Do Duncan 7s sound similar to their 6 string counterparts?

Discussion in 'Pickups, Electronics & General Tech' started by TheShreddinHand, May 14, 2018.

  1. TheShreddinHand

    TheShreddinHand Uber Stringer

    Messages:
    2,354
    Likes Received:
    215
    Joined:
    May 8, 2008
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Hey guys, it's been pretty well documented by folks on here (and in my own testing) that Dimarzio 7 and 6 string counterparts don't exactly sound like each other. So how well do Seymour Duncan 7 string pickups translate to their 6 string counterparts? My one experience so far was with a 6 string Distortion set and 7 string distortion set and unfortunately they weren't too similar (similar Jackson Mahogany guitars albeit not the same guitar obviously). So what about SD's other sets like the Blackwinters or JB/Jazz. Absolutely love those in 6 string, so are they close in their 7 string versions?
     
  2. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

    Messages:
    28,250
    Likes Received:
    6,170
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2008
    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    They're pretty much on par with DiMarzio in that regard.

    It's damn hard to make 6/7/8 pickups sound the same.

    They still sound really good, and most are in the same vein, but definitely not identical.
     
    AkiraSpectrum likes this.
  3. KnightBrolaire

    KnightBrolaire git gud scrub

    Messages:
    7,873
    Likes Received:
    4,873
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2015
    Location:
    Minneapolis, MN
    Depends on the pickups.
    The 6 string and 8 string black winter sets are basically the same in terms of feel/eq, but that's a bit of an issue for ERGs since the higher output and darker low end doesn't translate well to 8 strings. They crush for 6 strings, but for 8 strings I found em a bit muddy on the low end. The omega works well as both a 6 string and 8 string version, with the sound being pretty much the same in terms of eq. The omega works well in either 6 string or 8 string versions. Past those I can't really comment about their other offerings as I haven't tried them in both 6/8 string formats (ie pegasus/nazgul/sentient).

    I've found some other brands have virtually the same sound for their 6 string versions and 8 string versions like bkp (black dog), elysian (javelin II/goliaths) and lundgren (m6 and m8 are verrrry similar).
     
  4. TonyFlyingSquirrel

    TonyFlyingSquirrel Cherokee Warrior

    Messages:
    3,645
    Likes Received:
    711
    Joined:
    May 4, 2006
    Location:
    Auburn, Washington
    The only pickups made in 6, 7, & 8 configs that I've heard that have been consistently voiced with one another are all active. Passives may have the same amount of winds, but you have to take into consideration the additional length of the bobbin that needs more wire to completely surround the bobbin. While it may take somewhere in the ball park of 5.5 (Speculative) inches per revolution around a 6 string bobbin, that length increases considerably for 7 & 8 string pickups. By this math, 7800 winds would be 42,900 inches, or 3,575 feet of wire.

    Let's say for a 7 string model, that length of wire per revolution is increased by 1.25 inches, to 6.75". 6.75" multiplied by 7800 winds would be 52,650" or 4387.5 feet.

    Let's say for an 8 string model, that length of wire per revolution is increased by 1.75 inches, to 7.5". 7.5" multiplied by 7800 winds would be 58,500" or 4875 feet.

    So, while my base measurements per coil winding are approximate, you can see that there is a considerable difference in total wire used compared between each version. The more strings, the hotter the pickup. This changes the compression, resonant peak, and dc resistance of that pickup, resulting in inconsistency from 6 string to 7 string, from 7 string to 8 string.

    Active pickups may compensate for this in preamp specs and output settings, resulting in creater consistency between offerings.

    Disclaimer: While my base model coil measurements are speculative, the math that ensues thereafter is based on this simple reference. If anyone wants to clarify with actual measurements, be my guest. I was simply pointing out the physics of the principle.
     
  5. Zoobiedood

    Zoobiedood SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    183
    Likes Received:
    70
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2015
    Location:
    Tampa Bay
    I don't see how any of these could be *exactly* the same. I think extending the coil size and adding more turns is going to affect the sound. I think you can get close, but they'd never be exact. I don't even know how you'd know how far apart they'd be unless you temporarily install a 6 string pickup into a 7 string, record it, and then do the same thing with the 7 string version.
     
  6. eaeolian

    eaeolian Pictures of guitars I don't even own anymore! Super Moderator

    Messages:
    13,558
    Likes Received:
    897
    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Location:
    Woodbridge, VA
    Similar? Yes. The Same? No. TFS has it on the money.
     
    Ironbird666 likes this.
  7. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

    Messages:
    28,250
    Likes Received:
    6,170
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2008
    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I've had an RG520, RG7620 and RG2228 for several years now, with the 6 and 7 going back over a decade. You really can't get guitars more the same than that. I've had dozens of combinations of DiMarzio, Duncan, EMG, BKP and more in each.
     
    Noisy Humbucker likes this.
  8. TheShreddinHand

    TheShreddinHand Uber Stringer

    Messages:
    2,354
    Likes Received:
    215
    Joined:
    May 8, 2008
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Thanks guys, much appreciated. Ultimately, I'll be doing lots of soldering and trying em' out to find what me likes!
     
  9. TonyFlyingSquirrel

    TonyFlyingSquirrel Cherokee Warrior

    Messages:
    3,645
    Likes Received:
    711
    Joined:
    May 4, 2006
    Location:
    Auburn, Washington
    Incidentally, I was at Guitarget over the weekend, and was able to play two Schecter Sun Valley models,
    The 7 string Model: https://www.guitarcenter.com/Schect...FR-7-III-Ebony-Fingerboard-Electric-Guitar.gc

    And the corresponding 6 string model: https://www.guitarcenter.com/Schect...S-FR-III-Ebony-Fingerboard-Electric-Guitar.gc

    Both guitars made exactly the same, ie; Body neck woods. Same hardware, same electronics (EMG Retroactives). While aside from the 7 string neck having more mass, they are essentially the same instrument, generally. The two models that I had even had the same identical finish.

    I played them both through an Orange amp (don't remember which model) but I had a hard time noticing any significant difference in comparison from one guitar to the other, and that was specifically playing both as 6 strings and leaving the low b alone on the 7 stringer.
    I would attribute much of this to the active compensations that I described earlier.
     
  10. Defmelonn

    Defmelonn SS.org Regular

    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    12
    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2017
    Ive put jbs in Everything , until i tried the fishman fluence stef set and bought three of them cause they are jb sounding but better. Jb’s sound awesome on six strings. Tried a jb 7 string pick up in an alder bodied 7 string guitar and it sounded horrible. I actually put the emgs it came with back in, and i hate emgs.
     
  11. Kyle Jordan

    Kyle Jordan Ace of Knaves

    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    113
    Joined:
    May 25, 2008
    Location:
    Karakura Town
    How would you say the BKP 6, 7, and 8 string versions compare to each other in terms of accuracy? I want to give a couple of the 8 string versions of the BKPs an honest shot, but have only ever owned 6 string versions in the past. I already have experience with having hopes dashed by a 7 or 8 string version of a 6 string pickup I like being subpar. I'd rather save my money and time than repeat that again.
     
  12. MaxOfMetal

    MaxOfMetal Likes trem wankery. Super Moderator

    Messages:
    28,250
    Likes Received:
    6,170
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2008
    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI
    I've yet to find a pickup from any manufacturer that's close to the same accross the various string counts.

    Not to mention, some guitars just don't like certain pickups.

    Go used. You can typically sell off pickups for the same price you paid as you try them out. It's not like some years ago where BKPs were somewhat hard to come by, you should be able to track down which ever ones you want to try.
     
    Kyle Jordan likes this.
  13. KnightBrolaire

    KnightBrolaire git gud scrub

    Messages:
    7,873
    Likes Received:
    4,873
    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2015
    Location:
    Minneapolis, MN
    It depends on the pickup. Some of the BKP lineup (like the black dog or the juggs) have pretty much the same feel on 6 and 8 strings. I think the general eq of the pickup is a bigger factor with more strings. It's harder to utilize darker sounding pickups on a 7/8 string since they tend to get muddy on the low end (ie the ceramic warpig/blackhawk). In general I'd recommend staying away from higher output pickups for 8 strings since they also muddy up the sound (ie c-pig, ragnarok, painkiller).
     
    Kyle Jordan likes this.

Share This Page