# Zack Snyder and his films are awful



## oniduder (Mar 19, 2021)

Insert an image macro

nuff said 

/thread 

ahhhhh 

feel better


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## soul_lip_mike (Mar 19, 2021)

What a compelling argument.


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## wankerness (Mar 19, 2021)

I’m not sure what’s going on. Is this an ironic post from a Snyder fan imagining all the piling on Snyder that you imagine is about to occur?


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## KnightBrolaire (Mar 19, 2021)

counterpoint: you're wrong


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## Strobe (Mar 19, 2021)

KnightBrolaire said:


> counterpoint: you're wrong



Hot take. He's wrong, but not for the reasons you think.


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## Demiurge (Mar 19, 2021)

Sounds like somebody spent 4 hours watching a new movie and didn't enjoy themselves.


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## spudmunkey (Mar 19, 2021)

*shrugs* I liked it better than the first try.


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## oniduder (Mar 19, 2021)

I am being serious 

I don’t like Snyder or his sensibilities or puerile tendencies 

I haven’t seen the 4 hour opus nor the theatrical cut and don’t intend to 

he’s not only a hack fraud but he is also a really randian true objectivist and Christian douchebag who wears affliction tees not as a joke 

as for the tees I don’t think you can wear them ironically but Jesus fucking Christ he’s got nothing inside that’s interesting and he’s known for slowing that down on the screen to make sure everyone sees his emptiness which he thinks is truly deep 

ugh


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## wankerness (Mar 19, 2021)

Wow, I don’t like Zach Snyder much either, but you sound like a guy desperately trolling for outraged responses cause it would really turn you on.


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## oniduder (Mar 19, 2021)

wankerness said:


> Wow, I don’t like Zach Snyder much either, but you sound like a guy desperately trolling for outraged responses cause it would really turn you on.



i didn't think of this as trolling, but i guess it is by any definition

i honestly hate snyder but yeah this is definitely attention seeking/trolling

oops, the above opi0inons are real and i do dislike him and his fan base is probably more toxic than half of 4chan or 8chan or parlor,

ok that's a bit much on that latter part

but he's a not so good infantile director

his feminist movie is get a lobotomy and there's your real power? so that the good part of you lives in as your body is used? idk

he's got a thing for sexualizing rape and violence is cool to him like he's a 13 yo who threatens shooting up his school


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## thebeesknees22 (Mar 19, 2021)

I loved Man of Steel.

Also he was great to work for. When I was in Australia working on Sucker Punch he actually took the time to come to the studio and talk to us vfx peons. He seemed like a super fun dude.

He came in and basically did a whole monologue of the movie beginning to end, and it was great to see someone so stoked about their project.

Plus it's rare. Extremely RARE for a director to take time out of his day to basically acknowledge that we exist. Only he and Rob Cohen have ever talked to us like we're human beings in person out of all the shows I've worked on.

To most directors we're just shadows to be stepped on.

You all can hate his work all you want, but I'd work for him again. He's cool to work with and doesn't treat us vfx people like garbage.


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## MaxOfMetal (Mar 19, 2021)

I liked 300 and Watchmen.


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## diagrammatiks (Mar 19, 2021)

I like 300 and watchman

man of steel is ok.

all his movies after that kinda just look and feel that same.


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## wankerness (Mar 20, 2021)

Dawn of the Dead and Watchmen I remember liking, both solid 7/10. Man of Steel close to that. Everything else is worse, though I haven’t seen the damn owl movie. He at least has a distinctive look. It’s just too bad about the writing and hackneyed music cues.

he generally sounds like a decent dude “irl” and hearing positive stories like that about people always make me give their movies at least slightly more credit, even if I hate the content of the movie .


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## narad (Mar 20, 2021)

Yea, Dawn of the Dead remake was really well done.


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## MaxOfMetal (Mar 21, 2021)

narad said:


> Yea, Dawn of the Dead remake was really well done.


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## couverdure (Mar 21, 2021)

Man of Steel was pretty okay, but I didn't like the way Jonathan Kent's death was handled and the amount of not-so-subtle Jesus imagery was too many.

Batman v Superman was just bad, with so much self-indulging pretentiousness and a very convoluted plot. I watched the theatrical cut though but I don't think the Ultimate cut would've changed my opinion on it.

The 2017 version of Justice League was awful on many levels, but I wouldn't call it a Snyder movie because Joss Whedon reshot and cut out a lot of it and it ended up being a worse version of the first Avengers movie, which frankly along with the second one haven't aged that well (The Russo brothers' Infinity War and Endgame were far superior movies IMO).

I watched the Snyder cut of Justice League last night and the difference between it and the Whedon cut was night and day. I'd even call it his best DCEU movie, but that's not a high bar to clear. The four-hour runtime seems to drag but it's worth it for the character development, especially Cyborg who was barely a character in Whedon's version. The epilogue was completely unnecessary though, as there was obviously a newly-shot scene that was tacked on into a cut that was basically completed but shelved for years until now.


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## Louis Cypher (Mar 22, 2021)

I really love 300, Watchmen and Dawn of the Dead and have a lot of love for Man of Steel too actually. In his defense regarding the other DCEU films I'd say you cant lay the blame fully at his (or Whedon) door, Warner Bros. need to take a large amount of blame for it all. They wanted what Marvel had but wanted it immediately, there were not prepared to put the time and effort in to build a DC universe like Marvel had with their Phase 1 films and then WB keep trying to ride Marvel's coat tails like with the Suicide Squad rewrite tonal change farce after Marvel had scored so well with Guardians. DCEU needs to be taken away from WB and handled with some love for the characters and the stories in the same way Marvel have. To lay all the blame on its failure at the feet of Snyder is harsh and a bit lazy


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## Demiurge (Mar 22, 2021)

^The whole DCEU seems less planned-out, and trying to build it around one director's very idiosyncratic style was probably a mistake given the material. Snyder is probably best with material that already has some grit to it, but adding grit to things that don't need it (DC Comics to me, while not my bag, have always seemed colorful and varied- which is excellent to retain if you want a franchise) is just... well, poking fun at "gritty reboots" has been a long-standing meme.

Maybe if there's a 90's Image Comics cinematic universe he should be the first call. Everything rated R. Print the movie tickets on limited-edition foil stock. Go wild.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Mar 23, 2021)

Louis Cypher said:


> I really love 300, Watchmen and Dawn of the Dead and have a lot of love for Man of Steel too actually. In his defense regarding the other DCEU films I'd say you cant lay the blame fully at his (or Whedon) door, Warner Bros. need to take a large amount of blame for it all. They wanted what Marvel had but wanted it immediately, there were not prepared to put the time and effort in to build a DC universe like Marvel had with their Phase 1 films and then WB keep trying to ride Marvel's coat tails like with the Suicide Squad rewrite tonal change farce after Marvel had scored so well with Guardians. DCEU needs to be taken away from WB and handled with some love for the characters and the stories in the same way Marvel have. To lay all the blame on its failure at the feet of Snyder is harsh and a bit lazy



WB owns the rights to the entire DC Comics property so they won't be letting that go anytime soon. What they need is somebody at the helm who's as passionate as Kevin Feigie, and even then he worked damn hard to get his position. At least WB have that advantage rather than sharing custody with another big studio over their most popular character. 

Zack Snyder is (or at least was) passionate about it. Say what you will about his movies, and I've thrown some crap at his direction myself, but end of the day, he's a good filmmaker that knows exactly what he wants and does whatever it takes to fill his vision. That in itself is respectable. If anything, Snyder is perhaps arguably the kind of no compromise, auteur filmmaker that Martin Scorcese longs for when he was complaining about superhero movies. I say arguably since it's ironic when MCU have been known for hiring auteur directors for their movies.


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## MFB (Mar 23, 2021)

I mean, they've also got Geoff Johns on the payroll if memory serves correctly, and he's like DC's saving grace; so if he can't make a DCEU work - I honestly have no idea who can.


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## thebeesknees22 (Mar 23, 2021)

honestly directors for marvel don't have as much power as you think. What you see in a marvel movie isn't any one person's vision. It's a whole committee of people. Actually, that can be said for a lot movies these days. I can't remember the last time I worked on a big budget feature where the director had final say. ...but I spend most of my time in marvel land too. 

I can't speak on WB though since I've never been on one of their shows. They seem more hands off from the outside looking in. 

I do wish WB would take the vfx side of it a bit more seriously though. Some of the cg in Justice league and aquaman etc.. were....mmmmmm.....

...Visuals are such a huge part of a superhero movie that they need to spend the dollars to get those up to Marvel level vfx.


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## KnightBrolaire (Mar 23, 2021)

Demiurge said:


> ^The whole DCEU seems less planned-out, and trying to build it around one director's very idiosyncratic style was probably a mistake given the material. Snyder is probably best with material that already has some grit to it, but adding grit to things that don't need it (DC Comics to me, while not my bag, have always seemed colorful and varied- which is excellent to retain if you want a franchise) is just... well, poking fun at "gritty reboots" has been a long-standing meme.
> 
> Maybe if there's a 90's Image Comics cinematic universe he should be the first call. Everything rated R. Print the movie tickets on limited-edition foil stock. Go wild.


Everybody is too busy chasing that pg13 sweet spot, even though Deadpool/Logan/The Joker have proven that there's a big market for R rated comic book movies. 
Sony shit the bed with Bloodshot by neutering it/just making a bland film, which is surprising given the source material (which won a fucking eisner and is filled to the brim with hard R content). That kind of kills my hope of some of the 90s Valiant stuff getting expanded, and I have even less hope Image stuff would make it to film.


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## MaxOfMetal (Mar 23, 2021)

The DC movies were hampered by decades of reinventions and disparate projects. It's just a bunch of baggage, and it's definitely not helped by some controversial casting in recent time. 

Who the fuck makes a Batman movie <4 years after the Nolan Trilogy?


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## KnightBrolaire (Mar 23, 2021)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The DC movies were hampered by decades of reinventions and disparate projects. It's just a bunch of baggage, and it's definitely not helped by some controversial casting in recent time.
> 
> Who the fuck makes a Batman movie <4 years after the Nolan Trilogy?


I mean they COULD have done multiple batman films simultaneously, with each in a different universe, like Sony is setting up Spiderman for. The source material totally allows for it (morrison's batman in time run is awesome). I remember initially being super excited about how they were emulating Miller's older grittier batman for BvS, but then they completely wasted that take.


The problem has always been the execution and they rushed the build up to Justice League. Why the fuck did they think it was a good idea to make Batman's film centered around him fighting Superman instead of giving us more time to establish his version of the character/his enemies (like Leto's joker, which would have better set up suicide squad/Birds of prey, etc). Miller's batman becomes increasingly more callous/brutal because he's dealing with more extreme enemies and realizes his old methods don't work. BvS was just like "nah he likes branding dudes and blowing them up with high explosives" without really giving that context.

Also when the fuck can we get a batman film that doesn't beat us over the head with how his parents got murdered and he has bat PTSD? So sick of that shit.


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## Louis Cypher (Mar 23, 2021)

The Nolan trilogy is the best and worst thing to happen to the DC cinematic universe I think. I mean that in the sense that all three, in particular Dark Knight, set such a high bench mark (in scope, style, inventivness and obviously, financially) it now clouds all judgement on the DC films in particular those involving Batman. The irony I guess is that the more successful DC films in the last few years have for the most part distanced themselves from the Nolan tone and vision of a DC superhero film. Shazam!, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, even Birds of Prey. None are a patch really on anything in the MCU imo but they are really enjoyable (especially Aquaman, its just insane!) partly because they are very un-Nolan/Snyder like.


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## Bloody_Inferno (Mar 23, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> honestly directors for marvel don't have as much power as you think. What you see in a marvel movie isn't any one person's vision. It's a whole committee of people. Actually, that can be said for a lot movies these days. I can't remember the last time I worked on a big budget feature where the director had final say. ...but I spend most of my time in marvel land too.



Oh yeah. The Marvel machine is so carefully calculated by a selected team. I do remember hearing that the director dujour would tag team with a whole action crew that he or she may not have creative control over. One of the various reasons why Patty Jenkins, Joss Whedon and Edgar Wright jumped ship. The whole Asgard dream sequence was a big studio interference that made Joss Whedon pull the plug and a lot of the starts seriously ending contracts after Age Of Ultron.

Of course once the Marvel machine hit it's full stride (when The Russo Bros and James Gunn stepped in), that was when every studio suddenly wanted to be just like Marvel. Every other studio wanted that Disney money and copied the Marvel formula... which also lead to so many movies looking all the damn same, in turn also a detriment to Marvel movies too. When BvS flopped, WB was going so far as restructuring and reshuffling their plans. Hence why Suicide Squad was hacked to the bone, and WB hiring Whedon when Snyder stepped down specifically to create that Marvel flavour.

The first Avengers film on it's own isn't all that great but it worked so well because it was earned after 5 standalone movies. You can't just straight ham fist that formula. But that's exactly what they did with Snyder's footage and we got the theatrical cut of Justice League, a movie that offensively insults it's audience. 




MaxOfMetal said:


> The DC movies were hampered by decades of reinventions and disparate projects. It's just a bunch of baggage, and it's definitely not helped by some controversial casting in recent time.
> 
> Who the fuck makes a Batman movie <4 years after the Nolan Trilogy?



The thing is that WB have been planning a Justice League crossover since the 80s, and from what I heard, right back to the Richard Donner Superman and Tim Burton's Batman (the proposed Death And Return of Superman starring Nicholas Cage). The 3 people who saw that awful Green Lantern movie knew they were planting a crossover then too.

At least now they're doing their own thing. Bird Of Prey and upcoming Suicide Squad 2 is in a 'sort of but not really' section of DCEU. And Joker, despite the fact I found that grossly overrated and shallow (that's another story), is something I'm glad exists since it frees DC to continue doing standalone movies without getting bogged down from the obligation of 'continuity'.


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## Bodes (Mar 23, 2021)

What I find is that some of the characters in the films are there in name only. WB/writers/directors have not cared about the characters' background in any of the comics. (Yes, I know that different series of comic books do 'alter' some of the backgrounds of characters.)

Prime example: Cassandra Cain in Birds of Prey.

She is portrayed as a semi-helpless street kid who steals anything she can get her hands on and falls into trouble by accidently stealing from the wrong people.

Compare that to her comic book background, where she is a highly trained fighter, who was trained by her highly trained assassin father, David Cain. Everything she does is methodical. FFS, she doesn't even verbally communicate until that weird thing happens with the mind-altering superhuman in the 2000-2006 series of Batgirl.

I could go on, but won't.


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## thebeesknees22 (Mar 23, 2021)

I think that goes back to the main problem with the DCU movies. DC doesn't have seemingly much input as far as I can tell vs marvel which has a tight grip on how their characters are developed on the big screen


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## possumkiller (Mar 27, 2021)

I have no idea who Snyder is. The only reason I ever heard of him was because Snyder Cut kept popping up in news stories on google. I don't even know what the Snyder Cut is. Of all the movies you guys have been saying he made, I've only seen the first half of 300 and passed out drunk without finishing it.


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## wankerness (Mar 27, 2021)

I don’t get it, are you taking the time to go to a Zach Snyder thread just to brag about not knowing who Zach Snyder is?


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## possumkiller (Mar 27, 2021)

Yes.


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## spudmunkey (Mar 27, 2021)

What's amusing is that he directed Rod Stewart's music video for "Leave Virginia Alone" in 1994, and already back then, he was showing many of the things his films are known for today, like white flashes, cranked-up color saturation/contrast,, and sudden changes of film speed within the same shot.


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## H I G H W I N D (Mar 29, 2021)

oniduder said:


> Insert an image macro
> 
> nuff said
> 
> ...



His DC cinematic films are shitty, and these guys are ridiculous for ganging up to think you're desperately trolling.


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## Xaios (Mar 29, 2021)

Snyder is an excellent visual director, kind of in the same way as George Lucas. He has an excellent sense for the kinetic aspect of movie making and general visual grandeur.

Just don't let him near the script or the screenplay. Let's not forget that in BvS, he gave us two scenes _in a row..._


Spoiler



the dream sequence and then Flash traveling into the past to talk to Bruce


...that had no purpose except for setting up future DCEU movies. Also, I don't necessarily buy that "The Schneider Cut" would have been so distinct from the original film without the benefit of the torrent of criticism leveled at that movie. I figure the same thing applies to the Song of Ice and Fire books, in that the difficult truth that people don't want to face is that the story Martin had planned really does essentially match the show, and he's probably retooling a bunch of things based on criticism of how that show ended.


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## wankerness (Mar 30, 2021)

George Lucas is absolutely not a great visual director. One look at any dialogue scene in the prequels should tell you that! The good shots in the prequels tend to be limited to some of the fully cgi stuff, which is more credit to the effects teams than him.

snyder actually probably is a great visual director, even though I definitely am not personally a fan of his ugly gray aesthetics. The guy has a vision, though.


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## sakeido (Mar 31, 2021)

Call me crazy cuz I probably am, but I really liked the Snyder Cut of Justice League. It felt the most comic booky of any comic book movie I've seen... not just the visual aspects, which he absolutely nailed, but the way the whole plot played out. Each chapter was part of the overarching narrative, and none of them had anything resembling a full story in it.. just like real comics, you had to buy a bunch of them to get a full plot arc going. Since there were so many characters who were totally unrelated at first you had that "oh yeah you gotta get Aquaman #177, Batman #124-128, Flash #1, Cyborg #1-3, then the one-shot foil cover Justice League to cap it all off" thing going on. There were throwaway scenes in there that were clearly only there to sell some new limited run they had coming out, all that kinda thing.

I dunno. It felt ambitious and authentic in a way Marvel never does. I didn't get that sense of test screenings refining the movie to a perfectly inoffensive 8 out of 10 like the MCU stuff. The acting wasn't as good, the effects weren't as good, the soundtrack was pretty silly, the ending was unfulfilling and the epilogue was a total waste of time, but I still liked the movie more than the majority of the MCU anyways. There were a lot of individually awesome scenes, there were some shots in there that had me going "holy _shit _that's gorgeous," the Flash and Cyborg stuff was great.. and I felt the whole thing came together in a really satisfying way.

but do I want another movie like that? hell no. Snyder is married to this Knightmare crap - that's all going to happen, Lois Lane is gonna die, Superman loses hope in life so he can be enslaved by anti-life, he kills Batman blah blah blah. Don't wanna see even one second of that. I don't know if the Snyder Cut was successful enough for him to stay in control of the DCEU stuff going forward but I hope not. One-offs without any overarching DCEU would be way more interesting. Obviously they can't all be Joker but I'd rather they roll the dice trying to replicate that success than continue trying (and utterly failing) to go against the MCU


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## gnoll (Apr 1, 2021)

I've only seen a few of his films and didn't like them so now I kinda don't wanna see more.


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