# Please Recommend a 35" Scale Budget 5 String



## bostjan (May 24, 2016)

The title should say it all. I'm considering a budget 5 string to have some serious conversions done. I've decided that 35" is going to be a sticking point for me, since a 34" low B seems floppy. I've also noted some reviews on MF state that budget basses advertised as 35" sometimes end up being 34".

Other than that, I'm thinking low dollar amount.

Requirements:
5 String
Bass
Cheap

Strong preferences:
35" scale

Other preferences:
Not super heavy

As a starting point, I was thinking maybe a Dean Edge 5 or a Brice HXB405

Fire away.


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## ThePIGI King (May 24, 2016)

I believe most Schecter 5 strings are 35". Not sure what your dollar amount is, or what your thoughts on used are, but if you want a cheap 35", a used Schecter Omen might be your way.


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## LordCashew (May 24, 2016)

Your starting point seems pretty solid, as is the Schecter recommendation. You might also want to consider a used Peavey Grind. Those can be had sub-$300 and are nice looking (IMO) 35" neckthroughs. People's main gripe is usually the electronics IIRC, but if you're doing "serious conversions" I imagine that's probably going to be addressed anyway. There are also the usual recommendations of used Ibanez BTB and ESP/LTD.

Oh, and provided your B string is in fact going to be tuned to B, I wouldn't get too hung up on the scale length. I also favor 35" personally. But I find that in regards to "floppiness," the strings themselves are by far the biggest factor and the easiest to address. IMO you'd limit your options unnecessarily by making 35" a requirement, and might find a 34" bass that would be your best performer with the right set of strings.

Now if you're actually tuning _below_ B and 35" prevents you from going over the threshold of adding another wrap to the string, that would be quite valuable IMO.


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## Winspear (May 24, 2016)

Gotta ask about strings here too, I concur with LordIronSpatula. 
I know you know your stuff about strings though, so maybe you just mean you want to be able to use stock 130 sets for convenience?
I understand if you think the tone is a bit dark and don't want to go up in gauge, but honestly I haven't found B the limit for that. I use a .158 A at 34" and it's just right for tension, just bordering on a bit too dark tonally. 
Try a 145 B and see what you think. D'addario 107 balanced tension 4 string set and their single 145 is just right for B standard I find.

130 B is indeed floppy, but it's still too loose on 35" imo. It makes sense that people would appreciate every extra bit of tension and thus find 35" vastly superior and a necessity for B when using stock 130 sets, but the problem is entirely in the string, not the length, imo. 35" does at least bump a 130 up to the same tension as a 34" 100 E, but I still like a little more, closer to the tension of the A string. Hense the suggestion of the 107 balanced set. Ups the bottom a little and loses the unnecessarily tight D string.

The Dean Edge, I adored my Edge Q6 and an Edge Q5 I also owned for a while. I don't know about the quality of the non-qulited, non-EMG standard Edge ones though. Their website also had them listed as 34" for a while, I guess that was an error, the Qs were certainly 35".


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## bostjan (May 24, 2016)

I have an Edge QF6 that is certainly 35", and I have considered using it for this project, but I prefer to keep it the way it is for now.

I really hate the 0.130" at 34" low B. I've played with different gauges, and I just can't get into the tone nor the feel of a 0.145" 34" low B. A 0.140" 34" is okayish, but it's far from ideal, as I'd actually prefer something along the lines of 39" and a 0.120" tuned to B. Sorry if that hurts anyone's feelings. I know I'm certainly not going to find anything outside Wishbass >35" on a budget, and figured there are plenty of 35" scale instruments around for under $500 US.

It looks like maybe the Brice would be the best option, at $350 new, maybe I'll come across a used one some day soon.

It is interesting to me how guitar manufacturers more recently embraced extended scale as an option, with the new $200 Jackson seven strings being really great for the money and having a 26.5" scale length, yet basses stay the same. Even the upcoming fanned fret basses hitting mass production are a little shorter than pretty much all of the other fanned fret basses that were already available. I think I may know at least two reasons why it's slow to adopt for basses, but it's still too bad.


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## exo (May 24, 2016)

Used Schecter Raiden Special 5 or Omen, depending on how you like your pickups and electronics. Might be able to find a low end esp/Ltd F series.

Not a "real" bass player, but what the rest of the guys are saying about string guage is VERY true, probably even more noticeable than the low string looseness issues on 7/8/9 string guitars. That extra inch of scale makes a lot less difference in the feel than going up in string size. If you plan on going below B, you NEED to go with at least a 135, and will probably find a 140 or 145 preferable, even on a 35" scale. It's been my experience that a 135 at A flat is "workable" on a 35" scale, but far from ideal....any lower than that, and things just fall off a cliff......


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## bostjan (May 24, 2016)

I'm planning on tuning pretty close to B (30.68 Hz, so a tad below).

How about you guys recommend whatever, and if it's just a great deal for a 34" scale, I'll consider it. If we go that route, though, there's a bass on Rondo for, something like $150 with music-man style pickups, that I might be able to live with.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 24, 2016)

Schecter... anything.

Yamaha RBX775 used. Got mine for a good deal.


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## Winspear (May 24, 2016)

I understand - thought that was the case as I know you dislike your inharmonicity  I actually have a 39.5" on order and can't wait to hear how it sounds on the 'normal' strings.
I'd go for the Brice 
30.68hz...is that A=437hz? Never heard of that one before!


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## iron blast (May 24, 2016)

Brice has a multi scale 6 for $500 I know that's not super affordable but it's the cheapest option to get 37" scale low string


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## Nlelith (May 25, 2016)

Used MIK Schecter or Ibanez BTB. Stiletto-5 Session or Riot-5 Session would be absolutely great, because swamp ash bodies should be very lightweight. My BTB405 has basswood body and it's also quite light.


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## LordCashew (May 25, 2016)

bostjan said:


> I really hate the 0.130" at 34" low B. I've played with different gauges, and I just can't get into the tone nor the feel of a 0.145" 34" low B. A 0.140" 34" is okayish, but it's far from ideal, as I'd actually prefer something along the lines of 39" and a 0.120" tuned to B. Sorry if that hurts anyone's feelings. I know I'm certainly not going to find anything outside Wishbass >35" on a budget, and figured there are plenty of 35" scale instruments around for under $500 US.



You clearly know what you want and why, so you can ignore my opining. No hurt feelings.

39" sounds like a great idea. I've always wanted to try a Knuckle Quake. In fact I once pondered getting a cheap electric upright and adding frets - such a setup would yield something like a .100 tuned to B at 42". All outside the scope of your project, I imagine.

Good luck!


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## bostjan (May 25, 2016)

Hmm, I guess the Brice Defiant is looking more like it'll fit the bill, if even out of budget. Looking at these "cheap" basses that run $600+, I think it'does be best to save up and get something more along the lines of what I intend. I hope the pickups are okay.



EtherealEntity said:


> I understand - thought that was the case as I know you dislike your inharmonicity  I actually have a 39.5" on order and can't wait to hear how it sounds on the 'normal' strings.
> I'd go for the Brice
> 30.68hz...is that A=437hz? Never heard of that one before!



It's A=440 Hz in 19-EDO.


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## bostjan (May 25, 2016)

LordIronSpatula said:


> You clearly know what you want and why, so you can ignore my opining. No hurt feelings.
> 
> 39" sounds like a great idea. I've always wanted to try a Knuckle Quake. In fact I once pondered getting a cheap electric upright and adding frets - such a setup would yield something like a .100 tuned to B at 42". All outside the scope of your project, I imagine.
> 
> Good luck!



42" electric upright? Wow! I've seen acoustic uprights that size before, but the only electric uprights I've seen have been shorter than the typical 7/8 scale basses.

Have you tried one fretless? It'seems really not that difficult on a long scale upright to hit the notes in tune. It takes some practice, but it is rrewarding, IMO.

Wish has made some 40" fretless electric basses. They look cool (ish) from far away, but I've heard many horror stories about how kludgey they are in person. I'd still love to judge for myself.

I convinced myself that I saw a four string fretted subcontra bass in a guitar magazine with a globe motif finish. It would have been mid-90s, though, and now I doubt my memory, since there would have been no such thing as strings for it. Nowadays, though, with the multiscale production basses like the SRFF, Brice, and NG2, I think we might get into more availability of stuff to string up subcontra or extra long scale lengths.


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## ixlramp (May 25, 2016)

If it's going to be microtonally fretted an unlined fretless with a rosewood board is a good idea.


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## LordCashew (May 27, 2016)

bostjan said:


> 42" electric upright? Wow! I've seen acoustic uprights that size before, but the only electric uprights I've seen have been shorter than the typical 7/8 scale basses.
> 
> Have you tried one fretless? It'seems really not that difficult on a long scale upright to hit the notes in tune. It takes some practice, but it is rrewarding, IMO.



I actually use a 5-string electric upright from Ergo Instruments. His EUBs come with 42" scale as standard. It's not too difficult to hit the notes in tune, especially with the inlaid position markers. Well, plucked at least. Playing with a bow magnifies any discrepancies in one's intonation. But still, the fact that these don't need to produce strong acoustic volume allows you to set them up with ridiculously low action, which makes them much easier to play than an orchestral instrument.

The reason I've thought about fretting one (or having him build one with frets, as he has) was simply to make it sound more like an electric bass for subcontra tuning. I'd also want to use roundwound strings and magnetic pickups if that were the case. Currently I'm just trying to emulate the sound of a real upright, mostly so I have the option of using a bow. For this, my setup is a set of D'addario Helicore orchestral mediums in B standard through the stock under-saddle piezo.

A typical upright bass low B (and there are quite a few options) at 42" doesn't have the same tendency toward floppiness as a typical electric low B at 34" IME. If you're thinking about doing 19 EDO, that might lay out nicely on a 42" fretless fingerboard. I got my Ergo for about $500 on ebay. Just saying...



bostjan said:


> Wish has made some 40" fretless electric basses. They look cool (ish) from far away, but I've heard many horror stories about how kludgey they are in person. I'd still love to judge for myself.



There is a megathread on TalkBass full of owner-refurbished WishBasses. A lot of them are quite beautiful after a little additional work. People also seem to love how they sound. If you're handy, that might also be a viable and economical option.


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## ixlramp (May 28, 2016)

Secondhand might be good, many basses are cheap because the frets are old and need replacing, if you're going to pull those out you'll be extending the life of a bass instead of pulling out new frets. This is why i usually convert secondhand basses to microtonal, it's also less stressful if i make a mess of it.


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## Winspear (May 28, 2016)

This thread makes me happy, cool to see people discussing alternative use of EUBs  I really wanted to pick one up to throw some Kaliums on in E0, but I really have no idea how it will behave haha


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## LordCashew (May 28, 2016)

EtherealEntity said:


> This thread makes me happy, cool to see people discussing alternative use of EUBs  I really wanted to pick one up to throw some Kaliums on in E0, but I really have no idea how it will behave haha



Well, I hope I'm not hijacking the thread but...



That's an 8-string Ergo tuned to F#, I believe. He gets into the subcontra range around 2:20. This guy's upright technique is questionable, but the video gives some idea of what the instrument could be capable of.

I imagine he's using a heavy upright low B for the F#. With electric strings like Kaliums, you could get much greater tension if you wanted to. Electric strings are also harder on the fingerboard (not to mention the bow hair), so you might want to think about coating a non-ebony fretless fingerboard if you were to use them (and get a cheap bow if you want to use one).


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