# BEWARE: BigTime Entertainment is a SCAM



## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

some of you might know about these people already, but here's the deal:

the band that i just joined a couple weeks ago agreed to do a show that they asked us to do. i knew at the time that it would involve selling tickets, but i only just yesterday found out that it would also involve us printing out our own tickets from a .pdf file sent to us by them. talked to the guy who's essentially the band leader about this, and he's kind of sketched out by the whole situation, and wants to send the guy an email.

after talking to a couple friends of mine (music business/management majors at berklee) about possible ways to back out of the show without burning any bridges with the venue, i spoke to the band leader again and we pretty much decided to tell them that we wouldn't be doing the show. we were going to send an email trying to do it as tactfully as possible. however, i mentioned this to a friend of mine in another band (Zimbloth here on ss.org) last night, and he told me that his band had done a show for this company before, and that he felt that they were frauds, and his band sent an angry email to them after playing the show. a quick google search revealed this: Big Time Entertainment Pay-to-Play

now i want to send that link to every band that's on the bill and suggest that they cancel (it seems to me like it's the responsible thing....help these other bands that appear to be just starting out not get screwed). thought i'd give everyone here a heads up as well, in case they get a show offer from this company.


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## kristallin (Jul 13, 2008)

Wow, reminds me of the "You could already be an artist - take our free test!" ads you used to see on the back of magazines...


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## TomAwesome (Jul 13, 2008)

There are way too many people who try to fuck hard working musicians out of time and money.  Thanks for the heads up.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

i've just contacted every other band on the bill that i could find on myspace, as well as the venue's booking agent, and posted a myspace bulletin.

dan will be sending a "fuck off" email to BTE


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## eightballhemhorrage (Jul 13, 2008)

i played one of the gorilla BOTB's (i didn't want too but was outvoted by the rest of the band) and it was one of the worst shows ever. 10 bands (well 9, one dropped out last min) in 8 hours @ a club about the size of a rowhome. stay away from them as well. same scam BTE is rolling


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## Mattmc74 (Jul 13, 2008)

That really sucks. I hate it when people try to fuck over the little guys.


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## zimbloth (Jul 13, 2008)

Awesome, good to see this becoming more public.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

zimbloth said:


> Awesome, good to see this becoming more public.






so far i've heard back from 3 of the bands on the show we were on. 2 have decided to cancel. the 3rd decided it was worth the exposure even if they're getting screwed out of money, figuring it was ok since they all have jobs


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## NegaTiveXero (Jul 13, 2008)

I agree, we've been dealing with them for some time now and the people we actually deal with are cool, but the whole situation stinks. They want us to sell so many tickets at fucking ridiculous prices ($8 pre-sale/$10 door) and sometimes we get a saturday (we have one this week, actually). I'm done with them.

Gorilla Productions is even worse, they're not even trying to cover up the fact it's a scam. Fuck them.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

NegaTiveXero said:


> I agree, we've been dealing with them for some time now and the people we actually deal with are cool, but the whole situation stinks. They want us to sell so many tickets at fucking ridiculous prices ($8 pre-sale/$10 door) and sometimes we get a saturday (we have one this week, actually). I'm done with them.
> 
> Gorilla Productions is even worse, they're not even trying to cover up the fact it's a scam. Fuck them.



Did you catch the bit where they say there's a $3 fee for under-21s?


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## NegaTiveXero (Jul 13, 2008)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> Did you catch the bit where they say there's a $3 fee for under-21s?



It's $2 here, but it's only at certain clubs.

Fuck it, I've decided that we're selling tickets at $2 for this show coming up and giving the Big Time chick the finger.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

NegaTiveXero said:


> It's $2 here, but it's only at certain clubs.
> 
> Fuck it, I've decided that we're selling tickets at $2 for this show coming up and giving the Big Time chick the finger.



yeah, i was thinking of that as a possibility as well....either sell the tickets for really cheap, or just give them away


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## NegaTiveXero (Jul 13, 2008)

I'd give them away, but, we need to at least make _some_ money, you know, for gas and fucking munchies afterward....and alcohol.

She's going to be really pissed when we don't give her any money. 


I kinda feel like a dumb ass for not really realizing they're a scam earlier, but I really just thought of it as getting shows. At least we're pretty good friends with some of the guys at the clubs now, so we don't really need them now.


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## NegaTiveXero (Jul 13, 2008)

And another thing, I think once, maybe, we got paired with bands that were at least in the same wide genre as us. We always get paired with whatever they can find, we never get paired with metal acts (save for the one time).


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

yeah the show we were booked for had us (a progressive death/doom metal band), a couple deathcore type bands, a screamo band, a punk band, etc. something like 8 bands on the bill, most of which were shitty unknowns.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Jul 13, 2008)

Shows must be awesome in the US, $8-$10 isn't THAT bad here for a 3-4 band show.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Shows must be awesome in the US, $8-$10 isn't THAT bad here for a 3-4 band show.



i usually see $5-7 for local band showcases...and usually there's at least some attempt to get bands of similar genres to be on a bill together.


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## NegaTiveXero (Jul 13, 2008)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> yeah the show we were booked for had us (a progressive death/doom metal band), a couple deathcore type bands, a screamo band, a punk band, etc. something like 8 bands on the bill, most of which were shitty unknowns.



Dude, I'm talking folk bands, pop bands, electronica bands, etc...

We barely play with bands that play anything close to _rock_, much less metal.


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## WarriorOfMetal (Jul 13, 2008)

NegaTiveXero said:


> Dude, I'm talking folk bands, pop bands, electronica bands, etc...
> 
> We barely play with bands that play anything close to _rock_, much less metal.



 awesome


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## JJ Rodriguez (Jul 13, 2008)

WarriorOfMetal said:


> i usually see $5-7 for local band showcases...and usually there's at least some attempt to get bands of similar genres to be on a bill together.



Yeah, but I was just reading on that website how they were outraged that someone would even consider selling tickets at $8-10. And not playing with bands your own genre is just stupid. It just ends up hurting sales anyways. If it's a bunch of classic rock bands and shit, who's going to bother buying a ticket if you want to go see a metal band? That part is definitely stupid.


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## FoxZero (Aug 2, 2008)

This so reminds me of the Penn House Monster Factory near where I live. I tried getting a show there last year and I had two options. I could try and get onto and upcoming metal show by preselling 30 tickets $12 or I could pay a couple hundred dollars to buy onto a show with a major band that's touring through the area.

The pre sale tickets are insane, however back then at least we would have gotten a couple of dollars per ticket we sold, so for regular shows they were technically paying gigs. But It is still lame to have to sell so many pre sale tickets. However the venue is supposed to be really nice.

Guess there not even close to as bad as BTE.


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## thedownside (Aug 2, 2008)

JJ Rodriguez said:


> Shows must be awesome in the US, $8-$10 isn't THAT bad here for a 3-4 band show.



dude, how are the shows up there run? here it's usually about 5-6 cover at the door, 3-4 bands. every show we've played here was like that.


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## JJ Rodriguez (Aug 2, 2008)

thedownside said:


> dude, how are the shows up there run? here it's usually about 5-6 cover at the door, 3-4 bands. every show we've played here was like that.



Shows are run like shit up here. In fact, I think every show in NB is run like shit. Posters say 10 pm, first band never goes on less than an hour late, usually it's longer than that. I've NEVER been to a show in NB that's started on time. You go to Montreal or something, and shows start at like 6. Even in NS, they aren't that bad. I can't go to shows through out the week, because I work 8-4:30 Monday to Friday, so I can't be out late. If shows started at 6 around here, I could actually go to shows again, if they had something besides gay emo and hardcore bands playing around here. Needless to say, I'm fed up with the shitty metal scene around here. It used to be a lot better when Black Frost, Tension Point, and that other band from SJ played. I was in Soul Devourer briefly before they split, and I was a fan of them too before I joined. Anyways, that's my rant about our shitty metal scene


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## thedownside (Aug 2, 2008)

haha, yeah, i hear ya on all that stuff. we've never taken the stage before 10, but in moncton anyways, no one even comes out till 11. we dont normally open anymore, and it sucks that shows dont get going till so late, we're usually now playing till 2pm. which sometimes is great, but it means we dont get home till like 3-3:30 atleast.


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## 7slinger (Aug 2, 2008)

eightballhemhorrage said:


> i played one of the gorilla BOTB's (i didn't want too but was outvoted by the rest of the band) and it was one of the worst shows ever. 10 bands (well 9, one dropped out last min) in 8 hours @ a club about the size of a rowhome. stay away from them as well. same scam BTE is rolling



we played a BTE BOTB that was about the same as this - total joke

the guy contacted us about doing another show, and we told him to shove it up his ass


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## Speedy Fingers (Aug 3, 2008)

Sadly, this practice is commonplace in the UK and almost all local bands go through pay-to-play bastards before realising what they're doing.


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## eightballhemhorrage (Aug 3, 2008)

EVERY club in Baltimore has a under 21 + $3 thing. it doesn't matter what kind of show. i have seen 2 clubs do it on free show nites!!!!


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## Heavy Ed (Aug 3, 2008)

This seems to be pretty common place nowadays. In my area there's really only one place left for original music that you don't have to pay to play shit and its an under 21 venue. all the other clubs/bars shutdown cause bands refused to do it. Now all we have are a hand full of places you can play covers, as long as you know the owner and can assure them you'll pack the place.


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