On time when recording, off time on playback?

Discussion in 'Recording Studio' started by will_shred, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. will_shred

    will_shred not that good.

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    Every time I try to record a very simple guitar riff for a demo I'm making, I use a click track over the drums and when I'm recording, it sounds like I'm playing it dead on. But every time I play it back its just maybe 1/4 second or less off time, but its really noticeable. I'm %75 sure that its not me, my sense of time is pretty good and I'm no stranger to practicing with a click track. If its not me, what else could it be?
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
  2. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Sounds like maybe a driver issue to me. What's your sound card, and how do you have the drivers set up? Are you monitoring back as you record? You should be using the Asio driver that came with the card, or maybe asio4all or something like that. My understanding is that Reaper is supposed to compensate for latency, and you shouldn't be able to really hear a difference (except when you're live monitoring). If I'm monitoring as I record, I'll setup my sound card (a Tascam us1641) to run in it's lowest latency mode so that I can play in time- but otherwise, I'll put it into the higher latency mode while mixing, since it doesn't matter as much at that point.
     
  3. MrYakob

    MrYakob SS.org Regular

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    Which DAW are you using? I sometimes have this issue with Logic and turning on the "Low Latency Mode" option fixes it right up, not sure if that is available in other DAWs.
     
  4. duffbeer33

    duffbeer33 ..working on my mix Contributor

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    Could be latency, could be your playing. Are you used to recording with a click, as opposed to just practicing with one? I recommend trying a different recording device (e.g. a cell phone) and record yourself playing a guitar with a click in the background. When you play it back, you will know for sure whether it is your timing. Otherwise check out your latency settings. I think I had some issues with Reaper latency when I started as well.
     
  5. will_shred

    will_shred not that good.

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    I'm using Reaper, my interface is an Antelope Zen Studio, using the default ASIO driver.
     
  6. JohnIce

    JohnIce Singlecoils = tr00

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    Off the top of my head:

    - Buffer size in your audio settings is too high
    - There are plugins in your project that use delay compensation. If there's a limiter on your master bus, then your entire playback is delayed so if you record then, you're recording onto the delayed audio. I've made this mistake more times than I want to admit.
     
  7. will_shred

    will_shred not that good.

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    I'll check the buffer size, I generally set it to ultra high because I assumed it wouldn't make a difference because "oh my I7 can handle anything". I actually just fixed some latency problems I was having due to having a massive EQ on my master bus when trying to monitor :lol:. I'm sticking to basic RE-Q and IVGI compresser for recording tones.
     
  8. JohnIce

    JohnIce Singlecoils = tr00

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    Maybe it's just a typo, but your buffer size should be as low as possible, not high. The higher your buffer size, the more of a "head start" you give your CPU to process the audio, which is what latency is. So the higher your buffer size, the more latency you get. It doesn't change depending on how powerful your CPU is, having a high buffer size with an i7 is just a waste of a good processor, you still get the same latency regardless.
     
  9. Syphon

    Syphon SS.org Regular

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    Make sure all plugins on the master channel are off as well.
     
  10. FIXXXER

    FIXXXER ¯\(°_o)/¯

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    this might be the source of the problem. the ASIO driver should not be "default" it should be referring to your hardware,
    is there any other option like "Antelope ZEN ASIO" or something similar? if so chose this one. The Antelope Zen Studio should work
    perfectly as it seems like a high quality unit to me.

    also the higher the buffer size the more latency you'll get, my RME interface does
    run at 32 samples which is insanely low, however anything unter 256 samples should
    not result in any noticeable latency. setting the buffer to 1024 or 2048 samples will logically increase the latency immensely.
     
  11. Descent

    Descent SS.org Regular

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    To check if you are on time you can play the drums and play along to it, record on your mobile phone or some other room mic device. Might even engage clicktrack to be 100% certain. If the sound in the room is not off, most likely you have some kind of latency lag that is destroying your timing. See if you interface doesn't have an input monitoring vs playback monitoring, like say the PreSonus Audiobox. All current interfaces usually have something like that where you can monitor the direct dry signal coming in.
     
  12. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    ^ +1. This sounds like the issue to me. As I had mentioned before, I use the lowest latency mode (smallest buffer) I can get away with when tracking (so that I can monitor back while playing without the latency throwing me off too much), but then during mixing, I add a bit more to the buffers so that I'm less likely to get weird dropouts.
     
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  13. will_shred

    will_shred not that good.

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    I"ll give that a shot! before it was set to ultra high, so i'll set it to normal or low. Should I also do this when i'm tracking real drums?
     
  14. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Probably. You should drop it to the lowest you can get without dropouts whenever you're recording something and monitoring back at the same time. If all you hear is the click, Reaper should (I think) compensate for the latency. But if you record anything direct on top of that, where you need to hear the monitoring back as you play, the latency is going to trip you up. If you have a "low latency" option, you should be using that.
     
  15. will_shred

    will_shred not that good.

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    Set the buffering to "below normal" and I got the recording on time... now its an issue of double tracking on time :lol: so maybe it was part the buffer size and part my shitty playing. "how the hell do you play clean enough for recording" is another topic entirely. There's no better way to smash your ego than listen to your recording vs how you thought you sounded.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2017
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  16. eaeolian

    eaeolian Pictures of guitars I don't even own anymore! Super Moderator

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    This may be the truest thing ever said on this forum. :lol:

    Sounds like you have the computer issue fixed, though. :yesway:
     
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  17. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    The good news is over time it makes you a better player. :lol:

    But yeah, higher buffering is useful on mixdown when you're throwing a lot of tracks and FX instances at your machine, but while tracking, you want it set pretty low, as low as you can get away without dropouts.
     
  18. duffbeer33

    duffbeer33 ..working on my mix Contributor

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    Could not agree more. I think I remember a recent video of bulb talking about this very thing. He explained how you really need to record yourself playing to a metronome, because it doesn't lie. Practicing to one just isn't enough. It is probably the best way to tighten up your playing quickly.
     
  19. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    Both for your timing, but also for phrasing, note choice, etc. When I first started recording I found I tended to overuse certain licks and lines, and tended to alwayys resolve to the tonic root rather than notes more reflective of the actual chords I was over. You start to find flaws in your own playing, and, hopefully, fix them.
     
  20. JohnIce

    JohnIce Singlecoils = tr00

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    For tracking in general, yes. Vocals and midi too. Buffer size is really just a function to help your CPU tackle more demanding processes by introducing latency, but recording audio isn't a very demanding task at all, especially not with an i7. Plugins and VST instruments are what really challenges your CPU, but again, with an i7 you're very well equipped for that and should be able to run a very low buffer size anyway. i7's really are the bomb. Remember, you can always raise the buffer size later into the mix if your computer starts having trouble, in fact most people do this at some point to be able to finish a mix.

    By the way, I don't know how common it is to get "System Overload" in Reaper, but that's a result of setting the buffer size too high. So if that ever becomes an issue for you, you know what that comes from too.
     
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