[EverDream]

Originally Posted by JJ Rodriguez

To rule out the tuner, swap it with the one for the low E, then try it. If the low E does the same thing, then your tuner is fucked.

Brilliant idea! I think I will try that next, and then if that's not it I'll get a picture of the nut. I'll be back.

[Metal Ken]

Originally Posted by EverDream

I'm not tuning down a major 3rd, that'd be G, I'm at G#. Also I'm not tuning the whole guitar down, just the last 2 strings. The rest of the guitar is in A# (half step down). I also have this same problem in A tuning (a little tighter than G#), in A# it doesn't drop 10 cents probably drops 10 cents in G#, 8 cents in A and 6 cents in A#.

Meanwhile my .046 string tunes fine down to C# and barely drops at all. .046 tension at C# is close if not less tension than .062 at G#, so if the problem was that I need more tension then it would effect the .046 at C# too and it doesn't. So that can't be it. Also I wouldn't like playing on strings that tight. But the fact that it drops in pitch even at A#, that's like similar to if I did what you said and added thicker gauge string to do G#. Similar tension. So that's not the problem.

It looks crystal clear that this is a problem with something in the 7th string slot, whether it be the bridge saddle, the pickups, the nut, the tuning pegs, or even the string thru body hole. Because all the other strings are fine, and this has happened before with other string sets so I don't think it's a bad string, because that would mean I'd have to have gotten bad 7th string everytime I ordered and that'd be kinda rare, especially since it's D'addario and they are so consistant.

So anyone know how techs work? I'd have to have them check it out for free but then only charge if they are sure they can fix it... otherwise I'd rather just buy a new guitar.

My bad, i was thinking it was drop G.
Either way, i was just throwing that out there to consider every possibility.

[JJ Rodriguez]

Originally Posted by EverDream

Brilliant idea! I think I will try that next, and then if that's not it I'll get a picture of the nut. I'll be back.

Yeah, you can tell I'm a computer technician Easiest way to find out if something shit the bed, put it in something else and see if it's still fucked.

[EverDream]

Originally Posted by Lethe

1. If you tune your guitar so that ~3 seconds after you've picked the pitch is dead-on, how does it sound?

Well then doing short notes and chords sound out of tune, but if I sustain then it slowly drops into tune. I need it to just stay in tune altogether though not different depending on note length, lol.

Originally Posted by Lethe

2. How close are your pickups to the strings? If you lower them as far as possible, does it get better?

I have tried this, it doesn't get any better or worse, the only difference is the signal gets weaker (which is normal, lol)

Originally Posted by Lethe

3. If you tune to B, does the problem persist? Is it getting a little better or even worse?

It gets better (but still not perfect), but by then it feels like a steel rod, and I can't play strings that tight! Too tight for me.

Originally Posted by Lethe

4. In order to rule out the nut slot being too wide (although I think that's hardly the cause), could you try it with a 70 string, tuned to A? If you don't have one of those handy, try putting one or two thin layers of tissue in the nut, then put the string in, tune up, and cut away the parts that hang out. If you can't do that, try winding one layer of half an inch wide tissue around the part of the string that sits in the nut, then push the string in. This is no final solution, but it may help finding out what's wrong.

5. Report back.

Ok! This is a good idea, man so many ideas I don't even know which order to do them in. I think I might start with your idea first since it requires not much modification. Then if that's not it I'll try the other ideas. I'll report back. Thanks for all the ideas. I have a good feeling about getting this solved now.

[Lethe]

Whatever it is, let's hope there's an easy fix for it.

[EverDream]

Ok I just got back from doing the tissue idea. It didn't get any better at all. Still the same 10 cent drop. Ok so now it's on to the next plan. I guess I'll take the string off and see if I have a .070 in my drawer (I might have saved the .070 I had on a few years ago). If so that will be a better test then the tissue. After I'm done that I'll report back.

[Lethe]

If that didn't help and you're swapping the string anyway, go ahead and switch the tuner at the same time.

[EverDream]

That is coming next, first I wanted to just rule out that the string gauge mattered or not.. and here is the results...

I had the .070 still.... but it was b0rkEn!! unfortunately. BUT... I had an old .084 baritone string (meant for like the fender bass IV) and I tuned it up to G# just to see what would happen (insanely tight), and guess what... it still dropped 6 to 7 cents!! Ok so now I'm definitely moving on to swapping the tuners. Here I go, I'll be back with a report.

UPDATE 1:Ok! That was fun.....

Changing tuners did absolutely nothing. The 7th string still decays and the 6th string is still fine... now I'm just totally confused... I think maybe now it's time for some pictures. I'm gonna take some pictures of the various elements that the string goes through. (the tuners, nut, saddle, pickups, string thru hole) Anything else I should take a picture of that might help you guys let me know!! I'll be back.

UPDATE 2: Ok I decided to instead of taking pictures try one last thing... Taking the .062 string off and the .046 off and putting the .062 string in the 6th string slot. I did that and I have results...

The .062 string still decays 6-10 cents at G# even as the 6th string!! Ok, I'm starting to possibly have a hunch what the problem might be... When I tested the .084 string it was much worse at the same tension and about just as bad at higher tension (an .084 at G# is tighter than .062 at G# and it was just as bad at that!).

The thing about the .084 that was different was... the string was severly bent out of shape, even on the speaking length of the string around the first fret or two, now on the .062 the speaking length is totally straight... but the string IS bent a little from between the tuning peg and the nut.

I don't notice any bent parts of the other strings... I think we have our culprit. So I guess I must have a bad habbit of accidentally bending the thickest string when I first string them up! This has to be the reason, I just never dreamed that would effect the string decay behavior!!

So what I'm going to have to do is put on a new set of strings... (because I don't want 1 new string and 6 that are 3 months old!) But this time I have to string them up without bending them. I'll have to be extra careful. I think I accidentally bent it when I was doing the lock twist at the tuning peg, because the string was so thick it wasn't very flexible so I must have been a little too rough with it and bent it out of shape...

...I just never dreamed that would matter.. but I think that's it, because the .084 I put on was really bent out of shape and it was even worse... meanwhile my other 6 strings aren't bent at all even between the nut and the tuning peg and they are all fine.. It's just common detective logic!!

So I'll be back after I put on new strings. Anyone have any thoughts on this, I'm curious what you all think. Anyone have any reason I shouldn't believe the string being bent wouldn't matter, despite the hard evidence? (lol, it'd have to be some pretty darn good counter evidence!! lol).

UPDATE 3: Ok before I went changing strings I got an idea... to pull all the slack through on the 7th string so that all of the string is perfectly straight from the saddle to the tuning peg! And I stretched it like crazy for about a good 10 minutes, and then tuned to G# and, omg, nooo! it still drops 6-10 cents!! BUT!... there is a flaw with this test that I just realized... yeah by pull the (bent) slack through now the string is totally straight... but now there is no wraps around the tuning peg, and you need like at least 2 wraps in order for the tuning to be stable... so it's not an acurate test, it's probably dropping now because there's no wraps.

Hopefully after I restring it with new strings, and I do a better job stringing it up the problem will be gone. Also the next set I put on will be a lighter gauge and I'm tuning up to standard. I'm going to leave a little less slack on the 7th string than the rest because right now my string I have on I ran out of room for the wraps on the tuning peg and it had to overlap itself a little. So I'll leave maybe 1 inch of slack instead of the usual 2. Combine that with making sure I keep the string straight, and hopefully the combination will be a winning formula!

If it isn't, then I'm going to have to have a tech look at it, so just in case I might have to do that, do you guys know how tech's charge usually? Do you have to pay upfront or will they take a look at it to make sure it's something they can fix first before they charge you? Because if it's the former I can't afford to pay and then have them say "sorry we can't fix it" lol. So hopefully it's the latter right? I'll eventually post back here with an update after I put new strings on.

[Lethe]

When restringing, you might try the following:

1. Insert the string into the string-through-body-hole.

2. Grip the end firmly, keep pulling (no need to overdo it), lay it over the bridge (run your thumb over the bridge once while pulling the string), then the nut (again the thumb), then (still pulling) wrap it once around the tuning peg.

3. Release. The string will retain most of it's bent shape at the tuning peg.

4. Wrap it around again one and a half times, then use your thumb to keep it in place.

5. Now insert the string into the hole of the tuning peg. You might have to push the windings down in order to access it.

6. Take a pair of pliers, pull the end of the string through the hole as hard as you can.

7. Still pulling the string with your pliers, tune up a couple steps so it'll stay in place.

8. Tune up.

9. (Hopefully) Enjoy a properly intonating Blackjack.

[EverDream]

That method sounds extremely insane to me... I'd HAVE to see a video demonstration of this to know exactly what the heck you mean, I've never heard anyone explain stringing up this way! I think I've got the right idea already because my other 6 strings were fine, the only thing different about the 7th string was I had some layers of wrap overlapping, and I had some of the string between the tuner and the nut bent out of shape...

I'm going to leave less slack this time so that the wraps don't end up overlapping, and I'm going to be more careful to not bend the string below the tuner. If you want me to even consider your method though I'd need some kind of visual! I'm not saying it doesn't work for you, but I'd just have to see a visual to know exactly what you mean.