Metal in the current world

[JohnIce]

Germany is the kind of country you'd want to play in, shoot live videos in etc. because the audiences are so enthusiastic, and there is obviously a huge interest in metal music there. But, that doesn't automatically mean you make great music. Most die-hard metalheads I know aren't musicians (or very unambitious musicians), and most great musicians I know are pretty casual about it.

[Scar Symmetry]

Originally Posted by JohnIce

Most die-hard metalheads I know aren't musicians (or very unambitious musicians), and most great musicians I know are pretty casual about it.

yeah same dude.

[WrathOfGirth]

Was just reading over this thread as I've been away for about a week.
Wow, from what I've read so far this has been really interesting.

There was one post, I can't recall who posted it saying that as a genre, metal is looked down upon in society (in the UK) and that's just as true as it gets haha. I remember him saying about the media and how they pull everything in through from the US with all the mainstream pop spawning evils like X-Factor etc. (even knowing I can happily sit through the auditions for that and rather enjoy it, but that isn't the point)

(Gonna write some thoughts down on this topic and see if I can pull something from it, quote me on sections if you think it makes sense or I'm a numpty)

So going to the route of how the majority of bands get mainstream.
The Record Companies.
You have the current top few which are:
Warner Bros
Universal
EMI (I think)
and some other heeby jeeby money making machine.

I heard there's something above that again, I can't expand on that because I simply do not know enough about it, it's something I'm going to research on a bit.

Anyway the point;
With the amount of money these controlling companies are making out of musicians / artists / people yelling with auto tuners in the mix, they have no reason to say put other genre's in the mainstream or sign them at all. (Several are signed, but I'm assuming most are shaped by the record company, but then bands always change their sound as they progress as musicians, for better or for worst)

Not having being signed before, I don't know how the record company directly communicates with the band as an employer (which is basically what they are)

Also, I've lost what point I had in my head at the start of this, if anyone can expand if what I have said that'd be great haha

[JohnIce]

Originally Posted by WrathOfGirth

Not having being signed before, I don't know how the record company directly communicates with the band as an employer (which is basically what they are)

I'm a session guy for a band that has been approached by Universal, and my answer to your question: They don't :p There are dozens of strategically down-handling minions who send around messages that may or may not finally reach us and vice versa. They're not sponsoring us in any way either really, we don't get any budget for recording, mixing, equipment etc. What we get is some bad-ass marketing and distribution once the record is done though, but unless we produce a slew of hits we might be dropped at any minute.

I don't really want to sign with them, for reasons mentioned and also because I think the record industry is dated and should go away completely. But it's not really my decision. Sure it's a good pickup line to say you're on the same label as the Rolling Stones, U2 and Stevie Wonder but that's about it.

[WrathOfGirth]

Originally Posted by JohnIce

I'm a session guy for a band that has been approached by Universal, and my answer to your question: They don't :p There are dozens of strategically down-handling minions who send around messages that may or may not finally reach us and vice versa. They're not sponsoring us in any way either really, we don't get any budget for recording, mixing, equipment etc. What we get is some bad-ass marketing and distribution once the record is done though, but unless we produce a slew of hits we might be dropped at any minute.

Well that sucks all in all. I always thought they were meant to give the band the money to record their songs since the record company are going to be owning them for a certain amount of time, if not forever anyway.
Did the band you session for get signed afterwards?
Interested in what RC if that's the case...

[lnname]

Originally Posted by Konfyouzd

^ i'm trying self-producing thing right now.

it's cool because you do what you wanna do at all times, but it gets really frustrating with having to play all the instruments and i'm absolutely horrible with recording software (i think that's where the bulk of my frustration lies i probably would have wanted to learn extra instruments anyway to be honest) because every time i sit down and try to record something someone wants to bug me...

hmmmn

what you need is a writting recording partner, even if two guys aren't a band, its fun to have someone to bounce your ideas off- and i get he impression that most people are great with software. I have a similar aptitude to you, but since i started recording as a two piece my music really took off. Even though all i wanted was to hear my own tracks properly laid down and polished i now have a small band who do the odd gig. Its fun!

[Hawkevil]

Originally Posted by WrathOfGirth

Well that sucks all in all. I always thought they were meant to give the band the money to record their songs since the record company are going to be owning them for a certain amount of time, if not forever anyway.
Did the band you session for get signed afterwards?
Interested in what RC if that's the case...

Record companies tend not to just give you money for recording and stuff...

If they are willing to put some money into your band then they will expect to earn their money back from your record sails and unless you are on the right contract you won't see a penny of your record sale earnings until your debt has been paid off to them. There is another contract where it usually about 50% until the debt has cleared but I forgot what these contracts are called.

IMO the record industry needs to die fast. A few years ago it helped people because it was nearly impossible to record a great quality album but these days it is a lot cheaper and easier...

[JohnIce]

Originally Posted by Hawkevil

Record companies tend not to just give you money for recording and stuff...

If they are willing to put some money into your band then they will expect to earn their money back from your record sails and unless you are on the right contract you won't see a penny of your record sale earnings until your debt has been paid off to them. There is another contract where it usually about 50% until the debt has cleared but I forgot what these contracts are called.

IMO the record industry needs to die fast. A few years ago it helped people because it was nearly impossible to record a great quality album but these days it is a lot cheaper and easier...

My thoughts exactly (on all points). We haven't signed with them yet as the record needs to be mixed first, I'm just stating my reasons for not wanting to sign with them. And yes, good recording equipment is cheaper than your average guitar rig. There will always be a demand for good mixers though, but studios/producers are going out the window. What we need now is marketing companies, who do less work and therefore charge less money than what record companies do.

When you take the record companies out of music, it means artists have much less money to work with. The good thing though is that we'd (theoretically) be free of talentless hack popstars and instead radio would only be playing artists that went the whole 9 and set up a home studio, recorded the album themselves, mixed it, promoted it etc. etc. to a point where it gets recognition. The talent in popular music would (theoretically) skyrocket.

Due to the globalisation of mp3 downloads, there would be no need for shelling out the enormous amounts of money that it costs to produce CD's and get them into stores all over the world. Record companies are obsolete here too. Like I said, artists would only need themselves and someone good with marketing (perhaps even a band member) to make it in the so-called 'biz.

[McKay]

Originally Posted by JohnIce

My thoughts exactly (on all points). We haven't signed with them yet as the record needs to be mixed first, I'm just stating my reasons for not wanting to sign with them. And yes, good recording equipment is cheaper than your average guitar rig. There will always be a demand for good mixers though, but studios/producers are going out the window. What we need now is marketing companies, who do less work and therefore charge less money than what record companies do.

When you take the record companies out of music, it means artists have much less money to work with. The good thing though is that we'd (theoretically) be free of talentless hack popstars and instead radio would only be playing artists that went the whole 9 and set up a home studio, recorded the album themselves, mixed it, promoted it etc. etc. to a point where it gets recognition. The talent in popular music would (theoretically) skyrocket.

Due to the globalisation of mp3 downloads, there would be no need for shelling out the enormous amounts of money that it costs to produce CD's and get them into stores all over the world. Record companies are obsolete here too. Like I said, artists would only need themselves and someone good with marketing (perhaps even a band member) to make it in the so-called 'biz.

My sentiments for quite some time, they are.

Speaking of the UK metal scene, it's pretty huge but not in the traditional sense. There are scores of _core bands, many of which are pretty good. They are essentially metal, just not long haired and leatherbound.

There are scores of all kinds of metal bands here, the difference is that the Deathcore bands actually have a real following of people that aren't musicians themselves.

There is a thriving thrash scene here, with varying levels of originality and a good number of throwbacks.