# Singing Faults



## getaway_fromme (Jun 15, 2010)

Hey all. I'm a vocal instructor looking to get some more experience and to help out all of you aspiring rock stars out there! I'm classically trained, and I sing for a living. Although a lot of you may not be of the classical variety, the techniques can save you alot of Sore throats.

I open this up to all. 


Post up ANYTHING you are having vocal issues with and I will try to help anyway I can. I'm from San Francisco and will give free vocal lessons to anyone who wants them! 

START POSTING!!!!











5 steps to "proper" classical singing technique:

*1. Preparation - *
Perhaps the most obvious, you need to be mentally and physically able to sing. Really being able to draw the emotions needed for a performance is essential - clear your mind of anything that happens in the outside world, all the drama, bills, etc., and make sure you are prepared. Don't sing on a sore throat. Don't smoke. Always have water handy because the vocal chords need lubrication. Drink decaffeinated tea with Honey and Lemon, perhaps even pepper flakes, it really opens up the sinuses. 

Go jogging - Cardio does WONDERS for your breath support, posture, mental mindset. Not only does it help you warm up your breathing, but it also gets the crap out of your throat (mucus). Running too hard will in fact do a little damage, so around 20-30 mins at a time is preferred. Basically, you want to warm yourself up without completely tiring out your entire body. Don't go running any marathons. On weekends, I go jogging right before I take a shower, and it warms me up for the 3-4 gigs I do every Sunday, starting at 9 am, which is a HORRIBLE time to sing. 

Warm up when you wake up - So my girlfriend, a Mezzo sop. in choral/solo work, but also sings for her rock/blues band, now needs to warm up every morning before work. She's on the phone all day at work and strains her voice if she doesn't start warming up right when she wakes up. This may seem over the top, but people sound the most horrible right when they wake up, and speaking for the whole day the way people do in the morning is strenuous for the vocal chords. Warm up in the shower. Really, it helps. (properly, of course. More later). Coffee and tea are both great for physically warming up your vocal cords. When you wake up, they're dry and cold from not having water for a long time, so warm drinks that aren't too heavily caffeinated or milky are highly recommended. I drink tea at least 3 times a day now. Lastly, invest in a Neti pot. Go look it up. It's honestly, amazing. 

Don't sing too hard - Avoid trying to learn any music that is COMPLETELY out of your range or ability. Of course to try and set a high bar, but just as it's difficult for an instrumentalist to get used to the music they play and have the ability to learn, don't try singing stuff you blatantly can't do! Practicing it over and over and over and over like everything else, simply doesn't work. You'll fry your vocal chords. They will grow calluses, but they're not good. Really. Truly. Absolutely. Don't fry your cords. You only have one set. 

*2. Inhalation* - 
Basically, Breathe support is PARAMOUNT. I cannot stress this enough. This is the area most under trained singers FAIL. Ever listen to Slipknot's Corey try to make through an entire phrase live without leaving out a few words? BAD BREATH SUPPORT, most likely from tension in the wrong muscles. 

When you take in air, make sure you're NOT making a gasping sound, as if trying to take a very large breath. This will actually constrict your trachea, thus lowering the amount of air being taken in. The goal is to take in as much air as possible as SILENTLY as possible, so the diaphragm and intercostal muscles are used the most. These muscles will take time to be developed to a point where you can actually FEEL the sensation of controlling them. They work involuntarily, and we really don't spend time worrying about them. When inhaling, while keeping the throat open, try to breathe as low in your body as possible. The diaphragm is the main muscle in charge of expanding your rib cage so your lungs can inflate to their maximum capacity. Put your hands along your waist and try to feel your ribcage expand ALL AROUND as you take a breath. You should feel the expansion in the stomach, your sides, and your back. In contrast, High breathing (aka clavicular breathing) is frowned upon because it doesn't use the diaphragm and intercostals, hence creating tension with other muscles around, trying to do the job of your Diaphragm. This is extraneous and bad for singing in general. It's like trying to lift really heavy boxes with your back. Your legs are the most able muscles to do the job, so don't make your back do it. 

Feeling for the diaphragm - This is DIFFICULT to say the least, feeling for muscles you haven't felt before. Take in a breath and try to inflate your stomach without expanding your upper chest or raising the shoulders. The Diaphragm is the only muscle left for the job, since you can't use your abs . It's simply the only way to take in a breath and feel it in your gut. So the intercostals and the Diaphragm expand the ribcage, no other muscles are used, except for your Vocal cords and tongue throat muscles. Honestly. Don't try to use (create tension) with muscles that will not aid in the inhalation process. Good general rule to have. 

Try breathing in for 4 beats, and then enthusiastically say, "Ha Ha Ha Ha Haaaaaa". The goal is to do each Ha for about a 8th note, and the last one is held over for the last 2 beats in 4/4 time. When doing this, you should feel your stomach go in and out for every "Ha". The point is that you are using the diaphragm and the intercostals to push out air for the H's and the vowel. Try it on All vowels and with different consonants like Do, Fa, Sa, Si, whatever you like. It's all experimentation because every person sounds different than the next. Different body shape, different instrument. 

When inhaling, remember to keep your throat completely open, Try making the space in your mouth for "Ha", and you should notice the back of your throat expand, allowing you to take in more air (silently). Try to keep your tongue relaxed and down the whole time. It's a huge muscle that affects other muscles around, often creating tension in your skull and neck, so really try NOT to force it down, but generally speaking, keep the tip of your tongue right behind your bottom row of teeth. Check to feel where the sides of your tongue are. They change around for vowels like "ee" and "ay (play)". Your goal should be to at least feel how they modify in different spots in your mouth. It might seem weird, but when you get it, you'll know. 

*3. Suspension* - 
Is the ability to keep air in your body as long as possible. Basically, with the expanded ribcage, use the diaphragm and intercostals to hold your ribcage open. ABS will not help with this. I just got through arguing with someone else over it, and I promise you, they will NOT help. Remember, tension is shunned upon, tension from anything, shoulders, knees, back. Only use the muscles you need. Whether you're singing or holding in air, try to feel like you're pushing air in, rather than letting air escape. This not only works the respiratory muscles, but also helps you by avoiding using your throat to control your breathing, which is not good. 

Practice inhaling over 4 beats, then releasing the air on a Hiss for 4 beats. Next, inhale for 4, out for 8. In for 4, out for 12. Keep going as long as you can. My personal goal is around 32 seconds, which is pretty good, but nowhere near the best. I try to practice this EVERY second of every day, when I'm jogging, on the bus, on the way to work, class. Whatever. My life goal is to get to 1 minute without tension. It's a bitch.

*4. Phonation* - probably the hardest thing to teach, phonation deals with manipulating your Larynx to produce different tones at different intensities using air to make different parts in your upper body (chest, skull, nasal cavities,) resonate to produce a desirable tone (subjective). This, of course, can't happen without proper breathing, so make sure you got that down first, or else this section is useless. When singing, you are manipulating your Larynx to funnel air through different sized openings to get different notes. The lower the note, the more open your throat gets, the higher the note, the more tense. 

The goal is to produce pleasing tone as easily as possible, so stopping from tensing your throat may be difficult for a long, long time. But everything takes practice. When you do get to singing, try to find the middle of your range. Most basses have long necks, most tenors have shorter necks. Tenor should be able to sing comfortably up to an A above middle C and as low as an A, and octave and a minor 3rd below. Low basses should be able to hit a low D below the low Tenor A, and baritones are different variations along the middle. Most men, on average, are baritones because they don't try to sing or speak high in their range. Sopranos, for which I a m slightly unfamiliar with, should be able to safely sing down from a low D (whole step above middle C) all the way up to a D two octaves above that. The "Queen of the Night" aria from Mozart's "Magic Flute", goes up to a high F above the D. Mezzos/Altos should ideally sing down to the D an octave below the Sopranos, and up to about a high A, a perfect 4th below the Soprano's high D. Like I said before, there will always be slight variations, but in a very general sense, those are the standards (I'm aware of).

Pick an initial syllable and a latter, for instance, Si-Ah. In terms of scales, sing the "Si" as the 5th of a major scale, then sing "Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah", where the notes are 5-4-3-2-1, or Sol-Fa-Mi-Re-Do, which brought together, will become Si-Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah. The notes would be for example, C-C-Bb-A-G-F. The initial "S" opens your throat and consequently closes your teeth. The "s" prepares your throat for the proper space for the vowels, and also initializes breathing with the diaphragm. Just holding a "Hisssssss" you will most likely feel the diaphragm work. Moving this scale up and down your comfortable range, doing different permutations on different syllables, like sing up and down major and minor scales on different vowels, and arpeggios, is NEEDED, as you will sing a ton of vowels in any one song. It's just like doing guitar scales, your're just working the muscles. 

When doing the previous exercise, try to make both vowels (Si, Ah) in similar "space" in your mouth. Breathe in on the "Ah" vowel, and try to sing "Si" in the same space. Take note of what your tongue and lips are doing and how they change shape to make different vowel sounds. By making the vowels sound as similar as possible, such as opening the vowel of the "Si" to sound more like "Sih". This is called modifying the vowel. It's the difference between "She" and "Him", "Cat" and "caught", "Goat" and "good". With this, try to make each vowel sound as if you have the same mouth and throat space as the previous one, so EEE and OOO don't sound so extreme. This is a really dumbed down version, but I hope you get what I mean. We Americans really get this bad, because we use a ton of diphthongs and triphthongs in our speech, such as Goat, which is indeed 2 completely different vowel sounds, one after the other. Other languages like Latin, use pure vowels which are consistent in the rules which dictate pronunciation. 

with the EEE vowel, like in Clean, the sides of your tongue lift up to the sides of your upper teeth, and for an OOO, like in Blueberry, your tongue is pushed up right behind your bottom row of teeth and your lips slightly pucker outward. The goal is to try and make them sound less extreme over a musical phrase. Remember, Vowel Modification.

As far as breathing goes for these exercises, you should feel air on your hand if you put it to your mouth while singing, as you would when your simply exhale. This way, your throat isn't being restricted, and you have good airflow. Doing anything to hold the air in, and making that breathy feeling on your hand feel thinner, is not good. You should feel as though air is constantly moving through you as you sing. The air should never feel like it's sitting in your body. 

In regards to cracking, Don't worry if you crack alot. The Larynx is a muscle that needs to be worked in just like your fingers while playing guitar. Practice going up and down the most extreme parts of your register, like a back and forth Yawn. Going up and down, back and forth, helps you get the right amount of air pressure through your "passaggio" (aka. crack, break). Men have 2 of them! It's around Eb-F above middle C, and the Bb-G below it for Tenors, slightly lower for Basses and Baritones. When you sing in general, don't do ANYTHING to make your voice not crack, except during performance  It's totally fine. You'll just get used to it after awhile. It's like massaging out a knot in your back, but without the pain. 

*5. Recovery *- Doing it all again Every Phrase!

Now, a lot of men tend to depress their soft palate a.k.a. Uvula to try and "press" a sound out. You need to keep it raised the whole time while you sing. No matter the style. Pop singers get this wrong ALL THE TIME, which is why some black people can sound REALLY good (It also helps that they have great vocal musculature. Too bad it's all tension. And you wonder why people like Whitney Houston can't sing anymore, even though PAVAROTTI did until he died? Short lesson long, don't tighten anything in your throat, or uvula. Pressing tone is always bad, no matter what anyone says

This can be felt by saying the sound "ng" like at the end of "saying". This is the sound of your soft palate depressed against the back of your tongue, and therefore constricts the throat. While this is "pressed" down against the tongue, it can create a very desirable tone, but it's all because of the tension in the throat. It will sound good, but boy will it F*ck you up. It can create problems with the tongue and throat, and just generally gets in the way. When this is pressed down, I hypothesize it restricts where different parts in your skull resonate, and honestly, you want the most resonation WITHOUT pushing. Keeping the soft palate up can be felt like saying "Ah" at the dentist. Same idea. This way, you get maximum air flow AND the air vibrating against your soft palate transfers resonation to your skull and into your nasal cavities. One can indeed resonate the sinuses too much and get the Steve Urkel sound. In contrast, If you can remember the voice of Yogi Bear, he sounded like he depressed his soft palate against the back of his tongue, basically cutting out the sinuses altogether. Two completely different ends of the spectrum and tons of different colors in between. 

*WARM UP LIKE A MUTHA FUCKA*! I can't tell you how NOT singing before a performance and simply warming up has helped me get miles ahead of the game. By simply warming up for the day and AVOIDING singing all out until performance time has saved my voice on numerous occasions lately. Practice going through your cracks (aka break, i.e. Passaggio) Practice isn't supposed to sound good, the performance is. Also, you can't practice as much as you can on any other instrument. Your larynx is a muscle that is easily tired, and you cannot over work it under ANY circumstances. But, practice your breathing as often as possible. Keep your voice warm by speaking constantly around your passaggio. This will teach your larynx to comfortably resonate in that "Tessitura" (range). 

So, practice your breathing first, try to hold a pitch for over 30 seconds and NOT closing down your throat. Also, good posture is a GREAT idea 

Lastly, work it ALL into your body as if second nature. At first, it will a ton of stuff to take in, but you need to be able to do it without thinking about it. THEN you get to worry about other techniques for specific songs and styles

*GENRES - *So everything I've just mentioned is what I've learned in the classical field, and the point of this style is to making singing as easy as possible. By simply knowing what muscles are moving while you sing, you can learn to NOT use them if they are strenuous to ANY part of your body. I know that these will be difficult to bring over to harder genres like Rock and Metal, but at least starting with these can truly give you the stamina to perform for a LONG time. 

*EXPERIMENT - *So I sing classically now, but I used to sing lead and scream for my Prog Metal band. I have a little experience with this, and I'll try to pass on what I've only personally used for "Metal" technique. For the thrashy style vocals, or the higher end, fizzy, somewhat screechy vocals like Periphery, Threat Signal, Meshuggah, try singing into the absolute highest part of your range, and then go HIGHER! push some more air through your vocal cords on a bright "Ah" or "ae (cat)" and you will feel breakup in your throat. This may create a sort of screeching, similar to the metal scream. It ideally will resonate your False Folds (look it up) in the same way that a high-gain Amp head breaks up tubes on the distortion channel. If you try to fine tune this, it may work in a way that's sustainable for long periods of time. When I sang this way, I could only do it on one note, and it felt like a completely different set of muscles were being used compared to singing. If it hurts, STOP! This did work for me for a while, but I did eventually stop because I still felt a little fatigue, enough to get in the way of singing Italian Opera Arias. Yet, it can be sustained for a few years. 

Ever wonder why Randy Blythe's voice is so low? Fatigue maybe? Perhaps he used to sing Tenor? just something to think about. Some people are really, truly great at it, like Devin Townsend. He truly is an Alien. In fact, vocally, the album is f*cking astounding. The ability to hit those notes in the screamy, high-pitched screech, is an act of god. 

For Black metal style, similar to Mikael Akerfeldt of Opeth, I assume a similar technique is taken from the screechy style, but instead of creating vocal break-up in the upper range of your voice, it's in the lowest part of your range, and creating a sort of "Vocal Fry". That's completely speculation, but try it and get back to me about it!




If all else fails, just remember that tension ANYWHERE is bad, and if it's tense, you're doing it wrong. According the classical technique anyway. I realize it's hard to do everything right in "Rock", but it's really all down to stamina. If you want to be able to sing for a long time, then don't tense. Simple as that.


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## youheardme (Jun 15, 2010)

I'm terrible at singing... Where should I start?


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## Dragonfly (Jun 15, 2010)

I'm getting vocal lessons started in September, is there a good way to start preparing for this. I've already played saxophone in the past, so I'm good with the diaphragmatic breathing (I think.. how do I check this? - my shoulders don't move much when breathing and I feel my stomach go up and down not my chest (though my chest does move, it just doesn't feel like it's moving the same way as when I breath using my chest.)

But when singing (especially on high tuned parts) I will get dizzy after a while even while drinking a lot, I will get the feeling of getting out of breath a lot quicker when I'm about 15 minutes into singing a rock/pop song. And after about 30minutes I start feeling my throat thicken up, that's when I stop.

Am I not breathing all my air out (breathing in too soon?) .. Because I feel when breathing through my stomach there always feels a little bit air left in the bottom part of my stomach which I _can_ push out, but that also starts making me dizzy.

Normally I never get dizzy, when normally talking/breathing neither, only when I start paying attention to my breathing and start 'singing' along with a song.
I try to keep everything as relaxed as possible with my back straight.

If you got advice on these things it would be nice and I wish you best of luck with your vocal trainings!


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 15, 2010)

Thanks for getting this going. I'll do my absolute best to answer these as soon as I can. Keep 'em coming!


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## Dragonfly (Jun 15, 2010)

Now, I've already researched some stuff,, so I know a bit what you're talking about, but it would be really explaining if you would give some examples (in form of youtube vids/soundsclips.. they don't have to be your clips/video's but just for demonstration, like when you talk about "alot of men tend to depress their soft palate a.k.a. Uvula to try and "press" a sound out, which is horrible" 
This is really hard to imagine when you haven't seen/heard anything about it.
(Or maybe some image material when you're talking about where the breathing should be.)

At least, that's what got me some information about this all, text can be a lot harder to understand when you're new to theoretic stuff like this (just a tip from my experience)

But I like the input you're already putting in this, so I'm gonna ask if you have some specific breathing exercises that can be done over the day?
I mean: I sit in the train a lot, and that's boring, I can't use that time in a useful way, but maybe that can change if I can do some breathing exercises in the train (without making a complete douche out of myself in public off course )

Thank you!


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## The Atomic Ass (Jun 15, 2010)

youheardme said:


> I'm terrible at singing... Where should I start?


Ahh, beat me to it.


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## Deadnightshade (Jun 15, 2010)

First of all i can sing with minimum air,"locking" my breath and being able to aim directly at the pitch

Here are my problems/questions:
1)i'm a very shy person and when i'm about to sing in front of other people,i get tight and i can't let the note ring through my nose,although when i'm for example in my car i feel more relaxed with some warmup i'm good to go.Any tips on getting more relaxed?
2)I know how to apply grit in my voice,but i can't get always the amount of heat i want for example as DIO or Robert Lowe (Solitude Aeturnus,Candlemass) unless i sing just a pinch louder in that case.I can keep the grit pushing very little,singing low volume and actually being able to aim at notes,like for example some sounds Tori Amos does (dunno if you got what i mean).I know you are proficient at classical singing but do you have any tips on that?
3)Is it normal to feel the voice ringing in your mouth (for example in a lower note),instead of ringing more towards the nose and the head (which i feel when i sing for example dust in the wind)?
4)which is the difference between chest voice and ringing the note upwards like when singing a bit high pitched song like dust in the wind?(i'm giving this example cause there are high notes there which you can't imitate if you push too much)
5)What about falsetto/head voice?In order to get a clean falsetto note (not as the singer of muse would do,but more like for example Rob Halford or John Oliva) i'll have to push more to actually feel it ring in my head,which makes me a bit uncomfortable cause i can't switch between notes with the same ease.Any tips on that?About falsetto with a bit of grit as Daniel Gildenlow does in some songs?


Sorry if i was long i never took lessons,i've just watched some vids and i practice a lot (well..in my car..i'm to shy to sing in front of my parents for example+little time due to university) and i always wanted to ask things like that..Correct me if i said anything wrong i'm just trying to describe from what i've heard and through experience..I'd appreciate any advice..A million thanks


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## Semi-pro (Jun 15, 2010)

getaway_fromme said:


> Practice isn't supposed to sound good, the performance is.



That is so true! 


Trying to clarify the "pressing" thing a little:

Ever made a squealing sound with a balloon by letting the air out little by little? Ever squeezed an old fashioned horn (those with the rubber ball in the other end) to produce a sound from it?

Now imagine that your lungs are the ball with all the air inside. It's tempting to crunch out all the air under the illusion of producing a loud sound. This however will increase tension all over the body and very few places will remain relaxed enough to actually resonate with the sound. And like the horn, the sound won't last too long either. Don't do like this.

If you instead imagine that your breath support muscles around your waist and the diaphragm are extended like a balloon, they'll almost effortlessly squeeze the air out, just like the balloon. You'll just need to learn to control the air pressure in the end where all the air comes out, just like you control the emptying balloon with your fingers.


Now that's just a way of thinking that has helped me sometimes. Do you see anything worth confirming in that, getaway_fromme ?


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## Trespass (Jun 15, 2010)

I am interested in two voices in particular: Warrel Dane from Nevermore, and the cleans of Devin Townsend of Devin Townsend Project.

1) Could you explain what they're doing to get the tone they do?

2) How long would it take a untrained vocalist studying with a classical voice instructor to get to that degree of performance ability?

3) How many hours can you, a vocal instructor, practice a day for an upcoming difficult/challenging performance before it becomes unsafe?
(i.e. I can practice for 2 hours a day on this challenging Aria without risking damage to my voice)




Examples/References:

Warrel Dane of Nevermore:


Devin Townsend: (1:00, 2:34)


I love the sound of his voice!

As a Classically trained pianist (Gr. 10 RCM-Canada), I really enjoy what you've said about the technicalities of vocal technique so far, thanks!


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Hey guys. Just letting you know that I updated the main post here to include some more specific info, and I will be back on to help more tomorrow! It took me a little long to make the modifications, but I will respond back to all of your posts, so don't worry if I don't get to it right away, I'll be back soon! Much love. Hope the update helps.


PS - if you want to throw in some examples like the guy above, that would be great. I'll try to find some videos on youtube, but unfortunately I don't have a video camera right now


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## Stealthdjentstic (Jun 16, 2010)

Great post, thanks!


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Dragonfly said:


> I'm getting vocal lessons started in September, is there a good way to start preparing for this. I've already played saxophone in the past, so I'm good with the diaphragmatic breathing (I think.. how do I check this? - my shoulders don't move much when breathing and I feel my stomach go up and down not my chest (though my chest does move, it just doesn't feel like it's moving the same way as when I breath using my chest.)
> 
> But when singing (especially on high tuned parts) I will get dizzy after a while even while drinking a lot, I will get the feeling of getting out of breath a lot quicker when I'm about 15 minutes into singing a rock/pop song. And after about 30minutes I start feeling my throat thicken up, that's when I stop.
> 
> ...




So you aren't running out of air? Ok, check the tightness in your throat. To be specific, tightening the throat (making it a smaller air hole), will give you a more pressed, straight, intense, desirable pop vocal tone. If you're trying to push too much air through a really tight throat, then your muscles are exerting too much energy. It's like creating a bottleneck. Try singing quieter, and try to go for a more steady stream of air, that way, your Larynx isn't overworked and pressurized, which will make it tired and mucusy. If you sing at a lower volume, try to sing through the cracks into your falsetto, if you're talking about someone like Stevie Wonder or Michael Jackson. A great deal of falsetto at lower volumes will equalize your air flow and possibly solve some of this problem? I'm not sure if it's a tense throat, but check back with it. Your falsetto will only get stronger over time. After I'm done singing Alto in an Episcopal church choir, singing solo Tenor rep. is extremely easy because I spent SO MUCH time warming up my mixed voice and falsetto. It's all about equalizing the breath pressure between your chest and head voice. 

In any case, singing through your cracks and just letting it crack over and over will go a long way. Rather than tightening your throat when singing high notes, just let your chest voice flip over into falsetto, and it will hopefully get more comfortable in time. It may be awhile, but keep it up. 

Check back. Doctor's orders.


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Semi-pro said:


> If you instead imagine that your breath support muscles around your waist and the diaphragm are extended like a balloon, they'll almost effortlessly squeeze the air out, just like the balloon. You'll just need to learn to control the air pressure in the end where all the air comes out, just like you control the emptying balloon with your fingers.



Yes. Controlling the air flow is exactly what it comes down to. If you're singing high notes in whatever register, you have to make sure to equalize that pressure you're pushing out of your lungs and how open your throat is. 

Ok, this is a way to feel how open and how closed your throat is. 

Say "a nice man". Then say, "An ice man". The difference between the two is that for "An ice man", you're using a glottal stroke to push your uvula up right before the initial "I" vowel of Ice. It's kind of like squeezing a tube to pop open the top. 

On the other side of the spectrum, using an "H" sound completely opens up your throat. And, of course, there are many variations in between, but using an H to begin warm up exercises is a great to get the air moving and the throat open. Make sure your ribcage is expanded the whole time while you're singing, and try not to make a noise when you inhale.


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Dragonfly said:


> Now, I've already researched some stuff,, so I know a bit what you're talking about, but it would be really explaining if you would give some examples (in form of youtube vids/soundsclips.. they don't have to be your clips/video's but just for demonstration, like when you talk about "alot of men tend to depress their soft palate a.k.a. Uvula to try and "press" a sound out, which is horrible"
> This is really hard to imagine when you haven't seen/heard anything about it.
> (Or maybe some image material when you're talking about where the breathing should be.)
> 
> ...



Put alot of stuff in the OP that might help. And get used to sounding like a douche in front of people. Eventually you'll sound good and they won't think you're a douche!


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Deadnightshade said:


> First of all i can sing with minimum air,"locking" my breath and being able to aim directly at the pitch
> 
> Here are my problems/questions:
> 1)i'm a very shy person and when i'm about to sing in front of other people,i get tight and i can't let the note ring through my nose,although when i'm for example in my car i feel more relaxed with some warmup i'm good to go.Any tips on getting more relaxed?
> ...




1. Sing more in front of people. Practice it until you're really not nervous to do it anymore, or at least so it lowers how nervous you get. Really, take the opportunity to sing in the car with the windows open and not directly looking at people, make yourself sing at full voice while people can hear you and just get used to it. You're probably closing down because you're not used to singing in front of people. It 's just like speech class. Just get comfortable doing it in front of your friends, walking down the street, driving in the car, in band practice, whatever. No other way around it. We call them professionals because they do it day in, day out. 

2. For the one song I listened to Candlemass, it sounds like he does push a lot of air when he sings, but he's probably covering a little, at least that's what it sounded like in the Itunes preview clip of "Crystal Ball". "Covering" is the act of using the lips to change the size of your mouth when singing a vowel like "ee" to make it sound more like "ih", so maybe he's keeping the same vowel sound for the "ee", but the lips are doing all of the modifying. The position of the tongue and the amount of air pressure are probably the same throughout. 

3. Yes it's normal. It's just resonation, but the sensation comes from a different part of your skull. You may feel more of it in the back of the throat the farther down in your range you go, and for the higher range, it is normal and good to feel the resonation in your nasal cavities. When I get an A full voice for an aria, the amount of resonation is astounding. Literally, I can feel my entire skull vibrate and resound with really high overtones. That's good. It really helps with projection, and then we start dealing with Singer's Formant (look it up) and the like. For example, to combat the sound of a big orchestra, Opera singers can use formants to produce frequencies about that of any of the orchestral instruments, hence giving the impression that the singer is singing really loudly, but in fact is just using different frequencies to sing "over" an orchestra. 

4 + 5. These can be answered together. The "ringing note upward" you are referring to may be the falsetto register. For the 80's singers, it's a very well-developed falsetto. Singing up that high as comfortably as possible will help strengthen this part in your voice. A lot of people will try to make this sound by pushing, as I put in the OP, but the point is to try and make a comfortable shift from your chest voice up to your falsetto. You will eventually learn to not crack as much, and your chest voice will sound more like your falsetto, and vice versa. The Chest voice simply refers to where the resonation is primarily happening. Put your hand on your chest and sing low and loud in your range. You should feel your hand vibrate on your chest. This is resonation. Now, sing really high falsetto. Very lightly, like Michael Jackson going "Woo" like he did so often. It should feel breathy and open in your throat. This is falsetto. With Falsetto, your skull becomes the primary resonator, and it gets more specific for different voice types, but that's the cut and dry of it. 


Hope that helps?


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## Deadnightshade (Jun 16, 2010)

1)sorry i wasn't specific about candlemass the original version of "Crystal Ball" for instance isn't with robert lowe on the vocals he got in the band 2 years or so ago ..better listen to this with his other band:




around the chorus for instance from 2:33

and an example from dio listen to the chorus of the song "pain" from the album "strange highways".How the fuck does he manage to pull such grit right away?Sorry i didn't link it here i just can't find the album version on youtube





As for resonance on the back of my throat,it's ok for the lower notes,but i can resonate some notes that way and in the nasal area if i want,so i guess it depends on the sound i want to produce in some ranges..The only thing that worries me is sometimes when i push a pinch more when trying grit i resonate a bit harder on the throat and i feel it when i touch myself (MY THROAT I MEAN ).Any case that also happens to the singers above?Or maybe in the female singer below?:



the whole song is very subtle and towards the end she goes like forte fortissimo  if you listen when she says "down" with grit,i guess her throat resonates maybe too much and almost no resonating in her nasal cavity (at least that's what i get when i try to immitate that sound,whith a bit more pushing)


2)My range btw is very close to Rowan London's of the band Virgin Black..Check songs like "museum of iscariot","of your beauty","Requiem Kyrie".I think you'll love them due to your classical education  Any comments on his voice and technique?

3)How can i get a fat vibrato from the start of my phrase?Do you have to move periodically some muscles that you don't when trying to sing at perfect pitch?

4)FINALLY,when i used to push more,i could do easier "folk" vocals like the ones lisa gerrard does in dead can dance.( check "the host of seraphim" for instance).I still can do them,but trying to do it a bit faster or going up and down a bigger range doesn't work now i sing a lot quieter and i try to keep the notes in the nasal area.Any advice?Is it a matter of cracking the note by moving some muscles and then just practice onto recovering the resonance in the nasal cavity right away?



Sorry for my GIGANTIC post and that i ask some stuff outside your primary education..I appreciate your answers very much


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 16, 2010)

Deadnightshade said:


> 1. As for resonance on the back of my throat,it's ok for the lower notes,but i can resonate some notes that way and in the nasal area if i want,so i guess it depends on the sound i want to produce in some ranges..The only thing that worries me is sometimes when i push a pinch more when trying grit i resonate a bit harder on the throat and i feel it when i touch myself (MY THROAT I MEAN ).Any case that also happens to the singers above?Or maybe in the female singer below?:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





1. For both singers, that screamy sound comes from the false folds and from putting a little scream into your notes. This works best when the notes are at the extremes of register, which in the woman's case, it was. I put a section in the OP pertaining to this which might help. Same with the guy in the first band. Think of it like blending two different techniques together; Singing and screaming. Try some of the stuff I in the OP, and really just try to feel how you make the screamy sound. Once you know how to make it, you can control it, and mix it in with your singing voice. As far as the pinching of vocal cords, you won't need more air, it's register. The grit comes from how high they are singing. If you make low grumble sounds, that's the sensation you need to add in. It's not more air pressure. 

2. His technique is pretty good, actually. From what I heard, he seems to have the proper breath support and throat openness, but he uses his lips to cover certain vowels and make them sound darker or brighter, according to his needs. Listen to how he sings some of his words compared to how you would in speech. Then try to imitate the exact vowel sound. You should notice your tongue and lips moving into different positions. That's really all it sounds like. I can't get too specific without actually seeing him sing, but its a hypothesis.

3. "Adding" vibrato is touchy. Vibrato, honestly, is nearly unteachable. It's a phenomenon that comes from the phonation process and makes your vocal cords wabble a certain way. It is healthier, by the way, but one really shouldn't force a vibrato. You can only get it from making everything relax - No unwanted tension and an open throat. It's supposed to be natural. 

4. Most of her singing is good, she's a bit under pitch, but good technique nonetheless. Are you referring to the fast, kind of yodelly notes? After listening to a bit more of the song, but only about half way, she sounds like she's flipping back and forth from her chest voice and her upper voice, like a yodel. It would make sense, most Mezzos have a passaggio around F and G in that register. She may push a little air through to make the top note stick out a little bit, but it's nothing too difficult. It's a matter of getting comfortable singing through your break.

Edited after listening to more of the song  sorry.


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## getaway_fromme (Jun 17, 2010)

Trespass said:


> I am interested in two voices in particular: Warrel Dane from Nevermore, and the cleans of Devin Townsend of Devin Townsend Project.
> 
> 1) Could you explain what they're doing to get the tone they do?
> 
> ...




Ok, with Devin Townsend, in the first clip, he seems to be getting a little more nasally compared to the second. In the second part, he's singing with GREAT technique. If you listen to his lyrics and compare them to how one would speak them, you will notice that a lot of the vowel sounds are wider, like the line "I'm alright to fly!" sounds like (because of it's duration) Ah-ihm ah-lr-ah-ee-t to fl-ah-ee. Since most of those words are diphthongs (two vowel sounds in one syllable), Devin stays on the first vowel of each syllable. the word "I'm" is broken down to "Ah"-"ee"-"m", but to conserve energy and create maximum air flow, he stays on the first vowel sound, "Ah", because this vowel creates space in the back of your mouth and throat. 

As far as Warrel Dane, his technique is pretty good too, but his voice is on the edge of cracking in some lines when he sings around an Eb, F. He'll occasionally sing words like "change" nasally, for a text accent. Some of his intensity comes from pressurizing his throat, but for the most part, he has good control over his mixed voice. He never really tries to sing overly bassy (chesty) or completely falsetto. 

To be able to put on a worthwhile performance, I would give it a year or two, at least. It's not that I would ever doubt your musical abilities, but it takes time to make the muscles control your breathing and tone in a non-detrimental way without an instructor on the first go. As far as practicing is concerned, I try to not sing at full voice for more than a half hour on my own, but mostly go full voice in rehearsal. I'm in about 2 rehearsals per day on average, and about 4 or more performances a week. So that might add up to about 3 hours of choral singing and 1 hour of solo singing a day. I really try to avoid full-voice singing on the day of a performance. Trying to practice hitting all of your high notes for an aria will only wear down your vocal cords. I try to warm up all day, little by little, drinking tea the entire time. With Honey and Lemon. As soon as I feel a little dryness when swallowing, I know it's time to stop singing full voice and back it off a little.


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## Trespass (Jun 21, 2010)

I've been looking for your response, but assumed the thread was buried due to no replies. Thanks a lot! Very useful.


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## Charles (Jun 25, 2010)

Richie Kotzen and Chris Cornell. How do they sound the way they do and what is the quickest way to get there?

Sorry for the noob question. I'm not sure how to phrase it more eloquently.


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## Customisbetter (Jun 25, 2010)

This thread wins so hard. Im going to finish reading it tonight.


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## getaway_fromme (Jul 1, 2010)

Charles said:


> Richie Kotzen and Chris Cornell. How do they sound the way they do and what is the quickest way to get there?
> 
> Sorry for the noob question. I'm not sure how to phrase it more eloquently.





I'll do some more research into Richie Kotzen, as I've not heard of him before, but Chris Cornell has got some major vocal issues. For starters, he's just screaming. His tone is so gritty and harsh on the voice, he should sing for a death metal band. Correct me if I'm wrong, but he nearly shattered his vocal cords when he was with Audioslave? I saw him in concert once, and he was AMAZING! but only because I'm a metal head and I kinda like screaming  

Seriously though, he's just sing-screaming. He sings solidly in his lower range, but the higher he goes, the more scream he puts into it. That way, he doesn't crack, and he can potentially go up as high as he wants to. That screaming thing is done with the False Folds to some degree, and is covered at the end of the OP. That's really all it is. It's as if he tries to sing the higher notes, can't make it all the way, and resorts to the scream sound just so he can hit the notes!

Lastly, he really brightens up his vowels the more screamy he gets. The brightening comes from singing with the corners of the lips spread more than usual. This also makes it easier to use the False Folds for phonation rather than the True Folds (larynx). By doing this, it somewhat helps get a more nasally, brighter sound. Think of singing "Ooo". When say it, your lips are nearly touching, forming the shape of an O, nearly puckered. He does the exact opposite with some of his brighter vowels, like E's and A's, which spread the corners of the mouth. That's all I can really get from his general singing voice. Man it's good, but damn it's unhealthy. 

That might have been too general, but I hope that helps.


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