[Neal]

Not bad...


for a girl.

Just kidding.
I think the reason I never really got into jazz guitar is because a lot of it seems to just meander around and not really make much of a statement. Obviously there are some jazz players out there who can write good melodies and songs that go somewhere. But I think there are more guys who can play than there are who have something to say. Does that make any sense?

[bostjan]

Well, they have something to say, but not everyone will pick up what they are throwing down, and that's the whole thing about jazz, dig?

I think Eddie Lang would be an older jazz guy that would be worth checking out if you aren't liking the trippy stuff.

Norman Brown is a more laid-back modern jazz guitarist with very tasty melodies, but don't expect him to knock your socks off right away.

Al DiMeola runs the gamut, so he's another place to start, if you find the others boring.

Others I prefer (already mentioned):
Pat Metheny
Jimmy Rosenberg
Alan Holdsworth
George Benson
Wes Montgomerey
Stanley Jordan
Pat Martino
Bireli Lagrene
Kenny Burrell
Frank Gambale
Charlie Byrd
John Scoffield
Joe Pass
John McLaughlin
Tal Farlow
Earl Klugh
Bill Frisell
Barney Kessel
Lenny Breau
Mike Stern
George Van Eps
Charlie Hunter
Carl Kress
[voice trails off...]

[jacksonplayer]

Originally Posted by Denied by Christ

I think the reason I never really got into jazz guitar is because a lot of it seems to just meander around and not really make much of a statement.

It's funny, I've been going the opposite way. Lately I've been listening almost exclusively to '60s hard bop and the funkier aspects of '70s fusion (George Duke, Flora Purim, Herbie Hancock, etc.), and it's tough to go back and listen to most rock and metal because it all seems so structured and predictable.

Interestingly, you don't hear that many jazz guitarists who are willing to just go crazy. What is it about guitarists that we need our little structured songs and neat resolutions? That's one thing I love about guys like Sonny Sharrock and James Blood Ulmer--they're willing to step out on that ledge and risk playing a mistake or two.

[distressed_romeo]

Originally Posted by jacksonplayer

It's funny, I've been going the opposite way. Lately I've been listening almost exclusively to '60s hard bop and the funkier aspects of '70s fusion (George Duke, Flora Purim, Herbie Hancock, etc.), and it's tough to go back and listen to most rock and metal because it all seems so structured and predictable.

Interestingly, you don't hear that many jazz guitarists who are willing to just go crazy. What is it about guitarists that we need our little structured songs and neat resolutions? That's one thing I love about guys like Sonny Sharrock and James Blood Ulmer--they're willing to step out on that ledge and risk playing a mistake or two.

We need more of that sort of spirit in metal. It's wierd how rock was originally heavily improvisational, and yet now improvisation's pretty much a lost art amongst rock/metal musicians.

[jacksonplayer]

Originally Posted by distressed_romeo

We need more of that sort of spirit in metal. It's wierd how rock was originally heavily improvisational, and yet now improvisation's pretty much a lost art amongst rock/metal musicians.

I agree about the need for "free metal", since that's basically what I'm trying to cook up in the laboratory nowadays. But I don't think that rock has ever been very free. It's always been primarily a song-oriented form with structures inherited from country and blues and little space for true improvisation, other than the occasional solo. There was a period in the late '60s and early '70s when that was starting to change, with the psychedelic and jam-oriented movements, but I think fusion stole their thunder and redirected the energies of many of those musicians.

It's difficult to bridge the mindsets. In rock, musicians are always telling themselves to "play for the song." In post-bop jazz, the playing IS the song.

There are experimental bands today like Tortoise that are doing some interesting quasi-improvisational things, but I'm not as up on that stuff as I probably should be. There's only so many hours in the day to absorb new musical influences.

Of course, part of my point was that even jazz guitarists are often stuck in a box. How many guitarists would have the balls to do something like Coltrane's "Ascension"? I guess Metheny did with "Song X", but I can't think of too many more examples off the top of my head. Not strictly atonal, but "free".