hand built guitars.
Guitars specifically built to suit the modern player. Guitars that everyone who touches them believe, will etch themselves into history. 

With quality control managed from the design process to the finished production master by Bernie rico Jr. himself, the new 2013 Rico Jr. guitars are designed to be the ultimate choice for the most demanding and discerning player. Guitars that will surely become the next generation of classic guitars sought after for years to come.

The new 2013 series of Rico Jr. Guitars will include some new up and coming signature guitars. Guitars built around relationships that have been forged with a carefully selected group of players worthy to carry the Rico Jr. Badge.
The new 2013 series guitars will be in limited production numbers adding to their future value and exclusivity.
From 27 -28 Frets, to multiple Scale Lengths, New Body styles, from Finishes and woods that exude the individuality of the instrument and player, and playability and tone that has to be experienced the 2013 series of Rico Jr. Guitars are truly the next generation in the evolution of US hand built guitars custom guitars.


Rico Jr. Guitars previous series of guitars included the vixen, the Jekyll and the hesperian in 6, 7 and 8 strings configurations. 

Not foreseeing the demand in orders, the complication of sourcing the extra specialty woods required to fulfill these orders, the technical ordering challenges of software and systems and the number of staff required to finalise these orders, caused the production line to buckle and bring it, to it's knees.

There were waiting lists for the guitars with people even bartering for a spot to be in line to have a build date finalized. Whilst these problems required action to resolve, it demonstrated the ongoing demand for the product, something that we here at Rico Jr Guitars are unaware of anywhere else in the Marketplace.

Taking onboard the learnings from the previous series of Rico Jr. Guitars, and the consumer demand for the product, Bernie rico Jr. has expanded
his facility with new systems being implemented to make the process more streamlined. A new focus for the 2013 series guitars is to limit the number of guitars available per year over the previous series'. While this will impact on the price of each guitar it will also mean that every guitar is delivered on time and with even more time on each aspect of the build.
This will elevate the quality of each instrument to even higher levels than before, regardless, every Rico Jr. Guitar "in our view" stands head and shoulders above the crowded marketplace of expensive so called custom guitars, guitars who's build is mostly run by machine.

Stay tuned for more information as it comes to hand from Rico Jr Guitars

All existing orders have been entered into the newly formed systems and prices will be honored regardless of material increases.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Drop the marketing bullshit, the reason people are selling spots is because they dont want them anymore, not because of crazy market demand. Why don't you focus on maybe contacting everyone in the run like some of the guys that were told their guitars are ready to go 5 months ago instead of posting this? 

Also does bernie really have his head that far up his ass now? Plans for full blown production already? 

Focus on finishing whats on the table as well as finishing rebuilds. NOBODY is going to be dumb enough to buy another Bernie Rico ever again unless you guys get your act together and compensate everyone that has had to deal with years of bullshit and excuses.

A good start would be to contact ELQ and refund him for the hilariously terrible "instrument" you guys sold him.

Also it takes incredibly big balls to call out other builders when over the last few years BRJ has:

a) Sold subpar instruments;
b) Refused a full cash refund for some of these guitars, despite OBVIOUS flaws;
c) Gone way over quoted times;
d) And best of all, is still quoting people ready to lay down money for new builds when he is nowhere near done with the current backorder.


----------



## TemjinStrife

I hate to say it, but if you want to be the customer-facing guy, you need to have your press releases rigorously checked for correct grammar and punctuation. It colors the perception of the content of the release and the company as a whole when you release something official that is poorly-written and badly punctuated.

Also, the "demand" you see is people just wanting to get what they paid for. The "bartering" is people getting sick of waiting and hoping someone else will buy in.

That said "limited" production numbers in 2013 sounds like a good idea for the sanity of Bernie and everyone else involved. Hopefully this means you'll have the time to finish what's in the pipe to an acceptably high level of quality and have some time to breathe.


----------



## AngstRiddenDreams

Bernie Rico Jr certainly does not stand head and shoulders above the competition. Have you ever heard of Vik, Daemoness, Suhr, hell even Carvin? There is no excuse for all this shit you've been producing.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Also, I'm not trying to a dick, but you are a terrible, terrible marketer and should never try again, give up while you're ahead. You've broken literally every single rule that someone learns in a first year marketing class. Did you bother doing any research at all? You pretty much just told everyone thats been waiting a long time to cool their shit because its not a big deal, when really...they've been out of a nice chunk of cash for a while now with nothing to show for it.


----------



## HarryLikesProg

RicoJR Guitars Production said:


> Not foreseeing the demand in orders, the complication of sourcing the extra specialty woods required to fulfill these orders, the technical ordering challenges of software and systems and the number of staff required to finalise these orders, caused the production line to buckle and bring it, to it's knees.
> 
> There were waiting lists for the guitars with people even bartering for a spot to be in line to have a build date finalized. Whilst these problems required action to resolve, it demonstrated the ongoing demand for the product, something that we here at Rico Jr Guitars are unaware of anywhere else in the Marketplace.
> 
> All existing orders have been entered into the newly formed systems and prices will be honored regardless of material increases.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Also, waiting lists for guitars from small shops exist everywhere. Bernie isn't unique in that regard, I'm sorry to say.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

If bernie really wanted to demonstrate he cares he would come in here personally. It does not take more than 20 minutes to write a nice, thought out and clear explanation and/or update of what is going on. Hell, Vik even emailed me while he was in the hospital awaiting emergency surgery. 

If he can email me like that I'm sure Bernie could post in the Black Friday thread telling people whats going on.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Welp, that backfired.


----------



## Jake

Seems like typical BRJ bullshit to me. That bartering you're talking so highly about was people who are sick of the shit and wanted to get rid of their spots because Bernie is clearly making a living off of fucking people over here. I'd take a dozen brands over BRJ at this point in time due to the terrible track record, the absolutely terrible business aspect of it, and the horror stories I have seen here. Please just stop while you are ahead and don't try to act like BRJ is the greatest thing on the face of the Earth.


----------



## Thrashmanzac

i don't think anyone cares what 2013 holds for brj, unless it involves finishing all current builds that are WAY behind, and compensating customers for fuck-ups. Perhaps look at what the company is doing wrong presently, before you start talking about what will be done right in the future.


----------



## JoeyBTL




----------



## djpharoah

Congrats 

Gotta love the announcement of signature guitars while people who've probably paid for the process and prototyping of those are still left without their guitars almost 2 years later.

Damn - someone should have given the OP the link to the BRJ BFR thread.

Good luck to the OP.


----------



## Vicious7

elq should definitely be helped, as should Holloway, though I know the latter is getting a rebuild, point it is that it shouldn't have happened in the first place.

Get in contact with all the customers, create a queue, refund where necessary, beg and pray we don't send Chuck Norris to you. You guys have a lot of work to do before you regain the trust of some of the members here. I'm actually glad in a sad way I decided not to get a build from you guys...:-\. If you have to question whether or not the instrument will be playable when you get it, IF you get it, then there's no point in dumping hard earned money into the company.


----------



## Teh_Br00ts_Man

Holy shit, this is hilarious!


----------



## Watty

Perhaps the MODS should limit the replies in the thread (again) to those who actually have vested interest (i.e. a spot) in the business model being peddled here. I know it's easy for us to call BS on him, but without having a horse in the proverbial race, you're just needlessly complicating the situation. And, as several have already illustrated, there's no need for that in the slightest...

2 cents.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Anyone think we're getting troll'ed and that this message didn't even come from Bernie?


----------



## xCaptainx

Press release wording aside, this is certainly a step in the right direction. Get Bernie Rico concentrating 100% on builds, let other people concentrate on communication and order management. 

The long overdue update is certainly well appreciated (from a B.C Rich endorsee/fan and a huge Bernie Rico Jr build fan perspective) I'm looking forward to seeing what 2013 holds.


----------



## djpharoah

> Perhaps the MODS should limit the replies in the thread (again) to those who actually have vested interest (i.e. a spot) in the business model being peddled here. I know it's easy for us to call BS on him, but without having a horse in the proverbial race, you're just needlessly complicating the situation. And, as several have already illustrated, there's no need for that in the slightest...



I don't think us mods getting involved in this to prevent people from posting is gonna help nor do we have time to go through the 2k replies in that BFR thread to find out who has a vested interest in this.


----------



## elq




----------



## MythicSquirrel

Oh boy

EDIT: Beat to it....


----------



## jeleopard

The grammar and spelling in that was horrendous.

This can't be real....


----------



## Polythoral

Thread summary:


----------



## Adam Of Angels

My first instinctual response, when I read the user name, was, "this is bogus."


----------



## Onegunsolution

This thread is scary o.o


----------



## Polythoral

Some mod, IP check if he's actually from Hesperia, for the greater good.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Yeah, this looks "real" which is super scary.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Polythoral said:


> Some mod, IP check if he's actually from Hesperia, for the greater good.



The greater good...


----------



## Onegunsolution

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, this looks "real" which is super scary.



 I just did not expect the grill fest on the OP, was a bit in the dark about all this.


----------



## Might-is-Right

Wow, more lies, excuses and bluster from the Rico camp...yet not even from Bernie himself. 

I've owned a Rico and was part of the black friday debacle. I wouldnt take a Rico for free at this point based on principle...


----------



## Might-is-Right

I really feel for those from the black friday sale still holding on to hope. Fingers crossed that everyone eventually gets their guitars. 

I can only wonder though how long it will be before Chris G, the newly appointed Production Manager at Rico Jr Guitars, is relegated to the title of "web guy".


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

I wonder whats worse... 

This, or the guy at DAR Amps posting that "teaser" video and claiming the reason he couldn't work on amps anymore because everyone was criticizing him.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

Ive been dreaming of owning a BRJ for almost a year, even after reading this thread for the past few months..

But honestly this is the last straw.. I have no faith in Bernie anymore, the fact he's planning for 'bigger and better' things while leaving guys in the dark is disgusting..

Theres so many other builders I can dream and drool over while saving my hard earned pennies towards my dream guitar...

Congrads Bernie... Think its safe to say you're fucked..


----------



## JaeSwift

So did Bernie forget to hire a press & communications manager in the re-organization? 
I could help list the things that are wrong with your tactics (and the press release itself) but it would just prove that no one is monitoring this thread for responses. Which by the way, is also on the list of ''what are we not doing right''.


----------



## capoeiraesp

Fuck. Only 27-28 fret guitars now? The boundary really has been pushed to new, unexplored realms. What does this mean for current builds?


----------



## angus

First off, as was mentioned, anyone who is planning on writing press releases needs to be able to write grammatically correct, properly spelled English. I would not take any company seriously who permitted a press release like that.



RicoJR Guitars Production said:


> In the future there will be a Global head of sales operations and a national head of Sales operations sitting under Bernie.



The grandiosity and denial involved in thinking that either of these positions are necessary blows my mind. How about a manager (with experience)?

If anyone needs an idea of how to turn around a business, they need only look at how Jason DeSalvo completely turned around Fodera basses. After ~25+ years of producing amazing instruments with no real management or customer service, they had 4-5 year waits on instruments, orders getting misplaced, dealer issues, etc, but a mindblowing product. Jason swooped in and reorganized and rebuilt the company structure and the wait times have dropped 3-4fold, and there is constant communication. They've made some mistakes (including a major one with me), but they are a great example of how to take a company with fundamental management issues and turn it into a properly functioning business. 

But Fodera don't produce basses that need to be rebuilt really, either.


----------



## jeleopard

angus said:


> First off, as was mentioned, anyone who is planning on writing press releases needs to be able to write grammatically correct, properly spelled English. I would not take any company seriously who permitted a press release like that.
> 
> 
> 
> The grandiosity and denial involved in thinking that either of these positions are necessary blows my mind. How about a manager (with experience)?
> 
> If anyone needs an idea of how to turn around a business, they need only look at how Jason DeSalvo completely turned around Fodera basses. After ~25+ years of producing amazing instruments with no real management or customer service, they had 4-5 year waits on instruments, orders getting misplaced, dealer issues, etc, but a mindblowing product. Jason swooped in and reorganized and rebuilt the company structure and the wait times have dropped 3-4fold, and there is constant communication. They've made some mistakes (including a major one with me), but they are a great example of how to take a company with fundamental management issues and turn it into a properly functioning business.
> 
> But Fodera don't produce basses that need to be rebuilt really, either.




Halo guitars as well are changing things too. They're doing rebuilds even from before the new management change.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

RicoJR Guitars Production said:


> Bernie has expressed to me he believes greatly in this forum and the people and moderators on it.



Oh I'm so tempted to screencap what Bernie emailed me time ago about this. Liar!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Oh I'm so tempted to screencap what Bernie emailed me time ago about this. Liar!



You should see some of the h8 mail I got.


----------



## jeleopard

MaxOfMetal said:


> You should see some of the h8 mail I got.



Hate mail


----------



## MaxOfMetal

jeleopard said:


> Hate mail



Bernie was not a big fan of the mod staff and a good amount of the users here (some of them paying customers), and his sales agent at the time (The old version of Chris G. I guess. ) wasn't afraid to say it.


----------



## MetalDaze

djpharoah said:


> I don't think us mods getting involved in this to prevent people from posting is gonna help nor do we have time to go through the 2k replies in that BFR thread to find out who has a vested interest in this.


 
Max always found the time 

Things are bad enough and when trolls get in here it gets worse. I think the community can do its job of reporting people and we appreciate the ban hammer when appropriate


----------



## MaxOfMetal

MetalDaze said:


> Max always found the time
> 
> Things are bad enough and when trolls get in here it gets worse. I think the community can do its job of reporting people and we appreciate the ban hammer when appropriate



I don't even care anymore, and haven't even been around this thread in awhile (a couple months in fact). No NGDs, no need to assume anything was ever getting better.  

I'm sick and tired of this thread and this entire situation. This thread is nearly two years old. Two years. My niece went from not existing to pretty much walking around being a person. The original thread starter, two sales agents, three "web guys", and even a couple artists aren't even on board anymore, here or in the real world. At nearly 2300 posts, I don't think anything more can really be said. 

Either guitars are going to ship, or they aren't. That just seems to be it. 

I'm tired of the hate mail, of the threats, of the trolls, of the constant wave of folks going from happy and optimistic to pissed and negative. If it wasn't for the fact that this thread is keeping the smallest glimmer of hope alive in a few folks I would have closed it. Stickied it up top so no poor schmuck would fall for a BRJ again, but still. 

Want a few posts deleted, and a troll or two banned? Fine. Don't expect me to strip the negativity from this thread though, as some of the most, and rightfully founded, have come from actual customers. 

Hey, Chris G., you owe it to every person on the BRJ waiting list to read this thread in it's entirety.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

MaxOfMetal said:


> You should see some of the h8 mail I got.



Actually he emailed me that exactly 1 year ago, not that much ago (in Bernie's time frames). 
Plus, now that I re-read it, I don't get how it's possible to commit such huge amount of grammatical horrors in two lines. Oh well, at least the guitars are built correc...oh.


----------



## jeleopard

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Actually he emailed me that exactly 1 year ago, not that much ago (in Bernie's time frames).
> Plus, now that I re-read it, I don't get how it's possible to commit such huge amount of grammatical horrors in two lines. Oh well, at least the guitars are built correc...oh.





Laughed. Hard.


----------



## JaeSwift

MaxOfMetal said:


> I don't even care anymore, and haven't even been around this thread in awhile (a couple months in fact). No NGDs, no need to assume anything was ever getting better.
> 
> I'm sick and tired of this thread and this entire situation. This thread is nearly two years old. Two years. My niece went from not existing to pretty much walking around being a person. The original thread starter, two sales agents, three "web guys", and even a couple artists aren't even on board anymore, here or in the real world. At nearly 2300 posts, I don't think anything more can really be said.
> 
> Either guitars are going to ship, or they aren't. That just seems to be it.
> 
> I'm tired of the hate mail, of the threats, of the trolls, of the constant wave of folks going from happy and optimistic to pissed and negative. If it wasn't for the fact that this thread is keeping the smallest glimmer of hope alive in a few folks I would have closed it. Stickied it up top so no poor schmuck would fall for a BRJ again, but still.
> 
> Want a few posts deleted, and a troll or two banned? Fine. Don't expect me to strip the negativity from this thread though, as some of the most, and rightfully founded, have come from actual customers.
> 
> Hey, Chris G., you owe it to every person on the BRJ waiting list to read this thread in it's entirety.



I feel dirty for ''liking'' your post considering the situation ain't brilliant but I agree with your sentiments 100%


----------



## NemesisTheory

I really had no idea this situation had gotten so bad. I've been close to ordering a Rico several times in the past couple years, but my spidey sense must have warned me. So, I do not have a Rico on order. 

However, some of my buddies and I do have a fairly sordid history with BC Rich and I feel this is definitely connected. This is part of the reason I never ordered a Rico. If you're an older dude like me, you might have some firsthand knowledge of how the BC Rich custom shop was run (into the ground several times). Lost orders, specs completely bastardized, faulty parts, faulty wiring, crappy quality, mismatched woods, the secretiveness, dealers clueless about what was going on, the custom shop unable to tell anyone, well, anything. You thought your guitar was on order for the last year and the dealers (honest ones, mind you) had your cash? Guess what? We lost your order! But wait - 12 months after you said F-you and cancelled your order, a guitar with nearly identical specs to yours shows up at another dealer. Hey, you wanted to wait FIVE years for us to get a standard order built right, didn't ya? On and on. This goes back before Bernie got out of BC Rich, so he was there during those times of utter confusion and irritation. Bad things also happened in the 80's, when Bernie Sr. was running things. 

In all those times, some amazing quality instruments came out. I know. I own a few that I wouldn't part with for anything. I also owned some seriously questionable ones. There were good years, and there were years where I was like wtf is going on? I never questioned the designs, nor usually the craftsmanship or skill of the company - because they were capable of stunning brilliance in those areas. It was the damn management side - the complete lack of knowing how to run an efficient business, how to communicate with customers, how to meet deadlines and not continually break promises, etc. I was hopeful Bernie would turn things around after the BC Rich fiascos. For a while, it seemed he was. Some of the guitars are gorgeous and some people are pretty stoked. I just don't understand what is wrong. Is it a Rico family curse for godsakes? Because the bullshit _still _continues with BC Rich custom shop to this day, even though its owned by other people. Is it just Bernie? Is his mindset just embedded in the way they _used_ to run BC Rich? Anyhoo, wanted to add that in here because I feel its pertinent and maybe some of the younger cats here aren't aware of it. I hope things turn out ok for everyone who has something on order.


----------



## eaeolian

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Actually he emailed me that exactly 1 year ago, not that much ago (in Bernie's time frames).
> Plus, now that I re-read it, I don't get how it's possible to commit such huge amount of grammatical horrors in two lines. Oh well, at least the guitars are built correc...oh.



Man, do not DO that when I am drinking beer!


----------



## SpaceDock

FrancescoFiligoi said:


> Actually he emailed me that exactly 1 year ago, not that much ago (in Bernie's time frames).
> Plus, now that I re-read it, I don't get how it's possible to commit such huge amount of grammatical horrors in two lines. Oh well, at least the guitars are built correc...oh.



Dude, you never posted your NGD or at least I never saw it except the couple pics. I was hoping to see some of the details on this.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

SpaceDock said:


> Dude, you never posted your NGD or at least I never saw it except the couple pics. I was hoping to see some of the details on this.



I haven't posted it yet, been very busy. Lots to talk about, some flaws are almost illegal


----------



## MetalDaze

Speculation time (which is all we can do without real facts).

I don't think him meeting with business partners is a far fetched idea. The guy appears to be in trouble and could probably use a hand getting out of the hole he's in.

I don't think this huge delay has done him any favors. For example, imagine if I promised to sell you a computer with a 500GB hard drive. If I waited 2 years to ship it to you, I would come out ahead because that drive is going to get cheaper over time.

But that doesn't apply to guitars. If he has to do a rebuild, the guy doing the work is probably going to expect more for his hourly wage now then he did 2 years ago. Other material costs for that guitar are also either going to stay the same (pickups) or go up (wood). 

This huge delay means that those guitars cost more now, but he has to honor the 2 year old price.

One way out of this is to convince some guys with money that if they help him with some cash now to cover this backlog, the BRJ name could live on and they would get their money back plus some. It's a far better alternative than closing shop and could get him out of the hole.

I could think of a lot worse things going on behind the scenes than this scenario.


----------



## geofreesun

got an email from bernie today asking about electronics stuff, how i want the mini-switch etc. he replied my email within 1 hour as well. he is working at the moment i guess~


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

so now apparently you can't bend ebony enough to fit across a slant top. Hmm. Well, changing options might ad a little more time until completion... at least I know where things are. 

meanwhile, there's that KxK...


----------



## killertone

I don't give a flying fuck about press releases (even terrible ones like the one posted) all I care about is getting my guitars for which I have paid in full. I have a lot of money tied up in those two guitars. I am sure that goes for every single person in the BFR and for custom orders as well. TAKE CARE OF YOUR BACKLOG FIRST THEN EXPAND.


----------



## elq

He's gotta keep that pyramid growing somehow...


----------



## SpaceDock

killertone said:


> I don't give a flying fuck about press releases (even terrible ones like the one posted) all I care about is getting my guitars for which I have paid in full. I have a lot of money tied up in those two guitars. I am sure that goes for every single person in the BFR and for custom orders as well. TAKE CARE OF YOUR BACKLOG FIRST THEN EXPAND.



THIS x a million!

I am in the exact same boat.


----------



## Compton

Man, this is such a bummer! Sorry to all those of you who paid in full for your guitars. My condolences go to you and your children who did not get their huggies.


----------



## MJS

Has anyone that talks to Bernie confirmed that guy has anything to do with BRJ? It just looks like a troll... new account and only one post that is a horribly written announcement that doesn't sound like anything that would come from any guitar company. It just looks like it was slapped together to stir the shit, which it did. 

Or maybe it's legit and it's just a coincidence that he said he's here to rep BRJ, but just made that one post, then kicked back to watch the reactions without replying to anyone. Yeah, I'm sure Bernie thought, "those BFR guys don't seem pissed off enough... I think I'll send someone over to push their buttons and make things worse for me."


----------



## MetalDaze

MJS said:


> Has anyone that talks to Bernie confirmed that guy has anything to do with BRJ? It just looks like a troll... new account and only one post that is a horribly written announcement that doesn't sound like anything that would come from any guitar company. It just looks like it was slapped together to stir the shit, which it did.
> 
> Or maybe it's legit and it's just a coincidence that he said he's here to rep BRJ, but just made that one post, then kicked back to watch the reactions without replying to anyone. Yeah, I'm sure Bernie thought, "those BFR guys don't seem pissed off enough... I think I'll send someone over to push their buttons and make things worse for me."


 
I emailed him at the account he posted and he emailed me back, so he does seem to be working with Bernie.

We'll see what happens.


----------



## Khoi

MetalDaze said:


> I emailed him at the account he posted and he emailed me back, so he does seem to be working with Bernie.
> 
> We'll see what happens.



I did too, he responded to me saying he added me to his call list and will get back to me within 24 hours.


----------



## MJS

MetalDaze said:


> I emailed him at the account he posted and he emailed me back, so he does seem to be working with Bernie.



Yikes.


----------



## jeleopard

Khoi said:


> I did too, he responded to me saying he added me to his call list and will get back to me within 24 hours.



Hahahahaha.

He'll call you back in 2 years now


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Khoi said:


> I did too, he responded to me saying he added me to his call list and will get back to me within 24 hours.




same with me. pretty curious if it will happen


----------



## ikarus

sent email to production at ricojrguitars...



...failure notice


----------



## HeadBender

ikarus said:


> sent email to production at ricojrguitars...
> 
> 
> 
> ...failure notice



".com" is missing from the end.


----------



## ikarus

HeadBender said:


> ".com" is missing from the end.



oh shit i missed that. 

anyways I also wrote a mail to the usual adress and Chris G. responed within hours, saying my guitar will be shipped next week.


----------



## jjcor

Mine should be finished this week! Too bad once I get it I'm gonna have to sell it.


----------



## HeadBender

ikarus said:


> oh shit i missed that.
> 
> anyways I also wrote a mail to the usual adress and Chris G. responed within hours, saying my guitar will be shipped next week.



Lovely, I had no response at all


----------



## SpaceDock

I sent him an email on Sunday right after he posted, he told me 24-48 hours and still patiently waiting.


----------



## Khoi

jeleopard said:


> Hahahahaha.
> 
> He'll call you back in 2 years now





Pascal-Darrell said:


> same with me. pretty curious if it will happen




yeah, I didn't have high hopes for it, but it was worth a shot.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Although one should tread carefully on any news about BRJ, I think people should at least give this guy a shot before they go straight into assassination mode.

I'm trying to wrap up some business with BRJ regarding my build that was delivered in late June. I had given up hope completely, but decided I'd try and shoot him an email - he has responded, and I'm going to give him a fair chance to fix things. It'd be indecent and inhumane not to give him at least the benefit of an attempt to make some things right. I'm not going to get my hopes up for anything anymore, but at least I will be able to say I gave it a good go.

It's sad, as this whole process has made me wary of investing any money into anything until I have a palpable product available and at my disposal. All I can think about is the turmoil that I went through to get this instrument, and I never want to have that happen again. I don't even know if I'll ever invest money into a custom instrument again because I have some serious post-traumatic-build-disorder going on from it. Yikes.


----------



## Khoi

about 57 hours has elapsed with no response. Looks like promises have already been broken


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well... shit. At least we tried?


----------



## Danukenator

Khoi said:


> about 57 hours has elapsed with no response. Looks like promises have already been broken



To be honest, I'm almost impressed. It's like watching a train derail...that was never on any tracks.


----------



## JaeSwift

Danukenator said:


> To be honest, I'm almost impressed. It's like watching a train derail...that was never on any tracks.



More like a train with an open roof doing a loop-de-loop


----------



## mikernaut

24hr update fail! 

Should I be surprised?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Although one should tread carefully on any news about BRJ, I think people should at least give this guy a shot before they go straight into assassination mode.



I agree. At the very least we can give it a shot and see how things go, but it seems some have already tried and haven't received a response. 

I will say though that I agree with others that the press release Chris G posted wasn't very well written, nor did it truly address the issues we have, and at the end of the day, those of us in the run just want to see our guitars first and foremost.

As for me, I was on the phone with Bernie a month ago and he told me my guitar would ship out the following week (the week starting Oct. 4th), before people started hearing about him being in these business meetings. I haven't heard anything about my build since then, though I haven't tried contacting him since then either. But as you said with giving him a fair shot to fix things, he did mention he plans to make good on all the orders, and he does try to fix the issues people have with their guitars (inb4 elq) , as everyone who has been on the phone with him so far has said before.


----------



## drmosh

RicoJR Guitars Production said:


> All existing orders have been entered into the newly formed systems and prices will be honored regardless of material increases.



Holy shit are you series with that statement? "We're so kind that even due to our immense fuckup we won't be charging you more for the guitar you ordered 2-3 years ago at prices valid then".
that's just fucked up


----------



## ikarus

hey, my guitar is ready to ship. 
I also got some pictures of the finished guitar. 

Bernie told me that he needs to know the "country's insurance value of guitar". Can anyone tell me what this is? (I live in Austria)


----------



## HeadBender

ikarus said:


> hey, my guitar is ready to ship.
> I also got some pictures of the finished guitar.
> 
> Bernie told me that he needs to know the "country's insurance value of guitar". Can anyone tell me what this is? (I live in Austria)



He means the declared value on the package.
You will get charged for Customs and VAT tax based on the value on the package + they can also ask you to verify the declared value by presenting the receipts of your payment.

Calculate with somewhere around ~25-30% on top of the declared value + shipping cost


----------



## ikarus

thanks for the answer, Headbender!

btw here is a picture of the finished guitar:


----------



## gplayer51

ikarus said:


> thanks for the answer, Headbender!
> 
> btw here is a picture of the finished guitar:


 I just got this in a 7 string(check my NGD), This thing kicks ass! When you guys get your Ricos you will be astounded.


----------



## killertone

Has the guy that posted the release contacted anyone yet?


----------



## Red&Die

ikarus said:


> hey, my guitar is ready to ship.
> I also got some pictures of the finished guitar.
> 
> Bernie told me that he needs to know the "country's insurance value of guitar". Can anyone tell me what this is? (I live in Austria)



I saw your guitar when I visited Bernie 2 days ago, he was working on your guitar for the final assembly.


----------



## Adrian-XI

^Hey man, did you snap any pics of the shop? Just curious...


----------



## MetalDaze

killertone said:


> Has the guy that posted the release contacted anyone yet?




I emailed him the day he posted and he got back to me relatively quick and said he would have an update in 24 hours. 

That didn't happen, but he did email again yesterday (without me bugging him) saying that he should have some news on Monday.


----------



## Adrian-XI

Wow, some sweet looking guitars in those shots. Thanks for that!


----------



## HeadBender

killertone said:


> Has the guy that posted the release contacted anyone yet?



It took him a couple of days to get back to me, but he did answer to my mail and since then the communication is ongoing.

I also think that we should give the guy a break, I guess he has shitload of stuff to follow up, but at least he is doing his thing. (For me he replied on Sunday even). 

Let's face it: this is waaay better then the past comm. channel.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yup. I got an email saying he was meeting with Bernie on Monday to discuss the big list of issues and that I'd hear back afterward. I remain hopeful that he will be able to take care of business. And as I said before, we might as well give him a shot. It's not like we've got anything to lose by allowing him the opportunity.


----------



## MetalDaze

I've got my fingers crossed. We've all been saying that Bernie needs someone to manage the customer side so he can stay focused on the guitars. Hopefully, this is what is happening.

I know there have been the "web guys" in the past, but I never saw them add any value. At least Chris G is talking about a more structured order and producton process. Heck, I'm a glass is half full guy


----------



## killertone

I just want my guitars. That's all. It will be 2 years next week.


----------



## SpaceDock

I am trying to be optimistic, but a week and a half now with no reply from Chris. I fear there is something in the water down in Hesperia. 

Did anyone get any good news on these yet?


----------



## HRC51

Sorry everyone, but who's the new contact for Bernie? I tried Mr. Rico's phone, and the mailbox was full. I have not had an update in a long time.

Thanks


----------



## WickedSymphony

So, just so I'm certain... the e-mail is [email protected] right? E-mailed on Sunday and haven't gotten any reply yet.


----------



## mikernaut

Yup , that email is correct. I sent a follow up email yesterday but no response yet.


----------



## MetalDaze

I shouldn't have told you guys I got an answer back....now you are slowing down the process


----------



## WickedSymphony

Just got a response this morning. I wonder how many people are e-mailing 

Hopefully this gets things moving!


----------



## mikernaut

Yup, Chris emailed me this morning too.

Apparently there has been issues with the paint bleeding into the binding and its been repainted 7 times. 

Also some pics 

*mod edit: posting shop pics of bunches of guitars not related to the run will get you banned*


----------



## jjcor

Hey there's my lefty in the 4th pic!


----------



## Khoi

mikernaut said:


> Yup, Chris emailed me this morning too.
> 
> Apparently there has been issues with the paint bleeding into the binding and its been repainted 7 times.
> 
> Also some pics




I just want to know how the hell it takes 7 times to get the paint done right 

you'd think they would have the process down to a science already... that kind of scares me


----------



## geofreesun

i think i see mine! block side-dot inlays!


----------



## WickedSymphony

Khoi said:


> I just want to know how the hell it takes 7 times to get the paint done right
> 
> you'd think they would have the process down to a science already... that kind of scares me



Truth be told about my build, I asked for the top painted and back and sides natural, but they painted the whole thing. Bernie contacted me about that and I had them fix it. Then last I heard they left the barrel jack painted while the rest of the sides and back are natural. Although it could've been miscommunication and the electronics cavity is still painted and not the part visible on the outside, which is what I'm contacting Chris about.


----------



## gplayer51

I see mine too! theres hope


----------



## JP Universe

And so the drama continues 

Hope, dissapoint, hope, dissapoint....


----------



## Rap Hat

Man, I hope I can get an update about things. I really shouldn't have paid in full last December, but it was a super-simple build and I had some communication saying it would probably be done around the new year.

At this point I've resigned to not expecting it to ever be finished, and it's left a sour taste in my mouth. I could've used the guitar a while back, but now I don't even have the drive to play. It'd be better to just hear Bernie left the country, at least it'd be a damn resolution.

I swear I'm not usually this bitter, at least now I know how the Roter buyers felt!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I halfway know how you feel dude. I paid the man last October because I was told I'd get the guitar at the end of the month, and I didn't receive it until the last week of June - partly because I got lucky. The eventual sacrifice was just accepting that the finish was not to build specifications - instead of an oiled neck and a stained black back and sides, I got a black painted neck and body. I was then told that the neck would be satin-finished, and it showed up glossed. I was supposed to receive some money back (partly) as a result of it, but it never came either, and I've no reason to believe it ever will. 

He offered a rebuild if I was unhappy, but I just wanted to be done with the whole fiasco. The guitar plays well after my local tech set it up (it was so atrociously set up when I received it that it wouldn't even tune - I thought I'd have to send it back), and I'm just glad I don't have to deal with Bernie and his company any more. Aside from the times that things were going the way he wanted them to, his attitude toward customers was mostly poor, and the communication barriers/broken promises were even worse.

It's utterly sad that paying customers should simply "hope" to get in touch with the man they've given large sums of money to, and also just pray to God that their investment pays off with receiving a functional instrument made to the specifications that they ordered, in even close to the foreseeable future.


----------



## paddy

I reckon chris is bernie's new name


----------



## Red&Die

paddy said:


> I reckon chris is bernie's new name



No!


----------



## BaconRays

I sent Bernie a withdrawal email. Stating that i will no longer be able to finish this transaction. I was quoted a 6 to 9 month time frame and it is coming up on the 1 year mark. The last two times he has called me was at like 7:30am and when i listened to his voicemail telling me to call him back. He didnt answer. And of course i got an email from the Chris G guy saying on blah blah, were working on getting the backlog of guitars out, we've put out more guitars in the last 3 weeks than we have in the last 3 months. Your guitar is expected to be shipped out January 21st -_- .. "I apologize for the delay but i promise you once you get your guitar the wait will be worth it." "He's expressed to me to tell you he is not avoiding you but working towards getting everything cleared." ... 

Sound familiar to anyone? There's a promise in there, AND an ETA .. What are the odds both are bullshit attempts to try to keep me from withdrawing? 

To be honest, it seems like a "No pwease don't weave" kinda thing


----------



## MetalDaze

What do you mean by withdrawing? Giving up and forfeiting your deposit?


----------



## kruneh

BaconRays said:


> Your guitar is expected to be shipped out January 21st -_- ..




To give you a specific date like that two months ahead seems unrealistic to me.
And I´m not talking about he missing with a year or two before... but seriously, why should it be shipped out January 21st? What about the end of January?
This is why they need to get someone involved who understands communication.


----------



## killertone

BaconRays said:


> I sent Bernie a withdrawal email. Stating that i will no longer be able to finish this transaction. I was quoted a 6 to 9 month time frame and it is coming up on the 1 year mark. The last two times he has called me was at like 7:30am and when i listened to his voicemail telling me to call him back. He didnt answer. And of course i got an email from the Chris G guy saying on blah blah, were working on getting the backlog of guitars out, we've put out more guitars in the last 3 weeks than we have in the last 3 months. Your guitar is expected to be shipped out January 21st -_- .. "I apologize for the delay but i promise you once you get your guitar the wait will be worth it." "He's expressed to me to tell you he is not avoiding you but working towards getting everything cleared." ...
> 
> Sound familiar to anyone? There's a promise in there, AND an ETA .. What are the odds both are bullshit attempts to try to keep me from withdrawing?
> 
> To be honest, it seems like a "No pwease don't weave" kinda thing



Dude, people have been waiting much longer than that...I was told my build would be 3 months (it has been 2 years) and have all the emails to back it up. Every delivery date has been blown and still no guitars even though they are paid in full. Even f you get your guitar in January you would still be beating the wait time that the majority of people have had. Kinda not sure what you are complaining about compared to most of us.


----------



## BaconRays

I'm hardly complaining dude. I have nothing to do with others peoples guitars taking 2 years. I even stated in my email that best case scenario he'll have more time to work on YOUR guitar. People who have been waiting way longer than me. The fact is my funds aren't quite there anymore. And my point is, i'm probably NOT going to get it in January. I assume it's just an attempt to keep me from not paying for the guitar when and IF it's ever even finished


----------



## BaconRays

MetalDaze said:


> What do you mean by withdrawing? Giving up and forfeiting your deposit?


 
Pretty much, yes.


----------



## MetalDaze

BaconRays said:


> Pretty much, yes.


 
Your other option is to sell your build spot. You are too new to use the classifieds here, but it's a way for you to recover your deposit and whoever you sell it to is on the hook for the balance of the payment when its due.

It's been done many times and Bernie has been ok with it.


----------



## rifftrauma

So if were all assuming the January 21st date is bullshit why not just wait, doesn't seem like it would hurt? Who knows it could get finished 8 or 9 years down the road when funds aren't so tight...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I wouldn't blame you for withdrawing from the build, but I would bet shortly after you did there'd be a brand spanking new BRJ for sale at a premium price.

If you are sick of waiting, you are sick of waiting. I don't really understand when people say "Hey, there are people worse off than you in this situation" or the such. I marginally get it, but it's not like it's some testament to the patience of an oyster to get repeatedly jerked around by a dude again and again. 

I have a drummer friend who has had several kits custom made for him. He about freaked when I told him I had been waiting 11 months (guitar didn't arrive until month 17). He said if anybody who quoted him 4 months didn't deliver in 6, he'd basically tell them to fornicate themselves with an iron stick, demand his money back, and make their business-life hell if they didn't give him back even his deposit. So, horses for courses.

I love the guitar that was built me, but had I not gone through BRJ I would have been finished with album recording about the time he actually delivered my guitar to me. The lesson I learned was invaluable, but as I said earlier - I will never give this man another dollar. Ever.


----------



## Rook

I'm in the same position as the guy who's talking about withdrawal ie same wait time (mines a little longer I think) and I paid a bigger deposit. The view I take is if it comes up and I can't really afford it, I'll borrow the money and take it anyway and sell it on probably. Or take it and sell something I have if its good. I played a BRJ Jekyll 6 yesterday and it was really frickin good. If mine's as good as that I'd be so happy.

I'm assuming I'm not gunna see it til mid next year though.

Point is, either way, just leaving him your deposit seems a little pointless. 1 year would be considered crazy quick to receive a full custom. If I get mine within 2-2.5 years ill be happy.

As long as it isn't shit.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

The point isn't whether or not he gets his custom within a year, which we all know is freaky fast from the BRJ camp. The point is that even into recent past, Bernie has been telling people that he will get them a guitar in as short a period as 4 months, when he *HAS TO KNOW* it is ridiculous to give such quotes. There's no way that a year ago Bernie didn't know he was already completely buried in work. It was irresponsible, nay, straight deceptive, to tell him he'd get a guitar in 6 months. Did he think Thor was going to shoot lightning bolt guitars out of his ass into customer's hands?

_*If*_ the guitar _*is*_ finished by the time he says it is, I'm sure you can borrow the small amount of funds necessary to get the guitar, lest you kick yourself for being out your deposit, which it sounds like you probably need at this point. You'd be better off selling your spot, if you can find anyone to buy it at this time. Weirdly, even though there is plenty of information about how bad business has been with him, there are those who still want to invest money into his business - even when rather seriously flawed guitars have been coming out after people paid quite a bit of money for them, or when there have been numerous accounts of just blatantly missing or changing build specifications, offering rebuilds to people who've been waiting years for an axe. It's actually quite mind-boggling.

You're probably right though. You likely won't see your guitar in January, February, etc. Bernie and John (when he worked for BRJ) began telling me in August of 2011 that my guitar was going to ship in 3 weeks. I was told at least 10 times that my guitar was ready to go until it actually shipped in late June of 2012. Every time before then when my guitar was ready to ship, there was some reason as to why - twisted neck, bad fretboard, body had to be rebuilt. Then he got sick and everything went to shit. The story is shared by many people, so tread with caution. Your hope might end up costing you multiple years waiting for your guitar. Good luck with your decision.


----------



## Danukenator

What what does it accomplish? Bernie is clearly aware, regardless of his output that he is way behind.

You're just giving him the deposit. And walking off? Why not wait it out and check in ever three months or so.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

I second everyone else. Don't give up your deposit. Either sell it or wait and figure the funds later. Shit, I'm sure you can tell Bernie to sit on the instrument, either delay completion or hold it for you. I don't think he would mind putting a guitar aside, filling other back orders, and getting back to yours at a later date. Whatever the case, don't toss your money.


----------



## mongey

I;m not a custoemr and know the thread isnt for me but I gotta say you guys are like zen masters or something. I just got a custom made and had to wait just over 3 months and it killed me. 3 years. damn . I'd explode


----------



## Danukenator

mongey said:


> I;m not a custoemr and know the thread isnt for me but I gotta say you guys are like zen masters or something. I just got a custom made and had to wait just over 3 months and it killed me. 3 years. damn . I'd explode



Under three months? Was it a Roter or a Devries?


----------



## kmanick

I'm amazed anyone is still giving this guy their money.
I absolutely love my BRJ7 but really 2 years?.
People see this and still send him their money.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

kmanick said:


> I'm amazed anyone is still giving this guy their money.
> I absolutely love my BRJ7 but really 2 years?.
> People see this and still send him their money.



Well, I wasn't a member of this forum (unbelievable, I know), and was suckered into the 4-6 month wait. If Only I had gone with Mayones, I'd have it in 4 months or so. Or saved my coin for a KxK. Well, I want what I ordered very badly but I agree there is little to no chance of me ordering something else in the future. 

Anyone else have updates, progress pics, anything?


----------



## Rook

kmanick said:


> I'm amazed anyone is still giving this guy their money.
> I absolutely love my BRJ7 but really 2 years?.
> People see this and still send him their money.



I wouldn't if I were making the decision now, but since I already have...

Like I say time and time again, if I get a guitar out of this and its good, I don't care. If it's shit my brain will explode and possibly Bernie will hear from me lightning quick. Even if I have to show up on his damn doorstep.


----------



## SpaceDock

When I got into this two years ago, Bernie was shipping tons of guitars, just got featured in Guitar World, had the Bulb and Merrow endorsements, and was still working with dealers. 

It seems like everything fell apart a few months after the BF sale when the first mass email went out telling everyone the run wasn't limited to 45 guitars, it was 200+. 

I am hoping he can get over the clog and Chris G can help the Rico crew get organized again. IMO they bit off far more than they could chew. I don't think Bernie had malicious intent or is a scammer, but just got carried away trying to do so many full customs with too of a wide spectrum of options. 

I am eagerly awaiting some good news and can't do anything but wait. I don't believe any full custom or contracted work is ever 100% safe.


----------



## kmanick

I don't think he's a scammer either, when I dealt with Bernie he was really cool, and my Hesperian is just a flat out amazing guitar, ....but it would seem his business model has really gone to hell. In any other line of busines he'd be facing multiple lawsuits at this point.
I hope you guys do all get your guitars sooner than later and they are without "issues".


----------



## WickedSymphony

@SpaceDock I don't think he's exactly being malicious, but you can't continue to quote obviously false build times, ship dates, contact dates, etc. when you know they can't be met. They just set up disappointment for current customers and bring more new people into the shit when that's not what needs to happen right now at all.



kmanick said:


> I'm amazed anyone is still giving this guy their money.
> I absolutely love my BRJ7 but really 2 years?.
> People see this and still send him their money.



I remember we were talking when I first got my spot about a year and a half ago and it was very positive, guess that changed 

But if I were making the decision now I wouldn't have bit either.


----------



## WickedSymphony

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> Anyone else have updates, progress pics, anything?



I'm curious about this as well. I e-mailed Chris about 10 days ago, got a reply last Wednesday, was told it might take a day to get an update on what I asked, but still haven't actually gotten an update. Anyone else actually hear anything?


----------



## toiletstand

they probably took the rest of the week off for the thanksgiving holiday


----------



## BaconRays

Chris told me they will be working through the holidays. 

NAMM is coming up. Someone should ask Bernie wtf is going on. If he's there


----------



## Emperoff

Yeah. Sell your deposits if you're tired of waiting as I did. I'm OK with waiting, but I'm not OK with not knowing what the hell is going on with my guitar for months and then getting informed that was being rebuilt (or something like that).

Amazon is selling JP7s for 1300$. Go invest your money there and thank me up later!


----------



## Hollowway

Hey fellas, I emailed Bernie and just got an update picture. It's my BFR guitar. I'm going to see if he can put the Aftermath's in this one (that were originally for the custom than ended up with the PKs).


----------



## Lirtle

That's a gorgeous top. Hopefully this build will turn out a little better than your last. 

Did you contact Bernie direct or through this chris fellow?


----------



## Hollowway

Lirtle said:


> That's a gorgeous top. Hopefully this build will turn out a little better than your last.
> 
> Did you contact Bernie direct or through this chris fellow?



Direct. We've been going back and forth on email for a few years, so at this point I'm just going to keep doing that. We're supposed to talk this weekend sometime, too, about the custom rebuild.


----------



## Khoi

WickedSymphony said:


> I'm curious about this as well. I e-mailed Chris about 10 days ago, got a reply last Wednesday, was told it might take a day to get an update on what I asked, but still haven't actually gotten an update. Anyone else actually hear anything?



E-mailed him a week after he said he'd get a response to me in 24 hrs... still haven't heard back, and that was a week ago.


----------



## rifftrauma

Hollowway said:


> Direct. We've been going back and forth on email for a few years, so at this point I'm just going to keep doing that. We're supposed to talk this weekend sometime, too, about the custom rebuild.




Seriously Hollowway if your freaking guitar isn't Bernie's #1 priority...what is this round 3 now? Think the guy would be sending your updates daily with the shit he's put you through...


----------



## rifftrauma

Got an email from Chris G. this morning ironically. I'm guessing he's Bernie's new PR guy (don't have the heart to read through the thread to find out after hollowway's story). He sent me a rather unitelligible email, "At this time we need a photo for of your electronics placement."  No idea....glad I heard something though. Hopefully more pic's soon...but probably not.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

If there's a certain knob configuration you're looking for, send him a pic or description and he'll make it so. I sent him a picture of an EBMM Petrucci and he did it like that, hope it helps. And cheer up dude!


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea guy got back to me right away, was not a problem.


----------



## mikernaut

rifftrauma said:


> He sent me a rather unitelligible email



lol this all the way!. I really want to lay into this more being as ... this person is the "newly" appointed PR manager and trying to help out, but ...grammar is sooo bad....  ( aka almost pours more gas on the fire under the circumstances)

really trying to be polite after Turkey day beverages.


----------



## rifftrauma

un·in·tel·li·gi·ble


----------



## msalazar

got the same grammatically sound email yesterday too


----------



## SpaceDock

Two years boys.


----------



## Khoi




----------



## MetalDaze




----------



## ikarus

to lift your spirits a little bit: My guitar has been shipped today! I was in contact with Chris G. the whole week and he was really nice and helpfull. 

I got 10 (!) mails within 3 hours from Bernie today asking about details. Then he sent me the tracking number. 

I don't even dare to say when I bought the spot (I also changed all specs, kind of a rebuild) 

I hope your guitars will be on the way soon too.


----------



## MetalDaze

ikarus said:


> to lift your spirits a little bit: My guitar has been shipped today! I was in contact with Chris G. the whole week and he was really nice and helpfull.
> 
> I got 10 (!) mails within 3 hours from Bernie today asking about details. Then he sent me the tracking number.
> 
> I don't even dare to say when I bought the spot (I also changed all specs, kind of a rebuild)
> 
> I hope your guitars will be on the way soon too.


 
Good for you!

Chris G: write me back, dude! after a few initial emails, you've gone dark on me for over a week!


----------



## Adrian-XI

Hmm, could that mean if you contact them asking about your spot, they will prioritise it (to a certain extent)? Serious question...


----------



## rifftrauma

ikarus said:


> to lift your spirits a little bit: My guitar has been shipped today! I was in contact with Chris G. the whole week and he was really nice and helpfull.
> 
> I got 10 (!) mails within 3 hours from Bernie today asking about details. Then he sent me the tracking number.
> 
> I don't even dare to say when I bought the spot (I also changed all specs, kind of a rebuild)
> 
> I hope your guitars will be on the way soon too.




Excellent news good sir, glad to hear it! We'll be looking forward to your NGD very soon.


----------



## tjrlogan

Whoohooo...I got a tracking number today as well. It's beginning to look a lot like Christmas.....


----------



## MetalDaze

tjrlogan said:


> Whoohooo...I got a tracking number today as well. It's beginning to look a lot like Christmas.....


 
Good for you, man. I hope its everything you've been waiting for.


----------



## tjrlogan

MetalDaze said:


> Good for you, man. I hope its everything you've been waiting for.



Thanks bro. I hope you hear soon about your build. Communications have been pretty good lately so there is hope!


----------



## kmanick

ikarus said:


> to lift your spirits a little bit: My guitar has been shipped today! I was in contact with Chris G. the whole week and he was really nice and helpfull.
> 
> I got 10 (!) mails within 3 hours from Bernie today asking about details. Then he sent me the tracking number.
> 
> I don't even dare to say when I bought the spot (I also changed all specs, kind of a rebuild)
> 
> I hope your guitars will be on the way soon too.


 
Well that's good to hear.
I certainly hope Bernie can turn this around, I was playing my Hesperian all weekend and damn, it is an amazing guitar.


----------



## Red&Die

I got the tracking number from Bernie of my custom 724 Jekyll pearl white with abalone inlays, I asked Bernie to do the fastest shipping option that I wish I can receive it before my live show on this Sunday.


----------



## Rook

Can't wait to see that^


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

^ Ditto. 

Waiting on an update but as far as the exchanges have gone I am looking at a rebuild. Which is fine considering we nailed the specs down, color by picture, neck radius and other proper things. I guess that's better than getting it made wrong! And I can't really bitch being _only _14 months waiting. Hopefully it'll get to me before the two year mark, and the rest of you guys prior yet. 



kmanick said:


> Well that's good to hear.
> I certainly hope Bernie can turn this around, I was playing my Hesperian all weekend and damn, it is an amazing guitar.



That's the kind of stuff that keeps me anticipating.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Can someone please pm me Chris's email address? I just want to see how my guitar is coming along.


----------



## jjcor

So I got a text from Bernie today and.



[/IMG]

Ships Tomorrow!!!!

Too bad it will hit the for sale thread as soon as I get it


----------



## MetalDaze

Tasty!

My lefty 7 has to be in that shop somewhere


----------



## thepylestory

That looks great!!


----------



## rifftrauma

Dude looks sick!!!!!!! MOAR PICS!!!!!!!


----------



## Birdman

jjcor said:


> So I got a text from Bernie today and.
> 
> 
> 
> [/IMG]
> 
> Ships Tomorrow!!!!
> 
> Too bad it will hit the for sale thread as soon as I get it



it looks fantastic


----------



## killertone

A text came way early this morning...


----------



## Larrikin666

killertone said:


> A text came way early this morning...




I call "Pre-dibs" on both of those if you don't like them. LOL


----------



## MetalDaze

Holy fuck. That first one is on fire!


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Feckin hell, these look unbelievable. And pre-dibs is for pansies, I say we fight to the death with spears and broken beer bottles.


----------



## JP Universe

Seems like things are moving along now in the BRJ camp? 

If someone could PM me Chris address that would be swell


----------



## MJS

killertone said:


> A text came way early this morning...



Whoa. 

Congrats... I can't imagine getting that and not thinking it was worth the wait.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

glassmoon0fo said:


> Feckin hell, these look unbelievable. And pre-dibs is for pansies, I say we fight to the death with spears and broken beer bottles.



In college we would dual with half full trash bags loaded with only beer bottles. This never happened sober, or ended well. 

Damnit those tops look unreal! Awesome to the max! Can't wait to get an update photo


----------



## mikernaut

[email protected] is supposedly the new email after like 5 zillion others


----------



## glassmoon0fo

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> In college we would dual with half full trash bags loaded with only beer bottles. This never happened sober, or ended well.
> 
> Damnit those tops look unreal! Awesome to the max! Can't wait to get an update photo


 
I don't expect to end it well, I expect it to end VICTORIOUS. 

 seriously, those tops are god tier.


----------



## Michael T

Got a phone call from Bern early this morning. Great to know he's in the shop early on a Saturday working on our guitars. Verified some details on My Jekyll Slant 7, Got the order placed for the BKPs and looks like she will be here sometime in January. 

Things seem to be getting back on track @ the Rico camp.


Ahhh, nice gloss finish with natural maple 





Sexy ass Headstock


----------



## MetalDaze

I like the Diva headstock on that body.


----------



## tjrlogan

Just picked this up from Fedex....my hands smell like the curry buffet I had for lunch so I'm
afraid to touch it....


----------



## mikernaut

Wash your hands and Play that thing! Then post up a NGD thread with a review please.


----------



## tjrlogan

I'll try to get a NGD up ASAP. Just my initial thoughts after scrubbing my hands for an hour and finally taking it out of the box...

Looks flawless so far. No shims or gaps that I can see. Routing looks good and construction is very solid. I'll wait until the honeymoon period is over before I add anything else. 

I haven't plugged it in yet, but acoustically it sounds bright and clear. The playability is great with low action and was in tune (dropped A) out of the box. I don't think it needs a setup (unlike a JP7 that I recently bought from Amazon).


----------



## rifftrauma

Can't wait for this NGD, hope it came out perfect!


----------



## tjrlogan

rifftrauma said:


> Can't wait for this NGD, hope it came out perfect!



Here's some more pron...


----------



## tjrlogan

Also, that maple cap is pretty darn thick!


----------



## Rook

More and more win in this thread


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Lets not get ahead of ourselves. Someone will light the torches again soon enough


----------



## SpaceDock

These pics give me hope that I'll get mine soon. Need more happy Rico NGDs.


----------



## msalazar

Where's mine damnit. I'm Jealous JJ, I've been waitin over two years.


----------



## xCaptainx

killertone said:


>









That finish!


----------



## jjcor

msalazar said:


> Where's mine damnit. I'm Jealous JJ, I've been waitin over two years.



Yea I know man. I was jealous cause you were having one built so I snagged up that spot 4 months ago. Thought it was gonna be another year before I seem it. Guess not


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Yeah, I actually sold my original spot, got sad, and bought another. It was the first one shipped


----------



## kmanick

WOW! these are looking good. I'm happy for you guys finally geting some deliveries.
Is anyone getting a hesperian or jekyll 7 with a maple fret board on it?
I'd love to get a carbon copy of what I already have with but with a maple fret board
on it. 
Pics anyone?


----------



## MetalDaze

^ Yeah, where are these NGDs?


----------



## Lirtle

Still waiting for a fucking reply from Chris...


----------



## Larrikin666

kmanick said:


> WOW! these are looking good. I'm happy for you guys finally geting some deliveries.
> Is anyone getting a hesperian or jekyll 7 with a maple fret board on it?
> I'd love to get a carbon copy of what I already have with but with a maple fret board
> on it.
> Pics anyone?



Yes. No pics yet. We spec'd out a Jekyll 727 with a birdseye maple board for the other guitarist in my band a few months ago. I believe Bernie and I decided it would be best to hold off on it until the BFR stuff was all taken care of.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Lirtle said:


> Still waiting for a fucking reply from Chris...



I've been waiting nearly a month. I tried e-mailing again and e-mailing Bernie directly as well and got no response from either...


----------



## kruneh

WickedSymphony said:


> I've been waiting nearly a month. I tried e-mailing again and e-mailing Bernie directly as well and got no response from either...



Me too.
I tried every single email account they ever had, but nothing.
I´m just trying to get a "yes" to me selling my spot.


----------



## SpaceDock

I have sent repeated emails to Chris G, but still nothing. It is really disapointing since he was so confident about getting all of the guitars in a real production schedule.


----------



## EOT

kruneh said:


> Me too.
> I tried every single email account they ever had, but nothing.
> I´m just trying to get a "yes" to me selling my spot.



You may never get a "yes". You pretty much just have to sell it and let the new buyer and Bernie work it out. He seems to reply to new buyers rather quickly...


----------



## kruneh

EOT said:


> You may never get a "yes". You pretty much just have to sell it and let the new buyer and Bernie work it out. He seems to reply to new buyers rather quickly...



Ok, thanks EOT.
I would really like this to be sorted out to the best for everybody and not leave the new owner out in the blue, but it seems that it is almost impossible to get a reply, so..


----------



## geofreesun

i need to bump this thread, because:


----------



## MetalDaze

^ Is that your rebuild?


----------



## geofreesun

yes sir. bernie emailed asking about string gauge. looks like it should ship within a few days? fingers crossed.


MetalDaze said:


> ^ Is that your rebuild?


----------



## MetalDaze

geofreesun said:


> yes sir. bernie emailed asking about string gauge. looks like it should ship within a few days? fingers crossed.


 
Awesome!


----------



## geofreesun

but it's already got strings on it!!!


----------



## MetalDaze

geofreesun said:


> but it's already got strings on it!!!


 
Haha. Didn't notice that


----------



## jjcor

geofreesun said:


> yes sir. bernie emailed asking about string gauge. looks like it should ship within a few days? fingers crossed.



Mine was supposed to ship last Friday, and this Monday, and now tomorrow!


----------



## Larrikin666

geofreesun said:


> i need to bump this thread, because:



Oh wow. I dig that idea for the inlays. I might end up stealing that layout for future builds.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Larrikin666 said:


> Oh wow. I dig that idea for the inlays. I might end up stealing that layout for future builds.



After all the insanity, it boggles the mind that people are still talking about future builds. 

Seriously though, they are sick inlays.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> After all the insanity, it boggles the mind that people are still talking about future builds.
> 
> Seriously though, they are sick inlays.



LOL. I got an immaculate guitar, so that's all I cared about. Bought two more slots and have two full customs being built.


----------



## ikarus

a big box arrived at my parents place a few hours ago...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Larrikin666 said:


> LOL. I got an immaculate guitar, so that's all I cared about. Bought two more slots and have two full customs being built.



Oh, I know. My guitar is ridiculous too. It's strange how the more I play it, the more it settles in, the better it gets. It's pretty righteous. But the way I look at it, there's always KxK, Suhr, Anderson, and Hell at this point wait a half a year and get a Carvin CT7 27" scale and slam some BKP's into that puppy. If I get another custom, I'll likely go with this local father/son duo in my area. They do sick work.

No offense to you for your choice though, man. I just got jerked around so much by the dude throughout the whole process there'd be no way I'd work with him again.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Oh, I know. My guitar is ridiculous too. It's strange how the more I play it, the more it settles in, the better it gets. It's pretty righteous. But the way I look at it, there's always KxK, Suhr, Anderson, and Hell at this point wait a half a year and get a Carvin CT7 27" scale and slam some BKP's into that puppy. If I get another custom, I'll likely go with this local father/son duo in my area. They do sick work.
> 
> No offense to you for your choice though, man. I just got jerked around so much by the dude throughout the whole process there'd be no way I'd work with him again.



I totally understand that. I also have a KxK that I've been waiting on for 2 years now that was supposed to be in 1. Just ordered two "Standbergs" as well. To me, waiting is not a big deal. I have a really fantastic relationship with Bernie as well since we got pretty close after my Hesperian arrived. I speak to him often considering the time difference. I really believe things are going to get better once this massive pile of BFR guitars are taken care of.


----------



## kruneh

You know, there´s just to many great builders out there for me to give Bernie another chance.
It´s not about the waiting, it´s about people having paid full in for months, and then nothing. No answers, no guitars, no pics, nothing.
I just sold my spot, though I would really love to have the guitar I´ve been waiting for, but it´s not really worth the effort.
I have two other 8 strings that I´m sure play better than the BRJ anyway.
I hope the new owner gets a great guitar, but for me BRJ and his business is dead.
Good luck to everybody, you all have my sympathy.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I will second that. The wait time did have a bit to do with it, but that was solely because I was told a vastly underestimated wait time. I understand that shit goes wrong and all types of demonic forces of delay are unleashed, but I was told on numerous occasions (to the point where it became a rather large joke in my circle of family, friends and associates) that my guitar would be done in "x weeks" and then Bernie would completely fall off the map and get back to me weeks to a month after I was told I'd be receiving the guitar.

At one point when John was still working at the shop (January or so year) I got a call from him 3 weeks after I was supposed to receive the guitar (for the 6th time) - I was kind of pissed. This is when John told me that Bernie blew off my guitar, along with 10 others, in order to finish guitars for guys that were going to be at NAMM showing off his stuff. Apparently after being exposed for 1.5 months without proper conditions or work, the neck twisted and had to be rebuilt. It may all be bullshit, of course, as John went away shortly thereafter and I eventually got my guitar in late June.

It was at that point that I decided if I ever got my guitar, I'd just be happy if it were functional and I would probably not do business there again. I hope that Chris can get him back on track, and that BRJ guitars can reclaim their name, but to me, his business is dead as dead can be.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

glassmoon0fo said:


> Lets not get ahead of ourselves. Someone will light the torches again soon enough


 
 lol. Definately see where you brothers are coming from, although I tend to agree with Larrikin. I've had plenty of great guitars and NONE of them outplay my Rico, not even close. And that's with the minor shim in the board. That kind of thing just doesn't matter to me, it's the relationship to the instrument and what I feel it can help me achieve in terms of my craft. The BRJ just does it for me. That being said, I could see how having to wait and being disappointed time and again could ruin a guitar before you even get your hands on it, but I've had worse happen in life and I guess it just didn't get to me. I also have a KxK on order, and it will have probably been 3 years at least from the time i ordered it to the time I get it, if not somehow longer (there are still 3 runs worth of guitars to build before Rob even gets to mine), and I have YET to get a quote from Rob on the new build despite repeatedly asking, but if the guitar plays as well as or better than the BRJ, the end will justify the means.

Then again, I'm a simple bedroom shredder and local gun for hire, I imagine if i were semi pro or something it would have probably worked my last nerve waiting for a BRJ or KxK  At the very least, I'm glad this thread has swung back towards the civil side and people are agreeing to disagree as this mess gets slowly worked out. Those of you that are still waiting, I feel that most if not all of you will love the way it plays and looks regardless. If you don't, someone else will!


----------



## technomancer

Larrikin666 said:


> I totally understand that. I also have a KxK that I've been waiting on for 2 years now that was supposed to be in 1. Just ordered two "Standbergs" as well. To me, waiting is not a big deal. I have a really fantastic relationship with Bernie as well since we got pretty close after my Hesperian arrived. I speak to him often considering the time difference. I really believe things are going to get better once this massive pile of BFR guitars are taken care of.



If you're going to compare the two you might want to also point out that there was no estimated build time on the 7 Scale KxK runs while the BFRs were supposed to be done in 90 days and are now at 2 years. In fact it was even stressed in the run threads for the fanned fret KxKs that there was no estimated or guaranteed build time for those runs.

Being a longtime KxK customer and having nothing in the BRJ run I've stayed out of this thread, but I thought that was worth pointing out.

Good luck to all of those still waiting for the BRJ BFRs


----------



## MetalDaze

I'm currently waiting on the following:

BRJ - 25 months (quoted 60 days - first five orders)
Jackson - 21 months (quoted 8-12 months)
KxK - 18 months (no time given)

BRJ is definitely the biggest disappointment at this point because of the original expectation set, but to be honest, I'm tired of waiting for all of them. 

I've learned that my own patience threshold is about 12 months. I'll be glad to get them all and hopefully point myself back to this post every time I get the GAS to place another custom order


----------



## technomancer

MetalDaze said:


> I'm currently waiting on the following:
> 
> BRJ - 25 months (quoted 60 days - first five orders)
> Jackson - 21 months (quoted 8-12 months)
> KxK - 18 months (no time given)
> 
> BRJ is definitely the biggest disappointment at this point because of the original expectation set, but to be honest, I'm tired of waiting for all of them.
> 
> I've learned that my own patience threshold is about 12 months. I'll be glad to get them all and hopefully point myself back to this post every time I get the GAS to place another custom order





I'm really out of this thread now, but that shit was funny


----------



## MetalDaze

technomancer said:


> I'm really out of this thread now, but that shit was funny



Are you laughing at my pain?


----------



## technomancer

MetalDaze said:


> Are you laughing at my pain?



Only the last sentence


----------



## imprinted

Just reading this thread makes me sad. And very grateful that I didn't have the funds to jump on board when it was first announced. I'm with the minority that thinks that once this dies down and BRJ gets back to making his "Normal" amount of guitars that things will get better.


Good luck to all waiting!


----------



## JP Universe

How many BFR's do you think are left to go now?


----------



## Larrikin666

technomancer said:


> IIn fact it was even stressed in the run threads for the fanned fret KxKs that there was no estimated or guaranteed build time for those runs.




Haha. I don't want this to come off as argumentative or defensive, but I have an email from Rob that says differently. My intention was absolutely not drag KxK into the mud. I was using it to illustrate that I'm fine with waiting. It's a normal thing in the custom game. It's certainly true that some builders are better at estimating time and communicating throughout the process. 

*hugs and kisses*


----------



## technomancer

Larrikin666 said:


> Haha. I don't want this to come off as argumentative or defensive, but I have an email from Rob that says differently. My intention was absolutely not drag KxK into the mud. I was using it to illustrate that I'm fine with waiting. It's a normal thing in the custom game. It's certainly true that some builders are better at estimating time and communicating throughout the process.
> 
> *hugs and kisses*



No hard feelings, it just seems like that KxK gets brought up quite a bit when people are complaining about Bernie...

Honestly I hope Bernie gets his act together and delivers on this run, as stuff like this tends to turn people off of custom builders in general  

Peace, ,


----------



## Khoi

JP Universe said:


> How many BFR's do you think are left to go now?



a lot.


----------



## SpaceDock

I would guess at least 50 on the conservative side.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Update  :


----------



## SpaceDock

This was brought up a while back in this thread and I thought I'd share:

USA Bernie Rico Jr 6 String Jekyll Neck Through Body Blank Guitar | eBay

From the seller: All I can say is I got the guitar from the guy who builds for Rico.

So it does looks like Rico is just finishing at this point and farms out the builds as many had suggested. 

I am still eagerly awaiting my guitars, but I really can't understand what is taking so long.


----------



## MikeK

Damn, I wish you could just pick those ^ up in an 8 haha.


----------



## Jexey

SpaceDock said:


> This was brought up a while back in this thread and I thought I'd share:
> 
> USA Bernie Rico Jr 6 String Jekyll Neck Through Body Blank Guitar | eBay
> 
> From the seller: All I can say is I got the guitar from the guy who builds for Rico.
> 
> So it does looks like Rico is just finishing at this point and farms out the builds as many had suggested.
> 
> I am still eagerly awaiting my guitars, but I really can't understand what is taking so long.


 
HOLY SHIT ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Am I the only one that wants to throw something heavy through a fucking window after seeing this?


----------



## Jake

Jexey said:


> HOLY SHIT ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Am I the only one that wants to throw something heavy through a fucking window after seeing this?


If that's true this whole thing is fucking ridiculous. No reason for these kinds of wait times and shitty communication


----------



## HeadBender

The next lovely thing that will turn out is that these bodies are made in the factory where those hybrid vixen bodies were made, China or Korea, can't remember anymore.....


----------



## MetalDaze

Well, this has been discussed before. Bernie never said that he personally was building each guitar from scratch and given the volume of guitars hanging around his shop, I never expected that he was the only one building them.

There have certainly been lots of theories of where these are being built, but I've yet to see anything concrete. There's a bunch of information leading to Mexico, but I believe Bernie has said the "woodshop" is in the US.

If it's high quality, I don't care if they are being built by martians. But, I would like to get some info on my builds soon


----------



## Electric Wizard

717ctsjz said:


> If that's true this whole thing is fucking ridiculous. No reason for these kinds of wait times and shitty communication


If it's true, it's exactly the reason for shitty communication; Bernie can't meet requests for updates until the body is in his hands.

Not to stoke the fire, since I don't have a horse in this race, but the outsourcing of builds makes sense when you look back at the updates people have received. Seems like most are guitars that are in the finishing stage, and not other stages in construction.


----------



## SpaceDock

The eBay seller states that they are made in the USA.


----------



## MetalDaze

Electric Wizard said:


> Not to stoke the fire, since I don't have a horse in this race, but the outsourcing of builds makes sense when you look back at the updates people have received. Seems like most are guitars that are in the finishing stage, and not other stages in construction.


 
Exactly, they are always near finished guitars. Never pics of unfretted necks or rough cut bodies.


----------



## jjcor

MetalDaze said:


> Exactly, they are always near finished guitars. Never pics of unfretted necks or rough cut bodies.



That is true. Hmmmmm 

I mean if he is having them built somewhere else then they do some pretty good work (87% of the time from some of the horror stories that I've seen on here) cause when people do get them done RIGHT, they absolutely love them.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Dunno how much this counts for, but I got a pic of mine a long time ago when it was natural and another when it was first painted and it didn't have frets on it either time. As far as the full body's construction I have no idea since I never saw it until the whole body was finished, but I'm pretty sure he does the frets in house at least.

Edit for old pic:


----------



## MetalDaze

^ I stand corrected on that part 

...but it's true that they aren't be built in the same building that we get pics from (the shop in Hesperia). It would be nice if Bernie would clear some of this up so we don't keep spreading rumors, but I guess he doesn't feel the need to be so transparent about how his business works.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Yeh, I don't doubt that part since I don't recall ever seeing an in progress body from the shop. Clarification would definitely be nice, but I'm not sure we'll ever get it.


----------



## rifftrauma

Jexey said:


> HOLY SHIT ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Am I the only one that wants to throw something heavy through a fucking window after seeing this?




Yea this doesn't make me real happy. Not paying $4,000 to have some random dude build the body of my guitar...


----------



## mikernaut

$4000? you getting some major features?

I actually got a random email update from Chris today . Pretty much saying I'm going to love the guitar.  well, I certainly hope so.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

MetalDaze said:


> ^ I stand corrected on that part
> 
> ...but it's true that they aren't be built in the same building that we get pics from (the shop in Hesperia). It would be nice if Bernie would clear some of this up so we don't keep spreading rumors, but I guess he doesn't feel the need to be so transparent about how his business works.



If there's one thing I learned about BRJ guitars, it's that nothing about the business is honest or transparent. Yes, I received a really well-made guitar, but Bernie is so full of shit that he actually believes his own lies and misinformation.

The guy is arrogant - and it has caused his business to suffer plain and simple. He probably didn't check with the dudes who actually construct his guitars before he took a huge number of orders and then threw them under the bus to attempt to make a buck. It's pretty simple guys. He's a schmuck.

A schmuck who happens to usually build (I should say finish and even then we don't really know to what extent) excellently made guitars, but a total schmuck nonetheless.


----------



## UnderTheSign

rifftrauma said:


> Yea this doesn't make me real happy. Not paying $4,000 to have some random dude build the body of my guitar...


The Rico family has pretty much NEVER built guitars themselves. It was always the Mexican luthiers who built their stuff and I wouldn't be surprised if they had a shop down in Mexico or one somewhere in Cali with a lot of the old Mexicans where they still build stuff. If you expected Bernie Jr. to be building your guitar by himself, you better return your deposit.


----------



## killertone

AFAIK, Bernie picks up the built guitars in San Diego and takes them to Hesperia. He swore to me when I was at his shop that the wood shop is in the US. I assume that the Ricos have been using this method for a very long time. I don't care where it is built honestly as long as it exudes quality. My last BRG was extremely well built and the two that I have on order are amazing...I have held both in my hands in their unfinished stage. No shims or shenanigans whatsoever on them.


----------



## JP Universe

Got a reply from Chris G about my build. 6 weeks till finish is done. They want the rest of the money in 4 weeks time.... I'm going to wait till I see the finished guitar before I start sending more cash


----------



## JerichoCheng

got a email from Chris also and he mentioned my guitar will be ready in under 2 weeks.


----------



## Adrian-XI

JP Universe said:


> Got a reply from Chris G about my build. 6 weeks till finish is done. They want the rest of the money in 4 weeks time.... I'm going to wait till I see the finished guitar before I start sending more cash



Just say you'll pay him in two weeks, then in six months send a picture like this.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

Adrian-XI said:


> Just say you'll pay him in two weeks, then in six months send a picture like this.



Or just send an email saying "The money is in the printing stages, it'l be sent by the end of the week"

Then a couple of months later "There was a mistake with the serial number so a reprint is needed"


----------



## SpaceDock

I wish I would have waited to pay, he told me two weeks on my guitars back in February and I paid for both of them. I have yet to see any progress in the pictures since then. They are painted, one has frets, just need hardware and set up. I keep just getting "they are ready for final assembly"


----------



## geofreesun

got an email asking about my address. i guess it's ready to ship


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Feel for everyone here. It took 99 pages to realise he doesn't build em himself! I stand by my comments on my BRJ. It is NOT head and shoulders above anything else I have played/owned. Why would these "Mexicans" build the best guitars in the world for Bernie and no one else. There is a bit of the old snake oil with BRJ's. Yes, mine is good, but so is my Loomis, and my K7. 

I was going to order another one after I got my 1st, but now ......... I'm never ever going to go into a contract with a man that is just plain and obviously stupid, regarding his business and communication skills. It sickens me to see Bernie in recent pics on FB with "endorsees" and such, whilst most of you wait here for a slight glimmer of hope. Wonder how long Chris will last? 

All the best to everyone here for Christmas and the New Year, and I hope 2013 will see you all holding your BRJ's in your hands. I think there will still be 50 odd more pages to this saga before we see a concrete result unfortunately, but I have my fingers crossed for you all. Kudos to everyone here, cause I sure know that if this was happening to me here in Oz, I would of been over to Hesperia by now getting to the bottom of all the questions that have been asked here.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I don't know if I'd put a Loomis or even my Ibby MIJ that I owned in league with my BRJ. When the guitars are made right, they're really made right IMO. Of course, we've seen that BRJ has serious inconsistencies with the quality of their construction and finishing.

It's the customer service end of things that really has things all borked up. When I see him with pictures of Slash or at some art gallery in Fresno, and I think about dudes who have been waiting for 3 years for guitars they were told 6 months on, I just want to scream. I think most people are just holding onto hope that he's going to come around and be right as rain. But I truly believe the dude is an egomaniac who doesn't give one shit about anybody except that they give him their money. It's sad.


----------



## JPMike

I emailed Bernie about my orders 1 week ago and he still hasn't respond, should I start to worry?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I am being ignored as well. The last response from Chris said he would get back to me in about half an hour, that was a month ago. I am getting really bummed about this shit since he promised to update me and let me know where I was in the schedule, but after two years of waiting, having paid in full, and no communication I am on my last leg. 

Anyone want some BFR slots?


----------



## MetalDaze

Me too. After a couple of really fast responses, I've been in the dead zone for a month.


----------



## Khoi

JPMike said:


> I emailed Bernie about my orders 1 week ago and he still hasn't respond, should I start to worry?



no, me too


----------



## WickedSymphony

My suggestion would be try e-mailing towards the end of the day or really early in the morning, as they seem to respond in a "last in, first out" manner and if you e-mail in the late morning (like 11 am PST) or afternoon your email probably gets buried among all the others. Don't know if that's actually the case, but I noticed when I send an email at like 10pm I tend to get a reply more quickly whereas if I email in the afternoon the response comes days later or not at all. Alternatively, try calling the shop instead of emailing (though I haven't had the best luck with calling, personally).

Also, I don't know what luck anyone was having with Chris, but I didn't get an answer to my question for like 3 weeks before I just emailed Bernie and got a response a couple days later.

I don't know if that helps at all. It's definitely a pain in the ass to get a reply. Guess after about 1.5 years, you just get used to it.


----------



## gplayer51

Got an e-mail yesterday from Chris saying that the guitar will be 2-6 weeks and I will love the guitar and it looks great. I hope he's right lol


----------



## Red&Die

I have received my guitar from Bernie 2 weeks ago, here is the NGD thread:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...gd-bernie-rico-jr-slant-top-jekyll-724-a.html


----------



## killertone

I decided to send Chris G an email finally. Couldn't be bothered until now because of what I have heard about not receiving replies but figured I'd give it a shot and see for myself.


----------



## ikarus

Hey guys, please check out my NGD:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/st...jr-hesperian-slant-top-624-a.html#post3312976


----------



## MetalThrasher

I just emailed Bernie today. Hopefully, he will get back to me. I just want to see what's going on with my Vixen slot that I purchased a few months ago. I just hope all is well with the guitar. I could really care less when I get it. I just want to know what's going on. I actually paid for the whole thing in full a few weeks after I bought the slot.


----------



## rifftrauma

ikarus said:


> Hey guys, please check out my NGD:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/st...jr-hesperian-slant-top-624-a.html#post3312976




Hopefully we'll see a couple more BRJ's roll out before Christmas. HNGD man, very classy indeed!


----------



## Kiwimetal101

^^ Is bernie demanding new owners of slots pay in full with little info/photos/communication?

That seems wack to me


----------



## HeadBender

I am sitting here, waiting for a reply for weeks now.
Seriously considering giving up this hassle and getting rid of that rebuild spot.


----------



## paddy

Putting out a couple of guitars, is no big deal.
He hasn't stopped producing guitars, we know. 
He just does it in his own pace and having taken a lot of orders, there'll still be people in the queue since way back and for sometime to come yet.

If you were famous though, you would get your guitar built avoiding the queue (which would put more wait on the shoulders of the ordinary majority).


----------



## jjcor

Got my tracking number today!!!!!


----------



## Rook

I emailed Bernie yesterday heard back today, he's getting back to people. I was only asking for D-Activators instead of Crunch Lab and Liquifire and he said 'I don't stock D-Activators'...

....don't stock D-Activators? Thought you either stocked DiMarzio or you didn't 

You'd have thought he could have been a little more helpful for a multi thousand dollar customer...

STILL not the biggest problem in casa del rico I guess.


----------



## Adrian-XI

^When I confirmed my BFR specs earlier this year, I asked for a d activator in lieu of the CL. Bernie said he would have to order one in but said it would be no problem. Not sure what's going on there...


----------



## geofreesun

jjcor said:


> Got my tracking number today!!!!!


me too


----------



## WickedSymphony

Adrian-XI said:


> ^When I confirmed my BFR specs earlier this year, I asked for a d activator in lieu of the CL. Bernie said he would have to order one in but said it would be no problem. Not sure what's going on there...



Yeh, I could've sworn when I read Rook's post that a few people way back had them changed to D-Activators with no problem. Kinda weird.


----------



## Rook

Mother....

*deep breaths*

D-Activator 6's? I don't see what difference it bloody makes.


----------



## JPMike

Ok, I have paid for 3 orders in full and haven't gotten any update as Bernie told me I would by now. 

What is Chris G's email?? The "[email protected]" one?? 

Regarding the D-Activators, Bernie told me sometime ago that he stocks them. Weird.


----------



## Rook

I contacted Bernie's Bern[4digits]@yahoo.com and heard back within a day mike, if you have that one, maybe give it a shot.

I remember seeing pics of your guitars nearly done like 6 months ago, what's that about 

Story of BRJ I guess.

I don't care that much about the DA's, I'll juyst be happy to get the guitar, and I like the CL/LF, I'll probably swap them for the DA's in my own time if I can be arsed. Its the principle of it though


----------



## JPMike

Rook said:


> I contacted Bernie's Bern[4digits]@yahoo.com and heard back within a day mike, if you have that one, maybe give it a shot.
> 
> I remember seeing pics of your guitars nearly done like 6 months ago, what's that about
> 
> Story of BRJ I guess.
> 
> I don't care that much about the DA's, I'll juyst be happy to get the guitar, and I like the CL/LF, I'll probably swap them for the DA's in my own time if I can be arsed. Its the principle of it though



Hey Nick,

How are you, bro?

It's funny, cause I have been talking directly to Bernie for quite some time. 
Yes, I got that email address, we also were talking on the phone for an hour 2 months ago, discussing my orders etc and he told me, I can always call him or email him to his personal address if I wanted to know anything. Also got an email with updated photos of one of my orders(denim one) 7 weeks ago. 

And I have been trying to get in touch with him or whoever the last 1 and a half week and I get no answers. I had to rewrite an email today with more detailed content hoping to trigger some kind of emotion so they can actually answer to me. 

You mean that purple-ish 7 string?? That guitar had warped neck/fretboard, so they are building me a new guitar to whatever specs I wanted. But honestly, I doubt I will get any updates on it soon. 

Honestly, this inconsistency doesn't help out to send more money that way or get any other orders going. 

Sometimes, I say to myself Bernie is a really good guy that will make up for the lost time due to the rough period he went through and some other times, I think, are they playing with me and what not. 

I lean towards the first opinion of the two, but when I get no answers don't know wtf to do. Really I am so starting to lose interest on my builds, since it's almost 2 years since the orders have been made and I grow musically to other directions. 

I am frustrated...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

JPMike said:


> You mean that purple-ish 7 string?? That guitar had warped neck/fretboard, so they are building me a new guitar to whatever specs I wanted. But honestly, I doubt I will get any updates on it soon.
> 
> Honestly, this inconsistency doesn't help out to send more money that way or get any other orders going.



And therein lies the rub, my friend. The hot/cold treatment of his customers is astounding and incredibly confusing.

One day it's like he's your best bud. He's easily contactable, gives you "personal" contact means - progress seems good, and then...

There's a gap in the communication. Maybe it's a week, maybe it's a month or more. Suddenly, when you are finally able to force something out of him he might not even know who you are.

I had several instances where he would go from answering my calls by saying my name, and then after so little time as a week, would be asking me "Wait, who is this?" then "What guitar are we talking about here?" The conversation would slowly evolve into:

Bernie: "oh yeah, the black one?" 

Me: "No, the _______ that you said was basically done 5 weeks back."

Bernie: "Oh... yeah... what so-and-so was supposed to tell you was that the neck warped and it had to be rebuilt."

Me: "But I was talking to you about this"

Bernie: Insert relatively weak excuse meant to play on my emotions.

The impression that I get is that the guy is a barely functional liar. I mean, I suppose he's busy and all and had some rough spots, but I'm pretty sure the guy exists in a constant state of putting people on. There were a couple times I just called him out and just asked him to tell me the truth, he would get upset at me, eventually trying to bribe me with some promise about making sure I got taken care of. 

I'm still waiting on the partial refund I was promised when they got specs wrong and a ridiculous delay in my build. In August he basically said the check was in the mail, and then completely disappeared. Chris was adamant about correcting that, and then poof - gone.

Just so people know, I'm not simply butt-hurt about the whole thing. I think it's important that people know what they're in for when dealing with this guy. I don't lightly say that he's an egomaniacal sociopath who doesn't give one damn about people more than they're money can talk. He's way to willing to manipulate people into thinking he's a great guy, has a long lush history of holding up his family name, etc.

It's a rouse.


----------



## JPMike

I am super annoyed.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I´ve send a mail and got a reply from "Ivo", who´s that again ? 

and it was the usually "I´ll try to get you an update blabla... "

I´m wondering how many weeks its gonna be this time... -.-


----------



## jjcor

NGD in sixstring thread!!!


----------



## killertone

Rook said:


> I emailed Bernie yesterday heard back today, he's getting back to people. I was only asking for D-Activators instead of Crunch Lab and Liquifire and he said 'I don't stock D-Activators'...
> 
> ....don't stock D-Activators? Thought you either stocked DiMarzio or you didn't
> 
> You'd have thought he could have been a little more helpful for a multi thousand dollar customer...
> 
> STILL not the biggest problem in casa del rico I guess.



I changed my original BFR to D-Activators over a year ago but honestly don't know if they will be in the guitar or not. It was when a guy named MTech was helping out Bernie in this thread. 

My second guitar will have Duncans in it or at least it is supposed to...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Pascal-Darrell said:


> I´ve send a mail and got a reply from "Ivo", who´s that again ?
> 
> and it was the usually "I´ll try to get you an update blabla... "
> 
> I´m wondering how many weeks its gonna be this time... -.-



So is Chris already gone then? Ivo is his FB guy.


----------



## killertone

Speculum Speculorum said:


> So is Chris already gone then? Ivo is his FB guy.



I sent an email to Chris and never received a reply...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

killertone said:


> I sent an email to Chris and never received a reply...



I'm starting to wonder if the dude ever existed at all.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Ivo seems to be the fb guy. 

hope he does a better job in providing me an update. will see...


----------



## JP Universe

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I'm starting to wonder if the dude ever existed at all.


 
He replied to me and it was from Chris G so it seems like yes he did exist......

ahhh the mysteries of BRJ


----------



## JPMike

I haven't received a single answer and I have already sent quite a few emails. 

At least, when J was around, I could call any time or email any time and get an answer...


----------



## gplayer51

Edit: Crap pics didnt work ill upload again in a sec


----------



## gplayer51

http://imageshack.us/f/10/imageyir.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/f/109/imageylo.jpg/
Got an update today as promised! Should be 2-4 weeks! Im so pumped!


----------



## Qweklain

So I got an e-mail from Bernie today saying my guitar was ready for final assembly and _stated_ (not asking) that final payment was due. 

I replied with... 
"I will be more than happy to pay when I get pictures of it actually completed. I have been burned too many times paying full in advance, and on top of that tons of people have paid in advance when you have claimed to have their guitar ready for final assembly, or even ready to ship, and it does not happen."

Let us see what the reply is, if anything...


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

wow ! amazing color, congrats man


gplayer51 said:


> Imageshack - imageyir.jpg
> Imageshack - imageylo.jpg
> Got an update today as promised! Should be 2-4 weeks! Im so pumped!


----------



## Danukenator

Is it normal for builders to ask for the final deposit before the instrument is ready to ship?

I always thought it was a X amount up front and y amount on completion type deal.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Danukenator said:


> Is it normal for builders to ask for the final deposit before the instrument is ready to ship?
> 
> I always thought it was a X amount up front and y amount on completion type deal.



When he e-mails asking for final payment, he typically says the guitar is ready for assembly and will ship in the following week. So, the understanding is that you pay when the guitar is just about completed, or entirely complete, but before it is shipped. Of course, as I and many others have experienced, it is rarely the case that the guitars are actually ready to ship when we get these e-mails stating so.

It's an extremely frustrating experience to have paid (6 months ago now) and still not have a guitar in my hands, and I'm pretty certain there are several other people in this thread who have had their instruments paid off for even longer. I seriously recommend anyone who still hasn't paid to do what qweklain did, and say they will be happy to pay once they see the instrument is actually completed. 

I'd really love to see what reply you get, qwek.


----------



## kruneh

I´m amazed that he doesn´t finish the full paid ones first.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

my guitar is nearly finished since september last year and I asked them if it wouldn´t be better for them to finish the nearly completed instruments rather than having them laying around the shop collecting dust... Ivo didn´t really get into the question though.

It´s kinda fishy


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yup. He had my money for about 9 months before I had my guitar. I'm of the opinion people should just stop paying him until the guitar is literally ready to ship - pictures, packaged, then you get your money, Bernie.


----------



## paddy

It is logical to finish a guitar one at a time, ask for money and deliver it and THEN onto the next guitar.
But you have to look at itfrom his point of view. He works like a builder (house builder). He takes on a job today, gets paid part of the money, does a part of renovation, and tomorrow you don't see him. Why? because he's at someone else's house doing renovations simultaneously. Few days later he turns up at your house, does a bit more and dissapears again. This way they manage to get a few business (and their money) at the same time. It's good for them and bad for the customer (it takes longer for their house to finish). And once you've commited to them, they know that they got you under their control because of the money you've paid.
Back to bernie situation:
Also remember that christmass is around the corner and he needs to buy more stuff for the family (gifts, etc) and all, therefore, he needs your money to do so. So, he saysyour guitar is almost finished pay me the rest of the money. And quite rightly so you will reply: let me see my finished guitar and then I'll pay. And in most cases you won't see a finished guitar because as everybody have already said, they're not finished. He just needs your money to pay for his christmass holidays.


----------



## Walterson

paddy said:


> It is logical to finish a guitar one at a time, ask for money and deliver it and THEN onto the next guitar.




No, its not. You can build much faster when you work in batches of 5-10 Guitars....


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

paddy said:


> But you have to look at itfrom his point of view. He works like a builder (house builder). He takes on a job today, gets paid part of the money, does a part of renovation, and tomorrow you don't see him. Why? because he's at someone else's house doing renovations simultaneously. Few days later he turns up at your house, does a bit more and dissapears again. This way they manage to get a few business (and their money) at the same time.



Yes, only Bernie asks for your money, tells you he'll have the job done next Tuesday, and you hear from him 6-10 months later telling you he's sorry that your guitar needed to be rebuilt 3 times and that it ended up painted instead of oiled or stained - but hey he'll rebuild it for you if you're unhappy, and then he'll act like a total son-of-a-bitch if you hold him at all accountable for being a dick-head during this whole long process.

So yeah, he's just like every business man that is trying to make a buck, right?


----------



## paddy

Walterson said:


> No, its not. You can build much faster when you work in batches of 5-10 Guitars....



Fair enough.
But you do see the point that I was making.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

The anger in this thread is palatable. And I totally understand. Hopefully this crap ceases, although for most here the writing is on the wall. 

Fucking awesome stain on those update pictures, though! I can't wait to see some signs of life, like a fucking ultrasound or something...


----------



## silentrage

^ Few reasons I doubt this "crap" will cease, because it's a formula for success.

Company puts out pics of awesome guitars
Gets orders
Good reviews, more pics of awesome guitars
LOTS MOAR ORDERS
Company realizes it can't hit deadlines, starts employing excuses and stalling tactics

At this point, the people who got the short end of the shit covered stick will start complaining.(see this thread)

But the few people who actually got their guitars on time will defend said company since from their perspective nothing is wrong.

And people who don't know better and have only seen the awesome pics will continue to put in orders.

So as long as this portion of their customer base, meaning the naively optimistic who're thinking "nah it won't happen to me", and/or the ignorant who have only seen the pics and not the shitstorm on here, can maintain a stable source of income for the company, and they do just enough damage control, for example hiring someone to take pics of shiny things and write emails to lull customers into a false sense of security, they can continue to stay in business, even grow their business, indefinitely.

See bugera's early days.


----------



## JPMike

Chris' email, bummer.
"Dear Mike

It's Chris G Here, I got your message re your orders.
Bernie and I apologise profusely to you.
Bernie has explained the special relationship with you and I was unaware of this relationship until today.
We are still clearing guitars as fast as we can we have 60 guitars in Assembly 42 in paint and another 56 in woodshop
We are getting through the guitars iby the date of the commencement of the order.
Yes that is how big the backlog goes.

I have put all orders in our production system and all of your orders are in there
the denim guitar was out of woodshop and would have been close to delivery but the fingerboard cracked.
This meant the fingerboard had to be recut, shaped, slotted and reapplied.
This guitar has just left woodshop and is now ready for paint.
It will go into paint 

your build numbers are as follows

01 Build number 0118112134MBvs (delivery date 15th of Feb)
02 7 String build number 0218112134MBvs (midway through woodshop fingerboard gluing process delivery date March 1st)
03 Build number 0218112134MBvs (Woodahop electronics route delivery date March 15th)

decoding our build Numbers"


----------



## SpaceDock

^ Well I wish I could get an update like that. I have been shunned by the Rico organization for over a month now.


----------



## Adrian-XI

158 guitars, damn...


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> your build numbers are as follows
> 
> 01 Build number 0118112134MBvs (delivery date 15th of Feb)
> 02 7 String build number *0218112134MBvs* (midway through woodshop fingerboard gluing process delivery date March 1st)
> 03 Build number *0218112134MBvs * (Woodahop electronics route delivery date March 15th)
> 
> decoding our build Numbers"



2 different builds with the same exact build number?


----------



## MetalThrasher

Good news that some people are getting responses. I emailed a little over a week ago and so far no response. I have to admit that I am not flooding Bernie with emails. I think this was the first email I sent to him after talking to him about my Vixen slot I purchased this past July. Right after I received a confirmation email that the slot has been transferred to my name back in July, two weeks later I get an email that my guitar is almost ready and attached was a link to pay off the remainder of the slot which I did. Bernie called me in September asking about the pickup selector placement and we talked for a good hour. Bernie did explain how we has backed up and feels bad about it which I understand. I can also understand everyone else here especially the one's who have not sold their slot and are still hanging in there. I was aware of the whole run ordeal before I bought the slot and believe me I wasn't expecting anything to happen within 3 or 4 months. Bernie does seem like a really nice person on the phone and I still believe it. I understand that he has a lot on his plate right now and is trying his best to turn things around. I just wish that he would respond to some of our emails and keep us updated on what's going on. I'm not selling my slot and I don't expect my guitar soon but keeping us informed would help. This is my first true custom and I know when I do get it I am going to be blown away.


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> 2 different builds with the same exact build number?



I didn't even notice that... No idea what is going on...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

JPMike said:


> I didn't even notice that... No idea what is going on...



See my previous post - that, my friend, is exactly what is going on. GOOD LUCK!


----------



## mikernaut

Trying to remain positive ( but still shakin my head in frustration)so I will edit my post and just go with the end part.

Sidenote- I just bought my 1st PRS and while the prices and esthetics are different , it is one of the 1st guitars in awhile that has given my BRJ's a run for their money as far as responsiveness,sound and playing enjoyment.


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> I didn't even notice that... No idea what is going on...



The most reasonable thing I can think of was he was copy/pasting the build order numbers out of whatever system they put in place and accidentally copied the same one twice. I'm sure it's no big deal. Just thought I'd point it out in case you actually needed the build order numbers for whatever reason in the future.

I mean hell, at least you're getting a super detailed response from them


----------



## JP Universe

^baby steps


----------



## JPMike

Speculum Speculorum said:


> See my previous post - that, my friend, is exactly what is going on. GOOD LUCK!



No idea, what's up, bro. Honestly, this is super frustrating. Somehow 2 of my builds so far have cracked necks and need to be redone or whatever. 



mikernaut said:


> Trying to remain positive ( but still shakin my head in frustration)so I will edit my post and just go with the end part.
> 
> Sidenote- I just bought my 1st PRS and while the prices and esthetics are different , it is one of the 1st guitars in awhile that has given my BRJ's a run for their money as far as responsiveness,sound and playing enjoyment.


Well, I have acquired quite a few guitars since the orders I placed with Bernie and I have began losing interest in the BRJs, as I have mentioned before. Until the time comes and I get the BRJs in my hands, I might start getting back to the whole thing, but not sure, I might end up selling them. I have spent quite some money on the BRJs and while I think of it now, I could have easily grabbed some other excellent pieces that I have been GASing over. 



WickedSymphony said:


> The most reasonable thing I can think of was he was copy/pasting the build order numbers out of whatever system they put in place and accidentally copied the same one twice. I'm sure it's no big deal. Just thought I'd point it out in case you actually needed the build order numbers for whatever reason in the future.
> 
> I mean hell, at least you're getting a super detailed response from them



Well, I just wanted to know what's up with my builds. When you have paid in full for 3 builds and suddenly no one gets back to you as they normally would, they ought to explain in detail what's up.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

is it normal for a luthier that the fingerboard cracks , the neck twists so often ? 

I mean we heard that a lot, "your guitar had to be redone because the neck twisted / the fingerboard cracked"

I hope mine isn´t one of them. I´m sure it would take another year to be redone.
if that happens I´ll probably sell the spot and buy something else for the money


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I suppose it's possible that he's had that many issues with woods. He does live in the desert and has apparently so much shit going on that guitar hang on the wall for quite a while -giving them tons of time without care and maintenance, they may just eventually give into the conditions they are surrounded in. It could also be that the dude, in an effort to try to get guitars out, is using wood that is not properly dried and seasoned.

It could also be that he uses that excuse with almost everybody that is inquiring about why the hell they haven't heard anything at all about their guitar in the last 6-12 months, and we're now just starting to put together that it's a giant load of BS.


----------



## paddy

It could also be that he uses that excuse with almost everybody that is inquiring about why the hell they haven't heard anything at all about their guitar in the last 6-12 months, and we're now just starting to put together that it's a giant load of BS.[/QUOTE]


It has always been the above one. Make no mistake.


----------



## Danukenator

Regardless, it would never be an issue (assuming it actually is one) if they didn't sit around for so long.


----------



## EOT

I doubt the fretboard cracking is a load of BS. I've had my Rico for about a year now and it has started to crack. He uses such thin pieces of ebony. I don't if its that or if its just not the best quality ebony or what. But I've got a rebuild in process so yeah... At least it still plays and sounds really good.


----------



## killertone

JPMike said:


> Chris' email, bummer.
> "Dear Mike
> 
> 
> Bernie has explained the special relationship with you and I was unaware of this relationship until today.



Special relationship?


----------



## SirMyghin

Pascal-Darrell said:


> is it normal for a luthier that the fingerboard cracks , the neck twists so often ?
> 
> I mean we heard that a lot, "your guitar had to be redone because the neck twisted / the fingerboard cracked"
> 
> I hope mine isn´t one of them. I´m sure it would take another year to be redone.
> if that happens I´ll probably sell the spot and buy something else for the money



For amatuers, yes it seems to be  (oh right, I am not supposed to post in this one, my bad mods)


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> Well, I just wanted to know what's up with my builds. When you have paid in full for 3 builds and suddenly no one gets back to you as they normally would, they ought to explain in detail what's up.



I understand, dude. Many of us in this thread are in the same position, just with varying amounts of orders.



EOT said:


> I doubt the fretboard cracking is a load of BS. I've had my Rico for about a year now and it has started to crack. He uses such thin pieces of ebony. I don't if its that or if its just not the best quality ebony or what. But I've got a rebuild in process so yeah... At least it still plays and sounds really good.



Wow, I wonder if anyone else has had this issue with theirs. Was he still willing to offer the rebuild a year down the road?


----------



## EOT

WickedSymphony said:


> Wow, I wonder if anyone else has had this issue with theirs. Was he still willing to offer the rebuild a year down the road?



I haven't even told Bernie about it. It was being rebuilt before I found the crack... Like I said, it hasn't affected playability so it's not too big of a big deal.


----------



## MetalDaze

I know Bernie has been an easy target on lots of things, but ebony fretboards can crack if they get too dried out. I had this happen on a USA Jackson. The crack can be filled and sealed so it doesn't get bigger. I make it a habit to oil my ebony boards a couple times a year now.


----------



## Khoi

so what are the chances of me being able to pick up my own guitar, whether finished or not?

I'm going to California in January, and Hesperia is only about 1.5 hrs away. I might just pick it up from him, and have another luthier finish it up, depending on if it's close to finishing or now. I mean it technically is MY guitar since it's paid for in full.


----------



## MetalDaze

Khoi said:


> so what are the chances of me being able to pick up my own guitar, whether finished or not?
> 
> I'm going to California in January, and Hesperia is only about 1.5 hrs away. I might just pick it up from him, and have another luthier finish it up, depending on if it's close to finishing or now. I mean it technically is MY guitar since it's paid for in full.



It's worth a shot. Several people have visited the shop before, so it's not like he doesn't let anyone inside.


----------



## EOT

MetalDaze said:


> I know Bernie has been an easy target on lots of things, but ebony fretboards can crack if they get too dried out. I had this happen on a USA Jackson. The crack can be filled and sealed so it doesn't get bigger. I make it a habit to oil my ebony boards a couple times a year now.



Just to be clear, I'm not saying the crack is Bernie's fault. But he does use the thinnest fretboard I've ever seen. I wouldn't think that would be as stable as a thicker piece would be?


----------



## paddy

EOT said:


> I haven't even told Bernie about it. It was being rebuilt before I found the crack... Like I said, it hasn't affected playability so it's not too big of a big deal.



So ... does this mean that when the rebuilt is finished, you'll have to send him back the guitar you already have, or, you'll end up with 2?


----------



## mikernaut

Well it does seem there's an over abundance of things that go wrong during these builds which leads me to believe without a doubt there is outsourcing going on. ( I know this 1st hand from my line of work and experiences with withoutsourcing)

I have had no issues with the ebony on my BRJ's which I have owned for quite some time now. I will say that one of my custom shop Jackson's did have quite a few cracks just after I had received it even after conditioning it. Which like EOT stated usually does not effect the playability of the guitar and is more so just a visual blemish.

All in all it does suck when it happens on a new CS guitar. Over the years I have had the Jackson ( I was naive and never did anything about the cracks at the time) it has practically almost healed a bit and the cracks are not as visible and the guitar itself has kind of gone thru a breakign in period and plays and sounds better then it ever did when new.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Guess I'm lucky. I have a few guitars with ebony boards and none have cracked. Would be incredibly shitty to have that happen on a new guitar.


----------



## Hollowway

paddy said:


> So ... does this mean that when the rebuilt is finished, you'll have to send him back the guitar you already have, or, you'll end up with 2?



I assume that the original goes back, and he sells it as used, or refurbished, or just tosses it. He's rebuilding my custom, but we haven't really addressed that part of it. When someone's build came up for sale I was thinking about maybe buying it, then tricking it out and then asking him not to charge me for the upgrades, and take that in lieu of a rebuild, but I already have 3 Ricos so I don't know that I really need a 4th one. So I think I'll just wait for the rebuild.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Khoi said:


> so what are the chances of me being able to pick up my own guitar, whether finished or not?
> 
> I'm going to California in January, and Hesperia is only about 1.5 hrs away. I might just pick it up from him, and have another luthier finish it up, depending on if it's close to finishing or now. I mean it technically is MY guitar since it's paid for in full.



I'll tell you - when I made the suggestion to him about my guitar, he basically freaked out on me and in all capslock texted me that NO GUITAR HAS EVER LEFT MY SHOP UNFINISHED - PERIOD!

So, good luck with that, man.


----------



## Rap Hat

Just checked my records; I paid in full on 12/06/2011 with the word from Bernie that it would be done by the new year... . It's now over a year since the guitar has been fully paid and Bernie had the money.

I never got any response from that new guy, and no amount of bugging Bernie like I did from March to August got things to move any faster (though he did promise at one point that the guitar would be shipped in 1 week. Maybe he meant one year?). He also stopped responding after he asked me to pay the balance and I told him it'd been 8 months since I paid. That bothers me the most, because it comes off like he didn't believe me or doesn't have records so he's decided to ignore my build since it's clear he's not getting any more cash out of me.

For anyone coming up to the paying in full point: Don't do it until you *KNOW* the guitar is done. Once he has the cash you have no bargaining chip, nothing to guarantee your guitar will get finished. It's fucking awful it's like this, we shouldn't have to withhold payment just to guarantee our guitars. There's a little voice in my head saying that Bernie will shut down the shop and refuse to offer refunds, and while I don't want to believe it it's worth doing everything you can to avoid getting fucked if it does happen.

Best of luck to everyone in the new year, I hope this situation resolves itself.


----------



## SpaceDock

I was looking through the original dealer sale page that started all of this and found the post below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by
Think im also taking part in this! Waiting on Bernie to give me his paypal so I can send some deposit over, but sounds like its a go!

So excited! Finally getting a 27 fret guitar. Its gonna be the most badass guitar ever.

I also want to say that emailing Bernie has been amazing, how friendly he is and trying to make his customers beyond happy. I think it is obvious to everyone who knows about customshops that BRJ is arguably the best quality to price ratio (esp in the metal/extended range genre), along with being ultra-reliable and well-known thru his family, but ONTOP of all that, he has the best customer service I've ever had from any luthier?? Im blown away. Like someone said before, is this real or just a dream? hah.

I will recommend Bernie to anyone looking for a custom in the future for sure!
Nick, 
Thank you very much for the kind words! I was actually a little worried about seeming a little to "brief" or "short" with all of you. I've received so many emails, it's hard to get extremely detailed with all of them. I was up all night! haha. 

After the sale ends this weekend, I will be sending out spec sheets to everyone who has ordered so that we can confirm all your info, and give you your receipt, of course. 

Thank you guys so much for the support! I will not disappoint you. These guitars are going to be SICK. 

-B

End quote:


I got into this run without realizing it could go so wrong. I wish I wouldnt have gotten into it since I could really use the money now, two years later. I think everyone will get their guitars, but bernie will probably working on these for years to come.

Edit: sorry I can't get the quotes to work better it is from another page.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Knowing it only takes 4 months for a custom shop Mayones =


----------



## JP Universe

^how about 10 - 12 weeks for a Skervesen start to finish


----------



## Hollowway

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I'll tell you - when I made the suggestion to him about my guitar, he basically freaked out on me and in all capslock texted me that NO GUITAR HAS EVER LEFT MY SHOP UNFINISHED - PERIOD!
> 
> So, good luck with that, man.



Yeah, I don't think he'd allow something to go out unfinished, because then it's just going to be finger pointing between the 2nd luthier and the first. I'd be surprised if any luthier allowed that to happen, since they would be worried that they'd be held responsible for someone else's work. 

But, stopping by the shop might still be a good idea, because at least you can see where it is. And if he has a heads up there's a chance he could finish it before you get out there, Khoi. 

Either way, if you get out there and do drop in, make sure and take plenty of pics so we can see whose is near completion.


----------



## downburst82

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Speculum Speculorum*
> 
> 
> _I'll tell you - when I made the suggestion to him about my guitar, he basically freaked out on me and in all capslock texted me that NO GUITAR HAS EVER LEFT MY SHOP UNFINISHED - PERIOD!
> 
> So, good luck with that, man._


Originally posted by hollowway


> Yeah, I don't think he'd allow something to go out unfinished, because then it's just going to be finger pointing between the 2nd luthier and the first. I'd be surprised if any luthier allowed that to happen, since they would be worried that they'd be held responsible for someone else's work.
> 
> But, stopping by the shop might still be a good idea, because at least you can see where it is. And if he has a heads up there's a chance he could finish it before you get out there, Khoi.
> 
> Either way, if you get out there and do drop in, make sure and take plenty of pics so we can see whose is near completion.


USA Bernie Rico Jr 6 String Jekyll Neck Through Body Blank Guitar | eBay

Did we ever figure what this was all about then?

seems like someone smuggled one out of the shop unfinished..


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> Special relationship?



Special? Not really, Chris mentioned that, me and Bernie just had good communication for some time and of course paying in full for 3 orders before they even had started that adds some to that "special" relationship. 



Rap Hat said:


> Just checked my records; I paid in full on 12/06/2011 with the word from Bernie that it would be done by the new year... . It's now over a year since the guitar has been fully paid and Bernie had the money.
> 
> I never got any response from that new guy, and no amount of bugging Bernie like I did from March to August got things to move any faster (though he did promise at one point that the guitar would be shipped in 1 week. Maybe he meant one year?). He also stopped responding after he asked me to pay the balance and I told him it'd been 8 months since I paid. That bothers me the most, because it comes off like he didn't believe me or doesn't have records so he's decided to ignore my build since it's clear he's not getting any more cash out of me.
> 
> For anyone coming up to the paying in full point: Don't do it until you *KNOW* the guitar is done. Once he has the cash you have no bargaining chip, nothing to guarantee your guitar will get finished. It's fucking awful it's like this, we shouldn't have to withhold payment just to guarantee our guitars. There's a little voice in my head saying that Bernie will shut down the shop and refuse to offer refunds, and while I don't want to believe it it's worth doing everything you can to avoid getting fucked if it does happen.
> 
> Best of luck to everyone in the new year, I hope this situation resolves itself.




I SO totally feel you! I am in kinda the same situation with you. 
2 orders of the 3 had problems, cracked fretboard and warped neck and I have already paid in full for them. This is the second email this Chris guy responds to me, so I don't know much about him or who he is and what not.

Honestly, guys we all are in the same boat, we all wait for our guitars to be done in the near future. All we can do is have patience and wait for the best. 
As I mentioned before there are so many guitars that I would have bought if I didn't have "wasted" all these money to BRJs. If I knew it would take so long, I wouldn't even have made the orders or even bothered about BRJs. 

Honestly, what I would like to know is, what they are saying to each other, what they are thinking when they read all these emails. When they talk about orders, etc. Are they laughing? Are they like worried for the whole situation?? 
How do they really feel about the whole situation?? Do they have any guilts, or regrets for all this waiting. 

Was it actually John's fault for all this? Besides Bernie's health problem, regarding that email account with all these orders. Because, I am going to talk about myself, John never caused any problem to me and he would always update me on my orders, always help me out, etc.

Anyway guys, don't know what to say or to think anymore. I just wish I could get my money back and spend them on some other custom shop or some other deals I regret I never got.

I wish everyone a Merry Xmas and Happy Holidays!!


----------



## paddy

In hindsight, now we know why it was called "BLACK" friday.


----------



## finbarohanlon

I am interested in taking it off your hands if you cnt wait any longer
PM me


----------



## MetalDaze

Decided to lob another email over to see what's up (haven't received my promised 24 hour update from Nov 6th).

Here's what I got back:



> Bernie and the whole Rico Jr Guitar would like to wish you a happy holiday.
> 
> 
> Our team are out of office for the holidays and Back on Monday the 7th of January.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Regards Bernie, Chris and the team


----------



## JPMike

MetalDaze said:


> Decided to lob another email over to see what's up (haven't received my promised 24 hour update from Nov 6th).
> 
> Here's what I got back:



In their place, I wouldn't think of holidays. I would feel guilt and try to please my customers.


----------



## SDMFVan

Wow, he's this behind on orders and and still took 2 weeks off for the holidays? What a jagoff.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Color me unsurprised.


----------



## HighGain510

SDMFVan said:


> Wow, he's this behind on orders and and still took 2 weeks off for the holidays? What a jagoff.



Needs some time off from wor..... wait, that's not right.


----------



## JP Universe

You know what.... I think I'm just going to sell my spot and move on.There's far too many other talented builders pumping out guitars a lot quicker that I just don't have interest in this anymore. I remember the excitement I got from purchasing my spot last year and simply it has faded. Unfortunate because this guitar would have been killer

PMed guy a couple of posts up


----------



## Khoi

JP Universe said:


> You know what.... I think I'm just going to sell my spot and move on.There's far too many other talented builders pumping out guitars a lot quicker that I just don't have interest in this anymore. I remember the excitement I got from purchasing my spot last year and simply it has faded. Unfortunate because this guitar would have been killer
> 
> PMed guy a couple of posts up



yup, just listed mine last night. I'm done.

I hope I can even sell it at this point with BRJ's rep


----------



## WickedSymphony

Not that I would take a vacation in this position, and admitted 2 weeks is a bit long, but I don't know how much you can really blame someone for taking time off for holidays to be with family or whatever. Not saying I'm particularly happy about the whole situation, but just another perspective, I guess. 

That said, I've considered selling my spot a few times as well, but I had the same thoughts as Khoi. Especially with it being paid off in full I can't imagine someone wanting to pick it up 

Might as well wait it out, I suppose...


----------



## Fiction

2 weeks is 13 days too long to be spending with family, if anything motivates me to be at work, it's because im not at home


----------



## WickedSymphony

Fiction said:


> 2 weeks is 13 days too long to be spending with family, if anything motivates me to be at work, it's because im not at home



Oh, trust me, I'm the same way. I just don't happen to think that's "normal"


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Hell, even I'm willing to cut the guy a little slack. He apparently did nearly die in the year of 2012 and probably has some extensive post-near-death health stuff happening. So I'm sure that he's spending some time with his family after a really tough year.

HOWEVER - he's got, what? About 160 guitars backlogged that we know about, yes? I'm not Bernie, so I don't know what I'd do if I were in his position, but I think I might put that glass of eggnog down and get some guitars on the move - that is, unless I didn't give one shit about anybody that has the unfortunate happenstance of doing business with me.


----------



## MetalDaze

Speculum Speculorum said:


> some extensive post-near-death health stuff happening


 
Near death?


----------



## HeadBender

I guess this time period while Bernie is away would be the perfect opportunity for the other employees to follow up on the orders, update the Customers, send pictures check the backlog etc etc.


----------



## Danukenator

^HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...*sniff* 

Sorry, that made be laugh.


----------



## JPMike

JP Universe said:


> You know what.... I think I'm just going to sell my spot and move on.There's far too many other talented builders pumping out guitars a lot quicker that I just don't have interest in this anymore. I remember the excitement I got from purchasing my spot last year and simply it has faded. Unfortunate because this guitar would have been killer
> 
> PMed guy a couple of posts up



I am so with you, bro. I might even sell my builds for like less of what I paid. 

I wish I never made an order with BRJ, I am SOOOOOO regretting it. All the money and effort and thinking. Fuck that.


----------



## Khoi

stupid question, but has anyone tried disputing their payment via PayPal?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Khoi said:


> stupid question, but has anyone tried disputing their payment via PayPal?



There's a time limit to being able to file a dispute. Something like 45 days, I believe. So you probably wouldn't get very far with them if you tried to dispute a deposit from years ago.


----------



## Qweklain

WickedSymphony said:


> There's a time limit to being able to file a dispute. Something like 45 days, I believe. So you probably wouldn't get very far with them if you tried to dispute a deposit from years ago.


While that is correct I think, I wonder what would happen if 50+ people all filed against the same merchant at once? Especially when they are all for the same reason and same amount... I don't think PP would just mark as a coincidence...


----------



## elq

A guitar retailer recently had a messy end and the owner seems to have fucked over a lot of people with custom orders that were never placed, despite large deposits being payed months in advance. 

Many people in that debacle were able to convince PayPal and CC companies that they should get a refund as the original order wasn't intended to be filled in the normal dispute window provided by PayPal/Credit Card companies.



It's certainly worth a try.


Also if PayPal sees a flood of complaints for an account in a short window, they will freeze the account while their investigation is pending. Just an FYI.


----------



## mikernaut

I feel like after all this insanity this thread needs a theme song. Kinda like Bennie Hill's


----------



## ikarus

haha, dont choose a themesong based on stereotypes of my country for this fucked up thread. 

Maybe the refund thing is the reason that BRJ doesn't use paypal, he has his own payment system on his site. I was told I can't pay via paypal.


----------



## elq

^ credit card companies tend to be *much* better about refunds than paypal


----------



## Danukenator

I've also noted in the past that if you start a dispute with a credit card company and then get Paypal involved, they become much more cooperative. 

Given the amount of time that has pasted for some people, I'm not sure what is possible.

I'd say if you are concise and polite on the phone and explore all your options, you can usually get some stuff done that's well beyond "normal" operating procedure.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

MetalDaze said:


> Near death?



Yeah, the dude was hospitalized and damn near died. Wasn't that in like, January? Or am I thinking of the previous year? Pretty sure it was like... January or February of last year.


----------



## WickedSymphony

I guess it's possible to make a dispute through PayPal and see what happens. Those that paid directly through Bernie's site should have an easier time though. 

But what about the users that purchased their spots from other members here? I don't see how they could get refunds on the deposit without dragging in the previous owners which would just be a huge mess.


----------



## MJS

I don't see why anyone would want to deal with PayPal or CC companies, when you can easily just sell your spot to someone that would be happy to wait for it, wiping your hands clean of the mess while helping someone else out. 

Also, while it might sound like a fun idea, trying to corner someone with a bunch of charge-backs is a great way to get them to file bankruptcy and just blow everyone off completely to protect their assets. Just something to keep in mind, since trying to financially mess him up will definitely affect everyone... not just the ones doing it.

If anyone's mad enough to want to do it just to hurt Bernie, that's probably a sign that you should have sold your spot about 6 months ago.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I doubt the real inspiration is to somehow hurt Bernie by forcing him to take a loss. As previously stated, I think most are just concerned that they won't be able to sell their spot as it may be already completely paid off, or it might be a custom order coming to well over $2,000. 

Further, as some paid the guitar off well over _a year ago_, I think some people are concerned that his reputation might be starting to get to a point where people aren't going to buy up the spots and risk waiting for an undisclosed amount of time for a luthier who isn't communicative with his customers.


----------



## WickedSymphony

^ Spec nailed it. 

Not that I've committed to selling my spot or anything, but there have certainly been times when I've thought about it, and those are usually my first thoughts. I can't imagine someone wanting to purchase a paid off spot for $2k+ regardless of the current progress just because of the general history you can see throughout this thread.

I don't think anyone intends to go down that route to hurt Bernie as opposed to just wanting to recover their money. 

Also, it certainly doesn't "sound like a fun idea." Having to go through all that BS just to get your money back sounds like a massive headache.


----------



## SpaceDock

This happened with sims, roter, dar, and many others in the past few years alone. You can either wait or give up. If bernie doesn't want to refund you or if you can't sell it, there isn't much you can do. 

I really hope bernie gets these done or gives a refund option in the near future. I think a refund option would be a good deal for him since he could sell the guitars for twice as much now.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Speculum Speculorum said:


> He apparently did nearly die in the year of 2012



Not sure how anyone can take that seriously given how *full of fucking shit* the BRJ camp has been about just about everything from the get go. 

I haven't been around in a month nor here specifically in even longer, but it's.....interesting, yet not surprising this is how things are still going. 

If it was up to me, selling of spots would not be allowed. Do any of you guys who have been waiting for years wish this on anyone? Didn't think so. 

Sorry if I'm being an asshole, not in a great mood.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

^ Probably should have said "allegedly" almost died in early 2012. I was merely being polite. I don't believe a single God-damned word that comes out of that dude's mouth, or anyone who has anything to do with him professionally.

I'm just glad that I got my axe, that it's in really great shape and plays well. I personally think his business should fail, but not before he gives everybody who invested into his business either their guitar or their money back. He's a total sheister, that one.


----------



## JPMike

ikarus said:


> haha, dont choose a themesong based on stereotypes of my country for this fucked up thread.
> 
> Maybe the refund thing is the reason that BRJ doesn't use paypal, he has his own payment system on his site. I was told I can't pay via paypal.



+1

Exactly, I never paid through paypal.

I love this vid. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVeEBn0BXGE


----------



## Qweklain

JPMike said:


> +1
> 
> Exactly, I never paid through paypal.
> 
> I love this vid.



That "cut" he does at the end of the video... He should "cut" this fiasco by refunding us our money and ending this mess...


----------



## JP Universe

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not sure how anyone can take that seriously given how *full of fucking shit* the BRJ camp has been about just about everything from the get go.
> 
> I haven't been around in a month nor here specifically in even longer, but it's.....interesting, yet not surprising this is how things are still going.
> 
> If it was up to me, selling of spots would not be allowed. Do any of you guys who have been waiting for years wish this on anyone? Didn't think so.
> 
> Sorry if I'm being an asshole, not in a great mood.



Disclaimer - In no way am I defending Bernie or his actions just going to share my experience 

I think anyone that buys a spot knows what they're in for by now.... It's no secret  There are plenty of folks willing to wait to score a good deal on a BRJ. I remember buying my spot after reading this thread and was willing to accept it wouldn't be done until 2014.... I can only speak for myself but Bernies been fine with me so far. Responded to me getting my spot and answered a few questions about adding a finish. Emailed me to ask for the electronics and they responded after I asked them for an update a month ago (In no way am I defending him, just sharing my experience)

In saying that I probably will be selling my spot.  

I really empathise with the guys that have gone full custom though and have no way out and it's WRONG for BRJ to ask for the full amount a year before the guitar is done.... that irks me and it really puts the customer on the back foot

Bernies communication I can say has been better than a few builders who get all kinds of praise. I won't name any names but there have been a few who didn't get back to me on a quote or didn't respond. 

Point is you will receive your guitars at the end of the day..... things got out of control and now he has 150 guitars to finish off. Sucks


----------



## elq

JP Universe said:


> Bernies communication I can say has been better than a few builders who get all kinds of praise. I won't name any names but there have been a few who didn't get back to me on a quote or didn't respond.



I can see what you're saying here, but I'd rather hear no response than bullshit...


----------



## WickedSymphony

JP Universe said:


> Bernies communication I can say has been better than a few builders who get all kinds of praise. I won't name any names but there have been a few who didn't get back to me on a quote or didn't respond.



*Slightly* different when it's for a quote compared to people who've already paid off their instruments.


----------



## JP Universe

^^ In my personal experience there has been no bullshit..... But yeah in general 

Yep, it's not right that people have paid in full get no communication. I was asked to put my final payment in when the finish gets applied and that aint happening.

It's funny (not haha funny) that everytime this thread gets some pics some hope comes and then when there's no movement the panic begins....


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JP Universe said:


> Point is you will receive your guitars at the end of the day....



And those guitars will possibly have wrong specs and defects. Don't forget to sub the "day" in there with "decade".  

Once again, sorry to be ants at the picnic.


----------



## Hollowway

I always expect to see more NGDs on here than there are. Are people getting guitars and not posting them? I would think that most of us post as soon as we get anything new.


----------



## JP Universe

Yeah that worries me... Where are all the NGD's? Surely most of the BRJ buying public are on here and I don't see too many new postings on Facebook with new guitars.


----------



## JPMike

I have to agree that whenever I see a BRJ NGD or some photo in this thread I get hope. But really when you pay in full and always something postpones the guitar's completion that freaks me out. Two of my guitars had defects and had to be redone. If the area you work is not climate friendly for guitars/wood/whatever, move somewhere else. 

As I have said before, I wish I knew what B and the crew that's working with him, really think and feel of the whole situation. Two weeks off with a 150 guitar backlog, it's unprofessional to me. I would be super anxious and take advantage of the holidays and work my ass off. 

We have been talking about this all the time, what should happen, what's going on, etc. Whatever we going to say, we can't really do nothing, just wait. I am going to wait until the given dates I was told by Chris. If by that time, my guitars won't be done, I might be selling the spots.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

The weirdest part to me is that everybody starts getting super excited every time there's a NGD from BRJ, and there's a tendency to believe "the flood gates have opened" and we will all be seeing our guitars in the very near future.

And then a month passes, and there's a sudden flood of activity on this thread where no one has heard a damn thing at all, and everybody gets pissed again, and then there's a NGD again and we wash, rinse, repeat.

BTW - there were a couple NGD's months ago where the people said that there were massive build flaws that were almost criminal - we were supposed to see an NGD on an 8-banger over in Italy (I believe) and another one. What interests me is finding out what kinds of flaws we were talking about there.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Yeh, I'm curious as to why this is the case. Not the fact that people get excited when guitars start popping up, but why it is that 2-3 guitars ship out every 6-8 weeks, along with a few more progress shots of others, then nothing. It's really strange that such few guitars come out in such infrequent bursts.

And I'd also like to hear about the flaws people found in their instruments. The only one I can think of that was really bad was Hollowway's 8. I think you're right about the 8 string in Italy though; it was the purple one, right?


----------



## AndyLunt

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I think that one's owned by Francesco Filigoi, I remember him posting about it on facebook and waiting for the ngd thread, but never saw it =(, and then saw him mention that it had some mega flaws, now I'm even more curious!


----------



## paddy

yes, all NGD's mean is that he's not dead and therefore can build guitars in his own pace.


----------



## ikarus

Has anyone else got a spam mail from Bernies email adress? I ve seen in the cc that other people got it too. Nolly, Thrasher,... It kinda confuses me. Its just a void page with a link to a strange site. Better not open it.


----------



## toiletstand

yeah i got it too. he probably clicked the same link from someone else.


----------



## EOT

ikarus said:


> Has anyone else got a spam mail from Bernies email adress? I ve seen in the cc that other people got it too. Nolly, Thrasher,... It kinda confuses me. Its just a void page with a link to a strange site. Better not open it.



Yep. Somebody hack his account?


----------



## themike

ikarus said:


> Has anyone else got a spam mail from Bernies email adress? I ve seen in the cc that other people got it too. Nolly, Thrasher,... It kinda confuses me. Its just a void page with a link to a strange site. Better not open it.


 
"Ugh, I can't take all these emails...... hmm - I know! I'll sending them all a phishing virus!"


----------



## toiletstand

hahahah


----------



## Andrew11

Ya, I got it too.

Anybody hear from Bernie about it?


----------



## MetalDaze

Should I be worried that I didn't get the spam? 

Man, it sucks not knowing what is going on.


----------



## killertone

Got the spam, too. Didn't click the link and deleted the email.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Me too! I saw that I had an email from Bernie and when I opened it I was like WTF! For a minute I was excited hoping to hear some news about the guitar. Oh well.... better luck next time.


----------



## msalazar

I got it too


----------



## elq

is Bernie using yahoo mail? Yahoo Mail Allegedly Hacked via XSS Exploit


----------



## MetalDaze

Darn it, Bernie....don't click those links!


----------



## WickedSymphony

I didn't get an e-mail from Bernie. For once I suppose that's a good thing!


----------



## JerichoCheng

still didnt get any email / reply from Bernie or ChrisG :/


----------



## Adrian-XI

elq said:


> is Bernie using yahoo mail? Yahoo Mail Allegedly Hacked via XSS Exploit



Yeah he is using yahoo. I didn't get any emails though, hope that's not a bad thing...


----------



## glassmoon0fo

I got an email, and I havn't been on the BF list since spring haha. I havn't been here since this is supposed to be for those with a horse in the BRJ race, right? I assume we've just givin up on that and let anyone who wants hang around to help bitch? Look, we all know I'm pretty much indefferent to the crap that's going on at the shop, but it does kind of bother me that people that never had a BF order on hand AND mods are in here helping work people up. Flame or neg me if I'm wrong, if you must, just something I'd think about were I still in you guys' positions. Regardless, I hope you all get as good a rico as I did...at some point at least haha.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

glassmoon0fo said:


> I got an email, and I havn't been on the BF list since spring haha. I havn't been here since this is supposed to be for those with a horse in the BRJ race, right? I assume we've just givin up on that and let anyone who wants hang around to help bitch? Look, we all know I'm pretty much indefferent to the crap that's going on at the shop, but it does kind of bother me that people that never had a BF order on hand AND mods are in here helping work people up. Flame or neg me if I'm wrong, if you must, just something I'd think about were I still in you guys' positions. Regardless, I hope you all get as good a rico as I did...at some point at least haha.



Call me out all you want. It's not going to make anything better, or worse, just as nothing I really have to say will make a lick of difference regarding much of anything. 

Are we still at the phase of "if everyone is angry no guitars will ship"? I think that ship set sail long ago. 

As I've already said, I'm done pruning this thread. I'm simply all out of fucks to give.


----------



## MetalDaze




----------



## MetalThrasher

MaxOfMetal said:


> Call me out all you want. It's not going to make anything better, or worse, just as nothing I really have to say will make a lick of difference regarding much of anything.
> 
> Are we still at the phase of "if everyone is angry no guitars will ship"? I think that ship set sail long ago.
> 
> As I've already said, I'm done pruning this thread. I'm simply all out of fucks to give.



LOL. Hopefully, some of us will be seeing a guitar soon................. Somehow, some way I have hope.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

MaxOfMetal said:


> Call me out all you want. It's not going to make anything better, or worse, just as nothing I really have to say will make a lick of difference regarding much of anything.
> 
> Are we still at the phase of "if everyone is angry no guitars will ship"? I think that ship set sail long ago.
> 
> As I've already said, I'm done pruning this thread. I'm simply all out of fucks to give.



Nothing personal, max. Youve been nothing bet helpful throughout my years here and i hate to see you run out of fucks over something none of us have any control over. Stay classy, is all im saying guys. The wait (or selling process ) would probably be a lot easier of a deal if you guys werent all in here every other day talking about how bad you want resoloution and speculating at what new ways bernies probably screwing you over. But fuck me for trying to bring a mature prospective. I'll let you guys get back to your black panther party now haha.


----------



## themike

Change of thought - this post doesn't exist :waves hand:


----------



## MetalDaze

Website down again.


----------



## spawnsc

thought I would come by and see how things are going with the guitars and looks like nothing has changed, i've been waiting for a long time to and really thinking about speaking with my CC to get my refund. I've tried selling my spot with no luck and I hate to say it but Bernie really hurt his reputation with all of this. I've tried calling, emailing, and get no responses other then one back in November from Chris saying he will have me a update within 24 hours... well its been 1,920 hours lol


----------



## Lirtle

Just got this email. He said he's waiting on cases but im pretty stoked.


----------



## spawnsc

well thats good news! least we know his still alive how long you been waiting?


----------



## SpaceDock

Maybe he'll be rejuvenated now after the holidays. I'd really like to see some progress on my builds. I am having to sell all of my other guitars to buy a house and my money is all wrapped up in these. I don't want to sell them, I want to rock them.


----------



## Larrikin666

I just picked up another slot. I will literally be swimming in guitars when this is all said and done.


----------



## mikernaut

Hah Larrikin, you have some crazy faith.  how many is that now?


----------



## Larrikin666

mikernaut said:


> Hah Larrikin, you have some crazy faith.  how many is that now?



I actually added another between my post and now. That'll be the one I have, a blue denim 624, my purple 627, orange 827, white 627, and two full customs that haven't even been fully spec'd out yet. 7 total I believe.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Damn, dude. When you get them all in about 10-20 years from now you can start a BRJ orchestra.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Damn, dude. When you get them all in about 10-20 years from now you can start a BRJ orchestra.



Yup. Haha. My KxK is supposed to be done in a few weeks. I also have to Strandberg copies being made. I have issues.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

I was wondering about that. You should probably start contructing a new room in your house for storing all these guitars


----------



## Jexey

Just to keep the faith going... got an invoice and this pic in the email. Still waiting on an itemized invoice and to verify the right pickups are in there before any NGD.


----------



## Hollowway

Larrikin666 said:


> Yup. Haha. My KxK is supposed to be done in a few weeks. I also have to Strandberg copies being made. I have issues.



Which KxK is that? A custom or from a run?


----------



## mikernaut

HRC51 don't get me wrong , I love my Brj's quality but I hate the total BS behind the scenes/excuses and at this point and by posting what you did, makes it sound like it's "us the consumers" are in the wrong.
BAD NEWS: there is a whole thread on sevenstring.org about these guitars. Lots of complaining about the wait.

GOOD NEWS: When people do get their guitars, they rave and are very happy with them. Worth the wait!

I guess I'm saying it could have been worded a bit better.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ well he is trying to sell the spot.


----------



## HRC51

I can see how my phrasing of lots of complaining about the wait would me mis-interpreted. 

It was not meant to be a negative reflection on the customers at all! The fact is the wait is excessive and disappointing. The complaining is completely justified. I'll edit my classified.

Sorry about that. I'm not trying to mislead anyone.


----------



## technomancer

*Just a heads up folks, this is not the classifieds and the next person that tries to sell a spot in this thread is going to get a LONG break from the site*


----------



## Larrikin666

Stealthdjentstic said:


> I was wondering about that. You should probably start contructing a new room in your house for storing all these guitars



This is why I have a two bedroom apartment all to myself. Real talk. 



Hollowway said:


> Which KxK is that? A custom or from a run?



My purple KxK 7 scale. It shall be glorious.


----------



## Rook

Chad you're totally mental.

I guess you're the ideal BRJ customer, you have contact with him don't you?

That orange 827 looks ridiculous too. In a good way.


----------



## Larrikin666

Rook said:


> Chad you're totally mental.
> 
> I guess you're the ideal BRJ customer, you have contact with him don't you?
> 
> That orange 827 looks ridiculous too. In a good way.




Yeah. We'd speak on the phone 3 or 4 times a week for a few months. That died down quite a bit recently.


----------



## MetalDaze

Bernie must be pissed at me. I haven't heard anything in a long time about my two orders.


----------



## JP Universe

Larrikin666 said:


> Yup. Haha. My KxK is supposed to be done in a few weeks. I also have to Strandberg copies being made. I have issues.


 
 Don't we all. Thanks for making my guitar purchasing sound reasonable in comparison to you 

OT - I think I'm gonna hang on to my spot. The amount of pain that I feel when my guitar is all said and done will hurt too much.... even if that's in 2015.


----------



## MJS

If this thread went back to "customers only," Larrikin would be the only person allowed to post in it since he seems to have bought everyone's place in line.


----------



## infernalservice

elq said:


> Many people in that debacle were able to convince PayPal and CC companies that they should get a refund as the original order wasn't intended to be filled in the normal dispute window provided by PayPal/Credit Card companies.




Whether you paid thru paypal using a credit card, or internally to bernie with a card, just go directly to the cc company. they will be more willing to reverse the transaction as a charge back. it cuts paypal out at the middle man.


----------



## HeadBender

Did anyone receive any reply from them?


----------



## spawnsc

i've had no reply from Bernie or Chris since November


----------



## mikernaut

I emailed Chris on thursday, haven't heard anything yet. I sent them some BKP's and a case for my rebuild ( over a month ago.) hoping it was close to being ready to go. ( foolish me)


----------



## JPMike

I have lost hope of getting any answer back from them, so I am just going to wait, until I get surprised by some email that my guitar is ready. lol.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Havn't seen many vids posted of these guitars in action, so I thought I'd share mine here. I'm a bit low in the mix (don't really have the ability to record a mono track of just me, plus I like the one-shot type of cover), but it's there and I don't think I could have had a better run of this. Hopefully it'll renew some faith or something  Hoping for the best for all you guys still waiting!


----------



## MetalDaze

I've been thinking about writing a song called, "Waiting for my Rico".

Here's an idea for the chorus:



> Waiting for my Rico, is it real or just a dream?
> Waiting for my Rico, my blood's about to steam
> Waiting for my Rico, how many years can it be?
> Waiting for my Rico, it leads to my misery


----------



## spawnsc

think i'm going to call Bernie now ...

"Hello thank you for calling Bernie Rico guitars, i'm either busy or working on some guitars leave me a message and i'll get back to you soon.." *beep* *beep* 

can't even leave him a voice mail any more.


----------



## Danukenator

It would be more fitting to release a demo of the song in it's early stages and then never finish it.


----------



## MetalDaze

Instead of bitching, I thought I'd try to add some humor


----------



## HeadBender

MetalDaze said:


> Instead of bitching, I thought I'd try to add some humor



Make sure you rebuild it at least twice and in the end it should contain some misspelt words.


----------



## Danukenator

Play the song into the machine! Someone did that for to the Westboro Baptist Church.


----------



## spawnsc

it just worries me that his site is down, no facebook updates, no returned emails, can't leave him a voice mail, ect..


----------



## MetalDaze

spawnsc said:


> it just worries me that his site is down, no facebook updates, no returned emails, can't leave him a voice mail, ect..


 
I agree....those are all bad signs. But, it's all happened before and then he emerges from the darkness at some point. 

I'm not sure which product slogan fits best:

- Timex (takes a licking and keeps on ticking)
- Energizer (keeps on going....)


----------



## Might-is-Right

spawnsc said:


> it just worries me that his site is down, no facebook updates, no returned emails, can't leave him a voice mail, ect..



Business meetings!


----------



## SpaceDock

I think someone who knows Bernie a little better, cough cough Larrikan666, should help us out by cutting through the bs and finding out wtf is happening over there.


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> I think someone who knows Bernie a little better, cough cough Larrikan666, should help us out by cutting through the bs and finding out wtf is happening over there.



Amen!


----------



## Hollowway

Wow, the site's down?! How long has that been the case? Hopefully it's just an oversight, and it'll be back up soon. Though that is worrisome.


----------



## Khoi

the site has been down for over a week now, which is interesting considering NAMM is coming up at the end of the month


----------



## spawnsc

yeah it would be awesome if someone could get a little inside scoop on whats going on, I just think it sucks that he doesn't update his customers on his status, at least when he was posting guitars on facebook I knew he was working but his not updated since november.


----------



## Larrikin666

I'll see what I can do guys.


----------



## spawnsc

Larrikin666 said:


> I'll see what I can do guys.



thanks!


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Damn what did we do to deserve this? Between this and another custom luthier I have learned my lesson for who to and not to order from. Craps.


----------



## MetalDaze

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> Damn what did we do to deserve this? Between this and another custom luthier I have learned my lesson for who to and not to order from. Craps.


 
Yeah, prior to the whole Black Friday thing, NGD's from BRJ were filled with nothing but praise. 

That's why I jumped on. The guitars looked great, people seemed happy with them, and Bernie was responsive to answering emails. It was Nolly's Jekyll that sealed the deal for me (nice job, Nolly ).

Anyway, that was then and this is now. I wish the old days were back.


----------



## spawnsc

I think he should send out refund opportunities to help take the load off of him, and give people who are frustrated a chance to get their money back.


----------



## elq

MetalDaze said:


> It was Nolly's Jekyll that sealed the deal for me (nice job, Nolly ).



And Nolly's Jekyll was problematic enough to end Nolly's relationship with Bernie, so perhaps we all should take any praise given a guitar with a grain of salt.


----------



## WickedSymphony

elq said:


> And Nolly's Jekyll was problematic enough to end Nolly's relationship with Bernie, so perhaps we all should take any praise given a guitar with a grain of salt.



If it's ok to ask, what ever happened with that?


----------



## chimp_spanner

It's a real shame this is all still going on. Some of you probably wondered why I never played a note on mine, and while I won't go into details suffice it to say the guitar was not playable and the contact gradually reduced to nothing. A very good friend of mine now owns the guitar and is rocking it after what I understand was a partial rebuild. I gave it to him as he gave me my 7420. The universe is balanced once more.


----------



## elq

that's Nolly's story to tell. 


But here's one thing to consider, after spending months (or years) waiting for a guitar as long as something isn't grossly wrong, you're going to be excited to have it. This is not the best time to give an objective opinion on a guitar. The honeymoon phase is a powerful logic corruptor.

If someone is still thrilled about a guitar 6 months later, that's telling.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Fair enough, I suppose.

Though I feel that for me at least, part of the frustration from this whole situation has already eroded some of that excitement I would have had in the honeymoon phase, and I'm going to be even more critical of the instrument when I receive it. 

I know a lot of people have been thrilled with their BRJs, just as there have been others like yourself with the complete opposite experience. I'm only hoping that it's one of those guitars, like you said, that I remain excited about months later which has luckily been the case with my last few.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

MetalDaze said:


> Yeah, prior to the whole Black Friday thing, NGD's from BRJ were filled with nothing but praise.
> 
> That's why I jumped on. The guitars looked great, people seemed happy with them, and Bernie was responsive to answering emails. It was Nolly's Jekyll that sealed the deal for me (nice job, Nolly ).
> 
> Anyway, that was then and this is now. I wish the old days were back.



I could not have said it better myself. Nolly sold his Rico I think, and I saw a clip of a guy recording with it on youtube. It's heavy as fuck, and makes me want one. Sad as shit.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

elq said:


> And Nolly's Jekyll was problematic enough to end Nolly's relationship with Bernie, so perhaps we all should take any praise given a guitar with a grain of salt.



Yeah after reading that thread I came to the realization that all people getting free guitars from builders will always pimp them even if they've been long time posters here...because at the end of the day they're still endorsees.


----------



## spawnsc

Any updates?


----------



## MetalDaze

Nope and website still down.


----------



## -Nolly-

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Yeah after reading that thread I came to the realization that all people getting free guitars from builders will always pimp them even if they've been long time posters here...because at the end of the day they're still endorsees.



Yeah I won't make that mistake again


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Not blaming you, I dont think anyone saw this coming because BRJ seemed very established. Especially with his families history and all :/


----------



## SnowfaLL

Well, I got an email from Bernie around October saying he would still build my guitar if I wanted (I havent been able to get a hold of him for like a year, the last time I talked we put it on hold) and I emailed back after a month of thought, I rather not. He could use one guitar off his "list" and I don't really have the faith anymore to receive what I originally thought.. Plus Im content with what I have now, don't need more.

Thankfully due to an error in his paypal back then, most of my inital deposit was refunded, all he has left is $200 of my money. I emailed back in November saying I understand if he would like a slight "restocking fee" or something (even though nothing was mentioned of that sort at the beginning) - but I'd ideally like some of that back, if possible. No email back yet. Whats the vegas odds on me getting anything back? lol

You know, Its amazing I have any faith at all to go with small builders (like im doing hopefully this month) - I've so far somehow worked with Chris Woods, Patrick Sims, Bernie Rico Jr, and etc. I just have all the luck eh? Thankfully, my next build hopefully, I met the person face to face a few times and trust him to not screw me over.


----------



## Sepultorture

NickCormier said:


> Well, I got an email from Bernie around October saying he would still build my guitar if I wanted (I havent been able to get a hold of him for like a year, the last time I talked we put it on hold) and I emailed back after a month of thought, I rather not. He could use one guitar off his "list" and I don't really have the faith anymore to receive what I originally thought.. Plus Im content with what I have now, don't need more.
> 
> Thankfully due to an error in his paypal back then, most of my inital deposit was refunded, all he has left is $200 of my money. I emailed back in November saying I understand if he would like a slight "restocking fee" or something (even though nothing was mentioned of that sort at the beginning) - but I'd ideally like some of that back, if possible. No email back yet. Whats the vegas odds on me getting anything back? lol
> 
> You know, Its amazing I have any faith at all to go with small builders (like im doing hopefully this month) - I've so far somehow worked with Chris Woods, Patrick Sims, Bernie Rico Jr, and etc. I just have all the luck eh? Thankfully, my next build hopefully, I met the person face to face a few times and trust him to not screw me over.



you mean Brian?


----------



## SpaceDock

Even after all of this, I will stay optimistic. I hope they have turned off the phones and shut down the website to get through the hump and keep away from distractions. I know there was a lot of talk of new directions and big plans for the future of Rico Jr, but all of the stuff in the que would prevent them from starting fresh. 

Maybe I'm crazy, but what a wonderful dream.


----------



## WickedSymphony

It would just be nice if we could get some kind of update when this stuff happens instead of being left in the dark each time.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

@ Nick - No, you will never see that money again, and will likely never hear from BRJ so long as you live. He has a habit of weeding out people who aren't drinking the kool-aid, and that group is getting smaller these days.

@ Space - Businesses that need to catch up put into action an actual plan to communicate with it's base. BRJ is acting more like a failing business than anything else.

There were some unforeseen emergency circumstances that contributed to this mess, but something we all should come to terms with is that there is a large portion of the problem that has to do with it's owner and operator. Why should we believe that literally all of his helpers were just slackers, complete messes, or burn-outs that couldn't take the heat of the job? The old adage applies here: The only common link in all your failed relationships is you. I'm going out on a limb here and saying that Bernie is difficult to work with, and that's why he can't keep help around long enough to get anything sorted out.

The dude literally knew he was in deeper than hell and continued to personally take build orders and quote completely irresponsible and impossible build times. This is not the behavior or a man who cares on iota about the people that make up his clientele.


----------



## spawnsc

i'm just sick of being in the dark and thats enough for me to never do business with him again. I just wish I could get my money back but now I have to wait an eternity to get my guitar. 

He should just swallow his pride and offer a refund to his customers who want it and then spend the time working on the ones that want his guitars.


----------



## SnowfaLL

Sepultorture said:


> you mean Brian?



Yea, Hoping to get on his list for his next run. Meeting someone in person gives you much more confidence in them; not to mention being able to hold his guitars, see they are everything they claim to be (amazing), and when I come in the door everytime, hes sitting on the couch installing pickups or working on SOMETHING customer guitar-related; Hes not dicking around. So hopefully (and I have 100% confidence) Bowes will be my first successful custom experience lol - If I get in there, his wait list is pretty long, and Im right near his cutoff for the next batch I believe, fingers crossed

Yea, I wont hear from Bernie for another year or so I bet lol But we'll see. Hes a nice guy, great to talk to on the phone, I think he just bit off WAYYY more than he could chew and had a total collapse.. I do generally think he means well, and isnt a crook like Chris Woods and Patrick Sims.


----------



## kmanick

elq said:


> that's Nolly's story to tell.
> 
> 
> But here's one thing to consider, after spending months (or years) waiting for a guitar as long as something isn't grossly wrong, you're going to be excited to have it. This is not the best time to give an objective opinion on a guitar. The honeymoon phase is a powerful logic corruptor.
> 
> If someone is still thrilled about a guitar 6 months later, that's telling.


I try to stay away form this thread as much as I can cause I feel so terrible for all of you guys still waiting and still in the dark.
ELQ,
I'm going on a little more than a year and 1/2 of owning mine and I've had literally zero issues with mine at all and still madly love this thing.
Still one of the nicest if not "the" nicest 7 I've owned (and most of you guys has seen all of the 7's I've gone thru over the last 8 years  ).
I thank my lucky stars that I got mine before all of this shit started to go down.
Zimbloths BRJs were all also killer.
Playing his (many times ) was what made me decide to go this route in the first place. (and at the time I had a smoking Carvin DC727 and an Ibby J-custom 8527DK-B, Nicks Vixens had amazing necks on them)
There was a time when this company was putting out some amazing guitars.
I don't know what the fuck hapened here, it's a major travesty.


----------



## JPMike

So I guess, if BRJ goes down, I lose like, 9k... Wish I hadn't sold my Suhrs back then to get these builds going... In any case, not sure what's going on.


----------



## mikernaut

I must have missed what happened with Nolly's guitar. Was there a thread that explains the situation or would Nolly want to chime in if possible about what went down?

Francesco seemed to have a similar scenario and never posted his NGD

update- My question was answered


----------



## Qweklain

Well I got a reply back from Bernie regarding my "I need to see completed pics before I pay up" and well... holy fuck is all I can say.

I asked for him to reply asking for a shipping address to my other e-mail (I changed e-mails) so we shall see how long it takes. Hopefully it will actually ship out within a week of me paying!


----------



## JPMike

Qweklain said:


> Well I got a reply back from Bernie regarding my "I need to see completed pics before I pay up" and well... holy fuck is all I can say.
> 
> I asked for him to reply asking for a shipping address to my other e-mail (I changed e-mails) so we shall see how long it takes. Hopefully it will actually ship out within a week of me paying!



Nice one, how long you have been waiting for your guitar?


----------



## Qweklain

JPMike said:


> Nice one, how long you have been waiting for your guitar?


I am a member of the Black Friday club, so however long that is... 2.25 years now??


----------



## SpaceDock

Club, more like support group, lol


----------



## kmanick

cool!!
what is calling that burst ? I like the green edges.
2 1/4 years and this is the first pic you've seen of it??
WTF?????
I'm amazed none of you guys have taken legal action yet.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Qweklain said:


> Well I got a reply back from Bernie regarding my "I need to see completed pics before I pay up" and well... holy fuck is all I can say.
> 
> I asked for him to reply asking for a shipping address to my other e-mail (I changed e-mails) so we shall see how long it takes. Hopefully it will actually ship out within a week of me paying!



Oh mah gaaawl that looks sick! Damn, I'm doing the same thing. Trust but verify. Exclamation point on the verify. I'm probably way behind most of you guys, with a full custom getting a rebuild, but the last message a while back was out of wood shop by Christmas. Maybe the last month plus of zero news and down website means shit is getting done. I am going through a Flying Dog Shock and Awe case while I'm typing this.


----------



## HeadBender

Qweklain said:


> Well I got a reply back from Bernie regarding my "I need to see completed pics before I pay up" and well... holy fuck is all I can say.
> 
> I asked for him to reply asking for a shipping address to my other e-mail (I changed e-mails) so we shall see how long it takes. Hopefully it will actually ship out within a week of me paying!



Looks nice, but damn...I hate this:
- Nice picture and an update = my (and most of our) hope gets again a bit higher, then again the same sh*t: no reply or update for the most of us....


----------



## UnderTheSign

Qweklain said:


> Well I got a reply back from Bernie regarding my "I need to see completed pics before I pay up" and well... holy fuck is all I can say.
> 
> I asked for him to reply asking for a shipping address to my other e-mail (I changed e-mails) so we shall see how long it takes. Hopefully it will actually ship out within a week of me paying!


Nice pic, no strap buttons though?


----------



## spawnsc

looks nice but we as his customers deserve some updates of some form.. even if he said "it will be 5 years before you get your guitar" least thats an honest answer instead of going in the shadows, unplugging the phone, not answering emails and making all of us feel like fools for doing business with him. Just not good business practice.


----------



## Battousai

just gonna copy what i posted on the dealers and group buys sections as i have been advised to come to this thread .

I ordered a guitar from bernie rico last year .. and i had to ask him to pause the build as i had lost my job. and i couldnt afford the second payment ( i paid half of the build up front $1500 with a credit card.).he said ok he'll holdon the build until im doin better. now ive settled in a new job and wanted to continue it.. now im trying to call him it goes to voicemail, sent emails to him, and on the facebook page.. then i go online.. and his website is down. what the hell am i supposed to do ?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ sit back and wait with the rest of us?


----------



## Phrygian

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Yeah after reading that thread I came to the realization that all people getting free guitars from builders will always pimp them even if they've been long time posters here...because at the end of the day they're still endorsees.



I must have missed this, anyone have a link to that thread?


----------



## SpaceDock

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...rnie-rico-jr-jekyll-727-w-bkps-lots-pics.html


----------



## Phrygian

Oh, I thought there was a thread where Nolly mentioned the issues he found so I got curious, but there's nothing Of it In that thread. Oh well


----------



## Battousai

i dont think theres any issue with that guitar apart from the wierd lonely tuner on the other side of the headstock.. that guitar was sold to a friend of mine and what made me decide to order a a 7 string rico in the first place cos it felt and sounded amazing. the irony


----------



## Qweklain

UnderTheSign said:


> Nice pic, no strap buttons though?


Whhhaaaaaaat?!?! I did not even notice that... 

*le sigh*


----------



## SpaceDock

^ it would take ten minutes to do strap buttons, I wish mine were this far along and I paid a year ago.


----------



## Qweklain

SpaceDock said:


> ^ *it would take ten minutes to do strap buttons*, I wish mine were this far along and I paid a year ago.


I imagine that time frame is in non-Bernie time, right? 

Regardless, it should not be something I need to do/have done.


----------



## Fiction

No strap buttons?! Re-build!


----------



## Walterson

UnderTheSign said:


> Nice pic, no strap buttons though?






Fiction said:


> No strap buttons?! Re-build!











Need some glasses?


----------



## Fiction

I didn't actually look, it was just a joke, after reading the next few posts.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Dont you know, no jokes in Germany.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Battousai said:


> i dont think theres any issue with that guitar apart from the wierd lonely tuner on the other side of the headstock.. that guitar was sold to a friend of mine and what made me decide to order a a 7 string rico in the first place cos it felt and sounded amazing. the irony


 
ok, this makes me think that maybe someone isn't being truthful here. Is the guitar %100 flawless or unplayable? We've heard at least 3 times now that some Ricos have had unforgiveable flaws or something along those lines, but no explinations or anything to back them up, and all from high-profile members here who are not, or no longer, endorsees of Bernie's. If I was unhappy with anyone's guitar, Rico, Vik, KxK or otherwise, I'd have no problem stating that. Am I missing something?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Woah, woah, woah! Back the truck up. From my understanding, the only reason Nolly didn't keep that guitar is because it wasn't ultimately up his alley. Nothing wrong with the instrument.

Elq was quite detailed with his description of what was wrong with his guitar. Francesco doesn't make it on here very much, and perhaps he has been trying to work it out with BRJ. I think anybody who is a "high-profile" member here has been pretty up-front about the issues they've had with their respective builds when there have been problems.

Even though I've bitched quite a bit, it's always been about the customer service end of working with Bernie. The guitar plays fucking awesome - the only issues were that he finished the back and neck wrong, and it was set up like a five-year-old did the job, but it's still a great damn guitar. He also welched on a partial refund that he promised me due to the issues with the build.

Basically, the silence you are hearing from these people is the polite way of not doing business with a guy like him - you just walk away and never say anything again. If anybody asks you, you give them some PC answer like "Oh, it's a shame how things have gone with ____. He used to build such nice instruments".

Most of the time endorsees and things don't want to do damage to their business contacts because it doesn't look good on them. I just don't personally care. The guy has hosed a bunch of people and others need to know about it. But then again, I'm not touring the world in an up-and-coming underground hard rock group. So.... it is what it is.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Walterson said:


> Need some glasses?


All I saw was this pic...


----------



## Invader

Speculum Speculorum said:


> From my understanding, the only reason Nolly didn't keep that guitar is because it wasn't ultimately up his alley. Nothing wrong with the instrument.



False.


----------



## Birdman

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Dont you know, no jokes in Germany.



great joke man


----------



## Lirtle

Invader said:


> False.



Care to elaborate?


Sidenote: Bernie just e-mailed me. Once he gets cases from g&g my guitar will ship.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well then fuck me. What was the problem?


----------



## spawnsc

Lirtle said:


> Care to elaborate?
> 
> 
> Sidenote: Bernie just e-mailed me. Once he gets cases from g&g my guitar will ship.



wish he would email all of us back with some updates, i was told I would have a 24 hour update and that was back in november from Chris G.

"my name is Chris G and I am the newly appointed production
manager at Rico jr Guitars.
I have come onboard and am putting in new systems which will make the
production process run smoother and give you tools to track the
production process
I will get a proper update for you within 24 hours.
Thank you for your patience"


----------



## Hollowway

spawnsc said:


> I will get a proper update for you within 24 hours.
> Thank you for your patience"



Well, in his defense he meant 24 Plutonian hours. 

I know we all want updates, but now I'm also hoping that the radio-silence is due to everyone there shutting off the phones and getting down to business. That would be awesome.


----------



## spawnsc

Hollowway said:


> Well, in his defense he meant 24 Plutonian hours.
> 
> I know we all want updates, but now I'm also hoping that the radio-silence is due to everyone there shutting off the phones and getting down to business. That would be awesome.



I agree but they should give us some kinda formal update that they will not be responding to emails, phone calls, or what ever instead of shutting us in the dark. Makes it look like his out of business and we just lost our money. He needs to also get his web site up which also makes the situation look bad.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Woah, woah, woah! Back the truck up. From my understanding, the only reason Nolly didn't keep that guitar is because it wasn't ultimately up his alley. Nothing wrong with the instrument.
> 
> Elq was quite detailed with his description of what was wrong with his guitar. Francesco doesn't make it on here very much, and perhaps he has been trying to work it out with BRJ. I think anybody who is a "high-profile" member here has been pretty up-front about the issues they've had with their respective builds when there have been problems.
> 
> Even though I've bitched quite a bit, it's always been about the customer service end of working with Bernie. The guitar plays fucking awesome - the only issues were that he finished the back and neck wrong, and it was set up like a five-year-old did the job, but it's still a great damn guitar. He also welched on a partial refund that he promised me due to the issues with the build.
> 
> Basically, the silence you are hearing from these people is the polite way of not doing business with a guy like him - you just walk away and never say anything again. If anybody asks you, you give them some PC answer like "Oh, it's a shame how things have gone with ____. He used to build such nice instruments".
> 
> Most of the time endorsees and things don't want to do damage to their business contacts because it doesn't look good on them. I just don't personally care. The guy has hosed a bunch of people and others need to know about it. But then again, I'm not touring the world in an up-and-coming underground hard rock group. So.... it is what it is.


 
I forgot about the detailed thread elq made and bumped for a year  It was said by elq recently that Nolly's build was problematic and made him end the relationship with Bernie, and Nolly didn't correct him so i had to imagine something was wrong with the guitar itself. Francesco mentioned his played awesome but had some monster issues, and Chimp Spanner said his was unplayable, even though the guy he sold it to loves it. Just unclear to me, thought maybe I was missing something. And I totally agree with not bashing former business partners being the mature way to go about it, I'm just not used to seeing that in this thread


----------



## mikernaut

Well there have been plenty of strikes against the QC of the guitars for sure over the last year. Some with more public players some with us common joe bedroom players. 

Some people are comfortable speaking out, some people aren't and just quietly try to part ways.

No shocker at this point that a buyer should be wary but still be informed and I think most of us in this thread already have our own views and conclusions about our dealings with BRJ. but ...yeah it's a shame it's been a rocky road.

On the other end of the spectrum Hauch and Merrow still seem to be using their guitars.


----------



## teleofseven

mikernaut said:


> Well there have been plenty of strikes against the QC of the guitars for sure over the last year. Some with more public players some with us common joe bedroom players.
> 
> Some people are comfortable speaking out, some people aren't and just quietly try to part ways.
> 
> No shocker at this point that a buyer should be wary but still be informed and I think most of us in this thread already have our own views and conclusions about our dealings with BRJ. but ...yeah it's a shame it's been a rocky road.
> 
> On the other end of the spectrum Hauch and Merrow still seem to be using their guitars.



if i remember right, merrow's was delayed by a year and a half? but the quality was apparently perfect. something about a neck rebuild comes to mind too.

but it's not right for any business to have their expensive products delayed and then not respond to inquiries and then virtually dissapear (only facebook remains, and is basicly unactive)


----------



## Invader

Lirtle said:


> Care to elaborate?



It's not my place to do that really. I'd suggest pm'ing Nolly.


----------



## Qweklain

Update on mine... 
1) Bernie replied to TWO e-mails from TWO different accounts in the same day! Very strange...

2) He said strap buttons are the absolute final thing before a final polish and then shipping.

3) For those unaware, his site is back up. I payed this evening and now all I can do is wait...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Invader said:


> It's not my place to do that really. I'd suggest pm'ing Nolly.



Well, if you're not going to elaborate because it's not your place to say, then why is it your place to say there were issues with the guitar at all? I'd say maybe keep it to yourself next time rather than stir the pot.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ lol, getting hot up in here


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Sorry - I don't mean to sound angry. But seriously? What's the point of saying there's an issue with somebody else's guitar as if he has some sort of inside info, and then bombing out when people ask what exactly he means by his statement?


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> ^ lol, getting hot up in here



Well, he's right. And it certainly isn't fair to put Nolly on the spot with answering PM's about it when they bring it up.


----------



## SpaceDock

I just thought it was funny.


----------



## JPMike

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Sorry - I don't mean to sound angry. But seriously? What's the point of saying there's an issue with somebody else's guitar as if he has some sort of inside info, and then bombing out when people ask what exactly he means by his statement?



I am totally with you on this one. I don't really care if you sounded angry or not, if you got something to say, just say it, if not just don't.

In any case, I am really glad some people are getting answers, while others are still waiting and not getting any replies, I've emailed that Chris guy 2 times now the last 3 days. No answer. 

If I was living in California, I would just drive to the shop and get an answer, I believe that's the only possible way. lol.


----------



## spawnsc

I'm starting to think that Chris guy quit or got fired.


----------



## Phrygian

I'm starting to think the Chris guy is in fact Bernie.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Ignore this post - it never happened (bad link)


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Someone posted this on his FB page yesterday (NOT on his personal profile)

"Jed Simon &#9654; Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars (Official)
Yesterday at 3:51am · 
Hey Everybody...I had a long talk with Bernie yesterday. I am in the same boat as many of you and have been wondering what has happened to our beloved Bernie.

The man has been sick for months, and I mean really sick. No need for details but as a result he's found himself really behind. When you are a perfectionist like Bernie you don't have other people to do your guitars for you, it's all him. On top of that, his website people have all not lived up to their duties and he has no staff to run the sites. He is currently looking for folks who are capable to run the sites(this one included), and if you think you have the time and the skills, then drop him a line. I would do it, but being a busy Dad on top of all my other other responsibilities just doesn't afford me the proper time. Do not jerk him around, if you can do it and you are serious then hit him up, or me, and I'll pass the information along.

Let me be clear, he is far behind in his work and a lot of people are pissed. I can't do anything about that, but I can tell you that Bernie is doing something about it...he's back to work and he's tackling it one guitar at a time. Getting caught up. Getting things done. 

Bernie has so much pride, he didn't want to tell me about his condition...he's lucky to have a supportive family because he needs them. We need him too. Let's give the man a bit of time to get up and going again okay? There are some developments on the horizon for him that look promising, and I'm hoping for the best.

Please don't hit me with your concerns about your orders etc. That's not my territory, I'm just passing along a much needed update, and asking for some understanding.

The man is so talented, so gifted, so down to earth. Stop buying the 200 dollar crap that many of the big companies seem to be inundating us with. Only a Rico Jr is a Rico Jr.

Simon out..."


----------



## kruneh

With all due respect, but it doesn´t make sense to me.
Hope everything works out for the best!


----------



## Pikka Bird

The proper Jed Simon? I'll be damned...


----------



## Rap Hat

This is exactly what's been getting me about all this; Sure, Bernie has pride and doesn't want people to know what's going on, but when it comes to customers you don't leave a hundred people with $150,000 of guitars in the dark.

It's totally unprofessional that he's unwilling to let people know what's going on. If my boss was out for three months and didn't tell clients who'd already scheduled jobs or paid thousands of dollars for surveys, we'd probably go out of business just from word of mouth. 
This also leads to people thinking he's just bullshitting. Yeah, it'd be a little unfortunate if every other month we'd get an email from Bernie saying "I'm sick, won't be able to work for 2 months" and people would still cry fake, but it'd be something, and I think many of us would at least be able to empathize, if not understand. As of now this is what, the fourth, fifth time this has happened where we found out months in? It gets harder and harder to take it seriously when an observer can literally say "Bernie will disappear in a month and come back later saying he was sick" and be 100% spot on.

I know what it's like to be very sick and totally fuck over your obligations, but I can't understand what he thinks he's gaining by not telling anyone. He doesn't even need to say specifics, for christ's sake!


As an aside, it's funny how the relayed messages are all pretty much the same. "Bernie has too much pride, he's been very sick, he's an awesome guy, he knows everyone is pissed, he's now back to work, he'll do it this time he promises, etc. etc". It's like he has a checklist of what to say, and forgets he's done it multiple times before.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

What I don't get is how bizarre the pattern continues to be. Each time that we hear that the man is sick, it's through some 3rd party eventually leaking onto the forum. So Bernie is too proud to tell everybody he's sick, but he's apparently not aware of this massive communication device called the internet? Or is it that he finally folds and repeatedly asks a person who knows him: "Hey man, would you go onto some random forum or exclusively email some guy and explain to everybody that I can't build their guitars because I'm sick?"

I mean - I am sorry for the man if he is sick, but it's such a weird series of behaviors.


----------



## spawnsc

not to be an ass or anything but what if he dies? we screwed out of our money?


----------



## SpaceDock

It does say that he is working on the guitars again and feeling better. If you read it, it says he wants some time to catch up and get things done. 

Maybe people should just chill out and stop wishing for the worst. We are two years in now, what's a little longer? Gripping and dreading wont get us anywhere.


----------



## JPMike

Waiting is the least it can happen, you know what I want? Freaking honesty. Like to know the truth about what's going on and not getting ignored each time I send an email. Not answering just makes people angrier and more frustrated. What I would want would be something like:

Me: "Hey Bernie, any updates on my orders?"
Bernie: "Hey Mike, nope. Not yet, still haven't touched your guitar cause others are in prio, bla bla".

I'd rather get that than get ignored. That's what serious people do or at least, the pro people I know of. I can totally understand the sick part, I have/had people in my family having the disease, I just wish the best to him and his family and make it through this whole thing.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah. I get being sick too. When I got so fucking sick that I lost 35 pounds (which was 1/5 of my weight) was forced to leave my home state and move in with my parents and get back on my feet, it totally sucked balls. I couldn't even do 10 fucking pushups without my heart racing like it was going to blow up. It took me a year to get back into any semblance of the shape I was in. Quite frankly, I didn't give a shit about anything because I was trying to put on enough weight so that if I did get sick again I wouldn't just fall apart and die.

But you know what? I still gave my notice at my job (teaching guitar), and let all my friends and professional contacts know what was going on. Yeah, some of my students actually cried in front of me. It was embarrassing, sad, and terrible for me personally. But it was better than just leaving them in the dust. I still went to every single client that I had been doing landscaping works for (as it was winter and they weren't expecting me for several months yet) and told them I wasn't going to be able to help them any longer because I was moving hundreds of miles away.

It's called professional integrity. People are freaking out because they have been fed a bunch of bullshit for whatever reason comes along for the duration of their wait on their guitars. It's not that people are hoping bad things for the guy. They just want to be in the loop.

If the guy is sick, he's sick. That's how life is. But no matter what happens, there is no professional excuse for just disappearing off the map and ignoring the group of people you are doing business with.


----------



## paddy

He wasn't sick. He was up and about and very healthy judging by his pics. He only becomes sick when he remembers he can't clear the backlog.
He's not sick when you are placing an order. But as soon as you pay him, he becomes sick. 
I mean, if he was sick, how come people could contact him and place their orders regularly?
Make no mistake, this is his latest stunt and not his last either of course.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

.


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> I'm starting to think that Chris guy quit or got fired.





paddy said:


> He wasn't sick. He was up and about and very healthy judging by his pics. He only becomes sick when he remembers he can't clear the backlog.
> He's not sick when you are placing an order. But as soon as you pay him, he becomes sick.
> I mean, if he was sick, how come people could contact him and place their orders regularly?
> Make no mistake, this is his latest stunt and not his last either of course.



Sounds cruel, but you actually might be right or wrong. Don't know what to believe really. 

If what you say in a way it's true, then we are f***ed.


----------



## spawnsc

just emailed again, hopefully ill get an update. I got an email back in July of last year telling me "guitar will be going into final assembly stages in the next couple of
weeks. Please stand by for an update in that time."

not seen any pics of it or actually know if he really has started on it....


----------



## Jexey

I offed my Rg2228 and a couple other guitars to fund the project. I still haven't purchased another 8 string. 

So close to three years of 8 string experience is now down the tube... can you put a price on that?  Man I hope the wait was worth it.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

spawnsc said:


> not to be an ass or anything but what if he dies? we screwed out of our money?



i thought the same thing just before i read your post, weird.

my question is why hasnt anyone gone down to his shop to pay him a visit? and i dont mean to kick his head in or anything, i mean just go down and really see whats going on, surely out of everyone here someone has to live near him.


----------



## spawnsc

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> i thought the same thing just before i read your post, weird.
> 
> my question is why hasnt anyone gone down to his shop to pay him a visit? and i dont mean to kick his head in or anything, i mean just go down and really see whats going on, surely out of everyone here someone has to live near him.



who ever goes to the shop don't forget the torches and pick axes. But that is a good idea.


----------



## spawnsc

Jexey said:


> I offed my Rg2228 and a couple other guitars to fund the project. I still haven't purchased another 8 string.
> 
> So close to three years of 8 string experience is now down the tube... can you put a price on that?  Man I hope the wait was worth it.



I sold 3 guitars to fund this shit and I wish I would have just bought the PRS I wanted instead so I kick my self in the ass daily over that decision.


----------



## Qweklain

spawnsc said:


> I sold 3 guitars to fund this shit and I wish I would have just bought the PRS I wanted instead so I kick my self in the ass daily over that decision.


I sold an RG7-CT to fund this thinking it would not take this long... that was one of three guitars I wish I never sold, and I have owned at least 15 guitars.


----------



## kmanick

Qweklain said:


> I sold an RG7-CT to fund this thinking it would not take this long... that was one of three guitars I wish I never sold, and I have owned at least 15 guitars.


 
I sold a j custom 8527DK-B to fund mine because I was told 4 months.
4 months turned into 10 and I could've easily saved up for it and kept the J Custom 
well at least I actually have mine and it's issue free (thank god)


----------



## Jexey

Waiting on casses now... Bernie is alive over there, if anyone is curious.


----------



## mikernaut

Glad he's hanging in there , but "waiting on cases" is one of his most common responses. sigh.

LOL even though I sent him a case for mine. So he can't use that one on me.


----------



## SpaceDock

mikernaut said:


> Glad he's hanging in there , but "waiting on cases" is one of his most common responses. sigh.



Seriously, that is the third time in a year I have heard that.


----------



## JPMike

Jexey said:


> Waiting on casses now... Bernie is alive over there, if anyone is curious.



Who answered to you? Chris or Bernie?


----------



## spawnsc

how come some people get answers and some don't? i've emailed so many times for updates.


----------



## mikernaut

mikernaut said:


> Glad he's hanging in there , but "waiting on cases" is one of his most common responses. sigh.
> 
> LOL even though I sent him a case for mine. So he can't use that one on me.



and unless he has white Painkillers he can't pull a mysterious Pup swap either


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

mikernaut said:


> and unless he has white Painkillers he can't pull a mysterious Pup swap either



Same thing with Tyger Covered Aftermaths. Oh let me NOT see those on my guitar and it will make the cable news networks...


----------



## Jexey

JPMike said:


> Who answered to you? Chris or Bernie?


 
I think it was Bernie because I saw a comma in there and some correctly spelled words


----------



## Khoi

spawnsc said:


> how come some people get answers and some don't? i've emailed so many times for updates.



I think he's prioritizing people who have their guitars closer to completion


----------



## Hollowway

mikernaut said:


> and unless he has white Painkillers he can't pull a mysterious Pup swap either



Actually, that's a good point. I think I'm going to ask him to put the Aftermaths that were supposed to be in my custom into my BFR, rather than wait for the rebuild. That way I won't have two BRJs with PKs.


----------



## killertone

Jexey said:


> Waiting on casses now... Bernie is alive over there, if anyone is curious.



I was just coming in this thread to ask if anyone has actually gotten hold of him in the last few weeks. I texted him a few days ago and received no response. Shit, he may have changed his phone number for all I know. He used to respond to me fairly quickly but I have gotten no response to my last couple attempts.


----------



## JPMike

I am just trying to get a hold of him so I know what's up with my builds, I am SO thinking of selling my builds...

Edit: I have paid Bernie so far 10,5k USD. Good job.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

^ holy fuck man


----------



## JPMike

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> ^ holy fuck man



I sold freaking 3 guitars.


----------



## spawnsc

I wonder how many builds his working on all together...


----------



## mikernaut

thoughts on this ordeal-

rewind to the beginning of the thread-

now, present day-


----------



## Locrian

Can't get a hold of him either.


----------



## SpaceDock

spawnsc said:


> I wonder how many builds his working on all together...



Chris G said it was around 200.


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> Chris G said it was around 200.



Side note to this: out of these 200 or so builds Chris said they have in total, back when I emailed him he said about 60 of them were in assembly. Just thought I'd add that in case anyone was wondering.


----------



## HRC51

I have offered to assemble and set-up the guitar myself. Just send me the parts.

No answer, of course


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

HRC51 said:


> I have offered to assemble and set-up the guitar myself. Just send me the parts.
> 
> No answer, of course



Yeah, when I gave him that option he just flipped the fuck out entirely.

10.5 k? God damn, man. God. Damn.

And who really knows what "in assembly" means. Perhaps Chris' math skills are simply as bad as his grammar...


----------



## JPMike

Speculum Speculorum said:


> 10.5 k? God damn, man. God. Damn.



No one was there to show me the way.  I wish I knew...


----------



## Qweklain

JPMike said:


> No one was there to show me the way.  I wish I knew...








I feel for you...


----------



## SpaceDock

I think Bernie needs to call in some favors and get some other famous luthiers to help him bang these out. Not only would it be great for him and us, but it would be a great photo op as well.


----------



## elq

I can see it now...


----------



## SpaceDock

^ that was brutal


----------



## JPMike

Fuck, I have major PRS GAS atm, I would easily snag some Private stock stuff. God damn...


----------



## HRC51

elq said:


> I can see it now...



Interesting. I was wondering when we would see this:

"Bernie Rico Jr files for bankruptcy"

I wish the man no ill will. I just want my money or my guitar. Simple.


----------



## chimp_spanner

glassmoon0fo said:


> ok, this makes me think that maybe someone isn't being truthful here. Is the guitar %100 flawless or unplayable? We've heard at least 3 times now that some Ricos have had unforgiveable flaws or something along those lines, but no explinations or anything to back them up, and all from high-profile members here who are not, or no longer, endorsees of Bernie's. If I was unhappy with anyone's guitar, Rico, Vik, KxK or otherwise, I'd have no problem stating that. Am I missing something?



Nobody likes to be "that guy" and as has already been said, silence is usually a polite way of saying "I have nothing positive to say". In hindsight maybe that wasn't the best policy. I just assumed I would be conspicuous by my absence and that people would connect the dots.

For those that are curious my guitar had an intense sitar like buzz on all 4 treble strings when played open. This was after a prolonged wait for delivery which went through patterns of being told it was in transit, then being asked weeks later what gauge of strings I'd like on it. I tried adjusting the neck and shimming the already heavily shimmed (and evidently Pre-worn) nut but nothing worked. The neck appeared to have a slither of darker wood inserted under the fretboard near the heel and it looked like my neck thru was more like a botched set neck. I was told by a guy that used to work there (who was extremely helpful and apologetic) that it sounded like a twisted neck, which kinda makes sense because I'd seen pictures of a completed fully painted/finished guitar ready to go out, followed by a month or two of silence and then pictures of an unpainted neck and all the guts ripped out again. The only response I ever got from the man himself was that it was "fine when misha played it". Never heard anything else.

Seeing how this was an "artist build" I didn't want to come across as in any way ungrateful or fussy but after a few months of it sitting on my wall I just thought...fuck it. Now it has a new home and a new owner and I guess they managed to get it around. I had neither the expertise nor the money to do this. Shouldn't have needed it. I'm happy to be with Ibby. Had a great consistent experience with them. 

That's my story. I will say, as others have, that bernie is a nice enough guy when you talk to him. I want this to work out well for those that are down on their cash. I do wish I had've said something sooner and more publicly.


----------



## spawnsc

the update for today is there is no update only darkness and gloom


----------



## JPMike

Sell your slots before you get some guitars with major flaws? lol


----------



## Andrew11

Anybody been able to contact Bernire lately? I have a buyer for my slot and I can't get a hold of him. All I need is for him to comfirm the transfer and specs.

Anybody else had trouble lately with selling there spots?


----------



## patata

elq said:


> I can see it now...



Invictus?
ohgodwhy


----------



## JPMike

patata said:


> Invictus?
> ohgodwhy





patata said:


> Invictus?
> ohgodwhy



Can you please do not post uber stupid shit? You make your fellow Greeks look stupid. 



Andrew11 said:


> Anybody been able to contact Bernire lately? I have a buyer for my slot and I can't get a hold of him. All I need is for him to comfirm the transfer and specs.
> 
> Anybody else had trouble lately with selling there spots?



Man, I wish I could help you out but I am in the situation as you are. No answer on anything I asked so far.


----------



## Khoi

Bernie is gonna have a hell of a time with the mass exodus that seems to have occurred in the classified section


----------



## SpaceDock

I'll stay positive and think the blackout is him working hard to catch up, but this is really lame that he isn't responding to anything and Chris G is MIA.


----------



## JP Universe

Until we get some kind of update/he starts responding I think the spots are gonna be hard to sell. I'll just keep bumping mine


----------



## esp_eraser

elq said:


> I can see it now...




lmfao


----------



## spawnsc

I wish someone that is near his shop could stop by and see whats going on, we the customers should not be treated this way and it just ticks me off that we all go so much invested into this and we cannot get a simple update of "Sorry i'm sorry working hard to complete some orders ahead of yours, it could take a few more months before I start on it but soon as I make it to your guitar I will let you know asap". 

I really wish I could have dealt with BRJ before the whole black friday thing because I bet he was a lot more pleasurable to deal with but this whole experience just puts a bad taste in your mouth.

I wonder if he will close his shop after all of this? and since his sick?


----------



## Jonathan20022

I don't seem to understand how some people sympathize with people who work this way. 

Yeah Bernie might be a great guy, but this is his business and you all are his customers. In this fucked up system, there is no "corporate" to call and sort shit out Bernie is corporate at that point.

I feel like I dodged a bullet reading this thread through the last year, I almost put money down on one for the Black Friday Run a little over two years ago. But I could never bunch up enough cash to start a build. 

But Mike's invested 10k in his fucking builds with practically nothing to show for it? Who the hell does that to a customer investing that much money into something? I've had plenty of times where I felt the need to push someone to get what I need to be done be it in retail or anywhere else. I advise you guys to seriously contact your credit card companies and get your money back. Call me heartless, but I couldn't give a damn if Bernie is sick or not which is questionable from what a lot of people have been posting.

In an ideal situation, I would hope that Bernie would refund 150 of those 200 orders and just keep 50 on his plate. I don't doubt that he's a good person, but don't overload yourself with demand you see this with countless other companies who end up with either disappointed customers, a huge wait list, and even worse sometimes bankruptcy. Wether or not some people have found issues with their builds or not is between that individual and the builder to sort out. I've had to replace my JP12 twice now because of overwhelming issues and every time MusicMan and Guitar Center have been nothing but helpful.

I feel like people invest much more cash than I did should be met with the same kind of attention and communication. Even if he has to hire a team of 5-10 people to work in a department like that. He can definitely afford it with the amount of money he's received from his 200 builds.


----------



## SDMFVan

If Bernie gave refunds to everyone who's trying to sell off their spot in the Marketplace his workload would be a lot more manageable.


----------



## theoctopus

You guys are making the bold assumption that he has the capacity to refund your orders. I'm willing to bet that part of the problem with Bernie's system is that he's low on funds, so he needs to bring in income to finish orders and get them out the door. Kind of like a Ponzi scheme. If he still had the cash that you guys gave him 2 years ago, he would just hire more employees and crank the builds out. But, that's not happening.


----------



## Jonathan20022

theoctopus said:


> You guys are making the bold assumption that he has the capacity to refund your orders. I'm willing to bet that part of the problem with Bernie's system is that he's low on funds, so he needs to bring in income to finish orders and get them out the door. Kind of like a Ponzi scheme. If he still had the cash that you guys gave him 2 years ago, he would just hire more employees and crank the builds out. But, that's not happening.



I never made an assumption, I just think it's fucked up for a customer to be left on the shit end of the stick. And like I said, *IDEALLY* the refunds would be the best thing to do in this case so he could clear his plate and actually manage to make some customers happy instead of scaring the already invested 3/4 of his waitlist.

And on top of that, how could you burn through 120,000 of course assuming that everyone *only* invested a 600$ build start multiplied by the 200 guys waiting on their builds.

And of course there's people who paid in full so that number is the BARE minimum. I can't imagine factoring in guys like Mike who have put in 10k, you don't just burn through cash that fast to build a guitar. He already had his tools and shop obviously so all of this is just all kinds of fucked up.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I hate to break it to you dude, but if the guy really has been in the situation he claims, all that money is fucking gone - especially if his insurance wasn't that great. When my wife had to go to the ER for 8 days because a flesh eating bacteria almost killed her (gnarly story) the medical bill pre-insurance was about $140,000 - and she didn't have to go back in after the first time. We'd have been fucked if the hospital didn't cover the bills because they figured it may have come from their facility.

So there is no money. It's not there. He took orders to try to get ahead of an already shitty situation, and then took more orders when he got his ass behind to try to catch up again. He basically sent himself into a spiral of insanity.

The only way people will get their money back is if they go to their credit companies and reverse funds. As harsh as that may sound, it might be the only way out of this hell-hole of a business crap-off that we're seeing right now. Good luck to you folks. I truly am sorry I ever got involved and hope that there is light at the tunnel for each and every one of you.


----------



## JPMike

Kenji20022 said:


> I never made an assumption, I just think it's fucked up for a customer to be left on the shit end of the stick. And like I said, *IDEALLY* the refunds would be the best thing to do in this case so he could clear his plate and actually manage to make some customers happy instead of scaring the already invested 3/4 of his waitlist.
> 
> And on top of that, how could you burn through 120,000 of course assuming that everyone *only* invested a 600$ build start multiplied by the 200 guys waiting on their builds.
> 
> And of course there's people who paid in full so that number is the BARE minimum. I can't imagine factoring in guys like Mike who have put in 10k, you don't just burn through cash that fast to build a guitar. He already had his tools and shop obviously so all of this is just all kinds of fucked up.



I can't agree more with you, but there is not much we can do now.


----------



## theoctopus

Kenji20022 said:


> you don't just burn through cash that fast



You'd be surprised. A couple medical conditions, a couple large purchases (say, a car and some more factory equipment), plus one or two bad habits, and that money is gone in a flash. Maybe it was a poor call on his part, maybe it was just bad luck. Either way, it's probable that this is the position he's in, otherwise you'd be seeing guitars move out with greater regularity (and not in small spurts after sitting unfinished for years).

Anyway, my point is not to fan the flames, only to suggest that each and every one of you do what you can to get what you can while you still can. Don't wait anymore, don't pass the buck to a new buyer, call your credit card company and see what can be done ASAP. I was in this same position with an e-drum company a few years ago after dropping $4k on a custom kit, and I wouldn't wish it on my greatest enemy. It was a terrible couple years before I received satisfaction.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Speculum Speculorum said:


> The only way people will get their money back is if they go to their credit companies and reverse funds. As harsh as that may sound, it might be the only way out of this hell-hole of a business crap-off that we're seeing right now. Good luck to you folks. I truly am sorry I ever got involved and hope that there is light at the tunnel for each and every one of you.



Likewise, I truly wish nothing but the best for all parties affected. I hope most of you contact your credit companies and banks and sort this out with them. I don't wish ill will on Bernie but it isn't right for people to be out money that they earned. I don't feel Bernie's earned his money on incomplete builds, once shipped I would invest the final payment for a build. This and the wait is what turns me off of most custom builds.



theoctopus said:


> You'd be surprised. A couple medical conditions, a couple large purchases (say, a car and some more factory equipment), plus one or two bad habits, and that money is gone in a flash. Maybe it was a poor call on his part, maybe it was just bad luck. Either way, it's probable that this is the position he's in, otherwise you'd be seeing guitars move out with greater regularity (and not in small spurts after sitting unfinished for years).
> 
> Anyway, my point is not to fan the flames, only to suggest that each and every one of you do what you can to get what you can while you still can. Don't wait anymore, don't pass the buck to a new buyer, call your credit card company and see what can be done ASAP. I was in this same position with an e-drum company a few years ago after dropping $4k on a custom kit, and I wouldn't wish it on my greatest enemy. It was a terrible couple years before I received satisfaction.



Of course I'm not saying it's without reason, I just find it ridiculous and completely irresponsible to dip into all the funds from this for things like that. Sure it's his living, but what if I needed a refund for something that came up in my own life?

"Sorry, I already spent your money so I can't give you your cash back, might as well wait for your guitar to finish now"

That seems to be everything summarized at this point. Illness and being sick is completely understandable, but like I said within reason.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ so, did you call your bank/cc company and get your money back yet?


----------



## Jonathan20022

I didn't invest money in a build, was extremely turned off by the situations people were in when I read this thread. Didn't feel like putting myself in that position.

But my bank has helped me on numerous accounts of others not holding their end of a deal. It usually ends up worse for them if they avoid the bank on top of everything. And explanation and a realistic time frame is what these guys need, if not their money back.


----------



## SpaceDock

You probably shouldn't be in here just to stir the pot then buddy. Fair warning that a few have been banned for doing it before hence the "customers only" in the title.


----------



## downburst82

^to be fair 5-10 or so pages back I think one of the mods said something like they were not going to enforce the customers only thing anymore..can't remember why but I think they more or less gave free reign for anyone to post in the thread now.

*edit more than 5-10 pages..couldnt find the exact post. I did find one in which the mod said he had "ran out of fucks to give" ..but I thought there was another one that mentioned something more specific, but I might have been mistaken. If I was sorry for posting in this thread

I hope bernie sorts everything out and you guys get your guitars or money back at some point.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Yup, thread isn't being moderated at all, everyone is free to shit on it as they see fit


----------



## Jonathan20022

SpaceDock said:


> You probably shouldn't be in here just to stir the pot then buddy. Fair warning that a few have been banned for doing it before hence the "customers only" in the title.



I don't mean to stir the pot if that what it seems I'm doing, I didn't really catch the rest of the title. I actually came here just to state my opinion on the matter, and I'm hoping it empowers some people to take action. I was a potential customer at one point, I'm sure that won't count  but either way. I don't want to seem like I'm shitting on anything either.

Like I said no ill will towards either Bernie, nor anyone. And I wish for nothing but the best, I'll check back and see how everything shapes up in the coming months. Hopefully it gets sorted.


----------



## WickedSymphony

downburst82 said:


> ^to be fair 5-10 or so pages back I think one of the mods said something like they were not going to enforce the customers only thing anymore..can't remember why but I think they more or less gave free reign for anyone to post in the thread now.



I know what post you're referring to, and if I may give my take on it, it wasn't that they explicitly gave an invitation for everyone to post in here for whatever reason they wanted, but more that it's unreasonable to expect them to keep track of all the people who do or don't have orders that are posting here and they can't babysit this single thread trying to manage it.

Speaking for myself here, but I'd really appreciate it if those who aren't directly involved exercise some self control when posting in this thread. I come back in here every now and then to see if there are any kind of updates and it's just a shit storm where I can't find anything useful, and it's quite frankly just depressing to read through. All of us in the run know full well what situation we're in, and it really isn't necessary to jump in here and get people worked up. I'd just like it if we can keep the posts in here informative and helpful.

No offense to anyone posting in here, and by all means feel free to continue doing so, but a lot of the conversation in here lately just really doesn't contribute to any kind of productive outcome. 

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## JP Universe

It's just the same shit over and over..... we get it


----------



## killertone

I have emailed, texted, and called Bernie and heard nothing back. Anyone talk to him in the last couple weeks at all? I have remained extremely positive through out this entire thing but am seriously losing all hope at this point. I mean fucking reality is setting in here.


----------



## JaeSwift

WickedSymphony said:


> No offense to anyone posting in here, and by all means feel free to continue doing so, but a lot of the conversation in here lately *just really doesn't contribute to any kind of productive outcome. *
> 
> Just my 2 cents.



great choice of words


----------



## spawnsc

killertone said:


> I have emailed, texted, and called Bernie and heard nothing back. Anyone talk to him in the last couple weeks at all? I have remained extremely positive through out this entire thing but am seriously losing all hope at this point. I mean fucking reality is setting in here.



No, his dead for all we know and they buried our money with him.


----------



## SpaceDock

Come on man, we heard less than a week ago that he updated someone, "waiting on cases" and there were a few pics of some other guitars in the last two weeks.


----------



## spawnsc

SpaceDock said:


> Come on man, we heard less than a week ago that he updated someone, "waiting on cases" and there were a few pics of some other guitars in the last two weeks.



that just it we keep hearing from other people and we need to hear it from Bernie.


----------



## MetalDaze

I did speak with Bernie on the phone about 2 weeks ago. Ed the paint guy was there too as he joined the conversation at one point.

No idea why I got some attention because he was unresponsive to me for a long time too. I've been involved from the beginning so I've read this entire thread and experienced all of the emotions that go with it.

My feeling after getting off the phone is that Bernie has no plans to close shop and run for the hills. However, it also doesn't seem like he's figured out exactly how to get out from under this weight either. So, he's still chipping away at the list, but I expect this whole thing to go on for a while.


----------



## JPMike

I like whining.


----------



## HRC51

MetalDaze said:


> I did speak with Bernie on the phone about 2 weeks ago. Ed the paint guy was there too as he joined the conversation at one point.
> 
> No idea why I got some attention because he was unresponsive to me for a long time too. I've been involved from the beginning so I've read this entire thread and experienced all of the emotions that go with it.
> 
> My feeling after getting off the phone is that Bernie has no plans to close shop and run for the hills. However, it also doesn't seem like he's figured out exactly how to get out from under this weight either. So, he's still chipping away at the list, but I expect this whole thing to go on for a while.



Thanks for the information.


----------



## SpaceDock

I think he isnt responding because all of the spec, ownership, and build changes were slowing him down and since he has to take all of the pics, calls, and emails he is wasting all of the build time being a secretary. We should all just back off and let the man work.


----------



## teleofseven

SpaceDock said:


> I think he isnt responding because all of the spec, ownership, and build changes were slowing him down and since he has to take all of the pics, calls, and emails he is wasting all of the build time being a secretary. We should all just back off and let the man work.



every person that starts a business of any kind should know that not only do customers come first but also that being the "man" in a company basicly means bye bye free time.

if you've got to cut time from work you should never cut it from being in contact with your customers. that's actually the most badic rule. 

as they say, you don't bite the hand that feeds you. i.e in this case, you do all you can to keep your fans and customers happy.

and he clearly is not doing that. 

there's now what like 150 pages of total misery about how he runs his business and how things are really fucked up at times.

you can read all that crap he comes up with from time to time, all the stupid excuses and delays and some quality problems.

it is clear as day that he doesn't have the business in controll and he wont put the time in required to make thins as they should be.

and i fucken know, i've watched and been part of my brothers business journey, and he's like a fucking animal when it comes to doing things right!

he runs his company 10hrs a day, and then gets home and sits on his computer for several hours, planning the next moves and days and sending emails to customers and partners, contacting workforce ect ect.

HE calls to his customers atleast once a week, just to let them know where the project is at and asks if it's ok to buy this and telling them what he thinks the project needs. the customers never call him, because they've got absolutely no questions whatsoever. my brother keeps them well informed. JUST to avoid ANY possible problems with them.

then comes my job (which doesn't really matter here, but i'll say it anyway).
i handle the customers and workforce face to face. i sometimes set up a date with them to show them the state of the project were working on. 
i listen to the workers and tell my brother if we need more workers or if somebody should be sacked, or if theres need for certain consumables.

bottom line is, we keep in contact with our customers even if they don't fucking want to, and i think it's just because of that, because of happy customers that in a year, we've grown from just me and my brother to having 4 large projects at once, workforce of over 25 people, 5 new management staff and 6 cars. 

in a year. 

we don't even know how were it's all going, cause it's growing so fast. but things don't get out of hand because as soon as there's too much shit to handle for one person, we hire another. 

that's what i think bernie should do. if he's got his stupid fucking hands filled and cant fucking take the time to answer to his customers, then he should hire somebody to handle some of his stuff.

2 rules i think in business: 

1.take care of your customers
2.got too much shit on your plate? hire somebody to have some of that shit to theirs.


and i'm sick of reading people complaining in internet forums about when they paid for something and somebody didn't deliver, but complaining just keeps on going. if i'm not getting a product that i've paid for in the time i was told, and then getting no answers as to why that happened, to me that means automaticly: "gimme my fucken money back, your shit is done. i paid you motherfucker and you didn't deliver when you told me yaddayadda..." 

luthiery is a business same as any. no room for delays and definetly no room for made-up excuses. especially when thenre's thousands of the customers money involved in it.

rant done, i don't give a fuck about bernie.


----------



## SpaceDock

TL DR 

Doesn't help to rant. Bernie is behind, what's new? Don't like it? Move on.


----------



## elq

SpaceDock said:


> Move on.



How can you move on (i.e. sell your spot) if he doesn't reply?


----------



## SpaceDock

I don't even think he has a spot.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

It's amazing how determined some people are to keep this shit even more miserable than it has to be


----------



## djpharoah

glassmoon0fo said:


> It's amazing how determined some people are to keep this shit even more miserable than it has to be



I think it's time you moved on bro - you seem to be just trying to bait people to respond to your posts. The other one about the moderation about this thread also wasn't unnoticed. We all know you're on the BRJ bandwagon/BRJ fanboi trip but you need to stop getting butt hurt that this thread is bringing out the bad news that you may not like.

*Consider this a warning.*


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Not the case at all man. I have no sympathy for the situation Bernie's in, only the fact that he may indeed be sick. The business practices are pretty heinous, no doubt. I just don't understand the need a few people have to remind everyone on the waiting list how fucked they are. I always say, "If you cant change a situation, change the way you deal with it." I couldn't possibly care any less if people respond to me or not, just hope they hear what I have to say. Hell, I thought I was being pretty civil. But hey, your call bro, do what you will.


----------



## JPMike

djpharoah said:


> I think it's time you moved on bro - you seem to be just trying to bait people to respond to your posts. The other one about the moderation about this thread also wasn't unnoticed. We all know you're on the BRJ bandwagon/BRJ fanboi trip but you need to stop getting butt hurt that this thread is bringing out the bad news that you may not like.
> 
> *Consider this a warning.*



Bro, you are my hero!!


----------



## djpharoah

glassmoon0fo said:


> But hey, your call bro, do what you will.


Nothing is being done... but the next "baited" post will get you a nap especially when I'm not even sure you're a current BFR customer.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

PM incoming DJ


----------



## djpharoah

glassmoon0fo said:


> PM incoming DJ



Talk to me.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Right, well I'm obviously bating people, and no positive things can possibly be upheld in this thread so I'll take my permenent leave. I don't even have a guitar on order, what the hell I'm I doing here?! Crazy.

Good luck guys, really hope the best for you all


----------



## spawnsc

i'm curious, how long have some of you been waiting? i'm going on 2 years soon.. not trying to open any wounds or sore spots just trying to forecast how long I could still have to wait.


----------



## Larrikin666

Alright. I tend to stay out of here as much as possible. This is probably going to be the last time I post in the thread, because I genuinely get upset reading a lot of these things. I'm laying this out for the last time.

I have the MOST money invested in all of these. Not counting the guitar I already received, there are 6 guitars Bernie is working on for me in various stages. In theory, I have the most to lose, the most to worry about, the most entitled to complain about everything. Is that how things work? Of course not. If you are upset, then you feel the way you do. I get that. It doesn't matter where you paid a $600 deposit, paid off an entire guitar, or you have ~$15,000 in guitars at play. 

I feel for Bernie. The two of us got pretty close AFTER my first guitar came in. I wasn't a customer whose ass he needed to kiss at that point. I already loved my guitar and had nothing else in the pipeline then. I liked my guitar and transaction with him so much, that I immediately put in two full custom orders with him for 7s. When the shit hit the fan with the wait times on BFR orders, I saw two things: 1.) I could help calm Bernie down and customers by jumping on every order that someone didn't want. 2.) I'd be getting a bunch of guitars I love for an awesome deal.

I jumped on it. I picked up two 6s pretty quickly. I picked up another 6 and 8 (I don't even play 8s) in the last few weeks. I don't throw money around like that if I'm not certain it's worth it. I didn't even buy NEW guitars before my BRJ. It was unheard of for me. Everything was always used because I hated losing 25-40% of the value immediately after the purchase. That's a big jump for me, but that's what I felt was justified.

I was also trying to handle ALL of Bernie's communication through here for a few months. It's a lot....infinitely more than I ever anticipated. Just on this forum, I was spending 2 or 3 hours each and every day trying to coordinate updates, answer questions, etc. I'm already working 10 hours a day and trying to be in a band. His handful of customers on here had me overwhelmed and started affect my ability to do everything else. He picked up on that after a period, so I pulled back from doing those things.

That's right around the time he was hospitalized.....twice. Anyone who says he wasn't....you're wrong. I'm telling you it happened. Period. End of story. Accept it or don't. Your beliefs about it are irrelevant. I spoke to him regularly throughout the entire thing, and I know how much it still affects him. Should it matter to a consumer when something like that happened? Probably not. It doesn't change the fact that it happened though.

There's also something else he had to deal with right after that which I can't go into detail on. It was bad. It broke my heart, and I really felt for him. Maybe he'll come out and talk about it at some point, but that's not my call. I agreed that it wasn't prudent to discuss it at the time, and his feelings on it still haven't changed. 

After my experience dealing with all of the SSO communication, we talked about how to move forward. What works best? How do you please everyone? Obviously, that can't happen. Can he hire more people? Not with how things are. Does he refund builds? Not possible. Does he spend all day on the phone, answering emails, chasing down updates? No. I told him to stay away from the internet, stop checking the hundreds (sometimes thousands) of emails that roll in daily, stop letting people change specs daily on builds that were supposed to have ZERO changes to them except adding a neck pickup. He's just digging himself further and further down. Nobody is EVER going to get any resolution that way. I told him to focus on what he can control....builds. Spreading yourself thin is bad.....we've seen the result of that. You need to give something up at some point. I thought communication was the logical option. Is it going to be silent for a long time? I really hope so. 

If he's focused on builds, then he's working on getting things done. Guitars get finished, cases come in from G&G (eventually), guitars go out. No new customers. Get the backlog. Get the mess behind him. When this is all wrapped up, figure out how to make sure it never happens again. 


To wrap this up, I have zero doubt that my guitars will be finished, they'll be everything I wanted, or that he'll make it right if there are issues. That's all I want. I'm sorry that people out there are having bad experiences. Dwelling on things you can't change isn't good. That's not how I roll. I keep things moving. Don't want the guitar, sell the build. I'll probably end up buying more as time passes. You aren't helping other customers (or potential ones) by repeating the same things over and over again. If 114 pages of experiences don't change their mind, then you aren't either. 

I'm here if anything needs me. I've never ignored a PM about this stuff. Don't ask me about your builds. I've stopped bugging him about my builds, so I'm not going to ask about yours. 

Keep it real,

Chad


----------



## Locrian

spawnsc said:


> i'm curious, how long have some of you been waiting? i'm going on 2 years soon.. not trying to open any wounds or sore spots just trying to forecast how long I could still have to wait.



26 months and counting. I haven't seen any pics of my guitar yet, but I've spoken to Bernie twice in those 2+ years to discuss the specs. That's about it.

"I told him to stay away from the internet, stop checking the hundreds (sometimes thousands) of emails that roll in daily"

I was told there were somewhere around 300 guitars ordered in the black friday run. Hundreds or thousands of emails a day seems like quite a stretch for 300 customers. Maybe hundreds a year.


----------



## Larrikin666

Locrian said:


> 26 months and counting. I haven't seen any pics of my guitar yet, but I've spoken to Bernie twice in those 2+ years to discuss the specs. That's about it.
> 
> "I told him to stay away from the internet, stop checking the hundreds (sometimes thousands) of emails that roll in daily"
> 
> I was told there were somewhere around 300 guitars ordered in the black friday run. Hundreds or thousands of emails a day seems like quite a stretch for 300 customers. Maybe hundreds a year.



I'll respond since this is still directly related to my post. There more way more customers than just what came with the BF run. Add in previous customers, normal custom guitars, and the ridiculous amount of "artists" requesting free guitars.....the numbers gets ridiculous pretty quickly. Trust me. The amount of emails coming in daily is ridiculous.


----------



## msalazar

Anyone in contact, I'm trying to sell my slot and have gotten no response.


----------



## spawnsc

msalazar said:


> Anyone in contact, I'm trying to sell my slot and have gotten no response.



we all are in the dark with whats going on, only updates are his been sick again and out of guitar cases. Let's hope his working hard on the guitars and hopefully his filtering his emails because his going to have a hell of a time trying to sort through it all. I doubt you will even be able to sell a spot until his finished with the guitar... that's my opinion anyhow.





Anyone know if Keith Merrow still helps Bernie out?


----------



## Phrygian

msalazar said:


> Anyone in contact, I'm trying to sell my slot and have gotten no response.



If I was still in this mess I'd get a lawyer to end it and get my money back. There is no way in hell Bernies counterthreats to anyone wanting a refund hold water - he broke the deal over 2 years ago when he didn't commit to the 60 day build times, so if anyone wants to end their part of the deal now it's not fathomable that he would get far with suing his customers after fucking them over this bad. 

My advice to everyone - keep all documentation and document all communication (and lack thereof) of this ordeal, just in case. You might need it.


----------



## spawnsc

Phrygian said:


> If I was still in this mess I'd get a lawyer to end it and get my money back. There is no way in hell Bernies counterthreats to anyone wanting a refund hold water - he broke the deal over 2 years ago when he didn't commit to the 60 day build times, so if anyone wants to end their part of the deal now it's not fathomable that he would get far with suing his customers after fucking them over this bad.
> 
> My advice to everyone - keep all documentation and document all communication (and lack thereof) of this ordeal, just in case. You might need it.



Is this how you got out of this mess or did you ever have an order with him at all?


----------



## Phrygian

I bought a spot second hand, which I sold last fall. If I still had a spot and couldn't get a sale confirmed by bernie I would want my money refunded. He has previously given a somewhat threatening answer to anyone who wanted a refund, so I would want to have documantion that shows how he failed to do his part of the deal and be ready to take it to the next level if he continues with the attitude of either threaten the customer or keep silent until the guitar is done and basically force the customer to pay for a merchandise they don't want anymore.


----------



## spawnsc

Phrygian said:


> I bought a spot second hand, which I sold last fall. If I still had a spot and couldn't get a sale confirmed by bernie I would want my money refunded. He has previously given a somewhat threatening answer to anyone who wanted a refund, so I would want to have documantion that shows how he failed to do his part of the deal and be ready to take it to the next level if he continues with the attitude of either threaten the customer or keep silent until the guitar is done and basically force the customer to pay for a merchandise they don't want anymore.




I understand where you are coming from, but Bernie hasn't threatened me and the few times I've spoke to him, he seemed pretty cool and laid back. We all knew going into this there is a no refund policy so we shouldn't even ask for one. He should have someone managing the spot sells tho. The part that pisses me off is the lack of communication even if it was "Hey all I'm going to be away from emails and phone calls for awhile so I can hammer out these guitars I will update soon as I can in a few weeks." post on facebook. Thats simple enough for me to know his working and not to expect any responses for awhile.


----------



## Phrygian

Well, someone here posted that they asked Bernie for a refund and he replied pretty harsh about it and pointed to that no refunds bullshit. Well what about the promised 60-day build time? Can B choose which parts of the deal that suits him and neglect the others? He has even had people pay up front when he told them their guitars where basically ready to ship just to see another 6-12 months pass without a single word. Mindblowing! 

I bet Bernie is a really cool and nice guy, but this is business, and he is not doing it right at all. And as you said, if he had even spent just 5-10 minutes typing up a quick update for everyone on facebook then most customers would be a lot more tolerant. but to just disappear for months at a time is, well, you know - dee dee dee!


----------



## spawnsc

I missed that post about refund, he has no right to be a dick to anyone that's for sure.


----------



## killertone

spawnsc said:


> Anyone know if Keith Merrow still helps Bernie out?



That ended a looooong time ago.


----------



## spawnsc

killertone said:


> That ended a looooong time ago.



oh....


----------



## ThatCanadianGuy

spawnsc said:


> oh....



I'm pretty sure he ended everything with everybody. Now he's just working with SD and playing whatever the frig he wants! Good on him.


----------



## MJS

spawnsc said:


> oh....



I don't think it works out well for people that try to help. There are probably a few others here with better access to Bernie than most, but I doubt they'd step forward to be a punching bag if they've been following this thread.


----------



## msalazar

They can pm his contact info then. lol


----------



## mikernaut

truly sorry if if he's having health issues but we don't know that or anything else if there's no communication. so what is one to do?


----------



## teleofseven

even keith had to wait for his last guitar for years, and there's even pictures of it way back when keith got the deal with BRJ, on their facebook page. it took them years to paint the damn thing and IIRC it had to get a new neck made to it (a neck through) or some other major problems.


----------



## mikernaut

And curious enough- from " Merrow leaves strictly 7 thread"

"BRJ may have made some sweet guitars, but I don't have to tell anyone on this forum about his not-so-great builds, and his catastrophic business practices regarding that Black Friday thing. While most of the BRJ guitars I have owned/currently own were/are pretty awesome, I actually wouldn't suggest them to anyone at this point, just like S7. In so many ways, ordering a BRJ at this point would be far worse than even ordering an S7 (in my eyes).

Not trying to hate. You guys know the facts."

I do still love my BRJ's but I think these days my money probably would go elsewhere to avoid the hassles.


----------



## Hollowway

My guess is no, but anyone hear anything recently in terms of getting a phone call through or email response?


----------



## spawnsc

Hollowway said:


> My guess is no, but anyone hear anything recently in terms of getting a phone call through or email response?



nope, i'm almost to the point in my mind of thinking I lost my money and just chalk it up as a loss. This was my first custom build experience and probably my last unless the builder is local. This whole ordeal is fucked up. I get his sick and all but I'm sick of his business practice, if the dude is so sick that he isn't able to work on guitars and to touch base with his customers from time to time, then he needs to offer refunds or work out some kinda deal with his customers and close his doors. Then focus on getting well and spending time with his family.


----------



## Rook

Hollowway said:


> My guess is no, but anyone hear anything recently in terms of getting a phone call through or email response?


 
I email'd asking about my slot sale, nothing

I email'd asking about a pickup change, email'd back within a day with a flat out no.

All within the last 4-5 weeks I think. I have now sold the slot to chad and email'd this was happening. I got no response, but chad I think also emaild and as its him I assume Bernie will sort it out when he needs to. All that'll happen if bernie emails me about my build is direct him to Chad.

I also got contacted out of the blue by someone on facebook in response to a question I asked almost a year ago saying eh was gunna give me updates ASAP, I responded with a simple question, cant're remember what, radio silence again.


----------



## jgaul79

All of this is very disheartening. I am looking to buy someones black Friday build slot but we both are waiting on a reply from Bernie as to whether the specks are open or not. This has been over a month ago and nothing. Reading all of the recent posts (plus the S7G topic) makes me a little skeptical if I actually want to pull the trigger on this. I guess I can wait a bit longer while I slowly thin my own heard and maybe Bernie will come back to life and talk to someone.


----------



## Rook

^Bernie posted a finished guitar in similar specs to my order as 'for sale', I messaged asking if I could out my deposit towards that and take it and be done, after having asked several times where my guitar is, then and only then is the only time he has confirmed or denied the existence of my guitar saying mine had been cut in wood so deposit couldn't be transferred.

Maybe you have to ask him a different question that he can answer easily in order to get a clue 

That's not a joke either, if he's only answering emails he can answer easily, 'how far along is my guitar' is effort, 'can I change where my deposit is', involving money, will be a simple yes or no question and if the answer's yes he gets more money now....


----------



## HighGain510

jgaul79 said:


> All of this is very disheartening. I am looking to buy someones black Friday build slot but we both are waiting on a reply from Bernie as to whether the specks are open or not. This has been over a month ago and nothing. Reading all of the recent posts (plus the S7G topic) makes me a little skeptical if I actually want to pull the trigger on this. I guess I can wait a bit longer while I slowly thin my own heard and maybe Bernie will come back to life and talk to someone.



I'm still confused as to why anyone is still buying up used slots from this run? No offense to the guys selling them, but honestly if the original "buyer" in the slot isn't getting anything back from Bernie, and their guitar is 2 years in with no clue when it's going to be completed, I'm not sure why you would want to take their spot waiting in a line with no definitive end in sight?  Not to mention that Bernie has given misinformation to several folks about the actual progress of their guitars, I'm not sure I'd trust anything I heard from him at this point regarding an order. 

Beyond that there is also the issue of all the spot-swapping that has been going on with guys selling off their orders/spots... considering how much trouble he's had staying on top of the original orders in the first place, how great do you think his records are going to be when it comes to the spot swaps?  Just saying, if you weren't originally involved in the run, you're taking quite a leap/gamble jumping in line at this point.... think about it, there *IS* a reason folks are all looking to sell their spots.  I wouldn't want to be the one left holding the bag on someone else's order that never gets built...


----------



## Overtone

HighGain510 said:


> I'm still confused as to why anyone is still buying up used slots from this run?



If they get a guitar soon that is built well and at the black friday price then it's an awesome deal. Of course it's a fairly big gamble and you have to be a pretty serious optimist!


----------



## HighGain510

Overtone said:


> If they get a guitar soon that is built well and at the black friday price then it's an awesome deal. Of course it's a fairly big gamble and you have to be a pretty serious optimist!



Well based on the recent BRJ NGD threads, I wouldn't count on any of that. From the posts where people are talking about what has been said to them by BRJ recently via email, I wouldn't be taking much stock in any responses he is emailing out currently either.


----------



## Overtone

I agree 100%.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Damn guys. At this point, it's starting to sound like my 7 was the last custom guitar that Bernie made without significant build issues (except maybe Keith Merrow's white one). I'd be willing to sell it to the tune of.... 5-6 grand if anybody's looking for a true BRJ custom. PM ME!!! 

Seriously though, this is all starting to sound like one big ponzi scheme where people who invested into Bernie are trying to get other people to invest into Bernie by-proxy, thus relieving them of their debt. Anybody who is trying to get in at this point is either retarded, blind, or just ignorant to the shit-show that has been going on for the last 2 years.

I know that the guy had some bad stuff happen to him, but it's rather short-sighted to say that this didn't result from years of running his business poorly. The guy had to know there was no way he was going to fulfill his orders. He had to know ahead of time that there was no way he was going to complete the guitars he already had, much less the BF guitars within the estimated time - if at all. While he ran his shit into the ground, he continued to pile on irresponsible numbers of more custom orders. Whatever he was before all Hell broke loose, he's simply not up to his family name any more. Sorry to say it, but the Rico name has been shot to shit.


----------



## Qweklain

This is just gettin' dreadful... I have seen my guitar finished (minus strap buttons), but I hear nothing and read all these negative posts (and rightfully so!). I should just take a weekend and fly out there and get it, and just say "When you get cases, ship one to me, but as for now, I will take my guitar sir." My company will even pay to fly me wherever I want pretty much... plus I've never been to CA before.


----------



## spawnsc

Qweklain said:


> This is just gettin' dreadful... I have seen my guitar finished (minus strap buttons), but I hear nothing and read all these negative posts (and rightfully so!). I should just take a weekend and fly out there and get it, and just say "When you get cases, ship one to me, but as for now, I will take my guitar sir." My company will even pay to fly me wherever I want pretty much... plus I've never been to CA before.



Kick him in the balls for us while you're there and to answer his emails.


----------



## Rev2010

Qweklain said:


> I should just take a weekend and fly out there and get it, and just say "When you get cases, ship one to me, but as for now, I will take my guitar sir." My company will even pay to fly me wherever I want pretty much... plus I've never been to CA before.



Man, if I were in your shoes I'd probably do it. Somehow though I think you'll still come home empty handed... well not entirely empty handed... you'll still have that bag full of excuses Bernie will give you.


Rev.


----------



## Guitarist1976

Hey guys,

I'm new to this site. I don't play seven string guitars. They are really cool though. 6 is plenty for me.I'm waiting like the rest of you for my 2nd custom rico jr. diva guitar. I ordered the 1st custom Diva in March of 2010. I got the guitar in November of 2010. I love the shit out of my Diva guitar. It plays great and sounds great. If you look up rico jr guitar images on the web - mine is the gun metal grey Diva with black bevels. It is a 6 string. I guess I belong on six string.org haha. The last time I heard from Bernie was in mid November of 2012. I emailed him last week and he never got back to me - his website is down and you can't leave him a message when you call. Looks like we are all in the same crap canoe. When was the last time anyone got a call from him or an email?

Thanks - Brian


----------



## Jexey

His website is now a placeholder by a web hosting company. I JUST paid in full a month ago after seeing a completed picture of my guitar (waiting on cases.)

SOMEONE has to have talked to him recently because I'm getting the feeling he's packing up shop. I've been sending him emails every 3 days or so, no responses. I'm officially flipping the fuck out now.


----------



## Guitarist1976

Better contact your credit card company. Bernie is a terrible businessman


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

I agree about spot swapping. I've been afraid to offer mine especially because its a full custom. We've chatted back and forth and settled on a rebuild with better specs. I decided to quit trying to contact and just wait it out; hopefully these BFR guitars will get done first and mine will slide in there eventually. I'm more worried he will loose the custom BKPs he has for it, and I'll hold him to getting this right, one way or the other. Right now I've got bigger investments (although this was a 1K deposit) coming up, with a Daemoness to be built this year and the Vik FF8 run starting this summer. I really won't mind not hearing from Bernie for a long while since at this point I'd have to turn around and sell it anyways (if it is flawless). And I've decided to go elsewhere to fill my 7 string void for now. Hearts will be broken. 

If anything pops up from him I'll relay here just so people know wheels are turning and hopefully for all these paid for BFR instruments.


----------



## spawnsc

Guitarist1976 said:


> Better contact your credit card company. Bernie is a terrible businessman



Credit Card companies will not touch any request after a year. I've already tried.


----------



## Rap Hat

spawnsc said:


> Credit Card companies will not touch any request after a year. I've already tried.



I'm pretty sure this is different, since you're paying for something in the future that doesn't exist yet. I know cc companies generally won't deal with it if you've had the item for over a year, but in this case the payment was made with the promise that the guitar would be done in a certain amount of time. I don't think a cc company would shut you down if you, say bought a car with a 2 year build time and 1.5 years in the company ran off.
I know they'll blow you off if the situation isn't explained (that you were paying for a custom build with the written agreement it would be done in 45-60 days, and that you don't have the item as the builder has ceased all communications/isn't willing to work something out).

I'm mainly basing this off people who've mentioned similar situations here and my own inquiries, obviously it could depend on the card issuer's policies. Don't want to get anyone's hopes up, but you should _ideally_ be able to get a refund.

Now, if you're in my situation, you're probably screwed. I bought my spot from someone else, and even though I paid the remainder of the balance to Bernie there's virtually no written communication between us, and the only proof I have is the receipt for final payment, which shows that I paid $1100 or whatever. It doesn't describe the guitar or explain that it's a custom build that was started over 2 years ago.


----------



## Guitarist1976

spawnsc said:


> Credit Card companies will not touch any request after a year. I've already tried.


 

That was in response to the guy above my post. He paid in full a month ago. Sorry to see that you are in the same mess as the rest of us.


----------



## Guitarist1976

Rap Hat said:


> I'm pretty sure this is different, since you're paying for something in the future that doesn't exist yet. I know cc companies generally won't deal with it if you've had the item for over a year, but in this case the payment was made with the promise that the guitar would be done in a certain amount of time. I don't think a cc company would shut you down if you, say bought a car with a 2 year build time and 1.5 years in the company ran off.
> I know they'll blow you off if the situation isn't explained (that you were paying for a custom build with the written agreement it would be done in 45-60 days, and that you don't have the item as the builder has ceased all communications/isn't willing to work something out).
> 
> I'm mainly basing this off people who've mentioned similar situations here and my own inquiries, obviously it could depend on the card issuer's policies. Don't want to get anyone's hopes up, but you should _ideally_ be able to get a refund.
> 
> Now, if you're in my situation, you're probably screwed. I bought my spot from someone else, and even though I paid the remainder of the balance to Bernie there's virtually no written communication between us, and the only proof I have is the receipt for final payment, which shows that I paid $1100 or whatever. It doesn't describe the guitar or explain that it's a custom build that was started over 2 years ago.


 


I paid an $1,100 deposit as well. If Bernie comes through with the build- the next worry will be paying him in full and trusting him to ship the guitar. Good luck -I hope you-me and everyone else gets their guitars.


----------



## spawnsc

Guitarist1976 said:


> I paid an $1,100 deposit as well. If Bernie comes through with the build- the next worry will be paying him in full and trusting him to ship the guitar. Good luck -I hope you-me and everyone else gets their guitars *or money back*.



fixed


----------



## Jexey

Talked to the police and the credit companies, as well as a law professor who funny enough has been playing guitar since he was a kid. 

PayPal and Credit Card companies will reverse transactions upon a valid police report and the professor will file suit free of charge.

The problem is that I've seen the guitar. It exists. It's sitting there right fucking now. Why the hell would I want to sue Bernie if it can all be resolved with a 5 minute online UPS pickup request and 10 minutes of effort boxing the guitar up? 

Furthermore, if I screw him over and drown him in litigation it'll screw all you over, assuming there is a chance of you getting your guitars.

The shit of it is - I have money stuffed away to order two more full customs from him. I was stupid excited and was going to order the first fanned seven string I know of from Bernie... so depressing. The shitty shit? I'm deployed to a combat zone and stewing on this religiously.


----------



## Guitarist1976

Jexey said:


> Talked to the police and the credit companies, as well as a law professor who funny enough has been playing guitar since he was a kid.
> 
> PayPal and Credit Card companies will reverse transactions upon a valid police report and the professor will file suit free of charge.
> 
> The problem is that I've seen the guitar. It exists. It's sitting there right fucking now. Why the hell would I want to sue Bernie if it can all be resolved with a 5 minute online UPS pickup request and 10 minutes of effort boxing the guitar up?
> 
> Furthermore, if I screw him over and drown him in litigation it'll screw all you over, assuming there is a chance of you getting your guitars.
> 
> The shit of it is - I have money stuffed away to order two more full customs from him. I was stupid excited and was going to order the first fanned seven string I know of from Bernie... so depressing. The shitty shit? I'm deployed to a combat zone and stewing on this religiously.


 

Did Bernie email you a picture of your completed guitar and promise to ship? If so, how recent?


----------



## mikernaut

I wanted to order a 3rd BRJ but not after how he has been running things the past couple of years. I think Skervesen will be getting the business now.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Jexey said:


> Talked to the police and the credit companies, as well as a law professor who funny enough has been playing guitar since he was a kid.
> 
> PayPal and Credit Card companies will reverse transactions upon a valid police report and the professor will file suit free of charge.
> 
> The problem is that I've seen the guitar. It exists. It's sitting there right fucking now. Why the hell would I want to sue Bernie if it can all be resolved with a 5 minute online UPS pickup request and 10 minutes of effort boxing the guitar up?
> 
> Furthermore, if I screw him over and drown him in litigation it'll screw all you over, assuming there is a chance of you getting your guitars.
> 
> The shit of it is - I have money stuffed away to order two more full customs from him. I was stupid excited and was going to order the first fanned seven string I know of from Bernie... so depressing. The shitty shit? I'm deployed to a combat zone and stewing on this religiously.



I was in the same place doing the same thing, and I was foolish enough to think I'd have it shipped to me there or get it on R&R. Put the money towards a Mayones or Skerveson. Those new FF guitars will be shown at Music Messe so there's something better to hope in.


----------



## JPMike

One of my orders was supposed to be delivered today.


----------



## Guitarist1976

JPMike said:


> One of my orders was supposed to be delivered today.


 
Please keep us posted - I hope you get your guitar


----------



## JPMike

Guitarist1976 said:


> Please keep us posted - I hope you get your guitar



I am no exception here, I don't get any answers either but I assure you whatever comes my way I will let you guys know.


----------



## Guitarist1976

JPMike said:


> I am no exception here, I don't get any answers either but I assure you whatever comes my way I will let you guys know.


 
Cool man, thanks!


----------



## spawnsc

JPMike said:


> One of my orders was supposed to be delivered today.




Hope you get it did bernie contact you to tell you it shipped?


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> Hope you get it did bernie contact you to tell you it shipped?



I received this email 2 months ago...


"Dear Mike

It's Chris G Here, I got your message re your orders.
Bernie and I apologise profusely to you.
We are still clearing guitars as fast as we can we have 60 guitars in Assembly 42 in paint and another 56 in woodshop
We are getting through the guitars iby the date of the commencement of the order.
Yes that is how big the backlog goes.

I have put all orders in our production system and all of your orders are in there
the denim guitar was out of woodshop and would have been close to delivery but the fingerboard cracked.
This meant the fingerboard had to be recut, shaped, slotted and reapplied.
This guitar has just left woodshop and is now ready for paint.
It will go into paint 

your build numbers are as follows

01 Blue Denim build number 0118112134MBvs (delivery date 15th of Feb)
02 Indigo Blue 7 String build number 0218112134MBvs (midway through woodshop fingerboard gluing process delivery date March 1st)
03 Archtop with f Holes build number 0218112134MBvs (Woodahop electronics route delivery date March 15th)"


----------



## spawnsc

good luck man I truly hope those dates are met. We all do because it would give us some kinda hope at least. 

I wonder if Chris G got put through the wood grinder lol he like just vanished...


----------



## kmanick

guys I am as bg a fan of bernies work that you'll find, but the web site is gone, he isn't answering emails or phone calls?
and you're still waiting for your guitars? somethings up and it's not good.
I f he had any of my money I'd be on a plane out there tomorrow.


----------



## spawnsc

kmanick said:


> guys I am as bg a fan of bernies work that you'll find, but the web site is gone, he isn't answering emails or phone calls?
> and you're still waiting for your guitars? somethings up and it's not good.
> *I f he had any of my money* I'd be on a plane out there tomorrow.



His site has been up and down for awhile now and his got a lot of money from us and we are trying to be hopeful because what else can we do? no one can get updates and no one has reported yet on getting a guitar from him. I hope you're not trying to stir the pot because most of us are already angry enough as it is lol


----------



## Qweklain

Well fuck me, I just read that his site is down again.

When I first saw pics of my guitar finished, I could not pay since the site was down. Then he replied saying the site is back-up and I could pay, so I did. Now it's fuckin' down again?! Well, I just went from cautiously waiting, to really goddamn concerned and wonder if I should just do a charge-back or something now... 

Seriously Bernie, what the HELL are you doing over there?!?!


----------



## jfb

There are still people that haven't received their guitars? Wow. I got mine in October of 2011 and I felt I waited a long time.


----------



## thepylestory

Is there no one on this whole forum that lives some what close to his shop to go check it out?


----------



## spawnsc

Qweklain said:


> Well fuck me, I just read that his site is down again.
> 
> When I first saw pics of my guitar finished, I could not pay since the site was down. Then he replied saying the site is back-up and I could pay, so I did. Now it's fuckin' down again?! Well, I just went from cautiously waiting, to really goddamn concerned and wonder if I should just do a charge-back or something now...
> 
> Seriously Bernie, what the HELL are you doing over there?!?!



When did you get his email? and when did you get your pics?


----------



## spawnsc

thepylestory said:


> Is there no one on this whole forum that lives some what close to his shop to go check it out?



THIS, or maybe we all should fly down at once and all just show up. Could you imagine his reaction.


----------



## Danukenator

jfb said:


> There are still people that haven't received their guitars? Wow. I got mine in October of 2011 and I felt I waited a long time.



 No, this thread is for shits and giggles.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, or maybe someone wants to call one of the other businesses in the building (it's a big warehouse building with like 10 businesses in it, based on the Google satellite view) and see if the doors are open or if it's all locked up. 
You would think that at least ONE person on here lives near there. There was one guy that lives in Hesperia (on SSO) and I asked him to swing by and see if everything is alright, but he said he doesn't have a car. I'm tempted to PP his mom $10 to drive him over there for us.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I for one would be more than willing to put into a pool to send an ambassador to check in on Bernie.


----------



## Locrian

jfb said:


> There are still people that haven't received their guitars? Wow. I got mine in October of 2011 and I felt I waited a long time.



My guess would be that the majority of people have yet to receive their guitar.


----------



## Tyson

Hey, dropping by.

Nothing's changed?

Cool.


----------



## kruneh

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I for one would be more than willing to put into a pool to send an ambassador to check in on Bernie.




I´m in!
I sold my spot and my business with Bernie is history, but I feel the other guys pain.


----------



## JPMike

I am thinking selling my spots... What should I do? :S


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> I am thinking selling my spots... What should I do? :S


 
Think about who you'd wish your situation on before you consider selling your spot to some poor schmuck.


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> Think about who you'd wish your situation on before you consider selling your spot to some poor schmuck.



So true, but maybe someone is more patient than I am.


----------



## Locrian

JPMike said:


> So true, but maybe someone is more patient than I am.



Except that you can't even get a hold of Bernie to confirm any selling or purchasing of spots, so...


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

^ Yeah and we're back to the spot swapping mess.


----------



## absolutorigin

Well shit, no replies to my texts or emails either. I'm going to the shop next week to kick his doors down and see WTF is going on. I don't live far from him and he knows I can stop by anytime. He has to stop giving people the run-around. Hopefully, something positive comes from this.


----------



## SpaceDock

I had my spots for sale and there was some interested parties, but in the end I decided it was not the right thing to do. It would be different if bernie was in contact, but he is not, therefor I can't verify a sale, delivery or anything. I would be doing to someone else what Bernie had done to us.


----------



## SpaceDock

absolutorigin said:


> Well shit, no replies to my texts or emails either. I'm going to the shop to kick his doors down and see WTF is going on. I don't live far from him and he knows I can stop by anytime. He has to stop giving people the run-around. Hopefully, something positive comes from this.



For the love of Christ, TAKE A CAMERA!!!!! Let us know what's going on there!


----------



## JPMike

absolutorigin said:


> Well shit, no replies to my texts or emails either. I'm going to the shop next week to kick his doors down and see WTF is going on. I don't live far from him and he knows I can stop by anytime. He has to stop giving people the run-around. Hopefully, something positive comes from this.



Please do it!!


----------



## JPMike

I got this notification from gmail, just now.

"This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification

THIS IS A WARNING MESSAGE ONLY.

YOU DO NOT NEED TO RESEND YOUR MESSAGE.

Delivery to the following recipient has been delayed:

[email protected]

Message will be retried for 2 more day(s)

Technical details of temporary failure:
The recipient server did not accept our requests to connect. Learn more at 'The recipient server did not accept our requests...' - Gmail Help
[(0) ricojrguitars.com. [74.220.199.6]:25: Connection timed out]"


----------



## MJS

I doubt he uses a separate mail service, so that's probably just because his site is down. 

His domain name hasn't expired and he still owns it, so his problem just seems to be with Bluehost.


----------



## Diggi

I'm really bummed about all of this. He was making me (what looked like) a really beautiful Jekyll ll - 8.

I don't know what to say except that I hope that he sees that something - anything must be communicated to everyone.

Even if by proxy..


----------



## Hollowway

Diggi said:


> I'm really bummed about all of this. He was making me (what looked like) a really beautiful Jekyll ll - 8.
> 
> I don't know what to say except that I hope that he sees that something - anything must be communicated to everyone.
> 
> Even if by proxy..



What's a Jekyll II?


----------



## msalazar

This really blows


----------



## JP Universe

SpaceDock said:


> I had my spots for sale and there was some interested parties, but in the end I decided it was not the right thing to do. It would be different if bernie was in contact, but he is not, therefor I can't verify a sale, delivery or anything. I would be doing to someone else what Bernie had done to us.



Yeah me too. I'm not trying to sell at the moment - not because of the situation but more so as I have lost interest in another straight scale 8 string.

I'll put it back up for sale when/if Bernie appears out of the shadows.


----------



## kmanick

spawnsc said:


> His site has been up and down for awhile now and his got a lot of money from us and we are trying to be hopeful because what else can we do? no one can get updates and no one has reported yet on getting a guitar from him. I hope you're not trying to stir the pot because most of us are already angry enough as it is lol


 
Far from it my BJR is easily the best 7 I've evern owned, and I've come to Bernies defense many times over the years here, I hope you all get your guitars (wighout issues) , but if he had my money for over a year and hs web site was basically gone and i could not get a straight answer from him, I would be on a plane out there to see what is actually going on.


----------



## Guitarist1976

absolutorigin said:


> Well shit, no replies to my texts or emails either. I'm going to the shop next week to kick his doors down and see WTF is going on. I don't live far from him and he knows I can stop by anytime. He has to stop giving people the run-around. Hopefully, something positive comes from this.


 

Please do so!


----------



## spawnsc

absolutorigin said:


> Well shit, no replies to my texts or emails either. I'm going to the shop next week to kick his doors down and see WTF is going on. I don't live far from him and he knows I can stop by anytime. He has to stop giving people the run-around. Hopefully, something positive comes from this.



Please do it, and yes take a camera


----------



## mikernaut

Well his website has gone down a bunch of times so I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that he is taking peoples money and running. He's just terrible at- communication, the concept of email and paying his website hosting bills, amongst other things.

Also if he has some serious health issues that is not going to help the situation.. but..... on the opposite side of things, it's not hard to type up an email or a facebook update telling his customers what is going on.


----------



## spawnsc

so anyone planning on swinging by his shop this week? I hope someone that says they will will truly do it. Now his got email issues because like JPMike said I'm getting this message

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification

THIS IS A WARNING MESSAGE ONLY.

YOU DO NOT NEED TO RESEND YOUR MESSAGE.

Delivery to the following recipient has been delayed:

[email protected]

Message will be retried for 1 more day(s)

Technical details of temporary failure:
*The recipient server did not accept our requests to connect. *
[(0) ricojrguitars.com. [74.220.199.6]:25: Connection timed out]

the bold part has me concerned, so what do we all do now?


----------



## jjcor

Here's the email that I used to get him to reply too [email protected]
I also have his cell phone number but I'm not sure its ok for me to give that out on here.


----------



## WickedSymphony

^ How recently did you get him to answer on it? I tried that e-mail a few days ago and no response for me even though he usually answers within a couple days.


----------



## thepylestory

^ I've been trying that email for several weeks with no reply.


----------



## JPMike

Guys, I have both emails, bern's and the production one, no reply has been received by any of them. I tried calling his cell 2 days ago, no answer from that either.

The only solution, is someone to go by his shop and check what's going on.


----------



## jjcor

Last time I heard from him was December when he sent my guitar. I didn't know if you guys had tried this email address yet or not.


----------



## Phrygian

Am I the only one starting to think -


----------



## tabqwerty

spawnsc said:


> so anyone planning on swinging by his shop this week? I hope someone that says they will will truly do it. Now his got email issues because like JPMike said I'm getting this message
> 
> This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification
> 
> THIS IS A WARNING MESSAGE ONLY.
> 
> YOU DO NOT NEED TO RESEND YOUR MESSAGE.
> 
> Delivery to the following recipient has been delayed:
> 
> [email protected]
> 
> Message will be retried for 1 more day(s)
> 
> Technical details of temporary failure:
> *The recipient server did not accept our requests to connect. *
> [(0) ricojrguitars.com. [74.220.199.6]:25: Connection timed out]
> 
> the bold part has me concerned, so what do we all do now?



I called his local police and they knocked on the shop with no answer. There wasn't a sign on the door and the windows were tinted black.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Dislike.


----------



## toiletstand

arent there a bunch of businesses though? does he even work on mondays?


----------



## HaloHat

I came so close to being in on this mess. I'll keep it short. Can't believe bjr jr. did this. I could never believe another word from him ever.

Years ago I had something just like this happen to me on ebay. Though for a lot less cash, it was the principal which I need to explain to nobody here.

1. Property ownership is public record in the USA.

2. If you sent money through the US Postal Service or received or were to receive goods through same, the US Postal has a very good fraud unit. They got my problem guy shut down on ebay saving other at least.

My guy was the same. First the stories and excuses. I did visit his home, nice gated community. I got my money back.


----------



## 72xmulch

tabqwerty said:


> I called his local police and they knocked on the shop with no answer. There wasn't a sign on the door and the windows were tinted black.


I was wondering when someone was going to do this..


----------



## HeadBender

Now that is some troubling news.
Did anyone tried to like call him or tried his other mail addresses? I know he has like 3 at least and keep changing them.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

toiletstand said:


> does he even work on mondays?



You'd hope he does with all this shit going on...


----------



## spawnsc

i'm going to try calling my bank again today to try and get my money back... this is just ridiculous hopefully they will do something and we all should file something with the BBB we shouldn't be sitting here wondering what is going on and having third parties giving us updates. 

If the guy few back back truely called the police and there is no sign and windows are black that is messed up.


----------



## spawnsc

just got off the phone with my bank. They said that since this transaction has been over such a long time frame that I need to write a letter listing all the transactions dates, reference numbers on statement, and detail explination of what happen. I also need to fax all emails that I've tried to contact him, sign the letter and list my number to be contacted. They will contact be back within 48 hours and let me know if I have a case or not. They said it could be 2 weeks before I got my money back but hell beats 2 years on waiting for a guitar. 

Just thought I would share the info, I would suggest others contact their banks to see what they can do for you also.


----------



## Jexey

Guitarist1976 said:


> Did Bernie email you a picture of your completed guitar and promise to ship? If so, how recent?


 
Yes! January 24th.

edit: then the payment cleared and OOPS! no cases now!


----------



## mikernaut

So did JPMike get his guitar? I thought he said it supposedly had been shipped.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I'm-a-gonna' go out on a big fat limb here and say no, JPMike did not receive his guitar. Otherwise we'd have known and he wouldn't be posting in here talking about how he is getting the "email down" message like everybody else.


----------



## spawnsc

no i doubt JPMike got his guitar because i'm sure he would have posted pics or linked to NGD thread here.


----------



## MetalDaze

mikernaut said:


> So did JPMike get his guitar? I thought he said it supposedly had been shipped.


 
If you look back, he was just quoting a date that Chris G gave him for when one of his builds would be done.

Him saying that his guitar was supposed to arrive the next day was just a sad acknowledgment that it wouldn't happen.


----------



## spawnsc

just called the metal shop that according to google maps is beside bernie and they had no idea who i was talking about lol oh well worth a shot. Also noticed on http://www.la.bbb.org/business-revi...rnie-Rico-Jr-Guitars-in-Hesperia-CA-100120144 that someone has filed a complaint (wasn't me)


----------



## Qweklain

This is going to a serious (well, more serious) shit-storm in a hurry. Been a month since I payed, and I have not heard anything back after I payed. I have tried e-mailing too, and like everyone else, I get no response.

I am going to send another e-mail this evening after work, if I hear nothing by Saturday, I am filing a charge-back and seeing what I can do about the $500 deposit, I don't care anymore.


----------



## spawnsc

Qweklain said:


> This is going to a serious (well, more serious) shit-storm in a hurry. Been a month since I payed, and I have not heard anything back after I payed. I have tried e-mailing too, and like everyone else, I get no response.
> 
> I am going to send another e-mail this evening after work, if I hear nothing by Saturday, I am filing a charge-back and seeing what I can do about the $500 deposit, I don't care anymore.



how can you send an email to @ricojrguitars when the email address sends 

Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

[email protected]


if you got a chance to get out of this headache do it


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Just another train of thought here fellas. Who can ring the case company (G&C I think) and find out if any orders have been made and when was the actual last time that they sent out cases. May be a way of finding out a date that he fell off the planet. I'd ring but I'm in Australia.

Also, I'm gonna message Jed Simon on facebook (now I couldn't give a rats who he is or what he does), but he obviously has some form of contact with Bernie, and stuck his neck out with a post on facebook, telling everyone to stay cool, when things a red hot now, so I think you blokes have a right to message him as well. He'll either reply with some bad news (then at least there will be some sought of conformation), or just refuse to answer anything to do with the subject (aka Bernie like). 

I'm willing to bet my left nut that Bernie and ex-employees read this thread from time to time, and Bernie plans his next move with what has been written. It's about time this bloke is taken down, and the mood here I think is starting to suggest this. A few are starting the ball rolling, while a few on the other hand still hold a belief. It's gonna be one way or the other, and some are gonna be butt hurt, but at the end of the day, I would rather see 90% of you with your cash back than see a couple with a guitar or two.


----------



## paddy

I wonder if some one tried to get a quote for a new guitar, would bernie get back to him?
Just a suggestion fellas.


----------



## Tesla

So collectively, from this forum alone...how much money has he taken from everyone roughly? How many orders?


----------



## Rook

spawnsc said:


> no i doubt JPMike got his guitar because i'm sure he would have posted pics or linked to NGD thread here.



I think he's banned at the moment.

I also doubt he got his guitar...

I don't know why but I'm really surprised by what's happened. I know I shouldn't be.


----------



## JerichoCheng

Tesla said:


> So collectively, from this forum alone...how much money has he taken from everyone roughly? How many orders?



i've full paid for a order since last year


----------



## SpaceDock

I paid for both of mine January last year when he said "two weeks."


----------



## UnderTheSign

I posted on the BCR Junkies Facebook page as there are a lot of guys who have BCRs and BRJs over there and some might have closer ties to the Rico family... So far all I've heard is from the owner of the group and he says Bernie has indeed been very ill and in/out of the hospital, though he hasn't spoken to him since before the holidays. He got worried when I mentioned Bernies absence though, maybe there's some truth to the whole story after all.


----------



## spawnsc

There still should something formal coming from Bernie himself and not third parties. We are his customers and we gave him a lot of money for a product that he promised to deliver on. If he is sick he needs to make a statement about it and what he plans to do with our promised guitars even if it means bring third parties in to work on them I'm sure his got connections. Until then I'm only going to believe what Bernie has told us and that's nothing.


----------



## Guitarist1976

I have called Bernie's personal cell phone several times- his business line ( about 80 times ) - emailed him several times and still no response. His website has been down for over a month. There is no excuse that I will accept. He can always hire or should have had someone set in place to give updates or refunds. Being a business owner myself, I take deposits up front for my services. My mother and father are informed of all deposit money that I receive from customers. If I were to croak or fall ill -my customers would be notified and would have their money refunded to them. I'm tolerating the fact that I gave $1,100 of my hard earned money to the charity of Bernie Rico. It's a damn shame even if someone lost a dime to this company. I can't imagine how the guys who have paid in full for one or two guitars must feel. I think I would fucking snap if that was the case for me. Best of luck to all of us. I hope we get our money back or our guitars. I don't even want my guitar anymore. I will order a custom guitar from another company who wants my money and can deliver. Bernie will never see another penny of my money.


----------



## clubshred

SpaceDock said:


> I paid for both of mine January last year when he said "two weeks."



It's like that quote from the movie "The Money Pit" with Tom Hanks... "How long will it take to do all this work?" 

"Two weeks"

[Uproarious Laughter]


----------



## Guitarist1976

clubshred said:


> It's like that quote from the movie "The Money Pit" with Tom Hanks... "How long will it take to do all this work?"
> 
> "Two weeks"
> 
> [Uproarious Laughter]


 

Lol - as pissed off and annoyed as I am with this whole ordeal - I still found your comment to be pretty fucking funny.


----------



## Tesla

clubshred said:


> It's like that quote from the movie "The Money Pit" with Tom Hanks... "How long will it take to do all this work?"
> 
> "Two weeks"
> 
> [Uproarious Laughter]



Or in Total Recall when Arnie has the robot woman mask on and is stuck saying "Two weeks." to every question they ask. Quite fitting actually...


----------



## killertone

It is way past time to think that anyone will receive a guitar from him. It ain't happening. Doom and gloom? You fucking bet.


----------



## wannabguitarist

tabqwerty said:


> I called his local police and they knocked on the shop with no answer. There wasn't a sign on the door and the windows were tinted black.


----------



## spawnsc

Could hear a pin drop in here today


----------



## Jexey

I personally know there's some inquiries and asset searches beginning here towards Bernie and if someone on his end doesn't pipe up and start answering questions he's going to realize that class action lawsuits pack a pretty hefty punch. 

Furthermore I think it's notable that this is past fiscal trouble - we're talking criminal charges here. Someone above posted the info about the 150 guitars he has in process. That's at least $240,000 in potential revenue and if he doesn't deliver it's considered stolen, cut and dry. That leaves his family on the street and him in jail at a MINIMUM. Bankruptcy wont protect him here, litigation is a bitch.


----------



## thrsher

Jexey said:


> That leaves his family on the street and him in jail at a MINIMUM. Bankruptcy wont protect him here, litigation is a bitch.



if by chance is business is an LLC then he is pretty much safe (personal assets)


----------



## JPMike

Hey guys, ok that police thing is super fucked up, if this is true then his either sick or I don't know what else might be, closing down the business or something?? He has a quite heavy name on his back, why would he ruin it like that? :S As Guitarist1976 he should have someone answer to us when something's going on. 

Also, I haven't received anything yet, no contact, no guitar. 

I start to think, how right my girlfriend was almost a year ago. 

Today, my 2nd build was supposed to be shipped/delivered recording to ChrisG's email. :S


----------



## Jexey

thrsher said:


> if by chance is business is an LLC then he is pretty much safe (personal assets)


 
Doesn't mean shit, neither LLC or corporate charter will protect against flagrant criminal acts. If that was true I'd have a real exciting investment opportunity to tell you about right now. Tell me, where exactly is Bernie Madoff as you read this?? Fuck, they even have the same first name.


----------



## Rev2010

Jexey said:


> Doesn't mean shit, neither LLC or corporate charter protect against flagrant criminal acts. If that was true I'd have a real exciting investment opportunity to tell you about right now. Tell me, where exactly is Bernie Madoff as you read this?? Fuck, they even have the same first name.



 Have to say he's completely correct. I work for a corporate law firm and over the years have learned a lot just talking to the attorneys. Something like this would be considered fraud and he would not be protected from the result of his practices. If LLC's or full on corporations could do this and not have anyone get into trouble there would be waaay more of it going on. 

LLC Basics. Limited Liability Company Business Structure | Nolo.com


Rev.


----------



## paddy

Rev2010 said:


> Have to say he's completely correct. I work for a corporate law firm and over the years have learned a lot just talking to the attorneys. Something like this would be considered fraud and he would not be protected from the result of his practices. If LLC's or full on corporations could do this and not have anyone get into trouble there would be waaay more of it going on.
> 
> LLC Basics. Limited Liability Company Business Structure | Nolo.com
> 
> 
> Rev.



true


----------



## thrsher

I still think its a slippery slope. The initial deal offered on black Friday was a one shot thing and guitars have Been put out and shipped. If he were continuing to take orders in under the black Friday, then i would think it would be fraud.


----------



## thrsher

I just think the fraud case is a bit of a stretch. Did bernie fuck up, absolutely, dont disagree with that one bit.


----------



## Rev2010

thrsher said:


> I just think the fraud case is a bit of a stretch. Did bernie fuck up, absolutely, dont disagree with that one bit.



I don't think so really. There are still droves of people that paid down payments and some that have paid in full. He originally was quoting build times of what 2-3 months or 3-4 months and people have been waiting 2+ years? Add to that the complete disconnect of any communication just really looks like nothing else but a hit and run. Not saying that is the case, but a person simply cannot just sit back and collect money, make promises, fail to deliver a product over 8 times longer than the initial quote, then simply drop off the face of the planet with no communication or representation (not to mention the fact that all deliveries have completely ceased for quite some time now) and have it looked at as an honest understandable situation. Even sickness doesn't warrant how this is being handled. With friends and family not one person can handle communication so people don't go weeks/months without a word of what is going on?


Rev.


----------



## thrsher

Selling of my spot has made me not as involved. I agree with the above statement


----------



## engage757

But it does worry me for the people that bought spots, given that the original agreement is between Bernie and the person that paid him the deposit, that may nullify the original agreement. Maybe? Bernie technically doesn't have a contract with anyone but the original purchaser if I am correct in remembering the wording of the agreement.


----------



## WickedSymphony

engage757 said:


> But it does worry me for the people that bought spots, given that the original agreement is between Bernie and the person that paid him the deposit, that may nullify the original agreement. Maybe? Bernie technically doesn't have a contract with anyone but the original purchaser if I am correct in remembering the wording of the agreement.



But it's not like people are transferring the spots without him consenting to it and allowing it to happen, and then continuing on to discuss the builds with the new owners and then demand final payment from them. So I personally don't see why that would nullify anything if he's the one who gave the go ahead on the transfer of ownership of the spots.

I bought my spot from someone else, communicated with Bernie and members of his staff directly during the transfer of the spot, he continued to discuss my build with me for the past 1.5~ years, and I paid in full in summer of last year. And if we're going off the wording of the agreement, he promised a much shorter completion time and that final payment was due upon completion, and many of us have paid in full without getting our instruments yet. Far as I see it, he does have a contract with those of us who bought the spots from others.


----------



## leonardo7

I was at Bernie's shop in Oct '11. From the outside you would never know whats inside. There's also basically a hallway and room separating the front door from the shop. Anyone could knock and he could ignore it, not even be there or not even hear it.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Yeh, I figured as much about the cops going there and the windows being blacked out and no sign. I'm pretty much just waiting around since we'll have to hear some kind of confirmation of what's going on from somebody eventually, be it Bernie or someone else.


----------



## 72xmulch

I'm suprised the.cops.didn't just burn the building down.


----------



## killertone

Bernie drives a black Jeep. At least he used to unless he used all our money to buy a new ride. 

If it is there then he is there. 

Bottom line is the dude's not there. Ever. And hasn't been for some time. 

Sick or not, there is no excuse for zero communication. None.

The cops need to go to his house.


----------



## spawnsc

Yeah I agree ^

Like some of you I don't even want the pos now


----------



## JPMike

I am so annoyed by this, whining won't help, really. I wish he would just responde and say something.


----------



## mikenothing

I haven't bought a guitar from Bernie, so maybe its none of my business... but have any of you guys tried contacting the media? Maybe get a news crew to go out there and try to get some answers from him. I mean this is pretty news worthy stuff- a quarter of a million dollars are tied up. Just an idea.


----------



## spawnsc

I think most should look into this... Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars Business Review in Hesperia, CA

they try to get in contact with him to question whats going on.


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> I think most should look into this... Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars Business Review in Hesperia, CA
> 
> they try to get in contact with him to question whats going on.



Shed some light, this is interesting... What we have to do?


----------



## thepylestory

Larkin666, chime in man, you seem to have a lot invested a somewhat of a link with Bernie.


----------



## spawnsc

JPMike said:


> Shed some light, this is interesting... What we have to do?



you click on file a complaint an enter in the fields and explain the situation. They will contact Bernie asking why his doing such a shitty job and work on getting a solution between you and the business. They will email you updates on the process.

We all can't just sit around and let him take our money because he thinks "oh I told them all sales final no refund"


----------



## mikernaut

Seeing as his communication has been about as good as slow growing mold confused by bath salts, if he truly is sick I doubt the concept of communication is going to improve.


----------



## Jexey

This IS criminal if he doesn't deliver. It's a ponzi scheme, I don't give a shit if some people received their guitars or not. If I sell you a set of pickups and don't deliver them it's criminal. If I sell ten people the same set of pickups and don't deliver them it's still criminal. 

It doesn't make a difference If I send them pictures of me making the pickups or you tell me someone else paid for it and to ship it elsewhere. There are stacks of statutes of which we could take him to court on. It'd take me 5 minutes to find an appropriate case study for this.

Furthermore a class action is a fucking juggernaut of a lawsuit. With 120 pages of responses on this thread alone I don't think it'd be too hard to bring together 50 people on a claim against him. You know for a fact someone he's associated with is reading this and the very point that nobody is making the effort to warn him that's he's treading past the point of no return is scary. I don't care if he's in a coma, someone has a power of attorney to handle his affairs or even the common fucking decency to post a thread on here saying he's getting his head amputated or heart transplanted or penile reconstructive surgery; anything to excuse this gaping black suck hole of an absense he's created and put a hold to any litigation.


----------



## ovation22

spawnsc said:


> I think most should look into this... Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars Business Review in Hesperia, CA
> 
> they try to get in contact with him to question whats going on.




That was me. 

I've also contacted the State Attorney General and FTC. I've been promised a refund multiple times. The most recent of which was a month ago when Bernie said I would have it within 2 weeks. That was the last I heard from him (and I suspect the last anyone has). I followed up with him 2 weeks to the day, but never heard back.

I'm starting to think it's class action time. Let me know if anyone is interested.


----------



## Qweklain

ovation22 said:


> That was me.
> 
> I've also contacted the State Attorney General and FTC. I've been promised a refund multiple times. The most recent of which was a month ago when Bernie said I would have it within 2 weeks. That was the last I heard from him (and I suspect the last anyone has). I followed up with him 2 weeks to the day, but never heard back.
> 
> I'm starting to think it's class action time. Let me know if anyone is interested.


I am definitely interested. I am contacting my bank Monday to see if I can charge back my final payment I sent over 1.5 months ago when I saw my completed guitar. Since it clearly has not shipped yet I am done waiting and playing games. I will also see what I can do about that $500 initial deposit I payed.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well guys - good luck and I am sorry that it has finally come to this. At the same time, I am glad that people are finally starting to chin up and start working on resolving the issue. I don't understand how anybody can really get behind Bernie any more. No matter how sick he is, there is no excuse for completely going off the map on his entire customer base. People need to get behind this and push for a refund or lawsuit. Nothing else is going to change the situation.


----------



## SpaceDock

Well, is anyone got a lawyer friend or someone who can champion this? I'd be willing to sign up for a refund.


----------



## axxessdenied

Pretty ridiculous. Some people get in over their heads. It's not the customers fault. if you can't deliver, than don't take people's money.


----------



## JPMike

What concerns me, for people who live outside the US, how can we handle this? (legal wise) In any case I will call my bank to see what can happen.


----------



## HRC51

ovation22 said:


> That was me.
> 
> I've also contacted the State Attorney General and FTC. I've been promised a refund multiple times. The most recent of which was a month ago when Bernie said I would have it within 2 weeks. That was the last I heard from him (and I suspect the last anyone has). I followed up with him 2 weeks to the day, but never heard back.
> 
> I'm starting to think it's class action time. Let me know if anyone is interested.



I'm interested in joining. 

I have been considering small claims court, but I live out east. This would be tough to arrange and cost me more money. I've also read that even if you win, it can still be hard to collect. First, I'd like my money back. Second choice would be to give me the unfinished guitar with all the parts. I'll finish it myself.


----------



## ovation22

I'm going to talk to some lawyer friends tomorrow to see what our options are. I'll ask about international options as well. If there are others interested, please feel free to reply here or send a PM privately.


----------



## JPMike

ovation22 said:


> I'm going to talk to some lawyer friends tomorrow to see what our options are. I'll ask about international options as well. If there are others interested, please feel free to reply here or send a PM privately.



Let me know, cause I am close talking to my lawyer about it too.


----------



## killertone

I am in on any legal action we can take. My brother in law is an attorney and I have spoken to him about it as well. He is doing some research to figure out my best course of action and then it is go time.


----------



## SpaceDock

I think he needs to give everyone a refund and he can sell the guitars as he finishes them to new customers.


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> I think he needs to give everyone a refund and he can sell the guitars as he finishes them to new customers.



You'd think that'd be the easier choice and he'd probably get more money for an outright sale on all of the BFR guitars, but he clearly doesn't want to go down the refund route.

If people are going to organize something that will get us our money back or our guitars (though unlikely and with risk of issues) then count me in I guess. It's such a shame that it's come down to this and not at all what I wanted to happen, but I don't know what he expects when people have paid him thousands of dollars and this is how he runs his business...


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> You'd think that'd be the easier choice and he'd probably get more money for an outright sale on all of the BFR guitars, but he clearly doesn't want to go down the refund route.
> 
> If people are going to organize something that will get us our money back or our guitars (though unlikely and with risk of issues) then count me in I guess. It's such a shame that it's come down to this and not at all what I wanted to happen, but I don't know what he expects when people have paid him thousands of dollars and this is how he runs his business...



Honestly, I don't really want to go down that route, it saddens me and I don't want to cause extra trouble to a sick man, cause I really know how it is. 

But, when I've spend quite an mount of money and I get no answers to my emails, no communication, what he expects us to do. Wait for him all of our lives until he decides to start building/sending our guitars?? I know it sounds cruel, but money don't grow on trees these days. We want something out of our earnings. 

If he had sent a message, saying how bad he feels for all this, for not being able to work due to his sickness and actually apologised, in my case it would be totally different but he didn't. His Ego is too high, and fucking annoys me the fact he used some random guy to email us. Do it by yourself, I am sure you can. Just type "I apologise for the situation, delaying your orders, etc but I am really bad health wise. Bla bla bla..." or something and just mass send it to your contacts, you will just have to do a bit of clicking. How hard is that?? 

Good job ruining a family name with such a great history.

In any case, I hope he becomes well soon, for the sake of his family. It will be sad for those people to lose a husband and a father. Cause, I was near losing my father twice due to the illness.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

I swear i saw a picture of him recently (in the last 4 months) and he did look noticably lighter, like he had lost a ton of weight and not in a good way either. I might have seen it on his fb


----------



## spawnsc

Let me know more on the lawsuit action I would be willing to join in


----------



## Guitarist1976

Count me in too


----------



## killertone

Stealthdjentstic said:


> I swear i saw a picture of him recently (in the last 4 months) and he did look noticably lighter, like he had lost a ton of weight and not in a good way either. I might have seen it on his fb



The problem is that there is ZERO info about wether or not he is extremely sick or in Aruba kicking it on a beach. I'm not trying to be ruthless here, but when someone has a few thousand dollars of my hard earned cash for well over a year with no communication in months, it is unacceptable. And to be quite honest, it completely feels like he has cut and run. Any of you thinking you will get a refund are out of your minds. That money was gone the minute we paid. 

The crazy fucked thing about it is that it all could be handled with a simple communication from Bernie to us about what is going on. Even if there are major issues in his personal life there is not one single excuse for there not to be a statement about it to his customers. 

I would never wish ill will towards him as far his health and family go. I'm also not going to call him names or assassinate his character here. I will, however, fight for what is mine until I get it.


----------



## rifftrauma

Personally don't want any of this legal shit, I'd rather sit down and have a beer with him and ask him why the communications blackout. I'm pretty sure all any of us want is to just know what the fuck is going on...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Look guys. As hardened and terrible as this sounds, none of us should be concerning ourselves with whether or not Bernie is sick, or sippin' margaritas on a white sandy beach somewhere tropical. We need to look at the facts of how Bernie has acted (as a business man) over the last 2 years and go from there.

How many times have there been MASSIVE communication breaks? How many times have people had guitar spec'ed wrong by him? How many times has he had to rebuild in the last 2 years because a guitar was ridiculously unplayable? How many times has he taken people's money for a final payment and not delivered or spoken to said person for a long period afterward?

The shit-show is huge, and it's not just about Bernie being sick. If you are waiting for him to surface and tell you everything is going to get better, you should slap some sense into yourself. Even if he does, these issues are not going to stop. Be prepared to be waiting for a long time or never receive your instrument.


----------



## Necromagnon

Sorry, I had to...


----------



## Jexey

Asset search -> Private investigator -> Legal preceedings -> Paycheck. 

First two can be done in tandem. Mother fucker this sucks. I'm not enjoying my poptart right now because this put me in such a sour ass mood. 

POTENTIALLY GOOD POPTART. BAD MOOD. BAD POPTART. 

Anyone have luck with getting deposit back through paypal? They might want a police report.


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> Honestly, I don't really want to go down that route, it saddens me and I don't want to cause extra trouble to a sick man, cause I really know how it is.



I don't think anyone wanted to go down this route. I mean, we're all gear whores in here and would rather have an awesome new guitar than deal with this legal stuff, but as Spec said above this, we have to look at how the whole process has been, and sick or not we've all been pretty much getting shafted this whole time. 

Of course I feel bad that he's sick and that it's going this direction, but he's got a few thousand dollars or more from many of us and that is simply not okay with the way things have been going. I can barely play my own guitars anymore because every time I have one out my family or friends ask me what the fuck is going on with this and giving me a hard time about it when there hasn't been fuck all I could really do to get things moving. That shit is stressful to hear over and over again.

I really do wish that he gets better like you said, but that is separate from our business with each other, and it's not right to be left entirely out of the loop with what's going on. When I was on the phone with him several months ago and he talked about how people on here hate on him, I explained to him very clearly that all it would take is better communication. The vast majority of issues we have in here stem from that, and I don't think we'd be discussing this course of action if we had a simple idea of when things would get moving again.

At this point, my options are to gamble with when or if I'd ever receive my guitar (and apparently gamble on the quality judging from a few recent builds), or try this and get my money back from him. I think it's obvious which is the more sound choice, which is a damn shame considering how close it looked to being done in December.


----------



## Rap Hat

I'm attempting to see what my card company can do, hoping they'll at least refund my final payment (paid in 2011...). Last email I got from Bernie was 26 days short of 1 year ago, and I had 1 phone conversation a month? after that with him asking me for a final payment - when I pointed out I'd paid, all contact stopped and he wouldn't respond anymore.

Should've moved on this sooner, but I honestly didn't think it would get this bad.


----------



## possumkiller

Maybe he should sell BRJ to Davitt Hanser?


----------



## spawnsc

i wish the people who said they were going to stop by his shop would actually do it instead of saying they are going to do it.


----------



## thepylestory

I would gladly pay a fellow forum member that lives close to BRJ to stop by and rattle some cages.


----------



## xCaptainx

What the hell happened to this random guy who is supposed to be helping him with emails/contact etc? 

Really sucks to see such a historical name go through this


----------



## Kiwimetal101

^ From the amount of hate and emails he got he probs went "Fuck this" and ditched, you can't really blame him though...


----------



## WickedSymphony

spawnsc said:


> i wish the people who said they were going to stop by his shop would actually do it instead of saying they are going to do it.



If even the police went there with no results, I'd imagine it's really unlikely someone from the forum will do any better. And since he's not responding to anyone, it's not like you can tell him you're gonna be dropping by on a certain day to make sure he's there. Basically, unless someone is really close by they probably wouldn't want to make the trip since it'll be for nothing.


----------



## Tesla

It all sounds like this unannounced 'sickness' could be an addiction problem. A lot of factors are there - Dropping off radar for long periods of time, stealing money, sub-par worksmanship, dropping weight.

I say this, as it's the kind of thing people don't want to announce and will just say 'sick'. Which seems to be the case. If there's any way to check rehab facilities in his area, it could shine some light on where he is. Reporters always seem to know these things. Someone could try contacting a local newspaper without giving out too much info to see if they can dig any records up? Long shot, but anythings worth a shot at this point, right?


----------



## SpaceDock

I don't see myself ever putting money into a guitar/amp or maybe anything that doesn't yet exist after this.


----------



## PrestigeRS4

He could have saved himself a lot of trouble had he posted something like this.

Boden update - YouTube


----------



## Qweklain

PrestigeRS4 said:


> He could have saved himself a lot of trouble had he posted something like this.
> 
> Boden update - YouTube


You see, you say that, but the problem is that shows other people actually working on things. Such truths and magics are only bestowed upon a few Chosen Ones in the BRJ realm.


----------



## JP Universe

Disregard


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

I've never posted on this thread before because I am not a black-friday purchaser; however, I do have an order with Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars and would like to throw in my 2-cents.

I just filed a complaint with the Better Business Bureau, as well as contacted my credit card company, regarding Mr. Rico's failure to comply with my purchase agreement with him. In addition, he has also failed to communicate with me, his customer, as to why my order has not been shipped yet. The last personal communication that I had with Bernie was on December 5, 2012, when I received an email stating that my guitar was complete and it would be shipped before Christmas. I was supposed to have my guitar by the beginning of June 2012.

I'm not waiting around any longer for Bernie. Sick or well, Bernie's actions are grossly unprofessional. I feel bad if Bernie is really sick, addicted to drugs, or dying in a hospital, but that's not my problem. I know it sounds quite cold, but it is his problem. Now I have a problem because I've made a few thousand dollar investment and nothing to show for it. Not even a simple phone call, or email personally from Mr. Rico apologizing that he is not able to complete, or ship my guitar on time. This is a clear example of bad business. I'm done waiting for Bernie. I'm not a friend, I'm a customer and as a customer I have certain expectations. My expectations have not been met, or have even come close to being met.

If anyone cares, I'll keep people posted with my progress, if there is any at all. To all of you that are in the same boat as me... This sucks, but hopefully it will get better.


----------



## Adrian-XI

Being overseas and also having bought the spot off someone else pretty much seals the fate of my deposit...

I'm really disappointed because I really want the guitar, but seeing as people who paid in full over a year ago for their "ready to ship" guitars still haven't received them, I've lost all hope.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Ill-Gotten-James, this is exactly what I am talking about. Bernie Rico Jr. was not in my wedding party. He was not there for my 21st birthday. He did not show up for my graduation, and we sure as fuck don't go see movies together.

BRJ Guitars is not your friend. It is a business. It is, in fact, a failing business. Whether or not you are uncomfortable with saying it, this is a fact that we all need to come to terms with. Take legal action and get your money back, or wait even longer for a guy who cannot (legitimately or not) effectively operate his business of building guitars.


----------



## Qweklain

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Ill-Gotten-James, this is exactly what I am talking about. Bernie Rico Jr. was not in my wedding partner. He was not there for my 21st birthday. He did not show up for my graduation, and we sure as fuck don't go see movies together.
> 
> BRJ Guitars is not your friend. It is a business. It is, in fact, a failing business. Whether or not you are uncomfortable with saying it, this is a fact that we all need to come to terms with. Take legal action and get your money back, or wait even longer for a guy who cannot (legitimately or not) effectively operate his business of building guitars.


This man speaks nothin' but truth here! The time for waiting, being BEYOND patient, understanding, and (whether anyone cares to admit) somewhat naive to the hope that maybe shit just happened and Bernie just needed to take care of it.

Well that that hope is long gone and now if we want any resolution, we need to do it our selves, whether that be legal action, class lawsuit, or deal with our financial institutions with the fact that we have not been delivered the product for which our dollars have LONG paid for.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Ill-Gotten-James, this is exactly what I am talking about. Bernie Rico Jr. was not in my wedding party. He was not there for my 21st birthday. He did not show up for my graduation, and we sure as fuck don't go see movies together.
> 
> BRJ Guitars is not your friend. It is a business. It is, in fact, a failing business. Whether or not you are uncomfortable with saying it, this is a fact that we all need to come to terms with. Take legal action and get your money back, or wait even longer for a guy who cannot (legitimately or not) effectively operate his business of building guitars.



This 

My personal opinion is that we should all start filing claims to the better business bureau. The more people that file, the more this issue will get noticed, and the better chances we all have of getting a resolution to our problem. Good luck everybody.


----------



## spawnsc

Ill-Gotten James said:


> This
> 
> My personal opinion is that we should all start filing claims to the better business bureau. The more people that file, the more this issue will get noticed, and the better chances we all have of getting a resolution to our problem. Good luck everybody.



This^ I have post links to the bbb page or two back. I have done the same steps as you and got a letter from my bank telling they are investigating it. Which is good since they didn't send me a letter saying I have case here.

People start filing to the Bbb it will hopefully help some.

Makes me angry to think my money could have went to drugs.....


----------



## Qweklain

spawnsc said:


> This^ I have post links to the bbb page or two back. I have done the same steps as you and got a letter from my bank telling they are investigating it. Which is good since they didn't send me a letter saying I have case here.
> 
> People start filing to the Bbb it will hopefully help some.
> 
> Makes me angry to think my money could have went to drugs.....


So what do I do on the BBB page? Just click "File a Complaint" and go through the process?


----------



## WickedSymphony

For those of us who bought a spot from someone else, how would we go about this? Are we just boned on the deposit or would we have to get the original spot holder involved to help sort things out?


----------



## Rap Hat

Welp, this is what I was afraid of. CC company said no refund, because it had been more than 180 days. When I tried to point out that custom guitars often take more than 180 days to be built, they just repeated that you have 180 days. I then asked if they were giving me the okay to commit fraud as long as I told the person it would be 7 months, and they said no . But I couldn't get them to connect the two situations, even after getting them to agree that they would go after hypothetical me.

I just want the goddamn guitar. At least now I know I have no choice but to wait.


----------



## ForThisGift

WickedSymphony said:


> For those of us who bought a spot from someone else, how would we go about this? Are we just boned on the deposit or would we have to get the original spot holder involved to help sort things out?


 
Legally, unless you have correspondence from Bernie ackowledging the transfer of the build spot, you are not really going to have a leg to stand on. The build spot swaps were a slippery slope.


----------



## thrsher

i have my emails of my transferred spot along with correspondance from Bernie acknowledging the transfer


----------



## WickedSymphony

ForThisGift said:


> Legally, unless you have correspondence from Bernie ackowledging the transfer of the build spot, you are not really going to have a leg to stand on. The build spot swaps were a slippery slope.



Yeh, I have e-mails of him acknowledging the transfer, and the original owner is a member here who I'm sure would verify that Bernie was fully aware of the transfer. Not to mention almost 2 years of communication basically saying it's my build. I'm just curious how much of a hurdle it would be to get my money back without hurting the original owner in any way or causing him much trouble.


----------



## Might-is-Right

WickedSymphony said:


> Yeh, I have e-mails of him acknowledging the transfer, and the original owner is a member here who I'm sure would verify that Bernie was fully aware of the transfer. Not to mention almost 2 years of communication basically saying it's my build. I'm just curious how much of a hurdle it would be to get my money back without hurting the original owner in any way or causing him much trouble.



^^^ I will back you up any way I can help out man...


----------



## WickedSymphony

Might-is-Right said:


> ^^^ I will back you up any way I can help out man...



Much appreciated, bud. Sorry this turned out to be such a mess. I guess I'll let you know if and when I decide to move forward with this whole thing.


----------



## SpaceDock

Rap Hat said:


> Welp, this is what I was afraid of. CC company said no refund, because it had been more than 180 days. When I tried to point out that custom guitars often take more than 180 days to be built, they just repeated that you have 180 days. I then asked if they were giving me the okay to commit fraud as long as I told the person it would be 7 months, and they said no . But I couldn't get them to connect the two situations, even after getting them to agree that they would go after hypothetical me.
> 
> I just want the goddamn guitar. At least now I know I have no choice but to wait.



I figured this would happen, trying to charge back after two years is crazy.

Lets just pray that something will go right, I don't know if there is anything else we can do.


----------



## spawnsc

Qweklain said:


> So what do I do on the BBB page? Just click "File a Complaint" and go through the process?



yep


----------



## Rap Hat

SpaceDock said:


> I figured this would happen, trying to charge back after two years is crazy.
> 
> Lets just pray that something will go right, I don't know if there is anything else we can do.



Yeah, I was expecting that response and up until recently wasn't too keen on even trying, but the complete disappearance of Bernie has changed things. It does bring up an interesting conundrum though; if the card companies aren't willing to go to bat for things being built if the build time is longer than 6 months, what recourse do we really have? A lawsuit would cost more than the guitar in travel costs alone. 

It was insinuated in an earlier conversation with them that since it was being built (i.e. not a regular guitar) the standard 180 days would be waived since it's generally accepted it'll take longer than 6 months, but now that I'm actually trying to go through with it the story changed.

Definitely shows that, no matter how great a deal a custom is, if something goes wrong late in the build process you're shit out of luck. Better trust your builder 100%!

E: I was reading California law regarding preorders, and saw that upon final payment, if the item isn't received within 30 days, the seller has to (without the purchasers insistence) refund the money. That's why the final payment form that Bernie gives says the guitar will be received by the buyer within 30 days. Doesn't mean he followed it, but it's there if someone knows how to pursue it. Of course I listened to Bernie's "just two weeks, I promise" spiel for far too long...


----------



## WickedSymphony

^ You mind posting a reference link or something to that law? It could be useful.


----------



## HRC51

I just filed a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. I can't believe how bad this all went. I hope that by banding together we can achieve a greater outcome than each trying to resolve this alone.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

For what it's worth, I would continue to attempt dialog with your bank. Go to your local branch and talk to the bank manager if you haven't already done so. There MUST be some loophole for extenuating circumstances. Tell them you'll consider closing your account if the end answer is that they can't help you. It's not like you have anything to lose.

Look guys - I don't know how you would even go about filing a claim against BRJ. Maybe you could take him to small claims as individual cases. Just don't give up.


----------



## Rap Hat

WickedSymphony said:


> ^ You mind posting a reference link or something to that law? It could be useful.



I'm trying to retrace my steps to how I came across that without digging through California law directly - unfortunately I'm using Chrome on an ipad, which seems to have no "history" option (or I'm blind). When I get back on a PC I'll see what I can do, this is definitely an important fact.


Small update re: CC - calling back this morning, I was able to get a better answer. Apparently, their computer systems don't keep any records beyond 180 days, which means they can't even look something like this up. They have paper records, but for some reason this all needs to be done on their computer. So the lady got her manager, who said that if we mail or fax them all the info there's a chance (however small) they'll be able to do something.

I did have to use "would you tell some rich dude who paid for a yacht to be built that he's shit out of luck if it takes longer than 6 months?" though. Dumb and inaccurate analogies work!

E: Just noticed a comment above - in my case I'm only trying to get the final payment back, which was made a little over a year ago. I got my spot from someone else, and I've already written off that money if a guitar doesn't get completed. It does suck losing a third of the $, but I'm not going to go after the guy I got it from; I don't even think he plays guitar anymore.


----------



## spawnsc

I had to fax my bank a letter about the situation and sign it and included the statements of the payments I made in 2011 and all emails sent back and forth with Bernie along with the receipt of the guitar. It was about 30 pages of stuff I faxed over and I got a letter in the mail from my bank saying they are investigating the issue and could take up to 30 days. I also put a case in with the BBB about 2 weeks ago. Keep pushing people we will get answers, those who think they are getting a guitar from Bernie are fooled.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Here's what I am doing to resolve this issue.

I've contacted my credit card company to alert them that I want to dispute a charge.

Since I've dealt with similar issues in the past, I compiled all communication between Bernir Rico jr Guitars and myself. This communication also includes posts on Sevenstring.org. I've taken screen shots of all email communication and any relevant posts on this site. I've also taken a screen shot of the original advertisement that enticed me to attempt to purchase a BRJ guitar. Since it has been past 6-months since the purchase occurred, I am including the original billing statement that I received from my cc that shows my purchase from BrJ. I am sending all of this information to my credit card company.

In addition to the many screen shots that I am sending to my bank, I am also including a detailed disclosure statement of my dispute. The disclosure statement includes my account of the events, in chronological order, from my first contact with BRJ, until now. It's detailed, very detailed. The only form of contact that I cannot include are phone texts.

Last, I have filed a report with my local police department regarding fraudulent activity. I will state this again, I am not a black friday customer and I have proof that Bernie Rico jr has failed to comply with the terms of my sale. I'm not sure if this will work for the rest of you, but filing a police report at this point in the game will not hurt any customer.


----------



## Tesla

Ill-Gotten James said:


> Here's what I am doing to resolve this issue.
> 
> I've contacted my credit card company to alert them that I want to dispute a charge.
> 
> Since I've dealt with similar issues in the past, I compiled all communication between Bernir Rico jr Guitars and myself. This communication also includes posts on Sevenstring.org. I've taken screen shots of all email communication and any relevant posts on this site. I've also taken a screen shot of the original advertisement that enticed me to attempt to purchase a BRJ guitar. Since it has been past 6-months since the purchase occurred, I am including the original billing statement that I received from my cc that shows my purchase from BrJ. I am sending all of this information to my credit card company.
> 
> In addition to the many screen shots that I am sending to my bank, I am also including a detailed disclosure statement of my dispute. The disclosure statement includes my account of the events, in chronological order, from my first contact with BRJ, until now. It's detailed, very detailed. The only form of contact that I cannot include are phone texts.
> 
> Last, I have filed a report with my local police department regarding fraudulent activity. I will state this again, I am not a black friday customer and I have proof that Bernie Rico jr has failed to comply with the terms of my sale. I'm not sure if this will work for the rest of you, but filing a police report at this point in the game will not hurt any customer.



I'd also send links for all the screenshotted pages as well, just for further proof incase anyone tries to dispute the authenticity of the screenshots!


----------



## noob_pwn

Sucks for me, I paid in full and being an international customer I have no legal leg to stand on. Fuck this

edit: I've also owned 3 other BRJ's which were phenomenal instruments and was sent a picture of my 3/4 completed guitar about 18 months ago. If I could only get my hands on it, I would just finish it myself.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

noob_pwn said:


> Sucks for me, I paid in full and being an international customer I have no legal leg to stand on. Fuck this
> 
> edit: I've also owned 3 other BRJ's which were phenomenal instruments and was sent a picture of my 3/4 completed guitar about 18 months ago. If I could only get my hands on it, I would just finish it myself.



Uh... I'm pretty sure that's incorrect dude. How did you pay for it? You should still try and dispute it no matter what rather than just get boned in the bum over this.


----------



## MJS

If it turns out to be fraud (_note that it hasn't been proven yet_), this is where Craigslist sends people to report fraud: Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3) | Home

That might be useful for you international guys, since they only seem to require that 1 of the 2 parties involved is in the US.


----------



## spawnsc

my bank called me this morning and pretty said "sorry you're fucked" since its out of the time frame that they are allowed to dispute and that I should look into other actions for getting my money back. 

Guys I think we should just chalk up our losses. He may have our money but we can control his the future and reputation as a company. Maybe we should blow up his Facebook page on how much of a fraud he is, the fucker. I think its funny how people are asking on his wall how to place an order... if they only knew.

I'm so pissed

/rant


----------



## foreright

spawnsc said:


> Guys I think we should just chalk up our losses.



Seriously?? You must be pretty rich or cavalier with your money to write of quite a few thousand dollars (which I believe quite a few people are out...) without trying any more than speaking to your bank and then posting on facebook!

I would be suing this fucker into the ground regardless of what it cost and making sure he's bankrupted forever.

That's just me though and I'm a vindictive sod when it comes to people making me look like a mug 

Honestly though, the police / press (in that order) should be involved - this is a fraud and not exactly a small one!


----------



## killertone

I'm not chalking up shit. I'll get something out of that guy. I know won't be any cash but I'll get something.


----------



## Rap Hat

Lawsuits are great and all, but the costs to file, travel, etc are often more than what you'd get. And that's if the person has any money to begin with. I've been involved with a bunch of suits from clients refusing to pay for work done (sometimes totaling in the $20-30,000 range) and even with judgements against them, if we do see any money it can take years.

In the case of these guitars, by the time you're in California and filing, you've probably already gone over what the guitar cost. For people who have 3-5 builds I could see it being financially feasible, but in my case I literally don't have a couple grand to toss around for the small chance I'd see anything in return.


----------



## engage757

spawnsc said:


> my bank called me this morning and pretty said "sorry you're fucked" since its out of the time frame that they are allowed to dispute and that I should look into other actions for getting my money back.
> 
> Guys I think we should just chalk up our losses. He may have our money but we can control his the future and reputation as a company. Maybe we should blow up his Facebook page on how much of a fraud he is, the fucker. I think its funny how people are asking on his wall how to place an order... if they only knew.
> 
> I'm so pissed
> 
> /rant




You need to take a breath. Don't make any decisions while you are pissed, that's when you make mistakes, and you can't afford to do that now. 

Think about it, his future as a company looks potentially over already, and his reputation is already gone.

Calm down. take emotion out and think logically about the next course of action. 

I think it is interesting how much shit is being talked in this thread but the BBB only has one complaint against him listed online. EVERYONE needs to take 15 minutes and go file a complaint. Stop discussing it, just go do it. That is step one. NOTHING to talk about that isn't useless bitching until that is done. THe BBB is not investigating shit on one consumer complaint, but you best be DAMN sure they are going to when it comes to a hundred complaints.

Step two is to determine whether or not a class-action is the way to go. Individual claims against him will have a lot of credibility if the BBB has multiple complaints. A class-action will need legal representation, and a LOT more organization than a plethora of individual lawsuits. What is the best option? Banding together under legal counsel and having to pay them, or everyone launching their own individual small claim against the business at one time. 

What is another potential step? Go to your local police headquarters and file Criminal Charges against him. THis will get complicated, but it is VERY do-able.

After those two beginning steps are done, when you guys have actually STARTED on a course of action and have a game plan, then you can bitch. But honestly fellas, you need to get on this if you are going to do it. All of this conjecture, raw emotions, bitching etc isn't helping anything. Instead of writing a ten minute rant on here, write it to the BBB. "Blowing up" Facebook pages isn't going to get your money back, and will more than likely not help ANYTHING. Instead of ten people saying they are going to go "kick his door in" or whatever, do something constructive. NO ONE is going to go to the shop, they are just talking about it. Internet tough guys.

Be Smart fellas. And go get that filed. SHOW a potential claims court that you have exhausted all options and have made a record of all the times you tried to contact and the lack of response. I am telling you. GO FILE WITH THE BBB.


----------



## engage757

And as for all the "press" talk, that isn't happening. Wait until you have multiple pending lawsuits/1 class action, 100 complaints in the BBB, Criminal charges filed etc. Then the "press" will actually care.


----------



## thrsher

MJS said:


> If it turns out to be fraud (_note that it hasn't been proven yet_), this is where Craigslist sends people to report fraud: Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3) | Home
> 
> That might be useful for you international guys, since they only seem to require that 1 of the 2 parties involved is in the US.



i have used that site for an unrelated matter and never recieved any repsonse from it. mabye 50 people all at once though might do something


----------



## engage757

thrsher said:


> i have used that site for an unrelated matter and never recieved any repsonse from it. mabye 50 people all at once though might do something



NOW you are thinking! 50 complaints from individuals against one business on that site and the BBB? Another thing to think about. THis crosses state lines, as well as country borders. Interpol/F.B.I. may get involved if enough complaints are filed.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah, from the way people freak out and then never do anything at all, one would be of the impression that they paid for their custom guitar(s) with drug money or something...

Basically, the only way I got Bernie to actually deliver my guitar to me was, while he was still answering my calls, telling him it would be "very unfortunate for both of us if I had to find some other legal way to resolve our business together". He freaked out shortly afterward, but I was not feigning. If I didn't get my guitar sent to me, I would have taken whatever legal action I needed in order to receive my guitar, or receive my money back.

Just because your bank says no one time doesn't mean you should stop trying. When my bank (BoA) screwed up and deposited my money into the wrong account, bouncing my rent check, they went so far as to call my apartment manager asking them to pay the fine of $100, even though it was their fault. They're in perpetual cover-ass-and-act-like-whiny-bitch mode. If you sit down and show them that there is no fault in the fact that you had to wait further than 6 months to reverse charges, you should be able to talk some sense into them. If not, politely inform them that you would like to close your account with them and go give a local credit union your business. And if they don't comply, do just that. And then complain to corporate in an emotionless letter stating your case.


----------



## ovation22

No luck with lawyers and a class action lawsuit, yet. I'm not ready to give up. If others have better luck please let me/us know.

I have just filed a complaint with IC3.

I'm also going to explore filing a police report locally.


----------



## xCaptainx

RicoJR Guitars Production said:


> An open letter to all SS.org members
> 
> Dear all ss.org members my name is Chris G, and I am the newly appointed production manager at Rico Jr Guitars..




Does anyone have any knowledge as to who 'Chris G' actually is? I just searched LinkedIn and friends list of Bernie Rico Jr, I can't find a 'Chris' that would have fit this description. 

Where is this dude huh?


----------



## axxessdenied

Everyone should be filing complaints with BBB. Get enough complaints on there and I think a class action lawsuit would look more promising. No matter how nice you are as a person. Busines is fucking BUSINESS. You are TAKING peoples money and not giving them anything in return. That's called fucking theft. If he took care of this properly, and let people know what the hell was going on, than maybe this course of action wouldn't need to be taken. 

But, no matter how nice a person is, when it comes to money you can't trust anyone. Sometimes legal action is the swift kick in the ass they need to get their shit together!


----------



## Khoi

*For those wondering how to file a BBB complaint:*


Go to United States and Canada BBB Consumer and Business Reviews, Reports, Ratings, Complaints and Accredited Business Listings

Type in YOUR postal zipcode to find the BBB closest to you

Click on "FILE A COMPLAINT"

"Start your complaint"

In the Find Business section, the business is "Bernie Rico Jr.", in the city of "Hesperia, CA"

You will then be re-directed to the LA BBB

Fill out Complaint Form


----------



## thrsher

did anyone call the local authorities in hesperia cali?


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

A few pages back someone said they called the cops and they went to go check on the workshop didnt they?


----------



## jeleopard

I'm surprised it has taken you guys like 2 years to contact a lawyer. I'd get mine ready upon purchasing a custom and not hearing ANYTHING back for a month.


----------



## engage757

jeleopard said:


> I'm surprised it has taken you guys like 2 years to contact a lawyer. I'd get mine ready upon purchasing a custom and not hearing ANYTHING back for a month.



Then you would be really worried dealing with ANY custom guitar maker for the most part.


----------



## ovation22

Here's the reply I received from the California State Attorney General:



> ...We will retain your consumer complaint in our files because at some future date, legal action could be taken against this company by our office. If legal action is taken against the company named in your letter, your complaint could be utilized as important evidence and provide vital documentation for our use on behalf of all California consumer's interests...



Please, in addition to contacting the BBB, consider filing a complaint with the CA State Attorney General:

Consumer Complaint Against A Business/Company | State of California - Department of Justice - Kamala D. Harris Attorney General


----------



## SpaceDock

I filed with the BBB. Ill be sending bernie an email in the hopes he'll respond. I just can't believe thisis happening.


----------



## spawnsc

sorry guys i've had a bad day overall today and with the bank calling me saying nothing they could do just didn't help my day.

I've already did BBB about 3 weeks ago and they are still waiting to hear back from Bernie (go figure) buts going to be interesting when they start receiving more complaints. Ovation22 i'll look into the link you posted as well. Let not let him take our money and lets just all work together to resolve this issue.


----------



## spawnsc

ovation22 said:


> Here's the reply I received from the California State Attorney General:
> 
> 
> 
> Please, in addition to contacting the BBB, consider filing a complaint with the CA State Attorney General:
> 
> Consumer Complaint Against A Business/Company | State of California - Department of Justice - Kamala D. Harris Attorney General



Just filed complaint. So far we have hit the BBB up, our banks, and now this site.. the shit going to hit the fan hopefully and we can hopefully celebrate in getting our investments back.


----------



## JP Universe

Fingers crossed something can be done for us international guys


----------



## axxessdenied

You guys are doing the right thing! Make enough noise and Bernie will definitely notice that people have had enough.


----------



## Khoi

SpaceDock said:


> I filed with the BBB. Ill be sending bernie an email in the hopes he'll respond. I just can't believe thisis happening.



I can't either.. this is the last thing that any of us want, but I've lost all hope and don't see me getting my guitar any time soon, even though it's been "almost done"


----------



## spawnsc

jeleopard said:


> I'm surprised it has taken you guys like 2 years to contact a lawyer. I'd get mine ready upon purchasing a custom and not hearing ANYTHING back for a month.



We believed in Bernie because he DID have such a good reputation for quality guitars and figured he would come through for us sooner or later.

But now it seems.....


----------



## killertone

I have filed a BBB complaint and a complaint with the CA AG. 

This sucks ass. I feel like a total idiot. I have never been taken before in my life.


----------



## Rap Hat

killertone said:


> I have filed a BBB complaint and a complaint with the CA AG.
> 
> This sucks ass. I feel like a total idiot. I have never been taken before in my life.



Yeah, I feel the same, at least you're not alone in that!

It really sucks too, because Bernie could be a really nice guy and he had a good thing going with a good family name. It's hard to believe things took this turn, but knowing firsthand how expensive medical bills are (and the toll on a family) I'm not really surprised. I'm more baffled that he wouldn't communicate with the clients, even if it did mean saying "I'm not sure I can finish the guitar". He had a lot of goodwill in the community, and people would've been more supportive had he been even partially open about the state of the business. At this point, even if he does reappear and promises the guitars will be done soon, people aren't going to accept that. He's done it three or four times already with literally nothing to show.

It's not even the wait that's an issue. I'd be okay with waiting more than 2 years for a nice custom. But when there's no contact from the builder, that sets off red flags and makes people unwilling to compromise.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

killertone said:


> I have filed a BBB complaint and a complaint with the CA AG.
> 
> This sucks ass. I feel like a total idiot. I have never been taken before in my life.



You shouldn't feel like an idiot, dude. It's not like he was some spankin'-fresh luthier who rolled out of nowhere and started shafting people. Remember, BRJ guitars was well established, with many happy endorsees, a couple of which were pretty decent names in at least the underground community.

When things started to go badly, a lot of these endorsees never spoke up about it, and some still shilled for him when doubts started to arise. Now that all hell is breaking loose, many of them pretty much just resorted to passive-aggressive BS about how "sad it is that things have gone this way".

So, you really didn't get taken. You were going with the best information that you had, and things went south.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Rap Hat said:


> It's not even the wait that's an issue. I'd be okay with waiting more than 2 years for a nice custom. But when there's no contact from the builder, that sets off red flags and makes people unwilling to compromise.



How about the fact that almost every single build within the last 2 years of his career has at least had wrongs specs, or has in many cases had flaws so ridiculous you'd figure he'd been making guitars in the dark? 

Waiting almost 2 years to get a guitar that was promised to me in 4 months only to find out that he: 

Screwed up the specs on the finish and the neck finish, and then screwed up the secondary preference on the neck finish, then lied about refunding me the extra money for the difference in cost to do the finish I originally asked for, and then avoiding any contact I ever had with him. And then setting my guitar up so badly that I had to put an additional $150 into it just so it would intonate properly and play without fret buzz and praying that the ebony was dried properly so that it doesn't shit out after a couple months because you know that there is no way you'll ever hear from the fucker again. 

Yeah - that's a great company owner, bro.


----------



## Rap Hat

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Yeah - that's a great company owner, bro.



Hey, I never said I'd be fine with waiting for 2 years for the pieces of shit he's been putting out, just that a 2 year wait for a nice custom would be okay with me. I was around for all the "wood guy" nonsense, it was clear even then that Bernie's involvement didn't come in until the guitar was cut and glued. I can feel sorry for the man but still think he's a shit business owner and not-so-great builder.

E: how bad the builds are is a whole 'nother can of worms, to be frank. I feel sorry for everyone who received one with all those issues, then I remember I'm supposed to be getting one too...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

And that's why I believe everyone who can should hit the eject button ASAP.


----------



## killertone

Hey Spec and Rap - 

The huge problem with me is that we still have no idea what happened to the guy. Like I said in a previous post, we don't know if he is dying in a hospital, in rehab, or chilling on a beach somewhere. No one knows shit. 

I went to the shop in early Feb. 2012 and hung out with Bernie for almost a whole day. Had a good time and Bernie was super cool to me. I held both of my guitars in their unfinished states. I have pics of both of them painted and one of them with hardware on it. I mean what the MFing F? So close...what the hell happened?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

It sounds like he is sick, but that's the problem... on numerous occasions he's just left it swinging in the wind with absolutely no contact. Even before he had health problems, I was told my guitar was just getting ready for finishing and that it would be ready in 2 weeks (August of 2011), and then I didn't hear from him or John (when he still worked with Bernie) for 4 months. When he called me back, he didn't know who I was, what guitar was mine, when I placed my order, if I'd paid anything on the guitar yet.

The pattern of behavior is totally bizarre. And as said before - me giving him money was not an act of friendship. It was a business deal. He is not holding up his end of the business deal anymore, and people need to stop it with the "but Bern is such a nice dude" deal - that dog won't hunt.


----------



## engage757

spawnsc said:


> We believed in Bernie because he DID have such a good reputation for quality guitars and figured he would come through for us sooner or later.
> 
> But now it seems.....



probably not at all actually. THat money is LONG gone.


----------



## killertone

Speculum Speculorum said:


> It sounds like he is sick, but that's the problem... on numerous occasions he's just left it swinging in the wind with absolutely no contact. Even before he had health problems, I was told my guitar was just getting ready for finishing and that it would be ready in 2 weeks (August of 2011), and then I didn't hear from him or John (when he still worked with Bernie) for 4 months. When he called me back, he didn't know who I was, what guitar was mine, when I placed my order, if I'd paid anything on the guitar yet.
> 
> The pattern of behavior is totally bizarre. And as said before - me giving him money was not an act of friendship. It was a business deal. He is not holding up his end of the business deal anymore, and people need to stop it with the "but Bern is such a nice dude" deal - that dog won't hunt.




Completely agree. If Bernie was truly a nice guy he would communicate with his customers and at the very least give them an explanation as to why he has disappeared. 

I ordered my first guitar on 11/25/10. I have been through everything you mentioned. There was a time when I could text or email Bernie and hear back within 24 hours or so but that has been since the end of Summer of '12. After that it was very hard to get any response back and the ones I did get didn't sound like it was even him responding.


----------



## rifftrauma

I am completely torn on this topic. I have a $4000 custom guitar being built, I know it exists somewhere, have the pictures as proof. When I ordered the guitar I was quoted 12 months, that passed back in September. So officially I'm on month 18 of waiting and because of all the SNAFU in this thread I just assumed it was going to be about 2 years before the guitar was done. Now this shit storm has ensued and I feel guilty because I haven't emailed Bernie repeatedly over the past year. I just assumed it was going to take a long time and left it at that. I haven't been pinging the guy over and over and I would feel like a piece of shit to just drop some lawsuit or other action against the guy. Honestly I'd just like my guitar...


----------



## JPMike

What we, the international guys can do about it?


----------



## ovation22

rifftrauma said:


> I am completely torn on this topic. I have a $4000 custom guitar being built, I know it exists somewhere, have the pictures as proof. When I ordered the guitar I was quoted 12 months, that passed back in September. So officially I'm on month 18 of waiting and because of all the SNAFU in this thread I just assumed it was going to be about 2 years before the guitar was done. Now this shit storm has ensued and I feel guilty because I haven't emailed Bernie repeatedly over the past year. I just assumed it was going to take a long time and left it at that. I haven't been pinging the guy over and over and I would feel like a piece of shit to just drop some lawsuit or other action against the guy. Honestly I'd just like my guitar...



I was in the same boat with my full custom. When I did finally follow up with him after a year he told me it was in the wood shop. It took another 6 months for him to finally admit he lost the paperwork and it was never started.

Funny thing is, I could still log into his website and see my order wih spec sheet. That is, until the website was taken down.


----------



## mikernaut

Not sure he really has many endorsers left either. They have seem to have thrown in the towel and gone with other brands that are much more reliable. 

It's not hard to release a statement via your official site or Facebook to update your customers, that just blows my mind.


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea the only way I knew it was mine was that I had a custom Inlay drawn up, and the guitar he sent me pictures of already had the finished inlay. Otherwise I'd be more skeptical, still a shitty spot either way I guess.


----------



## MJS

MJS said:


> If it turns out to be fraud (_note that it hasn't been proven yet_), this is where Craigslist sends people to report fraud: *Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3) | Home*
> 
> _That might be useful for you international guys_, since they only seem to require that 1 of the 2 parties involved is in the US.





JPMike said:


> What we, the international guys can do about it?



Here you go. The posts with useful info in them tend to get buried under the ones about vandalizing his FB page, making lawyers richer with silly class action suits, just giving up, random guesses, misleading info, etc...


----------



## engage757

JPMike said:


> What we, the international guys can do about it?



You guys should all get together and contact INTERPOL I feel like.


----------



## PrestigeRS4

I'm wondering if something happened in the shop. Like all the woods went to shit and everything got destroyed or something. To leave people in the dark means some serious shit went down.


----------



## JPMike

mikernaut said:


> It's not hard to release a statement via your official site or Facebook to update your customers, that just blows my mind.




EXACTLY!!!!!


----------



## killertone

PrestigeRS4 said:


> I'm wondering if something happened in the shop. Like all the woods went to shit and everything got destroyed or something. To leave people in the dark means some serious shit went down.



Bingo. 

There are a SHITLOAD of guitars in his shop. There must have been at least 100 or so when I was there in various states of completion. Most of them were painted. Wonder what happened to all of them?


----------



## xCaptainx

JPMike said:


> EXACTLY!!!!!



especially as again, this 'Chris G' was introduced a few months ago who would handle all of this. Where the hell has this guy gone to?!?!


----------



## Rap Hat

ovation22 said:


> I was in the same boat with my full custom. When I did finally follow up with him after a year he told me it was in the wood shop. It took another 6 months for him to finally admit he lost the paperwork and it was never started.
> 
> Funny thing is, I could still log into his website and see my order wih spec sheet. That is, until the website was taken down.



Hoooooooooooly shit . My experience hasn't been this bad so far, but it was always jarring talking to Bernie and having him not know who I was or which guitar was mine, when 30 minutes before he'd asked me what pickups I wanted in my build in an email. I laughed the third time he said "okay, I'm putting this in your spec sheet" regarding the Aftermaths that the original buyer had ordered and had sent to Bernie (he eventually decided the guitar was getting Painkillers because he had no record of the Aftermaths and claimed they'd take a long time to order).

That guy probably has 50 sets of customer ordered and paid for pickups sitting there, unlabeled. When a build comes up, he tosses random ones in there and calls them either Aftermaths or Painkillers. Who had the build with the random BKs that weren't what Bernie claimed?


----------



## Qweklain

I just filed my complaint with the BBB. ALL of you who have still not received your guitar (BRJ or not) need to file one too! Don't keep procrastinating, just DO IT so we can all hopefully get some goddamn resolution to this nightmare!!


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

I've been worried about the pickups too. Custom TYGER covered Aftermaths. There's no fucking way you could mix those up. I'll flip if they "disappeared", and I won't accept substitutes. This is assuming some day the guitar actually gets built (or exists).


----------



## Jexey

MJS said:


> Here you go. The posts with useful info in them tend to get buried under the ones about vandalizing his FB page, making lawyers richer with silly class action suits, just giving up, random guesses, misleading info, etc...


 
Silly class action lawsuits? So all those hundreds of thousands of class actions in the past that have been ruled on, most over equivalent stakes, are bullshit? What the fuck kind of blindfolds are you wearing that you discredit hundreds of years of due process?

Lawyers are around for a reason: They work. If Bernie has the assets the court will burn them to get us our restitution. Don't discredit shit just because you have a problem with the legal process (Hint: Everybody does) or don't see a lawsuit coming to fruition.


----------



## elq

^ I suspect his point was that class action suites have tended to pay a massively disproportionate portion of the settlement to the attorney rather than the plaintiffs. 

Also, if you seriously think you're going to get an attorney to file a federal class action lawsuit with max damages in the range of, what, 150 * $1600 you're probably not thinking clearly  

Note that I'm generously ignoring the fact that Bernie is probably effectively broke, so the chances of collecting are near zero. And what assets do you think he has? A painting setup, some setup and wiring tools, and maybe a wood stash? His wood shop is strongly suggested to be in Mexico and is probably untouchable. It's not like he's running a big shop full of Haas machines 

Overall, it would probably be more productive to focus efforts in directions other than collective action law suites


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yes - Bernie is totally broke. A lawsuit at this point would be not the best idea.

Keep focusing your energy on getting your banks or credit card companies to reverse charges. This is, by far, the best way to go about it.


----------



## MJS

elq said:


> ^ I suspect his point was that class action suites have tended to pay a massively disproportionate portion of the settlement to the attorney rather than the plaintiffs.
> 
> Also, if you seriously think you're going to get an attorney to file a federal class action lawsuit with max damages in the range of, what, 150 * $1600 you're probably not thinking clearly



Bingo. 

Not to mention the number of people that would actually get involved would probably be closer to 15 than 150. Up until this week, only 1 person took a whopping 5 minutes to even file a BBB complaint.

The winners in class action settlements are the lawyers that get rich and the big companies that get off light by throwing them a few million bucks to shut up and go away. *Yay! Everyone wins *(except the class members)*!* 

The classmates.com _settlement_ is a good example of how it works... but congrats to those winners with their big fat $3 settlement checks! Oh, and a bigger congratulations to classmates.com that apparently pulled in between $30M and $120M on that scam... and made it all go away with a tiny little $9.5M settlement. 

Not to mention, how many companies knowingly sell dangerous products because it's cheaper to shut a few complainers up with a class action settlement than it is to recall the products? 




elq said:


> Note that I'm generously ignoring the fact that Bernie is probably effectively broke, so the chances of collecting are near zero. And what assets do you think he has? A painting setup, some setup and wiring tools, and maybe a wood stash? His wood shop is strongly suggested to be in Mexico and is probably untouchable. It's not like he's running a big shop full of Haas machines



Exactly. Even in ideal conditions, what were his assets? 

He rents (or rented?) a building that might be empty since no one can see through the blacked out windows.

Tools could have easily been sold off within a few days on Craigslist.

And it's not like anyone is going to look at a pile of dusty wood and mistake it for a gold mine.


----------



## MJS

Jexey said:


> Silly class action lawsuits? So all those hundreds of thousands of class actions in the past that have been ruled on, most over equivalent stakes, are bullshit? What the fuck kind of blindfolds are you wearing that you discredit hundreds of years of due process?
> 
> Lawyers are around for a reason: They work. If Bernie has the assets the court will burn them to get us our restitution. Don't discredit shit just because you have a problem with the legal process (Hint: Everybody does) or don't see a lawsuit coming to fruition.




Hilarious... especially the part where you wrote "Lawyers are around for a reason: They work." 

But who knows, maybe you'll get really lucky, then you can come back and wave a $12 class action settlement check in my face and tell me how wrong I was. 


*EDIT:* I just realized you're the same person that made this post, which pretty much shows that you're better at pointless ranting than thinking things out and grasping how the situation would actually play out in real life.


----------



## Rev2010

Jexey said:


> Silly class action lawsuits? So all those hundreds of thousands of class actions in the past that have been ruled on, most over equivalent stakes, are bullshit? What the fuck kind of blindfolds are you wearing that you discredit hundreds of years of due process?



The two or so posters above me already made the point but I just felt the need to add to this. Class action lawsuits are known by and large to benefit primarily the lawyers handling them. I don't know how old you are, probably quite young I would guess because if you weren't you would have at some point received some bullshit settlement from your credit card company or some other company you've dealt business with, for a lousy $5-$10 for some class action settlement. The thing is the company is forced to pay xxx millions of dollars (for big cases) and after the legal fees the people who started the lawsuit get scraps of left over change. The lawyers get the millions and the customers chump change.

So that is why I believe the person you responded too said "silly class action law suits" - not to say law suits overall are pointless. You'd basically have a better chance of getting a real payout via small claims court than a class action lawsuit. This case however looks like nothing less than fraud... and if those of you on here that are out $1000+ each band together and keep doing something about this there is no doubt in mind Bernie will likely see jail time. Unfortunately, unless he has money in the bank, assets, or property then getting your money back might not actually happen. Either way, at least not letting someone get away with flat out theft is a good cause.

*EDIT - wow, just told my wife the story of what went on here and she's pretty darn good at figuring things out and her immediate reaction was, "Sounds like he might have gotten into some serious gambling debt and ran a black Friday special so he could gather enough cash to pay up, but then couldn't meet demand or possibly took the excess cash and gambled more and got into trouble and just eventually took off" - that is of course PURELY speculation but kind of an interesting theory no?


Rev.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Filing a legal complaint can scare the hell out of someone, but it won't do you any good if someone is judgment proof.

Especially since BRJ as an entity is almost certainly a corporation, and there's not enough money involved here to bother even trying to pierce the corporate veil to get at other assets.


----------



## Rev2010

TemjinStrife said:


> Especially since BRJ as an entity is almost certainly a corporation, and there's not enough money involved here to bother even trying to pierce the corporate veil to get at other assets.



It's astonishing how little you know about law. Fraud is fraud, being incorporated or limited liability does not protect you from fraud charges and/or asset seizure.


Rev.


----------



## elq

um.... he's in law school, I do believe 

and what he wrote is accurate.


----------



## Hollowway

Well, sort of. On his website (though now down) and his facebook page, as well as all collateral material, there is no mention of his corp. (i.e. no "inc" or "corporation" or anything like that.) That's a big no-no in corporations, as it generally pierces the corporate veil from the get-go. Corps can't be "hidden" and are supposed to make it clear to the customer that there is a corp.

It appears, on searching the California government website that his corp has dissolved. The last Statement of Information filing was done in 2005. 

I'm chiming in here, because I am getting pretty discouraged about the whole situation. He's been generally good about answering my emails/phone calls. But I've heard nothing as well. I'm going to have to see what I can do to get my money/guitar as well.

Unfortunately, one person cannot represent another in small claims court in California. Otherwise I'd just go represent everyone.


----------



## elq

But I don't think this changes TemjinStrife's point, which was basically if Bernie doesn't have cash, you get no money.


Edit: derp. I think I misread. I wish everyone luck in resolving their issues with Bernie, but I don't think satisfaction will be coming...


----------



## Hollowway

elq said:


> But I don't think this changes TemjinStrife's point, which was basically if Bernie doesn't have cash, you get no money.
> 
> 
> Edit: derp. I think I misread. I wish everyone luck in resolving their issues with Bernie, but I don't think satisfaction will be coming...



Ah, good find. I only found the dissolved one. I agree with you that the odds of getting money aren't great, but I also would be VERY surprised if he is out of money. My guess is the business is out of money, but he, personally, isn't. I have no way of knowing that, though. At any rate, I'm going to try to do what I can to get some sort of resolution. I'm about 5 hours drive from his place, so it wouldn't be the end of the world to at least see what the heck is going on. I just have to find out where he lives, and either drop by or call the home number or something.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Rev2010 said:


> It's astonishing how little you know about law. Fraud is fraud, being incorporated or limited liability does not protect you from fraud charges and/or asset seizure.
> 
> 
> Rev.



Since it's likely most of you dealt with a corporation, you can likely only sue the corporation... and corporations exist to limit the personal liability of those who invest in them. To get at Bernie himself and his assets, you'd have to pierce the corporate veil, which is relatively difficult to do and typically quite expensive to argue, since it would require a fair bit of discovery into business practices and the like. While it's not impossible, you're looking probably a dozen hours of research, filing a complaint and a few discovery motions, plus at least one deposition. That'd eat up pretty much any recovery you might be able to secure.

My point is that the mere existence of such potential defenses drives the cost of bringing suit up dramatically... which means that, with the amount of money in question here, you're limited to suing the BRJ corporate entity. Therefore, you would require someone to do some research to determine if the corporation has any assets worth chasing in the first place.

Your best bet at this point is to continue to take action through organizations designed to protect consumers. IIRC, California has very strong pro-consumer laws, so there might be some cheaper cause of action in there as well. Hiring someone to draft a nastygram might not be a terrible idea either if you really want to burn bridges but try to force a result.

I mean, there's certainly the basis for a lawsuit here. Whether it would accomplish anything beyond earning the lawyer a retainer is something else entirely...


----------



## aiur55

I haven't been active on this forum for a while now but I also do have a guitar on order from BRJ. Being from Canada, I probably cannot do much to see my money or the guitar again. However, I couldn't find his business in the BBB either to file a complaint.

It really is amazing that so many people stuck up for him these past 2 years and we all get shafted because of it. I do agree with most people that a lawsuit would most likely be extremely costly and not help any of us recover our assets.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ the link to the BBB is a few pages back. 

I got a response a couple days ago from the BBB saying they have contacted BRJ and are waiting to hear back from him.


----------



## chimp_spanner

Speculum Speculorum said:


> You shouldn't feel like an idiot, dude. It's not like he was some spankin'-fresh luthier who rolled out of nowhere and started shafting people. Remember, BRJ guitars was well established, with many happy endorsees, a couple of which were pretty decent names in at least the underground community.
> 
> When things started to go badly, a lot of these endorsees never spoke up about it, and some still shilled for him when doubts started to arise. Now that all hell is breaking loose, many of them pretty much just resorted to passive-aggressive BS about how "sad it is that things have gone this way".
> 
> So, you really didn't get taken. You were going with the best information that you had, and things went south.



As I've said before I deeply regret not being more open about my experience. I've learnt two things; firstly not to endorse something I have NO prior experience of (a mistake a LOT of poor self made musicians have made, and an easy one at that), and secondly not to be afraid to call manufacturers out if they fail to deliver. In my own defence, I didn't feel it would've been entirely fair to be critical of my instrument given it was free. I also assumed that my total lack of enthusiasm about the guitar would speak volumes. No videos, no pictures, nothing. As a potential buyer, that would raise alarm bells to me.

I don't want to take this too far OT but I will accept that many people who have become involved with this probably did so because people like me were just trying to be courteous and professional, but ultimately ended up being far too vague/easy on Bernie. I guess we just thought he'd come through and sort his shit out.


----------



## JPMike

I feel somehow hopeless about it, since we guys who don't live in the US, don't know what to do.


----------



## MJS

JPMike said:


> I feel somehow hopeless about it, since we guys who don't live in the US, don't know what to do.





What about this?


----------



## JPMike

MJS said:


> What about this?



Thanks, sorry didn't notice. I am just in stupid mode lately.


----------



## Qweklain

Hollowway said:


> Ah, good find. I only found the dissolved one. I agree with you that the odds of getting money aren't great, but I also would be VERY surprised if he is out of money. My guess is the business is out of money, but he, personally, isn't. I have no way of knowing that, though. At any rate, I'm going to try to do what I can to get some sort of resolution. I'm about 5 hours drive from his place, so it wouldn't be the end of the world to at least see what the heck is going on. I just have to find out where he lives, and either drop by or call the home number or something.


If you do go and actually get some contact, I will seriously throw you (digitally of course) like $20 to help pay for fuels/time. Just PM me and I will give you some details on my axe that is done. Shit if you could grab it for me... ANYWAY, PM me if you are for sure going to go!


----------



## SpaceDock

Qweklain said:


> If you do go and actually get some contact, I will seriously throw you (digitally of course) like $20 to help pay for fuels/time. Just PM me and I will give you some details on my axe that is done. Shit if you could grab it for me... ANYWAY, PM me if you are for sure going to go!



I second this


----------



## JPMike

Well, I just filled a complaint form with https://complaint.ic3.gov/. I am losing way too much money with Bernie.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

chimp_spanner said:


> As I've said before I deeply regret not being more open about my experience. I've learnt two things; firstly not to endorse something I have NO prior experience of (a mistake a LOT of poor self made musicians have made, and an easy one at that), and secondly not to be afraid to call manufacturers out if they fail to deliver. In my own defence, I didn't feel it would've been entirely fair to be critical of my instrument given it was free. I also assumed that my total lack of enthusiasm about the guitar would speak volumes. No videos, no pictures, nothing. As a potential buyer, that would raise alarm bells to me.
> 
> I don't want to take this too far OT but I will accept that many people who have become involved with this probably did so because people like me were just trying to be courteous and professional, but ultimately ended up being far too vague/easy on Bernie. I guess we just thought he'd come through and sort his shit out.



Well for the record I don't really blame you and I wasn't trying to call you out. You at least had the balls to ultimately come out and talk about your experience. A lot of guys in the business end of things are afraid of stepping on people's toes because they're afraid somehow it will come back to bite them in the ass with future business deals.

We certainly should avoid cutting the guy (Bernie) down at a personal level. I think that saying stuff like "he's run off with our money" or "he's spending my cash on drugs or something" is pretty irresponsible. Nobody is better off with ad homonym attacks. 

We do need to be more critical of insanely irresponsible behaviors and quality control problems though right from the get-go. If telling the truth about a product means that others are going to look at me and say "Oh he's too critical - I won't ever do business with him because he'll hack me up if I screw something up" - well fuck you then. If your product and ethics were worth a shit you wouldn't have to worry about it.


----------



## Hollowway

JPMike said:


> Well, I just filled a complaint form with https://complaint.ic3.gov/. I am losing way too much money with Bernie.



I just did that as well.

US citizens (maybe others as well?) can also file with the Federal Trade Commission Consumer Protection Agency. https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?lang=en


----------



## aiur55

SpaceDock said:


> ^ the link to the BBB is a few pages back.
> 
> I got a response a couple days ago from the BBB saying they have contacted BRJ and are waiting to hear back from him.



I used the link and followed the instructions but could not find the business when I searched. I must be doing something wrong.

I do hope we hear something from somebody regarding this.


----------



## ovation22

aiur55 said:


> I used the link and followed the instructions but could not find the business when I searched. I must be doing something wrong.
> 
> I do hope we hear something from somebody regarding this.




Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars Business Review in Hesperia, CA


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> I just did that as well.
> 
> US citizens (maybe others as well?) can also file with the Federal Trade Commission Consumer Protection Agency. https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?lang=en



I think it's only for American Citizens.


----------



## ovation22

So far I've contacted the BBB, FTC, IC3, the CA AG, and a few lawyer friends.

I'm getting pretty discouraged too. The lawyers I've spoken too say there aren't many options other than small claims, and it's just not worth my time (or travel costs).

Unless anyone else has any other ideas, it looks like Bernie wins this round.


----------



## xCaptainx

This is a REAL long shot, but here was an artist called Finbar O'Hanlon who was posting about a NAMM 2013 appearance in leiu of a new signature Bernie Rico Jr he was announcing. 

Given that NAMM fell much later than any confirmed correspondence with Bernie, I figured he might have some additional info. I've sent him a message asking if he could shed some light on the matter. 

No reply yet, he hasn't posted anything since Feb 15th so not sure if I'm going to get a response, but hey it's worth a try.


----------



## xCaptainx

ok wow, just got an update. Won't post the entire thing but in general terms: 

- he hasn't spoken to him for months and said bernie is 'sick/unwell' 
- he's also tried his number without any reply
- staffing issues at his workshop (workers not showing up, workers ruining whole production lines before being fired) 
- he's one year into his wait for his guitar 
- Bernie has no one working for him now
- Chris G (who posted in here a while ago) has left, he couldn't cope with the negative communication (though communication was his job? what did he expect?) 

Unfortunately, no real suprises or new bits of information there. He's in the same boat as everyone else I'm afraid.


----------



## JPMike

God damn... For real? Bernie is all alone?




ovation22 said:


> So far I've contacted the BBB, FTC, IC3, the CA AG, and a few lawyer friends.
> 
> I'm getting pretty discouraged too. The lawyers I've spoken too say there aren't many options other than small claims, and it's just not worth my time (or travel costs).
> 
> Unless anyone else has any other ideas, it looks like Bernie wins this round.



Bernie wins this round? 

That means he gets the money without giving anything back? How can this be possible? We are not talking about a hundred bucks here.


----------



## SpaceDock

I think it is time to hurry up and wait. Based on these new findings I don't think Bernie was ever out to screw us. There is really nothing left at this point but pray he gets better and can finish some guitars this year.


----------



## xCaptainx

Thing I don't get though, was the huge focus on how difficult BRJ and Chris G were finding the negative communication. 

Yeah, people are upset. I think they have every right to be. But putting your head in the sand and ears in your fingers is not an effective way to run a business. 

You could still ignore all the hate and negative comments and just put up quick status updates, ANY communication would be great right now. I think every customer here has a right to have an update.


----------



## leonardo7

If I was sick and in his exact position and had nobody professional and trustworthy to help out, Id like to think that Id ask my wife to at least go onto my facebook to say something for me. I mean, unless your in a coma or cant move Id like to also assume that you could just do it yourself.


----------



## Jonathan20022

SpaceDock said:


> I think it is time to hurry up and wait. Based on these new findings I don't think Bernie was ever out to screw us. There is really nothing left at this point but pray he gets better and can finish some guitars this year.



New findings weren't anything new, it's honestly just another person who hasn't spoken to him in months and last I heard and say there was a gent in his shop in November checking out his Guitar. There's pictures of it on FB, so he's as in touch with accurate information as anyone else here is.

He could very well be doing anything at this moment, there's nothing there to prove that he's either BSing everyone. Or actually sick, so unless someone finds out from local hospitals where he is don't assume until we have facts.


----------



## ovation22

Another 3rd hand (or is it 4th now?) report of Bernie's illness? Seriously, a report from someone closer to the source (or the man himself) couldn't be that hard.


----------



## JPMike

At the same time, I feel really bad for all this but on the other hand, I really wish Bernie could have said something to avoid all this.


----------



## Rap Hat

It was definitely speculated, but now getting some (admittedly thirdhand) info that Bernie has no one working for him and had whole lines "ruined by employees" should show that there's a snowball's chance in hell the guitars will get done. 

At the very least file a complaint with a consumer organization/the FTC, and if you paid in full less than 120 (or whatever) days ago *GET THAT BACK NOW!!!* that last part I can't stress enough. If you wait in the hopes that Bernie will somehow bring in enough money with brand new custom orders to hire a whole new crew (because he most certainly doesn't have any $ now), you're going to lose it and end up in the headache a lot of us are in.

 To reiterate for the lurkers/people who are thinking "there's no way I'm going to get screwed now that I've paid, all it needs is a case/strings/hardware!" (This is what I thought): I paid in full in December of 2011, when Bernie told me the guitar was a week or two from being finished (only needed the hardware installed, holes were already drilled, finish was done). In mid-2012, he promised "one more week", then that was the last he communicated with me.


----------



## xCaptainx

ovation22 said:


> Another 3rd hand (or is it 4th now?) report of Bernie's illness? Seriously, a report from someone closer to the source (or the man himself) couldn't be that hard.



Hey, I tried my best. Finbar was very vocal about being at NAMM 2013 with a new 'signature guitar'. I took from that that he had contact with Bernie from January at the very latest?


----------



## leonardo7

When we were on tour in Oct '11 we stopped by his shop for an hour and I took some photos. I havent posted them yet but thought I would share em now.


----------



## leonardo7




----------



## Qweklain

leonardo7 said:


> When we were on tour in Oct '11 we stopped by his shop for an hour and I took some photos. I havent posted them yet but thought I would share em now.
> (lots of guitars in progress pics above)


Cool pictures if they were posted at the time, but completely irrelevant now. Please don't take that as me being a dick! I don't mean it to come off that way.


----------



## leonardo7

Qweklain said:


> Cool pictures if they were posted at the time, but completely irrelevant now. Please don't take that as me being a dick! I don't mean it to come off that way.



No prob. I expected some people to not understand why I didn't post em earlier. Bernie asked me at the time not to post em so I didn't out of respect for him. Then the computer they were on had a crashed motherboard and it took me about a year to get it fixed. I finally got the HP fixed last week and remembered I had these photos. By the way, these photos were just taken for memories as this was really before all this shit went down.


----------



## SpaceDock

Major cock tease bro. 

Seems like each guitar is so close, that's what makes this so hard.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Bernie looks a lot thinner and a lot less "old" in those pics.


----------



## killertone

My guitar is in those pics...fourth one up from the bottom. 

I was there as well and there was no evidence of anyone else working there. Pretty sure Bernie has had no one work there permanently except his paint guy Ed and I'm not sure he is there all that much. 

Remember that guy Mtech that used to be on here helping Bernie out? He claimed to be a long time friend of Bernie's, IIRC. Wonder if we could get in touch with him? Anyone have his contact info? I am going to scour my email and see if I can find anything.


----------



## leonardo7

Yeah we came from Vegas and arrived at his shop around 5pm then had to be in Hollywood by 8pm. We cut that one close! Point being that there was nobody else at the shop when we were there. But the place looked like a full functioning shop with around 200-300 unfinished guitars

Bernie did have a file with each and every single order on paper with lots of hand written notes on each one. I saw that stack of papers/folder. I think I already shared this info (not pics though) earlier in the thread


----------



## leonardo7

killertone said:


> My guitar is in those pics...fourth one up from the bottom.



When did you get it and thats how long from the end of Oct '11 it took to go from this stage to your hands.


----------



## SpaceDock

^


----------



## xCaptainx

errr based on his signature, he hasn't got it yet?


----------



## killertone

leonardo7 said:


> When did you get it and thats how long from the end of Oct '11 it took to go from this stage to your hands.



Never got it, dude. 

Here he is a few months after you were there holding it along with my 2nd one. Never got either of them. I took the pic when I was there at the end of January 2012. 






Here it is after it was painted...Bernie sent me this pic in a text:






Here is my 2nd one with hardware on it. Bernie also texted me this pic.


----------



## leonardo7

Damn! Crazy! 

This is like the Mike Sherman saga just on a much larger scale. 

My Sherman has been in the same state just needing hardware and electronics since summer '0 fucking 9!


----------



## Khoi

I see my guitar in one of those pictures as well. Looks the same, thanks for sharing the pictures


----------



## Red&Die

I'm curious that am I the last guy who received the guitar from Bernie? I got my 3rd Jekyll by the end of Nov/2012.


----------



## Hollowway

Holy crap, killertone, I think I might actually feel worse for you than me. That fire top is HOT! I love that. I'm totally gonna try to get someone to do a top like that for me some day!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I think the last guy to receive their BRJ was Keith Merrow - the while carve top, if I'm not mistaken.

Besides that, I believe my guitar was LITERALLY the last custom that he made that wasn't completely fucked in terms of playability. I may be wrong, but holy crazy shit.


----------



## Qweklain

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I think the last guy to receive their BRJ was Keith Merrow - the while carve top, if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> Besides that, I believe my guitar was LITERALLY the last custom that he made that wasn't completely fucked in terms of playability. I may be wrong, but holy crazy shit.


It sucks, because if you go back a few pages (depending on your posts per page) you can see I got a pic of mine clearly finished with the exception of strap-buttons, which is no big deal. Mine is the orange/green-burst 7-string.

I honestly would rather have the guitar than charge-back my final payment of 1/24, but even if I go down there, what are the chances I can get in contact with anyone to actually get it? 

At this point and with the situation, I just do not see any other resolution other than to have the payment reversed...


----------



## MJS

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I think the last guy to receive their BRJ was Keith Merrow - the while carve top, if I'm not mistaken.




I think Keith got his back in September. Someone else posted an NGD thread on December 18th: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/221461-ngd-brj-627-a.html

Note that there could also be newer ones than that, but that came up in a quick search.


----------



## elq

MJS said:


> ... Someone else posted an NGD thread on December 18th: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/221461-ngd-brj-627-a.html



I find this really amusing - that guitar started off as mine, I sold it before completion to phrygian who sold it before completion to jjcor who sold it shortly after recieving it to some random dude who's now selling it on ebay and was kind enough to take pictures that demonstrate quality -


----------



## Viginez

it could be that he had some disagreements (payment, etc.) with some of his employees and they maybe tried to ruin him or his instruments? some kind of revenge. never underestimate that kind of dispute...
to me it sounds like something big happened and he became depressed/sick.
it's speculative...


----------



## thepylestory

Where did all those guitars go?!


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

probably still sitting in some other room, never to see the light of day again


----------



## crg123

^^^^ elq.... Holy shit man! That's like scary bad. I'm glad you got your money back before you and didn't have to experience that in real life. My friend owns a Rico and its flawless. I've been shocked at how terrible his company has become :/

Edit: hahaha I though that was a fret hanging a 1/4" off the fretboard until I read the ebay ad . Still pretty bad though


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

And that's why I'm saying it sounds like Keith's and mine were the last guitars that came out that didn't have serious issues with build quality. And he still screwed up the specifics on mine. Yikes.


----------



## aiur55

It seems like I have had fairly recent communication with him. He last emailed me January 23 asking about electronics placement. Before that I have requested an update and he emailed me back in November:

Good morning Fin,

Sorry I did not get to your call last night fell asleep early. Been taken care if Terry after her surgery and working.

Please read below. K***** needs a update.

B.

Hope this helps somebody figure out this mess.


----------



## Qweklain

After seeing that image above of sticking paper under that fret, maybe I don't want my guitar after all... 

So sad that guitars that were so fantastic and a builder who does/did have talent (depending how you look at it now) has gone straight to the black-list of builders due to getting in over his head with the orders instead of just cutting it off as he should.


----------



## clubshred

killertone said:


> My guitar is in those pics...fourth one up from the bottom.
> 
> I was there as well and there was no evidence of anyone else working there. Pretty sure Bernie has had no one work there permanently except his paint guy Ed and I'm not sure he is there all that much.
> 
> Remember that guy Mtech that used to be on here helping Bernie out? He claimed to be a long time friend of Bernie's, IIRC. Wonder if we could get in touch with him? Anyone have his contact info? I am going to scour my email and see if I can find anything.



I saw MTech at a local music store this past weekend. He was with (what appeared to be) ESP sales reps. He doesn't like me anymore otherwise I would have asked him if he still was in contact with Bernie. I no longer have his contact info. Bernie had reached out to me last October because I was one of the guys who did a little work for him at the time and there was an issue he had with me regarding a notification he got from my email because when I was working with him, my Yahoo account was tied to his "[email protected]" email. Well, Bernie called me in a panic that day but we resolved it. 

As far as MTech, I thought he was banned on here so I'm not sure if he is still around or whatever, but I don't have any info on whether or not he still works with Bernie.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Damn this gives me so much PTSD for ordering. Anybody see any discussions on other forums? I don't check any and don't know. Just thought I'd ask. I guess I should feel lucky I'm only $900 in the hole for a custom, and not payed in full like many of you. My last contact with Bernie was November, by phone, and later over spec changes leading to a rebuild. Haven't heard anythin from anyone since Jan. I'd love To have the guitar if its not messed up, and even so I'd probably get I fixed and see if I'd keep it. I could use the deposit money for the ViK FF8 run. For the record and adding to this regret, Dylan H. told me when I was deployed if something happened to me he would refund my Daemoness deposit to my family. Ugh why did I do this.

FYI Keith Merrow's white BRJ 7 is up for a feeler trade on his Facebook. Maybe he's peacefully trying to pull away from all this.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

So then... my guitar really IS the last BRJ guitar to come out of the custom shop without issues. There is no other way that Keith would be even considering getting rid of his. Not after the way that he talked to me about his previous BRJ guitars. I'm seriously thinking I might sell my guitar.


----------



## MunchiesSockmonkey

I heard from a source that Bernie was in a coma but don't understand why the family hasn't said anything about it. 

The delay while not appropriate was by no means intentional. I will see what I can do to get a family member to post an update here so that all his customers can stop worrying and start praying.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

So wait a second... your join date is... today... your first post is to tell us that Bernie's in a coma... and you're from San Diego?

I'm dubious, my friend.


----------



## Danukenator

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I heard from a source that Bernie was in a coma but don't understand why the family hasn't said anything about it.
> 
> The delay while not appropriate was by no means intentional. I will see what I can do to get a family member to post an update here so that all his customers can stop worrying and start praying.



Was that source...your ass?

Wait, is this Chris G?


----------



## MunchiesSockmonkey

Joey Rico, Scary Gary, talk to these guys.

Can you imagine what Chris went through with all those irate customers. You can flame me if it will make you feel better, I'm just trying to get the appropriate info to this thread because the need for it is insurmountable at this point.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

We're just saying, bro. You don't have any history here. You come in and without any introduction of yourself, your very first post is "Bernie's in a coma I'll try to get somebody from his family to post here".

Dude... what would you expect from a bunch of guys who've been jerked around for the last several years. Even if you're telling the truth, a bunch of people are going to be pissed. If nobody has said anything about a situation this serious, it still reflects very badly on the business side of things.


----------



## SpaceDock

I'll take any info I can get about the situation, but it is hearsay at this point.


----------



## jjcor

elq said:


> I find this really amusing - that guitar started off as mine, I sold it before completion to phrygian who sold it before completion to jjcor who sold it shortly after recieving it to some random dude who's now selling it on ebay and was kind enough to take pictures that demonstrate quality -



Me and the guy who bought it had a little feud over this guitar. When I had it, it was in perfect shape. The frets had a little rough edges but that was it. I sold it to him and then all of a sudden he emails me 2 WEEKS LATER saying that the frets were sticking out and that the 3rd fret was actually coming completly off the fretboard. It made me a little curious as to why it took him 3 weeks to actually see that. So only thing I could think of was he did something (god knows what?) In between those 2 weeks that screwed up the frets. Now I'm not trying to say that what is going on here with Bernie is ok but as far as THAT guitar goes, it was in good shape when Bernie sent it to me. Oh and the conclusion to that story was he claimed it was damaged in shipping and ups gave him $150 to fix it, which he clearly didn't do. And I got my shipping money refunded as well.


----------



## Red&Die

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I heard from a source that Bernie was in a coma but don't understand why the family hasn't said anything about it.
> 
> The delay while not appropriate was by no means intentional. I will see what I can do to get a family member to post an update here so that all his customers can stop worrying and start praying.



Hey,man:

If you're telling the true, we would like to receive a official announcement from Bernie or even his family. I have visited Bernie's workshop last November, he is a great guy and I hope he can get well soon.


----------



## MunchiesSockmonkey

It was from diabetes related illness, which was on the downlow. There's no reason to keep it a secret. 

The windows are blacked out in the shop to prevent sun warping to the wood, the shop is climate controlled to keep the wood in good condition. The shops rent is getting paid and all the guitars are still there most just need assembly.

I can't reveal my source but some of the members here know more than they are saying.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Boy if you aren't trolling the shit out of us right now, you'd better get somebody in his family to get their ass onto his facebook page or a mass email out so that people can get some verifiable proof as to what it is you're saying. If you've got these sources, you'd better tell them that BRJ guitars is about to have a very large legal foot up their ass when he gets out of this said 'coma' because people who have been waiting for such a long time with absolutely no communication are straight freaking pissed about what has gone down.

Until that point, nobody believes you.


----------



## Red&Die

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> It was from diabetes related illness, which was on the downlow. There's no reason to keep it a secret.
> 
> The windows are blacked out in the shop to prevent sun warping to the wood, the shop is climate controlled to keep the wood in good condition. The shops rent is getting paid and all the guitars are still there most just need assembly.
> 
> I can't reveal my source but some of the members here know more than they are saying.



Since you're from San Diego, that's also Bernie's wood shop located, are you relate with BRJ guitar?


----------



## MunchiesSockmonkey

I am not trolling or trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to extinguish the towering inferno of flames. I just felt bad about this situation I saw unraveling on Facebook and knowing things that aren't getting out, and not knowing why it isn't getting out really bothers me. 

I have a friend thousands of dollars invested in BRJ that has talked to him about his health related issues. The seriousness of which has nearly bankrupted him and caused the loss of property.

BRJ's only concern throughout his entire ordeal is worrying about the guitars he makes. His first and foremost priorities even before getting back to good health is getting all those guitars out.

He made tremendous blunders by taking on way too many orders, coupled by bad hires, and a laundry list of business mistakes which are obvious to everyone. The guy in charge of the web presence was another unreliable.

Right now behind the scenes an effort is being made to get all the info out to everyone to all social media outlets. You have been very patient with BRJ and it is very appreciated, to ask for more patience might sound insulting and anger you further, but please know you will get the information you need soon. Close friends & relatives will either assign a spokesperson to give an update or they will do it themselves asap.


----------



## Hollowway

Assuming this is true, and you're not just messing with us, I'm glad to hear it. A lot of us thought he just skipped out on everything and we were hosed. Or he was doing drugs. I understand people wanting privacy, but once it's announced that you are in the hospital, and almost dying, I would think it would be ok to specify that is was diabetes. There's nothing shameful about that. Anyway, please do try to get information to us from a reputable source (ie one who can post on FB on his behalf, or send an email from his acct). And soon, because there are dozens of really nervous people taking preliminary legal and other steps that could really make it difficult for him to just go back to work.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

I call BULLSHIT yet again on this one Munchies! Not believing anything from your mouth, whoever you really are. It's just another stall/hope tactic that Bernie has used time and time again, and now this one comes conveniently after a week of "lawsuit" talk! Load of crap about "BRJ's only concern throughout his entire ordeal is worrying about the guitars he makes. His first and foremost priorities even before getting back to good health is getting all those guitars out." F*&K OFF mate! I've read 80 odd pages of gullibleness and hope, and if his pea sized brain can't type 1 f'n paragraph on his FB page or here, then this is just going to be another 15 pages of bullshit!

I messaged Jed Simon the other night, and he got back to me with a few paragraphs of his own. I can't show you what he said exactly (all due respect to him), but he did acknowledge that he stuck his neck out for him, hoping to get a reaction for all you blokes here. Now here's the funny part ...........

(I take it that I was talking to the "real" Jed Simon on FB), and not once in the message back, did he mention anything about Bernie being "sick". He does go on to say that he talked to him, and had others try and "reach out" to him. He also said "It seemed like he might be ready to tackle his issues but it doesn't look like it..." and "I thought that maybe me saying some positive things for him might help kick him in the ass...". All this plus a few other factors, suggest drug/gambling/bad investment issues, rather than "sick" issues. I truly believe if he was unwell, he would of posted something months ago. 

What I'm saying is that I am going to believe a one "Jed Simon" on facebook, over some "Chris G" cartoon character coming in here, trying to buy off another couple of weeks. Jed is now selling his Vixens because he is fed up with what has gone on. I think he knows more than most of what is really happening here, and I couldn't see him selling his guitars if Bernie was seriously ill and that's all. You're a $1.10 at the T.A.B to join the long list of have beens/workers/close buddies that disappear after a month of coming here and trying to patch up this monumental screw up called Bernie! 

And to do all this, only after a few have bound together to get a lawsuit happening and try and recover their hard earned, for me, is the last weak gutted effort in this shit fight. The whole BRJ camp is weak as piss, and f'n ludicrously stupid. So this is what the last roll of the dice looks like hey ......... feed them some more hope? I think you know exactly what's going on, and have money tied up in BRJ and are stalling for time. Then adding that some here know more than what they are letting on is the icing on the cake. Couple that with why you know exactly why the windows are blacked out etc, suggests to me that you stand to lose something big if shit hits the fan. Don't be a weak c^&t and tell everybody here who you are exactly, and what you stand to gain from posting here!


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

you are making some VERY big assumptions there bud, it still seems a bit odd though


----------



## MJS

Anyone _still_ wondering why no one sticks around to help with communication?


----------



## lametacomeat

I agree with slayer, this comes at a very convenient time. Someone comes in to promise that Bernie is still looking out for us a couple of days after legal routes are looked at.

This seems like a desperate attempt to keep everyone at bay.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, as I said earlier, it's a tough sell to come onto a forum with no history and start throwing around that kind of information to a bunch of dudes who have been screwed around with this builder for a substantial amount of time and money. It is bound to go over like a fart in church.

Yes - Bernie has taken some knocks over the last period of time. Health issues can have major impacts on the finances of even the pretty wealthy. However, as my father (who is probably one of the hardest working living men to walk the face of the planet) so brutally, and eloquently stated: "If you take a bunch of product orders, tell everybody they'll have the product in 6 months, and then take 2 years to build any products, you're going to go broke and lose your damn house." It sounds heartless, but at it's base it is true.

It is, at this point, difficult for people to accept that Bernie's primary concern is that his customers receive high quality instruments. Given the track record over the last few years of delivering sub-standard (that's below C grade) service, screwing up build specs, and delivering $3,000+ guitars with jaw-dropping flaws, one can only assume he went "Simple Jack" on us and just totally checked out. In addition to that, so many idle promises have been made to his customers that simply never came to fruition, Bernie has exhausted the level of grace that many are willing to extend to him. 

May I reiterate for the forum the growing list of concerns about the recent professional history of this builder? This is not to be cruel, but simply to put our grievances into concise context (in no particular order and I may miss some).

1. Securing a large number of build orders before securing supplies (including wood and bridges) to actually build said custom instruments
2. Taking deposits on new orders after establishing a backlog of at the very least 100 (!!!) instruments
3. Lying to people about build estimates to secure deposits for new builds (quoting 4-6 months after having a backlog of nearly 200 guitars)
4. Lying to customers about completion dates, requiring final payments to secure shipping, and then completely cutting off contact with the customer and in some cases never delivering the instrument.
5. Losing track of somewhere around 50 sets of ordered BKP humbuckers, and then installing them at random into customer's guitars in some cases using the incorrect pickups.
6. Numerous instances of telling people their guitars were almost finished with set-up, and then several months later telling the same people their guitars were just getting out of wood shop or that their guitar had never been started. In some cases, Bernie didn't even remember who the customer was.
7. Requiring additional money for complex finish options, completing guitars with incorrect finish options (which were simpler and less costly) and not refunding the customer for the additional money paid for the requested finish after agreeing to do so.
8. Using, knowingly, improperly or poorly cured wood for builds, resulting in warping, cracking, improper body binding, and splitting in builds (some of which were delivered)
9. The use of incorrect neck angles on builds, requiring questionable shimming of fretboards, and at least one case where a TOM bridge was shoddily ground down to "fix" issues with proper bridge/neck alignment (as the neck angle was originally built for a Hipshot bridge).
10. Improper shielding of pickup cavities and electronics cavities.
11. Lying to customers about personally completing final setups on instruments
12. Delivering guitars with flaws to construction not limited to: drilling tuner holes to incorrect width, improper binding of guitars, incorrect shaving and slotting of bone nut, incorrect sizing of nut, incorrect wiring of guitar (reverse of pickup selection).
13. Freaking out on customers who bring build issues to his attention
14. Refusing to give refunds after grossly failing to meet estimated build times on instruments (to the effect of 5x longer than estimated with no clear end to wait time).
15. Lying to customers about completing all finish work personally

I'm sure there are more, which is staggering. At this point, is anyone _still_ wondering why people are so pissed off? It's a tough fight from the BRJ corner if the man wants to rebuild his brand. A pity.


----------



## spawnsc

Sounds like a shit filled Twinkie to me... If his family or friends cared anything about his business and believed in what he is doing they would step out and make it known that he is sick or in coma.

Either way its gloves off we want our guitars or our money back simple as that.


----------



## lametacomeat

Everyone has to keep the pressure on him with BBB complaints and police fraud report filings. Eventually, it will be big enough problem for him that he'll have to do something.

Also, as said before, get your money charged back on your credit cards as soon as you can. If you are inside that 120 day back-charge period, consider yourself extremely lucky.


----------



## ovation22

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, as I said earlier, it's a tough sell to come onto a forum with no history and start throwing around that kind of information to a bunch of dudes who have been screwed around with this builder for a substantial amount of time and money. It is bound to go over like a fart in church.
> 
> Yes - Bernie has taken some knocks over the last period of time. Health issues can have major impacts on the finances of even the pretty wealthy. However, as my father (who is probably one of the hardest working living men to walk the face of the planet) so brutally, and eloquently stated: "If you take a bunch of product orders, tell everybody they'll have the product in 6 months, and then take 2 years to build any products, you're going to go broke and lose your damn house." It sounds heartless, but at it's base it is true.
> 
> It is, at this point, difficult for people to accept that Bernie's primary concern is that his customers receive high quality instruments. Given the track record over the last few years of delivering sub-standard (that's below C grade) service, screwing up build specs, and delivering $3,000+ guitars with jaw-dropping flaws, one can only assume he went "Simple Jack" on us and just totally checked out. In addition to that, so many idle promises have been made to his customers that simply never came to fruition, Bernie has exhausted the level of grace that many are willing to extend to him.
> 
> May I reiterate for the forum the growing list of concerns about the recent professional history of this builder? This is not to be cruel, but simply to put our grievances into concise context (in no particular order and I may miss some).
> 
> 1. Securing a large number of build orders before securing supplies (including wood and bridges) to actually build said custom instruments
> 2. Taking deposits on new orders after establishing a backlog of at the very least 100 (!!!) instruments
> 3. Lying to people about build estimates to secure deposits for new builds (quoting 4-6 months after having a backlog of nearly 200 guitars)
> 4. Lying to customers about completion dates, requiring final payments to secure shipping, and then completely cutting off contact with the customer and in some cases never delivering the instrument.
> 5. Losing track of somewhere around 50 sets of ordered BKP humbuckers, and then installing them at random into customer's guitars in some cases using the incorrect pickups.
> 6. Numerous instances of telling people their guitars were almost finished with set-up, and then several months later telling the same people their guitars were just getting out of wood shop or that their guitar had never been started. In some cases, Bernie didn't even remember who the customer was.
> 7. Requiring additional money for complex finish options, completing guitars with incorrect finish options (which were simpler and less costly) and not refunding the customer for the additional money paid for the requested finish after agreeing to do so.
> 8. Using, knowingly, improperly or poorly cured wood for builds, resulting in warping, cracking, improper body binding, and splitting in builds (some of which were delivered)
> 9. The use of incorrect neck angles on builds, requiring questionable shimming of fretboards, and at least one case where a TOM bridge was shoddily ground down to "fix" issues with proper bridge/neck alignment (as the neck angle was originally built for a Hipshot bridge).
> 10. Improper shielding of pickup cavities and electronics cavities.
> 11. Lying to customers about personally completing final setups on instruments
> 12. Delivering guitars with flaws to construction not limited to: drilling tuner holes to incorrect width, improper binding of guitars, incorrect shaving and slotting of bone nut, incorrect sizing of nut, incorrect wiring of guitar (reverse of pickup selection).
> 13. Freaking out on customers who bring build issues to his attention
> 14. Refusing to give refunds after grossly failing to meet estimated build times on instruments (to the effect of 5x longer than estimated with no clear end to wait time).
> 15. Lying to customers about completing all finish work personally
> 
> I'm sure there are more, which is staggering. At this point, is anyone _still_ wondering why people are so pissed off? It's a tough fight from the BRJ corner if the man wants to rebuild his brand. A pity.




This deserves to be quoted to a new page.


----------



## JPMike

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I am not trolling or trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to extinguish the towering inferno of flames. I just felt bad about this situation I saw unraveling on Facebook and knowing things that aren't getting out, and not knowing why it isn't getting out really bothers me.
> 
> I have a friend thousands of dollars invested in BRJ that has talked to him about his health related issues. The seriousness of which has nearly bankrupted him and caused the loss of property.
> 
> BRJ's only concern throughout his entire ordeal is worrying about the guitars he makes. His first and foremost priorities even before getting back to good health is getting all those guitars out.
> 
> He made tremendous blunders by taking on way too many orders, coupled by bad hires, and a laundry list of business mistakes which are obvious to everyone. The guy in charge of the web presence was another unreliable.
> 
> Right now behind the scenes an effort is being made to get all the info out to everyone to all social media outlets. You have been very patient with BRJ and it is very appreciated, to ask for more patience might sound insulting and anger you further, but please know you will get the information you need soon. Close friends & relatives will either assign a spokesperson to give an update or they will do it themselves asap.



You have a friend who has invested thousands of dollars in BRJ?? 
Do you have the slightest idea of how much money I have invested in BRJ?? *5 figure number!!*

And 1 guitar was almost ready and he wouldn't communicate to finish it, the other 2 somehow had the necks warped or whatever, plus the 1 was wrong finish, and had to be rebuilt. All my guitars were supposed to be delivered by March 15th (in 2 days). 

The guy in charge, you mean, John?? John is an amazing person,we have talked so many times and had amazing conversations. I wish I could find him and ask him what happened between him and Bernie. Really know both sides of the story. 

Bad hires? People quitting?
This makes me think, whose fault this might be? Maybe the boss' fucked up behaviour and Ego? Cause look at the videos in youtube, or notice the way he talks over the phone or by emails, feels like something's wrong.

And please stop fucking acting, like he's a Hollywood Star or some shit. He's not, so why keep secret of his "sickness"?? 

Yes it angers and insults me to post this here, cause it makes me I am stupid or some kind of sucker. If all this is true, say your name, show your face, you ID, who you really are and I bet you won't. 

I am one of these people that will actually forgive anything and I don't like causing anything bad to others, but I won't stand this shit anymore. If he was sick in any way he would have communicated through someone and notify us. We are human, we have families, friends, colleagues, etc too. We've been through serious shit in our lives, even as the ones suffering or as fellow people of the ones suffering. We understand how it is to be sick and we would have UNDERSTOOD words of honesty and truth. 

In any case, forgive me for this, but good job on destroying the legacy he have inherited. I've lost interest on my builds and I want my money back. Like, now!


----------



## MetalDaze

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I am not trolling or trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to extinguish the towering inferno of flames. I just felt bad about this situation I saw unraveling on Facebook and knowing things that aren't getting out, and not knowing why it isn't getting out really bothers me.
> 
> I have a friend thousands of dollars invested in BRJ that has talked to him about his health related issues. The seriousness of which has nearly bankrupted him and caused the loss of property.
> 
> BRJ's only concern throughout his entire ordeal is worrying about the guitars he makes. His first and foremost priorities even before getting back to good health is getting all those guitars out.
> 
> He made tremendous blunders by taking on way too many orders, coupled by bad hires, and a laundry list of business mistakes which are obvious to everyone. The guy in charge of the web presence was another unreliable.
> 
> Right now behind the scenes an effort is being made to get all the info out to everyone to all social media outlets. You have been very patient with BRJ and it is very appreciated, to ask for more patience might sound insulting and anger you further, but please know you will get the information you need soon. Close friends & relatives will either assign a spokesperson to give an update or they will do it themselves asap.


 
Trust me, we all want to believe, but understand that the community has lost patience and at no point in time has the phrase "actions speak louder than words" had more relevance.

We are all human and have compassion, but we are also customers who have spent money with nothing in return. More important than an explanation of what is happening is a plan for resolution, whether it be in the form of refunds or completed instruments. If it the latter, we need a timeline for completion and some assurance that it can/will happen.

Otherwise, there will be no end to the current inferno, as you state.


----------



## kmanick

killertone said:


> Never got it, dude.
> 
> Here he is a few months after you were there holding it along with my 2nd one. Never got either of them. I took the pic when I was there at the end of January 2012.


 
What a travesty this whole ordeal has become. Look at these two guitars, just f'n gorgeous, if these were mine I'd be so furious that they were never delivered.
thankfully my Hesperian was delivered in November 2010 way before all of this BS started to go down and luckily I apparently got one of the last "good ones".


----------



## MetalDaze

kmanick said:


> What a travesty this whole ordeal has become. Look at these two guitars, just f'n gorgeous, if these were mine I'd be so furious that they were never delivered.
> thankfully my Hesperian was delivered in November 2010 way before all of this BS started to go down and luckily I apparently got one of the last "good ones".


 
Yeah yeah, you keep reminding us 

Just kidding, of course. I guess it just goes to show that no matter how good you are, if life gets in the way, it all goes to


----------



## kmanick

sorry, I honestly don't mean to rub salt in the wounds, it's just amazing to me tht this has been drawn out this long and we still have no idea what is really going on here.
I almost ordered 2 more guitars from him right around the time of the Black Friday launch (I would love to have another version of what I have with a maple board and a 6 string version).
has anyone talked to Zimbloth , he did used to be one of his dealers maybe he knows something we dont"???
if Bernie is in a coma I want to know which hosptital he's in.


----------



## MetalDaze

kmanick said:


> if Bernie is in a coma I want to know which hosptital he's in.


 
Looks like these are the local options:

Desert Valley Hospital | Cardio-Neuro & Surgical Services

St. Mary Medical Center | Serving Apple Valley, Victorville, Hesperia & Adelanto


----------



## Andromalia

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I am not trolling or trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to extinguish the towering inferno of flames.



An official communication would be way better than a new account on a forum, you know.


----------



## Hollowway

MetalDaze said:


> Looks like these are the local options:
> 
> Desert Valley Hospital | Cardio-Neuro & Surgical Services
> 
> St. Mary Medical Center | Serving Apple Valley, Victorville, Hesperia & Adelanto



Did you call them?


----------



## MetalDaze

Hollowway said:


> Did you call them?


 
No. I'm wondering if HIPAA would prevent them from telling you he's there.

It's sort of an invasion of privacy step that I wasn't willing to take.


----------



## JaeSwift

MetalDaze said:


> No. I'm wondering if HIPAA would prevent them from telling you he's there.
> 
> It's sort of an invasion of privacy step that I wasn't willing to take.



There's no way they will be able to confirm or deny that he is there unless he's wanted by the police; I might live in Europe but privacy works the same, in regards to a hospital, around the western-world.


----------



## WillDfx

JPMike said:


> how much money I have invested in BRJ?? *5 figure number!!*



wat.

I feel so bad for you man, I really hope this gets sorted for all you guys. We all know Bernie is capable of building nice instruments, I've owned a few myself. And of course on that same token, he's capable of building utter pieces of junk-ola. I really wish he just would've kept on building righteous guitars, and not become a flake. Here's to hoping for a happy resolve


----------



## SrDeMaFp

Damn, what an absolute shame. I wonder WTF is up? Even Eric McKenna (BoogieStreet) and Jed Simon (formerly of SYL) are wondering what the deal is...


Jed Simon said:


> _Bernie Rico Jr., what has happened? I love you but I just can't keep going to bat for you Brother. And I'm sad that my calls, emails and texts are being ignored as well. If not me, at least please contact your loyal customers. Reach out, speak up, write a letter, anything...you owe them that much ok? Please!_


 - via FB.


----------



## SpaceDock

If anyone hasn't filed with the BBB, do it now! It seems like the fire is starting to get lit under his ass.


----------



## JPMike

WillDfx said:


> wat.
> 
> I feel so bad for you man, I really hope this gets sorted for all you guys. We all know Bernie is capable of building nice instruments, I've owned a few myself. And of course on that same token, he's capable of building utter pieces of junk-ola. I really wish he just would've kept on building righteous guitars, and not become a flake. Here's to hoping for a happy resolve



At the time, everything was fine. Too bad, I can't predict the future and see this coming. 

Let's hope things will work out some way.


----------



## killertone

Just like every other single person who has spoken for Bernie in teh past in this thread, that Munchies guy will disappear with no explanation or evidence of the things he has stated. Chris G part deux.

There is ZERO shame in being diabetic and having serious health issues because of it but there is NOTHING BUT shame for never speaking up to all of your customers and filling them in on the situation. I can not believe the health stories are true because there is no logical reason to not disclose them. It makes no sense to not communicate what is going on in that situation as we all know that a serious health issue is not something in one's control. 

Something stinks here and bullshit faceless mysterious posters in this thread need to become legitimate, factual, and transparent posters. Help not hurt.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, I reached out and contacted Scarry Gary (at random) and he hit me back saying that Bernie "might" be in a diabetic coma. He was apparently in one last year. He asked me to call him, which I am going to give a try tomorrow. I'll try to see if he actually knows anything, or if he is about to fill me full of crap. I will let you guys know.


----------



## Rap Hat

Fucking Christ, if this is true... I never asked Bernie directly about his illness, even though I did talk to him for like 3 hours shortly after he'd recovered the first(?) time and we talked a little about how it was tough for him to be told he couldn't work on the guitars. I was ready to PM some of the people who knew what it was for sure here, to at least get an idea what was going on. 

None of it excuses the overall situation though, because even when he did recover, it went right back to promises, payments, missed promises, and for some, nothing even when Bernie was still working with others.

Bernie/his family could've reached out to the community when it first happened, and at the very least gotten a shitload of a lot more (personal, not business) support. This would've probably killed off a lot of the anger towards his communication "issues" and made working things out with customers a lot easier. I understand the desire for privacy, but complete radio silence only breeds contempt from us who have supported the man. 
And at this point, I doubt people are going to say, "Oh, I guess I should stop worrying about my $2k/5k/12k". It's awful all around anyways, and Bernie being in a coma with literally no one to assuage (or even explain to) his customers just adds flames to the fire.

Ugh. I hope it's not true for Bernie's sake.


----------



## 7stringkeke

What's up guys. I'm in the same position as all of you. Still waiting on my BRJ. I was really hesitant on putting this but after seeing all of the law suit talking I figured I would go ahead and say this. I live in SD and I went to Hesperia last month and went to his shop... His truck wasn't there; (I had visited his shop a few times before and knew what color of truck he had.) So after I left his shop I decided to swing by his house to check to see if he was there before I drove back to SD. No answer at the door. As I was walking back to my car, a neighbor stopped me and asked if he was doing ok. I was confused and asked what she meant. She told me the last time she saw Bernie was about 3 weeks ago, which would be about the end of Jan to early Feb. And again just to reiterate, the only reason I am posting this is because of all of the posts that have been talked about here about law suits and people wanting updates. The neighbor said the last time she saw Bernie was around 11PM one night. She said she saw the cops pulling his body out of his truck... covered in blood and completely lifeless. Not sure what happened but the car port does show signs of blood having been cleaned up. She said she hasn't seen him since. So I'm not sure if he's in the hospital or what but he definitely is not around to post any updates on his site, I'm guessing due to the fact that he is probably still in the hospital. You don't have to believe me, I am just telling you what the neighbor told me.


----------



## Vicious7

^^^ Sounds highly suspicious...


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Wat.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Like I said believe me or not. I'm in the same boat you guys are. Highly pissed and wandering what the hell is going on.


----------



## Fiction

Why was his body being pulled _out_ of a truck at his place if he was lifeless?


----------



## 7stringkeke

Fiction said:


> Why was his body being pulled _out_ of a truck at his place if he was lifeless?


 What?


----------



## Fiction

Read it wrong, sorry.

I thought you meant they (the police) had him in their truck, not pulling him out of his truck.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Fiction said:


> Read it wrong, sorry.
> 
> I thought you meant they (the police) had him in their truck, not pulling him out of his truck.


 Yea... pulling him out of "his" truck.


----------



## thepylestory

Wow, just when you think shit couldn't get anymore fucked, BOOM!!


----------



## leonardo7

The same police dept that apparently also recently went to his shop to see if he was there?


----------



## 7stringkeke

leonardo7 said:


> The same police dept that apparently also recently went to his shop to see if he was there?


 Yea if they did go like that guy posted earlier about then I can see how they would have come back with a report of not seeing Bernie. The shops windows have the blinds all closed and there is no stickers or sign or anything that says Bernie's name. I almost cpuldnt find it the first time, but I walked around and asked some of the people that worked around him and finally found "1" guy to show me where it was. Most of the people that work right next to him didn't even know he was there.


----------



## Phrygian

Probably a reason for that, having hundreds of thousands of dollars in guitars stashed in there I wouldn't have a flaming sign saying "GUITAR BUILDER, COME STEAL MY STUFF!".


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Dude that doesn't really add up. The guy hasn't been in "his house" since before I received my guitar last July.

Guys - just hold off until I can get a hold of this Scarry Gary dude. I should be able to figure out WTF is going on after I call him. We might actually get some concrete ideas rather than some random internet dude just popping in to give us some crazy ass 4th hand story.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Dude that doesn't really add up. The guy hasn't been in "his house" since before I received my guitar last July.
> 
> Guys - just hold off until I can get a hold of this Scarry Gary dude. I should be able to figure out WTF is going on after I call him. We might actually get some concrete ideas rather than some random internet dude just popping in to give us some crazy ass 4th hand story.


 I don't see how my story is 4th hand. And like I stated earlier... You don't have to believe me, but why would I, a customer also waiting for my BRJ for a year now, come onto this forum out of nowhere and drop this. Doesn't make much since. I posted it on here to tell you guys exactly what is going on. And I think you all know its true, but maybe choose to believe its not to make yourself feel better. I'm not trying to be a dick but like I said I wouldn't come on here and post some random information if it wasn't true. If you don't believe me, get in a plane, car or whatever you want and go to his house or workshop and see how much luck you have. He's not there!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Dude - there's no reason to believe you. You might be right. You might be lying. We don't know because there is no way of vetting your story. I'm not saying he isn't in deep shit somewhere brain-stewing in a hospital. But your story and other things I have heard about his situation, things I've heard about from Bernie himself back when he finally delivered my guitar, and things that people are currently talking about - they don't jive dude. You have less than 20 posts here, so we have no real backlog to check in with you or any reason to believe you aren't just some "L33t HAx0r" eating ding dongs in his mother's basement and trolling the web instead of going to school.

I'm just saying that what I'm about to do today is CALL SOMEBODY WHO ACTUALLY KNOWS BRJ PRETTY WELL.

I've got the day off from work so the first thing I'm-a-gonna' do when I get off the phone with this guy is get on here and let everybody know what I heard. Until then, we love you, you're great, but please piss off.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Dude - there's no reason to believe you. You might be right. You might be lying. We don't know because there is no way of vetting your story. I'm not saying he isn't in deep shit somewhere brain-stewing in a hospital. But your story and other things I have heard about his situation, things I've heard about from Bernie himself back when he finally delivered my guitar, and things that people are currently talking about - they don't jive dude. You have less than 20 posts here, so we have no real backlog to check in with you or any reason to believe you aren't just some "L33t HAx0r" eating ding dongs in his mother's basement and trolling the web instead of going to school.
> 
> I'm just saying that what I'm about to do today is CALL SOMEBODY WHO ACTUALLY KNOWS BRJ PRETTY WELL.
> 
> I've got the day off from work so the first thing I'm-a-gonna' do when I get off the phone with this guy is get on here and let everybody know what I heard. Until then, we love you, you're great, but please piss off.


 Cool story bro. Good luck getting the truth from your scary Gary dude. I'm sure he'll tell you exactly what's going on so, you, some guy he's never met can get on the Internet and spill all of his personal information.


----------



## 7stringkeke

What's going to make you believe scary Gary over me? Really?? You have no clue. The only way I guess to get any of you to believe anything is a few other guys in here from San Diego need to just get together, drive up there, ring on the neighbors house get her to tell the story again and then maybe you'll believe me. Oh and the neighbor also commented on how she never saw Bernie leave the house. She said he would take his daughter to school in the morning and then right back. So now you can see why all of our guitars take years and years to build.


----------



## 7stringkeke

I want to know what's going on just as much as the next guy. But you really think some guy who apparently is good friends with Bernie is going to tell you exactly what is going on so that thousands of dudes can get on the Internet and talk about it. Probably not.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

^ both of those posts right there is reason enough for people to not believe you. if you would have read through here youd see that gary actually said to call him. also i dont see how taking his daughter to school can make some builds take "years and years". if gary really is his friend then yes he should be telling everyone what the hell is up with bernie to 1) give some kind of closure to people and 2) to potentially protect bernie from any further backlash but at this point i dont think thats possible.


----------



## Rap Hat

Come on man, with all the hearsay and crazy rumors people are going to be skeptical. Especially since your story is pretty fantastical (and what makes the neighbor trustworthy?). Getting all defensive because people want to contact others who are actually closer to Bernie than you makes it look suspicious.

If what you said is true, people will find out soon enough and you'll be "vindicated", feel free to gloat then. But pulling the "well why don't you go talk to the neighbor?!?" crap seems like a ploy to get us to accept it at face value.

Spec, thank you for reaching out to people who are/were close to Bernie. It's very much appreciated, even if not everything can be corroborated.


----------



## 7stringkeke

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> ^ both of those posts right there is reason enough for people to not believe you. if you would have read through here youd see that gary actually said to call him. also i dont see how taking his daughter to school can make some builds take "years and years". if gary really is his friend then yes he should be telling everyone what the hell is up with bernie to 1) give some kind of closure to people and 2) to potentially protect bernie from any further backlash but at this point i dont think thats possible.


 If you would read in there it said takes his daughter to school and then comes right back to the house and doesn't leave. His shop is 10 miles away. How is any work getting done. And it's cool like I said I don't care if you guys believe me or not. Just keep at your little game of trying to find where Bernie is. I guess I'm just going to have to drive up there and record the woman talking about all of this and get the news involved.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

^ do it then


----------



## 7stringkeke

I can see how you guys would be skeptical, yea I get it. Just throwing my 2 cents out there from what I was told when I was in Hesperia. Hopefully Scarry Gary can clear it up. Guess we'll see.


----------



## technomancer

Ok you've thrown up your two cents, it didn't need the jumble of posts that followed.

Also guys police reports are a matter of public record so it should be pretty easy to follow up on his story if somebody wants to.


----------



## 7stringkeke

technomancer said:


> Ok you've thrown up your two cents, it didn't need the jumble of posts that followed.
> 
> Also guys police reports are a matter of public record so it should be pretty easy to follow up on his story if somebody wants to.


 Yea I will actually call up there today and see how to get ahold of them so I can back my story up. I guess the neighbor could have been crazy and told me some off the wall story. I will call today and try to find out.


----------



## paddy

Could it be he's faked his own death and run off to somewhere like south America for good???


----------



## 7stringkeke

Doubt it. But hey I guess anything could be at this point.


----------



## Danukenator

paddy said:


> Could it be he's faked his own death and run off to somewhere like south America for good???



Seriously, STOP with the wild speculation. You people are leaping to conclusions because some random dude said a neighbor said they saw Bernie, bloody and batter, pulled from a truck. Until people can prove these stories, there is no reason to believe them.

This is a link to the City of Hesperia Police Department:
City of Hesperia - Official Website - Police

Someone can call and ask if there was a police report made.


----------



## ovation22

My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Bernie pass out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess it's pretty serious.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Spaceballs - "I am your father&#39;s brother&#39;s nephew&#39;s cousin&#39;s former roommate." - YouTube


----------



## eaeolian

I'm trying to figure out why you just suddenly appeared as the lawsuit talks started?

That, the fact that you've only posted in this thread and your "insider" information pretty much tell me you're shilling for Bernie. So you can produce something actually useful instead of adding rumor and innuendo to the fire, or you can not make it to 10 posts. Your choice.



MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> I am not trolling or trying to stir the pot, I'm trying to extinguish the towering inferno of flames. I just felt bad about this situation I saw unraveling on Facebook and knowing things that aren't getting out, and not knowing why it isn't getting out really bothers me.
> 
> I have a friend thousands of dollars invested in BRJ that has talked to him about his health related issues. The seriousness of which has nearly bankrupted him and caused the loss of property.
> 
> BRJ's only concern throughout his entire ordeal is worrying about the guitars he makes. His first and foremost priorities even before getting back to good health is getting all those guitars out.
> 
> He made tremendous blunders by taking on way too many orders, coupled by bad hires, and a laundry list of business mistakes which are obvious to everyone. The guy in charge of the web presence was another unreliable.
> 
> Right now behind the scenes an effort is being made to get all the info out to everyone to all social media outlets. You have been very patient with BRJ and it is very appreciated, to ask for more patience might sound insulting and anger you further, but please know you will get the information you need soon. Close friends & relatives will either assign a spokesperson to give an update or they will do it themselves asap.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Just talked to the Victorville PD. They cannot release records involving the Police Dept if the person requesting them is not or was not a part of the involvement.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Maybe someone can scan a copy of a payment they made to Bernie then send that to the police department in hesperia and ask?


----------



## clubshred

ovation22 said:


> My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Bernie pass out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess it's pretty serious.



Thank you, Simone.... Frye? Frye?

"When Cameron was in Egypt's land..... Let my Cameron.... goooooo"


----------



## eaeolian

clubshred said:


> Thank you, Simone.... Frye? Frye?
> 
> "When Cameron was in Egypt's land..... Let my Cameron.... goooooo"



OK, that's enough.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

This is all I got from Scary Gary, after I contacted him and told him that some spanner here was throwing his name around ..... "I WISH I KNEW WATS GOING ON WITH BERNIE...... HE HAS 1 OF MY GUITARS BEING BUILT...... CALL ME WHEN U GET THIS... TNX" Left me his number.


----------



## thepylestory

Munchies!!! Where'd ya go man??!!! Did you realize that people aren't falling for the 96 layers of horse shit anymore?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah I just tried calling the number he gave me. It just went straight to voice mail with an over-the-top voice saying "You've reached [insert phone number] leave me a message or text me."

I guess everybody will still have to try to go the legal route to find out what's going on. It sounds like this dude knows nothing.


----------



## eaeolian

thepylestory said:


> Munchies!!! Where'd ya go man??!!! Did you realize that people aren't falling for the 96 layers of horse shit anymore?



Anyone else want a week off? Grow up and let the mods deal with the troll instead of egging him on.


----------



## leonardo7

7stringkeke said:


> Just talked to the Victorville PD. They cannot release records involving the Police Dept if the person requesting them is not or was not a part of the involvement.



So Bernie lives in Victorville? His shop is in Hesperia. You said earlier that yes you believe it would have been the same PD who apparently pulled him from his truck that went to his shop. Wouldn't this mean they are two different police departments?


----------



## 7stringkeke

leonardo7 said:


> So Bernie lives in Victorville? His shop is in Hesperia. You said earlier that yes you believe it would have been the same PD who apparently pulled him from his truck that went to his shop. Wouldn't this mean they are two different police departments?


 I have no clue about the police visit. I said that I wouldn't doubt that the police had nothing to report back with due to the fact that Bernie probably was not there. He lives in Victorville so I would imagine Victorvilles PD would have gotten him. You keep trying to make me sound like I'm lying. Why do you question it. If you don't believe me just get in your car and go to his house and find out yourself. I don't know what else to tell you guys. You get on my case about me posting this acting like I'm some kid apparently in my mothers basement eating twinkles, and then turn right back around and start to question me more. I posted what I knew... Done.. Believe me or not I don't care.


----------



## eaeolian

...and another one bites the dust.


Anyone else want some time off?


----------



## spawnsc

has anyone received any updates from the BBB or any other sources?


----------



## Larrikin666

Hey guys. I'll keep this short. I apologize for not responding to the PM's recently. I wanted to try to reach out to Bernie before doing so. I'm in the same position as the rest of you now. I'm certainly not jumping ship, but that also means that I can really try to help calm the hordes any longer since I'm out of the loop. 

One thing I want to add is that I'm 100% positive Bernie isn't living in the same house he was a few months ago. I have a very hard time believing this story about him recently being taken away bloody and "Lifeless". Maybe something happened....maybe not. Speculation is the worst thing one can do in these types of situations. I understand people leaning towards the BBB and legal actions now that communication is a black hole, but I won't be fueling that fire.


----------



## SpaceDock

spawnsc said:


> has anyone received any updates from the BBB or any other sources?


 
Its supposed to take two weeks from your date of entry.


----------



## JPMike

delete this. nonsense.


----------



## MunchiesSockmonkey

Can someone else call to confirm the story told earlier about Bernie being injured. Apparently there is truth to the statement, but the cause of the injury is unknown.

Yes he was injured somehow and Police took him to Desert Valley Hospital in Victorville CA. The police department's number is (760)552-6800.

If one of you get the info it might be more believed by the community here.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Hate to bump this tread but I am a customer. I bought a slot back in July 2012. I realize that a lot of people here have been waiting a lot longer than I have been for their guitar. Don't know if this helps with the info that I read a few pages back but I did receive an email from Bernie towards the end of January and he did say that he was sick. I can understand the reasoning to pursue a lawsuit but I won't be one of them. Like others have stated I wish he would just let us know what's going on. If he's sick and has some medical issues that need to be addressed I can understand and I hope that he is doing well. I have the patience to wait for my guitar but I wish communication would be better. I have to admit that I do feel bothered from what I read a few pages back but I just can't seem to believe some of the stories because after all it is the internet. I hope this all gets resolved once the dust settles and we all get our guitars at some point in a well built fashion.


----------



## technomancer

MunchiesSockmonkey said:


> Can someone else call to confirm the story told earlier about Bernie being injured. Apparently there is truth to the statement, but the cause of the injury is unknown.
> 
> Yes he was injured somehow and Police took him to Desert Valley Hospital in Victorville CA. The police department's number is (760)552-6800.
> 
> If one of you get the info it might be more believed by the community here.



Yet strangely they have no patient by that name (another member called and checked). Enjoy your vacation.


----------



## engage757

Edit: Nevermind.


----------



## Red&Die

Larrikin666 said:


> One thing I want to add is that I'm 100% positive Bernie isn't living in the same house he was a few months ago. I have a very hard time believing this story about him recently being taken away bloody and "Lifeless". Maybe something happened....maybe not. Speculation is the worst thing one can do in these types of situations. I understand people leaning towards the BBB and legal actions now that communication is a black hole, but I won't be fueling that fire.



When I visited Bernie 4 months ago in his work shop, he was mentioned that he will move to other house very soon, but will still in same location.


----------



## engage757

7stringkeke said:


> Just talked to the Victorville PD. They cannot release records involving the Police Dept if the person requesting them is not or was not a part of the involvement.



Well, your credibility is gone. Police reports are a matter of public record.


----------



## engage757

Just out of curiosity, maybe I can email BRJ and offer to try to help him catch up on communication. I wonder if it would be easier for him to talk to one person once a day and then have them email customers. Wonder if he would respond to someone that isn't coming at him with a burning torch. Hmmmm...


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I have spent so much time in a one sided relationship with Bernie that I might as well have been talking to Jesus. He doesn't respond to anything anymore.

Edit: I have never been mean, cussed, insulted, or anything even close to disrespectful, so this is not about him being scared away from people.


----------



## technomancer

Just to make it clear guys, we're just trying to keep rumor mongering to a minimum. If somebody gets some real information that's awesome, but trolling with random crap doesn't help anyone.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, the other day I called the two hospitals listed and there is no one under the name Rico admitted. My texts seem to be going through, since I'm not getting an error message, but I don't know if he's getting them. He used to be on iMessage, and now it's going through as a regular text, so something definitely changed there. I got the home address from the one new guy before he got banned, because I was going to try to swing by his house next month when I go to LA, but I don't know that's going to help, now. 
I know a guy who is a private investigator, so I'm thinking maybe I will call him and see what it would cost to track Bernie down just we all know what the heck is going on. If he's truly sick, and it's to the point that the business and his family are just focusing on that, and completely ignoring the orders, then that's one thing. If he's MIA, that's another. 

Bottom line is that we need someone with a decent history here to figure it out so we know s/he isn't trolling. Anyway, hopefully it doesn't cost too much for this PI to hop online and do some research. If I get anywhere I'll post an update.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I just shot a text off to a buddy of mine who's brother works in a pretty significant law enforcement position. I'm going to see if he knows any PI folk in the LA area and maybe we can connect everybody together. Sound like a plan?


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> I know a guy who is a private investigator, so I'm thinking maybe I will call him and see what it would cost to track Bernie down just we all know what the heck is going on.





Speculum Speculorum said:


> I just shot a text off to a buddy of mine who's brother works in a pretty significant law enforcement position. I'm going to see if he knows any PI folk in the LA area and maybe we can connect everybody together. Sound like a plan?



I am willing to financially support you guys, if you are going to hire a Private Investigator.


----------



## spawnsc

i just hope all this comes to an end soon.. and that we get the answers we are looking for.


----------



## killertone

Hey Fellas - don't hesitate to contact me if you need some help with the PI fees. Glad to pitch in for actual results.


----------



## killertone

spawnsc said:


> i just hope all this comes to an end soon.. and that we get the answers we are looking for.



To be completely honest, I just want access to the shop to get my guitars and get out. Whatever level of completion they are in doesn't matter, I just want them. Seems that legally we have a right to get what is ours especially when they are paid in full. I am no lawyer of course. I have documentation and pics to prove what guitars are mine all sent by Bernie himself. Plus, my name is in the pickups cavity of each guitar.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Killertone - have you talked to a police department about your right to your property? They might be interested in that option.


----------



## killertone

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Killertone - have you talked to a police department about your right to your property? They might be interested in that option.



No I haven't. Will do that today.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Also, it sounds like my friend's brother knows nobody at all in LA. Thought I'd give it a shot anyway. Good luck with your dude Holloway.


----------



## Lirtle

I'd also pitch in with the pi fees provided they aren't too ridiculous. Just throwing it out there.


----------



## SpaceDock

killertone said:


> To be completely honest, I just want access to the shop to get my guitars and get out. Whatever level of completion they are in doesn't matter, I just want them. Seems that legally we have a right to get what is ours especially when they are paid in full. I am no lawyer of course. I have documentation and pics to prove what guitars are mine all sent by Bernie himself. Plus, my name is in the pickups cavity of each guitar.



I think this is a really good point. If I could get the guitars, they are painted and everything, and the hardware/pickups it wouldn't take too much for me to finish it up. I have paid for all of the components, why can't I get the stuff and finish it myself? I would much rather get the stuff I paid for than wait indefinitely for him to get back to work and maybe finish them.


----------



## SnowfaLL

If anyone finds anything out, let me know.. I only have $200 tied up in a deposit with him, so its not too bad, but it sucks losing $200 =s


----------



## Richard Von Shaft

*Dear Bernie fans & friends I have some news. This is first hand and not some made up crap. Im only giving you this to save you your cost on hiring a P.I. Ive been looking for Bernie for the last couple weeks myself. Thanks to 7stringkeke and MunchiesSockmonkey for their information. It was very helpful in tracking Bernie down. I called thinking it was Victorvilles Police department, but was told it was the Victor Valley police department (which I got the number from MunchiesSockmonkey on here), so this is what I got from them. They couldnt give me any details, but something happened to him February 15, 2013 and its an ongoing investigation. They did take him to Desert Valley Hospital in Victorville, but he was released. Hes at his home now recovering. Hopefully this will help you guys out. I would like to know who 7stringkeke and MunchiesSockmonkey are so I could get more info from them. Im also in San Diego, Ca. *
*R.V.S.*


----------



## JPMike

This gets way too complicated, movie scenario?


----------



## Adrian-XI

Cheers for the info, Dick Shaft.


----------



## SpaceDock

OMG  Dick Shaft!


----------



## Richard Von Shaft

No problem guys.


----------



## Richard Von Shaft

Really. Trolling? Go ahead waste your money on a P.I. to tell you what I did. You guys don't care or don't believe what really happened. WOW... I'm sickened by your comments. Someone has be injured really bad and all you guys do is bash the people giving you this info. I'm not here to give false claims. THIS IS FIRST HAND INFORMATION. Now I see why no one else is giving updates. Good luck.


----------



## Hollowway

Richard Von Shaft said:


> Really. Trolling? Go ahead waste your money on a P.I. to tell you what I did. You guys don't care or don't believe what really happened. WOW... I'm sickened by your comments. Someone has be injured really bad and all you guys do is bash the people giving you this info. I'm not here to give false claims. THIS IS FIRST HAND INFORMATION. Now I see why no one else is giving updates. Good luck.



Ok, then give me the name of the person you talked with at the Victor Valley sherrif's station. I called and asked if they had any record of Bernie Rico being involved in anything on 2/15 and the lady told me that even if there was she could not tell me. That is private information. They don't release that. So if you give me the name of the person you talked with I'll call, confirm it, and post it up here.


----------



## Rap Hat

A half-dozen people all registering in the last day or two with San Diego as their location, all saying the exact same stuff and referencing each other. Having the same reactions when people don't immediately accept it at face value. On top of that, only showing up after the talk of lawsuits has become more serious. Not during the past month or so with Bernie gone, not before when he disappeared, but only when people are actually starting to be proactive in getting this resolved.

Most of the people here have been in this for a long time, shared ups and downs together, been supportive of each other regardless of how stressful the whole situation has become. Some people got pretty close to Bernie and acted as liaisons for the community when things went to shit. And somehow, despite all that, we can't even question some wild rumors that don't fit with what we know without getting spammed by this reregging bullshit.

We're not idiots here (well, we kinda are but that's not what I mean).

E: This came off a little harsh, sorry... I have a nasty sinus infection, came here for an update, and got totally gobsmacked that there was yet another unknown person getting all pissed that people are skeptical. Y'all have helped me a bunch and I see it as disrespectful to the community as a whole when our experience and history is discounted because we actually question things.


----------



## eaeolian

Well since Bernie was tagged in a picture on Facebook that was taken this week, I don't think it's health problems, unless he had to leave the country in order to stay healthy.


----------



## spawnsc

I hope an admin compares your IP to the other banned accounts to see if its the same "Dick Shaft" making trolling post.

I'm sorry even if its true Bernie or a family member needs to give us the "First hand information". It's very simple to post on Facebook "We are very sorry to report that something very unfortunate has happen to Bernie, no worries his fan but we have an on going investigation into the matter. Bernie will not be able to work on any guitars in the mean time, but we are working to find other luthiers in the area that can live up to Bernies standards. If anyone would like to discuss the matter any further please call us at his shop and leave a voice mail and we WILL return your call soon as possible."

That took a whole 45 seconds to type gee!


----------



## xCaptainx

yeah but they just tagged him in pics of guitars? I could tag you in a picture of my TV right now, that doesn't really mean anything? 

Still going to wait for an official announcement. All this hearsay is so difficult to sit through.


----------



## eaeolian

xCaptainx said:


> yeah but they just tagged him in pics of guitars? I could tag you in a picture of my TV right now, that doesn't really mean anything?
> 
> Still going to wait for an official announcement. All this hearsay is so difficult to sit through.



Eh, could be. Didn't think of it that way.


----------



## Stealthdjentstic

Yeah tagging means nada


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

I don't want to sound like a jerk or anything, but no matter what condition a business owner is in, the owner of that business owes an explanation to his customers as to why his business cannot currently function. If the business owner cannot provide any updates himself and has nobody else to fill his shoes in his absence, then his business model is not set up proper and will never function properly. 

Whatever Bernie is doing, recovering, pulling his dick, gambling, puking, or even just sitting at home with his family enjoying a home cooked meal, his business practices currently suck. That's a fact and it is a fact that we are all aware of at this point. 

If you have not already, file a complaint with the BBB. Also, file a police report with your location PD. They in turn will hand the file over to whatever police department has jurisdiction over the region where BRJ guitar shop is. I tried to file a police report with the Hesperia police department, which I assume is the PD that would have jurisdiction, but they would not accept my report. They told me that I needed to file with my local police since I live out of state. 

I've done all I can for now in regards to legal aspects. Fuck the he said she said stuff. Stick to the facts, which there are not many of right now. We can all speculate and let our minds run wild with whatever thoughts, or suggestions are brought about on this thread. As far as I'm concerned, unless I see a post on BRJ's facebook, or get an email from his business, I don't think that I will believe any other BRJ updates. I may believe it if it comes from a member who has been on here for some time, but not some random person who just pops up at a convenient time. 

In closing, I'd also consider dropping some cash into a PI. I can't help it. I'm really curious to see what the real story is with BRJ.


----------



## spawnsc

James have you followed up with your police report to see if they got any leads? or info


----------



## axxessdenied

This is crazy what this has come to. I cannot understand how anyone can defend his business.

This has nothing to do with Bernie, the man himself. It's about BRJ Guitars not delivering guitars to paying customers. This is a serious issue and to me seems to be fraudulent behaviour going on at this point. Whatever kind of man Bernie is outside of his business means jack shit when his business practices are the complete opposite.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

spawnsc said:


> James have you followed up with your police report to see if they got any leads? or info



No not yet. I know damn well the police in my area have better things to do than worry about my guitar, or money. Unfortunately, this is going to take time and a lot of it, before I get any answers. I'm assuming that it may take up to a month before my report even gets handed off to the Hesperia PD. All that I know so far is that I received an email the other day from the department stating that my file is being reviewed and I will be contacted eventually. I'm giving them a week before I call the department to follow up.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Any updates from anyone? His FB page seems to have degenerated into middle age men posting pictures of themselves with their guitars, people warning others about getting involved with BRJ, and people posting that Bernie is "missing" and no one can contact him. Any luck with the PI stuff?


----------



## SpaceDock

I should be getting a response from the BBB on Thursday, I'll let you guys know what they say.


----------



## spawnsc

I got an update from bbb today this is word for word response

Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he is able to work or update anyone at this time. He has no access to phone or a computer. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.


Omg.....


----------



## infernalservice

I havent heard from bernie in over year regarding the bfr and just got an email from his personal account that looks like a virus. This was literally just now. For someone with no computer access, he did a good job of getting hacked. A few other dudes were cc'd on it...
Edited for privacy:


----------



## SpaceDock

spawnsc said:


> I got an update from bbb today this is word for word response
> 
> Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
> Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he is able to work or update anyone at this time. He has no access to phone or a computer. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.
> 
> 
> Omg.....




I got the same response, so this means we wait.


----------



## spawnsc

We still deserve an official response ....


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I don't think it gets more official than a response from the BBB, however it does state that we get 7 days to come up with a rebuttal. 

I am pretty torn about the situation. I can sympathize with illness and accidents, but how long must we be drug along in this shit? I need some time to digest.


----------



## WickedSymphony

spawnsc said:


> Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
> *Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. *There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he is able to work or update anyone at this time. *He has no access to phone* or a computer. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.



Wat.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

That is fucked. And it's so modus operandi for BRJ at this point. So they reply to the BBB because if they don't, his company gets screwed. But what about you know... all the customers that are waiting without having any information whatsoever to make decisions with?


----------



## JP Universe

spawnsc said:


> I got an update from bbb today this is word for word response
> 
> Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
> Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he _*is*_ able to work or update anyone at this time. He has no access to phone or a computer. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.
> 
> 
> Omg.....


----------



## Lirtle

Unbelievable. We need to get a PI over there before the rebuttal period is over.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

spawnsc said:


> I got an update from bbb today this is word for word response
> 
> Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
> Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he is unable to work or update anyone at this time. He has no access to phone or a computer. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.



I got the exact same email response as well today. Time to file the customer rebuttal with the BBB, as if it will do any good.


----------



## Khoi

got it as well, I'm sure everyone who filed a claim with the BBB got it.

I wonder how long the "recovery" period is.


----------



## killertone

I didn't get that email but did get one from Business Consumer Alliance referencing my complaint with the BBB. Never heard of them. Not sure if they just subscribe to the BBB's complaint list and send out theor own emails or if they are part of the BBB. 

Also got a letter from the CA AG stating that they received my complaint.


----------



## SpaceDock

I just made my rebuttal and told them the problem extends beyond this most recent accident. I am done waiting for everything in Bernie's life to be perfect, I have a lot of problems that he created. I really just want my money or my guitars, not more excuses.


----------



## ovation22

I'm sorry, I don't mean to be harsh, but I'm not buying it. Not yet anyway. 

The only communication I've had from Bernie since I filed with the BBB were promises of a refund. Nothing has been "officially" communicated since. It's just as easy to lie to the BBB as it is to all of us.

Those with outstanding claims with the BBB do what you will.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

ovation22 said:


> I'm sorry, I don't mean to be harsh, but I'm not buying it. Not yet anyway.
> 
> The only communication I've had from Bernie since I filed with the BBB were promises of a refund. Nothing has been "officially" communicated since. It's just as easy to lie to the BBB as it is to all of us.
> 
> Those with outstanding claims with the BBB do what you will.



Your cynicism is totally understandable, but I'm starting to wonder if there isn't something more to this whole "Bernie's in a coma" thing. I mean, the BBB response basically says that somebody from the company contacted them and that Bernie is not in a place where he has access to a phone or computer.

Being in a comatose state does make it difficult to use either. However, as it has been stated before, people need to respond by saying that the issues started well before this recent series of events. Otherwise this will just drift off into the wind and it'll be back where it started.

Also note that STILL - not a single soul has come forward on his behalf and put out a message saying that the man is too sick to work. I realize the BBB is an official statement, but some mass media exposure would be expected. If I was a contracted worker and just disappeared from all contact, I'd be in quite a bit of trouble. It seems that luthiers and big bankers are the only ones who can crap all over people and just walk off into the sunset untouched.


----------



## MetalDaze

Yeah, I've been wondering who responded on his behalf and if it was in response to a phone call from the BBB or a letter in the mail. 

Either way, someone does seem to be monitoring things but ignoring us.


----------



## killertone

ovation22 said:


> I'm sorry, I don't mean to be harsh, but I'm not buying it. Not yet anyway.
> 
> The only communication I've had from Bernie since I filed with the BBB were promises of a refund. Nothing has been "officially" communicated since. It's just as easy to lie to the BBB as it is to all of us.
> 
> Those with outstanding claims with the BBB do what you will.



When did you file your complaint with the BBB? It must have been a while ago since Bernie has been MIA for at least 2 months. I personally haven't had any contact with him since early December.


----------



## ovation22

killertone said:


> When did you file your complaint with the BBB? It must have been a while ago since Bernie has been MIA for at least 2 months. I personally haven't had any contact with him since early December.



I believe it was November. Mine was the first. A refund was promised, publicly.

Last response from Bernie:



> ---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
> From: "Bernie Rico" <[email protected]>
> Date: Fri, January 25, 2013 12:14 pm
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Hello John,
> 
> I will have your refund with in two weeks.
> 
> Have a good one,
> Bernie



Why 2 weeks? No idea.


----------



## Tesla

spawnsc said:


> I got an update from bbb today this is word for word response
> 
> Company's Initial Response - Posted 03/18/2013
> Company states by phone, they apologize for the delay. There has a medical emergency with the owner/operator and he is able to work or update anyone at this time. *He has no access to phone or a computer*. However, upon recovery he will properly address concerns and complete work. Again, they apologize for inconvenience this may have caused.



So he's been using all this money and time to learn Telepathy with the BBB then?


----------



## spawnsc

also just responded back to the BBB; more or less told them something needs to be official and we have all been down this road before with Bernie and to send me the guitar or issue me a full refund and that this is only the beginning....


----------



## HRC51

I got the same response from the BBB. I really appreciate that other members here have filed a complaint, so that they understand that mine is not an isolated incident. There are multiple people with the same problem.

I sent a rebuttal stating that I do not accept their response. I asked for a refund and stated that BRJ could recuperate the money later by selling my guitar upon completion.

I have no idea if this will lead to a desired result, but it is better than continuing to wait.


----------



## Khoi

I put in my rebuttal as well, and also demanded a full refund.


----------



## killertone

I still have not received that email response from the BBB.


----------



## Hollowway

Can, in a response to the BBB, we ask for contact information for someone at the company? That's not unreasonable. And is there a person handling your issues you can chief pick up a phone and call? The BBB is run by people, so we should be ae to call someone. (FWIW I've received nothing back from them yet.). 
Anyway, I'm at least glad there's been some response. I didn't expect anything. And if he is really sick, I hope he gets better. I just wish someone who cared about him would help him handle this stuff, too.


----------



## eaeolian

The next poster that has nothing to do with this thread that posts a regurgitation of the "Bernie illness" tale gets a month off, or a perma if they have under 100 posts. K?


----------



## LOUDONE

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> ^id watch it man you're treading on thin ice, he does not fuck around when he says hes gonna ban someone. if you've got some serious evidence then im sure the post would be allowed.



He has no reason to ban me. I was providing first hand information. However, w/ all the rumors floating around, how am I different than anyone else? He does not know me so I guess he can choose not to believe me. Oh well, I tried. Maybe some people don't want to hear the truth.


----------



## spawnsc

Bruce I read your post before it was removed but the main thing I and I believe everyone else here is want is for the Rico family to stop using others to get their message out to his customers. The Rico family needs to post a formal statement on their Facebook. I do not see why that is so complicated for them to do. I appreciate your efforts and if you do have contact with the Rico family I would pass this along.


----------



## eaeolian

LOUDONE said:


> He has no reason to ban me. I was providing first hand information. However, w/ all the rumors floating around, how am I different than anyone else? He does not know me so I guess he can choose not to believe me. Oh well, I tried. Maybe some people don't want to hear the truth.



Once again, personal or not, no substantiation - every person that's popped up in this thread lately has had some sort of "personal" contact that is in no way verifiable. Until it's something that's verifiable/official, keep it out of this thread. Got it?


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

LOUDONE said:


> He has no reason to ban me. I was providing first hand information. However, w/ all the rumors floating around, how am I different than anyone else? He does not know me so I guess he can choose not to believe me. Oh well, I tried. Maybe some people don't want to hear the truth.



but there have been several others providing "firsthand" information claiming that its the "truth" which without 100% solid evidence is seen as nothing more than rumors which just starts to work people up and mud up the thread.


----------



## killertone

eaeolian said:


> Once again, personal or not, no substantiation - every person that's popped up in this thread lately has had some sort of "personal" contact that is in no way verifiable. Until it's something that's verifiable/official, keep it out of this thread. Got it?



Exactly. Why does everyone that claims they have first hand information not have the ability to substantiate their claims with a family contact or some other verifiable source? I don't get it at all. The mystery around this whole thing has gone way beyond ridiculous levels of stupidity.


----------



## Qweklain

I have not received any response from the BBB yet as some others on here, and I put my complaint in quite a few weeks ago.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

killertone said:


> Exactly. Why does everyone that claims they have first hand information not have the ability to substantiate their claims with a family contact or some other verifiable source? I don't get it at all. The mystery around this whole thing has gone way beyond ridiculous levels of stupidity.



Well, it's not really weird if you think about it. The guy owes about 200 people (that we know of) guitars, or their money back, and it sounds like he can't or won't deliver either. My guess is that everybody involved is holding off for as long as is humanly possible before all that built of crap hits the proverbial fan. Also, he's a prototype Californian bullshitter. He was before he was sick, too, but he was just able to hide it well because he wasn't doing as much business. The light of day really is quite telling, isn't it?


----------



## axxessdenied

killertone said:


> The mystery around this whole thing has gone way beyond ridiculous levels of stupidity.



EXACTLY! DO you understand now why people are so pissed off and not trusting of what some random person on a forum says? Bernie Rico JR Guitars needs to make an official company statement addressing their customers!


----------



## Dewswimmer

It`s really sad to read about this. This guy sucked (((

I have ordered mine hesperian on november 2010.
The customer support was pretty well organized, Bernie himself returned me a call at 6 in the morning in CA - I was surprised. The guitar arrived on february 2011. Everything was fine exept the Korean Floyd Rose, instead of German (I think it is not very good when you order a guitar for 2K and receive a korean floyd instead of original)


----------



## Qweklain

Qweklain said:


> I have not received any response from the BBB yet as some others on here, and I put my complaint in quite a few weeks ago.


Interestingly, shortly after I posted this I got a reply. They said they don't deal with issues that are over a year old? What the hell? I specifically said I paid two months ago of almost 2k with no product. Just anyway I can get fucked, it will be found...

At least I just paid not too long ago, so hopefully my bank will just charge that shit back when I talk to them this weekend.


----------



## Rook

You guys claiming stuff back, demanding refunds and such. Do you think it'd be possible from across the pond? Granted I sold to Chad (at a massive loss) but if I get a refund I can refund Chad and maybe recover something from this.

Thoughts? I really don't know how this stuff works.

EDIT: Woah just flicked back a page, guess that's out of the question. Another dead end, I'm back out of this thread again, sorry


----------



## spawnsc

So I guess we just wait like we have been for the last few years.. but instead on waiting for our guitars we have to wait for the Rico family to get their shit together.


----------



## spawnsc

Guys I just checked my account and seen where my debit card was credited back $700! From my claim but they will not give me my credit on my credit card for some reason for the $400.


----------



## Khoi

spawnsc said:


> Guys I just checked my account and seen where my debit card was credited back $700! From my claim but they will not give me my credit on my credit card for some reason for the $400.



Why only $700? Was that refund just for the deposit? Did you ever make a final payment for the remaining balance?


----------



## spawnsc

I paid the deposit with my debit card $700 and $400 on my credit card. Credit card was out of the time frame for a refund. I never paid Bernie full amount


----------



## Tesla

Well, at least the cogs are starting to turn!

Here's hoping the rest get some reprise!


----------



## spawnsc

I wish everyone here the best also on getting back what they deserve. I will still be stopping in and out of this thread to see what is going on. We have formed a little brother hood here lol I will lose out on $400 but still feels good to get something back out of this ordeal and stick it to Bernie a little. I will probably get an email in 10 years telling me my guitar is ready and I will tell him to stick it up his ass.

I'm still wondering if I will get to keep the $700 because its says "Temporary Credit" so I hope this isn't a credit that will go away if the claim doesn't stick since its been over 2 years.


----------



## Qweklain

I went to my bank yesterday, and filed a charge-back against my final payment I made in January. Sounds like there will be zero argument against my claim based on the information I had to write to the credit card company itself.

I was told I should get contact this coming week on the status of my claim, or just simply to be made aware I was credited back. So ultimately, it looks like I may just be out the $500 deposit, but that's better than $2500. Would be nice if I could get my deposit back too, but my bank cannot do anything, and we all know PayPal won't do anything since it's been over two years...


----------



## ovation22

So, if a class action isn't possible (or practical), you can be sure that the credit card companies will prosecute fraud, when they don't get a response from BRJ Inc.

If anyone truly is in contact with the family, best let them know a world of hurt is likely headed their way.


----------



## killertone

Looks like I have a long day of phone calls with my credit card and bank ahead of me tomorrow. I just researched my guitar orders and realized that I paid for one with my CC and another one with a check through my bank. Maybe if I am totally lucky I will be able to get some charge backs from the CC company. No idea what the bank will do but you never know. Gonna give it a shot.


----------



## ovation22

Check through the mail? Might be worth looking into mail fraud.


----------



## killertone

ovation22 said:


> Check through the mail? Might be worth looking into mail fraud.



Yeah. Sent through the mail. I have the canceled check, too.


----------



## spawnsc

Good luck guys I hope you get back some or all your cash. I just check my bank account again this morning and so far the money is still in there. Ill feel more comfortable when the word "temporary" is removed from the title.


----------



## clubshred

Slightly odd entry on Facebook by someone named Linda Bergmann: 

"_Dear Mr. Bernie Rico Jr. , We believe in you, we have, and hope to always support you in your one of a kind beautiful art, that promotes more beautiful art in music! You are one of the top 5 Luthiers in the world, I believe the # one! ,,, .All of you , who do not understand, an incredible , perfect, one of a kind product takes at least 2 years to create, this is one beautiful genius man trying to create too much inventory on his own, and then falling to an illness, that is no fault of his own! He is an honest man ! All of you cry babies out there ,Be like a grown up Man, be patient!_"

She also responded to her own post by saying. "_If you are buying a very expensive ,,one of a kind,, guitar on a a credit card , you sir are a,,, anyone out there want to call it what it is??!_"

FWIW - I didn't make any changes to the grammar. Seems a little un-cool to call anyone a derogatory name because they used a credit card to make a purchase. Perhaps if BRJ was an "all cash type" it would be acceptable??? That makes like, NO SENSE. Just Sayin'...


----------



## spawnsc

lol i actually laughed reading that.


----------



## HeadBender

...and the soap opera continues. I honestly gave up hope on my rebuild spot.


----------



## clubshred

The part where it says, "It takes at least TWO YEARS to create a guitar blah, blah, blah"... well, I thought the attraction to the BFR (2010) run was that they were quoted 60 days...


----------



## thrsher

i just added a comment to that stupid post


----------



## spawnsc

where did she post that comment at on Facebook?


----------



## thrsher

bernies facebook page http://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars


----------



## spawnsc

look there did she put that comment on one of the photos?


----------



## clubshred

spawnsc said:


> look there did she put that comment on one of the photos?



It was on his wall.


----------



## spawnsc

oh I can't see his wall on new stuff only back in 2012.


----------



## WickedSymphony

So much wrong in that comment I don't even know where to begin.


----------



## JPMike

I don't even wanna comment on that comment.


----------



## tacotiklah

***Warning: Long and depressing post ahead. Don't read if you don't really wanna know what is in Hesperia, CA. Sometimes ignorance is bliss, provided you don't care what happened to your guitar or money.****


Okay guys, I'll start with a bit of a preface. I have not purchased a slot with BRJ, nor do I personally know anyone outside of here that has purchased a BRJ slot. So why am I posting in here? Simple. This situation of seeing all the people that I have shared a good amount of years of my life talking to and hanging out with on this site, getting fucked out of an instrument that they have paid very good money for, has really burned my ass. Enough is enough. Bernie has crossed a very serious line; whether he is sick or not is irrelevant now. He has had ample time to make an official public statement, or at least had a relative make said public statement on his behalf. He has not updated his facebook page since November 25th (insofar as I can tell), and he has also taken down his website. This whole thing smelled of a scam to me. But nobody can prove anything because nobody has really been able to go out to Hesperia. Until now. I live approximately 63 miles west of Hesperia, in the shitty LA suburb of Lancaster. Having discussed with Mesh (djpharoah) and some other people in the chatroom and realizing that I am in fact close enough to go out there have the financial means to do so, I felt the calling to make the trip and at least try to ask a couple questions. Even if it meant being told to fuck off, and that it's none of my business, I would at least be able to visually check on the condition of Bernie and see if he was indeed ill.

This Saturday, March 23, 2013, I and both my niece and her fiancee drove out to there to see what is going on, and maybe try to talk to Bernie or someone and get some sort of statement on audio for you guys. One thing to note -

Here is the yellow pages ad for the shop, so unless this posted address is incorrect, I went to the right place:
Bernie Rico Jr Guitars Hesperia, CA, 92345 - YP.com

I went to that exact address this Saturday and this is what I have found (this will be pretty pic heavy):

There are three big assed aluminum sided warehouses there with multiple businesses in it. This was the first building I looked around at:






This is what I found in the first space of building a:





Here is the parking lot area between buildings A and B:





Building next to the first empty one:





Other side of parking lot area between buildings A and B:





Building B sign with numbers to call for the leasing info. Perhaps someone can check with this:





Here is a metalworking shop on the backside of building C. Again there is a number that people could possibly call to see if they know anything about the guitar shop that it supposed to be in that area:





Another number of a business in that area. Actual lettering is hard to read, but the shadow it casts on the blinds is easy enough to read:





Tow hitch company in the same area. Again, another number that people can try:





Still another number of a neighbor business that people can call and see if they can find anything out:





Kinda dusty and hard to see, but there was another empty building over in building C:





Here is the part of building C that is closest to the street:





Knocked on the door here and no one responded, despite me seeing a car there:









So that's what I've got. I had no clue exactly which building the shop was supposed to be in, so I checked all of them out as best as I could. I went knocking on every door hoping someone would answer and give me info. No such luck. 
I don't know what to tell you guys in this thread other than either 1.) His shop is buried within one of those buildings all dragnet-like with no signage (which is shady as fuck to begin with) and thus was unable to hear me knock (and the doors were locked up tight, so no chance of just opening a door and popping in to say hi) or 2.) There is no open BRJ shop at 17205 Eucalyptus St, Hesperia, CA 92345

I present the evidence that I was there and made the attempt to get info for you. I did this because I felt that I was the only SSO member close enough to try and get some answers, and by me doing nothing, I would literally be the most apathetic jerk alive. My niece and her fiancee live in Lake L.A., which is the halfway point between my house and Hesperia, so I do have the selfish reason of wanting to visit and spend time with them as well. They both are musicians and once I told them of what was happening, they were very much on board to help out too. (doesn't hurt that I bought them 5 Guys Burgers and Fries afterwards either  )


I also wanna make it a point that I don't have the funding to make this trip frequently, so it would possibly be a while before I could go out there again. So for now, this is the best I can provide you guys with for the time being. I feel god awful that I couldn't get a 100% confirmation on anything, other than nobody is home. Do with this what you guys will, and all I ask for in return is a simple thank you.


----------



## JPMike

All I will say is "thank you",as of what's going on, I don't know. Maybe we are really fucked this time... or maybe it's in another location, who knows.


----------



## leonardo7

ghstofperdition said:


> Here is the parking lot area between buildings A and B:



If memory serves me correctly, then thats his shop right there where that dupster is and that door to the right of it


----------



## tacotiklah

If he moved shop, then I don't know. I really hope that is the case and not that he packed up and bailed, but we spent about 30-45 minutes there knocking, taking photos, and looking around to see what we could find. This is the absolute best that I could do short of breaking and entering. 

The one glimmer of hope is the number for the leasing company and the neighboring businesses there that you can try and call to see if Bernie's shop is still there. I at least was able to give you guys another possible lead on what was going on, so there's some silver lining in that.


----------



## clubshred

ghstofperdition said:


> If he moved shop, then I don't know. I really hope that is the case and not that he packed up and bailed, but we spent about 30-45 minutes there knocking, taking photos, and looking around to see what we could find. This is the absolute best that I could do short of breaking and entering.
> 
> The one glimmer of hope is the number for the leasing company and the neighboring businesses there that you can try and call to see if Bernie's shop is still there. I at least was able to give you guys another possible lead on what was going on, so there's some silver lining in that.



Having been there before (End of January, 2011 - right after the NAMM show), his shop is (or was) on the end of that picture. There is an entry-way, then the big shop area behind another door.


----------



## spawnsc

Thank You!!!

I swear the guy grabbed his shit and ran. The whole thing has just been shady with all the cover ups.


----------



## Ben.Last

I don't know how accurate it is in the context of that specific warehouse complex, but Google Maps does have a marker there for his shop if you look up the address. The satellite picture looks as desolate as the photos here, and there's no signage visible. I don't know if there's any way to find out how recent the Google map image is.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Thanks so much for making the trip!



clubshred said:


> Having been there before (End of January, 2011 - right after the NAMM show), his shop is (or was) on the end of that picture. There is an entry-way, then the big shop area behind another door.



Was there ever a sign on the shop or did it always look just like that?


----------



## tacotiklah

Lern2swim said:


> I don't know how accurate it is in the context of that specific warehouse complex, but Google Maps does have a marker there for his shop if you look up the address. The satellite picture looks as desolate as the photos here, and there's no signage visible. I don't know if there's any way to find out how recent the Google map image is.



The GPS navigation on my future nephew in law's phone had us stop right in front of Building A, claiming that was the place. It didn't seem right given that the very first shop of Building A was bone empty. However you guys saying that his shop is the part of building B that was closest to the street is pretty helpful should I or another member ever be able to go out there again. (no clue if I can or would have the money to do so, so I'm not gonna promise anything in regards to doing that)

I just feel that as a business, it is shady and irresponsible as hell to have no identifying markers as to where your business is. Had there been a sign that said "BRJ Guitars" I'd have saved myself a great deal of time and got photos of just the shop and its condition, and did all my knocking and asking questions there.


----------



## Rap Hat

I feel for all those nearly finished guitars that may have been sitting there unattended for god knows how long. Bernie's track record with properly dried wood is awful, I can only imagine the excuses that will show up if a portion of those have to be chucked (or sent out to customers anyways...).

E: I was just thinking about all the Rico Defenders that have posted here and on Facebook. When its pointed out that Bernie has terrible business practices, the excuse is always "we'll, he's not the best, but he's just one guy doing it all himself!" Like that's supposed to make us feel sorry for him and cut him some slack? He couldn't even keep an employee to answer phones or email. He can't even get someone (in an official capacity) to post on his behalf on Facebook. It's left to the members here to try to figure out what's going on, and that's plain wrong.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Somebody had previously mentioned that the shop wasn't marked because of the potential for theft - equipment, loads of exotic and standard guitar blanks just chilling. They said that the building was unmarked but that when you went inside the reception room had a sign for the company.

Granted, you went out on a Saturday. It is not a great surprise that a bunch of manufacturing companies were not at full operation on a weekend. Still, this does not bode well for faith in what is going on over there. It would be more helpful if we could get somebody out there on a weekday.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Oh great more encouraging news! Thanks ghstofperdition! I appreciate you taking the time to do this for all of usl! I just hope we hear some positive news soon. On a side note it looks like I'm going to order a Carvin CT7 in the meantime because I think I'll get that guitar before the Vixen if I even get it at all. Fingers crossed!


----------



## tacotiklah

Well I can tell you that the shop is in the middle of a hot desert and you would REALLY have to go out of your way to even get there. Meaning that you would have to know that it is a guitar shop and already have a good idea of what is in it to begin with. So I dunno how that line of "protecting the materials" holds up, given that it is well away from residential areas or anywhere people might be tempted to try and break in.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Don't think I'm shilling for BRJ by any means. The dude is not legit. I'm just saying what has been stated.

FWIW I don't think the guy has cut tail and run. I think he's probably mortally ill and his family/business is beholden to his machismo mentality about not telling anyone he's hard-up. And it's killing his business.


----------



## spawnsc

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Somebody had previously mentioned that the shop wasn't marked because of the potential for theft - equipment, loads of exotic and standard guitar blanks just chilling. They said that the building was unmarked but that when you went inside the reception room had a sign for the company.
> 
> Granted, you went out on a Saturday. It is not a great surprise that a bunch of manufacturing companies were not at full operation on a weekend. Still, this does not bode well for faith in what is going on over there. It would be more helpful if we could get somebody out there on a weekday.



Weekend or not Bernie should be in there working his ass off, but he could be home "sick" like others have claimed or just on a vacation to Mexico. No body knows other then his family and they for some reason beyond me refuse to release any statements.

Maybe we should go there and mount one of those deer hunting cameras that captures a photo of movement.


----------



## MetalThrasher

Maybe we should go there and mount one of those deer hunting cameras that captures a photo of movement.[/QUOTE]

Good idea! LOL As a bowhunter I know that these cameras get be bought for under $50


----------



## tacotiklah

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Don't think I'm shilling for BRJ by any means. The dude is not legit. I'm just saying what has been stated.
> 
> FWIW I don't think the guy has cut tail and run. I think he's probably mortally ill and his family/business is beholden to his machismo mentality about not telling anyone he's hard-up. And it's killing his business.



I share your sentiments, but all we can go off of is fact. Nobody was there, there were no statements on his behalf made by him or his famly, his website is down, no one is picking up the phone at the business, and he does not even have clear signage to say exactly which building his shop is in. 

The evidence is making a very strong case that he cut tail and ran. With a 15-20 sentence paragraph, coming directly from him or a legitimate legal representative that has verifiable proof of Bernie's illness, he can make much of his troubles go away. He refuses to do so, therefore stubborn pride will be his downfall. Sorry Bernie, but my personal recommendation is that you guys proceed with litigation against him if you have not done so. I'm convinced he will not honor anything he has said he will do and tbvh, the longer you guys wait to pursue legal action, the less likely you are to get anything out of this.


----------



## crazygtr

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Somebody had previously mentioned that the shop wasn't marked because of the potential for theft - equipment, loads of exotic and standard guitar blanks just chilling. They said that the building was unmarked but that when you went inside the reception room had a sign for the company.
> 
> Granted, you went out on a Saturday. It is not a great surprise that a bunch of manufacturing companies were not at full operation on a weekend. Still, this does not bode well for faith in what is going on over there. It would be more helpful if we could get somebody out there on a weekday.



I think this is relevant for the topic, and wish you guys the best. ( I really wish I could help in any way)

Fun at the shop | Facebook


----------



## Qweklain

*ghstofperdition*, PM me your PayPal, I am going to send you $25 for your time and troubles. I said I would contribute to whoever went there, and you have shown proof of that, and I am a man of my word.


----------



## tacotiklah

Qweklain said:


> *ghstofperdition*, PM me your PayPal, I am going to send you $25 for your time and troubles. I said I would contribute to whoever went there, and you have shown proof of that, and I am a man of my word.



I have no paypal and ask for no money. All I wanted was a thank you and for people here to get more info needed so they can decide for themselves what they wanna do about the situation. 

I say keep the $25 and start putting it towards legal counsel.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

So now Keith Morrow chimmed in and said that it will all come out in a couple of days and that he is sad for everyone! But now his facebook comment has disappeared....... Hmmmm!


----------



## spawnsc

interesting, either way what ever the news is I do not expect it to be good news.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

spawnsc said:


> interesting, either way what ever the news is I do not expect it to be good news.



It's not. 

I was put in a very difficult spot yesterday. I spoke with Terry Rico (Bernie's wife) on the phone, and she told me what's happened. I haven't talked to anyone in that camp in a long time. When Bernie dropped off the face of the earth, that even included friends of the family. 

What she told me is the kind of situation that most people would want to keep private. I was asked not to say anything. So I will not get into extreme detail about Bernie's personal health out of respect for Terry Rico. Let's just say that stress and severe depression got the best of Bernie this past year. 

But you guys deserve to know this much:


He's in a group home under close medial supervision
He legitimately does not have access to phone or internet
He'll be in there for an undetermined amount of time (I'm estimating "a lot longer than you want to wait")

So where do you guys go from here? I don't really know. Legal council, perhaps?

I just couldn't leave you guys hanging after hearing this. I'm saddened that the Rico family is going through such dark times, but I feel obligated to try to shed some light on this for everyone involved. 

Keep in mind: I have no affiliation AT ALL with BRJ Guitars. My story with him is fairly long and boring. I've tried to help in the past and got my head ripped off by his customers. I wanted to stay out of this. I'm just an artist/friend. I can't do anything at all to fix this. I can't provide you with details of your order. I can't help you get your refund. 

I'm telling you guys this so that we can all stop speculating, hanging onto hope, getting pissed, etc. It's way beyond that now. Like I said, I'd consider legal council. This is a tough one. 

Terry Rico told me that she is going to make a statement regarding this. That'll probably go down this week. Not too sure. 

That's all I got! Please don't shoot the messenger. It's definitely not easy to be the bearer of bad news.


----------



## killertone

WickedSymphony said:


> Thanks so much for making the trip!
> 
> 
> 
> Was there ever a sign on the shop or did it always look just like that?



There is no sign there. Only the B5 Suite number will tell you which shop is his. When I went there it was fairly easy for to me to find. I only drove around that whole industrial complex once and then found it. It is indeed on he end by the dumpster as was stated before. The pictures don't add to any discouragement as that is what the area looks like at all times. When I was there a little over a year ago Bernie was shipping guitars regularly and the outside of the shop looked the same. 

This is not to say that we aren't all still fucked. 

EDIT: ^^And there you have it^^


----------



## axxessdenied

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> It's not.
> 
> I was put in a very difficult spot yesterday. I spoke with Terry Rico (Bernie's wife) on the phone, and she told me what's happened. I haven't talked to anyone in that camp in a long time. When Bernie dropped off the face of the earth, that even included friends of the family.
> 
> What she told me is the kind of situation that most people would want to keep private. I was asked not to say anything. So I will not get into extreme detail about Bernie's personal health out of respect for Terry Rico. Let's just say that stress and severe depression got the best of Bernie this past year.
> 
> But you guys deserve to know this much:
> 
> 
> He's in a group home under close medial supervision
> He legitimately does not have access to phone or internet
> He'll be in there for an undetermined amount of time (I'm estimating "a lot longer than you want to wait")
> 
> So where do you guys go from here? I don't really know. Legal council, perhaps?
> 
> I just couldn't leave you guys hanging after hearing this. I'm saddened that the Rico family is going through such dark times, but I feel obligated to try to shed some light on this for everyone involved.
> 
> Keep in mind: I have no affiliation AT ALL with BRJ Guitars. My story with him is fairly long and boring. I've tried to help in the past and got my head ripped off by his customers. I wanted to stay out of this. I'm just an artist/friend. I can't do anything at all to fix this. I can't provide you with details of your order. I can't help you get your refund.
> 
> I'm telling you guys this so that we can all stop speculating, hanging onto hope, getting pissed, etc. It's way beyond that now. Like I said, I'd consider legal council. This is a tough one.
> 
> Terry Rico told me that she is going to make a statement regarding this. That'll probably go down this week. Not too sure.
> 
> That's all I got! Please don't shoot the messenger. It's definitely not easy to be the bearer of bad news.



Still don't see why no public statement can't be made on their facebook page or on their website stating that work has stopped for an indeterminate amount of time because of uncontrollable circumstances.


----------



## eaeolian

So, in other words, this is just a re-statement of the "Bernie is sick" meme.

You're lucky you have over 100 posts. As it is, I'll leave this up, but suggest that everyone treat it for what it is - hearsay.


----------



## killertone

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Terry Rico told me that she is going to make a statement regarding this. That'll probably go down this week. Not too sure.



Terry needs to grant access to the shop so we can get our guitars in whatever state they are in. There is zero hope of receiving anything even with a lawsuit. In my personal situation, the only thing I feel like I could get out of this that has any value at all are my unfinished guitars. 

I have every single text and email saved from Bernie to easily prove which ones are mine. These texts and emails are full of pics. Fuck, my name is in the pickup cavity for fuck's sake. 

Fuck.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

eaeolian said:


> So, in other words, this is just a re-statement of the "Bernie is sick" meme.
> 
> You're lucky you have over 100 posts. As it is, I'll leave this up, but suggest that everyone treat it for what it is - hearsay.



Ban threat? I expected that. I'm not even going to try to argue. This is exactly what happened last time I tried to offer any info. 

Take it or leave it, I don't care either way.


----------



## eaeolian

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Ban threat? I expected that. I'm not even going to try to argue. This is exactly what happened last time I tried to offer any info.
> 
> Take it or leave it, I don't care either way.



You obviously didn't read the rest of the thread. Since this isn't "official", I'm telling people to take it with a grain of salt. I don't doubt you're relaying what you've been told, which is why I'm leaving it up.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

eaeolian said:


> You obviously didn't read the rest of the thread. Since this isn't "official", I'm telling people to take it with a grain of salt. I don't doubt you're relaying what you've been told, which is why I'm leaving it up.



Fair enough. Although, deleting my posts and banning me would probably be more to my benefit than yours. So if you feel the need to give your magic power a spin around the block, be my guest. This is most definitely something I don't want to trouble myself with. But, I feel bad for all of the people here who paid money for something that they aren't likely to get. That is the ONLY reason I brought this out into the open.


----------



## Overtone

axxessdenied said:


> Still don't see why no public statement can't be made on their facebook page or on their website stating that work has stopped for an indeterminate amount of time because of uncontrollable circumstances.





killertone said:


> Terry needs to grant access to the shop so we can get our guitars in whatever state they are in. There is zero hope of receiving anything even with a lawsuit. In my personal situation, the only thing I feel like I could get out of this that has any value at all are my unfinished guitars.
> 
> I have every single text and email saved from Bernie to easily prove which ones are mine. These texts and emails are full of pics. Fuck, my name is in the pickup cavity for fuck's sake.
> 
> Fuck.



Realistically, BRJ/family/company are not going to voluntarily do any of those things.


----------



## Hollowway

Thanks Keith! Hopefully Terry is being 100% honest. I'm with the other guys that hopefully we can get our guitars in whatever state they're in and finish them on our own. If he's likely to be back in there soon, like 30-90 days, I can see him working on them to finish them up. If not, I can't imagine we wouldn't be allowed to just take them in whatever state they're in.
Normally I'd just take Terry's statement at face value (especially since based on your post it sounds like she sounded honest), but there is a part of me that wonders if the story goes deeper than she's letting on, just because of the weirdness of the whole situation.


----------



## spawnsc

Listen to Keith his a good source of REAL info. Everyone needs to keep contacting their banks and getting legal advice on what to do. You paid for a FINISHED guitar now something unfinished that you or another luthier will have to do. So far i've got $700 back of the $1100 I spent. Give a detailed report to your bank not something that is 5 lines and give them all emails that show communication. You have to keep pushing to make something happen.

Keith, I appreciate you taking the time to make that post here..

It sounds like Bernie tried killing himself and it might go hand in hand with the other stories we heard on here about him being bloody in his car. Either way if Bernie is trying to kill himself out of this situation I lost even more respect for him. Man up and give us the details no matter how hard it might be for us to swallow.


----------



## killertone

...


----------



## JaeSwift

spawnsc said:


> Listen to Keith his a good source of REAL info. Everyone needs to keep contacting their banks and getting legal advice on what to do. You paid for a FINISHED guitar now something unfinished that you or another luthier will have to do. So far i've got $700 back of the $1100 I spent. Give a detailed report to your bank not something that is 5 lines and give them all emails that show communication. You have to keep pushing to make something happen.
> 
> Keith, I appreciate you taking the time to make that post here..
> 
> It sounds like Bernie tried killing himself and it might go hand in hand with the other stories we heard on here about him being bloody in his car. Either way if Bernie is trying to kill himself out of this situation I lost even more respect for him. Man up and give us the details no matter how hard it might be for us to swallow.



The point of Keith's post was to stop the stupid speculation, not add more to it.


----------



## spawnsc

JaeSwift said:


> The point of Keith's post was to stop the stupid speculation, not add more to it.



I didn't add to it, I just said it COULD go hand in hand with what _was_ mention earlier.


----------



## asher

spawnsc said:


> Either way if Bernie is trying to kill himself out of this situation I lost even more respect for him. Man up and give us the details no matter how hard it might be for us to swallow.



If Bernie were trying to kill himself out of this situation I'd feel _extremely sorry_ for him. It'd have nothing to do with "manning up" bullshit and everything to do with this apparently triggering severe mental health issues or illness. While Bernie has every obligation to tell his customers _something_, like "sudden and serious health issues that will preclude work for an indeterminate but significant amount of time", the details of what those may be are private and between him, his family, and his doctors.

I'm not a BRJ customer, I've just been following the thread hoping that some sort of good resolution can be reached, because the whole thing's just been awful. But the comment struck me as particularly callous and ignorant about mental illness - it may not have wholly been intended that way, but it's how it read. Stuff can be incredibly serious.

I'm glad that you guys are finally having some luck with anything; if this account is true (and if it were not, it wouldn't be a reflection on Keith but his source - thanks for posting!) I wish the Rico family the best too, and hope that things can still eventually resolve themselves.


----------



## spawnsc

I was just trying to say that if his trying to kill himself over this mess that HE himself created and to leave his family to deal with it, then yeah that is bullshit. If he have a true serve depression and mental illness then that is something different, and I meant no disrespect to anyone who has or is going through a mental illness. I was just saying that if he did it over this situation then thats just messed up. Either way we just need to wait for Terry to never give us the real facts on what has happened. I feel sorry for our oversea brothers who will have a harder time getting their money then us in the states.


----------



## 7stringkeke

I'm going to Hesperia on Friday to talk to the Police Dept about getting a warrant to get our guitars. I will let you guys know what they say.


----------



## 7stringkeke

I'm going over to Hesperia and a Deputy is going to escort me over to the house just in the case that they don't answer phone calls or me knocking on the door. Will keep you guys posted.


----------



## spawnsc

7stringkeke said:


> I'm going over to Hesperia and a Deputy is going to escort me over to the house just in the case that they don't answer phone calls or me knocking on the door. Will keep you guys posted.



film it


----------



## 7stringkeke

spawnsc said:


> film it


 I don't think I will film it but I will take pictures.


----------



## asher

spawnsc said:


> I was just trying to say that if his trying to kill himself over this mess that HE himself created and to leave his family to deal with it, then yeah that is bullshit. If he have a true serve depression and mental illness then that is something different, and I meant no disrespect to anyone who has or is going through a mental illness. I was just saying that if he did it over this situation then thats just messed up. Either way we just need to wait for Terry to never give us the real facts on what has happened. I feel sorry for our oversea brothers who will have a harder time getting their money then us in the states.



Well, except I don't think situation A is valid, because that out is not healthy, normal, or I think something most people would consider at all... as opposed to those fleeing to Mexico theories. It's like, if it's something that's being seriously considered, that automatically makes it situation B.


----------



## tacotiklah

asher said:


> If Bernie were trying to kill himself out of this situation I'd feel _extremely sorry_ for him. It'd have nothing to do with "manning up" bullshit and everything to do with this apparently triggering severe mental health issues or illness. While Bernie has every obligation to tell his customers _something_, like "sudden and serious health issues that will preclude work for an indeterminate but significant amount of time", the details of what those may be are private and between him, his family, and his doctors.
> 
> I'm not a BRJ customer, I've just been following the thread hoping that some sort of good resolution can be reached, because the whole thing's just been awful. But the comment struck me as particularly callous and ignorant about mental illness - it may not have wholly been intended that way, but it's how it read. Stuff can be incredibly serious.
> 
> I'm glad that you guys are finally having some luck with anything; if this account is true (and if it were not, it wouldn't be a reflection on Keith but his source - thanks for posting!) I wish the Rico family the best too, and hope that things can still eventually resolve themselves.





Well if this *is* the case, then I give Bernie and his family my sincere apologies and will offer to help them in any way I can. My goal out of doing anything in regards to this is to help bring the situation to a close and do so in a way that satisfies both sides of this issue. If Bernie needs an extra hand around the shop doing grunt work, I'll offer my time once this school semester is over so long as he helps pay for my gas to and from there. I'll take it on myself to help make sure people get their guitars and that Bernie gets out from under this mountain of pressure.

That's my goal and reasoning.


----------



## Khoi

7stringkeke said:


> I'm going to Hesperia on Friday to talk to the Police Dept about getting a warrant to get our guitars. I will let you guys know what they say.



That sounds awesome, but perhaps we should wait until the statement from Terry Rico? It might cover what they decide to do with the remaining guitars.

I do want my guitar though, and I hope I can pick it up next time I'm out in California.


----------



## Hollowway

Khoi said:


> That sounds awesome, but perhaps we should wait until the statement from Terry Rico? It might cover what they decide to do with the remaining guitars.
> 
> I do want my guitar though, and I hope I can pick it up next time I'm out in California.



Well, I'm saying lets have him go ahead and do it. My feeling is that a lot of time has passed and there have been a lot of legal threats, reversed cc charges, etc. I understand how hard this might be on her, but letting those guitars sit unattended in a room in a desert is not going to help anyone. I'm also hoping she comes out and says they found someone else to finish them up, or that they will refund everything paid, or that they are shipping them as is, but I also doubt she really has any idea what he's doing at the shop, and her statement probably won't address our guitars at all.


----------



## leonardo7

Im going to be logical and level headed about this whole thing. The Rico's and courts wont ever just let people just show up and claim their guitar. A "free for all" is not something that will happen. In addition, there's too many things that would need to go down to get your unfinished build back. First Bernie would have to OK it, or the courts. Second someone would have to coordinate the whole thing and contact you. If they are given a long time frame to satisfy then it could take a year or two to even get in touch with you if they decide to take their time and stretch it out. Then you have to buy a plane ticket and fly out there. It would be one hell of a process and time involved for someone from Bernie's side to sit at the shop and coordinate the whole thing. That would be like hundreds of individual appointments that would need to be made. We would be talking about a very long process that nobody has the incentive or time to realistically do. Nobody, I repeat, nobody is qualified or has the time and will to do that type of thing but Bernie himself. Bernie is most definitely the only qualified person to sort through the specs sheets/builds. In addition, if he has the time to do that then he has the time to complete the builds so what Im trying to say is that on a logical level, nobody is going to get their unfinished builds. 

They are probably going to just apologize and tell everyone that there's nothing that will be done until Bernie is healthy, released, and gets back to it.


----------



## 7stringkeke

leonardo7 said:


> Im going to be logical and level headed about this whole thing. The Rico's and courts wont ever just let people just show up and claim their guitar. A "free for all" is not something that will happen. In addition, most of you guys aren't gonna actually fly out there even if that was the case. It would be one hell of a process and time involved for someone from Bernie's side to sit at the shop and coordinate the whole thing. That would be like hundreds of individual appointments that would need to be made. We would be talking about a very long process that nobody has the incentive or time to realistically do. Nobody, I repeat, nobody is qualified or has the time and will to do that type of thing but Bernie himself. Bernie is most definitely the only qualified person to sort through the specs sheets/builds. In addition, if he has the time to do that then he has the time to complete the builds so what Im trying to say is that on a logical level, nobody is going to get their unfinished builds. They are probably going to just apologize and tell everyone that there's nothing that will be done until Bernie is healthy, released, and gets back to it.


 Guess we will find out, hopefully if I get her to answer the door.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

7stringkeke said:


> Guess we will find out, hopefully if I get her to answer the door.



Bernie won't be there. He's in a psych ward. I'm not sure how going to that residence will help much. Terry told me that people have been coming by their house and pounding on the door. It terrifies her, to be honest. 

I wouldn't expect her to come rushing to the door to talk to you. Your guitar is the last thing on her mind, I promise you that.


----------



## Rev2010

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Your guitar is the last thing on her mind, I promise you that.



It's not about a guitar per se but about money. Sick or not someone doesn't just win a "get out of jail free" card for being depressed and hurting oneself when they have multiple thousands of dollars from customers without ever delivering a product. 

Would be more appropriate for people not to think of it like a bunch of whiny guitarist wanting their toys and facing the fact that a very very large amount of cash was given to this guy with zero return.


Rev.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Rev2010 said:


> It's not about a guitar per se but about money. Sick or not someone doesn't just win a "get out of jail free" card for being depressed and hurting oneself when they have multiple thousands of dollars from customers without ever delivering a product.
> 
> Would be nice to stop making it like a bunch of whiney guitarist wanting their toys and facing the fact that a very very large amount of cash was given to this guy with zero return.
> 
> 
> Rev.



I agree completely. I'm not trying to justify anything (I have no reason to). But Terry isn't the right person to target here. She's not a part of BRJ (the company). So going to her house might not do much. That may change as this situation begins to resolve, but as for now, I don't think she can legally even help anyone regarding BRJ guitars.

...and what I meant by "your guitar is the last thing on her mind": She's had to deal with some seriously heavy stuff this year. Her daughter and her family are the only thing she's concerned with right now. That eclipses even a major issue with BRJ guitars for her. I just wouldn't expect her to put this BRJ disaster before her interpersonal issues. These are non-business, human issues. That's all I'm saying.


----------



## Rev2010

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> ...and what I meant by "your guitar is the last thing on her mind": She's had to deal with some seriously heavy stuff this year. Her daughter and her family are the only thing she's concerned with right now. That eclipses even a major issue with BRJ guitars for her



I hear ya man, and I wasn't meaning to sound like I was suggesting you're the one looking at the customers in such a way (have seen comments along the way from others), I edited my post to adjust the wording but I guess not quick enough.

My point is even though BRJ is incorporated the actions he took could very well be found by a court of law to be fraudulent. In such a case you wouldn't be protected via the corporation and personal assets could very well be seized. So if I were Terry, with Bernie already being looked after now, one of my next most important concerns would be to try to work this out _somehow_, or at least do some type of damage control. Being that she hasn't even made a public announcement in all this time to at least alert the customers, or that Bernie hasn't had someone set to do such a thing in his place, just has them looking forward to an even deeper world of problems. 


Rev.


----------



## DIOBOLIC5150

Rev2010 said:


> I hear ya man, and I wasn't meaning to sound like I was suggesting you're the one looking at the customers in such a way (have seen comments along the way from others), I edited my post to adjust the wording but I guess not quick enough.
> 
> My point is even though BRJ is incorporated the actions he took could very well be found by a court of law to be fraudulent. In such a case you wouldn't be protected via the corporation and personal assets could very well be seized. So if I were Terry, with Bernie already being looked after now, one of my next most important concerns would be to try to work this out _somehow_, or at least do some type of damage control. Being that she hasn't even made a public announcement in all this time to at least alert the customers, or that Bernie hasn't had someone set to do such a thing in his place, just has them looking forward to an even deeper world of problems.
> 
> 
> Rev.



Totally. I talked with her again today, and she wants to come out and at least say SOMETHING. She's at work, but is going to try to make a statement on Bernie's Facebook ASAP. I don't know what all she can do/say in regards to this situation, but I guess we'll know soon enough.


----------



## MetalDaze

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Bernie won't be there. He's in a psych ward. I'm not sure how going to that residence will help much. Terry told me that people have been coming by their house and pounding on the door. It terrifies her, to be honest.
> 
> I wouldn't expect her to come rushing to the door to talk to you. Your guitar is the last thing on her mind, I promise you that.


 
Yes, let's please separate our issues with Bernie from his family. 

I know there's concern that his wife is covering for him, but whatever. If I was in a hospital only to emerge and find out that people were harassing my wife, you wouldn't have to come looking for me, I'd find you 

Anyway, this is the most real sounding information we've had in a long time and fits most of the anecdotal stories we've heard along the way. 

Let's just keep it civil and focus on who we are really mad at


----------



## HeadBender

I would say someone who has close(er) contact with the Family should explain the seriousness of the situation so that they are aware of the possible scenarios if certain actions would take place against the Guitar co.


----------



## SpaceDock

They need to issue refunds now.


----------



## killertone

Refunds are the teeny tiniest of long shots. I just don't see a scenario where that will happen. 

All I have wanted for the last 3.5 months since my last communication with Bernie is an explanation of what is going on. Hearing this new information, it sounds like his situation couldn't be any worse and I wish him and his family the absolute best. Don't know what else to say here.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ while I sympathize with him and his family, it is clear that he won't be finishing guitars any time soon and they have know it for some time. That is a clear failure of their business and they should issue refunds since they can't provide products.

I really fear that he doesn't have health insurance since he is self employed. If so then his medical bills will far outweigh any money that he could recoup in the relative future, in that scenario his assets ie our guitars, could be seized to pay his debt. Hospital stays can be thousands of dollars a day and that shit adds up quick.


----------



## JaeSwift

IF they start issuing semi-completed guitars to people in the Netherlands I can help out with completing them.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

7stringkeke said:


> I don't think I will film it but I will take pictures.


I would like to go with you if you have room. I brought him my B.C. Rich warlock his dad built for me and was suppose to be restored.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Grover Ballmer said:


> I would like to go with you if you have room. I brought him my B.C. Rich warlock his dad built for me and was suppose to be restored.


 And your trying to take your guitar to Bernie to be restored? Ha


----------



## killertone

7stringkeke said:


> And your trying to take your guitar to Bernie to be restored? Ha



I think he sent it to him already and Bernie has it.


----------



## 7stringkeke

DIOBOLIC5150 said:


> Bernie won't be there. He's in a psych ward. I'm not sure how going to that residence will help much. Terry told me that people have been coming by their house and pounding on the door. It terrifies her, to be honest.
> 
> I wouldn't expect her to come rushing to the door to talk to you. Your guitar is the last thing on her mind, I promise you that.


 Well I understand where you are coming from but like I stated earlier, I will have a Deputy Sheriff with me so there is no reason for her to be terrified of me or thinking that I'm harassing her. Because that is not the reason I am going. I also have a family and $3800 isn't made overnight. Sick or not its the Rico's responsibility. If Bernie gets in a bind like this, something so big and can't be there. She is next in line. It's just the way it is. The reason I am going is to finish getting the paperwork from the county clerk and taking the court papers and her court date. That is why I will have the deputy with me. I am taking her to court seeing that Bernie cannot come himself. She is next of kin. If she was to not respond to my court date then a warrant will be put out for her arrest. In this situation I feel very badly for Bernie and his family but, again this is the real world and people must take responsibility for their actions. Whether they are smart, or in this case, not so smart.


----------



## ovation22

7stringkeke said:


> Well I understand where you are coming from but like I stated earlier, I will have a Deputy Sheriff with me so there is no reason for her to be terrified of me or thinking that I'm harassing her. Because that is not the reason I am going. I also have a family and $3800 isn't made overnight. Sick or not its the Rico's responsibility. If Bernie gets in a bind like this, something so big and can't be there. She is next in line. It's just the way it is. The reason I am going is to finish getting the paperwork from the county clerk and taking the court papers and her court date. That is why I will have the deputy with me. I am taking her to court seeing that Bernie cannot come himself. She is next of kin. If she was to not respond to my court date then a warrant will be put out for her arrest. In this situation I feel very badly for Bernie and his family but, again this is the real world and people must take responsibility for their actions. Whether they are smart, or in this case, not so smart.




Good luck. Please do keep us posted.


----------



## 7stringkeke

ovation22 said:


> Good luck. Please do keep us posted.


 Will do. Won't be till next week or so that I get to Hesperia after all. But will keep you Gus updated.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

7stringkeke said:


> And your trying to take your guitar to Bernie to be restored? Ha


He's had it since 2011 with all the parts and I've already paid him. I just want to pick it up. It was built by his dad and the headstock was singed. My last contact with him was January 21 via text. He said he had been sick and was just getting back to work. You can call me and I'll give you some more info.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Grover Ballmer said:


> He's had it since 2011 with all the parts and I've already paid him. I just want to pick it up. It was built by his dad and the headstock was singed. My last contact with him was January 21 via text. He said he had been sick and was just getting back to work.


 I would bring you along but like I said I am doing this just to take her the court date and paperwork.


----------



## JPMike

So I got around $12k wasted? Nice...


----------



## Grover Ballmer

The pictures of his building is accurate. When I was there was no sign or anything. It looks like the pictures a couple threads back.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

leonardo7 said:


> If memory serves me correctly, then thats his shop right there where that dupster is and that door to the right of it


 Your right this is the shop. It looks like this (no sign or anything is posted outside), so maybe everything is still there. I was able to get the owners number, but when I called I got an answering machine. I left a message asking if suite B5 is available, so hopefully he'll call me back.


----------



## Grover Ballmer




----------



## Tyler

"*I am speaking to you tonight on behalf of my husband, Bernie. Bernie is currently unable to deliver this message, himself. I am not affiliated with BRJ Guitars in any professional sense, so I am unable to address any specific issues regarding outstanding orders with BRJ Guitars. In no way is this statement designed to assuage the confusion and anger those of you feel towards BRJ, or justify the extended delay on your orders. I am here to state facts, not give excuses.

Bernie is currently receiving acute psychiatric treatment in a controlled environment. By controlled, I mean that he has no access to phone, email, or basically any medium to conduct business with. Bernie has been admitted for psychiatric treatment several times since early 2012. More recently, Bernie was admitted 8 weeks ago, and his date of release has yet to be determined. My husband has developed a mental illness and is a danger to himself, and has been for some time.

As you can imagine, all of this has been devastating to our family. I have been left with a situation that I am in no way qualified to handle. I have limited and scheduled communication with my husband, so I am unable gain any immediate resolution in regards to his business. I won't tell you to be patient, because I know that has been asked of you for far too long. I simply hope that this helps you understand why closure to this situation has been delayed, and why it will continue to be delayed.

On behalf of the Rico family, I sincerely apologize.

Theresa Rico."

Just in straight from Facebook
*


----------



## DoomJazz

^Christ you're fast...


----------



## WildBroskiAppears

Damn, beat me to it. It's good that there was finally a direct update to this situation. However, that is truly terrible and I wish the best for Bernie and his family.


----------



## demonx

nellings6 said:


> Just in straight from Facebook
> [/B]



A screen shot of the above just to make it look official!


----------



## snowblind56

demonx said:


> A screen shot of the above just to make it look official!



Why is "Theresa" spelled wrong from what is on Facebook?


----------



## noizfx

snowblind56 said:


> Why is "Theresa" spelled wrong from what is on Facebook?



Cause the post was deleted then reposted


----------



## demonx

snowblind56 said:


> Why is "Theresa" spelled wrong from what is on Facebook?



Thats bizarre, my only guess is that she may have edited it after realising the typo, but I mast have screen capped it just before - as I swear, its a direct screen cap from facebook ands then I just cropped it before posting.


----------



## Hollowway

OK, so obviously I wish the best for the Rico family, and I have to admit I feel a lot better knowing he didn't close up shop and head for another country or something. But what does this mean for us? I feel like someone should step in and tell her that they will handle stuff in the short term to deal with it. But my guess is that they don't have any sort of contingency plan for situations like this. Honestly, if this is just a matter of hanging in there I'd be willing to do it, but I don't really know if her post indicates that the plan is to make good on the business stuff (i.e. honor the agreed orders or refund them) or not. 

For the record, I believe this. This is one of the few possible "health issues" one can have and have reasonable justification for wanting to keep it private.


----------



## Michael T

I agreehttp://www.sevenstring.org/forum/members/hollowway.html Hollowway 100%.

I've hung in here this long & I'd like to eventually have a guitar to show for it.


----------



## Hollowway

demonx said:


> Thats bizarre, my only guess is that she may have edited it after realising the typo, but I mast have screen capped it just before - as I swear, its a direct screen cap from facebook ands then I just cropped it before posting.



Yeah, that's weird. I've typo'd my name a lot, too, but always with a letter next to the one I'm typing or something. Never with a common alternative spelling of my name.  Maybe she emailed something to one of the guys at the shop and he posted on her behalf?


----------



## SpaceDock

Goddamn how far does the rabbit hole go?


----------



## Rap Hat

Welp. It's a statement, that's for sure. And it seems like it can be traced back to the BFR thing. It definitely shoots down some of the absurd rumors about his health that were being posted here.

Talking to my lawyer tomorrow. He doesn't generally cover things like this, but he told me he should be able to help. Mental illness runs in my family and I had many bouts with hospitalization when I was younger, and I know how hard recovery can be. At this point it's not realistic to expect the guitars to get finished - even when Bernie gets out, he's probably going to be told to stay away from triggers - from the looks of it, his job. I'd like to think someone else will be able to take over and finish the guitars, but that's fantasy on my part.

Good luck everyone. I know most of you won't care, but however you try to resolve this remember that his family is suffering because of his illness too. Way more than we are.

*I'm assuming this is true (or mostly anyways). I remember some of you had talked specifics about it with Bernie after his first hospitalization but chose not to mention what it was here out of respect. Now that there's a statement, I hope it can either be corroborated or shot down.


----------



## MetalThrasher

At least we know what's going on. I hope and pray for Bernie and his family that he is doing well! Honesty goes far in my book. Yes, I'm worried because I bought a slot for a guitar this past summer and then paid in full months ago but I realized I was in for a ride. I'm glad someone said something about Bernie's condition. I'll admit that I have depression and I can relate to what Bernie and his family are going through. Hopefully, we can at least get a few updates here and there on how Bernie is doing.


----------



## potatohead

I have exactly $0 invested into anything here, but I've been following this thread for some time, and this has me pretty miffed. 

The fact Bernie has absolutely no back-up plan for his business in case of a situation like this just shows how badly run this business is/was. People die in car accidents or heart attacks or choking on sex toys or whatever on a daily basis. To not have an action plan concerning your business for someone to take upon your demise is astronomically stupid. 

I can appreciate Theresa's predicament, and how it must be pretty hard on her. What I can't appreciate is how she is trying to deflect the blame all onto the business and onto Bernie. Does she honestly believe she hasn't benefitted from some of this deposit money that has vanished, or is she just completely naive? It's all wrapped up in supplies and invested back into the business? None of it was ever used for a mortgage payment or a vacation or a night on the town? I don't believe that for a nanosecond. 

I might get lambasted for saying this but I am a major skeptic and I can't say the thought hasn't crossed my mind this is all just a ploy to get out of owing a couple hundred grand.


----------



## AwDeOh

Feeling for all you guys who are invested in this, as well as the Rico family. I've been part way down the road that Bernie's on (I don't doubt many of us have to varying degrees). 

I've also been in a similar situation to Terry, having had a business run by a family member dropped in our lap when said family member had a stress related breakdown. We were lucky that it was a one off episode that didn't last too long, and were able to bring people in to keep the business running. That was hard as well, so yeah, feeling for Terry.

If I lived closer, I'd jump at the chance to work for free helping move the backlog along in return for some tuition from Bernie.


----------



## Guitarist1976

MetalThrasher said:


> At least we know what's going on. I hope and pray for Bernie and his family that he is doing well! Honesty goes far in my book. Yes, I'm worried because I bought a slot for a guitar this past summer and then paid in full months ago but I realized I was in for a ride. I'm glad someone said something about Bernie's condition. I'll admit that I have depression and I can relate to what Bernie and his family are going through. Hopefully, we can at least get a few updates here and there on how Bernie is doing.


 
Are you kidding me? He ripped numerous people off and you care how he is doing?He didn't give two shits when he took your money. Bernie obviously doesn't care about our families well being or the hard earned money that we all lost to his shit business antics. If he did, he would have issued refunds or completed the guitars. You are feeling bad for the wrong people!


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, I mean even if someone could go in and make sure the temperature of the shop was OK, then at least it would buy us time to figure out a way to figure out whose build was whose. Is Ed still affiliated with the shop? I know it's a lot to process, but even if Terry just gave us a little bit of help I think we could try to wrap this up in a weekend. Heck, if I knew I could get into the shop legally I'd donate an entire day to tabulate the builds in there and we could start matching them up with everyone's orders.


----------



## Hollowway

Guitarist1976 said:


> Are you kidding me? He ripped numerous people off and you care how he is doing?He didn't give two shits when he took your money. Bernie obviously doesn't care about our families well being or the hard earned money that we all lost to his shit business antics. If he did, he would have issued refunds or completed the guitars. You are feeling bad for the wrong people!



Yeah, I gotta agree with this. While I do, in general, feel sorry for anyone's family who has to go through having someone very sick, I don't think this absolves him of any of his responsibility either in the past or the future with respect to these builds. He's had plenty of time over the past two years to try to fix this situation. I honestly feel bad for the guy, but I don't "forgive" any of his debts to us.


----------



## asher

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I gotta agree with this. While I do, in general, feel sorry for anyone's family who has to go through having someone very sick, I don't think this absolves him of any of his responsibility either in the past or the future with respect to these builds. He's had plenty of time over the past two years to try to fix this situation. I honestly feel bad for the guy, but I don't "forgive" any of his debts to us.



Who's forgiving him? I don't think anyone's said it absolves him of any responsibility for the conduct of his business, but you can still be compassionate for a family going through some serious shit, and maybe have a little more understanding about how those actions may have arisen.

tl;dr compassion/understanding != forgiveness and absolvement from responsibility


----------



## Ben.Last

potatohead said:


> I have exactly $0 invested into anything here, but I've been following this thread for some time, and this has me pretty miffed.
> 
> The fact Bernie has absolutely no back-up plan for his business in case of a situation like this just shows how badly run this business is/was. People die in car accidents or heart attacks or choking on sex toys or whatever on a daily basis. To not have an action plan concerning your business for someone to take upon your demise is astronomically stupid.
> 
> I can appreciate Theresa's predicament, and how it must be pretty hard on her. What I can't appreciate is how she is trying to deflect the blame all onto the business and onto Bernie. Does she honestly believe she hasn't benefitted from some of this deposit money that has vanished, or is she just completely naive? It's all wrapped up in supplies and invested back into the business? None of it was ever used for a mortgage payment or a vacation or a night on the town? I don't believe that for a nanosecond.
> 
> I might get lambasted for saying this but I am a major skeptic and I can't say the thought hasn't crossed my mind this is all just a ploy to get out of owing a couple hundred grand.



I understand the pure fucked-up-titude of this whole situation but... do you have any experience at all running a small business, especially an artisan one??? My fiance's father was a luthier (high end acoustics), he died of an aneurism a few years ago. Let me tell you, there's no plan in place for something like that. I don't know details as to how things played out with customers he was building for at the time, but it more or less financially ruined his wife, even after life insurance. I know that that's very different from the situation here, but try to be realistic about how things work. There's almost never a safety net like you're talking about with small businesses.


----------



## Hollowway

^ Condolences on your father in law. But really, dying and owning a small business of any sort is not much different from dying in general. Generally people are recommended to have a will to disperse assets and/or life insurance to cover debts. A small business owner will generally have disability and life insurance as well as a written succession (a will for the business) in case of an emergency. My thinking is that it's not so much that someone would have to finish the work - that can't be expected for situations like these. But there should be a plan to wind the business down or insurance to refund money and pay off debts. The tricky part here is that many disability plans don't cover mental health issues (to prevent everyone from saying they're too stressed out to work). But at least someone in the shop should have been second in command, or there should have been some basic sort of steps in place. I'm no better than anyone else in terms of having a plan for what I pass on, but I'm thinking that anyone with a business running hundreds of thousands of dollars through would want to have something in place.


----------



## berzerkergang

While I appreciate the severity of mental illness and I wish him and his family the best, I think more than a facebook post is needed to prove his current situation and whereabouts, at least to those owed guitars. I am aware of his past mental history I just hope that it's not being used as an excuse for delays. 

Best of luck to all those owed money and guitars. I feel for yah. I went through a similar situation with the guy that did my granite counter tops. Paid half up front, said it would be done in a month, he got in a "skidoo accident",,, 10 months later, after threats and calls from lawyers, I got my money back.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Yeah, yeah, get well soon Bernie, blah blah blah .......... TO THE BRJ CAMP - "GET ON WITH THE REFUNDS AND WHAT IS OWED! SIMPLE!"


----------



## Khoi

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> Yeah, yeah, get well soon Bernie, blah blah blah .......... TO THE BRJ CAMP - "GET ON WITH THE REFUNDS AND WHAT IS OWED! SIMPLE!"



Thanks for your amazing insight, you're certainly offering a lot to this thread and the situation.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Still taking them to court. Someone has to start this off some how and its going to be me. I have a family too and bills to pay and hard times but Monday morning if something happens to me.... guess what... My wife takes my debt or whatever bills I have. It's just the way it is.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

Im curious if the family understands exactly how much shit is about to come their way if everyone decides enough is enough, his step daughter has been posting like the statement from her mother solves everyone's issues and they have no reason to claim money/legal action etc anymore.. 

The fact it took her 8 weeks to make a statement in insane to me, yes family is the most important thing, but this family is gonna be so fucked if they don't sort this shit out..


----------



## HeadBender

The question is if the Rico Family would accept / request help to sort out the situation. Because if they do I am pretty sure that with the contribution of Ed and with some other who are/were known to Terry could gather - and I bet there would be several members from here who would be more than glad to participate - to sort this out and to come up with some kind of "solution".

Let's face it: refunds will not happen at least not soon and not without some legal action. Shipping out unfinished guitars is also unlikely (I am certain that Bernie would never agree on that). This leads to an option which is arranging someone to finish the guitars. Obviously this is not the best option either, but possibly the one which could be somehow applied.

It is pathetic, but lets face it, seems like we need to group together, reach out for Terry and arrange some kind of solution otherwise, if we just wait, nothing is going to happen.


----------



## ridner

If he has mentally checked out and doesn't have the ability/desire to build anymore, someone needs to be appointed to handle his business. Refunds should be issued. They cannot expect people to just sit around and wait for the recovery process. The time has come for action from someone in the BRJ Camp.


----------



## eaeolian

potatohead said:


> The fact Bernie has absolutely no back-up plan for his business in case of a situation like this just shows how badly run this business is/was. People die in car accidents or heart attacks or choking on sex toys or whatever on a daily basis. To not have an action plan concerning your business for someone to take upon your demise is astronomically stupid.



It's also amazingly common. Fact is, a lot of small businesses - and that's what BRJ is - don't have this sort of plan, since they're too busy handling day-to-day operations.

I would expect there's going to be some sort of lawyering-up involved to getting any restitution (the aforementioned class-action suit? The individual amounts may be too small for anything but small claims court), and probably the destruction of BRJ Guitars as currently constituted.

Sad.


----------



## Guitarist1976

I can't believe the amount of people that are feeling bad for Bernie and his family. You people have to understand something - You paid money for a product that you didn't receive - communication has been pretty much nonexistant - his wife takes two fucking months to issue a statement and we are all going to sit back and say - best of luck to Bernie and I feel bad for him and his family? What about me and my family? I didn't take anybody's money. I didn't fail to deliver on a product. The world never gave me or my family any sympathy. Stop feeling bad for the wrong people. I must be in the fucking twilight zone - If you want to feel sorry - look in the mirror - feel sorry for yourself and your family -feel bad for Bernie's customers and the people who have been affected by you losing your money ( like your children )- there is no excuse as to why he couldn't offer refunds -he knew he was in trouble a long time ago and he didn't care - he just kept taking our money. I have no mercy for him or his family. Bernie didn't show me or my family any goddamn mercy. Whatever happens to Bernie and his family - it is all his fault , not ours. I can sum all of this up with one word - this word is the same reason why the entire world is in such a shit mess. That word is called GREED. 

FYI - I have my own business and my three family members are well versed in how to handle my business in the event of illness or death. Sorry, no excuses. Hey Zeke - please stay sane -you are one of the few who is thinking clearly!


----------



## spawnsc

^ have you been following the thread? Most of us are doing what we can with what we got to get our money back and most have contacted BBB, and other resources to put pressure on BRJ to give us our guitars or money. No offense to ZeKe but ZeKe is words with no action right now and a lot of people been in and out of here saying they are going to do a,b,c and haven't. I hope ZeKe does do what he says.


----------



## Guitarist1976

spawnsc said:


> ^ have you been following the thread? Most of us are doing what we can with what we got to get our money back and most have contacted BBB, and other resources to put pressure on BRJ to give us our guitars or money. No offense to ZeKe but ZeKe is words with no action right now and a lot of people been in and out of here saying they are going to do a,b,c and haven't. I hope ZeKe does do what he says.


 
Yes , I have. His recent facebook update ( Teresa's statement ) brought out a bunch of sympathizers. There are only a few people who are thinking clearly.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Speculum Speculorum said:


> 1. Securing a large number of build orders before securing supplies (including wood and bridges) to actually build said custom instruments
> 2. Taking deposits on new orders after establishing a backlog of at the very least 100 (!!!) instruments
> 3. Lying to people about build estimates to secure deposits for new builds (quoting 4-6 months after having a backlog of nearly 200 guitars)
> 4. Lying to customers about completion dates, requiring final payments to secure shipping, and then completely cutting off contact with the customer and in some cases never delivering the instrument.
> 5. Losing track of somewhere around 50 sets of ordered BKP humbuckers, and then installing them at random into customer's guitars in some cases using the incorrect pickups.
> 6. Numerous instances of telling people their guitars were almost finished with set-up, and then several months later telling the same people their guitars were just getting out of wood shop or that their guitar had never been started. In some cases, Bernie didn't even remember who the customer was.
> 7. Requiring additional money for complex finish options, completing guitars with incorrect finish options (which were simpler and less costly) and not refunding the customer for the additional money paid for the requested finish after agreeing to do so.
> 8. Using, knowingly, improperly or poorly cured wood for builds, resulting in warping, cracking, improper body binding, and splitting in builds (some of which were delivered)
> 9. The use of incorrect neck angles on builds, requiring questionable shimming of fretboards, and at least one case where a TOM bridge was shoddily ground down to "fix" issues with proper bridge/neck alignment (as the neck angle was originally built for a Hipshot bridge).
> 10. Improper shielding of pickup cavities and electronics cavities.
> 11. Lying to customers about personally completing final setups on instruments
> 12. Delivering guitars with flaws to construction not limited to: drilling tuner holes to incorrect width, improper binding of guitars, incorrect shaving and slotting of bone nut, incorrect sizing of nut, incorrect wiring of guitar (reverse of pickup selection).
> 13. Freaking out on customers who bring build issues to his attention
> 14. Refusing to give refunds after grossly failing to meet estimated build times on instruments (to the effect of 5x longer than estimated with no clear end to wait time).
> 15. Lying to customers about completing all finish work personally



Well, this news doesn't really surprise me, honestly. However, this list does make a lot more sense in lue of everything we're now learning. I have compassion for Bernie's family and his situation, as I've been touched on many fronts by mental illness. It's a terrible thing to have to watch someone go through, and it's a horrible thing to experience for one's self.

But at the risk of sounding like a huge dick head, this doesn't really change much in terms of people trying to finish up their business with Bernie. The problem that bloomed into a full blown break resulted from a long series of problems beginning years ago. You should get legal council, especially if you're in deep with multiple instruments on order. When someone checks into a psych ward for 2+ months, it's going to be a while before they are productive again, if ever. If you want to wait it out and see if there's light at the end of the tunnel, more power to you. But don't hate on people who just want to get out at this point.


----------



## engage757

Guitarist1976 said:


> Yes , I have. His recent facebook update ( Teresa's statement ) brought out a bunch of sympathizers. There are only a few people who are thinking clearly.



Because, some of Bernie's customers, myself included, actually realize that a human being is more important than any dollar figure. All this nonsense about approaching Theresa is cold. A little humanity would be nice, and I AM a BRJ customer, so don't even go there.

This will all get sorted out, but I would chop A BRJ guitar into PIECES if I thought it could magically help the man.

This woman is going through a lot, and she doesn't need anymore bullshit.

It's called humanity.


----------



## mountainjam

I would save the humanity until this story is confirmed true,


----------



## engage757

mountainjam said:


> I would save the humanity until this story is confirmed true,



I hear ya bro, but a statement from Theresa, on Bern's personal Facebook, confirmed by Keith Merrow, is good enough for me. Keith is a good dude, and with as fickle as the Internet is, he has a reputation to think about. I highly doubt he would confirm that statement if it wasn't true.


I just hope we can all put aside our personal issues with BRJ Guitars, and show a little grace (even if you feel it is unwarranted) and compassion towards the man and his family, or at the VERY LEAST, his wife, who must be living in a nightmare now and probably has been for some time.


----------



## Rap Hat

If this story turns out not to be true then so be it. This is the first official word we've gotten from the Rico camp, and the only thing it changes is the amount of compassion for the family. It's not going to change the fact that people are going to get back their money or guitars; in fact in my opinion it looks like legal action is going to be the solution. I'd have preferred to hear Bernie was mentally okay but physically sick, then it would fall on him. Regardless, it's a clusterfuck.


----------



## paddy

I might get lambasted for saying this but I am a major skeptic and I can't say the thought hasn't crossed my mind this is all just a ploy to get out of owing a couple hundred grand.[/QUOTE]

Same here bro. 
Unless it goes beyond claim and proof is provided.
And even then, all these people need their guitars or money back.


----------



## mountainjam

engage757 said:


> I hear ya bro, but a statement from Theresa, on Bern's personal Facebook, confirmed by Keith Merrow, is good enough for me. Keith is a good dude, and with as fickle as the Internet is, he has a reputation to think about. I highly doubt he would confirm that statement if it wasn't true.
> 
> 
> I just hope we can all put aside our personal issues with BRJ Guitars, and show a little grace (even if you feel it is unwarranted) and compassion towards the man and his family, or at the VERY LEAST, his wife, who must be living in a nightmare now and probably has been for some time.



Oh really? I must have missed the part about Keith.

I hear where you are coming from dude, but shit happens. If Bern really is in the mental hospital, his family needs to put someone in charge of the shop to get things rolling. I can't see it being a problem since Bernie didn't build the guitars anyways.

All in all, waiting months to make a statement, and then offering no help at all, seems like bs to me.


----------



## paddy

potatohead said:


> I have exactly $0 invested into anything here, but I've been following this thread for some time, and this has me pretty miffed.
> 
> The fact Bernie has absolutely no back-up plan for his business in case of a situation like this just shows how badly run this business is/was. People die in car accidents or heart attacks or choking on sex toys or whatever on a daily basis. To not have an action plan concerning your business for someone to take upon your demise is astronomically stupid.
> 
> I can appreciate Theresa's predicament, and how it must be pretty hard on her. What I can't appreciate is how she is trying to deflect the blame all onto the business and onto Bernie. Does she honestly believe she hasn't benefitted from some of this deposit money that has vanished, or is she just completely naive? It's all wrapped up in supplies and invested back into the business? None of it was ever used for a mortgage payment or a vacation or a night on the town? I don't believe that for a nanosecond.
> 
> I might get lambasted for saying this but I am a major skeptic and I can't say the thought hasn't crossed my mind this is all just a ploy to get out of owing a couple hundred grand.



I agree with you.
It's a claim (and it might be true) but none the less it's claim till there's proof.
And even then, all these people need their guitars or money back hopefully.


----------



## Guitarist1976

engage757 said:


> Because, some of Bernie's customers, myself included, actually realize that a human being is more important than any dollar figure. All this nonsense about approaching Theresa is cold. A little humanity would be nice, and I AM a BRJ customer, so don't even go there.
> 
> This will all get sorted out, but I would chop A BRJ guitar into PIECES if I thought it could magically help the man.
> 
> This woman is going through a lot, and she doesn't need anymore bullshit.
> 
> It's called humanity.


 
If you are so concerned -send the Rico family some more money to cover his medical expenses. Where is his humanity? I'm not showing compassion to someone who ripped a lot of people off. Get your head out of your ass. Hey man - I'm selling snake oil - you want to buy some?


----------



## MDP333

There are some incredibly cold, inhuman comments here. I'm sorry for those that feel their money is more important than a humans well-being.


----------



## Guitarist1976

MDP333 said:


> There are some incredibly cold, inhuman comments here. I'm sorry for those that feel their money is more important than a humans well-being.


 
Why don't you give all of your money away to charity if you are so worried about other people? Hey Mrs. Smith - I'm sorry - I know you paid me $3,000 for landscaping work and I didn't do the job. I was in a bad depression and by the way you won't get your money back. Mrs. smith - ok , no problem - feel better - depression can be a bitch. Thank you.


----------



## spawnsc

Is it human being, taking on orders you know you can not fulfill? And not giving people their updates and sticking to promises that they will have their guitars shipped in said amount of time and they still don't have the guitar? People question why so many people are enraged at the Rico family? How about you give me 3k for something promised in 4 to 8 months and never hear from me again? Would you still like me then? What if I sent you an update saying in sick and will be back to work it soon and then I completely fall off the face of the earth? So you are saying you will show me some compassion? Come on ill show BRJ when his company shows me some compassion for all the bullshit he fed to me for 3 years. I show him enough compassion and patience for my guitar. We will never see our guitars people, do you really believe they will put Bernie back in a stressful environment for him to relapse all over again? 

Either way the company is gone and we deserve our money back.


----------



## Guitarist1976

spawnsc said:


> Is it human being, taking on orders you know you can not fulfill? And not giving people their updates and sticking to promises that they will have their guitars shipped in said amount of time and they still don't have the guitar? People question why so many people are enraged at the Rico family? How about you give me 3k for something promised in 4 to 8 months and never hear from me again? Would you still like me then? What if I sent you an update saying in sick and will be back to work it soon and then I completely fall off the face of the earth? So you are saying you will show me some compassion? Come on ill show BRJ when his company shows me some compassion for all the bullshit he fed to me for 3 years. I show him enough compassion and patience for my guitar. We will never see our guitars people, do you really believe they will put Bernie back in a stressful environment for him to relapse all over again?
> 
> Either way the company is gone and we deserve our money back.


 

Thank you so much! I was beginning to think that I was in a tales from the darkside episode lol.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*Alright guys, let's all take a deep breath and keep this about the guitars and getting a resolution here. Feel free to start a "Get well soon Bernie" thread if all you're going to do is come in here and belittle those who just want what's rightfully theirs. *

*Also, next abusive rep I see is getting the giver a perma ban. For real. *


----------



## MDP333

I'm not saying you don't deserve your money back, what I'm saying is that money isn't more important than a human.


----------



## eaeolian

Guitarist1976 said:


> Why don't you give all of your money away to charity if you are so worried about other people? Hey Mrs. Smith - I'm sorry - I know you paid me $3,000 for landscaping work and I didn't do the job. I was in a bad depression and by the way you won't get your money back. Mrs. smith - ok , no problem - feel better - depression can be a bitch. Thank you.



Watch it, dude. No need to be a disrespectful ass, especially when you're new here.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*One down. Any other takers? *


----------



## killertone

Others have stated and I will concur, the FB statement does nothing to relieve my fear of never receiving my guitars. Regardless of Bernie's hospitalization we all need to continue on the path down legal means for refunds. That means contacting CC companies, banks, lawyers, consumer advocate agencies or any combination thereof. If you let your compassion create apathy towards this, I fear in the end you will receive zero. No money. No guitar(s).


----------



## RagtimeDandy

Patience seems to be the key with this situation. If you have any money invested in a guitar and you do not get a guitar, you have a lawsuit. I'm not gunna say it'll be pretty, and there's a good chance Rico's life is gunna be hell for the next few years, but in the end it'll all work out for you. If there is no update within the next few months, I'd certainly urge anyone who's lost in this situation to start putting lawsuit pressure. There's a legit issue going on - Bernie's in a mental institution. You have to be understanding of that and realize this situation won't fix itself over night. You do have a right to either get your money back or get your guitar, and anything less is fraud. But in the mean time try to realize the man had a break down and be compassionate towards the situation, but if he does not deliver in one of the two ways in a legitimate time frame, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to press charges, even if to put pressure on him to deliver. At least now there's an understanding of why everything's been messed up and delayed. You shouldn't open a business if you're that emotionally unstable, or at least don't take on so many orders that you physically and mentally can't handle it. He can't pull the mentally unstable card forever; someone will have to pay out in the end. He was incredibly irresponsible, but we're all human and we all make mistakes. That's the most important thing everyone must keep in mind throughout all of this.


----------



## Michael T

I thought this was a customers ONLY thread anyways.


----------



## Guitarist1976

eaeolian said:


> Watch it, dude. No need to be a disrespectful ass, especially when you're new here.


 


The truth hurts doesn't it? So kick me off - see if I give a shit


----------



## kmanick

Michael T said:


> I thought this was a customers ONLY thread anyways.


 
that was dropped a while back.


----------



## eaeolian

Guitarist1976 said:


> The truth hurts doesn't it? So kick me off - see if I give a shit



Well, that's always a winning approach. 

See you in a month. Anyone else dumb enough to continue to ignore mods?


----------



## Battousai

I was show ZERO compassion when I lost my job and had bills to pay and asked for a partial refund on the 7 String rico order I placed (that he didnt even start building by the way.). 
I was shut down straight away with Im Sorry All sales are Final BS and I said Fuck it ill put it on hold Cos I Absolutely Loved my Jekyll 6er so much so i thought it would be worth it when i get back to my feet to resume the order..
in the meantime i had to sell off a couple of other guitars and an amp to make up for the bills.. after asking Bernie to resume the build back in december and recieving 1 e mail in beginning of Feb that he will call me and discuss the build.. and that call was never made.. Now this Mental Health Borderline Pity scam tactic is being used and using our emotions to lay off Bernie for a while. I thought bernie had a company . and therefore had employees or is it a one man operation ? He had at least someone who handles the Website and e-mails cos he had mentioned in his emails once.
Ive contacted my Bank and now started a Dispute however it is unlikely ill get my money back apparently if the payment is older than 90 days VISA wont be able to refund. Im not in the USA so going through law/courts is probably futile. Ive been asked to show compassion. Meanwhile Im down $1500 and was given Excuses from day one. what am I supposed to do at this stage ?


----------



## Michael T

kmanick said:


> that was dropped a while back.



Well damn, that would have really helped filter some of this current mess. Oh well, thanks, I didn't get the memo, lol


----------



## canuck brian

Okay - I get the Bernie might in a very serious medical situation and I really do wish him the best and quick recovery. From what I've read, he's got some pretty serious issues that really do need to be addressed medically and immediately. I really really hope the guy comes out of this on top.

However....the people coming down on the people who've given Bernie their hard earned money are really missing a lot very valid points.

1) Problems started in September with guitars and clients. Bernie has been off the grid for 8 weeks in a hospital, not 24.
2) People have been told over 12 months ago that their guitar was "just waiting for a case". In a few cases of this, it was only told to them after they had sent their full payment.
3) people have been waiting for over 24 months on guitars that were supposed to be delivered in 2 - 3 months.

Here's some math:

Assembly, fitting, electronics, fretwork and finish should be around 20 - 25 hours per guitar.....so lets say 20 x 200 orders. Well that's 4000 hours, which comes out around 167 twenty-four hour days. Pretty sure it's not hard to deduce that this was an incredibly irresponsible business decision and this was made well before any sort of medical issue was publicly addressed.

Even if you devide that up between experienced builders, you'd need 3 or 4 guys dedicated to doing that work on a pretty non-stop basis.

Deposits were anywhere between $400 - 1000, so we'll take the median at $700.
Well that's $140,000. That's not even including the people that paid in full, so bump that to around $200,000.

So a almost quarter million dollars worth of property goes missing and isn't delivered and people are being told they're callous, cold and unfeeling? People get ripped off all the time in schemes where hundreds of people are brought in, lied to and bilked of their money. Usually in these cases, lawyers get hired, people get taken to court, sued and possibly go to jail.


----------



## dschonn

The amount of bans happening due to this thread almost equals the number of guitars not having been delivered to the customers...


----------



## eaeolian

dschonn said:


> The amount of bans happening due to this thread almost equals the number of guitars not having been delivered to the customers...



Nah, we've got a LONG way to go to get there, unfortunately.


----------



## Majkel

Sympathy aside, does this new information really change anything?

Teresa and Danielle have both made statements on Facebook to the effect that Bernie's health is paramount to them. And _of course_ it is, he's their family; the rest of you guys are "merely" customers. Understandably, to them his health is what matters most, not resolving this situation for you guys.

That leaves you in the situation that the only person with a personal stake towards you guys, the only one who would really care about resolving the situation is Bernie himself, and he's in no position to do anything about this at the moment. From the looks of things, and going by how mental disorders like these work (even if we bring it down to the level of "just" being burnt out, discounting any speculative suicidal tendencies) he's not going to be in a position to do anything about it for a long long time. Even if he got out of the ward tomorrow he would most likely not be in a position where he could do actual work. The only way to resolve such issues is to remove yourself from them - that's why people get medical certificates/orders from their doctors so they DON'T have to work until they get better, which can be years.

So Bernie can care as much as he possibly can, but he most likely won't be in a position to do anything about it, short of handing off his business (both business and production wise) to someone else, which one can suppose would already have happened if they were willing to do so. That leaves you in a position of giving up your hundreds or thousands of dollars - for free - out of sympathy, with nothing to show for it. If that's something you feel you can do then you are in a very fine position both financially and as a human being, but if not - this recent information doesn't change what was previously going on in this thread one bit. 

If you want any portion of your money back you will have to do something about getting it back, because it's not going to be forthcoming either in terms of a guitar or a refund from BRJ or the family. Lawsuits will put the family in a financial hole, but if you're not willing to go there then you are willingly giving up your money for what is essentially strangers. No different from any charity you might donate to.


----------



## SDMFVan

Unfortunately the most likely course of action for Bernie at this point is to dissolve the company and declare bankruptcy. That being the case, I think anyone who he owes money to needs to sue him sooner rather than later to ensure you'll be listed as a debt when he files Chapter 11. It may seem cold or callous but business is business.


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

Assuming that the story about the mental breakdown is true, this is just such an astronomically shitty situation for both BRJ's family and the customers that are being ignored.


----------



## AvantGuardian

SDMFVan said:


> Unfortunately the most likely course of action for Bernie at this point is to dissolve the company and declare bankruptcy. That being the case, I think anyone who he owes money to needs to sue him sooner rather than later to ensure you'll be listed as a debt when he files Chapter 11. It may seem cold or callous but business is business.



Yeah, I'm thinking maybe a Chapter 7 filing (Chapter 11 implies an eventual reorganization, I think) might be coming somewhere down the line. If Bernie's not going to get back to building any time soon and the company has no real means to finish the guitars or process refunds, he may just liquidate and dissolve. Then its up to the courts to dole out the proceeds. This is totally speculation, but it wouldn't surprise me if this is how it all ended up. Without knowing anything about the company's financials, it would be impossible to speculate on whether there are enough assets to fully refund everyone.

I think people need to remember that personal relationships and business are often best kept separate. You can feel compassion for Bernie and Terry (if their explanation is legit, I certainly do) but still pursue legal action to get your money back without making it a personal issue. Just look at the fact that a business owes you a finished product or your money back and you're going after it. That is a separate issue from any of the personal problems the business owner may be going through.

I wish Bernie and his family the best, but I hope everyone continues to pursue their legal options to recover their deposits.


----------



## engage757

I am NOT saying don't do anything to cover your bases guys. NOT SAYING THAT AT ALL. but what I am saying, is try to find a little love and compassion for him and his fam in your hearts as fellow human beings. This situation is ridiculous, I know that just as well as you guys do, but I am really going to try to show a little love.

Just a thought, I wonder if any other well-known luthiers would reach out to BRJ guitars out of the goodness of their hearts and help complete these instruments. I know I personally would take my knowledge and help set them up, do final assembly etc.


----------



## cardinal

I'll say right off that I have no involvement in this, but as has been said many times before: everyone involved should contact a lawyer quickly. Cordination (eg, multiple people hiring the same lawyer) will help save fees big time. 

I don't want to get banned, so mods can feel free to delete this, but thought I'd offer what little insight I can. This looks like a bad situation that has no good resolution. He owes you guys lots of money; I would be surprised if he didn't also owe suppliers money, too. As also was mentioned, he may not have medical insurance. I seems unlikely there's enough money to go around. This looks headed for bankruptcy, but how exactly that plays out will somewhat depend on what BJR Guitars was (a corporation? A sole proprietorship?). That will impact whether the Rico family's assets are on the line (as could the allegations of fraud). 

This will not be as simple as just showing up and taking uncompleted guitars. Even if that did happen, it could come back to actually cause trouble under certain circumstances if the "company" (whatever its legal status) enters bankruptcy. Again: this is not a simple situation and I'd suggest looking for a lawyer who has this type of experience.


----------



## Battousai

and what of the customers outside the USA what are they to do ?


----------



## Rook

If I'm not mistaken its the law in the jurisdiction in which the offence takes place, the USA. There's no reason we couldn't 'coordinate' with these guys and follow the same proceedings. I'm watching and waiting, I'll talk to chad soon too, see if he wants to do anything since he doesn't seem to be round much these days.


----------



## cardinal

^ it'll be more complicated for you just because coordinating might be more difficult, but I'd still suggest contacting a US lawyer. Im not saying this would be a "class action" thing (I honestly don't know), but getting group representation seems like a good idea. You all have the same legal problem, so whether the lawyer has one client or 15, the bulk of the substantive work is going to be the same for all of you. You'll just be able to share the costs. 

This isn't particularly helpful, but there are some not so great lawyers out there. Look for someone who has actually done something like this before.


----------



## Rev2010

All this talk about bankruptcy. For him to file for bankruptcy he would have to show that his corporation simply had no money or assets to continue on. If he collected all this money from people but didn't deliver a product then how would his business be bankrupt? In addition, correct me if I'm wrong and someone knows for sure, but a business owner that is incorporated simply can not just use all his companies monies for personal reasons, even be it for health costs - which also if he was pulling in that much cash I'm sure he'd have paid the money for insurance, if not for the sole reason to cover his family as well. That would be called embezzling no?:

Embezzling | Define Embezzling at Dictionary.com


em·bez·zle
[em-bez-uhl] Show IPA
verb (used with object), em·bez·zled, em·bez·zling.
to appropriate fraudulently to one's own use, as money or property entrusted to one's care.


Rev.


----------



## canuck brian

engage757 said:


> Just a thought, I wonder if any other well-known luthiers would reach out to BRJ guitars out of the goodness of their hearts and help complete these instruments. I know I personally would take my knowledge and help set them up, do final assembly etc.



I'm not well-known, but I'd seriously work to help him out if i lived anywhere near Hesperia. I just wanna see guys get what they're due.


----------



## kmanick

engage757 said:


> Just a thought, I wonder if any other well-known luthiers would reach out to BRJ guitars out of the goodness of their hearts and help complete these instruments. I know I personally would take my knowledge and help set them up, do final assembly etc.


I was thinking this as well. I think Neil Moser is local he does great work,
If Bernie still has any of this money he could set something up with Neil
to finsih off anything that "is almost there", as long as Neil gets paid that is.


----------



## spawnsc

Well seems I lost my claim to the $700 that the bank issued me. the bank is retracting it on April 3 due to the time frame. So angry.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

kmanick said:


> I was thinking this as well. I think Neil Moser is local he does great work,
> If Bernie still has any of this money he could set something up with Neil
> to finsih off anything that "is almost there", as long as Neil gets paid that is.



I think the last thing Neal Moser wants to do is help Bernie. They have a lot of history, not much positive.


----------



## kmanick

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think the last thing Neal Moser wants to do is help Bernie. They have a lot of history, not much positive.


well that sucks , Neil does great work.
Geez at this point who Hasn't Bernie pissed off???


----------



## mountainjam

Neil is in Arizona and not friends with the Rico family as Max mentioned.


----------



## teleofseven

i just knew that as soon as the statement by his wife would hit the headlines, so to speak, people would immediately go basicly from "fuck you bernie, gimme my money back" to "i give all my love and prayers to bernie getting better"... seriously. WHAT THE FUCK!?

bernie has a looooong history of shady moves. for all we know this all could be just another excuse. he could however be trying to get out of the mess he's gotten himself into, by appearing mentally unwell. most likely just to avoid legal issues. and angry customers demanding their money back.

(hell. it's america, he could also be hiding his ass from mobs some other crap that he might have gotten himself messed into xD)

so forget bernie, focus on getting legal advice for getting your money back. none of us seem to be lawyers here, so it's utterly pointless to keep whining about loosing your money here. it may help to take off some of that anger towards him, but it's getting you nowhere in terms of getting your money back. which, as of this point, is all you can hope for anymore. 

cause bernie rico guitars, is truly done for. no hope of getting your guitar done. turn all your effort NOW into getting your money back. do not try to contact bernie. he will not respond, nor will anybody else. seek legal counsel.

to all who can get that to their heads. good luck!


----------



## Hollowway

I just talked with a lawyer. I had a couple questions for him that I'll outline here as statements:
1) you can't get a warrant or something with a cop to go into the shop and get your guitar.
2) suing him now has no bearing on him getting out of it if he declares bankruptcy, so there's no advantage to suing now in that particular regard.
3) it's not likely that his hospital stay could delay a small claims court date, but its possible.


----------



## Dommak89

Hollowway said:


> 2) suing him now has no bearing on him getting out of it if he declares bankruptcy, so there's no advantage to suing now in that particular regard.


I might be wrong, since the European law might be different and I don't know how far you will go, but usually a small business is owner is liable with his personal assets. That being said, if a company has no cash, it has to file a petition for bankruptcy. Then the creditor with the highest claims will get a refund, just paritally, but still it's a refund. And then it goes down the ladder.

I hope that makes sense and that I explained it right. Never had to explain it English before. 

But I assume you're economic law doesn't differ that much from the European, but again, I can be wrong.


----------



## flexkill

engage757 said:


> Because, some of Bernie's customers, myself included, actually realize that a human being is more important than any dollar figure. All this nonsense about approaching Theresa is cold. A little humanity would be nice, and I AM a BRJ customer, so don't even go there.
> 
> This will all get sorted out, but I would chop A BRJ guitar into PIECES if I thought it could magically help the man.
> 
> This woman is going through a lot, and she doesn't need anymore bullshit.
> 
> It's called humanity.


Ummmm this sounds good and all, but this sounds funny coming from a guy who originally wouldn't take responsibility for a guitar he sent poorly packaged and basically told the guy to go fuck himself. Where is the "Human being is more important" slant on that one?

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/217026-need-advice-bad-deal-forum-member.html

Just saying man....


----------



## UnderTheSign

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think the last thing Neal Moser wants to do is help Bernie. They have a lot of history, not much positive.


I'm not sure what Neals relationship to Jr is but yeah... Him and Sr weren't the best of friends I believe. Also, Neal moved to Arizona a year or so ago so he isn't a local anymore.


----------



## teleofseven

Dommak89 said:


> I might be wrong, since the European law might be different and I don't know how far you will go, but usually a small business is owner is liable with his personal assets. That being said, if a company has no cash, it has to file a petition for bankruptcy. Then the creditor with the highest claims will get a refund, just paritally, but still it's a refund. And then it goes down the ladder.



most likely the money will be ripped from the assets and material the company has. but yes i think if you declare the company bankrupt then the owner doesn't have to pay. but sometimes, like in the case of my brother, the smaller and younger companies have done pretty risky moves to get a loan for the company. say, on paper, sold their own house to the company to use the house as deposit (or is guarantee the right word?) for that loan. so if the company goes bust, guess where they take back that loan. the house. (don't worry, my brothers company is doing fine, he still has his house )



Hollowway said:


> 3) it's not likely that his hospital stay could delay a small claims court date, but its possible.



did you mention that he's apparently in a closed psych ward? from what i understand, you can't pull a patient out from a place like that for legal proceedings or such. i could be wrong. 

but it's just because of that fact that he supposedly is in there, that the company is basicly, effectively, shut down, and maybe for good. 
so again, don't put your hopes on ever seeing your guitar done.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

flexkill said:


> Ummmm this sounds good and all, but this sounds funny coming from a guy who originally wouldn't take responsibility for a guitar he sent poorly packaged and basically told the guy to go fuck himself. Where is the "Human being is more important" slant on that one?
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/217026-need-advice-bad-deal-forum-member.html
> 
> Just saying man....




thats a can of worms i dont think anyone wants to be opened again.


----------



## flexkill

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> thats a can of worms i dont think anyone wants to be opened again.


You are probably right....sorry for that. Something just doesn't sit right with me is all....but again....you are right and I again apologize.


----------



## Jonathan20022

flexkill said:


> You are probably right....sorry for that. Something just doesn't sit right with me is all....but again....you are right and I again apologize.



Yeah, I recommend deleting that before this gets out of hand. 

This is really saddening, I can hope you all get what you guys paid for eventually but right now it seems pretty indefinite.


----------



## JPMike

Just saw the post, since I was out of home all day, so finally someone said something. 

I wish the best for the Rico family and all to go good. Having mental illness is really the worst thing someone can have. What's a healthy body without a healthy mind. Those 2 are linked as one.

What concerns me though is, that I have invested $12k on BRJ. What am I supposed to do now? What we the international guys can do? 

Honestly, I feel so annoyed right now.


----------



## potatohead

Lern2swim said:


> I understand the pure fucked-up-titude of this whole situation but... do you have any experience at all running a small business, especially an artisan one??? My fiance's father was a luthier (high end acoustics), he died of an aneurism a few years ago. Let me tell you, there's no plan in place for something like that. I don't know details as to how things played out with customers he was building for at the time, but it more or less financially ruined his wife, even after life insurance. I know that that's very different from the situation here, but try to be realistic about how things work. There's almost never a safety net like you're talking about with small businesses.



I've worked for one for eight years. Yes, there is. Anything else is ridiculous. It's like living your life and owning a bunch of assets and not having a will, only in that scenario only your family is screwed over, not a few hundred customers.


----------



## teleofseven

JPMike said:


> Just saw the post, since I was out of home all day, so finally someone said something.
> 
> I wish the best for the Rico family and all to go good. Having mental illness is really the worst thing someone can have. What's a healthy body without a healthy mind. Those 2 are linked as one.
> 
> What concerns me though is, that I have invested $12k on BRJ. What am I supposed to do now? What we the international guys can do?
> 
> Honestly, I feel so annoyed right now.



i get feeling sorry for the family i guess. but man 12k?!?! 

but hey, i suggest reading earlier posts. get legal advice. cause 12k is quite a serious ammount of money in this biz. especially when BRJ is basicly now done for. there's no hope of ever getting you guitars done. just try to get your money back.

and contacting bernie won't work anymore (as if it ever did) cause he's in a closed psych ward. (means no internetz, no walkie talkies, nothing.)


----------



## Hollowway

JPMike said:


> Just saw the post, since I was out of home all day, so finally someone said something.
> 
> I wish the best for the Rico family and all to go good. Having mental illness is really the worst thing someone can have. What's a healthy body without a healthy mind. Those 2 are linked as one.
> 
> What concerns me though is, that I have invested $12k on BRJ. What am I supposed to do now? What we the international guys can do?
> 
> Honestly, I feel so annoyed right now.



Yep. When I talked with the lawyer I told him there were likely about 100 of us with money between $400 and $12K. Sorry you had to be the high end in this one, dude!

So, to discuss the issue about personal assets being attached, that is definitely true for unincorporated businesses. But he is incorporated, so that means we can only get to the assets if the corp, like the guitars, equipment, etc. on the other hand, if he hasn't established enough of a separation between his person and his corp, then it could be established that he really is the corp (ie the corporate veil is pierced) and then all of his personal assets are liable. The onus of showing to the outside world that you are a corp is to make it obvious in your dealing with customers. Unless he has a fictitious name permit for the name he has on his website, cases, velvet tool bags, etc, then that's already a big no no. 
Regarding him being in the hospital, I'm not exactly sure how that would play out. If you sue a corp I'm not sure that the president needs to be the one in small claims court. It could be that someone else would go in his stead. I'm not sure, but I'm still looking into it. I think my first pass is a letter indicating that I'd like a refund or the guitar as it is now (it's been glossed, but that's it). If that gets me nowhere then I'll do the small claims thing. I'm honestly IMG to hang in there if I had any hope whatsoever that this would come to a resolution. But I've got this plus the rebuild for the full custom just in limbo, and I personally need some sort of resolution.


----------



## SpaceDock

My guitars were so close it's not even funny. His wife should let me have them with the uninstalled hardware and cases. I could finish them up in a few days at the most. 

If this ends up being a lost cause I'll be so f'ed. This is serious money for me and I could have bought a used car with that much money.


----------



## flexkill

SpaceDock said:


> My guitars were so close it's not even funny. His wife should let me have them with the uninstalled hardware and cases. I could finish them up in a few days at the most.
> 
> If this ends up being a lost cause I'll be so f'ed. This is serious money for me and I could have bought a used car with that much money.


I have a feeling that for people who are willing to let it go if BRJ/wife gives them their guitars in whatever state they are in....they should be more than happy to do so. That being said I'm sure legal shit will get all in the way of any simple solutions such as this.


I genuinely feel terrible for you folks that are caught up in this shit. I hope for the best possible outcome...and you guys deserve that.


----------



## 7stringkeke

I will fill you guys in by this weekend. As soon as I have new news on my small claims filing with BRJ I will update.


----------



## Watty

JPMike said:


> What concerns me though is, that I have invested $12k on BRJ. What am I supposed to do now? What we the international guys can do?
> 
> Honestly, I feel so annoyed right now.



$12k and you're just annoyed? 

I realize it'd be great for you to get that money back as it's no small amount, but if you can afford to drop that much on one guy with no delivery of the product in the interim, I'm thinking your lot is slightly different than the majority of the involved members. Not saying that should exclude you by any means, but you may want to take a back seat and let the "local" guys do the the proverbial leg work on the front end to see if that even goes anywhere.


----------



## SpaceDock

His wife should do the right thing and refund us before the medical bills take all of our money. If they don't fix this soon well be screwed, if we aren't already.


----------



## berzerkergang

What's the likelyhood of even getting the money you guys are owed even if you win the lawsuits? If he is broke, he is broke. I feel so bad for all you guys. I guess this is one of the realities of dealing with a small custom company. Something like this could happen to so many of the smaller companies.


----------



## Hollowway

I just talked with the lawyer again. Typically they do require the president of a corp to attend a small claims court hearing. So I'm not sure what would happen if he's not out by then.


----------



## leonardo7

SpaceDock said:


> His wife should do the right thing and refund us before the medical bills take all of our money. If they don't fix this soon well be screwed, if we aren't already.



Id assume that if you paid $400 and your guitar is sitting mostly finished in his shop, that the $400 easily went towards the woods, wood shop labor, and any parts that may have already been ordered and sitting in the shop as well. 

You guys dont seem to understand that the deposits payed probably just cover the woods purchased and labor of the wood shop. If the guitars have been started and partly made then Bernie hasn't really profited one single penny yet. 

As long as he's alive, it has to be in his best interest to finish these guitars, his profit is in the finished product, not the deposit. Think about it.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ my guitars are fully paid off and far more than 400 each, closer to 4 grand. He had me pay for them since they were so close to being done.


----------



## leonardo7

SpaceDock said:


> ^ my guitars are fully paid off and far more than 400 each, closer to 4 grand. He had me pay for them since they were so close to being done.



That definitely puts you in a different category then everyone who has only paid a deposit.


----------



## SpaceDock

I think most of the BFR guys have paid off a lot more than just deposits. I can think of several people that are over 5 grand into this and many more in the 2-5 range. There are far less with just deposits than not.


----------



## Hollowway

leonardo7 said:


> Id assume that if you paid $400 and your guitar is sitting mostly finished in his shop, that the $400 easily went towards the woods, wood shop labor, and any parts that may have already been ordered and sitting in the shop as well.
> 
> You guys dont seem to understand that the deposits payed probably just cover the woods purchased and labor of the wood shop. If the guitars have been started and partly made then Bernie hasn't really profited one single penny yet.
> 
> It has to be in his best interest (as long as he's alive) to finish these guitars, his profit is in the finished product, not the deposit. Think about it.



Yeah, I'm not wanting to pull an unfinished guitar out of his shop. But I honestly have no idea whether he'll ever go back in that shop to finish. If I knew that, I'd sit pat. But no one from his business is saying boo about it, so now I'm thinking that I'd either like the wood that it bought for myself or a refund of the money. What I don't want is to let him keep it, then his family sells off the assets of the corp and uses that money for themselves. All I want is one answer: will he build my guitar. If he won't, let me have it as is or keep it and give me a refund. If he will finish building it, fine, I'll kick back and wait. But for sure SOMETHING is going to happen to the guitars in there. If Bernie or his family or his employees aren't going to choose what to do then I will. (Reminds me of "if you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.")
Anyway, if bills are not getting paid at that shop the heat is going to start getting to those guitars. Someone needs to force the Rico family or business to make a call so that they can be salvaged. Having all that wood and completed builds thrown away does help us, it doesn't help Bernie, it doesn't help Terry, and it doesn't help any other creditors.


----------



## leonardo7

SpaceDock said:


> I think most of the BFR guys have paid off a lot more than just deposits. I can think of several people that are over 5 grand into this and many more in the 2-5 range. There are far less with just deposits than not.



Its that bad? So your saying that theres more finished BFR guitars in that shop than unfinished ones? 

Well, I do think that its wrong to state that Bernie has come out on top for anyone who has only paid a deposit. His profit is in the finished product, not the deposit.


----------



## leonardo7

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, I'm not wanting to pull an unfinished guitar out of his shop. But I honestly have no idea whether he'll ever go back in that shop to finish. If I knew that, I'd sit pat. But no one from his business is saying boo about it, so now I'm thinking that I'd either like the wood that it bought for myself or a refund of the money. What I don't want is to let him keep it, then his family sells off the assets of the corp and uses that money for themselves. All I want is one answer: will he build my guitar. If he won't, let me have it as is or keep it and give me a refund. If he will finish building it, fine, I'll kick back and wait. But for sure SOMETHING is going to happen to the guitars in there. If Bernie or his family or his employees aren't going to choose what to do then I will. (Reminds me of "if you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.")
> Anyway, if bills are not getting paid at that shop the heat is going to start getting to those guitars. Someone needs to force the Rico family or business to make a call so that they can be salvaged. Having all that wood and completed builds thrown away does help us, it doesn't help Bernie, it doesn't help Terry, and it doesn't help any other creditors.



I would assume that as long as he stays alive, its in the families best interest as well as Bernie's to finish these guitars and get him the $150,000+ in profit thats waiting for him. 

I will assume that as long as hes alive, you guys have nothing to worry about in terms of eventually getting your build. Unless of course, he is simply never released. It would be nice if she could get him to address this simple concern in one of her brief scheduled visits.

Bernie knows how much cash is in that shop. Hopefully he gets his head clear, gets released, comes up with a game plan, and gets back to business. As long as hes locked up theres no telling what will happen. 

I hear you on the heat temperature inside there. That could be a problem. I dont think his wife would feel comfortable going to the shop alone at this point, but I hope she or someone will at least go check on the place.


----------



## WickedSymphony

leonardo7 said:


> Its that bad? So your saying that theres more finished BFR guitars in that shop than unfinished ones?
> 
> Well, I do think that its wrong to state that Bernie has come out on top for anyone who has only paid a deposit. His profit is in the finished product, not the deposit.



I'm not sure how many are paid off vs deposit only, but speaking for myself I'm paid off at about $2.1k. And while not coming out on top for everyone who paid a deposit, there are probably a few builds that haven't even started so definitely on top for those ones.


----------



## SpaceDock

I talked to Hesperia PD, they said all mental stays are voluntary after 48 hours. They said we will all need to take him to court either jointly or individually, free lawyers are legally required to be available to us. If he is due in court, they will remove him from the institute for the hearings. I will need to make some calls tomorrow. 

FYI all CC, bank, and paypal refunds are far out of timeframe so this or waiting for his potential recouperation is the only option now.


----------



## leonardo7

A lawyer is the best means of accomplishing dialogue. A lawyer could possibly make a scheduled visit to where he is and go over a few things with him. Sort of converse a game plan, get a feel for where he is at. Start with no threats, just raise some concerns and get a feel.

Granted, a lawyer wants a trial or a settlement that they get a cut from. So its in their best interest to work it so that they make money. You can avoid this by paying the lawyer per visit and make it clear that there is no contingency or follow up possible. If you guys each paid like $25-50 then you could hire a damn good lawyer out of the Los Angeles area to start dialogue with him, even from inside where he is.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> I talked to Hesperia PD, they said all mental stays are voluntary after 48 hours. They said we will all need to take him to court either jointly or individually, free lawyers are legally required to be available to us. If he is due in court, they will remove him from the institute for the hearings. I will need to make some calls tomorrow.
> 
> FYI all CC, bank, and paypal refunds are far out of timeframe so this or waiting for his potential recouperation is the only option now.



Free lawyers? I don't think small claims allows lawyers and I thought free lawyers were only public defendants for felonies or something.


----------



## SpaceDock

Nope, the PD told me to consult a lawyer for how to do this. They also said if I go it alone, Bernie will have to come to my state for the court dates and could be jailed if he is a no show. 

More importantly, they said he can't cop out on this.


----------



## flexkill

Hollowway said:


> Free lawyers? I don't think small claims allows lawyers and I thought free lawyers were only public defendants for felonies or something.



A persons rite to a proper defense is a given in this country. That means in any court situation that a lawyer is applicable you have a rite as an american citizen to free representation (ie Public defender).


----------



## SpaceDock

Lawyers are allowed in small claims, but normally discouraged.


----------



## flexkill

SpaceDock said:


> Lawyers are allowed in small claims, but normally discouraged.


Also , doesn't this exceed the limits of small claims court?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ 7500 is the limit, so if I go alone then no, if we file as a group, yes.


----------



## JPMike

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, I am calling my lawyer tomorrow.

But, I am sure somehow or someway things will get better. That's what my intuition tells me, call me crazy, but I got this feeling things will be done the way they are supposed to be done. Just need to wait a bit...

Well, I am really annoyed, I don't really know how to express myself and I have really mixed feelings with the whole thing. Or even better, I don't know how I should feel about it. Cause I have talked to the guy many times, etc. Maybe cause, if all he is going through is true, have me soften a bit. He has delivered guitars in the past and I am sure he will do so again, I really don't know what to say and feel. Mental illness is a really fucked up thing and probably it's one of the things in the world that scares me the most.


----------



## flexkill

SpaceDock said:


> ^ 7500 is the limit, so if I go alone then no, if we file as a group, yes.


Good to know, I had no idea it was that high.


----------



## Danukenator

Watty said:


> $12k and you're just annoyed?



I imagine it's more of a "It's been coming for a while" type situation. If I knew slowly over the course of a couple months, I'd be pissed but not nearly as pissed as if I just got an email reading:

Dear Concerned Individual,

ur boned lulz

Sincerely,
A Sincere Man


----------



## JPMike

Danukenator said:


> I imagine it's more of a "It's been coming for a while" type situation. If I knew slowly over the course of a couple months, I'd be pissed but not nearly as pissed as if I just got an email reading:
> 
> Dear Concerned Individual,
> 
> ur boned lulz
> 
> Sincerely,
> A Sincere Man



I totally agree with you, but different people have different point of views, right?

Maybe I am used to the whole thing, I waited that long maybe I can wait even longer. I am a compassionate person by nature, I forgive easily, I like helping people (sounds weird saying that, but since this is kind of a faceless behing the computer situation, I can actually say it) and I find myself many times being a sucker (both in a good way or a bad way). 

If people get the idea of "I don't give a damn about the $12k I invested", it's not true, but there are so many other things running in my life at the same time that maybe I don't really wanna get worried a lot about this situation either. I am quite a stressful person when I take things seriously. 

Soap Opera, lol.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I´ll also talk to a lawyer in the next days. Will see what we international guys can do. I guess it won´t be easy from Europe. 

Oh man that´s all so fucked up... 

I´m a student and this was supposed to be my first custom build, so this is really serious money for me. Thankfully I haven´t paid in full yet (only deposit and BKP+shipping), regardless 1k is not something where I can say "alright, shit happens" and move on... 


If you guys are going to do some sort of jointly law suit then please post it here a few days in advance !!! I´ll most likely join in 

Nonetheless I really hope that Bernie will recover soon and everything will turn out "ok/good" for all of us.


----------



## HRC51

I think I just heard a giant flushing sound. It included my fully paid money and my almost complete guitar.

I do feel bad for the Rico family; however, I cannot excuse being lied to over the phone multiple times. He took too many orders and stalled too many times to garner sympathy.

I would love a refund. If not, please let me have the guitar and the un-assembled hardware. I can do the assembly and setup myself. No, I am not concerned with Mr. Rico objecting to someone else finishing the guitar with his name on it. Right now, I have doubts that he even did the woodwork.


----------



## Rap Hat

HRC51 said:


> Right now, I have doubts that he even did the woodwork.



Bernie has never (I believe) done the woodwork himself. It's always been a separate place, San Diego was the location named by a few people I talked to a while back. Bernie was always open about this, which is why he'd say stuff like "I had to fire the wood guy because he wasn't finishing builds" or "I just got your build in from the woodshop".

E: Though when he'd go on one of his "I do everything myself and no one else can do it so that's why I can't have your guitar done" rants he'd always fail to mention that wood and paint (and probably more) were absolutely not done by him.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Small claims paperwork completed, sent in, delivered and processed. Waiting on the court date now.


----------



## Khoi

god damn, I don't want to go this way, if I could just pick up my guitar and hardware, I'd be more than happy to send it to someone to finish it up.

Mine has been paid in full in January when it was supposed to be done, and supposedly it needed a refinish, which I haven't heard anything about since. 

The thing I'm most worried about is whether or not the guitars are even in the condition to be finished now, as it seems they've just been sitting there for so long. Who knows how much they've been warped and damage? I'm guessing a lot of them might even be at the point that they need to be rebuilt, and historically speaking, that's happened a lot in this run.

If you think you're guitar will be finished, I think you're being naively optimistic. I really don't see Bernie coming out of this soon, getting back in the shop, and finishing a guitar within the next year.

If I can get my guitar, I'd be happy. If I can get a full refund, I'd be ecstatic.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ right there with ya


----------



## killertone

I said I wanted my guitar in whatever state it was in probably 30 or 40 pages ago in the thread. Way before all of this other stuff began. I still want that. If it happened I would walk away and they would never hear from me again. One would think that the family would want that as the high levels customer dissatisfaction has to be one of the factors that led to Bernie's deteriorating mental state.

My guitars are paid in full. Profit in pocket. 

I think Bernie would send out emails for final payments when he needed cash. Sort of like his own personal ATM. It didn't really matter if he was working on your particular guitar at the time only that he needed cash.


----------



## AusTexCap

Count me in on any action that gets taken. I have filed complaints with the BBB, IC3, FTC, and California Attorney General.


----------



## pondman

I really feel for you guys and hope you get something out of this .
One thing that would worry me is that if he is paying rent on that work shop then is it still being paid ? If it isn't who knows what happens next . 
I'm not stirring thing up but would just like to see all your angles covered .

I seriously hope something good comes out of all this.


----------



## ovation22

AusTexCap said:


> Count me in on any action that gets taken. I have filed complaints with the BBB, IC3, FTC, and California Attorney General.



^ me too, all of the above.

Nothing's coming out of that shop but heart ache and empty promises.


----------



## rythmic_pulses

Does this sound like another set of companies that went down a similar route???


----------



## spawnsc

It felt real good explaining to my wife that I might have lost our money in this deal... the disappointment in her face makes me want to kick Bernie in the ass even more. I'm going to speak with a Lawyer that's employed at my work for advice. I'm also filing a complaint with my local PD.


----------



## aiur55

I do feel bad for Bernie and his family if this situation was true. However, I do want my money back and would be like to be notified of how the legal situation is sitting. I do live in Canada though so I guess I am with the international crowd on this on. If anyone knows if we can do anything please PM me.

Good luck to you all.


----------



## Locrian

I think the whole idea of "they should just let us have our incomplete guitars" is a total pipe dream, and would never happen. That's just not the way these things happen. It would be great if I could just go down there and grab my guitar that I payed a deposit on, but there's almost 0 chance something like that would happen. If you want "something" out of this, try to get a refund, because that's about the only option. 

My student, who is a judge here in California, is skeptical that I'll get even that, sadly. He says there are a number of laws in place that would protect an individual in the case of being admitted to a psychiatric center and dealing with mental illness, and protect his assets as well. He said the best that I could probably hope for would be a partial refund, and when I asked how "partial" we're talking, he said it more than likely would not be something that would satisfy me with this whole situation. Wasn't very encouraging stuff, honestly.


----------



## Rap Hat

For those of us that paid in full I'd hope the situation would be better. We own the guitars, there's no more debt to Bernie, and in some cases the guitars are supposedly complete, just waiting on cases. If those get liquidated to pay off loans or debts I'm gonna be furious. 
I feel for you guys who sent guitars back for wrong woods or whatever. You had a finished instrument and if this goes poorly it'll be used to pay off the banks.


----------



## Lirtle

fuck! mine was done. "Just needed a case"


----------



## leonardo7

Rap Hat said:


> If those get liquidated to pay off loans or debts I'm gonna be furious.



Oh man, could you imagine! The company dissolves and everything gets liquidated to a third party who legally buys everything then you see your finished guitar that you paid in full sell on ebay and there's nothing you can do! 

Unlikely, but Damn!


----------



## mikernaut

Well my "redo" guitar looked to be painted and ready for assembly so I sent him a case and BKP's to install back in December. So bare minimum I should get the case and Pups back if the guitar is never finished, sigh.


----------



## watson503

Locrian said:


> .
> 
> My student, who is a judge here in California, is skeptical that I'll get even that, sadly. He says there are a number of laws in place that would protect an individual in the case of being admitted to a psychiatric center and dealing with mental illness, and protect his assets as well. He said the best that I could probably hope for would be a partial refund, and when I asked how "partial" we're talking, he said it more than likely would not be something that would satisfy me with this whole situation. Wasn't very encouraging stuff, honestly.



I wonder if him being placed in a psychiatric center then wasn't just part of the plan to screw everybody over. Whatever the case may be, just reading about how this all went down really pisses me off, to rip good people off like this - especially as bad as things are right now - that is pretty god damn low.


----------



## Hollowway

Being put in the psych ward will not nullify any claims people have against him for things that occurred before. If you just paid the guy, then found out he went in, then maybe the court would give him the benefit of the doubt. But not for guitars that are 2 years overdue. I think there would be enough evidence to suggest that his being in the hospital is just a coincidence.
The issue of liquidating his assets to pay off loans only occurs for business loans, as he would be unlikely to declare personal bankruptcy if its just the business that is hurting. And we also don't know if there are any loans in the name of the business. At any rate, I personally would not recommend people throw in the towel because they're assuming they can't get their money back. Doing nothing is the only way to guarantee failure.


----------



## paddy

watson503 said:


> I wonder if him being placed in a psychiatric center then wasn't just part of the plan to screw everybody over. Whatever the case may be, just reading about how this all went down really pisses me off, to rip good people off like this - especially as bad as things are right now - that is pretty god damn low.



True.
You people with outstanding guitars and stuff need to "*be sure*" that he's "*really ill*".


----------



## leonardo7

This just in:

Bernie Rico Jr has officially stopped taking orders. You can buy mine for 10K


----------



## AndyLunt

I'm curious as to how many people there are outside of this forum and facebook who have an order with BRJ, and just have absolutely no idea as to what's going on as they rely solely on either having phone contact with Bernie, or emailing him/use his website etc. Totally left in the dark! =\


----------



## SpaceDock

He had to have 200+ orders and 100 in final assembly. The pictures of his shop show that much for sure.


----------



## leonardo7

He personally told me in Oct '11 when I was there that he had around 300 guitars in his shop. I saw around that many for sure. 




AndyLunt said:


> I'm curious as to how many people there are outside of this forum and facebook who have an order with BRJ, and just have absolutely no idea as to what's going on as they rely solely on either having phone contact with Bernie, or emailing him/use his website etc. Totally left in the dark! =\



Also remember that Bernie got permanently banned from here just a few months into the run. If he wouldn't have been perma banned then he may have popped up once in a while along the way to inform us all. Or not. Just sayin


----------



## DDDorian

leonardo7 said:


> On another note, remember that Bernie got banned from here. If he wouldn't have been perma banned then he may have popped up once in a while along the way to inform us all. Or not. Just sayin



Bernie wasn't permabanned, his absence is entirely self-imposed.


----------



## leonardo7

DDDorian said:


> Bernie wasn't permabanned, his absence is entirely self-imposed.



I remember he threw a fit and posted that he was never coming onto this site again. Then he got banned for the things he said. But that doesn't matter. Its irrelevant to whats going on right now. I shouldn't have even mentioned it.


----------



## MetalThrasher

I really hate following this thread anymore. I wish we could get an answer in the next few weeks about what's going on. I'm not sure how many people paid in full but I'm one of them. Regardless, as a paying customer we should at least get some news as to what's happening to our guitars and or refunds.


----------



## Khoi

Just got a reply from BBB


"We have closed our file and we appreciate your using Business Consumer Alliance. This complaint will remain in our file on this company and will be a part of the report we issue to the public. 

If we can assist you in the future, please contact us. 

Thank you."



And the response:


*Company's Final Response - Posted 03/27/2013*
"To all of Bernie's customer's, we first want to express our gratefulness for your support regarding Bernie Rico Jr. guitars. We first want to apologize for the lack of communication during the past several months and CERTAINLY understand your concerns and frustrations. These past several months have been extremely difficult times for the Rico family regarding Bernie's health issues. We seem to take our "well being" for granted, and when suddenly faced with a challenge, are not prepared for the burden it creates. It was never our intention to keep you, the customer, out of the loop in regards to Bernie's status and the status of your order(s), and in retrospect, wish we could have handled the situation differently. However, with the challenges that we, the Rico family, faced during the past several months, our primary focus was for Bernie to simply recover, so that he could come back to his family. Bernie's intentions are to resume working soon, so that he can finish your orders that you have waited so patiently for. We will keep you posted on when Bernie will be back in the shop. He is getting better every day and we are hopeful he will be back with his family soon."


----------



## spawnsc

I was coming to post the same thing ^ got kinda pissed that BBB closed my case...


----------



## Ben.Last

Yeah, there's no legal council allowed IN small claims, but I believe CA provides free legal council to go over the process and such. 

As for where that goes: it's hard to say, assuming the company ends up getting liquidated, filing claims earlier rather than later MAY actually matter. As has been stated, who knows if he owes money to suppliers, creditors, etc. that are going to come calling with lawyers of their own. 

I'm also not sure exactly how an unfinished product would be handled in a liquidation process. I don't know if it would get matched up to the customer that had originally purchased it (in full or part) or not. So, there's the potential for whatever finances the company has to get drained before everyone gets a refund. Then... what? You have someone that a court has declared owes you money that they don't have in the first place, and you're pretty much where you're all at now anyway.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Khoi said:


> *Company's Final Response - Posted 03/27/2013*
> "To all of Bernie's customer's, we first want to express our gratefulness for your support regarding Bernie Rico Jr. guitars. We first want to apologize for the lack of communication during the past several months and CERTAINLY understand your concerns and frustrations. These past several months have been extremely difficult times for the Rico family regarding Bernie's health issues. We seem to take our "well being" for granted, and when suddenly faced with a challenge, are not prepared for the burden it creates. It was never our intention to keep you, the customer, out of the loop in regards to Bernie's status and the status of your order(s), and in retrospect, wish we could have handled the situation differently. However, with the challenges that we, the Rico family, faced during the past several months, our primary focus was for Bernie to simply recover, so that he could come back to his family. Bernie's intentions are to resume working soon, so that he can finish your orders that you have waited so patiently for. We will keep you posted on when Bernie will be back in the shop. He is getting better every day and we are hopeful he will be back with his family soon."



Read: Dear Customers,


----------



## Ben.Last

That sounds like an utterly horrible idea.


----------



## killertone

Khoi said:


> Just got a reply from BBB
> 
> 
> "We have closed our file and we appreciate your using Business Consumer Alliance. This complaint will remain in our file on this company and will be a part of the report we issue to the public.
> 
> If we can assist you in the future, please contact us.
> 
> Thank you."
> 
> 
> 
> And the response:
> 
> 
> *Company's Final Response - Posted 03/27/2013*
> "To all of Bernie's customer's, we first want to express our gratefulness for your support regarding Bernie Rico Jr. guitars. We first want to apologize for the lack of communication during the past several months and CERTAINLY understand your concerns and frustrations. These past several months have been extremely difficult times for the Rico family regarding Bernie's health issues. We seem to take our "well being" for granted, and when suddenly faced with a challenge, are not prepared for the burden it creates. It was never our intention to keep you, the customer, out of the loop in regards to Bernie's status and the status of your order(s), and in retrospect, wish we could have handled the situation differently. However, with the challenges that we, the Rico family, faced during the past several months, our primary focus was for Bernie to simply recover, so that he could come back to his family. Bernie's intentions are to resume working soon, so that he can finish your orders that you have waited so patiently for. We will keep you posted on when Bernie will be back in the shop. He is getting better every day and we are hopeful he will be back with his family soon."



That was the response that BRJG sent to the BBB?


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, that sounds like the response. Which, honestly, is good news. I think we've pretty well established that the odds of us actually getting money aren't that great. So the likely best scenario is that he gets back to work and bangs these out. It's possible that what they're saying here is fluff, but that would only strengthen any of our cases if he did try to scoot out of the responsibility. The best case scenario for HIM and his family is also to get back into that shop and finish these orders. I'm not sure what you do as a 3rd generation luthier if you leave 300 customers high and dry and declare bankruptcy, but I doubt Bernie wants to go get a regular job like the rest of us. Color me naive, but I'm more optimistic now than I was yesterday.


----------



## berzerkergang

I will keep this short. I have a friend that until the speech from Bernie's wife had heard nothing about his guitar since he paid the deposit. His words were basically that there's a load of violins being played for Bernie right now but there's been absolutely no business related information relayed to the customers with money tied up in this. If his wife wants him to get better, she better work with him quickly to figure out a plan because he certainly isn't going to get better mentally with a couple hundred lawsuits on his back.


----------



## tabqwerty

So... when are visiting hours?


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, that sounds like the response. Which, honestly, is good news. I think we've pretty well established that the odds of us actually getting money aren't that great. So the likely best scenario is that he gets back to work and bangs these out. It's possible that what they're saying here is fluff, but that would only strengthen any of our cases if he did try to scoot out of the responsibility. The best case scenario for HIM and his family is also to get back into that shop and finish these orders. I'm not sure what you do as a 3rd generation luthier if you leave 300 customers high and dry and declare bankruptcy, but I doubt Bernie wants to go get a regular job like the rest of us. Color me naive, but I'm more optimistic now than I was yesterday.



I won't lie to you that the same thoughts float in my head. If you read my previous posts I believe you will get the same vibe. I feel that somehow things will get better and guitars will start getting delivered. Maybe not as soon as we want, but they will be coming.




tabqwerty said:


> So... when are visiting hours?



Haha, this made me laugh!!


----------



## HeadBender

JPMike said:


> I won't lie to you that the same thoughts float in my head. If you read my previous posts I believe you will get the same vibe. I feel that somehow things will get better and guitars will start getting delivered. Maybe not as soon as we want, but they will be coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, this made me laugh!!



I wonder if after getting back to "business" will he take up new orders....if so that will be a disaster.

Obviously it would be a source of funds, but if he takes up more orders, geez it will collapse.


----------



## ovation22

Hollowway, if you think the odds of us actually getting money aren't that great, I'm sorry to say the odds of anyone getting a guitar out of that shop are slim to none.

But I admire your optimism.


----------



## jbard

I'd at least like to get my BKPs back. =\


----------



## Rap Hat

In the end I definitely want a guitar more than money, but even if Bernie gets back to work I'm still terrified of a deluge of issues. I'm not entirely sure how this is going to happen either, because unless Bernie has a large cash reserve or can get loans he's not going to be able to pay the wood shop and paint guys. I'd hate to see him take in a bunch of new orders for cash... Still gonna pursue a legal avenue though, not giving up yet!


I was just looking back at some ancient records of mine, and the psych hospital I stayed at was a bit over $2,000 a day. I was there for 2 months. So around $120,000 (it was actually a bit more because there was an intake fee, meds, food, etc.) In my case insurance covered some of it, but it was still an absolutely crazy amount of money considering I was 15 at the time. The price has gone up since then too.


----------



## SpaceDock

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, that sounds like the response. Which, honestly, is good news. I think we've pretty well established that the odds of us actually getting money aren't that great. So the likely best scenario is that he gets back to work and bangs these out. It's possible that what they're saying here is fluff, but that would only strengthen any of our cases if he did try to scoot out of the responsibility. The best case scenario for HIM and his family is also to get back into that shop and finish these orders. I'm not sure what you do as a 3rd generation luthier if you leave 300 customers high and dry and declare bankruptcy, but I doubt Bernie wants to go get a regular job like the rest of us. Color me naive, but I'm more optimistic now than I was yesterday.


 

This, I dont think we would get much out of him through the courts, so late is better than never.


----------



## Diggi

Terry and I exchanged messages this morning. She said: 

"I spoke with Bernie last night, he seemed to be very positive and motivated to get back to work!!"

I believe her assessment of Bernie and his motivation at the moment. I do so because I developed a relationship with Bernie after Keith introduced us and we began working on a build together. Like many of you, my conversations with him were always more than 2 words, and his desire to do things the way he'd been taught seemed to always be at the forefront of his mind. Bernie and I talked about more than guitars, and became friends as a result. 

I can't say I know Bernie like his family does, or even as well (as deep) as his other friends, but I believe in my impression of him and that impression has always been good, honest and truthful. 

The way his departure was handled and communicated was an abomination in my eyes however. It wasn't done correctly, or with much thought about how his customers would handle (not just his lack of communication but,) the fallout of all the posts, possible lawsuits and anger that were justified as a result. The Rico family&#8217;s decision not to talk to the BRJ customers was abjectly unconscionable. We deserved then, and deserve now - the best and most frequent updates on when guitars will be completed, and I have communicated this to Terry many times, and in as many convincing ways I can muster. In the end, I think no one in Bernie's family knew just how serious this could get and had no idea how many guitars were left unfinished. I'll bet he made a conscious decision not to involve his Wife and daughter because he knew that it would be devastating for them to handle. BUT, he SHOULD have given the reigns of that big, overwhelming and hard to handle horse to SOMEONE that COULD, someone that would communicate with his customers and the public about his situation. 

Looking back in these pages, I see what I think is my guitar, almost finished and needing hardware. I "think" it is the red Jekyll pictured with two other guitars several pages back. I'm not positive though. I started a build/ progress thread about it some time ago on SS.org but changed hosting and the pic url's disappeared. I thought it pointless at that time to repost them as all the trouble had started by that time. 

One other thing; Paul Ortiz and I are friends. After the debacle with that white Jekyll Bernie sent him, Paul sent it to me. It needed some serious repairs and those repairs were done by a very competent local Luthier. The guitar eventually made it to Todd (other guitarist in my little band) and he had more work done to it which included an insane graphical upgrade. Once the repairs were made, it played so much better. Todd replaced the stock pups with Lundgren 8's and it now sounds massive. We used that guitar exclusively on our new record (in mix process now with Daniel Bergstrand)

Any way, 

I just wanted to pop on here and give my assessment of the future (and my past) with BRJ. I think Bernie will be back to work soon, and we'll start to see guitars moving out the door, in better finished condition that some that people received while Bernie was battling his mental health problems. 

Caveat: All of my opinions come from an amalgamation of conversations I've had with Bernie, and the conversations I've had with Terry over the past many months. 

Joel


----------



## berzerkergang

By the time Bernie is back to work, in my opinion he only has one option. Satisfy all outstanding orders and then close the company. If he doesn't have the money to finish the guitars, take out a loan or something along those lines to get them finished. He has loads of skill so after all this he could easily get a job with one of the many reputable guitar manufacturing giants. Any company would be better off having his experience. Maybe on the design side of things or what not, perhaps doing custom shop stuff who knows. Just something where he's not doing it all on his own.

Get well, finish guitars, close company, move on with life. That is the best option and in my opinion the only option for Bernie Rico at this time. If he was to take even ONE new order after this, he should be blacklisted across the board.


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

I don't necessarily think he should close his company. Obviously, and without a question, his company's name is dirtier than mud at the moment. But, I think that after a few _years_ that he can regain the prestige that he once had. If he hires someone (ANYONE) to handle the customer communication and takes on less orders, then it is realistic that he will eventually gain his name back.


----------



## Tesla

At the very least he should make the run of backorders he currently has into a special 'limited edition' run and give it a fancy name and/or logo. That way the guitars would hold a special value to any of the customers wishing to sell them on in future. 

I'm sure they will already have an infamous stigma about them, but to be able to officially prove it would be a good factor. And a nice gesture to the clients that are waiting so damn long.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Small claims accepted. Got my court date...


----------



## Diggi

Tesla said:


> At the very least he should make the run of backorders he currently has into a special 'limited edition' run and give it a fancy name and/or logo. That way the guitars would hold a special value to any of the customers wishing to sell them on in future.
> 
> I'm sure they will already have an infamous stigma about them, but to be able to officially prove it would be a good factor. And a nice gesture to the clients that are waiting so damn long.



^^ That's a GREAT idea.


----------



## Rev2010

Diggi said:


> ^^ That's a GREAT idea.



Actually, I think the opposite - that it would be a terrible idea. People would want guitars with the logo "pre-problem" time. Anyone knowing what has happened with this whole fiasco will think, if he actually does ever catch up and finish these guitars, that they are of inferior build quality. Not saying they actually would be but people will no doubt _think_ that. Then there's the issue of guitars that might be so close to done or actually done that couldn't be altered. 


Rev.


----------



## Diggi

Rev2010 said:


> Actually, I think the opposite - that it would be a terrible idea. People would want guitars with the logo "pre-problem" time. Anyone knowing what has happened with this whole fiasco will think, if he actually does ever catch up and finish these guitars, that they are of inferior build quality. Not saying they actually would be but people will no doubt _think_ that. Then there's the issue of guitars that might be so close to done or actually done that couldn't be altered.
> 
> 
> Rev.



^^ If that's how it was approached and presumed/ marketed, I too think it would be a bad idea. 

But 20 years from now, when (hopefully) Bernie is making guitars the way he USED to (flawless), then that monicker, identifier of the period in which these back-ordered guitars were built, might have some positive memories and perceived value. But no one knows at this point..... he could be in jail or dead by the time all of the proposed lawsuits or other actions against him are finished.

Admittedly, now that you mentioned your objection to the idea, I must think more on it.


----------



## JPMike

Getting new orders after he's back to business is not an option for sure. 

We all keep making assumptions of what's happening and what's going on, etc. We don't really know how serious or not it's the situation regarding his mental illness. And no offense to anyone, but being a little optimistic, a bit forgiving and more compassionate won't hurt. I just want to think for the best and get results out of this. Maybe when he's back he will be making even better guitars than he did. What I really want is Bernie actually hire the right people for this and make it go smooth. I might sound a bit harsh, but this is his last chance not to fuck up and actually deliver. This should be a lesson for him not to go through the same mistakes.

What Joel informed us about Terry's communication with Bernie, is really encouraging and actually gave me even more hope.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Diggi said:


> Admittedly, now that you mentioned your objection to the idea, I must think more on it.



Rev's post was my first thought when I read it as well. Not to mention people could also associate it with the whole BFR deal and the lower prices the guitars went for, driving the overall value downward even more.


----------



## blanco

Has anyone actually made a list of when people put their deposits down to get a better idea of how many people, on this forum, haven't had their instrument and the earliest date when it started? 
I know people are saying 200+ builds but if people are going down the legal route it would be more helpful having an sort of legitimate list rather than rough guesses and the dates will help show that its not a recent occurrence.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, I am pretty sure that the list of guys who got their guitars is somewhere around 10-15 people, at best. And the Black Friday run started in September of 2011. So come this autumn, it will be 3 years of no guitars after being promised 4 months. Oh and don't forget that the cap was supposed to be somewhere around what... was it 15 or 35 guitars? Isn't that what people were told?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, I am pretty sure that the list of guys who got their guitars is somewhere around 10-15 people, at best. And the Black Friday run started in September of 2011. So come this autumn, it will be 3 years of no guitars after being promised 4 months. Oh and don't forget that the cap was supposed to be somewhere around what... was it 15 or 35 guitars? Isn't that what people were told?



Yes it was around 15 guitars and he did a second sale for like 5-10 more guitars in December, but if I remember correctly after he decided to take more orders he let everyone know that the wait would be longer for all the additional guitars. Of course when I bought my spot off someone else he told me 7-9 months, and it's been nearly 2 years.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

WickedSymphony said:


> Yes it was around 15 guitars and he did a second sale for like 5-10 more guitars in December, but if I remember correctly after he decided to take more orders he let everyone know that the wait would be longer for all the additional guitars. Of course when I bought my spot off someone else he told me 7-9 months, and it's been nearly 2 years.



But that's part of what is so rotten about all this shit. People bought in because it was a really great deal, and then later he informed them that he took more orders and that build times would be longer.

If people really follow the bread crumbs throughout this drama, they'll see one lie after another. Delays, fabrication, outright lying to people... I feel bad that Bernie is now apparently mentally ill, but we're kidding ourselves if we actually believe that things are just going to be hunky dory if he ever gets out of institutionalization. I say that unless you have no other option than to wait, you should be hauling ass to get your money back and get out. Past behavior is the best indicator of future behavior.


----------



## Rap Hat

The spot that I got was either the very end of the first batch or the very beginning of when he did the additional 5-10. The guy I got it from had been waiting almost a year before he sold it to me, and I've been waiting over a year myself.

That was part of the reason I jumped on it, because it was one of the first spots and I stupidly assumed it would be a FIFO setup. Didn't go for spec changes, just wanted it quickly. It was nearly done when I got it, had already had the oil applied and was waiting for the hardware to be installed. 
And that blows my mind. Here's a guitar that could literally be finished in a day and be one less headache for Bernie. But instead it sits completely untouched minus the one day a year ago where Bernie takes a picture of it for me.


----------



## clubshred

blanco said:


> Has anyone actually made a list of when people put their deposits down to get a better idea of how many people, on this forum, haven't had their instrument and the earliest date when it started?
> I know people are saying 200+ builds but if people are going down the legal route it would be more helpful having an sort of legitimate list rather than rough guesses and the dates will help show that its not a recent occurrence.



I have a short list from the very first orders taken on Black Friday 2010. PM me for details.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> But that's part of what is so rotten about all this shit. People bought in because it was a really great deal, and then later he informed them that he took more orders and that build times would be longer.



I could be wrong, but as I remember it he let all the additional orders know that the wait for theirs would be longer when he started to take them. I don't know if he meant to say the original set would take longer too, and I don't remember if he gave an actual time quote for the additional instruments. I also don't know how many orders he took before he said they would take longer, and what times he told all those additional people that ordered before that. Just that at some point he did say that the guitars would take longer.

Not that I'm defending him or anything, as I purchased my spot from someone nearly a year after and the time I was told was still way off the mark so it's still nuts.



Rap Hat said:


> Here's a guitar that could literally be finished in a day and be one less headache for Bernie. But instead it sits completely untouched minus the one day a year ago where Bernie takes a picture of it for me.



That's what I don't get either. My guitar, last I saw it, just needed to be buffed and have the hardware installed. How long could that possibly take to finish? And I'm sure there are many guitars like ours that could be done in a few days and be out the door.


----------



## spawnsc

7stringkeke said:


> Small claims accepted. Got my court date...



hope it all works out


----------



## JPMike

At least your guitars had no flaws, my 2 builds had neck issues and had to be rebuilt. Yay!


----------



## peet

There's so much of this to read and I just can't/won't take the time to do so. I just thought I would post and tell my BRJ story.

I ordered a left handed bolt-on Jekyll 7 just before the black Friday sale. Was quoted 3-4 months build time. I paid in full right away...after 9 months of waiting and struggling with communication with Bernie, I received my guitar. It was less than perfect.

Issues are as follows,

1. I asked for offset dot inlays and they were straight down the middle (this was an issue I waived since I was tired of waiting) 
2. Body of the guitar was supposed to be tongue oiled except for the spalted top. The whole body was clear coated.
3. The pickups were wired wrong and I had to contact Bernie for a step by step as to how to solder it myself.
4. The nut was poorly glued and after a few weeks it popped off from string tension.
5. The nut was also poorly carved and the high E string kept popping off the nut.

I contacted Bernie with the list of problems and he quickly responded by phone and promised me a top priority rebuild. I agreed and ordered a set of Bareknuckle Warpigs and had them shipped to his shop for the rebuild. Time and time again I would wait, get impatient and call him out. Bernie would eventually respond to me and "calm me down". 2 years passed and he finally admitted that he botched the rebuild and had to start a new one. I asked for my pickups to be sent to me just to be done with it. He then persuaded me with a promise of a neck through at no extra charge. I foolishly agreed... that was the last time I spoke with him which was late November/early December 2012.

Now the whole story of his illness has been made public. He told me that he had been in and out of the hospital over these few years but I never pressed him for anymore information. In hind sight I should have demanded my pickups and not fallen for the BS again and again. 

I know my dealings with Bernie aren't as bad as some of you who haven't received anything at all. This has gotten WAY out of hand...to say the least. I really do hope Bernie pulls through, I really do. But I REALLY hope we get what we paid and waited so foolishly patient for.

Cheers,
~P


----------



## mikernaut

sorry to hear your story peet, it seems way to common:mad.


----------



## ovation22

Most elaborate April fools prank ever.


----------



## HaloHat

Just wondering...

With the number of you in this situation you could hire the best forensic financial investigator in the country. Where is all the money. If it was being spent on his "medical issues" or otherwise that could be evidence of wrong doing.

Who owns the building where all these partly build guitars are? If you paid in full or sent him parts you paid for, your property is in that building. The building has an owner of public record who is either still getting his rent from BRJ [doubtful eh?] or the building owner is going to seize the contents of the building to pay for back rent... which brings up another interesting situation. If BRJ IS behind on the rent with the building owner, what stories did he get from BRJ? I am a real estate investor and was a licensed real estate broker for 10 years. Unless the building owner is one of the worst property owners [commercial] ever he goes by a time line. What I am saying is if all your guitars and parts you sent BRJ are not seized already they will be soon if BRJ is behind on his rent.

I admire your patience guys. I love music and guitars too. But you who keep waiting to take action and hoping are being very naive. Better try and get what you can out of that building if it is still in there because the money is likely long gone boys. But a pro financial investigator might help you to find when this really started and if it bought any assets you can seize. Sorry.

btw - I actually read through every single one of these posts over the course of the last month. One in particular caught my eye from a real estate stand point. I don't remember what page it is on but the key words are - "I went by the building and the windows were all blacked out. BJR or someone said it was to keep the woods from wapring etc" something along those lines was said in a past post by someone. Well guys, blacked out windows on a commercial property is a very bad sign for the hopes anything is still inside that building. It is usually a sign that the tenant who is behind on their rent has been locked out. Again, sorry. Next time someone speaks with the family you might ask, and document or even ask if you can record the conversation, if someone in the BJR family who is not er, cough, sick if they have access to the building or if BJR is behind or even evicted/locked out. Get a feel good story - ask for the property managers ph number and state you only wish to verify BJR is not locked out or evicted. If they give you the nubmer, try to reason with the building owner/corp. for the guitars and parts. If they do not give you the ph number look up the owner yourself. The buildings owner is public record, a person or corporation with a phone number and address. Guitars and parts all gone? Who took them? The building owner or BJR? that is very important to know.

Lastly, and unless someone has a friend in BJR's phone carrier's company who is willing to do something they should not [i.e. don't ask your friend to risk their job or worse over this] an attorney or law enforcement person will have to do this - phone records can be subponaed. Follow BJR's phone calls and you will likely know everything you need to know about this whole mess. To the person who got their small claims court date - BJR will either be a no show and you get a judgement worth the paper it is written on or BJR hires an attorney to move your case out of small claims, yep, can and does happen all day every day. Then you need to get an attorney too $$$ they hope you won't. If you do they will offer to settle most likely for less than what you are out now. BJR, through his many stall tactics has now had time enough to move assets to others and get all kinds of ducks in a row for when and if you guys ever really go after him with some horsepower.


----------



## spawnsc

some good points and good advice ^


----------



## ovation22

Not really interested in throwing good money after bad.

Unless there's a way for me to get my money back with little or no effort (additional money) then I'm just counting it gone. The BBB didn't help. The CA AG didn't help. The FTC didn't help.

As for anything coming out of that place? Fat chance. When Bernie _was_ there he couldn't keep the necks from warping and fingerboards from cracking. What's the state of things with no one there? And to those that sent him pickups, yours were likely installed in another random customer's guitar and sent out months ago. The man couldn't keep anything straight. It took him a year and a half to admit to me that he lost my paperwork.


----------



## Diggi

2 things:

- I'd like to throw in $50 to hire a person to investigate this further - as HaloHat suggested.
- can we get a count of the guitars we're all waiting on? 

* I'm waiting on 1. Deposit given and pickups sent to Bernie.

I know we'll just scratch the surface as to how many folks who are watching and commenting on this thread have already paid and have guitars in various stages of completion, but it might give us an idea of what kind of resources we can raise to hire someone to look further into this mess.

I'm sure there's a better way to determine this, but it's a start.


----------



## kruneh

-I´d throw in $50 for whatever you guys deciede to do.
-I don´t have a guitar on order.


----------



## xwestonx

1st time poster, long time lurker... 
I'd chip in for sure. 
1 guitar fully paid for under the "March madness" deal he was running... Wouldn't be surprised if that beautiful looking guitar I bought was really someone else's... 

Last I heard from Bernie was late November. Communication pretty much stopped after I paid in the full balance, which I paid when the guitar supposedly only needed pickups and hardware...


----------



## berzerkergang

Has anyone asked for proof that Bernie is in a mental facility? I know that the two times a friend of mine checked himself in there was all sorts of paperwork to prove it to his boss, the bank etc. I would think that at this point some proof of his whereabouts should be given to those owed guitars. They can blank out the name of he hospital or whatever but after all this nonsense, it should be offered up. 

And in regards to what the guy said above, people could look up who owns the building and see what can be wiggled out of them however if the landlord is as pissed off and fed up as all of you, I wouldnt expect to be getting any merchandise out of the building, plus who's to say that if this person did let someone in they wouldnt take a nicer guitar than owed or lie and say there's two guitars owed etc, I really really dont see that happening at all because there's no proof that you own any specific instrument in the building apart from an email ordering it. Who's to say there isnt someone that ordered the same thing before you did and the other guys got done before yours got started. All in all, bad plan on that front.


----------



## JPMike

4 guitars.


----------



## paddy

berzerkergang said:


> Has anyone asked for proof that Bernie is in a mental facility? I know that the two times a friend of mine checked himself in there was all sorts of paperwork to prove it to his boss, the bank etc. I would think that at this point some proof of his whereabouts should be given to those owed guitars. They can blank out the name of he hospital or whatever but after all this nonsense, it should be offered up.



Yep, I've wondered the same thing as well. After all the BS he's given throughout time, what makes any one believe that this time he's telling the truth (I'm seeing some people believing the story so readily)?? 
Maybe it's just a convenient excuse just to buy more time and grind people into submission.


----------



## aiur55

1 guitar.

Yea, proof about this would be good. Even if we get proof, he could be doing this just to escape some of the flak he caught. You can't be too cautious nowadays with trusting people.


----------



## HaloHat

berzerkergang said:


> And in regards to what the guy said above, people could look up who owns the building and see what can be wiggled out of them however if the landlord is as pissed off and fed up as all of you, I wouldnt expect to be getting any merchandise out of the building, plus who's to say that if this person did let someone in they wouldnt take a nicer guitar than owed or lie and say there's two guitars owed etc, I really really dont see that happening at all because there's no proof that you own any specific instrument in the building apart from an email ordering it. Who's to say there isnt someone that ordered the same thing before you did and the other guys got done before yours got started. All in all, bad plan on that front.



I never said one person go to the landlord and try to get in. Obviously that would not work for the reasons you mention and more.

I said you guys need to contact the building owner or property manager. Is BJR is in fact behind on the rent? And since he apparently has no more employees, is not making guitars and sending them out at any rate per day, has had a family member tell you he is in a medical facility among all the other excuses it seems to me he probably is not paying the building owner to "store" your guitars until he is "feeling better". What have you guys estimated he took in? $200K+ or more? Who knows, maybe he is paying the building owner to store your guitars and the blacked out windows are something exclusive to the BJR magic?

This has been going on how long since anyone actually saw BJR in his shop? With employees? Isn't when the employees left the time the guitars slowed to a stop almost shipping wise and the quality declined? 

Things have been at a stop for so long I can't imagine he has been paying the rent. And if he hasn't, he either is smart enough to have removed his "assets" a.k.a. "your guitars" and any equipment he actually owned or was renting before he entered a medical facility OR he left it all in the building thinking things would somehow be ok. But they don't seem to be for anyone.

I feel for the people still hoping. Also, it is just the principle. I think you guys need to get together, if you care to, and do some legwork or pay someone professional to do it. For a good investigator finding out if your guitars are in the building owners possession or BJR's should be a one or two day deal billing hours wise. Worth it to you? I dunno and some have already said it is not worth it to them they have written it off as a loss. Maybe you could write it off as a bad loan on taxes [ask a tax pro] since you gave but never received.

But if you DO want to know I think you will have more success as an organized group rather then individuals. Chip in for a known forum member, no, a couple or more persons able to drive by BJR's shop and take pictures and post them here. Knock on some doors around the shop and ask nicely. Do not display anger at BJR to others. Be sincerely grateful for any information. Same time, write a letter to the building owner or property manager AS A GROUP. State your numbers [how many of you have been affected], give them as many contact avenues to as many of you as you can. Do not make threats or display hostility to them. They will read between the lines of your asking as a group that BJR is facing possible legal actions. You just want to know if BJR vacated the property and left it vacant or if the building owner seized a lot of guitars and parts [because if they did obviously BJR is not doing business there]. Leave a door open for them to share anything else they may want that would be helpful to you as a group. They may be unhappy with BJR too and blow off a little steam by giving you helpful information.


----------



## Dommak89

Just a quick suggestion for the matter of "how many guitars still need to be made". Why don't you guys do it like in the thread with the 1 million pushups. Basically always adding the numbers, so you don't have to go through the thread to count them. It's just a suggestion though.


----------



## spawnsc

Should we do an online petition for refunds?


----------



## Majkel

It's a long shot, and depending on his relationship with Bernie he might keep his cards close, but has anyone tried contacting the paint guy who worked with Bernie in the shop? Sounds like lots of people have come and gone, but that guy has been there with him the entire time... He might have something to add to the situation?


----------



## Diggi

Supposedly, this is Ed:


Ed.jpg Photo by DYERSEVE1018 | Photobucket

I found it in this thread:

Anybody Visit Rico Jr this Year? [Archive] - JCF Online


----------



## ovation22

Since we're doing research, here's a nice one I just stumbled across:

B.C. Rich Files Suit Against Moser Custom Shop

Like father like son, it would seem.


----------



## UnderTheSign

ovation22 said:


> Since we're doing research, here's a nice one I just stumbled across:
> 
> B.C. Rich Files Suit Against Moser Custom Shop
> 
> Like father like son, it would seem.


From what I've been told, Bernie Sr was a grade A asshole and he never gave (enough) credit to the original designers. Mockingbird, Bich, Seagull, Beast, Virgin... Neither Sr nor Jr have, to my knowledge, ever built a full guitar. They're businessmen first and foremost.


----------



## ovation22

And of course, there are some gems in this one:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/luthiery-modifications-customizations/176041-who-builds-brjs.html

Particularly page 4. Maybe it's time to take a trip down to Tijuana.


----------



## Tyson

I see the situation hasn't improved at all. Check back in another couple weeks.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

ovation22 said:


> Since we're doing research, here's a nice one I just stumbled across:
> 
> B.C. Rich Files Suit Against Moser Custom Shop
> 
> Like father like son, it would seem.





UnderTheSign said:


> From what I've been told, Bernie Sr was a grade A asshole and he never gave (enough) credit to the original designers. Mockingbird, Bich, Seagull, Beast, Virgin... Neither Sr nor Jr have, to my knowledge, ever built a full guitar. They're businessmen first and foremost.



I must be missing something, but BR Sr. wasn't alive during this lawsuit. He died in '99 and no one in the family was in the business at the time.


----------



## ovation22

Guess you didn't bother actually reading the link provided. Sr was shady, just like Jr.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Well excuuuse me, princess.  

I thought you were talking about that lawsuit that was linked. Now that I read the lower part, I understand what you're talking about.


----------



## arkohors

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Well excuuuse me, princess.
> 
> I thought you were talking about that lawsuit that was linked. Now that I read the lower part, I understand what you're talking about.



Somebody has been watching too many old Legend of Zelda cartoons


----------



## kruneh

Can´t really blame Bernie, I would get depressed myself if I was tagged in photos like this on facebook


----------



## 7stringkeke

Just talked to the landlord thanks to another 7string bretheren. Doesn't look good. No power has been on in the shop since Bernie's accident. And there never was any ac or heat. Just a small ac wall unit and small personal heater. But yea... No power in the building at all since the accident. So guitars may all be completely worthless and warped now.


----------



## Khoi

7stringkeke said:


> Just talked to the landlord thanks to another 7string bretheren. Doesn't look good. No power has been on in the shop since Bernie's accident. And there never was any ac or heat. Just a small ac wall unit and small personal heater. But yea... No power in the building at all since the accident. So guitars may all be completely worthless and warped now.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Court date still May 13 so I will let you guys know.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

Did Roger Graham "Bernie's landlord" say that the rent was getting paid? Here is his number **********

Mod Edit: That was stupid.


----------



## 7stringkeke

No rent is bring paid. He is behind on his rent.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Grover Ballmer said:


> Did Roger Graham "Bernie's landlord" say that the rent was getting paid? Here is his number (



If you could I would probably take this post down. I'm sure the guy doesn't want 500 people calling him all day for this stuff.


----------



## WickedSymphony

7stringkeke said:


> No rent is bring paid. He is behind on his rent.



Is the family even aware of this? I mean, let's say that hypothetically Bernie gets better and gets back to work at some point. What happens when he's behind on rent (assuming the land lord doesn't do anything), tons of guitars are warped from the lack of temperature control, and he has to start all over? I'm glad his wife finally made a statement about what's going on, albeit after a few months of silence, but they really need to be way more active in controlling the situation here in Bernie's absence.

And for what it's worth, I remember some guitars needing to get their fret boards redone last summer because of the weather. Mine was one of them and he told me this after I paid off my guitar, so the guitars becoming firewood is a very real possibility here.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

7stringkeke said:


> If you could I would probably take this post down. I'm sure the guy doesn't want 500 people calling him all day for this stuff.


 Sorry about that.


----------



## 7stringkeke

WickedSymphony said:


> Is the family even aware of this? I mean, let's say that hypothetically Bernie gets better and gets back to work at some point. What happens when he's behind on rent (assuming the land lord doesn't do anything), tons of guitars are warped from the lack of temperature control, and he has to start all over? I'm glad his wife finally made a statement about what's going on, albeit after a few months of silence, but they really need to be way more active in controlling the situation here in Bernie's absence.
> 
> And for what it's worth, I remember some guitars needing to get their fret boards redone last summer because of the weather. Mine was one of them and he told me this after I paid off my guitar, so the guitars becoming firewood is a very real possibility here.



I personally talked to Bernie's wife on the phone this morning. She is aware of it now.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Grover Ballmer said:


> Sorry about that.



Yea it's cool man just think he probably doesn't want in all this BS. If I hear anything else from Roger or you do I will update everyone.


----------



## Grover Ballmer

I have a guitar that is being restored by Bernie. It's a B.C. Rich Warlock that I bought years ago and brought it to him in 2011 and I already paid him in full (More than what it cost me new).


----------



## Grover Ballmer

Yeah sure thing. If there is anything I could to help let me know.


----------



## WickedSymphony

7stringkeke said:


> I personally talked to Bernie's wife on the phone this morning. She is aware of it now.



Well, that's good they know now, but Bernie's been out of the shop for like 3 months. I can't imagine that all the guitars are perfectly fine after that long. What a mess.


----------



## 7stringkeke

WickedSymphony said:


> Well, that's good they know now, but Bernie's been out of the shop for like 3 months. I can't imagine that all the guitars are perfectly fine after that long. What a mess.



Oh no I wouldn't be surprised if they are all ruined. The shop is in the middle of the desert during the summer. I wouldn't want my guitar now even if it was offered to me. There is no way all the set necks held up. Especially by the time he makes it back into the shop.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Jesus H. Christ. This whole shit-storm is like a Lovecraft horror nightmare slowly unfolding. God help every one of you.


----------



## spawnsc

I still don't believe Bernie is sick I'm just not buying into that, maybe his just sick of working on guitars but that's his own fault. I hope we get some solutions from the court. I hope he is faking it so we can get him for fraud


----------



## JPMike

Really what the hell is going on.


----------



## lametacomeat

Has anyone received confirmation that he is actually in a hospital? Given his reputation of lying to customers to get them off of his back, this could also be fabricated. Can anyone provide real proof other than word of mouth?


----------



## MatrixClaw

Saw the post on FB by his wife the other day. All I can say is, I'm glad I got my guitar when I did and that I feel for you guys that still haven't received yours!


----------



## Qweklain

I got the standard copy/paste response to my BBB Complaint. However, There is no longer a business rating and instead has this...
"BBB is currently updating its files on all businesses in the Greater Los Angeles area and pending that review, a BBB rating is unavailable."

Whether or not that is directly related to the complaints against BRJ specifically or not, I do not know, but I imagine after the update is done, I would assume the rating for BRJ will not be too good...


----------



## SpaceDock

FYI, the BBB sent me an update saying his is in the hospital and that medical documents can be provided. They are in communication with his wife and we all just have to wait. 

I don't know that anything more can be done until he gets out.


----------



## Qweklain

SpaceDock said:


> FYI, the BBB sent me an update saying his is in the hospital and that medical documents can be provided. They are in communication with his wife and we all just have to wait.
> 
> I don't know that anything more can be done until he gets out.


Even when (or IF) he gets out, what is going to be done? 

We all know his money is gone, most if not all of those guitars in that shop are worth nothing more than the burning capability if that shop has not been under temperature and humidity control, and any legal action is going to get us more of just that, absolutely nothing, but spending MORE money toward the same end result.

I think we are all completely FUCKED now at this point... 

I rebuttled the response to my BBB complaint, but that too will just lead through the same tunnel that has no light at the end.


----------



## leonardo7

I wouldn't assume that there is damage from the past few months. It has been a fairly dry and cool winter. 

In two months from now it will be an average of 90-105 F out there every day

http://www.weather.com/weather/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/USCA0481


----------



## Diggi

Any updates from anyone?


----------



## 7stringkeke

Not from me...


----------



## SpaceDock

Nothing


----------



## berzerkergang

Are there contracts involved here for these guitars? Also, wtf,,, most of the custom companies Ive dealt with only required partial payment up front, but Bernie demanded all of it up front? Or.....?


----------



## jbard

Email agreements with Bernie, so basically verbal binding. He takes a deposit like most, but the rub is that he would say a guitar is ready to ship in "two weeks" and take the rest of the payment, but no guitar would go out for months, if ever (happened on my 8 string slot)


----------



## SpaceDock

Sorry to bump the thread without any news,

But I was recalling all of his "march madness" and "more madness" sales from this time last year, it's just a bit too ironic really.


----------



## AwDeOh

SpaceDock said:


> Sorry to bump the thread without any news,
> 
> But I was recalling all of his "march madness" and "more madness" sales from this time last year, it's just a bit too ironic really.



Is it like rain, on your wedding day?


----------



## MetalDaze

AwDeOh said:


> Is it like rain, on your wedding day?


 
Sort of...also like getting a free ride when you've already paid 

(I blame knowing that on my ex-wife and her love of top 40 radio)

Last year's March Madness sale just means even more pissed off people out there....only they haven't waited as long.


----------



## SpaceDock

I thought it was funny that he is having all of the Madness sales and then finds himself in a mental institution, it's a cruel joke.


----------



## killertone




----------



## spawnsc




----------



## Grover Ballmer

Any news?


----------



## berzerkergang

MetalDaze said:


> Sort of...also like getting a free ride when you've already paid
> 
> (I blame knowing that on my ex-wife and her love of top 40 radio)
> 
> Last year's March Madness sale just means even more pissed off people out there....only they haven't waited as long.



I see the word EX wife in there and I want to give you a high five. Dating girls that like shitty music is tough to ignore. Id almost rather the girl have a Quebec nose.


----------



## killertone

Grover Ballmer said:


> Any news?



I got this today from the Business Consumer Alliance:

*Company's Response
Company's Initial Response - Posted 04/05/2013*

To all of Bernie's customers, we first want to express our gratefulness for your support regarding Bernie Rico Jr. guitars. We first want to apologize for the lack of communication during the past several months and CERTAINLY understand your concerns and frustrations. These past several months have been extremely difficult times for the Rico family regarding Bernie's health issues. We seem to take our "well being" for granted, and when suddenly faced with a challenge, are not prepared for the burden it creates. It was never our intention to keep you, the customer, out of the loop in regards to Bernie's status and the status of your order(s), and in retrospect, wish we could have handled the situation differently. However, with the challenges that we, the Rico family faced during the past several months, our primary focus was for Bernie to simply recover, so that he could come back to his family. Bernie's intentions are to resume working soon, so that he can finish your orders that you have waited so patiently for. We will keep you posted on when Bernie will be back in the shop. He is getting better every day and we are hopeful he will be back with his family soon. Very respectfully, Mrs. Rico

*Initial Response Summary*
Bernie's intentions are to resume working soon, so that he can finish your orders that you have waited so patiently for.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Isn't that the response that was posted here over a month ago?


----------



## Diggi

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Isn't that the response that was posted here over a month ago?




Yep, same shit, different day. 


Everyone is screwed at the moment.


----------



## killertone

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Isn't that the response that was posted here over a month ago?



Yeah, no idea why I just got it. Who gives a fuck really at this point.


----------



## ovation22

killertone said:


> Who gives a fuck really at this point.




Probably at least the guy that's owed $12k. Just a guess.


----------



## SpaceDock

Yeah, I still care for sure. This was a lot of money for me and it won't be forgotten or written off as a loss. That said I don't think Bernie is done yet, he is in his mid forties and still has a good 20-30 years before he will retire. This is a huge set back but I think he'll be back on the horse in a few months. I think this could happen to any small shop if the owner gets jacked, it's just the nature of artists.


----------



## leonardo7

I have a feeling he will be back at it too. My BRJ is such an awesome guitar that if he gets back to it, puts out guitars and proves he can turn them out then I will be looking to buy two spots.


----------



## JPMike

ovation22 said:


> Probably at least the guy that's owed $12k. Just a guess.



Well, as I mentioned before, I have a good feeling that things will get back to normal and everyone will receive their orders. Call me crazy, but that's the feeling I got.


----------



## paddy

So, let's hope he gets back soon "AND" when he get's back, he puts out "quality products all the time". This wasn't the case when he was building guitars.


----------



## WildBroskiAppears

paddy said:


> So, let's hope he gets back soon "AND" when he get's back, he puts out "quality products all the time". This wasn't the case when he was building guitars.



It certainly was before he started slipping. There's a reason his black friday sale took in ~200 orders.


----------



## ovation22

I can't imagine anyone giving this man more money after the events of the past few years.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

ovation22 said:


> I can't imagine anyone giving this man more money after the events of the past few years.



Well, there will be the occasional idiot that will shell him some cash, but probably not enough business to keep him afloat.

I sure hope that Bernie likes building Adirondack chairs, because he's going to have to find a different career path with all that wood equipment he's got going on there.


----------



## Qweklain

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, there will be the occasional idiot that will shell him some cash, but probably not enough business to keep him afloat.
> 
> I sure hope that Bernie likes building Adirondack chairs, because he's going to have to find a different career path with all that wood equipment he's got going on there.


Tht's assuming his assets are not seized to be liquidated for bills he cannot pay...


----------



## killertone

ovation22 said:


> Probably at least the guy that's owed $12k. Just a guess.



Yeah, I don't care about my 2 guitars,


----------



## WillDfx

I really do hope B can get back in shape, and start making and finishing guitars again. The few I've had were awesome, one had a few issues but nothing major, and Bernie made them right. I know he and his team have the capabilities to make great instruments, I just hope they make better decisions in the future.


----------



## JPMike

WillDfx said:


> I really do hope B can get back in shape, and start making and finishing guitars again. The few I've had were awesome, one had a few issues but nothing major, and Bernie made them right. I know he and his team have the capabilities to make great instruments, I just hope they make better decisions in the future.



I hope the same, bro!! I want to play my guitars.


----------



## Qweklain

As of yesterday my dispute I filed with my bank against my final payment was credited back to my account. I am still out $500 at this point, but it's better than being screwed out of $2500 total!

I would probably still want my guitar if he ever does return and is able to build again, especially considering mine is actually done. Oh well, the realistic aspect on that is it ain't gonna happen...


----------



## JPMike

Glad you got your money back. Unfortunately, some of us have to wait since it's been a long time since we paid. 

At least, spent your money wisely this time.


----------



## onetake-jam

I've reading the full topic.

You guys have balls of iron/steel/whatever is very heavy. I hope a solution can be found in the process to finish the guitars or get your money back (with a lot of prayers and candles, sadly)...

I've tried a Jekyll 6 in tropical burst finish with 27 frets and EMGs, not bad guitar. Luthiery is good, PU are good, but... the trem isn't a real Floyd Rose, an original. It's not a Schaller made or a Floyd made, it's an asian piece with huge fine tuners.
The electronics are basically mounted.
And... frets are... fat and flat. So the intonation point isn't good. I don't know if they are put as is to the fretboard (ebony) or if it's the intensive playing on it.
I'm interested in that guitar (it's a 3rd hand), but I'm afraid after have reading this thread and other messages about BRJ guitars (twisted necks)...

Good luck and best wishes for all those who placed a BF order.


----------



## Qweklain

JPMike said:


> Glad you got your money back. Unfortunately, some of us have to wait since it's been a long time since we paid.
> 
> At least, spent your money wisely this time.


I already spent it by picking up a spot in that Jackson CS SL2H-7 run.


----------



## judgey1197

Ive been following this thread for a long time now. Its painful to see what you guys are going through. Especially because a BRJ is my dream guitar, but now, i feel like that is a dream i will never achieve. 
BRJs are AMAZING instruments though


----------



## Diggi

judgey1197 said:


> Ive been following this thread for a long time now. Its painful to see what you guys are going through. Especially because a BRJ is my dream guitar, but now, i feel like that is a dream i will never achieve.
> BRJs are AMAZING instruments though




I believe that if you polled this audience, they'd disagree with you based on many of the instruments received from BRJ in the last year or so...

However, many are so tired of this that they may not even respond. 

In any case, it is insanely depressing.....


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Sometimes... sometimes they are amazing instruments.

If you've looked through this thread you'll know that on more than a few occasions an axe has come out of his shop so thoroughly "farkled" that you'd think a drunk 12-year-old put it together. Many others will attest that this recent botch job by him isn't the first time, either.


----------



## glassmoon0fo

I believe if you polled the audience that has/does own a BRJ, most would agree with him. MOST. I only wish he'd have gotten more good instruments into people's hands so his intended work could speak for itself. Damn, seeing what he used to make versus the way he's been building and operating of late actually gives me residual grief, it's like seeing Michael Jordan lose a foot to diabetes.


----------



## Diggi

glassmoon0fo said:


> I believe if you polled the audience that has/does own a BRJ, most would agree with him. MOST. I only wish he'd have gotten more good instruments into people's hands so his intended work could speak for itself. Damn, seeing what he used to make versus the way he's been building and operating of late actually gives me residual grief, it's like seeing Michael Jordan lose a foot to diabetes.



Me too.


----------



## paddy

.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

glassmoon0fo said:


> I believe if you polled the audience that has/does own a BRJ, most would agree with him. MOST. I only wish he'd have gotten more good instruments into people's hands so his intended work could speak for itself. Damn, seeing what he used to make versus the way he's been building and operating of late actually gives me residual grief, it's like seeing Michael Jordan lose a foot to diabetes.



If you compare the number of people who ordered guitars to the number of people who actually received great guitars (hell. Let's say even received any instrument at all), you start to get a pretty dismal impression of his luthier work. And there are reports of serious issues going back as many as, at this point, 5-6 years. Even with my guitar, which is really high quality, it looks like somebody took a pocket knife to the truss rod cavity. Really shit work. And almost every person who's received a guitar in the last several years will attest to the fact that there is at least one considerable cosmetic flaw with their instrument - botched side dots, inconsistent finish, etc. Difficult to defend when people are paying $3,000+ for a custom instrument.

Basically, that schmuck doesn't really build his guitars at all - barely touches them, in fact. What we've seen as far as great guitars coming out of BRJ have merely been periods where he had some great hired help for a while. I hope that everybody who's left over gets taken care of, but hopefully that douche hangs up his luthier work once he's finished.


----------



## kmanick

He did having it going on for while. Before I ordered mine I played all of Zimbloths and a couple that had come into his shop and were on their way to the owners and they were
all beautiful guitars. Zimbloth had a bunch of them and I don' think I ever heard of any issues with any of them. Mine is perfect and still blows me away every time I play it.
I wouldn't give him a penny of my money now, whoever was putting these things together in 2010-early 2011 knew what they were doing.
it's a tragedy that so many of you got royally fucked by this guy/company


----------



## paddy

Speculum Speculorum said:


> And there are reports of serious issues going back as many as, at this point, 5-6 years. Even with my guitar, which is really high quality, it looks like somebody took a pocket knife to the truss rod cavity. Really shit work. And almost every person who's received a guitar in the last several years will attest to the fact that there is at least one considerable cosmetic flaw with their instrument - botched side dots, inconsistent finish, etc. Difficult to defend when people are paying $3,000+ for a custom instrument.



Yep. Can confirm all of the above to be true on my guitar. Just like yours, really bad work in the truss rod cavity with totally worn hex end on truss rod, Wrong side dot positions, scratches on the finish, bad positioning of screws that connect the floyd strings to the body, are the ones that come immediately to my mind.

Feel really sorry for all the people who got shafted lot worse than me. At least I've got a guitar to show for.


----------



## Qweklain

Good news guys, Bernie just called me today. Literally got off the phone about 15 minutes ago with him at the the time of this post. 

I don't know any details, but he said he WAS in the hospital to clear up any of those rumors of running and whatnot. He is back and taking things slow and just taking things on one at a time.


----------



## eaeolian

Qweklain said:


> Good news guys, Bernie just called me today. Literally got off the phone about 15 minutes ago with him at the the time of this post.
> 
> I don't know any details, but he said he WAS in the hospital to clear up any of those rumors of running and whatnot. He is back and taking things slow and just taking things on one at a time.



Well, that's a positive, at least.


----------



## SpaceDock

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

Let's all say a prayer for Bernie and keep the negative BS to a minimum. The shit talk doesn't help anyone.


----------



## AwDeOh

It's nice to wake up in the morning, drink my coffee and get a warm fuzzy hearing that all this might get resolved eventually for all you guys.

Agreed, Spacedock, I'm hoping for his own sake he doesn't find this thread.


----------



## tacotiklah

Qweklain said:


> Good news guys, Bernie just called me today. Literally got off the phone about 15 minutes ago with him at the the time of this post.
> 
> I don't know any details, but he said he WAS in the hospital to clear up any of those rumors of running and whatnot. He is back and taking things slow and just taking things on one at a time.



That's good to hear man. I'm still watching this thread and hoping that things eventually come to a peaceful and workable conclusion.


----------



## killertone

Good to hear. I'd love a call myself.


----------



## Hollowway

Awesome! I'm going for relax, at least for now, because it looks like we'll be getting our instruments in time. That's a big load off!


----------



## MetalThrasher

Hollowway said:


> Awesome! I'm going for relax, at least for now, because it looks like we'll be getting our instruments in time. That's a big load off!



Amen to that brother!


----------



## spawnsc

hope rest of us get a well deserved call, any particular reason he called you? didn't you get part of your money back? lol


----------



## paddy

Qweklain said:


> He is back and taking things slow and just taking things on one at a time.



Let's all hope so.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

spawnsc said:


> hope rest of us get a well deserved call, any particular reason he called you? didn't you get part of your money back? lol



As though everything else so far has been the pinnacle of rational behavior. 

I'm glad the guy is out of the nut hut, but I wouldn't be too quick to jump on the hooray wagon. It's not like we haven't been here before, in a situation eerily similar to this. I wouldn't sit tight until my guitar was in my hands, and if I could, I'd still get my money back.


----------



## Qweklain

spawnsc said:


> hope rest of us get a well deserved call, any particular reason he called you? didn't you get part of your money back? lol


I did get my final payment back. He called me first because my guitar was literally completely finished, just sitting there waiting to be shipped. It is ready to go now and he called to see if I still wanted it.

Of course I am leery on it, but I do want it still so I am just waiting on those funds that were returned to me to be cleared before I basically send the money back to him again so I am not sitting out even more.


----------



## ramses

Qweklain said:


> I did get my final payment back. He called me first because my guitar was literally completely finished, just sitting there waiting to be shipped. It is ready to go now and he called to see if I still wanted it.
> 
> Of course I am leery on it, but I do want it still so I am just waiting on those funds that were returned to me to be cleared before I basically send the money back to him again so I am not sitting out even more.



That's going to be a really interesting NGD.


----------



## rifftrauma

Just got an email from the man himself...glad he's back and feeling better.


----------



## foreright

Qweklain said:


> Of course I am leery on it, but I do want it still so I am just waiting on those funds that were returned to me to be cleared before I basically send the money back to him again so I am not sitting out even more.



You're a braver man than me - I would be telling him to ship the thing and THEN he can have his money or going there in person with cash. It's not like he has form for saying a guitar is ready and then sitting on the money for two years is it... Oh wait...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Qweklain said:


> I did get my final payment back. He called me first because my guitar was literally completely finished, just sitting there waiting to be shipped. It is ready to go now and he called to see if I still wanted it.
> 
> Of course I am leery on it, but I do want it still so I am just waiting on those funds that were returned to me to be cleared before I basically send the money back to him again so I am not sitting out even more.



How does that saying go? "Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice......"


----------



## thepylestory

Somebody has to take the leap.


----------



## arkohors

Qweklain said:


> I did get my final payment back. He called me first because my guitar was literally completely finished, just sitting there waiting to be shipped. It is ready to go now and he called to see if I still wanted it.
> 
> Of course I am leery on it, but I do want it still so I am just waiting on those funds that were returned to me to be cleared before I basically send the money back to him again so I am not sitting out even more.



Tell him you'll do a CoD, that way you are guaranteed to get your guitar upon payment. If he's not willing to do that, then my guess is your guitar is not ready to be shipped


----------



## JPMike

To be honest, I haven't been checking this thread often and I am reading wonderful things. Bernie is finally back!!!

The first thing I did, and don't accuse me for that but I emailed him and texted him to see what's up and of course if he can update on any of my orders. Let's hope, we get our guitars soon and yeah, let's all be positive.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> To be honest, I haven't been checking this thread often and I am reading wonderful things. Bernie is finally back!!!
> 
> The first thing I did, and don't accuse me for that but I emailed him and texted him to see what's up and of course if he can update on any of my orders. Let's hope, we get our guitars soon and yeah, let's all be positive.





Man, I hope you're right. Did you get _any_ response from him?


----------



## Necromagnon

The morale of the story: _when you're deep in shit, take 2 months holydays and then go back to work, everybody will be happy when you'll be back._



Seriously, I hope he will take lesson about it and all the shit that was about to fall onto him, and do everything's necessary so that it won't happen again (I'm talking about lack of communication and all that, not quality or whatever). And hopefully, everyone of you will get his guitar(s).


----------



## JPMike

Diggi said:


> Man, I hope you're right. Did you get _any_ response from him?



It's been around 15 hours since I emailed and texted him, I still haven't gotten any response, I even wrote a sentimental paragraph talking about how I feel about the whole situation and such.

Let's hope, we will be getting some replies in the next 9 hours.


----------



## SpaceDock

I think we should be more concerned with him getting beck to building and less with him talking to us all. I'm sure he'll talk to us when he needs to, but the endless emails and BS calls were a big part of the problem. He can't get anything done when he's responding to 1000's of email a day. Be real about it.


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> I think we should be more concerned with him getting beck to building and less with him talking to us all. I'm sure he'll talk to us when he needs to, but the endless emails and BS calls were a big part of the problem. He can't get anything done when he's responding to 1000's of email a day. Be real about it.



I agree with you 100%, but I got quite an amount of money invested so I need to know something.


----------



## Ben.Last

SpaceDock said:


> I think we should be more concerned with him getting beck to building and less with him talking to us all. I'm sure he'll talk to us when he needs to, but the endless emails and BS calls were a big part of the problem. He can't get anything done when he's responding to 1000's of email a day. Be real about it.



I assure you, there's no way he's getting THOUSANDS of emails.


----------



## rifftrauma

Got these from the man himself earlier today.


----------



## JPMike

rifftrauma said:


> Got these from the man himself earlier today.



Finally some photos, let's hope he will get back to me soon!


----------



## patata

The prophecy was true.I might...I might be able to order a BRJ someday...
Oh mighty lawd!


----------



## TemjinStrife

patata said:


> The prophecy was true.I might...I might be able to order a BRJ someday...
> Oh mighty lawd!



Someone still wants to order from him?!?


----------



## JPMike

patata said:


> The prophecy was true.I might...I might be able to order a BRJ someday...
> Oh mighty lawd!



If you got nothing to contribute to the thread please keep it to yourself.



TemjinStrife said:


> Someone still wants to order from him?!?



Seems like it!!


----------



## msalazar

Bernie called me and we talked for about 15 minutes this morning, hes back and hopefully everything gets resolved soon enough.


----------



## JPMike

At least, he's calling some people, he still hasn't responded to me yet.


----------



## SpaceDock

I'm really hoping he paces himself and does things right, if that means not calling me for a while or taking a few more months, so be it. I would rather have a great guitar than a botched one.


----------



## JP Universe

I accepted just eating my $600 deposit but hey here we are .... back at the 'hope' stage 
Still hoping I can sell my spot down the line.... I don't have much interest in a straight scale 8 string at the moment. Maybe by 2015 that will change


----------



## xwestonx

Does his email work again? Last time I tried it got kicked back... Any sort of contact I'd call positive at this point ...


----------



## paddy

SpaceDock said:


> I'm really hoping he paces himself and does things right, if that means not calling me for a while or taking a few more months, so be it. I would rather have a great guitar than a botched one.



I guess time will tell.


Hopefully you'll get what you want.


----------



## aiur55

Hopefully for those who only paid the deposit, he would let us pay after the guitar is in hands...maybe after a few weeks.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

aiur55 said:


> Hopefully for those who only paid the deposit, he would let us pay after the guitar is in hands...maybe after a few weeks.



          

Because Obamacare like... paid for his last big stint in the mental facility he was staying at.


----------



## axxessdenied

I wouldn't be singing any praises yet... who knows what state the guitars will arrive? Just sayin'... QC hasn't been that great recently.


----------



## xwestonx

Ok, I am legitimately curious if anyone else has claim to this guitar. I bought this as part of the "march madness" sale. Like many I was promised an apparently unrealistic turn around once the guitar was paid in full. Given all the things I have read about in this thread, it wouldn't surprise me if this was sold to another person. I haven't talked to Bernie since early December. Maybe I'm just paranoid, but it sounds like I walked into an outright shit fest.


----------



## rifftrauma

I've tried to stay out of this thread for the past 6 months due to all the confusion/chaos and general lack of reliable information. I'm currently on month 20 of what I thought would be a 6-12 month wait tops. The deposite I paid on my guitar (full custom not black friday) was approx 1/4 of the total cost and now I face the delima of paying the rest and risking the ass pain so many have gone through. If I can get in contact with Bernie I may fly out there to pick it up/insepct my guitar in person...I'll let you know the deal, I want to be optimisitc and hope that he'll pull through but that weighs heavily on my $4K+ build....


----------



## JPMike

I am on 18 months and I have paid in full 3 builds, which is around $10k plus 1 build which I have paid only a deposit of $1.5k. NOT Black Friday guitars.

Shouldn't I be like contacted first or what? :S Or at least, one of the first?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I think everyone is going to feel that way, I'm waiting over 2 years now fully paid on two guitars. 

Larrikan,sp, had like ten guitars with him. 

No point in getting anxious now. I wonder if he's still going for people that haven't paid up so he can get more money and those of us who have paid are back burner.


----------



## Diggi

What a cluster fuck this thing still is.

I hope he's ok, and that his family is ok; that he is better, happier and working to build the best guitars he can, with all of his talent and capabilities in tact.

Has anyone else been contacted by him recently? Any other "proof" that he's actually working on guitars, and that the finished product wasn't subsequently damaged by the unattended environment these guitars lived in for the last several months? 

I'm curious (not to read about the next guitar received by one of us, but) to read about the guitar received by the 10th person in the current que.


----------



## yellowv

SpaceDock said:


> I wonder if he's still going for people that haven't paid up so he can get more money and those of us who have paid are back burner.



He's gotta get some cash flow back. Lord knows all the money he had is gone.


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea that's kinda where I was going with my explanation. Wasn't trying to turn it into a "who should get there shit first" / entitled kind of argument.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ totally, I hope we all get our shit. I'm gonna stay positive and know it takes a lot of time to build a good guitar and we know there's 200 to do.


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I think everyone is going to feel that way, I'm waiting over 2 years now fully paid on two guitars.
> 
> Larrikan,sp, had like ten guitars with him.
> 
> No point in getting anxious now. I wonder if he's still going for people that haven't paid up so he can get more money and those of us who have paid are back burner.



Probably he might, but in any case I guess I just have to wait!

Btw, have you been sent photos the last 2 years? Of any progress pics?


----------



## Larrikin666

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I think everyone is going to feel that way, I'm waiting over 2 years now fully paid on two guitars.
> 
> Larrikan,sp, had like ten guitars with him.
> 
> No point in getting anxious now. I wonder if he's still going for people that haven't paid up so he can get more money and those of us who have paid are back burner.



7.....but who's counting?


----------



## Khoi

I'll probably be asking for a refund instead of my guitar if he asks me if I still want my guitar.

I'm done with this, there are so many more builders who I'd rather give my money to.


----------



## SpaceDock

JPMike said:


> Probably he might, but in any case I guess I just have to wait!
> 
> Btw, have you been sent photos the last 2 years? Of any progress pics?


 
Yeah, Ive gotten some updates here and there, they just need hardware. Theyve been frozen for almost a year it seems.


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea this makes me paranoid as shit...all mine needs is hardware now too...only I still owe the guy $3K and I'm the first one he contacts?


----------



## MetalDaze

Maybe we should look into some sort of escrow service. Basically, he gives the guitar to them, you give the money to them and once both parties have done their part, the escrow company finishes the transaction.


----------



## JPMike

I have no idea what to think or say. I feel like anything I post will be useless on the matter... :S


----------



## Hollowway

MetalDaze said:


> Maybe we should look into some sort of escrow service. Basically, he gives the guitar to them, you give the money to them and once both parties have done their part, the escrow company finishes the transaction.



That's kind of the way it used to be with the dealers, like athe Axe Palace.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Khoi said:


> I'll probably be asking for a refund instead of my guitar if he asks me if I still want my guitar.
> 
> I'm done with this, there are so many more builders who I'd rather give my money to.



That's assuming he asks you anything at all.

Look - I talked to a guy who waited for 3 years to get his guitar AFTER the fact Bernie told him it only needed hardware. There is something seriously wrong with the guy's business model, or lack thereof.


----------



## Khoi

Speculum Speculorum said:


> That's assuming he asks you anything at all.
> 
> Look - I talked to a guy who waited for 3 years to get his guitar AFTER the fact Bernie told him it only needed hardware. There is something seriously wrong with the guy's business model, or lack thereof.



he asked me if I still wanted my 6-string build last June when I sold my 7-string spot. I regret saying I still wanted it then


----------



## Necromagnon

MetalDaze said:


> Maybe we should look into some sort of escrow service. Basically, he gives the guitar to them, you give the money to them and once both parties have done their part, the escrow company finishes the transaction.




In french, "escro(w)" means "scammer", well used here.


----------



## Majkel

rifftrauma said:


> Yea this makes me paranoid as shit...all mine needs is hardware now too...only I still owe the guy $3K and I'm the first one he contacts?



Not defending the guy in any way (this whole thing is FUBAR), but I don't think you need to spaz out about this. Wouldn't you do the same thing? 

If you had taken a vacation from sanity which resulted in a backlog the size of his, doesn't it make sense to get the "easy fixes" out the door first? If all it needs is hardware, that's an easy win for ol' Bernie no matter where in the queue you actually are?

Not exactly fair, but not solely a cash grab either perhaps


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Majkel,

The problem is that there have been numerous instances of BRJ saying "Just needs hardware" or "it's ready to ship - need payment" and then once he has money he disappears for a year or so, and the variety of responses when finally making contact range from:

Oh, your guitar had build issues.

to (paraphrasing):

Who, exactly, the fuck are you?

He has every right to be nervous, and it's probably reasonable that he is.


----------



## spawnsc

*looks for updates on people receiving guitars* 


/leaves


----------



## Majkel

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Majkel,
> 
> The problem is that there have been numerous instances of BRJ saying "Just needs hardware" or "it's ready to ship - need payment" and then once he has money he disappears for a year or so, and the variety of responses when finally making contact range from:
> 
> Oh, your guitar had build issues.
> 
> to (paraphrasing):
> 
> Who, exactly, the fuck are you?
> 
> He has every right to be nervous, and it's probably reasonable that he is.



Oh absolutely, there's been more than enough of those to warrant cash after delivery as some people have suggested. I may have misunderstood the intention of Rifftrauma's comment when you put it in that context


----------



## killertone

Ok so those of you who have gotten phone calls...is it from the same number he used to have or is it a new one?


----------



## Diggi

killertone said:


> Ok so those of you who have gotten phone calls...is it from the same number he used to have or is it a new one?




I gots nuttin'


----------



## SpaceDock

Now that he is out, can someone check in on him? 

I would like to trust him, but for Christ's sake, calling people for money without delivering to those of us who are paid up seems like a huge scam. My stuff has been "ready for assembly" "two weeks" "waiting on cases" and every other line for a year now, don't give him your money until you see the guitar boxed up with your name on the shipping label!!!!


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> Ok so those of you who have gotten phone calls...is it from the same number he used to have or is it a new one?



I've sent a few texts to the number I assume you got, which is registered on an iPhone and when he was in the "hospital" it was showing as text message, which meant it was turned off. Now that he's out it appears as iMessage and all my texts were delivered. 

So I guess, it's the same old number.


----------



## rifftrauma

He's asked me to call him now twice via email and I've responded with "yea dude I need your number...". I've tried calling the number I got 2 years ago when I set all this up and it rings twice, goes to Bernie's answering machine and then won't allow me to leave a message.


----------



## killertone

rifftrauma said:


> He's asked me to call him now twice via email and I've responded with "yea dude I need your number...". I've tried calling the number I got 2 years ago when I set all this up and it rings twice, goes to Bernie's answering machine and then won't allow me to leave a message.



What email address?


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> What email address?



Probably, the yahoo one.


----------



## 7stringkeke

Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

7stringkeke said:


> Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!



Fantastic news, man!


----------



## JPMike

7stringkeke said:


> Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!



That's fantastic news, how long ago did you pay him?


----------



## Khoi

I think I'm going to call them and talk to them about it. I'm with BoA, so I'm not sure how much of a chance I have...


----------



## Diggi

7stringkeke said:


> Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!





WAAAY excellent news for you!


----------



## Watty

7stringkeke said:


> Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!



WOW! That is probably THE BEST news to come out of this thread so far. Congrats man!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

YES! So many more deserving luthiers out there waiting for work. This is great news. I can only hope that it steamrolls forward for many others.


----------



## Lirtle




----------



## Adrian-XI

Quick, charge your phone in case he replies!


----------



## SpaceDock

I think we've all sent him one of those in the past week, am I right?


----------



## Lirtle

hahaha true.

You'd think someone like Bernie would turn off read receipts though.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Lirtle said:


> hahaha true.
> 
> You'd think someone like Bernie would turn off read receipts though.



Bro - I think we can all certify that Bernie is basically technologically retarded... *




* And maybe just retarded in general.


----------



## rifftrauma




----------



## Red&Die

rifftrauma said:


>



Cool inlay!


----------



## 7stringkeke

JPMike said:


> That's fantastic news, how long ago did you pay him?


 Jan 2012


----------



## MetalDaze

7stringkeke said:


> Jan 2012


 
Are you still going to your court date?


----------



## thepylestory

Good question


----------



## jeleopard

7stringkeke said:


> Just got off the phone with my bank. They went in my favor and the $3,800 amount I paid Bernie was completely credited back to my account. My Rico stress is now gone!!!



Hey man... all that cash is awfully heavy... why don't you give some to me 

Seriously, grats. What bank do you have, out of curiosity, just so others who may have the same bank can breathe?


----------



## JPMike

I am just glad someone is getting something, either it's refund or the guitar they have been waiting for.


----------



## 7stringkeke

jeleopard said:


> Hey man... all that cash is awfully heavy... why don't you give some to me
> 
> Seriously, grats. What bank do you have, out of curiosity, just so others who may have the same bank can breathe?



I have Navy Federal Credit Union


----------



## 7stringkeke

MetalDaze said:


> Are you still going to your court date?



Don't think so. It would be pointless now.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> I am just glad someone is getting something, either it's refund or the guitar they have been waiting for.



Bank Issued Charge Back/Credit =/= Refund 

It means that the bank believes that Bernie is at fault/in the wrong and in doing so protected their client (7stringkeke) and thus their interests by issuing the credit. 

Bernie had no say on the process, and is now on the hook for the balance whether he likes it or not. Bernie will likely get phone calls, letters, and other communication from the bank or an agent of the bank to seek the funds. If Bernie does not comply the bank will take him to court (they don't need him to show up, a judgement can be made without his presence) and it will go to a collection company. 

This is basically the equivalent of 7stringkeke winning his court case, only the bank is doing the work, and has more power in the way of actually getting the money at some point, as if this goes to collection it'll bash Bernie's credit and they'll hound him for it for years to come. If Bernie then tries to get a "day job" they can even garnish his wages if he doesn't pay. 

This is why folks should have contacted their banks sooner.


----------



## Rap Hat

I'm kicking myself for not doing it soon enough, that's for sure. Even though I paid in full and it wasn't ready (despite what Bernie promised), there were still guitars occasionally going out so I figured he'd get to mine eventually. Then he says its ready and asks for a second final payment...

I am a little pissed at my bank, as they have nothing in place for stuff like custom guitars that take longer than 6 months where you pay some up front. To them the deposit is considered purchasing the guitar, so if it takes longer than 6 months and then something happens you're SOL. No amount of records helped in my situation, as they literally couldn't understand that it was being built ("you paid for a guitar and didn't receive it? That's a shipping issue! Just ask for a refund! Oh, he's disappeared? And you're saying something about "build time"? Contact the owner! Oh, he is the owner? Well you should've contacted the us when you didn't receive it after 30 days! Anyway, we don't keep records past a year!")

I'm still holding some sliver of hope that I'll see the guitar against all odds. But this situation is getting worse with the potential influx of chargebacks (not saying it's bad, everyone should try). Bernie has totally lost everybody's trust, and he's gonna have to take some knocks and swallow his pride - but we've all seen and heard his fucking crazy reaction to the most timid inquiry of "refund". I'm not sure I really trust him to be reasonable to his existing customers, when he blamed this forum for a lot of his issues.


----------



## rifftrauma

Yea I'm having absolute internal war about what to do at this point. Bernie has made progress on my guitar in the last week. I shot him an email asking for a full album of photos. I want the guitar in the box with my address labeled before I give him another dime....and I'm still worried about the outcome.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

rifftrauma said:


> Yea I'm having absolute internal war about what to do at this point. Bernie has made progress on my guitar in the last week. I shot him an email asking for a full album of photos. I want the guitar in the box with my address labeled before I give him another dime....and I'm still worried about the outcome.



Dude, read that again to yourself. Pretend you're someone from the outside looking in, would you really tell someone to stick it out? 

Guys, tough love time, cut and fucking run if you can and fight tooth and nail to be made as close to whole as you possibly can. Really. 

It's 2013, is BRJ really offering something that at least a couple dozen other builders can't reliably deliver for a similar price? I get it, it's hard to let go after so long, especially when most of the guitars were an incredible (as in too good to be true) bargain, but it's really time to move on and A) get yourselves some great instruments, B) restore your piece of mind, this has to be stressful for you folks, and C) give your cash to some builders who actually deserve your patient patronage. 

You guys have been lied to numerous times. Just look through this thread again, in it's nearly 100/40 page/post, and examine the half truths, lies, shilling, excuses, this and that. It's time to come to terms with this and start thinking of yourselves and your families. Bernie might be a nice guy, but he's not your friend and doesn't want to be your friend. He's not family, and will never be. You are nothing but dollar signs to him. That's the cold hard truth. Is it wrong, a bit, but that's life. 

You guys have been taken for a ride. It's hard to admit that, and it's especially hard to swallow your pride, get your hands a little dirty and get what you're owed. 

Stop blaming The BBB, Banks, Credit Card Companies, and other regulatory agencies. It's not their fault that this has reached this point. The blame falls purely on two parties, which is more at fault is debatable. 

I'm not here to shame or lambaste you guys. I love you guys, really. That's why I'm saying this. You folks deserve better and need to do what it takes to get better. 

Best of luck.


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> Bank Issued Charge Back/Credit =/= Refund
> 
> It means that the bank believes that Bernie is at fault/in the wrong and in doing so protected their client (7stringkeke) and thus their interests by issuing the credit.
> 
> Bernie had no say on the process, and is now on the hook for the balance whether he likes it or not. Bernie will likely get phone calls, letters, and other communication from the bank or an agent of the bank to seek the funds. If Bernie does not comply the bank will take him to court (they don't need him to show up, a judgement can be made without his presence) and it will go to a collection company.
> 
> This is basically the equivalent of 7stringkeke winning his court case, only the bank is doing the work, and has more power in the way of actually getting the money at some point, as if this goes to collection it'll bash Bernie's credit and they'll hound him for it for years to come. If Bernie then tries to get a "day job" they can even garnish his wages if he doesn't pay.
> 
> This is why folks should have contacted their banks sooner.



Max, I am not sure if that would have worked for us international guys. 

But after he contacted some people is unacceptable not to answer back to some of us. Get your wife someone to help you out.

As to your last post, not sure, if I can actually get anything from my bank as I said since we are international, but I invested a big amount of money, what the hell am I supposed to do now.... ?


----------



## Rev2010

I guess it would be wise at this point for anyone sticking through this to be sure if they are asked for a final payment and it's said the guitar "Is ready to ship", that:

1. If you do make the payment do it with a credit card, NOT your bank account.

2. If you don't receive the guitar within 3 weeks you promptly call the credit card and challenge/dispute the charges.


Rev.


----------



## Jonathan20022

JPMike said:


> Max, I am not sure if that would have worked for us international guys.
> 
> But after he contacted some people is unacceptable not to answer back to some of us. Get your wife someone to help you out.
> 
> As to your last post, not sure, if I can actually get anything from my bank as I said since we are international, but I invested a big amount of money, what the hell am I supposed to do now.... ?



Have you tried sorting the problem out with whatever bank you're using? Don't write it off unless you've given it a shot, I haven't kept up with the thread in a few weeks but it seems like he's back in the shop and some people are succeeding in getting their money credited back which is good.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> Max, I am not sure if that would have worked for us international guys.
> 
> But after he contacted some people is unacceptable not to answer back to some of us. Get your wife someone to help you out.
> 
> As to your last post, not sure, if I can actually get anything from my bank as I said since we are international, but I invested a big amount of money, what the hell am I supposed to do now.... ?


 
You're in a pretty unique spot in this mess, Mike. You've actually given Bernie enough of your cash to make legal action a viable option. 

You're at five figures, if I remember correctly, so even if half the final judgement goes to fees you'll still be able to recoup a significant amount of money and at the very least keep the balance out of Bernie's hands. 

Not to call you out or nothing, but you've been extremely passive in this from what I've seen you post. My appologies if you've been doing a lot of research and seeking counsel outside what you've posted here. It's time to get serious man. I get that this shit isn't fun, but it's time to make things right. 



Kenji20022 said:


> it seems like he's back in the shop


 
If by that you mean he's buttering up some folks with pics and calls to get them to give him more cash, then yes, he's back.  

Has anyone gotten a guitar? Tracking number? Any shred of proof that things aren't still a total quagmire? I'm asking honestly.


----------



## Rap Hat

Rev2010 said:


> 2. If you don't receive the guitar within 3 weeks you promptly call the credit card and challenge/dispute the charges.
> 
> 
> Rev.



This right here is so so so important. Even according to Bernie's own receipts the guitar absolutely *will* be shipped out within 30 days of final payment, but we've seen how much he follows that. It's obviously gonna suck if you get proof the guitar is packed and ready to go, then no contact, but if you take Bernie at his word you'll end up like me, having paid in full back in 2011.


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> You're in a pretty unique spot in this mess, Mike. You've actually given Bernie enough of your cash to make legal action a viable option.
> 
> You're at five figures, if I remember correctly, so even if half the final judgement goes to fees you'll still be able to recoup a significant amount of money and at the very least keep the balance out of Bernie's hands.
> 
> Not to call you out or nothing, but you've been extremely passive in this from what I've seen you post. My appologies if you've been doing a lot of research and seeking counsel outside what you've posted here. It's time to get serious man. I get that this shit isn't fun, but it's time to make things right.



Max, I always hoped and to be honest I still hope and being positive about the whole situation. Now that he has started communicating with people I felt a little better. I don't like causing trouble to people, especially if they are in some weird/bad mental/health situation, but I know I must do something.

My girlfriend has been saying to me the last year to do something about it, she says, I am sure he is a scammer, it's been far too long receiving nothing.

And no, Max. I haven't taken any action but just hoping things will change. 

Well, I think this time I must act, I did pay with my debit/credit card, so I guess that will be a bit easier, right??

I wanna add that this forum has some amazing people and I am glad I am part of it!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Mike - It's not going to get better. Anyone who thinks so is so obviously out of their gord that it's not even funny. I don't mean that offensively to anyone. I'm just being objective about it all. 

Even if Bernie is somehow magically all better, is churning out guitars like he's some sort of god damn wizard on really good acid, and suddenly contacts every single person he has a build with maintaining consistent results, he'll never get out of the shit he's permanently planted himself in.

But Bernie is only exhibiting behavior that he has historically cycled through. You know very well why he hasn't contacted you - because he already has your fucking money, that's why. He's contacting people that he can suck more money out of because he's a vulture who preys on people's emotions, finances, and good graces.

Seriously people. This guy is a total schmuck, and you all need to figure that out before you go any further with him.


----------



## PrestigeRS4

Where is his Facebook Announcement? His wife spoke up for him but still have heard nothing public from the man himself. He needs to speak up and let everyone know the game plan.


----------



## mikernaut

That will take 3-4 months for someone to clue in , Oh snap, that was the web guy's job! (...what web guy, at this point?) insert this quote-


----------



## tommychains

I've literally been reading this thread for close to 4 hours; it's like a goddamn soap opera.

I actually have a dream to open my own guitar shop before I croak. Right now I just build my own guitars and sell them to friends. This whole fucked up situation really showed me three things:

1. If you can't do it, then don't. Deadlines and Build Limits are made for a reason. If you only feel comfortable building 20 a month, don't go over that.
2. Always have a worst case scenario plan. Without getting into details, I know what it's like to have no backup plan when the worst happens. It can go bad at any time, so be prepared when it comes knocking.
3. Be honest to the customer. If you aren't comfortable taking the order, tell him that and if anything, just ask him to inquire on a later date. I know i'd much rather have the luthier tell me "I'm a bit overloaded right now, if you can inquire in 3 months, i'd be more than happy to discuss a build for you." instead of yes-ing me to death.

Hope everything ends best case scenario for all you guys.


----------



## spawnsc

so how long will it take for him to disappear again? any estimates? I say in another 3 months he will fall off the map again and people will be back in here saying how he lied ect.. i've already gave up on it I know i'm not getting my guitar or money. The asshole hasn't emailed me or contacted me after all the emails i've sent. I agree with everything Max has said.


----------



## SpaceDock

Is there anyway we can get together on this and get a mass refund or unfinished guitars with hardware? Seems like it might be more plausible if all 100+ of us got together and filed something. Is anyone here a law student or want to do it pro bono?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

SpaceDock said:


> Is there anyway we can get together on this and get a mass refund or unfinished guitars with hardware? Seems like it might be more plausible if all 100+ of us got together and filed something. Is anyone here a law student or want to do it pro bono?


 
Everyone is too disorganized, lazy, unable, or simply doesn't care to get any of this done it seems. No one really has been willing to really "rally the troops" to get anything even close to worthwhile in motion. 

Heck, how many guys in here even know each others' first names? 

You guys need to get together, get on the same page, and get things done. 

The cold hard truth is, unless your banks start crediting you, you're not going to be getting anything close to a refund if any real sum of cash at all, and unless Bernie's books are incredibly well kept, there's no way you guys are going to get an unfinished instrument. 

The hustle was too good, and you guys were WAY too trusting, and thus it's at a point where most folks will never see 100% of thier cash ever again, and most won't even see half, or anything thanks to legal fees and fees that will be associated with getting this in motion. 

That doesn't mean you guys should give up. On the contrary, the time is now to show Bernie and all other flaky/shady builders that you aren't a bunch of sheep to be preyed upon. That some stuff is a bit more important than just cash in your pockets. 

[toughlove]

Get your shit together, guys. Fuck. 

[/toughlove]


----------



## SpaceDock

^ agreed, don't want this to end up like dar or Chris Woods.


----------



## paddy

I agree with Max and everyone else who basically concluded that he's a scammer. He's seen some people are beginning to take actions about getting their money back , so, he's decided to come out and steady the ship. 
And I wouldn't trust him even if he sent photos of boxed up guitar with shipping labels, etc (reference to what some of they guys are suggesting) in order for you to send your money. That can easily be staged.


Reflection: perhaps the excuse of insanity is the best way to get away with what he's done


----------



## SpaceDock

Ugg, I just saw this when I was googling Bernie, I took out the other people's names, but it looks like he's going to court on Monday. 


9. DATE: 05/13/13 8:30 DEPT: V14 Judge
----------------------------------------------------------------------
CASE #: SMC VS1300612
CATEGORY : Small Claims - >$1,5
CASE NAME: Guy -V- RICO
HRG: Small Claims Hearing
on 05/13/13 at: 8:30

PARTIES: FIRMS/ATTORNEYS

Plaintiff:
Some Guy


Defendant:
BERNIE RICO JR

Superior Court of Calif, County of San Bernardino


----------



## JPMike

^^

No more time for bullshit, really. We have to get our money back!


----------



## killertone

My lawyer is drafting a letter of demand on Monday. It will get sent to him by the end of day tomorrow. This is be the beginning of legal action if money is not refunded which is the only thing I am asking for in the letter. The only satisfaction for me in this situation is my money. Period. Will I get it? Damn sure gonna try. 

A group will unfortunately not work in this situation as I think everyone is better off trying on their own, honestly. Groups rely on everyone for action and I/we can't wait for others to get things done. I strongly suggest that everyone do the same thing. Talk to a lawyer and get things moving on your own.


----------



## MetalDaze

SpaceDock said:


> Ugg, I just saw this when I was googling Bernie, I took out the other people's names, but it looks like he's going to court on Monday.
> 
> 
> 9. DATE: 05/13/13 8:30 DEPT: V14 Judge
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> CASE #: SMC VS1300612
> CATEGORY : Small Claims - >$1,5
> CASE NAME: Guy -V- RICO
> HRG: Small Claims Hearing
> on 05/13/13 at: 8:30
> 
> PARTIES: FIRMS/ATTORNEYS
> 
> Plaintiff:
> Some Guy
> 
> 
> Defendant:
> BERNIE RICO JR
> 
> Superior Court of Calif, County of San Bernardino


 
That date matches the guy in this thread that had booked the court date but just received a full refund from his bank and he said that there's no reason to show for it now.


----------



## JPMike

I called my bank, they told me that a dispute can be done before 3 months have passed. I explained to them that this is not possible, cause the service/product I purchased takes at least 6 months to be made. 

So there are 2 solutions either I go to the dispute service or whatever it's called and explain them the situation and if I don't get through them, I have to contact the customer service and through there they will advise me what to do. I will go to my bank on Tuesday since I can't tomorrow but on the meantime, I am contacting my lawyer. 

I had enough of this crap. I keep messaging Bernie but he's not answering back. 

I guess it's the end of the line.


----------



## Jonathan20022

JPMike said:


> I called my bank, they told me that a dispute can be done before 3 months have passed. I explained to them that this is not possible, cause the service/product I purchased takes at least 6 months to be made.
> 
> So there are 2 solutions either I go to the dispute service or whatever it's called and explain them the situation and if I don't get through them, I have to contact the customer service and through there they will advise me what to do. I will go to my bank on Tuesday since I can't tomorrow but on the meantime, I am contacting my lawyer.
> 
> I had enough of this crap. I keep messaging Bernie but he's not answering back.
> 
> I guess it's the end of the line.



Don't give up! I hope you get your money in it's entirety back. I know for sure I wouldn't have the patience you've had this entire time man, good luck, seriously.


----------



## JPMike

Kenji20022 said:


> Don't give up! I hope you get your money in it's entirety back. I know for sure I wouldn't have the patience you've had this entire time man, good luck, seriously.



I won't!! 

I was honest and loyal to Bernie and all he did was lying and deceiving, fuck this really, I will get my money back no matter what!


----------



## rifftrauma

Anyone hear how or if the court hearing went?


----------



## Diggi

rifftrauma said:


> Anyone hear how or if the court hearing went?




As I understand it, since he got his money refunded he didn't pursue the court thing. There was really no point since he got the money he was suing for beforehand. 


I really think ya'll should make a list of People, Builds, Money Paid and Dates. Put it in a physical, document format...and/or post it here. 
That might get more folks working as a "collective" with a PLAN rather than as individuals who think all is lost. 

I see strength in numbers......


My $0.000000000666


----------



## clubshred

I do have some of the documentation of the first builds since I was helping BRJ out in the beginning and during the BFR. I can make an image of that public but I don't want to show everyone's personal info. It's basically a dump from Paypal that I put into a spreadsheet.


----------



## JPMike

Props to Bernie for finally giving an answer to my messages/texts, after 7 months.


----------



## Tesla

JPMike said:


> Props to Bernie for finally giving an answer to my messages/texts, after 7 months.



Props nothing. That just comes across like he's fishing for sympathy...and being very cheeky in the process.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Mike just didn't jam on the sarcasm button hard enough. I think the point is he's calling him out.

EDIT: On a serious note - I think it would be wise to start a thread where everyone posts the following details so we can verify just how much we're looking at in terms of product not delivered by Bernie.

1. Date of order
2. Date and amounts of payments made to Bernie
3. Last contact date with Bernie

The thread would be heavily moderated and only people with builds would be allowed to post in the section. Anyone just showing up to start crap or argue would receive a lengthy break from SS.org. If we can get enough people, we may be able to have it sent to Sticky-land. PM me only AND ONLY IF you would like to provide those kind of details andhave an outstanding situation with Bernie. This way we could have a strong consolidated area to really know where we are at in terms of what BRJ has been up to with his customers.


----------



## Watty

Speculum Speculorum said:


> EDIT: On a serious note - I think it would be wise to start a thread where everyone posts the following details so we can verify just how much we're looking at in terms of product not delivered by Bernie.
> 
> 1. Date of order
> 2. Date and amounts of payments made to Bernie
> 3. Last contact date with Bernie
> 
> The thread would be heavily moderated and only people with builds would be allowed to post in the section. Anyone just showing up to start crap or argue would receive a lengthy break from SS.org. If we can get enough people, we may be able to have it sent to Sticky-land. PM me only AND ONLY IF you would like to provide those kind of details andhave an outstanding situation with Bernie. This way we could have a strong consolidated area to really know where we are at in terms of what BRJ has been up to with his customers.



This. All the best of luck to you guys getting this resolved.


----------



## JP Universe

I bought a spot off Thrsher and I'm international so I'll just hang tight another couple years... I really feel for the guys that have invested thousands and thousands here


----------



## ovation22

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Mike just didn't jam on the sarcasm button hard enough. I think the point is he's calling him out.
> 
> EDIT: On a serious note - I think it would be wise to start a thread where everyone posts the following details so we can verify just how much we're looking at in terms of product not delivered by Bernie.
> 
> 1. Date of order
> 2. Date and amounts of payments made to Bernie
> 3. Last contact date with Bernie
> 
> The thread would be heavily moderated and only people with builds would be allowed to post in the section. Anyone just showing up to start crap or argue would receive a lengthy break from SS.org. If we can get enough people, we may be able to have it sent to Sticky-land. PM me only AND ONLY IF you would like to provide those kind of details andhave an outstanding situation with Bernie. This way we could have a strong consolidated area to really know where we are at in terms of what BRJ has been up to with his customers.




Already asked the mods if such a thread would be acceptable and got a reply from the admin. "No".


Edit: Actually, mine was more during the class action talk times and organizing such.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ovation22 said:


> Already asked the mods if such a thread would be acceptable and got a reply from the admin. "No".



I said "yes", so unless I get word from the higher up, go for it.


----------



## ovation22

In that case, I'll start it. Where should I post it and what should it be titled?


----------



## JPMike

I am up for the thread, I will provide spec sheets, I got and any email I can find with details of payments, etc. I have so many emails from Bernie (more from his associate at the time) that I have to do some good searching.


----------



## Tesla

An accompanying photo gallery could be helpful. Photos of hard copies and any progress photos Bernie has sent. Would be an easy layout to keep on track of everything because the thread could get cluttered.


----------



## Diggi

If he "is" back to work, is now a good time to make a visit and see what's up? 

I'm in for $50 to have someone drive out there....


----------



## rifftrauma




----------



## JPMike

I hope you get your guitar!! 

Come on guys, let's get together and get our money back!!


----------



## SpaceDock

Well holy shit, why aren't my guitars that far along, I've been waiting two years? Dammit Bernie.


----------



## craigny

rifftrauma said:


>


that looks pretty awesome....is he shipping it to you?? Whats the deal.....i've not posted here yet but have been reading....i hope all of you either get your builds or $.....just terrible some of the stories of how much people are out and how long the waits have been...mojo sent to all brothers!!


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> Well holy shit, why aren't my guitars that far along, I've been waiting two years? Dammit Bernie.



Cause our builds had defects and had to be rebuilt!! This is so BS!!!


----------



## C-PIG

i wouldnt want a guitar from a brj after all this and him being in a mental hospital for the last 3 months, i had a guitar from him 2 years ago and it was junk i can only imagine how these ones come out..... if the ever do get done.


----------



## rifftrauma

Not sure what's going to happen, he's still pretty off and on with communications and only emails me about once a week, pretty sure he isn't in the shop full time. I still haven't paid him any more than my initial deposit. I think if I do go through with the transaction I'll give him 30 days to get my guitar in hand and if it's not there I'll file with my CC company. If it does make it I'll have it professionally inspected and if there are any flaws I'll file with the CC company, return the guitar and be done with it. I think those are my two best options...that and I'm going to take out a large life insurance policy because MaxofMetal will probably woop my ass for going through with either of those .


----------



## JPMike

Max is our Dad!! Hehe!!

I seriously suggest to get the guitar in your hands first before you actually pay him... I don't trust the guy. I think he is mentally ill, he must suffer from some bipolarity or something. He needs help for sure or more like serious medication, cause he has a family to take care of and I feel bad for them having a "man" like him to watch for them. 

Shit, I know this might sound a bit mean, harsh or whatever but I just can't keep the "poison" in me not to leak out...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

OK guys - just wanted to toot back in here and say that the offer is still on the table. Not a soul has PM'ed me with information thus far, so I'm not sure anybody is serious about it or not, but the previous offer still remains.

I'm leaving tomorrow afternoon to go pick up a puppy my wife and I are rescuing to have trained to become a therapy dog. I've got a lot of prep work to do, so you guys won't hear from me until probably Sunday, at best.


----------



## ovation22

Speculum Speculorum said:


> OK guys - just wanted to toot back in here and say that the offer is still on the table. Not a soul has PM'ed me with information thus far, so I'm not sure anybody is serious about it or not, but the previous offer still remains.
> 
> I'm leaving tomorrow afternoon to go pick up a puppy my wife and I are rescuing to have trained to become a therapy dog. I've got a lot of prep work to do, so you guys won't hear from me until probably Sunday, at best.




Not sure how, but I sent mine to the wrong person first time. Resent.


----------



## SpaceDock

Speculum Speculorum said:


> OK guys - just wanted to toot back in here and say that the offer is still on the table. Not a soul has PM'ed me with information thus far, so I'm not sure anybody is serious about it or not, but the previous offer still remains.
> 
> I'm leaving tomorrow afternoon to go pick up a puppy my wife and I are rescuing to have trained to become a therapy dog. I've got a lot of prep work to do, so you guys won't hear from me until probably Sunday, at best.


 

 Are you a lawyer or something? What is the point of us giving you all of our information? What are you going to do with it?


----------



## Ben.Last

SpaceDock said:


> Are you a lawyer or something? What is the point of us giving you all of our information? What are you going to do with it?




"On a serious note - I think it would be wise to start a thread where everyone posts the following details so we can verify just how much we're looking at in terms of product not delivered by Bernie.

1. Date of order
2. Date and amounts of payments made to Bernie
3. Last contact date with Bernie

The thread would be heavily moderated and only people with builds would be allowed to post in the section. Anyone just showing up to start crap or argue would receive a lengthy break from SS.org. If we can get enough people, we may be able to have it sent to Sticky-land. PM me only AND ONLY IF you would like to provide those kind of details andhave an outstanding situation with Bernie. This way we could have a strong consolidated area to really know where we are at in terms of what BRJ has been up to with his customers."


----------



## SpaceDock

^ whats the point, you can figure out most of that from this thread.


----------



## Tesla

SpaceDock said:


> ^ whats the point, you can figure out most of that from this thread.



A cleaner, less cluttered thread for a start. Plus it might kick people in the ass and get a more proactive communal approach.


----------



## Qweklain

Bernie got back to me with pictures that I requested (mine was dine prior to his most recent absence) and it looks good in pictures. However, he stated that his Credit Card Service dropped him so he can only accept checks, money orders, direct deposits to his bank, and direct bank transfers.

So when/if he calls me as I request, the only way I am doing that is if he sends the guitar to me first and I can inspect it before sending him anything. With that method of payment there is no recovering if he flakes yet again.

This hole just seems to go deeper and deeper...


----------



## SpaceDock

I don't know that many are willing to put that much sensitive info up for all to see, especially since it doesn't have any sort of end goal beyond giving everyone a place to look at how much money he has, which we already know. 

Go ahead and start the thread, if you want to put your info on it maybe others will join. It just seems like more of the same to me and championed by those that have no stake in this. 

If someone wants to actually step up, get legal counsel or get a rep to go to Bernie; I am more than willing to give them my info. Otherwise it seems like a useless endeavor.


----------



## rifftrauma

I've talked to him and had the same thing arose. I won't go through with any of those options so I asked if he had a Paypal account I could use my CC through. Trying to work it that way, see what happens.


----------



## Rev2010

Oh god, he can't take credit cards.... I'd be VERY wary about that. I have to agree, send the guitars to the customers first is the only way he'd get anywhere with this. With his history of taking money and dropping all communication how stupid does he think people are? And what about those that already paid in full? Not like they're popping in here to say, "Happy happy joy joy I finally received my guitars!" which would at least give people at least a tiny degree of trust that maybe they actually will receive their guitar. I guarantee though that he will refuse to ship without full payment. 


Rev.


----------



## SpaceDock

Rev2010 said:


> And what about those that already paid in full?



This x1000, why doesn't he finish what has been paid for first? I think it is obvious he just wants money and has no concern for customers.


----------



## Rap Hat

It's not our fucking fault he has no money, but it sure as hell seems like it the way he treats people who are fully paid. 

I don't know what it is with some luthiers... It seems so many of them have a god damn white whale of sorts, the one (or in this case 100) builds they just cannot complete - customers will have paid, but the guitars or basses end up sitting in the builders shop for years while other builds get done. And then they get pissed at the customers when they try to figure out wtf, like "I'm really busy! Stop bothering me, I'll get to it!". And then when that customer complains on forums, the builder throws even more of a hissy fit and sometimes even drags up unrelated personal info.

And this is somehow supposed to inspire confidence in the fucking ERG community. Theres little choice when it comes to non-standard (and not major brand custom shop prices), and I think it's too easy for shitheads to prey on the community. Be it with terrible planning and fucked up behavior (Bernie), terrible builds overall (Rotor, Invictus), burning the people who've defended you against criticism (Sherman) and so on. And the wonderful thing is, there aren't always signs that so-and-so is going to turn to shit. Smaller builders recommended by everyone today could turn into the Rico Jr.'s of tomorrow.



Lol sorry, it's been a long day and I probably shouldn't have checked the thread.


----------



## MetalDaze

I heard from Bernie today too. He sent me some pics of my Diva that I had sent back to him because the original paint job didn't turn out exactly how I wanted.


----------



## mikernaut

So here's where I'm at with my situation. As some of you know I got a 7 String Jekyll back in January 2011 and it ended up getting the wrong inlays. Bernie agreed to redo the guitar and even try to get the paint job closer to road flare red which was what I had originally ordered. (ended up being more of a Ferrari red.)


Eventually got a few updates during the whole BFR ordeal and there was plenty of issues with the paint color. So at this point I said just paint it neon pink. Received some in-progess shots of the guitar painted before hardware in Nov. '12 So it was looking close to being ready.

Bernie during this rebuild eventually gave me a offer that was hard to refuse. I could keep the current wrong version if I sent him the hardshell case , a set of pups, return shipping cost and then I would receive the new version as well for my patience. ( so basically pretty close to being a 2 for the price of 1 deal)

Well that sounded really good to me. Bought some White BKP Nailbombs ($280) from Nick at the Axe Palace, put them in the BRJ G&G case I had and shipped it down to Bernie with a check for $80 to cover return shipping. That was in December and the last I heard from him ...then, well we all know the story from here of what happened to his production.

As far as I can recall he never cashed the check.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

I got the word today that my credit card company is siding with me regarding my dispute with BRJ Guitars. The downside is, they are allowing a 45 day period for BRJ to dispute the full refund, or actually ship me my guitar. Either way, this is the most progress that I've made in months regarding this shitty situation. I'm not sure if the overall outcome will be good or bad, but at least it is some sort of progress.


----------



## Rev2010

Ill-Gotten James said:


> I got the word today that my credit card company is siding with me regarding my dispute with BRJ Guitars.



That is excellent news, congrats  Were you paid in full or just a deposit?


Rev.


----------



## Pikka Bird

Ill-Gotten James said:


> The downside is, they are allowing a 45 day period for BRJ to dispute the full refund, or actually ship me my guitar.



Well, if he disputes it then he'll have to come up with some sort of actual explanation, so at least that's something. And if your get your guitar, that's alright, is it not? (unless it's one of the... less good ones)


----------



## Ben.Last

If you get the guitar and there are problems with it, notify your cc company immediately. He's not off the hook simply by getting a guitar to you. The goods have to be as expected.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Rev2010 said:


> That is excellent news, congrats  Were you paid in full or just a deposit?
> 
> 
> Rev.



Full refund. Now this does not mean shit at the moment, since they are allowing BRJ to rebuttal regarding the refund. They are allowing him 45 days to contact the CC company and make a statement, proving that he did not fail to meet our sales agreement. This means that after 45 days 1 of 4 things will happen.

I get a full refund (the preferred option at this point)

I get my guitar and its awesome

I get a guitar with flaws

BRJ finds a way to con the CC company and the process of trying to get my guitar, or money continues

I really hope that it is one of the first two options listed.


----------



## spawnsc

can someone pm me his email please the one i got gets fail on sending.


----------



## Hollowway

Ill-Gotten James said:


> Full refund. Now this does not mean shit at the moment, since they are allowing BRJ to rebuttal regarding the refund. They are allowing him 45 days to contact the CC company and make a statement, proving that he did not fail to meet our sales agreement. This means that after 45 days 1 of 4 things will happen.
> 
> I get a full refund (the preferred option at this point)
> 
> I get my guitar and its awesome
> 
> I get a guitar with flaws
> 
> BRJ finds a way to con the CC company and the process of trying to get my guitar, or money continues
> 
> I really hope that it is one of the first two options listed.



What CC company do you have? And how long ago did you make the payments? Typically CC companies are pretty strict about only doing chargebacks within the short window of the original sale.


----------



## Rap Hat

Hollowway said:


> What CC company do you have? And how long ago did you make the payments? Typically CC companies are pretty strict about only doing chargebacks within the short window of the original sale.



I'm curious about this too. That was the issue I ran into; because I waited too long on the stupid assumption that since Bernie was still putting out builds I'd get mine, by the time he stopped altogether it was well past the chargeback time and they told me to pound sand. It would be nice to know what banks are willing to go to bat like this. I was going to move to a local credit union anyways thanks to the good things I've heard, but someone could use that info.


----------



## peet

Glad to hear people are getting some response from Bernie. I've called and emailed today. Hopefully he'll be in touch. If anything I'd like to get the Bareknuckles I sent to him for my rebuild.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Hollowway said:


> What CC company do you have? And how long ago did you make the payments? Typically CC companies are pretty strict about only doing chargebacks within the short window of the original sale.



I have a Citi Bank CC. However, they only allow disputes up to 60 days after the charge is processed. I filed my dispute 10 months after the charge. I only contact BRJ through email and kept all the records. I was also able to prove from my email records, receipt, and terms/ conditions of sale, that BRJ did not follow our agreement. 

I'd be more than happy to shed more insight as it comes my way, but I do not have my hopes up at this point. All I can say is that this is progress, but it does not guarantee that I am going to wind up getting things the way I want them.


----------



## AwDeOh

Guy, sorry to divert the thread slightly, but based on the whole BRJ mess (and everyone's experience therein), which method of payment do you think protects the buyer the most in situations like this?


----------



## Walterson

AwDeOh said:


> Guy, sorry to divert the thread slightly, but based on the whole BRJ mess (and everyone's experience therein), which method of payment do you think protects the buyer the most in situations like this?



Cash on delivery, better: cash on pickup.


----------



## Ben.Last

Walterson said:


> Cash on delivery, better: cash on pickup.



Only if you are able to give the guitar an incredibly thorough examination before handing over the money. Otherwise, if you realize after a few hours that there's something seriously wrong, you're completely out of luck. Cash is NOT the best option.


----------



## AwDeOh

I was thinking similar. I guess what I'm asking is what payment method has the longest window for disputes if there is a problem?


----------



## PrestigeRS4

AwDeOh said:


> I was thinking similar. I guess what I'm asking is what payment method has the longest window for disputes if there is a problem?



I would say paypal. But they can be dicks to dispute claims with.


----------



## brutalwizard

Not a customer nevermind, I don't want banned.

Sorry mods


----------



## Diggi

I still can't get a response. 

If he's back, he should lay out what is going to happen, who's next in line, what is being finished, etc. 

I realize this is what others are already thinking, and what is "prudent".... I'm just hoping someone who has "his ear" is telling him something similar....


----------



## SpaceDock

^Seriously, I have messages him 6 times with no reply at all. Feel like I'm talking to Jesus.


----------



## JPMike

I haven't gotten any reply yet either!!

I am really getting furious of the whole situation!!


----------



## spawnsc

I've been furious and will continue to be until I get what I paid or get my money back. There is nothing I can do to get my money back, lawsuit would cost me more then the money I paid for the guitar. I come back to here now and then to check on progress and nothing has changed. Bernie sends a few photos out to some people to give them boners and then says send me money but sorry no credit cards since i've ....ed up and can't accept those any more. Anyone who sends him more money after all this is an idiot sorry but its true. JP i think you got more invested then any of us I hope you can figure out a way to get that money back.


----------



## peet

I also have not heard back.


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> I've been furious and will continue to be until I get what I paid or get my money back. There is nothing I can do to get my money back, lawsuit would cost me more then the money I paid for the guitar. I come back to here now and then to check on progress and nothing has changed. Bernie sends a few photos out to some people to give them boners and then says send me money but sorry no credit cards since i've ....ed up and can't accept those any more. Anyone who sends him more money after all this is an idiot sorry but its true. JP i think you got more invested then any of us I hope you can figure out a way to get that money back.



Bro, honestly, it doesn't matter if I invested more or less, it saddens me that all of us invested money on him and he is effin' lying to us and just ignores us like we are freaking 12 year olds that pulled a prank on him or whatever. It's freaking ridiculous!!!

As much as you guys feel me, I feel you too. 

Who is close enough to his shop?? I am willing to pay the gas for the trip there, to see what's going on.


----------



## axxessdenied

In my opinion... I think the time for waiting for your guitars is over. It's not worth it. He's proven he's just going to jerk people around again (as is going on now). Everyone should demand full refunds because of the lack of communication his business has provided. I think his customers have been MORE than patient by now. It's time for answers. If you don't get them. Go after your money. Screw his shady business practices!! This is not how you treat customers!

Edit: Also, the fact that he lost his rights to process credit cards isn't promising either. Just stipulating here, but I bet his business owes a lot of money. I bet his wood guy is owed a TON of cash on all those incomplete builds / re-builds.


----------



## ramses

Excuse my ignorance; but, how is it legal to ask for and receive full payment, stating that the guitar is ready to ship, and then not send anything? (something I have read multiple times while lurking this cautionary-tale thread)


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ramses said:


> Excuse my ignorance; but, how is it legal to ask for and receive full payment, stating that the guitar is ready to ship, and then not send anything? (something I have read multiple times while lurking this cautionary-tale thread)



It's not. Folks are just too........I'm not going to say it.......to do much, other than post here and talk to their cousin's son's girlfriend's friend who might know a thing or two about suing someone. 

Folks need to wake up and call the authorities. This isn't just a couple hundred bucks lost anymore, it's systematic fraud.


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's not. Folks are just too........I'm not going to say it.......to do much, other than post here and talk to their cousin's son's girlfriend's friend who might know a thing or two about suing someone.
> 
> Folks need to wake up and call the authorities. This isn't just a couple hundred bucks lost anymore, it's systematic fraud.



QFT

You guys aren't going to get your guitars and, at this point, it's unlikely you'll see any money unless lawsuits happen. He has had more than enough time to respond to everyone that has messaged him. If he just wrote a 2 line email to everyone saying "Yes, I am alive and I am functioning in my shop again," then that would take maybe 2 minutes from opening the email, reading it, typing it, and pressing send. 

He can't take credit cards. Honestly, at this point I would've given up and called my lawyer. There was no way in hell I would've sent him more money _before_, but _now_ that he can't even take credit cards? The laws of reality would have to warp and become something else entirely for me to give him any sort of currency.

Get out. Pull out of everything and run away. Max has said this so many times and many of you guys have agreed, which is encouraging. I realize that for people like JPMike that this is a considerable feat to be able to do anything legal, but you have to try. 

He is committing fraud. It is just that simple. There is no grey area at this point. He has promised a service, taken your money, and not provided the service and even avoided people entirely. This soap opera needs to reach its final act and just ....ing end.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

This is the reasoning behind the thread that I mentioned starting earlier. It would be good to consolidate into one thread all of the guitars owed, and the money paid to BRJ so that people can really get an idea of how much this has gotten out of control.

So far I have received one email with specs and payment information, and one tip that if it turns out to be true, could be a hell of a whopper. I'm still waiting for details on that one. Basically, as Max has said, people are too chicken to actually go out and do something about this. Like I said earlier in the thread (way back), you'd think everybody who bought a guitar from the man paid for it with crack money or something. If you've nothing to lose (because guess what - there are no guitars coming) you should pursue your money. Plain and simple.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

It's not just about seeking reparations, that window has closed to a certain degree for many. It's a bummer, but that's what inaction does. 

What needs to happen is legal recourse. 



> In the United States, common law recognizes nine elements constituting fraud:
> 
> -a representation of an existing fact;
> -its materiality;
> -its falsity;
> -the speaker's knowledge of its falsity;
> -the speaker's intent that it shall be acted upon by the plaintiff;
> -the plaintiff's ignorance of its falsity;
> -the plaintiff's reliance on the truth of the representation;
> -the plaintiff's right to rely upon it; and
> -consequent damages suffered by the plaintiff.
> 
> To establish a claim of fraud, most jurisdictions in the United States require that each element be pled with particularity and be proved with clear, cogent, and convincing evidence (very probable evidence). The measure of damages in fraud cases is computed using the "benefit of bargain" rule, which is the difference between the value of the property had it been as represented and its actual value. Special damages may be allowed if shown proximately caused by defendant's fraud and the damage amounts are proved with specificity.


----------



## Diggi

axxessdenied said:


> In my opinion... I think the time for waiting for your guitars is over. It's not worth it. He's proven he's just going to jerk people around again (as is going on now). Everyone should demand full refunds because of the lack of communication his business has provided. I think his customers have been MORE than patient by now. It's time for answers. If you don't get them. Go after your money. Screw his shady business practices!! This is not how you treat customers!
> 
> Edit: Also, the fact that he lost his rights to process credit cards isn't promising either. Just stipulating here, but I bet his business owes a lot of money. I bet his wood guy is owed a TON of cash on all those incomplete builds / re-builds.




I think if people here banded together and demanded answers from BRJ, they'd be more likely to get a response. I've read SO many posts stating "it'd cost me too much to hire a lawyer" (to get their money back) and wouldn't be "worth it". I'm of the opinion that most (NOT EVERYONE) are making this assumption without even a modicum of research into this possibility and simply don't want to call a lawyer, or 10 layers to see what they could do to recoup even a portion of their money. Talking about it on a forum might seem therapeutic, and it is for many, but this is not where BRJ will ultimately hear your voice. With a *chorus* of _demands_, you'll achieve more (IMO) than by speaking as individuals, and by all means, don't scream at HIM here. Get your name on a list, and someone FedEx it to his shop, signature required. 

I'm sensing a bit of apathy on the part of some when considering the recovery of their deposits (or full payments), and I DO have empathy for those who simply don't want more hassle in their lives. Humans are non-confrontational by nature and I have witnessed just that over the course of my life-time. There are exceptions indeed, but in most cases I think we as humans just want it "to be over" - one way or the other, and not DRAG out the suffering. 

But do yourself a favor, don't let people or circumstances dictate what is right or wrong in your lives - it is your responsibility to take what is yours in this world, be it with kindness or _with force_, if need be. If you don't make that effort, then the outcome is certain. If you do, there is a chance... and I believe what all people want is what is theirs, and to feel as though they didn't ALLOW someone to dictate, trample on or take advantage of their honesty, trust, loyalty and happiness. 


I say all of this knowing full-well that we have fists, for a reason. 


Start slingin' those arrows - 


Ps. 
I'm happy to help in any way I can... starting with paying someone to make a visit to Hesperia.


----------



## gerrawar

i've been waiting my guitar for almost 2 years! as jpmike, i live abroad 
but i wish i could visit hesperia to finally se what's going on with our orders!


----------



## HRC51

- I agree that a large group action is the best possible route.

- I have considered small claims court in California; however, you must be present and I live out of state.

- There are several mentions on the CA small claims court site talking about how difficult it will be to collect, even if you receive judgement: Collecting your judgment can be one of the most difficult parts of your small claims case. Remember, the court cannot collect the money for you.

It's not so easy to just say "take action". Also, is everyone giving advice waiting for a refund or a guitar? Or do you have personal experience with this scenario? Please include these details.

I am also in the unfortunate position of buying my spot from a member here and paying them through PP. So, I do not have a direct payment to BRJ. He has acknowledged the payment, sent pictures, and talked on the phone.

I would be more than happy to support a group action!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## HRC51

Not that it will make much difference, but does anyone have a recent contact phone or e-mail for BRJ?

The last phone # I have ends with -0776. Is this still current?


----------



## Lirtle

yes


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Well, I've read every page on this thread so far and I can not believe it is still actually going! It's like watching a mate in a relationship and seeing his misses shag everyone else bar him. I mean, how many months, and how many warning signs were needed at the end? Divorce should of happened 6 months ago (at least) and (80 pages ago) and it would of been far less messy than it is now!

I'm probably the luckiest customer (owed around $500 in parts), but I'm not going to sit here typing out *head butting brickwall* icons, and *hand over face* icons time and time again. I tried to get what was mine back, weighed up the cost involved and put it down to a lose and a lesson learned at least a year ago. I am now the proud owner of guitar with the wrong hardware, "handcrafted" by an absolute scumbag called Bernie Rico Jr. It feels worse than it looks, believe me.

I feel for those whom have full customs placed with the idiot, as the greed from both parties (BFR) has eventually led to them not receiving and/or getting a refund. You blokes are truly the victims in all of this, and as such, deserve to be looked after first and formost with whatever outcome arises.

The BFR was originally only a tiny run, no upgrades/spec swaps. That was it. Then "greed" kicked in on Bernies behalf with the numbers, then people jumped on it, and after that, the "greed" then came from a few here to start swapping specs and hardware etc, thinking that they will receive some type of "godlike" guitar for bugger all, in an incredible amount of time (90 days)! 1st signs of stupidity right there! First signs of Bernie's business brains failing at this point as well.

Thread starts to go on a downward spiral 30 odd pages in, and in true fashion here, has a few peaks on the way to 155 pages. 120 pages and nearly 2 years of info, and there were people still buying spots, gathering their 7th guitar etc, just adding to the agony of those who have had orders for 3+ years. 

Yet, with all the info and all the bullshit from Rico himself, nothing was done. Talk, talk, talk and if, if, if. And while all this was going on, Bernie obviously read all this, and kept planning his next lies with what he had read. 

"Bernie obviously has no computer skills". Wow, this one I couldn't buy. If the man can shoot a video on his phone for his Meshuggah client and post it on youtube, I'm willing to bet he knows a little about email! Then we had a few pages discussing how "non technical" Bernie is and how he "doesn't have time" to answer as he is busy building etc. Oh, and the "Gee his a good bloke" got about 50 pages worth of this thread. 

Then when shit really hit the fan, the best one was "I'd go down to the shop, but it's like a 2-3 hour drive"! WTF! These are some of the thoughts and posts that have fuelled Bernie to do what he has done, and that is why he has gotten away with it for so long. Always a step ahead, reading through some of the most gullible stuff I have read in a long time, and the end result?

It's harsh, but it's true. Bernie is not 100% to blame here. It's at least 80/20. With the greed from both sides, and most wanting a bargain, everyone has lost out. As I said before, I really feel for those guys with full customs. They have had to sit here and watch queue jumping, where's mine, NGDs etc. Now there are posts on "banding together". When will it ever stop? 

I think this thread should suspended, and stickied as a valuable learning resource on a finicky industry. We, as a whole have fed the lion, taught the lion, and undisciplined the lion. I am not familiar with American culture, but here in Australia, we would drive 3000kms to his shop if this shit was happening here! Most of these pages contain a cross breed of gullibleness and christian values, that when mixed together, let people like Bernie get away with what they are doing. 

This thread should be suspended for now for 3 months. That will give everyone here a big reality check and get those who wish to get off their backsides and work hard at a resolution the opportunity to do it by themselves without any more interruptions/glimmer of hope from those who are just kicking in here "hoping" that something will be done! Open her up again on a later date, and then see who was actually fair dinkum about getting a swift fast result.

Because, as it stands, Bernie is a chance at becoming a 2nd Jesus, and will rise from the dead after a fatal car crash or some other bullshit event and this thread will keep on enduring the same recycled garbage time and time again. 

Just remeber, he is not your "[email protected]$%ing mate",  he's not a "good bloke" and his guitars are not head and shoulders above every guitar out there! 

If we can take anything out of this mess it would be;
1. Respect the 1st initial build instructions.
2. If things don't go right, legal action, not 100 pages of hope/crap.
3. Unless you get christmas cards, invited to weddings/birthdays etc, they are not your friends, (nor is their family).
4. If it's too good to be true, it probably is.
5. If someone is going to serve you up a plate full of lies, please don't sit down to a 30 head banquet.
6. If there is going to be "group action", leave it to 3 with "smarts".
7. If you are 2-3 hours away from said shop - DRIVE THERE!
8. Can it on it's head A.S.A.P. 2 years of restless nights etc is no way worth it in the end.
9. Don't ever get caught up in the "I don't want to go to court over it, as it might upset him" syndrome.
..... and finally, look back through the whole thread, and ask yourself, (and be honest), with all the lies etc, how did I let it get to this, and (for some others), why am I still sending this bloke money? 

I really can not fathom how this has turned out. I show others this thread, and all of them come back saying, "I can't believe they believed all that as a whole". *Please do something about your individual circumstances now*.


----------



## spawnsc

Has anyone looked into doing this? FAQs About the FTC Refund Program | Consumer Information

If we all start here it might be a good start...

also I made a petition that will hopefully help http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/berniericojr/


----------



## MetalThrasher

I hate reading this thread. What slayer said seems right. I bought a slot for a Vixen that was part of the run almost one year ago. I like V's so shoot me. This build was completely standard no mods or anything! I even have pics and at the time seemed almost complete. The person I bought the slot from notified Bernie and I received an email about a week later verifying the slot I purchased was now in my name which it is. Then the email states that my guitar is almost done and balance is due. So like an idiot I pay the balance with my credit card. Mind you this was back in August 2012. WTF is going on? I realize I may be screwed on my deposit but I can try and recover the bulk of it fighting the charge that was back in Aug 2012?


----------



## TemjinStrife

For actual legal action, the statute of limitations for a contract for the sale of goods under UCC § 2-275 is four years, and some jurisdictions may allow more time for actions resulting from fraudulent contracts for the sale of goods (assuming you can prove fraud in the appropriate jurisdiction). That's the expensive route, but it is open.

I'm not sure if you'd be able to bring a collective action in a way that aggregates claims and allows individuals to pool money to save on attorney costs, though. It would take a bit of research first.


----------



## MetalThrasher

I hate to say this but..... those out there who have paid in full if we can all pull together and set up a pool aside in a very moderated topic somehow we might be able to do this. It just depends on the number of people? Is it 10 or 100?


----------



## Jonathan20022

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> Well, I've read every page on this thread so far and I can not believe it is still actually going! It's like watching a mate in a relationship and seeing his misses shag everyone else bar him. I mean, how many months, and how many warning signs were needed at the end? Divorce should of happened 6 months ago (at least) and (80 pages ago) and it would of been far less messy than it is now!...



Agreed completely, this thread should be locked temporarily so people will actually post in a new moderated thread with all the needed information. This isn't supposed to be therapeutic talking to others who aren't taking action, compile the list in a new thread and move forward is what I think needs to happen next.


----------



## JP Universe

Throwing out there a template.....

Guitars owed -
Money spent -
Deposit or full payment - 
Date of deposit or bought spot -
International -
Bought spot from someone else? - 
Legal action sought? - 
Contact received throughout build -


----------



## gerrawar

spawnsc said:


> Has anyone looked into doing this? FAQs About the FTC Refund Program | Consumer Information
> 
> If we all start here it might be a good start...
> 
> also I made a petition that will hopefully help Petition Refunds from Bernie Rico Jr.



sign it!


----------



## Tesla

gerrawar said:


> sign it!



Someone should post it on The BRJ Facebook too. (I would but I'm not on Facebook anymore)


----------



## Diggi

JP Universe said:


> Throwing out there a template.....
> 
> Guitars owed -
> Money spent -
> Deposit or full payment -
> Date of deposit or bought spot -
> International -
> Bought spot from someone else? -
> Legal action sought? -
> Contact received throughout build -





^ THIS

And, start a new thread detailing how the "action" will go down. AND, GET IN YOUR CAR AND MAKE A VISIT! Take 3 people, more......demand answers!!!


----------



## HRC51

spawnsc said:


> Has anyone looked into doing this? FAQs About the FTC Refund Program | Consumer Information



I filed a complaint with the FTC. Thanks for the suggestion.

I hope others will also file. Sadly, our complaints to the Better Business Bureau were not so productive.


----------



## Larrikin666

Guitars owed - 6
Money spent - $5,850 to Bernie. About $2400 additional buying spots. 
Deposit or full payment - Nothing paid in full
Date of deposit or bought spot - All over the map
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - 4 of them
Legal action sought? - No
Contact received throughout build - Constant until 1/13
Last known state - Two not started, two ready for assembly, two ready for finish sanding/buffing


----------



## JPMike

Guitars owed - 4
Money spent - $12,475
Deposit or full payment - Paid in Full 3 out of 4 builds. 1 build only deposit.
Date of deposit or bought spot - 1st Only Deposit: 8/6/2011, 2nd Full Payment: 8/26/2011, 3rd Full Payment: 10/21/2011, 4th Full Payment: 11/15/2011
International - Yes
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - On the talk with my lawyer.
Contact received throughout build - On and Off, Waiting to know what's going on since last contact on 5/21/2013, he decided to answer to my messages. Still hasn't replied to my request regarding what's going on and updates.


----------



## HRC51

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $2200
Deposit or full payment - Full
Date of deposit or bought spot - 2-13-2012
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - Yes, here
Legal action sought? - BBB, FTC
Contact received throughout build -email, phone, text Last Sept 2012


----------



## gerrawar

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - 4345 $
Deposit or full payment - full payment 
Date of deposit or bought spot - deposit on 28-sep-2011 / full payment on 06-apr-2012
International - yes
Bought spot from someone else? - no
Legal action sought? - 
Contact received throughout build - last contact from him was on the 22-gen-2013


----------



## Lirtle

Just thought I'd spread some good news. Not encouraging you guys to hold out any longer after what we've all been through but my guitar finally shipped.


----------



## xwestonx

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $2700
Deposit or full payment - full payment 
Date of deposit or bought spot - Initial deposit on 08/2012, Final payment two weeks later (08/15/2012)
International -No
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - BBB, sought action through my bank to no avail
Contact received throughout build - last contact from him was around Dec 15th 2012


----------



## ovation22

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $900
Deposit or full payment - deposit 
Date of deposit or bought spot - May 11, 2011, full custom
International - no
Bought spot from someone else? - no
Legal action sought? - BBB, FTC, CA AG, local PD
Contact received throughout build - Multiple initiated by me, replies with "in progress" (lies), June 2012 he admits to having lost my order and never started my build, BBB reply that I'll get my refund in November 2012, last reply from Bernie Jan 25, 2013 "I will have your refund with in two weeks" (another lie)
Last known state of build - never started


----------



## MetalThrasher

Guitars owed - One
Money spent - $1,500
Deposit or full payment - Full Payment
Date of deposit or bought spot - Bought spot back in July 2012 $600 then Bernie emailed me about two weeks after that confirming my spot and said guitar was almost ready and sent a payment link to pay balance of $900 which I did.
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - 
Legal action sought? - No
Contact received throughout build - Last contact was back in Jan 2013 and he did say that he was sick. No further contact afterwards. I would prefer not to pursue legal action but may consider it later down the road. I would just like to hear some honest answers for all of us as to what's going on in the shop with our guitars.


----------



## JP Universe

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $600
Deposit or full payment - deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot - 17/02/2012 bought spot 
International - Yes
Bought spot from someone else? - Bought Thrshers spot
Legal action sought? - No leg to stand on, All I can do is hope. Preparing to just eat the $600 unless there is a dramatic change in a few years time
Contact received throughout build - Actually pretty decent contact... As soon as Chris G requested full payment before I'd seen a pic of the finish being applied was on I became extremely wary. last contact 11/12/2012
Last known state of build - Out of the woodshop with control layout drilled out. Finish was going to be applied


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Lirtle said:


> Just thought I'd spread some good news. Not encouraging you guys to hold out any longer after what we've all been through but my guitar finally shipped.



I hope your guitar is flaw free dude. You've waited long enough for it and I wish for you the best.


----------



## JerichoCheng

Guitars owed -1 
Money spent - $2397+350(Shipping)
Deposit or full payment - Full payment
Date of deposit or bought spot -28/03/2012 bought spot from "IB-studjent"
International - YES
Bought spot from someone else? - Bought "IB-Studjent" spot
Legal action sought? - No
Contact received throughout build -last contact from ChrisG 11/12/2012, said the guitar is final assembly and ready in just under 2 weeks, and ask me pay for the balance (but i've full paid already since Mar 2012)


----------



## Hollowway

Guitars owed -1 
Money spent - $600
Deposit or full payment - Deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot -day of BFR sale
International - nope
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - BBB, FTC, etc.
Contact received throughout build -last contact from Bernie was a text last week. He asked if I sold the spot or if it were still mine. I said it was still mine, and I'd still like it, and asked when it would be shipped, but didn't get a reply back. As I last saw in the fall it just needed the hardware installed.


----------



## JaeSwift

Just a tip, you guys may want to add a "last known state of build" to the description


----------



## Adrian-XI

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $600
Deposit or full payment - Deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot - 09 April 2012, Bought spot
International - Yep
Bought spot from someone else? - Yes, from ticklemeasian
Legal action sought? - don't really have any avenue worthwhile of taking...
Contact received throughout build - None since initial takeover of the spot
Last known state of build - unknown


----------



## Rap Hat

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $1700
Deposit or full payment - Full Payment (Dec. 2011)
Date of deposit or bought spot - Sept. 2011, Bought spot
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - Yes, from JBCrazy
Legal action sought? - tried for chargeback through bank, gave all info to my family lawyer and waiting to hear back
Contact received throughout build - Bernie called me to confirm spot, had some emails confirming specs, lots of texts regarding build, had a couple of 2+ hour phone convos with Bernie talking about how he was doing his best, and one final text asking for final payment like 8 months after I paid in full.
Last known state of build - has only needed installation of hardware since Oct or Nov of 2011.


----------



## aiur55

Guitars owed -1 
Money spent - $600
Deposit or full payment - Deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot -day of BFR sale
International - Yes. Canada.
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - No
Contact received throughout build -He emailed me a picture of the sample BFR slant top and then told me the neck was warped. Last contact he asked what kind of control lay out I would like.
Last known state of build - needs hardware.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Guitars owed - 1 (Jekyll 7-string)
Money spent - $3060
Deposit or full payment - Full payment 
Date of deposit or bought spot - May 2, 2012
International - No (usa)
Legal action sought? - Police report filed for fraudulent activity, BBB contacted, Credit Card company notified and dispute process started.
Contact received throughout build - I only spoke with BRJ twice on the phone prior to purchasing a left over reserve build. After paying in full, all of my contact was via email. First excuse as to why my guitar was not finished was "Need to get cases." Second excuse was "fingerboard, or neck damage." Next excuse was "Sorry man, really busy, doing the best I can." Next contact was an email stating (1 from BRJ, then another from Chris G.) "Guitar is complete, you will have it before Christmas." Then the 4th excuse came via text in January when I asked why I did not receive my guitar before Christmas, "Sorry man, waiting for cases." The very last contact I had with the man was 1 week ago, when he emailed me in response to one of my emails. I was told that my guitar will be shipped within 2 weeks.


----------



## Khoi

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $2050
Deposit or full payment - Full Payment
Date of deposit or bought spot -Paid deposit on 11/27/2010, full payment on 1/9/12
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - Filed with the BBB
Contact received throughout build - Yes, last contact was 6/27/12.
Last known state - Needed a refinish


----------



## ras1988

Guitars owed -2
Money spent - $5150
Deposit or full payment - Full Payment
Date of deposit or bought spot -Fully paid first instrument 10/27/2011, deposit on second instrument 11/19/2011, full payment on second instrument on 1/8/12
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - Filed with the BBB
Contact received throughout build - Yes, last contact was 1/21/13.
Both instruments purchased as in-stock builds which carry a 90 days to completion timeline according to BRJ policy.
Last known state: one instrument needed to have the fretboard reworked, other had finish issues.


----------



## Larrikin666

Lirtle said:


> Just thought I'd spread some good news. Not encouraging you guys to hold out any longer after what we've all been through but my guitar finally shipped.



I think we'll all be eagerly waiting to see what happens when it arrives on Wednesday.


----------



## gerrawar

Larrikin666 said:


> I think we'll all be eagerly waiting to see what happens when it arrives on Wednesday.



yep, we all want to know the condition (sorry for my english) of the guitar.


----------



## spawnsc

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - 1100
Deposit or full payment - deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot - September 2011
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - BBB, FTC, spoke with my bank about getting money back no can do since its over a year now..
Contact received throughout build - Hardly none.
Last known state: In the wood shop..


----------



## AwDeOh

Just 17 responses so far and the total is already in excess of US$50,000.


----------



## MetalThrasher

AwDeOh said:


> Just 17 responses so far and the total is already in excess of US$50,000.


 
Give it another week or two. I'm sure all of us will be blown away with the total!


----------



## engage757

Just a thought, maybe someone should be asked to head this up. Keep a word document with everyone's info and username. Also, maybe everyone should send this person or edit their post to have their email address. It might be better if one or two people take the reins here and separate into US/Foreign client groups, and then have it all logged.


----------



## axxessdenied

engage757 said:


> Just a thought, maybe someone should be asked to head this up. Keep a word document with everyone's info and username. Also, maybe everyone should send this person or edit their post to have their email address. It might be better if one or two people take the reins here and separate into US/Foreign client groups, and then have it all logged.



Google Docs is a good choice since you can share the document with people and keep updating it.


----------



## SpaceDock

Guitars owed - 2
Money spent - $3740
Deposit or full payment - full payment on both
Date of deposit or bought spot - Original Black Friday deposit, bought second spot a year later, paid off original last January 
International -No
Bought spot from someone else? - One of them
Legal action sought? - BBB, FTC, 
Contact received throughout build - lots of contact, phone/email, last contact a few days ago said he'd call me but never did. Was told two weeks when I paid them off last year.


----------



## Khoi

Update for me:

Just got an e-mail from Bernie, out of the blue. I never contacted him or asked for an update ever since he "came back," but it was a fairly short e-mail and just told me that he will be working on my guitar now.

I just sent my reply and hope to receive a response, but I don't want my guitar anymore and will be looking for a refund instead.

I'll keep you guys updated on if he replies/what happens.


My suggestion is that you guys remain patient. I know that's really hard at this point, but it seems he's just going through and contacting people as their guitars come up for him to work on.


----------



## ovation22

Khoi said:


> Update for me:
> My suggestion is that you guys remain patient. I know that's really hard at this point, but it seems he's just going through and contacting people *looking for a sucker to give him more money.*




Fixed that for you.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Well, haven't posted in here in awhile since I really haven't had anything new to add, but here we go:

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $2127
Deposit or full payment - full payment
Date of deposit or bought spot - Bought spot from another user here in June 2011, final payment to BRJ in June 2012
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - Yes, Might-is-Right
Legal action sought? - FTC, etc.
Contact received throughout build - Occasional contact through e-mail, sometimes had to e-mail multiple times to get a response but always got one eventually. Phone call once last year about 3 months after final payment. Last heard from him in Dec. 2012 through e-mail after I kept bugging him for an update pic.
Last known state: Needed to be recleared, last pic I got showed that it had been done and just needed to be buffed and have hardware/electronics installed.


----------



## clubshred

Keep in mind that I still have the first Excel spreadsheet from the very first day(s) of the Black Friday Run. Upon quick glance of that, I have 57 payments processed for a total of $63,000 in total guitar prices. These were BASE prices and didn't include any mods that were added. This was also the time when they were supposed to be delivered within 90 days...

 

Sorry... I'll continue... the payments that were taken in were the initial $600 down payments. Some gave more, others a little less. That first 24-48 hours was about $32,000 and change. There's another spreadsheet that I can't seem to find anymore because I did suffer a hard-drive crash last year that had more of the details. I mentioned this before - if you guys want, I'll make an image of this document and post it here. However, it contains people's names, emails and personal messages that they entered into Paypal when they made this transaction. One good thing: I also captured the Paypal Transaction ID - that may help some of you.


----------



## Larrikin666

I think that's a good idea for a lot of people on here. Doesn't help me though since the guitar I bought and paid for initially was actually delivered.


----------



## JPMike

Anyone got any news??


----------



## xwestonx

JPMike said:


> Anyone got any news??



I wish... I've tried to get a hold of him every few days or so, even just to get acknowledgment that he is alive and breathing. No word back...shocker...


----------



## gerrawar

xwestonx said:


> I wish... I've tried to get a hold of him every few days or so, even just to get acknowledgment that he is alive and breathing. No word back...shocker...



me too, no word back


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, no word back on the ability to sticky a thread about all the people who've paid without delivery of product. I guess that's not happening.

And what ever happened to Lirtle? I'm assuming that either his guitar rocks balls, or it's a total pile of shit, because he never posted a NGD for the BRJ that was apparently being delivered.

Looks like BRJ's FB page has turned into a total fisting, with dudes trying to sell guitars on it, Scarry Garry just posting pics all over, and dudes talking about being drunk. I don't have a whole lot of hope for this situation. At all.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> And what ever happened to Lirtle? I'm assuming that either his guitar rocks balls, or it's a total pile of shit, because he never posted a NGD for the BRJ that was apparently being delivered.



It's not scheduled to be delivered until tomorrow according to the tracking info he posted. Yes, I signed up for tracking updates on a package that I didn't send and isn't coming to me. LOL.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, that explains that. I just got a puppy a week-and-a-half ago. I don't know my ass from a hole in the ground at the moment. HA! She's a sweety but my heavens a lot of work.


----------



## Larrikin666

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, that explains that. I just got a puppy a week-and-a-half ago. I don't know my ass from a hole in the ground at the moment. HA! She's a sweety but my heavens a lot of work.



That's probably the best thing for those of us who chose not to pursue the legal route. Distraction is great. I spent all my time with my family on the weekends instead of staring at this thread and wondering if I should consult my lawyer again.


----------



## Khoi

Haven't gotten a response from Bernie yet, so no update from me either. Sorry guys.


----------



## DarkSaga

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - $600
Deposit or full payment - deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot - 11/26/2010
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - No
Legal action sought? - Spoke with my credit card company and bank about getting money back but its been over 2 years now so.........
Contact received throughout build - 1 update pic.
Last known state: Ready for paint


----------



## killertone

I got an email from him 10 days or so ago. It said he would call in the next couple days. He didn't. Shocked.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I got the same thing


----------



## JPMike

I have been forcing him every 2 days to give me answers. He replies but still no actual answer.


----------



## xwestonx

Would anyone mind PMing me his email? I know it won't likely make a difference, but another way to try to get a hold of him wouldn't hurt.


----------



## Larrikin666

Well, Lirtle got something delivered to him today from Bernie according to the tracking number. We should hopefully see something today. *fingers crossed*


----------



## rifftrauma

Got a tracking # from Bernie this morning....hold onto your butts....


----------



## JPMike

I wanna see Lirtle's guitar too!! 

rifftrauma, let's hope everything will be good about your guitar.

I have been really stuck up on his ass to give me answers. I am not tolerating this shit anymore.


----------



## Qweklain

Well, here we go... I actually got my final payment back, and now I paid again. However, so everyone knows, he can accept PayPal, so there is protection for those who may need to send payment still/again.

I hope it is as good as the pics I got are and there are no issues!


----------



## JPMike

Qweklain said:


> Well, here we go... I actually got my final payment back, and now I paid again. However, so everyone knows, he can accept PayPal, so there is protection for those who may need to send payment still/again.
> 
> I hope it is as good as the pics I got are and there are no issues!



Can we see those pictures, man??


----------



## Locrian

Guitars owed - 1
Money spent - 750
Deposit or full payment - deposit
Date of deposit or bought spot - May 2011
International - No
Bought spot from someone else? - Yes
Legal action sought? - None
Contact received throughout build - 4-5 Phone calls, 10-12 emails.
Last known state: In the wood shop


----------



## rifftrauma

Qweklain said:


> Well, here we go... I actually got my final payment back, and now I paid again. However, so everyone knows, he can accept PayPal, so there is protection for those who may need to send payment still/again.
> 
> I hope it is as good as the pics I got are and there are no issues!




Same deal here, he accepted paypal and shot me the tracking # this morning, looks like hell might have froze over and well have a double BRJ NGD....


----------



## JPMike

rifftrauma said:


> Same deal here, he accepted paypal and shot me the tracking # this morning, looks like hell might have froze over and well have a double BRJ NGD....



Guys, I really hope you get what you paid for!!


----------



## SpaceDock

I think he should be taking care of those of us that already paid


----------



## Diggi

SpaceDock said:


> I think he should be taking care of those of us that already paid



FACK YES.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> I wanna see Lirtle's guitar too!!




YES


----------



## Rook

Chad you gotta let me know if you hear anything man, I'll let you know if he contacts me for whatever reason.

Lets see those pics!!!!


----------



## Lirtle

Hey guys,
I got the guitar delivered earlier today and wholeheartedly expected to receive a steaming piece of shit. To my surprise, what I got was a really good guitar. 

I'll put up a proper NGD with better pics tomorrow. Stay tuned.


----------



## JP Universe




----------



## Danukenator




----------



## Hollowway

Awesome! May the floodgates of guitars open widely! (or something like that). I was really worried that all that time in the shop with no temp control might have done damage. I guess it happened at a decent enough time of the year, weather-wise.


----------



## Larrikin666

Rook said:


> Chad you gotta let me know if you hear anything man, I'll let you know if he contacts me for whatever reason.




I will brother. I haven't pushed much yet since I had a new job I'm working to get right now.


----------



## JosephAOI

From the BRJ facebook:

"******UPDATE******
Okay Folks, Bernie is back at the shop and he is doing great!! 

He has a new mindset and focus and he is really making every effort to satisfy his current customers, this has been an unfortunate set of circumstances for everyone and as Terry stated previously, Bernie has been down sick for 3 months with no production for 5 months. This has not only impacted his business life but it has also put a large strain on his family life. 

The strength that Terry and the family have shown through this is phenomenal!

As you may have noticed the website is currently down but that is VERY temporary as there have been some technical difficulties because of the shut down but it will be back soon. In the mean time, we will continue to communicate through Facebook as best as possible.

Just to set a few minds at ease, the shop was monitored during the shutdown for climate control, theft and quality in order to ensure the products well being. 

The outpouring of support that has come from around the world on Facebook has been truly encouraging and inspiring and we appreciate it immensely...

BRJ Guitars asks that our customers and friends please be patient while things get back in order and please know Bernie is being extremely diligent towards making BRJ Guitars a much stronger foundation for the customers, the brand and most importantly his family. 

BRJ Guitars"

Hoping things get a lot better from here on and Bernie will continue to put out amazing guitars!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JosephAOI said:


> he is really making every effort to satisfy his current customers



Tell that to JPMike. 

Still doesn't have the stones to post himself still.


----------



## rifftrauma

Nice dude, lets hope we go 2 for 2 and they both don't suck!


----------



## Sytka

...., I don't have money right now !!!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

JosephAOI said:


> From the BRJ facebook:
> 
> "******UPDATE******
> Okay Folks, Bernie is back at the shop and he is doing great!!
> 
> He has a new mindset and focus and he is really making every effort to satisfy his current customers, this has been an unfortunate set of circumstances for everyone and as Terry stated previously, Bernie has been down sick for 3 months with no production for 5 months. This has not only impacted his business life but it has also put a large strain on his family life.
> 
> The strength that Terry and the family have shown through this is phenomenal!
> 
> As you may have noticed the website is currently down but that is VERY temporary as there have been some technical difficulties because of the shut down but it will be back soon. In the mean time, we will continue to communicate through Facebook as best as possible.
> 
> Just to set a few minds at ease, the shop was monitored during the shutdown for climate control, theft and quality in order to ensure the products well being.
> 
> The outpouring of support that has come from around the world on Facebook has been truly encouraging and inspiring and we appreciate it immensely...
> 
> BRJ Guitars asks that our customers and friends please be patient while things get back in order and please know Bernie is being extremely diligent towards making BRJ Guitars a much stronger foundation for the customers, the brand and most importantly his family.
> 
> BRJ Guitars"
> 
> Hoping things get a lot better from here on and Bernie will continue to put out amazing guitars!




And the beat goes on, and on, and on...

I hope that the bad is over, but seriously as stated before:

The guy puts out one guitar that's apparently not ....ed up, and everybody is like    

I'm happy for you, Lirtle. But pull yourselves together guys, lest you fall into another abysmal period of depression as a result of insane chicanery on Bernie's part.


----------



## Danukenator

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I'm happy for you, Lirtle. But pull yourselves together guys, lest you fall into another abysmal period of depression as a result of insane chicanery on Bernie's part.



I don't think anyone believes the people involved are free and clear. It's merely excitement because this is the first good thing to happen in a long time.


----------



## JPMike

First of all, I am so happy to see people are finally geting something after all this time. This might only be the start and a few more are coming on the way sure. 

Let's hope for the best!! 



MaxOfMetal said:


> Tell that to JPMike.
> 
> Still doesn't have the stones to post himself still.



Max, I am so close up his ass that he's responding to me whenever I text or email, he mentioned he will get back to me in the next couple of days. As himself told me, that he will be out of town until Friday due to the fact he's got doctor appointments. 

I also told him, that if my builds are not as near ready I will take any 7 strings or 8 strings, I fancy from the stock he got. He will check his stock and let me know what is available for me.

He has been claiming that he doesn't want our friendship to be done, so that he will do the best to get back to me. I am sure he's aware that I have paid quite a lot and of course I reminded him too. Hell, he owes me 4 guitars.

I won't lie I have my lawyers ready for any case something goes wrong.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> I also told him, that if my builds are not as near ready I will take any 7 strings or 8 strings, I fancy from the stock he got. He will check his stock and let me know what is available for me.
> 
> He has been claiming that he doesn't want our friendship to be done, so that he will do the best to get back to me. I am sure he's aware that I have paid quite a lot and of course I reminded him too. Hell, he owes me 4 guitars.



Please Mike, for my sake and yours, tell me you see the scam here. Please.


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> Please Mike, for my sake and yours, tell me you see the scam here. Please.



Honestly Max, I don't know what to believe. I see guitars being shipped and all, I feel like something will start happening, on the other hand I still feel he doesn't realise how serious things are and he can get in deep trouble. 

Ok, what I am supposed to do?? Fire at him with lawsuits, etc??


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> Honestly Max, I don't know what to believe. I see guitars being shipped and all, I feel like something will start happening, on the other hand I still feel he doesn't realise how serious things are and he can get in deep trouble.
> 
> Ok, what I am supposed to do?? Fire at him with lawsuits, etc??



I'll never order or tell you to do something, Mike. I'm not here to try and control you. It just pains me to see good folks be bent over a barrel and be taken advantage of. 

What in the past two years has made you believe anything from this point on will turn out in your favor. Bernie isn't an idiot, he's shown that he's smart enough to fleece you guys. It sucks to be the schmuck, but that's what he's turned you guys into: the suckers. It's a shitty feeling, I've been there way too often in life to not be able to see it as clear as day. He knows EXACTLY how serious things are, which is why he's now talking to you constantly, trying to stall you as long as humanly possible. 

You need to separate yourself from this. It's just not healthy.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead




----------



## Jonathan20022

^ Agreed man, it's unbelievably easy to send out a single guitar and get all your hopes up while you end up waiting even longer. You shouldn't settle for something different than what you wanted or ordered or having your funds back. If using the law is your last resort to getting some kind of repercussion is the only solution you should pursue it.

Worst case scenario is that he keeps playing you, and you're way out of the realm to get your cash back. That can happen, and there's countless luthiers you could be investing in.

By asking him for whatever he has available you're taking a HUGE risk. You'll either get flawless instruments that you'll love and be done with it or one of the following.
- Never get anything
- Get subpar instruments
- Get terrible instruments and an unreasonable rebuild expectancy

No one's forcing you to, but sitting and hoping in a hopeless situation is a terrible thing to do. Why are his highest paying customers getting shafted and a single guitar getting shipped out? It's not that it doesn't add up, it does but like Max said it looks just like a scam.


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> I'll never order or tell you to do something, Mike. I'm not here to try and control you. It just pains me to see good folks be bent over a barrel and be taken advantage of.
> 
> What in the past two years has made you believe anything from this point on will turn out in your favor. Bernie isn't an idiot, he's shown that he's smart enough to fleece you guys. It sucks to be the schmuck, but that's what he's turned you guys into: the suckers. It's a shitty feeling, I've been there way too often in life to not be able to see it as clear as day. He knows EXACTLY how serious things are, which is why he's now talking to you constantly, trying to stall you as long as humanly possible.
> 
> You need to separate yourself from this. It's just not healthy.



Max, I consider your sayings and advice wise enough to actually lead me to thoughts and actions. You got my respect and admiration, I have to acknowledge that and for all the cheesyness my words include, I am not ass licking or anything. I am just honest. 

I just want finally to get something out of this, I am sick of seeing my money going to waste. I am sure he knows how to play the game, but I know how to play the ....ing game too. I have quite a few aces up my sleeve, I will give him a few days to see if he can come up with something. If not I am letting hell break loose and get over with this. 

Call me stupid, naive, sentimental, whatever guy, I believe being good and actually doing good, you get granted back what you did. At least, that's how my family and I think. We always done good and always been ....ed over but somehow things always worked in our favour. 
Honestly, if I wasn't thinking about his family and how much trouble that would cause them, I would have already terminated this, more like or so collateral damage. 

It's the same question over and over, he delivered in the past, why the hell would he blow it up now? Why would he blow up his family's name?? We are going through a loop here. 

Ok, as I said, I will give it a bit more time, if things won't go the way are supposed to go for me and other people that are waiting, this getting resolved.


----------



## JPMike

Kenji20022 said:


> Why are his highest paying customers getting shafted and a single guitar getting shipped out? It's not that it doesn't add up, it does but like Max said it looks just like a scam.



Trust me , this is the question that has been floating in my head the last week.
I just don't get it...

P.S I am off to bed, really late here, will catch up with you guys in the morning. Take care.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JPMike said:


> Max, I consider your sayings and advice wise enough to actually lead me to thoughts and actions. You got my respect and admiration, I have to acknowledge that and for all the cheesyness my words include, I am not ass licking or anything. I am just honest.
> 
> I just want finally to get something out of this, I am sick of seeing my money going to waste. I am sure he knows how to play the game, but I know how to play the ....ing game too. I have quite a few aces up my sleeve, I will give him a few days to see if he can come up with something. If not I am letting hell break loose and get over with this.
> 
> Call me stupid, naive, sentimental, whatever guy, I believe being good and actually doing good, you get granted back what you did. At least, that's how my family and I think. We always done good and always been ....ed over but somehow things always worked in our favour.
> Honestly, if I wasn't thinking about his family and how much trouble that would cause them, I would have already terminated this, more like or so collateral damage.
> 
> It's the same question over and over, he delivered in the past, why the hell would he blow it up now? Why would he blow up his family's name?? We are going through a loop here.
> 
> Ok, as I said, I will give it a bit more time, if things won't go the way are supposed to go for me and other people that are waiting, this getting resolved.



You're too good of a person to have to deal with this, Mike. That is most definitely for sure.


----------



## MetalDaze

FWIW, I was talking to the owner of Xtreme Lefty Guitars today about placing a Jackson order and he told me that Bernie has contacted him too about some outstanding dealer orders.


----------



## AwDeOh

If I may make a suggestion..

He's the one that's broken the trust here.. to put it very ****ing lightly, not you guys. The trust is completely broken, and will be for a long time. If he's serious about getting himself out of this, moving forward and keeping the BRJ business from going down in flames along with the Rico name, then he needs to begin by shipping guitars to customers that have paid the entire amount, then start shipping to those who've paid a deposit, and allow them to pay him the remaining balance *when they have the guitar in their hands and are happy with the product.*

I know you'll all think that he simply won't do that, I don't either. But he ****ed you guys, not the other way around. He has the money and the product, so if he's not willing to do that, if he demands payment before shipping the guitar, then he's not interested in anything more than protecting his wallet. In that situation, I'd be calling a spade a spade, and taking that as all the proof you need that he's pulling the same old shit: "Pay me now, I'll send something later".

The onus is on him to prove that he's back, prove that he can be trusted in the future, and start making some major moves to rebuild that trust, something a lot more substantial than posting a vague "apology/update" through a 2nd party and sending out a guitar that he likely knows will attract a NGD thread here and generate hope to those with money invested.

I'm HOPING that he's serious about pulling himself out of this now, and if he shows enough good will to prove that, then he deserves support. Conversely, if he doesn't make an attempt to prove that he's not running the same old gag, then **** him and the horse he rode in on.

*TL;DR - DEMAND to have the guitar shipped to you and checked before investing any more cash. If he refuses to ship before full payment, then I think it's pretty obvious what's happening.*


----------



## JosephAOI

^While that sounds like an ideal scenario for the customers, it's simply not going to happen. Not because Bernie's completely unreliable, which, we don't know for sure that he isn't. He delivered before all of this BFR madness. I digress though. The point is, that's simply not how a business is run. No business will ship the product to you until it has been paid for. No person would do that unless they really REALLY trusted the receiving end.

What I hope will happen is that these guitars slowly but surely make their way out to their owners in excellent condition and that Bernie returns his business to how it was before all this. No one can really say for sure though, what will happen.


----------



## MetalDaze

Yeah, it's not like musicians are the most reliable people when it comes to paying their bills 

That's why I suggested an escrow service. But, the PayPal scenario could work too as long as people are diligent in only paying when the guitar is ready to ship and then filing the claim with the right documentation if Bernie doesn't produce the guitar.


----------



## Diggi

AwDeOh said:


> If I may make a suggestion..
> 
> He's the one that's broken the trust here.. to put it very ****ing lightly, not you guys. The trust is completely broken, and will be for a long time. If he's serious about getting himself out of this, moving forward and keeping the BRJ business from going down in flames along with the Rico name, then he needs to begin by shipping guitars to customers that have paid the entire amount, then start shipping to those who've paid a deposit, and allow them to pay him the remaining balance *when they have the guitar in their hands and are happy with the product.*
> 
> I know you'll all think that he simply won't do that, I don't either. But he ****ed you guys, not the other way around. He has the money and the product, so if he's not willing to do that, if he demands payment before shipping the guitar, then he's not interested in anything more than protecting his wallet. In that situation, I'd be calling a spade a spade, and taking that as all the proof you need that he's pulling the same old shit: "Pay me now, I'll send something later".
> 
> The onus is on him to prove that he's back, prove that he can be trusted in the future, and start making some major moves to rebuild that trust, something a lot more substantial than posting a vague "apology/update" through a 2nd party and sending out a guitar that he likely knows will attract a NGD thread here and generate hope to those with money invested.
> 
> I'm HOPING that he's serious about pulling himself out of this now, and if he shows enough good will to prove that, then he deserves support. Conversely, if he doesn't make an attempt to prove that he's not running the same old gag, then **** him and the horse he rode in on.
> 
> *TL;DR - DEMAND to have the guitar shipped to you and checked before investing any more cash. If he refuses to ship before full payment, then I think it's pretty obvious what's happening.*




^THIS^

Who can argue with this?


----------



## jacksonplayer

MetalDaze said:


> That's why I suggested an escrow service.



That's exactly what should happen.

However, I'm still smelling a scam here.


----------



## toiletstand

he accpets paypal now. why not agree on a tine limit for delivery and file a charge back if the guitar doesnt arrive on time


----------



## JPMike

MaxOfMetal said:


> You're too good of a person to have to deal with this, Mike. That is most definitely for sure.



I guess, I am used to people failing in terms of honestly, dignity, respect, willingness, friendship, and whatever values makes a human being, Max. 

It was my fault from the start getting too excited and getting orders together, I sold quite some gear.

Let's hope, it will turn out good for all of us.


----------



## HRC51

AwDeOh said:


> he needs to begin by shipping guitars to customers that have paid the entire amount, then start shipping to those who've paid a deposit



Yes!

Why can't Bernie look through his inventory and make a schedule/set an order and post the list? At least you would know where you stood in line.

I guess it makes more sense to him to complete 1 random guitar every 2 years...


----------



## AwDeOh

Agreed it won't happen, but it damned well should, or some other sincere offering. I read a quote a few days back from a small business owner:

_"The old-school model still really works: have passion for your product; care about your customers; have absolute integrity. That's still good business,"_


----------



## Ben.Last

Health care expenses, be they physical or mental, are not cheap. I'd be willing to bet that if he ceases to have all money come in he won't have money to finish many of the guitars that need to be finished.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I just saw a Mark Twain quote that is oh so fitting:

"It is easier to fool people than convince people that they have been fooled."


----------



## Diggi

Any NGD's on the newly received BRJ guitars?


----------



## SpaceDock

HRC51 said:


> Yes!
> 
> Why can't Bernie look through his inventory and make a schedule/set an order and post the list? At least you would know where you stood in line.
> 
> I guess it makes more sense to him to complete 1 random guitar every 2 years...


 
That's what Chris G tried, we all saw how well that went.


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> That's what Chris G tried, we all saw how well that went.



That doesn't necessarily mean it's the wrong way to approach this.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Keep in mind, the longer he strings you along, the closer it gets to a statute of limitations expiration.

When the SOL expires, you are generally SOL.*

Just a little something to think about.


(* = subject to a whole bunch of qualifiers, restrictions, exceptions, etc.)


----------



## JPMike

Bernie just told me to call him in 2 hours... Let's see what's up.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> Bernie just told me to call him in 2 hours... Let's see what's up.



He should be calling you, on HIS dime. 

Well, I hope you tell him you expect absolute perfection, no BS and free shipping for all the hassle.

KEEP US POSTED!!!!


----------



## JPMike

Diggi said:


> He should be calling you, on HIS dime.
> 
> Well, I hope you tell him you expect absolute perfection, no BS and free shipping for all the hassle.
> 
> KEEP US POSTED!!!!



Well, he should he has been avoiding to talk to me straight the last 1 and a half weeks. So I will tell him, exactly what I want and I won't let him try to make me feel bad or anything for his situation and demand what he owes me!!


----------



## xwestonx

Better news than I've gotten so far (no communication what so ever).

Update: I just got an email from Bernie. While it says nothing worthwhile it is the first time I've heard from him since mid December


----------



## spawnsc

hell i don't even have his new email address


----------



## rifftrauma

NGD tomorrow.....


----------



## JPMike

So "talked" with Bernie last night. 

After a couple of emails back and forth we finally arranged what time to call him, I called him 2 times the first one I couldn't hear him and then I called again. We talked for 2-3 min max, saying how much he is trying the past 5 months, he understands how everyone's frustrated about the situation, especially about my situation since, how hard I have been trying to reach him, that I have invested so much money and the usual same things over and over. 
When we were talking his phone had bad reception so the line went off. So I was calling back again and again but the automated voice mail system was coming up all the time. 
I sent him a few emails and messages asking what's up, why the line went off, my messages where not getting delivered to his phone since it was turned off or had no service I suppose. I tried calling around 40 times, still mailbox, I gave up since it was around 3am here and I had a long day so needed to sleep. 

Funny thing is, when I woke up like 2 hours ago, my messages were delivered but no word (email or text) from Bernie explaining why the phone went off or whatever. 
I guess, we will have a Round 2 tonight of trying to have some successful communication with Bernie and FINALLY get an update or something!! 

P.S Thank you, Bernie for actually confirming my frustration. I apologise for the whining guys. 




rifftrauma said:


> NGD tomorrow.....



Finally, Grats man!!!


----------



## ovation22

I don't understand why it's your responsibility to contact him. Shouldn't he be bending over backwards to contact you and make it right?

Seriously Mike, it's time for legal action.


----------



## foreright

ovation22 said:


> I don't understand why it's your responsibility to contact him. Shouldn't he be bending over backwards to contact you and make it right?
> 
> Seriously Mike, it's time for legal action.



This ^. You're in a foreign country to him. You're not going to show up on his doorstep. You're being overly reasonable here.

He has no reason to ship anything since you're continuously just willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and "one more try". Sorry to say you won't see anything - money or guitar - unless you sue his backside.

The above came out slightly harsher than I meant - nothing personal, but BRJ is using your good nature against you.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> P.S Thank you, Bernie for actually confirming my frustration. *I apologise for the whining guys. *





HUH???


----------



## Rev2010

Diggi said:


> HUH???



I think he's meaning to say to the forum that he's apologizing for whining, not that he's apologizing to Bernie for everyone on here complaining.

And Mike, you certainly don't need to apologize or call your frustration "whining". Let's be real here, you have the most invested, have the hardest time trying to collect either your instruments or money, and have been more patient than most. Don't get soft now just because you talked to Bernie for 3 minutes. I know you feel better having finally had some form of contact but your ordeal if faaar from over.


Rev.


----------



## Diggi

Rev2010 said:


> I think he's meaning to say to the forum that he's apologizing for whining, not that he's apologizing to Bernie for everyone on here complaining.
> 
> 
> Rev.



whew!


----------



## JPMike

So guys, just got off the phone with Bernie after 30 minutes of talking. 
He said the usual stuff of apologising, caring about us, how hard he is trying, how bad all this has been for him and his family, that he is trying to survive from shitstorm and you know the rest. 

Long story short, I told him not to make me go the lawsuit way and that I won't wait for any of my builds since they were still in the woodshop since all this started. So I told him, that I will take anything he has in stock that I like. He told me, that he knows how much money I have invested on him and he doesn't want to disappoint me in any way. He also told me, that until Friday I am going to have photos of guitars he has in stock and we will take it from there. 

Let's hope Bernie will deliver this time. God, I want this over...


----------



## SpaceDock

^ just don't choose any of my guitars, lol


----------



## WickedSymphony

Good luck with getting this resolved, Mike. Make sure you ask for a lot of good pictures of the ones you consider so you can check for any flaws as best as you can before they ship all the way overseas.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> So guys, just got off the phone with Bernie after 30 minutes of talking.
> He said the usual stuff of apologising, caring about us, how hard he is trying, how bad all this has been for him and his family, that he is trying to survive from shitstorm and you know the rest.
> 
> Long story short, I told him not to make me go the lawsuit way and that I won't wait for any of my builds since they were still in the woodshop since all this started. So I told him, that I will take anything he has in stock that I like. He told me, that he knows how much money I have invested on him and he doesn't want to disappoint me in any way. He also told me, that until Friday I am going to have photos of guitars he has in stock and we will take it from there.
> 
> Let's hope Bernie will deliver this time. God, I want this over...




Mike, I know you're a good person, period. But why, why would you tell him you'll take something else? He owes you the guitars YOU PURCHASED. You trusted him with your money, and now that he can work to make them, he should. 

And why, why do you have to wait three days to see pictures of possible guitars? Why not in an hour?

That said, I hope he doesn't give you mine 

I just hope you get a little (or a lot) more than you paid for, and EXACTLY what you want. 

Best wishes to you Mike,


----------



## Diggi

rifftrauma said:


> NGD tomorrow.....





tick, tick.... ha ha!


----------



## MrYakob

Diggi said:


> tick, tick.... ha ha!



Probably should have checked before posting that  Haha

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/239616-ngd-brj-hell-froze-over-content.html


----------



## Diggi

MrYakob said:


> Probably should have checked before posting that  Haha
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/239616-ngd-brj-hell-froze-over-content.html


----------



## HRC51

JPMike said:


> caring about us, how hard he is trying
> 
> Let's hope Bernie will deliver this time. God, I want this over...



So he cares enough to not respond or contact the rest of us?

Amen to the "over" part


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> ^ just don't choose any of my guitars, lol



I think, I won't. I told him I want mostly 2x 8 strings and 1x 7 string. Plus, a 7 string that was the first I ordered it's near completion, but somehow he never got my email to go on with it and deliver it.

I will most likely post the photos here before I go on with choosing.



WickedSymphony said:


> Good luck with getting this resolved, Mike. Make sure you ask for a lot of good pictures of the ones you consider so you can check for any flaws as best as you can before they ship all the way overseas.



I will, guys but I am going to ship them to a really good friend of mine in the US, who I trust him to check them for himself first. So it won't be a hassle to send them back and forth.



HRC51 said:


> So he cares enough to not respond or contact the rest of us?
> 
> Amen to the "over" part



As he told me, he goes one person at a time. I won't lie to you that the past 2 weeks, I have been texting/emailing him every ....ing day for over 3-4 messages until he responds. I was so close up his ass that he couldn't do anything but just respond. I don't want you to feel I get a better treatment in any way, if that's so please forgive me. I just went as persuasive as hell with him. 



Diggi said:


> Mike, I know you're a good person, period. But why, why would you tell him you'll take something else? He owes you the guitars YOU PURCHASED. You trusted him with your money, and now that he can work to make them, he should.
> 
> And why, why do you have to wait three days to see pictures of possible guitars? Why not in an hour?
> 
> That said, I hope he doesn't give you mine
> 
> I just hope you get a little (or a lot) more than you paid for, and EXACTLY what you want.
> 
> Best wishes to you Mike,



Well, I won't tell you if I am a good person or not. But I can tell you why I told him that I will take whatever he has in stock that I like, cause I am just SICK of waiting. I'd rather get something from him soon than wait for my guitars that won't be even coming out of the woodshop in the next 6 months. 2 of them had warped necks and cracked fretboards so had to be rebuilt. 
I guess the wait is that he can't take photos of any guitar he has in the shop, because some guitars are builds for certain people that might be one of your builds and he just can't give it to me. Also, he said he goes out of town for doctor appointments. Really I have no idea why would it take 3 days, but as long as I get what he told me in 3 days, so be it. If not, I don't even know what's going to happen!!

*I will make sure, I won't get any guitar that is made for someone else!! I will feel so bad, if I get one of yours guitars guys!! But, the best question for you guys would be, do you guys have /78 string builds?? Cause I mostly want 8 strings at the present time.*

*Last but not least, I wish I could do something to help you guys and I really mean it. By any means, I don't want you guys to feel I am special or favoured, as I said I was bombing him with emails and texts, always reminding him how we all feel about this and how valuable the money we all invested is for each one of us, no matter the number. I will keep you updated for anything new and of course I will post photos just to make sure I won't take your guitars.*


----------



## JP Universe

If you take another persons guitar won't it just get even more complicated?

You can take my 8 if I got my deposit back off Bernie


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

JPMike said:


> I think, I won't. I told him I want mostly 2x 8 strings and 1x 7 string. Plus, a 7 string that was the first I ordered it's near completion, but somehow he never got my email to go on with it and deliver it.
> 
> I will most likely post the photos here before I go on with choosing.
> 
> 
> Hey mike,
> 
> please excuse me if I understand that wrong, but I think it is absolutely NOT okay if you take a guitar from another guy
> 
> Don´t know how the others think about this, but I would be really really pissed off.
> 
> Don´t get me wrong, we´re all more or less in the same situation and I hope for everyone that it will work out somehow....
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> just red your last post a few seconds ago  so I´ll take everything back.


----------



## killertone

HRC51 said:


> So he cares enough to not respond or contact the rest of us?
> 
> Amen to the "over" part



Squeaky wheel gets the grease...I have emailed him a few times since he has been back in the shop and he has replied to all of them. Supposedly getting a call tonight.


----------



## rifftrauma

Talked to him tonight on the phone, he was in the shop working on another guitar. Hopefully we'll be seeing some more NGD's soon and I hope everyone's shit comes out 100%. 

...and for those who haven't seen it yet...

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/standard-guitars/239616-ngd-brj-hell-froze-over-content.html


----------



## JP Universe

After 10 NGD's within 1 year here I will then have hope


----------



## Qweklain

I got mine today and it is amazing. Only two small imperfections that really don't bother me.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...brj-hell-still-freezing-over.html#post3585071


----------



## killertone

Talked to him tonight on the phone as well.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

WHEN WILL WE STOP FEEDING THE MONSTER? F$%K!


----------



## JPMike

I think, what he means with in stock guitars is mostly guitars that are not owned by someone.


----------



## gerrawar

JPMike said:


> I think, what he means with in stock guitars is mostly guitars that are not owned by someone.



i swear


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> I think, what he means with in stock guitars is mostly guitars that are not owned by someone.



I just hope you get a little more than you paid for. And by the way, I don't think you've done ANYTHING to put yourself ahead of others. NOT AT ALL. 

So for me, I hope your guitars are his main focus right now. 

Peace!


----------



## JosephAOI

Bernie's best bet is to start sending out awesome guitars randomly. But to definitely include some of the dudes who have 3+ coming to them to tide them over for a bit. Honestly, that's probably what he is doing based on how it's been the last few days. Builds hype, let's people know that guitars are coming out again and keeps everyone anticipating theirs but keeps them at bay because they see others getting theirs, knowing theirs could come at any time. Smart dude to do it like that.


----------



## JPMike

JP Universe said:


> If you take another persons guitar won't it just get even more complicated?
> 
> You can take my 8 if I got my deposit back off Bernie





Diggi said:


> I just hope you get a little more than you paid for. And by the way, I don't think you've done ANYTHING to put yourself ahead of others. NOT AT ALL.
> 
> So for me, I hope your guitars are his main focus right now.
> 
> Peace!



I just want everyone including myself to get what they paid for, that's all. I am sure we all understand each other since we are in the same situation.



JosephAOI said:


> Bernie's best bet is to start sending out awesome guitars randomly. But to definitely include some of the dudes who have 3+ coming to them to tide them over for a bit. Honestly, that's probably what he is doing based on how it's been the last few days. Builds hype, let's people know that guitars are coming out again and keeps everyone anticipating theirs but keeps them at bay because they see others getting theirs, knowing theirs could come at any time. Smart dude to do it like that.



To be honest, I have no idea what's up with the woodshop. If it's running smoothly or not.


----------



## JosephAOI

To be honest, I think what's happening is that he's back, 100% at it again and is just trying to tide you guys over until he can actually finish the guitars. Like, he means well and is trying to get them all done, but it's not like you can finish a guitar a day and have them all be perfect. With some patience, I actually believe you'll all get your guitars and this mess will be completely behind us all.


----------



## JPMike

JosephAOI said:


> To be honest, I think what's happening is that he's back, 100% at it again and is just trying to tide you guys over until he can actually finish the guitars. Like, he means well and is trying to get them all done, but it's not like you can finish a guitar a day and have them all be perfect. With some patience, I actually believe you'll all get your guitars and this mess will be completely behind us all.



Amen, brother! Amen!!


----------



## paddy

JosephAOI said:


> Bernie's best bet is to start sending out awesome guitars randomly. But to definitely include some of the dudes who have 3+ coming to them to tide them over for a bit. Honestly, that's probably what he is doing based on how it's been the last few days. Builds hype, let's people know that guitars are coming out again and keeps everyone anticipating theirs but keeps them at bay because they see others getting theirs, knowing theirs could come at any time. Smart dude to do it like that.



Well, some look at it that way, and, some look at it this way:
Smart? Is it smart to ruin your business? Smart is the last word that comes to mind.
Is he building them again because he wants to or is he building them again because he sees dark clouds in the horizon?
And last but no least (as at least one other guy has already mentioned this), is he trying to buy time for himself?

I wonder.

So, he's building guitars again. Nothing special. Should've done it a long time ago.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

JosephAOI said:


> To be honest, I think what's happening is that he's back, 100% at it again and is just trying to tide you guys over until he can actually finish the guitars. Like, he means well and is trying to get them all done, but it's not like you can finish a guitar a day and have them all be perfect. With some patience, I actually believe you'll all get your guitars and this mess will be completely behind us all.



Why couldn't he be 100% before??

Yes he's trying his best to make amends and rebuild his reputation, but I don't think we should be welcoming him back with open arms until he gets past the backlog and into full STABLE production again


----------



## JosephAOI

Kiwimetal101 said:


> Why couldn't he be 100% before??
> 
> Yes he's trying his best to make amends and rebuild his reputation, but I don't think we should be welcoming him back with open arms until he gets past the backlog and into full STABLE production again



I never said we should be welcoming him back with open arms yet. Obviously, he's on a very short line with everyone but It's my belief that he is going to come through. And he couldn't be 100% before because he was sick. And just because he wasn't physically ill doesn't mean he wasn't more sick than people with the flu. Being sick always takes a toll, especially on his work.


----------



## Kiwimetal101

He was less than 100% a long time before he got sick man


----------



## Ben.Last

There's no smart or stupid when it comes to mental health problems. It's not like the guy chose to have a mental breakdown. I don't feel that that's meant that his customers shouldn't have and still shouldn't be pursuing whatever course they feel is appropriate. But I think the guy's actions now at least indicate that the story about him losing it were at least true to some extent. There's really no other logical reason for it.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

I'm glad to hear that Bernie is now feeling well enough to get back to work.


----------



## JosephAOI

Kiwimetal101 said:


> He was less than 100% a long time before he got sick man



When you're a guy like Bernie, who's passionate about his craft, you try to stay at it as long as you can. Even if you start to falter with it. As his mental health was declining, so was his work. The recent couple guitars he just put out are proof enough that both he and his guitars are back up to their original excellent standards.



Lern2swim said:


> There's no smart or stupid when it comes to mental health problems. It's not like the guy chose to have a mental breakdown. I don't feel that that's meant that his customers shouldn't have and still shouldn't be pursuing whatever course they feel is appropriate. But I think the guy's actions now at least indicate that the story about him losing it were at least true to some extent. There's really no other logical reason for it.



Repped. Exactly this.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I suppose that all the crap leading up to Bernie's hospitalization could have been a slow and steady drop-off into mental health issues. Perhaps over several years his mind was slowly deteriorating, and then all the self-imposed stress caused an eventual collapse...

However, he still screwed people around before the whole BFR deal, and we didn't find out about it until well into this whole friggin' mess. The guy still owes me $200 that I was supposed to get, half of which should have been used to fix his sorry-ass excuse for a setup that he did on my guitar before he sent it to me.

I hope that the guy can get people their guitars and that everybody gets what they paid for, because he owes it to his customers. But no matter what shining halo comes emerging out of the poo that is this last bit o' history... I won't give him any money, and I'll tell anybody who asks me about the guitar that they'd be better off slamming their pecker in a freezer door than ordering through him.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Kiwimetal101 said:


> Why couldn't he be 100% before??
> 
> Yes he's trying his best to make amends and rebuild his reputation, but I don't think we should be welcoming him back with open arms until he gets past the backlog and into full STABLE production again



Listen, as much as I hate to say it. Especially since one of my friends is stuck in this mess as well, absolutely nothing Bernie does will make anyone feel better until the current set of issues is stricken.

He puts out a guitar = People wonder where's theirs
He calls one person and we find out = Everyone wants a phone call
He gets on track and starts again = People wonder why he didn't do it sooner

There's no point to elongating the thread with things like this, sure it's a valid complaint but if Bernie's back in the shop he should be the one to hear your concerns. These updates give people hope, and people will start expecting things once again, a poor thing to do as history shows.


----------



## engage757

Agreed Kenji. Bernie needs to also understand that he isn't off the hook. As a BRJ customer, I love his instruments and the man himself, but this has become absurd. He needs to understand how close he is to MAJOR legal repercussions. He should be reminded of this by everyone who speaks to him in my opinion.


----------



## JPMike

engage757 said:


> He should be reminded of this by everyone who speaks to him in my opinion.



Trust me, I told him a hundred times, not to make me take legal action.


----------



## Diggi

Mike, 

Did he say anything about following a "list" or any comprehensive order or how he was deciding who's guitars to finish first?


----------



## JPMike

Diggi said:


> Mike,
> 
> Did he say anything about following a "list" or any comprehensive order or how he was deciding who's guitars to finish first?



Not really, but if I recall correctly he is finishing up the ones that are the easiest to be done. But, I promise next time I talk with him I'll ask him!


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

engage757 said:


> Agreed Kenji. Bernie needs to also understand that he isn't off the hook. As a BRJ customer, I love his instruments and the man himself, but this has become absurd. He needs to understand how close he is to MAJOR legal repercussions. He should be reminded of this by everyone who speaks to him in my opinion.



"Needs to also understand?" This is what he understands .......... "I just want to swap for something to the same value or better", "I think he's back", "My guitar arrived with a big dirty scratch in it, but at this point, I don't really care, I'm just glad I got something", "I'm chasing him hard, and am right on his arse, and I told him, if he doesn't deliver, Legal action could be pursued!", (and this gem) "I LOVE HIS INSTRUMENTS AND THE MAN HIMSELF!" Is it any wonder that this shit just rolls on? Apparently it now has "become absurd". *NEWS FLASH*, that was 18+ months ago!

"He needs to understand how close he is to MAJOR legal repercussions. He should be reminded of this by everyone who speaks to him in my opinion". No, he is not close and probably will never be, as all the "talk" has reverted to NO ACTION as a whole group and with the addition of a couple of NGD's with imperfections and scratches etc, has re-enforced this yet again, with 80% of us taking the bait, with posts of enduring love for the man and a gullible appetite for the brief glimpses of hope. We here now are REALLY becoming the problem, not Bernie!

So it's now down to swaps and imperfections on instruments. Can it get any lower? I think it can. It's obvious that there will be nothing done as a "group" and Bernie knows this, so sub standard guitars will be shipped in dribs and drabs and someone else will end up with another persons guitar in a swap deal that will go wrong, and the legal action ball will be talked about again and nothing done. Now we are starting to question "who should get theirs first", and "better not get my guitar in a swap". HE IS PLAYING YOU FOLKS, WAKE UP!

Oh well, sing it with me ........ (insert violins and tissues), "Que Sera Sera, whatever will be, will be" ..........


----------



## engage757

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> "Needs to also understand?" This is what he understands .......... "I just want to swap for something to the same value or better", "I think he's back", "My guitar arrived with a big dirty scratch in it, but at this point, I don't really care, I'm just glad I got something", "I'm chasing him hard, and am right on his arse, and I told him, if he doesn't deliver, Legal action could be pursued!", (and this gem) "I LOVE HIS INSTRUMENTS AND THE MAN HIMSELF!" Is it any wonder that this shit just rolls on? Apparently it now has "become absurd". *NEWS FLASH*, that was 18+ months ago!
> 
> "He needs to understand how close he is to MAJOR legal repercussions. He should be reminded of this by everyone who speaks to him in my opinion". No, he is not close and probably will never be, as all the "talk" has reverted to NO ACTION as a whole group and with the addition of a couple of NGD's with imperfections and scratches etc, has re-enforced this yet again, with 80% of us taking the bait, with posts of enduring love for the man and a gullible appetite for the brief glimpses of hope. We here now are REALLY becoming the problem, not Bernie!




Seriously man? You didn't read anything? That's exactly what I said, just in a more readable manner. ANYONE that talks to him needs to be on his ass and remind him their are SERIOUS repercussions, not only from them, but the talk of a class action lawsuit.


And yes, close. Some people have apparently already filed suit against him. The biggest mistake made here was waiting this long and expecting a group to do it. Sometimes problems don't fix themselves. TAKE HIM TO COURT AND STOP BITCHING ON A FORUM. DON'T wait.

STOP waiting for someone else to do it for you. Just do it, by yourself. It's obvious that there won't be a class action, but he can be warned of the possibilities. Just file. It takes less than an hour.


----------



## paddy

slayercannibalsuffohead, engage757
Amen brothers, Amen.
And I bet his mental or whatever excuse, was just an excuse. That's what my money is on anyways. 
I guess he's grinded people down so much that he manages to attract some sort of praise (out of desperation) now that he's showing signs of activity.


----------



## MetalThrasher

I'm just glad that some guitars are showing up! Anyone get a seven Vixen on the run? Mine has been totally paid for since Aug 2012 and from the look of the pics back in Aug it was almost ready. I hope I hear some news soon. Can someone PM Bernie's email.


----------



## mcsalty

as for the order of guitars being finished, i'd imagine he'd start by finishing the guitars that were closest to completion when he fell off the face of the earth before moving on to more incomplete builds.


----------



## AwDeOh

paddy said:


> I guess he's grinded people down so much that he manages to attract some sort of praise (out of desperation) now that he's showing signs of activity.



I saw a dog on TV the other night that was getting little doggy choc-treats for doing crazy tricks like backflips.

My dog gets a small handful of treats when he manages not to shit inside.


----------



## Hollowway

I understand the thinking for those who say that a lawsuit should take place, but I also know that there are people on here who have looked into it, and its not as easy as it seems. Here's why:
1) A small claims court case is possible, but anything beyond is going to cost a good deal of money because of the (likely) need to hire a lawyer. 
2) Small claims courts can't enforce payment - only render a judgement. Then you have to collect.
3) He is incorporated, so why he personally may be wealthy, you likely can't touch him. 
4) If you do file a small claims court case then you'll have to go to his local court house for the trial.
5) If you do to for a full on court case and hire a lawyer, you may get one who gets paid on a contingency basis, but you'd likely have to interview a few lawyers to find one that is in the area and willing to take the case for what might not amount to a lot of money.

So it's not a super easy thing to do from a time, risk, money standpoint, unfortunately. I wouldn't discourage anyone from doing it, but I also don't think it's fair to say that we all should be doing it. Those of us that have $400 to $600 tied up are least likely to benefit from flying there and taking a day off work in the hopes that he'd even show up to argue the case (as opposed to losing by default but not paying up). 
If anyone knows of anything legal that could be done that will have a high chance of payout or doesn't require a flight and car rental definitely post up so these guys with more money sunk in can consider it.


----------



## Ben.Last

paddy said:


> slayercannibalsuffohead, engage757
> Amen brothers, Amen.
> And I bet his mental or whatever excuse, was just an excuse. That's what my money is on anyways.



That makes absolutely zero ....ing sense, but, by all means, continue with the conspiracy theories.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Lern2swim said:


> That makes absolutely zero ....ing sense, but, by all means, continue with the conspiracy theories.



This is why this shitstorm keeps happening for f$%ks sake! Jed Simon wanted to sell his BRJs after telling me that Bernie "....ed up"! I doubt Jed would of wanted to sell them if Bernie had a "mental" condition! And as for Merrow and Co, they all know more than us, and all want to sell their BRJ's, you just don't do that if "poor old Bernie" was diagnosed with mental issues. Lie after lie for 18 months, what more proof do really need. Congratulations on keeping Bernie where he is. BERNIE HAS NO "MENTAL" ISSUES. IT"S THE ONES THAT STILL BELIEVE IN HIM THAT DO!


----------



## Ben.Last

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> This is why this shitstorm keeps happening for f$%ks sake! Jed Simon wanted to sell his BRJs after telling me that Bernie "....ed up"! I doubt Jed would of wanted to sell them if Bernie had a "mental" condition! And as for Merrow and Co, they all know more than us, and all want to sell their BRJ's, you just don't do that if "poor old Bernie" was diagnosed with mental issues. Lie after lie for 18 months, what more proof do really need. Congratulations on keeping Bernie where he is. BERNIE HAS NO "MENTAL" ISSUES. IT"S THE ONES THAT STILL BELIEVE IN HIM THAT DO!



You miss the point entirely.


----------



## Diggi

LITERALLY - if I didn't refund my customer's order within a certain period of time after cancelation, my local law enforcement would be so far up my ass, I'd need to 8 tubes of Preparation H and a Johnnie Cockran to stop the pain. 

Why in the HELL isn't his local law enforcement up his ass? If he committed FRAUD, and they KNEW it, they'd prosecute him themselves on behalf of the people of his county or city and those who've filed suit against him in that jurisdiction. Maybe the claim of mental illness prevents that from happening where his business is located, but I'd be on the phone asking the Hesperia police that question....

If you receive a guitar from him that is not 100% "right", send notification of such to him and demand a refund. Period. Don't stop your attempts to contact him. If YOU FAIL to do this, it's YOUR FAULT, not his.


----------



## Ben.Last

Diggi said:


> LITERALLY - if I didn't refund my customer's order within a certain period of time after cancelation, my local law enforcement would be so far up my ass, I'd need to 8 tubes of Preparation H and a Johnnie Cockran to stop the pain.
> 
> Why in the HELL isn't his local law enforcement up his ass? If he committed FRAUD, and they KNEW it, they'd prosecute him themselves on behalf of the people of his county or city and those who've filed suit against him in that jurisdiction. Maybe the claim of mental illness prevents that from happening where his business is located, but I'd be on the phone asking the Hesperia police that question.



Your profile doesn't say where you actually live, but I can almost guarantee that your local law enforcement wouldn't give two shits about something like this happening. even after an individual has won in small claims court, it is up to them to collect; they will receive zero help from law enforcement. 

That what some of you seem to be ignoring completely in your attacks on the people that are hoping this works out without legal action. If they go the legal action route, they're still likely to never see a single penny. So, it behooves them to try to work &#8220;something&#8220; out at this point. it was different when Bernie was completely MIA; there was no option B at that point. But he's actually sending out guitars and shiftily communicating now. Working with him is likely the best way for many to get asny kind of satisfactory result. legal action SHOULD be plan B now, because it would be a collosal pain in the ass and likely have no result.

But, by all means, continue to offer indignant advice that's not based in any reality.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, someone on here actually did talk to law enforcement down there, and they went out, knocked on the door, and when he didn't answer they called it a day. 

I'm not disparaging anyone saying that some action should be taken, but I'm honestly wondering what action_could_ be taken. It seems that filing with the BBB and other organizations did not get anywhere. Law enforcement did not get anywhere. No one has tried a small claims case, mainly because the feeling is that if it's gotten this far a judgement against Bernie is not likely going to result in actual payment. JPMike, et.al. are out of a lot of money and would like to see a guitar or money, but there just isn't an obvious solution that's the panacea we'd all like. And, while hindsight is 20/20, it's hard to say that everyone knew 2 years ago this would happen. Once you get out past that credit card/PP chargeback window it gets tough to do. I've been on the short end of a custom guitar deal more times than I'd care to mention, but how can you tell the good ones from the bad ones? I have a KxK that is 2 years in. I have a XEN and OAF that are 9 months in. I have a BRJ that is 2.5 years in. Go back 2 years, and how would we know that the XEN, OAF and KxK are nothing to worry about, but the BRJ would be a big deal? I sure am not going to charge back KxK, XEN, OAF just because a few months passed since I put my order in. I have no photos or any evidence that they will even build my guitars. But I completely trust them, I know the nature of the business, and it's a risk that I have to take to get the instrument I want. That's why I continually tell people they should ONLY order a custom if there is literally no production (or used) instrument that will meet their needs. You just can't eliminate the risk or predict the future, and once too much time has elapsed, there's not a whole heck of a lot you can do.


----------



## Diggi

Lern2swim said:


> Your profile doesn't say where you actually live, but I can almost guarantee that your local law enforcement wouldn't give two shits about something like this happening. even after an individual has won in small claims court, it is up to them to collect; they will receive zero help from law enforcement.



I agree with much of your follow up and we're on the same page about more of this than we disagree, but this ^ above, you're incorrect about. I'd be willing (right here and now) to bet you an NGD on it.

I know it, because I've seen it happen to other businesses in my city/ state (MN)


----------



## Ben.Last

Diggi said:


> I agree with much of your follow up and we're on the same page about more of this than we disagree, but this ^ above, you're incorrect about. I'd be willing (right here and now) to bet you an NGD on it.
> 
> I know it, because I've seen it happen to other businesses in my city/ state (MN)



I don't know exactly how we'd test that out. Haha


----------



## Hollowway

Diggi said:


> I agree with much of your follow up and we're on the same page about more of this than we disagree, but this ^ above, you're incorrect about. I'd be willing (right here and now) to bet you an NGD on it.
> 
> I know it, because I've seen it happen to other businesses in my city/ state (MN)



Meaning that if we call the cops they'll do something about it straight away or that if we win a small claims judgement then they'll get serious? You don't even need to bet me a NGD - if you're pretty sure that's good enough for me!


----------



## Ben.Last

Hollowway said:


> Meaning that if we call the cops they'll do something about it straight away or that if we win a small claims judgement then they'll get serious? You don't even need to bet me a NGD - if you're pretty sure that's good enough for me!



Regardless of how things may be in his state, in CA there is no assistance by law enforcement before or even after winning a small claims case in obtaining what you're owed.


----------



## Diggi

Hollowway said:


> Meaning that if we call the cops they'll do something about it straight away or that if we win a small claims judgement then they'll get serious? You don't even need to bet me a NGD - if you're pretty sure that's good enough for me!



I'm not "pretty sure" I _know_ it...I've seen it happen to businesses. If that is NOT the way it is with the Hesperia law enforcement, then there is something very seriously wrong. These parts of state and local government are arse-deep in fraud cases, especially internet fraud cases and they have a mandate to prosecute and wipe them out as best they can. If they are willing to go after someone who didn't ship a $100 Ebay item to someone that had already paid, then they'd better as hell be going after people who've asked for payment on something knowing there was a good chance they wouldn't be shipping it any time soon - except for A LOT MORE MONEY (at current estimates, perhaps more than $150,000.00 total- or more. 

I've said it before, if there was a "willing" *collective* ready to take this very huge problem to the Hesperia Police, and demand action - I think they'd get just that. 

On the other hand, this might result in never getting your shoddy-assed made, scratched up guitar or the money you've already doled out to someone who WOULDN'T even post an update to those waiting for word for three months. 

It's a cluster-.... all around.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Collect Your Judgment - small_claims_selfhelp


----------



## SpaceDock

For the record...

I called Hesperia Police a couple months ago before Bernie came back. In cases like this you need to file a small claims case in YOUR county and Bernie will have to appear in court, even in the case of mental illness.

After a judgement is served, YOU will have to collect the money unless YOU hire a claims company to extract it from him. 

Instead of arguing in this thread, just call the people who know, ie the police. 



I have talked to Bernie and I do not feel he is a scammer. If you want your money and don't want to talk with him, take him to court if you think that will help but please stop the arguing about bs and conjecture in here, it's killing me.


----------



## Hollowway

OK, fellas, since there's all the speculation, I just called the Hesperia Sherrif's office to get the straight poop. They told me if it's just me, it's a civil matter, and I would deal with it through the courts. If it's a group of people, then it's fraud, because he's making his business out of selling something and not shipping it. In that case, you file a report in your LOCAL police department, not the Hesperia one.

Now, I'm still personally wanting to just get my guitar and call it a day, so I don't know that I will be filing such a report (although, if I don't see it soon I may), but there's the info so we can stop hypothesizing.

EDIT:  by SpaceDock!


----------



## Hollowway

Work: The stuff that normally would occur, were you not posting in the BRJ Black Friday thread. 

Job: The thing you used to have before posting so much in the BRJ Black Friday thread.


----------



## WickedSymphony

So, Mike. Did you ever get pics of those guitars yesterday?


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> So, Mike. Did you ever get pics of those guitars yesterday?



Good question, well I didn't cause he forgot it was his daughter's graduation when he told me he would take photos on Friday. Also, today his wife have his car so he can't go to the shop. 

He told me, on Monday I am going to have photos. 

It's a believe it or not situation. Monday I guess


----------



## WickedSymphony

Well, that sucks. Guess we'll see on Monday.


----------



## patata

mikernaut said:


> Wicked Violet Jek
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How about a BRJ Tele?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I needz moar moneyz



HOLY SHIT 
H-O-L-Y S-H-I-T
GAS'o'meter is off the charts!


----------



## Diggi

patata said:


> HOLY SHIT
> H-O-L-Y S-H-I-T
> GAS'o'meter is off the charts!





??????


----------



## Khoi

patata said:


> HOLY SHIT
> H-O-L-Y S-H-I-T
> GAS'o'meter is off the charts!



if you still have GAS for a BRJ after all this, you are delusional.


----------



## Rev2010

Khoi said:


> if you still have GAS for a BRJ after all this, you are delusional.



Not like he said he's sending Bernie money straight away, just that he'd really like one of those guitars. 


Rev.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Khoi said:


> if you still have GAS for a BRJ after all this, you are delusional.



Not to mention the lower horn on that Tele is ....ing terrible.


----------



## JPMike

Bernie, just emailed me and said I am going to have photos of the in stock guitars later this afternoon. I guess it will be around 4-5am for me so I will be either sleeping or check them while in bed. 

As soon as I get free time, I will post the photos here to make sure that those are not owned by anyone in SSO.


----------



## patata

Am I not allowed to like these guitars because Bernie is irresponsible?
You guys are funny.


----------



## Pikka Bird

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Not to mention the lower horn on that Tele is ....ing terrible.


No it isn't... Because it doesn't exist. Those three are all the same guitar that's been photoshopped, just in case someone hadn't noticed. Now, imagine the upper bout a little further towards the headstock, and the horn a little stubbier... Yummy, IMO.


----------



## patata

Pikka Bird said:


> No it isn't... Because it doesn't exist. Those three are all the same guitar that's been photoshopped, just in case someone hadn't noticed. Now, imagine the upper bout a little further towards the headstock, and the horn a little stubbier... Yummy, IMO.



A BRJ Tele would look sick as fock.Bernie might be shitty but the guitars themselves look gorgeous.


----------



## Larrikin666

patata said:


> A BRJ Tele would look sick as fock.Bernie might be shitty but the guitars themselves look gorgeous.



He actually made two tele prototypes about 18 months ago. I had pictures of them. I might be able to dig through my phone and find them.


----------



## Pikka Bird

^Yeah, I saw some threads around here and other places that had the pictures, but they seem to have died. I'd love to see them again. Can't quite recall the look. Also, the new headstock prototypes elude me.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Larrikin666 said:


> He actually made two tele prototypes about 18 months ago. I had pictures of them. I might be able to dig through my phone and find them.


 
Were those the ones that were destroyed because the neck blanks were cut off-center?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ a lot of the older hesperians and jeckylls had a bit of extra wood on the upper horn side of the neck pocket. It was just part of his design from back then. 

He totally shredded those with a bandsaw though after people have him shit about them.


----------



## patata

SpaceDock said:


> He totally shredded those with a bandsaw though after people have him shit about them.



How to drive a luthier crazy 101


----------



## peet

Still waiting for a response from Bernie...thinking of just selling my jekyll...

Anyone wanna go down there and remake "Weekend at Bernie's" with me?


----------



## Larrikin666

MaxOfMetal said:


> Were those the ones that were destroyed because the neck blanks were cut off-center?





SpaceDock said:


> ^ a lot of the older hesperians and jeckylls had a bit of extra wood on the upper horn side of the neck pocket. It was just part of his design from back then.
> 
> He totally shredded those with a bandsaw though after people have him shit about them.



Yeah. He and I went back and forth a lot about what kinds of trends were on the rise around that time. He kept bring up the thing about a "modern tele", but I couldn't get behind it. I guess there's potential there. I wasn't dazzled by the ones he came up with. I really preferred the single cut prototype. There was also his version of an Explorer. Again, not a fan. I doubt any of those will see the light of day.


----------



## Diggi

peet said:


> Still waiting for a response from Bernie...thinking of just selling my jekyll...
> 
> Anyone wanna go down there and remake "Weekend at Bernie's" with me?



*I'd like to contribute $$ for your time and gas/ petrol. 
*


Who's in?


----------



## SpaceDock

I talked to Bernie last night, he is trying really hard but is well aware of the proplems. People just need to relax and chill a bit. This is what happens with small build shops if people get sick.


----------



## thepylestory

Any word JPMike?


----------



## JPMike

So guys, is any of these yours?? Bernie told me, these guitars are stock and don't belong to anyone, but I wanted to post them here to make sure.


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> So guys, is any of these yours?? Bernie told me, these guitars are stock and don't belong to anyone, but I wanted to post them here to make sure.




Not mine!


----------



## Ben.Last

They're all mine, actually. You should get them all and send them my way.


----------



## Tesla

Those finishes are pretty basic...are they close to the finishes you wanted? I know he can put out some gorgeous looking guitars but those don't seem like a very fitting replacement for, what I imagine would be quite beautiful custom jobs.


----------



## AwDeOh

Putting guitars on a concrete floor to photograph? Any wonder the last BRJ NGD guitar had a filthy scratch across the back.


----------



## Defrost

If these guitars are stock as Bernie says, why is he even building them when he's way behind on all custom orders? Regardless, I'd take the one in the second pic. It seems to have the nicest top.


----------



## Demiurge

Defrost said:


> If these guitars are stock as Bernie says, why is he even building them when he's way behind on all custom orders? Regardless, I'd take the one in the second pic. It seems to have the nicest top.



Yeah, a "stock in-progress" build seem like an oxymoron.


----------



## toiletstand

my understanding was that those might have been abandoned by people who put them on order when they changed specs or couldnt pay. could be wrong though!


----------



## paddy

How about a BRJ Tele?












Is it me or the double dots shouldn't be on the 23rd fret on these?


----------



## SpaceDock

They're photoshopped dude. But yeah half assed dots.


----------



## Rev2010

paddy said:


> How about a BRJ Tele?



These photos were posted one thread page back, just two days ago. And yeah, it's photoshopped.


Rev.


----------



## Larrikin666

JPMike said:


> So guys, is any of these yours?? Bernie told me, these guitars are stock and don't belong to anyone, but I wanted to post them here to make sure.




Hi Mike. I remember all of these guitars. These are from a year ago or so ago. They were built with pretty basic specs and random finishes were thrown on to see what caught everyone's eye. I think almost all of them we 26 3/16" scale. There were a few from that group that people bought, but I don't think these we them. These popped up whenever I was helping facilitate orders and communication, so you should be in the clear if one of them catches your eye.


----------



## JPMike

Larrikin666 said:


> Hi Mike. I remember all of these guitars. These are from a year ago or so ago. They were built with pretty basic specs and random finishes were thrown on to see what caught everyone's eye. I think almost all of them we 26 3/16" scale. There were a few from that group that people bought, but I don't think these we them. These popped up whenever I was helping facilitate orders and communication, so you should be in the clear if one of them catches your eye.



So should I go for a few of them??? or not worth it?? 

I like 2 of them. The yellow and the green-ish one.


----------



## Larrikin666

JPMike said:


> So should I go for a few of them??? or not worth it??
> 
> I like 2 of them. The yellow and the green-ish one.




I really dig the yellow as well. This is 100% your call though. How different are the specs from what you wanted originally? Here's the thread I had them listed in:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/dealers-group-buys/185401-rico-jr-direct-stock-thread.html

Looks like the pictures no longer show up. I think Bernie wanted like $3,300 each for these. Honestly, I'm struggling to remember the exact amount, but that at least gives you an idea of what these were worth in his mind at that time. 

You're in a worse place than me here, so I can't tell you what to do. I actually read through that thread and got a little lightheaded when I saw how many people I helped get facilitate transactions for a few people in that thread. It sucks that I had Bernie's back for a LONG time and vouched for him. I'm sure a few people give him money based on my word, and I can't help but feel guilty about that.


----------



## JPMike

Larrikin666 said:


> I really dig the yellow as well. This is 100% your call though. How different are the specs from what you wanted originally? Here's the thread I had them listed in:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/dealers-group-buys/185401-rico-jr-direct-stock-thread.html
> 
> Looks like the pictures no longer show up. I think Bernie wanted like $3,300 each for these. Honestly, I'm struggling to remember the exact amount, but that at least gives you an idea of what these were worth in his mind at that time.
> 
> You're in a worse place than me here, so I can't tell you what to do. I actually read through that thread and got a little lightheaded when I saw how many people I helped get facilitate transactions for a few people in that thread. It sucks that I had Bernie's back for a LONG time and vouched for him. I'm sure a few people give him money based on my word, and I can't help but feel guilty about that.



3.3k for each? he can't be serious. My specs were with bindings, MOP, Abalone inlays and logos, 5A quilts/flames, got quite a few options these don't have. 

Well, the yellow one is really nice and I will take it, it's really unique as far as the rest, not sure yet. I might get 2 that need paint and ask him to do some sick coloring on them.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

not mine


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> 3.3k for each? he can't be serious. My specs were with bindings, MOP, Abalone inlays and logos, 5A quilts/flames, got quite a few options these don't have.
> 
> Well, the yellow one is really nice and I will take it, it's really unique as far as the rest, not sure yet. I might get 2 that need paint and ask him to do some sick coloring on them.



Mike, with all due respect (truly), you really do deserve to get that you paid for. 

You waited this long, no sense in not waiting a little longer (IMO)

What did he say his timeline was to complete your custom builds?


----------



## MetalDaze

Web page is back up. There's not much to it at the moment, but it's another sign of him getting back to business.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Hey Mike. Be careful. Before your make a deal with Bernie check out my most recent post regarding BRJ. I purchased one of those guitars from the direct stock and am not thrilled with what arrived today.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/240390-about-f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html


----------



## JPMike

Diggi said:


> Mike, with all due respect (truly), you really do deserve to get that you paid for.
> 
> You waited this long, no sense in not waiting a little longer (IMO)
> 
> What did he say his timeline was to complete your custom builds?



There's explanation almost about everything in life, isn't it?? I totally agree with you, 100%, that I deserve and have to get what I paid for. But the things is, I am sick of waiting anymore and I am an impatient person by nature. If I didn't have other stuff to do or other guitars to buy while I wait for the BRJs, I would have freaked out. 

But I did some thinking when I read your post, that I actually asked Bernie what's up with my builds and what's their status, cause I might actually grab them if they are somewhere near to be done. 

Here's what happened, I have 4 builds going on, the first one that I have only paid the deposit for, is ready just needs hardware, when Bernie contacted me to finally get it, I told him I will get back to him in a few days to check my finance to see if it would be possible to grab it at the certain time. After a few days, I contacted him no answer back, he had disappeared again and when we talked last week he mentioned it and I told him that he wasn't responding. 

Then after I got the first order down and paid my deposit, after 2 weeks I immediately purchased a stock guitar with a few mods, the guitar was painted and finished but the neck warped, so it had to be discarded so Bernie offered me whatever model and specs I wanted, so that Jekyll 7 string started building and I think it's still being built. To be honest, I didn't like the outcome of the first choice so lucky me I got better specs and finish I wanted. It's paid in full.
This and the first order are the ones I want the most.

Then, I got some ideas regarding 2x6 strings I wanted to build so contacted BRJ and told them, what I wanted and paid in full. As time went by though, musical style changed regarding 6 string guitars and totally lost interest. I mainly play semi hollows and archtops on 6strings. The first of the 2 6 strings was ready, but somehow that had something wrong with the neck and had to be discarded too. :S

So long story short, I will replace the last two 6 strings with 2x stock 7s. If my replacement Jekyll 7 string is somewhere near to be done, I will wait for it. I will also grab my first order and I will certainly ask him not to even charge me the rest of the balance for it, since I think he should do so.



Ill-Gotten James said:


> Hey Mike. Be careful. Before your make a deal with Bernie check out my most recent post regarding BRJ. I purchased one of those guitars from the direct stock and am not thrilled with what arrived today.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/240390-about-f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html



Hey James, I saw your NGD thread so sad to see a beautiful guitar have these flaws, to be honest with you the scratch on the hipshot and the paint on the back wouldn't concern me that much as the shim of the neck. The top is amazing by the way. Well, I hope somehow BRJ will resolve that issue for you.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I am thinking the shims are from the necks twisting. 

It looks like the neck goes too thin at the heel for the design and he put the shims in to stabilize them. He probably didn't want to scrap the guitars and tried to fix them. I doubt it will be a problem, especially if you have a tech touch it up. Still lame though, for sure. 

I wouldn't care about the paint or the saddle either, but it's not up to par for modern expectations.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I am thinking the shims are from the necks twisting.
> 
> It looks like the neck goes too thin at the heel for the design and he put the shims in to stabilize them. He probably didn't want to scrap the guitars and tried to fix them. I doubt it will be a problem, especially if you have a tech touch it up. Still lame though, for sure.
> 
> I wouldn't care about the paint or the saddle either, but it's not up to par for modern expectations.



No, the shims are actually to lift the fretboard to correct for neck angle. I talked with Bernie about them when I got my custom. Mine had a particularly big shim because of the Kahler on there. He said that he does that on neck thrus to get the strings up high enough to get a bridge on there. He mentioned that other builders, like Carvin, do it a different way, and he was considering changing at some point, since people don't like the look of it. But all Rico Jrs. have that shim.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I heard that before too, but I wonder if its just a line. He *shouldnt* need to do that and it seems strange to me, oh well.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

The shims don't bother me. It's that the shim is separating from the neck and that there is a gap. For what I paid, I expected a little bit more.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I heard that before too, but I wonder if its just a line. He *shouldnt* need to do that and it seems strange to me, oh well.



Hollowway is correct. 

Though, you are correct, if every guitar is built from the ground up, a shim should not be required. Though, since the lion's share of BRJ guitars are ordered in bulk from their supplier/woodshop it's likely that they just make a ton of body/neck blocks and use the shims as needed when something requires a different bridge.

There's nothing structurally wrong with a *proper* shim, and it shouldn't have an effect on tone or the overall quality of the instrument. Once could argue though that is takes away a lot of the mystique of having an instrument made from the ground up for you. 

At least it's being recognized and discussed, opposed to the "drunken" side dots, which have zero excuse. 

Also, out of curiosity, did Bernie receive that big order of cases? I know that was the reason a few folks were given and it would seem they've materialized since a few guitars were shipped out.



Larrikin666 said:


> You're in a worse place than me here, so I can't tell you what to do. I actually read through that thread and got a little lightheaded when I saw how many people I helped get facilitate transactions for a few people in that thread. It sucks that I had Bernie's back for a LONG time and vouched for him. I'm sure a few people give him money based on my word, and I can't help but feel guilty about that.



Don't be hard on yourself, Chad. You meant only to help folks, unlike guys like MTech who had ulterior motives. 

You weren't the only one who was taken for a ride in this ordeal, so don't be down on yourself.


----------



## FrancescoFiligoi

If you want a very detailed story about my experience with Bernie, go ahead: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...ian-slant-824-pics-vid-long-story-inside.html


----------



## SDMFVan

I'm looking at Francesco's pictures (sorry to hear your story bro, by the way) and is it me or is the shim on his guitar significantly thicker on the treble side of the neck than the bass side? Wouldn't that indicate correction for more than just neck angle?


----------



## peet

Diggi said:


> *I'd like to contribute $$ for your time and gas/ petrol.
> *
> 
> 
> Who's in?



It would take a lot of people to pool in for gas...I live on the other side of the continent...East Coat Canada...saving up my airmiles as we speak...but I would totally do this


----------



## peet

I just want my pickups back...


----------



## Lorcan Ward

JPMike said:


>



I really like this one. The red stain and ^ pattern in the grain after the bridge makes it look like a Koa top.


----------



## Diggi

What other luthier uses shims?


----------



## engage757

JPMike said:


> ]




I have seen this one somewhere before, this exact picture I am pretty sure. Anyone else recognize this?


----------



## WickedSymphony

engage757 said:


> I have seen this one somewhere before, this exact picture I am pretty sure. Anyone else recognize this?



I'm pretty sure there was an extremely similar one to this where the back had that natural strip down the middle with just the wings painted black. This one looks like the whole back is painted. Could be wrong, but that's what I remember it being.


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> I'm pretty sure there was an extremely similar one to this where the back had that natural strip down the middle with just the wings painted black. This one looks like the whole back is painted. Could be wrong, but that's what I remember it being.


----------



## SpaceDock

The other one like this had the abalone stripe down the middle, iirc.


----------



## pathogenicmetal666

> There's nothing structurally wrong with a *proper* shim, and it shouldn't have an effect on tone or the overall quality of the instrument. Once could argue though that is takes away a lot of the mystique of having an instrument made from the ground up for you.





> What other luthier uses shims?



Luthiers generally build guitars from scratch, and do not have to shim this way.

I'm assuming the fretboard is taken off. The shim is added. The neck is leveled and the freboard is reglued? Just adding a shim would create a curve in the neck, and make it impossible to get a good setup.


----------



## demonx

If you guys are referring to the shim under the fingerboard/body join - its part of the neckthru build process.

There is nothing dodgy about it at all. It's simply the neck angle begins further towards the 24th fret, meaning there is a wedge needed above the body, (like how a violin etc has the fingerboard at an angle over the body but just unfilled) which puts the neck in a better position for playing, whereas the more modern (easier method) is not to use a shim and have the neck angle begin in a lower fret position, no shim needed, but then the neck pulls back into the body more.

I've built both ways. It's just a different build style, not anyone being dodgy. It's not something that "added later on", it's pre planned and is part of the neck construction.

USA BC Richs, Moser guitars and many, many other handmade guitars all are built this way

You will not see it on guitars that are mass produced, as when there is a rise on the surface of the guitar (like that angle shim) the guitar cannot be thrown through a thicknesser or drum sander and other fast levelling methods, it all has to be hand planed, hand sanded etc. It is a method used by old school hand crafted luthiers.


----------



## JPMike

So guys, I had a 35 minute talk with Bernie last night. We finally went on with the final deal and here it goes. 

I will take two stock guitars both Hesperians, the Yellow one (which to be honest looks really unique, like a pissed off wasp or something) and decided to take the one natural and paint it blue blackburst (late 90s petrucci Ibby came to mind, lol). The thing is all the stock guitars are the exact same specs, at least I get something in my hands, I will use them as pickup test guitars. 
The other two will be the builds I originally ordered the two 7 strings. My first build, which was the first guitar I ordered a Natural Oil Finished 7 Jekyll and the replacement of the failed build of the second guitar I ordered, which will be made last and will be the specs I wanted. 

Here are some photos of the first build and the second build I ordered which failed and to be honest I didn't like the outcome.


----------



## peet

You are a brave man JPMike


----------



## AwDeOh

The neck pickup cavity in the plum stained one concerns me :/


----------



## JPMike

peet said:


> You are a brave man JPMike



Thank you, sir!



AwDeOh said:


> The neck pickup cavity in the plum stained one concerns me :/



That's not the guitar I am getting, this is the build that I firstly purchased and had a warped neck, so I was offered a build of whatever specs I wanted. I just posted pictures of you to see.


----------



## peet

I just sold my Lefty Jekyll on ebay in less than 12 hours.... if anyone cares. Now...to get my Bare knuckle War Pigs from Bernie...


----------



## spawnsc

JP I hope everything works out in the end for you and that you're what with what he provides you.


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> JP I hope everything works out in the end for you and that you're what with what he provides you.



Let's hope he will delivery everything we agreed on.


----------



## patata

JPMike said:


>



Sexy.Is it 27''?


----------



## JPMike

patata said:


> Sexy.Is it 27''?



26" 1/3.


----------



## Jexey

For what it's worth I got an email today saying the cases were in. This means my guitar is ready to ship. More to come...


----------



## Tesla

Jexey said:


> For what it's worth I got an email today saying the cases were in. This means my guitar is ready to ship. More to come...



Good luck! Fingers crossed for you buddy.


----------



## Jlang

From what it seems , Bernie is actually *trying* to redeem himself in some way. Let's see how that works out....


----------



## SpaceDock

Any updates? It's been quiet for a week or so. Anyone get anything shipped out?


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> Any updates? It's been quiet for a week or so. Anyone get anything shipped out?



My 2 guitars are being painted and my oiled Jekyll will be ready in 2 weeks.


----------



## Jexey

Quick email exchange today, i'm going to talk to him on Monday about finalizing payment and shipping. Bernie's alive and kicking over there.


----------



## tommychains

Jlang said:


> From what it seems , Bernie is actually *trying* to redeem himself in some way. Let's see how that works out....



$10 say he's forced to close once he finishes the builds.


----------



## Hollowway

tommychains said:


> $10 say he's forced to close once he finishes the builds.



I think if that were the case (or if he thought that were possible) he'd just hang it up now and declare bankruptcy. My guess is that he wants to get out from under all of this and get his business/reputation back, which will likely improve his mood and outlook. Declaring BK or closing the business would be akin to admitting failure, and I would think that wouldn't do much for his mental health.


----------



## noob_pwn

can someone please PM me with their contact details that they were using to keep in touch? I need to find out whats going on with my build


----------



## paddy

In order to redeem himself, he needs to go to the nearest church and say: bless me father for I've sinned.
And the lord might just redeem him.


----------



## Khoi

JPMike said:


> My 2 guitars are being painted and my oiled Jekyll will be ready in 2 weeks.



I've heard that before.


----------



## Diggi

^ this^


----------



## SpaceDock




----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

paddy said:


> In order to redeem himself, he needs to go to the nearest church and say: bless me father for I've sinned.
> And the lord might just redeem him.



not even the power of God himself could redeem him.


----------



## JPMike

Haha, we all have heard it before!!! 

Let's hope he will do things correctly this time.


----------



## ikarus

Does anyone know where I can find pictures of that faded blue Hesperian (or Jekyll)?
I am sure I saw them in this thread, but I have no idea where.


----------



## Jexey

ikarus said:


> Does anyone know where I can find pictures of that faded blue Hesperian (or Jekyll)?
> I am sure I saw them in this thread, but I have no idea where.


 
I have one of them. However, mine is quite a bit lighter than the other one I saw. I _should_ be taking delivery on it soon.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ Thanks for reminding me why I keep waiting, that looks great!


----------



## Jexey

SpaceDock said:


> ^ Thanks for reminding me why I keep waiting, that looks great!


 
Thanks man, I really appreciate it. I'm nervous as hell; the finish was kind of a knee jerk thing I decided on so I want to see how it looks in person.

Also, it's the only Rico piezo-equipped guitar I've ever seen, so I'm interested in seeing how that goes.


----------



## JPMike

More guitars are getting out there, that's totally encouraging!

My Oiled Jekyll will be ready by next week, waiting on a 3-way blade switch to arrive on Monday.


----------



## Hollowway

Bernie texted me right after he got back into the shop and asked if I still had my spot or if I sold it. I said I still had it, and texted him a couple of times after when it would be done. As of last fall it just needed hardware. I'm hoping mine is one that goes out soon.


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> Bernie texted me right after he got back into the shop and asked if I still had my spot or if I sold it. I said I still had it, and texted him a couple of times after when it would be done. As of last fall it just needed hardware. I'm hoping mine is one that goes out soon.



I wish you get your guitar soon!!


----------



## gplayer51

Im in LA and I'm picking my guitar up Monday!!!


----------



## JPMike

I got this today, now I am waiting for the 3 way blade switch to arrive on Monday and get the guitar shipped. 1 out of 4, check.


----------



## asher

Gorgeous guitar, though those fret markers make very little sense to me given the angle of that photo


----------



## decoy205

JPMike said:


> I got this today, now I am waiting for the 3 way blade switch to arrive on Monday and get the guitar shipped. 1 out of 4, check.



I like the looks of that one man. the contrast is awesome. I hope there's no real flaws with it. I also like the straight neck pup. I hope you get them soon!


----------



## JPMike

Thanks guys, this guitar is being ready since last year. I don't think there will be any flaws.


----------



## MetalDaze

Yeah, previous pic shows the side markers on both sides. At first, I thought it was on the wrong side too 

Looks great!


----------



## Michael T

Looks good Mike. Glad to see you'll be getting something soon.


----------



## ikarus

what about the fret markers beeing on the wrong side?


----------



## Tyson

Hey guys, is there a reliable way of getting in touch with Bernie now that he's back in action? I don't even necessarily need a response from him immediately, but I'd just like to hear an update on the guitar I haven't seen since last August.


----------



## Rev2010

ikarus said:


> what about the fret markers beeing on the wrong side?



They're not on the wrong side, they run down both edges of the neck. One page back you can see it:












Smoking hot idea too I must say!  I'm guessing white binding cuts mixed in with the black binding?


Rev.


----------



## craigny

JPMike said:


> I got this today, now I am waiting for the 3 way blade switch to arrive on Monday and get the guitar shipped. 1 out of 4, check.



That looks great. Glad to see some gear coming your way. It looks as if Bernie is attempting to begin to make amends.


----------



## ikarus

Rev2010 said:


> They're not on the wrong side, they run down both edges of the neck. One page back you can see it:
> 
> ...
> 
> Smoking hot idea too I must say!  I'm guessing white binding cuts mixed in with the black binding?
> 
> 
> Rev.



ah, ok. That makes sense and looks pretty cool.


----------



## MetalDaze

Rev2010 said:


> Smoking hot idea too I must say!  I'm guessing white binding cuts mixed in with the black binding?
> 
> 
> Rev.



Could be white, but he also uses MOP for these.


----------



## JPMike

Thanks a lot guys for the nice comments, indeed looks beautiful. I can't wait to actually play it. I thought the idea of having MOP blocks along the fretboard in both sides would give it a nice look with the black binding on the guitar. 
The only thing, that is not included in my spec sheet is the BKP pickups I ordered. So this is equipped with DiMarzio Blazes. Which are getting swapped for Lundgren M7 Set.

Finally, the man has started to deliver guitars to people and I have no complaints whatsoever, he has been answering to every text and email I have sent him so far. I strongly believe he's really back. 
There might be some flaws in some builds, but lets hope when this storm passes he will get back in shape and deliver what he used to. He's just trying to keep up.

Have hope, guys! That's all I can say!!


----------



## MetalDaze

Xtreme Lefty Guitars just took delivery of 2 BRJs sixers... a Jekyll and a Diva:


----------



## spawnsc

JPMike wish I could say the same, I emailed him on his yahoo address and still have no response. I would just like a "Hey dude sorry for long delay here is a photo"

JP is the yahoo address the one you use?


----------



## Andromalia

Rev2010 said:


> They're not on the wrong side, they run down both edges of the neck.



*notes trick for future customs*

"Selling my old custom, markers on both sides, lefties welcome !"


----------



## SpaceDock

Can anyone spot what Floyd he is using on these now?


----------



## ormsby guitars

Why is he finishing guitars to be sold in stores, when he has so many many pre-sold instruments, with clients pulling their hair out trying to simply get what they paid for???


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ormsby guitars said:


> Why is he finishing guitars to be sold in stores, when he has so many many pre-sold instruments, with clients pulling their hair out trying to simply get what they paid for???



Dealers and stores are customers too.


----------



## ormsby guitars

MaxOfMetal said:


> Dealers and stores are customers too.



Absolutely, but they also pay 30-90 days after delivery, whilst others that have paid up front months/years ago are still getting the "missing a $5 part" excuse.

I see it as "lets get this into a store, create demand, take more deposits".

If the store guitars we're for customers that had played deposits, sure. But they aren't, they are stock items.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

ormsby guitars said:


> Absolutely, but they also pay 30-90 days after delivery



Do you know that as fact? From what Zimbloth (former BRJ dealer) has described, he had to pay upfront when commissioning builds, a couple other former dealers have alluded to that as well. Do you know when these were ordered? 

I'm not defending BRJ here, especially his recent "waiting on a switch" excuse, but if XLG paid upfront for these they're just as deserving of their property as any of the rest of the folks in here.


----------



## Dewswimmer

SpaceDock said:


> Can anyone spot what Floyd he is using on these now?



Back in 2011 he used non original FR. There was no logo "made in germany" on a back plate. But in the decription of my guitar it was stated.


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> JPMike wish I could say the same, I emailed him on his yahoo address and still have no response. I would just like a "Hey dude sorry for long delay here is a photo"
> 
> JP is the yahoo address the one you use?



Yes, I do use the yahoo address, but I am also sending him texts as soon as I send him the email along. So he can actually see, I am messaging him while he's working. Want me to give you his phone number?? Maybe try texting him??



Andromalia said:


> *notes trick for future customs*
> 
> "Selling my old custom, markers on both sides, lefties welcome !"



I actually, lol'ed!!! 



MetalDaze said:


> Xtreme Lefty Guitars just took delivery of 2 BRJs sixers... a Jekyll and a Diva:



Lefties without a spot, might have a chance on these. 



SpaceDock said:


> Can anyone spot what Floyd he is using on these now?



Well, I was asking him what Floyd brand he is using since I wanted to install a tremol-no, but he didn't tell me cause he already installed a tremol-no on the guitar.


----------



## ormsby guitars

MaxOfMetal said:


> Do you know that as fact? From what Zimbloth (former BRJ dealer) has described, he had to pay upfront when commissioning builds, a couple other former dealers have alluded to that as well. Do you know when these were ordered?
> 
> I'm not defending BRJ here, especially his recent "waiting on a switch" excuse, but if XLG paid upfront for these they're just as deserving of their property as any of the rest of the folks in here.



If that's the case, then it's more than fair.


----------



## spawnsc

JP PM it to me please


----------



## Ben.Last

ormsby guitars said:


> If that's the case, then it's more than fair.



Also, keep in mind, if he intends to get his business out of shit creek, he's going to be better off if he gets back in the good graces of distributors.


----------



## Andromalia

To be honest if he gets this right and can put his business afloat again I'll be impressed.


----------



## JPMike

Andromalia said:


> To be honest if he gets this right and can put his business afloat again I'll be impressed.



It will take a while for sure though.


----------



## Hollowway

I think he probably will get things sorted out at some point. Despite all that has happened he isn't directly shafting his customers, in the sense that he is still (ostensibly) shipping everyone their guitar(s), and where mistakes were made he's still promising rebuilds. Poor communication, spec mess up and quality gaffes are hardly unique to him. But he hasn't told anyone to pound sand over it, either. If poor communication and churning out in-stock instruments while custom orders wait are sins then we have a number of high profile luthiers on here who are equally guilty. So while I'm not defending his mistakes, I am saying that the way he is going about things now is not indicative of someone who is ready to hang it up and move on. I think he'll be back as a prime time luthier, but I don't know how much time it will take.


----------



## Seanthesheep

Hollowway said:


> I think he probably will get things sorted out at some point. Despite all that has happened he isn't directly shafting his customers, in the sense that he is still (ostensibly) shipping everyone their guitar(s), and where mistakes were made he's still promising rebuilds. Poor communication, spec mess up and quality gaffes are hardly unique to him. But he hasn't told anyone to pound sand over it, either. If poor communication and churning out in-stock instruments while custom orders wait are sins then we have a number of high profile luthiers on here who are equally guilty. So while I'm not defending his mistakes, I am saying that the way he is going about things now is not indicative of someone who is ready to hang it up and move on. I think he'll be back as a prime time luthier, but I don't know how much time it will take.



I agree with you to a certain extent but for him to rebuild his reputation as a high profile luthier, it will take 5-10 years mimimum IMO


----------



## ormsby guitars

Seanthesheep said:


> I agree with you to a certain extent but for him to rebuild his reputation as a high profile luthier, it will take 5-10 years mimimum IMO



He is already a high profile luthier. As soon as guitars start shipping, orders will start to flow again.


----------



## purpledc

Seanthesheep said:


> I agree with you to a certain extent but for him to rebuild his reputation as a high profile luthier, it will take 5-10 years mimimum IMO




Honestly I don't think so. Think about it. This thread is how many pages long and people still place orders with the guy? His bull shit is nothing new. It extends back into the days when he worked for his father at B.C. Rich. My feelings are that as long as the guy still has a website people will still buy into his bullshit. I know its a paradox of which there is simply no rational explanation but sometimes there are these select few people in the world that can simply pull bullshit stunt after bullshit stunt and they keep getting away with it year after year after year. While some others are never forgiven for the slightest misstep and pushed into obscurity for eternity. I must say Ive always liked Bernie Jr. and Sr. work. But Id be lying if I said I thought either one of them was a good business man. And thats what I really think needs to happen. Someone with a sense of responsibility needs to focus on the business end and let bernie handle guitar building. Because the man apparently cant walk and chew gum at the same time.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, I think it is weird that people are putting in orders now, too. But to a certain extent I think we all have just given in to the idea that luthiers will take our money and then decide on their own terms when they'll ship us an instrument. It's basically unheard of for a luthier to deliver on time. And it's becoming more and more common for these luthiers to take a lot of orders, but then not work on the instruments, and instead build a bunch of in-stocks to sell. I don't know if this is a recent phenomenon or not, since I've only been really into customs for about 4 years. I've had my fair share of FUBAR situations with customs as well. I'm fortunate in that most of the people I am currently doing builds with (there are 5) are good at communication and don't seem to be putting my builds on the back burner.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> It's basically unheard of for a luthier to deliver on time.



Actually, tons of builders deliver on time. They just don't lure you in with too-good-to-be-true delivery time frames just to milk a deposit out of you. 

All the most successful builders and shops will rather tell you the truth, even if it means not putting in an order, because they have the integrity for their craft to not be dishonest.


----------



## xwmucradiox

MaxOfMetal said:


> Actually, tons of builders deliver on time. They just don't lure you in with too-good-to-be-true delivery time frames just to milk a deposit out of you.
> 
> All the most successful builders and shops will rather tell you the truth, even if it means not putting in an order, because they have the integrity for their craft to not be dishonest.



My experience is that guys building more traditional guitars that aren't genre-specific tend to deliver way more on time than anyone building guitars that cater more to metal musicians. No idea why that is but it has been consistent throughout my guitar-buying history. Doesn't make sense either. No rationale for it. Just the way it has worked out.


----------



## gplayer51

Just got the guitar from Bernie himself today, all I can say is wow! This guitar is sweet! I'll post a proper NGD later after I play it! Here's some shitty pics lol


----------



## gplayer51

Another pic


----------



## AwDeOh

Really glad to see some guitars finally arriving! Hoping they all arrive safely :fingerscrossed:


----------



## MaxOfMetal

xwmucradiox said:


> My experience is that guys building more traditional guitars that aren't genre-specific tend to deliver way more on time than anyone building guitars that cater more to metal musicians. No idea why that is but it has been consistent throughout my guitar-buying history. Doesn't make sense either. No rationale for it. Just the way it has worked out.



Guitars catering to metal musicians are usually cheaper (to go along with the much younger demographic) and from newer builders, to go with extreme music's more recent rise in popularity. 

Though, the idea of a guitar being "made for metal" is pretty silly on it's face, as any guitar can pull off any tone. Those "traditional" guitars built by Suhr can do metal just as good as any BRJ. 

This is getting super off topic though.


----------



## JPMike

Another update, the 2 stock guitars I got, got their holes drilled and are getting for the final colouring and finish.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Actually, tons of builders deliver on time. They just don't lure you in with too-good-to-be-true delivery time frames just to milk a deposit out of you.
> 
> All the most successful builders and shops will rather tell you the truth, even if it means not putting in an order, because they have the integrity for their craft to not be dishonest.



Yeah, it's my admittedly small sample size that's giving me that impression. I have a poor track record of choosing luthiers, but I think the current ones I have on commission are going to be much better.


----------



## Jexey

gplayer51 said:


> Another pic



Wow!! Can't wait for more details.


----------



## patata

JPMike said:


> got their holes drilled



I 'd


----------



## JPMike

patata said:


> I 'd



Of course, you Greek!


----------



## JPMike

Another update!!!


----------



## Minoin

Owyeah!!

*Still waiting for that family-pic, Mike


----------



## JPMike

Minoin said:


> Owyeah!!
> 
> *Still waiting for that family-pic, Mike



I am on the wait!


----------



## mikernaut

question is will Jpmike get his batch of BRJ's or Skervesens 1st


----------



## WickedSymphony

Awesome pick on the finish Mike, we're gonna have twins one day


----------



## JPMike

mikernaut said:


> question is will Jpmike get his batch of BRJ's or Skervesens 1st



Hahahahahaha!! I am sure one of the BRJs will be here soon, just waiting on that 3 way blade switch and it's getting shipped. My last BRJ will be the last to arrive here for sure. 

The Skervies will be probably arrive the one after the other.  



WickedSymphony said:


> Awesome pick on the finish Mike, we're gonna have twins one day



Thanks!! But you haven't seen the final result yet.  

Who's gonna be the father and who's gonna be the mother?


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> Thanks!! But you haven't seen the final result yet.
> 
> Who's gonna be the father and who's gonna be the mother?



Is there something special planned for it?

And 2 fathers, but I call tops!


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> Is there something special planned for it?
> 
> And 2 fathers, but I call tops!



I wouldn't say special, just a little touch. Can you guess?? 

ok 2 fathers, I remembered this movie now, with DeVitto and Arnie. Who you be then?


----------



## patata

JPMike said:


> Of course, you Greek!


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> I wouldn't say special, just a little touch. Can you guess??
> 
> ok 2 fathers, I remembered this movie now, with DeVitto and Arnie. Who you be then?



No clue.

And if I could choose, Arnie, but more realistically Devito. T_T

Gotta hit dem weights more


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> No clue.
> 
> And if I could choose, Arnie, but more realistically Devito. T_T
> 
> Gotta hit dem weights more



It's easy, take a guess. Come on, don't be lazy!!

Hahahaha, maybe a mix of those!


----------



## spawnsc

so i finally got a answer from Bernie and it was very very generic answer "Hey man sorry doing my best to get back to everyone, I've been out sick, but I will work on your guitar soon" I got this response after telling him i'm a paying customer and I deserve some answers. Then I asked him for a photo and well no response back. I'm asking him for a photo again today and see what happens. I really don't believe his even started on my guitar to be honest. 

JP glad to you're getting some updates. I know you will be happy to close the chapter out on this ordeal like most of us.


----------



## spawnsc

well he just texted me back and said his out of town this weekend and he will do it monday. 

....Stay tuned we will see if he actually does it.


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> It's easy, take a guess. Come on, don't be lazy!!
> 
> Hahahaha, maybe a mix of those!



Hrm...

12th fret inlay?


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> JP glad to you're getting some updates. I know you will be happy to close the chapter out on this ordeal like most of us.



Thanks a lot, man!! I kept pushing him and bombing him with texts and emails, he eventually had to respond. But I will tell you this, I am sure he's trying to get back to the game, he would hire more people to do the job as contacting and all that, but he has no money to actually do so. So he is like at point zero now, just delivering what he was supposed to.



WickedSymphony said:


> Hrm...
> 
> 12th fret inlay?



Nope, it's a colour thing.


----------



## xwestonx

I've gotten a few responses from him now, but no real progress on finishing up my build at this point, but like JP said he has no money for help and is running a solo operation I'm sure. Patience is a virtue... I guess...


----------



## ovation22

spawnsc said:


> ...I really don't believe his even started on my guitar to be honest...



Rest assured, he hasn't.


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> Nope, it's a colour thing.



Ok, hint time...body or hardware?


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> Ok, hint time...body or hardware?



haha, body!!!


----------



## Jexey

UPS says my guitar will be here on Tuesday. Keep your heads up, homies, yours are next.


----------



## patata

Brace yourselves,NGD's are on their way from Hesperia!


----------



## spawnsc

wells its monday, just sent bernie text asking for a photo..he said he would send one on monday but i'm not getting up hopes up that he will.


----------



## WickedSymphony

JPMike said:


> haha, body!!!



Color on the back?


----------



## JPMike

spawnsc said:


> wells its monday, just sent bernie text asking for a photo..he said he would send one on monday but i'm not getting up hopes up that he will.



He text me like 10 min ago, he is on his way back from being out of town.



WickedSymphony said:


> Color on the back?



back and front, I think it's too easy now.


----------



## WickedSymphony

A burst? I thought you said a little touch lol


----------



## JPMike

WickedSymphony said:


> A burst? I thought you said a little touch lol



We have a winner, it's a black burst!!!


----------



## ridner

has there been an "official" I'M BACK statement from Bernie? sorry, lots of pages to search through. glad to see some progress is being made for people waiting on builds


----------



## mikernaut

There was a statement on his facebook, but it's still slow communication and progress.


----------



## Khoi

I'm curious if he still has guys working with him, or is he completely solo now?

I wonder if he has at least his paint guy, judging by JPMike's newly painted build


----------



## JPMike

Khoi said:


> I'm curious if he still has guys working with him, or is he completely solo now?
> 
> I wonder if he has at least his paint guy, judging by JPMike's newly painted build



The paint guy is still there, from what he tells me. At least, that's what I know.


----------



## Aris_T

JPMike said:


> We have a winner, it's a black burst!!!



Looking forward to the pics (I suppose you WILL get pics)!


----------



## JPMike

Aris_T said:


> Looking forward to the pics (I suppose you WILL get pics)!



Photos keep the faith alive!!


----------



## Jexey

Guitar has arrived. I'll post a proper NGD soon with a full review but until then I'll feed your dirty habits with these pictures.

Quick first impression is really good, guys... the few flaws I've strained myself to find are extremely trivial and virtually unnoticeable. Playability and weight is comparable to a 25" six string--this is really saying a lot for a 27" 8 string. The aftermaths are very growly, clear, and responsive. It's more of a sonic weapon than a guitar. The Piezo is shimmering clear and a blast to play with!

I'm not going to promise a NGD by the weekend because I'm buried in work but it will be here soon enough!! Cheers!


----------



## spawnsc

well Bernie text me back monday and said his still not made it back and it will be later this week before I got any photos.


----------



## JPMike

Jexey said:


> Guitar has arrived. I'll post a proper NGD soon with a full review but until then I'll feed your dirty habits with these pictures.
> 
> Quick first impression is really good, guys... the few flaws I've strained myself to find are extremely trivial and virtually unnoticeable. Playability and weight is comparable to a 25" six string--this is really saying a lot for a 27" 8 string. The aftermaths are very growly, clear, and responsive. It's more of a sonic weapon than a guitar. The Piezo is shimmering clear and a blast to play with!
> 
> I'm not going to promise a NGD by the weekend because I'm buried in work but it will be here soon enough!! Cheers!



Grats, man!! I am glad you like it!! 



spawnsc said:


> well Bernie text me back monday and said his still not made it back and it will be later this week before I got any photos.



Don't lose faith!!


----------



## JPMike

3 way switch is in the house and installed!! He is shipping tomorrow!!


----------



## MetalDaze

That guitar is bad ass.


----------



## JPMike

MetalDaze said:


> That guitar is bad ass.



Thanks, man!! It has DiMarzio Blazes on it atm, but I got a set of Lundgren M7s ready to be installed on this bad boy!!


----------



## thepylestory

Really happy to see some guys getting what is owed.


----------



## xCaptainx

JPMike you've had the patience of a saint. Really happy to see that progress is being made!


----------



## JPMike

thepylestory said:


> Really happy to see some guys getting what is owed.



I really hope everyone will get what they are owed soon, and I strongly believe that since Bernie is really working and we have seen some progress lately.



xCaptainx said:


> JPMike you've had the patience of a saint. Really happy to see that progress is being made!



Thanks a lot, man! The progress was made since I was pushing for it, I just couldn't just send over an email and wait for answers, I texted, I called, I tried everything and it actually paid back. 

Maybe I had the patience (even though I am a totally impatient person) but I am far from being a saint.


----------



## canuck brian

It is so good to see people getting their guitars.


----------



## JPMike

The guitar has been shipped, I just received a tracking number. 

USPS didn't ask him for a declaration value, though. Which is weird...


----------



## Larrikin666

JPMike said:


> The guitar has been shipped, I just received a tracking number.
> 
> USPS didn't ask him for a declaration value, though. Which is weird...



Really? That's very bizarre. I hope that doesn't affect it getting into Greece.


----------



## JPMike

Larrikin666 said:


> Really? That's very bizarre. I hope that doesn't affect it getting into Greece.



Well, I know that when you ship something overseas, you usually declare a value. Bernie told them to input a value and all, and they replied that is not necessary. So I don't know... 

I am sure it will get into Greece, but I don't know how the whole no value declaration will affect the Customs here, if it will pass or it will have to be examined.


----------



## JPMike

On the meantime, another update.


----------



## Minoin

That looks sleek as hell! Good for you Mike, who would have thought you would still get something decent out of this  Now look at those beauties..


----------



## WickedSymphony

Shit, dude. Looks good!


----------



## JPMike

Minoin said:


> That looks sleek as hell! Good for you Mike, who would have thought you would still get something decent out of this  Now look at those beauties..



Well, I had to make 2 stock guitars look good, didn't I?  I am glad they turned out nice so far. I bet the final product of both would be even better!! 



WickedSymphony said:


> Shit, dude. Looks good!



Thanks a lot, man!!


----------



## SpaceDock

Glad you're getting through. He hasn't responded to anything from me, but one at a time is better than not.


----------



## DISTORT6

JPMike said:


> On the meantime, another update.



DAT BLUE! Nomnomnomnom.....


----------



## noob_pwn

again, could somebody please PM me Bernie's latest contact details so I can find out what's going on with my guitar? I can't get in touch with him.
Much appreciated!


----------



## peet

^^I second this^^

I have gotten no response from any emails or texts from any of the contacts I have for him.


----------



## JPMike

noob_pwn said:


> again, could somebody please PM me Bernie's latest contact details so I can find out what's going on with my guitar? I can't get in touch with him.
> Much appreciated!





peet said:


> ^^I second this^^
> 
> I have gotten no response from any emails or texts from any of the contacts I have for him.



You both got PM!!


----------



## Aris_T

JPMike said:


> I am sure it will get into Greece, but I don't know how the whole no value declaration will affect the Customs here, if it will pass or it will have to be examined.



"But...officer, it's a gift!" 

Other than that, your guitars are turning out awesome!


----------



## JPMike

Aris_T said:


> "But...officer, it's a gift!"
> 
> Other than that, your guitars are turning out awesome!



hahahaha!

Since you are a fellow Greek, I am sure you know how annoying the Greek Customs are at the airport. I had to beg once for a guitar to be handed to me over regular mail or it would have sent back and the other time, I had to get papers from 7 different offices and pay quite an amount even though the value was declared quite low. 
Oh Dear Lord, let it all go smooth... 

Nonetheless, thank you very much, sir!!


----------



## Aris_T

JPMike said:


> hahahaha!
> 
> Since you are a fellow Greek, I am sure you know how annoying the Greek Customs are at the airport. I had to beg once for a guitar to be handed to me over regular mail or it would have sent back and the other time, I had to get papers from 7 different offices and pay quite an amount even though the value was declared quite low.
> Oh Dear Lord, let it all go smooth...
> 
> Nonetheless, thank you very much, sir!!



Hellenic Post Office (where dreams become nightmares). Hopefully you won't be having trouble with UPS (even if they charge you with something, you will just pay UPS to get the papers from the 7 different offices)

PS: do you have any shipments arriving around August 15?


----------



## JPMike

Aris_T said:


> Hellenic Post Office (where dreams become nightmares). Hopefully you won't be having trouble with UPS (even if they charge you with something, you will just pay UPS to get the papers from the 7 different offices)
> 
> PS: do you have any shipments arriving around August 15?



As long as, you know how to avoid the Customs here, it's all good. When the Customs get involved, it's like FML!! 
it's USPS, not UPS, normal post office. So I hope it will be like a breeze!! haha!
It should arrive here on Tuesday. Wish me luck!! :lol"

PS: Honestly, I have no idea, please Mother Mary help me out!!! The worst thing that happened to me this year, was when something arrived for me here on "Big Friday" during our Easter... I had to wait until Wednesday after Easter to receive the package, cause May 1st was on "Big Wednesday". Still, I love my country best place on Earth for vacation.


----------



## Aris_T

JPMike said:


> As long as, you know how to avoid the Customs here, it's all good. When the Customs get involved, it's like FML!!
> it's USPS, not UPS, normal post office. So I hope it will be like a breeze!! haha!
> It should arrive here on Tuesday. Wish me luck!! :lol"
> 
> PS: Honestly, I have no idea, please Mother Mary help me out!!! The worst thing that happened to me this year, was when something arrived for me here on "Big Friday" during our Easter... I had to wait until Wednesday after Easter to receive the package, cause May 1st was on "Big Wednesday". Still, I love my country best place on Earth for vacation.



Hahahaha, didn't notice the extra S... Good luck man!!! I'm sure it'll be smooth.

PS: I was waiting for a paycheck around that time...(arrived Monday, after Thomas' Sunday - I love greek-to-english translations)...I know the pain!


----------



## JPMike

Aris_T said:


> Hahahaha, didn't notice the extra S... Good luck man!!! I'm sure it'll be smooth.
> 
> PS: I was waiting for a paycheck around that time...(arrived Monday after, Thomas' Sunday - I love greek-to-english translations)...I know the pain!



Pray for me, bro!!! This stupid bureaucracy here is killing us, it's like wanting us to actually suffer from cancer!

PS: I feel you... (Hahahahahahaha, so true, our fellow forum members, might not understand anything of the terms we are referring to!) We need more Greeks in SSO for sure.


----------



## peet

I got this email last night. Finally...thank god.

"Hey Peter,

I apologize and understand your frustration. I'm doing my best to stay up on my emails and working. 

I will ship out your pickups this week. Once things have mellowed out I would still like to rebuild you the guitar. 

Call me this week on my cell.

Again, I apologize for not getting back to you."


----------



## Carver

well... i just looked through the majority of this thread, what a stand up class act we have here.... does he hug you when he ..cks you?


----------



## Diggi

JPMike said:


> hahahaha!
> 
> Since you are a fellow Greek, I am sure you know how annoying the Greek Customs are at the airport. I had to beg once for a guitar to be handed to me over regular mail or it would have sent back and the other time, I had to get papers from 7 different offices and pay quite an amount even though the value was declared quite low.
> Oh Dear Lord, let it all go smooth...
> 
> Nonetheless, thank you very much, sir!!



Mike, if you are ever concerned about how items get shipped to you, and whether or not the process of receiving them through Customs will be smooth, PM me. In my business, we ship all over the world, every day... and some countries simply want things done "their way". I know this from 25 years in the freight forwarding business and now in my Acoustic treatment business. 

It can be tricky, but it doesn't HAVE to be. 

One SS member to another 

If ANYONE here needs help with stuff like this, feel free to PM me. I may not get back to you super fast, but I will ... when I can. 

Peace to all!


----------



## peet

Just got a call from Bernie. He should be sending my pickups out to me early this week. He also assures me that he's really trying to get everyone's orders sorted out. Here's hoping he can keep on top of this and deliver the goods in time. From our conversation I can pretty much guarantee that my rebuild is going to take a while longer yet. Lots of unhappy customers to settle down and guitars to be built.


----------



## JPMike

peet said:


> Just got a call from Bernie. He should be sending my pickups out to me early this week. He also assures me that he's really trying to get everyone's orders sorted out. Here's hoping he can keep on top of this and deliver the goods in time. From our conversation I can pretty much guarantee that my rebuild is going to take a while longer yet. Lots of unhappy customers to settle down and guitars to be built.



My last build will take quite a while too. I also gave him time to complete the stock guitars at his own peace and not stress out about it, so other customers can get some of their guitars delivered. I just feel bad getting 3 guitars in a row and some other people not getting anything, regardless if it's 1 or 2 or 3 or even more guitars they are waiting. I deserve nothing more or nothing less than anyone in the same situation I am. 

Just don't lose faith and your patience, guys!


----------



## Watty

JPMike said:


> My last build will take quite a while too. I also gave him time to complete the stock guitars at his own peace and not stress out about it, so other customers can get some of their guitars delivered. I just feel bad getting 3 guitars in a row and some other people not getting anything, regardless if it's 1 or 2 or 3 or even more guitars they are waiting. I deserve nothing more or nothing less than anyone in the same situation I am.
> 
> Just don't lose faith and your patience, guys!



Pretty sure that you deserve just a slight bit of special treatment; no need to be so modest or humble in the face of your sizable investment.


----------



## mongey

Watty said:


> Pretty sure that you deserve just a slight bit of special treatment; no need to be so modest or humble in the face of your sizable investment.


 

+1 to this. you all deserve somehting in this thread . discount, free pick up updgrade . something at least 

even getting your guitars now or in 6 months you have been F'd around big time


----------



## JP Universe

After sending 4 emails I got a response from Bernie 

I got 2 similar responses to 2 of the emails  I'll probably end up keeping it provided he comes good with the guitar in 2014


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Considering the rebuild and amount of guys who have paid in full that are still waiting, plus whoever is in front of me, I'm hoping for 2014 'ish. Got other stuff that has shifted priorities anyways.


----------



## killertone

Mine was the 7th 7 string ordered in the BF sale. I still have nothing. Not to sound like an ass but I don't care if you ordered 10 guitars there should be some sort of list to fulfill those who have been waiting longest. Call me crazy.


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> Mine was the 7th 7 string ordered in the BF sale. I still have nothing. Not to sound like an ass but I don't care if you ordered 10 guitars there should be some sort of list to fulfill those who have been waiting longest. Call me crazy.



I totally agree with you! There should have been a prio list, but not sure why there isn't. I guess there are quite a few factors but can't really say what kind of.

In any case, you don't sound as an ass, your thinking is really logical and I hope you get your guitar soon!


----------



## SDMFVan

JPMike said:


> 3 way switch is in the house and installed!! He is shipping tomorrow!!



That looks killer! Any plans for the Blaze pickups once you replace them? I'm looking for a set.

Edit: D'oh! Didn't realize you were in Greece.


----------



## killertone

JPMike said:


> I totally agree with you! There should have been a prio list, but not sure why there isn't. I guess there are quite a few factors but can't really say what kind of.
> 
> In any case, you don't sound as an ass, your thinking is really logical and I hope you get your guitar soon!



In any case, it is good to see guitars shipping out and people liking them. At least we have that.


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> In any case, it is good to see guitars shipping out and people liking them. At least we have that.



It's true, at least we have that. 

Have you contacted Bernie about your guitar??


----------



## JPMike

So the Oiled Jekyll 724 arrived today, after 2 years of waiting. I know you all expect an NGD thread but it won't be until next week. I didn't take photos or anything, but I will try to explain everything orally. 

First of all, there was no issue with the Customs office, even though no value was declared.

As far as the guitar goes, there were 3 flaws, that I noticed and the 2 of them were not much of a big deal for me. First and second flaw, are 2 of the MoP side markers, 1 of their corners was a bit cut off. That didn't really bother me in any way, it was on the other side of the guitar which I won't really be seeing when I'll be playing.

The 3rd and the most serious flaw, I am not sure if it was caused in the shop or during the shipment, I believe the latter. The top point of the headstock, where the horn is, was a bit broken and like a 20-30mm chunk of wood was missing. It didn't affect the top of the headstock or the binding for my own good luck. It was cut diagonally. When I saw it was like, damn that sucks, I wouldn't mind a ding or something in the back but this!!! 
Then my girlfriend was like, oh see here, and she found 3 pieces of wood, actually the ones that were broken from the point of the headstock, cause they were fitting perfectly back on the horn. It was the big piece, a small one and a really small one. 

The first thing I did was strum the guitar, play a few shitty licks and then call my tech guy and ask him to go over his place to check it out, (I would be getting the guitar there anyway to change the pickups). I didn't even have the guitar for more than 5 mins and I left the house to go over my tech. Obviously, I didn't even think to take photos, I just wanted this to be repaired in no time.

He told me, it can be fixed and I shouldn't be worrying about it, he has this dude that does this kind of repairs, so it won't be something hard to pull. 
So an NGD will be coming next week, with a repair and new pickups. 

I'll make sure Bernie will wrap the headstock really well with bubble wrap in the next shipment. I would have easily sent an email over Bernie right now for the side marker "flaws" but really is not a biggie. I can take this, but for the broken tip of the headstock, I can't complain since I shipped uninsured. 

So hang on until next week.


----------



## xzyryabx

Been trying to follow the BRJ saga for a while now, and I always wondered:
Why do any of you put up with this?!
Delays/shims/rebuilds/etc you'd think BRJ was the only luthier out there.
Why don't you just get all yur money back, claim breach of contract of just fedup or whatever, get another one of the hundreds of great (if not better) made insruments out there and enjoy playing the guitar?!
Most will be on the chopping block anyways a year or two down the road anyways it seems....
Not trying to hate, just curious as to the magical properties of these guitars and what I'm obviously missing out on!


----------



## JPMike

xzyryabx said:


> Been trying to follow the BRJ saga for a while now, and I always wondered:
> Why do any of you put up with this?!
> Delays/shims/rebuilds/etc you'd think BRJ was the only luthier out there.
> Why don't you just get all yur money back, claim breach of contract of just fedup or whatever, get another one of the hundreds of great (if not better) made insruments out there and enjoy playing the guitar?!
> Most will be on the chopping block anyways a year or two down the road anyways it seems....
> Not trying to hate, just curious as to the magical properties of these guitars and what I'm obviously missing out on!



There was a bit of a trend thingy going on like 2 years ago with BRJ, now with Mayo, Decibel, Strandberg, Daemoness basically whatever Misha plays/played. I won't lie, I fell for it but I also liked the Jekyll shape a lot. 

We would have taken all our money back if we could, but it's not possible, especially when Bernie has no money to refund. Also, I got custom builds with other luthiers too as we speak so for me not only BRJ but other shops too. 
I'd like some custom builds from some other companies, I haven't contacted yet but the waiting list is quite some time and I have no patience for that. 

I wish things with Bernie were much easier and simpler, but *sigh* what can you do now...


----------



## Tesla

xzyryabx said:


> Been trying to follow the BRJ saga for a while now, and I always wondered:
> Why do any of you put up with this?!
> Delays/shims/rebuilds/etc you'd think BRJ was the only luthier out there.
> Why don't you just get all yur money back, claim breach of contract of just fedup or whatever, get another one of the hundreds of great (if not better) made insruments out there and enjoy playing the guitar?!
> Most will be on the chopping block anyways a year or two down the road anyways it seems....
> Not trying to hate, just curious as to the magical properties of these guitars and what I'm obviously missing out on!


----------



## Larrikin666

Mike, was there a piece of wood in the case swimming around from the headstock? If not, I'd think that would have had to happen in the shop. If it's in there, it's not much better. I absolutely hate how Bernie's guitars fit in the G&G case. I've never felt comfortable with mine. I'm honestly more confident in a cheap softcase. That should tell you something. They just sit so bizarrely in the hardcases G&G makes.


----------



## flint757

There's no reason he couldn't throw in some bubble wrap or peanuts either.


----------



## ihunda

^I know nothing about BRJ but I cringe each time I hear about expensive, unique instruments that are not properly packaged or have cases that in now way protect them for trip on a plane or car.

We see that way too often


----------



## JPMike

Larrikin666 said:


> Mike, was there a piece of wood in the case swimming around from the headstock? If not, I'd think that would have had to happen in the shop. If it's in there, it's not much better. I absolutely hate how Bernie's guitars fit in the G&G case. I've never felt comfortable with mine. I'm honestly more confident in a cheap softcase. That should tell you something. They just sit so bizarrely in the hardcases G&G makes.



There were 3 pieces (like a 15 mm piece, 5 mm and 1 mm.) of wood floating around the headstock area of the case, which those are going to get glued back(repair) on the guitar. I have never had a broken part out of any instrument I ever owned in my life, so this is my first one. So it bothers me more that I didn't cause it. 

I felt the guitar was somehow pushed in the G&G case, like the body was a bit bigger of the body part of the case. If you can understand what I mean. 

What I don't get though, how in the hell can a piece of wood get broken off the guitar, especially behind the headstock, while in shipment. It must really felt from somewhere or they might had it thrown while in transit. Or If I can be that suspicious, maybe while B was packing it or whoever does the packing, somehow managed to hit the headstock with the case while closing it. So he just threw the pieces in and didn't tell anybody, so to seem like it happened on the way here. The scenarios are endless, but I think it will be repaired and it will look nice. 

Imagine those pointy ESPs and Jacksons that have chipped tips, but on my guitar it was like being perfect on the tip and diagonally being cut/broken like cheese or something.

I should have taken photos for you to see, but the first thing was to actually get my tech to fix it. 

*Forgot to add, that the guitar was being in the shop since last summer waiting to be assembled and shipped. So I don't know what's up, really. I should have asked for front and back headstock photos before he had shipped. *



flint757 said:


> There's no reason he couldn't throw in some bubble wrap or peanuts either.



He did, but not the right amount if you ask me. I would wrap the headstock at least 3-4 times, as I do when I ship guitars.


----------



## xzyryabx

it definitely sounds like due to the headstock angle the headstock tip was pressing right on the case, and the case must have gotten a hit on the upper end and with no space to flex the impact went straight to the headstock.

wasn't the shipping insured by BRJ when he sent it?
I would definitely contact him and work out a monetary solution, even if you decide to keep the guitar, resale value will take a hit and that shouldn't be on you.


----------



## UnderTheSign

JPMike said:


> There were 3 pieces (like a 15 mm piece, 5 mm and 1 mm.) of wood floating around the headstock area of the case, which those are going to get glued back(repair) on the guitar. I have never had a broken part out of any instrument I ever owned in my life, so this is my first one. So it bothers me more that I didn't cause it.
> 
> I felt the guitar was somehow pushed in the G&G case, like the body was a bit bigger of the body part of the case. If you can understand what I mean.
> 
> What I don't get though, how in the hell can a piece of wood get broken off the guitar, especially behind the headstock, while in shipment. It must really felt from somewhere or they might had it thrown while in transit. Or If I can be that suspicious, maybe while B was packing it or whoever does the packing, somehow managed to hit the headstock with the case while closing it. So he just threw the pieces in and didn't tell anybody, so to seem like it happened on the way here. The scenarios are endless, but I think it will be repaired and it will look nice.
> 
> Imagine those pointy ESPs and Jacksons that have chipped tips, but on my guitar it was like being perfect on the tip and diagonally being cut/broken like cheese or something.
> 
> I should have taken photos for you to see, but the first thing was to actually get my tech to fix it.
> 
> *Forgot to add, that the guitar was being in the shop since last summer waiting to be assembled and shipped. So I don't know what's up, really. I should have asked for front and back headstock photos before he had shipped. *
> 
> 
> 
> He did, but not the right amount if you ask me. I would wrap the headstock at least 3-4 times, as I do when I ship guitars.


A friend of mine had it happen when he got his Moser guitar, a chip just broke off during shipping. Strange as Neal packs his guitars like freaking tanks. Guess sometimes it just happens.


----------



## JPMike

xzyryabx said:


> it definitely sounds like due to the headstock angle the headstock tip was pressing right on the case, and the case must have gotten a hit on the upper end and with no space to flex the impact went straight to the headstock.
> 
> wasn't the shipping insured by BRJ when he sent it?
> I would definitely contact him and work out a monetary solution, even if you decide to keep the guitar, resale value will take a hit and that shouldn't be on you.



That actually might be the case. 

No the shipping wasn't insured or else I would be paying 40% of the guitar's value. 



UnderTheSign said:


> A friend of mine had it happen when he got his Moser guitar, a chip just broke off during shipping. Strange as Neal packs his guitars like freaking tanks. Guess sometimes it just happens.



Damn!! And I wonder, did the damage got repaired??


----------



## killertone

JPMike said:


> It's true, at least we have that.
> 
> Have you contacted Bernie about your guitar??



I actually have two guitars that I am waiting on. Both are from the BFR and both are paid in full. I have talked to Bernie since he has been back at the shop both on the phone and via text message. Nothing I can do but wait...


----------



## JPMike

killertone said:


> I actually have two guitars that I am waiting on. Both are from the BFR and both are paid in full. I have talked to Bernie since he has been back at the shop both on the phone and via text message. Nothing I can do but wait...



Keep pushing, with several texts and emails during the week or say the day.


----------



## Rev2010

xzyryabx said:


> Why do any of you put up with this?!



I would guess because those with orders in could do little else?



xzyryabx said:


> Delays/shims/rebuilds/etc you'd think BRJ was the only luthier out there.



I think most of that started occurring when Bernie started running these deals and came to light after most people's orders were in already. 



xzyryabx said:


> Why don't you just get all yur money back, claim breach of contract of just fedup or whatever,



Did you read this whole thread? A lot of people made it quite clear that it wouldn't be easy to get one's money back. It was said you would need to file in small claims court in your own locale. Obviously Bernie or a representative wouldn't show and you'd reach a default win, but then how the hell do you actually get the money from him once you've won? It sure seemed like he didn't really have the money to payback to begin with. And some did get fed up and get partial refunds through their bank or whatever.



xzyryabx said:


> Not trying to hate, just curious as to the magical properties of these guitars and what I'm obviously missing out on!



Well I think now at this point Bernie's rep and work are not looked at in the same light it used to be. Maybe he'll work on fixing his rep and improving his work. Only time will tell.


Rev.


----------



## xzyryabx

Rev and JP, thanks for the mature responses.
Wasn't aware that it would be that difficult to get the cash; BRJ as a corporation must be doing VERY badly if they legitimately don't have the cash for refunds.
It's frustrating for me to to just read about this, can't imagine how tough it must be for the people that dished out the cash.


----------



## MetalDaze




----------



## JPMike

xzyryabx said:


> Rev and JP, thanks for the mature responses.
> Wasn't aware that it would be that difficult to get the cash; BRJ as a corporation must be doing VERY badly if they legitimately don't have the cash for refunds.
> It's frustrating for me to to just read about this, can't imagine how tough it must be for the people that dished out the cash.



No problem, man!! We would actually took our money back if we could. No we just wait for guitars to show up.


----------



## AwDeOh

Just speculating here.. but I wonder if the damage was something to do with the $0 shipping value. Customs inspectors can be dicks at the best of times (most are recruited from the NBPE clinic).

"Oh.. nice shiny new guitar worth $0 to avoid import tax? Guess I don't have to be careful with this one.."


----------



## JPMike

AwDeOh said:


> Just speculating here.. but I wonder if the damage was something to do with the $0 shipping value. Customs inspectors can be dicks at the best of times (most are recruited from the NBPE clinic).
> 
> "Oh.. nice shiny new guitar worth $0 to avoid import tax? Guess I don't have to be careful with this one.."



This is a scenario that could be possible, but for the first time, I've been doing this, I receive a guitar from overseas that had actual damage when it arrived. 

Damn, I should have really taken photos to show you the damage, I don't know if it could happen during shipment, at least to me it doesn't seem logical, where inside the case it could hit so hard so an actual piece of wood to pop like that.


----------



## thrsher

i had an issue with a guitar i shipped overseas where the headstock endured damage but the guitar was shipped not in a hardshell


----------



## UV7BK4LIFE

ihunda said:


> ^I know nothing about BRJ but I cringe each time I hear about expensive, unique instruments that are not properly packaged or have cases that in now way protect them for trip on a plane or car.


 
Yes, some hardshell cases do more damage to a guitar than a gigbag. I get ESP's from Japan in a gigbag with some bubblewrap and a box, never had problems. Sometimes they're carried out of the delivery truck upside down or "this way up" on the wrong side of the box.


----------



## AwDeOh

Most of my working life has been around couriers/shipping in different capacities.. the thing I've learnt is never to underestimate the stupidity or malice of the shipping industry. Their patron saint is Murphy.

Who knows.. either way it sucks, especially for a guitar you've waited for this long with all the attached baggage, but I'm glad it at least seems to be a reasonably easy fix.


----------



## JPMike

I know what you mean, guys. Either way, I always package any stuff I sent away really well, so even an atomic bomb won't damage them.

I should have taken photos of the damage for you to see, is awkward how it could happen. 
At least, my tech told me not to worry and it will get fixed. All I can do is wait for next week.


----------



## MetalDaze

I've seen some amazing headstock repairs where you wouldn't even know it happened.


----------



## JPMike

MetalDaze said:


> I've seen some amazing headstock repairs where you wouldn't even know it happened.



That makes me feel better!! Thanks!


----------



## crazygtr

One of the advantages of an oil finish is that it can be repaired and refinished without leaving a trace of what happened.


----------



## Devotee

Headstock breakage isn't uncommon when shipping guitars, especially in hard cases. The problem is not because the headstock wasn't padded enough, it's because the body probably wasn't secure enough in the case, meaning that the whole guitar could shift up and down inside it. It doesn't take much of a hard bump to knock the headstock into the wall of the case and cause it to break. The key is to secure the body so that the guitar doesn't move at all; padding the headstock can have the opposite effect because pressure is applied to it which can cause it to break. A chip in the headstock isn't a big deal but i would be pretty ....ing pissed after all the wait and money.


----------



## JPMike

Devotee said:


> Headstock breakage isn't uncommon when shipping guitars, especially in hard cases. The problem is not because the headstock wasn't padded enough, it's because the body probably wasn't secure enough in the case, meaning that the whole guitar could shift up and down inside it. It doesn't take much of a hard bump to knock the headstock into the wall of the case and cause it to break. The key is to secure the body so that the guitar doesn't move at all; padding the headstock can have the opposite effect because pressure is applied to it which can cause it to break. A chip in the headstock isn't a big deal but i would be pretty ....ing pissed after all the wait and money.



Thank God, the headstock didn't break, but like a small cut behind it, I can't explain it, it's like a slice missing. Pretty weird how that could happen inside the case, cause the body fits super tight inside of the case.


----------



## ormsby guitars

Headstock breaks inside cases are more commonly caused by a drop, or rather, a sudden stop. 40 odd kilos of string tension trying to straighten the headstock angle, plus the weight of the machineheads = headstock keeps moving when the case stops (usually thrown, or dropped).

But, it doesnt sound like that in this case (pun!).


----------



## Larrikin666

This is why double boxing should be mandatory. Pad the guitar in the case, box the case, wrap it in bubble wrap, box all of that. I've never had a guitar arrived damaged when shipped that way.


----------



## ihunda

^ I don't think this can help you if the guitar is wobbling in the case to begin with. Most shipping issues comes from the fact that the guitar can move a few inches inside its case due to improper fitting or using a generic case for example.


----------



## Hollowway

You guys are gonna think I'm crazy, but I actually think its safer to ship a guitar without a case than with one, unless its one of those ones where it's all foam and then cut out just in the shape of the guitar. When I ship without a case I just take the guitar and wrap the crap out of it in bubble wrap, then stuff it in a big old box, and fill in all the gaps with peanuts of whatever. I got the idea from when Tom Drinkwater shipped my 10 string. You can kick and drop that thing and nothing happens. But it's really hard to get a guitar in a case stabilized that well.


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> You guys are gonna think I'm crazy, but I actually think its safer to ship a guitar without a case than with one, unless its one of those ones where it's all foam and then cut out just in the shape of the guitar. When I ship without a case I just take the guitar and wrap the crap out of it in bubble wrap, then stuff it in a big old box, and fill in all the gaps with peanuts of whatever. I got the idea from when Tom Drinkwater shipped my 10 string. You can kick and drop that thing and nothing happens. But it's really hard to get a guitar in a case stabilized that well.



You got a point for sure... Like use as much bubble wrap as possible!!!


----------



## ihunda

Hollowway said:


> You guys are gonna think I'm crazy, but I actually think its safer to ship a guitar without a case than with one, unless its one of those ones where it's all foam and then cut out just in the shape of the guitar. When I ship without a case I just take the guitar and wrap the crap out of it in bubble wrap, then stuff it in a big old box, and fill in all the gaps with peanuts of whatever. I got the idea from when Tom Drinkwater shipped my 10 string. You can kick and drop that thing and nothing happens. But it's really hard to get a guitar in a case stabilized that well.



That's actually a good idea, interesting, would cost a lot in peanuts but anyways that's actually something to try.


----------



## kmanick

JPMike said:


> Thank God, the headstock didn't break, but like a small cut behind it, I can't explain it, it's like a slice missing. Pretty weird how that could happen inside the case, cause the body fits super tight inside of the case.



Gamoto......(only the other Greeks will get this  )


----------



## JPMike

kmanick said:


> Gamoto......(only the other Greeks will get this  )



hahahahahahhahahaha!!! 

How???


----------



## Devotee

Agapite talaipwre Mike, gamw ti gkantemia sou gamw!


----------



## JPMike

Devotee said:


> Agapite talaipwre Mike, gamw ti gkantemia sou gamw!



hahahahahaahahaha!! what's going on today???


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Devotee said:


> Agapite talaipwre Mike, gamw ti gkantemia sou gamw!


 
WHAT?! That's wrong man! Ya don't say! No wai!


----------



## JPMike

glassmoon0fo said:


> WHAT?! That's wrong man! Ya don't say! No wai!



Some people are talking Greek out of nowhere!!


----------



## isispelican

gamiseta, toulaxiston diorthwnetai h katastash!


----------



## kmanick

apparently there are a few more of us Greeks on here than meets the eye eh.........manga


----------



## JPMike

isispelican said:


> gamiseta, toulaxiston diorthwnetai h katastash!



Pali kala!!



kmanick said:


> apparently there are a few more of us Greeks on here than meets the eye eh.........manga



I am glad to actually hear that!!


----------



## Carver

it would appear my comment about BRj made some people butt hurt, sorry. hope your butts are ok and i do hope you get your guitar, i just find this situtation shitty all around. not trying to pick at a scab or anything, i truly do wish you all the best, sometimes a little humour is used to try to lighten the mood. funny how negative it can be taken. 
nothing but the best to the guys waiting for this gear, i really do hope you get what you ordered, and yeah, the term lighten up, i guess cant really be used here considering how long this has gone on for. But to that note, the idea of "if you arent a part of it stay out of it" this is a public forum, im sure you all know that, if this was meant to be a private thread, chalk it up to being new in these parts and reading through as much as i can, didnt mean to piss anyone off. but this is a touchy subject, i see that. my bad for dosing humour where humour isnt wanted.


----------



## JPMike

Carver said:


> it would appear my comment about BRj made some people butt hurt, sorry. hope your butts are ok and i do hope you get your guitar, i just find this situtation shitty all around. not trying to pick at a scab or anything, i truly do wish you all the best, sometimes a little humour is used to try to lighten the mood. funny how negative it can be taken.
> nothing but the best to the guys waiting for this gear, i really do hope you get what you ordered, and yeah, the term lighten up, i guess cant really be used here considering how long this has gone on for. But to that note, the idea of "if you arent a part of it stay out of it" this is a public forum, im sure you all know that, if this was meant to be a private thread, chalk it up to being new in these parts and reading through as much as i can, didnt mean to piss anyone off. but this is a touchy subject, i see that. my bad for dosing humour where humour isnt wanted.



Man, no worries about it. You are free to express your opinion, no offence taken, at least from my side.


----------



## Carver

cool thanks dude, i got some angry pms and some shitty feedback due to a post in this thread, didnt sit right with me, because i wasnt trying to ruin anyones fun at all, thats not my style. my style is more of a freddie mercury meets hulk hogan circa 1982 with a dash of fred penner.

thanks for your kind words dude.


----------



## kirill1988

*mod edit: post a WTB in the classifieds when you meet the requirements or PM people, DO NOT post to buy things outside the classifieds*


----------



## thepylestory

I heard from Bernie today, acknowledging a spot transfer.


----------



## mikernaut

Still waiting to hear about the status of my rebuild. I see his email skills haven't drastically improved after all this.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah I haven't been here in a while but it seems to me like it's all the same old bullshit. Has anybody posted an NGD since they've received their guitars? Sounds like more delays from Bernie, and his FB page is still just dudes posting ads for their bands and crap. Pathetic.


----------



## SpaceDock

I've heard from bernie several times in the last few weeks including a phone call, but no guitar in hand. When we talked on the phone he really wanted to express how all of the guitars are unique and take a shit ton of time to fit all of the components since it is not cnc build where everything falls into place perfectly. I understand and critique at the same time. I would really like my guitar, but who knows.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

SpaceDock said:


> I've heard from bernie several times in the last few weeks including a phone call, but no guitar in hand. When we talked on the phone he really wanted to express how all of the guitars are unique and take a shit ton of time to fit all of the components since it is not cnc build where everything falls into place perfectly. I understand and critique at the same time. I would really like my guitar, but who knows.



Except that is also part of the bullshit. The dude gets his guitars pre-shopped, so unless they screw up the initial build, like they have on numerous occasions as a result of absolutely piss-poor communication skills, he just has to have his finish guy do his job, and then he installs hardware.

His biggest problem seems to be that he has absolutely no sense of order in his shop, and is probably groping around in the dark trying to find the initial spec sheets on his customers orders. Once again. Pathetic.


----------



## ovation22

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Except that is also part of the bullshit. The dude gets his guitars pre-shopped, so unless they screw up the initial build, like they have on numerous occasions as a result of absolutely piss-poor communication skills, he just has to have his finish guy do his job, and then he installs hardware.
> 
> His biggest problem seems to be that he has absolutely no sense of order in his shop, and is probably groping around in the dark trying to find the initial spec sheets on his customers orders. Once again. Pathetic.



^ this

Remember, it took a *year-and-a-half* of me requesting updates for him to finally admit he *lost* my order.


----------



## SpaceDock

Yeah, I am not trying to defend him, I am just stating what was communicated to me.


----------



## JPMike

There you go, an NGD thread!!

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/244663-ngd-took-2-years-you-guessed-right-brj-jekyll-724-a.html


----------



## Jexey

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ex...-bernie-rico-bfr-piezo-828-a.html#post3664206 
NGD!


----------



## SpaceDock

Yeah, he is doing my electronics install!


----------



## ras1988

SpaceDock said:


> Yeah, he is doing my electronics install!



Same here I just got a request for a control layout diagram out of the blue...... 

The wait is nearly over for this one, still have one more lurking about in either paint or pre-assembly.


----------



## JPMike

SpaceDock said:


> Yeah, he is doing my electronics install!



Finally!!!


----------



## Michael T

Final setup was finished today. said itll ship tomorrow or saturday.


----------



## thepylestory

^ lookin good!


----------



## Hollowway

So are all you guys who are getting these already paid in full? Ie did you pay in full last year, or is he reaching out to people to collect final payment? I know mine is close to being done, but I haven't paid anything beyond the downpayment, so I'm wondering if its going to be a number of months before he gets to those builds.


----------



## ras1988

Hollowway said:


> So are all you guys who are getting these already paid in full? Ie did you pay in full last year, or is he reaching out to people to collect final payment? I know mine is close to being done, but I haven't paid anything beyond the downpayment, so I'm wondering if its going to be a number of months before he gets to those builds.



Mine were "in stock" builds. One paid in full October of '11 (aborted BFR 6er from Thrasher) and the other deposit was put in November with a full payment in January of '12. Second one is the one that is getting finished up and it is not a BFR build by a long shot. Pretty special little piece he had in-stock.


----------



## JPMike

Hollowway said:


> So are all you guys who are getting these already paid in full? Ie did you pay in full last year, or is he reaching out to people to collect final payment? I know mine is close to being done, but I haven't paid anything beyond the downpayment, so I'm wondering if its going to be a number of months before he gets to those builds.



I have paid in full everything almost 2 years now. 



Michael T said:


> Final setup was finished today. said itll ship tomorrow or saturday.



It looks killer, man!!! Glad you got it finally!!!


----------



## Michael T

I only owed a couple hundred on mine, due to adding the gloss finish about 2 yrs into the build otherwise she'd been paid in full thru the whole process. I'm glad I opted for gloss, just gives one a more "finished" look IMO.


----------



## killertone

I paid in full a looooooong ....ing time ago. I have nothing except a couple progress shots from almost a year ago.


----------



## Shunpeita0212

This is my incoming Jekyll 724 slant top Alpine White 
Come on BRJ to Japan !!


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I am glad to see that he is trying to fix some of the process flaws, put the foam down on the work bench that had scratched a couple guitars. 

I wonder how many are left to complete from the pile.


----------



## JPMike

Shunpeita0212 said:


> This is my incoming Jekyll 724 slant top Alpine White
> Come on BRJ to Japan !!



So nice Shun!! Finally!!! Post an NGD thread!!


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

hey guys, can someone tell me which email address is currently working ? 

just have this one "[email protected]"

Cheers guys


----------



## mikernaut

That one is correct but he still seems to ignore a bunch of us


----------



## Shunpeita0212

Today this white venus arrives my home!!

This venus has no flaws
Absoletely perfect condition
Thank you Bernie!!

>JPMike
Yeah,she is finally here & perfect condition.
I'm very very happy!!
I will post NGD thread ,but now i'm enjoying with her


----------



## capoeiraesp

Holy smokes! Those side dots....


They're. 



Sober. 

Congrats on getting that one dude.


----------



## Michael T

Congrats man.

Mine still hasn't shipped out & I received the finished picture and stuff on the first.

Oh well.

Hope I hear something soon because we are finalizing our move into our new house Monday. That way I can at least notify UPS or whoever he uses to hold it at one of their stores.


----------



## SpaceDock

^probably waiting on cases , jk.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

'Bout time I email Bernie, at random, after months of no talk just to see where the hell anything of mine is, if in fact it still "is". Email going out time meow, following this post. Hope you guys keep getting stuff in and rolling out the NGDs.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

mikernaut said:


> That one is correct but he still seems to ignore a bunch of us




alright, thanks man


----------



## craigny

Michael T said:


> Final setup was finished today. said itll ship tomorrow or saturday.


Hope you get her soon man.....looks KILLER!!!


----------



## Michael T

Mine shipped out today, should have her by Wednesday or Thursday hopefully. **fingers crossed shes flawless**


----------



## JPMike

Michael T said:


> Mine shipped out today, should have her by Wednesday or Thursday hopefully. **fingers crossed shes flawless**



Finally!! I expect an awesome NGD thread!! I contacted Bernie yesterday and he told me he would be out of the shop for a few days. No clue...


----------



## Michael T

Thanks Mike. Checked tracking this morning it'll be here Friday. That means I'll have the weekend to look over it and give it a test run.


----------



## MetalDaze

Glad to see that there's a steady (albeit slow) stream of guitars coming out of the shop. I noticed xlguitars.com just got this in:







On the flip side, Bernie's website is down again.


----------



## thepylestory

I noticed aswell, pretty badass.


----------



## Michael T

Knock knock......(open door)


----------



## JPMike

Michael T said:


> Knock knock......(open door)



WE WANT MORE!!!!


----------



## craigny

JPMike said:


> WE WANT MORE!!!!



Yes!!!! Mike your killing us here bro!!! Hopefully your too busy playing it!!


----------



## Michael T

Ha ha, its been raining here so no outside shots & indoor shots wouldn't do her justice . I'll get a NGD posted hopefully tomorrow.


----------



## thepylestory

Tease


----------



## will_shred

Last I heard he was back and starting up production again, and I saw a few black friday NGD's. Any idea if he'll be taking orders any time soon? Or... well anything really. I'm just curious to know if anyone knows what's going on there. I've been seeing some new BRJ NGD's but i'm not sure if those are custom orders or just older guitars that have been traded around. 

Personally I wish the best for BRJ, I think that whatever it was that put him out of business for so long must have been pretty bad what ever it may have been. I mean, (most) people don't just risk throwing away their entire livelihood/reputations over just anything.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

will_shred said:


> Last I heard he was back and starting up production again, and I saw a few black friday NGD's. Any idea if he'll be taking orders any time soon? Or... well anything really. I'm just curious to know if anyone knows what's going on there. I've been seeing some new BRJ NGD's but i'm not sure if those are custom orders or just older guitars that have been traded around.
> 
> Personally I wish the best for BRJ, I think that whatever it was that put him out of business for so long must have been pretty bad what ever it may have been. I mean, (most) people don't just risk throwing away their entire livelihood/reputations over just anything.


 
Well, he is kicking out orders at what seems to be a better than expected but less than hoped for clip. Speaking from the custom side, I have not had one reply to any call, text, email, or FB message regarding mine, which is a full blown, regular price custom several years waiting, and counting. I was told 9 months ago is was going to be a rebuild and we changed 3 minor specs, added a stain. I'm sure that's put be at the bottom again and it will be another year + before that happens. He needs to finish all current orders, even stock for shops, before he starts taking orders. We know it's not going to hurt him; he has enough to do. 

What has me livid is not being able to plan accordingly for other instruments or just shit in general because you never know when you'll get that random ass request to pay off the other half because it's "almost done". There is no timeline, just patience and guesses. 

Place an order with Skervesen, Mayones, or whoever else and save yourself the agony. I've had stupid luck ordering from the wrong luthiers (CWG owes me a NECK- ordered 3 1/2 years ago, paid in full; I almost put orders in with S7G and Invictus; I would have killed myself or someone if I did that). Go with a more reputable and favored brand for now.


----------



## mikernaut

Well basically the story was he had some mental illness issues. He's back working apparently but is still super backlogged with orders. My emails are still being ignored and I'm waiting on my rebuild from before the Black Friday sale.


----------



## peet

I received my pickups from Bernie today! I seriously thought I'd never see them again. Apparently I'm still going to get my rebuild guitar but it won't be for a while...

I sold my 1st Jeckyll a few weeks ago and it's on it's way to Italy. I'm using the money to buy a Carvin CT7.

The adventure continues...

-P


----------



## Hollowway

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> He needs to finish all current orders, even stock for shops, before he starts taking orders.



Yeah, I think everyone with an order in queue would agree with this. But I wouldn't bet on it.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

And like magic I get an update: not much on the instrument, with more promised later. He actually called me out of the blue, which was welcomed and what ensued was a brutally honest and somewhat personal exchange about everything. He's noticeably frustrated with not being able to convey himself to everyone like he wants, but he admits it's his fault. He's not letting anyone front or be a voice for the business but himself, and the only answers one email address and phone. He isn't in the shop 24/7 like we want but it's because he isn't completely healthy. I feel he's gotta do what's right for himself or we aren't going to see anything guitar wise. He did swear he's been picking up the pace and is priorotized to existing orders only; no new ones yet, not even proper quotes. I reiterated he better be for his businesses sake, for quality sake, etc. he hinted that the brand needs to be smaller, and he bit off way too much and tried to get way to big which ....ed everyone in the process. 

BLUF: he's working more and more, completes more custom orders than store orders, and only current ones. Lets hope that stands. I said everyone here and elsewhere has been through a lot, have a lot of money involved, and that pressure won't dissipate until he's caught up. He is gracious to take blame for every failure. But I can sense the frustration he's dealing with. I said welcome to the club, more or less, and having been in bad straits like that he better dig in and let the deserved bad karma make him focus on his work and on making himself better.

In the end I was glad to shoot the shit after 9 months and glad he does sound positive enough to get things right at for now a reasonable pace and sooner a more expected demand. It'll never correct everything, but it'll close a chapter when we receive out guitars and he's moved forward. More updates to come in time. Meanwhile, in the rest of GAS-land...


----------



## Workhorse

Best of luck to him and everyone ordering as well. I've seen his guitars a few times (one at a show) and they look killer. Kind of surprised to read all this.


----------



## JPMike

Guys, you need patience and some pressure on him. You will get your guitars sooner or later, trust me on this one.


----------



## jayelnyc

SpaceDock said:


> Yeah, he is doing my electronics install!


 
Spacedock, so does that mean I should be getting mine soon?


----------



## thrsher

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> What has me livid is not being able to plan accordingly for other instruments or just shit in general because you never know when you'll get that random ass request to pay off the other half because it's "almost done". There is no timeline, just patience and guesses.



you get this from other luithers. im 26 months into my vik order and still get the above BS


----------



## killertone

Michael T said:


> Ha ha, its been raining here so no outside shots & indoor shots wouldn't do her justice . I'll get a NGD posted hopefully tomorrow.



Whatever happened with this this guitar? Curious as to how it turned out.


----------



## thegame

I'm not much for formal introductions, so I'll just jump in : 
What the heck is going on here ? :
Custom Rico Jr Six String Vixen Guitars
New Bernie Rico Jr Seven String Jekyll Guitars
Custom Rico Jr Diva Guitars - $2000


----------



## thrsher

thegame said:


> I'm not much for formal introductions, so I'll just jump in :
> What the heck is going on here ? :
> Custom Rico Jr Six String Vixen Guitars
> New Bernie Rico Jr Seven String Jekyll Guitars
> Custom Rico Jr Diva Guitars - $2000




o man


----------



## crg123

I think I'm more shocked by the fact that you came out of 7 years of hiding to post this! I figure Bernie had a lot of people bail on him and he needs the cash he lost fast to jump start his business. I'm assuming this is all him or else someone raided his shop! I think its funny that most of the pictures are of half finished guitars though.


----------



## MetalDaze

thrsher said:


> o man


 
+1


----------



## thegame

crg123 said:


> I think I'm more shocked by the fact that you came out of 7 years of hiding to post this! I figure Bernie had a lot of people bail on him and he needs the cash he lost fast to jump start his business. I'm assuming this is all him or else someone raided his shop! I think its funny that most of the pictures are of half finished guitars though.



Actually I'm just a fan of the guitars, certainly not his business practices as of late. I bought a brand new one in 2005 without issue, and a couple used ones since. Anyway, did this forum experience a crash at one time, ala HC ? I believe I had a few posts (maybe a couple dozen) to my name here around 2008 - 2010 but I think they got wiped out. Can't remember.


----------



## SpaceDock

thegame said:


> I'm not much for formal introductions, so I'll just jump in :
> What the heck is going on here ? :
> Custom Rico Jr Six String Vixen Guitars
> New Bernie Rico Jr Seven String Jekyll Guitars
> Custom Rico Jr Diva Guitars - $2000


 

Looks like someone selling their spots, probably just as sick of waiting as the rest of us.


----------



## thepylestory

Larrikin666????


----------



## MetalDaze

thepylestory said:


> Larrikin666????


 
Ahhh....just made the connection based on the location myself (even though he just moved).


----------



## Pikka Bird

Are these from people cancelling their orders or the people he's ignoring? In any case, why doesn't he just put them in his "in stock"-section on the website? He could easily move these quick to give him some funds to get going again. 

Also, the ads say "100% hand built by the son of the founder of BC Rich himself Bernie Rico Jr."... So what about the alleged Mexican location?


----------



## Larrikin666

Hi guys,

That's definitely not me. I just got settled here in Cali. I might message that guy to see what's up. Some of those are right up my alley, but I'm going to avoid spending any money for awhile. I have no intentions of selling my spots either. I love my Rico, and I plan on continuing with patience hoping it'll pan out.


----------



## Danukenator

They may be builds where the owners said "Hey, I've waited too long, the quality has been sketchy, I'm not going to bother paying for the rest." 

Hopefully we'll get an official statement.


----------



## Tesla

I wonder if the splatter Vixens were Jed Simon's...Seems like his kinda thing, and there's 4 of them which would be a big order, for a touring guitarist maybe. Fairly sure I remember him saying on Facebook he was waiting on Vixens.


----------



## thegame

I can't see those "belonging" to customers selling their spots. All are offered the full gamut of hardware colors and pickup choices. Probably some of the same guitars that were "almost finished" on his website last year, available direct. It has to be either Bernie himself or an inside man IMO.


----------



## thepylestory

Anyone heard from Bernie?


----------



## spawnsc

Bernie and i been texting off and on been asking for pics for like 2 months and no pics yet. Keeps sayibg next week, didnt like the one from the woodshop, ect.. i keep pressing on and hope to get a glimse of my guitar.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Yeah he still owes me a picture (if there is anything to show) since our last conversation. I'm actually not dieing to get it, and have been GASing for other stuff so I'm ok to wait on it. Gives me time to save some funds. I will keep texting him on and off just to know, but I am pretty sure there are a bunch still ahead of me, regardless that it's a full custom. I just hope this doesn't run into my Daemoness and Vik builds... my wallet may defect to Russia.


----------



## Michael T

killertone said:


> Whatever happened with this this guitar? Curious as to how it turned out.



Its a beast man. Turned out great ZERO flaws, finish is excellent plays like a dream loving the 20" radius and the neck is a perfect transition over from playing Ibanez mainly. 

We just moved still trying to get things arranged and setup not really much free time to play it or take some good pictures of her. They will happen tho just got to get some free time. 

in a nut shell its a great guitar near perfect craftsmanship so no complaints or worries from me. It was well worth the price paid.


----------



## GSingleton

I will be playing it next week


----------



## Diggi

thepylestory said:


> Anyone heard from Bernie?




I can't get any kind of solid response from him. 

Bummed.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Glad to see everything is right on track here, folks. /sarc

His FB page is definitely still just a big hole of unending weird guy spam, and no updates from anybody. My thoughts on the matter is that nothing good is going on. Good luck to you all, yet again.


----------



## MetalDaze

Well, at least his website is back up again


----------



## killertone

Michael T said:


> Its a beast man. Turned out great ZERO flaws, finish is excellent plays like a dream loving the 20" radius and the neck is a perfect transition over from playing Ibanez mainly.
> 
> We just moved still trying to get things arranged and setup not really much free time to play it or take some good pictures of her. They will happen tho just got to get some free time.
> 
> in a nut shell its a great guitar near perfect craftsmanship so no complaints or worries from me. It was well worth the price paid.



Good to hear. Congrats!


----------



## mikernaut

Anybody get any updates on their builds? getting quiet again it seems.


----------



## aiur55

I emailed him recently at his @yahoo.com account. No response yet. I still haven't paid the rest of the guitar off though.


----------



## Diggi

mikernaut said:


> Anybody get any updates on their builds? getting quiet again it seems.



Haven't heard JACK though I did get a response about the "nut" he needed to reorder for my build.......................................weeks ago. 

I can't get any kind of response now........


This is hard.


----------



## gerrawar

anyone got news from him???


----------



## gerrawar

[email protected] com

is that his only e-mail addres?????!!!


----------



## Diggi

I've asked for my money and pickups 6 times, and no response. 

Nothing.

.....


----------



## Khoi

Haven't heard anything since May 23rd when he said he was working on my guitar.. I tried asking for a refund (yeah right), and of course, no answer.


----------



## gerrawar

I'm getting tired of all this situation, i'm sending like 10 e-mails per day asking for the guitar or the refund, but nothing! other e-mail addres?????


----------



## SpaceDock

I really don't think badgering him is going to help anything. Good luck collecting if you take him to court. Its small claims so you are responsible for collecting. 

All any of us can do is wait and hope he makes good. These things take time. This happens with lots of the one man shops, not saying he does everything, you know what I mean.


----------



## gerrawar

yes, maybe i overeacted but i'm really tired because after over 2 years of waiting something have to be done.


----------



## SpaceDock

I know exactly what you mean, Im at three years in a month. I know Bernie's word is good, its just how long will it take. We might be having this same conversation next year, know one knows.


----------



## BouhZik

SpaceDock said:


> We might be having this same conversation next year, know one knows.



Maybe no one knows, but many can guess....
Just a look at this thread, It was the same conversation a year ago, and the year before. If all you can do is wait and hope, its too easy for him to f!ck you all.... You should have done something wayyyyy earlier.

Thanks to the mods for letting this thread be. I wanted one a few month back, until I read this nightmare. So, thank you.

Good luck to all


----------



## glassmoon0fo

The way I see it, Bernie is playing it now the way a lot if other, less-bothered builders have been doing it. There are quite a few well known builders on this site that have orders that will make it to well over two or three years, the only difference is they weren't optimistic enough to keep in constant contact with customers or (let's be honest) dumb enough to state unrealistic timetables. Most of them took nowhere near the amount of orders Bernie did either. I have orders in with two that have not contacted me or responded to emails AT ALL since they took my deposit, one of them makes two years next month. It's just how it is, and not just with him. I think he's shown that he intends to get everyone's builds done, and he's also shown that badgering on a mass level only gets so much done. Not saying you should not try to keep a bug in his ear, but I honestly don't think outright pestering him with legal threats is going to end up fruitful either. Honestly, any luthier could just disappear with your money same as Bernie could, but I think he would have done it by now. And let's not forget, guy tried to off himself not too long ago, I'm sure there's a fair amount of family healing he's working on right now. I'm waiting on different builders, but my situation is the same and so it is for countless others, keep the energy positive bro!


----------



## MetalThrasher

I should email Bernie again but I do realize what's going on and I don't want to distract him from work.... it's only been 15 months since I completely paid for the vixen that was almost finished. All kidding aside I almost forgot that I'm getting another guitar at some point. I hope that some of us start getting our guitars soon, especially for the ones who paid in full a while back.


----------



## JPMike

Hey guys,

How you all doing??? I guess, Bernie answers to no one?? Since, I have been spamming him with texts for a few days now and I haven't gotten any replies back. 

A month ago my stock guitars had the final clear applied on them and he told me in 2-3 weeks they would be ready, I gave him around a month's time and contacted him, but no luck. I am not sure what's up, is he pulling the same shit again?? Or went back to the hospital? or any other ideas?? 

I got pickups ready to be installed on these.


----------



## spawnsc

Here we go again, I've been promised pics for months now and nothing but run around answers. Now his not replying to any text. I'm happy some of you got your guitars but I and many others will probably not see ours and if we do it will be few more years.....


----------



## thrsher

his wife just posted on fb asking people to message her


----------



## Adrian-XI

Anyone see the Facebook post by Terry Rico? Check it out on the BRJ page.

Edit: ninja'd


----------



## flint757

Anyone do so and find out what's going on?


----------



## xwestonx

I sent a message on Facebook, but like everything else, I doubt I will learn anything new or get a reply. This has been one of the most frustrating experiences I've dealt with.


----------



## Khoi

I sent a message and got a reply 30 minutes later asking for proof of payment and my specs.

I would suggest providing those to her when you first message


----------



## Adrian-XI

Same as Khoi. Getting instant responses, but I now have to find some other information. Looks promising.


----------



## leonardo7

I heard through email from a guy who is friends with Bernie and who just saw him around a month ago. He says he was doing OK. But now its pretty bad again. He says that he is talking with Bernies wife about a way to possibly get everyones guitars finished some other way. That seems to be the focus right now. He says that there is a chance that there will never be another guitar coming out of his shop. He says that everyone should wish Bernie the best because its really bad and he is in a very bad place right now. Its not a joke and Bernies wife as well as a few of Bernies buddies in the business are working on alternatives to get the guitars done without Bernies help. Wish him the best guys. That is seriously all that I know. I asked about specifics but had to respect the answer that I got which was "Id rather not elaborate right now".


----------



## flint757

Makes sense. He cracked under the pressure the first time and when he got back the pressure was even more intense I'm sure since people didn't trust him anymore (for good reason). Honestly, I'm kind of surprised he's lasted this long his second go around. Not the right career choice for someone who's mentally unstable.

If he's down for the count hopefully everything works out for everyone.


----------



## xwestonx

Update: Terry asked me for proof of payment and specs. Sent both over. More communication than I've gotten in a long while.


----------



## DarkSaga

Sent my info over to her on Facebook...will hopefully get a reply in the morning and see whats up


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

I don´t know if it´s just me (and the fact that this whole situation is pretty f***ed up), but I was a bit pissed when she asked me to send a proof of payment "if you still want the guitar".

I mean, it has been almost 3 years and it is also their job as a business to keep their data in check. 

Anyway, I fortunately found the proof of payment and hope that she will make things right somehow....


----------



## peet

I sent a copy of my original build sheet and a description of what Bernie and I agreed on for the rebuild to his wife on FB. All the rebuild info was discussed over the phone with Bernie. I don't have high hopes of getting my rebuild guitar, we'll see.... At least I got my pickups back. What a mess...


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## SpaceDock

I'll take my money or an unfinished guitar with partial refund at this point. I could have gotten this finished by another luthier years ago and I offered her that. I would prefer just a refund thought. The guitar would be tainted in my mind forever if I had to .... around with gettin it finished at this point.


----------



## JPMike

Sent my info over too, let's hope I will hear back soon.


----------



## straymond

Man, my heart bleeds for you who are tangled up in this mess.
I sincerely hope you guys get what you've been waiting far too long for.
Keep backing each other up in this thread, and I'll keep rooting for you up here in the north.

Together you stand, divided you fall.


----------



## gerrawar

you see guys?? we need to beat him with e-mails and everithings like that, like i did on his fb page. 1day later terry contacted me asking for the proofs of my order! something is moving!


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## thepylestory

So how is it going to work if we took over a build spot?


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## xwestonx

Has anyone gotten any more information since the facebook post? I haven't heard a thing since I sent my proof of payment and build specs...


----------



## Khoi

All I got after sending my proof of payment and stuff was:

"thank you and very sorry, I will look in to this. Terry Rico"

I do truly hope that people don't lash out and personally attack Terry, as I'm sure she's trying her hardest to assuage the situation on top of having her own life and her own job apart from BRJ Guitars.


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## SpaceDock

Did she actually get back to anyone? I sent her a very nice message with all of the details and never heard anything back. I am wondering what all of this is about?


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## flint757

The fact that it is necessary should be a concern too (aside from Rico probably being down for good). Why wouldn't he have a list already of who has what and how much they paid? Why would she need to compile a separate one now?


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## SpaceDock

^ I am really hoping she is doing his admin work so he can focus on the builds. When I spoke to him a month ago he was oprimistic about finishing them up and turning a new leaf, only time will tell. 

Worse comes to worse they can give me a bandsaw or a motorized buffer for a refund, lol.


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## guitarman1990

JPMike said:


> You both got PM!!



hello can i also get his contact email got a couple of questions for a build PM me

thanks


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## Xaios

guitarman1990 said:


> hello can i also get his contact email got a couple of questions for a build PM me
> 
> thanks



Okay, seriously, did you bother reading any of this? Even _the last page_ of this thread? There's a reason the mods linked you to it beyond simply getting you his contact info.


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

guitarman1990 said:


> hello can i also get his contact email got a couple of questions for a build PM me
> 
> thanks



You...want....Bernie Rico Jr......to build you a guitar?


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## BIG ND SWEATY

guitarman1990 said:


> hello can i also get his contact email got a couple of questions for a build PM me
> 
> thanks


----------



## underthecurve

You guys should totally let Guitarman place an order. It will help finance the finishing of the black friday run, and hopefully some of you will get your guitars


----------



## Galius

Looks like someone is trying to sell their spot. Im sure there will be someone oblivious to the cluster.... that is happening and buy it though.

BRJ Black Friday Hesperian 8 String Spot | eBay


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## SpaceDock

^ I didnt think you could sell build slots, reservations, or other abstracts like that on ebay? 

OT, I still havent heard back from Terry, wondering what the deal is, why did she reach out if she wasnt going to respond? It doesnt seem like too many people posted replies on the FB page.


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## BIG ND SWEATY

underthecurve said:


> You guys should totally let Guitarman place an order. It will help finance the finishing of the black friday run, and hopefully some of you will get your guitars



No it'll finance his build and if they use the money for something other than that they don't deserve to be making guitars anymore.


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## Speculum Speculorum

And yet, the gyre that is BRJ Guitars continues to chomp away at the lives of individuals sucked into it's insatiable maw.

Seriously - anybody that comes forward to defend Bernie at this point needs a giant kick in the can.


----------



## angus

Speculum Speculorum said:


> And yet, the gyre that is BRJ Guitars continues to chomp away at the lives of individuals sucked into it's insatiable maw.
> 
> Seriously - anybody that comes forward to defend Bernie at this point needs a giant kick in the can.



Speaking as someone who has been through this with another builder (where I still don't have the instrument I bought), there will always people who will defend the builder and pick fights with the people who are out money. That's fine, as long as they at least address reality on reality's terms and acknowledge the problems going on. 

It's a horrible situation to go through, so I hope everyone is keeping their chins up as much as possible. 

Sadly, the selling of spots is surely making this mess much more complicated.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

People can't be blamed for trying to get out. If someone is ridiculous enough to purchase a spot off someone else, the blame is entirely theirs. There is so much availability of information about how big of a mess this whole company is that anybody actually seeking to do business with Bernie would have to be completely internet ignorant (like don't even use google) or pretty much totally retarded.

I wish people the best of luck, but I'm also saying that at this point his company is done for.


----------



## underthecurve

BIG ND SWEATY said:


> No it'll finance his build and if they use the money for something other than that they don't deserve to be making guitars anymore.



I was attempting to use satire to describe his current business practices. It's not an if. Page back a bit you will see he was accepting final payments for guitars whilst people who had payed in full were not being communicated with.


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## thepylestory

So no one has heard back from Mrs.Rico?


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## SpaceDock

Nope, I sent a follow-up message as well.


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## Diggi

I've been in contact with Terry. 

Bernie is back in treatment, and is so "voluntarily". 



Terry told me (at least) that she is working on Bernie's backlog of orders with the help of other luthiers and is concentrating on a method that can streamline the process. She has been to the shop and is trying to catalog people's builds. 

She works VERY long hours at her day job and is doing the best she can. 

She sent me images of what she thought might be my guitar, and I was able to confirm her assumption when viewing them. She and the luthier at the shop that day went through my specs and confirmed everything with me. 

I don't know when, how, what, etc.... but any updates I receive, I'll be passing along. 

I think Terry is a wonderful but overwhelmed person who continues to suffer through this ordeal whilst doing her best to sort it out. 

Even if you can't support Bernie at this point (I can't imagine many can), please do throw your support to Terry as she attempts to make sense of it all. A note of encouragement might make the difference in her efforts.


----------



## Tesla

'Stand by your man' has its full meaning here. Good on her, hopefully she can ease some of the pressure. 

Curious as to who the other luthiers are as well.


----------



## SpaceDock

Some dealer just posted on fb that they got guitars coming in that they ordered last year. Seriously, wtf? We've been waiting almost three now. Wtf ever happened to first in first out?


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## ikarus

do you have a link?


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## SpaceDock

Bernie Rico Jr. USA Hesperian 727 Trans Blue 7 String Guitar


----------



## Lorcan Ward

Dealers can offer a lot of money up-front which is an instant source of cash for a business in a spot of trouble. Since its then a legally binding contract for the goods they can dispute it and be refunded all the money if the deal goes south.

We can all agree its a very shameful business practice when you have a mountain of backlogged orders.

In this case the deal was heading south so they took the nearly completed guitars and finished installing the hardware and setting them up themselves.


> We visited Bernie at his factory in late August to finalize a few guitars that we have been waiting for. And this is one of them. Unfortunately Bernie has had a lapse and is not producing guitars right now. But this is one that was completely finished prior to him going into the hospital *but it just needed the hardware installed*. So here it is


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## SpaceDock

I offered that deal as well. It would suck to have to finish it myself but it would be better than not having the guitar.


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## Ill-Gotten James

SpaceDock said:


> Bernie Rico Jr. USA Hesperian 727 Trans Blue 7 String Guitar



HA! that guitar looks like the one that I received from BRJ and sent back for a full refund. It had some minor flaws to it and I was not satisfied. Yup, I got my entire $3000 back for the guitar. Below is the link for the NGD is posted a few months ago. Looks really similar is you ask me.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html#post3596291


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## Negav

Ill-Gotten James said:


> HA! that guitar looks like the one that I received from BRJ and sent back for a full refund. It had some minor flaws to it and I was not satisfied. Yup, I got my entire $3000 back for the guitar. Below is the link for the NGD is posted a few months ago. Looks really similar is you ask me.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html#post3596291



I think its the same, look as the flame below the neck pickup. Its the same pattern.


----------



## Metal_Webb

Ill-Gotten James said:


> HA! that guitar looks like the one that I received from BRJ and sent back for a full refund. It had some minor flaws to it and I was not satisfied. Yup, I got my entire $3000 back for the guitar. Below is the link for the NGD is posted a few months ago. Looks really similar is you ask me.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html#post3596291



Looks the same to me as well, the flame tightens on the same spot on the upper horn as well as below the neck pickup. Would explain how the dealer got it so quick.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Ill-Gotten James said:


> HA! that guitar looks like the one that I received from BRJ and sent back for a full refund. It had some minor flaws to it and I was not satisfied. Yup, I got my entire $3000 back for the guitar. Below is the link for the NGD is posted a few months ago. Looks really similar is you ask me.
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/se...f-ing-time-ngd-plus-more-56k.html#post3596291




hey james, was your guitar from the black friday run ? 

If yes, I can´t see why this would go for 3000 ?


----------



## Hollowway

Diggi said:


> I've been in contact with Terry.
> 
> Bernie is back in treatment, and is so "voluntarily".
> 
> 
> 
> Terry told me (at least) that she is working on Bernie's backlog of orders with the help of other luthiers and is concentrating on a method that can streamline the process. She has been to the shop and is trying to catalog people's builds.
> 
> She works VERY long hours at her day job and is doing the best she can.
> 
> She sent me images of what she thought might be my guitar, and I was able to confirm her assumption when viewing them. She and the luthier at the shop that day went through my specs and confirmed everything with me.
> 
> I don't know when, how, what, etc.... but any updates I receive, I'll be passing along.
> 
> I think Terry is a wonderful but overwhelmed person who continues to suffer through this ordeal whilst doing her best to sort it out.
> 
> Even if you can't support Bernie at this point (I can't imagine many can), please do throw your support to Terry as she attempts to make sense of it all. A note of encouragement might make the difference in her efforts.



How do we get in touch with her? Do you have an email? I can email her the most recent photos of my guitar and my specs if that helps her sort out things.


----------



## Vostre Roy

Negav said:


> I think its the same, look as the flame below the neck pickup. Its the same pattern.



Further more, you can still see the scratch on the high B saddle. The exact same scratch


----------



## ikarus

I think thats the peak of shamelessness, selling a flawed and sent back guitar as new for this amount of money! Even more than the original buyer has paid.


----------



## Pikka Bird

SpaceDock said:


> Some dealer just posted on fb that they got guitars coming in that they ordered last year. Seriously, wtf? We've been waiting almost three now. Wtf ever happened to first in first out?



They apparently just got lucky in that something they ordered had the same specs as a Black Friday Hesperian that got sent back... Good for them, but this isn't the guitar _they_ ordered.


----------



## JosephAOI

Vostre Roy said:


> Further more, you can still see the scratch on the high B saddle. The exact same scratch



Not to mention 












Yeah, I firmly believe it''s the same guitar.


----------



## aiur55

I too am interested in contacting Terry. I got an emailing from Bernie's yahoo email a couple months back confirming the control lay outs and then nothing.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Pascal-Darrell said:


> hey james, was your guitar from the black friday run ?
> 
> If yes, I can´t see why this would go for 3000 ?



It was not a Black Friday Run. I am like 99% certain that the guitar posted is the same one that was shipped to me. All I can say now is it's not my problem any more and I am happy to be free of that guitar. I must say though, the guitar did play and sound really sweet. But it was not worth the wait, or what I paid for it.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

It just keeps getting "better" with this guy...

And they're selling it for $3,900 too... I'm sure they didn't really know when they posted it though. Bernie had to fall long and hard to get to where he is by now. Shameless doesn't even really begin to describe it.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well, it looks like CMC is saying they didn't know it was a used guitar when they got it. There's an explanation up on the FB page. What a mess:

https://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars?fref=ts


----------



## Hollowway

Soooo...anyone got a good way to contact Terry? I want to get my guitar identified before it ends up going to someone else. Sounds like from the CMC post Terry and the other luthier aren't sure which guitars are which.


----------



## Ill-Gotten James

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, it looks like CMC is saying they didn't know it was a used guitar when they got it. There's an explanation up on the FB page. What a mess:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars?fref=ts



Yeah that does suck. I will back what CMC guitars is stating though. The guitar is solid. It plays well and is structurally sound. I had the guitar checked by two different independent repair shops who said the only problem with the guitar was cosmetic. The guitar also has Dimarzio D-Activators in it, not the crunch lab and liqui-fire as ad states. 

I only sent the guitar back because - A - I was not satisfied with what I got, after how long I waited. And - B - I won my credit card dispute. So a few days after I received the guitar, all of my money was refunded to me. So I had all of my money and the guitar. The right thing to do was ship the guitar back to BRJ. 

Whoever does decide to purchase that guitar though will most likely be very happy. Why? Because they did not have to wait a ridiculously long time to receive a BRJ guitar. And the guitar is barely used. I played it for about 2 hours total and kept it in its case for the rest of the time. It's still basically a new guitar, but not quite.


----------



## Erockomania

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, it looks like CMC is saying they didn't know it was a used guitar when they got it. There's an explanation up on the FB page. What a mess:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars?fref=ts



yikes


----------



## Khoi

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Well, it looks like CMC is saying they didn't know it was a used guitar when they got it. There's an explanation up on the FB page. What a mess:
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/ricojrguitars?fref=ts



Before it gets buried through the spam on Bernie's page:



> Here is the deal with this one. It turns out it is the same guitar. I had no idea this was actually sent back. I just found out today. Here is the back story. There is a Builder, who is a friend of Bernies helping Terry Rico sort through everything right now. The Builder helping out was a builder for BC Rich and worked side by side with Bernie for many years and knows the process inside and out. But he is not affiliated with Bernie Rico Jr Guitars nor does he work for them. He is a friend that is trying to help out. CMC Guitars was owed guitars just like everyone else. I had met with Bernie back in August to plan with him a small roll out of guitars that he had that were close to being finished. Bernie had told me that he had planned to make good on all the guitars that he owed people. Unfortunately Bernie had another relapse and went back into the hospital again. I was owed guitars but without Bernie around nothing could move forward, for me or anyone. In an effort to make good on things Terry and offered to get me an unclaimed guitar immediately to sell. Terry and the Builder found this guitar in the warehouse and offered it to us. They had no idea it was sent back either. They are trying to figure this big mess out. Apparently Bernie kept everything all to himself which was part of the problem. So none of us knew this guitar was sent back. But it is common that guitars sent back are resold. It happens all the time. I just wish that I knew about it. And unfortunately no one caught the issues. Now on to the guitar.
> 
> There is a shim in the neck under the fretboard. That is very common and standard in guitars. Many people probably own guitars with shims in them and don't know it. If the neck were painted you would never see or know there is a shim. This one is visible because the neck is natural. The shim is not separating from the neck. What you see in the pic on 7 String.org is the seem. I will be posting hi-rez pics. Admittedly this is aesthetically kinda sloppy on a guitar with this price tag. The neck should have been painted black. We unfortunately didn't catch this or know this when we listed the guitar. There is also a scratch on one of the bridge saddles that is not very noticeable. And the string ferrules aren't quite lined up on the neck center blank on the back of the guitar which Structurally the guitar is 100%. And the guitar plays and sounds amazing. And it looks incredible as well.
> 
> With all that being said, we are going to be offering this guitar at discount. The entire situation with Bernie sucks for everyone. CMC Guitars and the Builder is trying to help Terry out by taking some of the guitars that are done but that just need to be buffed and dressed. CMC Guitars will be selling those guitars that the builder can finish up. For the people that are owed guitars, if your guitar has been built but just needs to be finished I believe Terry is going to try to have the guitar finished off by the builder and try to make good on the orders. But anyone owed guitars needs to speak with Terry. CMC Guitars has nothing to do with any past orders or guitars that are owed to people. We were owed guitars prior to Bernie having his breakdown just like everyone else. We were asked if we could help sell off some of the additional inventory that was left that did not belong to anyone. So that is the extent of our involvement. And that is the entire back story on this guitar. We will be adjusting the price and disclosing all of this in the listing of the guitar. So overall this guitar is amazing and who ever buys it will be getting a killer guitar. Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## Pikka Bird

Those guys said:


> "Admittedly this is aesthetically kinda sloppy on a guitar with this price tag. The neck should have been painted black."



Covering up sloppiness with opague paint doesn't make it any less sloppy and doesn't make it any more reasonable "on a guitar with this price tag". And it should NOT have been painted black when it was ordered with an unpainted neck.

"Yeah, I know you wanted this-and-that finish, but I kinda fucked up and dropped a hammer right on the top so I had to paint the whole thing black. No discount!" 

And shims may be "common" from some manufacturers, but when you're paying prime bucks then you deserve to get a properly cut neck that doesn't require shimming.

I'm not dumping on the structural integrity of this guitar, but it just seems like you're losing your professional pride when you let these things become commonplace. In fact, I'm more saddened than angry.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

And for the record - I don't buy CMC's story for a single damn second. You mean to tell me that you had a guitar, took a bunch of professional photos of said guitar for your website, and didn't notice the flaws? Every single picture gracefully limits the perspective on the neck/fb joint, for example. I call shenanigans. Big. F'ing. Time.

And no matter what, $3,900 for a misnamed mahog/maple BRJ? The guy is off his ....ing rocker if he thinks he can legitimately charge that price at this point in the game. If that's the case, I'll sell you my quilt top BRJ Jekyll 727 that doesn't have a bunch of ....ed up cosmetic issues for $5,000 and buy a Daemoness or a custom Mayones and never speak about BRJ Guitars again. ....!


----------



## CMCgtrs

Pikka, I agree with you. I wasn't suggesting that Bernie should have covered it up and sell you something you didn't want or pass it off. If anything he should have disclosed it to you and offered you a discount like you suggested or offered to paint it. And shimming is just a reality of building guitars even the high end ones. I know it isn't pretty. It isn't always the case but it is a reality. 90% of the BC Rich Custom Shop Guitars are shimmed. I've seen it in Fender Custom Shop Guitars and a lot of other manufactures. I do agree that given a choice it would be better if the neck angle was cut right from the beginning. But having a shim in the guitar doesn't make for a bad guitar. But paying the kind of money that you did that guitar should have never gone out the door to you.

Speculum, I can't help that you don't believe our story but it is the truth. Not that you care but you can go to any other neck-thru guitar on our site and you will see the same picture angles used on every neck-thru guitar. So the pictures that were taken did not intentionally "limit the perspective on the neck/fb joint". It was a standard photo shoot for that type of guitar. Again, check out website if you don't believe me. We get lots of guitars in all the time. Our photographer just put the guitar up and snapped the shots. Sometimes things are initially missed. And sometimes, as the case with this guitar it was listed before having a full inspection by our guitar tech. Our guitar tech is only in 2 days a week so sometimes there is some overlap. Fortunately, with some help, this issue was caught. Thanks to those who posted and made us aware of this. We are not in the business of ripping people off or trying to hide flaws. It doesn't make any sense that we would do that over one guitar. And we have a return policy anyway that would allow anyone who bought the guitar to return it without question if they weren't happy. We've never let someone walk away unhappy or stuck with a guitar they didn't like or want. So there was no shenanigans. We will be taking better hi-rez pics of the neck joint and posting them and offering this guitar at a discount. It is still a killer guitar that plays and sounds great. Anyone who gets it will love it and will have full disclosure of the cosmetic issues. Thanks again to all those who brought it to our attention. Peace to all.


----------



## Hollowway

Not to come to Bernie's defense (given that I'm in the same boat as everyone else), but the neck shim is his building technique. Not the neatest or cleanest one, but it is an intentional thing on all BRJ neck thrus. The higher the bridge sits the thicker the shim, and the more noticeable it is. I talked with him about it when I got my (non BFR) Jekyll 828 with a Kahler and noticed a thick shim in there. He said he was thinking of changing the way he constructs neck thrus to be more like Carvin, et. al., and not have that. I talked with a couple of other luthiers who said that it is a legitimate building technique that some people use. But again, maybe not the cleanest. It's possible that it's an older technique, because Bernie also told me they do tops old-school, by putting the top on, then tying rope all around the guitar and jamming wood pieces between the rope and body to tighten it up. (I asked because I had a couple of gaps between the body and top.)

Edit:  by CMCgtrs.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah I should probably apologize about that shot. It was rude of me. I just tend to get a little agitated about all this BRJ stuff after having dealt with him and seeing what people have gone through.


----------



## CMCgtrs

Speculum, no worries man. It is ok. There are a lot of unhappy customers and dealers waiting for guitars. Emotions run hot. And Bernie messed up bad. I was asked by to step in and help Bernie and Terry out because they are strapped and they have some finished inventory but no means of selling it. And I did so against my better judgement. And now with Bernie back in the hospital Terry is completely flying blind. It is a catch 22. Bernie has no cash to build new guitars and he can't sell their any of their existing inventory because every bridge was burned. I think CMC Guitars might sell through what we have, which is 4 guitars, and bow out of this mess. Unless this Builder can piece together a coherent plan with Terry to salvage the inventory he has left I think it will all go to waste. There are about 40 guitars that I saw with my own eyes that just need to be assembled. I'm sure some of them are owed to other people. So if anyone is owed a guitar get in touch with Terry via Facebook. She is going to try to make good on things. But honestly, if someone has a guitar that hasn't even been started I don't see it getting finished because there is no building going on and no money for materials. The 4 guitars I got, with the exception of this Hesperian, were all assembled with parts on hand. They best hope for those people would be to settle for another guitar that is already built. Even if it isn't exactly what you want at least you have something that could be sold, because I don't think anyone has a chance of getting money back. Trust me, I tried. You can't get blood from a stone. All the best.


----------



## SpaceDock

Getting a hold of Terry via FB is useless. I have messaged many times and tried to be as nice as possible but I havent heard anything back at all. 

My guitars were just needing hardware two years ago when they got fully paid off. I have been waiting three years for them to be finished, I never changed specs or caused any problems for them. Myself and many others are pure victims. 

I have offered: refunds, trading for in stock, and finishing them myself.

They need to fix this sooner than later and not worry about selling new guitars or messing around with future plans.... finish the guitars you already sold or give me my money back.


----------



## canuck brian

If anyone in Canada is able to get a hold of their blank/non-assembled guitar, I'll do the assembly and setup for you no charge. If it's just parts that are required, we'll figure something out if someone takes me up on this.

I just want to see guys get their guitars.


----------



## Forkface

canuck brian said:


> If anyone in Canada is able to get a hold of their blank/non-assembled guitar, I'll do the assembly and setup for you no charge. If it's just parts that are required, we'll figure something out if someone takes me up on this.
> 
> I just want to see guys get their guitars.



I know it says "only updates by customers" but I just wanna say kudos to you man   It's people like you who make the world a better place, seriously.


----------



## SpaceDock

canuck brian said:


> If anyone in Canada is able to get a hold of their blank/non-assembled guitar, I'll do the assembly and setup for you no charge. If it's just parts that are required, we'll figure something out if someone takes me up on this.
> 
> I just want to see guys get their guitars.



When I talked to Bernie on the phone a few months ago, he stated that one of the big issues is that every guitar is a bit different, no templates or cnc; so the assembly takes a lot longer than piecing together most guitars. Every guitar has to be shaped to the hardware and specially fitted to get it right, but that is his story if we want to believe it. I have rebuilt many guitars and I offered to do this, but he turned me down via email years ago and on the phone a few months ago. He said "no guitar of mine iwll ever be finished outside of my shop." Maybe Terry will change this. In my case, one of my guitars had a floyd, so if I didnt get all of the hardware it would really suck to eat the cost.


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## mniel8195

I think bernie needs to get a cnc machine and call it a day. That way he can focus on fret work and assembly etc...


----------



## Diggi

Hollowway said:


> How do we get in touch with her? Do you have an email? I can email her the most recent photos of my guitar and my specs if that helps her sort out things.




Sorry I've been away on business. Email seems to be the best contact method so far, but messaging through FB is recommended as well.


----------



## Hollowway

And we're messaging Terry on her personal FB page or just through the BRJ official page?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> And we're messaging Terry on her personal FB page or just through the BRJ official page?



http://www.facebook.com/BRJguitars has a post asking for people to message her there. I haven't gotten a response yet (messaged a few days ago), but I'm sure she has a lot to handle with all of this mess so it could take a bit.


----------



## JPMike

Still no answer through Facebook, it's been quite some time since she posted that status update. :S


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## mikernaut

Facebook is hard! (sarcasm)


----------



## crg123

Rico seems to have changed his site since I've looked at it. Granted that was a long time ago. What sparked my interest was the fact that he used the photo I took for a friend of mine without even asking me twice once at column 5, row 2 and column 1, second to last row. I don't care but I'm not exactly happy that my photography is being used to support him at this point. I wonder if anyone else's photos were thrown up on here. Note he's also put a watermark saying "copyright Bernie Rico Jr Guitars 2013" towards the middle of the page:

http://www.ricojrguitars.com/

phot they're using: http://nebula.wsimg.com/bfbd8b11cbf...ccessKeyId=DA010C3C18D7A7A8692E&disposition=0







Just kind of interesting more then anything. I wonder when the site was updated considering whats been going on with all you guys.


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## mikernaut

He updated it a month or 2 back. I believe this pic was from Joe Sousa's NGD thread .

http://nebula.wsimg.com/8ce3b5ce812b0e27828d8c1f40dbdfe4?AccessKeyId=DA010C3C18D7A7A8692E&disposition=0


----------



## technomancer

mniel8195 said:


> I think bernie needs to get a cnc machine and call it a day. That way he can focus on fret work and assembly etc...



You do realize that's all Bernie was doing anyways, right? He does not build the guitars or do the finish work, he just does final assembly and setup (or did).


----------



## JP Universe

Not gonna bother messaging Terry... I'll give it 3 months before I message whoever the .... is taking care of this mess again. At this point I've accepted that my deposit is gone


----------



## SpaceDock

Your lucky youve only got the deposit to worry about. Some of us are balls deep in this shit. I'm not too bad, thank god. Gotta feel for the guys with 5 guitars all paid for.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

People keep talking about how terrible his current situation is. I think we can deduce a lot by looking at this mess from where it really started unraveling: THE BF SALE.

1. The BF sale was supposed to be capped at 15. Although it is unclear exactly how many order were taken, he VASTLY overshoots the number quoted - it sounds like somewhere between 100-200 guitars were allowed in.

2. After the BF sale, Bernie continues to take custom shop orders, quoting ridiculously low build times. And I mean, RIDICULOUSLY LOW - 4 months, for example.

3. Shortly after the following winter, Bernie begins developing "health problems", and goes missing for several periods.

4. The winter after the next Summer, Bernie goes missing for a long period of time. It is eventually found out that he was hospitalized and in a coma - that he nearly died. John (his assistant) quit during his hospitalization. When Bernie gets out he blames all the business failures on John not keeping up on his duties.

*It's worth noting that during a personal phone conversation with Bernie about his coming back (still hadn't received guitar) he was much more upset that John did not tell him about countless individuals who wanted to place orders... he still wanted to take orders on top of everything he already had going.

4. Bernie puts on a spring sale offering his half-finished models up for grabs from his website saying that he can finish them and send them to customers shortly after purchase. Bernie continues to take orders from people, accepts deposits, and STILL quotes impossible build time estimates.

5. Bernie does complete a couple guitars, all of which have at the very least cosmetic issues or incorrect specs, several of which have issues with structural integrity or gross flaws that warrant being sent back.

6. Bernie goes missing again. This time months pass before we find out that Bernie is in a hospital undergoing psychiatric care after apparently attempting suicide. After getting out, Bernie says he's going to get things on track, and the last known guitar to be completed was in August 2013.

7. After going missing again, we find out Bernie is re-hospitalized. At this point we discover that he has absolutely no money left in the business and that he left absolutely no records for any of his orders. His wife is apparently trying to make sense of it. Now almost no one has heard from her either.

OK folks. I think it's time that we realized that no matter how you swing it, people got straight jacked out of their money. It is apparent that Bernie was having financial struggles, and took on a bunch of orders hoping to save his own ass. Even after he knew (HE HAD TO KNOW) that he wasn't going to be able to build guitars currently on order, he just kept taking orders. He told absolutely NOBODY about the fact that he was taking more orders, or that he was having severe emotional and financial troubles. Finally, realizing he is completely boned, he falls into a depressive cycle and tries to kill himself.

If you think you're going to be getting a guitar at this point, you're also out of your friggin' noggin.


----------



## leonardo7

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Once again - he has... NO RECORDS OF BUILDS! NONE! NADA! ZILCH!



Im just curious. Why do you say that?

Bernie does have a folder full of everyones specs. I saw it in person two years ago when we visited his shop. I dont know if he has record of the spot exchanges but he does have a folder with everyones original specs, names, info etc. At least from prior to Oct '11 when I was there. So that would basically mean that all of the original BFR info as well as all builds prior are in there. I would assume that some of the spot exchanges are also in there. Its at his main desk in the middle of his shop.


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## Speculum Speculorum

Did Terry not just say that she can't find any information on people's guitars?

Unless I seriously misunderstood or something.

EDIT: Yes it looks like I missed something. At no point in the thread or on BRJ's website does it say there's a lack of papers on the guitars. My mistake. I will edit my previous post to reflect it.


----------



## Khoi

There HAS to be some sort of record, whether it's peoples invoices for their payment (which is automated), or an e-mail of specs.

At the very least he should've still had all the e-mail conversations from his customers on the e-mail server, which would be insane to sort through, but it'd be there unless he purposely deleted them all.


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## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah I was wrong. Nowhere in the thread does it say that Bernie didn't have records of our orders.

However - I know for a fact that the first time he got sick, when John quit, he admitted that John had deleted any emails going back further than 6 months and that he hadn't responded to 99% of the emails he'd received in the last 6 months anyway.

So if you had any communication about an order from before that point that didn't make it to your hard copy, it's lost for good.


----------



## Hollowway

Hey does anyone have Terry's cell number? I want to call her directly.


----------



## teleofseven

hasn't anyone still filed a lawsuit? why do you still keep dissecting what happened?
jesus people! this isn't a game or a movie or a ....ing book! this is real! 

you have to take action and stop writing in here! leave the investigations to the authorities! it is absolutely useless to bitch and moan about it in here. all your complaints and problems are falling on deaf ears. you'll get nowhere here.


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## SpaceDock

Easier said than done bro... the cc or PayPal refund timeframe is well past. That leaves small claims. Problem there is the winner is responsible for collecting. That means you have to hire a collections company. He doesn't have wages to pull from, we all know that. Class action is a joke unless we find a lawyer to work pro bono. Sm I forgeting anything? We've been through this before many times.


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## Speculum Speculorum

Even if somebody won it would be like squeezing blood from a stone, dude.


----------



## Khoi

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Even if somebody won it would be like squeezing blood from a stone, dude.



Yeah, it would end up being our own blood.

Still awaiting a response from Terry on both Facebook and e-mail. All I want now is to just get my guitar in whatever shape it is so I can just finish it off myself or something.


----------



## basssolo4u

expletive deleted


----------



## SpaceDock

Did anyone even get a response from Terry? This just seems so f'ed now. They should at least send us our wood and parts so we are not 100% boned here.


----------



## mikernaut

Nothing, I have posted a couple msgs on the Facebook page and a pic of my painted guitar to try a get some sort of a response.


----------



## craigny

Shoot...i thought some people were starting to get guitars...it seems like the train has de-railed once again...


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

I've PM'd on facebook, a couple weeks ago. Same shit, no answer. It's anybody's guess, positive or negative, as to what is going on.


----------



## Watty

*Mods: Leave or delete at your discretion...*

Since I recall seeing a person or two that had successfully received a chargeback from their CC company, I figured this might be a good place to ask the following. I might be pursuing this option for a slightly different situation and was wondering what sorts of documentation they requested, what the overall timeline was, and any questions that they asked. PM me if you've got pertinent info or insight.

To the rest, here's hoping there's some sort of resolution, whether it be in hardware, a semi-complete body, or otherwise.


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## SpaceDock

^ most banks are 90 days, paypal is 1 year, iirc


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## Ill-Gotten James

Believe it or not disputes can be fought for up to 1 year after the charge, depending on the circumstance. You have to have damn good documentation though, which I was lucky enough to have, that explains why you did not file a dispute within the first 90 days of the charge. 90% of my communication with BRJ was through email. Not phone calls or texts. The email communications proved that BRJ violated our sales agreement, in addition to proving why I could not file a charge dispute within 90 days of the charge. It took 10 months of fighting with the bank and I had to file the paper work multiple times, but I never gave up. And I won. 

Sadly to say if you don't have thorough documentation of the transaction, build time, reasons for delay, bullshit reasons for delay, lies, and who knows what else you've been told by BRJ documented in email, you might be screwed at this point. Best of luck to you all and I wish you the best in getting your money or guitar.


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## xzyryabx

I don't have a dog in this fight, but fwiw, if you paid via amex there is a good chance that they will help you work something out re a chargeback. definitely worth a shot and you have nothing to lose. just collect all the evidence you have. they have lawyers and can afford to go after him, especially if they get enough complaints.


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## Hollowway

Yeah, +1 to the Amex. Unfortunately I used a Visa. 
I think I'm going to file a small claims suit, though. I'm just getting sick of it, and I think I've given plenty of time and communication attempts.


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## CMCgtrs

I thought I'd let everyone know that it is game over for Bernie Rico Jr guitars. They have no money. The shop owed too much in back rent. They were forced to close it down last weekend. Bernie is still in the hospital. I don't know what happened to the guitars that he did have. My source says Terri moved some stuff back to their house, sold off some of the parts and scrapped some stuff. None of us will be getting the guitars we were owed. This sucks for everyone.


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## eaeolian

CMCgtrs said:


> I thought I'd let everyone know that it is game over for Bernie Rico Jr guitars. They have no money. The shop owed too much in back rent. They were forced to close it down last weekend. Bernie is still in the hospital. I don't know what happened to the guitars that he did have. My source says Terri moved some stuff back to their house, sold off some of the parts and scrapped some stuff. None of us will be getting the guitars we were owed. This sucks for everyone.



Any actual source for this, or just piling on like everyone else?

I'm the last to defend Bernie, but you having 3 posts and spitting this out doesn't inspire a wealth of confidence in the source, y'know?


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## jfrey

eaeolian said:


> Any actual source for this, or just piling on like everyone else?
> 
> I'm the last to defend Bernie, but you having 3 posts and spitting this out doesn't inspire a wealth of confidence in the source, y'know?








hope that this is not true.


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## Tesla

Yeah...while what you're saying sounds plausible (with you being a dealer he recently dealt with) we're still gonna need evidence.

There shouldn't be any secrecy needed here, if he is indeed finished. There's nothing left to maintain a secret etc.


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## SpaceDock

For the love of christ they should give us the bodies unfinished.


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## Pascal-Darrell

Oh man -.- They have my bare knuckles and my guitar is also nearly finished. They really should give us the guitars as they are now. That´s the least they could do atm. 
This sucks so damn hard...


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## HRC51

CMCgtrs said:


> I thought I'd let everyone know that it is game over for Bernie Rico Jr guitars. They have no money. The shop owed too much in back rent. They were forced to close it down last weekend. Bernie is still in the hospital. I don't know what happened to the guitars that he did have. My source says Terri moved some stuff back to their house, sold off some of the parts and scrapped some stuff. None of us will be getting the guitars we were owed. This sucks for everyone.



I feel sick, and my wallet robbed!

I have a picture of my guitar that is basically complete. I'll finish it and even pay for shipping. It's the least they can do.


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## Speculum Speculorum

Guys - it was just a matter of time. He was upside down on his business, his home, and was not doing any productive work as things really started going downhill.

It is pretty clear that the Rico family is not going to help you. Those of you with significant money invested (you guys that are 10 guitars deep or so) should probably seek legal council. Seriously.


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## CMCgtrs

I'm not piling on. My source is Terry and the builder who will remain nameless (due to the fact he works for another major manufacturer) that was helping them. I was trying to help Bernie and Terry by getting them some orders to help get them some cash flow to get their business going again. I did this even though I was owed guitars. And I did so because I believe in the product I quickly found out that it was a mistake for me to get involved and that the company had no chance for survival. I actually was at Bernie's shop in August and had lunch with him. So I know what the situation is. And having met with him things were actually much worse than I could have imagined. I ended up getting 4 guitars out his shop in September and October and almost got screwed on them and would have unless my friend who is the builder didn't step in. And I for a brief moment considered buying the Bernie Rico Jr guitars name and all of his stock and debt as well but as they don't even have any clear idea of how many people they owe guitars too or what their total debt is I quickly dismissed that idea. Because if I was going to take that on I'd have complete all the guitars that people are owed. I couldn't come up with a price for the shambled remains of the company without knowing the risk and full debt. And Bernie didn't even build the guitars like everyone thought. He only put the frets and hardware on the guitars and sometimes didn't do that. So the company could go on with the wood shop that Bernie used to actually build the guitars and someone who could actually run the business but there was too much of a mess and risk. And not for anything Bernie's name is so trashed I don't know if a company using that name could make it. So it is game over for them. We are all screwed. Legal action is probably the only recourse but even then they have no money and no assets. Getting blood from a stone is not going to happen. So it is a sad day. Such great guitars. Unfortunately Bernie didn't know how to run a business.


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## CMCgtrs

So, yes. Bernie's shop is officially closed and shut down. The land lord had them clear out last weekend.


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## Speculum Speculorum

Well - what about people who had guitars reported as nearly finished? Or pickups on order? Are these people just hosed out of their investments into this shit-head? Or is the situation so out of control that there's no way to even figure out what is what at this point?


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## SpaceDock

^ exactly, why cant they send us our guitars as is so we are not totally screwed?


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## WickedSymphony

Yeah, I don't see why they can't just send us what's already done. My guitar was literally almost complete and I'd rather take that than nothing.


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## Khoi

So if they cleared out the shop, where are they keeping the guitars? Or the owed hardware (pickups, etc.)?

I'm sure they just didn't trash them all?

I would literally be willing to drive out to the shop and just pick it up myself next time I'm in California or have someone do it.


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## Speculum Speculorum

I mean, dudes, let's be real here. As CMC noted, it looks like inventory management was completely abandoned. And if no one is responding to emails or calls it's a pretty safe bet that unless legal action is involved, not a soul will be receiving anything from BRJ Guitars.

If I were you guys, I'd be calling a lawyer if you have big money invested. If you want to retrieve property that you paid for such as hardware/pickups, and no one has responded to you, I would call the local cops and report stolen property.


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## Pascal-Darrell

I will contact my lawyer next week and see what he can do. It´s a very shitty situation especially when you don´t live in the usa like I do. 

I want my pickups back at least, they´re my property and have nothing to do with bernie besides that they´re in his shop for about 2 years collecting dust. 

My nearly finished guitar or money back would also be great.


!!! ANY HELP IS MUCH APPRECIATED !!!

So if we can achieve more together count me in !


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## Lorcan Ward

You guys should try find someone who leaves nearby and knows or can get in contact with Terry so they can meet up and try to at least get an idea of where things go next + how to get incomplete builds and hardware out to people. 

I and many others would be willing to put together a paypal fund for fuel costs to help you guys out. 

Be prepared to pay shipping again though since the money originally allocated to it will be long gone. Having to pay shipping expenses and a luthier to finish your guitar does suck but its one of the only options at the moment.


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## jbguitarking

I've been following this thread for a while even though I haven't got an order with Bernie but what would it take for a few people with orders that live near Bernie to try and find him and just tell him "Send out the guitars as they are, people want SOMETHING".

I feel so sorry for all of you who live far away and dont even have the option of driving out to him to at least get whats been made so far of your instruments.


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## ramses

I did not order a BRJ, however I did suffer something similar some years ago: a custom laptop maker went under immediately after I placed my order (yes there are such things and yes I'm a nerd) ... so, I do know how this feels.

I hope that they will show some respect for you, the people that trusted them, and therefore find a way to recreate the inventory to at least return you your hardware.


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## flint757

I'd be willing to bet they sold it all off already or used parts in the last couple finished builds.

A lot of people are also saying they had nearly complete guitars. I have a feeling y'all were conned into believing that. If they were nearly done there would have been no need for some of the delays.

Based on what CMC said it sounds like Terry was gathering intel not to get you your stuff back, but to determine debts owed and inventory levels. It was only a matter of time honestly. He had no revenue coming in because he mishandled his funds. He'd need a huge loan or investor to get all of the guitars owed out and get a revenue stream going again.


----------



## Tesla

Surely though, if all the stuff (which I imagine was a LOT) was being sold off...someone on the forum would know about it? Or have seen something?


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## SpaceDock

Many of the guitars were almost done and we have seen pics to prove it. I have photos of my two guitars finished sans hardware with my name written in the neck pickup cavity. Selling or giving that to someone else would be totally funked and should raise red flags to any buyer.


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## Hollowway

Does anyone have Terry's number? My guitar is very close to done, based on the photos, and I'd actually pay her to get it. Which is Latin for I'll go to her house, get it, and give her money. I've only paid the deposit. I find it hard to believe that she, having been in there, would just have the landlord throw them all away. Many of those guitars are close enough to being done that they could quickly generate some revenue by collecting and shipping them out. Even if I was a landlord I'd feel weird about throwing away literally dozens of guitars in various states of completeness.

So does anyone have Terry's number they could PM me?


----------



## SpaceDock

I'm sure I'm not the only other person who wouldn't like her number, but if everyone gets her number it will be a slaughter.


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## paddy

Maybe they didn't throw the guitars away just like that. Maybe what they did was that they tried to pay their debts (for example to landlord, etc) with your guitars, your hardware and so on.


----------



## MetalDaze

Time to setup some BRJ alerts for eBay and Craigslist.


----------



## DarkSaga

Man...this is soooo ....ed!!!!!!!!

Ok.... I am a guitar tech up here in Los Gatos, CA @ Keith Hollands Guitar Hospital and I would like to extend my hand in trying to help getting people their guitars finished or unfinished, parts they shipped to Bernie, whatever so we can hopefully salvage something from this funked up mess that I am also apart of. I just shot Terry a message on Facebook, but CMC guitars, can you pm me Terry's # or call her and let her know that she can contact me?


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## HRC51

I thought about small claims court before, but it's really difficult to collect. Especially if you live out of state. My claim would be $2200

However, Bernie has stolen what $50-100,000 from people?

This is criminal! 

Bernie Rico Jr. should be in jail


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## DarkSaga

If anybody has any contact info they can share...then please pm it to me!!!! I am down to head out this Sunday if need be to claim my shit and hopefully work on snagging some other peoples stuff


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## mikernaut

Yeah , if anyone can actually go out to the shop and rescue any guitars I'd be more then willing to pay for shipping/gas money. 

My guitar would be easy to spot because its a bright pink 7 string Jekyll with white binding around the whole guitar. Looked like it just needed hardware and electronics. I had also sent him my other BRJ hardshell case with brand new white BKP Nailbombs, and a check for $80 for the return shipping which we had agreed upon before things went south.


----------



## mtndrew

Hey guys! I don't really post too much on here. Anyways, I wanted to let you guys know that I recently contacted my bank, Bank of America, and gave them the story about how I paid for the rest of my guitar back in January when all it needed was "final setup" and was 3 - 4 weeks out, blah, blah, you know this whole story. After just a short 10 minute phone call with the CSR and providing a few details along with Bernie's contact information, they refunded the charge and interest to my Visa card. I'm still out the money I paid for the build spot and the set of camo Aftermaths I sent him to replace the painkiller/cold sweat combo originally ordered, but it stings a lot less now. So there might still be hope for some of you guys out there to get some of your money back. 

I also wanted to say that I would be down to pay gas and shipping to anyone that could possibly recover the unfinished guitar and pickups. Here is a pic and specs:


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## leonardo7

Guys, the landlord company that owns the building owns his shop now. Contact them!


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## Speculum Speculorum

Somebody on his FB page just reported that indeed, everything has been moved out of the warehouse. They contacted local police, who said that they will have to file civil suit in order to involve police action. The individual responded that they will be going to the court house first thing Monday morning.

People - it's time to hop on that train if you can. Otherwise, prepare to be lubed up and penetrated. Big time.


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## SpaceDock

What is the landlord company? Do you have any contact info?


----------



## xwestonx

Well F#@$ me. I guess I can try bringing it up with the bank again, but I looks like I am out of luck. Just needed hardware and puckups...


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Hey guys, I contacted the guy who posted that on fb. 

He told me that there is nothing left but "thrash" in the shop and that the landlord is an old man who doesn´t know much about bernie and I think we shouldn´t bother him too much with thousands of calls etc... 

It looks like we have to contact the police and try to get Terry's number.


----------



## Hollowway

I contacted the police to file a report but they told me I have to file a report in the city where I ordered the guitar, so they're headed over to my house for me to file a report. Maybe the next thing is to get Terry's address? I have an address for them, but according to Trulia the house was sold last summer, so that's either their new address (doubtful) or their old address. I did oodles of internet searching, and I can't come up with anything about her, in terms of address, etc. Anyone have Bernie's new address or her phone number?

I'll probably have to hire a PI, but it appears her name is Teresa A Rico. Spokeo has what seems to be the best info on her, but I'm not sure how accurate it is, so I'm not sure I want to "join" to see what the email and phone number listed is.

Edit: Crap. So this is not considered theft because the item was not taken from my possession. It's just a civil matter, and a police report will not gain me any more than just filing on my own. The next thing up is to call the court system and see if I can file up here or if I have to go down there. And then I gotta find the guy to serve him.


----------



## kmanick

wow......hadn't checked in on this thread for a while,and now it's worse than ever.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Yeah dude. This is total shit. I think any of us would take anything at this point over nothing. 

I wonder if BC Rich would ever get involved. At what point does Bernie drop the pride and reach out for help? From anyone???


----------



## abandonist

I've read every page of this disaster.

Anyone have any idea exactly how many guitars were ordered?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Man - everything is up in the air. It's anywhere from 100-250 guitars or so...


----------



## spawnsc

i've done everything i know to do.. I would spend more on lawyer then i put on the guitar ($1500). I had to tell my wife all of this mess few months ago and I felt horrible because she didn't like me sending money to a person I didn't know to have a guitar built. She couldn't understand why I couldn't just go to Guitar Center for another guitar. I told her Bernie had a good reputation and would not screw me. 2 years later I tell her he screwed me over and I will probably not see my guitar or our money. Only thing I can really say about this whole situation is screw you Bernie, and i'm sorry you guys are in the same if not worse situation then i'm in.

I don't even believe he ever had my guitar even started. He would promise me pics, and told me the first guitar that came out of the wood shop didn't meet his expectations and he asked for another one. He would promised pics next week, after the weekend, or he was out of town and couldn't send the pics at the moment. I could go on and on, we all have heard it before.


----------



## xCaptainx

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> I wonder if BC Rich would ever get involved.



Nope. I caught up with BC Rich at their head office during our american tour in April. http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ge...-rich-schecer-fender-ar-office-pic-heavy.html

I got them up to speed with this debacle back then. They had absolutely no idea and were very sorry (though not suprised) to hear what was going on.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

xCaptainx said:


> They had absolutely no idea and were very sorry (though not suprised) to hear what was going on.


 
Not surprising, given that BRJ nearly destroyed B.C. Rich not once, but twice, to the point Harmon had to invest thousands so it wouldn't sink. 

Stuff like this is NOT new in the BRJ camp, hence why I and many others were very skeptical of this whole deal in the early phases. 

B.C. Rich and BRJ haven't been affiliated in many years, and if you do a little bit of reaseach you'll see why.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not surprising, given that BRJ nearly destroyed B.C. Rich not once, but twice, to the point Harmon had to invest thousands so it wouldn't sink.
> 
> Stuff like this is NOT new in the BRJ camp, hence why I and many others were very skeptical of this whole deal in the early phases.
> 
> B.C. Rich and BRJ haven't been affiliated in many years, and if you do a little bit of reaseach you'll see why.


 
Thanks for pointing that out. I just did some homework on it, and yeah I see completely. ..... I wish I had done that kind of homework before I ordered a full on custom, but I wasn't even a member of this forum yet. If I had known, someone more worthy would have recieved my business. This is disturbingly ironic, not just because we expected it, but because when I last spoke with Bernie he was so full of pride in who he was and his name, speaking of his lineage, in regards to another customer who accused him of stealing his money and delivering nothing. It was the "how dare you assume I did that; do you know who I am" speech. 

It's a good ....in' thing when I was at Ft. Irwin last month I didn't have the time to go drive to see him. My PTSD would have erupted. It takes a certain kind of individual to blow smoke at a combat vet, a nutty 12B at that, plus have swindled so many guys on here out of their money and good faith. I was polite on the phone, but in person might have been a different deal.


----------



## SpaceDock

Spoke to my bank, royally f#$%ed. Since Bernie never delivered during the original time frame, that would have been the only time to chargeback. Now that that has past and he never gives resolute dates, it compounds the situation. They are not able to do anything per Visa regulations. Paypal is 45 days only on charges and will not assist either.

If Bernie isnt a scammer, he should have been.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

*IF* Bernie *WASN'T* a scammer?


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Is it stated somewhere that Bernie Rico Guitars has officially closed down ?


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

When's the last time that you officially heard anything from the company? After months and months of being missing, Terri finally went on FB with a message about why he was gone.

We know for sure the shop is closed down. We know they used some of the machinery to pay back-debt. We know that Bernie is not locatable and is probably in an asylum. He's probably too crazy to admit that he's not functional.

Yeah - I'd say BRJ Guitars is closed dude.


----------



## Netherhound

My heart goes out to ALL you guys (especially the ones who sent parts, pickups, your OWN stuff). I wish for all of you to try to get your cash back because after the trouble every single person went through from this company regarding QC or money issues the last couple of years, you might as well seek damages.

By no means I'm a lawyer but I urge EVERYONE (at least at the SS.org family) to start contacting each and every individual that's involved. Get a solid number on the amount owed/value of parts sent and get as much members who are affected by this. If as many people are involved as some of you ladies and gentleman are saying and BRJ has cut off communication with their customers, there seems to be only option that pops in my mind to look into with representation:

Class Action Lawsuit


----------



## straymond

Netherhound said:


> By no means I'm a lawyer but I urge EVERYONE (at least at the SS.org family) to start contacting each and every individual that's involved.
> Class Action Lawsuit


 
I second this.
perhaps it would be an idea to make a new thread that contains ONLY the nicks of the people who have lost money and want to pursue this? this will make it easier for you guys to get together...

I sincerely hope this works out in the best possible way for you guys.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Netherhound said:


> My heart goes out to ALL you guys (especially the ones who sent parts, pickups, your OWN stuff). I wish for all of you to try to get your cash back because after the trouble every single person went through from this company regarding QC or money issues the last couple of years, you might as well seek damages.
> 
> By no means I'm a lawyer but I urge EVERYONE (at least at the SS.org family) to start contacting each and every individual that's involved. Get a solid number on the amount owed/value of parts sent and get as much members who are affected by this. If as many people are involved as some of you ladies and gentleman are saying and BRJ has cut off communication with their customers, there seems to be only option that pops in my mind to look into with representation:
> 
> Class Action Lawsuit


 


straymond said:


> I second this.
> perhaps it would be an idea to make a new thread that contains ONLY the nicks of the people who have lost money and want to pursue this? this will make it easier for you guys to get together...
> 
> I sincerely hope this works out in the best possible way for you guys.


 
How many times has this been tried now? Four? Five? 

You guys have to realize one of the reasons this got so far was because everything was so scattered, and I don't see this changing any time soon. 

I want to be proven wrong.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Max - not to mention that for some freakish reason there always seems to be some small contingency of people that hold out and say "I just know Bernie is going to pull out of this and make some AWESOME GEETARZ!" - making it hard to get everybody on board. Then some new web guy will show up, a picture will float on the website, and everybody will be back to Bernie worship.

Most of his customer base doesn't even realize that this all went down, it seems. Even if a class action lawsuit was fired, we'd need all the record keeping of the NSA to track down what the hell actually went down when it comes to money exchanged, because apparently his record keeping was disastrously terrible.

Good luck, people. If you have proof of your order in some sort of email exchange, and still have confirmations on your payments to BRJ Guitars, you might be able to build a case. Otherwise you'll be treading water.


----------



## basssolo4u

Sorry to offer this point of view but . . . 
Ever tried serving someone court papers that is in a NUT HUT? If lucky you get a court date, and perhaps a default judgement and a fist full of papers. IMHO all is over.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

So, does anyone actually know he's ill or in treatment? That everything in the shop is gone? That the person you're "talking" to is really Terri Rico? 

All I see is second, third, and fourth hand info being tossed around like photographic proof. All from Facebook, from folks who have no credentials other than being in a similar situation supposedly. 

The one guy who seems the most credible, CMC, isn't even spilling all the beans. 

How much is a PI? Around $1k? $2k? Split that amongst the lot of you and it shouldn't be too bad. I don't think ANYTHING is going to be accomplished before all the *facts* are on the table.


----------



## capoeiraesp

^bang! 
Even I'd throw in some dollars for a PI just to see some sort of REAL information or resolution to this issue.


----------



## SpaceDock

There has been no statement at all and I don't know of anyone who claims to have spoken to Terry besides the cmc guy. 

I'm just considering this a loss at this point, I have wasted far more money on booze burritos and boobs in the last three years. The money is water under the bridge and not coming back. Even if I had gotten the guitar, I would have traded it by now, lol. 

The thing that gets me is just the lack of communication and that Bernie won't make this right. Money comes and goes, but I feel like I got scammed. That is what hurts. I feel like I was taken for a shitty ride, lied to, stolen from, and left for dead. I won't forgive him for that.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Speculum Speculorum said:


> When's the last time that you officially heard anything from the company? After months and months of being missing, Terri finally went on FB with a message about why he was gone.
> 
> We know for sure the shop is closed down. We know they used some of the machinery to pay back-debt. We know that Bernie is not locatable and is probably in an asylum. He's probably too crazy to admit that he's not functional.
> 
> Yeah - I'd say BRJ Guitars is closed dude.





You´re totally right, and thanks for the answer. But that´s not the point here.

It HAS to be stated officially from the business that it´s bankrupt. 
You just can't go out of business and don´t tell anybody, especially the customers and pretend that nothing has changed. WTF !?!?

I need that statement for my lawyer.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

PASSIVE
&#712;pas&#618;v/Submit
adjective
1.
accepting or allowing what happens or what others do, without active response or resistance.
"It's alright, Bernie says he's back on the mend and I don't wish to stir things up. That's the last thing he needs right now".


GULIBLE
&#712;g&#652;l&#618;b(&#601l/Submit
adjective
1.
easily persuaded to believe something; credulous.
"Bernie says he'll ship it next week when the cases come in. There's been a delay with them for a while, but he's getting a few this week".


CHRISTIAN
Chris·tian [kris-chuhn] Show IPA
adjective
1.
of, pertaining to, or derived from Jesus Christ or His teachings: a Christian faith.
"My prayers are with you and your family Bernie. Get better soon. You'll be back in no time, I just know it".


MARRIED
mar·ried [mar-eed] Show IPA
adjective
1.
united in wedlock; wedded: married couples.
"My wife is very angry at the moment and she can't believe I forked out all that cash and have got nothing to show for it."


LAZY
la·zy [ley-zee] Show IPA adjective, la·zi·er, la·zi·est, verb, la·zied, la·zy·ing.
adjective
1.
averse or disinclined to work, activity, or exertion; indolent.
"I'd drive to the shop myself, but it's 3 hours away".

WARNING: If you fall into one or more of these categories, please do not invest a single cent into any guitar runs/builds. All you will be doing is making the luthier richer and teaching him/her that they can get away with it. In the end, it does not help anyone, one little bit!

P.S ..... BERNIE, TERRI and Co ...... GO F#$K YOURSELVES!


----------



## clubshred

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> PASSIVE
> &#712;pas&#618;v/Submit
> adjective
> 1.
> accepting or allowing what happens or what others do, without active response or resistance.
> "It's alright, Bernie says he's back on the mend and I don't wish to stir things up. That's the last thing he needs right now".
> 
> 
> GULIBLE
> &#712;g&#652;l&#618;b(&#601l/Submit
> adjective
> 1.
> easily persuaded to believe something; credulous.
> "Bernie says he'll ship it next week when the cases come in. There's been a delay with them for a while, but he's getting a few this week".
> 
> 
> CHRISTIAN
> Chris·tian [kris-chuhn] Show IPA
> adjective
> 1.
> of, pertaining to, or derived from Jesus Christ or His teachings: a Christian faith.
> "My prayers are with you and your family Bernie. Get better soon. You'll be back in no time, I just know it".
> 
> 
> MARRIED
> mar·ried [mar-eed] Show IPA
> adjective
> 1.
> united in wedlock; wedded: married couples.
> "My wife is very angry at the moment and she can't believe I forked out all that cash and have got nothing to show for it."
> 
> 
> LAZY
> la·zy [ley-zee] Show IPA adjective, la·zi·er, la·zi·est, verb, la·zied, la·zy·ing.
> adjective
> 1.
> averse or disinclined to work, activity, or exertion; indolent.
> "I'd drive to the shop myself, but it's 3 hours away".
> 
> WARNING: If you fall into one or more of these categories, please do not invest a single cent into any guitar runs/builds. All you will be doing is making the luthier richer and teaching him/her that they can get away with it. In the end, it does not help anyone, one little bit!
> 
> P.S ..... BERNIE, TERRI and Co ...... GO F#$K YOURSELVES!



^Pure Win. Every last word!


----------



## Hollowway

So I don't have a firm answer on whether I can file a small claims app in my home town or in Hesperia, but I'm working on it. Also, I called a couple of Hesperia P.I.s and left messages to get a quote to find out how much they charge. I only have $600 at stake here, but it's irritating me.


----------



## Erockomania

wow. What a Fuster Cluck.


----------



## mcsalty

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> ....



What a helpful contribution to the thread! Everyone here owes you nothing but thanks.


----------



## Pikka Bird

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> Show IPA



Okay?







But really, that was a bit much.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mcsalty said:


> What a helpful contribution to the thread! Everyone here owes you nothing but thanks.



I don't know why everyone here is piling on him, he's 110% right. His statements have had way more truth and honesty than anything else in here. 

Does it hurt to be told you were played? Yeah it does. But maybe instead of taking your frustrations out on a guy in the same place you guys are, you should use that energy to actually get something done. 

You guys do know that he was in the hole to Bernie for something like $4k right?


----------



## Diggi

deleted


----------



## thrsher

Diggi said:


> Any reports of guitars being received by SS members? I haven't gotten mine yet though I am told it's being worked on.
> 
> I'll update here when I get word of shipping.



have you not read the last two pages in this thread? i recommend you do so


----------



## BouhZik

I can't believe this thread is the only way to know what is happening....


----------



## spawnsc

seen one of bernie's cousins put this on bernie rico fb page and she got smoked lol

"listen guys i know its a frustrating situation for all...Bernie is my cousin and he's is dealing with alot and letting you all down is weighing heavy on him...The family is doing everything they can to figure out how to fix all this and make everything right...this is not an intentioned break in his business. I personally dont have any more info than you all. but i do know that our family in alot of aspects is a proud and talented one with many demons alot of us kids find difficult to deal with. I dont expect you to feel sorry for Bernie or even forgive. i just want you to know that his family is doing the best as they can and when there is a road to reconcile all orders, those who have money in will be up-dated on process to getting all you valued clients in a position of whole... Im sorry for all the inconvenience. but your patience means alot. Your loyalty is not going unnoticed... 
again I apologize on behalf of the family they are unable to respond at the time. Terry has asked those with orders and such to inbox her, give her your info and info on your order please be kind all the negative stuff is counter productive. peace to you all."


----------



## elq




----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I cannot possibly conceive why anyone would come to Bernie's defense at this point. Still though - calling someone racial epithets and threatening them with violence on FB is probably not the best advice...

I think this situation has permanently sunk itself down the "weird" hole, never to return. It's weird that they haven't declared bankruptcy. It's weird that no one is coming forward to deal with the couple of hundred grand owed. It's weird that no one can even verify if Bernie is actually in the whacky shack or if he's kicking it in some safe house hoping people give up on trying to track him down. It's weird that no builders have come out and said anything. It's weird that almost nobody who was invested into him is left to say anything at all. It's weird that his wife would randomly step up and say she was going to take care of business and then immediately be nowhere to be found. It's weird that his FB page has been some strange series of advertisements for a bunch of creepy guys in a band playing shows and asking young chicks to come dance for their concerts. 

I mentioned this whole situation to a lawyer during a completely separate conversation, and he was ....ing floored that nobody has filed suit (exception being one guy according to one source) yet. Yeah - I get that nobody is going to be paid if Bernie is in the "happy" house, but it's still weird nobody has tried yet. Certainly if you have tens of thousands of dollars invested it would be worth your while to look into it.


----------



## BouhZik

The only noticeable thing I can see on the Facebook page is "WWW.FBI.GOV".
Everything else is useless blah blah that change nothing.
Dont wait for somebody to do it for you. 
GL


----------



## LLink2411

I almost bought a BRJ almost four years ago but cancelled my order thankfully.


My grandfather died the day I found out there was a problem with the order and I backed out and demanded a refund right that second I heard. Someone was watching over me and I got out just in time.


EDIT: I see the otaku are out in swarms today in retaliation for my YouTube thread post.


----------



## wannabguitarist

Speculum Speculorum said:


> It's weird that they haven't declared bankruptcy



You guys are pretty fucked if BRJ declares bankruptcy. Money owed to customers/deposits are at the bottom of a rather long list of people that have to get paid. I think there's $2,600 payout limit per person too.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Dude, I think you fail to understand that people who haven't received anything yet from Bernie are already screwed to high heaven. Big time. My point is that nothing really adds up at all. Not that one expects it to with BRJ Guitars any longer, but it's all just such a weird turn of events. 

For all intents and purposes (from what we can tell), the company is not functioning any longer, but there have been no factual releases from the company. One would THINK that somebody within the company would come out and actually make a statement. I think everybody who has been following the slow and steady decline into hell that is BRJ Guitars can say that nothing has ever been "normal". But this is really starting to stink to high heaven.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ when I spoke to my bank, they said that once a company declares out of business or bankruptcy, they need to conclude business, ie they become liable. If they are still in limbo, they are not yet responsible. That is why the lack of statements, once they make an "out of business" statement they need to ship or refund.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

My point exactly. They're screwing people. They know they're done for, but they're trying to hold off for as long as is humanely possible before they have to accept the killing blow and are liable to their customers. I wouldn't be surprised if nothing ever goes forward and they just continue to "exist" as a business entity.


----------



## technomancer

I suspect BRJ guitars pretty much was Bernie, everything else was outsourced. I know for a fact woodworking (the "woodshop"), paint, and inlays were outsourced. His family apparently knew pretty much nothing about the business and Bernie is in the hospital. If all of the above is correct, there is nobody that can really give an "official" update or do something.

It seems like it was just Bernie and a bunch of sub-contractors, so with Bernie out of the picture there pretty much is no BRJ guitars. There is no THEY that's screwing everybody, it's a guy in the hospital and his family trying to deal with the cluster .... he made.

None of this is "official information", just speculation on my part (aside from the stuff that was contracted out) but it does seem to fit what has been going on pretty well.

Note I am definitely NOT defending anybody, but with the guy responsible for it all hospitalized there's not a lot anybody can do. I guess my point was really I don't think there is a THEY in this equation  If BRJ was a legal entity then you can file against the company, if not then you'd need to file against Bernie directly.


----------



## TylerRay

Wow this is bad! Their facebook page is taking a real hit. It's a real shame for the customers... My condolences go out to you all. F*** I would hate to get burned like that....


----------



## wannabguitarist

SpaceDock said:


> ^ when I spoke to my bank, they said that once a company declares out of business or bankruptcy, they need to conclude business, ie they become liable. If they are still in limbo, they are not yet responsible. That is why the lack of statements, once they make an "out of business" statement they need to ship or refund.



Right, sort of. Deposits owed to customers are only paid after all of the secured creditors and administrative expenses of the bankruptcy are paid off from the liquidated assets. Customers with deposits can collect from the remaining money before any unsecured creditors but other than that they're at the end of the line and are unlikely to get anything (which isn't any different from their current situation) because BRJ probably owes far more than just deposit money/finished products..

The only people BRJ is screwing over by not filing bankruptcy are his creditors. The customers have already been ....ed and once the bankruptcy process is started there's nothing they can do but collect from whatever (if any) scraps the creditors leave behind


----------



## C-PIG

hes right


----------



## JaeSwift

wannabguitarist said:


> Right, sort of. Deposits owed to customers are only paid after all of the secured creditors and administrative expenses of the bankruptcy are paid off from the liquidated assets. Customers with deposits can collect from the remaining money before any unsecured creditors but other than that they're at the end of the line and are unlikely to get anything (which isn't any different from their current situation) because BRJ probably owes far more than just deposit money/finished products..
> 
> The only people BRJ is screwing over by not filing bankruptcy are his creditors. The customers have already been ....ed and once the bankruptcy process is started there's nothing they can do but collect from whatever (if any) scraps the creditors leave behind



While it's sad but true, I don't see any other way of getting any kind of rebuttal. Chances are small you'll see money back but at least there is a chance. Waiting around and doing nothing will result in nothing.


----------



## capoeiraesp

Where's Larrikin these days? I'm not trying to stir things at all but he did have a lot of money invested in this late in the game. Just curious to see how he's holding up.


----------



## Diggi

Scary Gary - will you please PM me?


----------



## Hollowway

OK, latest info from my side: I finally got in touch with the small claims advisor up here, and she said that if I purchased the guitar from here, via email/internet, then I file the claim in my court house here. So my guess is most of the other (California, anyway) guys would do the same thing. The next step is figuring out where he is to serve him. I had zero luck getting a PI down in Hesperia to return my calls (I only tried 3, but...). But I do know a guy up here I can ask. I just have to watch my expenses, so I'm not throwing good money after bad. 

Anyone else file? Anyone heard from Terri? I wish she would just reach out to us so we don't have to take drastic measures. But she's leaving us no choice.


----------



## Tesla

She (or a proxy for her) will be reading this thread no doubt.

It wouldn't surprise me if someone creeps out of nowhere to try and calm the situation again now that you're making legal progress.


----------



## TemjinStrife

To be blunt, small claims court is rarely much in the way of "legal progress" since you still have to serve the party and enforce whatever judgment you get.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ exactly, this is why I decided to just walk away. not worth my energy. if you have multi thousands in this it would be different.


----------



## JaeSwift

TemjinStrife said:


> To be blunt, small claims court is rarely much in the way of "legal progress" since you still have to serve the party and enforce whatever judgment you get.



I'm surprised, I thought the US was known to be the country in which you can sue anyone for anything?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ he will need to hire a claims service to get the money from Bernie, normally by sending harassing mail or phone calls. I don't think their wages can be garnished unless it is a criminal suit.

I had a situation with a young driver with no insurance that plowed into my parked car. Since he had no money or insurance I was SOL. My insurance took care of me, but he was scott free excluding his busted ride.


----------



## wannabguitarist

JaeSwift said:


> I'm surprised, I thought the US was known to be the country in which you can sue anyone for anything?



Yay stereotypes!

People talk about ridiculous lawsuits all the time but rarely anything actually happens


----------



## TemjinStrife

JaeSwift said:


> I'm surprised, I thought the US was known to be the country in which you can sue anyone for anything?



We have a very litigation-friendly system with really intense discovery processes, and there are statutes that provide causes of action for many claims. However the amount of money involved in most claims is typically much more than that involved here with an individual's small claims case (in order to support the time and effort spent on recovery). The only way to get enough money involved in this particular case is to aggregate claims.

A joinder or class action suit amongst the aggrieved parties here might be big enough to justify its own expense, but it's expensive and slow, especially since there's always the risk that Bernie might be judgment-proof. However, the filing of such a case might be enough to scare them into rolling over, too (~$350 in filing fees, plus process server fees, plus a few hours' of legal fees to draft a complaint, and that's if they don't dig in and fight and doesn't deal with any judgment enforcement expenses). 

It's a tradeoff, and one you'd have to discuss with a lawyer that does this sort of commercial/creditors' rights litigation and who knows if there are any applicable California laws that might be able to help you out.


----------



## JaeSwift

wannabguitarist said:


> Yay stereotypes!
> 
> People talk about ridiculous lawsuits all the time but rarely anything actually happens



It was tongue-in-cheek. And cheers Tenjamin for the explenatio, I didnt know it worked that way


----------



## Tesla

My point was actually that someone will most likely be watching this thread. Usually when someone starts talking about legal action here...someone pops up from the BRJ camp. It's happened here twice already, I think!


----------



## crazygtr

Guys, I've been following this mess for a long time, and though I don't have any builds I feel for everyone who does, and would like to say that for no reason in this world let anybody on the BRJ side fool you again with words of false expectations. It's just their strategy for delaying things as much as they can so you guys keep loosing valuable time to recoup something. Like Tesla mentioned earlier, it would'nt be a surprise if someone comes from nowhere now and brings some more BS. Hoping for the best for you guys.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Yeah. Keep in mind your statutes of limitations... if you delay long enough, you lose your chance to try at all. In general, that's four years, maximum, for breach of a written contract in California.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, the clock on statute of limitations starts when one realizes that something wrong occurred, not when it actually occurred. So that's an advantage to us, because it's only been recently that it seems that all hope was lost. Still I hope that someone IS reading this thread, because all I (or any of us) want is what we've got, or some communication, or answers. Because of that I honestly doubt anyone is reading this thread other than us. It would be so easy to just register on here and post something, and because of that I don't think anyone from the BRJ camp has seen this.


----------



## SpaceDock

The BRJ Facebook page is getting really bad, people lashing out at his relatives and all. I don't think there is any recovery that can happen nor will any of us get any cash from him. This is done, he is wrecked, BRJ is no more. I just hope he his family can live some sort of normal life after this and move on. I feel bad for his family more than anything.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

^Its mainly one very aggressive guy who is being very abusive. I'm not sure he even has a build.


----------



## straymond

^yeah, he seems completely off his rocker...


----------



## TemjinStrife

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, the clock on statute of limitations starts when one realizes that something wrong occurred, not when it actually occurred. So that's an advantage to us, because it's only been recently that it seems that all hope was lost. Still I hope that someone IS reading this thread, because all I (or any of us) want is what we've got, or some communication, or answers. Because of that I honestly doubt anyone is reading this thread other than us. It would be so easy to just register on here and post something, and because of that I don't think anyone from the BRJ camp has seen this.



Uhh, that's actually completely wrong :-/



> UCC § 2-725
> 
> [...]
> 
> 2) A cause of action accrues when the breach occurs, regardless of the aggrieved party's lack of knowledge of the breach.



The UCC applies here, since it deals with contracts for the sale of goods. The statute of limitations begins to run from the date of "breach" which is when the contract was breached by one party or another. Since many of these contracts don't have actual delivery dates, determining when a breach occurred is tricky.


----------



## paddy

crazygtr said:


> Guys, I've been following this mess for a long time, and though I don't have any builds I feel for everyone who does, and would like to say that for no reason in this world let anybody on the BRJ side fool you again with words of false expectations. It's just their strategy for delaying things as much as they can so you guys keep loosing valuable time to recoup something. Like Tesla mentioned earlier, it would'nt be a surprise if someone comes from nowhere now and brings some more BS. Hoping for the best for you guys.



Above, AND, I know this doesn't help you guys but I just wanna say that I never even bought his illness story in the first place but people normally being good natured, like to believe things easily specially if it helps them not to think/worry about possible realities.


----------



## Hollowway

TemjinStrife said:


> Uhh, that's actually completely wrong :-/
> 
> 
> 
> The UCC applies here, since it deals with contracts for the sale of goods. The statute of limitations begins to run from the date of "breach" which is when the contract was breached by one party or another. Since many of these contracts don't have actual delivery dates, determining when a breach occurred is tricky.



Yeah, sorry, that's what I mean. It wasn't clear that the contract was breached at the time of the deposit, only from the time that he went AWOL. As recent as 6 months ago he gave me updated build information. So up until then it sounded like he was making good on it. But now that's stopped. That's what I meant.


----------



## spawnsc

Should we try the BBB again to see if they can get official word on him being closed?


----------



## abandonist

You can easily find out if a business has dissolved by calling the Secretary of State and asking.


----------



## Dethyr

I feel so terrible for everyone involved here. Mostly for the buyers with hard earned money down the toilet. Having been around a close friend that had a business, took on way too much and ended up having a nervous breakdown right before a large company was about to buy him out for a very large sum of money... I saw first hand how it went and what he went through. I dont know Bernie's end of it or what is truly going on with him, I don't think any of us actually know except for him and maybe his family but mental health is a real scary situation. This whole situation is just flat out awful. I wish all of you the best. 

It's been a long time since I have checked in on this whole fiasco can someone bring me up to speed? It's been about a year since I've heard anything.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah I can sum it up for you:





[/URL][/IMG]

Things have gone completely bonkers and people aren't going to be getting any guitars. The shop has shut down and nobody has heard a damn thing from anybody because Bernie's in the mental ward (allegedly) and nobody else from the company can legally tell us anything or else doesn't give a damn enough to help. There ya' go.


----------



## SpaceDock

spawnsc said:


> Should we try the BBB again to see if they can get official word on him being closed?



I filed another complaint about two weeks ago, still nothing.


----------



## F1Filter

abandonist said:


> You can easily find out if a business has dissolved by calling the Secretary of State and asking.



California Secretary Of State Business Search - Business Entities - Business Programs

Still listed "active" as of 11/22.


----------



## TemjinStrife

F1Filter said:


> California Secretary Of State Business Search - Business Entities - Business Programs
> 
> Still listed "active" as of 11/22.



The issue with that is it is only listed as "dissolved" if they actually make a filing to dissolve the company, or if the company fails to pay required taxes. So, the Secretary of State's office isn't a great way to tell if a business is still "doing business."

However, if it's listed as "active" on there, it is a valid target for legal action as it is a live entity.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Well, I called my bank and faxed my e-mails along with whatever additional information I had to them earlier this month, and after waiting a few weeks they decided to credit me back on the final payment. My final payment was about a year and a half ago and they still did it for me, so hopefully more of you guys have some luck going this route. I'm still out on the initial deposit since I bought someone else's spot, but it is way better to be out $600 than over $2.1k.


----------



## Hollowway

WickedSymphony said:


> Well, I called my bank and faxed my e-mails along with whatever additional information I had to them earlier this month, and after waiting a few weeks they decided to credit me back on the final payment. My final payment was about a year and a half ago and they still did it for me, so hopefully more of you guys have some luck going this route. I'm still out on the initial deposit since I bought someone else's spot, but it is way better to be out $600 than over $2.1k.



Bank, meaning credit card? Or did you link PP to your actual bank account? And what aspect of the emails made them refund the money? You don't have any kind of smoking gun sort of email, so I'm wondering what did it. I'd like to be able to make the same case.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> Bank, meaning credit card? Or did you link PP to your actual bank account? And what aspect of the emails made them refund the money? You don't have any kind of smoking gun sort of email, so I'm wondering what did it. I'd like to be able to make the same case.



Yeh, I have my Visa with Bank of America. After mtndrew posted that he had luck with them, I gave it a shot. My transaction was in June 2012 so they couldn't do it over the phone and I had to fax them everything.

Basically, in addition to the transaction number, posting date, etc., I sent them every e-mail I had since the date of the final transaction, all the contact info I had for Bernie, and I had to describe my situation as the events occurred (I wrote maybe 3/4 of a page in Word or so). I also sent links to this thread and to BRJ's facebook page to show that other people are in the same predicament to show more credibility for my story.

Also, this transaction was one directly to BRJ when he was doing the final payments through his site, if that changes anything. I'm not sure how this changes if it was linked through paypal, although my paypal is linked to my account.

As far as what exactly was in the e-mails that made them do it, I have no idea. I just told them about all the excuses he made for delays and they were reflected in the e-mails along with the lack of responses back from him over the past year. I'm fairly certain that linking to here and his facebook made my case much stronger than the e-mails alone would have.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ Same here, visa via wells fargo. I really had to bitch up a storm and talked to 5 bankers over several hours. Got my final payment back, but paypal told me to .... off with my deposit. Paypal wont do anything for me at all. 

There is a 8-10 week review period where they are looking into the situation, but I did get the "provisional credit" so I am praying they don't take it back. 

The emails just show the constant delays. The main point I tried to drive home with them is that this is like a contractor for a home. You dont get the product up front, but instead pay as progress is made and he kept delaying, therefore the 1 year starts at his last date of contact.

At this point I really think it is more of a customer satisfaction/loyalty benefit more than legal reparations. If you have this option, do it now!! Time is not on your side.


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> ^ Same here, visa via wells fargo. I really had to bitch up a storm and talked to 5 bankers over several hours. Got my final payment back, but paypal told me to .... off with my deposit. Paypal wont do anything for me at all.



Luckily with Bank of America, the calls in total took maybe 20 minutes including getting transferred around to the right departments, but I really didn't have to make any massive fuss or anything. In my case, I never got a provisional credit. It was nothing for 3~ weeks and then an account adjustment along with the interest back on the amount.

I'm not surprised about Paypal, but I'd imagine most people do the Paypal transaction through their credit card so you could still try with the bank directly. I got my spot from someone else on here so I'm not gonna go after them, obviously, but I don't think there's a viable way for me to go after BRJ for the remainder at this point. Anything I could think of would probably just be throwing good money after bad (along with a whole lot of headache on top of it).


----------



## Khoi

WickedSymphony said:


> Luckily with Bank of America, the calls in total took maybe 20 minutes including getting transferred around to the right departments, but I really didn't have to make any massive fuss or anything. In my case, I never got a provisional credit. It was nothing for 3~ weeks and then an account adjustment along with the interest back on the amount.
> 
> I'm not surprised about Paypal, but I'd imagine most people do the Paypal transaction through their credit card so you could still try with the bank directly. I got my spot from someone else on here so I'm not gonna go after them, obviously, but I don't think there's a viable way for me to go after BRJ for the remainder at this point. Anything I could think of would probably just be throwing good money after bad (along with a whole lot of headache on top of it).



I'm going to attempt to call Bank of America, I made my final payment through them. I can't remember if my deposit was with money already in my PayPal or not, but it's linked to my Bank of America account anyways.

What did you tell them when you first called customer service? Which department would I need to go through?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Khoi said:


> I'm going to attempt to call Bank of America, I made my final payment through them. I can't remember if my deposit was with money already in my PayPal or not, but it's linked to my Bank of America account anyways.
> 
> What did you tell them when you first called customer service? Which department would I need to go through?



I did this like 4 weeks ago so I don't remember everything exactly, but hopefully this helps:

https://www.bankofamerica.com/credit-cards/security-faq.go

I used the number listed here to contact them and told them I needed to file a dispute. I had the statement, transaction reference number, etc., but they still had a bit of trouble finding it since it was so old. One guy managed to find it but had to transfer me to the next department to actually handle it, but the guy there said since it was over a year he couldn't even see it on the computer (even though the previous guy had saved it for him) and I'd have to fax my claim in, and he told me to send as much relevant information as I possibly could for the best chances of getting it done. As far as what I told them in the call, it was just a recount of what had happened as best as I could remember. I didn't have to use any analogies to explain what a custom instrument order was like the way others had to in order to get the point across, and I didn't have to raise hell on the phone or anything to make them help me out.

I jotted down the numbers they transferred me to in notepad so I think this one is the last one i ended up at since I wrote 'billing dispute' next to it. (It took like 3 or 4 transfers to end up in the right place altogether so this might not be it.)

800-457-3693

Then they gave me the fax number here: 1-888-672-6262

I just googled a free online fax service to send it (about 8 pages of emails) since I don't have a personal fax. (Found one called myfax or something that worked, just attached the .doc file to send it)

In my fax, top to bottom, I listed my name, best contact number, account #, posting date, transaction reference number, transaction description, transaction amount, story of what happened with as much detail as possible, whatever contact info I had for BRJ (address, phone, cell, website, facebook, email), link to this thread, and my entire e-mail history (including headers) since he asked for the final payment.

In my explanation of what happened, I referenced the specific things in my case (him being dodgy with delays, missed delivery dates, back and forth about what actually needed to be redone), and all the things we heard happened through here along with time references to the best of my knowledge. I also explained that I had tried to be as accommodating as possible given the circumstances, but at this point I was simply out of options. I was always polite in my e-mails because a) I didn't want him to screw up the guitar any worse given how things had been going and then be left with him leaving me a messed up instrument/no refund, and b) I knew it probably wouldn't look good for my case if I was being a dick should it have come to this situation. I think the most important thing was that my e-mails reflected my story, and linking to here and facebook showed that I wasn't making things up. (There's literally no way someone could possibly fake THIS much information and posting content for a dispute)

Anyway, maybe that was a bit long winded, but I really hope it helps some of you guys out. Any other questions feel free to ask here or in PM. Best of luck!


----------



## Hollowway

I will likely try it, although my CC is not through BofA. But really, getting my $600 back from someone else doesn't really make me feel totally satisfied. The fact is I want either the money or the guitar from Bernie. It doesn't make sense that me, or my CC company, should make a "donation" to Bernie. I can think of millions of people more deserving of a donation from me than he. I've hung in there patiently waiting for him, but the fact is Terri is making zero effort to protect his legacy, help him out, or help any of us out. She's got a house full of guitars she could do something with, or plan to do something with, and instead of telling us what she's thinking we just get radio silence. I still plan on filing suit, or using whatever other avenues I have to get the guitar or money back. I fully understand he may not have the money, but he does have the guitar. And I paid for it.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Yeh, I feel the same way. I just wouldn't feel right going after the original spot holder for the deposit money, and I waited out because I'd much rather have gotten the guitar from Bernie and come to a happier solution. Hell, I would've even taken the incomplete guitar and parts when Terry started posting on facebook last month. I messaged her twice with absolutely no response. These people honestly don't give a shit at all.

The only thing for me is that after it's all said and done I'd probably just come out even more behind than I already am, and at this point it's been such a terrible experience I'd probably just get rid of the guitar instantly; I don't want the name of a POS like that on any guitars I own. If a good opportunity rises for me where I know I can get the rest of my money back from Bernie then I'll take it, but for now I'm just going to cut my losses. It's not worth it to me to potentially screw myself more just to recover that $600.

In any case, I'm probably just gonna stick to guitars from major companies now (I do have some past due NGDs I should get around to posting, actually). It would've been nice to get the exact guitar I wanted, but it's not worth the risk of being dicked around by the builder and BRJ is far from the only one pulling that stuff off. 

I just hope his name is tarnished enough that no one tries to order something from him again. Though it honestly amazes me that throughout all this people STILL asked where to place an order - good luck to them.


----------



## Hollowway

^ Amen to all of that.


----------



## MetalDaze

Well, unlike the rest of us, these banks do have the means to file some nasty lawsuits to reclaim the money they are refunding, especially if they start getting flooded with claims for BRJ. 

So, you may not be donating to the BRJ fund after all


----------



## Hollowway

^ Yeah, that's a good point. Though, I would guess that the group of us (as a whole, or especially the number that actually dedicate the time to file something with them) will be a mere blip on their radar. Still, it is another way to call attention to it.


----------



## WickedSymphony

MetalDaze said:


> Well, unlike the rest of us, these banks do have the means to file some nasty lawsuits to reclaim the money they are refunding, especially if they start getting flooded with claims for BRJ.
> 
> So, you may not be donating to the BRJ fund after all



Well, as of now I still donated $600, haha. Though earlier this month I thought I had donated 3.5x that so I'm (relatively) happy with that and knowing that they'll hopefully go after him for it.


----------



## MJS

Hollowway said:


> I will likely try it, although my CC is not through BofA. But really, getting my $600 back from someone else doesn't really make me feel totally satisfied. The fact is I want either the money or the guitar from Bernie. It doesn't make sense that me, *or my CC company, should make a "donation" to Bernie*.



If you're talking about a charge-back, the money your CC company gives to you gets yanked from Bernie's account. 

He'd have a chance to dispute it, but proof of delivering the goods that were paid for is about the only way to reverse one, as a merchant. My guess is that there would be no dispute.


----------



## Hollowway

MJS said:


> If you're talking about a charge-back, the money your CC company gives to you gets yanked from Bernie's account.
> 
> He'd have a chance to dispute it, but proof of delivering the goods that were paid for is about the only way to reverse one, as a merchant. My guess is that there would be no dispute.



Yes, but a charge back, IIRC, has a limited length of time in which it is valid. My guess is that he was right and BofA just credited him the money back as a CS move, and is not going after BRJ. But it would be awesome if they did.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Hollowway said:


> My guess is that he was right and BofA just credited him the money back as a CS move, and is not going after BRJ.



Well, oddly enough I just found out from my bank that they're still trying to contact BRJ. So I guess that it's not over yet. They said they'll contact me again within 30 days to let me know the result. Boy do I feel stupid for getting excited so quickly. Guess I jumped the gun and thought it was over since it took them nearly a month to post anything at all, and it showed up as an adjustment with no mention of it being temporary (never had to dispute something until this so I don't know how it usually goes).

I'd imagine at this point that either they won't get any response from him at all, or like MJS said that he'll have to provide proof of delivery to counter my claim. I don't see how there is any way that he could counter my dispute, and if they're looking into it, why they wouldn't find it in my favor by the end of this.

Sorry for raising a ruckus in here lol. Still, I really recommend everyone try contacting their banks for this. At the very least they're investigating it when I thought that we were way out of the dispute window, and I think if more claims go in they'd be more alerted to the issue.

I'll keep you guys up to date with what happens from here.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

What the hell does a temporary credit back even mean? Did they put money in your account? What? Are they going to charge you for it if you spend it and they ultimately doesn't resolve? I don't understand this. AT ALL.


----------



## Hollowway

Actually, I think that's really good news for them to reach out to him. I mean, all any of us are really after is to know what is going on. (Well, we want our guitars, but honest communication has been the big issue here.) I'm not sure the bank will get any more information than any of us has, but since they're "official" it might result in Terri or BRJ saying what they plan to do with all those guitars at the house.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Speculum Speculorum said:


> What the hell does a temporary credit back even mean? Did they put money in your account? What? Are they going to charge you for it if you spend it and they ultimately doesn't resolve? I don't understand this. AT ALL.



Basically as I understand it, while the charge is under investigation they credited the amount in dispute back to my card. Looking at my account online, it shows a 'balance adjustment' for the original amount and a 'credit protection adjustment' for the interest, both of which are non-pending, completed transactions. I had assumed from the wording and the time that had passed since filing that they had already investigated, but I got a letter just now regarding my dispute and contacted their CS to find out what was going on, and so I found out that it's still under investigation.

I personally don't understand the reason for the temp credit back if it's still under investigation, but I'm glad that they're at least investigating it instead of turning me away outright due to the long time period. As I said in the last post, I can only imagine that they'll either not get any response from BRJ or that he'll have to provide proof that he sent my guitar (which he didn't do and is thus unable to provide it). I suppose the third scenario would be that they give some excuse that they still intend to deliver the guitar, but I'm not sure that that excuse would fly given the constant delays shown in the e-mails and all the other issues regarding his absence right now.

@Hollowway - While it would be nice to have an honest answer about what's going on, I think the time for that has simply passed. We've all been more patient than they deserve, and every time they've communicated 'honestly' about their plans it has just resulted in false promises and even more delays for all but a select few who managed to get their guitars. Looking at their facebook, it took months to update the first time he went into the hospital, and when he came back that only lasted a few months and hardly any guitars seemed to go out. And now Terri says to message her about outstanding orders and it looks like most of us just got ignored. I'm confident any update they tell to the bank, much like when the BBB contacted them, wouldn't result in much of a resolution for the majority of us involved in this.

At this point, I don't want to know what's going on so much as I want to get what I can back out of this and wash my hands of it.


----------



## JPMike

I am so tired with the whole situation that I have started to not even care... 

But what's going on at the moment??


----------



## WickedSymphony

Update: BoA says they consider my dispute resolved, but BRJ still has a chance to dispute my claim by providing documentation showing why he considers the transaction to be valid. (I don't think that's going to happen any time soon.)

Mike, how long have you been out of the thread? Quite a bit's happened depending on when you were last in here, but I think the last 5 pages or so covers everything new.


----------



## spawnsc

I tried to dispute with Bank of America few months back they put the money in as temporary and then returned the transaction back to them  maybe I should try again to see what happens. 

So wicked did they finalize everything for you? when will they give it the ok?


----------



## WickedSymphony

spawnsc said:


> I tried to dispute with Bank of America few months back they put the money in as temporary and then returned the transaction back to them  maybe I should try again to see what happens.
> 
> So wicked did they finalize everything for you? when will they give it the ok?



If you don't mind my asking, how did it look in your account when it was temporary? Mine showed up as a balance adjustment, but it never actually said it was temporary anywhere. I first got a letter on Saturday, 10 days after that adjustment popped up on my account, saying it was under investigation (hence me posting about it here), and I just now got another letter saying that they consider the case resolved unless Bernie provides documentation to counter my dispute. 

Actual wording from the letter: "Although we consider your dispute(s) resolved, the merchant has an opportunity to review any information and provide additional documentation to support why they feel the transaction(s) is valid. In the event we receive additional information from the merchant, we will forward any relevant documentation, and let you know if additional information is needed to support your dispute(s)."

The credit is still on my card and right now I don't imagine it will be removed unless Bernie magically brings up said proof against me. Also, I personally don't think that him promising the bank to make good on the guitar will hold much weight after delaying me for 18~ months and ignoring me completely for 12, assuming he tries to do that. Most likely, it would just end in me having to file a dispute again. 

So all that considered I think it to be pretty final, unless of course your dispute went the same way and I'm just getting ahead of myself again. 

You should definitely try again, and send them everything you have - all e-mails, links to this thread, his facebook page (the one with people complaining), full story of what's been going on in the past year with him being out of the shop (if you want proof straight from their own mouths about it the original post Terry made on their facebook has since been deleted , but it's been reposted a few times in this thread if you look around March or so), etc. Do not leave any relevant documentation out of your claim. Since we did absolutely nothing wrong on our end, it can only help you if you add it in there.


----------



## MJS

You can consider that a completed charge-back, since he can't really dispute it. So... there is still money there and his merchant account is active. Who knows how much, so consider his balance first come, first served. 

The way "temporary" usually seems to work with charge-backs, from what I've seen as a merchant, is that it's just what the bank tells you (the cardholder) in case you're the one pulling something shady -- _which is quite often the case with charge-backs. 

_ I've processed a few from customers and successfully reversed all of them, but Bernie won't be able to do the same. No bank has ever asked me to provide _anything_ other than _proof of delivery_, which they got. They wanted to see one of two things immediately: 1) the customer receiving their merchandise or proof that they already have, or 2) they get their money back. 

Calling deposits non-refundable wouldn't help him at this point either.

There are plenty of millionaires that claim to be broke. Since his account's not closed and empty, he probably either has way more money than anyone thinks, or no one has been pushing as much as they claim to be on the internet. 


Another thing... when you call your bank, there's a pretty good chance that a moron will pick up the phone.  If you get a "no," ask to talk to someone higher up, or just call back later and hope that someone slightly smarter picks up.

Just make sure you have your proof and documentation ready to go. Be thorough, but keep it brief and to the point. A link to stuff like this thread doesn't mean much because no one is going to sit there and read it. 

Old emails/texts with promised shipment dates that passed long ago are probably the best bet, since nothing short of a tracking number will stand up against that.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Awesome, glad to hear that I'm pretty much cleared then.  As I've said before, won't go after the deposit since I got the spot second hand, but hopefully some others can. 

Anyway, everyone in this thread needs to get on the phone with their banks ASAP.

I will add that the last thing they asked me for was the last shipment date after all the delays, but I had no idea what to tell them since he never provided one in the last e-mail I got from him. Had a hard time trying to explain that one on the phone, but if you have a series of e-mails full of the '2 weeks' business then you're probably fine once you fax it in.


----------



## spawnsc

wicked call your bank back to make sure all is good but I had the money for like a week and they took it back.. but im going to try again.


----------



## WickedSymphony

spawnsc said:


> wicked call your bank back to make sure all is good but I had the money for like a week and they took it back.. but im going to try again.



The transaction where they put the money in my account was about 2.5 weeks ago now.

Did they happen to tell you why they reversed it? BoA said if BRJ provides any documentation to counter my claim they'll forward it to me and ask for more information from my side, so I'll just have to see what happens. 

And going by the dates on the letters, I contacted their CS after the one where they said they consider it resolved. That's when they told me it's still under investigation so I don't think they'd tell me anything different if I contacted them again. I'm guessing this just means they're keeping it open to allow BRJ a chance to dispute, but I don't see how he would possibly be able to.


----------



## spawnsc

ok cool, im going to try again lol why not. I just hope they don't change my cc number again....... i told them not to.


----------



## Khoi

Called BoA today, they said I should be able to file a dispute, and it was definitely a valid case. I wasn't able to go through it all today because I needed to request my statement online, which takes about 24 hours. This is for my final payment, which was $1450. Lucky I used my debit card for that purchase.

I'll update you guys if it works of course.

I realized that I paid my $650 deposit with my PayPal balance =/

I guess we're completely out of luck trying to get that back, huh?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Khoi said:


> I wasn't able to go through it all today because I needed to request my statement online, which takes about 24 hours.



For future reference, you should be able to download a copy of your statements in pdf format online instantly through the account page under 'statements and documents'. That's how I pulled mine up.

I'm not sure if paypal will help you, but I suppose you could try at the very least. I've heard they're more strict about that 45 day thing, but charge backs through the bank are usually like 60 days and they're still helping people apparently, so at the very least it's worth a shot. Worst case is you get a no and lose a few minutes filing the claim?

Good luck to both of you!


----------



## SpaceDock

Khoi said:


> I realized that I paid my $650 deposit with my PayPal balance =/
> 
> I guess we're completely out of luck trying to get that back, huh?



Paypal just about told me to .... myself. They claim 90 day protect, that is shit for this type of transaction. 

I spent a few hours over three calls with them. Maybe there is loophole , but I haven't found it. All of their support were in India where as my bank was far more sympathetic.

I wonder how long Bernie can hide out? He's completely ....ed his life.


----------



## Tyson

Still no word from Bernie? I don't get it. His website's up and running. Is he hiding out to avoid taking ownership of this gong show that was the Black Friday run of guitars?


----------



## Tesla

Tyson said:


> Still no word from Bernie? I don't get it. His website's up and running. Is he hiding out to avoid taking ownership of this gong show that was the Black Friday run of guitars?



That's strange, I distinctly remember his website being down for a long long time. Now all of a sudden it has popped back up? They ain't free to run either...


----------



## clubshred

Tyson said:


> Still no word from Bernie? I don't get it. His website's up and running. Is he hiding out to avoid taking ownership of this gong show that was the Black Friday run of guitars?



Spit my coffee out on that one! Well played!


----------



## xzyryabx

Hey guys, was just talking with some other net denizen and he mentioned that Bernie is out and about and even that he was out with Bernie to the shooting range around 10 days ago.
I don't know this guy and can't vouch for what he said. We just got to chatting over some gear I'm selling and that's what he said, figured you might like to know.


----------



## DISTORT6

xzyryabx said:


> Hey guys, was just talking with some other net denizen and he mentioned that Bernie is out and about and even that he was out with Bernie to the shooting range around 10 days ago.
> I don't know this guy and can't vouch for what he said. We just got to chatting over some gear I'm selling and that's what he said, figured you might like to know.



Do they really let someone in Bernie's "condition" near guns and shooting ranges?


----------



## SpaceDock

He's probably going to live his life as if this shit never happened. He always had such a huge ego, I'm sure he blames this on us. 

He can go to hell.


----------



## WickedSymphony

SpaceDock said:


> He's probably going to live his life as if this shit never happened. He always had such a huge ego, I'm sure he blames this on us.
> 
> He can go to hell.



Yeah, you're definitely right about his ego (not even gonna get into story time on dealing with it, but relevant to what you said he did put blame on me for asking them to fix their screw up on paint ), but I'm not sure what I'd believe at this point about any of it; there's way too much BS floating around the whole situation. I do find it weird though that I've heard nothing new from the bank regarding my dispute. If he was out and about I'm sure he'd want to counter a $1.5k charge back, considering how he handled some people in the past who were unhappy. I don't think he's the type to just walk away from things like that, mostly as a result of said ego. (There is the possibility that he realizes there's nothing he could do, or that he tried something and the bank didn't buy it but who knows, really.)

Anyway, how's the process going for everyone else attempting charge backs?


----------



## patata

nvm


----------



## ihunda

patata said:


> So did everyone got his guitar(s)?



Bro, it's too early to joke about it....


----------



## Danukenator

patata said:


> So did everyone got his guitar(s)?



Are you a part time troll? Half you posts are fine, the other half are clearly trying to annoy people or stir up shit.


----------



## Cloudy

patata said:


> So did everyone got his guitar(s)?



Uncool man :s


----------



## Larrikin666

capoeiraesp said:


> Where's Larrikin these days? I'm not trying to stir things at all but he did have a lot of money invested in this late in the game. Just curious to see how he's holding up.



I'm still alive. LOL. I had so much going on with moving my family across the country lately and my new job. 

I wish I could say I had good news. I don't though. My situation is just as dire as the rest, but I have moved on. I honestly don't have the energy to devote to fight my credit card company, Paypal, and federal credit union for the various transfers of money that took place. I'm so far from being rich, but I can handle the loss of funds and go on with my life.

There's something I've kept hidden from everyone except for Bernie and my girlfriend for all this time though. When things really started to get bad ~18 months ago.  Bernie was really hurting for money. No, I don't agree with the way he started emailing and calling people to get the balance on their guitars by saying they'd be done in a few weeks. 

Bernie started calling and emailing me every single person who wanted to back out of their spot. To keep things calm, I bought those spots from the customer if their guitars even seemed mildly appealing. Eventually, I realized that still wouldn't be enough to keep things afloat. Bernie called me very panicked one afternoon saying that things were bad. He was eating a lot of money because of the rework that was going into a lot of guitars. Regardless of how or why those mistakes happened, I felt it would have been worse to simply let things go under.

To (hopefully) keep the ship from sinking, I gave Bernie a considerable loan to help keep the doors open. This is when I was single, living alone, had no one to support, etc. I made considerably less money than I do today, but I lived very modestly. I really hoped that influx of cash would be enough to push things enough to get things moving in the right direction. We all know that didn't pan out. The terms of the loan were agreed to over the phone, so there is no way for me to go after Bernie for a breech and win. I don't believe I would go that route anyways.

I really struggle with the combined money from guitars and the loan that I've lost. I truly don't believe I'll ever see my money or guitars again. I accept that though. I'm happy. The recent changes in my life have forced me to take time away from music, so my schedule helps to keep my from dwelling on the tragedy. I understand that others feel the effects of the situation more intensely or regularly. 

All I can say is that I hope everyone gets what they are owed one way or another whether it's a guitar, money, or simply peace of mind.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ it hurts me inside.


----------



## Danukenator

Wow, this reminds me of how Mike Sherman messed with Metal Mike after he had supported him.

Hopefully something comes of this, you deserve better dude!


----------



## Hollowway

Hooooly crap! That makes me really like you, and really dislike Bernie. I seriously hope he has enough balls and integrity to make good and repay you that loan. The right thing to do would be to come back and take care of everything, but at the very least you should be repaid for being such an empathetic person and a good friend. 
And yeah, this does sound a lot like the Sherman issue. Even Chris got somewhat screwed in that whole thing, and Chris stood by him the whole way. 
It's a shame, but Larrikin, I will say this: you are one of the better people I know for doing that. I wish more people were like you. I might have to drive down there and buy you a beer sometime!


----------



## DanakinSkywalker

Larrikin666 said:


> I'm still alive. LOL. I had so much going on with moving my family across the country lately and my new job.
> 
> I wish I could say I had good news. I don't though. My situation is just as dire as the rest, but I have moved on. I honestly don't have the energy to devote to fight my credit card company, Paypal, and federal credit union for the various transfers of money that took place. I'm so far from being rich, but I can handle the loss of funds and go on with my life.
> 
> There's something I've kept hidden from everyone except for Bernie and my girlfriend for all this time though. When things really started to get bad ~18 months ago. Bernie was really hurting for money. No, I don't agree with the way he started emailing and calling people to get the balance on their guitars by saying they'd be done in a few weeks.
> 
> Bernie started calling and emailing me every single person who wanted to back out of their spot. To keep things calm, I bought those spots from the customer if their guitars even seemed mildly appealing. Eventually, I realized that still wouldn't be enough to keep things afloat. Bernie called me very panicked one afternoon saying that things were bad. He was eating a lot of money because of the rework that was going into a lot of guitars. Regardless of how or why those mistakes happened, I felt it would have been worse to simply let things go under.
> 
> To (hopefully) keep the ship from sinking, I gave Bernie a considerable loan to help keep the doors open. This is when I was single, living alone, had no one to support, etc. I made considerably less money than I do today, but I lived very modestly. I really hoped that influx of cash would be enough to push things enough to get things moving in the right direction. We all know that didn't pan out. The terms of the loan were agreed to over the phone, so there is no way for me to go after Bernie for a breech and win. I don't believe I would go that route anyways.
> 
> I really struggle with the combined money from guitars and the loan that I've lost. I truly don't believe I'll ever see my money or guitars again. I accept that though. I'm happy. The recent changes in my life have forced me to take time away from music, so my schedule helps to keep my from dwelling on the tragedy. I understand that others feel the effects of the situation more intensely or regularly.
> 
> All I can say is that I hope everyone gets what they are owed one way or another whether it's a guitar, money, or simply peace of mind.



You sound like too good of a person to have this happen to them. Woof. I wish I could get your money back to you myself somehow.


----------



## AwDeOh

Hollowway said:


> It's a shame, but Larrikin, I will say this: you are one of the better people I know for doing that. I wish more people were like you. I might have to drive down there and buy you a beer sometime!



Make good on that, and I'll flick some beer tokens your way before you get there, to cover you both. (hold me to that)

Larrakin, that bums me out dude, but kudos for moving forward. Been in a similar situation to you, so I appreciate how much character it takes to just move on and be positive.


----------



## capoeiraesp

Your situation crossed my mind again just recently. Glad I had a check on this thread.
So with your money down the toilet with Bernie and people filing charge backs I guess this means everything is done for at BRJ guitars. Sorry you've been burnt so bad, Larrikin. I know how it feels to be scammed thousands, not quite as much you though. Hope the good karma realigns itself your way.


----------



## SpaceDock

The BBB has told me that BRJ Guitars will not respond to their inquiries.


----------



## Rev2010

I've kept up with this thread even though I wasn't in for a BRJ. I say this NOT to joke, but the thread title should be "The BRJ Black Friday Group Support Thread" because of how upsettingly sad it is how many of you lost so much money. It's pretty clear at this point there won't be any guitars or reimbursements and reading even recent posts about how much money some people lost just makes me so sad, like Larrikin's post  Larrikin - it's good to see though you've come away from it with a positive attitude. 

The one thing though that's killing me about this whole ordeal even though I don't have a cent invested in it is I truly want to know WTF he did with all that money! I still have a suspicion he might've had a gambling issue, though that is purely speculation of course.


Rev.


----------



## underthecurve

Rev2010 said:


> The one thing though that's killing me about this whole ordeal even though I don't have a cent invested in it is I truly want to know WTF he did with all that money! I still have a suspicion he might've had a gambling issue, though that is purely speculation of course.
> 
> 
> Rev.



I'm curious about what happened to all the half built guitars, and guitars "waiting on cases". I can only imagine the landlord backing up a dumpster and just clearing out Bernies shop. Or, Bernie, a family member, or friend grabbed them before he fully defaulted on the lease....


----------



## technomancer

Rev2010 said:


> I've kept up with this thread even though I wasn't in for a BRJ. I say this NOT to joke, but the thread title should be "The BRJ Black Friday Group Support Thread" because of how upsettingly sad it is how many of you lost so much money. It's pretty clear at this point there won't be any guitars or reimbursements and reading even recent posts about how much money some people lost just makes me so sad, like Larrikin's post  Larrikin - it's good to see though you've come away from it with a positive attitude.
> 
> The one thing though that's killing me about this whole ordeal even though I don't have a cent invested in it is I truly want to know WTF he did with all that money! I still have a suspicion he might've had a gambling issue, though that is purely speculation of course.
> 
> 
> Rev.



Add up that he was close to going under BEFORE the Black Friday run plus the fact that everything was outsourced and I suspect the amount of money wasn't what you think it was. I would suspect the BF guitars were probably sold at minimal if any profit just to get cash in the door to cover back bills


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## SpaceDock

^ this. I dont think he was making any real money and all of the sales were an attempt to just stay afloat. 

I really do wonder where all of the half finished guitars went. I saw at least 200 guitars that were 2/3 finished. I wonder if or when we will see them pop up.


----------



## WickedSymphony

You probably won't see them pop up until most of this blows over, and if anything they'll be listed on craigslist or something. I'd be really surprised if all of those guitars weren't being held on to for exactly this purpose. No way he'd actually be able to get back in the business of selling completed guitars after all, and I don't think there'd be any sense in throwing such a large amount of materials and half completed instruments in the dump.

Also, didn't somebody say they talked to the landlord? You'd think he would've said something if he actually had everything tossed out.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Bernie didn't know how to run a business. It's really as simple as that. He swindled people out of money in a desperate attempt to save his ass and it didn't play out. I know that's hard to accept, and for a long time I thought surely there must be something more to the story.

But no. It really is that simple. The man had no brain for business, and was also a liar who was trying to hold off accepting that his business was a total failure for as long as possible.


----------



## AwDeOh

Is it possible that the assets may have gone to a company creditor? I might have missed something but if he owed money, there would be businesses he owed. There'd have to be alot of equipment, tools and such.. would be very interesting to see if they actually just up and vanished.


----------



## kmanick

underthecurve said:


> I'm curious about what happened to all the half built guitars, and guitars "waiting on cases". I can only imagine the landlord backing up a dumpster and just clearing out Bernies shop. Or, Bernie, a family member, or friend grabbed them before he fully defaulted on the lease....


^ this , luckily I backed out of grabbing a spot on this run but I'd love to know where the hell all of these guitars are.
I know he had a purple version of a hesperian 7 with the same Retro head stock I have with the 2/5 layout (I think they are the only 2 in existence) that I would
love to get my hands on (that one is a pre black Friday run guitar) that looked like it only needed hardware on it and it was good to go.


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## SpaceDock

I will be keeping a close eye on any Rico activity. If he tries to sell anything, I will be on him.

Additionally, I really feel getting some Rico knock offs built. I still love the design, the execution was the issue. If he tries to come at me with any "that's my design" bs, I'll tell him I will cease when he gives me my money or my guitar.


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## mcsalty

SpaceDock said:


> If he tries to come at me with any "that's my design" bs, I'll tell him I will cease when he gives me my money or my guitar.









(Sorry, but I pretty much had to)


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## SpaceDock

I just feel like I need to take something from him, to even the score. I would like a Hesperian one way or another. Not the optimal path, but what options are really left.


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## sehnomatic

I've been following the luthier scene for some while but never got to know how this gentleman dug himself his own grave so deep and so fast. Just over a year ago, there was an entire circlejerk over his guitars.

Can someone give me a rundown of how the bloody hell he ....ed up this bad?

Many thanks in advance.


----------



## AngstRiddenDreams

Read through some pages in this thread man ^


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

sehnomatic said:


> Can someone give me a rundown of how the bloody hell he ....ed up this bad?



Long story short, he bit off more than he can chew.


----------



## AwDeOh

sehnomatic said:


> I've been following the luthier scene for some while but never got to know how this gentleman dug himself his own grave so deep and so fast.









He took everyone's deposit, bought this, dug deep, dug fast.


----------



## Tyson

In hindsight I should have held off when he said things like, 'we've tripled the amount of orders we were originally going to take!'


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## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah and even that was a lie. It was a SHIT-TON more than 3x the orders after all was said and done.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

AwDeOh said:


> He took everyone's deposit, bought this, dug deep, dug fast.


 
If he bought THIS and I can be allowed to operate it through a few choice cities, well then deposit well spent.


----------



## MetalDaze

I wonder how Bernie's New Year was? Hey Bernie, we haven't forgotten about all of this, so I hope you haven't either.


----------



## thepylestory

I'm sure he will pop up one day and when he does it's gonna be like flies on a corpse.


----------



## mikernaut

here's one guitar that apparently made it out before the disappearing act - Bernie Rico Jr Guitar | eBay


----------



## SpaceDock

That price is ....ed.


----------



## Tesla

Safe to say that'll be the most recent picture of Bernie. Was expecting him to look a lot worse if what we've been told he's been through is true.


----------



## technomancer

Bernie doing what he did best, standing and posing with a guitar


----------



## MaxStatic

mikernaut said:


> here's one guitar that apparently made it out before the disappearing act - Bernie Rico Jr Guitar | eBay



Dude's story in the description....can't afford to keep a gift? What?


----------



## Khoi

Khoi said:


> Called BoA today, they said I should be able to file a dispute, and it was definitely a valid case. I wasn't able to go through it all today because I needed to request my statement online, which takes about 24 hours. This is for my final payment, which was $1450. Lucky I used my debit card for that purchase.
> 
> I'll update you guys if it works of course.
> 
> I realized that I paid my $650 deposit with my PayPal balance =/
> 
> I guess we're completely out of luck trying to get that back, huh?





WickedSymphony said:


> For future reference, you should be able to download a copy of your statements in pdf format online instantly through the account page under 'statements and documents'. That's how I pulled mine up.
> 
> I'm not sure if paypal will help you, but I suppose you could try at the very least. I've heard they're more strict about that 45 day thing, but charge backs through the bank are usually like 60 days and they're still helping people apparently, so at the very least it's worth a shot. Worst case is you get a no and lose a few minutes filing the claim?
> 
> Good luck to both of you!




Ugh, I finally had a chance to call BoA back today.. (I know it's a bit late, but with finals, graduating college, moving back home, going out of town for a for a few weeks, holidays, etc. I didn't have time)

Apparently, they have no chargeback rights with debit cards past 1 year-6 months (another representative told me 60 days).

I'm not sure what the other rep I talked to about filing my claim said, but they really have no way of accessing that money and taking it back through a debit card purchase (which is how I paid).

If I paid by credit card, then I think there would be a higher chance for me to getting the money back, but since it's a debit card purchase, they have no way of actually getting the money back.

They basically said I'm SOL and I'll have to seek other avenues outside of the bank to get my money back...


...and so it continues


----------



## SpaceDock

^ that really sucks man.

I think about this almost everyday. I can't believe there is no accountability. 

Is it really possible for someone to take a ton of money, not deliver anything, and walk scott free? 

I have placed a ton of complaints with BBB and other groups. His website is still up and there is just no communication. At the very least he could say, "yeah I'm done, sorry guys, I'm a failure." That would be some closure at least.


----------



## themike

I haven't commented in here while everything was going on because I wanted to respect the rules but since things have finally come into light, I seriously just want to say....






I hope good karma comes your way to try and balance out such a crappy situation.


----------



## MaxStatic

^what he said. I'm sorry for you guys.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Damn Khoi, that really blows. I'm sorry to hear you didn't have better luck just doing a charge back 

I think I filed mine at like 1 year 5 months in, so I must have just barely gotten it in before the limit if it's the same for credit card...


----------



## Khoi

It would have been possible to dispute if I paid by credit card.

I've learned from this whole thing that CCs are much more secure than debit in terms of disputes. With debit, once the money gets into the other party's hands (after 60 days or whatever) it's theirs for good.

If I did pay by CC, and dispute it, the CC companies actually would go after Bernie. Credit card companies don't let shit slide.


----------



## Hollowway

My CC said they don't do it after 60 days or something. Is that really the case? It's a Chase card, but it sounds like you guys got way more action out of it than I did.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

^Do you mind me asking what the story is with your 8 string? Did you keep the Quilted Red one or did you send it back?


----------



## Hollowway

Lorcan Ward said:


> ^Do you mind me asking what the story is with your 8 string? Did you keep the Quilted Red one or did you send it back?



No, I kept it, thank God! He offered to build me a new one, but I didn't think I'd really take him up on it, because I knew he was getting swamped. I just have a $600 deposit on my Black Friday one that I'm out. And I know it's just about done, so I wish I could just go there and get it.

As far as Terri is concerned, I don't understand why she wouldn't just give us our guitars and then take the money. I'd happily pay to get the thing. I'd rather pay for a guitar almost done than lose a deposit on a guitar.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ my guess is they are trying to wait out the legal limitations on this (probably a few years) and then will start up again and sell them. I am sure they are just going to sit on everything and try to cash in later.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> ^ my guess is they are trying to wait out the legal limitations on this (probably a few years) and then will start up again and sell them. I am sure they are just going to sit on everything and try to cash in later.



Could be. Although the statute of limitations is going to be tricky, given that there isn't an established time frame as to when we noticed we wouldn't get our guitars. As far as I know, Bernie is in the hospital and Terri is going to take care of everything. But what you're saying makes sense, if that's the way they're going to take it. But there are a load of us on here that will make a lot of noise, so I'd be surprised if he was able to get his business back up and running. Honestly, I think the best thing for him to do now is just honor his agreements, or offer refunds. Showing you're a man of your word goes a long way when doing business dealings based on trust. But I have no idea what that camp is thinking now.

Interestingly, I discussed the issue with the police previously, and if I had sent my red BRJ back to him, and he did not return it, then it would be considered theft. Not getting a guitar is a contractual thing, and you cannot file a police report for it. But if the guitar was in your possession, and then given to someone else but not returned, then that is considered theft. Not that it would do much good, but that may give someone on here another avenue to pursue.


----------



## mikernaut

Pimp my guitars on ebay has this- 

Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Hesperian 7 QM String Electric Guitar Trans Black | eBay

Interesting they say they are an official dealer, also there's no signature on the back of the headstock. Curious if this is an older guitar or something more recent.


----------



## foreright

SpaceDock said:


> ^ my guess is they are trying to wait out the legal limitations on this (probably a few years) and then will start up again and sell them. I am sure they are just going to sit on everything and try to cash in later.



Unfortunately I think it's far more likely that he has lots of creditors (ie. he owes money to suppliers, banks, etc.) that are "higher up the food chain" than you guys and those guitars will most likely be sold to pay them off. Not sure exactly how it works in the US but certainly in the UK, customers are right at the bottom of the list when a company is liquidated.


----------



## AwDeOh

foreright said:


> Unfortunately I think it's far more likely that he has lots of creditors (ie. he owes money to suppliers, banks, etc.) that are "higher up the food chain" than you guys and those guitars will most likely be sold to pay them off. Not sure exactly how it works in the US but certainly in the UK, customers are right at the bottom of the list when a company is liquidated.



Yep, I said the same a few pages back. I've seen a little of the internal workings with my family's business having loans with a failed finance company here in New Zealand. It's not pretty, and it seems universal that laws are primarily aimed at stopping a domino effect of business collapse, rather than protecting the customers.

Bernie was outsourcing a lot of the manufacturing process, so I'd imagine that while the customer side of the dispute is all very public, in the background the related businesses will be working things out behind closed doors - indeed they probably already have.


----------



## mikernaut

fun fact- Bernie's hacky work is preventing me from installing new BKP's in my Jekyll 7 string. The pup routes are cut too tightly. Looks like he grinded down the corners of the Aftermaths that he installed. Then he used bigger mounting screws to direct mount them. So I had to run out and buy some drill bits to make the new pups work with the larger screws and holes he. but... still can't get the bridge pup in without finding some way to grind the corners off a little. 

Also the Aftermath neck pup he put in was upside down. 

Another fun one was out of curiosity I opened the control cavity of my other BRJ and he didn't line up the input jack properly with the cavity route so he had to crudely grind the corner out to accommodate the input jack.


----------



## Phrygian

Dude, I had those EXACT same issues with the 8-string I had for a short while a couple of years ago. 

This makes me conclude that he didn't just cut corners on mine, but that it's his way of doing it. Not okay. 

I dare you to check the tuner holes as well..


----------



## ramses

Phrygian said:


> Dude, I had those EXACT same issues with the 8-string I had for a short while a couple of years ago.
> 
> This makes me conclude that he didn't just cut corners on mine, but that it's his way of doing it. Not okay.
> 
> I dare you to check the tuner holes as well..



And these things are currently selling second hand for $3K+??!!


----------



## JPMike

Well, I am being owed 3 guitars... 



mikernaut said:


> fun fact- Bernie's hacky work is preventing me from installing new BKP's in my Jekyll 7 string. The pup routes are cut too tightly. Looks like he grinded down the corners of the Aftermaths that he installed. Then he used bigger mounting screws to direct mount them. So I had to run out and buy some drill bits to make the new pups work with the larger screws and holes he. but... still can't get the bridge pup in without finding some way to grind the corners off a little.
> 
> Also the Aftermath neck pup he put in was upside down.
> 
> Another fun one was out of curiosity I opened the control cavity of my other BRJ and he didn't line up the input jack properly with the cavity route so he had to crudely grind the corner out to accommodate the input jack.



I had no problem with installing a Lundgren M7 set.


----------



## demonx

mikernaut said:


> Also the Aftermath neck pup he put in was upside down.



I'm a full time guitar builder and use mostly BKP, however I had to email them to ask which way they make their pickups, as they actually make their neck pickups upside down (old gibson style), so the wires will exit at the top. 

Strange but true.


----------



## SpaceDock

I got an update from my bank, Wells Fargo, saying they with Visa are doing an investigation into Mr. Rico's organization on my behalf. Not sure if anything will come of it, but I gave them a ton of documentation, including excerpts from this thread to detail the extent of his fraudulent behavior. 

I hope he is happy with the bed he has made.


----------



## SpaceDock

huh, double post..


----------



## Khoi

SpaceDock said:


> I got an update from my bank, Wells Fargo, saying they with Visa are doing an investigation into Mr. Rico's organization on my behalf. Not sure if anything will come of it, but I gave them a ton of documentation, including excerpts from this thread to detail the extent of his fraudulent behavior.
> 
> I hope he is happy with the bed he has made.



Visa credit card?


----------



## SpaceDock

Debit/credit


----------



## Drusas

I cannot believe there isn't any resolution. Anyone try bringing this to the media's attention? There's enough people that I imagine there would be a field day and flow of support for the peopel screwed. I.e. lighting a major fire under the Rico's asses. Whoever is running the shop or paying their electricity at this point. 

I'm not reading 188 pages to know if anyone has tried or what the sides of that I'm not thinking about are.. so, be gentle if that's too much of an assumption for a solution. Either way, I feel for you guys and I actually sold both my BRJ Vixens because of how he has treated his customers.


----------



## technomancer

mikernaut said:


> fun fact- Bernie's hacky work is preventing me from installing new BKP's in my Jekyll 7 string. The pup routes are cut too tightly. Looks like he grinded down the corners of the Aftermaths that he installed. Then he used bigger mounting screws to direct mount them. So I had to run out and buy some drill bits to make the new pups work with the larger screws and holes he. but... still can't get the bridge pup in without finding some way to grind the corners off a little.
> 
> Also the Aftermath neck pup he put in was upside down.
> 
> Another fun one was out of curiosity I opened the control cavity of my other BRJ and he didn't line up the input jack properly with the cavity route so he had to crudely grind the corner out to accommodate the input jack.



Grinding a baseplate or cover edge isn't uncommon to fit a pickup into a pickup route nor is using larger screws to direct mount a pickup  Also having to install a neck pickup "upside down" for it to be oriented correctly isn't unusual either. 

Grinding an output jack is another story


----------



## possumkiller

Or grinding off the bottom of a ToM instead of recessing it lol.


----------



## hardvalve

This makes me sad.


----------



## clubshred

Drusas said:


> I cannot believe there isn't any resolution. Anyone try bringing this to the media's attention? There's enough people that I imagine there would be a field day and flow of support for the peopel screwed. I.e. lighting a major fire under the Rico's asses. Whoever is running the shop or paying their electricity at this point.
> 
> I'm not reading 188 pages to know if anyone has tried or what the sides of that I'm not thinking about are.. so, be gentle if that's too much of an assumption for a solution. Either way, I feel for you guys and I actually sold both my BRJ Vixens because of how he has treated his customers.



I know for the longest time that I, myself, remained silent on all of this. As someone who had a lot at stake with BRJ I realized that I had to just cut my losses - which does include a "special" BFR guitar. I think it's a joke that it's even discussed when this happened in November of 2010 and barely any deliveries were made. Deep down I knew this would happen but I didn't want to start some kind of a half-assed war with the Bernie apologists and defenders. The text messages on my phone tell a different story, believe me. 

I'll still keep my mouth shut.


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## Nightrain

Just saw this. I see I am not alone. I'm out 1900 on a trans blue Vixen. Was going to create a thread on poss legal action but seems there is probably no need. I found a more competent luthier and I'll be using him from now on.
Nightrain


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## irocksteady

.

Join Date: Jan 2014

Location: Norway

Posts: 1

Thanked: 0

Feedback Score: 0 reviews

Ripped of by Bernie Rico Jr Guitars?

Hi people!

Ive been talking with the Californian Superior Court today and i would like to know if some of you are interested in taking some action and proceed with our "issue" vs BRJG! Seems like everyone's sitting on the fence waiting for a miracle to happen..

I need to gather at least 10 customers so we stay stronger in this case..

There's some options. It all depence on if we sue him all together or one by one alone.

*Small claims court
*Superior Court.

Im not an american citizen, but the judge i spoke with said it's no problem at all to sue him no matter where im located on the planet.

S.G

..


----------



## SpaceDock

The true justice is that this asshole won't ever be in any business for the rest of his shit head life. He took a legacy and threw it into the toilet. His Dad would punch him in the balls if he were still alive. 

I would never speak so heinously about anyone else. This man lied, cheated, and stole from so many of us. He deserves nothing, he is nothing. What a piece of shit he is. I hope he fades away like the waste he is.


----------



## wannabguitarist

SpaceDock said:


> The true justice is that this asshole won't ever be in any business for the rest of his shit head life. He took a legacy and threw it into the toilet. His Dad would punch him in the balls if he were still alive.
> 
> I would never speak so heinously about anyone else. This man lied, cheated, and stole from so many of us. He deserves nothing, he is nothing. What a piece of shit he is. I hope he fades away like the waste he is.



Wasn't Rico Sr. kind of sketchy too?


----------



## SpaceDock

Sketch is different from scam


----------



## irocksteady

Yeah as far as i know his father took the fame for some designs he never made hi self. Anyway im willing to spend $100 in small claims court trying to get back some money. Then i can rest my case and say at least ive tried!!!!


----------



## SpaceDock

Visa and Wells Fargo told me my case is being closed and they couldn't really give me any more info than that. I had worked really hard on getting them all of the important info but in the end they let me down. 

I really feel like going to Cali just to punch him in the face. It would be worth it IMO.


----------



## irocksteady

Same with me SpaceDoc. Visa want refound any $ when its over 120 days after the transfear.. For those who used Mastercard theres better insurance connected to the card. 

To the post above: Yes its true, Rico Sr ripped off another guys design and used it as it was him who created it:/ Both father and son are common with shady business


----------



## bloodlust

Right be for the black Friday sale I had been talking to Bernie about building me a guitar I had a severe back injury and had to pawn most of my good guitars to make it through the rough times and was just waiting on my disability to go through to order from him he even told me I understand you have been through some hard times so just send me what you can so I can start your build and you can get it sooner once your disability goes through but I told him no I would just rather bay for it in full, looking back now I can't belive that him being some one with health problems him self would take advantage of some one else that wad going through health problems of there own looking back I fill fortunate I did not get my back pay then its just so sad he seemed so sincere and sympathetic over the phone when I think now he was all ready starting to pull his scam I understand if he can't do the thing that he wsd so awsome at doing but there is no excuse for him to take advantage of every one the way he did obviously his disability is mental and not physical to this day I still love his guitars but would not buy one even second hand because of this ordeal . One last thing I hate to be the bearer of bad news as soon as the legal procedures start coming in against him he is just going to file bank ruptcey and no one will see a dime I'm sure all of this has dine been talked about with attorneys and I would imagine the shop has been transfered over to his brother . Good luck every body I fill for you guys but you are going to need it


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

I'm not sure if this belongs here, but it looks like Jed Simon ditched BRJ recently. He's now endorsed by Jackson. Is anyone even endorsed by BRJ at this point?


----------



## Lorcan Ward

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I'm not sure if this belongs here, but it looks like Jed Simon ditched BRJ recently. He's now endorsed by Jackson. Is anyone even endorsed by BRJ at this point?



His contract was most likely up. If he emailed Bernie he would have gotten no reply and he sure as hell would not have got another guitar anytime soon. 

Continuing to endorse BRJ guitars wouldn't be a good public move when there would be nothing to gain for the artist or fans.


----------



## Tesla

Lorcan Ward said:


> His contract was most likely up. If he emailed Bernie he would have gotten no reply and he sure as hell would not have got another guitar anytime soon.
> 
> Continuing to endorse BRJ guitars wouldn't be a good public move when there would be nothing to gain for the artist or fans.



Jed was among the load of people flooding his Facebook page with questions last year. IIRC he even released a statement about it on his own page. It was documented in this thread, probably quite a few pages back now. But yeah, I imagine he just got fed up like the rest of us.


----------



## MJS

SpaceDock said:


> The true justice is that this asshole won't ever be in any business for the rest of his shit head life. He took a legacy and threw it into the toilet.



He could start a "Back in Business Sale!" thread tomorrow and would get a bunch of orders from this forum, including from people that have read this thread.


----------



## SpaceDock

Maybe I should have put this in sooner....

I called around a bunch after losing my battle with the credit company. 

Bernie is bankrupt.
His house was foreclosed on.
He attempted suicide, pretty horrifically I will add ( I do not want to even think about what they told me)
He is living with friends/family and is destitute. 

There is nothing left for anyone and Bernie is barely alive. There are some criminal charges against him with his suppliers/other business partners. He will most likely be in jail after he goes to trial. 

Sucks for us.


----------



## thrsher

SpaceDock said:


> Maybe I should have put this in sooner....
> 
> I called around a bunch after losing my battle with the credit company.
> 
> Bernie is bankrupt.
> His house was foreclosed on.
> He attempted suicide, pretty horrifically I will add ( I do not want to even think about what they told me)
> He is living with friends/family and is destitute.
> 
> There is nothing left for anyone and Bernie is barely alive. There are some criminal charges against him with his suppliers/other business partners. He will most likely be in jail after he goes to trial.
> 
> Sucks for us.



intense. my condolences to all parties involved and screwed


----------



## downburst82

wow..thats alot worse that I expected :/

Really sorry to all the guys that got screwed


----------



## Khoi

jesus christ that is pretty horrible. I STILL don't see why they can't just give us our guitars though in whatever state they are in


----------



## SpaceDock

^ when Terry got to the shop everything was already too far gone. She thought they would be able to figure out who had what, but the records were f'ed. He didn't really have the hardware or pickups to finish anything and supposedly the suppliers cut him off even before the Black Friday sale. Rumor is that the "assets" Ie our guitars and his tools, are tied up in the legal bullshit to pay off some of his other debts.

Terry and some of Bernie's luthier friends thought they might be able to fix the situation while he was in the hospital, not voluntary due to the suicide attempt. When they got to the shop a lot of it was trashed, by Bernie most likely drunk or on drugs, prior to the "attempt." She realized how far gone everything was and had to just let go. 

In addition, everything of the guitars beyond the paint/fretwork/hardware/setup was done by an ex bc rich luthier out of San Diego, still trying to track him down. Bernie then farmed out the paint as well. He was only doing the hardware, frets, and setup. So really this is why nothing was being done. 

I have yet to determine if his descent was drug/alcohol/stress/wtf ever related, but the facts remain unchanged. WE ARE DONE. 

I have tried really hard to tie up any loose strings and I am trying to find Bernie. We'll see if I get lucky.


----------



## ramses

SpaceDock said:


> [...] supposedly the suppliers cut him off even before the Black Friday sale.



This is very revealing.


----------



## Slunk Dragon

I've been watching this whole thing for months, and I just want to say I have the utmost empathy for so many of you guys. I cannot imagine how gutting this feels.

If it's worth anything, I'd offer you guys all drinks if you were within a reasonable distance of me, though I think for many the distance is oceans.

Best wishes to so many of you. \m/


----------



## Lorcan Ward

So sorry to hear this you guys.


----------



## timbale

I've red almost the whole thread and have to say:

Heads up! I am sorry for you guys, but at least you know what you are about now. This sucks, but thats how it goes sometimes. In the end it's "just" money. Remember you could somehow be in his position.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Oh man, that´s far worse than I expected. 

However, I´m done with this shit. Thinking about it anymore will just get me mad.
I lost "only" 1000&#8364;, but I´m only a poor student, so tho sucks pretty hard.

But I learned a lesson: I will NEVER EVER AGAIN buy/ order something expensive overseas.

Half an hour from me lives an excellent luthier, I´m so fu**in retarded.

Different laws and the distance just made it nearly impossible to do something about this situation. If it was in europe I would have driven there and kicked some serious ass. 

I think I´ll just have to let it go....


----------



## thrsher

SpaceDock said:


> Visa and Wells Fargo told me my case is being closed and they couldn't really give me any more info than that. I had worked really hard on getting them all of the important info but in the end they let me down.
> .




i would close your accounts and open new ones on sheer principal


----------



## MaxOfMetal

thrsher said:


> i would close your accounts and open new ones on sheer principal



So little personal responsibility till the very end. 

I'm sorry guys, but looking back through the last 15 or 20 pages, I don't see how anyone can blame credit card companies, banks, or regulatory/policing agencies in the slightest. This whole thing went pear shaped years ago, not six weeks, six months, or even 16 months. 

This thread should serve as a reminder to everyone to cut the shit and pull the f_u_ck out before the window of action and reimbursement closes. I mean shit was already a year late before folks even started to question things and nearly two years past promised completion date before the first person even considered trying to get their money back. 

I'm sorry for your loss guys, I really am. I did everything I could behind the scenes and front and center to either convince you folks to get your money back or to not take the plunge. I contacted folks in my personal time trying to sort out this mess, and I certainly wasn't alone in that. 

If you guys didn't care enough to move things to the next level after _years_ (I can't stress that enough, _years_) why should banks or courts, or credit cards care? 

What would have had to of happened for your guys to wake up sooner? I mean, in the first year alone this thread had:
-Deadlines not being met by a pretty extreme degree
-Several shills signing up or coming in just to say what folks wanted to hear
-Guitars with the wrong spec
-Employees and artists jumping ship left and right
-Shills who admitted to accepting bribes to quell the backlash 

Fast forward another 12 months and you get:
-Guitars delivered with flaws
-Even longer delays
-Increased pricing on instock/new order guitars
-Rumors (some credible, some not) of business cash flow issues
-More employees leaving
-More shills coming out of the woodwork 
-Customers getting threatened 
-New guitars not getting NGDs

And then another 12 months:
-Absolutely zero word from the BRJ camp
-Dealers are losing their shit
-Guitars that are arriving are going right to the marketplace

It was then another year before folks started coming in here with talks of lawsuits and charge backs. 

There are several lessons to be learned from this ordeal and one of them is that you have to protect yourself because no one else is going to be able to, not even the behemoth banks and credit cards or the intricate legal systems of first world nations. 

Yes, Bernie Rico Jr. was the true villain in all this. He wanted/needed money and had been in the business long enough to know how to properly exploit it. He did so with dishonesty and a complete lack of shame. He screwed up so bad that it has wrecked his name, his family, his business, and ultimately his life. If what Spacedock is saying is accurate, Bernie might as well be dead as his presence in this world is going to be confined to little more than a dark cell. The stones have been wrought of all their blood. We live in an imperfect system though, I don't think I have to tell you guys that. You are all still out what you're owed and will never get it back, that's clear. 

The reason I'm being so harsh right now isn't a twisted way of saying "I told you so!". If all I wanted was the satisfaction of rubbing your faces in it I wouldn't take the time to write all this. You know me guys, and that's not how I roll. I'm being harsh because I desperately don't want this to happen again. I'm not saying this selfishly, while I did get numerous threats via here, FB, email, etc. and even had certain folks try talking to/threatening my family (keep it classy shills) over guitars, I just don't want this community to have to go through this. I don't want fellow guitarists getting fleeced and I don't want good builders missing out on orders because folks have been scared off by events like these. 

So guys, I'm sorry. I really truly am. There has been absolutely nothing positive to come out of this situation and from the looks of it, nothing positive ever will. 

Stay frosty and maybe sit back and say "This is a great deal, but is it a smart one?". Peace.


----------



## thrsher

MaxOfMetal said:


> So little personal responsibility till the very end.



i say this solely from a business aspect. these are the companies he/we give our business to and they should make so sort of attempt to help us out. i would never deny my part in a situation but if there are other business i am working with and they cant help me or provide better protection, best assured i will move on to another company that can provide to me god forbid another shit situation arises.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

thrsher said:


> i say this solely from a business aspect. these are the companies he/we give our business to and they should make so sort of attempt to help us out. i would never deny my part in a situation but if there are other business i am working with and they cant help me or provide better protection, best assured i will move on to another company that can provide to me god forbid another shit situation arises.



I can't think of a single bank or credit card company that would protect a client this far (3+ years) out. 

I could only see something like that being severely abused to the point business would not accept them as valid payment.


----------



## SpaceDock

Max, couldn't agree more. I think this should really be a warning to anyone dealing with small luthier shops. It seems like this is happening all the time now.

edit: this was my first time dealing with a custom guitar, what a learning experience


----------



## mikernaut

I'm a really sympathetic guy but not for Bernie after all this. Seems like karma is getting back to him, sadly at our expense though too.

I'm hoping Skervesen can keep it together. Just received my 1st guitar from them and it's the only guitar that has impressed me enough and is equal to my original BRJ ( pre-.... up era Bernie)

Planning a 2nd build currently, I know at this point most people might not want to try another Luthier after this debacle. but just throwing it out there.


----------



## canuck brian

My condolences to all involved


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

This news is what I had figured. He basically has relapsed. If I had the time I'd hunt him down (not the first time I've done that regarding a sour business transaction, or ID theft. The latter guy wishes he never used my name, but now he'll never forget it from his jail cell. Don't FVCK with deployed combat arms veterans). But that's not going to amount to anything anymore. The only honest redemption would be a court ruling forcing him to finish builds under house arrest, or even from jail. Hell I'd take a BRJ made in a workshop set up in prison, like Alcatraz . The logistics and loans needed would of course, make this impossible. And even if it happened, the chances of another suicide attempt will always be there. That would be a hell of a way to live, but if it was me and it gave me a chance to clear my name, I'd do it. Besides, axes from Alcatraz sounds like a metal as fvck idea. 

I'm sad and pissed for us all. Big lesson learned, as MaxOfMetal summed it up perfectly. I still love his designs, and at this point I'd have ZERO issue paying someone trustworthy to make a reasonable copy, especially considering how he did nothing but hardware, strings and setup. It would be the same thing: outsourcing a build. But with so many choices out there from AWESOME luthiers, I'd just like to get this behind me. I try to be lighthearted, but that's understandably NOT easy for some of the more invested guys. I'd love for us all to be there in court when the gavel falls. - OOH good title for a song.


----------



## arielmarx1014

I don't know how the Skervesen guys are doing it, but they seem to be delivering for a while now with consistency. So their model must work. I am a proud owner of one. I started this thread yesterday and basically just kind of finished skimming through it. I am appalled really at this situation and how long it has taken and zero resolution in sight. I was expecting as I kept advancing through the pages that individuals would start getting their instruments and see some closure to it.

I have to say when I read the initial Black Friday sale and how Bernie kept saying, hey guys this is a great deal, I want no one to miss out, etc etc, the statements did not give me a good feeling. They didn't sound like honest talk but rather salesmen talk. Anyways this is my opinion and assessment. I am truly sorry for all the victims here. People have families and work hard to maybe have the instrument of their dreams as a hobby, band or profession. Seeing companies with no moral compass that can shatter and destroy individual's hopes and passion is really disheartening. I hope some of you guys see resolution or at least can move forward form this.

Ariel


----------



## Xaios

MaxOfMetal said:


> -Shills who admitted to accepting bribes to quell the backlash



Damn, I missed that part. I can't say I'm terribly surprised by it in hindsight, but that's still a pretty stunning revelation...


----------



## Ajb667

After skimming this thread all I can say is just...wow. It really sucks a lot of you wont get anything back. That really sucks. D:


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Xaios said:


> Damn, I missed that part. I can't say I'm terribly surprised by it in hindsight, but that's still a pretty stunning revelation...


 
This is just the tip of the iceberg: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2687771-post665.html

Free guitars and guitar parts so you don't tell folks your guitars have issues and even try and sell more guitars (shill) is a bribe no matter how you cut it.


----------



## JPMike

Life has been really busy lately and I log in mostly to check the classifieds and just see if any interesting topic is up, but I don't really have time to get into deep conversations, etc. But since this thread feels personal to me, I will just share my experience. 

I had the luck to own 4 BRJs so far, which only 1 of them was one of my builds, I have to say that each of one of them blew me away and if I come by a cool and my finance allows it, I will just buy it. Funny thing, the best one so far I enjoy the most is my own build. 

Bernie owes me 3 more builds, 2 stock builds I chose from his inventory cause I couldn't help waiting anymore and a build that was supposed to be done later sometime. 
Ironically, the 2 stock builds were ready for final assembly the week Bernie got into the hospital. So it was bad luck for me. Of course, the last build would take a lot of time to be made, but somehow it would manage to be built. 

I don't know what's the future going to be. I guess, I lost a good amount of money. 

As for Skervesen, I already had 3 builds by them and they are ....ing amazing guitars. I expect 3 more, their ideas are limitless.


----------



## electriceye

What a shitty end to, what could have been, a great legacy. The stuff he started doing on his own was better than anyone else was doing, and had some amazing design ideas. 

To me, it sounds like anyone going through the trouble of filing a lawsuit or whatever is going to be throwing away MORE money. If he is, in fact, destitute and not well, where is the money going to come from? If his "inventory" was trashed, then there's nothing to sell. If he has no home, then what else is there. The money is gone. People have every right to be enraged. They were taken by someone who, previously, had a good name. Sad all around.  

If I could move forward on my dream of becoming a luthier, I'd basically use half of his designs.


----------



## mikernaut

Well lets not kid ourselves ... the reality is he most likely outsourced 90% of the work and just did finishing touches and tried to run the business side ( and failed) all while using the "Rico" name that his father had established back with BC Rich.


----------



## clubshred

MaxOfMetal said:


> This is just the tip of the iceberg: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2687771-post665.html
> 
> Free guitars and guitar parts so you don't tell folks your guitars have issues and even try and sell more guitars (shill) is a bribe no matter how you cut it.



Ah, yes, Max - my old buddy. He used to be my guitar tech and the crap I could tell you about those early days of BRJ and our relationship. There was no bigger shill than Mr. "Tech".


----------



## depa73

irocksteady said:


> .
> 
> Join Date: Jan 2014
> 
> Location: Norway
> 
> Posts: 1
> 
> Thanked: 0
> 
> Feedback Score: 0 reviews
> 
> Ripped of by Bernie Rico Jr Guitars?
> 
> Hi people!
> 
> Ive been talking with the Californian Superior Court today and i would like to know if some of you are interested in taking some action and proceed with our "issue" vs BRJG! Seems like everyone's sitting on the fence waiting for a miracle to happen..
> 
> I need to gather at least 10 customers so we stay stronger in this case..
> 
> There's some options. It all depence on if we sue him all together or one by one alone.
> 
> *Small claims court
> *Superior Court.
> 
> Im not an american citizen, but the judge i spoke with said it's no problem at all to sue him no matter where im located on the planet.
> 
> S.G
> 
> ..


Hi Irocksteady,
first of all I apologize for my bad English. 
I'm an Italian citizen and 2 years ago I paid $ 3740 for a custom Hesperian slant top guitar. 
I would like to participate in the legal action that you suggested. below you can find my address and my e-mail. Please contact me personally when you want.

Andrea De Paola
via Giovanni Pascoli, 64
21057 Olgiate Olona (VA) - Italy
[email protected]


----------



## Tesla

depa73 said:


> Hi Irocksteady,
> first of all I apologize for my bad English.
> I'm an Italian citizen and 2 years ago I paid $ 3740 for a custom Hesperian slant top guitar.
> I would like to participate in the legal action that you suggested. below you can find my address and my e-mail. Please contact me personally when you want.
> 
> Andrea De Paola
> via Giovanni Pascoli, 64
> 21057 Olgiate Olona (VA) - Italy
> [email protected]



I would send this as a PM, more chance of him seeing it!


----------



## Svava

depa73 said:


> Hi Irocksteady,
> first of all I apologize for my bad English.
> I'm an Italian citizen and 2 years ago I paid $ 3740 for a custom Hesperian slant top guitar.
> I would like to participate in the legal action that you suggested. below you can find my address and my e-mail. Please contact me personally when you want.
> 
> BADJUJU



I would recommend you to PM him that information and delete it out of this thread- having your personal address name and contact floating around on the internet is bad juju.


----------



## Diggi

SpaceDock said:


> ^ when Terry got to the shop everything was already too far gone. She thought they would be able to figure out who had what, but the records were f'ed. He didn't really have the hardware or pickups to finish anything and supposedly the suppliers cut him off even before the Black Friday sale. Rumor is that the "assets" Ie our guitars and his tools, are tied up in the legal bullshit to pay off some of his other debts.
> 
> Terry and some of Bernie's luthier friends thought they might be able to fix the situation while he was in the hospital, not voluntary due to the suicide attempt. When they got to the shop a lot of it was trashed, by Bernie most likely drunk or on drugs, prior to the "attempt." She realized how far gone everything was and had to just let go.
> 
> In addition, everything of the guitars beyond the paint/fretwork/hardware/setup was done by an ex bc rich luthier out of San Diego, still trying to track him down. Bernie then farmed out the paint as well. He was only doing the hardware, frets, and setup. So really this is why nothing was being done.
> 
> I have yet to determine if his descent was drug/alcohol/stress/wtf ever related, but the facts remain unchanged. WE ARE DONE.
> 
> I have tried really hard to tie up any loose strings and I am trying to find Bernie. We'll see if I get lucky.




And yet..... Terry gave me a much different story. She told me all of the guitars were brought to her house, how she did so herself and she sent me photos of my unfinished guitar, on her sofa. 

I still have all of the texts and photos she sent me of the guitar in the shop (before she moved it) and after.... at her house. 

There is even more "weirdness" (let's call it)

FU BRJ


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Diggi said:


> And yet..... Terry gave me a much different story. She told me all of the guitars were brought to her house, how she did so herself and she sent me photos of my unfinished guitar, on her sofa.
> 
> I still have all of the texts and photos she sent me of the guitar in the shop (before she moved it) and after.... at her house.
> 
> There is even more "weirdness" (let's call it)
> 
> FU BRJ





so the guitars are still existing ? How were you able to contact Terry ?


----------



## InfinityCollision

Bits and pieces of various guitars probably exist, but if he's got unpaid debtors come calling then you guys are last in line to get any of it. In other words, you'll probably never see your guitars or your money at this point.


----------



## SpaceDock

Diggi said:


> And yet..... Terry gave me a much different story. She told me all of the guitars were brought to her house, how she did so herself and she sent me photos of my unfinished guitar, on her sofa.
> 
> I still have all of the texts and photos she sent me of the guitar in the shop (before she moved it) and after.... at her house.
> 
> There is even more "weirdness" (let's call it)
> 
> FU BRJ



Then why the .... can't she do the right thing and send us our unfinished guitars!!!! Is she as much of a shit as him. Holding our money hostage!


----------



## Rev2010

InfinityCollision said:


> Bits and pieces of various guitars probably exist, but if he's got unpaid debtors come calling then you guys are last in line to get any of it.



Creditors however don't accept unfinished guitars, or even finished ones, as payment. And I kinda think it would be hard for Terry to try to sell off unfinished BRJ guitars as well. All I can think of is she either doesn't have or doesn't want to spend the money and time to sort everything out and ship customers their unfinished guitars and hardware they paid for (how many people in here have I seen sent Bernie Bareknuckles and such ).


Rev.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

yep, send them a brand new set of aftermaths in camo finish. Really pisses me of. 

And yeah, I know that we´ll most likely see our guitars never again. 

BUT if there´s some way to contact Terry, please let her know that we want our guitars or share the contact info


----------



## InfinityCollision

Rev2010 said:


> Creditors however don't accept unfinished guitars, or even finished ones, as payment.



IANAL, but I'm pretty sure they'd be counted as assets of the business. You can't pay a creditor in unfinished guitars, but they _do_ have some monetary value... Not much, but it's still money the creditors can collect on and you guys are further down the food chain. I remember this coming up earlier in the thread, think it was Max but might have been someone else.


----------



## fantom

Note: I'm not a customer, but I've followed this thread a VERY long time and wanted to say something. Please remove if this is inappropriate and PM me for bad behavior. I am saying this to possibly help people involved.

First off. This situation is terrible. I really feel bad for everyone involved (including the Rico family, they are people too).

Regarding creditors, I'm not a lawyer, but I'm going through something similar with a family member and wanted to share my learnings.

1) You guys won't hear back from the BRJ business. *The lawyer is probably advising the Rico family to avoid contact* and using means like newspapers and such to communicate. It is a legal tactic. This means if you want to act, you need to follow up with bankruptcy courts and put effort into finding what is going on.

2) The advice "you're further down the food chain" doesn't make sense to me. I strongly advise people not listen to this advice unless there is justification from someone linking to laws or a reputable source. See #3.

3) You guys have a *contract with BRJ in writing*. You gave him money. How are you not a creditor?! You gave him money on the assumption he was going to ship a guitar to you. That seems like you have collateral!

4) In a bankruptcy, the business is not allowed to "pick and choose" creditors to pay, they typically pay a percentage of the liquidated capital based on the investment amount. If banks or anything are involved, they care more about big ticket items that have deeds, like mortgages, vehicles, and land, ie. "secured credit". Guitars, wood, pickups, and parts and not "secured". So even "unsecured" creditors may be eligible for something, and you guys are in that class. *The Rico family's best hope is that you guys do NOT file claims so that they can keep anything that is leftover. Which means they likely have a lawyer telling them not to respond to anyone!*

5) Even if there are no funds available, BRJ has lied to you guys, in writing. He may not have intentionally started lying, but there is a clear pattern of him accepting payment on the false pretense that he is "shipping". This is fraud and, AFAIK, *not protected by bankruptcy* in CA.

6) Anyone who shipped him pickups, if you want them back, at this point it's probably theft.

Again, I'm not a lawyer. But I think some of these posts are talking people out of consulting a lawyer when they really should (I mean people with over $1000 invested, but really anyone who wants even a down payment back). Yes, there is a high chance that the lawyer will take more money and not produce results, but most consultations are free or relatively cheap. I'm kind of surprised someone hasn't updated this thread with actual legal advice from a lawyer. (If someone has, I must have missed it, but I've read every post for a few years now and it is the only thing that stopped me from buying a build spot as people were offloading them).

Again, apologies if this is out of line.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Well hey lookey lookey! Somehow these guys got a "new" BRJ. I wonder how that works? What with... you know... no more guitars being built... and all...

Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Vixen Spalted Maple Electric Guitar Natural | eBay


----------



## arielmarx1014

It says "full warranty" who offers the warranty? lol Seller?


----------



## downburst82

they did a great job with the trem cavity/cover....


----------



## SpaceDock

It says used in the "condition" field, not new.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

That spalted top is awesome though!


----------



## pondman

I was really digging that until I saw the headstock


----------



## basssolo4u

pondman said:


> I was really digging that until I saw the headstock


That is the Vixen headstock as originally designed.


----------



## esp_eraser

I really like it, looks fantastic minus the rear trem cavity cover as mentioned earlier.
Those inlays were used often used on earlier vixens, so I wouldnt be suprised if this isnt at least a few years old.


----------



## wannabguitarist

fantom said:


> 2) The advice "you're further down the food chain" doesn't make sense to me. I strongly advise people not listen to this advice unless there is justification from someone linking to laws or a reputable source. See #3.
> 
> 3) You guys have a *contract with BRJ in writing*. You gave him money. How are you not a creditor?! You gave him money on the assumption he was going to ship a guitar to you. That seems like you have collateral!
> 
> 4) In a bankruptcy, the business is not allowed to "pick and choose" creditors to pay, they typically pay a percentage of the liquidated capital based on the investment amount. If banks or anything are involved, they care more about big ticket items that have deeds, like mortgages, vehicles, and land, ie. "secured credit". Guitars, wood, pickups, and parts and not "secured". So even "unsecured" creditors may be eligible for something, and you guys are in that class. *The Rico family's best hope is that you guys do NOT file claims so that they can keep anything that is leftover. Which means they likely have a lawyer telling them not to respond to anyone!*



In a bankruptcy situation customers are further down the food chain than secure creditors. Customers only have access to a small percentage of what's left over (if anything) after the secure creditors (banks, suppliers, business partners-maybe) get their cut. 

Customers gave BRJ money for a guitar (I do hope you guys have some sort of written contract); they're customers not creditors. I doubt there's going to be much of anything left over related to BRJ business left over for the Rico family after the creditors take their part, let alone customers.


----------



## foreright

wannabguitarist said:


> In a bankruptcy situation customers are further down the food chain than secure creditors. Customers only have access to a small percentage of what's left over (if anything) after the secure creditors (banks, suppliers, business partners-maybe) get their cut.
> 
> Customers gave BRJ money for a guitar (I do hope you guys have some sort of written contract); they're customers not creditors. I doubt there's going to be much of anything left over related to BRJ business left over for the Rico family after the creditors take their part, let alone customers.



This is correct. A "creditor" is someone / a company who has given credit or lent money to BRJ. A customer is completely different unfortunately and (certainly in the UK, I can't imagine the US is much different in this regard) as stated above, secured creditors, ie, banks and suppliers, get paid out first and customers get paid from whatever is left over which is usually the square root of f-all given that they are bankrupt.


----------



## Rev2010

wannabguitarist said:


> Customers gave BRJ money for a guitar (I do hope you guys have some sort of written contract); they're customers not creditors.



Right, and BRJ kept taking the money, clearly did not use it for business purposes, and never provided a product to dozens up dozens of customers. That is FRAUD. Bankruptcy isn't an instant get out of jail free card for fraudulent actions, if it were everyone would be doing it and laughing their way to the bank.

Sure people are almost certain to not get their money back or their instruments, but you all should consider pressing charges so this SOB is punished for his fraudulent actions.


Rev.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Rev2010 said:


> Right, and BRJ kept taking the money, clearly did not use it for business purposes, and never provided a product to dozens up dozens of customers. That is FRAUD. Bankruptcy isn't an instant get out of jail free card for fraudulent actions, if it were everyone would be doing it and laughing their way to the bank.
> 
> Sure people are almost certain to not get their money back or their instruments, but you all should consider pressing charges so this SOB is punished for his fraudulent actions.
> 
> 
> Rev.



I'm not advocating for or against legal action, but it's worth noting:

The "punishment" for civil fraud is typically money damages. Those are hard to get when there's no money available. You can probably get a money judgment (assuming the UCC statute of limitations hasn't run out) but enforcing it (that is, actually collecting the money) may be tricky.

That said, it's very possible that BRJ would be unable or unwilling to contest the lawsuit, so you might get a default judgment for the cost of a court filing fee.

Of course, I'm not admitted in California, which is where all of Bernie's USA-based assets likely lie, so there may be wrinkles there I don't know about. Certainly, California has very strong consumer protection laws, but that may not apply here since these are probably sale-of-goods contracts involving a merchant which typically falls under the UCC.


----------



## holum84

Gearhounds bought all of Bernie Rico's works in progress an is going to finish them with the help of some of Bernie's old employees. They will announce an reopen in May.


----------



## JerichoCheng

holum84 said:


> Gearhounds bought all of Bernie Rico's works in progress an is going to finish them with the help of some of Bernie's old employees. They will announce an reopen in May.



really!?
any source of reference?


----------



## SpaceDock

Uh, what?!


----------



## holum84

I may have just said something no one was suppose to know yet....


----------



## SpaceDock

I won't believe shit from the BRJ camp until my guitar is in my hands.


----------



## holum84

I saw it with my own eyes at Gearhounds head quarters in murrieta/wildomar. 150 or so 3/4 finished brj's an dude gave me the scoop


----------



## holum84

Just wait an see


----------



## Matt_D_

So, a for profit company bought the inventory (of 150+ guitars) and will finish them, at their cost? That's highly unlikely.

If they have purchased (or were given as payment of debt) the inventory. Its far more likely that they will simply sell them in an attempt to re-coupe money. IANAL so cant comment on whether any external party who takes over the inventory will legally have to honor any contractual agreements. 

If I was part of this run, I'd take the above with a few billion metric tonnes of salt.


----------



## sehnomatic

Well this sure is going to get interesting if gearhounds makes a statement. There are going to be several complications with people calling in and saying "hey, that's my guitar!." If this really is true, they better prepare for an onslaught of questions.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I've already contacted them


----------



## downburst82

they _have_ had a couple of "newish" Rico's for sale lately?

Man if its true and they start finishing and selling guitars that were meant for other customers that Bernie screwed over the shitstorm will be MASSIVE!!


----------



## Matt_D_

It is possible they think they can procure, and finish the guitars for less money than the remaining inventory would bring in, in terms of people fixing up the remaining balance of their order, or outright selling them if people pull out and forfeit their deposit. Assuming of course they bother to honour the contracts they bought.

If they bought them. At all. Which they may not have, and there's been conflicting reports on the state of the remaining inventory, and BRJ's continually awful record keeping and inventory tracking. Billion... Metric... Tonnes... Of... Salt.

I was [] to pulling the trigger on a guitar in the BF run, but didnt thinking that Id be out in the cold if the shit hit the fan, residing in Australia. Watching this trainwreck has broken my heart. Please, In the event that this gearhound thing is true, _ please talk to a lawyer regarding where you stand with your contractual obligations and what their contractual obligations are to you_. In the event that this thing doesn't happen, previous posters have outlined possible avenues of legal investigation and ensuring that you are part of any bankruptcy action.

So yes, good luck folks. I'll GTFO back out of this thread. I hope we never see anything like this ever again.


----------



## SpaceDock

holum84 said:


> Gearhounds bought all of Bernie Rico's works in progress an is going to finish them with the help of some of Bernie's old employees. They will announce an reopen in May.



Talked to gearhounds.

They said Bernie is still down, they are not buying BRJ and Bernie is not selling, BRJ is just temporarily down or so BRJ claims. As for now, BRJ claims to still be an entity with no plan of shutting down or calling it quits. 

Gearhounds just has a lot of old BRJ stock, platinum series, old bc rich stock, and some non-customer unfinished stock they bought before the shit circus. 

So, essentially nothing changes for us and their isn't any great conspiracy, just Bernie still being Bernie.


----------



## xCaptainx

Haven't checked this thread in ages, but sad to see it's still filled with false hope and low post count members spreading insane rumours to fuel desperate victims.


----------



## holum84

xCaptainx said:


> Haven't checked this thread in ages, but sad to see it's still filled with false hope and low post count members spreading insane rumours to fuel desperate victims.



I wasn't trying to spread rumors. I was spreading info I was told an was trying to help. Sorry if I came off wrong. Low post count=having a life.


----------



## Diggi

Well, after a long wait and many, many back and forth messages, etc... I got my guitar...

Unfinished. 

I got it on Monday, in a very nice box, wrapped in bubble wrap... with someone's pickups... it has my name on the box, but it was opened the pick ups are shuffled around. 

I asked for them to send it to me this way if they had to, months and months ago. There is no hardware, even though I asked this to be included. 

In the end, I got an unfinished (nothing installed, etc), but I got it. 

I'll buy all the hardware and have my local luthier do the work. 

It's a damn shame, but I got it. 

Pics are on my phone, but some of you have seen it in older posts. 

Wishing everyone some success in this endless struggle.


----------



## Diggi

NOTE:

I BEGGED BRJ and his Wife for my guitar. That is how I got it. I BEGGED, offered money to help the company, offered to help manage people's guitar builds, you name it.

After MONTHS I got (this thing) because I never let up. 

Keep calling, emailing, whatever ...gents/


----------



## hardvalve

What a bloody mess.


----------



## Pascal-Darrell

Diggi said:


> NOTE:
> 
> I BEGGED BRJ and his Wife for my guitar. That is how I got it. I BEGGED, offered money to help the company, offered to help manage people's guitar builds, you name it.
> 
> After MONTHS I got (this thing) because I never let up.
> 
> Keep calling, emailing, whatever ...gents/



Could you tell us what email address you used ? Thanks


----------



## Diggi

I called and text'd like most.


----------



## Khoi

I'll be in California this week, hoping to at least do something with this whole BRJ situation. Who knows, maybe I can pick up other member's guitars at the same time. Hoping to be able to communicate to them somehow.


----------



## mikernaut

One shouldn't have to beg for what is owed to them. Terry should have made another reply on Bernie's facebook if they think that he can return and eventually continue. Communication =fail. Douchebaggery continues to pile up. He's blown his trust ages ago.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ agreed! She had the chance to at least throw us a bone and she decided to ditch. Shame on her too.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Begging to receive what you paid for? What kind of bullshit is this?


----------



## mikernaut

I don't mean to take it out on Diggi, In the end it's great that he got his guitar, that's more then most of us have. It just shouldn't have to go down like it has. If there's no communication, then obviously why should we show any sympathy towards the BRJ camp? Although karma is probably not in Bernie's corner if he get's back to work after all this. ( pc version of my thoughts)


----------



## kmanick

I'm sure at this point Terry is just doing exactly what their legal counsel is telling them to do.
what a shame this had to go down this way. I was playing my Hesperian all day yesterday (not to rub salt in the wounds, not my intention at all) and I am still constantly impressed with it.
Bernie could have had so many happy customers. 
what a train wreck


----------



## esp_eraser

Everytime I click in here, im hoping to read theres been a dramatic turn of good fortune, and that people will recieve partly finished guitars or some money back. But never does :-(

I hope everything works out for you guys, its been terrible reading his thread.


----------



## SpaceDock

Although gearhounds/pimpmyguitars(eBay) claims he was not selling customer guitars, I'd keep a close eye. Some of them look a bit familiar. 

Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Jekyll 727 Fr QM Electric Guitar Trans Black | eBay


----------



## Rap Hat

SpaceDock said:


> Although gearhounds/pimpmyguitars(eBay) claims he was not selling customer guitars, I'd keep a close eye. Some of them look a bit familiar.
> 
> Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Jekyll 727 Fr QM Electric Guitar Trans Black | eBay



This is what worries me most. I really can't see a company buying up the Rico stock and then finishing them for free out of the goodness of their hearts. What I could see is them selling the guitars on eBay or something to recoup their cost.

It's a total non-surprise though that Bernie is keeping BRJ "going". I've never heard him truly apologize for the ....ups, it was always customers' or suppliers faults that things weren't getting done. And when he did say "sorry", there was always a caveat. Dude's ego is huge, and he'd rather have the BRJ name than a positive reputation.

E: I do have to "commend" Bernie for his communications; mostly phone and texts, so no records of his promises, contracts, deals, etc. It was a wake-up call for me, and I've gotten in the habit of doing all my business over email or letters. If someone doesn't want to put something in writing I know something is up.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Shit that guitar on Ebay went for $1999! Lucky bidder. This never seems to end and just continues to get stranger (and no less frustrating). And apparently some people have nothing better to do but troll through posts from months ago just to bitch or be negative. Meatbiscuits do exist.

Diggi I'm glad you actually got something in return. I'd accept the same at this point if it can be finished and doesn't have major flaws. I haven't contacted Bernie in a long while. If money wasn't already spent there'd be no motivation to.


----------



## Khoi

here's a sad bump


----------



## spawnsc

I still send text to bernie asking for my parts or what ever completion is done to my guitar, but i know his not even started on it. I hope this man gets jail time for what his done to all of us. So has anyone heard or know what Bernie is doing? he homeless, on drugs, or just hiding out somewhere?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ the Gearhounds dude told me he was hiding out "this is a guy who knows how not to be found" is what he said. If I saw him I'd punch out his balls.


----------



## MetalThrasher

I hate to bump this but guess I'm out of the total money I spent on my Vixen. This is a really crappy situation for all of us who donated money. I don't ever wish anyone bad things to come but this whole ordeal makes me think twice.


----------



## Churchie777

Sorry if this an unnecessary bump are people hearing from Bernie? I'm seeing him on Facebook chat on mobile obviously could be his mrs etc but its a sign of life


----------



## SpaceDock

^ thanks for the heads up.....I noticed gear hounds really has a lot of his stock as of last night.

I wish he would just do something. It's been almost a year since he went dark.


----------



## downburst82

Churchie777 said:


> Sorry if this an unnecessary bump are people hearing from Bernie? I'm seeing him on Facebook chat on mobile obviously could be his mrs etc but its a sign of life



Noticed today that it seems like the Bernie Rico Jr guitars facebook page is now totally gone. (his personal account to I think?)

Just one more sign that its done and he is trying to disappear it looks like


----------



## thepylestory

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ge...n/274424-tmg-guitars-new-brj.html#post4091469

I wonder if TMG have any ties to Bernie?


----------



## Tesla

thepylestory said:


> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ge...n/274424-tmg-guitars-new-brj.html#post4091469
> 
> I wonder if TMG have any ties to Bernie?



I doubt it... That just sounds like another luthier making a mess.


----------



## xCaptainx

downburst82 said:


> Noticed today that it seems like the Bernie Rico Jr guitars facebook page is now totally gone. (his personal account to I think?)
> 
> Just one more sign that its done and he is trying to disappear it looks like



Wow, that sucks. Even their attempt back in September to reach out via Facebook was a farce, your typical engagement is only about 10% of your audience, so 90% of people who liked their page would not have seen their weak attempt at contact. 

What an absolute mess. I'm so sorry to everyone that has lost $ to this guy.


----------



## Red&Die

Okay, I saw the Pimpmyguitars Ebay still selling some brand new BRJ guitars.

Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Hesperian 728 QM Electric Guitar Trans Carmel | eBay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bernie-Rico...r-/271545586032?pt=Guitar&hash=item3f3960d170

I sent the message thru e-bay to asked them see if they have any other new BRJ guitars coming for sale&#8230;here is the reply from the seller&#8230;

"Hello,

Thanks for your inquiry,

We may have a couple of others please let us know what you are interested in"

Seems Bernie might still in somewhere and try to sell his stock/finished guitars for cash out, I paid two guitars deposit for custom order to Bernie, $1500 each, total $3000 in 2012. If he is not going to make any custom guitar from now, and no cash for the payment return. At least he should give us the finished guitar as a credit to complete the deal.


----------



## flint757

He's already committed a crime that he isn't going to pay for so why would he honestly. Ethically he should, but he's hardly shown himself to be an ethical person up to this point.


----------



## SpaceDock

Red&Die said:


> Okay, I saw the Pimpmyguitars Ebay still selling some brand new BRJ guitars.
> 
> Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Hesperian 728 QM Electric Guitar Trans Carmel | eBay
> 
> Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA "Iron Cross" Custom Double Cut Away Acoutic Guitar | eBay
> 
> I sent the message thru e-bay to asked them see if they have any other new BRJ guitars coming for salehere is the reply from the seller
> 
> "Hello,
> 
> Thanks for your inquiry,
> 
> We may have a couple of others please let us know what you are interested in"
> 
> Seems Bernie might still in somewhere and try to sell his stock/finished guitars for cash out, I paid two guitars deposit for custom order to Bernie, $1500 each, total $3000 in 2012. If he is not going to make any custom guitar from now, and no cash for the payment return. At least he should give us the finished guitar as a credit to complete the deal.



I had talked to these guys on the phone, they bought a ton of unfinished Rico stock that they are finishing. He claimed mine was not in the pile, but who knows really.


----------



## ramses

SpaceDock said:


> I had talked to these guys on the phone, they bought a ton of unfinished Rico stock that they are finishing. He claimed mine was not in the pile, but who knows really.



How can you buy stuff that belongs to someone else? Are those guys aware of why that stock is unfinished?


----------



## Red&Die

So those guys on e-bay selling the non 100% Bernie's custom made guitar, final finished by 3rd party factory? That sounds really bad...


----------



## SpaceDock

Supposedly the stock was not customer owned and Bernie thinks he will one day finish the others, yeah ....ing right.

The shop owner said they are being finished by the same folks that used to work with Bernie since they had stake as well. 

I'll just emphasize that this is just what the dude told me. For all I know these were opened by folks and Bernie is finishing the guitars while setting up his next no-tell motel visit with Jim from S7.


----------



## SpaceDock

Oops ipad glitch induced double post...


----------



## Rap Hat

SpaceDock said:


> I had talked to these guys on the phone, they bought a ton of unfinished Rico stock that they are finishing. He claimed mine was not in the pile, but who knows really.



So some random company can buy unfinished Rico stock, but Bernie wouldn't send out my guitar as-is... Confirming yet again that if you paid in full, he has no interest in giving you your guitar.


----------



## leonardo7

Red&Die said:


> Bernie Rico Jr Guitars USA Hesperian 728 QM Electric Guitar Trans Carmel | eBay



Oh look, they named the guitar after a coastal city in California


----------



## Tesla

leonardo7 said:


> Oh look, they named the guitar after a coastal city in California



Hasn't it always been..?


----------



## leonardo7

Tesla said:


> Hasn't it always been..?



Carmel doesn't mean Caramel. They have two distinctly different meanings. One is the name of a place and the other is a referenece to a candy and a color


----------



## UnderTheSign

According to the guys at BCR Junkies (where some seem to know Bernie personally) Bernie still has 'medical' issues but they refuse to discuss the matter any further and allow no 'bad talking' him.


----------



## Tesla

leonardo7 said:


> Carmel doesn't mean Caramel. They have two distinctly different meanings. One is the name of a place and the other is a referenece to a candy and a color



Ahh right! I thought you were referring to Hesperia (I'm in Scotland, don't have that much knowledge of Californian cities/towns).


----------



## SpaceDock

UnderTheSign said:


> According to the guys at BCR Junkies (where some seem to know Bernie personally) Bernie still has 'medical' issues but they refuse to discuss the matter any further and allow no 'bad talking' him.



Medical issues or not, he should give people their guitars. 

I remember the Chris G character talking about how Bernie wanted to charge people extra since his costs had gone up, even if they had paid in full. I think this guy was horrible at business and blamed everyone but himself for not being able to deliver. 

I still don't get why his wife reached out and then never followed up. Them saying "oh, yeah, we ....ed up and are bankrupt now" would have been a step in the right direction. Leaving us in the dark just twisted the knife.


----------



## abandonist

Not for nothing, but when my business went under I had a lot of debt that was never paid, and that I won't pay. I have nothing to give. At this point in the debacle, I'd recommend you all just forget about it and chalk it up to a bad situation. You're not going to get the guitars. Sometimes things go very wrong and, while terrible, there's nothing you can do about it. It came down to losing my house and everything I own, or not paying back loans. I'll always choose the latter. Call me a bad person, but I'd challenge you to be in the same scenario and not save yourself. 

Just my .02.


----------



## Hollowway

Well, I have one guitar that is almost complete, and I've only paid the deposit on it. I'd asly give him more money just to ship it to me. Sort of like pro-rate where it is and then give him that. It's not doing either side any good as it is. But my guess is that no one really knows the situation with all of the guitars, and until he's back at it there's no chance of rectifying situations like this.


----------



## crg123

SpaceDock said:


> Supposedly the stock was not customer owned and Bernie thinks he will one day finish the others, yeah ....ing right.
> 
> The shop owner said they are being finished by the same folks that used to work with Bernie since they had stake as well.
> 
> I'll just emphasize that this is just what the dude told me.




:/ I find it a little annoying they don't list this on their ad, for full disclosure, that these aren't really 100% BRJ's in that case. I know I was under the impression those guitars were finished before his breakdown and I'm sure others will too. Its a sad thing really, the whole situation. I love my friends BRJ 8 he got about 3 years back.

I do think its funny he used my picture on his website when he updated it after his disappearance: 

http://www.ricojrguitars.com/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/6982857698/in/set-72157629934330579


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I just wanted to share this with you guys. A friend of mine on FB sent me this.

Bernie Rico Jr USA Double Cut Away Iron Cross Acoustic

I'm pretty sure that's *NOT* the acoustic I remember that he completed and sold before everything went to wild hell. I find it disturbing that there seems to be a slow trickle of completed "new" BRJs coming out every once in a while, and that Bernie has still not surfaced to clean up any of the mess that he created. Disturbing, indeed.


----------



## Hollowway

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I just wanted to share this with you guys. A friend of mine on FB sent me this.
> 
> Bernie Rico Jr USA Double Cut Away Iron Cross Acoustic
> 
> I'm pretty sure that's *NOT* the acoustic I remember that he completed and sold before everything went to wild hell. I find it disturbing that there seems to be a slow trickle of completed "new" BRJs coming out every once in a while, and that Bernie has still not surfaced to clean up any of the mess that he created. Disturbing, indeed.



Anyone down in that area that can check it out?


----------



## SpaceDock

The guy made an entire career out of building guitars, that is his life and the life of his family for generations. We can't expect him to never work on guitars again. 

I fully expect Rico to finish the stuff he has and sell it, you think he'll go be a greeter at WalMart? What else would he ever do?

I don't think it is right for him to leave everyone high and dry, but dudes got a house full of guitars and that is the only way he knows how to make money. Maybe someday he will make things right, but he will most likely wait out statute of limitations then try again.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Actually, dude, Bernie Rico Sr. made a career out of building guitars. Jr. just jumped on the truck as it was heading down the interstate and was barely lucky to keep it running for the period that he did.

What else would he ever do? If he had half an ounce of decency he would give people the instruments that are due to them. Keep in mind we at one point figured out he probably stole around $200k, remember? It is pretty much full simple Jack that the dude is not in prison.


----------



## MetalDaze

I just want my guitar


----------



## SpaceDock

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Actually, dude, Bernie Rico Sr. made a career out of building guitars. Jr. just jumped on the truck as it was heading down the interstate and was barely lucky to keep it running for the period that he did.
> 
> What else would he ever do? If he had half an ounce of decency he would give people the instruments that are due to them. Keep in mind we at one point figured out he probably stole around $200k, remember? It is pretty much full simple Jack that the dude is not in prison.



no need to cop an attitude with me. I lost out hard on this deal too so don't feel like I don't understand the situation.

People's businesses flop all the time and screw over their customers/investors. If you want him in jail, make your case in court, don't throw shit at me. 

He is a normal person who tried and failed. Should a construction company owner go to jail when they go bankrupt? Should they finish all of the buildings at no charge, get real. He ....ed up, we ducked up by trusting him too much, he doesn't know what else to do with his life. He is a normal person.


----------



## xzyryabx

SpaceDock said:


> Should a construction company owner go to jail when they go bankrupt?



actually in many countries they do, and depending on the circumstances I'm all for that....the system in this country of ours is a bit different, for better or worse.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

SpaceDock said:


> no need to cop an attitude with me. I lost out hard on this deal too so don't feel like I don't understand the situation.
> 
> People's businesses flop all the time and screw over their customers/investors. If you want him in jail, make your case in court, don't throw shit at me.
> 
> He is a normal person who tried and failed. Should a construction company owner go to jail when they go bankrupt? Should they finish all of the buildings at no charge, get real. He ....ed up, we ducked up by trusting him too much, he doesn't know what else to do with his life. He is a normal person.



The issue here is that you're painting a picture that poor little Bernie suffered some sudden problem that just caused his business to up and go bankrupt, when nothing could be further from the truth.

Sensing a lack of serious profits, Bernie Rico Jr. threw a hail Mary and offered the people of ss.org a great deal on limited spec guitars called "the Black Friday Deal". He then pretty much immediately took far more orders then he could ever possibly fulfill, not revealing that to the initial few people that took orders. After that, he began allowing people to ask for any type of specs on the guitars that they could name and allowed people to continually change specs to higher grade materials provided they would give him more money up front. 

He then continued taking custom orders and in many times large payments from individuals when he knew many of the instruments, if any, would never be completed. He requested people pay in full for guitars that he claimed were ready and then never shipped them. He threw multiple sales that were aimed at targeting people who wanted "fast track" guitars that were "nearly completed" and never delivered on most of them.

Meanwhile, the entire time he did this he also fleeced his customers into believing he was doing the lion's share of the work on their guitars when in fact he was barely even touching them, many times having assistants do final setups on guitars that were being shipped (the few that were).

So yeah, when you write that we shouldn't expect he never build guitars again, I will look at my computer screen like I'm staring at a little, green martian. He systematically manipulated, conned, and screwed nearly every customer that came after the black friday event, and then conveniently went crazy after he couldn't possibly recover, making him ineligible to appear in court under Californian state law. Brilliant and evil.

If anybody in this thread, at this point, can't see that it was deliberate, they are riding the Dumbass train express to Dipshit-ville.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I've been here all along! I bought my slot day one.

Doesn't change what is happening now. Anyone who wanted to challenge 
Bernie in court could have. You want to talk hard and rant about it, do it in court. 

I am just saying that it comes as no surprise that he is still building and won't stop because we don't like it.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Actually - no. They couldn't challenge him in court. He declared himself mentally ill and was institutionalized. It would be damn near impossible to get him into court and win anything at all.


----------



## SpaceDock

The problem is that he goes bankrupt and there is nothing to claim.

I don't get why you are acting like I am defending him. I CALLED THE COPS ON BERNIE more than ago when I was in credit dispute with him. 

I want you to understand that he will move on with his life and has. If you think he will crawl under a rock and die then you are dim. He builds guitars, he gets in trouble, rinse repeat, he doesn't care. I don't think it's right, ok, tolerable, or reputable but IT IS FACT! 

You have a beef with him, good luck. I know it sucks, I tried.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I don't expect him to crawl under a rock and die. But I do expect that whenever he crawls out from under the rock where he is hiding that there will be a ton of people to pile shit on him so that he will be, at the very least, socially accountable for what he did to people.

As far as personal business goes, I'm one of the few that got a guitar. But I swear to God if I hear for sure he's building guitars again and selling them for profit, I will, at the very least, start up a social media organization calling out how many people he screwed while he continues to make money off of more poor schmucks who get in with him.


----------



## SpaceDock

Well, you might as well get on that.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Actually, dude, Bernie Rico Sr. made a career out of building guitars. Jr. just jumped on the truck as it was heading down the interstate and was barely lucky to keep it running for the period that he did.
> 
> What else would he ever do? If he had half an ounce of decency he would give people the instruments that are due to them. Keep in mind we at one point figured out he probably stole around $200k, remember? It is pretty much full simple Jack that the dude is not in prison.


While he didn't mess up like Jr did, Sr wasn't exactly an angel either. Made a carreer having others build for him (and then stole their designs/whatnot), more like it.


----------



## MetalDaze

If and when he does surface, I do believe that it is our responsibility to remind the world of what transpired here.

No informed future customer would trust him, if they knew how many were left in the cold. We just need to make sure they are informed and that this doesn't fade away.

Of course, I'd be willing to forgive and forget if my situation was made right.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

I just needed to come back in here with an update.

I didn't get into electronics within guitars until pretty recently. I've been focused more on recording tech and mixing for a while. Recently I decided that Painkillers weren't for me, and I'm changing them out for Holy Divers - the guitar has a lot of upper mid bite and the top end is so stark with the Painkillers the guitar always sounds totally *in your face*. Would be perfect for TDM or some more extreme styles, but I play mostly progressive hard rock and want a more evened out sound.

So what does this have to do with BRJ? Well, I started to really have a good hard look at my electronics, and I realized... because of how my control cavity was routed, there was no room to fit in a 500k pot on the tone knob. So Bernie, instead of routing and creating extra room, just put a 250k pot on there and called it good... further, he put like $0.99 pots on my guitar... A nice three-way switch, mind you. And the soldering is good and clean. But WTF on those pots?! HAHAHA! So I'l be unsoldering the tone knob (as I don't use it anyway) and I'll be putting in a new BKP 550k pot in the volume position when the stuff arrives tomorrow afternoon. It blows my mind that somebody would cut such a weird corner or not communicate an issue on a build like that (but what else could one expect?).

The thing is, my guitar is actually very nice. Whoever was doing the work on it used excellent tone woods, excellent ebony for the fretboard, used a fantastic quilt and did an immaculate job on the stain. The finish is really good. The headstock has a gorgeous abalone inlay that was set wonderfully. The fretwork is fantastic, I have had the guitar set up once since owning it and will only now, nearly 2.5 years later, have it set up again (when I get the electronics re-wired by my luthier) - pretty much a super solid instrument.

And then Bernie cut the weirdest possible corner and installed shitty, mismatched electronics into a custom instrument containing boutique pickups. I just wanted to let everybody here know so that if they've never had a gander at their electronics cavity, but have felt like MAYBE the sound wasn't quite up to snuff, it might be time to go over that particular feature with a really close eye.


----------



## mikernaut

Sounds about right. I had a simular experience on mine when I decided to try Juggernauts instead of the installed Aftermaths. Opened up the electronics cavity and right away saw that under all the pots were drilled/routed some crude potholes because he didn't judge the distance/shaft pot length properly when routing the whole cavity. 

Then I saw what made me facepalm even harder. The input jacket wasn't lined up with the electronics cavity. So once again he made some totally ugly routing into the side of the wall to fit the input jack in. How in the hell do you not line that up when making the hole in the 1st place?

Surprise 3, The routing was too close around the pickup cavity ( direct mounted pups) to get the new BKP Juggernauts to fit in. So what he did was cut off some of the original mounting tabs, bend them inward some, cram them in, and re-drill new mounting holes for the screws. Thus making any new pups impossible to mount in with out some guitar surgery.

I gave up trying to get the new pups in myself and sent the guitar to Nick at the Axe Palace and even he said it was a total nightmare getting the new pups installed.


----------



## Renkenstein

I was holding off on posting in here until I read the entire thread, and then waited until I saw someone had posted for the day, so as not to cause false hope in those still holding on.

I read every single post of this thread, and I think every aspiring luthier should. It's obvious this guy hasn't appreciated the legacy that was handed down to him for a long time. His work ethic was horrible, and his respect for his customers was just not there.

I've never even touched a BRJ guitar, but I did see a few of Gary Holt's up close around 2007-08. I was impressed with the quality of the instrument, and the attention to detail(it was in a dark club, so who knows what I really saw). They had scalloped ebony fretboards, and I thought that alone was flippin wicked.

Anyway, you could tell that Mr JR once loved what he did. It's no wonder so many jumped at the opportunity to own one(or a few, in some cases). I felt all your pain when I would see the hope being kindled, only to have it snuffed several pages later. 

So I've learned a lot from this. Build within your own limits. Resist the temptation to take on too much. Treat clients with respect and honesty. Don't sell yourself short. He quite literally underbid himself out of business. A mass order like that may seem like a lot of money up front, but what is the labor investment on the back end? A rhetorical question, because we all know the answer. 

My best to all those burned by this scoundrel.


----------



## VanDewart Guitars

Renkenstein said:


> ...
> I read every single post of this thread, and I think every aspiring luthier should. ...
> So I've learned a lot from this. Build within your own limits. Resist the temptation to take on too much. Treat clients with respect and honesty. Don't sell yourself short. He quite literally underbid himself out of business. A mass order like that may seem like a lot of money up front, but what is the labor investment on the back end? A rhetorical question, because we all know the answer...



This. Reading about BRJ, Rotor, Invictus, Acacia, et. al. should be mandatory at all luthier schools. These flops have taught me more about (not) running a business properly than any class ever could. 

Bernie and the above have no doubt screwed over countless customers, but something that hits closer to home with me (and I'm sure many others) is the damage they did to small luthiers trying to start out. There is an air of caution and even disdain that is present to myself and other legitimate builders trying to start up/build a business in this field, and I blame the dickhead scam artists that called themselves custom luthiers and ended up screwing people over. I absolutely think that research should be done before shelling out multiple thousands on a custom guitar. I absolutely think that if you have only built and sold three guitars, you shouldn't be charging multiple thousands. But I hate that it's so hard to have people give me a shot, so I can start building my portfolio and repertoire and reputation. 

In short, eff you Bernie (and others) for making my chosen career path that much more difficult to succeed in.


----------



## sunung1188

I am rushing to their site now


----------



## MetalDaze

VanDewart Guitars said:


> Bernie and the above have no doubt screwed over countless customers, but something that hits closer to home with me (and I'm sure many others) is the damage they did to small luthiers trying to start out.


 
I see your THIS with THIS 

I am so done with any guitar that doesn't have a return policy, if it isn't right. At least with production guitars, you can get another one off the line, if you get a flawed one. With customs, your best hope is a rebuild, which takes forever with the big guys and almost never happens with the small ones. 

Best of luck for all of those that choose to roll the dice, but I wasted enough money chasing the magical custom guitar  Please remind me of this post if you see me in another thread getting excited about another custom build


----------



## Andromalia

MetalDaze said:


> Please remind me of this post if you see me in another thread getting excited about another custom build



Just in case your Edit impulses took over.


----------



## Guitarist1976

mikernaut said:


> Sounds about right. I had a simular experience on mine when I decided to try Juggernauts instead of the installed Aftermaths. Opened up the electronics cavity and right away saw that under all the pots were drilled/routed some crude potholes because he didn't judge the distance/shaft pot length properly when routing the whole cavity.
> 
> Then I saw what made me facepalm even harder. The input jacket wasn't lined up with the electronics cavity. So once again he made some totally ugly routing into the side of the wall to fit the input jack in. How in the hell do you not line that up when making the hole in the 1st place?
> 
> Surprise 3, The routing was too close around the pickup cavity ( direct mounted pups) to get the new BKP Juggernauts to fit in. So what he did was cut off some of the original mounting tabs, bend them inward some, cram them in, and re-drill new mounting holes for the screws. Thus making any new pups impossible to mount in with out some guitar surgery.
> 
> I gave up trying to get the new pups in myself and sent the guitar to Nick at the Axe Palace and even he said it was a total nightmare getting the new pups installed.






I received a custom Diva in November of 2010 after months of dickerry and flaky customer service from Bernie. It sounded like utter shit. I had the pickups removed and installed bareknuckle holydivers. The guitar sounds incredible now and plays incredible. My luthier/tech went over the entire guitar and the only bad thing he had to say about the guitar was the electronic cavities looked like ass. I had him clean up the cavities from head to toe. Now the electronic cavity looks perfect.The Diva I own is perfect and is my favorite guitar that I have ever played. I ordered a second Diva from Bernie and got screwed. I gave him an $1,100 deposit almost 3 years ago.I knew I was taking a risk because I got shit customer service the first time around. I stumbled upon this thread a year and a half ago. I wish I could hit a powerball so I could buy everyone who got screwed a custom guitar. So has anyone had success with small claims? Lawyers? Police? I haven't read all of the posts or kept up with this thread in awhile. Thanks guys


----------



## canuck brian

Guitarist1976 said:


> I received a custom Diva in November of 2010 after months of dickerry and flaky customer service from Bernie. It sounded like utter shit. I had the pickups removed and installed bareknuckle holydivers. The guitar sounds incredible now and plays incredible. My luthier/tech went over the entire guitar and the only bad thing he had to say about the guitar was the electronic cavities looked like ass. I had him clean up the cavities from head to toe. Now the electronic cavity looks perfect.The Diva I own is perfect and is my favorite guitar that I have ever played. I ordered a second Diva from Bernie and got screwed. I gave him an $1,100 deposit almost 3 years ago.I knew I was taking a risk because I got shit customer service the first time around. I stumbled upon this thread a year and a half ago. I wish I could hit a powerball so I could buy everyone who got screwed a custom guitar. So has anyone had success with small claims? Lawyers? Police? I haven't read all of the posts or kept up with this thread in awhile. Thanks guys



Bernie went batshit crazy, lost the shop after it had the electricity turned off (california heat + california humidity = dead guitars), dropped off the face of the planet, shut down the website and the facebook page. He's gone dude. People could band together and attempt to sue him, but they haven't. They probably wouldn't get anything anyways as he's probably flat broke. 

The Black Friday run was a complete sham. If he had any intent of actually delivering the amount of guitars that he had taken orders for in the time completed, he was clearly completely insane with no concept of time.

I'm in the process of slowly bringing one that was halfway thru completion to being a good guitar, but there is LOT of work that needed to be undone and cleaned up.


----------



## Guitarist1976

canuck brian said:


> Bernie went batshit crazy, lost the shop after it had the electricity turned off (california heat + california humidity = dead guitars), dropped off the face of the planet, shut down the website and the facebook page. He's gone dude. People could band together and attempt to sue him, but they haven't. They probably wouldn't get anything anyways as he's probably flat broke.
> 
> The Black Friday run was a complete sham. If he had any intent of actually delivering the amount of guitars that he had taken orders for in the time completed, he was clearly completely insane with no concept of time.
> 
> I'm in the process of slowly bringing one that was halfway thru completion to being a good guitar, but there is LOT of work that needed to be undone and cleaned up.





I pretty much accepted the fact that I got screwed a few weeks after I found out. Oh well - life goes on. Somewhere in Mexico there are some amazing luthiers. Bernie never made the guitars. He installed the hardware and did the set up. All of his guitars were made by Mexican luthiers across the border. Bernie being a luthier was another bullshit lie. He couldn't even set the guitars up the right way or wire them correctly. He is an utter failure. Thank god for the Jackson custom shop.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Another twist in this debacle: https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany


----------



## TheStig1214

MaxOfMetal said:


> Another twist in this debacle: https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany



Wait, they are selling new BRJ guitars? 

Are they just copying the old style guitars (somehow involving the previously mentioned mexi luthiers) or were those projects people payed for and never got finished until now?


----------



## JSanta

TheStig1214 said:


> Wait, they are selling new BRJ guitars?
> 
> Are they just copying the old style guitars (somehow involving the previously mentioned mexi luthiers) or were those projects people payed for and never got finished until now?



Posted right on the page:

Here at The SoCal Guitar Company we are proud to have Bernie Rico Jr. the son of legendary luthier, Bernie Rico Sr., founder of B.C. RICH guitars! 
B.C. Rich Beginnings


----------



## TheStig1214

JSanta said:


> Posted right on the page:
> 
> Here at The SoCal Guitar Company we are proud to have Bernie Rico Jr. the son of legendary luthier, Bernie Rico Sr., founder of B.C. RICH guitars!
> B.C. Rich Beginnings



So Bernie is back then. I feel shit's about to go down.


----------



## technomancer

JSanta said:


> Posted right on the page:
> 
> Here at The SoCal Guitar Company we are proud to have Bernie Rico Jr. the son of legendary luthier, Bernie Rico Sr., founder of B.C. RICH guitars!
> B.C. Rich Beginnings



I wonder if they're using the same Mexican "woodshop" Bernie was using for base construction...


----------



## JSanta

technomancer said:


> I wonder if they're using the same Mexican "woodshop" Bernie was using for base construction...



That's what I am thinking actually. For a guy that has been out of building for a while, this store sure seems to have a plentiful stock of his guitars available for purchase. I would also guess that at least a few of these guitars were partially completed that he was able to take with him before the shop closed up.

Pretty awful for everyone involved. Just my second post in this thread, but I've read every page, and I cannot imagine the anger some of you are feeling, especially now.


----------



## geofreesun

this is very strange. in aug 2014 their facebook page posted about a purple jekyll 724 for sale at $3999. however i already bought that same exact guitar via gearhounds several months ago. looks like they are just trolling to get more clicks and likes. if you look at their in stock BRJ photos and compare with gearhounds' webpage, either they are the same company or SoCal is directly using gearhounds' photos without permission.


----------



## Samark

Just saw this. If you look at the photos, nearly every single BRJ photo says Sold to one lucky SoCal Guitar Company customer!

Fishing more more orders to run away with, perhaps?


----------



## JD27

geofreesun said:


> this is very strange. in aug 2014 their facebook page posted about a purple jekyll 724 for sale at $3999. however i already bought that same exact guitar via gearhounds several months ago. looks like they are just trolling to get more clicks and likes. if you look at their in stock BRJ photos and compare with gearhounds' webpage, either they are the same company or SoCal is directly using gearhounds' photos without permission.



SoCal and Gearhounds are the same. It's the same location, same scam, different name.

https://www.facebook.com/gearhounds

36625 Kevin Rd Suite 152, Wildomar, California

https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany?ref=br_tf

36625 Kevin Rd Suite 152, Wildomar, California


----------



## Blood Tempest

Someone local to the area should stop by and pay a friendly visit.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

JD27 said:


> SoCal and Gearhounds are the same. It's the same location, same scam, different name.
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/gearhounds
> 
> 36625 Kevin Rd Suite 152, Wildomar, California
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany?ref=br_tf
> 
> 36625 Kevin Rd Suite 152, Wildomar, California



Jesus Christ, .... both of them. 
Can't believe I supported Gearhounds as much as I did.


----------



## SpaceDock

Speculum Speculorum said:


> I don't expect him to crawl under a rock and die. But I do expect that whenever he crawls out from under the rock where he is hiding that there will be a ton of people to pile shit on him so that he will be, at the very least, socially accountable for what he did to people.
> 
> As far as personal business goes, I'm one of the few that got a guitar. But I swear to God if I hear for sure he's building guitars again and selling them for profit, I will, at the very least, start up a social media organization calling out how many people he screwed while he continues to make money off of more poor schmucks who get in with him.



So..uh....you doing this or what?


----------



## canuck brian

SpaceDock said:


> So..uh....you doing this or what?



I already bombed their site on Facebook with a bunch of stuff. Someone else linked the thread here to their page.


----------



## SpaceDock

Yeah, I will be calling them later. I had talked to the guy from GearHounds over the summer. He said they were finishing guits they bought from Bernie, but claimed none were mine. I will be watching.


----------



## Rev2010

I think their page needs more one star reviews from others that have been ripped off in this thread. So I'm guessing no one ever tried to sue or file fraud claims against him if he's back in action trying to rip off musicians again. Seriously, he should be in jail by now for fraud.


Rev.


----------



## ihunda

^ What, they are openly advertising they hired the "Bernie Rico Jr." from the blackfridaygate?

Wow, just wow!


----------



## SpaceDock

Maybe someone can pm me the SoCal phone number if they know it. I sent a colorful email, but would like to be more personal.


----------



## JD27

SpaceDock said:


> Maybe someone can pm me the SoCal phone number if they know it. I sent a colorful email, but would like to be more personal.



It's the same as Gearhounds, but what makes you think they will answer? They never answer the phone!


----------



## SpaceDock

They talked with me in March. I think someone should go there. I would if I wasn't in colorado. 

I am going to the police about this since they have a new business and Bernie is officially mentioned.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

Damn this is really happening? Did he (they) think this would all just go away? This is stupidity and ignorance on a whole new level. I'm not shitting on a guy getting healthy and back to work, but agenda #1 should be to fix all of the orders still due. Not a note, a mention, and plan. Nothing. It's like everyone here, and anyone else out there, don't exist and just let go of $600, $900, $2,000, or $10,000 in deposits and full payments. He sure is shitting on all of us. AGAIN.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

SpaceDock said:


> They talked with me in March. I think someone should go there. I would if I wasn't in colorado.



To my knowledge, they won't even answer their phone for the guys at Randall Amps.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> To my knowledge, they won't even answer their phone for the guys at Randall Amps.


 
Damn. Like peas in a pod.


----------



## MJS

SpaceDock said:


> I am going to the police about this since they have a new business and Bernie is officially mentioned.



Why would the police care? It's not illegal to have a job. 

It stinks that all this stuff happened, but did even a single person bother taking him to court? If he hasn't been defeated in a courtroom, then disobeyed whatever was ordered by the court, he's not exactly a fugitive on the run. 

I'd also guess that if people start confronting him at his work place, there's a better chance of them getting arrested than him.


----------



## pushpull7

Now, I've been here at SS for a while, and I've heard a bunch of stuff over this "guitar brand" and all that goes with it.

I'll be damned if I can make heads or tails of it other than I know I'll never even think about getting one.


----------



## atrfan1

I had no connection to any BRJ guitars until I got offered one by Gearhounds. They had seriously screwed up a big order from me, and offered to just cancel it and sell me a 6 string vixen for a really low price. Always loved the vixen shape, so I took the offer.

It was a cool guitar, but really wasn't good enough to make up for the 2 grand and 2 guitars I originally ordered. I sent it back, and gave them the benefit of the doubt. They offered me first pick out of the Ricos they had, and when I heard they had a 7 string Vixen I jumped on it. Been GASing for one since I first starting playing.

A month and a half after that phone call, I shipped out to US Army basic training. Still no guitar, just a lot of reassurances over the phone. Wasn't too happy, but I figured that I wasn't going to be playing it for a while anyways so I would just wait until I got finished with training.

Another month later, I was medically discharged due to an accident that nearly killed me. Still no guitar, and they didn't want to give me a refund. Fortunately, after a few weeks and some seriously angry phone calls, I got my refund.

Now, bear in mind that this all started Dec 2013. If you look on the Social Guitar Company facebook page, you can scroll down and see a 7 string vixen for sale dated August. It literally took them 8 months to get that guitar up for sale, and they were telling me it would be a couple weeks the whole time. And they were entirely aware of my situation with the military. I just don't understand how you can lie to someone like that.


----------



## SpaceDock

MJS said:


> Why would the police care? It's not illegal to have a job.
> 
> It stinks that all this stuff happened, but did even a single person bother taking him to court? If he hasn't been defeated in a courtroom, then disobeyed whatever was ordered by the court, he's not exactly a fugitive on the run.
> 
> I'd also guess that if people start confronting him at his work place, there's a better chance of them getting arrested than him.



When I called the cops, for theft, fraud, failure to deliver goods; hesperia pd said they weren't able to locate him. The gearhounds guys had also mentioned he was hiding out to keep people off him. If he is starting all this over again, I am going to try to get him.


----------



## canuck brian

he's starting again. Go after him if you're able to do so legally.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Alright guys, get your shit together. It's VERY rare to have this opportunity again.


----------



## aiur55

What are we doing about this? Especially those of us not in the states?


----------



## SpaceDock

^same thing. If you bought something from him and didn't receive a product or refund...call the police. Businesses and contractors pull this shit all the time. Nondelivery or work not completed are criminal offenses. 

If all of those he boned call, they will take this seriously. Just google "contractor never finished" or similar things and you will see hundreds of news article of roofers, landscapers, software developers, ect being sentenced to jail for leaving their customers high and dry. This is criminal, there is no valid reason not to take action. 

Let's not let him do this to other people, that would be the worst outcome.

Edit: your local police is where to file

Edit 2: anyone who paid money and didn't receive a guitar should shoot me a pm regardless of state or country. I made some really good progress with some authorities and would like to help anyone else with moving on.


----------



## Larrikin666

Okay. Thanks for the PM on this. I'm 100% in for whatever legal actions we decide upon here. I'm not incredibly close to that area despite living in Cali, but I'll be done there next month for Thanksgiving. Let's keep in close contact on this. James, shoot me over your email address or phone number when you have a second. I'd like to chat about what you've done so far and see what I can do to help move things along.


----------



## canuck brian

Theres some guy on there right now arguing with me saying that everyone who ordered a guitar will actually get their guitar. It's a crock, but I thought you guys might want to know.


----------



## Blood Tempest

A new Necrophagist album will be released before you guys ever receive the guitars you ordered. Take action NOW and at least get that hard earned money you spent returned to you. This is BS and awfully ballsy of him to just resurface and act like he's part of a legitimate business again.


----------



## SpaceDock

canuck brian said:


> Theres some guy on there right now arguing with me saying that everyone who ordered a guitar will actually get their guitar. It's a crock, but I thought you guys might want to know.



Well, I have yet to hear from the man himself on anything. If he wants to give me my guitar, he better get on that before the police arrive. I am pressing criminal charges for fraud and gave him warning. I have tried too many times to email, call and text. He has had his chance. I can't let him do this to anyone else.


----------



## Rev2010

canuck brian said:


> Theres some guy on there right now arguing with me saying that everyone who ordered a guitar will actually get their guitar. It's a crock, but I thought you guys might want to know.



Went and read that after you posted this. What an absolute joke. He fails to realize the point at hand is Bernie is still at it trying to make money after he's scumbagged all the people in here. So regardless of whether he's trying to get back on his feet and make things right it just looks like he's after more money. And how nasty that F'er is!!! 


Rev.


----------



## electriceye

I'm missing something here. Has ANYONE filed a legal claim against Junior? If not, why the hell not? I see everyone saying they're going to give him a piece of their mind, etc. But if there are no legal judgments against him, then you're sort of SOL.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ I have been having a bitch of a time with it. I called Hesperia, they said call local, called local they said call jurisdiction I was in when I paid, called old town PD and they have kept me in a shuffle between fraud specialists and detectives. So no official charges yet, but in the works. 

Anyone who got screwed...get on it now! This definitely takes time, but all the police I have talked to say it is a solid case of fraud and that the emails/pics of guitars with Jr are excellent evidence. It is a matter of getting everything into the correct hands. Our bureaucracy is insane!


----------



## electriceye

SpaceDock said:


> ^ I have been having a bitch of a time with it. I called Hesperia, they said call local, called local they said call jurisdiction I was in when I paid, called old town PD and they have kept me in a shuffle between fraud specialists and detectives. So no official charges yet, but in the works.
> 
> Anyone who got screwed...get on it now! This definitely takes time, but all the police I have talked to say it is a solid case of fraud and that the emails/pics of guitars with Jr are excellent evidence. It is a matter of getting everything into the correct hands. Our bureaucracy is insane!



But besides criminal charges, what about civil suits? Has no one bothered to file a claim against him?? No wonder he's able to jump right back into business. No one actually went after him for the money.


----------



## clubshred

This doesn't surprise me that a scumbag like him "magically" started working again. Unreal.


----------



## MetalThrasher

This is F ing unreal the shit he is pulling right now. I haven't been active here for a while due to fishing big tournaments all summer but I log on today and see this nonsense. SpaceDock, I will be sending you a PM shortly and thanks for your actions trying to get our guitars or money back. I am one of the many people that paid in full and didn't get crap.


----------



## MatrixClaw

Just checking in and reading some newer posts, as I often do, just to keep up with things. Can't believe this SoCal / Gearhounds crap. WTF???

How more shady can Bernie get at this point? Disgusting.

Even more interesting is that I noticed BRJ has updated their website since the last time I checked and is actually using a photo of my guitar on their website, without permission from me to use it. I'm no copyright expert, but I'm pretty sure it's illegal for them to use my photo as their own, as I can prove I was the photographer and have never released my copyright for their use. I also noticed they're actually using photos watermarked by BoogieStreet...

I think, if anything, these violations are enough to contact the website provider (GoDaddy) and have their website taken down, so that no one can contact them. I can't seem to find their Facebook anymore, or Bernie's personal one, so I'm assuming they've deleted those, as well?


----------



## Tesla

Been a bit busy lately so haven't managed to catch up on the latest. Can someone quickly fill me in on what's going on now please?


----------



## stevexc

Tesla said:


> Been a bit busy lately so haven't managed to catch up on the latest. Can someone quickly fill me in on what's going on now please?



The latest is that BRJ has resurfaced, working with a company (SoCal Guitars) that appears to be, for all intents and purposes, GearHounds with another name. He's apparently putting out new guitars with/through them without addressing the hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of undelivered goods.


----------



## Larrikin666

Since this is a niche forum, I started a group on Facebook as well. I'm going to use it to house any and all documents people want to put forward as James works with the California Attorney General. 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/794673537222033/

We need to get anyone and everyone who this affects in this group. I'm not going to tolerate people coming into the group to defend Bernie. The group isn't meant for that.


----------



## crg123

MatrixClaw said:


> Even more interesting is that I noticed BRJ has updated their website since the last time I checked and is actually using a photo of my guitar on their website, without permission from me to use it. I'm no copyright expert, but I'm pretty sure it's illegal for them to use my photo as their own, as I can prove I was the photographer and have never released my copyright for their use. I also noticed they're actually using photos watermarked by BoogieStreet...



Yea they used my photographs of my friend's guitar as well. That's the least annoying thing this guy has done though. I hope all of you can get your money back.


----------



## Khoi

haven't checked the thread in a while, but I PMed you SpaceDock and joined the Facebook group


----------



## leonardo7

Hey guys, how do we actually know that Bernie is back in business here? I believe it but before I get all excited Im curious to know where the proof is. Did he straight up make a statement or has someone said that he started a new business?


----------



## crg123

This is the source people are refering to if you're curious: https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany/info



> About
> The Socal Guitar Company is southern California new premier custom guitar shop.
> 
> Description
> Southern California is now home to one the premier diverse guitar building facilities and retail outlet "The SoCal Guitar Company." &#8220;A company that is as diverse as the California lifestyle&#8221;. *This is a joint venture which combines one of Southern California leading online and local retail dealers and Bernie Rico Jr.* This joint venture will not only enable access to some of the music industry&#8217;s best high end custom guitars but also access to some of the industries high end quality products previously provided by the parties involved. Our commitment will be to not only customer satisfaction but to respect the legacy that was built by the three generations of Rico family guitar luthier&#8217;s. Many of the archives and history of the Rico family will be on display at the Southern California location to honor the legacy of the great guitar builders which will give you the player and fans a chance to view, touch and feel not only the history, but a chance to play and see the quality of the existing and new &#8220;Bernie Rico Jr&#8221; and &#8220;The SoCal Guitar Company&#8217;s&#8221; lines coming.
> 
> LIVE LOUD AND PROUD!
> The Socal Guitar Company


----------



## leonardo7

crg123 said:


> This is the source people are refering to if you're curious: https://www.facebook.com/TheSocalGuitarCompany/info



Wow OK. I find it quite odd that he would "come out" like this! Some investigating needs to be done.

So are they using his name because he's actually involved helping them finish those 200+ guitars? And then they are going to sell them?

Or are they using his name because he's now involved directly with building NEW guitars for them? And they are going to sell them?

Or is Bernie not involved and they are just using Bernie's name because they have the 200+ unfinished guitars started by his company? And they are finishing them without his help and then they are going to sell them?


----------



## Larrikin666

leonardo7 said:


> Wow OK. I find it quite odd that he would "come out" like this! Some investigating needs to be done.
> 
> So are they using his name because he's actually involved helping them finish those 200+ guitars? And then they are going to sell them?
> 
> Or are they using his name because he's now involved directly with building NEW guitars for them? And they are going to sell them?
> 
> Or is Bernie not involved and they are just using Bernie's name because they have the 200+ unfinished guitars started by his company? And they are finishing them without his help and then they are going to sell them?



It doesn't matter how he is involved to be honest. The fact that he has any association with this company makes it suspect. He's resurfaced a bit, so that's the driving force behind all the activity here.


----------



## leonardo7

Larrikin666 said:


> It doesn't matter how he is involved to be honest. The fact that he has any association with this company makes it suspect. He's resurfaced a bit, so that's the driving force behind all the activity here.



I know but Im jumping a few steps ahead, as I always do! Thats exactly what Im saying, it makes it "suspect", but doesnt catch him red handed! If your going to go after him in court then it would be good to know to what extent he is involved. I mean what if those assholes just claim that they legally bought all of the guitars from a third party and there is no paper work or evidence involving Bernie's association aside from his name being used? I do believe that he is behind this, its obvious. But obvious isnt proof. I hope someone get's busted. Dont hesitate guys! get on this immediately


----------



## Larrikin666

We're not going after SoCal guitar company. We'll be filing against Bernie himself. We are also, however, leaving review on the SoCal page warning people about Bernie's reputation.

1. If Bernie is building new guitars for them, people need to know about what he's done in the past.
2. If they are finishing old builds and selling them, people need to be aware of this who paid previously so they can ensure they don't sell their slot/guitar to someone new.


----------



## mikernaut

Joined the facebook group. I also have some more WIP pics of various guitars from his shop that I can post up when he sent me a couple shots of my rebuild. Not sure if anybody else might spot one of their guitars in these pics.


----------



## SpaceDock

Guys, file asap and get the ball moving.

If you look at the for sale ads on the SoCal website, they call out new custom runs and are trying to sell partially finished guitars all over again. No way can he get away with this again.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

I'm joining this, despite only having some emails I have to dig up. And maybe a bank statement if I can find it or request one from USAA for fall 2011. I'll try to find the BKP correspondence as well.


----------



## toiletstand

best of luck to you guys i want this to work out in your favor!


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

^ Ironically, I was in El Paso when the order was placed. Well, Camp McGregor. Asbestos filled buildings, lead paint, experimental small pox vaccine, tarantula chasing, massive dehydration, all good times! The Hoppy Monk is awesome too, when we were granted a local pass.


----------



## Hollowway

Larrikin666 said:


> We're not going after SoCal guitar company. We'll be filing against Bernie himself. We are also, however, leaving review on the SoCal page warning people about Bernie's reputation.
> 
> 1. If Bernie is building new guitars for them, people need to know about what he's done in the past.
> 2. If they are finishing old builds and selling them, people need to be aware of this who paid previously so they can ensure they don't sell their slot/guitar to someone new.



You filing suit? I'll get in on that action. I was going to do small claims, but if you're doing something more significant, count me in.


----------



## toiletstand

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> ^ Ironically, I was in El Paso when the order was placed. Well, Camp McGregor. Asbestos filled buildings, lead paint, experimental small pox vaccine, tarantula chasing, massive dehydration, all good times! The Hoppy Monk is awesome too, when we were granted a local pass.



hahah oh yeah definitely sounds like a good time! and yeah i agree theres a lot of cool little places around here.

I sold my spot back before things went upside down and i plan on giving all correspondence ive had with bernie over to the guy organizing everything on the fb page.


----------



## electriceye

leonardo7 said:


> I know but Im jumping a few steps ahead, as I always do! Thats exactly what Im saying, it makes it "suspect", but doesnt catch him red handed! If your going to go after him in court then it would be good to know to what extent he is involved. I mean what if those assholes just claim that they legally bought all of the guitars from a third party and there is no paper work or evidence involving Bernie's association aside from his name being used? I do believe that he is behind this, its obvious. But obvious isnt proof. I hope someone get's busted. Dont hesitate guys! get on this immediately



What are you talking about? His level of involvement with the new company has NO bearing on what he did 2 years ago. He could be skydiving and selling pina coladas now. Doesn't matter. He did what he did and should be prosecuted and sued for that. Technically, what he's doing NOW is legit. 

That said, I'm not defending him at all. I just think you are mixing up some logic and emotion here.


----------



## leonardo7

electriceye said:


> What are you talking about? His level of involvement with the new company has NO bearing on what he did 2 years ago. He could be skydiving and selling pina coladas now. Doesn't matter. He did what he did and should be prosecuted and sued for that. Technically, what he's doing NOW is legit.
> 
> That said, I'm not defending him at all. I just think you are mixing up some logic and emotion here.



So selling other peoples guitars that they have paid for is legit?


----------



## Jake

leonardo7 said:


> So selling other peoples guitars that they have paid for is legit?


This is the part that a lot of people seem to be missing. Makes me sick.


----------



## electriceye

leonardo7 said:


> So selling other peoples guitars that they have paid for is legit?



You can't really prove that. It's certainly not legit, but it's not illegal in what he's doing (technically). Again, I still don't understand why people have yet to go after this scumbag. Why the sudden interest now that he's surfaced? These lawsuits and such should have been pursued well over a year ago. It's not like he moved to a different state or anything.

I'm not trying to be an ass. I'm just being lawyerly, because I think people's emotions are skewing what needs to be, or should have been, done.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

If you read back through the thread you can see that people tried a lot of things from paypal disputes to even going to the address of the workshop(which was closed). Disputing payments only worked for a short period of time so thats only a short window. Not to mention a lot of customers are overseas or bought their spots second hand so that leaves very limited options. 

Its very easy to throw around the word lawsuit but do people even realise the costs involved in hiring someone. Lawyers charge crazy amounts for their time and before you even get a case together you'd have a hefty bill.


----------



## leonardo7

electriceye said:


> You can't really prove that.



Tell me something I dont already know and havent already said! Re-read my quote again that you quoted a few posts above. I stated that being a suspect doesn't mean you have been caught red handed. If anyone can legally tie him in with this new business then they have a case.

Its waaay too late to keep it on the under so I'll go out and say that this thread probably tipped him off from the very beginning too, just sayin


----------



## SpaceDock

Update: my police have contacted the police in the city SoCal is in asking for them to open an investigation.

I will update when I hear something new.

If you haven't filed in your town, stop letting him get away with this. It is a painless process to file a police report.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> Update: my police have contacted the police in the city SoCal is in asking for them to open an investigation.
> 
> I will update when I hear something new.
> 
> If you haven't filed in your town, stop letting him get away with this. It is a painless process to file a police report.



Can you walk us through how to do it? I called my local PD and they said I can't file a police report because I never had the guitar in the first place. What did you file it as? Like, what crime? I'll go do it asap as soon as I know what I need to tell them to get it done.


----------



## SpaceDock

Fraud/ deception/ fraud by check is what is on my report. 

They used some verbiage like: less than honest business transactions, using Internet to gain money without delivering product, ect.


----------



## xCaptainx

People who are talking about lawsuits should read the entire thread first and see how futile it is. 

You'll spend 3x your lost deposit having a lawyer work on this for a week, let alone a month or so.


----------



## Tesla

xCaptainx said:


> People who are talking about lawsuits should read the entire thread first and see how futile it is.
> 
> You'll spend 3x your lost deposit having a lawyer work on this for a week, let alone a month or so.



People are aware of that but still feel that an example needs to be made of BRJ, because frankly - if an example isn't made of him, he's just paving the way for this to happen again and again with any other greedy asshole at the helm.

Public service and whatnot.


----------



## SpaceDock

xCaptainx said:


> People who are talking about lawsuits should read the entire thread first and see how futile it is.
> 
> You'll spend 3x your lost deposit having a lawyer work on this for a week, let alone a month or so.



Not trying to do a lawsuit, trying to file criminal charges. ie no lawyer; DA is the lawyer.


----------



## HRC51

SpaceDock said:


> Not trying to do a lawsuit, trying to file criminal charges. ie no lawyer; DA is the lawyer.



Good for you, and thanks for trying. I hope he gets what he deserves, because I'll never get my money back.


----------



## xCaptainx

Tesla said:


> People are aware of that but still feel that an example needs to be made of BRJ, because frankly - if an example isn't made of him, he's just paving the way for this to happen again and again with any other greedy asshole at the helm.
> 
> Public service and whatnot.



Yup I agree. Will be very noble of someone if they want to spend much, much money getting BRJ accountable for his deplorable actions. Hope it all goes well. My heart just goes out to anyone who thinks they can do down that route for a recoup of costs.


----------



## fantom

xCaptainx (Sorry to call you out). I see you aren't from USA... We have several types of court proceedings. Earlier in the thread, people semi-seriously talked about civil lawsuits. SpaceDock is taking it beyond a civil matter. A criminal proceeding, which includes fraud, is an action that the "public" takes on an entity. This means, people file police reports, the police provide evidence to the district attorney, and the district attorney decides whether or not to take a case to a judge for criminal behavior (for the good of the public). This is paid for by the tax-payers.

That being said, SpaceDock clearly stated that he is pushing for (and trying to organize) *criminal* charges and asking people to provide additional evidence. SpaceDock clearly has discussed the situation with authorities and stated it won't cost anything (correct me if I'm wrong). Speculating about the cost in the current discussion is irrelevant and undermines his efforts by spreading misinformation that buries his call for action in hundreds of pages of posts.

I just want to see resolution in this thread, not more speculation!


----------



## SpaceDock

^ you are correct, criminal charges cost nothing but time. 

I have not had much luck though. I don't know that anyone else has done a report. It seems like this will fall on deaf ears if I am the only one trying to call him out.


----------



## will_shred

SpaceDock said:


> ^ you are correct, criminal charges cost nothing but time.
> 
> I have not had much luck though. I don't know that anyone else has done a report. It seems like this will fall on deaf ears if I am the only one trying to call him out.



I think that if we can show all the people who were screwed out of their money, there would be plenty of evidence for a criminal case. Actually, couldn't this thread itself count as evidence? With plenty of documented photos, testimonies, and (though I haven't read though the whole thing, I assume there is going to be some evidence of communication with bernie before he dropped off the radar). I really don't know much about criminal law so I can't say that I actually know what i'm talking about, just speculating. I like the idea of "making an example" of Bernie however the most practical thing to do is just to try and make sure he never works in the guitar industry again (assuming he will even show his face in the public light) and recognize the reg flags of a bad builder, which many of us are quite familiar with at this point. Just generally use common sense.


----------



## TemjinStrife

will_shred said:


> *I really don't know much about criminal law so I can't say that I actually know what i'm talking about, just speculating.*



Unfortunately, this is true. I'm not an expert on criminal law and what causes DAs to want to bring cases, but you are far more likely to get *anything* that you want (restitution, damages, whatever) through a civil suit (breach of contract, etc.) than through the punitive measures of a criminal one. Even if you managed to convince the DA to take your case, and even if he was convicted or pled guilty, you'd still have to bring a civil suit to recover anything.


----------



## Chokey Chicken

TemjinStrife said:


> Unfortunately, this is true. I'm not an expert on criminal law and what causes DAs to want to bring cases, but you are far more likely to get *anything* that you want (restitution, damages, whatever) through a civil suit (breach of contract, etc.) than through the punitive measures of a criminal one. Even if you managed to convince the DA to take your case, and even if he was convicted or pled guilty, you'd still have to bring a civil suit to recover anything.



At this point it really just seems a lot of folks want to see him stopped. If they can get their money back that's great, but at the very least he should be stopped before he can do it again which he very well might be doing. 

Basically this will prevent future people from getting burned.


----------



## TemjinStrife

Chokey Chicken said:


> At this point it really just seems a lot of folks want to see him stopped. If they can get their money back that's great, but at the very least he should be stopped before he can do it again which he very well might be doing.
> 
> Basically this will prevent future people from getting burned.



Well, there's no guarantee. Unless he is incarcerated, most criminal penalties won't stop him from working in the guitar business again. The same goes for civil penalties as well, really.

Also, regardless of what you want to do, you'd better move soon; the Black Friday Run is getting further and further away, and the statute of limitations is ticking (it might even have run out, depending on who is involved and what the time of breach may be).


----------



## Chokey Chicken

TemjinStrife said:


> Well, there's no guarantee. Unless he is incarcerated, most criminal penalties won't stop him from working in the guitar business again. The same goes for civil penalties as well, really.
> .



Yeah, well it's better than sitting on thumbs while the prick continues on. Better to be a thorn in his side than do nothing. Not too sure why you'd even argue against it. It's a shame that it appears only one guy is trying to do anything at all about it.


----------



## spawnsc

Thought I would step by and see what's going on. Looks like nothing has changed and this will always haunt me knowing I gave free money to someone else on a failed promise. I agree crazy or not, he knew what he was doing and if his wife didn't know of his wrong doings she should have left his ass. I knew she tried to step in at one point and got grilled. Any heard any updates on his status?


----------



## Axel_Blaze

Just by reading through this thread, as well as reading the reviews on SoCal's Facebook page, I definitely will NOT be doing business with them anytime soon. I was going to contact them and get a quote on a new 7-string, but after sfter reading all that, I don't trust this guy on his word as far as I can kick him- let alone trust him with my money.

The sad thing about it is that his guitars look absolutely gorgeous, and I jammed on a buddy's Hesperian 627 (which he ended up selling, go figure) and it was pretty sweet (I'm a sucker for rosewood). Bernie obviously has a lot of talent for building guitars, but I'm not going to get suckered into an abusive relationship just because of a pretty face (mixing metaphors obviously, but IDGAFF).

I guess my point is that I'm really sorry this situation had to even transpire, and I'm just as mad as you guys are. No business- big or small- should EVER treat their paying customers like pieces of shit (it's why I don't play games from EA, Capcom, or Ubisoft anymore). I really hope he gets what he deserves.


----------



## ikarus

Axel_Blaze said:


> Bernie obviously has a lot of talent for building guitars


----------



## TemjinStrife

Chokey Chicken said:


> Yeah, well it's better than sitting on thumbs while the prick continues on. Better to be a thorn in his side than do nothing. Not too sure why you'd even argue against it. It's a shame that it appears only one guy is trying to do anything at all about it.



My point is that if you want to actually *accomplish* something, you need to do it yourself, and not just leave it up to some overworked DA's discretion.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

ikarus said:


>



I know what you're thinking, but I did cream a little when I laid eyes on the Vixen


----------



## ikarus

Axel_Blaze said:


> I know what you're thinking, but I did cream a little when I laid eyes on the Vixen



No this was a hint on his mexican connection. Do a little research.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

ikarus said:


> No this was a hint on his mexican connection. Do a little research.



I shall do that, for you have aroused my curiosity


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Has anyone had any luck here?


----------



## SpaceDock

^ that is a hard one to answer...

While the police here in CO were super helpful, the police in CA have pretty much told me "yeah we have real crimes to deal with" with the exception that they told me their was an inquiry but they could not give me details. Im not sure if that means these things move slow or what, Im not that well versed in legal stuff.

I will say that these efforts to scare him and gearhounds off seemed to work a bit. Their FB went dead, their phones are dead, any redemption those guys were planning seems to have been squashed. Lets all just be sure to keep our eyes open for them resurfacing and expose them again if needed.


----------



## clubshred

SpaceDock said:


> ^ that is a hard one to answer...
> 
> While the police here in CO were super helpful, the police in CA have pretty much told me "yeah we have real crimes to deal with" with the exception that they told me their was an inquiry but they could not give me details. Im not sure if that means these things move slow or what, Im not that well versed in legal stuff.
> 
> I will say that these efforts to scare him and gearhounds off seemed to work a bit. Their FB went dead, their phones are dead, any redemption those guys were planning seems to have been squashed. Lets all just be sure to keep our eyes open for them resurfacing and expose them again if needed.



If I know the liar and thief that he is (and trust me, as a former pseudo-employee, I do), his response to all of it would be like, "awww brah... come on... that ain't right, dooood. I was always good to you..."

Really?? I mean, really?? Asswipe...


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

SpaceDock said:


> ^ that is a hard one to answer...
> 
> While the police here in CO were super helpful, the police in CA have pretty much told me "yeah we have real crimes to deal with" with the exception that they told me their was an inquiry but they could not give me details. Im not sure if that means these things move slow or what, Im not that well versed in legal stuff.
> 
> I will say that these efforts to scare him and gearhounds off seemed to work a bit. Their FB went dead, their phones are dead, any redemption those guys were planning seems to have been squashed. Lets all just be sure to keep our eyes open for them resurfacing and expose them again if needed.



So basically... not enough people have filed police reports for an investigation into him? Because if everybody who lost a significant amount of money actually filed, aren't we talking about quite a bit of money? I mean - if I stole a house... I would probably be arrested, right? So I'm assuming most people just gave up. Stupid.


----------



## SpaceDock

I won't fault anyone for not filing, I got started way too late and the process is very painful.


----------



## Velokki

I'd always been interested in Bernie Rico Jr. guitars since I saw Michael Keene's Jekyll.

I must say, now that I started reading more about BRJ in the thoughts of possibly buying one, I'm positively astounded at how big of a shitstorm can one individual start. He's got to be the Blake Judd of custom shop guitars.

What's the most recent information people have of their instruments? And possibly of Bernie's whereabouts?


----------



## mcsalty

Velokki said:


> What's the most recent information people have of their instruments? And possibly of Bernie's whereabouts?



This thread pretty much.


----------



## MetalDaze

Anyone think BRJ will show his face at NAMM? Not as an exhibitor, but just an attendee.


----------



## Tesla

MetalDaze said:


> Anyone think BRJ will show his face at NAMM? Not as an exhibitor, but just an attendee.



No.


----------



## Cloudy

Id be surprised if he arrived at NAMM, I'm sure there are a number of attendees who would love to punch his lights out.


----------



## clubshred

MetalDaze said:


> Anyone think BRJ will show his face at NAMM? Not as an exhibitor, but just an attendee.



Not a chance in hell. If he did, he'd prove to have balls the size of Alpha Centauri


----------



## UnderTheSign

Ed Roman went to NAMM for years despite being despised in the guitar world so never say never!


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Yeah, people despise Ed Roman. But I'm pretty sure there are at least a handful of dudes who might actually physically hurt Bernie if they saw him. 

And for the record, I am in no way recommending or encouraging violence against him. It's just that I'm pretty sure I've even read things from people saying if they ever see him in public they will hurt him. I doubt he would go to NAMM though.


----------



## electriceye

Speculum Speculorum said:


> Yeah, people despise Ed Roman. But I'm pretty sure there are at least a handful of dudes who might actually physically hurt Bernie if they saw him.
> 
> And for the record, I am in no way recommending or encouraging violence against him. It's just that I'm pretty sure I've even read things from people saying if they ever see him in public they will hurt him. I doubt he would go to NAMM though.



DespisED. He's dead for a while now.


----------



## pushpull7

Man, I love SS. I'd never have found out about this.


----------



## Hollowway

So what are the options here, really?
1) file a police report - not likely since it's a civil issue
2) small claims court - But we have to find him to serve him.

Anything else? I was thinking he may not have been paying his taxes as well, so a call to the IRS may be in order. I'm going to guess he didn't claim all those payments as income. That will at least keep him from making guitars for a while, because any income will be attached to what he owes.


----------



## clubshred

UnderTheSign said:


> Ed Roman went to NAMM for years despite being despised in the guitar world so never say never!



You're right, Ed Roman did go to NAMM for years but of all the BS that came out of his mouth, one thing stands true: The man delivered. I don't give a furry rat's ass if he had a sweat shop or whatever there were always guitars being built and put out for sale... forget the fact on whether or not you think they're good or not. He had product.

Bernie? Not so much. He just stole money. That's all. 

BTW, I was at NAMM and didn't see Bern - didn't really expect to either.


----------



## Tesla

clubshred said:


> You're right, Ed Roman did go to NAMM for years but of all the BS that came out of his mouth, one thing stands true: The man delivered. I don't give a furry rat's ass if he had a sweat shop or whatever there were always guitars being built and put out for sale... forget the fact on whether or not you think they're good or not. He had product.
> 
> Bernie? Not so much. He just stole money. That's all.
> 
> BTW, I was at NAMM and didn't see Bern - didn't really expect to either.



Can someone give me a quick rundown of Ed Roman and what he done wrong?


----------



## ElysianGuitars

Tesla said:


> Can someone give me a quick rundown of Ed Roman and what he done wrong?



Well, for one, bondoing up a bunch of Ibanez bodies and then claiming Ibanez used bondo on their guitars instead of building them right. He said a lot of bullshit for years, and ripped off other guitar companies.


----------



## UnderTheSign

He built BC Rich copies for years and claimed he was building them _for_ BCR. 

Like Elysian said he was quite the ripoff yet until his death he went to NAMM every year. Think one year he had a little confrontation with Neal Moser on some designs.


----------



## Tesla

Pretty grim stuff...cheers for the catch up.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

UnderTheSign said:


> He built BC Rich copies for years and claimed he was building them _for_ BCR.
> 
> Like Elysian said he was quite the ripoff yet until his death he went to NAMM every year. Think one year he had a little confrontation with Neal Moser on some designs.



I heard that Bernie went up to a well known custom shop at NAMM before accusing them of stealing his ideas. The quickly told him where to go and laughed as he stormed off in a huff.


----------



## SpaceDock

For those interested, from the Gearhounds Still Open? Thread:



zimbloth said:


> Interesting side note to this place. I don't know if this is old news or not, but I heard from some very reliable sources at NAMM that this is where many (if not all) the BRJ guitars that people were trying to track down ended up. They were selling them as new in their store, despite the fact many of them were customers builds that were already paid for. Apparently BRJ himself was spotted in there finishing up incomplete guitars to be sold here. Pretty sketchy stuff.
> 
> For those who don't know, I too was screwed by the BRJ situation. Apart from the business side of things, I had sent Bernie my old white Vixen 7 for a headstock repair a couple years ago, and he never sent it back and disappeared forever on me. Pretty disappointing considering we were friends. We drove down to see the place ourselves before we left California, but its been abandoned now.
> 
> PS: I don't know if this is 100% true, but the people who told me this at NAMM saw this first-hand and have no reason to lie that I can figure out. Just some FTF.



Let's all keep an eye out for them trying to resell peoples guitars, I don't know how an influx of Hesperians couldn't go unnoticed, though


----------



## mikernaut

Yeah really sad stuff, I know Nick ( Zimbloth) probably really feels sick about all this. I know I got interested in BRJ because of Nick's praise of the quality. I ordered my 6 string and it blew me away and still does to this day, the best guitar in my collection. 

My 2nd order had issues, I even sent it to Nick before he disclosed that he too had been burned with his vixen. needless to say he said doing a pickup swap on my Jekyll was a total headache.

Also seeing as Bernie even screwed over Jed Simon speaks volumes to his character.

shout out to the luthiers who built the good BRJ's cuz pretty much at this point we know Bernie doesn't do much then just sign the headstock.


----------



## Tesla

Thing is though, if these guitars do start appearing for sale...what can be done? Unless someone got an up-to-speed lawyer actively ready to pounce, isn't it just your word against theirs?


----------



## wizbit81

Hey hey chaps, I just did my usual quick Ebay search for a used Rico at a reasonable price and I came across this:

Bernie Rico Jr USA SN Black Fr Like New EMG Floyd Rose Neck thru B C Rich | eBay

This German shop is selling 4, yes 4 Ricos, in block colours. Sounds like it could be a new supply and he's trying abroad.....could be wrong, but thought I'd put it in here in case anyone wanted to check it out.

EDIT: They all say seller refurbished.....could it be non-finished stock showing up that someone else has finished off?


----------



## DIM3S0UL

@wizbit yeah german shop ProMusicTools, i asked them for serial number for a white hesperian but they have no clue about that / can't find one on the guitar.
As far as i know the shop orders directly from the companys and they carried BRJ Guitars for a long time. (they had a orange helloween vixen a frew years ago i remember)


----------



## flint757

The serial numbers were probably removed, if they were ever there.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

I haven't really paid attention to what happened with this, but pretty shady from what I have heard. But what is that old saying when there is a father son company? Not entirely the same since it's a separate company, but regardless.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

Interestingly, the seller removed the BRJ - what the hell is going on here?


----------



## SilentCartographer

Interesting to read this post from the beginning, what exactly happened? Just kind of up and effed off on a run or something?

EDIT : Thread*** not post


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

SilentCartographer said:


> Interesting to read this post from the beginning, what exactly happened? Just kind of up and effed off on a run or something?
> 
> EDIT : Thread*** not post



Lots of what I perceive as lies and false promises, non-delivery of guitars, etc.


----------



## SilentCartographer

But is he no longer active or just still being slow with responses or ignoring customers all together?


----------



## asher

So did you actually read the full thread or not?


----------



## SilentCartographer

asher said:


> So did you actually read the full thread or not?


 
Hells no, just like the first 10 pages and then some stuff here and there, sorry if I'm nosey, just like to be informed


----------



## Jake

TL;DR Version of this thread:

He's gone. Nobody has received guitars or money back and Bernie is basically a worthless piece of shit who fvcked a lot of people.


----------



## SilentCartographer

Sorry to hear guys/gals , and thanks, appreciated.


----------



## JP Universe

*no new news* What a ......... To the guys that have 1000s in this the world owes you so you'll get it back in another form.... While I only have 600 in it, it still stings. .... you Bernie. Hopefully that new venture didn't go anywhere


----------



## MetalDaze

The only thing that makes me feel better is knowing that there are plenty of us that will make sure that Bernie never lives this down no matter where he pops up. 

This is something that time will not erase.


----------



## clubshred

Does anyone want control of the "www.ricojrguitars.com" domain? Apparently, it's under my account somehow (I was trying to help this fool about 3 years ago and got burned with the rest of you). I don't want it at all so I just wanted to see if there was someone that would want to assume ownership. 

Keep in mind, I haven't followed up on this too much because it was like an orphaned account from some years back. There's a .org domain too - that was what I used for the testing of his revamped site that I did - that he never paid for... shocker... 

Anyway, PM me if interested - I need to make sure I can dump it. I honestly don't know why it's showing up in my account.


----------



## canuck brian

clubshred said:


> Does anyone want control of the "www.ricojrguitars.com" domain? Apparently, it's under my account somehow (I was trying to help this fool about 3 years ago and got burned with the rest of you). I don't want it at all so I just wanted to see if there was someone that would want to assume ownership.
> 
> Keep in mind, I haven't followed up on this too much because it was like an orphaned account from some years back. There's a .org domain too - that was what I used for the testing of his revamped site that I did - that he never paid for... shocker...
> 
> Anyway, PM me if interested - I need to make sure I can dump it. I honestly don't know why it's showing up in my account.



Hotlink it to goatse.


----------



## Tesla

To be honest, I'd just set it up with a page that has a picture of him and a big WANTED sign with a paragraph as to why. 

Shame him. Shame him good.


----------



## crg123

^ Lol This. Do like a cheesy old Wild West One.


----------



## xCaptainx

Hey, I'll take it. I'd link it to this thread haha.


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

crg123 said:


> ^ Lol This. Do like a cheesy old Wild West One.



and then follow it with more wanted posters of each members guitar(s) that was never completed or delivered. it should also include the $ amount lost at as the reward...


every time he pops up somewhere, someone could post a link to the site...then he would be sent back underneth the rock from which he crawled.


----------



## xCaptainx

Posted two days ago 

Bernie Rico jr. guitar Custom shop

"I picked it up from Bernie's factory down in Wildomar CA"

*edit* Doesn't say WHEN it was picked up, so I cannot presume too much from the given details. Although it does say 'new' condition, which is odd.


----------



## SpaceDock

^ that was the Gearhounds shop that is also closed now. I ended up calling the cops on them, lol.


----------



## canuck brian

I'm finally getting around to working on a guy's half finished Rico guitar. Needs a LOT of work still I think the painted on side dots are my favorite thing. I'm drilling out side dots for luminlay.


----------



## rifftrauma

xCaptainx said:


> Posted two days ago
> 
> Bernie Rico jr. guitar Custom shop
> 
> "I picked it up from Bernie's factory down in Wildomar CA"
> 
> *edit* Doesn't say WHEN it was picked up, so I cannot presume too much from the given details. Although it does say 'new' condition, which is odd.




As far as I know my Hesperian was one of the last one completed before Bernie sh*t the bed. The serial number on mine is about 20 lower than this one, but I'm not sure if he used the same system for every make and model of guitar. This could have been one of the last guitars out of the shop but who knows. I'm not trying to spread rumor and hearsay, but just FYI.


----------



## ikarus

canuck brian said:


> I I think the painted on side dots are my favorite thing.



I KNEW IT!  But nobody believed me. I have been trying to figure out if they are painted or not since I got my Hesperian...


----------



## pondman

canuck brian said:


> I'm finally getting around to working on a guy's half finished Rico guitar. Needs a LOT of work still I think the painted on side dots are my favorite thing. I'm drilling out side dots for luminlay.



WTF is the point in that, I mean how long does it take to install a few side dots 
The lazy bastard


----------



## MetalDaze

First I've heard of Bernie associated with Wildomar.


----------



## Forrest_H

Hey guys,

so I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post on here considering I was not part of the sale, but while browsing reverb, I found this.







https://reverb.com/item/453029-bernie-rico-jr-guitar-custom-shop-7-free-shipping

Just wanted to make sure this wasn't somebody else's guitar that they never received, not at all trying to barge my way in.

Serious condolences to all of you guys, this situation is f-cked.


----------



## HRC51

Forrest_H said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> so I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post on here considering I was not part of the sale, but while browsing reverb, I found this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://reverb.com/item/453029-bernie-rico-jr-guitar-custom-shop-7-free-shipping
> 
> Just wanted to make sure this wasn't somebody else's guitar that they never received, not at all trying to barge my way in.
> 
> Serious condolences to all of you guys, this situation is f-cked.



*Unbelievable!!! This is my guitar that I never received. *

Here is a picture Bernie sent me:


----------



## MaxOfMetal

HRC51 said:


> *Unbelievable!!! This is my guitar that I never received. *
> 
> Here is a picture Bernie sent me:
> 
> View attachment 47073



I'd call the cops.


----------



## ikarus

HRC51 said:


> *Unbelievable!!! This is my guitar that I never received. *
> 
> Here is a picture Bernie sent me:



Have you paid in full for it?


----------



## HRC51

ikarus said:


> Have you paid in full for it?



I paid $2200 back in Feb. 2012. I spoke with Bernie many times on the phone about specs and delivery. Like many others here I wrote it off as lost.

The seller on Reverb bought it from Gearhounds. Meaning, Bernie sold the guitar twice. I consider this stolen property. I have not heard back from Reverb, but the seller paid for it. That does not change the fact that it's all illegal.

I looked into small claims court, but that's hard because I live in another state. Even if you win, you don't always collect.

I'm so pissed.


----------



## Prophetable

Call the police. Report your stolen property and the internet post of it being found.


----------



## Larrikin666

Damn....this one looks like one of mine

https://reverb.com/item/812643-bernie-rico-jr-hesperian-2013-trans-blue-jeans

The timing doesn't quite work though. I might still try to hit that guy up to see.


----------



## Jake

^^ Isn't that one Rifftraumas?


----------



## Larrikin666

Found a guy who used to work for him. We'll see what he says.

https://www.linkedin.com/pub/bronson-benzien/64/ab3/bb0


----------



## Larrikin666

This freakin guy too

https://www.linkedin.com/profile/vi...-1-1,tarId:1436728808478,tas:james marshall q

James Marshall Quan


----------



## crystallake

HRC51 said:


> *Unbelievable!!! This is my guitar that I never received. *
> 
> Here is a picture Bernie sent me:
> 
> View attachment 47073



Unreal! Sorry to hear fellow Ohioan!


----------



## MetalThrasher

That's crazy! Sorry for you HRC! Where are all of these guitars suddenly popping up from? It seems every few months a handfull of his guitars show up for sale. I wrote mine off as a loss but this is nuts.


----------



## MAJ Meadows SF

HOLY PHUCK... I'd call the FBI.


----------



## HRC51

MAJ Meadows SF said:


> HOLY PHUCK... I'd call the FBI.




I have filed a complaint with the FBI; however, they get thousands of complaints a week.

If more people let the FBI know that Bernie ripped them off, they might take notice. We are talking about a lot of money that he stole from us!


----------



## SpaceDock

Good luck to any who can get anything done here. I tried for a long time, filed complaints and called around. The guys from gearhounds told me straight up he was reselling guitars and I posted about that ..... Too bad we are seeing some proof now. I wish I could find that bitch, that is the hardest part. Without a doubt he still has a lot of these guitars.


----------



## Rap Hat

Dammmmn, now there's proof to what everyone suspected. I have a feeling most of them were probably sold on the DL, since Bernie apparently finished them for Gearhounds and he definitely wouldn't want his new customers to know that the guitars were all literally the property of not-Bernie (i.e. us).

The one I bought had a super distinctive moustache shaped quilt between the two pickups, and since I have a few WIP pics it would be very easy to identify. I've been periodically searching for it with no luck so far, but as of my last contact with Bernie, the guitar was effectively done.

It's gonna be a ....show trying to get them back. The new buyers are going to be like "No I paid for this!", the old sellers are not going to refund them since they'll 100% lose out on the cash (as Gearhounds isn't refunding them...), and I highly doubt, even with proof, that the police would do anything. Civil court is the best bet, but in this case it would be screwing over someone who bought the guitar in "good faith". (note: with even a cursory google search showing that Bernie scammed tons of people, anyone that's buying or selling Ricos now should be regarded with extreme caution).

My other concern is that buyers may look up their Gearhounds (or wherever) purchased Rico, find out it's a stolen guitar, and keep it hidden as a result. If you paid 2-4k for a guitar and then found out it was stolen and you'd 100% lose out on the cash by bringing it up, would you say anything? That's probably where most of the finished guitars are at right now.

It's a zero-sum situation. Everyone that's involved has lost out, and unbelievably more people are getting roped in by purchasing these stolen Ricos, therefore setting themselves up for a loss of $. The only winner was Bernie, who got to scam tons of people and blow the money on drugs or whatever, then got to waltz off into the sunset.


----------



## SpaceDock

Rap Hat said:


> The only winner was Bernie.



While I agree with alot of what you said, ^THIS is about as wrong as it could get. 

As much as I hate Bernie for everything he did, he ruined his career and his life. This and the other threads like this (looking at you Strictly 7 Jim) need to be a cautionary tale for any young entrepreneurs or anyone buying anything they can't get in hand when they pay for it. If these guys kept their businesses in check they would make much more money and it would be sustainable. These guys were shifty business men and lost everything trying to promise too much then not knowing when to say no.


----------



## Khoi

Anyone hear anything back from that guy on Reverb?


----------



## HRC51

Khoi said:


> Anyone hear anything back from that guy on Reverb?



Yes. He said he bought it from GearHounds after they tried scam him out of some money for an Ibanez. Offered him some BRJ's. Mine had a $3799 tag for a guitar I paid $2200.

Just because he paid for the guitar does not make it right. I paid for it first and got nothing for it.

I filed a complaint with Reverb, but have not heard anything back. Clearly, they just want their 3% of his sale.


----------



## Cold_Aeon

HRC51 said:


> Yes. He said he bought it from GearHounds after they tried scam him out of some money for an Ibanez. Offered him some BRJ's. Mine had a $3799 tag for a guitar I paid $2200.
> 
> Just because he paid for the guitar does not make it right. I paid for it first and got nothing for it.
> 
> I filed a complaint with Reverb, but have not heard anything back. Clearly, they just want their 3% of his sale.



What you want to hear from Reverb? They are closing the selling lot and give the guitar to you? Guy that selling it now bought it, now he want to sell it. Why he or Reverb must care about dark past of the instrument? 

I'm fully agreed that its now good that you are not get your axe, but you cannot blame Reverb. Bernie is only guilty person.


----------



## MrYakob

Cold_Aeon said:


> What you want to hear from Reverb? They are closing the selling lot and give the guitar to you? Guy that selling it now bought it, now he want to sell it. Why he or Reverb must care about dark past of the instrument?
> 
> I'm fully agreed that its now good that you are not get your axe, but you cannot blame Reverb. Bernie is only guilty person.



It's still stolen goods, just because the seller paid for it does not change that fact.


----------



## Cold_Aeon

MrYakob said:


> It's still stolen goods, just because the seller paid for it does not change that fact.



Seller bought that guitar in music shop, not steal it. Also this guy paid 2200 its not a full price, just a part. I do not want excuse Bernie, his deeds are terrible for sure, but Reverb and those guy who bought guitar from GH are not steal anything.


----------



## canuck brian

Cold_Aeon said:


> Seller bought that guitar in music shop, not steal it. Also this guy paid 2200 its not a full price, just a part. I do not want excuse Bernie, his deeds are terrible for sure, but Reverb and those guy who bought guitar from GH are not steal anything.



You are correct - they didn't steal anything. They're in possession of stolen property.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

canuck brian said:


> They're in possession of stolen property.



Which is a crime in the United States, where this is taking place. 

Worth mentioning is that you don't have to prove whether the party in possession of the stolen property knew it was stolen. 

So, as long as HRC51 can provide documentation proving he paid for the specific guitar, Reverb and the seller are obligated to surrender the guitar or face legal action ranging from fines up to jail time. 

HRC51, if Reverb and the seller are not cooperating, call the cops. This is a felony and depending on local statutes the amount paid could push it into a higher felony category. I doubt Reverb wants legal problems like that. This isn't about dodging a lawsuit, these are criminal charges.



Cold_Aeon said:


> Why he or Reverb must care about dark past of the instrument?



Because the instrument has a criminal past which is becoming a criminal present. 

Learn about the law or don't bother posting.


----------



## Rap Hat

Cold_Aeon said:


> Seller bought that guitar in music shop, not steal it. Also this guy paid 2200 its not a full price, just a part. I do not want excuse Bernie, his deeds are terrible for sure, but Reverb and those guy who bought guitar from GH are not steal anything.



Think about it this way: If buying something that was stolen meant it was yours and the original owner couldn't get it back, what's to stop someone from stealing all of your gear and selling it to a guitar store? Now that the store has it and paid for it thinking it was not stolen, you as the original owner have no claim to it. Even if you could prove it was stolen from you, why should the guitar store have to lose the thousands of dollars that they paid to the guy that stole it?

In these cases in the real world, the purchaser of the stolen goods will lose money in the short term, but the legal system is set up so that they can then go and sue the person that sold them the stolen gear and hopefully recoup what they lost + legal fees.
In this BRJ mess if the guitars show up, we as the original owners have to get the police involved to get the instruments back, then the people who we got it from have to take wherever they got it from to court (in this case probably no one, unfortunately). Maybe they can find someone from GearHounds to sue because they 100% knew this stuff was hot, but that's probably unlikely.

And this is why resale of stolen goods is such a nasty situation. It can end up screwing multiple people out of money who honestly believed the equipment was legit, and since the thief either has nothing to garnish or doesn't get caught, innocent people bear the brunt of the financial pain.

With that in mind, no one here should just give up if their guitar does show up but they get pushback from the new "owners". Don't give them $, let them negotiate terms for you getting your guitar back, etc. Go to the police with whatever proof of ownership you have, and let them get it back for you. If they're understanding and willing to give it to you, great, but don't let yourself get more screwed over because you felt bad because they didn't know. I've seen this happen with stolen gear, where the real owners ended up either giving the person what they paid or traded gear of their own to get it back, because the person gave a sob story or got threatening because they paid for it "legit". 
Had a studio PC of mine stolen and sold to a pawn shop, and I went with the police to get it back. The pawn shop owner refused at first, then made a huuuuuge scene about how much he was losing by having to give it back, and it must be a scam, and I must be in on it, and that I was banned for life from the shop even though it was stolen from me, etc. If I didn't have the cops with me, he never would've given it back, no matter what kind of proof I had. And even so, in the end my name is on the "thief: DO NOT DEAL WITH" list at that pawn shop because if I hadn't pursued my stolen gear they wouldn't have lost money.


----------



## HRC51

Cold_Aeon said:


> Seller bought that guitar in music shop, not steal it. Also this guy paid 2200 its not a full price, just a part. I do not want excuse Bernie, his deeds are terrible for sure, but Reverb and those guy who bought guitar from GH are not steal anything.



$2200 was the full price. Don't think for one minute that you know more about this guitar than me. Gear Hounds was trying to say it was a custom shop guitar and charge more.

I know the guy on Reverb paid for it, but I bought it first. Bernie sold it twice!

I contacted Reverb: no reply. They just want their commission.

I contacted the FBI: no reply. There is so much crime in America right now.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

HRC51 said:


> $2200 was the full price. Don't think for one minute that you know more about this guitar than me. Gear Hounds was trying to say it was a custom shop guitar and charge more.
> 
> I know the guy on Reverb paid for it, but I bought it first. Bernie sold it twice!
> 
> I contacted Reverb: no reply. They just want their commission.
> 
> I contacted the FBI: no reply. There is so much crime in America right now.



It's not a federal crime unless the item is valued at $5000 or greater, not to mention it hasn't crossed state lines. The FBI would not have jurisdiction. 

You need to call your local police, the police where the guitar is currently, and the police where Reverb is headquartered. You're going to have to play a lot of phone tag and repeat yourself many times, but they'll eventually help. 

Once you have a report filed you'll be in a better legal position, especially if the guitar winds up selling again. 

Get all your proof together, sit by the computer, fax, and phone and don't give up. The second you get complacent, you lose.


----------



## Tesla

Please tell me I'm not the only one who read Cold_Aeon's posts in an exaggerated Russian accent.


----------



## pondman

What I don't get is why he's getting carried away with defending the people trying to sell em


----------



## MetalDaze

I've been keeping an eye out for mine. It's a lefty and unique so it will be obvious when it surfaces. 

I'm honestly hoping Bernie jumps in front of a bus. He deserves it.


----------



## Cold_Aeon

Rap Hat said:


> Think about it this way: If buying something that was stolen meant it was yours and the original owner couldn't get it back, what's to stop someone from stealing all of your gear and selling it to a guitar store? Now that the store has it and paid for it thinking it was not stolen, you as the original owner have no claim to it. Even if you could prove it was stolen from you, why should the guitar store have to lose the thousands of dollars that they paid to the guy that stole it?
> 
> In these cases in the real world, the purchaser of the stolen goods will lose money in the short term, but the legal system is set up so that they can then go and sue the person that sold them the stolen gear and hopefully recoup what they lost + legal fees.
> In this BRJ mess if the guitars show up, we as the original owners have to get the police involved to get the instruments back, then the people who we got it from have to take wherever they got it from to court (in this case probably no one, unfortunately). Maybe they can find someone from GearHounds to sue because they 100% knew this stuff was hot, but that's probably unlikely.
> 
> And this is why resale of stolen goods is such a nasty situation. It can end up screwing multiple people out of money who honestly believed the equipment was legit, and since the thief either has nothing to garnish or doesn't get caught, innocent people bear the brunt of the financial pain.
> 
> With that in mind, no one here should just give up if their guitar does show up but they get pushback from the new "owners". Don't give them $, let them negotiate terms for you getting your guitar back, etc. Go to the police with whatever proof of ownership you have, and let them get it back for you. If they're understanding and willing to give it to you, great, but don't let yourself get more screwed over because you felt bad because they didn't know. I've seen this happen with stolen gear, where the real owners ended up either giving the person what they paid or traded gear of their own to get it back, because the person gave a sob story or got threatening because they paid for it "legit".
> Had a studio PC of mine stolen and sold to a pawn shop, and I went with the police to get it back. The pawn shop owner refused at first, then made a huuuuuge scene about how much he was losing by having to give it back, and it must be a scam, and I must be in on it, and that I was banned for life from the shop even though it was stolen from me, etc. If I didn't have the cops with me, he never would've given it back, no matter what kind of proof I had. And even so, in the end my name is on the "thief: DO NOT DEAL WITH" list at that pawn shop because if I hadn't pursued my stolen gear they wouldn't have lost money.



Ok, maybe you right. Also if my Vixen that now lying in case under my bed was stolen and resold my opinion will be different.



> I'm honestly hoping Bernie jumps in front of a bus. He deserves it.



Maybe he is, who knows? But i heard from my friend (he was an endorser of BRJ) other version.

P.S. read all with exaggerated Russian accent.



> I've been keeping an eye out for mine. It's a lefty and unique so it will be obvious when it surfaces.



http://www.ebay.com/itm/Left-Handed-Bernie-Rico-Jr-727-Custom-/191636345827?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c9e6a93e3


----------



## Dooky

Cold_Aeon said:


> Left Handed Bernie Rico Jr 727 Custom | eBay


This seems very dodgey. The Ebayer only has 3 feedback reviews and all 3 are from the same person.


----------



## Tesla

I want MetalDaze to confirm wether or not that's his...it's been days now. It could give us a lead if we open a line of communication and find out who/where it came from.


----------



## crg123

Dooky said:


> This seems very dodgey. The Ebayer only has 3 feedback reviews and all 3 are from the same person.



He has been an eBay member since 2007 though. Maybe someone should reach out and inquire.


----------



## crystallake

Dooky said:


> This seems very dodgey. The Ebayer only has 3 feedback reviews and all 3 are from the same person.



Looks like he has a feedback of 8, and been on eBay since 2007. Doesn't seem dodgey to me. Looks like he's just not active with eBay.


----------



## jjcor

Dooky said:


> This seems very dodgey. The Ebayer only has 3 feedback reviews and all 3 are from the same person.



I actually know this guy and have sold and boughten from him. He's legit and super stand up guy. He just doesn't keep up with forums and things like that unlike some of us. And also this guitar was built prior to the run, cause I've actually looked into buying it myself and found out some info on it.


----------



## pondman

This was listed on the bay today.


----------



## MetalDaze

Tesla said:


> I want MetalDaze to confirm wether or not that's his...it's been days now. It could give us a lead if we open a line of communication and find out who/where it came from.



Not mine (it was a Diva).


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

saw this and thought it was worth a mention...

Bernie Rico Jr R s Series Black Hybrid Vixen 6 of 30 New Old Stock | eBay



> One of the ORIGINAL R.S. Series Hybrids from the first run when only white (only 20 made) or black (only 30 made) were available. Unused, it has been in climate controlled storage and comes with its original matching hard case. *This guitar came from Rico Jr. straight to us, an early and original Rico Jr dealer, right after they were made and have nothing to do with the recent wave of Rico incidents! *Custom shop quality at a real bargain price! New old stock, this is quite a find and a steal! Please note: The cases have some shelf wear due to them being stored since 2008!


----------



## Tesla

The terrible blurring on those photos is unforgivable.


----------



## Shrediablo

Anyone got the inside scoop on this guitar? BRJ Bernie Rico Jr Vixen Fr 6 String Black Gray Splatter Duncan Pickups | eBay

I remember seeing this on gearhounds a while back, atleast I think it was this one.


----------



## crg123

He's a member here: SevenString.org - View Profile: geofreesun He's probably had it for awhile now.


----------



## Hollowway

Interesting development on my end: I was in a music store in NorCal today, and saw a few unfinished guitars that looked very much like Ricos leaning up against the back counter. I asked the shop owner what they were, and he's like, "The unfinished guitars? We got them from a guy in Mexico." So after talking with him for a bit, it seems a friend goes down to Mexico quite frequently, and came across a shop that had all of these guitars in it, and called the guy and asked if he wanted to buy some. I brought him up to speed on the situation, and he's going to see if he can get me more information. I'm not going to reveal the music store or anything on here, because I don't want to get him in a hot mess. I want to follow this and see what we can learn from it, and take it from there. And I will keep you guys posted!

And, yeah, they were all made in Mexico. Pretty much no doubt about that now.


----------



## UnderTheSign

I wonder if the place in Mexico just made extras or if this is some other BRJ stock.


----------



## Hollowway

UnderTheSign said:


> I wonder if the place in Mexico just made extras or if this is some other BRJ stock.



Although there could be a number of possibilities, I think it's clear that the odds are 99.99999999% that this place in Mexico made ALL of the BRJ guitars. Based on what I saw, all woodwork, fretwork, and staining was done down there. They then came into the US, were painted or cleared or oiled, electronics put in, and final fret dressing was done. 

Anyone who ways they believe that Bernie was building these here, despite the wealth of evidence to the contrary, is either lying or incapable of deducing this very easy conclusion.

No slight at you, UnderTheSign. This was the final piece of evidence to tip me over the edge to knowing everything was MIM.


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

have any former brj employees ever confirm this or go into detail about how he ran the business?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

M3CHK1LLA said:


> have any former brj employees ever confirm this or go into detail about how he ran the business?



Publicly? No. 

I've gotten some PMs from former employees that pretty much confirm that he [Bernie] didn't really do anything aside from artist relations, answering the phone, placing orders, and basic setups. 

There have been industry people and other builders who have alluded to this for years. 

A lot of those folks involved with Bernie didn't want to come forward in fear of legal or punitive retaliation, not to mention plain old self incrimination. Few of those who worked with and for him don't have any kind of dirt on thier hands. From the guys who ran the website knowing that the company was failing, to the guys boxing up guitars with defects, to the endorsees who knew to jump ship. 

Interestingly enough, early on in this thread someone did come forward but I've never been able to confirm if they were legitimate or a troll who could tell the future.



steelhorse said:


> Really? Sounds like a typical Bernie ploy to me.
> 
> Delays followed by excuses, followed by endless delays
> 
> Ask him why he had a falling out, could betrayal and deceipt on his part have anything to do with it? The truth is the webguy did everything he could to promote Rico, but he grew tired of having to basically lie to customers about why their guitars were not done month after month.
> 
> Bernie is on the brink of going under if he hasn't already which is why with another desperate move he got rid of the webguy and hired another company or guy and had his "artists" do his bidding on facebook and the like for him, that's just how he works.
> 
> I personally know what happened with that situation.
> 
> As for handbuilt by Bernie Rico Jr. Lies. The woodshop guy hand builds them, and speaking of the woodshop guy notice how you never hear of him?
> 
> Ed paints them, the woodshop guy builds them so Bernie does what?
> 
> Oh and good luck getting those sale items. You may get them....one day, but if the disappearing website is any indication, he's gone.
> 
> Epic in Oz got totally screwed out of thousands if you don't believe me.
> 
> I salute all the members here. Most are truly stand up. Good luck!



Check the date on that.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Hollowway said:


> Although there could be a number of possibilities, I think it's clear that the odds are 99.99999999% that this place in Mexico made ALL of the BRJ guitars. Based on what I saw, all woodwork, fretwork, and staining was done down there. They then came into the US, were painted or cleared or oiled, electronics put in, and final fret dressing was done.
> 
> Anyone who ways they believe that Bernie was building these here, despite the wealth of evidence to the contrary, is either lying or incapable of deducing this very easy conclusion.
> 
> No slight at you, UnderTheSign. This was the final piece of evidence to tip me over the edge to knowing everything was MIM.


Nah I got what you meant, I'm well versed on BRC and BRJ history and was one of the first to claim he had a shop down south  Like father, like son.

What I meant was, are the unfinished guitars "old stock" from BRJ or did the Mexican shop makes themselves some extras?


----------



## Hollowway

UnderTheSign said:


> Nah I got what you meant, I'm well versed on BRC and BRJ history and was one of the first to claim he had a shop down south  Like father, like son.
> 
> What I meant was, are the unfinished guitars "old stock" from BRJ or did the Mexican shop makes themselves some extras?



Ahhh, I see. Yeah, that's a good question - I'm not sure. I'll post up news as I get it. Basically, I think it would be cool if we could go down there and buy up what is left over, and then try to work out some arrangement where we could get our guitars. Doubtful that will ever happen. But whatever information I can get I will let you guys know.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Buying up old supposed Bernie Rico stock... Reminds me of this old fellow, Ed Roman


----------



## SDMFVan

Didn't BC Rich have all their guitars built in Mexico back in the Rico Sr. days? I thought I read that on here, and that Jr. even used the same people.

EDIT: Found it: http://mcs.acidpit.org/showthread.php?18324-BCR-Bible-History

From Neal Moser:
"Production didn't start the one down South until 78 or 79 ish. Quality was too close to tell the difference. The only way you could tell was by the shape, and mostly only Mocks. I'm not sure how it happened, but two different Mock shapes appeared. I don't remember any difference in the Eagle shape. These luthier's who worked in the BC South shop were trained by us, BC North, Wink so they were very good Luthiers and the guitars coming up from them were excellent.We "BCR North" trained the BC South crew. They were NOT a different company that we farmed out our guitar building to. The guitars were made the same way with wood that WE supplied to them and the guitars costs just as much from them as from OUR wood shop. There were NO "white guys" doing the "wood work" on BCR guitars either North or South. ALL BC Rich guitars were made by Mexicans."


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> Ahhh, I see. Yeah, that's a good question - I'm not sure. I'll post up news as I get it. Basically, I think it would be cool if we could go down there and buy up what is left over, and then try to work out some arrangement where we could get our guitars. Doubtful that will ever happen. But whatever information I can get I will let you guys know.



It's been pretty well established that anything resembling a complete instrument has already been sold off, at least once if not more. 

I know it's nice to believe there's a magic storage locker out there with everyone's guitar in it ready to go, but that's not reality. 

At best you'll grab some incomplete body/neck/fretboard blocks, like Bernie had hanging everywhere. After so many years, it's likely anything built back then has expired. 

But then who gets what? A lot of specs were extremely similar and some even identical. 

Unless you see the actual, completed guitar in the wild it's safe to assume you'll never get a guitar out of this. 

And so what if this leads to the infamous woodshop? By all accounts it wasn't an integrated part of Bernie's business and being in Mexico it's not like you'll be able to force them to give you anything.


----------



## SDMFVan

According to that link I posted the Mexican wood shop is located at 15 April Street, Pan-American Colony, Tijuana, Mexico.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

SDMFVan said:


> According to that link I posted the Mexican wood shop is located at 15 April Street, Pan-American Colony, Tijuana, Mexico.



Which is an address that just doesn't exist, at least anymore.


----------



## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's been pretty well established that anything resembling a complete instrument has already been sold off, at least once if not more.
> 
> I know it's nice to believe there's a magic storage locker out there with everyone's guitar in it ready to go, but that's not reality.
> 
> At best you'll grab some incomplete body/neck/fretboard blocks, like Bernie had hanging everywhere. After so many years, it's likely anything built back then has expired.
> 
> But then who gets what? A lot of specs were extremely similar and some even identical.
> 
> Unless you see the actual, completed guitar in the wild it's safe to assume you'll never get a guitar out of this.
> 
> And so what if this leads to the infamous woodshop? By all accounts it wasn't an integrated part of Bernie's business and being in Mexico it's not like you'll be able to force them to give you anything.



Yeah, I doubt we'll get anything from it. The guitars at the store I saw were basically right out of the woodshop in Mexico - fretted, stained, and complete, sans the oil/paint/clear, electronics and hardware. My guess is that stuff happened stateside. I talked with Terri over text and got very close to having her mail mine back to me. She had it, and we had some good text conversations last year, and then she went completely silent. Likely the advice of a lawyer. I contacted her because there was a guy on here who DID get her to send his guitar to him, and I bought it from him, and got her number. At any rate, those were here in the US, because they had made it as far as clear coat. I had a video of Bernie with mine, and I was soooo close to getting it. Sucks. What sucks most is this isn't the first time or last time I've been burned by a luthier! Fortunately, my currently outstanding orders (KxK, Peters, OAF, Jahn) all seem like good guys, and despite it being years (KxK), there doesn't seem to be an indication that I will never receive them (knock on wood).
Anyway, it was interesting to see these show up locally. A weird end to a sad event. Sad for us, not sad for him. I have no sympathy for the family, because they actively avoided dealing with this. I offered Terri more money to simply ship my guitar, and she just stopped responding. 

Overall, my luck with these sorts of things has forced me to all but completely stop ordering instruments on a to-be-built basis. They either take way longer than expected, or simply never show up.


----------



## Rap Hat

It's an aside to the main convo and I know I've said this before, probably to you Hollowway, but Tom at OAF is one of the most reliable and kindest luthiers I've ever had the pleasure to work with. He went way above and beyond to make my guitar more than just one of five, to the point where I consider it my "Rap Hat" sig. From letting me pick out the woods and figure out the color in person, to adjusting the frets and lightly sealing the neck after I realized temp and humidity changes seemed to effect it too much, to taking it back AGAIN to route it for a HSH set of Ionizers and have it rewired+reshielded with a six-way switch... The guitar is (I feel) pretty uniquely mine, and one I'm proud to have people see me play. And if someone wanted an OAF 8 Singlecut that's super versatile I'd say, "Hey, grab one with my specs!"

Such a difference from Bernie. Like, sure, Bernie would talk to me on the phone for 2-3 hours at a time (literally), but much of it was him "apologizing" and coming up with tons of excuses while badmouthing other Luthiers.


----------



## Hollowway

Rap Hat said:


> It's an aside to the main convo and I know I've said this before, probably to you Hollowway, but Tom at OAF is one of the most reliable and kindest luthiers I've ever had the pleasure to work with. He went way above and beyond to make my guitar more than just one of five, to the point where I consider it my "Rap Hat" sig. From letting me pick out the woods and figure out the color in person, to adjusting the frets and lightly sealing the neck after I realized temp and humidity changes seemed to effect it too much, to taking it back AGAIN to route it for a HSH set of Ionizers and have it rewired+reshielded with a six-way switch... The guitar is (I feel) pretty uniquely mine, and one I'm proud to have people see me play. And if someone wanted an OAF 8 Singlecut that's super versatile I'd say, "Hey, grab one with my specs!"
> 
> Such a difference from Bernie. Like, sure, Bernie would talk to me on the phone for 2-3 hours at a time (literally), but much of it was him "apologizing" and coming up with tons of excuses while badmouthing other Luthiers.



Amen to all of that. Same experience here!


----------



## Hollowway

Update: So the guy from the music store found an 8 string in the bunch. It's unfinished, but he will finish it and quote a price to the owner, so if someone here has it he will basically give it to you for the price of the work he has left to do on it. It's not mine (specs don't match). But if it's one of yours then we might be able to get you your guitar! Let me know what specs you have and if it matches I'll let you know. Don't PM me, cuz my inbox is gonna hit 100% if a bunch of people read this and have missing 8 strings. But visitor messages or replying on here is fine. I'm not going to tell YOU what the specs are, because I don't want a bunch of guys saying, "Yeah, that's mine!"


----------



## JerichoCheng

i got a 8s hesperian spot since around 2012 from the original owner called Mahmound Sammak,
since he already paid half for deposit so i have pay the final payment+shipping to Bernie,
after few times of email and he still mentioned was ready for final assembly and setup,
9-Oct-2012 was the last time i got the reply from Bernie,

and here is some pics for the 8s
















https://goo.gl/photos/X8hHBJhuZAXNmdVr9


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> Update: So the guy from the music store found an 8 string in the bunch. It's unfinished, but he will finish it and quote a price to the owner, so if someone here has it he will basically give it to you for the price of the work he has left to do on it. It's not mine (specs don't match). But if it's one of yours then we might be able to get you your guitar! Let me know what specs you have and if it matches I'll let you know. Don't PM me, cuz my inbox is gonna hit 100% if a bunch of people read this and have missing 8 strings. But visitor messages or replying on here is fine. I'm not going to tell YOU what the specs are, because I don't want a bunch of guys saying, "Yeah, that's mine!"



This is getting into some really murky, shady territory. 

What if the owner of this, the rightful owner, paid for it in full? 

So is this "music store guy" basically holding the guitar hostage until someone pays him to complete it? 

Morally, I don't think I'd want to do business with someone looking to take advantage of the situation like this.


----------



## Rap Hat

Hollowway said:


> Update: So the guy from the music store found an 8 string in the bunch. It's unfinished, but he will finish it and quote a price to the owner, so if someone here has it he will basically give it to you for the price of the work he has left to do on it. It's not mine (specs don't match). But if it's one of yours then we might be able to get you your guitar! Let me know what specs you have and if it matches I'll let you know. Don't PM me, cuz my inbox is gonna hit 100% if a bunch of people read this and have missing 8 strings. But visitor messages or replying on here is fine. I'm not going to tell YOU what the specs are, because I don't want a bunch of guys saying, "Yeah, that's mine!"



I kinda agree with Max that its a little sketchy if it's one that's been paid in full (mine for example), but hell, I'll toss my specs up here:
Hesperian 8
Quilt with a super distinctive "moustache" curl right below the neck pickup (have pics if this sounds similar, didn't see another Rico like that)
I got two pics from Bernie that show 24 frets, and one pic that has 25 or 27, don't recall, but IIRC my initial pics were the 24 feet one
Hipshot routing
Oil finish
And god knows what else, I think my pics show writing in the PU cavities, so I can provide that too.

E: Since tons of stuff could've been done to the guitar since I last talked to Bernie in, oh, 2011 or 2012, the pattern of the quilt is the only definitive thing I can think of, so if it's not a quilt, it's probably not mine.


----------



## Hollowway

Well, we don't know exactly what the situation is with the guitar the guy has in the music store. He bought some unfinished guitars, I saw them, and told him what the situation was. Someone needs to finish the guitars, and he would like to be the one to do it. I personally think he's being petty cool that he would just take someone's word that the guitar is there's, and then not charge them anything other than the parts and labor to finish it up. He already paid money for the thing, and is willing to eat it to do the right thing. There's no way to find out if this is a guitar that is owned by anyone on here, or if it was paid in full or what. I'm the one that chose to come on here and try to find the rightful owner so we can get it back. He's being super cool, and didn't say he'd be holding it hostage or anything. He just said, "we'd like to finish it up. If this already belongs to someone I don't want them to get hurt." But if this is shady what should he do? I mean, here we might have a solution that can get someone's guitar back. If you guys think the solution is to just stay silent so the person never sees their guitar, I'll tell him that we'd rather just bitch about Bernie online and not actually try to identify who owns it.


----------



## Rap Hat

My stance is that it's a crappy situation for everyone, as if it's a paid in full guitar the owner isn't going to want to pay more, while the guy who has it doesn't want to finish it for free because that's not his responsibility.

It's going to come down to the individual if it's one of ours. Personally I'd pay some to have it finished, as long as it plays well and doesn't have any Bernie surprises, so to speak. But I wouldn't hold it against anyone if they find that absurd. And hey, they could always sell it to someone else and recoup some of the cost.

E: It didn't come off like the guy is going to hold it hostage, so I apologize if my comment came off that way. But it may come down to the fact that the original owner paid in full to have it completed, and unless the guy is willing to just give it away as is to that person they're going to have to pay even more.

It's like no matter what, anyone who's gotten involved with this gets burned over and over. You can't even buy a used one without the potential for the actual owner to say "Hey, that's my guitar!"


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> Well, we don't know exactly what the situation is with the guitar the guy has in the music store. He bought some unfinished guitars, I saw them, and told him what the situation was. Someone needs to finish the guitars, and he would like to be the one to do it. I personally think he's being petty cool that he would just take someone's word that the guitar is there's, and then not charge them anything other than the parts and labor to finish it up. He already paid money for the thing, and is willing to eat it to do the right thing. There's no way to find out if this is a guitar that is owned by anyone on here, or if it was paid in full or what. I'm the one that chose to come on here and try to find the rightful owner so we can get it back. He's being super cool, and didn't say he'd be holding it hostage or anything. He just said, "we'd like to finish it up. If this already belongs to someone I don't want them to get hurt." But if this is shady what should he do? I mean, here we might have a solution that can get someone's guitar back. If you guys think the solution is to just stay silent so the person never sees their guitar, I'll tell him that we'd rather just bitch about Bernie online and not actually try to identify who owns it.



Here's the best case scenario: someone sees these posts, comes forward with proof it's their guitar, like a "progress" (notice the quotes ) photo from Bernie so the wood grain can be matched up, and then they have a PayPal or credit card invoice that shows they paid just a deposit or a partial amount. That guy still actually wants the guitar and is willing to pay to get it completed. The shop does a great job and everyone goes home happy. 

But what are the odds of that? The whole theme of this fiasco is "hope for the best, but prepare for the very likely very worst". 

Bernie was a shyster. He lied, cheated, and stole. He sent pictures of the same guitar to multiple people, botched specs, and even sent pictures of different guitars to the same person. 

Here's how it's probably going to play out:

Scenario A: Someone comes forward with proof of full payment, and that it's their guitar and they want it without paying this guy to finish it. If they call the cops or have a lawyer and the proof, they're getting that guitar back and the shop is screwed. 

Scenario B: Multiple people come forward who were shown the same picture of the same guitar and told, fraudulently, by Bernie it was theirs. Who gets the guitar? Who decides? 

Scenario C: No one comes forward until the guitar is purchased again and we get the same situation as that Reverb guitar. Everyone loses there. 

Hollowway, Andy, I know you're a good guy and you have everyone's best interest at heart. You're one of the best guys on here and I have total faith in you, but I don't think this is a situation you should bear. Your heart is in the right place, but I don't think this is going to bring anything but more heartache. 

As for this shop, even if they are doing things in good faith they put themselves in a precarious position, see Scenario A, and they really shouldn't have bought these and should really try and return them if they're not willing to lose their shirt on them. How they didn't know the history on these is rather suspect and I have a feeling they really want to unload these quickly, lest they get caught for dealing in stolen goods, see the Reverb situation a page or so back. 

Honestly, there's no positive outcome here, at least not a likely one. Even if someone doesn't come forward to claim these guitars, chances are someone did pay at least a deposit on them and is out their cash and guitar. Personally, I know I wouldn't touch a guitar with that kind of bad karma (Guitarma if you would) with a ten foot pole. All I'd be able to think is that it represents two things: someone who was a crook, and that out there someone is bummed the guitar isn't theirs even though they paid for it. 

Worst of all though, I feel it's nothing short of abusive to get folks' hopes up. It's great to think there's going to be a magic moment of discovery where all of the guitars are found and we're able to go through them and everyone lives happily ever after, but after so many let downs and some much time, that's just not going to happen. I want it to more than anyone, and I don't have a horse, or guitar, in this race. 

After all that, and me being the glutton for punishment that I am, if there's anything I can do to facilitate a good outcome here, let me know via PM. Like I said, I want the best outcome more than anything.


----------



## electriceye

At this point, this needs to be dropped. *No one* has filed any legals claims against Bernie. *No one* has filed charges. Outside of those two things happening, it's time to move on. How many more years do you need before this sets in, guys? Sh*t or get off the pot.


----------



## Tesla

electriceye said:


> At this point, this needs to be dropped. *No one* has filed any legals claims against Bernie. *No one* has filed charges. Outside of those two things happening, it's time to move on. How many more years do you need before this sets in, guys? Sh*t or get off the pot.


----------



## SpaceDock

electriceye said:


> At this point, this needs to be dropped. *No one* has filed any legals claims against Bernie. *No one* has filed charges. Outside of those two things happening, it's time to move on. How many more years do you need before this sets in, guys? Sh*t or get off the pot.



Read more of the thread bud.


----------



## Serratus

Not trying to cause trouble, just help if possible. Just saw this on another forum, some unfinished BRJ guitars up for sale:
Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars!!! BEST OFFER!


----------



## xzyryabx

Serratus said:


> Not trying to cause trouble, just help if possible. Just saw this on another forum, some unfinished BRJ guitars up for sale:
> Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars!!! BEST OFFER!



just came here to post this.....hopefully some of the guys find some kind of resolution here


----------



## Larrikin666

Serratus said:


> Not trying to cause trouble, just help if possible. Just saw this on another forum, some unfinished BRJ guitars up for sale:
> Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars!!! BEST OFFER!



None of these are mine. I'm very close to this guy, so I'm going to do what I can. Hollowway, let me know if you want to go check these out together. I know you're in the area as well.


----------



## SpaceDock

Not mine. This is just about the most ....ed up situation ever. How can anyone think it is acceptable to give away other people's guitars for someone else to sell? I am betting rico couldn't pay his workers/debt and used our guitars to pay them.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

SpaceDock said:


> Not mine. This is just about the most ....ed up situation ever. How can anyone think it is acceptable to give away other people's guitars for someone else to sell? I am betting rico couldn't pay his workers/debt and used our guitars to pay them.



That's the impression that I've gotten as well. 

Around the time Gearhounds and BRJ started that partnership I felt that's how he was paying his share. 

Though, as before, I'd just save the pics to post here, and flag the heck out of the ad.


----------



## BEADGBE7

Serratus said:


> Not trying to cause trouble, just help if possible. Just saw this on another forum, some unfinished BRJ guitars up for sale:
> Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars!!! BEST OFFER!



also came here to post this today, flagged the ad, the guy seems like he has a bunch of them, does anybody know him?


----------



## Khoi

Almost flipped out because that first one looked similar to mine, but it's not


----------



## ras1988

First one is mine....Baritone 6 string in a blackedge burst.


----------



## Khoi

ras1988 said:


> First one is mine....Baritone 6 string in a blackedge burst.



holy .... dude, do you have documentation proving it's yours? really hoping you can get it back without paying them a dime


----------



## btbg

electriceye said:


> At this point, this needs to be dropped. *No one* has filed any legals claims against Bernie. *No one* has filed charges. Outside of those two things happening, it's time to move on. How many more years do you need before this sets in, guys? Sh*t or get off the pot.



You sure are dumb, aren't you?


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10207712468109023&set=pcb.745354178909114&type=3&theater


----------



## Larrikin666

This guy wants me to meet him on Monday. I'm not sure I can get to him that early. Maybe Tuesday or Wednesday. My plan is to assess what all he has, how he got it, then pass that information to the police in the area. My preference is to not have everyone flag the ad. If this guy gets spooked, then I won't be able to collect any information. I'd like to give the police a little bit to work with.


----------



## Mklane

Someone posted a link to this thread in the comments so he will likely back out when he sees it. Unless he actually wants to help.


----------



## JohnnyRich

a facebook group has been created to help find brj guitars that have been stolen or paid for and never received. https://www.facebook.com/groups/1615606095359273/


----------



## JohnnyRich

also, i am an admin for the b.c. rich junkies groups on facebook. all the posts from that guy with the craigslist ad have been removed and the poster has been band from all 3 of the group pages. the b.c. rich junkies does not and will not support, approve of or condone people trying to sell things that do not belong to them on our group pages.


----------



## JohnnyRich

the guy who posted the craigslist ad, Juve Quintana, wants to help in getting the guitars in the hands of the rightful owners, those that can prove the guitar is their's. i have lifted his ban on the junkies facebook pages and he has been asked to re-joint the group. we shall see what happens.


----------



## Khoi

JohnnyRich said:


> a facebook group has been created to help find brj guitars that have been stolen or paid for and never received. https://www.facebook.com/groups/1615606095359273/



There's already a big Facebook group with more members, you will probably have better luck connecting with people here:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/794673537222033/956101441079241/?notif_t=group_activity


----------



## MaxOfMetal

JohnnyRich said:


> a facebook group has been created to help find brj guitars that have been stolen or paid for and never received. https://www.facebook.com/groups/1615606095359273/





JohnnyRich said:


> also, i am an admin for the b.c. rich junkies groups on facebook. all the posts from that guy with the craigslist ad have been removed and the poster has been band from all 3 of the group pages. the b.c. rich junkies does not and will not support, approve of or condone people trying to sell things that do not belong to them on our group pages.





JohnnyRich said:


> the guy who posted the craigslist ad, Juve Quintana, wants to help in getting the guitars in the hands of the rightful owners, those that can prove the guitar is their's. i have lifted his ban on the junkies facebook pages and he has been asked to re-joint the group. we shall see what happens.



Oh look, the guys who were always ALWAYS there to defend Bernie are now trying to help, but only if: "this is NOT to bitch and complain or rant and rave about Jr or the situation". 

 

Still trying to defend him in some way. Ever think this stuff might lead to Bernie and all the legal stuff that entails? If that is the case, what's to stop you guys from shutting this down when your homeboy Bernie might be in a rough spot? 

None of you have cared until now. You've insulted, belittled, and talked awfully terrible to and about many of the users on here who are just good folks trying to get what they paid thousands for. 

Was this to clear your conscience?


----------



## Mklane

Never trust a junkie. Lol


----------



## Dewswimmer

Let me tell you about my experience with bernie. Back in 2011 I have ordered from him a hesperian 627 with choosing pickups and controls placement. It takes 2 months to get El Diablo from factory according to him. He also add diamonds on the fretboard for free. The cost of the guitar was total 1800 + 120 shipping to Russia via USPS priority. I was really surprised when UPS agent called me and offered to pay customs (about 400 usd), cause Bernie used UPS shipping instead if USPS where I could avoid customs fees. To tell you more Bernie told me that he paid 700 bucks for shipping and asked me to cover this. Crazy! I have told him 100 times to use only USPS.

So I paid 400 bucks customs and get my guitar, After inspection I had found 1000 series tremolo instead of the OFR. And refused to cover extra shipping. As for the guitar itself - it wasn`t his best sounding axe even after 3-4 years. I own one Jekyll now from 2003 - and this is awesome sounding guitar (but it Had some probles with neck and floyd routing - all was fixed and frets were replaced)


----------



## User

...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Your "friend" doesn't have access to Google? 

The guitars, at least the pictures posted, show the unmistakable markings of the BRJ brand, they even have his name on them. Your "friend" didn't think to do a five second search, results showing the fiasco surrounding the brand are on the very first page?

He obviously knew enough about them to try and sell them.



User said:


> ...



 

I see you removed that the second you realized how fu_c_king stupid it was.


----------



## Tesla

Every time this thread is bumped back up we'll get a couple of new users who will post something questionable once or twice here then vanish. I'm not the only one that noticed, right?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Tesla said:


> Every time this thread is bumped back up we'll get a couple of new users who will post something questionable once or twice here then vanish. I'm not the only one that noticed, right?



They don't come back because it's pretty obvious when they're full of .... or have an ulterior motive.


----------



## Rap Hat

Shoot, I didn't get a chance to see any of the pics before it was taken down. Pic of my guitar below. I have a few more as well.

Please please let me know if one that looked like this popped up on that guy's list.

E: I know I'll never see this, it's been what, like 5 years now? But even some resolution that some asshole in CA bought the unfinished one and is trying to sell it would be good. Then at least I could put the word out wherever it's listed that it's a stolen instrument. This whole deal really ruined me on trusting small luthiers, and it was only because I was working with Tom Drinkwater before disaster struck here that I followed through with the OAF (which I don't regret at all). 

At least the amount of fraudulent luthiers seems to be dropping a little? 2009-2013 was insane, there were at least 5 or 6 "companies" that built terrible guitars and scammed people, but lately it's been seemingly less.


----------



## Larrikin666

Rap Hat said:


> Shoot, I didn't get a chance to see any of the pics before it was taken down. Pic of my guitar below. I have a few more as well.
> 
> Please please let me know if one that looked like this popped up on that guy's list.
> 
> E: I know I'll never see this, it's been what, like 5 years now? But even some resolution that some asshole in CA bought the unfinished one and is trying to sell it would be good. Then at least I could put the word out wherever it's listed that it's a stolen instrument. This whole deal really ruined me on trusting small luthiers, and it was only because I was working with Tom Drinkwater before disaster struck here that I followed through with the OAF (which I don't regret at all).
> 
> At least the amount of fraudulent luthiers seems to be dropping a little? 2009-2013 was insane, there were at least 5 or 6 "companies" that built terrible guitars and scammed people, but lately it's been seemingly less.



That's not one of the ones that popped up. I figured this was going to happen eventually, so I screen-capped everything. I also saved my emails and Facebook conversations with the guy.


----------



## canuck brian

Rap Hat said:


> At least the amount of fraudulent luthiers seems to be dropping a little? 2009-2013 was insane, there were at least 5 or 6 "companies" that built terrible guitars and scammed people, but lately it's been seemingly less.



The ....heads acted in a manner consistent with any new, emerging market. They whipped up hype, made a passable product or two and promptly bilked everyone until they could run away.


----------



## Rap Hat

Larrikin666 said:


> That's not one of the ones that popped up. I figured this was going to happen eventually, so I screen-capped everything. I also saved my emails and Facebook conversations with the guy.



That was very smart, you rock for doing that! I guess I'm kind of glad mine didn't pop up, it means I don't have to annoy the people around me with another update about this awful situation/get stressed out even more.

I feel like we have reunions every so often here to commiserate this mess, it's like "oh it's been five years? Let's post in the Rico Jr thread and see how everyone else is doing (hint: they won't have their guitars)!"

I want to say I'm done with this for good, but every time I hit money troubles or have to work on a guitar I'm like, "God dammit Bernie, why did you do this?" Then I remember just how much crap he spouted about other luthiers, forum members, mods, etc and it seems so obvious in hindsight.


E: did anyone else wonder if they were going to be next on his s***-list? You couldn't even ask certain things without running the risk of him badmouthing you to the next customer he talked to, which sure as hell made the whole situation worse.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Rap Hat said:


> This whole deal really ruined me on trusting small luthiers, and it was only because I was working with Tom Drinkwater before disaster struck here that I followed through with the OAF (which I don't regret at all).
> 
> At least the amount of fraudulent luthiers seems to be dropping a little? 2009-2013 was insane, there were at least 5 or 6 "companies" that built terrible guitars and scammed people, but lately it's been seemingly less.



You're far from the only one who shunned all custom builders after this mess, not only did Bernie manage to ruin his own business he really put the wrench in the works for other, reputable builders. I know of at least two who were ready to launch significant updates and improvements and runs around the time this went down. 

There are still scam builders out there, it's just as a community we've gotten much better at weeding them out and not falling for the BS. 

This showed everyone that even a builder with a big name, big name endorsers, and even dealers could be a scammer. If this happened before Roter, Sherman, Invictus, Siggery, etc. I feel like those incidents wouldn't even of happened.


----------



## mnemonic

Did anyone ever find out who was building the guitars in Mexico? 

Someone could totally get them building guitars again and make Rico copies, probably with no kind of pushback, since Bernie would presumably have to show his face if he wanted to stop people from using his design.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

mnemonic said:


> Did anyone ever find out who was building the guitars in Mexico?
> 
> Someone could totally get them building guitars again and make Rico copies, probably with no kind of pushback, since Bernie would presumably have to show his face if he wanted to stop people from using his design.



The whole idea of that makes my skin crawl, for plenty of reasons.


----------



## UnderTheSign

mnemonic said:


> Did anyone ever find out who was building the guitars in Mexico?
> 
> Someone could totally get them building guitars again and make Rico copies, probably with no kind of pushback, since Bernie would presumably have to show his face if he wanted to stop people from using his design.


If Ed Roman wasn't dead, he'd be selling Rico "factory spares" already 

Anyway, if he used his dads old facility down south, according to the history of BC Rich (courtesy of the guys at the Moser forums - B.C. Rich - History) it is or was located at 15 April St, Tijuana, Mexico. Hower, as Max pointed out a month ago, the address either doesn't exist or we're terrible at finding Mexican addresses on Google Maps. Maybe it's something along the lines of "calle abril" instead of April Street. Maybe someone who knows his Mexico can help out here.

If it was that easy to get a Mexican factory to start churning out guitars though, trust me - it would've happened way more often and way sooner.


----------



## MetalDaze

Who would want a BRJ anymore...real or fake? It's all tainted now (yes, I said taint )


----------



## SpaceDock

^this....


----------



## JohnnyRich

MaxOfMetal said:


> Oh look, the guys who were always ALWAYS there to defend Bernie are now trying to help, but only if: "this is NOT to bitch and complain or rant and rave about Jr or the situation".
> 
> 
> 
> Still trying to defend him in some way. Ever think this stuff might lead to Bernie and all the legal stuff that entails? If that is the case, what's to stop you guys from shutting this down when your homeboy Bernie might be in a rough spot?
> 
> None of you have cared until now. You've insulted, belittled, and talked awfully terrible to and about many of the users on here who are just good folks trying to get what they paid thousands for.
> 
> Was this to clear your conscience?


fist of all, bernie is not my homie, and i never insulted, belittle or talked awfully terrible about anybody. im trying to help. if that bothers you then thats your problem, not mine.


----------



## btbg

And you've done so much to help us Johnnycakes.


----------



## eaeolian

...OK, that stuff needs to stop, or you'll both be sitting out for a while.


----------



## SpaceDock

Well... it has been five years. I think of all that has changed, all the people who have come and gone. One thing remains the same, we are not getting any guitars or refunds. 

I think I will move on the best I can.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, the music store owner I was talking about, once he found out about the whole situation, decided not to buy them off the guy who had them from the factory. I thought he already had, but he hadn't yet bought them. The other guy has them, but they are mostly in a pre-paint stage. I believe he had them listed on CL or something. But yeah, I've pretty much given up hope. I know mine is in the Rico household somewhere, with his wife, but that's as far as I got.


----------



## canuck brian

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, the music store owner I was talking about, once he found out about the whole situation, decided not to buy them off the guy who had them from the factory. I thought he already had, but he hadn't yet bought them. The other guy has them, but they are mostly in a pre-paint stage. I believe he had them listed on CL or something. But yeah, I've pretty much given up hope. I know mine is in the Rico household somewhere, with his wife, but that's as far as I got.



And theres one in my shop all taped up waiting for me to finally jump at it.


----------



## Khoi

Officially 5 years. Black Fridays make me so sad now.


----------



## MetalDaze

Khoi said:


> Officially 5 years. Black Fridays make me so sad now.



Yep. Bernie should rot in hell for stealing our hard earned money and flat out lying to our faces over and over again.


----------



## shredderz28

I don't know if anyone here has heard yet. But he is actually reopening Bernie rico jr guitars. Has a new webpage that isn't completely up yet. I've been told he will be selling guitars again by Jan 2016


----------



## Jake

More like he'll be going to jail by Jan 2016 if he tries to pull that ....


----------



## shredderz28

Everyone that ordered one and did not receive it. I would gather any paperwork or documentation you have on it. From what I've been told he lost all his paperwork. And watch the website until it posts then obviously contact him. I have to assume he knows the hailstorm waiting for him the second he becomes available to the public. Website is ricojrguitars.com


----------



## asher

shredderz28 said:


> I don't know if anyone here has heard yet. But he is actually reopening Bernie rico jr guitars. Has a new webpage that isn't completely up yet. I've been told he will be selling guitars again by Jan 2016



Hello, newly registered person claiming insider information. Please give your sources.


----------



## pondman

shredderz28 said:


> I don't know if anyone here has heard yet. But he is actually reopening Bernie rico jr guitars. Has a new webpage that isn't completely up yet. I've been told he will be selling guitars again by Jan 2016



One hell of a first post.


----------



## shredderz28

I'm on a bc rich group on facebook. A couple of the admins know rico jr and made a post regarding it. I owned a few bc rich custom shops and owned a 2008 vixen so I have kept up with this forum thread just because of how ....ty the situation is. I just saw that posted today so I felt compelled to make an account to let everyone here know


----------



## watson503

I've been following this since I saw the following posted on Facebook starting @ November 4th, here are some of the posts I've saved since then - I couldn't believe it when I saw it posted late last night that BRJ is supposedly coming back but it was confirmed by one of the mods over there that is and has been in contact with him -


> Things are starting as we speak I figure new years will be the "official" launch , but we will see . as pappa smurf would say " not far now " LOL



The whole thing is bizarre, why wouldn't BRJ have contacted the police, filed a report, and notified everyone what was going on? But no, now we have this and people are already frothing at the mouth to throw this guy their money from the posts made since this morning



> Ripped off by Bernie Rico JR? Then you were ultimately ripped off by this man, Joseph J. Donner. Let's all pitch in and find his ass. Wherever he may be.



https://m.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/?tsid=0.7290152653586119&source=typeahead

From @ Nov. 4th:



> Joe Donner ... PUBLIC ENEMY No 1 !!!
> this is the man that stole all of Jr's inventory while he was in the hospital.
> this piece of garbage is now selling off the stolen guitars AND even making counterfeit B.R.J. guitars .
> he is in no way affiliated with or working for Jr . BUY AT YOUR OWN RISK !!!
> MEET THE NEW ED ROMAN LADIES AND GENTLEMAN



https://www.facebook.com/groups/1615606095359273/permalink/1624679981118551/



> So I had a conversation today with Bernie Rico Jr. for a little over an hour today about this guy. This dude is absolutely the piece of .... as described. How do you not only take advantage of a business partner like this, but someone you break bread with and call a friend? This dude has helped to not only destroy Bernie's reputation, but left a sick man out to dry. I hope he rots in the deepest depths of hell. Thanks Dave for hooking Jr. and I up brother. Still surreal to talk to the man himself. Hard to believe I got "starstruck" from talking to a dude that's known me since I was a toddler.



https://www.facebook.com/groups/bcrichjunkies/?fref=nf


----------



## shredderz28

It definitely has a very strange aura surrounding it. And yes there are many people on there that want him back in business


----------



## asher

shredderz28 said:


> It definitely has a very strange aura surrounding it. And yes there are many people on there that want him back in business



How convenient then that everything is this new other person's fault...


----------



## shredderz28

Yeah if he had my money I would be all over his ass the second the website posts


----------



## shredderz28

I was just told that anyone who paid and did not receive a guitar will be "made whole" again. Whether that's money back or the guitar I do not know.


----------



## Hollowway

Well, I know for a fact mine was not stolen. His wife texted me that she had it in her house. So hopefully, if this did all go down as described, he can help those of us that were left high and dry to get back to where we need to be. I mean, I paid $600 for mine, so he would gain $1000 by finishing it. I would think that if he plans on moving forward he'll never get off the ground if he doesn't "make whole" the people who ordered from him previously.


----------



## flint757

Is he starting a business now because the statute of limitations for theft is pretty much up for everyone involved? If it's true (big if) that's probably why now...

I personally think at this point the lot of you who are buying into this are just fooling yourselves. More continued false hope. Even if he does reopen the shop again what makes y'all think he's going to really honor any past commitments. He's doomed even if he were to honor all past commitments. Anyone buying a guitar from him or paying him money is literally asking to be ripped off. Even if he's magically changed his ways his reputation is far too tarnished to really get anything worthwhile going.


----------



## Chokey Chicken

Hollowway said:


> Well, I know for a fact mine was not stolen. His wife texted me that she had it in her house. So hopefully, if this did all go down as described, he can help those of us that were left high and dry to get back to where we need to be. I mean, I paid $600 for mine, so he would gain $1000 by finishing it. I would think that if he plans on moving forward he'll never get off the ground if he doesn't "make whole" the people who ordered from him previously.



You don't really know that for a fact. A lot of things everyone said in this whole ordeal were lies. I hope for the best for you and everyone, but taking his wife's word as fact is just wishful thinking. Sounds like they're tossing someone new under the bus just to try to start again. With the quality of the last few that trickled out though, I would have zero interest in even getting anything from him at this point.


----------



## downburst82

Just curious does (or did) he ever claim his guitars were "made in the USA"? Because as everyone knows they were imported from the "secret shop" in Mexico. I was under the impression the USA government takes that stuff fairly seriously (is it Martin or Taylor that can't legally claim made in USA anymore for some BS reason even though they are?)

If he does re-launch people should watch for that and make sure he gets called on it...at the VERY least....or tip off the tax man to look into if he was importing/accounting everything aboveboard.


----------



## Hollowway

Chokey Chicken said:


> You don't really know that for a fact. A lot of things everyone said in this whole ordeal were lies. I hope for the best for you and everyone, but taking his wife's word as fact is just wishful thinking. Sounds like they're tossing someone new under the bus just to try to start again. With the quality of the last few that trickled out though, I would have zero interest in even getting anything from him at this point.



Yeah, my point is that if they say that mine was stolen, I have her word saying she had it. That's a start. A start to what, I don't know. But if he is planning on coming back, I will be trying to get in touch with them again. I was thisclose to getting mine, but she suddenly ceased all communication, and that's where I am left. Who knows, though. He has to know that there are loads of people who will work very hard to make sure he doesn't succeed. It would be in his best interest to try to placate all of them. How he could possibly do that, I'm not sure. I mean, honestly, just coming forward and making some sort of a statement and trying to make amends would do a lot more than hiding and planning on starting a new business. The problem is that the people who trusted him the most are the ones that got burned the most. Some people paid him in full for 2 or 3 guitars, and got nothing. I was one of the ones supporting him right through the end. If he's anything other than a con man then he should work with those who have been left high and dry and try to compensate us. 

Though, this whole thing does make me feel particularly good about a couple of others. Shad Peters (of Peters Instruments) was dealt a hefty blow when his entire shop and contents burned down, and his insurance company found a loop hole to not pay him. So he started a donation page, got donations from a bunch of people, including some big-name shops and music stores, and is now back up and running. And right after it went down, when he was down the most, he send me an email saying that he would repay me one way or another. And just a few weeks ago he sent me an email saying he was ready to start building my guitar again. Now that's a guy with integrity. I'd recommend him to anyone, and I'll always support him because of his "me last" attitude. That's how you build a business, and a legion of enthusiastic supporters. So if Rico decides to walk away from all of his past mess, and take a, "I have to lookout for myself first, they don't know what I've been through," attitude, then that's on him, and says volumes about his morals, ethics, and the Rico name. But I know I'd never want that to be the legacy for my family.


----------



## xCaptainx

watson503 said:


> I've been following this since I saw the following posted on Facebook starting @ November 4th, here are some of the posts I've saved since then - I couldn't believe it when I saw it posted late last night that BRJ is supposedly coming back but it was confirmed by one of the mods over there that is and has been in contact with him -
> 
> The whole thing is bizarre, why wouldn't BRJ have contacted the police, filed a report, and notified everyone what was going on? But no, now we have this and people are already frothing at the mouth to throw this guy their money from the posts made since this morning
> 
> 
> 
> https://m.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/?tsid=0.7290152653586119&source=typeahead
> 
> From @ Nov. 4th:
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/1615606095359273/permalink/1624679981118551/
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/bcrichjunkies/?fref=nf



OH
COME
ON! 

Seriously guys? FIVE YEARS on and we're still seeing wild accusations and insane explanations. 

EVEN IF we believe this tripe, and this mysterious boogeyman man made off with warehouse content after hospitalization, this STILL does not explain the YEARS of ponzi scheme style fraud, lies, deceit and poor business processes from BRJ. 

This mysterious third party removes ZERO liability and ownership from BRJ and the horrible, horrible ways he has ripped you all off. 

This new information, if true, is meaningless and if anything, it seems like a poorly deviced attempt to instill sympathy for BRJ (REALLY?!? If this actually happened, why has there been ZERO communication outside of BRJ apologists on the bc rich junkies page?)

Making up a mysterious boogey man to take the heat off BRJ is reprehensible, and does nothing to sooth the financial loss of his victims. 

This misinformation and false hope has to stop. It's abundantly clear that very little, if anything can be done for most peoples loss here. 

Stop kicking a dead horse here, please.


----------



## feraledge

The relaunch is just vile. Literally unbelievable.
I have to ask, to all the people who Bernie ripped off, if he offered to finish commissioned guitars, could you even stomach giving him another dime?


----------



## MetalThrasher

Nice, so the sneaky prick is opening up shop again with the money I paid him in full for my ghost vixen. WTF! He better be ready cause if this is true I'm not letting this go if he opens up shop! I want my money back or guitar. I'll tell you what he has balls if he does decide to open shop up again.


----------



## Chokey Chicken

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, my point is that if they say that mine was stolen, I have her word saying she had it. That's a start. A start to what, I don't know. But if he is planning on coming back, I will be trying to get in touch with them again. I was thisclose to getting mine, but she suddenly ceased all communication, and that's where I am left. Who knows, though. He has to know that there are loads of people who will work very hard to make sure he doesn't succeed. It would be in his best interest to try to placate all of them. How he could possibly do that, I'm not sure. I mean, honestly, just coming forward and making some sort of a statement and trying to make amends would do a lot more than hiding and planning on starting a new business. The problem is that the people who trusted him the most are the ones that got burned the most. Some people paid him in full for 2 or 3 guitars, and got nothing. I was one of the ones supporting him right through the end. If he's anything other than a con man then he should work with those who have been left high and dry and try to compensate us.
> 
> Though, this whole thing does make me feel particularly good about a couple of others. Shad Peters (of Peters Instruments) was dealt a hefty blow when his entire shop and contents burned down, and his insurance company found a loop hole to not pay him. So he started a donation page, got donations from a bunch of people, including some big-name shops and music stores, and is now back up and running. And right after it went down, when he was down the most, he send me an email saying that he would repay me one way or another. And just a few weeks ago he sent me an email saying he was ready to start building my guitar again. Now that's a guy with integrity. I'd recommend him to anyone, and I'll always support him because of his "me last" attitude. That's how you build a business, and a legion of enthusiastic supporters. So if Rico decides to walk away from all of his past mess, and take a, "I have to lookout for myself first, they don't know what I've been through," attitude, then that's on him, and says volumes about his morals, ethics, and the Rico name. But I know I'd never want that to be the legacy for my family.



Gotcha. That makes way more sense, and that's cool about Shad Peters. (getting back to you, I mean... not that whole disaster of a fire thing.) That's some legit dedication right there.


----------



## Hollowway

xCaptainx said:


> OH
> COME
> ON!
> 
> Seriously guys? FIVE YEARS on and we're still seeing wild accusations and insane explanations.
> 
> EVEN IF we believe this tripe, and this mysterious boogeyman man made off with warehouse content after hospitalization, this STILL does not explain the YEARS of ponzi scheme style fraud, lies, deceit and poor business processes from BRJ.
> 
> This mysterious third party removes ZERO liability and ownership from BRJ and the horrible, horrible ways he has ripped you all off.
> 
> This new information, if true, is meaningless and if anything, it seems like a poorly deviced attempt to instill sympathy for BRJ (REALLY?!? If this actually happened, why has there been ZERO communication outside of BRJ apologists on the bc rich junkies page?)
> 
> Making up a mysterious boogey man to take the heat off BRJ is reprehensible, and does nothing to sooth the financial loss of his victims.
> 
> This misinformation and false hope has to stop. It's abundantly clear that very little, if anything can be done for most peoples loss here.
> 
> Stop kicking a dead horse here, please.



Yeah, so I agree about most of that, and we left the horse alone when we thought it was dead. But it appears the horse was playing dead, waiting for us to move on, and planning to get up again. And seeing how this particular horse made off with a lot of people's money, there are a number of people that are either wanting to beat said horse, or question it enough to find out if we can get our money/guitars back.


----------



## SpaceDock

He needs to make right with the past before taking on new customers. I can't believe anyone would give him money at this stage.


----------



## MetalDaze

Can you imagine those who have only put down a deposit getting an email saying to send the rest of the money and their guitar will ship in a week? Been there, done that. 

Unfortunately, I bet some sucker will do it.


----------



## flint757

SpaceDock said:


> He needs to make right with the past before taking on new customers. I can't believe anyone would give him money at this stage.



I can't believe anyone would contemplate giving him money at all no matter what he does next.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

O.K. Gonna throw a couple of things out there ...........
Firstly, I can't stand the prick or anyone that still kisses his arse like nothings happened. Which leads me to this .......

*I may be wrong here, but this is what is going on at the moment in my eyes*

I am on the B.C Rich Junkies facebook page. I have always liked the USA stuff, but anyway ......
Some might know this, but probably most won't. BC Rich have apparently opened up their custom shop again (a few months back), all be it without an official website (strange), but only a facebook page which actually doesn't give out much info at all. They are taking orders/deposits through that page and I quickly jumped on the opportunity to do so. But I asked a few questions first before even thinking about placing anything after the BRJ fiasco.

One of the questions that I asked was "Who is/are the luthiers?" To which I got a reply (along the lines of), "We can't name names yet, but lets just say it's someone that worked for/with us a while back and can not wait for this venture to start up again."

So .......... I placed an order with all the specs that I wished for, and in typical BRJ fashion, got an answer back (after trying several times to communicate with whomever was in charge) with the wrong specs on the "official" order document, things spelt incorrectly, punctuation up the creek (I know it shouldn't matter, but it looks unprofessional) and to cap it off, no sign of the eye poplar top that I asked for!

Now, there are 3 blokes on the junkies site that "seem to be in the know" about all that's happening with the CS. These are also the same 3 blokes that "seem to be in the know" that BRJ is making a comeback! These 3 blokes also back Bernie 100% and kiss his arse nearly everyday on the page for the last 3 weeks. Any negative comments are swiftly removed by the "leader & Co" and are also the 3 that have "sourced" info blaming some other dude for everything that has happened!

I may be way out of wack here, but the timing of everything and the terrible start to the "relaunch" of BCR's CS, and all of the above (including this new fella who apparently ripped of Bernie) just seems a tad fishy. 

I'll say it again ........ I may be completely wrong, but 3 "nobodies" with a wealth of knowledge that we all don't know bugger all about, is aligning as we speak. Most of us know that the actual page is for fanboys and any other opinion is removed swiftly and dealt with accordingly (as cheap chinese BCR's take up most of the feed anyway), but it sickens me that the "God bless Bernie', "Get well soon Bern" etc is now starting on the page and it smells like the same saga here 3+ years ago! 

I hope he does show (doubt it though) and is dealt with accordingly. But, this could be so far from the truth, it doesn't matter. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## twguitar

Im also on the junkies page and was the one who posted the link to Bernies site in the first place. There have been rumours for a while but this is the first actual confirmed link so thought Id share. The only way this could ever work is if he has things in place to set right what he owes people and has some in there to run his business. I sure as hell wouldn't hand any money over directly and would only buy from a store if it was already complete. Its a shame its gone this way but wouldn't want to get caught up in anything else.

As for the BC Rich custom shop.... That is legit and Ive had it confirmed by Hanser (who own Bc Rich). Its being run by someone thats worked for Bc Rich since 86, Im not going to say who as its being announced at NAMM but thats a genuine thing and nothing to do with the Rico family. I too would wait and see a few of the guitars come out first though.... If anyone wants a Bich I don't understand why you wouldn't go to Neal Moser anyway.

Anyways lets see where this new Bernie Jr site goes in the next few weeks


----------



## UnderTheSign

watson503 said:


> https://m.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/?tsid=0.7290152653586119&source=typeahead


This whole page seems to be written by one of the admins of BCR Junkies. Who, coincidentally, have been defending Bernie for the past 5 years. 

Bernie will be back, and it's all Joe's fault...
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1080490218658101&id=1078971508809972


----------



## asher

You guys do know that if it really had been someone else's fault, that Bernie would have thrown him under the bus ASAP five years ago?

(and rightly so, were it the case).


----------



## xCaptainx

Btw any assumption of BRJ being associated with present day HHI BC Rich is quite simply, false. 

I was a BC Rich Artist for a number of years. A few U.S tours back I was fortunate enough to visit head office and have a tour of the floor + custom shop assembly area. 

This was during the thick of BRJ silence, no shows and when his wife had made the announcement. 

BC Rich knew nothing of any of this and had not spoken to him for a long, long time. They said it was 'saddening, but not a huge surprise' given their past. 

I find it extremely, EXTREMELY doubtful that BC Rich would ever work with BRJ ever again.


----------



## electriceye

I've been a BCR fanboy since 84 (I own 4 at the moment spanning 30 years) and IF I had the money, there's no way in hell I'd give it to Hanser right now. Why? Near radio silence from the company for years, the "silence" surrounding who is actually building their stuff, etc. The US-made stuff has been so far off Hanser's radar the past several years and ABSURDLY over-priced, that I can't take BCR seriously anymore. The company's main focus on the crappy imports, the poorly-executed NJR series (don't get me started) and the overall cheapening of the name and brand has really turned me off. Hell, they couldn't even get the 40th Anniv Biches right!

Anyway, I digress. Whether or not Junior is involved, I wouldn't give my money to BCR right now. I hope you get what you ordered, Slayer.


----------



## SpaceDock

asher said:


> You guys do know that if it really had been someone else's fault, that Bernie would have thrown him under the bus ASAP five years ago?
> 
> (and rightly so, were it the case).



The story is bull..... He kept sending me pictures of my guitars up to September of 2013. Wtf don't you finish guitars that weren't stolen Rico!! The stolen guitar story is just the latest line of .....


----------



## canuck brian

Was the guy they're attempting to throw under the bus the same guy that stopped paying the bills on the shop and caused an overwhelming majority of guitars to be exposed to extreme heat and humidity? That was Bernie. 

Did this other guy that they're attempting to blame do the ridiculously bad work that was done on the guitars? What a crock of ..... We need to follow this crap around and make sure he doesn't get to rip anyone else off. 

If this new Joe dude is the culprit, Bernie should suing this guy into oblivion but since he's not, Bernie's once again lying.


----------



## canuck brian

UnderTheSign said:


> This whole page seems to be written by one of the admins of BCR Junkies. Who, coincidentally, have been defending Bernie for the past 5 years.
> 
> Bernie will be back, and it's all Joe's fault...
> https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1080490218658101&id=1078971508809972



I just linked the folder on my business facebook page with all the pics of the repair that I'm doing on an unfinished one. 

Link to this SSO thread at every chance you get. Don't let this douche take anyone else's money.

edit: this guy really really doesn't like me.


----------



## TonyFlyingSquirrel

May I offer an alternatively respectful luthier, who has many decades in the business, and has had his own dealings with the Rich family, suffered for it, and come out still a respected friend, confidant and tangible custom shop alternative.

My friend, Neal Moser.
Neal Moser Guitars , Fine Custom Handmade Guitars, Basses, electric guitar parts and BC Rich Parts


----------



## Edika

canuck brian said:


> I just linked the folder on my business facebook page with all the pics of the repair that I'm doing on an unfinished one.
> 
> Link to this SSO thread at every chance you get. Don't let this douche take anyone else's money.
> 
> edit: this guy really really doesn't like me.



Man I must have liked most of your posts there. This guy is just pure slime. For a guy claiming these outrageous credentials, he sure is clueless how businesses work and what PR means hahahaha. I couldn't resist and I commented myself.

I'm wandering couldn't they have found a better name than Joe Donner. Why not John Doe or John Smith for example?


----------



## canuck brian

Well, the latest statement is that this guy will sort out everything. Unfortunately we have no idea who this guy is except that he ran 3 fortune 500 companies, has a PhD in mechanical engineering and it's quite possible he's a level 21 wizard, but that last point hasn't been confirmed yet.

EDIT: There is a claim being made that the SoCal guitars thing was also this Joe Donner guy. I told the guy running that page that he should be posting anything that would give a shred of credibility to the claim that Bernie is the victim here. 

EDIT2: I talked to the guy over PM - there is a claim that this Joe dude was the one taking all the calls, responding to email and sending all the pictures. Take that with whatever amount of salt that you require.


----------



## asher

SpaceDock said:


> The story is bull..... He kept sending me pictures of my guitars up to September of 2013. Wtf don't you finish guitars that weren't stolen Rico!! The stolen guitar story is just the latest line of .....



Of course it's a load of horsesh!t. Was rhetorical/aimed at these new people...


----------



## SpaceDock

^ well I think the take home message here is that they will go to no end for making excuses. I hope that he does make good but they will never get anywhere until they own up to the past without excuses


----------



## UnderTheSign

canuck brian said:


> I just linked the folder on my business facebook page with all the pics of the repair that I'm doing on an unfinished one.
> 
> Link to this SSO thread at every chance you get. Don't let this douche take anyone else's money.
> 
> edit: this guy really really doesn't like me.


I just checked the bcr junkies page and it's indeed Dave (their admin) running the "it's not Bernie, it's Joe" page. I don't know Dave very well but what I've seen from him is that although I'm sure he does a lot of cool stuff for the bcr fans/community, he's also an asshat that doesn't want to hear ANYTHING negative on the Rico family. And I mean literally anything - he deletes any post that implies Bernie screwed anyone over and wants people to just talk about how cool his instruments were.

His responses to you show his personality - utterly ignorant and unwilling to hear or believe anything other than his viewpoint. Teling you that you should stay out because you have no dog in the fight? He's so full of crap...

edit: also, FYI - there are multiple guys with his name on WSJ but none of them are him.


----------



## SDMFVan

If anyone needs to get a hold of this Dave Cohen person to arrange for their full refund, his number is 516-503-4248.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

These are teenagers, and not grown adults. 
Right?
Right!?


----------



## BlackMastodon

Best of luck to all the guys involved in this never ending sh*tstorm. There's just so much to this that it's hard to comprehend. I still can't even believe that people are still jerking BRJ off after all the sh*t he's pulled... If there was another guy that was the cause of all this, you'd better believe that BRJ would've blamed him and threw him under the bus the second it happened, that's just par for course when it comes to him.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Why does anyone even still care about this? Is there no point where you guys value your sanity and time more than the money lost? This dude is gone, he isn't ....ing coming back. Come to terms with it.


----------



## feraledge

Jonathan20022 said:


> Why does anyone even still care about this? Is there no point where you guys value your sanity and time more than the money lost? This dude is gone, he isn't ....ing coming back. Come to terms with it.



So I'm guessing you missed the part where he's relaunching the brand?


----------



## asher

SDMFVan said:


> embarrassing stupidity



I really hope that Joe account is a sock puppet


----------



## Jonathan20022

feraledge said:


> So I'm guessing you missed the part where he's relaunching the brand?



Really? 100% Confirmation and .... we can see ourselves or just rumors sprouting up and a splash site saying coming soon? None of this is confirmed.

This is getting peoples hopes up for ....ing no reason. You can't believe everything you read on the internet, I thought we learned that from the random new accounts giving insider information in the past. But I guess lessons are learned the hard way.


----------



## asher

...how can this remotely be construed as "getting people's hopes up"?


----------



## Jonathan20022

How can it not? Do you guys know for a fact if this is happening or is this some contrived bull....?


----------



## Hollowway

Jonathan20022 said:


> Really? 100% Confirmation and .... we can see ourselves or just rumors sprouting up and a splash site saying coming soon? None of this is confirmed.
> 
> This is getting peoples hopes up for ....ing no reason. You can't believe everything you read on the internet, I thought we learned that from the random new accounts giving insider information in the past. But I guess lessons are learned the hard way.



Oh, no one is getting their hopes up and learning a hard lesson. I think what we're all doing is saying that if he relaunches we want to make sure everyone is aware of what went down in the first place. Effectively everyone has moved on. (Well, except for the BCR forum guys....) I know you don't want to talk about this stuff, but generally if I'm burned by someone I want to make sure my friends aren't burned in the same way. I think we're all pretty much just doing that.


----------



## watson503

Hollowway said:


> Oh, no one is getting their hopes up and learning a hard lesson. I think what we're all doing is saying that if he relaunches we want to make sure everyone is aware of what went down in the first place. Effectively everyone has moved on. (Well, except for the BCR forum guys....) I know you don't want to talk about this stuff, but generally if I'm burned by someone I want to make sure my friends aren't burned in the same way. I think we're all pretty much just doing that.



And that is what seems to be taking place, Cohen and his several cohorts are lining people up with their hands out for the next round by starting this "Where's Joe Donner" group on fb and deletion of any and all negative posts concerning BRJ since the BC Rich Junkies group's inception.


----------



## Jonathan20022

Yeah I've spread the word a ton myself, I convinced my friend to dip out and chargeback before it all went to .... but I know a lot of people didn't do that.

I'm mainly worried about other people thinking it's a good idea to reorder and for dudes who have been burned to take it with a grain of salt if there's even any possibility of getting cash or the guitars back.


----------



## mikernaut

Shame his painter Ed couldn't have helped get some of the info in order and get some of the guitars out the door to the rightful owners. Where's he workin these days?

Strangely enough while I was reading the new posts here I decided to google around and found a picture of my Red Jekyll7 on Pinterest that I have never seen. It appeared to have been taken in the shop before they shipped it out. Made me wonder who took that picture and who else worked at the shop who could have tried to help out during the mess. Did they not know the BRJ Titanic was sinking? get a bucket!


----------



## UnderTheSign

Holloway, considering you as a customer are apparently worthy of Daves response, have you gotten in touch with him?

Also lol @ "there are only about 30 customers still waiting for their guitar". That's a good wad of money we're talking there man...


----------



## Edika

I see Brian's comments are not there anymore and Mr. Fortune 500 claiming that Brian deleted them because he found out he was wrong. My comment went missing too and I haven't deleted it hahahaha. Really classy guy, reaaaaally classy.


----------



## downburst82

Yup he deleted mine as well or blocked me...whatever at least its crystal clear now he's up to no good.


----------



## flint757

If we're talking about the same person in that picture further up the page I wouldn't expect any real maturity in the first place. He sounds like a 12 year old going through puberty who just recently learned a bunch of curse words.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

WOW! Just WOW!


----------



## electriceye

When is that from??


----------



## downburst82

https://www.gofundme.com/chdkp3bs

An hour ago..


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Here's the .... talk ..... (WHAT A LOAD OF ....)

"The world we currently live in, mental illness, depression, anxiety, and severe stress are crippling disabilities affecting a number of families. Some are affected worse than others.
I would like to introduce my friend Bernie Rico Jr.... The son of Bernie Rico Sr, founder and name sake behind B.C. Rich Guitars. Bernie Jr. himself was a guitar builder following in his father&#8217;s footsteps with his own successful guitar company. He was a loving husband and father who had a happy marriage until his disabilities devastated the life he worked so hard to build.
The stress of day to day life and business became overwhelming which lead to anxiety. When the anxiety got too much to bear, it then turned into severe depression. As the situation grew worse, he watched the world around him crumble and was unable to stop it. He lost his family, and not long after, his company as well.
Over the course of the last 6 years fighting this disease, he was committed to in-patient treatment numerous times from suicide attempts . He did 5 short term treatments and 3 long term, each lasting many months. While undergoing treatment, individuals he felt were trustworthy took advantage of his situation by lying and stealing everything Bernie Jr ever owned. This included family photos, gifts from his father, the remainder of his business inventory, contacts, file cabinets, ledgers, all of his tools, even his clothes. Leaving Bernie Jr. with absolutely no means to an end. After years of fighting his illness he's doing all he can to pick up the pieces. Unfortunately, this is a battle he will continue to struggle with for the rest of his life.
I&#8217;m running this campaign in an effort to help my friend pay off some of his medical bills. At this point his bills are so high they are denying him critical treatment . Those of us who know him have seen his selfless nature, dedication to hard work, and his commitment to getting better . Though he has been left with nothing, I&#8217;ve still seen him give what little he has just to see another person smile. I would like to see him smiling and happy as well.
Bernie Jr. is dedicated to restoring his life. Unfortunately, as stated before... along with losing everything he owned, he accrued a very heavy debt as far as medical and treatment expenses are concerned. This is the last major obstacle standing between him and his future.
By no means do I think we are going to pay off all his medical bills, but I&#8217;d like to help him move forward and get accepted back into treatment. Any donation, no matter how big or how small, is warmly appreciated. I will be handling the donations and personally applying them to his debts so that anyone who stumbles upon this can be confident that the funds being raised are going exactly where we say they are.
If you have any questions or concerns about this campaign please feel free to message me and I will respond as quickly as possible. Thank you in advance for all your help, understanding, patience, and compassion."


----------



## Khoi

yeah........ I already donated $2000 to this guy


----------



## russmuller

I don't have a dog in this fight, so forgive me for posting in this thread, but if BRJ were serious about making whole the people who were wronged, he'd have done so privately. Why in the world would you re-launch your business with a parade of "someone else did it" and "I made mistakes, but you can trust me"? Wouldn't it be better to launch with "Bernie squared up everything with those who were put out, and now he's ready to move forward"? Then nobody would need to be convinced of anything, because the facts would speak for themselves.

I can't believe anyone would buy into this tripe, given how well the BRJ f*ckery has been documented. This whole Joe Donner thing reminds me of that third Tobey Maguire Spiderman flick. "Remember years ago when that guy killed your uncle Ben? Well it was actually this OTHER guy!" -.-

If the hunt for Jon Doe er..., Joe Donner had started a few years ago instead of right when Bernie decides to relaunch his business, and there was any kind of documentation to support these claims, then there might be a whiff of legitimacy to it. But honestly, where's the police report? Bernie was operating a business and all his stuff got stolen? Isn't that what insurance is for?

I don't doubt that Bernie has mental health issues, and the situation he put himself in surely would have made those things worse. But the guy needs to give up and do something else with his life. If his mental health is important, he shouldn't be trying to revive a career with a reputation so irreversibly tarnished.


----------



## SpaceDock

I just messaged the campaign creator about this.I really wish Bernie would acknowledge the problem and it wasn't always these third party people.


----------



## Rap Hat

Man, I don't even know what to think... This was the most stressful situation, lies after lies surrounded by untruths, and now the ....er might start up again, and is blaming someone else???

How much you want to bet only one or two guitars get sent out and Bernie claims everyone else is trying to scam him? I know a bunch of us have proof of payment, I have email communication too showing that I paid in full. But I wouldn't be surprised at all if Bernie tries to claim he had nothing to do with the emails or texts (even though he sent me selfies of him driving) and uses that to get out of what he owes. It wouldn't be the first time he's claimed customers are trying to scam him - I remember him threatening to keep someone's guitar and money because they went public with his lies, and he even told me during a phone call that he believed that person was working with KxK to ruin him (lololol).

E: I give him 8 months before he has another "breakdown" and scams the new batch of people, all the while blaming it on his old customers for "causing drama" and demanding their guitars.


----------



## feraledge

The ability for Bernie to continually find new lows is just absolutely shocking. What a scumbag.


----------



## JohnnyRich

watson503 said:


> And that is what seems to be taking place, Cohen and his several cohorts are lining people up with their hands out for the next round by starting this "Where's Joe Donner" group on fb and deletion of any and all negative posts concerning BRJ since the BC Rich Junkies group's inception.



we dont just delete negative posts about brj, we delete all negative post that cause problems, arguments or fights on our group pages so its not like the other guitar groups on the net and full of assholes. you people have no clue. you come on here and spout off all your assumptions and dont care whos name you drag through the mud. Dave Cohen is a friend of mine and is not the one who started the go fund me thing. he is not "Joe Donner" either. he is a fan of bc rich and related guitars that started the bc rich junkie so other fans can get together and discuss their passion for the brand. as far as who is running the bc rich custom shop and building the guitars, its not Bernie Jr.. the identity is not being reveled yet at the request of Gary Hanser. the info will be reveled soon.


----------



## BlackMastodon

JohnnyRich said:


> we dont just delete negative posts about brj, we delete all negative post that cause problems, arguments or fights on our group pages so its not like the other guitar groups on the net and full of assholes. *you people have no clue*. you come on here and spout off all your *assumptions *and dont care whos name you drag through the mud. Dave Cohen is a friend of mine and is not the one who started the go fund me thing. he is not "Joe Donner" either. he is a fan of bc rich and related guitars that started the bc rich junkie so other fans can get together and discuss their passion for the brand. as far as who is running the bc rich custom shop and building the guitars, its not Bernie Jr.. the identity is not being reveled yet at the request of Gary Hanser. the info will be reveled soon.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Yeah, I was about to say...

A lot of these people have dealings with BRJ and have lost several THOUSAND dollars because of this man. 

But no, it's all assumptions and BRJ is an innocent saint.


----------



## MetalDaze

Can't wait for the big *revel*


----------



## Axel_Blaze

MetalDaze said:


> Can't wait for the big *revel*



We shall revel in the big revel!


----------



## Edika

Imagine it turns out that Bernie doesn't have depression but schizophrenia and he actually IS Joe Donner!

Disclaimer: I'm not making fun of mental illness and I don't think depression is something trivial. However I do know people with severe depression that haven't run off with thousand of dollars and then using it as an excuse along with an imaginary boogie man to try and scam people for money. Having depression doesn't make you any less of thieving bastard.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

Edika said:


> Imagine it turns out that Bernie doesn't have depression but schizophrenia and he actually IS Joe Donner!
> 
> Disclaimer: I'm not making fun of mental illness and I don't think depression is something trivial. However I do know people with severe depression that haven't run off with thousand of dollars and then using it as an excuse along with an imaginary boogie man to try and scam people for money. Having depression doesn't make you any less of thieving bastard.


----------



## Andromalia

That guy is not mentally ill, he's a scam artist.


----------



## SpaceDock

As someone who is still owed a guitar, I will play along. They are having me contact the Joe Donner page, let's see where this goes. I've got nothing to lose.


----------



## Edika

Axel_Blaze said:


>



I actually had that in mind when posting! Cheers


----------



## Axel_Blaze

SpaceDock said:


> As someone who is still owed a guitar, I will play along. They are having me contact the Joe Donner page, let's see where this goes. I've got nothing to lose.



Be prepared for a whole lot of "All will be revealed soon" schtick


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

> Where's Joe Donner
> 17 hrs ·
> lol i was just on 7 string .org and i gotta say those guys are real morons . @ Dave Cohen from B.C.Rich Junkies im sorry they think im you, feel free to contact me .




https://www.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/



edit: not sure how to attach the actual fb post, so i just copied the text. maybe someone can do that so we have a record of it.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

Edika said:


> I actually had that in mind when posting! Cheers



It's what I do


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

M3CHK1LLA said:


> https://www.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/
> 
> 
> 
> edit: not sure how to attach the actual fb post, so i just copied the text. maybe someone can do that so we have a record of it.




Oh yes, Joe Donner will fix everyone's problems.


----------



## feraledge

M3CHK1LLA said:


> https://www.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/
> 
> 
> 
> edit: not sure how to attach the actual fb post, so i just copied the text. maybe someone can do that so we have a record of it.



That's a compelling case. Bernie was ripped off and just hurt so bad by this P.O.S. scumbag and absolutely real person that no one who was "ripped off by Bernie" has a right to even talk about it. I mean all these a holes on SSO who _think_ giving money for goods that weren't delivered constitutes being ripped off by the guy who took the money and said he would deliver the goods are clearly the morons, right?

Let's go down the rabbit hole for a second. Even if an ounce of this was true, which it obviously isn't (despite the fact that truth usually has a five year incubation time), if a douche bag like this: 




has access to your stuff, then you need to be held accountable for that. 
Because, for real, this dude is like a Trailer Park Boys reject coke dealer, RV and all.


----------



## BlackMastodon

M3CHK1LLA said:


> https://www.facebook.com/Wheres-Joe-Donner-1078971508809972/
> 
> 
> 
> edit: not sure how to attach the actual fb post, so i just copied the text. maybe someone can do that so we have a record of it.


I think we hurt his feelings, guys. 
Guess we should know what we're talking about in this 207 page thread about peoples' personal experience in the matter.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Yeah, sure looks like the guy has a Phd


----------



## feraledge

It seems shockingly appropriate that this imaginary enemy shares the last name with a party of pioneers who got lost so long that they started to eat each other.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

I'm going to call bulls**t on this after reading his posts. The guy is utterly clueless about Bernie's dealings even before the Black Friday sale and is just feigning ignorance whenever he is presented with facts and proof of undelivered guitars.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

Lorcan Ward said:


> I'm going to call bulls**t on this after reading his posts. The guy is utterly clueless about Bernie's dealings even before the Black Friday sale and is just feigning ignorance whenever he is presented with facts and proof of undelivered guitars.


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

This from Cohen ......... "I have email and text convos between Jr and Joe where he admits stealing everything. We have a lawyer involved going over every inch and going after Joe. As soon as he says it cool to make it all public I will . how could Jr Rob people from the hospital ? All the orders , emails , and PayPal receipts are all time/date stamped . his 8 hospital stays are documented . it's funny how they all match . Joe Donner still has just about everything . like I said the whole truth will come out SOON . also we are actively trying to pay all that's owed back but you wouldn't know or care about that . also it's only 30-60 people TOTAL that are owed."


----------



## xCaptainx

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> also it's only 30-60 people TOTAL that are owed."



Ok cool so only $60,000 to $120,000 of peoples money that he stole. 

That's cool, hey guys? Everyone ok with that? Can we continue the hunt for the mysterious stranger? Guys? Guys?


----------



## Tesla

If it's only 30-60 then there's no excuse for his wife or whoever to take an evening and contact these people before it got so out of hand and at least shed some light on the matter. So that's either a lie, or they had no intentions of righting the wrong at all.


----------



## feraledge

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> This from Cohen ......... "*also it's only 30-60 people TOTAL that are owed.*"


----------



## flint757

Is it 30 or 60? Kind of a big difference between the two.


----------



## asher

feraledge said:


> It seems shockingly appropriate that this imaginary enemy shares the last name with a party of pioneers who got lost so long that they started to eat each other.



I know right? I mean, if they ate each other, how did the name get passed along?

(sorry, I'll see myself out)


----------



## Edika

I thought Bernie took about 200-300 orders for Black Friday and delivered maybe 10-30 of those .


----------



## Axel_Blaze

slayercannibalsuffohead said:


> it's only 30-60 people TOTAL that are owed."



[sarcasm] Phew! That makes me feel so much better about this whole situation! See guys? It's not that bad. It's only an arbitrary ballpark figure that still equals quite a bit of money, but still! [/sarcasm]  

Way for this Cohen guy to conduct damage control AFTER the nukes fell!


----------



## Edika

Axel_Blaze said:


> [sarcasm] Phew! That makes me feel so much better about this whole situation! See guys? It's not that bad. It's only an arbitrary ballpark figure that still equals quite a bit of money, but still! [/sarcasm]
> 
> Way for this Cohen guy to conduct damage control AFTER the nukes fell!








Time to return the favor !


----------



## Axel_Blaze

Edika said:


> Time to return the favor !



You. I like you. I think we're gonna get along just fine.


----------



## canuck brian

flint757 said:


> Is it 30 or 60? Kind of a big difference between the two.



Oh weird. When i was talking to him, it was only 30 and they'd already contacted him.

Mind you, this is the guy that said the following:

Between 40-45 years of age
PhD Mechanical Engineering
*sold* 3 Fortune 500 companies
"successful career in sales"
uses the word "bro" a lot and has the spelling capacity of a sophomore high school student.
He knows of Holloways' guitar in my possession and apparently it was in the scrap heap...with a matched case...and pickups...

Oddly doesn't know what those 3 Fortune 500 companies that he sold use as their stock identity on the NYSE and doesn't understand that I'd be able to find someone who did that on Forbes or the Economist's website. He's also not really up on the notion of time considering how much time the PhD alone would take to obtain if he wasn't lying thru his teeth. 

He might want to look into the legal ramifications of letting information from a private case public in an attempt to publically shame someone that hasn't had a single legal action taken against them. There's also the impact upon the case itself, but i wouldn't expect someone who ran and eventually sold 3 fortune 500 companies to understand the legalities of business. /s

If everyone here got the identity wrong as Dave Cohen, it's only because whoever the admin for the JD page is also a BRJ apologist with a similar limited vocabulary. The admin for the page though does seem to have a limited ability to read though with all the evidence direct from BRJ showing that he's a thief explicitly on display thru this entire thread.

Also - "We have admission of guilt on file from Joe admitting to everything. We're not gonna show you this until we go public, BUT HE BE A BAD MAN." You should probably call the cops. You know, like you should have 5 years ago when this apparently happened.


----------



## SpaceDock

The Where is Joe Donner people won't even reply to my multiple messages, same .... different name. How many times have we done this? They say they will change, they say they will fix the problems, in the end they want your money and will deny all contact after they have it.


----------



## Rap Hat

Tesla said:


> If it's only 30-60 then there's no excuse for his wife or whoever to take an evening and contact these people before it got so out of hand and at least shed some light on the matter. So that's either a lie, or they had no intentions of righting the wrong at all.



Well, there was also the times people here were in contact with Bernie's wife well after the first two hospitalizations, and IIRC she at first said she had some guitars in her possession, then something about the shop's HVAC system dying and a bunch being ruined, and I don't know what else.

And how does this even account for the fact that when Bernie said my guitar was finished and I paid, then nothing for months, then I talked to him on the phone and he was making up excuses as to what was going on, then a final email asking for payment, and when I pointed out I paid nothing? Am I supposed to believe that during this time, when some people were STILL receiving guitars, that somehow this dude managed to only steal mine and hijack my communication with Bernie? Or what?

I don't even understand what this person is trying to claim. I'm going to go with my gut and say it's another Bernie freakout/meltdown under another name to try to quell the constant flames. If it's not, great, show some proof. But they won't, just like the last dozen times this has happened.

To Bernie's family he's probably the greatest guy and the fact that he just cant seem to catch a break from all these whiny "customers" must seem grievously unfair. But he scammed at least 60k, up to double, from a bunch of different people. If he can't make it right, he doesn't deserve to just move on and re-open shop no matter how serious his psych issues are. And from literally everything we've seen over the past five or six years, the man *cannot* take responsibility.


*note: I'm more than willing to eat my words if something actually happened. This isn't a personal vendetta, not some crusade to ruin an innocent man's business or whatever. But I've been directly lied to from Bernie himself, and so have a bunch of other people here. I paid him a lot of money for a guitar he told me was complete. But since I never got the guitar or the money back and only got progressively more insane excuses from the Rico camp, I will trust my own experience over more "I'm totally not Bernie I swear" nonsense.

E: I can't help but harp on the "only" 30-60 customers. That could easily and realistically reach 100,000 US dollars. That's an assload of money and definitely not something to just brush aside. The only people that see that number and think "that's nothing" are children, spoiled rich people, and Bernie Rico Jr. No amount of justification will make that number less impactful and the people that try come off looking like the biggest out of touch assholes ever.

e2: And I never contacted anyone who claimed to be able to do something about it besides Bernie (and my bank, and my CC company, and local police). So anyone claiming they're in contact with all of the scammed customers is lying.


----------



## Emperoff

I was a former BRJ customer, but decided to cancel my order after the SECOND rebuild. I got a really bad feeling, because no matter how busy you are, if you have to rebuild a guitar twice when you have all the specs clearly written in an e-mail, with pictures, etc. Something wrong is definetely happening.

I sold my "spot" to somewhere else in here, but I don't know if he managed to get his guitar, sold it as well, etc. I was lucky enough to get out of the sh*tstorm in time, but I've done my share since then to badmouth this company.

Now that he's relaunching it (¿?), I'll continue doing that. It's the least I can do in solidarity for my "fallen comrades". Starting a funding campaign for 15000$ after ripping out around 100-150k is not only the icing on the cake, but also just vile.


----------



## MetalDaze

Any Bernie sightings at NAMM?


----------



## Cold_Aeon

MetalDaze said:


> Any Bernie sightings at NAMM?


he was there


----------



## UnderTheSign

Yup. Bcr junkies is hailing him as a brother and the new saviour


----------



## axolotls

https://www.facebook.com/BCRichGuit...07882511013/10153752772416014/?type=3&theater


----------



## Jake

axolotls said:


> https://www.facebook.com/BCRichGuit...07882511013/10153752772416014/?type=3&theater



Jesus fvcking Christ I hate this guy so much and I didn't even get ripped off


----------



## Hachetjoel

I never bought a guitar from him but I've read every post on this thread and the fact that he's walking around at NAMM make me sick.


----------



## Qweklain

MetalDaze said:


> Any Bernie sightings at NAMM?





Cold_Aeon said:


> he was there


https://www.facebook.com/BCRichGuit...07882511013/10153752772416014/?type=3&theater


----------



## UnderTheSign

Oh boy... This is gonna be interesting to see play out. They're still doing the Joe Donner story yet no one has seen a shred of evidence or a cent of their money?


----------



## Axel_Blaze

MetalDaze said:


> Any Bernie sightings at NAMM?





Cold_Aeon said:


> he was there




... and NO ONE punched him?


----------



## Edika

Bernie sure has balls. I don't know for how much longer though.


----------



## mikernaut

and BC Rich deleted his pic they posted on their Facebook hmmm, I can't believe he showed his face at NAMM.

https://www.gofundme.com/vdg8s5yk

Wow that description!


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

axolotls said:


> https://www.facebook.com/BCRichGuit...07882511013/10153752772416014/?type=3&theater








> Sorry, this content isn't available right now
> The link you followed may have expired, or the page may only be visible to an audience you're not in.


----------



## xCaptainx

A NAMM interview with the thief himself. 

On mobile so haven't watched it yet. Posting for later. 


https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=FT9UwZOTLY4


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

^Tone King was BFFs with Ed Roman, so I'm not surprised. 

I can't respect this dude. Giving legitimacy to two well-known ....s like this.


----------



## Cold_Aeon

Axel_Blaze said:


> ... and NO ONE punched him?



Looks like all of those who wanna do that were very busy by posting messages on forums


----------



## Tesla

Neither of those links work anymore.

EDIT: 666th post \m/ SATAAAAAAAAN etc.


----------



## ikarus

Qweklain said:


> https://www.facebook.com/BCRichGuit...07882511013/10153752772416014/?type=3&theater



Can anybody post a screenshot of that? I can't see the content because i am not in the group...


----------



## UnderTheSign

ikarus said:


> Can anybody post a screenshot of that? I can't see the content because i am not in the group...



It's a photo on the bcr page that was later deleted.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

ikarus said:


> Can anybody post a screenshot of that? I can't see the content because i am not in the group...



It was just a picture of Bernie Rico at the BCR booth holding one of their Waves.


----------



## xCaptainx

xCaptainx said:


> A NAMM interview with the thief himself.
> 
> On mobile so haven't watched it yet. Posting for later.
> 
> 
> https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=FT9UwZOTLY4



And the video is now private. 

There was obviously quite a lot of anger in the youtube comments. Someone asked The Tone King if he knew about all the BRJ drama before posting the video. He replied that he did not.


----------



## SpaceDock

If Bernie thinks he can resurface without ramifications he is wrong. People don't let things like this go so easily.


----------



## will_shred

I don't have any stake in this thing, but every time I come back to this thread i'm kind of amazed at how the plot seems to get more and more convoluted as time goes on. Just how low will one man go in order to avoid taking responsibility for his .... up? stay tuned to find out!


----------



## jeremyb

This one is still available!


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

thought id copy & paste the comments from the brj namm vid before its deleted...




> Published on Jan 23, 2016
> An amazing opportunity to meet up w Bernie Rico Jr! Right at the BC Rich booth. Bernie is looking great, and is super stoked about the new BC Rich line-up! Happy to have the opportunity to talk shop w him! LIVE from Winter NAMM 2016! Enjoy, SUBSCRIBE & CONNECT
> &#9658; Subscribe: http://bit.ly/18W2CYq





circle skate 1 minute ago
@thetoneking

it seems you are not aware why there is a lot of anger over brj guitars...please take the time to read this thread that started back in nov. 2010 and it may shead some light on things. it documents the infamous brj black friday sale. thanks

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...d-only-updates-customers-ad-free.html&#65279;
Read more
Reply · 


Chad Neville 16 hours ago
Glad you're super excited to interview someone who stole $20,000 from me and never delivered guitars to a massive number of paying customers. 
Maybe you should interview S7G next.&#65279;
Reply · 1 


The Tone King 8 hours ago
How was I supposed t know he owes you $20k. You write the comment like I know your business.&#65279;
Reply · 2 


eric dye 1 day ago
PUNCH HIM IN THE FACE!!!!!!&#65279;
Reply · 6 


Dat D. Nguyen (SirZozzo) 1 day ago
Somebody call the police !&#65279;
Reply · 9 


daniel molina 7 hours ago
Tone king you are a cool man. Please do not relate to such piece of ..... It disgust me he can freely walk around NAMM, someone should put that man in jail. F*cking scammer.&#65279;
Reply · 3 


alonehades100 1 day ago
-yeah
-yeah
-yeah

haha that was cool. like the new guitars&#65279;
Reply · 1 


Tim shufflebottom 1 day ago
lmao this ....wit owes a lot people a lot of money.&#65279;
Reply · 10 


Judson Wall 1 day ago
Honest question to The Tone King...are you aware of the amount of money he has stolen from people?&#65279;
Reply · 3 

View all 8 replies 

Bryan Hopkins 1 day ago
+Judson Wall thanks. Horrible.&#65279;
Reply · 


Patrick Small 1 day ago
i don't know. i only heard about all of this drama after the fact. there is a HUGE post detailing all of this drama at sevenstring.org, since that's where the majority of the orders came from. But honestly that doesn't excuse people having that much money stolen from them with no refund or recourse.&#65279;
Reply · 


Ross McDougall 1 day ago
'Slowly but surely getting back into it' 

AKA getting back into stealing money, not responding to customers, losing guitars, reselling guitars people have already paid for. Congrats on ruining the Bernie Rico name!&#65279;
Reply · 8 


Patrick Small 1 day ago (edited)
+Ross McDougall there are already a bunch of djent kids saying "hey you dont know the full story give the guy a chance"...anybody who would be stupid enough to order a guitar from him after the Black Friday cluster.... deserves to have their money stolen, honestly, especially with how well that whole thing was documented.&#65279;
Reply · 1 


Ross McDougall 1 day ago
I agree. The sheer audacity of him turning up after years of silence and broken promises is staggering! &#65279;
Reply · 2 


Jeffrey Cheng 1 day ago
'doing good'
seriously what the actual ....?&#65279;
Reply · 4 


Dante DMC 1 day ago
Str8 up criminal.&#65279;
Reply · 4 


Fizz n Sprinklez 7 hours ago
kick him in the throat!!!&#65279;
Reply · 


Solid|Ranger 23 hours ago
wow! I knew I had to see this video. Holy crap... TK hide your pockets.&#65279;
Reply · 1 


mehtabb1 18 hours ago
Good job promoting this scammer. He stole over $20,000 from my friends...&#65279;
Reply · 1 


Blake Bagnell 1 day ago
Rico needs to give people their money back before he even shows up at namm.&#65279;
Reply · 4 


jim leiss 1 day ago
Wow, uhm,wow!&#65279;
Reply · 1 


Zachary Patten 18 hours ago
what a douche canoe, honestly i'm surprised his ass didn't get jumped leaving NAMM, there are a large amount of pissed off musicians because of this guy&#65279;
Reply · 1 


Patrick Small 1 day ago
He's got some big balls coming to an event where probably 95% of the people that know who he is are probably ready to kick the .... out of him for running off with their money&#65279;
Reply · 8 


Ubermax 23 hours ago
Lol this is like Sean Penn interviewing the el chapo of guitars. I hope he gets arrested now. So funny the dude's worshipping him completely unaware he's such a ....ing thief&#65279;
Reply · 


pisyakot 17 hours ago
dat cow&#65279;
Reply · 


andrew hollowway 1 day ago
Yeah, i sincerely hope he has plans to pay everyone back who gave him money and never received their guitars. Otherwise I honestly don't know who would give him money. Or let him live it down.&#65279;
Reply · 3 


RunawayThumbtack 1 day ago
Well, this is something I never thought I'd see.&#65279;


----------



## slayercannibalsuffohead

Poor ol' sick Bernie, looking all sick and that! What a lowlife! Great stunt from BCR too! Seeing as Dave Cohen is "manager" of the BCR CS, I presume he invited his little rat bastard mate along!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

The Tone King has an account here. It's BS that he's pulling the ignorance card. He seems to find every thread he's mentioned on here, so he has lurked.


----------



## CaptainD00M

*Gets popcorn*

This is even more exciting than S7G turning up last year at NAMM.


----------



## SpaceDock

I get that Bernie wants to move on and try to rebuild his image, there is little other reason for him to be at namm. However, the pseudo guitar celebrities will not be the people financing his return, it will be normal consumers like you and me. Therefor it makes no sense to me that he is trying to win KK and TK over, he needs to make right with his actual consumer base. 

To reiterate, bernie still doesn't understand business.


----------



## Mathemagician

So someone who stole tens of thousands from a rough estimate of ~60-100 people, can walk around with no warrant/arrest? Is it because of California law that protects "businesses that fail" to a ridiculous degree or something? Holy .... I can't imagine him not being punched.


----------



## BlackMastodon

The one positive I see from this is that people aren't letting him live it down in that YouTube comments section. After the sh*tshow that was the Facebook group looking for...whatever the hell name they made up...I thought all hope was lost. Not to say this will actually make anything happen, just saying, it's good to see people not forgetting.

The North remembers.


----------



## Axel_Blaze

M3CHK1LLA said:


> eric dye 1 day ago
> PUNCH HIM IN THE FACE!!!!!!&#65279;
> Reply · 6
> 
> &#65279;



Eric Dye for President 2016!


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

^ glad i copied and pasted that...

went to see todays comments and it says "this video is private"


----------



## Mathemagician

Also, off topic, but for a channel called "The Tone King" a lot of their videos have absolutely .... tone. Just saying. 

Conspiracy? ...Maybe. 

Most likely yes.


----------



## 1HB

Did he really think people wudnt recognize him without his facial hair?


----------



## pondman

1HB said:


> Did he really think people wudnt recognize him without his facial hair?



From watching that vid he obviously doesn't give a f*ck and that's how all this started in the first place. He wont stop until he's in a box.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Mathemagician said:


> Also, off topic, but for a channel called "The Tone King" a lot of their videos have absolutely .... tone. Just saying.
> 
> Conspiracy? ...Maybe.
> 
> Most likely yes.


Well... That tone is what he's known for, Lord knows why


----------



## clubshred

I was playing in the Mission Engineering booth for the show and I wasn't that far from BC Rich. I never saw him and I don't know if I could have contained myself from calling that prick out. I think it's repulsive that he had the balls to show up there.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

The nerve of that guy is astounding. He deserves a full force throat punch for ripping people off. I can't stand scammers and people think that giving it time will make others forget what happened. I don't know if threads ever expire or whatever, but I hope this thread is never deleted. It needs backed up and preserved long after the thread is dead and gone, as well as us and the scumbag whom ripped everyone off. Why? To serve as a warning to others not to get tricked by some douche asshole to give them tons of money only to have that person pocket it and leave everyone else holding the bag because of their .... ups and .... business practices.


----------



## jwade

I don't know how it works in the U.S, but wouldn't a 'citizens arrest' be a possibility now? I mean if he's showing up in public again...


----------



## MaxOfMetal

jwade said:


> I don't know how it works in the U.S, but wouldn't a 'citizens arrest' be a possibility now? I mean if he's showing up in public again...


 
That's not at all how it works. 

What would he be held on? He's not actively committing a crime, and there's no standing arrest warrant. 

This would have been a great opportunity to serve him with papers, but that's it.


----------



## RUSH_Of_Excitement

Wait question... How did he not get jailed? sorry, I'm new here


----------



## MaxOfMetal

RUSH_Of_Excitement said:


> Wait question... How did he not get jailed? sorry, I'm new here



Long story short: him and his merry band of d-bags were able to hold off on folks taking legal recourse until he was already in hiding coupled with the fact that those who were scammed were all around the world and couldn't easily join together to form a stronger, valid legal case.


----------



## Cold_Aeon

Stunning Vintage Bernie Rico Jr Custom Jekyll 7 String Electric Guitar RARE | eBay

Without case and not signed headstock. No serial on the fretboard as well. Looks like was sold not completed, ist it?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Cold_Aeon said:


> Stunning Vintage Bernie Rico Jr Custom Jekyll 7 String Electric Guitar RARE | eBay
> 
> Without case and not signed headstock. No serial on the fretboard as well. Looks like was sold not completed, ist it?



Obvious, crappy fake.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

> Neck: Straight



How does it compare to a maple neck?


----------



## Chokey Chicken

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> How does it compare to a maple neck?



Quality.


What kind of quality? Oh ho ho, that's for whoever buys it to find out.

Also, .... the tone king for not addressing the only thing that matters when it comes to this hack. Late to the party, but that .... is nauseating.


----------



## wannabguitarist

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> How does it compare to a maple neck?



Doesn't like it in the butt


----------



## asher

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> How does it compare to a maple neck?



Are we talking flam(ing)ed or that funky curly sh1t?

_lo, how I wish this forum had strikeouts_


----------



## feraledge

> Strings: No Buzz









$3500. Awesome, I hope the background conversation was, "you really think we can get that for this piece of crap?" "You should see how much this dude scammed people for, we're good."


----------



## pondman

That is a fake. I bought one a few years ago on a whim  http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/sevenstring-guitars/241565-ngd.html
I managed to get it playable but it was never quite right. I found the neck had a mind of its own so gave up and sold it for £380.


----------



## Hollowway

Him: Alright, Mr. Hollowway, one final question: If you could go to lunch with anyone, living or dead, who would it be, and why?

Me: PONDMAN! I wanna go to lunch with Pondman! (wipes accidental drool off chin.) Because he's AWESOME! He builds awesome guitars, and every once in a while, he'll take one for the team, and buy a guitar we're all wondering about, and see if it's legit! 

Him: Pondman? You're not interested in meeting Bill Gates, or the Dalai Lama?

Me: Wait, do they build guitars, too?


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

Hollowway said:


> Him: Alright, Mr. Hollowway, one final question: If you could go to lunch with anyone, living or dead, who would it be, and why?
> ...




when i read this i thought you were gonna say brj so you could punch him in the throat


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

saw this ad...

Bernie Rico jr. Unfinished custom 7string


----------



## Tesla

I'm not savvy with Craigslist, but where are the pictures? He says to look at them but I'm just getting a mostly empty page with some text.


----------



## wannabguitarist

Tesla said:


> I'm not savvy with Craigslist, but where are the pictures? He says to look at them but I'm just getting a mostly empty page with some text.



I got them:

















I'll be honest-it was cheap enough to consider buying and finishing myself but I can't stand that inlay. Did anyone here order that? I'll be in this guy's area at the end of the month so I can play middle man if someone wants to recover their guitar.

EDIT: Apparently this guy is a friend of Bernie's and received this unfinished guitar as payment for business services? He said there were three made and none were finished.


----------



## BlackMastodon

I remember seeing one of the members here ordering BRJs with those inlays before, not sure if they still come around or not.


----------



## wannabguitarist

Beyond it being ugly he spelled zombie wrong 

Shame because it's a gorgeous guitar and I've been looking for a project.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

wannabguitarist said:


> Beyond it being ugly he spelled zombie wrong



Looks like they miscalculated the amount of frets needed to spell zombie.


----------



## SDMFVan




----------



## Arkeion

So at what point in this thread does .... start hitting the fan? I'm a little ignorant to the whole fiasco, I just know he royally screwed people out of tons of money. Help!


----------



## Tesla

Arkeion said:


> So at what point in this thread does .... start hitting the fan? I'm a little ignorant to the whole fiasco, I just know he royally screwed people out of tons of money. Help!



It probably won't.


----------



## Hollowway

Based on this guitar's build thread, either there was a duplicate of this guitar, or this guitar is inherently flawed (read the other thread) or BRJ took this guy's guitar and gave it to someone else 5 years ago. And it also sounds like this Adam guy is a total scammer anyway, so...

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/lu...ustom-bernie-rico-jr-hesperian-slant-top.html


----------



## SpaceDock

Omg, from the original thread you can see this is the rebuild! That's at least three zombi piece of crap guitars floating around. Bernies lack if attention destroyed him.


----------



## wannabguitarist

SpaceDock said:


> Omg, from the original thread you can see this is the rebuild! That's at least three zombi piece of crap guitars floating around. Bernies lack if attention destroyed him.



Found the guy on FB and sent him a message. Regardless of the scam accusations this guy should know his unfinished guitar is out in SoCal


----------



## MrWulf

I wonder if anyone can redo an inlay on a guitar. That inlay looks as enticing as a dog's ass.


----------



## Tesla

MrWulf said:


> I wonder if anyone can redo an inlay on a guitar. That inlay looks as enticing as a dog's ass.



I dunno, my dog tells me they smell pretty good.


----------



## Hollowway

wannabguitarist said:


> Found the guy on FB and sent him a message. Regardless of the scam accusations this guy should know his unfinished guitar is out in SoCal



Ah, nice work. Hopefully he makes contact. I'd like to see people not getting much money for these so there's not much motivation to sell them.


----------



## 77zark77

Zombies eat brains - This explains that


----------



## glassmoon0fo

Cannot BELIEVE this .... is still going on. I can believe even less that I ever once went to bat for this prick.


----------



## Spaced Out Ace

Sorry, but I gotta facepalm at those that didn't know the inlays were a reference to Lucio Fulci's "sequel" to the Italian cut of Dawn of the Dead. 



SpaceDock said:


> Omg, from the original thread you can see this is the rebuild! That's at least three zombi piece of crap guitars floating around. Bernies lack if attention destroyed him.





It's supposed to be "Zombi". It's a Lucio Fulci film, meant to be spelled sans the E, because it's an Italian film. Sheesh.

I think it looks uglier than the inbreds in Wrong Turn and all of it's sequels, but still.

To make it clearer though, there is NOT supposed to be an E.


----------



## mnemonic

Still ugly though.


----------



## SpaceDock

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Sorry, but I gotta facepalm at those that didn't know the inlays were a reference to Lucio Fulci's "sequel" to the Italian cut of Dawn of the Dead.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's supposed to be "Zombi". It's a Lucio Fulci film, meant to be spelled sans the E, because it's an Italian film. Sheesh.
> 
> I think it looks uglier than the inbreds in Wrong Turn and all of it's sequels, but still.
> 
> To make it clearer though, there is NOT supposed to be an E.



I'm not commenting on the spelling, but the three rebuilds.


----------



## Tesla

Spaced Out Ace said:


> Sorry, but I gotta facepalm at those that didn't know the inlays were a reference to Lucio Fulci's "sequel" to the Italian cut of Dawn of the Dead.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's supposed to be "Zombi". It's a Lucio Fulci film, meant to be spelled sans the E, because it's an Italian film. Sheesh.
> 
> I think it looks uglier than the inbreds in Wrong Turn and all of it's sequels, but still.
> 
> To make it clearer though, there is NOT supposed to be an E.



I hope you don't take life as seriously as you take the internet.


----------



## UnderTheSign

Guess what.
Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars

By the way, has anything ever come from that Joe Donner Facebook page or was that just a way to divert attention from Bernie before his return?


----------



## MaxOfMetal

UnderTheSign said:


> Guess what.
> Bernie Rico Jr. Guitars
> 
> By the way, has anything ever come from that Joe Donner Facebook page or was that just a way to divert attention from Bernie before his return?



Case of beer (if local) or a t-shirt to the best Photoshop of that photo. 

Do your worst.


----------



## BIG ND SWEATY

Do I win?


----------



## Hywel

All credit to BIG ND SWEATY for the idea.


----------



## Tesla




----------



## SpaceDock

This really does need to be a contest, I am loving this!


----------



## MaxOfMetal

SpaceDock said:


> This really does need to be a contest, I am loving this!



I wasn't kidding.


----------



## Captain Butterscotch

Tesla said:


> funny 'shoop


----------



## feraledge




----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

EDIT:



feraledge said:


>



It took me a second to get this one.


----------



## feraledge

^ In all fairness, a cheap Chinese copy of a BRJ will actually arrive if you order it.


----------



## Serratus

Seems legit


----------



## Randy

Bernie Rico Jr Jekyl 724 Blank/Unfinished

http://reverb.com/item/2149529-bernie-rico-jr-jekyl-724-blank-unfinished


----------



## ASoC

I have no horse in the race (thank god) but I've been following this thread since I joined the forum 4 years ago and I'm seriously surprised that nobody assaulted Bernie at NAMM. Keep fighting the good fight guys, this dirtbag will get his eventually. You can only go on stealing for so long until you piss off the wrong guy.


----------



## Hollowway

I just messaged the seller and explained that this is likely one of the stolen instruments. It's debatable who stole them, but they are definitely not acquired legitimately.


----------



## Randy

Hollowway said:


> I just messaged the seller and explained that this is likely one of the stolen instruments. It's debatable who stole them, but they are definitely not acquired legitimately.



Slippery. I'm going to guess BRJ lost the factory in either a foreclosure, bankruptcy or just flat out sold it off to get out from under it, and all the unfinished guitars were sold/auctioned off.

The legality of selling off half finished builds, I don't know and if illegal, whos guilty of selling said stolen goods (especially if it were via foreclosure or bankruptcy sale) I don't know either.

I'd say we'd be better served getting what info we can rather than scaring this guy off and losing another year+ on putting the puzzle together.


----------



## technomancer

If they were liquidated as part of bankruptcy, seized by a landlord for back rent, etc etc they're not stolen...


----------



## Randy

Which, considering the theme was that Bernie was screwing everyone over, that likely also included his landlord/creditors and is the most likely thing that happened.


----------



## pondman

In short he's a complete c*nt.


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

wonder if sso could hire a private detective to solve this mystery of what really happened?


----------



## Tesla

M3CHK1LLA said:


> wonder if sso could hire a private detective to solve this mystery of what really happened?



That was spoken about quite a bit earlier in the thread but nothing came of it in the end.


----------



## Rev2010

M3CHK1LLA said:


> wonder if sso could hire a private detective to solve this mystery of what really happened?



Might look a little something like this:


----------



## BlackMastodon

Jinkies!


----------



## jeremyb

Comedy gold!


----------



## Rev2010

jeremyb said:


> Comedy gold!



Why thank you! I had to work OT yesterday just to be present for a 3rd party's technicians to do some work. Had absolutely nothing to do so I scrapped that together in GIMP to pass a few minutes time 


Rev.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands

Max, just send Rev the case of beer.He wins with that picture.


----------



## M3CHK1LLA

awesome meme

brj: "...and i would have gotten away with it if it weren't for those darn sso djent kids!"



Rev2010 said:


> Might look a little something like this:


----------



## feraledge

M3CHK1LLA said:


> awesome meme
> 
> brj: "...and i would have gotten away with it if it weren't for those darn sso djent kids!"



I laughed at this post and then got really bummed because he's totally getting away with it. What a serious dick.


----------



## Ram150023

a full 3 weeks reading this ENTIRE thread start to... Well... This point... Never gonna see a "finish".

Unbelieveable. Despicable. Flat out evil. My sincerest condolences.


----------



## Randy

Randy said:


> Bernie Rico Jr Jekyl 724 Blank/Unfinished
> 
> http://reverb.com/item/2149529-bernie-rico-jr-jekyl-724-blank-unfinished



Original listing got switched completely and this new one went up with the word "replica" in the title and no more mention of the BRJ factory closing in the description, hmmm

https://reverb.com/item/2150433-bernie-rico-jr-jekyll-724-replica-unfinished-blank-neck-thru-body


----------



## MetalDaze

This thread is no longer sticky.


----------



## big_aug

Wow, I remember when BRJ guitars were all the rage on this forum a few years back and them whole scam. I can't believe this is still going on.


----------



## stevexc

MetalDaze said:


> This thread is no longer sticky.



Now it's just kinda crusty.


----------



## Randy

MetalDaze said:


> This thread is no longer sticky.



That was my doing. If we stickied every "I got screwed by a luthier thread" this site would be nothing but those. The thread no longer has the same value it did when it was new or being updated regularly. If someone wants to know about BRJ or what happened, google or the search function on here will point them in the right direction.


----------



## CaptainD00M

stevexc said:


> Now it's just kinda crusty.



Thats what she said


----------



## big_aug

Sso get paid off by BRJ to burry this thread? He has a new website and this becomes unstickied all around the same time? Coincidence?


----------



## Randy

big_aug said:


> Sso get paid off by BRJ to burry this thread? He has a new website and this becomes unstickied all around the same time? Coincidence?



Also, jet fuel can't melt steel beams.


----------



## big_aug

Randy said:


> Also, jet fuel can't melt steel beams.


----------



## stevexc

big_aug said:


> Sso get paid off by BRJ to burry this thread? He has a new website and this becomes unstickied all around the same time? Coincidence?



If Bernie could afford to bury his reputation he wouldn't be in this mess in the first place.


----------



## InfinityCollision

Yeah, that worked really well for UC Davis didn't it?


----------



## Randy

stevexc said:


> If Bernie could afford to bury his reputation he wouldn't be in this mess in the first place.



For the record, I unstickied it for the OPPOSITE reason. I thought the posting of an unfinished BRJ in SoCal with the initial description that MENTIONED all the drama with Bernie was significant and yet the view/post count remained low. On re-looking at things, I got the feeling a lot of people figured the thread was dead and after it was no longer "the latest post" in this subforum (thus, no longer showing up on the SSO.com/forum landing page), the only way anybody would see this thread was bumped is by looking in the stickies, which people don't seem to do.

Being unstickied, if other threads get bumped after this one, you go to the luthier subforum and you at least see this thread has recently been active because it's listed only two or three threads down. After all the conversation over the latest developments has settled, this will disappear from the frontpage and people can go back to finding it via Google or however else they're usually finding it.

Stickies are more appropriate for beginner stuff and subforum related rules that new people should see as soon as they come here the first time. 133+ pages about a luthier that screwed some people over (one of many) several years ago at this point, IMO, doesn't qualify.


----------



## Tesla

The chem-trails are strong on this page!


----------



## Danukenator

Randy said:


> Also, jet fuel can't *bernie* steel beams.



Needed to be done.


----------



## Slunk Dragon

Guitar luthiers are really just lizardmen in disguise.


----------



## downburst82

All the worlds most powerful luthiers are part of the secret/not so secret bilderbergutar group...they control EVERYTHING PEOPLE!!!


----------



## Mklane

Bernie Rico Jr Guitar not Finish Project | eBay
Here's another one.


----------



## Randy

Mklane said:


> Bernie Rico Jr Guitar not Finish Project | eBay
> Here's another one.





> Item location:
> San Diego, California, United States



Also SoCal. Keeps with the theme, so far.


----------



## Tesla

Mklane said:


> Bernie Rico Jr Guitar not Finish Project | eBay
> Here's another one.



It literally says "Paid" in the neck pickup cavity.


----------



## MoshJosh

Should we be reporting these items on eBay? Its probably an over simplification of the situation but isn't it stolen?


----------



## InfinityCollision

Sadly there's a very good chance they're _not_ stolen, which would mean that the infinitesimally small chance buyers previously had to at least recover parts has now vanished completely.


----------



## Randy

MoshJosh said:


> Should we be reporting these items on eBay? Its probably an over simplification of the situation but isn't it stolen?



Anything possible until a final explanation presents itself but the most likely scenario is that all the guitars were liquidated during a foreclosure/bankruptcy sale, which would make the eBay/reverb listings totally legal.

I've been advocating from the first listing that somebody take "soft touch" approach and see if we can get a straight answer on how all these guitars got dispersed. My guess is that it's the liquidation deal, but itll be nice to know for sure. 

If somebody has cache of unbuilt BRJs, there's at least a mild chance somebody could try and hunt down theirs and buy it back. Depending on the kinda deposit they put down, it might be the same or less than they originally were quoted to buy the unfinished build and have it finished by someone they trust or on their own.


----------



## SpaceDock

So...I went over that about three years ago. There was a small guitar shop in SoCal that did buy a ton of these without knowing the story. The owner was really shocked when I told him about the situation. He was then trying to unload many of the guitars through various routes, yep he got really scummy really fast. I would have to look through my records cuz I can't remember his companies name. He had 4 dozen!!! of the guitars when I spoke to him. I sent him pics of my guitar and he claimed it was not in his pile.

Found it... it was ebay handle Pimpmyguitars


----------



## Jaek-Chi

Sorry i've just joined in on seeing all this... I've picked up on bits. So far i've picked up, Bernie Rico is a c-bomb, people are debating whether some were stolen, and someone is making cheap chinese copies... 

If one were looking at a BRJ that was for sale now, what would you look out for?


----------



## Prophetable

Jaek-Chi said:


> Sorry i've just joined in on seeing all this... I've picked up on bits. So far i've picked up, Bernie Rico is a c-bomb, people are debating whether some were stolen, and someone is making cheap chinese copies...
> 
> If one were looking at a BRJ that was for sale now, what would you look out for?



I would look out for a different brand and then buy that instead.


----------



## Rev2010

Prophetable said:


> I would look out for a different brand and then buy that instead.



Without a doubt.  Why would anyone want to have anything to do with that name from this point on? - except for those that already have functioning instruments from a purchase before all this of course.


Rev.


----------



## Hollowway

Yeah, the guitars that are available, based on the 3 separate people I've talked to selling them, and based on what others have said (including Bernie's wife), say in a warehouse with no temperature control for months. I would be seriously worried about getting a guitar with a warped neck or worse. And there is no one to take responsibility if anything happened to be wrong. It's just not worth the risk, even if you could stomach potentially buying a stolen instrument that might belong to a completely innocent guy out $1600-$10,000.


----------



## SpaceDock

Mklane said:


> Bernie Rico Jr Guitar not Finish Project | eBay
> Here's another one.



So, this is *my* guitar. I can even see my name written in the control cavity. I have been quite for the last few days and I tried to recover the guitar with the help of the police. Sadly, Bernie stole my money and not "my guitar" so I cannot lay claim to the guitar.


----------



## Hollowway

SpaceDock said:


> So, this is *my* guitar. I can even see my name written in the control cavity. I have been quite for the last few days and I tried to recover the guitar with the help of the police. Sadly, Bernie stole my money and not "my guitar" so I cannot lay claim to the guitar.



Holy crap. Did you try to contact he seller? See if you can trace it back. And how is it not stolen? If you have him money, he gave you a guitar. He just hasn't shipped it yet. What does the law say about that? Is there really no way to get the police involved?


----------



## SpaceDock

I have contacted seller, bought it without paying. Since it was never in my possession bernie still owes me money and the guitar was never mine, kinda sucks. Still working on any way forward I can.


----------



## Tesla

That truly sucks man.


----------



## possumkiller

So glad I got rid of my BRJ. I got mine two years before the black friday run and still had headaches with it. It was shipped with the wrong color trem bar, broken switch which was probably due to the case being completely empty inside with a few loose random shaped pieces of case interior tossed in to try and keep the guitar from sliding around. It's not like it was any crazy shape either it was a Jekyll and fit my Ibanez prestige hard case just fine. Bernie wanted me to buy another case off of him. Instead I just left it in his excuse for a case and sold it off later at a huge loss.

I can't believe this douche has the nerve to try and start a business again.

Edit: He didn't see any reason to send me a new switch since it was broken in shipping so not his problem or the correct color trem bar since the one he sent was functional.

Double edit: After my initial BRJ experience I wanted nothing to do with his crap but I was almost convinced that my ....ty experience was just a freak accident and that Bernie was the best guy to deal with and his guitars pure gold. Quite a few forum members were singing his praises and a few well known (only around here at the time) artists were going on about it. I'm pretty sure Bernie's black friday run would never have amounted to much if it wasn't for the djent guys spamming pics of all their awesome guitars and their friendship with old uncle Bernie. I'm happy to see they didn't lose anything in dealing with him though and were able to move on to Jackson, PRS, Ibanez, Schecter...


----------



## Womb raider

It just boggles my mind how a business can collect a bunch of money, not deliver the product and get away with it with not even a slap on the wrist. The only option people are left with is small claims court which is more time and money than its worth.
I guess he could still get caught up with the IRS for tax fraud, since I'm sure he wasn't doing proper bookkeeping the way he ran his business. I'm sure Uncle Sam would love to know about the hundreds of thousands of dollars he made during that span of time. Not much consolation for those that lost money though.


----------



## SDMFVan

Womb raider said:


> It just boggles my mind how a business can collect a bunch of money, not deliver the product and get away with it with not even a slap on the wrist.



Ever heard of Kickstarter? You just described the business model of about 75% of the businesses on there. I read a story today about a guy that made $600k for some new type of 3D printer; he used the money to build a house and told all the people he'd robbed "sorry".


----------



## BlackMastodon

Doesn't Kickstarter have some sort of clause where the owner of the campaign has to deliver some kind of product? I could've swore there was some liability, however small it may be.


----------



## mperrotti34

Womb raider said:


> It just boggles my mind how a business can collect a bunch of money, not deliver the product and get away with it with not even a slap on the wrist. The only option people are left with is small claims court which is more time and money than its worth.
> I guess he could still get caught up with the IRS for tax fraud, since I'm sure he wasn't doing proper bookkeeping the way he ran his business. I'm sure Uncle Sam would love to know about the hundreds of thousands of dollars he made during that span of time. Not much consolation for those that lost money though.



Im surprised the IRS hasnt gone after him already. If what everyone has said on here is true (which I dont doubt at all at this point) the amount of money he would have had would be way over the reasonable amount of capital that a business should keep. The law requires that a company only keep excess capital that is necessary for progressing in business. Thats the core of the Supreme Court case filed by the Dodge brothers against Ford in the early 1900's (only their case was for dividends and not products that had been paid for). Not only did they get what they were owed but they got more on top of it because of the excess capital that Ford had at the time. The IRS should have already audited him. If they havent yet he is going to be in for a rude awakening when they finally catch on to what has happened. He will get charged with at least tax fraud and criminal tax evasion. For those that dont know what those are......He will be going away for a long time.


----------



## BlackMastodon

We can only hope. But if he filed for bankruptcy, would that protect him at all? BRJ seems to be the kind of guy that would go to any and all lengths to hide behind anything that would save him.


----------



## SDMFVan

BlackMastodon said:


> Doesn't Kickstarter have some sort of clause where the owner of the campaign has to deliver some kind of product? I could've swore there was some liability, however small it may be.



Not really: https://www.kickstarter.com/blog/accountability-on-kickstarter 

They basically say that if someone doesn't deliver than you can try and go after that person, but it's not KS's problem. It's really not in their best interests to go after the projects anyway since KS's user agreement absolves them of any liability and they get a cut of the proceeds whether the project is real or fake.

People should keep this in mind when giving money to ANY luthier before a product has actually been made, especially when you're buying your way into a "run" of multiple guitars. You're basically investing in that company, and any legal ramifications are going to have to be initiated and most importantly *followed through* by you. The government generally won't be proactive in these kind of cases.


----------



## possumkiller

You guys should buy the domain name for Bernie Rico Jr guitars and make it into a website dedicated to publicising his shenanigans with pics of jacked up orders, stolen guitars for sale and list of people he ripped off for how much and testimonials. It would be a good way to warn new people about him when he inevitably starts trying to sell guitars again.


----------



## BlackMastodon

Please someone do this.


----------



## Electric Wizard

The domain isn't for sale and registration won't expire until Christmas day. You can buy .net or .org though.


----------



## possumkiller

As long as it pops up when someone googles BRJ


----------



## clubshred

Electric Wizard said:


> The domain isn't for sale and registration won't expire until Christmas day. You can buy .net or .org though.



I actually owned the .org name for a couple of years because I was building his website at the time - of course, he didn't pay me. Shocker.

I let it expire I think last year because I wanted nothing to do with that crooked bastard.


----------



## Speculum Speculorum

possumkiller said:


> So glad I got rid of my BRJ. I got mine two years before the black friday run and still had headaches with it. It was shipped with the wrong color trem bar, broken switch which was probably due to the case being completely empty inside with a few loose random shaped pieces of case interior tossed in to try and keep the guitar from sliding around. It's not like it was any crazy shape either it was a Jekyll and fit my Ibanez prestige hard case just fine. Bernie wanted me to buy another case off of him. Instead I just left it in his excuse for a case and sold it off later at a huge loss.
> 
> I can't believe this douche has the nerve to try and start a business again.
> 
> Edit: He didn't see any reason to send me a new switch since it was broken in shipping so not his problem or the correct color trem bar since the one he sent was functional.
> 
> Double edit: After my initial BRJ experience I wanted nothing to do with his crap but I was almost convinced that my ....ty experience was just a freak accident and that Bernie was the best guy to deal with and his guitars pure gold. Quite a few forum members were singing his praises and a few well known (only around here at the time) artists were going on about it. I'm pretty sure Bernie's black friday run would never have amounted to much if it wasn't for the djent guys spamming pics of all their awesome guitars and their friendship with old uncle Bernie. I'm happy to see they didn't lose anything in dealing with him though and were able to move on to Jackson, PRS, Ibanez, Schecter...




Those guys definitely lost a lot of my respect after all that bull..... But I will say this - for no reason I can think of, my BRJ Jekyll 727 is a damn phenomenal guitar. For some reason he pulled out the stops on the construction and quality of my guitar. It sounds and plays amazing, is incredibly resilient and stable - I'm FINALLY setting it up again after 2 years of not being set up and I'm just being picky, really. It did come to me very wonky though, and had to have quite the series of adjustments and nut-work done on it to make it play better than a 2-year-old built it.

When he did good work, he really did GREAT work. He just didn't seem to give one damn about consistency at all, and he also had a chronic issue with taking responsibility for his own problems. As I've stated before, even weeks before going completely bonkers and running off with a bunch of people's money he was talking about how nobody asks him "how Bernie is doing".

I explained to him it might be because they gave him sometimes thousands of dollars and expect a guitar or several guitars, but he just couldn't wrap his head around it.


----------



## Randy

It seemed to be pretty well documented some or maybe all the raw bodies and necks were being 'ghost built' (speculation was in Mexico) and there's a good chance the people running that factory knew how to build an alright guitar.

Dunno *exactly* how the finishing (final sanding, prep, paint, QC and setup) was handled but it appeared to be done in Bernie's shop. Considering how scatterbrained the guy is/was with an operation to match, it wouldnt surprise me at all if the "factory setup" and stuff done in Bernie's shop were all poorly done appointments on an otherwise decently built guitar.

For the record, I played a Hesperian 7 before and thought it was one of the best guitars I've ever picked up. The guy did some less than stellar .... prior and we've been over the song and dance over how unwise it is to underpay for a guitar and not think there's good reason, but being the guys namesake, all the forum celebrities, they looked cool and at least some of the ones in the wild played great... I can definitely see how a lot of people were blindsided.


----------



## JPMike

I haven't been on here for so long! 

What's the situation?


----------



## Hollowway

Randy said:


> It seemed to be pretty well documented some or maybe all the raw bodies and necks were being 'ghost built' (speculation was in Mexico) and there's a good chance the people running that factory knew how to build an alright guitar.
> 
> Dunno *exactly* how the finishing (final sanding, prep, paint, QC and setup) was handled but it appeared to be done in Bernie's shop. Considering how scatterbrained the guy is/was with an operation to match, it wouldnt surprise me at all if the "factory setup" and stuff done in Bernie's shop were all poorly done appointments on an otherwise decently built guitar.
> 
> For the record, I played a Hesperian 7 before and thought it was one of the best guitars I've ever picked up. The guy did some less than stellar .... prior and we've been over the song and dance over how unwise it is to underpay for a guitar and not think there's good reason, but being the guys namesake, all the forum celebrities, they looked cool and at least some of the ones in the wild played great... I can definitely see how a lot of people were blindsided.



Yeah, when some of the guitars were up here because a friend of the owner at a nearby music store brought them in, that seemed to be the case. The word was he got them from a shop in Mexico. They were essentially like what we've seen on here a few times. Like that pile of guitars in the BRJ thread. Essentially all of the wood work was done, and they just needed to be painted and set up. My guess is that no wood working occurred in the US. My Jekyll has the side dots painted on, so they probably came from Mexico without side dots, and they just dabbed them on during the painting process.


----------



## SpaceDock

The bodies were made in mexico, the guitars were then painted by contractors, bernie was doing the hardware amd set up, supposedly there was a contractor installing frets and primary leveling. 

Update on my struggle: my guitar was not recoverable legally. However, due to Bernies continued "2 weeks", he drug out the statute of limitations. In colorado what he did is a class 4 felony and this is still an active case. The DA in my county has decided to pursue the case because of the numerous complaints against Bernie in their Internet crimes database. I am taking this as far as I can. Not giving up now!

Edit: thanks for emailing me all of your bs plight bernie!I have everything documented and your ....ed!


----------



## BlackMastodon

You're a hero, SpaceDock. I really hope they nail him for this whole sh*tshow.


----------



## possumkiller

Good to hear it! I hope someone can make an example of this douche.


----------



## Tesla




----------



## Pikka Bird

What is this? A sprout of some kind of breakthrough? This thread has been consistently pissing me off/bringing me down forever, so I hope something will come of this!


----------



## SpaceDock

This is probably my final update for a long time in a 6 year old debacle that started with me wanting to order my first custom guitar.

The case has been filed and all paperwork filed. Now we wait. The police don't actively seek someone for a crime like this, rather they have this filed in their computer system. The next time Bernie gets pulled over or gets in trouble where an office looks up his identity, the police will see an active out of state warrant. They will then apprehend him per the warrant. Let's all hope a bored cop goes through active warrants and decides to serve mine, but I doubt it. 

Once the warrant is served, the Colorado DA has requested extradition to face charges here. 

Because this is a full case and not an unreported crime, there is no limit to the time this stays open. Could be tomorrow or might be five years, I just hope he likes to speed.


----------



## Tesla

If he reads this thread, he's about to become the most law-abiding, model citizen America will ever see.


----------



## russmuller

SpaceDock said:


> This is probably my final update for a long time in a 6 year old debacle that started with me wanting to order my first custom guitar.
> 
> The case has been filed and all paperwork filed. Now we wait. The police don't actively seek someone for a crime like this, rather they have this filed in their computer system. The next time Bernie gets pulled over or gets in trouble where an office looks up his identity, the police will see an active out of state warrant. They will then apprehend him per the warrant. Let's all hope a bored cop goes through active warrants and decides to serve mine, but I doubt it.
> 
> Once the warrant is served, the Colorado DA has requested extradition to face charges here.
> 
> Because this is a full case and not an unreported crime, there is no limit to the time this stays open. Could be tomorrow or might be five years, I just hope he likes to speed.



 I wasn't even a part of this run but, you da man!


----------



## NeoTheMaggot

bernie rico jr guitar (blank) 7 strings this is the second one ive seen from this seller. Not sure if anything can be done about it, but the description says it was in storage. Maybe there are even more of these in "storage" this guy knows about.


----------



## mastapimp

Forgive me for being so late to this thread, but I don't often go to this forum as much as i used to. I hadn't picked up on the BRJ thread in a few years and was wondering if there was any resolve when i came across a familiar name of "Joe Donner"

Back in March 2011 i ordered a Jackson USA Chris Broderick 7 guitar through Gearhounds. They offered the best price at the time and even took off about 400 dollars for my pre-order. It took about 12 months for the guitar to finally arrive so i had a lot of correspondence with the folks at Gearhounds. Although I mainly dealt with a guy named Erik through email, i spoke to Joe Donner several times over the phone. The guitar was plagued with delays (jackson custom shop was building the first run of these and they had some problems with the floyd trem for 12" radius) and Joe was always honest and upfront with the situation. He even knew i was waiting for a guitar and called me up to offer a change of my original order of trans-black to trans-white finish because he had one coming in from NAMM that was pretty unique at the time. He even told me that there would be a slight delay as Jackson needed to photograph this exact guitar for their website...lo and behold, this was also true as my guitar was represented on the jackson site for years (maybe still is). Joe even called me to personally thank me for my business and ask if the guitar was to my liking and satisfaction (only other person to do that with me was the mayones dealer Chris Campbell from guitar addict).

I was surprised to see Gearhounds bit the dust as they were very responsive and professional in my interaction 5 years ago. Joe Donner is real, he was very professional in my experience, and I dealt with him and gearhounds for about a year without any complaints. My guess would be that these problems most likely stem with Bernie and his shop cause anytime i'd deal with Joe Donner or Gearhounds they were upfront and doing things right...I'm hoping Bernie's just dragging his name through the mud cause it'd be pretty sad to see this guy fall down the same hole.


----------



## feraledge

It's worth noting that Gearhounds pretty much went down in a slow burning flame. Customer service went down first, screwed a bunch of people over, never responded to anyone, stopped answering the phone, wouldn't send out orders, all of it. 
My experience with them was brief. I purchased an "in stock" guitar from them in like 2012/2013. It became immediately apparent that they either didn't have the guitar nor didn't feel obligated to ship it or respond to me. I tried cancelling about 3 business days in, another week later (about a dozen unanswered calls in between) I went to paypal dispute and got my money back in about an hour. 
Not sure what role Joe Donner may or may not have in any of this, but just saying that Gearhounds has a reputation that is fitting for BRJ.


----------



## mastapimp

Ouch...I was unaware of the gearhounds controversy or any details of their demise. Thanks for filling me in.


----------



## Benny84

Hi guys, I just joined your Forum after reading the whole thread over the last few days. I have no horses in this race, I just own a 2007 BRJ Vixen. Feel Sorry for all you guys who lost money, time, faith and enthusiasm in what was called the "Bernie Rico jr. Debacle" by a German Guitar-mag this month. I wanted to inform you that I found a BRJ "Jekyll 627 BOLT ON" in pearlwhite/blackburst for sale in European ebay Could be a BFR. Look at that neck heal of the placement of toggle-Switch, pretty unique. Is there a S7-member waiting for that Guitar After paying for it??? The german Seller states he will ship Guitar from Switzerland, dont ask me why. Any Forum Members intersted in contacting seller????


----------



## BlackMastodon

Benny84 said:


> Hi guys, I just joined your Forum after reading the whole thread over the last few days. I have no horses in this race, I just own a 2007 BRJ Vixen. Feel Sorry for all you guys who lost money, time, faith and enthusiasm in what was called the "Bernie Rico jr. Debacle" by a German Guitar-mag this month. I wanted to inform you that I found a BRJ "Jekyll 627 BOLT ON" in pearlwhite/blackburst for sale in European ebay Could be a BFR. Look at that neck heal of the placement of toggle-Switch, pretty unique. Is there a S7-member waiting for that Guitar After paying for it??? The german Seller states he will ship Guitar from Switzerland, dont ask me why. Any Forum Members intersted in contacting seller????



Got a link?


----------



## Benny84

http://m.ebay.de/itm/Bernie-Rico-Jr-Jeckyll-627-USA-Custom-made-/122052074543?nav=WATCHING_ACTIVE


----------



## fantom

That guitar is dated before the black Friday run.


----------



## bubingaisgod

I own a BRJ, from 2010, shortly before this whole incident began. 
Although I get the compassion in situations like these, I also have seen a good amount 
of ways people can side step their business liabilities. I know this may tread on the line of speculation, but since time has far removed everyone from the initial speculations, I just want to put out there that if somebody had recklessly spent all of their capital, for whatever reason, and had no way of making good on their obligations, one way of skirting that responsibility would be to claim mental illness,
fold the company, and escape the pressures of the hole they dug for themselves. 
As an LLC or a Corporation, you would easily escape any personal responsibility, and putting yourself in a situation where you don't have access to any communications would be a convenient side effect. Taking hundreds of thousands of dollars from people, it wouldn't be out of character for someone to go to those measures. People have done far worse over far less. That is just a thought I had while reading literally all of the pages of this thread over the past couple of days. As a long time musician and online vendor of vintage music gear and tubes, this situation you were all put in hit me very hard on both sides. As a consumer I felt anger and related to your feelings. As a small business owner, I felt absolutely zero compassion for Bernie Rico, and could see the red flags from a mile away, right from the beginning with his "web guy", and Chris G. Those trolls, the Facebook post from that phantom woman, addressing all of your issues in such a hollow an false way while trying to discredit your legitimate problems, and then seeing Bernie Rico at NAMM and saying he's going back into production, seeing him designing the Firebird guitar, all of this has kept me up all night tonight while I finished this thread. All I can say is I am very sorry for all of your investments here, and I don't mean money (thought that is obviously a factor). You all are some good dudes who deserved better. You put all of that time, trust, energy, hope, compassion, patience, and understanding into this. You should all be given an award, if not a ****ing refund. I've never seen such dedication in the face of such bull****.

Hopefully mods won't take this down, because I've grown fond of all of you guys, and it has taught me a lot about people in general, and everything not to do in business so you can do right by your customers. Thank you.


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## bubingaisgod

SpaceDock said:


> So...I went over that about three years ago. There was a small guitar shop in SoCal that did buy a ton of these without knowing the story. The owner was really shocked when I told him about the situation. He was then trying to unload many of the guitars through various routes, yep he got really scummy really fast. I would have to look through my records cuz I can't remember his companies name. He had 4 dozen!!! of the guitars when I spoke to him. I sent him pics of my guitar and he claimed it was not in his pile.
> 
> Found it... it was ebay handle Pimpmyguitars





Oh wow, Pimpmyguitars certainly sold a nice chunk of completed custom BRJs. It's really ****y knowing who's merchandise that unquestionably is. So it's ok for strangers to buy all of your guitars that you paid for, but it's not ok to have someone go in and verify who's property is who's and make sure you guys got what you paid for. SMH, this country needs a serious moral and legal facelift.


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## twguitar

David Cohen on the BC Rich Junkies Facebook page has just relaunched BRJ. Ask him where you money is, his problem now it seems


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## Hollowway

twguitar said:


> David Cohen on the BC Rich Junkies Facebook page has just relaunched BRJ. Ask him where you money is, his problem now it seems



I didn’t watch the video yet, but I saw a post in the comments about BRJ. Is BRJ affiliated with Dave in any way? If he’s making money off this venture, I’m going after him for either money or a discount on the guitar such that I’m compensated for the loss.


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## MaxOfMetal

I remember that jackass [Cohen]. He's been riding Bernie's cock/corpse since day one. 

Anyone who gives that charlatan money deserves to lose twice as much.


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## twguitar

Hollowway said:


> I didn’t watch the video yet, but I saw a post in the comments about BRJ. Is BRJ affiliated with Dave in any way? If he’s making money off this venture, I’m going after him for either money or a discount on the guitar such that I’m compensated for the loss.



Dave has it in his head he's the saviour of the Rico name. He was involved with BCR and got fired for his terrible customer service and constant lies. He became friendly with Jr and is now having his many minions try and restart BRJ, seemingly with Jrs blessing. DO NOT BE FOOLED, DC knows nothing about building guitars and farms it out to people, some of whom are decent builders but the majority are nobodies blowing hot air up his ass. 

I would strongly advise everyone to stay well clear of him however he is in direct contact with JR and clearly is attempting to bring the brand back so I would ask him where your money is and how he is going to solve this.


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## ikarus

Hollowway said:


> I didn’t watch the video yet, but I saw a post in the comments about BRJ.



Got a link to that video?


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## Randy

twguitar said:


> DC knows nothing about building guitars and farms it out to people, some of whom are decent builders but the majority are nobodies blowing hot air up his ass.



So in other words, exactly like BRJ the first time around?


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## watson503

BRJr, Cohen...all total scumbags. I saw this in the comment section of one of Cohen's latest videos - this was in response to Joe Rico's comment "Using my grandfathers name was a big mistake.
One you will regret!!!!!!!" Real class act, this bunch...


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## Hollowway

Yeah, I watched the video (it’s in the BC Rich Junkies FB page feed) and I was like  . That is a real ummm, interesting group. Lots of chain smoking, f bomb dropping, alcoholic tough guy types in there. Definitely not what I was expecting.


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## CapinCripes

twguitar said:


> David Cohen on the BC Rich Junkies Facebook page has just relaunched BRJ. Ask him where you money is, his problem now it seems


oh.... oh no.


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## Vyn

Luthier Wars Episode VII: BRJ Awakens

I nearly jumped on the train back in the day, only life expenses came up and I missed out on getting in a run. I've been thinking of framing the power bill that did it now!


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## Frostbite

Well this is just fantastic


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## Edika

I wonder if the other pieces of shit Rico jr is reffering to is all the negative haters he owes thousands of dollars to.


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## Randy

The man looks like a walking crack pipe


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## 777timesgod

https://reverb.com/item/13404803-bernie-rico-jr-jekyll-throback-4-of-only-5-new
Hello everyone, sorry for posting here even though I am not a customer but two Rico Jrs from 2012 appeared on Reverb from the same seller. Not sure what "Throback" is, probably misspelled from throwback. Just to check that they do not belong to one of you guys, as this whole thread made me sad to read. Stay strong and best of luck.


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## MaxOfMetal

777timesgod said:


> https://reverb.com/item/13404803-bernie-rico-jr-jekyll-throback-4-of-only-5-new
> Hello everyone, sorry for posting here even though I am not a customer but two Rico Jrs from 2012 appeared on Reverb from the same seller. Not sure what "Throback" is, probably misspelled from throwback. Just to check that they do not belong to one of you guys, as this whole thread made me sad to read. Stay strong and best of luck.



Looks to be some schmuck actually working with Bernie, or a scumbag selling old guitars as new. Take your pick.


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## 777timesgod

Most likely, I also like how the word new is between stars *, I do not remember seeing build photos of the particular models from members for the BFR run (could be wrong at 269 pages of content that Bernie caused) but the ads seem fishy. Perhaps Bernie is unloading stock again or finishing old blanks to raise cash.


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## twguitar

That seller is a friend of mine, think he was a BRJ dealer and bought countless BRJs. Great guy to deal with. He got screwed over massively by Jr and is missing far more money than I imagine anyone else is.


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## MaxOfMetal

twguitar said:


> That seller is a friend of mine, think he was a BRJ dealer and bought countless BRJs. Great guy to deal with. He got screwed over massively by Jr and is missing far more money than I imagine anyone else is.



At least he got guitars. 

Talk to the two or three guys on here who paid _tens of thousands_ for nothing.


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## Hollowway

Yeah, BRJ screwed a load of people, and took zero responsibility for it. If I ever see him pop up again I immediately investigate. If we stay vigilant, we can make sure he doesn’t just start up again selling guitars.


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## twguitar

MaxOfMetal said:


> At least he got guitars.
> 
> Talk to the two or three guys on here who paid _tens of thousands_ for nothing.


Yeah this guy was in the same position, many tens of thousands it sounded like. Bernie tried to pay him back with stock at the very end which is where these guitars came from. Him and Bernie were friends but all went south when Bernie sold some of his guitars 2/3 times to other people. 
Im a huge BCR/BRJ guy but Jr cant ever be allowed near a guitar company again.


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## 777timesgod

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=173500736947
This has SSOrg written all over it but you guys can judge on your own (7 string with BKPs). The seller is letting it go for a low price, they are based in Cali and claim it was "in storage" for a long time.


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## twguitar

777timesgod said:


> http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=173500736947
> This has SSOrg written all over it but you guys can judge on your own (7 string with BKPs). The seller is letting it go for a low price, they are based in Cali and claim it was "in storage" for a long time.


Theres no way that was finished by Rico the routes and fitting are awful, could well be a fake or one picked up from the builders in Mexico,


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## USMarine75

twguitar said:


> Theres no way that was finished by Rico the routes and fitting are awful, could well be a fake or one picked up from the builders in Mexico,



Yeah looks like an older Chibanez. (The newer Chibby's being better passable copies)


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## MaxOfMetal

twguitar said:


> Theres no way that was finished by Rico the routes and fitting are awful, could well be a fake or one picked up from the builders in Mexico,



Towards the end they started looking pretty bad. I wouldn't be surprised if this was a real body/neck/board block that was finished/completed by someone else. Wouldn't be the first one.

Not saying what it is definitively, but you can't really go by things like fit and finish. 

If you take the time to look back through the thread, you'll see rough routes, poor tuner and bridge installs, sloppy finishing, drunken side dots, etc. These are all pictures sent by BRJ to customers.


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## ikarus

777timesgod said:


> This has SSOrg written all over it



nah it has a TOM. 

Also to the reverb listing: You must be completly out of your mind if you buy a BRJ for over 3k.


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## Randy

MaxOfMetal said:


> Towards the end they started looking pretty bad. I wouldn't be surprised if this was a real body/neck/board block that was finished/completed by someone else. Wouldn't be the first one.
> 
> Not saying what it is definitively, but you can't really go by things like fit and finish.
> 
> If you take the time to look back through the thread, you'll see rough routes, poor tuner and bridge installs, sloppy finishing, drunken side dots, etc. These are all pictures sent by BRJ to customers.



I wish you could still find the pics of those awful truss rod routes that look like they were done by a beaver.


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## Hollowway

There was a guy selling a bunch of unfinished BRJs for a few hundred a pop. It was a few weeks ago. I messaged him (on eBay) about the history. He said he didn’t know about the history, but that he bought them from a guy who bought them all out of a storage unit where they had been sitting for a few years. My guess is they’re warped beyond belief, at best.


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## MaxOfMetal

Hollowway said:


> There was a guy selling a bunch of unfinished BRJs for a few hundred a pop. It was a few weeks ago. I messaged him (on eBay) about the history. He said he didn’t know about the history, but that he bought them from a guy who bought them all out of a storage unit where they had been sitting for a few years. My guess is they’re warped beyond belief, at best.



By my best estimate, there were a couple hundred guitars ordered, with around 30 or 40 delivered.

We're bound to see them pop up, as they were mostly given away or sold cheap on the DL to cover debts with folks that had either enough information/close enough relationship to Bernie that he couldn't hide from them, or were local enough that they could persue real legal action.

Towards the end the quality was so inconsistent, and regardless of time period there were still problems, that most are probably not that great and/or require more work than its worth. There are plenty of builders making decent, well spec'd super strats.

The fact there are still dipshits stumping for BRJ blows my mind.


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## possumkiller

BRJ was my first time jumping on the SSO hype wagon. I bought one in 2008 and was not impressed. Voiced my opinion here and was responded to by BRJ himself which I thought was cool. However, privately he flaked out and never rectified the situation as he made out he would here. I paid $35-3600 for a Jekyll 627 from Boogie Street. I received it bouncing around inside a case that had absolutely nothing fitting to the body. The case was just an empty rectangle. They tossed inside a few loose chunks of felt covered foam to hopefully cushion the edges. The boost switch was broken off in transit. The guitar had chrome hardware but they tossed in a gold trem arm for a little extra fuck you. The guitar itself was mahogany body, ebony fretboard supposedly maple neck (the neck was painted solid black from headstock tip to strap button so none of the neck wood was visible) quilt top with transparent black top and natural back of the body wings. I had just come off an ESP custom shop KH4 so I was expecting perfection. Never could get the action as low without fretting out and buzzing. The paint lines were not crisp or straight. The whole experience left a bad taste in my mouth so I sold it at a huge loss to a guy in Asia. He wanted me to mark it as a gift and skip insurance to ship it as cheap as possible and avoid customs fees. It ended up taking four months to get there and of course the case made sure it was damaged some more.

Tl;Dr 
I was a BRJ hater years before it was cool. When the YouTube djenters were going crazy hyping his shit a couple of years later, I thought maybe I just had bad luck the first time. Really glad I didn't waste any more money there.


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## pondman

Its a fake, there were quite a few of those about a few years ago and I bought one out of interest. It was a pile of shite !


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## Vyn

pondman said:


> Its a fake, there were quite a few of those about a few years ago and I bought one out of interest. It was a pile of shite !



So if it was a pile of shite, it was an accurate copy then? 

I remember when Merrow started using BRJ's back in the day and lusting hard for the white 7 he used to have. Before the Dark Times. Before the War...


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## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> So if it was a pile of shite, it was an accurate copy then?
> 
> I remember when Merrow started using BRJ's back in the day and lusting hard for the white 7 he used to have. Before the Dark Times. Before the War...



Before he chose to get free guitars over helping hundreds of customers......


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## Vyn

MaxOfMetal said:


> Before he chose to be a massive fuckstick



FIFY


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## MaxOfMetal

Vyn said:


> FIFY



You said it, not me.


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## DiezelMonster

There are a few B.C. Rich groups on Facebook I belong too, anyhow there is a guy selling "good" almost complete BRJ guitars. He was asking about 2k before he has them completed and then about 3500 or more after. He had quite a few, over 10. I'm sure there were a bunch of guitars from owed customers.


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## Hollowway

DiezelMonster said:


> There are a few B.C. Rich groups on Facebook I belong too, anyhow there is a guy selling "good" almost complete BRJ guitars. He was asking about 2k before he has them completed and then about 3500 or more after. He had quite a few, over 10. I'm sure there were a bunch of guitars from owed customers.



You need to call him on it. Not to get all philosophical, but, to paraphrase Edmund Burk, the only thing needed for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing. As far as I'm concerned, people selling these BRJs are either complicit, or knowingly selling stolen guitars. I've encountered 3 different sources selling old BRJs, and each time I called them out on it. On two occasions (music stores) they returned them to the consigner and said they didn't want to be a party to it. At the very least, we need to stick up for each other so this sort of shit doesn't happen again.

In fact, what group did you see that? I wanna go check it out myself.


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## nikt

Some Bernie Rico guitars on sale on ebay. Some unfinished.
Check guys is there anything from your orders

https://www.ebay.com/sch/the-guitar...5138974286&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.m3561.l2562


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## SpaceDock

Gross


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## pondman

I'd say it's too far down the line now.


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## Chris Bowsman

MaxOfMetal said:


> Before he chose to get free guitars over helping hundreds of customers......





Vyn said:


> FIFY



If either of you would be willing to PM the story behind this, I'd appreciate it.


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## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Before he chose to get free guitars over helping hundreds of customers......


Yeah, it's interesting because a few weeks ago he made a post on FB about how much he hated a company (I think it was sweetwater?) because he said they screwed him over or something, and he only likes working with companies that support musicians, rather than just try to make money at their expense, or something like that. I almost commented, but I don't know that I have all the info on it to start a flame war. (As a guy who was screwed over by BRJ, I am still feeling the sting of that, though!)


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## Randy

Chris Bowsman said:


> If either of you would be willing to PM the story behind this, I'd appreciate it.



The whole thing is a long story but my recollection of that specific part is that it was after BRJ had already stiffed a number of people, but some of the ERG influencers continued to get guitars from him and promote him on social media.

That's despite the fact the stories about Bernie taking money and screwing over regular folks were already out there in the same channels these dudes were promoting him on. There's also the fact none of the woodwork was being done at Bernie's shop, which would be clear as day if you were there at any point, which these guys all were.

If there's something more specific out there, I don't know off hand.


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## MrWulf

2.5k plus for an unfinished guitar is fucking gross. 1k maybe but 2.5k? He better sleep with the fishes


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## MaxOfMetal

MrWulf said:


> 2.5k plus for an unfinished guitar is fucking gross. 1k maybe but 2.5k? He better sleep with the fishes



Not just any unfinished guitar, _one that's over a decade old_ at this point. 

Every couple years someone finds a few of these in the closet.


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## MrWulf

MaxOfMetal said:


> Not just any unfinished guitar, _one that's over a decade old_ at this point.
> 
> Every couple years someone finds a few of these in the closet.



I'd fork over money for one of the 7 or 8 strings at reasonable price but at 2.5k i might as well order a semi custom from someone that i know wont fucked me over.

Does he think that BRJ's death will make this collector's edition or some shit?


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## MaxOfMetal

MrWulf said:


> I'd fork over money for one of the 7 or 8 strings at reasonable price but at 2.5k i might as well order a semi custom from someone that i know wont fucked me over.
> 
> Does he think that BRJ's death will make this collector's edition or some shit?



Trust me, you don't want one of these. You'll spend almost as much time, energy, and money getting it remotely playable.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, it's interesting because a few weeks ago he made a post on FB about how much he hated a company (I think it was sweetwater?) because he said they screwed him over or something, and he only likes working with companies that support musicians, rather than just try to make money at their expense, or something like that. I almost commented, but I don't know that I have all the info on it to start a flame war. (As a guy who was screwed over by BRJ, I am still feeling the sting of that, though!)



A bunch of other people called him out on it at least. Even a Sweetwater guy responded to him.


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## Hollowway

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> A bunch of other people called him out on it at least. Even a Sweetwater guy responded to him.


Oh interesting. I never circled back to see what happened. It was a really weird rant to go on.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands

Hollowway said:


> Oh interesting. I never circled back to see what happened. It was a really weird rant to go on.



Yeah when I saw it I was thinking he got shafted on the price, but in actuality it seemed like he was pissed because he didn't get an artist's discount? :lol


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## Hollowway

MaxOfMetal said:


> Trust me, you don't want one of these. You'll spend almost as much time, energy, and money getting it remotely playable.


Yep. I did get mine in this same contrition as these are right after the whole event. At the time, luthier Brian Bowes said that if anyone was able to get their guitar he would finish it at no charge. (Because he’s a saint, and an awesome dude. Like, no joke, he’s helped a lot of people, and luthiers, alike.). Anyway, there were loads of problems with it. It took a LOT of work to get it playable. These are not something you can just put hardware on and go. AND, mine was not sitting in a warehouse with no heat or AC for months, like these were.


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## yotgguitar

Looks like all those unfinished Black Friday guitars are all for sale on ebay....
Honestly I don't know if they are the lost unfinished guitars or not, but when I saw 10 half finished BRJ guitars for sale, I immediately thought of this thread lol....

I wish I had the extra to spend to get one and finish building it out...... would be peachy!!!

edit: I didn't know these guitars were already known about.....
sorry... guess i'm stuck in the past lol....


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## eaeolian

The saga will never end. Lol

...and I will never forget that this scam put KXK out of business because he couldn't compete withe the prices for guitars BRJ never delivered. There's just nothing good about this whole affair


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## Alberto7

eaeolian said:


> The saga will never end. Lol
> 
> ...and I will never forget that this scam put KXK out of business because he couldn't compete withe the prices for guitars BRJ never delivered. There's just nothing good about this whole affair


Oh damn, is that why Rob eventually went off the face of the Earth? What a number Bernie pulled...
Rob's back by now though, correct? I see Pyramid Guitars posting a lot of pictures of kxks for sale on social media, and I could swear they are brand new. Beautiful guitars.


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## Hollowway

Alberto7 said:


> Oh damn, is that why Rob eventually went off the face of the Earth? What a number Bernie pulled...
> Rob's back by now though, correct? I see Pyramid Guitars posting a lot of pictures of kxks for sale on social media, and I could swear they are brand new. Beautiful guitars.


Yep, he’s doing new builds for Corey (Pyramid). I’m glad to see him back at it, because his stuff is crazy good.


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## Spaced Out Ace

eaeolian said:


> The saga will never end. Lol
> 
> ...and I will never forget that this scam put KXK out of business because he couldn't compete withe the prices for guitars BRJ never delivered. There's just nothing good about this whole affair


Not only did this bag of dicks rip a bunch of people off, but another builder (who likely actually delivered guitars) went out of business because of it? Fucking hell.


----------

