Can you be a Muslim Satanist?

[rectifryer]

I was wondering this the other day. Its like certain religions require you to believe most of the premises of another religion, and since Islam shares alot with Christianity in this regard, I was wondering if there are those that have taken to "the other side" via the vein of Islam?

Discuss.

[MaxOfMetal]

Yes.

The "Devil" of Islam is called Iblis, and some folks find "him" worthy of worship.

[vampiregenocide]

Evil tends to be represented in every religion. It exists in the world and it would seem silly to represent all that is holy and good without recognising the bad. Some people go to religion for moral guidance, and that means acknowledging evil is necessary.

As such, where these religions deify evil there will no doubt be people who see these beings as worthy of worship also. These people may believe in a God, but question their motives and so look to alternatives within that religion.

Also, Iblis is a badass name.

[TRENCHLORD]

I thought we americans were the great satans of islam?

[rectifryer]

/thread as far as I am concerned. You guys have enlightened me.

[ghstofperdition]

Originally Posted by TRENCHLORD

I thought we americans were the great satans of islam?

Damn beat me to it. I was gonna say Americans.

Honestly I have no clue, but from talking with known Satanists on this site, I don't think so. Reason being is that Satanists (like LaVayan satanists) are pretty much atheists, but recognize the human need for rituals and the like, so they partake in them. But I've yet to meet a Satanist that ACTUALLY believes in satan, or any other deity for that matter.

[Taha-Nasser]

No, you cant be a Muslim satanist. Why? Because....

The word 'Islam' in Arabic means peace and submission. The peace refers to that within each person and between human beings (and actually also between man and all other creation), whereas submission refers to the destruction of the ego in submission to the being that originated the Universe. In Islam, this being characterises himself in many ways, but one of the key ways is as 'Nur' or light.

With regards Satan, known as 'shaytan' in Arabic - he is mentioned in the Qur'an as a being from among the Jinn (Arabic word which can include a wide array of things from certain bacteria to certain types of human beings, and also potentially other species of creation which are not known to us), and not from among the Angels as Christian mythology surmises, since Angels are believed to be incapable of rebelling against God. However, whilst this being is referred to as a single entity his only real trait is the absence of light or divinity and according to Islam he exists within the nature of all men, dissuading them from the 'straight path', in other words the path of peace and submission to God. When a person reaches the very height of rebellion under the influence of this intrinsic Satan, he is labelled in the Qur'an as Iblis. Thus Iblis and Satan are actually two different entities, one being the intrinsic rebelliousness that all human beings have turning them away from peace and submission, the other (Iblis) being an actual individual who has reached the pinnacle of evil.

Thus according to Islam, evil (ie. darkness, misguidance, satanic things etc) are simply the absence of light and so it would be difficult for a person who understood these teachings to try and worship something that was simply the absence of something else. In a sense, any person not submitting themselves to God and creating peace is actually worshipping their own internal Satan or ego, but it is not possible from an Islamic point of view to worship Satan since he is not an external permeating entity like light.

[Grand Moff Tim]

Originally Posted by Taha-Nasser

In a sense, any person not submitting themselves to God and creating peace is actually worshipping their own internal Satan or ego, but it is not possible from an Islamic point of view to worship Satan since he is not an external permeating entity like light.

Huh. That's really interesting. It actually sounds startlingly similar to some of the concepts behind LaVeyan Satanism.

Semirelated, but if you want to read up on something interesting that often gets unfairly branded as "satanism" in the middle east, read up about the beliefs of the Yazidi of northern Iraq.

The nutshell is they believe that after God created the world, he left it in the care of seven holy beings, chief amongst which was Malek Taus, who is also known as Shaytan, which as was pointed out is the Muslim word for Satan. His story is also similar to the biblical Satan, though instead of rebelling against God, the Yazidis revere him for rebelling against Adam and don't see him as an evil figure at all.

[nostealbucket]

I didn't know there was a difference between a christian satanist, a jewish satanist, and a muslim satanist.
If I'm right, it would all be based around the same concept of what is considered satan. The Torah, the Bible, and the Qur'an are both nearly the same in their explanation of evil's creation (correct me if I'm wrong.). So really, there is no such thing as a "Muslim Satanist".
If you're a satanist, you're a satanist.

[rectifryer]

Originally Posted by Taha-Nasser

No, you cant be a Muslim satanist. Why? Because....

The word 'Islam' in Arabic means peace and submission. The peace refers to that within each person and between human beings (and actually also between man and all other creation), whereas submission refers to the destruction of the ego in submission to the being that originated the Universe. In Islam, this being characterises himself in many ways, but one of the key ways is as 'Nur' or light.

With regards Satan, known as 'shaytan' in Arabic - he is mentioned in the Qur'an as a being from among the Jinn (Arabic word which can include a wide array of things from certain bacteria to certain types of human beings, and also potentially other species of creation which are not known to us), and not from among the Angels as Christian mythology surmises, since Angels are believed to be incapable of rebelling against God. However, whilst this being is referred to as a single entity his only real trait is the absence of light or divinity and according to Islam he exists within the nature of all men, dissuading them from the 'straight path', in other words the path of peace and submission to God. When a person reaches the very height of rebellion under the influence of this intrinsic Satan, he is labelled in the Qur'an as Iblis. Thus Iblis and Satan are actually two different entities, one being the intrinsic rebelliousness that all human beings have turning them away from peace and submission, the other (Iblis) being an actual individual who has reached the pinnacle of evil.

Thus according to Islam, evil (ie. darkness, misguidance, satanic things etc) are simply the absence of light and so it would be difficult for a person who understood these teachings to try and worship something that was simply the absence of something else. In a sense, any person not submitting themselves to God and creating peace is actually worshipping their own internal Satan or ego, but it is not possible from an Islamic point of view to worship Satan since he is not an external permeating entity like light.

You just blew my mind.

[areyna21]

This made for a very interesting read it's nice to here people discuss things that may be touchy with respect to one another.

[Dan]

Originally Posted by areyna21

This made for a very interesting read it's nice to here people discuss things that may be touchy with respect to one another.

I think most of us here are pretty open minded so we can share our religious knowledge and feelings in an environment where we know none of us are going to get penalised for it. Which is awesome IMHO.








I also like to think of this forum like a religious entity. Chris created it and buggered off, we have a group of disciples (mods) constantly preaching the rules.....









.....and Stealth is Satan

[ghstofperdition]

^ we have a few "demons" that try to continue on in Stealth's work, but I think he has it well in hand on his own.

While there may be a couple of subjects that will cause us to go apeshit at each other, on the whole I pretty much see the forum on the whole as cool and laid back.

[Taha-Nasser]

[matt ritti]

re grand moff tim:
as i understand it, i believe the only surviving sect (maybe i'm wrong) of gnosticism is in that area

as gnosticism has tended to be demonized throughout history,i was wondering if this sect would be the Yazidi(sp)?
m.r.

[DrakkarTyrannis]

You can't be a Christian Satanist..or a Jewish Satanist..a Wiccan Satanist or anything of the sort. Satanism makes you your own god, and as an Atheist religion, rules out all supernatural higher powers. "Theistic Satanists", or devil worshippers, are seen as "inverted Christians", thus aren't Satanists

[Konfyouzd]

???

Who cares? You can be whatever you want and call it whatever you want. Other folks just might not agree. But with religion that seems to come w the territory no matter what you choose.

[DrakkarTyrannis]

Originally Posted by Konfyouzd

???

Who cares? You can be whatever you want and call it whatever you want. Other folks just might not agree. But with religion that seems to come w the territory no matter what you choose.

I agree to an extent. If you have a religion with pretty certain guidelines..you can alter it and label it the same thing, but it just isn't. That's the issue I have with so many Crosstitutes who call themselves Christian, yet seemed to have created their own version of the rules to suit their needs.

[rectifryer]

Originally Posted by DrakkarTyrannis

You can't be a Christian Satanist..or a Jewish Satanist..a Wiccan Satanist or anything of the sort. Satanism makes you your own god, and as an Atheist religion, rules out all supernatural higher powers. "Theistic Satanists", or devil worshippers, are seen as "inverted Christians", thus aren't Satanists

If I were to reform my original question in light of this, it would be to ask if there are "inverted Muslims".

One must ask one's self, how is a religion truly atheist if you are the god?

[Konfyouzd]

Bc man is not god. You are god in the sense that there is no power above your will. Not literal.

[DrakkarTyrannis]

Originally Posted by rectifryer

If I were to reform my original question in light of this, it would be to ask if there are "inverted Muslims".

One must ask one's self, how is a religion truly atheist if you are the god?

Atheist in terms of a "supernatural higher power"..since we don't believe one exists, we are Atheist. We're our own gods..but we use the term in a more realistic sense.

[Jakke]

I agree with Drak, there are no muslim satanists, as there are no muslim christians either, it's a completely different philosophy (I would not call satanism a religion, just as atheism is not one either).

It was enlightening to hear about the muslim concept of evil, as a western atheist one usually gets threatened with the christian hell, so that part of islam mostly eludes me. It is very similar to the christian of course, but yet slightly different.
Techno is soo Paul

[BlindingLight7]

Here we go again...


Just worship who you want and stop arguing over whats write and wrong...you could worship a cheeseburger for all I care.

[Explorer]

Just noting that there are always those who argue that a religion does or does not stand for a particular thing. I appreciate the view that Islam is a religion of peace, just as most others are by what they say, and I also acknowledge that defending the faith of Islam by calling for the death of Rushdie wasn't universally denounced by Muslims.

Similarly, just as Lucifer means the devil to most Christians, but isn't really Scriptural, Islam also has its traditions which aren't Koranic.

Actions speak louder than words, and so it's worthwhile to examine actual practices, rather than what is just strictly orthodox.

----

BTW, TN, nice to see you taking part in the discussion here at SevenString.org. Hopefully you'll contribute in other places beyond this one issue in the Political and Current Events forum.

[Jakke]

Originally Posted by BlindingLight7

Here we go again...


Just worship who you want and stop arguing over whats write and wrong...you could worship a cheeseburger for all I care.

And you came in here just to say that? If you see what is written, everyone has kept an extremely civil tone, and I have personally benefited from different perspectives

Have you even read the thread? No one is sending someone else to hell (or any equivalent), a member asked a question, and we are doing our best to reason out an answer.