Two handed note tapping. Help?

Discussion in 'Music Theory, Lessons & Techniques' started by elkoki, Mar 23, 2018.

  1. elkoki

    elkoki SS.org Regular

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    To anyone who can two hand tap : Are there any decent tutorials or maybe even some tips you guys can give me? I'm not talking about the Van Halen kind of tapping. I'm talking about tapping that involves using both hands. I decided to push myself more when it comes to my guitar playing, i've kind of been stuck on the same level for years and i've become a lazy guitarist. I'm fairly decent with some solo-ish shred stuff, but i'm not great. So I bought an Angel Vivaldi tab book ( insert people laughing at me here ) to try and push my self a little harder. The regular tapping is easy.....But the two handed stuff is just.....

    The problem i'm having is when I tap with my fretting hand I get that string vibration from behind . What tips do you have for that? The thinner strings are much easier to get to sound "clean" but on the thicker strings it sounds too sloppy.

    I'm normally not a "shred" type of guy, so please no anti-shred comments... Just trying to open up my mind and learning to master different styles of playing.
     
  2. Andrew Lloyd Webber

    Andrew Lloyd Webber Super Duper Moduraturr

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    Apologies if this is in any way offbase - Without a demonstration, all I can do is pep talk:

    You may end up finding the problem more mental than anything. I’ve found the upfront effort in bringing the tapping hand’s coordination up to working with the fretting hand easier in students already familiar with fingerpicking and the piano. All I can say is that training a new limb is the same, regardless of it’s another arm or your left leg: Get the hands tapping the notes in-rhythm at a tempo slower than what seems reasonable. By time you’ve practiced the coordination enough to increase the speed, much of the other involved technique will have come together on its own. Then work on cleaning up extraneous noise by slowing it back down to focus on the muting, now that the recitation requires less concentration.

    Concerning the “vibration from behind”: Are you referring to the notes ringing between the tapping fingers and bridge when unplugged, or between the fretted notes and nut?
     
  3. InCasinoOut

    InCasinoOut syncopAZN

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    Don't forget you're at ss.org.... You wont find much anti-shred talk going around here. :rofl:
     
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  4. Dcm81

    Dcm81 SS.org Regular

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    Would a fretwrap help? Not quite sure what you mean with the "string vibration from behind" - or do you mean when practicing unplugged and hammering on?

    The Levitated by Scale the Summit is a good song to practice with as the right hand is pretty straight forward. Maybe also give New Breed by Pomegranate Tiger a shot - the intro and variations of it are reasonably simple so good to get your (usually) picking hand used to tapping and fretting.
     
  5. elkoki

    elkoki SS.org Regular

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    I am referring to the fretted notes and nut, the string vibrates behind my fretting finger when tapping down . I'm not sure if it's coming out of the amp too, but I almost feel like it does slightly.

    and i'm definitely practicing slowly. I more or less have the technique down. The biggest problems I have are the noise from tapping down with the fretting hand behind the finger. and low tapped notes sound unclear. But I think that also has to do with some muddy electronics I have in this current guitar... My main 7 string is at the shop getting a fret level
     
  6. elkoki

    elkoki SS.org Regular

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    A fretwrap would probably help. but it also kind of feels like cheating.

    What I mean by the vibration, I mean the string vibration from the back of the fretting finger to the nut. If you tap hard enough it creates 2 different pitches, 1 from the fret to the bridge, and another from the fret to the nut. It's kind of annoying.
     
  7. CerealKiller

    CerealKiller SS.org Regular

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    A fretwrap isn't cheating. Guthrie uses one, lol. In two-handed tapping there usually is no way to mute the strings behind the fretted note, so use a fretwrap, a scrunchie, a sock, or whatever. It shouldn't go through your amp though.
     
  8. Dcm81

    Dcm81 SS.org Regular

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    Yeah, fretwrap it is then. As CerealKiller pretty much said, you don't have a third hand to mute with once both are tapping ;)
     
  9. ArtHam

    ArtHam SS.org Regular

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    Or you can practice for a long time and actually become good at it without fretwrap:

     
  10. The Mirror

    The Mirror SS.org Regular

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    Or just be TJ Helmerich, which of course includes the first part, but also the addition of being friggin TJ Helmerich.
     
  11. USMarine75

    USMarine75 Doc McStuffins (*Block version, not sig) Contributor

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    It all starts with Jennifer Batten... check out her vids on YT.




    [​IMG]
     
  12. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    Practicing the song Sequoia Throne by Protest the Hero improved my tapping ability quite a lot

     
  13. Xaios

    Xaios Foolish Mortal Contributor

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    I can't really manage it because I'm missing the end of my right-hand middle finger, but the intro to "Heroes of Sand" by Angra seems like a good place to start. It uses all 8 fingers, but it isn't super fast or complicated, so it seems like a good jumping off point. There's videos on Youtube of people playing it, although they practically all deviate from each other for some reason as to how. My recommendation is to just watch the one featuring Kiko Loureiro.
     
  14. Sogradde

    Sogradde SS.org Regular

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    I have nothing constructive to add but everytime I glance over the thread title in this sub forum I read "two handed fapping" and have to re-read it.
     
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  15. InCasinoOut

    InCasinoOut syncopAZN

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    Are you actually practicing tapping through an amp? Unplugged, you will always hear other overtones that tapping brings, but they disappear when you're actually amplified.
     
  16. Matt794

    Matt794 SS.org Regular

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    This is something I've been trying to learn as well (I'm still trash at it though).

    I'll echo what other folks are saying a recommend a fret wrap.

    As far as technique goes, I just run through scales and arpeggios and try to play most of the notes with my right hand and use my left hand for barring, muting, and whatnot.
     
  17. elkoki

    elkoki SS.org Regular

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    practicing through Bias FX at the moment with headphones. I don't want to put people through hearing it through my rig. I also practice lots of tabs unplugged.I should learn to ignore all that excess noise, but it can be distracting.

    So that's all the tips? I assume you know how to double hand tap, any other advice other than something I basically already knew?

    I want to learn how to cleanly tap low notes and not sound so sloppy.
     
  18. InCasinoOut

    InCasinoOut syncopAZN

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    Are you using ample compression too? It can really make tapping sound like night and day, especially with those lower notes that you're struggling with.

    Along with metal, I play a lot of math-rock too, and that genre is absolutely full of two-hand tapping, with open tunings. I'd suggest learning some of that stuff. The open tunings make things a little more forgiving, because it's easy to still stay in key, and all the techniques transfer over to other styles.
     
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  19. nyxzz

    nyxzz SS.org Regular

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    The intro tapping part to the song Dew by Chon helped me get so much better at 2 handed tapping
     
  20. jagraal

    jagraal SS.org Regular

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    If you're just starting to try and get the technique together, one piece of advice would be to keep it simple. I got a little overwhelmed and subsequently shut down (on a lot of things, for that matter) when I tried to take on some big complicated piece of music while still trying to learn a technique. So, for me, a good thing to practice (after all the Van Halen/ Randy Rhoads stuff) was to just go through all of my 3 note per string modal fingerings, but the 3rd note on each string became my RH tap. Up and back.

    Now, the object of the game here is to make sure and keep each note, the LH and the tapped RH notes equal in volume and sound. Sometimes, with a 3 note tapped thing, the RH overpowers the left (or fretboard) hand. If you're doing it right, you'll not hear much difference at all between the notes. It will almost sound entirely like a LH legato thing. Watch the muting, too. Strings will want to ring out like crazy. You can use your left hand first finger to rest against unused strings and some of your right hand palm and forearm.

    That's stage one. When you get on top of that, up things a bit by introducing sequences; simple ones like groups of 4s or 5s or 6s, etc.

    Once i added a few more things to the basic idea, I felt on top of the technique enough to begin to start improvising with it. And that's when the real fun begins. Now the thing is in your hands and it makes larger pieces of music a lot easier to get quickly, too.

    That's really just the smallest tip of the iceberg, there's a metric crapton more to say on it, but it may be a helpful place to begin. Hope it helps.
     
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