[ZeroSignal]

Hey,

I'm going to start a Fretless 7-String project before the end of the year. I'm thinking of getting a used RG7321 and using that.

But what I want to know is which DiMarzio Pickups have the longest sustain? (Fretless guitars have notoriously short sustain)

And does Output = Sustain?

Thanks

[JBroll]

No, output does not bring sustain; compression brings sustain, distortion naturally compresses, and thus more output (which yields more distortion, and thus more compression that way) can be confused for that, but don't get them confused. I would go for D-Activators, myself, but I can see a more middy pickup being better suited than a more scooped pickup; using a compressor (for cleans) or a Tube Screamer (for distortion sections) would give the impression of more sustain.

Jeff

[ZeroSignal]

Originally Posted by JBroll

No, output does not bring sustain; compression brings sustain, distortion naturally compresses, and thus more output (which yields more distortion, and thus more compression that way) can be confused for that, but don't get them confused. I would go for D-Activators, myself, but I can see a more middy pickup being better suited than a more scooped pickup; using a compressor (for cleans) or a Tube Screamer (for distortion sections) would give the impression of more sustain.

Jeff

So no to a Blaze Bridge and yes to a Blaze Custom? (My RG1527 will have DA7's so there's no point in having two guitars that sound the same)

[frank falbo]

I'm making a fretless 6-string right now and I'm waffling back and forth. On one hand I want the Blackouts or Livewires, so I have low magnetic pull but high output. That should facilitate the best sustain.

On the other hand, I kind of want to try a Distortion style pickup with a huge ceramic magnet, so I get a lot of magnetism around the string to compensate for the limited vibrational pattern you get from a fretless anyway. Sorry if I haven't helped.

If it helps at all I have the Distortion 7 in the "bridge" position of my lap steel. It's rude and gnarly, and it's backed off from the strings a bit because with slide you push the strings down more. But as I said, for that guitar I want it nasty and rude sounding. Perhaps for fretless you want a smoother tone? I don't know. If so, then the Blaze Custom or Evolution could be okay. THe Evo 7 would have a lot of upper mids to cut through. The Evo has the kind of upper mids that get piercing and grating with frets, but maybe on a fretless it's a perfect match.

[ZeroSignal]

Do Ceramic magnets have less string pull than Alnico magnets?

[JBroll]

Would the magnetism actually help the sound? I'd think that it would dull it even more, that's why I hesitated to recommend a pickup with a powerful magnet but a relatively lower coil count.

I don't know the Blaze pickups that well so I can't say, but if the BC is more middy than the BB I'd say it might be a better option.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by ZeroSignal

Do Ceramic magnets have less string pull than Alnico magnets?

I should think that it's about power and not material, so whichever is more powerful - which depends also on size and other things - should have more pull. END EDIT

Jeff

[frank falbo]

Ceramic has more pull than Alnico II and IV. It's more a question of the distance from the string and what you'd like to accomplish. Let's pretend the coils are exactly the same and only the magnet is changing:

The Ceramic magnet is stronger, and therefore senses and amplifies more subtle string movements. In other words, the pickup is more sensitive and "louder" for the fretless guitar because the fretless guitar string doesn't vibrate in a large pattern. The note dies off early because it's fulcrum is contacting your flesh, not a hard fret. So in that regard Ceramic should increase the perceived sustain because as the note dies off, Alnico would theoretically let the note drop into "unusable" signal level before the Ceramic would.

If the pickups are really close to the strings, then the magnetic field can choke the sustain of the string, but that's in an environment where the fretted note wants to still ring out. The fretless is going to die out whether you like it or not. Your "fretted" note on the fretless is likely to die out naturally long before magnetic pull would have been an issue. So I'd use a Ceramic especially if I was putting a little distance between the poles and the string. But traditionally Alnico (AII especially) is thought of as a sustain increasing magnet, but they mean it increases the "acoustic" sustain of the guitar by not pulling on the string so hard. In this case the note is going to die a premature death regardless of the magnet. So I'd choose the magnet type that will give me the best sensitivity.

[JBroll]

I see what you're saying with that one, I hadn't thought of it that way.

Are you considering a different fretboard material by any chance? I know of a guitarist who made glass fretboards for his fretless guitars, can't recall his name but he mentioned getting a better sound out of it because the board was denser.

Jeff

[ZeroSignal]

Originally Posted by JBroll

I see what you're saying with that one, I hadn't thought of it that way.

Are you considering a different fretboard material by any chance? I know of a guitarist who made glass fretboards for his fretless guitars, can't recall his name but he mentioned getting a better sound out of it because the board was denser.

Jeff

I was just going to defret and dedot () a RG7321's fretboard and fill in the gaps with epoxy resin. I've seen the outcome on unfretted.com and it looks quite clean.

I've thought about getting someone to make an Ebony fingerboard for me but the sheer amount of labour involved on removing the fretboard is insane...