# So what does the bass do in a 8-string band?



## mrlespaulman (Nov 30, 2010)

Play unison lines or something? Obviously there's no hope in playing octaved lines, unless it's strung with 1/4" steel cable for a low F#. 

I m confus


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## xmetalhead69 (Nov 30, 2010)

Quite a few bands do have thier basses tuned an octave lower.


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## AySay (Dec 1, 2010)

IIRC Meshuggah plays in unison, and all the 8 string bands do what Meshuggah does so...
I remember some people here complaining about how it didn't sound as heavy because of being played in unison back when Obzen came out.

Also I don't think Tosin/ Animals as Leaders even have a bassist.


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## mrlespaulman (Dec 1, 2010)

xmetalhead69 said:


> Quite a few bands do have thier basses tuned an octave lower.



Wow. Is that even audible?


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## xmetalhead69 (Dec 1, 2010)

that may have been an exaggeration, but I do recall hearing about basses being tuned an octave down


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## Rick (Dec 1, 2010)

Lee from ATB plays a .165 down to low F.


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## Stealthdjentstic (Dec 1, 2010)

This might just be the stupidest thread ever.


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## Necris (Dec 1, 2010)

mrlespaulman said:


> Wow. Is that even audible?


My 8-string bass currently has its lowest string currently tuned to down to D, I don't spend alot of time down there but when I do it is completely audible. 


To answer your question, it all depends on the choice of bass and the bassist playing it.
Some guys have 5,6,or 7 string basses strung up for the low F# and tuned accordingly, some keep their basses in the standard tuning. As for what each player does it is entirely reliant on their own personal playing style, some simply follow the root notes, some play melodies and chords to ornament the guitar parts and some do a combination of both. 

The amount of strings on the guitars doesn't change the function of the bass.


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## Scarpie (Dec 1, 2010)

Stealthtastic said:


> This might just be the stupidest thread ever.






This had me rolling. Hahaha


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## Stealthdjentstic (Dec 1, 2010)

Necris said:


> My 8-string bass currently has its lowest string currently tuned to down to D, I don't spend alot of time down there but when I do it is completely audible.
> 
> 
> To answer your question, it all depends on the choice of bass and the bassist playing it.
> ...



Exactly, when you tune a step down does the bassist suddenly start playing rock and only ever play root notes? No, he does not.


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## mrlespaulman (Dec 1, 2010)

Stealthtastic said:


> Exactly, when you tune a step down does the bassist suddenly start playing rock and only ever play root notes? No, he does not.



Lol I should have thought of that. But hey, you never know till you ask...


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## Stealthdjentstic (Dec 1, 2010)

mrlespaulman said:


> Lol I should have thought of that. But hey, you never know till you ask...


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## mattofvengeance (Dec 1, 2010)

Our bass player plays in unison with us when we go super low. He's got a 6 string, but he also does a lot of playing with me in the upper registers. So basically, we simultaneously encroach on eachother's territories.


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## sh4z (Dec 1, 2010)

I really like how bass sounds an octave below the low F# on an 8 string AWESOME


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## Guamskyy (Dec 1, 2010)

AySay said:


> IIRC Meshuggah plays in unison, and all the 8 string bands do what Meshuggah does so...
> I remember some people here complaining about how it didn't sound as heavy because of being played in unison back when Obzen came out.
> 
> Also I don't think Tosin/ Animals as Leaders even have a bassist.


 
Yeah Tosin doesn't have a live bassist, but Tosin recorded the bass on his album.


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## Daggorath (Dec 1, 2010)

Listen to a guitar on it's own, then with a bass playing the same note. That should answer your question. It's all about frequencies, a guitar with the kind of EQ of a bass is hopelessly muddy, and a bass with a guitar style EQ is equally as inept.


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## bostjan (Dec 1, 2010)

As long as everyone in the band is using the same tuning, the range of the instruments can be adjusted individually to whichever root note the player wishes.

Do you remember that show "The Kids in the Hall?" There was a band that played the incidental music and theme for the show called "The Shadowy Men on a Shadowy Planet." Their music was pretty simple, and although the band claimed over and over not to be a surf band, the guitar definately had that kind of tone. Anyway, my distant point is that this band's bass player almost never played duplicates of the guitar riffs and octave down, but instead came up with his own riffs that sort-of counterpointed the guitar and filled in the voids. To me, it sounded twenty times as interesting that way.

It's a shame that there is a widespread mentality in heavy music for the bass player to riff an octave down, but in perfect lockstep, with the guitar. While this is a great way to get a thick groove going, it really doesn't add as much to the arrangement as it could in many instances.

Then you have bands like Local H, where there is no bass player, and the guitarist just uses an A/B switch with an octave pedal and a combination of bass and guitar amps, which limits the band to only very simple arrangements.

Both styles can be used very successfully, but I really do believe that a combination of the two makes for stronger arrangements.


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## Peteus (Dec 1, 2010)

mrlespaulman said:


> Wow. Is that even audible?



Yep a bassist can tune audibley to an E0 which is an octave below normal low E on a bass due to it being just a fraction above 20Hz which is the lowest common frequency we can hear as humans. However we are all different so I should imagine that some people can hear below that.

My bassist tunes down to F# however he wants a mad 7 string bass so he can have the high for those bits where we use the huge range of an 8 string. However he will also make parts which act as other rythem parts.


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## thesimo (Dec 10, 2010)

guambomb832 said:


> Yeah Tosin doesn't have a live bassist, but Tosin recorded the bass on his album.



I seen an interview on toontrack the other day, he says he recorded it clean on guitar and pitch shifted it down. Whatever works


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## josh pelican (Dec 12, 2010)

I will always tune the same as the guitars. I played in a band that used 8 strings. I had my 6 string bass set up for F#. I was using Octave 4 Plus strings and although it sounded good by itself, I don't like the way it sounded in the mix. Since going to Circle K I would never touch another string for low tuning.

My next step is to get a four string and set it up for an octave lower with a Hipshot D-Tuner to go to "drop D".


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## Allhailpantera123 (Dec 12, 2010)

There was some dude a long time ago who got a custom 12 string bass and tuned it down to B00, an octave below a 5 string bass. That's resonating at about 15 Hz. Makes me wonder why people like to waste their money on things that can't be heard. Then again he could feign a bassline and claim to have superhuman infrasonic hearing.


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## SD83 (Dec 12, 2010)

Allhailpantera123 said:


> There was some dude a long time ago who got a custom 12 string bass and tuned it down to B00, an octave below a 5 string bass. That's resonating at about 15 Hz. Makes me wonder why people like to waste their money on things that can't be heard. Then again he could feign a bassline and claim to have superhuman infrasonic hearing.


a)there are still overtones which an average human being can hear as far as I know
b)it's not necessarily all about the things you can hear. With the right speakers, I'm sure you can feel 15 Hz. Infrasound  Infrasound - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Not sure to which extend some of those effects can be achieved with an instrument like a 12 string bass. 
c)from the fifth fret onwards, it would be back in the normal range of human hearing. Which might still make it useful without any infrasound-stuff etc.


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## Demiurge (Dec 12, 2010)

As usual, help carry equipment and split the cost of gas.


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## GATA4 (Dec 12, 2010)

I agree with bostjan.

Dan Briggs from BTBAM uses some pretty amazing bass arrangements that vary from the guitar riffs at hand. I'm pretty sure he tuned an octave down from C#, but he's still got unique stuff going on. BTBAM isn't an eight string band, but you get the idea 

I also think that it matters about what the band wants to sound like. The bass can compliment the guitar quite well when used in a unified, lockstep kind of way. The guy from ATB (who was mentioned previously) plays a lot like this, but his sound adds to the overall thickness to the guitar sound. This is why a lot of people think that metal guitars sound really bassy and huge when in fact, they are mostly a mid-range instrument accompanied by the bass (which opens them up). The prime example of bass complimenting guitar, that I can think of, is Metallica's song "Sad But True." If you listen to the verses, the bass adds such a HUGE thickness to the guitars, it's not even funny. It also adds to their attack, and makes them sound awesome.

So, it's a bit more complicated due to sonic limits at hand when using eight string guitars, but the options are still the same as with 7 strings, 6 strings, or even banjos


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## thrashcomics (Dec 12, 2010)

guambomb832 said:


> Yeah Tosin doesn't have a live bassist, but Tosin recorded the bass on his album.



all the bass is programed. no one played it.


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## josh pelican (Dec 12, 2010)

GATA4 said:


> I'm pretty sure he (Dan Briggs) is tuned an octave down from C#



What are you talking about?


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## GATA4 (Dec 12, 2010)

josh pelican said:


> What are you talking about?



wait wait...so he doesn't play in C#? or am I just wrong about the octave part? I guess the bass is already like 45809 octaves down anyway haha so that wouldn't make sense.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 12, 2010)

GATA4 said:


> wait wait...so he doesn't play in C#? or am I just wrong about the octave part? I guess the bass is already like 45809 octaves down anyway haha so that wouldn't make sense.



Per the Colors sheet music Dan tunes his 5-string to G#-C#-F#-B-E from low to high. The C# being one octave below the C# Standard that Paul and Dustie tune to, which is the C# on the 2nd fret of the low B on a standard tuner 7-string.


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## GATA4 (Dec 12, 2010)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Per the Colors sheet music Dan tunes his 5-string to G#-C#-F#-B-E from low to high. The C# being one octave below the C# Standard that Paul and Dustie tune to, which is the C# on the 2nd fret of the low B on a standard tuner 7-string.



 ok, excellent. I believe my source of information regarding Briggs's tuning was some no-name tab post on ultimate-guitar.com haha. *note to self*


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## josh pelican (Dec 12, 2010)

Yeah, the octave part was incorrect, but Max was right about the tuning. He would be an octave lower than the guitar, but not a bass strung for C#. The G# (Ab) is for fun and I don't think he hits it open very often, if at all.


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## MintBerryCrunch (Dec 14, 2010)

i love how when someone says they're playing in E, or B on this forum you really have no idea what octave they're talking about lol


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## No2EMGs4Me (Dec 20, 2010)

**This is a repost from another thread that i meant to put in here**When tuning down lower than B on a bass you need to get a pretty decent bass....which we all know has a pretty penny attached to it. Warwicks or another smaller named company of equal quality. I know there's a few out there, I just cant think of a name right now, or a custom one like Fender did for Christian in Fear Factory. A huge problem lower price basses have is the bridge is cheap so theres lots of bleed when youre playing on one string and the others start making noise due to vibration. Ibanez's SR's have this issue I had an SR 406 and I never truely noticed it until I bought a BTB4006(not 100% on model#) and the bridge has each string separated from one another and immediately I noticed a huge increase in the overall cleanliness of my right hand and everything sounded more articulate.


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## ViolaceousVerdance (Apr 9, 2012)

Daggorath said:


> Listen to a guitar on it's own, then with a bass playing the same note. That should answer your question. It's all about frequencies, a guitar with the kind of EQ of a bass is hopelessly muddy, and a bass with a guitar style EQ is equally as inept.



all one needs to know is right there^ and that's context.


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## cGoEcYk (Apr 9, 2012)

I might be behind the times, I just can't do super low mud frequencies. I keep my 5 string in standard, even when playing F# stuff. When you are tuned low (even B) the guitars + kick have so much low end the bass should just be filling in low mids with a somewhat midrange voicing for presence to taste.

I think the role of bass is somewhat percussive in this context... specically to add the harder punch and attack that a guitar might lack, or just fill in a different kind of grit if you are heavily overdriven (Meshuggah).


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## Splinterhead (Apr 9, 2012)

I can't imagine trying to record the articulation of a low F# on a bass. I know that if it wasn't there its absence would indeed be heard/felt but I'd be interested in the actual recording technique of capturing frequencies that low.


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## Konfyouzd (Apr 9, 2012)

I write guitar and basslines like counter melodies that dance around each other rather than following each other.

I also don't write metal really.


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## Konfyouzd (Apr 9, 2012)

Stealthdjentstic said:


> Exactly, when you tune a step down does the bassist suddenly start playing rock and only ever play root notes? No, he does not.



Plus even at the same pitch a guitar and bass just don't sound the same.


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## Davey (Apr 9, 2012)

The bass player plays the melody of course. It's a classic role reversal


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## rectifryer (Apr 9, 2012)

It goes without saying that the overtones of a bass tuned an octave below will still help fill out the guitar tone. I have a baritone five string f-5e and it is glorious behind / under my k7 at fsharp. Are the fundamentals the main voice? No, but its not that way in any band. Proper string gauge and scale is a must. I know my k7 is short so I got some eight strings on the way.


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## Rick (Apr 9, 2012)

ViolaceousVerdance said:


> all one needs to know is right there^ and that's context.



You bumped this thread for that?


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## ViolaceousVerdance (Apr 16, 2012)

Konfyouzd said:


> I write guitar and basslines like counter melodies that dance around each other rather than following each other.
> 
> I also don't write metal really.



I think metal could benefit from some counterpoint between the guitar/s and bass. Unison is cool and all, but it is really much more powerful when it's not the only technique being used.


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## mrlespaulman (Apr 18, 2012)

Wow, I started this thread a year and half ago. How is it still going??

Oh, and +1 to all the counterpoint stuff. That makes the unison lines really feel like you just got hit in the balls by a freight train carrying atomic weapons made in Russia during the Cold War Under the rule of a zombie Joseph Stalin.


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