# Let's talk about baritone sixes



## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 1, 2013)

Basically, what are some good production model baritone sixes that can compete price-wise with a seven string? I realised, looking for seven string guitars, I had completely overlooked baritone 6 string guitars.

I know schecter do a 30" model, and there are a few 26"+ ibanezes, but I don't know much about their reputation and how they stand up to seven string guitars. Not many people seem to use baritone six string guitars. Is there a reason for this, or are they just less popular? Is a baritone 6 a good choice in lieu of a seven string? 

cheers


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## shawnperolis (Nov 1, 2013)

Fender just made a Bass VI for like 350 bucks. 30" scale. Pretty cool.


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 1, 2013)

shawnperolis said:


> Fender just made a Bass VI for like 350 bucks. 30" scale. Pretty cool.



WWWill it djent?


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## djohns74 (Nov 1, 2013)

It depends on what you're going to do with it. If one has no need for the range (additional string) afforded by a seven string, I don't entirely understand why one would elect to play one versus simply down-tuning a six string. Then, if the goal is down-tuning, a longer scale length is often seen as beneficial for string tension versus string diameter issues, though this is extremely subjective at the same time. 

The fact is though that if one would be happy with the sound and playability of the lower six strings on a 25.5" scale (for example) seven string, there's no good reason not to just throw heavier strings on a standard scale six string and call it a day. I feel like "baritone" is more about the tonal range available anyway, especially since a 26.5" scale six string is often considered a "baritone" guitar, but can very easily be strung up with normal strings in standard tuning, so what's necessarily so "baritone" about it? If I put 13s on a Les Paul and tune it to Drop A or whatever, how is that less of a baritone?

Anyway, this mini-rant may be a bit off-topic, in which case I apologize. But in terms of whether a baritone six string is a viable alternative to a seven string, I don't feel that there's necessary any comparison between the two, depending on what you want to do with it. If you just want to chug away on a low B string, a seven seems like overkill. Then again, a longer scale six string probably is as well.


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## patata (Nov 1, 2013)

I sent you a PM.


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## coffinwisdom (Nov 1, 2013)

Ibanez Mike Mushok - Neck-through 28" scale

I like it better than the PRS model personally


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## OfArtAndArsenal (Nov 1, 2013)

^That guitar was fantastic.


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## tripforks (Nov 1, 2013)

People usually don't tune down past A or B standard, which is totally doable on 25.5" or 24.75". Sometimes it's even preferred for a "sludgier" or "heavier" kind of tone or attack to the strings, where too long and the strings can sound too piano-like for a lot of people.

It also seems like more of a commitment to buy a baritone 6 string. You have to adjust to a brand new scale length, which can screw up the "feel" for some people, or just their muscle memory from paying Les Pauls their whole life. Not only that, but it always seems easier to downtune a strat than to uptune a Mushok sig, and committing to such a niche instrument is a hard sell. Not to mention that most baritone scaled guitars are 7 or 8 string anyway

But, bari sixes are rad as hell and you should definitely check a few out. Common scales are 26.5" (Ibanez RGD320) , 27" (Fender Jaguar Baritone Special HH), 28" (Fender Blacktop Telecaster Baritone, some Schecters), and 30" (Squier Bass VI, a few Schecters, and anything ending in VI which is more of a bass guitar/baritone guitar lovechild). Who knows, maybe one of those scales will feel like home more than 25.5" or 24.75" ever could, even for a standard E tuning.


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## LeAdEr (Nov 2, 2013)

ZMD said:


> Ibanez Mike Mushok - Neck-through 28" scale
> 
> I like it better than the PRS model personally



Exactly...i own one of the, the Ibanez MMM1 is one of the best guitars i ever owned (and there are some...). I bought it twice, bought the first one, sold it in a critical moment of my live and searched some years (!!) to find another one (here on ss.org, french guy). I am so happy again, will never let the MMM1 go again 

I play just B normal, you can play this tuning on a normal guitar too, but i like the massive sound and handling of my baritone


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## celticelk (Nov 2, 2013)

Slight correction to tripforks' post: the Fender Blacktop baritone Tele is a 27" scale. I agree that thinking seriously about whether you actually need an extended scale for your application is a useful exercise.


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## mitchybang (Nov 2, 2013)

ZMD said:


> Ibanez Mike Mushok - Neck-through 28" scale
> 
> I like it better than the PRS model personally



Exactly!!! I've been posting all over the place trying to find a mint unmodded one. Exceptional instrument. Waaaaaaaay better than the PRS.


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## LeAdEr (Nov 2, 2013)

mitchybang said:


> Exactly!!! I've been posting all over the place trying to find a mint unmodded one. Exceptional instrument. Waaaaaaaay better than the PRS.




Really hard to find. Mine is modded with some EMG´s. I am in contact at the moment with Ibanez to get those original humbuckers.The rest is original, and that´s perfect.


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## mitchybang (Nov 2, 2013)

LeAdEr said:


> Really hard to find. Mine is modded with some EMG´s. I am in contact at the moment with Ibanez to get those original humbuckers.The rest is original, and that´s perfect.



Yeah some guy on eBay is trying to get $750 for his. Personally I think that's a little high.


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## coffinwisdom (Nov 3, 2013)

mitchybang said:


> Yeah some guy on eBay is trying to get $750 for his. Personally I think that's a little high.



My brother paid $600 about 2 years ago for his with some minor cosmetic flaws. That's pretty steep considering it's only a Premium level Ibanez (Made in Korea) and it's about a 10 year old guitar.

However it is one of the best guitars I've ever played. I don't think my brother plans on ever selling his. It's such a unique Ibanez. Hardtail neck-through baritone with a natural finish. It might be worth it.


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## Alice AKW (Nov 4, 2013)

Rondomusic has a bunch of neat Baritones on their site, some for dirt cheap. Among them I've seen 27" Les Pauls and even a 30" Strat


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## shawnperolis (Nov 4, 2013)

^ I really want the 30" strat they have.


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## Roland777 (Nov 4, 2013)

OLP used to make a bad-assed "30-baritone as well. Shame it was discontinued.


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 5, 2013)

Gotdayum, I hate how rondo music have all these supposedly sexy and cheap guitars, but I live in the UK  I guess I'll stick to trying to find a 7 string


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## rockskate4x (Nov 5, 2013)

try some fatter strangs, before spending on a baritone or a seven.


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## DanakinSkywalker (Nov 5, 2013)

There's the Schecter Hellraiser C-VI (30" scale)





Ibanez MMM1 (28" scale)





These are the most popular ones that I know of.


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## mitchybang (Nov 5, 2013)

Love the Mushok. Those were built like tanks.


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## AATTWDIS (Nov 5, 2013)

I picked up a LTD VB400 recently and it's awesome! 27" scale and it's incredibly comfortable, minus the neck dive, haha!


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## ThePhilosopher (Nov 5, 2013)

rockskate4x said:


> try some fatter strangs, before spending on a baritone or a seven.



I'm using 14s on my PRS SE Mushok (~28" scale).


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 6, 2013)

rockskate4x said:


> try some fatter strangs, before spending on a baritone or a seven.



I already use fat strings, but one can only go so low with a six string


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 6, 2013)

AATTWDIS said:


> I picked up a LTD VB400 recently and it's awesome! 27" scale and it's incredibly comfortable, minus the neck dive, haha!



I did have a look at this one, one of the guys from Northlane plays one, so it'd probably be good for dropG-ish


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## FireInside (Nov 6, 2013)

AATTWDIS said:


> I picked up a LTD VB400 recently and it's awesome! 27" scale and it's incredibly comfortable, minus the neck dive, haha!



I have one, very happy with it. Sounds great. There is a bit of neck dive but not too bad. I have definately had way worse. The vb-400's are solid.


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## ThePhilosopher (Nov 6, 2013)

Ed_Ibanez_Shred said:


> I already use fat strings, but one can only go so low with a six string


 I'm down to F (half-step below the lowest note on a standard tuned 8) on one of my 6s.


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## DeKay (Nov 6, 2013)

I want an mmm1 so bad. The prs mm baritone is great but not as perfect looking as the mmm1. I am playing as low as C# with the prs (8string octave)


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## lucasreis (Nov 6, 2013)

shawnperolis said:


> ^ I really want the 30" strat they have.



That strat is sexy, indeed.


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## Yo_Wattup (Nov 6, 2013)

Agile Interceptor Pro 630 EB CP Tribal Red DOT - RondoMusic.com


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 6, 2013)

Yo_Wattup said:


> Agile Interceptor Pro 630 EB CP Tribal Red DOT - RondoMusic.com



If there was ever a budget bolt-on version of this, I'd so be all over it. 

Also I think I'm the only one in this thread that prefers the PRS Mushok.


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## gerbby_doge (Nov 6, 2013)

Since this is a six string baritone thread, I might as well ask. I need help looking for a baritone six string. I'm not quite sure what I want but I am willing to pay at most $1500 for one. I play anything metal and main tuning is drop B.


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## FireInside (Nov 6, 2013)

ThePhilosopher said:


> I'm down to F (half-step below the lowest note on a standard tuned 8) on one of my 6s.



Damn, what size strings you using and what scale length?


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## coffinwisdom (Nov 6, 2013)

gerbby_doge said:


> Since this is a six string baritone thread, I might as well ask. I need help looking for a baritone six string. I'm not quite sure what I want but I am willing to pay at most $1500 for one. I play anything metal and main tuning is drop B.



Ibanez Mike Mushok or PRS SE Mike Mushok are your best bets without going custom. There are also more metal looking baritones by LTD I believe an SG and a LP shape. Schecter has a 30" scale 6 string Hellraiser that's pretty cool but has the typical gaudy finish Schecter used to do.

It's such a niche market. I don't know if you want to go this route but you could order a custom Agile 6 string baritone for under $1300 and choose between 27", 28.625" and 30" scales.

Gibson put out a LP Studio baritone a while back you could find used, and they're putting out an all white SG baritone around the $1500 price range.

Ibanez makes a 6 string 26.5" scale RGD.

You don't necessarily need a baritone to do B tuning that's still within the range of sounding and feeling good on a 25.5" scale with the right strings.


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## ThePhilosopher (Nov 6, 2013)

FireInside said:


> Damn, what size strings you using and what scale lengths?



I'm using .010-.080 on 25.5"-28.625"; tuned F-E in fifths. 

E4 .010"
A3 .014" 
D3 .024" (wound) 
G2 .036" 
C2 .054" 
F1 .080"


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## sniperfreak223 (Nov 7, 2013)

I have a 25.5" sixer tuned to F#BEAC#F# using a custom 14-75 set.

I also have a 27" baritone (Epiphone Love/Death) tuned to ADGCFA with an 11-56 set, and a 30" baritone (BC Rich SE Bich baritone) tuned to EBEADG with a 13-72 set.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 7, 2013)

You don't know how badly I want that BCR Baritone.


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 7, 2013)

ThePhilosopher said:


> I'm using .010-.080 on 25.5"-28.625"; tuned F-E in fifths.
> 
> E4 .010"
> A3 .014"
> ...



Surely your guitar's neck must be a bit worse for wear? Those are some thick strings...


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## BIG ND SWEATY (Nov 7, 2013)

^ that .080 being used for the low F is only 18 lbs which is pretty normal. i bet the strings on your guitar are just as tight if not a little tighter.


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## ThePhilosopher (Nov 7, 2013)

Ed_Ibanez_Shred said:


> Surely your guitar's neck must be a bit worse for wear? Those are some thick strings...



Not really, the tension is progressive and not much more than a standard guitar - in fact it's one of my most comfy easy playing necks. I have a .051 - .182 set on my 5 string bass; those are thick strings.


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## celticelk (Nov 7, 2013)

Ed_Ibanez_Shred said:


> Surely your guitar's neck must be a bit worse for wear? Those are some thick strings...



Note that it's also a fanned-fret, so that 0.080 is at a 28.625" scale length.


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## LordCashew (Nov 7, 2013)

ThePhilosopher said:


> I'm using .010-.080 on 25.5"-28.625"; tuned F-E in fifths.
> 
> E4 .010"
> A3 .014"
> ...



I would love to hear what you do with this.



ThePhilosopher said:


> I have a .051 - .182 set on my 5 string bass; those are thick strings.



And this! Do you have clips anywhere?


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## BrailleDecibel (Nov 7, 2013)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Also I think I'm the only one in this thread that prefers the PRS Mushok.



Make that two of us, if I ever wind up getting another baritone 6'er after my Blacktop Tele, it's gonna be that one.


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## Primitive Guitarist (Nov 7, 2013)

I'm gasing hard for a Baritone backtop tele
Played a few of them and they are real good value for money (about $950NZD over here)
Strung B through b and sounded tasty as


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Nov 8, 2013)

celticelk said:


> Note that it's also a fanned-fret, so that 0.080 is at a 28.625" scale length.



Silly me


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## mitchybang (Nov 11, 2013)

I just scored a MINT MMM1 on eBay last night! Those things are becoming more and more impossible to find in mint condition.


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## Roland777 (Nov 11, 2013)

mitchybang said:


> I just scored a MINT MMM1 on eBay last night! Those things are becoming more and more impossible to find in mint condition.


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## TheWarAgainstTime (Nov 11, 2013)

Damn, I played a show about a year and a half ago and the guitarist/singer of another band was using an MMM1 that looked to be in great shape and fully stock and I didn't even think to ask him about it or to try it out since I had no idea what those things were all about at the time  

Really wish I could try one out since I've liked the PRS Mushok's that I've tried and I imagine the Ibanez would be even better


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## Aghasura (Nov 11, 2013)

Hope not to hijack, but anybody have any good suggestions for a 27" scale production guitar with a fairly flat radius and low, fixed bridge? preferably something that looks a bit vintage. I dig the blacktop tele, but it's got a fairly small radius (9.5). I'd like at least a 14.


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## mitchybang (Nov 11, 2013)

TheWarAgainstTime said:


> Damn, I played a show about a year and a half ago and the guitarist/singer of another band was using an MMM1 that looked to be in great shape and fully stock and I didn't even think to ask him about it or to try it out since I had no idea what those things were all about at the time
> 
> Really wish I could try one out since I've liked the PRS Mushok's that I've tried and I imagine the Ibanez would be even better



Seriously! If you see one, pounce on it! The Ibanez is so much more guitar than the PRS.


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## Danno (Nov 11, 2013)

I recently picked up an MMM1 for £350! Rather pleased with the result, it's a little beat up but nothing obvious. Got a set of Lace Dirty Heshers to put in it and turn it into a doom machine.


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## ceiling_fan (Nov 11, 2013)

I love my Agile Harm 1 with 30 inch scale. Right now I have it tuned to G Standard with D'addario Chromes flatwound 7 string set (top string left out, so 15-65.) I need thicker strings to go lower or Drop F. Also kind of funny how all the strings are wound but the thinnest. Flatwound strings are awesome on a baritone, but not very "metal", I have other guitars for that 


It's such a cool guitar for being so cheap ($379 from Rondomusic)


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## Toxin (Nov 11, 2013)

Has anyone tried this 27" EC-401B? The ESP Guitar Company | 2013 USA Website


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## Aghasura (Nov 11, 2013)

pretty cool


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## Floppystrings (Nov 12, 2013)

rockskate4x said:


> try some fatter strangs, before spending on a baritone or a seven.



That can't even Thordendal, let alone Abasi.


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## Alice AKW (Nov 13, 2013)

Floppystrings said:


> That can't even Thordendal, let alone Abasi.



I actually used to run these on a 25.5 guitar. Worked so-so for anything lower than Bb

This is why I personally prefer baritone scales, as it ets kinda rough bending anything above a 70


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## Aghasura (Nov 13, 2013)

I was using 65s for Bb standard on a 25.5" guitar, and honestly, it was just too muddy for my tastes. 27" has been super nice.


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## LeAdEr (Nov 13, 2013)

Danno said:


> I recently picked up an MMM1 for £350! Rather pleased with the result, it's a little beat up but nothing obvious. Got a set of Lace Dirty Heshers to put in it and turn it into a doom machine.




That´s really cheap. I payed around 600&#8364; for mine, some scratches and stuff. But ,to be honest, i would do it again. This guitar is totally worth it.

At the moment i use 14-70 on standard B but i might use 13-72 Ernie Balls in the Future. I always play some thicker strings, 11-54 on standard E, 11-56 on Drop D and Stuff like that.


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## BrailleDecibel (Nov 17, 2013)

So I got some alright outdoor pics of my Blacktop Baritone Tele, and really couldn't think of anywhere to post them but here, since it really wouldn't require a whole new thread. Enjoy!





















And here's a song I recorded with it, in case anyone's interested in how it sounds:
https://soundcloud.com/telecatastrophe/rise-up-broken-say-your


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## DeKay (Nov 17, 2013)

Prs baritone (27.7 scale) equipped with 090 strings and bkp painkiller tuned to* c#1 *sound example go!:

https://soundcloud.com/caynug/caynug-teaser-1

this thing is a monster groove machine, I don't need anything else!


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## Aghasura (Nov 17, 2013)

nice guitars!


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## kaka (Nov 23, 2013)

Ibanez RGD Series

RGD 320WH






IMO, best bang for your bucks.


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## last_for_death (Nov 23, 2013)

Schecter used to have a baritone 5 string guitar. Trying to find pics.


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## muffinbutton (Nov 23, 2013)

CJLsky said:


> So I got some alright outdoor pics of my Blacktop Baritone Tele, and really couldn't think of anywhere to post them but here, since it really wouldn't require a whole new thread. Enjoy!
> 
> And here's a song I recorded with it, in case anyone's interested in how it sounds:
> https://soundcloud.com/telecatastrophe/rise-up-broken-say-your



1. how is that guitar?

2. I like that song. got a facebook page for your band?


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## celticelk (Nov 24, 2013)

last_for_death said:


> Schecter used to have a baritone 5 string guitar. Trying to find pics.



The Celloblaster, followed by the A-5X and C-5X models. They were intended to be tuned in 5ths, like a cello (AEBF#C# or CGDAE).


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## sifi2112 (Jan 26, 2014)

Seems the MM1 gets a lotta love ..... uhm I keep getting drawn back to that model for some reason


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## Ed_Ibanez_Shred (Mar 23, 2014)

So I've been looking at 3 guitars of different scale lengths: (as serious contenders for purchase)

Ibanez RGIB6 28"
PRS Mike Mushok 27.7"
Schecter C VI Baritone 30" 

Caynug posted a clip in C#1 above with .090 strings using the PRS, has anyone else got experience tuning that low with a similar scale? I always assumed that 27.7" would be too short for C#1 even with ~.090 strings? And surely such a low tuning would sound better on a longer scale with thinner strings?


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## monkeysuncle (Mar 23, 2014)

Those mmm1's are rad but its hard to beat a silverburst PRS bari in my eyes


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## Abborre (Mar 23, 2014)

I've tried the Fender, PRS, Schecter and Ibanez baritone models. The schecter felt like a bass with skinny strings, really hard to play. The one i liked the most is the MMM1, i bought one 2011 and replaced the pickups with a pair of tight BKP Aftermath, could not be happier. The Fender felt like it was 2" radius.. and the PRS was like the MMM! only less resonant.


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## Abborre (Mar 23, 2014)

Ed_Ibanez_Shred said:


> So I've been looking at 3 guitars of different scale lengths: (as serious contenders for purchase)
> 
> Ibanez RGIB6 28"
> PRS Mike Mushok 27.7"
> ...



I play with .076 mostly in G with the MMM1

Here are some short simple tests.

[SC]https://soundcloud.com/palleryde/guitarrig-metal-test[/SC]

and a bit lower, no idea what tuning 
[SC]https://soundcloud.com/palleryde/heavy-guitar-purrrrrr[/SC]


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## Rap Hat (Apr 5, 2014)

I have a semi-custom Agile AL627 I got a few years back, tuned drop-A, and it's a pretty decent sludge metal machine. 27" scale, far too weighty for it's own good, but the stock Agile pickups have this satisfying crunch I wasn't expecting at all. I got it with a wide neck as the larger string spacing is more comfortable for me, but that part isn't for everyone.

Also use the SS.org standard PRS Mushok SE, tuned drop-F#. Mainly running Elixir strings, with the F# a .068. It's light, yet still easy to play. Have a Dimarzio D-Sonic in the bridge, highly recommended for everything from djenty stuff to sludgy metal.

My next baritone sixer will be a 30" scale of some sort. I played a vintage Danelectro baritone at some shop in DC years ago and would've bought it if I'd had the cash. Thing was a surf monster and I can only imagine it through an Orange Rockerverb.


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## tastehbacon (Apr 7, 2014)

I have been gassing for a 30 inch 6 er to be a mix of bass and guitar


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## AkiraSpectrum (Apr 7, 2014)

I used to have an LTD VB-300 27" tuned to B-standard/Drop A (and sometimes Drop Bb). Strung it with 13-59 D'addario's. Great guitar (well made--Korean, played great). I didn't like the neck-dive on it and being a Viper (SG) shape it made it even worse. 
I bought it used and the previous owner threw in active EMG pups (originally came with passive EMGs) which I didn't quite care for (not a fan of standard EMGs). 

In the end instead of swapping new pups I ended up trading it (with cash) for an Ibanez RGA121H CDO which I now use for Drop Bb/Drop A. I find the 25.5" scale more comfortable anyways so it all worked out. 

The VB-300 was a great guitar though. Had a lot of fun with it.

Played some Schecter C-1 EX's in the past and they played really well. The PRS MM model also seemed to be fairly decent, although I didn't get much play time on it.

Maybe some day i'll go back to a baritone 6. But if I do it will be a super strat shape as I found the Viper (SG) shape to be a little awkward with the extended scale. But I know a number of bands who have used Viper Baritones (LTD, ESP and ESP Custom Shops) and loved them (John Lecompt and Ben Moody ex/ Evanescence, now We Are The Fallen and a bunch of other side projects; Also Shaun Glass from DirgeWithin/Bloodline).


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## SkullCrusher (Apr 7, 2014)

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/extended-range-guitars/256310-jackson-custom-shop-doom-soloists.html


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## Grindspine (Apr 7, 2014)

I have not played the six string versions of the Ibanez RGD at 26.5" that were available a couple of years ago. If they compare to the Prestige 7 that I have, I would say they'd be damn fine guitars!


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## Bigredjm15 (Apr 7, 2014)

I had both the PRS and Ibanez mike mushok models at one point. The Ibanez has much more of a thick sound to it. I think it has to do with the woods but the Ibanez really resonates throughout the guitar, it has some serious weight to it as well. The PRS feels more like a standard ibanez guitar but with the extended range. Little more bite and mid range sounds to it. The pickups in the PRS are HOT. Both played about equally well. I have the brownburst for the PRS and it is a very very nice looking guitar in person.


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## wheresthefbomb (Apr 8, 2014)

I want baritone telecaster bad, so baaaaaad


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## ThePhilosopher (Apr 8, 2014)

My Mushok:





PRS SE Mushok with BKP C-Bomb set 
Stock string gauges (.014-.068) tuned GDGDGB


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