# New Amp Head? (Mesa Mark V 25 vs ???)



## Eden (Aug 21, 2017)

Hey Guys, looking for some amp advice; My current rig is a 6505+112 combo running into a Mesa 2x12 cab and I'm looking into making the leap into a full head/crate setup. I don't need anything with too much power because for the most part I play at home, but do jam semi-regularly with friends. As for as sound is concerned I'd prefer versatility and Peavey cleans just aren't super doing it for me. Currently I have my mind set upon finding a used Mesa Mark V 25 head (I see them on reverb around 1000-1100 typically) but what amps may I be overlooking? I wouldn't mind saving money if I could


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## getowned7474 (Aug 21, 2017)

If you are looking for versatility (and good cleans!) Mark V is where it's at for sure. If you like a bit more of British voicing Laney IRT is inexpensive and looks to be versatile. I have one coming in a few days and can update you on it if you are interested at all.


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## LiveOVErdrive (Aug 21, 2017)

I moved from a 6505+ 112 with a Mesa cab to a mark V and never looked back. (90...the used 90s weren't much more than used 25s or 35s when I looked). Cleans are perfect. High gain is perfect. Great amp. Really.


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## Eden (Aug 21, 2017)

getowned7474 said:


> If you are looking for versatility (and good cleans!) Mark V is where it's at for sure. If you like a bit more of British voicing Laney IRT is inexpensive and looks to be versatile. I have one coming in a few days and can update you on it if you are interested at all.



Yea please update me if you think about it, I've wondered about Laneys but have never really gotten to play one


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## cwhitey2 (Aug 21, 2017)

Fryette sig:x.

You can get ANY tone out of them with the right cab... They are just kinda hard to find.


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## will_shred (Aug 21, 2017)

The 35 gives way more volume than the 25 in my experience, but if I could go back in time I would've just saved my money for the big boy 90 watt. 

Honestly I don't see myself using any amp that isn't a Mark Series in the future, its just perfect.


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## purpledc (Aug 21, 2017)

Eden said:


> Yea please update me if you think about it, I've wondered about Laneys but have never really gotten to play one




I used to own a mark V. The 90 watter. Great amp. But I was very much a set it and forget it type of guy so I really only used 2 sounds out of it. A clean and a dirty tone. All those switches do change the tone. But I found I only liked it with specific settings. I would argue they are very versatile if you like the other voicings the amp provides. Still even though for me the amp was a one trick pony for my personal tastes it was still the best amp I have ever owned until a couple weeks ago. 

I get it if you want a mark series. They are great. But if versatility is really what you want and the Mark series stuff is in your price range I would highly suggest you try out a kemper. I was a total non believer. But now that I have one, I have to say it was the best purchase I have ever made. My ear isn't perfect but its decent. And the amount of tonal difference between the kemper and the amp it references could easily be the same difference in tone you would get from 10 different mark V's lined up. As in if there is any difference my ear cant pick it up. Just a thought.


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## ctgblue (Aug 21, 2017)

I had three of the Laney IRT amps.
Studio
60 head
30 combo
They are closer to a Mesa than a Marshall, IMO, having had all of them.
The studio 15 got as loud as the 30 combo, but I'd go for the 60 head with a 212 or 112.
The watts feature is great and it'll make the 6505 combo sound tame
Hunt GC's used stuff or eBay
$600'ish
Good luck


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## ctgblue (Aug 21, 2017)

OR. Positive grid head amp, what I would have if I had the money

600 watts $1299
And much easier to use than the Kempers


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## Eden (Aug 22, 2017)

purpledc said:


> I used to own a mark V. The 90 watter. Great amp. But I was very much a set it and forget it type of guy so I really only used 2 sounds out of it. A clean and a dirty tone. All those switches do change the tone. But I found I only liked it with specific settings. I would argue they are very versatile if you like the other voicings the amp provides. Still even though for me the amp was a one trick pony for my personal tastes it was still the best amp I have ever owned until a couple weeks ago.
> 
> I get it if you want a mark series. They are great. But if versatility is really what you want and the Mark series stuff is in your price range I would highly suggest you try out a kemper. I was a total non believer. But now that I have one, I have to say it was the best purchase I have ever made. My ear isn't perfect but its decent. And the amount of tonal difference between the kemper and the amp it references could easily be the same difference in tone you would get from 10 different mark V's lined up. As in if there is any difference my ear cant pick it up. Just a thought.



You know I have always wondered about Kemper. Having never really gotten to play anything of the sorts I've just mentally written them off as a more cost effective Axe FX and never thought I would be able to get into them. I have heard amazing things about them though, but have my reservations about any learning curves that might be associated with them


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## purpledc (Aug 22, 2017)

Eden said:


> You know I have always wondered about Kemper. Having never really gotten to play anything of the sorts I've just mentally written them off as a more cost effective Axe FX and never thought I would be able to get into them. I have heard amazing things about them though, but have my reservations about any learning curves that might be associated with them




The most complicated thing about the kemper is the persons own reservations. I was very intimidated. Then after ten minutes with it you go " it cant be that easy". But it really is. Overthinking it is the only reason someone might have an issue. Now when i play on it I vontemplate why all gear cant be set up to work the way it does. If you have the chance to try one out i would. I didnt have one to try so i got one from sweetwater. They gave me an insanely good price and i was fully expecting i would send it back and just buy the mark v. That didnt happen. Whats most awesome is the noise gate and noise reduction. The thing is silent unless you are playing yet notes fully bloom and they have all the character and feel of the amp its emulating. Sorry for coming off like a fanboy. Its just when you experience something this good you want to share it with others.


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## purpledc (Aug 22, 2017)

ctgblue said:


> OR. Positive grid head amp, what I would have if I had the money
> 
> 600 watts $1299
> And much easier to use than the Kempers




Have you ever used a kemper? I would say on one hand you are correct that the pg head is easier to use. But that doesnt mean the kemper is actually difficult to use. Plus positive grid bias head has no effects. And i would argue the amps on the kemper are more realistic. I got my kemper rack which also has 600 watts for $2000 shipped. Imho it was worth every penny over the bias. Plus i have all the bias software and got it for $75. Makes the head not really worth it imho.


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## PBGas (Aug 23, 2017)

If you can spring for it, get the Mark V head. If you want a great sounding head which is plenty loud and also sounds great, the Mark V 35 is fantastic as well.


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## Deadpool_25 (Aug 23, 2017)

I have a Mark V:25. It's a great amp. Fantastic cleans, fantastic Crunch, fantastic high gain. Will said the 35 gives way more volume. That may or may not be true, I haven't tried the 35. But I can say the 25 gets very loud even through the 1X12 cab. I haven't run mine through my 2x12. As much as I love its tone, I'm considering selling it.

The things I don't like:
1) The Crunch mode is on channel 1 so I can't switch quickly between clean and Crunch. Crunch is my favorite mode on the amp.
2) I wish it was 3 channels (goes with number 1)
3) I wish it was organically MIDI capable

Those things really aren't true showstoppers, but I'm planning on a stereo rig with the TC-50 and a Peavey Invective. so I consider selling it but every time I look at it I think about how awesome that little amp is and wonder if I should just keep it.


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## InCasinoOut (Aug 24, 2017)

Deadpool_25 said:


> I have a Mark V:25. It's a great amp. Fantastic cleans, fantastic Crunch, fantastic high gain. Will said the 35 gives way more volume. That may or may not be true, I haven't tried the 35. But I can say the 25 gets very loud even through the 1X12 cab. I haven't run mine through my 2x12. As much as I love its tone, I'm considering selling it.
> 
> The things I don't like:
> 1) The Crunch mode is on channel 1 so I can't switch quickly between clean and Crunch. Crunch is my favorite mode on the amp.
> ...


I was considering the 25 like OP originally, but ultimately decided to save for the 35 (actually saved a little more and got it custom-colored), and I'm glad I did, because playing with a loud drummer is not a problem. I do feel like 35 watts is kinda pushing it on clean headroom when playing loud, and thats what makes me think the 25 is juuuust a little too small when jamming with other loud musicians.

I agree with not liking that the crunch mode is actually a voicing tied to the clean channel, but I understand that if Mesa were to make it a 3 channel amp, that would blur the line with it's 90 watt big brother too closely. My solution was to pick up a Friedman BE-OD, and now I feel like I've finally achieved my goal of a very versatile tube amp that I can gig, jam with, and play at bedroom volume or lower easily. Still, my main use for the 35 is recording and bedroom playing, so living without being able to switch between clean and crunch for a year wasnt a big deal.


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## DarthV (Aug 24, 2017)

ctgblue said:


> OR. Positive grid head amp, what I would have if I had the money
> 
> 600 watts $1299
> And much easier to use than the Kempers



You haven't used a Kemper then. No harder to dial in than a Mark V. For 1299, I'd take a Mark V 25 over the BIAS head. It's not exactly the pinnacle of amp modeling. Hell, you could get a Helix LT + FRFR for the same price as the BH as well.

To the OP, the biggest drawback to the 25/35 marks is that they are only 2 channel. You want clean, crunch and heavy (or lead) available on the fly, then you'll need to go with the 90. In my case, I pretty much never play clean so the 25w works great for me. Had no problem keeping up with a metal drummer in a small room through a 2x12.


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## ctgblue (Aug 24, 2017)

There's a used Pos Grid Bias Powered head at GC online for $849, and I spent my money already... arghh... $920 with tax and shipping, for me anyway

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Used/Positive-Grid/Bias-Head-Solid-State-Guitar-Amp-Head.gc


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## getowned7474 (Aug 24, 2017)

Eden said:


> Yea please update me if you think about it, I've wondered about Laneys but have never really gotten to play one



I got my IRT studio and it's pretty versatile. The cleans are a little bland with settings at noon but if you scoop the eq a bit and turn up the dynamics knob it gets full and sparkly on the top end. The breakup when the clean is pushed is pretty pleasant as well. Distortion channel is good, pretty bright and chunky, reminds me a little bit of orange amps in the gain structure. The eq is very versatile, you can get a lot of different sounds but it requires a bit of experimenting since there are so many different combinations with all the options on it. Even with all the different eq settings it seems to retain a bit of that grittiness in the gain structure that gives me a bit of a British vibe. I would make sure you like that kind of sound before you think about getting one. The Mark V in comparison will have a smoother gain structure and a little more "refined" sound. I personally prefer the more raw sound of the Laney


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## budda (Aug 24, 2017)

a 25W mark V is not going to be much quieter than a 90W mark V, and both have adjustable wattage if memory serves.

Get the highest wattage for the most headroom and tightest bass response, if those are requirements.

Really, you need to grab your guitar and try them out and see which one you prefer.


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## Shoeless_jose (Aug 24, 2017)

maybe I just dont use a "crunch" tone very much, but I figured even with either of the two Channel smaller Mark series amps you could have that third over the top sound through use of the graphic EQ, but obviously as someone who has not spent much time with one of these I could be way way off.


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## InCasinoOut (Aug 24, 2017)

Dineley said:


> maybe I just dont use a "crunch" tone very much, but I figured even with either of the two Channel smaller Mark series amps you could have that third over the top sound through use of the graphic EQ, but obviously as someone who has not spent much time with one of these I could be way way off.


I reaaaaaallly love the 2C+ voicing on the mini Marks. Somewhere not too modern and not too vintage.


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## DarthV (Aug 25, 2017)

Dineley said:


> maybe I just dont use a "crunch" tone very much, but I figured even with either of the two Channel smaller Mark series amps you could have that third over the top sound through use of the graphic EQ, but obviously as someone who has not spent much time with one of these I could be way way off.



The crunch on Ch1 of the 25/35 also has a lot of gain on tap, not 5150 levels but quite a bit more than AC/DC crunch. The foot switch on the 25 (25 too?), lets you turn the GEQ on and off, but it's a very important part of getting a "mark" tone. Guessing 99%+ of owners would be using the GEQ most of the time for high gain tones.

And like budda said, don't expect the lower wattage versions to be much quieter. CH2 in either IV or extreme modes is pretty twitchy when you go from TV volumes to a slight twitch of the master & having someone yelling at you.

And Marks aren't for everyone. They do offer a wide variety of tones, but if you're looking at the very saturated gain from a 6505 it may not be what you want. Then again, throw a good clean boost in front and maybe it will work for you. I'm using a Grid Slammer in front of mine and love it


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## Eden (Aug 27, 2017)

I've gotten the chance to play a mark v 25 watt before and I thought that it was pretty stellar. I loved the cleans and thought that the crunch and leads were pretty amazing, I've yet to find a 90 watt head that is close enough to the same price point though


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## Nicki (Aug 28, 2017)

If you're dead set on Mesa then go for it!

If you're open to new possibilities, Revv Amplification has been making some pretty big waves lately. The Generator 7-40 may be the droid you're looking for. Toss it on to a pretty nice 2x12 (Orange and Egnater come to mind) and you're set for both practice sessions and jams with your buds!


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## Brutal S (Aug 31, 2017)

the new low wattage mark are awesome. Don't hesitate!! they are awesome and do really come close to their bigger brothers


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## EdgeCrusher (Aug 31, 2017)

I really want to sell/trade my 5150 III 50 watt for a Mark V:25. The EVH is great for for super saturated modern tones, but is not near as versatile as my old Mark III. I miss the fantastic cleans and buttery smooth lead tones. The EVH is kinda meh for these. 

The only thing I'm weary of is the el-84 power section of the V:25. I want to be able to use it in a band situation with it farting out.


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## NinjaRaf (Sep 1, 2017)

I thought the Mark V 25 was the PERFECT at home/studio/recording amp. Just sounds so damn good and records SO easily. Its downfall for me was when I started playing in bands again. It just will not keep up with a drummer without sounding like its going to die. Real squealy, sorta thin sounding when the volume gets too high, you lose definition, compression gets too crazy. The small transformers and EL84s are just not made for keeping up with a drummer, in my opinion. Might work for your situation, but this was just my experience. I do still wish I had one for jamming and recording at home, though.


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## InCasinoOut (Sep 1, 2017)

NinjaRaf said:


> I thought the Mark V 25 was the PERFECT at home/studio/recording amp. Just sounds so damn good and records SO easily. Its downfall for me was when I started playing in bands again. It just will not keep up with a drummer without sounding like its going to die. Real squealy, sorta thin sounding when the volume gets too high, you lose definition, compression gets too crazy. The small transformers and EL84s are just not made for keeping up with a drummer, in my opinion. Might work for your situation, but this was just my experience. I do still wish I had one for jamming and recording at home, though.


I think this is where the 35 watt version does well for all the home applications you mentioned, as well as for jamming with a drummer. After all, Vox AC30s also have a quartet of EL84s and have been used for decades with loud, great drummers. When I play with my drummer buddy, my masters are only around noon and the amp keeps up fine even when he's blastbeating away. The clean channel starts to break up a bit though, but then I just ask him to play a little softer during a clean section


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## Eden (Sep 6, 2017)

Thanks for the comments so far guys, I appreciate them. Regarding moving away from 6505 levels of saturation, I'm pretty fine with changing. As far as my preference goes, I'm way more concerned with great cleans than distortion but I know that the mark can do both, plus I have a tubescreamer or Precision OD I could throw over to get some push.



Nicki said:


> If you're dead set on Mesa then go for it!
> 
> If you're open to new possibilities, Revv Amplification has been making some pretty big waves lately. The Generator 7-40 may be the droid you're looking for. Toss it on to a pretty nice 2x12 (Orange and Egnater come to mind) and you're set for both practice sessions and jams with your buds!



Cant Believe I've forgotten about Revv! I used to look at SMG and Fluffs vids and think those were such badass amps that I'd never afford, but for the price that I'm seeing them go for, I'd consider getting a mark v:90


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## Deadpool_25 (Sep 7, 2017)

NinjaRaf said:


> I thought the Mark V 25 was the PERFECT at home/studio/recording amp. Just sounds so damn good and records SO easily. Its downfall for me was when I started playing in bands again. It just will not keep up with a drummer without sounding like its going to die. Real squealy, sorta thin sounding when the volume gets too high, you lose definition, compression gets too crazy. The small transformers and EL84s are just not made for keeping up with a drummer, in my opinion. Might work for your situation, but this was just my experience. I do still wish I had one for jamming and recording at home, though.



Curious if you're talking about clean or distorted tones (or both) and what cab you were using in the band scenario.


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## DarthV (Sep 7, 2017)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Curious if you're talking about clean or distorted tones (or both) and what cab you were using in the band scenario.



Same, my 25 in extreme with an EVH 212 cab angled back had no probs keeping up with a drummer without going above 10 o'clock. Small room, though. If I wanted great cleans at volume, I would have bought the 90w


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## NinjaRaf (Sep 8, 2017)

Deadpool_25 said:


> Curious if you're talking about clean or distorted tones (or both) and what cab you were using in the band scenario.



Distortion channel. Didnt use clean stuff in that band. I tried with a couple of cabs...Mesa Thiele and a Randall 412.


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## Deadpool_25 (Sep 8, 2017)

NinjaRaf said:


> Distortion channel. Didnt use clean stuff in that band. I tried with a couple of cabs...Mesa Thiele and a Randall 412.



Interesting. I'd expect a 5:25 through a good 4x12 (or even a 2x12) to get loud enough to keep up with a drummer, but I guess it depends on a lot of factors.


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## NinjaRaf (Sep 13, 2017)

Yeah, I supposed...small room, super loud drummer (probably the loudest drummer I have worked with). I had the amp cranked to 75% volume, and it started squealing way too much to be usable, even with a noise gate.


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## Airhead (Sep 13, 2017)

Mesa Mark V 25 head is my dream amp, is first on my wish list.


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## Andromalia (Sep 13, 2017)

NinjaRaf said:


> Yeah, I supposed...small room, super loud drummer (probably the loudest drummer I have worked with). I had the amp cranked to 75% volume, and it started squealing way too much to be usable, even with a noise gate.



Weird, I rehearsed for ages with a mesa 20:20 power amp and it was waaaay loud enough.


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## TedintheShed (Sep 14, 2017)

Andromalia said:


> Weird, I rehearsed for ages with a mesa 20:20 power amp and it was waaaay loud enough.



Try an Ironball with an Engl can. Can't go wrong.


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## DarthV (Sep 15, 2017)

NinjaRaf said:


> Yeah, I supposed...small room, super loud drummer (probably the loudest drummer I have worked with). I had the amp cranked to 75% volume, and it started squealing way too much to be usable, even with a noise gate.



I'd try angling the cab up. In a small room, you're going to be right on top of the drummer and you'd be close enough to your cab for it to beam right into your knees or crotch


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## NinjaRaf (Sep 21, 2017)

DarthV said:


> I'd try angling the cab up. In a small room, you're going to be right on top of the drummer and you'd be close enough to your cab for it to beam right into your knees or crotch



Meh, I tried moving all around the room to see if I could get it to stop. Even standing behind the kit with him, it squealed. Regardless, I sold that amp close to 2 years ago, and am running a Mark IV these days.


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## Eden (Oct 19, 2017)

>>> bumping this thread

So I've recently sat down and played with a PRS Archon (it was the 25 watt combo) and I didn't have to crank that badboy up too much at the guitar store I was in before I started to feel a little guilty about the volume, so my hopes for owning a mark v: 25 and being able to jam with it aren't dashed (although I may be heavily considering saving for a 35w now) 

Also, continuing with the prs, what are your guy's thoughts on the Archon? The full sized amp can be found for the price of a mark v 25 on reverb and it had headroom for days on the clean channel. I was pretty impressed, but because of how more recently I've played it versus a mark v, I can't properly compare them in my head.


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## Jeff (Oct 20, 2017)

Deadpool_25 said:


> I have a Mark V:25. It's a great amp. Fantastic cleans, fantastic Crunch, fantastic high gain. Will said the 35 gives way more volume. That may or may not be true, I haven't tried the 35. But I can say the 25 gets very loud even through the 1X12 cab. I haven't run mine through my 2x12. As much as I love its tone, I'm considering selling it.
> 
> The things I don't like:
> 1) The Crunch mode is on channel 1 so I can't switch quickly between clean and Crunch. Crunch is my favorite mode on the amp.
> ...



I've owned both the 25 and 35, and I definitely disagree that the 35 is a lot louder. Maybe a little more clean room. Certainly not worth the increase in cost/weight/size. I'd much rather get the 25w, and a Fryette Power Station if I need more juice.


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## chassless (Oct 20, 2017)

just gonna butt in to mention the Engl Ironball, because it deserves it and it should be in the same price range as the Mark V depending where you live. i've owned one for a little over a year. the cleans are very crystally, it does a very convincing crunch and the high gain + gain boost is ungodly.

this video is quite accurate, thpugh his guitar is slightly out of tune in the lower strings which takes away a bit of the amp's amazing string separation.


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## Eden (Dec 10, 2017)

Gonna bump this again

So I've been saving up still and keeping my eye on reverb, and I have noticed a decent amount of the full 90w Mark Vs going for 1400 - 1500, which for what you get compared to the 25w, is incredible. So I'm really thinking about getting the full head when I'm saved up, the only thing stopping me is this: Can you still get that amp quiet to bedroom/home practice? I know you can adjust the wattage for each channel, but I'm wondering if anyone here who has one or played one can confirm, I'd be super grateful. 

On a related note, I can't find any 35w used at all, are they just that much better that no one is selling theirs?


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## Shoeless_jose (Dec 10, 2017)

Eden said:


> Gonna bump this again
> 
> So I've been saving up still and keeping my eye on reverb, and I have noticed a decent amount of the full 90w Mark Vs going for 1400 - 1500, which for what you get compared to the 25w, is incredible. So I'm really thinking about getting the full head when I'm saved up, the only thing stopping me is this: Can you still get that amp quiet to bedroom/home practice? I know you can adjust the wattage for each channel, but I'm wondering if anyone here who has one or played one can confirm, I'd be super grateful.
> 
> On a related note, I can't find any 35w used at all, are they just that much better that no one is selling theirs?



The 35 was a more recent release and since the 90 watt had been out for so long people buying a 35 watt know thats what they want, wheras some people bought the 90 and then the TC100 came out, and the Invective and so on and so forth, and the JP2C lots of other amps to compete with the 90 watt.


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## Eden (Dec 10, 2017)

Dineley said:


> The 35 was a more recent release and since the 90 watt had been out for so long people buying a 35 watt know thats what they want, wheras some people bought the 90 and then the TC100 came out, and the Invective and so on and so forth, and the JP2C lots of other amps to compete with the 90 watt.


That's a fair point but for the price range that I'd be working with, most of those amps are out of the question (although a TC-50 wouldn't be impossible, I've heard great things about the triple crown series)


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## Shoeless_jose (Dec 10, 2017)

Eden said:


> That's a fair point but for the price range that I'd be working with, most of those amps are out of the question (although a TC-50 wouldn't be impossible, I've heard great things about the triple crown series)



Yeah I hear you on the price points, the TC-50 isn't much more than the 35 watt mark and I think is more amp for your money, but with any of the options you are considering you can't really go wrong, will really just boil down to preference and/or finding a good deal on one and not the other. 

I got my 5150 III for just over 1000 canadian, or else I would have been saving for the Mark 35 or TC50 so I know how you feel.


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## Eden (Dec 10, 2017)

Dineley said:


> Yeah I hear you on the price points, the TC-50 isn't much more than the 35 watt mark and I think is more amp for your money, but with any of the options you are considering you can't really go wrong, will really just boil down to preference and/or finding a good deal on one and not the other.
> 
> I got my 5150 III for just over 1000 canadian, or else I would have been saving for the Mark 35 or TC50 so I know how you feel.


At this point, I feel it would be easier getting a TC50 than a mark v 35, but with all the features in that amp, I would prefer it anyway. I just haven't gotten the chance to play any triple crown stuff. 

And then of course the 5150 III EL34 comes out and presents itself as another big competitor


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## budda (Dec 10, 2017)

Thought: look into the trans atlantic 30 along with the V:25.


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## prlgmnr (Dec 11, 2017)

Eden said:


> So I've been saving up still and keeping my eye on reverb, and I have noticed a decent amount of the full 90w Mark Vs going for 1400 - 1500, which for what you get compared to the 25w, is incredible. So I'm really thinking about getting the full head when I'm saved up, the only thing stopping me is this: Can you still get that amp quiet to bedroom/home practice? I know you can adjust the wattage for each channel, but I'm wondering if anyone here who has one or played one can confirm, I'd be super grateful.



For sure, nothing to worry about in that regard.


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## Eden (Dec 12, 2017)

Awesome! This was something that would have bothered me since I'll be moving out before too long and if I end up in an apartment, I wouldn't want to have an amp too loud to play. I know there are attenuators I could look into, as well as the two note products, but I'd prefer those to be long term investments rather than immediate considerations


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