# Why aren't KT88's more popular?



## sevenstringj (Apr 11, 2009)

Alternatively, how much of the saturation tone do metal practitioners typically get from the power tubes? I remember with my old rig, I could set the preamp to clean, and crank the power amp (EL34's) to get brutal distortion. But the tubes wouldn't last very long.

So if metalers get most if not all of their distortion from the preamp, why aren't KT88-equipped power sections more common, with their increased headroom and articulation (or so I've heard)?

Somewhat related question--does the "brown sound" come from preamp or power amp saturation?


----------



## WarriorOfMetal (Apr 11, 2009)

KT88/6550s ftw!


----------



## ohio_eric (Apr 11, 2009)

Guitar players and amp builders seem bound to the past. Since most of the classic amps favor the EL34 or 6L6 tubes the 6550 types never have really caught on. 

I love them though. 

Brown Sound comes from a cranked up old Marshall through low wattage speakers and a bright guitar with a PAF type pickup.


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 11, 2009)

6550/KT88s are the key to life. I'll NEVER play another tube


----------



## onefingersweep (Apr 11, 2009)

sevenstringj said:


> Alternatively, how much of the saturation tone do metal practitioners typically get from the power tubes? I remember with my old rig, I could set the preamp to clean, and crank the power amp (EL34's) to get brutal distortion. But the tubes wouldn't last very long.



What rig? 


I've never tried K88's, but I would like to, maybe I'll buy a Pitbull Ultra Lead and try


----------



## MrRedRaider (Apr 11, 2009)

ohio_eric said:


> Guitar players and amp builders seem bound to the past. Since most of the classic amps favor the EL34 or 6L6 tubes the 6550 types never have really caught on.
> 
> I love them though.
> 
> Brown Sound comes from a cranked up old Marshall through low wattage speakers and a bright guitar with a PAF type pickup.



Along with a variac to modulate the voltage to the amp, which is damaging, but creates that extra sag and articulation.


----------



## sevenstringj (Apr 11, 2009)

onefingersweep said:


> What rig?



Sansamp into VHT 2/50/2.


----------



## Scar Symmetry (Apr 11, 2009)

DrakkarTyrannis said:


> 6550/KT88s are the key to life. I'll NEVER play another tube



which ones did you have in those vids of your JSX? they sounded fucking awesome.


----------



## SargeantVomit (Apr 11, 2009)

If people are relying on clean power and overdriven preamps why the heck do they even buy tube amps?!

The only reason to buy tube power is to push them.


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 11, 2009)

Scar Symmetry said:


> which ones did you have in those vids of your JSX? they sounded fucking awesome.



6550s. And get this. The 6505 can be modded for 6550 tubes. I GOTTA get me one of those. Can you fuckin' imagine? I'd love to hear a Triple Recto with KT88s


----------



## Scar Symmetry (Apr 11, 2009)

6550s have my approval 

when the new E34Ls on my Cobra are worn out I'll definitely be giving them a try


----------



## TomAwesome (Apr 11, 2009)

ohio_eric said:


> Guitar players and amp builders seem bound to the past. Since most of the classic amps favor the EL34 or 6L6 tubes the 6550 types never have really caught on.



That was more or less my assumption.



DrakkarTyrannis said:


> 6550s. And get this. The 6505 can be modded for 6550 tubes. I GOTTA get me one of those. Can you fuckin' imagine? I'd love to hear a Triple Recto with KT88s



I think that's what Dino Cazares does with his 5150. It sounds pretty good to me.


----------



## Tukaar (Apr 11, 2009)

I've been meaning to get into the KT88's someday. (Hopefully via some GREEN amps. ) I would have sex with the tone emitted from a Green Master Volume head and a Green 200 watt slave unit running KT88s. *melts*


----------



## Corwin (Apr 12, 2009)

I think that the new Blackstar Series One 200 has KT88. That is one amp I've set my eyes on.
This week I'll be going to play some blackstar (if the Series One 200 is there so i'll sure play it!) and see whats going on.


----------



## WarriorOfMetal (Apr 12, 2009)

SargeantVomit said:


> If people are relying on clean power and overdriven preamps why the heck do they even buy tube amps?!
> 
> The only reason to buy tube power is to push them.



even run clean, they still have an effect on the tone.


----------



## budda (Apr 12, 2009)

you dont see many amps running around wiht KT66's or KT77's stock either 

i think that chances are, if you're an average guitar player (meaning that you dont spend time on guitar forums ), then you dont know a whole lot about different tube types, or tube characteristics, unless you tech your gear, are interested in amps, or have friends who are amp techs.


----------



## nordhauser06 (Apr 12, 2009)

KT88's + Mesa Mark III = win.


----------



## zimbloth (Apr 12, 2009)

The two Diezels I got in have 6550s and they sound _crazy _good (I think I like the VH4 better in an unrelated note). Of course, my beloved VHTs use KT88s as well, and even Marshalls I've heard with KT88s sounded awesome. I love KT88s/6550s


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 12, 2009)

Well..we can start a 6550/KT88 club. And wage war on those damn 6L6ers and those EL34ies


----------



## budda (Apr 12, 2009)

good thing i sport KT77's!

KT88's are also *expensive*


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 12, 2009)

budda said:


> good thing i sport KT77's!
> 
> KT88's are also *expensive*



Shut up you..you don't belong here..get out!!


----------



## budda (Apr 12, 2009)




----------



## sevenstringj (Apr 12, 2009)

budda said:


> good thing i sport KT77's!
> 
> KT88's are also *expensive*



What amp are you equipping with KT77's, and what do you make of them? I tried them in my VHT a while back and was neither disappointed nor impressed. They were kinda in between EL34's and 6L6's. But since they're direct replacements for EL34's, I'm not surprised that they don't come standard. Though it'd be interesting to hear a head _designed_ with KT77's.

Anyone have a THD or Groove Tubes power amp? They're the only ones I know who allow you to use almost any tube. It'd be interesting to hear how such different tubes sound in the same amp.


----------



## hairychris (Apr 12, 2009)

DrakkarTyrannis said:


> 6550s. And get this. The 6505 can be modded for 6550 tubes. I GOTTA get me one of those. Can you fuckin' imagine? I'd love to hear a Triple Recto with KT88s



The Dual Recto with KT88s and GZ34 rectifier tube set is fucking great - a beast. 6L6's bigger brother, cleans are really affected too and sound a lot nicer. Eurotubes does sets for Mesa & Peavey, as long as you like JJs.

I tried putting my set into my Diezel Einstein, and wasn't really convinced. =C= SED EL34s seem to work better in that amp, but I may try 1 pair =C= 6550 + 1 pair =C= EL34 next time...


----------



## groph (Apr 12, 2009)

Apparently Randall RM100's can run on KT88's. What are the typical sound characteristics of them? (KT88's, not RM100's)


----------



## budda (Apr 12, 2009)

sevenstringj said:


> What amp are you equipping with KT77's, and what do you make of them? I tried them in my VHT a while back and was neither disappointed nor impressed. They were kinda in between EL34's and 6L6's. But since they're direct replacements for EL34's, I'm not surprised that they don't come standard. Though it'd be interesting to hear a head _designed_ with KT77's.
> 
> Anyone have a THD or Groove Tubes power amp? They're the only ones I know who allow you to use almost any tube. It'd be interesting to hear how such different tubes sound in the same amp.




I had/have them in the JSX, which came stock with EL34's (which are in right now, as 1 KT77 went on me). I get the most punch with them, and i dont want big huge low end. I tried 6L6's in the JSX once, it felt like the amp was a bit neutered. I really want to get the KT77's back in mine, just gotta ship a KT77 to be tested so i can get a proper replacement.

I know a guy on here who used to own the THD univalve, i'll let him know his experience is requested


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 12, 2009)

Alright..a triple recto loaded with KT88s and GZ34 Rectifier tubes..through a Vader cab loaded with 4 EVM12L Black Label 300 watt speakers. I almost came just typing that


----------



## Zugster (Apr 12, 2009)

sevenstringj said:


> What amp are you equipping with KT77's, and what do you make of them? I tried them in my VHT a while back and was neither disappointed nor impressed. They were kinda in between EL34's and 6L6's. But since they're direct replacements for EL34's, I'm not surprised that they don't come standard. Though it'd be interesting to hear a head _designed_ with KT77's.
> 
> Anyone have a THD or Groove Tubes power amp? They're the only ones I know who allow you to use almost any tube. It'd be interesting to hear how such different tubes sound in the same amp.


 
I had a THD Univalve for a while. A JJ KT77 was by far the best power tube I ever put in it. Never tried a KT88. I didn't get that far because the Uni didn't do it for me - I had hoped for low power, low volume metal - but it was not the answer. So I sold it. It did give me a feel for the sound of different tubes.


----------



## sevenstringj (Apr 12, 2009)

DrakkarTyrannis said:


> Alright..a triple recto loaded with KT88s and GZ34 Rectifier tubes..through a Vader cab loaded with 4 EVM12L Black Label 300 watt speakers. I almost came just typing that





I had no idea that was possible. It's just KT88's and GZ34's, you don't have to mod the amp for that? Can you do that with Mesa's power amps?


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 12, 2009)

sevenstringj said:


> I had no idea that was possible. It's just KT88's and GZ34's, you don't have to mod the amp for that? Can you do that with Mesa's power amps?



Just pop em in and you're good to go


----------



## vontetzianos (Apr 13, 2009)

In some of the combo amps where the tubes are upside down, you have to buy a different bracket for each socket for them to fit properly.


----------



## blackrobedone (Apr 13, 2009)

I've seen about 3 brands of KT88s available that are reasonably priced: Sovtek, JJ, and EH. Anyone compared them? I don't know what brand the KT88s are in my 2203KK, but they are labelled TAD (Tube Amp Doctor).

I just put some JJ 6L6s in my Soldano, removing the 5881 Sovteks. They had a lot less noise and a lot more low end.


----------



## maat (Apr 13, 2009)

Tukaar said:


> *melts*




Yuppers, that'd be about right...That's EXACTLY what'd happen to your penorz if you tried to stick in a Green Amp.



DrakkarTyrannis said:


> Well..we can start a 6550/KT88 club. And wage war on those damn 6L6ers and those EL34ies


Damn you. My Carvin TS-100's got no other choice!



For now...


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Apr 13, 2009)

maat said:


> Damn you. My Carvin TS-100's got no other choice!
> 
> 
> 
> For now...



Assimilate or die!


----------



## sami (Apr 13, 2009)

I'd be interested in doing this in my amp. It's got a switch for EL34/6L6 with bias prongs and adjustment knob all on the back. What is the general proper voltage setting for KT88's??


----------



## Randy (Apr 13, 2009)

nordhauser06 said:


> KT88's + Mesa Mark III = win.



WOAH! Bias mod? NEED-MORE-INFO-PLEASE!!! 



sami said:


> What is the general proper voltage setting for KT88's??



My sources tell me EL-34s run 37-29 VDC, 6L6's run 45 VDC, and KT88/6550's run +/- 52 VDC.

Also, I've heard these are less common because they beat the living shit out of your transformer(s), so they require a higher quality/capacity unit than most companies are willing to put in for the sake of experimenting or diversifying. Not sure if that's the case, but that's what I've heard.


----------



## maat (Apr 13, 2009)

I've been LONGING to upgrade at least one side of my TS-100 to KT77 or KT88s, but I'd have to modify the chassis for space. Looks like I'll end up building it out of wood or something.


----------



## CornSyrup (Apr 13, 2009)

Ive got JJ KT88s and KT66s in my voodoo mod Dual Rectifier and it sounds massive now. Just adding the two KT88s added much enjoyed girth to my tone. KT88s are going into my Uberschall when it is due to its next retube!!


----------



## MTech (Apr 13, 2009)

They're extremely expensive compared to other tubes and a lot of guys find them to be too tight/blunt, that's why you've seen some guys leave the VHT roster.


----------



## groph (Apr 13, 2009)

Dammit I just got GAS for some KT88's for my RM100.... I checked the Randall forums and a lot of guys run KT88's with EL34L's. I know nothing about tubes but it sounds good in theory.


----------



## BurialWithin (May 12, 2009)

can you put 6550/KT88's in a 5150??


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (May 12, 2009)

BurialWithin said:


> can you put 6550/KT88's in a 5150??



It would have to be modified to take a quad of 6550's..however Eurotube sells and integrated quad with two KT88s on the outside and two 6L6s on the inside


----------



## yacker (Jun 8, 2009)

I know this is an old thread but I just have to chime in and say I LOVE KT88's. I use a set of 4 in my Mesa Boogie 50/50 power amp running with my Mesa Quad preamp. The difference between the 88's and 6L6's was massive.


----------



## BIGKAHUNA (Jun 8, 2009)

*edit bolded**For my Triple Rec *Bob at Euro-Tubes recommended a set of KT88's and a *quad *of KT66's. I was wondering if someone could elaborate on the tonal differences in the combinations. I was thinking that all KT88's would be the trick but Bob insisted on the mixed set. 

I am assuming that all KT88's is pure high gain brutality and the mixed set is designed for a more balanced attack...am I trackin?


----------



## MTech (Jun 8, 2009)

because it's fixed bias and can't handle running all of them more than likely. Though I don't see that combo anywhere on the site, for the 5150 it says Integrated KT88-6L6GC or KT66-6L6GC's not KT88 & KT66's EDIT: It's the same with the mesa it's fixed bias but he mixes them so it stays tight but still has plenty of mids.

KT88's being for massive thick lows and gain where as the KT66's are more for the british sound.


----------



## WarriorOfMetal (Jun 8, 2009)

MTech said:


> because it's fixed bias for one and possibly the fact they *drawl* more power maybe the amp doesn't pump out enough to run 4... so you probably can't get away with running 4.



The tubes speak with a southern accent?

The word is "draw"...no "L"


----------



## MTech (Jun 8, 2009)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> The tubes speak with a southern accent?



I caught that but I guess you saw it before I changed the post


----------



## Meldville (Jun 8, 2009)

*wonders how he could run kt88s in his engl straight 100*


----------



## WarriorOfMetal (Jun 8, 2009)

MTech said:


> I caught that but I guess you saw it before I changed the post



You did it in the Savage vs. Cobra thread, too


----------



## MTech (Jun 8, 2009)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> You did it in the Savage vs. Cobra thread, too



I knew I did it somewhere else  I was typing out this time and I was like wait a minute that's not right, and I just did this the other day too (I looked though and I must've caught myself in that thread cause it's correct in that thread.  FML


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Jun 8, 2009)

6550/KT88s are the best thing that ever happened to me. I'll never play another amp that can't take them...NEVER


----------



## sol niger 333 (Jun 8, 2009)

Splawn Nitro with kt88 mod. Very special


----------



## DrakkarTyrannis (Jun 8, 2009)

sol niger 333 said:


> Splawn Nitro with kt88 mod. Very special



My next amp...


----------

