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Discussion in 'Recording Studio' started by Mike, Aug 8, 2017.
Not. And I really like TH3. But no.
Have to say, I'm surprised Glenn liked the Helix. I'd like to hear more honest comparisons in these YouTube reviews rather than "in-mix" examples that don't reveal the weaknesses you can here when isolated.
He also kind of "liked" Positive Grid's Bias FX, so... I hope there will be another video with real constructing criticizm. Or not, because he's not into modelers anyway. I'm just so disappointed in Helix, and even considered bying the hardware version for a long time.
You should spend more time with it. Clearly, you can hear people in multiple genres getting great sounds with it. They're there. The opinion I had on Day 1 of having a Helix is nothing like the one I had on Day 10, which was nothing like the one I had 3 months later, and certainly not 2 years later.
Yes they do, but mostly in a mix. Individually Helix Native's tones just don't cut it for me. Also I could spend next couple of weeks with it, but still not getting out what I want.
Here's what I could get at this point, couple of quick generic riffs that came into my mind.
Both amps are Peavey 5150 equivalents of these softwares, no post eq, just low pass filter at 90Hz in both, di-box> audio interface> gate> tubescreamer> amp> IR.
It's better than bias, but it's no axe fx.
Oh man, I remember BIAS. I remember having to gate the living hell out of that high gain for all the EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE I'd get on the demo version. Yeah, anything tops that.
I liked Bias and whatnot when they stuck to mobile apps. Ever since they started trying to do hardware and computer plugins, etc., it's been pretty lazy and updates usually cause more problems than they solve.
Native doesn't have any input or output settings, but level adjustment. That bugs me out little bit, because in hardware Helix's there is plenty of options to choose. When plugging straight into di-box and interface you don't have those. Plugin should have more intelligent input adjustment.
But it's not AxeFX or Kemper, any of these plugins aren't
You guys putting Axe-Fx and Kemper on some untouchable pedestal are hilarious. I've had the AX8 twice. There's no magical unobtanium. It puts out what you put into it. There's nothing inherently superior to Helix. But if you want to believe that....have at it.
Nothing special about either base-sound wise, its the features like tone matching that help them out IMO. I still to this day hold TH3 > Axe FX Ultra, although by less of a margin than POD products.
There is a reason why so many metal players lean towards those. They are closer to real deal and especially Fractal has huge variety how they can be dialed in, tones are very much in control. I can't say same about Helix. Line 6 will only be a second tier modeler at this point, and it's a shame.
I 100% agree that you get out what you put in. However, in my experience i think its a heck of a lot easier with the Axe compared to every other modeler that I've tried.
Jeff Loomis is using a Helix as his complete live rig these days, and he previously was Kemper all the way. John Browne from Monuments...Helix. Chris Letchford from Scale the Summit was an official Fractal artist...now Helix. There are more. Not to mention it appears to be a pretty insane sales success with way wider distribution than Kemper or Fractal, so the idea of that being "second tier" is a joke.
I also love the "huge variety" claims. Let's be honest...of the hundreds of Fractal amp models, the vast majority of metal players use what...5-10? 5150, Recto, EVH 5153, Friedman, FAS Modern, Das Metal......maybe with a little Mark IIC/Mark mixed in. Then, they stick an 808 in front and use some V30 cab IR.
Wow....so exotic and unachievable. The variety in amp modelers these days isn't in the models. There are only so many distinct circuit paths that produce sufficient clipping to be considered "high gain". It's in the IRs. Why do you think every Fluff demo sounds the same? Or every Ola Englund demo sounds the same. Or anybody demoing gear? It's the IRs, and they all load them now.
That's cool. My experience is different. Gotta go with what works for you.
Pretty flimsy argument when you bear in mind sponsor deals. Line 6 has the benefit of:
A) Years of advantage in brick and mortar stores, especially here in Europe where the Axe FX could only be imported to Germany for years. Their brand and niche is well defined amongst even less voracious musicians (see the range of their products vs Kemper or Fractal).
B) Price being a better deal for bedroom musicians who maybe just want to practice or don't have $ to blow on FX pedals and fancy amps, which holds a lot of water when you see the sales of Spider models and POD units mostly go to men in their late 20's or older.
Jeff Loomis? When? Is there video or any other information about it, I'm intrested because he's one of my favourite players of all time.
For that I mainly meant that the dialing good tones seems to be way easier, and there isn't nothing exotic about using traditional recipe of modern metal tones. There is just different nyances, that some people like more than others. Most of it comes from IR's, but thing about input settings and hardware has impact on those nyances. It is something I want to find out, so there's not any other solution than test it myself.
Axe 2 is better sounding than the Helix, in my opinion. With tweaking and 3rd party IRs aswell as without.
It doesn't matter if Jeff Loomis or someone else advertises for one brand or the other.
Still can't really gel with Helix Native. The GUI is just not timely anymore.... i would have to rename all my IRs to shorter names just to use it with Helix Native.
After using it a bit more i think there is some really strange stuff going on in the low-mid range with some drive models. Weird interaction, unreal saturation and stuff that one could almost call artifacts.
Just search YouTube for "Arch Enemy Will to Power Tour Trailer".
As for the rest, no tone on any of these units is a fixed point. Adjusting the Sag and Bias controls on any Helix amp makes them respond and behave VERY differently. The IRs have way more impact on the finished tone, tho.
Yeah....because $1000-$1500 modelers are an easy impulse purchase for "bedroom musicians" and other "amateurs". Talk about flimsy reasoning.....
It's an unqualified success. Period. There are no caveats.