[Tech] HOW TO: The reversible 18v mod!

darren · 09-06-2008, 06:32 PM

It's fairly well known that EMG preamps are designed to work with as much as 27 volts. The 18 volt modification is pretty common among bass players, as it offers more dynamic range and greater headroom, reducing the amount of built-in compression that the EMG preamp performs in 9 volt operation. However, on EMG's own advice, there's not much benefit of 27 volts over 18, so i'll focus on the 18 volt mod here.

There are a few scattered threads on the forum asking about the 18v mod, so i thought i'd do one comprehensive writeup incorporating everyone's input on how to do the 18v mod. Of course, you can do this by modifying the guitar's original wiring, but when i saw this idea, i thought it was pretty clever, and 100% reversible without changing your guitar's original wiring. (Making it really easy to switch back if you prefer 9 volt operation of your EMGs.)

The idea is to bump the voltage feeding the EMG preamp to 18 volts in order to increase dynamic headroom. You can run two 9 volt batteries in parallel to double battery life, but that's not the point of this exercise.

All you need is a soldering iron, some electrical tape and/or heat shrink tubing and three 9 volt battery clips from Radio Shack (or somewhere similar).

And, since a picture is worth a thousand words, i'll save you from any further reading by providing a handy diagram which explains it all:

It's also been asked a number of times if the 18 volt mod will benefit other active pickups or preamps. The best advice is to consult the preamp's manufacturer. I believe Bartolini preamps do well with 18 volts. However, Seymour Duncan Blackouts have a preamp that's designed to offer optimum headroom at 9 volts, making the 18 volt mod unnecessary.

DISCLAIMER: All modifications, including this one, are undertaken at your own risk. If you screw something up and you blow up your guitar, your pickups/electronics, your cables, your pedals, your amp or yourself, it's your own damn fault. You will not hold the author of this post or sevenstring.org liable for any personal injury or loss or damage of personal property that may arise from this modification.

yellowv · 09-06-2008, 07:10 PM

This has been posted before, but your diagram is better.

darren · 09-06-2008, 10:10 PM

Yes, i know it's been posted before, but the information is really scattered across a few disparate threads that are hard to search for because "EMG" and "18v mod" all fall below the forum's search threshold.

And my diagram is better.

I've done a quick A/B test with the EMG 808 in my Agile Intrepid Pro. I played something really simple, clean and distorted to try and get a sense for the differences. I tried to include regular/lighter picking as well as slamming the strings harder in both clean and distorted modes.

In the left channel are the 9v tracks, and in the right channel are the 18v tracks. The cleans are totally unprocessed. Just the guitar into my Line 6 DI, and through GearBox on the "no amp" setting direct into GarageBand. No post-processing was used. The distorted tracks are the same Recto patch i've used on other recordings.

Soundclick: EMG 808 9v vs. 18v

Initial impressions:

My setup makes it hard to do quick pans between the left and right channels, but there are definitely differences in tone and responsiveness. Essentially, everything that's been said about the 18v mod is true... there are much greater dynamics, which you can hear and also see on the waveforms. There's a lot more "air" in the sound when running 18v. It's more apparent on the cleans than the distorted sound. When playing with a lighter touch, it's quieter, and when really slamming the strings, it's louder. In 9v mode, the amplitude of the signal coming out of the guitar is much more even.

Tonally, i actually like the 9v sound a bit better. It has a bit more depth to it to my ears. The 18v has a touch more "presence" at the super-high end of the sonic spectrum. That said, i'd gladly swap more dynamic range and responsiveness for a minor tonal difference that i can tweak back in with EQ.

So there it is... my pseudo-scientific comparison of an EMG 808 in 9v and 18v modes.

My apologies for some audio glitching on the tracks... i haven't really got my system optimized for running audio apps, so there's a bit of weirdness at times. Sometimes it makes it into the recordings, other times not.

Josh Lawson · 09-06-2008, 10:18 PM

I added tags to this because I think it is a very important thread for many users. This will hopefully help searches in the future.

Elysian · 09-06-2008, 10:22 PM

hmmm so i could run 4 batteries, a pair in series connected in parallel with a pair in series to double the voltage and battery life?

thatd be crazy battery life.

darren · 09-06-2008, 10:23 PM

Good call on the tagging.

darren · 09-06-2008, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elysian

hmmm so i could run 4 batteries, a pair in series connected in parallel with a pair in series to double the voltage and battery life?

thatd be crazy battery life.

You'd pretty much need to route a whole separate compartment just for the batteries! Maybe just stick a lantern battery in there.

angus · 09-07-2008, 04:16 AM

I did a similar thing to one of a friend's studio instruments- a custom EMG. I wired a switch in so he could swap on the fly from 9V to 18V. They sound very different, and it allows you to have a lot more freedom to change the tone on the fly in the studio. Not at all practical for live work, but a very very easy mod.

Nice diagram, but the way. Love the realistic shading on the batteries!

I don't know about the guitar pickup stuff, but EMG bass preamps can actually be wired up to 45V (I think Seymour Duncan's can, too). Absolutely no reason to, but you can. I can't remember if their active bass pickups go up to 27 or 45V. I've never heard of someone actually going beyond 18 with them, though.

neoclassical · 09-07-2008, 10:13 AM

Hmmm. Never thought it would be that easy. I'll have to try it this week. I've been interested in the difference.

Thanks,
Adam

eleven59 · 09-07-2008, 10:25 AM

Couldn't you do this with just one extra battery harness?

Just hook up the positive of one battery and the negative of the other battery to the stock harness, then use the second harness to join the other two poles, and solder and tape the wires on the second harness together?

darren · 09-07-2008, 10:29 AM

Yes, you could do that, too! Smart guy! I forgot about that one.

This way is a little more idiot-proof, though, and allows one to more easily attach the wiring harness to the two batteries (in my case, they're taped together, as there's only one battery clip in the Intrepid's control cavity) then insert the batteries and hook them up to the stock battery clip. And if you don't have room to put the batteries exactly side-by-side, you can position the second battery wherever you need it, and can adjust the wire lengths to suit.

eleven59 · 09-07-2008, 10:36 AM

Like this:

eleven59 · 09-07-2008, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darren

Yes, you could do that, too! Smart guy! I forgot about that one.

This way is a little more idiot-proof, though, and allows one to more easily attach the wiring harness to the two batteries (in my case, they're taped together, as there's only one battery clip in the Intrepid's control cavity) then insert the batteries and hook them up to the stock battery clip. And if you don't have room to put the batteries exactly side-by-side, you can position the second battery wherever you need it, and can adjust the wire lengths to suit.

Ah yeah, valid point. I think if I end up trying this with my Hellraiser, I'll be doing it the way I suggested, with the two batteries taped together and taped into the back of the guitar, as it only has room for one battery in its battery compartment

darren · 09-07-2008, 11:16 AM

Yeah, that kinda sucks. But it's worth trying out, for sure. It's a tough call on 9v vs. 18v for me. The 808 in 9v mode had more girth to the tone, but the dynamics were very even overall. Going to 18v opened it up quite a lot, made the dynamics a lot better, and to the best of my ability to describe it, essentially shifted the "resonant peak" upwards.

You can especially hear it on the long clean sustained tail in my demo recording. If you listen to the overtones on the 9v tail, it has a slight "oooooh" tonality to it. On the 18v side, it sounds more like an "aaaaah". It's very subtle, but it's there. It's not so much a shift in the fundamental tone of the pickups or the guitar, but a slight difference in the way the pickup/preamp hears the overtones.

Having never been an EMG user before, i'm really impressed with the quietness of them and their sustain. Also their ability to really "hear" the string. Picking softly on a clean channel gives you that Metallica "Enter Sandman" tone instantly. With gain, they're quite articulate and brutal. No surprise, really.

st2012 · 09-07-2008, 03:12 PM

Great diagram! Helpful as always Darren

decoy205 · 09-08-2008, 07:57 AM

This is great. i never knew about this mod before this forum thanks for the information.

7deadlysins666 · 09-09-2008, 01:56 PM

I just did this to my Schecter C7 which has Duncan Designed active pickups.....you CAN do it with Duncan Designed active humbuckers. Just to let everyone know. Sounds amazing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eleven59

Ah yeah, valid point. I think if I end up trying this with my Hellraiser, I'll be doing it the way I suggested, with the two batteries taped together and taped into the back of the guitar, as it only has room for one battery in its battery compartment

I have this problem too. I THINK what im going to do after I tape off the joints I just soldered (can't find my damn electrical tape!!) Im going to rout the wires for the original battery connector back into the control cavity, and just have both batteries in there. That way you don't have to worry about the batteries falling off the back of the guitar etc. I can't seem to find my camera's charger so I can't do a tutorial on it but if you'd like I'll tell you how it works.

Groff · 09-11-2008, 09:09 AM

I have a question.

I'm trying to get a Schecter Loomis hardtail for christmas, and I'm curious to see what the 18v mod can do. I plan on making the reversible harness as you posted as that is VERY easy to do. But I had a thought. Is there ANY way to hook up an on-on toggle switch to the harness so that you can SWITCH between 18v and 9v?

angus · 09-23-2008, 11:46 AM

Of course. 18V power into one input, 9V power into the other input, center output is power out. I actually usually do it with the ground circuit (18V's ground is input 1, 9V ground is input 2, output is chosen ground) as it's technically safer and easier on the circuit, but it really doesn't matter for these currents. Most people do power, hence why I mentioned it first.

Metal Ken · 09-27-2008, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMissing

I have a question.

I'm trying to get a Schecter Loomis hardtail for christmas, and I'm curious to see what the 18v mod can do. I plan on making the reversible harness as you posted as that is VERY easy to do. But I had a thought. Is there ANY way to hook up an on-on toggle switch to the harness so that you can SWITCH between 18v and 9v?

I was just looking at this thread as i just did the mod to the OFR loomis. If you get solid plastic battery clips, you'll have to mount both batteries in the control cavity (It takes up just a hair too much room to use the main battery compartment using this mod-- Unless you splice off the connector from the stock batteries and soldier the new jack on)

That said, i'm sure the switch is possible, but on the loomis i barely noticed any difference between the two. I sat there and A/B'ed them for about twenty minutes. Its true what darren said about some more dynamics, but the basic tone of the pickup, to my ears, is unchanged. i was just using a practice amp, as my cabinet for my Single Rec is at the band practice space, but in the end, i cant justify spending another 3 dollars to buy another 9 volt so i dont have to use my hellraiser's battery. it really doesnt make too much a difference to me.

mmotorsport · 10-01-2008, 10:54 PM

I just did this mod on my new ec-1000 with dual 81's. I love what it did for the bridge pickup but the neck pickup has seemed to loose all of its jazzy tone. I can barely tell the difference when i switch between the two. any one ever had this happen

andreeee · 10-02-2008, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmotorsport

new ec-1000 with dual 81's.

i thought the ones with emgs came with a 60 in the neck?

mmotorsport · 10-02-2008, 10:40 PM

the models now do come with 81/60...........the earlier ones came with dual 81's

soldierkahn · 10-03-2008, 05:21 PM

it should be possible to run your bridge pup off of 18v and then wire your neck pup to run off of 9v. i wouldnt dare try to make a diagram for yall, considerin i dont have the right crayons lol

but it should be possible

Neil · 10-22-2008, 02:00 PM

Hey can someone confirm whether this wiring diagram will work.

Its using a push pull pot (DPDT switch) in the middle of the diagram, the advantage of which in 9V the batteries drain equally.

Cheers

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09-06-2008, 06:32 PM	#1
darren Decibel Guitars Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Greater Toronto Area, Canada Posts: 11,472 Thanked: 75 Feedback Score: 9 reviews	[Tech] HOW TO: The reversible 18v mod! It's fairly well known that EMG preamps are designed to work with as much as 27 volts. The 18 volt modification is pretty common among bass players, as it offers more dynamic range and greater headroom, reducing the amount of built-in compression that the EMG preamp performs in 9 volt operation. However, on EMG's own advice, there's not much benefit of 27 volts over 18, so i'll focus on the 18 volt mod here. There are a few scattered threads on the forum asking about the 18v mod, so i thought i'd do one comprehensive writeup incorporating everyone's input on how to do the 18v mod. Of course, you can do this by modifying the guitar's original wiring, but when i saw this idea, i thought it was pretty clever, and 100% reversible without changing your guitar's original wiring. (Making it really easy to switch back if you prefer 9 volt operation of your EMGs.) The idea is to bump the voltage feeding the EMG preamp to 18 volts in order to increase dynamic headroom. You can run two 9 volt batteries in parallel to double battery life, but that's not the point of this exercise. All you need is a soldering iron, some electrical tape and/or heat shrink tubing and three 9 volt battery clips from Radio Shack (or somewhere similar). And, since a picture is worth a thousand words, i'll save you from any further reading by providing a handy diagram which explains it all: It's also been asked a number of times if the 18 volt mod will benefit other active pickups or preamps. The best advice is to consult the preamp's manufacturer. I believe Bartolini preamps do well with 18 volts. However, Seymour Duncan Blackouts have a preamp that's designed to offer optimum headroom at 9 volts, making the 18 volt mod unnecessary. DISCLAIMER: All modifications, including this one, are undertaken at your own risk. If you screw something up and you blow up your guitar, your pickups/electronics, your cables, your pedals, your amp or yourself, it's your own damn fault. You will not hold the author of this post or sevenstring.org liable for any personal injury or loss or damage of personal property that may arise from this modification. Durero, Evergrey, emperor_black and 2 others like this. web \| facebook \| twitter

09-06-2008, 07:10 PM	#2
yellowv Turd Ferguson Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: S. Florida Posts: 7,091 Thanked: 220 Feedback Score: 19 reviews	This has been posted before, but your diagram is better. Konfyouzd likes this.

09-06-2008, 10:10 PM	#3
darren Decibel Guitars Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Greater Toronto Area, Canada Posts: 11,472 Thanked: 75 Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Yes, i know it's been posted before, but the information is really scattered across a few disparate threads that are hard to search for because "EMG" and "18v mod" all fall below the forum's search threshold. And my diagram is better. I've done a quick A/B test with the EMG 808 in my Agile Intrepid Pro. I played something really simple, clean and distorted to try and get a sense for the differences. I tried to include regular/lighter picking as well as slamming the strings harder in both clean and distorted modes. In the left channel are the 9v tracks, and in the right channel are the 18v tracks. The cleans are totally unprocessed. Just the guitar into my Line 6 DI, and through GearBox on the "no amp" setting direct into GarageBand. No post-processing was used. The distorted tracks are the same Recto patch i've used on other recordings. Soundclick: EMG 808 9v vs. 18v Initial impressions: My setup makes it hard to do quick pans between the left and right channels, but there are definitely differences in tone and responsiveness. Essentially, everything that's been said about the 18v mod is true... there are much greater dynamics, which you can hear and also see on the waveforms. There's a lot more "air" in the sound when running 18v. It's more apparent on the cleans than the distorted sound. When playing with a lighter touch, it's quieter, and when really slamming the strings, it's louder. In 9v mode, the amplitude of the signal coming out of the guitar is much more even. Tonally, i actually like the 9v sound a bit better. It has a bit more depth to it to my ears. The 18v has a touch more "presence" at the super-high end of the sonic spectrum. That said, i'd gladly swap more dynamic range and responsiveness for a minor tonal difference that i can tweak back in with EQ. So there it is... my pseudo-scientific comparison of an EMG 808 in 9v and 18v modes. My apologies for some audio glitching on the tracks... i haven't really got my system optimized for running audio apps, so there's a bit of weirdness at times. Sometimes it makes it into the recordings, other times not. Purelojik likes this. web \| facebook \| twitter

09-06-2008, 10:23 PM	#6
darren Decibel Guitars Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Greater Toronto Area, Canada Posts: 11,472 Thanked: 75 Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Good call on the tagging. web \| facebook \| twitter

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09-06-2008, 10:18 PM	#4
Josh Lawson Banned Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Davis, Ca Posts: 931 Thanked: 10 Feedback Score: 1 reviews	I added tags to this because I think it is a very important thread for many users. This will hopefully help searches in the future.

09-06-2008, 10:22 PM	#5
Elysian Banned Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 6,622 Thanked: 43 Feedback Score: 22 reviews	hmmm so i could run 4 batteries, a pair in series connected in parallel with a pair in series to double the voltage and battery life? thatd be crazy battery life.

09-07-2008, 04:16 AM	#8
angus SS.org Regular Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Haven, CT Posts: 759 Thanked: 5 Feedback Score: 4 reviews	I did a similar thing to one of a friend's studio instruments- a custom EMG. I wired a switch in so he could swap on the fly from 9V to 18V. They sound very different, and it allows you to have a lot more freedom to change the tone on the fly in the studio. Not at all practical for live work, but a very very easy mod. Nice diagram, but the way. Love the realistic shading on the batteries! I don't know about the guitar pickup stuff, but EMG bass preamps can actually be wired up to 45V (I think Seymour Duncan's can, too). Absolutely no reason to, but you can. I can't remember if their active bass pickups go up to 27 or 45V. I've never heard of someone actually going beyond 18 with them, though.

09-07-2008, 10:13 AM	#9
neoclassical FENRISMAW Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Petty obsessions. If this is heaven, how bad is hell? Posts: 775 Thanked: 11 Feedback Score: 0 reviews	Hmmm. Never thought it would be that easy. I'll have to try it this week. I've been interested in the difference. Thanks, Adam "But Lord, during the hardest trials of my life, why was there only one set of footprints?" "Because," said the Lord, “Sandpeople always ride single-file to hide their numbers." man wat u satalking about i am shono -shonoo

09-07-2008, 10:25 AM	#10
eleven59 None shall pass. Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 8,039 Thanked: 164 Feedback Score: 5 reviews	Couldn't you do this with just one extra battery harness? Just hook up the positive of one battery and the negative of the other battery to the stock harness, then use the second harness to join the other two poles, and solder and tape the wires on the second harness together? jsl2h90 likes this. The Offensive Senses Twitter Facebook

09-07-2008, 10:29 AM	#11
darren Decibel Guitars Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Greater Toronto Area, Canada Posts: 11,472 Thanked: 75 Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Yes, you could do that, too! Smart guy! I forgot about that one. This way is a little more idiot-proof, though, and allows one to more easily attach the wiring harness to the two batteries (in my case, they're taped together, as there's only one battery clip in the Intrepid's control cavity) then insert the batteries and hook them up to the stock battery clip. And if you don't have room to put the batteries exactly side-by-side, you can position the second battery wherever you need it, and can adjust the wire lengths to suit. web \| facebook \| twitter

09-07-2008, 11:16 AM	#14
darren Decibel Guitars Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Greater Toronto Area, Canada Posts: 11,472 Thanked: 75 Feedback Score: 9 reviews	Yeah, that kinda sucks. But it's worth trying out, for sure. It's a tough call on 9v vs. 18v for me. The 808 in 9v mode had more girth to the tone, but the dynamics were very even overall. Going to 18v opened it up quite a lot, made the dynamics a lot better, and to the best of my ability to describe it, essentially shifted the "resonant peak" upwards. You can especially hear it on the long clean sustained tail in my demo recording. If you listen to the overtones on the 9v tail, it has a slight "oooooh" tonality to it. On the 18v side, it sounds more like an "aaaaah". It's very subtle, but it's there. It's not so much a shift in the fundamental tone of the pickups or the guitar, but a slight difference in the way the pickup/preamp hears the overtones. Having never been an EMG user before, i'm really impressed with the quietness of them and their sustain. Also their ability to really "hear" the string. Picking softly on a clean channel gives you that Metallica "Enter Sandman" tone instantly. With gain, they're quite articulate and brutal. No surprise, really. web \| facebook \| twitter

09-07-2008, 03:12 PM	#15
st2012 Texas CEO / RHLC Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 2,617 Thanked: 28 Feedback Score: 4 reviews	Great diagram! Helpful as always Darren

09-08-2008, 07:57 AM	#16
decoy205 SS.org Regular Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: NJ Posts: 175 Thanked: 2 Feedback Score: 3 reviews	This is great. i never knew about this mod before this forum thanks for the information. http://www.soundclick.com/bands/defa...bandID=1114140

09-11-2008, 09:09 AM	#18
Groff Medicine Chief/RHLC© Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: South Jersey Posts: 6,880 Thanked: 253 Feedback Score: 18 reviews	I have a question. I'm trying to get a Schecter Loomis hardtail for christmas, and I'm curious to see what the 18v mod can do. I plan on making the reversible harness as you posted as that is VERY easy to do. But I had a thought. Is there ANY way to hook up an on-on toggle switch to the harness so that you can SWITCH between 18v and 9v? AHHH MOTHERLAND! All hail soviet Arktanistan-Groffistan!

09-23-2008, 11:46 AM	#19
angus SS.org Regular Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Haven, CT Posts: 759 Thanked: 5 Feedback Score: 4 reviews	Of course. 18V power into one input, 9V power into the other input, center output is power out. I actually usually do it with the ground circuit (18V's ground is input 1, 9V ground is input 2, output is chosen ground) as it's technically safer and easier on the circuit, but it really doesn't matter for these currents. Most people do power, hence why I mentioned it first.

10-01-2008, 10:54 PM	#21
mmotorsport ss.org Regular Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: NJ Posts: 29 Thanked: 0 Feedback Score: 0 reviews	I just did this mod on my new ec-1000 with dual 81's. I love what it did for the bridge pickup but the neck pickup has seemed to loose all of its jazzy tone. I can barely tell the difference when i switch between the two. any one ever had this happen

10-02-2008, 10:40 PM	#23
mmotorsport ss.org Regular Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: NJ Posts: 29 Thanked: 0 Feedback Score: 0 reviews	the models now do come with 81/60...........the earlier ones came with dual 81's

10-03-2008, 05:21 PM	#24
soldierkahn BAD MAMMA-JAMMA Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 1,387 Thanked: 18 $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ $soldierkahn is rather kvlt and tr00. \m/$ Feedback Score: 6 reviews	it should be possible to run your bridge pup off of 18v and then wire your neck pup to run off of 9v. i wouldnt dare try to make a diagram for yall, considerin i dont have the right crayons lol but it should be possible Looking for an Ibanez RG970XL

10-22-2008, 02:00 PM	#25
Neil XL Whore Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: UK Posts: 691 Thanked: 9 Feedback Score: 7 reviews	Hey can someone confirm whether this wiring diagram will work. Its using a push pull pot (DPDT switch) in the middle of the diagram, the advantage of which in 9V the batteries drain equally. Cheers

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