# Obama vs Trump 2012



## Sofos

We've all heard the rumours of Trump running against Obama next year. What do you think? Opinions?


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## Chickenhawk

I'll reserve my fairly obvious opinons on Obama, but if America honestly allows Trump to be a viable contender for President, I'm done with this country, completely.

It's a fucking joke


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## CooleyJr

My opinion on this.. is neither of them should be allowed into office. I'll leave it at that.


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## -42-

I don't like Barack Obama, but words cannot accurately convey my distaste for Donald Trump. It's times like this that the two party system really irks me (of course, it's merely a byproduct of the electoral college).

I'll probably end up writing in the Libertarian candidate (haters gonna hate).


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## Customisbetter

I will vote for Trump in an instant. I don't give a FUCK about my government employee's personal life. 
What I do want is somebody who has proven that they are successful and know what the fuck they are doing. Obama was a decent city planner, but a horrible politician and not the best businessman.

Trump has proven that he can get shit done and he can get money where its needed for success. I really hope he gets the seat and I'm sure if he does we will actually see some fucking change.


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## CooleyJr

Customisbetter said:


> Trump has proven that he can get shit done and he can get money where its needed for success. I really hope he gets the seat and I'm sure if he does we will actually see some fucking change.



The fact that Trump is a REAL business man makes him the lesser of 2 evils for me. I wouldn't vote for either, but if it DOES come down to it, I'd rather have Trump as the president.


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## Sofos

haha. the irony.


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## CooleyJr

^   for ads!!


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## AvantGuardian

Trump is a blowhard attention whore, but I'd like to see him in the Republican party primary debates. He's not afraid to speak his mind, and I'd really like to hear him put the screws to the current administration and the other Republican hopefuls. I'd hope the actual nominee ends up being someone a little less.. well.. Donald Trump-like though. If that party wants to put a competent business-focused guy on the ballot, nominate Mitt Romney.


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## -42-

The Republicans are between Scylla and Charybdis at this point. If the pick a Tea Party approved candidate then they have zero chance of picking up the moderates, but if they pick a moderate candidate then the Tea Party may select their own candidate, at which point the Republican base would be split.

They're screwed.


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## AySay

Donald Trump is the biggest fucking idiot ever. 
Have you guys seen the appalling shit he has been saying recently? I hope you people who say you'd vote for this stupid cunt haven't, because if you're saying that AFTER seeing even a small sample of the idiotic shit he has been spewing in the last couple of weeks, you are a scary fucking bunch of retards.

Obama is lucky because despite being a spineless "slightly left-leaning republican" rather than a true democrat, he is going to get a free pass in 2012 with morons like Palin, Trump, Gingrich etc running.




PS: I mean that in the least offensive way possible.


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## Customisbetter

AySay said:


> Donald Trump is the biggest fucking idiot ever.
> Have you guys seen the appalling shit he has been saying recently? I hope you people who say you'd vote for this stupid cunt haven't, because if you're saying that AFTER seeing even a small sample of the idiotic shit he has been spewing in the last couple of weeks, you are a scary fucking bunch of retards.
> 
> Obama is lucky because despite being a spineless "slightly left-leaning republican" rather than a true democrat, he is going to get a free pass in 2012 with morons like Palin, Trump, Gingrich etc running.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS: I mean that in the least offensive way possible.



I honestly have no doubt that Obama will not be reelected. It doesn't matter who he is up against.


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## Chickenhawk

Customisbetter said:


> I honestly have no doubt that Obama will not be reelected. It doesn't matter who he is up against.



Extremely true, which makes this whole Trump thing that much more awful.


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## Randy

AySay said:


> Obama is lucky because despite being a spineless "slightly left-leaning republican" rather than a true democrat, he is going to get a free pass in 2012 with morons like Palin, Trump, Gingrich etc running.



I see I have found a new best friend.


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## Scar Symmetry

Randy said:


> I see I have found a new best friend.



Aye, I may not be a resident of the USA, but this is also what I think.


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## ROAR

Obama made a lot of promises, and didn't deliver on most of them.
What the fuck has Obama done so far?
That's all legit and it's mostly small things but at least he has
actually done something.
I don't necessarily like him, but there a very few main candidates I support.
The real people with plans who don't want to take part on corruption are
never able to make it because of funding. They don't want money from big
people/businesses because then they "owe" them.

Let me talk about being president for a second.
Here's roughly how it works:
Your elected president, you then spend 2 years trying to make the
promises you want happen in a government full of people who may
or may not disagree so that takes a lot of time. BUT 2 years into
your presidency you now have to decide whether you want another term.
Obama does so now his last 2 years everything he does will be based around
getting more voters so he can be re-elected. His focus from now until next year's
election will be on the American people for votes and support.
Once he gets re-elected he has 4 years now to actually do what he promised in
the beginning. But that will only lead to the same problems as before.

America cannot make up it's mind if it's democratic or republican.
Which is very sad because 2 parties don't represent America well enough.
I prefer the Labour party of England, mostly because I like Ed Milliband and
he seems to be doing a lot to make things happen. Please keep in mind I
don't live in England so my knowledge on their system is very limited.
I very strongly agree that a major two-party system is the worst thing in American
government.

On to Trump:
He's a good businessman, he went to a good school, he knows a lot of people.
That doesn't mean shit. Obama had a lot of support but sometimes you just can't
make what you want happen.

The President is not the main focus everyone should have.
Every member of Congress should be, and your senate.
Once the citizens can realize that Congress is extremely important
and deserves more thought and attention, THEN will we get some more things done.
The President is good for some things, especially overseas negotiations, but
when you have something like the "Tea Party" who argues against gov't involvement
and then says we're a Christian nation and that same gov't should push this religion
onto America, you have to feel sorry for the guy.

This will be my first time voting in a presidential election and right now
it's going to other. For 2 reasons:
1. I'm not a republican or democrat.
2. I feel that voting is something every American should do if they wish to express their opinion, and by voting for a third party I can vote for the closest thing I want. In some ways it's a "waste" but Obama and Trump are people I can't agree with right now.


TL;DR Shono for President.


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## BrandonARC

i think trump is a smart businessman. I also think he is a master of manipulation, which, in theory, would make him perfect for president haha.


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## orb451

AySay said:


> Donald Trump is the biggest fucking idiot ever.
> Have you guys seen the appalling shit he has been saying recently? I hope you people who say you'd vote for this stupid cunt haven't, because if you're saying that AFTER seeing even a small sample of the idiotic shit he has been spewing in the last couple of weeks, you are a scary fucking bunch of retards.
> 
> Obama is lucky because despite being a spineless "slightly left-leaning republican" rather than a true democrat, he is going to get a free pass in 2012 with morons like Palin, Trump, Gingrich etc running.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS: I mean that in the least offensive way possible.



Wow, vote for Obama after he's done jack shit for the country? I can't believe you'd vote for that sniveling, arrogant, snot-nosed bullshit artist. Accepting the Noble prize for nothing, sinking us further into debt with his horseshit healthcare overhaul and reneging on almost every promise he made to the pussies on the left. How any imbecile would vote for him is beyond comprehension. Thankfully he's got about as much chance as being elected as a camel has of passing through the eye of a needle.


PS: I mean that in the least offensive way possible


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## AySay

orb451 said:


> Wow, vote for Obama after he's done jack shit for the country? I can't believe you'd vote for that sniveling, arrogant, snot-nosed bullshit artist. Accepting the Noble prize for nothing, sinking us further into debt with his horseshit healthcare overhaul and reneging on almost every promise he made to the pussies on the left. How any imbecile would vote for him is beyond comprehension. Thankfully he's got about as much chance as being elected as a camel has of passing through the eye of a needle.
> 
> 
> PS: I mean that in the least offensive way possible



Not American, so I'm obviously not voting anyways. However If you read my post you'd notice I never said vote for Obama. I said he was spineless and excuse for a democrat, so we "kindasorta" agree on that. I just said that the dangerously stupid fucks that are running against him give him a better shot at being reelected due to how insane they are. Once again...Palin, Trump?!? Really? That is the solution to the Obama problem? It's a disgrace. It's like trying to fix a creaky stair by blowing up the whole house. 























PS: Fuck you.


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## orb451

AySay said:


> Not American, so I'm obviously not voting anyways. However I never said vote for Obama. I said he was spineless and excuse for a democrat, so we "kindasorta" agree on that. I just said that the laughably stupid fucks that are running against him give him a better shot at being reelected due to how insane they are. Once again...Palin, Trump?!? Really? That is the solution to the Obama problem? It's a disgrace. It's like trying to fix a creaky stair by blowing up the whole house.
> 
> 
> PS: Fuck you.



Well it sure as shit sounded like you were advocating Obama as a better presidential candidate than either Trump or Palin. First, has Palin even announced a presidential exploratory committee? If not, why bring her up? Second, why would *anyone* vote for someone (like Obama) that buckles, like a fucking belt? 

Obama was the logical choice after George W. Bush managed to push the presidential bar appallingly low. Against almost anyone else, he wouldn't have stood a chance. He had no substantial experience doing anything. At least with Trump you can see that he's run a business, failed and hit bottom, and managed to pick himself up and make something of himself again. He also pulls no punches and isn't afraid to speak his mind, right or wrong, I'd rather a president know at least *something* in practice and not just theory.

And lastly, if you're not voting, or not American, why do you give a shit who we vote or don't vote for? Is it because you're convinced that the actions of our president are going to affect you on a personal level? If so, get over yourself.


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## Curt

I don't like Obama much to be honest, but if Trump runs and succeeds, i'm fucking out of here. I don't care WHERE I move to because America would be twice as bad with an ignorant fuck like Trump in there.

I've given up hope of economic recovery any time soon with the incompetence of pretty much every politician we've had run since Bush. And none of the options seem to be any better than our last 2 presidents and WORSE if you can possibly get worse.

You can refer to my signature for my feelings on Trump.


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## Customisbetter

I won't be leaving the country until I'm no longer allowed to.


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## heilarkyguitar

Just let the gop have it imo tired of the struggle. I'm a democrat. But the rich run and control the gov and the flow of money. So on that Regan clone and pay me already. Fuck whats right. I'm hungry.


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## SirMyghin

Curt said:


> I don't like Obama much to be honest, but if Trump runs and succeeds, i'm fucking out of here. I don't care WHERE I move to because America would be twice as bad with an ignorant fuck like Trump in there.
> 
> I've given up hope of economic recovery any time soon with the incompetence of pretty much every politician we've had run since Bush. And none of the options seem to be any better than our last 2 presidents and WORSE if you can possibly get worse.
> 
> You can refer to my signature for my feelings on Trump.



The problem with acting out of emotion is it is entirely frivolous. Until you have seen it in action you can't make a proper opinion of how you would feel about it.


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## Curt

orb451 said:


> Well it sure as shit sounded like you were advocating Obama as a better presidential candidate than either Trump or Palin. First, has Palin even announced a presidential exploratory committee? If not, why bring her up? Second, why would *anyone* vote for someone (like Obama) that buckles, like a fucking belt?
> 
> Obama was the logical choice after George W. Bush managed to push the presidential bar appallingly low. Against almost anyone else, he wouldn't have stood a chance. He had no substantial experience doing anything. At least with Trump you can see that he's run a business, failed and hit bottom, and managed to pick himself up and make something of himself again. He also pulls no punches and isn't afraid to speak his mind, right or wrong, I'd rather a president know at least *something* in practice and not just theory.
> 
> And lastly, if you're not voting, or not American, why do you give a shit who we vote or don't vote for? Is it because you're convinced that the actions of our president are going to affect you on a personal level? If so, get over yourself.




Trump's head is directly up his ass and that's plain to see. I don't think there is anyone with his kind of wealth that doesn't have the same problem. He's so detached from the problems of society that I can't see why anyone thinks he'd do anything positive for our country. Except for his peers probably. But those are the kind of people who are even at this time are influenced by the economic downturn in the fact that their business and whatever they are selling isn't doing as well as it should be, but that doesn't mean they don't have the money to toss out for whatever bullshit policies Trump would lay out.

As sad as it sounds, with all the candidates supposedly running Trump actually seems like the smartest of all of them. But that doesn't mean i'll vote for him, simply because I despise him and all that he epitomizes.


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## highlordmugfug




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## Curt

SirMyghin said:


> The problem with acting out of emotion is it is entirely frivolous. Until you have seen it in action you can't make a proper opinion of how you would feel about it.



I can't think of one valid reason that I should even give someone like Trump the time of day. He's already proven to be all but an unfeeling robot. The only thing he is concerned with is his own wealth and well being. Truth is, there isn't a single honest politician among us these days, so I don't see why I even bother with politics.


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## orb451

Even with his head firmly planted in his ass, I'd *still* take him over Obama any. day. of. the. week.

With that said, that's if it comes down to a race between the two of them and *only* them. So long as there's a Libertarian somewhere on the ticket, regardless of how it's a wasted vote, blah blah blah, they're the ones that are likely to get my vote unless someone spectacular crawls out of the woodwork.


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## Customisbetter

I don't want to have casual tea with my president. I don't want the president to be on the television every day giving speeches to minorities or under fed kids. I don't want a president that everybody likes or one that tries to make everyone like them.

I want a president, (whether its a ma,n womon, robot, or flaming insane clown possey fanatic) to run this country with the authority and tact worthy or a world super power. Somebody that will make the hard decisions and not kiss asses while doing it. Someone who doesn't follow the lines or party boundaries, but does what they have to do to make sure this country is not in debt to any other nation.

Is that so much to ask?


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## orb451

Customisbetter said:


> I don't want to have casual tea with my president. I don't want the president to be on the television every day giving speeches to minorities or under fed kids. I don't want a president that everybody likes or one that tries to make everyone like them.
> 
> I want a president, (whether its a ma,n womon, robot, or flaming insane clown possey fanatic) to run this country with the authority and tact worthy or a world super power. Somebody that will make the hard decisions and not kiss asses while doing it. Someone who doesn't follow the lines or party boundaries, but does what they have to do to make sure this country is not in debt to any other nation.
> 
> Is that so much to ask?



This.  About a billion times over. 

Not a pushover, belt-buckle or sad sack of shit that kow-tows to everyone and everything, trying to save face and win friends. A president with balls. Not a guy with a permanent pensive look on his face as if he's agonizing over just *how*to say every, fucking, thing...


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## Customisbetter

Obama said something that I fell in love with a few weeks ago during an interview.

The interviewer asked him if he owned a computer and Obama replied with,

"I'm the president of the United States of America."


I need a president who is like that 111% of the fucking time.


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## Curt

orb451 said:


> Even with his head firmly planted in his ass, I'd *still* take him over Obama any. day. of. the. week.
> 
> With that said, that's if it comes down to a race between the two of them and *only* them. So long as there's a Libertarian somewhere on the ticket, regardless of how it's a wasted vote, blah blah blah, they're the ones that are likely to get my vote unless someone spectacular crawls out of the woodwork.



I can see where you're coming from. Obama has made a ton and a half of promises that he hasn't backed up, but the couple things he did take action on is something that not many wanted to see done and he has ignored everything else he has promised.

If it's down between Obama and Trump and I do vote, it would most likely be Trump because regardless of the decisions he may or may not make, at least he'd probably go through with it and not be a pushover like Obama has proven to be. And that's what a president is supposed to do, make decisions for their country and act upon their decisions.



Customisbetter said:


> I don't want to have casual tea with my president. I don't want the president to be on the television every day giving speeches to minorities or under fed kids. I don't want a president that everybody likes or one that tries to make everyone like them.
> 
> I want a president, (whether its a ma,n womon, robot, or flaming insane clown possey fanatic) to run this country with the authority and tact worthy or a world super power. Somebody that will make the hard decisions and not kiss asses while doing it. Someone who doesn't follow the lines or party boundaries, but does what they have to do to make sure this country is not in debt to any other nation.
> 
> Is that so much to ask?



Apparently so...


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## heilarkyguitar

I vote for NORML President Mark Stepnoski. At least he'd get one thing correct while in office.


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## Guitarman700

No. Never. Fuck Donald Trump to his very core. That man is a cancerous piece of trash, as is every politician in this country. I wouldn't trust a man with that hair anyway. Actually, he'd fit right in at the white house. Hmmm.....


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## Curt

Guitarman700 said:


> No. Never. Fuck Donald Trump to his very core. That man is a cancerous piece of trash, as is every politician in this country. I wouldn't trust a man with that hair anyway. Actually, he'd fit right in at the white house. Hmmm.....



Honestly, that was my initial opinion, but I can honestly say that I don't approve of ANY politician that has ran in quite some time..


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## tacotiklah

Obama dropped the ball in many ways. Least of them being that whole 'I'll try and make both parties get along' crap. You'd think he'd have been in the political arena long enough to know that shit won't ever happen. What surprised me the most is that during the first couple of years of this first term, he had a tame congress and even THEN could barely get anything done.


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## TXDeathMetal

My take on it is this... while Trump may not have much of a background in politics is that the man knows his shit as far as running a business and being successful and let's face it... the government and our county is essentially one big business and he is known to be quite the philanthropist and considering the amount of debt we currently have is that it COULD be a possibility that if he's elected that he could distribute some of his very own wealth back into our economy to give it one hell of a kick in the nuts as it so desperately needs.


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## tacotiklah

The best thing Trump ever did was sit for an hour and let people talk shit to him. (the roast of donald trump. Goddamn was Gilbert Godfried funny as hell.  )

We will have truly reached idiocracy if we elect an egotistical bastard like him into office.


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## orb451

ghstofperdition said:


> We will have truly reached idiocracy if we elect an egotistical bastard like him into office.



I know huh, not like the current egotistical bastard we have...


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## Guitarman700

orb451 said:


> I know huh, not like the current egotistical bastard we have...



How is Obama an egotistical bastard? Is it just because he's OMG DEMOCRAT?
I'm not saying I support the guy, but he seems a lot better that the last 8 years.


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## orb451

Guitarman700 said:


> How is Obama an egotistical bastard? Is it just because he's OMG DEMOCRAT?
> I'm not saying I support the guy, but he seems a lot better that the last 8 years.



Nope, nothing to do with him being a Democrat, sorry to disappoint you at least as far as I'm concerned. It has everything to do with the fact that he's as in love with himself as his sycophantic knob polishers. He's smug. His contrite. He believes the bullshit as if he's the second coming of Christ. I gave him his shot, he blew two years off patting himself on the back and setting us up for failure. If he had declined the Nobel prize, he would have *at least* had a modicum of credibility left. But he didn't. He accepted it, and all the praise knowing full well it was for nothing. Stooping, bowing, kow-towing to foreign leaders, apologizing for everything....

He's exactly what's wrong with this country in one, god awful man. Thinks his shit doesn't stink and that he's going to change the world by willing it. Seems to think that apologizing and cowering in the corner make him worldly and stately. He's a phony.


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## orb451

At least with Trump you get someone with some real world experience, not a fucking "community organizer". He has business acumen and shoots from the hip. I want that, more than a vainglorious pussy in the White House. 

People are in love with Obama because, once again, W. set the bar pretty fucking low. I mean, low, like on the ground low. When you're at the bottom, there's not too many ways to go and even still, Obama has managed to fuck things up and all he can do is blame his predecessor over and over again. "It's not my fault, it's *his* fault, he ruined everything!". What a fucking copout. You know what that gets you in the real world, away from the cozy rhetoric at Columbia, Harvard and other Ivy League schools? It gets you fucking fired. Out the door, on your ass, fuck off, see ya later. Blaming the other guy is the absolute last thing I want a President doing.


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## TXDeathMetal

orb451 said:


> Nope, nothing to do with him being a Democrat, sorry to disappoint you at least as far as I'm concerned. It has everything to do with the fact that he's as in love with himself as his sycophantic knob polishers. He's smug. His contrite. He believes the bullshit as if he's the second coming of Christ. I gave him his shot, he blew two years off patting himself on the back and setting us up for failure. If he had declined the Nobel prize, he would have *at least* had a modicum of credibility left. But he didn't. He accepted it, and all the praise knowing full well it was for nothing. Stooping, bowing, kow-towing to foreign leaders, apologizing for everything....
> 
> He's exactly what's wrong with this country in one, god awful man. Thinks his shit doesn't stink and that he's going to change the world by willing it. Seems to think that apologizing and cowering in the corner make him worldly and stately. He's a phony.



 he's enjoyed the "celebrity status" of being the President more than actually being the President and getting shit done.


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## Customisbetter

Heres the deal...

I bet I could have a super cool day with Mr. Obama. I bet we could shoot the shit and watch some football. Play some catch and go people watching on the beach. 

The problem is that he isn't a good leader. My dad is a great father, great guy, had good intentions for this country, but hes a SHIT leader. The exact same could be said about our current president. Cool guy, but lousy at running a country.

This is the problem with politics in this country. People vote based off of personal beliefs and shit promises and personalities rather than leadership ability.


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## DesertBurst

Neither

but I don't think there is a suitable republican candidate for 2012.
I'd like to see Marco Rubio in 2016.

oh and I don't want to see any more of that insane T-party shit.
I hope the "movement" just dies out.


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## SirMyghin

That nobel prize nonsense really pissed me off too. He had to have been nominated something like within 2 weeks after he attained the office? WTF was that. Goes with the long standing history of giving democratic prez's their peace prize I guess.


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## JamesM

Get off the Nobel Prize shit. Even if he DID decline the award (which has only happened TWICE to the best of my knowledge) he is STILL declared the winner of the award on record.

Blame the committee, not the recipient.


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## Guitarman700

orb451 said:


> At least with Trump you get someone with some real world experience, not a fucking "community organizer". He has business acumen and shoots from the hip. I want that, more than a vainglorious pussy in the White House.
> 
> People are in love with Obama because, once again, W. set the bar pretty fucking low. I mean, low, like on the ground low. When you're at the bottom, there's not too many ways to go and even still, Obama has managed to fuck things up and all he can do is blame his predecessor over and over again. "It's not my fault, it's *his* fault, he ruined everything!". What a fucking copout. You know what that gets you in the real world, away from the cozy rhetoric at Columbia, Harvard and other Ivy League schools? It gets you fucking fired. Out the door, on your ass, fuck off, see ya later. Blaming the other guy is the absolute last thing I want a President doing.



Ok, I can agree with that. I just wanted an elaboration, not saying I disagree with you.


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## Daemoniac

I'm not American, so take this with a grain of salt.

I agree with Orb in a lot of ways that Obama really hasn't done anything for the country and, realistically, just isn't forceful enough to be President. He makes a lot of promises (all of which are excellent in theory and IMO), but again; none of them have really come to fruition  The health care thing he put through I am all for, but from here it seems like again he gave in to the other side so much that the entire exercise became pretty pointless...

I also think that in some ways Trump would be better; he is a proven business man (which means he knows how to make, and stick to a decision), he knows how to listen to a board of other people, and he knows how to make a profit and _possibly_ bring the countries debt down slightly.

That said though, ultimately he is a businessman who has been out for his own gain his entire life, and I just do not feel like his head is in the right place to do the right thing for "the average American," and really help them, which after all the economic fallout of the last few years i think is exactly what is needed.


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## Guitarman700

The problem is that most everything sounds good on paper...


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## JamesM

I just want my president to be a strong, intelligent and careful human being. Apparently that's too much to ask.

I want to put Jimmy Carter in a time machine and have him be president all over again. 

That's just me.


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## Guitarman700

The Armada said:


> I just want my president to be a strong, intelligent and careful human being. Apparently that's too much to ask.
> 
> I want to put Jimmy Carter in a time machine and have him be president all over again.
> 
> That's just me.


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## orb451

Wishing there was a "dislike" and "severely dislike" button on here about now...

Here's a flow-chart that breaks things down:


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## Guitarman700

He HAS abandoned many of the ideals upon which he campaigned, which is my whole problem with him.


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## orb451

Guitarman700 said:


> He HAS abandoned many of the ideals upon which he campaigned, which is my whole problem with him.



And there ya have it. Change? My ass... Meet the new boss, essentially the same as the old boss. For all his hope and change bullshit, he's another snake in a suit. Abandoned promises are the status quo for politicians, he was supposed to be *sooooooo much different* *sooooooo much better than that*. Turns out the masses got duped yet again.

ha ha /nelson


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## JamesM

You know, with the level of hostility you're presenting, it is really hard to take you seriously.


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## tacotiklah

orb451 said:


> I know huh, not like the current egotistical bastard we have...



Well played sir. But, since we're being technical, we already reached that stage with George W. Bush. 

These last few presidents have really made me lose faith in the executive branch of government tbvh.


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## -42-

The Armada said:


> Jimmy Carter



Not to be blunt, but you have a good two hundred plus years of presidents to choose from and you choose Carter?


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## JamesM

-42- said:


> Not to be blunt, but you have a good two hundred plus years of presidents to choose from and you choose Carter?



Yep.


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## orb451

The Armada said:


> You know, with the level of hostility you're presenting, it is really hard to take you seriously.



Oh I'm sorry, am I not allowed to express my opinion? Is hostility reserved only for those on the Left, is that how it works?

Ask me if I give a shit if you (or anyone else here) takes me seriously. I'll save you the suspense and tell you, no, I really don't care if I'm taken seriously or not.


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## JamesM

Alright man.


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## Daemoniac

orb451 said:


> Secretly I love you all


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## Guitarman700

orb451 said:


> Oh I'm sorry, am I not allowed to express my opinion? Is hostility reserved only for those on the Left, is that how it works?
> 
> Ask me if I give a shit if you (or anyone else here) takes me seriously. I'll save you the suspense and tell you, no, I really don't care if I'm taken seriously or not.



Maybe more people will listen if you take a more civil tone...


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## -42-

inb4 thread lock


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## Guitarman700

Great bread, would butter again.


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## Guitarman700




----------



## orb451

I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore 


I love you guys...




mostly


----------



## Guitarman700

orb451 said:


> I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore
> 
> 
> I love you guys...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mostly


I don't really give a shit about your political views, you seem like a good guy.


----------



## xtrustisyoursx

Seriously, Carter?


----------



## JamesM

Yep.


----------



## leandroab

Trump for president?

The fuck?


----------



## Guitarman700

leandroab said:


> Trump for president?
> 
> The fuck?



Leandrob for president.
DO IT.


----------



## orb451

Guitarman700 said:


> I don't really give a shit about your political views, you seem like a good guy.



Thanks man, I'm an asshole though. I guess I got carried away because there are so few times when I can really rip into Obama on here, that I bottle it up. "_...I built myself a nice little cage, with bars of anger, and a lock of rage..."

_


----------



## Guitarman700

orb451 said:


> Thanks man, I'm an asshole though. I guess I got carried away because there are so few times when I can really rip into Obama on here, that I bottle it up. "_...I built myself a nice little cage, with bars of anger, and a lock of rage..."
> 
> _



I hear ya. There's a reason I usually shy away from this section.


----------



## leandroab

Guitarman700 said:


> Leandrob for president.
> DO IT.


----------



## groph

ITT: Racists






Problem?


----------



## -42-

Pretty much.


----------



## TRENCHLORD

At this point I'll most certainly be voting for Mike Huckabee if he chooses to run. His common sense and practicality best represent the old fashioned midwestern values on which many of us were fortunatly raised. He has always struck me as the least political and most common-sensed of our potential choices. I'm not a christian, but it doesn't bother me a bit that he is. At least he might feel an accountability to something, unlike these self indulging pawns that have presided over this nation for far to long.


----------



## Curt

orb451 said:


> Thanks man, I'm an asshole though. I guess I got carried away because there are so few times when I can really rip into Obama on here, that I bottle it up. "_...I built myself a nice little cage, with bars of anger, and a lock of rage..."
> 
> _





I do the same thing, honestly. I try to just shut my stupid mouth when it comes to politics because let's face it.. I have less experience than any of the candidates, but I can see when they're fucking something up, so it's in threads like these that I become a complete asshole, i'm rather easy-going IRL.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

orb451 said:


> Nope, nothing to do with him being a Democrat, sorry to disappoint you at least as far as I'm concerned. It has everything to do with the fact that he's as in love with himself as his sycophantic knob polishers. He's smug. His contrite. He believes the bullshit as if he's the second coming of Christ. I gave him his shot, he blew two years off patting himself on the back and setting us up for failure. If he had declined the Nobel prize, he would have *at least* had a modicum of credibility left. But he didn't. He accepted it, and all the praise knowing full well it was for nothing. Stooping, bowing, kow-towing to foreign leaders, apologizing for everything....
> 
> He's exactly what's wrong with this country in one, god awful man. Thinks his shit doesn't stink and that he's going to change the world by willing it. Seems to think that apologizing and cowering in the corner make him worldly and stately. He's a phony.



Fuck, orb, I can smell the venom from here 

I would pick the contrite guy over the megalomaniacal businessman any day of the week. 

I actually think Obama is a decent enough president. While it's obvious that he's not made the necessary changes, as far as I can see the guy who could actually do that would in fact be the second coming of Christ, so maybe it's not such a bad thing for him to believe in himself.

As for apologising to foreign countries, that was a smart move IMO. America pissed off a lot of countries and Obama's first move was to mend bridges, which seemed purely logical to me, he took responsibility.

And thinking his shit doesn't stink... what kind of world leader (let's be honest, that's basically synonymous with US President) thinks his shit stinks? In a job like that there is no room for weakness, your opponents and the press will eat you alive.

My question to you is this: which one is he, an arrogant and smug self-professed second coming of Christ or a contrite and stooping coward?


----------



## Krauthammer

Ron Paul. That is all.


----------



## orb451

To answer your question Dave, he's both. He's smug in general to his opponents stateside and a coward in worldly affairs. It's not the US President's job to run around apologizing for things he had nothing to do with. That's weakness. Not the apology, the fact that he thinks he's going to mend fences with other countries by saying "oops, sorry". And who did that impress? All our new friends in the Middle East that still loathe us? The French and other Europeans? I want my president in the business of running our country like a well oiled machine, taking care of its citizens, not galavanting around the globe stooping and bowing and generally looking like a bitch to world leaders. If he's in any kind of popularity contest, it should be with his boss, the people of the US, not other countries or world leaders. 


Watch his speeches, tell me he doesn't look as if he's physically trying to hold back on his delivery. Every word out of his mouth is *too* measured and just make for good applause lines and quotes for the papers and TV. Sure he can read a teleprompter quite well, but every time I've seen him talking off the cuff, he gets rattled easily and seems easily annoyed. I would love to see him debate Trump if it ever comes to that. Trump would tear him a new asshole.


----------



## Blake1970

Neither of the two for me. I wish we could get an independent in office that has no ties to either party.


----------



## Customisbetter

Krauthammer said:


> Ron Paul. That is all.



The problem with this is not the candidate, but the people. Hes the right leader for the wrong country.

You don't hire a sweet loving teacher for a class of misfits, you get somebody who can get shit in line working properly.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

orb451 said:


> To answer your question Dave, he's both. He's smug in general to his opponents stateside and a coward in worldly affairs. It's not the US President's job to run around apologizing for things he had nothing to do with. That's weakness. Not the apology, the fact that he thinks he's going to mend fences with other countries by saying "oops, sorry". And who did that impress? All our new friends in the Middle East that still loathe us? The French and other Europeans? I want my president in the business of running our country like a well oiled machine, taking care of its citizens, not galavanting around the globe stooping and bowing and generally looking like a bitch to world leaders. If he's in any kind of popularity contest, it should be with his boss, the people of the US, not other countries or world leaders.
> 
> 
> Watch his speeches, tell me he doesn't look as if he's physically trying to hold back on his delivery. Every word out of his mouth is *too* measured and just make for good applause lines and quotes for the papers and TV. Sure he can read a teleprompter quite well, but every time I've seen him talking off the cuff, he gets rattled easily and seems easily annoyed. I would love to see him debate Trump if it ever comes to that. Trump would tear him a new asshole.



The first paragraph I thoroughly disagree with so I'll leave that where it is as to persue that would be completely pointless.

The second paragraph I can get on board with, when he knows what he's going to say he's solid, but when posed with a random question that he's not sure how to answer he stammers and looks very uncomfortable.

One thing I will say is that in my opinion, the US people are definitely not the boss of their government and if you can name a country where that is actually the case I'd be very interested to hear about it.


----------



## orb451

Scar Symmetry said:


> The first paragraph I thoroughly disagree with so I'll leave that where it is as to persue that would be completely pointless.
> 
> The second paragraph I can get on board with, when he knows what he's going to say he's solid, but when posed with a random question that he's not sure how to answer he stammers and looks very uncomfortable.
> 
> One thing I will say is that in my opinion, the US people are definitely not the boss of their government and if you can name a country where that is actually the case I'd be very interested to hear about it.



With regard to the first bit, fair enough 

Who does the commander in chief and other politicians in the US report to? No one? I know it seems that way most of the time, but in theory, *we* the people are the ones who they should answer to. "...E we elect them, E we eject them..." and so on. I'm not interested in other country's leaders as far as this direct comparison is concerned.


----------



## Sephiroth952

Ima follow in the path of Lewis Black... Ronald Reagan's dead and/or renimated corpse for president. That is all.


----------



## Konfyouzd

Is that a serious question? 

I can see Trump stirring up some shit, but I seriously don't see him winning. A lot of what he says just sounds reckless to me... Another fuckin' cowboy.


----------



## Randy

He won't make it through the Republican primary.


----------



## Konfyouzd

ROAR said:


> Obama made a lot of promises, and didn't deliver on most of them.


 
Yep... And he was totally the first leader to do this...


----------



## Konfyouzd

Customisbetter said:


> I don't want to have casual tea with my president. I don't want the president to be on the television every day giving speeches to minorities or under fed kids. I don't want a president that everybody likes or one that tries to make everyone like them.
> 
> I want a president, (whether its a ma,n womon, robot, or flaming insane clown possey fanatic) to run this country with the authority and tact worthy or a world super power. Somebody that will make the hard decisions and not kiss asses while doing it. Someone who doesn't follow the lines or party boundaries, but does what they have to do to make sure this country is not in debt to any other nation.
> 
> Is that so much to ask?


 
So you want a president that only works for you... Screw everyone else in the country... I see.

Furthermore, ass-kissing--while frowned upon--is a rather necessary part of interactions with ppl in every day life whether you're the president or not. I don't know what type of job you have, but those that work in an office environment get used to having to kiss a little ass from time to time less they stagnate forever in the same position or simply get let go. There are exceptions, of course...

It's just a fact of life that ppl in a position to help you out typically don't want you all up in their face like you're entitled to something. Our last president had the "I'm gonna do what I want attitude and now we're in the economic crisis everyone expects Obama to sweep up in 2 weeks and move on."

The truth of the matter is that no matter what ALL of these ppl are only going to tell you what they think they have to tell you to get your vote. Once they have it they push whatever agenda they had planned. Don't act so surprised.


----------



## Randy

Goddamn this thread title and the banners it's generating.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Yeah, so.. News flash: the President ultimately doesn't have much power. He's a public figure, and all he needs to be is a face. Hate Obama all you want, but he's not a bad guy, and he wouldn't be able to ruin your life even if he wanted to.


----------



## Konfyouzd

In regards to the smugness... I've seen plenty of white presidents that were smug as fuck. I don't remember it mentioned. I hate to turn this into a race thing and I hope it doesn't turn into a huge racial debate, but I've been noticing that things ppl would typically dismiss in a [100%] white man, they seem to bitch about in Barrack. 

These are also the first ppl to defend themselves with a "I'm not racist, but..." before it's even brought up.

Just an observation...


----------



## TXDeathMetal

Randy said:


> Goddamn this thread title and the banners it's generating.



I have a ad for Guitar Center Easter Weekend sale or something along those lines but last night I had an ad with Trump on it, thought it was pretty ironic.


----------



## orb451

Konfyouzd said:


> In regards to the smugness... I've seen plenty of white presidents that were smug as fuck. I don't remember it mentioned. I hate to turn this into a race thing and I hope it doesn't turn into a huge racial debate, but I've been noticing that things ppl would typically dismiss in a [100%] white man, they seem to bitch about in Barrack.
> 
> Just an observation...



Nobody but you has brought up the racial angle in this thread. I remember all the other white presidents I grew up with starting with Carter and going forward and I can't remember any of them as smug as Obama comes off. At least in my opinion. He's got the others beat hands down.

And I don't think it has anything to do with him being black. I think he just, as an individual, buys into the shit that people are/were saying about him. That he was so different, the hope, the change, etc. I think a lot of people did vote for him solely on the color of his skin though, which is pathetic, in my opinion.


----------



## Randy

Adam Of Angels said:


> Yeah, so.. News flash: the President ultimately doesn't have much power. He's a public figure, and all he needs to be is a face. Hate Obama all you want, but he's not a bad guy, and he wouldn't be able to ruin your life even if he wanted to.



Good lord. I agree with you, Adam. What kind of witchcraft is this?!


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Orb, the public/media/voice of the people rarely has anything good to say about Obama, so he's not buying into any bullshit.. He's holding his composure. I don't think the man's ego appears large enough, actually.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Randy said:


> Good lord. I agree with you, Adam. What kind of witchcraft is this?!



Get out my face, son - you agree with me all the time. Thug nation.


----------



## orb451

Adam Of Angels said:


> Orb, the public/media/voice of the people rarely has anything good to say about Obama, so he's not buying into any bullshit.. He's holding his composure. I don't think the man's ego appears large enough, actually.



Ummm, I remember the run up to his election win and the honeymoon thereafter and sorry, I don't remember them talking shit about him or making it seem like he wasn't doing a good job. It's only now, about 2+ years in, that the cracks are starting to show and he's getting called out for it. So prior to now, the *majority* of what I've heard from *most* media outlets, has been praise, fawning and doe-eyed admiration. 

So yeah, I think he bought into most, if not all of the praise that was thrown his way. And continues to do so. And no, surprise, I don't think he deserves it, and he does need an ego check. That's what the mid-term elections were for him, an ego-check, and this next election will be the same thing, no matter who he ends up running against.


----------



## Konfyouzd

orb451 said:


> Nobody but you has brought up the racial angle in this thread. I remember all the other white presidents I grew up with starting with Carter and going forward and I can't remember any of them as smug as Obama comes off. At least in my opinion. He's got the others beat hands down.
> 
> And I don't think it has anything to do with him being black. I think he just, as an individual, buys into the shit that people are/were saying about him. That he was so different, the hope, the change, etc. I think a lot of people did vote for him solely on the color of his skin though, which is pathetic, in my opinion.


 
Innauguration Day: "It's nice to see a change from all the rappers and thugs..." - Commentator.

Why is this a necessary point to even address on a day like that? Especially considering we're discussing our nations's leader? It just goes to show that that is what mainstream white America EXPECTS from us whether you and your peers do or not.

I don't remember which channel it was, but I saw something a Congressman had been sending around on the news soon thereafter... It was a grid with all of the president faces on it except the very last one. It was just a black square w/ eyes...

Just recently I heard about an email going around up there with a cartoon of several monkeys or Barrack's head on a monkey's body and it says "No wonder they can't find the birth certificate..."

It's certainly walking like a duck...

Again, this may not be an attitude you take, but you're one of several hundred thousand. The Tea Party, to me, seems to be like the Republicans' embarassing redneck cousins and unfortunately, as they gain popularity, it appears to me that there are more like-minded folks in this country than I'd once thought.


----------



## Vidge

Adam Of Angels said:


> Yeah, so.. News flash: the President ultimately doesn't have much power. He's a public figure, and all he needs to be is a face. Hate Obama all you want, but he's not a bad guy, and he wouldn't be able to ruin your life even if he wanted to.





The ones pulling the strings need somebody else to take the beating for the consequences = US President.


----------



## Konfyouzd

Vidge said:


> The ones pulling the strings need somebody else to take the beating for the consequences = US President.


 
Bildeberg shall die...?


----------



## Adam Of Angels

orb451 said:


> Ummm, I remember the run up to his election win and the honeymoon thereafter and sorry, I don't remember them talking shit about him or making it seem like he wasn't doing a good job. It's only now, about 2+ years in, that the cracks are starting to show and he's getting called out for it. So prior to now, the *majority* of what I've heard from *most* media outlets, has been praise, fawning and doe-eyed admiration.
> 
> So yeah, I think he bought into most, if not all of the praise that was thrown his way. And continues to do so. And no, surprise, I don't think he deserves it, and he does need an ego check. That's what the mid-term elections were for him, an ego-check, and this next election will be the same thing, no matter who he ends up running against.




"Yeah, well, that one time, I didn't like how things were going, so I'm going to bitch about them as if that's the way things are now too."


----------



## Konfyouzd

And ppl have been talking shit about Obama since like 2 months after Innauguration... I dunno where this "It's only after 2+ years..." shit is coming from. Someone just sounds like a bitter bitter McCain supporter...


----------



## orb451

Konfyouzd said:


> Innauguration Day: "It's nice to see a change from all the rappers and thugs..." - Commentator.
> 
> Why is this a necessary point to even address on a day like that? Especially considering we're discussing our nations's leader? It just goes to show that that is what mainstream white America EXPECTS from us whether you and your peers do or not.
> 
> I don't remember which channel it was, but I saw something a Congressman had been sending around on the news soon thereafter... It was a grid with all of the president faces on it except the very last one. It was just a black square w/ eyes...
> 
> Just recently I heard about an email going around up there with a cartoon of several monkeys or Barrack's head on a monkey's body and it says "No wonder they can't find the birth certificate..."
> 
> It's certainly walking like a duck...
> 
> Again, this may not be an attitude you take, but you're one of several hundred thousand. The Tea Party, to me, seems to be like the Republicans' embarassing redneck cousins and unfortunately, as they gain popularity, it appears to me that there are more like-minded folks in this country than I'd once thought.



So I ask, what did you expect from people? I mean, racism didn't cease to exist the day he was elected 

When the next cowboy / country bumpkin white guy gets elected they'll be a slew of bumper stickers about how he's mentally challenged, dumb, village missing it's idiot, etc all over again. So what? People are entitled to their opinions... right or wrong.


----------



## orb451

Adam Of Angels said:


> "Yeah, well, that one time, I didn't like how things were going, so I'm going to bitch about them as if that's the way things are now too."



What???


----------



## Konfyouzd

orb451 said:


> So I ask, what did you expect from people? I mean, racism didn't cease to exist the day he was elected
> 
> When the next cowboy / country bumpkin white guy gets elected they'll be a slew of bumper stickers about how he's mentally challenged, dumb, village missing it's idiot, etc all over again. So what? People are entitled to their opinions... right or wrong.


 
You're confusing me now... First you say... "I dont think it's racism." Then I point it out and you ask me what did I expect. This convo is deteriorating fast. Have a nice day, Orb. I'll let you win this one.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Yeah


----------



## orb451

Konfyouzd said:


> And ppl have been talking shit about Obama since like 2 months after Innauguration... I dunno where this "It's only after 2+ years..." shit is coming from. Someone just sounds like a bitter bitter McCain supporter...



Sounds like someone is konfyouzd if they think I supported McCain  
You guys must have selective amnesia, the Left has been wetting it's pants over the guy since he announced his bid for the presidency... Hope, Change, etc, you guys forget all about that crap or what? The Right has been dogging him since about the same time the Left started busting a Forrest Gump over the notion of a Democrat that might actually win. I never said the Right liked the guy... the honeymoon has been on the Left, how with this guy in office, things would be different, he would make all things transparent, etc... and almost all of it turned out to be bullshit.

Sounds a lot like the people on the Left can't handle criticism for their "chosen one".


----------



## orb451

Konfyouzd said:


> You're confusing me now... First you say... "I dont think it's racism." Then I point it out and you ask me what did I expect. This convo is deteriorating fast. Have a nice day, Orb. I'll let you win this one.



Let me clarify, I don't think his race has anything to do with his smugness. Get it? I don't think most people view him as smug, because of the color of his skin. Get it? I don't deny however, that *some* people hate him, just by the fact that he's of the darker persuasion, which I would say yes, is racism. See the delineation? 

Black man is not equal to "smug" in my book and the people I know. Black folks don't own the patent on being smug, anyone can be smug, just look at Randy and Adam  I don't think they're black... 

You brought up the racial commentators and whatnot, making dumb jokes and off-color comments (pardon the pun) so yeah, that to me is racial or racism.


----------



## USMarine75

I think South Park summed it up perfectly... sometimes you have to choose between a Big Douche and a Turd Sandwich.

As someone who leans moderately towards the Right... I normally tend to begrudgingly vote Republican... even though I disagree with about 40% of their agendas... but I tend to disagree with the Dems 60%... so I choose the lesser of two turds...

I hated Clinton back in the day from everything the sensationalized agenda-driven media told me... now that I'm on the inside looking out, I must admit... he might have been one of the greatest presidents we ever had... its very unfortunate he got mired down in BJ-gate and that put an end to a lot of his ability to get stuff done in the last couple years, but some of the stuff I've learned about him has blown my mind and I wish he would run again... 

Conversely, I loved Bush and his 'pro-military' and 'Don't Mess With Texas' appearance while I was in the Marine Corps, but now I've learned a lot from current co-workers that now makes me realize he was actually anything but that... 

Sometimes it's unbelievable how different things really are from what we're told they are....

I think Obama and Bush are two of the worst presidents in US history... they're worse than William Harrison and he only made it a fucking month before he died...


----------



## Randy

orb451 said:


> just look at Randy and Adam  I don't think they're black...



Actually, I think we're both mixed race.


----------



## Konfyouzd

orb451 said:


> Let me clarify, I don't think his race has anything to do with his smugness. Get it? I don't think most people view him as smug, because of the color of his skin. Get it? I don't deny however, that *some* people hate him, just by the fact that he's of the darker persuasion, which I would say yes, is racism. See the delineation?
> 
> Black man is not equal to "smug" in my book and the people I know. Black folks don't own the patent on being smug, anyone can be smug, just look at Randy and Adam  I don't think they're black...
> 
> You brought up the racial commentators and whatnot, making dumb jokes and off-color comments (pardon the pun) so yeah, that to me is racial or racism.


 
You continue to miss my point. 

The point was that these comments go to show what is expected of a black man and the fact that he stands his ground comes off as smug to those who don't like him as a result of his race in a lot of cases. I don't know how many times I've said that I'm not talking directly to you, so quit actin' so but hurt about it and let it be. Racist ppl exist and they say a lot of stupid shit they can't back up when talking about the president. That's what I said... That's all I've been saying.

If you still don't get it, then we're officially done here. I won't be coming back to this thread and I can see one of your 90 page pseudo-epic responses coming sooner than later. Save it for someone w/ that kind of time.


----------



## Konfyouzd

Randy said:


> Actually, I think we're both mixed race.


 
Ain't that some shit?


----------



## Customisbetter

Konfyouzd said:


> So you want a president that only works for you... Screw everyone else in the country... I see.



Thats why its MY vote.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

It's my vote, Ed.


----------



## orb451

Konfyouzd said:


> You continue to miss my point.
> 
> The point was that these comments go to show what is expected of a black man and the fact that he stands his ground comes off as smug to those who don't like him as a result of his race in a lot of cases. I don't know how many times I've said that I'm not talking directly to you, so quit actin' so but hurt about it and let it be. Racist ppl exist and they say a lot of stupid shit they can't back up when talking about the president. That's what I said... That's all I've been saying.
> 
> If you still don't get it, then we're officially done here. I won't be coming back to this thread and I can see one of your 90 page pseudo-epic responses coming sooner than later. Save it for someone w/ that kind of time.



Settle down man, I'm not butt hurt by your comments or opinions and I'm not going to launch into a tirade or epic post detailing all the ways you're wrong and I'm right. We agree, racist people do certainly exist. I think we're missing each others' points because yeah, I'm still at a loss. Forgive the stereotype for a second, but I'm sorry, I don't see Obama as a "strong black man". To me anyway, he's a man first, politician second and black man a distant third and the last one has zero bearing on whether I like him or dislike him. I realize I'm not *everyone* and that everyone doesn't think of him that way.

I don't see him as someone that sticks to his guns or his principles. I think he's bent and buckled at every opportunity. That's not a strong leader to me. Compromise, or the ability to do so, is admirable and I accept that it's sometimes necessary, as opposed to lying and buying into a bunch of lofty feel good bullshit, and then realizing that the job you sought requires some hard fucking work and some hard fucking decisions. I think that's where Obama is at, hard decisions and the inability to act decisively because he's too afraid to hurt someone's feelings or step on some toes. 

That's all, you're free to hate me or those that think the same way, but just know that not *every* fucking Obama hater out there is basing it on the color of his skin. And regardless, I still like you as a person on here, keep your pimp hand strong


----------



## Customisbetter

Black was soooo last season.


----------



## vampiregenocide

You Yanks are really fucking passionate about politics.  We just vote for the guy who is the lesser douchebag and hope to fuck everything goes okay.


----------



## Customisbetter

vampiregenocide said:


> You Yanks are really fucking passionate about politics.  We just vote for the guy who is the lesser douchebag and hope to fuck everything goes okay.



This country was founded by whiners so pissed off they travel 6 months across the ocean to form their own politics.


----------



## Chickenhawk

Customisbetter said:


> This country was founded by whiners so pissed off they travel 6 months across the ocean to form their own politics.



And kicked the living shit out of the Brits in the process 

*with the help of some Natives...


----------



## vampiregenocide

Chickenhawk said:


> And kicked the living shit out of the Brits in the process
> 
> *with the help of some Natives...


 

You sure did!



How's that $14 trillion debt feeling?


----------



## Customisbetter

How are those public security cameras and 1.30p/l for petrol feeling?


----------



## Randy

Randy said:


> Actually, I think we're both mixed race.



And actually, so is Obama... I think we might be onto something.


----------



## vampiregenocide

I'm for public security cameras and my car has a good mpg.


BRING IT.


----------



## Customisbetter

vampiregenocide said:


> I'm for public security cameras and my car has a good mpg.
> 
> 
> BRING IT.



You're probably one of those sissies that doesn't own a gun. 

Oddly enough I was chatting with a fellow from London today at my work. We discussed the silly rivalry between aussies and brits.


TL;DR the world is a strange and beautiful place filled equally strange and beautiful people.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Customisbetter said:


> *2 sentences*
> 
> 
> TL;DR


----------



## vampiregenocide

Customisbetter said:


> You're probably one of those sissies that doesn't own a gun.
> 
> Oddly enough I was chatting with a fellow from London today at my work. We discussed the silly rivalry between aussies and brits.
> 
> 
> TL;DR the world is a strange and beautiful place filled equally strange and beautiful people.


 
Over here we fight with knives. 

I've never understood it myself. I love Americans. Your politics and media are deeply retarded and needs sorting out, but as a people you're some of the nicest I've met. I think it's because British people are a lot more withdrawn whereas American's are more outgoing, so we tend to clash a bit, whereas I like it when people actually act fucking friendly. Here everyone is like 'better not stare, he might have a knife'. 

I'd come and live in America if I didn't have so many connections here, and if I didn't spend every waking minute going 'what the hell?! you guys put up with this?'.

But yeah, going OT. 



EDIT - Australia seems like a nice place too, for a biological hellhole full of fuck and bad censorship laws.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Adam Of Angels said:


> Yeah, so.. News flash: the President ultimately doesn't have much power. He's a public figure, and all he needs to be is a face. Hate Obama all you want, but he's not a bad guy, and he wouldn't be able to ruin your life even if he wanted to.



So... much...



Adam Of Angels said:


> Orb, the public/media/voice of the people rarely has anything good to say about Obama, so he's not buying into any bullshit.. He's holding his composure. I don't think the man's ego appears large enough, actually.



...win...


----------



## Daemoniac

vampiregenocide said:


> EDIT - Australia seems like a nice place too, for a biological hellhole full of fuck and bad censorship laws.



You watch your f****** mouth you little piece of s***, this is a great f****** nation and you'd better not forget it, c***. Are we c...


----------



## vampiregenocide




----------



## Guitarman700

Australia:


----------



## Adam Of Angels

vampiregenocide said:


> Here everyone is like 'better not stare, he might have a knife'.



No, that's pretty much how it is here too. It tends to change on a town-to-town basis, though.


----------



## Customisbetter

^^That is by far the scariest thing i have ever seen since Jumanji.


----------



## JamesM

^Agreed.


----------



## leandroab

Australia&#8482;: No Mortal Kombat


----------



## vampiregenocide

Adam Of Angels said:


> No, that's pretty much how it is here too. It tends to change on a town-to-town basis, though.


 
Oh yeah I mean from what I've seen some parts of America are like that and some aren't but being an island nation theres not such drastic changes here.


----------



## The Somberlain

Obama, whilst not bringing his promises and overseeing one of the most lackluster congresses, has been solid in foreign policy and used the same proven Keynsian technique (though to less stellar results thus far) that Roosevelt used during the great depression. Now, our budget us much much tighter (3 wars, entitlement, and sucking corporate dick anyone?), and our country was on a path to being royally fucked by the time he took office. He's a decent (not that I did not say great, or even good) president in impossible times, and though he is too conservative for my ideology, he is increasingly becoming the realist we need, and he will have my vote.


----------



## Guitarman700

Australia: where you kill the spiders with handguns, not Kleenex.


----------



## The Somberlain

Guitarman700 said:


> Australia: where you kill the spiders with rocket propelled grenades, not Kleenex.



fix'd


----------



## Adam Of Angels

I've yet to get a legitimate, well-researched reason why Obama is such s horrific, awful president from anybody.

I usually just get a long, drawn out ramble that's all over the place, making a rebuttal on my part feel like a waste of time.


----------



## The Somberlain

Adam Of Angels said:


> I've yet to get a legitimate, well-researched reason why Obama is such s horrific, awful president from anybody.
> 
> I usually just get a long, drawn out ramble that's all over the place, making a rebuttal on my part feel like a waste of time.



Like I said, solid, but not awesome. It's the Congress that's dragging this country down, not him.


----------



## JamesM

Guitarman700 said:


> Australia: where you "clean-up" with handguns, not Kleenex.



Fixed, better this time.


----------



## Randy

It's just epic sensationalism. The illusion that he was going to be Jesus Christ and Buddha wrapped into one has been shattered, so of course the critics have jumped all over him; and admittedly, he fell short of my slightly more realistic expectations. However, by the extremely narrow expectations of most presidents of the last 100 years, he's been no worse than his predecessors. 

He inherited an economy on the way down the shitter, and the last year or so, he's served over a slowdown and eventual turn around. Both wars have pretty much dried up, the stock market turned around, jobs are on the rebound and consumer confidence/spending is on the way up again. It's not utopia and it's not the Industrial Revolution all over again, but we're on our way back to 2003ish standards; which isn't great but it isn't "OMG! WORLD ON FIRE!" like we've been sold.


----------



## Randy

The Somberlain said:


> Like I said, solid, but not awesome. It's the Congress that's dragging this country down, not him.



Agreed. Too much 365 campaigning "what bills have my name on them?!" pandering instead of actually, you know, legislating to fit the needs of the people.


----------



## Guitarman700

Congress is such an epic waste of air and internal organs.


----------



## The Somberlain

Randy said:


> It's just epic sensationalism. The illusion that he was going to be Jesus Christ and Buddha wrapped into one has been shattered, so of course the critics have jumped all over him; and admittedly, he fell short of my slightly more realistic expectations. However, by the extremely narrow expectations of most presidents of the last 100 years, he's been no worse than his predecessors.
> 
> He inherited an economy on the way down the shitter, and the last year or so, he's served over a slowdown and eventual turn around. Both wars have pretty much dried up, the stock market turned around, jobs are on the rebound and consumer confidence/spending is on the way up again. It's not utopia and it's not the Industrial Revolution all over again, but we're on our way back to 2003ish standards; which isn't great but it isn't "OMG! WORLD ON FIRE!" like we've been sold.



With stimulus, an economy shot to pieces takes about 12 years to recover, without about 30. So, we've been on track (except for the deficit), but people always want instant gratification...


----------



## JamesM

That's America for you.


----------



## JamesM

Let me say that I don't give a shit who's president anymore, honestly. I don't think they do much of anything, anyway. I think there's a reason that nine times out of ten a president drops a huge campaign staple the second they enter office--someone who's _actually_ in charge told them _really_ what's up.

That's just me, and I'm not even a conspiracy theorist.


----------



## Guitarman700

The Armada said:


> Let me say that I don't give a shit who's president anymore, honestly. I don't think they do much of anything, anyway. I think there's a reason that nine times out of ten a president drops a huge campaign staple the second they enter office--someone who's _actually_ in charge told them _really_ what's up.
> 
> That's just me, and I'm not even a conspiracy theorist.


----------



## JamesM

I don't know who that guy is BUT HOW THE FUCK DID HE GET MY CAT AND MENTAL SECURITY HELMETS


----------



## Guitarman700

The Armada said:


> I don't know who that guy is BUT HOW THE FUCK DID HE GET MY CAT AND MENTAL SECURITY HELMETS



ITS A CONSPIRICUH!


----------



## Randy

Chem trails.


----------



## Guitarman700

GEORGE SOROS!


----------



## vampiregenocide

Haven't 100,000 jobs been created since Obama got in office? I read that somewhere. Might be more or less, but it was a fair few.


----------



## Guitarman700

vampiregenocide said:


> Haven't 100,000 jobs been created since Obama got in office? I read that somewhere. Might be more or less, but it was a fair few.



BUT WURRS MAH JOWB?!


----------



## JamesM

Colin's caps lock key broke.


----------



## Guitarman700

The Armada said:


> Colin's caps lock key broke.



wat.


----------



## JamesM

2/0


----------



## Guitarman700

The Armada said:


> 12/21/2012



Fix'd


----------



## Daemoniac

Australia; We Dare You.


----------



## Prydogga

The Armada said:


> Let me say that I don't give a shit who's president anymore, honestly. I don't think they do much of anything, anyway. I think there's a reason that nine times out of ten a president drops a huge campaign staple the second they enter office--someone who's _actually_ in charge told them _really_ what's up.
> 
> That's just me, and I'm not even a conspiracy theorist.



I remember hearing on a talk show from someone who used to work very closely with a few Presidents, and he said that at any point in time in their meetings, the President was the dumbest man in the room. Take from that what you will.


----------



## Guitarman700

This thread is now about Australia.


----------



## JamesM

The above photo has actually been rotated one-hundred-eighty degrees in order to be appropriate for the rest of the world.


----------



## Guitarman700

A strange place, where night is day, and toilets flush the wrong way...


----------



## Chickenhawk

Randy said:


> Both wars have pretty much dried up



Uh, then why is my old unit preparing for another deployment, and a Marine buddy of mine is going back to Afghan for the 7th time next month?

Iraq may be less in the news since the 'withdrawl' (read: complete bullshit...), and Afghan is just as dangerous as it has been, but we still have a lot of troops over there, the news (and general public) have started ignoring the wars. They're far from 'dried up'.


----------



## Guitarman700

Chickenhawk said:


> Uh, then why is my old unit preparing for another deployment, and a Marine buddy of mine is going back to Afghan for the 7th time next month?
> 
> Iraq may be less in the news since the 'withdrawl' (read: complete bullshit...), and Afghan is just as dangerous as it has been, but we still have a lot of troops over there, the news (and general public) have started ignoring the wars. They're far from 'dried up'.


----------



## Randy

Chickenhawk said:


> Uh, then why is my old unit preparing for another deployment, and a Marine buddy of mine is going back to Afghan for the 7th time next month?
> 
> Iraq may be less in the news since the 'withdrawl' (read: complete bullshit...), and Afghan is just as dangerous as it has been, but we still have a lot of troops over there, the news (and general public) have started ignoring the wars. They're far from 'dried up'.



I'm referring to troop numbers, the numbers of skirmishes, the number of casualties and the amount of money required to keep up either. As a liberal who didn't and doesn't support either war, yes I find either occupation still ongoing to be beyond what I consider acceptable, but it's plain to see our level of involvement has diminished greatly.

I didn't mean to imply there's not still violence or people being deployed there, so I apologize if that's what it sounded like. Best of luck to your friend. I still have family and friends serving over there as well.


----------



## Chickenhawk

Randy said:


> I'm referring to troop numbers, the numbers of skirmishes, the number of casualties and the amount of money required to keep up either. As a liberal who didn't and doesn't support either war, yes I find either occupation still ongoing to be beyond what I consider acceptable, but it's plain to see our level of involvement has diminished greatly.
> 
> I didn't mean to imply there's not still violence or people being deployed there, so I apologize if that's what it sounded like. Best of luck to your friend. I still have family and friends serving over there as well.



The number of skirmishes is still high. If they've gone down a considerable amount (more than 5% or so), that's news to me. 

Troop numbers have been increasing in Afghan...Everybody focused on the whole "We're pulling out of Iraq" hoopla, and ignored the fact that we increased troops in Afghan by ~30% at an extremely rapid pace. 

And of course, casualties are still high. Same thing with reported 'skirmishes'. 

But, I do agree with you about the money thing.


----------



## leandroab

If I get elected, there will be big-butted (new verb) women for everyone.

Thank you. God bless America.


----------



## cwhitey2

i voted other, because... for starters i don't believe either candidate. Trump will change his opinion on subjects just to get votes...and Obama has not proved much of anything to me yet...

I will wait to see who is actually running before i make my decision.


----------



## orb451

leandroab said:


> If I get elected, there will be big-butted (new verb) women for everyone.
> 
> Thank you. God bless America.



Where can I make campaign contributions??? 

Popozuda 2012!!!!


----------



## TreWatson

I don't see a problem with obama whatsoever. he promised to put things in place. and had to fight republican dissenters shooting his (i'll admit) rather grandiose plans down to 1 tenth of their potency, thus resulting in effectively very weak policies.

think about where we JUST came from, and think about where we are trying to go. Obama didn't put us in the hole, the stock market crash did. that wasn't really anyone's fault 9 though people blame bush as well)

i think the people quoting Obama as not doing "jack shit" need to check THIS site, because well, these are all facts, and not mudslinging.

Donald trump knows how to run a business. not a country. considering the government doesn't have NEARLY as large a hold on market as you'd think, it pretty much means one thing: you put donald trump in a seat where he has less power to do anything than he did as a businessman.

second. a large chunk of Trump's platform seems to be this whole " obama isn't an american, obama is this, obama is that" mudslinging bullshit. (which again, is a baseless and stupid platform to go on. they perform background checks the likes of which you have never even SEEN for offices that aren't even the presidents, i doubt they'd let something like that slip through the cracks.)

i feel like the guy honestly thinks he has a chance in his head when in all actuality, he couldn't pull this job if he wanted to.

if you want something to pass, if you want things to change, the person you should be ejecting from seats are congress and the senate. they're the ones who are making the real decisions and (if you've been following some of the funding bills they're proposing) they're all stupid ones lately.

I'm not stating my political affiliation, but i'm neither democrat nor republican, and I will say that while I hoped obama would have been able to accomplish more, i'm unsurprised and TOTALLY called this. obama wanted to try to change the whole political game by trying to unify bipartisan ideals and making us really butt heads so we could make true compromise.

in the words of the military duck of pearls and swine, "You make poor choices, floyd."


----------



## TreWatson

also, if i'm elected, everyone gets a custom guitar. hand built (so that makes jobs)

a chicken in every pot and a pick in every hand.

may his noodly appendage bless this land. Ramen.


----------



## Randy

Pazuzu 2012


----------



## orb451

Randy said:


> Pazuzu 2012



If pazuzu is another synonym for popozuda or popozau or whatever the other words are, then yes, hell yes. I'll even drive you to the voting place of your choice, let you sit in the back and wear a funny hate and call you sir.

BIG ASS 2012 baby, that's what I'm talkin' bout'


----------



## highlordmugfug

^




Vote for Pazuzu!


----------



## Guitarman700

Pazazu/Zod 2012.


----------



## leandroab

orb451 said:


> Where can I make campaign contributions???
> 
> *Popozuda* 2012!!!!






Donations can be sent to my offshore account campaign account.


----------



## The Somberlain

Randy said:


> Pazuzu 2012



Austrian Darkwave band and/or Assyrian Demon?


----------



## highlordmugfug

I'm just going to drop this off here: discuss.


----------



## Konfyouzd

^Just looking at the "cover screen" they're both making very funny faces... I don't support that.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Konfyouzd said:


> ^Just looking at the "cover screen" they're both making very funny faces... I don't support that.


Trump: Woooooooooo!
Obama: MMMMMMMMMMMMM


----------



## WickedSymphony

highlordmugfug said:


>




@the guy in this video

"But you didn't even look at her grades, they just assume if you're a minority you can't ever be a good student..."

The same way that you're assuming that his premise for saying he's heard someone is a bad student is race? And that you're assuming that all of his friends are white? And that you're assuming that they think minorities can't be good students? I'm not saying it's an impossibility, because let's face it, I don't know either, but you can't draw a conclusion like that with bullshit, baseless assumptions thrown everywhere. Sorry.

"In a recent YouTube video, this guy called Donald Trump a racist. I mean, why is he racist? What's with that assumption? Here's the evidence he proves up - NOTHING."


Gotta love YouTube - gives everyone with a camera and spare time a chance to make a fool of themselves on the Internet.


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> @the guy in this video
> 
> "But you didn't even look at her grades, they just assume if you're a minority you can't ever be a good student..."
> 
> The same way that you're assuming that his premise for saying he's heard someone is a bad student is race? And that you're assuming that all of his friends are white? And that you're assuming that they think minorities can't be good students? I'm not saying it's an impossibility, because let's face it, I don't know either, but you can't draw a conclusion like that with bullshit, baseless assumptions thrown everywhere. Sorry.
> 
> "In a recent YouTube video, this guy called Donald Trump a racist. I mean, why is he racist? What's with that assumption? Here's the evidence he proves up - NOTHING."
> 
> 
> Gotta love YouTube - gives everyone with a camera and spare time a chance to make a fool of themselves on the Internet.


 
You don't have to do much to be labeled a racist in this country anymore... 

Then again, depending on who made the comments, those assumptions aren't all that farfetched. But this can't be assumed about everyone.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Konfyouzd said:


> You don't have to do much to be labeled a racist in this country anymore...
> 
> Then again, depending on who made the comments, those assumptions aren't all that farfetched. But this can't be assumed about everyone.



Seriously. Oh, man. I held a door open for someone of a different race than me - REVERSE RACIST!!!!!!! 

E: Yeah, but like I said, even though it's not an impossibility, it's still a bullshit assumption. I'm not defending what Trump said or anything, I don't care for that kind of shit either because it just seems childish (but hey, politics, right?). But the point is that these guys can't call him out on something while simultaneously doing the same thing they're calling him out for doing. It's ridiculous


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> Seriously. Oh, man. I held a door open for someone of a different race than me - REVERSE RACIST!!!!!!!
> 
> E: Yeah, but like I said, even though it's not an impossibility, it's still a bullshit assumption. I'm not defending what Trump said or anything, I don't care for that kind of shit either because it just seems childish (but hey, politics, right?). But the point is that these guys can't call him out on something while simultaneously doing the same thing they're calling him out for doing. It's ridiculous


The main point is this, after all the birther nonsense he's spewed, coupled with his "I'm good friends with the blacks" comments.

That's how I see them arriving to 'he's racist' assumption, and I can follow that line of thinking.


----------



## Randy

Eh. Coupled with Trump jumping on the "birther bandwagon" and his "the blacks" comment, it's not totally "baseless" to assume there's racial overtones. You're totally selectively picking which statements to weigh this argument next to. If you took all of Trumps statements in total, you might come to the same conclusion but you probably wouldn't be flailing your arms around screaming "OMG! ASSHATS!"

EDIT: Ninja'd by mugfug


----------



## WickedSymphony

Let me reiterate that my point isn't so much of whether if he is a racist or not (as I said, it's not impossible), but rather that I think that saying "This guy is making assumptions based on race!" while simultaneously assuming that it's "obviously," as he puts it, based on race is silly. And to be honest, I've always thought people that do that (calling out one person for something while doing that very same thing to form their argument) are "asshats," or hypocrites, rather.


----------



## highlordmugfug

highlordmugfug said:


> The main point is this, after all the birther nonsense he's spewed, coupled with his "I'm good friends with the blacks" comments.
> 
> That's how I see them arriving to 'he's racist' assumption, and I can follow that line of thinking.






Randy said:


> Eh. Coupled with Trump jumping on the "birther bandwagon" and his "the blacks" comment, it's not totally "baseless" to assume there's racial overtones. You're totally selectively picking which statements to weigh this argument next to. If you took all of Trumps statements in total, you might come to the same conclusion but you probably wouldn't be flailing your arms around screaming "OMG! ASSHATS!"
> 
> EDIT: Ninja'd by mugfug





WickedSymphony said:


> Let me reiterate that my point isn't so much of whether if he is a racist or not (as I said, it's not impossible), but rather that I think that saying "This guy is making assumptions based on race!" while simultaneously assuming that it's "obviously," as he puts it, based on race is silly. And to be honest, I've always thought people that do that are asshats, or hypocrites, rather.


Read our posts again and get back to us, because you're not addressing anything. You just said exactly what you said before.

EDIT: Specifically, that he's not assuming anything, he's viewing the evidence me, Randy, and Cenk in the video pointed out, and came to a conclusion.
Also that he was very hesitant to call Trump a racist before, you probably haven't seen that particular video, but he says that in this video too.


----------



## Konfyouzd

highlordmugfug said:


> "I'm good friends with the blacks"
> .


 
How many black friends must one acquire to be excluded as a racist? 

I've heard things like this before... "I'm not racist, I have 5 black friends..." Why are you counting them? 

I don't think that Trump is a racist, per se, though. I think he was just brought up in a less than "informed" environment as it pertains to "minorities." And clearly he was never shown any different through his experiences (not that I'm all that surprised). When I think racist I think Clayton Bigsby.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Konfyouzd said:


> How many black friends must one acquire to be excluded as a racist?
> 
> I've heard things like this before... "I'm not racist, I have 5 black friends..." Why are you counting them?
> 
> I don't think that Trump is a racist, per se, though. I think he was just brought up in a less than "informed" environment as it pertains to "minorities." And clearly he was never shown any different through his experiences (not that I'm all that surprised). When I think racist I think Clayton Bigsby.


I'm not arguing that Trump is or isn't racist, merely asserting that using the phrase "the blacks", being gung ho about the Birther theories, and saying Obama was a bad student "just because" is evidence that one could view and come to the conclusion that he is racist, and the claim that Cenk saying Trump's racist means he's assuming everything and being a hypocrite is incorrect.


----------



## Randy

Konfyouzd said:


> When I think racist I think Clayton Bigsby.



When I think racist, I think people who have preconceptions about a group of people which are indirectly related to their actual race and instead directly influenced by their personal observations or interactions with people of said race.

So, by my definition, Trump is a racist.


----------



## right_to_rage

I hope Ron Paul runs, he would be a good choice overall.


----------



## Randy

WickedSymphony said:


> Let me reiterate that my point isn't so much of whether if he is a racist or not (as I said, it's not impossible), but rather that I think that saying "This guy is making assumptions based on race!" while simultaneously assuming that it's "obviously," as he puts it, based on race is silly. And to be honest, I've always thought people that do that (calling out one person for something while doing that very same thing to form their argument) are "asshats," or hypocrites, rather.



Yeah, I got that the first time you said it. When it was based on previous incident, you had a valid argument. When you take the other things into account, you do not. If you want to stick your fingers in your ears to people being called racist because you just don't like it, then that's another issue.


----------



## Vidge

right_to_rage said:


> I hope Ron Paul runs, he would be a good choice overall.


Aye, even though the system is rigged, I would vote for Ron Paul. He at least would try and solve all the problems at the root of the tree rather than just try and trim the branches. Ending the Federal Reserve or at least forcing them to be transparent for one.

Although the last president that tried that, JFK, was assassinated...


----------



## WickedSymphony

Randy said:


> Yeah, I got that the first time you said it. When it was based on previous incident, you had a valid argument. When you take the other things into account, you do not. If you want to stick your fingers in your ears to people being called racist because you just don't like it, then that's another issue.



It doesn't matter what the topic is, making assumptions about something or someone by using assumptions in the argument just doesn't hold for me. That's what I'm getting at.

And for the record, being of middle eastern descent, I've dealt with plenty of racist fucks.


----------



## Konfyouzd

@ Randy & MugFug - I see what you guys mean. Maybe I'm just used to ppl saying shit like that all the time. And I suppose although he may not have out right said it he may very well be thinking some of the terrible stuff I've heard from more "open" racists...


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> It doesn't matter what the topic is, making assumptions about something or someone by using assumptions in the argument just doesn't hold for me.


 
And what else are we to go by aside from the things he says? He speaks with a reckless tongue. 

As a non-racist "politician" I think he'd choose his words more carefully.


----------



## GuitaristOfHell

If trump is elected I'm fucking leaving this country . Dude can NOT debate well.


----------



## WickedSymphony

Konfyouzd said:


> And what else are we to go by aside from the things he says? He speaks with a reckless tongue.
> 
> As a non-racist "politician" I think he'd choose his words more carefully.



And I agree with you wholeheartedly on that point. He should definitely be choosing his words more carefully so as to not be garnering this specific kind of attention.

The sad thing is that perhaps this might actually win votes of people who do think in that vein for him. This mudslinging crap has always been a dirty, cheap way to get votes from people who don't or can't vote based on what actually matters.


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> It doesn't matter what the topic is, making assumptions about something or someone by using assumptions in the argument just doesn't hold for me. That's what I'm getting at.
> 
> And for the record, being of middle eastern descent, I've dealt with plenty of racist fucks.








They're.

Not.

Assumptions.






Read what we're saying: looking at evidence, and coming to conclusions 





Is.

Not.

Assuming.


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> And I agree with you wholeheartedly on that point. He should definitely be choosing his words more carefully so as to not be garnering this specific kind of attention.
> 
> The sad thing is that perhaps this might actually win votes of people who do think in that vein for him. This mudslinging crap has always been a dirty, cheap way to get votes from people who don't or can't vote based on what actually matters.


 
I think that's what he wants. 

There are enough ppl who feel the same way he seems to suggest that he does. There are also others who don't like Obama for various other reasons. He's doing what he does best... Being a business man.


----------



## Randy

highlordmugfug said:


>





I love this thread.


----------



## Konfyouzd

Not sure I get your point mugfug...


----------



## WickedSymphony

@ mugfug and that ridiculously unnecessary, immature post

Yes, they are assumptions as he is assuming what the basis of Trump's comments stemmed from without any factual, undeniable evidence to support it. From what he said, you may arrive to the conclusion that he MAY be a racist, but there is not enough evidence to conclude that he IS, in fact, a racist.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Konfyouzd said:


> Not sure I get your point mugfug...


brb, finding Michael Bay gifs.


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> @ mugfug and that ridiculously unnecessary, immature post
> 
> Yes, they are assumptions as he is assuming what the basis of Trump's comments stemmed from without any factual, undeniable evidence to support it. From what he said, you may arrive to the conclusion that he MAY be a racist, but there is not enough evidence to conclude that he IS, in fact, a racist.


@WickedSymphony and that saying the exact same thing over and over again

I forget that exactly what someone has said and done doesn't count as factual evidence.

So unless someone says that that they specifically feel a certain way about something, outright, and we get it in writing, and a court transcriber is there, no conclusion we ever come to will be anything more than an assumption?

Good to know.


----------



## Konfyouzd

By that logic you can hate a person, and do things to suggest that you hate them constantly on a daily basis, but w/o your written confession, you do not hate said person?

To be fair, just because the law does not perceive me as guilty does not make it so.


----------



## Randy

WickedSymphony said:


> @ mugfug and that ridiculously unnecessary, immature post
> 
> Yes, they are assumptions as he is assuming what the basis of Trump's comments stemmed from without any factual, undeniable evidence to support it. From what he said, you may arrive to the conclusion that he MAY be a racist, but there is not enough evidence to conclude that he IS, in fact, a racist.



The Young Turks is an opinion broadcast. Take that with a grain of salt.


----------



## Randy

Forgive my rage over this whole thing but I get epic frustration from the "anti-anti" movements.

Anti-djent fanbois became more numerous and annoying than those they were rebelling against, anti-Apple fanbois became more numerous and annoying than those they were rebelling against, anti-affirmative action advocates became more numerous and annoying than those they were rebelling against; so-on and so-on. 

The anti-anti racism movement thing either sounds like justification for intolerance (among those who chose to wield racism) or Judenrat.


----------



## Konfyouzd

But Affirmative Action blows...


----------



## WickedSymphony

Konfyouzd said:


> By that logic you can hate a person, and do things to suggest that you hate them constantly on a daily basis, but w/o your written confession, you do not hate said person?



So, by the Young Turks logic, saying that Trump said he heard one person was a bad student means that he thinks that every African American is a bad student?


----------



## Konfyouzd

I think you used different logic. 

Plus I could care less what Trump has to say about Obama much less any other black man. There's not a whole lot he can say to surprise me. I'm not so much wrapped up in the individual issue as I am the larger picture. What Trump said about Obama being a student is of no consequence to me. All I've heard anyone say in here is that he isn't always the most respectful in regards to minorites. 

This isn't to say that anyone is entitled to his respect. I'm just saying it affects the way certain ppl will feel about him.

Also, you're absolutely free to like Trump all you wish. It doesn't make YOU a racist (assuming he is one--and you know what they say about assuming  )unless you share the same ideals that earned HIM that label.


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> So, by the Young Turks logic, saying that Trump said he heard one person was a bad student means that he thinks that every African American is a bad student?





Konfyouzd said:


> I think you used different logic.


WickedSymphony, you're cherry picking again.

GP Essays: Common mistake #6 (cherry picking arguments / discussing the non-contentious, rather than the contentious) « read, think, write.


This has become less about Trump and Obama for me, and more an attempt at a lesson on logical fallacies and the art of debating.


----------



## Konfyouzd

highlordmugfug said:


> WickedSymphony, you're cherry picking again.
> 
> GP Essays: Common mistake #6 (cherry picking arguments / discussing the non-contentious, rather than the contentious) « read, think, write.
> 
> 
> This has become less about Trump and Obama for me, and more an attempt at a lesson on logical fallacies and the art of debating.


 
Then perhaps Trump should read it.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Konfyouzd said:


> Then perhaps Trump should read it.



Marvelous!


----------



## IshiiKurisu

I'm Brasilian, so I wouldn't be able to vote in US Elections, but, americans, please, Trump is Millionaire, and Obama is a Lawyer; there's no reason of voting in a black lawyer when there's an white millionaire as a choice [I'm not racist; that's just a stupid joke, O.K.? My mother's black and my father's white]!!!


----------



## Konfyouzd

IshiiKurisu said:


> I'm Brasilian, so I wouldn't be able to vote in US Elections, but, americans, please, Trump is Millionaire, and Obama is a Lawyer; there's no reason of voting in a black lawyer when there's an white millionaire as a choice [I'm not racist; that's just a stupid joke, O.K.? My mother's black and my father's white]!!!


 
My name is Konfyouzd and I approved this message.


----------



## Randy

Donald Trump doesn't care about black people.


----------



## Randy

Also, what the hey, I'll leave these here:

Donald Trump's Companies Filed for Bankruptcy 4 Times - ABC News

How Does Trump repeatedly file for Bankruptcy and still stay on top? | LegalZoom


----------



## WickedSymphony

highlordmugfug said:


> This has become less about Trump and Obama for me, and more an attempt at a lesson on logical fallacies and the art of debating.



I think the issue here is that you're saying:
"If it walks like a duck, then it must be a duck."
And I'm saying:
"If it walks like a duck, then it might be a duck."

Apparently, my way of thinking doesn't hold when the topic at hand involves racism because there's no solid line where one all of a sudden is a racist or is not a racist.


And no Konfyouzd, I don't care for Trump, or Obama, for that matter.


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## Vidge

Randy said:


> Also, what the hey, I'll leave these here:
> 
> Donald Trump's Companies Filed for Bankruptcy 4 Times - ABC News
> 
> How Does Trump repeatedly file for Bankruptcy and still stay on top? | LegalZoom



Hm interesting, I wasnt aware.


----------



## WickedSymphony

IshiiKurisu said:


> I'm Brasilian, so I wouldn't be able to vote in US Elections, but, americans, please, Trump is Millionaire, and Obama is a Lawyer; there's no reason of voting in a black lawyer when there's an white millionaire as a choice [I'm not racist; that's just a stupid joke, O.K.? My mother's black and my father's white]!!!



The sad thing is people are actually going to vote like that because Trump is not only a millionaire but also a tv personality, etc. Governator in California, anyone?


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> I think the issue here is that you're saying:
> "If it walks like a duck, then it must be a duck."
> And I'm saying:
> "If it walks like a duck, then it might be a duck."
> 
> Apparently, my way of thinking doesn't hold when the topic at hand involves racism because there's no solid line where one all of a sudden is a racist or is not a racist.
> 
> 
> And no Konfyouzd, I don't care for Trump, or Obama, for that matter.


Like I said earlier, I'm not arguing one way or the other on whether Trump is racist or not (though I would have to admit there is a decent amount of evidence that he might be, although I'm not sure how much of it is just him acting/being just plain stupid) I just don't think that Cenk is wrong, or hypocritical, to accuse him of such, considering the things that he's said and done AND considering that Cenk did not think he was racist until this last crazy thing he done did.


----------



## WickedSymphony

I'm not saying Cenk is wrong or right either way, I just don't agree with the way he's going about presenting his argument. What I was saying was hypocritical were the parts of the video where he talks about how "Oh they just ASSUME that they don't deserve to get into these schools based on their race" but then he goes "what he says is well my smart WHITE friends' sons" and so on. I'd call that an assumption, and to make one after using the word assume like 8 times in his video to me is hypocritical. So even if we disagree, I'd hope you can at least see where I'm coming from. It's also unfortunate that this whole thing snowballed into racism and other BS when that wasn't the original intention in the slightest.

And see, another thing is that you follow these guys and probably know where he was coming from much better than I do. All I've got is this one video to go off of, as I don't very often go out of my way for all of this political drama.


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## Konfyouzd

Randy said:


> Donald Trump doesn't care about black people.


 






When it all falls down...


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> I'm not saying Cenk is wrong or right either way, I just don't agree with the way he's going about presenting his argument. What I was saying was hypocritical were the parts of the video where he talks about how "Oh they just ASSUME that they don't deserve to get into these schools based on their race" but then he goes "what he says is well my smart WHITE friends' sons" and so on. I'd call that an assumption, and to make one after using the word assume like 8 times in his video to me is hypocritical. So even if we disagree, I'd hope you can at least see where I'm coming from. It's also unfortunate that this whole thing snowballed into racism and other BS when that wasn't the original intention in the slightest.
> 
> And see, another thing is that you follow these guys and probably know where he was coming from much better than I do. All I've got is this one video to go off of, as I don't very often go out of my way for all of this political drama.



I can see that, but at that point he was sort of incensed, and it is an opinion show, so I can sort of understand that sort of hyperbole (and I bet he's probably right anyway about Trump's friend's sons being crackers.  ).

I used to just watch their videos every once in a while, but my friend Jon posts them a lot on facebook, so I've become a more regular viewer.


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## synrgy

I'm late to this party, and there's a heck of a lot going on in this thread, most of which I'm going to ignore.  My 2 cents are as follows:

I have a hard time believing anyone would back Trump as a political candidate for any office.

Donald Trump - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The man built his empire on media attention surrounding his multiple bankruptcy filings, divorces, bad hairpieces, making an ass out of himself on national television, and placing a trademark on the phrase 'you're fired'. That doesn't exactly scream 'Presidential Resume' to me. 

Further, the valuations of one's assets do not directly correlate to their business savvy or lack thereof. I don't really see what he's ever done that's been so 'brilliant' from the business perspective. He lucked himself into a slew of media attention, and cashed in on it. Right place, right time. He's certainly no Gates/Jobs on the business end, or even a Buffett/Lynch on the investing end of things. He's certainly a successful celebrity, but that doesn't make him a great business man.

If my choice is between that, and a guy who -- if _nothing_ else -- was _at least_ a Professor of Constitutional Law, well.. Seems like an easy choice to me.

Not that it matters. As expressed here by at least a few others already, the Pres. is just a 'face' at the end of the day. I think what we ought to be doing is taking the energy/time/money we dump into the Presidential elections, and redirecting it toward Congressional elections which are far more important to the big picture. (Well, maybe not the money. Let's just stop throwing that at politicians completely.*)

It's Congress that ultimately determines whether or not shit gets done. They've been an embarrassment to our system longer than I have memory, and we ought to be demanding more. These last few years in particular are unfortunately easy to label as 'theater of the absurd'. Our entire political dialog is basically boiled down to 2 people with their fingers stuck in their ears shouting 'lalalalalalalalalaican'thearyoulalalalalalalalala'..

*obviously a Utopian ideal that will never take place.


----------



## WickedSymphony

highlordmugfug said:


> I can see that, but at that point he was sort of incensed, and it is an opinion show, so I can sort of understand that sort of hyperbole



The problem is far too many political programs are "opinion shows" that try to rile up people one way or the other by spewing their opinions as fact rather than actually informing people about what's important.


----------



## synrgy

WickedSymphony said:


> The problem is far too many political programs are "opinion shows" that try to rile up people one way or the other by spewing their opinions as fact rather than actually informing people about what's important.



Deeper than that, is that much of our actual political dialog is about opinion. Moral legislation. As just one of countless examples, there is no _factual_ data that supports or refutes the claim that a newly developed fetus has consciousness, but that doesn't stop either side of the debate from claiming otherwise. It's not just the media; it's the entire landscape. Facts are irrelevant to a disturbingly large number of people.


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> The problem is far too many political programs are "opinion shows" that try to rile up people one way or the other by spewing their opinions as fact rather than actually informing people about what's important.


 
It's the responsiblity of the voters to "overstand"--as the Rastas put it... Or to see through the proverbial bull poop--as Christopher Walken put it...


----------



## WickedSymphony

synrgy said:


> Deeper than that, is that much of our actual political dialog is about opinion. Moral legislation. As just one of countless examples, there is no _factual_ data that supports or refutes the claim that a newly developed fetus has consciousness, but that doesn't stop either side of the debate from claiming otherwise. It's not just the media; it's the entire landscape. Facts are irrelevant to a disturbingly large number of people.



Very true. And I also agree with everything you said in your previous post. We need to put the focus on Congress because they're the ones that are a fucking embarrassment when it comes to getting shit done.


----------



## highlordmugfug

WickedSymphony said:


> The problem is far too many political programs are "opinion shows" that try to rile up people one way or the other by spewing their opinions as fact rather than actually informing people about what's important.





synrgy said:


> Deeper than that, is that much of our actual political dialog is about opinion. Moral legislation. As just one of countless examples, there is no _factual_ data that supports or refutes the claim that a newly developed fetus has consciousness, but that doesn't stop either side of the debate from claiming otherwise. It's not just the media; it's the entire landscape. Facts are irrelevant to a disturbingly large number of people.


It's sad, but if just facts about what people were doing and had done, and science, and economics were covered in the news, then most people wouldn't watch it, because most people are goddamn dumb.


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## leandroab

Big Butts


----------



## synrgy

Seems his chances are pretty bleak:



> A poll released by USA Today/Gallup this week revealed that Palin would have a tough time beating President Barack Obama in a bid for president in 2012. Although the poll shows that the president himself is up against 46 percent who will "definitely not" vote for him in the next election, it is still a far cry from having 65 percent say they will not. *The poll also had bad news for current Republican frontrunner Donald Trump as well, revealing that 64 percent will "definitely not" vote for the New York real estate tycoon as well.*



Polls Indicate Sarah Palin Should Just Forget About 2012 Presidential Run - Yahoo! News


----------



## highlordmugfug

synrgy said:


> Seems his chances are pretty bleak:
> 
> 
> 
> Polls Indicate Sarah Palin Should Just Forget About 2012 Presidential Run - Yahoo! News


White House releases Obama birth certificate - Yahoo! News

Maybe now Trump can also make less of an ass of himself at every opportunity, but I doubt it seeing how he handles everything else.


----------



## Vidge

right_to_rage said:


> I hope Ron Paul runs, he would be a good choice overall.



[Ron] Paul makes move toward 2012 run | The Des Moines Register | DesMoinesRegister.com



Thats who Im going for...


----------



## GuitaristOfHell

Randy said:


> Donald Trump doesn't care about black people.


 Let's put it like this. Donalds ego is so big he will make a video of him masturbating and then masturbate to that video.


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## synrgy

God bless the Onion.

Trump Unable To Produce Certificate Proving He's Not A Festering Pile Of Shit | The Onion - America's Finest News Source


----------



## synrgy

Jesus Christ Monkey Balls. I totally called it, and I expected it, but I didn't think it would be THIS QUICK.

Donald Trump's New Obama Conspiracy Theory - Yahoo! News

This is what my friends and I call 'Moving the Goal Posts'. IE, when you've clearly lost an argument based on whatever grounds you presented, you just change the topic.


----------



## pink freud

Customisbetter said:


> What I do want is somebody who has proven that they are successful and know what the fuck they are doing.



How Does Trump repeatedly file for Bankruptcy and still stay on top? | LegalZoom

Yes, repeated bankruptcy has always been a hallmark of the successful.


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## Korngod

I generally don't like getting into any political arguments, let alone talking politics at all, but I may just be the only one who actually likes Trump's ego at times... not all the time but some of the time. For example, when he states that he is a very smart, and wealthy man, is that not a fact? Or is it the fact that he demands a birth certificate to prove a presidents birth place that makes him such a bad/dumb person? Unless the government had something to hide, they should have had no problem in releasing his birth certificate, which I see they finally did. After watching various interviews of Trump, I agree with most of the things he stands for. This country need a LEADER and not a family man in office. As Trump stated, the USA is a whipping post for the rest of the world and is no longer respected, in general, which I find to be true. Maybe we don't need Trump in office, but I believe we do need someone with similar beliefs to him in charge.


----------



## Diggy

IMO..Putting Trump in the Oval Office would..

temporarily fix the US economy, if u could call it a fix
ultimately widen the gap between the rich and poor
end VERY bad for him

just my opinion.


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## leandroab

The Onion = Yes please.


----------



## Korngod

FWIW 

http://qbit.cc/obamas-long-form-birth-certificate-is-computer-generated-proves-nothing/


----------



## highlordmugfug

synrgy said:


> Jesus Christ Monkey Balls. I totally called it, and I expected it, but I didn't think it would be THIS QUICK.
> 
> Donald Trump's New Obama Conspiracy Theory - Yahoo! News
> 
> This is what my friends and I call 'Moving the Goal Posts'. IE, when you've clearly lost an argument based on whatever grounds you presented, you just change the topic.


He was actually talking about this crap before the certificate came out.


----------



## scottro202

It seems like a good amount of people are not realizing something that's pretty damn important in this whole discussion, from my point of view and the way I see it anyways:

The president doesn't have all THAT much power in this country. Sure, he IS the leader, in theory, but, what about our system of checks and balances? Every single thing he does has to go through congress. Yes, the president has an effect on congress (democrat president, dem majority in Congress, so on), but ultimately, if they don't like something, then it's tough shit for the president whether he wants whatever he wants or not. 

With all that being said, if I was old enough to vote, I'd probably vote liberal libertarian.

And with the whole Obama vs. Trump thing, I think it'd be interesting at the least to see a businessman as a president. Maybe he could bring this country out of some of its debt. I don't know all that much about Trump besides he's got a ferocious combover and a hot wife.

TL,DR: Leandro for prez 2012


----------



## highlordmugfug

Birtherist response highlights racial undertones of &#8216;debate&#8217; - Yahoo! News


----------



## -42-

The president's number one power is that of persuasion. People seem to confuse 'figurehead' with 'not powerful' when that is anything but the case. The powers of the president have expanded enormously in the past century as the United States emerged as a world power.

Amazon.com: The Imperial Presidency (9780618420018): Jr. Arthur M. Schlesinger: Books

^Read it.


----------



## Konfyouzd

leandroab said:


> Big Butts


 
God I wish I lived in Brazil too... Every time I see a Brazilian woman this is what goes through my mind.

Oh yea... And Donald Trump isn't running for president there.


----------



## Konfyouzd

synrgy said:


> Deeper than that, is that much of our actual political dialog is about opinion. Moral legislation. As just one of countless examples, there is no _factual_ data that supports or refutes the claim that a newly developed fetus has consciousness, but that doesn't stop either side of the debate from claiming otherwise. It's not just the media; it's the entire landscape. Facts are irrelevant to a disturbingly large number of people.


 
Truths like this make me so sad...


----------



## WickedSymphony

synrgy said:


> Seems his chances are pretty bleak:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A poll released by USA Today/Gallup this week revealed that Palin would have a tough time beating President Barack Obama in a bid for president in 2012. Although the poll shows that the president himself is up against 46 percent who will "definitely not" vote for him in the next election, it is still a far cry from having 65 percent say they will not. The poll also had bad news for current Republican frontrunner Donald Trump as well, revealing that 64 percent will "definitely not" vote for the New York real estate tycoon as well.
Click to expand...


Thank God. Even though Obama isn't doing such a great job, I'm glad to see that, at least as far as this poll is concerned, people would rather have him than fuckwits like Palin and Trump in office.


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> Thank God. Even though Obama isn't doing such a great job, I'm glad to see that, at least as far as this poll is concerned, people would rather have him than fuckwits like Palin and Trump in office.


 
Isn't that a no brainer? 

I wouldn't let Sarah Palin run my coffee back and forth to me let alone a whole goddamn country... But I WOULD tap that... 

And about the bankruptcy thing with Trump... Aren't there several types of bankruptcy? Like... Is Donald Trump bankruptcy the same as MC Hammer bankruptcy?


----------



## WickedSymphony

Konfyouzd said:


> Isn't that a no brainer?


Well, with some of the people in this country you never know... 



> Like... Is Donald Trump bankruptcy the same as MC Hammer bankruptcy?


----------



## WickedSymphony

highlordmugfug said:


> Birtherist response highlights racial undertones of &#8216;debate&#8217; - Yahoo! News





People are fucking stupid. It should say Negro on the certificate instead of African because African suggests political correctness? Please... They got what they wanted, now they need to shut up and go away, but that probably isn't going to happen.


----------



## Konfyouzd

WickedSymphony said:


> People are fucking stupid. It should say Negro on the certificate instead of African because African suggests political correctness? Please... They got what they wanted, now they need to shut up and go away, but that probably isn't going to happen.


 
But considering the time the birth certificate would have been produced didn't they call black ppl negros? 

I can't comment on the political correctness of documents produced at that time, of course, but it seems odd to nitpick like that about the president's birth certificate.

I'm a gov't contractor and *I* have to go through hell and high water to get these clearances. If the president didn't have a valid birth certificate he couldn't even hold MY job...

Also... If we wanna talk about being sneaky. Remember all those recounts when Bush ran? 

The moral? You can be a sneaky sack of shit so long as you have a valid US birth certificate to substantiate your doucehbaggery...


----------



## WickedSymphony

Konfyouzd said:


> But considering the time the birth certificate would have been produced didn't they call black ppl negros?
> 
> I can't comment on the political correctness of documents produced at that time, of course, but it seems odd to nitpick like that about the president's birth certificate.



Yeh, I'm not sure if they tried to be politically correct on documents like this back then (even so, I'd imagine African would have been flat out more correct in terms of putting the father's race on a birth certificate, regardless of political correctness), but like you said and part of what I was getting at, nitpicking that is just too much.



> Also... If we wanna talk about being sneaky. Remember all those recounts when Bush ran?



Yes, my God that was ridiculous.

E:


> The moral? You can be a sneaky sack of shit so long as you have a valid US birth certificate to substantiate your doucehbaggery...



I've got mine! Go get yours and let us commence in sneaky shit-sackery!


----------



## IshiiKurisu

Konfyouzd said:


> My name is Konfyouzd and I approved this message.



Thanks, sir! At least one person in this world understands me. [MADE MY DAY!  ]


----------



## Overtone

Konfyouzd said:


> And about the bankruptcy thing with Trump... Aren't there several types of bankruptcy? Like... Is Donald Trump bankruptcy the same as MC Hammer bankruptcy?




ROFL! No, it's not. At some point he wasn't doing well financially on a personal level, but the bankruptcies were filed by companies that he owned. Basically he burdened his companies with a lot of debt hoping things would go great, and when they didn't, they had to file bankruptcy instead of repaying those loans. It's kind of like the recent financial crisis... a lot of people (including home buyers, banks, and even hedge funds and real estate firms) basically saw in the period before the financial crisis that there was this great payoff where either they made money hand over fist with very little personal investment, or if they did lose money, it was the lenders' money anyway. Like a trip to the casino using somebody else's credit card! Granted that somebody else was dumb enough to say "Hey, have my credit card. Please! I'm begging you!"


----------



## BuckarooBanzai

Customisbetter said:


> I will vote for Trump in an instant. I don't give a FUCK about my government employee's personal life.
> *What I do want is somebody who has proven that they are successful and know what the fuck they are doing*. Obama was a decent city planner, but a horrible politician and not the best businessman.
> 
> Trump has proven that he can get shit done and he can get money where its needed for success. I really hope he gets the seat and I'm sure if he does we will actually see some fucking change.



Donald Trump - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Definitely knows what he's doing.

**EDIT: Hadn't read the whole thread. But still, Ron Paul IMHO.


----------



## Treeunit212

Mo Jiggity said:


> Donald Trump - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Definitely knows what he's doing.
> 
> **EDIT: Hadn't read the whole thread. But still, Ron Paul IMHO.



Ron Paul is a "small government" Republican that doesn't believe in the separation of church and state, voted against gay adoption, and wants the STATES to decide everything. Letting the states decide everything would make every state an entirely separate country just like the slave owning south wanted 150 years ago. HE IS A SELF PROCLAIMED CONSITUTIONALIST THAT DOESN'T BELIEVE IN THE SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE. Why don't people get that?!

As for Trump, did everyone forget that a big chunk of his wealth was inheritance? How bout all those real estate deals that failed under his watch? Do we REALLY want the guy that thinks China is the enemy to run our military? Yeah let's charge 25% interest on china for the 14 trillion dollars they're holding and see if THAT doesn't start WWIII.

I'll take the president that inherited all these problems and still hasn't killed himself yet over those idiots any day. And no, stem cell research isn't the only thing he did. He also saved us from the second depression and ordered the feds to stop raiding marijuana dispensaries in California.

That counts for something, right? Right?!?!



Fuckit. Trump 2012.


----------



## Konfyouzd

How the fuck is Trump still in the lead?


----------



## TreWatson

Konfyouzd said:


> But considering the time the birth certificate would have been produced didn't they call black ppl negros?



just a little intejection: His father was native african, so actually, they can;t call him negro. that's reserved for black americans with no discernable ancestry ( because of slavery)

Obama's family is kenyan. so since he's technically 2nd generation, he's kenyan american, just like tosin abasi is Nigerian-american (music and politic related FUCKYEAH!!!1)


----------



## Randy

Half Kenyan American.


----------



## Konfyouzd

TreWatson said:


> just a little intejection: His father was native african, so actually, they can;t call him negro. that's reserved for black americans with no discernable ancestry ( because of slavery)
> 
> Obama's family is kenyan. so since he's technically 2nd generation, he's kenyan american, just like tosin abasi is Nigerian-american (music and politic related FUCKYEAH!!!1)



Well damn... Did not know this...


----------



## synrgy

Konfyouzd said:


> How the fuck is Trump still in the lead?



If I understand a few posts above, it's apparently because people can read his wikipedia article and STILL think he's capable of doing something other than running businesses into bankruptcy.


----------



## aslsmm

i dont want trump or obama in the race, wich is why i dont vote. when they take away the purose of voteing, then they have taken away voting all together.

people can say "if you dont vote then you dont have the right to bitch about it" but really voting was never suppose to be about picking the lesser of two evils. it was about who would run the country better. read the constitution then get a blue collar working man or an educated non politician man in there and ill vote. someone who is trying to get out of hud housing and struggling to make his child support would give 2 shits about iraq. a contractor that is out of bussiness due to the colapse of the economy wont fuck with free health care. these americans are the ones that should be purposing bills and amendments. 

a minority that overcomes his obsticles to make something of himself wont have a 10+ year bullshit debate on same same sex marriage. we need some one who deals with the every day problems to get in office so we can fix the every day problems.

ok im done.


----------



## Konfyouzd

^ But he'd die for lack of air time... 

That's our country.


----------



## Blind Theory

I hope to God that Trump doesn't seriously run. I am not a fan of Obama by any means but I'd much rather have him as President over The Donald. For one, and I haven't seriously looked into it so correct me if I'm wrong but, Donald Trump has very little if no political experience when it comes to running for any office. So what makes him qualified? He has billions of dollars but that doesn't mean he can run a country with as many problems as ours. And I haven't looked at other candidates so I have to say Obama on this......... That tasted bad in my mouth


----------



## aslsmm

Yup. G.E and MSN wont puroduce a worthy canidate.


----------



## Alimination

I'm confused on why people go for the lesser of the two evils thing.

Its like picking either an electric chair or lethal injection.

...Just pick neither. There are other parties out there you know? Chances are if you vote for the others (or at least get a high enough percentage) the other parties will start acting like the others.

The main reason why most of the candidates move towards this socialist, police state, big brother route.. is because the last couple presidents we voted for.. WERE FOR THEM!!!



I for one am not voting for either, unless Ron Paul is running for republican. Even then I hope he drops out and runs as a libritarian or Independent.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

I understand the frustration of the US folk who think Obama has done a shitty job. However, US Presidency is nearly Global Presidency and from an outsiders POV he's the best guy you've had in my lifetime.

He's smart, he's responsible and he doesn't fuck around. Hell, I actually quite like the guy. If you choose to re-elect him for another term in office I will for the second time have my faith restored in America.


----------



## The Somberlain

Alimination said:


> I'm confused on why people go for the lesser of the two evils thing.
> 
> Its like picking either an electric chair or lethal injection.
> 
> ...Just pick neither. There are other parties out there you know? Chances are if you vote for the others (or at least get a high enough percentage) the other parties will start acting like the others.
> 
> The main reason why most of the candidates move towards this socialist, police state, big brother route.. is because the last couple presidents we voted for.. WERE FOR THEM!!!
> 
> 
> 
> I for one am not voting for either, unless Ron Paul is running for republican. Even then I hope he drops out and runs as a libritarian or Independent.



Our current path is far from socialist if we're bailing out big business, and after all, Marx, Proudhon, Kropotkin, Engels, et. al were as anti-statist as one could get




Scar Symmetry said:


> I understand the frustration of the US folk who think Obama has done a shitty job. However, US Presidency is nearly Global Presidency and from an outsiders POV he's the best guy you've had in my lifetime.
> 
> He's smart, he's responsible and he doesn't fuck around. Hell, I actually quite like the guy. If you choose to re-elect him for another term in office I will for the second time have my faith restored in America.



Yep, peeps don't get the big picture in America, and tend to gravitate towards batshit crazy.


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## josh pelican

Scar Symmetry said:


> I understand the frustration of the US folk who think Obama has done a shitty job. However, US Presidency is nearly Global Presidency and from an outsiders POV he's the best guy you've had in my lifetime.



Unfortunately, I don't think that's saying much.


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## -42-

The Somberlain said:


> Our current path is far from socialist if we're bailing out big business, and after all, Marx, Proudhon, Kropotkin, Engels, et. al were as anti-statist as one could get



You're right, we aren't going socialist as much as we're going Keynesian. Granted the two are both poor systems in my opinion, but this isn't a thread for discussing economic models.


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## The Somberlain

-42- said:


> You're right, we aren't going socialist as much as we're going Keynesian. Granted the two are both poor systems in my opinion, but this isn't a thread for discussing economic models.



My heart goes socialist, my mind goes Ricardo-influenced Keynesian economics; damn economics get confusing.


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## Speedy Fingers

I really like Obama.


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## Randy

Trump announces he will not run for president - Yahoo! News


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## CFB

Is anyone surprised? After the birther-fiasco nobody could take him serious.


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## Randy

He was never going to fucking run. It was a stunt.


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## Treeunit212

Randy said:


> He was never going to fucking run. It was a stunt.



Thank. God.


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## McKay

ROAR said:


> I prefer the Labour party of England, mostly because I like Ed Milliband and he seems to be doing a lot to make things happen.





> England


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## soliloquy

i think obama wins coz of this:





trumps arguments are invalid


(yes, i know he stepped down...)


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## Konfyouzd

^ This guy...


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## daemon barbeque

soliloquy said:


> i think obama wins coz of this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> trumps arguments are invalid
> 
> 
> (yes, i know he stepped down...)


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## IshiiKurisu

GUYS!!! WHY ARE YOU LETTING OBAMA WIN? DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUCK IT MEANS?


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## AySay

IshiiKurisu said:


> GUYS!!! WHY ARE YOU LETTING OBAMA WIN? DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUCK IT MEANS?



Incompetence is better than insanity?


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## synrgy

IshiiKurisu said:


> GUYS!!! WHY ARE YOU LETTING OBAMA WIN? DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUCK IT MEANS?



It means there's a hand full of people on a guitar forum who will vote for him?


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## Guitarman700

IshiiKurisu said:


> GUYS!!! WHY ARE YOU LETTING OBAMA WIN? DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE FUCK IT MEANS?



WUT


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## highlordmugfug

Now we just have to count on Gingrich to save us from a horrifyingly contradictory future of &#8220;a secular atheist country, potentially one dominated by radical Islamists&#8221;.


:dipshit:
Also because he supports Paul Ryan's budget plan for healthcare/Medicare, but he's against it, and he would have voted for it, but it's unconstitutional.
...

:lolwut:
New thread?


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## Guitarman700

highlordmugfug said:


> Now we just have to count on Gingrich to save us from a horrifyingly contradictory future of a secular atheist country, potentially one dominated by radical Islamists.
> 
> 
> :dipshit:
> Also because he supports Paul Ryan's plan for Medicare, but he's against it, and he would have voted for it, but it's unconstitutional.
> ...
> 
> :lolwut:
> New thread?



Gingrich is so dumb. HE SO DUMB.


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## ArkaneDemon

highlordmugfug said:


> Now we just have to Count Grishnackh president in 2012



THIS IS WAR

HUH

WOW


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## Holy Katana

I don't really know what I'm going to do. I've never actually voted before, since I was 17 in 2008, and the local elections are more or less guaranteed Republican wins. Although our last governor, Phil Bredesen, was a Democrat, and somehow managed to not only get elected, but get reelected.

There's a good chance I'll just sit it out, since I'm not a fan of either major party, and have a distaste for party politics in general. I'd rather have Obama than a Republican, but I'd rather not vote for him. I could vote for a third-party candidate if there was a halfway decent one on the ballot here, but I don't know who's going to be on it.


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## Alimination

ArkaneDemon said:


> THIS IS WAR
> 
> HUH
> 
> WOW


 
hahaha that litterally made me LOL


----------



## Konfyouzd

AySay said:


> Incompetence is better than insanity?


----------



## Randy

ArkaneDemon said:


> THIS IS WAR
> 
> HUH
> 
> WOW





Many laughs.


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## IshiiKurisu

synrgy said:


> It means there's a hand full of people on a guitar forum who will vote for him?



Yeah, I have to say you're right...

BUT, GUYS!!! IT MAY BE BETTER FOR YOU, but think about your children, the rest of the world, think about the future. We have a problem here in Brasil called Dilma, she came here just to fuck us! Imagine what Obama will do if he has more 4 ok years? He killed Osama beneath a crisis, imagine without it!

[Please, I'm just joking, it was meant to be a funny thread, I respect Obama]


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## Treeunit212

IshiiKurisu said:


> Yeah, I have to say you're right...
> 
> BUT, GUYS!!! IT MAY BE BETTER FOR YOU, but think about your children, the rest of the world, think about the future. We have a problem here in Brasil called Dilma, she came here just to fuck us! Imagine what Obama will do if he has more 4 ok years? He killed Osama beneath a crisis, imagine without it!
> 
> [Please, I'm just joking, it was meant to be a funny thread, I respect Obama]



Oh don't worry. I see what you did there...

Wait. No. I didn't.


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## IshiiKurisu

Treeunit212 said:


> Oh don't worry. I see what you did there...
> 
> Wait. No. I didn't.



WTF?


----------



## Randy

Language barrier.


----------



## Treeunit212

IshiiKurisu said:


> WTF?


----------



## IshiiKurisu

Let me explain it better...

There's Dilma, a bitch no one knows where she came from, everything she did after some months was to destroy Brasil. She's white, but no man. But we can forgive her, it's passed just some months.

But there's Obama, man, black, lawyer, hawaian and american. In 4 years, he lived a global crisis, watched the rise of that Canadian dwarf and killed Osama, too much for just one man in a short period of time. Imagine if he had more 4 years! What else can come? World War III against China? The buy of the Amazon Rainforest? The rise of another Pop demon?

Please, the only white man who has been around the White House we all hate is Bush Jr.. Even Bush Sr. is a good boy.
Now imagine Trump, a millionaire who achieved his own success after a lot of hard work, as a president of the USA, the most powerful man in this World.


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## Treeunit212

IshiiKurisu said:


> Let me explain it better...
> 
> There's Dilma, a bitch no one knows where she came from, everything she did after some months was to destroy Brasil. She's white, but no man. But we can forgive her, it's passed just some months.
> 
> But there's Obama, man, black, lawyer, hawaian and american. In 4 years, he lived a global crisis, watched the rise of that Canadian dwarf and killed Osama, too much for just one man in a short period of time. Imagine if he had more 4 years! What else can come? World War III against China? The buy of the Amazon Rainforest? The rise of another Pop demon?
> 
> Please, the only white man who has been around the White House we all hate is Bush Jr.. Even Bush Sr. is a good boy.
> Now imagine Trump, a millionaire who achieved his own success after a lot of hard work, as a president of the USA, the most powerful man in this World.



I don't follow your logic. At all...

It also troubles me that the color of his skin still matters.

Trump is a professional bullshitter. Putting that at the head of the entire Military would be bad news. But it's not like it matters, he's out of the race. Wasn't really in it to begin with, just wanted better ratings for the Apprentice.

Professional. Bullshitter.


----------



## Randy

This thread has taken a rather peculiar turn.


----------



## Guitarman700

Randy said:


> This thread has taken a rather peculiar turn.


----------



## IshiiKurisu

Treeunit212 said:


> I don't follow your logic. At all...
> 
> It also troubles me that the color of his skin still matters.
> 
> Trump is a professional bullshitter. Putting that at the head of the entire Military would be bad news. But it's not like it matters, he's out of the race. Wasn't really in it to begin with, just wanted better ratings for the Apprentice.
> 
> Professional. Bullshitter.



The color of the skin doesn't really matter, it was just to piss people off. 

For real, my opinion is:

The problem here is that Obama isn't that Administrator Trump is. People [at least to me] know only the side he's shown at TV, but, for me, a guy who built an Empire and keeps it growing, without many problems, is completely able to be the president of USA. His vision [in this side] is better than most of the lawers, who need an economist to keep the office going on. I'm not saying Obama is a bad keeper; his government is a real challenge, and he's taking it nicely. But I think Trump would take it better.

Please, it's my opinion, since I respect yours, dear Reader, I think you're supposed to respect mine.


----------



## Guitarman700

IshiiKurisu said:


> The color of the skin doesn't really matter, it was just to piss people off.
> 
> For real, my opinion is:
> 
> The problem here is that Obama isn't that Administrator Trump is. People [at least to me] know only the side he's shown at TV, but, for me, a guy who built an Empire and keeps it growing, without many problems, is completely able to be the president of USA. His vision [in this side] is better than most of the lawers, who need an economist to keep the office going on. I'm not saying Obama is a bad keeper; his government is a real challenge, and he's taking it nicely. But I think Trump would take it better.
> 
> Please, it's my opinion, since I respect yours, dear Reader, I think you're supposed to respect mine.



Trump is no administrator, he's a terrible businessman who made his fortune off TV and running his businesses into the ground. He's a freaking hack. A sham.


----------



## highlordmugfug

IshiiKurisu said:


> The problem here is that Obama isn't that Administrator Trump is. People [at least to me] know only the side he's shown at TV, but, for me, a guy who built an Empire and keeps it growing, *without many problem*s, is completely able to be the president of USA. His vision [in this side] is better than most of the lawers, who need an economist to keep the office going on. I'm not saying Obama is a bad keeper; his government is a real challenge, and he's taking it nicely. But I think Trump would take it better.
> 
> Please, it's my opinion, since I respect yours, dear Reader, I think you're supposed to respect mine.


Trump has filed for bankruptcy multiple times (4 I believe), and he owns (correct me if I'm wrong) mostly real estate, casinos, and golf course/country clubs: if Obama's community organizing and what not isn't considered political experience, how could Trump's building places for people to sleep and play golf be considered experience?


----------



## Guitarman700

How do you make a small fortune?
Give a large one to Donald Trump.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Guitarman700 said:


> How do you make a small fortune?
> Give a large one to Donald Trump.


----------



## Treeunit212

Guitarman700 said:


> How do you make a small fortune?
> Give a large one to Donald Trump.



ZING!


----------



## Alimination

lmfao!!


----------



## IshiiKurisu

Yeah, I have to say you're right. That joke is really serious, and he's been bankrupt many times, I can't deny it. And I'm sure Trump would be a worse puppet than Obama; lil' Donald would create laws to improve the shit he already has.

But I'd still vote in Trump. lol YEAH, YOU CAN HATE ME FOR THAT BUT I DON'T CARE.


----------



## Justin Bailey

SoldiersOfFilth said:


> haha. the irony.



Thats not ironic, it's coincidental. Actually it's not even coincidental, it makes perfect sense as ads these days usually use keywords to focus in on what a page may be about.


----------



## Chickenhawk

I find it extremely funny that this thread is still alive.


Since...y'know...Trump isn't running for President.


----------



## highlordmugfug

Chickenhawk said:


> I find it extremely funny that this thread is still alive.
> 
> 
> Since...y'know...Trump isn't running for President.







Allegedly!


----------



## IshiiKurisu

Justin Bailey said:


> Thats not ironic, it's coincidental. Actually it's not even coincidental, it makes perfect sense as ads these days usually use keywords to focus in on what a page may be about.




They are following you, guys. It's true. The day I said in youtube I prefer buying songs to downloading them, the next day i was sent thousand friend invitations. That can't be just a coincidence...

And I wanna know why I'm in this thread since I'm no american. [O.K., I have american relatives, but that doesn't make me american.  ]


----------

