Debbie Wassermen Schultz resigns as DNC chair, promptly joins Clinton campaign.

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by will_shred, Jul 24, 2016.

  1. wankerness

    wankerness SS.org Regular

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    Agreed with everything except your conclusion, which is purely a Trump vote in this election system. Do you want to vote for Trump? That's what an independent vote is.
     
  2. flint757

    flint757 SS.org Regular

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    Bull..... At best it is akin to not voting at all, and this is only the case because people like yourself maintain that mentality.

    More importantly, in past elections more people didn't vote at all than voted 3rd party. The corruption that creates apathetic citizens is far more culpable for ....ty presidents and representatives than someone making a choice that goes against what everyone automatically presumes to be the only option.

    The only bargaining chip we as citizens hold with politicians is our vote. That's it. If we give them our vote no matter what they do what reason do they have to ever play by the rules? Unless you're filthy rich the only thing you have is your voice and your vote. I will use mine accordingly to express my extreme dissatisfaction with mainstream politics. :shrug:

    I'm also growing really tired of this argument as it's both patronizing and ironically ill-informed at the same time. Ill-informed mind you because we don't have proportional representation or a true popular vote. Only a handful of states make or break these elections and if you don't live in one, I most definitely do not, then voting for Clinton, Stein, Johnson, Trump or whomever doesn't really matter because at the end of the day Clinton is not winning where I live. Based on the atmosphere locally my assumption is Texas will go to Trump, but even if it didn't it'd likely be Johnson before any of the others.
     
  3. wankerness

    wankerness SS.org Regular

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    It's not ill-informed, it's bred out of many years of seeing people act like idiots over and over and over. There is no chance a majority of the population is going to rise up and do anything different in the forseeable future. Well, unless we go a year without phone service and wifi or something, which would be about the only thing that would get the vast majority of the "under 30" demographic motivated enough to actually turn out for an election. The majority of the over 30 demographic tends to be a moron that votes for whoever spends the most money on campaign ads. Most states are totally f'd up by serious gerrymandering (and in my state, laws implemented which make it very difficult for minorities to vote) which ruins any chance of true democracy. Trump is the first salvo in the country getting mad as hell and not taking it anymore, but it isn't nearly enough, and with the amount of inertia and safeguards in the system, we're not going to get another chance until the next primary. Our political system is too corrupt. I have faith that this rage about Hillary is going to result in a vastly superior candidate, but it can't be done for four years.

    The idea of inspiring anyone under 30 to go out and vote for a third party candidate is great and all, but after going through my political optimist phase back in college, I've had it. At best you'll get them to come out to political rallies, but come election day, 3/4 of them will end up sitting around their house twiddling on their phone because they didn't want to go stand in line for a couple hours.

    Unless you simply meant ILL-INFORMED in that you live in a state where your vote literally can't impact where the electoral votes end up going, like you do, and thus obviously third party is the best maneuver. If I lived in Oregon I'd be all over that. But after our state elected probably the single most f'd up conservative state government in the entire country, I'm not taking any chances!!!
     
  4. flint757

    flint757 SS.org Regular

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    I meant the latter. I live in a state where my vote already doesn't matter, and a majority of Americans do as well. It's both majority conservative and heavily gerrymandered. I also live in a conservative county, which doesn't help much. Often times local seats have only one person running as well (which shouldn't be allowed IMO). I just fail to see how any of this will be fixed by going about things like business as usual. The biggest hurdle is getting people to the booths and then the next hurdle is keeping voters informed, but not only is our for-profit media incredibly biased, pending on the station, we are learning from the Wikileaks that the two major parties are colluding with the media conglomerates and manipulating voters (I presume that the Republicans are equally as guilty; I highly doubt it is just Democrats).

    Serious inquiry: How does one take steps to fix any of these things when all of this is the case and the only influence you have is your vote? It seems to me the only options are sticking to ideals and integrity or taking the nihilistic approach that nothing will ever be fixed/changed for the better. If pivotal groups throughout our history had taken the latter approach we'd never have progressed to the point we are at now IMO.

    The two parties from within will never willingly allow changes to happen that aid in the removal of their power and position so I don't see how constantly giving them our only leverage, our vote, will solve this issue.

    I'm curious what sort of damage control measures will be taken in the coming weeks. They'll either twist it in to something it isn't, dismiss it entirely, or actually make a positive effort to resolve the tension. So far I've seen MSM call booing cheering and the SOP for the past 6 months has simply been complete dismissal. Needless to say I'm extremely doubtful that they'll do the right thing.
     
  5. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    Anyone catch Sarah Silverman's awkward speech at the DNC tonight?
     
  6. wankerness

    wankerness SS.org Regular

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    No. What did she do? She seems like someone that might be a blind Hillary fanboy. There are a lot of them in the entertainment industry. She does also seem like someone that wouldn't be afraid to be VERY awkward if she felt like it, though.
     
  7. Promit

    Promit SS.org Regular

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    (accidental duplicate)
     
  8. Promit

    Promit SS.org Regular

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    I was a Bernie supporter, but that ship has sailed. I don't support any of the remaining candidates, but I guess I'm voting Clinton as she's at least in the general ballpark of things I support. I'm not on board with Johnson's stated platform even if I do take him seriously (which I don't) and I cannot say enough bad things about Jill Stein.

    I donated to Bernie and shared my reasons for supporting him with those I knew, during the primary. During the general, I'm what Michael Moore described today as a "depressed voter" - my vote may go to Clinton, but I'm not doing anything to help her get anyone else's vote. I also do not appreciate the threats that every choice that isn't Clinton is Trump - the people using that scare tactic are pathetic.
     
  9. aesthyrian

    aesthyrian SS.org Regular

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    Jill Stein, anyone?
     
  10. bostjan

    bostjan MicroMetal Contributor

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    It was entertaining for all the wrong reasons. She gave a speech in support of Bernie Sanders, got everyone in the crowd booing or chanting "Bernie!" and then told everybody to vote for Hillary because Bernie said so, basically. Then her little mic drop moment at the end of her speech was completely aborted when she was told that Paul Simon wasn't ready to go on yet, and she'd need to stretch her speech another minute. So, then there was ~60 seconds of very awkward "ummm... uhhh..." and posing for the camera whilst the crowd continued descending into pandemonium, which culminated in her shouting "To all the Bernie or bust people - YOU"RE BEING RIDICULOUS!!!!"

    Vote for whomever you want to vote. If you don't like Clinton, don't vote for her. You can still vote in local elections where your choice makes a difference. The presidential candidates will only take your vote as another drop in the ego bucket. Our only hope right now is to vote in a good and just congress to take care of Hillary once she cheats her way into the White House.
     
  11. Drew

    Drew Forum MVP

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    She was actually an early and prominent Sanders supporter.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dh78x0Pr1s
     
  12. Promit

    Promit SS.org Regular

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    I don't consider "don't vote" to be an acceptable course of action, and of the various candidates Clinton is the clear winner. I'm not thrilled about it, but that's where the chips fell.
     
  13. vilk

    vilk Very Regular

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    But dudeman didn't say not to vote. He just said don't vote for the candidate you don't want to be president.
     
  14. Promit

    Promit SS.org Regular

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    ??? Did you miss the thread? That's exactly what I'm doing.
     

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