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Unread 01-11-2012, 10:12 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealthdjentstic View Post
Thats cause people are newbs, they clearly havent been reading enough studies on sustain
Yep, seriously. MindDusk, that's probably because most people are talking about how a $900 neck thru LTD is better than a $400 bolt on Ibanez or whatever. Hang around this forum and you'll notice a lot of high end boot guitars and hear people say bolt on is better. A lot of custom builders choose bolt on and a good portion of the rest of them choose the same construction as bolt on accpet they glue it in. But there's still a separate neck with a heel of some kind and a neck pocket.
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Unread 01-12-2012, 12:02 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MindDusk View Post
Well thanks for enlightening me then... but then is the 1 million dollar question, how do you know you buy a good superior bolt on guitar and a bad one... almost all guitars are bolt on..so I guess..it is like finding a needle in the haystack.

Sounds like what you want is a Les Paul then.
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Unread 01-12-2012, 12:18 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealthdjentstic View Post
Yup exactly, their was some experiment someone did that concluded bolt-on = more sustain too. You also get that level of security knowing your neck could .... up and you can just slam a new one in.
I remember reading that on Wikipedia, though I don't know if the study was peer-reviewed or if it's been replicated, which are the real tests of its validity.

But it seems to me like neck-throughs would actually decrease sustain simply because of the fact that you have two "wings" glued onto either side of the neck. Any time you're gluing parts of a body together, you're adding to its rigidity and hence losing tone you'd have with a one-piece body. Not to mention the fact that most neck-throughs are maple, which is a hard and dense wood not well suited to lots of warmth or sustain.

People always talk about the "tone" effects of solid tops, seemingly forgetting that it's glued on to the main tone wood. If it's doing anything, it's giving you more brightness and less sustain by making the body more rigid.

But I digress. The big question is whether this change in sustain/tone would actually be perceptible in normal playing, and I'm gonna guess probably not. The best reason for a neck through is the total absence of a heel, which can make upper-fret playing exceedingly comfortable. But a really good bolt joint, like the contoured joints of an Ibanez, provide just as good of upper fret access.
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Unread 01-12-2012, 12:27 AM   #79
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I've owned plenty of both well built neck throughs and well built bolt ons. I much prefer the bolt ons. I don't like neck thru guitars because I'm paranoid about screwing up the neck and being unable to fix it. Of all the guitars I've owned, it wasn't the custom shop, fixed bridge neck through BC Rich's with the best sustain. It was the bolt on J Custom (with a Floyd, no less).

Wanting a 27" scale custom eliminates Anderson and Suhr (at least for the foreseeable future). Don't let people on a forum talk you about of the specs for your dream guitar (whether it's neck though/bolt on or scale length) but I'd make real sure I actually knew what my dream specs are before throwing down big bucks. Used values on custom instruments are horrible from any builder that's actually reliable (e.g., used Black Machines hold value well but even if the guy was taking orders, good luck getting that guitar anytime soon). But, of course if you've got the cash maybe don't worry about it.
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Unread 01-12-2012, 01:33 AM   #80
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Strictly 7 Guitars – Solar 7 signature line | Ola Englund <-- Seems like this might fit your bill.
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Unread 01-14-2012, 07:42 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
Sounds like what you want is a Les Paul then.
I never really been into Les Paul. I might look what the production market has the offer... I wish there was more baritone 7 string guitars to choose from.. but there is almost a void..of supply... But all this choice gives me a serious headache

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angus Clark View Post
Strictly 7 Guitars Solar 7 signature line | Ola Englund <-- Seems like this might fit your bill.
Looks too much like Ibanez... I am quite tired of Ibanez look I want to try something different this time... Regarding....strictly 7 guitars... I have seen they have only 27.5 inch scale to choose from in the custom shop...from what I remember long time ago..when I was reading this forum...a lot of "problems" did occur just after 27 inch.. 27 inch was the perfect balance for the RG2228... I do not remember why exact 27 inch was perfect though... and why you should not go above that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cardinal View Post
I've owned plenty of both well built neck throughs and well built bolt ons. I much prefer the bolt ons. I don't like neck thru guitars because I'm paranoid about screwing up the neck and being unable to fix it. Of all the guitars I've owned, it wasn't the custom shop, fixed bridge neck through BC Rich's with the best sustain. It was the bolt on J Custom (with a Floyd, no less).

Wanting a 27" scale custom eliminates Anderson and Suhr (at least for the foreseeable future). Don't let people on a forum talk you about of the specs for your dream guitar (whether it's neck though/bolt on or scale length) but I'd make real sure I actually knew what my dream specs are before throwing down big bucks. Used values on custom instruments are horrible from any builder that's actually reliable (e.g., used Black Machines hold value well but even if the guy was taking orders, good luck getting that guitar anytime soon). But, of course if you've got the cash maybe don't worry about it.
Yeah good to know...then I can delete those from the list.
I am now also open to bolt on guitars...thanks for the people who did bring light into this subject..

I am now also looking what the market of production guitars have to offer... also semi customs of course..
It is getting frustrating as the time goes by to have no guitar to play with...
But hopefully it will be rewarding later and worth the wait...

I think tonight I have more or less decided VIK Duality..or some of the stricty7 guitars... I will spend some time reading up on VIK duality on this forum..regarding sustain and sound etc...also look for different custom models and finishes for inspiration...maybe I will end up to buy an vik duality custom made from an previous customer... maybe..I will choose the pickups myself though..
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Unread 01-15-2012, 10:22 AM   #82
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hello there,
maybe you want to take a look at these Excellent (imho) Italian Brands!
Rash
Manne
GNG
Frudua

Especially GNG, I mean just take a look at his works, he (Giulio Negrini) clearly defined a very modern (not ultra/post modern like .strandberg*) vision of what a SuperStrat should look/feature... it's definitely worth a quick look to their website.
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Unread 01-15-2012, 12:08 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by fabriarockz View Post
hello there,
maybe you want to take a look at these Excellent (imho) Italian Brands!
Rash
Manne
GNG
Frudua

Especially GNG, I mean just take a look at his works, he (Giulio Negrini) clearly defined a very modern (not ultra/post modern like .strandberg*) vision of what a SuperStrat should look/feature... it's definitely worth a quick look to their website.
wow fabriarockz, Italians seem to really be able to build guitars... now VIK Duality is not the obvious choice anymore, I looked at some of the links and I find plenty of guitars that I would consider, the question is if they are able to do custom 27inch neck. the GNG's was very nice especially fanned series..they seem to breathe quality! Manne had some nice also

I have never played with fanned frets, I wonder what is the learning curve to get used to fanned frets ? I did get used to 8 string guitar kind of fast..
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Unread 01-15-2012, 12:36 PM   #84
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You should consider a mayones, they are very good guitars and you can design a custom one with the woods and pickups and the scale length you want
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Unread 01-15-2012, 01:05 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MindDusk View Post
wow fabriarockz, Italians seem to really be able to build guitars... now VIK Duality is not the obvious choice anymore, I looked at some of the links and I find plenty of guitars that I would consider, the question is if they are able to do custom 27inch neck. the GNG's was very nice especially fanned series..they seem to breathe quality! Manne had some nice also

I have never played with fanned frets, I wonder what is the learning curve to get used to fanned frets ? I did get used to 8 string guitar kind of fast..
I'm sure there would be no problem with either a 27 scale or fanned frets.
I exchanged a couple of emails with Giulio, he's a really nice guy and he could build your guitar up to probably any specs you'd want to have, especially tone woods and tops. Not to mention a White Ebony fretboard option.

I'll try the best I can to translate the email exchange I had with Giulio:
"Starting price would be €1700 + VAT (GNG shape, satin oil finish, fixed bridge, HH pu config).

Here's a pricelist for some of the instruments displayed on my website, they are a few examples of possible configurations/features, every model is
COMPLETELY Custom.

Morgoth 7 Montorsi Signature - €2562
Morgoth 7 Standard LG7 - €3177
Morgoth DRV7 Fanned - €3240
Morgoth FM6 - €3373
Morgoth JT8 - €3984
Morgoth DrV7 Dr. Viossy - €4077
Brea Splotch - €2683
Brea MM Carved - €3244
Brea Koa Flat - €3362
Brea Funned - €3618

Prices shown of the above mentioned models are without the following customized options:
- White Ebony fretboard,
€279
- Piezo saddles, Graphtech preamp
€392
- Custom Inlays, from
€80
- Scalloped Frets, from
€190

All prices shown are VAT-less

Waiting time: 6 months or so
Payment Method: a third of the total amount as the project begins, a 2nd third before finish/painting job starts, and the final quote on shipping.
Rigid case, warranty and Certificate of Authenticity included."


He sent me this 4 days ago, so it's quite recent. This should give you a general idea about the process and the avaiable options. Maybe you would like to get in touch with him directly:giulio@liuteriagng.com
I also would like to point out that, being the both of you from EU, you wouldn't have to pay Outside EU extra charges for shipping, that alone would a fairly decent 20%-25% charge.

I hoped I helped
Fabrizio

Last edited by fabriarockz; 01-15-2012 at 01:06 PM. Reason: changed text color due to post's poor background contrast
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Unread 01-15-2012, 01:17 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WIDASK View Post
You should consider a mayones, they are very good guitars and you can design a custom one with the woods and pickups and the scale length you want
yeah, they're all good.

I'm so glad Europe is so full of potential these days, I'm pretty much sure my first custom would come from one of the European brands out there, some of them are really inspiring!
Too bad Strandberg and Blackmachine are on a huge waiting list issue right now, but I'm sure there's lots of other brands that can deliver top premium quality...
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Unread 01-15-2012, 04:02 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fabriarockz View Post
I'm sure there would be no problem with either a 27 scale or fanned frets.
I exchanged a couple of emails with Giulio, he's a really nice guy and he could build your guitar up to probably any specs you'd want to have, especially tone woods and tops. Not to mention a White Ebony fretboard option.


I'll try the best I can to translate the email exchange I had with Giulio:

"Starting price would be €1700 + VAT (GNG shape, satin oil finish, fixed bridge, HH pu config).

Here's a pricelist for some of the instruments displayed on my website, they are a few examples of possible configurations/features, every model is
COMPLETELY Custom.

Morgoth 7 Montorsi Signature - €2562
Morgoth 7 Standard LG7 - €3177
Morgoth DRV7 Fanned - €3240
Morgoth FM6 - €3373
Morgoth JT8 - €3984
Morgoth DrV7 Dr. Viossy - €4077
Brea Splotch - €2683
Brea MM Carved - €3244
Brea Koa Flat - €3362
Brea Funned - €3618

Prices shown of the above mentioned models are without the following customized options:
- White Ebony fretboard,
€279
- Piezo saddles, Graphtech preamp
€392
- Custom Inlays, from
€80
- Scalloped Frets, from
€190

All prices shown are VAT-less

Waiting time: 6 months or so
Payment Method: a third of the total amount as the project begins, a 2nd third before finish/painting job starts, and the final quote on shipping.
Rigid case, warranty and Certificate of Authenticity included."


He sent me this 4 days ago, so it's quite recent. This should give you a general idea about the process and the avaiable options. Maybe you would like to get in touch with him directly: giulio@liuteriagng.com
I also would like to point out that, being the both of you from EU, you wouldn't have to pay Outside EU extra charges for shipping, that alone would a fairly decent 20%-25% charge.

I hoped I helped
Fabrizio
Well thank you my friend, GNG did give me a very serious impression... I am reading the site now with google translate...quite strange they have no english website, but I guess, they prefer only Italian customers.

Anyway as it feels now I am quite sure I will stick with GNG. I get a better feeling then with VIK guitars and Strictly 7.

Also good news that GNG accept custom mades...The price is within my budget with a small margin.

Too bad I am not looking for an 8 string guitar any more (I will probably never buy one again). But this guitar is a ....ing monster!!! :O
And those pickups I am sure...is very nice..



I have not decided yet if I should go with fanned or normal frets... Fanned frets looks cooler for sure..but I am not sure how I will actually like to play it...increased playabillity should be the main purpose of fanned frets ?

This is the 7 string version... I like the body shape... I much prefer the silver bridge..I much prefer the darker color of the neck as on the 8 string model above...the pickups looks better on the 8 string...well good to know I can customize how I want it myself.. I did do not find any one with gng guitars on the forum using the search function...but I read on the site with google translate a little bit about how he build the guitars which did sound quite convincing.

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Unread 01-15-2012, 04:07 PM   #88
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Lets cool it with the funky colors please.

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Unread 01-15-2012, 04:25 PM   #89
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Lets cool it with the funky colors please.
You mean...these guitars are only about aesthetics ???
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Unread 01-15-2012, 04:28 PM   #90
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Quote:
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You mean...these guitars are only about aesthetics ???
No. I just edited out all of the color tags from the few posts above. Just look at the quote and then the original post.

Just keeping the site easy on the eyes.

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Unread 01-15-2012, 04:31 PM   #91
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No. I just edited out all of the color tags from the few posts above. Just look at the quote and then the original post.

Just keeping the site easy on the eyes.
ah
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Unread 01-15-2012, 05:48 PM   #92
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Those fanned 8's look awesome!

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Unread 01-15-2012, 05:52 PM   #93
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If I understand this correctly... Why fanned-frets? | Dingwall Guitars

Does this mean that if you have a fanned fret neck..baritone 27 inch might be overkill ?
I am not sure how many inches you gain of using fanned frets can some one explain ?
For what I understand fanned frets neck is an alternative to baritone ?
... besides that it looks cool I am skeptic I will like playing on fanned frets..
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Unread 01-16-2012, 01:14 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littledoc View Post
I remember reading that on Wikipedia, though I don't know if the study was peer-reviewed or if it's been replicated, which are the real tests of its validity.

But it seems to me like neck-throughs would actually decrease sustain simply because of the fact that you have two "wings" glued onto either side of the neck. Any time you're gluing parts of a body together, you're adding to its rigidity and hence losing tone you'd have with a one-piece body. Not to mention the fact that most neck-throughs are maple, which is a hard and dense wood not well suited to lots of warmth or sustain.

People always talk about the "tone" effects of solid tops, seemingly forgetting that it's glued on to the main tone wood. If it's doing anything, it's giving you more brightness and less sustain by making the body more rigid.

But I digress. The big question is whether this change in sustain/tone would actually be perceptible in normal playing, and I'm gonna guess probably not. The best reason for a neck through is the total absence of a heel, which can make upper-fret playing exceedingly comfortable. But a really good bolt joint, like the contoured joints of an Ibanez, provide just as good of upper fret access.
How would an increase in rigidity lead to a decrease in sustain?
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Unread 01-16-2012, 01:19 AM   #95
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Whatever is decision is he definitely asked this on the right forum
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Unread 01-16-2012, 09:58 AM   #96
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Quote:
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How would an increase in rigidity lead to a decrease in sustain?
on an 27 in scale with fanned neck if my logic goes right... it should mean that the lighter strings gets LESS tension and the lower gets higher..
But I guess..it creates better balance in sustain..on all strings... (with the right set of strings).

is there any calculator to calculate the tension on fanned neck ?

I just want to understand...cause if I get a 27 inch scale..it means if I understand correct the the length of the scale will be different for every string..so it basically means only the lowest string will have 27 scale baritone neck... the higher strings will have non-baritone standard neck...
Help me to understand please.
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Unread 01-16-2012, 10:10 AM   #97
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Unread 01-16-2012, 03:03 PM   #98
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Quote:
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Here's a good resource for general wood information.
http://www.jemsite.com/jem/wood.htm

After that, just go through every part of the guitar until you have exactly what you'd like. Use google a lot.
Happy building dude!
Wow thanks, that link was AMAZING!
There's so much good information there that I could just say what wood mix I'd like to build a guitar with, and I always felt like it's been kind of a shady topic for me to dig into.

The only thing that's missing (due to obvious reasons) out of the equation, would be to apply those general guidelines to your ear.
Maybe when it does quote, referring to X wood, to have a tight low, it's indeed "almost tight" to you.
I mean, what does "opennes to a certain freq" sound like? What does a tight low freq response sound like? In a basswood body? What about in a Korina body, hard Maple neck guitar?
And even if one would have the answers for all of the above, would be still compatible with what my perception of things is?

I think that probably a good chunk of my time should be dedicated to swap guitar parts (unfortunately I'm a lefty, so I don't have the same shop variety as yours probably) with one another.
I mean I'm talking about gather mid-range guitars such as Ibanez (which happen to have lots!), so not too expensive mess with a little, and start swap a basswood body for a mahogany one, and then why don't try a Koa neck into an Ibanez standard basswood body? etc, etc, etc...
Luthier's required here, but I happened to found one fairly near! Great!

Being Ibanez RG1570L (I have 3 of them) and RG7321L (4) served as a reference's starting point, I feel like I would experiment different variations, still wouldn't cost me a fortune, like buying customs all day long and then having to sell them 'cause they don't sound the way you wanted to.

What do you think about it btw? Does anyone has some thoughts about improve's one ability to know wood properly, without having to drop grands by grands?
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Unread 01-16-2012, 07:51 PM   #99
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it looks nice, but at the same time what 8 string guitar doesn't ?
no but really... it takes more to build a 7 string that looks as monstrous..
But for sure I like the guitar.
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Unread 01-16-2012, 07:58 PM   #100
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Well I have finally decided what guitar I want, I Think as it feels now I definitely want the GNG Morgoth. Now I only need help to what specs to choose. Mostly importantly..should I dare to choose fanned frets? or should I play safe and choose a standard neck... I suspect..fanned frets are maybe better and not so good depending on what guitar style.. I Can imagine it gets problematic playing chords... But I think it also depends on the scale length...on a 27 in scale neck...fanned frets might be more playable...

Besides the neck..I need to choose pickups..all other things I will ask GNG for suggestions...as for art design.. etc... if he would recommend me the standard wood used in the Morgoth series..or something else more fitting to my style.
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