# Lets try this again...but better!



## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 4, 2014)

So the moment some of you have been waiting for and others had no idea was coming! After getting all of my money refunded from Etherial I've decided to move on to a new build since the stuff I want won't ever be in mass production. A lot of the specs have changed but the build is still pretty similar at heart. I'm really really excited for this build for reasons I'll get to! Anyway! The builder will be SVS designs out of Arizona (I think lol) I knew for a fact Shawn could handle the build since I've seen even crazier shit come out of his shop, like 9 string multiscales and 11 string fretless Vs and what not. I'd also asked around and the over whelming response was Shawn was super legit and a quality guy/builder. A lot of his standard body styles are a bit too extreme for what I want so I actually opted to take the body I'd created with Matt and use it on this build. I feel like that's justifiable considering it was designed together and he had more than enough chances to do it right, which fell through, so now I'm taking it to someone that can get me results in a timely manner. So, on to the specs!


*Strings*: 7
*Body*: Personal design 
*Top/back*: Birdseye Maple Burl (or lace burl I think)
*Center*: Walnut
*Finish*: Emerald Green stain with clear coat
*Neck*: Set neck with 5 piece Flame Maple/Ebony/Quartersawn maple/Ebony/Flame Maple lamination with two dual action truss rods and graphite reinforcement, oil finish
*Fretboard* Streaky ebony board, 20" radius, nickel jumbo fretwire, zero fret and graphitech nut
*Inlay*: Custom human Ouroborus pearl inlay around 12th, bass side dots 3-9, treble side dots 15-24.
*Scales*: 37"-33" fan
*Headstock*: Custom design (Pictures to come) 4+3, maple cap and finish to match the body
*Electronics*: 2 custom James Reed RJ Neo passive soap bars with active on board 3 band preamp
*Hardware*: Monorail bridge system, modern ultra-lite tuner system, barrel style knobs, flush mount output jack, recessed straplocks, all black
*Case*: Custom built by Arachnid Cabs

So yeah, I'm pretty sure I hit everything there. Okay. So I have a few pictures, more to come very soon!

These are the dealer's pictures of the top/back and we'll take more when they get in. The one piece will be the top and the book matched one will be the back. 













The ebony board!






And the picture that the inlay will be based on






And a dry run of the inlay, maple into ebony. This inlay is actually being done by Jamin of Chepernich guitars and so far he has absolutely killed it. Go check em out if you get a second!







Stay tuned! Hopefully this one can actually make it to me!


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## AwDeOh (Mar 4, 2014)

That inlay is going to be utterly amazing.


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## BlackMastodon (Mar 4, 2014)

Very intrigued by this, ans also hoping that this goes a lot better this time around. Judging by the scale lengths, it's a bass right?


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 5, 2014)

BlackMastodon said:


> Very intrigued by this, ans also hoping that this goes a lot better this time around. Judging by the scale lengths, it's a bass right?



Lol thank you, and yeah, a long scale bass at that lol


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## jonajon91 (Mar 5, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> *Strings*: 7



Oh, awesome. I assume from the scale length that that this is going down to F#


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## Necromagnon (Mar 5, 2014)

Mple inlay? The whole board will be laquered? Or how do they plan to protect this maple inlay?
Btw, the idea of the inlay looks really cool, and the work is amazing! 
It's already year-lights over the previous version...


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 5, 2014)

jonajon91 said:


> Oh, awesome. I assume from the scale length that that this is going down to F#



Actually, I'm thinking I'm going up hahah it'll be tuned to A D a d g b e, since that is what my current band plays in. I'll definitely be experimenting with turnings though lol not to worry.



Necromagnon said:


> Mple inlay? The whole board will be laquered? Or how do they plan to protect this maple inlay?
> Btw, the idea of the inlay looks really cool, and the work is amazing!
> It's already year-lights over the previous version...



Nope, maple test, the actual inlay will be pearl. And nah, it'll get sanded to 2500 grit and oiled. Should hold up just fine lol and thank you! I'll be sure to pass along the kind words to those actually doing the work hahah


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## downburst82 (Mar 5, 2014)

I hope this goes better for you I really do. I have to say though there are some not so great things going on in a few of the pictures on svs facebook..and most of the pictures are to low res to really tell much as far as build quality. Didn't see anything too bad really, just a couple neck pockets that could have been tighter some awkward headstock string paths, and one reallly bad looking neck heel finish transition.

Make sure he know lots of eyes will be on his work, it will do awesome things for his business if he does a killer job on this..and if he doesn't..well we know what sevenstring.org does to sub-par luthiers...

I really hope he does an awesome job for you though 

ps: Inlay and top are SUPER SICK!!


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## Daf57 (Mar 5, 2014)

Love that inlay! Subbed for updates!


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## pondman (Mar 5, 2014)

Great to see everything's back on track DL.
I've got a good feeling about this


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## Riley (Mar 5, 2014)

Excellent choice! I am liking where this is headed.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 5, 2014)

downburst82 said:


> I hope this goes better for you I really do. I have to say though there are some not so great things going on in a few of the pictures on svs facebook..and most of the pictures are to low res to really tell much as far as build quality. Didn't see anything too bad really, just a couple neck pockets that could have been tighter some awkward headstock string paths, and one reallly bad looking neck heel finish transition.
> 
> Make sure he know lots of eyes will be on his work, it will do awesome things for his business if he does a killer job on this..and if he doesn't..well we know what sevenstring.org does to sub-par luthiers...
> 
> ...



Oh yeah, I've seen em all and even stuff that he doesn't want to put on the page like the 5K jazz basses he's built because he's trying to build his brand in a certain direction. It'll also be a set neck, so I'm not terribly concerned with the neck pocket issues anyways hahah I'll have control over the headstock as well and since the last build, I've just completely cut out the shit with people. I'm even more blunt about things I don't like and if I see something I don't like, it'll be addressed much more aggressively on my part. 

I honestly think my biggest concern will be making sure I can get the bass from Shawn after it's done  we're both incredibly excited about it.


Thank you all for the kind words! Hopefully I can deliver on the finished product this time


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 20, 2014)

So a bit of an update here. Got some of the woods in and some minor adjustments! Something that happened is this will now be a 27 fret build! Shawn just built another 7 with 27 frets and won't stop talking about it and really wanted to do it again, but on a multiscale so I said f*ck it, why not  Other than that, it'll have a custom Bass Mods preamp with single vol that is also push/pull active/passive toggle, 1 blend, bass, mid, treb control and variable gain stages built in. So it should be pretty versatile tone wise. 

OH!? I guess I forgot to mention that the side dots will be green LEDs too! Should be pretty crazy!

Picture time! 

Quicky stencil of the body in case you missed the other thread...lol






The headstock will be the one on the left, 3+4 config. Trying to get as straight string pull as possible.






Body walnut and neck maple, pretty stoked about the neck on this. I wasn't even aware people put ebony in necks!? Plus I'm a huge sucker for figured maple necks too, so it's really just a whole lot of win in my books lol






After the fretboard has been milled and cleaned up a bit! It looks so cool! Streaky and a little quilt! I'm super happy with it!











And a chart of the preamp just for shits!


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 28, 2014)

More things and stuff! Also! If any of you will be at NAMM next year! Look out for an SVS/HJC (look em up, crazy work, gonna eventually have a few of these as well) Basses/Arachnid Cabs (future build thread ) Booth! Should be crazy! I'll probably have this monster there as well as a bunch of other awesome stuff! Anyways! On to the goods!

Super exciting baggies full of hardware!!






Super tasty walnut core that won't ever be seen again once the tops get in!!






Super-f*cking-tasty neck laminates!!! 9 PIECE Flame maple/ebony neck!?


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Mar 29, 2014)

So, I normally wait until I have a decent handful of pictures to share, but the fretboard just got slotted and it looks unreal! I've never seen a piece of ebony this big nor this figured, it's ridiculous! Either way, thought I'd share the highlight of my day with y'all lol


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## DredFul (Mar 29, 2014)




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## FIXXXER (Mar 29, 2014)

the top looks incredible!


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## ixlramp (Mar 29, 2014)

Very interesting and a beautiful design.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (May 1, 2014)

And we are back! Sorry for the delay, just waiting till I had a decent amount of pictures to share! The board took a while to radius and sand since it's ebony and yeah hahah but it's looking really good! Other than that, the board is glued up, the neck is carved, the LED's are in, and some of the inlays are in! Now it's off to Jamin to get the Orouborus inlaid! So stoked to see how that comes out! Also! Slight change in the body woods! The original ones were marked slightly wrong and were too small, so we went with plan B! On to the pics!

So, the new tops!











And in real life!






The headstock glued up






Trussrods and titanium rod installed. This neck is definitely not going anywhere anytime soon!






LEDs installed! This was just a standard blue one light he had, mine will be a high intensity green, so even brighter!











Everything glued up and glowing!






The neck all carved up, but you totally can't tell hahah






Pre side-dots!






Sidedots in!







The body should be done gluing up and through routing and carving here soon enough! This should be done in less than a few weeks now!


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## skeels (May 1, 2014)

Wow....

skeels likes this.


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## BlackMastodon (May 1, 2014)

The only thing I worry about is that 4th tuner placement, the string pull won't be very straight and it might rub against the tuner post of the higher string. Otherwise it's looking great so far.


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## ormsby guitars (May 2, 2014)

Oh no... here we go again...


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## pondman (May 2, 2014)

Looking good DL. 
If that pencil mark is the center line on the head-stock the string line looks ok to me


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (May 2, 2014)

ormsby guitars said:


> Oh no... here we go again...



What now?


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (May 2, 2014)

pondman said:


> Looking good DL.
> If that pencil mark is the center line on the head-stock the string line looks ok to me



The string pull will be fairly straight on all of em. I'm not terribly concerned with the fourth string being up against the fifth, I'll just have to string the fifth before it.


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## djohns74 (May 2, 2014)

EDIT: Sorry, don't mind me...


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## ormsby guitars (May 2, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> What now?



The headstock is off centre by a large amount. The strings will be far from a straight pull. 

You mentioned a titanium bar in the neck, with two truss rods. Do you have a photo of that?

The bridge pieces in the pic are really really cheap. $10 a set of five. There aren't too many (any?) tuners I've ever seen packaged like that, which haven't been really bad Chinese made tuners. Can you get a better pic? 

I don't understand why builders spend the time, effort, and $$$ on nice woods, but then save money by buying cheap hardware. Which brings me to the pickups... They will be nice, but if you can afford a nicer preamp to go with them, they would be even better. The frequency range for that preamp is a bit out... The bass knob controls a frequency that most good preamps use for the mids. So, you want a fat tight bottom end? this preamp aint for you. If you can afford $100 more for any of the big brand preamps you won't regret it.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (May 2, 2014)

ormsby guitars said:


> The headstock is off centre by a large amount. The strings will be far from a straight pull.
> 
> You mentioned a titanium bar in the neck, with two truss rods. Do you have a photo of that?
> 
> ...



The headstock isn't that far off? The pictures are definitely not helping that any though. I'm not terribly concerned with it. If it's that bad I can have him redo it and won't be out maybe a week or so. He's a lot closer than etherial lol

I double checked for you and there's just one titanium rod, in the center thats been epoxied in, it's a thin slot, but it's there. Its ridiculously hard to see, but it's there. 

I'm getting the info on the hardware now, can't say. He uses it on all his personal basses that get toured heavily so I'd imagine they can't be that bad.

EDIT: So Shawn got back to me, it's all manufactured in Canada actually, basically Gotoh but not hah it's the same hardware that HJC customs uses and seeing what his basses go for, I can't imagine it is anywhere close to cheap hardware. 

The preamp is not going to be that exact model, it's being hand built by the guy from bassmods. If you have any recommendations for how it should be set up please shoot em over in the messages.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (May 20, 2014)

Updates! This project keeps changing and evolving with every turn. It's a bit ridiculous in all honesty and has gotten quite exhausting, but onward and forward we go!

Changes! 

The neck we've been working with will now go on a back up 7! 

New neck! 9 piece; flame maple, jatoba, and ebony. Also. it's a neck-thru now hahah!

Also some other minor things, I added a black eucalyptus veneer between all the layers on the body for extra wood sammich goodness! Pics of that to come at the end of the week hopefully. 

So now, more neck stuff!

The clamps!






All glued and planed up





New board!










OH! And just for kicks we reworked the headstock so there is absolutely nothing to gripe about.


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## Walterson (May 21, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> OH! And just for kicks we reworked the headstock so there is absolutely nothing to gripe about.



Are you shure you can mount the 3rd and 5th Tuner? To me it looks like the holes are pretty close to each other and the tuner housings may touch each other on the back of the headstock....


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## RV350ALSCYTHE (May 21, 2014)

Walterson said:


> Are you shure you can mount the 3rd and 5th Tuner? To me it looks like the holes are pretty close to each other and the tuner housings may touch each other on the back of the headstock....



I have a Carvin bass which has the 3rd and 4th tuners mounted right beside each other. The housings are touching each other.
It shouldn't be a problem as long as they aren't mounted very tightly together causing stress between them.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jun 15, 2014)

Big progress update! This whole process has been seriously delayed by James Reed, whose making the pickups. I've heard nothing but amazing things about his pickups, but holy shit is he a bad businessman. He's had over two and a half months after quoting less than a month. I think they're on their way, but I won't say until they've actually shown up in the shop. Either way! Big progress on the inlay and body! Everything is in final glue and the board is on it's way back to get fretted and glued as well! I got so worked up because of how excited I was after seeing these pictures I couldn't sleep the entire night. It's ridiculous but oh well hahah on to pictures!

We're now doing a neck thru, but with a twist!











With the burl top on! 






Before glue, obviously, but a good idea of what is going on here. It's weird, but really unique, and I love it! It was Shawn's idea and I just let him run with it. Definitely a good call I'd say hah






Then there's the back of this thing, which was the spalted maple slab, which...you'll see...






But wait...it gets better






So much better






And even better! 











And the top! Minus a fretboard and a final cut on that insert of burl and ebony











And just when you thought it couldn't possibly get any better, there's this thing







Yeah...just....yeah....


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## octatoan (Jun 15, 2014)

Whoa. Whoa. That thing is going... on the _guitar_?!


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## JuliusJahn (Jun 15, 2014)

I don't understand why he doesn't have a design for the headstock, like this




which would save us some worrying. 

IMO, there's too many laminations going on and I'd be worried if a luthier you hired had to re-do a headstock and sends such low res pics. The corner roundover looks burnt from what I can make out. It's not a big deal to sand out but takes 2 minutes to prevent from happening. He also put the inlays in wrong, and you were supposed to have a 5 piece neck - So unless you told him to do all of these changes, I'd be kinda weirded out. 

Also, the "inlay" looks like a print off, you can even see the white part of the spine where the ribs are going to be. 

I hope all goes well for you though, especially after having a build flop already.


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## Erockomania (Jun 15, 2014)

Honestly dude, I am worried for you. I found SVS on Facebook and took a look through his photos. I think this guy is marginally better, if at all, than the Etherial guy. I can't imagine there is good feedback from anyone who knows what a quality guitar is. Just my opinion tho. Here are a few pics of his work:






















Cringe-worthy. I think he's eying the placement of everything from pickup routes to tuner placement to saddles. Nothing is symmetrical. 

I don't mean to be a dick. I actually hope it works out and that these are flukes, but it is my opinion that you either have an eye for detail or you do not.


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## ferret (Jun 15, 2014)

100% with Erock. I don't understand what's going on with this thing anymore. That 9-piece neck being capped off by a 5-piece insert.....


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## FIXXXER (Jun 15, 2014)

HORRIBLE!


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## Pikka Bird (Jun 15, 2014)

I think there are several WTF factors here. Besides what the other guys have said, he didn't shape the neck symmetrically, so one of those jatoba neck lams is rather thin at the end and the corresponding one on the other side is unharmed. A very messy look.

Also, he didn't use the actual bookmatched surfaces of that gorgeous spalted slab, so the symmetry of the bookmatch is lost completely (this MIGHT be a stylistic thing to make it more "organic" or whatever, but this decision wasn't mentioned anywhere that I've seen).

And lastly, the way he does the scarfed headstock it doesn't look like there's enough thickness at the nut to allow for a volute (though we haven't seen side shots, so I can't tell for sure) or some other flourish that would enable him to put a veneer on the back and hide that transition from the neck lams to the back of the headstock.

It seems odd that he's the same guy who did that test inlay in the first post, because that looks rather well done, but the rest has no finesse at all, IMO. Looking at those finished shots, he does seem to be able to shoot a decent clearcoat though, but check out those tuner layouts and the not-quite straightness of the pickup routs.

I don't think anybody means to pile on the hate here, but just advising you to consider your options/escape plan.


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## sehnomatic (Jun 15, 2014)

Erockomania said:


>



Oh boy. That B and high E string vibrato real estate. That is string slip city.


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## Erockomania (Jun 15, 2014)

sehnomatic said:


> Oh boy. That B and high E string vibrato real estate. That is string slip city.



yep, just follow the strings to the nut... yikes.


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## Purelojik (Jun 15, 2014)

honestly dude theres a reason why people settle on specs beforehand. And before you put money down you HAVE to know what you want. the luthier will work with your specs unless he isnt a custom builder and builds guitars he likes with minor changes for personal preferences of the owner. guitar building isnt hard, but the devils in the details. 

From your posts it sounds like you are kinda just rolling with it, which in most cases is a nice attitude to have but not in something like this. You need to acquire a discerning eye. 

before this build goes further, decide what you want and what you dont want. at this point its looking all over the place.

Also tell him to get some adequate lighting or something, this is 2014 and even my grandparent's phones have better cameras on them. Tell him to focus on areas of transistion, joining, carves etc. basically areas which need to be viewed at a closer distance. 


I know it sounds harsh a bit but honestly its better than looking at this thing in disappointment when it lands in your hand.


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## Jason2112 (Jun 16, 2014)

This thread started off pretty good and went downhill pretty fast. The criticisms in this thread have a lot of merit and hopefully the OP doesn't take offense to them, but you really need to reconnect with the builder and see if you can get this train back on the rails.


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## BlackMastodon (Jun 17, 2014)

After seeing those pics linked of his work I think I'd rather have an Etherial.  I'd get this under control ASAP if I were you.


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## UnderTheSign (Jun 17, 2014)

"It's not a smudge, it's some weird reflection cause of the leds in the photo"


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## XxJoshxX (Jun 17, 2014)

I don't know whats worse^^, the filler, or the fact that he went through the process of nipping the fret tangs but didn't even fill them in.


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## Erockomania (Jun 17, 2014)

XxJoshxX said:


> I don't know whats worse^^, the filler, or the fact that he went through the process of nipping the fret tangs but didn't even fill them in.



Even worse... he took that photo and thought nobody would notice all the garbage work in it? More likely, he has no eye for detail.


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## Helstormau (Jun 18, 2014)

In all honesty mate, this isn't looking too good for you. I saw this guys work a while ago and thought that hopefully your build would be a one off (every one of his builds I've seen prior to this thread looked extremely hideous). Did you research this guy before you placed an order? If so, surely you would have seen the faults on these. For instance, the blue guitar/bass/whateverthef_u_ck's highest string isnt even straight. Come to think of it, nothing on it is inline properly. 

Sorry to say this man, but it seems you chose the wrong guy to build again


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jun 18, 2014)

See, here's the thing guys. Shawn is a weird motherf_cker. He hasa. Very specific vision as to what he wants his brand to be, which is guitars/basses built for extreme musicians to survive extreme conditions. He's just a builder either, he actively tours with all of his own basses and most of what he's built is actively touring as well. Not only that, but because he has a very specific vision in mind, he won't release pictures to the public of the 6k jazz basses that he's built. He's a stubborn dude that really doesn't care what the internet thinks about his designs because people are still coming back to get more builds from him. Yes I researched him. I did a lot of research actually. He actually came recommended from Harold at HJC Customs, who is an incredible builder and has an amazing eye for detail. This guy has been in the industry all his life and if a builder was sub par, I trust Harold enough to know he wouldn't highly recommend me to him, especially considering I was going to go with HJC but he want to work with such extreme specs. The picture that's come under fire with the LEDs and the Neck joint is a prototype. I talked to Shawn about it yesterday, it's not supposed to be pretty, it was a rough test of a few new concepts. I've seen his customer builds and they're incredible. Everyone I've talked to has said the same thing, THE BEST fretwork they've ever seen on a guitar. That's over a dozen different people that have all actually held one of these in their hands. 

So here's what it comes down to

1) the headstock wasn't redone. It's a new neck and I changed it. The string pull is dead straight on this one and I honestly didn't mind the first one. It'll tune up all the same. I'll actually be using that neck for another version of this bass at a later date. And yeah, it's weird and pointy, what the hell were you expecting on a bass like this?? A classic gibson headstock? Maybe one of those sweet, old school danelectro inline paddle head stocks? No? It's meant to work with the body, which in case you haven't noticed, is a little nonconventional, so logically, the headstock would be too. It'll get even better, just wait.

2) the inlay, that was a picture taken BEFORE it was inlaid to make sure it was in the correct orientation since there are a few ways we could have done that. It's all hand carved out of pearl. I'm super thrilled with how it came out.

3) his designs, I don't really care for most of them either, but again, it's aesthetics. They're EXTREME guitars so having EXTREME designs would make sense, obviously they're not going to appeal to people who thing strats and rgs are the epitome of guitar design. 

4) the pictures, yeah, they're shot on a potato. He has an iPhone 3, so yeah, they're lower res pictures. They're shot that way because as he put it, he's a builder and not a photographer, he's got very little time to actually get a picture in and he does only because I bug him for them. 

5) His communication, I talk to this guy on a semi daily basis. He keeps me updated to the hour on any progress and developments. Any changes are made with my approval. I couldn't ask for more from him here. He's been absolutely fantastic and totally transparent the whole time.


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## XxJoshxX (Jun 18, 2014)

Why aren't the laminates centered on the neck?


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## Mik3D23 (Jun 18, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> "words"



What's with the guitars that look like the outside strings are about to fall off the fretboard? And sideways pickups? Etc..

We're (I'm) not trying to shit on your build, just looking out for others. It just smells a bit fishy to me that he for some reason would post all of these issues for the public to see, while making up reasons that don't make sense (weird LED reflections ), but hide away the quality builds. Why even have a facebook then?

Anyway, good luck man. Hope it turns out nice.


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## UnderTheSign (Jun 18, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> The picture that's come under fire with the LEDs and the Neck joint is a prototype. I talked to Shawn about it yesterday, it's not supposed to be pretty, it was a rough test of a few new concepts. I've seen his customer builds and they're incredible. Everyone I've talked to has said the same thing, THE BEST fretwork they've ever seen on a guitar. That's over a dozen different people that have all actually held one of these in their hands.


Anything he puts online is going to be a show of his talent as a luthier. He doesn't want to show off all the supposed high dollar stuff he has built? Fine. But to churn out some shoddy ass work, _then_ claim "it's because of the way the pic was taken" _then_ claim it was a prototype and not meant to be pretty... Sure.

I don't get it. _Best_ fretwork anyone has ever seen on a guitar yet he doesn't show it?


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## sehnomatic (Jun 18, 2014)

Mik3D23 said:


> What's with the guitars that look like the outside strings are about to fall off the fretboard? And sideways pickups? Etc..
> 
> We're (I'm) not trying to shit on your build, just looking out for others. It just smells a bit fishy to me that he for some reason would post all of these issues for the public to see, while making up reasons that don't make sense (weird LED reflections ), but hide away the quality builds. Why even have a facebook then?
> 
> Anyway, good luck man. Hope it turns out nice.



It may as simple as he is still learning, unable to see mistakes until he has improved upon other things. 

You can't blame him, same thing with me, I finished my refret/fretjob "Oh man, my fretwork is great", upon going back to it with a lot more experience I now think "Oh man, what the bloody hell did I do to these frets."

I'm pretty sure the guitar i built recently will be a complete shitshow after a couple more builds under my belt. If Shawn feels the same about the instruments he's built in the past, that's a good sign. What's worse than having faults, is the inability to recognize them and act upon them.

Best wishes


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## TedEH (Jun 18, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> He's a stubborn dude that really doesn't care what the internet thinks



I fully admit that I'm taking this quote out of context... but that's not a very good business model, whether the work he does is good or not.


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## stevexc (Jun 18, 2014)

sehnomatic said:


> It may as simple as he is still learning, unable to see mistakes until he has improved upon other things.
> 
> You can't blame him, same thing with me, I finished my refret/fretjob "Oh man, my fretwork is great", upon going back to it with a lot more experience I now think "Oh man, what the bloody hell did I do to these frets."
> 
> ...



I'm sorry, but there's a huge difference between building something, documenting it, and learning from it and building something, using it for advertisement, and making excuses for the flaws. What you do is perfectly fine and beneficial and provides transparency. What he seems to be doing... not so much. He's building what appear to be flawed guitars and selling them, and hiding the "good" ones from public view. Yes, he could just be extremely eccentric. But it's more likely that what he is showing (for paying customer's instruments at that) is the typical quality of his work.

CLB - your build seems to be turning out okay, albeit with a few minor things that look off... I hope it turns out great, I really do. Although I'm curious, I must have missed it - what are the really crazy, out-there specs you were originally looking for?


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## sehnomatic (Jun 18, 2014)

stevexc said:


> I'm sorry, but there's a huge difference between building something, documenting it, and learning from it and building something, using it for advertisement, and making excuses for the flaws. What you do is perfectly fine and beneficial and provides transparency. What he seems to be doing... not so much. He's building what appear to be flawed guitars and selling them, and hiding the "good" ones from public view. Yes, he could just be extremely eccentric. But it's more likely that what he is showing (for paying customer's instruments at that) is the typical quality of his work.
> 
> CLB - your build seems to be turning out okay, albeit with a few minor things that look off... I hope it turns out great, I really do. Although I'm curious, I must have missed it - what are the really crazy, out-there specs you were originally looking for?



I didn't think I'm in the position to seriously criticize his work because a) I have limited build experience myself, and b) never played one of his instruments. You pretty much nailed what I was going to say, but I'll add upon your statement.

Strictly based on his luthiery skills, not design, if his instruments can't stand up against a korean LTD, let alone the numerous builders that are his direct competition, he should not be selling his services.

The fact that he's able to communicate on a bi-daily basis may *not* be a good thing. It potentially implicates a lack of business traffic, the lack of business traffic can implicate faults in other parts of his business.

OP, if you're able to hound him on a regular basis, make damn sure that he delivers a stellar guitar. If you and Shawn can make an instrument that can shut us shut up, that's all loads of good.


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## Erockomania (Jun 18, 2014)

CLB... you(or others) are making excuses for him, plain and simple. 

I doubt he has done the best fretwork I've seen let alone anyone. That's pure hype, and most likely, totally false. Also...

he does not have an eye for detail... that much is obvious. On the other hand, and please don't take this the wrong way... you might not yet either and that may actually be a good thing in the end. 

I just hope you get what you want, man.


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## Les (Jun 18, 2014)

"the best fretwork" aint gonna matter much if the low and high strings wont even land on the frets.

Best of luck OP, I hope yours will prove us all wrong.

PLOT TWIST: OP is SVS...


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## Purelojik (Jun 18, 2014)

sehnomatic said:


> It may as simple as he is still learning, unable to see mistakes until he has improved upon other things.
> 
> You can't blame him, same thing with me, I finished my refret/fretjob "Oh man, my fretwork is great", upon going back to it with a lot more experience I now think "Oh man, what the bloody hell did I do to these frets."
> 
> ...



dude i understand that when building you have to keep certain things in check but i've seen your las tbuild and it was pretty great. you have an eye for design and the lines of shapes flow properly.

its more than just someone learning, you'll see if they have a natural talent for design, for composition, and for other aspects of a guitar. sure fretwork can be improved and theres really no special aspect of that other than perhaps doing a semi hemi. 

@CLB

I dont buy the extreme players and extreme conditions thing, its marketing hooplah and serves to entice people. he may do the best fretjob in the world but if he has zero eye for the general mechanics of a guitar then whats the point? 

i get that he'll take on strange shapes but then again it goes like it did with the ethereial thread; why spend money on something that you're not gonna scrutinize and make 100% sure its what you want?


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## Helstormau (Jun 18, 2014)

Im going to be honest here...

If this guy's so called vision is to make instruments with f_u_cked up neck laminates and everything not being straight then you are in for trouble (unless you want that of course). I wouldnt really trust the guy since he made that comment about the smudge mark being a weird camera problem or something (you would have to be an idiot to believe that sh_i_t). 

Now, if you dont care about these issues then thats fine. Thats your taste. But since you ditched etherial because of the design/build flaws then youre obviously just making excuses for what appears to be another shoddy build.

In the end it's your decision. I dont care whether you like or dislike this bass. It doesnt matter to me whatsoever. We are just trying to help you out by pointing out whats wrong since you dont seem to notice it.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jun 18, 2014)

Holy shit hah lots of responses, I'll try and get most of em here with out the wall of text this time. 

I'll track down a video of the guy playing and it should clear things up. He's a super goofy dude that loves extreme music and the entire aesthetic around it. I'm actually in agreement with you guys that it's a bit ridiculous and not a great business practice, but he seems to be perfectly happy with it and his business is growing pretty steadily. He said specifically that he doesn't want to be the builder that just shits out "customs" that have been CNC'd and have no real love and attention put into em. He does it all by hand. 

What I think this really comes down to is quality. It might look a little goofy and different, but that's the idea. As far as the neck laminates, I think the bottom maple lam got shaped out towards the lower frets quicker than the treble side, but it won't effect the shape of the neck, it's also a tight spacing at the nut. 

I'm all over the any possible alignment issues that might arise, I'm calling him every other day, asking every question I can think of as well as any concerns voiced here. 

As far as the fretwork. It's been vouched for by a guy who builds for clientele around the Victor Wooten calibur, so I'm genuinely not too concerned.

Found a video of Shawn, shot on an even worse potato. So, apologies there, but it'll suffice

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wtGXhc54BM&feature=youtu.be


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jun 19, 2014)

Also, this back...


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## Necromagnon (Jun 19, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> He said specifically that he doesn't want to be the builder that just shits out "customs" that have been CNC'd and have no real love and attention put into em. He does it all by hand.


Bro, doing it all by hand is by no means a token of quality. If you want, I can send you a guitar done all by hand that is shitty as hell, that's no problem. 
And although a guitar can be CNC'd, I don't see why the builder doesn't put attention into it nor love. That's completely different. Would you say that someone like Daemoness or I don't know which modern builder doesn't put love on his builds?

About attention... Looks like he needs to do this with his eyes opened. 



CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> It might look a little goofy and different, but that's the idea.


So, an unplayable instrument could be, in that state of mind, a good instrument because different of the cood playgin one? That a freaking nice news for all the Invictus/Rotter/DeVries/Etc. builders. 

About the pictures shown on here, maybe it's an old work, but the least you can expect from someone that has learn things is to have a critical eye on his own old work, like Sheno said, and being able to say: "wtf did I just build at that time?"
He tries to justify himself with stupid argument, that nobody would believe. That's clearly not the sign of someone knowledgable.

I do hope your build turns out great, off course. I'm just joining the "warning army", as it looks to take the Etherial down way... :/


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## Thrashman (Jun 19, 2014)

I don't mean to talk shit or offend anyone, but.. You were better off with Etherial..


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## ForThisGift (Jun 19, 2014)

I think a solid web presence is a sign that a builder is proud of their work. Obviously this is not a hard and fast rule, but something to use to gauge the skill level of the builder you are hiring. There are certainly exceptions on both sides of the line, but the fact that this guy's limited gallery of work is all of questionable quality, coupled with his backwards business model of not wanting to "show off" his best work should have been a pretty clear red flag. It is an indication, at best, that he is not a savvy business owner. The worst case scenario is that he is also being disingenuous about his accomplishments and embellishing the quality of his work. 

I know that this kind of stuff can and does happen with established builders, but this is kind of the price you pay when you are dead set on going with an unproven commodity. 

As far as the build itself is concerned, putting aside that the design is not to my taste, there are some glaring deficiencies in both attention to detail and organization/planning. Unless you have given him carte blanche to make changes as he sees fit, then he has already overstepped the parameters of your agreement and you should not be making excuses for that. The change to the 9pc neck (which he obviously does not have the understanding or skill to pull off) as well as the bizarre 5pc overlay on the top are examples of alterations that shouldn't be made at this point on a build that has already been planned out. 

I completely understand that the criticism received thus far may have put you on the defensive (especially with this being round 2) but you should not let that cloud your judgement when dealing with the builder; making/accepting excuses for what appears to be inexcusable work thus far is working AGAINST your interests as the customer in this relationship. You need to take the reins on this build before it is too late and force some accountability to ensure you get what you desire in the finished product. 

Don't let this turn into his experiment with incorporating laminates into every piece of the build with you footing the bill.


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## Les (Jun 19, 2014)

Ninja Edit: I'm not a Luthier, and am not claiming to be. But i am a skilled woodworker/carpenter, and have been around the guitar world since i was a young lad, so i think i may know enough to say these few things without overstepping my boundaries. 

Having a unique instrument that is unlike any other is all fine and good, but hes missing the simple basic fundamentals when it comes to building guitars, or any skilled manufacturing type of thing... 

Things like, 
-the neck needs to be wide enough for whatever string spacing will be
-things like pickup routes should be square and even at least relative to each other, or at least have the intention of looking off on purpose(e.g. the fan fret guys), not looking like they just didnt give a shit and didnt measure at all...
-body shapes/headstock shapes need to be cohesive in style and function, and not look like if you even halfway drop the damn thing its going to snap off all of its "horns"
-Crazy headstocks are cool, but the reason a headstock exists is to hold the strings, in as straight and stable of a manner as the shape will allow, and have room for tuning machines to mount.
-if your going to make a neck through guitar, make the goddamn neck long enough. Its very clear that he didnt do this, and hes just masking a mistake as a "unique styling" or "extreme design". 

Proper Planing Prevents Piss Poor Performance

Sorry dude, this is tweaker level shit, like painting your pickup truck with house paint or something.


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## patsanger (Jun 19, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Holy shit hah lots of responses, I'll try and get most of em here with out the wall of text this time.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wtGXhc54BM&feature=youtu.be




All I can say after seeing the bass he is playing in the video is wtf? The ergonomics are all messed up - it looks like he might be able to play the 1st few frets, but only by stretching heavily. Basically it looks like he took the scale of an acoustic bass and put the body at the lowest point....

Oh, and you seem to have a set neck. A neck through would go all the way through the body forcing the body to be wings attached to the neck. 

One positive design style that I saw for a second was the gap at the bottom of the 9 piece, that looked kinda cool showing the wood... adding that last bit...


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## DredFul (Jun 19, 2014)

But that back though


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## Churchie777 (Jul 12, 2014)

once bitten twice shy......


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jul 12, 2014)

Churchie777 said:


> once bitten twice shy......



Pretty much. Despite the internet not liking things, this guy is legit as they come.

I have a few updates now that the fretboard is installed and everything is glued up and looking sharp. We also changed the insert on the body to a solid piece of burl vs the 5 piece. It looks super clean and the whole thing has come together really well. The one complaint I do have is that James Reed (the guy building the pickups) has been an absolute nightmare to work with. He makes incredible pickups but he sucks at running a business. He's 4 months behind on my set and has pushed this build back two months because of it. As far as everything else goes, it's looking really really good. I've been itching for this 7 for a long time now and I keep finding myself on eBay looking for another 7 to hold me over till it arrives. All that's left is to get the pickups, route, stain, then clear. By then the case should be done as well and it'll be sent out! I'm still incredibly excited about this thing. 

Also! The inlay picture I posted a while back, in case I forgot to mention, was before it was actually inlaid into the board. It was to see which orientation I preferred the most and then it was inlaid. The ribcage was added as well so everyone bitching about that,  it looks absolutely insane. To the rest of you that are still supportive, thank you and I'll have some awesome updates shortly


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## VSK Guitars (Jul 13, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Pretty much. Despite the internet not liking things, this guy is legit as they come.
> 
> I have a few updates now that the fretboard is installed and everything is glued up and looking sharp. We also changed the insert on the body to a solid piece of burl vs the 5 piece. It looks super clean and the whole thing has come together really well. The one complaint I do have is that James Reed (the guy building the pickups) has been an absolute nightmare to work with. He makes incredible pickups but he sucks at running a business. He's 4 months behind on my set and has pushed this build back two months because of it. As far as everything else goes, it's looking really really good. I've been itching for this 7 for a long time now and I keep finding myself on eBay looking for another 7 to hold me over till it arrives. All that's left is to get the pickups, route, stain, then clear. By then the case should be done as well and it'll be sent out! I'm still incredibly excited about this thing.
> 
> Also! The inlay picture I posted a while back, in case I forgot to mention, was before it was actually inlaid into the board. It was to see which orientation I preferred the most and then it was inlaid. The ribcage was added as well so everyone bitching about that,  it looks absolutely insane. To the rest of you that are still supportive, thank you and I'll have some awesome updates shortly



Pics or it didn't happen... 

I'd be pissed about the crooked neck laminates. It looks to me like the neck blank wasn't squared up correctly before he started cutting it to size. That's why the back of the neck has a twisted look to it and the laminates are way off from nut to heel...

If a builder can't line up laminates on a center line they have no business charging for their work...


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## ForThisGift (Jul 14, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Pretty much. Despite the internet not liking things, this guy is legit as they come.



I don't really see how he can be as "legit as they come" with clear photographic evidence to the contrary. The people in this thread aren't just making it up. If you don't want anyone else's opinion that is fine, but I wouldn't just haphazardly write off the criticisms raised in this thread. From what I have seen from his previous work and the work he is doing for you he may be a passable amateur AT BEST. Nothing I have seen cries quality craftsmanship, but rather inexperience with proper technique and lack of organization. 

I truly hope it all works out, but if not you will regret being passive.


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## Neilzord (Jul 15, 2014)

I'm not a master by any means, but aren't Neck laminates meant to increase stability? So surely if they are wonky, then if for any reason the neck does bow then it will also be a bit twisted? 

Either way... My fingers are crossed for you and hope this comes out as a sweet guitar! Its an interesting shape and would be good to see it finished well!


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## stevexc (Jul 15, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Also! The inlay picture I posted a while back, in case I forgot to mention, was before it was actually inlaid into the board. It was to see which orientation I preferred the most and then it was inlaid. The ribcage was added as well so everyone bitching about that,  it looks absolutely insane. To the rest of you that are still supportive, thank you and I'll have some awesome updates shortly



You mentioned that a couple times, nobody's been bitching about it... there were two comments about it right after it was posted but that's it... I can safely say that the inlay is the least of anyone's worries. The neck laminates are the really big issue you've got.

On the bright side, it DOES look leaps and bounds above his other... work. In terms of overall aesthetics and quality.


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## Danukenator (Jul 15, 2014)

Yikes! Those stringers are way off. That alone warrants a rebuild.

People here aren't trying to rag on your build! They are concerned about it's quality. Think about how little you would be able to sell a guitar with crooked neck laminates and a headstock with absolutely zero regard for string pull? (If and only IF those are the only issues)

As with BRJ and TMG, we want to stop you from getting too deep.

EDIT: Who cares about the inlay? The guitar neck is built incorrectly.


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## Renkenstein (Jul 15, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


>



Not here to rag on your build, I have a legit observation regarding the laminated neck. I saw the blank, and the lams were perfectly straight. Now that we see this, it seems it's being built with the lams running parallel to what would be an Endurneck profile. Is that the reason these laminates run off the normal alignment of the neck?


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## ormsby guitars (Jul 15, 2014)

Unfortunately, the angled laminates are not the only issue here with the neck. If you would like more details, PM me. After getting neg rep for pointing out what everyone else is now seeing, Im reluctant to assist in the public space.


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## GunnarJames (Jul 16, 2014)

Les said:


> like painting your pickup truck with house paint or something.



Totally off topic, I did this once.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jul 16, 2014)

So apparently I forgot to mention it being an assymetrical neck, I blame the booze loll. Goofy carve that came out seems to have come out great. Had a buddy swing by and check it out. Says it feels and looks amazing. 

Also, when has dead straight string pull ever been a make or break point for headstocks? Tons of guitars don't have dead straight pull and that's never been an issue I've seen get this much attention. Every brand I can think of, maybe with the exception of PRS?, has at least one type of headstock with angled pull. I can't see any issue with this one at all? Its pointy too, I like that? Haven't had an issue with those either aside from almost stabbing a vocalist in the eye on accident... 

And Perry, I didn't neg you...not sure what's up with that.


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## VSK Guitars (Jul 16, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> So apparently I forgot to mention it being an assymetrical neck, I blame the booze loll. Goofy carve that came out seems to have come out great. Had a buddy swing by and check it out. Says it feels and looks amazing.
> 
> Also, when has dead straight string pull ever been a make or break point for headstocks? Tons of guitars don't have dead straight pull and that's never been an issue I've seen get this much attention. Every brand I can think of, maybe with the exception of PRS?, has at least one type of headstock with angled pull. I can't see any issue with this one at all? Its pointy too, I like that? Haven't had an issue with those either aside from almost stabbing a vocalist in the eye on accident...
> 
> And Perry, I didn't neg you...not sure what's up with that.



Among other things, the neck is also asymmetrical on the fretboard side. Look at the top view of the neck blank closely, the outside pieces on both sides are not right. The carve hasn't even started at this point, he just cut the blank wrong, period.

For the headstock, it's not an issue of the string pull being dead straight it's a matter of the strings rubbing on other tuner posts or other strings and looking like there was no planning or craftsmanship involved in the layout and execution.

For an amateur, these things can be chalked up to learning experiences. I honestly can't believe this guy has paying customers at this point, it's not good work at all, not even close


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Jul 16, 2014)

Swirltop said:


> Among other things, the neck is also asymmetrical on the fretboard side. Look at the top view of the neck blank closely, the outside pieces on both sides are not right. The carve hasn't even started at this point, he just cut the blank wrong, period.
> 
> For the headstock, it's not an issue of the string pull being dead straight it's a matter of the strings rubbing on other tuner posts or other strings and looking like there was no planning or craftsmanship involved in the layout and execution.
> 
> For an amateur, these things can be chalked up to learning experiences. I honestly can't believe this guy has paying customers at this point, it's not good work at all, not even close



Addressing everything regarding the neck tonight with him, will keep this updated. 

And that shouldn't be an issue with this one. It's one of those minor things to me that would just require a little extra attention while stringing up the bass. Haven't heard of any issues with that from the guys that have his basses and guitars.


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## VSK Guitars (Jul 16, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Addressing everything regarding the neck tonight with him, will keep this updated.
> 
> And that shouldn't be an issue with this one. It's one of those minor things to me that would just require a little extra attention while stringing up the bass. Haven't heard of any issues with that from the guys that have his basses and guitars.



It doesn't look like your new headstock will be a problem. Whether they are having functional problems with strings running into other strings and tuners or not, it's bad form and looks like a hack job. Not something a paying customer should have to deal with.

Don't fall for any of the asymmetrical carve BS when you talk to this guy. It's not right and needs to be redone. I wouldn't accept it, and I sure as hell wouldn't send one out like that, I'd be embarrassed to accept money for that type of work man...


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## asher (Jul 16, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> So apparently I forgot to mention it being an assymetrical neck, I blame the booze loll. Goofy carve that came out seems to have come out great. Had a buddy swing by and check it out. Says it feels and looks amazing.



That's fine. That's not going to make the laminates look like they're on the booze oil too when viewed straight-on from the back.


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## XxJoshxX (Jul 16, 2014)

Now that I look again, the treble side of the neck isn't even straight. Taking that in to account, There may have been tear out or some other woodworking issue that he attempted to fix that resulted in the uneven laminates. Even if there is some crazy asymmetrical neck profile, the laminates aren't running parallel to the centerline. That Mahogany (I think its mahogany, but im on my phone so im not gonna go back to check) lam on one side runs all the way through the neck, while on the other, it is cut off by the neck taper. I cant think of any structural issues with it being wonky, just an eye sore.
EDIT: I meant jatoba, not mahohany


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## Thrashman (Jul 17, 2014)

ormsby guitars said:


> After getting neg rep for pointing out what everyone else is now seeing..


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Aug 12, 2014)




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## frahmans (Aug 12, 2014)

Good inlay. Upper fret access?


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Aug 12, 2014)

frahmans said:


> Good inlay. Upper fret access?



I have huge hands hahah not worried


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## DredFul (Aug 13, 2014)

The width of that neck  do you have the dimensions? Just wondering is it wider than an eightstring guitar. And I'm also maybe interested in extended range basses


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Aug 13, 2014)

I'll measure it up when it gets here, I can tell you for certain it's a good bit wider than an 8 string guitar. 8s are usually comparable to a 6 string bass


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Oct 22, 2014)

So this monster ships on monday. I should have her by wednesday or so, and then a whole lot of madness will really begin. I know for a fact this bass will hold up and be a solid touring bass for decades to come, so I'm not terribly worried. I won't bore you with my rants so I'll just get on to the pictures. 

I finally found my color!





















I can't get enough of these tops. I absolutely love the green with both of them.
















Final assembly is complete and she comes home soon!






And as far as all the people that don't like the design, or SVS's stock work, or what ever else it is you have to complain about, just know that this bass is done and plays like a wet dream. So as far as your complaints go, this is how I feel




Also, this applies to mostly Shawn's phone, but also this thread lol


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## Neilzord (Oct 23, 2014)

Glad you'll be getting it soon!! If it ships Monday how do you know if it plays like a wet dream yet?! 

Either way I hope it does!

Look forward to seeing a NBD with some nice pictures of it to properly show it off!! I'm interested to see that green finish on some decent pictures!!


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## Churchie777 (Oct 23, 2014)

Your build your taste dude so respect there but damn that stain or paint killed that top


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## asher (Oct 23, 2014)

Churchie777 said:


> Your build your taste dude so respect there but damn that stain or paint killed that top



I'll give the photos the benefit of potato and wait for better shots first.


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## Purelojik (Oct 23, 2014)

im glad youre happy OP but i must say, that green really obscures the figure of those beautiful woods that were there already. i feel like if he took his time and dyed it twice, once to enhance the grain then went with a lighter shade, or then shot tinted topcoats, it'd look spectacular. looking forward to the NGD


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## pondman (Oct 23, 2014)

Hoping for a happy NGD for you DL.
You deserve it


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## BlackMastodon (Oct 24, 2014)

I'm gonna have to agree and say that I would've left the top and back natural but yeah, it's your build your choice. I'll hold my full judgement until I see strings on it and see if it has any actual overhang.


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## Renkenstein (Oct 24, 2014)

Definitely need better photos.


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## Connor (Oct 24, 2014)

Will be nice when you get it and take some decent photos. Gotta agree with the rest of the guys though, either kept it natural or a lighter colour, that awesome grain is hidden now 
Perhaps decent pictures in good light might make it pop more.


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## jwade (Oct 24, 2014)

Took a look at this SVS guys Facebook page. Hands down, the fugliest guitars/basses I've ever seen. I hope you're works out though, really hope you consider having some of that finish sanded back to show the woods a bit better, as those were both really excellent pieces!


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## Erockomania (Oct 25, 2014)

How do you know it plays like a wet dream and how do you know 'for a fact' it will hold up for decades when you don't even have it yet?

Should we go ahead and assume the NGD will be completely biased with a bunch of favorable adjectives? 

I actually do hope this works out for you. It's obvious you REALLY don't want this to end badly and want all of us to be wrong about what we are seeing. I never wish bad on anyone so I hope so too, but it's hard to deny the proof we see in the pictures and past work. Crossing my fingers for you. I also hope you are honest about the NGD if you do one.


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## downburst82 (Nov 3, 2014)

Have you received it yet? I am really interested in seeing some decent pictures of it and hearing your impressions about it once its actually in your hands.


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## Neilzord (Nov 3, 2014)

downburst82 said:


> Have you received it yet? I am really interested in seeing some decent pictures of it and hearing your impressions about it once its actually in your hands.



X2 !!!


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## awesomeaustin (Nov 3, 2014)

My guess is he's either happily playing it, or getting back with SVS to discuss the rebuild.


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## JuliusJahn (Nov 4, 2014)

"Delayed because the string broker screwed up the order. Had to get new strings."

Who buys strings so last minute...


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## JP Universe (Nov 4, 2014)

'And as far as all the people that don't like the design, or SVS's stock work, or what ever else it is you have to complain about, just know that this bass is done and plays like a wet dream. So as far as your complaints go, this is how I feel'







How did I miss this build thread  I was rooting for you in the beginning but&#8230;. ^&#8230;&#8230;. yeah fuck your feelings!!

All I've seen in this thread is people trying to give you advice after your first build with Etherial didn't work out&#8230; 'I hope it works out this time' has been repeated here many times. Why you're so intent on defending everything about this builder and the tone in which you're responding is bizarre&#8230;. it's like defending your best mate that just gets drunk sometimes and does stupid things speech 

'He doesn't care about internet guys'&#8230; I agree with you there looking at how this build is turning out&#8230;.


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## Edika (Nov 4, 2014)

Not wanting to be negative about the OP's build as I haven't paid too much attention to the photos posted but I was wondering why do that thing with the multilaminate and then burl insert, instead of forming the top like that from the beginning. 
Now I will say that showing off the worst builds of your building career instead of the best could be that this guy only wants to build small numbers for specific people. Probably doesn't want to attract too much work. It is extremely hard to believe and statistically improbable but not impossible.

Really hoping your bass kicks ass man!


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## foreright (Nov 4, 2014)

^ Again without wanting to be too negative, I can't believe the inlay and the routing (especially for the truss rod access at the headstock...) was done by the same person. Is he outsourcing the inlay? If not, why is he using a potato instead of a router for the cavities?


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## ElysianGuitars (Nov 4, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


>



That headstock is about 5 broken tuner holes waiting to happen... Very irresponsible design.


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## Pikka Bird (Nov 4, 2014)

^Totally weird layout in many ways. Now, I may not have drilled a whole lot of tuner holes myself, but is there even enough room for the lips on the bushings there?

And as I've posted in here before, taking a bookmatched top and attaching it non-bookmatched is just completely insane.


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## stevexc (Nov 4, 2014)

foreright said:


> ^ Again without wanting to be too negative, I can't believe the inlay and the routing (especially for the truss rod access at the headstock...) was done by the same person. Is he outsourcing the inlay? If not, why is he using a potato instead of a router for the cavities?



In the first post he mentioned someone else was doing the inlay, but I'm not sure if he meant just carving the pearl or actually inlaying it. I'd assume the latter but given how this build is going I'm not gonna make any bets...


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## Necromagnon (Nov 4, 2014)

I think there's almost enough space for the bushings (barely enough for the bottom right one). I'm only concerne about the end of the fretboard, and that the strings might be resting on that part. Not a non-playable mistake, but we reproached it to Etherial so... Also, that headstock decal is... hum... well... not-so-well inlayed/covered by the laquer...


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## Helstormau (Nov 6, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> So this monster ships on monday. I should have her by wednesday or so, and then a whole lot of madness will really begin.





CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> as far as all the people that don't like the design, or SVS's stock work, or what ever else it is you have to complain about, just know that this bass is done and plays like a wet dream


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## Purelojik (Nov 6, 2014)

I was looking at that headstock again and realized they sprayed clear over it. the binding wasnt even scraped flush with the wood! you can see the noticeable bump where the binding is.


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## Stijnson (Nov 6, 2014)

Really hope you don't have a bad case of OCD of wanting to have everything in perfectly straight lines and be symmetrical. 

And I hope you end up getting what you wanted, but in case you decided that you're dissatisfied with the end result, and you can admit that too (which I can imagine might be hard seeing as you defended the luthier alot) be sure to let us know. 

Hope it works out though dude!


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## Renkenstein (Nov 6, 2014)

Purelojik said:


> I was looking at that headstock again and realized they sprayed clear over it. the binding wasnt even scraped flush with the wood! you can see the noticeable bump where the binding is.


 
Holy crap, I didn't even notice that headstock binding on first look. 

That Pennywise meme just emptied this guy's corner.


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## VSK Guitars (Nov 6, 2014)

I really hope it worked out for the OP. 
Since he got burned on one before, he really deserves a good outcome!


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## Qweklain (Nov 6, 2014)

Swirltop said:


> I really hope it worked out for the OP.
> Since he got burned on one before, he really deserves a good outcome!


Gotta say I disagree. Just because you got burned doesn't mean you are entitled to a good outcome the next time. The OP clearly has bad decision skills in his "loothier" choices for a guitar build.

In my opinion, as harsh/dick-ish as it may seem, the OP deserves a bad guitar. Why do I say this? Because he foolishly is putting faith in and defending someone where there is clear proof he has no talent, no developed skills, and is just a hack job. Who doesn't put their best work on the net? The experiments, mistakes, and prototypes are the ones that stay hidden or under wraps.

Yeah yeah, haters gonna hate, but the proof is in the pudding, or in this case the proof is in the many photos of his shoddy work.


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## TemjinStrife (Nov 6, 2014)

My hope was that OP learned from the Etherial debacle.

Unfortunately, he hasn't.


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## VSK Guitars (Nov 6, 2014)

Qweklain said:


> Gotta say I disagree. Just because you got burned doesn't mean you are entitled to a good outcome the next time. The OP clearly has bad decision skills in his "loothier" choices for a guitar build.
> 
> In my opinion, as harsh/dick-ish as it may seem, the OP deserves a bad guitar. Why do I say this? Because he foolishly is putting faith in and defending someone where there is clear proof he has no talent, no developed skills, and is just a hack job. Who doesn't put their best work on the net? The experiments, mistakes, and prototypes are the ones that stay hidden or under wraps.
> 
> Yeah yeah, haters gonna hate, but the proof is in the pudding, or in this case the proof is in the many photos of his shoddy work.



I agree with a lot of what you're saying, but I still hope the dude gets a guitar that plays better than it looks. 

I'm still not convinced the OP isn't the person "building" these "guitars"...


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## Neilzord (Nov 7, 2014)

JUST SHOW ME THE GUITAR ALREADY.


Please


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## jwade (Nov 7, 2014)

Guys, he's probably been tragically impaled on the many absurdly sharp points.



RIP, dude.


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## capoeiraesp (Nov 7, 2014)

There's something seriously wrong here. 

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd....187_934806643214271_5343147865787949606_o.jpg


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## JuliusJahn (Nov 7, 2014)

capoeiraesp said:


> There's something seriously wrong here.
> 
> https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd....187_934806643214271_5343147865787949606_o.jpg









Now wait a tick!

Is the "center" laminate, scarf jointed as well? Unless it's a rogue grain line that decided to wander off 15' (just like the rest of the neck laminates )


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## Necromagnon (Nov 7, 2014)

capoeiraesp said:


> There's something seriously wrong here.
> 
> https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd....187_934806643214271_5343147865787949606_o.jpg


Wait, is that a bass? Anyway, which sane mind would draw something like this?
About the misalignement of the laminates... well... I guess it's one of is special "tricks".


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## Deegatron (Nov 7, 2014)

Im dying to see how this turns out...
if the OP loves it.. good for him... haters gonna hate...
if the OP hates it... good for him... I dont really care... he was warned right from day 1 about the flaws.... at this point in time I just need closure danmit!!!!!


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## wat (Nov 7, 2014)

R.I.P. in peace CaptainLuckeyBeard


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## Oreo-Tan (Nov 7, 2014)

ElysianGuitars said:


> That headstock is about 5 broken tuner holes waiting to happen... Very irresponsible design.



Cutting it close to the ends of the headstock? Because I could see one not-so-light tap on either side of the headstock could do it.


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## kruneh (Nov 7, 2014)

No sympathy.


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## BlackMastodon (Nov 7, 2014)

JuliusJahn said:


> Now wait a tick!
> 
> Is the "center" laminate, scarf jointed as well? Unless it's a rogue grain line that decided to wander off 15' (just like the rest of the neck laminates )


Looks to me like it's a grain line, but this wouldn't surprise me at this point.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Nov 7, 2014)

Still alive, wasn't aware that there was this much attention here. Patience, it ships monday. There's been issues getting strings because the fan is so wide. We've gotten two different sets that were both wrong so hopefully the third time is the charm. To everyone that's being supportive, thank you, you're awesome (cough Pondman  ) To everyone else, go outside for a minute and relax. You'll get your chance to complain about things in due time. Honestly, I'm not concerned with how this is turning out. The headstock is pointy, yeah, so are half the headstocks on guitars I own. Not everyone wants the same EBMM headstock. It's different. That's the point. If I come across any issues with the bass, I've been told numerous times that Shawn will just buy it back from me because he likes it so much. So my end is covered.


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## jonajon91 (Nov 7, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> I've been told numerous times that Shawn will just buy it back from me because he likes it so much. So my end is covered.



That's good news


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Nov 7, 2014)

I'm really curious though. I feel like a lot of this is just bitching to feel important. Now, if one of you feels like you can do this better, point me in the direction of someone that can build this bass "right". It has to be this body with these specs and inlay for under $3k.


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## UC MisteryC (Nov 7, 2014)

> point me in the direction of someone that can build this bass "right"



Onslaught in 3, 2, 1....


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## stevexc (Nov 7, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> for under $3k.



There's your problem. "High-quality" and "cheap" rarely go hand-in-hand.

The reason people have been so up in arms about this build is because there have been major flaws and/or issues, pointed out by random Joes and by professional luthiers, that have been met with defensiveness.

People haven't been telling you about the problems because they want you to feel bad or get upset - they're telling you about them because they don't want to see you make the same mistake twice.

Man, I really hope this bass turns out great for you, and that you don't turn a blind eye to any flaws due to the drama. There's really nothing more than I'd like to see than for all of us to get proven wrong. I just really don't see that happening, and I'm not gonna offer any sympathy when the worst happens. I hope he follows through in buying it back from you, and I hope that you don't gloss over any issues to save face. No one's gonna fault you for admitting you were wrong.


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## Purelojik (Nov 7, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> I'm really curious though. I feel like a lot of this is just bitching to feel important. Now, if one of you feels like you can do this better, point me in the direction of someone that can build this bass "right". It has to be this body with these specs and inlay for under $3k.



I think if you read the criticisms of the thread you'll find that most of them are constructive. I understand that its your build and you like whats going on, but if you post on this forum people will chime in with input. Thats kinda the whole point of this place. People new to the custom world will eventually develop a discerning eye when other's who know better point it out for them. 

As for better people who can make this under 3 k im sorry to say that if you paid anything close to 3 k for this then its pretty bad craftsmanship from the viewpoint of anyone who'd buy this. I understand you have an emotional/financial investment/attachment to this as it is your dream instrument, but its not reason to brush off everyone who's pointed something out as being a 'hater'. if anything its the opposite, we're looking out for other people who have been blinded by the illusion of receiving a high end custom for what appears to be a good price and at a decent speed. The fact remains that there are a lot of builders here on the forum that post in this sub thread that could do a much more clean consistent and aesthetically pleasing job than this luthier (walterson, pondman, TyleRay(i think thats his name) for much less if they decided to take payment. But then again it should never BE about the money in the first place. Its the craft and how it stands up against similar works across the board. 

Im sorry to say that this isn't worth the money you've shelled out. And its not opinion its more or less the lay of the land when you compare it to the other luthiers who design and craft guitars and basses around the same price point. Might sound harsh but the constant blind support of such blatantly shoddy work makes this all the more reason for you to really reflect on the price vs. end product.


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## VSK Guitars (Nov 7, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> I'm really curious though. I feel like a lot of this is just bitching to feel important. Now, if one of you feels like you can do this better, point me in the direction of someone that can build this bass "right". It has to be this body with these specs and inlay for under $3k.



I would have; except I would have really fought with you over the green


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## ElysianGuitars (Nov 7, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> Still alive, wasn't aware that there was this much attention here. Patience, it ships monday. There's been issues getting strings because the fan is so wide. We've gotten two different sets that were both wrong so hopefully the third time is the charm. To everyone that's being supportive, thank you, you're awesome (cough Pondman  ) To everyone else, go outside for a minute and relax. You'll get your chance to complain about things in due time. Honestly, I'm not concerned with how this is turning out. The headstock is pointy, yeah, so are half the headstocks on guitars I own. Not everyone wants the same EBMM headstock. It's different. That's the point. If I come across any issues with the bass, I've been told numerous times that Shawn will just buy it back from me because he likes it so much. So my end is covered.



The only thing I'm saying is there isn't enough meat between the tuners and the edge of the headstock. Any kind of significant bump will wind up breaking the tuner out of the hole. I wouldn't trust a headstock that's designed so poorly, and it's a huge oversight by the builder. The design of the thing doesn't bother me, do what you like, but it needs to be structurally sound.


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## Pikka Bird (Nov 8, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> The headstock is pointy, yeah, so are half the headstocks on guitars I own. Not everyone wants the same EBMM headstock. It's different. That's the point.



See, that's the thing- throughout this entire thread you have been taking many of our points kinda the wrong way. Nobody has said a single word about the pointy nature of the headstock. It's literally only been comments about the tuner layout and how close they are to the edge and to each other.

There are several examples of legitimate quality issues with this build that you've glossed over or just not adressed at all. Granted _some_ of these might not affect playability, but the reckless way he slaps the wood together and seemingly just "measures" most things by simply eyeballing it before cutting just gives me a bad taste in my mouth.

You seem to be a little too blinded by your investment in this to see that everybody has been trying to warn you from the start, and even though most are hoping this will feel and sound awesome we all agree that your guy is a complete and utter hack who should take as long a break from building as your previous luthier should.


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## capoeiraesp (Nov 8, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> I'm really curious though. I feel like a lot of this is just bitching to feel important. Now, if one of you feels like you can do this better, point me in the direction of someone that can build this bass "right". It has to be this body with these specs and inlay for under $3k.





I'll do it!


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## Churchie777 (Nov 9, 2014)

OP buy a BC Rich and stay away from customs


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## TemjinStrife (Nov 10, 2014)

CaptainLuckeyBeard said:


> If I come across any issues with the bass, I've been told numerous times that Shawn will just buy it back from me because he likes it so much. So my end is covered.



Is that a binding, contractual promise?


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## Helstormau (Nov 10, 2014)

Honestly mate, a 7 string multiscale bass with exotic woods done PROPERLY and to a HIGH STANDARD will cost you well over $3000. Under $3000 is just unrealistic as f_u_ck. Why not save that little bit more for something amazing and not settle for something lacklustre or even shit?


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## Qweklain (Nov 12, 2014)

Helstormau said:


> Honestly mate, a 7 string multiscale bass with exotic woods done PROPERLY and to a HIGH STANDARD will cost you well over $3000. Under $3000 is just unrealistic as f_u_ck. Why not save that little bit more for something amazing and not settle for something lacklustre or even shit?


Now I may start a flame-war in and of itself with this statement, but would it cost over 3k because that's what the labor and materials actually are worth/cost, or because at some point one guy did it, offered it for said price, and then others just hopped on the wagon peddling their wares for the same prices? I understand the elements of supply/demand, but think about it...


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## sehnomatic (Nov 12, 2014)

Qweklain said:


> Now I may start a flame-war in and of itself with this statement, but would it cost over 3k because that's what the labor and materials actually are worth/cost, or because at some point one guy did it, offered it for said price, and then others just hopped on the wagon peddling their wares for the same prices? I understand the elements of supply/demand, but think about it...



That's a good question, here's my take:


At $3k we're used to the parameters of options: Bodies X, Y and Z, scales 1, 2, and 3 and woods A, B and C. The luthier can demand $3k and under while maintaining high quality because he/she is likely well jigged up and prepared to build the guitar efficiently, often in batches.

When you begin to look at custom shapes, scales, construction methods; essentially building a one-off build, this is where a lot of money has to go: Time at a CAD or design program ensuring the proportions and distances make sense is spent, new templates have to be made, and things like fret slots may be done by hand because building a new jig for one guitar is pretty much throwing money and shop space away. Most importantly ironing out issues takes much longer because you might be facing unfamiliar wood, finishes, construction methods, or incompatible jigs and tools. That's a lot of money.

That said, this builder may as well be the best woodworker, machinist, painter, and musician on the planet, but price demanded is at $3k because corners have clearly been cut at the planning phase, arguably more vital to guitar building than the building part itself.


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## Helstormau (Nov 12, 2014)

Qweklain said:


> Now I may start a flame-war in and of itself with this statement, but would it cost over 3k because that's what the labor and materials actually are worth/cost, or because at some point one guy did it, offered it for said price, and then others just hopped on the wagon peddling their wares for the same prices? I understand the elements of supply/demand, but think about it...



It would cost over 3k because of the labour involved/materials. A 7 string bass becomes a fair bit more expensive since the woods need to be that bit bigger/longer. Lots of guys havent made 7 string basses so jigs need to be made up, the fret layout will need to be adjusted for extra strings etc.


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## Necromagnon (Nov 13, 2014)

Helstormau said:


> It would cost over 3k because of the labour involved/materials. A 7 string bass becomes a fair bit more expensive since the woods need to be that bit bigger/longer. Lots of guys havent made 7 string basses so jigs need to be made up, the fret layout will need to be adjusted for extra strings etc.


+1
I think it's a whole. The jigs might be slightly different than usual (so understand time to made/modify existant, supply cost, conception, etc.), the woods bigger than most of in-stock ones, hardware rarer thus more expensive, etc.
But beside it, I think you get a point, Qweklain. It's probable that because of rarity of this kinda of build, people will just charge more because there's less offer than demand.Imo, it's a mix of two.


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## Deegatron (Nov 13, 2014)

Just another thing to consider on this front.
Lost shop time.
Let's assume a build like this would take 2x as long as your std run of the mill strat that the luthier already has templates for.
If the luther can make profit on strat style x 2 or custom x 1. you danm well better be making 2 x as much profit on the custom to justify tying up the shop for that length of time especially if you have strat syle customers waiting for you to finish the custom.

there is also the concept of risk. once you have your jigs setup and plans made, you are significantly less likely to make a mistake that will result in a complete rebuild... because you've done all of the steps before and are comfertable with them... throwing away a neck blank and starting freash costs money... and time.. and time is money... so it costs you money and money...


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## JuliusJahn (Nov 16, 2014)

OP shared this on facebook....Dat saddle is hanging on for dear life! 
RIP That figured top.


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## VSK Guitars (Nov 16, 2014)

Ugh... The pickup routes aren't even centered


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## jonajon91 (Nov 16, 2014)

This seems to be turning into a bit of a hate bandwagon, but apart from those (seriously) questionable machine head placements :/ it looks like a pretty decent bass. Just don't go recommending this guy to anyone.


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## Neilzord (Nov 16, 2014)

String spacing on the highest string seems way off! But apart from the flaws, It's a pretty cool looking bass. 

NBD Pics & review!!!!!


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## Purelojik (Nov 16, 2014)

Ugh. Nuts not straight, fretboard taper isn't correct. Pickup routes aren't right. Splotchey dye. Overall it doesn't look as bad as we were expecting judging from this guy's other work. But i truly feel that the green dye was the worst offense.


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## jonajon91 (Nov 16, 2014)

How are you tuning this? Standard fourths from B upwards?


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## stevexc (Nov 16, 2014)

Did the fretboard inlays get screwed up or did you change your mind? Your OP says bass-side on 3-9 and treble-side after 15.

Man, I hope this plays as well as you hope.


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## BlackMastodon (Nov 16, 2014)

Well, at least there is actually some fretboard overhang and the strings aren't literally parallel to the fretboard edge.


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## KnightroExpress (Nov 17, 2014)

Honestly the one thing that bothers me the most about this build is the fact that they picked a bunch of nice figured wood and then drowned it in that green dye.


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## Churchie777 (Nov 25, 2014)

Any updates?


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## Erockomania (Nov 26, 2014)

Some very basic build flaws on there and that is just after seeing a terribly low quality pic. No doubt this thing is a hot mess.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Nov 26, 2014)

Shipped today, NBD, review, pictures, and such to come.


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## jahosy (Nov 27, 2014)

Thought it was shipped one month ago? 

Looking forward to the NBD.


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Dec 2, 2014)

Got it today, I couldn't be more happy with the bass. I'm gonna take a few days to play with it and get comfortable with it before posting a review so I can soak in all the details on this thing.


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## flint757 (Dec 2, 2014)

Congrats brotha. Glad it all worked out for you at the end of the day. As long as you're happy that's all that matters since you'll be the one playing it. 

My only suggestion is don't overlook any faults because you want it to be perfect or out of pride. If you see something wrong with it tell your luthier and either get it fixed or get your money back.


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## Neilzord (Dec 4, 2014)

Bring on the NBD! I want to see some pictures! Hope you're happy with it, Look forward to the review!


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Dec 4, 2014)

I'll probably put one up tonight. I wanted to do a proper photoshoot for it, but I'll probably do that later when I have more time. My phone has a 1080p camera so it'll manage pretty decent pictures. So far the more I play this thing, the more I love it. There are some minor discrepancies that Shawn had no control over that I'll address then too. Everything is exactly where it's supposed to be, structurally it's built like a tank, and the top looks way better in person


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## CaptainLuckeyBeard (Dec 6, 2014)

http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/ba...ed-arrival-death-machine-nbd.html#post4234270


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