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Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by highlordmugfug, May 1, 2011.
I think it was handled fine. Pakistan could, I dunno, maybe pay more attention to what terrorists are doing in their borders. With friends like them, who needs enemies?
IMO, that's the only thing that actually seems a bit suspicious about this entire thing.
Yeah, that's a real head scratcher. Maybe we should find out what Pakistani officials have made some extra money lately. Perhaps from not paying attention to certain little things...
I wrote a huge paragraph but honestly I can't be fucked. Second guessing these professionals when it is proven we don't know quite what has happened yet is frankly naive. You don't all have the intel or military experience to judge how this situation should've been handled. It's pointless. Move on.
BUT I POST ON THE INTERNET SO I KNOW BETTER THAN SEAL TEAM 6 OPERATORS!
I don't care what happened, the bastard's dead. Bottom line is that Pakistan should STFU about it.....simply put, they were harboring an international fugitive/terrorist and I seriously doubt they didn't know about it...they're just trying to save face in front of others probably still in the country.
Special forces teams in all branches of the military have their orders and ROE to follow with one complete objective: success. I've been deployed into combat (Bosnia) and can tell you that ROE can and will escalate out of order....that's why they exist in the first place. No, I wasn't SEAL nor Army SF, but still know how ROE functions and have seen them skip the "shout at them then fire warning shot" part and go direct "red & free" on the weapons in an instant (which is scary with Apaches overhead & M1 next to you).
As for the innocent people shot...casualty of war and in small numbers. How many died inside of the WTC? As for him being unarmed, pretty sure no one during 9/11 was armed outside of people carrying his orders. Pakistan shouldn't of harbored him, and the world should stop sniveling about his death.
I'm pretty sure Pakistan authorities were paid off so America/Obama could get the glory. Thats as far as my conspiracy theory stretches and I think it's a pretty reasonable one.
Oh how people forget:
Pakistan releases Taliban leader, signs peace deal with outlawed Taliban group - The Long War Journal
Pakistan releases Abdul Qadeer Khan, 'father' of nuclear bomb, from house arrest | World news | guardian.co.uk
Zakir: Why Does Pakistan Release Taliban Leaders? - Newsweek
Pakistan: U.S. not hunting bin Laden on its turf - World news - South and Central Asia - Pakistan - msnbc.com
Amid U.S. Policy Disputes, Qaeda Grows in Pakistan - NYTimes.com
Eyewitness Testimony and Memory: Human Memory is Unreliable and so is Eyewitness Testimony
Memories are unreliable, doesn't matter if you are a SEAL. SEALs are trained in the art of war, not the art of remembering minutia. You seem to operate under the assumption that those who work in the top tiers of government are infallible, or inhuman, which absolutely not the case.
Anyone want to take a stab at answering this?
I thought it was fairly obvious for a long time that Pakistan was playing both sides.
I think they did watch some of it, but there was a blackout and so they didn't see a lot of what happened for 20-25 minutes. That image doesn't show the screen so they might have been waiting for a visual.
Sorry people, but as I am an armchair general, you are armchair international experts.
The way it was handled is wrong, and it will stay wrong.
I am not happy for his dead, I would prefer him alive, paying the dues and giving the right info. Now he is in Martyr level, and we can't even know what he did, who he knows, how he handled all this.
It was handled wrong because you just can't go to a foreign land and kill people. not just Osama, but other innocent people. If you think it is legal or at least acceptable, you need some serious education!
This is not how you "bring" democracy to others, nor it is to show what "peace, freedom and justice" is.
Obama made a big mistake, I thought he might be the new sparkle, but I was wrong.
EDIT - Fuck it.
I don't think he's wrong for going in anD killing Bin Laden. You might as well say that a child rapist is wrong for committing his deeds, but that the FBI has no right to storm into his house and take him into custody. Who cares if dude was in another country? That point is weightless.
They were playing black ops on the 360.
To answer all the questions regarding wrong info given in the week post-incident.
I have $20 on it that 90% of the problem has been uninformed, or under-informed officials wanting to feel important and "with the 'in' crowd".
During Obama's address to the nation he SPECIFICALLY said only very VERY few people knew what was going down. I'm guessing somewhere on the 4-5 people IN TOTAL. Across the world. Some others knew parts, bits and pieces that they needed to know to do the job. I'm willing to bet even the SEAL team didn't have 100% operational knowledge until it was mission go and they were in the air. Much less multitudes of gov't officials and lackys.
So what you wind up with is a bunch of people who don't want to look "out of the loop" so they gather what bits and pieces they can and head to the media with it. All the media wants is people watching and to say "you heard it here first!" so you get a TON of news people reporting on any and all news "shotgun style" until someone hits on the right facts.
Also, i bet we won't get too much info until years and years from now. I don't think we're done, and given the intel held inside that compound i think this type of operation will be occurring frequently over the next few weeks. To keep our guys safe, i'm sure the flurry of wrong info isn't a bad thing really. What ever we can do to keep the tactics and "next moves" off the air is a good thing. You'd be surprised what a bad intentioned terrorist can figure out by watching our news.
Also, for the guys talking about "police can subdue a guy...." well. You are correct sir. Absolutely.
But we aren't talking about police, we're talking about SEALs and military special forces. They aren't supposed to use "police" tactics. They are a weapon designed and trained to kill. I'm not saying that's a plus or minus either way, its just reality. A sad reality of war.
For my money, the only thing i want to know is...."whats the REAL word on that Helo. What was it?"
I guess I'm an "asshole" For not second guessing everything trained, elite soldiers do in the field. Next time, sign your rep.
Anyway, yes, I believe Pakistan are doing their best to play both sides here. They put on a good show, but anyone with half a brain could see through it. Cut their aid money and watch them panic for a while.