# Oakland Axe Factory 10 string



## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 19, 2009)

Finished prototype. 

Features:

Neck thru
Mono wiring but can be switched to stereo easily
Birdseye Maple fretboard and pickup cases
O.A.F. bridge and string retainer
Multiscale 30" to 27.5"
















This is the prototype of the more guitar oriented 10 string that I will be offering soon. The actual 'production' version will feature a rear routed control cavity and different pickups. The 'production' version will also have a maple or bamboo neck with two adjustable truss rods and carbon fiber reinforcement. Fingerboards and body woods will vary based on availability. Proposed upgrade features include piezo pickups, various scale lengths and tunings, different string spacing and a semi hollow/set neck version. Base price as it stands right now is $1250.


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## Fred the Shred (Oct 19, 2009)

It does look quite cool, although the lack of a dedicated bridge pickup does take away some versatily, IMO. Will the production model have one as an option or is this the final layout?


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## troyguitar (Oct 19, 2009)

That is fucking intense! My wrist hurts just looking at it


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## TimSE (Oct 19, 2009)

theres something about that ... that makes me like it :S


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## hufschmid (Oct 19, 2009)

amazing work there!!!!


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## vansinn (Oct 19, 2009)

Very cool prototype! looks like excellent access to top frets - did I count 25?

A coupe of suggestions:
For me, the light maple makes such a wide board 'stand out' too much.
Continuing the upper horn curvation to meet the body may make for a more elegant look.
Same goes with terminating the fretboard in the same angle as the last fret.
And the same with slanted pups (which may or may not be right for your wanted tone).
Something about the headstock doesn't match the body lines..

Which finish for the final bridge and tuners? I think platinum plating should look good..


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## vampiregenocide (Oct 19, 2009)

Whats the tuning?


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## highlordmugfug (Oct 19, 2009)

vampiregenocide said:


> Whats the tuning?


Probably low C# to high A. Just guessing though.


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## Adam (Oct 19, 2009)

highlordmugfug said:


> Probably low C# to high A. Just guessing though.



I only see 3 plain steel strings so unless the G string is corroded I think it just has a G,B, and E. 
Also nice work Tom, didn't know you know how to do multiscale Did you get a chance to check out my finished 11 string?


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## mlp187 (Oct 19, 2009)

Seems really affordable!


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## ledzep4eva (Oct 19, 2009)

mlp187 said:


> Seems really affordable!



Also try Roter for bang-for-buck.


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## Apophis (Oct 19, 2009)

looks nice, but being honest back looks awesome, the right side is not so impressive imo, but as said it's a prototype, so can be improved


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## vansinn (Oct 19, 2009)

ledzep4eva said:


> Lol, try Roter. Better quality too



..not too polite a comment on a cool prototype..


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## Apophis (Oct 19, 2009)

I have to say so also, sorry but to tell that my quality is better you have to try both  said a little to soon


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 19, 2009)

Thank for the positive feedback!! 

To answer a couple of questions

1) Tuned like a bass on the lowest 4 strings, e a d g and the highest 6 are tuned like a guitar e a d g b e. I considered tuning it in straight 4ths but I didn't. I need to get with Garry at www.octave4plus.com to make that happen. 

2) I think that continuing the upper horn into the neck would be sweet. I like single cuts. Same goes for the slanted pickups and terminating the fretboard at the same angle as the last fret. I left the end of the fretboard square becuase of the length of the truss rod. The shorter rod was too short for the scale length so I had to compromise with the squared off fingerboard. The headstock is also a product of functionality over aesthetics. The stock Ernie Ball strings fit just right without a millimeter to spare and the strings needed to be relatively straight to the tuners. With this many tuners you don't have much to work with. The new bridge design that I am working on incorporates tuners at the bridge like on the Box guitars. That way the headstock will be a non issue. 

3) To keep cost down I decided to use standard off the shelf pickups rather than customs. As luck would have it any EMG 6 string bass pickup covers the string spread as long as they aren't slanted with the frets. I have used their bass pickups as guitar pickups with success so that is an option. Another option is to use 4 pickups in an array similar to what I used here and group them as neck and bridge. That may be the best bet as not everyone likes EMG and there are a ton of different rail style humbuckers to cover everything from blues to metal and everything in between. I may have to look into using Dimarzio as a supplier. They have very high quality and consistancy from unit to unit. I have been very disappointed in some other cheaper brands. 

4) The wood selection will always be beautiful to one person and butt ugly to the next. I plan on using pretty standard woods, maple, rosewood, ebony, ash and poplar for the builds. I do have some bamboo that will find it's way into some necks. The maple does really jump out though doesn't it. I bet it would look pretty sweet if the maple was an amber color with a sunburst body. 

5) As far as this being a prototype and regarding the final layout, all of my guitars are hand made and vary in minute detail from one to the next. My tool box consists of cabinet scrapers, grinders with chainsaw discs, bandsaw and lots of sand paper and other hand tools. CNC like repeatability isn't something that I can offer but on the other hand I can incorporate many changes mid build that you can't with a computer. So, that being said, the next one will be very similar in many ways but include the needed changes and updates. 


Hi Adam, I saw your guitar and it is incredible. I can't wait to see it in action. I wouldn't even know where to start on a beast like that. Great job.

I hope Roters are better than my prototype!!!


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## JonnHatch (Oct 19, 2009)

amazing!!!!! I want that exact guitar but mayyybe a lime green finish, rear-routed controls, and Q-tuner pickups. and possibly semi-hollow/chambered body. if you can make that happen, PM me and lemme know when you take deposits


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## TomAwesome (Oct 19, 2009)

Very interesting prototype.  What's going on at the nut? Is that a string retainer and a zero fret?


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## phaeded0ut (Oct 19, 2009)

Gotta say that it was really pretty, Tom! Can't wait to see a few of your finished products being posted as NGD's for folks on this forum.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 19, 2009)

> Very interesting prototype.  What's going on at the nut? Is that a string retainer and a zero fret?


 
You bet. Solid brass string retainer and zero fret. 



> amazing!!!!! I want that exact guitar but mayyybe a lime green finish, rear-routed controls, and Q-tuner pickups. and possibly semi-hollow/chambered body. if you can make that happen, PM me and lemme know when you take deposits


 
Lime green would be super classy.  I love bright colors. Actually I am really thinking about some transparent finishes too. 




> I hope Roters are better than my prototype!!!


 
No, really, I want a Roter someday and I really hope they are better than this prototype!!!


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## TomAwesome (Oct 19, 2009)

Tom Drinkwater said:


> You bet. Solid brass string retainer and zero fret.



Neat! What made you go with that? I've heard of that being done before, but I'm unclear what advantage it offers aside from not having to file or replace the nut to make large changes in string gauges.


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## MaxOfMetal (Oct 19, 2009)

Looks really good man!

With all these really good smaller shops coming out of the wood work, I just may be able to get a custom sooner then I thought.

I can't wait to see how this instrument evolves. I can really appreciate how you're taking to the constructive criticism, shows dedication to bettering your craft.


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## Hollowway (Oct 19, 2009)

This is by far the most beautiful instrument you've made. I've seen your other designs and none of them really resonated with me, but this one is just incredible. Two thumbs up! (er - two horns up?)


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## pink freud (Oct 19, 2009)

Tom Drinkwater said:


> Base price as it stands right now is $1250.


 
My wallet, it hates you.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 19, 2009)

> Neat! What made you go with that? I've heard of that being done before, but I'm unclear what advantage it offers aside from not having to file or replace the nut to make large changes in string gauges.


That is biggest advantage that I know of. The first zero fret instrument I played was a Mobius Megatar and they are supposed to be able to change the string gauges/tunings easily. Then I played a couple of really nice Veillette baritones and then I really loved the zero fret. 



> I can really appreciate how you're taking to the constructive criticism, shows dedication to bettering your craft.


 
I learned early on that after working hard for many hours on a guitar that I wanted it to look good so badly that I could actually ignore some imperfections or design flaws. The only way to get past that is to have someone else look at the guitar. People on these forums rarely hold punches so as long as it is constructive I really like criticism. I am looking forward to seeing how the design evolves as well. 



> This is by far the most beautiful instrument you've made. I've seen your other designs and none of them really resonated with me, but this one is just incredible. Two thumbs up! (er - two horns up?)


 
Thank you. It is a departure from my usual builds. This is the first guitar that I have posted that was 100% my design. Most of the others are customs so they are essentially co-designed by the customer. I bet most people would never guess that I play fingerstyle on a $300 Alvarez classical and sing children songs to my kids based on the guitars that I build.


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## pink freud (Oct 19, 2009)

One thing that concerns me is the lower horn. It looks like it could break fairly easily.


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## yevetz (Oct 19, 2009)

It's FUCKING AEWSOME!!!!!

I just bought a 7 string Ibanez acoustic and I don't have money......WHY!?!?!?!?


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 19, 2009)

> One thing that concerns me is the lower horn. It looks like it could break fairly easily.


 
It's actually a bit beefier than it looks in the pics. 



> I just bought a 7 string Ibanez acoustic and I don't have money......WHY!?!?!?!?


 
What model?


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## Hollowway (Oct 19, 2009)

So Tom, are you telling me that you are taking orders for 10 string guitars with a base of $1250? And then could you pinch me? Seriously, though, I wouldn't have thought I could get such a beautiful, functional instrument for such a reasonable price. 
Now, to weigh in on the way it looks: I'm personally cool with the maple fingerboard, but I think bamboo, if it has the right properties (and I assume you've researched it) would be really, really cool.

I am not a fan of single cuts, and I like the horns on there.

I'm a BIG fan of how much access you gave by making the heel the way you did. 

I've never played a zero fret guitar, but conceptually I can't imaging why everyone doesn't do it. It would seem to give perfect action right off the bat.


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## pink freud (Oct 19, 2009)

Hollowway said:


> I've never played a zero fret guitar, but conceptually I can't imaging why everyone doesn't do it. It would seem to give perfect action right off the bat.



In my opinion it also gives better open note sounds. My Steinberger has one, and it seems to make the sound more consistent going from open to fretted.


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## leftyguitarjoe (Oct 19, 2009)

That is an amazing base price!! Thanks for making an instrument like that more affordable.

I cant wait to see the production version.


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## BigPhi84 (Oct 20, 2009)

I like this prototype.


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## Daggorath (Oct 20, 2009)

Looks nice, would be more use as a touch style instrument than a regular guitar really. The neckjoint/heel looks fucking crazy, and the cutaway is pretty nice, but a little imbalanced aesthetically imo. Price is fair crazy, look forward to hearing reviews of your instruments.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 20, 2009)

> So Tom, are you telling me that you are taking orders for 10 string guitars with a base of $1250? And then could you pinch me? Seriously, though, I wouldn't have thought I could get such a beautiful, functional instrument for such a reasonable price.
> Now, to weigh in on the way it looks: I'm personally cool with the maple fingerboard, but I think bamboo, if it has the right properties (and I assume you've researched it) would be really, really cool.


 
I am not taking orders yet for 10 strings. I have to finish building several custom guitars first and then I plan to make a few 10 strings before I do full on customs. It is pretty hard to make a guitar like this for $1250 and use the best parts and not rush the build. I have used bamboo successfully on guitars before. It is really a great material. When my website was a merchant site bamboo neck blanks were my most popular item. It is stiff and stable and relatively light. 



> In my opinion it also gives better open note sounds. My Steinberger has one, and it seems to make the sound more consistent going from open to fretted.


 
I find this to be true as well.



> That is an amazing base price!! Thanks for making an instrument like that more affordable.
> 
> I cant wait to see the production version.


 
I figure that in this economy $1250 isn't too bad. It's still a lot of money and a guitar is a nonessential item for most of us. I always try to make my guitars a value and not cut corners on quality. 

The production version will be similar but more refined. I still need to work out some details but the prototype was a huge success as far as prototypes go. 



> Looks nice, would be more use as a touch style instrument than a regular guitar really. The neckjoint/heel looks fucking crazy, and the cutaway is pretty nice, but a little imbalanced aesthetically imo. Price is fair crazy, look forward to hearing reviews of your instruments.


 
I think that it will make a good tapper too. It can be easily switched to stereo by moving one pickup lead to the other lug on the stereo jack. Then you'd have a 5 + 5 stereo tapper. 
The heel area is something that I have been working on for about a year and a half. I love neck thru guitars, particularly Carvins, but I wanted to do something a little different. The cutaway is a result of the fret access. When I design a guitar I put in the string path, scale length, bridge placement and pickups and then draw the guitar around that.


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## Hollowway (Oct 20, 2009)

So Tom, not to belabor the point, but at what point do you envision your making 9 and 10 string production models for sale?


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## phaeded0ut (Oct 20, 2009)

Also, will those production models be able to handle being tuned C#, F#, B, E, A, D, G, B, E, A (with the specialized strings)? Would a pair of Q-Tuner BL-6's http://www.q-tuner.com/sizes/BL-6%20dims.pdf work instead of using 4 EMG pickups? 
Have to admit that I'm interested in the idea of a fanned fret instrument.


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## MF_Kitten (Oct 20, 2009)

that's awesome!

if i were getting one, i would make some changes here and there though, but that's just me


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 20, 2009)

> So Tom, not to belabor the point, but at what point do you envision your making 9 and 10 string production models for sale?


Please, belabor away!! I am shooting for January but maybe sooner if I can get through my back log. Ideally I could ship the last custom out by the end of November but that is extremely optimistic. 



> Also, will those production models be able to handle being tuned C#, F#, B, E, A, D, G, B, E, A (with the specialized strings)? Would a pair of Q-Tuner BL-6's http://www.q-tuner.com/sizes/BL-6 dims.pdf work instead of using 4 EMG pickups?
> Have to admit that I'm interested in the idea of a fanned fret instrument.


 
The BL-s would be a tad too narrow. The string spacing at the bridge is 94mm and the widest string spacing a BL-6 can do is 87mm. Even with the strings tapering closer as they go towards the nut it wouldn't work. It is close. That would be perfect for a 9 string with the same string to string spacing. 

Tuning down to C# and up to A with the 04p strings is definitely doable. 



> if i were getting one, i would make some changes here and there though, but that's just me


 
I don't think that I have ever seen a perfect guitar either. There is always something that could be different or better.


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## Scarpie (Oct 20, 2009)

this is a great thread. tom it's amazing work. and your pricing is as well. best of luck to you!!!!


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## yevetz (Oct 20, 2009)

Tom Drinkwater said:


> What model?



AJ307ECENT


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 22, 2009)

Should this thread be in Dealer/Group Buys? Just wondering.


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## Hollowway (Oct 22, 2009)

I don't think this particular thread should, since you can't even buy this particular guitar of yours. But if you don't already have one, post something there - because I wanna order one of these super strat shaped fanned 8,9, or 10s!


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## Erik Hauri (Oct 22, 2009)

Cool axe!  I actually like the headstock - the only change I'd make (besides those already mentioned) would be to enlarge the upper cutaway, it looks a little odd being smaller than the lower cutaway.

How are you dealing with threading the bass strings through those tuner posts? Unwrapping the windings a bit?

I'd also love to see a closeup of your bridge - that's a good piece of work there.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 23, 2009)

Here are some pics of the bridge. I built it specifically for this guitar. It is angled the same as the frets. Each saddle is a brass lock down saddle that is height adjustable and able to be intonated. Each saddle allows for about 5/16" of adjustment and if that isn't enough I drilled and tapped additional holes for the lock down screw so you can move the saddle and screw forward or back to a different position and you can adjust from there. 

I didn't have any issues with the string and tuners at all because I used the Ernie Ball sillohuette bass strings for the 4 lowest strings. The are actually just big guitar strings. These particular tuners didn't need to be drilled. Drilling tuners is super easy though. Usually a 3/32" (.09375") is the biggest that you'll need to drill if you are using an exposed core. The .090 isn't an exposed core but its outer wrap stopped before the tuner. Sometimes all you need to do is unwrap the outer wrap and clip it so the rest of the string goes into the tuner. The octave4plus strings are great as well because you can tell Garry the exact dimensions of the guitar like the distance from ball end to the saddle, the distance from saddle to nut and the distance from nut to tuner. That way the strings are sure to fit. I just got lucky with the Ernie Ball strings. They fit perfectly.


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## JonnHatch (Oct 23, 2009)

my excitement level went up another notch


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## phaeded0ut (Oct 23, 2009)

JonnHatch said:


> my excitement level went up another notch


Same here! 

My only other recommendation is to sink the bridge into the body if possible.



Erik Hauri said:


> Cool axe!  I actually like the headstock - the only change I'd make (besides those already mentioned) would be to enlarge the upper cutaway, it looks a little odd being smaller than the lower cutaway.



Totally agree!


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## vansinn (Oct 23, 2009)

Tom Drinkwater said:


> Here are some pics of the bridge. I built it specifically for this guitar. It is angled the same as the frets. Each saddle is a brass lock down saddle that is height adjustable and able to be intonated. Each saddle allows for about 5/16" of adjustment and if that isn't enough I drilled and tapped additional holes for the lock down screw so you can move the saddle and screw forward or back to a different position and you can adjust from there.



Very interesting design and details, Tom. I'd suggest making the ball-end end-part of the base thicker for implementing recessed balls, and rounding the edges of that part a fair deal more - dunno, but as it is now, it looks like it might painfully interfere with part of the hand when doing heavy parmmuting.

Same seems valid for some of the saddle height adjustment screws, but I guess those can easily be trimmed shorter once the required adjustment range is determined. If so, it looks like a neato slick bridge for parmmuters (like me, hehe) 

I can see why you mentioned a headless version; should be relatively easy to implement on this design.. cool work!


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 23, 2009)

I still haven't finalized the new bridge. I will take all of that into consideration when I make the new ones. Sharp edges aren't good on bridges. 

I have worked out some specs for the guitar in its base model trim. 

4 Carvin blade style humbuckers
Maple or Bamboo neck thru
Poplar wings
1 color semi transparent dye with satin clear coat
Multiscale 30"- 27"
Maple or Rosewood fretbaord
2 vol. and 1 tone control. Still haven't worked out the details on the stereo/mono wiring yet. 
Price-$1250


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## Hollowway (Oct 23, 2009)

Sign me up!!!!


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## leandroab (Oct 23, 2009)

OH GOD OH GOD OH GOD!


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## All_¥our_Bass (Oct 24, 2009)

Needs a bridge pup and I personally would prefer a straight fourths tuning(but that's just me). I'd still play this proto though-it kinda reminds me of the TrebleBass.


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 24, 2009)

I had the same thought about the Santucci Treblebass when I strung it up. I think the tuning is the same. 

A straight 4ths tuning will probably be the default tuning for this baby.


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## Andrew_B (Oct 24, 2009)

Tom Drinkwater said:


> I still haven't finalized the new bridge. I will take all of that into consideration when I make the new ones. Sharp edges aren't good on bridges.
> 
> I have worked out some specs for the guitar in its base model trim.
> 
> ...


 

sharp edges arent good on guitars in general 

this guitar looks sweet...

now.... what with bamboo for a neck?
iv never heard of that before...

good work man


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## Tom Drinkwater (Oct 24, 2009)

> now.... what with bamboo for a neck?
> iv never heard of that before...


 
Bamboo is relatively new as a guitar wood. It has alot of good qualities. It is very stable, rigid, hard and easy to finish. It is a bit stringy to work with at first but when you get used to it it's all good. You just have to be careful around the end grain.

I got the idea from a Chapman Stick that was made from bamboo. Really sweet.


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## JonnHatch (Nov 12, 2009)

any news on this beast yet Tom??


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## Tom Drinkwater (Nov 16, 2009)

Nothing too interesting happening yet. Just working out all of the details of producing this thing. If it was as easy as just building the dang things it wouldn't be a problem. Making a living while building the dang things is a different story. So the info on the 10 string as of right this very minute-

1) The first 6 months or so will be bamboo neck thru and poplar body.
2) Carvin pickups with dual mono outs. 2 volumes.
3) Scale of either 30"-27" or 27"-24" I haven't totally decided yet. This is up in the air right now. Really depends on the tuning and whether or not I make it a headless with bridge tuners.

Making one instrument is very different than producing several of the same instruments at the same time. Everything comes down to material cost and time spent on each operation. I have a great bridge design but it would take alot of time to mill each bridge, so that got set aside in favor of a less time intensive design that I have yet to prototype. The wood milling part is fairly easy but certain parts of the guitar take alot of time like the transition area from the neck to the body. This of course will be very much like the prototype because it is a very important part of the instrument and even though it takes alot of time to hand carve and scrape and sand the area to perfection it is worth it. So then I have to make up time somewhere else, like the bridge. My goal is the same as it was when I prototyped the guitar. I want to offer a really cool ERG to people at a really reasonable price. If I were charging $3000 a peice for the guitars I wouldn't have many problems at all setting up and starting production. That would be easy because I wouldn't need to make that many of them each month. Gotta pay the bills you know. By making these affordable, $1250 is the goal, it creates some difficulties. I still think that by January I will be up and running. During the first 6 months I won't be able to take custom orders. I will build the base models and sell them from my website. After I get the production wrinkles ironed out I may be able to offer a few different wood choices. I am playing around with idea of offering the base model as is and a deluxe model featuring better pickups, piezo, exotic woods and some other stuff but it all comes down to the same issues as I listed above.


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## JonnHatch (Nov 16, 2009)

awesome. i definitely wouldnt want a headless,because your headstock design is too damn sweet. pretty much exactly what your pic is in the first post, 27 to 30 in. scale, i would buy in a heart beat!! except with rear route electronics, side mount jack, and the carvin pickups should i just place a custom order with you Tom?


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## Tom Drinkwater (Nov 17, 2009)

I will keep the 30"-27" multiscale. I forgot that I was planning on doing a piezo/nylon version of this guitar down the road. I can get strings from La Bella for a classical contra guitar (30" scale guitar tuned down 1 octave) and use standard nylon strings for the high strings. By using a very similar design I don't have to spend months of prototyping when I am ready to bring out the nylon string. 

The back routing is a must and the side mount jacks are a go too. I am still going to develop the headless but I think the headstock will be on the standard. The time savings of using standard tuners will be huge. To keep the 30" scale I would have to totally change the design to accomodate the headless bridge. Hopefully I can make it work out on a shorter scale instrument. Then the only limiting factor would be the production time for bridge.


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## sun_of_nothing (Jan 3, 2011)

Adam said:


> I only see 3 plain steel strings so unless the G string is corroded I think it just has a G,B, and E.
> Also nice work Tom, didn't know you know how to do multiscale Did you get a chance to check out my finished 11 string?



Could be a wound G. I use them, they have a richer tone.


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## pink freud (Jan 19, 2011)

Hey Tom, I was just browsing your site and came across the info that you will have a single-cut multiscale 8 projected. Is there any art of this, or even a concept guitar built yet that you could show us?


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## Tom Drinkwater (Jan 20, 2011)

I have been so swamped with orders that I haven't had the time to finish my prototype of the single cut 8. I do have one in the works for a customer though so I will try to remember to post a pic of the finished product when it is complete. Thanks for asking.


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