# Fortin Meshuggah amps



## Jacksonluvr636 (Nov 1, 2016)

Sounds gewd.


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## bnzboy (Nov 1, 2016)

I saw Meshuggah when they came to Toronto last sunday. One of the BEST metal concerts I have ever been and the guitar tone was too good to be true. Throughout the show I assumed it was Randall Satan but turns out the tone was being pumped out from Mike Fortin's customer amps. Brutal!


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## Jacksonluvr636 (Nov 1, 2016)

bnzboy said:


> I saw Meshuggah when they came to Toronto last sunday. One of the BEST metal concerts I have ever been and the guitar tone was too good to be true. Throughout the show I assumed it was Randall Satan but turns out the tone was being pumped out from Mike Fortin's customer amps. Brutal!



I think I see you in the video  jk

Yeah, I guess they swapped out the Satan's at some point during the tour.

I think this is the only video showing the Fortin's. Man these really sound killer plus it is not even the best quality recording.

50W monsters with some type of "nos" parts. I can't imagine these being mass produced if he is using nos internals unfortunately.

Hopefully I am wrong there.


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## wakjob (Nov 1, 2016)

I've been trying to tell people that Mike Fortin and Martin Kidd have the best ears in the amp building business lately.

They get it.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 1, 2016)

wakjob said:


> I've been trying to tell people that Mike Fortin and Martin Kidd have the best ears in the amp building business lately.
> 
> They get it.



 Mike Fortin, Martin Kidd, and Dave Friedman are the 3 top amp geniuses.


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## technomancer (Nov 1, 2016)

Here's what they look like... love that black one


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 1, 2016)

Mike said there was something else in store for Fredrik when he left Randall. KInda wondering if this is it?


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## technomancer (Nov 1, 2016)

From what Mike has said these are just for the tour and they're not sure if they're going to do a limited run of these or something else from scratch later.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 1, 2016)

https://www.instagram.com/p/BMSbC1vj4fY/

It has two gain knobs. I'm guessing a simplified version of the Girth/Grind? I also see a knob that says "MVC". Long shot, but I guess it means "Master volume control?"


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## technomancer (Nov 1, 2016)

They're from the ground up custom builds so who knows...


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## 4Eyes (Nov 2, 2016)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> 50W monsters with some type of "nos" parts. I can't imagine these being mass produced if he is using nos internals unfortunately.



looks like just NOS preamp tubes, no reason why it couldn't happen if there was demand

edit: well, some caps as well, but it still could happen


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## Alekke (Nov 2, 2016)

There are also two mystery pedals in the upper left corner that look like Grind pedals that they use in front of the amps. Fortin won't say what they are but I'm guessing custom Grind pedals or a regular Grind.


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## vick1000 (Nov 2, 2016)

I though they use Axe FX? So these are basically used as power amps?


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## Alekke (Nov 2, 2016)

vick1000 said:


> I though they use Axe FX? So these are basically used as power amps?



They started to use tube amps on the TVSOR tour. They use axe fx for the effects only. Rhythm sound is analog but they still use their custom cab IR's.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 2, 2016)

vick1000 said:


> I though they use Axe FX? So these are basically used as power amps?



For this tour, they switched to using real Fortin-designed amps for distortion. They're running into Two-Notes loadboxes. For cleans and FX, they still use the Axes.


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## jerm (Nov 2, 2016)

The whole Marshall look is somewhat misleading due to them being full on custom haha

Would love to see these go to production though. Fortin makes awesome amps.


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## Wookieslayer (Nov 2, 2016)

Pretty sick


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## noob_pwn (Nov 2, 2016)

i got the inside scoop on these.
50w, single channel, 2 gain stages, 2 separate gain controls. Must have a lot of diode clipping going on in the preamp because I have no idea how an amp designed that way would get so gainy.

edit: just read most of you figured this out on your own! oh well. Can't wait to try one of these things if they ever get released.


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## bnzboy (Nov 2, 2016)

When I heard them using the amp in Toronto during the sound check it sounded quite edge-y with tight low end and lots of upper mid. Phenomenal combination with the massive bass tone. Cut through the mix like a knife even with their low tuned 8 string guitars.


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## vick1000 (Nov 2, 2016)

noob_pwn said:


> i got the inside scoop on these.
> 50w, single channel, 2 gain stages, 2 separate gain controls. Must have a lot of diode clipping going on in the preamp because I have no idea how an amp designed that way would get so gainy.
> 
> edit: just read most of you figured this out on your own! oh well. Can't wait to try one of these things if they ever get released.



You don't need lots of preamp tubes on a class A, since you don't need a PI/splitter. So you have four stages there with just two tubes. Most rackmount preamps and pedals only have two tubes.


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## technomancer (Nov 2, 2016)

Also as far as tubes / components Mike posted this:



Fortin said:


> Winged C SED EL34s, V1= Tungsol reissue 12ax7, V2= NOS Ei 12ax7, V3= NOS Philips 12ax7
> 
> NOS LCR filter caps, Hand wound paper bobbin OT and PT, custom choke, NOS caps mix of Philips mustards, Lemco Dogbones, RS, Sprague, killer pilot NOS indicator = equals modern tone with killer control and feel!


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## Wizard of Ozz (Nov 2, 2016)

technomancer said:


> Also as far as tubes / components Mike posted this:
> 
> Originally Posted by Fortin
> Winged C SED EL34s, V1= Tungsol reissue 12ax7, V2= NOS Ei 12ax7, V3= NOS Philips 12ax7
> ...




So... 3 gain stages (1 tube is for the phase splitter and at least 1 stage is for the cathode follower), and some sort of diode clipping similar to the Fortin Killer Kali mod? Not a fire-breather from these specs... at least on paper.


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## noob_pwn (Nov 2, 2016)

Wizard of Ozz said:


> So... 3 gain stages (1 tube is for the phase splitter and at least 1 stage is for the cathode follower), and some sort of diode clipping similar to the Fortin Killer Kali mod? Not a fire-breather from these specs... at least on paper.



Fortin's rep told me that it's two gain stages


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## Wizard of Ozz (Nov 2, 2016)

noob_pwn said:


> Fortin's rep told me that it's two gain stages



So... dual cathode follower (2 stage design - 1 tube). Cool.


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## technomancer (Nov 6, 2016)




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## prlgmnr (Nov 7, 2016)

Is that a switch? Like, "Meshuggah mode activated".

Or is it a dial, like "Can we set it to about 30% more Meshuggah please?"


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## lewis (Nov 7, 2016)

technomancer said:


>



omg a meshuggah "knob" is awesome  why cant all amps have this feature? haha


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## beavis2306 (Nov 7, 2016)

Haha, that's cool.


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## Mike (Nov 7, 2016)

prlgmnr said:


> Is that a switch? Like, "Meshuggah mode activated".
> 
> Or is it a dial, like "Can we set it to about 30% more Meshuggah please?"



lol Meshuggahswitch Engage


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## technomancer (Nov 7, 2016)

I'm pretty sure it's just a brightness adjustable power light


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## prlgmnr (Nov 7, 2016)

technomancer said:


> I'm pretty sure it's just a brightness adjustable power light



Right yeah and next you'll be saying the brightness of the power light DOESN'T affect tone in any way.


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## musicaldeath (Nov 7, 2016)

The blacked out plexi look and that light are awesome. Would be interesting to see if they do some sort of production model based on this. I have not had a chance to try anything by Fortin, but everything online sounds awesome for them.


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## Jacksonluvr636 (Nov 10, 2016)

musicaldeath said:


> The blacked out plexi look and that light are awesome. Would be interesting to see if they do some sort of production model based on this. I have not had a chance to try anything by Fortin, but everything online sounds awesome for them.



Mike said he is considering something.

No details, I just wonder how can they start a production run with NOS internals?

Maybe he will find a way to adjust OR maybe the NOS internals are plentiful.

Who knows?


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## Tisca (Nov 10, 2016)

fb video:
"In case you missed it, one of the first tone tests of the Meshuggah amps!"

https://www.facebook.com/FortinAmplification/videos/1312519878778905/


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## thrsher (Nov 10, 2016)

fortin amp is def on my bucket list


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## Spicypickles (Nov 10, 2016)

God that lead tone was saucy!!


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## Wizard of Ozz (Nov 10, 2016)

Tisca said:


> fb video:
> "In case you missed it, one of the first tone tests of the Meshuggah amps!"
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/FortinAmplification/videos/1312519878778905/



Sounds like an old 2-channel Recto orange channel.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 10, 2016)

^Isn't Fredrik a big fan of the Recto amps? They recorded 2 of their best albums with old 2-channel Rectos.


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## Wizard of Ozz (Nov 10, 2016)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> ^Isn't Fredrik a big fan of the Recto amps? They recorded 2 of their best albums with old 2-channel Rectos.



I believe you are correct sir.


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## Monkeypriest (Nov 11, 2016)

For me it sounds like a Fortin modded jcm800. That mids and tight distortion, three valves preamp and the EL34s in power section.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 21, 2016)




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## prlgmnr (Nov 21, 2016)

I emailed Mr Fortin and enquired how much he would be charging for one of those delightful items.

He said.....

"Keep an eye out on social media"

He did reply very very quickly though, so there's that.


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## Decipher (Nov 21, 2016)

Not only that but that interesting little "33" pedal someone pointed out on the Social Media as well. My gut tells me we're going to see some Meshuggah sig gear coming from Fortin soon. 

Exciting times.....


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## gfactor (Nov 21, 2016)

Really digging the whole modern/classic thing going on with these


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 21, 2016)




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## lewis (Nov 21, 2016)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


>



easily the best looking one imo!! looks so stealthy


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## Syphon (Nov 21, 2016)

3 tubes is actually 6 gain stages and when you're not driving an effects loop or using cathode follower stages to drive the tone stack then it's A LOT. It's more than a dual rec, in fact.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 21, 2016)

I'm guessing the 33 pedal is an offshot of the Grind pedal, just tweaked to Fredrik's and Marten's tastes?

And after Mike left Randall and someone asked about the Randall Fredrik amp, Mike did hint that something under the Fortin name was on it's way. So, we're definitely seeing a new pedal or amp.


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## Shask (Nov 21, 2016)

Syphon said:


> 3 tubes is actually 6 gain stages and when you're not driving an effects loop or using cathode follower stages to drive the tone stack then it's A LOT. It's more than a dual rec, in fact.



It is probably 4 or 5 stages + a cathode follower.

A Marshall 2203 based amp I built has 4 gain stages + CF, and it has tons of gain. Easily Recto/5150 levels of gain.


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## Syphon (Nov 21, 2016)

Shask said:


> It is probably 4 or 5 stages + a cathode follower.
> 
> A Marshall 2203 based amp I built has 4 gain stages + CF, and it has tons of gain. Easily Recto/5150 levels of gain.



Marshall tone stack driven by cathode follower? Nice. I'm not really a fan of the plate driven stacks. 

Did you use one of those naughty 39k cathode resistor stages or keep it more inline with marshall's style for the distortion?


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## Shask (Nov 21, 2016)

Syphon said:


> Marshall tone stack driven by cathode follower? Nice. I'm not really a fan of the plate driven stacks.
> 
> Did you use one of those naughty 39k cathode resistor stages or keep it more inline with marshall's style for the distortion?



Most Marshall based amps have a CF.

The amp I built is basically a JCM800 2203 circuit with 5150 style resonance controls, and extra gain stages in front of it. I have tweaked it a million different ways, but eventually settled on it being as close as a 2203 as possible. 

I actually had a pot for that cathode resistor for a while and dialed it between 5K and 50K. It mostly added a bunch of fuzz and noise, so 10K sounded best to me.


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## Syphon (Nov 21, 2016)

Shask said:


> Most Marshall based amps have a CF.
> 
> The amp I built is basically a JCM800 2203 circuit with 5150 style resonance controls, and extra gain stages in front of it. I have tweaked it a million different ways, but eventually settled on it being as close as a 2203 as possible.
> 
> I actually had a pot for that cathode resistor for a while and dialed it between 5K and 50K. It mostly added a bunch of fuzz and noise, so 10K sounded best to me.



Hmm shows how much I know about modern marshalls.

I prefer the VHT-type depth control to the 5150. I will give the 5150 style another chance.


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## Shask (Nov 21, 2016)

Syphon said:


> Hmm shows how much I know about modern marshalls.
> 
> I prefer the VHT-type depth control to the 5150. I will give the 5150 style another chance.



VHT/5150/Soldano/Etc depth controls are all roughly the same. The VHT ones just sound tighter, because the power supply is more highly filtered overall.


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## Syphon (Nov 21, 2016)

Shask said:


> VHT/5150/Soldano/Etc depth controls are all roughly the same. The VHT ones just sound tighter, because the power supply is more highly filtered overall.



VHT has feedback in the preamp, the presense on the 5150 is global is what I am getting at. I have a bench setup running both right now and I really do prefer the tighter sound of the VHT preamp feedback.


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## Shask (Nov 21, 2016)

Syphon said:


> VHT has feedback in the preamp, the presense on the 5150 is global is what I am getting at. I have a bench setup running both right now and I really do prefer the tighter sound of the VHT preamp feedback.



Ah... I think I remember what you are talking about. If I remember correctly, that feedback loop is part of what gives VHT that crystal clear, upper mid / treble heavy tone.


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## NorCal_Val (Nov 23, 2016)

Just saw Meshuggah last night(Wednesday) in Amsterdam.
They sounded ferocious!!!


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## travis bickle (Nov 24, 2016)

As a kemper user, every once in a while an amp comes that one must own. this amp is one such animal. hahahaha. live in nyc, meshuggah sounded incredible live.


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## lewis (Nov 24, 2016)

travis bickle said:


> As a kemper user, every once in a while an amp comes that one must own. this amp is one such animal. hahahaha. live in nyc, meshuggah sounded incredible live.



not guna lie....I CANNOT WAIT for someone like Sinmix to get one and release profile packs of it. <3 haha


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## Paul McAleer (Nov 24, 2016)

Are the "Gain 2" & "Gain 1" switches the similar as to the Grind and Girth?


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## Alekke (Nov 25, 2016)

Paul McAleer said:


> Are the "Gain 2" & "Gain 1" switches the similar as to the Grind and Girth?



It is hard to say as Fortin still keeps it a secret and due to the fact that they are using mysterious Fortin pedal labeled "33" in front of the amp.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 25, 2016)

Actually on his FB, he said they're not Girth/Grind controls.

He also said it's not based on a Marshall (or anything at all). It's a ground-up build, and they only went for the Marshall aesthetic.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 25, 2016)

Also, this isn't Shuggah-related, but jeeeeeeezus


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## Faldoe (Nov 25, 2016)

Sick looking amps. It's nice Meshuggah is back to using amps live.


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## Paul McAleer (Nov 25, 2016)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Actually on his FB, he said they're not Girth/Grind controls.
> 
> He also said it's not based on a Marshall (or anything at all). It's a ground-up build, and they only went for the Marshall aesthetic.



I saw some of his comments on fb that both gain controls are simply just, "more gain!"

Excuse my ignorance  could that mean that one of the gain controls acts as an input overdrive/boost, as the other is from elsewhere? 

Wish I knew more about these kind of things!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Nov 25, 2016)

Probably just that one gain control cascades into the other.


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## protest (Nov 25, 2016)

Could be like the gain controls on the older Mark series.


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## oniduder (Feb 9, 2017)

my guess is the two gain controls are cascading like on the mark iv (small digression, why the hell did mesa ever get rid of that feature on future mark amps?!?!?!?)

any way i've spoken with mike, he's secretive as he should be, and probably annoyed more than anyone because i'm sure he gets tons of emails about this

point is he said the amp isn't a marshall modded extravaganza, and is pretty much built (of course any amp is a directive of another) from the ground up for the meshuggah peeps

the 33 pedal probably awesome, although airis effects is making a modified integrated preamp called the the liverkick, and speaking with him he plans on making a rackmount overdrive thingy which he is still prototyping, 

and blabalbalbalbalalbalbalablabalbalbla


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## oracles (Feb 9, 2017)

oniduder said:


> airis effects is making a modified integrated preamp called the the liverkick, and speaking with him he plans on making a rackmount overdrive thingy which he is still prototyping



And it'll likely still be poorly built, and/or just rehoused from one of his competitors in an over priced format in direct relation to his competition, seeing as how that's the way he does things.


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## oniduder (Feb 9, 2017)

oracles said:


> And it'll likely still be poorly built, and/or just rehoused from one of his competitors in an over priced format in direct relation to his competition, seeing as how that's the way he does things.



.... thanks for the heads up!

damn just when you thought you might have found something cool

ciao


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## oracles (Feb 9, 2017)

oniduder said:


> .... thanks for the heads up!
> 
> damn just when you thought you might have found something cool
> 
> ciao



Hit up Matt at Dunn Effects, Brad at Nerd Knuckle Effects, and Nick over at Dunwich Amplification. Those guys are all fantastic builders that come in at or around the same price point and are great dudes to work with.


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## oniduder (Feb 9, 2017)

oracles said:


> Hit up Matt at Dunn Effects, Brad at Nerd Knuckle Effects, and Nick over at Dunwich Amplification. Those guys are all fantastic builders that come in at or around the same price point and are great dudes to work with.



seriously thanks!


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## Tisca (Jun 2, 2017)

This popped up in my yt feed


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## mnemonic (Jun 3, 2017)

Celestion Alnico Cream seems like an odd choice for a Meshuggah sig amp demo but it seemed to work out. 

Sounds very tight. He didn't mention any pedals so unsure if he was using a boost of some kind. 

I guess this settles that the Gain 1 / Gain 2 is not like Girth / Grind. Seems more like the usual dual gain controls on old marshalls. 

Must not be a very loud amp? He's got both gain controls on 10 and the master on 8 or 9 for most of the demo, yet he's sitting right in front of it, and it doesn't sound like a garbled mess of power tube distortion. 

Also looks like there's a Zener diode clipping section on the push/pull master volume.


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## technomancer (Jun 5, 2017)

Let's keep this on topic guys



mnemonic said:


> Must not be a very loud amp? He's got both gain controls on 10 and the master on 8 or 9 for most of the demo, yet he's sitting right in front of it, and it doesn't sound like a garbled mess of power tube distortion.



Not very loud based on what? The cab is mic'ed and decent power sections generally don't fall apart at 3/4 volume... It could be shaking the walls loud from all you can tell from the clip


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## mnemonic (Jun 5, 2017)

Maybe I just have more delicate ears than you guys, I don't think I could sit in front of a 50w amp turned up that high. Plus, I guess I'm surprised the poweramp isn't distorting and getting flubby.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jun 5, 2017)

if anyone's actually looking to get one of these, there's a guy selling one in the music gear exchange group. he wants like 3.7k for it though.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 5, 2017)

technomancer said:


> Let's keep this on topic guys
> 
> 
> 
> Not very loud based on what? The cab is mic'ed and decent power sections generally don't fall apart at 3/4 volume... It could be shaking the walls loud from all you can tell from the clip



That, or the guy is actually smart and is wearing ear protection. 

I'm curious about how the gain stages work though. When he cranked Gain 2 it sounded fine. Cranking gain 1 seemed to make things sound fuzzy and undefined. 

Also, FWIW, the dude in that video considers it one of his favorite high-gain amps now.


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## technomancer (Jun 5, 2017)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Also, FWIW, the dude in that video considers it one of his favorite high-gain amps now.



Yeah that's the same guy selling it, also looks like it is sold


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## Blytheryn (Jun 5, 2017)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> That, or the guy is actually smart and is wearing ear protection.
> 
> I'm curious about how the gain stages work though. When he cranked Gain 2 it sounded fine. Cranking gain 1 seemed to make things sound fuzzy and undefined.
> 
> Also, FWIW, the dude in that video considers it one of his favorite high-gain amps now.



If it's one of his favorites, why did he just list it on Wired's Facebook page for 3666 USD? Might have been for like 72 hours...


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## KnightBrolaire (Jun 5, 2017)

Blytheryn said:


> If it's one of his favorites, why did he just list it on Wired's Facebook page for 3666 USD? Might have been for like 72 hours...


think he said in the sales post that he was getting a custom guitar and needed the $$$.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jun 5, 2017)

I can't find the listing.


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## Blytheryn (Jun 5, 2017)

KnightBrolaire said:


> think he said in the sales post that he was getting a custom guitar and needed the $$$.


Well I guess, but I'd probably reach for something else. He probably listed it because it would sell fastest?


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## KnightBrolaire (Jun 5, 2017)

Blytheryn said:


> Well I guess, but I'd probably reach for something else. He probably listed it because it would sell fastest?


from what he said in the comments it was first in, so first out.


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## mnemonic (Jun 26, 2017)

New clip of #4 from Rigtalk. Sounds brutal as fck


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## technomancer (Jun 26, 2017)

Hey #4 can do more than just chuggah, who knew 



Wonder if I could get Mike to build one of these sans-cosmetics since I am indifferent on looks but this sounds killer...


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## KnightBrolaire (Jun 26, 2017)

man too bad I don't have space for another tube amp, otherwise I'd try to get a hold of one of these.


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## Jacksonluvr636 (Jun 26, 2017)

technomancer said:


> Hey #4 can do more than just chuggah, who knew
> 
> 
> 
> Wonder if I could get Mike to build one of these sans-cosmetics since I am indifferent on looks but this sounds killer...



This is cool. I like the tone. I am not much into the 80's music but this tone is good.

Glad you posted this because TBH I had written this amp off completely. I heard the first few clips to come out and thought wow...That sounds near Identical to my Uberschall. Why spend more than double the cost?

But now I kind of want to be able to try one.


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## technomancer (Jun 27, 2017)

So rumor is there is going to be another run of these... might have to see if I can land one


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## technomancer (Feb 1, 2018)

These are going back into production. They're going to be built in batches of 15 as preorders with an estimated 8-10 week delivery time.

First batch of preorders opens Monday 2/5. Second batch will open after first batch ships and so on. Pricing looks to be $3333.33.

Only thing I am not liking is the production run is getting the Marshall 4 hole look instead of the killer blacked out cosmetics of the first run that were sold.


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## bnzboy (Feb 1, 2018)

how come the pre-order link is password protected? do you need to email subscribe to enroll?


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## technomancer (Feb 1, 2018)

bnzboy said:


> how come the pre-order link is password protected? do you need to email subscribe to enroll?



I believe they are opening the preorder up to the Fortin Army Facebook group first before opening it to the public. Guessing they're posting the password to the group Monday, then later will remove the password if there are any slots left.

I didn't even realize they had updated the website as there was nothing about it last time I looked.


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## technomancer (Feb 5, 2018)

Meshuggah pre-orders are up. Payment is pre-pay by bank wire. Going to have to pass on that one


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## lewis (Feb 5, 2018)

technomancer said:


> Meshuggah pre-orders are up. Payment is pre-pay by bank wire. Going to have to pass on that one


ouch!
Shady as.
Might aswell sign your soul away haha


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## technomancer (Feb 5, 2018)

lewis said:


> ouch!
> Shady as.
> Might aswell sign your soul away haha



Yeah I really do like Mike and have had numerous dealings with him, but just nope.


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## technomancer (Feb 5, 2018)

And sold out after 13 minutes...


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## TheRileyOBrien (Feb 5, 2018)

That's pretty sketchy. I'll be relieved to see these start shipping. Way too many people have been burned by this method. There is no good reason to do a run that way. There is no doubt they would sell if he would have just built them ahead of time. They aren't even custom, they could have all been built before offering them up for sale. If he can't afford to build a run of these(doesn't have to be 15) he probably should look into a different business model. Could have even done prebuilt runs of 5 or something. This is silly and disappointing. If I end up getting one it will be one that already exists and can be shipped to me right after I pay for it.


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## technomancer (Feb 6, 2018)

Mike has made it clear he has no interest in accepting credit card sales for his amps and that this is how he will be doing business going forward, even if it means he has fewer customers.


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## Kyle Jordan (Feb 6, 2018)

technomancer said:


> Mike has made it clear he has no interest in accepting credit card sales for his amps and that this is how he will be doing business going forward, even if it means he has fewer customers.



Well, Maxwatt, Satan, and used it is for me then. Not going to play that game.


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## technomancer (Feb 6, 2018)

Kyle Jordan said:


> Well, Maxwatt, Satan, and used it is for me then. Not going to play that game.



Yep same here, I passed on the Meshuggah run yesterday when I saw the terms. Just deciding if I want to wait for the Maxwatt, order a KSR Juno, or start picking up some of the Randall stuff.


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## KnightBrolaire (Feb 6, 2018)

I like the sound of fortin's stuff but considering how few of them are actually floating around in the wild and the insane prices they go for, I think I'd rather get the maxwatt higain or the MI Beta.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (May 16, 2018)




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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 16, 2018)

So apparently Mike had to change the logo because of Reasons, so it's gonna look like this now.


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## Vyn (Jul 16, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> So apparently Mike had to change the logo because of Reasons, so it's gonna look like this now.



I do have to laugh at Marshall, they gain absolutely nothing from this - the potential buyer pool for these is either an amp horder so they already have the Marshall's worth buying, or they aren't interested in Marshall at all. If anything it was free PR for Marshall leaving Fortin to have the old logo. Now Marshall just looks petty.


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## KnightBrolaire (Jul 16, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> So apparently Mike had to change the logo because of Reasons, so it's gonna look like this now.


I actually prefer the new logo, it makes the amp feel a bit less like another marshall clone.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jul 16, 2018)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I actually prefer the new logo, it makes the amp feel a bit less like another marshall clone.



I think it helps. People probably see the logo and think "oh it's just another hot-rodded Marshall amp" if they're not familiar with Meshuggah. At least with the new logo, people are like "huh this might be a metal amp."


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## mnemonic (Jul 17, 2018)

I didn’t know you could trademark a cursive font.

I think my favorite iteration of the amp is with the cursive logo and black front panel. I’ve never been a fan of the gold that Marshall uses.

I think it might look better with no logo at all.


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## narad (Jul 17, 2018)

Wish it kind of just said FORTIN front and center. I guess it's the precedent -- that's where brands go, and models go somewhere off to the side.


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## StevenC (Jul 17, 2018)

Vyn said:


> I do have to laugh at Marshall, they gain absolutely nothing from this - the potential buyer pool for these is either an amp horder so they already have the Marshall's worth buying, or they aren't interested in Marshall at all. If anything it was free PR for Marshall leaving Fortin to have the old logo. Now Marshall just looks petty.


Logos and trademarks have some amount of value. If you don't protect them they can become generic. See: jacuzzi


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## Vyn (Jul 17, 2018)

StevenC said:


> Logos and trademarks have some amount of value. If you don't protect them they can become generic. See: jacuzzi



I feel like it's a bit late for Marshall to be pulling that one. If you see a generic cartoon/illustration of any hard rock band (and some metal bands) it'll be a black, gold-faced amp with curly writting on it. Heck just as average people draw a Strat when asked to draw a guitar, they draw a Marshall of some description if asked to draw an amp.


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## StevenC (Jul 17, 2018)

Vyn said:


> I feel like it's a bit late for Marshall to be pulling that one. If you see a generic cartoon/illustration of any hard rock band (and some metal bands) it'll be a black, gold-faced amp with curly writting on it. Heck just as average people draw a Strat when asked to draw a guitar, they draw a Marshall of some description if asked to draw an amp.


Cartoons dont count because that's not IP infringement. Marshall have been doing this for a while. See Friedman Marsha.


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## I play music (Jul 17, 2018)

StevenC said:


> Cartoons dont count because that's not IP infringement. Marshall have been doing this for a while. See Friedman Marsha.


Cartoons are just free advertisement for Marshall products, not a competing product


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## prlgmnr (Jul 17, 2018)

Had I been in charge of Marshall I would probably have changed my mind and let them use whatever name they wanted just to avoid there being a 3 grand amp called "Brown Eye"


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## noise in my mind (Jul 17, 2018)

I guess people could always get the Marshall styled Meshuggah logo custom made. I prefer the Marshall styled one.


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## JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo (Jul 17, 2018)

narad said:


> Wish it kind of just said FORTIN front and center. I guess it's the precedent -- that's where brands go, and models go somewhere off to the side.



Ditto. It's built from the ground up by Fortin, so why not stick that in the center. The logo in the corner would fit great in the center, the Meshuggah text looks kinda doofy to me when it's on an amp and not album art.


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## sakeido (Jul 17, 2018)

Fortin's logo sucks, so I'd rather they stick with the Meshuggah stuff like they've got.

Amp is way too expensive for what it is though, I don't particularly care about things being hand built or point-to-point wired or whatever. You can put together stuff in a modern assembly line way with printed PCBs, put em together properly, save a ton of man-hours and get the exact same tones, sell them for reasonable prices and probably make more money in the end too. 

in short IMO paying $3,500 USD+ for single channel ultra high gain amps is really fuckin stupid but oh well


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## technomancer (Jul 17, 2018)

sakeido said:


> Fortin's logo sucks, so I'd rather they stick with the Meshuggah stuff like they've got.
> 
> Amp is way too expensive for what it is though, I don't particularly care about things being hand built or point-to-point wired or whatever. You can put together stuff in a modern assembly line way with printed PCBs, put em together properly, save a ton of man-hours and get the exact same tones, sell them for reasonable prices and probably make more money in the end too.
> 
> in short IMO paying $3,500 USD+ for single channel ultra high gain amps is really fuckin stupid but oh well



They sold out the last run in 5 minutes so I’d say the pricing is fine for the market... and as I was told when I disliked the sales model I don’t think Mike gives a fuck


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## sakeido (Jul 17, 2018)

The demand is definitely there.. there's a lot of morons out there after all

but I balked instantly when Mike told me the price and suggested I get some weird credit card to pay for it. Maximum nope right there


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## narad (Jul 17, 2018)

technomancer said:


> They sold out the last run in 5 minutes so I’d say the pricing is fine for the market... and as I was told when I disliked the sales model I don’t think Mike gives a fuck



But that'll happen with just about anything in this market. There's always those guys willing to pay a premium -- I'm sure Mike could have put it up at $5k and sold out the run. Question is, what do you do after you use up that comparatively tiny amount of guys willing to pay that much?

But yea, I think the answer here is, like a blackmachine Doug thing, no fucks are given, so no one cares much about the sustainability of it all.

The weird bit here is like amp guys like Wizard that sell $4k+ amps seem to cater more towards genres and guys that are 40+ years old and don't flinch about $1k here or there. Being tied into Meshuggah points the demographic a bit younger, where people are used to lower priced or feature rich amps. Probably part of why there's push back here.


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## I play music (Jul 17, 2018)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> So apparently Mike had to change the logo because of Reasons, so it's gonna look like this now.


I really like that logo but would never spend that kind of money on an amp, so my opinion doesn't really matter in this case ;-)


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## FitRocker33 (Jul 17, 2018)

The amp with the revised lawsuit-proof logo looks tacky like the schecter hellwin amp did.


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## Vyn (Jul 18, 2018)

narad said:


> But that'll happen with just about anything in this market. There's always those guys willing to pay a premium -- I'm sure Mike could have put it up at $5k and sold out the run. Question is, what do you do after you use up that comparatively tiny amount of guys willing to pay that much?
> 
> But yea, I think the answer here is, like a blackmachine Doug thing, no fucks are given, so no one cares much about the sustainability of it all.
> 
> The weird bit here is like amp guys like Wizard that sell $4k+ amps seem to cater more towards genres and guys that are 40+ years old and don't flinch about $1k here or there. Being tied into Meshuggah points the demographic a bit younger, where people are used to lower priced or feature rich amps. Probably part of why there's push back here.



I think it's a matter of perspective as well - for example anyone involved in competitive motorsports will tell you $4k is loose change. I know quite a few racers (myself included) that consider gear hoarding to be the 'cheap' hobbie!

Heck you don't have to go outside music to even see things like that - the dudes in the vintage game are happy to drop tens of thousands without even batting an eyelid.


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## sakeido (Jul 18, 2018)

narad said:


> But that'll happen with just about anything in this market. There's always those guys willing to pay a premium -- I'm sure Mike could have put it up at $5k and sold out the run. Question is, what do you do after you use up that comparatively tiny amount of guys willing to pay that much?
> 
> But yea, I think the answer here is, like a blackmachine Doug thing, no fucks are given, so no one cares much about the sustainability of it all.
> 
> The weird bit here is like amp guys like Wizard that sell $4k+ amps seem to cater more towards genres and guys that are 40+ years old and don't flinch about $1k here or there. Being tied into Meshuggah points the demographic a bit younger, where people are used to lower priced or feature rich amps. Probably part of why there's push back here.



Meshuggah has been around long enough and has a big enough fanbase I think a good chunk of their fans have aged into a bracket where this amp is easily affordable.. plus there are always 1%er type guys hanging around who like this kind of stuff and can throw crazy money at it. There's enough of them around they could have bought up the run themselves. They'll never do anything noteworthy with the gear they get, but oh well... a certain banned member on here on comes to mind.

Eventually copies will start coming out for a lot less money. Happened to blackmachine, you see it with recording stuff all the time (Warm Audio, CAPI, Louder Than Liftoff), so my guess is we'll see something similar with these at some point too, if the hype lasts long enough for a really motivated hobbyist to get on it. Seems like a really good time for Mesa to bring back the Stiletto...


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## technomancer (Jul 18, 2018)

It's not like there is anything stunningly unique in the amp, it's not like nobody has done a high gain amp with four gain stages and a plate-fed tone stack before... the Cameron Aldrich comes immediately to mind. So anybody that knows amps could come up with something in the ballpark without too much trouble if that is the target.

I guess the dumber cloners that don't know how to bias a gain stage or voice an amp might need to get one to copy to figure that out though


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## DudeManBrother (Jul 19, 2018)

technomancer said:


> It's not like there is anything stunningly unique in the amp, it's not like nobody has done a high gain amp with four gain stages and a plate-fed tone stack before... the Cameron Aldrich comes immediately to mind. So anybody that knows amps could come up with something in the ballpark without too much trouble if that is the target.
> 
> I guess the dumber cloners that don't know how to bias a gain stage or voice an amp might need to get one to copy to figure that out though


For that matter, you could probably grab a Krank Revolution. I think they are basically modified JCM800 circuits with a plate fed tone stack. Shove that chassis in a mojotone headshell and you’re 90% there


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## beavis2306 (Jul 19, 2018)

What's the advantage of a plate-fed tone stack?


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## DudeManBrother (Jul 19, 2018)

beavis2306 said:


> What's the advantage of a plate-fed tone stack?


Different strokes... sound wise: The plate fed might be a bit smoother distortion character. The cathode follower tends to be grittier overall. Just depends on how you want to design the preamp. Both are cool. You also have to be more selective in preamp tubes on CF stages, as certain tubes like to blow up quickly.


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## beavis2306 (Jul 19, 2018)

Yeh ok. Thanks for that


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## technomancer (Jul 19, 2018)

DudeManBrother said:


> Different strokes... sound wise: The plate fed might be a bit smoother distortion character. The cathode follower tends to be grittier overall. Just depends on how you want to design the preamp. Both are cool. You also have to be more selective in preamp tubes on CF stages, as certain tubes like to blow up quickly.



There's also the obvious that if you're modding a Marshall like a JCM800 that has 3 preamp tubes it lets you do four gain stages without drilling the chassis and adding a tube.

I should also note I am not knocking Mike's work, from what I have heard the amp is incredible, it's just that some guys seem to think amp design is voodoo magic and it really isn't. There really isn't anything in the tube amp realm that isn't variations on a theme at this point, it's pretty much the nature of the technology. 

There is however a lot of skill and knowledge involved in really voicing something and understanding the frequency interactions caused by changing components that a good designer can do. It's one of the reasons Cameron was so highly regarded before business issues, he could talk to you about what you wanted and tweak his circuits to deliver it for each customer.


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## DudeManBrother (Jul 19, 2018)

technomancer said:


> There's also the obvious that if you're modding a Marshall like a JCM800 that has 3 preamp tubes it lets you do four gain stages without drilling the chassis and adding a tube.
> 
> I should also note I am not knocking Mike's work, from what I have heard the amp is incredible, it's just that some guys seem to think amp design is voodoo magic and it really isn't. There really isn't anything in the tube amp realm that isn't variations on a theme at this point, it's pretty much the nature of the technology.
> 
> There is however a lot of skill and knowledge involved in really voicing something and understanding the frequency interactions caused by changing components that a good designer can do. It's one of the reasons Cameron was so highly regarded before business issues, he could talk to you about what you wanted and tweak his circuits to deliver it for each customer.


Absolutely. With the plate fed TS freeing up the common cathode of a typical CF JCM800 circuit, you get an extra gain stage almost by default haha. 

I agree that circuit design is little more than modified modifications of modified modifications of something that probably came out of the RCA Receiving Tube Manual originally; but there is an art to placing the TS at a certain point and how you select components to shape the overall clipping characteristics. The ability to execute said design without inducing unwanted noise is also something that is under appreciated, like Steve Fryette can do, as good or better than anything I’ve played. 

I think it’s a cool amp; not enough to stick $3500 in an unmarked paper bag and duct tape it under the old dock, or whatever ridiculous requirements are needed to acquire one, but if the opportunity presents itself to grab one used in the future I probably would.


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## neotronic (Jul 19, 2018)

technomancer said:


> It's not like there is anything stunningly unique in the amp, it's not like nobody has done a high gain amp with four gain stages and a plate-fed tone stack before... the Cameron Aldrich comes immediately to mind.



Or any of Engl amps...


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## FourT6and2 (Jul 20, 2018)

I got one coming. Will be removing that gaudy logo and either running a naked headshell or I'll have a custom logo made to look like the original. Or I'll just put a Marshall logo on it. Don't know yet. As far as price goes, $3K is the going rate for most higher end amps these days. Diezel, Bogner, Fryette, Rhodes/KSR, Wizard, Soldano, etc. etc. Nothing out of the ordinary.

The whole bank wire to pay is a little strange for a retail product. But hey, no different than buying other things like cars or property. I bought a car recently and paid with a wire transfer. No big deal. I don't think Mike Fortin is going to take your money and move to Switzerland.

Looks like each run had about 30 amps? Three runs total? That's 90 amps. At $3,333 each, that's $300,000. Roughly. Total to build each amp for parts and labor is probably $1800 at least. Leaving about $138K left. Minus any taxes at the end of the year, would probably leave about $98K left in profit. Then gotta pay any employees, utilities, property taxes on office/shop, and so on. At the end of the day he's probably left with $60K. If he accepted Paypal, that would eat another $9,000. That's not insignificant. So I can understand wanting to cut out credit processing fees. But he should accept other forms of payment, like checks I guess. Who knows.


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## technomancer (Jul 20, 2018)

FourT6and2 said:


> I got one coming. Will be removing that gaudy logo and either running a naked headshell or I'll have a custom logo made to look like the original. Or I'll just put a Marshall logo on it. Don't know yet. As far as price goes, $3K is the going rate for most higher end amps these days. Diezel, Bogner, Fryette, Rhodes/KSR, Wizard, Soldano, etc. etc. Nothing out of the ordinary.
> 
> The whole bank wire to pay is a little strange for a retail product. But hey, no different than buying other things like cars or property. I bought a car recently and paid with a wire transfer. No big deal. I don't think Mike Fortin is going to take your money and move to Switzerland.
> 
> Looks like each run had about 30 amps? Three runs total? That's 90 amps. At $3,333 each, that's $300,000. Roughly. Total to build each amp for parts and labor is probably $1800 at least. Leaving about $138K left. Minus any taxes at the end of the year, would probably leave about $98K left in profit. Then gotta pay any employees, utilities, property taxes on office/shop, and so on. At the end of the day he's probably left with $60K. If he accepted Paypal, that would eat another $9,000. That's not insignificant. So I can understand wanting to cut out credit processing fees. But he should accept other forms of payment, like checks I guess. Who knows.



You're wasting your time typing this there are guys that will argue price for pages on this site, and the argument is basically that is more than I want to pay / can afford so it is too high  Bottom line is he is selling out his production capacity in 15 minutes when he opens orders so I'd say he's fine. He could have probably upped the price significantly and still sold out the runs he is looking to do if he wanted to.

The payment method concern is more because it is a preorder and as far as I can see if something happens to Mike the business is gone and so is your money. I paid for my last car by cashier's check and it wasn't a problem, but it was also an exchange on the spot with a large business and if the guy I was dealing with was hit by a bus I would have still gotten my car. That's how Mike wants to do things and that is fine, but it is a risk. Again he is obviously selling out runs in no time so there are clearly people willing to take that risk.

Also the runs are getting progressively bigger. I'm not going to go back and search for it on Facebook but assuming I am remembering correctly the first run was 30, the second was 90 and the third is supposed to be somewhere around 150.

I'd definitely be interested in discussing the amp from a technical standpoint once you get yours. I'm not interested in building a direct clone but it's always interesting to see how different guys do things. Might also be fun to throw some switchable voicing changes in my Aldrich I'm building since the topology is likely at least similar.

Still debating if I want to try to get in on the last run or not. I probably will give it a shot since selling it used for what I paid for it would clearly not be a problem


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## mnemonic (Jul 20, 2018)

I’m also pretty interested what’s going on in that amp.

I’d love to build an amp one day, and a purpose-built, single channel metal machine is exactly what I’d want to make. Unfortunately most amp kits and single channel turret board layouts are for Plexis and JCM800’s and I don’t know enough about amps to tweak one into a modern metal amp.

But the specs of this amp (single channel, high/low inputs, dual gain controls, EL34, 3x 12ax7’s, heyboer transformers, Plexi headshell and mike Fortin making it) all point toward it likely being a heavily modded and gained out plexi or 2204.

Knowing what the mods are certainly would help in making my own. Maybe I should just build a plexi and then just change stuff until I’m happy with it.

I guess I should just get my ass in gear and study Cameron, Friedman, etc schematics.


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## Beheroth (Jul 20, 2018)

mnemonic said:


> But the specs of this amp (single channel, high/low inputs, dual gain controls, EL34, 3x 12ax7’s, heyboer transformers, Plexi headshell and mike Fortin making it) all point toward it likely being a heavily modded and gained out plexi or 2204.



when he first started posting on ig about the prototypes he clearly stated, that except the look, the meshuggah amp has nothing to do with a marshall amp, it's not based of an existing design


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## mnemonic (Jul 20, 2018)

All amps are based off an existing design.


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## Beheroth (Jul 20, 2018)

of course, but i meant it as this isn't a modded clone, it's an "original" design as far as originality go in the tube amp design world.


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## narad (Jul 20, 2018)

Beheroth said:


> when he first started posting on ig about the prototypes he clearly stated, that except the look, the meshuggah amp has nothing to do with a marshall amp, it's not based of an existing design



Probably shouldn't have posted that video of the guy saying it does a great job copping classic Marshall tones then


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## FourT6and2 (Jul 20, 2018)

technomancer said:


> You're wasting your time typing this there are guys that will argue price for pages on this site, and the argument is basically that is more than I want to pay / can afford so it is too high  Bottom line is he is selling out his production capacity in 15 minutes when he opens orders so I'd say he's fine. He could have probably upped the price significantly and still sold out the runs he is looking to do if he wanted to.
> 
> The payment method concern is more because it is a preorder and as far as I can see if something happens to Mike the business is gone and so is your money. I paid for my last car by cashier's check and it wasn't a problem, but it was also an exchange on the spot with a large business and if the guy I was dealing with was hit by a bus I would have still gotten my car. That's how Mike wants to do things and that is fine, but it is a risk. Again he is obviously selling out runs in no time so there are clearly people willing to take that risk.
> 
> ...



All valid points. 

Yeah, I have my suspicions about what the amp actually is. I'm pretty sure it's just another take on the Jose/Cali circuit. Dual gains with bright switches (hard wired this time) + diode clipping master. It does seam to have more gain than a typical Cali circuit though. But with three preamp tubes, only so much you can do. Three gain stages eat up 1.5 tubes. Then tone stack is V2b. Leaving the third for the PI. So not sure where else you can get more gain without diodes. We'll see.



Beheroth said:


> when he first started posting on ig about the prototypes he clearly stated, that except the look, the meshuggah amp has nothing to do with a marshall amp, it's not based of an existing design



Yeah... I doubt it. It's probably another Cali-type of circuit, just revoiced. I'll find out soon enough.


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## technomancer (Jul 20, 2018)

FourT6and2 said:


> Yeah, I have my suspicions about what the amp actually is. I'm pretty sure it's just another take on the Jose/Cali circuit. Dual gains with bright switches (hard wired this time) + diode clipping master. It does seam to have more gain than a typical Cali circuit though. But with three preamp tubes, only so much you can do. Three gain stages eat up 1.5 tubes. Then tone stack is V2b. Leaving the third for the PI. So not sure where else you can get more gain without diodes. We'll see.



That's where the plate fed tone stack comes in. You eliminate the cathode follower so V2B is a gain stage. Check out the Cameron Aldrich thread over on sloclone for an example (though be aware there are some errors in the schematic, like the voicing switch that is labeled on-off-on should be on-on-on or the switch does nothing in all but one position, and some values should be different).

I am curious if there is diode clipping in this or not, but IIRC Mike had said it was 4 gain stages and the only way to do that with 3 tubes is lose the cathode follower.


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## FourT6and2 (Jul 20, 2018)

> That's where the plate fed tone stack comes in. You eliminate the cathode follower so V2B is a gain stage. Check out the Cameron Aldrich thread over on sloclone for an example (though be aware there are some errors in the schematic, like the voicing switch that is labeled on-off-on should be on-on-on or the switch does nothing in all but one position, and some values should be different).
> 
> I am curious if there is diode clipping in this or not, but IIRC Mike had said it was 4 gain stages and the only way to do that with 3 tubes is lose the cathode follower.



Yeah, plate-fed TS is a strong possibility. My amp should ship next week.

There is definitely diode clipping.


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## technomancer (Jul 20, 2018)

FourT6and2 said:


> Yeah, plate-fed TS is a strong possibility. My amp should ship next week.
> 
> There is definitely diode clipping.



Awesome 

I nuked the stuff about the Cali as I decided it was better to not open that can of worms, hope you don't mind


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## Kyle Jordan (Jul 21, 2018)

technomancer said:


> ... it's just that some guys seem to think amp design is voodoo magic and it really isn't. There really isn't anything in the tube amp realm that isn't variations on a theme at this point, it's pretty much the nature of the technology.
> 
> There is however a lot of skill and knowledge involved in really voicing something and understanding the frequency interactions caused by changing components that a good designer can do. It's one of the reasons Cameron was so highly regarded before business issues, he could talk to you about what you wanted and tweak his circuits to deliver it for each customer.



Excellent point. 

I think that what you wrote is basically the reason that even if I've never owned a product of theirs or played many of them, there are a few amp makers/engineers I always keep up with and pay attention to. Steve Fryette and Peter Diezel are the first that come to mind. More recently, I'd also say Kyle Rhodes and Mike Fortin as well.


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## Vyn (Jul 30, 2018)

Alright, so who purchased one this time around?


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## bulb (Jul 30, 2018)

considering they are my favorite band, how could i not haha


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## Vyn (Jul 30, 2018)

bulb said:


> considering they are my favorite band, how could i not haha



Brilliant! You'd pretty much own most of the popular high-gain heads now yeah?


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## icipher (Jul 31, 2018)

I'll chime in and say that while I thought about ordering one of these heads, I didn't.

$3.3K for a single channel, 50 watt head? Meh. I paid a grand less for a new KSR Orthos II with two channels and 100 watts of power. I have heard plenty of demos of the Meshuggah head and to my ears, it doesn't sound better than the KSR. That is only my opinion, i know.

I like Fortin, and I've bought 3 of his pedals which are AWESOME. I just think the price of these Meshuggah heads are a little much. If they were 2 channels and 100+ watts it'd maybe be a different story.


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## Jacksonluvr636 (Jul 31, 2018)

icipher said:


> I'll chime in and say that while I thought about ordering one of these heads, I didn't.
> 
> $3.3K for a single channel, 50 watt head? Meh. I paid a grand less for a new KSR Orthos II with two channels and 100 watts of power. I have heard plenty of demos of the Meshuggah head and to my ears, it doesn't sound better than the KSR. That is only my opinion, i know.
> 
> I like Fortin, and I've bought 3 of his pedals which are AWESOME. I just think the price of these Meshuggah heads are a little much. If they were 2 channels and 100+ watts it'd maybe be a different story.



I agree. Personally, I dislike the whole hype thing that Fortin does. "limited", "get them now" meh. I would definitely rock one of these but for $3.3k I am with you. So many other things I would get instead. Mike Fortin is definitely among the best but there are so many other and more affordable options.

FWIW I really disliked the 33 pedal, I sold it immediately and that was the only Fortin product I have owned. I would love one of his high gain amps or mods however. 

Anyway regarding the Meshugga amp. They just did a final run and it sold out in 1 day. There are only 100 of these ever going to be made so I guess this is a gear flippers dream come true.


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## bulb (Jul 31, 2018)

The way I see it, with the limited nature you would at least get your money back on the amp if you choose to sell it, and potentially more if you find the right buyer. So as long as you can afford it and are interested it’s pretty risk free!


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## StevenC (Jul 31, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> There are only 100 of these ever going to be made so I guess this is a gear flippers dream come true.


Hmm...


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## Jacksonluvr636 (Aug 1, 2018)

StevenC said:


> Hmm...


Ok maybe an exaggeration. Bet they pull 5k in due time. Sure not the most amazing return in history but definitely a profit to be made and people eat the limited thing up. Ive seen the 33 pedal sell several times for double the cost and up to as high as triple.

Some of the modded amps have gone for over 3k and probably over 1k profit in those if done right by the seller.

I get it. Regarding the creating hype with limited stuff. If it helps sell then whatever works. Guys have to make a living and its nothing new for marketing experts. Just as a consumer, I don't buy into it.


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## narad (Aug 2, 2018)

Jacksonluvr636 said:


> Anyway regarding the Meshugga amp. They just did a final run and it sold out in 1 day. There are only 100 of these ever going to be made so I guess this is a gear flippers dream come true.



Exactly. Same reason why I stocked up on these 1999 First Lady Dolley Madison commemorative coins. As time goes on, the need to commemorate just gets higher and higher, fixed supply, no-brainer.


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