[_detox]

Yo guys!

I'm interested in learning the basics of using EQ and Compression with DKFH. My band is going to be putting out a small demo before the summer to sort of create an interest, and for that we're using my POD, recording vocals at the other guitarist's house, and I'm programmed drums in DKFH. Obviously since it's a demo, it doesn't have to sound SUPER SPECTACULAR, but I'd like to set us apart from everything else 'round here with a superior sound.

I see everyone here talking about cutting certain frequencies and boosting others, but I'm not exactly sure how to do that. I do all of my synth and programming work in FL Studio 7, which is probably not the preferred DAW around here, but I understand it the most and it works well for what I want to do.


I downloaded all of the Modern Plugins that were up here in some topic, so I have those to use, as well as the typical FL Studio plugins, or other plugins that you guys would recommend. And what to start with on the DKFH mixer would be great too.


I'm starting to gradually understand what combination of EQ and compression creates what sound, but any advice (with picture examples if possible?) would be greatly appreciated.

friendforafoe, the bulber, Greg Pope, etc. anything I hear from you guys would be helpful!

I'm looking to create a really compressed, punchy snare, crisp cymbals, deep toms, and a semi-clicky bass drum as well.

Thanks SO MUCH!

[KaLeVaLA]

there are quite a few threads about this allready i think !
Just search the forum and i can imagine you will find some good pointers

[F1Filter]

Never a bad idea to add the Kjaerhus Audio Classic Series plugins to your collection. Kjaerhusaudio.com

Not all that diverse. But also a nice plugin to tinker around with. Solid State Logic LMC-1 compressor

[JBroll]

Okay, I'm assuming you already know the basics of how they work so I'll just move onto conventions. If you're not familiar with what a compressor really does (i.e. you couldn't tell me what the ratio and threshold do), I can go into that too.

EQ:

Kick scooped, to make room for other instruments... fundamental is typically around 60Hz, beater hit will be best adjusted by tinkering with 1-4K. Compression serves the purpose of 'evening' the hits and increasing the sustain to the desired level - less sustain is more appropriate for faster parts because the low end can get muddy quickly. To avoid 'boxiness', any time you boost one frequency in the lows try to cut a bit out around the frequency that is twice what you boosted (boost 60, cut 120, and so forth) - the octave.

Snare - top mic is for 'snap', bottom mic is for 'meat', may have to tinker with the phase and timing of the bottom so that it adds properly to the top. Heavy compression is typical; also, get GClip and look around the Sneap forum for the "Getting your loudness?" thread. Again, faster parts use less sustain, so compress accordingly. As far as EQ... just make it fit.

Toms - like snare, EQ to fit in the mix. Compress to get the sustain up where you want it.

For the above, it is perfectly acceptable to gate. James Murphy told me a while back to try gating the snare so that only the attack got through and then compress that - I actually like snares now.

OHs - highpass is necessary, I wind up around 500-750Hz myself most of the time. Adding 'air' with a high shelf is also helpful. Compression serves to 'even' the sounds out, and (like the others) to adjust the sustain given.

When using (or adding with reverb) the 'room sound', get rid of highs to make it sound more 'back there' and keep your drums from sounding 'buried', and get rid of lows if things start getting mushy in the bottom end. The room is great for reinforcing mids and giving a nice 'cohesion' in doing so, think of it like that - a 'depth' control.

PM or IM me for more, I can even go so far as to walk you through some basic drum mixing if you want.

Jeff

[friendforafoe]

Originally Posted by JBroll

Okay, I'm assuming you already know the basics of how they work so I'll just move onto conventions. If you're not familiar with what a compressor really does (i.e. you couldn't tell me what the ratio and threshold do), I can go into that too.....
....PM or IM me for more, I can even go so far as to walk you through some basic drum mixing if you want.

Jeff

this guy is spot on ... like i don't know what to even add seriously thanks for name dropping the three of us there detox. That's a first for me!
anywho, there's really no right answer to your question. There's suggestions and starter points, but even though you can make your drums sound phenominal alone, they can really affect your overall mix (i.e. guitars, bass, etc). The frequency ranges and compression techniques JBroll mentioned are great starter points, but you shouldn't use everything he says as gospel...nor what I or anyone else says.
The art of mixing is what you make of it. It depends on what sound you want and making it your own. What style of music are you playing/recording? Is it fast paced or slow? All of these can affect what type of sound you should go for. Now we all use DKFHS ... take Bulb's, Greg's, and my kick sound...they're all individual:

Bulb=Fleshy Beefy (Sonor)
Greg=Clicky Beefy (DW)
Mine=Ballsy Beefy (Sonor)

What's the one thing we have in common? Beefiness, but our kick sounds are all different. It may be a poor example, but I'm just trying to say know what part should do what and where it should sit in the mix and enhance it to make it unique and your own...don't copy someone else's sound. a kick should be beefy,but not bulby... a snare should give a nice crack, but not greggy [gregy?]...cymbals should chime, but not be friend for a foey. all those hits should sound like yours. Now I'm not saying don't use someone's settings as a reference and expand on it....jesus i'm rambling.
anywho, i'll give you my typical setup in dkfhs from memory. I won't give you exact volume levels or q settings, or vst presets because you should really make it your own unique sound and plus those and the frequency ranges change depending on my song and the sound i'm going for (i'm sorry if i'm coming off as an ass dude, i'm really not trying to be...my brain isn't functioning because i'm at work at 2am without coffee ):

Kick-sonor-plastic or wood beater-overhead mic off: I tend to cut around 250Hz with a narrow Q and boost 100-125Hz with a bit wider Q. i sometimes boost 1000-1500. i sometimes cut 3000-3500Hz. I always boost around 7000-7500Hz with a wide Q (for that clickiness). I'll use WavesSSL and / or Classic Compressor (that's literally the name of it) plugins on it.

Snare-THE,Pearl 2, DW: i cut 100-200Hz and boost 250Hz a bit. I boost 5000Hz and cut 1000-1500Hz. I'll as WavesSSL and Waves RComp to the top and bottom mics

Toms- Premier and Sonor- Ambient mics off (sometimes): boost 7000Hz and 500Hz. Waves SSL or Classic Compressor

Hihat- Various hats - ambient mics off sometimes: I cut 500Hz on down sometimes. I cut 200Hz on down sometimes. I boost around 5000Hz and 10000Hz. Waves SSL

Overheads- Various cymbals,etc - ambient mics off sometimes: I always cut 200Hz and boost around 10000Hz. Waves SSL

Ambient- I tend to be completely random with this sometimes so i can't really give EQ settings...if it's muddy cut lower frequencies (100-600Hz). I use a combo of Voxengo Curve EQ, Waves SSL, Waves RComp, Waves L1, or Nuendo's Muti-Band Compressor

Well there you have it...That's pretty much the gist of my drums mang. It's really all about the sound you want though. Be sure to take breaks from mixing because ear fatigue is a tricky thing...you think it'll sound great before, but come back an hour later and it sounds like ape-dick. Just tweak, tweak, tweak.

Remember these:
1) Your ears are your best friend
2) Cutting is better than boosting
3) Don't over compress anything
4) I own expensive plugins that may or may not be of the swashbuckling variety, so that means you may or may not be able to get em too. Yay for poor people like me!!

Hope this helps you some and good luck...my hands hurt from typing so much

[JBroll]

I should have put 'cutting > boosting' myself, thanks for catching that. Also, if you ever get stuck wondering whether something really should be cut or what to do next, take a little break and come back later. You have two hands, use them - when you're cutting something, if the volume seems to drop raise the track's volume to compensate... the ear tends to equate louder with better to degrees much larger than it should, so never let yourself fall into that trap. Also, start with minute adjustments (remember the eye doctor... 'better 1 or better 2') and just tinker with everything when you get lost.

Finally... look into freebies. I have mixes where I don't use anything that cost me a dime... and they sure as fuck don't sound cheap. Voxengo, Kjaerhus, digitalfishphones, even the freebies that came with Reaper... all fucking useful. You don't need the Waves shit to make the best mix ever... just know what to do with what you have.

Jeff

[friendforafoe]

Originally Posted by JBroll

You don't need the Waves shit to make the best mix ever... just know what to do with what you have.

Jeff

but Waves is nice ... You're right though. You can make anything sound great with minimalistic programs if you use your ear wisely. Nothing sounds the same...You can boost and cut the same exact frequencies with the same Q with Voxengo Curve EQ and Voxengo Gliss EQ and it's still going to sound different even though it's the same brand. Take what you have and master it and you'll be able to get a great sound...even if i use waves

[JBroll]

The problem is that everyone just pirates them and expects that all they need to do is load presets and 'master' with L2... putting aside my personal dislike for piracy and the so-far-accurate impression of Waves users that I've gotten (99% pirates, 1% people who know what they're doing and could do without them if they had to), presets are the herpes of mixing and the 'maximizers' destroy mixes like no software has a right to.

Also, the more you expect something to do for you, the less you get on your own. I still just use bare-bones stuff and recommend that new users do the same because there are fewer 'black boxes' of magic and pixie dust and more places to grasp what's actually going on. Sure, you could pay a grand for a magic box that does it all, but you won't be any more a mixer than a printer shooting out Dalis is an artist of unprecedented genius.

Jeff

[friendforafoe]

Originally Posted by JBroll

The problem is that everyone just pirates them and expects that all they need to do is load presets and 'master' with L2... putting aside my personal dislike for piracy and the so-far-accurate impression of Waves users that I've gotten (99% pirates, 1% people who know what they're doing and could do without them if they had to), presets are the herpes of mixing and the 'maximizers' destroy mixes like no software has a right to.

Also, the more you expect something to do for you, the less you get on your own. I still just use bare-bones stuff and recommend that new users do the same because there are fewer 'black boxes' of magic and pixie dust and more places to grasp what's actually going on. Sure, you could pay a grand for a magic box that does it all, but you won't be any more a mixer than a printer shooting out Dalis is an artist of unprecedented genius.

Jeff

I actually bought the waves stuff and make my own presets. I'm not a big fan of piracy by any means either. The only thing i like is the try before you buy releases H20 releases or when certain companies release, say 30 day demos. i completely agree with you about presets and piracy. Unfortunately I do have some pirated plugins, but if i like it i make sure to buy it. the lord chris alge presets that came with waves ssl actually don't sound that great...neither do the majority of prests that come out for the majority of plugins. like i said about my mixing tips and using my settings as guidlines, new users can use presets as starter points, but they should really master what they have. i used the default nuendo plugins for ages, but i needed more than just those and when i got DKFHS i was using the superior lick what you've bled settings and those got me using waves products. i read about waves ssl in future music (good magazine with all sorts of digital recording tips and software demos) and downloaded the demo. i loved it so i bought it, but i never use presets. as far as voxengo stuff, i got some free plugins with my presonus firebox and that lead me to buying some more voxengo plugins. I just have shit ton of plugins from a bulky torrent i downloaded ages ago, but do i use any? nope...well...i lied...i got classic compressor from that, but that's a free one...and i actually didn't pay for voxengo curve eq...i should...the shame i don't like piracy at all...you're stealing from the people that worked hard on something. I'm pretty sure stealing isn't legal...dammit i reeeeally should pay for voxengo curve eq