# 7 Reasons Why Men Cheat



## Randy (Jan 23, 2013)

> *1. They're Avoiding Intimacy *
> "Some men cheat to avoid any real intimacy. Intimacy scares them, so they distance themselves from their wife or girlfriend by cheating on her," says psychiatrist Gail Saltz, MD. This way they never have to fully rely on someone else, so they can't get hurt. Yeah, it makes sense in their minds&#8230;
> 
> *2. They Crave Intimacy *
> ...



7 Reasons Why Men Cheat | Love + Sex - Yahoo! Shine

Posting this as food for thought.

I had a LONG conversation with Mr Violence about this subject the other day. I'm a little disappointed by the level of victimhood that seems to be culturally cast on women in relationships. This implication that "Every man you'll ever be with *will* cheat on you"

My personal experience, of all the relationships I've been in, I had one incident where I cheated (which I'm obviously not proud of). However, in several of my relationships (including the one mentioned previous), I've been cheated on multiple times. Among a sampling of guys I've talked to, this isn't uncommon. Likewise, I've been privy to a lot of conversations among women about how they fool around. 

Is there a cultural double standard? Thoughts?


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## AxeHappy (Jan 23, 2013)

There absolutely is a cultural double standard. That and most of the, "Mainstream," experts haven't caught up with the times. Women cheat at least as much as men in relationships. Women are MORE likely to physically abuse a man in a relationship, etc, etc. 

The list goes on and on, but you still hear about how men are evil and women are victims. It's a vicious ingrained sexism. And it's sexist against both men and women equally.


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## flexkill (Jan 23, 2013)

I was married for close to 15 years....Fuck marriage and all that go's with it. I'm sorry I know i'm jaded but seriously....DON'T DO IT!


EDIT: If you feel she is the one....fine... she can be the one without a stupid piece of paper that the state acknowledges as "the one".


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## skeels (Jan 23, 2013)

Haha! You tell 'em Flex!

Seriously though, look at all the caveats on that list- "this is a cop out", "lame excuse" and so forth. It's like this list isn't even about anything at all. It is shadowed by the big list that self-victimizing "poor little" attitude cultivates.

1. Girls good
2. Men bad

Even if we were to come to a more accurate survey of the situation, such as...

1. Men are stupid
2. Women are crazy

I would be stupid to bring it up to a woman, knowing that she would go crazy over it. 

Which is why I would stick to a more concrete, easily qualifiable list such as.. 

1. People are fucked.


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## Rick (Jan 23, 2013)

Who the hell is "Mr Violence?"


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## Randy (Jan 23, 2013)

Rick said:


> Who the hell is "Mr Violence?"



Sevenstring.org - View Profile: Mr Violence

Good friend of mine, offline. Super smart dude.


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## Pooluke41 (Jan 23, 2013)

Rick said:


> Who the hell is "Mr Violence?"



It's what Randy calls his penis.


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## Jason_Clement (Jan 23, 2013)

flexkill said:


> If you feel she is the one....fine... she can be the one without a stupid piece of paper that the state acknowledges as "the one".



This. Ohmahgod. This x 400%. If only every one else realized this.


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## Yo_Wattup (Jan 23, 2013)

flexkill said:


> EDIT: If you feel she is the one....fine... she can be the one without a stupid piece of paper that the state acknowledges as "the one".



That's exactly what I said to my girlfriend. What are we trying to prove by being legally together? Why does marriage even exist? If you love someone and they love you and you both know it, why is marriage necessary?

Fuck da police


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## BlackMastodon (Jan 23, 2013)

Yo_Wattup said:


> That's exactly what I said to my girlfriend. What are we trying to prove by being legally together? Why does marriage even exist? If you love someone and they love you and you both know it, why is marriage necessary?
> 
> Fuck da police


The way I see marriage is that it's a really old timey practice (similar to how I feel about most things in the bible) that basically just says you can have sex with this person and make kids, but you gotta take care of those damn kids and not just fuck everything that moves.

I agree, though, I really don't think marriage is necessary. If she wants it, fine. If not, double fine.

But you should have the reception one way or the other 'cause those are fun as hell.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Jan 23, 2013)

They forgot...


#8: dat ass


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## Belleal (Jan 23, 2013)

Men cheat same reason women cheat--boredom. Long term relationships built from adolescent dreamscapes become boring as both, men and women, learn a little more about their desires.

Whole thing reminds me of a Metallica song-- 
metallica - fuel (official video) - YouTube


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## ZEBOV (Jan 23, 2013)

flexkill said:


> If you feel she is the one....fine... she can be the one without a stupid piece of paper that the state acknowledges as "the one".





Jason_Clement said:


> This. Ohmahgod. This x 400%. If only every one else realized this.





Yo_Wattup said:


> That's exactly what I said to my girlfriend. What are we trying to prove by being legally together? Why does marriage even exist? If you love someone and they love you and you both know it, why is marriage necessary?



Now I know I'm not alone with this opinion. However, I have never personally met anyone who has this same opinion. I live in Misissippi, soon to be in Tennessee. People around here just think there is something wrong with the way I think.


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## Church2224 (Jan 23, 2013)

flexkill said:


> I was married for close to 15 years....Fuck marriage and all that go's with it. I'm sorry I know i'm jaded but seriously....DON'T DO IT!
> 
> 
> EDIT: If you feel she is the one....fine... she can be the one without a stupid piece of paper that the state acknowledges as "the one".



Eh, now I feel depressed because I want to get married...

I will say this, my father's first marriage ended because his wife cheated on him multiple times, not the other way around. Women cheat as much as men do. There certainly is a double standard in society.


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## troyguitar (Jan 23, 2013)

I always thought that women cheat more, is that not a commonly held assumption?


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## ZEBOV (Jan 23, 2013)

Church2224 said:


> Eh, now I feel depressed because I want to get married...
> 
> I will say this, my father's first marriage ended because his wife cheated on him multiple times, not the other way around. Women cheat as much as men do. There certainly is a double standard in society.



I'd have to say MORE than men do. And more often than not, they're "Christian" and don't want sex until marriage. And then they go blow another guy.
I haven't been cheated on since I started dating un-religious potheads.


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## GuitaristOfHell (Jan 23, 2013)

My ex cheated on me with 5 guys. I neighbor texted me picture proof too. Personally, I could never cheat I see it as just wrong. Plus, if she finds out you did she's going to tell all her friends, who will tell other friends and it will spread. You don't want to be known as a cheater because you'll have no luck with any relationship. I love the current woman I am with and I'm certain it will stay that way.


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## pink freud (Jan 23, 2013)

Yo_Wattup said:


> That's exactly what I said to my girlfriend. What are we trying to prove by being legally together? Why does marriage even exist? If you love someone and they love you and you both know it, why is marriage necessary?
> 
> Fuck da police



Be legally together means you get all the legal benefits of being legally together. Tautological, but true.


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## flexkill (Jan 23, 2013)

pink freud said:


> Be legally together means you get all the legal benefits of being legally together. Tautological, but true.



Was wondering how long this post was gonna take to surface. This should have no bearing on marriage dude. If you are getting hitched for financial benefits....yeah...you are fucked.


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## wespaul (Jan 23, 2013)

Every single woman I've ever been in a relationship with has cheated.

EVERY

SINGLE

ONE

It got to the point that in the early stages of a relationship, I'd put it out there --if you ever want to fuck anybody else, and for _any reason_, just have the god damn courtesy to call me up and say "hey, I'm not feeling us anymore, no big deal." They'd all agree that it would be the right thing to do, and some have even went as far as to say they actually respect me (lol) for putting that out there.

And it's not even the bad girls, either. Sure, there's the ones that went south because of drugs, alcohol, other various substance abuses, daddy issues, bad self esteem, etc...but it's the ones that are genuinely kind, caring, (seemingly) honest, good people that throw your ass for a loop.

tl;dr - women are _never_ to be trusted


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## JPhoenix19 (Jan 23, 2013)

ZEBOV said:


> Now I know I'm not alone with this opinion. However, I have never personally met anyone who has this same opinion... People around here just think there is something wrong with the way I think.



Hmmmm, I wonder why?



ZEBOV said:


> I live in Misissippi, soon to be in Tennessee.



Oh, that's why.  I've been in the south for several years- it just comes with being in/near the bible belt. 

I'd like to think I'm fairly sensible on the issue. I do tend to lean the other way here. It seems to me that despite the things marriage was in the past (a union of more than just persons. Land, finances, and property were exchanged and matrimony was like a business merger in many cultures), marriage in America nowadays is about accountability. It's a tangible, written testament to your commitment to each other that you agree to be held legally accountable for- I don't see a problem with that. Do I think you _need_ to get married? Certainly not! I'm frankly disgusted at how marriage seems to be treated as a glorified version of dating- no emphasis on commitment. To me, marriage represents a commitment to place the relationship above everything else- to make sure there is mutual joy and happiness that is not self-seeking.

Maybe I'll get flamed for that, since it's a fairly traditional/conservative viewpoint, but it's what I believe and it's a value ingrained deep within me.




wespaul said:


> Every single woman I've ever been in a relationship with has cheated.
> 
> EVERY
> 
> ...



I hope I don't come across as condescending, but that is a sad position to be in- believing that. I really hope you can meet someone who can be trusted.

There's so many factors to consider in relationships like maturity, background, age, goals, and values- how can you ever get it all figured out? God, if I were single I'd have a hard time- it seems like many of the women around me play by the sort of rules you're pointing out. There are women who can generally be trusted, though. Look at it this way- we all make mistakes and we all are in the process of maturing relationally- who then can be trusted?


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## flexkill (Jan 23, 2013)

JPhoenix19 said:


> Hmmmm, I wonder why?



Just wondering....do you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ?


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## sage (Jan 23, 2013)

Title of the article in the OP should read, "7 Reasons People Cheat." Each and every one of those applies to women also. There is a total double standard. Women are every bit as bad as men in any one of those 7 categories. There are a couple more that should be on there.

8. Spite.
Some bitches (male and female bitches) like to get back at a motherfucker (male and female motherfuckers) by sleeping around on them. I don't know what the fuck is wrong with all you bitches. Just dump a motherfucker for their transgressions. Which leads us to reason number 9.

9. As a break up method.
OK, this is definitely not a particularly mature way of dealing with issues, but it does have its own sense of finality. No matter how many times you try to dump your partner, it just doesn't stick? Fuck his/her best friend and leave the condom where it's gonna be found. Works every time. If you are a chickenshit motherfucker (male or female motherfuckers).

I'm a faithful sort of dude. I will happily dump a broad instead of cheating on her and expect likewise treatment. But chivalry is dead. Just try not to get infected and then infect your partner.


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## wespaul (Jan 23, 2013)

JPhoenix19 said:


> I hope I don't come across as condescending, but that is a sad position to be in- believing that. I really hope you can meet someone who can be trusted.
> 
> There's so many factors to consider in relationships like maturity, background, age, goals, and values- how can you ever get it all figured out? God, if I were single I'd have a hard time- it seems like many of the women around me play by the sort of rules you're pointing out. There are women who can generally be trusted, though. Look at it this way- we all make mistakes and we all are in the process of maturing relationally- who then can be trusted?



My post was tongue-in-cheek with a small spice of seriousness. Everything I said was true regarding all of my relationships, though. I don't know if it's just a generational thing, or maybe it's the water where I live, but I've yet to find somebody who is faithful. 

But you're right, people do make mistakes. I'm not a forgiving person, unfortunately. There are no second chances with me after it goes down. I tried the second chance deal exactly one time to never consider it again. Maybe that's a character flaw in myself, who knows? I really do envy couples who have been together for a long time, and have a genuine trust with one another. That must be so amazing (and I'm not saying this sarcastically).


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## renzoip (Jan 23, 2013)

I have a suspicion that my last 2 exes might have cheated on me. But as soon as they started acting weird and evasive, and giving me crappy excuses, I ended the relationships; I never really got a chance to find out. At the time I felt that if things were already not working out, then I would just end it all before going through the pain/anger of trying to catch her cheating on me. I haven't seen either of them or spoken to them or anyone they know in many years, so I'll probably never know. Honestly, at this point in my life, I find it irrelevant. I'm happy with my current relationship. I guess some things are better left unknown. 

To the OP: I think women cheat just as much as men do. Not sure about why, but I think they reasons are probably not too different from those of men. I'm not sure if there is a double standard in society for the expectations for infidelity. If there is, then there shouldn't be one. I'm yet to see any compelling data or argument to believe that one gender will be more likely to cheat than the other.And if a girl is going to presume I'm likely to cheat on her because I'm a guy, then she is definitely not the one for me.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Jan 23, 2013)

Now taking bets on how long before Groph drops a bomb on this thread.


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## JPhoenix19 (Jan 23, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Just wondering....do you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ?



Yes. To be more specific, I'm coming from a Protestant Christian religious tradition.

Back on topic: I've always considered it more of a hassle to cheat. I imagine all the drama that would ensue and figure it's not worth the trouble. One complicated relationship is enough for me.


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## TRENCHLORD (Jan 23, 2013)

Well here's 4 good reasons.


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## SP1N3SPL1TT3R (Jan 23, 2013)

It's cause of how the male brain is "wired." Ancient humans had a social structure, similar to all other social mammalians, such as lions and wolves. Men were atop the hierarchy and 1 male had multiple females, for several reasons. The times have changed, but the human brain hasn't. IMO, it's the reason why men act on primal urges.


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## McKay (Jan 23, 2013)

SP1N3SPL1TT3R said:


> It's cause of how the male brain is "wired." Ancient humans had a social structure, similar to all other social mammalians, such as lions and wolves. Men were atop the hierarchy and 1 male had multiple females, for several reasons. The times have changed, but the human brain hasn't. IMO, it's the reason why men act on primal urges.



Obsolete thinking that incorrectly paints men as bastions of infidelity when evidence points to _at least_ a parity between the sexes.

Women are hyperagamous and men are polyagamous, or at least the primitive parts of the brain are. To assume that women exclusively are drawn to monogamy because of their biological imperatives is ridiculous and there are good arguments rooted in evolutionary psychology and modern empirical evidence to suggest that there is no greater instinctive drive to monogamy in women than men.


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## neurosis (Jan 24, 2013)

wespaul said:


> It got to the point that in the early stages of a relationship, I'd put it out there --if you ever want to fuck anybody else, and for _any reason_, just have the god damn courtesy to call me up and say "hey, I'm not feeling us anymore, no big deal." They'd all agree that it would be the right thing to do, and some have even went as far as to say they actually respect me (lol) for putting that out there.



I used to say this and I had it said to me as well. Most of my friends live by this, too. Commited relationships and cheating... bad karma. Once something like that goes out of balance it has to be put back into perspective, hence why so many people cheat after they have been cheated on.

But you made a great point here. In any kind of relationship between two people, communication is key. There is too much stuff left unsaid for many reasons depending on each person. I went nuts from girl to girl trying to find somebody with the actual balls to go through live with a straight face. No bullshit. I finally found her and well... we are married, hahahahahahah


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## AngstRiddenDreams (Jan 24, 2013)

This thread is seriously making me fucking paranoid.


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## pink freud (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Was wondering how long this post was gonna take to surface. This should have no bearing on marriage dude. If you are getting hitched for financial benefits....yeah...you are fucked.



Really? You think providing my spouse with continued pension benefits after my death so she can more easily support herself in her later years isn't important? Easier dealing with issues over power of attorney? Marriage benefits aren't just for you, they are for BOTH of you.

Not that I follow the practice, but I do know enough about it to be able to state your views on marriage are very ethnocentric, given that arranged marriage still exists. Entire cultures view marriage beyond the scope of two people loving each other, who are you to say they are "fucked"?


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## Adrian-XI (Jan 24, 2013)

I'm getting married in 9 days. This thread burns lol I might as well have just ordered an Invictus.


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## Varcolac (Jan 24, 2013)

Replace the word "men" in the article with "shitty people of any gender," and we've got a much more accurate study.

It's a bit stupidly essentialist to say "MEN CHEAT. MEN BAD. MEN ALL BAD" - just as stupid as saying "Women are crazy" or "Lesbians like mint chocolate chip ice cream."* We're all products of inheritance and environment - that's true for everyone. You can only make the broadest of assumptions about people if you divide them into groups as broad as these, and these "insights" are nowhere near broad enough to apply to all men.



*I mean who fucking doesn't like mint choc chip? Heathens, that's who.


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## Pooluke41 (Jan 24, 2013)

Two words: Tony Soprano.






thug fo lyf


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

I wonder how many of the guys that get cheated on are good lovers and attractive enough for their partners...


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## avenger (Jan 24, 2013)

pink freud said:


> Be legally together means you get all the legal benefits of being legally together. Tautological, but true.


Doesnt being common law give you the same benefit without the 20k wedding?



m3l-mrq3z said:


> I wonder how many of the guys that get cheated on are good lovers and attractive enough for their partners...


Can't tell if you are trolling, a virgin, or 15?



Possibly all three.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

JPhoenix19 said:


> Yes. To be more specific, I'm coming from a Protestant Christian religious tradition.


Thought so.



pink freud said:


> Really? You think providing my spouse with continued pension benefits after my death so she can more easily support herself in her later years isn't important? Easier dealing with issues over power of attorney? Marriage benefits aren't just for you, they are for BOTH of you.
> 
> Not that I follow the practice, but I do know enough about it to be able to state your views on marriage are very ethnocentric, given that arranged marriage still exists. Entire cultures view marriage beyond the scope of two people loving each other, who are you to say they are "fucked"?



Well for your sake I hope your marriage lasts. The statistics are against you though in every way.... that's a fact. If/when you get divorced...you will wish you had never been married because now the state decides your future not you, where as if you had only been "together" both parties could agree to disagree and walk away. Every fucking thing you ever worked for can be taken from you and you have to sit back and watch it all happen. Call me Ethnocentric if you want....I want you to bookmark this thread my friend... I think you might relate to my views in the future


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## SD83 (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> I wonder how many of the guys that get cheated on are good lovers and attractive enough for their partners...


Why would that be relevant at all?  "If men cheat, they are assholes, if men are cheated on, they are bad lovers & ugly?"
Honestly, finding out I was being cheated on would be the only reason I can think of when I might actually beat a girl/woman. To me, there is no reason for cheating. Everything that one might list as a "reason" would be a reason to end the relation, everything else just seems stupid and despicable to me. 
+1 on those who don't believe there is any major difference between men and women when it comes to cheating.
@avenger:
No, it doesn't, at least not as far as I know (in Germany, that is). You still get advantages from being legally married if it comes to taxes, making decisions for each other of one is no longer able to make decisions etc.


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

avenger said:


> Can't tell if you are trolling, a virgin, or 15?
> Possibly all three.



Why?


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> Why?



Because that's silly nonsense.


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Because that's silly nonsense.



Why?


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> Why?



For you to even wonder such a thing leads me to believe that you might think that these are legitimate reason to cheat. Like the woman who gets caught cheating and says "I needed more attention than he was giving me" bullshit. That's no license/excuse for your partner to go fuck the free world. Get a fucking dildo lady!


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> For you to even wonder such a thing leads me to believe that you might think that these are legitimate reason to cheat. Like the woman who gets caught cheating and says "I needed more attention than he was giving me" bullshit. That's no license/excuse for your partner to go fuck the free world. Get a fucking dildo lady!



How about re-reading my post? I never said that being bad in bed or being ugly was the only reason why some men get cheated on. Judging from what I've read on women's forums and the like, it does seem to make them "curious".


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## pink freud (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Thought so.
> 
> 
> 
> Well for your sake I hope your marriage lasts. The statistics are against you though in every way.... that's a fact. If/when you get divorced...you will wish you had never been married because now the state decides your future not you, where as if you had only been "together" both parties could agree to disagree and walk away. Every fucking thing you ever worked for can be taken from you and you have to sit back and watch it all happen. Call me Ethnocentric if you want....I want you to bookmark this thread my friend... I think you might relate to my views in the future



I'm not married, all references to spouses are hypothetical.

As for post-marriage impact, that's why prenups exist.

If people went about marriage a bit more responsibly (wedding within reasonable cost, prenups etc.) and treated it more like it IS in the modern age, a contract between two people, there would be a lot less strife involved.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

pink freud said:


> I'm not married, all references to spouses are hypothetical.
> 
> As for post-marriage impact, that's why prenups exist.
> 
> If people went about marriage a bit more responsibly (wedding within reasonable cost, prenups etc.) and treated it more like it IS in the modern age, a contract between two people, there would be a lot less strife involved.



So you have never been married? HA! Oooook then. You have no idea. I wish the best to all who are married or getting married. I really do, I just don't believe in it....and I have close to 15 years experience on the subject. Not all of the years where bad....but when it go's south, it go's south quick.


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## pink freud (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> So you have never been married? HA! Oooook then. You have no idea. I wish the best to all who are married or getting married. I really do, I just don't believe in it....and I have close to 15 years experience on the subject. Not all of the years where bad....but when it go's south, it go's south quick.



Being married isn't a requirement for this discussion. It literally provides no insight into why a prenup is a good idea, why a financially responsible wedding is a good idea or why marriage is fundamentally different than simply being together in our society.

Marriage is a contract, people should treat it like such.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

pink freud said:


> Marriage is a contract, people should treat it like such.


Yeah because, nothing says I love you the most like a "Contract".....

EDIT: I can see it now....... "Honey, you know I love you more than anything in the world right? This is why we are getting married right? Just a few quick things before we do this though. I will need you to sign a prenup for when this marriage eventually fails you can't have any of my shit. Also you need to understand that this marriage is a contract...and needs to be treated as such."



Buahahahahaha, good luck Bro.


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## Grand Moff Tim (Jan 24, 2013)

TRENCHLORD said:


> Well here's 4 good reasons.


 

Lolololol, fuckin' Topanga.

I'd nail that chick to the goddamned ceiling.


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## pink freud (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Yeah because, nothing says I love you the most like a "Contract".....
> 
> EDIT: I can see it now....... "Honey, you know I love you more than anything in the world right? This is why we are getting married right? Just a few quick things before we do this though. I will need you to sign a prenup for when this marriage eventually fails you can't have any of my shit. Also you need to understand that this marriage is a contract...and needs to be treated as such."
> 
> ...




You can have a love based relationship without marriage. As an Atheist, the ONLY reason for me to get married is for contractual purposes. All of the non-contractual stuff can be had without. As others have said, love can exist without the whole marriage thing. You can raise a family, the whole shebang. But if you want the legal benefits, you need the legal contract. And if you want to protect yourself from future strife should the marriage fail, you need to take steps to do so.


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## r3tr0sp3ct1v3 (Jan 24, 2013)

If I was married or in a relationship for that matter, I wouldn't cheat. 

But i'm also the type who puts all his chips on one hand.


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## Randy (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> How about re-reading my post? I never said that being bad in bed or being ugly was the only reason why some men get cheated on. Judging from what I've read on women's forums and the like, it does seem to make them "curious".



That's all relative, you realize.

I can tell you as a matter of fact that, when I cheated, I definitely "traded down". Likewise, not giving myself too much credit, but I was also cheated on by girls who "traded down". One girl cheated with a guy with two kids, on welfare and living in HUD housing, the other cheated on me with a 300lbs.+ bald guy with two kids. Not saying I'm Don Juan but enough people on here know me well enough offline to know I'm better than that. 

So, with all due respect, fuck you.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

Randy said:


> That's all relative, you realize.
> 
> I can tell you as a matter of fact that, when I cheated, I definitely "traded down". Likewise, not giving myself too much credit, but I was also cheated on by girls who "traded down". One girl cheated with a guy with two kids, on welfare and living in HUD housing, the other cheated on me with a 300lbs.+ bald guy with two kids. Not saying I'm Don Juan but enough people on here know me well enough offline to know I'm better than that.
> 
> So, with all due respect, fuck you.



BAM!


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

Randy said:


> That's all relative, you realize.
> 
> I can tell you as a matter of fact that, when I cheated, I definitely "traded down". Likewise, not giving myself too much credit, but I was also cheated on by girls who "traded down". *One girl cheated with a guy with two kids, on welfare and living in HUD housing, the other cheated on me with a 300lbs.+ bald guy with two kids*. Not saying I'm Don Juan but enough people on here know me well enough offline to know I'm better than that.
> 
> So, with all due respect, fuck you.



Damn.


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## -42- (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> Judging from what I've read on women's forums


Have you tried talking to them?


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 24, 2013)

I never tried asking a woman "so, how would you justify cheating on your partner" or "in which situations would you cheat?" or "what made you cheat your last partner?"


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## Randy (Jan 24, 2013)

I wasn't much better. The ex I cheated on was ~100lbs, attractive, good job, etc. and the girl I cheated with was overweight, unemployed, etc. Cheating, as far as I've experienced it, is done out of desperation. In my case, I was depressed and we'd already grown distant... I went for what was right infront of me since the girl was a friend of mine.

In the case of the girls I was cheated on by, I can only hypothesize, but I don't doubt it was a similar scenario. 

Another thing that happens commonly (and probably factored into my cheating as well) is, when you're with someone long enough, you question if you're actually still attractive to your sex of preference or if you're both just "settling". Once again, "trading up" isn't necessarily a factor there. Not sure how "normal" it is but at least for myself, after I'm with a girl for a while, she becomes my standard for "attractive" and my brain can no longer distinguish her on the "1 to 10" scale like guys commonly do. When I've felt desperate enough to cheat or at least look, my eye usually gravitated toward something "different"... better or worse wasn't much a factor at all.


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## Randy (Jan 24, 2013)

Anyway, that's all besides the point.

I certainly don't want to be cheated on but actually not the "be all, end all" for me, TBH. I mean, devastating when it happens and certainly an implication something's wrong but I'm desensitized enough that I know there's a lot of deep and not-so-deep reasons it happens. These days when it happens, I don't really get mad just say "welp, guess this isn't for me" and move on with my life.

The original point of posting this article is in discussing the culture of "victimhood", IMO. I've had a few different times (between friends and personal experiences) that relationships have fallen apart with equal responsibility for both involved and it ultimately turned into a pity party for the girl in the relationship. 

I'd be curious to hear your take on why things sway that way? 


EDIT: Or taking gender out of the equation completely... When a relationship is falling apart, why is it more or less offensive when X does something than when Y does the same?


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## soliloquy (Jan 24, 2013)

its scary how common it has gotten for people to cheat, let them be male or female
i know a few women that are the 'other women' in that love triangle, and they have no problem being there.

likewise, there are other women that have trust issues for that very reason.

but i do agree, women cheat just as much as men. however, i find that maybe women cheat more in the sense that men, when they cheat, go for physical cheating. women might do that, but they also might just have an emotional affair where nothing physical happens. 

not that its related, but if you take bullying as an example - when men bully each other, its usually physical abuse. when women bully women, its mental abuse which can leave more internal scars that might lead to long term effect. 

however, in most cases, people cheat because something isn't right in that relationship, thus they both are victims yet society fails to point finger on both of them, and just that one person who cheated initially.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

soliloquy said:


> however, in most cases, people cheat because something isn't right in that relationship, thus they both are victims yet society fails to point finger on both of them, and just that one person who cheated initially.


Yeah, but why when men cheat they are no good lying dogs and when a woman cheats the man must have not been attending to his wife the correct way?

I know this is not always the view....but it happens a lot!


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## pink freud (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Yeah, but why when men cheat they are no good lying dogs and when a woman cheats the man must have not been attending to his wife the correct way?
> 
> I know this is not always the view....but it happens a lot!



Same reason that husbands/fathers in sitcoms are generally bumbling idiots and the wives always know better. Society has a bit of a white knight syndrome.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

pink freud said:


> Same reason that husbands/fathers in sitcoms are generally bumbling idiots and the wives always know better. Society has a bit of a white knight syndrome.


I agree. I was just thinking someone could post/explain it better than me....guess it is just that simple.


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## AxeHappy (Jan 24, 2013)

Randy said:


> The original point of posting this article is in discussing the culture of "victimhood", IMO. I've had a few different times (between friends and personal experiences) that relationships have fallen apart with equal responsibility for both involved and it ultimately turned into a pity party for the girl in the relationship.




I was at one point in a really...really abusive relationship. I mean...like in every possible way I was being abused. It rather fucked me up quite a bit. 

Thanks to a very special person I finally managed to break free. And when I kicked the psycho bitch out I ended up being the bad guy. Lost a lot of mutual friends and all kinds of brutal shit. 

It was fucking ridiculous.


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## flexkill (Jan 24, 2013)

AxeHappy said:


> I was at one point in a really...really abusive relationship. I mean...like in every possible way I was being abused. It rather fucked me up quite a bit.
> 
> Thanks to a very special person I finally managed to break free. And when I kicked the psycho bitch out I ended up being the bad guy. Lost a lot of mutual friends and all kinds of brutal shit.
> 
> It was fucking ridiculous.



Sounds like my Divorce....go figure.


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## soliloquy (Jan 24, 2013)

flexkill said:


> Yeah, but why when men cheat they are no good lying dogs and when a woman cheats the man must have not been attending to his wife the correct way?
> 
> I know this is not always the view....but it happens a lot!



i agree with you.

i think its a bit of a confusion that society is dealing with. society as know it, has had/has a VERY long history of patriarchy; where men can do no wrong. 

however, the confused notion MIGHT come from the rise of feminism. i'm not bad mouthing feminism as i'm a feminist myself. however, there are people who misunderstand what feminism is about and say 'fuck anything that has a penis, women should rule everything' and abuse what feminism tried to preach. 

so on one hand, the old patriarchal views persist and are going strong. on the other hand, they exist in a weak state as people abused what feminism was trying to say (which was equality for all, fuck gender stereotypes. we all do good and bad things regardless of if we are men or women).


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## flint757 (Jan 24, 2013)

In every instance I was cheated on and every instance that I was aware of another person cheating on someone else it was because they were insecure and unable to tell the pursuer no. They liked the attention and effort as it made them feel special since low self esteem and insecure kind of go hand-in-hand. 

That was semi mentioned in the list, but in a very sexist manner that didn't tackle the root of the "They just can't say no" logic.


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## Valserp (Jan 24, 2013)

Women are much much more probable to cheat, because, let's face it - an average looking woman will get more "opportunities" presented to them in a week, than a "hot" guy would in half a year.

Now, the reason why most of them grab on to that opportunity at some point is because - once us men settle into a relationship we tend to wind down, get boring and generally trust that we will have that "vag hole" whenever we need it. Emotional spikes dwindle and turn into flats and that's when your girl can get swept off her feet by any half-baked charmer.
On a further note - once you've been together for a long time and there's no baby - the reproduction instincts kick in and go "Oh oh... something's wrong between these two... we'd better keep our eyes open for other seed carriers/incubators!"

Now on the note of MEN cheating - Why I Left My Fat Wife « Chateau Heartiste
Best read ever!


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## tacotiklah (Jan 24, 2013)

The amount of sexism here on both sides is literally melting my brain. Brb, getting a lobotomy...


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## wespaul (Jan 24, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> I wonder how many of the guys that get cheated on are good lovers and attractive enough for their partners...



Why would you even wonder something like that?


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## Philligan (Jan 24, 2013)

I thought some of those sounded kinda dumb. Especially #2. So you're too sensitive and want more emotional intimacy, so the solution is to have sex with someone else? I could be totally thinking about this the wrong way, but I think that's either incredibly unrealistic, or it means your SO is a stone-cold asshole 

I heard an interesting theory once as to why guys cheat/flirt/etc. They said that guys are programmed to try and spread their genes and populate the earth, like all other animals - you see it as a competition where the strongest survive, so you've gotta spread your seed. Apparently, when you're with one person for a while, you stop feeling like you're a biological force to be reckoned with and start getting into the seek & impregnate mode again. Not that it excuses anything, but it's pretty interesting to think about. And boobs.

Personally, I know more girls that have fooled around than guys. IMHO, guys seem more likely to abruptly end the relationship for no apparent reason, whereas girls have seemed more likely to stay in the relationship but cheat.

EDIT: Partial ninja by Valserp. I didn't read all three pages


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## Mexi (Jan 24, 2013)

I cheated on my first girl friend wayyyy back in the day because: 1. I was a dumbshit teenager and 2. I was afraid that she'd find someone "better" so my insecurities got the best of me I suppose. We had grown distant by then (I think as a teenager, once the honeymoon period ends, you feel like the relationship itself has grown stale) and we ended up breaking up. I never really had the balls to tell her why I cheated until a few years back when we got together for some drinks and reminiscing over our old lives.
She understood where I was coming from, in fact, she said she would have done it if I hadn't at the time, not that it didn't hurt at the time, but she at least _understood_ why.
So I'm not proud of it, but situations like those tell you a lot about yourself, the reasons you get into relationships, what you're looking for in a relationship and, most importantly, the kind of value you put on someone else's feelings of dignity and self-worth.


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## Splinterhead (Jan 24, 2013)

I've been married for a long time. Guess what. Marriage is work.
I've been up, down did the looptyloop and corkscrew on this journey of marriage and its been really good, and really bad. When entering into this lifetime contract you have to be able to say to yourself that you will do most anything to make it work. You have to sacrifice, so does she. You have to compromise, so does she. You want to have kids? Dude that's a whole other level. Now both of you are responsible for a life so now the pressure is really on. Marriage is like guitar, the more you put into it, the more you get out of it. 

That said I'm no where near the perfect husband/father, no where near. All we can do is our best. If the relationship isn't salvageable get out with grace and always take the high road. If you have a kid it is essential that you be there for them no matter what. /dadrant


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## Nile (Jan 24, 2013)

The one true thing that I can gather from all this is this:

"Everybody should trust nobody."

Literally what I'm gathering here and from my experience. And girls cheat more, come on, no way can guys cheat this much. Not being a biased dickwad, its honestly what i see, hear and experience.


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## tacotiklah (Jan 25, 2013)

People keep saying women cheat more. Nah, but since the majority of you are straight males, you're BOUND to see more women cheat because I doubt any of you date men. It's just what you see, but what you see and what the truth is are two different things. The truth is that men and women both cheat. A LOT. It really makes me wonder what half-baked person decided that monogamy was the only way to live life.


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## incinerated_guitar (Jan 25, 2013)

soliloquy said:


> however, there are people who misunderstand what feminism is about and say 'fuck anything that has a penis, women should rule everything' and abuse what feminism tried to preach.


 
There was actually a book that the womens role in society class at my highschool made the students read called "Why women should rule the world". The title of that book alone gave a pretty good idea of how sexist the class was. LOTS of man bashing in there, and it carried to the students as well. I know of a few guys that took the class, just to be with women and go on the end of the year trip to washington DC and the white house. They couldnt believe how that class hasnt been banned from the school. The teacher was a hardcore-feminist-man-hating-extremist as well. I couldnt stand the lady at all. Felt bad for her husband and kids


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 25, 2013)

Let's not forget the influence of culture and religion. I have had the opportunity to live among very religious people and "cheating" doesn't seem like an option (no, it's not because someone could be murdered). 

I personally believe one's views on marriage and relationships influence the odds of being a cheater.


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## incinerated_guitar (Jan 25, 2013)

Ive got to say, some women are evil as fuck . As soon as I started my current relationship, I had four different girls trying to steal me away (Be jelly, bro ). First one, total typical pshyco bitch cheerleader, constantly telling me she would treat me so much better than my gf, and would throw glitter on me or spray me with her perfume on the days that id go to my gf's band practice. Second one, which just wasnt attractive at all, was her best friend at the time, and she was just blatantly begging for the D...right in front of my girl. She was also kinda after my gf too, but like I said, not attractive enough to make me ask for a little Ménage à trois. Third, cute little country girl, probably desperate because of her bad relationship at the time. She was really sweet though, I admit that even though I was with someone, I had a soft spot for this one. But I had to kinda cut off ties with her before something bad happened. She was constantly saying she wanted to sneak in my room and come crash....and I probably wouldve let her if I didnt just stop texting. And then there was number four. Partier, raver, somewhat of a groupie. This one wanted to just make my girlfriend jealous and leave me. Shed send I love you, or come kidnap me messages randomly on my facebook wall. That kind of shit. I pretty soon just stopped talking to all of them though. Im dating someone for the sake of wanting to be monotonous. Plus, hearing people tell you to leave your gf gets kinda old after a while. I like to think of myself as a stronger man than most after this though, being that I didnt just go for it and plow them. Because I personally know too many people who would've. I'm pretty fucking happy in this relationship now too. I mean, If I wouldve gone for it, I wouldnt be dating a totally awesome girl who plays bass and a pretty decent band (was also a fill in for my band), can drum, sing amazingly, and actually listen to my death metal albums and put up with me constantly talk about gear


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## JPhoenix19 (Jan 25, 2013)

ghstofperdition said:


> People keep saying women cheat more. Nah, but since the majority of you are straight males, you're BOUND to see more women cheat because I doubt any of you date men. It's just what you see, but what you see and what the truth is are two different things. The truth is that men and women both cheat. A LOT. It really makes me wonder what half-baked person decided that monogamy was the only way to live life.



You bring up a good point. I've heard tale of how vicious relationships can he in the gay community, for instance, and I can't help but wonder if such stereotypes are a result of limited observations. I personally choose to look at it as all of humanity being vicious at times, with cultural norms guiding many to believing some watered-down truths about other people, and relationships. Therefore, everyone in a relationship can be tempted to cheat, and some people act on it.


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## troyguitar (Jan 25, 2013)

Valserp said:


> Women are much much more probable to cheat, because, let's face it - an average looking woman will get more "opportunities" presented to them in a week, than a "hot" guy would in half a year.



This is really all there is to it. Men might even be 'worse' than women but since it is so much harder for them to actually accomplish cheating, they end up doing it less.


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## Phrygian (Jan 25, 2013)

I haven't read through all the posts here, but I'd like to add this one to the list.

reason: Attention. 

I have a theory that alot of people cheat because of the need for attention. After living together in a relationship for a while, you slowly stop giving each other the amount of attention you used to, and eventually end up being more like roomies than a couple. the problem here is that we as humans crave attention, especially flirting and compliments. Another might be that getting compliments from that one person gets old and doesn't mean as much as it used to. This is where a person can start to look into attention from others, and when they get it it's kinda lika rush of adrenaline - they know it's wrong because they are in a relationship, but it's exciting to and very refreshing to hear a new person tell you nice things about yourself. It can only go downhill from there and might end up in physical cheating. 

In my opinion you don't have to have sex to be unfaithful, words do just as much damage.


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## flexkill (Jan 25, 2013)

ghstofperdition said:


> It really makes me wonder what half-baked person decided that monogamy was the only way to live life.




You can thank Jesus Christ the all mighty mythical creature again for this one. All hail Zod!


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 25, 2013)

flexkill said:


> You can thank Jesus Christ the all mighty mythical creature again for this one. All hail Zod!



I am not sure about this one, but I think that poligamy was still practiced in the Middle East at that time.


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## flexkill (Jan 25, 2013)

m3l-mrq3z said:


> I am not sure about this one, but I think that poligamy was still practiced in the Middle East at that time.


I think religion is a major reason for marriage. I also think Marriage is fading away....I mean just look at the Divorce rates...and a lot of young people say they have no desire to get married. Used to be a young girls big dream....meet Mr. Right, get married, then pop out little ones.

I also feel that women rights/equality has a lot to do with it(Marriage fading away) as well. They no longer feel they need to have a man take care of them...they can make their own way.


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## m3l-mrq3z (Jan 25, 2013)

flexkill said:


> I think religion is a major reason for marriage. I also think Marriage is fading away....I mean just look at the Divorce rates...and a lot of young people say they have no desire to get married. Used to be a young girls big dream....meet Mr. Right, get married, then pop out little ones.
> 
> I also feel that women rights/equality has a lot to do with it(Marriage fading away) as well. They no longer feel they need to have a man take care of them...they can make their own way.



Religion a major reason for marriage? Where? The problem with this discussion is that most people here are talking about the situation in the US (obviously, since most users live there). Consequently, unfair generalizations are made "MEN are this" "WOMEN are that"...I wish people took the time to differentiate.

Monogamy doesn't work because of the way we are engineered. Most societies worldwide practice poligamy. The West is probably the place where monogamy is enforced most of the time and interestingly enough, the divorce rate in some countries is quite alarming (50% for Germany, 60% for Estonia). That's not very encouraging.

Another thing people should do is do some introspection and find out where they have acquired their ideas and expectations regarding relationships. That ideal you just mentioned is something that's been passed on through generations and intensified by movies, books and the like. It's very unrealistic though, that every person has ONE perfect partner waiting somewhere out there and that as soon as they meet, things will work out wonderfully and they will always be in 7th heaven. Life doesn't work that way.


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## Randy (Jan 25, 2013)

Another issue could be that we're considering polygamy and monogamy as black and white issues. I've definitely checked out, had dreams or passing thoughts about other women before but consciously, I tell myself another women in my life = another headache (personal perception).

Perhaps some people want the love of another, some want the sex of another and some just appreciate the feeling of being wanted? Depending on where your lines are, perhaps you can have monogamy without necessarily being confined? Look at swingers for example.


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## soliloquy (Jan 25, 2013)

Randy said:


> *Another issue could be that we're considering polygamy and monogamy as black and white issues. I've definitely checked out, had dreams or passing thoughts about other women before but consciously, I tell myself another women in my life = another headache (personal perception).*



i dont think 'thought crime' would be considered cheating. if you have dreams of someone, your mind has no control over it. plus, even if you think it, it doesn't necessarily mean you do it. the mind will always wonder the question like 'what if?' and if you wander off with it, then it will do harm. but if you've controlling it, rather than the other way around, then you should be fine.


as for polygamy/monogamy/marriage; i could be wrong, but i believe in the western world, Julius Cesar was the first to force marriage and monogamy. his idea was that he had the right to sleep around with women, while his friends, who were men shouldn't. this gave him freedom while it took that freedom from men. likewise, it took the image of being 'tainted' from women as they are 'only' sleeping around with 2 men (their husband and Cesar). and that was WAY before religion came into play

again, i could be wrong about this...

but yes, the eastern world has had the concept of marriage LONG before religion came into play. however, it was limited to women. men could sleep with other women so long as they were his slaves who were single and without child. 



but for what it's worth, there are a lot of people who live happily in the swingers/cuckolding/open marriage. i know of people where the sex drive of the wife/husband diminishes and he/she lets his partner sleep around for that specific reason as well. 

that idea isn't specifically for me (maybe yet? i'm still young), but if it works for them, who am i to judge them?


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## Randy (Jan 25, 2013)

soliloquy said:


> i dont think 'thought crime' would be considered cheating. if you have dreams of someone, your mind has no control over it. plus, even if you think it, it doesn't necessarily mean you do it. the mind will always wonder the question like 'what if?' and if you wander off with it, then it will do harm. but if you've controlling it, rather than the other way around, then you should be fine.



Right. I should've been clearer.

I was referring to reasons for, or rather, the "seeds" of adultery. We're discussing whether or not monogamy is forced on us; which implies that there's a hardwired inclination toward polygamy. I disagree with that notion. To say "We're forced into being in a relationship with one person which means if we were left to our own devices, we'd carry on intimate relationships with several" is an overstatement. My point was, probably in the majority of cases, being in a monogamous relationship does not preclude you from any feelings toward somebody else that your partner would find offensive ("adultery of thought") but those feelings don't necessarily resolve in wanting sex OR a relationship with other people.

That's what I meant by "grey area". Your explanation of swingers gets into what I'm talking about. In your example, you have people that are inclined to want to have a relationship with somebody (be it for stability, similar interests or even attraction) but having sex with other people out of what could almost be called "necessity".


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## JPhoenix19 (Jan 25, 2013)

Ironically, my wife and I have had discussions about polygomy, and I think her and I both agree that it's not morally wrong- but practically adds to the complications of overpopulation. I personally believe people have the capacity to truely love more than one person at the same time- but it's a murky issue since polygomy was so common in history to keep one's legacy going with such a short lifespan.

Cheating is a moral issue since it is a violation of trust and integrity, polygamy is a practical issue relating to the population.

I'm not sure about things like open marriages and swingers. I personally wouldn't want to get involved with them because the potential for drama increases exponentially with each partner.


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## Randy (Jan 25, 2013)

JPhoenix19 said:


> Ironically, my wife and I have had discussions about polygomy, and I think her and I both agree that it's not morally wrong- but practically adds to the complications of overpopulation. I personally believe people have the capacity to truely love more than one person at the same time- but it's a murky issue since polygomy was so common in history to keep one's legacy going with such a short lifespan.
> 
> Cheating is a moral issue since it is a violation of trust and integrity, polygamy is a practical issue relating to the population.
> 
> I'm not sure about things like open marriages and swingers. I personally wouldn't want to get involved with them because the potential for drama increases exponentially with each partner.



This is a lot of what I mean for my own personal life when I said "I tell myself another women in my life = another headache (personal perception)."

I consider myself reasonably morally conservative not because I look down on anybody's personal choices but, my own experience and observations, indicate that "sex complicates things". Whether it's jealousy, or a 'physical only' relationship that turns emotional, etc. I agree with you completely... wanting to have some kind of feelings for other people while still loving someone else "differently" (or even the same ) isn't a stretch but carrying out seems to be very impractical.


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## SirMyghin (Jan 26, 2013)

^^

Taking care of one woman is already too much work indeed.

Also everyone rep incinerated for saying 'Im dating someone for the sake of wanting to be *monotonous*.' Holy shit I almost died when I read that.


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## groph (Jan 26, 2013)

*sound of incoming bomb*




Well then maybe "cheating" shouldn't be seen as some kind of abhorrent thing if it happens so damn often.

I know that if I were in such a relationship and my partner fucked someone else without my .. I don't want to say "approval" because I don't control anybody but let's say "beyond our terms of agreement" then yeah I'd be hurt as I'd associate the sex with some kind of emotional bond and I'd feel like ours has been cheapened considerably, enough to terminate the relationship. I'd absolutely feel betrayed and that's a pretty typical thing, lots of people think that way so it shouldn't pose a problem in my life. Monogamy is a big thing around here and it's how most people approach and understand the dynamic of relationships.

That's all well and good, but think about how we look down on "open relationships" and polyamory. Yes, people can get jealous and jealousy (intuitively) isn't a good thing in these kinds of relationships. Yet we still tend to understand things like open relationships in terms of monogamous relationships, say if a guy and his girlfriend have a relationship where the girlfriend sleeps with other guys, buddy is "actually" getting duped by a total whore. Maybe everybody is totally cool with it! Of course, a lot of polyamory, at least the stuff that makes it to the news has a lot to do with a man marrying underage girls and there's a degree of coercion but I'm just talking about the concept of not having only one partner at a time here.

And yes, I agree that this list isn't an accurate descriptor of "what men are like" at all. I don't see anything in there that's gender specific and that psychiatrist has probably been taken out of context. The list is about as rigorous as some pop-psych on PsychologyToday or Cosmopolitan. I'd say it's only evidence of the culture it's embedded in as it re-iterates things we "just know" and assume about "men."

That being said, it could be argued that nonmonogamy is a cornerstone of masculinity. There are PLENTY of counterexamples, the "stable" "family man" who is married faithfully is something Western culture seems to adore and value. Still, you've got womanizers all over media, movie stars, etc. and "settling down" means to some degree you've "let" a woman take control of you and rein you in to the bondage that is marriage, it sort of treats male sexuality as that unstoppable force powered by a biological drive to sow wild oats. Remember, "men think with their dicks!" Nonmonogamous guys who rack up a lot of belt notches aren't exactly castigated (women who do this are often vilified) especially today with "hookup culture" being at the forefront of young people's dating lives. Sex is treated with an incredible amount of casualness as if it barely matters at all yet at the same time we still hold monogamy dear to our hearts. So yes, there are mixed messages and contradictions everywhere.

And for fuck's sake, there isn't a feminist cabal going around systematically destroying masculinity and blaming men for everything bad in the world. Read some books. I'd bet real life money that most people who call themselves feminist would rip that list apart and even say that it's harmful to men to imagine men in the sense that the list suggests.


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## Varcolac (Jan 26, 2013)

groph said:


> And for fuck's sake, there isn't a feminist cabal going around systematically destroying masculinity and blaming men for everything bad in the world. Read some books. I'd bet real life money that most people who call themselves feminist would rip that list apart and even say that it's harmful to men to imagine men in the sense that the list suggests.



Count me among that number.

Good point on the "terms of our agreement" thing - my partner and I have what you could call an "open to the possibility" relationship. Not "open" as in "actively sleep with other people," but "open to the possibility" as in "if either of us _really_ wants to get down and dirty with someone else, we will talk about it." 

The only limits anyone poses on a relationship are those they agree to themselves. In my opinion, if two or more consenting adults are serious about giving the old long term relationship thing a try, they should at some point sit down and talk about what those limits are.


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## groph (Jan 26, 2013)

Varcolac said:


> Count me among that number.
> 
> Good point on the "terms of our agreement" thing - my partner and I have what you could call an "open to the possibility" relationship. Not "open" as in "actively sleep with other people," but "open to the possibility" as in "if either of us _really_ wants to get down and dirty with someone else, we will talk about it."
> 
> The only limits anyone poses on a relationship are those they agree to themselves. In my opinion, if two or more consenting adults are serious about giving the old long term relationship thing a try, they should at some point sit down and talk about what those limits are.



Ah, "consenting adults," the great equalizer of controversy


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## Varcolac (Jan 26, 2013)

groph said:


> Ah, "consenting adults," the great equalizer of controversy



I put the "sensual" in "consensual."


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## JosephAOI (Jan 26, 2013)

Alright, I've got a story to throw into the ring of this thread. But first, 



AngstRiddenDreams said:


> This thread is seriously making me fucking paranoid.



You are learning, young padawan. 

Ahem, now:

As most of you know, my last ex and I have been kind of on-again-off-again for quite a few reasons. Plans after high school, her gender identity, both of our wants and needs, etc etc. Well when we broke up back in October, she started dating a girl (LONG-DISTANCE) that she's known for roughly 5 years. This girl views Carlee (My girlfriend) as a male. So, they've been together and all.

Then, Carlee and I meet up to discuss us because I finally realized I was a total fucking idiot for everything and I just wanted her back (I know, call me stupid or what have you, I can't help it). Now, I wasn't 100% sure what to expect but I had a feeling that I would get rejected hard.

However, it ended with me spilling out all of my guts and heart to her (Not doing so having been one of our problems before). Afterwards, we hung out a little more that night and went back to my house and got a little heavy. The next day, we had sex. While she still had a girlfriend. Fuck.

I know that she isn't the type of person to typically cheat or look on it light-heartedly. She was extremely hurt that she had actually done it and mentioned that it was "Only me" that could have made her do it. Like I'm some kind of fucking relationship gold mine or something, fuck, I dunno. But yeah, and she ended up deciding to pretty much be with me unofficially and secretly while she was with her official girlfriend, and remember, they have a long-distance relationship, because her other girlfriend would be coming to visit in a few weeks. Damn. Fuck. Shit. Balls.

So the days went on and it went pretty much like that. She came to visit, I never saw her while she was there but she tells me they didn't do anything but kiss a few times. Not cheating on me cause we weren't in a relationship, but fuck, it still hurt.

After she left, a couple weeks ago, she told her and broke up with her. Now, we aren't technically together yet but we're still kind of a couple. I don't even fucking know, man.

TL;DR/Summary/Analysis:

- I got to experience the "other person" role. It sucked. I knew that I wanted her back and that what I was doing was wrong but my desire to have her outweighed my sense of wrong. Especially since I didn't know the other girl and they had a long-distance relationship. Not that that makes it right by any means.

- From all of this, I think cheating stems from a typical need to feel intimate with someone when you're in a relationship. Unfortunately, sometimes, when that person isn't around. Also, feelings for exes DO NOT go away if the people stay the same.


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## Mr Violence (Feb 5, 2013)

Pooluke41 said:


> It's what Randy calls his penis.



I am Randy's penis.


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## skeels (Feb 5, 2013)




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