Do most guitarists really care how big a guitar builder is?

[jl-austin]

There is a lot of small company hype. You know the NGD threads with all sorts of crazy wood, flamed this, quilted that, with woods that I cannot even pronounce.

How does it play?

However, lets be honest here. A lot of people like BUYING guitars. Very rarely do you see a guy with a custom guitar that has 1 guitar. They already have there trusted guitar to play, and most of the time are just looking for something different (I am talking about the person who orders a custom guitar from a small company).

So the bottom line, what ever makes YOU happy. If playing an pointy shape Ibanez makes you happy, so be it. If playing a KxK makes you happy, so be it. It's all good!

[Thep]

In my opinion, the best guitars are Japanese strats and superstrats from the late 90's, early 00's.

Namely, Ibanez and Jackson Professionals.

If I had to pick the most magical experience with current models, it would probably be G&L. I was really quite disappointed the first time I played a couple Musicmans and Carvins.

[Church2224]

Originally Posted by oremus91

Talking to another guitarist is a lot like politics. You can both argue until you're blue in the face but at the end of the day it's generally a battle of preference in which there is not a correct answer.

Custom builders appeal more to 7 string/ERG players like you said and that's because the "big" companies aren't willing to make those sorts of instruments and if they have them but you don't like it.. too bad!

Then you have hipsters who need to have the most obscure brand to be cool.

I can agree the whole arguing about gear is a lot like politics. I read a Suhr vs. Jackson thread on the Gear Page and people were siding with Suhr because they thought Neck thrus were inferior for a variety of reasons, while others argued for Jackson for overall playability and thirty year reputation. So a lot of people have the idea of what the "perfect guitar" really is.

Then I went to another forum where a guy put his Suhr against his Sl2h-MAH and said the Suhr one only because he liked the Gotoh FR on it more than the Jackson,then later the Jackson won when he put a titanium FR on it. He also believed the Jackson USAs he has played are better than 90% of the Suhrs he has tried, so it is really preference.

Originally Posted by Stealthdjentstic

Imo the only reason to go custom is if no production guitars meets your criteria.

Originally Posted by MFB

Both of my electrics are by brands that are no longer what they used to be, with Steinberger only doing the Spirit/Trans-Scale guitars and Parker now doing the Radial Joints and being owned by Washburn, etc... I'd say that constitutes as a no since they should be considered "dead" and that makes ME a hipster guitarist or something (Either way, carbon fiber guitars > *)

It is unfortunate to see these two companies as shadows of their former selves. I really liked Parkers. But from what my Jackson dealer, who is also a Parker dealer, told me that Parker might be coming back with some cool stuff, but that is a big MIGHT. US Music Corps also did away with Washburn which is sad as those WM526's were sick as hell.

Fortunately Fender has done some good for my boys at Jackson and their guitars are still awesome .

Originally Posted by Blitzie

I've never understood the whole "expensive = good" thing. I mean, obviously some companies make some really cheap guitars that aren't worth the money but most of them don't.

Honestly, I've played a bunch of Les Paul's that cost $1200+ and they were pretty nice but for my money, my LTD EC-1000 has a better neck and better pick ups for half the price. Obviously some companies make high priced but amazing instruments. Any of the JP models are the best guitars you'll ever play. Same with PRS and Ibanez.

Personally, if I connect with an instrument and it inspires me, it's worth whatever the price tag is. I'm just lucky that my taste isn't very expensive...except for a PRS CU24...need me one of those

Well I agree with this to an extent, I do tend to go for more USA/ Japanese/Canadian/European built guitars, mainly for quality of components and over playability. Having compared an LTD to a Japanese ESP, You can tell the difference in quality and construction. Same with comparing a Japanese Jackson with a USA, or a PRS SE with a Maryland PRS.

That being said the above mentioned imports are still great guitars, I would just like to pay for for the overall quality. Not "custom shop small company" prices but more the high end production guitars.

As for PRS being the best played, like I said personal preference. I personally think that I enjoyed playing other guitars more than PRSi.

Originally Posted by snowblind56

It really all just snobbery, but not only for the high priced guitars. Some people only play boutique. Some only play Gibsons. Some will only play 60's pawn shop garbage guitars.

Right or wrong, it all comes down to the fact that people bond with their guitars for many different reasons.

I had a Bernie Rico Jr 7 string that I never really bonded with. It was the best playing guitar that I have ever played, but i just didn't feel right playing it. Ibanez 7's fit me better, so I traded it off. Same with a PRS Singlecut that I had, amazing guitar, but it just didn't feel right. That got traded for a Les Paul, which got traded for an American Standard Strat, an ESP LTD EC1000t, and a Fernandes Tele. Of all of them, I have bonded with the Strat the most. Just a simple sunburst Strat with an H-S-H pickup setup. Weird, but I just go with it and keep searching for guitars that I bond with better.

100% agree with the snobery. The "What I have is better than what you have because it is mine" mentality essentially is the problem here, and imho gives inaccurate facts that some people will believe.

Originally Posted by engage757

Kev,

75% of guitarists are following the popular bandwagon. They play a name, not a guitar. It is a just in keeping with the popular crowd. I have picked up my buddy's guitars that are your standard Fenders/Gibsons etc, and been apalled at how shitty and unplayable it is. However, they have a Gibson! So they must be cool.

Then you have 10% Fanboys. People that just jump on a smaller companies bandwagon. SHit or not, it must be the greatest thing in the world, or people on a forum that have never even considered being able to afford or come close to owning one would not be talking about it so much. These people hype a brand into existence and may have never even seen one in person. Then they may purchase one and play it for awhile, then learn that God's gift to the guitar world isn't perfect for them, as it was for the people who made the intelligent decision to actually see what they like and not follow popular trends.


Then you have the extra 5% that actually care. That play every guitar they can to find out what they like and what sounds good where. Often times, these people move to smaller, more boutique, handbuilt custom shops, often times for the simple fact that they like little things about different guitars, and this is the best way to get a tailored or semi-tailored guitar for them. Craftsmanship matters, or they would go to a CNC machined Fender.

and the other 10%? just random. THink about it. People randomly stumble across something that just works for them.

I guess you can say I am the ten percent. I really do care about the guitars I like no matter the name on the headstock.

That said, I am also a Jackson, ESP and Carvin fan boy

Still I do not believe that people who care about their guitars just go for the custom shop stuff so called "boutique" brands. Some people may just play tons of guitars and find a simple LP shape guitar to be their personal favorite. Plus Look at it this way a Caparison TAT may be made in much smaller quantities that a USA Select Jackson Soloist, but they are both high quality and very well built guitars.

Also I do not get the hate some people have for CNC machines. ESPs, PRSi, Carvins and Suhrs are have a good amount of CNC work in the building process and they are very high quality guitars.

Originally Posted by SirMyghin

Sorry but all I got out of posts was WHY YOU NO LIKE G&L!?

In all seriousness, there is no accounting for it. Most folks like to really justify to themselves where they put their money, which leads to some snobbery. If you shelled out a tonne on customs, you are going to want to believe they are the best. Where as as Stealth said (probably the only useful thing he has ever said at that ), if you can find what you need in a production guitar, get that.

lol I ALMOST got a G&L Invader, almost, and one day I think I will, but overall I prefer neck thru bodied guitars.

Also I would love a Suhr Modern one day, but it would have to have my own neck carve for me to like it. The ones I played either had that elliptical shape Suhr uses, the Guthrie Carve, or a strat like neck and radius, never could bond with the neck on them but everything else was great.

Originally Posted by Jack Secret

The times are no longer "Well, I don't agree with you about ______ but I respect your opinion and I hope you'll be happy". It's "YOU PIECE OF DOGSHIT HOW DARE YOU NOT LIKE WHAT I LIKE!!!!".

When I told the Jemsite cats I was done with Ibby and moving on to Carvin, it felt like they thought I turned traitor. Not everyone mind you but some gave me that stinkeye that happens through forum posts. Just let it roll, brothers. I'm the happiest I've been with my collection (albeit waiting on the three new Carvins). I was a willing victim over quality. I'm not going to go over what I called the "guitar mid-life crisis" again but things are better with 20 guitars from 4 different companies than 55 with one company the majority over the rest and most just bought to say I have one.

Sometimes, you have to learn the hard way.

Play what you like. If someone says you're wrong, flip 'em the bird.

Ironically the Carvin forum treated me that way when I said I was getting a USA Jackson. Saying how they were poor quality for reasons that were not true by any means. After than I asked to have my account deleted.

But like you said my Virginia Brother I would rather have guitars from four brands than just one. I think I will stick with the Carvin, Jackson, ESP and soon Guerrilla arsenal. I just wish I had 20 guitars period!

Originally Posted by NickCormier

I think a lot of what makes a guitar "perfect" for you is the specs; regardless of who makes it.. So from your post, where you say you loved the ESPs, Jacksons and Dean, but dont like the Suhr/Anderson/G&L/etc, I think its safe to assume you clearly prefer the superstrat flat-radius style over the Fender-based stratocaster style (bolt ons, rounder radius, thicker neck profile, etc)

I know when I tried JJ's KxK's, which he thinks are amazing, I found them to be "eh".. Id take a new Carvin over his KxK's anyday (unless I could sell the kxk and buy two carvins with the profit haha) - POint is, it was his specs so I didnt like it. If it was my specs, maybe I would like it more. (I also find them quite ugly, eh)

I think the only way you can really find out if the "boutique" customshops are worth it for you, is to order one with your EXACT specs and then give it a proper A/B.. If you like Jacksons and ESPs chances are you like neckthru and 16" or 20" radius, thin shredder profiles and humbuckers with floyds; you wouldnt find a Suhr, PRS or G&L with those specs in any store lol You'd have to order it with your specs.

Then theres the appearance; Each company has their own "style" in looks, and I personally think a guitar I love the look at, I'll want to pick it up and play a lot more than if I found a guitar ugly as .... even if it played great. If you prefer the looks of Jackson/ESP/etc along with the price and playability.. Just get it and be happy with it. Theres no "absolute best guitar company ever made", just different specs/looks.

So in other words.. Just buy a Carvin. jk hahah

lol I have two Carvins and want more

But you hit the nail on the head, I tend to prefer the neck thru super strats, Vs, and warriors with occasionally liking certain bolt on models super strats, typically with either very flat or compound radius fretboards, 12 inches being the smallest I can handle right now.

Originally Posted by Overtone

-The issue with bigger companies can be quality control, where flaws might be allowed in the final product, and in cases where they might use cheaper materials. But I think that ultimately it comes down to that those manufacturers have different lines, and in the cheaper lines they allow this stuff. I've seen some crappy cheap Ibanez, but I've never played a bad JEM!
-One thing smaller companies often do a good job of is making sure that they nut is made well and the guitar ships out with a good setup. That alone can make the guitar feel better to play. But again, when the big shops go to the trouble of doing that, the results are great too!

I agree that the lower quality import stuff tends to be that way, but like I always sat you get what you pay for. The higher end production stuff I.E. PRS, EBMM USA, Jackson USA, ESP Japan, Ibanez Prestige, ect tends to be very consistent.


One thing I do see is that people automatically also assume that a smaller company makes more consistent guitars. Yet I have seen some sub par and problematic Caparisons, BRJs, Guerillas, Strictly 7s, Suhrs and a couple of other brands on other forums. BUT this is generally an exception to their reputations, not general quality they have.

No matter how big or small a company is they will make mistakes, a few bad guitars will slip out there, it is a fact of life and will happen. But these few do not represent the huge amount of great guitars that have been produced.

[LolWotGuitar]

Originally Posted by Fun111

As someone who's owned over 30 guitars the last few years, and used to sell 'em I drink tele have some views on this.

-There is a big name brand mentality among trendy players, people who play to be in an Indy band and because their friends do, it's just a fashion thing so like with their clothes, the name is basically all that matters. From there you just get the model that suits your image. That's fine, if that's what you care about then great, I wouldn't go into a fashion district and comment because I don't know that. Guitars aren't just for us gear nuts, anyone can do whatever they want with guitars.
-There are the pseudo-knowledgable, semi-gearnut types. These are generally about 16 years old or under (though older ones exist). They look at what all their favourites like and only like that, and tend to just repeat what their favourites have said, everything else is crap and laughable (EMG Pickups? What a crock of shit! You want Seymour Duncan 59's in your xyz guitar - Mark Morton fan). These are normally also genre-nazis (and normally metal fans too for some reason :-S).
-There are the 'everything' players, who know what they want out of a guitar and generally know what guitar they want. They know what they want, they walk into the shop and having poured over specs on the web they just buy/order stuff. Nothing custom generally, And they never seem to sell anything...
-There's the total gearslut, wise at buying, lots of selling. These guys generally tend to have the broadest and most complete knowledge of guitars, and usually have an acceptable set of specs which they prefer, but will break away from them for certain exceptions. These guys enjoy guitars for what they are, and the ones of these that I know usually have quite a broad set of tastes, they also tend to see the good in most guitar related things, rather than bashing genres or types of guitars. Quality is generally the most important factor, and these guys seem to bounce around the top end of the scale when it comes to price range.
-There's the old-timer aka vintage snob. Tends to turn the nose up at anything modern and different to the original dozen odd configurations. There is also an exact opposite of this, see the first line. When these two mix, guitarguments ensue.

Those seem to be the main groups, there are obviously others.

I feel people tend to try out new things based on what their inspirations like because it's what sounds good to them, so they try to find something they can implement a part of themselves into if that makes sense.

From what I have experience over the years is that through experimentation comes knowledge and development of your own style as a guitarist whether or not you fit into any specific category listed above. I found myself fitting small parts in each that I have done or tried in order to get the sound that I can hear in my head as well as have the playability that suits me.

I've tried a lot of older guitars, old Fenders, Gibsons, Guilds, guitars like that and I never really enjoyed playing them, they just didn't feel comfortable to me. Although when I moved into guitar manufacturers such as Schecter, Ibanez, Dean, etc., I found multiple things about certain guitars that suited me very well as a player and that I was comfortable with. I enjoy'd Schecter's a lot, they sat well with me and my playing, however the neck was a bit on the wide side, just something about it set me off, but I could deal with it for a time and still do. I had tried an Ibanez FGM100BLK 89; used..and I died inside. It was a GREAT guitar and it was what I was looking for, for the most part. I however did not like that it had tune locks, as well as only 22 frets, but the cutaway was unique and since I enjoy playing on high frets and do a lot of solo stuff it's what I found to be right for me. But, seeing as I could not find a guitar that had EVERYTHING that I wanted in it; I moved to custom guitars. I just went about experimenting with guitars as I found specific artists whose sound or playing style caught my eye; and i'd study or research the guitars that they used and then try them for myself and if I found something I liked, i'd add it to a specific specification list of what I NEED to have if I want the perfect guitar for my taste and style.

I feel that regardless of what everyone is into, everyone goes about buying guitars based on personal preference, Playing Style, and even body build, or just what sounds good to them. Everyone is built differently. People go through different stages as they progress as a musician as well, i'm sure there are plenty of knowledgeable and talented musicians out there who started as the 'pseudo-knowledgable, semi-gearnut types' that have moved on and developed their own taste for what works best for them, and also come to respect themselves and they guitar they are playing, rather than respect their idols and what they are playing.

[Church2224]

This is another thing for me, I could never find ONE guitar I like, I like to switch them up and play different ones.

[Trespass]

I`m not really caught up on neck carves and joints like most guitar players seem to be caught up on. I once was, so I can kind of empathize, but my technique has grown way past that point. I also don`t care for the look of a guitar that much. Obviously, I enjoy a good looking guitar, especially if it`s an archtop, but those PRS carved `10` tops usually make me gag.

I am, however, really caught up on sound. Give me a oil finished, no stain, blond archtop that sounds awesome, and I`m happy. Or a plain, satin finished solidbody with decent looking woods that`s ergonomic, (Strandberg etc.).

I also do not believe in the `body wood` impacts tone bit, or that chambering makes much of a tonal difference.

[SirMyghin]

Originally Posted by Church2224

lol I ALMOST got a G&L Invader, almost, and one day I think I will, but overall I prefer neck thru bodied guitars.

There is the point of contention I am a bolt on guy. They work for me, not to mention I am a set up nut. Might be correlated.

[Konfyouzd]

All I care ab is how the company's instruments feel in my hands and whether or not their designs are aesthetically pleasing. .... all the bullshit.

[JP Universe]

I buy all my guitars online without even playing them.... My mate that works in a guitar store considers it wrong but for whatever reason it always works out well for me.... I have a pretty good idea of what I like and what I don't like and I know I just need to give a guitar a good set up and everything will work out fine. I stick to superstrats in general (Ibanezes for the most part) because of the looks. Essentially I just buy on gut feeling and what will work for me at the time.

It's funny that without even playing them beforehand that i was never been into BC Riches, Schecters, Gibsons and Fenders and after trying all of them I didn't bond with them at all.

I'll be sticking with my future purchasing of a superstrat Suhr (Only played 1 of their strats before), Tom Anderson (Only played 1 of their strats before), Ibanez 90th's Satch, PGM and Jem (for aesthetics and my JPM 90th plays amazing so a no brainer. Another higher end PRS (My workhorse CE 24 is probably my favourite playing guitar) and with regards to customs I am on the waiting list for Strandberg (My G/F said it best - 'these ones are like art'). I want a BRJ at some point (Superstrat, hype)
I've never been super pumped for something only to play it and it let me down. If that ever was the case, hell... i'd set it up and i'm sure it would come through.

[Explorer]

I remember when I finally bought my first new-to-me guitar. I kept going back to the store, trying different guitars, and finally knew this one was more satisfying than the rest, so I'd have to (unwillingly) pay a bit more. I'd rather have saved the money for something else, but fortunately I had a job and had saved the money.

I know there's a lot of members here who are gainfully employed, but I've run across a lot of threads here which typify this:



*laugh*

[cGoEcYk]

quality of player > guitar fanciness

[MFB]

Originally Posted by technomancer

Two words: personal preference

Play what you like

Says the man who owns HOW MANY KxKs vs. production guitars?

[Key_Maker]

I love guitars, are just like girls, some beauty queens other not so much but every woman can be loved/....ed, as the guitars, every guitar can make my neighbors angry and that's the important thing.

[eaeolian]

Originally Posted by Stealthdjentstic

Wait till you guys see my custom I ordered in bright pink with skittles inlays

I knew it. You're actually Lee!

[technomancer]

Originally Posted by MFB

Says the man who owns HOW MANY KxKs vs. production guitars?

I'm playing what I like, what's your point? I've been through literally dozens of different guitars figuring out what I like for different applications and now I own KxKs to fill most of those roles (you'll note my KxKs all have different specs to fit different uses).

So like I said, play what makes you happy.

Originally Posted by eaeolian

I knew it. You're actually Lee!

Don't mess with the Skittle flames

[The Reverend]

Does it matter how big they are, or whether they can make something unique? It seems to me that people want an instrument that reflects them or their tastes, and I don't see anything wrong with that. I'm considering getting a custom guitar, not because I have such exact specs I have to have, but because I want a guitar made for me, one that is unique, and one that reflects who I am. It's a tool of personal expression, after all, so it follows that wanting a personalized guitar isn't a bad thing.

[Stealthdjentstic]

Originally Posted by technomancer

I'm playing what I like, what's your point? I've been through literally dozens of different guitars figuring out what I like for different applications and now I own KxKs to fill most of those roles (you'll note my KxKs all have different specs to fit different uses).

So like I said, play what makes you happy.



Don't mess with the Skittle flames

Did he ever post his ultimate fr00t or did he disappear before hand?

[Go To Bed Jessica]

Hands and ears decide - I don't care what the headstock says.

I can't pretend to speak for "most guitarists" though.

[luca9583]

For me it's just a case of how practical something is. A well setup decent Strat copy with quality pickups installed is likely to sound good and would be a good backup guitar for a real Fender for example.

I would say that i'm not concerned with how big a guitar builder is at all, if they can make the guitar that i'm looking for, be it a Gibson Les Paul, custom fan fret ERG or anything else.

[technomancer]

Originally Posted by Stealthdjentstic

Did he ever post his ultimate fr00t or did he disappear before hand?

He disappeared before it was done. I think the fretboard pics I have were the only ones ever posted

[Konfyouzd]

Originally Posted by MFB

Says the man who owns HOW MANY KxKs vs. production guitars?

A perfect illustration of his point if you ask me...

[Andromalia]

Well, big companies have more customers so getting an opinion on them is easier. Forum nuts notwithstanding, you're more likely to get a neighbour's opinion on a Gibson or Fender than on a boutique brand that you likely don't know exist anyway.
Seriously, how many blackmachines have been made ? Does it even reach 100 ? How do you want people to have an educated opinion about them ? ^^

[Explorer]

That's an interesting point, but I think one of the things which got lost was one of the original ideas, that the conversation wasn't necessarily about the ultra-customs versus Squire, but about smaller lines versus larger lines at the higher end.

So, someone might turn up their nose at Fender and go for G&L just because Fender is more popular (following the examples given), when actually trying a high-end and price-comparable model would show little difference between the two, and sometimes even a lower-priced model from the big boys can be great in playability, while some more "boutique" brands might not be all that.

----

Interesting point about people who order customs which they've never actually seen.

Every high-end custom instrument I've bought (and it's not many, only four in my lifetime) have come about because I've been able to play a few examples, and have traveled to meet the builder and to try out some more, and to talk about what I needed. It's actually been more than four builders who got a visit, because it seemed that there was a mismatch of the vision of the finished instrument, and it wasn't worth taking a chance when I was thinking of dropping more than a few thousand on an instrument. I wanted something which would work for me in making money, and I didn't want to buy a tool which I'd hate every tiime I set up at a gig.

One more observation: I never worried about expressing my individuality with the instrument(s). It was always about getting something more playable, with easier access to more range. I figured my individuality came out in my playing, so I didn't need lots of flash, so the instruments basically looked like Scandinavian furniture, with the beauty coming from removing most things which had no utility, and the functional remaining.

[Stealthdjentstic]

Originally Posted by technomancer

He disappeared before it was done. I think the fretboard pics I have were the only ones ever posted

God damnit, hopefully your Herc swirl fills the high end fruit void in my life.

[All_¥our_Bass]

I have no loyalty to any make or brand.
If it's good for me, I can afford it and have a good use for it, I'll buy it.