The Wheel of Time

RgAscendant · 07-12-2007, 01:07 PM

That was EXACTLY the kind of response I wanted, cheers.

Quote:

As far as I can tell every cycle plays out differently. The basic plot is the same, but the paths to get there are unique. Is there an Age of Legends in every cycle? No, because things play out differently. The last age of the previous cycle was the Age of Legends, in which people in the world had a higher technology level, a more fundamental understanding of magic, and a higher standard of living. When the world was broken at the end of that cycle, they entered into something of a dark age, where civilization regressed considerably. The current cycle is nearing it's close in the story, but civilization has not yet progressed to the point of the Age of Legends, which is why it is clear that each cycle plays out in a unique way.

Oh jesus, I never thought about that, I thought that the Age of Legends was the beginning of every cycle, and that all knowledge and artefacts from the previous cycle was lost when it ended. That's really made me think more about the cycles.

Quote:

The souls of all of the important players return over and over with new names, most of them return multiple times per cycle. The Dragon only shows up once, at the end.

Does this mean, in a way, that Lews Therin was also the Dragon Reborn? Or were there no previous records of the Dragon for them to compare to?

Quote:

On the Dark one, you're thinking too literally. The Dark One is actually outside the pattern (reality itself). His prison is a place outside of reality. The physical location in the world that they say he is imprisoned is just a place where reality is not completely formed, they describe it as feeling "thin." Since they're always using a woven garment as an analogy, you could imagine it as a seam in the universe or something. He's not going to break through and rule the world as an evil god. If he manages to break into the pattern, he's going to destroy the pattern and unmake reality, so that everything that has ever been ceases to be and the record of all time, all the repetitious souls will be unmade.

I thought I must be, I was just confused at people saying that the Dark One was imprisoned at Shayol Ghul. Does this mean he was banished from reality, but a taint was left at this place? It's just that Lanfear tells Rand that standing inside Shayol Ghul is an amazing experience, as you can actually feel the Dark One in your presence.

Quote:

By book 7 and 8, Perrin and Mat do indeed begin kicking more ass and taking more names, so look forward to it.

Kick ass, is there any more to do with Perrin being able to speak with wolves and Mat being able to speak the Old Tongue?

Cheers for your response, it made me think a lot.

Krunch · 07-12-2007, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Oh jesus, I never thought about that, I thought that the Age of Legends was the beginning of every cycle, and that all knowledge and artefacts from the previous cycle was lost when it ended. That's really made me think more about the cycles.

Nope they're more loose than that, each one starts where the last leaves off. The next cycle is likely to begin with rudimentary firearms and steam power which will likely shape that one into a very different world than the current, more science and less magic. The previous cycle had far superior magical capabilities, and yet they never figured out how to do some of the things that are commonplace in the current time, like forming the Warder bond.

Quote:

Does this mean, in a way, that Lews Therin was also the Dragon Reborn? Or were there no previous records of the Dragon for them to compare to?

No records in the story go back far enough to tell for sure. But the Lews Therin does seem to hint that he has had contact with a previous self.

Quote:

I thought I must be, I was just confused at people saying that the Dark One was imprisoned at Shayol Ghul. Does this mean he was banished from reality, but a taint was left at this place? It's just that Lanfear tells Rand that standing inside Shayol Ghul is an amazing experience, as you can actually feel the Dark One in your presence.

It's just the "thinnest" (again using their words) area of the pattern itself. Someone remarks at one point that the bore in the prison is "everywhere at once" but it is easiest to detect at Shayol Ghul. Thus the prison is just outside the pattern (another dimension whatever), not at a specific physical location. I could probably back up my point of view better if I had read the series less than 3 years ago.

Quote:

Kick ass, is there any more to do with Perrin being able to speak with wolves and Mat being able to speak the Old Tongue?

You'll have to find out for yourself.

Drew · 07-12-2007, 01:41 PM

Krunch, I edited in spoiler tags - use them.

Krunch · 07-12-2007, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew

Krunch, I edited in spoiler tags - use them.

Sorry I didn't know there was such a thing.

Thanks for the fix.

RgAscendant · 07-12-2007, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krunch

Nope they're more loose than that, each one starts where the last leaves off. The next cycle is likely to begin with rudimentary firearms and steam power which will likely shape that one into a very different world than the current, more science and less magic. The previous cycle had far superior magical capabilities, and yet they never figured out how to do some of the things that are commonplace in the current time, like forming the Warder bond.

That's really interesting, I just thought all cycles were exactly the same with very minor differences. Does this mean that the Aes Sedai will eventually die out, as they won't be needed as much? Or will there still be need for them to train girls who can channel so they won't kill themselves?

And was the Age of Madness the end of the last cycle, or the beginning of the current one?

And sorry about the spoiler tags (or lack of), Drew.

Krunch · 07-12-2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RgAscendant

That's really interesting, I just thought all cycles were exactly the same with very minor differences. Does this mean that the Aes Sedai will eventually die out, as they won't be needed as much? Or will there still be need for them to train girls who can channel so they won't kill themselves?

And was the Age of Madness the end of the last cycle, or the beginning of the current one?

They'll still be around. The One Power is integral to the universe in the story. Since it will never go away I doubt they would either. The organization will change, but there will always be channelers. But we'll never know. We'll be lucky if the series even gets concluded at this point.

I'd say the Age of Madness was the end of the last cycle. There were years (I'm not sure how long it was, but it was multiple years) where the whole world was in chaos starting shortly after the bore was sealed. When enough of the men were killed, killed themselves, or killed each other, the dust began to settle and people started trying to rebuild. That would be the beginning in my opinion. People stood up to see a very different world than they remembered. The rampage of the men physically changed the landscape all over the world and whole areas were lost and people separated from their old homes couldn't find their way back.
Some people are of the opinion that the entire history of the world repeats after thousands upon thousands of years, which may be a more exact repetition instead of the loose history repeating itself that we see in the last few ages. Most of this kind of information is only left in small tidbits and hints in the text so it's hard to say for sure.

RgAscendant · 07-12-2007, 04:56 PM

Damnit, I hope he does manage to finish up the series, there's so much I want to know! You've been great in this thread, thanks a bunch!

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07-12-2007, 01:41 PM	#13 (permalink)
Drew Fear the Polo! • Super Moderator • Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Somerville, MA Posts: 29,955 Real Name: Call me Ahab... Main Seven: 1991 Ibanez UV7PWH Main ERG: Sherman 5-string bass Rig: Mesa Recto-verb 50 Thanked: 154	Krunch, I edited in spoiler tags - use them. "...and everything under the sun is in tune, but the sun is eclipsed by the moon."

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07-12-2007, 04:56 PM	#17 (permalink)
RgAscendant ss.org Regular Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Hartlepool, UK Posts: 300 Real Name: Josh Main Seven: Ibanez RG7321 Rig: PODXTLive->LaneyVC30 Thanked: 3	Damnit, I hope he does manage to finish up the series, there's so much I want to know! You've been great in this thread, thanks a bunch!


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