Decapitated accused of kidnapping?

Discussion in 'General Music Discussion' started by HeavyMetal4Ever, Sep 10, 2017.

  1. tedtan

    tedtan SS.org Regular

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    Rape isn't about sex. Rapists are generally people who are controlled by others in their day to day lives and use rape as a means to be in control and have power over someone else for a change. I would think you'd have to have some kind of mental issues for rape to seem like a legitimate option.
     
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  2. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I hear this pretty often, but I don't know that it can be considered true as a blanket statement. I think it's true in some contexts, but not in others.
     
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  3. tedtan

    tedtan SS.org Regular

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    Yeah, I think that is more applicable to premeditated rape. A situation such as a woman changing her mind during sex and the guy shes with not stopping is a different situation, so I'm sure its not universally true. But there is a lot of psychological research that backs it up in many situations.
     
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  4. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    I would not rule out any explanation as to why it happens. Separating the act from the act of sex itself seems a bit odd a concept to me, but I agree that the act can be just as much about violence and persecution.

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    This is a bit weird. The statutes for first degree rape are clear that any rape that occurs during first degree kidnapping is first degree rape. That means that this would be first degree rape, given the kidnapping allegations and the charge being first degree kidnapping.

    Two defendants are charged with second degree rape, which is rape by a health care provider, when the victim is fully incapacitated, or during transport.

    The other two are charged with third degree rape, which is when there is simply lack of clearly expressed consent or when sex is coerced through threats to the victim's personal property.

    These charges are not consistent with the testimonies given by the accusers here.

    --------------------------------

    Lysejko also has his own attorney now, but her batting average as a criminal defense lawyer doesn't look so hot, based on the court records I quickly scanned. She has had a significant portion of cases where charges were dismissed in court before the formal trial proceeded, though, so maybe that's the angle that's at play.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
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  5. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    Some details here: http://www.nme.com/news/music/decapitated-rape-charge-statement-2149931#YS6Yj44h0jFZY6HP.99

    This is looking more and more like a complete shit show. Other than the DNA evidence, I'm not sure what evidence needs to be processed, though. It's still a wait-and-see game, but statements like the above are real head-scratchers. If there is not probable cause (I would imagine in any world, two witness testimonies would be probable cause), then why would there be charges?! Maybe Spokane police are just making a bunch of missteps. :scratch:
     
  6. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    Formal arraignment for the rape charges (2nd degree) are now scheduled for 10:30 AM, 24 Oct 2017 (Pacific Time) with Judge Annette Plese presiding.
     
  7. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    I had no idea there were "degrees" of rape charges.
     
  8. lewis

    lewis SS.org Regular

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    yeah me either.
    Why does the world over complicate things?.

    You either raped someone ( maximum sentence for rape should apply)
    or you attempted rape and failed, or you havent done either and are free?

    humans trying to create grey area, is what created interpretation. The second we created/allowed interpretation, was the second the whole system became a clusterfuck. Especially coupled with "Human rights for criminals" now too. Its the reason how 1 judge can be incredibly harsh and serve huge sentences, then in comparable cases another judge can be lenient and the sentences dont match up? Thats honestly ridiculous.

    the whole thing is a mess. Only in this modern world, does the criminal get to act like a victim and it actually work with sympathisers. (this is mostly a rant about things in general, not really aimed at the Decapitated situation)
     
  9. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    So you guys believe that forceable rape is equivalent to coerced rape is equivalent to lack of clear consent? I guess I don't really see it that way, even if they are all quite bad.

    So court documents are quite contrary to what news outlets have been reporting. I'm starting to get frustrated with how poor quality the information is that's out there. Even the court documents themselves seem to have lots of little minor things that sure seem to be contradictory and not really that confusing.
     
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  10. Spaced Out Ace

    Spaced Out Ace 0 0 1 0 0 6 5 0 3\

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    "forced rape" = some guy running out on a jogging trail, grabs a girl, and Last House on the Left's her.
    "coerced rape" = Harvey Weinstein-ing that one.
    "lack of clear consent" = She didn't really say no, she may've been flirting with the guy, sitting in his lap, etc. and they ended up having sex, but she didn't exactly give consent.

    Is that what you mean? Just want to make sure, because if so, I see each as being quite different.
     
  11. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    Not what I meant to say. I just meant I wasn't aware that there was a legal distinction.

    DEFINITELY not what I meant to say. :lol:
     
  12. Dredg

    Dredg Insignificant Contributor

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    I completely understand that victims both male and female will not immediately come forward to press charges. My girlfriend was abused by a former boyfriend years ago and only came forward after she learned he was extradited back to her hometown to face multiple counts of rape charges, including multiple charges of forcible against a minor. After she testified, she definitely wishes she pressed charges sooner, but the good news is that the sack of shit got 3 life sentences withoutr parole - he's never seeing outside ever again.
     
  13. lewis

    lewis SS.org Regular

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    lol it was humans that created the legal distinction.
     
  14. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    By my count, it actually took a little longer than 30 days, but w/e.

    Also, looking at court documents, the news is mincing a lot of details. Technically, the arraignment Friday was postponed until the 24th (next Tuesday), so none of the band members have been formally arraigned on any charges. This is not highly unusual, but somewhat unusual, given the seriousness of the crime and how long it took for the first court appearance to occur. Technically, this puts pretty much everything that's happening just after the time limit for it to happen. I'm not sure why the defense is allowing this, as I pointed out earlier, especially, now, after making the above public statement, which leads me to believe that they are ready to fight the charges and use the fact that things are taking longer than allowed by statutes. I had previously assumed that there was some sort of understanding, but the statement above strongly suggests otherwise.
     
  15. wankerness

    wankerness SS.org Regular

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    God yes, they're incredible different. I HATE this new trend of "WOKE-STERS" that have to use the exact same language to refer to everything and purposely try to obfuscate any difference. Ex, the Casey Affleck thing - everyone was like HE COMMITTED SEXUAL ASSAULT, as if he was equivalent to Roman fuckin Polanski, because now "sexual assault" is used by them to refer to exposing themselves to a woman against their will, and is ALSO used by them to refer to actual full-blown rape. Morons. It trivializes actual rape victims in a gigantic way, that's for damn sure. Yes, it should be a crime, but don't change the terms to be uniform to pretend it's all equal, cause it isn't. It's like trying to equate attempted murder and punching some guy for making a lewd remark at your girlfriend. Oh right, unwanted lewd remarks don't exist anymore, I mean, sexually assaulting your girlfriend.
     
  16. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    Allegations against Affleck were still pretty serious, but no criminal charges were pressed.

    Since someone else brought up Weinstein, I find it amazing how many folks are still defending him on message boards and comment postings, when he's facing rape allegations from two women and other degrees of sexual assault and harassment from so many others, and I have a very difficult time believing that all of these women colluded to take him down without just cause. So, in my mind, I have reason to believe that he's done some awful things. But, and I feel kind of gross even asking this, but, purely from a legal standpoint, how does this work in cases where he paid some of these women off to keep them quiet? On one hand, it seems to suggest guilt, but on the other hand, does he get the money back? I would think not... Like, if someone murdered someone else, and then a third person witnessed the murderer disposing of the body and other evidence, and was paid off to keep quiet, it'd make that third person accomplice to the crime, no? On the other hand, if someone punched you in the face (physical assault) and paid you off to keep quiet about it, and you pressed criminal charges, I would think that you'd have to give back the hush money. With Weinstein, is it somewhere in between? I guess, legally, you'd have to pay back the money, but that seems really icky, to me, at least.

    If Decapitated really has the investigating officer stating in court that she didn't find probable cause to make the arrest, I really don't think it means much at this point, since someone else must've thought that there was probable cause to issue a warrant. But now that the judge and prosecutor have been bobbled around, I think the Spokane court is not really seeing this case as a high-profile thing, and if this washes out to any sort of not-guilty outcome, which is looking like a fair possibility at this point, the court is going to have a lot of egg on its face to deal with. If there is a guilty verdict at the end of all of this, then it'll make the news media appear biased, IMO, since they are really focusing reporting on stuff that supports the band's side of the story much moreso than the victim's side.
     
  17. Spaced Out Ace

    Spaced Out Ace 0 0 1 0 0 6 5 0 3\

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    I would post a meme I made of Mr. Weinstein, but it may be against the TOS of this fine establishment, and may, perhaps, be in poor taste. It's of Weinstein's head photoshopped -- poorly, I might add, for comedic value -- onto Tony the Tiger's body, and the caption is, "Tony the Tiger says... It'ssssss..." And I'll let you fill in the rest.
     
  18. ArtDecade

    ArtDecade Unhindered by Talent

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    What is up with those Affleck brothers?
     
  19. Nicki

    Nicki SS.org Regular

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    One party would get charged with bribery, the other with accepting a bribe. Since both are criminal offenses, it traps the person who accepts the bribe into staying quiet.

    Reference
     
  20. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    I guess this is a whole inappropriate can of worms under the circumstances, but why not go deeper into it, since the can is open?

    So, would the actresses paid off by Weinstein to keep quiet be facing potential charges for accepting a bribe now? I would hope not, but accepting a bribe is bad (not as bad as offering a bribe, though). It could set a new precedent if they aren't in danger of such charges, which might be bad or maybe not-so-bad, ultimately. Under the potentially new precedent, though, it could be possible to accept a bribe, not honour the terms of the bribe, keep the money, and face no consequences. It'd essentially render bribery useless. Which would be, well, not so bad an outcome.
     

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