The Quest for Max Tone!

Discussion in 'Gear & Equipment' started by youheardme, Mar 2, 2010.

  1. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    hey guys I am on a quest for max tone!

    Preferably a crushing tone for metal.

    My current rig is:
    5150 head
    avatar 2x12 w/ v-30's

    Petals:
    Ns-2
    tu-2

    Guitars:
    MH-400NT
    Ibanez 2570, & 1527 w/ blaze custom & air norton
    Jackson rr 24

    I find the actual eq knobs on the 5150 seem to do very little to effect the tone....
    I've heard a lot of people mention that they pair a ts-9 or a maxxon sonic maximizer with the 5150's distortion to get better tone. (can you run them through the ns-2?)

    I was wondering what you guys had to say about this?.... Or what od/distortion petal should I get to increase the awesomeness of my tone.
    I don't want it to sound like an ice pick to peoples ears but I would like it to cut through the mix a little better. Without maxing out midyyness.

    I find when I play live I have to jack my amp up much louder than my bandmates to actually be able to heard through the mix as i find the 5150 has a lot more of a lower frequency.

    I prefer not to run anything through the effects loop as i've had problems with it in the past causing the amp to cut out.


    Let me know what you guys think or even examples of what rig's you guys have that blow people away.

    - J
     
  2. StupidDav

    StupidDav SS.org Regular

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    Really? I find when I'm jamming with my band my 6505 cuts through nearly anything my other guitarist's Marshall TSL can dish up :scratch:

    Well about a week after I bought my 6505 I bought a Boss SD-1 and put it in front with the level maxed, drive on 0 and adjust the tone to taste and it absolutely sang, tightened up the low end, added a lil bit of saturation for solos and stuff. Since then I've modded it which wasn't too hard but made it much better IMO.

    So I'd start with an SD-1, or a Tubescreamer as theres not much difference in the circuits.

    What are your settings? I agree that the EQ on the amps isn't particularly responsive, except the Resonance and Presence. I've got mine on
    Pregain=3 Low=3 Mids=5.5 High=6 Resonance=5 Presence=6

    Possibly get a retube if its been a while since they've been changed, but someone with more knowledge will have to talk about that.
     
  3. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    I retubbed recently...
    Pre gain=5-6 (depending on the guitar), Low=4 Mids=5 High=6 Resonance=5 Presence=2

    I find it has the power to overpower others with volume but the tone is still not as chunky as I would prefer. More on the low side.

    My bandmates are using:
    mesa 2x12 ... w/dual rec

    peavey bandit w/ line 6 uber metal
     
  4. 155

    155 SS.org Regular

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    the 6505 will cut through anything your settings are screwy?
     
  5. StupidDav

    StupidDav SS.org Regular

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    Yeh if you're finding the tone a bit bassy then an overdrive like a tubescreamer will tighten that up which will make your tone punchier. I personally would raise the presence a bit, it might add some fizz when you're playing solo but helps it cut through in a band situation.
     
  6. Necky379

    Necky379 SS.org Regular

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    raise your pres to around 5-6. buy a quality od, i recommend the mxr gt-od. i'd say after you get the od raise your lows to 5 or higher but no more than 7, but it's up to your ears. what brand tubes did you use? a tung-sol in the v1 spot will do wonders. if you want to take things a step farther get it bias modded.
     
  7. groph

    groph SS.org Regular

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    well the gear you have now is easily capable of crushing metal tones.

    Try out an overdrive pedal like an Ibanez TS-9 or a Maxon OD-808. Run the gain REALLY low on the 5150, like at 2, and set the pedal at zero gain (or not much), max level (or almost max), tone to taste. That's usually how overdrives are set up to provide a low end tightening type of tone.

    Crank the mids on that amp and watch the treble and presence. I hate to sit here and tell you how to dial in your amp, but from experience, I've heard numerous terrible tones from 5150's, all fizzy because the guy ran the treble/presence too high. The best tones I've ever heard live were also from 5150's, and the mids were cranked, you could just hear that they were. I can agree about the 5150 not having a super sensitive EQ, but just be careful with the high end controls like I said.

    If in doubt, try the 666 setting. Lows, mid, and treble all at 6.

    Sonic Maximizers are made by BBE, and they're controversial. I've never tried one but they apparently add more low and high end to your tone, and guitars do not generally need more highs and lows. The result is bit of a scooped sound, and nine times out of ten, scooped guitar tones don't sound good live/can't cut through a mix.

    Where in Nova Scotia are you from?
     
  8. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    My 5150 does have the bias mod but was not re-adjusted since i re-tubbed.

    I re-tubed pre and power amp tubes with groove tubes.


    Yeah like you guys are mentioning i'm really looking for is just to tighten up the low end .. But not so much that it's peircing.

    I was jamming last night with the band and found that adding more presence or resonance just kind of adds noise/fuzzyness...




    Origionally from Amherst but Rockin Halifax now.



    Anyone else have any opinions on the differences between the TS-9 or a Maxon OD-808?
    Or anything else that might be an option?
     
  9. budda

    budda Guiterrorizer Contributor

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    I'd grab a used OD808, or a used TS7 and mod it to TS808 specs :yesway:.

    Trusted peavey settings:
    EQ at 6, resonance and presence at 5, boost it, pre-gain at 4, post gain to taste. If anything, have more mids than treble and presence. Also, do you have stock pickups on that 1527?
     
  10. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    nope

    1527 w/ blaze custom(bridge) air norton (neck)
     
  11. 7 Dying Trees

    7 Dying Trees Forum MVP

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    If it's bias modded, you should get the bias readjusted with new tubes, so definately do that

    Secondly: tubescreamer! get a ts-808 (keeley modded if you can) or the maxxon etc. use it as a clean boost and that should do wonders, also, when you get a tubescreamer, try adding dirt (distrotion) on it, bring the level down a bit, and slam it into the crunch channel, whcih gives a really biting aggressive rhythm sound, is awesome, I think I kind of prefer it to the lead channel a little bit!
     
  12. Ishan

    Ishan Giant Fridge Magnet Contributor

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    For the TS type pedal I'd get an Hardwire CM-2 Tube Overdrive as it's relatively cheap, true bypass, switchable between TS9 and TS808, and got a treble/bass 2 pots EQ control.
     
  13. HamBungler

    HamBungler Lord Zorgatron

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    With the NS-2 you can use that both through the loop and in front at the same time I THINK (that's what the loop on the pedal was for I was thinking) so you should hook that through both to get the best out of it. You'll have the OD that you end up getting after the NS2 going from the Out on the OD to the In on the NS.

    The OD should give you a good bit of tightness which will give you a chunkier overall sound I'd reckon. Also, you could put an EQ in the loop (I'd stay away from the BBE personally) and that'll give you a bit more control over your sound as well.
     
  14. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    I've never actually used the loop on the ns-2 so i'm kind of confused on how it works.
    Is this picture somewhat right? or am i way off?
     
  15. HamBungler

    HamBungler Lord Zorgatron

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    No, you'd hook the loop up to the FX loop on your amp and any effects after in the "new" loop system on the pedal, hooking the last pedal in the chain back to the return on the amp. So it would be Send (pedal) > Send (amp) and then put your EQ and modulation effects after the return on the pedal and run that to the Return on the amp after the chain is finished. On the In/Out side run the Out to the amp and then put your OD after the Input on the pedal and then OD>Guitar.
     
  16. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    Hmm,

    If I just throw the OD petal in my petal chain would I have the same results for tone?
    I would like to avoid using the fx loop on my amp since i've had problems with it before.
    I used to have an lpb1 in the loop and i would use the peavey footswitch to activate that for a boost for solos...but after using that for awhile it would just cause my amp to cut out...or stop working completley... I dont know if it was just the jacks getting dirty or just because the amp is from like 93 or 94... Either way i have some elecronic contact cleaner that I use to clean it before shows and what not...
    Last thing I want is my amp crapping out on me before a show
     
  17. HamBungler

    HamBungler Lord Zorgatron

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    I'm not sure why using the effects loop would cause the amp to crap out, and if that's a problem I'd invest in getting the amp back in shape before doing anything else. The FX loop is there for a reason; to throw mod/eq effects in there so they sound their best. The reason you have the loop on the pedal is to reduce noise at both the preamp and power amp stages to get the best noise reduction possible.

    So in short, if you're just going in the front of an amp with the NS and an OD after that you should be fine but you wouldn't be gaining the full benefit of the NS-2. What I would do though is get the FX loop checked out on your amp so you can use that, then go with the previous method I suggested. Also, I just checked the LPB1 (EHX Linear Power Booster) and you probably should have used that in front of the amp instead of in the loop like you had. I don't think that damaged anything but you get the best results from using it up front, hell you could use that as a boost if you'd like but it wouldn't have the same effect of the OD.
     
  18. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    I think i'm going to go with the maxon OD808... Since a lot of great players use them... Devy... Buz....

    Whats the difference between the maxon od808 and the maxon od-9?
     
  19. HamBungler

    HamBungler Lord Zorgatron

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    ^ Doesn't look like there's much difference. It would be like comparing a TS7 to the TS808 I'd guess, but the 808 is usually a staple in ODs so I'd go with that honestly.
     
    youheardme likes this.
  20. youheardme

    youheardme Feelin' Groovy

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    Picked up a maxon-od808 on saturday. After I jam tuesday i'll let you guys know how it turned out.
     

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