Djent is EDM

Discussion in 'General Music Discussion' started by thoughtpyotr, Jun 28, 2017.

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  1. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    I'm kidding...... But what compelled me to say this is that I barely noticed how a HUGE number of musicians are also "producers" nowadays. There are a bunch of solo acts that write, record, mix/master their own stuff with primarily MIDI instruments....like a modern DJ would.

    My question to you guys is:
    Is there really a difference between BATHS (DJ-ish guy) sitting in his room programming beats for him to sing over and MISHA sitting in his room programming drums to play guitar over?

    I sometimes tell people that I consider djent to be closer to electronic music than rock or metal. I actually really pissed off my guitarist when I said this. I don't mean EDM by the way, I mean electronic music in the more literal sense.
     
  2. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    its 2017
    djent has been over practically since you joined the website

    dubstep too
     
  3. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    lol my bad but the same is true of other genre's. My friend makes black metal on his macbook, similar arguement maybe?
     
  4. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    What's that argument again? That there's no difference? Because two major differences seems plain to me: composition and instrumentation
     
  5. Seybsnilksz

    Seybsnilksz SS.org Regular

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    Misha has a band that records everything for real after the programmed demo has been done. The same isn't true for EDM.
     
  6. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    Yeah that's the argument, that in a meta sense there is no real difference. The composition and instrumentation is obviously different but isn't that on the basis of genre rather than a product of different tools? Both are using a computer for the most part.

    My rebuttal to that would be Toro y Moi. He made his songs by himself in a bedroom but plays with a live band irl. Sure, it's not dubstep (i think he's technically chillwave) but it's technically 'electronic dance music'
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 29, 2017
  7. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    [​IMG]
     
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  8. Science_Penguin

    Science_Penguin SS.org Regular

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    Well, what's the criteria for weather or not your music is "Electronic?"

    If we're talking about the literal implementation of digital instruments into music, then sure, I guess... but I think the more universally agreed-upon idea is that Electronic music means a particular emphasis on what are obviously (and not trying to hide it) synthesized sounds.

    Djent showcases an organic instrument (the guitar) over digital simulations of other organic instruments (drums, bass, ect.) and has more obvious relationships to Metal and Rock than it does to Electronic.
     
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  9. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    Let's also not forget that Meshuggah, the pioneers of djent, composed and recorded their stuff using non-digital instruments all the way until Catch-33, and as far as I know that's their only album which has the drums copy pasted.
     
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  10. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    The criteria (for me at least) is more based on definition that cultural connotation. The universally agreed-upon model you referenced model is fairly new if you think about it (like 20 years max) but I bet if you showed a typical djent DAW session to Robert Moog he would have called it electronic music.

    At least you get what I mean. My guitarist couldn't separate the term 'electronic music' from dubstep/EDC haha
     
  11. works0fheart

    works0fheart Tike Myson

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    I'm not sure if it's obvious to you guys or not, but it seems like this guy has to be trolling. Yes, in 2017
     
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  12. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    omfg lol

    good point on the meshuggah thing. I guess I just want to say that djent wouldn't be what it is today if it wasn't for electronic music.



    Djent, from a compositional standpoint is definitely a derivative of rock/metal. But because of its dependence on computers/digital technology, I think it derives from electronic music just as much.
     
  13. thoughtpyotr

    thoughtpyotr SS.org Regular

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    ha no not trolling. the title was purposely sensationalist though I'll give you that.
     
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  14. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    Every style/microgenre of music has ties to others. I think it's a fair comparison to make to point out that both djent and EDM are usually associated with programmed drums and heavy reliance upon rhythm.

    I guess I am surprised to see than there is a debate over that observation.

    Is there a difference between a guy who programs all of the instruments and another guy who programs the instruments, then records real instruments over them one at a time until all of the fake instruments are gone? Well, umm, I mean the answer is right there in the question if I word it that way.

    I mean, if there was literally no difference between guitarists and DJ's, then you shouldn't be able to tell which is which in this photo:

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    A lot of the production has moved into a more digital space but none of these observations are new. Computers have been involved in pretty much all genres of music for a good while now. MIDI is old (80s?) and synthesizers were a thing long before that. Someone somewhere always had to be doing some kind of production work regardless of what kind of music is it, and it makes a lot of sense that a lot of those people are also musicians. The only difference now is that it costs maybe a few hundred dollars to buy a laptop and some headphones that you can make commercial quality audio with, so it's accessible to everyone- whereas the farther back in time you go the more expensive and specialized it was.

    IMO "djent is just like EDM!" holds about as much water as "metal is just modern classical music maaaan". (As in they're both a huge stretch.)
     
  16. xCaptainx

    xCaptainx Dr Djodson

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    Not entirely sure where you're going with this.

    A large number of musicians are bedroom producers? Well duh, that's been happening for 30 years now. I started with a four track and shitty mic hanging in the middle of a room, years before anything like fruity loops or drumkit from hell was available.

    What's your point?
     
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  17. HeHasTheJazzHands

    HeHasTheJazzHands greg rulz ok

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    Whats with all the hot take threads today?
     
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  18. budda

    budda Guiterrorizer Contributor

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    It's almost like... people can work on things at home now... without shelling out tons of money... :eek:

    Edit: yeah, I'd say trolling. But it's something to read, so whatever.
     
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  19. Ordacleaphobia

    Ordacleaphobia Can only power chord

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    For what it's worth, I've referred to djent as metal's answer to dubstep for years now.
    Compositionally, they feel very similar, to be honest. Production-wise too, I suppose.

    Are you referring to the rise of the 'one-man project,' and how it seems to be much more prevalent in this scene as opposed to other subgenres? That's something we've all noticed (and mocked, lets be honest) over the years; how every bedroom warrior with an AxeFX and a Mayones has their own djent project, kind of how every bro with a macbook and a pirated copy of FL Studio is an EDM 'producer'. I dig it though; seen more than a few of 'em turn into something great.
     
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  20. JohnIce

    JohnIce Singlecoils = tr00

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    This thread wants to discuss semantics yet doesn't know what the term DJ means... A DJ doesn't even create music, how are they even brought up in this thread?

    The difference between a DJ and a producer is vast, yes. But the difference between an EDM producer and a rock producer or a hip hop producer is to me a useless line to draw. If anything the difference isn't about methods or gear but rather that EDM is created to be danced to, with bpm and rhythms and song structures specialized to that end and to make each song fit seamlessly with other artist's songs (THAT is when a DJ comes in, he creates that mix and the transitions), whereas most other music is created more to be standalone short tracks to be listened to. However, even that distinction is flawed. For example metalcore is historically much more based on community and moshing (=dancing) than for listening to at home or have standout tracks.

    To make this distinction even more pointless, look at hip-hop vs. reggae. Reggae is traditionally performed live with a band, but musically it's just a short, looped beat designed for a singer or MC to jam over, exactly like hip-hop. Hip-hop on the other hand uses turntables, mpc's or sequencers but it's to achieve the exact same thing, i.e. make a "beat" for someone to flow over. Hence, hip-hop and reggae have more in common than for example rock and jazz.

    TL;DR: The intent of the production is what matters, the method is irrelevant.
     
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