# Meshuggah Ibanez Custom Scale Length



## Aerospace274 (Jan 30, 2011)

All righty, does anyone actually know what they use for a scale length on those custom 8's? I've read anything between 29" and 32"! I know Mårten said he *thinks* it's 30.5" but does anyone know for sure?


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## plyta (Jan 30, 2011)

Why do you wish to know precisely 

It's a continuation of standard 25.5" scale 

Add two more frets and you get 30 point something inch scale 

Find yourself a fretboard calculator and check


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## Xodus (Jan 30, 2011)

30.5 or 30.2 I think.


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## Deadnightshade (Jan 30, 2011)

plyta said:


> Why do you wish to know precisely
> 
> It's a continuation of standard 25.5" scale
> 
> ...



I'm not sure it works exactly that way..What happens if you want for example a 25.6" scale?The difference is less than a fret however it can be done!The fact that you can find longer scale guitars that may have the same fret to fret distances from the 3rd fret and on with a 25.5" may be just for production facilitation.You can make any scale you want as long as you recalculate the fret distances that give you the equal temperamented frequencies of the notes


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## thewildturkey (Jan 30, 2011)

plyta said:


> Why do you wish to know precisely
> 
> It's a continuation of standard 25.5" scale
> 
> ...



sounds the same as my custom, originally had a 21 fret 25.5 scale neck, now has a 24 fret 30.375 scale neck.


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## Aerospace274 (Jan 30, 2011)

I'm just curious. I'll be getting an 8 with a 30" scale and i'm wondering if i'll be able to work the string gauges they use and sound similar (with proper eq of course) and still have playable tension with a .070, lol. My current band would call for an 8 to be tuned to F(We're all a half step down) and I don't really know what i'll be shooting for with string gauges.


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## Danxile (Jan 30, 2011)

I would really like to know what brand of strings they use and where they get them for their 30(+) inch scale necks as I'm having a hard time finding them for my own. Perhaps somebody could shed some light on this as well.


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## highlordmugfug (Jan 30, 2011)

Deadnightshade said:


> I'm not sure it works exactly that way..What happens if you want for example a 25.6" scale?The difference is less than a fret however it can be done!*The fact that you can find longer scale guitars that may have the same fret to fret distances from the 3rd fret and on with a 25.5" may be just for production facilitation.*You can make any scale you want as long as you recalculate the fret distances that give you the equal temperamented frequencies of the notes


It does work that way,if you're just continuing a certain "pre-existing" scale length out further.

As for the bolded part and what's past that, that has to do with factoring in bridge placement, not just the neck's/fret's setup.


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## Aerospace274 (Jan 30, 2011)

Yeah, i'd really like to know what brand they use as well! 
I've done a lot of searching and can't seem to find any good answers.
I really love their tone and while i'm not getting an 8 just to cover Meshuggah songs, I wouldn't mind if my axe would sound like theirs! It's just such a huge tone, lol.


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## Variant (Feb 4, 2011)

I'm pretty sure that it was confirmed at 30.5".


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## Philligan (Feb 4, 2011)

Variant said:


> I'm pretty sure that it was confirmed at 30.5".




They start off with the guitars right away in this vid. They aren't totally sure, though, so take it with a grain of salt?


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## MTech (Feb 4, 2011)

For some reason I always thought they used DR but had to use bass strings for the last 1 since they don't make strings that big.....
*which watching that video he says just that, the last one is a bass string*

anyway seeing as a lot of the 8 string bands use gauges like 74 for F at 27" you should be fine with 70 or so at 30" which obviously you can get something like the LaBella crazy 8's set or just order custom.


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## Scarpie (Feb 4, 2011)

Ghs makes guitar strings up to a .090 guage, and so does labella


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## Philligan (Feb 4, 2011)

To the OP, if you're going with a 30" scale, .070 should work, but if not, .074 pretty much will for sure, and that's still not unreasonably heavy.

30" is pretty much the best common scale for low end articulation; at that length, you can use pretty much anything between like a .066 and .080 and get an ideal tone. It's gonna be more about your pick attack and how you EQ your amp.


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## MTech (Feb 4, 2011)

Scarpie said:


> Ghs makes guitar strings up to a .090 guage, and so does labella



No need for attitude, obviously you didn't read my whole post or comprehend it at least.. I was saying the company that they use didn't make them that big so they used bass strings... which of course they may manufacture them these days, but I know when those guys first started playing 8's that was the case. Obviously some brands go up to bigger sizes like 90 if their willing to and their machines are capable of doing so, LaBella isn't limited at at what you said though, they make ANY gauge you want.

The funny thing is some of the guitar strings have bigger cores then their equal gauge bass strings. This is always funny to have in mind when some guys try going off they don't get the tension with a guitar string so they use a bass string.... it really shows if they actually even tried the guitar string in the first place, at least from certain brands anyway.


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## Scarpie (Feb 5, 2011)

MTech said:


> No need for attitude, obviously you didn't read my whole post or comprehend it at least.. I was saying the company that they use didn't make them that big so they used bass strings... which of course they may manufacture them these days, but I know when those guys first started playing 8's that was the case. Obviously some brands go up to bigger sizes like 90 if their willing to and their machines are capable of doing so, LaBella isn't limited at at what you said though, they make ANY gauge you want.
> 
> The funny thing is some of the guitar strings have bigger cores then their equal gauge bass strings. This is always funny to have in mind when some guys try going off they don't get the tension with a guitar string so they use a bass string.... it really shows if they actually even tried the guitar string in the first place, at least from certain brands anyway.




It's cool man. No attitude, my attempt at a sarcastic emoticon was a failure.


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## vampiregenocide (Feb 5, 2011)

I think they use Dunlop strings, and their guitars almost definitely have a 30.5" scale.


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## AVH (Feb 5, 2011)

They were endorsed by DR for a long time, but are experimenting with Dunlop strings now. 9-46,52, 70. I've thoroughly inspected and measured their guitars - they are indeed 30.5" scale, and despite varying tunings on the Nothing album, live they tune down a 1/2 step to F standard.


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## MF_Kitten (Feb 6, 2011)

Dendroaspis said:


> They were endorsed by DR for a long time, but are experimenting with Dunlop strings now. 9-46,52, 70. I've thoroughly inspected and measured their guitars - they are indeed 30.5" scale, and despite varying tunings on the Nothing album, live they tune down a 1/2 step to F standard.



any reason they aren't going for d'addario strings? i always found them to be perfect for that kind of sound. I guess it's a matter of finding strings that work with the PH of your hands too though. some people can't have dunlops for more than a couple days, while d'addarios work for months, and then for others the exact opposite is true, etc.

i've used dunlop strings lately though, and they really are good strings


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## Deadnightshade (Feb 6, 2011)

highlordmugfug said:


> It does work that way,if you're just continuing a certain "pre-existing" scale length out further.



Yes i know,what i mean is that you can make whatever scale length you wish thus you can easily continue further a 25.5" scale (if that's what you want),and not the other way around ( that you can make only scale lengths expanding the 25.5").Unless i don't get something


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## AVH (Feb 6, 2011)

MF_Kitten said:


> any reason they aren't going for d'addario strings? i always found them to be perfect for that kind of sound. I guess it's a matter of finding strings that work with the PH of your hands too though. some people can't have dunlops for more than a couple days, while d'addarios work for months, and then for others the exact opposite is true, etc.
> 
> i've used dunlop strings lately though, and they really are good strings



Although I've tried just about everything, D'Addario are my normal go-to string because they're consistent in quality, and snappy tonally - you're right, they are good for that kind of metal. I found DR round-cores having much consistency problems, with wanky winding and certain strings that wouldn't properly intonate for anything, particularly A and D strings for some reason.

I know what you mean about different strings reacting differently for different people (huh? ); I kill Ernie Ball's in about 3 days, just don't last for me...and back at the old shop there was a reason I used to say "Dean Breakley's".

*Money-saving tip for my Canadian friends back home* 
If you want to try Dunlop strings, and save at least 50% on the price: just go and buy Long & McQuade house-brand strings - they're actually made for and repackaged Dunlops! About $4 a pack. I loaded up on four boxes of them before leaving for Norway, and are the best deal going for a good string.


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## dracohowe (Feb 7, 2011)

Dendroaspis said:


> *Money-saving tip for my Canadian friends back home*
> If you want to try Dunlop strings, and save at least 50% on the price: just go and buy Long & McQuade house-brand strings - they're actually made for and repackaged Dunlops! About $4 a pack. I loaded up on four boxes of them before leaving for Norway, and are the best deal going for a good string.


 

Wait....really?

damn it, I've always overlooked those purely due to the low price..

What ever happened to you get what you pay for


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## MF_Kitten (Feb 7, 2011)

Dendroaspis said:


> I know what you mean about different strings reacting differently for different people (huh? ); I kill Ernie Ball's in about 3 days, just don't last for me...and back at the old shop there was a reason I used to say "Dean Breakley's".



Considering the battery acid that must come out of Mårten's hands (judging by his guitar... jesus!), i guess choosing the right strings must be really important for them.


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## MTech (Feb 8, 2011)

MF_Kitten said:


> any reason they aren't going for d'addario strings?


Probably because they're one of the only companies making an effort to make larger strings and are aggressively going after artists, especially in Europe seeing as the Euro AR is a very well known guitar tech (In Flames/Dimebag etc etc)



Dendroaspis said:


> Although I've tried just about everything, D'Addario are my normal go-to string because they're consistent in quality, and snappy tonally - you're right, they are good for that kind of metal. I found DR round-cores having much consistency problems, with wanky winding and certain strings that wouldn't properly intonate for anything, particularly A and D strings for some reason.
> 
> I know what you mean about different strings reacting differently for different people (huh? ); I kill Ernie Ball's in about 3 days, just don't last for me...and back at the old shop there was a reason I used to say "Dean Breakley's".



Probably cause it's a round core, try the Hi Beams there's a reason string companies started using Hex-Core once it was available.



dracohowe said:


> What ever happened to you get what you pay for



The mass market doesn't want to pay for quality, they rather buy whatever they see in flashy ads or because somebody else plays them. Getting what you paid for more or less went out the door in the US... People here follow what they read ads on or because of a certain artist using the product..they don't realize that arguing one brand over another is sometimes quite hilarious cause the brand they mock is made by the brand they praise. There's very few companies that actually make strings, it's all a giant marketing battle hundreds of thousands of dollars on marketing.. Then you have artists playing the said strings not because they feel they have the best tone/feel/life, but because they get free pedals, picks, or thousands of dollars worth of cables for free.


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## Danxile (Feb 10, 2011)

i actually measured d'addario strings in relation to my 30 inch scale agile and i found out that even though i was measuring XL's there was not enough winding length and the strings would not fit my guitar. its 30 inches from the bridge to the nut but an additional 8-10 inches including the headstock. count in winding length and you're talking about one hell of a long string. the labella crazy 8s fit (just barely) but apparently theyre on back order and havent been produced for a while. i ordered a whole box of them because theyre the only strings ive found that fit my guitar. im still waiting on those strings 6 months later


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## signalgrey (Feb 10, 2011)

confirmed at 30.5


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## MTech (Feb 10, 2011)

Danxile said:


> the labella crazy 8s fit (just barely) but apparently theyre on back order and havent been produced for a while. i ordered a whole box of them because theyre the only strings ive found that fit my guitar. im still waiting on those strings 6 months later



Those shouldn't be on back order they just made a ton of them and got back stock in Jan... are you calling BigCityMusic like I've posted 100x on here?? Or even call LaBella direct since as I pointed out before you don't live that far from the factory... Also they're all made 46inches.


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## Danxile (Feb 10, 2011)

MTech said:


> Those shouldn't be on back order they just made a ton of them and got back stock in Jan... are you calling BigCityMusic like I've posted 100x on here?? Or even call LaBella direct since as I pointed out before you don't live that far from the factory... Also they're all made 46inches.



I've actually spoken to Labella directly several times. it was a miracle i even got the set that i got because i called a store recommended on here on a hunch and they had one set in the back somewhere. Labella said they're waiting for the next set of strings to release.


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## MTech (Feb 11, 2011)

Danxile said:


> i ordered a whole box of them because theyre the only strings ive found that fit my guitar. im still waiting on those strings 6 months later


Where did you order the strings from because Rondo has them and stock and should pretty much always have them in stock. Also they have never never stopped making them...



Danxile said:


> I've actually spoken to Labella directly several times. it was a miracle i even got the set that i got because i called a store recommended on here on a hunch and they had one set in the back somewhere. Labella said they're waiting for the next set of strings to release.



I'm talking to the head of the entire company on the telephone right now and he has no idea what you're talking of and said you can call them directly. They have not stopped making them and said Rondo/Agile should always have them in stock...


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## TTWC Ben (Mar 4, 2011)

i play a 27" 7string which i tune to F and i have been playing about with string gauges on the F for months! i have tried an 80 right down to a 68!
68 is best for tone by a long shot, and still maintains a good (enough) tension. So that's what i have settled on, and i love it!

So i guess in conclusion, a 30something" neck would be nice, but a playable, toneworthy F is easily acheived on a 27"!


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## BorisG (Mar 5, 2011)

plyta said:


> Why do you wish to know precisely
> 
> It's a continuation of standard 25.5" scale
> 
> ...


 
Acording to latest Ibanez catalog-27" scale , with factory gauges 9,11,16,24,32,42,54,65.And a scale lengt has nothing to do with frets number.A csale lengt is The DISTANCE between nut and bridge,and 12 th fret is allawys in the MIDDLE.If you look at any fretboard calculator ,for certain scale ,distance between frets is the same.Adding more frets 27,29,... does not change the scale.Reason for guitar builders to use longer scales is to have more tension on lower strings,because lower tunings sound muddy and sloppy.Another approach is multy scale neck,or fanned neck,where first higher strings have shorter scale for easy bending-lower tension and lower strings have longer scale for higher tension-better lows.


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## TomAwesome (Mar 5, 2011)

plyta said:


> Why do you wish to know precisely
> 
> It's a continuation of standard 25.5" scale
> 
> ...



Actually, that puts it at 28.625".



BorisG said:


> Acording to latest Ibanez catalog-27" scale , with factory gauges 9,11,16,24,32,42,54,65.And a scale lengt has nothing to do with frets number.A csale lengt is The DISTANCE between nut and bridge,and 12 th fret is allawys in the MIDDLE.If you look at any fretboard calculator ,for certain scale ,distance between frets is the same.Adding more frets 27,29,... does not change the scale.Reason for guitar builders to use longer scales is to have more tension on lower strings,because lower tunings sound muddy and sloppy.Another approach is multy scale neck,or fanned neck,where first higher strings have shorter scale for easy bending-lower tension and lower strings have longer scale for higher tension-better lows.



I think what is meant here is that, for example, a 27" scale is like a 25.5" scale guitar with an extra fret added on the nut end of the neck. If you use a capo and consider the first fret the nut, it will be like having a 25.5" scale guitar. Steve Vai had a 28.625" scale 7 built for him some time ago based on that logic, so he could tune a step down but use a capo to make it function and feel like a 25.5" scale guitar.

Also, technically, the scale length is the distance between the nut and the 12th fret, multiplied by two, since bridge adjustments change the string length slightly.


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 6, 2011)

Nah, that's not necessarily true. The spacing between the frets will be different if it's a different scale length, no matter which fret you're at. Unless you actually add an extra fret, then i'm not sure. But if you're gonna buy an extended scale guitar and perma capo it to 25.5", why bother with an extended scale?


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## cardinal (Mar 6, 2011)

(from the ESP website: http://www.espguitars.co.jp/original/m7/index.htm)

This is the concept that they are discussing: take a given scale length that you're comfortable with and just back the nut away from the bridge by a specific amount to give another fret or two.


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## Durero (Mar 6, 2011)

Yes TomAwesome and cardinal are correct, the concept is to add frets past the nut.

There is an online calculator which helps this: Reverse Fret Calculator


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## Jamie (Mar 9, 2011)

The strings that come on the 27" ibanez rga8 are so loose that they make more buzz than any other sound. They say it's a 56, but the dial caliper read 52. The 70 barely has enough tension to work, but does work in standard. I tune a half step down, and the 74 is much better in my opinion. I'm putting the 80 on today, so as to see if it will do Eb. I haven't been able to get Dunlop strings anywhere near these gauges. I swear by Dunlop 100%. If they made them, I wouldn't even consider another brand. I am told that Thomastik has developed an 8string set that's supposed to be great, but I go through too many strings too pay those kind of prices.
On a 28-30", a 70 should be fine.


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## Philligan (Mar 9, 2011)

30.5" isn't the continuation, even though that's what the guys in Meshuggah use. From what I understand, Nevborn (and Mesh) felt that was the most ideal scale for their tuning.

The fret continuations are: 
25.5"
26 3/16"
27.5"
28 5/8"
30.2"

Those are what the guys at Strictly 7 use, so their necks are interchangeable (although the 28/30 aren't interchangeable with the smaller scales - they moved the bridge farther back for those two scales so the guitars wouldn't be too top heavy).


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## coreysMonster (Mar 9, 2011)

Philligan said:


>



I love two things about that video:

1. how they are completely clueless about the wood their guitars are made of
2. Marten's explanation of how the Bleed practice sessions went


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 9, 2011)

Philligan said:


> 30.5" isn't the continuation, even though that's what the guys in Meshuggah use. From what I understand, Nevborn (and Mesh) felt that was the most ideal scale for their tuning.


Good point! Didn't they use 32" or 31" with Nevborn though?


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## MF_Kitten (Mar 14, 2011)

Aerospace274 said:


> Good point! Didn't they use 32" or 31" with Nevborn though?



Pretty sure it was actually 29" scale.


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## Winspear (Mar 14, 2011)

I'm well aware of the adding frets behind the nut concept, but I'd still like to know an answer to this in reference to the Vai comment:



Aerospace274 said:


> But if you're gonna buy an extended scale guitar and perma capo it to 25.5", why bother with an extended scale?


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 14, 2011)

MF_Kitten- Damn, I recall reading somewhere that they went as high as 32" and for sure 31" at some point! Ah well, guess you can't trust everything you read.
Edit: To anyone still curious about string brands for long scales, on a 4x4 Intrepid headstock, D'addario strings will fit, a .054 Ernie Ball will reach for the 7th string as well. Had to frankenstein a set at my local shop which was a .009-.042 D'addario, .054 Ernie Ball and a .070 Ernie Ball bass string. Worked well for me in F and E.


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## MTech (Mar 14, 2011)

Aerospace274 said:


> Had to frankenstein a set at my local shop which was a .009-.042 D'addario, .054 Ernie Ball and a .070 Ernie Ball bass string. Worked well for me in F and E.


That's almost the exact gauges of the HRS-81 set except theirs is made with perfect balance like all their strings.


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 15, 2011)

Yeah, that was the first thing I noticed about the Crazy 8's, lol. Definitely going straight to the HRS81's with my replacement guitar! I still have a spare set of them lying right next to me. I love the balanced feel on them! (Have to return my Agile 830 cause of numerous factory defects sadly)


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## MTech (Mar 15, 2011)

Aerospace274 said:


> Yeah, that was the first thing I noticed about the Crazy 8's, lol. Definitely going straight to the HRS81's with my replacement guitar! I still have a spare set of them lying right next to me. I love the balanced feel on them! (Have to return my Agile 830 cause of numerous factory defects sadly)



Glad to hear on the strings but that's a bummer on the guitar... I have been throwing around the idea of getting an Agile but I see these stories lately of issues and I don't want the headache... I'm just getting aggravated waiting for my customs to be finished.


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 15, 2011)

Honestly if it weren't for the frets lifting off a little, I'd be able to live with every other little defect on it. If you're interested you can see it in my thread about Agile 8 bridges and action. My guitar sounds like it was exceptionally flawed though. I'm still gonna stick with Agile, I just prefer my axes to be pristine out of the box, not uh "used feeling" if you know what I mean. 
I want to get a custom 8 somewhere down the line when I have a few thousand dollars lying around! I love Cataclysmichael's custom! (I think he goes by a different name here though.) Definitely interested in it!!


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## TomAwesome (Mar 15, 2011)

EtherealEntity said:


> I'm well aware of the adding frets behind the nut concept, but I'd still like to know an answer to this in reference to the Vai comment:



I think the idea was that he could easily go back and forth between tuning a step down and returning to a familiar "standard" tuning and scale. I don't think he ended up using it much, though, so I dunno.


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## Aerospace274 (Mar 15, 2011)

So just because he could, then? Lol, damn people with their endorsements!


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## MTech (Mar 15, 2011)

TomAwesome said:


> I think the idea was that he could easily go back and forth between tuning a step down and returning to a familiar "standard" tuning and scale. I don't think he ended up using it much, though, so I dunno.



I'm with this...he said in some interview the guys in Korn of all things changed the way he looked at a 7 so it really wouldn't surprise me if he wanted one setup in A.


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## Winspear (Mar 16, 2011)

TomAwesome said:


> I think the idea was that he could easily go back and forth between tuning a step down and returning to a familiar "standard" tuning and scale. I don't think he ended up using it much, though, so I dunno.



Ah I see, that makes a lot of sense and is my plan for my 9 string  I thought you meant perma capo'd, which confused me being baritone. Makes sense on 25.5" 12 strings where they tune down and perma capo to stop the G string breaking


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## 8sz8 (Mar 16, 2011)

as i manufactured my 1st custom 8 string 2 years ago, we took the measures that i got from measuring fredriks guitar. my guitar manufacturer found either by calculating that 30,5 inch is the right measure.

at the end you can put a 29,6... either, its quite flexible at that range.


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## guitarplayerone (Mar 26, 2011)

idk about the whole entire scale length, string thickness, etc thing.

you can make an acoustic guitar djent in E standard, it's really 99% in the pick attack

long scale lengths, specific amps/tone settings etc help for sure.

but nothing beats that pick attack at the end of the day.

also... secret weapon

Dunlop Jazz III XL


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