New Dem Add-Funny but sad

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Dive-Baum, Aug 1, 2006.

  1. Metal Ken

    Metal Ken Hates the Air Contributor

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    Fuck if i know. But the one thats really striking the dude who drew that up really quick didnt bother to compare is Mithra, he's almost exactly like Jesus. I also wonder why no one else mentions Prometheus as a 'savior' type often either.


    Edit:
    Wikipedia to the rescue:

    The 18th-century Druidic revivalist Iolo Morgannwg identified Esus with Jesus on the strength of the similarity of their names. He also linked them both with Hu Gadarn, writing:

    "Both Hu and HUON were no doubt originally identical with the HEUS of Lactantius, and the HESUS of Lucan, described as gods of the Gauls. The similarity of the last name to IESU [Welsh: Jesus] is obvious and striking."[3]

    This identification is still made in certain Neo-Druidic circles. Modern scholars consider the resemblance between the names Esus and Jesus to be coincidental.
     
  2. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    Well, because in the strictest sense, he wasn't. Literally, yes, he died to redeem mankind, but it wasn't from anything as abstract as sin. Unless there's a part of the story I'm missing, Prometheus was condemned to eternal damnation (or the equivalent of his day, being chained to a mountain and having two eagles pick at his liver for the rest of time) for giving fire to mankind, allowing them to stay warm in the winter, cook their meat, and eventually make refined metal weapons. The gods had denied mankind fire in that they considered it a threat, but Prometheus identified with mankind more than the average elder (pre-Zeus) god did and eventually took pity on them. He sacrified himself for their earthly, not heavenly, comfort.

    Of course, Prometheus as a very early precursor to a Jesus-type figure I'd totally buy - if nothing else, as this is a VERY old myth, it works if you take it as a simple metaphor for the greater abstraction that would follow - replace "fire" with the redemption of god's love, for example.
     
  3. Metal Ken

    Metal Ken Hates the Air Contributor

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    Yeah, thats kinda what i was getting at.

    Check out the wiki on Mithras:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraism

    Similarities to Christianity section.

    Edit: LOL @ how far from the original topic this thread has gotten.
     
  4. Vince

    Vince Contributor

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    [action=desertdweller]raises his hand, "my fault." :D[/action]
     
  5. Leon

    Leon {##[====:::. Contributor

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    a far more interesting direction, IMHO.
     
  6. Vince

    Vince Contributor

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    two different dollar amounts. The surplus/debt is a reported yearly analysis. The trillions of dollars of national debt is accrued over time. When there's a report of a surplus (and there hasn't been since Clinton was in office), that means that for that fiscal year, the government ended up in the black instead of the red.

    Of course, with the end of 'tax & spend liberalism' and the beginning of the neo-conservative 'don't tax & spend 100 times more' philosophy, we're not going to see a surplus anytime soon. The budget is unbelievably fucked up right now. How you can cut taxes in a time of war? Unfuckingbelievable! :scream2:

    we won't see this anytime soon...

    [​IMG]

    What I think is most fascinating, if I remember this correctly, is that the letters of paul to the romans and the letters of paul to the corinthians did not appear until constantine's rule. There is no evidence to say they weren't fabricated. My honest opinion is that Constantine thought he could gain power & unify Rome (which had not been doing well for awhile) by ordering a strong, centralized national religion. One God rule, no more praying to various gods. Taking ideas from the jews (old testament) & pagans (rising from the dead) and using it against them. The Jews killed your savior, run them back to israel. That kind of thing.

    It's interesting because none of us will ever really know what happened, but you can deduce that religion was used for social control because of how powerful it's grip on masses of people can be. Nothing unifies like a common belief. Nothing's more dangerous than people who will die for their beliefs. I think Constantine recognized this & used it to his advantage.
     

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  7. Metal Ken

    Metal Ken Hates the Air Contributor

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    I know, i get that. Well, yeah, so i make more than i spend in any given month, but im still in debt. that doesnt mean my finances are in the read..it means... i'm still in debt :D I guess thats what im getting at.

    Going back to "constantine making christianity up" like we were discussing earlier-- Constantine wasnt around till, what the 300s?
    Didnt Nero slaughter Christians en masse around 55-65 AD?
     
  8. Vince

    Vince Contributor

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    There's definitely evidence of christianity before constantine, it
    s not the same though, it just doesn't appear to be very organized. More cultish, imo. Constantine centralized it & used it as a national religion for Rome.
     
  9. Metal Ken

    Metal Ken Hates the Air Contributor

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    Ah, i get what you're saying then. Back in 'christain school' that i used to go to (5th-7th grde), they made a huge deal about how awesome the martyrs were. and that we should be so lucky to be in a situation they were in lol
     
  10. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    That goes a LONG way to explaining you, Ken. :lol:

    Vince, I agree. The Roman Empire had exactly the influence you'd expect a large empire would on the Christian religion - centralized it, and gave it teeth.
     
  11. Dive-Baum

    Dive-Baum Bite Me Fan Boy!!

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    Wow did this thread go in a strange direction. To coment on the Constantine discussion....Of course there was evidence of Christianity before Constantine. What he is credited for is using the religous symbol (the cross) as a unifying gesture. He had his soldiers paint white crosses on their shields the night before a battle. He was very skilled at merging Christianity (which at that time was little more than a cult) and other Pagan type religions into one. Why do you think Christmas is December 25th?? Do you really think that was his birthday? It coincides with a Pagan holiday and merged the 2 into one. I do believe that the resurection story is older than the time of Constantine though. Could be wrong but I don't think I am. Listen to me...A Jew is telling everyone about the birth of Christianity as a major religion. :lol: I just know a few things about Constantine because he is the patron Saint of my Fraternity from college. We had to learn quite a bit about him in pledge class.

    EDIT AFTER READING MORE: Desertdweller...pretty harsh stance there. I don't even think that about Constantine. Even Jews aknowledge the existance of Jesus. We just don't believe he was the messiah. Besides.Rome didn't have anything personal against the Jews. We were just like any other soverign nation...in the Romans way for world domination. I was in Israel about 10 years ago and went to Masada. Very powerful moment for me. I overheard someone sayin "Damn Romans" and I said "it wasn't personal" that is until the uprising against them...but that didn't go so well...ie: the importance of Massada. But Romans just thought they should run the show..it didn't matter who you were.
     
  12. Metal Ken

    Metal Ken Hates the Air Contributor

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    No, there's NO new ideas in christianity. Even the dates are copied. The resurrection story is older than the story of jesus.
    Also, look at the similarities between Horus & jesus:
    http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jcpa5.htm
    But be warned!
    See? THe devil knew jesus was coming, so he made up all that stuff beforehand to confuse us.

    Anyway, about constantine, the cross was used for a while before that, too. just not on shields of the roman army.. becuase.... 200 years before that, the roman army.. kinda killed christians..

    I also used to acknowledge a historical jesus, like a lot of religions do, but there doesnt even seem to be any evidence for him aside from the bible itself. Records of history in that time speak nothing of him. And even if there was the whole 'second coming' thing was supposed to happen within the lives of his disciples... but... it didn't... heh..


    Drew - Yeah. I actually liked reading the books about the martyrs though cause it explained in detail how they died. The teacher told me that "Those men were lucky enough to have their faith put to the test that way, and they were lucky cause they didnt have to live on the earth for very long before going to see jesus". i was thinking "Jeez, i woulda just been like 'yeah, hail zeus, whatever' and just made them let me go then kept going to church."
     
  13. Vince

    Vince Contributor

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    Right. But it's my educated opinion, and if that's a little harsh or not what you believe, so be it.
     
  14. Dive-Baum

    Dive-Baum Bite Me Fan Boy!!

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    Wasn't knocking it...or really disputing it. I have faith and am spiritual but I also believe that everyone can believe whatever they want to as I don't think that anyone has it right. Like I said..the man had no bearing on my faith in the slightest bit...easy there fella..
     

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