Martial Arts

Discussion in 'Lifestyle, Health, Fitness & Food' started by theo, Feb 14, 2013.

  1. yellow

    yellow Banned

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    don't mean to answer for him man, but after he said ninpo, he posted to explain more to say he doesn't actually study/train/learn the art himself at a school. his friends are practitioners and they taught him what they learn, at least that's what I think he meant.
     
  2. ghostred7

    ghostred7 Banned

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    Anyone have any good recommendations in the Atlanta area?

    Also, in regards to someone telling you that 'x' martial arts is the best....my philosophy is this:

    IMO, there is no best, only "best for me."

    Everyone's mind and body differ so the individual styles will fit each individual differently. That's why you so often find adults, while dedicated to training in an art, hop from dojo/dojang/etc so frequently...the style may not work best for them.

    While MMA definitely has real-world applications, and lets agree that it does (if it didn't, JKD would of never have been invented), a lot of martial artists I know in the US prefer to take a pure or at least a mixture of pure ARTS. There is definitely a more cohesive spirit to the arts than there is in MMA gyms. Again, I will never slam MMA b/c for fitness and overall defensive techniques, it definitely has its place in the world and to call it "not self-defense" I would say is wrong, especially after seeing the results of someone defending themselves using what they learned in a MMA gym.

    Yes, there are plenty of schools in the US that you can still get the "full benefit" of the arts. Be it Aikikai, Tai Chi, Aikido, Shinkendo, Aikijutsu, etc....there are still plenty. It is sad that a lot of the traditional schools are either giving way to MMA gyms or to the "corporate Karate" schools like Joe Corley, "The Dojo," etc. These are good for children...but as an adult that also likes the Martial Spirit as well as the Martial Art, makes it more difficult to find a "home."
     
  3. mcleanab

    mcleanab Theta Sagan Swords

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    I think Sifu Francis Fong is still in Duluth, GA? Some serious Wing Chun and probably a bunch of Kali/JKD as well. I don't know if that's the type of martial art you are looking for, but I've never heard a bad word about Sifu Fong. It's worth looking into...


     
  4. Estilo

    Estilo SS.org Regular

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    Hmm.. why don't you try your luck with MMA then?

    It's funny how some *edit* some of the UFC *edit* guys are actually trained in the "old-school" forms but almost always stick to Muay Thai, BJJ and good old wrestling.

    Also there are documentations of how old-style martial artists doing superhuman stuff, like being able to harden their bodies so they knives can't get through their flesh, or an old man standing his ground being pushed by 10 younger, bigger men, but you don't see none of these in MMA. Is it because they abhor and despise MMA to an extent they see no point in proving their worth in it, or because their skills are useless in a brawl-like setting?
     
  5. thedonal

    thedonal SS.org Regular

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    Nice to see all this talk of martial arts and some depth to it too.

    I agree that there is no best style for everyone, but a best for each of us.

    I practiced southern Shaolin kung fu (tiger and crane combination- Nam Yang Pugilistic Association in the UK) for 8 years. I stopped the classes a couple of years ago after a bike crash- not from injuries but more from financial and travel circumstances. Though when I do start exercising again, I work through my forms (trying to remember them!) And the sword and staff forms I learned. Though practicing forms without instruction can lead to bad habits, it's amazing how natural it feels and now much is still with me.

    I've just starred running and exercise again after a year and its amazing how flexible I'm not these days (age 40 compared to 30!). My Sum Chen form is still there-though it's going to take my body a few weeks to fit back into it again!

    The other thing that's missing with solo practice is interaction- pushing hands and sticking hands practice for example. While am more interested in the pure art and self developement, its when you practice application that you really start improving..

    I will get back there once I get a car and a rise... (Ok the car will probably follow the Payrise!). It's something, like music, that once in my life, will always be..
     
  6. Choop

    Choop n______n

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    I used to practice Isshin-Ryu for a good while, and tbh I really miss it..but the school/dojo closed due to the dan who ran it having arthritis complications.

    It's a really neat style. Very simple with emphasis on short, efficient motions.. at least for the most part (save for some of the kata).
     
  7. capoeiraesp

    capoeiraesp Ormsby nutter

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    It's interesting seeing how prominent Karate is around here, it was also the first martial art I did as a kid.
    My martial arts history
    10-13 years old - Karate
    14-18 off the rails on the swayze express
    18-27 capoeira - this has done a tremendous amount of good in my life
    23-26 Tai Chi
    Currently I've been training boxing and muay thai just to round out my skills a bit
     
  8. thedonal

    thedonal SS.org Regular

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    Karate does seem have been the more prevalent art in the west from an earlier time(judging by amount of mention). I think that it may have been the first to be widely taught, whereas some of the deeper kung-fu styles (white crane, for example- though that came to the west via Okinawan karate to a degree) were held back from westerners for longer.

    Bigger kicking styles are more impressive to watch than more internal styles or short range styles (ie like southern kung fu styles), which may appear more attractive to kids etc.

    I actually started with Tae-Kwon Do at the age of 14. The class closed, so I stopped for a year or two, did Chines Boxing for about 18 months then nothing for over a decade (discovered beer and guitars!! :)).
     
  9. ghostred7

    ghostred7 Banned

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    Ya, I think Sifu Fong still has school(s) here. Sorry, I should of been clearer....I meant American Kenpo. The only thing I've found is Tracy Kenpo and they're not near me. I have been thinking about looking into Sifu Fong tho. Thx for the info.
     
  10. yellow

    yellow Banned

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    @estilo, I don't need to try mma, why would I start filling in coloring books if I can draw my own pictures and color them myself?

    I gave very legitimate reasons as to why MMA does not deserve respect as a martial art, remember the term we are using here, and I did not include boxing because boxing is sport again, not art. there is technique to it and there is craft and strategy, but its not a martial art., fighting is fighting, martial arts is a lifetime of personal development that never ends

    and you can ask any real martial artist the same, ive been doing it about 25 years, and I would have no problem handling an mma brawler, at all. why not try my luck in a fight with mma? for the same reason I don't compete in karate or kung fu anymore, I don't need to. my technique is only used for self defense in lethal situations and only used if I feel there is a real threat to myself or someone I love, not to have fun showing I can kick your ass.if forced to fight or if I was attacked by an MMA street fighter/brawler, after 25 years, I have absolutely do doubt, an MMA practictioner wouldn't be too hard to handle, at all. but I wouldn't wanna hurt them just cuz they are street fighers/brawlers. doesn't make them martial artists, and that is what we are discussing: martial arts.

    and why are you being so confrontational towards me? I said nothing that warranted that response to provoke me into wanting to prove that I can kick ass?? like really, I didn't say anything like that, and ive been very supportive of everyone here. im sorry if anyone took offense at what I said, I didn't meant to hurt your feelings. and I didn't mean MMA is useless, its of course a great self defense tool sure, id take it if I had no other option, but im talking about the arts of the east (well u know what I mean), which includes spiritual cultivation as much as physical training. so again, I wasn't saying MMA is gay, im saying its something outside of what were lookin at. that's all, hope u forgive me if ur into MMA.

    so if you felt offended, im sorry, and looking back at the post, I can see if an MMA fighter would not like it. I do apologize, and I tried to edit it out, but I cant, so if possible please delete that for me because I cant edit it and I don't know why. point is : im sorry if I offended you, I didn't mean to do that to anyone personally. really, im sorry. I did rant and I shouldn't have

    (PS for the record, my friend is from Thailand, his father is a muay thai lightweight champion, he taught is son muay tahi, and his son now does MMA....needless to say, we decided to show each other some techinques and appplications in response to combat attacks, and remember hes really a muay tahi guy with a strong background whos been doin MMA for about two years, so hes a great fighter, but still new to MMA, tho 2 years is pretty much all there is to learn from MMA I think, and I gotta say, if we actually turned combat application display "light contact" demostronations on each other, to full sparring, there would not have been much to really see on his end, except him staring up at me from the floor quite a bit.)
     
  11. mcleanab

    mcleanab Theta Sagan Swords

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    Hmmm... my old teacher coaches and trains MMA and continues his study with such martial artists a Guro Dan Inosanto, Ajarn Surchai "Chai" Sirsuite and many others. He's a lifelong practitioner of martial arts, which includes MMA. He did Wing Chun for years, Kali/Silat, wrestling, BJJ, Judo... all the stuff that Bruce Lee did WAY back in the day... yet I don't see many folks saying that what Bruce did was NOT a martial art. I think MMA deserves just as much respect as any other art. It takes a tremendous amount of hard work, determination, focus, concentration, etc, etc... that will begin to shape anyone's character.

    I would hazard a guess that many folks that study exclusively MMA are also lifelong martial artists and not just brawlers... Randy Couture seems to me to be a martial artist period regardless of what style or system he's studying, be it wrestling, BJJ, MMA, whatever. MMA has changed many peoples' lives for the better I'm sure, just as "traditional" martial arts has as well. To say that it doesn't deserve the same respect seems a little wonky to me.

    I would say the same for boxing too... sure it's a sport, but it's damn hard work. A lot of people that study boxing, MMA or any other martial system don't do it for self defense... sometimes it's just the work out, the sense of community, the betterment of the self and those around them. That seems to deserve respect. And I would call it an art... watch someone like George St. Pierre, Anderson Silva, hell even old Royce Gracie or any other high level MMA practitioner... there is a skill set that is only cultivated through the betterment of self.



     
  12. Estilo

    Estilo SS.org Regular

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    @yellow: Not offended at all man. I too apologise if I caused you distress in any way or form; reading back at my post it does seem confrontational in some ways haha, which was not what I intended.

    What I said about pro MMA fighters (something I've just edited in) not using stuff from the old styles even when they're proficient is what I've observed so far. A classic example being GSP, who despite his proclamation of his Kyokushin roots almost always depends on wrestling and BJJ in his matches. His stand up is outstanding too but I don't see anything from him that is beyond the scope of Muay Thai. I was just wondering why this is.

    And that last part about the practitioners of the traditional arts being able to display superhuman abilities, is also a point of ponderation for me. If a knife can't pierce through them, surely the striking prowess of Anderson Silva nor the ground and pound of the heavyweights would mean nothing to them? And surely there must be someone amongst them who is interested to prove to the public eye that they can kick the asses of the "new breed" that are MMA fighters, using the styles sneered upon by MMA fighters themselves?

    I hope that clears it up for me :). I must say though, your comments about MMA do leave much room for debate and disagreements, maybe even confrontations from the other SSO members on here. Though I swear, I'm not one of them :lol:.
     
  13. ghostred7

    ghostred7 Banned

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    This is a bold over-generalization. By this statement alone, you're stating that just because someone practices MMA they'd be "easy" for you. So by this sweeping statement you wouldn't have any issues against someone, that say, had been practicing Jeet Kune Do for the same amount of time you've been in your various arts, simply because it is a MMA? Let's face it....JKD is the parent of all MMA as it was the first public mixture of various arts & disciplines.

    Additionally....every MMA person I know personally has studied at least 1 pure art for many years. Hell, one of my friends had 20yrs Karate learned IN JAPAN (military baby) that branched out to MMA later (total of over 30yrs training....damn wish he lived closer lol).

    For someone so based in the spiritual side of the arts, why so much ego and pride that is usually taught as one of the first things to let go of?

    Disclaimer: I do not do MMA
     
  14. yellow

    yellow Banned

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    not what I said at all...just doubt that if he fought fair and clean with just his skill set, nothing dirty or cheap shit, It wouldn't be a problem for me. did i say I would beat his ass from here to sunday and then mop the floor with him and then some? no...i just dont see a challenge from what ive experienced with my mma friend.

    other veteran martial artists of real tradition I would be more wary of, another person who practiced any real art from a real teacher could be a challenge to me, but who knows, so could anyone, I don't underestimate any opponent, but if we were put into an octagon with MMA fighter, id feel easier about it than a rooftop or basement match with a kung fu practictioner in china town, but most of you probably don't know what I mean or what im talkin about.

    close minded and egoism? the only thing I said was truth. sorry if it hurts. in any case, I really don't care (not ur feelings, but if u agree with me or not about MMA bein art or sport)...if you wanna be a martial artist, be a martial artist. I just don't recognize mma fighters (or boxers) are artists, they are competitive sportsman. so whoever neg repped me with that nice apology for speaking my very open mind to all arts and artists and respecting all of them, except MMA which is not a martial art, has no idea what im talking about and I doubt you practice.

    someone asked what ive learned most from the arts? it is something I cannot mention here or put into words, but its the complete opposite of ego: think of the exchange between jet lis character and the karate master at the end of fearless....tea is tea, the details dotn matter. there is no superior style, only a superior fighter

    I was talking about the purity of authentic, traditional, classical martial arts. I have no ego, just a very direct way of saying things.


    PS Jeet Kun Do is cool, and to call it MMA is an insult to JKD, ive read the Tao of JKD and knew a JKD practictioner, its not MMA, but its bruce lees take on Wing Chun and his own experiences in fighting application. It is nothing more than a new lineage or offshoot of an established style: wing chun. my experience and reason in this knowledge, my sigung and sifu sihing worked with and trained with bruce in china before he came stateside.

    PPS A martial artist, who goes to learn MMA, is not an MMA fighter who walks into a school wanting to learn how to kick ass from scratch, a martial artist who learns MMA is a martial artists who wants a taste of some other martial arts, a watered down expose. a karate guy of 30 years who goes to learn mma, which I wouldn't really think happens, Is still a martial artist who wants to see what mma is about

    ANYWAY , I really meant no disrespect and I asked to delete my post cuz I cant edit it off, so please disreguard the statement, and please accept my apologies for anything you took as an insult. I did not mean to hurt anyone feelings or judge anyones preference. I restract my opinion and concede that you are correct in correcting my phrasing. Everyone is entitled to their own and I wish you success. I hope you will accept my apology.

    To show my regret in hurtin anyones feelings, I will stop posting here so I don't start any arguments
     
  15. Estilo

    Estilo SS.org Regular

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    @ghostred7: Can you ask that mate of yours how applicable he thinks his Karate is in an MMA context? Seriously I'm dying to know.
     
  16. ShadyDavey

    ShadyDavey 7ibrarian

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    "Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation"

    Open minds my friends....open minds. Acceptance of one's faults is courageous, being quick to assist with others faults with others is altruism.......but being blind to one's own faults is ignorance, and finding fault with others is disrespect.
     
  17. yellow

    yellow Banned

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    like I said a long post ago: "seeing sameness in difference"
     
  18. ShadyDavey

    ShadyDavey 7ibrarian

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    If you can see sameness in difference then the interminable and tiresome debate of traditional vs. contemporary/hybrid styles is a moot point - superior practitioners count - not a superior style :)
     
  19. yellow

    yellow Banned

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    again man, like I said already^:
    so agreed :)
     
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  20. Lagtastic

    Lagtastic Five Align

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    I feel the same way about guitarists.
     

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