[Luan]

Well.
I got interested in modal jazz since distressed_romeo explained it to me in the other thread.
I thought that So what was a great start, since it only has 2 chords.
They are Dm7 and Ebm7.
I used the aebersold backing track of the song.
So I thought, ok, over each chord I will play the blues scale, dom 7th arpeggio over the IV degree, and the dorian mode of course.
It sounded like crap.

I don't have any problems when I improvise over BT that use only 1 chord for an hour, I can use lots of ideas, but I don't know what happens here, maybe it's a problem of appreciation or whatever, i'm not on my best moment in life.

Well, any help will be appreciated.

Thanks a lot!

[DDDorian]

Here's an old GFTPM lesson by Alex Skolnick regarding playing over changes that uses a couple of examples, including "So What", that might help give you an understanding of how you can approach modal playing and negotiating progression. Hope this helps!

Playing over key changes is a big challenge for any
musician, guitarists being no exception. Not only does
it involve the memorisation of a couple (sometimes
several) scales and figuring out which scales go with
what chords, but also requires the ability to put aside
this information and concentrate on playing something
smooth and melodic over the changes. Although key
changes are more common in jazz than in rock,
knowing how to approach them will benefit both your
compositional and improvisational skills, no matter what
type of music you play.

Here are a few guidelines for making key changes
easier to grasp. First of all, no matter how many key
changes a song may have, you should work on each
change one at a time. Second, with each key change
you should ask yourself the following questions:

1. What scale or mode can I play over the new key so
thatmy left hand doesn't have to change positions?

2. Which notes, if any, are the common tones (notes
that work over both keys)?

EXAMPLE 1 is a chord progression from Nirvana's
compelling tune "Heart Shaped Box". The first two
chords are powerchords, A and F, which suggest the
key of A minor (C major). This calls for A Aeolian
(ABCDEFG, aka A natural minor). The next chord, D7,
imposes a raised 6th (D#) onto the A minor key. While
it is tempting to jump on the D root and play D
Mixolydian (DEF#GABC), it sounds better to play A
Dorian, it contains the F# and maintains the minor
modality. Plus, this way you don't have to change
positions. That's because the root of the first key, A, is
a common tone. In fact, every scale note is a common
tone except for the F, which moves to F#.

If you're clear on everything so far, move on to
EXAMPLE 2, which is more difficult. Miles Davis' "So
What" is a jazz classic that broke new ground in the
late 50s and has since been covered by many
(including yours truly on Guitar's Practicing Musicians
Vol.III). In it, you have a rythym that implies D Dorian (C
major) for 16 bars, moves up a half-step to D# Dorian
(C# major) for 8 bars, then moves back down for the
remaining eight bars. The obvious choice for
positioning is to move from D Dorian to D# Dorian, but
it sounds much better to move in the opposite direction
of the chords by using relative modes. Try going from
D Dorian to C# Ionian as the changes go up, and then
go from D Dorian to E Phrygian over the descending
changes. This way you get a smooth transition without
sounding too obviousand without a drastic position
change. Notice that there are only two common tones
in "So What", F and C, which you can use as a "safe"
note.

Don't be discouraged if it takes a long time to get in
the hang of these and other key changes. Rather than
trying to dive right in and do a full-blown solo (which
almost never happens the first time around), it's better
to ease into it slowly and only play a few notes. It also
helps to start by just playing scales over the changes
until you are able to improvise. Enjoy.

[Luan]

That was great, specially the last paragraph.

I'm having problems speacially making melodies, or motives, ideas, etc
Seems like it is harder to solo when you have 1 hour of the same chord..

Thanks a lot!

[neon_black88]

Originally Posted by Luan

That was great, specially the last paragraph.

I'm having problems speacially making melodies, or motives, ideas, etc
Seems like it is harder to solo when you have 1 hour of the same chord..

Thanks a lot!

I have to solo over this for an assesment also, so some disscussion here would be good for me to. One of the things that helped me was listening the original recording over and over again, and soloing over it. Kinda try to copy the Sax and Trumpet lines, it pushes you in the right direction, and needs some out of the box thinking to get simialair sounds on guitar.

[distressed_romeo]

Originally Posted by Luan

That was great, specially the last paragraph.

I'm having problems speacially making melodies, or motives, ideas, etc
Seems like it is harder to solo when you have 1 hour of the same chord..

Thanks a lot!

One thing to think about that can help you get more ideas out of simple motifs is to introduce rhythmic, rather than melodic, variation, for example, if you start off with a simple four-note motif, try adding or taking away notes from it when you repeat it, or playing exactly the same notes with a triplet feel, or slightly behind or ahead of the beat.