[Chris]

Originally Posted by JBroll

So THAT's why I post in P&CE once in a blue moon in hopes that maybe I can have an opinion and not be the bastard child of Dick Cheney and Pol Pot...

Jeff

Yep. So you can grandstand and act all persecuted like a 12 year old when you get called out for being a pompous ass. That's correct.

Edit: Dickbag.

[JBroll]

So I can grandstand? I'm not persecuted, I'm annoyed, and as far as grandstanding I'm hardly the only one who's trying to act high-and-mighty about anything. I'm the one who didn't check his facts, and who quoted clearly biased sources rather than spending five seconds on Google. I don't know where you're getting 'persecution complex', I'm really just getting more disappointed at how some people who I thought were at least mostly rational (even if a little too closed to dirty communists) are resorting to 'dickbag' and not actually addressing things I said.

Jeff

[Chris]

Originally Posted by JBroll

So I can grandstand? I'm not persecuted, I'm annoyed, and as far as grandstanding I'm hardly the only one who's trying to act high-and-mighty about anything. I'm the one who didn't check his facts, and who quoted clearly biased sources rather than spending five seconds on Google. I don't know where you're getting 'persecution complex', I'm really just getting more disappointed at how some people who I thought were at least mostly rational (even if a little too closed to dirty communists) are resorting to 'dickbag' and not actually addressing things I said.

Jeff

Blah de fucking blah dude. I've already debated with you enough in this thread. I posted both sides of it. The scam, and the revealing of the scam, in my first post. If that's not checking the facts, I'm sorry but I'm not going to cite 19 different sources in every post I make in here so that you and your inferiority complex will feel better about yourself without namedropping political icons in every reference that you make in order to try and sound like you know what you're talking about.

I addressed you enough, and your whining isn't worth me bothering to quote you time and time again to show you where you're wrong. It gets nowhere, because you're hard-headed and refuse to believe that anyone's viewpoint other than your own on the issue is correct, and furthermore that anyone who doesn't share your view "fails".

I really don't give a fuck what you think at this point, and judging by the rest of this thread, nobody else does either.

[JBroll]

And yet again you think that I said people 'failed' because they disagreed and not because they had biased bullshit sources and couldn't get their facts straight. Chained up for a week... oh, but really it was just a few hours... yeah, deliberately misleading, but still you're a dickbag because you say I'm a dickbag. Now you're just attacking things that aren't there (namedropping? inferiority complex?)... maybe if you actually had any idea what I think (and not just clawing at strawmen and making assumptions that made no sense) you'd be getting somewhere, but while other people are actually trying to post meaningfully you just post idiotic insults that wouldn't even win a six-year-old an argument.

If you disagreed with me on things I actually said and believed it would be one thing, but I don't see too many indications that you are doing that anytime soon.

Jeff

[Chris]

Originally Posted by JBroll

And yet again you think that I said people 'failed' because they disagreed and not because they had biased bullshit sources and couldn't get their facts straight. Chained up for a week... oh, but really it was just a few hours... yeah, deliberately misleading, but still you're a dickbag because you say I'm a dickbag. Now you're just attacking things that aren't there (namedropping? inferiority complex?)... maybe if you actually had any idea what I think (and not just clawing at strawmen and making assumptions that made no sense) you'd be getting somewhere, but while other people are actually trying to post meaningfully you just post idiotic insults that wouldn't even win a six-year-old an argument.

If you disagreed with me on things I actually said and believed it would be one thing, but I don't see too many indications that you are doing that anytime soon.

Jeff

Sigh.

Indication #1: here

Indication #2: here

Indication #3: here

Indication #4: here

You can't win this argument by sticking your hands in your ears and screaming LA LA LA YOU DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING like a five year old. I'm resorting to calling you a dickbag because despite my already shitting all over your opinions in this thread, you still don't get the point. You can conveniently ignore the entire rest of this thread and say bullshit like:

Originally Posted by JBTroll

but while other people are actually trying to post meaningfully you just post idiotic insults that wouldn't even win a six-year-old an argument.

After several pages of me trying to help you understand that CHAINING A FRIGHTENED, STARVING DOG TO A WALL IN AN ART GALLERY TO BE GAWKED AT IS A FUCKING DICK THING TO DO REGARDLESS OF WHAT MESSAGE YOU ARE TRYING TO SEND.

Now, let's play the "Memorable Jeff quotes in this thread that show him as a full of shit blowhard with no leg to stand on who makes shit up to solidify the ground he stands on" game!

Look, here's you being wrong, because nobody "believed everything they read in a chain letter" because I POSTED BOTH OF THEM IN THE VERY FIRST POST OF THIS THREAD.

but I'm the bad guy for not believing every fucking thing I read in a chain letter or petition page, and actually responding to what I say doesn't count for as much as ignoring a great deal of what's going on and making completely unjustified assumptions.

Here's you being wrong again, because CHAINING A DOG TO A WALL IN AN ART GALLERY IS CRUEL.

You're assuming cruelty, thanks to a misleading first impression, and not owning up to it.

And again, 15 posts in. Did I mention that it's all in the first post? That nobody "fell for the chain letter" BECAUSE THEY WERE BOTH POSTED AT THE ONSET OF THIS DEBATE. I guess I should mention it again because you keep going to that argument and you are ABSOLUTELY WRONG.

You fail for making unsubstantiated claims and holding inconsistent standards. How many bloody times does one goddamned faulty assumption have to be contested before people stop believing everything they read in chain letters?

Here you are apparently having a hard time reading what I type. See the whole "chaining dog to wall" thing, referenced above.

You still aren't saying WHAT HE DID WRONG explicitly

Now, here's the part where you leave out that he just let it go again. I mean, the dog served it's purpose, being terrified and chained to a wall so that people can stare at his "art", right? Fuck it, why adopt it, or send it to a humane society, or try to find it an owner, when you can just DISCARD IT BACK TO THE STREET.

You're forgetting that people DO this in the 'better' ways and get MUCH less attention. People are always holding demonstrations and trying to get people interested in helping animals... and it isn't working quickly enough. This guy went steps further, and got blasted for it by lies and gullibility. He didn't hurt the dog, but you would all rather believe inaccurate and often outright false reports than look at what actually happened.

Here's you trying to reverse things. The "things that didn't happen" include EVERYONE HERE FALLING FOR THE CHAIN LETTER, which you seem to keep bringing up. The correct version of the following quote would be "So Jeff has gone from attacking everyone else.."

So we've gone from attacking me to citing atrocities that didn't happen to taking our ball and going home

Here's you not seeing the point again. I'm "demonizing" him because I think he's a fucking asshole. If I took your dog and chained it to a wall with no food or water for any length of time, and then added the stress on top of it of letting onlookers come in and stare at it when it had no place to hide, nowhere to run and no recourse but to sit and be afraid, the average person would be pissed off. This isn't some domestic dog. This is a stray animal that's already fucked mentally enough as it is. The extra emotional stress on the dog to be part of this guy's "art" is absolutely unnecessary, and makes him a fucking asshole. And you backing it up as though he did something positive - well that makes you a fucking asshole too.

without actually harming the dog, this guy makes a serious statement about double-standards and general stupidity and gets a hell of a lot of attention for it. What's more useful, relying on faulty information and demonizing the guy, or taking a valid point and running with it?

Moving on, here you are, wrong again, because once again, both the scam and the "reveal" are in the first post. Once again, in order for you to have some leg to stand on with your absurd argument, you conveniently ignore this, again, and, again, call us out on something that NOBODY DID.

Whoops, I said you guys were misinformed and needed to look past the bullshit petition and into slightly less biased sources

And again.

So looking past chain letters is a bad thing

Here's you claiming to quote "CREDIBLE SOURCES", which is ... yourself. Bravo.

(which I don't do - seeing as how I'm the one quoting CREDIBLE sources here, that's a stretch)

And again with the chain letter argument:

but I'm the bad guy for not believing every fucking thing I read in a chain letter or petition page,

Here's you saying basically that it's ok to mistreat one animal, as long as you treat another one well. Great policy you have there.

Just because he released this one doesn't mean he doesn't care for animals normally

This quote is awesome, because you're taking a shot at us and describing your own actions in this thread perfectly.

Again, reading things that aren't there... you guys aren't even arguing things I actually SAID, yet I'M the one who doesn't listen to others. Right...

Here's you lumping us in with the "LYING BASTARDS". Now, the guy put this shit out there, people made a petition because he was full of shit, and yet somehow THEY become the liars for taking this guy on his word. And they're bastards, no less. The guy's own website had him saying "I am letting this dog starve to death". Yet everyone who believed him is not only a liar, but a bastard, because he later came out and said "A-ha! I am full of shit!".

Seriously, do you even read the shit you blather out?

Further, we don't know if he made money off of it, or, if he did, where it went, so AGAIN the posters in this thread ASSUME based on their original impression from LYING BASTARDS who make MISLEADING PETITIONS that the guy is a total bastard.

You win the fucking prize dude, seriously.

[JBroll]

#1 -

Have you ever been to a third world country? Did you go to the fucking art gallery there? Where was it, between the 4x4 disease infested hovel that houses the family of 12 and the outhouse? Do the people in those pictures look like starving third-world citizens to you?

Straw man, not something I said or implied.

They took that dog, already emaciated, then chained it to a wall for a week

As was said before, they didn't emaciate the thing, they actually fed it. Also, as said before, not a week...

As for cruelty, tying a dog to the tree on the front lawn has the same effect as tying the dog in an exhibition.

#2

Actually champ, the personal attacks started with you, here, when you opted to slam us all en-masse for not seeing your gloriously objective side of things.

Straw man, you completely misread the actual statement to feed your own persecution complex. The problem isn't with disagreement, it's about simply being wrong left and right. Also, you'll notice I pulled that back after it was taken in a way I didn't intend for it to be taken.

Chaining a scared, hungry, starving dog to a wall with no food or water to be gawked at in a museum

Again, they fed the thing... oops.

'm resorting to calling you a dickbag because despite my already shitting all over your opinions in this thread, you still don't get the point.

You were throwing names around from the start, and you haven't exactly had a bulletproof case by any stretch. You're just jumping around saying you win and you win and you win and I'm a dickbag, that's no substitute for an argument - especially when you're so frequently wrong on important details.

And again, 15 posts in. Did I mention that it's all in the first post? That nobody "fell for the chain letter" BECAUSE THEY WERE BOTH POSTED AT THE ONSET OF THIS DEBATE. I guess I should mention it again because you keep going to that argument and you are ABSOLUTELY WRONG.

Most people I know have seen this petition, and it has led just about everyone (for a while, myself included) to a much different view of what happened. You've gotten the time the dog was tied wrong and implied that it wasn't fed a few times, not correcting yourself or admitting a mistake once, and now you're insisting that you weren't misinformed?

Here's you claiming to quote "CREDIBLE SOURCES", which is ... yourself. Bravo.

And the Wikipedia article's links to credible news sources.

Here's you lumping us in with the "LYING BASTARDS". Now, the guy put this shit out there, people made a petition because he was full of shit, and yet somehow THEY become the liars for taking this guy on his word. And they're bastards, no less. The guy's own website had him saying "I am letting this dog starve to death". Yet everyone who believed him is not only a liar, but a bastard, because he later came out and said "A-ha! I am full of shit!".

I'm not lumping you in with lying bastards. I'd like to see where you're sourcing his personal website, as that's one of the first things I looked for but I have yet to see that one... what I will say is that if you willingly repeat things you know to be false, you're lying, and that's happened a few times here.

Seriously, do you even read the shit you blather out?

One of us has to, and it doesn't seem to be you.

Jeff

[noodles]

Jeff, shut up.