# Meshuggah's bass tone



## pepsodjent (Jan 10, 2011)

hey guys i have tried to get as close as i could to this sound but still a lot is missing...your views are welcome...

here is the link to my recording: Hotfile.com: One click file hosting: bass.mp3


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## josh pelican (Jan 10, 2011)

Upload your file to something like Soundclick or Soundcloud. It's much easier and seems to be preferred around here.


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## ixlramp (Jan 12, 2011)

I wonder if Dick is using Circle Ks yet?


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## Variant (Jan 13, 2011)

^
I don't believe so... as far as I know, they're sticking with unison tuning on the low F string stuff. Dunno why, M.A.N, and particularly Mnemic, do fine with the bass an octave down.


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## drmosh (Jan 13, 2011)

Variant said:


> Dunno why, M.A.N, and particularly Mnemic, do fine with the bass an octave down.



Because that's their sound?


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## Rook (Jan 13, 2011)

Best way to get that sound is with a humbucker in the bridge (he uses the twin Jazz obviously); have a bright bass, Ash or Ovangkol; and use Line 6 Products. The one time I got the chance to play with this, I plugged a Line 6 Pod XT Live (guitar version) into the Power Amp in on My SVT-3Pro then into a Mesa 410. Bass was a corvette $$ 4 in F using bridge MEC humbucker with a bit of treble boost, and a bit of bass cut on the bass. I had the EQ on the XT flat, the gain pretty high using a Rectifier model I think.

Nailed it.

Seems a bit much haha. I had nowhere near the same luck with the bass pod. The best distorted bass sound I've had was 2 SVT-3 Pros, one with a TS808 in front of it each going into 4 ohm 410s. Tube gain all the way up, front end gain about 3 quarters so it was grinding but not constantly peaking. The tubes were JJ's, and the bass was a Japanese Geddy Lee on the neck pickup. Sounded so sweet. Not Meshuggah-ish tone though, lol.


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## vampiregenocide (Jan 14, 2011)

They tune in what is essentially drop Bb on a bass so they can use the low Bb for the old 7 string material. Besides, their tone is the best 8 string tone I've heard so if unison tuning works for them, why not.


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## Variant (Jan 31, 2011)

drmosh said:


> Because that's their sound?



 Not really, it's the sound they have at the moment, maybe. Meshuggah's style and sound have changed dramatically over the years. I know Skip (Knuckle Guitar Works) lent Dick a Quake bass to mess with last time they came through Seattle, so they're obviously down to try new things (e.g. Fredrik's switching to DAR amps at the moment, which are way different and cool).

That said, I'm a big Meshuggah fan, have been for years, and whatever they end up doing will work in the context of their music, I'm sure... I've just always found the unison bass parts lacking in guts, whereas Mnemic's last album rattles your nuts off.


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## angus (Jan 31, 2011)

Nothing fancy about that tone- just a bunch of distortion. If you've heard it live, there are really zero guts or bottom to it...it sounds like an 8 string guitar. It's pretty sad. 

Adding a bunch of distortion to bass really destroys the low end unless you are careful with it and/or make a wet/dry mix. It doesn't sound to me like he's doing the latter, as there is very, very little bass in it. IMO it would sound better if he ran clean, even if he was going to tune unison.


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## Steve08 (Jan 31, 2011)

The key is basically just scoop mostly everything below ~200Hz and then use very guitar-like distortion, in fact I'm pretty sure Dick uses guitar amplifiers (Vetta II specifically I think) with bass cabinets.

As angus said, while it sounds decent on recording, it lacks any sort of balls in a live situation, unless you're playing so loud that it'll make people feel it no matter what the tone is.


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## ixlramp (Feb 1, 2011)

I love this tone, so smooth and light, so refreshingly lacking in balls  It's a refreshing new approach to 'bass', bringing the tone up to be beside the guitar tone, a longer scale version of the guitars.


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## angus (Feb 2, 2011)

I think that's a guitarist's perspective of how a bassist feels.

I'm a bassist and I don't feel limited whatsoever by "being a bassist". Putting me in the frequency domain of the guitars, though, doesn't give me freedom to do what I want at all- it means I'm going to get lost in the mix really quickly and have zero identity. Making sure that there is some separation between my instrument and the guitarists is what actually gives me freedom to do what I want AND be heard.


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## TemjinStrife (Feb 2, 2011)

angus said:


> I think that's a guitarist's perspective of how a bassist feels.
> 
> I'm a bassist and I don't feel limited whatsoever by "being a bassist". Putting me in the frequency domain of the guitars, though, doesn't give me freedom to do what I want at all- it means I'm going to get lost in the mix really quickly and have zero identity. Making sure that there is some separation between my instrument and the guitarists is what actually gives me freedom to do what I want AND be heard.





The only time I feel "limited" by being a bassist is when the guitarists decide to stomp all over my "space" in the mix.


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## ixlramp (Feb 2, 2011)

Apologies for poorly expressed rant


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## getaway_fromme (Feb 3, 2011)

I did watch in an interview once that Dick's tone and tuning fills in mostly mids since the low guitar tuning gets scooped w/o even eq'ing it that way. Just the nature of the 8-string beast beast I guess.


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## AlexWadeWC (Feb 3, 2011)

when we toured with them in australia in 2009 Dick was using a POD XT Pro and using the "Insane" model. Didn't catch what cabinet in the POD he was using.


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## Durero (Feb 3, 2011)

ixlramp said:


> I wonder if Dick is using Circle Ks yet?



Skip has posted that he _gave_ Dick a Quake bass. I sure wish they'd start using it! I'd love to hear their stuff with the bass an octave down. 

If they're really attached to the distorted mids from the bass then perhaps a double-course 8-string bass would suite them.


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## HaMMerHeD (Feb 3, 2011)

Durero said:


> Skip has posted that he _gave_ Dick a Quake bass. I sure wish they'd start using it! I'd love to hear their stuff with the bass an octave down.
> 
> If they're really attached to the distorted mids from the bass then perhaps a double-course 8-string bass would suite them.



A double-course 8-string with separate piezo pickups for the octave strings, which run through a distortion while leaving the rest of the bass clean-ish.

As for me, my next guitar build project will be a 4 string 36" scale bass strung F# B E A. I'm considering an offset V for the body style. Gotta keep up with that baritone somehow. Honestly though, my bass stack moves so much more air than my guitarist's rig, even in unison tuning, I can add a significant bottom end to his baritone.


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## jaco815 (Feb 3, 2011)

HaMMerHeD said:


> Honestly though, my bass stack moves so much more air than my guitarist's rig, even in unison tuning, I can add a significant bottom end to his baritone.



On a current mix we are working on, we have the 8-string guitars tuned to F#, then took the 5-string bass, drop tuned it to AEADG, then capo'd the EADG strings at the 2nd fret. The end result is AF#BEA and it works out great for the song which has a lot of A min chords. So it's unison, but not all the time, we can go a bit lower if necessary. The unison bass notes definitely add alot of bass to the mix. We just keep the bass eq'd flat than boosted the presence a bit I believe with hardly any distortion.

We used this process of capo'ing cuz those strings did not want to tune any higher. They felt uncomfortably tight and I didn't feel like getting lighter strings.


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## drmosh (Feb 4, 2011)

Variant said:


> Not really, it's the sound they have at the moment, maybe.



Well obviously that's their sound at the moment, no need to be condescending.
Asking why Band A doesn't do it like Band B because it works for Band B is a pretty silly question, which is what I was referring to.


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## Excalibur (Feb 4, 2011)

Why do Meshuggah even need a bassist ?


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## ixlramp (Feb 4, 2011)

'Cus it would sound different if they didn't.

The sound of the 2 different scale lengths complement each other beautifully even when playing in unison and both distorted. It's a more complex, richer and spatial tone.


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## Excalibur (Feb 4, 2011)

I suppose, but with my crap headphones, it just sounds like a wall of low end to me.


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## angus (Feb 4, 2011)

I actually couldn't hear any difference live. The bassist wasn't even very loud relatively.


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## Excalibur (Feb 5, 2011)

It's a shame, Dick's not a bad bassist at all, even if he is a pickstyle player, he can keep up with the rest of the band with no problems.


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## TemjinStrife (Feb 5, 2011)

Being a pickstyle player has nothing to do with how good or bad you are. Certain songs/styles demand certain sounds from certain techniques; just because he doesn't triple-thumb slap or play with four fingers on his right hand doesn't mean he's not doing the right thing for the music he's playing.


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## Varcolac (Feb 5, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> Being a pickstyle player has nothing to do with how good or bad you are. Certain songs/styles demand certain sounds from certain techniques; just because he doesn't triple-thumb slap or play with four fingers on his right hand doesn't mean he's not doing the right thing for the music he's playing.



This times a million. I mostly play with a thumbpick on because certain sections demand the forceful attack of the pick but others are more suited to the sound of fingers on steel. Hell, some chordal bits I flamenco smack the strings with my fingernails like Stanley Clarke. They're all techniques, and they're all valid in different contexts to get the most appropriate sound out of the instrument.


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## Excalibur (Feb 6, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> Being a pickstyle player has nothing to do with how good or bad you are. Certain songs/styles demand certain sounds from certain techniques; just because he doesn't triple-thumb slap or play with four fingers on his right hand doesn't mean he's not doing the right thing for the music he's playing.



What has this even got to do with anything


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## TemjinStrife (Feb 6, 2011)

Excalibur said:


> What has this even got to do with anything



You were saying that it was "too bad" that Lovgren (or whateverthehell his name is, I'm not a Meshuggah fan) was a pick player. I was making sure it didn't get into a "pick vs. fingers = better bassist" argument like it always seems to.


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## Bigfan (Feb 6, 2011)

He does prefer fingerstyle but apparently isn't allowed to in the band, as the other members prefer the sound of picks against strings.


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## Excalibur (Feb 6, 2011)

TemjinStrife said:


> You were saying that it was "too bad" that Lovgren (or whateverthehell his name is, I'm not a Meshuggah fan) was a pick player. I was making sure it didn't get into a "pick vs. fingers = better bassist" argument like it always seems to.



I said "even if he is a pickstyle player, he can keep up with the rest of the band with no problems."

Expressing admiration that he can keep up with a pick as I'm hopeless with one.

Sorry that you seem to have taken it the wrong way


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## nephilymbass (Feb 6, 2011)

Yeah I'm pretty sure he goes straight into a line 6 XT pro and line out to the board for his live rig, I'm sure he also blends in a dry direct signal. As a bassist I like Meshuggah because I look them as having 3 bass players. But that's just me. At one point around the Nothing recording they talked about dropping guitars altogether and just using basses and personally the re-recorded Nothing album actually reminds me of RATM Evil Empire when it comes to tone for some reason. I have seen interviews where they've said Dick is there to fill in the mids but their older higher tuned songs definitely need bass as well. A lot of metal bands don't have much bass live. Especially if they are fast or play crazy rhythmic stuff, to much low end tends to turn things to mud which I think is why Dick doesn't go down an octave or go for a tone with a lot of low end. I've yet to see an 8 string band sound great without an actual bass. Even Animals As Leaders who are an amazing band only tours with guitars but has bass on their recordings. Chebon Littlefield recorded bass on their full length and Tosin is playing bass on their new stuff. live they are without a doubt great musicians and while the bass isn't very loud on the album I could tell the difference live.


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## nephilymbass (Feb 6, 2011)

that said I'm a bass player and I'd like an 8 string guitar just to mess around playing tapping parts.


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## AVH (Feb 7, 2011)

He was using a Vetta II head, straight into the board for that Hakke seminar...he was using a surprising amp model during that time, although as stated he also has another POD Pro Insane patch...here's Dick's Vetta patch from that C33 period:


Eq/adj pots are listed as "O'clock" unless otherwise stated, same for both amps unless stated.

Dick Distortion

Amp1: '73 Hiway Custom 
Amp2: none
Cab: 4x12 Hiway
Mic: 57 - Off Axis
Drive: 8
Bass: 2.5
Mid: 10
Treble: 2
Pres: 12
Ch.Vol: 2
Effects: 
Gate - Thresh: -40db, Release: 11ms 
Stomp - MT Zone - Drive: 58%, Gain: 16%, Bass: 92%, Mid Gain: 75%, Mid Freq: 33%, Treble: 60% 
Post FX:
Comp - Thresh: -13db, Gain: 1db, Ratio: 20:1, Attack: 33ms, Release 10ms
EQ - 4 Band - L Gain: 0db, H Gain: 0db, Freq B1: 82Hz, Q: 1.1, Gain: 0db, Freq B2: 1306Hz, Q:1.0, Gain: 2db


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## Customisbetter (Feb 7, 2011)

I have always been of the opinion that the guitarist provide the notes, and Dick provides the tone.


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## TemjinStrife (Feb 7, 2011)

You know, I'm not surprised he was using the Hiwatt model. That's one of the models that Line 6 got right.


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## leandroab (Feb 7, 2011)

Dendroaspis said:


> He was using a Vetta II head, straight into the board for that Hakke seminar...he was using a surprising amp model during that time, although as stated he also has another POD Pro Insane patch...here's Dick's Vetta patch from that C33 period:
> 
> 
> Eq/adj pots are listed as "O'clock" unless otherwise stated, same for both amps unless stated.
> ...




Is that the Hiway 100 ? Bass guitar amp or Guitar amp? Or both are the same..?

Also, I don't get the EQ settings. It seems that only one frequency is changed. Also, is there a way to get that cab model (bass) with a guitar mic (SM57) using podfarm?


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