# Jackson NAMM 2020



## Lada The Great (Dec 18, 2019)

Since this thread has been made for every other guitar manufacturer out there, lets make one for Jackson 

Michael Keene, seems to be getting a sig, kinda suprising considering recent shenanigans with The Faceless


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## Skullet (Dec 18, 2019)

Looks like a fat caparison headstock

Surprised for sure.

EDIT: is that not a Vola?


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## Albake21 (Dec 18, 2019)

Are you sure that's Jackson? I'd be pretty surprised that's a Jackson judging by the headstock, but hell I hope I'm wrong because it looks badass.


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## Lada The Great (Dec 18, 2019)

Oopsie, it is actually made by Vola.  Thought that he was still with Jackson but he jumped to Vola during summer.


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## Bastian93 (Dec 18, 2019)

Albake21 said:


> Are you sure that's Jackson? I'd be pretty surprised that's a Jackson judging by the headstock, but hell I hope I'm wrong because it looks badass.



I agree this does not look like a Jackson. Could it be a Vola Guitar Ares? They seem to be bolt on though. 
He has posted a pic of one on insta a while ago and it seems to me he is no longer associated with Jackson Guitars. I could be wrong here as I dont follow him that closely.

Edit: got ninjaed


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## Spicypickles (Dec 18, 2019)

Lol, this thread is off to a good start.


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## Lada The Great (Dec 18, 2019)

Indeed!


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## musicaldeath (Dec 18, 2019)

Spicypickles said:


> Lol, this thread is off to a good start.



It's doing as well as any Faceless tour in the last 10 years.


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## sleewell (Dec 18, 2019)

well shit


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## MrHelloGuitar (Dec 18, 2019)

musicaldeath said:


> It's doing as well as any Faceless tour in the last 10 years.



Oooof


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 18, 2019)

I've heard from two dealers that 7-strings are remaining Masterbuilt and that there is no indication they'll be opening back up to Masterbuilt orders for at least the first half of 2020. 

That's all I really need to know really. 

Additionally, no USA Dinky or Soloist in 7-string, at least as far as anyone (two dealers) knows.


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## Spicypickles (Dec 18, 2019)

Well that seems to follow trends at least. No one is really offering high end 7’s, apart from ESP USA and Ernie ball, etc. . It’s a shame.


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## mastapimp (Dec 18, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Additionally, no USA Dinky or Soloist in 7-string, at least as far as anyone (two dealers) knows.



Jackson categorizes their Chris Broderick offerings as "soloists" even though the body shape and contours are different. I think they're covering the USA production 7s with that model as well as the juggernaut for a bolt-on alternative (in place of dinky).


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## Samark (Dec 18, 2019)

They’re not Jacksons? Keene has been playing Vola for quite some time now


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## manu80 (Dec 18, 2019)

Don't get the vola hype.....Mayones rip off all the way....
Anyways....hard to know anything about jackson before Namm, they don't let stuff slip easily...
waiting for the rob Caggiano sig , the skatecaster/JJ mix looks great (import already ?) and the Loomis import sig maybe.
Why not put this topic in 6 string ? jackson isn't a "true" 7 string brand for me (like ibanez or schecter etc...)


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## MASS DEFECT (Dec 19, 2019)

Jackson NAMM is just Customs with graphics, $9K Masterbuilts, the usual lineup of imports and Signature USAs. Nothing new. Fender has neutered Jackson this past three years and hardly anything exciting or new has come out. Where are the Warrior Pros at least??? Give me the bevels back on my Kelly and Warriors!


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## Siggevaio (Dec 19, 2019)

I guess it's very likely that an affordable Jeff Loomis signature will be revealed at namm?


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 19, 2019)

MASS DEFECT said:


> Jackson NAMM is just Customs with graphics, $9K Masterbuilts, the usual lineup of imports and Signature USAs. Nothing new. Fender has neutered Jackson this past three years and hardly anything exciting or new has come out. Where are the Warrior Pros at least??? Give me the bevels back on my Kelly and Warriors!



I think it's the opposite problem. 

They've let their master builders run the show and we've been subjected to their whims. All those relic'd "Gibsons" last year were what Mike Shannon wanted.

Remember those goofy Pablo builds? 

They [FMIC] needs to rein things in. Give us stuff we might see in production some day.


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## Musiscience (Dec 19, 2019)

I liked Planetary Duality just as much as the next guy, but it’s hard to believe anyone would want to associate with Keene at this point.


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## sakeido (Dec 19, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think it's the opposite problem.
> 
> They've let their master builders run the show and we've been subjected to their whims. All those relic'd "Gibsons" last year were what Mike Shannon wanted.
> 
> ...



Yeah this. Some of those Pablo builds were just horrendous.

Show us new production line guitars and build them in the Mexico shop that does the new Charvel DK24s. The Jacksons selling at basically that same price point are made in Indonesia and suck... which is really too bad because they look fantastic and spec out really well on paper. They are just horribly inconsistent and even the best one I played wasn't good enough for the money.


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## cardinal (Dec 19, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I think it's the opposite problem.
> 
> They've let their master builders run the show and we've been subjected to their whims. All those relic'd "Gibsons" last year were what Mike Shannon wanted.
> 
> ...



It's really strange. Last year I was begging dealers to get me a masterbuild slot, and there were just none. I guess the masterbuilders were too busy building the abominations that they showed at NAMM? Some of which dealers are still trying to unload (example: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=292971304028), rather that take an order for something guaranteed to sell because I was trying to order it??? Makes no sense at all.


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## mlp187 (Dec 19, 2019)

cardinal said:


> It's really strange. Last year I was begging dealers to get me a masterbuild slot, and there were just none. I guess the masterbuilders were too busy building the abominations that they showed at NAMM? Some of which dealers are still trying to unload (example: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=292971304028), rather that take an order for something guaranteed to sell because I was trying to order it??? Makes no sense at all.


That does seem pretty nonsensical. 

That being said...
I absolutely love that abomination, but I'm going EBMM if i'm spending that kind of money.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 19, 2019)

cardinal said:


> It's really strange. Last year I was begging dealers to get me a masterbuild slot, and there were just none. I guess the masterbuilders were too busy building the abominations that they showed at NAMM? Some of which dealers are still trying to unload (example: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338014327&icep_item=292971304028), rather that take an order for something guaranteed to sell because I was trying to order it??? Makes no sense at all.



Pretty much the only way to get a Masterbuilt spot for the foreseeable future is to either be an artist or be lucky enough to become a pet project of one of the builders, like that RR1 spec'd Warrior run. 

From late summer to the new year all they're focusing on are NAMM builds. 

But there's no incentive to change. They're at absolute peak capacity thanks to the Select models. Those a such a blessing for most Jackson players, but it's pretty much locked guys like you and me out of the shop.


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## Aso (Dec 20, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> pet project of one of the builders, like that RR1 spec'd Warrior run.


Where can I find more info on this run? Isn't a WR1 same spec's as a RR1?

I am interested in what Jackson shows this year but I need to be done buying guitars for awhile so hopefully nothing too tempting. I have acquired multiple Masterbuilts this past couple years and a few Sullys. I really think I may have too many around the house. I do have a Masterbuilt Double Rhoads on order so don't really need more after that.


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## xzacx (Dec 20, 2019)

Aso said:


> Where can I find more info on this run? Isn't a WR1 same spec's as a RR1?
> 
> I am interested in what Jackson shows this year but I need to be done buying guitars for awhile so hopefully nothing too tempting. I have acquired multiple Masterbuilts this past couple years and a few Sullys. I really think I may have too many around the house. I do have a Masterbuilt Double Rhoads on order so don't really need more after that.



I think he's referring to that set of "Rhoad Warriors."


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 20, 2019)

xzacx said:


> I think he's referring to that set of "Rhoad Warriors."


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## StevenC (Dec 20, 2019)

I guess Scott Ian has a new Charvel signature coming out according to Facebook.







https://www.facebook.com/scottian/photos/a.77483449134/10156752575064135/?type=3&theater


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## xzacx (Dec 21, 2019)

StevenC said:


> I guess Scott Ian has a new Charvel signature coming out according to Facebook.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very weird, it looks like the exact guitar they introduced a while back as a limited Super Stock SC1, which had no Scott Ian association at the time.


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## manu80 (Dec 21, 2019)

that's a SC1. Funny coz at that time of the year each picture of a player having a different guitar in his hand just for fun means it's his new sig !!!!!.
I saw the SC1 in a shop, really nice axe, distressed looks is well done, i almost went for it but took the skull and bones instead. Pao ferro is sweet when playing but i don't like the look of it, prefered the ebony of the S&b.
they should reintroduce the JJ though.


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## mastapimp (Dec 21, 2019)

StevenC said:


> I guess Scott Ian has a new Charvel signature coming out according to Facebook.



He's joking about being the Charvel guitar's signature model human. Between this and the introductory post with the Volas, might as well lock it up and start fresh with a real Jackson thread.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 21, 2019)

mastapimp said:


> He's joking about being the Charvel guitar's signature model human. Between this and the introductory post with the Volas, might as well lock it up and start fresh with a real Jackson thread.



This is the NAMM thread Jackson deserves.


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## Musiscience (Dec 21, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> This is the NAMM thread Jackson deserves.



Not the thread Jackson needs, but the thread Jackson deserves.


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## exo (Dec 21, 2019)

Musiscience said:


> Not the thread Jackson needs, but the thread Jackson deserves.



Beat me to it.....


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## Hollowway (Dec 22, 2019)

Max beat you both to it


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## Church2224 (Dec 22, 2019)

I would like to see what Jackson and Charvel will offer in the USA Offerings...

I got a USA Dinky in 2017 and a new USA Charvel San Dimas Style 2 this year and both guitars were immaculate. Also played a few USA Misha sigs and they were on point. I had CMC Guitars spec out two USA "Custom Select" So Cals and the prices were pretty good. Say what you will but the quality of the USA Stuff recently has gone up and the pricing on the Custom selects is at least decent. like everyone else I would love to see 7 string offerings but I have other outlets for that....

https://www.schecterguitars.com/custom-shop/usa-product-collection/sunset-24-7fr-detail

https://www.espguitars.com/espusa


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## oppgulp (Dec 22, 2019)

We want Death Angels!


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 22, 2019)

StevenC said:


> I guess Scott Ian has a new Charvel signature coming out according to Facebook.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



When did Charvel start making humans?


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## Emperoff (Dec 22, 2019)

Ok, there is a "why" for not having USA production sevens, explained by a Jackson dealer. Basically they don't have CNC programs for them. All USA 7 string Jacksons are handbuilt. That's also why they're in the "masterbuilt" category. It's just not cost-effective for them.

In defense of Pablo Santana, he also built normal stuff which is fantastic. I happen to own one of his builds (which is plain black). For example:






This one had a full ebony neck with maple inlays. Pretty cool.






And mine: (NGD thread pending).






I heard he got kicked out of Jackson because his "goofy builds" always took various attempts which resulted in plenty of scrapped guitars.



mastapimp said:


> Jackson categorizes their Chris Broderick offerings as "soloists" even though the body shape and contours are different. I think they're covering the USA production 7s with that model as well as the juggernaut for a bolt-on alternative (in place of dinky).



The broderick has enough "issues" to not be considered a soloist:

- 12" radius instead of compound 12-16"
- Floyd Rose Pro, which has a different (narrower) string spacing.
- Odd shape
- Weights a fucking ton


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 22, 2019)

Emperoff said:


> Ok, there is a "why" for not having USA production sevens, explained by a Jackson dealer. Basically they don't have CNC programs for them. All USA 7 string Jacksons are handbuilt. That's also why they're in the "masterbuilt" category. It's just not cost-effective for them.



That reason is pretty much bullshit, and I've heard it before too. 

They have production USA 7-strings, so they have at least some CNC plots available and in use. 

It's not even that expensive or time consuming to program. Where I work custom makes complex machine parts with CNC. It only takes a single employee a day or two to whip something up. Heck, smaller operations come out with new designs fairly frequently. 

The thing is, FMIC has always been pretty averse to 7 and 8 strings. You can't even order a handbuilt one from Fender or Charvel. They refuse to do it.


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## Emperoff (Dec 22, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> That reason is pretty much bullshit, and I've heard it before too.
> 
> They have production USA 7-strings, so they have at least some CNC plots available and in use.
> 
> ...



Yeah, it's their reasoning. Their "production" sevens are handmade. All USA Jacksons come from the same place, but obviously six strings are all CNC'd (maybe besides the Friedman, Juggernaut and Dominion models). Here's a bit more of info after re-checking my sources:

"Only Corey Beaulieau V's are CNC'd. Every other one is hand built. Still, the Corey B's cutouts are hand made since they don't have a machine for that. Any Corey B has taken at least a year to get out of them. It is brutal".

Bullshit or not, end result is: We still don't get a godammn soloist . If you want something other than a sig model your only choice is to hunt for used B7s. You're basically getting a CS for the 1,5k they go used.

I'm pretty sure I've seen a blue 7-string Charvel somewhere, though.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 22, 2019)

Emperoff said:


> Yeah, it's their reasoning. Their "production" sevens are handmade. All USA Jacksons come from the same place, but obviously six strings are all CNC'd (maybe besides the Friedman, Juggernaut and Dominion models). Here's a bit more of info after re-checking my sources:
> 
> "Only Corey Beaulieau V's are CNC'd. Every other one is hand built. Still, the Corey B's cutouts are hand made since they don't have a machine for that. Any Corey B has taken at least a year to get out of them. It is brutal".
> 
> ...



If they're hand-building them all already, why not do it per-order? What's the difference?


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## Vyn (Dec 22, 2019)

The reasoning I heard through my dealer as to why Masterbuilt was closed off was that they are swapped with endorsement orders/builds.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 22, 2019)

Vyn said:


> The reasoning I heard through my dealer as to why Masterbuilt was closed off was that they are swapped with endorsement orders/builds.



Yeah, everything I've heard is that they're absolutely at, and somewhat above, capacity right now, and have been for at least the last 18 to 24 months. 

They just never planned on the Select stuff being a runaway hit like it has been. They've tried throwing more manpower at it, but they just don't have the shop space.

It's a great problem to have. 

From what I was told, all they're adding is a price increase (~10% to MSRP, not a big deal) first quarter 2020, and some small options to existing Select models, mostly hardware/pickups.


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## Emperoff (Dec 22, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> If they're hand-building them all already, why not do it per-order? What's the difference?



That would be a massive shitstorm, I guess. Remember the ss.org SL-7 limited run?

To summarize pretty quickly: They're getting more orders than ever now, because custom shop guitars are more popular than ever. They had some big problems that led to their current situation.

1 - Their CS orders weren't in a database up until very recently. They were handwritten orders piled up with no particular order. No shit.

2 - They have what they call "unicorn builds", which are when customers ask all kinds of crazy stuff or requests that made any templates unusable. These builds dramatically slow the rest since, well, they're made by people. Even if the customer pays 8k for it, the manpower remains the same. This issue led to the creation of the "*Custom Select*" department, to filter the "unicorns" from more common customs.

3 - Artist guitars. This is probably the worst problem as they pull Mike Shannon out of the loop for months to work with the artist. This means building prototypes, etc.

The Custom Select thing has been a huge success I suppose, so my guess is that the Master Builders focus on NAMM and Masterbuilt guitars while the rest of the guys work on the other ones.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 22, 2019)

Emperoff said:


> That would be a massive shitstorm, I guess. Remember the ss.org SL-7 limited run?
> 
> To summarize pretty quickly: They're getting more orders than ever now, because custom shop guitars are more popular than ever. They had some big problems that led to their current situation.
> 
> ...



What I'm saying is, the CNC excuse isn't valid if they're doing them by hand on production run stuff. 

They're getting more orders now because they streamlined the process and created a simplified options menu at a set price, the Select line. Prior to that they treated everything like a Masterbuilt, even small changes like fretboard wood, finish, hardware, all stuff that now falls under the Select banner. It was basically the Wild West. 

Which loops back around to what I said earlier: Masterbuilt stuff is pretty much unobtainium as their time is pretty much 50/50 artist work and NAMM stuff that encompasses whatever the particular builder feels like making at the time. 

That all basically means that we're not going to see much in the way of new USA models until the regular shop clears up their backlog. 

This NAMM is going to be similar to the last few years: a bunch of new import stuff and weird Masterbuilt one-offs with minimal, if any, new USA production stuff outside of perhaps some color refreshes for existing models. 

Just nipping in the bud any hopes of a USA 7 or 8 coming out.


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## Emperoff (Dec 22, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> What I'm saying is, the CNC excuse isn't valid if they're doing them by hand on production run stuff.
> 
> They're getting more orders now because they streamlined the process and created a simplified options menu at a set price, the Select line. Prior to that they treated everything like a Masterbuilt, even small changes like fretboard wood, finish, hardware, all stuff that now falls under the Select banner. It was basically the Wild West.
> 
> ...



Yup. That is pretty much what I said in my previous post.

I honestly don't care for their excuses. What matters is the end result, and the end result is that nothing seems likely to change from the last 5 years. If you want a USA Jackson 7 string, you have to either get a sig or snag something used like a B7, an older custom or a NAMM guitar.


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## manu80 (Dec 23, 2019)

damn i just wanna see some new guitars pics not a bashing thread....


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## Apex1rg7x (Dec 23, 2019)

manu80 said:


> damn i just wanna see some new guitars pics not a bashing thread....


Might wanna visit the ESP thread then


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## possumkiller (Dec 24, 2019)

It does seem like Jackson are a bit behind on the toilet burl abalone fishmans and evertune front.


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## Chiba666 (Dec 24, 2019)

King V with the old SLS headstock, some crackle finishes in RRs and King Vs


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## MASS DEFECT (Dec 24, 2019)

possumkiller said:


> It does seem like Jackson are a bit behind on the toilet burl abalone fishmans and evertune front.



Give it two more years. They are currently in their fanned-fret phase. 

What I like to see with Jackson is that they thrive as well as ESP/LTD. There is a market for their guitars, they have legacy, but they don't have the manpower, marketing, and models to push them out.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 24, 2019)

MASS DEFECT said:


> Give it two more years. They are currently in their fanned-fret phase.
> 
> What I like to see with Jackson is that they thrive as well as ESP/LTD. There is a market for their guitars, they have legacy, but they don't have the manpower, marketing, and models to push them out.



I couldn't disagree with a take more, unless you're being sarcastic, then I agree fully. 

Jackson is right where FMIC wants them. They're up to their elbows in high margin semi-custom orders, have the widest reaching and most current artist roster they've ever had, are well supported (Mike Fucking Taft), with near limitless resources (FMIC), legacy access to the biggest active dealer network in the world, and haven't been as financially solvent in decades. 

They're just more cautious about niche products, which is purely an FMIC thing. Folks rag on Gibson for being conservative, but Fender is practically regressive in comparison. 

They've just sort of evolved into the space they do best: one-off and small batches of their few flagship models. 

In comparison, ESP makes everything and dips into nearly every market because they don't really have as carved out of a niche anymore. Schecter, Ibanez, and the newest generation of Japanese specialty builders have eaten much of their lunch the last decade. Not that they aren't doing great, because they are, but there's certainly more pressure from the competition and really it's the brand strength and willingness to undercut in the European market that grounds them.


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## manu80 (Dec 24, 2019)

Chiba666 said:


> King V with the old SLS headstock, some crackle finishes in RRs and King Vs


 
Love you, man !


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## possumkiller (Dec 25, 2019)

Chiba666 said:


> King V with the old SLS headstock, some crackle finishes in RRs and King Vs


Is there a different SLS headstock? I remember long ago thinking the Jackson pointy 3x3 was a badass headstock. But now when I look at it the tuners look all bunched up and stupid. Like on the juggernaut guitars. It looks like they tried to move the tuners to get them closer to a straight string pull but it looks retarded.

Then there is the one that looks like someone had a brain fart and forgot which way the pointy tip was supposed to be angled and that one looks retarded as well.


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## works0fheart (Dec 25, 2019)

Sick thread, 3 pages long with 3 actual Jackson guitars actually posted, and those may not even be new.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 28, 2019)

Can we still talk about new shit? 

Because Angel confirmed that there's gonna be a matte black version of his sig Charvel being released.


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## Hollowway (Dec 29, 2019)

OK, that's pretty cool. The word is that those aren't super well made (MII) and need various fixes (shims, fret dress, etc) to get them playable. But, they're priced reasonably well, and have cool specs.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 29, 2019)

Hollowway said:


> OK, that's pretty cool. The word is that those aren't super well made (MII) and need various fixes (shims, fret dress, etc) to get them playable. But, they're priced reasonably well, and have cool specs.



I thought they were Mexican-made?


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## Hollowway (Dec 29, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I thought they were Mexican-made?



I think they’re Indo. That’s what Nick from the Axe Palace told me when we were talking Charvel a while back.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 29, 2019)

Hollowway said:


> I think they’re Indo. That’s what Nick from the Axe Palace told me when we were talking Charvel a while back.



I decided to look around and apparently they're made in Korea? Huh, coulda swore someone said they were initially made in Mexico with the other Charvel/Pro series stuff.


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## Hollowway (Dec 29, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I decided to look around and apparently they're made in Korea? Huh, coulda swore someone said they were initially made in Mexico with the other Charvel/Pro series stuff.


Yeah, apparently Angel said he thought they were made in Mexico, then then was told Indonesia, and then Korea. So it’s possible that they’ve moved the manufacturing around. You’re probably right about it starting in Mexico, and it sounds like currently they’ve moved to Korea, based on what I can see now.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

Hollowway said:


> OK, that's pretty cool. The word is that those aren't super well made (MII) and need various fixes (shims, fret dress, etc) to get them playable. But, they're priced reasonably well, and have cool specs.



Everything has been MIK so far, based on NGDs here and stock on Sweetwater and Reverb.


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## xzacx (Dec 29, 2019)

I’ve played a couple and both were made in Korea, and considerably nicer than the MIM Charvel stuff I’ve played (which I know people rave about but has always seemed underwhelming to me—maybe they’re just inconsistent). The narrow nut would have been the dealbreaker for me if I was interested in buying one, but the quality was solid.


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## dav43 (Dec 29, 2019)

Hollowway said:


> Yeah, apparently Angel said he thought they were made in Mexico, then then was told Indonesia, and then Korea. So it’s possible that they’ve moved the manufacturing around. You’re probably right about it starting in Mexico, and it sounds like currently they’ve moved to Korea, based on what I can see now.


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## jephjacques (Dec 29, 2019)

xzacx said:


> I’ve played a couple and both were made in Korea, and considerably nicer than the MIM Charvel stuff I’ve played (which I know people rave about but has always seemed underwhelming to me—maybe they’re just inconsistent). The narrow nut would have been the dealbreaker for me if I was interested in buying one, but the quality was solid.



The MIM Charvels are inconsistent, yeah. I played two identical DK24s in my local store- one had great fretwork, the other was lousy.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

The MIM are inconsistent, which is better than the Indo, which are consistently not very good.


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## Hollowway (Dec 29, 2019)

xzacx said:


> I’ve played a couple and both were made in Korea, and considerably nicer than the MIM Charvel stuff I’ve played (which I know people rave about but has always seemed underwhelming to me—maybe they’re just inconsistent). The narrow nut would have been the dealbreaker for me if I was interested in buying one, but the quality was solid.



Narrow nut? I didn’t realize that. I’m super sensitive to string spacing, so that would probably be a deal breaker for me, too.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 29, 2019)

Holy shit, it IS a narrow nut. 1.75''/44.5mm. 

That's how wide my 6-string G&L Superhawk is. 


xzacx said:


> I’ve played a couple and both were made in Korea, and considerably nicer than the MIM Charvel stuff I’ve played (which I know people rave about but has always seemed underwhelming to me—maybe they’re just inconsistent). The narrow nut would have been the dealbreaker for me if I was interested in buying one, but the quality was solid.





Hollowway said:


> Narrow nut? I didn’t realize that. I’m super sensitive to string spacing, so that would probably be a deal breaker for me, too.


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

Hollowway said:


> Narrow nut? I didn’t realize that. I’m super sensitive to string spacing, so that would probably be a deal breaker for me, too.



Yeah, they're sub-45mm.


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## Emperoff (Dec 29, 2019)

Another thing to consider is that the gap in quality (and price) between Jackson Pros and USA models is massive. Kinda PRS-ish. Problem is that PRS SEs are actually good guitars.

Make Jackson (Japan) great again, lol.

Meanwhile, I'll just sit and drool over whatever 7-string NAMM guitars they pull out this year. That Palemoon one was freakin' sick.


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## exo (Dec 29, 2019)

It is truly distressing to me that I can’t get a “new” Jackson comparable to my Japanese ‘94 soloist without spending 3 grand for a USA model.

MY Jackson is an awesome guitar....but I’ve played multiple $1kplus WMI instruments that are easily comparable, which basically means Jackson has a “gap” in what they offer.

Maybe the “booked to the gills” Custom Shop makes enough profit that they donte really need to “worry” about servicing the “upper mid range” market......


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## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

exo said:


> It is truly distressing to me that I can’t get a “new” Jackson comparable to my Japanese ‘94 soloist without spending 3 grand for a USA model.
> 
> MY Jackson is an awesome guitar....but I’ve played multiple $1kplus WMI instruments that are easily comparable, which basically means Jackson has a “gap” in what they offer.
> 
> Maybe the “booked to the gills” Custom Shop makes enough profit that they donte really need to “worry” about servicing the “upper mid range” market......



Those Japanese Pros were just amazing, and even more so considering the price. So amazing that it lead to insolvency for both Jackson's USA works and Chushin Gakki. 

I think you're right though. Jackson just doesn't want to compete in that space, and they're not alone. Schecter steers clear of that zone too, only they tend to make better cheaper guitars. Tend...


----------



## exo (Dec 29, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Those Japanese Pros were just amazing, and even more so considering the price. So amazing that it lead to insolvency for both Jackson's USA works and Chushin Gakki.
> 
> I think you're right though. Jackson just doesn't want to compete in that space, and they're not alone. Schecter steers clear of that zone too, only they tend to make better cheaper guitars. Tend...


I’d disagree entirely, Shecter makes their bread and butter in “that zone”....and BC Rich looks like they’re trying to eat some of that pie.

Jackson? They’ve got that FMIC backing and just don’t give a fuck about that segment anymore.....


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

exo said:


> I’d disagree entirely, Shecter makes their bread and butter in “that zone”....and BC Rich looks like they’re trying to eat some of that pie.
> 
> Jackson? They’ve got that FMIC backing and just don’t give a fuck about that segment anymore.....



I guess it depends on what you consider "upper mid". I don't think ~$1k is really there. The "around a grand" is where just about all the Schecter production guitars sit, the singular exception being certain KMs which hit the "just under $2k” tier. Almost all the Jackson Pro models are about $1k. I'd say that's the same market, with a sub-20% variance. 

When I think "upper mid" I think between $1500 and $1800. That's where you'll find higher volume ESP E-IIs and Ibanez Prestige. That's also where you won't really find Jackson or Schecter right now, minus one or two signature models. That's where BCR is trying to break in, but we'll see how successful that is.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Dec 29, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> When I think "upper mid" I think between $1500 and $1800. That's where you'll find higher volume ESP E-IIs and Ibanez Prestige. That's also where you won't really find Jackson or Schecter right now



Given Schecter just released another line of guitars that'll be in the $1400 - $1800 range, I think the're working on it.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Dec 29, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Given Schecter just released another line of guitars that'll be in the $1400 - $1800 range, I think the're working on it.



I don't super follow them, but it would definitely be a new development. 

Making guitars in South Korea is getting more and more expensive, so it's only natural they'll be boosting prices in line with that. Throw an extra spec or two and sell them as "upgraded". That's pretty much what we've been seeing across the board.


----------



## exo (Dec 29, 2019)

My (absolutely personally unaffordable) definition of “upper midrange” these days is $1500-$2k area, so we’re pretty muchin agreement on that. I’m just looking at where a KM3 was a year ago and where BCR is at in a “price
Vs specs” viewpoint.....and realized Jackson (probably thanks to FMIC money) just does not give a FUCK about that price bracket.

Just my personal outlook.....


----------



## bmth4111 (Dec 29, 2019)

That black angel charvel WITHOUT inlays and a natural headset headstock would be sooooo sexy.


----------



## Hollowway (Dec 30, 2019)

Wow, that is very narrow.


bmth4111 said:


> That black angel charvel WITHOUT inlays and a natural headset headstock would be sooooo sexy.


Throw a normal nut width in there, too.


----------



## Tuned (Dec 30, 2019)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> Can we still talk about new shit?
> 
> Because Angel confirmed that there's gonna be a matte black version of his sig Charvel being released.
> 
> View attachment 75938


basswood body for cost cutting, gaudy gold hardware that looks even worse when it is worn and you have to pay more for the finish alone to replace it, maple fretboard being my choice wood for bass guitar but not for guitar, non-locking tremolo, DiMarzios, bolt-on, made in Korea... sounds like a sad sad sad version of the JP7 unloaded.

I can still buy a basswood-bodied MIJ 7-string Ibanez with a headstock pointed at any direction of my choice, DiMarzios and almost any bridge system, some being very reputed, for 6-10 hundred dollars. I have yet to understand the arguments to peace myself with the 13 hundred dollars-worth MIK guitar of roughly the same specs. It sure has a color of its own, but I haven't yet heard about color making a guitar sound better. 

Judging by the current market, I shouldn't have taken a 7-string. There is a plenty of great MIJ and MIA 6-string guitars from the previous decades that I can still afford, but what the current market brings me is just not for me and for ridiculous money. Things I can haul from Japan are also more and more of obscure origin, mostly CIJ not fair MIJ. 

Sigh and off to work.


----------



## c7spheres (Dec 30, 2019)

Damn, That's a narrow nut. I was thinking maybe a typo but apparently not. I always thought an Ibby with a 50mm nut would be nice. Those extra couple mm would make a big difference for me. I know you can get them on non locking nuts, but dang you gotta have some nimble or skinny fingers for that on 7 string.


----------



## Spicypickles (Dec 30, 2019)

I’ve got an ESP custom that is 45mm, and it’s about as narrow as I can deal with. I quite enjoy it though


----------



## manu80 (Dec 30, 2019)

I like the wide nut of the 2015 gibson.


----------



## xzacx (Dec 30, 2019)

I guess I've kind of grown to accept/appreciate what Jackson has become. It started as a custom-only shop, so I think it's kinda cool that the Custom Select program is basically what's left of it—one-off Jacksons are really my primary interest. And as much as I'd like to order Masterbuilt 7s, the fact they're so elusive kinda makes finding them more fun. I think it sucks they ever went the import route, but I understand the need to make money so I guess it was inevitable. I don't even think they're bad guitars—most of the Pro Model and X Series guitars I've picked up lately have impressed me. 

All that said, the fact that there aren't options in that $1,200-$2,000 range should be seen as a blessing in disguise, because basically any used USA model (excluding some of the old signatures like KE/KV1s) is readily available in that price range, and going to be a heck of a lot better guitar than one that's been overspec'd and underbuilt to that price point.


----------



## Emperoff (Dec 31, 2019)

xzacx said:


> I guess I've kind of grown to accept/appreciate what Jackson has become. It started as a custom-only shop, so I think it's kinda cool that the Custom Select program is basically what's left of it—one-off Jacksons are really my primary interest. And as much as I'd like to order Masterbuilt 7s, the fact they're so elusive kinda makes finding them more fun. I think it sucks they ever went the import route, but I understand the need to make money so I guess it was inevitable. I don't even think they're bad guitars—most of the Pro Model and X Series guitars I've picked up lately have impressed me.
> 
> All that said, the fact that there aren't options in that $1,200-$2,000 range should be seen as a blessing in disguise, because basically any used USA model (excluding some of the old signatures like KE/KV1s) is readily available in that price range, and going to be a heck of a lot better guitar than one that's been overspec'd and underbuilt to that price point.



Couldn't agree more with everything in this post.

That being said, Jackson had an "upper midrange" import seven at one point: The SLAT3-7. There's a reason you don't see these used often. They were a hell of a guitar for what they costed (they'll probably in the ~2k if they were to be released today). It sees more live action than my customs, actually!


----------



## xzacx (Dec 31, 2019)

Emperoff said:


> That being said, Jackson had an "upper midrange" import seven at one point: The SLAT3-7. There's a reason you don't see these used often. They were a hell of a guitar for what they costed (they'll probably in the ~2k if they were to be released today). It sees more live action than my customs, actually!



I've never played one, but that's pretty much the only non-USA Jackson I've semi-seriously considered buying—I've always heard great things. Almost pulled the trigger on a green swirl a few times over the years but ended up deciding to save the money for when a Custom Shop I want more pops up. I imagine that some day I'll end up grabbing one though.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Dec 31, 2019)

xzacx said:


> I've never played one, but that's pretty much the only non-USA Jackson I've semi-seriously considered buying—I've always heard great things. Almost pulled the trigger on a green swirl a few times over the years but ended up deciding to save the money for when a Custom Shop I want more pops up. I imagine that some day I'll end up grabbing one though.



The SLAT3-7s were some of the last from Chushin Gakki. Definitely pick one up, especially if you already like MIJ Jackson.

I've had two. While I didn't jive with them, they were impressively well built.


----------



## XxAlbertoxX (Dec 31, 2019)

I was listening to Jeff Loomis was he was still in Conquering Dystopia and signed to Schecter using 7 strings in 2016ish.

Can anyone shed some light why he went to Jackson and why he's apparently using 6 strings now? (he's signature guitar)


----------



## Mathemagician (Dec 31, 2019)

He was using Schecter and had signatures for way longer than 2016. He was with them long before Keith Merrow joined. In his words he “just wanted to play other stuff”.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Dec 31, 2019)

XxAlbertoxX said:


> I was listening to Jeff Loomis was he was still in Conquering Dystopia and signed to Schecter using 7 strings in 2016ish.
> 
> Can anyone shed some light why he went to Jackson and why he's apparently using 6 strings now? (he's signature guitar)



$$$


----------



## Church2224 (Dec 31, 2019)

MaxOfMetal said:


> $$$



That and apparently from what I was told his deal with Schecter was he was "Schecter Only" and Jeff wanted to play other guitars. Jeff is a big collector and also wanted to play "Other" guitars so being endorsed by Jackson he can also use Charvel, Fender, Gretsch, ect….

At least that is what heard, take it for what its worth. He left Schecter pretty abruptly and they were secretly working a USA model with him...


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Dec 31, 2019)

Church2224 said:


> That and apparently from what I was told his deal with Schecter was he was "Schecter Only" and Jeff wanted to play other guitars. Jeff is a big collector and also wanted to play "Other" guitars so being endorsed by Jackson he can also use Charvel, Fender, Gretsch, ect….
> 
> At least that is what heard, take it for what its worth. He left Schecter pretty abruptly and they were secretly working a USA model with him...



It's weird that there always needs to be a narrative other than someone wants to be more prosperous at their profession. There's nothing wrong with wanting to make more money doing what you do.

Schecter has the capability and capacity to make any guitar under the Sun. 

What they couldn't do, or perhaps chose not to, or maybe weren't even given the opportunity, to pay more. 

Jackson, was ready to pay more. They also have the capability to make whatever he wants. 

I don't doubt there might have been some wanderlust on Jeff's part. But the endorsement game is all about business.


----------



## Church2224 (Dec 31, 2019)

Hence why I said That is what I was told, not sure it is the 100% Gospel...

My belief is Jackson approached him when Jeff was good with Schecter but Jackson gave him a better offer. So Jeff back out of Schecter and went with Jackson.


----------



## cardinal (Dec 31, 2019)

Church2224 said:


> That and apparently from what I was told his deal with Schecter was he was "Schecter Only" and Jeff wanted to play other guitars. Jeff is a big collector and also wanted to play "Other" guitars so being endorsed by Jackson he can also use Charvel, Fender, Gretsch, ect….
> 
> At least that is what heard, take it for what its worth. He left Schecter pretty abruptly and they were secretly working a USA model with him...



FWIW those specific brands (Charvel, Fender, Gretsch) and his Jackson are all suspiciously Fender Musical Instrument Corp brands. So if he named those brands specifically, he could simply be toeing the line of his FMIC endorsement.

And i agree with the posters saying that if he switched because he didn't get more money, then good for him! I sure like having more money.


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 1, 2020)

I was happy when I heard Loomis was getting into Jackson and he was playing Kellys. Bad news came in a form of a no sevenstring flat top Kelly at $6k.

Honestly, I don't think there is any reason other than money. Jeff is far from a gear nerd and just plays his ass off with anything he can get. He was almost clueless of the specs of his signatures in the demo videos, and the updated signatures were more about customer requests than Jeff's.

That being said, endorsements are all about the money anyway. Why do you think Periphery has three guitar players with signature guitars and pickups from three different brands? Coincidence? Destiny?


----------



## oppgulp (Jan 1, 2020)

Made in Japan Charvel?

https://reverb.com/item/30199679-ch...are&utm_campaign=listing&utm_content=30199679


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 1, 2020)

oppgulp said:


> Made in Japan Charvel?
> 
> https://reverb.com/item/30199679-ch...are&utm_campaign=listing&utm_content=30199679



http://www.charvel.jp/mj/


----------



## Wildebeest (Jan 1, 2020)

Yeah yeah Jeff likes money but he likes Yngwie strats too. I'm glad he moved, despite the fact that I love my Schecter Loomis.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 2, 2020)

damn no pics yet....in this world when everything leaks 3 months before official release....Can't believe nothing's out yet....


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 2, 2020)

manu80 said:


> damn no pics yet....in this world when everything leaks 3 months before official release....Can't believe nothing's out yet....



Jackson is like that. And it is not like they are releasing anything exciting this year (or the year before that).
Although, I'm looking out if they will be releasing another color for the friedman sig. i kinda like that shape. Or a loomis pro.


----------



## jephjacques (Jan 2, 2020)

Also anything they announce now won't actually exist in reality until 2022


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 6, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> "Only Corey Beaulieau V's are CNC'd. Every other one is hand built. Still, the Corey B's cutouts are hand made since they don't have a machine for that. Any Corey B has taken at least a year to get out of them. It is brutal".
> 
> Bullshit or not, end result is: We still don't get a godammn soloist . If you want something other than a sig model your only choice is to hunt for used B7s. You're basically getting a CS for the 1,5k they go used.



It's a load of bullshit. My Soloist 7 was CNC'd (and it's a non-standard 22 frets), as were all of the short run done through Matt's Music and the short run of white ones, I suspect. Tim told me they made a CNC template of my guitar when it was built.

That said, the SL7s from Indonesia I've played were good guitars, but that's only two, and I still don't understand the damn blade on that when the SL2 has a toggle, but...


----------



## cardinal (Jan 6, 2020)

Yeah, the gloss black SL7 with the reverse headstock really looks pretty nice. Send it out for a pro fret level, and I'm sure it'll play as well as anything else you could find.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 6, 2020)

possumkiller said:


> It does seem like Jackson are a bit behind on the toilet burl abalone fishmans and evertune front.



You left out the "Thankfully" at the end there...


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 6, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The MIM are inconsistent, which is better than the Indo, which are consistently not very good.



In general, I wouldn't say the Pro level guitars are bad, just meh with some good ones.

The X Series kinda sucks though.

All this is kind of a surprise given how good ESPs Indo guitars are, though.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 6, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yeah, they're sub-45mm.



So that was why it bothered me a bit. I played one and there was something that bugged me about it other than the VERY flat bridge, which everyone but me seems to love.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 6, 2020)

eaeolian said:


> In general, I wouldn't say the Pro level guitars are bad, just meh with some good ones.
> 
> The X Series kinda sucks though.
> 
> All this is kind of a surprise given how good ESPs Indo guitars are, though.



They're getting better though. Just weirdly not very good yet. 

If they can get just a bit more consistent they'd have some LTD maybe even E-II M/H killers on their hands.



eaeolian said:


> So that was why it bothered me a bit. I played one and there was something that bugged me about it other than the VERY flat bridge, which everyone but me seems to love.



I really want to give these a go. I actually really liked the ESP NT7 when they had 45mm nuts.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 6, 2020)

jephjacques said:


> The MIM Charvels are inconsistent, yeah. I played two identical DK24s in my local store- one had great fretwork, the other was lousy.



Fortunately, the shop that sells Charvel near me does real, actual setups (including fret leveling if needed) on everything they sell. I'm kinda spoiled by that.


----------



## cardinal (Jan 6, 2020)

For a time I had an ESP with a 45mm nut, some other 7s with the typical 48mm nut, and some 8s with a 55mm nut. I could go between all of them and never really noticed the nut spacing...


----------



## jephjacques (Jan 6, 2020)

I definitely noticed the narrow nut on the Horizon NT7 I had, but it didn't really make a difference to me either way.


----------



## Bucketheadtwo (Jan 8, 2020)

I'm wondering if and when this might come out


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 10, 2020)

eaeolian said:


> It's a load of bullshit. My Soloist 7 was CNC'd (and it's a non-standard 22 frets), as were all of the short run done through Matt's Music and the short run of white ones, I suspect. Tim told me they made a CNC template of my guitar when it was built.



Guess each dealer has a different story (which doesn't help Jackson's excuses either).


----------



## sakeido (Jan 10, 2020)

eaeolian said:


> In general, I wouldn't say the Pro level guitars are bad, just meh with some good ones.
> 
> The X Series kinda sucks though.
> 
> All this is kind of a surprise given how good ESPs Indo guitars are, though.



RIP Japanese Pro series... like seriously. every time on of Jackson's overseas factories gets too good at building guitars, they axe em, then start from scratch elsewhere

imo the X series has been terrible for the last two decades


----------



## Albake21 (Jan 10, 2020)

sakeido said:


> RIP Japanese Pro series... like seriously. every time on of Jackson's overseas factories gets too good at building guitars, they axe em, then start from scratch elsewhere
> 
> imo the X series has been terrible for the last two decades


The X series is hot garbage. This is my biggest gripe with Jackson's catalog and why I wish Japanese made Jacksons would come back. The gap between shit and amazing is just way too big when looking at it from a money stand point.


----------



## Mathemagician (Jan 10, 2020)

IMO Jackson is basically working hard to keep the 80’s mentality of “buy cheap shit or buy USA”. Not knocking it great for Jackson. 

However There are almost no quality construction options $1500-1800. Except surprisingly enough, the B7 I think. 

So ESP/E2 is the one that gets my attention.


----------



## th3drap3ryfalls (Jan 10, 2020)

So came across this on zzounds... New Walnut color for the Dave Davidson Wr7 Pro. 

Edit: looks like this one has bevels vs. the distressed ash one, assuming this is due to no veneer on this one?


----------



## gunch (Jan 10, 2020)

I want a black soloist like Doug Cerrito ca. 95-98 but then I remember how current Jackson is


----------



## SJShinn (Jan 11, 2020)

eaeolian said:


> Fortunately, the shop that sells Charvel near me does real, actual setups (including fret leveling if needed) on everything they sell. I'm kinda spoiled by that.


Wow, small world! I grew up in Woodbridge! If I may ask, what shop are you referring to?


----------



## Musiscience (Jan 11, 2020)

gunch said:


> I want a black soloist like Doug Cerrito ca. 95-98 but then I remember how current Jackson is




This show was at Foufounes Électriques! Used to go there all the time when I was about 18 haha. It's like a 2 stories bar/show room.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 13, 2020)

Not really Jackson. There's a leak about the resurrected Fender "Strat" superstrat. Basically a Jackson/Charvel Dinky body.


----------



## wannabguitarist (Jan 13, 2020)

It's a shame the blue HM Strat doesn't seem to be available with a maple board.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 13, 2020)

NO LEAK YET ?????????? WTF ?


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 13, 2020)

manu80 said:


> NO LEAK YET ?????????? WTF ?



Jackson and Charvel does this every year.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 13, 2020)

yeah I know but i know some of you are good in finding stuff  I've tried but nothing.
Kuddos to them for succeeding in keeping it secret til the end !


----------



## I play music (Jan 13, 2020)

I would expect a new Loomis sig. But I'm afraid it will be a Strat..  guess Loomis has lost my interest about when he did the switch from Schecter to Fender Jackson. Used to be a big fan of his playing and his guitars in his Schecter time.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 13, 2020)

Hopefully a dinky or a soloist pro. And not made in china. The cheap ones that have maple and black sharks have issues with inlays popping off. I hope this is a return to proper dk2m.


----------



## Mathemagician (Jan 13, 2020)

My $0.02 on their import lines: More cheap Chinese and indo bolt ons with big heels, cheap trems, and way too light brown fretboards. Then some will be neckthrough but otherwise the same.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 13, 2020)

SJShinn said:


> Wow, small world! I grew up in Woodbridge! If I may ask, what shop are you referring to?



Action Music in Falls Church. There's several NoVA types here.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 13, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> Not really Jackson. There's a leak about the resurrected Fender "Strat" superstrat. Basically a Jackson/Charvel Dinky body.
> 
> View attachment 76504
> View attachment 76505



I owned an original. Not very Charvel like at all, despite the similar look.


----------



## NikSampson (Jan 14, 2020)

Looks like David Davidson (Revocation) is getting a new Pro series signature model!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B7RIq6uHFcS/


----------



## xzacx (Jan 14, 2020)

NikSampson said:


> Looks like David Davidson (Revocation) is getting a new Pro series signature model!
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/p/B7RIq6uHFcS/



I think this is actually the one thing that has leaked. Kinda looks more like his first Custom Shop that released with proper Warrior bevels rather than the Ikea veneer from the first Pro Series.


----------



## NikSampson (Jan 14, 2020)

xzacx said:


> I think this is actually the one thing that has leaked. Kinda looks more like his first Custom Shop that released with proper Warrior bevels rather than the Ikea veneer from the first Pro Series.



Oh, the stained black one? That'd be cool. I always thought his coolest Warrior 7 was his very first spalted maple one, from the Invidious video.


----------



## xzacx (Jan 14, 2020)

NikSampson said:


> Oh, the stained black one? That'd be cool. I always thought his coolest Warrior 7 was his very first spalted maple one, from the Invidious video.


I think it’s a more reddish-brown then that, but that’s the one I was referring to rather than the spalt one. I like the spalt one because at least it doesn’t have the stripe down the center, but spalt just reminds me too much of wood paneling from a basement decorated in the ‘70s. I actually think the first Pro Series looks the coolest from afar, but the flat top/veneer feels and looks kinda cheap in person. The one I tried out though actually played and sounded awesome.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 14, 2020)

there we are !
sand blasted , crackle, new Beaulieu color, usa caggiano, pro series loomis (looks like the usa, good !!)
Guess i'll go for the loomis and caggiano import 

https://www.jacksonguitars.com/gear/new


----------



## Albake21 (Jan 14, 2020)

Damn there's some solid offerings here. They finally did it though, they put the HT headstock on their 7s. I always hated the inline headstock on their 7 strings.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 14, 2020)

hmmmm some of those sand blasted dinkys have Fishman Fluence OpenCore PRF-COC pickups. Cheapo fluence?


----------



## Bdtunn (Jan 14, 2020)

That crackle slm3 is the stuff! 
And them loomis pro of course


----------



## sell2792 (Jan 14, 2020)

A little disappointing. Would have liked to seem more 7’s.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 14, 2020)

Dinky Modern series looks sweet.

I saw Gus G got a custom Jackson Strat a month ago, but goddamn didn't expect it to become a signature model.

FINALLY a proper P/J Ellefson bass with the RIGHT P config. 

Hope the Caggiano sig doesn't have the Surfcaster stock.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 14, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> hmmmm some of those sand blasted dinkys have Fishman Fluence OpenCore PRF-COC pickups. Cheapo fluence?



Keith Merrow apparently talked about a line of Fluences with a single voicing.

EDIT Nevermind these are regular Fluence Open Cores.


----------



## xzacx (Jan 14, 2020)

That USA Gus G neck-thru San Dimas with the matching reverse Strat headstock is super cool. Not a color I’d ever buy but love the model.


----------



## mlp187 (Jan 14, 2020)

This is a great goddamn year


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 14, 2020)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I saw Gus G got a custom Jackson Strat a month ago, but goddamn didn't expect it to become a signature model.
> Keith Merrow apparently talked about a line of Fluences with a single voicing.



And it is quite surprising that it is a mahogany, maple neck through!!!

The modern dinkys are ditching the scarf joint! necks are now 3 pc. Single voicing fluence would be fine if it is $60 less than the current line.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 14, 2020)

Goddammit the Caggiano sig has the sinful headstock.  That guitar would have looked SWEET with a 6-in-line.

Oh well. I really hope Jackson ups their import quality, because these guitars DO look pretty cool.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 14, 2020)

The Caggiano and the loomis seems to have good pups, not designed crappo stuff
Dimarzio for the rob’s sig and real duncan loomis on the kelly ?
Like the domino KV too !


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 14, 2020)

Take back what I said about the Fluences. look like they're still multi-voiced. "COC" is just the itemized name for the Open Core like. 

Gus also talked about his own active passive pickups. Looks like they're custom made by Jackson just for him.


----------



## MFB (Jan 14, 2020)

More Dominion series options eh?

Keep talking...


----------



## possumkiller (Jan 14, 2020)

As far as looks are concerned, that Loomis Kelly beats the hell out of every Schecter he ever had. 
It's just more civilised.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 14, 2020)

xzacx said:


> I think this is actually the one thing that has leaked. Kinda looks more like his first Custom Shop that released with proper Warrior bevels rather than the Ikea veneer from the first Pro Series.



Thankfully. Without the bevels the Warrior is uncomfortable as hell.


----------



## Overtone (Jan 14, 2020)

It bums me out that so few of the main lineup guitars have the classic sharkfin inlays now.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 14, 2020)

...and they finally make a cool DK7 and it's 26.5". Assholes.


----------



## StrmRidr (Jan 14, 2020)

Pretty decent offerings this year, but it seems my wallet is safe. Nothing really grabbed my eye. The modern DK's are pretty cool though.


----------



## I play music (Jan 14, 2020)

Not exactly the worst line up but after seeing what Ibanez, ESP and Schecter have coming this year, Jackson is not interesting for me.


----------



## BillCosby (Jan 14, 2020)

I've never been particularly impressed with Jackson, except for the Dave Davidson WR7, but those Ash 7 string DK7s with the reverse AT1 headstock are seriously awesome. I really like the blue one, especially.


----------



## gunch (Jan 14, 2020)

2020: Superstrats are back and they are leveling your house SUBMIT SUBMIT SUBMIT

I've wanted a SL2 for a while now. 

Has anyone that's played a lot of the pro series Indos say whether or not it's still the best move to just hunt old USA or Japan SLs? The new HM strats and Charvel Dk24s are weighing heavily on my GAS too 

Spec wise the new pro series SL2s leave me wanting nothing though


----------



## xzacx (Jan 14, 2020)

gunch said:


> 2020: Superstrats are back and they are leveling your house SUBMIT SUBMIT SUBMIT
> 
> I've wanted a SL2 for a while now.
> 
> ...



Absolutely just wait for a used USA at a good price. They’re not that hard to find, but they do move quick when prices right. The older MIJ ones are good for sure, but people ask to much for them these days, and they still aren’t quite as good as the USAs. I think the quality of the MIIs is actually really solid, and better than the MIM stuff I’ve played, but no chance I’d buy one over a used USA.


----------



## bassplayer8 (Jan 14, 2020)

That new Davidson warrior is absolutely killer!


----------



## CapinCripes (Jan 14, 2020)

A neck through 2 hum front routed mahogany 2 point non locking tremed 24 fret strat is definitely a... unique combination.


----------



## couverdure (Jan 14, 2020)

Am I going mad or is this color style going to be the new thing?


----------



## dirtool (Jan 14, 2020)

Those RGDs looks not bad


----------



## XPT707FX (Jan 14, 2020)

couverdure said:


> Am I going mad or is this color style going to be the new thing?


You aren’t going mad Mayones is doing the same thing


----------



## Sdrizis89 (Jan 15, 2020)

All I want Jackson to do every year is expand the current USA line to have a 7 string version of every shape and have the price be comparable to their 6 string USA counterparts. At least start with the soloist and expand from there. The DD sig was a cool start, although it is way too expensive. Standard USA 7 string Soloist and maybe the other shapes please.... maybe one day.


----------



## Mathemagician (Jan 15, 2020)

manu80 said:


> View attachment 76525
> View attachment 76526
> View attachment 76527
> View attachment 76528
> ...



Now this is the sort of high brow content I come here for.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)

This could have been great if it wasnt a flat top and the headstock matched. Why are there so many flat top RRs, Kellys, and Warriors right now? Is it cheaper to produce??


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 15, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> Is it cheaper to produce??



Yes.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Yes.


But we have JS series with the bevels and WRXMGs before that were also made in Indonesia.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 15, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> But we have JS series with the bevels and WRXMGs before that were also made in Indonesia.



I assume the only difference isn’t just bevels.


----------



## NikSampson (Jan 15, 2020)

couverdure said:


> Am I going mad or is this color style going to be the new thing?



The edge on that looks super comfortable compared to the other two!


----------



## possumkiller (Jan 15, 2020)

NikSampson said:


> The edge on that looks super comfortable compared to the other two!


That's not an Edge. It's a Floyd Rose. Probably a 1000 or Special.


----------



## JimF (Jan 15, 2020)

possumkiller said:


> That's not an Edge. It's a Floyd Rose. Probably a 1000 or Special.



If that was a joke, bravo


----------



## NikSampson (Jan 15, 2020)

JimF said:


> If that was a joke, bravo


Expert trolling right there, I'll give him that. Great puns. Huge.


----------



## StrmRidr (Jan 15, 2020)

The new David Davidson WR7 with bevels is one step closer to a regular pro series 6 string warrior. I can't believe one still doesn't exist after all these years.


----------



## Mathemagician (Jan 15, 2020)

StrmRidr said:


> The new David Davidson WR7 with bevels is one step closer to a regular pro series 6 string warrior. I can't believe one still doesn't exist after all these years.



Jackson doesn’t care about warrior people!


----------



## StrmRidr (Jan 15, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> Jackson doesn’t care about warrior people!



Seriously, the new X series with the maple board is alright but WHY did they go with the flat top on it. It ruins it for me (I can live with the non-matching headstock although it would have been much better if it was matching).


----------



## AdenM (Jan 15, 2020)

The DK Modern with the Floyd is quite sick - not sure if I like these enough to dole out funds though.


----------



## The Spanish Inquisition (Jan 15, 2020)

XPT707FX said:


> You aren’t going mad Mayones is doing the same thing
> View attachment 76545


And has been doing it for a veeeeeeery long time.


----------



## Fierce_Swe (Jan 15, 2020)

I wouldn't mind this one..... https://www.charvel.com/gear/shape/dk/pro-mod-dk24-hh-fr-m-mahogany-with-quilt-maple/2969431558


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 15, 2020)

gunch said:


> 2020: Superstrats are back and they are leveling your house SUBMIT SUBMIT SUBMIT
> 
> I've wanted a SL2 for a while now.
> 
> ...



The quality of the recent SL2s is pretty good, but play a few or order from somewhere that has a return policy.

The Charvel DK24s are pretty awesome. I think the Mexican guitars (Charvel and Jackson) are far more consistent than the Indo ones - but the good Indo ones are *quite* good.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 15, 2020)

bassplayer8 said:


> That new Davidson warrior is absolutely killer!


Yep. Adding the bevels back makes it playable for me. I'm in trouble.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 15, 2020)

Sdrizis89 said:


> All I want Jackson to do every year is expand the current USA line to have a 7 string version of every shape and have the price be comparable to their 6 string USA counterparts. At least start with the soloist and expand from there. The DD sig was a cool start, although it is way too expensive. Standard USA 7 string Soloist and maybe the other shapes please.... maybe one day.


They're making too much money off of people ordering custom shop guitars to devote that level of production to 7 strings, which are a tiny market for Jackson anyway. They will Masterbuild you any shape as a 7 through the CS, but grab your ankles - and yet they have no shortage of orders for $6K guitars.


----------



## eaeolian (Jan 15, 2020)

StrmRidr said:


> Seriously, the new X series with the maple board is alright but WHY did they go with the flat top on it. It ruins it for me (I can live with the non-matching headstock although it would have been much better if it was matching).



Because the bevels are more expensive to cut and sand/polish. They have machines for flat and carved tops, IIRC.


----------



## Samark (Jan 15, 2020)

Would be great to see an import based on this. Should be relatively well priced too


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)

From CmC guitars:

More of the same I guess...


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)




----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 15, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> From CmC guitars:
> 
> More of the same I guess...



Called it. 

Tons of really cool guitars you'll never be able to actually buy since the shop is too busy because they're working on show pieces. Round and around it goes.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)

And that is why I can't get a Masterbuilt slot for the next year.


----------



## cardinal (Jan 15, 2020)

lol. They won't make me a 7-string So Cal or Dinky but they'll make that thing?


----------



## Frostbite (Jan 15, 2020)

couverdure said:


> Am I going mad or is this color style going to be the new thing?


Maybe it's just me but the Schecter looks like someone tried and failed to clean up after a nut


----------



## Mattykoda (Jan 15, 2020)

Samark said:


> Would be great to see an import based on this. Should be relatively well priced too
> 
> View attachment 76561
> View attachment 76562
> View attachment 76563



Damn I love that.


----------



## xzacx (Jan 15, 2020)

I might be the only one, but I love that wacky 7 thing we’ve seen Chris Broderick with. I’d be tempted if it ends up with a dealer. The pink WR is pretty cool too—would have been a lot cooler with standard scale, sharkfins, and a Floyd though. I’d still probably be interested assuming it’s not some stupid long scale lengths. Green sparkle HS Charvel is good too. Not much else I’d be interested in actually trying to buy though.


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 15, 2020)

The Broderick is offensively hideous considering the good taste he usually has in designing guitars. The pink Warrior is again a completely niche guitar.

... Aaaaand the Bulb signature 6-string relic'd strat left me absolutely clueless. I mean what the f*ck


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jan 15, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> From CmC guitars:
> 
> More of the same I guess...
> 
> ...


I will do absolutely terrible things for that multiscale pink 7 string warrior. I NEEED IT


----------



## Mathemagician (Jan 15, 2020)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I will do absolutely terrible things for that multiscale pink 7 string warrior. I NEEED IT



This but without multi scale. Given that Jackson hates warrior people we likely have enough to to save up for a custom shop before anything like this ever hits production. Also the production model will be MII/MIC and have a bolt on block heel with a dry brown FB.


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jan 15, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> This but without multi scale. Given that Jackson hates warrior people we likely have enough to to save up for a custom shop before anything like this ever hits production. Also the production model will be MII/MIC and have a bolt on block heel with a dry brown FB.


By the time they actually bring a multiscale warrior to the market I'll probably have built a couple of my own after getting sick of waiting for a masterbuild slot


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 15, 2020)

Who has a picture of that yellow demon-ish bass with a reverse headstock? That one is awesome.


----------



## zenonshandro (Jan 16, 2020)

Check those Ibanez-esque rounded neck heels and dark wenge middles on the 3-pc necks. I think they look pretty good specs-wise. I'm not feeling the colour choices or overall finish direction, though.


----------



## zenonshandro (Jan 16, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> The Broderick is offensively hideous ...



Is this abomination the Broderick?


----------



## dirtool (Jan 16, 2020)

Holy~shit


----------



## Vyn (Jan 16, 2020)

zenonshandro said:


> Check those Ibanez-esque rounded neck heels and dark wenge middles on the 3-pc necks. I think they look pretty good specs-wise. I'm not feeling the colour choices or overall finish direction, though.




They are the love children of a Mayones/Ibanez orgy and it’s brilliant.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 16, 2020)

F...n love the broderick even if i prefer the white version we saw back in the days on some pics
Pink warrior is cool too


----------



## bulb (Jan 16, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> ... Aaaaand the Bulb signature 6-string relic'd strat left me absolutely clueless. I mean what the f*ck



that guitar makes me so fucking happy. Looks like a dad rock relic strat, plays like a modern shredder, sounds absolutely fantastic. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.


----------



## cardinal (Jan 16, 2020)

bulb said:


> that guitar makes me so fucking happy. Looks like a dad rock relic strat, plays like a modern shredder, sounds absolutely fantastic. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.



7 or 8 string version please!!!


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 16, 2020)

bulb said:


> that guitar makes me so fucking happy. Looks like a dad rock relic strat, plays like a modern shredder, sounds absolutely fantastic. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.


Hey, don't get it in the wrong way. If new David Gilmour signature was a Bc Rich Beast I'd have the same feeling 

Now, we want the 7-string version of it.



zenonshandro said:


> Is this abomination the Broderick?
> 
> View attachment 76583



It is. What makes it even funnier is that Chris Broderick is huge, so this will look super small on him.


----------



## olejason (Jan 16, 2020)

I can't believe they have the audacity to put a nasty laurel fretboard on a $1000 bass


----------



## sakeido (Jan 16, 2020)

The NAMM photos gave me big time deja vu. Same stuff as it's been for the last 10 years, except maybe a little different because Charvel >>>> Jackson these days

They've got the good designs AND the good factory. Why can't they make the Jackson Pros in Mexico?


----------



## _MonSTeR_ (Jan 16, 2020)

bulb said:


> If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.



so the question is... Will we be able to get it? 

As in, is this a new production model that we will find in stores or is it a one off custom shop repro of your guitar special?


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 16, 2020)

sakeido said:


> Why can't they make the Jackson Pros in Mexico?



The FMIC facility in Mexico is setup exclusively for bolt-on guitar construction.

Could they do neck-through stuff their? Probably if they converted a line or two, but they'd lose efficiency and they need to cut costs to hit unit price targets. 

If you look up videos of the plant you'll see the place is split into three wings: body shop, neck shop, assembly.


----------



## MASS DEFECT (Jan 16, 2020)

They cant built the pointies in Mexico too. Except for a Star here and there.


----------



## bulb (Jan 16, 2020)

_MonSTeR_ said:


> so the question is... Will we be able to get it?
> 
> As in, is this a new production model that we will find in stores or is it a one off custom shop repro of your guitar special?



Currently this is a CS special masterbuilt by Red Dave and we are only gonna build them for the shops that order them, though the guitar did get quite a few cards yesterday. If we see enough interest, could be worth discussing tooling up for a USA model. But one step at a time for now, I’m just stoked I have one for myself honestly...


----------



## MetalDaze (Jan 16, 2020)

bulb said:


> that guitar makes me so fucking happy. Looks like a dad rock relic strat, plays like a modern shredder, sounds absolutely fantastic. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.



@Ola Englund recently bought a relic-ed Fender Strat so we all must be getting old


----------



## Zado (Jan 16, 2020)

I like the green HS Charvie and the blue HSS Jackson. Curious about the price, but guesa there will be many fine choices in that price range


----------



## Fenceclimber (Jan 16, 2020)

Looks like some of the pro series guitars have switched production to China.






Nothing from Jackson really got me all that excited tbh, I miss the days of the MiJ Pro series. The new Dave Davidson Warrior does look great though!


----------



## Apex1rg7x (Jan 16, 2020)

bulb said:


> that guitar makes me so fucking happy. Looks like a dad rock relic strat, plays like a modern shredder, sounds absolutely fantastic. If you don’t get it, you don’t get it.


How limited will these be?? I Neeeeeeed this guitar!


----------



## Albake21 (Jan 16, 2020)

Fenceclimber said:


> Looks like some of the pro series guitars have switched production to China.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Gross...


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 16, 2020)

I've played great MiC guitars. Better than Indo.

But given Jackson's spotty import QC... Meh.


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jan 16, 2020)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I've played great MiC guitars. Better than Indo.
> 
> But given Jackson's spotty import QC... Meh.


yeah I've played good MIC and MII guitars, but never from Jackson. The ones I've managed to get my hands on are consistently worse than comparably priced schecters/LTDs ime.


----------



## jephjacques (Jan 16, 2020)

KnightBrolaire said:


> I will do absolutely terrible things for that multiscale pink 7 string warrior. I NEEED IT



I'm going to fight you for it


----------



## KnightBrolaire (Jan 16, 2020)

jephjacques said:


> I'm going to fight you for it


TWO MEN ENTER, ONE MAN LEAVES


----------



## Flappydoodle (Jan 16, 2020)

Samark said:


> Would be great to see an import based on this. Should be relatively well priced too
> 
> View attachment 76561
> View attachment 76562
> View attachment 76563



That's super tasty


----------



## cardinal (Jan 16, 2020)

jephjacques said:


> I'm going to fight you for it



Crossroads guitar battle!


----------



## metal4life71 (Jan 16, 2020)

Well I love my Jackson USA CS Soloist and would love a USA Jackson 7 string model that does not cost a small fortune.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 17, 2020)

Caggiano is listed in uk in preorder at 1200 euros, loomis at 1700..... nice specs and pups but expensive for indo made....(the headstock of the caggiano shows it)we’ll see....


----------



## Zado (Jan 17, 2020)

manu80 said:


> loomis at 1700..... nice specs and pups bit expensive for indo made


AH. How cute Europe.


----------



## Flappydoodle (Jan 17, 2020)

manu80 said:


> Caggiano is listed in uk in preorder at 1200 euros, loomis at 1700..... nice specs and pups but expensive for indo made....(the headstock of the caggiano shows it)we’ll see....



Yeah, I’ve noticed this recently. Indonesia is creeping up to even above where the Korean guitars used to be. Prices of the imports are definitely being pushed up to test the maximum of what people will pay. 

And apparently people still pay it. Kinda crazy considering you can buy Japanese made guitars for not much more than that. I bought a brand new Eii Horizon in Japan for less than $1800 USD.


----------



## possumkiller (Jan 17, 2020)

I honestly don't care where they are made. I pay for quality. I've had Chinese guitars that were built as well as and played as nice as name brand USA guitars. What I can't stand is the hike in prices with no increase in quality. Every Indo Ibanez I've ever played has been on the same quality level as the bottom of the barrel Indo standard series. Irregardless of whether it was a premium, iron label, or standard series. I'm not paying Korea and Japan quality money for less than Korea and Japan quality. But most kids don't know how well a high quality instrument plays and feels. They just go by the spec sheet. So companies take their garbage low end instruments these kids are used to and slap some flashy flavor of the week specs on them and charge high quality prices.


----------



## Anquished (Jan 17, 2020)

Oh mannn...

I was after a 7 with a floating bridge and this looks like it'll fit the bill quite nicely.


----------



## couverdure (Jan 17, 2020)

possumkiller said:


> But most kids don't know how well a high quality instrument plays and feels. They just go by the spec sheet. So companies take their garbage low end instruments these kids are used to and slap some flashy flavor of the week specs on them and charge high quality prices.


Now we know why companies don't listen to forums like this and sell more "cheaper" guitars than their high-end lines.


----------



## Randy (Jan 17, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> View attachment 76576



Mckayla Maroney signature?


----------



## SenorDingDong (Jan 17, 2020)

Fenceclimber said:


> Looks like some of the pro series guitars have switched production to China.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I will be biting the bullet on this next week (releases in a few days), so will report back with feel/quality/overall impressions.

I am nervous about the MiC from Jackson, since their Indos are so consistently inconsistent, but who knows, maybe first batch will be good.


EDIT: My dealer fucked up his email and it is April 21st, not January 21st. Oh well.


----------



## causeunknown (Jan 17, 2020)

I've been in the market for a hardtail seven string in the ~$1,200 - $2,500 range. I know that's a pretty big margin that should afford me lots of options, but i've also been really interested in something that's Fishman equipped. I saw this today and it definitely caught my eye. I like the specs and the look a lot. I wasn't particularly in love with anything from Ibanez's 2020 releases. The only other guitar's I'm considering is the Ibanez RGR5227MFX or the Schecter Keith Merrow KM-7 MK-III. I currently play the Ibanez RG652AHMFX, which I love and assume has very similar feel to the other one and I had an opportunity to play the KM-7 and also really liked it. Not really sure what I'll go with. If anyone has any input I'd love to hear it. When I saw the lineup of the new Dinky's though I was very impressed with them and I feel like they could be a big contender in the mid range 7 string space. I really want to try one.


----------



## metal4life71 (Jan 17, 2020)

I really liked the entry level Ibanez with BKP pups that I played recently for under 2k. Now if only they made a 7 string model like that. I am leaning toward the Jackson USA Misha 7 string or Vigier Excalibur 7 guitar as these seem to be the best ones under 3k for semi-custom level quality guitars or maybe an Ibanez J Custom 7.


----------



## Shawn (Jan 18, 2020)

MASS DEFECT said:


> This could have been great if it wasnt a flat top and the headstock matched. Why are there so many flat top RRs, Kellys, and Warriors right now? Is it cheaper to produce??
> 
> View attachment 76546


I never could get over why Jackson angles their headstocks so much, it just always looked wrong to me. I like the look of strings being straight from bridge to tuners. I have always loved their headstock shape and the white bound necks with the sharkfin inlays but the headstock angle has always been my pet peeve.

I’ve owned quite a few of BC Rich Warlocks back in the day and I know their headstocks were ridiculously angled too so it’s not just Jackson lol.


----------



## Asphyxia (Jan 18, 2020)

The Corey Beaulieu signature is my guitar for this year. That Winterstorm finish is just awesome.
I don't listen to Trivium and neither does anyone I play with. Somehow that makes me more comfortable playing someones signature guitar.


----------



## zenonshandro (Jan 18, 2020)

Asphyxia said:


> The Corey Beaulieu signature is my guitar for this year. That Winterstorm finish is just awesome.
> I don't listen to Trivium and neither does anyone I play with. Somehow that makes me more comfortable playing someones signature guitar.



Same here. I've wanted a mahogany bodied 7 string KV for a while now. Everything looks good except the serrations on the bottom but i might be able to swallow em because of the specs and colour!


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 18, 2020)

Funny stuff is that you can buy plenty of used MiJ Jacksons (although not sevens) from 250$ upwards. Got myself an SLSMG for 250€ which is a ridiculous guitar even for 1k.

MIJ SL3s and RR5/KE5 usually sell around 500$ and will destroy any import they've put in the recent years.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 18, 2020)

just found a grover jackson FUIG37 for nothing, MIJ too for almost nothing.


----------



## manu80 (Jan 18, 2020)

BY the way , finally nothing from Mustaine's new home ? he's still listed on Dean's site though. Maybe nothing happened finally...


----------



## Masoo2 (Jan 18, 2020)

Asphyxia said:


> The Corey Beaulieu signature is my guitar for this year. That Winterstorm finish is just awesome.
> I don't listen to Trivium and neither does anyone I play with. Somehow that makes me more comfortable playing someones signature guitar.


I've wanted one of those Soloists they released in the Winterstorm finish for a while now, it's absolutely killer

might just have to get one of those Beaulieu's


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 18, 2020)

manu80 said:


> BY the way , finally nothing from Mustaine's new home ? he's still listed on Dean's site though. Maybe nothing happened finally...



Still using Dean as of now. He was rehearsing for the upcoming Euro tour a couple of days ago and still using his Dean Vs.


----------



## Asphyxia (Jan 18, 2020)

Masoo2 said:


> I've wanted one of those Soloists they released in the Winterstorm finish for a while now, it's absolutely killer
> 
> might just have to get one of those Beaulieu's


The lack of binding and the serrations on the body make it look like an icicle. The Soloist and the new Rhoads have the binding on the body that didn't look as good to me. I don't like pickup rings. But the top is so good looking I don't care.


----------



## wannabguitarist (Jan 18, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Funny stuff is that you can buy plenty of used MiJ Jacksons (although not sevens) from 250$ upwards. Got myself an SLSMG for 250€ which is a ridiculous guitar even for 1k.
> 
> MIJ SL3s and RR5/KE5 usually sell around 500$ and will destroy any import they've put in the recent years.



The older MIJ stuff has sadly gotten more expensive over the last couple of years. You can still get the 00's models for dirt cheap thankfully (paid $250 for my DK2M), but I miss the days of $300 Fusion and Stealth Professionals.


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 18, 2020)

wannabguitarist said:


> The older MIJ stuff has sadly gotten more expensive over the last couple of years. You can still get the 00's models for dirt cheap thankfully (paid $250 for my DK2M), but I miss the days of $300 Fusion and Stealth Professionals.



The old pros are definetely expensive now. You can blame internet hype for that (the cat is out of the bag for quite some time already). However newer hi-end pros such as the SLSMG, RR5 or KE5 can be had for 500$ or less.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 20, 2020)

Anquished said:


> Oh mannn...
> 
> I was after a 7 with a floating bridge and this looks like it'll fit the bill quite nicely.


why does it have to be a Pro only
why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only
why does it have to be a bolt-on only
why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale
so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.


----------



## Albake21 (Jan 20, 2020)

Tuned said:


> why does it have to be a Pro only
> why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only
> why does it have to be a bolt-on only
> why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale
> so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.


Because this is exactly what's selling. Also never understood the hate against the 1000 series floyd. I have one in my USA made JP16 and it's absolutely perfect. Stays in tune as good as my Ibanez Edge.


----------



## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 20, 2020)

Tuned said:


> why does it have to be a Pro only
> *why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only*
> why does it have to be a bolt-on only
> *why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale*
> so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.



I mean, if it's popular enough, they'd probably release a US version.

But uh, the bolded... I don't get?  1000-series bridges are legit. And whats wrong with the ash/26.5'' combo?


----------



## StrmRidr (Jan 20, 2020)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I mean, if it's popular enough, they'd probably release a US version.
> 
> But uh, the bolded... I don't get?  1000-series bridges are legit. And whats wrong with the ash/26.5'' combo?


Haven't you heard? Ash shrinks about an inch over time making the guitar 25.5".


----------



## Adieu (Jan 20, 2020)

StrmRidr said:


> Haven't you heard? Ash shrinks about an inch over time making the guitar 25.5".



I think that's a joke about somebody's NON-musical "equipment"?

Ash is a male name in some parts of the world


----------



## cardinal (Jan 20, 2020)

1000 series Floyd locking nuts are around 15" or 16" radius. The OFR7 nut is 10" I think. The difference matters. Of course you can use the OFR7 bridge but 1000 nut if you have a 16" radius, but it's easier and cheaper to just use the 1000 kit. 

I dunno the radius on that Jackson, but that may have been on consideration for the 1000 series.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 21, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> Because this is exactly what's selling.


 Ah, that marketing mantra! So , MIM Charvel only sells because of the 1000 series, and the MIJ HM Strat reissue will only live because of the fr special, is that correct? not because "what is selling" is what they sell to you , and you have no valid choice? Thus indonesian Pro with so-so specs and quality that brings up discussions is at the $1400 point, and it's selling for that money by itself, right? The MIJ Professional and the Pro were worse guitars altogether and it was the buyers who ruled them out of the market replacing with indonesian Pro, is that exactly what happened?
How about this - there is an option of color or fancy top for about $100 upcharge or so in the MIM Charvel line. I would pay an upcharge of like $120-150 instead to get an OFR and then f*ck the fancy top, - are you positive this option wouldn't be selling?


Albake21 said:


> Also never understood the hate against the 1000 series floyd. I have one in my USA made JP16 and it's absolutely perfect. Stays in tune as good as my Ibanez Edge.


oh yes I read about your love to your JP16 but that's _your personal attitude_. My _personal _is that, otherwise the better model for me than some of the others (I sold my JP7 exactly because I was disappointed by the EBMM Modern Trem), the 1000 series floyd is one rotten trick by filthy scavengers of marketing people, given the guitar _being a $3K - range instrument_.
1000 is not "_absolutely perfect_". They just install it cutting corners saving less than a hundred bucks or whatever on each instrument. I also have a 1000 on my current MIJ Schecter Japan SD-7-24 built in a ESP Takada facility in Japan. It is a very nice instrument altogether (actually better built than the JP7 it replaced), but I don't say the 1000 "absolutely perfect", because I 've lately had a CIJ ESP Edwards with an OFR, a MIJ Fernandes with a GOTOH1996T and another MIJ Fernandes with an OEM by GOTOH Fernandes-branded bridge, and I know the difference by my own hands. They all are better than the 1000, each in its own way. The sad thing is , the 6-string version of this same model comes with a GOTOH1996T, which is absolute perfect _for me personally. _
Nevertheless, I am looking forward to upgrade my guitar with an OFR7. Probably doing that by my coming birthday.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 21, 2020)

HeHasTheJazzHands said:


> I mean, if it's popular enough, they'd probably release a US version.
> 
> But uh, the bolded... I don't get?  1000-series bridges are legit. And whats wrong with the ash/26.5'' combo?


hopefully they will.

it is legit; but the marketing people make it a vast choice of colors that add nothing to the sound but don't offer the choice of better compoments at an upcharge, and aftermarket upgrading is more expensive.

what's wrong with ash + longer scale: ash being my first choice for bass guitars because of the clarity it adds , it is just too harsh and brittle in the guitar frequencies range to my ears. I've played a few Schecter Jeff Loomis guitars, they were fine from the viewpoint of components, but sounded as jigsaws. The Jackson Jeff Loomis - well, we've heard the sound samples from the ad. Hopefully you loved it.
A longer scale _'for metal' _guitar implies accent on the lower frequencies, also likely by tuning down. And then you use ash to do ...what? cut the lows and move the accent back to the higher frequencies again?


----------



## _MonSTeR_ (Jan 21, 2020)

These days someone at even a guitar company will look at the cost/benefit of things like different finishes vs different pickups.

They’ll have sales data to tell them what sells and a lot of it, especially on mid tier models, is just number crunching.


----------



## Zhysick (Jan 21, 2020)

Tuned said:


> hopefully they will.
> 
> it is legit; but the marketing people make it a vast choice of colors that add nothing to the sound but don't offer the choice of better compoments at an upcharge, and aftermarket upgrading is more expensive.
> 
> ...



Nope.

Longer scale means better intonation for thicker strings, considering on a 7 string you use a thick string for the lowest it is interesting to have a longer scale to improve intonation and have better in-tune chords and all intonation related. Longer scale also means more tension so you can use thinner strings, which improves intonation, because you get more tension from the scale length. Also, if you tube lower: yes, a longer scale with thinner strings will give you more bite so more definition in the lower notes making the sound clearer so do the swamp ash and it's emphasis in the higher frequencies...

So, in paper, is a nice way to make a metal 7 string guitar.


----------



## Xaios (Jan 21, 2020)

KnightBrolaire said:


> TWO MEN ENTER, ONE MAN LEAVES


Spin the wheel, RGD man!


----------



## Tuned (Jan 21, 2020)

_MonSTeR_ said:


> These days someone at even a guitar company will look at the cost/benefit of things like different finishes vs different pickups.
> 
> They’ll have sales data to tell them what sells and a lot of it, especially on mid tier models, is just number crunching.


excuse me I am not sure I grasp what you are driving at.
are you driving to the idea that buyer who cannot order a slightly better version of the product at an adequate upcharge ought to be reconciliated to know there's probably a potential niche for a glistening purplish with sparkle color to be sold this time of the year to more other people around the world?


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 21, 2020)

Tuned said:


> why does it have to be a Pro only
> why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only
> why does it have to be a bolt-on only
> why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale
> so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.



1 - OFRs are 10-12" whereas FR-1000 is 15-16" so the OFR needs to be shimmed to work with Jackson's compound radius. That's extra labour that matters cost-wise so obviously it's better for them to use 1000 series models on non-USA models. There is ZERO need to replace a FR-1000. It's rock solid.

2 - Ash + longer scale is the magic combo that EVERYONE wants for their extended range guitars these days. It's the safe option for them, and the one that makes the most sense since it's what *most* people wants. Indeed people want their sevens to sound like ducks with jigsaws these days, so models are built on that demand.

3 - Bolt-ons. Again, this is what everyone wants this days for MOAR pick attack, clarity, definition and ducks with jigsaws. User demand.

4 - Conclusion: This will sell like hot cakes.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 21, 2020)

I don't get the FRT1k hate. It's come a long way.

It's made in South Korea by Sung-Il, who has been making hardware for everyone for decades, to OFR spec. Same materials milled on similar modern equipment to the same tolerances. They've even been putting better parts on them too. The threading on the fine tuners and locking nuts is much better than even a few years ago, trem posts have been tighter too.

For what it's worth, Sung-Il probably has a better overall manufacturing record than Schaller, who has had fairly significant ups and downs in recent memory. 

The one downside, some finishes on them isn't as nice, especially the chrome. But it's minor. 

The way I see it, beat the crap out of it for years and then upgrade when it needs replacement, if even still own the guitar.


----------



## Blind Tortuga (Jan 23, 2020)

Tuned said:


> why does it have to be a Pro only
> why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only
> why does it have to be a bolt-on only
> why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale
> so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.


I kinda agree. Really dont like that its bolt on. I may have bought it otherwise. I dont have experience with Floyd's so i can't speak on that.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 27, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I don't get the FRT1k hate.


There is no 'hate' - why even suppose 'hate'? of the two items available I want the better one and ready to pay extra for it - is it against capitalism lately or something?




MaxOfMetal said:


> *Same *materials milled on *similar *modern equipment to the *same *tolerances


This is the question. You see, I've read in several sources that the materials are not *same *but *similar, *and Andertons' site _still says so_, and on the Floyd Rose site I can't find the correct information now and, using the contemporary rhetoric of the US special services, it seems _highly unlikely_ that the *same *alloy is sent from the metallurgy Mecca, Germany to Korea to mill there.
In this regard, it makes really little difference in what equipment is used to achieve the same result, it is a simplictic 70-ies design, for goodness sake.
_Same tolerances_, I will comment on that below.



MaxOfMetal said:


> They've even been putting better parts on them too. The threading on the fine tuners and locking nuts is much better than even a few years ago, trem posts have been tighter too.


with all due appreciation of their attempt, I have had OFR, GOTOH, 1000, Takeuchi, Special and know the difference between them by my fingers. Trem post, on my current MIJ 7 with the FR1000 the trem is thinner than the cylinder it goes into, so there's free play before the trem actually begins to work. Also, the arm is not being fixed in the same way across the 360 degrees, and it tightens when I turn it (the arm, not the nut) clockwise and loosens when I turn it (the arm) counterclockwise. Also, it gets loose every now and then, many a time during a song. Also, even if I detach the bridge from the body to securely tighten the hex screw on the bottom, eventually the trem arm older cylinder loosens as well.
Ironically, the 6-string version of my guitar comes with ... the GOTOH1996 that is my favourite FR of all, but I can't get a GOTOH 7. I even asked (I can speak and write Japanese a bit), they said no.



MaxOfMetal said:


> The way I see it, beat the crap out of it for years and then upgrade when it needs replacement, if even still own the guitar.


That's great, but you have seen the prices in Europe. I must mention that my monthly wage is around the price of an unexpensive MIA guitar here. And most peope in my parts honourably toil and still earn less than myself. So I will always choose to invest in a simple-finished guitar, any color, no stars no glitter, but with the best components the same money can buy, and play it until I find a better guitar to substitute it. Why do I have to pay for 2 FR units if I only need the better one? And then when I need replacement buy the better one again.
In fact, I am about to buy an OFR7 for my current player, maybe for my coming birthday


----------



## MrWulf (Jan 28, 2020)

Tuned bro with all due respect you need to stop huffing your own farts about these specs are shit and these trems are better than Floyd 1000. Your fingers' ability to recognize these parts' quality means jack fucking shit in the grand scheme of things when brands are trying to appeal to the mass market, not SSO or RigTalk basement dwellers. 

Then again this is classic SSO so why am i bothering jfc


----------



## c7spheres (Jan 28, 2020)

Tuned said:


> why does it have to be a Pro only
> why does it have to be equipped with a 1000 series only
> why does it have to be a bolt-on only
> why use ash and kill the idea of a longer scale
> so much hope for a perfect model once seeing this picture,so much the miss finding the specs sheet.


 To each his own. It's like all the stuff you're not into I actually like about it. If anything I'd prefer 25.5 scale though,but this guitar looks sick. I still think it would look better with no inlays or just two mini fins at the 12 though, but those dots being small and offeset are actually not annoying to me. For $1400 I think it's a pretty strong contender compared to what other brands are offering. Plus it's greena and black, so you know it sounds good. Green is a great tone color. The best and black is second best. It's scientifically proven I tell ya' : )


----------



## Tuned (Jan 28, 2020)

MrWulf bro why bother about mass market numbers? It matters to guys who sell many guitars and their income depends on their numbers. I buy to play and sell to finance another, and things like "this year this purplish pinkish color is the reason to buy another guitar of the same specs" means sh*t. The world has yet to see a guitar that would sound better because of being purple or not purple, burl or flame etc.
It's up to the person to collect dozens of identical unused objects gathering dust and to spend money (or owe money to bank) on that - fine.
Just don't tell me I must feel sorry that I personally find this idea not attractive.
All the best!


----------



## Tuned (Jan 28, 2020)

c7spheres said:


> To each his own. It's like all the stuff you're not into I actually like about it. If anything I'd prefer 25.5 scale though,but this guitar looks sick. I still think it would look better with no inlays or just two mini fins at the 12 though, but those dots being small and offeset are actually not annoying to me. For $1400 I think it's a pretty strong contender compared to what other brands are offering. Plus it's greena and black, so you know it sounds good. Green is a great tone color. The best and black is second best. It's scientifically proven I tell ya' : )


I hear you) that's a good point, totally fine with me)


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 28, 2020)

@Tuned just drop it bro. Why should Jackson build a guitar according to your specs instead of what the market wants?

Guess what. There are plenty of custom builders that will accomodate your needs. For a price.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 28, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> @Tuned just drop it bro. Why should Jackson build a guitar according to your specs instead of what the market wants?
> 
> Guess what. There are plenty of custom builders that will accomodate your needs. For a price.


ouch, that hurt. In my parts people would respond 'don't tell me what to do, I won't tell you where to go', but that's considered a very rude way to tell an arrogant comment off. But I don't want to sound rude; also, that would imply your comment was arrogant.
I don't want that so I'll only say '_*please*_ don't tell me what to do, I *gladly *won't tell you where to go'.


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 28, 2020)

Tuned said:


> ouch, that hurt. In my parts people would respond 'don't tell me what to do, I won't tell you where to go', but that's considered a very rude way to tell an arrogant comment off. But I don't want to sound rude; also, that would imply your comment was arrogant.
> I don't want that so I'll only say '_*please*_ don't tell me what to do, I *gladly *won't tell you where to go'.


Cool story, bro


----------



## MrWulf (Jan 28, 2020)

You should go to your basement and huff more of your own farts. If you cant the stomach the thoughts of a brand releasing something that you dont like, dont look at it. Or better yet, dont buy it. It is a very simple process.

It is rather tiring to see another series of posts where people like you just bash a product and a manufacturer like they somehow scammed you out of your purchase when you havent even brought and play it. Maybe you should actually play guitar instead of fantasizing about doing so.


----------



## MaxOfMetal (Jan 28, 2020)

Chill out guys.


----------



## bulb (Jan 29, 2020)

I didn’t even post here and it’s an absolute shitshow


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## c7spheres (Jan 29, 2020)

possumkiller said:


> I honestly don't care where they are made. I pay for quality. I've had Chinese guitars that were built as well as and played as nice as name brand USA guitars. What I can't stand is the hike in prices with no increase in quality. Every Indo Ibanez I've ever played has been on the same quality level as the bottom of the barrel Indo standard series. Irregardless of whether it was a premium, iron label, or standard series. I'm not paying Korea and Japan quality money for less than Korea and Japan quality. But most kids don't know how well a high quality instrument plays and feels. They just go by the spec sheet. So companies take their garbage low end instruments these kids are used to and slap some flashy flavor of the week specs on them and charge high quality prices.



I know it's hard to believe but as I mentioned a long time ago in another thread, or maybe this one, I played a made in INDIA not Indonesia Jackson Soloist neck thru my buddy bought for like $400. I restrung and set it up for him and it was phenomenal. It was a 6 string, but in comparison to a limited 1 of 9 Mike Shannon 7 string another freind down the hall had who said it was like a $9k guitar that I did a setup for, it was amizingly good. If you were to do new frets and put the hardware to German FLoyd and match the pickups like the Shannon had it would be basically just as good. I know, I know how it sounds, but this specific guitar was apparently built by some guy who was having a really good day or month or year or something. It was on par with it in just about every way. I'm sure the wood probably wasn't as high grade or whatever, but there are jems out there for sure.


----------



## bulb (Jan 29, 2020)

In my opinion guitars are kinda sick unless they aren’t, in which case they aren’t sick, unless they are.


----------



## narad (Jan 29, 2020)

Tuned said:


> ouch, that hurt. In my parts people would respond 'don't tell me what to do, I won't tell you where to go', but that's considered a very rude way to tell an arrogant comment off. But I don't want to sound rude; also, that would imply your comment was arrogant.
> I don't want that so I'll only say '_*please*_ don't tell me what to do, I *gladly *won't tell you where to go'.



Is this like an insult from Downton Abbey or some Jane Austen novel?


----------



## eggy in a bready (Jan 29, 2020)

Guitars are sick. The people who play them are fuckin whackkkk


----------



## Boris_VTR (Jan 29, 2020)

I'm interested in Loomis Pro model but price here is 1.5k EUR. Was kinda hoping to be more in 1.2k range.


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## manu80 (Jan 29, 2020)

1500 on thomann
Still it has the loomis pups and not some « designed by » shit
The caggiano should be around 1200
A bit expensive but cool specs still
May go for a washburn scott ian usa instead


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## r3tr0sp3ct1v3 (Jan 29, 2020)

bulb said:


> In my opinion guitars are kinda sick unless they aren’t, in which case they aren’t sick, unless they are.


I just saw that Thomann video with you talking about the blue strat. Is that thing going to be released to us plebians?


----------



## Tuned (Jan 29, 2020)

MrWulf said:


> You should go to your basement and huff more of your own farts. If you cant the stomach the thoughts of a brand releasing something that you dont like, dont look at it. Or better yet, dont buy it. It is a very simple process.
> 
> It is rather tiring to see another series of posts where people like you just bash a product and a manufacturer like they somehow scammed you out of your purchase when you havent even brought and play it. Maybe you should actually play guitar instead of fantasizing about doing so.



As people responded me concerning exact guitar posted here, and asked me questions, I answered them. All dedicated to this particular thread.

I will buy this brand, or another, as soon there is a guitar that I search for. Has _nothing to do _with bashing, because I hope Jackson make just a few more steps in the same direction they've done, so I buy one. This model was getting close but, unluckily, not too much. Other than this one, there is only the USA Jackson CB7, but they are rare (and with a Pro FR that implies a different string spacing). USA Jackson HT7 isn't as it does not have a FR.
I have a MIJ 7-string with a FR made in an ESP facility. My previous was an EBMM JP7 that I sold because it didn't have a FR (I even considered modding it for an OFR). I've owned MIA boutique basses, including one one-of-a-kind custom ordered by me, and one of their LE imports customized by their USA shop to my specs. I've owned 3 of their MIJ line basses built by ESP that aren't sold outside of Japan, and a few MIJ guitars that aren't either. Also a MIJ Jackson, and some other stuff.
But I want a _MIA Jackson 7 with an OFR_, preferrably a derivative of the Soloist.
I really hope this explains my first reaction and my answers to the further questions, and that there's no effing reason to chew on this any longer.

If it really aches to read (as it may happen to a person whose both consequent remarks are about fancying sniffing farts), there's really no need to trouble


----------



## Emperoff (Jan 29, 2020)

Woah, didn't see the Loomis Pro.

7 STRING, NAO!


----------



## cardinal (Jan 29, 2020)

FWIW @Tuned I spent around two years repeatedly asking Jackson and Charvel to make me a custom 7-string. They said "No." Over and over. It didn't matter what specs I wanted. They said no. It just is not happening unless one of their artists wants it to happen.

I moved on an ordered from a company that was more than happy to make the guitar (in my case, Schecter). No hard feelings to Jackson and Charvel. They do what they want to do. Just the way it is.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 29, 2020)

cardinal said:


> FWIW @Tuned I spent around two years repeatedly asking Jackson and Charvel to make me a custom 7-string. They said "No." Over and over. It didn't matter what specs I wanted. They said no. It just is not happening unless one of their artists wants it to happen.
> 
> I moved on an ordered from a company that was more than happy to make the guitar (in my case, *Schecter*). No hard feelings to Jackson and Charvel. They do what they want to do. Just the way it is.


now that you've mentioned))



I did consider a great MIA CS Schecter 7 just a bit less than $2500 but it was a hardtail so I let it go) Will look more to what they do, thanks!
As for Jackson and Charvel, it's kinda nostalgic as I started listening to metal in 80-ies. Like Horizons much, but the Soloist prevails in my heart


----------



## cardinal (Jan 29, 2020)

Tuned said:


> now that you've mentioned))
> View attachment 77090
> 
> 
> ...



for sure, I wanted a Charvel 7 because (1) I had one already that I loved and (2) I love the Strat headstock, so I really wanted a second one. But it just wasn't going to happen. I've now placed two custom orders with Schecter, and the quality is almost unbelievably good and the price is probably less than Charvel/Jackson anyway. It's not same headstock, but I got over it. The only way to get Jackson or Charvel to do it is (a) get endorsed or (b) lobby a current, big-time endorser to get a signature model of what you want. 

But the company is not taking suggestions from internet message boards or willing to make custom 7- or 8- strings from regular paying customers.


----------



## xzacx (Jan 29, 2020)

Tuned said:


> Other than this one, there is only the USA Jackson CB7, but they are rare (and with a Pro FR that implies a different string spacing).



Every once I've seen has a 1000 Pro, which as same spacing as an OFR. The German Pros are narrow.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 29, 2020)

xzacx said:


> Every once I've seen has a 1000 Pro, which as same spacing as an OFR. The German Pros are narrow.


Wow, it's getting a bit more complicated. It just says 'Floyd Rose Lo-Pro tremolo bridge' on the USA model page w/o the clarification or the string spacing detail, and the Pro CB7 which is not currently on the official site appears to have a Special, according to reviews.


----------



## c7spheres (Jan 29, 2020)

Tuned said:


> Wow, it's getting a bit more complicated. It just says 'Floyd Rose Lo-Pro tremolo bridge' on the USA model page w/o the clarification or the string spacing detail, and the Pro CB7 which is not currently on the official site appears to have a Special, according to reviews.


 If you go to FLoyd site under the drop down menu it says "Pro" then it branches off and says wide or narrow next to it. Then there's the7 string version which is only available in wide.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 29, 2020)

c7spheres said:


> If you go to FLoyd site under the drop down menu it says "Pro" then it branches off and says wide or narrow next to it. Then there's the7 string version which is only available in wide.


ah I see. thank you!


----------



## mastapimp (Jan 29, 2020)

Tuned said:


> Wow, it's getting a bit more complicated. It just says 'Floyd Rose Lo-Pro tremolo bridge' on the USA model page w/o the clarification or the string spacing detail, and the Pro CB7 which is not currently on the official site appears to have a Special, according to reviews.


I have a USA Broderick 7 with the pro and a USA WR7 with an offical trem and the spacing is nearly identical and i can't tell the difference when i play them. From the spec sheets on the floyd rose website, the difference between the two is just a hair under 0.5 mm with the pro being slightly narrower (64.50 vs 64.02 mm). I can borrow some digital calipers from work and compare just to be sure.


----------



## Tuned (Jan 30, 2020)

mastapimp said:


> I have a USA Broderick 7 with the pro and a USA WR7 with an offical trem and the spacing is nearly identical and i can't tell the difference when i play them. From the spec sheets on the floyd rose website, the difference between the two is just a hair under 0.5 mm with the pro being slightly narrower (64.50 vs 64.02 mm). I can borrow some digital calipers from work and compare just to be sure.


would be really great to know, thanks!


----------



## mastapimp (Jan 30, 2020)

Tuned said:


> would be really great to know, thanks!


Yeah, they're measuring up to the specs. The OFR is only 0.5mm wider than the Pro.


----------



## bulb (Jan 30, 2020)

r3tr0sp3ct1v3 said:


> I just saw that Thomann video with you talking about the blue strat. Is that thing going to be released to us plebians?



yes, but it’s a Masterbuilt custom shop strat and it’s priced appropriately, my main impetus for doing this was being able to snag one for myself, and my word it was worth it haha

If they judge the demand is there I hope we can justify the cost of tooling up for a USA model because goddamn I just love that guitar so much.


----------



## Albake21 (Jan 30, 2020)

bulb said:


> yes, but it’s a Masterbuilt custom shop strat and it’s priced appropriately, my main impetus for doing this was being able to snag one for myself, and my word it was worth it haha
> 
> If they judge the demand is there I hope we can justify the cost of tooling up for a USA model because goddamn I just love that guitar so much.


I'd definitely say the demand is there. Every single time I see it posted I see loads of people drooling over it, me in included haha. By the way, what's the neck like on it? Is it closer to a real Fender or closer to like a Charvel?


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3 (Jan 30, 2020)

bulb said:


> yes, but it’s a Masterbuilt custom shop strat and it’s priced appropriately, my main impetus for doing this was being able to snag one for myself, and my word it was worth it haha
> 
> If they judge the demand is there I hope we can justify the cost of tooling up for a USA model because goddamn I just love that guitar so much.



Yeah I mean it got my interest which can be pretty hard to do. I love 20 inch radius and love strats. The only reason I don't currently play strats is because I hate both compound radius and 9.5 radius. Flatter the better for me


----------



## Mattykoda (Jan 30, 2020)

bulb said:


> yes, but it’s a Masterbuilt custom shop strat and it’s priced appropriately, my main impetus for doing this was being able to snag one for myself, and my word it was worth it haha
> 
> If they judge the demand is there I hope we can justify the cost of tooling up for a USA model because goddamn I just love that guitar so much.



When you say priced appropriately, what are we talking here?


----------



## xzacx (Jan 30, 2020)

Mattykoda said:


> When you say priced appropriately, what are we talking here?


I think at least one other dealer got one too (they must by making a couple) and also sold it already. 

https://reverb.com/item/31362291-20...-misha-mansoor-so-cal-hss-namm-show-pre-order


----------



## cardinal (Jan 30, 2020)

I asked the Music Zoo if I could order a 7-string version, and... no response.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 30, 2020)

SSO: Fender are boring old people guitars that are too expensive and relic stuff is lame and cringey. 

Also SSO: HOLY FUCK I WANT A MISHA RELIC STRAT AND A JOHNSTON STRAT!!!

Man, this place sometimes.


----------



## c7spheres (Jan 30, 2020)

Mattykoda said:


> When you say priced appropriately, what are we talking here?


 $6 trilliion dollars ! !


----------



## Vyn (Jan 30, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Woah, didn't see the Loomis Pro.
> 
> 7 STRING, NAO!



Definitely hitting send on the Pro Loomis.


----------



## Boris_VTR (Jan 31, 2020)

Can't wait for Loomis Pro reviews. Hopefully guitars will be available soon.


----------



## Louis Cypher (Jan 31, 2020)

https://blog.jacksonguitars.com/a-d...tom-models-to-celebrate-our-40th-anniversary/

"A DOZEN STUNNING JACKSON CUSTOM MODELS TO CELEBRATE OUR 40TH ANNIVERSARY" 

Link Inc pics and details of the Misha strat and the rather cool Adrian Smith custom graphic too












RR Rhoads Custom





PC1 Walnut


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## bulb (Jan 31, 2020)

Mattykoda said:


> When you say priced appropriately, what are we talking here?


Msrp is 5999, no one pays MSRP of course so I’d guess in the 4-5k range.


----------



## narad (Jan 31, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> SSO: Fender are boring old people guitars that are too expensive and relic stuff is lame and cringey.
> 
> Also SSO: HOLY FUCK I WANT A MISHA RELIC STRAT AND A JOHNSTON STRAT!!!
> 
> Man, this place sometimes.



Hey man, I've been all over the 20" radius strat thing for like 5 years now (Navigator):






Looks like Misha's is floating though, which I would have preferred.


----------



## Musiscience (Jan 31, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> SSO: Fender are boring old people guitars that are too expensive and relic stuff is lame and cringey.
> 
> Also SSO: HOLY FUCK I WANT A MISHA RELIC STRAT AND A JOHNSTON STRAT!!!
> 
> Man, this place sometimes.



Couldn't have said it better haha.


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## Mattykoda (Jan 31, 2020)

narad said:


> Hey man, I've been all over the 20" radius strat thing for like 5 years now (Navigator):
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I couldn’t remember who’s NGD this was. I’ve wanted one of those since you posted it. That thing is such a beaut.


----------



## r3tr0sp3ct1v3 (Jan 31, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> SSO: Fender are boring old people guitars that are too expensive and relic stuff is lame and cringey.
> 
> Also SSO: HOLY FUCK I WANT A MISHA RELIC STRAT AND A JOHNSTON STRAT!!!
> 
> Man, this place sometimes.


So true. To be fair, I have never shit on fender. I have always loved their stuff. I just disliked the whole hype build up for the ultra series. My local store has some though and I would be lying if I said I didn't want one


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## AndiKravljaca (Jan 31, 2020)

For me the sad thing about Fender was that Leo was a tinkerer - he always wanted to improve on a design. He would consider every new model to be the replacement for the old one, and wanted to build new and better stuff all the time. The fact that the company which bears his name is the world champion at making time stand still, and market seventy year old designs as reissues and relics is a problem.

I don't mind the fact that people want these guitars, more power to them. I just think it's not what Leo would have wanted to do if he were running the place. He'd have been tinkering away, and coming up with new stuff.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 31, 2020)

AndiKravljaca said:


> For me the sad thing about Fender was that Leo was a tinkerer - he always wanted to improve on a design. He would consider every new model to be the replacement for the old one, and wanted to build new and better stuff all the time. The fact that the company which bears his name is the world champion at making time stand still, and market seventy year old designs as reissues and relics is a problem.
> 
> I don't mind the fact that people want these guitars, more power to them. I just think it's not what Leo would have wanted to do if he were running the place. He'd have been tinkering away, and coming up with new stuff.



If you look at the specs, hardware, and electronics of a Strat from each decade from the 1950's to 2020 they are almost completely different guitars. The silhouette hasn't changed (much), but just about everything else has. 

Leo died in the 90's. If you look across his later brands, Music Man and G&L, you'd see that he didn't just change things for the sake of it. He had no problem with subtle, meaningful changes.


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## StevenC (Jan 31, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> If you look at the specs, hardware, and electronics of a Strat from each decade from the 1950's to 2020 they are almost completely different guitars. The silhouette hasn't changed (much), but just about everything else has.
> 
> Leo died in the 90's. If you look across his later brands, Music Man and G&L, you'd see that he didn't just change things for the sake of it. He had no problem with subtle, meaningful changes.


I think what he's trying to say is that if Leo were still around we'd have a lot more 7 and 8 string Jazzmasters.


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## musicaldeath (Jan 31, 2020)

I really like everything about the relic strat and the idea behind it - a classic model with modern appointments to give it a modern feel with a classic sound. I'll 99% probably never get one, but it's a cool guitar for sure.


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## Mathemagician (Jan 31, 2020)

The ultras are GREAT. I’m not saying perfect. I’m saying that for $1800 USD new that’s a damn good guitar and I like it a lot.

But since that one thread I’m just waiting for an update on that Northlane pro series. A really cool collection of specs on a seven with a longer scale.

Patience. Patience. Patience.


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## Krazy Kalle (Jan 31, 2020)

zenonshandro said:


>




I hope one day they'll come in more "standard" finishes, I'm not a fan at all of these sand blasted stuff


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## Albake21 (Jan 31, 2020)

Krazy Kalle said:


> I hope one day they'll come in more "standard" finishes, I'm not a fan at all of these sand blasted stuff


Same, I'm hoping I can snag one for cheap on the used market in the future and then just get it refinished. It's funny, I loved the sandblasted look on Mayones guitars, but all of these new companies doing it just doesn't look as nice.


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## c7spheres (Jan 31, 2020)

I just realized the Dinky 7's have a 44.5mm nut width. To narrow. I'd want wider than the Ibanez 48mm already or the same. That's a deal breaker on these for me unfortunately.


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## Albake21 (Jan 31, 2020)

c7spheres said:


> I just realized the Dinky 7's have a 44.5mm nut width. To narrow. I'd want wider than the Ibanez 48mm already or the same. That's a deal breaker on these for me unfortunately.


1.75"? Is that a mistake? That's tiny and very close to being the size of a 6 string.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 31, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> 1.75"? Is that a mistake? That's tiny and very close to being the size of a 6 string.



The Charvel Nova is 44.45mm.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 31, 2020)

Welp, that's another FMIC 7-string I can't buy.


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## Mathemagician (Jan 31, 2020)

What the width on a JP7 for comparison? Those get praised for being comfortable/smaller.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Jan 31, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> What the width on a JP7 for comparison? Those get praised for being comfortable/smaller.



1 7/8''/47.5mm.


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## MaxOfMetal (Jan 31, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> What the width on a JP7 for comparison? Those get praised for being comfortable/smaller.



The JP7s are 47.6mm (1 7/8") so less than half a millimeter thinner than most 48mm 7s.


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## gunch (Jan 31, 2020)

I can't fault them for trying to cook up something new and trendy


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## mastapimp (Jan 31, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> 1.75"? Is that a mistake? That's tiny and very close to being the size of a 6 string.


I think there are a few mistakes. For example, the Davidson Warrior USA and Pro with ash top are listed at 1 7/8" while the new mahogany top one is listed at 1 3/4" although they're both equipped with the floyd-rose 7-string nut clamps, that to my knowledge, only come at 1 7/8" width.


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## oppgulp (Feb 2, 2020)

As always disappointed that they don't make a production model of the Death Angel. Maybe next year...


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## NotDonVito (Feb 2, 2020)

Jackson(I think?) made a prototype copy of the Ibanez egen18, but if it were to come out it would be next year at the earliest.


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## eaeolian (Feb 2, 2020)

bulb said:


> I didn’t even post here and it’s an absolute shitshow



NOW it's a shitshow.


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## Emperoff (Feb 2, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The Charvel Nova is 44.45mm.



Woah. That looks like too much. I understand that the standard 48mm could be trimmed down a bit for the sake of confort but cramming 7 strings into an almost 6-string nut must feel odd.

One of my sevens has a 46.5mm nut and it's hella comfy, but I'd definetely not want to go lower than that. Strings popping out of the fretboard can become an issue.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Woah. That looks like too much. I understand that the standard 48mm could be trimmed down a bit for the sake of confort but cramming 7 strings into an almost 6-string nut must feel odd.
> 
> One of my sevens has a 46.5mm nut and it's hella comfy, but I'd definetely not want to go lower than that. Strings popping out of the fretboard can become an issue.



The nut width is just that, the width of the nut. Stuff like string spacing and neck width will help define exactly what that means. 

So, try it out. It works for Angel, and there are Nova owners who seems happy with it. 

Folks get so wrapped up in raw specs. Guitars are far more than the sum of their measurements.


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## Emperoff (Feb 2, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Folks get so wrapped up in raw specs. Guitars are far more than the sum of their measurements.



Remember when people just went to stores and tried guitars to see if they liked them?


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Remember when people just went to stores and tried guitars to see if they liked them?



For real.


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## Albake21 (Feb 2, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Remember when people just went to stores and tried guitars to see if they liked them?


I mean, yeah I'd absolutely love to do this, but sadly every single store I've been to has nothing but cheap crap. Hence the reason why people get so granular with specs because ordering online is like playing roulette.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> I mean, yeah I'd absolutely love to do this, but sadly every single store I've been to has nothing but cheap crap. Hence the reason why people get so granular with specs because ordering online is like playing roulette.



Did you move out of Chicago? I'm about an hour and change away and we have access to some of the best shops full of rare and high end gear in the country, maybe the world. Definitely the best outside of LA and NYC.


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## Albake21 (Feb 2, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Did you move out of Chicago? I'm about an hour and change away and we have access to some of the best shops full of rare and high end gear in the country, maybe the world. Definitely the best outside of LA and NYC.


I'm in the city, but all I have is CME and Guitar Center. CME definitely has high end stuff, but typically catered to more traditional players. They do however get some more modern stuff in their used section every now and then. The guitar center by me is by far one of the best guitar centers I've been to, but sadly that still doesn't mean much. You're not wrong in that compared to other locations, I have a lot here. Still, that doesn't mean I can try most of the things I am actually after.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> I'm in the city, but all I have is CME and Guitar Center. CME definitely has high end stuff, but typically catered to more traditional players. They do however get some more modern stuff in their used section every now and then. The guitar center by me is by far one of the best guitar centers I've been to, but sadly that still doesn't mean much. You're not wrong in that compared to other locations, I have a lot here. Still, that doesn't mean I can try most of the things I am actually after.



Definitely consider taking a trip to Chondro Guitars. It's probably about a two hour drive for you, they have tons of high end/custom ESP, Jackson, Charvel, Ibanez, Dean, Mayones, etc.


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## Albake21 (Feb 2, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> Definitely consider taking a trip to Chondro Guitars. It's probably about a two hour drive for you, they have tons of high end/custom ESP, Jackson, Charvel, Ibanez, Dean, Mayones, etc.


Ah I totally forgot about Chondro Guitars, I've bought pickups from them before. Never realized how close they were so I'll definitely have to make it up there one of these days.


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## Emperoff (Feb 2, 2020)

Albake21 said:


> Ah I totally forgot about Chondro Guitars, I've bought pickups from them before. Never realized how close they were so I'll definitely have to make it up there one of these days.



Randall goes the extra mile for their customers. Can't recommend his store enough, specially regarding Jackson.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 2, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> The nut width is just that, the width of the nut. Stuff like string spacing and neck width will help define exactly what that means.
> 
> So, try it out. It works for Angel, and there are Nova owners who seems happy with it.
> 
> Folks get so wrapped up in raw specs. Guitars are far more than the sum of their measurements.



To this point, Kirk Hammet used a 42mm nut on a 43mm neck. It gave narrower strings spacing and left you with enough FB to not pull strings off the edge.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> To this point, Kirk Hammet used a 42mm nut on a 43mm neck. It gave narrower strings spacing and left you with enough FB to not pull strings off the edge.



It probably didn't do a whole lot. 

The bridge was still "standard" spaced, meaning the geometry only influenced the first few frets in any meaningful way, and by the time you hit the mid point it was practically indistinguishable. 

Spacing wise, you're looking at a difference of about 1/10th of a millimeter between the usual 42mm and 43mm locking nuts. 

It's important to remember, nut width is not string width (E to E).


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## narad (Feb 2, 2020)

Are there any clips of Misha's strat model? Curious what it sounds like with the ragnarok in the bridge.

Tangent, but wasn't "ragnarok" so much cooler as a final fantasy term than it is now as a marvel movie term?


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## couverdure (Feb 2, 2020)

NotDonVito said:


> Jackson(I think?) made a prototype copy of the Ibanez egen18, but if it were to come out it would be next year at the earliest.


Is that the one next to his PRS and Abasi that Herman shared on Twitter?















He also responded to a tweet identifying that it's a Jackson and he seems to be positive that it is.


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## Vyn (Feb 2, 2020)

couverdure said:


> Is that the one next to his PRS and Abasi that Herman shared on Twitter?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's also got a VERY interesting bridge on it...


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 2, 2020)

Vyn said:


> It's also got a VERY interesting bridge on it...



It's a CSL Sophia. The trem everyone says is "the future" but doesn't want to buy.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 3, 2020)

More of that PRS as well please.


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## cardinal (Feb 3, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> Randall goes the extra mile for their customers. Can't recommend his store enough, specially regarding Jackson.



Randall's a good dude. Recommended.


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## diagrammatiks (Feb 3, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's a CSL Sophia. The trem everyone says is "the future" but doesn't want to buy.



I'm buying a few. doesn't really help them that they are like 375 dollars each.


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## Fred the Shred (Feb 3, 2020)

Problem with the CSL stuff is really the pricing - who wants to fork out almost 400 bucks for a trem that is competing with a good old FR type that is known to deliver the goods like the Schaller or Gotoh stuff? I found them pretty great, mind you, and there's a lot of attention to every aspect of its design and functionality, but at that price I doubt they'll have manufacturers running to them even at OEM rates if they follow the norm.


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## eaeolian (Feb 3, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> It's a CSL Sophia. The trem everyone says is "the future" but doesn't want to buy.



Their blocks are the tits, though.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 3, 2020)

I spec’d a CSL bridge with all the features and it came out to $500+. The base version is just under $400. It looks brilliant but not something I would expect to see on a sub-$2-2.5k guitar. There’s a guy with several mayones with them installed and it looks VERY futuristic/different.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 3, 2020)

I don't think the price is that bad. It's between $100 and $175 more expensive than an OFR. Folks spend that much on off the shelf pickups and TS9 clones. 

I guess I'm just surprised that they're still such a novelty given the feature set.

Though I suppose bridge swaps aren't as common as they used to be.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 3, 2020)

I would imagine it only hitting existing guitar prices by $15-200 more than a current Floyd model. 

But if you’re a manufacturer trying to hit a price point, taking an $1099 model and charging $1299 makes it harder to move units in a price-sensitive bracket. Above a certain prices there is more leeway for ~$150.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 3, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> I would imagine it only hitting existing guitar prices by $15-200 more than a current Floyd model.
> 
> But if you’re a manufacturer trying to hit a price point, taking an $1099 model and charging $1299 makes it harder to move units in a price-sensitive bracket. Above a certain prices there is more leeway for ~$150.



When did we start talking about guitars that cheap? 

It's on what would probably be a $6k+ Masterbuilt.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 3, 2020)

I originally said $2.5k in my posts.


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## MaxOfMetal (Feb 3, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> I originally said $2.5k in my posts.



Yeah, but why? We're talking about high end stuff. I don't think anyone is making the argument for the Sophia on cheaper guitars.


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## diagrammatiks (Feb 3, 2020)

MaxOfMetal said:


> I don't think the price is that bad. It's between $100 and $175 more expensive than an OFR. Folks spend that much on off the shelf pickups and TS9 clones.
> 
> I guess I'm just surprised that they're still such a novelty given the feature set.
> 
> Though I suppose bridge swaps aren't as common as they used to be.



there's a Chinese guitar maker that has those trems on headless guitars that are like 600. I'm seriously thinking about buying them and stripping out the hardware.


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## Mathemagician (Feb 3, 2020)

Is it an actual CSL, or a Chinese knock-off?


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## cardinal (Feb 3, 2020)

I tried to order an 8-string CSL trem a while back and was surprised when they said they didn't make them. I just kinda assumed they would given the futuristic nature of the product, etc., but nope. It looks neat, though I'm not sure how you set the intonation. I fear it's something like the old Schaller Fender trem where you have to pull the bridge out to loosen set screws on the underside. 

I really like the idea of their spring plate or whatever it's called. Seems so simple but it could be a nice, no-brainer trem stabilizer.


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## diagrammatiks (Feb 3, 2020)

Mathemagician said:


> Is it an actual CSL, or a Chinese knock-off?



actual csl. I've been talking to them a lot in the last few months. 

Like I would buy the guitar and change out the hardware for cheaper hardware. but then I've be left with one good guitar and one weird guitar. eh.

The thing is though that headless wise there's only like 4 options for headless multi scale trems and they are all around the same price. So the CSL isn't that out there for that purpose. gonna order a couple of things when I'm not living a real life version of a apocalypse movie.


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## gunch (Feb 3, 2020)

Herman Li making PRS _and_ Jackson build their own take on a Saber? 

Color me interested.


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## Emperoff (Feb 4, 2020)

gunch said:


> Herman Li making PRS _and_ Jackson build their own take on a Saber?
> 
> Color me interested.



You mean a Jackson Stealth? They're like 30 years old by now. You can satisfy your curiosity quite easily on Reverb.


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## gunch (Feb 4, 2020)

Emperoff said:


> You mean a Jackson Stealth? They're like 30 years old by now. You can satisfy your curiosity quite easily on Reverb.




You’re right I don’t know why Stealth/SLS completely slipped my brain meat. This looks like it has the more bevely soloist top though


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## works0fheart (Feb 16, 2020)

Thought some of you might be interested in this. Can't say I'm a huge fan of a lot of guitars to come out this year, but I've gotta give Mick props for the attention to detail he put into designing his.


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## HeHasTheJazzHands (Feb 16, 2020)

Mick is gear nerdy as fuck and I love him for it. Knows exactly what he wants and loves.


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