# Baritone Strings WTF?



## Infinite Recursion (Jul 28, 2011)

So a longer scale increases tension. Heavier strings also increase tension. Then why the hell does every manufacturer ship their baritones with heavy strings? (i.e. LP baritone with a 28" scale and .60-.something tuned to C). I must be missing something.


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## myampslouder (Jul 28, 2011)

Dude I wonder the same thing. I also wonder why you cant buy a set of strings for a seven string guitar with a decent sized low B but a baritone set for a longer guitar comes with the perfect sized low b


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## Triple-J (Jul 28, 2011)

My Epiphone lp baritone came with 11-56 my Yamaha baritone with 12-62 and my Fender Squier baritone with 12-64 and they were all tuned to B standard so it does seem like companies just throw on whatever they feel like but I think it's because they don't really know what players are using really.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 28, 2011)

myampslouder said:


> Dude I wonder the same thing. I also wonder why you cant buy a set of strings for a seven string guitar with a decent sized low B but a baritone set for a longer guitar comes with an oversized low B and retardedly huge everything else.



fixed!


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## simulclass83 (Jul 28, 2011)




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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 28, 2011)

Exactly, unless your tuning to like F# standard that's completely unnecessary.


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## Metal_Webb (Jul 28, 2011)

simulclass83 said:


>



wow, someone must have gone through a spare strings bucket to pick that set out. It'd be one "interesting" tension profile for those strings even in F# standard.


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## Dayn (Jul 28, 2011)

Perhaps we're simply the odd ones out. Maybe a baritone guitar means a guitar with heavier strings and a longer scale so it has more of a 'bass' tonal quality to it?

Either way, that doesn't excuse them, nor does it excuse the crazy tension ranges in one pre-packaged set.


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## leonardo7 (Jul 28, 2011)

Believe it or not longer scale guitars are actually meant for heavier gauge strings. If you want to use thicker gauges it actually makes more sense to use a longer scale guitar cause it can handle thicker gauges better. Its meant for it. Yes you get more tension but its also easier to put thicker gauges on a baritone than a normal scale. Think about it, a bass is long scale and uses way thicker gauges when the logic would be to use thinner ones right? A .066 gauge intonates way better on my 27" than on my 25.5".


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## Hemi-Powered Drone (Jul 28, 2011)

Also the thicker strings ring out clearer when longer.


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## notasian (Jul 28, 2011)

hahahaah i juse got my ernie ball baritone strings today!!! haha i put them on my agile pendulum pro 6, i have it in G# standard but i can go down to f# or even E but its wobbly. the 72 for G# is pretty much perfect its really tight and gjenty lol


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## Meatbucket (Jul 28, 2011)

I use .14-.68 for drop G# on my 6. Feels good, man.


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## Oceans (Jul 28, 2011)

They're good for drop A but it would be really tight. The band Nile I think uses these strings, I think they have it to where the top strings have heavy gauge and the bottom ones have light gauge.


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## BigPhi84 (Jul 28, 2011)

Infinite Recursion said:


> So a longer scale increases tension. Heavier strings also increase tension. Then why the hell does every manufacturer ship their baritones with heavy strings? (i.e. LP baritone with a 28" scale and .60-.something tuned to C). I must be missing something.







I'm confused by what you're asking.

_"So a longer scale increases tension." _

Relatively speaking yes. If you had a 24.75" scale guitar tuned to E and a 28" scale guitar tuned to E, the 28" guitar will have much more tension. The thing is, that 28" scale guitar is meant to be tuned a LOT lower than E standard. Taken from the LP Baritone ad.
_
"The Gibson Les Paul Studio Baritone can be tuned either in a B to B set-up, or an extra low A to A tuning."_

Imagine the bottom six strings on a seven string guitar and .13-.60 doesn't seem out of place at all. I know some people on here that use a .70 or .80 for their B string to maintain the tension that they like on a 25" or 27" scale!!! .60 on a 28" tuned to A is reasonable. 

Funny story, when I went through my Jimi Hendrix phase back in 1999, I strung my Stratocaster with .13-62s in E Standard!!! Yeah, bends were terribly hard, but otherwise, it didn't play much differently.


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## danieluber1337 (Jul 29, 2011)

myampslouder said:


> Dude I wonder the same thing. I also wonder why you cant buy a set of strings for a seven string guitar with a decent sized low B but a baritone set for a longer guitar comes with the perfect sized low b



Elixir...

ALSO - has nobody heard of a baritone guitar?  The bottom one or two strings are tuned very low to give it a bass sound... or did I just not read the posts before mine very carefully?


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## yingmin (Jul 29, 2011)

Dayn said:


> Perhaps we're simply the odd ones out. Maybe a baritone guitar means a guitar with heavier strings and a longer scale so it has more of a 'bass' tonal quality to it?


It's worth keeping in mind that a Bass VI is considered a "baritone" guitar, even though it's tuned a full octave lower than a standard guitar, thus putting it only a full step lower than the lowest six strings of an 8-string.

I never thought I'd see SS.org complaining about strings being TOO heavy.


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## Dayn (Jul 29, 2011)

yingmin said:


> It's worth keeping in mind that a Bass VI is considered a "baritone" guitar, even though it's tuned a full octave lower than a standard guitar, thus putting it only a full step lower than the lowest six strings of an 8-string.
> 
> I never thought I'd see SS.org complaining about strings being TOO heavy.


We get all kinds, it seems. I'm one for the lightest strings possible.


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## JamesM (Jul 29, 2011)

simulclass83 said:


>



I use this and put a .010 on top for Drop G# on my Loomis.

Fuck yeah, it's nice.


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## johnythehero (Jul 29, 2011)

Dayn said:


> We get all kinds, it seems. I'm one for the lightest strings possible.


I like diffrent tightnesses for diffent tunings. i.e. I use .8s or .9s for standered while for B I use the already mentioned ernie ball baritone set. and for F# standered I use 11 + the baritone set .


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## Infinite Recursion (Jul 29, 2011)

I'm saying that it if increases tension, wouldn't you ship it with strings that are lighter to maintain the same amount of tension as you would normally (i.e. if you put on .56 for a C at 25.5 you would put something lighter then that for C at 28), but through the use of lighter strings and a longer scale get better clarity? Isn't that the point of a baritone guitar?


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## Poparad (Jul 29, 2011)

Infinite Recursion said:


> I'm saying that it if increases tension, wouldn't you ship it with strings that are lighter to maintain the same amount of tension as you would normally (i.e. if you put on .56 for a C at 25.5 you would put something lighter then that for C at 28), but through the use of lighter strings and a longer scale get better clarity? Isn't that the point of a baritone guitar?



"Baritone" refers to the range that an instrument or voice uses. A true baritone guitar is simply a guitar that is tuned lower than a normal guitar, but not quite as low as a bass. To compensate for the lower tuning, both thicker strings and a longer scale are usually employed to keep the strings sounding crisp and clear.


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## TRENCHLORD (Jul 29, 2011)

Torque tension and percieved tension can be two different things all together.
For instance; Imagine a barbed wire fence torqued to 500 pounds pull pressure. 
Now, imagine it's pulled tight over a distance of 20 yards from corner post to corner post.
Now, if you were to place one "in-between post" about 2/3 of the way down, at about the 13 yard mark, which section would feel tighter if trying to bend the wire down or up?
Of coarse the 7yrd stretch of wire would move less, and the 13yrd stretch (the ERG), even though it's torqued to identical tension, would "seem to be" much looser.
With guitars the difference is more like 5% or 10%, but the concept still applies.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 29, 2011)

^I noticed something along these lines on my multiscale, 15lbs on the 27" scale doesn't feel like 15lbs on 25.5".

But its not something begging for an extra 500lbs, its something that you'd go up .002 or .004 to fix.


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## BigPhi84 (Jul 29, 2011)

Infinite Recursion said:


> I'm saying that it if increases tension, wouldn't you ship it with strings that are lighter to maintain the same amount of tension as you would normally



Ok, well, first off, this guitar is supposed to be tuned from B-B or A-A, so if you wanted to tune to C-C, obviously, it would make sense to consider changing the stock set of strings to something a little lighter. 

On my 25.5" guitars, I typically use .10's for E standard, .11's for D standard. If I was going to tune to C Standard, I'd probably go with a .12-.60, and B standard would be .13-.65.





Infinite Recursion said:


> _through the use of lighter strings and a longer scale get better clarity? Isn't that the point of a baritone guitar?_



Maybe you are confusing extended scale with baritone scale. I don't consider anything under 28" to be baritone scale. 26.5" Schecter 7's and 27" XL Ibanez guitars can still be tuned to E standard. I have an RG1077XL and I use .09's on it since my usual .10's felt so tight. In that case, yeah, I'm using a smaller gauge string.

The point of a baritone guitar is be able to have a 6-string guitar that can play in the 7 or 8 string range, or lower. Someone mentioned the Fender VI... that is tuned one whole octave below E Standard!  Of course, the Fender is 30" scale length.

Sorry, if this comes out all douchey. I have a hard time trying to explain stuff over the internets.


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## myampslouder (Jul 29, 2011)

In my earlier post I was mainly referring to D'Addario.

The typical D'addario seven string set of 10's comes with an undersized .059 Low B which is has way less tension on a regular non baritone 7






But the Baritone set which is intended for use on a much longer scale guitar comes with a .062 low B which is a m much better balance in tension than the similar set for a 7 string. Even though both are meant for tuning to B. 







If you look at the gauges Everything is the same except for the Low B and of course the lack of a .010 for the high e in the baritone set. 

I actually use the baritone set on my fixed bridge 7 strings because it is a better matched set than the actual D'addario seven set. I just buy a .010 seperate


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## Lukifer (Jul 29, 2011)

I had the same questions. I just got a schecter 6stringer baritone. Of course its 26.5, which seems way short for a supposed "baritone". I want to play in standard b so what gauges are suited beat for it?? For normal tension a 24.75 has in e is what I'm shooting for.


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## myampslouder (Jul 29, 2011)

I would try a regular D'addario 12-54 set


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## Lukifer (Jul 29, 2011)

I bought some Ernie ball 11-54 and was gonna try those, but I think the 12-56 would be better. Drop A would be tighter then. Hmmm.


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## The Reverend (Jul 29, 2011)

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/be...per-thread-got-string-question-post-here.html

That's one of the first things I read when I joined the site. It's a sticky, for Christ's sake!


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## Lukifer (Jul 29, 2011)

Yeah but everything I post a question it never gets answered. As with lots of questions other people ask.


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## myampslouder (Jul 29, 2011)

11-56 might be just what you want. I run 9-58 on my 25.5 seven for B standard so with the longer scale on your schecter that should feel pretty good


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## Lukifer (Jul 29, 2011)

Thanks! I'll string them up this weekend and report back.


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## CD1221 (Jul 29, 2011)

I use a .070 on the B on my 7. not sure what the fuss is about. *shrugs*


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 29, 2011)

Not everyone likes their guitar to play / sound like a bass.


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## signalgrey (Jul 29, 2011)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> Not everyone likes their guitar to play / sound like a bass.



ok not only do I use the Ernie Ball baritone strings, I use them on a 30" scale baritone guitar, tuned to B standard. I can tell you with all the certainty in the world, that not only is it easy to bend these strings, but the whole guitar sounds NOTHING like a bass. It sounds like...a low tuned guitar.


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## bostjan (Jul 29, 2011)

I want my guitar to sound like a guitar *and* a bass playing in unison.


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## Lukifer (Jul 29, 2011)

Im new to the whole ERG guitar thing so gonna experiment and take advice and all that so this is all good stuff! My only thing is if I Wanted to use a .70 I would just use my EC-1000 for B-B.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 29, 2011)

signalgrey said:


> ok.



I wonder what a .074 gauge ernie ball string sounds like on a short scale (30") bass tuned to B* hmm 

The world may never know.


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## UnderTheSign (Jul 30, 2011)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> Not everyone likes their guitar to play / sound like a bass.


That's what all the Fender guys say when you start mumbling about 8-strings, too!


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## 77zark77 (Jul 30, 2011)

myampslouder said:


>


 
My preference for my RG6CSD2 (27" B to B)


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 30, 2011)

UnderTheSign said:


> That's what all the Fender guys say when you start mumbling about 8-strings, too!



Big difference between a .074 tuned to F# on a 27" or 28" scale, and a .074 tuned to B on a 30" scale.

To get the equivalent you would need to use a .062 gauge string on your low E of a standard tuned 25.5" guitar to get comparable tension.


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## Dvaienat (Jul 30, 2011)

Leonardo7 answered the question, but here is my take. 

Basically the reasoning behind your question is that a longer scale length requires thicker strings for correct intonation. That is why a bass uses 45-105 gauges, when on a 34" you could easily use a 74 for correct tension. Longer scale = thicker strings is basically the logic.


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## Explorer (Jul 30, 2011)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> I wonder what a .074 gauge ernie ball string sounds like on a short scale (30") bass tuned to B* hmm
> 
> The world may never know.



Assuming that the Fender VI in the following track is strung normally...



...you can at least know what a 30" .072 B sounds like.The bass tones and baritone guitar tones are pretty distinctive... and the Fender sounds like a guitar. 

Until recently, I always wondered about the assertions that thicker strings immediately led to an instrument sounding like a bass. I started up a thread in the bass section, asking actual bass players about this assertion. I'm now convinced that a lot of guitarists don't know how a normal bass tone sounds. I'm also convinced that bass tone comes from tension more than from string thickness, with bass tensions normally double those of guitar.

----

Regarding why people don't answer incomplete questions... I've noticed that a lot of people ask what strings they should use, but just assume that others know what tension they're aiming for. Telling people what instrument you're going to be using lets everyone know the destination, but not telling them where you're starting from (scale length, tuning, full string set beyond listing just one string) means that you're just asking people to cover a lot of bases and to ask a lot of clarifying questions. I sometimes remind people to give more details, but every time I open that thread I just don't feel like typing that out.

Maybe I'll do so now, though.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Jul 30, 2011)

Explorer said:


> I'm also convinced that bass tone comes from tension more than from string thickness, with bass tensions normally double those of guitar.



a .074 gauge string at 30" in B is like 31lbs... basically twice the tension the average guitarist uses for any given string.

It comes from a few things but Imo* the biggest 3 are string brand, technique, and amp / eq. 

Elixir nanowebs on my 5 string bass thats right behind me along with a pick could fool anyone into thinking I was playing a guitar, DR extra life strings on my 7 string multiscale finger picked can fool people into thinking I was playing a bass.

Even the elixir strings on my 7 string can trick people into thinking its a bass if I finger pick it / slap it the right way. Basically once your delving so far into the bass range that you need bass sized strings that HAVE to be double wound it starts sounding a lot like a bass.

Its just gonna happen.

Like I said before, the comparable string is a .062 in E2 (your standard low E) on a 25.5" guitar. Slap that thing on there and tell me how guitar like it sounds, it won't.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 31, 2011)

myampslouder said:


> In my earlier post I was mainly referring to D'Addario.
> 
> The typical D'addario seven string set of 10's comes with an undersized .059 Low B which is has way less tension on a regular non baritone 7
> 
> ...



These are my thoughts almost word-for-word. I've even emailed D'Addario on the subject...twice. The first time, which was almost 4 years ago, this is the response I got:



> Hello!
> 
> The EXL158 is for Baritone guitar. The application of the instrument by
> design, is different than that of a 7-string. I suppose you can
> ...



I never received responses to my response to that email, OR to the one I sent last summer on the same subject, expanded to the COMPLETE lack of sense in the 8-string set they provided for Schecter (who has since switched to Ernie Ball strings, of the same useless gauges, now available as the 8-string Slinky set).

Here's what I sent to them, in response to their "answer" to my original email:



> I'm sorry, but that really tells me nothing at all. Obviously a baritone or otherwise low-tuned 6-string guitar is intended for low tunings, normally on an extended-scale instrument, but on 7-string guitars, you have exactly the same pitch (assuming standard tuning), and many of the most common models are your standard 25.5" scale length, so if anything, I'd think that the lower strings should be getting heavier for the same pitch as on a guitar with the extended scale. Not to mention the fact that there are a good number of extended-scale 7-string guitars on the market now, as well.
> 
> Obviously, strings can be bought individually and mixed & matched, but I don't like the fact that I had to spend more to get the 158 set plus a single .010 than I would to get the 110-7 set, which is exactly the same other than the one string.
> 
> I also find it interesting that the guage of the 2nd string in the 158 set is not adjusted for the different tuning, relative to that same guage's tuning on a 7-string.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 1, 2011)

You need to whip out some tension calculators based on daddario's very own calculations, since on the back of every single on of their packages they advertise how unbalanced and nonsensical all of their packs are.


Smart guys who probably play nothing but blues and heavily blues driven rock making sets for baritone and extended ranged guitarists.... what a joke.


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## nunonaos (Aug 1, 2011)

ok, this is a great string tension calculator:
String Guage and Tension Calculator - Version 0.1.4 - 26 apr 1998

here's an example for a 7 string guitar with 27'' scale tunned to drop A
E4 .009" PL == 14.72#
B3 .012" PL == 14.69#
G3 .015" PL == 14.46#
D3 .021" PB == 14.57#
A2 .028" PB == 14.72#
E2 .039" PB == 15.96#
A1 .056" PB == 14.5#

another example, this time for 8 string, with a low A and a high A (low to high A E A D G B E A )
A4 .007" PL == 15.87#
E4 .009" PL == 14.72#
B3 .012" PL == 14.69#
G3 .015" PL == 14.46#
D3 .021" PB == 14.57#
A2 .028" PB == 14.72#
E2 .039" PB == 15.96#
A1 .056" PB == 14.5#

by the way, daddario sells individual strings and they're not too expensive, those 8 strings i mentioned would cost under 15&#8364;.


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 1, 2011)

^Was meaning during a letter to daddario... we all know how to use calcs here...

We all also know about the individual strings... its just annoying having to piece together a set that costs more money than just being able to buy a pre-packaged set that has correct gauges. There's absolutely no reason for them to intentionally put out unbalanced sets.


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## Dayn (Aug 1, 2011)

nunonaos said:


> ok, this is a great string tension calculator:
> String Guage and Tension Calculator - Version 0.1.4 - 26 apr 1998


Just remember to change the PB to NW: you'd want the tension of the nickel-wound strings, not the phosphor bronze acoustic strings. So:

len 27"
A4 .007" PL == 15.87#
E4 .009" PL == 14.72#
B3 .012" PL == 14.69#
G3 .015" PL == 14.46#
D3 .021" NW == 13.51#
A2 .028" NW == 13.4#
E2 .039" NW == 14.33#
A1 .056" NW == 13.16#


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 1, 2011)

Cheesebuiscut said:


> You need to whip out some tension calculators based on daddario's very own calculations, since on the back of every single on of their packages they advertise how unbalanced and nonsensical all of their packs are.
> 
> 
> Smart guys who probably play nothing but blues and heavily blues driven rock making sets for baritone and extended ranged guitarists.... what a joke.





I emailed D'Addario again last night after posting in this thread, and did exactly that 

I got a response this afternoon, apologizing for never giving me a good answer, and said they'd take some time to "delve into it" and get back to me tomorrow.


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## Greatoliver (Aug 2, 2011)

Just like to leave this here....:







A bit OT, but I think this is the only balanced set I have seen. It's always confused me why 10s are so unbalanced.

On topic: I agree about how baritone sets don't make sense... In fact, most string sets that companies put out (especially for 7strings) are bizarre


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## Hemi-Powered Drone (Aug 2, 2011)

To be honest I like my sets to be a bit unbalanced, very light unwound strings, heavy wounds.


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## Greatoliver (Aug 2, 2011)

dragonblade629 said:


> To be honest I like my sets to be a bit unbalanced, very light unwound strings, heavy wounds.



They don't balance like that however:

E .010" PL == 16.21#
B, .013" PL == 15.38#
G, .017" pl == 16.57#
D, .026" nw == 18.41#
A,, .036" nw == 19.54#
E,, .046" nw == 17.48#
total == 103.59#

While the wound are heavier, there is over 2 pounds tension between the A and the E string...


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 2, 2011)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> I emailed D'Addario again last night after posting in this thread, and did exactly that
> 
> I got a response this afternoon, apologizing for never giving me a good answer, and said they'd take some time to "delve into it" and get back to me tomorrow.



Awesome! I'd like to see what good answer they come up with 

Or maybe it'll start a revolution and things will actually get fixed!


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 2, 2011)

They got back to me today, apologizing that they didn't have an answer yet, but that hopefully they could establish closure tomorrow


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 3, 2011)

Wow, that's impressive. No joke to take the time to write out the message at all not to keep you waiting.

Well shit. Good for you d'addario, good for you.


edit:


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 3, 2011)

BTW, if anyone feels like reading my (long and detailed) letter to D'Addario:



> Hi, my name is Ari Goldberger, and I'm a salesman for Daddy's Junky Music in Boston. I've emailed a couple times before about this, but I've never received an actual answer. About 4 years ago, I noticed a strange inconsistency with the gauges in a couple of D'Addario's string sets.
> 
> Here's my original question, from 2007: "I was just curious why the EXL-110-7 set comes with a .059 for the low
> B, while the EXL-158 set comes with a .062 for the low B, while the rest
> ...


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## Cheesebuiscut (Aug 7, 2011)

Sooooooo...


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## Captain Shoggoth (Aug 7, 2011)

The plot thickens!

Seriously though, I'm also waiting for an answer, and I think your gauges are spot on (apart from maybe the high E and B I'd change to an .09 and a .12 'cause I like 'em loose haha)


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 7, 2011)

Still waiting on an answer. Last I heard, there was a particular person they were trying to get in touch with for an answer. Maybe sometime this week.


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## MTech (Aug 7, 2011)

myampslouder said:


> In my earlier post I was mainly referring to D'Addario.
> 
> The typical D'addario seven string set of 10's comes with an undersized .059 Low B which is has way less tension on a regular non baritone 7
> 
> But the Baritone set which is intended for use on a much longer scale guitar comes with a .062 low B which is a m much better balance in tension than the similar set for a 7 string. Even though both are meant for tuning to B.




You only have that problem because you're not looking in the right places or at the right brands...That's why you just buy one of THESE sets. 

In defense of a smaller Low string though I will say that's why Pat Martino has 15g strings on his guitars but a relatively light low E compared to the rest of the set...because he plays hard and the larger low string is more boomy......so perhaps they're thinking of sound that way rather than merely focusing on tension...


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 8, 2011)

Here's what I heard from D'Addario about their strings. If you have any thoughts on this, please let D'Addario know, because it sounds like they're willing to listen to suggestions. Anything in a quote box is from my original email.


Hello Ari, thank you for your detailed and passionate message regarding our string gauges. String development is a combination of science and art, there are no right and wrong answers, and as you know from your own experience, personal choice and preference also factor in. In have been involved over the years in some of the products in question, not in others, but I think I can give you some background and perspective. Whether or not you agree or like the answers is TBD, but at least you will see how things have progressed. Also, keep in mind that the market changes, guitars change, styles change, hardware changes, scales change, etc. so whats good for today is not always good for tomorrow or the past. That said, here are some explanations and rationale. 



We appreciate your insight and point of view, so if you are interested, well keep you in mind for future changes or development projects and put you on the beta list.



Thanks,



Brian Vance

Director of Product Management





> Hi, my name is Ari Goldberger, and I'm a salesman for Daddy's Junky Music in Boston. I've emailed a couple times before about this, but I've never received an actual answer. About 4 years ago, I noticed a strange inconsistency with the gauges in a couple of D'Addario's string sets. Here's my original question, from 2007: "I was just curious why the EXL-110-7 set comes with a .059 for the low B, while the EXL-158 set comes with a .062 for the low B, while the rest of the latter set's strings are the same guages as the 2nd through 6th in the 7-string set. Why the inconsistency?



The 110-7 set was designed in the 90s with input from the guitar manufacturers and early adopter players. We did increase the low B gauge in the past few years due to people complaining about the 056. The 059 was chosen based on player input and what people were using out there in the real world. Perhaps we didnt have enough feedback, but players responded positively when we made the change. As I said, things change, so perhaps were not as in touch with the 7-string market as we should be. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

As far as the Baritone goes, it too was created based on an amalgamation of various modern baritone guitar makers (Ibanez, Schecter, ESP, etc.) and what gauges there were using from the factory. There is/was no standard, but the gauges in the 158 set were designed to be as close as possible to a factory replacement set from the major builders. Theres not enough demand and market there to offer a special set for every guitar maker, I wish there was, if so wed market all of the sets we could. Also, there is some truth to the fact that the scale length changes the tension and feel of the string, the way one gauge feels on a longer scale guitar can be different than on a shorter scale, even if tuned to the same pitch. We took advisement from our trusted guitar building partners in order to maximize the applicability of a single replacement gauge for longer scale (but not as long as traditional baritone electrics) baritones.



> I think the .062 would be a good fit in the EXL-110-7. Thanks" The "answer" I received was as follows: "Hello! The EXL158 is for Baritone guitar. The application of the instrument by design, is different than that of a 7-string. I suppose you can experiment with different combo's. But, the set's are designed in a particular manner, based on most common application. Thanks for your email. Best of luck! Mark Roldan Consumer & Artist Customer Service Supervisor D'Addario & Company, Inc. Over 100 Years Of Excellence." Now...this answer reeks of someone who had no idea what they were talking about. As far as I can tell, there is no reason why the gauge for the low B string shouldn't be the same between the two sets. Every gauge in the EXL-158 set matches the EXL-110 and EXL-110-7 sets, except that the low B string is annoyingly light in the 110-7 set (although, admittedly an improvement over the .056 gauge string used in the earlier versions of that same set). Interestingly, there is no compensation for the fact that the 2nd string on a typical baritone guitar tuned to B standard would be tuned to F#, while the 3rd string on a typical 7-string guitar tuned to standard would be tuned to G...but you've included the same gauge. Considering that D'Addario is the ONE major guitar and bass string manufacturer who actually provides tension information for their strings, and also now has the EXL-111 set, with the more balanced gauges than the 110 set, I don't understand this inconsistency. Using D'Addario's own tension guide, we can see that the NW046 tuned to E on a 25.5" scale guitar has 17.5lbs of tension, while the NW059 tuned to B on the same guitar comes up at 16.4lbs, and the NW062 also tuned to B on that same guitar will be 18.1lbs. I, and many of my fellow 7 and 8-string players, as well as my customers at Daddy's, would prefer to err on the side of MORE tension for the lower strings...something also evidenced by the fact that many string manufacturers make light top/heavy bottom sets available, and you pretty much never see a heavy top/light bottom set around. As both a player and a salesman, I find it endlessly frustrating that to achieve a useful set of strings for either a 7-or-8-string guitar, I have to go with the EXL-158 set (which, itself, costs more than the EXL-110-7 set), and then also add on the PL010 for the high E...and then the NW080 (16.6lbs of tension on our aforementioned theoretical guitar, when tuned to F#.



My suggestion in your case is to purchase a 6-string set and then buy the single you prefer. Most 110 sets are pretty price competitive and a single wound low B string to your spec, will probably put at the same price as buying a 110-7 set. Assuming Daddys carries our singles, this should be a pretty simple transaction and meet your discerning specs.



> On my 26.5" scale Schecter 8-string, it comes in at 17.9lbs) for another few dollars. I understand that D'Addario has recently announced an 8-string set, but was then disappointed (although entirely unsurprised) to find that it includes the same USELESS gauges as Ernie Ball's 8-string Slinky set, and Schecter's "Decimator" 8-string set.



Again, this is an issue of the guitar manufacturers creating a standard. At the time, Schecter was an OEM partner (meaning, a company that uses DAddario strings on their guitars) and we took their advisement on this set. There arent a lot of 8-string guitars out there, at least at the time. Perhaps, as things develop and there are more options, experts and variations on preference, we can justify expanding our line to accommodate a broader range of tastes.



> On a 26.5" scale guitar, I find that the top 3 strings (.010, .013, and .017) are pretty much perfect...and these match the top 3 from the 110, 110-7, and my customized 158 set. Then, the middle two strings (.030, .042) are extremely tight in comparison, followed by the 6th and 7th strings (.054, .064), which are slightly tighter than my preference, but not unbearable. Next to the slightly-too-tight B string, we have the .074 gauge 8th string. Tuned to F# at 25.5", we're looking at 14.2lbs of tension, which, in practice, is a floppy mess. Having those two strings next to each other makes playing difficult...it's extremely frustrating needing to adjust one's pick attack (significantly) between two adjacent strings. Knocking one out of tune just from picking it, while the other barely moves while playing a power chord on the two lowest strings is a pretty severe problem, and I think most people would agree with that. On a few occasions, I've brought my 8-string into work to give my customers a side-by-side comparison between the seemingly-random tensions of the apparently now-standard 8-string set, and what's effectively a "10" set all the way across. So, as both a player/customer, and a salesman for one of D'Addario's dealers, I think it would be great to see an EXL-110-7 set with a useful low B string, and an EXL-110-8 set, with a similarly useful F# string. To reiterate, my preferred gauges (chosen using D'Addario's String Tension Guide, in conjunction with some online guitar string tension calculators), are: .010 E (16.2lbs at 25.5") .013 B (15.4lbs at 25.5") OR .0135 B (16.6lbs at 25.5") .017 G (16.6lbs at 25.5") .026 D (18.4lbs at 25.5") .036 A (19.5lbs at 25.5") OR .034 A (17.6lbs at 25.5") .046 E (17.5lbs at 25.5") .062 B (18.1lbs at 25.5") .080 F# (16.6lbs at 25.5")



Thank you for your detailed gauge listings. As mentioned, well take your suggestions into consideration and give them a try. On paper they make sense, however, we do have a lot of satisfied 110-7 players out there. The gauges you are speaking of would be a new set (how many gauges of 7 and 8 string sets do you think Daddys will carry? Not being funny, seriously?) and for the time being I think it makes more sense for you to build your own gauge to preference. As far as the 8-string goes, well stay in close contact with the guitar building market and determine from them what the standard is, perhaps you should also let them know your opinions.


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## crg123 (Aug 19, 2011)

I really hope they can fix this mess. It'd be nice to be able to buy a 7 or 8 string set that makes sense. I love D'addario strings but their stock gauges for 7's and 8's just don't feel good to play. I've used the exact gauges Ari recommended (010 E, .013 B, .017 G .026 D .036 A .046 E .062 B .080 F#/E) For my 27" Scale Agile and its the best. The tension is right on the money.

Ari works near my school and helped me choice the appropriate gauges when the stock strings (Labella Crazy 8's) Rondo Music put on disappointed me. Hopefully they'll produce a set with the gauges mentioned; I'll be a customer for life if they do haha. Hopefully they'll read through the forums and actually realize what their customers want.


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## AlexWadeWC (Aug 20, 2011)

As a D'Addario ENDORSER I would be THRILLED if they stepped the .059 up to a .062. The .059 is DECENT in B standard, but way too loose for drop A (25.5 scale). I've tried a .064 for the low A and it's a tad too thick, so I think a .062 would be PERFECT though I haven't tried it yet. 

If you think it's annoying ordering a pack and a single to change your strings every couple of weeks from playing at home imagine how frustrating it is having to order packs and singles for a whole tour when you change your strings every 2 shows.

because of this we actually just started endorsing LaBella as well because we can order packs of custom gauges from them and get exactly what we want. So I can order and pack our custom gauged strings for tour instead of having to pack a bunch of packs and having .010 singles laying around everywhere.

I realize tension and gauges ARE subjective to the person playing, but as Ari stated the .059 is just plain annoying. There is no reason why it shouldn't be a .062.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 20, 2011)

AlexWadeWC said:


> As a D'Addario ENDORSER I would be THRILLED if they stepped the .059 up to a .062. The .059 is DECENT in B standard, but way too loose for drop A (25.5 scale). I've tried a .064 for the low A and it's a tad too thick, so I think a .062 would be PERFECT though I haven't tried it yet.



I have one of my 7s tuned a step down with a .010-.062 set (although on that guitar, it's also a Dunlop set), and it's much too light. I need a D'Addario .011-.064 set on it.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Aug 20, 2011)

FYI: Daddy's will soon have single D'Addario .062s and .064s available in-store.


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## Lukifer (Aug 20, 2011)

AlexWadeWC said:


> As a D'Addario ENDORSER I would be THRILLED if they stepped the .059 up to a .062. The .059 is DECENT in B standard, but way too loose for drop A (25.5 scale). I've tried a .064 for the low A and it's a tad too thick, so I think a .062 would be PERFECT though I haven't tried it yet.
> 
> If you think it's annoying ordering a pack and a single to change your strings every couple of weeks from playing at home imagine how frustrating it is having to order packs and singles for a whole tour when you change your strings every 2 shows.
> 
> ...



Ive never heard of Labella strings. How do you like them. how well do they hold up in the long run??


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## MTech (Aug 21, 2011)

Lukifer said:


> Ive never heard of Labella strings.


They're one of if not the oldest string company out there... Chances are even if you aren't keen on the name because the huge chain stores only carry brands that dump hundreds of thousands into marketing and hype I'm sure you've heard them and probably played something made by them at one point and just didn't know it. 
Welcome to La Bella Strings!


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## Lukifer (Aug 21, 2011)

Damn, where the hell have i been ? Thanks for the info.


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## JPMike (Aug 21, 2011)

I know the name, but can't find them anywhere.


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## MTech (Aug 21, 2011)

JPMike said:


> I know the name, but can't find them anywhere.


I couldn't tell you off hand where to get them in your area but they're definitely distributed all over Europe. If you ask your regular shop you go to more than likely they already carry the classical line or folks so they should have no problem getting them in from their distro. Aside from that everybody has been buying them from BigCityStrings.


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## Konfyouzd (Aug 21, 2011)

Honestly... I have never thought this much about my string gauges before... On 25.5" guitars I use a D'Addario 10 - 59 set and on my 28.625" 8 string I use their 9 - 54 set with a 74 for low E. Done... 

The tension feels ever so slightly higher on the 8 even though it may very well be the same, but it's not a big enough deal to me to go calculating it...


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## WarriorOfMetal (Oct 11, 2012)

Necrobump for the benefit of the guy I was talking to about this thread this afternoon at Guitar Center in Boston. Here's the specific post I told you about: http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/2609349-post62.html


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