# The Dark Knight Rises Thread



## Vicissitude27

Christopher Nolan has officially released the title of the 3rd movie in his Batman trilogy. It will be entitled "The Dark Knight Rises" and will NOT be in 3-D. 
Personally, I'm so thankful that it isn't in 3-D. The whole 3-D rage lately, is not my thing. 

But I figure I would start a thread about this movie, where people can post updates about the movie. So where are you Nolan freaks?


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## MFB

You also forgot the big mention that Riddler WON'T be the villain


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## Vicissitude27

MFB said:


> You also forgot the big mention that Riddler WON'T be the villain




This is why I started this thread! So I can figure out this stuff


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## OrsusMetal

I read this the other day. I think the title could have been a little better, but I'm still looking forward to it. Something like 'Batman Rises' would have been better, imo.


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## vampiregenocide

Sweet, and Tom Hardy looks like he's going to be in it too. He's a great actor so thats good news.

I wonder who the villain will be. Hush or Freeze would be pretty cool.


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## bostjan

Nolan has said that there would be no Mr. Freeze nor Penguin.

I think that anything at this point is pure speculation, but I think Hush would be interesting as a villain in this series.

I highly doubt that Nolan would include Killer Croc in the film. These films have been very successful shunning the supernatural, and a half-man-half-lizard just doesn't jive with the premise. Same goes for Mr. Freeze...I really don't see it being the best choice for this style of film.

I would laugh pretty hard, and then cry if the choice ended up being Ventriliquist or Clock King.


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## vampiregenocide

bostjan said:


> Nolan has said that there would be no Mr. Freeze nor Penguin.
> 
> I think that anything at this point is pure speculation, but I think Hush would be interesting as a villain in this series.
> 
> I highly doubt that Nolan would include Killer Croc in the film. These films have been very successful shunning the supernatural, and a half-man-half-lizard just doesn't jive with the premise. Same goes for Mr. Freeze...I really don't see it being the best choice for this style of film.
> 
> I would laugh pretty hard, and then cry if the choice ended up being Ventriliquist or Clock King.


 
Killer Croc could be done in the same vein as Reptile in the Mortal Kombat trailer, shame about Freeze. :/


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## OrsusMetal

They should do Clayface!  I always loved him.


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## synrgy

If done right (which I completely trust Nolan to do) I could see the Mad Hatter working well as a villain in this one.

In terms of putting butts in the seats though, having confirmed there's no Riddler, Penguin, or Freeze, my next guess is Catwoman. *sigh*


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## bostjan

The trouble with Catwoman is that it's been done. Again and again...

But I can totally see that being a possibility. If WB insists that the movie be 3-D and Nolan refuses, he'll probably have to make a concession about the characters, so maybe there will be a Catwoman or ...

Well, the most well-known are Joker, Catwoman, Riddler, and Penguin, and if Nolan says there will be no Joker, Riddler, or Penguin (or Mr. Freeze) and we don't expect Two Face to return, that really only leaves one well-known, which at least begs the question.


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## synrgy

Poison Ivy, maybe?

Hard to imagine anyone but Uma wub in that role, though..


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## MFB

Maybe have Harley Quinn doing some of Joker's work, and possibly Bane?


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## Marv Attaxx

I want Bane!!!

But who could play him?


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## Xaios

Gotta say, gonna need more info before I'm sold on the title. I trust Christopher Nolan, but the name just doesn't roll off the tongue.

I'm quite surprised though that they decided not to go with The Riddler as the villain, as he would have seemingly been the villain that would fit best into Nolan's interpretation of the Batman universe. Without him, there are only a limited set of options...




That is, unless Nolan decides to create an original villain...


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## MFB

Clayface would be a cool one, but if we're sticking with realistic possibilities then it's not likely  Doubtful they'd bring back Scarecrow as a legit villain instead of a supporting character like he's been, but it's plausible. 

Imagine if they did Red Hood!


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## Xaios

MFB said:


> Clayface would be a cool one, but if we're sticking with realistic possibilities then it's not likely  Doubtful they'd bring back Scarecrow as a legit villain instead of a supporting character like he's been, but it's plausible.
> 
> Imagine if they did Red Hood!



That would be difficult. The Red Hood's 2 main identities, The Joker and Jason Todd, aren't doable in Nolan's bat-verse. The Joker, for obvious reasons, and Jason Todd, because he was not only the second Robin (which is a character Nolan swore he never used), but also because he was killed by the Joker (hasn't happened, and can't happen in the current bat-verse), only to be ressurrected by Rha's al Ghul, who is also quite dead in the current bat-verse.

However, speaking of characters who's names are references to colored facial apparel, Black Mask would be a good choice. Not only does his character fit well into Nolan's Mob-centric storyline, but he also has a history that is tied closely to the Wayne family, as well as a life that mirrors Bruce Wayne's (Black Mask INTENTIONALLY burned down his parents' mansion, for example).

Also, no super powers.


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## MFB

Exactly, I know a Red Hood wouldn't be possible due to what's been mentioned, as well as Nolan would probably receive HUGE backlash for doing someone that would turn into the Joker and move in on Ledger's territory.

Black Mask could work, as well as using Dr. Hugo Strange


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## Daemoniac

vampiregenocide said:


> Killer Croc could be done in the same vein as Reptile in the Mortal Kombat trailer



Horribly?


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## MFB

Demoniac said:


> Horribly?





Thank God someone said it


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## Gameboypdc

+1 for The Mad Hatter! +2 if they have a huge spinning tea cup scene in a old warehouse.


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## vampiregenocide

Demoniac said:


> Horribly?


 
He was fucking awesome.


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## Daemoniac

He was an completely butchered version that bore absolutely no resemblance to the actual character (who, I might add, is awesome...).


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## vampiregenocide

Demoniac said:


> He was an completely butchered version that bore absolutely no resemblance to the actual character (who, I might add, is awesome...).


 
It was a modern adaption of it, but I thought it was a very well done one.


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## petereanima

No 3D, no Mr. Freeze = I'm sold.

Riddler could have been done very good, and i reallyreally hope he stays away from Catwoman.


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## Daemoniac

vampiregenocide said:


> It was a modern adaption of it, but I thought it was a very well done one.



Eh, to me they (like with every other aspect of that trailer) took out all of the interesting semi-supernatural elements of his character to replace them with some ridiculous "explicable" version that totally destroyed the core of the story. Same with Baraka 

On the topic of this movie though, I look forward to it


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## heavy7-665

Calendar Man - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deadshot


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## Daemoniac

^ Deadshot would be sweet as.


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## sakeido

Catwoman, catwoman, catwoman, pleeeease be catwoman 
Done a lot but the relationship between Batman/Catwoman & Bruce/Selina Kyle is so interesting to me.. plus Nolan blew up Bruce's love interest in the Dark Knight, so some kind of replacement is needed.. and also, Michelle Pfeifer and Halle Berry were both SMOKIN hot as Catwoman. 

I believe it was io9 that suspected Talia al Ghul or something like that, to bring it full circle back to Batman Begins


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## jaredowty

Talia al Ghul would work, seeing how it's a trilogy of films and that would be a great way to connect it back to Batman Begins. Can't really think of anyone else if they aren't using The Riddler. Surprising.


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## goth_fiend

two-face is out of the question as we all saw what happened in dark knight, I wouldnt mind seeing catwoman (jessica biel+skin tight leather=yessum ) harley quinn seems to be a likely choice as well, my dc universe knowledge is pretty limited so I only really know the "regulars" of the batman mythos (freeze, poison ivy, whom actually could work as some kind of serial killer who uses plant based toxins now that I think about it, clayface etc.) either way no 3d=godsend


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## synrgy

I don't really see how they could do Harley, not having established her character in any way when Joker was on screen. It's hard to invest in her until or unless you know that she's associated with one of the best villains of all time. Without Joker, Harley is more or less lame-sauce.. To me, anyway.

I'm still sad we won't get to see Joker's Trial (I guessed that's where this would have gone had Ledger not died during the filming of the last one..) and I'm also just a bit disappointed there won't be a Riddler. Jim Carey aside, I was imagining how cool it would be to see Nolan's take on the Riddler we saw in the animated series; almost robotic in his mannerisms, cold, calculating. I imagined that once one of Riddler's traps/games/whatever were in place, it would basically be like Batman meets Memento/Inception, and I was getting all hyped at the very idea of it. Not to be, I guess.

In The Dark Knight, Lucius Fox gives Wayne the new bat-armor, telling him something to the effect of "it'll do just fine against cats". Sneaky foreshadowing?

Then there's this guy:







He's an actor I actually like quite a bit and was in "The Dark Knight" as a Bank manager. The Joker said to him "I believe whatever doesnt kill you simply makes you stranger. Wouldn't mind seeing that be more than a catchy line.


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## bostjan

synrgy said:


> I don't really see how they could do Harley, not having established her character in any way when Joker was on screen. It's hard to invest in her until or unless you know that she's associated with one of the best villains of all time. Without Joker, Harley is more or less lame-sauce.. To me, anyway.







synrgy said:


> I'm still sad we won't get to see Joker's Trial (I guessed that's where this would have gone had Ledger not died during the filming of the last one..) and I'm also just a bit disappointed there won't be a Riddler. Jim Carey aside, I was imagining how cool it would be to see Nolan's take on the Riddler we saw in the animated series; almost robotic in his mannerisms, cold, calculating. I imagined that once one of Riddler's traps/games/whatever were in place, it would basically be like Batman meets Memento/Inception, and I was getting all hyped at the very idea of it. Not to be, I guess.







synrgy said:


> In The Dark Knight, Lucius Fox gives Wayne the new bat-armor, telling him something to the effect of "it'll do just fine against cats". Sneaky foreshadowing?



Or maybe that's what they want you to think. 



synrgy said:


> Then there's this guy:
> He's an actor I actually like quite a bit and was in "The Dark Knight" as a Bank manager. The Joker said to him "I believe whatever doesnt kill you simply makes you stranger. Wouldn't mind seeing that be more than a catchy line.



It'd be cool to see that guy turn into a super-villain. People like me always enjoy good tie-ins like that.


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## Skyblue

No Riddler? damn, I really wanted him to be the villian.... Nolan seems like someone that could make some awesome stuff with him. 
I really don't want it to be Catwoman to be honest- I have a feeling it won't end well :\ 

and yay for no 3D!


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## Anthony

synrgy said:


> He's an actor I actually like quite a bit and was in "The Dark Knight" as a Bank manager. The Joker said to him "I believe whatever doesnt kill you simply makes you stranger. Wouldn't mind seeing that be more than a catchy line.



I would love that, he's one of my favorite actors for a reason I don't quite understand.


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## conorreich

I think it would be great if they tied in Victor Zsasz somewhere in the new one. I think he would fit in perfectly in Christopher Nolans adaptation.


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## aslsmm

the mortal kombat movie was a college project that was hopfully going to become a movie but never did. and it wont from what i understand. if i remember correctly the people who made that trailer are trying to avoid a lawsuite from acclaim. presuming your talking about the scorpion assassin movie. 

as far as the dark knit rises is concerned, i love every movie nolan has put out. i hope batman gets some cough medacine before this film though cause i dont really like the over the top raspy voice that he has in the movies. also heath did such an amazing job as the riddler that id be okay with any villan as long as they get in to charachter like heath did. there is also some speculation that two face will be the villan. the second movie never confirmed his death. i would personally like to see scar crow rise from the ashes and quit getting his ass kicked. i think if they made him a focus on the third with the addition of cat woman or who ever, that would be bad ass


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## aslsmm

dude the bank manager is from a movie called drowning mona and it is the best movie ever!!!!!!!


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## Adam Of Angels

aslsmm said:


> the mortal kombat movie was a college project that was hopfully going to become a movie but never did. and it wont from what i understand. if i remember correctly the people who made that trailer are trying to avoid a lawsuite from acclaim. presuming your talking about the scorpion assassin movie.
> 
> as far as the dark knit rises is concerned, i love every movie nolan has put out. i hope batman gets some cough medacine before this film though cause i dont really like the over the top raspy voice that he has in the movies. also heath did such an amazing job as the riddler that id be okay with any villan as long as they get in to charachter like heath did. there is also some speculation that two face will be the villan. the second movie never confirmed his death. i would personally like to see scar crow rise from the ashes and quit getting his ass kicked. i think if they made him a focus on the third with the addition of cat woman or who ever, that would be bad ass


 

The raspy voice makes sense.. he just doesn't want anybody to know who he is, and if you sound like Bayle does, that's pretty much the only thing you can do to hide your voice.

I suspected that Two Face would be the villian in the next one, because they made it obvious that he wasn't dead.


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## Scar Symmetry

Here's to hoping it's better than the previous two Batman installments.

Call me Naive, but I'm expecting to Nolan to improve on Inception, which was a brilliant movie IMO. I'm hoping his integrity won't let him regress.


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## vampiregenocide

conorreich said:


> I think it would be great if they tied in Victor Zsasz somewhere in the new one. I think he would fit in perfectly in Christopher Nolans adaptation.


 
He's one of the inmates that escapes in the first film.



Scar Symmetry said:


> Here's to hoping it's better than the previous two Batman installments.
> 
> Call me Naive, but I'm expecting to Nolan to improve on Inception, which was a brilliant movie IMO. I'm hoping his integrity won't let him regress.


 
Man I have no issues with the past two Batman films, they're brilliant imo. Well written, well shot and well acted. Probably the best superhero films I've seen. I don't think he'll 'better' Inception, because that is a pretty immense film. I reckon he'll at least equal it though


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## Scar Symmetry

Equal is fine with me.

However, though the past 2 Batman films were better than they needed to be for films based on a comic book character, they don't hold a candle to some of the films that have withstood the test of time.


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## aslsmm

vampiregenocide said:


> He's one of the inmates that escapes in the first film.
> 
> 
> 
> Man I have no issues with the past two Batman films, they're brilliant imo. Well written, well shot and well acted. Probably the best superhero films I've seen. I don't think he'll 'better' Inception, because that is a pretty immense film. I reckon he'll at least equal it though


 

dude have you never seen teenage mutant ninja turtle 1-3?


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## vampiregenocide

Scar Symmetry said:


> Equal is fine with me.
> 
> However, though the past 2 Batman films were better than they needed to be for films based on a comic book character, they don't hold a candle to some of the films that have withstood the test of time.


 
Really? I felt what was good about the Batma films, particularly the Dark Knight, is exactly that point, that they can stand strongly against films of other genres. I thought TDK was a powerful film in itself, not just as a superhero film. I think its already become a classic in pop culture, something that takes other films a long time to achieve.


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## Scar Symmetry

vampiregenocide said:


> Really? I felt what was good about the Batma films, particularly the Dark Knight, is exactly that point, that they can stand strongly against films of other genres. I thought TDK was a powerful film in itself, not just as a superhero film. I think its already become a classic in pop culture, something that takes other films a long time to achieve.



You can't call a classic this early. The Dark Knight will never achieve The Godfather status, nor should it.

It's not a bad film, it's just not a great one either.


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## aslsmm

i hate the god father. it was super boring. but pulp fiction is a good classic. i think the dark knight will become a classic. so will batman begins, the prestige and inception. they are all really really well written and acted films.


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## Scar Symmetry

While I enjoy The Prestige I highly doubt that it will become a classic.

Pulp Fiction is a classic for obvious reasons.


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## vampiregenocide

Scar Symmetry said:


> You can't call a classic this early. The Dark Knight will never achieve The Godfather status, nor should it.
> 
> It's not a bad film, it's just not a great one either.


 
Okay I'm not saying its a real classic but I think it is respected as much as many classics. But fair dooze man different strokes n all that.


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## petereanima

I admit to LOVE the Dark Knight, and i also really enjoyed Batman Begins. But the truth is - without Ledgers over-the-top performance of the Joker (which i think it really was, and one of teh few cases where its not just overhyped mediocrity), TDK would have been "not bad, but..." at most.


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## conorreich

vampiregenocide said:


> He's one of the inmates that escapes in the first film.



Now I'm going to have to go back and watch it, I don't know how I missed that.


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## vampiregenocide

Yeah I do think Heath's performance made that film.


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## vampiregenocide

conorreich said:


> Now I'm going to have to go back and watch it, I don't know how I missed that.


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## Scar Symmetry

vampiregenocide said:


> Yeah I do think Heath's performance made that film.



Oh defo.

Sorry if I came off a bit obstinate yesterday, had a few glasses of vino haha.


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## vampiregenocide

Scar Symmetry said:


> Oh defo.
> 
> Sorry if I came off a bit obstinate yesterday, had a few glasses of vino haha.


 
Ha ha nah s'cool bro.


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## Decipher

vampiregenocide said:


>


 Good catch man. I totally missed that one. It would be cool if Nolan did use Victor Zsasz.

I also truely think we'll see Two-Face as the main villian in the Dark Night Rises. I could almost see this movie showcase a rise in Underground/Organized Crime led by Two-Face.....


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## vampiregenocide

I really think they're done with two-face. I know his death wasn't 'confirmed', but I think he's gone. The Joker aimed to make Gotham's white knight fall, and I think bringing him back in the next flm would undermine that, and therefore the Joker's whole 'plan'.

I think the next film will mainly focus on Batman's relationship with the police and the public, with a villain as more of a side story.


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## DaddleCecapitation

"The Dark Knight Rises" sounds like a porno.


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## aslsmm

i love bat porn


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## Prydogga

I thought the Dark Knight got a little out of hand with two face. I hope he's not returning as I thought he was fairly weak in interest as a villian, unlike the Joker.


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## Triple-J

And this just in..........*Tom Hardy = Bane! and..........Anne Hathaway = Catwoman!
*
I'm not 100% on Hathaway as she constantly looks like a frightened teenage girl not a woman and has starred in some absolute dreck so far but I've faith that Nolan has picked her cause he sees potential, I'm totally stoked about Hardy being Bane though as it's about time such a great character was done justice and there's no doubt he's the man to pull it off.


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## Scar Symmetry

Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.

Good news though!


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## vampiregenocide

I was not expecting Bane, interested to see how he has changed in Nolan's universe.


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## synrgy

FUCKING CATWOMAN?! 

I'd just like to point out that I totally called it, on the first page. 

My interest in this film just plummeted.


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## vampiregenocide

My bet is that she's not referred to as Catwoman in the film, just implied that she is.


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## Triple-J

vampiregenocide said:


> I was not expecting Bane, interested to see how he has changed in Nolan's universe.



I think it was a bit obvious he'd be Bane but bar the cheesy wrestler outfit I don't think much will be changed as much of the character could be altered to fit in. 
For example Bane uses a drug named venom to fuel him but this drug could easily be one which is made by the League of Shadows as we've already seen a similar plot point used in the 1st film plus Talia al ghul is supposed to be the 2nd villain in this film (Catwoman is a Batman inspired vigilante in this film not a bad guy) she just hasn't been cast/confirmed yet.


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## ROAR

Tom Hardy is great, but I don't know about Bane.
And Catwoman... Wow. I'm not really excited for this at the moment.
I thought Nolan would go the route of Batman being the villain and a
side story of someone like Scarecrow as the first movie did.
Though I have to say Nolan has never let me down and I hope after
some more info is released in later months I will be excited.


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## Adam Of Angels

Scar Symmetry said:


> Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.



You, sir, know know what you're talking about


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## setsuna7

It is also confirmed that the Batwing will be intorduced.. Seeing how bad ass the the Tumbler was..I wonder if this is gonna top that.


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## LUCKY7

To the Batpool!


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## Scar Symmetry

^ You've just been waiting for a chance to post that haven't you?


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## ROAR

From past movies featuring the Batwing and Catwoman,
I'm really not thrilled.


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## Scar Symmetry

ROAR said:


> From past movies featuring the Batwing and Catwoman,
> I'm really not thrilled.



I'd be more concerned with past Batman movies directed by Nolan. I think after Inception, he knows he has to take Batman up a seriously large notch.

If this film is anywhere near as good as Inception, I will be pleased.


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## JeffFromMtl

Scar Symmetry said:


> Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.


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## Xaios

Scar Symmetry said:


> Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.



This. I would do such terrible, yet such wonderful things to her. She is a goddess.


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## ROAR

Scar Symmetry said:


> I'd be more concerned with past Batman movies directed by Nolan. I think after Inception, he knows he has to take Batman up a seriously large notch.
> 
> If this film is anywhere near as good as Inception, I will be pleased.



I'm not worried about past films because they're amazing.
Batman Begins is class Nolan filming/story. It's an amazing re-boot
and most definitely IMO the best comic book movie I've seen.
Dark Knight takes that movie up a notch but not in a ridiculous way.
Although the more I think about me being wrong, i'm nervous about
Catwoman, the Batwing (if that happens), and Bane.
He's made everything else work though, so I'll most likely regret
everything I've said and all my worries. 
BUT SERIOUSLY?! CATWOMAN. BANE.
That is so random.... Bane..? He's not classic, he's from the 90's.
Though Tom Hardy is just a fantastic actor.

Until I see some more info after filming begins I will be worried
about what Nolan is doing. 
And he better not make that Superman movie.


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## sakeido

ROAR said:


> From past movies featuring the Batwing and Catwoman,
> I'm really not thrilled.



the best Batman movie is still Batman Returns with Michelle Pfiefer as Catwoman imo...


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## ROAR

sakeido said:


> the best Batman movie is still Batman Returns with Michelle Pfiefer as Catwoman imo...



She does give Arnold a run for his money.


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## sakeido

ROAR said:


> She does give Arnold a run for his money.



I'm deeply offended by that comparison and have come to the conclusion you have stupendously bad taste in everything


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## The Reverend

I struggle to think of a way they could top the last film. I don't even _like_ the Batman, and I loved that movie. Heath Ledger's performance was one of the best I've seen in my life, the plot was brilliant, seeing Two-Face was awesome, and most importantly, the pacing was absolutely _perfect_. The movie was an intense experience.

That being said, in keeping with the very dark atmosphere of Nolan's Batman universe, I don't know that many of the Batman's notable villains would translate well to film. Keep in mind that they were comic book characters, meant to be loud and splashy on the page. I think Nolan may have to go with a secondary villain here.


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## Rick

Scar Symmetry said:


> Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.



The only discussion is what would be done to her by me.


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## Xaios

Rick said:


> The only discussion is what would be done to her by me.



Hands off bucko, she's mine.


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## Rick

Xaios said:


> Hands off bucko, she's mine.



I'll cut you.


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## metalheadpunk

Scar Symmetry said:


> Anne Hathaway is hot as fuck, this is not up for discussion.
> 
> Good news though!


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## Daemoniac

Am I the only one here who thinks Hathaway just looks a bit plain?


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## The Reverend

Demoniac said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks Hathaway just looks a bit plain?



I think she's kinda plain. Actually, she's one of those conditionally attractive people. When her hair and makeup are done a certain way, and you see her from certain angles, she can be very pretty. 

I'm sure my rep is about to look like this-->


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## petereanima

I've learned my lesson and won't say now "this is going to be shit" - because thats what i did when i first heard "Heath Ledger will be the Joker" - here i stand corrected.

(Tough, i can understand Dave's point - take TDK, and leave Ledgers OUTSTANDING performance of the Joker aside...whats left? Not so much anymore...)

Nonetheless - i'm not as excited anymore, hearing that Catwoman will be in it...


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## aslsmm

setsuna7 said:


> It is also confirmed that the Batwing will be intorduced.. Seeing how bad ass the the Tumbler was..I wonder if this is gonna top that.


 

wait wait wait, like the bat plane bat wing or streached out ball skin batwing? haha, waiting reference ba-zing.


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## Triple-J

setsuna7 said:


> It is also confirmed that the Batwing will be intorduced.. Seeing how bad ass the the Tumbler was..I wonder if this is gonna top that.



I think thats just more bs made up by the media as the Warner Bros press release confirming the cast of TDKR made no mention of it anyway plus they had an opportunity to feature some kind of Bat-plane/copter during the hong kong scenes in TDK and that didn't happen.

I could be wrong but I suspect the most we will get in this one is maybe a new car as Nolan seems to prefer practical gadgets that serve a purpose within the movie not just some random Bat-vehicle to throw into a five minute set piece in order to sell toys to kids.



Demoniac said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks Hathaway just looks a bit plain?



Nope it's not just you man I think she is plain looking (maybe that's what Nolan's after though?) plus something about her eyebrows scares me and reminds me of Chris Noth but I'd rather have her than an ott hollywood sexpot like Angelina Jolie or Megan Fox as they'd distract from the movie and overshadow the rest of the cast. 
Anne Hathaway's looks aren't the main concern here though it's the fact that Catwoman is a streetwise athletic character and is supposed to be able to hold her own in a fight against both male and female criminals and Batman himself but Hathaway looks like she couldn't fight her way out of a wet paperbag.


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## Scar Symmetry

petereanima said:


> I've learned my lesson and won't say now "this is going to be shit" - because thats what i did when i first heard "Heath Ledger will be the Joker" - here i stand corrected.
> 
> (Tough, i can understand Dave's point - take TDK, and leave Ledgers OUTSTANDING performance of the Joker aside...whats left? Not so much anymore...





You know, it's funny. Each time I watch The Dark Knight, I'm less impressed by Ledger's performance. Last time I watched it, I was left with the impression that he did little more than the rest of the cast. I know it's not true, but maybe the novelty wears off after time. One thing I did notice about the film is one of the rooftop scenes where Gordon and Dent interrupt each other - that take should've been a blooper.


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## Decipher

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think with Catwoman being in this movie. I have total faith in Nolan and what he will do with this movie/characters but I would've rather seen some other villians instead. Bane is an interesting choice for sure and I'm very intrigued as to how Hardy will play that out.


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## aslsmm

Scar Symmetry said:


> You know, it's funny. Each time I watch The Dark Knight, I'm less impressed by Ledger's performance. Last time I watched it, I was left with the impression that he did little more than the rest of the cast. I know it's not true, but maybe the novelty wears off after time. One thing I did notice about the film is one of the rooftop scenes where Gordon and Dent interrupt each other - that take should've been a blooper.


 
thats funny cause i saw a clip of it on TV just yesterday and was thinking "damn heath blew this film up" i agree that with out his performance the movie would have been blah, but his performance was "insane in the membrane, insane in the brain."


----------



## vampiregenocide

I think the Dark Knight was a generally superb film, the acting was good all around, but Ledger's performance was so good the rest suffered in comparison.

I literally have no idea how this next film is going to go. Nolan could do anything with it, so its hard to judge. I am interested to see how they do Bane and Catwpman though. Bane is cool but a bit OTT for what I expected from Nolan, and Catwoman whose spin-off was poorly recieved and imo she's more eye candy than an interesting character.


----------



## ROAR

vampiregenocide said:


> I think the Dark Knight was a generally superb film, the acting was good all around, but Ledger's performance was so good the rest suffered in comparison.
> 
> I literally have no idea how this next film is going to go. Nolan could do anything with it, so its hard to judge. I am interested to see how they do Bane and Catwpman though. Bane is cool but a bit OTT for what I expected from Nolan, and Catwoman whose spin-off was poorly recieved and imo she's more eye candy than an interesting character.



This. 
I just can't buy into Bane or Catwoman.


----------



## Xaios

ROAR said:


> This.
> I just can't buy into Bane or Catwoman.



Look at it this way. Coming into Batman Begins, who would have "bought" the Scarecrow? Even in the comic books, he was pretty well a secondary villain and no one really took him seriously. Along comes Christopher Nolan who manages to turn it into a villain with real menace with believable motivation and a credible reason as to why he is able to do what he does.

After the original Batman, who could have envisioned a movie Joker that was any different from Jack Nicholson's mad-happy clown, with his giant pistol and ridiculous clown gags? Along comes Christopher Nolan who transforms the character into an elemental force who's both completely psychotic, yet somehow completely grounded as well. A character who can tear the moral fabric of his victims to threads.

And lest we forget Tommy Lee Jones' rendition of Harvey Dent. I mean, seriously... there are no words. This was about as two-dimensional a character as you could possibly come up with. Along comes Christopher Nolan, who takes the time to develop the character and give insight into what makes him tick, and then convincingly destroys what he holds dear, in order to give us a villain that, unlike the Joker who is meant to be awed but not understood by the average person, we can understand and sympathize with.

All this to say, at this point, I think Christopher Nolan has earned our trust in matters of creating real and organic characters, not caricatures, and placing them in believable circumstances, thus letting them evolve naturally.


----------



## ROAR

Xaios said:


> Look at it this way. Coming into Batman Begins, who would have "bought" the Scarecrow? Even in the comic books, he was pretty well a secondary villain and no one really took him seriously. Along comes Christopher Nolan who manages to turn it into a villain with real menace with believable motivation and a credible reason as to why he is able to do what he does.
> 
> After the original Batman, who could have envisioned a movie Joker that was any different from Jack Nicholson's mad-happy clown, with his giant pistol and ridiculous clown gags? Along comes Christopher Nolan who transforms the character into an elemental force who's both completely psychotic, yet somehow completely grounded as well. A character who can tear the moral fabric of his victims to threads.
> 
> And lest we forget Tommy Lee Jones' rendition of Harvey Dent. I mean, seriously... there are no words. This was about as two-dimensional a character as you could possibly come up with. Along comes Christopher Nolan, who takes the time to develop the character and give insight into what makes him tick, and then convincingly destroys what he holds dear, in order to give us a villain that, unlike the Joker who is meant to be awed but not understood by the average person, we can understand and sympathize with.
> 
> All this to say, at this point, I think Christopher Nolan has earned our trust in matters of creating real and organic characters, not caricatures, and placing them in believable circumstances, thus letting them evolve naturally.



I thought of all that, but not as in-depth.
You have now changed my mind.
Thank you!


----------



## Sepultorture

i saw both movies, and i loved the first, doubted the heath ledger choice on the second, was immediately floored by his performance and like many proven wrong that the choice would be a disaster.

so i don't doubt for a second that this will be a huge epic and, because of the bain character, BRUTAL.

also i can see very well that this could be a very grounded movie easily. as for catwoman, so far they only said Celina Kyle. they may come at it from the dominatrix role, or the jewel thief one, she may nopt dress up like catwoman, yuh never know, but you know this is gunna be his love interest, and will be very interesting due to their opposite sides, him the hero, her the thief


----------



## petereanima

Sepultorture said:


> as for catwoman, so far they only said Celina Kyle.



Ha, totally missed that little detail! Thanks for pointing out. That gives these news a bit a different touch.


----------



## synrgy

Xaios said:


> Look at it this way. Coming into Batman Begins, who would have "bought" the Scarecrow?



Me! He was pretty damn crazy in Batman: The Animated Series. 

That's the thing. I just feel like the Catwoman character was always the weakest link. There's essentially no reason for her to exist other than to score a few points with the 'why aren't there any female superheroes' crowd and maybe a few boners with the young guys.

Actually, I take that back. Penguin was the weakest link, but Catwoman was right behind him. (Hence why I still feel that Batman Returns was the worst of any of the Batman movies... And that includes the Adam West film! )

All that said, Nolan has certainly earned my trust over the years, and I do hope he'll prove me wrong about the character. I'm just guessing that he must see something I don't.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Xaios said:


> All this to say, at this point, I think Christopher Nolan has earned our trust in matters of creating real and organic characters, not caricatures, and placing them in believable circumstances, thus letting them evolve naturally.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

synrgy said:


> I'm just guessing that he must see something I don't.



That's highly likely


----------



## Xaios

Scar Symmetry said:


> That's highly likely



Yeah, Chris Nolan definitely has a knack for seeing the potential in his actors.

I do have to say this though. When he cast Heath Ledger as The Joker, I think I was one of the very few people who defended the choice at the time. Heath Ledger didn't have the body of work to show it yet, but I always thought he was always the best part of whatever movies he was working on. He had a way of channeling the overall quality of the films in which he starred into his performances and amplifying it. I mean, let's face it, A Knight's Tale isn't a very good film from a critical standpoint, but he makes it highly enjoyable viewing. Even before he was cast in The Dark Knight, I always thought he was a better actor than what his past body of work really showed.


----------



## Triple-J

synrgy said:


> That's the thing. I just feel like the Catwoman character was always the weakest link. There's essentially no reason for her to exist other than to score a few points with the 'why aren't there any female superheroes' crowd and maybe a few boners with the young guys.



That's the opinion of many people who haven't read the comics and considering the very cliched way she's been portrayed in tv/movies/games I can see why but Catwoman has existed without Batman in her own series of comics for 20+ years now so she's far from being a weak character.
I think Nolan is very aware that most people think of Catwoman/Selina Kyle the same way you do and that there's a set of characteristics/cliches people associate with her so I imagine his version of the character has been designed to avoid all these cliches and be more faithful to comics than previous movie/tv versions after all he's already done a similar thing to the Joker so why not Catwoman too?


----------



## vampiregenocide

Xaios said:


> All this to say, at this point, I think Christopher Nolan has earned our trust in matters of creating real and organic characters, not caricatures, and placing them in believable circumstances, thus letting them evolve naturally.


 
Oh I agree, but the Joker and Scarecrow are both characters that I could imagine translating well into a modern, realistic setting like Nolan's films. Bane and Catwoman seem a little bit trickier to work with, but I am very interested to see how he works with them. Being that Bane is a bit of a two-dimensional character, all muscle and not much else, it will be cool to see how Nolan fleshes him out. I think he'll be a real test for Batman, seeing as he's never really fought against someone physically more powerful than him. Hell, in the comics, Bane breaks his back and puts him in critical condition for ages. Maybe Nolan will build on the drug part and make Bane into a sort of tragic villain, at the mercy of an addiction. I mean that was never really humanised enough in the renditions I've seen.


----------



## sakeido

Selina Kyle = Bruce love interest
Catwoman = Batman love interest 
Selina/Catwoman's dual identity is pretty obvious foil for Bruce/Batman's. Especially with Batman publicly becoming a villain at the end of Dark Knight, you could do a lot with it.. why did Nolan's Kyle become Catwoman? what does she want to gain? what does she have in mind for Batman? can also be a source of potential conflict for Bruce.. I'm hoping the third movie has a little bit more of that so that its more like Batman Begins and less like Dark Knight.

I've said it before and will say it again Dark Knight is only good the first time around and shows its rough edges more and more with each subsequent viewing.. same as any other movie that depends on plot twists and inexplicable developments to move the story along. Batman Begins, on the other hand, doesn't have that same problem because it is much more character driven. IMO

He's not going to tie himself to what has happened in the comics at all. Bane isn't just a muscle-bound bruiser, either.. he certainly looks the part but he is quite intelligent as well.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Maybe seeing Batman become a villain inspires Selina to take his place, or maybe even take him down. Then obviously she would discover it was false, and try to help him get some respect back in the public eye.

And depends on the depiction, sometimes he's not much of a character, but other times Bane is more intelligent and intimidating. It depends what Nolan goes with.


----------



## heavy7-665

vampiregenocide said:


> Maybe seeing Batman become a villain inspires Selina to take his place, or maybe even take him down. Then obviously she would discover it was false, and try to help him get some respect back in the public eye.
> 
> And depends on the depiction, sometimes he's not much of a character, but other times Bane is more intelligent and intimidating. It depends what Nolan goes with.



This.

Although I believe Deadshot would have translated well also.


----------



## ROAR

After some researching n such
I found out Bane pretty much the smartest 
sane villain Batman ever face, and also
broke his back and defeated him and what not.
So after reading about him it seems pretty interesting
seeing as Nolan had a much different way of thinking
through things than we might.
He's like... a god!
or valor.


----------



## Plankis

I'm not worried. Nolan seems to be unable to do anything less than awesome, poor man. 
I'm very much looking forward to the soundtrack as well! Hans Zimmer is on a incredible roll too. The Inception soundtrack is one of the best albums that came out last year. So I got high hopes on that too.


----------



## synrgy

Triple-J said:


> That's the opinion of many people who haven't read the comics and considering the very cliched way she's been portrayed in tv/movies/games I can see why but Catwoman has existed without Batman in her own series of comics for 20+ years now so she's far from being a weak character.



I'm certainly familiar with most of the Miller books, but I'll admit I've never touched a Catwoman comic.

I just feel there were better options. Again, I have full faith in Nolan and I'm sure he'll surprise me yet. I just find myself apprehensive about the character choice, is all.


----------



## vampiregenocide

I wonde rif they include the back breaking in the film. That was a big event in Batman's life.


----------



## synrgy

vampiregenocide said:


> I wonde rif they include the back breaking in the film. That was a big event in Batman's life.



Big event? Yes. Good for a 2 hour on-screen story arc? Not so much. I don't think anybody wants to watch Bruce Wayne going through physical therapy through half the film. 

Then again, it seems to have worked for Harry Potter. DH part 1 basically includes an hour of them walking around the forest being emo.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Yeah but they can fast forward long periods of time in the film, as the first one took place over many years.


----------



## pink freud

As good as an actor Tom Hardy is, I don't think he has the right build for Bane. Even when he is bulked up, hie looks like a muscular average build. Bane needs a seven foot tall guy with a shoulder to shoulder width of an ox.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Dude, Hardy was fucking huge as Bronson. Besides, you don't want someone too huge otherwise itsa bit over the top for the Nolan continuity.


----------



## ROAR

vampiregenocide said:


> Dude, Hardy was fucking huge as Bronson. Besides, you don't want someone too huge otherwise itsa bit over the top for the Nolan continuity.



Exactly! Bronson was also an amazing film acting wise.
Pretty strange for my taste but Hardy is badass.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

He'll bulk up, but if he's not big enough they'll CGI him until he's the appropriate size.


----------



## Triple-J

synrgy said:


> I'm certainly familiar with most of the Miller books, but I'll admit I've never touched a Catwoman comic.
> 
> I just feel there were better options. Again, I have full faith in Nolan and I'm sure he'll surprise me yet. I just find myself apprehensive about the character choice, is all.


 
I see what you mean as I was very sceptical about the Scarecrow being in Batman Begins as he always came across as a D-list bad guy and minor character not big enough to be a main bad guy but Nolan really revitalised the character and Cillian Murphy portrayed him as a genuine creep not just a guy in a dumb straw outfit. 
If you've never read a Catwoman story give the "When in rome" graphic novel a go as it's one of the best stories of recent years and it's one which has been mentioned as being an inspiration for Dark Knight Rises plus there's a pretty cool twist about her being related to an existing character in it which I think Nolan may use in this film.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

I'm in my second playthrough of Arkham Asylum and I like how they've taken leaves out of Nolan's book and woven in darker themes. The Dark Knight and Batman Begins were obviously influences on the game, the dev team must be big fans.


----------



## MrGignac

was bane a scientist in the comic at some point?

I give Nolan total props for taking a played out franchise and modernizing it. 
also, if you havent seen his earlier film "memento" i recommend it for inception fans


----------



## vampiregenocide

@Scar - Yeah I'm pretty sure I read that the makers of AA liked the darker feel of the films, and kept that in mind when making the game. Worked beautifully imo, can't wait for Arkham City.

@Gignac - Memento is amazing. Great film.


----------



## The Reverend

Well it's also not like Nolan is really responsible for this Batman. Don't forget that the Dark Knight was Nolan's inspiration. Batman hasn't always been campy, especially in the books.


----------



## ROAR

If you like Memento watch Following.


----------



## Triple-J

The Reverend said:


> Well it's also not like Nolan is really responsible for this Batman. Don't forget that the Dark Knight was Nolan's inspiration. Batman hasn't always been campy, especially in the books.





All Nolan has done is bring a more direct adaptation of the character from the comics to the big screen which is what I love about them so much as I've always felt most tv/movie versions of Batman have been in the shadow of the horrendous 60's show and even Tim "ooh I'm so dark me" Burton's Batman movies weren't that different from it either.


----------



## Sepultorture

anyoent hat thinks Bane is not a good fit should look into his back story, he's ruthless, cunning, extremely educated, and his muscles are just tools, not his only power.

i think the drug thing will appear in the film, as for it making him HUGE, i doubt it, i think he will make that REAL somehow

but i do see the Bane mask making an appearance


----------



## vampiregenocide

Triple-J said:


> All Nolan has done is bring a more direct adaptation of the character from the comics to the big screen which is what I love about them so much as I've always felt most tv/movie versions of Batman have been in the shadow of the horrendous 60's show and even Tim "ooh I'm so dark me" Burton's Batman movies weren't that different from it either.


 
Its not so much the darkness of it, but the realism. You kinda forget its a comic book movie, because the characters could so easily be real. Thats what impressive about it, dragging such a franchise into the real world.


As for the Bane mask, it could quite easily be a regular balaclava that just looks a bit different. Don't want him looking like a masked wrestler though.


----------



## Triple-J

I see what you mean about the realism as the best Batman stories have always been the most realistic and unlike a lot of other DC/Marvel characters Batman doesn't tend to do well in plots that have ott fantasy/sci-fi elements in them cause unlike other comic book characters he's just a detective at heart not a superhero. 
I think one of the other ways in which Nolan achieves this sense of realism is by not hammering his movies with a ton of half baked cgi as a lot of things in his films are built and cgi is used very sparingly and when it is used it's sometimes very hard to spot plus cgi tends to distract you from a film and pull you out of the story especially when it's not done well. 

As for Bane I was thinking the same thing myself as the Bane costume could easily be combat pants a black vest and a balaclava and he'd still be recognisable.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Maybe Bane will be a 'mercernary' hired by the city to kill Batman?


----------



## Triple-J

Joseph Gordon Levitt has been confirmed in an "unspecified role" I think it was obvious he'd make the TDKR cast after making Inception with Nolan but I'm really curious as to whether he's going to be a main character in the film or just a minor one.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

So seeing as Christian Bale is a through-and-through method actor, is he going to go and break his back?

If he doesn't he's wimping out IMO.


----------



## synrgy

Triple-J said:


> Joseph Gordon Levitt has been confirmed in an "unspecified role" I think it was obvious he'd make the TDKR cast after making Inception with Nolan but I'm really curious as to whether he's going to be a main character in the film or just a minor one.



That's good news. I have been thoroughly impressed with him in almost every film I've seen him in. For such a young actor he's made a lot of really good choices. He seems to avoid the phone-it-in roles most young actors take like voices in the latest CGI-cartoon or roles in one of the prototypical teen horror flicks.

Also,  @ Dave's comment about Bale and method acting. I completely agree!


----------



## vampiregenocide

Triple-J said:


> Joseph Gordon Levitt has been confirmed in an "unspecified role" I think it was obvious he'd make the TDKR cast after making Inception with Nolan but I'm really curious as to whether he's going to be a main character in the film or just a minor one.


 
He might be a precursor for a bigger part in a future film maybe? I reckon he'd make a good Riddler.


----------



## Triple-J

Scar Symmetry said:


> So seeing as Christian Bale is a through-and-through method actor, is he going to go and break his back?
> 
> If he doesn't he's wimping out IMO.



Bale is such a hardcore method actor I'm sure that he's already hired both Brock Lesnar and Randy Couture of the UFC to storm into his house wearing Bane costumes trash all his furniture give him a severe beatdown and break his back.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Triple-J said:


> Bale is such a hardcore method actor I'm sure that he's already hired both Brock Lesnar and Randy Couture of the UFC to storm into his house wearing Bane costumes trash all his furniture give him a severe beatdown and break his back.



That's what I like to hear


----------



## vampiregenocide

He's probably been going to various UFC matches and hitting on the fighter's girlfriends.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

vampiregenocide said:


> He's probably been going to various UFC matches and hitting on the fighter's girlfriends.



And then crapping in the driver seat of their cars for good measure.


----------



## sakeido

Scar Symmetry said:


> And then crapping in the driver seat of their cars for good measure.



whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat  but, why?


----------



## lobee

Scar Symmetry said:


> So seeing as Christian Bale is a through-and-through method actor, is he going to go and break his back?
> 
> If he doesn't he's wimping out IMO.


I hear Christian Bale has been walking around the sets of Tom Hardy's latest projects inspecting the lights during his scenes and trying to get Tom to snap and break his back.


----------



## Vicissitude27

Scar Symmetry said:


> So seeing as Christian Bale is a through-and-through method actor, is he going to go and break his back?
> 
> If he doesn't he's wimping out IMO.


----------



## CrushingAnvil

Marv Attaxx said:


> I want Bane!!!
> 
> But who could play him?



"Woah, chill the fuck out...










...I got this"








 I hope not.


----------



## ThePinealGland

Mickey Rourke should play Bane.


----------



## Nick1

ARRRGGGHHH!!!! I cant wait to see what Nolan is going to make Bane look like. I assume its going to be very different from the Batman Forever version of Bane.


----------



## Nights_Blood

Dominic Purcell from Prison Break, if they gave Bane's character the depth it's supposed to have, not some mindless fuck like in "Batman and Robin".


----------



## vampiregenocide

It'd be really interesting to see a character that breaks the cliche of 'strong but dumb' bad guys.


----------



## Ibanezsam4

i read this thread and see people are picking who they want to play bane... im confused considering the part has been cast


----------



## vampiregenocide

I think people are saying who they'd want to play him, rather than who is. I think Tom Hardy will be good though.


----------



## Triple-J

Marianne Cottillard has also been confirmed for the movie I think she was an obvious choice considering her role in Inception but a lot of people seem to think she's going to play Talia Al Ghul which would fit in with Bane quite nicely as he could be working with/for the league of shadows as he has done in the later comics.

But the news I'm most excited about is that Hans Zimmer has been talking about his score for this movie....

*"The one thing I can tell you, is that it's going to be a lot more epic. Extraordinarily epic." *
*"...It's like, 'What's epic these days?' I think there's something in the core of the story that allows you to get the music much bigger and much more sort of, iconic**."* 

This to me is a big hint that the character will finally get a theme tune in this film (the lack of one in Nolan's bat movies so far is something a lot of people whinged about) and those who've followed Zimmer's work will remember that during the press interviews for Batman Begins he revealed that him and James Newton Howard actually came up with one but they didn't feel it was appropriate to use it as the character wasn't quite a fully formed "hero" yet so they kept it aside for future use. ​


----------



## Scar Symmetry

vampiregenocide said:


> I think people are saying who they'd want to play him, rather than who is. I think Tom Hardy will be good though.



Mate I think he will be fantastic. I really don't get why people are concerned over him being given the role.



Triple-J said:


> Marianne Cottillard has also been confirmed for the movie I think she was an obvious choice considering her role in Inception but a lot of people seem to think she's going to play Talia Al Ghul which would fit in with Bane quite nicely as he could be working with/for the league of shadows as he has done in the later comics.



Great news.



Triple-J said:


> But the news I'm most excited about is that Hans Zimmer has been talking about his score for this movie....
> 
> *"The one thing I can tell you, is that it's going to be a lot more epic. Extraordinarily epic." *
> *"...It's like, 'What's epic these days?' I think there's something in the core of the story that allows you to get the music much bigger and much more sort of, iconic**."*
> 
> This to me is a big hint that the character will finally get a theme tune in this film (the lack of one in Nolan's bat movies so far is something a lot of people whinged about) and those who've followed Zimmer's work will remember that during the press interviews for Batman Begins he revealed that him and James Newton Howard actually came up with one but they didn't feel it was appropriate to use it as the character wasn't quite a fully formed "hero" yet so they kept it aside for future use. ​



THANK GOD. The Batman Begins and Dark Knight scores really let me down in a big way. We all know Zimmer still has it as he evidenced on Inception, so there's no need for bat cape sounds in 4/4 for HALF THE BLOODY FILM as he chose to do on both Begins and Dark Knight 

I hope Zimmer lets Howard breathe in this score too because I know Howard is capable of producing work equal to if not sometimes better than Zimmer. Begins and Dark Knight were dominated by Zimmer's work, which wasn't great.

Can't wait to hear Batman Goes Epic.


----------



## Skyblue

Marion Cottilard... can't say I'm overjoyed, cause I didn't really like her in Inception, but no real complaints, I'm sure she'll do great.


----------



## Triple-J

Scar Symmetry said:


> THANK GOD. The Batman Begins and Dark Knight scores really let me down in a big way. We all know Zimmer still has it as he evidenced on Inception, so there's no need for bat cape sounds in 4/4 for HALF THE BLOODY FILM as he chose to do on both Begins and Dark Knight
> 
> I hope Zimmer lets Howard breathe in this score too because I know Howard is capable of producing work equal to if not sometimes better than Zimmer. Begins and Dark Knight were dominated by Zimmer's work, which wasn't great.
> 
> Can't wait to hear Batman Goes Epic.



I like the soundtrack to Begins and think it's a good starting point as it has a quiet/loud dynamic to it which is similar to the title character but it's really TDK which let me down as it had some good pieces but overall it just wasn't enough of a progression really and failed to build upon the foundation of the Batman Begins soundtrack.


----------



## vampiregenocide

I liked TDK soundtrack, but Inception was better.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Triple-J said:


> I like the soundtrack to Begins and think it's a good starting point as it has a quiet/loud dynamic to it which is similar to the title character but it's really TDK which let me down as it had some good pieces but overall it just wasn't enough of a progression really and failed to build upon the foundation of the Batman Begins soundtrack.



Absolutely. The Batman Begins score was fine on it's own, but when they basically recycled the score for TDK, it ruined both for me. Cape strokes on every beat in 4/4 does _not_ represent what Hans is capable of nor what he should be allowed to get away with using for more than 10 seconds.


----------



## Xaios

The score would have done fine in both movies if it was distinctive enough, but it was just too basic, all things considered, and it basically faded into the background. Granted, I think it was designed to do just that.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Xaios said:


> The score would have done fine in both movies if it was distinctive enough, but it was just too basic, all things considered, and it basically faded into the background. Granted, I think it was designed to do just that.



I agree and yes I'm sure it was, it may even have been what Nolan asked for, but hopefully we'll see both Zimmer and Newton flexing their muscles this time round.


----------



## Triple-J

Figured I'd bump this as the 1st official trailer is due before the end of this week! (it plays with the new Harry Potter film) and throw in some updates..... 

James Newton Howard has officially dropped out of the the soundtrack for this so it's Hans Zimmer going solo but the Zimmermeister has spoken a lot about aiming for a more "epic" score recently and has also been a little critical about the previous score for TDK.

*"I've been listening to a lot of Verdi lately," he says. "And Alison Goldfrapp, and a lot of electronica as I'm heading into Dark Knight territory again."*
*"Of course I'll try to make it different, but I'm not going to abandon the musical language of the previous film. It's a matter of knocking down some walls and making it broader, wider and more epic."*​
Tom Hardy is apparently back into the same kind of shape he was in for "Bronson" and has put on over two stone so this means no cgi muscles or crap "Vinny Jones in Xmen-3" style prosthetics for Bane (thank god!)

A character from Batman Begins _*will*_ return I won't mention his name but it's been hinted at on the past few pages of this thread and fans of the comic will have guessed who it is already.


----------



## Xaios

Triple-J said:


> A character from Batman Begins _*will*_ return I won't mention his name but it's been hinted at on the past few pages of this thread and fans of the comic will have guessed who it is already.



Is it... Batman?


----------



## MFB

I HIGHLY doubt we'll see anything from the movie in this supposed "Trailer" versus it just being a teaser like they did for TDK; where it was some dialogue, then you had Joker saying "I'm a man of my word" over the new blue Bat logo.


----------



## Triple-J

MFB said:


> I HIGHLY doubt we'll see anything from the movie in this supposed "Trailer" versus it just being a teaser like they did for TDK; where it was some dialogue, then you had Joker saying "I'm a man of my word" over the new blue Bat logo.



I thought that myself but a version of it recorded on a mobile has emerged (and been taken down) on youtube within the past few hours all of the news sites I've hit on have said it begins with clips from BB & TDK then reveals Jim Gordon in a hospital bed begging Bruce Wayne to bring back Batman then cuts to a fight between Batman and Bane!!

I haven't actually had a chance to track it down yet but the fact that Warner Bros has taken down just about every link I've found for it makes me think that this one is actually legit but I guess we'll have to wait a day or so for the official reveal now anyway.


----------



## jaredowty

I saw the trailer. Looks legit.


----------



## Nick1

GRRRR! I hate how trailers ruin ALL the best scenes of the movies. Although I really want to see this one and summer 2012 is a long fucking wait!


----------



## Ninetyfour

Warner Bros. have taken the trailer down pretty much everywhere, anybody got a mirror?


----------



## Triple-J

Nick1 said:


> GRRRR! I hate how trailers ruin ALL the best scenes of the movies. Although I really want to see this one and summer 2012 is a long fucking wait!



I finally managed to see the trailer last night and to be fair it avoids making the typical Hollywood mistake of blowing the best scenes in two minutes and if anything it's now made me very curious about how things play out especially in regards to the fate of Jim Gordon. 
Overall it's actually a very well constructed and balanced trailer as it doesn't reveal much but what it does show draws you in and really whets you're appetite for the movie which is what any good trailer should do really.


----------



## petereanima

I hate myself for searching this teaser, and actually watching shittons of "fan-made-trailers" that are horseshite.


----------



## vampiregenocide




----------



## Marv Attaxx

I'm so glad it's Bane 
Can't wait to see what nolan is gonna do with this character


----------



## Black_Sheep

Batman Begins was good. Certainly the best Batman movie ever made (at the moment of course, Dark Knight definetly topped it) if you ask me. 

The Dark Knight was a masterpiece. I had huge expectations towards it, and it delivered. It's one of my all time favorite movies. And Ledger's performance is one of the best i've ever seen. 

These two movies also made me really apreciate Chris Nolan, so i checked out his other movies as well, and find them great too. Especially The Prestige, it's just great. 

So, naturally, i have very high expections for this one. The last Batman movie by Nolan. It will be extremely hard to top Dark Knight, but seeing how awesome Inception was, im sure he and other guys can do it. 

Is there an official trailer out yet? I haven't seen one, and i don't think there is one. Fan made trailers are always crap. Especially since in the worst case they take footage from other movies and videos. It's just stupid.


----------



## GazPots

The official trailer got leaked then Warner Bros. made the sites take it down.


They are due to release the official one now or around a day or so from now.


----------



## Black_Sheep

Alright. Thanks for the info!  

Im very excited to see that one. I remember when i saw the Dark Knight trailer, it was great


----------



## Behaving_badly

very excited for this

2012 seems like it may be good for movies, already got Dark Night Rises, plus first installment of the Hobbit


----------



## MFB

Saw trailer; am pumped.


----------



## Triple-J

MFB said:


> Saw trailer; am pumped.



I must have watched it 8 times or more before the link got taken down!  

There's still nothing on the films official site (http://thedarkknightrises.warnerbros.com/) but Harry Potter is released today so I guess it'll be up there within the next 24 hours.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Yeah I just saw a very crappy version of the trailer. Does show a little bit here and there.


----------



## Black_Sheep

Didn't see it. I just searched it from youtube, and all i got was a fan made trailer. Blah. 

Is it available anywhere? 

...Why won't they just release it. It would be better for all...


----------



## technomancer

Given it's showing before the new Harry Potter in theaters now I'd say it will show up online soon


----------



## ROAR

The trailer on the HP film was intense.
I can't wait for a theatrical trailer now.
Wow.


----------



## Triple-J

For those who haven't seen the teaser trailer with HP yet it's now here! The Dark Knight Rises


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Err... what? Lame name for a film, lame trailer consisting mainly of clips from the previous two films... why even bother? Even the music is anticlimatic.


----------



## vampiregenocide

It said enough for me to be excited. I'm guessing that final fight takes place in Arkham, sounds like the cheering of prisoners. Maybe in Batman's abscence Bane manages to take control of the criminal underworld and Arkham, injuring Gordon as he tries to contain things. Hence, Batman has to come out of hiding and 'rise' to become the knight of Gotham once again. Would kinda tie in with the new game as well.


----------



## ROAR

Scar Symmetry said:


> Err... what? Lame name for a film, lame trailer consisting mainly of clips from the previous two films... why even bother? Even the music is anticlimatic.



It's a teaser trailer.
The previous film clips build up the story
showing his beginnings and then when he is
finally "on top" as the Knight of Gotham,
before he falls.


The trailer makes me mad just because I want
to see this film now. It looks incredible and Nolan
has never let me down.


----------



## Black_Sheep

Nice trailer. Not great, but nice. Hopefully there will be a longer one in the next months. 

Can't wait to see this movie!


----------



## Xaios

If I recall, the first Dark Knight teaser was simply dialogue in the background with a picture of the Batman logo exploding. This seems a liiittle more descriptive, so I'm happy.


----------



## sakeido

I thought the new trailer was horrible... the new footage seemed horribly written and acted, the Bane costume looked dumb, and the music sucked.


----------



## vampiregenocide

sakeido said:


> I thought the new trailer was horrible... the new footage seemed horribly written and acted, the Bane costume looked dumb, and the music sucked.


 
Dude...why so serious?


----------



## sakeido

vampiregenocide said:


> Dude...why so serious?


why would I not be serious? Dark Knight was an extremely serious movie and it has extremely serious fans. The third one can only be worse.. and all the taglines they jammed into the trailer kinda demand you take it seriously.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

I dunno, I think it looked pretty sweet. Looked like a lot was going on. Robin Williams playing another bad guy? That's what's up. Anne Hathaway could play a balding retard in a Ronald McDonald outfit and still be gorgeous.


----------



## Marv Attaxx

^ I think you saw the fake trailer on youtube 'cause robin williams isn't in the movie 
Looked pretty "real" though


----------



## vampiregenocide

Sorry did I miss something with the Robin Williams thing? 



sakeido said:


> why would I not be serious? Dark Knight was an extremely serious movie and it has extremely serious fans. The third one can only be worse.. and all the taglines they jammed into the trailer kinda demand you take it seriously.


 

Either you missed my reference or I wasn't obvious enough that I was joking.


----------



## Marv Attaxx

Fake trailer with robin williams


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Wow, ok, yeah I did miss that. Scratch everything I said, with the exception of Anne Hathaway being hot.


----------



## Triple-J

sakeido said:


> I thought the new trailer was horrible... the new footage seemed horribly written and acted, the Bane costume looked dumb, and the music sucked.



In regards to footage they only began filming at end of May so there's probably not many suitable scenes to choose from right now and as for the music Zimmer will compose the bulk of that when Nolan can get a rough edit of the film to him which probably won't be until sept/oct anyway.

Personally I like the trailer despite it's OTT taglines (they were different in the version which was taken down) but I feel it's the studio that's behind releasing a trailer so soon not Chris Nolan and I could be wrong but I think the purpose behind it all was to reveal Bane before cheap cellphone pics of the character ended up all over the internet like they did with the new Spiderman costume last year.


----------



## sakeido

You are probably right. The trailer just smacked of something studio brass pushed through with little respect to the filmmaker.. it also seemed like a really amateurish trailer, all said and done. This might be one of those sneak peaks that disappears from all official channels as soon as a real trailer comes out hah


----------



## Triple-J

Ign posted a new article with a pretty clear photo of Bane in some sort of street combat/army style outfit the article itself contains some spoilers and plot points (one of which seems pretty damn epic to me) though so if you're trying to avoid them you have been warned. Bane's Full Costume Revealed - Movies News at IGN


----------



## Black_Sheep

^ Epic  


And by the way i love the tumbler. It's the coolest batmobile ever imo. I would love to have one myself


----------



## TheDivineWing22

Was at Heinz field all day yesterday as an extra...can't really say anything cause I don't want Christopher Nolan hunting me down and killing me. But, now I can't wait to see the movie next summer!


----------



## technomancer

TheDivineWing22 said:


> Was at Heinz field all day yesterday as an extra...can't really say anything cause I don't want Christopher Nolan hunting me down and killing me. But, now I can't wait to see the movie next summer!



I TOTALLY missed this was happening 

Here's an article on it from one of the local papers

Film extras, Steelers players pack Heinz Field for football scene - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review


----------



## TheDivineWing22

It was a lot of fun. It was also awesome that we were the first anyone from the general public has got to see Tom Hardy in his role as Bane actually acting.


----------



## Vicissitude27

Huge bump for possible sneak peakage. 8 Minute Prologue to THE DARK KNIGHT RISES Might be Attached to MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE &#8211; GHOST PROTOCOL | Very Aware | Movie and TV news, reviews and other goodness


----------



## vampiregenocide

Apparently Liam Neeson has been spotted on the set of TDKR, so Ra's al Ghul may still be alive. Perhaps he is the man behind Bane? This would make perfect sense, it's the sort of thing he'd do. However explaining his survival of the crash at the end of Batman Begins would be tricky.


----------



## GazPots

Well he's listed on wiki and imdb as being in the movie but it _is_ wiki after all.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Someone else has been listed as playing a young Ra's Al Ghul, and there are pictures from what is apparently a TDKR set in India showing a green pool, potentially the Lazarus Pit that Ra's uses to rejuvenate himself. His daughter Thalia is also in the film, so the chances are it's either a flashback or she saved his body and took it to the Lazarus Pit to be rejuvenated.


----------



## MFB

I had a feeling since Bane is being included, this is a condensed version of the "Knightfall" story in which Batman has his back broken by Bane and thus uses the Lazarus pit to rejuvenate himself, and where there's Lazarus Pits - there's Ra's al Ghul 

I'm still really not that interested in this, but maybe those 8 minutes will change my mind


----------



## Triple-J

Empire magazine did an online vote last week to choose the cover of their upcoming TDKR special (those with long memories will remember they did something similar for TDK) which is out at the end of this week the choice of covers is revealed here. Batman Vs Bane! Empire Magazine's Dark Knight Rises Cover Reveal

Nolan is interviewed by Empire for this issue and in it he reveals that Bane needs to wear the mask because he's suffered some kind of accident (look at the pic in the link above and you can see that his skin looks like it's been burnt by chemicals) but the most interesting piece of news to me is that this movie takes place a massive EIGHT years after TDK. (there's some bits of the interview here News On The Dark Knight Rises | Movie News | Empire)


----------



## Marv Attaxx

I like how brutal they describe bane


----------



## Konfyouzd

Is the Scarecrow not going to be in it either?


----------



## Xaios

Triple-J said:


> but the most interesting piece of news to me is that this movie takes place a massive EIGHT years after TDK.



Holy crap, really? I wonder if he'll still be playing vigilante after 8 years!

One thing that I *really* liked about The Dark Knight was that it finally eschewed the whole "tortured over the death of my parents" thing.

This is a rough approximation about how I felt about all the Batman movies prior to Chris Nolan taking the helm:







Thankfully, TDK finally got rid of that. I just hope we don't enter into some sort of drawn out depression of Rachel.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Konfyouzd said:


> Is the Scarecrow not going to be in it either?



Don't believe so, he was only in the second one briefly.


Ra's Al Ghul however is returning, both with Liam Neeson and a younger version (either in a flashback, or maybe he is rejuvenated from the Lazarus Pit).


----------



## Sepultorture

well seeing as the new batman is moving to 8 years since the events of dark knight, the Rachel bit is probably dead and burried so he can have a semi love interest in cat woman.

Also hearing that Bane's facemask is actually a gas feeder mask (feeding a gas mix from two cannisters hidden on his back) that do0es not feed venom and make him uber strong, but actually feeds him a pain numbing agent that helps him functio due toa previous injury in his life time. this could also make it hard to take him down as he would then also not be able to feel pain and make moves or other actions that might hamper someone.

makes sense to me, i love Nolan's appoaches to realism yet still keeping that fictional element we love in movies.

Bane sounds like he's going to be a complexe yet extremely brutal and efficient villain, a much harder to take down villain than even the joker, ( seeing as the joker was methodical, yet insane and evasive)

and Liam Neeson and the young Ra's Al Ghul character could be flashback elements, we don't know yet, i hope not, would be great to see how he pulled off surviving, and it wouldn't surprise me if he somewhat set the whole Bane thing into motion aswell


----------



## Black_Sheep

I was pleasantly surprised to see that it takes place 8 years after TDK. This means probably that it loans a bit of it's story from Frank Millers "the dark knight returns" again. Thankfully we won't see Robin though  


And about Ra's Al Ghul: i don't know what to think about he's return. Maybe it's necessary in order to finish this trilogy properly, but i don't know... we'll see.


----------



## MFB

Sepultorture said:


> well seeing as the new batman is moving to 8 years since the events of dark knight, the Rachel bit is probably dead and burried so he can have a semi love interest in cat woman.
> 
> Also hearing that Bane's facemask is actually a gas feeder mask (feeding a gas mix from two cannisters hidden on his back) that do0es not feed venom and make him uber strong, but actually feeds him a pain numbing agent that helps him functio due toa previous injury in his life time. this could also make it hard to take him down as he would then also not be able to feel pain and make moves or other actions that might hamper someone.
> 
> makes sense to me, i love Nolan's appoaches to realism yet still keeping that fictional element we love in movies.
> 
> Bane sounds like he's going to be a complexe yet extremely brutal and efficient villain, a much harder to take down villain than even the joker, ( seeing as the joker was methodical, yet insane and evasive)
> 
> and Liam Neeson and the young Ra's Al Ghul character could be flashback elements, we don't know yet, i hope not, would be great to see how he pulled off surviving, and it wouldn't surprise me if he somewhat set the whole Bane thing into motion aswell



So...this gas still sounds like Venom since part of it was that it made him resistant to pain through being super strong and whatnot. I feel like we just won't see this type of over-the-top-holy-shit Bane like we're expecting, which is fine by me since he looked ridiculous in Arkham City. 

Sheep : Ra's will probably only be in it to introduce the Lazarus Pits, so he's definitely a necessary component in the Bane/Dark Knight story, but it won't be a massive role I imagine


----------



## Sepultorture

MFB said:


> So...this gas still sounds like Venom since part of it was that it made him resistant to pain through being super strong and whatnot. I feel like we just won't see this type of over-the-top-holy-shit Bane like we're expecting, which is fine by me since he looked ridiculous in Arkham City.
> 
> Sheep : Ra's will probably only be in it to introduce the Lazarus Pits, so he's definitely a necessary component in the Bane/Dark Knight story, but it won't be a massive role I imagine



it's still very much what you'd expect bane to be, the mask, the coctail fedding him constantly to keep him at peak form

but it ends there, Venom enhanced Bane making him stronger than any other person, also able to bulk himself up to almost super human proportions. for the sake of trying to keep things at a semblance of realism they made it into more of a gas mask that feeds him pain killer meds to help with the pain he suffers from ona daily basis froma previous injury aswell as being able to do things that would hamper a normal person. the pain killer gas makes more snese than super human serum like Venom, so he is stilla hard to hurt or kill foe and relentless like bane, but more realistic. it's more of a story plot to keep things grounded in a sense of realism to stop it going into Batman & Robin territory (extrem example i know, but that Bane sucked hard)


----------



## vampiregenocide

I hope they don't end it like every comic, with band getting his tubes ripped out.


----------



## sakeido

big lol if anybody actually thinks lazarus pits are going to be in this movie

if Bruce gets his back broken, he's staying that way and somebody else will take over for him as Batman. after all he has to be "more than just a man"


----------



## MFB

I highly doubt Nolan would bring in any of the would-be-Robins (in this case, Dick most likely) just to have them take over. He'd catch so much backlash over doing a potential tie in to "Battle of the Cowl" while also fucking up the "Knightfall" story arc. Itd require too much editing to each of the respective stories, especially since BftC requires bringing back Jason Todd, which means introducing Infinite Crisis and why he was so psychotic as Batman.


----------



## Sepultorture

don't see robin happening period

as for lazerus pits, porbably not cus those aren't even remotely realistic, still amkes you wonder what all the randomb green screens are in odd locations with the young Ra's Al-Ghul


----------



## vampiregenocide

I think Lazarus Pits are possible. I mean Ra's used flowers that cause you hallucinate like crazy. I don't think that'd be too mad. 

As for Batman breaking his back, that might explain the 8 year time gap. You could survive it and get back mobility with lots of physiotherapy depending on the nature of the injury. Not to mention, he's a a billionaire with access to the best technology and medical care. In 8 years, he could recover, regain his former strength and figure out a way to return as Batman. 

I'm interested in Joseph Gordon-Levitt. He is supposed to be a police officer called John Blake, but I reckon there's more to him than that.


----------



## MFB

vampiregenocide said:


> I think Lazarus Pits are possible. I mean Ra's used flowers that cause you hallucinate like crazy. I don't think that'd be too mad.
> 
> As for Batman breaking his back, that might explain the 8 year time gap. You could survive it and get back mobility with lots of physiotherapy depending on the nature of the injury. Not to mention, he's a a billionaire with access to the best technology and medical care. In 8 years, he could recover, regain his former strength and figure out a way to return as Batman.
> 
> I'm interested in Joseph Gordon-Levitt. He is supposed to be a police officer called John Blake, but I reckon there's more to him than that.



The back break is pointless if they do it by somenother means by Bane though, to do it before hand would waste a big plot point. What they could do is introduce Bane, then time pass in the movie, then show Ras and the pits, some more time passes then bam! Back breaker BY Bane, and use the Lazarus Pits to wrap it all up and continue with the story


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> The back break is pointless if they do it by somenother means by Bane though, to do it before hand would waste a big plot point. What they could do is introduce Bane, then time pass in the movie, then show Ras and the pits, some more time passes then bam! Back breaker BY Bane, and use the Lazarus Pits to wrap it all up and continue with the story



I don't know, as has been mentioned there is a rumour that the start of the film takes place immediately after the first, with Batman on the run (weakened and having been shot remember) and as he is escaping, he is found by Bane who then breaks his back. Presumably this causes Bruce to stop being Batman and explains the 8 year gap.


----------



## MFB

Ah OK, then that works just as well since its still Bane breaking the back, explains the gap and allows there to be a period of rage between the two and also allows Batman to be a sort of underdog since Bane will be working to tarnish his reputation/name.


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> Ah OK, then that works just as well since its still Bane breaking the back, explains the gap and allows there to be a period of rage between the two and also allows Batman to be a sort of underdog since Bane will be working to tarnish his reputation/name.



Yup.


Spoiler



Apparently part of a script leaked showing this happen, and Bane says he knows who Batman is. The only person to know Batman's identity that we know of, is Ra's Al Ghul.


----------



## MFB

vampiregenocide said:


> Yup.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently part of a script leaked showing this happen, and Bane says he knows who Batman is. The only person to know Batman's identity that we know of, is Ra's Al Ghul.





Spoiler



I'm perfectly alright with this set up for the film, and IIRC, Hugo Strange also knows it in the comics as well as games. I dont know if Bane ever discovered it, but I know he is very intelligent and strong so its not too far off to say he could discover it; hell he couldve just unmasked him after the back break.


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I'm perfectly alright with this set up for the film, and IIRC, Hugo Strange also knows it in the comics as well as games. I dont know if Bane ever discovered it, but I know he is very intelligent and strong so its not too far off to say he could discover it; hell he couldve just unmasked him after the back break.





Spoiler



A few people know in the comics, but in Nolan's universe the only people who know are both dead (Rachael and Ra's).


----------



## sakeido

vampiregenocide said:


> I think Lazarus Pits are possible. I mean Ra's used flowers that cause you hallucinate like crazy. I don't think that'd be too mad.
> 
> As for Batman breaking his back, that might explain the 8 year time gap. You could survive it and get back mobility with lots of physiotherapy depending on the nature of the injury. Not to mention, he's a a billionaire with access to the best technology and medical care. In 8 years, he could recover, regain his former strength and figure out a way to return as Batman.
> 
> I'm interested in Joseph Gordon-Levitt. He is supposed to be a police officer called John Blake, but I reckon there's more to him than that.



there are real life plants that will make you hallucinate like crazy, but there are no real life ponds that turn you back into a young man and fix you up if you soak in one for awhile. It would be a plot device the likes of which has not been seen.. at all.. in the series so far. 

Nolan doesn't have to stick to any established canon. he already has shown he is picking and choosing inspirations from some of the best Batman stories and mixing them together with his own special sauce. somebody else can take over for Batman, and it could be anybody. the guy could be named Jason Todd or Azrael or whoever else, and Nolan could do whatever he wants with the character. Having to introduce Infinite Crisis to explain why Todd would be insane? lolololololololol


----------



## vampiregenocide

sakeido said:


> there are real life plants that will make you hallucinate like crazy, but there are no real life ponds that turn you back into a young man and fix you up if you soak in one for awhile. It would be a plot device the likes of which has not been seen.. at all.. in the series so far.
> 
> Nolan doesn't have to stick to any established canon. he already has shown he is picking and choosing inspirations from some of the best Batman stories and mixing them together with his own special sauce. somebody else can take over for Batman, and it could be anybody. the guy could be named Jason Todd or Azrael or whoever else, and Nolan could do whatever he wants with the character. Having to introduce Infinite Crisis to explain why Todd would be insane? lolololololololol



Haha I know, but it's still somewhat in the realms of science fiction, so who knows. 

And true, but I don't think Nolan is going to have someone else come in and take on the mantle of Batman. There is no reason to.


----------



## sakeido

vampiregenocide said:


> Haha I know, but it's still somewhat in the realms of science fiction, so who knows.
> 
> And true, but I don't think Nolan is going to have someone else come in and take on the mantle of Batman. There is no reason to.



the way I see it, Bruce will be dead or crippled at the end of the movie, out of commission forever. Batman either becomes a matyr or somebody takes over for him. Nolan's world is too realistic for Wayne to continue as Batman forever.


----------



## vampiregenocide

sakeido said:


> the way I see it, Bruce will be dead or crippled at the end of the movie, out of commission forever. Batman either becomes a matyr or somebody takes over for him. Nolan's world is too realistic for Wayne to continue as Batman forever.



Dunno man doubt it. 8 years is enough time to recover, if he even gets his back broken anyway.


----------



## Triple-J

All this talk of Bane breaking Batman's back is most likely nonsense and I think people need to quit assuming that just because Bane is featured in the movie it's going to follow the plot of the Knightfall story arc or any other Bane story because Nolan isn't that obvious plus most of the plot that's been revealed so far seems to have more in common with The Dark Knight Returns than anything else.



Marv Attaxx said:


> I like how brutal they describe bane



I could be wrong but the graphic detail that Tom Hardy used to describe Banes fighting style makes me think this movie may get a higher rating than the previous two.


----------



## Marv Attaxx

^ I thought so, too. 

I like it.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

This film better live up to the hype that The Dark Knight created. Inception stepped up to that plate, I'm interested to see if Nolan can do it within comic book restrictions.


----------



## vampiregenocide

He originally was sceptical about doing a third one apparently, but when he got the script he was up for it. Good to see a director with a sense of quality control.


----------



## Captain Shoggoth

I cannot vociferate how psyched I am for this film. The months pass too slowly.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

vampiregenocide said:


> He originally was sceptical about doing a third one apparently, but when he got the script he was up for it. Good to see a director with a sense of quality control.



I read an article about that and allegedly it had a lot more to do with the figure that was written down and passed to him.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Scar Symmetry said:


> I read an article about that and allegedly it had a lot more to do with the figure that was written down and passed to him.



hahaha even so, looking at his filmography, he always does stellar films.


----------



## murakami

i am going to go in with low expectations... the dark knight just set the bar way too high, and though i have to admit that inception was AN AMAZING movie... i don't want to go in there thinking this movie will be the 'be all'. 

i have to say that nolan's movies are the only ones i go to watch in theatres though haha.


----------



## Mexi

I'm really looking forward to this, it'll be interesting b/c it takes place 8 years after The Dark Night


----------



## Black_Sheep

My expectations are extremely high, as Chris Nolan is pretty much my favorite director at the moment. All he's movies i've seen have been great (and i've seen all but the very first one he directed), with The Dark Knight being my favorite, it's just perfect imo. It's definetly among the top ones in my list of "greatest movies ever made" ...and that's quite a list  


Of course, TDK sets the bar incredibly high, but honestly i don't see any reason why this sequel would not deliver. Sure (and very sadly) it doesn't have Heath Ledger's great performance, but does it need it in order to be as good? No. 

Im actually very excited just by the fact that TDKR takes place long after the two previous films (and goes even closer to Frank Millers Batman, one of the biggest inspirations for Nolan and co. in the first place). Can't wait...


----------



## Triple-J

Figured I'd give a heads up that a 2nd trailer (not the prologue which will be featured with MI:Ghost Protocol) is going to be attached to the new Sherlock Holmes movie and should also be on the official TDKR website tomorrow/Saturday too it's also worth noting that a 2nd poster for the movie which features Bane is now up on the official TDKR site as well.


----------



## vampiregenocide

A friend managed to make this.


----------



## Sepultorture

after hearing some more run down from Nolan and seeing more pics i'm gettin pretty reved on seeing this, i imagine after seeing the theatrical trailer i will be bouncing off the walls to see this.

i think Tom Hardy will bring a sick performance as Bane, it's gunna be a sick piece


----------



## Decipher

I actually got to attend the advanced Prologue screening at my local IMAX last week (13th). The Prologue was a truely unique opening to the movie. Definitely the same format as the beginning/prologue of the Dark Knight Joker Bank Heist (introduce you to the villain). My only complaint was just that it was a little difficlt to understand Bane's dialogue due to the muffling from the mask and his accent. Otherwise I'm completely fucking syked fo the movie. I must've watched the leaked 2nd trailer a dozen times Friday night. 

I beleive the official HD version of Trailer #2 should be released anytime now.


----------



## toiletstand

official trailer is coming tomorrow.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

The Dark Knight Rises (2012): Official Trailer #2 Released - Cosmic Book News

Looks AMAZING.


----------



## MFB

Holy shit.


----------



## Captain Shoggoth

HORY SHET

"When Gotham is in ashes, you'll have my permission to die." Epic.


----------



## Ibanezsam4

MFB said:


> Holy shit.



my thoughts exactly. 

i like how they are portraying catwoman in this. not just a thief, but an idealist making a statement


----------



## GazPots

God, even i had a hard time hearing what Bane said first time. 


Looks epic though.


----------



## MFB

Ibanezsam4 said:


> my thoughts exactly.
> 
> i like how they are portraying catwoman in this. not just a thief, but an idealist making a statement



That's never really been Selena though, she was just a cat burglar and nothing more I thought? I haven't read the reboot from what I've seen previously she's never really had motivation to be an "idealist" unless you count her being a prostitute before; and I don't think she got shit on by any of Gotham's "elite" so why now?


----------



## Captain Shoggoth

Oh come on, Bane was completely dechipherable. I guess none of you have ever been paintballing in England


----------



## Triple-J

Did anyone else notice that one of the sign cards the audience members at the football game were holding used the "Robin" logo from the comics? 
I couldn't make out exactly what the sign said but the first two letters of it were an R and an O. 



MFB said:


> That's never really been Selena though, she was just a cat burglar and nothing more I thought? I haven't read the reboot from what I've seen previously she's never really had motivation to be an "idealist" unless you count her being a prostitute before; and I don't think she got shit on by any of Gotham's "elite" so why now?



Selena/Catwoman rather like the Joker has been portrayed in many different ways and there have been a few comic stories that portray her as a sabateur so I think Nolan's just pushing that aspect of the character instead of going for the tired old love interest/cat obsessed jewel thief angle.


----------



## synrgy

Looking forward to this. I'm still iffy on Bain - especially hearing how muffled his voice is under that mask - but I'm sure seeing it in the theater will alleviate any misgivings I'm carrying.


----------



## setsuna7

HOLY SHIT!!!! A flying Tumbler????!!!


----------



## vampiregenocide

Captain Shoggoth said:


> Oh come on, Bane was completely dechipherable. I guess none of you have ever been paintballing in England



There were some bits in the prologue trailer where it was kinda difficult to hear what he was saying. He also speaks with an odd sort of manner that makes his voice just sound weird, but cool.


----------



## vampiregenocide

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Does-Dark-Knight-Rises-Trailer-Include-Hint-About-Robin-28435.html


----------



## Rev2010

Holy crap, some of you guys are easy to please. Sorry, but I couldn't see what was so awesome or epic from that new trailer.

I hope it's great too, I really do, I loved the last one. But that trailer wasn't amazing to me.


Rev.


----------



## synrgy

One thing's for sure: Nolan's got an knack for detail.


----------



## Loomer

Oh goddamnit how can Anne Hathaway be so friggin' gorgeous?


----------



## petereanima

No shit, that trailer gave me goosebumps...


..tough, I dont know why exactly.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

petereanima said:


> No shit, that trailer gave me goosebumps...
> 
> 
> ..tough, I dont know why exactly.



Same man, so stoked here.


----------



## drgordonfreeman

My prediction: this movie will gross about $400 trillion worldwide. lol. 

Bane looks amazingly sick. I'm stoked.

The Dark Knight Rises Trailer - Trailer Addict

I'm almost as excited about seeing this as I am about The Expendables 2.


----------



## Explorer

Repost.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/movies-books-tv-media/135413-dark-knight-rises-thread.html


----------



## Black_Sheep

I liked the new trailer. Seen it many times by now. Really can't wait to see this! 


Also, i was wondering with a friend that is Batman going to die at end of this movie. What do you guys think?


----------



## MFB

The Dark Knight Rises - Official Trailer #3 [HD] - YouTube

My prediction, JGL = older Tim Drake, but it seems too easy/predictable. Tim's a bit more ...innocent I guess than Grayson (Nightwing) plus his hair was normally shorter and more "proper" for lack of better word, but again, it's still fairly predictable for them to write Robin in as this kind of deus-ex-machina; so who else in Gotham could he be?


----------



## Xaios

Awwww yeeeaaaah.

So, seems like they've made Selina Kyle one of the "good guys" in this one.


----------



## Rick

MFB said:


> The Dark Knight Rises - Official Trailer #3 [HD] - YouTube
> 
> My prediction, JGL = older Tim Drake, but it seems too easy/predictable. Tim's a bit more ...innocent I guess than Grayson (Nightwing) plus his hair was normally shorter and more "proper" for lack of better word, but again, it's still fairly predictable for them to write Robin in as this kind of deus-ex-machina; so who else in Gotham could he be?



Goddamnit, why did you post that? You're making my DKR GAS worse.


----------



## MFB

Xaios said:


> Awwww yeeeaaaah.
> 
> So, seems like they've made Selina Kyle one of the "good guys" in this one.



Overall, she'll probably be considered a "good guy" but at the same time we have no idea what she's doing when she's not in the scenes with Bruce, and those scenes wil probably show her more "wildcard" personality


----------



## Volteau

Xaios said:


> Awwww yeeeaaaah.
> 
> So, seems like they've made Selina Kyle one of the "good guys" in this one.



Seems like it. I just can't get over the fact that her costume sucks. I know, I know, it's always been like that but meh. Nolan could have done something "cooler" with it, for lack of a better word.

Anyway, I'm dying to see it all the same!


----------



## veshly

Holy fuck am I ever stoked for this. I don't want it to ever end.


----------



## GazPots

"My mother warned me about getting into cars with strange men."

"This isn't a car"

*Flies off like a boss*



Looks mindblowing. I cannot wait.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Getting pretty fed up of the pseudo-smart dialogue in these Nolan films. Let's hope this isn't the disappointment that The Dark Knight was.


----------



## rectifryer

Scar Symmetry said:


> Getting pretty fed up of the pseudo-smart dialogue in these Nolan films. Let's hope this isn't the disappointment that The Dark Knight was.



Ever read a comic book? Its this sorta self aware slightly corny dialogue that makes its hit home for me, atleast. 

What I'm getting at, is, in the end, this all started from comics meant for teenagers. Just be happy its not twilight or Avatar.


----------



## sakeido

rectifryer said:


> Ever read a comic book? Its this sorta self aware slightly corny dialogue that makes its hit home for me, atleast.
> 
> What I'm getting at, is, in the end, this all started from comics meant for teenagers. Just be happy its not twilight or Avatar.



The Dark Knight takes itself extremely seriously though. If you want to be as lofty and high-handed as that movie was, you need quality dialogue to make it all come together.. and also less plot holes. After how massively overrated TDK was at first (still is overrated - better than Return of the King? Are you kidding?) I'm curious to see how this one settles out. I don't have much hope though, because Nolan for some reason right now can do no wrong.

And I'm happy its not Twilight, but it definitely won't be an Avatar. I saw that movie like eight times in theaters and bought the blu-ray.. twice. They couldn't make a sequel to it soon enough.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Complaining about cheese dialog in TDK, but going gaga over Avatar? My head hurts.  

To each his own. I loved both films.


----------



## Xaios

MaxOfMetal said:


> Complaining about cheese dialog in TDK, but going gaga over Avatar? My head hurts.
> 
> To each his own. I loved both films.



My thoughts exactly. TDK is Shakespeare compared to Avatar. That's not to say that Avatar is a bad movie, but the dialogue is cheesy as hell and the central plot is incredibly trite.


----------



## sakeido

Xaios said:


> My thoughts exactly. TDK is Shakespeare compared to Avatar. That's not to say that Avatar is a bad movie, but the dialogue is cheesy as hell and the central plot is incredibly trite.



didn't pretend to be anything than what it was, though, and you have to take it as a whole. visually it was something completely... otherworldly... to behold  

TDK tried way too hard to be gritty and dark, and forgot it was ultimately a comic book movie. The HUGE plot holes drive me nuts any time I watch it. After the insanely intense first viewing, it couldn't capture me any more and played worse and worse on every subsequent viewing while Avatar, Iron Man and Thor still hold up well. imo if it wasn't for Ledger's Joker it would have been a completely, entirely average movie


----------



## Gothic Headhunter

Xaios said:


> My thoughts exactly. TDK is Shakespeare compared to Avatar. That's not to say that Avatar is a bad movie, but the dialogue is cheesy as hell and the central plot is incredibly trite.


 Exactly, its just pochahauntas with aliens and in 3-D.
Back on topic, how heavily will this be leaning off of the dark night returns and knightfall, because there seem to be many similarities.


----------



## Xaios

sakeido said:


> The HUGE plot holes drive me nuts any time I watch it.



Care to elaborate on that point? Everyone keeps talking about these "huge plot holes," but I've never had one pointed out to me where a) there wasn't a simple explanation, or b) it wasn't important to the story. People tend to get caught up on details that really don't matter. There's a ton of classic literature and movies that contain the same kinds of "gigantic plot holes," and yet they're still considered classics.

One other thing: "it's a comic book movie" is precisely the reason that Joel Schumacher made "Batman Forever" and "Batman and Robin" the way he did. I think we've benefited immensely from Nolan's more realistic approach.


----------



## highlordmugfug

drgordonfreeman said:


> My prediction: this movie will gross about $400 trillion worldwide. lol.
> 
> Bane looks amazingly sick. I'm stoked.
> 
> The Dark Knight Rises Trailer - Trailer Addict
> 
> I'm almost as excited about seeing this as I am about The Expendables 2.


I actually didn't get that excited over that trailer, and I loved The Dark Knight, and was looking forward to this movie. 

The dialog in that seemed kind of lame and over the top to me.
[/heath_ledger_joker_made_the_last_movie]

EDIT:


Xaios said:


> Care to elaborate on that point? Everyone keeps talking about these "huge plot holes," but I've never had one pointed out to me where a) there wasn't a simple explanation, or b) it wasn't important to the story. People tend to get caught up on details that really don't matter. There's a ton of classic literature and movies that contain the same kinds of "gigantic plot holes," and yet they're still considered classics.


Yeah, what gaping, goatse-esque plot hole is everyone yammering about?


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> My prediction, JGL = older Tim Drake, but it seems too easy/predictable. Tim's a bit more ...innocent I guess than Grayson (Nightwing) plus his hair was normally shorter and more "proper" for lack of better word, but again, it's still fairly predictable for them to write Robin in as this kind of deus-ex-machina; so who else in Gotham could he be?



I was thinking along the same lines. He might not even become Robin, but perhaps the next Batman. From what I've seen in the trailers, I don't think Batman is going to walk away from the end of this film. Bruce Wayne might survive, but I think it might be the end for Batman, and the start of something new for the next person to take up the mantle of Gotham's protector. We shall see.

As for this whole 'The Dark Knight' is overrated stuff, to each and his own. I thought the film was brilliantly written, acted, shot and just generally awesome, especially when you compare it to a lot of the unoriginal tripe that comes out nowadays. I loved the first one, but TDK is probably one of my favourite films of all time.


----------



## rectifryer

sakeido said:


> The Dark Knight takes itself extremely seriously though. If you want to be as lofty and high-handed as that movie was, you need quality dialogue to make it all come together.. and also less plot holes. After how massively overrated TDK was at first (still is overrated - better than Return of the King? Are you kidding?) I'm curious to see how this one settles out. I don't have much hope though, because Nolan for some reason right now can do no wrong.
> 
> And I'm happy its not Twilight, but it definitely won't be an Avatar. I saw that movie like eight times in theaters and bought the blu-ray.. twice. They couldn't make a sequel to it soon enough.


I don't think it takes itself that seriously. It's not Full Metal Jacket. It's a movie based on a comic book and I think it portrayed the experience I received from the comics well. It does have a "holier-than-thou" sense to it that is kinda goofy but so did the comics. I think thats a great contrast to the extreme villains.


----------



## sakeido

Xaios said:


> Care to elaborate on that point? Everyone keeps talking about these "huge plot holes," but I've never had one pointed out to me where a) there wasn't a simple explanation, or b) it wasn't important to the story. People tend to get caught up on details that really don't matter. There's a ton of classic literature and movies that contain the same kinds of "gigantic plot holes," and yet they're still considered classics.
> 
> One other thing: "it's a comic book movie" is precisely the reason that Joel Schumacher made "Batman Forever" and "Batman and Robin" the way he did. I think we've benefited immensely from Nolan's more realistic approach.



these are all spoilers but imo statute of limitations on Dark Knight has run out 

- they say Dent killed more people than he actually does on screen. who were the others? or was he framed?
- how does the Joker do half the things he does without anybody catching on... like replacing a bunch of police officers, who will be right next to the mayor during a tumultuous time, with his own cronies, with nobody noticing even though they are surrounded by real cops? or rigging up two ferries with a truly massive amount of explosives, or predicting exactly which street a helicopter will fly down so his goons can take it out, or wiring an entire hospital to explode, or replacing the commisioner's alchohol with acid
- what does the Joker do after he makes Batman jump out the window of Bruce's party? does he murder a few guests before he leaves, or does he just walk away? doesn't he wonder where the person who actually owns the place is?
- how did Bruce roll out his cell phone sonar software to everyone in Gotham? forced software update, or was this just done so they could bolt on a Big Brother-esque message to the movie for no reason?
- how did the Joker figure that somebody would be able to pull a fingerprint off a bullet, so he could set a trap for them at the parade?
- how did the Joker get those scars?

jk about the last one but seriously. not a good movie, just a great villain. TDKR might be better but I doubt it

Joel Schumacher also sucks at making movies in general. Good comic book movies - Iron Man, Thor, from the sounds of it the Avengers. Iron Man is the best comic book movie of all time.. its good fun, like a comic book movie should be, great action scenes, but it still has a lot of heart. hell I like Batman Returns better than anything Christopher Nolan has done 



rectifryer said:


> I don't think it takes itself that seriously. It's not Full Metal Jacket. It's a movie based on a comic book and I think it portrayed the experience I received from the comics well. It does have a "holier-than-thou" sense to it that is kinda goofy but so did the comics. I think thats a great contrast to the extreme villains.


how did it not take itself seriously? weird atonal music playing all the time to ratchet up the tension, the main character's love interest is blown up mid-sentence after rejecting the hero, said hero mopes about after that and he needs his butler to relate a war story to try and understand his nemesis, blah blah blah

it was just a series of coincidences and the real payoff was just... a great speech from the villain! and then a really hokey one from Gordan. 

if I wanted to watch a movie with an absolutely reprehensible bad guy, I'd watch Rob Roy over TDK 10 times out of 10 because it is still a good movie even when Archibald Cunningham isn't on the screen


----------



## rectifryer

Your right, everything about TDK was corny. Thats why I don't think it was as serious as you make it out to be.


----------



## MFB

The only that worries me about that being the direction it takes, is that they haven't shown any of the training he would have undergone to be even CLOSE to taking over the cowl, so people would question that between TDKR and whatever film follows this since if he's just this out of nowhere badass - how did he get Bruce to trust him enough to take over the Batman legacy? With Dick taking over the cowl, he was under Bruce's wing for YEARS, and then became his own hero, and when he did take over as Batman it ended badly IIRC. Which is what makes it so great when he takes over later as Batman (circa 2008, I forget the name of the arc) and does it _right_. He's older, more mature, he's grown as a person and he still recognizes his flaws but he's nowhere near the person he was before so he feels more confident in it now.

You'd lose all that aspect if you just throw his character in as Batman for the next film without answering all those question


----------



## rectifryer

I agree with all that. I don't think the third installment its going to make any fucking sense.


All that will probably happen in a montage lol.


----------



## Ibanezsam4

The whole TDK not a good movie argument is very similar to the same argument made by film critics when Old Boy received critical praise from film festival goers. It's not good because it tried to stray from its comic roots and previous iterations of the bat have not been good because they stuck TOO much to the comic roots. 

honestly it strikes the right balance


----------



## sakeido

Ibanezsam4 said:


> The whole TDK not a good movie argument is very similar to the same argument made by film critics when Old Boy received critical praise from film festival goers. It's not good because it tried to stray from its comic roots and previous iterations of the bat have not been good because they stuck TOO much to the comic roots.
> 
> honestly it strikes the right balance



uhh no actually its just not a good movie. I'm comparing it against its peers in the comic book movie genre because its only within the confines of its genre it could qualify as a good movie.

judge it as a crime movie - it took a lot of pages out of Heat's book, but Heat is still better because it develops its hero and villain equally. then there's the Godfather, GoodFellas, etc... all of which are immensely superior

as an action movie - not much in the way of cool choreography or fight scenes. Even Batman Begins is better in this regard. Semi truck flipping over was incredible in imax tho 

as a thriller - has nothing on the Girl With the Dragon Tattoo or Se7en

as a social commentary - can you even judge TDK like this? in any case, loses out in a big way to the Social Network

etc....


----------



## MFB

Girl with the Dragon Tattoo wasn't very "thrilling" it was a good movie yeah, but I wasn't like "OH HOLY SHIT THAT HAS NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE!"


----------



## sakeido

everything has been done before, usually dozens of times. that is literally the furthest thing from my mind when I watch a flick these days. its all in the execution and the fine details.


----------



## Xaios

* - they say Dent killed more people than he actually does on screen. who were the others? or was he framed?*

This question is firmly planted in the "doesn't matter" category. Maybe he was framed, maybe not, but the point that Gordon is trying to make is that Dent's fall from grace isn't going simply come out in the wash. At that point, it doesn't make any difference if it's 5 or 50.

*- how does the Joker do half the things he does without anybody catching on... like replacing a bunch of police officers, who will be right next to the mayor during a tumultuous time, with his own cronies, with nobody noticing even though they are surrounded by real cops?*

Gotham is a big place with a ton of cops. If an entire unit gets kidnapped and replaced at the last second, no one is going to have the time to figure out that they've been switched as there was no obvious indicator that they *weren't* cops. It's not like they'll be checking down a roster as they're firing their ceremonial shots into the air.

*or rigging up two ferries with a truly massive amount of explosives*

That one's a bit harder, but it's still not outside the realm of possibility. If the ferries were also used to transport cargo in addition to passengers, they would have only needed a very small window of opportunity to get them loaded up. Wouldn't have taken long.

*or predicting exactly which street a helicopter will fly down so his goons can take it out*

The Joker likely knew any possible routes that the police van could have taken and probably had people stationed over multiple streets.

*or wiring an entire hospital to explode,*

This is the only one that strikes me as beyond feasible, so I'll have to give you an "I don't know" on this one.

*or replacing the commisioner's alchohol with acid*

The Joker was originally commissioned by the mob to deal with their problems, the same mob that had several corrupt cops in its pocket. While the joker killings were going on, they could have told any one of these corrupt cops to be complicit in the Joker's plans in order to avoid getting offed themselves. Said cop could have gained access to the police commissioner's office and replaced his booze with acid. This is given more credence by the fact that, just before the commissioner was killed, Gordon realized that the fingerprint on the joker card was probably pulled from his scotch glass.

*- what does the Joker do after he makes Batman jump out the window of Bruce's party? does he murder a few guests before he leaves, or does he just walk away? doesn't he wonder where the person who actually owns the place is?*

Remember, the Joker came to find Dent. When Batman is interrogating the Joker later in the movie, the Joker states that, at that point, he thought Batman *was* Dent, so either a) he went to run after him, or b) decided to GTFO before SWAT showed up, because if Dent just flew out the window, there's no point in sticking around as far as they're concerned. As for Bruce Wayne, he had just earlier knocked out one of the Joker's goons and escaped into what other guests believed to be a panic room, so the Joker probably reasoned that he was beyond his reach at that point.

*- how did Bruce roll out his cell phone sonar software to everyone in Gotham? forced software update, or was this just done so they could bolt on a Big Brother-esque message to the movie for no reason?*

Another question that doesn't really matter, but the simplest answer is probably the one that makes the most sense: money. They probably had the right people in their pocket at the right time to be able to distribute the software with no one noticing. After all, if nothing else, Wayne Corp has lots of money.

*- how did the Joker figure that somebody would be able to pull a fingerprint off a bullet, so he could set a trap for them at the parade?*

I think you're misremembering something. The reason the timer was set was to pull the blind up and divert the attention of the snipers on the balconies so that they wouldn't be able to stop the Joker's men on the ground. Bruce just happened to be standing there.


----------



## Gothic Headhunter

sakeido said:


> these are all spoilers but imo statute of limitations on Dark Knight has run out
> 
> - they say Dent killed more people than he actually does on screen. who were the others? or was he framed?
> - how does the Joker do half the things he does without anybody catching on... like replacing a bunch of police officers, who will be right next to the mayor during a tumultuous time, with his own cronies, with nobody noticing even though they are surrounded by real cops? or rigging up two ferries with a truly massive amount of explosives, or predicting exactly which street a helicopter will fly down so his goons can take it out, or wiring an entire hospital to explode, or replacing the commisioner's alchohol with acid
> - what does the Joker do after he makes Batman jump out the window of Bruce's party? does he murder a few guests before he leaves, or does he just walk away? doesn't he wonder where the person who actually owns the place is?
> - how did Bruce roll out his cell phone sonar software to everyone in Gotham? forced software update, or was this just done so they could bolt on a Big Brother-esque message to the movie for no reason?
> - how did the Joker figure that somebody would be able to pull a fingerprint off a bullet, so he could set a trap for them at the parade?
> - how did the Joker get those scars?
> 
> jk about the last one but seriously. not a good movie, just a great villain. TDKR might be better but I doubt it
> 
> Joel Schumacher also sucks at making movies in general. Good comic book movies - Iron Man, Thor, from the sounds of it the Avengers. Iron Man is the best comic book movie of all time.. its good fun, like a comic book movie should be, great action scenes, but it still has a lot of heart. hell I like Batman Returns better than anything Christopher Nolan has done
> 
> 
> how did it not take itself seriously? weird atonal music playing all the time to ratchet up the tension, the main character's love interest is blown up mid-sentence after rejecting the hero, said hero mopes about after that and he needs his butler to relate a war story to try and understand his nemesis, blah blah blah
> 
> it was just a series of coincidences and the real payoff was just... a great speech from the villain! and then a really hokey one from Gordan.
> 
> if I wanted to watch a movie with an absolutely reprehensible bad guy, I'd watch Rob Roy over TDK 10 times out of 10 because it is still a good movie even when Archibald Cunningham isn't on the screen


 It was my understanding that he bribed the police officers. Also, I'm 99% sure that in the movie they say that the sonar thing was added as a mass update to all of the cell phones in gotham, without the owners' knowledge of said update, but I could be wrong. Other than that, those were very good questions that I would be interested in hearing the answer to. 
And in what ways was Iron Man better than TDK? Having only seen Iron Man once, I'm probably not a good judge, but I thought it really wasn't that good. IIRC not much happened untill the last fight sequence, and at least TDK didn't have product placement. I wonder how much Burger King paid for that.


----------



## sakeido

Xaios said:


> *- how does the Joker do half the things he does without anybody catching on... like replacing a bunch of police officers, who will be right next to the mayor during a tumultuous time, with his own cronies, with nobody noticing even though they are surrounded by real cops?*
> 
> Gotham is a big place with a ton of cops. If an entire unit gets kidnapped and replaced at the last second, no one is going to have the time to figure out that they've been switched as there was no obvious indicator that they *weren't* cops. It's not like they'll be checking down a roster as they're firing their ceremonial shots into the air.


he didn't replace the entire chain of command, and the unit would have been in place before the actual ceremony started. I don't see how they could have made it through roll call unless there was yet another off-screen crooked cop that specifically overlooked the Joker and his goons 


> *or rigging up two ferries with a truly massive amount of explosives*
> 
> That one's a bit harder, but it's still not outside the realm of possibility. If the ferries were also used to transport cargo in addition to passengers, they would have only needed a very small window of opportunity to get them loaded up. Wouldn't have taken long.


It likely would have left a trail of bodies if they snuck it onto a loading dock, and it didn't look like the ferry carried cargo. iirc they went down into the engine room because the boat had been sabotaged so it'd be parked in the harbor.

I guess the whole thing can be explained away as "corrupt cops did it" which is ehhhhh  where did all the screen time go to explain this stuff...? the villains grabbed the spotlight to the detriment of the protagonist, but they are both dead at the end of the movie (kinda, in the Joker's case - he is executed between TDK and TDKR) so what was the point? neither Dent or Joker were all that great as a foil to Batman, even though they kept beating us over the head "joker only exists because you do, Bats!" 



Gothic Headhunter said:


> It was my understanding that he bribed the police officers. Also, I'm 99% sure that in the movie they say that the sonar thing was added as a mass update to all of the cell phones in gotham, without the owners' knowledge of said update, but I could be wrong. Other than that, those were very good questions that I would be interested in hearing the answer to.
> And in what ways was Iron Man better than TDK? Having only seen Iron Man once, I'm probably not a good judge, but I thought it really wasn't that good. IIRC not much happened untill the last fight sequence, and at least TDK didn't have product placement. I wonder how much Burger King paid for that.



Iron Man was just more fun. way less angsty. still had a lot of positive growth for the protagonist, and he is way more fun to watch than Bruce Wayne. the villain was pretty good. loved the chemistry between Tony, Pepper and Rhodey and how the dialog all sounded natural and improvised. thought it was awesome how he doesn't bother with a secret identity. I like his toys better than Batman, and his world just makes more sense. why does ANYONE live in Gotham City? 

any kind of advertising is background noise to me.. that stuff hasn't bothered me since the first Transformers movie


----------



## Gothic Headhunter

I just got the impression that Tony Stark was an egotistical asshoe, but it certainly worked for the movie, and for some reason made him more likeable. Anyway, am I the only one who has no idea what Bane is saying every time he speaks?


----------



## Xaios

See, I loved both The Dark Knight and Iron Man. The Dark Knight is sort of the ultimate comic book crossover movie, whereas Iron Man is the ultimate pure comic book movie. They're basically my two favorite comic book movies, albeit for completely different reasons.


----------



## The Reverend

sakeido said:


> he didn't replace the entire chain of command, and the unit would have been in place before the actual ceremony started. I don't see how they could have made it through roll call unless there was yet another off-screen crooked cop that specifically overlooked the Joker and his goons
> 
> Blah blah blah blah



It's a movie about a man who dresses up like a fucking bat, refuses to use guns (how impractical is that) and has a butler named Alfred who abandoned some brutal war in the jungle to serve as a butler.

Stop overthinking it. This is why I hate internet people sometimes. You can't just enjoy a movie, instead you have to search for utterly meaningless plot holes. Just say the movie wasn't for you. Sometimes we can't pin down what exactly it is about an object, place or thing that we don't like, but it's okay to say "I just don't like it."

Fiction isn't supposed to be a documentary, and for that matter there's gaping plot holes in history, so enjoy stories for what they are, because at the end of the day, it's all a lie anyways, isn't it? Sort of odd to say that you want the most truthful, realistic and rational lie possible.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

The problem with TDK is it tried to do too much without thinking it through. Inception was awesome because it answered all of its own questions. I just hope Nolan sees the gaping flaws in TDK and doesn't repeat them. Mind you, this time he has $250m to fuck around with so hopefully he won't.


----------



## Ibanezsam4

sakeido said:


> uhh no actually its just not a good movie. I'm comparing it against its peers in the comic book movie genre because its only within the confines of its genre it could qualify as a good movie.
> 
> judge it as a crime movie - it took a lot of pages out of Heat's book, but Heat is still better because it develops its hero and villain equally. then there's the Godfather, GoodFellas, etc... all of which are immensely superior
> 
> as an action movie - not much in the way of cool choreography or fight scenes. Even Batman Begins is better in this regard. Semi truck flipping over was incredible in imax tho
> 
> as a thriller - has nothing on the Girl With the Dragon Tattoo or Se7en
> 
> as a social commentary - can you even judge TDK like this? in any case, loses out in a big way to the Social Network
> 
> etc....



then judge it as a fucking comic book movie, considering that's what it is  i dont like comparing films to each other (seeing as I'm a cinema fan and feel different pieces of work should be judged on their own merit and not to a mythical standard of "good film") but if this is your approach then my opinion is really just piss in the wind. 

i dont know how familiar you are with serialized comics, but most of the "problems" you have are in fact continually present in all comics save for larger graphic novels. "how did he rig up explosives and be a criminal mastermind and whatnot.." i can guarantee you that if you read some issues of Batman you'd have the same problem. Story tellers in the visual medium have to deal with problems like deadlines and another bugger of a problem, page limits. often times the whole master plan is not revealed for the sake of constraints and is left to the reader to be enthralled and use their imagination to fill in the blanks (its never when its in a print medium for some reason). Basically think of it as Occam's Razor, never exceeding what is absolutely necessary. I think Tufte's Principle of Good Design, the greatest possible information, with the least amount of clutter, and the least amount of space. 

This is what the TDK emulates, a comic (duh comic movie). is it necessary to know each of the Joker's methods and why he is so awesome?? no actually, the mystery of his intelligence and menace is half of what makes the Joker terrifying.. but that's just me, I'm willing to accept that he has resources (mob cooperation) and the means to execute; and I'm done. 

then again I'm a fan of Tokyo Drifter.. if you need explanation for everything do not watch that movie


----------



## Sepultorture

blargh, i hate it when people over analyze the shit out of movies, it's entertainment, extreme real life "behind the scenes" details are not truly needed, as entertainment is to be taken at face value.

it boils down to whether you liked it or not, and me, i fucking loved it and i'm looking forward to TDKR


----------



## vampiregenocide

Sometimes you don't need to know all the details. The main characters don't. The fact Joker was able to pull all this together and no one understood his plan is part of the film. If you could understand how he did everything, it would make it less of an amazing feat. Wondering how the fuck he did it all is integral to the film. Other than that, I didn't find any real 'plot-holes'.


----------



## synrgy

Top Ten Films of 2008 
(2008 in film - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

1	The Dark Knight
2	Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull	
3	Kung Fu Panda
4	Hancock
5	Mamma Mia!
6	Madagascar
7	Quantum of Solace
8	Iron Man
9	WALL-E
10	The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian

In that company, it seems like a freaking AMAZEBALLS movie, to me.


----------



## HighGain510

The Reverend said:


> It's a movie about a man who dresses up like a fucking bat, refuses to use guns (how impractical is that) and has a butler named Alfred who abandoned some brutal war in the jungle to serve as a butler.
> 
> Stop overthinking it. This is why I hate internet people sometimes. You can't just enjoy a movie, instead you have to search for utterly meaningless plot holes. Just say the movie wasn't for you. Sometimes we can't pin down what exactly it is about an object, place or thing that we don't like, but it's okay to say "I just don't like it."
> 
> Fiction isn't supposed to be a documentary, and for that matter there's gaping plot holes in history, so enjoy stories for what they are, because at the end of the day, it's all a lie anyways, isn't it? Sort of odd to say that you want the most truthful, realistic and rational lie possible.



This x 10000000. Dude seriously... let it go. The movie wasn't titled The Dark Knight: A 100% historically-correct plot-hole free documentary for a reason. It's not based in reality, it's a work of fiction. FICTION. As in did not actually happen. Why grasp at straws for something that is not MEANT to be 100% correct as you see it? 

You're trying to make it into something it isn't. It's a work of fiction, focusing on minute points that make zero difference to storyline. You might have some pretty severe OCD if stuff like this affects your enjoyment of movies if they have the slightest plot hole, most folks are able to let it go.  "ZOMG!!!! How did they sneak past the police without replacing 100% of them?" WHO CARES! If at the end of the day, that's the biggest concern in your world, I don't know what to tell you. 


I'd hate to discuss movies based on comics with you in real life if this is how far you analyze things, Cody.  I mean if you're pointing out stuff like that, do you really think that the thin material with a few poles attached to it that makes up his cape would REALLY let Batman float horizontally across Gotham City? I've seen the "flying squirrel" suits, but they're connected to form a pocket and even then, you float at a downward angle for the most part. Watch the first Batman movie again, did you question it when he was floating over the city as everyone was freaking out from the gas? Do you freak out every time you watch X-Men or Wolverine? I mean, they just hooked tubes up to his bones and MAGICALLY the adamantium molded around his bones perfectly? HOW DOES THAT WORK?! OH NOES!  Seriously.... it's meant as entertainment, not as a brain-teaser that you're supposed to over-analyze and point out any possible flaw you can find.


----------



## technomancer

Ok enough already, if you want to play movie critic about TDK make your own thread for it. This thread is to discuss The Dark Knight Rises so lets get it back on topic.


----------



## sakeido

HighGain510 said:


> I'd hate to discuss movies based on comics with you in real life if this is how far you analyze things, Cody.



this is the only one that gets this kind of treatment because it was the only one that was all "look how fuckin serious this shit is! We are making statements about heroes and villains and the fate of a whole city and shit! this whole thing is grim, grim, grim serious business! so serious we'll murder the main character's love interest and everything! TAKE! ME! SERIOUSLY!" 

I just spent a bunch of time talking about how much I liked Iron Man. the guy made his first suit, in a cave. with a box of scraps! didn't bug me. He can't get the shrapnel out of his heart so he'll hold it back with a magnet instead? oooookay... his suit probably couldn't fly, the arc reactor is obviously impossible, his AI is unrealistically advanced, etc. all that stuff is okay because the movie is fun and any kind of thematic elements are pretty incidental. 



> This is what the TDK emulates, a comic (duh comic movie). is it necessary to know each of the Joker's methods and why he is so awesome?? no actually, the mystery of his intelligence and menace is half of what makes the Joker terrifying.. but that's just me, I'm willing to accept that he has resources (mob cooperation) and the means to execute; and I'm done.
> 
> then again I'm a fan of Tokyo Drifter.. if you need explanation for everything do not watch that movie


most of the shit the Joker did stretched my suspension of disbelief past the breaking point, which is saying something. Batman exists, cool, he can pull a fingerprint off a bullet, cool.. but the shit the Joker did needed some explanation. right now it seems to be - "the Joker wills it, it happens by magic." great. very compelling stuff.



technomancer said:


> Ok enough already, if you want to play movie critic about TDK make your own thread for it. This thread is to discuss The Dark Knight Rises so lets get it back on topic.


OT: I hope TDKR is better than the TDK because TDK isn't very good at all


----------



## Mexi

sakeido said:


> how did it not take itself seriously?



Batman movies have a strong track record of taking themselves seriously


----------



## sakeido

Mexi said:


> Batman movies have a strong track record of taking themselves seriously




are you serious? not only is that movie more than 20 years old, it was made by a different director, is a different continuity... and I like the original Batman and Batman Returns better than Batman Begins and TDK. Batman Returns is the best batman movie ever made.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

synrgy said:


> Top Ten Films of 2008
> (2008 in film - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
> 
> 1	The Dark Knight
> 2	Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
> 3	Kung Fu Panda
> 4	Hancock
> 5	Mamma Mia!
> 6	Madagascar
> 7	Quantum of Solace
> 8	Iron Man
> 9	WALL-E
> 10	The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian
> 
> In that company, it seems like a freaking AMAZEBALLS movie, to me.



I think Wall-E and Iron Man are much better


----------



## Scar Symmetry

technomancer said:


> Ok enough already, if you want to play movie critic about TDK make your own thread for it. This thread is to discuss The Dark Knight Rises so lets get it back on topic.





http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/mo...i-think-dark-knight-way-overrated-thread.html


----------



## sakeido

Scar Symmetry said:


> http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/mo...i-think-dark-knight-way-overrated-thread.html



hahaha its been two years since then and my opinion hasn't changed yet! go me! that's unusual


----------



## synrgy

Scar Symmetry said:


> I think Wall-E and Iron Man are much better



I didn't say TDK was the best. Just said it was damn good in that company. I kinda feel like you're cherry picking, unless you'd like to convince me of what exactly makes Crystal Skull, Hancock, or Narnia better flicks than TDK.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

*Alright, next one to keep this whole TDK bitchfest going, even though another Mod already said to cut it out, is getting a long nap. Got it?*


----------



## Korbain

So overly excited for this movie! My life is going to feel empty after i see it knowing its Nolan/Bales last batman. 

I really hope they get into Bruce Wayne/Batmans character again like batman begins did. I got a bad vibe batman is either gonna get really fucked up in this, or killed...i may cry if he dies lol


----------



## MrPepperoniNipples

I hate Anne Hathaway as cat woman.

and that Bane is going to be a normal sized human being
ESPECIALLY that he's not even hispanic.


----------



## Marv Attaxx

Well, Bane's dad is british, isn't he?


----------



## Captain Shoggoth

MrPepperoniNipples said:


> and that Bane is going to be a normal sized human being



Personally I'm pretty impressed that they got a talented method actor in order to play the _character_ well, and that said actor then took it upon himself to gain roughly thirty pounds of muscle in order to look as much the part as possible.


----------



## MrPepperoniNipples

Marv Attaxx said:


> Well, Bane's dad is british, isn't he?



he's raised in what is supposed to be Cuba in 'Batman World,' but they give it a different name i don't remember what


----------



## Ibanezsam4

Captain Shoggoth said:


> Personally I'm pretty impressed that they got a talented method actor in order to play the _character_ well, and that said actor then took it upon himself to gain roughly thirty pounds of muscle in order to look as much the part as possible.



he certainly has come a long way since his Band of Brothers days....


----------



## Gothic Headhunter

MrPepperoniNipples said:


> I hate Anne Hathaway as cat woman.
> 
> and that Bane is going to be a normal sized human being
> ESPECIALLY that he's not even hispanic.


 Bane realised that the venom was an addiction and he stopped using it. I don't think he's used venom in several years. I don't get why he's not hispanic though.


----------



## vampiregenocide

I don't think venom is even in this film. The reason he has the mask is because he had an accident or something and needs constant painkillers.


----------



## Sepultorture

vampiregenocide said:


> I don't think venom is even in this film. The reason he has the mask is because he had an accident or something and needs constant painkillers.



which is a great substitue for Venom. instead of being an unstoppable super human machine, he is instead a strong, agile, cunning mercenary that is constantly fed painkillers, making him not super human but def hard to put down, kinda like someone on PCP, they'll just keep coming cus they don't feel the pain or know their damaged


----------



## highlordmugfug

I'm going to ruin this movie for you before it even comes out. 

Bane&#39;s Mask Resembles Goatse


----------



## Michael T

Movie posters from whole trilogy 
Photos from The Dark Knight Rises - Yahoo! Movies


----------



## MFB

I'm digging the Bane one, but I'm biased because of my raging mancrush on Tom Hardy


----------



## SenorDingDong

If I do go see this movie, it will be for Anne Hathaway


----------



## Black_Sheep

Soon.... 


Can't wait! Seriously, haven't been this excited to see a movie in a long time.


----------



## vampiregenocide

I'm not mad on Anne Hathaway, and her costume in this could've had a lot more thought put into it. But that's pretty much my only gripe with this film from what I've seen so far. I may change my mind when I see it.


----------



## MFB

Im just not diggin how big the mask is on her face. It looks like it should be either a domino mask with some accents or a cap with some ears like in the game/comics but its this half way in between thing


----------



## VILARIKA

I just purchased tickets for a showing at 3:50 A.M. in NYC (Crazy? yes, but it should be quite the experience, especially in IMAX ). I would have bought the 12 A.M. showing but it sold out like lightning. Anyone else plan on getting their tickets early?


----------



## MFB

Waiting to hear back from a buddy of mine on getting some IMAX advance ones as well. Hopefully we snag midnight's but I'm really not fussy when we go.


----------



## VILARIKA

I'm going all out for this one, I want to see it ASAP and get the best seats in the house . So, it looks like I'm gonna have to camp out for awhile, 3 to 4 hours possibly. I know for sure that this show will sell out, regardless of the late time, and it's going to be extremely packed. Anyone have some good ways to kill time while waiting on line? I think time will feel like it's moving extra slow for me when I'm there...


----------



## toiletstand

got my tickets for the marathon. Batman begins at 6:15 pm all the way to Rises at 12:01 am. only wish we had an imax here


----------



## prashanthan

I'm kind of scared to watch the film; right now, I can't see how it'll top TDK, and I'm not crazy on how Catwoman and Bane are looking at the moment. Either way, got me two sets of IMAX tickets, I'm hoping/expecting to be pleasantly surprised!


----------



## petereanima

Yep, pretty much in the same boat. I try to keep my expectations as low as possible, but it's hard after the (imo / imho / for ME / please do not discuss this) epicness that was TDK... currently I ahve mixed feelings for this, Bane looks good tough imho, but currently I just can't see how Catwoman will work in all that...


----------



## Blake1970

I can't wait. This whole series has been epic!!!


----------



## Korbain

Blake1970 said:


> I can't wait. This whole series has been epic!!!



Thats how i am lol Got my tickets to the midnight screening! Nolan will not let us down, how can you people doubt the man lol


----------



## Sepultorture

k, seen Avengers, awesome
seen Prometheus, amazing

now this, and this is by and far the movie i am looking forward to seeing the most of any of them.


----------



## jordanky

Thinking about making an occasion out of this and seeing it in an IMAX theater, I've never been. Too bad it's a few hours drive no matter what direction I go to get to an IMAX theater, haha


----------



## MFB

Friend of mine confirmed we got tickets for a show, looks like there'll be about eight of us going so should be good. Since I've been playing Arkham City and reading the new 52 Batman I'm more excited.


----------



## VILARIKA

jordanky said:


> Thinking about making an occasion out of this and seeing it in an IMAX theater, I've never been. Too bad it's a few hours drive no matter what direction I go to get to an IMAX theater, haha



IMAX is definitely worth it when it's the kind of movie that will draw you into it's story-line, making the experience more realistic. I can't say I've seen a lot of movies that do that for me unfortunately, but the Batman series has been pretty deep since day one, so I'm sure this one won't dissapoint


----------



## jordanky

VILARIKA said:


> IMAX is definitely worth it when it's the kind of movie that will draw you into it's story-line, making the experience more realistic. I can't say I've seen a lot of movies that do that for me unfortunately, but the Batman series has been pretty deep since day one, so I'm sure this one won't dissapoint



Sounds killer, It's looking like Cincinatti or Columbus for me if I plan on doing it. Or maybe Pittsburgh, I love that city and I could make a nice weekend out of it. Anyone in those three areas trying to hang out? SS.org Batman party haha


----------



## Scar Symmetry

If this film doesn't deliver on it's promises I'm going to find Christopher Nolan and kick him fucking hard in the shins.


----------



## sakeido

Scar Symmetry said:


> If this film doesn't deliver on it's promises I'm going to find Christopher Nolan and kick him fucking hard in the shins.



you better start looking 
i bet this movie will be completely average


----------



## sakeido

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ASQqjK47c04

forgot how to embed vids.. new trailer.


----------



## toiletstand

cheers to you buddy. heres the embed. i cant wait for the soundtrack for this to be released. it sounds incredible!


----------



## Church2224

Well here is a mix of the soundtrack some one made, plus an actual track. I got to say this is some awesome music they came up with for the movie-


----------



## kerska

Scar Symmetry said:


> If this film doesn't deliver on it's promises I'm going to find Christopher Nolan and kick him fucking hard in the shins.


 

I concur with this, but shit...it's Christopher Nolan. He has yet to do anything that has left me dissapointed. He's an intelligent director and I'm sure he probably knows there is a lot riding on this after The Dark Knight. Personally, what made TDK so good for me was Heath's performance (I'm sure a lot of others agree too), and he knows he's going to have to really step up to the plate with this one. I'm not worried about it since his track record with movies leaves me feeling it's in good hands.

I've stopeed watching any trailers, paying attention to any news, and I've kind of let go of any expectations. I think this is going to be one hell of a movie and conclusion to the story. If anything, I just want to know how it ends.

I feel bad for anyone that decides they want to take their hand at a new Batman series after this.


----------



## VILARIKA

I just noticed this movie is 2 hours and 45 minutes. Sweet.


----------



## MFB

kerska said:


> I concur with this, but shit...it's Christopher Nolan. He has yet to do anything that has left me dissapointed. He's an intelligent director and I'm sure he probably knows there is a lot riding on this after The Dark Knight. Personally, what made TDK so good for me was Heath's performance (I'm sure a lot of others agree too), and he knows he's going to have to really step up to the plate with this one. I'm not worried about it since his track record with movies leaves me feeling it's in good hands.
> 
> I've stopeed watching any trailers, paying attention to any news, and I've kind of let go of any expectations. I think this is going to be one hell of a movie and conclusion to the story. If anything, I just want to know how it ends.
> 
> I feel bad for anyone that decides they want to take their hand at a new Batman series after this.



Part of me feels like this will be more of the same but replace Heath Ledger with Tom Hardy and the word Joker with Bane. Seriously, Hardy is amazing in nearly everything he's done (I can count one movie he's in that's just TERRIBLE but it was on SyFy so not really fair either) but Bronson is great, Warrior was awesome and he had a cool role in Inception as well so this is just continuing his streak.


----------



## kerska

MFB said:


> Part of me feels like this will be more of the same but replace Heath Ledger with Tom Hardy and the word Joker with Bane. Seriously, Hardy is amazing in nearly everything he's done (I can count one movie he's in that's just TERRIBLE but it was on SyFy so not really fair either) but Bronson is great, Warrior was awesome and he had a cool role in Inception as well so this is just continuing his streak.


 
You're probably right about that. I really like how Nolan puts such emphasis on the villians in this series and it probably won't be much different in this one. 

Goddammit I'm excited.


----------



## Triple-J

Well it looks like the Scarecrow might return for this movie after all.... Batman: Dark Knight: Movie Masters Wave 2 Action Figures: The Scarecrow @ Forbidden Planet


----------



## Church2224

Triple-J said:


> Well it looks like the Scarecrow might return for this movie after all.... Batman: Dark Knight: Movie Masters Wave 2 Action Figures: The Scarecrow @ Forbidden Planet



I was thinking he might be a minor character in it, but I am willing to bet Ra's al Ghul will have a much bigger role than we think.


----------



## MFB

Ugh, that just says "Dark Knight" nothing about Rises so I don't see how it's indication? He WAS in "The Dark Knight" but there's been zero hinting at him in "Dark Knight Rises" and through an action figure would be a lame reveal.


----------



## Rick

Seeing it at an IMAX next Saturday.


----------



## cataclysm_child




----------



## SirMyghin

kerska said:


> I concur with this, but shit...it's Christopher Nolan. He has yet to do anything that has left me dissapointed. He's an intelligent director and I'm sure he probably knows there is a lot riding on this after The Dark Knight. Personally, what made TDK so good for me was Heath's performance (I'm sure a lot of others agree too), and he knows he's going to have to really step up to the plate with this one. I'm not worried about it since his track record with movies leaves me feeling it's in good hands.
> 
> I've stopeed watching any trailers, paying attention to any news, and I've kind of let go of any expectations. I think this is going to be one hell of a movie and conclusion to the story. If anything, I just want to know how it ends.
> 
> I feel bad for anyone that decides they want to take their hand at a new Batman series after this.



Not sure Heath was nearly as vital as people make him out to have been there. He was given a good script and acted accordingly, which for him was a step up really (not a fan of his). His role, I feel, was greatly overstated due to his death and overall the movie was well done regardless, not carried by one.


----------



## jaredowty

^Ledger managed to transform himself into being nearly unrecognizable; with far different mannerisms, facial expressions and speech than we've seen from him before. No easy feat. His death hyped things up, no doubt, but it was a great performance regardless - certainly more than just "acting accordingly".  Then there's Eckhart over-acting his heart out everytime he raises his voice. *sigh* Gary Oldman is the best actor on the cast IMO, and Christian Bale does a great job despite the ridiculous voice.

And what's so great about the TDK script? It's actually a poorly paced, convoluted mess, and a lot of the dialogue is quite pretentious. Don't get me wrong, I still really like the film. It's just overrated as all hell. Somehow I feel that TDKR will surpass it and BB, but we'll see...


----------



## cataclysm_child

Hans Zimmer 1:36 AM - Public
My face mid session while working on The Dark Night Rises. Here are some clips of my songs, just for my fans.


----------



## flint757

I don't know why, but I'm not excited for this one at all. Then again I'm not a huge fan of Bale, but I really liked Dark Knight.


----------



## Xaios

Alright folks, apparently we've got some early screening opinions, and so far they are quite positive!

The Dark Knight Rises Early Reviews - MoviesOnline


----------



## jordanky

Bought my midnight premiere tickets last night. Can't wait!


----------



## Xaios

So, Warner Bros removed the review embargo last night, and they've starting pouring in.

The Dark Knight Rises - Rotten Tomatoes

So far it's sitting at 95% with 19 "Fresh" and 1 "Rotten" review on Rotten Tomatoes, which is actually better than The Dark Knight was at this point in time. (I remember monitoring RT when TDK came out, at this point it was in the early 80 percent, and clawed it's way up to 94% over time.)

Some reviewers are saying that it's not quite as good as TDK simply because it doesn't have Heath Ledger (and let's face it, a performance like that doesn't come around very often). Others are saying it's the best of the trilogy.

I'm certainly looking forward to it more now.

*EDIT*: This is a comment someone left on the review of the one guy who's given the movie a bad review thus far:



> This is the critic rottentomatoes deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll flame him. Because he can take it.





*EDIT 2*: One of the most telling things is that TDKR also has an 88 so far on Metacritic, which is also higher than The Dark Knight (82). The critics on Metacritic seem to be generally harder to please overall (for example, The Avengers only scored 69), as opposed to the "everyone and the kitchen sink" that RT takes, and Metacritic also uses a normalized rating system as opposed to RT's "yay or nay," so it should be a good thing for the fortunes of TDKR.


----------



## Decipher

Got my tix for the noon IMAX showing on Friday..... This week has been a slow one waiting for this.


----------



## Xaios

Sooooo...

Thus far, the critical consensus seems to be that, while it's a bit overwrought compared to The Dark Knight which ran relatively lean, it's every bit as ambitious and has absolutely massive scope. Currently it holds an 85% "yay or nay" rating on Rottentomatoes, which is the same as Batman Begins, but it also has an 8.2 average rating, compared to 7.7 for Batman Begins and 8.4 for The Dark Knight. On Metacritic, it has a rating of 82, compared to 70 for Batman Begins and 82 for The Dark Knight.

The main complaint (aside from Tom Hardy's voice being muffled) seems to be that it's bloated. It's a legitimate complaint, but one that I don't think any non-critic will mind, as the pacing is still quite brisk, and it's not a universal complaint. Also, apparently the score is a bit on the loud side.

Conversely, the acting seems to be uniformly excellent with many critics saying that it's Bale's best performance of the trilogy. There's also been a lot of praise for Anne Hathaway, who's done the same thing for Selina Kyle as Heath Ledger did for the Joker, in that she's given what will probably be remembered as the definitive performance of the character. Lots of love as well for Morgan Freeman, Tom Hardy, Michael Caine and Joseph Gordon-Levitt, who some have said gives the best performance of the movie.

The complaints being leveled are essentially the same complaints put forth against Inception, which is actually a good thing in a way, because I found the things that some critics complained about to actually be positives in that case. Additionally, of the reviews posted so far, those who love TDKR _really_ love it.


----------



## MFB

I've ALWAYS found Zimmer's music to be put way too high in the mix and then when it's delivered to the theaters, it's fucking ROARING and my ears immediately freak out when hearing it. They adjust within the first minute but I think every time it starts I'm jolted because his music is the only persons who gets put so high.


----------



## Xaios

Yeah, Zimmer & co's motto seems to be "go big or go home." And Hans Zimmer is not a man to go home. 

Still though, as loud as the music in Inception was (no complaints about the score itself though, it was gorgeous), the mixing was equally as brilliant. Even when the music in Inception was at its most bombastic, all the dialogue and sound effects were still crystal clear and fully intelligeable.


----------



## Marv Attaxx

There's nothing better than being pushed into the cinema-chair by a Zimmer score 
Oh, and please keep this thread spoilerfree!!


----------



## Xaios

SPOILER ALERT!

Batman...



Spoiler



...isn't wearing hockey pads.


----------



## devolutionary

My fucking God... Bane and Catwoman were incredible.


----------



## Xaios

devolutionary said:


> My fucking God... Bane and Catwoman were incredible.



Have you... seen it?


----------



## MFB

Is that REALLY a spoiler or a fake one to tempt people? I mean, it's less than 24 hours away and I'm not super tempted but still, at this point/matters like this I don't use spoilers for jokes just ginormous gaps between lines.


----------



## pentecost

jaredowty said:


> And what's so great about the TDK script? It's actually a poorly paced, convoluted mess, and a lot of the dialogue is quite pretentious. Don't get me wrong, I still really like the film. It's just overrated as all hell. Somehow I feel that TDKR will surpass it and BB, but we'll see...



i actually felt like the pace lent to it feeling more "real," whereas the dialogue kept one foot in the verbosity of the comics. i'm a marvel guy, but imo they have yet to achieve a movie that pushes you past "i'm watching a movie" as well as TDK did.


----------



## devolutionary

Xaios said:


> Have you... seen it?



Yep, midnight screening last night when it opened in NZ. Saw all three back to back.


----------



## flint757

Part of me really wants to do that at the Alamo Draft House, but damn that is a long time to be sitting in a theater.


----------



## devolutionary

The 20-30 minute breaks in between were a god send. Walk it off, have a smoke, top up on sugar. Thankfully the first two weren't packed, so we got away with additional seats and stuff, but TDKR was paaaacked. And I ain't a small boy.


----------



## Xaios

MFB said:


> Is that REALLY a spoiler or a fake one to tempt people? I mean, it's less than 24 hours away and I'm not super tempted but still, at this point/matters like this I don't use spoilers for jokes just ginormous gaps between lines.



Why don't you highlight and find out?


----------



## indrangelion

No spoilers in this post.

Opening day here in Australia. Instead of going to work this morning, I took my sister with me to go and see it. Gotta love morning viewings, only around 15 people were there!

I'll say this about TDKR...It's brilliant, just as I hoped it would be. Might be abit of a slow-burner at the start (especially for those who haven't seen the first two movies). But once the plot and character intros/backstory are in place, then shit gets really serious.

I'm very pleased with the actors' performance in this movie. I think I'm one of those people who finds Joseph Gordon-Levitt's performance to be the standout. In true Nolan style, the plot left me on edge the whole time.

I'm not going to give anything away, but towards the end I find it amusing that it actually reminded me of the 60's Batman. That's all I'm going to say.

Tl;dr: Go and see it.


----------



## Xaios

T minus 1 hour 20 minutes, baby! 

EDIT: So yeah, got here an hour before the movie was supposed to start and the theatre is already packed! So much for getting an optimal seat...


----------



## MFB

Speechless.

Absolutely brilliant. Brilliant.


----------



## Tang

You guys hear about this shit yet? Gunman opened fire in a midnight screening of TDKR in Colorado. Scary situation.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18921492

EDIT: created a thread in off-topic.

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/of...ight-rises-premier-denver-co.html#post3108099


----------



## Xaios

Alright folks, just got home from a midnight screening.

Verdict?

*FUCKING DELIVERED!*

I'm gonna go ahead and say it now, I actually liked it even more than The Dark Knight. And I LOVED The Dark Knight.

Is it bloated? A little bit, but not nearly as much as some critics would have you believe. Is Bane's voice hard to understand. Again, a little bit, but I still got 98% of what he said.

Man... where to begin?

I suppose a safe place to start without veering into spoiler territory is that the acting was once again absolutely top-notch. Every actor brought their A-game. The highlight, though, was probably Anne Hathaway. Her character is just a JOY to watch when she's on screen. Similar to the Joker, except instead of morbid curiosity, she inspires genuine likeability. Joseph Gordon-Levitt is also just great while he's on screen. Hell, everyone is great!

Oh fuck it. Major spoilers ahead, tagged. And when I say major, I mean major. Major, MAJOR, *MAJOR*. I've gotta get them out of my system, though. Only read if a) you've either seen the movie, or b) you're a person of true bravery, because here, there be dragons. Dragons that are actually spoilers.

YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

*#1*


Spoiler



The movie ends with happiness, true genuine positivity. All the other movies, even though they ended on a hopeful note, also had portents of doom built in. Not this one. Good wins the war in this movie.



*#2*


Spoiler



True to the comics, Bane does indeed break Bruce Wayne's back.



*#3*


Spoiler



When certain actors and actresses were revealed to be cast members, there was one rumor that was categorically denied, and pretty much died out. Turns out, however, that it's true. Marion Cotillard's character, Miranda Tate, is actually Talia Al Ghul. She is the true villain, the one pulling Bane's strings. I did NOT see this one coming, not by a mile, and it was an incredible surprise.



*#4*


Spoiler



Bruce Wayne/Batman appears to have been killed at the end of the movie, but is revealed to be very much alive in the closing montage, and has gone away with Selina Kyle.



*#5*


Spoiler



Joseph Gordon-Levitt's character, John Blake, does indeed inherit the mantle of Batman at the end of the film.



Phew!

See this movie. SEE THIS DAMN MOVIE!


----------



## Tang

I'm really glad people are enjoying Hathaway as Catwoman. I remember reading a lot of doubt that she could pull the roll off.

Full disclosure: I loves some Anne Hathaway.


----------



## jaredowty

Wow, and I thought TDK's script was convoluted. This one is just a sloppy, incoherent and utimately ineffective mess.

I'm sorry, but this movie pretty much sucked. I'm not saying that to be combative or to "get a reaction" out of anyone, I truly didn't enjoy it. The acting, cinematography and effects were good, but that's all I was able to appreciate.

I'm glad that the majority is enjoying it though, good for ya'll...


----------



## Korbain

Loved it! so it a few nights ago at the midnight screening. going to see it again ASAP. Was it as good as the dark knight!? They're different, it's hard to not compare them, but heath ledger delivered a performance for a villain no one can top lol

The story had a few minor problems, bit confusing at times. by the end of it though, everything came together, and boy what an ending. Edge of the seat stuff.

Highly recommend. Great movie! On a much larger scale this one. It's definatly a lot more morbid and dark...bane plays such a powerful menacing villain that makes batman look like nothing. Really liked the focus on bruce waynes character and tension between him and alfred growing because of him being the batman.

Some great moments that actually got me feeling a bit bit teary lol 

Anna hathaway was brilliant as selina kyle! i don't think she was actually called cat women once?! but she really nailed it, sexy, smart and had the cheeky humor which was good considering how dark the tone of the movie is lol


----------



## setsuna7

Saw it. Blown away by it. Chris Nolan is a fucking genius!!! The plot is amazing,it's really a twist of the knife that is so slow,it burns you at the end. The best of 2012.Hands down.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

Let me start off by saying that I really enjoyed the film, and I think it was, as far as Thirds go, very good. 

Though, I did see some flaws in the film, namely the pacing and how the provided certain background elements to the story. Basically, they could have made this a two-parter, added an hour or two. This probably would have taken care of the "out of nowhere" and "at times hard to follow" aspects of the movie that seems to be what most critics of the film seem to have an issue with, and they're completely right. 

Something else I'm not entirely sure how I feel about is how they added a little more camp than the previous two films. I know it was for comic relief, and such a dark movie really needed it at times, but there were a few lines I would have been embarassed as an actor/actress to say. 

I'm not a big movie buff, or superhero/comic buff, but I found the film very entertaining. Considering all that was going on and all the story archs they needed to close up, I felt they did a tremendous job. 

Is it better or on par with TDK? I guess we'll see how long this one lingers with fans, and how it holds up to multiple viewings.


----------



## VILARIKA

It was an entertaining movie with a lot of twists. I can say I thoroughly enjoyed it 

The 2 big questions that'll be thrown around are if this is movie tops The Dark Knight, and if it tops The Avengers. I think the Dark Knight had a smoother story-line that didn't get too jumpy, which is what I felt The Dark Knight Rises did at times. Also, I think the acting was a bit stronger in The Dark Knight (large in part by Heath Ledger). 

Though The Avengers is a totally different type of superhero movie, I still think The Dark Knight Rises comes out as a better overall film.

I also got an early birthday present, snagged up one of these in the theater:


----------



## Xaios

The best comic relief line was when...



Spoiler



Batman and Catwoman are talking on top of the building after Batman saves Selina from the thugs. Batman turns away at one point, then turns back, only for Catwoman to have vanished, to which he says "Hunh, so that's what it feels like..."


----------



## MFB

#1.


Spoiler



The only bit that made me kind of chuckle was when he was "interrogating" Bane for the detonator right before Talia reveals herself, and he just keeps yelling in his face, "WHERE'S THE DETONATOR! WHERE'S THE DETONATOR!" over and over. It was a logical thing to do and whatnot, just the way he did it with the voice and all it was funnier than it should've been.



#2.


Spoiler



I REALLY wish they had given us WHICH Robin that Blake was supposed to be. When she said "use your real name" then paused I SO wanted to hear "Richard" or at LEAST "Tim" but neither, it was actually Robin.



#3.


Spoiler



There's still a few bits where you can't understand Bane, but overall I'd say the mask wasn't as big an issue as people assumed it was going to be and I say good to Nolan's crew for doing it so well. Obviously it was overdubbed given the scale of some of the announcements Bane made, like before they storm Blackgate and such but still, I thought it was fine. Hardy overall was fucking horrifying as Bane, just the way he carried himself with such authority KNOWING he was already one step ahead of us.


----------



## Xaios

MFB said:


> #1.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> The only bit that made me kind of chuckle was when he was "interrogating" Bane for the detonator right before Talia reveals herself, and he just keeps yelling in his face, "WHERE'S THE DETONATOR! WHERE'S THE DETONATOR!" over and over. It was a logical thing to do and whatnot, just the way he did it with the voice and all it was funnier than it should've been.





Spoiler



Hahaha, yeah, that part totally reminded me of that spoof Youtube video of Batman interrogating the Joker where Batman keeps yelling "WHUHDAYAWARMAKIEWMEH!!" and the Joker's like "...what?"





MFB said:


> #2.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I REALLY wish they had given us WHICH Robin that Blake was supposed to be. When she said "use your real name" then paused I SO wanted to hear "Richard" or at LEAST "Tim" but neither, it was actually Robin.





Spoiler



I don't think he's supposed to be any of the previous Robins, and it doesn't look like he'd ever play the role of Robin, jumping instead right into the role of Batman.


----------



## Black_Sheep

Just got back from the theater. Loved it. Too tired to write lot about the details right now. It was a fitting and a perfect end for this trilogy. I'd give it a 10/10 at the moment. Gonna see it again next week.


----------



## Xaios

Anthony said:


> Both Batman and Avenger's spoilers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I absolutely loved the movie, but is no one going to mention the fact that the movie had the same ending as The Avenger's?





Spoiler



Only in the sense that they feature a montage of the characters post-story, but The Dark Knight did that before the Avengers did.


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



Oh man, fulfilling the role of HERO? That's kind of what they do.

Plus, Bruce knew what he was doing with the auto-pilot and it wasn't a humongous gamble like they played it out. Tony on the other hand had to make a split decision and had no clue if he was gonna make it hence why he tried to call Pepper.


----------



## bob123

Max hit the nail on the head. This should have been a 2 part movie. Character development was a bit too fast, and they rushed some bits. That aside, fucking epic. Bane really surprised me, he did great. Anne hathoway, hotter then ever nailed catwomanpretty well.


And... robin lol.......


----------



## synrgy

bob123 said:


> And... robin lol.......



Spoiler tags, people! Fuck!


----------



## sakeido

most of the movie - ehhhhhhhhhhhh. ending was perfect tho, great resolution to the trilogy.

but I'd give it 3.5 out of 5. If the ending wasn't so good I would have given it a 2.5/5

there was nobody in this movie who could hold it up like Ledger's Joker did in the last one. Bale and Caine put on their best performances of the series so that helped. Hardy as Bane looked great but sounded vaguely ridiculous to me. Most of the new characters the movie introduced were distractions that just added to the run time, except for Joseph Gordan Levitt's character who I'm pretty sure had just as much screen time as Bale did. And Catwoman. Good God. Catwoman. OMFG. Not as sexy as Batman Returns Catwoman. Shows a decent amount of depth for a Nolan character, which is to say she is almost two dimensional. I don't quite get how Nolan always manages to make such long movies when all of his characters cut the bullshit (y'know, real dialogue and characterization) and just state exactly what ideal they are in the movie to represent.

Movie had some dodgy CGI at times. The Batwing did not look convincing, the new change to the Batcycle looked weird every time it was used - sick idea though. Soundtrack wasn't as good as the second movie's. Fight scenes were alright but not outstanding. Bane's massive plot was... interesting... like Occupy Wall Street on steroids and evil.

I dunno tho. this could only be one of the best movies of all time if you haven't actually seen any movies that were 't rammed down your throat by hollywood.


----------



## soliloquy

sakeido said:


> most of the movie - ehhhhhhhhhhhh. ending was perfect tho, great resolution to the trilogy.
> 
> but I'd give it 3.5 out of 5. If the ending wasn't so good I would have given it a 2.5/5
> 
> there was nobody in this movie who could hold it up like Ledger's Joker did in the last one. Bale and Caine put on their best performances of the series so that helped. Hardy as Bane looked great but sounded vaguely ridiculous to me. Most of the new characters the movie introduced were distractions that just added to the run time, except for Joseph Gordan Levitt's character who I'm pretty sure had just as much screen time as Bale did. And Catwoman. Good God. Catwoman. OMFG. Not as sexy as Batman Returns Catwoman. Shows a decent amount of depth for a Nolan character, which is to say she is almost two dimensional. I don't quite get how Nolan always manages to make such long movies when all of his characters cut the bullshit (y'know, real dialogue and characterization) and just state exactly what ideal they are in the movie to represent.
> 
> Movie had some dodgy CGI at times. The Batwing did not look convincing, the new change to the Batcycle looked weird every time it was used - sick idea though. Soundtrack wasn't as good as the second movie's. Fight scenes were alright but not outstanding. Bane's massive plot was... interesting... like Occupy Wall Street on steroids and evil.
> 
> I dunno tho. this could only be one of the best movies of all time if you haven't actually seen any movies that were 't rammed down your throat by hollywood.



i havnt seen the movie yet, so i cant say...
but when you say "there was nobody in this movie who could hold it up like Ledger's Joker did in the last one. " what do you mean?

in terms of acting? in terms of destruction of the city? in terms of what he/she/it/they do to batman?

if thats the case, i'll say that ra's al ghul and scarecrow were far more devastating than the joker was in the second movie. what did the joker do? he killed a man using a pencil. he blew up a hospital. (and the movie only had two action scenes...one at the end where its too dark for anyone to see anything, and the second when the truck flips)

where as ra's al ghul and scarecrow destroyed the entire city by throwing that gas all over. 


but in terms of acting, sure, the joker was awesome.


----------



## sakeido

Joker actually did fuck things up pretty bad for Batman in the second one.. they touch on that a bit in this one. This one Bane definitely does more to Batman, but I was mostly talking about acting. Ledger sold Joker as a completely maniacal force of nature. He had a ton of charisma in his own twisted way.. Hardy as Bane does not have that. Not even close.


----------



## MFB

I felt Bane did FAR more in terms of commanding presence and maniacal force of nature then Joker could ever come close to. Sure Joker made off with some money and killed a guy here and there, but Bane had Gotham's balls in a vice and he _knew it_. You have the entire police force at their knees to one man and the handful of others he started with from NOTHING. He's not a privileged child either, he came from nothing and still comes to be the most feared man for a period of what, just shy of two months? That's impressive.


----------



## Xaios

sakeido said:


> Joker actually did fuck things up pretty bad for Batman in the second one.. they touch on that a bit in this one.



Indeed. The Dark Knight basically ended with "the noble lie," as direct result of the Joker's twisting of Harvey Dent. One of the key themes of the new movie is how, even though the lie was told with the best of intentions, it ultimately made the situation that much worse, which ultimately sets the stage for Bane to thrive.



sakeido said:


> This one Bane definitely does more to Batman, but I was mostly talking about acting. Ledger sold Joker as a completely maniacal force of nature. He had a ton of charisma in his own twisted way.. Hardy as Bane does not have that. Not even close.



Part of the reason it works so well isn't simply because of Heath Ledger's magnificent performance, but he gave a magnificent performance playing the Joker, who is already a character known for on-screen charisma. Bane, as a character, is probably more nuanced than the Joker, but he's not a charismatic villain. Tom Hardy portrayed Bane's ruthless brutality extremely effectively, but that simply isn't as fun to watch as the Joker's mania, simply by nature.

I still loved his performance, though.


----------



## Genome

It was a 9/10 for me. It was an exceptional film. I thought Inception was better, and this narrowly beat The Dark Knight, but that goes to show how fucking good Christopher Nolan is.

Stellar plot and script as per, Bane was a good villain although his voice took a while to adjust to and a couple of the lines I couldn't make out. Hathaway was fantastic. Some good plot twists, the set pieces were awesome. Zimmer's score felt a little bit under-the-radar compared to The Dark Knight but when he popped up he did it in style.


----------



## Xaios

That's one thing I noticed, some of the more intense scenes are actually completely devoid of background music, such as...



Spoiler



...Batman's first fight against Bane in the sewer.


----------



## Genome

Also, Bane's voice felt a bit loud in the mix in comparison to the other characters and very obviously ADR'ed, but I got used to it after a while.

Was it actually Tom Hardy's voice or a David Prowse/James Earl Jones type thing?


----------



## MFB

That might've been because there was the dialogue going on and it was made all the more intense with the sound of just the hits



Spoiler



Does it frighten anyone else that with his BARE hands Bane managed to punch through the lead cowl? And then punched off a chunk of a pillar for city hall?


----------



## flint757

For me the overdub for Bane was too loud in a "it doesn't make since why" kind of way. During the epic speeches it makes since, but EVERYTIME it was at the forefront of the audio.

Zimmer is great, but music was playing through the whole thing and I'm not a huge fan of that style. (to be expected though of Zimmer)

It felt bloated and rushed to the point where it was hard to tell how much time was or wasn't passing. They truly should have made this into 2 parts or just longer especially since there were scenes that didn't necessarily have to be shown.


Spoiler



the twist totally took me by surprise though.



Ann Hathaway was absolutely brilliant and I didn't mind Bale as much as usual (not his biggest fan).


Spoiler



Caine did not pull off the emotional scenes as good as it could have IMO.



To be perfectly honest I think hype is giving this movie more credit than it deserves. Kind of like when people said TDK was the best movie EVER and while it was good, as this one is, it is not the best movie ever, but that's just my opinion. I'd give it a 3/5


----------



## MaxOfMetal

I think Bane's voice being in the forefront of the audio mix was 100% on purpose. Bane is supposed to be this hulk or unmovable object, more than some strongman in a mask, and having a commanding, omnipresent voice helps elevate the character to that level of perceived invulnerability. It's part of the character. 

Just like Batman's much maligned growl. Bruce Wayne is not an imposing figure, nor is he meant to be. The voice is part of the character and what is supposed to separate the billionaire playboy from the scary evil stopper.


----------



## flint757

Oh I understood why in that regard. It's just one of those things where you can't immerse yourself because it is a constant reminder you're watching a movie.


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



Part of me didn't want to accept that Talia would be in this, simply because I knew with Bane being in it that he would be a HUGE role so Talia would take back seat despite being another large player in Bruce's life so to see her be used for such a short amount of time was really surprising and I didn't think Nolan would do it. However, I will say they did successfully get me to believe she wasn't going to appear as they said that Bane was the one who escaped, and that he was Ra's' heir and such and I thought "Well, that's not technically true but it's a nice rework" then BAM! Back to Bane being born in the prison and his origins are regular, it was TALIA who escaped the prisoner! Didn't see it coming.

I agree about Caine too, just something about his role as Alfred this time didn't feel too real. He just seemed like he was there and doing an average performance.


----------



## ROAR

Awesome movie, glad I went. Bane rules.
No need to break down every scene and give an opinion


----------



## bob123

synrgy said:


> Spoiler tags, people! Fuck!




theres absolutely no spoilers from that... relax.


----------



## kerska

I though it was bad ass.

Couldn't have asked for a better ending to a bad ass trilogy.


----------



## Xaios

bob123 said:


> theres absolutely no spoilers from that... relax.



Yes, there is. Use the tag.


----------



## Genome

On the contrary, I thought Caine was brilliant... *shrugs*


----------



## HolidayKiller

Not gonna lie, the last 5 or so minutes of The Dark Knight Rises gave me chills.


----------



## kerska

HolidayKiller said:


> Not gonna lie, the last 5 or so minutes of The Dark Knight Rises gave me chills.


 
Did the same thing to me.


----------



## bob123

HolidayKiller said:


> Not gonna lie, the last 5 or so minutes of The Dark Knight Rises gave me chills.




USE THE GOD DAMN SPOILER TAG RAGE RAGE RAGE RAGE....


Just kidding. People are gonna get.. "sensitive" here.



Xaios said:


> Yes, there is. Use the tag.



uh. no. if you want to explain how, I'd love to hear it.


----------



## MFB

bob123 said:


> uh. no. if you want to explain how, I'd love to hear it.





Spoiler



Yes, it WAS a spoiler.

Everyone knows that JGL's character John Blake was kept tightly under wraps and was never explained what the extent of his role was to be yet EVERYONE was assuming that given this was Nolan's last piece in the trilogy - HE would assume the mantle - or should I say cowl - of Batman; and the entire time he's using a fake name to cover his real name which is ROBIN - precisely what YOU said WITHOUT spoiler tags! Did 99% of the people see it coming? Yeah but that's not the point. It's that your denying them the closure of seeing it themselves and experiencing it by just going "ROBIN LOL" which does mean it's in there and presumably where everyone expected it to be.


----------



## MaxOfMetal

bob123 said:


> USE THE GOD DAMN SPOILER TAG RAGE RAGE RAGE RAGE....
> 
> 
> Just kidding. People are gonna get.. "sensitive" here.
> 
> 
> 
> uh. no. if you want to explain how, I'd love to hear it.


 
Hey Bob, don't be a dick.


----------



## StevenC

I saw it for the second time today, and I was rather impressed. It's just as good the second time, if not better. I put it above the TDK, personally. I haven't found anyone to go see it tomorrow with yet., so that's as good a review as I can give it.


----------



## kung_fu

Despite a few shortcomings, I really enjoyed this movie. Probably about as good as TDK for me. A few thoughts, not all spoilers but i'll make it green just in case:

General thoughts


Spoiler



The first half was too fast; Not in the sense that i feel i missed anything but...I get that we've got to do a lot to get from retired Batman to saving the day one last time, but I think it came at a cost of solid character development and resulted in a rather clunky beginning. Obviously there is a lot of info that needs to be given, but to me it seemed like the scenes were just sort of bullet points delivering bits of plot information and it seemed a little forced. Catwoman wasn't really developed very well imo she was just sort-of a cat burgler who wants to change her stripes. It wasn't too bad, but I definitely prefer the way Catwoman came into being in Batman Return (Though the seductiveness-ness of both performances were about equal ). Even though the movie was already long, i'm willing to bet there was a lot of stuff cut out of the first half that would help fill-out the first half a bit better. If this is true, i look forward to seeing them surface on the DVD. 

The second half was just stellar. I really don't have all that much negative to say about it. It was really the right way to end this (Happily and open-ended). Though some people seemed to think that Caine/Alfred was laying it on thick, i really enjoyed his scenes and think he did a great job adding some real emotion to the film.

I can see why people would have wanted this to be an actual 2-part movie (ie two movie-movie) but to be honest splitting the movie in two wouldn't have worked, as TDK already had a bleak ending and pat one of this saga would have been ending n a very similar note



Notes on a few "cameos"


Spoiler



Thomas Lenon (The State/Reno 911 etc.) as Bruce Wayne's doctor. I nearly fell out of my chair when he popped up "Definately no Heli-skiing"

Quinn from "Dexter" (don't know actor's name) as the nervous cop who blew the bridge and was trying to keep people from leaving Gotham. I have little confidence in this actor and his little role in this movie shows why he isn't in more movies. I mean...he did a passable job, but this was a pretty high drama moment and i don't feel he really lived up to it.

Hines Ward FTW. The only man remaining on the field 



About Bane


Spoiler



I could understand him for the most-part, but there was a line or two that i just couldn't understand. After he first spoke, i leaned over two my brother and said "On the way to St Ives, I met a man with seven wives..." as i thought his voice reminded me of Jeremy Irons from Die-hard 3


----------



## MrPepperoniNipples

Am I the only one that absolutely hated it?



Spoiler



Bane is supposed to be Latino. His only appearance in every comic or animation series is because he is hired by Rupert Thorne to kill Batman.

But what does he do here? He's a terrorist. He has no relation in any previous batman comics/animations to Ra's al Ghul but out of the blue he's now is son? They twist the backstories of two characters now that weren't even related into each others blood?

And this shit about the league of shadows again? It was bad enough they totally fucked Ra's Al Ghul's character and relation to Batman in the first movie but now they bring it back? And Bane is part of it? NO NO NO NO NO

And don't even get me started on Robin.

Dick Greyson is the first Robin, end of story. There isn't even a Robin with the name 1. John Blake and 2. Robin.

This is what I hate about Hollywood. They didn't make a Batman trilogy, they made a movie and then dressed the characters up like those from batman.

Movie 1:
Ra's Al Ghul did not train Bruce Wayne, and the League of Shadows never existed. And they just throw Rachel in there because Bruce Wayne needs to have girl troubles!

Movie 2:
Heath Ledger did not play the Joker. He played a terrorist that dressed like the Joker. 

And I just went off on movie three already.
Well there we go!

I did think that the first two were good movies, just not good "batman movies," but this last one was pretty boring I thought.




also i can't stand the "batman voice" that is done
Anne Hathaway did a fair job, much to my surprise


----------



## Hemi-Powered Drone

My only problem with the film, and this only really matters to a reader was



Spoiler



Bane is supposed to be, essentially, a Luchador. He's supposed to be Spanish, totally ripped, and wear a full, luchador style mask. Instead they turned him into a bulky bare knuckle boxing type Scotsman. It actually reminded me a lot of when Sean Connery played Juan Sanchez in Highlander. They still made Bane work with this new character, but it bothered me a bit. And the scene where he broke the Bat was absolutely *PERFECT*. Though my friends and I made asses of ourselves when we were the only four in the theatre that cheered when he broke him. That was, excuse the unintentional pun, the make or break moment of the movie. We didn't really care for Bane save for the fact that he was the only man to break the Bat.



Otherwise I absolutely LOVED it. The Dark Knight was a fantastic trilogy and I feel that this may have been the strongest one.

Also, Christopher Nolan is a dick,


Spoiler



you know, adding in the little Robin thing at the end, even though he keeps stressing he's done with Batman. Maybe he's going to do a Nightwing movie? That could be pretty cool.



The theatre I originally was going to see it at had a sprinkler malfunction, so they had to close it down temporarily. Problem was, they eventually decided that they shouldn't tell the public what happened. Combine that with the fact that, due to there being a concert at the Bank Atlantic Center across the street, there were police in the parking lot at the mall, and there were some people that started to panic. It was sad and hilarious at the same time, because I would think it'd be easy to figure out it wasn't something bad by the fact that they didn't close the entire mall.


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Saw the movie, and it was good, but I was a little disappointed with it. It felt like the plot wasn't very substantial, even though a lot of stuff was happening and it felt a bit rushed.. Sort of strange. 

Wasn't it once said that Nolan was committed to making 5 of these movies or something?


----------



## flint757

dragonblade629 said:


> My only problem with the film, and this only really matters to a reader was
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Bane is supposed to be, essentially, a Luchador. He's supposed to be Spanish, totally ripped, and wear a full, luchador style mask. Instead they turned him into a bulky bare knuckle boxing type Scotsman. It actually reminded me a lot of when Sean Connery played Juan Sanchez in Highlander. They still made Bane work with this new character, but it bothered me a bit. And the scene where he broke the Bat was absolutely *PERFECT*. Though my friends and I made asses of ourselves when we were the only four in the theatre that cheered when he broke him. That was, excuse the unintentional pun, the make or break moment of the movie. We didn't really care for Bane save for the fact that he was the only man to break the Bat.
> 
> 
> 
> Otherwise I absolutely LOVED it. The Dark Knight was a fantastic trilogy and I feel that this may have been the strongest one.
> 
> Also, Christopher Nolan is a dick,
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> you know, adding in the little Robin thing at the end, even though he keeps stressing he's done with Batman. Maybe he's going to do a Nightwing movie? That could be pretty cool.
> 
> 
> 
> The theatre I originally was going to see it at had a sprinkler malfunction, so they had to close it down temporarily. Problem was, they eventually decided that they shouldn't tell the public what happened. Combine that with the fact that, due to there being a concert at the Bank Atlantic Center across the street, there were police in the parking lot at the mall, and there were some people that started to panic. It was sad and hilarious at the same time, because I would think it'd be easy to figure out it wasn't something bad by the fact that they didn't close the entire mall.





Spoiler



I like your theory because then it means he was only technically telling the truth and will continue on with a new hero. There are plenty of options.


----------



## Hemi-Powered Drone

Adam Of Angels said:


> Wasn't it once said that Nolan was committed to making 5 of these movies or something?



Recently he's been saying he wanted to keep it a trilogy.


----------



## vanhendrix

Spoiler



Can we talk about when Bane died? What the hell

After Batman was _finally _able to win a fight in the movie, it was rendered pointless by the betrayal (I was _wondering_ when she'd show up). To pick that moment as the twist worked timing-wise, but it just destroyed the _one time _Batman actually got to kick some ass. Think about it. In the Nolan movies, Batman really isn't all that great at what he does. We jump from "brand new at batmanning, still figuring things out" in the first 2 to "old and decrepit, been out of the game too long". For the sake of giving something for Bruce to be conflicted and troubled about (that plane? gimme a break) we never once get to see an established, badass Batman. Then later in the scene when catwoman shows up and casually blasts Bane...I really felt like that moment should have had more weight behind it. I mean, at the time I thought she had shot the gun out of his hand or maybe knocked him out. It wasn't until I was driving home until I realized that, wait, that was the last we saw of Bane? That was the death of the main villain? Lame. There's just no payoff for anything in this movie.

Plus Batman should have died. The restaurant scene was absolute cornball. And Robin? Don't even get me started...

Still a good movie, as far as movies go. Not a good Nolan movie though, no sir.


----------



## MFB

MrPepperoniNipples said:


> Am I the only one that absolutely hated it?
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Bane is supposed to be Latino. His only appearance in every comic or animation series is because he is hired by Rupert Thorne to kill Batman.
> 
> But what does he do here? He's a terrorist. He has no relation in any previous Batman comics/animations to Ra's al Ghul but out of the blue he's now is son? They twist the backstories of two characters now that weren't even related into each others blood?
> 
> And this shit about the League of Shadows again? It was bad enough they totally fucked Ra's Al Ghul's character and relation to Batman in the first movie but now they bring it back? And Bane is part of it? NO NO NO NO NO
> 
> And don't even get me started on Robin. Dick Greyson is the first Robin, end of story. There isn't even a Robin with the name 1. John Blake and 2. Robin.
> 
> This is what I hate about Hollywood. They didn't make a Batman trilogy, they made a movie and then dressed the characters up like those from batman.
> 
> Movie 1: Ra's Al Ghul did not train Bruce Wayne, and the League of Shadows never existed. And they just throw Rachel in there because Bruce Wayne needs to have girl troubles!
> 
> Movie 2: Heath Ledger did not play the Joker. He played a terrorist that dressed like the Joker.
> 
> And I just went off on movie three already.
> Well there we go!
> 
> I did think that the first two were good movies, just not good "batman movies," but this last one was pretty boring I thought.
> 
> 
> 
> Also I can't stand the "Batman voice" that is done. Anne Hathaway did a fair job, much to my surprise





Spoiler



Think of how silly it would've been if Bane were ACTUALLY a Luchador? I mean, did you SEE "Batman & Robin" and the atrocity that it was? Good lord, the imagining of Bane from the comics onto screen just makes him goofy and would totally counteract the ability for people to take him seriously. Yet when you make a change like making the Luchador mask into a more menacing form of gas mask and he still retains that sort of anonymity - he's TERRIFYING. God damn frightening. I was more terrified of Hardy/Nolan's rendition wearing the tac-vest and gas mask than I EVER was of the X' tall comic version that breaks Batman's back. I can't really justify the changing of him being Latino to white, but my guess is that no one really fit the role like Hardy did because shit - he's been the big, beefy jacked up guy for the past 3 roles  I've yet to see a big burly, Latino actor that could've commanded a performance like Hardy did.

Wayne's connection to the League of Shadows is really only one degree off as Bruce trained with Master Kirigi who also trained members of the League, so that's not that big of a stretch. I'd have to look up and see if Ra's himself trained with him since he may have, I can't remember at the moment. However, Bane ISN'T associated with the League and they even say this after they reveal Talia. That whole spiel Ra's told him in the prison wasn't in detail and he ASSUMED the child who came out was Bane, but it wasn't confirmed we all just took the bait. Talia said she asked for him to be a member of it as retribution for helping save her but he couldn't because all he could see in Bane was him being a monster.

Nightwing, I'm 50/50 on. I love, love, LOVE Dick Grayson and the Nightwing character but this is Nolan. If we had a character who was named Dick Grayson as a cop, people would immediately know the ending and realize he would take over the mantle as Batman. In this case, they decided to alter Robin and he never saw his parents die in front of him, and if anything he's closest to Tim Drake since he kind of earned his right as Robin - so if anything they should've named him Tim. But alas, they didn't. I found it to be a fine twist since everyone kind of saw it coming and it was a tongue-in-cheek one liner.

Ledger's Joker wasn't a terrorist either, he didn't blow up the entire city or take his hostage like Bane did - the entire time he was solely fucking with Batman because that's what he does. The ORIGINAL Joker was a psychopath who killed and had a very twisted view which this one slightly went back to while still keeping him fairly tame and "fun." The SHOW's Joker was really eccentric and colorful because guess what - IT WAS A KID'S SHOW ON CARTOON NETWORK! They COULDN'T have him gunning down innocents citizens so they made his pranks more fun and less destructive. Joker's been written eighteen different ways between people and those are the two sides of the coins to him - either sadistic or colorful, this one happened to be a slight combination. But to call him a terrorist? That's wrong.





dragonblade629 said:


> My only problem with the film, and this only really matters to a reader was
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Bane is supposed to be, essentially, a Luchador. He's supposed to be Spanish, totally ripped, and wear a full, luchador style mask. Instead they turned him into a bulky bare knuckle boxing type Scotsman. It actually reminded me a lot of when Sean Connery played Juan Sanchez in Highlander. They still made Bane work with this new character, but it bothered me a bit. And the scene where he broke the Bat was absolutely *PERFECT*. Though my friends and I made asses of ourselves when we were the only four in the theatre that cheered when he broke him. That was, excuse the unintentional pun, the make or break moment of the movie. We didn't really care for Bane save for the fact that he was the only man to break the Bat.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, Christopher Nolan is a dick,
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> you know, adding in the little Robin thing at the end, even though he keeps stressing he's done with Batman. Maybe he's going to do a Nightwing movie? That could be pretty cool.





Spoiler



For the Bane part of this, see my first reference in my above spoilers. As for a Nightwing/Robin movie, I'd prefer they go with Tim Drake as he was closer to the Robin in this than any other. In the comics, Drake was also there the night the flying Graysons died with Dick and he did detective work and earned his right to be Robin down the line. In this case, that's how Blake was - he was a beat cop turned detective who figured out Batman was Bruce Wayne, and helped him fight off Bane as just a regular guy. Plus, they could use the Arkham City Robin costume which to me looks TOTALLY badass and is practical minus the fact that he doesn't have sleeves  

You weren't the only one making an ass of yourself when Bane broke the back either, me and several friends of mine where like halfway out of our seats and we all had like cries of excitement and giddiness afterwards. I think I may have even been shaking from how great it was to see.


----------



## The Reverend

I'm so behind. I haven't seen this, haven't finished Season 2 of Game Of Thrones, and I'm behind on Avatar. It's like these spoiler tags are mocking me.


----------



## Xaios

MFB wins.


----------



## MFB

Aww, schucks


----------



## MrPepperoniNipples

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Think of how silly it would've been if Bane were ACTUALLY a Luchador? I mean, did you SEE "Batman & Robin" and the atrocity that it was? Good lord, the imagining of Bane from the comics onto screen just makes him goofy and would totally counteract the ability for people to take him seriously. Yet when you make a change like making the Luchador mask into a more menacing form of gas mask and he still retains that sort of anonymity - he's TERRIFYING. God damn frightening. I was more terrified of Hardy/Nolan's rendition wearing the tac-vest and gas mask than I EVER was of the X' tall comic version that breaks Batman's back. I can't really justify the changing of him being Latino to white, but my guess is that no one really fit the role like Hardy did because shit - he's been the big, beefy jacked up guy for the past 3 roles  I've yet to see a big burly, Latino actor that could've commanded a performance like Hardy did.
> 
> Wayne's connection to the League of Shadows is really only one degree off as Bruce trained with Master Kirigi who also trained members of the League, so that's not that big of a stretch. I'd have to look up and see if Ra's himself trained with him since he may have, I can't remember at the moment. However, Bane ISN'T associated with the League and they even say this after they reveal Talia. That whole spiel Ra's told him in the prison wasn't in detail and he ASSUMED the child who came out was Bane, but it wasn't confirmed we all just took the bait. Talia said she asked for him to be a member of it as retribution for helping save her but he couldn't because all he could see in Bane was him being a monster.
> 
> Nightwing, I'm 50/50 on. I love, love, LOVE Dick Grayson and the Nightwing character but this is Nolan. If we had a character who was named Dick Grayson as a cop, people would immediately know the ending and realize he would take over the mantle as Batman. In this case, they decided to alter Robin and he never saw his parents die in front of him, and if anything he's closest to Tim Drake since he kind of earned his right as Robin - so if anything they should've named him Tim. But alas, they didn't. I found it to be a fine twist since everyone kind of saw it coming and it was a tongue-in-cheek one liner.
> 
> Ledger's Joker wasn't a terrorist either, he didn't blow up the entire city or take his hostage like Bane did - the entire time he was solely fucking with Batman because that's what he does. The ORIGINAL Joker was a psychopath who killed and had a very twisted view which this one slightly went back to while still keeping him fairly tame and "fun." The SHOW's Joker was really eccentric and colorful because guess what - IT WAS A KID'S SHOW ON CARTOON NETWORK! They COULDN'T have him gunning down innocents citizens so they made his pranks more fun and less destructive. Joker's been written eighteen different ways between people and those are the two sides of the coins to him - either sadistic or colorful, this one happened to be a slight combination. But to call him a terrorist? That's wrong.





Spoiler



I'm not so much bothered that he wasn't a luchador but his connection with Ghul altogether, regardless of the league of shadows because that shouldn't exist in the first place.

And Ghul doesn't have any direct connection with Master Kirigi, other than training a few members in his league of assassins, which I'm not even sure were in the league until after Nyssa took over.

Also referring to it as the league of shadows in the movies as opposed to of assassins makes these types of discussions difficult 

Ledger's Joker didn't have the "Joker" vibe, neither the colorful one or the sadistic one. But that I guess has to do with how I interpreted him whilst reading the comics back in the day.
ledger's sorta reminded me of Captain Jack Sparrow


----------



## VILARIKA

Spoiler



Probably my favorite line in the movie. I don't remember it word for word but I can make it out close enough:

Scarecrow: So what will it be, death or exile?

Gordon: ...Death.

Scarecrow: Ok, Death....



"BY EXILE!"


----------



## flint757

Spoiler



What I loved about that scene too was that the first guy falls through the ice and then all of a sudden people are just walking over it like it is nothing. Seemed illogical to me.


----------



## VILARIKA

flint757 said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> What I loved about that scene too was that the first guy falls through the ice and then all of a sudden people are just walking over it like it is nothing. Seemed illogical to me.





Spoiler



There was a lot that was illogical in this movie , but the quality of the movie makes up for it in my opinion. 

Bane was quite terrifying, and ironically, I think his voice added to his intimidating figure. The battle in the sewer really got me tensed up, especially when Bane smashed Batman's mask.


----------



## Mwoit

genome said:


> Also, Bane's voice felt a bit loud in the mix in comparison to the other characters and very obviously ADR'ed, but I got used to it after a while.
> 
> Was it actually Tom Hardy's voice or a David Prowse/James Earl Jones type thing?



Hardy's voice was booming the entire movie, no matter where he was it felt like he was right next to you. I couldn't get past his voice, the intonation he used to end every sentence made me think Bane was ridiculous!

Good film though. 



Spoiler



The thing that really broke the movie illusion was when Batman gives Gordon the flare to light up the bridge with the Batman logo. He's only got a couple of hours to stop the fusion bomb, so the first he does is set up the bridge with the sign?



EDIT:

Another thing...



Spoiler



Another totally shattering point was the end when Lucius Fox is asking "What I could have done to fix the auto pilot" then discovers Bruce Wayne fixed it. C'mon! That's just... no! Is Bruce Wayne the secret computer scientist AI in disguise too?


----------



## jordanky

I don't see this as needing a spoiler tag, so someone correct me if I'm wrong. 

Am I the only one stoked to see Nolan cast Prison Break characters in the last two films? William Fichtner (Alex Mahone), Wade Williams (Brad Bellick), and Reggie Lee (William Kim) all made small cameos that didn't matter, but I was still excited to see them because I loved Prison Break.


----------



## Xaios

VILARIKA said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Probably my favorite line in the movie. I don't remember it word for word but I can make it out close enough:
> 
> Scarecrow: So what will it be, death or exile?
> 
> Gordon: ...Death.
> 
> Scarecrow: Ok, Death....
> 
> 
> 
> "BY EXILE!"


----------



## Rick

I absolutely loved it. The only problem I had was


Spoiler



when Selina hits Bane with the missile from the Batcycle, it separates Bane from Batman. But what happened to him?


----------



## flint757

My guess is a lot of problems were because of editing. The rest is the typical super hero fallacies and illogical impossibilities that would end a movie in 5 minutes if they didn't happen the way they did.


----------



## vanhendrix

Rick said:


> I absolutely loved it. The only problem I had was
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> when Selina hits Bane with the missile from the Batcycle, it separates Bane from Batman. But what happened to him?




That was exactly my point.


Spoiler



I guess he died?


----------



## simulclass83




----------



## jaredowty

K this movie is some overrated horseshit. Here's my rantview that I've been posting all over the net..

I'll have to watch it a second time in order to give a more informed and well-rounded criticism, but here's some initial thoughts:

Pros:

1) The acting was solid, including the smaller roles (even saw Robert Wisdom and Aiden Gillian, two of my favorite actors). JGL brought a lot of heart and charisma to an otherwise bland role. Hathaway actually managed to be sexy for once, and did a nice job IMO (loved her feline-like movements, though some of her line-delivery was corny). Bale, Caine, Oldman and Freeman were their usual reliable selves. Hardy was limited by wearing a mask but did a lot of acting with his eyes, which takes some serious skill. Hated his voice, though, Cotillard..*drool*. Was too struck by her beauty to notice her performance...

2) Effects. I thought the CGI on The Bat looked amazing, frankly, and the practical effects were great in typical Nolan fashion. Most of the actions scenes were too remiscent of the first two films, but were entertaining nonetheless.


Spoiler



I LOVED seeing Batman and Catwoman fighting together.



3) Photography was nice. I prefer the visual tone of the first two films (especially the dirty browns of Batman Begins), but there were some nice shots and moods here.

4) The inspiration from


Spoiler



No Man's Land, Knightfall and The Dark Knight Returns


 was appreciated. Too bad the execution was shit.

5) The score was good, but like everyone has mentioned, the audio mix was horrible. I missed some dialogue because of the ear-piercing score (which, given the general quality of this film's dialgoue, may not of been a bad thing). 

6)


Spoiler



Bane kicks Batman's ass. One of the best scenes of the trilogy and easily the best scene in the film.



7) Big, epic scale.

Cons:

It seems like all the things I disliked about Batman Begins and The Dark Knight are further accentuated in this film. Huge leaps of logic, epic plotholes and conveniences, uneven attempts at "realism", prententious/"precious" dialogue that in no way reflects how people actually communicate, corny one-liners that are downright unnecessary. lame attempts at humor, characters that are almost completely unrelatable, clunky pacing, and some vague, half-baked attemtps at social relevance. TDKR is riddled with new problems as well: retread of previous films, lame plot twists (Scooby-Doo esque big reveals), TONS of spoon-fed exposition, and some scenes that are supposed to make us teary-eyed but make us laugh or cringe instead.

1) Pacing. The Dark Knight's frantic, disjointed pacing actually works in it's favor at times, and makes for a goddamn intense first-time viewing. Here in The Dark Knight Rises, it's downright annoying. From the very first ten minutes, things just didn't feel right, which is never a good sign. Things just seem to "happen" without proper buildup


Spoiler



(especially Batman's initial return), and the audience would have no awareness of the timelines of events if it weren't for Bane's bomb countdown.


 It all felt very rushed and obscure to me.

2) Lame, expositional dalougue.


Spoiler



Everyone has some painful , uber-dark backstory that they must spew out in the least realistic way possible and at the most awkward times, usually accompanied by a flashback.


 And then there's the cheesey one-liners...sooo many one-liners.....

3) An over-reliance of characters conveniently showing up at the exact RIGHT time..this is a cliche that I find obnoxious in all storytelling, and was present in BB and TDK (a few "last-minute rescue" moments), but is taken to the max in this film. So typical. So lazy.

4) Illogical bullshit.


Spoiler



Why the fuck would the residents of Gotham be so gung-ho at overthrowing the rich 1% if crime has been LOW since the Dent Act? Generally, it takes extreme unrest and extreme crime/corruption to warrant a "revolution"...yet here we are, in "peace time", about to experience an uprising to end all uprisings. It takes the zany concept of No Man's Land (isolating Gotham City) and somehow makes it even less believable.


 Whatever attemtps at realism the series made in the past (which were sometimes laughable, at other times satisfying) are completely lost. We're in generic superhero fantasy mode here, just like all the other comic book movies. Problem is, TDKR tries to be dark and edgy instead of being fun like other said comic book films, and falls flat on it's face as it tries to make up it's mind on what kind of tone it wants to possess. (I'll explore the lack of narrative logic to a further degree after I see it again and have my memory refreshed on the overwhelming dispaly of events)

5) Lack of intensity...I remember being on the edge of my seat the first time I saw TDK., and of course seeing Batman's origins in the first film was interesting. Here, I was mostly bored..hell I even almost fell asleep at one point, and kept checking the time on my phone, waiting for it to be over. This rarely happens to me.

6) Bane is just plain uninteresting.


Spoiler



His motivations are copied and pasted from Rhas, ony he's completely one-dimensional and lacks humor or wit. Not Hardy's fault, though.



7) Re-tread of the first two films.


Spoiler



Bane, like I mentioned, is simply a brawnier, less interesting extension of Rhas Al Ghul. The whole "Wayne Enterprises weapon stolen by bad guys to destroy the city" at the core of the conflict was already done in Batman Begins, remember? Wayen in prison, too. Action scenes feel like less inspired versions of what we saw in TDK, with far less "wow" factor.



8)


Spoiler



"Which girl will Bruce choose?" Who gives a shit? There's zero chemistry between him and Hathaway, and only a little between him and Cotillard.



9) The big reveals felt cheap. I'm a TV guy, so I'm a bit picky in this area.

10) Spider-Man 3 syndrome of trying to stuff WAY too much into one movie. The film, even at nearly three hours, barely has time to breathe. Shit is just all over the place.

11) I've always picked on Nolan's films for being psuedo-intellectual, and now we're treated to some psuedo-emotion.


Spoiler



We get a teary eyed Alfred, a severely beaten Wayne, and many characters at the biggest moments of their lives as the city is torn apart in a way that it never has been...so how is it that I don't care, at all?


 It felt sentimental rather than dramatic.

12) I was expecting an ending that would shock me, but I saw it coming a mile away.

13) So-called "Social Commentary": One critic hit the nail on the head: "Christopher Nolan wants to entertain you, but he also wants you to think about..stuff"

American viewers are so starved of smart, socially relevant storytelling that we like to think weak attempts like Nolan's bat-films are somehow "deep". I'm not saying Nolan isn't intelligent, it's pretty obvious that he is...he just has no idea how to properly explore the themes introduces, or how to get to the bone of an issue.

We get lots of "stuff" in the trilogy. Fear, chaos, 9/11 references, Wall Street/occupy references, Bush comparisons, revolutions. Thing is, none of it means anything. There's no message, no insight into crime or the human condition, nor the nature of terrorism. None of us can relate to the problems Batman and Gotham face. What conclusions are we meant to draw from these films? Please, don't all answer at once.

Uh-oh, guess I'll just be labeled a "hater" who's sole purpose is to pick on Nolan and his fanbase...lol...



jordanky said:


> Am I the only one stoked to see Nolan cast Prison Break characters in the last two films? William Fichtner (Alex Mahone), Wade Williams (Brad Bellick), and Reggie Lee (William Kim) all made small cameos that didn't matter, but I was still excited to see them because I loved Prison Break.



There were also two The Wire-alumni (Robert Wisdom as the soldier on the bridge, Aidan Gillan as the CIA agent in the prologue) and even a guy from Dexter (Quinn!).


----------



## flint757

While I was able to overlook some of that and enjoy the film to an extent I actually think you were rather spot on. News sources are talking about how it is destined for awards and whatnot, but I don't get it.


Spoiler



OWS reference though was ridiculously obvious and he clearly has a very low opinion of them given the setting/role the people took in this film.


----------



## MFB

jaredowty said:


> 4) Illogical bullshit.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Why the fuck would the residents of Gotham be so gung-ho at overthrowing the rich 1% if crime has been LOW since the Dent Act? Generally, it takes extreme unrest and extreme crime/corruption to warrant a "revolution"...yet here we are, in "peace time", about to experience an uprising to end all uprisings. It takes the zany concept of No Man's Land (isolating Gotham City) and somehow makes it even less believable.





Spoiler



I think this was more in their own interests of self survival, because if they didn't rise up then they'd be considered the enemy along with the 1% they were supposed to fight against. Plus, it wasn't about overthrowing the rich because crime is low, it's because the rich still weren't helping those lower than themselves and were kind of thriving off it, so that's what Bane was about - he was bridging the gap between the extremely rich of Gotham and the extremely poor.



As for the dialogue


Spoiler



This one had introduced a lot of new characters, so that requires explaining their origins but I didn't feel it was overly sobby. Bane's got kind of a "troubled" past for lack of better word so it's necessary to explain what he's gone through, and Talia had to kind of alter what we had already been told because some of the stuff about the child in the prison was about her. You can see where I'm going with this. Etc... etc...


----------



## Varcolac

Saw it. Rather liked it. Still processing. Overwhelmingly positive though.


----------



## sakeido

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I think this was more in their own interests of self survival, because if they didn't rise up then they'd be considered the enemy along with the 1% they were supposed to fight against. Plus, it wasn't about overthrowing the rich because crime is low, it's because the rich still weren't helping those lower than themselves and were kind of thriving off it, so that's what Bane was about - he was bridging the gap between the extremely rich of Gotham and the extremely poor.
> 
> 
> 
> As for the dialogue
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> This one had introduced a lot of new characters, so that requires explaining their origins but I didn't feel it was overly sobby. Bane's got kind of a "troubled" past for lack of better word so it's necessary to explain what he's gone through, and Talia had to kind of alter what we had already been told because some of the stuff about the child in the prison was about her. You can see where I'm going with this. Etc... etc...



bane wasn't about anything. 


Spoiler



alright, so give the poor some hope...... and then blow them up with a nuke? and as far as I can tell, him and Talia were both well within the nuke's blast radius so apparently they were planning on killing themselves as well?

seems to me this is yet another half-baked thematic element for the series. look, terrorists! nuclear suicide bombers! Occupy Gotham! give us our jobs back! or just a flimsy excuse for an incredibly violent disproportionate revenge on behalf of Ras al Gul


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



I suppose I should've said that Bane/TALIA were about bridging the gap, but even that wasn't necessarily their end game - their end game was the total destruction of Gotham after tearing it down and having Bruce watch it's demise. They would've gotten away with it to if it wasn't for that meddling Batman! But seriously, they were picking up were Ra's left of with destroying Gotham, but they set a stage that made it seem as if there was a chance that it wouldn't happen. That's why when they told the Special Forces Unit that came in under the guise of being food and supplies that everything wasn't as it seemed, they really meant it. It LOOKED to the outside world that they could appease them and they wouldn't detonate the bomb because they didn't release the information about it being on a timer. So in reality the whole 'tearing down the rich and building up the poor' was even a cover for their real motive.


----------



## ittoa666

Loved the movie. Anne Hathaway is hawt. That is all.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Spoiler



I loved the film, my only issues were that Bane's voice was a little hard to understand at times, and Bruce's relationship with Catwoman changes too abruptly. It goes from her betraying him, leaving him with Bane who near kills him and takes control of Gotham, to suddenly falling in love and heading off together. Catwoman is a cool character, but she's not exactly a 'nice' character, so it seems kinda weird Bruce would forgive her so easily when she'd quite easily leave him and Gotham to perish. 

As for the changes to character's origins etc, you have to accept that this isn't simply a comic book/movie re-adaptation, it is a re-imagining. You have to tear yourself away from wanting everything to be like the comics, and accept something new.

I loved Bane though. Tom Hardy was awesome. I heard people saying he wasn't big enough, but to be honest he was still huge ad his presence was scary enough. His voice was kinda funny and camp at times, especially when he sees the Batman symbol and realises he's still alive and says 'impossible!' in a pretty ridiculous way.  Otherwise, awesome awesome film. Dare I say, better than the original.


----------



## Xaios

vampiregenocide said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> His voice was kinda funny and camp at times, especially when he sees the Batman symbol and realises he's still alive and says 'impossible!' in a pretty ridiculous way.


----------



## fps

vanhendrix said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Can we talk about when Bane died? What the hell
> 
> After Batman was _finally _able to win a fight in the movie, it was rendered pointless by the betrayal (I was _wondering_ when she'd show up). To pick that moment as the twist worked timing-wise, but it just destroyed the _one time _Batman actually got to kick some ass. Think about it. In the Nolan movies, Batman really isn't all that great at what he does. We jump from "brand new at batmanning, still figuring things out" in the first 2 to "old and decrepit, been out of the game too long". For the sake of giving something for Bruce to be conflicted and troubled about (that plane? gimme a break) we never once get to see an established, badass Batman. Then later in the scene when catwoman shows up and casually blasts Bane...I really felt like that moment should have had more weight behind it. I mean, at the time I thought she had shot the gun out of his hand or maybe knocked him out. It wasn't until I was driving home until I realized that, wait, that was the last we saw of Bane? That was the death of the main villain? Lame. There's just no payoff for anything in this movie.
> 
> Plus Batman should have died. The restaurant scene was absolute cornball. And Robin? Don't even get me started...
> 
> Still a good movie, as far as movies go. Not a good Nolan movie though, no sir.





Spoiler



Bane deserved more, he was the key bad guy in the whole movie, and suddenly in 5 minutes he became a henchman without his own vision at all. This rendered his own philosophy, all his words, meaningless. I couldn't care less about Talia suddenly being this big presence, she was the worst actress throughout the film, she didn't have any time to establish herself (saying *kill them all* doesn't count, she was about to blow up EVERYONE IN GOTHAM so what difference did it make?), and her death scene was embarrassing. 

Maybe Bane didn't deserve a big showy hero's death, but there should have been more. He should have been in the background screaming and writhing, or just twitching, as they left, that would have been enough for me. Alternatively, preferably, Batman still shouldn't have been able to take him down physically. 

The story became too convoluted, I still want to see it again because there were so many great bits, but there really didn't need to be a nuclear bomb, there didn't, once that was introduced there was only one way out, Gotham is saved, Batman lives, not in doubt IMO. Also it rendered Bane's vision of giving people a little circle of sky to destroy them with hope obsolete. It would have been a freakier film if he just wanted to rule Gotham with no-one in no-one out and power to the people enough that they destroyed themselves. But that wouldn't give you a big Hollywood countdown-to-crisis moment to end the movie on would it? Also, what we got in the prison with Batman, let's not beat around the bush, it was a montage, pure Rocky. 

I wonder whether, and it goes without saying the tragedy of Heath Ledger's untimely death made it impossible and it would have been inappropriate to bring the character back or reference him, Nolan intended to bring the Joker back as well as part of his grand vision, and ended up having to fudge something due to Ledger's passing. Because the nuke aspect was bloody boring. There was not a chance that thing was gonna go off and annihilate Gotham, once the stakes are that high in a film there's only one outcome.

Also, nothing action-wise came close to touching the FEET of the scene where Batman fought Bane for the first time. That was the action high point by such a long way that the ending paled in comparison. That's not what you want from a film. But what a scene, can't get it out of my head, the intensity, there was a very real feeling of dread, the filming, editing, it was a man looking around him thinking *this is where it ends for me, this is where I die*

There were so many good, even great, parts though that I'm looking forward to seeing it again and getting my head around it, and that doesn't normally happen. Most films don't make it out of the start gate when it comes to me bothering to care. This film I care about which is why on first viewing the flaws were so frustrating (how does Batman keep meeting Catwoman at random? Why do impossible-to-predict things happen and get seamlessly integrated into the villains' plans?) And yet.... The middle section from the fight through the establishment of Bane's new order was utterly chilling, I was so silent and still. A shame his character was thrown away at the end for all the hokey League of Shadows stuff with its pseudo-spiritual musings that nearly killed the first movie.


----------



## vampiregenocide

fps said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Bane deserved more, he was the key bad guy in the whole movie, and suddenly in 5 minutes he became a henchman without his own vision at all. This rendered his own philosophy, all his words, meaningless. I couldn't care less about Talia suddenly being this big presence, she was the worst actress throughout the film, she didn't have any time to establish herself (saying *kill them all* doesn't count, she was about to blow up EVERYONE IN GOTHAM so what difference did it make?), and her death scene was embarrassing.
> 
> Maybe Bane didn't deserve a big showy hero's death, but there should have been more. He should have been in the background screaming and writhing, or just twitching, as they left, that would have been enough for me. Alternatively, preferably, Batman still shouldn't have been able to take him down physically.





Spoiler



Agreed. I felt Bane's end was too abrupt. Suddenly, his whole back story is revealed to be a lie, and just as you're wondering 'so where the fuck did he come from?', he is quickly killed off. It would've been better if Batman had torn his mask off and Bane died slowly and painfully.


----------



## fps

vampiregenocide said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Agreed. I felt Bane's end was too abrupt. Suddenly, his whole back story is revealed to be a lie, and just as you're wondering 'so where the fuck did he come from?', he is quickly killed off. It would've been better if Batman had torn his mask off and Bane died slowly and painfully.





Spoiler



Yeah, I mean, whatever Nolan wanted, but just, more of it. Then again the *sidekick saves the day in the nick of time* thing was one of several cliches that reared its ugly head near the end, along with the ticking bomb (never do it, there's no suspense in it. Except maybe that the people of Gotham will all get radiation poisoning, which is a grim but perhaps unintended consequence of all of this). But seriously, in TDK those boats could have gone up. A nuclear device to destroy all of Gotham? Never gonna happen. 

Still, I can't wait to see this film again. For instance, this wasn't some Prometheus-like abomination. It's a really, really good film, and those are very rare IMO. That's why I take issue with some of it.


----------



## Lorcan Ward

Great film!! What an end to an amazing trilogy.


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



I think Bane's motives were still what he was saying and that he really did believe everything he said, he just wasn't the highest of highs; he was fulfilling a role he had to play and was only revealed because Batman made it back out of the prison. If that hadn't happened, he would've been assumed as the be-all-end-all of the League of Shadows. 

Do we know he's dead as well? I mean, he took a heavy hit but we haven't seen anything saying he's dead plus the Venom that he took in the comics gave him incredible resistance to pain so he could build himself back up. As for his origins, you know he still came from the prison and he was affected by the plague/inmates after he saved Talia from them. Ra's came in and ex-communicated him and so he was a mercenary instead who kept an allegiance with her when I assume she asked him for help bringing down Gotham and Batman. It wasn't necessarily all a lie, we were told bits of his origin here and there but were also told false stuff and Talia herself revealed most of what I said right there.

I do wish he got a bit more of a closing though


----------



## vampiregenocide

Spoiler



Catwoman blows up a wall of cars and concrete with the Bat-Pod, so if Bane survived that then he really is a force to be reckoned with.


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



I didn't think that was only with one shot, I thought it was a few shots to do that, so that would mean the power behind them was good yeah but he was also wearing that diesel ballistic vest and combined with the Venom, he might've at least been out of commission for a while.


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think that was only with one shot, I thought it was a few shots to do that, so that would mean the power behind them was good yeah but he was also wearing that diesel ballistic vest and combined with the Venom, he might've at least been out of commission for a while.





Spoiler



They've done a lot of damage with one shot, certainly more than a person could take. Yeah, but it wasn't actually venom in this film, just painkillers. They don't make him stronger, just enable him to survive the intense pain. Besides, this is the last Batman film they're doing anyway so I wouldn't expect to see Bane back regardless.


----------



## VILARIKA

Spoiler



Was Talia the only person aware of what Bane's mask was for? If I was Batman and I was aware of Bane's mask and it's fatalities, I wouldn't even fight the guy. I'd just stand from a distance and throw batarangs at his face 





Spoiler



Looking back at the trilogy now, these movies deserve to have good villain deaths, or at least villain endings. I don't think there was much put into that unfortunately.


----------



## potatohead

Went and saw this last night for the first time. 



Spoiler



I completely agree with what most of you are saying. I thought the timeframe of the movie jumped around way too much. From the time Bane stole the bomb to it going off was supposed to be five months, but it seems like two days in the movie. The only thing that made you feel it might be longer was Wayne working and trying to heal while in the jail.

I also thought there was way too much "sidekick last minute saves". I would have loved to see the fight between Bane and Batman finished at the end, but Catwoman just barges in there and shoots the guy. Lame. When Wayne tries to leave the jail without the rope, did anyone think he actually wouldn't make it? In fact did anyone ever think the bomb would actually go off? Of course not.

Some of the acting was good, some was terrible. Talia's death scene was almost laughably bad. 

I do think Bane is still alive. I also don't think this is the last Batman movie, it's just the last one Nolan is doing (or so he says). Seriously if they throw enough money at these guys to make another one, they'll do it. I think that's why the ending was left pretty wide open. If I was Nolan I would do the exact same thing, if they think you don't want to do it they're going to pay you more. Look at Depp and the Pirates movies. He didn't want to do more after the third until they started throwing nine figures at him. 

Anyway, with all that said, I did enjoy the movie quite a bit.


----------



## Xaios

Saw the movie a second time last night, and I gotta say, it benefits immensely from repeated viewings. I'm pretty good at catching subtleties in films, but there was a LOT that I caught onto on second viewing that I missed the first time around. This film is absolutely packed with fine detail.

And yeah, Anne Hathaway is just hot as hell in this movie.


----------



## sakeido

I'm not sure if I want to see this one again.. Dark Knight there was an absolutely incredible intensity to it the first time I saw it, and I wanted to get back to it as soon as I could to put myself in that same headspace only to realize it was only going to be like that the first time. TDKR didn't have that same sense of impending doom and it wasn't as exhilirating to experience.. I'm worried I'll get bored before the movie is even half done


----------



## MFB

vampiregenocide said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> They've done a lot of damage with one shot, certainly more than a person could take. Yeah, but it wasn't actually venom in this film, just painkillers. They don't make him stronger, just enable him to survive the intense pain. Besides, this is the last Batman film they're doing anyway so I wouldn't expect to see Bane back regardless.





Spoiler



Ah, OK then - I thought Nolan still said it gave me a boost to his strength and numbed the pain making it a type of lesser Venom just not to the extent that everyone knows Bane to be taken to. If that's the case then I can fully see him being dead.

As for the mask bit, I don't see why anyone would think it didn't have some function, but to expect it to be that critical to his survival is a bit of a jump IMO. I could see it being a respirator on first glance but his basic life support? No, I wouldn't have thought that.

It does benefit from two viewings and you can really see Talia's change from after Bane starts to come into power and it's quite dramatic. Like her watching from above the Wall Street fight she just has this stone cold glare on her face that I didn't catch the first time. But her death scene was laughable, that much I can't argue. She just kind of closes her eyes and falls asleep.


----------



## vampiregenocide

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> As for the mask bit, I don't see why anyone would think it didn't have some function, but to expect it to be that critical to his survival is a bit of a jump IMO. I could see it being a respirator on first glance but his basic life support? No, I wouldn't have thought that.
> 
> It does benefit from two viewings and you can really see Talia's change from after Bane starts to come into power and it's quite dramatic. Like her watching from above the Wall Street fight she just has this stone cold glare on her face that I didn't catch the first time. But her death scene was laughable, that much I can't argue. She just kind of closes her eyes and falls asleep.





Spoiler



I don't think it was life support so much, just he had an injury that needed constant pain killers otherwise the pain would be unbearable. I'm still not sure on what the injury was exactly, whether it was from the inmates or the result of the plague in the prison.

I wasn't paying too much attention to her as I didn't expect that twist, so I probably missed a lot. I didn't think her death was that bad, though it would've made sense if she blew herself up and tried to take them with her. One thing I didn't get, similar to Bruce's relationship with Catwoman, Talia just sort of appears in the story and suddenly her and Bruce are sleeping together. Seemed to progress too quickly given how little dialogue they have together beforehand.


----------



## flint757

Spoiler



Even if she acted fabulously the rest of the movie her death scene would have discounted every last bit of it. It was just atrocious.


----------



## VILARIKA

The real question is: Who was hotter, Anne Hathaway as Catwoman, or Scarlett Johansson as Black Widow?











Anne Hathaway/Catwoman .


----------



## Xaios

VILARIKA said:


> The real question is: Who was hotter, Anne Hathaway as Catwoman, or Scarlett Johansson as Black Widow?



I'm gonna have to go with Anne Hathaway on this one. Scarlett Johansson is plenty hot, but the hotness of her performance in Iron Man 2 and The Avengers basically came from the fact that she was a babe beating up goons, which, to be fair, is pretty sexy. However, her character is cold and clinical.

Anne Hathaway's character, conversely, is incredibly sensual, not to mention flexible. And those legs, dear God, those legs...


----------



## MFB

I think I'm the only person who also found her WAY better as a Catwoman than Michelle Pfeiffer. I've never understood the love for the Catwoman from whichever Batman she was in - Forever, I think? - but I felt she looked ridiculous and wasn't very sexy.


----------



## flint757

halle berry? Anyone?


----------



## sakeido

MFB said:


> I think I'm the only person who also found her WAY better as a Catwoman than Michelle Pfeiffer. I've never understood the love for the Catwoman from whichever Batman she was in - Forever, I think? - but I felt she looked ridiculous and wasn't very sexy.


that'd be Batman Returns, the last of the Burton batmans. she was so sexy. still my favorite rendition of Catwoman. They did a much better job with the Selina Kyle/Bruce Wayne - Batman/Catwoman thing in Returns than they did in TDKR although


Spoiler



I do like how Catwoman & Batman end up together in this one. dunno what it is about that pairing that makes me care so much





flint757 said:


> halle berry? Anyone?


she was absolutely smokin in the Catwoman movie. the movie was absolutely terrible but god she looked great


----------



## VILARIKA

Hmm, I guess i'm biased since I've always liked Anne Hathaway. Same with Johansson, but something about Hathaway does it for me. 



Spoiler



Especially how she went about taking the keys to the lambo. Dat shit was hot.



And I never really got into the whole Halle Berry being ridiculously attractive thing, not to mention she didn't outperform Hathaway or Pfeiffer. Different strokes for different folks


----------



## flint757

Oh the movie Catwoman was bad, but I love me some Halle Berry.


----------



## SirMyghin

vampiregenocide said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I wasn't paying too much attention to her as I didn't expect that twist, so I probably missed a lot. I didn't think her death was that bad, though it would've made sense if she blew herself up and tried to take them with her. One thing I didn't get, similar to Bruce's relationship with Catwoman, Talia just sort of appears in the story and suddenly her and Bruce are sleeping together. Seemed to progress too quickly given how little dialogue they have together beforehand.





Spoiler



I think that one hearkens back to the billionaire playboy character perpetuated in the earlier films


----------



## vampiregenocide

SirMyghin said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I think that one hearkens back to the billionaire playboy character perpetuated in the earlier films





Spoiler



Both of the main female characters aren't your typical bimbo eye-candy. They're both strong, independent women and it seems like it would take more than money to win them over.


----------



## SirMyghin

vampiregenocide said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Both of the main female characters aren't your typical bimbo eye-candy. They're both strong, independent women and it seems like it would take more than money to win them over.





Spoiler



For catwoman I am inclined to agree, but for Talia, if you want to manipulate someone / dispel doubt, it is a pretty sound move. Especially when you suspect Bruce will be in for it.


----------



## hypotc

Saw the movie last night, and I think it was awesome. It sucked that the cinema didn't have any A/C on, making me sweat like hell, haha. Anyways, I enjoyed it alot!


----------



## Mr Violence

Ok, I have to address a few things I hated about this movie. This post is going to be TERRIBLY nitpicky, but I couldn't ignore these things. It was a grand and entertaining movie, but I was much more invested in TDK. Here's why:

1.)


Spoiler



TDK establishes that Batman can accomplish his goals without killing anyone. In TDKR, he kills people. I'm not going to explain it away that they could've lived. He fucking kills people. The mercs in the tumblers explode, the driver of the nuke truck dies so Talia has to drive and finally Talia dies, too. Batman kills them all. This effectively rapes the entire theme of the second movie.



2.)


Spoiler



The action was an absolute atrocity, save for the first Bane/Batman fight. Think about the final building scene in TDK. He disables the Joker's men and the SWAT team using tactics, gadgets and stealth. In TDKR, he fucking just jumps in the middle of a group of 10 guys with guns and they all wait patiently for Batman to fist their assholes. When they first enter that City Hall place during the last fight between Batman and Bane, a henchmen runs at Batman with a gun, NOT FIRING, and gets a nice dislocated shoulder. Just really stupid shit. Then, instead of using strategy to fight Bane, he just jumps in with no planning and tries to go toe-to-toe with the dude that BROKE HIS FUCKING BACK. During this fight in the mob, NO ONE on EITHER SIDE helps Batman or Bane to get the upper hand? They just ignore that the 2 powerhouses in control of everything are fighting and to let them do their thing? In a crowd of hundreds? GO FUCK YOURSELF. Also, the police decide to rally into an angry mob and run at armed gunmen? I believe police have training that includes, "Don't run at someone pointing a gun at you." They have some guns. I know it was symbolic, but it was FUCKING STUPID.



3.)


Spoiler



How the shit did Bruce Wayne get back to Gotham? Seriously. He was in Eastern Bumfuckistan with nothing but the clothes he was wearing. This one is a little nitpicky, but come the fuck on.



4.)


Spoiler



When the police see Batman, all of them chase him instead. Not half on Batman, half on the guys that just broke into the stock exchange. Nope. All of them go for Batman. I understand the dude in charge is a powertripping idiot. That's clearly established, but he's straight up not qualified for his fucking job at all. Fuck you again.



5.)


Spoiler



Also, isn't it fairly apparently that the transaction at the stock exchange was fraudulent? Can't they just overturn it remotely?



There are others but I couldn't get into the movie while still dealing with these really dumb sequences.

Bane was menacing, Catwoman was awesome. But the plot and the scenes pissed me off so goddamned much with illogic, it ruined it for me.

 Don't kill me.


----------



## fps

Mr Violence said:


> Ok, I have to address a few things I hated about this movie. This post is going to be TERRIBLY nitpicky, but I couldn't ignore these things. It was a grand and entertaining movie, but I was much more invested in TDK. Here's why:
> 
> 1.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> TDK establishes that Batman can accomplish his goals without killing anyone. In TDKR, he kills people. I'm not going to explain it away that they could've lived. He fucking kills people. The mercs in the tumblers explode, the driver of the nuke truck dies so Talia has to drive and finally Talia dies, too. Batman kills them all. This effectively rapes the entire theme of the second movie.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> The action was an absolute atrocity, save for the first Bane/Batman fight. Think about the final building scene in TDK. He disables the Joker's men and the SWAT team using tactics, gadgets and stealth. In TDKR, he fucking just jumps in the middle of a group of 10 guys with guns and they all wait patiently for Batman to fist their assholes. When they first enter that City Hall place during the last fight between Batman and Bane, a henchmen runs at Batman with a gun, NOT FIRING, and gets a nice dislocated shoulder. Just really stupid shit. Then, instead of using strategy to fight Bane, he just jumps in with no planning and tries to go toe-to-toe with the dude that BROKE HIS FUCKING BACK. During this fight in the mob, NO ONE on EITHER SIDE helps Batman or Bane to get the upper hand? They just ignore that the 2 powerhouses in control of everything are fighting and to let them do their thing? In a crowd of hundreds? GO FUCK YOURSELF. Also, the police decide to rally into an angry mob and run at armed gunmen? I believe police have training that includes, "Don't run at someone pointing a gun at you." They have some guns. I know it was symbolic, but it was FUCKING STUPID.
> 
> 
> 
> 3.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> How the shit did Bruce Wayne get back to Gotham? Seriously. He was in Eastern Bumfuckistan with nothing but the clothes he was wearing. This one is a little nitpicky, but come the fuck on.
> 
> 
> 
> 4.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> When the police see Batman, all of them chase him instead. Not half on Batman, half on the guys that just broke into the stock exchange. Nope. All of them go for Batman. I understand the dude in charge is a powertripping idiot. That's clearly established, but he's straight up not qualified for his fucking job at all. Fuck you again.
> 
> 
> 
> 5.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Also, isn't it fairly apparently that the transaction at the stock exchange was fraudulent? Can't they just overturn it remotely?
> 
> 
> 
> There are others but I couldn't get into the movie while still dealing with these really dumb sequences.
> 
> Bane was menacing, Catwoman was awesome. But the plot and the scenes pissed me off so goddamned much with illogic, it ruined it for me.
> 
> Don't kill me.



It's all valid. I can't bring myself to hate the movie, there were too many awesome moments, but the complaint about the action especially hits home, if you're going to abandon logic at least make sure the action makes sense and has cool moments. Nothing held a candle to the first Bane-Batman fight. That was a shame. The Bat annoyed me.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Overall, cliched and convenient plot, but nothing I wasn't expecting,


Spoiler



save for Talia, which was cripplingly obvious once revealed



In fact, it lived up to every expectation I had! It wasn't as good as Inception, but it's at least in the same league. It's by far the best superhero movie I've personally ever seen.

Tom Hardy also deserves a fucking medal for balancing so many things. Gaining gigantic weight, not overshadowing Heath Ledger and communicating many different emotions with only his eyes - fantastic acting. His voice was verging on ridiculous (Gandalf anyone?), but I actually think in an odd way it actually worked and even bettered the movie, his monologues brought a very intimidating tone to the film.



Spoiler



The scene where Batman screams at Bane is so intense! I fucking loved it. It felt like true catharsis on Batman's behalf and perfectly communicated his new found strength in himself and his confidence in beating Bane.


----------



## MFB

Really? I feel like Hardy just over-shadowed Ledger's Joker. As Bane he seemed like this god damn calculating, brutally-efficient machine but there was still logic and reason behind it as well as a physical, human body. Most of which was conveyed through body-language and eyes.



> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> How the shit did Bruce Wayne get back to Gotham? Seriously. He was in Eastern Bumfuckistan with nothing but the clothes he was wearing. This one is a little nitpicky, but come the fuck on.





Spoiler



When they show him leave the prison and walking off, he's leaving to go to a city that's not too far from where he was and they show it as he's walking. It's like just over a couple hills. Maybe he traded goods/whored himself out and such for a plane ride home? 

Also, I don't think he shoots anyone in the Tumbler before the Wall Street fight - I believe he shoots at the cannon's that were aiming at the GPD and that was it. Same for the truck driver, I forget exactly how he died, was it Bruce going in front and shooting at it? If so, I can see that going two ways - one: he was shooting ahead of the truck as a warning fire to say "You keep going this way and I shoot at you" and Talia made him keep going so it's on her hands or two: he fucked up and accidentally killed the guy during that leading fire so oops. One guy out of 3 movies.


----------



## Mr Violence

MFB said:


> Really? I feel like Hardy just over-shadowed Ledger's Joker. As Bane he seemed like this god damn calculating, brutally-efficient machine but there was still logic and reason behind it as well as a physical, human body. Most of which was conveyed through body-language and eyes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> When they show him leave the prison and walking off, he's leaving to go to a city that's not too far from where he was and they show it as he's walking. It's like just over a couple hills. Maybe he traded goods/whored himself out and such for a plane ride home?
> 
> Also, I don't think he shoots anyone in the Tumbler before the Wall Street fight - I believe he shoots at the cannon's that were aiming at the GPD and that was it. Same for the truck driver, I forget exactly how he died, was it Bruce going in front and shooting at it? If so, I can see that going two ways - one: he was shooting ahead of the truck as a warning fire to say "You keep going this way and I shoot at you" and Talia made him keep going so it's on her hands or two: he fucked up and accidentally killed the guy during that leading fire so oops. One guy out of 3 movies.





Spoiler



Even so, he still killed Talia. And it really wouldn't be an enormous deal if the THEME of the second movie wasn't based on him NOT killing people. Ya know?


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



I'd say Talia killed herself, she was so dedicated to going straight on the road that instead of turning she went through the barrier and under the street crashing head first. Bruce didn't shoot her, or pushed her off the road down there she gunned the truck so she wouldn't let the nuke get back to the reactor.


----------



## Xaios

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I'd say Talia killed herself, she was so dedicated to going straight on the road that instead of turning she went through the barrier and under the street crashing head first. Bruce didn't shoot her, or pushed her off the road down there she gunned the truck so she wouldn't let the nuke get back to the reactor.





Spoiler



Indeed. Batman killed Talia in much the same way that he "killed" Ras in Batman Begins. He didn't technically kill them, he just did the same thing that Saffron did on Firefly: put them in a position where they die easily.


----------



## Mr Violence

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I'd say Talia killed herself, she was so dedicated to going straight on the road that instead of turning she went through the barrier and under the street crashing head first. Bruce didn't shoot her, or pushed her off the road down there she gunned the truck so she wouldn't let the nuke get back to the reactor.





Spoiler



Well, he still killed the truck driver. Like I said at the beginning of my original post, you can probably explain it away, but in the second movie, he goes far out of his way to disable but still save the lives of his enemies. He makes it a point not to kill the Joker because he doesn't kill people. It's a big deal for him and "point of no return" kind of thing. But in this one, it seems to not matter at all.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Spoiler



To be fair, when you're pushed to a point where a city has been taken over by terrorists and there is a nuclear bomb about to go off, you're going to be more concerned about saving innocent people than killing evil ones. He killed Two-Face, and Joker had promised Batman he'd have to break his one rule.


----------



## flint757

Has anyone seen red hood? Gives a pretty good explanation as to why not killing the joker is just a stupid notion. In all formats he hurts/kills people, goes to jail, escapes, repeat. Batman is contributing to the harm of others by letting some of these psychopaths live.


----------



## vampiregenocide

flint757 said:


> Has anyone seen red hood? Gives a pretty good explanation as to why not killing the joker is just a stupid notion. In all formats he hurts/kills people, goes to jail, escapes, repeat. Batman is contributing to the harm of others by letting some of these psychopaths live.



Doesn't Joker bring that point up to him at some point? I seem to remember him or someone else telling Batman how stupid it is to allow some criminals to live.


----------



## MFB

"Under the Red Hood" is a GREAT Batman film and one that my buddy was saying should be adopted for the next Batman film since right now it's only an animated. Trust me, I fully get Jason Todd's standpoint of how never killing villains doesn't help at all as they still just keep coming back, but I put it aside for Batman films since I know he's never going to be that "fight a villain, kill them, get new villains" type of hero


----------



## flint757

vampiregenocide said:


> Doesn't Joker bring that point up to him at some point? I seem to remember him or someone else telling Batman how stupid it is to allow some criminals to live.



It very well could have I'm certainly no expert on Batman, but everything I have seen/read he doesn't and for me it is infuriating.

Even in the games all he does is knock people out.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

MFB said:


> Really? I feel like Hardy just over-shadowed Ledger's Joker. As Bane he seemed like this god damn calculating, brutally-efficient machine but there was still logic and reason behind it as well as a physical, human body. Most of which was conveyed through body-language and eyes.





Spoiler



In that sense, yes. But Bane's calculating monopoly is cracked by the work of Batman and Co. whereas the Joker was much less predictable and undeniably a greater performance from Ledger, though Hardy did very well.

In a sense, The Joker was more calculating and more sinister rather than flat-out intimidating, giving a different edge to the character.

I think the choice of Bane and Hardy were very deliberate in order not to disrespect Ledger's contribution to the trilogy.


----------



## Mr Violence

That's a fair enough point about Two-Face. I concede that argument. Though, I will maintain his tactics in this movie were not clever and more brute force.

Again, I was nitpicking but those things really did affect the entire movie for me. Just an opinion.


----------



## MFB

Scar Symmetry said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> In that sense, yes. But Bane's calculating monopoly is cracked by the work of Batman and Co. whereas the Joker was much less predictable and undeniably a greater performance from Ledger, though Hardy did very well.
> 
> In a sense, The Joker was more calculating and more sinister rather than flat-out intimidating, giving a different edge to the character.
> 
> I think the choice of Bane and Hardy were very deliberate in order not to disrespect Ledger's contribution to the trilogy.



I had this in spoilers but there's nothing spoilerish about it 

I can see exactly what you mean and I think it might come down to personal bias at this point since they represent two sides of a coin; Bane the physically intimidating and yet still efficient in scheming, with the Joker's schemes being more unpredictable and doing danger to those AROUND Batman vs. him directly.

I apparently lean more towards the Hardy given his past roles that I've enjoyed and everything else that I've said in this thread, but I can see where people who loved the Joker's side come from.


----------



## vampiregenocide

Mr Violence said:


> That's a fair enough point about Two-Face. I concede that argument. Though, I will maintain his tactics in this movie were not clever and more brute force.
> 
> Again, I was nitpicking but those things really did affect the entire movie for me. Just an opinion.



Bane is smarter than Bruce Wayne, and physically stronger. There was not much to rely on after Bane took over Gotham. They were desperate.


----------



## MFB

Alfred's emotions in ALL of Nolan's movies summed up into glorious picture


----------



## steve1

Just saw the movie. Maybe my expectations were too high, or I was just expecting something different, but I didn't particularly enjoy it. There were some moments of awesome though.


----------



## iamthefonz

Mr Violence said:


> 3.)
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> How the shit did Bruce Wayne get back to Gotham? Seriously. He was in Eastern Bumfuckistan with nothing but the clothes he was wearing. This one is a little nitpicky, but come the fuck on.





Spoiler



Completely agree. This bothered the hell out of me. To be fair, we didn't know how long he was in prison and at what time did he escape. With the massive time skip, he could have taken months to get back to Gotham. He could have had enough of to his name still to get someway to travel back. How he got in, I don't know. But of course, the chronological order of this movie is fucking nonsense and we don't know shit between those five months.



In conclusion, Catwoman and Bane were awesome, the plot could have been better, and it thankfully wasn't like Spider-man 3.


----------



## flint757

Okay saw it for a second time and payed closer attention this time. First impression was I liked it better, but there were some glaring problems.



Spoiler



Overall I'd say I liked it better the second time. Once you watch it the second time the Talia thing isn't a blindside and you realize it was setup that way from the get go, it definitely filled up some holes for me. And overall I didn't have much issue with the relationship stuff this go around either. Talia was using Wayne and he is only human. Catwoman lives on the edge and she kissed him once (in the moment kind of thing). As for the movie it doesn't necessarily mean much. Obviously based on the end they get together, but you get my point, it was kind of like the starting point in the relationship so I could buy it.

The fighting it least for the first half was bad. Watch it again nobody lands a punch and yet people are flying, that is very poor choreography or acting if they can't give off the illusion better. The only fight that felt real was towards the end when they are fighting on the steps. Everything else had six inches between hands and body at all times (even the kicks lacked oomph!). BAD! The practical effects weren't much better. During the cop vs villain scene the villains fire into the crowd and not one person falls over . When catwoman tries to clear the tunnel you see the cars (attached to a rig clearly) move before the explosion which I just shouldn't see in a polished film. Those are just things they should have noticed during production IMO. Which brings me to the Bane dead debate and he definitely is IMO. That bike tore through a wall of cars and blew up the bat mobile so I'm pretty sure a human could not withstand it. He is not super human he is just strong and well trained (and needs a painkiller).

I didn't like the lack of blood, totally takes away from the realism. There weren't even bullet holes in people.

He takes the no killing oath in this one as well (tells Catwoman no guns) and yet he does in fact intentionally kill someone. Talia told that driver to go straight at the same moment he just killed over. However, Bane did say that he broke him, could have meant his body and spirit or could imply that he forced him to break his own rules. 

Did anyone notice that he always uses the bat voice even around those who already know when he has the suit on. Catwoman knows he is Wayne and yet still talks in the grovel voice around her (and no one else is around either). I get it, but at the same time is just silly.

I can't get over the ice scene. It is supposedly thin, bu then all of a sudden it isn't a problem everyone is just chilling out on the ice. I agree about the bat symbol in this scene as well, they have 12 hours left and he goes to makes some art on a building which would be practical if it empowered the citizen to act, but it didn't. (even if it did what difference would that have made?)

This is a BIG negative for me. Batman could not do any of the things he did in this movie. He has no cartilage (bad shoulder, etc.) in many places and yet all he does is put a brace on ONE leg and okay now he is fine again, back to kicking ass. Then Bane strips him of everything and throws him in jail with a broken back and within a couple months he is fitter than ever, cartilage grew back as well I guess and is able to escape while no one else ever has (other than Talia). Here is the other thing I'm pretty sure many others in that prison were more fit and yet only 2 have escaped overall. They even know that you need to not use the rope (well at least one person knows that, he could share ) and yet everyone still uses it, they didn't seem stupid to me. That is just illogical. In any case he was never in good enough shape to beat Bane and yet he is able to hold up in a fight against him towards the end too. I do realize they talk about the fear of dying giving strength and maybe that is a factor, but the spirit cannot make your body go that much further when your practically a cripple.

The timing is just horrid in the middle. They should have stopped, zoomed out to the city and just typed in the corner 90 days later because the approach they took is confusing and just takes you right out of the moment. Then a month passes and your like wait only one day till the bomb goes off? That should not happen in a movie. Don't get me wrong it gets mentioned, but just because it is said doesn't mean it felt right. Others have pulled it off way better so he is guilty here.

I don't know if this was like that in the comics or other formats and movies, but is it me or does Nolan give Batman major Jesus like references in this movie (trilogy rather)? No killing, save the people, sacrifice, etc. On it's own those wouldn't give that vibe, but the way he presents it, it does feel that way.

I did notice that Batman was training Blake throughout the movie. I can't explain it, but you can kind of tell he is prepping him for something (probably next movie with the new director, it will happen I'm sure). If the GPS at the end is relevant then he gives Blake the coordinates which confirms this slightly I think too.

The plot overall is riddled with problems that I can't even remember them all (not big ones, but still). The one that sticks out the most is that the bomb is going to go off on its own through natural decay and yet there is a timer attached to it. Also, why would sticking the core back in it all of a sudden re-stabilize it. I imagine if it isn't stable it may be too late just minutes before it is about to go off.

The ending isn't clever at all. The Talia thing is fine and I don't mind that Bane got demoted (Hardy got emotional in a very believable way here as well). However, when he takes the bomb he says the auto pilot doesn't work implying he hadn't even worked on it, but then at the end oops no he is alive he fixed it a long time ago. He was just screwing with everybody. Amazing how he found the time since that was just slightly before he got thrown into a jail. That was a twist for the sake of it or rather drama for the sake of it. That explosion would have caused some damage to the city as well even over the water. Talia's dying scene (rather her acting in general) was just bad.

I do retract my comments about Caine, on second watch I thought it was phenomenal while a tad overkill (crying every scene?).

As for the joker vs Bane conversation, Bane definitely did more damage and was far more brutal and unforgiving. The difference is definitely in approach/goal. The joker wants to screw with peoples heads and make them make bad choices (chaos), while Bane just wanted to crush everyone's spirit then kill them all. His was more efficient, but the joker version was more entertaining. Even though Bane is more dangerous you feel like Joker is more dangerous because he seems like a psychopath whereas Bane seems quite sane (arguably makes him scarier, but not to watch) In other words one projects crazy while the other just kills people which in its own right is crazy.



[EDIT]

I realize my review sounds really negative, but I enjoyed the movie thoroughly (although I got bored in the middle a bit) and thought it was good overall as a package. Honestly, I enjoyed TDK more though...
4.0/5


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Spoiler



If you fall 100+ feet and the only thing that catches you is a rope tied around your waist, you'd be lucky to ever walk again.


----------



## Scar Symmetry

Guys... we are talking about a comic book movie here 

There were numerous things in every single scene that I thought "but..." although the film allowed me to somehow completely ignore my own questions and just enjoy it!

The script is also very shallow, but given the shallow depth of the script in the previous film (which is why I can never agree with the hype around TDK) they at least brought it up a notch or two in this film. 

The Joker was menacing and demonic, with a very scary idea. Bane, once his plans were revealed were actually kind of disappointing, seemed to me very lacking in menace considering how they had built the character up.

However, it was all completely congruent with the previous films and the overall Batman universe, so it was easy to digest.


----------



## flint757

I'd agree if he wasn't attempting to pull off the "real" aspect for his movies.

[EDIT]

The Avengers, as an example, was not sloppy and yet there were many sloppy aspects of this film. That too was a superhero movie and since they practically beg to be compared, IMO it misses the bar.


----------



## Ibanezsam4

^ I also found TDKR sloppy in places, and also agree that The Avengers was very polished, however film was fairly standard fair story-wise for Joss Whedon IMO. Nothing surprised me (none of the Marvel movies ever really get me thinking to begin with) and it was pretty predictable. It was like a AC/DC album, you know what you're getting, and what you get will always be good. 

TDKR is a different animal entirely, and i find myself as a viewer forgiving the films horrible representation of time simply because it tried to be more... and that i was emotionally satisfied with how Nolan ended the trilogy. that being said the way the passage of time was shown is my biggest pet peeves in film. so Nolan is lucky my positive emotion are outweighing my negative opinions at the moment  

i think i will reserve the rest of my opinions until i see TDKR a 2nd time... if i find i can't forgive Nolan for the sloppy elements on the next viewing then this film will only be good as an ending for me.. and seeing tom hardy with his shirt off


----------



## Scar Symmetry

There's only so far you can go with making comic book movies realistic though! The limits of what you can do should be a given when first sitting down to watch it.

I think The Avengers had a much, much stronger script. The script wouldn't have suited TDKR though. At the end of the day, for a comic book movie I can't really fault TDKR, despite it's obvious indiscrepancies. Whether it's better than The Avengers... I don't really care  They both highly impressed me, The Avengers moreso I think.


----------



## beneharris

Scar Symmetry said:


> Bane, once his plans were revealed were actually kind of disappointing, seemed to me very lacking in menace considering how they had built the character up.





Spoiler



Yeah, but once the plans were revealed, they weren't even his. They were Talia's. That sort of killed him being the bad guy for me. He was awesome up to that point, and then splat.

Am I missing anything from the comics that makes that a good plot twist, and not just a "gotcha?"


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



That's not how the Knightfall story goes, like, at all so there's that for starters


----------



## fps

Spoiler



The whole plot ended up being far too dastardly, give them a tiny ray of light for a pre-designated amount of time then kill them anyway with a nuke that they drive around the city endlessly? Talia should not have been a thing in this movie, that character shimmied around the edges taking up screen time for no reason except to be a reveal later on, and that's really annoying, she was a placeholder for a character who hadn't arrived yet, and diminished Bane, who I'd grown utterly fascinated by. 

The plot should have been giving the city back to the people (under Bane who was closely watching and encouraging all the worst of people with his extraordinary, manipulative speech-making) and then the resultant chaos destroying everything until Batman was able to defeat Bane, breaking him as the mouthpiece (a symbolic element nicely played in the film) and the whole thing ended with a new society being forged from the ashes. Therein lies hope. Could still have had the massive fight without reducing Gary Oldman to rattling around in a trailer for the part of the movie he didn't spend sitting out, trying to disarm a nuke (it may be a standard plot device, but most people couldn't care less about nukes, they just think they should)


----------



## mcleanab

Man... lots of fun while in the theatre...

Anne Hathaway and Tom Hardy did excellent work...

After a few minutes even, such a let down on so many parts...

I'll watch it again though... might just be my favoritism towards the first two Tim Burton versions...


----------



## RedSkull

jaredowty said:


> K this movie is some overrated horseshit. Here's my rantview that I've been posting all over the net..
> 
> Cons:



*I guess im into the minority like you because I agree 100% with everything you said. I thought Batman Begins was average... Well after the fact, The Dark Knight Rises have enough weak/stupid/impossible parts to win the palm as the weakest of the 3 ... also;


Spoiler



1) Gordon Lewitt is shoved in our faces so hard during ALL the movie as the new good guy wanting to help and being everywhere that you can just expect the name reveal and in someway, the end

2) They tried to pack way too much stuff and its still 2h40. Feel so rushed that edited with more breathe would probably be 3h30 or 2 parts; also a lotttt felt forced to death. 

3) Bane was just ... boring? Physically Supreme but then nothing, he had nothing interesting to say, he was not compelling.

4) Guess what, I checked my watch too and it never happen during a movie


*


----------



## flint757

I looked at my watch too.  In the middle I almost fell asleep both times I watched it. I didn't think it was terrible though. Definitely not Oscar worthy as some have been saying.


----------



## MFB

I don't think the script or anything is worth an Oscar, but I'd say Hardy's performance was


----------



## flint757

Yeah I could buy that.


----------



## ZXIIIT

I watched this on Friday, I avoided ALL trailers and pics to go in un-spoiled, but within the first 10 minutes, I was already irritated by Bane, his voice to be exact.

Everyone else's voice: "These men were hunting your man too" @ 5 db

Bane: "I AM BANE" @ 2345 db

WTF Nolan, why was his voice SOOOOO loud? I expected him to talk a bit louder/deeper than the rest but it was fucking loud.


----------



## flint757

He supposedly had to edit the audio because no one could understand it during the opening. That could be a factor, but it could have been that way opening night as well. The mouthpiece made him hard to understand, it literally might have been the only way to do it.


----------



## ZXIIIT

flint757 said:


> He supposedly had to edit the audio because no one could understand it during the opening. That could be a factor, but it could have been that way opening night as well. The mouthpiece made him hard to understand, it literally might have been the only way to do it.



It just so fucking loud, like he had a personal PA in the mask.


----------



## flint757

Maybe he did


----------



## sakeido

flint757 said:


> I'd agree if he wasn't attempting to pull off the "real" aspect for his movies.
> 
> [EDIT]
> 
> The Avengers, as an example, was not sloppy and yet there were many sloppy aspects of this film. That too was a superhero movie and since they practically beg to be compared, IMO it misses the bar.



bingo

I think Avengers was very successful at what they set out to do. Huge, entertaining slam-bang summer blockbuster. It had good action scenes, great effects, and great character moments. Seriously, Tony Stark & Bruce Banner's little bit when they first start doing science on the heli-carrier was something that Nolan's Batman series has _never had_. Good, subtle characterization. And it had some good laughs! 

TDKR was not as successful at what it tried to do. It was huge, but the timeline was confused and lurched ahead in fits and starts. No great action scenes, some dodgy effects. The best actor in the movie was probably over-acting (Michael Caine). There was no subtle characterization anywhere in the series, much less in the third movie. The actual message of the movie is muddled and I'm not entirely sure what they were trying to say about the state of the world. 

TDKR didn't seem like it wanted to be a superhero movie, but I don't know what alternative they tried to achieve instead


----------



## mcleanab

sakeido said:


> bingo
> 
> I think Avengers was very successful at what they set out to do....
> 
> TDKR was not as successful at what it tried to do....The actual message of the movie is muddled and I'm not entirely sure what they were trying to say about the state of the world.
> 
> TDKR didn't seem like it wanted to be a superhero movie, but I don't know what alternative they tried to achieve instead



Yes... Well said... 

THE AVENGERS had no pretense, no overt message hurling... just excellent storytelling... you could not 'like' it based on a number of things like it not being perfectly in line with the comics (X-MEN films were way off for example), or that it was mis-cast (although Scarlett Johansen kicked ass in THE AVENGERS and I didn't like her at all in IRON MAN 2), or you like your movies grittier, etc... ad nauseum/whatever... we all have what we like or don't like...

But TDKR just seemed exactly like you said... just seemed unsure of what it wanted to be. 

I'm a sucker for super hero movies, especially Marvel, since I grew up reading the late 70's and 80's Chris Claremont/John Byrne X-men and a bunch of the John Romita Jr. Spider-man... (Stan Lee must be the happiest guy on the planet...) And with that in mind, I did enjoy the time in the theatre with TDKR as a guy who is delighted to see "real life" super hero movies. (And I'll go see THE MAN OF STEEL too!)

I'm gonna go see THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN very soon and see what sort of discussion that stirs up!


----------



## flint757

Surprisingly mild on the Spiderman stuff lately, but I really enjoyed it. It seems like Batman is a lot more of a cultural phenomenon for whatever reason.


----------



## Church2224

I saw it today. Overall I liked the movie almost as much as I liked the Dark Knight, but I got a few things to say...



Spoiler



Like many I thought that adding Talia (her character and acting was just...bad and not even needed) in the end took a lot off of the greatness off of Bane. I thought the back story about Bane being the son of Ra's al Ghul and being born in the prison was perfect for him, but making a small character come out of nowhere and take the place as the true mastermind behind the destruction of Gotham seemed like a poor plot twist. 

I got goosebumps when I saw Liam Neesan appear as I thought "OMG I THOUGHT HE WAS GOING TO RETURN AS A VILLAIN! AWESOME!" Then he turned out to be a hallucination/ dream, which was disappointing. I though if Ra's and Bane were the ones who were going to take down Gotham together it would have been perfect. 

Also the timing did throw me off a bit, although for the most part I could pay attention. 

Overall I enjoyed it and honestly I liked Bane more than the Joker as a character. They could have done so much more with him though...


----------



## MFB

Spoiler



Ended up going with my parents to see it tonight for my 3rd - and last - time and I've come to find the things that annoyed me most :

1. The lack of bulletholes/blood after supposedly shooting Foley, seriously, c'mon Nolan
2. The lack of cops that fell down during the overhead shot when Bane's army was firing into the cops
3. Talia's delivery of the "Shoot them, shoot them all" line - so fucking wooden
4. Talia's death was just boring, she shut her eyes and looked like she was just tired
5. The random explosion behind the Bat as he's dragging the bomb towards the harbor? WTF was the point?
6. The time between when Blake was interrogated by the thugs and when Batman saved Gordon. It should've been happening side-by-side/at the same time yet it looks like one happens after the other. What the fuck were Bane's men doing with Blake ALL that time Batman talked to and saved Gordon and his guys?

Minor things yeah but they're very glaring and I thought about some of them the first time aroung and more the second to where they annoyed me the third. On first watch it was an amazing movie, and I still feel it's a really good film but those handful of complaints are things that are EASILY fixed yet so horribly overlooked for a guy like Nolan.


----------



## CannibalKiller

I'm gonna be completely honest, prior to this my only REAL experience of Batman was Tim Burton's film and the Dark Knight. I thought it was a good movie


----------



## flint757

Most of the complaints people are having is that the mistake make it from a great movie (potentially) to just a good one.


----------



## jon66

Seen it. Decent enough movie. Some amazing parts. Mostly average. Great job by all the actors/actresses though imo. Bane was awesome until he spoke his first line - his voice reminded me of a higher-pitched Buzz Killington from Family Guy.  Nothing close to movie of the year in my opinion though.


----------



## -42-

Finally saw it. My only opinion? 


HOLY LONG MOVIE BATMAN


Seriously, it just dragged on and on and on and on.


----------



## fps

sakeido said:


> bingo
> 
> TDKR was not as successful at what it tried to do. It was huge, but the timeline was confused and lurched ahead in fits and starts. No great action scenes, some dodgy effects. The best actor in the movie was probably over-acting (Michael Caine). There was no subtle characterization anywhere in the series, much less in the third movie. The actual message of the movie is muddled and I'm not entirely sure what they were trying to say about the state of the world.
> 
> TDKR didn't seem like it wanted to be a superhero movie, but I don't know what alternative they tried to achieve instead



Some of this I agree with, but on a musicians' forum of all places you gotta realise that everything shouldn't be spelt out right there in the first viewing. I'm looking forward to multiple viewings, I am glad this wasn't an utterly simplified movie. One thing it did very well was show good but compromised people. You want a totally simple message? Life is complicated, Nolan's tried to make a film that reflects that.


----------



## flint757

fps said:


> Some of this I agree with, but on a musicians' forum of all places you gotta realise that everything shouldn't be spelt out right there in the first viewing. I'm looking forward to multiple viewings, I am glad this wasn't an utterly simplified movie. One thing it did very well was show good but compromised people. You want a totally simple message? Life is complicated, Nolan's tried to make a film that reflects that.



Not at all what happened dude and watching it several times doesn't erase any of the errors. You are acting like Nolan is deep, he isn't.

Watching it again does not create any new realizations and the timeline still sucks balls, the fighting is sub par and there is tons of inconsistency. If you're really paying attention everything is obvious from the get go so how is it deep? Really?


----------



## Captain Shoggoth

I loved it, it lived up to the hype for me and was a satisfying end.
Film of the century? Hardly. Film of the year? Quite possibly.

Personally loved Bane, thought his physicality and demeanour were perfect and loved the way he delivered his lines.


----------



## soliloquy

i honestly dont get how people are saying that this movie lacked any action and it dragged when comparing to the second one. 

second one only had two action scenes. one where the truck flipped, which isn't an action scene. and the second at the end in the dark building and you cant see anything.

the second movie was 2 and a half hours long, and all it had was a political storyline, and thats it. it lacked any substance to it. 

this one on the other hand, i found was paced really well with just the right amount of action and story in it.

though i didn't like the way they did the ending. 



Spoiler



not that i hate/dislike batman, but i was really hopping they would kill him off. why? if they killed him, it would have led to such a unique and impactful ending. and if they did kill him, i would rather have been die a slow death or something. maybe even end the movie with him taking a shot/stab and he's bleeding profusely; that way its a bit open ended.



the only thing i didn't like was the volume in certain parts. it was really hard to understand what people were saying as the background music was way too loud. or if that wasn't the case, then banes mouth piece made him hard to understand at times.


----------



## flint757

As far as me I didn't say lacked action I said the action scenes were bad. They pulled punches and it was WAY too obvious. The rest is just a matter of opinion honestly. Different strokes for different folks. I'd watch it again and probably buy the blu ray, but still don't think it was great, just good. The motive and direction was WAY more clear in TDK though and as such flowed better IMO.


----------



## fps

flint757 said:


> Not at all what happened dude and watching it several times doesn't erase any of the errors. You are acting like Nolan is deep, he isn't.
> 
> Watching it again does not create any new realizations and the timeline still sucks balls, the fighting is sub par and there is tons of inconsistency. If you're really paying attention everything is obvious from the get go so how is it deep? Really?



It's clear there are errors, I've spelt out my own frustrations in this thread, but my point was that a film does not have to have a clear message in order to be a good film. Then again you'd never catch me watching anything as formulaic as I'm certain the Avengers movie must be. This is why I found it disappointing that this film dipped into cliche many times. 

The fighting is not as good as previously, it seems as if they just shot and shot and shot and ended with too much footage. But for a director of blockbuster films, Nolan has tried to create a trilogy with more depth and nuance to the situation his characters find themselves in, and greater exploration of the consequences of those situations on both the *good guys* and *bad guys* side, than any other superhero film I've seen. There are some terrific ideas in there, and some chilling passages, that wouldn't get near another big budget action film.


----------



## ROAR

Saw the movie again today, it ruled.
Probably my favorite of the trilogy. Bane is just rad
haters hate


----------



## TheDivineWing22

I really enjoyed the movie. Probably on the same level as The Dark Knight for me, although I like Bane as a villain more than the Joker. It's not perfect but more enjoyable than a lot of movies out there.

That being said, I still think The Avengers wins for my favorite comic book hero movie.


----------



## mcleanab

fps said:


> Then again you'd never catch me watching anything as formulaic as I'm certain the Avengers movie must be. This is why I found it disappointing that this film dipped into cliche many times.



Not to go off topic... did you see all the lead up movies to THE AVENGERS? I thought those were pretty formulaic... THE AVENGERS, however, isn't... it's pretty awesome... very much a solid Joss Whedon film with flawed and struggling characters fumbling toward success... it might surprise you...


----------



## MFB

mcleanab said:


> Very much a solid Joss Whedon film with flawed and struggling characters fumbling toward success... it might surprise you...



But that IS the formula: a bunch of people who are opposites of each other and can't get along that have to for the sake of the greater good - and surprise, eventually do to succeed! 

It's nothing new by any means


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

What are y'alls thoughts on the end? 

It just didn't feel right with me. 

Also, I wonder if there will be a reboot with JGL. I'm hoping they make a nightwing movie :S


----------



## MFB

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> What are y'alls thoughts on the end?
> 
> It just didn't feel right with me.
> 
> Also, I wonder if there will be a reboot with JGL. I'm hoping they make a nightwing movie :S





Spoiler



I feel like if they were to do a Nightwing movie, they should've called him Dick in the end vs. Robin, and I'm also extremely hesitant since I've come to love Nightwing  They'll probably use the newer costume he has with the red crest vs. the blue and finger stripe one which will IMMEDIATELY offend the fanboys (I jumped on during new 52 so I don't care) and so on and so forth


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

MFB said:


> I feel like if they were to do a Nightwing movie, they should've called him Dick in the end vs. Robin, and I'm also extremely hesitant since I've come to love Nightwing  They'll probably use the newer costume he has with the red crest vs. the blue and finger stripe one which will IMMEDIATELY offend the fanboys (I jumped on during new 52 so I don't care) and so on and so forth





YEah I was thinking to myself. Why set him up as robin? They should of just been named Dick Grayson xD It''d make more sense


----------



## MFB

I just realized what I said as I re-read it and I'd say add spoiler tags to that post, since it does give stuff away



Spoiler



Secondly, he was closer to Tim Drake in terms of any other Robins so I'd prefer them to do a sequel with him as Tim Drake/Red Robin but do a BADASS costume like the one he had in Arkham City with the tac-vest and such. JGL's character did a bunch of detective work and knew Batman was Bruce which is basically Tim's origins, then Bruce just legally adopts him and trains him and is like "You're Robin now." In TDKR, he just works with him and then is like "Take over as Batman."

Only problem is that if they do a Batman reboot with JGL, he's DEFINITELY going to have to do a Batman voice since well, he doesn't sound super manly


----------



## GazPots

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> 5. The random explosion behind the Bat as he's dragging the bomb towards the harbor? WTF was the point?





Spoiler



Isn't the point that it covers up Batman escaping from The Bat and allowing it to travel onwards on autopilot while we assume he's still in it? Or perhaps because he didnt pull up in time to miss the building so he just blew a hole in it and followed through while ejecting. 


That's what i thought once the film ended.


----------



## Genome




----------



## MFB

GazPots said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't the point that it covers up Batman escaping from The Bat and allowing it to travel onwards on autopilot while we assume he's still in it? Or perhaps because he didnt pull up in time to miss the building so he just blew a hole in it and followed through while ejecting.
> 
> 
> That's what i thought once the film ended.





Spoiler



The problem with that is that after Bruce flys over the kids and JGL they show him look back and smile so he's still in the Bat at that point


----------



## -42-

fps said:


> Then again you'd never catch me watching anything as formulaic as I'm certain the Avengers movie must be. This is why I found it disappointing that this film dipped into cliche many times.


Ease up on the pretension dude. Media these days is saturated with cliche, so much so that the inversion of cliche is cliche. There's nothing wrong with having a comfortable, familiar story.


----------



## flint757

Batman isn't exactly free of cliches either. 

[EDIT]

To add, I do agree with TDK comments you've made and I even think you could say Nolan was "deep" with Inception as an example. For the life of me though can't see how you think TDKR is deep though, you give him too much credit. It is linear for the most part and very super hero predictable. In fact the only reason some aspects weren't predictable was because the other batmans he did were less predictable so we go in with the assumption that he wouldn't be cliche and he was. 

The timing in the movie was bad, it is not a "you just don't get it" thing, it was bad. I picked up just fine how much time passed because each character in the first scene after a time jump so nicely said it blatantly for me to hear. Doesn't change the fact that it felt wrong. The truth is he wanted to say a lot and he only had so much time to do it so he crammed. When you cram timing gets thrown off.


----------



## fps

-42- said:


> Ease up on the pretension dude. Media these days is saturated with cliche, so much so that the inversion of cliche is cliche. There's nothing wrong with having a comfortable, familiar story.



I'm not being pretentious, I'm saying Nolan makes ambitious films and gives himself a lot further to fall than if he had just embraced the tried and tested. 

The inversion of cliche is the equivalent of telling a joke so many times that it stops being funny then becomes funny again precisely because it isn't funny any more. Arguable whether there's any value in that. Plus inversion of cliche has been done for yeeeears. Either way the end result is that they've saved themselves the trouble of thinking up any new ideas. TDKR had a lot of problems but it also had my attention while I was watching, and in all the blockbusters I've been dragged to that has never usually been the case.

Saturation of cliches does not add value to cliches. "Carried over time, it (irony) is the voice of the trapped who have come to enjoy their cage". Essentially you're admitting that what you're watching is predictable and formulaic and probably written by a committee who are ticking boxes as they go. Why stand for it?


----------



## GazPots

MFB said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> The problem with that is that after Bruce flys over the kids and JGL they show him look back and smile so he's still in the Bat at that point



Ahhh balls.


----------



## mcleanab

MFB said:


> But that IS the formula: a bunch of people who are opposites of each other and can't get along that have to for the sake of the greater good - and surprise, eventually do to succeed!
> 
> It's nothing new by any means



Okay... for me, it's the journey... AVENGERS was a helluva ride... as was Whedon's SERENITY and the entire short lived series FIREFLY. As far as new, there ain't nothin' new under the sun... stories about folks struggling to get by (even in cool costumes)... even TDKR... some struggles just hit me more than others...


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## soliloquy

humm...so its been a few days, and the movie has settled in my system...

i have a few issues with it...



Spoiler



that scene in the beginning with alfred saying he goes to veniece every year hopping to see him with a girl and blah blah blah...as soon as he said that, i was thinking 'well, i know how the movie will end....'

they mentioned the damn auto-pilot a few dozen times. you saw the ending coming that way too. 

if bane/talias plot was to blow up the city, then why bother going through with the entire movie?

that pit that bane and talia came from, they a)never really mentioned as to where it was b) never mentioned why people were there c)never mentioned how long they have been there for. at the same time, through out the movie they kept saying that bane had his face disfigured there, but they kept showing a kid escaping from the pit with a full face intact. so either the first 90% of the movie they were saying that bane escaped, then came back, only to get his face fucked, then escape again...or idk what they were trying to say with it.

they never really explained the relationship between taliya and bane other than he saved her. for someone who wanted to destroy the city and kill people, him having a soft spot for one lil girl doesn't make sense. was he sleeping with her mom? was he sleeping with her? sure, in the comics they show bane having a strange attachment to his lil teddy bear...so maybe the girl is his teddy bear and they couldn't show all that. they never really explained much about bane then provided the ending was taliya and not bane running away. 

they kept showing/telling how bruce wayne has gone bankrupt and is down to zero. when he does escape from the pit, it means he has no money, no technology, no nothing. how the fuck does he come back in those 12 hours, only to be able to save the city?




even with that, i still enjoyed the movie. in terms of ranking, i'd say the first one was the best, then the third, then the second.


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## MFB

Solil:



Spoiler



Bane wasn't the one who escaped, the child was TALIA - Bane was the one who protected her while she was in prison. 

Bane's relationship with Talia is that she gave him hope while he was in prison and said they would be the prison's redemption which she ultimately was because she and her father - Ra's al Ghul - came back and freed everyone. That's why he loves her.

They don't say why everyone else is there because it doesn't really matter, they explain it's a pit for the worst of prisoners so therefore you can assume anyone who's there is one of those people.

They don't just immediately blow up the city because they wanted to torture Bruce's soul by having him watch the city have a chance at redemption and still ultimately fail, but this is foiled by him coming back.

Also, they only mention the auto-pilot twice before Bruce flies off with the bomb and one of them is RIGHT AS he's going to fly away with it, so if that's "mentioning it a bunch of times" then man, we say EVERYTHING a bunch.


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## soliloquy

MFB said:


> Solil:
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Bane wasn't the one who escaped, the child was TALIA - Bane was the one who protected her while she was in prison.
> 
> Bane's relationship with Talia is that she gave him hope while he was in prison and said they would be the prison's redemption which she ultimately was because she and her father - Ra's al Ghul - came back and freed everyone. That's why he loves her.
> 
> They don't say why everyone else is there because it doesn't really matter, they explain it's a pit for the worst of prisoners so therefore you can assume anyone who's there is one of those people.
> 
> They don't just immediately blow up the city because they wanted to torture Bruce's soul by having him watch the city have a chance at redemption and still ultimately fail, but this is foiled by him coming back.
> 
> Also, they only mention the auto-pilot twice before Bruce flies off with the bomb and one of them is RIGHT AS he's going to fly away with it, so if that's "mentioning it a bunch of times" then man, we say EVERYTHING a bunch.






Spoiler



i know, it was taliya that escaped, not bane. yet the entire movie, they kept showing a child with a perfect face escaping, which lead it to be very predictable. at the same time, if the folks in the pit mentioned that it was a girl, then it would have lead to a bigger deal. however, they kept saying 'its a child' and thats it. point being, it made it far more predictable. 

ra's al gul and taliya didn't free everyone from the pit. there were those who still told the stories to wayne. and if they did come to save everyone from the pit, then it doesn't make sense to leave a few behind. 

and they could have pulled the trigger when bruce was in the pit as that would have been far more torturous as he is sitting it out and watching his entire city burn. i mean, when batman came back, bane said 'impossible!' meaning no one was expecting him to come back, meaning they would have blown the place regardless of if batman was there or not. which still stands my point regarding why they had to wait to blow it up.


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## flint757

What you are describing is super hero cliches and also factors that take place in ALL action films. Most films could end in like 10 minutes if they had done it the right way, but that wouldn't make a very good movie.


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## RedSkull

I'll be honest .. upon second ''private session'' viewing , I've enjoyed it a lot more but it doesnt erase the complains I have with it.


Spoiler



What I've notice also is that if the first Florence talk was only described by Alfred and not shown , that specific part in the end would have been a lot more powerful/enjoyable.


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## Scar Symmetry

fps said:


> I'm not being pretentious, I'm saying Nolan makes ambitious films and gives himself a lot further to fall than if he had just embraced the tried and tested.
> 
> The inversion of cliche is the equivalent of telling a joke so many times that it stops being funny then becomes funny again precisely because it isn't funny any more. Arguable whether there's any value in that. Plus inversion of cliche has been done for yeeeears. Either way the end result is that they've saved themselves the trouble of thinking up any new ideas. TDKR had a lot of problems but it also had my attention while I was watching, and in all the blockbusters I've been dragged to that has never usually been the case.
> 
> Saturation of cliches does not add value to cliches. "Carried over time, it (irony) is the voice of the trapped who have come to enjoy their cage". Essentially you're admitting that what you're watching is predictable and formulaic and probably written by a committee who are ticking boxes as they go. Why stand for it?



Why stand for entertainment that succeeds on its own merits? That doesn't make a lot of sense. It would have been nigh on impossible to make a Batman film as good as Inception (given the premise of each) and I actually think Nolan and team did a pretty fucking good job of getting it to stand shoulder to shoulder with films such as Inception and The Avengers (it could even be argued by some that it trumps both).

If it had your attention (and therefore I am assuming entertained you for at least the majority of the film) then why not forgive its flaws and appreciate it as a whole? Doesn't make sense to me to go nitpicking in a blockbuster (and therefore its promise on artistic value is limited as it has to have a wide appeal) that is quite clearly vastly superior to what blockbuster films used to be even as recent as 5 years ago.

I personally left the cinema feeling like I had been handed _at least_ £8.40 worth of entertainment, if not more.


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## flint757

fps said:


> I'm not being pretentious, I'm saying Nolan makes ambitious films and gives himself a lot further to fall than if he had just embraced the tried and tested.



When a man has high caliber actors, plenty of source material, tons of money, plenty of time and a great reputation there is no reason he couldn't have avoided some of the errors (dare I say most).

I have a feeling (or at least wishful thinking) that TDKR will come out on blu ray with extended edition.

As to your comments earlier about Avengers go see it. It doesn't make you cool to be a hipster and to just presume it sucks is ridiculous. After you've seen it by all means hate on it all you want.


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## vampiregenocide

Spoiler



With regards to the Avengers, the plot may have been fairly straight forward, but the dialogue and acting were brilliant, so I didn't really care if the story wasn't revlutionary.

In terms of why Nolan set up Johnny Blake to be Robin (or Batman, he could just take up the mantle as Bruce maintains Batman could be anybody), is that if he'd had the same name as known Robins, you would've seen it coming from the start. By changing his name, it made a nice cheeky surprise at the end (though I think a lot of us still saw it coming). I don't think Nolan intends to do any more Batman films, he just wanted to leave the universe with a bit of hope and not completely devoid of a hero. Leaves you wondering.


----------



## Bekanor

Saw it a couple of weeks ago on a date and enjoyed it, didn't like it as much as the first 2 but it was decent enough with a few silly things that probably only seemed silly to me. 

For example, JGL looks like a little kid in an adult size police uniform halloween costume. Again, that's probably just me but he doesn't seem to have aged or grown at all since 3rd rock from the sun. Talented enough but a little one-dimensional in this I thought. 

Another thing that really put me off, and has been mentioned is the weird effect they put on Bane's voice. I get that it's the mask but does he really need to sound like stroke guy from the simpsons doing a Sean Connery impression? It only happened a couple of times where obviously the scene calls for certain emoting but it just comes off sounding really weird and shatters the immersion for those split seconds.


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## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

I can not take Christian Bale serious as an actor.

After watching "American Psycho", I only see him as the man running around naked with a chainsaw xD


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## flint757

He is definitely overrated, but his role in Machinist was quite phenomenal so he has his moments.

The bat voice is what drew the line for me though.


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## JosephAOI

Dammit, fuckin


----------



## vampiregenocide

I loved Christian Bale's voice.  Was funny, but awesome.


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## tm20

was i the only one who walked out of the cinema wishing i was Batman?  i love this movie, well the whole series is great but this one i really like. great ending to the trilogy


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## Xiphos68

Saw the movie today is IMAX 2D for my birthday (IMAX = Awesome)! 

I really liked the movie (I cried a little, haha), but I absolutely loved Catwoman, Anne Hathaway did a fantastic job (I had my doubts about her, but she proved me wrong)! Plus I have a crush on her again.  

Anyway, I enjoyed the movie, would love to see it again or just watch the whole trilogy!

Does anyone know if he's going to be doing another movie with another *special* character?  

Bane as a character surprised me, didn't think that much action was going to happen (insane). I enjoyed him though as a villain. Anyway, great overall, and the soundtrack *RULED* in IMAX!


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## SenorDingDong

Saw the movie not too long ago.

I wasn't expecting much after the last movie, and I wasn't disappointed on that. It's just... I can't take Christian Bale seriously. And Bane was... eh. I didn't like the movie at all. Maybe it is because I grew up reading the darker Batman comics of the 90s and practically everything falls short in comparison. I just found the movie to be cliched and boring.

But, as I said, I seem to be the minority on this; I may just be jaded.


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## synrgy

I _finally_ saw this last night. IMAX @ Smithsonian.

I really, really liked it. I'll reserve final judgement for a year or two from now, after repeated viewings, but after the first view, I think it's my favorite of the trilogy. The only moment I raised an eyebrow at was


Spoiler



when Bruce sleeps with Talia


 because


Spoiler



A) we don't know she's Talia, yet, and B) they've said all of 3 sentences to each other prior to sleeping with each other.


 That single moment felt completely contrived and out of place, and I literally threw my hands up at the screen in a brief, exasperated gesture of "wtf is this shit?!"

Other than that, though, I thought it was very well done. I will likely see it again before it leaves theaters.

Is IMAX really *that* expensive to shoot, so much so that even with a movie as big as this, with a virtually limitless budget, they still don't shoot the whole film in IMAX frame? I found myself getting a little annoyed by the surprisingly frequent switching between the widescreen and full screen displays throughout the film..


----------



## MFB

synrgy said:


> I _finally_ saw this last night. IMAX @ Smithsonian.
> 
> I really, really liked it. I'll reserve final judgement for a year or two from now, after repeated viewings, but after the first view, I think it's my favorite of the trilogy. The only moment I raised an eyebrow at was
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> when Bruce sleeps with Talia
> 
> 
> because
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> A) we don't know she's Talia, yet, and B) they've said all of 3 sentences to each other prior to sleeping with each other.
> 
> 
> That single moment felt completely contrived and out of place, and I literally threw my hands up at the screen in a brief, exasperated gesture of "wtf is this shit?!"
> 
> Other than that, though, I thought it was very well done. I will likely see it again before it leaves theaters.
> 
> Is IMAX really *that* expensive to shoot, so much so that even with a movie as big as this, with a virtually limitless budget, they still don't shoot the whole film in IMAX frame? I found myself getting a little annoyed by the surprisingly frequent switching between the widescreen and full screen displays throughout the film..





Spoiler



Yeah, it's definitely kind of surprising but I thought of it like this: it's been 8 years between this and TDK, as well as her having a fairly big hand in Wayne Enterprises with the whole fusion-reactor deal they talked about (I THINK that's shown before they bone). So I figured there was a lot of back relation that we don't know and this was just that moment of vulnerability that she exploited. 

I also freaked when they revealed her as Talia cause ya know, Damian Wayne and all.


----------



## Randy

RedSkull said:


> I'll be honest .. upon second ''private session'' viewing , I've enjoyed it a lot more but it doesnt erase the complains I have with it.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> What I've notice also is that if the first Florence talk was only described by Alfred and not shown , that specific part in the end would have been a lot more powerful/enjoyable.





Spoiler



At the end, if you notice, Bruce and Selina are sitting in the opposite orientation of the 'man and wife' Alfred sees in the original 'Florence' flashback. Symbolically, I guess we know who wears the pants in that relationship.


----------



## zero_end

> I didn't like the movie at all.





> I just found the movie to be cliched and boring.





> I seem to be the minority on this


Yes yes and no! And I thought that I was the only one who didn't like it at all. Count me into the minority as well 



> I found myself getting a little annoyed by the surprisingly frequent switching between the widescreen and full screen displays throughout the film..


I thought that no one would realize this! That, the cliches, and all of the "fight scenes" that looked more like a bad dance choreography (and by that I mean worse than the ones with Adam West in the 60's; who knows, maybe it was a tribute =P) than actual fights, made me dislike it with a passion.

Marion Cotillard is such a hottie. She should've been the cat woman  I don't like that hathaway chick 

Cheers.


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## Explorer

The thing which didn't make sense for me was


Spoiler



if they were letting out all the oppressed people like the Scarecrow and others, why wasn't the Joker among them? I know there were real-world reasons, but in the world of the movie, Joker would have been very active in that situation.

That occurred to me as I watched Crane presiding over the court, and it took me out of the movie for the remainder. I'm sure I'm the only one who thought out the implications of the situation and was bothered by it, though. Story of my life. *laugh*


----------



## Adam Of Angels

Explorer said:


> The thing which didn't make sense for me was
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> if they were letting out all the oppressed people like the Scarecrow and others, why wasn't the Joker among them? I know there were real-world reasons, but in the world of the movie, Joker would have been very active in that situation.
> 
> That occurred to me as I watched Crane presiding over the court, and it took me out of the movie for the remainder. I'm sure I'm the only one who thought out the implications of the situation and was bothered by it, though. Story of my life. *laugh*





Spoiler



Same thing bothered me, amongst a ton of other things. What about all of those mobsters? You know as well as I that the mob wouldnt lay down for Bane anymore than the next guy, so why weren't they more of a problem once they were let loose?

Also, the biggest problem is.... Let's say Bruce got that bomb 10 miles away from Gotham... First of all, how did he then get at least 6 miles away from the bomb, to safety, in that amount of time? It would have been physically impossible. Secondly, Gotham would have still been fucked with the bomb having gone off that close to the city.

Also, why does Catwoman have a suit? I understand that this is a super hero movie, and costumes are a staple, but not only were we given nothing about her background, but we were given no reason why she sometimes had a custom made combat suit on... I'll venture to guess that I'm the only one that was bothered by that.


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## vampiregenocide

Spoiler



Apparently there was a planned scene where Joker in Arkham notices all the inmates getting let out of their cells, and he eagerly jumps to his door only to be left behind and remain locked up. He goes and sits back down on his bed. 

If Joker had been let out, he would have been too much of a liability to Bane's plan most likely.


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## ROAR

Suspension of disbelief, please notice you're all watching a comic book movie.
Chill


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## fps

ROAR said:


> Suspension of disbelief, please notice you're all watching a comic book movie.
> Chill



If a film fails to operate within logical and logistical boundaries it has itself set, it deserves to be criticised for it.


----------



## ROAR

I honestly just think you're picking this apart too much.


----------



## fps

ROAR said:


> I honestly just think you're picking this apart too much.



Would the film be a better film without some of these issues? Disbelief has to be suspended, absolutely, but there's a limit, and since that limit is set by the film-maker, if they outrun themselves it pisses me off. You'd better believe some of these things will have annoyed Nolan when he saw the final cut too, unless he's just burned out on it by that point.


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## flint757

If 'Dark Knight Rises' Was 10 Times Shorter and More Honest | Cracked.com


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## Spaceman_Spiff

I quite liked it...but I feel it's necessary to ask this as people in this thread are pointing out some flaws: How does bane eat?


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## flint757

That is a great question.

Considering he took the mask off for just a second and was crippled with pain I imagine not through the mouth. If we are being serious then probably an IV or perhaps he hooks up to an IV of drugs to kill the pain while he eats through his mouth. It is so mundane I doubt it was ever given much thought.


----------



## Korbain

flint757 said:


> He is definitely overrated, but his role in Machinist was quite phenomenal so he has his moments.
> 
> The bat voice is what drew the line for me though.



the fighter!! bale is awsome in that


----------



## Xaios

Buda-bump!

Bought the Bluray last night, enjoyed the heck out of it. Noticed a couple small differences from the theatrical cut, but nothing major. The one I noticed most was in the scene just before the end where Batman gives Selina the Batpod, they took out the tiny bit of banter where he's explaining to her how to use it before she revs it up and goes "I got it," with her usual sly expression. It's probably in the extras. 

Again, loved this movie. Considering the running time, it flies by.


----------



## Rev2010

Watched this last night with the wife. We'd both loved the last movie but with this one we both agreed it was one of the stupidest and most ridiculous movies we'd ever seen. In a rare event I actually took to my Facebook page to rant about how idiotic the movie was.


Rev.


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## flint757

It didn't ebb and flow as well as the first 2. Certain elements felt forced and too many errors for the budget size.

I absolutely hated all of the fight sequences: People getting shot and nothing happening, hand-to-hand combat looking incredibly choreographed (in a cheap way), and I wasn't a fan of the plot device at all.

Still a good movie, but not up to snuff IMO.  

Saw it 3 times in theater nonetheless .


----------



## MFB

Same here, saw it three times in theaters and by the third I swore I'd never watch it again as it definitely unravels and the details allow you to pick it apart more and more


----------



## xFallen

just saw this it was pretty good imo


----------



## fps

Watching it again, the build-up and first half of the film are just so exciting for me. After the first big fight, you know the one, it have a feeling it just falls apart. Let's see if it holds together better this time.


----------



## The Reverend

Bane's voice rendered the entire movie a comedy hit IMO. I watched the movie on DVD with some buddies of mine and we just drank and laughed at the absurdity of it. Selena Kyle's characterization was shit, and Anne Hathaway should accept her place as the girl-next-door, not a seductress. 

I was hoping for a movie even better than The Dark Knight. I was let down. Fucking Batman movies.


----------



## Mexi

you know, batman movies haven't had the greatest track record. nolan put them in the right direction, he just doesn't know how to shoot fight scenes and doesn't care about plot holes.


----------



## SenorDingDong

Finally found a video that sums up almost every reason this movie failed for me:


----------



## flint757

All the complaints I had pretty much. 

The only additional one is how every one-on-one fight looked SO FAKE...


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3

they also could have been less lazy and called "robin" Tim Drake instead of John Blake


----------



## Gothic Headhunter

Actually, at the end of the move, when they reveal that guy's name to be "Robin", I was expecting them to go with "Tim" or "Dick" or the name of someone who actually was Robin and make it a little less obvious, but no. I still like my idea better lol


----------



## Mexi

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> they also could have been less lazy and called "robin" Tim Drake instead of John Blake



I don't think it was about laziness as it was the amount of people that would even get the reference. this trilogy has been more about rebranding batman for newer audiences than it was about appealing to the comic fans. By leaving it out there that robin picks up where batman left off, audiences are more likely to be content with that feeling of continuity as the movie ends over having to look up who the fuck tim drake is on their phones on their way out


----------

