Heavier moderation of tech advice/subjective stuff?????

Discussion in 'Feedback & Suggestions' started by dpm, Mar 24, 2008.

  1. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    I sort of mentioned this in a thread once, but lately I've noticed a fair amount of basically shitty advice, and BS regarding guitar construction/tonal effect type stuff popping up here lately, kinda HC style :rolleyes:.

    Without digging up quotes and making examples of people, I'm talking about dudes giving irrelevant setup advice, or giving possible solutions as absolute (guitar setup being a whole slew of interacting adjustments), and also statements of particular construction/materials traits being solely responsible for the tonal difference between 2 instruments despite just about every other aspect of the 2 instruments being different. I think someone even stated that one manufacturer's superstrat body shape made it sound brighter than another manufacture's almost identical body shape.

    Any chance this kind of thing could be reined in a little?:wavey:
     
    Durero likes this.
  2. FortePenance

    FortePenance SS.org Regular

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    I guess you can't exactly stop people from posting their advice, regardless of how weird it might be. I dunno, if I saw someone in a thread giving misinformed advice, i'd probably just go in there and say "no, that's wrong IMO, the best way to do it is this..."
     
  3. Shannon

    Shannon Lord Super Awesome Contributor

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    I can see where you're going with this, Dan. However, this IS a discussion forum. Members can post their opinions no matter how wrong or right they are. If members are giving incorrect advice, you (as well as any other member here) are free to differ in your opinion by posting your own retort. In a lot of ways, differing opinions are a lot of what keeps a discussion going on a forum.

    We can moderate on those who break forum rules and all, but I don't see how we can moderate members opinions who are staying within ss.org forum guidelines. Ya know?

    Food for thought.
     
  4. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    Oh, I'm all for differing opinions and preferences. We all play differently and want to hear different things from our instruments. That's all cool, even if occasionally I'd like to see more of "I prefer this for my playing style" and less of "this is the only way to do it". What I'm more concerned about is statements of supposed absolute fact about things with so many other variables that nothing can be proven either way. That, and downright incorrect 'observations'. Us old farts can weed out the crazyness, but there are a lot of guitar newbs scratching around of late who tend to believe everything they read :shrug:

    I do try to reply when I have time to do it properly, but I feel for me that means a comprehensive explanation and debunking and follow up discussion, whereas the mod team (in my eyes anyway) has the authority to just say "prove it or don't say it", or at least point out that opinions should be stated as such. As I said, I'm cool with discussion, opinions and preferences, it's the blatantly irrational stuff that worries me.
     
  5. zimbloth

    zimbloth Nick // Axe Palace Vendor Forum MVP

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    I'm with you man, there's some really horrible and misinformed advice being dished out here all the time. But I also agree with Shannon, the mods have lives too and they can't spend their time calling people's bullshit you know?

    Perhaps the only way to combat this would be to continue to make stickys that contained informed advice/instructions on things. That way if someone said something ridiculous, anyone could link to that, and it would be game over :)

    :shrug:
     
  6. ibznorange

    ibznorange Chief Officer/RHLC © Contributor

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    I think at this point, we just gotta stick to calling peeps out like simon said. Openly disagree. Thats all there really is to do, you know?
     
  7. oompa

    oompa Ze.. Contributor

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    thats the price you pay for trusting idiots on the internet instead of taking it to a luthor :lol:

    j/k i get what you mean dan, and while i wish it was doable it probably isn't or it would kill discussions and might keep people from posting stuff because they are only 99% certain.

    but whats true tho is that people should be more careful in posting stuff like "this is the way to do it" over "this might work" etc. :yesway:
     
  8. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    Good points coming through here, I'm glad I started this thread now :yesway:

    I understand the concerns about mod time :agreed: The sticky aspect might be effective, at least it would put a formal wording to things. I'd love to get some stuff typed up, and have intended to for a long time, it's just been a matter of time which I don't have - as I'm sure is the case with the team here too.

    I'm a little concerned with open disagreement because of the risk of shit fights if the facts aren't fully backed up. Go that route, with a longwinded explanation and a few follow up posts and there goes a good couple of hours.

    As Chris has noted, there's a vibe of HC creeping in around the place and that's exactly what we don't need here. This is the only guitar forum I'm genuinely involved in, and it's not just because of the seven string focus. There has always been good, educated discussion and respect among members here, along with the wicked sense of humour, heavy drinking and debauchery :drew:
     
  9. amonb

    amonb Les Pauls forever Contributor

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    As a complete newb who has been subjected to "advice" on this forum and found it to be wrong through my own research, I think Nick has the thing solution here... I know as a newb that if something is stickied a mod has seen it as containing merit, and I know that any other advice on here (unless from someone with some credibility, such as a luthier like Dan) can be taken with a grain of salt, and I see as a starting point for my own investigations.

    Me too, I am NOT a primarily seven string player, but this place sure beats the crap out of the other places I have tried.

    :2c:
     
  10. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    Hmm. I'll start a thread to talk about this in the Mod forum, if someone hasn't beat me to it.

    On one hand, Shannon's right in that we can't moderate opinions, really... But on the other, I suppose it wouldn't hurt to start editing in disclaimers on outright bad advice if/when it can be incontrovertably identified as such...

    You're right though. 2-3 years ago when we were a much smaller community, just due to the smaller numbers involved it seemed like everyone pretty much knew what they were talking about, or knew enough to ask when they didn't. It's totally a product of size... :/
     
  11. Chris

    Chris metalguitarist.org Forum MVP

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    This is one of the main reasons I have the Workbench set up. The more solid contributions in there, the easier it will be to answer questions by pointing people to the tech article. The best way to "combat" (for lack of a better word) bad advice is to archive the good advice.

    A million stickies aren't the way to go about it, and neither is super-over-moderation of all the forums. We get 50k posts a month, there's just no way to screen them all. Really it's in the hands of the community and all of you guys.
     
  12. AVH

    AVH avhguitarrepair.com Forum MVP

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    Dan - you are my hero! Nicely put. IMO, there shouldn't be any stickied 'tech' articles made by novices or anyone who doesn't do this for a living without some kind of disclaimer. Seriously, you wouldn't believe the number of patch/screw-up work I get from people who said they seen how to it online. The serious f/t luthiers and techs like ourselves have enough on our plates (just like the mods too), I could spend hours on here just making corrections and rebutting improper methods from well meaning, but erronous noobs. I think we're way too busy for that.

    Carry on....my 2 cents.
     
  13. Chris

    Chris metalguitarist.org Forum MVP

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    I'm open to suggestions, and as I said, the best thing you guys who are primarily concerned about this can do is to grab a camera and make some articles. ;)
     
  14. Papa Shank

    Papa Shank Be-otch

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    Hey Dan, if it wasn't for us 'tards you technical folk wouldn't look so damn smart! We work hard to talk crap so you don't have to!

    Some sort of professional/scally-wag article to dispel bullshit would probably work best against us 'tards version of advice.
     
  15. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    Fuck. I closed my browser and lost my post :wallbash:

    In a nutshell, Dendro, Paul = :wub:, and I'll try typing some articles related to frets and setup. They won't be 'how-to' guides, certainly not the fret stuff anyway, more like 'why you probably shouldn't' articles :lol: No, really what I want to do is explain the complexities and interacting variables in what we do. I'll forward this to Dendro and Mike (if he's available) for checking and then to Chris. Everyone cool with that?
     
  16. dpm

    dpm Oni Guitars Contributor

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    I've just started a new thread here trying to get an idea of how to write this without it being boring, too techy, too simple, too eccentric. There's 2 hours just in this snippet so I don't want to get further into it and have it reading like shit. Let me know if I'm on the right track please!

     
  17. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    As a correlary, if any of you guys who know what you're talking about* see something that's dead wrong in our Workbench section, or at least probably not such a hot idea, a quick post or PM suggesting that it be removed (or at least edited/disclaimered) for whatever the reason it's not good would be appreciated. :yesway:











    *and yes, I realize this is a total judgement call on my part, deal with it. :fawk:
     
  18. Hawksmoor

    Hawksmoor Wannabe Shredder

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    Well, IMHO, these forae are very much limited where BS is concerned... I've been a HC forumite.
     
  19. Scott

    Scott Aye. Contributor

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    What about taking some of the techs and giving them forum specific mod abilities. So don't make them Super Mods with forum wide abilities, make them, I dunno....Batman Mods, :lol: specific to the general tech section or something.

    That way, they could give their advice, or opinion on someone elses advice, without it having to be 3-4 pages into the conversation, where it might go unread.
     
  20. Stitch

    Stitch Banned

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    That'd be a great idea - like some sort of "official response" right below the original post. You could even make it so that if someone makes a good suggestion that a lot of people agree with, that post could be elevated to that 'status'.
     

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