# Disadvantages of a 2 2x12 cabinet setup vs. 1 4x12



## Zepp88 (Nov 22, 2007)

Yep, do the 2x12 cabinets sound any worse than a 4x12?

I'm thinking of going this way with Vader cabinets. 

I'm pretty sure this has been discussed before, I just didn't see it in a search..


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## SHREDTOKILL (Nov 22, 2007)

this is so weird i was thinking the same thing this morning, would it sound tighter or more articulate to have 2 212's?
hope someone knows hah.


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## darren (Nov 22, 2007)

The biggest advantage is not breaking your back when trying to move it.


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## bulb (Nov 22, 2007)

yeah 2x12s will sound great, you would have to a/b because different cabs will react differntly to their 4x12 counterpart, but the best part is that you can mix and match 2 diff cabs
what sucks is lugging them around, very unpractical, so i am a single 4x12 fan maself


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## budda (Nov 22, 2007)

disadvantages? that one extra trip to the car for your stuff. that's about it.


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## bulb (Nov 22, 2007)

well if you have a 4x12 with casters not only is it one less trip, but you can pile stuff like your amp and rack on your 4x12 and push it around instead of having to lift each piece, a huge deal if you are playing regularly.


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## darren (Nov 22, 2007)

You can put casters on 2x12s as well. 

My old G-Flex was a monster, so i put casters on it. It was great until i played a club with stairs.


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## ibznorange (Nov 22, 2007)

dude
for 2x12s i've heard wonderful things about earcandy cabs


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## Zepp88 (Nov 22, 2007)

Seems like it would be easier to carry them around, arrange in a car for transport, adapt to apartments, etc..

Just not really sure if it would be worth paying for the two 2x12s vs. the one 4x12? 

It would seem the 2x12s would have a bit tighter response as well..


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## budda (Nov 23, 2007)

1 412: $600 for a good one
1 good used 212: $300

*shrugs* you're not really spending extra money if you go the 2x212 route. the 212 tightness would depend more on the speakers and the construction, wouldnt it? we all know orange and vader cabs are incredibly tight: construction and high power handling.


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## Ojinomoto (Nov 23, 2007)

I know NOTHING about guitar amps (<-Noob) but I have a thought...
If one is to have two different 2x12s wouldn't his tone have the possibility of sounding ungodly because the different tone variations? 


Kinda like the double-amp thing on a Line6 X3.


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## Leon (Nov 23, 2007)

darren said:


> The biggest advantage is not breaking your back when trying to move it.





plus, if you're trying to keep your stage volume down, a 4x12 is redonkulous. i actually removed a speaker from my Mesa Nomad 2x12 combo, to make it a 1x12, and i could STILL hear myself very well on stage. the trick is to aim the speaker right at your head.

just ask yourself...

do i have roadies? yes, 4x12(s) are the way to go.
am i my own roadie? yes, a 2x12 is sufficient.


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## starsnuffer (Nov 23, 2007)

The only 2x12's that sound as big as 4x12 are the "vintage" style 2x12's (bluesbreaker/bogner/ect). Two of these are much bigger then a single 4x12 so room in the van may be an issue.

4x12's are incredibly easy to move, so I don't really think that is an issue. Casters are cheap.

The only reason for using 2 2x12's would be for a stereo setup. . . which have limited use in live enviorments but rule for the bedroom.

-W


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## Leon (Nov 23, 2007)

starsnuffer said:


> 4x12's are incredibly easy to move, so I don't really think that is an issue. Casters are cheap.



casters are cheap, but helpful bandmates are rare


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## FoxZero (Nov 23, 2007)

From what I observed so far is that the 2x12 counterparts do not have the bass that the 4x12s have, simply because the 4x12 is larger. I'd say stick your current 2x12 on an angled stand so the highs get to you better.

I say slant 4x12s own because of the coverage. BTW I haven't been in a band without helpful bandmates so far, in mine we kick out the jerks because we don't have all day for the drummer to set himself up. You and a buddy can easily carry a 4x12 up a flight of stares if we can lol. Don't let bandmates be !


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## noodles (Nov 23, 2007)

The main problem with a pair of 2x12's (at least for me) is that most clubs will only mic one. This is fine if they are identical, but if you're mixing and matching, then forget it. It is also one more thing to lug around, one more speaker cable to worry about, and one more thing that can go wrong.

As Leon said, you don't even need two of them. They're loud enough that one will suffice.


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## noodles (Nov 23, 2007)

FoxZero said:


> BTW I haven't been in a band without helpful bandmates so far, in mine we kick out the jerks because we don't have all day for the drummer to set himself up. You and a buddy can easily carry a 4x12 up a flight of stares if we can lol. Don't let bandmates be !



 

In Division, the whole band keeps working until all the gear is on the stage. Ditto when it comes time to drag it all off. Bands really do need to act like a team to make everything flow smoothly.

Now, I have been in the situation where one band member realizes this, so he drags his feet to keep from having to move so much stuff. That was my last band, and suffice to say, he didn't last long.


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## FoxZero (Nov 23, 2007)

^^^
He sums it up well.

Plus with a 2x12 there is less resistance going to your speakers so it could actually be louder depending on the ohms of the speakers.


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## ibznorange (Nov 23, 2007)

noodles said:


> The main problem with a pair of 2x12's (at least for me) is that most clubs will only mic one.



thats why you do all your own levels, mic all your own stuff, and send a single processed out to the sound guy


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## FoxZero (Nov 23, 2007)

noodles said:


> In Division, the whole band keeps working until all the gear is on the stage. Ditto when it comes time to drag it all off. Bands really do need to act like a team to make everything flow smoothly.
> 
> Now, I have been in the situation where one band member realizes this, so he drags his feet to keep from having to move so much stuff. That was my last band, and suffice to say, he didn't last long.



That's cool. That's the way it should be, I mean the drummer's gotta deal with all those mics and pieces why sit there and make him deal with it all?

I kinda run my band (though I don't really want to most of the band has maturity issues), so pretty much they listen to me when we're setting things up. If someone's slacking off, they hear from me (after I talk to rest of the band). If they don't straighten out they're gone.

It's also kinda lame that I ran things cause although I have the most experiance and I'm the only one so far that's done multible gigs, I'm still a bit of newb and they all look to me to figure out what to do so it's tough sometimes.


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## Darth Nihilus (Aug 2, 2010)

Or you can get a 2x12 that's as loud as a 4x12 and if it's a detuned design like my 2x12 I bought from a small shop called "Happy Cabs", you'll never return to a conventional cab design again! 

I have a buddy who bought a 1x12 Detuned cab from these guys and he said the guys have an old Mesa/Boogie half open back 4x12 in the shop and even with four speakers, the 4x12 BARELY kept up. I couldn't believe it so I went to the shop in Azusa, Ca. and heard it for myself. I ordered two 2x12 cabs. The only thing that might be an issue is the size of the cabs. My 2x12 is slightly larger than a regular 4x12 due to the required size needed for the ports but the cabs are lighter because there are two less speakers. They're also expensive. The 2x12's go for $949.00, about the price of a Mesa but the tone is just killer. There's simply no better sounding cab out there. I love them and you guys can check them out on Myspace.com/happycabs

They have sound comparisons with the old Mesa 4x12.
BTW, here are some pictures I took of my cab and that the shop emailed me.









And here's a picture of their 4x12 they call THE BEAST


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## Harry (Aug 2, 2010)

Old thread is OLD 
But that was actually pretty interesting and useful info for a necro thread bump, so it should be no issue


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## BabUShka (Aug 2, 2010)

hehe indeed..  
As far as I can remember, Andy Timmons prefer 2x 212 cabinest insted of a 412 because of the sound. 
I dont know, but I might have an theory that with 2x 212 you can "spread" the sound even better by pointing the cab in different ways


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 2, 2010)

That 4x12 sized 2x12 kinda defeats the whole idea of having 2 2x12's.


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## TMM (Aug 2, 2010)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> That 4x12 sized 2x12 kinda defeats the whole idea of having 2 2x12's.



+1

One of the best compact live setups I've seen was a guy that had a rack w/ TriAxis, GForce, & 2:90, and (2) Thiele 112 cabs. He spread the cabs out a little on stage, and his tone was awesome and full, even though it was only 2 speakers.


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## Dehumanize (Aug 2, 2010)

Vader 212s don't have the 'boom' that the 412. It's still there, but not quite the same. I currently play a Vader 212 on top of a 412, at least 'til I can snag a 215.


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## brodjentle (Aug 2, 2010)

I would love a thiele! But they are expensive


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## Darth Nihilus (Aug 3, 2010)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> That 4x12 sized 2x12 kinda defeats the whole idea of having 2 2x12's.



The whole point of the Happy Cabs stuff is that if you're looking for the volume of a standard 2x12, you get a Happy Cabs 1x12.
Getting a HC2x12 would be like using a standard 4x12 volume-wise.

You wouldn't need two Happy Cabs 2x12's. If you're looking for a cab with the volume of a traditional 4x12, a single Happy Cabs 2x12 will do it louder and sonically better. If you're looking for the volume of a traditional 2x12, the Happy Cabs 1x12 will do it. That's the cab my buddy got.

The whole point of these cabs is that they'll give you the volume you want with less speakers and will often times produce an even louder volume than a standard cab with twice the speakers. The HC 2x12 although slightly larger than a standard 4x12, is easier to move because it's lighter due to less speakers.

I'm sorry if I'm going on here. I just think these cabs are the best thing out there.


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## Samer (Aug 3, 2010)

Just a quick FYI, i have both a vader 2x12 and 4x12, i found in live environments the 4x12 just reacts much better to my head (Engl Invader 100). It has more of an "open" feel. 

The 2x12 is fine for what is, but there is a big volume difference between the two.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 3, 2010)

Darth Nihilus said:


> .



As far as I know # of speakers has nothing to do with volume. The size of the cabinet / # of speakers has to do with frequency response and how it pushes air. 

I used to run a 200w 4x12 and now I run a 250w 2x12, I haven't noticed a huge difference in volume and if anything my 2x12 is louder. The main difference is how they project and how much bass they're putting out. 

The whole idea of running a 2x12 is that its half the SIZE of a 4x12, which cuts a lot of excess bass and makes the thing way easier to move / transport. You'd get 2 2x12's so you could push as much air as a 4x12 but still have the tighter bass response and be able to move the cabinets separately which is way more convenient. 

If you have a 4x12 sized 2x12 you have added a ton of bass back into the picture, even more with a huge ported cab like that and then you made it huge and clunky again. 

Again it defeats the purpose. Not to shit in your cereal if you like your cab kudos to you but it completely goes against the entire idea behind using a 2x12 over a 4x12.


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## Mop (Aug 3, 2010)

In my experience pushing less/more air is a very good way to get quieter/louder.
Disconnect one of the speakers in that 2x12 and don't move the volume on your amp if you don't believe me (change the impedance setting obviously).
You can't compare a 200w 4x12 to a 250w 2x12, the speakers are obviously completely different and therefore behave differently 

Moving from a 4x12 to a 2x12 or 1x12 is a much better way of reducing volume (assuming the speakers are the same or similar) than changing your head (unless you go from a 100watt tube to a 5 watt tube head or something)


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## m4rK (Aug 3, 2010)

very good info all around in this thread! For me, I'll run my 4x12 forever, I love it and thats reason enough to not change!
I also dont think of myself as hercules either but I can pack mine up the stairs alone. I'm not saying everyone on heres a wuss, but its not nearly as bad as most people act like!


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