# Possible Scammer on here (Cooley Jr.)



## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

I don't know if this is the place to be posting this but seeing as this was a 7620 sold I wanted it to get as much viewing as possible. 

Here is the thread where it began

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/gu...-huge-feeler-my-white-7620-a.html#post1931922

Again, this is very sad for me to have happen to as Cameron was a really good/close friend of mine. As shitty as this is turning out to be, I do hope this can come to full circle with some sort of respectful closure.

Your thoughts? What should I do?


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## Prydogga (Apr 10, 2010)

Cameron has done many trades/sales that I've seen and you obviously have as well being a close friend, but I find it hard to believe he would do this, I'm really sorry for your situation and really hope for everyone's sake this isn't what it seems, and he will come through, I have confidence it might turn out alright.  Again sorry man.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

Me to man, I just had to say something though. I couldn't let it happen on here again.


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## Evil7 (Apr 10, 2010)

people tend to operate slower than normal when they've been in a bind and the other side gets pushy.... I understand both sides. If he never ships the guitar.. Thats Fucked up.

EDIT.. either way... he should have kept the other party well informed of his situation before they had time to get upset.....


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## Demiurge (Apr 10, 2010)

This wouldn't convince me that he's a scammer (like, someone who'd set up all of these sketchy deals with other people) but I think he's taking advantage of a friendship here. It looks like he was given a loan with the guitar as collateral and is intent on taking his sweet time paying it back because he knows he'll have the guitar back anyway.

Church and State go together better than friends and financial issues. There are only a few friends that I can go to dinner with and trust that they won't stiff on their part of the bill, let alone consider "loaning" them hundreds of dollars.


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## Hollowman (Apr 10, 2010)

I'm gonna give the benefit of the doubt since the last time he was on was 4-2 -10 maybe he doesn't have the web right now.


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## Scar Symmetry (Apr 10, 2010)

If he's a friend shouldn't you give him the benefit of the doubt?

Sure it does sound a bit suspicious, but Cameron is a long time poster of 777 and I don't think he would be doing what he's doing unless there was a very good reason.

Hang tight.


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## Prydogga (Apr 10, 2010)

After re-reading the messages between your GF and him, I'm going to have to go on the side of this being a misunderstanding, I think as a friend it is a bit impatient to call out a guy as a possible scammer over a friendly agreement, I don't blame him for being late with his end of the deal, things sound rough, I'd let it wait for a bit.


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## jhonson (Apr 10, 2010)

From an outsiders perspective I think that you shouldve given him the benifit of the doubt in order to preserve your friendship with him, but I also know full well that I would have reacted exactly the same in your position, personally, i think you should try and make up with him, Im sure he knows you were doing him a favour, hes probably just getting stressed with all the shit happening around him and we all know that feeling.

But nice one on the buying back deal, you sound like a good friend (y)


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## snuif09 (Apr 10, 2010)

cameron seems like a cool guy to me but i think he has alot of stress and things top worry about atm im sure when he is done with getting things right he will ship the guitar asap


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## Nonservium (Apr 10, 2010)

I think a face to face visit is in order. Get the law involved if you have to but don't just sit and take it. He's already disrespected you and her enough to prove any civil dealing with him is just wasted effort. Do what ever it takes to come out of this with your money or the guitar is what I would do. The second he stopped communicating is the second I would've been on a plane to where ever he is.

I'm not encouraging some kind of violence but folks generally change their tone when confronted face to face.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Apr 10, 2010)

I think he's only like 17-18. This is why I prefer not to deal with really young people. Not all teenagers will fuck you over, but it's far more likely since they don't generally have the cash to fall back on when shit hits the fan.

I hope you get your guitar or your money dude.


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## Mindcrime1204 (Apr 10, 2010)

Hes been coming online, he logs into myspace, facebook, and youtube. He's totally avoiding them. 

No one wants to hear an excuse, they just want you to send the Money or the guitar. People have their own problems too, ya know.


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## Mindcrime1204 (Apr 10, 2010)

Nick and his GF are both very nice people, and it pisses me off to see them bein taken advantage of!

I really do hope you get the guitar or the money real soon guys!


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## S-O (Apr 10, 2010)

Well, reading the messages it seems Cameron is being quite the irresponsible cunt. Shipping the guitar with ~3 days is fair business. Taking weeks is just fail.

But

This is just your side of the story, so I'd have to know all the details to know what's truly up.


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## cvinos (Apr 10, 2010)

I am sure you guys can get on again in the future, shit is happening all around the world. Hope all three find a way and the guitar is delivered at last, soon. If it is, do not fight each other too much, no one really knows what happened exactly during the days except the one who received the money. Which was a considerable amount and the complete exchange should end civil. Me too can understand both sides and hopes for a bit of metal freedom.


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## guitarplayerone (Apr 10, 2010)

yea idk dude i'm not sure if you could safely call him a scammer based on this.

but this is why if you really want a safety blanket, you use a credit card to pay paypal, this way you have an added layer of security


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## djpharoah (Apr 10, 2010)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> I think he's only like 17-18. This is why I prefer not to deal with really young people. Not all teenagers will fuck you over, but it's far more likely since they don't generally have the cash to fall back on when shit hits the fan.


So true - which is why I even included that in my Safe Rules for Trading post.


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## Customisbetter (Apr 10, 2010)

I guess you can't even trust friends anymore.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 10, 2010)

I wouldn't say he's a "scammer" straight up, but rather a stupid kid who got in a little over his head with no way to really work his way out. 

Instead of confronting you directly, and keeping contact (talk about a blow to his ego) he chose to "run" from talking to you. Most likely out of shame. 

The ball is in his court, if he doesn't reply by Wednesday (which I assume is his next pay day) then perhaps this would be worth moving to the next level, as in getting higher powers involved and such. 

For the record, save all e-mails, Facebook postings, YouTube postings, etc., anything that can definitely prove he was avoiding you. As well as show his intentions. While I'd like to believe he's just in between a rock and a hard place, he wouldn't be the first SSO member with great rep to go rogue on us.


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## leonardo7 (Apr 10, 2010)

Im just curious, when you say hes a friend what does that mean? Im only asking cause I see you live in different parts of the country so Im just curious what you mean by "friend". You used to live in or near the same town and used to hang out in person? Grew up together? Went to school together? If your calling him a friend and have never met him then thats a bit weird to be calling him a friend if you have only met over the internet. So are you "friends" or "internet friends"?

Most likely he will come through but you learn that there are three types of people, those of us who are good business people, those of us who arent and then there are the scammers. Scammers bring it into a whole different world of issues. I hope its just that hes bad with business and not a scammer. Hopefully hes just bad with business and feels embarrassed and figures he cant own up to it until he gets the money. Its just too bad cause a third party was involved when they lent you the money. Did she lend him the money or you the money? Seems like she lent him the money if she is getting invloved trying to reach him no? Now he doesnt know who to pay the money to so to speak. Tricky it can get. Hopefully he gets the money and comes through for you and this can all just be an issue of a good person who is bad with business.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

Internet friend. This is why I have no shame in publicaly calling him out. He has a history of being a doucwbag and irresponsible. Noone else would have considered this deal in a hundred years but somewhere out of the kindness of my heart I wanted to help a friend in need. This isnt the first time he's been kicked out, last tine he was on the streets. I couldnt stand to let it happen again. If you all knew him the way a lot of us do on camfrog, that's where some have known him for 7+ years, you would know this is a typical act of cam being cam. No way in hell he's getting the benefit of the doubt this time. This is ourely him being irresponsible and taking full advantage of him not having anything to lose. Hell, im just some nice Guy online he'll never meet anyways right? This is the kind of crap We get for making an effort to help a friend in need these days? I'm totally disrespected by all his BS.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

He knows damn well who to pay money to, believe me. We all hand in a video/audio chat room. He's known me and my gf for a while now, she lives with me. Just trust me, he knows damn well who he's paying back.

Maybe a little more detail is needed.

As stated originally, he needed money for rent that month in Vermont. Previously, about a month before the deal he set up a paypal...oddly enough. Few feeks later he makes a "Help cam pay rent fund" on facebook. Then a few days after that he puts his 7620 up for sale. We offer to do the deal, knowing how much he loves his guitar. He takes the gracious deal and the money is sent the day after, the 20th of March. He starts the process of getting that money to his bank account, which takes 3-4 days. During this whole process of waiting, he goes onto continue about "what i should buy" with the money to me and others. He even joked to me about buying fleshlight, yes a fleshlight. Goes to show how serious he intended on being from the start. So few days go buy and the money is officially his and only his. ONE HOUR before his bus ticket leaves, he casually informs us of, "hey btw I can't ship the guitar because I had to buy a bus ticket to South Caronlina". So he was kicked out the day he got the money, and waited all fucking day until the last minute when what was done was done to tell us. He then rushed off stating the guitar wasn't important right now and he can't worry about dealing with it, and "i'm taking it to SC with me." He said he would get to it when he could. 

So he just signed off and leaves without a warning. He Arrives in SC on march 27th with a big facebook status of "I'm in SC fokerz." So THREE days go buy of him casually browsing the internet, posting shit on facebook and youtube. Carrying conversations with people, comment rusty cooleys new videos etc. All the while NOT ONE fucking update on HIM OR THE GUITAR. So I finally message him myself.

Yes, I know I was a little pissed off, but I knew this was going to happen.

"I'm not playing this game anymore. You don't have the decency to fucking talk to me or ari with any kind of an update..and it's been 4 days since you've had internet?"

Again, sorry I know. But You have to understand my anger at this point. He already went back on his word of what the money was for, didn't have the brains to set aside enough for shipping, and refused to keep in ANY kind of contact as to if the guitar even made the trip. He took a bus for fuck sake, of course I worried if had been stolen or not. Hell that's probably the case and he's to ashamed to admit it. OH and about the shipping. He claims he went to the post office and they quoted him $72 for ups ground. Now being apart of a site like this, I can tell you it simply does not cost that much to ship a guitar of that size/weight. I've paid for shipping twice on a 1527, and twice on a 7620, WITH CASES, and they both cost under $30 everytime. Not to mention both my parents work work for fedex/ups/usps. I've personally called ups in Shelburne Vermont and NO, they didn't quote him that much. EVEN IF THEY DID, any decent human being would have shipped the fucking guitar in the first place, BEFORE they spent it on other bullshit. *Excuse my language please*

Those are just some minor details in this whole fiasco as I don't want to make him look like even more of a fool before I absolutely know whats going on. Givin the above circumstances; the setting up a paypal a month prio to knowing he would be short on rent, the fund, the shady ups deal, the waiting 'till an hour before the matter to inform us, the serious lack of communication, everything points towards well, Cameron just doesn't give a shit about making this deal come to full circle any EFFIN time soon.


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## Mindcrime1204 (Apr 10, 2010)

That S&H rate is a crock of BS, I know for sure it doesn't cost nearly as much.


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## Konfyouzd (Apr 10, 2010)

i was gonna lend the guy one of my guitars to play while he had to go through all this bs... 

this whole situation is bad news bears


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 10, 2010)

Anyone else notice that he (Cooley Jr./Cameron) hasn't posted on here since 3/20/10, when he got the money from Duckykong/His GF?

Though, he's been able to log into other sites just fine, such as Facebook. This adds a whole other level of suspicion, for me any way.


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## Customisbetter (Apr 10, 2010)

Ill be honest, i found myslef in a similar situation as Cooley with the need money thing. I sold my guitar to a LEFT HANDED guy on AGF.  i dunno what i was thinking but he was willing so whatever. he tried seting it up lefty and didn't like it (understandable) and loaned it to a friend. a couple months later he put it back up for sale, and i bought it back. 

TL;DR these transactions CAN work. It seems Cooley is just being a dick.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

Here is a quote from a good friend Paul who has also know cam for many years. Even through the internet, the Video/Audio chat room allows for a pretty personal friendship. We all know him well.

PaulMetalDieHard : odd you fell into his scam. he has been scamming for years dude.. he tried to sucker me out of 300 for bus fare and food. I told him that will be the day i'll give you 300 to party with. he just laughed and that was it. his song and dance was not flying with me. i knew his character well. nick your kindness to help him play you will probably be more of an ego hit to you than a money loss. chock this one up to a life learning lesson. sorry your kindness got you scammed. your good people. life moves on.


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## Sephiroth952 (Apr 10, 2010)

He also hasn't been on camfrog in forever,this all a load of bs.Cam needs to come out of hiding.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

EDIT: He also told others he was moving to SC before informing me or my girlfriend. I was just noted of this by a friend. just another level of shadyness.


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## Necris (Apr 10, 2010)

Sorry to hear about all this. It really sucks that your kindness/willingness to help a friend came back to bite you. I hope things end well for you.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)

Thanks dude. 
As far as getting her money back, that really isn't an option I don't think.
The money was sent as gift option to avoid fee's. The card was funded with her credit card however, does this add ANY security at all on my part?


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 10, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> Thanks dude.
> As far as getting her money back, that really isn't an option I don't think.
> The money was sent as gift option to avoid fee's. The card was funded with her credit card however, does this add ANY security at all on my part?



Call up the number on the back of the card, as well as contact PayPal. I'd try PayPal first though. 

The CC companies tend to side in favor of their clients (you/your GF), but I'm not sure how the PayPal thing will tie in. It might make it so the charges to PayPal are reversed and your account will be in the negative. 

You really need to talk to some CS reps ASAP.


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## Duckykong (Apr 10, 2010)




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## BlindingLight7 (Apr 10, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> EDIT: He also told others he was moving to SC before informing me or my girlfriend. I was just noted of this by a friend. just another level of shadyness.


Told me about it too, I told him that this exact thing was going to happen, and whataya know...  He pretty much used the cash to go back to South Dakota, I don't think he has any intentions on getting the guitar back and giving you your money.


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## MorbidTravis (Apr 10, 2010)

hopefully you get your guitar, or refund and never have to deal with him again


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## BlindingLight7 (Apr 10, 2010)

Sidenote, He also said he wasn't sending the guitar till he moved, it's been awhile since he moved, think you got screwed man, =\


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## InTheRavensName (Apr 10, 2010)

I *think* if you paid by credit card, you can still get a chargeback through paypal up to 60 days from the original transaction.


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## metal_tones (Apr 10, 2010)

That sucks DuckyKong.
I hope you either get the money back or the guitar. Hopefully he isn't a scammer.
GOOD LUCK!


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## scaryari (Apr 10, 2010)

I, sadly, am the girlfriend who this happened to.
I called my bank (I used a debit card) and they said I am able to file a dispute for this matter. 
But in the process of this, I have to SHUT DOWN my card, and a new one will be mailed in 7-10 business days. And because my bank isn't local (I moved to Oregon from California just a couple months ago and haven't switched banks), I've been doing online banking and using my debit card.
I'll get some forms to fill out with as much detail as possible and with copies of the messages. When I send those back it will be about a week before they get in touch with me and tell me what I can and cannot do through the bank and this claim.
They said on the phone that I'll "most likely have to go to Small Claims, there's only so much a bank can do before it is out of our hands".

I REALLY REALLY don't want it to go this far.
I've never been involved with the law. It's pathetic how low this has sunken and how long I have been waiting. For a response, for anything.
I just either want HIM to give me my money back, or just take a simple 30 bucks out of his paycheck like he SAID he would do and ship the guitar.

As many people from Camfrog have noted, I have been patient with this. I'm finally reaching my limit to where enough is enough.
He's gone to so many lengths to lie to me, betray me, and hide. He's stopped coming online ALL TOGETHER.
I put my trust into a supposed "friend" who took advantage of it and screwed me over. 

And the fucked up thing is (as some of you said, don't do trades with teenagers), he's older than me. I'm 18, he's almost 20.


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## metal_tones (Apr 10, 2010)

That sucks. I hope it all works out.
GOOD LUCK!


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## Nonservium (Apr 10, 2010)

The more I read of this the more it sucks. You two seem like good people and good people don't deserve to be treated like this. I've had my fair share of being used by unscrupulous bottom feeders but this is just crap. In the end you'll still come out on top, guitar/money or not, just by simply not sucking at life to the point where you have to scam people. That doesn't make this blow any less. I still think you should confront him in person, he shouldn't be too hard to find. Dumbshits usually leave a trail of fail a mile wide and 10 miles long. I hope your bank works it out.


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## Scar Symmetry (Apr 10, 2010)

Fuck what I said earlier, Cameron is a real dick


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## ykcirj (Apr 10, 2010)

I hope it works out for you guys. I hate to say it but there probably is no guitar anymore. He probably pawned it or sold it locally. Your best bet is to stop wasting time and make a call to The police dept. In his area. He obviously isn't concerned about getting you your money or your guitar. it's situations like this that ruin it for everyone. It makes it hard to trust people.


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## Mindcrime1204 (Apr 10, 2010)

cam if youre reading this, SHIP THAT FUCKING GUITAR!


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## Prydogga (Apr 10, 2010)

Scar Symmetry said:


> Fuck what I said earlier, Cameron is a real dick



sadly I'm on this idea too, sorry Cam, but you lost me with all this evidence,* if* it's true, you may as well be Sandford, scamming a friend of years


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## sevenstringj (Apr 10, 2010)

MegaDTSX said:


> Hi guys, don't mind me. I'm just here for the gay anal.





Sorry dude, but I think it's safe to say your'e fucked. (pun intended)

I mean, c'mon. This guy is your _internet_ friend!?!?!?!?!? There are a bunch of cool dudes I've "met" on teh internets, but you can be damned sure that if one of them ever fucked me over I'd have ZERO problem coming down on his ass. And that does NOT mean bitching about it on teh internets. It means filing a dispute with Paypal, with the credit card company, and getting the cops on his ass if necessary.

Internet friends. Those two words don't belong next to each other.


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## Zahs (Apr 10, 2010)

I have read this all... and all I can say is that Justice is Balance. His attitude and irresponsibility towards you and your girlfriend is unexceptable. It just causes extra stress and problems on you two. Just see what the police can do, because a crime no matter how big or small is still a crime. Hopefully you guys can get something out of this.


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## Zahs (Apr 10, 2010)

sevenstringj said:


> I mean, c'mon. This guy is your _internet_ friend!?!?!?!?!? There are a bunch of cool dudes I've "met" on teh internets



^ This, there is always a risk of dealing with people on the interwebs, some people don't show their real colours.



sevenstringj said:


> Internet friends. Those two words don't belong next to each other.



 This also is a very true statement...


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## Deathbringer769 (Apr 10, 2010)

Trust me, Cam is failing big time on this deal. Taking advantage of friends, dishonesty, etc.. Having a high post count means nothing in regards to his moral character.


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## OrsusMetal (Apr 10, 2010)

It's shitty to know that there are people out there that are willing to give up years of friendship, trust as well as their reputation for $600. I don't think he's going to get all that far in life if he treats people like this. 

I hope everything works out for you both and your bank is able to help get your money back.


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## CloudAC (Apr 10, 2010)

Wow thats shit, get the police on his ass!


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## El Caco (Apr 10, 2010)

Does anyone know if MegaDTSX is Cameron? I gave him one day for the comment, now I'm just confused.


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## scaryari (Apr 10, 2010)

yeah CloudAC, the police isn't really where I want to go. I want to try and solve this without the law. I talked to my bank and hopefully we can have this all figured out without going to court, having lawyers, etc.


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## BlindingLight7 (Apr 10, 2010)

This is rather depressing, I hope you guys get it sorted out. Cam doesn't seem like the guy to do this but apparently I've been deceived as well.


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## MorbidTravis (Apr 10, 2010)

TBCH, im pretty pissed. after reading this all i figured maybe he doesnt have internet or hasnt made it to SC yet. And then i looked at his personal myspace. his status is something like "good to be in SC" on march 27th, last login april 6th. wtffffffff


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## paintkilz (Apr 10, 2010)

do you have someone willing to track this tool down?

are you able to get the cops involved? get his address, then call the cops and say you saw him smoking meth with kids and give them the address...thatll figure things out!


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 10, 2010)

paintkilz said:


> do you have someone willing to track this tool down?
> 
> are you able to get the cops involved? get his address, then call the cops and say you saw him smoking meth with kids and give them the address...thatll figure things out!



It's not worth stooping down to his pathetic level. Don't lie, deceive, or do anything too brash as that will quickly erode your credibility, which in a situation like this is worth it's proverbial weight in gold. 

Like I said before, get in touch with PayPal and your Credit Card Company/Bank, try as hard as you can to get your money back. 

If that doesn't work, speak to a lawyer, most civil lawyers will offer free consultations, and see what your chances are as far as a civil case. 

Also, contact both your local police, as well as the police where Cameron is in SC. Let them know that he essentially stole the property that you payed for. Present them with ALL the evidence you have.


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## Evil7 (Apr 10, 2010)

paintkilz said:


> do you have someone willing to track this tool down?
> 
> are you able to get the cops involved? get his address, then call the cops and say you saw him smoking meth with kids and give them the address...thatll figure things out!


 No need to add a huge lie. 
That would be a douchbag move. You should't try to add dumb false drama into the already bad situation.
Giving flase information to an officer is also a crime.

Edit.. Max you beat me to it!


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## MorbidTravis (Apr 11, 2010)

well, what paypal will do(i was frauded and its considered family fraud since my house number was on my profile[wtf?]) is evetually hand it to a collections agency, after a while of not paying(you guys will be paid and nothing to be worried about) they will put it against him in his credit, so his credit score will go down. fucking him over.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Problem with payoal is we avoided fees with gift. As far as they are concerned we are screwed. My Gdansk contacted her bank and they deactivated her card for 10 days. Her bank is in California 500 miles awaway. Not only is she screwed 600 bucks, she can't have access to any money for 10 days. Thanks Cameron.


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## MorbidTravis (Apr 11, 2010)

well he scammed over $200, he can go to jail!


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## dhalif (Apr 11, 2010)

????hmm


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## djpharoah (Apr 11, 2010)

*Like every thread of this premise can we keep the threats of physical harm to none otherwise you'll be taking a nap - especially the dude above me who has just joined the forum with 5 posts.*


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## dhalif (Apr 11, 2010)

i have to disagree with this.. along the years i have met many good friends, nick, ari, mindcrime, necro, these are just some of them. i can trust my life in their hands man. ive known mindcrime since? i was 14? or 15 when i was still in high school .. 
but of course u still have to be wary of the people around you. its not a case of internet friends when even your real life friend shitz u over. u know what i mean. 

Nick and Ari are super nice people but an a-hole like cam comes along and dont respect that fact at all. I've known cam for years, hes always lying about shiz. like almost 80 - 90% hit when i heard about the agreed "exchange". So his word doesnt weigh to me at all fullstop. i dont give a shiz if you come to me in future cam being girly and say "awww u put me down on the forum" .
the fact is you trip on the nick and ari's friendship, i would gladly take a military knife and kill ours. f you sir 



sevenstringj said:


> Sorry dude, but I think it's safe to say your'e fucked. (pun intended)
> 
> I mean, c'mon. This guy is your _internet_ friend!?!?!?!?!? There are a bunch of cool dudes I've "met" on teh internets, but you can be damned sure that if one of them ever fucked me over I'd have ZERO problem coming down on his ass. And that does NOT mean bitching about it on teh internets. It means filing a dispute with Paypal, with the credit card company, and getting the cops on his ass if necessary.
> 
> Internet friends. Those two words don't belong next to each other.


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## Hollowway (Apr 11, 2010)

Man, that sucks! I feel for you on that. Someone mentioned on here during the last scam that we should consider using someone's shop (like Zim or someone) as an escrow center, where the money is held until the guitar arrives. We might have to go to that.


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## scaryari (Apr 11, 2010)

Yeah, it seems to be like a life lesson for me. 
If he needed money so desperately, I should have sent 30 bucks for shipping. Then he would get the message that no guitar=no money.

I just want it all to go away.


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## djpharoah (Apr 11, 2010)

Wait - he was an internet friend or an actual face-to-face friend?


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Im just speechless at this point. I'm so flustered at the fact we may have to get the law involved in what was suppose to be such an easy deal between a fucking friend..

Thanks for all the support guys. Glad to see someone's batting for the right team.

Hope for the best. I'm still pissed my GF has no fucking money for 10 days in attempt to resolve this bullcrap. This is not only wrong on a moral level but is now a matter of personal security and finance. I am NOT happy guy right now.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 11, 2010)

Hollowway said:


> Man, that sucks! I feel for you on that. Someone mentioned on here during the last scam that we should consider using someone's shop (like Zim or someone) as an escrow center, where the money is held until the guitar arrives. We might have to go to that.



Or we can all just be adults, do our homework, and educate ourselves fully. I've NEVER been screwed over online, and I've been quite the gear whore in the past. If you plan on giving someone money, or sending them an item in trade, you HAVE TO protect yourself. 

Look at the recent scammers, these aren't criminal mater minds, these are folks with very little legitimate references (iTrader, eBay, other forums, etc.), that in all honesty, in hindsight I'm sure many of those scammed wouldn't have gone for. If it looks like a rock, smells like a rock, it's probably a rock.

Ducky, Ari, this is *not* aimed at you in the least.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

I fully understand where you're coming from. 

This could have been avoided. Our hearts got the best of us, we didn't want to see him on the streets again.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> I fully understand where you're coming from.
> 
> This could have been avoided. Our hearts got the best of us, we didn't want to see him on the streets again.



And that's truly commendable. 

A far better reason to make a deal, then for the bonanza that many of the others which are scammed fall for.


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## TemjinStrife (Apr 11, 2010)

Dick move. I hung out with him once, seemed like a nice kid. This is fucking sad and disappointing.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

I've never really dealt with the law in this manner. What should I do? Call his local PD and have them guide me through it?

If anyone can offer me advice on how to civilly handle this, please feel free to PM me.
ANY and ALL help is appreciated guys. Again, thanks a lot for the help thus far.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

I would have never in my right mind been okay with letting my girlfriend put her self in this position with anyone she wasn't comfortable with, or someone who wasn't as close a friend he seemed to be. So I understand what you're saying man. Saddest part for me is she was ok with it, and I gave the go ahead on the whole deal.

I honestly knew cam was a dirtbag, but I really thought it was more of a front than anything else. Just kind of a false coverup because he had nothing else going for him. I truly didn't think he was so low to completely screw TWO of his good friends. I just realized something else. I pay for that chat room server EVERY month, $25 bucks out of my pocket out of the kindness of my heart. It's worth it to me when the friends around me have a welcoming place to come in and jam on any instrument they may have, or just to shoot the shit with everybody. He came in that chat room day in and day out being a little prick to everybody, acting all tough over the internet and bullying new people that would join. Always with his stupid sob stories about how HE did something dumb and it was somehow the other persons fault. Not to mention he was doped up half the time. Just kills me I pay for such a room for cool ass people to chill and he was one who would lounge in there all damn day while he refused to do anything positive. 

Is that wrong of me to being saying all that? At this point I could really care less if I make him a public display of wrong doings, though I do not want any of this to discredit anything I have stated. This thread was a place for me to get the word out so as to avoid this happening to anyone else and somewhere for all you guys to offer me any input you can.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> I've never really dealt with the law in this manner. What should I do? Call his local PD and have them guide me through it?
> 
> If anyone can offer me advice on how to civilly handle this, please feel free to PM me.
> ANY and ALL help is appreciated guys. Again, thanks a lot for the help thus far.



Gather up all the info you have (e-mails, forum posts, Facebook updates, Camfrog sessions, etc.) and contact both your local police, who can help guide you through what you need to do, and after that contact the police over by Cameron. 

You need to prove the following:
1) Cameron promised to give you the guitar for $600. (Forum posts and E-mails)
2) You payed Cameron the $600, and he received it. (Your PayPal and Debit statements will prove this.
3) Cameron is knowingly keeping the instrument from you. 

Be calm, and always have a proper answer when you speak to the police. Remember, in a situation like this, your credibility is paramount. 

Also, find out some info on Cameron. Tell them his full name, where he lived before, and where in SC he's living now, as well as when he moved. 

The more info (which is backed up by evidence) you can give them, the faster and smoother this process will be.


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## Metal Ken (Apr 11, 2010)

Not to get emotionally invovled here, but: Sue his ass out from under him.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Metal Ken said:


> Not to get emotionally invovled here, but: Sue his ass out from under him.




How? Like I said I have no experience with the law.


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## Metal Ken (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> How? Like I said I have no experience with the law.



Hire a lawyer, have lawyer file civil/small cases claim. Sue for money, damages, emotional distress & legal fees. Sure, he cant pay it now, but he'll have his wages garnished and his credit ruined.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Well, tons of evidence has been gathered. 30-40 pages worth.

Tons of Things placing him in SC on specific dates, after the money was sent. Pages placing him in Vermont days before the money was sent.

I Have cold hard proof the money was sent to cameron barton, from the original paypal deal. The paypal invoice states the money was successfully sent with a side note one the sent money stating "money for pawn for cameron barton white ibanez rg7620"

I have proof of him being completely active online after ariving in SC...Facebook,myspace, youtube etc. All the while not keeping any contact with us. 
Also, him personally stating he had arrived in SC on specific dates a week after the money was sent. 

I then found the gold. 






Him flat out carrying a one on one conversation with Arianna about "pawning" the guitar for money and confirmation he recieved that money. Not to mention paypal can verify this.

On top of all that I have all the fine little details placing him here and there. him confirming yes in fact he had the guitar after he moved and after he had the money. Him Stating he would send the guitar on wednesday the 7th when he got paid.

I've got the original FS thread where he says he made a deal with a friend.

I've got tons of pictures placing that guitar in his hands. All the dates he was active last on various sites, WELL after the deal was done. Printouts of every conversation he had publically with people , carrying out conversations about random things, showing his obvious "I could give a shit" about dealing with this attitude. I've got his status updates where he would say "I'm in SC fokrz" followed by arianna posting on those status's asking when he was shipping the guitar. After these post, he continued to post many other updates and/or conversations with everyone BUT us.

There is tons tons more That I have, all highlighted with some sort of dialogue explaining the specific events. Roughly 40 pages worth. All that in itself should and hopefully will be more than enough to convince Arianna's bank that she deserves her money back. Seeing as she is a client of there's, and they could care less about Cameron, I see positive things happening. 

Excuse my lack of spelling/grammer in all of the above. I'm super tired and going really fast in this message. I have no energy to make it right. lol


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

who edited my tags? lol

"online kid drama"


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## Metal Ken (Apr 11, 2010)

Wait.

Paypal. Dude, just file a paypal claim. 

Assuming they side with the buyer (You) which they usually do, they'll give you back the money charge his bank back the 600$ to get their cut. Try it. WHats the worst that can happen? You did this less than a month ago, you're totally covered.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

I don't think I can
We Did the paypal with the gift option, not good or services.
Basically it's our word against his. 

We filed a claim with her bank because we didnt use existing money on her paypal balance, rather used paypal to send the money, but paypal took the money directly from her bank account as they are linked.


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## Metal Ken (Apr 11, 2010)

ah, okay. i always do it as goods and services, regardless of what it is.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Yea, we were not aware of that fee being the buffer is something happened.

Like I said, with the evidence I will be supplying the bank as soon as they send us the claims forms, I'm confident things will make progress.


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## sevenstringj (Apr 11, 2010)

So he's looking to raise the funds to pay back your gf and keep his guitar. Though if I were him and I knew you were stroking your ego at my expense on teh internets, I wouldn't be so eager to send you the guitar or pay you back either.


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## BlindingLight7 (Apr 11, 2010)

Cam, If your on here lurking..reading this, SEND HIM THE GUITAR. 

If he is screwed up with drugs I wouldn't be surprised if he used the cash to get a fix, when you get screwed with drugs you'll fuck over anyone to get cash for the high, It's depressing.


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## Fzau (Apr 11, 2010)

Metal Ken said:


> Hire a lawyer, have lawyer file civil/small cases claim. Sue for money, damages, emotional distress & legal fees. Sure, he cant pay it now, but he'll have his wages garnished and his credit ruined.


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## 7slinger (Apr 11, 2010)

Metal Ken said:


> Hire a lawyer, have lawyer file civil/small cases claim. Sue for money, damages, emotional distress & legal fees. Sure, he cant pay it now, but he'll have his wages garnished and his credit ruined.



problem with this is, in principle one side loses one side wins, in reality both sides lose...one side gets credit score ruined, other side gets lawyer and court fees to basically decimate any "winnings"


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

sevenstringj said:


> So he's looking to raise the funds to pay back your gf and keep his guitar. Though if I were him and I knew you were stroking your ego at my expense on teh internets, I wouldn't be so eager to send you the guitar or pay you back either.



Excuse me? I have said many times i made this thread to inform you all and to gain advice. Therefore I have presented all the evidence. This isnt some kind of bash on cam, although its not like this isn't his fault. And no he isnt raising money to pay her back. He meant he was raising money to BUY his guitar back, which he still has.
And for the sake of my ego? Get real man. The fact I'm not the low SOB screwing a friend is enough for my "Ego". Trust me, it doesnt require telling the truth about cam to feel better about myself. I'm not the bad guy here. Don't make excuses for him. He should send that guitar regardless of what is said here. It's just the truth, afterall.


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## MJS (Apr 11, 2010)

7slinger said:


> problem with this is, in principle one side loses one side wins, in reality both sides lose...one side gets credit score ruined, other side gets lawyer and court fees to basically decimate any "winnings"



You sue for the legal fees too, so it basically works out that the loser gets stuck paying them. You could even try to find a lawyer that won't charge unless he wins, but I'm not sure how easy that would be with such a small amount.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

Trust me it wont get to that point. It's not worth the time, stress and money.


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## Hollowway (Apr 11, 2010)

You can always look into small claims court. No lawyers are permitted, so no fees there. It's pretty much designed for small amounts of money.


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## metal_tones (Apr 11, 2010)

Hollowway said:


> You can always look into small claims court. No lawyers are permitted, so no fees there. It's pretty much designed for small amounts of money.


This option may work out best.
I would gather ALL your info on the incident, print them out, (ALWAYS keep copies of these), and go to the police. They may not get involved with this stuff?? I'm not sure. (ask them what the best type of action may be.) If that's the case, you may need a lawyer. If you do need a lawyer, ask him/her for some advice and offer a bit of cash for their help, which they may charge you anyways. (Never know when you might need them again.) Maybe even have them write you a nice little letter that can be sent to this dude directly from the lawyer, stating that you'll see him in court, if he doesn't comply. (get a copy of that letter as well, for your records.) Maybe once he sees/thinks that you guys hired a lawyer , he may just return the guitar or give you the cash.
GOOD LUCK!!!


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## Hollowman (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> Excuse me? I have said many times i made this thread to inform you all and to gain advice. Therefore I have presented all the evidence. This isnt some kind of bash on cam, although its not like this isn't his fault. And no he isnt raising money to pay her back. He meant he was raising money to BUY his guitar back, which he still has.
> And for the sake of my ego? Get real man. The fact I'm not the low SOB screwing a friend is enough for my "Ego". Trust me, it doesnt require telling the truth about cam to feel better about myself. I'm not the bad guy here. Don't make excuses for him. He should send that guitar regardless of what is said here. It's just the truth, afterall.



I can tell you by reading this entire thread thats what it became a bashing  and it's sad. let me ask you a question? have you ever moved to another state by yourself ? do you know how much it costs? trust me when I say that $600 isn't much in that category, when my wife and I moved to Maine from Delaware 940 miles. it cost us $17300 that was for gas $360, rent + security deposit $950, food and groceries $300 and tolls $120 and thats not including utilities. thats why I said maybe give him the benefit of the doubt as for him being on the net does he have a cell phone that has web access? some phones will only let you have Facebook and other user apps, try getting on here, it's a lost cause on a phone.In hindsight, You say he was a friend? He was an internet friend Honestly ,You met him on here it's not like you actually knew him. I am sorry this happened to you and your girlfriend for trying to be nice and help someone out and I hope it gets resolved for you and her since $600 dollars is alot of money.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 11, 2010)

Hollowman666 said:


> I can tell you by reading this entire thread thats what it became a bashing  and it's sad. let me ask you a question? have you ever moved to another state by yourself ? do you know how much it costs? trust me when I say that $600 isn't much in that category, when my wife and I moved to Maine from Delaware 940 miles. it cost us $17300 that was for gas $360, rent + security deposit $950, food and groceries $300 and tolls $120 and thats not including utilities. thats why I said maybe give him the benefit of the doubt as for him being on the net does he have a cell phone that has web access? some phones will only let you have Facebook and other user apps, try getting on here, it's a lost cause on a phone.In hindsight, You say he was a friend? He was an internet friend Honestly ,You met him on here it's not like you actually knew him. I am sorry this happened to you and your girlfriend for trying to be nice and help someone out and I hope it gets resolved for you and her since $600 dollars is alot of money.



Ducky (or his GF by proxy) paid $600 for a guitar. Cameron did not send them the guitar, and is essentially refusing to talk to them. It's as simple as that. 

Fuck benefit of the doubt. My "benefit of the doubt" limit is about two weeks. It's been a little over three weeks, as they paid on the 20th of March. 

I've moved cross country before, and I'm gearing to do it again in a couple months. I've never had to screw over a friend to do it. I moved from Fort Lauderdale, Florida to Peoria, Arizona which was about 2370 miles. I spent close to $5000 to do so. Does that give me the right to break deals, and not pay my dues? Could I have told my cell phone provider that I was a month late on paying the bill because I was moving? Could I have told the bank that I pay my car payment to the same? 

Also, last time I checked nearly every public library in the US has free internet access.

The only thing I could perceive as "bashing" is calling Cam out on some of the very shady things he has done, which, to be honest, seem to be true which takes them from being "bashing" to them being truthful. There's a big difference there.


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## 7 Strings of Hate (Apr 11, 2010)

Hollowman666 said:


> I can tell you by reading this entire thread thats what it became a bashing  and it's sad. let me ask you a question? have you ever moved to another state by yourself ? do you know how much it costs? trust me when I say that $600 isn't much in that category, when my wife and I moved to Maine from Delaware 940 miles. it cost us $17300 that was for gas $360, rent + security deposit $950, food and groceries $300 and tolls $120 and thats not including utilities. thats why I said maybe give him the benefit of the doubt as for him being on the net does he have a cell phone that has web access? some phones will only let you have Facebook and other user apps, try getting on here, it's a lost cause on a phone.In hindsight, You say he was a friend? He was an internet friend Honestly ,You met him on here it's not like you actually knew him. I am sorry this happened to you and your girlfriend for trying to be nice and help someone out and I hope it gets resolved for you and her since $600 dollars is alot of money.



Yea dude, thats alot of boohooin for someone who was clearly a douche to ducky


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## Hollowman (Apr 11, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Ducky (or his GF by proxy) paid $600 for a guitar. Cameron did not send them the guitar, and is essentially refusing to talk to them. It's as simple as that.
> 
> Fuck benefit of the doubt. My "benefit of the doubt" limit is about two weeks. It's been a little over three weeks, as they paid on the 20th of March.
> 
> ...



Oh.. No not at all. he should have had the courtesy to contact them someway. as for the bashing it's not necessarily them like i said, I'm sorry this happened to them since they were trying to help someone out, but that is the chance you take when dealing with anybody on the web whether it be Ebay on craigslist or here in the classifieds. I bought a guitar on here my purple 207, did I take a chance, yes. did I know him, no. They should file a claim with PayPal and get their money back then not deal with him ever again.


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## Spaced Out Ace (Apr 11, 2010)

sevenstringj said:


> So he's looking to raise the funds to pay back your gf and keep his guitar. Though if I were him and I knew you were stroking your ego at my expense on teh internets, I wouldn't be so eager to send you the guitar or pay you back either.


 
'cept... that doesn't seem like it was apart of the deal. And that last statement has to be the most absurd crap I've ever read. Just wow.


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## Hollowman (Apr 11, 2010)

7 Strings of Hate said:


> Yea dude, thats alot of boohooin for someone who was clearly a douche to ducky



Quite honestly do I care? No, because I wouldn't have done it the guitar wasn't worth that much. it is a shame that they got screwed.


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## MaxOfMetal (Apr 11, 2010)

sevenstringj said:


> So he's looking to raise the funds to pay back your gf and keep his guitar. Though if I were him and I knew you were stroking your ego at my expense on teh internets, I wouldn't be so eager to send you the guitar or pay you back either.



Him saying that he'll eventually send it out, coupled with the fact he's avoiding talking to Ducky, and has been misleading them the whole time points to him trying to raise funds to send the guitar/pay them back? 

While, it may not be something Cam wants to hear, or to be aired out in public, he made that decision. Him being butt hurt about any of this has absolutely NOTHING to do with the situation. That's like not paying your car payment because the letter they sent you about your late fees was not as nice as you'd like. Yeah, you can be sore, and hold out on the payment, but in the end you're either forking out the dough or getting your shit repossessed.


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Him saying that he'll eventually send it out, coupled with the fact he's avoiding talking to Ducky, and has been misleading them the whole time points to him trying to raise funds to send the guitar/pay them back?
> 
> While, it may not be something Cam wants to hear, or to be aired out in public, he made that decision. Him being butt hurt about any of this has absolutely NOTHING to do with the situation. That's like not paying your car payment because the letter they sent you about your late fees was not as nice as you'd like. Yeah, you can be sore, and hold out on the payment, but in the end you're either forking out the dough or getting your shit repossessed.




Thank you, very much. Like Max said, it's very simple. Cam received the money for rent and he instead decided to use every last dime on moving. He told me he was already short on rent in the new place in SC and couldn't pay the guy upfront. Boo fucking Hoo, thats his goddamn problem. He should have set aside the $30 freaking to ship the guitar FIRST. Not put it at the bottom of his list of shit to do while he takes care of his own BS. A deal is a deal, and he did not uphold to his end. SIMPLE. 

If any of this offends cam at all, i'm sorry. As someone said, me stroking my ego in the internet wouldn't make him so eager to ship it, well what makes you think I'm eager to give him the benefit of the doubt after he's been screwing me in circles for almost a month? I gave him the benefit of the doubt when I waited 10 days of him ignoring me to finally call him out. Or when I refuse to contact his local PD, giving him even more time to come through. He's lucky I gave him THIS long before going public or getting the fucking law involved. Not to mention he got a free ride with our money to a new city because he got himself kicked out? Let me remind you he was originally kicked out of his moms, then moved with "friends" and got kicked out there not but 2-3 weeks later? I see a pattern, don't you? Plain and simple if it wasn't for us he'd be back on the damn streets. I'd say he got more than the benefit of the doubt when we stepped in to help after every single other person said eff off.


Ok, I'm done for tonight..I've ranted enough.

OP's please excuse me here, I know I'm way out of line right now (purposely making this post a direct bash on cam) but I've about had it with his BS and people actually sticking up for him. Honestly people. HE'S THE BAD GUY HERE.

ok.. 

EDIT: He had a stable job a few months back at Duncun Donuts, you know, a steady income?? Guess what he does, he QUITS because his hours got cut a little and his boss was telling him what to do. I guess no hours is better than some?? And oh gosh, your boss telling you what to do?! BLASPHEMY! You tell me this is hard times or whatever but he is his own problem in that he can't afford rent and needs to screw others to get by.


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## Konfyouzd (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> A deal is a deal, and he did not uphold to his end. SIMPLE.







/thread


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## wannabguitarist (Apr 11, 2010)

Duckykong said:


> EDIT: He had a stable job a few months back at Duncun Donuts, you know, a steady income?? Guess what he does, he QUITS because his hours got cut a little and his boss was telling him what to do. I guess no hours is better than some?? And oh gosh, your boss telling you what to do?! BLASPHEMY! You tell me this is hard times or whatever but he is his own problem in that he can't afford rent and needs to screw others to get by.





Had to get that out of my system


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## Duckykong (Apr 11, 2010)

wannabguitarist said:


> Had to get that out of my system



@ him or me?

haha


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## HighGain510 (Apr 11, 2010)

If you couldn't tell based on threads like this:

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/97099-youtube-jealousy-hatred-rant.html

that the kid (despite his age, I stand by calling him kid as he seems majorly immature for his age ) is a douchebag, I don't know what to tell ya!  Sorry to hear your girlfriend is out the cash, but to get it back you either need to continue to follow up with her CC company and file that he you paid for goods and they were never delivered OR figure out what town he moved to and file with his local police department. If you're going to pussyfoot around the issue, you absolutely (IMO) lose the right to continue crying over the lost funds in this thread. Several people have given you and your girl the right advice but by saying you don't want to get the police involved yet you're soooo mad that he just scammed you out of your money, what's the point? 

Also, knowing that he quit his job at Dunkin' Donuts rofl and the reasons behind it (again, childish much?! ), why the hell would your girlfriend lend him the cash expecting him to do anything but take the money and disappear?  Again, I feel bad that she's getting scammed here but now that it's happened you guys are taking such a passive approach to get the money back at this point that I don't see why you're spending all the energy of fighting with people in this thread when you could be spending it towards getting her money back.


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## lateralus819 (Apr 11, 2010)

HighGain510 said:


> If you couldn't tell based on threads like this:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/97099-youtube-jealousy-hatred-rant.html
> 
> ...



x10, just call the police, do what you gotta do, get it over with so you can relax over it bro. You guys are very nice people, shame it happened to you.


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## Metal Ken (Apr 11, 2010)

The problem with the police is that the crime took place over state boundaries for one, and since the crime occurred in a state that he no longer lived in, the fastest, most effective method would be a civil or small claims suit.


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## scaryari (Apr 12, 2010)

I understand that the people who are saying negative things about the girlfriend (me) are also saying positive things. So thanks to everyone who shows interest in me losing my money. 
But I (repeat) I haven't said one nasty thing to put Cam down in this thread to publicly humiliate him. 
I think he's a low-life fucking DOUCHEBAG and I regret making this mistake. I said it's a life lesson. I want it to go away. 

Questioning my intelligence and common sense is in no way necessary when I was trying to help a friend out and stupidly thought I could trust him to follow up on the transaction. I get that. 

The only thing I'm bitter about is that I'm down 600 bucks, have no access to my funds in my checking account unless I drive 40 miles north to my nearest bank, and that I stressed so much about an idiot. 

If you guys HAVEN'T read, I HAVE contacted my bank. We HAVE printed out information. We ARE prepared to fill out the forms. But if all of that proof isn't enough and the bank can't get my money back, I'm not pursuing it anymore. This drama is NOT worth it to me.


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## MJS (Apr 12, 2010)

HighGain510 said:


> If you couldn't tell based on threads like this:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/97099-youtube-jealousy-hatred-rant.html
> 
> that the kid (despite his age, I stand by calling him kid as he seems majorly immature for his age ) is a douchebag, I don't know what to tell ya!



haha... I remember that thread. I doubt I'm the only one that read it, then went straight to Youtube and gave all of his videos 1 star. 

It's funny that he thinks giving a video 1 star on Youtube makes someone a horrible person, but he doesn't seem to have any moral issues with stealing $600.


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## ittoa666 (Apr 12, 2010)

MJS said:


> haha... I remember that thread. I doubt I'm the only one that read it, then went straight to Youtube and gave all of his videos 1 star.
> 
> It's funny that he thinks giving a video 1 star on Youtube makes someone a horrible person, but he doesn't seem to have any moral issues with stealing $600.





Just watched his old videos. He looks like he's 13. Hope you get some compensation for this bullshit.


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## Duckykong (Apr 12, 2010)

HighGain510 said:


> If you couldn't tell based on threads like this:
> 
> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/off-topic/97099-youtube-jealousy-hatred-rant.html
> 
> ...



Thanks for your concerns but heres the deal. We have both done everything possible thus far to get the money back WITHOUT the law being involved. This is because by my gf has expressed a few things, one she is not poor, two she is very young, three she has more moral character than cam will EVER have. She and I will do anything possible, without the law, to get this worked out. It simply isn't worth all the BS, stress, time, and possible investing more money just to have a financial victory. Being the good people we are is a victory far greater than anything money can provide. 

We have contacted paypal and since we regretfully did the "gift" option to avoid fee's they have no legal obligation to any of this. Basically it was a big fuck you and good luck from paypal.

Her bank has cancelled her card and filed the claim. The paper work is on it's way. When it gets here I will include all the evidence I have collected online and printed. We will go from there. If nothing happens then we will move on and know who was the real winner here.

" If you're going to pussyfoot around the issue, you absolutely (IMO) lose the right to continue crying over the lost funds in this thread."
In response to this all I have to say is am I really not allowed to be pissed of about this? Sure, keep saying its out fault for doing the deal. Yes, it was a stupid move to begin with. The fact is we did it and he screwed us. Me retaining how I feel isn't going to fix that. I'm going to express how I really feel about this regardless of whats happening. HE brought this on himself.

"you guys are taking such a passive approach to get the money back at this point that I don't see why you're spending all the energy of fighting with people in this thread when you could be spending it towards getting her money back. "
Who are you to assume we aren't doing both? We have done everything up to this point without the law to get this resolved. I have enough energy to deal with getting the money back AND rant about this whole deal. 

"Several people have given you and your girl the right advice but by saying you don't want to get the police involved yet you're soooo mad that he just scammed you out of your money, what's the point? "
Just because we are making the decision not to get involved with the police doesn't mean we can't be upset by this. We have every right to be completely pissed about this. Yeah we would rather take the loss and get passed it than to get involved with the law, more money and stress. This doesn't change how he has offended us in such a low form.


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## Duckykong (Apr 12, 2010)

Well, cam has caused enough tension.
Time for some good ole moosik to fix the EMOshunz


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## Evil7 (Apr 12, 2010)

^ thats the happiest little ditty ever  nice


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## PlagueX1 (Apr 12, 2010)

Yeah, I've pretty much stayed neutral on this as I do with all things haha, but Cam if you read this send the damn guitar already.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Apr 12, 2010)

Really, you don't have many options. As Cameron obviously isn't inclined to give you the money or the guitar, you have 3 options: Go to the police (you don't want to), take him to small claims court (you don't want to), or suck it up and eat the loss.

Really though, those are your only 3 options and no matter what you do, that isn't going to change unless he has a change of heart (which I doubt).


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## djpharoah (Apr 12, 2010)

*Agreed with JJ. This topic is closed for now since it seems no matter what people are suggesting the OP doesn't want to go to the cops leaving him the only option of forgetting about the money and just moving on. You can't have "We want our money back ...but don't want to go to the cops" situation as it just doesn't work.

This thread is also digressing into obliqueness and it doesn't seem like it's helping. Cant have it both ways, you either force him to give money back by going to the cops since he's not willingly going to give you the money, or you suck it up and move on. *


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