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Discussion in 'Live Performance & Stage Sound' started by scottro202, Mar 13, 2011.
Dude, that is CRAZY
You guys must really click to travel that far just to practice!
I don't know if the situation is better in north america and northern europe, but here in italy there's just NO WAY to even think about getting paid if you're playing metal.
in fact, the best chances to play are the various music contests that pop out a couple of times a year, where you have to pay to participate, but as long as the fee for the whole band is less than 70-80€ i still consider it a good deal because you get to play at least 2-3 shows and even though it's impossible to win (because metal bands just cannot win these contests, period), it's pretty much the only chance to play a bit.
we consider ourselves lucky if we get a free sandwich and beer, just to state how things work here.
my band is just starting out, we are only 1 year old and we started strictly as a cover band for the first 6 months, but still 4 out of the 6 gigs we played were for a music contest, and i would gladly pay the 75€ fee again to do 4 more.
So... have you ever considered looking for a place you can rent, and then selling tickets and pocketing what you make? Maybe starting small and building an audience?
popular thing in the south here is to find a friend with a garage,basement, whatever and check the other bands and then put on a show.
we will pretty much play anywhere because we are sitll in our formative stages
for the rjght amount of money i'll play anywhere
first off, this is a great thread!
secondly, for my 2 cents
to play a gig, my band needs 2 things to happen:
1. good organization: gig posters need to be up, some media promotion (forums, facebook, myspace, youtube if possible...), a good relationship with the guy that's organizing the gig -> when to be at the location, whens the tone test, will there be any catering, how long is the playing time per band, what equipment will be there etc.
2. we need travel expenses to be paid... we will play anywhere if after the show we will be at 0% loss for the gig. we feel that we haven't quite reached the "i am a metal god" status and therefore can't ask to get payed. but things are looking well and we have a tone guy and manager... as our EP will soon hit the streets and when we finish our euro tour we will ask for money + traveling expenses per gig...
at my country things are kinda bad... you can play, let's say, a festival but you'll go there at your own expense, play during the day (20-30min at best), manage your own food etc. it's a pain in the a** but you can always say that you've played "at that festival"...
all in all, we're all up for playing live... but some standards have to be met...
Never really understood this mentality, I always figured it as a hard-and-fast rule that meant you never had to think about whether to play a gig or not. If the band's philosophy is to better the band at every opportunity then it should be applied to choosing not to play shows also. Playing a particular show or indeed too many of the wrong type of shows for the wrong amount of money can earn you a reputation with promoters that can be hard to shake. I've not been in a band that's done this because it seemed like common sense to me, but I see it happening a lot.
but still, i wouldn't play just any gig... a lot of things come to mind. if we, as a band, don't get (let's say) gas coverage chances are we won't play. we have to pay our monthly band space rent and 3/4 of us don't work (collage) so the income is small :/
not to mention merchandise, recording, mix/masters etc. that you have to pay...
if we get an offer to play Wacken and we have to cover all our expences than ok... but if you play some bar or gym with no PA system, have to carry your entire backline, travel 200 miles and play 4 free -> hell no
Thats ~50% of our gigs.
I mean we DO get "gasmoney", but often it wont cover it complete. But I dont care. Even if we reach only ONE person at that show, obtained one single new fan - it was worth it, and money cant buy that. Hell, at our first show in Germany (first one outside of Austria), we drove 800km (1600 in total), and as only 40-50 people showed up (and there were more expensive headliners also), the guy made a total loss. He offered as a few bucks, we declined, as we really saw that he lost a serious amount of money that evening. And you know what? We played there again (with much more people attending that time). The band that played after us, insisting on the full cash, did not.
One just needs to realize - if you want to take your band outside of your country, you ARE going to make a financial loss. Thats it. Tour? Financial loss to the max. I can only recommend everyone to FORGET the idea of getting away equal. It may work for selected single shows, but than please forget the idea of "making it" (whatever that means today).
Playing a show and getting one fan from it when you make a monetary loss is hardly worth it unless that fan goes crazy and convinces hundreds of people to listen to you.
A band IS a business after all...
My Band discussed this topic last rehersal, as we are still writing our first stuff (prog extreme metal), and we think:
- We do not want to play a gig, that will cause us a financial loss. Promoting our own gig as hard as we can is an absolute must, but if we are forced to buy and resell XXX tickets at this stage of publicity won't work out. I don't get how someone would not want to promote his gig, the more people come to hear you, the better ... or not?
- As far as bands are concerned: we won't play with nazi bands (or every literally extremist band) or in such venues. This sticks to you, and ain't no good.
As far as style or genre is concerned, we will pay with anything, that somehow fits together with us. Meaning, we won't play with a poprock band, but there is no problem with metal, prog, post-stuff or crossover ect, as long as there is a chance we might get people interested in our stuff.
No matter how big you are, for corner genres it is almost impossible to find a completely matching bands to gig with...
that's basically it. A written contract is appreciated, or someone we trust tells us to trust the booker ... I have seen a lot of bands getting ripped of, by being told "you will get paid" and then being given 5 beer and a smile.
I really dont know about the situation in Sidney, or Australia in general - in Europe, forget the idea of getting away even, let alone making a profit. It wont work, unless you play in your hometown (or near it) only.
I'm not talking about EVERY gig, but the further away the gig is, the higher the loss usually. At least for the first few times. We for example- when we play in Vienna, we make profit. When we play the nearest states (lower austria, styria, etc) we make little profit, or sometimes at least get away even.
Further away (rest of austrian states, or Germany/Czech/Slovakia/Hungary/...) - we make a financial loss very often (depends on if we sell shirts or not etc.etc.).
some of you guys must either be in some pretty big established bands or not play many shows? cause not taking a loss is almost unheard of around here, whether we play 2 hours away or 20 minutes away we usually just make something like 20 bucks from the promoter and maybe a little more if we sell merch
Not for many, many people.
If people ran bands as a business there would be WAY fewer bands. I don't know of any business that can outlay thousands of dollars worth of gear, travel to shows, break even or LOSE money and keep operating. lol
On a REALLY good gig my band will clear a couple hundred bucks between venue/merch. The occasional big show we've made a good bit more. BUT , 80% of the shows we play break even if you factor in gas. Which we don't . The band members pretty much supply that so we can go play 'rockstar'.
If you want to make money on most gigs or have any kind of a guarantee you need to be in a cover band. I know a few guys making a decent second living with covers. However they HATE it as much as they hate their "day job".
Edited because I spell like a two year old sometimes...