[7 Strings of Hate]

i ment in the whole middle east

[ohio_eric]

Originally Posted by 7 Strings of Hate

at this point we stired a hornets nest, so now we have to finish it or the hornets will grow too strong over time, reguardless how this started

There are ways to solve this that don't need hundreds of thousands of troops and hundreds of billions of dollars.

[settite]

I have a different view on things in Iraq... I have been there 3 times and will and want to go back again. My first two times were with the Navy doing Intel collection and the 3rd was with General Dynamics supporting a USMC program. Anyways pretty much all I have done since I was 18 (24 now) has been involved with Intel operations of the US Gov and support every bit of it. Alot of people really dont grasp or understand how difficult Intel collection, dissemenation, and analysis is overall. There are things I think that need to be worked on but the US has the most advanced and fastest reacting Intelligence operations in the WORLD. We use every bit of every piece of technology we can get our hands on and try and adapt it to the war fighter so they can do their job more effectively. In terms of casualties of war, well if you look at the statistics for this war compared to others we are doing VERY well. Especially if you look at the nature of the enemy we are fighting. Did you know more people die every day in the US in car accidents, murders, and suicides than you can even come close to over there? I feel more safe in Iraq or Afghan than I do driving through most major cities most of the time. How many times driving to work every day do you see a bad car accident on the side of the freeway or hear on the news about murders? Put this all into perspective and it really isnt that bad. I am fully open to discussing this more if you would like. Either continue it on this thread or send me a pm or a message on one of the instant messengers I use.

[settite]

Check this page out and then tell me what you think...

Death Statistics

[ohio_eric]

FOr one you can't compare Iraq to World War Two, for example. Iraq was supposed to be like the Gulf War or Panama. We were supposed to be in and out with minimal casualities and remember Remsfeld himself said he'd be shocked if we were there six months. Well over a year ago Cheney said the insurgency was in its last throes. We been getting lied to since this war started. The planning has been horrible. About three-quarters of the Iraqis want us out. We need to leave. It's just that simple. We should have been using diplomacy since the moment Saddam was removed from power and we still need to use it. It's not completely too late but it won't be as effective as if we started four years ago.

[The Dark Wolf]

Not to mention the whole WMD/Saddam in kahoots with UBL type bullshit we've been fed, too.

Read 'Imperial Life in the Emerald City' for a nice account of how bungled this war has been. It was get rich and establish a military presence in a hot region with valuable resources, pure and simple. It had shit to do with "democracy" and ideals like that.

I never saw how we're fighting an "enemy' in Iraq, either. Especially considering since "Mission Accomplished" (I just knew there would be a Wiki page on that topic ), it's mostly been a mission of... fighting terrorists? Nope. But trying to keep Shiites and Sunnis from killing each other (and us)? Oh hell yeah.

[7 Strings of Hate]

ohio eric, i hear ya, i didnt mean more enlongated war was the answer, i think the best answer is to with drawl into our own country and really spend the money on our own country and tighten the boarders and intel here, settie, i know you mean well, but i think the army kind of brainwashes people , and to say you feel safer in iraq than in a major city is ludicris, i mean no disrespect, your right about the statictics of the war, i dont have a problem with that, we ARE doing pretty good in that reguard, its the why i have the problem with,

[settite]

I agree with you partially but you have to agree the media has manipulated the war to look like a great tradegy and blown the deaths of the soldiers into something far greater than it is. Yes its sad the soldiers had to die but they joined the military knowing the risks and knowing what they were up against. Everyone who joins the military takes and swears to oath and its understood from that point on what each and every one has gotten themselfs into. I was shot and medically discharged from the military and I was fine with that. I knew what the risks were when I joined and were fine with that. Some things could of been done differently I completely agree but there is no reason to codemn the President alot of the things that have happened because the death toll for the war is very low considering many other conflicts the US has been in. I will support this Gov, this Country, the Democrats and Republicans til the day I die. I myself am a Republican but to me that has nothing to do with understanding alot of this.

[The Dark Wolf]

Originally Posted by settite

Check this page out and then tell me what you think...

Death Statistics

Setite, to quote Mark Twain...


As for supporting the soldiers, of course. Without question. As for supporting Bush, and a totally misguided war? No way. Never. As for supporting the Republicans and Democrats? Uh... lemme get back to you in 50 years or so when hopefully a viable 3rd party has been established.

[7 Strings of Hate]

hey, i support the country too, , for ever, but you got shot? in iraq? that doesnt sound as safe as you made it out to be.